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#debian IRC Logs for 2008-02-04

---Logopened Mon Feb 04 00:00:12 2008
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00:10<Aleric>This is why I should stop using 'testing' ...
00:10<Aleric>They REMOVE packages!
00:11<Aleric>All the time packages are gone from testing, but still in unstable and in stable!
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00:16<vook>Aleric: yeah - I've noticed, which is why I'm back up to sid. It's like a two year cycle for me. I get stable working great, but then I move to testing for some feature, then to sid, then a few months later everything breaks, I get frustrated and go back to stable.
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00:18<Aleric>vook: They remove the nvidia drivers again (although, I already made myself undependent of the debian "maintainers" last time that happened), and now they simply removed the flash plugin :/
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00:21<vook>why not just always compile the nvidia drivers yourself? It takes minute or two, and probably always yields a faster module.
00:21<Aleric>vook: I don't trust the nvidia installer.
00:22<Aleric>I only want to install them as .deb's. So, I create the .deb's myself now.
00:22<vook>Aleric: you can change the options of the installer though so that it doesn't do anything but compile the driver. When executing the package from Nvidia, just through in some options to just extract it.
00:23<vook>I had issues with the installer in the past too.
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00:23<Aleric>I just run a script when things break - and then it works again.
00:23<Aleric>No problems whatsoever
00:24<vook>whatever works
00:25<vook>I kept moving up toward sid to get compiz to work well, only to realize that compiz really annoys me.
00:25<Aleric>Seems something for kids
00:26<Aleric>Not for serious computer hackers
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00:30<vook>It's nice to have around just to keep the mac users from gloating too much. beyond that...
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00:35<Aleric>Hmm, I should fix my nvidia install script.
00:36<Aleric>I downgraded from 169.09 to 100.14.19 again because red and blue was reversed in any movie after I ran cedega once with 169.09.
00:36<Aleric>But the script didn't downgrade nvidia-glx-ia32 I just noted. That was why cedega didn't want to run at all anymore after the downgrade :)
00:36<Aleric>Just tried, and now everything works again :)
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00:45<jim>is it possible to build a later version of the nvidia driver than is available in the etch repo?
00:45<Aleric>Of course
00:46<Aleric>I have to go to bed... read this:
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00:48<jim>perfect, thanks
00:51<vook>jim: if you run the installer with the -x and -a options, it'll just extract the files, then you can go in and have a bit more control over the compilation of the module and the subsequent installation.
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00:53<killuminati>anybody into lvm?
00:54<jim>are you?
00:54<killuminati>is it adequate to set swap on a lvm partition?
00:54<killuminati>or should i put it on a non-lvm one?
00:54<jim>I wouldn't necessarily do that, in fact it's better to have it on not just its own partition, but on a separate drive
00:55<jim>especially if you expect any more than about 10% swappage
00:55<killuminati>ok.. i see
00:55<killuminati>so swap on another partition
00:56<jim>would be nice. also: swap on another DRIVE.
00:56<killuminati>no other hardrive.. it's a laptop
00:57<ameyer>if you've got enough RAM, it isn't really likely to matter much
00:57<vook>killuminati: i.e. disk 1 - 10% non-lvm (/boot, /), disk 2 - 10% non-lvm (swap), disks 1,2 90% each lvm
00:57<blarson>killuminati: it doesn't really matter much unless you use programs larger than memory a lot. Extra drives for swap are usually impractical.
00:58<killuminati>vook, i don't think i thorougly understood that
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00:59<killuminati>ameyer, it doesn't matter wether i put it on a lvm volume or its own partition, or wether i put it on a separate hard-drive or not?
00:59<jim>true impractical... but if you're swapping a lot and your swap is on the same drive as data you're accessing (also a lot), then your drive's head arm will have more wear and tear, and get hot
00:59<jim>it's actually not all that impractical
01:00<killuminati>well in my case I have just one drive, it isn't the actual deal
01:00<vook>killuminati: if you have more than one drive, you should ideally place swap on the non-primary drive - that's the point.
01:00<killuminati>what I'm into is the lvm thing
01:00<killuminati>no no
01:00<killuminati>i have just one drive and i'm doing lvm on it
01:00<killuminati>the question is if swap goes well as a lvm volume
01:00<jim>I'll go out on a limb and say no
01:01<blarson>killuminati: adds trivial unnoticable extra overhead, and makes reconfiguring easier.
01:01<vook>yeah killuminati, because lvm is handled by software.
01:01<jim>swap file and lvm lv, both don't guarantee that blocks are physically contiguous
01:02<killuminati>vook, why not use lvm on root if you're separating boot?
01:02<blarson>jim: nor does any modern hard drive that does bad block reloaction.
01:02<killuminati>yes but...
01:03<jim>also I would think -really- hard before doing things like combining physical vols on separate drives into one vg (unless you're doing -full- -real- -hardware- raid
01:03<killuminati>I'm going to use the same swap space over two linux distros
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01:03<vook>killuminati: no reason not to - I'm just picturing two identical drives, and a good way to use an identical amount of space on each as non-lvm partitions.
01:03<jim>and not hardware raid is not real raid)
01:03<killuminati>I'm not on raid
01:03<killuminati>it's quite a simple scenario
01:04<killuminati>two distros on the same machine and the same hard-drive
01:04<jim>then it's good that you're sticking with one drive
01:04<killuminati>both using the same swap and /home
01:04<killuminati>and I'm going to use lvm
01:04<vook>this all begs the question : why LVM with one drive? (other than for fun and kicks?)
01:04<killuminati>yes, practice
01:04<jim>two distros? then I'd allocate two /boot vols near the beginning
01:04<killuminati>I don't have another set-up for doing it
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01:05<killuminati>jim, yes but my actual problem is about swap
01:05<killuminati>I already have the picture of the boot vols
01:05<killuminati>but can't picture the swap
01:06<killuminati>not sure if putting it on lvm
01:06<killuminati>that's the issue
01:06<vook>killuminati: how is swap used on your system? ('free')
01:06<vook>how/ how much
01:06<killuminati>vook, not that much I guess
01:06<killuminati>since i have 512 MB RAM
01:06<killuminati>I put 512 MB for swap there
01:07<killuminati>that's all
01:07<vook>yeah - so whatever. If you want to put swap on your lvm, have at it I'd say - given the circumstances.
01:07<jim>you should consider a few things for these /boot vols: 1, primary partitions, NOT lvm... 2, both near physical beginning of drive... 3, using ext2 or maybe ext3 on those /boots (NOT reiser or especially not xfs)
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01:07<killuminati>jim, ok, thanks
01:07<killuminati>i'm not using lvm on /boot, obviously
01:08<killuminati>vook, and the two distros would be permitted to use it?
01:08<jim>well actually I've seen it work but I don't understand it and I don't see the purveyers offering proper rescue media for them... so I can't recommend it
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01:11<jim>actually the /boots could be on logical partitions (and the lvm pv as well) so you're not hurting for partitions)
01:11<jim>but the more basic you get with it, the more able you will be under a greater number of conditions to fix problems
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01:13<jim>someone from here is /msging me... please ask on channel, thanks, and I'm not actually available now
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01:32<jim>why is my arch i686 when I installed an i386 dist and a 486 kernel?
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01:36<jim>or stated another way... how can I compile modules for the 486 kernel?
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01:42<shital>jim: do u mean its 2.6 kernel??
01:44<jim>yes, I'd like to build the module for the 2.6.18 kernel, but the latest nvidia I can get
01:47<shital>ok fine.., for compiling kernel modules u should write the Makefile for 2.6 kernel and then u can try u will get
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01:48<jim>is not this done already?
01:48<shital>did't get u
01:50<jim>let's look at it the simplest way possible: is there a way that exists now (all files exist now) to build the nvidia kernel module for the 2.6.18 kernel? if so, what is the latest nvidia driver version for which this exists?
01:50<jim>if not...
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01:51<jim>which kernel version has an existing (that is, all files/build systems exist now) way to build the kernel module for the latest available nvidia driver?
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01:52<Slydder>morning all
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02:06<alaya>jim: install linux-headers-`uname -r`
02:06<alaya>jim: then use module-assistant to build it
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02:12<jim>I think those are installed... let's see
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02:12<jim>that would be on my system... linux-headers-2.6.18-5-486
02:12<jim>let's see if it's installed
02:13<jim>no, but in progress.
02:13<jim>now they are
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03:01<Ouroboros>why is 'contrib' included for security patches but not for normal packages by default?
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03:13<JustSoul>How to echo/cat the N-line in File
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03:16<dondelelcaro>JustSoul: head+tail is the usual method used.
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03:19<JustSoul>dondelelcaro: ok, thx, but if I need to read file by each line?
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03:20<Ouroboros>cat file | while read line; do echo $line; done
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03:24<vook>there is some kinda of key sequence that creates a ^M that can be echo'd too, can't remember.
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03:28<vook>yeah, ctrl-v, ctrl-m
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03:32<JustSoul>Ouroboros: Error: Not a valid identifier
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03:33<vook>JustSoul: echo (ctrl-v - then m) >> file
03:33<JustSoul>in script
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03:34<JustSoul>or "how to add some lines in File"
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03:35<vook>editing a script, you can create the ^M escape code, (such as in vi)
03:35<Ouroboros>JustSoul: not sure what you want to do
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03:36<JustSoul>I want to write script that edit some config file and add some lines in it
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03:36<Ouroboros>do you want to add them to the end or something more complicated
03:37<vook>is it a arbitrary number of lines? Is the script going to ask how many empty lines to add?
03:37<JustSoul>no, to the middle after "[My config]" - line
03:37<vook>just one empty line?
03:37<JustSoul>not emty
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03:37<Ouroboros>there are a variety of ways of doing something like that
03:38<Ouroboros>probably want to use something like sed
03:38<vook>JustSoul: have you tried placing the ^M (new line) escape code into your script?
03:39<JustSoul>vook: no
03:39<Ouroboros>vook: why do you need that
03:40<vook>that was the question wasn't it? "How to echo/cat the N-line in File" (does N-line != newline)?
03:40<Ouroboros>i dont think so :)
03:41<Ouroboros>i think he basically just wants to insert a line into a config file... so just search for the line with something like sed or perl echoing everything before, then write your thing, then echo the rest
03:42<Ouroboros>there is an infinite number of ways to do this depending on your requirements and expertise
03:42<vook>ah, I see. not a newline, but a "new line"
03:43<Ouroboros>err, why do i keep saying sed
03:43<Ouroboros>i means awk
03:45<JustSoul>Ouroboros: err, sed or awk? because now I reading tutorial for sed =)
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03:46<Ouroboros>JustSoul: sorry, awk
03:46<Ouroboros>JustSoul: sed is for when you want to do regex replace though, so read that too
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03:48<Ouroboros>JustSoul: also, if you know exactly on what line you need to insert, then it is much easier
03:48<Ouroboros>JustSoul: you can just use head/tail then
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03:49<Ouroboros>JustSoul: you can also figure out what line it is using grep, instead of using awk/perl
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03:50<JustSoul>yea.. good idea..
03:50<JustSoul>1 moment
03:51<Ouroboros>JustSoul: you can also probably do it using the little shell script i gave and string comparison or something
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03:54<JustSoul>ok, now I echoing smth like "99 [My config]"
03:55<Ouroboros>from grep?
03:55<Ouroboros>then use 'cut'
03:55<Ouroboros>you can feed the result to head
03:57<Ouroboros>is there a way to make sudo take more than one command (i.e. using semicolon)?
03:58<JustSoul>mb using "()" ?
04:00<Ouroboros>screw it, will use 2 commands :)
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04:04<jim>man bash, or better, info bash... look at (), try it and see if it helps
04:04<jim>if you do, you might have a chance at having what you want in the way you want it
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04:05<Ouroboros>ah, didnt realize that was an actual thing
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04:09<jim>well most things whether implementable or not, are just ideas and possibly abstractions
04:10<jim>so anyway, info bash contains the better quality docs
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04:12<Ouroboros>i found the info in the man page
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04:17<jim>my condolences... and congratulatoins
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04:19<N0fxDebian>Hi all. Who known how to set fvwm-crystal to make it when window move not show its content but just outline?
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04:20<Ouroboros>i am sad and happy to say that i have never used an info page so far...
04:21<schlurchz>Hi, can someone please tell if I'm supposed to report bugs in experimental packages like normal, or is there any special procedure?
04:21<jim>where do you think most people who have some sort of objection to info have it?
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04:21<N0fxDebian>Maybe just changing the ~/.fvwm/component/style/FVWM file, but i don't konw how to...Some one help~
04:22<blarson>schlurchz: report bugs like normal, be sure to include the version.
04:22<jim>Ouroboros: here's the example I cite most often...
04:22<schlurchz>blarson: well reportbug should do that anyway. Thx
04:22<Ouroboros>jim: no idea, since i do not know what it looks like, but is suspect for some people it is simply a dislike of having to get information from 2 places (man and info)
04:22<jim>the info pages found in the source distribution is actually the book "using and porting gnu cc"
04:22<schlurchz>blarson: no special tag or something like that?
04:23<jim>Ouroboros: which form do you think is updated first?
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04:23<Ouroboros>jim: yeah i know for some things its pretty inevitable
04:23<blarson>schlurchz: no, the BTS keeps track of versions
04:23<Ouroboros>jim: and there are a number of man pages which are stub links to info
04:23<jim>mostly vise versa
04:24<schlurchz>blarson: kay, thanks
04:24<blarson>schlurchz: It does a pretty good job of guessing what versions the bug applies to, adn can be told otherwise if wrong.
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04:25<schlurchz>blarson: that's great, I already prepared mentally to compile X from git and report upstream :-)
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04:26<jim>here's one part that makes info different... for gnu tools, generally the info pages are where updates happen first and most often, and so are more uptodate. the man pages for those tools lose the structure in the translation.
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04:26<jim>the issue most people have between info and man stinks to me, of school rivalry
04:26<N0fxDebian>Need Help!
04:26<jim>and is therefore irrelevent
04:27<Ouroboros>jim: agreed there
04:27<jim>the source to use, is the one with the greater quality
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04:27<mosno>jim: i personally just use whichever one is the canonical reference for the given package
04:27<mosno>(if any)
04:27<jim>right, exactly
04:27<jim>for many if not most gnu tools, that would be the info pages
04:28<Ouroboros>jim: i was not aware that there was a rivalry, i thought it was just me being clueless :)
04:28<mosno>jim: usually, yes
04:28<jim>well the school thing is my guess based on how people are so hysterical over it
04:29-!-mode/#debian [+l 321] by debhelper
04:30<mosno>jim: you mean like the Arch Linux folk? ;-)
04:30<jim>who's that?
04:30<jim>I've never met any of those
04:30<mosno>jim: a distro. they strip out the info documentation for all packages on the grounds that it adds bloat
04:30<mosno>jim: i wonder if they ever did du -s /usr/share/info and realised they were full of s**t
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04:31<Ouroboros>mosno: that usually dont stop people from exercising their religion
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04:32<jim>then they do a disservice, at least for those gnu tools for which it's the canonical docs
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04:33<mosno>jim: yea i know, but there is no reasoning with them
04:33<mosno>Ouroboros: ?
04:33<mosno>jim: a pity, they otherwise make a fine distro
04:33<Ouroboros>mosno: being full of s
04:33<mosno>Ouroboros: o, right :)
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04:34<jim>I'll vote by not using them... but even if they strip them out, they can be obtained again... perhaps the idiots can be foiled by offering an out-of-dist package with the docs they strip out
04:34<JustSoul>I made it!! Thx very much
04:35<Ouroboros>JustSoul: how did you end up doing it
04:35<jim>as they take away the user's choice, providing such an offering will restore that choice
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04:35<Ouroboros>is it technically necesary to to "apt-get update" prior to "apt-get remove" ?
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04:35<Lynoure>Ouroboros: no
04:35<jim>well I always use dpkg to remove
04:35<jim>apt-get is not necessary in any way
04:36<Ouroboros>yeah i know
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04:36<witte>Ouroboros: I don't think so
04:36<Lynoure>Ouroboros: but it's wise to do before install
04:36<Ouroboros>but i tend to use dpkg -r only for things which i manually installed with dpkg -i
04:36<Ouroboros>which is only things which i manually compiled for some reaosn
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04:42<Ouroboros>etch comes with a bittorrent tracker by default? nice
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04:48<Ouroboros>JustSoul: yep, makes sense
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04:48<Ouroboros>JustSoul: though i prefer to use a single tool when things become this complicated.. thus my suggestion of awk/perl
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04:50<Ouroboros>JustSoul: in channel please... and no, i am busy
04:51<JustSoul>Ouroboros: ok, sorry
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04:51<Ouroboros>JustSoul: basically you just need two match rules: one that prints everything and one that detects the line you want
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04:57<Ouroboros>JustSoul: something like that
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04:59<vook>what is the proper(debian) way to apply the debian-patches to source? I'm used to running patch itself.
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05:01<vook>nevermind - didn't realize linux-source was already patched.
05:01<Ouroboros>yeah, its awesome like that
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05:02<sardior>Howdy, I have a sym-link /bin/sh that points to the /bin/bash command. When I try to install a file (via yum, kpackage, etc.) I get the error message that dependency /bin/sh is missing. How do I fix that?
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05:02<Ouroboros>i think there is always a pre-patched source package
05:02<Kazuhiro>sardior, if that is the only problem use --no-deps as a large hammer
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05:02<witte>sardior: which linux version are you using?
05:03<sardior>debian etch
05:03<creeed>sardior, are you sure you'r on the right channel?
05:03<witte>sardior: there is no yum in debian i think
05:03<sardior>I think I'm on the right channel
05:03<sardior>I've installed it, it is available
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05:03<witte>ah, sorry there is. Why would you use it?
05:03<witte>sardior: try apt-get
05:03<sardior>because I've tried everything else to get flash working
05:03<witte>sardior: or aptitude
05:04<creeed>sardior, witch package is that?
05:04<Kazuhiro>vmware provide rpms no debs..
05:04<witte>!tell sardior about flash
05:04<Kazuhiro>as one example
05:04<witte>!tell sardior about adobe flash
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05:04<Ouroboros>Kazuhiro: vmware always provides a universal installer
05:05<vook>there better ways to install an rpm in debian (such as converting it to deb)
05:05<witte>Kazuhiro: ok, that could be an alternative, I would probably try to alien it to a deb
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05:06<witte>sardior: in any case, for flash you certainly don't need yum ;-)
05:06<Kazuhiro>witte, I know the previous version did not work with alien. Did not have time to debug so I just smashed it into place.
05:06<sardior>well, I know, but I couldn't get it to work other ways.
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05:07<sardior>I am using amd64 architecture
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05:07<witte>sardior: ah, ok, that is something different
05:08<creeed>sardior, I'll try with nspluginswrapper
05:08<witte>sardior: the flash version for amd64 etch does not exist, it exists in unstable though
05:08<sardior>Yea, I just bought the MB case, memory, cpu etc and made my own puter
05:08<witte>Kazuhiro: I have no experience with vmware, so it could be that yum was the most appropriate for that application...
05:09<sardior>Now I'm finding I'm ahead of linux instead of behind as I've always been before
05:09<Ouroboros>i always install vmware using their installer
05:09<Ouroboros>(vmware server)
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05:09<Ouroboros>this also compiles the required kernel modules from source to match your kernel, not sure if yum will do that as well
05:10<sardior>If I could just get it to recognize my /bin/sh I think it would work. I've downloaded the noarch version of flash
05:11<creeed>I have an amd64 architecture too, and it's like this way how I installed the Flash Player plugins for iceweasel
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05:13<Kazuhiro>sardior, you could hack it up by copying /bin/bash to /bin/sh ... but that is bad. --no-deps will work
05:14<Kazuhiro>what package are you installing?
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05:14<sardior>I have three packages the depend on the /bin/sh to work. One is my printer drivers for my samsung laser printer, the next are the adobe flash and shockwave
05:15<sardior>It drives me nuts somtimes.
05:16<sardior>brb... I'm going to try something..
05:16<Kazuhiro>sardior, --no-deps will fix this problem for you if that is the only error
05:16<Kazuhiro>yum install foo --no-deps
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05:17<petemc>on debian, /bin/sh is a link to bash
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05:18<mosno>petemc: speaking of which, do you know if it is still /bin/dash on Ubuntu these days?
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05:18*mosno was reading an interesting launchpad discussion he was linked to via some planet
05:19<petemc> /bin/sh -> dash
05:19<petemc>seems to be
05:22<Kazuhiro>anyone come across some good pulse audio guides for lenny?
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05:23<Ouroboros>night people, thanks for the help
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05:25<mosno>s/some planet/dash entry on wikipedia/
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05:26<Kazuhiro>I must say debian has improved a lot from the last time I used it. (have been on the ubuntu bandwagon for desktops)
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05:27<sardior>The instructions "apt-get install ia32-libs-gtk nsplugingwrapper" gives me the error package not found. and that is with and without the space between "...gtk nsplugin..."
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05:27<ServerSide>ups, wtf
05:27<Kazuhiro>do you have non-free repo enabled?
05:28<jim>did you update after enabling?
05:28<ServerSide>If I run any graphic application, my gdm crashs (restart), games, glxgears etc- ... anyone?
05:28<jim>do you have contrib enabled
05:28<sardior>I think sop
05:28<jim>ok, sounds good to me...
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05:29<sardior>brb... I have to turn some things off on another login.
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05:30<jim>why not update right now and then try again
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05:31<jim>is it saying 404 not found?
05:31<jim>are there any problems when you update?
05:31<sardior>updating right now...
05:32<sardior>nope, no problems updating.
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05:32<jim>and contrib is enabled?
05:32<sardior>yes, contrib is enabled
05:32<jim>ok sounds good
05:32<zamolxes>hey. how can I see what processes are doing more disk activity?
05:34<sardior>markybob-keyring is installed.
05:34<sardior>no errors
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05:36<sardior>ok... must have been a typo on my part earlier, It is working now... so far.
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05:37<jim>maybe updating made it work
05:37<sardior>maybe..., but I had updated a couple of times.
05:37<jim>sometimes old packages are cleared out and new packages replace them... plus lists of packages are replaced to reflect that
05:37<sardior>it could have been my fingers too.
05:37<jim>suppose so
05:39<sardior>hang on... i'm going to try the rest of the instructions here.
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05:57<sardior>Ok... now I'm testing it... Thank you Jim... We'll see if it works now..
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06:00<sardior>well, I don't get the missing plugin message, but it still doesn't work.
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06:12<sardior>I keep getting back to "Error: Missing Dependency: /bin/sh is needed by package adobe-release-i386". The symlink "/bin/sh" is there pointing to bash...
06:13<sardior>I tried the "-t" option as the "--no-deps" is not valid.
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06:18<^DarkSun^>i'm trying to rebuild the linux-modules-2.6.18-6-xen-amd64 package
06:18<^DarkSun^>with the following commands:
06:18<^DarkSun^>apt-get build-dep linux-modules-2.6.18-6-xen-amd64
06:18<^DarkSun^>apt-get source linux-modules-2.6.18-6-xen-amd64
06:18<^DarkSun^>cd linux-2.6-2.6.18.dsg.1
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06:18<^DarkSun^>dpkg-buildpackage -b -us -uc
06:19-!-db is now known as Guest377
06:19<^DarkSun^>but it starts to recompile every package specified in the debian/control file
06:19<^DarkSun^>how to make ONLY the linux-modules-2.6.18-6-xen-amd64 package?
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06:21<^DarkSun^>any clue? thx
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06:27<kapil>^DarkSun^: if you want to make a custom kernel install kernel-package linux-source-2.6.18 and linux-patch-debian-2.6.18 and follow the README's in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package
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06:29<kapil>!dpkg make-kpkg
06:30<kapil>^DarkSun^: and message "dpkg" about make-kpkg
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06:30<dpkg>To compile a kernel The Debian Way(tm) "apt-get install kernel-package build-essential libncurses5-dev" and follow the instructions in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/README.gz; You should also ask me about <make-kpkg> and <kp mantra>
06:31<kapil>kmap: thanks. i never get the basic dpkg mantra right!
06:31<kmap>kapil: It took me quiet some time as well. Welcome! :-D
06:32<kapil>kmap: did you get my comment about your interesting article about screen?
06:32<kmap>kapil: Er, no. Did you mail me?
06:32<kmap>kapil: Or just /msg me the criticsm! :-p
06:32<kapil>kmap: no. i used the talkback link. i'll forward it.
06:33<kmap>kapil: I'd appreciaet it, thanks
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06:52<Sweeney-Todd>hi, any idea on how I can make bitlbee work through a proxy? I am using XChat with is already connected throygh that same proxy
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06:54<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: See /etc/bitlbee/bitlbee.conf ("Proxy").
06:54<Sweeney-Todd>cheers gsimons
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07:06<Phocean>hi all
07:06<Phocean>does someone know if hybrid hard drives are supported by the kernel ?
07:07<Phocean>I am wondering if I buy a 7200 tpm classic hard drive, or a 5400 tpm hybrid one, with 1 Gb of flash memory, for my laptop
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07:07<Phocean>which is the best ?
07:08<lupine>it should present as a normal drive to the kernel
07:08<lupine>as for best... well. dpkg knows all about that
07:08<dpkg>Best for what? Please define what you mean by "best". Gloria Gaynor! Tina Turner! Aretha Franklin! Men without Hats! Women without Hats! Men at Work! Women at Play! Anyone for Tennis!
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07:09<Phocean>lupine, my question is if I will have any performance benefit ?
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07:09<Phocean>lupine, if the flash is just not used in a smart way, I would better use a 7200 disk
07:10<lupine>I'm pretty sure the flash usage would be managed internally by the drive... or do you have to install custom drivers to use it in windows?
07:12<Phocean>lupine, I don't know... I am trying to dig it more
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07:13<Torsten_W>Phocean: at the moment the flash memory of ths drives u only can use with windows
07:14<Phocean>Torsten_W, ha...
07:14<Phocean>Torsten_W, shit
07:14<Torsten_W>Phocean: u have to thank the manufacturer
07:14<Phocean>Torsten_W, so a 7200 drive is definitely a better choice !
07:15<Torsten_W>i think so, yes
07:15<Phocean>Torsten_W, like so often...
07:15<Phocean>Torsten_W, thanks
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07:21<evilbelgian>hi guys, how do i uninstall a package that ii installed not using apt get or any package manager
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07:22<JustSoul>evilbelgian: and how you installed it?
07:22<evilbelgian>and then what package is java and how do i add it to firefox
07:22<evilbelgian>i dled the file and extracted it manually
07:23<evilbelgian>i'm going on a tangent here and guessing that i can just delete the folder (its on my desktop)
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07:33<themill>evilbelgian: Please ask one question at a time and please try to provide us with enough information so that we know what on earth you are talking about.
07:34<evilbelgian>well then let us ignore the first question i can deal with it myself
07:34<evilbelgian>umm i just need some help installing java into firefox
07:35<themill>evilbelgian: OK. Ignore the package you have downloaded from sun. It's not needed under debian.
07:35<themill>!install java
07:35<dpkg>Free java implementations available in debian can be seen by running "apt-cache search java-virtual-machine". If you need to run software not supported by one of the free java implementations (anything not in main) then install sun-java5-plugin or sun-java6-plugin from non-free. If you are running amd64 then you'll need a 32bit chroot and browser for the java plugin.
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07:36<evilbelgian>thanks the mill
07:36<padski>see also the ibm jvm implementation for ppc users
07:36<themill>evilbelgian: so: (1) add to your sources.list including the non-free section, (2) aptitude update (3) aptitude install sun-java6-plugin
07:37<themill>evilbelgian: note that sun-java5-plugin is present in etch already, but you will probably be back asking about java6 at some time if you grab that...
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07:40<JustSoul>How to make that new files anybody created have permissions 666
07:42<evilbelgian>umm so what would be the line exactly i have to put in my sources list
07:43<themill>!tell evilbelgian about bpo
07:44<JustSoul>Is it mask-option when mount?
07:44<padski>JustSoul, maybe umask
07:44<themill>JustSoul: umask 000; but why would you want to do that....
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07:48<evilbelgian>i'm curious as to why putting deb etch-backports main contrib non-free in my repositiries list is crashing synaptic
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07:49<padski>evilbelgian, if synaptic crashes, it is a bug in synaptic
07:49<themill>evilbelgian: can you pastebin your sources.list for us?
07:49<evilbelgian>whats the directory
07:49<themill> /etc/apt/sources.list
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07:52<evilbelgian>i know nothing is wrong with my source list
07:53<evilbelgian>only thing that gives and error is
07:53<evilbelgian>deb etch-backports main contrib non-free
07:53<dpkg>Do not paste more than 3 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or or for pics. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste!
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07:54<evilbelgian>i know how to paste bin i am not a complete noob
07:55<themill>evilbelgian: can you pastebin your sources.list for us?
07:56<evilbelgian>bleh ok
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07:58<themill>evilbelgian: why don't you have a main etch mirror in there anywhere?
07:58<evilbelgian>i dunno
07:58<evilbelgian>sort of was just like that
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07:59<alexandru123>heloo people
07:59<evilbelgian>HELLLOOOO BACK
07:59<alexandru123>i have a problem
07:59<themill>evilbelgian: editted by whom? That is not a file that the installer would create.
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07:59<evilbelgian>well i added disks 1 - 6, i dunno how the sarge source got there
08:00<alexandru123>i have a dell optiplex 755 and i don't have driver for the network card
08:00<evilbelgian>deb etch main contrib non-free
08:00<evilbelgian>deb-src etch main contrib non-free
08:00<alexandru123>is a intel 825xx gigabite
08:00<evilbelgian>i added that
08:00<padski>I read it and I crashed ;-)
08:01<themill>evilbelgian: that would be a good thing to add. And get rid of the sarge line. Then run aptitude update
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08:01<evilbelgian>ok but the backports line gives me an error
08:02<gsimmons>alexandru123: Looks like you'll need the e1000e module. See Debian bug #452134.
08:02<themill>evilbelgian: can you pastebin the output of apt-get update --print-uris
08:02<evilbelgian>umm ok
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08:04<evilbelgian> , christ on a stick that was a frightening display of text
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08:05<themill>evilbelgian: Do you have anything in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ ?
08:06<evilbelgian>winhq.list and
08:07<themill>evilbelgian: ok. That makes sense. Now can you pastebin the output of: apt-get update
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08:11<evilbelgian> , small children cry when they see this
08:13<themill>evilbelgian: there are no errors there... did you apt-get update after editing the sources.list but before running synaptic?
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08:13<evilbelgian>and there is an error
08:13<evilbelgian>or not
08:14<evilbelgian>thought i saw something
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09:18<JustSoul>I'm readable?
09:18<dpkg>Test Failed.
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09:40<NiaB>pls help:
09:40<NiaB>how can i block this kind of attack?
09:41<NiaB>i tried these
09:41<NiaB>ocskavas:~/iptables# iptables -A INPUT -s -j DROP
09:41<NiaB>ocskavas:~/iptables# iptables -A INPUT -s -j DROP
09:41<NiaB>didnt work
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09:44<Supaplex>NiaB: if your ip traffic monitor is using pcap, it's listening to the network before iptables acts on it. use iptables -L -v -n to see packet counts per rule acted upon
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09:46<NiaB>3018K 90M DROP udp -- * *
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09:49<NiaB>Supaplex but im still laggy
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09:50<Supaplex>you'd have to firewall it at the next router up to prevent that traffic from lagging you
09:50<Supaplex>is the auth.log filling up with new authentication requests?
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09:52<NiaB>Supaplex nope
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09:53<NiaB>but this server where i logged it from is my router
09:53<NiaB>but im not sure that it overloads my modem
09:53<NiaB>or the server
09:53<NiaB>i mean network card
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10:04<NiaB>Supaplex i think i got it what u said
10:05<NiaB>so it doesnt matter how cool rule i do, it will remain laggy
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10:06<NiaB>iptables -A INPUT -p udp --dport 22 -m limit --limit 3/min --limit-burst 1 -j LOG --log-prefix "ssh_in: "
10:06<NiaB>i set this
10:06<NiaB>and i think my latency is better
10:08<Supaplex>ssh needs no udp, so you could just DROP
10:08<NiaB>check it pls
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10:09<NiaB>it shows no traffic on 3rd and 4th ip address
10:09<NiaB>but im still getting ddos from them
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10:09<NiaB>i receive packets on udp port
10:09<Supaplex>you can drop udp, but it only saves you the icmp reply 'udp port not open' type msgs
10:10<NiaB>so i should just simply drop them?
10:10<NiaB>without port specification
10:10<Supaplex>if the ip is hostile, sure why not?
10:10<NiaB>iptables -A INPUT -s -j DROP
10:11<NiaB>it should work?
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10:15<NiaB>Supaplex im still laggy :/
10:15<NiaB>i cant just ignore all packets that i get from these ip?
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10:17<NiaB>ummm... sometimes i got this message while pinging my gateway
10:17<NiaB>ping: sendmsg: Network is unreachable
10:17<NiaB>for 5-10 lines
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10:19<Supaplex>NiaB: is your ip static? did you piss off any kiddies?
10:19<NiaB>yes my ip is static
10:20<NiaB>and few months ago my friend pissed off a kiddie behind my server
10:20<NiaB>he could use only ipv6
10:21<NiaB>but my tunnel provider was corrupt and he gave my ip address out...
10:22<NiaB>of course i changed tunnel but this kiddie tattoied my ip on his forehead i guess
10:23<NiaB>i asked ip change from my isp but it takes a life while they do it
10:24<NiaB>Supaplex so what would u do in this situation?
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10:29<Supaplex>can't help you there :)
10:30<amphi>NiaB: you'd have to ask your isp to drop the traffic, I think
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10:38<burnclouds>hello all
10:40<AbsintheSyringe>heh, this is weird, just got invitation (email) to join fedora development team :)
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10:41<Wesley>where does postfix-tls get its user/pass data from?
10:41<lupine>wherever you tell it to
10:41<lupine>the default is probably /etc/passwd
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10:42<Wesley>so it uses the normal (shell) users?
10:42<tarbo>i have some packages installed which contain daemons. these daemons by default start running when installed or upgraded, and on boot. i have moved them in the approprate rc?.d folders, so that they no longer run on boot, but i dont know how to stop them from running when i upgrade them. is there a different way to keep them from running on boot that will also solve the upgrade problem? or something else i am missing?
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10:43<Supaplex>Wesley: it's vastly flexible. out of the box, it'll use pam
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10:44<Supaplex>tarbo: you /moved/ them into rc?.d folders?
10:44<tarbo>Supaplex: i moved their links within those folders, so they no longer have the necessary magic names
10:44<Supaplex>you should use update-rc.d to manage that
10:44<padski>tarbo, use a runlevel editor
10:45<tarbo>aha, thats the part i am missing
10:45<tarbo>thanks folks, i will look into that
10:45<Supaplex>as for 'starts after upgrade', there's a policy sample in sysv stuff someplace. try locate policy | grep /usr/share/doc/
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10:51*burnclouds Thinks 15:00z is a good time for bed on the east coast
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10:56<burnclouds> can any one suggest a good read on regulaer expressions?
10:56<Gathond>what ever you prefer to use them with really, as regular expressions come in different flavors
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10:57<Gathond>there is man 7 regex which is a nice reference for POSIX compliant regex, though the perl documentation is probably better if it is perl regex and not POSIX you are interested in
10:58<artista_frustrado>burnclouds, the oreilly book on regex is really good
10:58<padski>burnclouds, or the wikipedia page
10:59<artista_frustrado>even though the best read on regex I've found was in pt_BR
10:59<Gathond>burnclouds: sounds great for the perl case
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11:03<burnclouds>ok, i'm doing some bash scripting and I'd really like some regex by example and explaned in detail. any sugestions?
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11:04<padski>burnclouds, what like frob *.{c,h}
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11:06<burnclouds>yeah, but i would like several examples of more complex regex's like the ues of & and other more obsecure characters in combination with others
11:07<padski>burnclouds, are you preparing for an obfu competition ?
11:08<Supaplex>don't expect to be regexful33t overnight
11:08<burnclouds>lol, no just a job
11:08<dpkg>You want to reboot for WHAT?? If it's not a new kernel or a hardware change, you probably don't need to reboot. Ask me about <qotd2>.
11:08<padski>burnclouds, man bash
11:09<burnclouds>man bash is to simplistic and does not carry enough varying examples.
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11:12<Supaplex>google code search, man grep, perldoc perlre, perldoc perlretut, apropos grep, arpopos regex, man 7 regex (posix)
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11:13<Supaplex>apropos perlre etc etc.
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11:14<burnclouds>thanks much guys and gals
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11:16<Aleric> 5) #457291: flashplugin-nonfree: decision 2007-12-21: keep this package out of stable starting with lenny
11:16<Aleric>Where can I learn more about this "decision"?
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11:17<Aleric>That bug doesn't say anything
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11:18<padski>Aleric, read down, the maintainer outlines his reasons
11:18<Aleric>padski: Got an url for me?
11:18<padski>"It is not acceptable that users of Debian "stable" use
11:18<padski>flashplugin-nonfree to install the Adobe Flash Plugin, and not get
11:18<padski>updates for security bugs in the Adobe Flash Plugin within reasonable time. "
11:18*Supaplex checks
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11:19<Aleric>And it IS acceptable to rip flash out of debian and leave all the users in the cold?
11:19<Aleric>I really hate debian for things like this :/
11:19<Supaplex>it's non-free
11:20<Supaplex>!tell Aleric -about non-free
11:20<Aleric>I KNOW flash is closed source :?
11:20<padski>Aleric, he says he will maintain it in backports. it is a change of venue intended to bring a better service to users.
11:20<Supaplex>it's not our fault adobe wants to cripple our management of their binaries. think about it... we're not allowed to dist their software, and they're only making one file available for updates
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11:23<hever>Hi I'm writing a shell script and I must create a symlink: /etc/php5/cgi -> . This is no problem if my cwd is /etc/php5/cgi. But now is my question how can I set up the link to . if my cwd is somwehere else ?
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11:25<Aleric>Ok, I've read enough... it's just like with the nvidia drivers: I'll have to write a script myself so the users of debian can still continue to use flash :/
11:25<hever>ln -s /etc/php5 /etc/php5/cgi will create a link: /etc/php5 -> /etc/php5/cgi But I need a relative link...
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11:26<Supaplex>Aleric: read enough, or read it all?
11:26<padski>Aleric, closed-source intel-only flash sucks monstrously, use your time on gnash, please!
11:27<Aleric>padski: I SHOULD be using my time for libcwd and libecc, and several other projects.
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11:28<Aleric>I have a TODO list so long that I'll be dead before I finished it already
11:28<petemc>you need an urgent action items list
11:28<padski>if it weren't for those durned distracting you-tube movies!
11:28<Aleric>Highest on my list is releasing libcwd for debian now-- the version on debian is very old.
11:29<Supaplex>Aleric: how's the one in sid?
11:30<Aleric>I became (next to being the author) the new maintainer of the libcwd package, but in order to satisfy my sponsor, I need to test everything in unstable - which is why I'm setting up a chroot.
11:31<Supaplex>someday you'll catch the vserver bug :)
11:31<hever>Can I change the cwd in a bash script just for one command ?
11:31<Aleric>Doing so (setting up the chroot), it is most efficient to combine that with another thing on my TODO list: writing a HOWTO that involves setting up a chroot, namely: howto maintain firefox on debian amd64 with 32bit plugins, running firefox *outside* the chroot (see which is what I'm currently working on)
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11:42<padski>Aleric, what is that a workaround for ?
11:42<Aleric>padski: context?
11:43<padski>Aleric, the firefox on amd64 thingy
11:43<Aleric>I describe that in the intro.
11:43<padski>Aleric, apologies, I will go read
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11:48<padski>Aleric, would that work with running the flash-plugin in a processor emulator ?
11:49-!-mode/#debian [+l 334] by debhelper
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11:49<Aleric>amd64 can natively run 32-bit assembly, as you will know :P
11:49<Aleric>No need to emulate anything.
11:49<padski>on my ps3
11:49<Aleric>/usr/lib32 is symlink to /emul/whatever, because they the same.
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11:50<Aleric>I don't know about ps3 - this is about amd64
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11:52<padski>I hear that amd64 thingy is pretty popular. If I were to register my ps3 on popcon it would double the number of installations :-)
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12:00<padski>how hard is it to transcode these flash movies to some other format ?
12:00<Aleric>Can't be hard, if you know the right commandline.
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12:03<padski>themill, thanks, superb
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12:04<Aleric>mozilla-plugin-gnash is not in testing either.
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12:05<padski>Aleric, according to p.d.o it is, but it is still the 0.7.2 version
12:06<Aleric>It's on security server, but not on the normal servers.
12:07<padski>is that *because* it is on the security archive ??
12:08<themill>Aleric: what of it? If you're running lenny, you'd have lenny/updates in your sources.list, wouldn't you?
12:08<Aleric>themill: I suppose so, but debootstrap doesn't add that to sources.list...
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12:09<Aleric>You think I should have people add that whenever they create a chroot?
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12:09<padski>why doesn't debootstrap add the security line ?
12:10<Aleric>No idea
12:10<padski>perhaps just because it is a recent development.
12:10<themill>testing security it a new thing... if it doesn't add that line, it probably should though
12:10<padski>I can't think of a reason not to by default
12:11<dpkg>who's on first!!
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12:12<shanebama>oops, sorry, just trying to get to learn this thing
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12:23<Schreck>Hello guys... :)
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12:24<Schreck>Is there a way to have TIME=`date +%H:%M:%S` and TIME=`echo -e "\033[01;31m$TIME\033[m"` in just one line in a bash script ?
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12:28<Supaplex>TIME=$(echo -e "\033[01;31m$(date +%H:%M:%S)\033[m")
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12:33<Schreck>Thanks Supaplex ! :)
12:34<Supaplex>np. $() is the new ``
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12:34<Supaplex>it may be quite old, but that's the better way anyhow.
12:35<RainbowW>am looking for a utility that will take the contents of a directory and break it up into DVD-sized ISOs. Is there such a utility? I know I can do this manually with a number of tools, but considering the size of the data (and the fact that I'll want to repeat this procedure often) a tool that manages this for me would be better. suggestions?
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12:43<Supaplex>RainbowW: shell script. I made one weeks ago, but I have no idea where it's at already. :)
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12:45<RainbowW>uh. will keep that in mind.
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12:47<Aleric>iceweasel looks for plugins in /usr/lib/iceweasel/plugins and /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins
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12:48<Aleric>gnash installs it's plugin in /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins and /usr/lib/firefox/plugins
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12:51<RainbowW>ln -s ...
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12:52<RainbowW>short term fix. long term fix.
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13:06<Schreck>Supaplex I'm begining with scripting ! :)
13:07<NiaB>Supaplex do u think it will help if i block all udp packets?
13:07<Supaplex>I keep my goodies in ~/bin/ but this goodie musta been short term.
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13:07<Supaplex>NiaB: not really. I've been on the receiving end of ddos before. it just sucks.
13:07<Schreck>Is it possible to not display that apache server is shutting dong when calling /etc/init.d/apache2 stop ?
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13:16<McSwordfish>When installing Etch, I’ve got as far as the Domain section of the network config. I do not have a domain running on my home network just now (which consists of my soon-to-be deb based LAMP machine and my windows box). Does what I enter in the domain field make any difference on a small network like mine? Will it be important if I later use dyndns (or similar) to access this machine externally? I’ve looked around online a bit, but found nothing that
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13:21<bernardo>hello debian!
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13:24<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and ABI complications.,,, ask me about <simple sid backport> and <backport caveat>, <>
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13:37<sardior>any ideas of why I cannot get my flashplayer, shockwave, and printer drivers to work. I'm using etch on an AMD64 processor. Each of those plugins/programs require /bin/sh to work and mine isn't.
13:38<faclon>how can I do to run this script at startup
13:38<faclon>root-tail -g 800x450+10+312 -font 6x12 /var/log/syslog,
13:38<faclon>I already add it into the session startup but it doesn't work
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13:47<sardior>I'm going back to fedora 8... bye guys.
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13:48<ServerSide>we soon will see him here
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13:52<ServerSide>do someone know how can I get wifi again? I updated my kernel to 2.6.24, but ipw3945 fucked up, I m-a a-i ipw3945 but this one have prob with building ipw3945-source
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13:53<hathe>ServerSide: kernel headers are borked in .24
13:55<mahdi>i look 4.0r2 released /msg dpkg etch | /msg dpkg etch->lenny | PUBLIC KEY NOT AVAILABLE? /msg ....
13:56<ServerSide>someone tells me to stop use ipw and start iwl
13:56<hathe>ServerSide: broken
13:56<ServerSide>mh, they aren't
13:56<ServerSide>nvidia driver installed with success
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14:07<bernardo>fedora is for...
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14:17<andreG>can anybody read me?
14:17<andreG>why not :) ?
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14:26<sco50000>how do i enable flash in konqueror?
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14:27<mahdi>plugins sco50000?
14:27<sco50000>mahdi: they don't seem to be working
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14:28<mahdi>i load with firefox up then i look bei plugins or settings
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14:28<sco50000>mahdi: i said konqueror, flash is fine in firefox
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14:31<mahdi>i think you can at settings Addons from Firefox impotieren, sorry for my english ;)
14:32<sco50000>bernardo: ?
14:32<bernardo>sorry, wrong message
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14:51<pavillion_>I am having a problem with tar, it just stops midway for some files for some reason
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14:53<raul>hola a parte de este canal hay alguno mas
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14:55<pavillion_>Could it be virus that would caues tar to stop midway (for system security)?
14:55<dkr>no error message?
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14:56<jagerman>Stop as in finishes, or stop as in "nothing happens"?
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14:56<sco50000>pavillion_: i doubt you have a virus
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14:57<pavillion_>it just stops extracting, it supposed to extract up to like 40 files, and it does ony 12
14:57<jagerman>It's a new tar virus called "feather" ;)
14:57<pavillion_>and it makes the shell go all symbols
14:58<pavillion_>and makes directory and file thats all symbols. network
14:58<jagerman>Sounds like a corrupt/broken tar file
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15:00<pavillion_>That sucks
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15:01<pavillion_>its never happenned like that before though, usually corrupt file, it just has missing rar inside but it never before just stopped midway
15:02<pavillion_>unrar usually stops, but tar always goes even if corrupt file
15:03<panagos>is there a program that can add readline functionality to any command line program? something like "$ readline | myprogram" - ie, readline takes responsibility for command line editing, history etc, and pipes commands to the other program
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15:05<jagerman>pavillion_: It depends how it's corrupted; sometimes tar can detect something impossible, but sometimes what's left is "valid" (if weird).
15:05<jagerman>pavillion_: rar builds a checksum into the format so that it can verify the file; tar relies on external tools to do that.
15:06<pavillion_>jagerman, hmm I see thanks
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15:11<Palm76>Hi everybody. I updated my testing box last night wich inclded updates to initscripts and sysv init. On shutdown I now get "killing all remaining prcosesses failed". Is anyone experiencing the same thing?
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15:13<einstein_>Hi everybody! How can I recreate content of /etc/X11? Sorry for my English ;p
15:13<pavillion_>I have that gnome program, called eye, how do I start it from the command line?
15:13<pavillion_>oooh got it eog
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15:15<pavillion_>my movie player is set too bright, I can't figure out how to readjust it
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15:56<Schreck>Does anyone know a software that crypts data ?
15:56<Schreck>Gathond thanks
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15:58<Ouroboros>arg, another kernel upgrade
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16:27<blarson>Schreck: rot13 :-)
16:27<Schreck>blarson: sorry ? :)
16:28<blarson>Schreck: use rot13 for really poor encryption.
16:28<Schreck>blarson: lol Really poor ? :)
16:29<Schreck>In fact, what I need would be a kind of "PGPDisk"
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16:34<dkr>how come aptitude claims "You can only view changelogs of official debian packages"? because the repo(in this case did not split out changelogs the way the official repos do?
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16:38<sun>hi whats a simple program to grab from my usb webcam in my laptop? i tried kino but it seems to want firewire, and xawtv doesnt seem to capture into any usable format (.avi would be best)?
16:38<martok>Hey, does anyone know of any x86-64 testing issues presently which would cause exim4 and apache2 to segfault on reboot? Any libc6 issues or the like running around?
16:38<blarson>dkr: I think it grabs the changelogs from a debian machine.
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16:43<hell-jack>i am using debian etch and my kernel 2.6.24i have nvidia gforce 8400m card i have to install nvidia-glx it wants nvidia-kernel-source 169.09 but this site has 169.09-1 it suggest nvidia-glx nevidia-glx suggest it but nvidia-glx doesnt accept this version i couldnt find nvidia-kernel-source 169.09
16:44<hell-jack>what can i do
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16:44<grasn>can someone tell me whats the name of the 3d desktop software?
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16:45<hell-jack>someoe help me pls
16:46<hell-jack>heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy someone there
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16:47<Robh># /join #tech sk1ttl3z
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16:48<grasn>i cant apt-get install compiz, i get: The following packages have unmet dependencies....
16:49<grasn>can i correct this?
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16:50<witte>grasn: which dependencies
16:50<witte>can you paste them in a pastebin
16:50<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
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16:52<witte>grasn: well, it proposes apt-get install -f
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16:53<grasn>ok what does -f do?
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16:53<witte>grasn: fix broken
16:53<grasn>now it works, thx
16:54<grasn>can someone tell me how to start compiz?
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16:55<dpkg>compiz is, like, a window and composite manager that uses OpenGL for rendering. It runs on <Xgl> and <AIGLX>. It is now in Debian and can run when AIGLX and composite are enabled for your X server. Read for configuration and usage details. Current state of Compiz (et al) in unstable can be found at
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17:09<lupine>hmm. What's a process likely to be doing when it's status is "uninterruptible"?
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17:11<koollman>lupine: blocked on some kind of syscall
17:12<koollman>lupine: like reading from a network filesystem
17:13<ranix>koollman: shortly after its creation, my network filesystem became self-aware. Fearing this, I attempted to pull the plug. However the filesystem, sensing this, sent pornography via email to my boss, thus purging me. I now fear for my life.
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17:13<lupine>koollman: thanks
17:14<koollman>ranix: run. run as fast as you can, and try to find a shelter, isolated from computers. maybe some bunker :)
17:14<lupine>in this case, I suspect, writing stuff to an sqlite database
17:14<koollman>lupine: you can use strace, or some other debugging tools, to get a better idea of what's going on
17:15<ranix>koollman: I have already done that. Right now I am in a bomb shelter in Arizona. There isn't a computer within 20 miles of my present location.
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17:15<lupine>ranix: direct neural uplink?
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17:15<koollman>ranix: good. now, find some tinfoil to wrap around your head, cause your thoughts are intercepted by our irc network ;)
17:16<ranix>I guess I'm boned :(
17:17<ranix>I can't wait for Debian on the Wii
17:17<ranix>that's some sexy hardware
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17:20<dpkg>Hi, ranix!
17:20<ranix>hi, dpkg
17:20<lainlain>how are you
17:20<dpkg>eh, ok, lainlain
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17:26<brunokrebs>how would I search for a file only in the $PATH
17:26<witte>brunokrebs: whereis
17:27<brunokrebs>only this?
17:27<ranix>beat me to it witte
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17:28<witte>brunokrebs: i am not sure it will read only in the path, you should check the man, and also have a look at which
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17:28<witte>brunokrebs: just did that myself, and which seems better suited to your needs if you need to find an executable
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17:37<N2ghtCrawler>Hello, is it posible to run sshd on more than one port?
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17:38<lupine>see /etc/ssh/sshd_config
17:39<jagerman>N2ghtCrawler: Yes, just specify multiple Port lines (or ListenAddress lines)
17:39<lupine>I forget if you want to have multiple Port directives or have a comma-seperated list
17:40<themill>N2ghtCrawler: for details, man 5 sshd_config
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17:40<jagerman>Shhhh! Don't give away the Secret Source of Information!
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17:43<N2ghtCrawler>Thanks all. It was a pice of cace
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18:02<brunokrebs>hi I just installed liballegro-dev but when I try to compile an example I get errors like the compiler does not know about allegro
18:02<themill>brunokrebs: can you pastebin the entire output for us?
18:02<brunokrebs>how do I tell c++ that allegro ins installed
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18:06<themill>brunokrebs: In your compilation command, you will need to specify that the compiler should also link to a library. something like: g++ -lalleg lesson1.cpp
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18:06<themill>brunokrebs: as a general rule, every time you have a #include for something that is a little non-standard, you will need a -l entry for the linker step.
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18:07<sco50000>is there an "official" debian usenet group?
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18:08<witte>Schreck: debian-user can be read as a newsgroup
18:08<witte>that was for sco50000
18:09-!-mode/#debian [+l 329] by debhelper
18:09<witte>tab-completion is nice, but people with the same two characters for their nickname should be forbidden :P
18:09<themill>Everyone should be made to start with a unique character... all 314 of them
18:10<witte>sco50000: could also be debian-users instead of debian-user, i'm not sure
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18:10<witte>themill: you are right. Of course, the w is taken by me :-)
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18:11<sco50000>witte: thanks
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18:20<rado__>anybody from warsaw?
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18:27<dpkg>rumour has it, pl is perl, "packet loss", or polska -> (on
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18:37<sco50000>witte: debian.user seems empty... i'm confused. is my news program just not downloading it for some reason?
18:37<witte>sco50000: debian-user
18:38<witte>with a dash
18:38<sco50000>my mail program seems to show everything with periods in between. debian-user doesn't exist
18:39<sco50000>witte: linux.debian.user works
18:40<witte>yeah, you are right, the mailing list is debian-user, but if i am correct it is linked with a newsgroup (and that shoudl be linux.debian.user)
18:40<witte>I used to follow it, but i have no time for that anymore :-)
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18:41<sco50000>heh, it looks like a mailing list that get a LOT of messages
18:41<witte>sco50000: you don't feel lonely if you subscribe to that one :-)
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18:53<Aleric>Which package supports viewing a pdf file inside firefox?
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18:54<streuner>Aleric: any extern pdf-viewer will work...
18:57<streuner>thats basically good enough, but just use "apt-cache search pdf plugin" or such
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18:57<Aleric>So, what do I need to install to see them inside the firefox window/tab's ?
18:57<themill>Aleric: the non-free acroread can do that. But you don't want to. It's a pain in the arse.
18:57<Aleric>What is the name of that package, themill?
18:58<Aleric>acroread-plugins ?
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19:00*streuner cannot see much difference if you using an extern pdf-viewer or some plugin
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19:02<themill>streuner: other than fewer things going crash when one goes bang, the ability to multi-task more easy, less chance for memory leaks, no confusion over whose menus are doing what.... :)
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19:04<brunokrebs>is it possible to do a series of command with the output of aptitude search?
19:04<brunokrebs>I mean, install all the libraries that it finds
19:04<Aleric>Can't find mozilla-acroread anywhere
19:04<themill>!tell Aleric about dmme
19:05<Aleric>I already have that, themill
19:06<themill>Aleric: in which case, "aptitude install mozilla-acroread" would work.
19:07<Aleric>No candidate version found for mozilla-acroread
19:07<themill>Aleric: in which case you obviously don't have debian-multimedia correctly installed...
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19:08<Aleric>hikaru:~/tmp>grep debian-multimedia /etc/apt/sources.list
19:08<Aleric>deb testing main
19:08<Aleric>deb unstable main
19:08<Aleric>deb-src unstable main
19:08-!-Aleric was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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19:10*themill looks for the line that contains "etch"
19:10<Aleric>I don't have etch, I have testing :/
19:11<themill>Aleric: anything else you'd like to tell us... like that you're running powerpc of something...
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19:12<Aleric>I suppose that's the reason - I have amd64
19:13<themill>Aleric: and you expect anything non-free to work at all?
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19:17<TheFearsomeFufu>How do I list the currently loaded modules in the kernel? I tried "modprobe -l" but that listed a certain file, but the file doesn't exist on my filesystem (I rebooted after removing it).
19:17<TheFearsomeFufu>I'm just getting my wireless card working and I had to remove the kernel/net/ieee80211/ driver
19:18<themill>TheFearsomeFufu: you got that answer when you asked on freenode too.
19:18*TheFearsomeFufu looks
19:18<TheFearsomeFufu>Oh, I was looking for a nick hilight on it.
19:18<TheFearsomeFufu>I apoglize for asking twice.
19:18<witte>TheFearsomeFufu: which wireless card?
19:19<TheFearsomeFufu>I'm using the drivers and instructions
19:19<TheFearsomeFufu>on deb lenny
19:19<themill>You have my deepest sympathies.
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19:21<TheFearsomeFufu>I was tempted to go buy a 500 foot ethernet cable instead
19:21<lupine>well, that's well in range for Ethernet
19:21<witte>TheFearsomeFufu: i did not even know that realtek made also wireless cards, I hope they are better than their ethernet cards
19:21<lupine>or you could buy a replacement wireless card
19:21<TheFearsomeFufu>It's on a laptop
19:21<TheFearsomeFufu>I guess I could get a USB card
19:22<lupine>and if you open the laptop, you'll find that it'll be plugged in using a miniPCI interface
19:22<lupine>failing that, PCMCIA or USB ftw
19:22<brunokrebs>how do I use aptitude or apt-get to install all packages shown by aptitude search blablabla?
19:22<lupine>Atheros do good miniPCI cards
19:22<TheFearsomeFufu>well the rtl-wifi drivers were working for a bit, then my system crashed
19:22<lupine>brunokrebs: with the joy of pipes and awk
19:22*themill wonders about going back to carrier pigeons
19:22<TheFearsomeFufu>so I'm trying it one more card
19:23<brunokrebs>lupine sorry for my ignorance, but what would be that?
19:23<brunokrebs>| pipe ok, I know a little how to use
19:24<TheFearsomeFufu>Oh, quick question while I'm here. How can I get rid of IPv6 completely? I guess removing the ipv6 module? Should I put it in /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist ?
19:24<brunokrebs>but I dont know how to take only the name of the packages and throw it on apt-get install or else
19:24<witte>brunokrebs: i would have a look at the "cut" program, you want to select the first column
19:24<lupine>you pipe the output of aptitude search to awk or cut or something similar, to transform it into a space-seperated list, then pass it to apt-get install
19:25<lupine>cut -f1 -d' ' gets you a \n-seperated list
19:25<brunokrebs>ok, I'll try this
19:26<lupine>sudo apt-get install $(apt-cache search foo |cut -d' ' -f1)
19:26<lupine>that works here. but I'd suggest you try with apt-get install -s to begin with, to make sure it's doing what you want
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19:29<themill>brunokrebs: if you're wanting to search and then install like that, then the curses mode interface to aptitude might be better for you. Or synaptic.
19:31<brunokrebs>cool I learned how cut works thx lupine
19:32<brunokrebs>synaptic would throw a graphic interface no?
19:32<lupine>np, and yep
19:33<brunokrebs>I think I stay with bash to learn more
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19:44<brunokreb1>I think I have to setup debian to warn me when Im running out of battery :P
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19:45<themill>dpkg: g'night
19:45<dpkg>Sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite :)
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19:55<istoc>Hi. I'm having problems connecting to trackers with rtorrent. Iptables are configured such that my default policy for input is drop. Do I need to open ports other than the listening port range if the tracker url is
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19:58<amphi>istoc: it's nothing to do with that; you have to allow inbound traffic to whatever port rtorrent listens on there
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19:59<istoc>amphi: I have exceptions for the listening range in the input chain for rtorrent but I'm still getting "Couldn't connect to tracker" erros.
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19:59<amphi>istoc: either the tracker is down, or your outbound rules are blocking it
20:01<istoc>amphi: Could there be any other reasons? Output is set to allow and I'm getting a torrent with a ton of trackers but still getting less than 2 kbs.
20:01<Aleric>For torrents (I use azureus) I have ports 56881:56889 open, TCP and UDP.
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20:01<Aleric>I think that range can be configured in the client.
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20:02<Aleric>If you use the default range, then your ISP might block it.
20:02<istoc>Aleric: Is there a good way to test what ports are open?
20:02<amphi>istoc: you can test if your reachable with t3h gibs0n - point your browser to where NNNNN is the port rtorrent is set to use
20:03<amphi>*your rtorrent
20:03<istoc>amphi: Ok Ill try that, thanks
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20:04<Aleric>I also only get like 2 kB/s per connection by the way - often less, just a few hunderd bytes per second.
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20:05<Sweeney-Todd>hi, i need a hand connecting to Bitlbee to my proxy server. I am using Xchat and SQUID. When I change the bitlbee.conf file to put in my proxy in I get HTTP/1.0 503 service unavailable proxy transversal fail
20:05<Aleric>You need a really good tracker with a good community to see high speeds :/
20:05-!-LimCore is now known as Guest440
20:05<istoc>Aleric: I meant in total. I'm also at a university. We have really good connections :)
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20:07<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: You need to configure your Squid proxy to permit clients to use HTTP CONNECT for TCP 6667.
20:07<Aleric>Can I force apt-get to install this anyway?
20:07<Aleric> acroread-debian-files: Depends: acroread (>= 8.1.1-0.7) but 8.1.1-0.6 is to be installed
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20:07<Sweeney-Todd>gsimons that is done already
20:07<Sweeney-Todd>Xchat is working fine on that port
20:07<Sweeney-Todd>through my proxy
20:08<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: Please provide the contents of your /etc/bitlbee/bitlbee.conf and /etc/squid/squid.conf files at a paste site.
20:08<dpkg>Do not paste more than 3 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or or for pics. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste!
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20:09<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: Additionally, what services are you attempting to connect to (eg. which IM services(s)) via bitlbee?
20:10<brunokreb1>I dont know if it is the right place to ask, but I think you guys might know the answer
20:10<Sweeney-Todd>yes gsimons, msn mainly
20:10<brunokreb1>any #include that I make in my cpp program has to have a file with that name in /usr/include/c++... ??
20:11<brunokreb1>like #include iostream, and there is a /usr/include/c++/4.1.2/iostream
20:11<brunokreb1>#include <iostream>*
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20:13<lupine>brunokreb1: you can use #include "..."
20:15<brunokreb1>yes, but I mean if anything between " " or <> has to have a file with the same name in /usr/include/c++ ???
20:15<lupine>well, no
20:15<lupine>that would be silly
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20:15<brunokreb1>I don`t know
20:15-!-gsimmons [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20:15<lupine>I do :)
20:15<brunokreb1>hehehehhe thx
20:16<brunokreb1>anyway, so I installed all the packages related to allegro
20:16<brunokreb1>then I try to compile a program with allegro functions and it gives me a lot of errors
20:16<brunokreb1>g++ code.cpp -lalleg gives me tons of errors
20:16<Sweeney-Todd>gsimons: here is the bitlbee.conf file
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20:21<Sweeney-Todd>gsimmons: here is the squid.conf file
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20:24<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: You'll need to specify additional ACLs to permit your other IM services. IIRC, MSN uses TCP 1863.
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20:27<lupine>you shouldn't need open inbound ports for a basic messenger client, surely?
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20:29<Sweeney-Todd>gsimmons: I still get the same error message even if I open port 1863 for msn
20:31<Sweeney-Todd>the way to get connected to bitlbee is /server I think the problem being that the connexion is refused on
20:31<Sweeney-Todd>through my proxy
20:31<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: Did you restart Squid? grep your /var/log/squid/access.log for TCP_DENIED.
20:32<Sweeney-Todd>i did restart squid but didnt check the log to see if I has a miss
20:33<Sweeney-Todd>gsimmons: I do get a tcp_miss/503 in the log on port 6667
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20:34<Sweeney-Todd>should I try to pick another port for bitlbee? xchat connects fine to the port 6667 but may be bitlbee needs to know a different port ?
20:35<Sweeney-Todd>since I am going direct with my proxy to (localhost) for bitlbee
20:36<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: Please provide your bitlbee configuration as previously requested.
20:37<Sweeney-Todd>gsimmons: bitlbee configuration
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20:42<Thotter>My crashing program isn't creating a core file, even though ulimit -c reports unlimited. This is on Debian Etch. Can someone help me with that?
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20:50<Thotter>When I create a simple application that does nothing but crash, it does create a core
20:50<Thotter>But with the app I actually need core files from, it doesn't work :(
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20:54<Thotter>Nevermind. The problem was that the program has a signal handler which handled the SIGSEGV and then exited normally
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21:00<Sweeney-Todd>gsimmons: any thoughts ?
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21:05<devolic2know>Hey guys, I have a really old computer P1 or 2, 3 Gig HD, and 48 MB of ram someone said to use the netinst file. Is that correct?
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21:07<Thotter>Netinstall doesn't really mean less will be installed, just that it'll download what it needs so that you don't have to burn a few dvd's to do it
21:07<devolic2know>Also, what should I use as a browser and for a light desktop (WM, IWM, Flux, Blackbox) which one is better for that old of a computer?
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21:08<gsimmons>Sweeney-Todd: I'm unable to reproduce your issue, using your Squid configuration. I've xchat connecting to bitlbee (with this client configured to use the Squid proxy), along with bitlbee configured to use Squid for its outgoing connections. I added an ACL for TCP 5222 (jabber) to test. I can only assume there's an issue with your cache peering.
21:09<Sweeney-Todd>ok thanks a lot gsimmons
21:10<devolic2know>is links the browser or desktop?
21:10<Thotter>devolic2know: Sorry, I don't know. I never had to setup a low-resource system. I suggest XFCE for desktop though, lightweight but still similar to things like KDE or GNOME. Of course, if you despise those, Fluxbox would be better :P
21:12<amphi>or openbox ;)
21:12<SeveredCross>For the really sadistic in your family.
21:13<Thotter>.. or twm.
21:13<Thotter>If you really relaly really need your lightweightness and refuse any features
21:13<devolic2know>I heard XFCE is quite more than i need but not as bad as kde or gnome
21:14<SeveredCross>Isn't twm installed by default if you install Desktop Environment as a package selection from netinst?
21:14<Thotter>I think it is
21:14<blarson>I use olvwm, but it has quirks and probably isn't good for new users.
21:15<Thotter>I use XFCE now, used gnome, fluxbox and windowmaker before
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21:16<Thotter>Hmm, or you could just install xfwm and then install the xfce programs you really need
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21:16<Thotter>Not sure if that'd work though
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21:18<Thotter>I'm going to sleep now, goodnight
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21:20<istoc>Hi, how can I check what ports my isp is blocking?
21:20<lupine>istoc: write them a nice letter
21:20<lupine>or try to connect to the port in question to a known-open server
21:20<istoc>Yea but wouldnt I need something listening on all the ports I wanna connect to?
21:21<lupine>that's what "known open server" means
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21:40<istoc>Hi, what's the difference in these two rtorrent config settings? ip (# The ip address reported to the tracker.) and bind (# The ip address the listening socket and outgoing connections is bound to).
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21:43<lupine>istoc: it tells the tracker to talk to the one specified on 'ip'; and listens on the one specified on 'bind'
21:44<istoc>lupine: Is it alright if I use a dynamic ip for both?
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21:55<geekitty>can anybody help me fix the problems with installing aplications?
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21:56<geekitty>i have dpkg... error
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22:00<javo>hello. is it possible to install compiz-fusion without installing privative ati drivers?
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22:03<istoc>Do most bittorrent clients (Azureus/utorrent) allow complete RC4 encryption?
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22:19-!-mode/#debian [+l 316] by debhelper
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22:25<W3ird_N3rd>Hi. A few days ago I tried to install debian testing i386 with de netinst iso, but I could not install grub. I now saw there was a bug. Now I downloaded the netinst iso from 04-Feb-2008 but I still can't install grub. Is this correct?
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22:26<W3ird_N3rd>So I mean the patch for grub did not yet make it to netinst iso?
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22:35<blarson>W3ird_N3rd: If you are using the testing/unstable images, you should ask on #debian-boot . Use etch if you want a stable release.
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22:59<RIVE>Hello, good evening.
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23:05<steven-m>are there any gizmo project users here?
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23:13<W3ird_N3rd>blarson: yes and okay. I wanted to install testing because I had the idea I wanted a reasonably recent iceweasel.
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23:14<blarson>W3ird_N3rd: it may be easier to install stable and then upgrade to testing.
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23:16<W3ird_N3rd>I guess that's an option as well. Just started writing the stable netinst image. CD-RW, best thing since sliced bread.
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23:50<W3ird_N3rd>stable does install grub correctly so the bug is still in the testing/sid netinst. Thanks :)
23:52<blarson>W3ird_N3rd: please file an install report in case the problem isn't known yet. beta1 should come out soon.
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23:54<beginner>hello, how can I download recursively all contents of an URL, I tried with wget with different options like -R -lx .. I get just the index.html file but not the the contents, can someoneone give me advice please?
23:56<tmg1|cl131>I take it the index.html doesn't link to the contents?
23:56<tmg1|cl131>does anything link to the contents?
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23:57<beginner>the contents under the URL
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23:58<beginner>the contents under the URL:
23:58<tmg1|cl131>I have been trying to install etch from floppies; this is attempt #3; the 3 previous times there was no pcmcia support after install. Beyond keeping an eye on the output of lsmod during the install process to make 100% sure I know what modules I need afterwards, is there any trick to making sure pcmcia is left installed after the installation is complete, and the system is rebooted?
23:58<tmg1|cl131>pcmcia works fine before reboot
23:58<tmg1|cl131>beginner: so like Card Services for Linux is a complete PCMCIA or ``PC Card'' support package. It includes a set of loadable kernel modules that implement a version of the Card Services applications program interface, a set of client drivers for specific cards, and a card manager daemon that can respond to card insertion and removal events, loading and unloading drivers on demand. It supports ``hot swapping'' of most card types, so cards ca
23:58<tmg1|cl131>ny time.
23:58<tmg1|cl131>ACK sorry
23:59<tmg1|cl131>wtf copy buffer
23:59*tmg1|cl131 kicks ubuntu
---Logclosed Tue Feb 05 00:00:06 2008