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#debian IRC Logs for 2008-03-01

---Logopened Sat Mar 01 00:00:00 2008
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01:08<Tr3buchet>hello folks!
01:09<Tr3buchet>so i heard #debian was a busy channel...
01:17<vook>sometimes Tr3buchet
01:17<Tr3buchet>oh thank goodness, something isn't broken.
01:17<Tr3buchet>well i'm sure something somewhere is, but not this client :D
01:18<Tr3buchet>i figured 225 users I was bound to have seen something by now
01:18<vook>heh - 225 users - many of which never log off.
01:20<Tr3buchet>well.. maybe not the best time to ask then
01:20<Tr3buchet>but the reason I came here was to discuss my considering a new linux distro
01:20<vook>ask away
01:20<Tr3buchet>i've been using this gentoo for a long while now
01:20<vook>phooey on that
01:21<vook>apt-build can do anything emerge or portage can do.
01:21<Tr3buchet>it's pretty much served me well except once, unless you count trying to install it
01:21<Tr3buchet>that one time i was trying to update something that lead to a long series of updates which lead to me updating portage and trying to update world
01:21<vook>it's all in good fun, as long as you come back to debian in the end.
01:22<Tr3buchet>8 hours later i was unable to do much.. so i reinstalled that ninja
01:22<Tr3buchet>anyway i need to update again
01:22<Tr3buchet>pick something new
01:22<Tr3buchet>and I've always heard great things about debian
01:22<Tr3buchet>fairly fast
01:22<vook>have you used debian before?
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01:22<Tr3buchet>peopel who would use gentoo but don't like compiling and want a better package manager use debian etc
01:23<Tr3buchet>i have not
01:23<Tr3buchet>and by old i don't mean out of date, i mean it's been around
01:23<Tr3buchet>so i get to asking a couple of friends of mine what they'd recommend just for kicks
01:24<vook>the thing is Tr3buchet, compiling everything from scratch is nothing new. Gentoo does nothing new. The BSD's can compile everything, as can debian. See apt-build.
01:24<Tr3buchet>right exactly. i'm not saying compiling everything is good
01:24<vook>yep. I respect Gentoo - but this is where it's at :)
01:24<Tr3buchet>maybe its a little faster, but it's a right pain in the ass when it comes to USE flags and having to recompile/install dependencies etc
01:25<Tr3buchet>i just don't want to mess with it
01:25<Tr3buchet>so anyway a couple of my friends starting talking up ubuntu...
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01:25<Tr3buchet>for some reason i've always had a bad opinion of it, not sure why really.. maybe it was the time i played with it and to use sudo over and over
01:25<vook>Tr3buchet: ya - well, FreeBSD is a little faster too. Looking at the whole OS though, debian does more right than anything else that I've seen.
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01:26<vook>Tr3buchet: just make sure you start with true debian - a netinst - none of those debian-like OS's.
01:27<Tr3buchet>I started looking around to see if I could find a good comparison of the two. comparing gentoo and debian is easy. ubuntu and debian not so much. All I can find is flames and flames and people unhappy or saying debian is dieing or ubuntu devs are irresponsible etc etc
01:27<Tr3buchet>right i've got the netinst iso sitting here on my desk
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01:27<Tr3buchet>i just wanted to ask and see what the deal was with this ubuntu from some actual debian people
01:28<Tr3buchet>before i mess with trying it anyway
01:28<vook>Tr3buchet: ubuntu isn't evil or anything - but I think ubuntu users miss something - part of the linux experience.
01:29<babyseal>exactly ... got some ubuntu cds ... some debian cds ... but actually silk gloves are not made for smashing but for fitting
01:29<Tr3buchet>i see
01:29<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: I've used both extensively; if you're coming from Gentoo, you'll be happier with Debian
01:29<Tr3buchet>p_quarles: is there an easy way to say why?
01:30<babyseal>(this is why i failed to install ubuntu whereas i don't know which programs to install on debian)
01:30<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: Ubuntu is great for people who *want* to miss parts of the Linux experience; but it's not ideal for expreienced users
01:30<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: I
01:31<vook>My feeling is that any distro that doesn't make xsnow available in the default install has issues. Linux just isn't linux without xsnow.
01:31<p_quarles>I've found Debian to be faster, more lean out of the box, less buggy -- and I like the rolling releases
01:31<Tr3buchet>i see, well that makes sense. ubuntu is all about ease of use and such. but..
01:31<babyseal>and more or less the same issue
01:31<Tr3buchet>rolling releases means that everything gets updated continually as opposed to release 1, release 2 etc?
01:32<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: depends on which release you use
01:32<p_quarles>Stable (Etch) gets infrequent updates on anything, but is definitely stable
01:32<p_quarles>the testing and unstable distros are continually updated with new packages
01:32<Tr3buchet>now "release" has been bandyed about enough i've become lost to your meaning..
01:33<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: there are three currently available versions of Debian: stable, testing, and unstable
01:33<p_quarles>the first gets security updates, with the option of enabling backports
01:34<vook>Tr3buchet: and once you are comfortable - you can start adding other repositories (like for example).
01:34<p_quarles>the others are continually updated with newer versions of applications
01:34<Tr3buchet>it appears i would like the unstable version best then, i dislike having to worry about a new release..
01:35<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: go with testing; unstable *is*
01:35<Tr3buchet>testing is more stable than unstable then.
01:36<Tr3buchet>so if i took your meaning correctly, testing is just the stable release with continually updating packages?
01:36<babyseal>is there a way to set unstalbe during net install with mini cd?
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01:36<babyseal>(i usually do a upgrade afterwards)
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01:37<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: testing is the release that is being built into the next stable release
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01:37<p_quarles>it contains newer packages that the stable version will never see
01:38<p_quarles>babyseal: you would just add the repository, and then run a dist-upgrade, I believe
01:38<Tr3buchet>ok so say i get the stable release, it's been 9 months or so, things need updating... what do i do in debian?
01:39<Tr3buchet>that didn't make sense.. say i get stable, install, fast forward 9 nine months, things need updating... same question.
01:39<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: nothing would *need* updating; all security patches are continually applied to the stable version
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01:39<Tr3buchet>what do you mean "continually applied"
01:39<p_quarles>if you wanted newer versions of apps, you could use the backports repository
01:40<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: I mean that the security patches will install themselves automatically when you run updates
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01:40<Tr3buchet>i'm not saying i want bleeding edge by any means. I'm just saying i don't what outdated stuff..
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01:40<vook>Tr3buchet: it's not really automatic. You have to run - aptitude update && aptitude dist-upgrade
01:40<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: for the sake of comparison: Firefox is at v in stable; (current) in testing
01:40<Tr3buchet>and thats a big update all applications situation?
01:41<Tr3buchet>right ok there's a good example..
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01:41<Tr3buchet>firefox gets updated all the time (too often for me really)
01:41<vook>Tr3buchet: if you want to move to "testing" for example, you just modify /etc/apt/sources.list - go to and read more :)
01:41<Tr3buchet>how do i get the new version if i've been running debain for a while
01:42<Tr3buchet>in gentoo portage had to be updated, and then you just emerge -u firefox
01:42<vook>Tr3buchet: just run aptitude update && aptitude dist-upgrade - thats it. It'll upgrade everything.
01:43<vook>Tr3buchet: just run it daily - everything is always secure and up-to-date
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01:43<Tr3buchet>so aptitude update i guess is synonymous with updating portage, and dist upgrade is likewise with emerge -u world
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01:45<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: analogous, yeah, not synomymous
01:45<Tr3buchet>so "aptitude update && aptitude dist-upgrade" is something i could schedule to run each evening?
01:45<p_quarles>you can easily make it a cron job
01:45<Tr3buchet>ah analogous. true
01:45<Tr3buchet>right that's what I was saying
01:46<vook>easy peasy
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01:46<Tr3buchet>hmmm.. but if i installed stable.. new releases(with the exception of security updates) would only come along once every 6 months(or whatever the release interim is) right?
01:47<chealer>Tr3buchet: dist-upgrade is (more or less) interactive
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01:48<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: the release cycle is very flexible in Debian; when it's ready it's ready (another reason to like it, imho)
01:48<chealer>Tr3buchet: 6 months is the Ubuntu target. Debian releases much more "when it's ready"...which is much longer.
01:48<vook>Tr3buchet: no - it varies. Etch receives updates weekly
01:48<chealer>vook: but they're only security updates (basically)
01:48<vook>(weekly meaning - often, not "weekly") daily sometimes.
01:48<Tr3buchet>I'm still missing how to get an updated application if the debian releases only come along every so often.
01:49<Tr3buchet>firefox as an example
01:50<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: well, again, that's why a lot of people use the testing release -- it gets those updates regularly
01:50<p_quarles>it's just the stable release that's limited to security updates
01:51<vook>Tr3buchet: if you want an up-to-date system - you add the testing repository, but default to stable - you can set up apt to pull from testing only when directed to (which would enable you to have a more up-to-date Firefox (iceweasel), for example, while still staying in Etch.
01:51<Tr3buchet>oh i see so "aptitude update && aptitude dist-upgrade" on the testing release will be getting updated applications as soon as they are added to the testing repository(which ought to be very soon after the applications are released themselves)
01:52<vook>*you add/you can add
01:52<chealer>vook: nah, you need to master APT to do that
01:52<Tr3buchet>so would you suggest getting the stable release, installing, and then adding the testing repository if there is something i notice i need?
01:53<Tr3buchet>or rather installing from the testing repository if there is omethign i need
01:53<chealer>Tr3buchet: right, except it's not necessarily very soon after
01:53<vook>chealer: I dunno - I don't consider myself an APT master. maybe I am?
01:53<babyseal>for that one would have to know how to install from testing repository ...
01:53<p_quarles>you'd need to master APT, or read a good tutorial:
01:53<Tr3buchet>right.. basically what kicked off my rather large quarrel wtih gentoo was a new version of ventrilo coming out...
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01:54<babyseal>(what was actually my question)
01:54<vook>chealer: you are right though :) I don't want to scare them away.
01:54<Tr3buchet>i just wanted the new version of ventrilo and i ended up trying to upgrade the whole system..
01:54<chealer>vook: well, what did you install this way?
01:55<vook>chealer: do you want a list?
01:55<Tr3buchet>would you say it's easier to just install the testing release instead of installing stable and trying to setup apt to get the testing releases ?
01:55<chealer>vook: I'm just curious. if you have one handy, yes
01:56<vook>chealer: I'm not going to give you a list of all the software I've installed in linux.
01:56<Tr3buchet>and included in that question is the difficulty of fixing something which might break becuase i'm in the testing release?
01:56<chealer>p_quarles: that's about testing/unstable mix. that requires skills/luck, but much less than a stable/testing mix.
01:57<chealer>vook: I was talking about what you installed from testing.
01:57<kapil>Tr3buchet: "testing" is called that because it involves that from its users --- testing. and consequently reporting bugs etc. there is less outright breakage in "testing" but bugs of various colours do float around.
01:57<vook>chealer: ok. I pull from experimental and unstable as well.
01:57<vook>chealer: I haven't kept track.
01:57<Tr3buchet>kapil: so you would recommend the "testing" release?
01:58<chealer>Tr3buchet: yes (unless you need nothing from testing)
01:58<p_quarles>chealer: point taken; it's probably easiest just to grab .debs directly via ftp -- that introduces dependencies, but leaves less up to fate
01:58<Tr3buchet>but if you posses the constitution, you don't have to worry about fate.
01:58<kapil>Tr3buchet: only if you are committed to helping Debian improve --- by diagnosing and reporting bugs.
01:59<chealer>p_quarles: even then, the dependencies make it hard and then you'd have to manually monitor your system's security.
01:59<kapil>p_quarles: what you suggest is not good.
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01:59<Tr3buchet>i think to sum up what i am: i'm after a situation where i have a stable system with the ability to install new apps when they come out if needed.
02:00<Tr3buchet>which release is that?
02:00<p_quarles>Tr3buchet: testing; it's stable for the majority of use cases
02:00<kapil>Tr3buchet: if you only need one or two applications from "testing" then it is better to install them in a "chroot" created with "debootstrap".
02:01<suiside>Tr3buchet: you want to keep the cake and eat it, you have to pick one
02:01<Tr3buchet>lucky i don't like cake then..
02:01<p_quarles>chealer: true; what I said is pretty strictly dependent on the specific package in question
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02:01<Tr3buchet>i'll avoid having to setup chroot environments every chance i get.
02:01<kapil>the chroot can be replaced by a vserver if you are really keen on keeping your stable end clean.
02:02<Tr3buchet>i don't even know what debootstrap is
02:02<chealer>Tr3buchet: stable or testing, but it depends on what you consider "stable" and "when they come out".
02:02<kapil>Tr3buchet: apt-get install debootstrap or apt-get install cdebootstrap. you'll never have to install Debian from CD again.
02:03<Tr3buchet>i haven't ever installed it the first time
02:04<peyman>hi everyone. i am using Etch on my laptop, and faced this problem that my mouse moves extremely slowly. how can i fix it?
02:04<suiside>Tr3buchet: if you want a system that just works, go for stable, if are prepared to fix occasional problems and give feedback about them in exchange for fresher packages or if you have an specific issue on stable which you are sure would be fixed in testing, then you could consider using testing
02:04<alaya>xset m 5 1
02:04<peyman>oh, and it is slow only when i use the mouse pad on laptop. but it's ok with external mouse
02:04<alaya>different sensitivity
02:05<peyman>alaya: thanks
02:05<alaya>you can also change values in /sys/devices/platform/i8042/serio1/sensitivity
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02:05<Tr3buchet>if i go with stable, and a new version of ventrilo comes out, am i unable to upgrade it simply until the next stable release?
02:06<alaya>the path will differ according to device
02:07<alaya>peyman: e.g. echo -n 155 > /sys/devices/platform/i8042/serio1/sensitivity, echo -n 8 > /sys/devices/platform/i8042/serio1/thresh
02:08<suiside>Tr3buchet: not ontopic here picking and installing unstable versions of packages alongside stable versions in gentoo is in fact quite simple, if you ended up uprading your whole system to unstable you were propably doing it the wrong way
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02:08<chealer>Tr3buchet: not necessarily. you could find a backport or make one.
02:09<Tr3buchet>right that was in fact the case, i had a few different applications that needed updating, and instead of doing them individually i figured i'd just upgrade the whole system. lazyness turned out to be a bad thing in that case.
02:09<alaya>!tell Tr3buchet about backport
02:09<alaya>simple backports from testing or sid are usually pretty easy for smaller apps
02:10<Tr3buchet>thats what i would be after in fact
02:11<peyman>alaya: the first one didin't work, let me check the other one.
02:11<chealer>Tr3buchet: are you talking about the ventrilo server?
02:11<alaya>!doesn't work
02:11<dpkg>Look buddy, "doesn't work" is a vague statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message".
02:11<Tr3buchet>i am
02:12<Tr3buchet>ventrilo 3.0 was not compatible with 2.3 so i needed to upgrade.
02:12<Tr3buchet>oh!! "With this knowledge you can live the life of eternal upgrade :-)"
02:12<Tr3buchet>i'm set now!!
02:12<Tr3buchet>thats always the life i wanted to live too
02:13<chealer>Tr3buchet: it's not distributed by Debian... so in this case it would do no difference.
02:15<Tr3buchet>i guess i'll be installing that one from scratch then
02:15<alaya>Tr3buchet: does someone else package it?
02:15<Tr3buchet>you can emerge it straight out in gentoo
02:15<alaya>into a .deb?
02:16<Tr3buchet>i wouldn't have any idea
02:16<alaya>you are not in debian?
02:16<alaya>what does gentoo have to do with it?
02:16<Tr3buchet>i am in gentoo
02:16<suiside>Tr3buchet: if you're installing it from scratch make a deb package of it, it'll save you alot of hassle later on if you're upgarding it, don't be lazy this time
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02:16<Tr3buchet>i'm in the switch to debian market
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02:17<alaya>some 3rd party may package it
02:17<alaya>i think used to have a searcable database
02:18<Tr3buchet>well you can get it straight from ventrilo's site you just have to install it manually
02:19<Tr3buchet>it just happened to be in gentoo portage tree
02:19<alaya>then read the new maintainers guide on how to build a deb
02:20<Tr3buchet>i wonder how many times i could install it manually in the time it takes to figure that out
02:21<Tr3buchet>what would be the benefit of making it into a deb package?
02:23<Tr3buchet>i think stable and backports would keep me sufficiently happy
02:23<Tr3buchet>(from the previous discussion)
02:23<alaya>there are many reasons
02:23<alaya>i like it for control change reasons
02:24<Tr3buchet>the only one i can think of would be if i was to reinstall it later or on something else (hopefully neither would happen) it'd be easier.
02:24<Tr3buchet>but i'm not really sure what you maen
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02:28<alaya>s/control change/change control/
02:29<Tr3buchet>ah i see
02:30<Tr3buchet>"Repackaging and/or Redistribution of the the client and/or server is in direct violation of the license."
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02:30<Tr3buchet>i guess that solves that problem..
02:31<alaya>that has no relevance
02:31<Tr3buchet>personal use?
02:31<alaya>you are only doing it for yourself
02:31<alaya>if you put it up for download, possibly
02:31<Tr3buchet>a .deb would allow me to reconfigure or remove it using the package manager right?
02:31<Tr3buchet>thats sorta the situation?
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02:32<Tr3buchet>also.. now i'm pretty much sold on debain, but I'll ask once more just to seal the deal.. only reason i've gotten to go with deb over ubuntu is that coming from gentoo i'll probably like it better. anything else?
02:32<alaya>but if its on only one box for personal use, maybe easier not to
02:33<Tr3buchet>well thats what it would be for sure. strange that gentoo is in direct violation of ventrilo's license..
02:34<alaya>i use both actually
02:34<alaya>but still my *main* system is always sid
02:34<Tr3buchet>not sure what that is
02:34<alaya>I'm just so used to it, and think it is the best design
02:34<alaya>sid is the unstable branch
02:34<Tr3buchet>oh ok
02:34<Tr3buchet>naming conventions.......
02:35<alaya>if you are knowlegable and not afraid to handle issues, it can be ok
02:35<alaya>otherwise choose stable
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02:35<Tr3buchet>i guess i'm in the somewhat knowledgeable and not wanting to mess with issues school
02:35<imperia>guys what was the command for purging all packages i have flaged with
02:35<imperia>p flag
02:36<alaya>sid is usually pretty stable for me, but some people would have my head for recommending it
02:36<alaya>but i like the idea of it being like a continual flowing stream from upstream source downstream
02:36<Tr3buchet>yeah. first people to make that stable, win the world
02:37<alaya>i don't know though, can it, by definition, ever be stable?
02:37<chealer>imperia: which p flag?
02:37<alaya>i just like always having new, cool shit on my desktop ;-)
02:37<Tr3buchet>stable is just the opposite of crashing
02:38<Tr3buchet>well since you've used both why should i use deb over ubuntu?
02:39<alaya>on my dad's machine i put ubuntu, because its still recent but not changing constantly, and hopefully its been QAed reasonably well
02:39<Tr3buchet>does either have some awe inspiring aspect that i couldn't do without?
02:39<chealer>Tr3buchet: you don't have to come from Gentoo. Ubuntu is more oriented towards new Linux users, in general Debian is better.
02:40<Tr3buchet>"in general Debian is better." perfect. thats all i was after
02:40<alaya>i'm not actually happy about what ubuntu did. i think they should have tried to work from within debian
02:40<Tr3buchet>maybe i'll ninja install ubuntu on my parents machine...
02:41<Tr3buchet>i thought i was hilarious putting the blue screen of death screen saver on their computer until i found out my mom spent 3 hours on the phone with dell tech support.....
02:41<imperia>chealer: when i run aptitude search * ... it shows many packages with different flag.. some are 'p' some are 'v'
02:41<Tr3buchet>then i just felt bad..
02:41<Tr3buchet>i can't imagine what they would do with some linux..
02:41<chealer>imperia: ah...I don't know aptitude.
02:42<imperia>what about apt-get it should be the same?
02:43<chealer>imperia: hum, no, apt-get has no flags
02:43<alaya>imperia: pastebin the output?
02:45<alaya>imperia: maybe look at the flags of dpkg -l ?
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02:49<imperia>alaya: yes those flags works too i guess.. what are the one with 'rc' flag
02:49<alaya>remove something
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02:50<Tr3buchet>how is debian with graphical interfaces like gnome or fluxbox?
02:50<alaya>Tr3buchet: yes
02:50<imperia>its nice with both
02:51<imperia>fluxbox is light and easy
02:51<Tr3buchet>i've pretty much used fluxbox exclusively but i might try out gnome with this next install so i wanted to make sure.
02:52<imperia>have you used mrxvt?
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02:55<Tr3buchet>what is this about debian not working with gnome 2, is that some old news?
02:55<imperia>c ya laters
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02:56<chealer>Tr3buchet: huh? hopefully
02:56<Tr3buchet>i was just googling.. i hate when pages don't have dates on them....
02:56<_george>can the debian installer do lossless partitioning of an ext3 partition?
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02:59<chealer>_george: do you mean resizing?
02:59<_george>chealer: yes, resizing
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03:01<_george>like parted does
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03:07<chealer>_george: did you check the installation manual?
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03:11<Tr3buchet>anyone every try beryl or compiz-fusion?
03:12<_george>chealer: yes, but it's not very clear on that point. anyway, going to try it now!
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03:22<shevek>On my sid box, I lately see only blue screens instead of video. This happens for mplayer, xine, totem and realplayer. Is that a known thing which is worked on? I have an ATI video card with the Debian X drivers ("ati").
03:24<dli>shevek, can you install an open source ati driver?
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03:24<shevek>dli: I suppose so. Is it packaged?
03:25<dli>shevek, I think radeonhd is, check radeon 6.8.0 also
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03:27<shevek>dli: I see radeonhd indeed, although from the list of cards I don't think it should work. But I'll give it a try anyway. :-)
03:28<dli>shevek, what's your card?
03:28<shevek>dli: "VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc 3D Rage IIC AGP (rev 3a)"
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03:30<dli>shevek, xserver-xorg-video-ati
03:30<shevek>Yes, I am using that one now. The radeonhd indeed doesn't work.
03:31<dli>shevek, if still not working, try: "mplayer -vo x11 -zoom "
03:31<dli>shevek, make sure you install the version 6.8.0
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03:31<shevek>Hmm, -vo x11 does indeed help. Is it an sdl bug?
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03:32<shevek>That wouldn't make xine fail, though, it isn't sdl AFAIK...
03:32<dli>shevek, try "-vo xv" also
03:33<shevek>dli: That's just blue as well. sdl too
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03:33<chuxxsss>hi all anyone set up a 3ddesktop in Kubuntu? where would I fine the docs for this...
03:34<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
03:35<chuxxsss>thanks for the help dpkg
03:35<dpkg>my pleasure, chuxxsss
03:35<chuxxsss>have a good day mate as well
03:35<kapil>"fine the docs". i like that. "hey! who's the doctor here? i think we should fine her/him."
03:37<chuxxsss>kapil get a life mate
03:38<dli>shevek, I realize your card is probably too old for XV
03:38<shevek>dli: That is well possible. :-)
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03:42<shevek>dli: Is there a way to tell programs not to use that then?
03:43<dli>shevek, yes, for mplayer, put two lines in ~/.mplayer/config, " vo = x11 ", " zoom = yes"
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03:45<aslag>upon booting etch I got an fsck warning for my root partition so I performed the operation and rebooted. Now I get this error when I try to boot: "crc error / List of all partitions: / No filesystem could mount root, tried: Kernel panic .." What might be the problem here?
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03:46<dli>aslag, sounds like serious fs error, might be hard drive failure
03:46<shevek>aslag: If the fsck warning just popped up out of nowhere, most likely a broken drive
03:46<dli>aslag, boot a livecd/liveusb to check
03:47<aslag>dli: what tools might I use to check? ( I noticed the common livecd's I have around don't include smartctl)
03:48<dli>aslag, you should have badblocks
03:48<dli>aslag, man badblocks
03:48<aslag>also, I dual-boot winblows and have been using that machine heavily with the same drive and have no problems. I don't suppose that rules out drive problems, does it?
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03:49<chealer>aslag: Debian Live, for example
03:49<dli>aslag, also, if you get a debian livecd, you can always get connected and "apt-get install "
03:49<shevek>aslag: No, you could have bad blocks only on a part of the drive. But if you do, it's a very good idea to backup and replace the entire drive anyway. ;-)
03:49<aslag>cool, I didn't know I could install programs in the livecd environment, thanks for that tip.
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03:50<dli>aslag, usually, you should see error messages in "dmesg", also, you can run badblocks to see
03:51<chealer>aslag: not really
03:51<aslag>I'll do that; I just recalled that I have speedfan installed in winsuck; I'll check the reports from SMART and see if there are any clues there
03:51<dli>aslag, debian live uses unionfs by default, so you can modify on fly
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03:52<aslag>oh, could bad memory have caused this?
03:52<aslag>I recently returned a kit that couldn't pass memtest
03:52<aslag>I only discovered the problem after it crashed my box a couple of times
03:53<shevek>aslag: Yes, bad memory can cause all sorts of weird things, including severe fs corruption
03:53<dli>aslag, try memtest86+ then
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03:54<aslag>dli: right, I know the kit I returned was bad because of memtest.
03:55<dli>aslag, if it doesn't pass memtest86, not much chance
03:56<aslag>dli, clearly.
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03:57<aslag>much of my fs is still readable; is there any way to generate a list of packages installed on my current system and feed that to apt to reinstall the same stuff? (That would leave only configs and personal files to restore and greatly ease my reinstallation of this system)
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03:58<aslag>.. or is there something I can do -- short of a reinstall -- to fix this problem?
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03:59<dli>aslag, like reinstall all packages currently installed?
04:00<aslag>yeah, I imagine the only way to fix this properly is to rebuild the system (who knows what got corrupted, right?) In gentoo I'd emerge world, is there anything like that here?
04:01<dli>aslag, I guess there's no a simple command to do so, dpkg -l|grep '^\[ii'
04:01<dli>aslag, should give you a list of all installed
04:01<Gathond>dpkg tell aslag about reinstall
04:02<aslag>Gathond: thanks
04:02<Gathond>actually aptitude made that a lot simpler then the one liner I remembered
04:03<aslag>thanks for the help, everyone
04:03<dli> aptitude reinstall '~i'
04:03<dli>that's elegant
04:04<aslag>oh, one final, and unrelated question -
04:04<aslag>has anyone here used vmware + an intel proc with virtualization tech. and can one get good performance out of that with heavy winblows programs?
04:05<aslag>(I'm required to use some awful win. apps for work and I'd like to stop running windows natively)
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04:20<vook>anyone have TV working with and older ATI card? I'm trying to get the tuner working on a 7500 All in wonder.
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05:03<Tuplad>Can anyone help me out ? Each time I try to run 'sudo aptitude' I get: Ouch! Got SIGSEGV, dying.. and then a segmention fault or something
05:03<Tuplad>I tried restarting a couple of times but it doesnt help
05:04<shevek>Tuplad: Try running it from gdb and see where the segv happens
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05:05<shevek>Tuplad: su (or sudo bash), then gdb aptitude, in there run, then there should be a segmentation fault, then bt.
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05:07<shevek>Tuplad: first run, then bt ;-)
05:07<Tuplad>shevek: hm, so I first run aptitude, then I use gdb aptitude and then bt ?
05:07<shevek>No, in gdb you first give the command "run", and when it breaks you do "bt"
05:08<Tuplad>One momet
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05:09<Tuplad> is what I get
05:09<Tuplad>I have the feeling I'm doing it all wrong
05:10<shevek>Not all, just a bit. :-) you should start gdb with aptitude (you did that right before).
05:10<Tuplad>ah, so sudo gdb aptitude
05:10<Tuplad>right, I'm there
05:10<Tuplad>shevek: getting (no debugging symbols found) Using host libthread_db library "/lib/i686/cmov/".
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05:11<shevek>Yes, for precompiled packages there aren't debugging symbols, but that's not a big problem (at least not always).
05:12<shevek>Doesn't it break with a segmentation fault?
05:13<Tuplad>when I run sudo aptitude it does
05:13<shevek>You may need to press enter to scroll through the messages
05:13<Tuplad>Ouch! Got SIGSEGV, dying.. and then (translated from Russian) segmention fault
05:13<Tuplad>Enter doesn't do anything
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05:14<shevek>You can try "ulimit -c unlimited ; aptitude"
05:14<shevek>Does it crash when not running as root, too, btw?
05:14<Tuplad>shevek: yes
05:14<shevek>Good. :-)
05:15<Tuplad>ulimit -c unlimited ; aptitude gives the same
05:15<Tuplad>but with (core dumped)
05:15<shevek>so then you can do "gdb aptitude core"
05:16<shevek>Hmm, maybe it named the core with the PID. is there a file in there which starts with "core"?
05:16<Tuplad>in where ?
05:16<Tuplad>I have a core file in my home
05:16<shevek>Where you were running the command
05:16<Tuplad>core.3624 - 25,9MB
05:16<Tuplad>in /home/vlad
05:17<shevek>Yes. use "gdb aptitude core.3624" then.
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05:17<shevek>And then bt. No run.
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05:17<Tuplad>oh wait, bt too
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05:18<Tuplad>shevek: this is from bt
05:19<shevek>Hmm. I'll check the source to see if I can find something there. One moment.
05:19<Tuplad>Maybe this will help...
05:19<Tuplad>before I was trying to install python-apt because it was on my update list, but it was giving me an error
05:19<Tuplad>like a piece of code
05:21<shevek>In that case, it may be solved by running "sudo dpkg --configure --pending".
05:22<Tuplad>shevek: oh sec, going to translate that
05:22<trueno>Hi! Is there a way to clone the hd of the machine I am running debian on? System is running, hd contains / and is accessed via ssh. Ican't find how
05:22<Tuplad>shevek: Something like: couldn't process python-apt, package is absolutely not working -- before configuring it you should reinstall it
05:23<shevek>trueno: With dd you can clone it, but if you do that while running, the copy may be corrupt. I don't think this is different with any other tools.
05:23<vook>trueno: clone using dd. backup using tar -cpf
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05:25<trueno>shevek: vook: -- I tried with dd, but it didn't work, and tar would not "copy" the lvms :-( Is there any other tool?
05:26<shevek>trueno: What didn't work about dd?
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05:28<trueno>shevek: I don't know how to do a dd across the network
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05:28<shevek>trueno: Set the output to stdout, and pipe the result to ssh with a command to receive it.
05:29<vook>trueno: have you used sshfs before? fuse?
05:30<shevek>trueno: dd if=file | ssh host "cat > target" should work, I think
05:30<vook>or install sshfs
05:30<shevek>vook: yes. :-)
05:32<trueno>I think I will try both, thanks!
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05:33<eduanotsu>como instala o lanbr servidor no linuxfx
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05:36<shevek>Tuplad: I can't find anything. You could try cleaning some things with apt. apt-get clean and apt-get update in particular.
05:36<Tuplad>shevek: good idea
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05:37<Tuplad>:/ WTF ?
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05:37<Tuplad>It just worked, haha!
05:37<shevek>Good. :-)
05:37<Tuplad>Nice, haha, thanks ! :D
05:38<Tuplad>but I have another question: Can you learn Debian like you can learn Windows ?
05:38<shevek>Tuplad: I don't know. How do you learn Windows?
05:38<Tuplad>I have never read a book or anything in Windows, I just hopped in and started learning by clicking stuff... everything is pretty easy to learn there
05:39<shevek>Tuplad: Debian is much nicer for that. You have much less chance of breaking things. :-)
05:39<Tuplad>but in Linux for example, I'm on Debian since august and I still can't do the normal things like killing stuck processes that wont even go away through kill -9 and stuff. Or like that sigsegv error
05:39<Tuplad>I'm kinda restarting 5 to 10 times a day (but that's probably because I'm on lenny)
05:40<suiside>Tuplad: depends on how good you want learn, but I garantee you, you don't learn Windows good by just "clicking stuff"
05:40<shevek>Tuplad: I have "unstable" boxes running for months without problems, so with Lenny it should be no problem at all.
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05:40<Gathond>sigsegv is not normal stuff, it is basically the same as windows telling you your program will be closed now because it crashed
05:40<Tuplad>I'll be like surfing the internet and my opera crashes just like that, then I cant start it because I get a segment fault, so I restart and it works again :] or I'll be doing something and my keyboard will start flashing (the colors for num, scroll and caps lock) and it's probably a kernel panic
05:40<Tuplad>shevek: hmm
05:40<vook>Tuplad: xkill
05:41<Tuplad>vook: that's handy!
05:41<shevek>Tuplad: Yes, that's a kernel panic. Shouldn't happen though, especially on Lenny. Are you using non-free stuff like nvidia drivers or so?
05:41<trueno>shevek: vook: -- sshfs is great for making tars of remote hosts :-)
05:41<Tuplad>shevek: hmm, I'm on ati, let me check my sources.list
05:41<Gathond>Tuplad: have you verified (memtest86 or similiar) that the memory on that machine is good?
05:42<Tuplad>shevek: my first lines are: deb lenny main non-free
05:42<Tuplad>Gathond: yes, I had let it run for like a whole day and had no errors or anything
05:42<Tuplad>here's my whole sources list actually:
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05:44<shevek>Tuplad: All the ones which have "main non-free", you probably also want "contrib".
05:44<shevek>Tuplad: It doesn't look too strange. Certainly not a reason for kernel panics.
05:45<Tuplad>I have read an article about those names a while ago on , but I couldn't ever find it back
05:45<Tuplad>names like contrib and main and non-free
05:47<vook>Tuplad: kernel panic could point to bad memory.
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05:47<Tuplad>vook: hmm I'll probably run it again then
05:47<vook>Tuplad: or motherboard
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05:47<Tuplad>vook: anything special about memtest I should know ? last time I just started it and did a full test
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05:47<Tuplad>shevek: thank you!
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05:52<Tuplad>vook: there's also memtester, memtest86 and memtest86+, does it matter which one I choose ?
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05:59<Le_Vert>memtest is obsolete
05:59<Le_Vert>use memtest86+
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06:01<duniabersih>has anybody here ever installed Oracle RAC 10g or 11g instead of Redhat, suse and asianux??
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06:02<bartm>duniabersih: is the question "has anybody here ever installed oracle on debian" ?
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06:03<duniabersih>yeah... make it like that barthm :)
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06:03<duniabersih>cause what I know is oracle RAC is certificated to redhat, suse and asianux
06:04<bartm>duniabersih: as far as I remember, there are debian packages available on the website of oracle somewhere
06:04<duniabersih>so that's why I wanna know whether its compatible to debian
06:04<duniabersih>what I know is Oracle XE edition only
06:04<bartm>duniabersih: what does RAC stand for ?
06:04<duniabersih>not RAC for grid-computing
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06:05<duniabersih>several nodes (servers) combined together with 1 shared database
06:05<duniabersih>that is the basic logic
06:05<duniabersih>RAC = Real Application Cluster
06:06<duniabersih>I prefer installing Oracle in Debian.. I dislike redhat cause it's not free :p
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06:06<bartm>oracle is not free :)
06:06<shevek>duniabersih: I like free software, but don't see how that leads to Oracle. ;-)
06:06<bcochofel>Hi, I'm trying to format my usbdrive and I need a way to list the C/H/S info. How can I do that?
06:07<duniabersih>but for personal purpose.. it's still free
06:07<duniabersih>for study
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06:07<lloeki>bcochofel, fdisk -l
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06:08<shevek>duniabersih: Ah, you mean for no money. I thought you were talking about having the freedom to give it away and study the source and such. :-)
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06:08<bcochofel>lloeki: ok, I'm creating a partition W95 FAT32 with fdisk, format it with mkdosfs -F 32 /dev/sdc1 but can't mount it
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06:08<bartm>shevek: yeah the ever returning debate about beer and speech
06:09<bartm>bcochofel: define "can't mount" ?
06:09<shevek>bartm: In most places I expect people to be talking about free beer, but in #debian, it's usually free speech. :-)
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06:09<bartm>shevek: no really?! :)
06:10<bcochofel>bartm: mount -t vfat /dev/sdc1 /mnt I get can't read superblock
06:10<bcochofel>gparted list my device wrong, so cfdisk
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06:20<bcochofel>bartm: ok, I can mount but it's an mp3player and now it doesn't recognize any file
06:20<bartm>bcochofel: well, the mount succeeded, so problem solved I guess :P
06:21<bcochofel>bartm: not quite. for now is just a usbdisk not an mp3 player
06:21<bartm>bcochofel: maybe more luck with fat=16 ?
06:21<bcochofel>bartm: that's what Idid
06:21<bcochofel>I've tried both fat 16 and fat 32
06:22<bartm>hmm did you format the storage containing the software for the mp3 player ?
06:23<bcochofel>bartm: how can I tell that?
06:23<bartm>bcochofel: so, it does work as an usb disk, so it does recognize files ?
06:23<bcochofel>bartm: let me check
06:23*bartm lets bcochofel check :)
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06:24<toff>salut tous
06:24<bcochofel>bartm: ok, it works. don't ask me why, but I've tried to copy again the files and I'm listening
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06:24<bartm>bcochofel: great !
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06:25<bartm>bcochofel: which make and model is the mp3 player ?
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06:26<bcochofel>bartm: creative zen nano plus 512Mb
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06:36<philipp>what have i wride to sources.list to activate all packets
06:37<Le_Vert>add contrib non-free after main
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06:43<nohero>hi! i'm trying to set the console resolution of my widescreen but i cannot set it to 1280x800. can you help me? is it possible or should i set it to 1024x800?
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06:44<bartm>nohero: what is "console resolution" ? is that something else than the resolution specified in /etc/X11/xorg.conf ?
06:45<nohero>bartm, yes. you can set it passing "vga=xxx" parameter to kernel at boot time
06:45<suiside>nohero: you'd have to check what framebuffer modes your display adapter supports
06:45<alaya>nohero: hwinfo --framebuffer will print out what your card can do
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06:46<philipp>Le_Vert thats what i already have... arent there more packets
06:47<alaya>e.g. mine can do Mode 0x0376: 1600x1200 (+6400), 24 bits vga=0x376
06:47<nohero> Mode 0x0367: 1280x800 (+2560), 16 bits
06:47<nohero>should i set vga to 0x0367?
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06:48<alaya>so edit /boot/grub/menu.lst and have # defoptions=vga=367
06:48<alaya>then run update-grub
06:50<nohero>ok, rebooting system
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06:54<alaya>what i would like to do is find out how to get a clean, san-serif font in vesa fb mode
06:54<alaya>not the ugly, blocky one
06:54<nohero>alaya, works!! many thanks. just a precision: vga=0x0367
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06:54<alaya>nohero: uh, in menu.lst i don't think so.
06:54<alaya>i take it you did not edit it?
06:55<nohero>i didn't understand
06:55<nohero>vga=367 is not recognized, i chanced it in 0x0367 and works
06:56<alaya>in menu.lst ?
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06:57<nohero>no, i edited in grub directly and now in menu.lst
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07:46<redsolo>I received a disturbing mail from the pkg Tiger this morning, and Im wondering if it means that my hard drive is going belly up. Mail content at
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07:59<redsolo>my /etc/rc0.d/K20inetd is linked to /etc/init.d/K20inetd. but there is no such file.. I should have one there, shouldnt I?
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08:01<Staale>I am trying a network (PXE) install, but the pxelinux.0 file doesn't seem to get sent, and the installer doesn't start on the target comp.
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08:08<gsimmons>Staale: Try increasing your TFTP server's verbosity. For example, if using tftpd/tftpd-hpa via inetd, /etc/inetd.conf and append '-v' within the TFTP service line, then reload inetd's configuration.
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08:13<qq>redsolo: try a reboot
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08:20<Staale>gsimmons, thanks, I felt I was missing some logs that told me what was going on
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08:32<Staale>if I run "sudo strace /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -vv -L -s /var/lib/tftpboot" I seem to get a line: "bind(4, {sa_family=AF_INET, sin_port=htons(69), sin_addr=inet_addr("")}, 16) = -1 EADDRINUSE (Address already in use)" - and tftp doesn't start
08:33<riganta>hi, I have had this error message coming up every time I start my PC where it seems to be searching for the right driver. The problem is that it takes a while at start time for my box to switch from "8139cp" to "8139too"Is there a way I could tell my box to use the driver 8139too instead of it choosing the 8139cp?
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08:37<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, z25 is as of version 0.090, udev has the ability to statically rename ethernet cards based on MAC address. The addresses are configured in /etc/udev/rules.d/z25_persistent-net.rules . If you want the mappings to change, edit that file. See <forcedeth mac>
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08:37<cahoot>riganta: ^^
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08:45<riganta>thanks cahoot, but I am afraid that, because I am a complete noob at this, I don't quite understand what I am suppose to do here. I have edited z25_persistent-net.rules file and I do see the right driver
08:45<cahoot>ok so the ysstem
08:45<cahoot>loads the correct module?
08:46<cahoot>i e 8139too?
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08:46<riganta>well, when I start my PC the correct module is not loaded. It first loads the 8139cp
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08:47<riganta>then it searched for the right one which is in fact the 8139too
08:47<riganta>but that takes for ever
08:47<cahoot>but in the file mentioned above it says 8139too?
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08:48<cahoot>you don't happen to have 8139cp listed in /etc/modules?
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08:49<riganta>no I have only firewire-sbp2 and loop
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08:50<cahoot>riganta: ok - in that case I'd try to blacklist 8139cp
08:50<cahoot>riganta: try the instructions in /msg dpkg blacklist
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08:59<sasha999>hi i ve just upgaded my debian from stable to testing , and now xserver start and then it comes back to the termional without errors in it or in Xorg.log , any advice ?
09:00<gravity>Wow, that's different
09:00<gravity>sasha999: Could you post your Xorg.0.log in a pastebin or somewhere else that I could see it?
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09:01<sasha999>yes 2 min
09:01<sun>any have hda (stac9xxx) problems with recording audio on alsa?
09:03<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
09:03<sun>pastebin pipe
09:03<sun><pastebin pipe>
09:04<sun>dpkg pastebin pipe
09:04<dpkg>Download and install libwww-mechanize-perl. Then pipe your output to perl
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09:07<sasha999>hi gravity here it is
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09:07<sasha999>i removed some lines in the lmiddle cause the past azs too long
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09:08<gravity>sasha999: Can you duplicate this if you use the mouse driver instead of synaptics?
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09:09<gravity>sasha999: And cutting out large chunks of the log file is really bad, ok? I need the whole thing.
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09:09<sasha999>isnt there a filepaste somewhere
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09:11<andrem>hi, the nagiosweb Does not support the settings of the versions 3.X od nagios?
09:11<sasha999>after checking i think the problems comes from gdm qnd not X , if i do spkg-reconfigure gdm , it tells me somes error i will dig iin it , and come back if i m stucked , btw thanks a lot for your time
09:11<gravity>sasha999: /msg dpkg pastebin pipe
09:11<gravity>(which is really handy, thanks sun)
09:11<klimy>i have a problem booting into vista. i run normally debian, but i had to install vista thus my grub got overwritten. i reinstalled grub like always. now only debian can boot.
09:12<klimy>i googled the normal solution for booting vista, which is the same as xp.
09:12<klimy>but i get a weird error: BOOTMGR missing
09:13<klimy>i cannot figure out how to solve this, because even the vista dvd tells me the boot configuration works fine. now i don't know where to look next.
09:14<klimy>anyone had similar problems?
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09:15<qq>klimy: edit /boot/grub/menu.lst
09:15<vook>whats vista?
09:15<sasha999>klimy : there a some utils to reinstall the original vista bootloader
09:16<sasha999>once done reinstall grub in the mbr and it should be ok
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09:18<klimy>i don't quite understand. i had the vista bootloader, then i reinstalled grub. now i am in this situation.
09:18<lorenor>whois debhelper
09:18<qq>sasha999 : paste is here
09:18<vook>klimy: try this. at next boot type : rootnoverify (hd0,0) then chainloader +1, then boot (at the grub prompt).
09:19<sasha999>klimy , did you installed grub in the mbr
09:19<sasha999>if not then you get that error
09:19<klimy>qq: what entry do i need in my menu.lst? i have: rootnoverify(hd1,0)\n makeactive\n chainloder +1
09:20<klimy>sasha999: i installed it twice: in mbr and on my /boot partition which is hd(0,0)
09:20<klimy>perhaps thats the problem
09:20<vook>klimy: do you have more than one hard drive?
09:20<klimy>vook: yes
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09:21<vook>and vista is on drive two?
09:21<klimy>vook: yes ;)
09:21<sasha999>hi gravity ; sorry but i m completely sticked with my problem here is my xorg.log
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09:22<vook>klimy: well, make sure it says chainloader (not chainloder), I dunno tho. I'm sure Vista would like to have the first drive all to itself (and debian would be happy on drive two).
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09:25<gravity>sasha999: Why are you using vesa? What sort of card do you have?
09:25<klimy>when i do not enter a chainloader i do not have a kernel.
09:26<gravity>There may well be a fix for vesa that might help
09:26<sasha999>an ati , but it wzas a fresh install with the 4.0r3 cd 1 and vesa worked great
09:26<qq>sasha999: edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf
09:27<vook>sasha999: try X -configure - it usually creates a good xorg.conf to start with.
09:27<qq>sasha999 end change so Section "Device"
09:27<qq> Identifier "Generic Video Card"
09:27<qq># Driver "vesa"
09:27<qq> Driver "ati"EndSection
09:27<sasha999>my card is an ati hd2400 so i have to compil a recent kernel cause only recent driver from adm do work
09:27<sasha999>qq : ho thanks i ll try it right now
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09:32<qq>sasha999: and do . in a terminal /etc/init.d/xdm restart or change xdm with gdm or kdm
09:33<gravity>You probably want radeonhd unfortunately
09:33<sasha999>X start perfectly but i have no windows manager , gnome in my case so i think it is a gdm related problem
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09:33<gravity>I should really backport that to lenny and get it in there
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09:34<sasha999>i type dpkg-reconfigure gdm and i get no error but if i start gdm , i go back to the terminal
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09:34<gravity>Yeah, that's expected
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09:34<sasha999>i ll compile a new kernel with the latest ati driver and will see thanks for your time
09:35<gravity>sasha999: Actually...
09:35<gravity>sasha999: If you could file a bug with a backtrace, that'd be most helpful
09:35<qq>sasha999: apt-get install gdm gnome* nautilus
09:35<gravity>You could also go to unstable
09:36<gravity>Let me get the wiki page...
09:36<sasha999>gravity , in fact i reinstalled my debian cause my /bin rep as been deleted , bzefore that i was under lenny with kernel with the 8.02 ati driver and i had no problem at all
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09:36<gravity>sasha999: Ok
09:38<vook>sasha999: when I went to lenny from etch - I had similar issues with gnome (gnome-desktop-environment was broken if I remember correctly). As qq said, you may need to direct *aptitude to install gnome again.
09:39<vook>sasha999: and always do aptitude dist-upgrade a few times until nothing is available.
09:39<sasha999>qq vook , thanks i think this the right thing to do cause i upgrade it under an X environnement and i have had a lot ogf problems while configuring - dpkf -configure -a ...
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10:25<romolo>ciao a tutti
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10:35<lupine>I need help configuring a 3G wireless internet device with Debian. I have the hardware recognised; it's just the ppp/wvdial configuration I'm having trouble with. Anyone willing to help out?
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10:45<bcochofel>Hi, after I create a partition with fdisk how can I format an ext2 partition?
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10:47<noflash>bcochofel, man mk2fs
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10:47<noflash>bcochofel, man mke2fs
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10:53<tyguaike>hao are you
10:55<Lynoure>normal quiet Saturday. Anything you need help with?
10:55<dpkg>i heard cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
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10:56<bcochofel>noflash: thx, done
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11:02<noflash>tyguaike, no thanks, I use debian
11:03<noflash>!tell tyguaike -about ubuntu
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11:03<tyguaike>mp3 player
11:04<tyguaike>software ?
11:04<noflash>tyguaike, #ubuntu
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11:27<gass>hello there
11:27<gass>is there a way for apt-get to use the next available mirror to download a file if the first mirror have it broken?
11:28<gass>my first mirror in sources.list have a bad linux-image* file
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11:28<gass>and it fails to retrieve it
11:28<gass>but the next mirror has it ok
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11:37<panagos>are usb flash drives better than hard disks for swap partitions?
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11:40<gass>panagos, no ... flahs drives have limited write
11:40<panagos>so they would quickly wear off? :|
11:41<gass>normally when using flash drives, we don't use swap and mount an tmpfs for /var/log at least
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11:42<rasher>Have you checked the numbers? Wearing out a modern flash drive is hard work. Especially if you have a good deal of free space on it.
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11:56<peterS>rasher: swapping to it for awhile would probably get the job done
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11:57<peterS>I think in that case the kernel is going to just use the same few blocks every time it needs to
11:57<peterS>rather than wear-leveling the whole partition
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12:15<avtobiff>hi i was kicked from the irc-server with a message that i should fix my irc-client. what is up with that?!
12:17<azeem>avtobiff: it was a network error
12:17<azeem>disregard it
12:17<avtobiff>so it was... ok thanks :)
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12:18<avtobiff>i am also interesting in contributing to debian through google summer of code (gsoc)...
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12:19<avtobiff>i am really motivated and would like to do some neat and helpful project on debian through gsoc, but since i dont know that much about debians inner workings i need tips on what is a good and helpful project for debian.
12:21<LoLLo>how can i convert a GIMP extension in a JPG extension ? ? ? ?
12:21<gravity>uh, what?
12:21<avtobiff>i would also like if a gsoc project would result in me continuing with the project (or other stuff) after gsoc. developing debian.
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12:22<gravity>avtobiff: Have you looked at the project proposals on already?
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12:24<avtobiff>gravity, looking at them now :)
12:24<avtobiff>gravity, did you "uh, what?" me btw?
12:24<gravity>avtobiff: No, to LoLLo, sorry
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12:25<avtobiff>gravity, np. just checking :)
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12:38<avtobiff>any more tips for doing a gsoc project in debian? what is needed for the project?
12:39<gravity>Heh, what I think needs doing isn't the usual gsoc stuff :-)
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12:43<zuch>Hi! I've installed debian on a new system using the netinst cd. My harddisk partitions are not mounting on their own. If I manually add an entry in /etc/fstab then they get mounted but I can't open them via nautilus computer: Any ideas?
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13:07<live>ciao a tutti
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13:28<Cyorxamp>Kind of important for me... was wondering what distributions people knew of that were based on Debian and used an official Debian repository - so they wern't exactly forks but pre-customized debian installs.
13:28<Cyorxamp>Basically _not_ Ubuntu
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13:29<Cyorxamp>I've found DreamLinux which is for desktop environments, but most support for it is in Portuguese and a few bits are broken in it like installing Wine (odd things with dependencies) - so I'm wondering what else there is out there
13:30<Cyorxamp>Debian XFCE install disc is cool, but I use that on servers... I consider it 'server debian with a minimal X' :P as it doesn't come with much which is great for servers.
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13:32<sati>Hi everybody
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13:33<sati>I bought an Acer Inspiron M1610 yesterday and i try to install Etch on it
13:33<sati>I have a problem with my cd/dvd device, it's not detected
13:34<sati>what got i to do?
13:34-!-bartm [] has joined #debian
13:34<bartm>anyone in flanders not yet understanding "free software", watch tv now on kanaa2, it's the movie "antitrust"
13:35-!-rickbot_not_here is now known as rickbot
13:35<Cyorxamp>bartm: whats kanaa2 ?
13:35<bartm>it's kanaal2
13:35<noflash>!tell rickbot -about away
13:35<Cyorxamp>and kanaal2 is ?
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13:36<bartm>Cyorxamp: tv channel in flanders
13:36<Cyorxamp>whatever, that so told me nothing
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13:48<Naosu>Hello I am Running Debian 2.6.18, Does anyone have any experence in the program LIRC?
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13:49<dpkg>Please do not ask if anyone uses <someprogram>. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use <someprogram>?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <sicco> <ask-to-ask> <polls>
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13:52<Naosu>I am having trouble properly configuing LIRC in Debian 2.6.18, I don't know what i am doing wrong. Currently Try to run the command "mode2" and i get an error saying, "Error opening /dev/lirc (new line) No such file or directory"
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13:55<Cyorxamp>Hi, I'm looking for any Debian-based distribution that unlike Ubuntu is simply Debian (stable or otherwise) with extra packages and/or customizations and continues to use official Debian repositories (DreamLinux is like this). Can anyone name some?
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13:55<knoppix_>Is it german?
13:56<Cyorxamp>Is what german?
13:56-!-knoppix_ is now known as Guest151
13:56<Guest151>can i speak german?
13:57<bartm>Guest151: you can, but not here :)
13:57<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
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13:58<Cyorxamp>lol that page doesn't exist in the Wiki yet the guidelines page references to it
13:58<Guest151>ok bye bye
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14:10-!-mode/#debian [+b *!*root@*] by ChanServ
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14:15<Cyorxamp>qq: DreamLinux is knoppix too
14:16<Cyorxamp>is knoppix itelf essentially debian and using debain repositories?
14:16<bartm>I don't think so
14:18<Cyorxamp>If I was to simply use Debian XFCE Etch like I do on my servers... is there something that can record what I have 'done' to it so I can re-automate what customizations I've made the next time I install it ?
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14:19<Cyorxamp>Why are you showing me a Ubuntu video?
14:20<Naosu>Hello again, I am using A Thinkpad 380XD laptop (roughly 10 years old now) and I can't find any information about its IR device built in, Do anyone know where i can find out about driver support for internal IR devices via laptops?
14:22<Aleric>Can someone think of a way for a shell script to determine if it was called directory by root, or was called as 'sudo script' from the command line?
14:23<gsimmons>!tell Naosu -about thinkpad
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14:25<Aleric>nm, I found something; sudo sets the environment variable SUDO_USER
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14:27<xpl>i've just downloaded the installation cd for ia64 (debian 4r3) (~ 210 or 220MB) and burned it with CD/DVD creator in debian 4r1. when i put it into my drive and reboot, it doesnt boot from it. instead it continues to grub. my dvd-rom is first boot device. does anybody know why i cant boot from that cd?
14:27<cahoot>you have an ithanium cpu?
14:27<Gathond>xpl: and you are SURE you have an ia64 and not AMD64 machine?
14:28<xpl>no :S
14:28<Gathond>aka an Itanuim instead of an x86 one
14:28<xpl>i have P4 64bit
14:28<xpl>intel P4
14:28<xpl>of course
14:28<Gathond>you would know if you had an ia64:)
14:28<Gathond>that is AMD64 you want then
14:28<xpl>ok thanx... LS
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14:53<xpl>but, the problem still stands. I have i386 debian installation cd, and when i try to boot the system from it, it won't do it. I burned the cd, like i said, with CD/DVD Creator.
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14:54<ifvoid>it won't boot at all?
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14:54<xpl>and yet, booting from live dvd is working fine...
14:54<xpl>no, it just swithes to grub
14:55<xpl>like there was no cd
14:55<ifvoid>you need to press a key for it to boot
14:55<xpl>(i have debian r1 installed here but its 32bit and my machine is p4 64bit)
14:55<mzhang>dli: hi there?
14:56<ifvoid>xpl: that shouldn't matter
14:56<xpl>ifvoid: i know, i m just saying to you, not to get confused
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15:01<xpl>ifvoid: i dont know if you were here a bit earlier. it does boot from live dvd, but from that installation cd - it won't.
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15:01<ifvoid>xpl: doesn't it even show the "press any key to boot" prompt?
15:02<xpl>not for the cd
15:02<ifvoid>does it try to read from the cd at all?
15:02<xpl>i mean, not when i try to boot from cd
15:02<xpl>but when i try to boot from livedvd it doesnt ask me anything, it just boots it (from dvd)
15:03<xpl>well, yeah
15:03<ifvoid>almost sounds like the cd image was broken
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15:04<xpl>well i dont know. does that cd/dvd creator burns just the files or it burn everything, even that little code at the and of boot sector?
15:05<ifvoid>depends on what you tell it to do
15:05<xpl>i must say that dvd and cd were not burned with the same burner nor machine
15:05<ifvoid>maybe you accidentally burned the iso file as a file on the cd, rather than burn the entire iso on the cd?
15:06<xpl>no i didnt
15:06<xpl>i clicked the image file twice
15:06<xpl>no no no sry
15:06<xpl>i right clicked on the image file and clicked on write to dics...
15:07<xpl>from a dropdown menu
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15:08<xpl>and when i double click the image file, it normally opens it in, like it does for every archive file
15:09<ifvoid>can you check what is on the cd?
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15:09<xpl>in nautilus
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15:10<xpl>ifvoid: yeah, sure
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15:10<xpl>ifvoid: what do you want me to check?
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15:10<ifvoid>check hwat files are there
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15:11<xpl>it has .disk bootdists doc pics pool tools and some readme's and two more file
15:12<xpl>in boot
15:12<xpl>boot.catalog 2.0KB boot.img 32.0MB
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15:12<ifvoid>hmm, lloks good then
15:12<ifvoid>no idea what's wrong
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15:13<xpl>i even tried to open some files to see if they are broken
15:13-!-dario [] has joined #debian
15:13<xpl>with gedit
15:13<xpl>and i did
15:13<xpl>i mean, it did opened it :S
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15:14<xpl>ifvoid: anything special i should check ?
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15:16<xpl>what cd burner is really reliable?
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15:18<Supaplex>mine is :)
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15:18<suiside>xpl: drives manufactured by Plextor usually are
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15:21<suiside>xpl: if you were referring to cd recording software you should be aware of that the vast majority of such software on linux use cdrecord as a backend
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15:24<Vantage13>hi, I'm having a bit of trouble with an etch machine I have. I'm postive the problem is hardware, but I'd like to be able to diagnose it a bit more to confirm what hardware to replace. The machine runs smooth and then suddenly stops responding. I hook up a monitor and keyboard and can't get any display on the machine.
15:24<Vantage13>I reboot the machine and the kernel loads, then there's a click from the hard drive, it spins down and hangs. If I reboot the machine several times it will eventually come back up. There's no sign of any problem in the logs though (dmesg, message, syslog, kernel, etc). I'm pretty sure the HDD is failing, but is there anything else it could be? Or any way to confirm the drive as the problem?
15:24<xpl>suiside: well, yes i was thinking on software. but it probably isnt that whats wrong
15:25<Supaplex>Vantage13: clicking from the hdd is pretty awry. try the drive in the known good machine and see if the problem moves.
15:26<Vantage13>Supaplex: hrmm it'd be hard to reproduce. It can run for as much as a week at a time in between occurances
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15:26<Supaplex>oh, and grab a freshbackup and a new drive before it's too late :)
15:26-!-Vantage13 [] has joined #debian
15:27<Vantage13>sorry, might have missed a last response
15:27<Supaplex>oh, and grab a freshbackup and a new drive before it's too late :)
15:27<chealer>Vantage13: did you run a SMART self-test?
15:28<Supaplex>chealer read my mind. hehe
15:28<Vantage13>chealer: what's the command for that?
15:28<dpkg>smart is probably the opposite of stupid, or the opposite of straightforward and polite, or what I definitely am, or "Self-Monitoring, Analysis, and Reporting Technology" used by some hard drive manufacturers to detect imminent drive failure, or see the smartmontools package.
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15:31<xpl>Supaplex: where to you get this !commands ?
15:31<xpl>to ~ do
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15:32<Supaplex>xpl: /msg dpkg help
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15:40<xpl>Supaplex: and how do i say thanx to dpkq ? :)
15:41<xpl>he actually answered me: de nada. I'm starting to love this guy :D
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15:42<Supaplex>xpl: dondelelcaro is flatterd his bot is used so well :)
15:42<xalanthyr>i've got a problem i can't set up my video card in xorg
15:43<xpl>dondelelcaro wrote it? i bet he is...
15:43<qq>xalantthyr : lspci
15:43<Vantage13>hrmm smart test came back clean... running long tests now
15:44<xalanthyr>qq: what do you mean?
15:44<qq>lspci |grep VGA
15:45<Supaplex>dpkg: who owns you?
15:45<dpkg>dondelelcaro does
15:45<qq>do that command
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15:47<xpl>Supaplex: :)
15:47<xpl>Supaplex: and where do you find those?
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15:47<xalanthyr>qq: i did it - it shows my card correctly but in xorg.conf my card is Generic Video Card with "vesa" driver...
15:47<Supaplex>dpkg: factoids
15:47<dpkg>My factoids are available at They are updated nightly and the previous 18 days are archived. there is a searchable database of my factoids at
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15:50<qq>well what is your video card ?
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15:50<xpl>he is definitely great
15:50<flypiper>dudes.. Debian rocks.. I needed an Assembler for Microchip PIC-family... and VOLLA.. picasm.. sweet :-)
15:51<ServerSide>is there any code blocks package for debian? from apt?
15:51<xalanthyr>ati rage 128
15:52<qq>ok edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf so # Driver "vesa"
15:52<qq> Driver "ati"
15:52<qq># Driver "vesa"
15:52<qq> Driver "ati"
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15:53<qq>in Section "Device"
15:53<flypiper>ServerSide, apt-cache search asm ????
15:53<qq>and in Section "Monitor"
15:53<qq>HorizSync 28-75
15:53<qq>VertRefresh 43-75
15:54<flypiper>ServerSide, I dunno what code block your looking for
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15:54<flypiper>asm= assembly
15:55<xalanthyr>ok, i'll try to reboot x now
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15:55<ServerSide>the software code::blocks
15:55<qq>not need
15:55-!-Piet [] has joined #debian
15:55<ServerSide>it's an source code editor
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15:56<qq>try /etc/init.d/gdm restart or kdm if needed
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15:59<lukasz>qq: it didn't work...
15:59<lukasz>the x didn't even start
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16:00<lukasz>qq: it's xalanthyr here btw, i don't know why my nich changed...
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16:01<prezes>have you got any log ?
16:01-!-bjbW [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:01<xalanthyr>no, i wasn't able to made any...
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16:03<prezes>x server doesn't start, but the system does?/
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16:03<prezes>check the start log
16:03<xalanthyr>start log?
16:04<prezes>let me check something... wait...
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16:06<qq><xalanthyr> put your /etc/X11/xorg.conf here
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16:08<qq>have you yet installed gdm or kdm ?
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16:10<xalanthyr>no, i didn't
16:10<xalanthyr>i pasted the content there
16:10<lex>then try in console startx
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16:12<xalanthyr>the xorg is starting but i don't think that the driver is working properly...
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16:13<lex>did you install gnome or kde ?
16:15<lex>you have this problems after installing video drivers ?
16:17<xalanthyr>the only problem is that the xorg recognizes my video card as "Generic Video Card"
16:17<xalanthyr>and my video card is "ATI Rage 128"
16:17<qq>add " Driver "ati"
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16:21<xalanthyr>umm, i think i found another stange thing in my xorg.conf - mu card is on AGP and xorg.conf shows BUSID "PCI;1;0;0"
16:23<qq>do " # BUSID "PCI;1;0;0" met a # before that line
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16:24<qq>you have to put # before that line
16:25<xalanthyr>ok, i'll try it now
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16:29<xalanthyr>xorg starts like before
16:29<w33d5>is anyone familiar with "os x" ALL WINDOWS function
16:30<xalanthyr>i think i'll try something else...
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16:42<Ouroboros>how do you unmount the original / from the kernel command line mounted by initramfs? in particular i want to replace it with unionfs over the original mount and tmpfs... or is there a way that i can use the unionfs from the beginning?
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16:43<Ouroboros>also i am a little confused as to how to mount unionfs on /, since its branches must already be mounted somewhere... so lets say i make a mount point /ro, then when i mount the unionfs over /, isnt that mount point no longer accessible by unionfs driver?
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17:09<xpl>i have problem with dhcpcd
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17:09<xpl>i emerged it, edited /etc/conf.d/net file
17:09<xpl>sorry, i installed it
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17:11<SharkMa-san>wtf was that autokill flood few days ago? :/
17:11<azeem>SharkMa-san: a mistake
17:11<SharkMa-san>ah k
17:11<petemc>that answers my question then
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17:12<azeem>xpl: /etc/conf.d/net?
17:13<xpl>well, yeah, that was from gentoo, but no metter
17:13<xpl>problem is that dhcp client is not working
17:13<azeem>xpl: which client?
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17:15<xpl>azeem: dhcpcd
17:15<azeem>oh, alright
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17:40<kurumin>someone can get me a information?
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17:48<john>what kernel do i use for sempron 3800+
17:49<aptituz>john: 686
17:49<john>is it better to compile a kernel or get it from backports?
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17:50<john>isnt 686 for pentium 3
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17:51<andrem>Jhon: Use the official Mirror
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18:06<Aleric>I'm getting this error:
18:06<Aleric>/usr/share/themes/Clearlooks/gtk-2.0/gtkrc:68: error: unexpected identifier `colorize_scrollbar', expected character `}'
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18:07<Aleric>How can I check if that file is still what it was when being installed?
18:08<dondelelcaro>Aleric: by comparing it's md5sum to the list that dpkg keeps
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18:08<Aleric>dondelelcaro: I have debsums installed...
18:08<dondelelcaro>!verify packages
18:08<dpkg>To verify the contents of debian packages, you can either install and use debsums, or you can cd /; find /var/lib/dpkg/info/ -type f -name '*.md5sums' -print0|xargs -0 md5sum -c|grep -v ' OK';
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18:10<Aleric>debsums says it's ok... weird
18:10<Ouroboros>dondelelcaro: any hints on my unionfs question above? my current theory is that i need to make an initramfs script that does pivot_root?
18:11<dondelelcaro>Aleric: I mean, the md5sums file is *just* a textfile, so it's possible that someone malicious could change it
18:12<dondelelcaro>(but if you suspect that, there's no way to actually verify it on a running system)
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18:16<etherboy>so is debian at etch right now?
18:17<etherboy>or lenny?
18:17<craigevil>etch is stable, lenny is testing
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18:19<etherboy>how much space will i need for an install
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18:19<azeem>etherboy: depends on what you decide to install
18:19<azeem>between 1-3 GB maybe
18:19<etherboy>assming FULL to be safe
18:19<azeem>what is FULL?
18:20<azeem>why would you want that?
18:20<Ouroboros>azeem: every package from apt, of course
18:20<etherboy>wait. yeah.
18:20<azeem>etherboy: are you interested in astrophysical packages?
18:20<craigevil>every package is like 50gb more or less
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18:20<etherboy>are you interested in biochemestry?
18:20<azeem>etherboy: why do you want to install the menstruation calendar?
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18:20<Ouroboros>azeem: normal desktop install is 1-2 GB or so
18:20<azeem>you get the idea
18:20<etherboy>so i can know when it's safe to call your mother
18:21<azeem>Ouroboros: ~2 GB for GNOME AFAIK
18:21<azeem>etherboy: my mother's beyond menopause, but thanks
18:21<etherboy>i'm bringing her back to life. my pleasure
18:22<azeem>etherboy: do you have another reasonable question?
18:22<etherboy>what's a menstruation calendar?
18:23<azeem>ask in the appropriate IRC channel
18:23<etherboy>no. really. how much ram should i have to run Debian Etch?
18:23<azeem>etherboy: 00:18 < azeem> etherboy: depends on what you decide to install
18:23<azeem>between 64MB and 1GB, dunno
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18:24<Ouroboros>yeah, menstruation calendar takes like 32 GB
18:24<azeem>for a desktop install, 512MB should woork
18:25<Ouroboros>where in initramfs should i be calling pivot_root? trying from init-bottom, but getting "Device or resource busy", since presumably / is still being used?
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18:39<phinix>first time in irc and first time on debian, or any linux os for that matter, any advice?
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18:40<Ouroboros>phinix: dont eat yellow snow
18:41<phinix>ok, too general, I
18:41<phinix>thanks anyway
18:41<etherboy>what are you trying to do?
18:41<etherboy>or are you just "taking it for a spin"
18:42<phinix>how do I find out what version of debian I installed?
18:42<phinix>testing it out, found book on linux at garage sale, fell in love
18:42<etherboy>uh, "uname" i think
18:42<etherboy>or uname -a
18:43<Bushmills>phinix: cat /etc/debian_version
18:43<phinix>thank you
18:43<phinix>linux seems pretty cool
18:43<etherboy>what does uname do?
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18:44<Bushmills>etherboy: it is aliased to rm -rf /
18:44<phinix>my book had some weird hints about loopback in the ipconfig
18:44<amphi>etherboy: man uname ;)
18:44<phinix>what is that all about
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18:44<etherboy>still telling new guys to do the old rm -rf /
18:45<etherboy>that never get's old does it
18:45<Bushmills>etherboy: no, i didn't
18:45<amphi>etherboy: it dores
18:45<amphi>er, does
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18:45<Bushmills>i only warned that uname would do that
18:45<amphi>etherboy: he made a feeble joke
18:45<Bushmills>i forgot the <sarcasm> tag
18:45<azeem>Bushmills: well, kindly stop doing lame jokes like that one, please
18:45-!-phinix [] has joined #debian
18:46<Bushmills>azeem: ok
18:46<etherboy>no really. i see that at least once a day on irc
18:46<amphi>etherboy: ignore the tardswarm
18:47<phinix>did anybody answer my loopback question while I was rejoining?
18:47<amphi>phinix: you want the loopback interface; it should be enabled automatically on boot
18:48<Bushmills>phinix: it haves like a NIC, but in software, to allow the machine to talk to itself
18:48<amphi>!tell phinix -about loopback
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19:00<phinix>Is dpkg, just a bot or something, I thought he was telling me about loopback, lol
19:00<azeem>it's a bot, yeah
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19:01<amphi>phinix: it is, and he was
19:01<Ouroboros>hm, am i supposed to be using switch_root instead of pivot_root?
19:01<phinix>so, amphi, what were you referring to
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19:02<amphi>phinix: when?
19:02<phinix>oh, was I just not giving right answers?
19:03<phinix>I closed his window
19:03<amphi>phinix: dpkg is a bot, and he did tell you about loopback
19:04<phinix>not the part I was referring too, my book was very cryptic, but it definetely gave more credit to loopbacks than the bot did
19:05<phinix>it was an old book Linux Unleashed V1
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19:05<phinix>seemed to suggest a network within the net
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19:06<amidude>ne1 running 2.6.24 on a Dell having stalled boots at USB input devs?
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19:07<phinix>amphi, am I on the right track, or does it sound like a joke he played on newbies?
19:07<azeem>phinix: why are you interested in loopbacks?
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19:09<azeem>LoLLo: please don't spam the channel with off-topic links
19:09<phinix>because I book I am reading seems to suggest it is a way to get in touch with another network of users with I presume more intelligence than most, If they are doing what the book suggests anyway
19:09-!-k111u [richard@] has joined #debian
19:09<azeem>phinix: no idea what that book is talking about
19:10<azeem>phinix: if you have specific questions about debian, please ask them
19:10<phinix>it sounds weird, but he drops so many hints in the ipconfig section
19:10<phinix>ok, no worries
19:11<k111u>why xchat uses my username for my ident? i didnt setted my username anywhere on xchat options, but when someone whois me they see "richard@190...", so i went to #xchat and they told me to come here to see how to edit debian ident server
19:11<phinix>can I run xplorer2 in debian?
19:11<Ouroboros>phinix: there is no ipconfig... there is however ifconfig
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19:12<amphi>phinix: what is it?
19:14<phinix>ouroborous, he mentions that, I'm just worried a book from 95 is too far out of date, will check for mentioned files later, just thought I would come check this out here first
19:14<amphi>phinix: see
19:14<phinix>amphi, xplorer2 is file explore that works in both windows and linux, supposedly
19:15<Ouroboros>is there an example script somewhere that shows how to pivot_root in initramfs and actually works with debian?
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19:15<craigevil>phinix: take a look at Xfile explorer
19:15<amphi>phinix: there is a huge number of file managers for linux, although you'll likely come to find the shell the handiest
19:15<phinix>thank you amphi, opened it up, will look it over when done here
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19:17<phinix>thank you, do they support Alternate Data Streams, like xplorer2?
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19:21<phinix>one more question, is KDE the best GUI or should I look into others, which others are supported by Debian?
19:22<Ouroboros>phinix: GNOME is the other big one, and default for debian
19:22<amphi>phinix: 'best' is in the eye of the beholder
19:22<etherboy>if i want to have multiple users and have each of them have a directory in /home which option should i select for partitioning?
19:22<amphi>phinix: I like standalone window managers myself, without any 'desktop environment'
19:22<Ouroboros>etherboy: that always happens
19:23<amphi>etherboy: / and /home is enough
19:23<gass>etherboy, root with about 20G the rest for /home .... so 3 partitions, swap, / , and /home
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19:23<phinix>ok, will look into that amphi, thanks. I will be able to use them in Debian?
19:24<Ouroboros>/ is enough actually
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19:25<phinix>ok, thanks everyone, maybe see you here again. Off to do some more research
19:25<amphi>phinix: debian packages many WMs, as well as kde, gnome, and xfce
19:25<amphi>Ouroboros: separate /home is generally a good idea
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19:26<phinix>ok, obviously I should do some more poking around on my system ;)
19:26<etherboy>gass: how much for each
19:26<amphi>phinix: install the debian reference perhaps
19:26<gass>etherboy, 20 Gb for /, about 1 or 2 Gb for swap, rest for /home
19:27<etherboy>i'm working with 20 total
19:27<phinix>did debian also come with a firewall, or is that something I should be looking into
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19:27<phinix>what is it called in in aptitude?
19:27<Ouroboros>phinix: iptables
19:27<phinix>the reference
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19:28<amphi>phinix: aptitude install debian-reference-en
19:28<amphi>phinix: or adjust for your default language
19:28<qq>Ouroboros : I have a linuxrc
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19:28<wd>does anyone know how compiz works in kde please
19:28<phinix>thank you. Ouroborous: Did you mean it came with iptables, or get iptables
19:28<amphi>phinix: it'll be in /usr/share/doc/Debian
19:28<Ouroboros>qq: hm, well, i am a bit confused as to how i am supposed to be doing this in general... i am trying using initramfs-tools/scripts now
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19:29<phinix>thank you amphi
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19:29<amphi>phinix: iptables is a utility program for configuring the kernel packet filter
19:29<Ouroboros>phinix: generally we mean that such a package exists, if it is not installed on your system, you can always apt-get it
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19:29<phinix>thank you
19:30<Ouroboros>phinix: if you want a GUI firewall, see firestarter, but i recommend manual iptables
19:30<qq>Ouroboros: is a good to look at linuxrc
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19:31<qq>is a good thing to look at linuxrc
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19:31<phinix>ok, thanks again, that is enough to work on for now
19:31<Ouroboros>ok i am looking
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19:32<qq>can a send you the file ?
19:32<Ouroboros>you can try
19:33<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
19:33<Ouroboros>yeah put in on pastebin
19:33<witte>qq: if you want to share a file, you can put it online using a pastebin
19:34<etherboy>i'm creating /
19:34<etherboy>do i want to set the bootable flag?
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19:34<witte>etherboy: not needed if you are not using a dos bootloader
19:34<etherboy>i'll be using grub or lilo
19:35<etherboy>btw this is a virtual machine
19:35<etherboy>not that it matters
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19:36<Ouroboros>so which script/binary is calling the boot scripts in initramfs-tools/scripts ?
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20:17<edward_>how do i setup a streamin radio station? i have a pc at home and i would like to be able to listen to music being played by my pc while im at work
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20:33<lupine_85>edward_: vlc can do that
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20:41<Guest182>Hi, I am running LTSP and would like to resume the session I locked. Is this possible?
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20:47<amphi>debian: pardon? ;)
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20:50<kie27>greetings all, any ideas on if it is possible to get the fingerprint reader on my sony g2 working?
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20:53<amphi>kie27: dunno; the one on my x61s is, perhaps thinkfinger will work with yours
20:53<debian>i need some help with setting up vsftpd server
20:54<debian>i am not able to set up one home directory for multiple user's
20:54<debian>anyone have any idea's on how i can do that?
20:54<amphi>!tell kie27 -about laptop
20:55<kie27>amphi: any tips on what to do next, it would be cool to be able to log in/deactivate the screensaver with just a fingerprint
20:55<kie27>amphi: my laptop ias not listed on those sites yet, i think it is too new
20:56-!-hank_ [] has joined #debian
20:56<amphi>kie27: install thinkfinger-tools libthinkfinger0 libpam-thinkfinger (that's testing, BTW)
20:56<amphi>kie27: ah - you get to write the howto ;)
20:56-!-topherjames [] has joined #debian
20:57<amphi>kie27: try playing with tf-tool and see if it works
20:57<topherjames>hi all
20:58<kie27>amphi: thanks
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20:58<amphi>kie27: describes the one I have; yours may be the same
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21:01<topherjames>has anyone else successfully put debian on an old tray loading imac?
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21:05<kie27>amphi: i hope so, externally it looks the same...
21:05<amphi>kie27: any luck with tf-tool?
21:06<amphi>kie27: try tf-tool --acquire, and if that appears to work, tf-tool --verify
21:07<kie27>amphi: just check but the packages are not listed, as i am currently running stable, i guess i will need to upgrade to testing...
21:07<amphi>kie27: you should probably run testing on such fancy new hw in any case
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21:07<amphi>kie27: what laptop is it?
21:09<kie27>sony g2, the light one with the carbon fibre case and 64Gb SSD :) my old panasonic laptop started to have some problems after 3 years, so that was the perfect excuse
21:09<kie27>i bought it in japan when i was there a couple of weeks ago
21:11<amphi>kie27: oh, similar size to an x61
21:11<kie27>i have always run stable so far (no complaints), but i will give testing a try (gulp).
21:11<amphi>testing has been good to me, over a considerable period
21:11-!-Piet_ [] has quit [Quit: Piet_]
21:11<kie27>yes 7xx grams, 12.1" screen
21:12<witte>kie27: stop that, you are making the rest of us drewl ;-)
21:12<kie27>witte: sorry :)
21:12<amphi>kie27: yeah, similar, except I got the large 8 cell battery
21:13<amphi>kie27: yours uses the UL core 2 duo?
21:13-!-RaulSlacker [~RaulSlack@] has joined #debian
21:13<RaulSlacker>alguna mujer?
21:13<RaulSlacker>anybody here?
21:14<kie27>amphi: yes, intel 945gms although dmesg reports it as 945gm
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21:14<amphi>'mujer' is an odd word for 'here'...
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21:14<RaulSlacker>girl ?
21:15<RaulSlacker>como puta la conoscona ;>
21:15<RaulSlacker>kiero romperle el culo
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21:29<kie27>amphi: changed the references from etch to lenny in apt sources, ran update, then dist-upgrade but it says no packages need upgrading. what am i doing wrong here?
21:30<dpkg>First, see <apt-listbugs>. Next, edit sources.list (# editor /etc/apt/sources.list), change all non-local mentions of 'etch' or 'stable' to 'lenny'. Save the file, then update and dist-upgrade. Also consider subscribing to debian-devel-announce (ask me about <d-d-a>) to be aware of what developments are happening. NOTE: you should be running a 2.6 kernel before trying to upgrade
21:30-!-Blacker47 [] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
21:31<witte>kie27: so the thing you did should be correct, and you should have multiple packages that need upgrading...
21:32<kie27>witte: that is what i was expecting, but not what happened, there were no references to stable, only etch.
21:32<amphi>kie27: did the update apparently work?
21:32<witte>kie27: ok, but that is the same. those are symlinked on the servers
21:33<kie27>maybe the hong kong lenny repositories are actually also etch, maybe i should just use another mirror.
21:33<craigevil>do you have a apt.conf pointing to stable?
21:34<witte>kie27: you could try that, but if it is a official debian mirror, it should have the correct lenny
21:35<kie27>craigevil: no apt.conf file (just did a quick updatedb then locate apt.conf)
21:37-!-sebbo__ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:37<witte>kie27: just try to install (or reinstall) a small packet and see where it get's it
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21:39<kie27>hmm, nothing seems installable, e.g. Package lynx is not available, but is referred to by another package.
21:40<amphi>kie27: perhaps update again, or choose another mirror
21:40<witte>kie27: and if the thing that amphi sais fails, can you upload your sources.list and the complete
21:40<witte>error message to a pastebin?
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21:44<kie27>amphi: am now trying (instead of, my connection is a little slow since am on a 3g wireless connection
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21:45<kie27>witte: yes will do
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21:50<tyguaike>hello im is chinase
21:50<dpkg>methinks cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
21:50<tyguaike>yes cn
21:50<kie27>same problem, i am messing up some how, doesn't look like the mirror is the problem,
21:51<tyguaike>are you from ?
21:51<witte>kie27: strange
21:53<kie27>witte: just to ask the obvious but having the clock 8 hours ahead of GMT (being based in HK) should not effect this.
21:54<kie27>witte: s/effect/affect/
21:54<witte>kie27: i would not see why it would. The only thing that i can think of is that you are in lenny
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21:55<witte>kie27: can you do "dpkg -l libc6 |tail -1"
21:56<witte>kie27: could it be that you had a mixed sources.list with lenny and etch in it?
21:57<kie27>witte: ii libc6 2.3.6.ds1-13etch5 GNU C Library: Shared libraries
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21:57<witte>kie27: that is a no, you are in etch
21:57<kie27>witte: apart from that one backport for flash, no should be completely etch up until 10 minutes ago
21:57<vook>it'd be a good idea to get in the habit of using aptitude rather than apt-get
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21:58<witte>kie27: it should just work, i have no idea why it doesn't
21:59<kie27>witte: hmm, am running gnome, is it possible that synaptics configuration is affecting it in some way?
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21:59<witte>kie27: try removing /var/cache/apt/*.bin, and update and dist-upgrade again
21:59<witte>kie27: could be, i don't use synaptic, but normally it is just a frontend
21:59<tyguaike>ubuntu ?
22:00-!-eisen__ [] has joined #debian
22:00<witte>!tell tyguaike about ubuntu
22:00<tyguaike>yes about ubuntu
22:00<tyguaike>where have about ubuntu?
22:01<witte>tyguaike: the dpkg bot sent you a private message about ubuntu
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22:01<cheeseboy>Setting up mysql-client (5.0.51-3) ...
22:01<cheeseboy>debian:/home/greg# mysql
22:01<cheeseboy>bash: mysql: command not found
22:01<cheeseboy>how i fix it?
22:01<tyguaike>dpkg bot?
22:01<dpkg>I ain't no stinkin' bot. I am a finely tuned and hand crafted tool. Oh wait... I guess I am a bot (that you should not abuse).
22:01<monsterb> /msg dpkg etch->lenny
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22:02<amphi>kie27: is your dist-upgrade working now?
22:02<tyguaike>are your use system what?
22:02<amphi>tyguaike: this channel is for debian
22:02<noflash>tyguaike, #ubuntu
22:03<amphi>tyguaike: debian gnu/linux
22:03<kie27>amphi: first time gave some errors md5sum mismatch ,just waiting for second time
22:03<tyguaike> #ubuntu not people
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22:03<amphi>tyguaike: heh
22:04<noflash>tyguaike, this is a debian channel
22:04<tyguaike>debian gnu/linux can office ?
22:04<amphi>tyguaike: open office, yes
22:04<noflash>tyguaike, there are a lot of people in that channel
22:05<cheeseboy>any idea how to fix it?
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22:05<kie27>witte: current error messages are now
22:06<tyguaike>heh I setup the debian see.
22:06<amphi>kie27: the update didn't work
22:06<kie27>amphi: correct
22:06<tyguaike>debian system can auto update?
22:06<amphi>kie27: no sense doing a dist-upgrade until update worked
22:06<amphi>tyguaike: yes
22:07<vook>kie27: you may as well make your line "" instead of ftp.
22:07<vook>that may fix the md5 sum warnings.
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22:08<noflash>tyguaike, you have a debian question?
22:08<kie27>vook: ok
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22:08<amphi>noflash: eh? he just asked more than one
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22:10<vook>kie27: well, nevermind. It probably won't.
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22:15<kie27>vook: well it seems to have fixed the update error, however, still get the same problem that dist-upgrade suggests no packages need updating
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22:16<tyguaike>noflash, yes ,im setup the ubuntu not player muse
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22:18<cheeseboy>dpkg: serious warning: files list file for package `libmysqlclient15off' missing, assuming package has no files currently installed.
22:18<cheeseboy>i got bunch of those errors
22:18<cheeseboy>how i fix that
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22:23<qq>apt-get dist-upgrade
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22:24<cheeseboy>tried that
22:24<witte>cheeseboy: when did you get that error?
22:24<cheeseboy>wen i tried to install mysql
22:25<witte>cheeseboy: so you do "apt-get install mysql" on a debian etch, and that error comes?
22:26<qq>cat /etc/apt/sources.list |grep http
22:26<cheeseboy>but ya
22:26<cheeseboy>deb testing main contrib non-free
22:26<cheeseboy>deb experimental main
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22:27<witte>cheeseboy: oh, so you are on testing, not on etch
22:27<witte>cheeseboy: did you check the bug tracking system
22:27<cheeseboy>its my fault
22:27<cheeseboy>i deleted somtin i shouldnt have
22:27<qq>and experimental on .debian-multimedia
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22:28<witte>cheeseboy: it would be better if you told us everything
22:28<witte>that makes it easier to help you!
22:28<cheeseboy>i dunno wat i deleted
22:28<cheeseboy>but i know i deleted somtin important
22:29<witte>cheeseboy: sigh :-)
22:29<qq>very sigh
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22:29<cheeseboy>it was somting to do with apt database
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22:30<witte>cheeseboy: look in /var/log/dpkg.log
22:30<witte>cheeseboy: or rather, post it to a pastebin
22:30<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
22:30<cheeseboy>i know pastebin :P
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22:34<qq>2008-03-01 19:19:27 status installed mysql-client 5.0.51-3
22:34<qq>so mysql-client is installed !
22:35<qq>see line 830
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22:37<cheeseboy>witte, u still there?
22:37<witte>cheeseboy: and what if you just install libmysqlclient15off
22:38<witte>cheeseboy: yes still here, and i agree with qq
22:38<cheeseboy>says its already installed
22:38<witte><qq> 2008-03-01 19:19:27 status installed mysql-client 5.0.51-3
22:38<witte><qq> so mysql-client is installed !
22:38<witte>04:35 <qq> see line 830
22:38<cheeseboy>yep but it doesnt work
22:38<cheeseboy>greg@debian:~$ mysql
22:38<cheeseboy>bash: mysql: command not found
22:39<qq>try as root
22:39<witte>cheeseboy: whereis mysql
22:40<cheeseboy>debian:/home/greg# whereis mysql
22:40<cheeseboy>mysql: /usr/share/man/man1/mysql.1.gz
22:40<witte>cheeseboy: reinstall mysql-client and the libmysql stuff with apt-get install --reinstall
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22:41<cheeseboy>same errors
22:41<cheeseboy>Setting up mysql-client (5.0.51-3) ...
22:41<cheeseboy>debian:/home/greg# mysql
22:41<cheeseboy>bash: mysql: command not found
22:42<witte>cheeseboy: mysql should be in /usr/bin
22:42<cheeseboy>its not tho
22:42<cheeseboy>debian:/home/greg# ls /usr/bin/ | grep mysql
22:43<witte>cheeseboy: see in the bug tracking system if it is a bug
22:43<PowerBook_G3>Hello. I'm attempting to install linux on an oldworld PowerBook G3. I've read the documentation up to 4.5.1 where it talks about "hard disk installer booting" for old world systems. It says to copy linux.bin and ramdisk.image.gz from a directory on the Debian CD to my System Folder, but I cannot find this directory at all! Help totally lost in a noob-fashion
22:43<cheeseboy>witte, this happened after i deleted somtin
22:43<cheeseboy>it worked before
22:44<kie27>any other ideas why my upgrade to lenny is failing?
22:44<witte>cheeseboy: I don't use mysql myself, and as long as you don't remember what you deleted, i cant realy help...
22:44<cheeseboy>i deleted anything with mysql in the name
22:44<amphi>kie27: it seems very odd
22:44<witte>kie27: check the entire /etc/apt directory for "strange" stuff
22:45<witte>cheeseboy: in which directories (or did you locate msql, and deleted that output)
22:45<cheeseboy>locate and deleted stuff
22:46<cheeseboy>i think it mightve been stuff in /var/lib/dpkg/ that messed it up
22:47<witte>cheeseboy: i think so as well, but i don't know how they are generated.
22:47<witte>cheeseboy: an update and reinstall should fix that though...
22:47<kie27>witte: good call, have renamed the /etc/apt/preferences file to preferences.old. i first used it when i installed the flash-plugin frombackports (i think that may have been the problem), will try again now
22:47<cheeseboy>witte, i tried apt-get update and still errors
22:47<qq><PowerBook_G3> linux.bin on CD is vmlinux-2.6.18 ,or so and ramdisk.image.gz is initrd-2.6.18 or so
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22:49<kie27>witte, amphi, yes thanks, that fixed it, now i need to wait while 841MB are downloaded!
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22:50<witte>kie27: great, i really had no idea what else it could be :-)
22:50<PowerBook_G3>qq: i see no such files on this CD
22:50<PowerBook_G3>which is named Debian/PowerPC_etch
22:51<qq>give me ls /media/cdrom
22:51<PowerBook_G3>oh wait a second
22:51<dpkg>Do not paste more than 3 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or or for pics. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste!
22:53<PowerBook_G3>qq i'm on Mac OS currently so
22:53<netbird>Hi, does anyone knows if there is support for the Initio 162x sata in unstable debian?
22:53<PowerBook_G3>not sure how to give you what you seek
22:54<PowerBook_G3>i found files with similar names on the CD, initrd.gz and vmlinux (with no extension) but they're not located in the same directory or even a related directory as mentioned in the documentation
22:54<PowerBook_G3>instead they're located in install/powerpc
22:55<amphi>kie27: cool
22:55<qq>use initrd.gz and vmlinux
22:56<witte>netbird: not sure it does, you need a newer kernel i think
22:56<witte>!tell netbird about etch 2.6.23
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22:56<qq>Are you installed bootX
22:58<netbird>witte: I've tried with lenny and a custom 2.6.24 kernel, which include the initio 162x driver but it doesn't work due to lba
22:58<witte>netbird: sorry, misread your question, i read stable
22:58<PowerBook_G3>i just did that and told it to restart it recognized those files thank you
22:59<witte>netbird: well, the difference between hardware support in lenny and in unstable is the kernle
22:59<PowerBook_G3>i'll see if i can figure out some more of this myself
22:59<witte>and you already have 2.6.24
22:59<PowerBook_G3>thanks again
22:59<witte>netbird: i doubt there will be better support in unstable
22:59<witte>but you can try the debian
23:00<qq>PowerBook_G3: tip you must use initrd.gz from cdrom directory if you want boot from cdrom
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23:00<netbird>witte: think you're right, there wasn't any news about it in the 2.6.25 changelog
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23:02<PowerBook_G3>i keep losing video on the powerbook screen
23:02<netbird>witte:i think i'll wait if there is any improvement in future kernells. thanks
23:02<PowerBook_G3>after a little bit of booting
23:02<PowerBook_G3>should i rely on an external display for now?
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23:04<PowerBook_G3>i have nothing attached externally so i don't know where the video is ging
23:04<PowerBook_G3>it seems fine at first, then the colors get all weird and it fades out
23:04<qq>yes attache a external
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23:17<Jagster>hi i am new to usin debian can anyone help me i am trin to boot a dvd burned on vista and i am getting told that i need a OS that supportes ISO-13346 can anyone advise thx
23:18<PowerBook_G3>ok i booted the powerbook with an external display - video shows fine but now i get a "kernel panic" error
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23:19<PowerBook_G3>says error syncing vfs
23:19<PowerBook_G3>can't mount root fs
23:19<PowerBook_G3>will restart in 180 seconds
23:19<PowerBook_G3>although it never restarts
23:19<qq>ahhh, you have to use a kernel for old_wold
23:19<alaya>PowerBook_G3: its not finding your drive
23:19<PowerBook_G3>the CD?
23:20<alaya>PowerBook_G3: either it lacks the driver for it or else the wrong device is specified in the boot loader config
23:21<qq>sorry old_world
23:21<alaya>PowerBook_G3: or maybe some issue it has with non-dos partition table possibly
23:21<qq>not that
23:22<qq>have you put initrd.gz from cdrom directory ?
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23:23<PowerBook_G3>i believe so but let me double check
23:23<PowerBook_G3>sorry for delayed responses i have to run up and down stairs from the powerbook to this imac with IRC running
23:24<qq>see /insta/cdrom/initrd.gz
23:32<PowerBook_G3>in BootX do i have to select that image or something
23:32<PowerBook_G3>or should i just leave the default settings
23:35<PowerBook_G3>i don't see an install/cdrom/ directory
23:35<PowerBook_G3>just instal/powerpc, install/powerpc64, and install/chrp
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23:39<qq>choose /install/powerpc/
23:39<qq>ls /install/powerpc/ for me
23:42<PowerBook_G3>so i took those files from that directory
23:42<PowerBook_G3>and put them into the Linux Kernels folder in the system folder
23:42<PowerBook_G3>and just had bootx restart with default settings
23:42<PowerBook_G3>fails with same error
23:43<qq>I see
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23:44<PowerBook_G3>on my Mac OS 9 CD i booted from
23:44<PowerBook_G3>i reparitioned the hard drive using the 'Preferred settings for LinuxPPC" option in Disk Utility
23:45<PowerBook_G3>which gave me a 100 MB Mac HFS partition
23:45<PowerBook_G3>and the rest is some other stuff i don't recognize nor does mac os 9
23:46<PowerBook_G3>on that 100 MB partition i installed a tiny copy of mac OS 9 with BootX and the CD-ROM extension
23:46<PowerBook_G3>i believe i've done everything correct so far
23:46<flypiper>PowerBook_G3, when I build a kernel the debian way.. the VFS error is the kernel not seeing the initrd image. If that helps any
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23:48<qq>PowerBook_G3: booting is not dependent of partions
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23:50<qq>what are in bootx the default settings?
23:50<PowerBook_G3>oh huzza its workign now
23:51<PowerBook_G3>default settings has no disk image "specified"
23:51<PowerBook_G3>but i didn't know if i had to or not
23:51<PowerBook_G3>i thought i did specify one
23:51<PowerBook_G3>but now i just double checked and it booted into what looks like an installer
23:51<PowerBook_G3>asking me to choose my language
23:51<PowerBook_G3>i'm excited
23:51<flypiper>PowerBook_G3, KOOL
23:51<qq>super go on !
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23:59<PowerBook_G3>this installer seems to be sitting on this "configuring network with DHCP" window for quite a while
---Logclosed Sun Mar 02 00:00:08 2008