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#debian IRC Logs for 2008-04-10

---Logopened Thu Apr 10 00:00:06 2008
---Daychanged Thu Apr 10 2008
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00:04<prathibha>In user login the volume control is not while.
00:04<prathibha>But it is working fine in root login.
00:04<prathibha>The volume control displayed this message "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found."
00:06<prathibha>Can anyone help me to solve the problem
00:06<vook>prathibha: you may need to add your user to the audio group.
00:06<prathibha>vook, How yo add
00:15<prathibha>vook, How to add to the audio group?
00:15<vook>hold on (the way I do it would be bad advice)
00:15<CaptObvious>As a first time linux user, what etensions whould i look for installables? (lke .exe in windows, etc) Tryng to download pidgin and have no idea which is for me..
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00:15<vook>prathibha: erg - ok. The isn't the proper way (I may be smited). I usually just edit the group file directly (with vigr). You basically just need to find the 'audio' line in /etc/group and add your username after it. If there is another user on the line, place a comma first.
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00:15<vook>prathibha: once you've finished, log out and log back in.
00:15<prathibha>vook,I have added.
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00:15*vook finds 'usermod'
00:15<sutula>CaptObvious: apt-get install pidgin
00:15<CaptObvious>sutula, i really have no idea what that means..
00:15<sutula>CaptObvious: Are you using Debian?
00:15<CaptObvious>I am.
---Logclosed Thu Apr 10 00:15:13 2008
---Logopened Thu Apr 10 00:15:56 2008
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00:15-!-Irssi: #debian: Total of 309 nicks [2 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 307 normal]
00:16<prathibha>vook, what to do?
00:16<vook>prathibha: you could try installing aumix to help diagnose. Do you have a /dev/dsp?
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00:17<prathibha>vook, No I don't have dev/dsp
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00:17<vook>prathibha: what about /dev/mixer and /dev/audio?
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00:18<prathibha>vook, no it is also not there
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00:19<vook>prathibha: do you have alsa installed? alsa, alsa-oss?? (I'm not sure at this point)
00:20<prathibha>vook, do u mean alsaconf
00:21<prathibha>vook, i ran alsaconf command, but also no use
00:21<vook>install alsa-utils and then try to open alsamixer as your user.
00:21<prathibha>vook, should I install alsa-utils
00:21<prathibha>vook, ok
00:23<prathibha>vook, I ran alsamixer. In that any changes I have to make
00:24<vook>prathibha: no, but it works? do you have sound?
00:25<prathibha>vook, no sound
00:25<vook>but root has sound hmm...
00:26<vook>prathibha: pastebin the output of lsmod if possible.
00:26<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
00:26<prathibha>vook, yes i am play songs,videos,etc.,
00:26<vook>under root, but not as your user?
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00:30<vook>I'm having an evil time with an upgrade for module-init-tools - "dpkg-divert: rename involves overwriting `/sbin/depmod' with different file `/sbin/depmod.modutils', not allowed" I've been stumped for > 24 hours now.
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00:32<jermman>I dont suppose anyone could help me with a sound card problem, im new to linux
00:33<jermman>the problem is, it isnt detecting it
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00:36<rks>hello to all
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00:36<jermman>Someone wanna help me with my soundcard problem :/
00:36<rks>can anyone tell how to change the DNS server in linux
00:37<vook>rks: edit /etc/resolv.conf
00:37<gsimmons>jermman: What sound device do you have?
00:37<jermman>Im new to linux, I dont even know how to check
00:37<gsimmons>!tell jermman -about what's my hardware
00:37<jermman>Thank you sir
00:38<jermman>nvidia MCP61 high definition audio
00:38<jermman>oh yay.
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00:39<prathibha>vook, The output of lsmod is present in this link
00:39<rks>so waht i do
00:40<rks>and what the lsmod does
00:42<rks>plz tell
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00:44<rks>plz anyone tell
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00:44<chealer>rks: if you don't mind, why do you want to do that?
00:44<jermman>You're not getting any help asking like that
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00:45<rks>i just want to know
00:45<rks>because i am also new in linux
00:45<rks>and want to know something about linux
00:45<rks>and work on it
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00:48<keith>Debian4.0.AMD64. Winfast A280LE. Xorg.Which files do I install from the Debian Package. There seem to be 9 packages that apply. Any help here?
00:49<phillipsjk>rks: are you familiar with any other unix variants? (no, windows doesn't count)
00:49<rks>i am using knoppix
00:49<rks>and just know how to boot it
00:49<rks>and connect to internet
00:49<rks>and no more
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00:50<keith>Winfast A280Le. And I should have said I want to install the card.
00:51<rks>one more question phillipsjk
00:51-!-mike [] has joined #debian
00:51<rks>what is debian
00:52-!-linac [~lin@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:52<mike>A reprieve from god-awful Microsoft software.
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00:53<rks>and thanks for the books phillipsjk
00:53<phillipsjk>!tell rks about knoppix
00:53<prathibha>vook,did u check that link. Any solution
00:53<rks>i know a little much about
00:54<rks>that it is a live cd
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00:54<rks>and it doesn' requre to install on the hd
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00:54<rks>and it has all the facilities that we find in a normal linux distribution
00:55<phillipsjk>In summary, debian is a linux distribution that focusses on stability and "free" (as in freedom) software.
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00:55<jermman>So, im still looking for drivers for this MCP61 audio card
00:55<gsimmons>jermman: What version is reported for `cat /proc/asound/version`?
00:55<mike>rks: And it uses a convenient packaging system, apt[itude]
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00:56<jermman>Im not sure how to check that, whats the terminal command
00:56<mike>rks: apt-get install <software> is how my friend convinced me to try out Debian.
00:56<jermman>apt-get is awesome
00:57<jermman>Im already loving it
00:57<mike>jermman: agreed :-)
00:57<rks>and can u tell me a debian based distributin
00:57<mike>jermman: except when the app isn't in the stable database yet (i.e., splashy)
00:57<mike>rks: Ubuntu
00:57<mike>rks: and Debian itself.
00:57<mike>rks: Ubuntu is focused on ease of use.
00:58<rks>debian is a linux distribution
00:58-!-chick [] has joined #debian
00:58<rks>i have a old version of ubuntu
00:58<rks>can i use that
00:58<phillipsjk>rks is english your first language?
00:58<rks>i talk in hindi
00:59<mike>rks: I would recommend getting the latest Ubuntu (hindi, awesome)
00:59<rks>why mike
00:59<mike>rks: Usually you'll have an easier time supporting your hardware and all that if you get the newer stuff
00:59<rks>is it too easy
00:59-!-Bearman [] has joined #debian
00:59<mike>rks: because Hindi is a cool language, the written language looks cool.
00:59<chick>does anyone know what's wrong with the following line in fstab '/dev/hda2 /mnt/data ext3 defaults,grpid 0 2'
00:59<mike>rks: and because I can't understand it :-)
01:00<rks>u can't understand hindi
01:00<rks>so, what language u can understand
01:00<keith>rks: Debian would probably be the best for you. Ubuntu is too bleeding edge.
01:00<mike>rks: English, Spanish, Japanese (in order of fluency [if fluency is a word])
01:01<mike>rks: Aye, it is.
01:01<phillipsjk>mike: it is.
01:01<mike>phillipsjk: Heh, yeah, just dictionary'd it :-)
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01:02<chick>@keith isn't debian unstable pretty bleeding edge too
01:03<phillipsjk>the about debian page is available in about 20 langauges... Hindi does not apear to be one of them..
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01:03<jermman>where is forcedeth.c located? does it come with the distro>
01:03<mike>phillipsjk: That comes as a surprise to me!
01:03<mike>phillipsjk: I would think there'd be at least one Hindi speaker on the Debian project :-)
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01:05<keith>chick: OK, I should have said 'stable'. Needless to say I keep well away from the other 2.
01:05<rks>anyone can tell me any room talking about gprs connection
01:05*phillipsjk is still trying to check for the actual release.
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01:09<rks>all are silent here
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01:09<rks>no one has any questions
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01:11<rks>how to check the connection speed in linux
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01:12<chick>you can't really check connection speed
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01:12<jm_>the same way you check it elsewhere
01:12<chick>you have to check against some site
01:12<rks>there is no any way
01:13<rks>thats bad
01:13<rks>no tools in linux itseld
01:13<chick>depends on what you want to test
01:13<rks>i want to check download speed
01:13<rks>because i want to download
01:13<rks>not upload
01:13<chick>from where?
01:14<chick>the thing is download depends on the server too
01:14<phillipsjk>Debian Etch does have some hindi support:
01:15<chick>@rks: you might want to google 'bandwidth meter'
01:15<CaptObvious>or just something like
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01:28<prathibha>In user login volume control is not working It is giving the following message "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found." How to solve this?
01:29<mike>It's extremely good at what it does. But it's also extremely expensive.
01:31<phillipsjk>mike: wrong channel?
01:32-!-mode/#debian [+l 332] by debhelper
01:32<mike>phillipsjk: I forgot to type /msg so-and-so... I was comparing matlab and octave.
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01:32<prathibha>In user login volume control is not working It is giving the following message "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found." How to solve this?
01:32<mike>phillipsjk: topic being, what's so special about Linux :-D
01:32<prathibha>Is there anyone around to help me
01:33<mike>prathibha: I'm not ignoring you to be rude, I just don't know the answer.
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01:33<prathibha>mike, ok mike. Anyone else might be knowing. They can help me.
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01:42<phillipsjk>prathibha I don't see a mixer module listed in your pastebin
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01:47<phillipsjk>I think you are using oss, so you may want to try #modprobe snd-mixer-oss
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02:02<JustSoul>Is it possible to make "chown -R /somefolder/" to not work with symlinks?
02:02<JustSoul>jm_: zdarova
02:03<jm_>JustSoul: --no-dereference
02:06<JustSoul>jm_: thx
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02:09<phillipsjk>the blurb for the XMMS package says in works with OSS, but it depends on esound (or alsa emulating esound)
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02:11*phillipsjk wonders if it is a bug or compile-time option
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02:12<jm_>that's because it can play through esound
02:12<jm_>i.e. its output plugin is user selectable
02:14<phillipsjk>So I can safely overide the dependencies then?
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02:16<cwood>Are you that badly limited for disk space?
02:17<phillipsjk>no, CPU time is the limiting factor.
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02:19<phillipsjk>plus I removed esound because I thik it was interfering with module installation. (There is no documentation for the conf file)
02:19<cwood>esound was interfering with kernel modules, you mean?
02:20<jm_>you don't need esound installed - only libesd
02:22<cwood>I'm not certain why libesd0 is an issue... does not having a few extra kb of libs on the system really outweigh the annoyance of breakage somewhere in your package dependencies?
02:22<phillipsjk>I couldn't install the module for soundblaster emulation because the mixer was busy.
02:23<cwood>The kernel module for soundblaster emulation, do you mean?
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02:24<phillipsjk>cwood: yes
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02:24<cwood>I recall OSS can block if something is using your sound, in which case you'd have to stop all your sound-using apps, install the kernel module, then restart them. And, of course, have all your useful modules loaded on boot, saving you the problem in future.
02:24<phillipsjk>libesd0 depends on esound:
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02:25<cwood>You can always recompile xmms without esd support, if it's that important. That said, I think it's a tempest in a teapot.
02:25<jm_>that actually depends on your card - with sb live even multiple OSS apps worked just fine
02:25<cwood>I always had the cheap sound cards. :p
02:25<jm_>and still work ;)
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02:26<jm_>yeah it's all software mixing these days, even in windows
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02:26<cwood>libesd0 only suggests esound, it doesn't depend on it.
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02:28<phillipsjk>I may look at: pulseaudio
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02:29<phillipsjk>at esound-common != esound: that may explain why I am having trouble configuring it.
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02:32<phillipsjk>My main difficulty is I am using ancient hardware. I am having enough trouble resolving resource conflicts without a sound dameon causing similar symptoms.
02:32<jm_>how many times will we have to tell you you don't need any sound daemon for xmms
02:32<cwood>Why use a sound daemon at all, if resources are limited?
02:33<cwood>In fact, why not start culling your daemons entirely?
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02:41<phillipsjk>I just checked, the sb driver is still failing even without esound-common. I way have to check with the DOS utility that SB emulation is actually enabled.
02:42<cwood>Can you play sound with anything else? ogg123, for instance?
02:42<cwood>And do you have your sound driver module loaded?
02:43<phillipsjk>As for limited resources, I have decided to get a slightly newer machine.
02:43<cwood>What are you on currently?
02:43<cwood>And what are you using in terms of desktop environment, general apps, that sort of thing?
02:43<phillipsjk>yes, before removing esound, I was able to play sound thourgh XMMS (the pas2 driver)
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02:46<robert_>hey guys can somebody help me with my video card issues?
02:46<cwood>robert_: don't ask to ask. What card, what problem?
02:47<phillipsjk>I am using xfce. I experiencd an issue where X would not respond to mouse clicks. First time it happened I noticed that the PnP ISA NIC was auto-probing incorrectly (taking the IRQ the SB emulation was supposed to be using) The second time, I has set the NIC parameters manually..
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02:47<robert_>i'm using a x1350 ATI raedon and it has worked before but I reinstalled ubuntu and now it will not use the flgrx drivers only the vesa
02:47<cwood>I know nothing about ISA IRQ's, not much help here.
02:47<cwood>robert_: you might want to try #ubuntu for ubuntu questions.
02:47<phillipsjk>THis was not immediate, but after ~2 hours
02:48<robert_>where do i go for that?
02:48<cwood>robert_: you would /join #ubuntu
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02:50<robert_>can anybody here help me with my ubuntu problem....there is nobody at the ubuntu channel
02:51<sep>robert_, try #ubuntu on freenode
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02:51<phillipsjk>Did you perhaps install a package to get it working in the past?
02:52<robert_>yes i mean i went through the normal install process adding the drivers it has always just done it automatically
02:54<robert_>sep know of any other places there are nobody in those two channels
02:54<Supaplex>kd5mey1: let's start by not using all caps. (it's like yelling)
02:55<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
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02:55<Supaplex>robert_: when a spinoff of debian can't help, maybe it's time to install the real debian. :)
02:56<robert_>will debian give me the same exp as ubuntu? i mean is at as user friendly?
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02:57<Supaplex>I'm not qualified to suggest how user friendly it is to new comers. I'm a long time user :)
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02:57<robert_>how are packages installed on debian?
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02:57<Supaplex>I'd think there's a slightly steeper learning curve, but we're more likely to help if it's actually debian. :)
02:58<robert_>well i tried gentoo and it was a bit too much for me
02:58<Supaplex>aptitude, apt-get, dselect, dpkg. depends. usually aptitude
02:58<Supaplex>oh deb's way eaiser than gentoo :P
02:59<robert_>forget it i'm just gonna take off the whole linux thing
02:59<robert_>i'm tired of my drivers not working
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03:00<jhr-online>wow! i've never seen someone giving up that fast...
03:00<robert_>hey i'm been working on this for a while
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03:00<jhr-online>with debian?
03:00<Supaplex>what driver?
03:00<robert_>ubuntu is debian based and if it is debian based then my drivers should be utilized the same way
03:01<robert_>flgrx for ati
03:01<dpkg>hmm... ati is For X1300 and later, see Proprietary FGLRX <fglrx> <fglrx one-liner>. 3D accel is available via xserver-xorg-video-ati driver for many cards. "man radeon" for a full list.
03:02<robert_>i tried that i went through the terminal and config'ed the xserver myself
03:02<Supaplex>maybe debian shares a similar issue. see
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03:05<robert_>man i don't know, at least gentoo does support my drivers
03:06-!-ao2 [~u@2001:1418:117::1] has joined #debian
03:07<robert_>well thanks for your help on this one guys, at least i know where to go to now
03:07<robert_>goodbye linux!!!!
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03:08<Supaplex>try it again sometime. stuff improves all the time.
03:08<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building
03:08<jhr-online>Supaplex: do you feel like he really asked for help? :)
03:09<Supaplex>well, I didn't really offer much
03:09<Supaplex>a new video card can do wonders...
03:09<shital_>Hello All
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03:09<Supaplex>I may not agree with the non-free drivers, by I *do* like both my displays running. 02:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: nVidia Corporation GeForce 8600 GT [10de:0402] (rev a1)
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03:10<shital_>in my Ubuntu system export command is not working even though its installed, can any one help me????
03:10<Supaplex>!step 0
03:10<dpkg>hmm... step 0 is install debian for support here, or kindly GTFO. thank you. </public-svc-announce>
03:10<Supaplex>yeah, install the real thing.
03:10<sep>shital_, you got the wrong number try
03:10<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
03:11<shital_>thank you dpkg
03:11<dpkg>shital_: sure thing
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03:12<sep>dpkg: you get all the credits :P
03:12<dpkg>I resemble that remark!
03:12<Supaplex>!beer dpkg
03:12*dpkg deftly decants a fine Yuengling Lager for dpkg
03:13<sep>resemble. should it perhaps be resent ?
03:13<Supaplex>that's like resenting flattery?
03:14<sep>i resent that remark means i feel annoyed at it
03:15<sep>to resemble that remark must be i look similar to that remark. and makes little sense to me
03:15<sep>but i am not a native english speaking person so i could be on a wild goose chase
03:15<Supaplex>I think you're closer to the right understanding than I :)
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03:23<Clawfire>hello everybody
03:23<Clawfire>i've some trouble with my apt-get sources and i try to find debian deb depot
03:24<Clawfire>can you give me some url to find this ?
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03:27<dpkg>somebody said debian mirrors was or | ask me about <apt-spy> | to make a mirror, see, or
03:28<sep>rely not the patient type that one
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03:51<saasf>any1 around?
03:52<genmin>hi there
03:54<saasf>was just after some advice on pickin a linux distribution for use on some old pcs i got given to me. old aptive ibms. think they hav amd cpu at bout 500mhz and 64mb ram
03:54<genmin>i have a problem with a relative old hardware (4 Years), adaptec driver for scsi raid5 and xen kernel 2.6.18-5-xen-vserver-686. as soon as i run rsync with files over 3GB the server crash down. do smb. have the same experience?
03:55<saasf>not a noob wen it comes to computers or electronics just decided to get into usin linux or a unix based system as something to do for they hell of it
03:55<saasf>as i am a noob in the unix world heh... (ok im a hardware man mostly)
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03:57<franklin>saasf, Have you tried Debian with XFCE desktop ? ( )
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03:59<saasf>no i hav not. i was lookin into debian but wasnt sure if it was the way to go as these old pcs might not meet the standards needed and wasnt able to find a system requirements (heh was lookin n found the irc channel n thought was easier to ask)
03:59<jm_>installation manual lists requirements
03:59<franklin>saasf, CPU should do, but you 'll need some extra ram if you want to use GUI. (second hand RAM should be very cheap)
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03:59<saasf>yeh i got couple pcs here so can always throw some in from othas
03:59<saasf>wat sort of hdd space do i require??
04:00<franklin>a few GB will do.
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04:01<saasf>ok cheeers i shall return heh goin to check a few things out. cheers for help
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04:09<saasf>ok its a amd k6-2 475mhz cpu and a sis based 8mb gfx... heh like i said free pcs. will debian run on these??? (of course if i get more ram) or could any1 recommend a distribution that would b suitable for this system??
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04:14<Supaplex>depends on how much ram. I don't suggest a heavy wm/dm
04:14<Supaplex>dillo as a web browser can run pretty well even on p133/32mb ram (or elinks)
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04:30<franklin>Supaplex, I didn't know dillo. That's good to have/know.
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04:35<saasf>ok because this hardware is a lil before my time heh i no the stance that celerom but out of amd k6-2 475mhz or the celerom 600mhz???
04:35<saasf>im thinkin the k6?
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04:36<jm_>if you are asking which to use, go with celeron
04:37<saasf>yeh sorry heh half asleep
04:37<Supaplex>2:35am here. i'm ... mostly asleep. :p
04:37<Supaplex>didn't notice hehehe
04:38<saasf>so the of the celerom more so enough to use instead of the k6?? heh sorry again like i said this hardware is before mytime
04:38<jm_>I use 533 on my firewall (with 256M of RAM)
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04:41<Supaplex>the celeron should be faster. what's the clock speed on it?
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04:42<saasf>yeh should b heh just got off my ass n read some specs
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04:43<Supaplex>pop quiz. 600 > 475 right? :)
04:43<weasel>Supaplex: so?
04:43<weasel>celerons have notoriously little cache
04:43<saasf>yeh y i askd.
04:43<weasel>are your w and h keys broken?
04:44<saasf>wwwwwwwwwwwwwwww hhhhhhhhh
04:44<saasf>nope all good
04:44<saasf>just lazy
04:44<weasel>don't be.
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04:48<genmin>hi there
04:48<Supaplex>hi again
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04:58<saasf>ok got the best of the hardware together.
04:58<saasf>cpu: CELERON 600MHZ
04:58<saasf>RAM: 128MB
04:58<saasf>HDD: 40GB
04:58<saasf>GFX: 650 SIS
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04:58<padski>ooxml got through iso ?!?!? I thought it was an april fool ...
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04:59<jm_>padski: unfortunatelly it wasn't
04:59<saasf>so is debian going to be able to run smoothly enough on this setup?? or what would you guys recommend
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05:01<sallen>saasf, it depends. If you can use some light-weight WM and application, then it's enough.
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05:01<jm_>FSVO smoothly
05:02<saasf>i no im bein a pain in the ass but i havent got the greatest internet connection and why im asking so much instead of just fishing out and trying
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05:03<saasf>ok like ive said, im a noob in unix/linux and is why im putting this system together because i want to learn something new. so please try to explain a little more
05:05<padski>saasf, I still have a Pentium-120 running debian. It does have 64MB of RAM though, which is quite a lot, and I don't use it as a desktop.
05:05<sallen>saasf, simply speaking, use "icewm" instead of "gnome/kde" and use "epiphany-webkit" or "dillo" instead of "iceweasel"
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05:10<saasf>arr ok i see what you mean now. feel like abit of an idiot now....
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05:11<saasf>padski interesting mate i will have to try it out hey.
05:13<Gekz>whats that console app to see your wifi signal and noise?
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05:14<padski>Gekz, iwconfig
05:15<Gekz>the graphical one
05:15<Gekz>using curses
05:18<gsimmons>Gekz: 'wavemon'?
05:18<Gekz>whats a good way to check a connection for its volotility?
05:19<saasf>thanks alot you guys very helpful, i shell be off sleep time and time to leave this downloading.
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05:21<Gekz>my connection works fine
05:21<Gekz>but when I try to apt-get update
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05:21<Gekz>it always fails
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05:22<Gekz>it stalls
05:22<Gekz>and trys again
05:22<Gekz>and fails over and over
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05:39<padski>mind you, I still think that being unable to install awk in 64MB or RAM is a sign that something went wrong.
05:39<Zyklon-B>hi I would like to mount an ntfs system, which code is better for me?
05:40<Zyklon-B>sudo mount /dev/hda1 /mnt/windows
05:40<dpkg>[ntfs] Windows NT's filesystem. There are 3 main drivers in Debian, a Linux driver only able to read and FUSE drivers able to write too. For information about the former, ask me about <ntfsro>. For information about the read/write access, ask me about <ntfsrw>. See also and
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05:41<padski>Zyklon-B, the coll kids are using the FUSE driver these days I hear
05:41<Zyklon-B>mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/windows
05:41<Zyklon-B>or this one
05:42-!-mode/#debian [+l 341] by debhelper
05:42<Zyklon-B>I have problem with NTFS... root and the user can read and write to the disks
05:42<Zyklon-B>but after reboot
05:43<Zyklon-B>it'S the same as the start point... I can't see the ntfs patitiion... I have to mount it again...
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05:43<Torsten_W>Zyklon-B: write it in your fstab
05:43<Zyklon-B>I tried writing it to fstab as well... but I
05:43<Zyklon-B>I think I wrote it wrong
05:43<Torsten_W>that's your problem, not our
05:44<Zyklon-B>is something wrong here...
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05:44<Torsten_W>we don't know something
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05:45<Zyklon-B> / dev/hda1 /mnt/windows ntfs defaults 0 0
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05:45<franklin>Zyklon-B, compare with another line in fstab...
05:46<Zyklon-B>I am not sure about the defaults part
05:46<buffoon_work>Zyklon-B, remove the space between the 1st / and dev
05:46<Zyklon-B>in other distro it was longer than only NTFS
05:46<Torsten_W>Zyklon-B: ntfs != ntfs-3g
05:46<Zyklon-B>I added the space consciously other wise I couldn't send the message her
05:46<Torsten_W>u see the differnce?
05:47<Zyklon-B>Torsten_W: hm
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05:47<Zyklon-B>so I should write ntfs-3g right?
05:47<Torsten_W>i would do so
05:47<Zyklon-B>ok thank you very much
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05:50<Aishiko>hello, I'm wondering what the default desktop is in debian?
05:51<buffoon_work>Aishiko, gnome
05:52<Aishiko>buffoon_work, ick, I shouldn't have chosen desktop then
05:53<hever>Hi I can't scroll up manpages with pageup or pagedown or upkey or downkey ?!
05:53<df1amb>Hi I am tring to set up a new printer with the cups webfrontend but everytime I hink I have finished setup the cupsd crashes and I have to restart the cupsd. What could that be?
05:53<Aishiko>Zyklon-B, I only respond to in channel messages
05:53<Aishiko>buffoon_work, thanks :)
05:54<jm_>hever: install less and use it as pager
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05:56<Aishiko>I have another question is beryl or whatever it's called now also installed?
05:56<hever>jm_, I installed it and now ? You mean I use the wrong software to show manpages ?!
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05:59<jm_>hever: is it your default altnerative for pager?
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06:00<buffoon_work>Aishiko, afaik it's not, you have to do that manually
06:00<hever>jm_, No I'm going to use it system wide. $PAGER is not defined.... So what must I set or do ?
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06:01<jm_>hever: update-alternatives --config pager
06:01<hever>jm_, Actually I don't know the default alternative
06:01<Aishiko>great! too many are coming with that and it's annoyuing to have to uninstall it
06:01<twb>Every time I boot, something complains about being unable to mount /selinuxfs. Since I don't use selinux, I find this spurious error irritating. I can find no reference in /{etc,usr/share}/initramfs-tools, so how do I avoid this error?
06:01<hever>jm_, oh interesting... ok it became it directly after installing it.... thanks
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06:02<jm_>twb: maybe?
06:03<hever>jm_, And I've also a vi problem. I can't move one col more to the right by using a arrow key. Then a "C" is put in the line above and its buggy...
06:03<jm_>hever: in X? console?
06:03<hever>Or using arrow keys gerneally causes inserting chars.
06:04<jm_>what TERM are you using? which vi variant?
06:04<hever>jm_, ok on X I got the characters and on the console its still not working going one more right...
06:05<hever>its a standard lenny setup
06:05<twb>jm_: I don't think it's mtab
06:05<twb>jm_: that appears to just which selinuxenabled, which fails
06:05<jm_>twb: I remember seeing it on Lenny too at home, will check today
06:05<twb>jm_: thanks
06:05<jm_>hever: answer my questions pleas4
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06:07<hever>jm_, vim-tiny vim-common
06:08-!-sebash_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:08<hever>jm_, and $TERM is linux and xterm
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06:10<jm_>hever: did you try fully-fledged vim?
06:10<hever>jm_, Don't know what you mean
06:10<twb>hever: apt-get install vim-full
06:10<hever>ahh I did this just in the moment
06:11<hever>thanks now it works as I know and like it...
06:12<hever>thank you
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06:13<ilias>hi all. i installed yesterday debian 4.0. As i wrote my notebook is an old one (P celeron @650 /64 ram). Installation was ok. swap file 500mb. the system by default loads Gnome. Gnome is fine but slow for this cpu. How can i change to other desktop manager with fewer needs of ram? Which is the best desktop manager for a notebook with that configuration. I am new in linux (i tried with it 10 years ago, but i failed). How can i install older programm
06:13<Aishiko>nope can't find a list of what packages are installed when you choose different options when installing
06:13<twb>ilias: aptitude install xfce ~sgnome\&M
06:14<ilias>how can i do this twb?
06:14<twb>ilias: that's BROADLY what you need to do, but it might remove some packages you want, or keep some packages you DON'T want, so you'll probably want to fine-tune it with more aptitude/apt-get commands
06:14<twb>ilias: do you know what a command line is?
06:14<Aishiko>ilias, I'm going to remove gnome too, wasn't planing on having to remove it (didn't want it to begin with) but that is what you get when you go binary distro
06:15<tim_flatus>Question: I'm trying to watch one of the presentations on using iceweasel. I have installed mozplugger, but I don't know how to access any useful debugging information from it, so I have no way of workng out whether my changes to /etc/mozpluggerrc are having any effect. I'm sure the IET would be open to suuporting Linux clients, but I'm guessing I may have to write them a mini-HOWTO. Can anyone help me with thi
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06:15<twb>Aishiko: no, that is what you get when you don't pay attention
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06:15<ilias>sure i know.
06:15<twb>Aishiko: you have GNOME installed because you chose the "desktop" task.
06:15<ilias>can i find it opening root terminal window?
06:15<Aishiko>twb, and I was expecting options at that point
06:15<twb>ilias: aptitude is a command-line program that installs or removes packages.
06:15<padski>ilias, debtags search x11::window-manager
06:16<hever>And now the last one I'm going todo. More complicated. I'm going to do a "su -" after logging in via ssh. This works with the -t flag and passing su as command. But how can I pass the password to it? (su reads from tty and not from stdin)
06:16<twb>Aishiko: well, that's totally unrelated to the fact that debian is binary-based
06:16<ilias>is aptitude already installed with based system?
06:16<twb>hever: ssh -t wally su - works for me, I think
06:16<hever>ilias, Perhpas you going to use synaptics if you've already gnome installed. It's easier to handle than apt for beginners.
06:16<twb>ilias: it's installed if you chose the "standard" task, which is ticked by default
06:17<twb>ilias: hever makes a good point
06:17<Aishiko>twb, no it's not, it's based on what packages the designers wanted to include with the desktop, they could have easily have used KDE or xfce instead
06:17<twb>ilias: synaptic is a GUI tool for installing and removing packages
06:17<twb>Aishiko: plonk
06:18<jm_>hever: use ssh's key-based authentication or expect
06:18<hever>twb, Yes it works to pass su - but su asks me for the password wich is long and secure and I can't or won't remember it, so I'm going to pass it directly to ssh, you understand ?
06:18<ilias>is it synaptic installed too by default?
06:18<twb>ilias: I suspect you mean "is it installed on my system?" to which the answer is "try it and see"
06:19<hever>jm_, I'm using public key authentication for the normal account. And from this I'm going to become root.
06:19<twb>tim_flatus: you can't ssh-add the su password
06:19<twb>hever: is your problem the ssh password or the su password?
06:19<tim_flatus>twb: Sorry, yes. That would be silly.
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06:19<hever>tim_flatus, Nice tool but doesn't solve what I need. thank you
06:19<Aishiko>ilias, I don't know, I was looking for a list of what packages are installed when you pick options and it's not there (at least not easily found)
06:19<hever>twb, the su one
06:20<jm_>hever: then you'll need to use expect
06:20<jm_>hever: or sudo
06:20<hever>twb, actually I must copy and paste it
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06:20<twb>jm_: ooh, ooh! Can we have a flame war about sudo's security model?
06:20<jm_>twb: sure
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06:22<hever>I can say I don't need sudo and I'm not going to use it at this point.
06:22<tim_flatus>Where would be a good place to ask about embedded video? I guess there are no experts on here. I don't care what browser so long as I can apt-get it.
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06:24<jm_>tim_flatus: it works fine for me with mplayer
06:25<tim_flatus>jm_: damn. Mplayer no work for me. This is with the default /etc/mozpluggerrc?
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06:25<hever>This doesn't work for me
06:25<ilias>ok i'll try to find it. in aptitude what should i write to install xfce in place of gnome?
06:25<jm_>tim_flatus: no, I am using MediaPlayerConnectivity extension for iceweasel
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06:26<hever>I do a ssh and then I'm asked for the private key password. Then I'm logged in and I have to copy and paste the root password to become root and I'm going to automating this.
06:26<jm_>hever: of course it doesn't
06:26<twb>ilias: you can install them side-by-side, so your question is really twofold: how do I install xfce; and how do I remove gnome?
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06:27<tim_flatus>jm_: thanks.
06:27<twb>ilias: you can easily install all of xfce by apt-get installing the "xfce4" metapackage.
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06:28<ilias>i c. do i remove gnome to make run xfce4, or can i have both of them install and just prefer xfce be my desktop manager?
06:28<hever>jm_, cant I forward "input" to ssh ?
06:28<tim_flatus>hever: In that instance you would have to run the script as suid or something equally heinous.
06:29<hever>tim_flatus, no it should not running on the server it runs on my local box
06:29<jm_>hever: you can with expect
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06:29<vinboy>why my mdadm is using 100% CPU ?
06:29<vinboy>it's really strange
06:31<twb>vinboy: look at /proc/mdstat
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06:32<twb>ilias: at the login screen, look for a "session" option
06:32<vinboy>twb: yes.. it doesn't show anything unusual
06:32<twb>vinboy: dunno then
06:32<twb>vinboy: dmesg and /var/log?
06:33<vinboy>twb: oh wait... there is a md1, which I don't know of
06:33<vinboy>twb: how do I stop md1 and remove it?
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06:35<twb>Argh, I forget
06:36<vinboy>its' strange though
06:37<twb>vinboy: true
06:37<vinboy>why mdadm try to create a raid on md1
06:37<vinboy>it says /dev/hdb1
06:37<vinboy>i don't even know what that is
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06:40<vinboy>any idea?
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06:40<hever>jm_, Perhaps you're fit in expect. If I use this script I see just a password prompt and be back on the shell... I think it should give me something like invalid password...
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06:41<jm_>hever: I am not - I wrote my own tool for this because I don't like tcl
06:42<jm_>I have used something expect based years ago, but I lost it
06:42<twb>You have to be weird to like tcl
06:42<twb>Where "weird" means something like "I started on computers with Unix between 1992 and 1995" :-)
06:43<petemc>green horn
06:43<jm_>hmm I satrted using Unix during that time but I never really used tcl
06:44<twb>I probably have the dates a bit wrong
06:44<twb>ISTR Perl taking off about then
06:45<padski>base64 on the commanline ?
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06:46<twb>Th' dawn of the FILTHY FILTHY interwebs and the death of all things nice
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06:49<hever>(This is not a big or strange script...)
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06:52<vinboy>ok i stopped md1... cpu is fine now :)
06:52<vinboy>hey... why is adept removed from lenny?
06:53<twb>It's going through new again as 3.x, it appears
06:54<jm_>!tell vinboy about why is adept not in testing
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06:55<vinboy>hi twb
06:55<vinboy>can u give me the link again?
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06:57<[machine]>hever: you need another expect call on the end
06:58<hever>I right back on the shell...
06:58<hever>[machine], can you write it in the paste ?
06:59<[machine]>i have done :)
06:59*[machine] is one of the aforementioned "weird" people
06:59<twb>Burn him!
07:00<twb>Wait wait wait
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07:00<twb>First we need him to name a bunch of other actors^W witches^W tclers
07:00<jm_>I remember a comment in eggdrop - they are using tcl for scripting there, something along the lines of "what was he smoking?"
07:00<jm_>refering to tcl author
07:01<twb>tcl is dead, long live lua? ;-)
07:03<hever>[machine], thanks now I get the authentication failure ;)
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07:05<pelsey>Hello just got a quick newbie question. I was trying to update my flash player but now matter how many times I ran the installer it wasn't updating any of the so files except the one in mozilla-firefox directory - no good for epiphany or opera - so I just used common sense and replaced all the so files with the newer versions. Is there any disadvantage to this? I mean except for the extra time it took my obviously :)
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07:05<twb>pelsey: did you apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree?
07:05<jm_>pelsey: well next time you upgrade it you'll have to do the same
07:06<twb>"I ran the installer" sounds like "I broke the system by circumventing the package manager"
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07:06<pelsey><twb> no I ran the script from the tgz file from the adobe site
07:06<pelsey><twb> ah that's likely what I've done then
07:06<twb>pelsey: that could have done absolutely anything
07:07<twb>(One reason I hate non-Free software)
07:07<pelsey>that is true but I need to use flash and opera
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07:07<pelsey>opera installer behaves very well
07:07<twb>You can apt-get install both opera and adobe flash
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07:08<pelsey>should I try using apt now or is it too late?
07:08<twb>I honestly don't know
07:08<twb>I run screaming from "installers"
07:08<pelsey>I suppose I could wait for the next versions as they're both working at the moment
07:09<pelsey>To be honest I do trust Opera
07:09<twb>But to apt-get install opera, you need this apt sources.list entry: deb sid non-free
07:09<pelsey>I'm more reluctant to trust adobe
07:09<twb>To apt-get flashplayer-nonfree you just need the non-free branch of Debian
07:09<pelsey>thanks for those
07:09<pelsey>saves me looking
07:10<twb>You're lucky; normally I just cuss
07:10<vinboy>any repository for subpixel hinting enabled fonts?
07:10<altair>hi, anyone know if any binary of squid support follow_x_forwarded_for ?
07:10<pelsey>I really ought to spend more time learning but to me Debian is just a system I like as user
07:10<twb>vinboy: DVSM supports hinting
07:10<vinboy>twb: what is DVSM
07:10<twb>vinboy: but it's IMPLEMENTED by the font system, not the fonts
07:10<twb>DejaVu Sans Mono
07:11<jm_>altair: Debian has that doesn't it?
07:12<altair>I started with version 3..
07:12<hever>[machine], Now I'm asked for the password for the private key but if I enter it I can see it and I can't enter it this way. Can you help me, that I'm possible to enter the password and then send the su password ?
07:12<twb>Is squid 3 stable?
07:12<jm_>hever: interact or somesuch
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07:12<twb>I mean, is it out of pre-release?
07:13<altair>i'm using lenny/sid
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07:14<altair>it's a pre-release
07:14<jm_>what can I say, use 2.6
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07:15<tim_flatus>Question (going ...): I'm trying to watch one of the presentations on using iceweasel. I have installed mozplugger, but I don't know how to access any useful debugging information from it, so I have no way of working out whether my changes to /etc/mozpluggerrc are having any effect. I'm sure the IET would be open to supporting Linux clients, but I'm guessing I may have to write them a mini-HOWTO. Are thre any e
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07:17<hever>jm_, yes its interact thanks... but the last problem is now that interacts then works for the whole conversion. So I must tell it when the interact ends (with typing Return)
07:17<jm_>hever: yeah that's where my knowledge stops
07:18<jm_>I really hated writing it in tcl so I wrote my own tool using FPL for scripting
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07:22<gsimmons>twb: The 3.0 branch is production-ready, but has some known issues, along with certain features (found in 2.6) not available. There are more details in the release notes.
07:22<hypnotic>how and where can I request OSS4 to be a standard implementation in debian?
07:24<twb>gsimmons: ah, OK
07:24<dpkg>For information on packages which are not in Debian but you think should be, check the Work-Needing and Prospective Packages list at Also use the script wnpp-alert (from the devscripts package) to see what packages you are using that are in need of help.
07:25<hypnotic>cool thanx
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07:27<hypnotic>aha the request has already been filed
07:27<twb>What is OSS4?
07:28<jm_>open sound system?
07:28<twb>That's still alive?
07:28<hypnotic>the new open sound system drivers which are now open source (gnu)
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07:28<azeem>OpenSolaris just adopted it, AFAIK
07:28<twb>I thought it was legacy
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07:28<twb>I thought ALSA replaced it
07:28<hypnotic>thats oss3
07:28<azeem>twb: there's no L in OSS :)
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07:29<hypnotic>yup oss3 went closed source, alsa took over
07:29<twb>I didn't even know oss became closed source
07:29<hypnotic>alsa does everything software based
07:29<twb>Just that suddenly it wasnt "cool"
07:30<azeem>twb: there always was an enhanced closed source version
07:30<hypnotic>oss came back with oss4 and is open source now
07:30<twb>Fair enough.
07:30<hypnotic>and works great
07:30<azeem>hypnotic: what does OSS do hardware based that ALSA does software based?
07:30<hypnotic>had a lot of trouble with alsa
07:30<twb>I guess if I was an audio workstation weenie I'd know these things
07:30<hypnotic>3 major things work now
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07:31<twb>I just use sound for mplayer and festival, basically :-)
07:31<hypnotic>alsa always had one channel muted, if i logged in with 2 users, sound always produced hang ups, and mic never worked
07:31<hypnotic>*muted on startup
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07:31<twb>hypnotic: the init scripts are supposed to fix that
07:31<azeem>hypnotic: which kernel did OSS4 got added to?
07:32-!-mode/#debian [+l 349] by debhelper
07:32<hypnotic>these problems where there since i started using linux ( 1,5-2 years now)
07:32<hypnotic>no idea
07:32<azeem>hypnotic: so the answer to your question is: Get OSS4 into the kernel first, then we can talk about Debian integration
07:32<twb>If you fix the channels and do a clean shutdown they should be stored by /etc/init.d/alsa-utils
07:33<twb>That works for me.
07:33<hypnotic>any idea how my oss4 is working now?
07:33<hever>jm_, [machine], If I use the script ( I'm logged in. But if I type for example ls. It waits and then loggs me out...
07:33<azeem>hypnotic: eh?
07:33<azeem>how should we know how your oss4 is working?
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07:33<hypnotic>no idea but oss4 is not in the kernel but i have it installed
07:33<Guest1265>does anyone have any suggestions for a newbie to chat how to find a network/channel that is area specific (if there is such a thing) (area=eau claire, wisconsin)
07:33<azeem>hypnotic: please try to ask coherent questions
07:34<azeem>did you install it yourself?
07:34<twb>azeem: `so?' isn't a very lucid question, either.
07:34<twb>azeem: plonk.
07:34<hypnotic>yup, installed it with a script (there is also a deb which didnt work for me)
07:34<azeem>hypnotic: then you should ask the people who provided the script
07:34<azeem>we don't know about it
07:34<hypnotic>but i am still learning how the kernel, kernel modules work and communicate
07:35<twb>Guest1265: that is called a "linux user group" or similar
07:35<twb>Guest1265: there's a list on, IIRC
07:35<hypnotic>is alsa in the kernel?
07:35<hever>Aaah I solved it by using interact instead of expect at the end
07:36<hypnotic>ok and oss4 is not, does this work the same as using proprietary nvidia drivers who make use of kernel modules instead of being in the kernel?
07:37<jm_>hypnotic: not entirely the same, but similar
07:37<azeem>hypnotic: the nvidia drivers are packaged for Debian, I don't know whether the OSS4 drivers are
07:37<twb>Is oss4 something that one would m-a?
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07:37<hypnotic>yes they are but do not work but are there nvidia debs for nvidia?
07:37<hypnotic>using lenny
07:37<twb>If so, then it wouldn't be necessary for linux upstream to ship oss4 in thernally.
07:38<dpkg>module-assistant is, like, a tool helping to build additional (kernel) module packages and generate/install .deb packages with them, or aptitude install module-assistant build-essential && m-a prepare
07:38<jm_>hypnotic: they will be in Lenny too
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07:38<hypnotic>but not yet
07:38<jm_>because of RC bugs - you can get it from sid
07:39*twb grumbles about filthy tainted spawn-o'-th'-devil proprietary kernel modules
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07:39<madav>hello all. Could someone help me where to copy the firmware for ipw2200?
07:39<dpkg>The module is built into the kernel from etch onwards but you need the firmware to make the card work. Run "/sbin/modinfo ipw2200 |grep version" to get your driver version. Go to and download the firmware matching your driver version. Unpack it into /lib/firmware. See For sarge, ask me about <ipw2200 build>. See also <ipw2200 troubleshooting>
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07:39<madav>lib/firmware.. thx ;)
07:40<hever>jm_, [machine] it works now: thank you for your help
07:40<twb>Is ipw2200 a filthy wifi chipset?
07:41<madav>something like that..
07:41<hypnotic>I am going to install debian lenny at a friends pc and want to make it as easy as possible for her, can you recommend getting a nvidia sid package or using the nvidia script (logout to CLI, sh, answer some questions and then relogin)
07:41*twb grumbles more
07:41<madav>ok, im off, thx for the help :) bye
07:41<jm_>hypnotic: sid package
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07:41<hypnotic>ok never tried that
07:41<jm_>!simple sid backport
07:41<dpkg>First: See if the package has already been backported. Ask me about <backports>. If it hasn't, 1) Add a deb-src line for sid to your sources.list. 2) apt-get update 3) apt-get build-dep packagename;apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs.
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07:43<hypnotic>is there a way to setup synaptic/apt to use only lenny repos except the nvidia package from sid?
07:43<hypnotic>so packages will be updated automatically
07:44<hypnotic>fiddled around with mixed systems a while back but wasnt a succes
07:45<dpkg>If you are running stable, don't pin; use a backport. Ask me about <backports> or <simple sid backport>. If you're using testing, man apt_preferences or see
07:45<hypnotic>apt.conf set to lenny, add sid repo in sources.list and how can i set that synaptic only uses sid repo for nvidia packages and not the other apps
07:45<hypnotic>yes i know that howto
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07:48<hypnotic>if i gonna use that sid deb for nvidia, do i have to uninstall the nvidia driver first (driver is from nvidia site)?
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07:49<jm_>uninstall it
07:50<hypnotic>gonna try it
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08:11<hypnotic>well trying to install nvidia-glx with this:
08:11<hypnotic>apt-get -t unstable install nvidia-glx
08:11<hypnotic>The following packages have unmet dependencies:
08:11<hypnotic> nvidia-glx: Depends: nvidia-kernel-169.12 but it is not installable
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08:13<jm_>use nvidia-kernel-souirce to build one
08:14<jm_>uhm install it, read $docdir/package/README.Debian.gz
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08:15<hypnotic>this seems to be much more a hassle than using the nvidia drivers from the nvidia site
08:16<sep>hypnotic, yes typing m-a a-i nvidia is almost incredibly complex
08:16<hypnotic>i have the entire stable repo so if people with unstable have the packages, why dont i have them?
08:16<jm_>they are in stable ...
08:16<hypnotic>unstable sorry
08:17<hypnotic>why is it complex?
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08:17<sep>it was sarcasm..
08:18<themill>hypnotic: it's complex because of nvidia's non-free licence and because they won't support older versions of their software (or their older cards) properly.
08:18<hypnotic>first i had to now that i had to type it, and then i like to know why
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08:18<hypnotic>ok but the debian packages do that automatically right?
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08:21<hypnotic>is it possible to have this procedure: set dist to lenny, add sid repo and then install nvidia drivers with one click?
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08:22<azeem>hypnotic: try a simple sid backport
08:22<azeem>!simple sid backport
08:22<dpkg>First: See if the package has already been backported. Ask me about <backports>. If it hasn't, 1) Add a deb-src line for sid to your sources.list. 2) apt-get update 3) apt-get build-dep packagename;apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs.
08:22<themill>hypnotic: people's time would be better spent knocking the sid drivers into shape so that they can just go into lenny.
08:22<jm_>I told him about that half an hour ago
08:23<hypnotic>still dont know what to do
08:24<azeem>hypnotic: start by reading what dpkg said
08:24<jm_>is giving up not an option then?
08:25<hypnotic>i can only find a backport with version 8***
08:25<jm_>backports are only for stable
08:25<hypnotic>i want to understand why things now are not working
08:26<jm_>you'll have to invest more effort for that
08:26<hypnotic>if this doesnt work, why would other packages work
08:26<hypnotic><azeem> hypnotic: try a simple sid backport
08:27<tim_flatus>Question (going x2): I'm trying to watch one of the presentations on using iceweasel. I have tried using mozplugger with no success. What methods are known to work for watching embedded videos? Is there a better place to be asking these questions? I'm guessing there are no experts here.
08:27<azeem>hypnotic: did you read what dpkg said?
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08:28<hypnotic>first step yes, there are now backports
08:28<hypnotic>so i have to ask him
08:28<hypnotic>dpkg is a bot?
08:28<hypnotic>how do i ask him?
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08:29<franklin>hypnotic, if your not happy with the nvidia driver, blame Nvidia who doesn't provide nor support free drivers... but don't blame linux [freee software] for not providing non-free software ;)
08:29<azeem>hypnotic: read scrollback, d'oh
08:29<azeem>14:20 < azeem> !simple sid backport
08:29<hypnotic>i dont, i just wanted to try another way of installing it in lenny
08:29<azeem>14:20 < dpkg> First: See [...]
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08:30<hypnotic>compiling it with he nvidia script works nice but maybe a bit too much of a hassle for a linux newbie
08:30<hypnotic>its for a friend of mine
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08:31<hypnotic>nvidia drivers only give me some trouble in comination with compiz sometimes, for the rest works great
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08:31<azeem>hypnotic: please stop babbling about and confirm you read what dpkg said
08:31<hypnotic>nvidia is not the thing but mixing unstable and testing
08:32<azeem>hypnotic: so read dpkg's solutoin
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08:34<hypnotic>ok it did something, dont no what or why, but gonna try to relogin
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08:35<suiside>tim_flatus: mplayer has a gecko plugin, so does vlc, and then there's helix for real, adobe flash for (yeah you guessed it) flash as well as gnash (equivalent for something like flash 7 at this point with an increasing number of flash 9 features being added), as you've propably noticed there's several methods for embedding video on sites so unless you're going to specify what kind of media we're talking about this is a specific ...
08:35<suiside>... as one can advice you
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08:37<jm_>it's selectable by user - real or wmv, works just fine with mediaplayerconnectivity
08:38<peritus>what is the easiest way to "reset" a debian installation to a minimal installation? - to remove all non-default packages and purge all other installed packages - without re-installing from scratch
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08:38<jm_>peritus: aptitude
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08:39<peritus>jm_: how do i do that with aptitude?
08:39<jm_>peritus: read about its advanced search patterns in the manual (i.e. priority/essential fields)
08:40<vinboy>flashplugin is not available in lenny?
08:40<azeem>vinboy: no
08:41<vinboy>azeem: how come? what can I do to get flash player?
08:41<themill>!adobe flash
08:41<dpkg>Adobe flash is a non-free flash player and is in the package flashplugin-nonfree but is broken in etch: use the one from or flashplayer-mozilla from (ask me about <non-free>, <bpo> and <dmm>). It will not be included in future stable releases (see If you are using a 64-bit browser, ask me about <nspluginwrapper>. For a free alternative, ask me about <gnash>.
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08:41<azeem>vinboy: install swfdec-mozilla
08:41<hypnotic>well it messed up my system
08:41<azeem>vinboy: or wait till it is available again, or simple sid backport
08:42<azeem>hypnotic: that's not an adequate error description
08:42<hypnotic>nvidia doesnt start, tried to uninstall the thing i just did
08:42<azeem>what exactly did you do?
08:42<hypnotic>nvidia-glx was still not installable
08:42<hypnotic>so installed nvidia from the script, but doesnt work now
08:42<vinboy>thanks azeem
08:42<hypnotic>i followed the dpkg
08:43<themill>azeem: flashplugin-nonfree will never migrate to testing again. See the bug that dpkg referenced.
08:43<hypnotic>logged out and in, found no screeens
08:43<azeem>themill: ok
08:43<azeem>hypnotic: which script?
08:43<hypnotic>tried to install nvidia-glx from unstable with apt-get, still not installable
08:44<azeem>hypnotic: how?
08:44<azeem>hypnotic: please try to make sense
08:44<hypnotic>nvidia***.sh from their site
08:44<hypnotic>.run i mean
08:44<azeem>hypnotic: ok, so ask nvidia customer support, not us
08:44<azeem>we don't support that
08:44<hypnotic>you gave me the cmds
08:44<azeem>who told you to run a script off
08:44<hypnotic>how can i undo what you just recommended me|?
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08:44<hypnotic>i always do and always works
08:45<themill>hypnotic: the one thing we told you *not* to do was use the .run file from nvidia.
08:45<hypnotic>and thats the one thing that always worked
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08:45<themill>hypnotic: if that always works, why are you here?
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08:45<hypnotic>i told you, i was looking for a more simpler way to install nvidia for a friend of mine
08:45<_spOOn_>can anyone help me with an apache2 and virtual hosts issue
08:46<hypnotic>but this other way messes up the system
08:46<azeem>hypnotic: *shrug*, we don't support this
08:46<hypnotic>you dont support your support?
08:46<azeem>hypnotic: we don't support using
08:46<themill>hypnotic: we support people who don't follow our advice, no.
08:46<_spOOn_>virtual hosts stopped working, and my server is now looking for /htdocs/
08:47<hypnotic>i followed your advice by reading dpkg and using those commands
08:47<_spOOn_>instead of the documentroot defined in each site
08:47<azeem>hypnotic: what commands?
08:47<themill>hypnotic: and where did dpkg mention the .run file?
08:47<azeem>hypnotic: if you cannot be more precise, we cannot help you
08:47<hypnotic>i am trying to get the log file from this chat
08:47<franklin>_spOOn_, any error in /var/log/*/* ??
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08:48<franklin>_spOOn_, any error when you run "apache2 -t" ?
08:48<hypnotic>irst: See if the package has already been backported. Ask me about <backports>. If it hasn't, 1) Add a deb-src line for sid to your sources.list. 2) apt-get update 3) apt-get build-dep packagename;apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs.
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08:48<azeem>hypnotic: where does it talk about
08:48<_spOOn_> File does not exist: /htdocs, referer: http://inserthostnamehere/index.html
08:48<hypnotic>followed this and didnt work
08:48<azeem>!didn't work
08:48<dpkg>Look buddy, "doesn't work" is a vague statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message".
08:49<_spOOn_>apache2 -t = good :)
08:49<hypnotic>there was no error message, only when trying to login after this, there was the message no screens found
08:49<azeem>hypnotic: so a .deb got created?
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08:50<hypnotic>i have no idea, i was telling u want to understand what I am doing but you said read the dpkg so i followed it
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08:50<hypnotic>without understanding the use of these cmds
08:50<azeem>hypnotic: how did you install the deb if you do not know whether one got created?
08:51<hypnotic>i guess its makeing a kernel module for nvidia
08:51<azeem>it's a general procedure for using sid packages on lenny
08:51<hypnotic>deb nvidia-glx cannot be installed, and what the cmds do i dont no
08:51<_spOOn_>2.6.18-6-686 #1 SMP Sun Feb 10 22:11:31 UTC 2008 i686 GNU/Linux
08:51<_spOOn_>any ideas?
08:51<franklin>_spOOn_, and "apache2 -t -D DUMP_VHOSTS"
08:51<azeem>hypnotic: so use vesa
08:51<hypnotic>what does apt-get build-dep do?
08:51<azeem>or nv
08:51<azeem>hypnotic: read the apt-get manpage
08:51<hypnotic>apt-get -b source packagename
08:52<hypnotic>and how can i undo that
08:52<azeem>hypnotic: what did you put in as packagename?
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08:52<azeem>hypnotic: what was the output?
08:52<_spOOn_>it is listing the incorrect ip address
08:52<_spOOn_>where does it get that from
08:52<_spOOn_>i had to change local ip range of late
08:53<franklin>_spOOn_, I suspect the config file isn't use ...
08:53<_spOOn_>that must be why it died
08:53<franklin>_spOOn_, may be some file a directory permission ?
08:53<_spOOn_>VirtualHost configuration:
08:53<_spOOn_>* is a NameVirtualHost
08:53<_spOOn_>it should be
08:53<hypnotic>there were about 100 lines of compilation and ended with no errors, is the output still somewhere in a log?
08:54<hypnotic>where can i find that?
08:54<jm_>ls -rt /var/cache/modass
08:54<azeem>he didn't use modass
08:54<azeem>he did apt-get -b source nvidia-glx
08:54<franklin>_spOOn_, do you do ip based vhost or hostname based vhost ?
08:54<hypnotic>pasted those cmds in konsole
08:54<hypnotic>and put nvidia-glx in it
08:54<_spOOn_>where does apache store that ip?
08:55<jm_>then the description of compilation is wrong or you stating it didn't use modass are wrong
08:55<franklin>*:* would do..
08:55<hypnotic>dont know what modass is
08:56<azeem>jm_: there's no nvidia-kernel-source in lenny
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08:56<jm_>azeem: that's why he was told to get it from sid
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08:56<azeem>fair enough
08:56<franklin>_spOOn_, "<VirtualHost *:80>" then "ServerAlias"
08:56<hypnotic>yup and did download something from sid and compiled something for nvidia
08:57<jm_>did it create nvidia kernel packages?
08:57<hypnotic>damn it did
08:57<jm_>install it
08:57<hypnotic>but it didnt install it
08:57<azeem>hypnotic: that's the part where you have to think along a bit as well
08:57<_spOOn_>franklin, all fixed, thanks, lol
08:58<hypnotic>but what did it do to the system
08:58<_spOOn_>still had wrong ip in /etc/hosts
08:58<hypnotic>if it only compiled packaages
08:58*_spOOn_ is so dumb
08:58<azeem>hypnotic: nothing
08:58<_spOOn_>thanks for the help franklin
08:58<hypnotic>why doesnt the nvidia script work
08:58<franklin>your welcome.
08:58<hypnotic>nvidia drivers from the site
08:58<azeem>hypnotic: probably because you're mixing the tow
08:58<hypnotic>cant be coincidence
08:59<azeem>get rid of all the stuff before you install the Debian way
08:59<hypnotic>ok first gonna uninstall the nvidia site drivers then
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09:01<azi_valedhel>geez... wouldn't his life be easier if he would just upgrade to sid?
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09:02<franklin>azi_valedhel, he would get differents problem (because unstable is unstable).
09:02<ranix>googling for man pages is flooding the internet with your ignorance
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09:04<azi_valedhel>franklin, I use sid and it seems to be very stable (not that I would set up web server on sid^^)
09:04<franklin>ranix, yes... and is useful if one haven't installed a package.
09:04<hypnotic>installing the packages isnt working smoothly
09:04<hypnotic>nvidia-glx-dev conflicts with libgl-dev
09:04<azeem>azi_valedhel: please don't advertise sid in here
09:05<azeem>what do you need that for?
09:05<jm_>do you need glx-dev?
09:05-!-hypnotic was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
09:05<Gekz>why does apt-get update keep stalling for me
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09:06<jm_>you need nvidia-kernel-version...
09:06<azeem>hypnotic: don't paste
09:06<hypnotic>those are the packages that were made
09:06<azeem>hypnotic: that doesn't mean you need to install them all
09:07<azeem>I thought you were mainly interested in nvidia-glx
09:07<jm_>run m-a a-i nvidia
09:07<jm_>after installing nvidia-kernel-source
09:07<themill>!pastesmite hypnotic
09:07<themill>bloody bot
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09:08<dpkg>hello, azeem
09:08<hypnotic>nvidia-kernel-source is installed but nvidia-glx is still uninstallable
09:08<jm_>run the above command
09:09<hypnotic>bash: m-a: command not found
09:09<dpkg>*** NEWS FLASH! *** Your box does not come with every app, tool and utility known to debiankind installed already. If you find that the program you've been told to use isn't there, install it. Also ask me about <search>. if someone suggests an application to you, it's highly likely that it's available via apt-get, or aptitude
09:09<franklin>azi_valedhel, new bugs are fount (and fixed) in unstable every day. Whereas under stable, you have fewer bugs, which are known (with documented workaround) so you have the frustration of _knowing_ those few bugs.. but you can quickly solve your problem.
09:09<jm_>hypnotic: install module-assistant
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09:10<hypnotic>its working :D
09:10<hypnotic>what does this exactly do?
09:10<azeem>I'm amazed, I gave up on how 20 minutes ago
09:10<jm_>now check if it created the afore mentioned .deb
09:10<jm_>man m-a
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09:12<hypnotic>it installs nvidia-kernel-common but i dont see a new deb created
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09:12<jm_>where did you look?
09:13<hypnotic>my home, where the others debs were created
09:13<hypnotic>invoked the command from home
09:13<jm_>did you also check in /usr/src?
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09:13<hypnotic>nvidia-kernel-2.6.24-1-amd64_169.12-1+2.6.24-5_amd64 this one?
09:14<hypnotic>ok installed
09:14<azeem>now isntall nvidia-glx
09:15<hypnotic>ok done
09:16<hypnotic>nvidia-kernel-source is updateable in syanptic
09:16<azeem>check whether xorg.conf has nvidia set as driver
09:17<hypnotic>am i correct that you download the kernel source, invoke the m-a ... cmd, get the nvidia-kernel and install and then install nvidia glx?
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09:17<azeem>sort of, yeah
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09:17<azeem>for the final lenny release, the kernel module should just be available via apt-get
09:17<hypnotic>but why did i have to use these cmds from dpkg when the kernel source is in the repo
09:17<azeem>hypnotic: the source, not the module
09:17<azeem>and the source isn't in lenny either, AFAICT
09:18<hypnotic>no its is unstable
09:18<azeem>hypnotic: you still need nvidia-glx for lenny
09:18<azrael_valedhel>franklin, okay, okay, I never said anything ;) without any advertising - in my opinion life is a bit easier if you use new packages on your desktop with unstable than with stable or testing, but I am aware that it's not that great for someone completely new to linux (which I am^^) cause of possible troubles... no azeem, I'm not advertising nothing :P
09:18<azeem>that is what simple sid backport is for
09:18<hypnotic>i have nvidia-glx for unstable
09:19<azeem>hypnotic: then you were to incoherent for us to notice
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09:20<hypnotic>if there was no backport i had to use these cmds whoch i did, (and used this within a mixed repo setting)
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09:20<hypnotic>where can i get nvidia-glx for lenny ?
09:20<azeem>you can't
09:20<azeem>15:16 < azeem> that is what simple sid backport is for
09:20<hypnotic>hypnotic: you still need nvidia-glx for lenny
09:20<jm_>the same way you got it now - from sid
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09:21<hypnotic>i have a homemade nvidia-kernel and nvidia-glx from sid
09:21<jm_>no you only have homemade nvida-kernel
09:21<azeem>jm_: he backported nvidia-glx
09:21<hypnotic>nvidia-glx from unstable is installed
09:21<azeem>15:03 < hypnotic> nvidia-glx_169.12-1_amd64.deb
09:21<jm_>azeem: that's a binary only package, he simply used it
09:22<azeem>technically, he backported it
09:22<jm_>maybe it needs rebuilding on lenny yes
09:22<jm_>that's a good point
09:22<azeem>I don't know if it does
09:22<azeem>but it's safer to tell users to backport than to add sid to sources.list
09:22<azeem>or explain how to download+install manuall
09:23<hypnotic>right, missed that one, now installed that one instead of the sid one
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09:23<azeem>hypnotic: remove sid deb from sources.list (you can leave sid deb-src)
09:23<hypnotic>working on it
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09:25<hypnotic>ok lets see if nvidia works
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09:27<hypnotic>it works! :D
09:27<hypnotic>was the sid src repo manditory for this procedure?
09:27<azeem>eh, yes
09:28<azeem>the sid binary repo was not
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09:30<hypnotic>was dpatch neccesary?
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09:30<azeem>sheesh, no diea
09:30<azeem>probably it was
09:31<hypnotic>i am logging this in a txt file for the future
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09:31<azeem>hypnotic: did you apt-get install dpatch?
09:31<hypnotic>could be a dependency for one of those other packages i treid to install
09:31<hypnotic>no through synaptic
09:31<hypnotic>was needed
09:32<azeem>that's useless information again
09:32<hypnotic>kpackage gave an error but cant remember if it was needed for nvidia-kernel source or the other packages i did not have to use but tried to install
09:32<hypnotic>its not really important
09:34<hypnotic>so the procedure: add sid src repo and apt.conf, follow the dpkg cmds, install nvidia-kernel-source, install module-assistant, then m-a a-i nvidia and then install nvidia-glx
09:36<azeem>why apt.conf?
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09:37<azeem>Gekz: ?
09:37<Gekz>apt-get update still stalls for me
09:37<hypnotic>to set lenny as default distro
09:37<Gekz>Get:1 sid/main Packages [5278kB]
09:37<Gekz>Get:2 sid/main Packages [5278kB]
09:37<Gekz>itll do that about 5 times
09:37<Gekz>sometimes completes the file eventually
09:37<Gekz>but its corrupt
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09:38<Delph>Gekz: find a different archive, then?
09:38<azeem>hypnotic: you don't need that if you only add deb-src
09:38<Gekz>Delph: tried another
09:38<Gekz>same thing
09:38<hypnotic>o its only for bin repos?
09:39<hypnotic>did the rest of the procedure look ok?
09:39<Delph>Gekz: is your internets broken?
09:39<ranix>Delph: are your internets broken
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09:39<azeem>hypnotic: rather make a dpkg factoid out of it
09:39<azeem>!nvidia one-liner
09:39<dpkg>nvidia one-liner is, like, apt-get install nvidia-kernel-2.6-`uname -r | sed 's,.*-,,g'` nvidia-settings nvidia-glx && dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg (if you're on amd64, also install nvidia-glx-ia32. Using sarge? Ask me about <nvidia_sarge>. Homegrown or kernel from testing/sid: <nvidia_post_etch>. If you're using a Geforce2 or older: <nvidia_legacy>.
09:39<Delph>ranix: internets is *totally* a singular noun.
09:39<Delph>so we should use is not are :)
09:40<ranix>hypnotic: the nvidia driver installers from actually work now by the way
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09:40<Gekz>Delph: how am I talking here if my internets are broken
09:40<azeem>ranix: ugh, thanks a lot
09:40<Gekz>plus, my internet radio would stutter
09:40<Gekz>and its not
09:40<ranix>hypnotic: they work weirdly and you may have to install them more than once, but they DO work
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09:40<azeem>it took us half an hour to convince hypnotic to not use them
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09:40<hever>I'm looking for a TODO application that can synchronise with a "TODO" Server and sharing todo lists, any idea ?
09:40<ranix>azeem: why would you want to do that
09:40<azeem>ranix: are you going to support hypnotic if he got problems?
09:40<hever>It must be also usable offline...
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09:41<Delph>azeem: that's nvidia's job, no :)
09:41<azeem>Delph: not if people in here recommend it
09:41<ranix>azeem: the nvidia one liner doesn't work anymore, nvidia-kernel is orphaned
09:41<azeem>ranix: what
09:41<Delph>azeem: i reccomend red hat for enterprise deployments of maya :)
09:41<Delph>'s not this channels' job
09:41<Delph>and i shouldn't be here
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09:42<azeem>it just worked for hypnotic
09:42<dpkg>i guess nvidia_post_etch is update-pciids && apt-get install module-assistant nvidia-kernel-source && m-a prepare && m-a a-i nvidia && apt-get install nvidia-glx && depmod -a && modprobe nvidia && dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
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09:42<ranix>nvidia-glx doesn't exist in lenny+
09:42<ranix>I thought it also didn't in etch but I was confused
09:42<azeem>ranix: thanks, captain obvious
09:43<azeem>that's why we're currently discussing instructions on how to install it on lenny nevertheless
09:43<ranix>azeem: so it's better to install a volatile package or a backport than it is to use manufacturer provited drivers?
09:43<azeem>yes, if those drivers break with the next upgrade
09:43<azeem>or the next kernel upgrade
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09:44<hypnotic>yes but you can update the kernel module with one cmd
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09:44<Venlift>i wanna get the f4l
09:44<Venlift>somebody here knoe where can i find it?
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09:45<hypnotic>sh -K
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09:48<hypnotic>thanx for the support, it was little frustrating but it seems too work now
09:49-!-Venlift [] has quit [Quit: Saindo]
09:49<tim_flatus>suiside: Thanks. VLC has a plugin? Good. The files are .wmv, .mov, .flv or .rm. Flash and real use the embedded plug-ins directly, Windows & qt media using mozplugger currently. I'm probably going to try uninstalling Mozplugger next.
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09:55<Gekz>--- ping statistics ---
09:55<Gekz>816 packets transmitted, 8 received, 99% packet loss, time 825281ms
09:55<Gekz>rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 3643.776/3645.045/3645.861/2.437 ms, pipe 4
09:55<Gekz>thats the australian debian mirror
09:55<themill>Gekz: the .au primary mirror is problematic on a regular basis
09:56<Gekz>themill: lovely.
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09:56<Gekz>oh dear
09:56<Gekz>it stalled with the us mirror
09:57<Gekz>wtf is wrong here
09:57<themill>Gekz: I also use: deb etch main contrib non-free
09:57<themill>Gekz: as well as the australian mirror. Both are flaky so on any day, at least one of them normally works.
09:57<Gekz>I think i'll reboot my router
09:57-!-ccube [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:57<themill>Gekz: But it sounds like you have some local problems.
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10:02<Gekz>well at least I got apt-get update to compelte now
10:02<Gekz>its still screwing up
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10:02<Gekz>I've really had enough of bigpond
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10:05<Gekz>oh wtf
10:05<Gekz> is DOSing me
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10:06<blue>Gekz: its
10:07<Gekz>its scanning too much to be natural
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10:10<jaakko>If I compile kernel with "make-kgpk kernel_image" without "--initrd", what is going to happen modules (items I selected to be modules in make xconfig)? Are they excluded or included in kernel image?
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10:11<madgorilla>Gekz, use tor and smile as "they" scan someone else's box to oblivion
10:11-!-Blacker47 [] has joined #debian
10:11<Gekz>its werid
10:11<Gekz>its scanning random ports
10:11<Gekz>5 a second
10:11<madgorilla>Gekz, replacing they with whomever
10:11<Gekz>i'm not paranoid lol
10:12<madgorilla>Gekz, they're not out to get you!
10:12<Gekz>but my router cant take it
10:12<Gekz>its spamming bad packets
10:13<madgorilla>Gekz, so use and put your feet up on your router instead of your worries :)
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10:14<Gekz>signal for my wifi is -58
10:14<Gekz>noise is -88
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10:15<Gekz>bad or good?
10:15<jaakko>Gekz: Goooood
10:16<Gekz>jaakko: really?
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10:17<jaakko>Gekz: My signal level is -161 dBm, and works fine.
10:18<jaakko>Gekz: where do you see that noise?
10:18-!-surgeon [~surgeon@binford.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #debian
10:18<Gekz>I use wavemon
10:20<Gekz>I see why I'm getting so many bad packets
10:20<Gekz>there is massive interference every few seconds
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10:22<Emilien>Hi, got a question using dpkg-buildpackage : I need to use a version such as 1.2.9-1sarge and everything worked but it has used the 1.2.9-1 version which makes my depencies broken :(
10:23<opera>how come, that i on the seperate etch machines, with identical sources.list-files and both recently updated, one of them is not finding the checkinstall package?
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10:23<opera>this is truly beyond me :P
10:24<madgorilla>Gekz, what is causing it?
10:24<Gekz>madgorilla: I lied to get your attention
10:24<jaakko>opera: it is not in etch
10:24<Emilien>Problem of caching ?
10:24<Emilien>Proxy ? DNS resolution ?
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10:26<madgorilla>Gekz, are you high?
10:26<jaakko>opera: sometimes you have to run "upgrade" to find some package.
10:27<Gekz>madgorilla: on hate
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10:27<madgorilla>Gekz, high on hate?
10:28<christ>excuse me, which repo sould i add to install the last version on Firefox?
10:28<madgorilla>is that even possible?
10:28<azeem>christ: what's the last version in your book?
10:28<Emilien>Then anyone is building packages ???
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10:29<opera>jaakko: but my server at home is also using etch-repos, but still i can apt-cache search it...
10:29<Emilien>Got a simple problem of versionning :(
10:29<azeem>christ: apt-get install iceweasel
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10:29<christ>it says that need some libraries and they are not going to be installed azeem
10:30<azeem>christ: which version of Debian?
10:30<jaakko>opera: etch-backports? Ok, if they are identical.. Download the package manually, dpkg -i check-install.deb.
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10:30<jaakko>opera: proxy caching too much?
10:30<azeem>christ: put the output of "apt-cache policy iceweasel" and "apt-get install iceweasel" on a pastebin
10:30<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
10:30<opera>it did have alot of things to upgrade thugh, maby it will magically disappear from there later on
10:30<opera>jaakko: i dont have a backports repo on there
10:30<themill>opera: did you once have checkinstall from sarge? look at apt-cache policy checkinstall for both of them
10:31<opera>themill: it is possible
10:31<jaakko>opera: so what do you have? checkinstall is not in etch main.
10:32<opera>themill: how do i find out if it is something that lingers on from sarge?
10:32<opera>jaakko: what themill suggested might be whats going on, that it got installde while it still was a sarge-box
10:32<christ>azeem: policy --->
10:32<themill>opera: apt-cache policy <packagename> will tell you where apt thinks you might have got it from. Look at the changelog and the dates in it and when etch was released.
10:33<jaakko>opera: so add the etch back-ports to your sources and get it..
10:34<christ>azeem: Install --->
10:34-!-Torsten_W [] has quit []
10:34<jaakko>opera: I can't understand that such package is removed from etch. How do you install and remove compiled apps without it?
10:34<azeem>christ: now pastebin the output of "LANG=C apt-get install libmyspell3c2"
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10:36<opera>themill: where do i find the changelogs? cant seem to find any datestamps in the statusfile that the policy-check mentions
10:36<christ>azeem: need to install, wait a min
10:36<themill>opera: /usr/share/doc/checkinstall/
10:36<opera>jaakko: beats me :)... at the moment im just trying to understand why it still shows upp in my old server, since there is only etch-repos now
10:37<themill>jaakko: iirc it was buggy because of a bug in libc. Now libc wasn't going to be removed, so checkinstall had to go.
10:37<azeem>christ: I'm gone now, bbl
10:38<christ>thx man
10:38<christ>maybe it works :)
10:39<opera>themill: seems as there is 2006-ish comments in there, don't know if they are relevant though...
10:39-!-Torsten_W [] has joined #debian
10:40<opera>but lets say it shows up beacuse of the sarge roots... why is it still showing? since i though a
10:40<opera>*apt-cache search just looks at what i got from the latest update
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10:42*lupine_85 gets the nails out
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10:46<opera>oh well, thanks for helping out; themill and jaakko
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10:55<evilmanu>I have a problem with tv-out
10:56<evilmanu>I've connected my laptop on pc with s-video, but on the TV I have a B&W image
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10:56<evilmanu>on TV
10:57<evilmanu>I've connected my laptop on tv
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10:57<franklin>evilmanu, Sometime there are tools to configure the video card. which one is yours ?
10:57<evilmanu>I have GeForce GO 7300
10:57<evilmanu>I'm using nvidia-settings
10:58<evilmanu>I've tried to find if can I choose PAL or NTSC, but I don't find it
10:59<franklin>(that was my next question ;)
11:00<franklin>evilmanu, did you try this :
11:00<franklin>`` Option "TVOutFormat" "COMPOSITE" ``
11:00<evilmanu>n, I'll try
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11:03<franklin>evilmanu, Do you use free or non-free driver ?
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11:03<evilmanu>I've downloaded from nvidia site
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11:04<evilmanu>I think they're non-free
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11:04<franklin>evilmanu, you get them from nvidia (?)
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11:05<franklin>evilmanu, bingo...
11:05-!-Snuffpigs [] has joined #debian
11:05<franklin>evilmanu, something like Option "TVStandard" "PAL-G"
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11:08<evilmanu>I have nothing about that
11:09<evilmanu>I have: Option "TwinView" "1"
11:09<evilmanu> Option "metamodes" "TV: nvidia-auto-select +0+0, DFP: nvidia-auto-select +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 1024x768 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 800x600 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 800x512 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 720x450 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 640x512 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 640x480 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 640x480_60 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 640x400 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 640x384 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 512x384 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 400x300 +0+0; TV: NULL, DFP: 320x240 +0+
11:09-!-devil is now known as devil_
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11:11<evilmanu>Can I add this options?
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11:11<franklin>evilmanu, you would have to add this line in /etc/X11/xorg.conf, under another option line.
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11:13<franklin>evilmanu, of course, you have to edit this file as root ;)
11:13<evilmanu>yes, I know
11:14<evilmanu>ok, now I have to restart X
11:14<franklin>evilmanu, not necessairly
11:14<franklin>evilmanu, do you use gnome ?
11:14<evilmanu>no, fluxbox
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11:15<evilmanu>I've clicked an restart
11:15<franklin>evilmanu, you could have done like if you want to switch user..
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11:16<evilmanu_>it works >D
11:16-!-Snuffpigs [] has joined #debian
11:16<evilmanu_>thank you very much
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11:17<Snuffpigs>does anyone know when xorg 7.3 will debut in testing?
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11:18<jkl>I update-upgrade yestarday.. and I change a user from /etc/passwd and now I just restart my pc and Im getting this.
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11:20<jkl>Could not get password database information from UID of current process: ??? ...
11:21<azeem>jkl: how did you change a user from /etc/passwd?
11:21<Snuffpigs>why not just a tool like kuser?
11:22<jkl>azeem, yes.. and now I can't load gdm.. sure enough a made something wrong..
11:22<azeem>jkl: don't edit passwd directly
11:22<azeem>what exactly did you change?
11:22<Snuffpigs>jkl: passwords are in /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
11:22<Snuffpigs>so you need to use a tool to change this
11:24<jkl>Snuffpigs, azeem.. clear.. well now Im trying to identify what is the problem..
11:24<azeem>jkl: 17:20 < azeem> what exactly did you change?
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11:24<azeem>jkl: please try to answer questions
11:24<jkl>azeem, I create a group for tomcat
11:24<azeem>how did you install tomcat?
11:25<jkl>azeem debian way...
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11:25<jkl>It creates a user... but not group
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11:25<azeem>jkl: why do you think you need a group?
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11:26<franklin>jkl, Can you compare with a backup in /var/backups/passwd.bak... and check what's missing
11:26<azeem>jkl: did you edit /etc/shadow as well?
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11:28<jkl>azeem, for groups yes, :s but later on I change something else just in groups.
11:28<azeem>17:23 < azeem> jkl: why do you think you need a group?
11:28<jkl>I was trying to run tomcat as another user.. (non-root).
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11:31<jkl>azeem I think I have thing enough to check.. thanks for helping franklin, Snuffpigs.. Im check
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11:47<kmikz>hey channel for debian fr ??
11:47<ala2>algien español por aqui
11:47<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr sur French users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr on
11:47<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
11:47<azeem>kmikz: read what dpkg said
11:47<azeem>ala2: read what dpkg said
11:47<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
11:48<azeem>ala2: please write in english or leave
11:48<kmikz>thx :)
11:49<ala2>el ingles es una mierda
11:49-!-mode/#debian [+o azeem] by ChanServ
11:49-!-ala2 was kicked from #debian by azeem [please go to #debian-es]
11:49-!-mode/#debian [-o azeem] by azeem
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11:50<kmikz>nobody respond to me on debian-fr :(
11:51<kmikz>when i type su root i have that: bash: enable: bash: not a shell builtin
11:51<kmikz>bash: enable: completion: not a shell builtin
11:51<kmikz>bash: enable: in: not a shell builtin
11:51<kmikz>bash: enable: interactive: not a shell builtin
11:51<kmikz>bash: enable: shells: not a shell builtin
11:51-!-kmikz was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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11:51<kmikz>why i have that ?
11:51<azeem>maybe su is aliased to something else
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11:52<kmikz>ok thx
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12:14<e-yes>hello? what I do apt-get to make man for fprintf available?
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12:16<fxiny>buffer buffer
12:16<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
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12:17<fxiny>btw . new buggy flash from atrope today
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12:21<Daniel_DK>Hi guys! could you help me compile the shipped adp94xx module from adaptec?
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12:22<noflash>overflow, if you have a debian related question...just ask
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12:22<Daniel_DK>i get an no dotconfig file foun - error -
12:23<e-yes>alephnull, thank you
12:23<Daniel_DK>also my .config file is located in /usr/src/linux so adaptecs compile script is fubar
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12:26<Daniel_DK>i've been looking through their script and it looks like the haven't accounted for uname -i could return "unknown"
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12:32<jclinton>Daniel_DK: you have linux-headers installed?
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12:34<Daniel_DK>jclinton, thanks for responding, Im currently running a custom kernel
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12:34<jclinton>Daniel_DK: which card are you compiling this module for?
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12:35<Daniel_DK>jclinton, the Adaptec Serial Attached SCSI 58300
12:36<jclinton>Daniel_DK: can you give me the output of lspci? i'm interested in its PCI ID numbers
12:36<_haxi_>If a click on a link who make a Pop-up with JS, my iceweasel is segfaultin'... wth?!
12:36<jclinton>just the line for the adaptor, please, Daniel_DK
12:36<jclinton>_haxi_: do you have extensions installed?
12:37<_haxi_>mh, yes
12:37<Daniel_DK>jclinton shure :) 6:03.0 Serial Attached SCSI controller: Adaptec ASC-58300 SAS (Razor-External HBA non-RAID) (rev 09)
12:37<jclinton>_haxi_: try turning all of them off; it's almost certain an extension
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12:37<_haxi_>mh, if I run iceweasel in --safe-mode, no crash, It could be that huh.
12:37<jclinton>Daniel_DK: lspci -n
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12:38<Daniel_DK>jclinton, 06:03.0 0107: 9005:0416 (rev 09)
12:38<jclinton>Daniel_DK: ok, hold while i look this up
12:39<Daniel_DK>jclinton, fyi i'm limited to kernel ver. < 2.6.19-7
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12:39<bill_>I do not remerber the name of the debian etch install CD with 2.6.22 kernel (debian etch half) any URL ? thx. I try to install an etch but 2.6.18 do not see hardware :-(
12:39<fxiny>_haxi_: safe mode disable extensions
12:40<_haxi_>yep that's why
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12:40<jclinton>Daniel_DK: the reason i asked is that we have had terrible luck with the official adaptec drivers... the in-kernel drivers have always been better
12:40<jclinton>Daniel_DK: i see here that the aic94xx driver does support your card
12:40<jclinton>Daniel_DK: i don't know what kernel revision added support, though
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12:41<bill_>franklin: this is a lenny. I prefere keep etch it is for a server
12:41<Daniel_DK>jclinton, yes, 2.6.24 does indeed find both my card and it's disks
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12:42<_haxi_>it's "hyperBK" extension who fucked anythin' up ;]
12:43<Daniel_DK>jclinton, adaptec has 2 different drivers on ther web site: the aic94xx opensource driver wich i have sucessfully built and the adp94xx semi closed source wich is giving me greif
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12:43<franklin>bill_, iirc, you have to use DI/lenny with "install suite=etch"
12:43<jclinton>bill_: etchnhalf just got 2.6.24 yesterday
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12:44<bill_>ok I will test it. I downloqd then try. thx
12:44<jclinton>Daniel_DK: use to paste the build error
12:45<themill>jclinton: it did? excellent. Any news on etchnhalf (and a 2.6.24 kernel for etch)?
12:45<jclinton>themill: it's in proposed-updates
12:46<themill>:) sounds like a project for me for this weekend then
12:46<Daniel_DK>jclinton, adaptec has included a "build" script wich returns the error: "no dotconfig file found, build terminated"
12:46<jclinton>Daniel_DK: try running bash -x
12:46<bill_>do you know where to found xen patch for 2.6.22 or up?
12:46-!-noflash [noflash@2001:5c0:8fff:ffff:8000:0:cda7:61ee] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:46<jclinton>xen is crap
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12:47<jclinton>Daniel_DK: the output will contain the results of hte script's evaluations; the trouble should stand out
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12:49<Daniel_DK>jclinton, dammn id'say
12:49<bill_>xen is very useful in server.
12:49<Daniel_DK>- Setting putty to 4000 line history
12:50<jclinton>bill_: in principal, yes; unfortunately their patches are too intrusive to ever be merged mainline and they introduce too many bugs
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12:50<jclinton>Daniel_DK: the problem should show up at the very end of the output
12:51<jclinton>Daniel_DK: something like KERNEL_SRC_DIR=/completely/wrong/path
12:51<Daniel_DK>jclinton, heres the output:
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12:54<Daniel_DK>jclinton, i see the script copying the adp94xx into the kernel, and editing some makefiles, the thing has actually popped up in .config
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12:55<Daniel_DK>jclinton, maybe i shoud just try an make the modules the debian way
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12:58<jclinton>Daniel_DK: so it's looking for some stupid configs file
12:58<jclinton>i have no idea what that is or why it thinks it should have one
12:59<Daniel_DK>jclinton, yeah i think it wants to crosscompile the kernel with it's own shipped modules
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12:59<jclinton>Daniel_DK: which is fine but the configs file is not standard
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13:00<jclinton>Daniel_DK: i even just checked a RHEL system; also not there
13:00<jclinton>Daniel_DK: their build script is apparently written by an intern
13:00<Daniel_DK>jclinton, oh i was just about to that :-D
13:01<jclinton>Daniel_DK: so, the solution is to upgrade your kernel to .24
13:01<Daniel_DK>jclinton, yeah - believe me i would like to nut IBM - and the lin_tape driver disagrees
13:02<jclinton>what tape drive?
13:03<Daniel_DK>jclinton, im using an IBM 3573 autoloader
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13:04<Daniel_DK>jclinton, lsscsi: [0:0:5:0] tape IBM ULT3580-TD4 and [0:0:5:1] mediumx IBM 3573-TL
13:04<jclinton>lspci -n?
13:05<jclinton>Daniel_DK: ?
13:05<jclinton>oh it's scsi attached?
13:05<jclinton>why do you need a special driver?
13:05<jclinton>st doesn't work?
13:05<Daniel_DK>Jclinton - its our TSM server
13:06<jclinton>but what does the driver do?
13:06<Daniel_DK>TSM aparantly needs it to control the library correctly
13:06<jclinton>we've had good luck with even the most proprietary scsi tape changers
13:06<jclinton>we use mtx + bacula for library and changer management
13:07<jclinton>regular st driver
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13:07<jclinton>works pretty well
13:07<Daniel_DK>i've trid to point it to the generic sg files and the sch files
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13:08<Daniel_DK>TSM just spits out a error 6 - (no such device)
13:08<jclinton>i don't know what TSM is
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13:08<jclinton>oh, more proprietary IBM crap
13:08<Daniel_DK>jclinton, TSM is IBM Tivoli Storage Management
13:08<jclinton>can mtx read /dev/sg2?
13:09<jclinton>you can poke it w/o changing anything
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13:09<peyman>hi everyone, what was the name of the package to install windows fonts?
13:10-!-ppikula [] has joined #debian
13:10<peyman>amphi: thanks :-)
13:10<jpkeels>hello all.. any idea why XCDRoast is stuck at "starting to scan for devices...." on a sony CDR that works pefectly with windoze
13:10<Daniel_DK>jclinton, i havent tried it with MTX ( wouldn't know how :) i can use /dev/st1 just fine though
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13:13<jclinton>Daniel_DK: mtx -f /dev/sg2 inventory
13:13<Daniel_DK>Jclinton, i have my 58300 controller working in kernel 2.6.13 AND i can compile and load lin_tape, however i rely on udev to create the device files - wich does not work in 2.6.13
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13:13<Daniel_DK>if i could just create them device files i would be golden
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13:15<svend>If I have multiple default routes, does the metric set the prefered route?
13:15-!-dancho [] has joined #debian
13:15-!-genaro [genaro@] has joined #debian
13:15<svend>I have both wired and wireless network connections up, and I want to use the wired.
13:16<genaro>would somebody help me?
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13:17<genaro>i'm having some weird problems with the sound on lenny
13:17<Daniel_DK>jclinton, AHA! i rebuilt my kernel with the modifications done by the script and now i have a adp94xx.ko - time to reboot
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13:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 356] by debhelper
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13:25<dancho>bylgari ima li tuka be
13:25<cetko>skoro, ima balkanaca
13:25<dancho>a taka
13:25<dancho>q da pitam sq az kat po pros
13:25<Daniel_DK>how do i change in which order my modules ar loaded - my servers boot disk has been renamed to /dev/sdR1 ACK
13:26*fxiny wow signal array detector beeps
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13:27<dancho>she mi otgovori li nqkoi ako pitam neshto
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13:29<cetko>dancho, nekužim bugarski iz Hrvatske sam
13:29<cetko>dancho, I'm from Croatia
13:29-!-blackinside [] has joined #debian
13:29-!-emonge [~emonge@] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
13:29<cetko>I don't do bulgarian
13:29-!-svend [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:30<cetko>speak english
13:30<dancho>a little
13:30<cetko>Ok, repeat the question in English, German, Serbian, Bosnian or Croatian :)
13:30-!-das_maze [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:31<dancho>i want to download any clip(song) but in audiofail
13:31-!-emonge [~emonge@] has joined #debian
13:31<dancho>any program about this?
13:31-!-das_maze [] has quit []
13:31<dancho>for linux?
13:31<fxiny>reboot can do that :P
13:33<dancho>pls tell me
13:33<cetko>sorry, no idea
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13:34<cetko>what audiofail is, that is :P
13:34-!-knoppix_ [~knoppix@] has joined #debian
13:34<dancho>i know that program but it`s for windows
13:34-!-knoppix_ [~knoppix@] has quit []
13:34<dancho>i need for linux
13:34<dancho>i`m sorry bad english
13:35-!-brei [] has joined #debian
13:36<dancho>ok bye
13:36<GhostlyDeath>dancho: There's Goodbye Windows
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13:37<Daniel_DK>dancho, whit is the program for windows called?
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13:43<cetko>ok, have a question, how do i set user quota when creating user??
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13:45<benabik>So... Anyone have an idea when libqt4-core will be fixed on sid i386?
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13:52<lindenle>Where is the best place to ask a how to debug a kernel panic?
13:53<E0x>lindenle: #kernelnewbies
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13:55<s_i_m>cetko, with edquota/setquota perhaps?
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13:56<lindenle>/j #kernelnewbies
13:57<jclinton>benabik: supposedly already uploaded
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13:57<jclinton>benabik: not that there's anything that actually uses it...
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13:58<cetko>sim, yeah but automatically on user creation
13:58<cetko>not after
13:59<benabik>jclinton: All the dependencies for libqt4-core aren't available for i386.
14:00<s_i_m>cetko, i dunno
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14:05<benabik>jclinton: says it's not available for i386. Does it take time to propagate?
14:06<azeem>the autobuilders need to build it first, then it needs to get uplodaded, then it needs to get mirrored
14:06<azeem>might take a another day or two
14:06<benabik>azeem: Thanks.
14:06<azeem>benabik: don't use unstable if you're annoyed by this
14:07-!-Tharos [~Tharos@] has quit [Quit: Me fui!]
14:07<azeem>benabik: actually, it's already uploaded, so should be available tomorrow or tonight
14:07<benabik>azeem: This is my first system running unstable. Didn't realize packages could hit before their dependencies.
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14:08<azeem>benabik: what package are you talking about?
14:08<benabik>azeem: libqt4-core-4.4.0~rc1 is in unstable, but libqt4-dbus and friends are not.
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14:09<radek>hi all
14:09<benabik>And I pulled this system to unstable and experimental to try KDE4
14:09-!-radek is now known as Guest1300
14:09<azeem>benabik: you've likely got libqt4-core-4.4.0~rc1 from experimental then
14:09<azeem>because they go in together
14:10-!-Guest1300 is now known as radeka
14:10<benabik>azeem: I have 4.4.0~beta1 from somewhere online to get it to work, but I have ~rc2 listed from (I thought) unstable listed in aptitude.
14:11<azeem>benabik: run "apt-cache policy libqt4-core" to check
14:11<radeka>Iam solving problem with logrotate. I need to rotate logs to other physical device, but 'logrotate' in official repositories cant do it.
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14:11<benabik>azeem: 4.4.0~rc1-2 - 500 sid/main Packages
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14:12<azeem>benabik: then maybe the us mirrors are out of sync again
14:12<ma3x>Gtk-WARNING **: Unable to locate loadable module in module_path: "",
14:12<ma3x>i get that error
14:12<ma3x>whats wrong
14:12<azeem>ma3x: it's a WARNING
14:12<benabik>azeem: Alright, I've hit that with git mirrors before, so I'll just sit tight for a day before finishing my updates.
14:12<ma3x>i know its a warning
14:12<ma3x>but why is it displaying it
14:12<azeem>ma3x: then why do you claim it's an error?
14:12<radeka>Maybe project 'rot[t]log' is what iam looking for, but it isnt in repositories and that it isnt 'debian way', I gues.
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14:14<radeka>I know, that rotating logs to other physical devices can brings many problems, but I thing, that it is common request...
14:14<ma3x>azeem, we're not here to study rhetorics but to solve problems,help eachother
14:16<azeem>ma3x: you shouldn't report warnings
14:16<azeem>if everybody reported all their GTK warnings in ~/.xsession-errors, we'd get nothing done here
14:16<ma3x>azeem i think it's because of that error, that iceweasel menus are to big
14:16<radeka>Some solution may be save logs and rotate them with some own script, but I cant believe, that this problem isnt solved many times
14:17<ma3x>i want to reduce the font of the menus
14:18<azeem>ma3x: it's a warnind
14:18<ma3x>you mean it's normal ... ?
14:18<ma3x>ok one more thing
14:18<ma3x>why is the font in firefox (iceweasel) looking like shit?
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14:18<azeem>which desktop environment?
14:18<azeem>might look better in GNOME, dunno
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14:19<Daniel_DK>q pr
14:19<ma3x>all fonts are sans serif, only fixed width is monospace
14:19<azeem>ma3x: did you install the kde-desktop task?
14:20<ma3x>what's that?
14:20-!-lontra [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:20<azeem>run tasksel as root
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14:21<ma3x>you can choose what to install : default selected is web server
14:21-!-ricky [] has joined #debian
14:21<ma3x>what should i select/install from there?
14:21<chealer>ma3x: it's unlikely that anyone can help unless you're more precise than "looking like shit"
14:22<ma3x>chealer, go browse internet pages from windows, you'll see the difference
14:22<ma3x>it has much smoother fonts
14:22-!-ricky is now known as Guest1301
14:22<chealer>ma3x: the only problem is that I'm not on your machine
14:22<ma3x>firefox fonts (or kde, I dunno) look like typewriter machine
14:23<ma3x>and there is no balance - if you select the minimal font size, then it's better but some pages need smaller fonts
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14:24<ma3x>heh I just launched ppracer
14:24<ma3x>not good graphics, mouse lags
14:24<ma3x>and glxinfo's running fine
14:24<ma3x>glxgears too
14:25<amphi>ma3x: what card?
14:25<ma3x>intel gma x3100
14:25<ma3x>i use 'intel' driver in xorg.conf
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14:25<amphi>XAA or EXA ?
14:25<ma3x>what's that?
14:25-!-geenna [] has joined #debian
14:26<amphi>then you're using XAA ;)
14:26-!-knoppix_ is now known as Guest1302
14:26<amphi>EXA is the new accel method, but it's a bit slow on current X/DRI
14:26-!-Guest1302 is now known as springer
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14:27<amphi>I'm using EXA here, it works ok with compiz, and doesn't have the composited xv problems on that card/driver that XAA has
14:27-!-mihkel [] has joined #debian
14:27<ma3x>how do you get to use exa?
14:27<ma3x>you install deb or what?
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14:27<amphi>no; monkey about with xorg.conf
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14:28<amphi>ma3x: it's quite experimental ATM I believe
14:28<benabik>ma3x: Try installing msttcorefonts, then changing iceweasel's default fonts to match your Windows machine.
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14:28<ma3x>msttcorefonts are already installed
14:28<benabik>ma3x: By default (ASAICT), it uses Times instead of Times New Roman, which is a noticable difference.
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14:30<ma3x>do you allow pages to use their fonts?
14:30<ma3x>you see - i set the minimal font size to 9
14:30<ma3x>and then everything's fine
14:30<ma3x>but when I go to some sites, it's just unreadable hence font is too small
14:30<ma3x>and if i set it to 10-12 (minimum) then some sites display it huge
14:31<benabik>ma3x: I do. But most pages just specify serif, sans-serif, etc. Which default to the not quite as nice looking fonts Serif and Sans-Serif instead of Times New Roman and Arial.
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14:34<Daniel_DK>Guys, is it possible to create an .htaccess file that does not apply to sub-directories - i need to list files only in my sub directories but not my root directory..
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14:37<tsp>What is debian's equivalent of rc.local?
14:37<avu>rc.local 8)
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14:37<avu>(lives in /etc)
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14:38<tsp>damn, totally made a fool of myself there
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14:41<benabik>tsp: Happens to the best of us.
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15:05<psams>hi all, how is it nowadays with smp+preemtible kernel? still performance issues with?
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15:06<valdyn>psams: like what?
15:08<mjk>Is there any way to reset a serial port? No hints in setserial/stty manpage. :-/
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15:10<kingsley>Does anyone here happen to know whether an EXT3 filesystem can be recovered if its journal is on a second drive, and that second drive crashes?
15:10<azeem>kingsley: what
15:10<valdyn>kingsley: there is nothing to recover
15:10<valdyn>kingsley: you can use the remaining ext2 fs as is
15:10<azeem>kingsley: if you don't understand answers, say that, there's no need to go to another chan and ask the same question all over again
15:11<psams>valdyn: in high cpu load situations, performance with realtime jackd for example, was very poor, lots of xruns
15:11<valdyn>psams: you mean that latency was poor
15:11<valdyn>psams: because that is what jackd needs
15:11<valdyn>psams: and this is probably primarily a driver issue, no idea
15:12<valdyn>psams: or the result of using a filesystem or driver with high latency
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15:13<psams>valdyn: with single core kernel i had np with 'bout 5ms latencies, samesystem with smp enabled kernel audio dropouts starts to happen
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15:14<valdyn>psams: alright, no idea about that specific issue
15:15<psams>ty anyways, guess i just had to test it for goor.
15:15<valdyn>**** alsa_pcm: xrun of at least 1207846406455.296 msecs
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15:16<valdyn>im not playing anything, nor do i have significant load, just smp idling
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15:16<psams>so, there might be some issues with that ;)
15:16<valdyn>the value is broken
15:17<valdyn>so jackd is, probably
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15:18<psams>there is smp jackd server(jackmp), i just coulnd get it to work yet
15:18<valdyn>im not getting extremely high latencies using "interbench" anyway
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15:18<kingsley>valdyn: Is my assumption correct that the journal-less filesystem should be readable, but converting it back to EXT3 would be harder? I've read that when EXT3 journals reside on separate drives, the journal must be created first. If that's true, it seems to me that the data would have to be copied to a new EXT3 filesystem that refers to the new journal. Do you agree?
15:19<valdyn>kingsley: no
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15:19<zarchne>What do the different state numbers in aptitude/pkgstates mean?
15:19<valdyn>kingsley: an ext3 filesystem without a journal is just a normal ext2 filesystem, which can be converted to ext3 easily
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15:20<kingsley>valdyn: How would you convert an EXT2 filesystem to EXT3, with its (new) journal on a (new) second drive?
15:20<valdyn>kingsley: no idea.
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15:21<zarchne>kingsley: tune2fs -j
15:21<BGLamEr>ima li Bulgari :>?
15:22<valdyn>kingsley: and -J ( big J )
15:22<valdyn>but what do i read manpages for you, read yourself )
15:22<zarchne>Yeah, -J device=
15:23<kingsley>zarchne & valdyn: Schwheat! Thanks!
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15:25<BGLamEr>how to install Driver for 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation NV5M64 [RIVA TNT2 Model 64/Model 64 Pro] (rev 15)
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15:26<BGLamEr>how to install Driver for 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation NV5M64 [RIVA TNT2 Model 64/Model 64 Pro] (rev 15)
15:27<chealer>BGLamEr: which Debian suite do you use?
15:29<BGLamEr>Debian 4.0
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15:29<chealer>BGLamEr: and X11 doesn't start?
15:30<BGLamEr>how to install OpenGL support for compiz fusion and beryl
15:30<bartv>is it possible to make a .deb from installed files?
15:31<chealer>BGLamEr: you'd need to use the nvidia driver.
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15:33<BGLamEr>i dont know
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15:36<BGLamEr>chealer, ?
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15:37<chealer>BGLamEr: the way to install the nvidia driver is documented on
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15:38<BGLamEr>chealer, tnx ;)
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15:39<BGLamEr>ep 'nv\|vesa'
15:39<BGLamEr>/etc/X11/xorg.conf: Driver "nv"
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15:58<bartv>for those interested, i was looking for dpkg-repack
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16:06<frido>hi, has anybody working with NUT on slave machine reboot if power is back and master stay alive, but slave is in shutdown sequence ?
16:07<frido>base on POWER_OFF variable in /etc/default/nut
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16:12<lui_G>ich habn problem mit debian netinstaller
16:12<lui_G>wenn ich die cd boote dann zerfetzt mein laptop die setup also optisch
16:13<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
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16:14<lui_G>oh sorry
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16:46<ditoa>I have just installed Debian from a netinst iso in VMware workstation
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16:47<ditoa>Is there a guide to what packages I need to install in order to get a working desktop such as gnome or kde?
16:48<ditoa>I want to fine tune my install rather than just pick "desktop environment" during installation
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16:49<chealer>!tell ditoa about install gnome
16:49<chealer>!tell ditoa about install kde
16:49<ditoa>:) thank you chealer
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16:50<CptObvious>I installed Debian last night and it was working perfectly. I try to log in now but I get the normal login screen, when i enter my username and password all i get is a solid grey screen and it doesnt continue from then. Can anyone tell me why please and/or a fix?
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16:51<ditoa>What is the difference between apt-get and aptitude?
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16:55<Supaplex>!tell ditoa -about why aptitude
16:56<ditoa>it seems dpkg is the debian oracle!
16:56<Supaplex>CptObvious: does it login as root?
16:56<chealer>ditoa: apt-get is the first APT front-end written, and it never intended to be used in the long-term. aptitude has a TUI in addition to the CLI. aptitude has more features than apt-get, but doesn't make as good use of APT and dpkg as apt-get, so it is somewhat incompatible with other APT front-ends.
16:56<ditoa>many thanks chealer
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16:57<ditoa>how can I find out what 'gnome-core' contains compared to 'gnome-desktop-environment' ?
16:57<CptObvious>login as root? I think so
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16:58<teque>estan hay?
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16:58<Supaplex>!tell CptObvious -about msg
16:58<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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17:00<Mr_Giraffe>is there any way to list the contents of a directory in vim?
17:00<CptObvious>But yes, as i said, i think i log in as root (its the only account on it, and i gave it root privs). It just wont go past the loading screen after username and pass have verified.
17:00<Supaplex>:!ls :P
17:01<Supaplex>CptObvious: which debian release is this, and how did you install it?
17:01<kjb>ditoa: less /var/lib/dpkg/info/gnome-core*.list will tell you what files the package installs
17:01<CptObvious>latest, (i386) from a .iso on a CD from the website
17:01<CptObvious>everything updated too.
17:02<ditoa>thanks kjb. I also found 'aptitude show gnome' to be helpful :)
17:02<ditoa>apt is already rather impressive :)
17:02<ditoa>I have never seen such a tool before
17:03<Supaplex>CptObvious: from a console try, xinit /usr/bin/xterm
17:03<CptObvious>hw do i get into console please?
17:04<hw>yay ?
17:04<hw>haha </joke>.
17:04<Supaplex>use ctrl+alt+backspace to kill off x first :) ctrl+alt+f1 should put you on tty1
17:05<CptObvious>im on the windows hardrive now.
17:05<CptObvious>as i cant log into debian
17:05<dpkg>i heard single is <single user mode> to boot for recovery/rescue. man init, or boot with "single" as a kernel option. Also, init=/bin/bash if init is very brain dead. (filesystems are usually readonly and shell has no job control. unmount and reboot with care)
17:06<CptObvious>Ok, i dont understand that. BRB
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17:06<Supaplex>I guess he could shutdown the display manager.
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17:08<kjb>ditoa: Great, I don;t use aptitude (I'm too old). The *.list files are useful if you want to fine out which package [pprovides a particular file
17:08<novatillodeb>tengo la testing super DESACTUALIZAAAA
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17:09<novatillodeb>i hav a doubt
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17:10<novatillodeb>can i use aptitude to update all my debian testing without update the kernel?
17:10<amphi>updating the kernel to a new kernel version won't remove the old one
17:12<novatillodeb>i know but then i must compile ndiswraper.....and a lot of etc
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17:13<amphi>novatillodeb: only if you boot the new kernel
17:14<amphi>is compiling ndiswrapper particularly difficult?
17:14<novatillodeb>webcam yes
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17:15<amphi>luckily I've never had, or wanted to have, a webcam
17:15<novatillodeb>if i do #aptitude dist-upgrade keep kernel? what about headers
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17:18<_moro_bana_>can anyone help me with wget
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17:18<_moro_bana_> i need to download a cd from there
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17:23<kjb> mono_bana: wgat URL will fownload the file, is there something more you need?
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17:28<Tib>I have a sarge(3.1) system template installed into xenserver3 that I am trying to do a dist-upgrade for to get it to 4.0, but changing the apt/sources.list to current/stable sources and trying a dist-upgrade has it trying to REMOVE vital system packages rather than upgrade. what's goign on?
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17:31<chealer>Tib: like what?
17:31<Tib>One sec.. let me get a paste url for you. what's the main site for that again? it's been a while
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17:32<xxx>any turkish?
17:32<Xvlmd4>cheers all..
17:33<kjb>Tib: this could be to do with upgrading to a 2.6 kernel
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17:33<Xvlmd4>im trying for the last 3 days to install the nvidia driver on my system.. dual core..
17:33<Xvlmd4>but without luck
17:33<Xvlmd4>can anyone guide me?
17:33<chealer>!tell Tib about pastebin
17:34<Tib>I just got to pastebin actually - hehe. here's what I am getting -
17:34<chealer>Xvlmd4: which Debian suite do you use?
17:34<Tib>kjb: I'm already on a 2.6 kernel
17:34<Xvlmd4>the distro?
17:34<Xvlmd4>4.0 etch
17:34<amphi>'already', heh
17:34<xxx>i just set up this irc konversation :S i use ubuntu now :S
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17:34<chealer>Xvlmd4: follows the NvidiaGraphicsDrivers guide
17:35<jclinton>!tell Xvlmd4 about nvidia
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17:35<chealer>Tib: which version of e2fsprogs do you have?
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17:36<Tib>ii e2fsprogs 1.37-2sarge1
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17:37<Tib>how does e2fsprogs relate, chealer?
17:38<novatillodeb> apt-get dist-upgrade --ignore kernel* linuxkernel* is this correct
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17:38<novatillodeb>i wanna update everithing except the kernel with apt-get
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17:39<Tib>you probably want --no-upgrade novatillodeb
17:39<guillaume>hello, how can I activate all filesystem type in gparted ?
17:39<chealer>Tib: hum. I wanted to make sure you were running up-to-date Sarge. what does /etc/debian_version contain?
17:40<kjb>Tib: OK, have you tried using dselect, it gives you a lot more info on what package conflicts are happening
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17:40<chealer>novatillodeb: no, but apt-get dist-upgrade will not "upgrade" any package causing the problems you are worried about
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17:41<novatillodeb>but apt-get dist-upgrade "update the kernel?"
17:42<Tib>chealer: it originally said '3.1' but now it says '4.0' because I tried an 'apt-get -u upgrade' with the current/stable/etch sources and it upgraded some things without doing the whole 'REMOVE EVERYTHING' nonsense.
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17:43<chealer>Tib: did you try aptitude (aptitude dist-upgrade)?
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17:44<chealer>novatillodeb: apt-get dist-upgrade won't do important Linux upgrades. it will never remove an old Linux image ABI
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17:45<Tib>kjb: I tried aptitude, and it does the same thing, but at least mentions why when in the menu - talks about unsatisfied dependencies of a ton of stuff, perl-base not being >= 5.6 for example, but doing dpkg shows that perl-base is already at 5.8
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17:45<guillaume>what's the command under debian to format a drive in fat32 ? mkdosfs doesn't work
17:45<amphi>guillaume: mkfs -t vfat ?
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17:49<kjb>Tib: Not surprised, this is clearly a dependency problem, the perl-base thing is odd...
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17:51<Tib>looking through dselect and I'm seeing a bunch of required in group XXX that are just not there. But rather than install these missing dependencies it seems like it would rather just rip everything out
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17:52<kjb>Tib: I just checked on my machine and perl-base is indeed at 5.8.8
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17:53<kjb>Tib: If it can't find the files depened on then it has no cchoice but to remove the packages, have you checked your sources.list file for errors?
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17:54<chealer>Tib: sorry, you highlighted kjb in your answer and I was focused on something else. do you have broken packages currently?
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17:56<Tib>The system works currently as is, but it's a very minimal install system template that was with xenserver3.2 and seems to have some big glaring holes in it, to say the least.
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17:56<teque>/dev/modem connection setup (serial/USB/IRDA/Bluetooth)
17:56-!-blackibex [] has quit []
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17:57<teque>help me /dev/modem connection setup (serial/USB/IRDA/Bluetooth) << kubuntu
17:58<guillaume>amphi: :mkfs -t vfat /dev/sdd1 fail :mkfs does recognozie vfat : mkfs.vfat : no file or directory of this type
17:58<Tib>this is my current sources.list -
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17:59<guillaume>amphi: my sdd is a 2,5" ATA100 HDD conect on usb bus. I can create partiition on it without problem
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18:01<kjb>ruillaume: you need to install the dosfstools package
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18:01<Tib>chealer: I tried updating e2fsprogs, it wanted e2fslibs, which then wanted libc6 2.3.6-6 - but when trying to install/update that it tells me that the currently installed 2.3.2 is already teh current version, which is bogus.
18:01<guillaume>amphi: can I use dd to copy my old hdd to sdd without fomating it before ?
18:01<amphi>guillaume: install dosfstools
18:01<chealer>Tib: FYI, non-us is discontinued, you can simply remove that from your sources
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18:02<themill>Tib: are you running sarge or etch?
18:02<guillaume>amphi: thank you :)
18:03<amphi>guillaume: you could have used apt-file to search for mkfs.vfat
18:03<Tib>it really looks like this is a problem with it thinking libc6-2.3.2 is the most current when I need to get to at least 2.3.6
18:03<Tib>themill: started with sarge, trying to get to etch
18:04<themill>Tib: ahh. That *should* be easy enough... :(
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18:04<themill>Tib: was it an up-to-date sarge box before you started?
18:04<guillaume>amphi : I have it but I 'm not familiar with it yet :)
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18:05<amphi>guillaume: apt-file update && apt-file search mkfs.vfat
18:05<Tib>it was a bare/minimal OS template install under a xenserver3.2 host
18:05<chealer>Tib: what I meant is does # apt-get check; report something bad?
18:05<chealer>Tib: what do you mean by OS template?
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18:05<Tib>Nope, nothing bad reported by apt-get check
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18:06<chealer>Tib: what does $ apt-cache policy libc6; output?
18:07<Tib>chealer: go to for apt-cache output
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18:09<themill>Tib: can you pastebin the output of "apt-cache policy" too?
18:09<Tib>output at
18:09-!-emonge [~emonge@] has quit [Quit: That's all for now, folks]
18:09<chealer>Tib: WTH is libc6 2.3.2.ds1-22sarge4.xs3.2.0.58?
18:10<themill>and what's with the pinning?
18:10<Tib>that's what was in the OS template for xenserver3.2 apparently
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18:11<Tib>this wasn't a fresh-install of sarge, it was some pre-built thing that was on the platform to use as a debian OS. I figured I'd install it and upgrade, but the upgrade part is giving me headaches. I'm not familiar with apt-cache so not sure what the pinnings are
18:12-!-mode/#debian [+l 344] by debhelper
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18:12<themill>Tib: perhaps pastebin /etc/apt/preferences -- that's where the pins are defined.
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18:12<dpkg>If you are running stable, don't pin; use a backport. Ask me about <backports> or <simple sid backport>. If you're using testing, man apt_preferences or see
18:12<kjb>Tib: Oh you have some pinned files, these are user defined as not to be upgraded, i.e. they override the apt-get behaviour
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18:14<Tib>MUUUUCH better.. whacking the preferences file has it trying to upgrade/install a whole buch of stuff now. finally
18:15<Tib>Thank you everybody, I'm going to let this run overnight and head home for the evening.
18:15<themill>Tib: :) have fun
18:16<kjb>Tib: good luck tomorrow
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18:16*Tib crosses his fingers and jumps on his ST to head home.
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18:19<deconvolution>hello, my harddisk heep reading files and how can I know which process visit which files at the moment ?
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18:32<gizmokaka>hey everyone
18:33<gizmokaka>can any one tell me please what might be the reason i sudenlly loose my desktop?
18:33<gizmokaka>everything goes black and i can't see anything
18:33<gizmokaka>moving the mouse / keyboard pressing doesn't help
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18:34<guillaume>gizmokaka: have you got a terminal or just a black screen ?
18:35<themill>gizmokaka: does pressing Alt+F7 bring it back?
18:36<guillaume>gizmokaka: you should try to restart xserver in a terminal
18:37<gizmokaka>i just get a black screen
18:37<gizmokaka>i didn't try pressing Alt+F7 (I will next time it happens), what does that do?
18:37<guillaume>gizmokaka: : can you get access to a terminal by pressing ctl+alt+F1 ?
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18:37<gizmokaka>how do i restart xserver in a terminal?
18:38<gizmokaka>didn't try that either
18:38<gizmokaka>willl try also next time
18:38<guillaume>gizmokaka: first you need to acess a terminal and then to logon as root
18:38<gizmokaka>but how do i do that?
18:39<gizmokaka>it's a black screen that doesn't react to anything i tried
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18:41<gizmokaka>are you still here guillaume?
18:41<guillaume>gizmokaka: press CTRL+ALT+F1 keys if you don't access to a terminal the system is freeze and you'll lhave to do a hard reset
18:41<guillaume>gidoes it happen at boot time ?
18:43<gizmokaka>it happened when i installed another system on a virtual machine (virtual box)
18:43<gizmokaka>suddenly froze in the middle of installation(frustrating...)
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18:46<guillaume>gizmokaka: I don't know virtual box but maybe it's safer to setup your virtual box in a terminal and not in an X session
18:47<gizmokaka>guillaume: what do you mean by that? i need the installed system on the virtual machine to have gui
18:48<gizmokaka>guillaume: and i also use the gui installer. so i don't quite understand what do you mean by setting up the virtual machine in a teminal
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18:49<phillipsjk>Hom do I co about find out what is useni my OSS sound driver? As far as I know, I have no sound dameans installed.
18:49<phillipsjk>gizmokaka, A buggy video dirver can mean you need to use the console anyway. (For the host system)
18:50<phillipsjk>..restarting is just frowned upon ;)
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18:52<gizmokaka>but threw a teminal I can't do the installation i guess as far as i know
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18:53<gizmokaka>it requires me to run the virtual box application
18:53<gizmokaka>and start the installation of debian(for instance) on that machine
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18:56<acp>hi any one have successfully installed simdock here in etch, can any one direct me to a repository that i could just add it in my source.list?, tnx
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18:57<acp>I been getting deps but I could not find the > version of that dependenc
18:58<acp>here is a sample simdock depends on libatk1.0-0 (>= 1.13.1); however: Version of libatk1.0-0 on system is 1.12.4-3.
18:58<gizmokaka>phillipsjk, guillaume.......
18:59<abrotman>acp: which version of debian? tried the source package?
18:59<guillaume>gizmokaka: you're trying to setup virtual box on wich debian branch stable/testing/unstable ? Have you follow on howto ?
18:59<gizmokaka>it's a stable etch
19:00<gizmokaka>and it's quite a simple installation, i installed one system and it was fine
19:00<gizmokaka>than when installing the second it fail.
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19:01<acp>@abrotman: yes I tried
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19:01<gizmokaka>same thing happens sometimes at work in cases very different. seems like some kind of hibernation but of the type I cant wake up
19:02<guillaume>gizmokaka: I'm not an expert of virtualbox so I'm looking how it's working :)
19:02<beaufils>got trouble with openvpn connecting to my university VPN. When my laptop is connected through eth0 openvpn works OK, when connected through wifi (ath0) openvpn does not work. Any idea where to look for ?
19:03<gizmokaka>greate thanks dude, i really appreciate it
19:03<acp>@abrotman: Im using Debian4.0
19:03<gizmokaka>guillaume: thanks dude i really appreciate it
19:03<abrotman>acp: where did you get that simdock from ?
19:04<guillaume>gizmokaka: yoou're trying to setup the OSE version or the proprietary version ?
19:04<acp>@abrotman: from
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19:05<acp>@abrotman: can I just apt-get this?
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19:05<abrotman>i doubt it
19:06<abrotman>acp: you're likely going to have to compile it
19:06<abrotman>and that stil might not work
19:06<gizmokaka>of what?
19:06<gizmokaka>guillaume, of what?
19:06<abrotman>!info libatk1.0-0 etch
19:06<dpkg>libatk1.0-0: (The ATK accessibility toolkit), section libs, is optional. Version: 1.12.4-3 (etch), Packaged size: 74 kB, Installed size: 200 kB
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19:07<abrotman>acp: if this is a workstation .. you could migrate it to lenny
19:07-!-b0r0las [~mmejiav@] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
19:07<guillaume>gizmokaka: virtualbox exist in different version, an open source and a proprietary, wich one is yours ?
19:08<gizmokaka>oh, proprietary
19:08<acp>@abrotman:how can I do that?
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19:08<abrotman>!tell acp about etch->lenny
19:08<gizmokaka>guillaume, oh proprietary
19:08<abrotman>acp: be aware that lenny is still very much in flux .. and things may break
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19:09<gizmokaka>guillaume, i've apt-get it
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19:10<acp>abrotman: if I compile it I think it would still ask for the dependence, ryt?
19:10<guillaume>gizmokaka: for good help you should check #vbox irc channel
19:10<abrotman>acp: likely
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19:11<acp>abrotman: I just like to have a dock in my desktop
19:11<gizmokaka>guillaume, oh thanks, but i still believe it's a debian issue since it happened at work also under different circumstances
19:11<abrotman>acp: there are other docks in debian
19:11<gizmokaka>can I ask another question?
19:11<acp>what is it?
19:11<abrotman>acp: what's your WM/DE ?
19:11<gizmokaka>guillaume, can i ask you another question
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19:12<acp>sory,whats WM/DE?
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19:13<guillaume>gizmokaka: in this case you should check log to see what's wrong
19:13<abrotman>acp: gnome? kde?
19:13<abrotman>!info docker etch
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19:13<dpkg>docker: (System tray for KDE3/GNOME2 docklet applications), section x11, is optional. Version: 1.4-3 (etch), Packaged size: 10 kB, Installed size: 84 kB
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19:14<acp>abrotman: gnome, is this same as what it lock like in mac?
19:14<abrotman>no idea .. i don't use it
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19:15<acp>abrotman: thanks, Im gona look at it
19:15<gizmokaka>guillaume, OK
19:15<gizmokaka>now can i ask another ques?????
19:15<abrotman>acp: i'm sure it has a website
19:15<guillaume>gizmokaka: just ask
19:17<gizmokaka>guillaume, i have a pptp configured to my work vpn
19:17<acp>abrotman: thanks!
19:17<gizmokaka>guillaume, i run the pptpconfig tool to access it and succeed
19:17<gizmokaka>guillaume, when trying to connect with the nx client to my inner address it fails to connect
19:18<gizmokaka>guillaume, thereis an nx server running there
19:18<gizmokaka>is there something I am missing on the way?
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19:26<phillipsjk>gizmokaka: by "inner" adress do you mean If I understand it correctly, the virtual machine should be separate from localhost.
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19:33<Mykroft>If i was going to setup a mailing list on a debian server which package would you guys recommend?
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19:40<abrotman>Mykroft: depends how much management it will need
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19:41<Mykroft>ideally very little
19:41<themill>Mykroft: my personal preference is mailman. But there are plenty of others.
19:41<Mykroft>has anyone tried sympa?
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19:42<abrotman>Mykroft: if it's actually something that needs to be managed/monitored .. i'd use mailman .. if it's not, just a mail alias
19:42<lucas_amorim>hello, does anyone knows if " PSX MODE" in bchunk's man page refers to PlayStation ??
19:42<Mykroft>i used mailman for a while a couple years ago and it seemed really clunky
19:42<Mykroft>are there any improvements?
19:43<abrotman>depends how long ago you used it i suppose
19:43<lucas_amorim>I mean, if I am going to get a bin/cue from a PS2 game and want to record it in iso, so i should use the PSM MODe?
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19:44<themill>Mykroft: if you want clunky, you should try majordomo then with the wonderful majorcool web interface.
19:44<Mykroft>and if i don't want clunky?
19:45<themill>Mykroft: well, majorcool makes mailman look really really polished.
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19:53<lucas_amorim>where can I get more info then the manual?
19:54<phillipsjk>unfortunately, google is your freind.
19:54<lucas_amorim>I tried googling for "bchunk PSX mode" nothing usefull came out of it
19:54<lucas_amorim>anyway, thanks
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19:55<phillipsjk>source code... who needs docmentation then ;)
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19:59<Supaplex>phillipsjk: managers ;)
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20:08<spider>whys everybody so quiet whats wrong?
20:08<Supaplex>*puff* HIGH
20:08<spider>are these bots or what?
20:08<cwood>Maybe all our Debian installs are working well today.
20:08<Supaplex>or what.
20:10<Supaplex>can startx use an alternate config besides xorg.conf?
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20:12<cwood>I thought xorg.conf was X's config file, whereas xinitrc is startx's config file.
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20:13<ferfactor>que onda
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20:16<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
20:16<abrotman>Supaplex: you mean can X use an alternate ?
20:16<Supaplex>yes abrotman
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20:18<abrotman>Supaplex: i'd suspect .. but can't confirm .. ask #xorg on freenode
20:19<weasel>dpkg: tell spider about lol
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20:22<themill>Supaplex: I'm sure it can... man Xorg and look at -config
20:22<tin>haha, this is not #ubuntu
20:23<tin>quick question, is the move to kde4 worth it? I prefer gnome to kde 3.5
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20:23<Supaplex>thanks themill. didn't find it until now
20:23<abrotman>tin: then use gnome?
20:23<tin>which i do
20:23<Supaplex>!tell tin -about kde4
20:23<Supaplex>short answer, no
20:24<tin>thanks, cause i'm currently running etch and would upgrade to lenny just for kde4
20:24<Supaplex>it's eyecandy rc/beta
20:25<tin>true, and i still run windows classic XP theme at work
20:26<cwood>As much as I love the shinies, is there a window manager which offers a new metaphor for a computer desktop? Rather than ever-spiffier eye candy?
20:26*cwood mutters.
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20:27<tin>have you tried olpc?
20:27<tin>the journal is pretty nifty
20:27<cwood>Sugar graphical shell?
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20:28<cwood>no, googling
20:28<dpkg>Sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite :)
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20:29<abrotman>tin: kde4 isn't in lenny
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20:33<tin>apparently i'd need the experemental build of debian to run kde 4
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20:34<abrotman>tin: that's not quite how it works ..
20:34<abrotman>tin: ask #debian-kde if you want to know more about how to get kde4 going
20:35<tin>ah, cool beans
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20:35<tin>silly me, following the kde 4 website, i can shoehorn it into etch! :)
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20:38<tin>but thanks
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20:52<loc>é brasileiro??????
20:52<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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20:55<loc>I am new here
20:56<loc>To no matter if people presisar of something to here?
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20:57<gravity>loc: What do you want?
20:58-!-K4k [~K4k@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:59<loc>I want to see what is new here
20:59<cwood>you should: /msg dpkg news #debian
20:59<loc>Ja but people have to go tchau
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21:01<tin>i know this is a question for some sort of aptitude channel, but what is the score that's printed out whenever i use aptitude?
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21:01<gravity>aptitude has a complex algorithm for solving dependencies. It uses a scoring system to choose the best solution to the problem. The score is what you see, and it's really just an internal calculation based on factors I don't understand.
21:02<tin>hmmm, ah, thanks
21:02<tin>so a score of -1817 is bad
21:02<tin>meaning the chances of it succeeding are slim
21:02<gravity>Well, I don't know if it has anything to do with success or failure
21:03<tin>no, it failed
21:03<gravity>It's just not what aptitude really wants to do
21:03<tin>i suppose i should get a version of aptitude with super cow powers
21:04<abrotman>aptitude moo -vvvvv ?
21:05<tin>i want to downgrade to the one from 2005 when you feed it more than 6 v's, it says "go away, i'm thinking"
21:05<tin>rolling back all the work performed on aptitude in the past 3 years is so totally worth the additional easter egg line
21:05<abrotman>you could send in a patch ?
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21:06<tin>i suppose i could
21:06<tin>but the fact that it was removed means that the patch may not stick, so i'll just have to get the source and make my own versions
21:07*gravity notes that aptitude seriously needs contributors
21:07<phillipsjk>tin: aptitude moo -vvv
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21:07<gravity>Then again, what doesn't?
21:07-!-dpalacio [~david@] has joined #debian
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21:08<tin>i work in digital forensics pulling 10-11 hour days, i wish i had free time to donate
21:08*gravity nods
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21:09<tin>i'd probably contribute to the ntfs project if i had a choice, seeing as we do most of our work on windows XP systems
21:10<tin>yesterday i spent the better part of the day rebuilding a partition table for a dd image i found on a recovery drive only to find that the file system on the third partition was bad :(
21:10-!-mire__ [] has quit []
21:10<cwood>law enforcement forensics?
21:10-!-genmin [~genmin@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:10<tin>corporate/white collar crime forensics
21:10<tin>i would die in LEO forensics
21:10<cwood>Ah, okay. All the niftiness of the tech with none of the image nightmares.
21:11<tin>no stomach for the CP
21:11<Supaplex>I hear the united states has, or will require a private investiators licence before you can do pc/digital forenciscs/recovery etc
21:11<tin>ny already does
21:11<tin>i'm in florida, people are sue happy down here
21:11<Supaplex>otherwise you can end up in jail. how sucky is that? :P
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21:12<tin>yeah, we had a sort of scare about that last month
21:13<gravity>rage is a great motivator for improving software
21:13<tin>we looked into it but because the circuit is in marshall, tx (guess what the case is about, you're probably right) we were ok
21:13-!-genmin [~genmin@] has joined #debian
21:13<tin>i'd work this NY case for free because its against a patent troll
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21:15<cwood>Always good to be on the right side.
21:15<tin>we try
21:15<Hydroxide>tin: I like your nick; I used to use that to read newsgroups :)
21:16<tin>my full nick is tin bromide
21:16<Hydroxide>tin: nice to meet you, fellow chemical ;)
21:16<abrotman>wasn't tin the only real reader long ago?
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21:17<Supaplex>now I'm itching for an old school video game to play. hummm I wonder which one I should play.
21:17<abrotman>tin and slrn ? maybe?
21:17*Supaplex !
21:17<Supaplex>easy ;)
21:17<abrotman>Supaplex: .. uses java
21:17<dpkg>rumour has it, supaplex is a classic game from the m$dos days featuring 111 levels of insanity. Now it's freeware, and has atleast 11 level seperate sets of (111) levels. a super hero one man support team, or see
21:18<Supaplex>^^^ that on ^^^
21:18<tin>at work we can install whatever we want, it comes with the work, so i'm currently introducing my co-workers to the joys of regex's via notepad++
21:19<tin>however, n++ doesn't specify ungreedy, :(
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21:28<tin>hey, i've been having a problem mounting my ntfs partition via the file system in etch
21:28<tin>i can mount it with the ntfs-3g userspace and kernel read only driver, but i can't double click it in the computer and just explore it
21:29<tin>i usually mount it to my /mnt folder, but i'd prefer a double click to get to my XP files, any input?
21:30<tin>here's the error message: libhal-storage.c 1401 : info: called libhal_free_dbus_error but dbuserror was not set.
21:30<tin>process 7182: applications must not close shared connections - see dbus_connection_close() docs. this is a bug in the application.
21:30<tin>error: device /dev/sda1 is not removable
21:30<tin>error: could not execute pmount
21:30-!-tin was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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21:31<abrotman>!find bin/pmount etch
21:31<dpkg>Debian Search of 'bin/pmount' (1): (/usr/bin/{pmount|pmount-hal}) in utils/pmount.
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21:42<tin>i have the most recent version of pmount and i get this:
21:42<tin>MiniCompy:/usr/bin# pmount /dev/sda1 squee
21:42<tin>Error: device /dev/sda1 is not removable
21:44<abrotman>can't you just put it in your fstab as an automount ?
21:45<tin>i suppose i could, but how would i keep it as a separate "drive" along side Filesystem?
21:46-!-qq [~qq@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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21:48<tin>can you drop a link into the "Computer" directory?
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21:49<abrotman>in gnome?
21:49<abrotman>my "camera" is in there .. so i ugess you can
21:50<Entheogen>i have one question... can i make my debian to recognize when cable is plugged in eth1 and automatically to start that connection? like in windows?
21:50<abrotman>among other things
21:50<abrotman>allow_hotplug i believe
21:50<tin>make eth1 your primary interface in /etc/network/interfaces file
21:51<tin>open a root terminal and nano /etc/network/interfaces
21:51<Entheogen>allow-hotplug in interfaces?
21:51-!-luckylin [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:51<Entheogen>how can i make eth1 primary interface?
21:52<tin>MiniCompy:~# nano /etc/network/interfaces
21:52<tin>go to this section and make it look like this
21:52<tin># The primary network interface
21:52<tin>allow-hotplug eth1
21:52<tin>iface eth1 inet dhcp
21:52<Entheogen>let me try that
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21:55<vinboy>what are the popular admin GUI packages available in debian?
21:55<vinboy>e.g. managing users, managing startup process etc
21:55<gravity>gvim, xemacs... :-)
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21:55<vinboy>no they are not :)
21:56<abrotman>they are!
21:56<vinboy>well.. anything like yast or fedora's sysconfig?
21:56<tin>real admins use root terminal and nothing but
21:56<tin>i can't be assed to sudo anything
21:56<abrotman>yast is utter poo
21:57<abrotman>vinboy: which aspects of the system do you want to admin ?
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21:57<vinboy>abrotman: currently i want to select which program to run at startup
21:57<gravity>I don't think anyone's really packaged any sort of gui admin tool in a while
21:57<gravity>Debian users and developers don't tend to care for such things
21:58<Entheogen>i think it works.. what does mean allow-hotplug and auto options in interfaces?
21:58<abrotman>Entheogen: man interfaces
21:58<abrotman>gravity: or admins?
21:58<gravity>abrotman: I counted admins as users
21:58<gravity>admins are users too
21:58<abrotman>vinboy: rcconf? there's another GUIish thingie
21:58<abrotman>gravity: i suppose
21:58<tin>nano is all the gui i need :)
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21:59<gravity>Just going to throw this out there because it's really awesome: squeak is pretty much the coolest shit I've seen since first discovering *nix
21:59<tin>enlighten me
22:00<gravity>It's a smalltalk implementation
22:00<abrotman>bubble and squeak ?
22:00<vinboy>thanks abrotman
22:00<gravity>Written in smalltalk itself
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22:00<tin>haha, bootstrap paradox solved?
22:00<gravity>How they did it is documented actually. Google "back to the future squeak"
22:00<gravity>They have a minimal subset of smalltalk that compiles down to C. The compiler is written in smalltalk.
22:01<tin>nice, well, i must take my leave
22:01-!-NetNuttt [] has left #debian [Konversation terminated!]
22:02<vinboy>ok rcconf is pretty nice
22:02<tin>some day, i'm gonna implode into a mathematical singluarity from my sheer-nonexistingness... sitting in a debian irc while my woman is waiting, naked on my bed...
22:02<gravity>But you can learn and understand every aspect of the environment, from the VM all the way up through your gui widgets without learning anything but smalltalk. Further, you can make live changes to any aspect of the system and have it take effect immediately. No hunting down source or recompiling. It's amazing.
22:02<tin>but i gotta go
22:02<gravity>heh, take it easy
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22:03<abrotman>gravity: how does it feel to be the last smalltalk programmer? :)
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22:04<gravity>abrotman: ;-)
22:04<gravity>It's actually still thriving, believe it or not
22:04<gravity>I thought it was dead also
22:04*abrotman sends gravity his Ada books
22:04<vinboy>how do I tell debian to auto modprobe a kernel module?
22:05-!-brincadeira [~brincadei@] has quit []
22:05<abrotman>vinboy: /etc/modules
22:05<abrotman>or modconf if you need one of those GUI things
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22:05<vinboy>i love GUi
22:07<vinboy>by the way, how hard is it to make the console appear in different color when I enter super-user mode "SU"?
22:07<abrotman>you mean the background ?
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22:07<vinboy>when I enter SU, it becomes debian-vin:/home/vinboy
22:08<vinboy>but same color..
22:08<abrotman>change your $PS1 perhaps
22:09<vinboy>.bashrc ?
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22:14<vinboy>ok i got it :D
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22:30<RIVE>Hello, good evenning.
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22:30<chealer>abrotman: you should come study CS with me at université Laval. they still taught Smalltalk no earlier than last year.
22:31<gravity>There's a damn good reason. I never actually liked object oriented programming until I used smalltalk
22:32-!-mode/#debian [+l 329] by debhelper
22:32<gravity>It turns out that it's because all the other systems (except ruby, but they don't teach you ruby properly) are all doing it wrong
22:32<abrotman>chealer: bah .. i got to learn snobol/cobol/rpg .. those beat the snot out of smalltalk
22:32<gravity>snobol turned in to icon, which is kinda neat
22:32<abrotman>it was kind of neat .. it was just some intro to it ..
22:32<gravity>But you can have generators with python and gnu-smalltalk anyway, so there you go
22:33<gravity>And you can do all the same stuff with blocks in ruby and smalltalk
22:33<chealer>abrotman: haha. OK, your place is good enough
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22:33<abrotman>i think there are parts of every language that i learned that i liked
22:33*abrotman tries to think
22:33<cwood>I've never gotten the hang of OO programming... but all I know is Perl, so don't know much.
22:33<abrotman>oh .. cold fusion totally sucked
22:35<abrotman>chealer: don't get me wrong .. cobol/rpg are ancient .. but RPG really wasn't bad for what it had to do ..
22:36<gravity>I don't know anything about rpg
22:36<abrotman>AFAIR .. it had like a header section .. a detail section and a footer .. and it just processed lines of data
22:36<dpkg>rpg is, like, Report Program Generator
22:36<abrotman>dpkg: you suck
22:36<dpkg>I resemble that remark!
22:37<abrotman>everything had a column that it belonged in
22:38*abrotman isn't sure if he still has those books
22:38<chealer>abrotman: smalltalk isn't necessarily bad neither, just ancient
22:39<abrotman>lots of languages are .. doesn't make them bad
22:40<abrotman>imagine if you were restricted to languages invented before you were born
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22:41<cwood>What, like learning to talk English? :p
22:41<gravity>Oh man
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22:42<abrotman>cwood: no .. for example .. i wouldn't be able to use C++/Python/PHP/Java .. x86 asm maybe .. all kinds of stuff
22:42<cwood>Hm. A world without the language vs language penis comparison wars. Sounds appealing.
22:42-!-Holborn [] has quit []
22:43<abrotman>nah .. they'd still have smalltalk vs ada wars :)
22:43<abrotman>you're biased!
22:43<gravity>We have those today. They're called "ruby vs. java"
22:43<gravity>I don't know ada
22:43<abrotman>it has some interesting bits
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22:44<gravity>I know a bit about it. It seems interesting, although not something I currently have a need for. I'd reach for haskell to get the strict typing.
22:44<abrotman>you just don't work 600ft under the rest of us .. working on some goofy system that will never be used by anyone without top secret clearance :)
22:45<gravity>Exactly :-)
22:47<abrotman>egads .. the 777 has ada stuff on it
22:48<guillaume>hello, how long can take dd to copy a partition of 60G to another hdd ? (2external hdd on usb2)
22:48<abrotman>480Mbps .. at best .. do the math .. i'd guess at least an hour
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22:49<abrotman>it's probably more like 200Mbps
22:49<guillaume>abrotman: that's I was thinking, but it run since 2 hours now
22:49<abrotman>guillaume: i think .. moment
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22:50<abrotman>man dd ... see the section about kill -USR1 $pid; sleep 1; kill $pid
22:50<abrotman>that seems like i didn't copy something
22:51<cwood>Maybe you can mount the destination partition read-only while it's copying, to see where it is?
22:53<guillaume>cwood: it won't break copy ?
22:54<cwood>I have no idea.
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22:54<abrotman>guillaume: man dd .. there is a way to see how far it's gone
22:54<cwood>I suspect not, since you'll be mounting read-only, hm.
22:54<abrotman>*tap tap*
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23:04<guillaume>abrotman: 10982118912 bytes (11 GB) copied, 13,2726 s, 827 MB/s...11G in 2 hours, I'll go to bed cause it's 5:00 AM :(
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23:07<abrotman>haha .. okay .. good plan
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23:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 322] by debhelper
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23:43-!-david is now known as Guest1354
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23:50-!-`Buttehad is now known as `Butthead
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23:58*Killing_Frost wonders if the makers of mp3/mp4 can be sued for creating a monopoly on an industry standard.
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---Logclosed Fri Apr 11 00:00:46 2008