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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-11-15

---Logopened Sun Nov 15 00:00:14 2009
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00:00<xanavi>backtrack install, schweet
00:00<xanavi>its a pretty decent base for a basic debian install
00:00<Gaartboom>no vnc at this moment, butt you couls use putty
00:01<venger>Gaartboom, are you just talking about the panel items ie Applications, Places, System, etc not responding?
00:01<Gaartboom>yes indeed,
00:01<venger>have you tried killall gnome-panel
00:02<Gaartboom>no,
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00:05<Gaartboom>I just did it now, the killall gnome-panel. no change.
00:05<DarkPurpose>?
00:06<Gaartboom>i gues to see if there was something hanging
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00:07<Gaartboom>is it possible that xserver brings the problem? because my xserver don't work
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00:10<sney>!doesn't work
00:10<dpkg>Look buddy, "doesn't work" is a vague statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message?". Ask me about <smart questions> and <errors>.
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00:11<vadim>i like debian
00:12<sney>me too
00:12<Gaartboom>No error messages, when i hover to one of those top menu items, its like just an image. It don't react at all. none of the bar's react. every
00:13<sney>Gaartboom: still no reason to believe it's an X issue. you've said your xserver "doesn't work" a few times already but with no supporting evidence other than some gnome issues. Have you tried another (non-GTK) window manager to see if it could be caused by gnome or gtk?
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00:14<Gaartboom>no, its a fresh install, and don't want to bloat it more. I use gdm with gnome
00:14<vadim>Is it possible to organize translation of messages in xchat to another language on the fly?
00:15<KingKong2009>Had a play around with rsnapshot, rdiff-backup and duplicity, I have chosen rdiff-backup as my backup solution
00:15<Gaartboom>could i generate a log that would be usefull for you?
00:16<goodger>vadim: it would be relatively trivial to write an xchat plugin to do that, but it would be very slow indeed
00:17<goodger>well, I say relatively trivial assuming that google translate has a python API
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00:18<vadim>Thank you for your reply.
00:18<vadim>My English is too bad so I am looking for the solution
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00:19<faheem>vadim: what locale are you using?
00:21<vadim>in the sense?
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00:22<vadim>utf
00:22<Gaartboom>the xserver fault i have, is this one look : http://lkml.indiana.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0901.2/00705.html
00:23-!-yuri_i [~yuri@c-69-181-198-138.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #debian
00:24<Gaartboom>and this would be the fix look: http://bugzilla.kernel.org/attachment.cgi?id=19720&action=view
00:24<yuri_i>Anyone know where debian keeps the global configuration for dircolors? /etc/DIR_COLORS does not exist and I see no options being set in /etc/bash.bashrc
00:25<faheem>vadim: my understanding is that if you set your locales appropriately, the messages you see may be translated. what is your language/location?
00:26<venger>Gaartboom, if the xserver failed to start you would not be able to use gnome, so are you working two different issues? you can always use pastebin to provide logs or some evidence as to why you think this is your problem
00:28<faheem>vadim: see http://wiki.debian.org/Locale
00:28<vadim>I live in Ukraine.
00:28<vadim>Avail speak Ukrainian (native) and Russian
00:29<venger>or [file|image]bin for screenshots
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00:30<faheem>vadim: i assume setting your locale to something suitable would help. anyone feel like clarifying
00:30<faheem>you could talk to people in a russian channel
00:30<faheem>!ru
00:30<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian @ irc.freenode.net.
00:31<faheem>vadim: try there
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00:33<faheem>yuri_i: to answer your question, dircolors -b outputs the value
00:33<faheem>it is not set in a file
00:33<faheem>as you can see in your .bashrc
00:34<vadim>en_US.UTF-8 UTF-8
00:34<faheem>ie eval "`dircolors -b`"
00:34<faheem>vadim: right. that is not going to help you. again, consider changing your locale
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00:35<faheem>talking to the people in a russian channel will probably be helpful
00:37<Gaartboom>venger: my xserver gives a fatal error look at: http://pastebin.com/d5b16c171
00:37<vadim>for me it is difficult
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00:39<leo>hi ppl
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00:40<leo>i've got 2 dvds for lenny 5.03 and i just got squeeze netinstall and about to proceed with the 6 install - can i use the packages from the lenny dvds in squeeze?
00:40<faheem>vadim: what is difficult?
00:41<sney>nope
00:41<leo>thanks sney
00:41<faheem>leo: no
00:41<leo>and faheem
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00:43<leo>where can i find package dvds for 6?
00:44<faheem>leo: go to debian.org and click on links
00:44<vadim>I Founded link
00:44<vadim>http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=182303
00:44<sney>it won't be called 6 until it's released though, for now it's just 'testing' and/or 'squeeze'
00:45<leo>ok thanks
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00:46<Gaartboom>ok I found out that I can't start a gui-application as root. I get this error: Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: :1006.0
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00:47<faheem>Gaartboom: you can if you set the appriate env variables
00:47<vadim>I want this to using it.
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00:47<faheem>Gaartboom: eg. -> export XAUTHORITY=$HOME/.Xauthority in .bashrc
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00:48<Gaartboom>faheem: thank you i will try this.
00:49<faheem>the point if that root does not own your display, so you need to give it some kind of permission (i think)
00:49<faheem>i forget the details
00:49<faheem>that's the users .bashrc, not roots
00:49<faheem>can anyone give a more precise description?
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00:58<Gaartboom>faheem: I fixed it like this: sudo -i
00:58<Gaartboom>xauth merge my-username/.Xauthority
00:58<Gaartboom>export DISPLAY=:1006.0
00:59<Gaartboom>faheem: thank you!
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01:05<faheem>Gaartboom: that DISPLAY variable looks a bit fragile
01:05<faheem>assuming you have saved it in a file
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01:07<sney>the 'sux' command has the ability to let the superuser start X applications
01:07<sney>it's not sudo, but you can sudo sux
01:09<Gaartboom>sney: I did a reboot and see that i need tho put the fix again. How can i make this persistent?
01:09<sney>I just told you
01:11<Gaartboom>sney: ah ok, i'm new to linux so i need to get the feel with it. Thanks
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01:29<DebJay>anyone know the KDE applet that places a sound mixer in the notification area?
01:30<leo>is it possible to copy openjdk-6-jre downloaded in lenny onto squeeze?
01:34<leo>i guess no because it has lenny2_ in the name
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01:35<leo>but couldn't i just copy everyfile that has openjdk and the locations and put it all in the squeeze fs?
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01:40<dbldtx>IRSSI for the win! I just discovered how to be on multiple IRC servers using the same window... Meat and potatoes: What would be the best way to go about submitting an OpenOffice3 bug involving opening .xls?
01:40<faheem>leo: yikes. why don't you just install openjdk-6-jre from sqeeze?
01:41<faheem>dbldtx: cool. want to share?
01:41<leo>i suppose i could just means downloading 40 mb which i just downloaded last night
01:41<faheem>dbldtx: if it is an upstream bug, then find the oo bug tracker i guess
01:42<leo>just wanted to know if it's the same files in the same locations
01:42<faheem>leo: hard to tell.
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01:42<faheem>in general the same package from different versions of debian are not identical
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01:43<leo>ok i'll play it safe
01:43<leo>installing squeeze now brb
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01:47<dbldtx>Okay, so I tried it again without anything running and was able to recreate the bug.
01:49<dbldtx>Does anybody know how to make a .xls require repairing prior to opening? The crash I'm getting kills everything and spits me out to my xdm login (apparently this isn't supposed to happen in Linux, especially if you're running LAMP or something mission critical)?
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01:50<dbldtx>I tried to open a .xls and it required repairing. Instead of hitting cancel or repair file, I left it pending and attempted to then open a SECOND .xls that I know required repairing... I thought I would just click [repair][repair] and they'd both open... but that first pending one was too much for the second to handle?
01:50<dbldtx>Anyway, I rebooted and then tried, with nothing (almost nothing, at least) running, to open both at the same time. CRASH without even the pending...
01:50<dbldtx>So then I log back in and open one... click repair, and it's open.
01:51<dbldtx>Open the second, click repair, and it's also open. Is this a bug? Debian Squeeze Open Office 3
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01:52<diego>hi, I'm looking for a graphical ide that does "diff -r dir1 dir2" or a console one that shows estimated time left
01:52<diego>so I dont get bored
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01:53<dbldtx>Looks like he got bored with the channel.
01:54<franki^>heh
01:55<dbldtx>"Do not say that you are bored. Instead, say that you are simply not poet enough to call forth life's riches."
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01:56<franki^>indeed, i don't believe in boredom :)
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02:10<simonrvn>dbldtx: LAMP servers don't a) have x running on them b) wouldn't have wine installed to run microcrap excel on them..., so that statement is a non-sequitur.
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02:14<dbldtx>Simonrvn; wouldn't have Open Office 3?
02:14<dbldtx>I was attempting to open a .xls sent from Vietnam
02:14<simonrvn>!paste
02:15<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: http://paste.debian.net/ http://pastebin.ca/ http://pastie.org/ http://pastebin.com/ or http://picpaste.com/ for pics. Use wikisend.com for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>.
02:15<simonrvn>^^^
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02:16<dbldtx>simonrvn; understood. I am sorry - I did not paste though, it was an afterthought which provided more information relevant to the topic; information about the file that was producing the error. I know about paste.
02:16<simonrvn>dbldtx: no, put the file up at a file sharing site
02:17<simonrvn>dbldtx: or a web site you can put it up to easily
02:17<dbldtx>simonrvn; sensitive data and is no longer in disrepair. I'm currently reading about it and trying to figure out how to make a file need "repairing" -- I get you now, thought you were just being a dick but I understand.
02:18<simonrvn>haha
02:18<simonrvn>@ the being a dick
02:18<simonrvn>dbldtx: mm ok. 'cause i do have ooo 3 installed
02:18<dbldtx>:) Yes, I am working on it but other things taking my time at the present... will file this and bring it back up when I have the facts if need be.
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02:20<simonrvn>dbldtx: there might be some util in the repo that can convert the thing to something more sane
02:21<simonrvn>dbldtx: i *was* a bit hard you before with the non-sequitur stuff..
02:22<dbldtx>simonrvn; It's sane now, I'm editing it just fine - opened it three times earlier today and only once of those it needed repairing... the bug arose when I tried to open it's sister-file which needed repairing also, when the first REPAIR FILE? option was still pending.
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02:23<dbldtx>simonrvn; It's okay, I've gotten far worse, and I just misunderstood your paste reference for you telling me to not say two lines when it could be said in one - I agree with that anyway. You're not a dick regardless and you actually contribute well. I can be a pain and am very annoying and I talk ENTIRELY too much for how much I know about Debian..
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02:27<simonrvn>dbldtx: heh, well i try not to be a dick :P.
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02:52<Gaartboom>ok when i do a reboot when i'm in gnome, those top menus(applications, places and system) suddenly begin to work. Butt then offcourse the server restart.
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02:53<dbldtx>nick doubledutch
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04:04<draconis>is it possible to install from a live-disk?
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05:07<EmleyMoor>After all that, it looks like it's the motherboard
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05:14<hingwah>I just find that ia32-apt-get seem to be removed from debian, is there an alternative?
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05:56<nk3>dsl
05:56<nk3>:s
05:56-!-nk3 is now known as server
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06:01<Nemoder>grr why does udev set /def/fuse ownership to root:root
06:01<Nemoder>*dev
06:02<Gathond>Nemoder: becaus that is the default and you have not told it to do otherwise?
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06:02<Nemoder>I thought it used to be root:fuse
06:02<Gathond>I can't actually remember at the moment where it is you tell it differently though:)
06:03-!-achury [~Marco@urb2-01-440.ccs.ras.cantv.net] has left #debian []
06:03<Nemoder>I know where I just don't know how, udev rules and docs are really confusing
06:03<Gathond>actually it may remember it
06:03<Gathond>so if you just change it manually then restart I think the permissions may be kept
06:03-!-kutio [~kutio@vig38-1-82-67-76-10.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #debian
06:03<Nemoder>hm
06:04<Nemoder>looks like that worked, thanks
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06:38<RexKiller>evey (:
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06:51<pepito>hola, alguien que hable español para ayuda ??
06:51<azeem>!es
06:51<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
06:51<pepito>gracias
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07:02<janke>Добрый день
07:02<janke>Можете подсказать как мне настроить интернет и сеть через хаб в дебиан?
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07:21<hmh>anyone rebooted an up-to-date unstable box in the last two days?
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07:50<marcel>moin
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07:57<valdyn>!tell hmh -about ask
07:57<hmh>valdyn: that WAS a direct question
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07:59<hmh>valdyn: but if you'd rather pester me with something this stupid, here is it again: did anyone manage to coldboot successfully an ia32 2.6.27 box with udev 147-* ?
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08:39<jmut>hi folks. I have memcached installed. But when PC starts only one instance of it will start. Should I create copy of /etc/init.d/memcached like /etc/init.d/memcached2 and force it to use another config or what is recommended approach?
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09:08<Juanjo>alguien español
09:08<Juanjo>????
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09:15<cahoot>!es
09:15<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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09:16<abrotman>he's gone
09:16<cahoot>ok back to nirvana
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09:20<Lethalman_>I need libGL.so.1 for 32-bit
09:20<Lethalman_>I have mesa drivers for ati
09:20<Lethalman_>what to do?
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09:21<Lethalman_>ah yes ia32-libs
09:21<khalaf>i can use google talk for video chat
09:21<khalaf>?
09:22<khalaf>can i use google talk for video chat?
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09:34<damiank>hi
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10:13<gernot>Hi. What could be the reason that my CPU temperatur sensor (/sys/class/hwmon/hwmon0/temp1_input) suddenly stopped working (only reporting 0)?
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10:27<oorah>there are a couple big bugs in ubuntu karmic, would it be a better idea to downgrade to jaunty or to get debian?
10:29<noflash>oorah, you're on a debian support channel..what do you think would be said ?
10:29<cahoot>oorah: considered the possible outcomes of that question in #debian?
10:29-!-kalle [~kalle@c-83-233-144-4.cust.bredband2.com] has joined #debian
10:29<oorah>just askin for advice sorry
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10:32<khalaf>which program i can use for video chat on ubuntu
10:32<khalaf>which program i can use for video chat on ubuntu ?
10:32<khalaf>which program i can use for video chat on ubuntu
10:32<khalaf>which program i can use for video chat on ubuntu
10:35<azeem>khalaf: ask #ubuntu
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10:44<leo>hello, i need heaps of help
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10:45<leo>i'm trying to rescue squeeze and reinstall grub 2 over lilo but have rescued a corrupt lenny on a different partition
10:45<leo>and i have a non bootable grub 2 atm
10:46<leo>i can't seem to rescue the squeeze partition because "EXT4-fs: Update your userspace programs to mount using ext4"
10:46<leo>how do i do that please?
10:47<leo>problem being not mounting
10:47-!-zd [~ls@95-29-29-181.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #debian
10:48<leo>"/target failed: Invalid argument"
10:48-!-mith [~melvin@82.211.214.52] has joined #debian
10:49<leo>also i see a "FATAL: Module lvm_mod not found"
10:49<leo>i think this all has something to do with the logical volume i setup and then deleted in the partitioning process
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10:56<leo>my main issue is ext4 not being recognised by installer / rescue / grub
10:56<leo>if anyone has some ideas i'd be much obliged
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11:00<leo>and grateful
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11:08<Xeross[sick]>What other locations then ~/.bashrc are ran similiarly
11:09<Xeross[sick]>I have a script I put somewhere that shows the current git branch but I have no clue which file and it aint ~/.bashrc
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11:11<bighornram>I'm trying to use reportbug to submit a bug but not getting an email confirmation nor is the report appearing in the list of submitted bugs. I can send mail from commandline successfully.
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11:14<weasel>bighornram: how long ago did you send it?
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11:16<bighornram>I sent one within the last 15 minutes but was unsuccessful in submitting about a week ago. I was on the road and connected from a different location then, am home now and thought possibly was a firewall issue.
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11:16<weasel>if it isn't there after an hour or so tell us again?
11:17-!-mode/#debian [+l 410] by debhelper
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11:17<bighornram>weasel: will do. :D thanks
11:17<bighornram>should I be able to see a log entry if an email was sent?
11:18<weasel>reportbug might have sent mail using your sendmail, or it might have connected to bugs-master directly
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11:21<leo>nevermind proceeding to reinstall with ext3
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11:28*EmleyMoor had better start putting money aside for future repairs, once this one is out of the waf
11:28<EmleyMoor>way
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11:40<EmleyMoor>One of the parts of a raid6 I have is offline - how do I bring it back? (I've forgotten how I did it before)
11:42<EmleyMoor>Found it...
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11:45<MSameer>any idea why loading pcspkr disables the console beep (testing) ??
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11:47<cahoot>conflicting with already loaded snd-pcsp perhaps?
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11:47<MSameer>both are not loaded
11:48<MSameer>when I load one of them, the beep disappears
11:48<MSameer>T61 if that makes a difference
11:48<MSameer>and lost the beep under X completely :(
11:49<cahoot>biss
11:49<cahoot>meh
11:49<MSameer>yeah odd :)
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11:51<patrikf>MSameer: at least on some systems, you can disable the system speaker using alsamixer. I'm not entirely sure how that works concept-wise, but you might check that.
11:52<MSameer>but I want to enable it not to disable it
11:52<MSameer>I can't live without it
11:52<MSameer>sort of :)
11:52<patrikf>MSameer: I mean that it might be disabled through alsa.
11:52<MSameer>mmm
11:52<MSameer>now I have the beep when I press C-G
11:53<MSameer>but not under X
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11:53<MSameer>with pcspkr and snd-pcsp unloaded
11:53<MSameer>which makes me wonder... What's X/Gnome doing in the background
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11:54<jharr>Is there anything I can do to apt to have it automatically install -dev packages along with the normal packages?
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12:02<zas>hi somebody use debian with kernel 2.6.30 with driver nvidia?
12:02<zas>i have problems with module-assistant, whent that try compile
12:04<Yoda-BZH>zas with testing ?
12:04<zas>Yoda-BZH, yeah
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12:05<Yoda-BZH>use nvidia-kernel-source from unstable
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12:06<zas>Yoda-BZH, that packet is th eproblem, when module-assistant try compile make an error
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12:07<Yoda-BZH>zas use the one from unstable, not testing
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12:07<zas>Yoda-BZH, can you tell me the respository?
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12:08<Yoda-BZH>http://packages.debian.org/sid/nvidia-kernel-source
12:10<zas>Yoda-BZH, thanks i will try now to install
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12:13<runev>I've tried setting up my wireless on two machines now using wpa_supplicant. One with ndiswrapper drivers, and one with kernel-shipped drivers. In both cases i get "Bit Rate = 1 Mb/s" and very slow download speeds. Trying to set "iwconfig wlan0 rate 54M" manually doesn't help either. Anyone with ideas on what I'm doing wrong?
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12:17<cahoot>nothing useful in dmesg/logs?
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12:20<runev>cahoot, only thing i see in dmesg is CTS protection enabling and disabling itself after i first associated with my AP
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12:21<runev>nothing in messages of relevance
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12:21<cahoot>runev: what kind of device is this?
12:23<runev>one is a dlink dwl-g510 pci card set up with ndiswrapper from XP drivers, and the other is a bcm4317 where i had to manually download new firmware from wirelesslinux.org
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12:23<cahoot>so it's two different wlan devices (mis)behaving ?
12:23<runev>yeah
12:24<runev>so i'm guessing i'm the weak link
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12:24<runev>bad configuration or something
12:24<cahoot>the router being the root of the problem?
12:24<sney>or possibly the router itself. how long has it been since you last power cycled it
12:24<sney>mine tends to get a little bit of gunk in the tubes if I leave it on constantly for more than 6 months or so
12:24<runev>it's not a problem on my two win7 workstations, so i've ruled that out .. but i've tried that a few times already
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12:28<runev>pastebin.ca/1672316
12:28<runev>could anything i've done there be the root of my problem?
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12:33<cahoot>runev: debian kernel - not a custom?
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12:40<runev>cahoot: yes, 2.6.26-2-686 on both machines
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12:42<cahoot>runev: then I doubt it's a matter of any misconfig from your side
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12:57<MSameer>got my bill back!
12:57<MSameer>http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=551590
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13:17<kapeed>gdeepk: Hi
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13:31<stopkin>Ку
13:31<bighornram>weasel: still no success with reportbug
13:32<stopkin>oi
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13:32<weasel>bighornram: what's your email address?
13:32<bighornram>jwolf+2uk8h3iy@doemail.org
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13:33<weasel>don't see that in the mail log
13:33<bighornram>and I can send mail from commandline successfully
13:33<bighornram>what else can I check?
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13:34<weasel>just send a regular email and don't use reportbug?
13:34<weasel>(/me not a huge fan of reportbug)
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13:35<weasel>bighornram: see http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting - the gist is that you send mail to submit@bugs.debian.org, with Package: and Version: pseudo headers
13:35<EmleyMoor>Experience suggests that there's fewer problems changin the motherboard of a Debian box than doing the same to a Windows box - but are there any points I should watch for?
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13:42<faheem>bighornram: what do your mail logs say about the reportbug mail?
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13:43<faheem>EmleyMoor: same motherboard or different?
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13:43<EmleyMoor>faheem: Different.
13:45<faheem>EmleyMoor: i assume your installation is making assumptions about what kernel modules to load and so forth. so it might not boot properly with the new mb
13:45<faheem>but i have no experience with this
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13:46<bighornram>faheem: Which file would contain that info? mail.log?
13:47<faheem>bighornram: what is your mta? if exim4, then /var/log/exim4/mainlog
13:47<faheem>possibly with a number after it, like mainlog.1
13:47<faheem>postfix would be similar, i assume
13:47<EmleyMoor>The last time I had do to a motherboard change (in fact, even more than the motherboard), it went far better than I expected
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13:47<faheem>EmleyMoor: maybe the system has got smarter.
13:47<faheem>EmleyMoor: you got it to boot, then?
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13:49<EmleyMoor>faheem: Yes - and I expected trouble there but it just worked straight away. This time I don't expect any trouble but you never know when Murphy is waiting in the wings.
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13:50<faheem>EmleyMoor: well, the debian installer has improved dramatically in the time i've been using Debian
13:51<faheem>the potato installer couldn't detect anything. you had to tell it what kernel modules to use and so forth
13:51<EmleyMoor>Wish it wasn't necessary but USB has gone horribly flaky on this one
13:52<faheem>EmleyMoor: what is the mb?
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13:53<bighornram>faheem: I dont' see any entries for reportbug in mainlog
13:54<EmleyMoor>New is Asos M3A79-T Deluxe
13:54<EmleyMoor>Asus
13:54<EmleyMoor>Not sure what old is... will see if I can find box or book
13:55<faheem>bighornram: grep for 'debian'
13:55<faheem>bighornram: the entry looks like - 2009-11-14 21:39:55 1N9V1u-0008JX-IG => submit@bugs.debian.org ...
13:55<faheem>that's a bug i sent yesterday
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13:57<faheem>bug report, i mean
13:58<bighornram>the whole file is only 20 lines long and only shows test messages I sent to myself and start queue runs and end queue runs.
13:58<bighornram>doesn't appear that reportbug is attempting to send
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14:04<faheem>bighornram: strange. should be fixable, though
14:04<faheem>do you have any other mtas installed? not sure debian would allow that, but anyway...
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14:04<bighornram>faheem: no only exim
14:04<faheem>you just have a mainlog, no mainlog.1 or anything?
14:05<bighornram>have others
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14:05<faheem>wonder if reportbug needs to be configured
14:05<faheem>wrt the mta i mean
14:05<faheem>bighornram: did it ask you questions about the mta when you first ran it?
14:06<cahoot>a bugreport on reportbug?
14:06-!-andrew- [~andy@ppp079166013115.dsl.hol.gr] has quit []
14:06<faheem>cahoot: yes, his report didn't get sent
14:06<bighornram>faheem: just did reportbug --configure and it simply asks if i have an mta and then asks about a proxy. that's it
14:06<faheem>apparently not getting to exim
14:06<bighornram>also my email address and name etc. which it correctly identifies
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14:07<faheem>bighornram: weird
14:08<faheem>bighornram: if you type mailq does it show anything?
14:08<faheem>it should return nothing
14:08<bighornram>nothing
14:09<bighornram>how do i check the permissions that reportbug has?
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14:09<faheem>bighornram: what is your exim config, smarthost?
14:09<bighornram>maybe a permissions issue
14:09<faheem>bighornram: how do you mean?
14:09<bighornram>yes
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14:10<bighornram>well i can send mail from commandline but reportbug can't seem to
14:10<bighornram>maybe permissions of some kind?
14:10<bighornram>i know exim is working
14:10<bighornram>and not blocked
14:10<faheem>bighornram: don't think it is a permissions issue. but could be wrong
14:10<faheem>might be a routing issue
14:11<weasel>bighornram: have you verified that reportbug sends mail using your MTA?
14:11<faheem>like your return headers are screwed up. but should get to exim regardless
14:11<bighornram>weasel: that is what I think the issue might be. how can i check that?
14:12<weasel>as I told you, I don't know reportbug. why don't you just avoid it?
14:12<faheem>weasel: what else could it be trying to use?
14:12<faheem>weasel: because it is convenient?
14:12<weasel>faheem: smtp to bugs-master.
14:12<faheem>also it includes necessary info for packagers
14:12<weasel>most of which is almost always crap
14:12<faheem>they like that. and it is customizable, so they can say what info they want
14:13<faheem>weasel: the packagers don't seem to think so
14:13<weasel>I think so
14:13-!-k10 [~k10@151.66.150.57] has joined #debian
14:13<weasel>and I am one of them
14:13-!-k10 [~k10@151.66.150.57] has quit []
14:13<weasel>never yet has all this crap been useful to me
14:13-!-hscade [~debian@g229036191.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #debian
14:13<faheem>there was a heated discussion with the reportbug-ng guy once, because he wouldn't cooperate on that front
14:13<faheem>weasel: depends what you package i suppose
14:13-!-quaker66 [~quaker66@213.191.105.214] has joined #debian
14:13<weasel>anyway, reportbug doesn't work for him
14:14<weasel>so changing to something else would be a valid strategy
14:14<weasel>if only to get more data
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14:14<faheem>weasel: it should be fixable
14:14<faheem>i admit i don't have any ideas right now how to do so
14:14<weasel>it no doubt is
14:14<weasel>but it's just not time effective
14:15<faheem>bighornram: if you have some bugs to file right now, i suggest you do so using regular mail, and perhaps see if you can find a more specialized forum to ask in
14:15<faheem>bighornram: must be annoying. sorry.
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14:16<bighornram>faheem: is ok, will report via email.
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14:28<faheem>bighornram: random thought. try with reportbug-ng and see if that works
14:28<faheem>it is a different program
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14:51<bighornram>faheem: reconfigured reportbug to use text interface and not gtk and seems to have submitted successfully.
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14:52<Lethalman>bighornram, what problem did you encounter using reportbug gtk?
14:52<bighornram>Lethalman: doesn't send
14:53-!-enderst [~enderst@174.44.9.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:53<Lethalman>bighornram, you hit "Send" and it doesn't?
14:53<bighornram>yes
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14:53<bighornram>Lethalman: acts as if it completes the submission but it doesn't and there is no entry in mail logs
14:53-!-enderst is now known as Guest2189
14:54<bighornram>I reconfigured to use text instead and it completed and sent
14:54-!-urbinek [~urbinek@chello089074036205.chello.pl] has joined #debian
14:54<urbinek>hi
14:54<urbinek>how to burn CD image in .iso file on DVD disk ?
14:54<Lethalman>bighornram, does it say "you will receive an email blabla..." at the end of the submission?
14:54<urbinek>k3b says that i cant
14:54<bighornram>yes
14:54<urbinek>or i cant find an option
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14:55<bighornram>but never get a confirmation
14:55<Lethalman>bighornram, how did you reconfigure reportbug? maybe you used some different policies for mail sending? like smtp, etc.?
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14:55<Lethalman>could retry sending a test bug report (using --debug) with --ui gtk option?
14:55<faheem>bighornram: weird. sounds like a bug
14:56<faheem>did you report the reportbug issue?
14:56<Lethalman>faheem, looks like it changed the smtp configuration to me
14:56<Lethalman>*he
14:56<Lethalman>usually "send report" in the gtk interface falls back to the reportbug engine to send email, doesn't change between text and gtk
14:56<faheem>bighornram: with no input from you? that really sounds funny
14:56<bighornram>Lethalman: I ran reportbug --configure and it went through the setup questions again, I changed to text instead of gtk2
14:57<Lethalman>bighornram, ok could you do what I said please?
14:57<faheem>well, no different input from you, presumably...
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14:57<faheem>Lethalman: are you a reportbug maintainer?
14:57<Lethalman>faheem, the gtk part
14:57<faheem>Lethalman: ah, that's good
14:58<faheem>bighornram: i'd follow his instructions
14:58<Lethalman>yes I have to do update the gtk part lately :)
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14:58<faheem>bighornram: you are running sid?
14:58<bighornram>faheem: I'm running squeeze
14:58<bighornram>testing
14:59<bighornram>Lethalman: what did you say to do?
14:59<faheem>bighornram: ok.
14:59<Lethalman>bighornram, run reportbug --debug --ui gtk
14:59<Lethalman>create a fake bug report and send it
14:59<bighornram>K
14:59<Lethalman>it should mail the bug to your mailbox
14:59<Lethalman>errr --ui gtk2
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15:09<bighornram>Lethalman: this time it went through to a couple other prompts and completed. I got a confirmation email this time also. mainlog also indicates it sent.
15:10<Lethalman>bighornram, good, then there were some differences between your first configuration and the second configuration
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15:10<Lethalman>I think you can replace text with gtk2 in your ~/reportbugrc if you want to keep using gtk interface
15:10<Lethalman>thanks for your help bighornram :)
15:11<bighornram>awsome thanks!
15:11<drbombay>hello all, could some provide me a link on installing debian onto a raid0 running lvm2
15:12<EmleyMoor>drbombay: The installer lets you set up RAID and LVM "as you go"
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15:20<faheem>Lethalman: what was the problem?
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15:21<Lethalman>faheem, he re-run the configuration to switch to text, in the while he would have changed smtp configuration too
15:22<faheem>Lethalman: i see, you mean if he changed the smtp config, that would have broken reportbugs setup?
15:22<Lethalman>faheem, the problem was in "sending the mail", so yes that caused the problem
15:23<faheem>Lethalman: right, i meant the smtp/sending part of reportbug's setup
15:23<faheem>funny, my reportbug setup is basically blank
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15:28<leonardo>st
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15:28<leonardo>list
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15:40<sdsdsd>hello guys, if i make a backup of my partition (partimage), format my partition, and put my backup on computer again, errors on my partition will stop?
15:41<sdsdsd>im getting a lot of 'segmentation faults' these days
15:41<sdsdsd>(btw, im using Squeeze AMD64, 2.6.31-6)
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15:42<Gathond>I would guess not if partimage does what I think it does, i.e. makes an image of the whole thing including filesystem
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15:43<Gathond>what makes you think the segmentation fault is related to the partition and not the actual disk or memory/CPU/motherboard
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15:44<sdsdsd>humm, so i was thinking... there is a way to get a list of my packages and then format my partition and install all packages again?
15:45<sdsdsd>Well, after some segmetation faults, i get some errors and i have use fsck manually....
15:46<faheem>sdsdsd: segfaults often mean hardware problems. first thing i would do is run some hardware checks
15:46<faheem>particularly RAM
15:47-!-karbassi [~karbassi@v-209-98-44-65.ip.visi.com] has joined #debian
15:48<sdsdsd>and it is a Laptop, with hard disk... and I bring with me all the time... which indicates that I may have shocked him with something, and lost part of HD ...
15:49<sdsdsd>well, how to do a RAM test?
15:49<sdsdsd>How to do a complete hardware check?
15:49<faheem>memtest86+ for example
15:49-!-karbassi [~karbassi@v-209-98-44-65.ip.visi.com] has left #debian []
15:50<faheem>for RAM, that is
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15:51<sdsdsd>humm, i know memtest86+, but this way i'll have to restart computer...
15:51<sdsdsd>another checks, like processor and motherboard, how to do they?
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16:05<dzielny>ss
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16:13<Aleric>Is there a vuze toolbar for linux?
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16:14<valdyn>thank god no
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16:15<Aleric>I found one.. but don't trust them...
16:15<Aleric>they want to directly install something on my machine
16:15<Aleric>http://vuze.ourtoolbar.com/
16:15-!-poeta [~poeta@189.124.144.197] has quit []
16:16<valdyn>Aleric: thats not for linux
16:16<Aleric>oh well.. says System requirements "windows, Mac, Linux" at the bottom :/
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16:20<doubledutch>You don't want vuze anything.
16:20<valdyn>vuze is trash too, sure
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16:22<Aleric>What do you use then?
16:22<valdyn>Aleric: transmission is fine and neat
16:22<valdyn>Aleric: rtorrent is the best
16:22<Aleric>... to download torrents
16:23<valdyn>Aleric: ( but its a text interface )
16:23<Aleric>k
16:23<Aleric>huh
16:23<valdyn>Aleric: if you have used vuze you might want to try transmission
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16:24<titi_linux>hi, I(and my friends) extended the game glest a lot by making a very big new data package for it. ( megapack at http://www.titusgames.de )
16:24<titi_linux>Its all with proper licenses ( GPL )
16:24<titi_linux>Is this package an option to be included in debian?
16:24<titi_linux>Who and where do I have to ask if someone is willing to maintain/include it in debian?
16:24-!-titi_linux was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
16:24<valdyn>!wnpp
16:24<dpkg>For information on packages which are not in Debian but you think should be, check the Work-Needing and Prospective Packages list at http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp Also use the script wnpp-alert (from the devscripts package) to see what packages you are using that are in need of help.
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16:25<valdyn>oo
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16:27<titi_linux>hi, I(and my friends) extended the game glest a lot by making a very big new data package for it. ( megapack at http://www.titusgames.de )
16:27<sdsdsd>i used memtest86+ 4.0, and it found about 500000 errors, but when it comes at 25% my computer halt.
16:27<titi_linux>Is this package an option to be included in debian?
16:28-!-runev [~runev@129.211.251.212.customer.cdi.no] has joined #debian
16:28<titi_linux>Who and where do I have to ask if someone is willing to maintain/include it in debian?
16:28<sdsdsd>i think that may be an error on memtest86+ itself so ill try again with a older and stabler version
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16:30<sdsdsd>btw, it solves the error by itself? (like skiping bad blocks?)
16:30<sdsdsd>\
16:31<enderst>the only wat to solve the error is to replace the bad stick of ram
16:31<valdyn>sdsdsd: more likely your ram is just broken
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16:32<valdyn>!tell titi_linux -about wnpp
16:32<valdyn>titi_linux: find tarzeau on here or somewhere
16:32<sdsdsd>broken like "ill have to buy a new one" or like, "ill have to fix it with something"
16:32<sdsdsd>?
16:33<enderst>replace
16:33-!-ethoxyethaan [~nick@d51527565.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
16:34<sdsdsd>oh no...
16:34<sdsdsd>well, but the OS can just skip the broken parts?
16:34-!-massimo [~massimo@host187-202-dynamic.181-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Sto andando via]
16:34<enderst>nope
16:35-!-prahal [~prahal@dan75-7-88-166-184-3.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #debian
16:35<enderst>welllll yes, after you remove the bad stick ;)
16:36-!-silvering [~silvering@ip-92-53.lanultra.net] has joined #debian
16:36<enderst>try reseating it, maybe different slot
16:36<silvering>got a problem guys, fresh installed lenny doesnt mount usb on startup.. last week it mount it on /media/disk with shortcut on desktop and in the sidepane in thunar, now its nowhere
16:37<enderst>silvering: unplug/plug it in while watching dmesg
16:37-!-chattr [~mike@164.254.121.70.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
16:38<sdsdsd>i have two 1GB modules.. 2 slots... i belive that on linux i never used the other module
16:38<silvering>enderst thanks, but i'll have to go now in emergency case.. i`ll deal with this later
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16:42<titi_linux>valdyn who is tarzeau?
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16:45<titi_linux>ok, I'll try to find a forum where I can ask . byby
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16:47<valdyn>ooo, /whois tarzeau
16:47<valdyn>goner..
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16:51<T_X-->hi there, I just shrinked my encrypted ext3 partition with resize2fs. ehm, how can I determine the number of blocks for cryptsetup resize?
16:51-!-andrewk [~ak149@voodoo.cs.waikato.ac.nz] has joined #debian
16:52<box02>hello, I would like to know how many packages available for Debian GNU/Linux?
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16:52<abrotman>!dstats lenny
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16:53<dpkg>Debian Distro Stats on lenny... 22971 packages, 1933 maintainers, 59051 MB installed size, 20844 MB compressed size.
16:53-!-giorgos [~giorgos@ppp56-75.adsl.forthnet.gr] has quit []
16:53<abrotman>box02: as a rough guess ^^^
16:53<abrotman>and that's stable .. unstable would have more
16:53<box02>wow .. amazing .. thank you very much :-)
16:54-!-andrewk [~ak149@voodoo.cs.waikato.ac.nz] has quit []
16:54<abrotman>!dstats sid
16:55-!-dotslash [~frank@194.50.96.11] has joined #debian
16:55<dpkg>Debian Distro Stats on sid... 27280 packages, 2088 maintainers, 80581 MB installed size, 29777 MB compressed size.
16:55<T_X-->I read in a tutorial, that the the size for cryptsetup would have to be determined by trial and error with (g)parted, but I'm wondering if I could break anything if choosing it too small
16:55<box02>wow OMG .. :-)
16:56<box02>@abrotman Thank you so much. I'm very proud of being Debian user. :-)
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17:11<box02>hello abrotman, one more please, those all packages are under GNU license?
17:11<box02>All are Open Source?
17:11<abrotman>box02: the GPL? or open source licenses?
17:11<abrotman>box02: not sure if those numbers include non-free or not, but i'd guess they do
17:12<box02>yes GNU GPL or some other Open Source License?
17:12<box02>yeah abrotman, thanks
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17:12<eightyeight>hmm. i'm stuck. i grabbed the latest devel installer, as it supports putting down an ext4 filesystem, and it has the kernel with my lan card driver, but it won't boot
17:12<eightyeight>any ideas?
17:13<eightyeight>i _really_ would like to get ubuntu off this netbook
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17:14<abrotman>it won't boot?
17:14<abrotman>as in? it never even prompts you?
17:14<eightyeight>at the 'boot:' prompt, i should mention
17:15-!-adb [~adb@212.147.109.90] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:15<eightyeight>'expert' 'linux' or just plain <enter> bounces me back to "boot:"
17:15<eightyeight>so, i'm not loading the kernel
17:16<abrotman>eightyeight: perhaps ask #debian-boot
17:16<eightyeight>ok
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17:23<fgh>any good rssfeed with debian news?
17:23-!-pup_user____ [~pup_user@c-24-7-71-37.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #debian
17:23<pup_user____>hi. what's wrong with this line in a scrip?
17:23<pup_user____>"/usr/bin/mplayer -gui"
17:24<pup_user____>are my quotes in the wrong place?
17:24<weasel>there is no program called '/usr/bin/mplayer -gui'
17:25-!-SQlvpapir_ [~teis@188.177.95.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:25<weasel>you probably just want to get rid of the quotes, since there might be an mplayer that takes an argument -gui
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17:27<pup_user____>yeah.
17:27<pup_user____>got it already thx
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17:29<Nazcafan>hi
17:29-!-mase [~mase@e179166225.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #debian
17:29<Nazcafan>I wanted to report a bug, but reportbug also crashes
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17:30<Nazcafan>this is quite discouraging
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17:35<abrotman>Nazcafan: you can use your email
17:35<Nazcafan>I'll try that
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17:36<Nazcafan>abrotman, it is quite ironic that the very tool that is supposed to help users to send bug reports is to a certain extent not usable
17:37-!-mode/#debian [+l 396] by debhelper
17:37<abrotman>Nazcafan: are you using unstable ?
17:37<Nazcafan>testing
17:37<Nazcafan>which is the same, when it comes to reportbug (same version)
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17:46<peej>what do the curly brackets mean in the response to aptitude -s safe-upgrade? eg: libgpod4{a} linux-headers-2.6.26-2-486{a}
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17:49<peej>oh, {a} for automatically installed (man aptitude, -W option)
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17:57<faheem>Nazcafan: you could also try reportbug-ng
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17:58<Nazcafan>faheem, I just sent an email, hoping it will work
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17:58<faheem>Nazcafan: are you also reporting the reportbug bug? :-)
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17:59<Nazcafan>faheem, there are so many bug reports for bug report that I am unsure it hasn't already been reported
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18:00<Nazcafan>!paste
18:00<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: http://paste.debian.net/ http://pastebin.ca/ http://pastie.org/ http://pastebin.com/ or http://picpaste.com/ for pics. Use wikisend.com for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>.
18:00<Nazcafan>faheem, http://paste.debian.net/51630/
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18:02-!-elusivis is now known as elusive
18:03<confused1>hello, i have a problem with my source list i think. When i tried to install any software like apt-get install xchat , its giving me many dependencies. Also when i tried to apt-get update , its stucking at somewhere. Any suggestions ?
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18:05<Nazcafan>abrotman, I sent the bug report but never received any acknowledgement, how long is it supposed to take?
18:05<gsimmons>dpkg: tell confused1 -about bat
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18:06<faheem>Nazcafan: looks nasty. i
18:06<faheem>would still report it
18:07<faheem>this is the gtk2 version, yes?
18:07<Nazcafan>yes it is
18:07<abrotman>Nazcafan: can take up to an hour
18:07<faheem>the gtk reportbug maintainer was here earlier
18:07<gustux>hi! I'm having problems with sarg
18:07<gustux>can anyone help?
18:07<faheem>apparently not any longer
18:08<faheem>Nazcafan: is can take a while, depending how backed up the system is
18:08-!-box02 [~pkhtut@33-195-207-85.sevmorava.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:08<faheem>Nazcafan: you could use the text version
18:08<faheem>i think the gtk2 version is not so stable
18:09<Nazcafan>abrotman, I sent one many hours ago, and didn't receive anything, so I assumed reportbug had crashed, and sent another one by email
18:09<gustux>hum...
18:09<gustux>I installed on aptitude on the fly
18:09<gustux>=/
18:09<Nazcafan>gustux, sarge is quite outdated, and I am not sure it is still supported
18:09<faheem>gustux: are you actually using sarge?
18:09<gustux>aptitude search sarg ... and I install
18:09<Nazcafan>sarg
18:10<Nazcafan>aaah
18:10<faheem>Nazcafan: oh. sarg is a package?
18:10<gustux>sim
18:10<gustux>yes
18:10<gustux>sarg
18:10-!-ted [~ted@c-76-124-227-136.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #debian
18:10<Nazcafan>good evening
18:10-!-Nazcafan [~fou@ant06-1-82-242-110-209.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte]
18:10<faheem>Sarg is a Squid Analysis Report Generator ...?
18:10<gsimmons>gustux: You still need to define your problem.
18:10-!-ted [~ted@c-76-124-227-136.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit []
18:10<gustux>Apache created the squid-reports, only that there is nothing
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18:11<gustux>I do not think the sarg.conf, has nothing in the / ETC
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18:12<mase>gustux this might be ok (no /etc files) in the case sarg is just a application which you give the log files to
18:13<gustux>then he is running normal?
18:14<confused1>hello, i have a problem with my source list i think. When i tried to install any software like apt-get install xchat , its giving me many dependencies. Also when i tried to apt-get update , its stucking at somewhere. Any suggestions ? # http://paste.debian.net/51633/
18:14<gustux>q told me there is a configuration file sarg, the better I get the source code and install
18:14<gustux>thank's mase
18:15<faheem>gustux: installing from source is unlikely to help you, unless the debian package is really broken
18:15<faheem>this is lenny?
18:15<gustux>you all
18:15<mase>confused1 and whats "apt-get -f install" telling?
18:16<gustux>the reality is that I'm with the distribution backtrack, I'll change the etc / apt / sources to the debian lists
18:16<gustux>you all, thank's
18:16<confused1>mase: WARNING: POSIX threads library NPTL requires kernel version 2.6.8 or later. If you use a kernel 2.4, please upgrade it before installing glibc.
18:17<confused1>more detailed : http://paste.debian.net/51634/
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18:18<mase>confused1 wow, what kernel do you have? still an 2.4.xx? i had such an problem to, was very difficult to resolve...
18:19<faheem>confused1: what release are you running?
18:19-!-dante_2core [~dante@80-219-138-134.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:19<confused1>sorry im not good at debian, how can i learn my release ?
18:20<dr|z3d>uname -a
18:20<faheem>confused1: cat /etc/debian_version
18:20<mase>well, either "cat /etc/debian_version" which is not very reliable
18:20<dr|z3d>Try that from a terminal/console
18:20<confused1>Linux doby 2.4.27-2-386 #1 Wed Aug 17 09:33:35 UTC 2005 i686 GNU/Linux
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18:21<mase>confused1 i had this problem too, by the need of uprading kernel 2.4.xx to 2.6.xx
18:21-!-kneet [~chris@213.187.160.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:21<confused1>how can i upgrade it without cd
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18:22<mase>cant remember how i solved it because there were always conflicts (with initrd-tools etc)
18:22-!-kneet [~chris@home.chrissearle.org] has joined #debian
18:22<confused1>better i install from beginning right ?
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18:22<faheem>confused1: over the network. no, don't need to reinstall
18:23<faheem>confused1: what is cat /etc/debian_version?
18:23<confused1>cat: /etc/debian_version?: No such file or directory
18:24<faheem>confused1: ok, that's a bit scary
18:24<faheem>confused1: no, cat /etc/debian_version
18:24<streuner__>confused1: without questionmark...
18:24<faheem>no question mark :-)
18:24<confused1>ups 5.0
18:24<faheem>confused1: ok, lenny then
18:25<mase>but lenny should not use a 2.4.xx kernel...
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18:25<faheem>confused1: paste the output of apt-cache policy libc6
18:25<confused1>http://paste.debian.net/51635/
18:26<mase>you did an upgrade from etch to lenny sometime?
18:27-!-mode/#debian [+l 388] by debhelper
18:27<faheem>confused1: does http://paste.debian.net/51634/ correspond to apt-get -f install?
18:27<confused1>actually i started to work for some company, the old guy leave after i start. I mean already system was installed
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18:27<confused1>yes faheem
18:28<faheem>confused1: this looks a bit of a mess. your installation of libc6 is failing, and the old version still reports as installed
18:29<faheem>is may be worth trying to downgrade to the etch version of libc6
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18:29<confused1>what i have to do , any suggestion ?
18:29<faheem>apt-get install libc6=2.3.6.ds1-13etch
18:30-!-xPhilosx [~pbuster@gw9.umcaz.edu] has quit []
18:30<confused1>E: Version '2.3.6.ds1-13etch' for 'libc6' was not found
18:30<faheem>this might break your system, but you've got major problems alredy
18:30<abrotman>he's using lenny ?
18:30<confused1>5.0 lenny i think
18:30<faheem>abrotman: with a 2.4 kernel
18:30<faheem>and libc6 is not upgraded properly
18:30<abrotman>so .. aptitude install linux-image-<arch> libc6 ?
18:31<faheem>confused1: yes, give that a try
18:31<faheem>downgrading may be too risky
18:31<abrotman>is this a productino machine ?
18:31<confused1>i tried but gave me this error , E: Version '2.3.6.ds1-13etch' for 'libc6' was not found
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18:32<abrotman>confused1: what does uname -r say ?
18:32<faheem>apt-get install libc6=2.3.6.ds1-13etch5
18:32<confused1>2.4.27-2-386
18:32<faheem>missing the final 5
18:32-!-scientes [~scientes@174-21-207-238.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #debian
18:32<faheem>but maybe abrotman's approach is better, dunno
18:32<abrotman>confused1: aptitude install linux-image-486 libc6
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18:33<confused1>abrotman its running right now
18:33<confused1>Remove the following packages: webmin Score is -301 Y/n/q ?
18:33<confused1>yes ?
18:33<abrotman>if you're not using it .. sure
18:33<dr|z3d>webmin.. the entire channel will tell you "yes!" remove.
18:33-!-linkage [~linkage@85.112.65.252] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:33<dr|z3d>!webmin
18:33<dpkg>webmin is probably a lame web-based interface for unsafe system administration for Unix. Check it out at http://webmin.com/ Remember, dondelelcaro *hates* webmin. "i'd rather sit on the floor shoving table knives into live electrical outlets than run webmin on an exposed server." See http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/12/msg00790.html about the removal. Don't use their .debs, they are of extremely poor quality.
18:34<faheem>dr|z3d: funny quote
18:35*dr|z3d smirks.
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18:35<dr|z3d>-301 is the karma points you won't get if you don't remove..
18:35<dr|z3d>Go figure.
18:35*dr|z3d winks.
18:39<mase>is it possible to have two servers with mysql-servers, syncronising each other. the db-servers should have the same content. one of the server may get powered off some time and should get updated when he is up again
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18:40<abrotman>mase: mysql can do clustering ... see the documentation or ask #mysql on freenode
18:41<confused1>abrotman, i did aptitude install linux-image-486 libc6 . and i get error http://paste.debian.net/51637/
18:42<abrotman>confused1: put your sources.list in a pastebin
18:42-!-nteon [~nteon@ip68-105-188-72.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #debian
18:42<confused1>http://paste.debian.net/51638/
18:43<faheem>confused1: you can use paste.lisp.org, which has the advantages of allowing paste annotations
18:43<abrotman>so does paste.debian.net ?
18:43<faheem>abrotman: news to me
18:44<confused1>http://paste.lisp.org/+1XSL
18:44<faheem>confused1: have you tried running - apt-get -f install repeatedly?
18:44<abrotman>confused1: add "deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ oldstable main" to your sources.list
18:44<faheem>sometimes that can help
18:44<abrotman>this is going to be ugly
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18:44<confused1>abrotman i add it
18:45-!-peteinlux [~peteinlux@L3dc6.l.pppool.de] has joined #debian
18:45<faheem>is seems to want the etch 2.6 kernel for some reason
18:45<abrotman>confused1: aptitude update ; aptitude -t oldstable install linux-image-486
18:45<confused1>ok its running
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18:47<peteinlux>hello, im in a post aptitude update & upgrade situation. Nmap on localhost shows multiple services I never asked for, rcconf shows everything on. Is there a place where I can get a translation for these daemons?
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18:48<peteinlux>this is a vps, and I do not want a situation where the system does not boot, but also it would be nice to see if any of theses services could be usefull
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18:54<confused1>abrotman , now it gave me this # http://paste.debian.net/51639/
18:55<abrotman>confused1: did it install the kernel or not ?
18:55<confused1>its installed many things , how can i be sure ?
18:55<faheem>confused1: run - apt-get -f install
18:55<faheem>if everything is ok it will do nothing
18:56<abrotman>that won't work probably ..
18:56<abrotman>he'll probably have to say a very long prayer .. reboot the mahcine .. then finish the dist-upgrade
18:56<confused1>apt-get -f install giving me http://paste.debian.net/51640/
18:56<faheem>confused1: looks ok to me
18:57<faheem>confused1: yes, i'd reboot into the new 2.6.18 kernel now
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18:57<confused1>ok be right back , im going to disconnect probably
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18:59<confused1>rebooted
19:00<faheem>confused1: well, you can get online, that's good
19:00<confused1>Linux doby 2.6.18-6-486 #1 Sat Dec 27 08:57:46 UTC 2008 i686 GNU/Linux
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19:00<faheem>i'd now do an apt-get upgrade, followed by a apt-get dist-upgrade
19:00<faheem>or use aptitude if you prefer
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19:00<confused1>oh thanks its good now
19:00<confused1>thank you guys for share ur time for me
19:00<faheem>confused1: you haven't finished your upgrade
19:01<faheem>unless you want more problems, suggest you do that now
19:01<confused1>do i have to apt-get upgrade ?
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19:01<abrotman>confused1: remove that line i gave you earlier
19:01<abrotman>confused1: then we'll continue from there
19:02<themill>(s/stable/lenny/ should be on the todo list)
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19:02<confused1>ok the chat history deleted, what i have to do now abrotman
19:02<faheem>themill: i think he has that commented out
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19:03<abrotman>confused1: edit /etc/apt/sources.list .. delete the line that has the 'etch' in it .. and change everywhere that says 'stable' to say 'lenny'
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19:08<confused1>abrotman http://paste.debian.net/51641/ is this good ?
19:08<abrotman>confused1: comment out the 'oldstable' line
19:08<abrotman>and change everywhere it says 'stable' to 'lenny'
19:09<themill>and don't use ftp.debian.org
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19:09<faheem>confused1: take out or replace the ftp://
19:09<abrotman>confused1: actually .. let me fix it for you
19:10<confused1>would be better
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19:11<abrotman>confused1: http://paste.debian.net/51642/
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19:12<confused1>im going to clear everything and im going to paste ur link
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19:12<abrotman>the contents .. yes
19:13<confused1>ok done
19:13-!-nadjan [~francisco@189.84.228.253] has joined #debian
19:13<abrotman>confused1: aptitude update && aptitude install aptitude dpkg && aptitude full-upgrade
19:13<nadjan>ola a todos
19:13<nadjan>algum brasileiro aqui
19:14<abrotman>!br
19:14<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
19:14<abrotman>judd: info zabbix --release lenny
19:14<nadjan>nao sei como usar isso aqui
19:14<nadjan>estou aprendendo
19:14<abrotman>nadjan: #debian-br
19:14<nadjan>tem canal de ubuntun
19:14<abrotman>nadjan: #ubuntu-br on irc.freenode.net
19:14<confused1>is aptitude update mean same with apt-get update ?
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19:15<abrotman>confused1: please use aptitude
19:15<confused1>aptitude: command not found
19:15<nadjan>esta dizendo q nao existe ou esta errado o endereço
19:15<abrotman>confused1: apt-get update && apt-get install aptitude && aptitude update && aptitude install aptitude dpkg && aptitude full-upgrade
19:15<abrotman>nadjan: english ehre
19:15<abrotman>here
19:16<nadjan>alguem ai pode me ajudar
19:16<abrotman>nadjan: english here
19:16<themill>nadjan: /server irc.freenode.net ; /join #ubuntu-br
19:17<nadjan>deu a mesma mensagem
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19:17<nadjan>bom aqui serve
19:17<abrotman>nadjan: /server irc.freenode.net
19:18<themill>nadjan: É no irc.freenode.net. Não é sobre este servidor.
19:18<nadjan>bom ja coloquei esse ai de cima e diz q esta errado
19:19<nadjan> Endereço desconhecido. Enganou-se no endereço?
19:19<abrotman>!br
19:19<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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19:22<confused1>abrotman its seems going to take long time, still running . Do i need to do after these process finish ?
19:22<abrotman>depends how well it goes
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19:23<TERRIVELBR>ola tudo
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19:27<RobbieThe1st>Hi all
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19:38<confused1>abrotman, am i going to lose any of my configuration ? like iptables , squid ?
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19:39<abrotman>hopefull ynot
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20:03<gesichtslos>Has anyone experienced issues with their Compiz's 3D Desktop Cube's rotation keys not working?
20:04<gesichtslos>I have <ctrl><alt>Button1 but when I do it it just drags the blue selection box on my desktop. If I click the plugin on that off it will work for one rotation then get stuck again.
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20:32<inkbottle>Hi, I want gnome applet 'fortune' to call fortune with LANG=C; but if i put that in the preferences it doesn't work
20:32<inkbottle>it is the same with .desktop file (in case the two problems are related)
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20:39<faheem>abrotman: good job on fixing that upgrade
20:39<faheem>you have experience with such things?
20:39<abrotman>faheem: you mean totally breaking machines and rescuing them?
20:40<abrotman>faheem: personally i don't think so, but i've seen it often enough here
20:40<faheem>abrotman: well, you didn't do any of the breakage :-)
20:40<faheem>abrotman: no, i meant the rescue part
20:40<abrotman>well, he never said if it was successful
20:40<faheem>after someone else screwed up
20:40<faheem>abrotman: looked successful to me
20:40<abrotman>faheem: right .. i've helped others that had done the same thing
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20:42<confused1>its done , last message is Current status: 1 update [-250], 12842 new [-2].
20:42<abrotman>confused1: how is it working out ?
20:42<confused1>just finished
20:42<abrotman>confused1: you'll probably want to reboot
20:42<abrotman>!bless confused1
20:42<dpkg>O $DEITY, bless your child confused1, who is about to do something stupid and needs all the help you can give. Amen.
20:42<confused1>i hope i can get online again, lets see
20:43*abrotman thinks the humor got lost somewhere
20:43<faheem>amen to that
20:43<faheem>good luck, confused1
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20:44<confused1>here i am
20:45<confused1>where i have to look now
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20:46<confused1>Linux doby 2.6.26-2-486 #1 Wed Nov 4 20:19:07 UTC 2009 i686 GNU/Linux
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20:47<faheem>confused1: looking good. upgrade complete?
20:47<confused1>yes seems completed
20:47<faheem>!thank abrotman
20:47<dpkg>de rien, faheem
20:47<faheem>!thanks abrotman
20:47<dpkg>de rien, faheem
20:47<faheem>bugger
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20:48<confused1>thank you very much faheem & abrotman
20:48-!-XayOn_ [~xayon@85.251.10.246.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:49<faheem>confused1: you can now change your nick :-)
20:50<confused1>:) yes you are right
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20:51<abrotman>confused1: hold up a moment
20:51<abrotman>confused1: you'll want to look for packages that are left over from etch .. and you'll probably want a kernel more suited to your CPU
20:53<confused1>what i have to do
20:53<faheem>dpkg -l | grep etch
20:53<dpkg>No packages found matching | grep etch
20:53<faheem>would be a start
20:53<faheem>$ dpkg -l | grep etch
20:54-!-SQlvpapir__ [~teis@188.177.95.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:54<eightyeight>or you could 'cat /etc/debian_version'
20:54<eightyeight>hmm. nm
20:54-!-crazyb0y [~antov@zenith.knackery.net] has joined #debian
20:54<crazyb0y>anyone using dependency-based boot system?
20:55<eightyeight>solaris is
20:55<crazyb0y>squeeze too =)
20:55<faheem>crazyb0y: what is a dependency-based boot system?
20:55<crazyb0y>i'm having problems with migrating to dependency-based boot system
20:55<crazyb0y>http://wiki.debian.org/LSBInitScripts/DependencyBasedBoot
20:55<crazyb0y>heh =)
20:56<eightyeight>crazyb0y: you may be interested in upstart, if you're not already
20:56<abrotman>crazyb0y: what about it isn't working ?
20:57-!-mode/#debian [+l 366] by debhelper
20:57<crazyb0y>http://pastebin.com/m11c0f345
20:57<crazyb0y>http://pastebin.com/m3521ee84
20:59<crazyb0y>abrotman: i can't migrate, there's something wrong what i can't understand =)
21:00-!-helix [~e@amnesiac.heapspace.net] has quit [Quit: yo canto con pantalones]
21:00<abrotman>crazyb0y: it's telling you that your init scripts aren't up to par
21:00-!-Texou [~Texou@pat35-5-78-226-56-130.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: ++]
21:01<crazyb0y>abrotman: i have to rename them to 20firewall? 20openvpn? 20qmail.firewall?
21:01<abrotman>i don't think so
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21:02<crazyb0y>what is an LSB tag?
21:02-!-Holborn [~holborn@170.Red-88-26-182.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]
21:03<crazyb0y>The /etc/init.d/X script is lacking the LSB fields. Adding them to the script header or as a override file in /etc/insserv/overrides/X would solve it.
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21:04<alex__>good morning guys and gals
21:04<alex__>anyone about?
21:04<alex__>i'm pulling my hair out
21:04<crazyb0y>abrotman: but i dunno what is a correct LSB tag =)
21:05<abrotman>i'd guess the stuff at the top of the normal init scripts ?
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21:42<tonyd>Maybe this is a show of extreme linux ignorance, but does anyone know how to install a compiz theme in debian 5.0 using the xfce desktop?
21:42<sney>I found a howto online a while ago, but the fact of the matter is that compiz only likes gnome and kde, and the others you have to hack to make it work
21:43<sney>hopefully they will fix that in a future release
21:43<tonyd>What themes can I get? I was on an xfce site. What about beryl?
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21:44<tonyd>The themes with xfce are okay, but I want a better one. Maybe I should change desktop environments? Is there a better one? I did not care for kde it was kinda slow
21:46<tonyd>I like the windows transparency in xfce, does any of the others have that feature?
21:46<tonyd>**do
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21:53<tonyd>noone can offer their opinion? lol
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21:59<tuzi>?
21:59<tonyd>That's what I said lol
21:59<sney>tonyd: I don't think a lot of people here use compiz
21:59<sney>I tried it once, couldn't get it to work properly with xfce, forgot about it
21:59<tonyd>Well, It is a compiz/beryl theme.
22:01<tonyd>I just want some opinions on the various desktop environments. I like xfce better than gnome and kde, but I cant find any themes? if I did wouldn't be able to install them. I have compiz installed, but don't even know what it is or if it is doing anything at all other than taking up space
22:03<sney>compiz is a set of software for using your graphics accelerator to make the desktop. It's basically a bunch of eye candy. the most famous thing is the 'rotating cube' desktop switcher
22:03<goodger_>tonyd: compiz is a window manager that adds a large quantity of resource-intensive special effects to windows, most of which are implemented in order to make Ubuntu look cooler than Windows Vista
22:06<Nemoder>tonyd: install/run compizconfig-settings-manager to see all the stuff you can do with it
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22:08<leo>got grub 2 (squeeze) to recognise vista but when try boot into vista i get GRUB and nothing happens
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22:11<leo>i just have a blinking underscore
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22:14<abrotman>did you install os-prober too ?
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22:26<int_80h>hi guys
22:28<leo>abrotman, yes
22:28<leo>i'm going to have to give up unfortunately and use vista to control booting
22:29<leo>need to repair vista by tonight
22:29<sney>does vista do the same 2-partition thing as 7?
22:29<Krazyesko>anyone play quake live and dont have any issues ?
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22:31<int_80h>hope it's not rude to ask, but why do you say that leo?
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22:32<leo>i need to use vista tonight for a recording and have a job interview now so time is critical
22:33<leo>once i repaired vista, i don't know how to restore linux
22:33<int_80h>i boot vista and 7 from grub, no problems
22:33<int_80h>you can use a rescue cd or an emergency boot floppy...
22:33<leo>grub 2?
22:33<int_80h>im sure people have already gone over this with you, i'm late to the discussion (:
22:33<int_80h>i dont use grub 2
22:33<rjent>leo: Not sure what you need but you should consider a live cd to boot and do your work then take your time on the repair
22:33<int_80h>havent had time to learn the new syntax/havent had a reason to upgrade
22:33<rjent>live cd of flavor linux
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22:34<int_80h>yes, rjent has a good suggestion...you can kill two birds with one stone that way sometimes
22:34<rjent>I like debian-live but I am biased
22:34<leo>the install cd recognises vista when reinstalling grub but then it's not on the list
22:34<leo>until i go 'osprober'
22:35<rjent>forget all the problems and just use a live cd if time is of the essance
22:35<int_80h>i do not use osprober, i manually manage my grub entries
22:35<int_80h>booting vista or win7 is as easy as root, makeactive, chainloader +1 usually
22:36<leo>i think makeactive i could try on the grub2 win entry
22:36<leo>i would use a livecd but i don't have one
22:37<leo>unfortunately have a job agency interview to goto now
22:38<int_80h>good luck
22:38<leo>thanks rjent, i may download a live cd when i get back
22:38-!-leo [~user@ppp121-45-229-202.lns20.per1.internode.on.net] has quit []
22:38<int_80h>aw, no thanks for me
22:38<int_80h>:P
22:38<int_80h>okay guys, here's a question i've been mulling for a while
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22:38<int_80h>has anyone ever wanted to install something through apt that has unnecessary dependencies?
22:39<abrotman>such as ?
22:39<rjent>yes example please
22:39<int_80h>how do YOU get around them? you can force it to install but apt will not work after, or you can create a virtual package to fool apt into thinking the dependencies are there
22:39<abrotman>are you sure you don't mean Recommends ?
22:39<int_80h>no, i have recommends disabled
22:39<int_80h>i should be more clear
22:39<int_80h>i am sure the dependency is there
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22:39<int_80h>but it will run without
22:40<int_80h>e.g. i wanted to install kpat just now, and it wants esound, arts support, libavahi, etc
22:40<rjent>If a package has dependency that should be recommends then you should file issue with the maintainer
22:40<abrotman>because it probably depends on kdelibs .. which wants all that stuff
22:40<int_80h>right, so it is a multi-level dependency on stuff that the individual app does not strictly need
22:40<int_80h>i have had this issue before
22:41<int_80h>i wanted to install something the other day that wanted to install swsusp! which is clearly Not Necessary
22:41<int_80h>my point was not to start a discussion on the dependency system per se, but ask if anyone ever has the need to work around it that i perceive (:
22:43<Nemoder>you would have to rebuild the package from source to not use those dependencies
22:43<int_80h>yes, that is an option
22:43<int_80h>albeit a somewhat tedious one
22:44<int_80h>kpat runs fine without, for example, libavahi being on the system. although kdelibs wants it, it's not necessary for kpat
22:44<int_80h>so i can get around this with virtual packages MUCH easier than installing from source
22:44<Nemoder>in that case you would have to rebuild kdelibs to not require avahi
22:45<int_80h>i disagree with your use of 'have to', nemoder :P
22:45<int_80h>but i recognise this is your recommendation
22:46<tonyd>what is beryl is it better than compiz?
22:46<abrotman>beryl is dead
22:47<int_80h>beryl re-merged with compiz a while ago, tonyd
22:47<int_80h>you can read about it on wikipedia
22:47<Nemoder>afaik beryl was a fork of the original compiz that merged back into compiz fusion
22:47<tonyd>oh. is there a better alternative to compiz or is the alternative to do without?
22:47<int_80h>what's your problem with compiz?
22:47<int_80h>is it not doing something you need?
22:48<tonyd>nothing really a problem just don't know how to set it up and I am using xfce,
22:48<int_80h>xfce does not have a manager that can be replaced by compiz atm, afaik
22:48<tonyd>Is there a desktop environment better than xfce?
22:49<int_80h>everyone uses what is best for them (:
22:49<int_80h>i use fluxbox, many MANY people use gnome, or KDE
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22:49<int_80h>so 'better' is too relative for me to say
22:49<rjent>Is gome smaller in footprint wrt memory than kde4?
22:50<int_80h>i dunno. check the 'size' field for kdelibs and kde-data vs gnome-core maybe?
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22:51<tonyd>I did not care for kde or gnome, I am a 24 year windows user so I need something close to familiar and easy for the novice to figure out. It seems like rocket science to do the simplest things to me. Like finding where my porograms are installed so I can add a shortcut to my panel, lol
22:51<int_80h>i don't think most people use gnome or kde if they care about footprint
22:51<int_80h>imo
22:51<int_80h>tonyd, windows is not natural to use. you spent 24 years using it
22:51<int_80h>nothing will be as easy to you immediately as windows is now
22:52<int_80h>but gnome is probably as easy to use for a complete noob as windows is
22:52<int_80h>they are quite similar in some respects
22:52<int_80h>i hope that made sense, haha
22:53<tonyd>I am not computer illiterate by any means, but I just don't know how to do the things I want to do in linux. Can anyone suggest a good guide online to teach myself?
22:53<tonyd>and yes it made sence
22:53<tonyd>sense
22:54<tonyd>sorry got a baby in one arm typing with the other
22:55<int_80h>tonyd, i learned originally but learning one task at a time. figure out something simple you can't do yet, and learn it
22:56<int_80h>the more of these tasks you figure out the broader your knowledge will become, as you learn the 'linux way' of doing things
22:56<int_80h>you may also start to be able to discern between those tutorials written for the gui and those for the cli, and i find the cli tutorials to be more explanatory
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23:16<spazztic665>sorry to bother again guys but...is it possible to lan Debian with a windows vista and if so...can linux connect to the internet using the windows vista internet connection?
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23:24<itsosimpo>hello friends! just got a new laptop and i want to install debian in one partition. what distro is best for these specs: Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo (2.2 GHz) ?
23:25<itsosimpo>err, here: http://reviews.cnet.com/laptops/toshiba-satellite-a505-s6980/4507-3121_7-33776110.html?tag=psum
23:26<sney>good choice, toshibas are usually pretty good for driver support
23:26<itsosimpo>yeah that's what i hear too
23:26<itsosimpo>i'm on a compaq presario right now
23:26<itsosimpo>the driver support is okay
23:26<itsosimpo>great for my wireless
23:26<sney>wireless is such a grab bag
23:27<itsosimpo>haha i hear that toshiba's internal wireless is supported in some linux distros
23:27<itsosimpo>i hope it works fine with mine
23:27<sney>lately toshiba has been using some little realtek USB wifi adapters inside the case, which is a supported device
23:27<itsosimpo>the only problem i've had with this distro on my compaq is my ipod shuffle
23:27<itsosimpo>but that was resolved easily with a python script
23:27<itsosimpo>nice
23:28<sney>so what do you mean by "which distro?" debian is only one
23:28<sney>if you're talking about debian-based stuff they have their own channels and are not supported here :P
23:29<itsosimpo>err i mean.... i'm confused about the architecture
23:29<sney>ahh
23:29<itsosimpo>this is intel core2 duo, is it i386?
23:29<sney>i386 and AMD64 will both work
23:30<itsosimpo>hm, it's interesting that AMD64 will work
23:30<sney>amd got there first so they get the architecture name. Debian amd64 is for any x86_64 cpu
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23:31<itsosimpo>i thought intel always releases stuff first
23:31<sney>not every time
23:32<sney>Intel still downplays x86_64's advantages, and will probably continue to do so until 4GB+ ram amounts are more common
23:32<spdupee>is there any good sit to see how to config apache2 to allow user directories?
23:32<int_80h>may i take this moment to recommend, while we're on the topic, that new users not run amd64, as you may (will) have some issues that have complicated workarounds
23:33<sney>spdupee: http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/
23:33<itsosimpo>hm i'm guessing i386 is 32 bits?
23:33<sney>int_80h: heh, it seems to vary from machine to machine, but yes. i386 is better supported.
23:33<sney>itsosimpo: bingo
23:34<itsosimpo>how about ia64?
23:34<sney>ia64 is not for yours
23:34<sney>it's for a different kind of CPU that intel makes for high-end servers
23:34<sney>completely unrelated to i386/amd64/etc
23:35<int_80h>the itanium :D :D
23:35<itsosimpo>oh that sounds fancy. okay well i'm going to take advantage of 64 bits computing
23:35<int_80h>flash probably won't work for you
23:35<int_80h>if you're using a desktop
23:35<itsosimpo>i'm going with the amd64
23:35<int_80h>that's the most immediate issue
23:36<itsosimpo>int_80h: why won't flash work for me?
23:36<sney>int_80h: he may need backports/squeeze for wifi support anyway. Toshiba likes the RTL8187B for wireless and that's only supported by 2.6.27 and later
23:36<itsosimpo>oh
23:36-!-rjent [~rjent@dpc674450141.direcpc.com] has joined #debian
23:36<itsosimpo>hrm.
23:37<sney>itsosimpo: if you have a wired network connection available, don't worry about it. get the base system installed and come back. helping with wifi is one of the things #debian is great at
23:37<int_80h>see, this is why i recommend 32bit for desktops at this time
23:37-!-siskulous [~sisk@ip68-103-211-66.ks.ok.cox.net] has joined #debian
23:37<int_80h>i run 64 on my servers
23:38<itsosimpo>oh it's not a desktop, it's a laptop: http://reviews.cnet.com/laptops/toshiba-satellite-a505-s6980/4507-3121_7-33776110.html?tag=psum
23:38<sney>itsosimpo: if you don't have more than 3.5GB of ram, you won't notice a difference between i386 and amd64, so you migh as well go with i386 for the better software support/fewer bugs
23:38<itsosimpo>i have 4 gigs
23:38<faheem>sney: he might add more ram later, though
23:39<itsosimpo>and i might add more :) :)
23:39<sney>and he already has 4 gigs
23:39<faheem>itsosimpo: what is your mb ram capacity?
23:39<faheem>sney: not that much these days
23:39<faheem>the machines i regularly work on have 64 gig
23:39<sney>faheem: yeah. I'm still chugging along with 2G here
23:39<faheem>depends what you are doing, i suppose
23:39<sney>definitely
23:40<int_80h>itsosimpo: it's up to you, just be aware of the challenges you will face. flash doesn't run natively in 64 (there is a plugin, but it's alpha)
23:40<int_80h>so you'll need to run a 32bit browser
23:40<faheem>itsosimpo: flash works fine on 64bit
23:40<int_80h>which means maintaining a 32bit library setup
23:40<faheem>i use it
23:40<faheem>on lenny at least
23:40<int_80h>it is alpha. it crashes a lot on my boxes. which are lenny
23:40<sney>works in squeeze too
23:40<siskulous>I run that 64 bit flash plugin....It's a real PITA.
23:40<int_80h>so you see, there is a mixed reception
23:40<sney>ok, so it's a "maybe works" as opposed to a "doesn't work"
23:40<itsosimpo>yeah i've been on debian for less than a year
23:40<faheem>int_80h: flash crashes all the time anyway, where 32b or 64 :-)
23:40<sney>maybe is much better
23:41<int_80h>haha I am not telling anyone not to use 64, I just want the poor fellow to know he may have some troubles!
23:41<int_80h>it IS harder, unquestionably, to run 64bit
23:41<faheem>int_80h: fair enough
23:41<itsosimpo>i'm on compaq 32-bits, 3 gigs ram
23:42<faheem>personally, not that big a deal either way i think. my home machine is 32b, office machine 64b
23:42<itsosimpo>that's okay i'll atleast have other partitions to run applications if i need them
23:42<faheem>i haven't noticed much difference in usability at all
23:42<sney>and you can always bounce back to windows if you get completely lost
23:42<sney>brb, rebootin'
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23:42<siskulous>I will say this: I run 64 bit Squeeze on 2 machines and the only trouble I have is with Flash.
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23:43<siskulous>One of those machines is a Toshiba Satellite, though not the model you linked to.
23:43<sney>I changed my mind
23:43<sney>I got lenny running on a satellite a210 without too much trouble a while ago
23:46<faheem>when people say flash here, are they talking embedded in a web browser (which is the only way I use it) or something else?
23:46<faheem>i think embedded flash is the major reason my web browsers crash.
23:47<siskulous>Bah....my GoogleFu sucks tonight....Anyone know where I can find the changelogs for the radeonhd driver?
23:47<faheem>siskulous: changelogs.debian.net or just go to packages.qa.debian.org and follow links
23:47<siskulous>Thanks
23:48<itsosimpo>oh boy i just realized that this is the server channel
23:48<faheem>i think there is a link to the changelog from packages.qa.debian.org from every source package page
23:48<faheem>itsosimpo: ?
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23:51<sney>itsosimpo: this is the general #debian channel, but probably more people run linux on servers than on desktops/laptops
23:52<itsosimpo>oh okay, thank you
23:52<int_80h>itsosimpo yeah but all the desktop people come here anyway, don't worry about it
23:52<sney>it's only bad when they're actually running ubuntu and expecting us to help :|
23:53<int_80h>hahaha i cannot understand why they would do that, ubuntu has about three times the user-level support debian does
23:53<int_80h>still happens, though
23:53<itsosimpo>yyeah i'm not exactly sure why i like debian better than ubuntu
23:54<itsosimpo>i think i actually learn more using debian
23:55<faheem>itsosimpo: ubuntu is a snapshot of debian. they are not different things
23:55<faheem>the fact that people think this is a triumph of marketing
23:56<itsosimpo>faheem: what's wrong with that?
23:57<faheem>itsosimpo: what's wrong with what?
23:57<itsosimpo>that i think ubuntu is a triumph of marketing
23:57<faheem>itsosimpo: um, not sure i follow
23:57<faheem>maybe i was being unclear
23:57<siskulous>Bah, it's a snapshot of the unstable branch with junk added that makes it less stable. At least that was my experience with it.
23:57<itsosimpo>yeah, could you clarify?
23:58<itsosimpo>if it's less stable why does it look so much flashier?
23:58<faheem>what i meant to say was, the fact that people think Ubuntu is different from Debian is a triumph of marketing
23:58<faheem>itsosimpo: flashiness and stability have little to do with each other
23:58<itsosimpo>oh, i see.
23:58<siskulous>stability != flashiness.
23:58<itsosimpo>yeah, um.
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23:59<siskulous>Admittedly, my experience with Ubuntu is way out of date though. They may have improved in the three years or so since I last loaded it up to look at.
23:59<faheem>actually, if the whole Ubuntu business has shown anything, it is how important marketing is
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23:59<faheem>for years you couldn't get people to review the new Debian release
23:59<Xenguy>absolutely agreed. they are pushing the envelope, and that necessarily entails less stability - it's just common sense (and also my own experience)
23:59<siskulous>Yeah, they've got the marketing aspect down, which is good for Linux in general.
---Logclosed Mon Nov 16 00:00:15 2009