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#debian IRC Logs for 2011-01-23

---Logopened Sun Jan 23 00:00:38 2011
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00:16<Esteban_>has anyone here ever got module-assistant to work? I'm at my wits end ...
00:17<sney>several times in fact
00:17<sney>what module are you trying to assist?
00:17<Esteban_>sney: cool!
00:17<Esteban_>sney: /usr/src/modules/lirc-modules/lirc_dev.c:35:28: error: linux/autoconf.h: No such file or directory
00:18<Esteban_>ive been using make-kpkg for my headers on another machine
00:18<sney>start from the start
00:18<sney>what debian release, what kernel, what module
00:19<Esteban_>squeeze custom-local-version lirc-modules-source 0.8.3-5
00:19<Esteban_>i havent used module-assistant for a long time, because I never got it to work
00:20<Esteban_>i thought it might have had something to do with my "local-version"
00:20<sney>it likely does
00:20<Esteban_>so I'd always found a way around it
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00:20<sney>since you built your own kernel, why not just make your own module?
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00:20<Esteban_>but I tried making the same kernel without local version, and module assistant had the same error
00:21<Esteban_>sney: that sounds like a plan
00:21<Esteban_>i've been using make-kpkg since the start of 2.6 ... sooo
00:21<Esteban_>remind me how I make the module manually again :-)
00:21<Esteban_>or point :-)
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00:22<sney>module-assistant is just a tool to streamline dropping extra modules into debian's prebuilt kernels. if you're building kernel trees on your own, there's no point when you can just go to your kernel tree, enable the module in make menuconfig, then make modules (I believe that's the correct target, 'make help' will tell you for sure), find the correct .ko and then bung it into your /lib/modules/`uname -r`
00:23<Esteban_>I'm not really building the tree on my own tho
00:23<Esteban_>just using a custom config
00:24<sney>it's fantastically easy once you've been around the block a few times.
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00:24<sney>almost all the modules/options are well documented within make menuconfig
00:26<Esteban_>yeah, the lirc modules are outside the kernel tree pre 2.6.36
00:27<Esteban_>i tried the 2.6.36 in kernel tree lirc modules, but the changes confused the hell outta me, so I'm trying to use the last with the old method
00:27<sney>lirc likely has documentation to patch them into the tree, or someone's documented it somewhere
00:28<Esteban_>because that method is at least documented
00:28<Esteban_>ok searching
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00:33<Esteban_>the more I read about lirc and ~2.6.3[5-6] the more I think I'll leave it well alone a few months :(
00:33<sney>on the other hand, Esteban_
00:33<Esteban_>the module assistant error seems to be pretty common tho
00:33<sney>just an idiot check here - is your kernel source tree symlinked to /usr/src/linux ?
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00:34<Esteban_>yes, but m-a prepare fucks with it
00:34<Esteban_>it renames the link linux-OLDVER... and moves the link to linux-headers-...whatever it wants
00:34<sney>you only need to do m-a prepare the first time you install module-assistant
00:34-!-jester54 [] has joined #debian
00:34<sney>so you can fix the symlink, then do your m-a a-i lirc?
00:38<Esteban_>yeah i tried that
00:38<Esteban_>i'll start again just to be suyre
00:38<Esteban_>purged it all
00:38<Esteban_>sudo dpkg-reconfigured lirc-moduels-source for mceusb
00:38<Esteban_>sudo m-a preparing ....
00:39<Esteban_> Getting source for kernel version:
00:39<Esteban_>Kernel headers available in /usr/src/linux-headers-
00:39<Esteban_>and it freaks with the symbolic link again
00:39<Esteban_>linux-OLDVERSION.1295761135 -> linux-
00:39<Esteban_>linux -> linux-headers-
00:40<Esteban_>as opposed to linux -> linux- as it was
00:40<sney>my question is why are you running m-a prepare at all
00:40<Esteban_>i just reinstalled m-a
00:40<Esteban_>so i shouldnt have done the prepare?
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00:41<sney>well, all m-a prepare does is set up the header symlink and install build-essential
00:41<Esteban_>indeed that is what it seems
00:41<sney>assuming build-essential is and has been installed, m-a prepare is useless to you
00:41<Esteban_>ok i'll put it back the way it was before the prepare
00:42<sney>and just do your build command without it
00:42<Esteban_>ok sudo m-a a-i lirc --text-mode
00:42<Esteban_>now the issue I have is
00:42<Esteban_>/usr/src/modules/lirc-modules/lirc_dev.c:35:28: error: linux/autoconf.h: No such file or directory
00:42<Esteban_>linux / autoconf.h doesnt exist ANYWHERE in my system
00:43<sney>autoconf.h *is* in the standard header package
00:43<jester54>m-a prepare wont hurt anything if you run it...
00:43<Esteban_>it is in generated / autoconf.h or similar in all the headers
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00:43<sney>jester54: if he's using a nonstandard source tree it will, see above
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00:44<Esteban_>it does exist:
00:44<sney>it should be located at /usr/src/linux-headers*/include/linux/autoconf.h
00:44<Esteban_>but now after running module-assistant, linux/autoconf.h is pointing elsewhere!
00:45<Esteban_>the symlink has been moved again
00:45<Esteban_>so linux/autoconf.h wont work
00:45<Esteban_>as linux -> linux-headers-
00:45<Esteban_>and now linux-OLDVERSION.1295761347 -> linux-
00:45<sney>oh well
00:46<sney>this is starting to bother me as well so I'm going to see if my amd64 machine will build it
00:46<sney>just for consistency, what's the CIR port type?
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00:47<sney>my options are 'standard' and 'digimatrix'
00:47<Esteban_>i sudo dpkg-reconfigured just mceusb2 mceusb
00:47<Esteban_>and for that question i used standard
00:47<Esteban_>the next question i cant remember ... :/
00:47<Esteban_>i think i just used the defaults
00:47<Esteban_>then reconfigured lirc-modules-source for mceusb and mceusb2 only
00:48<Esteban_>god damnit
00:48<Esteban_>the machine i was working on, just fell asleep!
00:48<sney>hmm, failed over here for different reasons, but now I've got the source tree to poke at
00:48<Esteban_>I'm on i386
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00:49<Esteban_>but i initially compiled all my kernels on an AMD64 machine chroot debian32 for the machine with the remote
00:49<Esteban_>i think that makes sense
00:49<Esteban_>anyway, it's faster :-)
00:50<sney>my amd64 machine is severely faster than the i386 one, if I'd offered to do the compile here we'd still be waiting :P
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00:50<Esteban_>i couldnt get cross-compiling to work to save myself
00:50<Esteban_>with make-kpkg
00:50<Esteban_>so i gave up and built the chroot
00:51<sney>cross-compiling is a royal pain
00:52<Esteban_>good news! I thought it was just me ...
00:52<sney>I got it to work... once. in 2002. On PowerPC. and I have no idea how
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00:53<Esteban_>the planets aligned and there was a simultaneous solar flare/coronal mass ejection
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00:55<Esteban_>i mounted the kernel tree into tmpfs too, sped up the compile a bit/saved the ssd lots of garbage collection or whatever
00:56<sney>ok, so since this seems to be consistently broken, my next place to send you is for the package lirc-modules-source
00:56<Esteban_>the bug process scares me
00:56<sney>and see how common your issue is
00:56<sney>no filing, just reading
00:56<Esteban_>I'm only little :-)
00:56<Esteban_>ok cool
00:56<Esteban_>i'll have a good read
00:56<Esteban_>thanks so much for your help man
00:56<Esteban_>debian rocks
00:56<sney>no problem
00:57<Esteban_>7 machines and counting :-)
00:57<Esteban_>(slowly subverting all my work machines)
00:57<sney>haha word
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01:20<brandon><-IRC noob here, just wondering how this works? i am having an issue installing windows in a virtual machine and i am having some issues, is this a good place to look for help?
01:21<sney>a windows channel would be better suited
01:21<brandon>thank you
01:21<sney>do /server and then do /join #windows
01:22<brandon>thanks again :)
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01:22<brandon> /server
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01:59*bintut waves
02:00<bintut>i'm planning to add the full path /var/www/html/project-one/dir1/dir2/*.swf to my php apc.ini's apc.filters directive so that all the files with an extension of .swf should not be cached.. what is the correct way to have it comply to POSIX extended regular expressions?
02:00<bintut>what i did was -^\/var\/www\/html\/project-one\/dir1\/dir2\/*\.swf$ but i'm not sure if it really works properly or not..
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02:13<lulzyboy>guys, ive added unstable to my apt-get and managed to screw up my system
02:13<lulzyboy>how can i repair it, its lenny
02:16<streuner>lulzyboy: what does "dpkg -l libc6 | tail -1" say?
02:17<lulzyboy>how the hell do i get the line
02:17<streuner>just run /exec -o dpkg -l libc6 | tail -1
02:18<lulzyboy>i cant get | to run it
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02:18<streuner>copy and paste?
02:18<lulzyboy>only have access to single user
02:18<lulzyboy>so in terminal on there
02:19<streuner>well, how are you able to added unstable to sources.list then?
02:19<lulzyboy>what are you pressing to get |
02:19<lulzyboy>i added that BEFORE it screwed it
02:19<lulzyboy>apt-get upgraded, rebooted and now it hangs on boot
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02:20<lulzyboy>how are you getting |?
02:21<streuner>so it just stops at the fsck process?
02:21<streuner>but it boots the kernel?
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02:21<lulzyboy>then it hangs at nfs
02:22<lulzyboy>all i can do
02:22<lulzyboy>is get it to show ¦
02:22<lulzyboy>not |
02:22<streuner>just use a live CD and make changes
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02:23<lulzyboy>however, running without tail-1, i get desired: unknown/install/remove/purge/hold
02:23<lulzyboy>status not/inst/half
02:23<streuner>sure, you need to be root...
02:23<lulzyboy>however it says libc6 2.11.2-9
02:23<lulzyboy>im root
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02:24<streuner>what mount say about / ?
02:24<streuner>its only ro?
02:24<lulzyboy>/dev/sda1 already mounted or /busy
02:25<streuner>/dev/sda3 on / type jfs (rw,noatime,errors=remount-ro)
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02:26<streuner>anyway, you are running not stable/lenny anymore
02:26<lulzyboy>syntax error
02:26<streuner>just backup your important data and reinstall
02:26<lulzyboy>the problem i have
02:26<lulzyboy>i cant backup anything
02:26<lulzyboy>so is there an option to REPAIR
02:26<lulzyboy>rather than reinstall
02:27<streuner>why arent you able to backup?
02:27<lulzyboy>how can i
02:27<lulzyboy>i have no access to it
02:27<streuner>via LIVE-CD
02:27<lulzyboy>cant you just repair without?
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02:28<dpkg>VATTENE VIA!
02:28<nutshell>is there a way i can join server on xchat?
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02:29<TheScene>I need help installing apt-get on iphone plz
02:30<streuner>dpkg, listkeys iphone
02:30<dpkg>Factoid search of 'iphone' by key (1): iphone.
02:30<nutshell>is there a way i can join server on xchat?
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02:32<TheScene>I need to install apt-get , got the tar , wher eDo I untar and dpkg ?
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02:37<lulzyboy>The first CD/DVD disk contains all the files necessary to install a standard Debian system.
02:37<lulzyboy>To avoid needless downloads, please do not download other CD or DVD image files unless you know that you need packages on them.
02:37<lulzyboy>does this mean i can apt-get the rest of the pacakges?
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02:50<sney>lulzyboy: yes
02:51<cahoot>TheScene: if you have dpkg - simply dpkg -i the deb?
02:51<lulzyboy>right btw
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02:51<lulzyboy>i removed the problem of samba
02:51<lulzyboy>now its up i have no network
02:51<lulzyboy>ifconfig just shows loopback
02:51<sney>what if you do 'ifconfig eth0 up'
02:51<sney>or wlan0, if you're on wireless
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02:52<lulzyboy>shows as running
02:52<lulzyboy>but broadcast running multicast
02:52<lulzyboy>no ip
02:52<sney>dhclient eth0
02:52<lulzyboy>ok it got an ip now
02:53<sney>nothing wrong then, just not set to do it automatically
02:53<lulzyboy>theres lots wrong lol
02:53<lulzyboy>now its up
02:53<lulzyboy>you can ssh in if you want
02:53<sney>nothing wrong with your lan connection, anyway
02:54<lulzyboy>the install is still screwed
02:54<TheScene>where can I find apt-get ?
02:54<sney>that's ok, I'm sure you can sort it out without giving anyone else access to your computer
02:54<sney>TheScene: I didn't know apt was available for the iphone.
02:54<lulzyboy>i cant
02:55<lulzyboy>server:~# dpkg -l libc6 | tail -1
02:55<lulzyboy>ii libc6 2.11.2-9 Embedded GNU C Library: Shared libraries
02:55<lulzyboy>i can do it now
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02:58<EmleyMoor>How, from a Debian system, can I create a FreeDOS boot USB stick?
02:58<sney>get the freedos boot image, then do cat foo.img > /dev/bar
02:58<sney>where bar is /dev/sdb or whatever your usb stick comes up as
03:04<EmleyMoor>sney: That easy? Hmmm... will check it out
03:05<sney>mkdosfs can't create bootable volumes so you need a premade image. syslinux may also be necessary, depending on what freedos offers
03:05<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... all that stick does when booted is print "FreeDOS"
03:06<sney>maybe the md5sum doesn't match, but you're on the right track I think
03:06<cthuluh>I boot freedos using pxe, works fine
03:06<sney>oh, after the cat part sometimes it helps to 'sync' a few times to make sure the write isn't cached
03:08<EmleyMoor>cthuluh: Details?
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03:09<yang_>hey, why is there no insight package available?
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03:10<EmleyMoor>yang_: What is "insight"?
03:10<yang_>graphic end of gdb
03:10<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... ODIN image just gives lots of ".Error!."
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03:11<sney>yang_: ask the maintainer. looks like it was in lenny but not squeeze
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03:12<yang_>the gdb maintainer?
03:12<cthuluh>EmleyMoor: that's weird. my freedos image is 2.5MB large => I can't remember where I have found it. otherwise, it's a plain pxe boot using memdisk
03:12<sney>yang_: actually, looks like your answers are here:
03:13<cthuluh>EmleyMoor: oh yeah, I had taken it from SystemRescueCd
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03:14<yang_>Ah.. nobody wanted it.
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03:24<EmleyMoor>Still getting no further with FreeDOS
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04:07<Rapsodius>Hi! I have an old computer, and having trouble with my disk, want to use ata instead of scsi module, how can i achieve this?
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04:07<Rapsodius>Hi! I have an old computer, and having trouble with my disk, want to use ata instead of scsi module, how can i achieve this?
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04:12<dpkg>The people here are volunteers, your attitude should reflect that. Answers are not always available.
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04:14<yang_>Rapsoduis i may not be able to help at all . you mean you want to switch SATA drives out of ACHI mode?
04:14<yang_>Rapsoduis - often times that can be done w/ the BIOS by setting the controller in compatibiltiy mode
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04:17<Lantizia>Hey can someone double check my logic? For our server we don't want two passwords to log in (just one)... yet we disable & lock root as people try to guess roots password... and sudo asks for YOUR password not the targets (root)... so ultimately I'm disabling sudo asking for a password... as if you'd got in as our non-root user then you'd already know the password it's asking for anyway... and we had it asking for another password (roots - but it
04:17<Lantizia> could stay locked) then we'd be back to two passwords again... which we don't want
04:17<Lantizia>Logical - I think :D
04:18<yang_>I think a good root password is important because of single user mode and physical security failure
04:18<Lantizia>s/and we had it asking/and if we had it asking/
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04:18<yang_>and you can disable root login on all terms but one w/ PAM
04:18<Lantizia>yang, yeah but you can get to that via sudo su
04:18<Lantizia>yang, I just use passwd -d -l
04:18<yang_>which ruins the point of sudo
04:19<yang_>loging etc. if all your sa's sudo su then you have no loging
04:19<Lantizia>ah but our non-root user is only there because root is off... our non-root user is still there for the system admin only
04:19<Lantizia>thus if you know our non-root users password - that is good enough
04:19<Lantizia>but you'd obviously need to guess both our username & password (not just password) to get in
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04:21<yang_>Whats the point of locking root? - to avoid brute force and a known user name? fix. set /etc/securetty and strong root pw known only to Senior SA and implment good sudo policy + loging
04:21<yang_>and you want sudo to prompt for pw always
04:21<Lantizia>we don't want to allow logging in as root as it's a known username... but don't wan thte hassle of updating two passwords (both the non-root admin user and the root user)
04:21<Lantizia>thus why leave a password for root at all?
04:21<yang_>idea is single user mode
04:22<yang_>attacker cant hit machine in single user mode if UID 0 has pw
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04:22<yang_>if you disable login w/ PAM on all but physical console any way it equailvant
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04:22<yang_>also SUDO should always ask for pw! idea is idle consoles arnt grab and sysadmins have to think about commands
04:23<yang_>just like an are you sure?
04:23<Lantizia>yang, the fact they enter "sudo" before everything they _really_ need to do is thought enough
04:23<Lantizia>the point here is to NOT have two passwords... you're not following this
04:24<yang_>there identical
04:24<yang_>its one pw entered twice if you make it the users pw
04:24<Lantizia>if both the root password and admin password is the same... then why have sudo ask for a password at all?
04:24<Lantizia>be it the targets or the users?
04:24<yang_>roots pw shouldn't be the sys admins pw
04:24<Lantizia>but we don't want two password - period
04:24<cthuluh>security by obscurity. what if the used login becomes known?
04:24<Lantizia>those are the conditions of my question
04:24<Lantizia>take it or leave it
04:24<yang_>the idea is that the SA must enter his pw to run a command as root thus not 2 pw 1 pw entered twice
04:25<Lantizia>no i don't see why 1 pw should be entered twice either
04:25<Lantizia>ok lets start over...
04:25<yang_>confirmation , prevents idle terms
04:25<Lantizia>root is locked (pw removed) and disabled (no logging in)
04:25<Lantizia>sudo is installed
04:25<Lantizia>admin has a password and can use sudo without it asking for a password
04:26<cthuluh>yang_: obviously Lantizia doesn't like when you say he's wrong. why continue arguing?
04:26<bartm>yang_, what cthuluh said
04:26<yang_>cthuluh: bartm: too bad huh? his box will get owned and when sys admins walks away from computer
04:27<Lantizia>why will it! that is insane
04:27<yang_>because i come up to your computer after distracted sys admin walks away
04:27<Lantizia>were just substituting the user "root" for another username
04:27<cthuluh>Lantizia: you had no security by locking the root password.
04:27<cthuluh>Lantizia: exactly
04:28<yang_>forget the root thing. thats an issue but meh
04:28<yang_>worry about sudo w/ NO password
04:28<yang_>i distract your admin
04:28<Lantizia>I am adding security by not keeping a known username
04:28<yang_>grab his computer
04:28<cthuluh>Lantizia: security by obscurity. period.
04:28<yang_>sudo ownedyourcomputer i dont need a password
04:28<Lantizia>yang, you could say the same about leaving yourself logged in as root though!
04:28<yang_>yes you could
04:28<Lantizia>so it's a mute point!
04:28<yang_>because how many sudo users are there?
04:29<yang_>and what did i say to do w/ root?
04:29<Lantizia>to replace root ONLY
04:29<Lantizia>this is what I keep saying... were only having 1 extra user and the use of sudo to replace root
04:29<yang_>ok i understand what your doing
04:29<yang_>but still a problem
04:29<yang_>you ruin the point of sudo
04:29<Lantizia>so if your stupid enough to walk away as logged in as admin then your stupid enough to walk away as root too
04:30<yang_>the idea of sudo isn't to replace root
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04:30<Lantizia>no but that's what I'm using it for
04:30<yang_>its to allow multiple users root access and LOG who , when why
04:30<Lantizia>root can't be renamed
04:30<Lantizia>well i don't need that
04:30<yang_>root can be renamed
04:30<yang_>its not good practice
04:30<Lantizia>yeah and break _maaaany_ things
04:30<cthuluh>oh, please, my ears
04:31<Lantizia>so lets not go there
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04:31<yang_>the idea of sudo -- admin access multiple users audited logged and revokable when your admins leave
04:31<Lantizia>sudo will still log if not using a password anyway
04:31<yang_>but who did it?
04:32<yang_>they all use same account
04:32<yang_>ruins logs.
04:32<yang_>how do you revoke privllages?
04:32<Lantizia>the point of this isn't to have multiple logins - it's to replace 1 login with another
04:32<yang_>admin leaves?
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04:32<cthuluh>Lantizia: your admin will never type sudo anyway. he'll do sudo bash, done. no logging except /root/.bash_history
04:32<Lantizia>cthuluh, sudo su more likely
04:32<cthuluh>Lantizia: whatever
04:32<yang_>which ruins sudo
04:33<yang_>what do you get by renaming root?
04:33<yang_>your trying to avoid brute forcing root but you can help that w/ PAM anyway
04:33<Lantizia>right well within the confines of my original question (no two passwords, and 1 user to replace another only, no need for logs)... you've spotted no security holes
04:33<Lantizia>BUT! you don't like the general idea anyway
04:33<Lantizia>that is fine
04:34*EmleyMoor is still getting nowhere trying to create a FreeDOS USB stick for maintenance use
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04:34<cthuluh>Lantizia: the big security hole is that you believe that acting so adds security to your system. this reasoning is flawed. thus, there is a security problem
04:34<yang_>its bad practice , your doing things the wrong way .. not using sudo correct, but if you dont care about any of that its not insanely dangerous . just stupid
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04:34<Lantizia>I just don't NEED or WANT multiple users! OK!
04:35<Lantizia>that was _NEVER_ the question
04:35<yang_>how many system admins do you have?
04:35<Lantizia>only a couple will know this password for these boxes
04:36<ml|>Lantizia: READ what people are telling you, but do what you want it is your machine; good luck
04:36<Lantizia>which there are going to be many - MANY boxes on several customers sites...
04:36<Lantizia>ml|, read every word - but it's not the question I asked
04:37<cthuluh>oh, god... those systems are going to be distributed in several places?
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04:37<Lantizia>adding in each and every sys admin that may/may-not need access and remembering where we added them or didn't on all these systems that are customer owned and stamped out like coins... it'd be a hassle to manage
04:37<yang_>while, like cthuluh said security by obscrutiy but your idea althought rapes the who idea of security in general is not explicted doing anything usefull for you or dangerous other than making your believe you know what you are doing.. when you dont
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04:38<Lantizia>yang, no it's just _you_ can't accept the limitations of the circumstances
04:38<cthuluh>I'm already laughing, thinking about the guy that'll have to recover a box in single user mode. with a root account blocked. fun!
04:38<Lantizia>yang, I have my own boxes which I _do_ have multiple users which I choose to/or-not grant sudo access
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04:38<Lantizia>I get the point - really I do
04:38<Lantizia>but in this case it won't be done
04:38<bartm>Lantizia, do you?
04:38<yang_>i mean for gods sake at least require a pw for sudo
04:39<Lantizia>yang, why when it's the same god damned pw?
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04:39<yang_>because admins can walk away
04:39<yang_>specially on site
04:39<bartm>Lantizia, it's basic sudo use
04:39<Lantizia>yang, how does a sudo pw help if they walk away? lol
04:39<ml|>yes, atleast use sudo correctly
04:39<yang_>becuase i dont know it
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04:39<yang_>and i cant walk up to term and rm all your date + backups
04:40<Lantizia>yang, again! if your stupid enough to leave your admin user logged in - then you're as stupid to leave root logged in if it was enabled
04:40<yang_>i agree so dont allow root to login - but have a root pw
04:40<yang_>and force sudo pw
04:40<bartm>Lantizia, no, the difference is correct sudo use, asking for a password
04:40<yang_>then walk away problem is fixed
04:40<Lantizia>yang, and sudos's default behaivour is to only ask once in a while for the pw anyway
04:40<yang_>yeah but sudo -k
04:41<Lantizia>yang, so if someone walks up it shortly after... dun dun dunnn
04:41<yang_>yeah true
04:41<yang_>kill the timeout in the PAM modules
04:41<cthuluh>Lantizia: OK. for twenty minutes you've repeated over and over the same arguments, and you were repeated that you were wrong. are you going to keep on this way? do what you want, live and let live
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04:41<Lantizia>having it ask pw _everytime_ will only make people do 'sudo su'
04:41<cthuluh>Lantizia: please. stop.
04:41<Lantizia>which means it was pointless asking for the pw twice
04:41<yang_>alright your win your right
04:42<Lantizia>lol I'm not trying to win anything here - just demonstrating my track of thought
04:42<ml|>you can make sudo ask for pwd each time before use iirc; Lantizia wins yay ;)
04:42<yang_>and its one hundred percent correct
04:42<Lantizia>you've helped me see the extea possible angles though
04:42<Lantizia>so thanks
04:42<yang_>you should rewrite the securing debian howto
04:42<bartm>everybody except Lantizia is wrong
04:42<Lantizia>no they aren't!
04:42<cthuluh>yang_: the backtrack one, rather
04:42<Lantizia>jesus your taking this personally
04:43<yang_>in all serousness no hard feelings man
04:43<Lantizia>I can't help the limits OK!? there _can not_ be more than 1 user... it's not my choice!
04:43<yang_>its funny
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04:43<Lantizia>yang, thanks :P
04:43<Lantizia>you too
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04:44*bartm hums depeche mode's "wrong"
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04:45<ml|>whoever made that choice should be raked across coals then ;)
04:45<Lantizia>ml|, it's a distro we are making so this is it's default set up when you install
04:46<yang_>Lantzia your making a distro?
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04:46<Lantizia>yang, nearly done in fact
04:46<bartm>Lantizia, what's the name of the distro?
04:46<Lantizia>only for internal use mind you
04:46<Lantizia>bartm, doesn't have one yet
04:46<Lantizia>phone system
04:47<yang_>Lantzia: lfs or debian remaster?
04:47<bartm>phone system... a good name might be "phony"? :)
04:47<cthuluh>could only be a remaster
04:47<Lantizia>yang, squeeze based
04:47<mikeyb>What's the point in making a distro, unless it is for an embedded system or something like that?
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04:47<Lantizia>mikeyb, it is
04:47<yang_>Lantzia: well in all seriousness consider reading this
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04:48<yang_>Lantzia its intresting, even if you dont follow all of the practices.
04:48<ml|>yang_: was about say the same
04:48<Lantizia>yang, have read it before
04:49<ml|>good time too look it over again I think
04:49<yang_>the irony
04:49<yang_>So what does your company do?
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04:49<yang_>What will you be using your new distro's for ?
04:50<Lantizia>it's a phone system
04:50<Lantizia>uses asterisk from our repo's
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04:50<yang_>ah. nice. VOIP gatways ? or POTS ?
04:51<Lantizia>both - but in this new version we are dropping support for internal cards... so POTS via SIP gateways
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04:51<Lantizia>were moving as many of our physical box customers onto virtual systems as possible
04:51<Lantizia>99.9% use SIP providers anyway
04:51<yang_>Lantzia : who will be hosting?
04:51<EmleyMoor>I would like to see a list of the files in "mbr", but seems to have a problem
04:52<cthuluh>EmleyMoor: use apt-file
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04:52<cthuluh>or just install it, it's cheap
04:53<yang_>so what you are creating is more of an appliance?
04:53<Lantizia>yang, yeah gives you asterisk. hylafax, kannel - and the appropriate customer-friendly frontends for them
04:53<cthuluh>ugh... GNU rcs build uses some crap called ./ damn slow
04:54<Lantizia>yang, we have our own debian and freepbx repo's... I've debian packaged the freepbx framework for the purpose
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04:54<Lantizia>not the modules - just the framework ... since freepbx has it's own way of updating
04:55<yang_>Lantzia - never used them not a telephony guy ! Customers use IP phones that hit the virtualized appliances servers that you host?
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04:56<Lantizia>yang, hopefully that'll be true in most of the cases - some customers will want to hang on to their physical boxes (some are tiny via c3 cpu based boxes with tiny SSD's)
04:56<Lantizia>but more fool them... no HA :P
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04:58<yang_>lantzia: whats the virtilzation solution?
04:58<Lantizia>yang, unfortunately it's vmware esxi... not my choice
04:58<Lantizia>i use kvm myself
04:58<mikeyb>nothing wrong with vmware!?
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04:58<Lantizia>mikeyb, not free
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04:59<yang_>so the physical konsole is always secure then provided your ESXI server is secure
04:59<Lantizia>yang, indeed
04:59<mikeyb>But sometimes that's nota bad thing as you have paid support.
04:59<Lantizia>mikeyb, exactly why they've gone for vmware :P
04:59<yang_>how do you plan to hit the virtual boxes ? SSH or from the Physical ESXI client soft?
04:59<Lantizia>i'm hoping proxmox 2 will give them pause for thought :P
05:00<Lantizia>yang, SSH
05:00<yang_>while that be the only viable way of getting a shell provided the other phone services are secure?
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05:00<Lantizia>yang, indeed
05:01<Lantizia>well you can always go on the console if desperate
05:01<mikeyb>I just started a new job working for a company that uses opensource for everyting, after coming from a company that uses microsoft and .net for everything.
05:01<Lantizia>mikeyb, we are currently half and half ourselves
05:01<ml|>!congratulate mikeyb
05:01<dpkg>Good show mikeyb, you did it!
05:02<yang_>how will you do ssh? pw based or RSA ?
05:03<Lantizia>yang, pw... and yeah I'm aware we can do it with keys but remember this is an appliance
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05:03<mikeyb>I have 4 years experence programming c# professionaly. But I do notice that most people that are network admins of windows networks, and even most .net developersdon't know much at all!
05:04<yang_>a possible advantages w/ keys is you can have diffrent SA admins manage diffrent sets of customers and have them have only keys to needed boxes.
05:04<Lantizia>already aware :)
05:04<Lantizia>me thinks your poking holes
05:04<yang_>i dont understand the phrase poking holes
05:04<yang_>in what?
05:04<Lantizia>ok doesn't matter
05:05<Lantizia>ok rephrase... searching for problems
05:05<mikeyb>Lantizia, can't you just make the password retry time quite long and it will be retty secure?
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05:05<yang_>meh. more of a boncing ideas off you for me own gain
05:05<yang_>allows me to think about how i would set it up
05:05<Lantizia>yang, ok, that's ok then :)
05:06<Lantizia>just this channel seemed to me pretty hostile a moment ago
05:06<Lantizia>and for things that are seriously out of my control
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05:06<yang_>i think was rage for your own benefit kindof thing
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05:07<mikeyb>Guess it is because you are ripping off debian to make you own distro :P
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05:07*EmleyMoor is trying yet another method to get FreeDOS onto a stick
05:07<Lantizia>mikeyb, I'm not ripping it off at all - how on earth have you called that one?
05:07<Lantizia>mikeyb, it's no different than installing debian and running a script... it's just bundled on it's own ISO
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05:08<mikeyb>Wow just joking!
05:08<Lantizia>it is _still_ debian, and it will still be advertised as debian, and it still uses debian repo's
05:08<Lantizia>well it doesn't translate
05:08<yang_>meh what is ubuntu?
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05:08<yang_>i dont think that was the issue
05:08<Lantizia>yang, ubuntu is ubuntu - it's a proper fork
05:08<mikeyb>Actually it sounds like quite a job you have commited to.
05:09<Lantizia>stuff like dreamlinux and linux mint (debian edition) I consider to be debian though
05:09<yang_>kindof? the resync w/ debian and mod every 6 monthes.
05:09<Lantizia>yang, but it is entirely forked and copied/managed elsewhere
05:09<cthuluh>EmleyMoor: if you ever want to try freedos, you know what you have to do ;)
05:09<yang_>yeah thats true. just the resync w/ debian thing.
05:09<Lantizia>where as sidux/mint(debian)/dreamlinux use debian's repo's
05:10<Lantizia>no resyncing needed, not true forks
05:11<yang_>yeah just in my mind if it was a "proper fork" ( whatever that means) then they would have stop syncing with debian and repackaged / developed indepdantly from there on out
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05:12<Lantizia>shaggy_, i like how they're not a "proper fork" then... it means people take one look and realise where they need to go to get the original and best :)
05:12<shaggy_>Lantzia i went from knoppix -> Kubuntu -> Debian
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05:12*bartm from fedora -> Debian
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05:12<shaggy_>Ah i hate fedora
05:12<shaggy_>rpm sucks
05:13<shaggy_>chkconfig sucks
05:13<Lantizia>S.u.S.E -> Red Hat -> Fedora -> Debian -> Ubuntu
05:13<shaggy_>the redhat / fedora way i have always disliked.. maybe because i started debian based.
05:13<Lantizia>when I say Debian though - that was sarge lol - not very desktop friendly lol
05:13<Lantizia>for servers though I use nothing but debian
05:13<zem>mandeake->redhat->fedora->debian->ubuntu->debian XD (with ocasonal suse/knopix/others i don't remember)
05:14<cthuluh>sarge was nice
05:14<mikeyb>I did a hop from Red hat -> suse -> slackware -> Debian
05:14<s_i_m>in my case it was Slackware -> Debian
05:14<Lantizia>shaggy_, yeah I avoid RH based stuff myself now... the 2 phone system distro's i'm replacing with this are RH based
05:14<shaggy_>cthuluh who are you to the debian project btw ? you always seem extremly knowledgable.
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05:16<mikeyb>How about generating a unique admin user for each box!?
05:17<cthuluh>shaggy_: huh? nothing but a random user. and I could question your last sentence
05:17<cthuluh>shaggy_: though perhaps, one day...
05:17<Lantizia>mikeyb, rather like that idea - but we'd need to note it down each time we did an install
05:17<mikeyb>Not really, you just need to hash the name of the machine.
05:18<shaggy_>cthuluh: i didn't mean to imply anything lol im just a random user also. i just kindof guessed you were a developer because you always are around and know a hell of a lot more than i do
05:18<Lantizia>mikeyb, and if the hostname changes? :D
05:19<mikeyb>Then it will be fun times! But I'mguessing you can always mount the disk image if someone screws up.
05:19<Lantizia>not as easy if a physical box - gotta drive out there
05:20<Lantizia>i'm ok with it being the same username
05:20<Lantizia>it's got a good strong password anyway
05:20<shaggy_>at least anagram the user name
05:20<Lantizia>shaggy_, it's not dictionary
05:20<mikeyb>Well you could use a hash of the nic mac address
05:20<Lantizia>mikeyb, which nic? :D
05:21<shaggy_>IE. companyname "Joes Crab Shack" -> "jcsadmn"
05:21<shaggy_>its bad security
05:21<mikeyb>Damn it
05:21<shaggy_>its guessable
05:21<Lantizia>oooh crabs :P
05:21<Lantizia>shaggy_, yeah it's guessable but the password isn't
05:21<shaggy_>do all machines have same pw?
05:21<cthuluh>Lantizia: what? the username will be the same on *each* box running your system? and you think that's better than "root"?
05:22<cthuluh>that's completely ridiculous
05:22<Lantizia>cthuluh, no i don't think that's better - but it's the task at hand - again not decided by me
05:22<shaggy_>if all machines have same pw ill take one of your hosted appliances crack pw and own all your customers lol
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05:22<mikeyb>I have a phone server in the garage, but it has a seperate network port you have to use to use to get a console.
05:22<Lantizia>shaggy_, no diff passwords
05:23<shaggy_>THANK GOD
05:23<cthuluh>Lantizia: get rid of that job, dude...
05:23<Lantizia>cthuluh, pays well - can't lol
05:23<shaggy_>job requires same user name per box?
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05:24<Lantizia>been told to have root disabled (so yeah they believe in security through obscurity)
05:24<Lantizia>i guess they could have diff usernames per box
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05:24<shaggy_>print out securing debian howto and ask them to read and decide again. Security failure in the IT world cant mean an end to your company
05:25<cthuluh>Lantizia: again, did you think about the need of booting into single user mode? how can you do that with root pw disabled?
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05:25<Lantizia>cthuluh, don't need a root pw to get in on single user mode
05:25<shaggy_>cthuluh: maybe im wrong here but i swear it just drops you @ root prompt
05:25<shaggy_>yeah it does
05:25<Lantizia>you can get in to any box without the root pass
05:26<shaggy_>if you boot single user mode you get root prompt if root account is disabled
05:26<mikeyb>you have to type the password?
05:26<cthuluh>if you access grub and boot with init=/bin/bash, then yeah
05:26<shaggy_>only if account exists and has pw
05:26<mikeyb>Oh right
05:26<Lantizia>cthuluh, exactly
05:26<Lantizia>but we pw grub though
05:26<shaggy_>cthuluh yeah thats true but also single user mode @ least in ubuntu with root locked produces root prompt no pw prompt
05:26<bartm>a different pw? ;)
05:26<cthuluh>shaggy_: ubuntu ;)
05:26<Lantizia>bartm, no! :D lol
05:27<Lantizia>they want _one_ master password
05:27<Lantizia>for better or worse
05:27<shaggy_>cthuluh: never tried debian lol i also have root pw
05:27<Lantizia>that is what they want
05:27<shaggy_>tell them the problem w/ master pw! that whole backdoor thing
05:27<shaggy_>what if employee gets fired lol . you gunna change master password on everysingle box?
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05:28<Lantizia>shaggy_, indeed - that's what they used to do at my last job ... you should have seen the day I left :P
05:28<Lantizia>i had access to everything at that ISP
05:29<shaggy_>so master password applies to your sudo user? or just grub?
05:29<shaggy_>and sudo users all have same user name?
05:29<shaggy_>and pw?
05:30<Lantizia>if you end up having custom usernames and custom passwords per EVERY BOX... then you end up with engineers making spreadsheets of them
05:30<Lantizia>which is what my current employer has been known to do before
05:30<Lantizia>and then looses them
05:30<shaggy_>that you gpg encrypt?
05:30<Lantizia>on trains, buses, etc
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05:30<bartm>shaggy_, with one master passphrase :)
05:30<Lantizia>me? no - THEY make excel spreadsheets with standard password on them :)
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05:31<shaggy_>lol will can i 'try' your appliance distro and get a list of your customers ?
05:31<shaggy_>security testing reasons of course
05:31<Lantizia>how would you get a list of our customers from installing a copy of the distro through?
05:32<shaggy_>i asked for that in addition to lol
05:32<Lantizia>oooh - umm no :P
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05:32<shaggy_>they way you describe it your boss my loose that spread sheet on a train any way
05:32<Lantizia>oh they have before now
05:32<shaggy_>where is any of the security. if you company can't maintain any kind of confidential info i cant imagine how its been around @ all.
05:33<Lantizia>last 9 years I'm told
05:33<shaggy_>financial info, cust info. etc. specially being an IT company and a service provider
05:33<Lantizia>i've only been there since may
05:33<shaggy_>ouch. i work @ a Retial Store doing tech work and they have better security
05:34<Lantizia>if you have 1 user/pass for servers... no spreddy needed - easy to remember - but bad to change when someone leaves or it gets "found out"
05:34<Lantizia>if you have diff user/pass then you end up with spreddys and engineers fobbing off with excuses of "I couldn't get in"
05:34<shaggy_>you have got to store configueration information any way store in some way
05:35<@Ganneff>i do think you got a bit offtopic already, so:
05:35<dpkg>#debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
05:35<Lantizia>shaggy_, shall we? :D
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05:35<Lantizia>Ganneff, done :P
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05:44<EmleyMoor>My laptop is not playing DVD video - though my desktop does - both running squeeze... laptop says: "An error occurred - Could not read from resource" in "Movie Player". In xine, the initial copyright message and logo work, then "Error: The source can't be read. Maybe you don't have enough rights for this, or source doesn't contain data (e.g. not disc in drive). (Error reading NAV packet.)"
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05:45<bartm>EmleyMoor, maybe a hardware problem
05:45<EmleyMoor>bartm: Hmmm... how to prove?
05:45<cthuluh>I'd try with vlc, though
05:46*EmleyMoor is just checking something...
05:46<cthuluh>perhaps with vlc from debian-multimedia, if the one from main doesn't work well
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05:47<EmleyMoor>Ah, laptop was missing libdvdcss2
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05:56<grummund>Hi, anyone know if pdftk will append a ps file to a pdf file?, or do i need to use ps2pdf first and then cat the two pdf files with pdftk?
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06:00<s_i_m>grummund, you can do this with gs
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06:02<s_i_m>gs -dBATCH -dNOPAUSE -q -sDEVICE=pdfwrite -sOutputFile=result.pdf f2.pdf
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06:04<grummund>s_i_m: thank you
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06:05<s_i_m>pdftk is an overkill in most cases, imo
06:06<grummund>seems a convenient way to cat two pdf files (which is all i have used it for)
06:06<grummund>sledge hammer / nut. perhaps...
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06:08<themill>doing that with gs used to degrade the quality of the original pdf; don't know if it still does.
06:08<s_i_m>well, it depends
06:10<themill>it would rasterise everything making nice blurry text etc
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06:13<s_i_m>just checked joining two pdf (articles from NJP). no degradation; the size is about the sum of the two originals.
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06:16<sammy>quien ahi ahi??
06:17<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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06:37<Lantizia>Any particular advantage in a swap partition rather than file... and if not then why do distro installers still make you a partition by default instead of a file?
06:37<Lantizia>(obviously a file is easier to resize even if your using lvm)
06:38<petemc>it used to be that using a file was much slower, i dont think thats as true now
06:38<s_i_m>swap partition is faster if that matters to you
06:38<Lantizia>only benefit then? (however minor)
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06:39<s_i_m>is hibernate possible with a swap in a file? (never tried)
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06:50<s_i_m>after a short read-up: possible, but either with uswsusp (which is a pile of crap, imo), or with kernel's swsusp but then an offset to the swap header must be given as a kernel boot parameter.
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06:54<lord_rob>Hi ! Isn't it possible to change grub splash screen with update-alternatives ? I thought so ...
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06:55<petemc>lord_rob: look in /etc/alternatives
06:56<s_i_m>why it should be done with alternatives? I do not have any splash screens, but I guess it is done with dpkg-reconfigure
06:57<babilen>lord_rob: do you mean grub2's background image?
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06:59<lord_rob>babilen: YES
06:59<lord_rob>babilen: sorry for caps
07:00<babilen>lord_rob: No problem (I interpreted that as excitement) -- You could install desktop-base and edit "/usr/share/desktop-base/"
07:00<babilen>Not quite sure if that is "The Way™"
07:02<s_i_m>that is for sure not the best way. the files on /usr should not be changed by the admin.
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07:03<lord_rob>actually apt-file told me about grub2-splashimages
07:03<babilen>s_i_m: Yes, my thought exactly. But /etc/grub.d/05_debian_theme sources that file -- /usr/share/doc/desktop-base/README.Debian indicates that running "update-alternatives --config desktop-grub" allows you to " select standard or widescreen version(s)"
07:03<lord_rob>which I'm installing right now
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07:04<babilen>Just a collection of splash images (and probably a way to set them)
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07:05<s_i_m>babilen, I see. Still looks a bit strange to me that the alternatives are used for that, but why not, if that is just replacing a file...
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07:05*s_i_m wonders why people want to install these splash screens...
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07:06<babilen>s_i_m: I would have expected this setting in /etc/default/grub -- but /usr/share/images/desktop-base/desktop-grub.png (e.g.) is specified in /usr/share/desktop-base/ -- It might be worth a try to search for that file in other configuration files ... *shrug*
07:06<s_i_m>well, I guess, splash screens are installed by default on any recent system...
07:07<babilen>s_i_m: The 1-second beauty when you boot 100 times a day should not be missed!
07:07<lord_rob>s_i_m: If I could I'd prefer start grub text
07:07<babilen>lord_rob: Well, check some of the update-alternative invocations given in /usr/share/doc/desktop-base/README.Debian
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07:09<babilen>lord_rob: You most definitely want to play with desktop-base -- comment in /etc/grub.d/05_debian_theme is "# this allows desktop-base to override our settings" before /usr/share/desktop-base/ is sourced. I can't tell you how that file is *meant* to be edited though
07:09*s_i_m still uses grub-legacy and is not going to throw it away
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07:10<Lantizia>is there some kind of tool for deleting older kernels you don't need?
07:10<cahoot>aptitude purge
07:10<babilen>Lantizia: ^^^^
07:10<Lantizia>but they have the same package name don't they?
07:11<cahoot>how could they?
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07:11<s_i_m>no, there is the version in the name
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07:11<Lantizia>ah so I upgrade a metapackage then?
07:11<Lantizia>and they conflict
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07:11<lord_rob>I see I'm gonna look for that thanks babilen
07:11<Lantizia>no they don't conflict thus the old one stays there - i see
07:12<Tiff>the old one always stays
07:12<babilen>lord_rob: Good luck -- Let me know how far you get with update-alternatives and dpkg-reconfigure desktop-base (grub2 is still a bit of a mystery for me, and I end up reading the scripts in /etc/grub.d/ to understand what is going on)
07:14<s_i_m>btw, does squeeze install on ext4 by default?
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07:15<babilen>lord_rob: But to make it clear: editing /usr/share/desktop-base/ and specifying a different background and running "update-grub" should give you a different background. I am just not sure if that is the canonical way and would therefore try reconfiguring/update-alternativeing desktop-base (see /usr/share/doc/desktop-base/README.Debian)
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07:18<Lantizia>does anyone know where I can find out how the d-i determines the recommended size for swap and also /boot ?
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07:26<lord_rob>babilen: googling gave me that
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07:27<lord_rob>update-grub once and that's all
07:28<lord_rob>or I don't even know if I need to do that twice because I suppose it's done by default
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07:30<babilen>lord_rob: I think that editing /etc/grub.d/05_debian_theme is even worse than editing /usr/share/desktop-base/ -- The latter is already sourced in there and apart form the fact that is in /usr and not in /etc it seems to be a more sensible choice for changing the background
07:31<babilen>lord_rob: Have you tried the update-alternatives invocations outlined in /usr/share/doc/desktop-base/README.Debian ?
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07:32<babilen>lord_rob: I am not saying that it won't work -- but look at for a change to 05_debian_theme proposed by KiBi
07:36<lord_rob>yes actually that was exactly what I was looking for
07:36<lord_rob>So I was wasting my time and yours ...
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07:37<babilen>lord_rob: The README of grub2-splashimages suggests changing the WALLPAPER variable in 05_debian_theme to a different value. That variable is not set in 05_debian_theme but in (which is sourced in 05_debian_theme)
07:38<babilen>lord_rob: Don't worry -- I think that there must be a better way. Have you tried the methods outlined in /usr/share/doc/desktop-base/README.Debian ? I haven't tried them yet, but they might just be what you are after.
07:38<lord_rob>not yet ;)
07:39<lord_rob>and I can't try any method without rebooting my system
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07:40<lord_rob>and now it's lunch time :) so I'll try later
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07:41<babilen>lord_rob: It seems to adjust the symlink for /usr/share/images/desktop-base/desktop-grub.png (link to /etc/alternatives/desktop-grub) to your choice. I would expect other background images installed from, for example, grub2-splashimages to register with the alternatives system and be available when you run update-alternatives --config desktop-grub -- That still doesn't answer the question how to set a background *you* provide that is not ...
07:41<babilen>... available in some debian package
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07:42<faheem>hi. were is the appropiate place to talk to people about getting a package fix uploaded for squeeze? mentors?
07:42<faheem>where is the appropriate, sorry
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07:43<faheem>s_i_m: irc? #debian-release?
07:43<s_i_m>mailing list
07:43<faheem>s_i_m: no irc?
07:43<s_i_m>should exist too
07:43<faheem>join #debian-release
07:43<babilen>lord_rob: I hope the situation is a bit clearer to you. If you want to provide *your own image* I would copy it to /boot/grub (as proposed by KiBi) and set it in /usr/share/desktop-base/ If you want to set a background installed from grub2-splashimages I would use the alternive system. The former method seems a bit awkward but seem to be the best way to handle this (in my opinion) -- There are million of other ways though ;)
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07:44<TIBS01>hey ya
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07:44<TIBS01>anyone know how to enable access to apache
07:44<TIBS01> is blocked from access by apache and i dont know why
07:44<faheem>s_i_m: apparently yes. will ask there. thanks.
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07:45<TIBS01>cant access it
07:45<TIBS01>shell1:/var/www# ls
07:45<TIBS01>index.html phpsysinfo webalizer
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07:48<TIBS01>anyone know how to get it working
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08:07<gruetzkopf>TIBS01, sorry, worked OOTB for me
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08:15<TIBS01>wots that mate
08:15<ananth123_>TIBS01: have you changed the default port to 81 instead of 80 ?
08:15<ananth123_>ootb = out of the box
08:16<cahoot>debian comes in a box now?
08:16<ananth123_>i think he just meant by default...
08:16<ananth123_>without modifying anything
08:17<zem>cahoot: nope, but you can put it in a box, and then take it out, and it might just work ootb
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08:18<TIBS01>i changed it to 81
08:18<cahoot>and restarted apache?
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08:18<cahoot>lsof -i says it listen on 81?
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08:19<TIBS01>apache2 3206 root 4u IPv6 7116 TCP *:81 (LISTEN)
08:19<TIBS01>apache2 3225 www-data 4u IPv6 7116 TCP *:81 (LISTEN)
08:19<TIBS01>apache2 3226 www-data 4u IPv6 7116 TCP *:81 (LISTEN)
08:19<ananth123_>can you access index.html?
08:19<cahoot>checked apaches logs?
08:19<ananth123_>what does error.log show ?
08:20<ananth123_>in /var/log/apache2/
08:20<TIBS01>[Sun Jan 23 12:11:09 2011] [notice] Apache/2.2.9 (Debian) PHP/5.2.6-1+lenny9 wi$
08:20<TIBS01>[Sun Jan 23 12:11:20 2011] [error] [client] File does not exist: /$
08:20<TIBS01>[Sun Jan 23 12:11:20 2011] [error] [client] File does not exist: /$
08:20<TIBS01>[Sun Jan 23 12:11:20 2011] [error] [client] File does not exist: /$
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08:20<TIBS01>back soon
08:21<TIBS01>ill come back and get help
08:21<ananth123_>TIBS01: what is the documentroot specified in your config files ?
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08:51<Lantizia>does anyone know where I can find out how the d-i determines the recommended size for swap and also /boot ?
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08:53<s_i_m>you should be able to manually partition your drive if you are not satisfied with the defaults.
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08:54<Lantizia>s_i_m, i know that but I still want to see how it determines the defaults
08:55<ompaul>Lantizia: what determines what's defaults?
08:55<Lantizia><Lantizia> does anyone know where I can find out how the d-i determines the recommended size for swap and also /boot ?
08:55<Lantizia>ompaul ^
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08:56<ompaul>Lantizia: interesting q /me goes to research
08:56<cthuluh>just download the source for the debian installer
08:56<ompaul>cthuluh: speak ye of the obvious ;-)
08:56*ompaul was going to
08:56<Lantizia>cthuluh, does the d-i run based on some kind of script file though?
08:56<Lantizia>i can't believe these things are hard coded
08:57<ompaul>Lantizia: most likely an algorithim that is hard coded
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08:58<Lantizia>would be nice to speak to someone who knows for sure how/where this stuff is determined
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09:00<ml|_>maybe the d-i factiod might help
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09:02<s_i_m>Lantizia, for what precisely do you need this info? (just asking to clarify things)
09:02<Lantizia>s_i_m, just something I've always wanted to know
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09:03<s_i_m>well, I always do partitioning manually
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09:04<cthuluh>also, #debian-boot
09:05<Tiff>i think it's 300% of your RAM size.
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09:07<themill>Lantizia: use the source, luke:;a=blob;f=recipes/atomic
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09:10<Lantizia>themill, i don't think that particularly tells me anything
09:11<Lantizia>I mean for a start it presumes ext2
09:11<themill>d-i puts /boot on ext2, yes.
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09:13<Lantizia>themill, ok I'm guessing what I'm reading is the guided lvm option with all files in root partition (except boot)?
09:14<Lantizia>i mean there is no context to this file at all, it's just called atomic
09:14<Lantizia>swap is 200%, 200% of what?
09:14<themill>Lantizia: there's an entire git full of context. I'm not the one who is interested in this.... but I'm sure you'll work this out soon enough with a little thought.
09:15<themill>about 3 seconds' thought is going to tell you that's 200% RAM
09:15<ompaul>Lantizia: go digging and you will find that my thoughts were right ;-) hard coded algorithim in a file autopartition and 200% of ram
09:15<ompaul>Lantizia: and at that it is game over - not interested any more ;-)
09:15<Lantizia>this really ought to be documented someplace
09:16<ompaul>Lantizia: it is in the file you stick it in the wiki you want it that much and you have the skills and now the information and be aware that you should morally keep it up to date if there are things going on you are interested in such as this
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09:45<saulo>Hello! I have problems with java and internet. But I can't find the file /etc/sysctl.d/bindv6only.conf to disable ipv6, then I don't know the possible problem
09:46<saulo>ssomebody could help me with this?
09:46<abrotman>did you create it?
09:46<saulo>no, the last time I've done the file was already there. Can I create with only that fix line?
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09:47<Black_Prince>Same should be for Lenny
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09:48<abrotman>i don't think it is the same
09:48<abrotman>saulo: yes, just create the file
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09:51<dpkg>[noipv6] To disable use of <IPv6> on Lenny: echo install ipv6 /bin/true >> /etc/modprobe.d/local.conf (and reboot for this change to take effect). From Squeeze onwards, IPv6 is built into the kernel, add the kernel command line option ipv6.disable=1 to your bootloader.
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09:56<saulo>In what place can I add this to
09:56<saulo>grub conf
09:56<saulo>I'm using testing
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10:00<abrotman>/etc/default/grub or grub2 .. wahtever the file is called
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10:03<saulo>Thanks you all! I'm rebooting the system to test!
10:03<saulo>I back soon
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10:11<saulo>hello al, I'm back
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10:11<saulo>Added all fixes, but my netbeans it's unable to update yet
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10:16<ompaul>saulo: have you seen this? I don't know how applicable it is to you
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10:22<saulo>ompaul: I've installed the last netbeans version from website. :(
10:27<saulo>restarting the system to another test
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11:15<TIBS-AWAY>can someone help me with that apache
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11:16<dominick>TIBS01, what's the problem>
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11:16<TIBS01>i cant access anything on the website
11:16<TIBS01>its there
11:16<TIBS01>but i cant get access
11:16<TIBS01>same as
11:16<TIBS01> wont access index.html
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11:18<Black_Prince>Where did you put your index.html ?
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11:19<TIBS01>its in /var/www
11:19<Black_Prince>Did you configure anything else?
11:21<TIBS01>just changed the port
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11:22<abrotman>check the logs to see which file it's attempting to load
11:22<dominick>TIBS01, then where is the index.html for your server running on port 80?
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11:23<dominick>TIBS01, your port 80 is working. If you just changed your port, you might have to restart apache.
11:23<TIBS01>ang on
11:23<TIBS01>NameVirtualHost *:80
11:23<TIBS01>Listen *:81
11:24<TIBS01>do i put them on both 81 ?
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11:24<dominick>TIBS01, you can try.
11:26<TIBS01>still aint working
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11:28<dominick>TIBS01, only listen should do the trick. Did you restart apache?
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11:28<dominick>TIBS01, "/etc/init.d/httpd restart"
11:29<TIBS01>shell1:~# /etc/init.d/httpd restart
11:29<TIBS01>bash: /etc/init.d/httpd: No such file or directory
11:29<TIBS01>shell1:~# ./etc/init.d/httpd restart
11:29<Black_Prince>invoke-rc.d apache2 restart
11:29<TIBS01>Restarting web server: apache2[Sun Jan 23 16:29:23 2011] [warn] NameVirtualHost *:81 has no VirtualHosts
11:29<TIBS01> ... waiting [Sun Jan 23 16:29:24 2011] [warn] NameVirtualHost *:81 has no VirtualHosts
11:30<Black_Prince>/etc/apache2/sites-available/default ... what's the first line ... something like <VirtualHost ....
11:31<TIBS01>its only on ports.conf
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11:31<Black_Prince>pastebin your /etc/apache2/sites-available/default
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11:32<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or for pics. Use for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <>, <wgetpaste>.
11:33<abrotman>did he check the log yet?
11:33<Black_Prince><VirtualHost *:80> change to <VirtualHost *:81>
11:33<Black_Prince>then restart again
11:33<dominick>Black_Prince, he did.
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11:34<abrotman>did he ever say the server wasn't responding on port 80 ?
11:34<Black_Prince>NameVirtualHost and <VirtualHost> are not the same
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11:35<Black_Prince>He wants to access files in /var/www on port 81, that should do it ...
11:35<TIBS01>it works now
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12:17<satish>hi dominick!!!
12:18<satish>hello u there...?
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12:20<dominick>satish, hi
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12:24<bsat>hi dominick
12:24<dominick>hi bsat!
12:24<dominick>do i know u?
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12:25<bsat>yes its satish... :)
12:25<dominick>then who's satish?
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12:25<dominick>i mean he's still in the channel.
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12:26<bsat>thats me itself...
12:26<bsat>i got kicked out with that username
12:26<bsat>so had to get another one
12:26-!-bsat was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use or /msg dpkg paste]
12:26<babilen>dominick: satish was autokicked because he said too many lines in row.
12:26<dominick>babilen, lol!
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12:27<dpkg>The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
12:27<babilen>bsat: ^^^^^^^
12:27<ompaul>fedora at ip lovely
12:27<bsat>why do i keep goin out of channel...
12:27<babilen>bsat: Read what dpkg just said and use some interpunctation.
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12:28<bsat>k got it
12:28<bsat>hi babilen :)
12:28<babilen>err, punctuation :-\ (damn german)
12:28<ompaul>bsat: cos you type and hit enter, rather than making your point on one line, so you keep hitting enter like you had a full idea and then all of a sudden you went NOOOOO I need to say more, and you do then the bot counts your enters and says ... too many in one go OUT DAMN YOU or something like that
12:28<ompaul>babilen: ;-)
12:29<dominick>ompaul, :))
12:29<bsat>okie thanks guys :)
12:29<dominick>wat's been happening bsat? have you got any VXML servers on debian?
12:30<bsat>i ll keep that in mind;
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12:31<bsat>no not so far... have you??? i actually was thinking is there any way of interconnectin PSTN with regular voip phone??
12:31<troulouliou>hi does anybody have problem with teir wifi card recently on squeeze ?
12:31<dominick>bsat, yes, there is. you need a PSTN card.
12:33<bsat>PSTN card in PCI slot and a regular phone can be connected to it?? a regular mobile can be used to make calls to it?
12:33<sney>troulouliou: what card?
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12:34<bsat>i have a lot of confusion so if ur busy i ll keep my littlt doubts for later... :)
12:34<dominick>bsat, do you realise you're running late on your project?
12:34<troulouliou>sney: thi
12:35<troulouliou>sney: Intel Corporation PRO/Wireless 4965 AG or AGN [K ; sorry
12:35<bsat>yes i do...
12:35<dpkg>iwlagn is the driver for the Intel Wireless WiFi Link (4965AGN, 5100AGN, 5300AGN, 5350AGN, 5150AGN, 1000BGN, 6200AGN, 6300AGN, 6250AGN) series of devices. Included in mainline Linux kernels since 2.6.27. Lenny users: ask me about <bdo kernel> to install a later kernel containing this driver. Firmware is required, ask me about <iwlagn firmware> to provide.
12:35<sney>looks like you need firmware to make it work.
12:35<troulouliou>yes but it workded like a charm since 2 - 3 days ago
12:35<dominick>hi! can anybody help us with configuring a VXML server with speech recognition out of the debian repository?
12:36<troulouliou>i h ave a dual boot on windows and under win it is working perfectly
12:36<bsat>i am going to talk to my college guide tom divide the work among the team explain them wat has to be done...
12:36<sney>troulouliou: and you were on squeeze the whole time?
12:36<dpkg>iwlwifi is the driver for Intel 3945 and 4965 wireless LAN chipsets since Lenny. Firmware is required, ask me about <non-free sources> and install the firmware-iwlwifi package to provide. If upgrading from Etch, see to switch from ipw3945 to iwl3945. See also <iwlagn> <wmaster0>. #ipw2100 on
12:36<troulouliou>sney: yes and i rememvered there was an update on the firmware package
12:36<bsat>i hav only told it to hiru until now... i am sorry
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12:37<sney>troulouliou: in that case you should check for the firmware package, if it killed your nic then it likely killed other peoples' as well
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12:40<dominick>troulouliou, I have the 3945, which uses the same driver. I have no problem with my card.
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12:40<troulouliou>dominick: will reinstall the firmware-iwlwifi package and check
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12:41<troulouliou>when i do ifconfig wlan0 up it says ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): wlan0: link is not ready in dmesg
12:42<cybercaffe><cybercaffe> what is good billing for hot spot on windows?
12:42<cybercaffe><cybercaffe> free billing please
12:42<cybercaffe><cybercaffe> like antamedia hotspot but another
12:42<cybercaffe><cybercaffe> do you know?
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12:46<dominick>Hi! Please help me find the tools to set up a VXML server from the debian repository!
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13:48<Kfree>hello, ive just upgraded lenny to squeeze and i have a minor problem with fonts, i 'm used to use a font called "terminal" but i can't find it anymore in squeeze, so... can anyone tell me if there is a way to get this old font from lenny on squeeze ?
13:48<Kfree>maybe a package containing many fonts i don't know....
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13:51<f8l>Kfree: Do you mean Terminus?
13:52<Kfree>hum... i was written terminal on my system
13:52<Kfree>it was*
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13:53<Kfree>f8l: no matter do you know if there is a way to get terminus fonts on squeeze ?
13:53<Kfree>gonna give it a try
13:53<Kfree>i checked out on google it looks similar
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13:54<cd>Hi guys (and girl if any :P)! Is any chance to redirect a putty session (from my vista PC) console to the display attaced to my debian gateway? Thanks!
13:54<ompaul>Kfree: xfonts-terminus xfonts-terminus-dos xfonts-terminus-oblique
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13:55<Kfree>thx ompaul
13:55<ompaul>cd: your question, I don't understand it, which box are you logged onto from where, and where do you want the final display to be, is it of a console?
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13:58<cd>ompaul: now I'm speaking from x-chat running on my PC running vista (:P), and I log on to my debian gateway using putty; I have 2 monitors: one attaches to my vista PC and one attached to my debian gateway; I want that a putty session from my vista PC have the console messages redirected to the debian gateway display (console, monitor)... Are you following me?
13:59<ompaul>cd: you want to log on a second time and tail -f some logs?
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14:00<cd>ompaul: you mean to log on my debian gateway using putty and show you (what) logs?
14:00<ompaul>cd: what you are talking about is a recipe for failure - blasting your work environment out of it with messages that belong in other places
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14:01<cd>ompaul: doesn't care... just want that the monitor attached to my gateway to not sit there for nothing... OR do you have any ideea how can I make a better use of this hardware?
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14:01<ompaul>cd: no I mean you log onto the debian box twice, the second time to read your log files what you are describing that is a forced echo to the attached session means that you have to do some serious work to prevent your session from filling up with junk from log files that you don't need while you see 20 messages time after time that you don't need while trying to fix the box
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14:03<ompaul>cd: this is a bit like dossing your email with 20k messages when you over log what you want
14:03<cd>ompaul: I'm quite not really following you...
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14:05<ompaul>cd: you are the person who was nattering about fwlogwatch a short time ago?
14:05<cd>ompaul: yes, sir, I am...
14:05<ompaul>cd: I'm telling you what you are trying to do is even worse this time,
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14:06<ompaul>cd: I'm telling you log onto the box, tail -f the log files you want
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14:06<cd>ompaul: so... my second monitor had to sit there for nothing?
14:07<ompaul>cd: no, you can put several putty sessions on it and watch many log files - from within your crazy vista (which I strongly suggest you scrub and put squeeze on)
14:07<ompaul>cd: you could even full screen the putty application
14:07<cd>ompaul: I think you didn't understand me completely... I want that a ssh session from my vista to my debian system had the console redirected to the monitor attached to my debian gateway, not to the one attached to my PC running vista...
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14:09<cd>ompaul: I'm not interested for logs for the moment... only if it would help solve this problem...
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14:09<ompaul>cd: console redirect - you mean you want to type on the vista box and appear on the debian screen and the typing on putty takes place on the vista box ...
14:09<Tiff>logs generally are conducive to solving issues. >_>
14:10<cd>ompaul: yes, that's what I mean...
14:10*ompaul takes cd's crack pipe away
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14:10<pleb2>hey, I managed to restore a backup of my system, but now I need to replace the kernel with an i386 option, any howto guides?
14:10<cd>ompaul: what's that? a crack pipe?
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14:11<Tiff>lol. :P
14:11<ompaul>cd: it is me saying in not to good a way "you got to be joking if you think I am even going to consider that as a realistic proposition"
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14:12<cd>ompaul: so, what I want is kinda silly thing...
14:12<ompaul>that would be a very polite way of saying it
14:13<ompaul>you could do it
14:13<cd>ompaul: can't be done? why?
14:13<ompaul>but pointless beyond the point of crazy
14:13<cd>ompaul: yes, I want to do it... how?
14:13<ompaul>cd: you have the source code - you have the internet - you have the time - you do it
14:14<cd>omapul: doesn't care if it is crazy... just care to be done...
14:14<ompaul>cd: I'll give you two clues | and tty have fun on your own with that one
14:14<cd>ompaul: wow! source code... isn't there any other way?
14:14<cd>ompaul: ok, give me the clues...
14:14<ompaul>cd: if you haven't gotten the clue already I'm not interested
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14:16<cd>ompaul: sorry, guess didn't got any clue... thanks for oppinion and help anyway...
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14:16<ompaul>cd: I'll give you a third clue two clues " | tty tee " go have fun
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14:16<ompaul>meh happy editing on the fly
14:16<mc68040>cd: have a look at "screen", i think with it you can do what you want
14:17<cd>mc68040: thanks, already I'm using screen in my ssh session...
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14:18<cd>ompaul: thanks for clues... and happy irc-ing...
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14:19<pleb2>Guys i've restored a backup of a x64 machine on a machine with only a 32bit proc... how do I reinstall a new kernel??
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14:20<Tiff>you have larger issues than the kernel
14:20<pleb2>I have my original x386 debian install CD, can I use that?
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14:20<pleb2>Tiff explain?
14:20<ompaul>pleb2: afiui you will have to install amd64 to restore a 64 bit box
14:21<ompaul>pleb2: you can't mix and match like that if any apps were restored that needed 64 bit
14:21<Tiff>all of /usr/bin etc. will be the 64-bit equiv apps too, etc.
14:21<Tiff>it won't run just with a kernel switch going from 64 -> 32
14:21<mc68040>pleb2: i386 and amd64 are different architectures, you have to replace all binaries
14:22<pleb2>sounds like i'd be better of just restoring the data and configs
14:22<ompaul>cd: I still think you need your head examined for doing that but here is more or less what you want
14:22<pleb2>making a list of the apps
14:22<Tiff>that's sensible yes
14:22<mc68040>pleb2: yes
14:23<pleb2>okay, this might help then, is there anyway to copy a list of installed packages?
14:24<mc68040>pleb2: dpkg --get-selections
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14:25<ompaul>pleb2: well the database would be dependant on files that were 64bit so you would be a little screwed there, however if you can look in /var/cache/apt/archives and then do a cut at some point you might manage so to take a look at what got installed (not quite as clean as mc68040 but does look at the files on the machine)
14:25<ompaul>with a view to manipulating them
14:26<pleb2>@ompaul, okay, and thanks @mc68040 I'll have a go :).. I think I know what I have to reinstall, just knowing my luck I'll miss something
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14:27<mc68040>pleb2: another way: ls /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.list
14:27<ompaul>pleb2: if you look where I told you and do the right kind of cut -d"-" and so on you just might get very lucky :)
14:27<pleb2>last thing, is there anyway I can take user accounts + passwords over, from one to the other? which files would I need to take?
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14:29<mc68040>pleb2: normally /etc/passwd /etc/shadow /etc/group
14:29<ml|_>/etc/passwd* /etc/shadow* /etc/group*
14:29<ompaul>pleb2: and /home
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14:29<ompaul>pleb2: but if you are restoring you must have these already
14:29<pleb2>I've already got /home with permissions backed up :)
14:30<pleb2>yeah, do
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14:30<pleb2>when I move i'll just replace the whole /etc folder
14:30<ompaul>pleb2: do base install first and then move on up
14:30<ml|_>pleb2: better to only change what is needed in /etc imho
14:31<pleb2>ompaul, just ruined a perfectly good base install :P...
14:31<pleb2>and okay... change bits.. fun times :).
14:31<ompaul>pleb2: /etc is not your friend for random dumps
14:32<ompaul>pleb2: do them on a case by case basisi
14:32<ml|_>a bit late but, /msg dpkg aptitude clone
14:34<ml|_>that^ saved me a lot of time when I moved to amd64 recently
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14:34<pleb2>think it would have been all groovy had the machine supported 64bit :\.. and thanks, just had a look at that.. hopefully this should just be a one off :)
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14:35<ompaul>pleb2: you falling back to 32 bit because the box does not work with 64 bit?
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14:36<pleb2>ompaul its complicated... essentially yes. The machine is currently hosted on a vbox x64 machine but needs to be moved off of that machine... all we have spare is an old dell poweredge 2600
14:36<pleb2>backwards_progress much... but budget is non-exsistent atm
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14:38<ompaul>pleb2: base install 32, then check your package listing, then make sure you change the list to move to 32 from 64, take it slowly and test a lot you might get there, hope it is not too urgent
14:38<ompaul>pleb2: not might should
14:38<mc68040>pleb2: must be very old, xeon with 32bit only... i have 3 old fujitsu-siemens machines like this too
14:39<pleb2>it is old... on the borderline before they started shipping 64 xeons... has 10krpm drives though and IO is more important than proc power to this machine... its a mailserver...
14:40<pleb2>hence the "copy accounts" question... creating 900 new accounts wouldnt have really been practical
14:41<pleb2>and Thanks everyone.. hopefully should get sorted :)
14:41<mc68040>pleb2: 900? i switched to a ldap based solution when i reached 100
14:41<ml|_>pleb2: good luck and have fun ;)
14:41<mc68040>pleb2: yep, good luck
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14:43<ompaul>pleb2: and again .., good luck, that kind of lack of budget indicates time to run away
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14:44<pleb2>You're not kidding... im sure we've still got a 386 knocking around here somewhere... hmmm... new domain controller ;P
14:44<pleb2>catch you guys later!
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14:55<sret>anyone's got sound working on x11vnc?
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15:17<sret>anyone awake
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15:21<sret>ive read this but im using x11vnc without ssh and i have esound installed
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15:23<cahoot>you actively cose esound?
15:23-!-Jo2006 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:23<sret>ive installed esound
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15:23<sret>not sure how i actively choose it though
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15:27<sret>cahoot: if im not using ssh how do i do this based on that link?
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15:30<cahoot>no idea - esd seems rather dated/obsolete though
15:31<sret>what do i use instead of ESD then
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15:35<cahoot>sret: may I ask what you aim for?
15:36<sret>cahoot: trying to get sound working on my remote machine (local machine) using x11vnc
15:36<Zokudu>If I built the FGLRX driver to get 3d acceleration is it safe to upgrade xorg without upgrading the driver as well?
15:36<sret>i was trying to play a flash vid, the video works but o sound
15:36<cahoot>for playing music?
15:36<sret>music, demos, etc
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15:38<cahoot>pulseaudio has network capabilities IIRC
15:38<sret>yeah i noticed
15:38<sret>but will pulseaudio work well with x11vnc?
15:39<cahoot>no clue
15:39<ompaul>sret: do you run Debian as a native operating system?
15:39<sret>it's running as the VNC server now
15:40<ompaul>just curious :)
15:40<ompaul>sret: I'm not likely to think about x11vnc problems, have you checked that you can get sound out of the box itself?
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15:41<sret>on the remote machine there's sound working
15:41<sret>on the debian box im not sure if it has a sound card but should this matter? so long as x11vnc tells the remote machine to just play the damn audio file?
15:41<ompaul>are both machines running debian
15:41<sret>remote: windows
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15:43<sret>if i do a cat /proc/asound/cards
15:44<sret>0 [Intel ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel
15:44<sret> HDA Intel at 0x901c0000 irq 22
15:44<sret>that's about it
15:45<cahoot>but you want the sound handle by the win laptop?
15:45<cahoot>so the hda-intel will be by-passed - no?
15:46<sret>if im using x11vnc i want my windows machine to pick up sound
15:46<sret>as of now it doesnt
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15:47<sret>so i suspect x11vnc will need a workaround to get sound working remotely, the windows laptop machine works fine with sound just on its own
15:47<ompaul>sret: tells a story of a guy called sret and it tells how he was to read it and find out that x11vnc does not do audio nor to realvnc* versions
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15:48<sret>ompaul: but based on the link above it tells a story f a guy called ompaul who has to scroll and see i pasted a workaround just dont know how to get it working using ESD
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15:48<ompaul>sret: you seem to have the interest and the link enjoy
15:49<ompaul>sret: basically it is a windows problem
15:50<ompaul>sret: so x11vnc according to that faq is not going to work, however you can do it with an ssh tunnel, and that well you have a how to for, but don't say it is a hack for x11vnc it is not, it is how you pipe sound over ssh :-/
15:51<sret>how is this a windows problem? the link you pasted just talks about x11vnc having no support for windows
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15:51<sret>im not using x11vnc in windows, just on debian, the viewer is tinyvnc
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15:52<sret>the link you pasted clearly tells x11vnc doesnt work on windows, as in a server i suspect, but im using it on debian as a server, the viewer is tinyvnc
15:53<sret>sorry tightvnc viewer
15:53<Zokudu>If I built the FGLRX driver to get 3d acceleration is it safe to upgrade xorg without upgrading the driver as well?
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15:54<sret>from the looks of it, neither of them have audo support, not even tighgvnc
15:54<ompaul>sret: you should have read what I said, x11vnc has no audio support - did not say platform - I dislike windows and will put it down and rm it at half a chance
15:55<olasd>Zokudu: I guess the driver would need to be rebuilt for it to work with the new xorg version
15:55<ompaul>sret: if the server does not support audio how do you get the audio off that box - you use another tool
15:55<sret>ompaul: yeah neither tightvnc or realvnc supports audio, only other guy who does is freenx
15:55<ompaul>not only but that is a whole other debate
15:55<sret>so say i run freenx, and use a tightvnc viewer will audio work?
15:56<ompaul>sret: why would a vnc viewer see nx?
15:56<ompaul>sret: someone who needs chalk to write on a board will not ask for cheese
15:57<ompaul>sret: take a moment to read the link you posted it suggests how to do it
15:57<ompaul>sret: the one I pointed at was based on your software suggestion that you were using and wanted to pump audio over
15:57<sret>i dont want to use ssh tunnelling, ssh lags like crazy even with just plain ssh + x11portforwarding
15:58<sret>but you ewre saying a vnc viewer wont see freenx?
15:58<ompaul>sret: are you smoking something illegal?
15:58<sret>asin it wont pick up audo?
15:58<ompaul>ssh lags ...
15:58<cahoot>the audio quality from laptopspeakers is a lesser nuisance?
15:58*ompaul gives up
15:58<sret>yeah like major if i do x11 port forwarding
15:58<sret>half the apps hang, freeze, i tried running iceweasel from ssh on windows, it practically just sat there for 10 mins before i could even type anytihng
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16:01<sret>but anyhow if freenx supports audio wont i get it working in the remote box ? it supports audio
16:01<ompaul>sret: ok before you go making bigger statements read this carefully, over a distance of 10km I had an inter office link of 10megs I could run ssh -X user@farend oowriter and use my open office in the other office, no real lag - so you got something else there in you mix
16:02<ompaul>sret: am I to understand that both your machines are on a home network?
16:02<ompaul>sret: so how do you think the exercise would have fared on your network that I just did?
16:02<sret>for local there is no lag issues, i get that
16:03<ompaul>sret: ssh -C compresses unless it is assumed like in the case of -X
16:03<sret>but even during local ssh session apps were freezing up in the windows machine
16:03<ompaul>ssh -C should always be used
16:03<sret>the bandwidth is not the issue, its the apps loading
16:03<ompaul>windows shmindows
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16:04<ompaul>do yourself a favour and get a live CD of dsl and mess with ssh -X
16:04<bsat>hey dominick!!!!
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16:04<sret>things like xclock load up real quick
16:04<sret>but things like a browser, etc freeze up
16:05<ompaul>sret: how old is the laptop and what is it running?
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16:05<sret>i'll try ssh later,but i just want to know if freenx will work here?
16:05<sret>IBM t42
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16:06<ompaul>sret: according to the docs yes - however freenx is not in the repos so you need to read the docs that come with it and not have us read them for you
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16:08<sret>ompaul: the link i posted why is it sound only works via ssh?
16:09<sret>i dont get the point of how ssh relates to sound to get it working
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16:09<ompaul>sret: read the link where it tells you about how it is a work around i.e. does not involve x11vnc - you need to read to execute
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16:12<sret>im reading it i just odnt follow it
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16:13<sret>ssh -C -R 16001:localhost:16001 far-away.east
16:13<ompaul>sret: what it says in very simple language - x11vnc does not work - use ssh and far-away.east is the other machine localhost is the linux box
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16:14<ompaul>sret: and I didn't even check if it works with putty
16:14<ballison>i have a "wget" "pipe" "perl" question. If I wget a perl script and pipe it to perl, it works and it runs, BUT it skips all the prompts in the script (where it prompts for user interaction)... does anyone know how to fix that?
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16:15<ompaul>sret: that sound movement is between two linux boxes
16:16<sret>ompaul: it says it works for windows too
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16:16<sret>which means i need to install windows esd port in the laptop ?
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16:17<ompaul>sret: this is the bit I am reading - you got something else there that says it does audio? How can I hear the sound (audio) from the remote applications on the desktop I am viewing via x11vnc?
16:17<ballison>so for example wget -q0- http://www/ | perl -i
16:17<sret>ompaul: im reading that
16:17<ballison>it runs the script, but never gives me a chance to answer the prompts.
16:17<sret>We show a simple Unix to Unix esd example here (artsd should be possible too, we have also verified the esd Windows port works for the method described below.)
16:19<ompaul>sret: and pray tell how would I know anything about windows let alone windows esd port ?
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16:20<sret>ompaul: your point? you said the sound movement was between two unix boxes and i corrected that saying he shows it owrks for windows too
16:21<sret>im not asking you to know if it'll work but im trying to make sense of the docu
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16:23<ompaul>sret: the ssh stuff is simple on debian you decide which machine is faraway and the other one - for putty ... I don't know that putty is what you want for that on windows you may want cygwin but again that is a windows issue ssh works it pumps data as requested between boxes and is not laggy when used with -C or correctly
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16:24<sret>ompaul: yeah on debian i have no issues
16:24<ompaul>sret: so to sum up go to ##windows on and ask them how you might install an esd port for windows and then put esd on your linux box but if it has no sound card it might say ... I have nowhere to pipe to so I'll just die quitely
16:24<sret>i know to install the esd port in window
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16:29<ompaul>sret: as a 100% aside since 1993 I have not had a windows desktop as my personal desktop - so I really don't know how they work and I don't understand why people still use it
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16:36<sret>ompaul: ok
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16:36<sret>ok let me get this right, i have to first ssh -C -R 16001:localhost:16001 to the linux machine ?
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16:40<sret>does this mean i ssh tunnel into the debian box with those options?
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16:44<ompaul>from my reading on it
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16:45<Soultaker1974>buenas tardes
16:45<Soultaker1974>a todos
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16:45<Soultaker1974>alguien sabe como poner la resolucion en una Acer aspire one d255
16:46<sret>so my display for vnc was actually :1
16:46<sret>in this example it's set to 0
16:46<Soultaker1974>sorry wrong channel
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16:51<osmans>Howdy. Can somebody provide a pastebin of their "/etc/fail2ban/jail.conf"
16:51<osmans>I've seemed to have fucked up my config file and I can't find a default config file anywhere on the internet
16:52<@Ganneff>download the package or the source, whatever you want, take it from there
16:52<osmans>I've tried removing it and re-installing, but it isn't re-installing the default "jail.conf"
16:52<osmans>not sure why :/
16:52<@Ganneff>i bet you removed, not purged
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16:52*osmans noobie question
16:52<osmans>Whats the difference?
16:53<@Ganneff>you just ran into it
16:53<osmans>ok let me try that then
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16:53<dpkg>In Debian package management, "purge" means to completely wipe away a package, including its configuration files. Use 'aptitude purge [package]' or 'dpkg -P [package]' (note: you can't apt-get purge a package that is already removed; use aptitude or dpkg instead). To purge all "removed" packages: aptitude purge '~c'. To restore configuration files, ask me about <confmiss>. Also ask me about <why aptitude>.
16:53<dpkg>The reason you have to use dpkg --force-confmiss is because whenever your config files (<conffiles>) are gone, dpkg assumes you deleted them on purpose, and that you want them to stay deleted. You can also reinstall them using the following apt-get line: apt-get -o DPkg::Options::="--force-confmiss" --reinstall install <packagename>; or using aptitude, aptitude -o DPkg::Options::="--force-confmiss" reinstall <packagename>.
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16:55<osmans>Ganneff: Thank you!
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16:55<osmans>Amazingly I
16:55<osmans>Amazingly I've used "remove" all these years without any issues..
16:56<sret>ompaul: if i do a esd -promiscuous -port 16001 -tcp -bind
16:56<sret>i get a unrecronised option: bind
16:56<sret>unrecognised option:
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16:59<ompaul>sret: apt-get install esound*
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16:59<sret>ompaul: already done that
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16:59<ompaul>then it should work - works here
17:00<sret>i have esound-clients too
17:00<ompaul>sret: on a server why
17:00<sret>i know but was just making sure i had everything
17:00<yoshio>how do I get aptitude to show me if I have any untrusted packages installed?
17:01<sret>ompaul: im still trying to figure how to connect using putty with those options -R and -C
17:01<ompaul>sret: I think this comes down to what I said earlier ... you may find that you lack a sound card and the driver has no where to direct the initial stream
17:01<sret>-R is port forwarding and i added port:16001 and destination
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17:01<ompaul>sret: basically unless you have fully functioning (by this I mean tested) esd on the debian box how can you hope to redirect it
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17:02<sret>how do i test esd on the debian box
17:03<sret>if i go into system> preferences> sound
17:03<sret>if i do an sound playback, test, i cant hear nothing
17:04<sret>or under the Sounds tab if i try to play a .wav file cant hear nothing
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17:06<ompaul>sret: so you need to get something that (A) plays esd and (B) talks out its speakers and choose your sound mixer and and card
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17:07<ompaul>sret: if you were on KDE I'd be more useful now if you are on gnome I suggest you right click on the speaker and see if you get any config options there
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17:10<sret>right now there's preferences
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17:11<sret>select the device and track to control: HDA Intel (Alsa mixer)
17:11<sret>how do i check if there's a soundcard
17:11<ompaul>how will alsa work with esd
17:11<ompaul>sret: it should show you a list of devices
17:11<sret>i tried modprobe but thee''ss modprobe installed here, it doesn't recognise it
17:12<sret>ompaul: which one should i choose? PCM?
17:12<ompaul>sret: for esd?
17:12<ompaul>sret: dots join the
17:12<ompaul>sret: you want to use esd yes?
17:12<sret>my default mixer tracks under preferences> sound> is HDA intel ALSA mixer
17:12<sret>ompaul: yes
17:13<sret>whatever will get my system to produce some sound
17:13<ompaul>you want esd for your example
17:13<ompaul>you can't just randomly pick stuff
17:13<sret>oklets try esd
17:13<sret>i havent setup the x11vnc stuff yet, im trying to rectify my sound issue on the debian box if there's an issue
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17:16<sret>i have an option to select ALSA mixer or realtek's OSS mixer
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17:19<sret>i tried cat /dev/urandom > /dev/audio
17:19<sret>no sound
17:21<sret>lspci | grep -i audio
17:21<sret>00:1b.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation 82801G (ICH7 Family) High Definition Audio Controller (rev 01)
17:21<sret>so ther eis one
17:22<dpkg>There is no universal driver for every single motherboard that uses AC'97 audio. As AC'97 is just an audio codec standard, you need a driver for your audio chip. In <ALSA>, it is usually one of snd-intel8x0, snd-au8810 or snd-via82xx; use <lspci -k> to check. The AC'97 standard was superseded by the Intel High Definition Audio specification in 2004 (supported by snd-hda-intel).
17:22<yoshio>sret: modprobe snd-hda-intel ?
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17:23<sret>modprobe not recognised, modprobe isnt even in the debian repors
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17:23<yoshio>modprobe is the replacement for 'insmod'
17:23<sret>alsa is getting configured, let me see if it'll work first then we can try ESD
17:23<sret>yoshio: ok
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17:25<yoshio>/sbin/modprobe is in the package 'module-init-tools' for squeeze
17:25<sret>ok if i do speaker-test, i get no errors, but i dont hear no sound either
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17:27<Thiago>hello guys, I use gentoo distro and unfortunately I can't connecting to #gentoo channel...I have an X server problem...(EE) No devices detected found ... Fatal server error .. No screens found
17:28<Thiago>can someone help me?
17:28-!-Dominus [] has joined #debian
17:28<Thiago>my current xorg-server is 1.9.3
17:29<sret>im giving up
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17:30<yoshio>sudo /sbin/modprobe snd-hda-intel doesn't help?
17:30<ansgar>Thiago: #gentoo is on Freenode, not OFTC as far as I know.
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17:32<sret>yoshio: it returns nothing
17:33<yoshio>sret: ok, if it wasn't found, it would complain. /sbin/lsmod - should show that it's installed
17:33<sret>i see snd_hda_intel on the top of the list
17:33<yoshio>sret: if you are using an old release, you need to install a package like alsa-modules-2.4.27-1-686 to get sound
17:33<sret>and a bunch of other snd_* stuff
17:34<sret>i just did alsaconf
17:34<sret>and it reconfigured it i think.. not sure if its updated
17:34<yoshio>sret: the mixer defaults to a level of '0' - did you turn up the sound level?
17:34<sret>i have alsa-base
17:34<sret>yeah the sound is way up
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17:36<sret>i have alsa-base and alsa-utils installed here
17:36<sret>yoshio: not sure if this makes sense but from doing /sbin/lsmod in the list i see pcspkr:0
17:37<ompaul>pc speaker
17:37<sret>but psmouse : 0 too though im using one
17:37<ompaul>.. 0 is the first one found
17:37<ompaul>1 would be the second one found
17:38<sret>ok so this means i do have a pc speaker and sound card stuff judging from the list
17:38<yoshio>sret: I think that'
17:38<yoshio>I think it's for the bee
17:38<yoshio>!alsa install
17:38<dpkg>"aptitude -r install alsa-utils". After package installation, run alsamixer and unmute the volume levels. Some applications don't know how to talk directly to ALSA, see <devdsp>. You may also need to install libesd-alsa0 if you're using ESD-based applications on Lenny. Some ALSA drivers require firmware from userspace, ask me about <alsa firmware>. To set the default sound card, ask me about <default alsa>.
17:39<dpkg>1) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 2) use alsamixer to unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels & toggle jack sense) 3) arts or esound stopped? 4) speakers on? 5) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? 6) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 7) squeeze: purge any installed <oss4> packages to remove ALSA blacklist. See also <list alsa users>, <alsa firmware>.
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17:41<sret>5 doesnt wor
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17:42<yoshio>sret: if you have onboard sound, is the bios set for sound on?
17:42<sret>i'll have to check
17:42<sret>brb need to feed the horses:D
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17:44<babilen>sret: cat /proc/asound/cards is always interesting
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17:49<Dominus>Oy. Do you know the name of a good IRC Bouncer (BNC) ? :)
17:49<Dominus>Besides shroudBNC
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17:49<babilen>,info znc
17:49<judd>Package znc (net, optional) in lenny/i386: advanced modular IRC bouncer. Version: 0.058-2+lenny4; Size: 989.0k; Installed: 2804k; Homepage:
17:50<babilen>!tell Dominus -about search
17:50<Dominus>babilen: I did search first......
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17:58<k-man>with the kp-mantra, is there some trick to recompiling without having to do a make clean first?
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18:08<sret>ok done
18:09-!-mode/#debian [+l 459] by debhelper
18:09<sret>hi babilen i think i chcked that before, let me try now
18:10<sret>babilen: yep i did this command before it says
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18:10<sret>0 [Intel ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel
18:11<sret> HDA Intel at 0x901c0000 irq 22
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18:13<yoshio>sret: and you made sure sound was enabled in bios?
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18:13<sret>checking that too
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18:14<babilen>all the information you need ^^^^ check with #also on freenode if in doubt -- /me calls it a day
18:15<babilen>#alsa that is
18:15<sret>if i do a ps aux
18:15<sret>if i do a ps aux |grep esd
18:15<sret>its set at esd -nobeeps
18:16<sret>babilen: ok
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18:20<sret>yoshio: in my bios > peripheral settings: audo: enabled
18:20<sret>it was enabled before
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18:23<sret>ok i connected my USB speaker and still nothing
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18:27<sret>yoshio: any ideas
18:28<ompaul>sret: usb speakers are not the best option you seem to have the worst in the world setups don't you have one speaker set that is using a "normal" sound card output
18:29<sret>well how do i find out if its even using it
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18:29<sret>the system has an onboard sundcard from the looks of it
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18:30<sret>we probed for the soundcard in every way possible im not getting any sound at all
18:30<ompaul>sret: if it was me, a normal computer speaker cable and speaker from sound card (light green) alsa to test, then I would try the other funky stiff you want
18:31<sret>but i just ran the alsa tests, its not picking up anything
18:31<ompaul>sret: it is like you get the bar and you put it 100m above your head and say I'll just throw this small golf ball over it
18:31<ompaul>sret: in general linux "just works"
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18:31<yoshio>sret: when you checked the audio levels, you did make sure that the channels were not muted?
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18:32<ompaul>sret: when you look at the box there is a green jackplug socket ]on it?
18:32<sret>yes its not muted, from the speaker icon i dont see anything muted and inside alsamixer too
18:32<sret>ompaul: where should i look for that?
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18:33<ompaul>sret: on the box - a box is a computer
18:33<sret>ompaul: are you talking about the green jack like to inser headphones?
18:33<ompaul>sret: yes
18:33<sret>yeah i have 3 of those
18:33<ompaul>sret: so have you headphones?
18:34<ompaul>I'll take that as a no
18:34<yoshio>sret: on the mixer, you made sure both the Master and PCM are up?
18:35<sret>PCM 100
18:35<sret>master: 81
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18:36<ompaul>yoshio: this guy does not have a normal speaker, want to push esd across an ssh link to a windows box running some kind of ssh client because tightvnc client does not do audio
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18:37<ompaul>yoshio: and the tightvnc box is a windows box I have basically given up but can't let go ;-)
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18:37<sret>ompaul: we're not trying to fix x11vnc audionow
18:37<ompaul>sret: well it is not fixable
18:37<sret>just trying to get sound working and then i'll work on x11vnc,you deduced that if sound doesnt work here, then its not going to get directed to the windows machine
18:37<ompaul>sret: the thing you want is some output device for your debian box
18:37<sret>ompaul: why not?
18:38<ompaul>x11vnc can't carry audio you have not been at the races at all today have you?
18:38<sret>ompaul: why are you jumping topics now man?
18:38<sret>im trying to fix audio on my debian box, thats all!
18:39<sret>not esd, not anything else! i can look into x11vnc or freens or whatever the hell it is later on
18:39<ompaul>I'm not jumping, I was bringing yoshio up to speed with your aim at the end of the day
18:39<sret>im trying to get alsa working
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18:39<ompaul>sret: have you got some "normal speakers"?
18:39<sret>my aim at the end of the day is pointless right now, i ned sound working, to reduce all fial factors when connecting through vnc later on
18:39<ompaul>usb is not nromal
18:39<sret>but at the moment the only important thing is getting sound working
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18:40<sret>i dont have any other speaker, just the USB logitech ones
18:41<ompaul>sret: borrow some - it should work out of the box. I have it working out of the box on five boxes here four of mine and my wifes
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18:41<sret>i dont understand
18:41<sret>why would only an out of the box speaker work and not USB?
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18:42<ompaul>sret: it will work out of that nice speaker socket first
18:42<ompaul>it may or may now work on your usb
18:42<ompaul> s/now/not
18:42<sret>but it picked it up right away in the default device
18:42<ompaul>you had an audio out?
18:42<ompaul>noise and stuff
18:43<sret>no sound, but it picked up the device in the sound settings
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18:43<vacco>Hello! Would anybody be able to help me out a little bit with installing Debian to a USB stick?
18:43<sret>before i had device: HDA itntel (Alsa mixer) now i see that and Z-10 USB speaker (Alsamixer)
18:44<ompaul>you want two things - to show that alsa has worked (you need audio output to do that) and then to show that esd also works
18:44<yoshio>sret: you have alsa-base, alsa-oss and alsa-utils installed?
18:44<vacco>with the stick plugged in, I type sudo zcat boot.img.gz > /dev/sdb in Gnome Terminal in Ubuntu, which returns bash: /dev/sdb: No access
18:44<ompaul>sret: I'm not in this conversation going forward
18:45<sret>i got sound working
18:45<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
18:45<sret>but the system sounds dont work, but otherwise it does
18:45<abrotman>ompaul: he's asking how to setup the Debian installer in ubuntu
18:46<abrotman>vacco: try putting the whole command in quotes perhaps?
18:46<sret>i had to select USB audio instead of ALSA Advanced Linux and Sound Arch
18:46<ompaul>abrotman: ack
18:46<sret>ompaul: my usb audio works
18:46<vacco>I should use quotes in the terminal?
18:46<sret>so i guess i dont need no out of the box speaker after al
18:46<sret>its all in the settings from the looks of it
18:47<sret>yoshio: yes i have alsa-base, alsa-utils
18:47<sret>let me check for alsa-oss
18:47<abrotman>vacco: try it .. or don't do it using sudo
18:47<sret>yoshio: alsa-oss wasnt installed, installing it now
18:48<vacco>bash: sudo zcat boot.img.gz > /dev/sdb: No such file or catalog
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18:48<yoshio>sret: there is also an oss-compat package
18:49<ompaul>abrotman: he'll need sudo sudo -i to get to root and then the cat should work
18:49<vacco>ommitting sudo did not help
18:49<abrotman>vacco: sudo su .. just do it as root ?
18:49<yoshio>sret: you selected USB audio instead of alsa where? in the mixer?
18:50<sret>yoshio: in the systems> preferences> sound>
18:50<babilen>vacco: I have not idea if this works in Ubuntu, but you could try "sudo -i" to become root or: sudo sh -c "zcat boot.img.gz > /dev/sdX"
18:50<sret>i had USB audio, ALSA, OSS, and when i did a test for audio playback it worked
18:50<sret>i got a beep
18:50<sney>sudo -s will also make you root
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18:51<babilen>vacco: replace X with a sensible value (insert stick, run "dmesg|tail -n 10" to see which /dev/sdX you need)
18:51<babilen>vacco: and listen to abrotman :)
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18:52<vacco>Thank you, sudo -i seemed to help
18:53<vacco>now, I am following the easy way in this guide:
18:53<yoshio>how do I get aptitude to show me if I have any untrusted packages installed?
18:53<vacco>am I supposed to copy the actual .iso to the stick or mount the .iso and copy the contents?
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18:55<sret>yoshio: the tests passed, but i cant get sound fromsay i tried youtube, nothing
18:55<ompaul>yoshio: start with apt-key list to see if all your repos have the right keys
18:55<abrotman>vacco: the ISO file ..
18:55<ompaul>yoshio: it will tell you if you have keys for all repos you use
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18:59<ompaul>yoshio: there is also this nightmare ;-)
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19:00<vacco>thank you. Does the content of my "Debian Inst" flash stick look OK to you guys: adgtk.cfg f3.txt g2ldr.mbr setup.exe
19:00<vacco>adtxt.cfg f4.txt gtk.cfg splash.png
19:00<vacco>debian-507-amd64-netinst.iso f5.txt initrdg.gz stdmenu.cfg
19:00<vacco>disk.lbl f6.txt initrd.gz syslinux.cfg
19:00<vacco>exithelp.cfg f7.txt ldlinux.sys txt.cfg
19:00-!-vacco was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use or /msg dpkg paste]
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19:04<yoshio>ompaul: apt-key list is fine
19:05<yoshio>sret: esound is no longer developed, seems pulseaudio can do the remote thing
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19:09<yoshio>sret: I was playing the game Gweled (like bejeweled, match three objects), and it turns out that it steals the sound, browser (youtube) won't have audio while the game is running
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19:12<perlsyntax>Does anyone know if the testing is stable yet?
19:12<babilen>!tell perlsyntax -about wwsr
19:12<timon>perlsyntax: testing is not stable because it's testing
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19:12<babilen>perlsyntax: and "testing" will never be "stable" -- squeeze (current testing) will be
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19:13<babilen>perlsyntax: You should have received a private message from dpkg
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19:13<abrotman>perlsyntax: squeeze is suspected to maybe relebleh
19:13<timon>there he goes...
19:14<timon>...anyone else has a good idea of how to keep me from doing those letters I need for the government agency supposed to pay for my job training?
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19:15<sret>aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav
19:15<sret>Playing WAVE '/usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav' : Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 48000 Hz, Mono
19:15-!-MJD [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:15<sret>but i hear nothing
19:18<sret>any ideas? ;/
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19:22<babilen>sret: Was ompaul's description of your setup more or less accurate? If so → make it easier and eliminate error sources (direct connection, no tightvnc, no usb speaker, ...) describe the *exact* setup you have. I would also recommend to talk to the "sound people" in #alsa on freenode as they are likely to know more about sound than we do.
19:24<babilen>sret: That said: Your soundcard is well supported and you shouldn't have problems. It must be something else, so make it *as easy as possible* and make sure it works. You can then venture into more complex setups (although I don't understand why you actually need such a setup, but meh)
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19:26<yoshio>sret: what do you mean by system sounds don't work, but otherwise it does? when you said sound worked, what app were you using?
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19:27<sret>System: preferences: sound: in there you can run tests for playbackk, sound for movies, etc
19:28<sret>it worked there but if it doesnt work if i play a youtube video or something
19:28<sret>babilen: im just tring to get sound working now, it works inside of the gnome sound settings, but not anywhere else
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19:30<babilen>probably some pulseaudio fuckup -- do you have it installed/running?
19:30<yoshio>sret: weird, sound themes are disabled in preferences->sound->preferences in gnome for me
19:30<sret>yeah someone told me to installl pulseaudio in here
19:31<yoshio>and I don't have any place to do tests in there
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19:31<tuxodau>sret: no don `t use pulse
19:31<sret>yoshio: under devices: Sound playback
19:31<sret>i had it selected to USB audio and clicked test, it worked
19:32<sret>sam ewith music and movies, audio conferencing
19:33<sret>ok dont have pulseaudio installed here
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19:34<babilen>sret: try in /etc/asound.conf (if you start it as system daemon) or ~/.asoundrc (if you start it in your window manager) -- kill pulseaudio and restart it. check volume levels with, for example, pavucontrol
19:34<babilen>sret: further details on the pulseaudio wiki
19:34<sret>got no pulseaudio installed here
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19:34<babilen>sret: you just said that you have it installed ... is it installed or not? running or not?
19:34<sret>its not
19:35<babilen>so, your sound is working, just not with flash movies?
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19:35<sret>its not working within alsa either
19:36<sret>the speaker-test or the aplay usr/share/sounds/alsa/xx.wav doesnt work
19:36<sret>it shows its playing wave,, etc but cant hear nothing
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19:37<yoshio>sret: maybe it's trying to send audio to the 1/8" jack rather than the usb speakers?
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19:39<babilen>sret: change the default output
19:41<sret>you mean options snd -pcm thingy?
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19:45*babilen starts some gnome-thingie
19:46<babilen>no, i meant in gnome-control-center → sound → default whatever
19:46*babilen kills gnome-thingie
19:47<global_>Anyone know why gedit would change my scrool behaviour?
19:47<global_>*scroll. I want to hold down on the down arrow to scroll, after gedit opened it is disabled
19:48<abrotman>and it does what instead?
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19:48<sret>babilen: my default mixer is shown as alsa
19:48<sret>default mixer tracks: PCM
19:48<global_>Goes down one line not multiple
19:49<abrotman>but only in gedit ?
19:49<global_>No, now all of them do it AFTER executing gedit
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19:49<abrotman>sounds like something in your gedit preferences ..
19:49<global_>I killed x and it fixed it, i do not want to kill x again
19:50<abrotman>check your keyboard settings in the system->preferences
19:50<abrotman>and/or .. stop using gedit ?
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19:50<global_>I used it once, i mainly don'y
19:50<sret>babilen: i did what the ubuntu link said
19:50<sret>i set default to Speaker
19:50<babilen>sret: So, could you paste the output of "cat /proc/asound/cards again (to a pastebin) please?
19:50<sret>still nothing
19:50<babilen>sret: What did you do?
19:50<global_>what setting would it be though?
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19:51<abrotman>who konws .. remove them all for gedit
19:51<sret>i did asoundconf list
19:51<sret>and ran sudo asoundconf set-default-card Speaker
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19:52<sret>good god that workaround messed it up more, i dont hear anything now
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19:53<babilen>sret: I asked you before -- and you just listed the intel card -- you do indeed have more cards. *sigh*
19:54<babilen> → read and understand that
19:54<sret>i only have USB logitech device
19:54<sret>if i remove that i only have the intel one
19:55<babilen>no, you have card (index 0) snd hda intel and USB-Audio - Z-10 USB Speaker (index 1) you want the latter to be the default
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19:55<babilen>s/card/the intel card
19:55<sret>the USB audio is the logitech one man
19:55<sret>its one thing
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19:55<sret>cards mentioned will have a 0 and if there's more than one it'll have 0,1.2 and so on
19:55<babilen>yes, and it needs to be configured as your soundcard/output
19:56<sret>well based on the ubuntu link
19:56<sret>i did asoundconf
19:56<sret>and set default card to speaker
19:56<sret>and now nothing works
19:56<babilen>sret: Could you please get some headphones somewhere and check the motherboard soundcards headphone output?
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19:57<sret> dont have any here
19:59<yoshio>sret: do you have a 1/8" to RCA connector audio cable to connect to your TV or portable DVD player? then switch the input of the TV or DVD to the external connector, to use as a speaker
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20:05<yoshio>do 'alsamixer', then hit F6 to choose a sound card. is PC Speaker up to a decent level?
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20:07<yoshio>sret: what choices (sound cards) does asoundconf list?
20:08<sret>Speaker, Intel
20:08<sret>f6 does nothing
20:08<yoshio>that's with the USB plugged in?
20:09<yoshio>alsamixer 1.0.23 in squeeze - when I hit F6, it allows me to choose a sound card
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20:10<sret>im in lenny
20:10<yoshio>I don't have asoundconf in squeeze
20:10<sret>f6 doesnt do anything
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20:14<sret>this is pretty fucked up if you ask me
20:14<sret>to get sound working i need to break my head over it
20:15<sret>theres like a 1000 fucking settings for alsa and what not in 10 different places
20:16<yoshio>sret: gives a link to which has "Dupe output to multiple cards"
20:17<yoshio>sret: to do debugging, you should have regular speakers or headphones
20:18<sret>i dont understand that link says i could use USB and modify asound
20:18<sret>by adding external
20:18<drone77>are you trying to set it as the default? or get it to work at all?
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20:19<sret>where the hell is asoundrc file?
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20:21<drone77>you may have to create one
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20:22<sret>i found it
20:22<sret>when i do aplay -L
20:23<sret>i dont see my USB listed there
20:23<yoshio>it says under warning Neither .asoundrc or /etc/asound.conf is normally required.
20:23<sret>i dont see my USb audio in the aplay list
20:24<sret>fuck this shit im done for today
20:24<sret>thakns for all your help
20:24<yoshio>aplay -l -- does this list the usb
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20:24<sret>it does not1
20:25<sret>fuck it man im done
20:25<sret>for today
20:25<sret>fucking pissing me off to no ends, to get just volume working i have to add a line here add a line there, fucking add a ;line up alsa's ass
20:25<sret>good day
20:26<yoshio>delete ~/.asoundrc, see if /etc/asound.conf is screwed up, try to get back to where you were
20:27*abrotman wanted to find good USB headphones .. gave up
20:27<babilen>sret: Run the also info script i gave you earlier -- it queries *all* information you or anybody else might need. Make sure your USB speaker soundcard is working properly and discuss it in #alsa -- there is a USB device list on the wiki
20:28<drone77>my Z10s are playing me music atm
20:28<babilen>drone77: :-þ
20:28<Tiff>You realize you've been talking about sound for like, 5 hours straight, right? That's prob not healthy. :P
20:29<babilen>why buy usb something if you have a soundcard and can buy some nice AKG headphones for the same price (i know, irrelevant)
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20:29<abrotman>babilen: uhm .. because i thought it would be fun
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20:30<drone77>because the speakers have a pretty little LCD in!
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20:57<sret>drone77: yeah
20:57<sret>are you runinng it off gnome?
20:58<sret>babilen: i was in alsa awhile ago, some douchebag who couldnt even write a decent sentence in english had to be check the alsamixer and mademe unmute everything and asked me to do alsamixer -c whatever and still couldnt get a sound, he then said he had to hit to bed
20:58<sret>had me*
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21:00<drone77>sret: nope not gnome
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21:00*dvs_ hides in the bushes
21:00<babilen>sret: Ok, that is unfortunate.
21:01<sret>also he had me take a screenshot of cat proc/sound/cards or whatever
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21:01<sret>sorry had mepaste that to a pastebin and a screenshot of the alsamixer so he could see the settings
21:02<sret>linux needs to seriously work on volume stuff, having to configure so much of crap just to get some volume is ridiculous
21:02-!-dvs is now known as Guest1399
21:02<sret>i mean each wm has its own volume settings, if you muck that up you're screwed, then over hat you got alsa and esd and what not
21:03<drone77>sret do you have anything under /dev/snd/by-id/
21:03<sret>a USB device should be picked up automatically
21:03<sret>not having to edit asoundrc or whatever, it should be automatic!
21:03<sret>let me check
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21:03<babilen>sret: I would start with running the also info script I gave you around 22:30 GMT -- It contains all information one might need and spares #d to ask many questions.
21:04<sret>where is this info script
21:04<babilen>sret: Check your logs -- or google "alsa info script" or something like that
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21:05<babilen>2314 <babilen>;a=blob_plain;f=utils/
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21:06<sret>drone77: there's a bunch of stuff there
21:07<sret>pcm, controlC0, timer
21:07<drone77>mine lists: usb-Logitech_Z-10_USB_Speaker-00
21:07<sret>under where?
21:07<drone77>ls /dev/snd/by-id/
21:08<sret>what should i put in by-id?
21:08<sret>all i have is the stuff i mentoioned, nothing about a USB logitech
21:08<drone77>also here is dmesg from removal and insert of usb cable
21:08<drone77>you shouldn't it should auto populate
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21:11<drone77>what does dmesg show, anything?
21:11<babilen>sret: *please run the script and paste its output*
21:11<sret>yes in dmes i see my USB speaker
21:11<sret>babilen: im frankly tirewd of googling dont take offense
21:11<sret>first it was it to get something working., so i googled, then to get that working i had to google some more
21:12<sret>finally i ended up in ground 0 to get started on something while i have 10 steps to make before i can reach anywhere and it still wont work
21:12<babilen>why google? open link in browser → save → execute
21:12<sret>i dont want to google
21:13<drone77>have you a link to your dmesg output?
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21:13<babilen>sret: And to be honest: I am 100% sure that your hda intel card works without a problem *right now* (and assuming a wage of 7-15€/h you could afford a pair of headphones right now -- just saying)
21:14<babilen>sret: why do you want to google i gave you the link to the script *twice* already ...
21:14<sret>i didnt see it!
21:14<abrotman>whihc kernel is it?
21:14<abrotman>and which intel device?
21:15<babilen>sret: At 23:14 UTC and 02:05 UTC -- check your logs
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21:18<drone77>mm... or not...
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21:21<sret>how ami supposed to run this thing
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21:22<abrotman>shouldn't you ask babilen ?
21:23<sret>ok i ran the script
21:23<sret>it just talks diagnostics
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21:24<abrotman>well .. aren't you having a problem?
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21:26<sret>it lists a bunch of commands, dmesg, lspci, etc, we've been through this, what doi need the info script for?
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21:27<sret>ok alsa information uploaded
21:28<sret>is that it?
21:28<drone77>you could say the location of this mystical upload
21:28*dvs watches abrotman answer in questions
21:29<abrotman>dvs: eh?
21:30<drone77>sret: alsamixer -c 1 doesn't work?
21:30<sret>thats what one of the guys in alsa on freenode said to do
21:31<babilen>intel is still the default card
21:32<sret>yeah lspci said that too
21:32<drone77>yes, but it should still allow access to the other one
21:33<sret>i read on the alsa docs though that if you wished for it to start the USB external speaker then you have to modify it or something
21:33<babilen>well, /me tired (2:30) -- good nite.
21:33<drone77>sret: have you rebooted since your prior fiddling (or at least undone absolutely everything)?
21:34<sret>no javent rebooted
21:34<sret>i dont know what the correct settings are to even see if a reboot will work
21:35<sret>gnome has its own version of sound settings
21:35<sret>even if alsa was ocnfigured right, what about gnome?
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21:35<drone77>worth a shot i guess? if it's being strange and not allowing access for alsamixer -c 1 even though it's clearly listed as the 1
21:35<sret>in the gnome conf editor, the default mixer is alsa
21:35<drone77>hmm, dunno - don't use it, you could try not starting gnome and check?
21:36<sret>how doi check without starting gnome?
21:36-!-dan__ [] has joined #debian
21:36<drone77>go to a terminal (ctrl+alt+f1)
21:36-!-dan__ [] has quit []
21:37<drone77>after killing gnome
21:37<sret>wait, wouodnt that shut off gdm?
21:37<drone77>i don't know about gnome as i say, although i wouldn't have thought it would cause a problem
21:37<sret>ok here it goes
21:37<drone77>gdm is still on ctrl+alt+f7 then, but you can kill it if you like
21:38<sret>ok im in Vt1
21:38<sret>now what/
21:38<drone77>killed gnome?
21:38<sret>killed gdm
21:38<drone77>dunno, try alsamixer
21:39<sret>its at HDA intel, chip realtek ALC662 rev1
21:39<drone77>i was thinking after a reboot (or reload the associated modules) so gnome can't grab them, if it does..
21:39<drone77>and f6 shows nothing in alsamixer?
21:39<drone77>*nothing else?
21:39<sret>f6 doesnt change anything
21:40<sret>i had to do alsamixer -c 1 again to get it back to USB
21:40<drone77>i thought you said alsamixer -c 1 didn't work
21:40<sret>i tried aplay usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav
21:41<sret>it says Playing waveblabla.. signed 16 bit little endian, 48000hz, mono
21:41<sret>but i hear nothing
21:41<drone77>try speaker-test
21:41<sret>playback device is default
21:41<sret>and outputs a bunch of stuff regarding buffer, and then the time period
21:42<sret>Front left front left
21:42<drone77>any noise?
21:42<drone77> speaker-test --device hw:1
21:42<drone77>anything noise-wise?
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21:42<sret>got noise in the USB speakers
21:43<drone77>out of interest - i thought you said alsamixer -c 1 didn't work earlier?
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21:43<sret>so i need to set my default to USB?
21:43<sret>drone77: it didnt as in if i typed alsamixer -c 1 it would set it to USB but if i typed alsamixer again, it went back to HDA itel
21:43<sret>i guess if i switch without the options, it goes back to default..
21:44<drone77>i thought the issue was the speakers didn't work..
21:44<sret>na na the speakers work jut fine
21:44<sret>its getting sound
21:44<sret>i couldnt get sound playing youtube or anything
21:44<drone77>you are setting them to default that's the issue? or just any noise?
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21:45<sret>if i did speaker-test default:hw:1
21:45<sret>i get that white noise, like the alsa docs say
21:45<yoshio>drone77: he said that in system->preferences->sound, the sound test works in Gnome, but aplay and youtube doesn't give audio
21:45<sret>yoshio: yeah
21:45<drone77>ah yes, i never bothered fiddling with it to get it set to default - instead i have an extra 3.5mm jack to connect the intel hda device to the speakers (you need it to default for flash [yewtube] to use it)
21:46<sret>yoshio: and then it stopped working for that too
21:46<drone77>yoshio: i wasn't here then, asked and got confused
21:46<sret>drone77: how to set it to defualt now
21:46<sret>im still in VT1
21:48<drone77>another ball game, i did it once, there were some instructions on ubuntu forums iirc
21:49<sret>ok atleast sound works
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21:49<drone77>try that, bottom post
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21:49<sret>alright will do in the morning im glad it works atleast
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21:50<drone77>if you want the buttons look up xbindkeys
21:50<babilen>drone77: It is explained on the debian wiki under troubleshooting -- i gave you the link earlier
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21:50<drone77>babilen: i thought you were off to bed ;)
21:50<babilen>i'm off active support
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21:51<drone77>babilen: alright, i'll look, ta
21:51<drone77>sret: no problem
21:51<babilen>i meant sret actually :)
21:52<babilen>it's always the same thing -- hence my first question is "cat /proc/asound/cards"
21:52<babilen>and then off to the wiki, configure modules, set default and basta ...
21:53<drone77>my fix (that works fine i might add) to make it default was an extra cable, so it applies to me also
21:54<babilen>the one on the wiki describes it for two "normal" cards -- not sure if it is applicable for USB thingies as well. You might actually need an asound config file ..
21:55-!-Piet [] has joined #debian
21:56<drone77>well looking at my /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base.conf there is a line specifically stating "Prevent USB from being loaded as first soundcard"
21:56-!-thkoch [] has joined #debian
21:56<drone77> so fixing it, cheers for prompting me to get off my arse
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21:57*abrotman thought babilen was going to bed?
21:58<babilen>gah, I just can't watch this ;)
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22:00<yoshio>sret: gstreamer-properties allows you to choose between alsa/oss also
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22:04<sret>just wanted to thakn everyone
22:05*dvs doesn't want to be thakn
22:05<sret>i'll work on the default thing in the morning, wife is a bit pissed i spent like few hrs here on a weekend in front of a computer:P
22:05<babilen>no wonder -- get a laptop and snuggle up with her ;)
22:06<sret>wow totally weird
22:06<sret>i just tried from the terminal speaker-test --device hw:1
22:06<sret>i get a bunch of errors about PCM
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22:07<sret>this is from the terminal running in GDM
22:07-!-chitchat [] has joined #debian
22:08<sret>is that because i didnt set it as default yet or a possible GDM issue?
22:08<sret>yoshio: i have that
22:10<yoshio>sret: speaker-test default:hw:1
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22:11<sret>getting errors running that with GDM on
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22:38<twb>I'm running debmirror against and, and it's successfully fetching the Contents files of the latter, but not the former.
22:38<twb>As you can see, both HAVE the Contents files for me to fetch -- anyone want to help me work out what's going wrong?
22:39<twb> is the script
22:39<twb> is the typescript
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22:52<sret>drone77: i set 0 to USB
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22:55<drone77>sret: cool
22:55<drone77>hope all goes according to plan, did you resolve the GDM thing?
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23:00<sret>I GOT IT WORKING
23:00<sret>guys thanks a bunch!!!
23:00<sret>i remoced snd_intel
23:01<sret>for the time being i had it removed, it picked up my USB as 0 and modified the asoundrc file as Alsa says, friggin works!!1 finally!!!!!!! thanksss
23:01<sret>drone77: what about the GDM thing? yeah it works in gdm, outside gdm anywhere:P
23:03<sret>fucking works, ok time to sleep:D
23:03<sret>thanks all
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23:09<drone77>sret: night
23:09<yoshio>sret: you can blacklist the snd_intel i you don't need it
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23:19-!-mode/#debian [+l 430] by debhelper
23:20<edbian>Is there something similar to the janitor utility in ubuntu here in Debian?
23:22-!-GetsomeSON [] has joined #debian
23:23<GetsomeSON>hello what server would i join to get help with WEP key hacking?
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23:25<GetsomeSON>is anyone here
23:25-!-GetsomeSON [] has quit []
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23:29<amphi>edbian: what is the 'janitor utility'?
23:30<edbian>amphi, It cleans up things like temp files and such. If I knew exactly what it did I would just do those things manually
23:31<amphi>if you don't know what it does, why do you want it? ;)
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23:38<simonrvn>edbian: tmpreaper?
23:39<edbian>amphi, I want to investigate it ;)
23:39<edbian>simonrvn, I'll look at that
23:40<simonrvn>there's also some other one, less specific, can't recall the name right now
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23:40<simonrvn>!wb streuner_
23:40<dpkg>O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay! streuner_ has returned!
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23:41<babilen>edbian: bleachbit ftw ;)
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23:41<edbian>babilen, I'll look at that too
23:42<faheem>is it still the case that the report doesn't get automatically subscribed to a Debian bts? That used to be so.
23:44-!-smv [smv@] has quit [Quit: protect freedom, don't abuse it]
23:46<simonrvn>er? report*er* you mean maybe?
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23:48<faheem>simonrvn: reporter, yes. sorry.
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23:49<simonrvn>dunno. i was always under the impression i was subbed to the bug itself.
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23:54<faheem>simonrvn: checking for the package gives for example
23:54<faheem>and nothing else that looks relevant.
23:56<faheem>See also
23:56<faheem>simonrvn: this at least used to not be the case
23:57<ananth123>how do i find out which version of opengl is being used by the nouveau driver? i cannot see any opengl string in the /var/log/Xorg.log
23:57<simonrvn>somehow got borked..
23:58<simonrvn>ananth123: try glxinfo
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---Logclosed Mon Jan 24 00:00:40 2011