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#debian IRC Logs for 2011-04-06

---Logopened Wed Apr 06 00:00:29 2011
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00:31<Judas_PhD>Has anyone had problems with udev version 167-1 from the unstable branch?
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01:09<mesaber>hello, I have debian with xfce and i have to mount partitions every time>
01:09<mesaber>any idea?
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01:11<sney>mesaber: what do you mean
01:11<cthuluh>be more patient...
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01:12<mesaber>i want to automount partitions
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01:12<sney>what partitions? like on an external drive?
01:12<cthuluh>working here, on debian stable
01:13<cthuluh>nothing particular except perhaps that pmount is installed
01:13<mesaber>same hd but only the linux part is mounted
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01:13<mesaber>wi pmount?
01:14<cthuluh> list of installed xfce packages
01:14<cthuluh>why? I don't remember
01:14<sney>mesaber: what filesystem is the other partition you want to automount?
01:15<cthuluh>!tell mesaber -about ntfs
01:16<sney>!user accessible ntfs
01:16<dpkg>To get an NTFS or VFAT file system accessible by users and groups on the local machine, man mount; man 5 fstab; and read about the umask, fmask, dmask, uid, and gid options. You'll end up sticking something like conv=auto,uid=<user>,gid=<group>,dmask=0002,fmask=0003 into your fstab's mount option field.
01:16<sney>cthuluh: he wants it in fstab for automount, so this ^ is what he needs (unfortunately)
01:16<sney>it's a stupid pain in the ass and it's all microsoft's fault.
01:17<cthuluh>I don't have ntfs partitions to test with, but I'm sure that xfce can automount it
01:17<mesaber>sorry dudes, still a noob
01:17<mesaber>the easy way
01:17<cthuluh>let me test
01:17<cthuluh>there's no easy way, btw
01:17<cthuluh>ntfs is a pita
01:17<sney>you can also run the ntfs-3g binary setuid root, and chown the relevant partition to your user, but this is a gaping security hole (tm) and not recommended unless it's a system with nothing important on it
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01:18<sney>(this may or may not be how sney gets his WoW fix once every 6 months or so))
01:18<mesaber>thanks for help
01:19<sney>and even the suid/chown hack requires scripting of some rudimentary sort
01:20<sney>it really stinks, why can't somebody write a jfs or ext3 or whatever driver for windows so this nonsense isn't necessary
01:20<jm_>there is ext3 driver for windows ...
01:20<mesaber>can i convert ntfs to ext3?
01:21<sney>jm_: is it any good?
01:21<sney>I remember there were some ext* file browser applications for windows but that's not the same
01:21<jm_>sney: I don't trust it to use write access, so can't comment on that part, but reading works fine for me
01:22<jm_>yup, that feller also wrote a FS driver later, and then there are several others too
01:22<mesaber>thanks guys
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01:22<cthuluh>huh. I've nuked an usb key just to help him...
01:22<dpkg>[ext2ifs] "Ext2 Installable File System For Windows" is a Microsoft Windows NT4/2000/XP/2003/Vista/2008 driver for accessing <ext2> and <ext3> filesystems, supports reading and writing. See also <ext2read>, <ext2fsd>.
01:23<sney>jm_: sney likes this.
01:23<sney>cthuluh: still be interesting to know what happens when you try it
01:23<sney>I didn't know windows would let you ntfs a removable drive though.
01:24<cthuluh>who makes you think I run windows? :P
01:24<cthuluh>but it does, if people didn't lie to me
01:25<sney>you seem to have the ability to format something with ntfs
01:25<sney>last I checked, windows was the only thing able to do that, unless you just have a handy disk image or something
01:25<cthuluh>see the ntfsprogs package
01:25<sney>I own more legit xp licenses than I know what to do with, you'll get no flak from me
01:26<sney>huh, how about that
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01:34<cthuluh>sney: working fine, automounted, user-writable, etc
01:34<kop>I thought there was a way to make a ntfs fs.
01:34<cthuluh>well, I've just did
01:38<cthuluh>I'm just unable to mount it on openbsd. perhaps a partitioning issue, shouldn't be a big problem...
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01:43<chiku01>does exist for 32bits ?
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01:44<chiku01>package libpam-unix2
01:45<chiku01>it should be in side /lib32/security/, isn't it ?
01:45<cthuluh>I don't understand. I can install it on i386
01:45<cthuluh>but you seem to imply something else, as running a 32 bit lib on a 64 bit arch
01:46<chiku01>my arch is 64
01:46<cthuluh>then I can't help
01:47<chiku01>you can run 32bits on 64arch right ?
01:47<cthuluh>in most cases, yes
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01:48<chiku01>I don't find for 32bits from package search
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01:51<cthuluh>but, isn't is available in the amd64 repo?
01:52<chiku01>amd64 already installaed
01:53<chiku01>but I got this error wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64]
01:53<cthuluh>dpkg -L libpam-unix2 to see the files installed
01:53<dpkg>No packages found matching libpam-unix2 to see the files installed
01:53<cthuluh>sorry, poor bot
01:53<cthuluh>chiku01: running what?
01:54<chiku01>vmware-authd[24482]: PAM [error: /usr/lib/vmware/lib/ wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64]
01:54<cthuluh>ewww, vmware...
01:54<chiku01>vmware try to use 32bit pam
01:54<cthuluh> see here, there seems to be some good hints on this page
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01:54<cthuluh>should I add that vmware is braindead?
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01:55<chiku01>nevermind, this module is sufficient
01:55<chiku01>and I can logon
01:55<chiku01>just want to get no log error
01:55<cthuluh>but wait, isn't there a 64bit version of this stuff?
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01:58<jm_>he probably has a 32bit app
01:58<jm_>you'll need to wait for multi-arch support to be available for such stuff
01:59<mjt>extracting files from libpam-unix2 to /lib32/... wont help?
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01:59<mjt>i assume pam will look into /lib/security/ not /lib32/security/
01:59<chiku01>maybe it's good idea
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02:25<Garp>Question: On my machine (Debian squeeze - that is powered most of the time), I have (as default I think) both anacron and cron installed. It seems however that cron.daily is always performed by anacron, that very unfortunately start it at about 6am, and I would prefer 2am. I've failed to understand how anacdron was triggered and how I could set up a right time for it to start. Any help? Thanks.
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02:36<johnsmith_>good morning
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02:39<jm_>Garp: because /etc/crontab has this test -x /usr/sbin/anacron || ( cd / && run-parts --report /etc/cron.daily )
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02:45<Garp>jm_: Am I right then just to remove anacron ?
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02:48<jm_>Garp: in that case some cron jobs will not run if your machine is powered off
02:49<Garp>jm_: But I dont see anything else I cpould do, because I dont want them at 6-7am
02:49<doubledutch>I know this isn't #google, but I want to try out Chromium-browser. Should I use Google's repo or just apt-get it?
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02:49<doubledutch>I just asked this in freenode... it's about apt-get/newness of a Debian package vs developer's commercial Debian repo... figured I'd heed "!ask"
02:50<Garp>doubledutch: chromium is in debian
02:50<doubledutch>I am using Wheezy
02:50<jm_>Garp: can't you change it in /etc/anacrontab?
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02:50<jm_>!info chromium-browser wheezy
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02:51<Garp>doubledutch: afaik, binaries provieded by Google includes lots of spywares. I would not encourage ppl to use them. Binaries recompiled for the open source bases of chrome by debian sould be fine
02:51<jm_>!info chromium-browser
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02:52<Garp>jm_ : doesnt seems like, anacron is not tied to a specific time as expected
02:52<EmleyMoor>fcron is a good alternative to cron/anacron for a machine not always on. It does tasks at set times if possible or as soon as possible thereafter
02:52<jm_>wheezy has some older version it seems
02:52<jm_>Garp: yeah but it should run it at that time if machine is powered on, no?
02:52<EmleyMoor>Garp: fcron will probably be what you need
02:52<Garp>EmleyMoor: thanks for the information
02:52<Garp>EmleyMoor: I take note
02:53<EmleyMoor>jm_: No - anacron runs x amount of time after last time - regardless of the actual time
02:54<EmleyMoor>I've been using fcron for a while - it has some very useful settings
02:54<Garp>Thanks everybody, I have to go now, see ya.
02:54<Garp>I'll try fcron
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02:56<doubledutch>!info chromium-browser
02:56<dpkg>chromium-browser: (Chromium browser - transitional dummy package), section web, is optional. Version: 10.0.648.204~r79063-1 (sid), Packaged size: 166 kB, Installed size: 1668 kB
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02:59<jm_>ahh I had a space after package name and it's not smart enough to exclude it :)
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03:07<doubledutch>jm_: It's all good - super helpful/most helpful IRC-er ever, as usual
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04:36<doubledutch>!selftell anyone
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04:50<dselect>Hi! I'm here as a backup for dpkg since he seems to be pining for the fjords. My database is readonly so don't try changing factoids. My address character is %.
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04:51<weasel>now we need a factoid in dpkg that starts with %
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05:34<fralle>sombody knows hot to intall eclipse git plugin? :)
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06:17<XTF>Hi. Can the network be expected to be up at the time @reboot cron jobs run?
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06:20<jm_>XTF: looks like it with dependency based boot since cron init script has Required-Start: $remote_fs
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06:22<locklace>there must be some non tortuous and horrible way to just record alsa's sound output to a .wav
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06:23<petemc>XTF: also looks like it with sysv as its S13networking and S18cron
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06:23<jm_>locklace: as in arecord?
06:23<jm_>ohh sound output, no that's not it
06:23<locklace>jm_: i'd be happy to use arecord if it worked
06:24<jm_>locklace: yeah I misunderstood, arecord is for recording sound input
06:24<XTF>jm_: Does $remote_fs ensure net is available even if no remote FSs are defined?
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06:27<locklace>i just want a simple capture of whatever's sent to the sound output
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06:28<locklace>jm_: it would probably work if you could do something like create a virtual "input" device that loops back whatever goes to the output, but i can't find a way to do that
06:28<jm_>XTF: the way I understand it yes, but don't take this for granted
06:29<jm_>locklace: tried this ?
06:30<jm_>locklace: or this
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06:32<locklace>there is no "mix" capture device on this card (or at least no such thing shows up in alsamixer), so that method doesn't work, and having to create a separate device and tell specific applications to send output there is awful
06:35<XTF>jm_: I'm asking because often my @reboot apt-get job fails.
06:35<babilen>XTF: What kind of job is that and why don't you create an init script for it that depends on $network ?
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06:37<jm_>XTF: or simply run it from post-up hook
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06:40<XTF>babilen: Just a custom apt-get update / upgrade download job.
06:41<babilen>XTF: Any particular reason why you don't use cron-apt for that?
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06:42<babilen>XTF: Please also note the warning in the description of that package -- I assume that this applies to your script as well.
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06:43<babilen>XTF: I guess you also want to depends on $named as $network just makes sure that the interfaces itself are configured. It would help us if you could describe what you are actually trying to achieve.
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06:44<adamthecamper>Hello, I found something I regard a bug in Debian, but I am not sure where to ask about it.
06:44<babilen>adamthecamper: Tell us more about it :)
06:44<XTF>babilen: Didn't know about cron-apt and the manual thing worked fine. My script only downloads pkgs, so the warning doesn't apply.
06:45<adamthecamper>I want to install Selinux on my x-less server, but setools depend on loads of GUI libs
06:45<XTF>babilen: What I'm trying to achieve is to have new pkgs ready to be installed after I boot.
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06:46<adamthecamper>and I haven't found no package that would provide setools for commandline only. Not even in testing/unstable.
06:47<adamthecamper>What can I do? Should I ask package maintainer, or file a bug? :)
06:47<babilen>adamthecamper: I guess you want at least selinux-basics and selinux-tools
06:47<babilen>adamthecamper: setools are GUI tools AFAICT
06:48<adamthecamper>well, selinux-basics still depends on them, and I dont need gui on my server
06:48<babilen>adamthecamper: Read -- It does not mention that setools are mandatory for SELinux but explicitly mentions that these are optional ones
06:49<babilen>,depends selinux-basics
06:49<judd>Package selinux-basics -- depends: checkpolicy, policycoreutils, selinux-utils, python.
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06:50<babilen>adamthecamper: selinux-basics does not *depend* on setools, but it *recommends* them. If you don't want to install the recommended packages you can run "aptitude -R" or "aptitude --without-recommends"
06:50<babilen>!apt recommends
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06:50<dpkg>APT installs recommended packages by default since Lenny. To disable once, "aptitude -R install packagename" or "apt-get --no-install-recommends install packagename". To disable permanently, echo "APT::Install-Recommends no;" > /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/no-recommends. By not installing "recommended" packages, you will miss the standard functionality they provide. Squeeze's <D-I> installs recommended packages by default. See <why recommends>
06:50<vikas>how to enable desktop effects in gnome
06:50<babilen>,recommends selinux-basics
06:50<judd>Package selinux-basics -- recommends: setools, selinux-policy-default.
06:50<babilen>adamthecamper: Please check if you want selinux-policy-default to be installed.
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06:53<babilen>vikas: run "gconf-editor" and check the value of /apps/metacity/general/compositing_manager
06:53<adamthecamper>yes, that is probably the problem, I will try to skip the recomended packages
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06:55<adamthecamper>great, that was the problem, thanks for help! :-)
06:56<babilen>You are welcome
06:57<vikas>yes it already checked compositing_manager
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07:00<vikas>how to rotate window when it minimize and open
07:00<vikas>i have installed avant window nevigater
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07:23<ZeroEnna>HI @ all
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07:26<ZeroEnna>I have a question concerning Debian lenny. Who in general is responsible for releasing Updates from packages? Because I would like to use some new features in a package, but the repo version is not up to date
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07:28<jm_>ZeroEnna: which package?
07:29<ZeroEnna>jm_ cacti: The are about to release version 0.8.7h, while Debian has 0.8.7b in its repos
07:29<ZeroEnna>I know I can self compile it, but I would like to not do any experiments with productive systems
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07:31<tim_>hey guys; did somebody blow something up at the repositories? Because I just upgraded my desktop and laptop today, and they both went plonk; whereas they working just fine until after the upgrade/restart.
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07:35<jm_>ZeroEnna: debian has 0.8.7g in current stable release, don't expect it in lenny
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07:36<loigod>connect ct
07:36<loigod>to usr
07:37<loigod>top da
07:37<dutchfish>!tell loigod about pastebin
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07:38<ZeroEnna>jm_ okay, but I can't upgrade, because I don't know how my server will react v.v
07:38<loigod>how to quit
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07:39<loigod>see you
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07:40<jm_>ZeroEnna: well you better start planning for it
07:41<tim_>you know what debian needs? A big fat "undo update" button... that you can run from the terminal in recovery mode because everything else has gone plonk. :P
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07:45<tim_>hm; it seems that my roundabout calls for help are being misconstrued as unhumourous jokes. Is this the place to get help with problems with debian?
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07:47<nutterpc>i dont know tim_
07:47<nutterpc>i didnt hear what the problem u had was
07:47<nutterpc>been unwindin after work
07:47*nutterpc 's brain is a friend one after dealing with windows
07:47<tim_>nutterpc: no worries; also, poor you :P
07:48<nathan>i would like to upgrade to squeeze. I m following the info given by dpkg so i want to make sure that my sources.list is ok :
07:48<tim_>well, I'll start with my laptop
07:49<nutterpc>they look ok, BUT
07:49<tim_>grub is at 1280x768 resolution, but as soon as I press enter, linux switches to ~800x600?
07:49<nutterpc>saying that
07:49<nutterpc>i wouldnt suggest running experimental
07:49<nutterpc>not unless you got pl;enty of hair/patience
07:50<tim_>then it proceeds through the usual boot cycle without any other errors, but when it tries to load gdm, it gives a blank screen instead, with a blinking cursor
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07:50<nathan>nutterpc, talking to me? :))
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07:50<nathan>nutterpc, what i have to change?
07:50<tim_>nathan: your line 5 says squee but your line 4 says lenny; is that intentional? They seem to be grouped together.
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07:51<nutterpc>hold a sec
07:51<nutterpc>work email just came thru
07:51*nutterpc goes to read
07:51<nathan>tim_, made a mistake, thanks.
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07:52<tim_>But yes, back to my complaint, pressing ctrl-alt-F1 only momentarily flashes the contents of that console and all I can do is restart into recovery mode.
07:52<nutterpc>lol, soz im trying to think of 2 things at once
07:53*nutterpc just realised he was looking at nathan 's issue
07:53<nathan>: DD
07:53<tim_>hey! I was here first! :P
07:53<nathan>I have time it s ok x)
07:53<nathan>handle the tim_ issue first
07:53<nutterpc>experimental is like trying to snort wasabi
07:54<nutterpc>you can do it
07:54<tim_>I'm kidding; I have a feeling my issues are going to take a looong time.
07:54<nutterpc>but it WILL HURT
07:54<tim_>nutterpc: I happen to like snorting wasabi. :P
07:54<nathan>what experimental is?
07:54<tim_>nathan: It's the bleeding edge of the bleeding edge.
07:54<nutterpc>oh so do i mate
07:54<nutterpc>eat huge dobs of it
07:54<tim_>nathan: Personally, I only upgrade packages to experimental if I really need the features.
07:55<nathan>squeeze = experimental?
07:55<nathan>: O
07:55<tim_>nathan: So, I really only have a few packages at experimental.
07:55<nutterpc>with the gdm issue
07:55<nutterpc>what graphics driver?
07:55<tim_>nathan: I'm not sure, actually; I type stable, unstable, testing and experimental; I don't use their names. :P
07:55<nathan>i don't understand ><, squeeze isn't the stable release?
07:55<nutterpc>squeeze is
07:56<nathan>if i update to squeeze, there is nothing about experimental
07:56<nutterpc>squeeze is stable
07:56<nutterpc>sid unstable
07:56<tim_>nutterpc: That's a good question. How do I check which one is loaded again?
07:57<nathan>!dpkg experimental
07:57<nutterpc>open an xterm and type lsmod, see what comes up, it should show up in that list your graphics driver somewhere
07:57<dpkg>experimental is the bleeding edge of Debian Development. Packages here have been deemed unfit/DANGEROUS/untrustworthy/etc for release by the maintainer responsible for them. DO NOT INSTALL PACKAGES FROM EXPERIMENTAL WITHOUT KNOWING EXACTLY WHY AND WHAT YOU ARE DOING. #debian does _not_ support experimental. For an actual description, see section of the Developer's Reference.
07:57<nathan>i understand now ^^
07:58<jm_>!which driver
07:58<dpkg>To work out what module you need to load for your PCI card, try pasting the output from "lspci -n" into . To determine the driver currently associated with an Ethernet interface, ask me about <which ethernet module>. To show the video driver used by your X server: grep Load.*mod.*driv /var/log/Xorg.0.log . See also <oot>, <nodriver>, <judd-hardware>.
07:58<nutterpc>!dpkg sid
07:58<gsimmons>nathan: (re sources.list paste) squeeze/volatile does not exist (lines 10-11) ; /msg dpkg squeeze-updates
07:58<nutterpc>brb all
07:59<babilen>nathan: You should read and follow the release notes -- /msg dpkg squeeze release notes
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07:59<nathan>i have to keep backports?
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08:01<tim_>nutterpc: Well, it says it loads fbdev_drv
08:01<nathan>i just want to understand, if i update from my current sources.list, i ll get stable packages?
08:01<nathan>or experimental?
08:02<tim_>nutterpc: However, it also spazes out, saying that /dev/fb0 doesn't exist.
08:02<tim_>nathan: If squeeze is stable, and you put in squeeze, then it'll go to squeeze.
08:03<tim_>nathan: As far as I'm aware, it will never upgrade to experimental unless you explicitly tell it to. Or at least, that's been my experience.
08:03<babilen>nathan: If you upgrade your lenny system to squeeze you will upgrade from oldstable to stable. This has nothing to do with experimental. Please read and follow the release notes. In particular the "What's new in Debian GNU/Linux 6.0" and the fourth chapter are relevant.
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08:05<tim_>nutterpc: syslog has a massive amount of warnings about the GdmDisplay lasting less than ~0.03 seconds.
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08:06<nathan>Ok thanks. I ll read it
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08:10<nutterpc>tim_, that sounds like you havent even installed the driver
08:10<nutterpc>or more to the point
08:10<nutterpc>it hasnt been installed
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08:11<nutterpc>fbdev_drv is the framebuffer driver, which isnt the one u want to see going handgrenade
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08:11<tim_>nutterpc: according to aptitude, xserver-xorg-video-fbdev is installed as 1:0.4.2-6; I'm not sure if that was part of the recent upgrade.
08:11<jm_>in most cases you don't want to use plain FB driver
08:12<nutterpc>thats why ur display isnt working
08:12<nutterpc>can you get into recovery mode?
08:12<tim_>Why isn't it working? And yes; I'm there now.
08:13<tim_>jm_: I know, but at this point I'd settle on getting it working first, then getting a more efficient driver.
08:13<nutterpc>try typing this (might have a commanbd or something missing, regaining brain power after today, 3 failed deployments out of 5 which i had to fix) _-_
08:13<nutterpc>Xorg -configure
08:14<tim_>it segfaulted :P
08:14<tim_>right after saying that it can't find /dev/fb0
08:14<nutterpc>you have one very sick xorg
08:15<tim_>aye, that I do
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08:15<nutterpc>its trying to connect to FB, which in reality, it should be doing this
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08:15<nutterpc>DRIVER -> FB -> Xorg
08:16<nutterpc>the graophics driver initialises the FB
08:16<tim_>also, very sadly, I've forgotten how to configure my ethernet connection using the console :P
08:16<nutterpc>if theres no driver, theres no fb
08:16<nutterpc>hence the error
08:16<nutterpc>then if its eth0
08:16<nutterpc>just ifconfig eth0 up
08:17<tim_>nutterpc: Yeah, but doesn't it usually give that screen that says blah blah unable to initialise xorg and dumps you back into the console?
08:17<nutterpc>run ifconfig again to confirm it giving you an IP
08:17<nutterpc>yea it does
08:17<nutterpc>when it has a driver its tried to load
08:17<nutterpc>and couldnt
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08:18<tim_>awesome :P
08:18<nutterpc>anyone else for a beer?
08:18*nutterpc going to the fridge for another
08:18<tim_>I think I need something harder :P
08:19<jm_>tim_: these days debian kernels enable KMS by default and that's what X driver then uses
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08:19<nutterpc>brb then
08:19<nutterpc>bleh, brains fried after the shit today
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08:21*nutterpc sits down with another beer
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08:22<tim_>how do I tell ifconfig to dhcp client?
08:23<nutterpc>dhclient eth0 iirc
08:24<jm_>tim_: edit the interfaces file - "man interfaces" has an example
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08:25<tim_>jm_: Yeah, tried that first, but I must've made a mistake somewhere; running dhclient directly worked.
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08:26<jm_>tim_: that's what ifup would run for you if configured properly
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08:26<tim_>jm_: I know; but like I said I must've screwed something up. I've done this all before but god I'm so rusty now.
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08:26<nutterpc>jm_, i really hope idont get a private support call for windows in the next few days
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08:26<nutterpc>i think im going to scream if i do
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08:27<tim_>nutterpc: What's your number? Much as I hate it, I'll install windoze just for you. :P
08:27<nutterpc>but then the company i work for supports it, so i have no choice
08:28*nutterpc hurls an empty beer bottle at tim_
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08:28<tim_>Finished one already? That was quick. :P
08:28<nutterpc>ive had a few linux installs to do the past few days
08:28<nutterpc>they've been good
08:28<nutterpc>nothing heard from those users
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08:29<nutterpc>cept they lovin it
08:29<tim_>Okay; fbdev uninstalled and -intel installed. Time for a restart.
08:31<tim_>Looking bad so far; resolution has been shrunk again.
08:31<nutterpc>why my work cant give me linux installs to go to, i dunno
08:31<tim_>Ah, but at least gdm loads.
08:31<nutterpc>would be better imo
08:31<nutterpc>see i told u
08:32*nutterpc taps his nose
08:32<tim_>well, now the touchpad isn't working :P
08:32<nutterpc>better go make my bed shortly
08:32<tim_>I'll reinstall -thingo
08:32*nutterpc has to be in bed shortly, early start again tomorrow
08:32<tim_>nooo not yet; I have so many more problems :P
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08:33<jm_>tim_: verify that you have the touchpad driver installed
08:33<tim_>jm_: Doing that now.
08:33<nutterpc>use lsmos
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08:35<tim_>What's it called for touchpad? (At least video is there now. :P)
08:35<tim_>There's no mouse either, btw.
08:35<tim_>But I've reinstalled -synaptics so I'll give it a kick in the guts and see.
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08:36*tim_ is scratching out the windoze logo on his hp laptop
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08:37<nutterpc>i just cut mine out
08:37<nutterpc>mine runs debian, all it ever will run
08:37<jm_>xserver-xorg-input-mouse for mouse
08:37<nutterpc>so will my new desktop
08:38<tim_>but if you scratch it off, it leaves a nice shiny mirror :P
08:38<nutterpc>u need synaptics
08:38<tim_>did it on my other laptop too :P
08:38<nutterpc>not mouse
08:38<jm_>heh I remember printing tux in colour once to put it on a case over the windows logo
08:38<tim_>Yeah, I just uninstalled and reinstalled -synaptics, but still no good :\
08:38<jm_>he can safely install both synaptics and mouse driver
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08:39<nutterpc>jm_, considering i get paid for the hand grenade rollouts i did today 60 p/hour
08:39<nutterpc>i aint complaining
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08:39<nutterpc>machines which didnt wanna play ball
08:39-!-grochap [~grochap@] has joined #debian
08:39<nutterpc>made it worse they were semi mission critical
08:40<jm_>nutterpc: 60 pushups/hour?
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08:40<nutterpc>jm_, $60AUD
08:40<nutterpc>per hour
08:40<jm_>ah "per"
08:41<nutterpc>and these clients were like the fkn ops managers also
08:41<nutterpc>and main workers
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08:41<nutterpc>they sittin there going bonkers, im just sittin there tapping away, on the phone drinking a redbull
08:41<nutterpc>no worries on my face
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08:42<tim_>nice :P
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08:42<tim_>what city?
08:42<nutterpc>on the phone to their support line that is
08:42<nutterpc>in aus tho, not US
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08:43<nutterpc>ah tpg
08:43<nutterpc>in SA
08:43<tim_>nutterpc: I kinda figured that from the AUD; unless the yanks have changed to using our currency. :P
08:43<nutterpc>u in nsw?
08:44<tim_>I remember when tpg was tiny
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08:44<tim_>aye; how did you guess?
08:44*nutterpc is psychic
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08:44<tim_>And back to the problem at hand, I've reinstalled and then also downgraded -synaptic, but still no go.
08:44<nutterpc>saw ur IP u connected with
08:44<nutterpc>most ones i seen like that come from nsw
08:45<nutterpc>the driver is loaded yes
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08:45<nutterpc>its not telling xog to loas the synaptics driver
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08:45<nutterpc>its telling it to load the mouse one
08:45<tim_>I don't have the mouse one installed, though
08:46<nutterpc>you need to see if u can edit the xorg.conf file to change the mouse driver to synaptics
08:46<nutterpc>or see what it is trying to load
08:46<tim_>nor do I have a xorg.conf file, so it should be generating one each load.
08:46<nutterpc>if anything
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08:54<tim_>well, xorg.log makes no mention of trying to load synaptics
08:54<nutterpc>there u go
08:54<nutterpc>synaptics is the touchpad driver
08:54<nutterpc>hence why u have no mouse
08:55<nutterpc>taken 4-5 beers for my memory to come back after today
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08:55<tim_>Indeed; but why?
08:55<nutterpc>thats how u know it was a bad day
08:55<nutterpc>tim_, what hardware is it
08:55<nutterpc>ur laptop
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08:56<tim_>nutterpc: er; it's an hp compaq nc6400
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08:59<tim_>It's not anything "special", and I have my old nc4010 running with synaptics as well
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08:59<jm_>try comparing the logs between the two, but I have to go now
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09:01<nutterpc>tim_, try checking on the net to see if u can find others who have that machine
09:01<nutterpc>i need sleep
09:01<nutterpc>gottsa be up early
09:01*nutterpc wanders off
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09:03<tim_>nutterpc: Thanks for your help.
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10:30<Kennix>Does anyone ever talk in here?
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10:36<kop>Kennix: No. If you just want to chat go to #debian-offtopic.
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10:36<Kennix>What would this room be for then?
10:36<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
10:37<kop>Kennix: !topic
10:37<kop>Kennix: Debian support.
10:37<Kennix>Ok, what would anyone say is the best filesystem for Debian? reiserfs, ext3, ext4?
10:38-!-Name1ess [] has joined #debian
10:38<OdyX>Kennix: "it depends"
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10:38<Kennix>Oh ok
10:38<OdyX>Kennix: for standard use, I'd go with ext4, but then it's a matter of taste.
10:38<babilen>Kennix: ext3, ext4, jfs and xfs are all sensible choices. What attributes would the "best" filesystem have in your opinion?
10:39<Kennix>Ok, thanks
10:39<Kennix>I am looking for something that can handle large file transfers
10:39<Kennix>bigger than 4gb
10:40<Kennix>What would be the quickest ?
10:40<kop>Kennix: If you want something stable/proven then I hear jfs is good for large files.
10:40<daemonkeeper>reiserfs is dead, Everything else is fine. XFS shows good performance for large files.
10:40<OdyX>see. "it depends" :->
10:40<daemonkeeper>And 4 GB is no size limit but for vfat.
10:40<Kennix>ok, I will try those...thank you
10:41<Kennix>Well 4Ggb seems so slow transferring from ext3
10:41<Kennix>I heard reiserfs is suppose to be good for huge file transfers so I thought I wowuld check
10:41<daemonkeeper>Well, the file system won't be the culprit.
10:41<kop>Kennix: The only thing that should be slow, IIRC, with ext3 is deleting.
10:41<babilen>Kennix: if in doubt stay with ext* -- What kind of machine is this for? Which services will you run? Tell us more about your needs and the hardware/software you have or plan to use.
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10:42<kop>babilen: Is ext4 "stable" in the squeeze kernel?
10:42<Kennix>It is a samba and SSH server...need to transfer alot of video and other stuff over LAN
10:42<babilen>kop: It's just not (yet) the default fs in d-i
10:42<Kennix>and locally
10:43<Kennix>I did hear that ext4 was unstable in squeeze and did not know if I should use it
10:43<daemonkeeper>For your local system don't use XFS.
10:43<babilen>Kennix: I would go with ext4 or jfs ... and probably ext4 because more people are familiar with it.
10:43<daemonkeeper>XFS has problems with power outages and "hmm, just plug it off and on"
10:43<kop>Kennix: You need to instrument and find out why it's slow.
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10:44<sney>reiserfs development is stalled due to the principal developer being in jail.
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10:44<daemonkeeper>That's what I said.
10:44<sney>you didn't say why. sometimes "is dead" can be taken as a statement of opinion
10:44<daemonkeeper>kop: Its not the file system which slows down a file transfer on home equipment (anyway).
10:44<daemonkeeper>sney: Ok, you're right.
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10:45<Kennix>ok, I will try ext4 and jfs, thank you guys
10:45-!-AbsintheSyringe [] has quit [Quit:]
10:45<kop>Kennix: Unless you're using jumbo frames, and have a switch and endpoints to handle it, you'll not get the "best" performance out of your network.
10:45<sney>I've been using jfs since years before Hans Resiser killed his wife and I've had overall positive experiences with it.
10:46<daemonkeeper>Right. Its the network, its the NIC, the disk, SSH/Samba which slows down things.
10:46<daemonkeeper>I am curious how many years Hans has left.
10:46<Kennix>Some are local transfers...from disk to disk
10:46-!-mtn [] has joined #debian
10:47<daemonkeeper>Its still the disk, write performance is poor for home hardware, especially for random IO.
10:47<kop>Kennix: Disks are slow unless you get good ones.
10:47-!-noCloudsDotOrg [~javier@] has joined #debian
10:47<kop>Kennix: Use bonnie++ to benchmark your raw disks.
10:47<Kennix>it is a 15k raptor sata on AMD quad core and 16 gb of ram...would I need to change anything else?
10:48<Kennix>ok, I will try that
10:48<kop>Kennix: You can improve things by using raid1, so two disks are used simultainously. Of course you need twice as many disks.
10:48<daemonkeeper>RAID 1 won't improve anything
10:48<daemonkeeper>RAID 0 you mean
10:48<daemonkeeper>1 is for fault tolerance
10:48<babilen>Kennix: Invest in a good 1GbE or 10GbE NIC and switches ...
10:48<daemonkeeper>Or better RAID levels like 5, 6, 10 ...
10:48<kop>daemonkeeper: Raid 1. It can seek/transfer off both disks at once.
10:49<daemonkeeper>kop: Won't affect write performance.
10:49<kop>daemonkeeper: 5/6 slows things down.
10:49<daemonkeeper>kop: 5 is bad, yes
10:49<Name1ess>trying to get nVidia drivers installed, fresh install of Squeeze/KDE4 using GeForce FX5200. I've been following this page -> <- that's where I am stuck
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10:50<Name1ess>Can anyone offer assistance, or at least leding questions?
10:50<babilen>Name1ess: I would recommend to install the dkms drivers
10:50<babilen>!tell Name1ess -about nvidia
10:50<babilen>!tell Name1ess -about nvidia dkms
10:50<Name1ess>reading ..
10:50<babilen>!tell Name1ess about dkms
10:50<daemonkeeper>babilen: No one needs 10GbE at home. Really. You will hardly even get 1g performance unless you use high end RAID systems as well.
10:50<kop>daemonkeeper: Write performance may or may not improve. If you exceed the sustained transfer rate to a single disk but are spreading the I/O over two disks and the disks have enough cache to finish writing while the transfer shifts to the other disk raid1 can double write performance.
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10:51<babilen>daemonkeeper: I have to confess that my statement regarding 10GbE NICs was done in jest (I should have ;) it)
10:51<Name1ess>make the bot tell me about nvidia dkms-173xx please
10:51-!-Ae| [] has joined #debian
10:51<Kennix>lol ok
10:52<babilen>Name1ess: Is dpkg yourself -- /msg dpkg nvidia dkms-173xx -- or just write "nvidia dkms-173xx" in the chat window with dpkg
10:52<daemonkeeper>kop: That's a a lot of "if" and "can" but I think in principle we're at one.
10:52<babilen>Name1ess: s/Is/Ask
10:52<Name1ess>k, thanks
10:52<Name1ess><dpkg> are you smoking crack?, Name1ess
10:52<daemonkeeper>babilen: Well, I think Kennix whould have found out himself as soon as he would have seen prices for a 10 GbE NIC (not even started to talk about switches :))
10:53<Kennix>lol, yes I did
10:53<babilen>daemonkeeper: probably :)
10:53<kop>Name1ess: You have a typo.
10:53<kop>Name1ess: (You don't want to type the " characters.)
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10:54<Name1ess>> for older series, ask about <nvidia dkms-173xx>
10:54<Name1ess>><Name1ess> dkms-173xx
10:54<Name1ess><dpkg> are you smoking crack?, Name1ess
10:54<babilen>Name1ess: In that case don't write the "<" ">"
10:54<Name1ess>i did not write the anything
10:54<kop>Name1ess: /msg dpkg nvidia dkms-173xx
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10:54<Name1ess>i pasted in precisely what i quoted above
10:55<kop>Name1ess: You also didn't write the "nvidia".
10:55<Name1ess>.... self-facepalm
10:55<babilen>Name1ess: nvidia dkms-173xx (note no < > " and the nvidia)
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10:55<babilen>!pal Name1ess
10:55*dpkg points at Name1ess and laughs uproariously
10:55<Name1ess>o hey, it works if you type it all in
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10:56<mesaber>hello, i need to install firefox and not iceweasel
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10:56<daemonkeeper>Iceweasel /is/ Firefox
10:57<Name1ess>not on KDE 3.5 systems though
10:57<kop>!tell mesaber about why iceweasel
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10:57<Name1ess>i can't install AdBlock Plus in this version of iceweasel
10:57<mesaber>i know it's built on firefox but i want firebug and it tell me it needs last version
10:57<Name1ess>but it installs flawlessly in the version that ships with Squeeze
10:58<kop>,versions iceweasel
10:58<judd>Package iceweasel on i386 -- lenny: 3.0.6-3; lenny-security: 3.0.6-3; squeeze: 3.5.16-5; lenny-backports: 3.5.16-6~bpo50+1; squeeze-security: 3.5.16-6; sid: 3.5.18-1; wheezy: 3.5.18-1; experimental: 4.0-3
10:58-!-firefoxx [] has joined #debian
10:58<daemonkeeper>mesaber: Iceweasel is binary compatible to Firefox. All you need is a newer version then.
10:58<daemonkeeper>If available.
10:58<mesaber>update it
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10:58<mesaber>how to
10:58<bo>Hello, I have troubles with my mic. It's a simple headphone. I hear sound where ever I plug it, but speaking does not work. I tried many different things in the alsa mixer menu but no success. Can somebody tell me a good way to do it? It worked fine before as I used another debian based distro. So I'm sure it's just a small issue actually
10:58<kop>daemonkeeper: Yeah, but there's no easy way to get a newer version in squeeze, packaged by debian.
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10:59<daemonkeeper>mesaber didn't tell the distribution yet, did he?
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10:59<daemonkeeper>Where are you on?
10:59<babilen>kop: (not supported)
10:59<babilen>mesaber: Which version?
10:59<babilen>Which is?
10:59<mesaber>i think
10:59<babilen>mesaber: "cat /etc/debian_version" gives you what?
11:00<Name1ess>babilen: at the bottom of dpkg's info about my driver, the last bit reads "Restart your system to enable the <nouveau> blacklist." Does this mean that the nouveau driver will be removed? (I hope so)
11:00<mesaber>i need to leave , cya later. it's urgent sorry
11:01<babilen>Name1ess: It is blacklisted and the module will not be loaded.
11:01<Name1ess>excellent, ty
11:01<firefoxx>Hello for everybody! I'd like to ask: Will be there a debian with Gnome3? If yes, please tell me when...
11:02<daemonkeeper>Testing/Unstable will get it sooner or later.
11:02<daemonkeeper>Stable too, but ... later :)
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11:03<babilen>firefoxx: Gnome3 has not yet been released (still some hours) and yes, there will be a version of Debian with Gnome3 -- Probably wheezy, but gnome3 will be available in testing/sid soon
11:03<babilen>firefoxx: I wouldn't be surprised if gnome3 is also backported to squeeze, but time will tell.
11:03<firefoxx>babilen: I know it (thanks for the info) but when wheezy will come out?
11:04<daemonkeeper>Probably 2012
11:04<kop>!tell firefoxx about overview
11:04<kop>firefoxx: You can run wheezy now, but it does not have the security support or the stability of a released vesion.
11:05<firefoxx>kop: thanks.. i got it... going to read overview
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11:54<rovanion>What is the difference between experimental and unstable?
11:55<babilen>!tell rovanion -about experimental
11:55<babilen>!tell rovanion -about sid
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12:10<petrol>Hi, all i have problem after updating my sid, im lost control to mouse, touchpad, sound device and some other things. Do you think that is a repository problem?
12:10<babilen>!udev 620995
12:10<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it unconditionally uses /run created by base-files 6.2 although the initscripts version in sid does not yet support it. To fix it you have to downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
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12:11<babilen>petrol: Ping me if you need further help
12:12<babilen>petrol: The problem should go away if you remove /run -- but I would still recommend to downgrade the packages mentioned in the factoid above
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12:12<babilen>petrol: And please make sure that you install apt-listbugs -- It would have warned you about this problem, because the bug was reported this morning (GMT)
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12:16<martinj>hi, today, after an upgrade of xserver-xorg-input-mouse (on unstable) my trackpoint no longer works. Is that a known issue? The /var/log/Xorg.0.log file no longer contains the references to "mouse" that it used to. Where else should I look to start debugging this?
12:17<babilen>martinj: Do you experience other problems too?
12:17<jhutchins_lt>martinj: sid?
12:17<martinj>I have had weird screen refreshing issues with the latest kernel that hoped would go with an upgrade. They probably did, but I have no mouse now :-)
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12:18<martinj>but kernel was not upgraded today, only xserver-xorg-input-* stuff
12:18<martinj>yeah, sid
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12:19<babilen>martinj: I don't see an applicable bug reported against xserver-xorg-input-mouse -- And I asked because some people experience problems due to a udev /run fuckup -- The symptoms are a bit more severe than just a missing trackpad though
12:20<babilen>martinj: Could you paste the applicable part of you /var/log/aptitude log (or dpkg if you don't use aptitude)
12:20<martinj>I have looked at bugs reported against that package too
12:21<babilen>martinj: But the trackpad is not handled by xserver-xorg-input-mouse anyway -- trackpads are handled by xserver-xorg-input-synaptics
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12:21<martinj>I see
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12:22<martinj>babilen: I will post the aptitude log in a second
12:23<martinj>but xserver-xorg-input-synaptics did not get upgraded today
12:24<martinj>babilen: hm, the problems are probably more severe, the notebook does not even know about its wifi now :-/
12:24<martinj>so it's difficult to post the log, anything specific I can look for myself?
12:24<babilen>martinj: I knew it -- did you upgrade udev and base-files ? Do you have a /run directory?
12:24<martinj>I do have /run directory
12:25<babilen>!udev 620995
12:25<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it unconditionally uses /run created by base-files 6.2 although the initscripts version in sid does not yet support it. To fix it you have to downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
12:25<martinj>and some udev stuff got upgraded, yeah
12:25<petrol>How do you think, when it will be fixed?
12:25<babilen>martinj: Please make sure that you have apt-listbugs installed
12:26<martinj>will that help me not to run into issues like this?
12:26<babilen>petrol: As soon as the new initscripts version is uploaded. Can't tell you exactly when this happens though. (matter of days)
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12:26<martinj>I will certainly check it out then
12:26<daemonkeeper>martinj: Don't use sid.
12:26<babilen>!tell martinj about apt-listbugs
12:27<daemonkeeper>Or follow d-d, there have been warnings about this issue ;)
12:27<petrol>!tell petrol about apt-listbugs
12:27<martinj>daemonkeeper: I got too used to unstable being extra stable over the years :-)
12:27<daemonkeeper>dpkg: tell petrol about selftell
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12:28<daemonkeeper>martinj: I do as well, but such problems from time to time is the price for using Sid :)
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12:30<martinj>daemonkeeper: sure, but since screw-ups as big as this only happen about once a year for me and with a little help of others I am usually able to fix them, I'm fine with that
12:31<daemonkeeper>martinj: That's the second big issue within few weeks, as far as I remember. Sid is (still) rather stormy currently.
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12:32<martinj>I'll have one more idiotic question because I forgot, what is a convenient place to get the older versions of the packages?
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12:33<martinj>I'll have to move them over on a USB disk, if I can mount it :-)
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12:33<daemonkeeper> archives older packages.
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12:34<babilen>martinj: You can still bring up your interface manually (modprobe the module and do whatever is needed to configure it)
12:34<babilen>martinj: And an easy way to get the packages is to use "dget PKG=VER" (e.g. dget udev=166-1) if you have that installed.
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12:35<babilen>martinj: Old ones might be in /var/cache/apt/archives/ as well. (although they might have been automatically removed)
12:36<babilen>daemonkeeper: Do you think that *udev* should be added to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/01autoremove's NeverAutoRemove section? I consider filing a bug that suggests this ..
12:37<martinj>babilen: yes, they most probably are! I forgot to have that cleaned up for a while apparently... thanks!
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12:40<daemonkeeper>babilen: That might be appropriate for all users, yes.
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12:40<daemonkeeper>Since an explicit remove will still work, there is nothing wrong with that.
12:40<daemonkeeper>But: What /would/ actually autoremove udev?
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12:42<daemonkeeper>babilen: As far as I can see, several essential packages depend on it
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12:43<retrospectacus>daemonkeeper: he's afk
12:43<retrospectacus>daemonkeeper: I am seeing only "unetbootin Depends udev" in "aptitude why udev"
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12:44<cthuluh>and here there's only alsa-utils (stable)
12:45<cthuluh>and as it was a netinstall installation, I had installed alsa-utils manually
12:45<retrospectacus>on my server I see " initramfs-tools Depends udev" - that sounds useful
12:45<cthuluh>also, lvm2 depends on libudev0
12:46<cthuluh>either aptitude why is broken or I misunderstood what it does
12:47<cthuluh>clearly, there are much more packages that depend on udev
12:47<cthuluh>(looking at it in aptitude)
12:48<retrospectacus>indeed. Maybe it just picks one example of why
12:48<daemonkeeper>I used to use apt-rdepends, shows a long list.
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12:50<daemonkeeper> but I was wrong, nothing essential.
12:50<martinj>hm, I downgraded the three packages and once gdm fires up, I can't use either mouse or keyboard :-( Probably some more downgrading needs to be done
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12:50-!-arw is "arw" on #debian #debian-es #debian-mentors-es @+#Linux-es #debian-es-cachondeo
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12:52<martinj>but the wlan is there, I can see the DHCP going on so there is some progress
12:52<retrospectacus>martinj did you (re)move /run ?
12:52<martinj>I moved it to roots home, yes
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12:52<martinj>I verified it was not there before rebooting
12:53-!-skyegg is now known as skyegg_away
12:53<martinj>and it is not there now
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12:55<martinj>btw, this is the aptitude log:
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13:01<martinj>serves me right for not reading things properly, I have not downgraded udev itself :-(
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13:04<Ahoalton>I need some help
13:04<Ahoalton>how come when I install a program it doesn't show up in the applications tab
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13:06<sney>a few programs have missing .desktop entries but most will show up in the applications menu
13:06<mateusz>after recent sid update
13:06<retrospectacus>Ahoalton, it depends on the program
13:06<mateusz>udev is not starting
13:06<sney>!broken in sid
13:06<dpkg>Well, duh, what'd you expect, of course it's broken. See <sid>, <break>.
13:06<mateusz>and network is not connecting
13:06<mateusz>and everything is fucked up
13:06<sney>mateusz: welcome to sid
13:06<retrospectacus>!udev 620995
13:06<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
13:06<retrospectacus>mateusz: ^
13:07<mateusz>retrospectacus, will that fix my issu e?
13:07<jhutchins_lt>mateusz: So just restore the snapshot you made before you updated.
13:07<mateusz>retrospectacus, where I can find deb files to downgrade amd64 ?
13:07-!-smuxi [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:07<martinj>mateusz: it fixed mine :-D
13:07<retrospectacus>it's fixed several peoples' same issue here this morning already
13:07<sney>mateusz: if you need that kind of certainty you shouldn't bue using sed
13:07<Ahoalton>I'm trying to install firefox
13:07<sney>*shouldn't be using sid. where did my fingers go
13:08<mateusz>where can I find packages ?
13:08<mateusz>I mean snapshots?
13:08<mateusz>from previous versions
13:08<daemonkeeper> (as said)
13:08<martinj>mateusz: I still had them in /var/cache/apt/archives/
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13:08<sney>mateusz: sorry for not being your best friend. Sid is not supported in #debian. If you're going to use it you need to be able to support it yourself.
13:08<Ahoalton>so I shouldn't download it from the firefox site?
13:08<mateusz>martinj, thanks
13:09<jhutchins_lt>martinj: You're running sid and you don't snapshot the system before you upgrade?
13:09<Ahoalton>is it possible to install ff from package manager?
13:09*mateusz ignores sney
13:09<jhutchins_lt>Ahoalton: firefox 4 is not supported here.
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13:09<daemonkeeper>mateusz: sney is right though.
13:09<Ahoalton>what do you mean jhutchins?
13:09<martinj>jhutchins_lt: no, I did not know there is such a thing as a snapshot... and I've been running sid for about eight years now
13:09<retrospectacus>Ahoalton: generally, no. Not from debian repositorys
13:09<mateusz>daemonkeeper, maybe, but he keeps repeating himself instead of helping
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13:10<Ahoalton>thanks retrospectacus
13:10<jhutchins_lt>Ahoalton: It is mozilla software, not debian. We can support iceweasel, which is packaged by debian.
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13:10<jhutchins_lt>martinj: By snapshot I mean a system backup.
13:10<martinj>but if there indeed is such a thing, I guess I should find out more about it
13:10<sney>Ahoalton: he means firefox from is not supported. there are semi-official packages for Iceweasel (aka firefox) 4 at as stated above.
13:11<mateusz>martinj, can I get your packages if they're for amd64 ?
13:11<martinj>jhutchins_lt: like an image of the disk? no, and I don't think that is really feasible
13:11<mateusz>martinj, and one more time which exactly packages do I need to downgrade?
13:11<jhutchins_lt>Ahoalton: Firefox 4 is not yet stable enough to be supported by debian.
13:11<martinj>mateusz: unfortunately they are for i686
13:11<mateusz>martinj, ok
13:12<martinj>mateusz: udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1
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13:12<martinj>mateusz: and remove /run
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13:12<mateusz>martinj, libudev is not on snapshots
13:13<Ahoalton>how is iceweasel different that icedove
13:13<sney>Ahoalton: icedove is the debian name for Thunderbird.
13:13<sney>Ahoalton: the software is the same, just due to licensing restrictions, Debian can't use the same names.
13:13<Ahoalton>oh, ok, thanks
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13:13<daemonkeeper>!why iceweasel
13:13<dpkg>Due to Mozilla logos licensing, Mozilla software isn't DFSG-free, so Debian distributes Mozilla software with different logos. One day Mozilla Corporation decided to revoke the agreement to let Debian use Mozilla trademarks, so Debian changed to non-trademarked product names. See for more information. Ask me about <dfsg>.
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13:14<martinj>mateusz: and are you sure it's not in /var/cache/apt/archives?
13:14<Ahoalton>that was a stupid move
13:15<mateusz>martinj, on my laptop its not I have that directory mounted in tmpfs
13:15<mateusz>martinj, anyway I found those debs on snapshots already somehow search was not finding everything
13:15<retrospectacus>Ahoalton: if you want to discuss that you may do so in #debian-offtopic
13:15<sney>Ahoalton: what was? mozilla revoking the agreement? eh, it's easier this way anyway
13:16<martinj>mateusz: good
13:16<Ahoalton>so how wouldI go about getting the mozilla Icon in the applications under internet
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13:17<daemonkeeper>Well, if you insist on the icon, just replace it.
13:17<retrospectacus>Ahoalton you would edit /usr/share/applications/iceweasel.desktop and change the icon path
13:17<retrospectacus>(you could also change the display name to Firefox if it makes you feel warm inside)
13:18<Ahoalton>no I'm using ff4 I don't like iceweasel
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13:18<sney>it is _the same_
13:18-!-ml| [] has quit []
13:19<sney>but you can change the display name and download the pixmap and replace it in /usr/share/pixmaps, which I believe is the location for all of your deb-installed icons.
13:19<Ahoalton>I keep getting errors about it not being accepted from websites
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13:19<retrospectacus>You should contact the website maintainers and tell them to smarten the fuck up
13:20<Ahoalton>I should
13:20<mateusz>martinj, time to switch harddrives in laptop and do the downgrade ;)
13:20<retrospectacus>you could also install a UA-switching addon
13:20<retrospectacus>or change it in about:config, iinm
13:21<martinj>mateusz: also remember removing the /run directory
13:21<mateusz>martinj, after downgrading ?
13:21<martinj>yes, at least that's what others have told me to do
13:22<mateusz>I am trying this
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13:23<Ahoalton>I just edited the menu and added a launcher there
13:25<retrospectacus>Ahoalton: fine, but FF4 is still not really part of your Debian system - it won't be upgradable by apt, won't get security updates, etc.
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13:43<sheepa>hello, i cant install debian 6.0 on an old computer
13:43<sney>how old?
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13:43<sheepa>when i press install the screen freezes then starts flickering forever
13:43<sheepa>dont know, it was delivered with windows 2000
13:43<cthuluh>perhaps a problem with those old nvidia rage 128 </wild guess>
13:44<sney>cthuluh: is that like an ati geforce?
13:44<cthuluh>oh, ati, yeah
13:44<sney>sheepa: try the expert install, see if it gets any farther or gives you more information
13:44<sheepa>fujitsu siemens
13:44<cthuluh>sheepa: try vga=no
13:45<sheepa>expert mode gives: "Undefined video mode number: 314"
13:45<sheepa>though i was able to continue by pressing space
13:45<Black_Prince>I have a PIII Fujitsu Siemens 600MHz 256MB SRAM and Matrox Millenium G200 AGP Card
13:45-!-Ahoalton [~IceChat09@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:45<Black_Prince>And squeeze installed on it
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13:46<sheepa>trying expert mode now
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13:46<sney>sheepa: ok, so it was just an incompatibility with your framebuffer, you can try the standard install with cthuluh's suggestion or just continue with expert mode. and if you need help understanding something you can ask in here
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13:47<sheepa>sney: okey, thanks
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14:06<rossorosso>Hello...should ubuntu understand by it's self to change from battery 1 to battery 2 when batter1 is empty?
14:07<rossorosso>oops sry wrong channel i guess
14:07<EmleyMoor>rossorosso: (a) this is not the place for Ubuntu (b) battery changeover is a hardware function, not OS.
14:07<rossorosso>yeah my bad i am sorry
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14:09<martinj>thanks everyone once again, you really saved me a LOT of time. And I have installed apt-listbugs so hopefully something like this won't happen to me for a very long time.
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14:14<lluvia_>how can I know whick is the device which is doing work my mic?
14:14<lluvia_>my mic works, but I don't know which /dev file I have to map
14:14<nardev>hello, where can i get site design from 1.april at
14:15<lluvia_>I have not /dev/dsp
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14:17<erstazi>Hello all. I have an ia64 box running 6.0.1 that has a process (gdm3) that I cannot kill and is eating all 4 cpu's. I tried kill -15 1448 but no avail. Suggestions?
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14:17<EmleyMoor>erstazi: Try invoke-rc.d gdm3 stop
14:17<nardev>erstazi, try to go to some other terminal Alt + F3 and than kill it
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14:18<erstazi>nardev: tried that.
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14:18<erstazi>EmleyMoor: tried that just now. top says that the process is still there at 100%.
14:19<erstazi>also, I cannot reboot and I cannot run ps aux or w. But I can run top. which has me baffled.
14:19<nardev>anyone??, where can i get site design from 1.april at
14:19<cthuluh>nardev: google cache, perhaps
14:19<daemonkeeper>Suse might have a copy as well
14:20<EmleyMoor>erstazi: Try to kill -9 it
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14:20<erstazi>EmleyMoor: tried that as well
14:20<cthuluh>erstazi: try other signals before -9
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14:21<cthuluh>then you can't do anything
14:21<cthuluh>what's the process state, in top?
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14:22<erstazi>cthuluh: 1448 root 20 0 28544 9.8m 5616 R 100 0.1 74:05.67 gdm3
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14:23<erstazi>what really pisses me off: this is a server. I never installed GNOME on it let alone gdm3. I think the people that are hosting this box installed gnome on it when they installed debian.
14:23<cthuluh>you should be able to kill it
14:23<cthuluh>you're doing that as root, right?
14:23<erstazi>cthuluh: yes
14:23<erstazi>cthuluh: I am as root.
14:24<erstazi>the only thing I can think of why I cannot kill it is something hardware is dying, which concerns me.
14:25<erstazi>guess I have to run smartctl on it to see if any hard drives are dying.
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14:30<lluvia_>a light program for record my voice?
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14:32<jackyf>lluvia_: arecord?
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14:32<SynrG>xawtv has 'record', which i've used with some success
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14:33<mase_>arecord is in the alsa-utils package
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14:35<lluvia_>i didnt know that program
14:35<retrospectacus>there is also the "gnome-sound-recorder"
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14:36<lluvia_>I don't know why I cannot find it
14:37<lluvia_>in repositories
14:37<mase_>luvia_ what application are you searching for?
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14:38<retrospectacus>lluvia_ it's in "gnome-media" package
14:39<lluvia_>retrospectacus: thanks
14:39<retrospectacus>enjoy :)
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14:44<erstazi>[ 8026.220765] BUG: soft lockup - CPU#1 stuck for 61s! [gdm3:1448] << yar
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14:49<erstazi>cthuluh, EmleyMoor, nardev, and everyone else: thank you. solved it by manually kicking the box and removing gdm3 from starting when booting. and then rebooted. Thanks again.
14:50<retrospectacus>nothing like a good boot-fuck to fix up a hardware problem
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14:51<erstazi>retrospectacus: it was a soft lockup.
14:52<aber>I have to admit I used debian unstable and now udev is not loading for me after upgrading the package. Anyone knows this issue, can help?
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14:52<retrospectacus>!udev 620995
14:52<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
14:52<retrospectacus>aber ^
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14:52<sney>erstazi: and it's really ia64? I'm guessing you're one of the very few people running a gui on an itanium, so it could be a bug that just never got reported
14:52<retrospectacus>aber, also
14:52<dpkg>( The great thing about running sid is that, when it breaks you get to keep ALL the pieces!! )
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14:53<erstazi>sney: I didn't install GNOME on it. it wasn't supposed to have anything on it. I think those that installed Debian it also installed GNOME.
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14:54<sney>erstazi: yeah, it's the default in the 'desktop' task so it'd get installed in a "press next without looking" install
14:54<dpkg>VATTENE VIA!
14:54<hender180>buenas tardes
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14:54<sheepa>im trying to get my webcam to work work with debian 6 (creative nx ultra). Im running without the desktop enviorment and want to take pictures every 10 mins and save/upload them somewhere.
14:54<sheepa>i cant seem to find the webcam at /dev/
14:54<dpkg>VATTENE VIA!
14:54<hender180>soy novato en linux
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14:54<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
14:55<hender180>como puedo compartir la conexion de internet con un servidor con dos tarjetas de red
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14:55<daemonkeeper>Please talk English here or join #debian-es
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14:58<tartax>hey, need some help on uswsusp (s2disk)... it works fine but peeps several times through the process. Any hints where to look for the cause?
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15:24<sheepa>When i connect my webcam i get this in the kernel logs
15:24<sheepa>Apr 6 21:23:19 gdb kernel: [ 1429.880065] usb 1-1: new full speed USB device using uhci_hcd and address 4
15:24<sheepa>Apr 6 21:23:20 gdb kernel: [ 1430.070067] usb 1-1: New USB device found, idVendor=041e, idProduct=401d
15:24<sheepa>Apr 6 21:23:20 gdb kernel: [ 1430.070080] usb 1-1: New USB device strings: Mfr=1, Product=2, SerialNumber=0
15:24<sheepa>Apr 6 21:23:20 gdb kernel: [ 1430.070089] usb 1-1: Product: Creative WebCam NX Ultra
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15:24<iCEmAN_CZ>sheepa: flood protection
15:25<sheepa>thats what i get in my kernel log
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15:25<sheepa>but the webcam does not show up at /dev/video0
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15:28<jhutchins_lt>!tell sheepa about webcam
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15:56<Guay>hay alguien hay
15:57<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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15:58<Guay> debien-es
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16:06<Guest894>is it possible to install Ubuntu to flash drive? And IM NOT talking about live cd.
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16:07<sney>damn my slow fingers
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16:29<pzzx>hi, im getting the option of chosing between kernel 2.6 and in the netinst.. which one would the 2.6 one be?
16:29<pzzx>havent gotten this option before
16:30<sney>pzzx: with linux-2.6 it would automatically update the kernel to any new versions
16:30<daemonkeeper>Which is again for now
16:30<sney>with stable that doesn't happen so it doesn't matter which you choose
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16:45<m0jdd>is any one on i am runing Debian I am AN AMATEUR radio operator i install uiview which is aprs the program is running but i cannot get the maps to sho all i seeing it a black spot
16:47<m0jdd>the maps on uiview go black after started if i click on uk the uk map show then go black cannot see anything but the program runing
16:47<jhutchins>m0jdd: which release are you on?
16:47<jhutchins>,versions uiview
16:47<judd>Sorry, no package named 'uiview' was found in i386.
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16:48<m0jdd>i am running debian at mepis1
16:48<dpkg>MEPIS is a live CD distribution based on Debian Lenny (as of version 8.0). SimplyMEPIS and antiX are not supported in #debian. #mepis on See also <based on debian>.
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16:54<pzzx>im amazed. debian truly handled my system and partitioning great. /boot on raid1 (5 drives) and / on crypted lvm raid6 (4 drives + 1 spare)
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16:54<pzzx>installed and booted without problems :)
16:54-!-jc is now known as PadawanLearner
16:54*PadawanLearner ahoy!
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17:03<karika200->I'm trying to set up radvd on my router
17:03<karika200->I'm here now:
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17:03<karika200->but on the clients I can't reach other machines on IPv6
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17:03<karika200->what can be wrong?
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17:19<tartax>hey, need some help on uswsusp (s2disk)... it works fine but peeps several times through the process. Any hints where to look for the cause?
17:20<retrospectacus>or dmesg
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17:21<sney>some laptops do a beeping thing when they're going into an acpi suspend state too, so there might be something in the bios
17:22<tartax>well, while hibernating it actually pees three times. if its the acpi suspend peep i reckon thats only the last one
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17:22<vizor>hi guys, how to make synaptics work with udev 167?
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17:22<tartax>i have the feeling its something about the graphic chip that is causing that as the screen also goes black for one sec and flickers a little.
17:22<vizor>I have similar problem as describer here
17:23<retrospectacus>!udev 620995
17:23<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
17:23<sney>man retrospectacus that is just on your speed dial today
17:24<vizor>retrospectacus: thx
17:24<retrospectacus>yes, yes it is.... seems like I just have to press "up" a few times and it's there :)
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17:25<tartax>as to the beep during hibernate and resume i thought it might help to add a few "read"s to the scirpts through which s2disk goes so that I can find out which message belongs to the beep. but I failed at finding where to add them
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17:36<tartax>are there any modifiable scripts which are gone through by s2disk or is it just the /usr/sbin/s2disk?
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18:09<PadawanLearner>i'm having some issues with alsa on my laptop, anyone can help?
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18:14<retrospectacus>PadawanLearner: /msg dpkg alsa checklist
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18:15<jgoppert>i just rebooted my server and get grub-rescue and help doesn't even work, any ideas?
18:15<retrospectacus>jgoppert: disks order changed?
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18:16<jgoppert>retrospectacus: no, recent upgrade, said it was renaming stuff, upraded to testing
18:16<jgoppert>jgoppert: other server was fine, thinking i forgot to click the right option and install grub or something
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18:18<jgoppert>ls / still shows my filesystem
18:18<PadawanLearner>retrospectacus, :)
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18:19<retrospectacus>jgoppert: not sure. can you "update-grub"?
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18:22<jgoppert>retrospectacus: i think what happened is that i moved the boot to /home and sym linked , was stupid, but i didn't want to reformat, ran out of room on /, how to recover?
18:23<retrospectacus>ah hmmm... well move it back :) easier said than done I know...
18:24<sney>jgoppert: boot with a rescue disk, put boot back where it's supposed to be
18:24<sney>and apt-get clean to make some space
18:24<jgoppert>yeah, was thinking that.. don't have one handy :-P
18:25<jgoppert>i can do a usb stick right, any good recommendations that are easy to get up and running?
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18:25<doubledutch>What's the best way to search my entire disk for all text files which CONTAIN the word "kaliningrad" ?
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18:27<retrospectacus>doubledutch: not the "best" way but the easiest: grep -r 'kaliningrad' /
18:27<doubledutch>retrospectacus: THANK YOU!
18:27<nardev>can ayone tell me where i can find template or printscreen from 1.april this year?
18:28<sney>nardev: maybe
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18:28<retrospectacus>doubledutch: sure... if you have more information about the file you may be able to use "find" to locate it
18:28<nardev>sney, i tried but there has been no cache last two years
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18:29<sney>nardev: actually, I just typed "the canterbury distribution" into google images, and the results say you haven't tried that :P
18:29<retrospectacus>doubledutch: find /path/you/know/its/in -type f -mtime -5 |while read f ; do grep 'kaliningrad' "$f" && echo "$f" ;done
18:29<nardev>sney, no i didn't thnc MAN
18:29<doubledutch>retrospectacus: All that I know is that I made a brief note in a text file two years ago... I know that it has survived backups/moving around, but do not know its name or location. v_v
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18:29<retrospectacus>doubledutch: that will be much faster (and easier on your hard disk) if you know the path it may be in and that its modify time is in the last 5 days
18:29<nardev>sney, but i don't see it :(
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18:30<retrospectacus>doubledutch find / -type f -mtime +700
18:30<retrospectacus>doubledutch: that finds files who are more than 700 days old
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18:31<doubledutch>retrospectacus: can I find ~ -type.. ?
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18:31<retrospectacus>sure, or find . -type ...
18:32<retrospectacus>. being your PWD
18:32<sney>nardev: I dunno, check your spelling?
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18:32<nardev>i can find some printscreens
18:32<doubledutch>find ~ -type f -mtime +700 |while read f ; do grep 'reddit' "$f" && echo "$f" ;done
18:33<nardev>when i search for iamges
18:33<doubledutch>retrospectacus: Thanks so much
18:33<doubledutch>I will remember this and look more into search/find/grep operations
18:33<nardev>but unfortunately there is no "the canterbury distribution" web that i'm lookig for
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18:33<retrospectacus>doubledutch: you're very welcome
18:33<sney>ask and ye shall receive. if that's not what you wanted, why did you ask for it? feh
18:34<doubledutch>I'm running Canterbury distro right now!
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18:46<jhutchins_lt>While canterbury linux contains debian, it is not debian and is not supported on #debian.
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18:59<PadawanLearner>jhutchins, so it's not an april's 1st prank?!
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18:59<sney>PadawanLearner: I don't know, what do you think
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19:00<PadawanLearner>sney, i think it is not
19:00<jhutchins>PadawanLearner: If you knew Novell you'd know.
19:01<dpkg>somebody said canterbury was april fools
19:01<PadawanLearner>jhutchins, las thing from novell that i had to install was a suse box...
19:02<PadawanLearner>there was no support for debian from progress database on it, so had to go the novell way
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19:02<jhutchins>By "knew Novell" I mean like remember when Netware was peer-to-peer.
19:03<PadawanLearner>nop, never used ipx, thank god
19:03<jhutchins>I think I still have the floppies for peer-to-peer Netware here somewhere.
19:04<PadawanLearner>but is canterbury the future or did i misunderstood it?
19:04<jhutchins>Peer-to-peer over thin ethernet - now that was a party!
19:05<PadawanLearner>ok, it was an april fools joke
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19:06<PadawanLearner>thank you korencia
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19:07<diederik>Hi, I have a weird problem. It seems like / is mounted readonly, which causes udev not to function properly
19:08<diederik>Which in turn (?) makes that my keyboard/mouse aren't recognised and therefor not work until I unplug/plug them back in
19:08<PadawanLearner>mount -o remount,rw /
19:08<sney>/ is mounted readonly on boot and then remounted when the system goes into multiuser
19:09<diederik>is the keyboard/mouse issue cause by sth else then?
19:09<sney>you're not using sid are you
19:09<diederik>and this behaviour only started today, yesterday everything was fine
19:09<diederik>yes I am
19:09<sney>and you just did an upgrade
19:09<sney>udev is currently broken in sid
19:09<diederik>I did do an upgrade today
19:10<sney>!udev 620995
19:10<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
19:10<diederik>so 167-1 is bad?
19:10<dpkg>( The great thing about running sid is that, when it breaks you get to keep ALL the pieces!! )
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19:11<diederik>haha, so true
19:12<diederik>what about nfs-common? It is broken for a week now, but "aptitude install -t testing ..." didn't downgrade it
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19:12<sney>gotta use dpkg -i, apt doesn't do downgrades
19:13<diederik>since when? I've done it numerous times before, but only (?) with nfs-common it didn't work
19:13<diederik>or is my memory failing me?
19:14<diederik>btw: libudev or libudev0 (I have the latter)?
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19:15<jhutchins_lt>I guess we get to see how many people shouldn't be running sid this week.
19:15<sney>no kidding.
19:15<daemonkeeper>jhutchins_lt: The same whom complained when X was broken lately.
19:15<diederik>apparently my memory is failing me, downgrading udev with aptitude didn't work either
19:16<daemonkeeper>You can't downgrade with apt/aptitude unless you stick a particular repository. That won't help in that case.
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19:17<diederik>stick = pin?
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19:19<daemonkeeper>Yes, you need to pin package(s)/repositories
19:19<diederik>ok, thanks
19:19-!-taffit [~taffit@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:20<daemonkeeper>Obviously this will help only to switch between package versions on a repository, e.g. downgrade testing to stable and so on. Repositories won't keep older/obsolete vesions of packages within a distribution though.
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19:21<diederik>ha, "aptitude install udev=166-1 libudev0=166-1" did downgrade the packages
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19:22<sney>jhutchins_lt: and the people who seem to be able to handle it, as well. sid user's first trial by fire
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19:25<diederik>related question wrt nfs-common: "aptitude versions nfs-common" list 1.2.2-5 from testing and 1.2.3-1 from unstable
19:26<diederik>but "aptitude install nfs-common=1.2.2-5" returns "Unable to find a version 1.2.2-5 for the package nfs-common"
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19:26<diederik>how is that possible?
19:26<sney>maybe that only works if the deb is present in /var/cache/apt
19:27<diederik>both versions are in /var/cache/apt/archives/
19:28<diederik>and if it didn't have the old version, shouldn't apt download it then?
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19:29<sney>diederik: well, if you have eyes on the deb, just dpkg -i
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19:30<diederik>sney: good point :)
19:35<jhutchins_lt>,vesions nfs-common
19:36<jhutchins_lt>,versions nfs-common
19:36<diederik>,versions nfs-common
19:36<judd>Package nfs-common on i386 -- lenny: 1:1.1.2-6lenny2; lenny-backports: 1:1.2.2-4~bpo50+1; squeeze: 1:1.2.2-4; wheezy: 1:1.2.2-5; sid: 1:1.2.3-1
19:36<judd>Package nfs-common on i386 -- lenny: 1:1.1.2-6lenny2; lenny-backports: 1:1.2.2-4~bpo50+1; squeeze: 1:1.2.2-4; wheezy: 1:1.2.2-5; sid: 1:1.2.3-1
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19:40<diederik>how to search (with aptitude) for packages which are on hold?
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19:43<diederik>found it myself: "aptitude search ~ahold"
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19:51<diederik>why does "aptitude search ~i~Aexperimental" not return all installed packages from experimental?
19:51-!-alt [] has joined #debian
19:51<diederik>putting the search term inside single quotes didn't make a difference
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19:52<zerookrash>hola alguien que hable español??
19:52<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
19:52<zerookrash>ok grax
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19:53<dominiquenf>good evening
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19:53<dominiquenf>sney: hello, how's everything?
19:53<sney>good enough I suppose. can I help you with something?
19:54<dominiquenf>not now, thanks.. for now i'm only here to chat and see if i can help
19:54<sney>ah ok
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19:55<lisandropm>hi! any known issue with keyboards and mouses in the latest sid update?
19:55<diederik>lisandropm: yes I do
19:55<sney>!udev 620995
19:55<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
19:56<lisandropm>thanks :)
19:56<diederik>aptitude install udev=166-1 libudev0=166-1 libgudev-1.0-0=166-1
19:56<lisandropm>wow, even complete aptitude lines, that's what I call efficience :-D
19:56<lisandropm>thank you both :)
19:56<diederik>and then "aptitude hold udev libudev0 libgudev-1.0-0"
19:57<diederik>I just went through them ;)
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19:57<daemonkeeper>Well, guess what: You're not the first one having this problem today, lisandropm )
19:57<sney>diederik: try to avoid directly supporting sid in here, since technically it's not supported here
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19:58<diederik>ok, but didn't he need those commands to fix his issue?
19:58<lisandropm>sney: didn't knew that, first time I get in this channel in more than five years that I use and collaborate in Debian :-P
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19:59<sney>we just try not to make it look like there's a safety net for sid users, that's all
19:59<diederik>lisandropm: you also need to downgrade and hold base-files to the lower version
19:59<lisandropm>seems reasonable
19:59<lisandropm>diederik: great :)
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20:01<diederik>sney: point taken btw :)
20:02<lisandropm>thank you all guys :-)
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20:09<diederik>thanks for resolving my keyboard/mouse issue, much appreciated :)
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20:31<jgoppert>can someone recommend a pxe boot linux for gonig in an mounting ext3 and fixing a boot directory issue i made?
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20:36<daemonkeeper>Wouldn't it be much easier just to boot from a USB disk/CD-ROM?
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21:10<todd_dsm>hey guys, I got a silly one for ya...
21:11<todd_dsm>I've installed my first debian server and found the docs to manually change from dhcp to static.
21:12<todd_dsm>I made the change, and I'm watching the log on my dchpd server and the debian box is still requesting a dhcp address every few seconds.
21:12<todd_dsm>is there some community supported method?
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21:12<amphi>kill dhclient ;)
21:13<todd_dsm>won't this still be a problem after reboot?
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21:15<sney>if you changed the settings in /etc/network/interfaces then it'll know not to even run dhclient on boot
21:15<todd_dsm>sney, amphi: thanks you guys.
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21:16<amphi>todd_dsm: you're welcom
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21:26<dpkg>Zenoss is an open source application/server/network management system based on <zope>. Zenoss Core is not in Debian, see bug #361253 for the <ITP>. The packages from are not supported in #debian. FAQ: . #zenoss on
21:27<twb>Ugh, third-party packages? I'm NOT deploying those.
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21:28<twb>Explains why nobody bothered to do a proper debian version, tho -- most people will just run the upstream version.
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21:31<twb>Ah, also due to license issues.
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21:34<daemonkeeper>Reading the ITP it seems to be a software issue more than anything.
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21:35<daemonkeeper>Or, RFP actually.
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21:53<carlos>please why is chanel debina espanish
21:53<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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21:54<carlos>tkanks cth
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21:55<cthuluh>carlos: it's cth<TAB> ;)
21:55<Kill-9>been a looongg time since I have last logged into IRC, cool its still going
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21:58<Kill-9>wow this is interesting
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22:19<AgentC>Hi, good morning
22:20<AgentC>:) anyone likes music with a player made possible through debian systems ?
22:21*AgentC was using a yamaha cs1x :)
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22:22<ork>i haven't
22:23<AgentC>ork: would you like to test my webinterface ? you could get some free sms for thanx
22:23<ork>what? free sms?
22:23<ork>what web?
22:24<AgentC>ork: user: testuser pw: test
22:24<AgentC>made on debian lenny
22:26<AgentC>i would like to implement a multilanguage support on that site, but that needs time
22:26<ork>German,not english
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22:28<jgoppert>so i messed up grub, how do i get it to reset the inittab file? any magical update grub dommand form the command line?
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22:29<AgentC>ork: "kundenservice" means customersupport where you can find sms possiblities. would you like to test it on your own or girlfriends phone for a test? does not matter what it cost about....
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22:31<ork>no, sorry :)
22:31<bones_was_here>jgoppert: inittab isn't really related to grub? but grub will normally fix itself (after config problems) if you do 'update-grub' (that wont help if the config problem is in /etc/default/grub or /etc/grub.d)
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22:31<AgentC>ork: thats my costs, so i pay for it, it is my server
22:32<bones_was_here>jgoppert: maybe you mean initrd/initramfs
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22:32<AgentC>ork: do you like that sounds ?
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22:32<jgoppert>well grub tries to start and says no parent found for device
22:33<jgoppert>and the INIIT: no inittab file found
22:33<ork>i have no time, i am working.
22:33<jgoppert>there issue is i moved my /boot directory to a different partition to make some room, but grub didn't like that obviously, i was stupid, but went back with partedmagic and put it back, now this error
22:33<AgentC>jgoppert: grub-mkdevicemap , grub-install
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22:34<bones_was_here>jgoppert: init can't complain about not finding inittab unless a kernel has successfully started first...
22:35<bones_was_here>init is normally the first process started by the kernel (grub can't run it directly, as it can't run without a kernel)
22:35<AgentC>jgoppert: when you start to reinstall bootloader to existing partition from native volume, start grub-install /dev/devicename , then reboot and run grub-mkdevicemap, grub-install , reboot again, you'll see friend
22:36<bones_was_here>jgoppert: if you need to generate a new initrd.img file in /boot, update-initramfs should work
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22:37<jgoppert>thanks guys
22:38<AgentC>jgoppert. there is also a tool "update-grub" or "update-grub2" for reinit config-files with actually data
22:38<jgoppert>can i do this from the grub command line?
22:38<jgoppert>ah recovery mode seemed to work
22:38<jgoppert>so i can run it like that possibly
22:39<AgentC>dpkg: thankyou is a way to say i love your handling of my mind
22:39<dpkg>no problem, AgentC
22:39<AgentC>dpkg: thankyou
22:39<dpkg>AgentC: de nada
22:39<jgoppert>nvm, asks for run level
22:39<jgoppert>so do i have to do this at grub?
22:39<bones_was_here>jgoppert: you have to be booted to use those commands, grub's command line can't write these kind of changes to the disk, it can only read
22:40<jgoppert>so how do i fix it?
22:40<AgentC>jgoppert: i can advice you, query me if you need help
22:40<AgentC>dpkg: i love you
22:40<dpkg>The feeling's not mutual
22:40<bones_was_here>jgoppert: rescue mode will work, or you can chroot into your install from eg the debian install cd
22:41<bones_was_here>but it really doesnt sound like you have a grub problem
22:42<bones_was_here>you may like to pastebin your /boot/grub/grub.conf and the output of ls -l /boot
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22:43<bones_was_here>AgentC: its usually good to do debian tech support in channel, rather than in pm, that way others can see what the fix was for the issue
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23:02<AgentC>!tell jgoppert about HAL
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23:13<pmitros>Here's a dumb vaguely Debianish question. I'm looking for the cheapest possible USB-controlled actuator. I'd like something to push a button once in a while. Any ideas? Of course, it has to be Debian-compatible.
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23:15<erstazi>pmitros: << something like this?
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23:16<pmitros>That's an EEG, not an actuator.
23:16<pmitros>They call it an actuator, which makes it almost impossible to find anything useful on Google.
23:16<pmitros>An actuator is a mechanical device for moving or controlling a mechanism or system
23:16-!-jeflui [~jeflui@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:16<erstazi>pmitros: hmm, ah ok
23:17<erstazi>pmitros: what would you use this actuator for, specifically?
23:17<pmitros>So a little motor or solenoid or something. I'd like to have my computer push a button. That's all.
23:17<erstazi>pmitros: ah. I understand now.
23:18<pmitros>I have a little book reader I'm using in a project. I'd like the computer to turn the pages. I'd rather not modify the device, so I don't want to use a relay in place of its switch, but something extrernal.
23:19<pmitros>It's not tough to build, but if the project works, I'd like others to be able to replicate it.
23:19<erstazi>so, a mechanical actuator plugged in via usb
23:19<erstazi>I mean, in theory, you could have one that flushes a toilet.
23:20<twb>Wow I walked in at an odd time
23:20<erstazi>twb: (:
23:21<dpkg>well, toilet is a device which absolutely must hold 1.6 gallons of water, otherwise you will go to jail. So sayeth Big Brother. Of course, you might wind up flushing 3 times (or more), using 50% or more water than you would use had you been allowed to keep the old kind of toilets, which used one mammoth flush.
23:21<twb>Well, management did tell me to "eliminate waste"...
23:22<erstazi>pmitros: I would think that robotics should be pretty big thing with Linux
23:22<pmitros>One would think there'd be some device on the market, yes.
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23:24<erstazi>pmitros: << is this too far off?
23:25<erstazi>pmitros: << or this?
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23:25<pmitros>I wasn't planning on spending hundreds of dollars...
23:26<pmitros>CNC machine is probably around $1k+. Second one starts at $44760
23:26<erstazi>pmitros: right but I am just trying to pinpoint. the first one is a FLOSS project
23:26<pmitros>Er, 447.60
23:26<pmitros>Second one would be fine if it was about $20
23:26<erstazi>you could probably build one for around that price
23:27<pmitros>I'm hoping for some idiotic Chinese-made USB toy. The problem is all the idiotic Chinese-made USB toys don't have computer control.
23:27<pmitros>Or a $50 Toysrus-grade robot.
23:27<pmitros>Or something made out of legos.
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23:28<erstazi>pmitros: has a bunch of how-tos on that
23:29<pmitros>I want something like this, but USB-controlled as opposed to just USB-powered:
23:31<pmitros>Okay .I should go to sleep soon.
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23:49<AgentC>!tell jgoppert about grub2
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---Logclosed Thu Apr 07 00:00:46 2011