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#debian IRC Logs for 2011-05-26

---Logopened Thu May 26 00:00:09 2011
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00:13<nickzxcv>so in the partitioner, when it says "You are editing partition #1 of RAID1 device #0." does that mean its a partitionable raid?
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00:14<nickzxcv>or does the partitioner still make the normal unpartitionable raid?
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00:15<nickzxcv>does anybody use partitionable raid with linux and the debian partitioner, with several filesystems on the same raid mirror?
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00:19<ferni>usually one raid1, which will be /boot, then other raid1/5, which will be lvm and has many logical volumes
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00:32<nickzxcv>ferni: are the raid1 for / and raid for lvm separate partitions though? do you use msdos or gpt partition tables or something else?
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00:39<dudunewage>i don't know how use this...
00:39<dudunewage>what i can do here?
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00:52<ferni>nickzxcv: one raid1 for /boot to be formatted as ext2 or similar. grub (don't know about grub2) didn't know how to boot from other than raid1, ie not from raid5. And you cannot boot it from lvm. So you need at leas two raid devices
00:53<ferni>oh and with grub1 you need to do a little trick to be able to boot from the second drive in raid1 array if the first one fails
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00:54<kop>ferni: grub2 is supposed to be able to boot from lvm. Or so I hear.
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00:58<mix22891>how do i go back dir ?
00:58<mix22891>cd.. not work
00:58<kop>mix22891: cd ..
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00:59<mix22891>thank you kop
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01:00<ferni>kop: oh, well that would be nice
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01:01<mix22891>where i can get help in installing NVIDIA DISPLAY DRIVER?
01:02<mix22891>i can understand how to install -
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01:03<mix22891>it's not an .exe file -true ?
01:03<chealer>!tell mix22891 about ngd
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01:14<mix22891>O:-) i'm dead
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01:17<kusanagi>thanks kop!
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01:23<mix22891>what that message means: bash: nvidia-kernel${270.41.19}-source: bad substitution ?
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01:28<chealer>mix22891: which command did you enter?
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01:29<chealer>mix22891: did you read the last paragraph of ?
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01:35<mix22891>chealer: i've enter : m-a auto-install nvidia-kernel${270.41.19}-source
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01:37<jm_>remove ${270.41.19}
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01:40<brohelm>my printer worked under linux mint, but not debian. It just moves the paper through the machine but with no ink. What should I do? download cups and try to get it to work?
01:41<mix22891>jm_ bash: m-a: command not found
01:41<mix22891>i'm removed it
01:41<brohelm>it looks like I already have cups...
01:41<jm_>mix22891: did you install module-assistant first?
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01:42<jm_>you didn't follow instructions properly then
01:42<mix22891>i'll print the page
01:43<jm_>apt-get install module-assistant nvidia-kernel-common
01:43<jm_>and then run m-a auto-install nvidia-kernel-source
01:44<mix22891>E: Unable to locate package nvidia-kernel-common
01:45<jm_>0. Make sure APT has non-free and contrib sources (consult the sources.list(5) man page for help on doing this)
01:45<jm_>did you skip this too?
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01:46<mix22891>i've forgot what is APT
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01:47<jm_>!tell mix22891 -about non-free sources
01:48<mix22891>how to edit sources.list ?
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01:50<jm_>it's a text file, use an editor
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01:50<mix22891>where the file is?
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01:56<jm_>apt told you the exact location
01:58<brohelm>so no one knows what the problem could be with my printer? :(
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02:03<chealer>mix22891: the dpkg bot told you
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02:04<jm_>yeah dpkg not apt ;)
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02:07<mix22891>Permission Denied
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02:07<mix22891>i need to access trough my admin
02:07<brohelm>where is archerseven when you need him? :P
02:07<chealer>mix22891: which desktop environment do you use?
02:08<chealer>mix22891: are you using GNOME? or KDE?
02:09<MAXmark>Do I need to install NVIDIA driver for XP that WINE work?
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02:10<chealer>!tell MAXmark about wine
02:11<chealer>MAXmark: did you ask on WINE's IRC channel?
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02:12<MAXmark>Thanks guys
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02:22<mix22891>jm_ !!!
02:22<mix22891>i've tryed to install
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02:23<mix22891>i've update and all that
02:23<mix22891>and i've got this message : Bad luck, the kernel headers for the target kernel version could
02:23<mix22891> │ not be found
02:23<mix22891> │ and you did not specify other valid kernel headers to use.
02:23<mix22891>module-assistant, error message
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02:26<jm_>mix22891: which kernel package are you using?
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02:29<mix22891>ok! it's work, when it asked me to write [Y/N] in the terminal... i've been on my HEBREW FONTS
02:29<mix22891>got it :) ?
02:29<mix22891>i've press ט beside Y
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02:45<brohelm>ok so this isnt debian specific, but is slackware a lot of work?
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02:46<mix22891>it's WORK PERFECT
02:46<mix22891>THANKS TO YOU
02:47<jm_>mix22891: enjoy
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02:47<mix22891>but how to change resition?
02:48<jm_>why would you change it?
02:48<mix22891>every thing so big
02:48<jm_>can your monitor show the resolution it's running at?
02:49<mix22891>where i can cheak it?
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02:50<jm_>well its on-screen menus/info
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02:51<Random>hello every one
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02:52<mix22891>hello Random
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02:53<mix22891>jm_ ?
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02:57<ompaul>mix22891: the monitors own menus should be able to tell you what it is running at and what it is capable of
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02:57<jm_>mix22891: do you know what OSD is?
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03:04<pretendo>how come debian cant run fsck when the disk is mounted?
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03:06<mix22891>jm_ no menu for the screen
03:06<ompaul>pretendo: it can, doing so will rip the heart out of the disk, so it is a "Bad Idea TM"
03:07<jm_>mix22891: then check in /var/log/Xorg.0.log file
03:08<pretendo>osx can repair is that the same thing?
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03:11<ompaul>pretendo: no idea what osx is
03:11<ompaul>pretendo: if it is an ext3 or 4 partition don't touch it with other tools
03:11<ompaul>or ext2 or whatever - use the right tools
03:12<pretendo>OSX operating system
03:12<pretendo>repair permissions
03:12<pretendo>is that the same thing as fcsk
03:12<ompaul>ohh you mean that copied version of BSD
03:12<ompaul>look - you have been told use the native tools to fix debian partitions if they need it have fun
03:13<ompaul>using other tools is not supported
03:13<pretendo>thanks paul
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03:13<mix22891>jm_ how do i find the screen resultion on this .log file ??
03:13<ompaul>all it will do will make you go - I guess should not have done that - I've lost all that worthless stuff I had on that partition now I can go and play with teh shiny like I wanted to and avoid irc trolling :P
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03:14<jm_>mix22891: put it on a pastebin
03:14*ompaul goes to work - it will be fun
03:14<jm_>!tell mix22891 -about paste
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03:17<mix22891>jm_ i've lost you
03:18<mix22891>i need to change the screen resultion
03:19<mix22891>it's 800x600
03:19<jm_>mix22891: I need to see your Xorg.0.log file to help you
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03:25<mix22891>!tell mix22891 -about paste
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03:28<jm_>mix22891: you are not using nvidia driver but nouevau driver
03:28<mix22891>so what do i do now>
03:28<jm_>mix22891: or rather, it switches to vesa because it probably doesn't support your card - which card is it?
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03:28<jm_>ahh geforce 210
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03:29<mix22891>it's Nvidia yes?
03:29<jm_>there's one more step you missed: Modify an existing xorg.conf
03:30<jm_>you need to tell it to use driver nvidia
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03:34<mix22891>how please?
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03:43<mix22891>jm_ ?
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03:46<jm_>mix22891: read section Modify an existing xorg.conf or Create an xorg.conf, whichever applies to you (on the wiki page)
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03:47<mix22891>what wiki page?
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03:48<mix22891>after i've create xorg.conf file, where i'm put him?
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03:50<devil>mix22891: towards the end
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03:59<mix22891>fm_ It's PERFECT NOW
03:59<mix22891>thank alot!
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04:42<pko>hi all
04:43<pko>does anyone knows a channel or a server where i can trade for hacking stuff ?
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04:53<daemonkeeper>Does the stuff on Debian mirrors qualify for "hacking stuff"?
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06:43<Guest2295>Hi There!
06:45<Guest2295>I just installed Debian 6.0 on my laptop and am unable to get the wireless internet working?; The password is all correct. I get this error "Disconnected:Network is disconnected"
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06:46<Zaba>look in dmesg, perhaps
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06:48<smb>Guest2295: What did you use to configure it?
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06:50<Guest2295>I used the NetworkManager applet on the panel to configure, I am seeing an ERROR in dmesg : "ERROR! NICLoadFirmware failed, Status[=0x00000001]; rt28xx Intialized failed!
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06:52<jm_>enough clues in there
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06:53<JohnnyDoe>is there a generic configuration file or command to automatically set the audio volume to zero at startup?
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06:55<Zaba>Guest2295, you need to have the firmware files
06:55<Zaba>Guest2295, the firmware-ralink package, I guess
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06:57<Guest2295>I have the debian DVD, can I use the synaptic to install firmware-ralink package?
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06:57<Zaba>I don't know, it might be missing non-free packages.
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06:57<Guest2295>I can dowenload this to my present computer, co it to falsh drive then install it right?
06:58<Zaba>theoretically yes
06:58<Guest2295>OK I will try it now.
06:59<smb>JohnnyDoe: You can use alsamixer to set the volume
06:59<jm_>JohnnyDoe: set it a such and run alsactl store
06:59<jm_>JohnnyDoe: after wards /etc/init.d/alsa-utils should restore saved state
07:00<Guest2295>What is the apt-get command for download but dont install a package?
07:00<jm_>apt-get -d foo
07:00<Zaba>apt-get download foo
07:00<jm_>where fo is "install pkg"
07:01<JohnnyDoe>smb, jm_: yes but the problem is that it would not work in a generic way, e.g. same config file on diffferent machines with different soundcards
07:01<jm_>does apt-get also know "download" like aptitude?
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07:01<jm_>which version?
07:02<Zaba> here
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07:02<jm_>JohnnyDoe: in that case I'd write an init script that uses amixer
07:02<jm_>ahh that's in testing
07:03<ferni>maybe just amixer set Master toggle to /etc/rc.local to mute the master channel?
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07:03<JohnnyDoe>jm_, yes I do that now. Thank you.
07:04<jm_>JohnnyDoe: now that you said it I remember that I had to re-create asound.state file on my new machine last month
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07:12<automatical>hey guys - i'm wondering if anyone can point me in the direction of how to create my own source deb packages? (I'm trying to write an svn hook for a private instance of the opensuse build service) - I'm not sure if i'm in the right channel, so feel free to tell me to go somewhere else :)
07:12<babilen>automatical: You probably want to read the new maintainers guide -- /msg dpkg nmg
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07:16<ferni>hmm.. squeeze grub seems to be failing with "unaligned pointer 0x8ef10002" when using "qlx" video device
07:16<ferni>with qemu-kvm
07:17<automatical>babilen: awsome, cheers
07:17<babilen>automatical: There is also a channel (#debian-mentors) that is helps new maintainers with their packaging problems. But read the nmg (+ debian developer's reference and policy) first. Other nice articles comprise and
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07:17<babilen>s/that is/that
07:17<R33D3M33R>hi, I got a strange problem ... I left computer on for 3 days and i noticed a file .xsession-errors became huge! 13G. I'm using Squeeze. How can I find out which program has filled the file up?
07:18<automatical>awsome, exactly what i'm looking for :)
07:18<Guest2295>I installed firmware-ralink by downloading on a different computer, I see the NetworkManger Icon rotating, In the NetworkManager What is SSID, and What mode do I choose?
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07:18<babilen>automatical: Lucas' slides give a good overview, you might actually want to start with that and follow the nmg to get some practical experience
07:19<babilen>Guest2295: SSID is the name of the wireless network you are connecting to. What modes can you choose from?
07:19<automatical>babilen: wow, thanks for your help!
07:19<babilen>R33D3M33R: Take a look at it -- You might want to file a bug against the software that is responsible for the "spam"
07:20<babilen>automatical: Have fun :)
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07:20<R33D3M33R>yeah, I thought so myself, but there are millions of lines in it
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07:20<daemonkeeper>You don't want top /open/ that file
07:20<daemonkeeper>use less
07:21<smb>R33D3M33R: tail -n100 .xsession-errors
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07:21<R33D3M33R>Xlib: extension "DPMS" missing on display ":1.0".
07:21<R33D3M33R>hmmm, drivers issues?
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07:23<R33D3M33R>hm... there is also a lot of data from /usr/bin/nepomukservicestub
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07:26<R33D3M33R>btw: against which package should I file a bug:§ion=all
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07:27<babilen>,file /usr/bin/nepomukservicestub
07:27<judd>/usr/bin/nepomukservicestub in squeeze/i386: kdebase-runtime: usr/bin/nepomukservicestub
07:27<R33D3M33R>excellent, thanks
07:28<babilen>!tell R33D3M33R -about apt-file
07:28<themill>R33D3M33R: you can tune how much krap gets written to your .xsession-errors with kdebugdialog. That won't change the xlib errors though
07:29<daemonkeeper>Also it is perhaps not a bug at all, I mean if nepomuk would trash everyone's xsession as much as 15G in two days, surely someone noticed before KDE 4.4 ...
07:30<Guest2295>Thanks folks: I got the wireless internet working
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07:31<R33D3M33R>yeah, strange
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07:35<azatoth_work>why is default papersize letter?
07:36<babilen>azatoth_work: What do you mean? A* formats are just nice, it is good that they are standardised.
07:37<babilen>azatoth_work: uups, I replaced "letter" with "better" in my head. I guess it is either due to the PPD you are using or your locale.
07:37*babilen gets coffee
07:37<themill>or /etc/papersize
07:38<babilen>themill ftw :)
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07:57<azatoth_work>babilen, why would locale have any inpact on default papersize? why still default to letter? it's not like letter is the most common paper format around the wörld
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07:59<amitz>war winners get to choose.
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08:00<themill>azatoth_work: the US uses letter style paper, so if you choose a US locale, you get a US letter size by default unless you dpkg-reconfigure libpaper1 and choose otherwise. So it's not really a default of letter in the way you suggest.
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08:09<azatoth_work>themill, I think letter should be erradicated from any default :)
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08:10<themill>well yes, it's a stupid paper size, but there's a lot of things about en_US that fit that category...
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08:11<azatoth_work>themill, what is /etc/papersize sat to at installation?
08:12<themill>azatoth_work: it should be the default paper size for the default locale you chose
08:12<daemonkeeper>How is en_US different to, say, en_GB?
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08:14<azatoth_work>themill, I don't know what default locale is, I only know my current locale
08:14<azatoth_work>but I assume the default locale is pretty much always C
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08:15<themill>not at all, you choose that at installation time
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08:16<azatoth_work>themill, hypothetically, if I've drop /etc/default/locale, what locale is default then?
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08:16*azatoth_work hates locale
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08:20<azatoth_work>themill, well, I've always set sv_SE.UTF-8 as locale during install, and I've always had to manually change /etc/papersize to a4 from the dreadful letter
08:22<themill>hmm... that locale should default to A4.
08:22<azatoth_work>though true, I might have sat to en_US.utf8 as I've always felt the swedish translations always have been sadly bad
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08:22<gnugr>azatoth_work; what you get with " cat .profile " ?
08:22<daemonkeeper>azatoth_work: That holds for every localization, de_DE is the same, hence I use en_US as well (but LC_TIME=de_DE.UTF-8 and LC_MONETARY, ...)
08:23<azatoth_work>daemonkeeper, yea, and the assumption that because I'm Swedish, I want swedish translations isn't always true, and that LANG === LC_ALL
08:23<gnugr>azatoth_work: also what you ger with " locale -a "
08:23<azatoth_work>but if we abolish letter from the world, the issue goes away :)
08:24<SynrG>azatoth_work: my reading is, if you select 'None' as your locale, update-locale isn't run, therefore /etc/default/locale isn't created, therefore you should end up with locale "C"
08:24<azatoth_work>SynrG, default papersize goes letter then?
08:24<SynrG>(from looking at /var/lib/dpkg/info/locales.template, locales.postinst, etc.)
08:24<daemonkeeper>I opted to english/C locales since links asked me whether to accept (literally) biscuits
08:25<SynrG>azatoth_work: damned if i know
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08:25<gnugr>,file papersize
08:25<judd>papersize in squeeze/i386: c++-annotations-html: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-html/README.papersize; c++-annotations-dvi: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-dvi/README.papersize; c++-annotations-txt: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-txt/README.papersize; c++-annotations-contrib: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-contrib/README.papersize; c++-annotations-ps: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-ps/README.papersize;
08:25<judd>c++-annotations: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations/README.papersize; c++-annotations-pdf: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-pdf/README.papersize; c++-annotations-latex: usr/share/doc/c++-annotations-latex/README.papersize
08:25<SynrG>daemonkeeper: biscuits! haha
08:26<themill>gnugr: it's useful to know the answer prior to spewing it into the channel; no package owns /etc/papersize
08:26<gnugr>got it
08:27<azatoth_work>well, actually the system in question isn't really a standard debian install, thus I can't imply it's ever been installed in the view of "debian installer", i.e. no locale has ever been set
08:27<azatoth_work>,file /etc/papersize
08:27<judd>No packages were found with that file.
08:28<azatoth_work>but I have 695 locales installed
08:29<gnugr>what did you get with " locale -a "
08:29<gnugr>all 695?
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08:29<azatoth_work># locale -a | wc -l
08:30<gnugr>just " locale -a "
08:30<beers>I have a short questions for you. I can see that the linux-image-2.6-686 in sid /(eg2.6.39) now supports PAE as default. Since I am running 64 bit for onee reason (eg more than 4 gb ram in my mashine) should I then go back to 32 bit with PAE to get bethher support for non-64 bit software (flash java etc). or are they in simelar state today?
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08:30<azatoth_work>having locales-all installed as it's an server installation
08:31<azatoth_work>gnugr, well, ok:
08:31*gnugr gets dizzzzzzzzzy
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08:32<azatoth_work>gnugr, it's an semi-embedded installation
08:32<jm_>beers: java is no reason to use 32bit, and flash crap exists too, the only downside is it's badly outdated
08:32<daemonkeeper>beers: There is no reason to use PAE unless you have to, since its a performance penalty. On the other hand there isn't much reason to go with a 64 bit user land neither (although there isn't much difference but for some legacy non-free crap)
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08:33<daemonkeeper>beers: You can, however, use a 64 bit kernel with a 32 bit user land which comes over most of the AMD64 penalties while still having many advantages
08:33<azatoth_work>what I actually want to know is what action beside reconfigure libpaper1 sets default papersize, and which is default is /etc/papersize aint exists and /etc/default/locales aint exists either
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08:44<nevyn>daemonkeeper: big per process memory
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08:45<daemonkeeper>nevyn: True, hence "almost". For the desktop that's probably not such a problem though
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09:34<opalepatrick>Getting Unable to find expected entry 'squeeze/source/Sources' in Release file (Wrong sources.list entry or malformed file) but the sources.list file has not changed, any clues?
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09:35<azatoth_work>should system-config-printer-udev restart samba or not?
09:35<azatoth_work>when printer is attached or not
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09:35<opalepatrick>It tried both debian and a local resource
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09:37<mutante>opalepatrick: probably best to pastebin your sources.list
09:37<opalepatrick>ok thanks mutante
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09:39<opalepatrick> for the sources.list
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09:41<dvs>opalepatrick: you're mixing squeeze and lenny.
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09:42<gsimmons>opalepatrick: Lines 13-14 are also incorrect.
09:42<opalepatrick>Wondered about that dvs. I think I entered it early days to get an old.
09:43<dvs>gsimmons: 14-15
09:43<gsimmons>Uh, yes.
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09:44<opalepatrick>the ones referring to squeeze-updates?
09:44<themill>opalepatrick: there's an extra "squeeze" on those lines that shouldn't be there
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09:46<opalepatrick>OK, I see that one refers to deb and the other deb-src. This is my first use of Debian so this is all a bit new to me. Is there a way to set up a virgin sources-list?
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09:48<dvs>opalepatrick: backup the file and then put "deb squeeze main contrib non-free". Then copy that line and change "deb" to "deb-src".
09:48<dvs>make that "deb"
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09:50<babilen>!squeeze sources.list
09:50<dpkg>The list of repositories for installing packages is /etc/apt/sources.list and has lines like "deb squeeze main" and "deb squeeze/updates main". Be sure to run "aptitude update" after editing sources.list. Also see <mirrors> <apt-spy> <squeeze updates> <squeeze security> and "man sources.list".
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09:51<babilen>opalepatrick: You probably want to ask dpkg about <contrib> <non-free> <squeeze-updates> and <bdo> as well. For example: /msg dpkg non-free
09:51<babilen>opalepatrick: Ah, add <geo sources.list> in there too :)
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10:07<opalepatrick>thanks a lot babilen
10:08<babilen>opalepatrick: If you want we can have another look at the sources.list you came up with
10:08<opalepatrick>cheers just about to do it :-)
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10:10<firdaus>hay all
10:10<firdaus>how are you ?
10:10<firdaus>i have a problem
10:10<firdaus>can you help me ?
10:11<babilen>firdaus: Yes, please ask your question, consider using punctuation characters instead of the enter key and provide as much information as you can about your problem. Thank you :-)
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10:18<opalepatrick> /msg dpkg non-free
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10:21<babilen>firdaus: What is your problem?
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10:26<firdaus>bagaimana supaya kita terhindar dari serangan deauthification dengan aireplay-ng ?
10:27<firdaus>i have search on google
10:27<firdaus>but have not answer
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10:27<akerl>firdaus: wtf...
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10:28<firdaus>how so that we avoid the attack with aireplay-ng deauthification
10:29<akerl>You're trying to protect your network from deauth attacks?
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10:30<firdaus>protect from tuxcut
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10:33<firdaus>can you all help me ?
10:34-!-mode/#debian [+o themill] by ChanServ
10:34-!-mode/#debian [-b *!*@] by themill
10:34-!-mode/#debian [-o themill] by themill
10:34<themill>firdaus: is this with ubuntu or backtrack or debian?
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10:35<firdaus>if attacker send me deauthinfication by aireplay-ng
10:35<themill>firdaus: so you want #ubuntu on
10:36<firdaus>i want that we avoid the attack with aireplay-ng deauthification
10:37<firdaus>can you help meeee
10:37-!-mode/#debian [+q *!*@] by ChanServ
10:37<themill>firdaus: you want #ubuntu on
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10:38<gnugr>firdaus: check tjis out " "
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11:02<houms> can anyone help me with time settings. gota new sager laptop and in bios it is set to local time
11:02<houms> i assume that means my /etc/default/rcS should read UTC=no is that correct?
11:02<ballison>how do i see what build options mysqld was built with? strings the binary?
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11:04<themill>ballison: it's in the source package; /msg dpkg debian/rules
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11:07<babilen>houms: Yes, or set the hardware clock to UTC (beware of the windows daemon) -- You might also want to consider to use ntp to adjust the time automagically -- /msg dpkg ntp -- /msg dpkg set time
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11:14<houms>is there a way to change bios to use UTC or is there an easier way to get the time to display correctly
11:14<houms>currently Bios is set to local time
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11:14<sney>yeah, just boot into the bios and change the clock
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11:14<sney>alternately, you can use hwclock
11:15<babilen>houms: Read "/msg dpkg set time"
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11:16<babilen>sney: Ah, yes and use "hwclock" (I foolishly assumed that would be mentioned in the factoid → todo)
11:16<babilen>houms: ^^
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11:16<houms>but hwclock does not work
11:17<houms>i already tried hwclock --systohc --utc
11:17<houms>and on reboot still bios shows local time
11:17<sney>I had an old powerpc box that had no battery for the hardware clock, so I wound up putting a cron script to run a ntp update and hwclock --systohc about once every hour
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11:18<houms>i read the dpkg, thanks btw, but what i don't understand is if utc=no in rcS and bios is set to locatime, then why does date command show wrong time
11:18<babilen>houms: Just set it in the BIOS then and automatically adjust it with ntp
11:18<houms>it is normally set to UTC time in bios no?
11:18<sney>it's what the system expects
11:18<babilen>houms: Might be due to your timezone settings -- "dpkg-reconfigure tzdata" will let you configure the timezone
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11:19<houms>yeah but when i run that and choose american/ new york
11:19<houms>it shows Local time is now: Thu May 26 07:19:12 EDT 2011.
11:19<houms>Universal Time is now: Thu May 26 11:19:12 UTC 2011.
11:19<houms>which is backwards
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11:22<babilen>houms: That is with hardware clock set to Thu May 26 11:19:12 EDT and UTC=no in /etc/default/rcS after a reboot?
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11:34<rcc>hi guys, what happened to build-essentials? it doesn't seem to be in the default squeeze repositories
11:34<themill>!b-e rcc
11:34<dpkg>rcc: Sounds like you need to aptitude install build-essential.
11:34<weasel> *** 11.5 0
11:34<weasel> 500 squeeze/main i386 Packages
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11:35<rcc>themill, apt can't find it
11:35<weasel>rcc: without s.
11:35<tharkun>Gentlemen if i use lvm for a drive can i add aditional partitions in case they are needed?
11:35<themill>rcc: check your spelling
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11:36<weasel>themill: yes. no. depends on what you mean.
11:36<weasel>tharkun: ^.
11:36<rcc>hah, thanks
11:36<rcc>well spotted
11:36<weasel>(why are you not using a shell with tab completion anyway)
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11:37<rcc>I am using the shell, but I didn't know it can autocomplete package names
11:37<tharkun>weasel: I mean the /var partition on the standard partition of the install gives only a /var i really do not know if i need to split it in the future or what the optimal sizes would be for this new server. I planned on using lvm to fix it if needed.
11:37<themill>rcc: you need to install the bash-completion package and enable it in your shell startup
11:38<tharkun>weasel: is that an ok aproach?
11:38<weasel>lvm can be used to solve this problem. I don't know if you are doing it right tho.
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11:39<tharkun>weasel: I should start installing as soon as the blank cd's arrive. This was just a previous question. Just to be sure what i need to take special care when installing
11:40<weasel>tharkun: if in doubt putting everything on a single filesystem isn't the worst approach.
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11:42<tharkun>weasel: Since this server will also have mail i am sure someone is going to get extremely pissed if it does not arrive because some i)=? filled the hdd unintentionaly
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11:45<daemonkeeper>You want to learn about limits
11:46<sney>and make sure the antivirus on your email server doesn't blindly decompress anything it needs to scan
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11:47<sney>a guy I know once brought down his school's email server by gzipping 300 megabytes of zeroes and emailing it to himself
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11:47<tharkun>sney: a zip bomb is far easier to generate :D
11:48<sney>we're talking about disk space though.
11:48<tharkun>daemonkeeper: hmm limiting the email server is easier than limiting a rdbms requirements on a busy web app
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11:50<tharkun>daemonkeeper: anyway thanks for the idea. Since email has similar priority as rdbms the both get their own independent partitions. I get from weasel comments that resizing partitions using lvm is far simpler than generating them so that is the most sensible aproach i can imagine. Any extra thoughts
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11:51<daemonkeeper>tharkun: Still there are quotas and/or limits integrated into kernel and/file system throttling user permissions. IO bound can be limited with dm-ioband and/or ionice
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11:52<tharkun>daemonkeeper: thanks i'll research those before i start
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11:56<thewanderer1>hint: cgroups provide an I/O throttling interface when appropriate config options are enabled in the kernel - ionice can't do that, dm might be a hack
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12:05<daemonkeeper>thewanderer1: dm-ioband supports cgroups as well, I'm not sure it is still actively maintained upstream though.
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12:14<tharkun>sney, daemonkeeper thewanderer1: thanks all of you for your comments
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12:16<themill>!es-social ruben
12:16<dpkg>ruben: Este canal es de ayuda con ordenadores en Ingles. Si no necesitas ayuda con tu ordenador por favor ingresa al canal social de #debian-es con /join #debian-es-cachondeo. Tus amigos probablemente ya esten ahi.
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12:17<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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12:26<tharkun>Gentlemen is it a good idea to add acpid support to a server to monitor the temperature status or is it a plain overkill?
12:27<daemonkeeper>You can answer this question yourself.
12:28<daemonkeeper>If its worth enough for you, do so, if not don't
12:29<tharkun>daemonkeeper: Thanks. I do have my answer, but sometimes a fresh aproach can enlighten me to make better decisitions (sorry for the spelling)
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12:30<mix22891>how do i change the size of the icons on the desktop?
12:30<daemonkeeper>Among my 2000 or so servers I never cared enough to monitor temperature. Is this answer valid for you?
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12:31<mix22891>CTRL/ALT and rolling the mouse button Not work
12:31<tharkun>daemonkeeper: I do not manage that many servers. But leaving in a place where the server room temperature has a 20° difference from the outside made me think about that little isue.
12:31<retrospectacus>mix22891: you can right-click them and choose stretch icon to resize one
12:32<tharkun>daemonkeeper: anyway thanks for the insight
12:32<daemonkeeper>tharkun: Well, fair enough. Mine are in dcs obviously.
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12:35<tharkun>daemonkeeper: I would like to have a long chat with you on how you manage that many servers. But that will have to wait for some other day
12:35<daemonkeeper>Of course I don't do that all alone.
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12:53<dpkg>VATTENE VIA!
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13:04<guilherme>can some one tell me if debian squeeze has utf-8 enabled by default? if so, why can't i read japanese characters on wikipedia?
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13:06<themill>guilherme: you presumably don't have a decent font installed and enabled.
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13:06<guilherme>themill: ok, so it is utf-8 enabled but i still need extra fonts?
13:06<smb>guilherme: Try installing ttf-kochi-gothic
13:07<robi>Sziasztok tud nekem segíteni valaki , én skype-t szeretnék fel tenni a xubuntu-ra?
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13:08<guilherme>smb: if i install a debian japanese locale (and i don't even know how to do that) does it install the fonts for me?
13:08<themill>robi: → #ubuntu-hu
13:09<smb>guilherme: I would have thought so, but I've never done it so I'm not certain
13:09<gnugr>robi: seems skype's server is down
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13:09<guilherme>smb: the reason i ask is that i want to have several languages and i'm wondering what's the easiest way to be able to display characters for different languages, and if i have to instal fonts one by one that would be difficult i think.
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13:10<guilherme>smb: that's why i also asked about utf-8, i thought having that would enable most characters by dafault.
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13:11<themill>guilherme: using utf-8 to encode the characters doesn't mean that the people who made the font actually included the symbols (glyphs) in the font
13:11<guilherme>themill: i see
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13:12<guilherme>themill: do you know if there is a pack of fonts that will cover most asian characters?
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13:12<themill>no idea, sorry.
13:12<guilherme>themill: thanks for trying.
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13:14<guilherme>themill: do you know how to add locales without the command line? is there a gui for that?
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13:15<guilherme>does anyone know?
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13:18<gnugr>guilherme: see this it might help you:
13:20<guilherme>gnugr: thanks but i saw that, i was asking about a gui (graphical user interface)
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13:20<guilherme>gnugr: i guess there isn't on ethen
13:21<robi>Segítene valaki hogyan tudnám telepíteni a skype alkalmazást és honnan szerezem be xubuntu-ra ?
13:21<retrospectacus>there is the keyboard layout preferences thing but that's not exactly locales
13:21<retrospectacus>robi: 10:08 < themill> robi: → #ubuntu-hu
13:23<robi>köszönöm !!
13:23<retrospectacus>robi: we only speak English. We do not support *ubuntu
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13:26<gnugr>guilherme: with utf-8 i can see japanese, why don't you
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13:27<guilherme>gnugr: i installed debian squeeze yesterday from dvd1, i assumed i would too.
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13:28<gnugr>guilherme: i have keyborad layouts el_GR and en_US and i can see Japanese
13:28<tharkun>Gentlemen i need to download the tg3 firmware for i386 is it hardware dependent or is it idependent?
13:29<valdyn>guilherme: doesnt really make sense to have all glyphs in one font
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13:30<guilherme>valdyn: i thought thats utf-8 did, i suppose i was wrong.
13:30<dvs>tharkun: It's hardware INdependent
13:30<tharkun>dvs: thanks
13:30<gnugr>guilherme: check System/preferences/keyborad
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13:30<valdyn>guilherme: utf-8 is just a number <-> glyph mapping scheme
13:30<tharkun>dvs: next beer is on me :D
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13:31<dvs>tharkun: How are you getting the firmware?
13:31<tharkun>from my laptop using apt-get instead of downloading it from the web site
13:31<guilherme>valdyn: is it really just that because on the browser it shows under "character encoding"
13:31<valdyn>guilherme: that means the same thing
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13:31<guilherme>gnugr: i am using a brazilian keyboard
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13:32<valdyn>guilherme: selecting the character encoding is the same as selecting the number <-> glyph mapping scheme
13:32<guilherme>valdyn: i didn't know that, i thought it included the characters themselves
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13:33<guilherme>gnugr: i don't think the keyboard layout can affect the characters displayed
13:34<valdyn>guilherme: in iceweasel / firefox you see the "Fonts for:"
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13:34<valdyn>guilherme: thats maps numeric ranges in utf-8 to fonts
13:34<guilherme>valdyn: where is that, i'm on iceweasel
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13:35<valdyn>guilherme: in Preferences - Content - Advanced Button right of the font size
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13:35<gnugr>guilherme: go firefox addons to add on iceweasel extras
13:36<guilherme>valdyn: yes i see now
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13:36<guilherme>gnugr: but add what?
13:37<valdyn>guilherme: so theres support for having specific fonts for some of the utf-8 alphabets
13:37<guilherme>valdyn: yes, thanks for showing that to me.
13:37<guilherme>valdyn: i didn't know
13:38<guilherme>valdyn: i was just wondering if there is an easy way to get most characters to show for most languages.
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13:38<guilherme>valdyn: especially chinese, japanese and korean, but if possible others too.
13:39<guilherme>valdyn: without having to install many different fonts one by one.
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13:39<valdyn>guilherme: well, you have to install them one by one if you cant use something like regular expressions with apt-get or a loop
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13:40<guilherme>valdyn: the problem is that when i look there are so many fonts even just for japanese.
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13:41<ballison>I'm trying to build mysqld to support InnoDB. But when I try and start the server it just bombs. Anyone know how to make mysqld such that it support InnoDB ?
13:41<valdyn>guilherme: thats typical for debian, that you get alot of choice, but get to have a hard time to chose
13:41<ballison>Here's the error I'm seeing in the logs:
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13:43<guilherme>valdyn: things are looking difficult because of that :(
13:43<valdyn>guilherme: so anyway i dont know about any metapackage that depends on a reasonable selection of fonts
13:43<dpkg>MySQL is a fast and reliable open source relational database implementing a large subset of SQL. It is the world's most popular open source database. To install, ask me about <install mysql>. #mysql on, #debian-mysql on See also <mysql squeeze>, <mysql checking>, <mysql memory usage>.
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13:43<valdyn>guilherme: you can just install all fonts ( except those that conflict with each other obviously )
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13:45<guilherme>valdyn: how do i know if the conflict?
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13:46<valdyn>guilherme: any package management tool will keep you informed about conflicts as they happen, dont worry about that
13:46<guilherme>valdyn: ok
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13:47<valdyn>The following packages have unmet dependencies: ttf-kochi-gothic : Conflicts: ttf-kochi-gothic-naga10
13:47<valdyn>guilherme: i dont know or care about the difference between those 2
13:47<ballison>anyone here good with mysql? I'm not able to start the mysqld with InnoDB enabled....
13:47<valdyn>guilherme: nor should you probably
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13:48<guilherme>valdyn: i care mainly about japanese chinese and korean thai can read some
13:48<guilherme>that* not thai
13:48<guilherme>i can't read thai
13:49<gnugr>ballison: did you try " /etc/init.d/mysql restart " ?
13:49<guilherme>it's just that with so many options i am paralysed
13:49<ballison>gnugr: yes that's what generated those errors
13:50<valdyn>guilherme: just chose 1, if youre unhappy with the font that is being displayed later on you can still change things
13:50<guilherme>ok valdyn
13:51<valdyn>guilherme: so like ' apt-get install "ttf-*" ' and be done
13:51<gnugr>ballison: you have mysql-server-5.1 ?
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13:52<ballison>gnugr: mysql-5.1.49 source code
13:52<ballison>./configure --with-big-tables --with-plugins=blackhole,innobase,partition --with-embedded-server
13:52<ballison>i'm trying to make innobase work.
13:52<ballison>when i compiled with that option i can't get the server to start
13:53<gnugr>ballison:sorry m8 i use phpmyadmin, no idea about innobase
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14:01<poppy76bg>i have a question
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14:02<breakout>are you from bg
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14:03<poppy76bg>i am bulgarian male
14:03<poppy76bg>age 35
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14:03<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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14:05<poppy76bg>i am running on linux ubuntu and i am using skype. is it possible my skype account to be attacked with some exploits to guess my password
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14:05<petemc>if someone guesses your password they wont need exploits
14:05<thewanderer1>poppy76bg: 1. this is Debian support channel. 2. Skype is not free software - please use their forums to ask this question
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14:06<poppy76bg>my password in skype is complex
14:06<poppy76bg>it is not easy for guessing
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14:10<thewanderer1>poppy76bg: this is outside of this channel's scope, I'm afraid. You can go over to the Skype forums, or ask a maths channel about the complexity of guessing your password (if you can't compute that yourself...)
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14:11<poppy76bg>thanks a lot
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14:13<demooriaan>get the hash, and run it through john...
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14:13<engywucz>just tell us your password. we then tell you how complex it is :D
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14:14<thewanderer1>I suppose he meant side-channel leaks and protocol flaws rather than actual guessing
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14:15<demooriaan>sony said their service was safe, so what...
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14:15<thewanderer1>they didn't keep passwords in plaintext, did they?
14:15<engywucz>so thought the american government before their documents were in wikileaks :D
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14:16<engywucz>thewanderer1, i think they were unsalted.
14:16<demooriaan>hashes are sufficient to crack the passwd
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14:16<engywucz>and now for completely on-topic :)
14:16<engywucz>the manpage for ifconfig in testing says
14:16<engywucz> add addr/prefixlen
14:16<engywucz> Add an IPv6 address to an interface.
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14:17<demooriaan>_every_ pass can be cracked, just a matter of time/cpu-power
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14:17<engywucz>so only IPv6 can use CIDR?
14:18<thewanderer1>engywucz: no, works for IPv4 as well
14:18<engywucz>ok, then why do I get this error when trying?
14:19<thewanderer1>ifconfig is a bit old anyway, we're all going to be using `ip` from iproute2 in a few years
14:19<engywucz>LANG=C sudo ifconfig wlan0 add
14:19<engywucz> Unknown host
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14:19<thewanderer1>you were trying to do what?
14:19<engywucz>add an additional ip address in a different range as subinterface
14:19<engywucz>written as
14:20<thewanderer1>oh wait, I've misinterpreted that snippet
14:20<engywucz>LANG=C sudo ifconfig wlan0 add netmask it works
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14:20<thewanderer1>but does it really add a subinterface?
14:20<rpetre>engywucz: i usually use ip address add dev wlan0
14:21<thewanderer1>well, use `ip`, it works :P
14:21<rpetre>never heard of ifconfig's 'add' before :)
14:21<thewanderer1>same here...
14:21<thewanderer1>thought it was short for address :P
14:21<engywucz>I use it for years and years now.
14:21<thewanderer1>yeah, time for a change :P
14:21<engywucz>always as the second form
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14:22<engywucz>with netmask
14:22<engywucz>now I thought it was time for a change so I tried CIDR notation :D
14:22<engywucz>wlan0:0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr 00:15:af:67:8d:43
14:22<engywucz> inet addr: Bcast: Mask:
14:22<engywucz>after the version with netmask
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14:22<engywucz>and ip.... well...
14:22<thewanderer1>you might want to stick with `ip`... subinterfaces are a hack anyway
14:23<thewanderer1>some things work with them (daemons?), some don't (iptables are not always happy)
14:23<engywucz>my last experiences with ip are from ~10 years ago
14:23<tharkun>Gentlemen i managed to screw the partitioning scheme i intended to set. I wanted a /boot partition of 500 Mb but somehow i made it of 250 how can i get rid of the lvm that is on the other partition so i can freely fix this isue. I am doing a fresh install
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14:23<engywucz>horrbly complicated for such simple things :D
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14:23<thewanderer1>engywucz: blame Cisco, it seems to be modelled after IOS :P
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14:23<thewanderer1>(try it - it even accepts short forms without tab...)
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14:24<engywucz>I try. should have gotten better since 2001 :D
14:24<engywucz>@tharkun do you want to clean complete hdd or "only" that partition?
14:25<engywucz>if the latter I'd use some live CD and dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/<partition> bs=1M count=20 :D
14:25-!-EVILUTION [~EVILUTION@] has joined #debian
14:25<thewanderer1>actually, selecting the disk and pressing Return in d-i cleans the disk and makes a partition table :P
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14:26<engywucz>well, thats too easy :D
14:26<EVILUTION>heya there
14:26<engywucz>and I got bitten once in another distro because it tried to use already-on-disk data for guesstimating some setting
14:26<tharkun>engywucz: clear the full disk
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14:27<thewanderer1>tharkun: see what I wrote :P
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14:27<engywucz>then just use the debian installer as described
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14:28<tharkun>thewanderer1: tried it but is says that No modifications can be made to partition #5 of device --- for --- In use by LVM volume group ...
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14:28<thewanderer1>try removing the VG first
14:28<engywucz>doesn't d-i has an "make new on-disk format" or so option?
14:29<thewanderer1>that's what selecting the disk is supposed to do
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14:29<tharkun>thewanderer1: done, same error message
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14:30<Eulenspiegel69>how do I rename hundreds of files in a folder from "<filename>" to "<filename>.<extension>" ?
14:30<engywucz>dd is always working in these cases. Overkill, taking too long etc. But assured to work :D
14:30<tharkun>!tell Eulenspiegel69 rename
14:30<engywucz>Eulenspiegel69, try mmv or so
14:31<tharkun>!tell Eulenspiegel69 about rename
14:31<thewanderer1>I wonder if removing the PV would make sense here
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14:31<tharkun>thewanderer1: PV?
14:32<thewanderer1>physical volume of the LVM
14:32<thewanderer1>so the partition which holds the VG
14:33<thewanderer1>but yeah, maybe you should just erase the MBR and restart the installer...
14:33<tharkun>thewanderer1: FWI it is a scsi Compaq Smar Array
14:33<thewanderer1>dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/MYDISK bs=512 count=1 -- no MBR, no partitions
14:33<thewanderer1>I hope it's detected as one disk only
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14:34<tharkun>thewanderer1: how do i have shell acces on d-i?
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14:37<k1lumin4t1> I have this Asus Crosshair IV Formula, with an AMD Phenom II X6 processor, 4 GBs of RAM and Debian AMD64. I hadn't had not a single issue until now. I just connected a SATA HD with a IDE/SATA to USB adapter (generic stuff) and all of a sudden the system hanged up. well, the SATA HD made a click sound, turned off (I think), and happened. does that mean problems with my -system (hardware + OS)? or a random problem generated by the SATA HD through USb?
14:38<thewanderer1>k1lumin4t1: try it again a few times, observe (if seeing/smelling smoke, stop)
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14:38<k1lumin4t1>thewanderer1, smoke from where?
14:38-!-tiodude [] has joined #debian
14:38<thewanderer1>from anywhere... it'd be a bad sign anyway :P
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14:39<thewanderer1>you should also switch to the console before plugging in the HD and read what happens in the kernel
14:39<engywucz>frictin between socket and cable
14:39<tharkun>thewanderer1: next beer is on me thanks a lot you saved the day
14:39<k1lumin4t1>thewanderer1, dmesg throws some unhandled error codes, but it has always been like this and no hang-ups
14:40<engywucz>removing MBR did help?
14:40<tharkun>engywucz: yes
14:40<tharkun>now it is askin for a partition table type, which one should i use?
14:40-!-tiodude [] has quit []
14:40<engywucz>dos, if available
14:40<tharkun>aix, amiga, bsd, dvh, gpt, mac, msdos, pc98, sun, loop
14:41<thewanderer1>msdos or GPT if you're feeling funky
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14:41<thewanderer1>k1lumin4t1: you mean you're able to observe the dmesg after plugging in the disk?
14:41<tharkun>thewanderer1: gpt? i really have no idea wich one is safer
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14:42<thewanderer1>tharkun: msdos... GPT is if you want to experiment. works fine for me (nice for disks above 2TB), but you need some tweaking
14:42<tharkun>thewanderer1: ok running the msdos one
14:42<engywucz>msdos is most compatible. for disks under 2TB
14:42<engywucz>ancient but therefore supported everywhere
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14:43<ballison>I'm going through hell trying to install mysql server that supports InnoDB
14:43<k1lumin4t1>thewanderer1, yes, the system hanged-up, I did a reset, and i'm back on it, connected again, did not hang-up and observed the same messages as usual when connecting this particular SATA HD through the system I described
14:43<thewanderer1>k1lumin4t1: is it detected / does it work now?
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14:44<k1lumin4t1>thewanderer1, yes, it is detected and mounted, and I just copied some data into it
14:44-!-jumper [] has left #debian []
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14:44<thewanderer1>ok well, it's either a kernel race condition (which you should be able to verify by "googling" hard) or just an electrical failure
14:44-!-zimpee [] has joined #debian
14:45<thewanderer1>these tend to happen when using a poorly-designed hardware system, and almost all are built clumsily nowadays (I've had speakers malfunction when plugging in a USB mouse...) - a spark here and the system buys the farm
14:45<zimpee>Hi! What architecture should I download for my laptop containing an Intel Core i5-480M? It is 64 bit, but do I need AMD64 or IA64?
14:46<ZykoticK9>zimpee, AMD64 or i686 - if you want 64bit then AMD64
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14:47<zimpee>thanks, rpetre, ZykoticK9, will use AMD 64. Easier to do so, it is also downloaded. Appreciate it!
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14:47<k1lumin4t1>thewanderer1, I see
14:48<dpkg>Intel Architecture-64 (IA-64) is a 64-bit processor architecture developed in cooperation by Intel and Hewlett-Packard, implemented by processors such as <Itanium> and Itanium 2. The goal of Itanium was to produce a "post-RISC era" arch using EPIC. See -- if your CPU is opteron/athlon64/turion/sempron/xeon/em64t/pentium/core2duo/core*, then it is NOT ia64, it's <amd64>.
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14:49<zimpee>thanks! homepage was not that specific. See you!
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15:02<engywucz>ok, back to ip address setting with ip
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15:02<engywucz>sudo ip addr add dev wlan0
15:02<engywucz>korrekt, if already another ip address is on wlan0 by DHCP?
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15:02<dpkg>[sudo] (Substitute User DO) Not enabled by default on Debian systems; configure /etc/sudoers first, ask me about <visudo>, <sudoers>. sudo can give limited super user privileges to specific users, or allow you to do silly things like run X apps with root permissions, or good in scripts with "username ALL = NOPASSWD: /some/program".
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15:03<engywucz>Black_Prince, my problem is NOT sudo :D
15:04<Black_Prince>The problem is?
15:04<engywucz>adding another ip address to an existing device
15:04<daemonkeeper>You do it right. Just sudo is pointless.
15:05<engywucz>as I wrote way above, I until now use ifconfig wlan0 add netmask
15:05-!-pipeep [] has joined #debian
15:05<Black_Prince>Does it use static or dynamic ip?
15:05<engywucz>everyone here agreed that this is ancient and I shoul learn "ip"
15:05<engywucz>ifconfig makes a new wlan0:0 device
15:05<Black_Prince>engywucz, debian ifupdown still uses ancient method ...
15:05<engywucz>then all works
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15:06<engywucz>the command above seemed to work, but I can't ping
15:06<shiloh24>what cd image to i dl, there are a list of 52?
15:06<engywucz>shiloh24, depends
15:06<daemonkeeper>shiloh24: The first CD, DVD, netinst image.
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15:07<shiloh24>its only 24k
15:07<daemonkeeper>Those are BitTorrent links
15:07<engywucz>if you don't have a network connection *and* need to be able to install every package, even source packages: all 52 :D
15:07<shiloh24>ahh, cool cool
15:07<engywucz>for everythin else: just the first and rest via network
15:07<Black_Prince>engywucz, this one works for me ip addr add dev eth0
15:08<daemonkeeper> Here are CD images.
15:08<daemonkeeper> DVD ...
15:08<shiloh24>ill just need the first one correct?
15:08<engywucz>ah, k
15:08<daemonkeeper>If you are going to have network connectivity on the installation target, yes, you need the first only.
15:09<engywucz> is down. great .D
15:09<engywucz>yes, workes
15:09<daemonkeeper>Even more, a smaller netinst image works for you
15:09<shiloh24>cool, ty daemonkeeper
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15:09<babilen>shiloh24: You probably want to learn about the different images that are available. Please ask out friendly bot about: <netinst> <cd1> <various cd1> <firmware image> <install debian> <ig> (e.g. /msg dpkg ig) -- If you have a working (wired) internet connection during the installation I would recommend the netinstall image with firmware (if your hardware requires it) -- You can also supply firmware during the installation (/msg dpkg ...
15:10<babilen>... installer firmware) or later on
15:10<daemonkeeper>Oh, you are a bot now?
15:10<daemonkeeper>babilen: firmware image
15:10<babilen>shiloh24: Depending on your hardware you can also choose between i386 (32 bit) and amd64 (64 bit)
15:10<engywucz>I recommend DVD1, if possible. Then you don't need internet for the first install till its running
15:11<shiloh24>ive been using the "lazy man" linux, Mint, for about 6 yrs
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15:11<daemonkeeper>engywucz: You neither do for the netinst.
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15:11<babilen>daemonkeeper: haha :-D
15:11<engywucz>but that needs a DVD drive and patience while downloading heaps of later unused stuff
15:11<engywucz>netinst is so slow :D
15:11<shiloh24>i want to use debian since it has a solid sound architecture
15:11<engywucz>my DVD drive is faster than my cable :D
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15:11<babilen>engywucz: That depends on your package selection and your downlink
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15:12<daemonkeeper>ehmm, but you need to /download/ the whole DVD image first. You do only need the 200M netinst to complete installation, engywucz
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15:12<daemonkeeper>Despite its name, you /don't/ need a network connection for netinst
15:12<engywucz>yes, but *that* download goes overnight *and* I can use it for different PCs :D
15:12<engywucz>daemon, i know.
15:12<daemonkeeper>(if a minimal system ought to be enough for you to start with)
15:13<engywucz>but what fun is the debian you get with netinst *only*
15:13<daemonkeeper>The only way I go.
15:13<babilen>engywucz: You can also proxy packages locally. Yes, there is no one-size-fits-all solution which is why Debian provides different images. You can also leave the installation overnight.
15:13<ZykoticK9>i find the biggest advantage to a netinstall (for desktops) is being able to avoid mono.
15:13<Black_Prince>Well, engywucz, you are right if there are several machines to install debian on. But if there is only one, there is no need to download whole set, nor dvd 1
15:13<engywucz>debian minimal is right for "oh, it boots" effect, but for everything else....
15:13<daemonkeeper>Its enough to have a system to install what you actually want.
15:14<daemonkeeper>I prefer that over a system, trashing my disk with programs I don't use
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15:14<engywucz>then select "minimal" in the d-i plus the packages you want manually
15:14<engywucz>works. I tested it
15:14<babilen>shiloh24: Please don't let this discussion confuse you :)
15:14<daemonkeeper>So? What's your point to download the full DVD then?
15:15<babilen>*all of them*
15:15<engywucz>what's your point to even download netinst?
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15:15<daemonkeeper>Well, somehow I need to install Debian, as bootstrapping it all the time isn't so much fun
15:15<engywucz>use any live-cd, and then manually copy the necessary files via download in a chroot
15:15<babilen>engywucz: You will only download what you need when you use the netinstall.
15:15<engywucz>debian-from-scratch :D
15:16<Black_Prince>Live CD's are actually full of unnecesary software.
15:16<daemonkeeper>engywucz: Guess what, that's exactly what netinst + d-i does
15:16<engywucz>as I said: I don't *want* to need downloads just for install. My downstream is slower than my dvd drive
15:16<Black_Prince>Because it includes most commonly used software, but not everyone has a scanner, a printer, a bluetooth device, needs software a that depends on software b .. etc
15:16<engywucz>Black_Prince, I already have some. Great for debugging windows machines D
15:17<Black_Prince>I have one too, for resizing partitions, and for fixing things I ussualy screw up.
15:17<engywucz>and then there are live CDs and live CDs
15:17<shiloh24>babilen, lol, no not at all, i think this is the best choice for me though, i will have a sweet stable debian base, solid kernel and sound architecture, and a solid package selection
15:17<engywucz>my favourite these days is grml
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15:17<dpkg>The Debian Live project provides pre-built Debian live system images and allows creation of your own. These can be used to install a Debian system. Live images are available from . #debian-live on
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15:18<engywucz>guess what grml is based upon :D
15:18<daemonkeeper>Its not
15:18<daemonkeeper>Its based on Debian
15:18<daemonkeeper>Not Live
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15:18<engywucz>i said live CD, not DEBIAN live cd
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15:18<babilen>shiloh24: exactly -- If you are a little experienced with Linux in general you might already know which desktop environment or window manager you want to use. I would personally recommend *not* to install the desktop task during the installation (just minimal + standard) and take it from there. You probably want to install Xorg (/msg dpkg install x) and a DE/WM of your choice. Which one do you prefer?
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15:19<sney>a lot of debian users and developers swear by grml as a rescue image anyway
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15:19*babilen raises his hand
15:19<babilen>I have to try the Debian Live rescue image though
15:19<shiloh24>babilen, i am used to gnome, as for window manager
15:19<babilen>It is rather that I like GRML, not that I dislike Debian Live in any way
15:20<shiloh24>like i mentioned, ive used Mint, the lazy mans linux
15:20<shiloh24>but it has become problematic for me to use now
15:20<Black_Prince>I dislike Debian Live because of two things. First: kexec-tools won't let me reboot my machine. Second: Gparted is not included in default images.
15:20<ZykoticK9>Installing from the "live" media always resulted in Debian 6 not "restarting" (reboot would drop to kernel, but wouldn't restart BIOS), yet upgrading to 6 or installing using other media didn't have the same issue? just food for thought.
15:21<Black_Prince>ZykotickK9, not restarting is kexec-tools problem.
15:21<sney>did you file a bug?
15:21<shiloh24>the "pulse audio" has made my machine useless to me for most enjoyment now
15:21<engywucz>gparted not included? great :D
15:21<babilen>shiloh24: Ok, if you install the "Desktop" task during the installation it will give you a Gnome desktop but it will also install *a lot* of packages you might not actually want. If you are happy with that just do that, if you aim for a slimmer alternative, don't install the desktop task but either select packages manually or install it *after* the initial installation. (/msg dpkg install gnome) -- I recommend the "gnome-session" package ...
15:21<Black_Prince>sney, I reported it to #debian-live guys. SynG believes it's fixed in 3.x branch.
15:22<babilen>... which is the most minimal and you can then add programs you really need.
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15:22<ZykoticK9>Black_Prince, i only experienced it with the "live" debian disks... problem was worked around by simply installing from the real disks - sorry I didn't file a bug.
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15:22<engywucz>babilen: more minimal, if you start aptitude with Option -R
15:22<engywucz>or -r?
15:22<Black_Prince>ZykoticK9, I told you. Debian Live includes kexec-tools, which provides that option. Workaround would be to remove it.
15:23<engywucz>no autoinstall of only "recommended" packages. :D
15:23<shiloh24>babilen, yes i will intall the native desktop with installation, not worried about it being "slim"
15:23<babilen>engywucz: Packages are typically recommended for good reasons.
15:23<engywucz>yes, but you wanted minimal :D
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15:23<ZykoticK9>Black_Prince, thanks :)
15:23<engywucz>oh, did I mention the system I'm working on right now has only 4GB hdd? :D
15:23<Black_Prince>engywucz, not installing recommended packages can lead you into non functional software.
15:23<Black_Prince>Or less functional than it should be.
15:24<engywucz>then it should not be recommended but needed
15:24<engywucz>ok, less functional I can live witg
15:24<babilen>shiloh24: Alright, have fun! (in that case the CD1 is a viable alternative -- just make sure you have the firmware around if your hardware needs it) Do you run a linux now? If so, you could pastebin the output of "lspci -nn" and we can tell you if you need firmware.
15:24<engywucz>on a small disk anyway
15:24<Black_Prince>engywucz, it is recommended because not all users need it.
15:24<shiloh24>babilen, yes i have linex now, ive no idea what firmware is
15:25<dpkg>Firmware is software to operate electronic devices, usually contained in EPROM or flash memory. Some drivers require firmware to be provided from userspace, prior to device operation, notably for <WiFi> devices. Most firmware files are not part of a Debian release as they do not conform to the <DFSG>; some are available via <contrib> and <non-free> packages. See also <search>, <installer firmware>.
15:25<babilen>!tell shiloh24 about firmware
15:25<engywucz>!tell shiloh24 about firmware
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15:26<Black_Prince>!tell me about going to hell
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15:28<engywucz>you are already there
15:28<Black_Prince>Oh yes, I forgot.
15:29<Black_Prince>Every time someone said 'go to hell' to me, I came right here.
15:29<Black_Prince>judd: pciid 1106:3065
15:29<judd>[1106:3065] is 'VT6102 [Rhine-II]' from 'VIA Technologies, Inc.' with kernel module 'via-rhine' in squeeze. See also
15:30<babilen>shiloh24: Yes, you'll need firmware (firmware-realtek) -- /msg dpkg installer firmware -- Or just use the firmware images. All that is also detailed in the installation guide which I highly recommend (/msg dpkg ig)
15:30<ZykoticK9>Black_Prince, sney just as a piece of background information regarding that kexec-tools and not restarting to BIOS, on a fresh boot audio would work - but if I did a "restart", no audio. That's actually what made me notice, the not seeing the BIOS on restart is easy to overlook.
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15:31<babilen>!tell shiloh24 about rtl8169
15:31<shiloh24>babilen, oks ya lost me, lol
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15:32<babilen>shiloh24: hehe
15:32<babilen>shiloh24: one second (/me is not so sure anymore about the firmware)
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15:34<babilen>shiloh24: Ok, your NIC (ethernet) card needs firmware. This firmware can be found in the firmware-realtek package on Debian. The netinstall firmware image contains the firmware, but you can also provide it on a USB stick during the installation if you use another image (e.g. CD1) see for details
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15:35<babilen>shiloh24: clearer now?
15:35<babilen>shiloh24: All that being said: Just use the firmware image and install the desktop task and you'll be fine.
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15:35<shiloh24>babilen, in otherwords, if i use the net-install, it would be easier for me?
15:35<babilen>shiloh24: yes
15:35<Black_Prince>babilen, I noticed on debian 6.0.0, 6.0.1, and 6.0.1a net install disks, installer would not look up for firmware even if firmware.tar.bz2 is on usb stick.
15:35<Black_Prince>On debian netinstall rc1 and rc2 it worked fine.
15:36<shiloh24>the net install image just hung up on me, i already dl'd that one
15:36<babilen>shiloh24: You probably feel a bit oversupported now :)
15:36<shiloh24>lol, not at all :)
15:36<babilen>!tell shiloh24 -about firmware image
15:36<babilen>shiloh24: I was talking about the image dpkg just told you about
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15:38<shiloh24>babilen, dl'ing it, ty so much
15:39<babilen>have fun :)
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15:40<shiloh24>yeah im excited about it, seems like a perfect fit for me
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15:40<kop>!tell shiloh24 about overview
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15:40<kop>shiloh24: ^^ since you're new.
15:41<Black_Prince>Hell, how to rip dvd to matroska with dvd::rip ?
15:42<shiloh24>kop, ty i read that page, i read allot of the wiki also, i needed a distro without pulse audio, lol
15:42<Black_Prince>I see only mpeg4 and x264 with ffmpeg selected, and divx, xvid ...
15:43<ZykoticK9>Black_Prince, handbrake supports matroska containers. I'm doing webm (matroska container) with ffmpeg, using mplayer to dump the source. I haven't used dvd::rip in a while. good luck.
15:43<Black_Prince>I'll take a look at mpeg4 for now.
15:44<ZykoticK9>mpeg4 is probably your best bet for cross compatibility right now for devices (unfortunately not an open format)
15:44<zimpee>You guys have any idea how to install debian next to win7 which set my hdd to dynamic disk?
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15:45<kop>!dynamic disk
15:45<dpkg>Logical Disk Manager (LDM) is a logical volume manager implementation used by Microsoft Windows {2000,XP,Vista,7} operating systems. Partitions created within LDM are referred to as dynamic disks. Supported by the Linux kernel since 2.4.8; LDM is not supported by <GRUB> (Debian bug #569133). . See also <lvm>.
15:46<dpkg>[lvm] the Linux Logical Volume Manager ( Resources:, <lvm_tutorial>, <lvm removedisk>, <lvm movelv>, <install using lvm>,, IRC: #lvm on
15:46<kop>zimpee: You'd have to shrink the partition that win7 created to put it's dynamic disk in, somehow.
15:46-!-egwk [] has joined #debian
15:46<kop>zimpee: Or add another disk so you've somewhere to put Deiban.
15:46<shiloh24>this channel bot is sweet
15:47<shiloh24>kuddos to the channel admin
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15:47<shiloh24>very very helpful
15:47<dpkg>Please do not use the bot's !tell feature on #debian to see factoids for yourself (!tell me about something). Doing so could be considered spam. Instead, send a private message to the bot (dpkg) containing the factoid you want to read. For example, instead of "!tell me about foo", use "/msg dpkg foo". See also <msg the bot>
15:47<kop>shiloh24: Anyone can add to the factoids.
15:47<kop>zimpee: I don't suppose the debian install manual has any hints?
15:48<zimpee>kop, it is a notebook, adding disk is not possible now :D
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15:48<kop>zimpee: Perhaps parted/gparted can do something. Or maybe the installer already knows how. Did you check the manual?
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15:51<Black_Prince>I guess last quit message was meant for eminem.
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15:51<Black_Prince>He said in one of his songs 'There are some skeletons in my closet.'
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15:53<greenland>In xorg, is there a way to constrain the bounds of specific InputDevices to a Monitor? I ask because I've a Wacom Cintiq, and having my main-mouse drift off of my main-screen onto the tablet on occasion is somewhat irritating.
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15:53<zimpee>it is open, did not find any useful yet. As i see, debian installer can resize ntfs partitions. So, if I convert my hdd back to basic drive instead of dynamic, with a big ntfs partition, can I chop some off for debian, and install? Will there be no problems in Win7?
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15:55<Black_Prince>!dual boot
15:55<dpkg>rumour has it, dual boot is This describes a system that can boot to two different operating systems. Some OSs, such as Windows NT and OS/2, allow for dual booting when installed. Of course, you can also use other methods such as commercial programs that install a special boot partition that is capable of launching operating systems from other partitions. You can also boot to more than two operating systems on the same machine. see <dual boot guide>
15:55<dvs>OS/2 ?!?
15:55<dvs>that MUST be old!
15:55<Black_Prince>Windows NT ...
15:55<Black_Prince>Sure it's
15:56<daemonkeeper>Well, maybe this factoid can be updated a bit
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15:57<dvs>zimpee: Why dont you leave some unused space instead of making it an NTFS partition?
15:57<kop>zimpee: Anyway, yes. If you convert to a basic drive then the installer has the tools built-in to resize and make more room on the disk.
16:00<zimpee>thanks dvs, didn't think of that, doing it right now. Also thanks kop for your help, i was wondering if it bothers w7, if i use the installer to resize, make new partitions. Because then there will be +2 partitions, sum of 6, which means w7 will want to change the disk to dynamic
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16:02<engywuck>" So, if I convert my hdd back to basic drive instead of dynamic, with a big ntfs partition" <--- well, at least in Windows up to XP it's impossible to change a "dynamic" drive back to basic
16:02<engywuck>never tried in 7 though
16:03<kop>zimpee: As near as I can tell from wikipedia a dynamic disk must take up the whole drive. On such a drive you'd have to install Linux inside a Microsoft logical volume. This sounds dicey.
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16:03<engywuck>zimpee: more than 4 partitions (on MSDOS partition table) is only possible using extended partitions
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16:04<engywuck>dynamic disk is somewhat like LVM but or whole disk only, IIUC
16:04<kop>engywuck: Apparently you can buy a program to change back to a regular disk. Or just erase and start over from backup.
16:04<zimpee>engywuck, i use easeus partition magic, it can convert it back.
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16:04<engywuck>so you'd have, say, 3 primary partitions, including 2 Windows ones (boot and system disk), plus an extended one containing the rest
16:04<zimpee>also it is fre for home use
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16:05<engywuck>well, as always: do have a backup. playing with these types of changes are tricky
16:05<engywuck>even when using specialised programs
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16:06<kop>zimpee: Google says that partition magic erases all the data when converting back to a regular disk.
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16:08<engywuck>ah, so it dows the same as windows :D
16:08<engywuck>btw: do not use the integrated backup in windows.
16:08<engywuck>It can't restore to smaller hdds/partitions
16:09<zimpee>kop, i have to disagree with google, it did the trick
16:10<kop>zimpee: The <ldm> factoid indicates you _can_ put linux inside ldm volumes. I can't say whether that's a good idea.
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16:11<engywuck>well, you can also sew a button to your knee and hang a piano on that, as my mom used to say
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16:11<zimpee>thanks, kop, but google indicates that grub does not support that. Because of some reasons, i'd prefer Grub over Lilo
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16:13<kop>zimpee: so it worked?
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16:14<zimpee>still processing my dinner, meanwhile searching about this whole dynamic disk miserie in win7. There must be a way to disable using it
16:15<Uthark>Guys, any idea about how to install linux-headers in a Squeeze with backported 2.6.38 kernel?
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16:15<Black_Prince>Uthark, you can use kbuild from testing, but It's not recommended.
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16:16<Uthark>Unstable, perhaps?
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16:16<Black_Prince>Testing has 2.6.38 kernel
16:17<Black_Prince>You can install it on your own risk.
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16:17<engywuck>zimpee, I have 7 partitions on my primary hdd (dual-booting windows) and no dynamic disk.
16:17<Uthark>It's safe, it's a new box, there's no problem if it crashes
16:18<engywuck>but then again I boot win7 from a vhd file on one of these partitions... :D
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16:20<kop>zimpee: Let us know if it works so I can update the factoid.
16:21<zimpee>kop, will inform you about the success of the method
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16:25<engywuck>since "dpkg" here dowsn't know:
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16:26<engywuck>ony human knowing, if/when firefox/iceweasel 4 will come to debian (testing)
16:26<engywuck>goggle didn't give usefu informaton
16:27<engywuck>*useful*informatiob *google
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16:27<ferni>already running firefox 5
16:27<kop>engywuck: It's in experimental now. So that means it'll get to testing/backports sooner or later.
16:27<engywuck>experimental unfortunately too often means "later" :D
16:28<engywuck>dvs: the backport runs well for you?
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16:28<dvs>engywuck: yes
16:29<engywuck>ok, then I'll try
16:29<Black_Prince>Uthark, I managed to install linux 2.6.38 packages from testing. Still haven't broken anything. I'll see if I will when I reboot
16:29<dvs>Black_Prince: Why not use backports?
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16:29<Black_Prince>No kbuild in backports
16:30<zimpee2>well kop, in installer i cannot do anything with my unused free space, but read some details about it.
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16:32<kop>zimpee: You mean when you try to install in a dynamic disk?
16:32<Uthark>Ok, i've installed linux-headers-2.6.38-bpo.2-686 successfully after installing linux-kbuild-2.6.38 from wheezy
16:32<Uthark>No apt errors
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16:36<zimpee>no kop, my disk is basic now. containing all my old partitions and a new unused space (6 GB)
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16:37<Uthark>Black_Prince, i've rebooted and everything looks good, kernel-headers are valid and I've managed to compile NVIDIA's non-free display driver
16:37<jhutchins_lt>zimpee: Try to change the details.
16:37<kop>zimpee: The installer will let you partition the unpartitioned space. (And I think it'll shrink your existing partitions too if you ask it to.)
16:38<jhutchins_lt>zimpee: That partitioning tool is not the most intuitive interface. Obvious once you figure it out.
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16:38*jhutchins_lt wants an installer emulator so he can go to that spot in the installer and see what somebody is talking about.
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16:39<kop>zimpee: I agree. The installer's interface is not always obvious. You can always use whatever you like to partition/resize before starting the installer.
16:39<zimpee>thanks jhutchins, i'm using debian since 2000, did not that much installing since then. i am only a user, didn't figure it out yet.
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16:39<kop>jhutchins_lt: Good idea. File a bug report.
16:40<jhutchins_lt>Yeah, I've run the installer maybe four or five times since I started using it.
16:40<jhutchins_lt>That was etch.
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16:40<jhutchins_lt>kop: What on? Installer?
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16:40<kop>zimpee: Does your disk have 4k blocks perchance?
16:40<kop>jhutchins_lt: Sure.
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16:40<zimpee>kop: so i click on the free space to use, hit next, then new window contains: a one-piece list about seeing Cylinder/head data. I have 4k blocks
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16:41<kop>zimpee: It should do the right thing, but see the <4kb> factoid for fyi.
16:42<kop>jhutchins_lt: Surely the developers must have something they use to emulate installation?
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16:42<kop>zimpee: The installation manual should talk you through it.
16:42<kop>!tell zimpee about ig
16:42<jhutchins_lt>I rather doubt they do.
16:43<kop>jhutchins_lt: Real Men, eh?
16:44<jhutchins_lt>It's kinda like there's no way to parse the grub files and see the menu without booting.
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16:44<zimpee>no option to mount root fs whatever, kop, checking manual again. brb
16:44<jhutchins_lt>There haven't been many support-specific tools built in Linux.
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16:45<kop>zimpee: Be sure to look at the bottom of the screen for direction. You select the free space/partition of interest and then do things to it.
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16:54<ZykoticK9>I'm having a command line completion issue with mplayer and .webm files. Using "file foo.webm" returns only "data". In a directory with a foo.avi and bar.webm - mplayer will autocomplete foo but not bar. Any suggestions?
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16:58<Uthark>ZykoticK9, have you tried another video player that supports WebM?
16:58-!-devnet [~devnet@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:58<engywuck>also autocompletion is a shell-feature, isn't it?
16:59-!-MAXmark [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:59<daemonkeeper>Autocompletion is not related to the actual program getting a file name supplied as argument but from the shell
16:59<ZykoticK9>Uthark, oh mplayer works fine to play them, it's in the bash area that i'm having the problem.
16:59<ZykoticK9>daemonkeeper, that's what i thought!
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16:59<daemonkeeper>So if anything, you have to blame your shell, bash in most cases.
17:00<petemc>ZykoticK9: do you have /etc/bash_completion.d/mplayer ?
17:00<ZykoticK9>daemonkeeper, it's SO strange, if I have "mplayer foo.avi<TAB>" foo.avi will come again, even if there are other files in that directory
17:00<Knorrie>an actual program can provide bash completion rules in its package
17:01<daemonkeeper>Yes, but it is still a bash problem, not mplayer itself.
17:01<ZykoticK9>petemc, YES, thank you so much, there is a list of extensions in there!
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17:01<ZykoticK9>daemonkeeper, bash_completion.d explains the odd (specific) behaviour
17:02-!-jespada [] has quit [Quit: So long and thanks for all the fish]
17:02<daemonkeeper>ZykoticK9: File a wishlist bug to the bash-completion package to include webm
17:04<tharkun>Ok, gentlemen i think i found a bug on d-i but i do not know how to document it. For some reason the partitioning on hw raid with cciss is not performing as espected when using lvm since it utterly fails to ammend user mistakes.
17:05<tharkun>I know that i originally screwed up but the isue is a bit more complex than that. Anyone care to join to pinpoint the problem?
17:05<daemonkeeper>tharkun: You might get further indications in #debian-boot
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17:05<tharkun>daemonkeeper: on freenode or oftc?
17:05<tharkun>ok, thanks
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17:13<zimpee>re. kop, everything seems fine now, converted one of my partitions to logical, now i'm able to create new ones under windows, which are seen by debian installer. installing right now, will see if it screws with my current win7 installation
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17:19<kop>zimpee: You're better off creating the partitions under the OS you plan to use (linux), but it probably does not matter.
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17:20<zimpee>i know kop, but didn't find any options to do that. anyway, installing now, found my next problem (with no utp cables at home, having troubles netinsting it.)
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17:20<kop>jhutchins: It occurs to me a nice support tool would be able to ssh in to an install process and see the screen, without necessarly being able to change it.
17:21<kop>zimpee: You select the unpartitioned space with the up/down keys and then hit enter and go from there. I think that's what I recall.
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17:25<zimpee2>(found the utp:D)
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17:30<zimpee> hmm. grub detecting my win7 recovery partition. nice
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17:32<zimpee>kop, finished installing minimally, didn't mess up my win7 install. everything is fine now, the key was to set one of my partitions to logical, this way win didn't want to upgrade it to dynamical disk
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17:59<bighornram>I'm using sid currently updated. kernel-image 2.6.39-1 breaks hfsplus mounting. I can confirm that rolling back and booting on kernel-image-2.6.32-5 image hfsplus works.
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18:03<dpkg>sid is the <unstable> version of Debian. Sid is the destructive kid in Toy Story. It is NOT an acronym, but is sometimes backronymed Still In Development anyway. Do not use sid unless you have the skill to find your way out of the mess that broken packages may put you in; sid is not supported in #debian, but in #debian-next on Sid will never be released. See also <sid faq> <unstable>.
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18:29<dr_bob>hey. hope someone can shed some light on this. installing squeeze onto a USB stick, grub is failing to install - the installer tries to install grub to /dev/sda, but I can see the USB stick target is actually /dev/sdf. If I drop to a shell and manually do 'grub-install /dev/sdf' it says its installed ok, but I get no /boot/grub/menu.lst or grub.cfg and when trying to boot it just boots into grub, unable to find a root fs or kernel....
18:30<dr_bob>presumably because there's no config
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18:31<seatle_94>recover grub yed??
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18:33<dr_bob>seatle_94: how do I do that?
18:34<seatle_94>dr_bob debian lenny or debian squeeze?
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18:35<seatle_94>want to install grub to mbr?
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18:36<dr_bob>seatle_94: yes
18:36<dr_bob>the mbr of the usb stick
18:36<Class>hello guys is there any why that i can use rolling releases model with debian ?
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18:37<Class>i have heard that there is repository for rolling release for updating some software like firefox gnome x11 etc
18:38<dr_bob>seatle_94: never mind - i got it sorted by chrooting the install and running update-grub
18:38<Class>i have also heard about Debian CUT is this just a rumor ?
18:38<dr_bob>thnx anyway
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18:52<simonlnu>Class: WIR, if at all.
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18:53<Class>simonlnu, i did not get you
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18:54<dpkg>wir is probably When It's Ready. See also <rsn> and <siyh>.
18:54<musca>!debian cut
18:54<dpkg>CUT is "constantly usable testing", a proposal to make a rolling branch of Debian. See the proposal: and the discussion:
18:55<simonlnu>see, proposal. it's still a concept only.
18:55<ompaul>however please note that testing does and will undergo a code freeze as it gets ready for release which is kind of curious - things to worked out are things yet to be worked out
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18:58<Class>is there any repository for stable release of debian to update my software like rolling release works
18:59<Class>only for specific packages
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19:48<oddMod>Hello all. I was just curious if I wanted to get into modifying the user interface which WM gives me the most flexibility
19:49<lindi-_>oddMod: sounds quite abstract. do you want to customize it just for you or also send the changes to upstream?
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19:51<lindi-_>oddMod: also WM does not really let you customize things like fonts and scrollbars. If you use GTK you might want to read
19:51<lili>Is there any simliar network spy like iftop on debian
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19:57<daemonkeeper>What about ... iftop?
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19:57<oddMod>lindi-_: This was more of a thing for just me. My ultimate goal is to no longer have a task bar on certain applications.
19:57<lili>daemonkeeper thank you i can use iftop actually...
19:58<oddMod>err top bar*
19:58<lindi-_>oddMod: you mean title?
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19:58<oddMod>lindi-_: Yes title bar is what i meant.
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20:00<lili>my network is very bad,it can run apt-get update accidently with interrupt,alwalys failed when run apt-get install
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20:01<lili>i use pppoe
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20:03<grrrrrr>que vuelva fcr!
20:04<lili>when i run sudo pppoeconf,it says the Access concentrator of your provider did not respond..anyway i can use irssi to talk to you..
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20:15<grummund>Is it possible to do a disk image from a running debian system?
20:16<grummund>that is bit-copy the MBR, partition table, and all partitions, to a 2nd HDD of the same size?
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20:17<grummund>the 2st HDD in fact being dual boot between Debian and another os
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20:25<daemonkeeper>grummund: Only if you are using LVM
20:25<grummund>hmm that's a shame
20:26<grummund>it was going to form my backup strategy
20:26<daemonkeeper>As said, install into a LVM and you can do that
20:27<grummund>so would LVM be happy if the 2nd HDD is then taken away for physical archive?
20:28<daemonkeeper>Whatever you want. I meant to install your system into a LVM volume. This allows you to make atomic snapshots of your running disk you can safely copy to your backup disk.
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20:28<grummund>ok i understand
20:29<grummund>backup strategy needs to cater for dual-boot OS
20:30*grummund was thinking along the lines of dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/hdb ...
20:30<daemonkeeper>You can do that, unless you rely on the result ;)
20:30<grummund>oh ;)
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20:31<daemonkeeper>You need an atomic snapshot for this kind of stuff. Obviously the resulting backup is undefined, if you copy block wise while the file system is changing.
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20:32<grummund>yeah, that's what i was thinking... although obviously the "other" dual-booted OS won't be changing at that point...
20:32<daemonkeeper>Well, if you want to backup only half of your system go on
20:32<grummund>and presumably the running system could be mounted RO?
20:33<daemonkeeper>Well, yes
20:33<daemonkeeper>But you probably really don't want that.
20:33<grummund>how come? :)
20:34*grummund knew there would be a flaw in this cunning plan
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20:36<daemonkeeper>Well, maybe you can imagine most running processes on your system won't happily await until you remount rw but continue to write changes to your disk. And even if they wouldn't, they aren't told by your plans so they might hold volatile data in memory you're going to lose.
20:37<grummund>hmm, not even single user mode
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20:52<socrates>hola necesito ayuda
20:53<socrates>tengo debian 6.0 con kde y esta lentisima
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22:42<ballison-home>if i need disk space, is it safe to manually rm files in /var/cache/apt/archives ?
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22:43<teage>where would python documentation html be after i have downloaded from package manager?
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22:45<chealer>teage: which package is it in?
22:45<chealer>ballison-home: do you know about apt-get autoclean?
22:46<teage>What do you mean by wich package? IDK, its python 2.6 html document
22:47<teage>and I got it from the package manager
22:48<ballison-home>chealer: yes - but which is better? autoclean or clean?
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22:49<chealer>ballison-home: did you read the manual page? none is better, it depends on what you want to do
22:49<ballison-home>chealer: yes i read it and yes I already knew about it. thanks
22:49<teage>chealer, well it still should be in usr share applications, right. I will check anyway.
22:49<teage>no no
22:50<teage>i mean var coach apt
22:50<chealer>teage: how did you get it? what was the name of the package you installed?
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22:51<chealer>ballison-home: if you don't want to use clean, it's safe to remove manually, yes
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22:53<teage>chealer, I dont remember, I was downloading so many things. I just know I saw the package and it said python documentation html.
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22:54<chealer>teage: well if you can find it, you can check its contents. filter installed packages with "python" in their name"
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22:55<teage>chealer, good idea
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23:35<wujie>i come from china,hello
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---Logclosed Fri May 27 00:00:12 2011