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#debian IRC Logs for 2011-05-27

---Logopened Fri May 27 00:00:12 2011
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00:12<amitz>statistically speaaking, is ext4 damage more lethal than ext3, due to power loss?
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00:13<ssb>from my own experience, yes
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00:14<apa>buenas noches
00:14<ssb>but I cannot subtract the 'new and buggy code' effect from this statistics, as last damage happened quite a while
00:14<apa>de casualidad
00:14<apa>alguien conose bien
00:14<apa>como instalar amanda en debian
00:14<apa>con windows
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00:20<amitz>ssb: noted.
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00:20<ssb>amitz, though to be honest, all my few cases of [an extensive] damage happened with -o data=writeback. Since then I switched to -o data=ordered and -o data=journal and had no more statistics
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00:34<amitz>ssb, hmm, customized fstab then...
00:35<ssb>I remember -o data=ordered being deault on and off and then again on. Don't know the status quo
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00:38-!-sney is now known as crickets
00:41<crickets>chirp chirp
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00:42<mix22891>hello world!
00:42-!-Levenson3 [~alex@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:42<mix22891>good morning
00:42<mix22891>linux is wonderful
00:42<sney>depending on /etc/timezone
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00:52<amitz>ssb: yeah, relying on distro setting is scary for me.
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00:54<Cute>are you all aware that theres a huge exploit in all firmares 10.0+?
00:54-!-X-LP [~X-LP@] has joined #debian
00:54<Cute>And that every machine on this IRC is being accessed?
00:54<Cute>Nah JK <3 GOTCHA.
00:56<nevyn>we use 11 MEGA DOODLIES here...
00:56<sney>we used to but it was causing problems with the animatter reactors
00:56<sney>!ops Cute adorable
00:56<dpkg>Hydroxide, bob2, caphuso, dondelelcaro, doogie, eeyore-, ElectricElf, ):, helix, ljlane, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, Netsnipe, TML, walters, xk, abrotman, gravity, azeem, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Alife, Myon, Ganneff, Maulkin, weasel, zobel, themill: sney complains about: Cute adorable
00:57<sney>Cute: are you Syrian?
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00:57<Cute>Wrong IRC ;w;
00:57<Cute>Damn BlackBuntu
00:57*nevyn wonders how people get ops on #debian.
00:58<nevyn>or if it's a secret society and very undebianlike.
00:58<sney>nevyn: a long period of irc helper purgatory would be my guess
00:58<sney>and a bunch of them are developers
00:58<nevyn>sure I figgured being a dd helped.
00:59<sney>a few, like abrotman, aren't
01:00<Cute>I'm Americab
01:00<sney>so I think once you've been here for a while and you're not immature/annoying they eventually just promote you
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01:00*nevyn must be too annoying ;)
01:00<sney>Cute: amazing what the american educational system is turning out these days. all of 14 years old and you're already confused by irc while simultaneously pretending to be a hacker on the internet
01:00<sney>they grow up so fast *snif*
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01:02<Cute>Sney <33 You see I'm really actually 6 ;D
01:02<sney>u mad
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01:03<taglass>mmmm jelly.
01:03<sney>you must be so disappointed that you couldn't come to some random irc channel and make everyone think they had been hacked
01:04<sney>next time try synirc, it's full of somethingawful goons who are not good with computer
01:04<sney>in the meantime, go do your homework
01:04<Cute>Lol actually I just opened xChat and this was already up :3
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01:05<Cute>So Nice try there, :D And secondly, I'm supposed to be in hidden wiki chat.
01:05<sney>you just opened xchat and pushed connect without looking at anything. amazing
01:05-!-jm_ [] has joined #debian
01:05<sney>incredible that you would wind up connected to the irc channel set up to support users of the OS yours is derived from!
01:06<Cute>Oh ok well while I'm on support
01:06<sney>anyway, you can hit ctrl+s to get your network list again. so go find your little h4x0r channel and go away
01:06<Cute>My H's show up as squiggly lines.
01:06<AlexMax>Cute: gentoo is thataway ->
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01:06<sney>AlexMax: nice try but it's an ubuntoid of some sort
01:06<sney>Cute: we don't support anything that's based on debian so you'll need to ask in #ubuntu or #backtrack-linux or whatever you're using
01:06<Cute>I'm running BlackBuntu
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01:07<AlexMax>sney: why the snarky jab at ubuntu
01:07<nevyn>oh wow. the things that are wrong with that...
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01:08<pastelpixeldrops>Hello there
01:08-!-dabir [] has joined #debian
01:08<pastelpixeldrops>Hi dabir
01:08<sney>pastelpixeldrops: hi
01:09<pastelpixeldrops>Whats going on?
01:09<sney>AlexMax: snarky jab?
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01:09<Cute>TBH I'm just waiting to get banned.
01:09<sney>we've got all kinds of nonsense in the support channel! it's too bad the ops are all sleeping.
01:09<dabir>fresh new computer, fresh new start with Debian.
01:09<dabir>and linux alltogether
01:10<dabir>dunno where to start, but at least i could figure out how to get to this irc :)
01:10<Cute>WINDOWS FTW
01:10<AlexMax>Cute: you're not the first or funniest troll
01:10<AlexMax>in fact you're really boring
01:10<dabir>wha bout virtualbox
01:10<sney>dabir: well, you're in the right place for support, so if you have any questions go ahead :)
01:10<sney>and ignore the troll
01:10<AlexMax>/ignore Cute
01:11<pastelpixeldrops>What happened to #dextromethorphan
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01:11<dabir>what can i read that will tell me all i need to know about linux?
01:11<AlexMax>have you never used linux before?
01:11<dpkg>Before asking in here or on the <debian-user> mailing list, you should read the Installation Guide, or if you already have Debian installed, the Debian Reference. Ask me about <ig>, <overview>, <reference>, <refcard>, <docs>, <manuals>, <fundamentals>, <newbiedoc>, <faq>, <unix lessons>, <general cli tutorial> (e.g. in your IRC client, type /msg dpkg reference).
01:11<jm_>dabir: ^^^^^
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01:12<sney> has a lot of useful stuff as well (though some of it is outdated)
01:12<taglass>dabir: is a good start
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01:12<AlexMax>to be frank, i'm not sure debian is the best for a true linux newbie
01:13<sney>as long as the newbie can read, what's the harm
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01:13<AlexMax>well...depends on their goals, if they can read like you say they'll be fine
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01:13<sney>everything is documented and the support network is gigantic
01:13<nevyn>you need to re-install your system 4 times to understand why debian
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01:14<nevyn>you need to run something like gentoo or rhel into a gooey pile of self compiled unmaintable junk before you get why working within packaging systems is worth it.
01:14<nadir>dabir: i often look at the german Ubuntu-wiki, which is very good. Try the English one:
01:14<AlexMax>nevyn: buh...buh but but I want the _latest and greatest_ a blo blo....
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01:14<nadir>for starters its not bad as a guide.
01:14<gnugr>!msg dpkg why debian
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01:15<AlexMax>you aren't kidding though, debian's package management is peerless, especially if you're stuck with a command line
01:15<dabir>nadir: dead link
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01:15<AlexMax>been a debian/ubuntu convert since sarge was in testing
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01:15<taglass>I'll probably be burned at the stake, but zypper isn't bad either.
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01:16<dabir>i guess i got alotta reading to do -_-
01:16<nadir>strange. google for "ubuntu desktop guide" or "ubuntu wiki".
01:16<dabir>i'm on debian
01:16<dabir>debian gnome
01:16<sney>yeah, don't google for ubuntu anything
01:16<sney>just read the manuals linked above and ask any questions here
01:17<gnugr>AlexMax: read this :
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01:19<dabir>how do i get youtube videos to work in iceweasel?
01:19<AlexMax>you need flashplayer-nonfree
01:19<jm_>they work when you have flash crap installed
01:20<dabir>can i get that from System>administration>software center
01:20-!-devil [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
01:20<jm_>wiki page tells you how to install it
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01:22<sney>dabir: you can also go to
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01:22<dabir>okay, now do i have 'squeeze' or 'lenny' and what does that mean? i thought i have gnome
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01:23<sney>dabir: it's the release codename
01:23<jm_>try to read some more on before asking here
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01:23<sney>Squeeze is the same thing as Debian 6
01:23<AlexMax>there's this
01:23<AlexMax>i literally heard of it two seconds ago
01:23<dabir>how do i check if i have debian 6? last question, then i'll read some
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01:24<jm_>!tell dabir -about debian version
01:25<sney>dabir: our info bot, dpkg, has sent you a message! its name shows up on the left in xchat
01:26<sney>if you just installed debian from an image that you just downloaded from, chances are good that you have squeeze
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01:27<limpocoa>cat /etc/debian_version
01:27<dabir>yep 6.01
01:28<dabir>thanks everyone . will read some of those links above ;p
01:28<taglass>Good luck
01:28<AlexMax>i like how cute just left on his own
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01:29<AlexMax>the hell
01:30<AlexMax>i'm running ubuntu on this box, what is this debian_version tomfoolery
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01:30<AlexMax>i guess they update it based on what version they base the current release on?
01:31<sney>ubuntu doesn't change anything they don't have to
01:31<sney>same reason the default xchat.conf comes here if you push connect without looking at it
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01:33<bones_was_here>sney: one of the reasons i dont use ubuntu is how much they change (for the worse) that they really didn't need to touch :)
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01:34<bones_was_here>they really should change the xchat defaults...
01:34<bones_was_here>(and probably other clients too)
01:34<bones_was_here>(if they package them)
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01:51*EmleyMoor keeps getting Bluetooth problems
01:52<EmleyMoor>Devices not talking and being hard to pair being the main ones...
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02:13<cfrabel>#j angstrom
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02:23<spiderman>im having a hard time setting up dual monitors using two nvidia cards, can someone help me out?
02:24<jm_>which driver are you using?
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02:25<spiderman>nvidia i think
02:26<jm_>did you read about twinview in their readme?
02:26<spiderman>ya but i can't get it to work and im not sure why
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02:28<retrospectacus>spiderman: can you run nvidia-settings in your terminal as your normal user?
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02:30<dpkg>Your box does not come with every app, tool and utility known to debiankind installed already. If you find that the program you've been told to use isn't there, install it. Also ask me about <search>. If someone suggests an application to you, it's highly likely that it's available via apt-get or aptitude.
02:30<jm_>try asking in #nvidia on freenode, I only used it to display stuff on LCD and TV at the same time, so single card
02:30<spiderman>ya i can get it working with a single card
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02:32<gnugr>!tell spiderman -about nvidia dkms-96xx
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02:33<spiderman>thank you
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02:55<shadenzo>is it possible to get mouse working in the text console ? (not the virtual within gnome the real RAW one )
02:56<@Ganneff>install gpm
02:56<@Ganneff>and use gpm enabled apps
02:56<jm_>so the answer would be yes
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02:57<shadenzo>ok thus only works with emacs for example , but not with bash ? right ?
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02:58<jm_>you can still copy and paste with bash
02:59<shadenzo>well that what i meant great i'll try tahks
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03:01<pretendo>anyone know how to get backround.xml file to work with the Change Desktop Background?
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03:33<jrabbit>[36128492.730758] kernel BUG at /tmp/buildd/linux-2.6-2.6.32/debian/build/source_i386_none/fs/hfsplus/bnode.c:623!
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03:34<ReiKo>Necesito Ayuda en español por favor
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03:34<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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03:36<dpkg>Sorry reiko, you're not online.
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03:58<classical>hello guys i need some help my dns server is refusing to resolve authoritative domains here is my config
03:59<classical>i have auth-nxdomain yes in my configuration the ip range which i have setup to allow recursion can resolve non authoritative and authoritative domains as well
04:00<classical>ups i fix it
04:00<jww>hehe, what was wrong ? :)
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04:08<classical>jww, i had this allow-query { xx.xx.xx.0/20;;} ; in my configuration i did not realize that allow-query option will block authoritative dns queryes too lol :-D
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04:08<classical>shame on me
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04:17<davromaniak>I would like to know if there's any IRC channel for talking about backports
04:17<davromaniak>I do create backports on my own (for me), and I'm to publish them on my repository, and I would like to contribute to the officials debian backport with these packahes
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04:26<jm_>davromaniak: from the page
04:26<davromaniak>ok, so all the work is done using a mailing list
04:26<davromaniak>I'm subscribing, and preparing a mail
04:27<davromaniak>thanks jm_
04:27<jm_>davromaniak: no worries
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04:46<ayaka>Can I turn debian to sleep in disk by CLI ?
04:46<thewanderer1>`man s2disk`
04:47<jww>you need need to install uswsusp.
04:47<jww>oh thewanderer1 was quicker :)
04:48<thewanderer1>btw. uswsusp doesn't seem to be in stable, just in sid, which makes one wonder :P
04:49<thewanderer1>try "hibernate" package instead
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04:50<ayaka>thewanderer1, hibernate installed before but I can't find the man page of s2disk
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04:51<thewanderer1>yeah, the commands in hibernate are different than uswsusp - `dpkg -L hibernate` will show you what files the package includes, pick one that sounds like a binary :P
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04:52<jm_>ayaka: you'll need to backport it yourself
04:52<thewanderer1>maybe not if hibernate works properly
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04:53<ayaka>jm_, do you said backport versiom ?
04:53<Zaba>there's also pm-utils
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04:54<thewanderer1>yeah, that too... what an abundance of options :P
04:54<jm_>ayaka: it's not on backports
04:54<Zaba>I'm puzzled as to what one is actually supposed to use; however, most (if not all) of them are frontends to echo $state > /sys/power/state anyway.
04:54<jm_>the difference is that s2disk can also compress the image which other methods don't
04:54<thewanderer1>but they also do stuff like module loading/unloading and other hacks
04:54<Zaba>I mean, you can hibernate by just echo disk > /sys/power/state provided you boot with the right resume= parameter and have a large enough swap partition
04:54<ayaka>jm_, well, what do you want to say ? I can't know
04:54<thewanderer1>/usr/sbin/pm-hibernate -- this one should work
04:54<Zaba>but if you want anything more fancy, you can use wrappers and what not
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04:55<jm_>ayaka: you will need to backport the uswsusp package yourself from sid if you want to use it (/msg dpkg ssb)
04:55<ayaka>jm_, I see, I don't want to
04:55<Zaba>likewise for suspend to ram, except you don't even need swap or special kernel paremters, just echo mem > /sys/power/state. Likewise for fancy stuff and wrappers.
04:56<thewanderer1>ayaka: ok, see the manual page for pm-hibernate
04:56<thewanderer1>it seems to be the standard tool in Squeeze
04:56<jm_>ayaka: on squeeze one can install it from sid I guess, or simply use other methods if you don't care about what extra s2disk does
04:56<ayaka>thewanderer1, yes , I see man 8 hibernate-disk
04:56<thewanderer1>that too... should do the same thing
04:57<ayaka>jm_, well I think it will upgrade other packages to unstable
04:58<jm_>ayaka: most of that are probably the same version in testing and in sid
04:58<jm_>(its dependencies I mean)
04:59<ayaka>jm_, but if hibernate can work , I don't need it
04:59<jm_>ayaka: sure, up to you
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04:59<ayaka>Zaba, I have tried it before, nouse
04:59<Zaba>ayaka, what is?
05:00<ayaka>Zaba, echo disk > /sys/power/state
05:00<Zaba>that's because you need special setup (like a proper resume= kernel command-line parameter) for it to work
05:00<Zaba>the wrappers might do that setup for you, or even (in case of some kernel patches) provide more options than suspending to a swap partition
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05:01<Zaba>but ultimately it all boils down to that
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05:02<ayaka>but can I do this through ssh ?
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05:02<Zaba>why not
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05:03<ayaka>Zaba, jm_ thewanderer1 thank all of you
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05:04<danlii>My Iceweasel has suddenly begun to refuse to open links I click in other programs; Instead I get a new Iceweasel window with my start page. The configuration looks OK in Preferred Applications, and I haven't changed anything. What could have happened?
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05:06<ayaka>I try to login a server by, but it always me password don't use key
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05:07<Zaba>ayaka, you need .ssh/id_rsa and .ssh/ locally and the contents of .ssh/ in .ssh/authorized_keys at the remote end. Is that what you have?
05:08<ayaka>Zaba, yes
05:08<ayaka>Zaba, but you said local is the server ?
05:09<Zaba>local is where you're connecting from
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05:09<ayaka>Zaba, oh, I see, I do wrong
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05:10<aminiesta>what is debian
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05:12<dpkg>debian is probably See
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05:14<jm_>danlii: tried to open it from CLI?
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05:16<danlii>jm_: I have now. That works.
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05:17<jm_>danlii: maybe your apps do it incorrectly then
05:18<danlii>jm_: The apps are gnome-terminal and emesene, and it just suddenly stopped working yesterday, for both. I can't see how both those apps would start doing wrong at the same time.
05:18<jm_>danlii: never used either, so no idea, but it seems the problem is not in iceweasel, try to strace one
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05:24<ayaka>Zaba, thank you
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05:25<Zaba>no problem
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05:28<lindi-_>jm_: if he comes back, tell him to create a new account and see if the problem occurs there. this is an easy way to see if something changed in his $HOME or not
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05:31<ayaka>there is a problem , I can't rm the file name -rf, there is how I create it
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05:32<jm_>ayaka: man page for rm explains how to fix this: rm -- -foo
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05:33<ayaka>jm_, but it will cause a big problem in my way ,all the file will be rm, it is not a bug, is it ?
05:33<jm_>ayaka: yes, you can use rm -i
05:33<mix22891>i'm trying to install flashPlayer and i get this error: E: Unable to locate package
05:33<mix22891>E: Couldn't find any package by regex ''
05:33<jm_>but no, it's not a bug
05:34<jm_>I'll be away for a while now
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05:35<ayaka>jm_, I know this , but ,a famous chinese said there is a short of Unix_philosophy
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05:37<shadenzo>gpm run just fine
05:37<ayaka>jm_, but you can ignore it, don't care for it
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05:52<mercutio22>I need to pick a port for my torrent client. I read that my ISP blocks almost everything > 1024 unless its a known "behaved" service, meaning not p2p
05:53<koollman>change isp ?
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05:53<mercutio22>koollman: I suspect most ISPs here will do some sort of throttling. Maybe I will have to try and disguise transmission as some "ok" service
05:54<ferni>8080 ?
05:54<ml|>comcast does not at least for now ;)
05:54<mercutio22>ferni: if I choose that wouldn't that be a problem for apps that use 8080?
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05:55<mercutio22>ml|: I am afraid comcast is not present where I am
05:55<koollman>mercutio22: just pick one below 1024 then.
05:55<ferni>anyway, you should enable encryption from torrent client. I had a isp that tried to limit torrent traffic, but with encryption their limits didn't work :)
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05:56<mercutio22>koollman: any specific suggestions? What happens if a peer uses my chosen port for some other service?
05:57<koollman>mercutio22: nothing
05:57<mercutio22>koollman: I was afraid he would be unable to connect
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05:58<koollman>just pick a port you don't use, below 1024, and use that for your torrent client
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05:59<Luffy1980>In my laptop I can't see the character 'µ' in any terminal app. Instead of it, there's something like '??'. I have locales installed. Does anybody know how to solve this?
05:59<mjt>non-privileged user can't use ports <1024 by default
05:59<mjt>and you really don't want to run your torrent client as root :)
05:59<mercutio22>koollman: yea, wilco.
05:59<ml|>dumb isp, like bittorrent is bad
05:59<mercutio22>mjt can't?
05:59<koollman>mjt: there's that wonderful technology called 'port forwarding' :)
05:59<mercutio22>well I guess I will try 8080 then
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06:03-!-zloy is now known as backdoor
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06:05<mix22891>bash: update-flashplugin-nonfree: command not found
06:05<mix22891>i don't understand this wiki
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06:07<mix22891>any buddy?
06:09<mix22891>i'm using IceWeasel
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06:10<kusanagi>mix22891, just apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree
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06:11<kusanagi>mix22891, in that wiki tells you to run the command as root
06:11<kusanagi>are you running it as root?
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06:12<kusanagi>I am trying to use fstab to mount a encfs directory like this -> /home/serverbackup/backup/ /home/afuentes/Dropbox/backup/ fuse uid=1001,gid=1001,allow_other 0 0 but I get "Permission denied". Can somebody help me figuring out whats wrong?
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06:13<zhangyongshun>x86_64 version flashplugin for linux with firefox 3.5.3,if it work well now?
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06:16<jm_>zhangyongshun: for some values of well
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06:29<mix22891>kusanagi: thank you
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06:32<zimpee>Hi all. Can't get google talk plugin working under squeeze. Using firefox 4.0.1 (downloaded separately), xfce4, tried to install latest google-talkplugin_current_amd64.deb. firefox doesn't recognize it as plugin, didn't find anything helpful online. Kernel version is 2.6.32-5-amd64. Can anyone help me pls?
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06:33<jm_>zimpee: where did you find google-talkplugin_current_amd64.deb.?
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06:35<zimpee>jm_, used
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06:35<jm_>zimpee: in that case you need to ask them for help, it's not a debian provided package
06:36<petemc>i would hazard a guess it doesnt work on 64bit
06:36<zimpee>thanks, jm_, just wondered if anyone tried to make it work.
06:36<jm_>zimpee: also, is your firefox actually iceweasel or not?
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06:37<zimpee>jm_, it is firefox. downloaded from AFAIK iceweasel is currently 3.5.16 only
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06:38<jm_>zimpee: and is it 64bit or 32bit app? there's 4.0.1 as deb
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06:40<Good-maN>zimppe: i just installed it yesterday but directly from google: not with the package manager.
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06:41<zimpee>jm_, didn't find anything on supporting 64 bit yet. will try
06:41<Good-maN>zimpee: google provide 64bit
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06:42<jm_>zimpee: so what petemc said is probably true, but in reverse - plugin is 64bit, firefox 32bit
06:43<jm_>try to run it in a terminal and see if it spits any crap
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06:44<zimpee>jm, i started the plugin in terminal, didn't say a thing
06:44<zimpee>does iceweasel provide the firefox sync function?
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06:45<Good-maN>zimpee: yes it does
06:45<Black_Prince>When I install base system via netinst, and when tasksel starts, there are several options like base system, dns, web, ftp server, desktop etc ... Metapackage for desktop is eg gnome, kde, xfce4 etc. What name has metapackage for base system (if it exists).
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06:46<zimpee>thank, Good-maN, maybe i should try iceweasel.
06:46<Good-maN>zimpee: i dont think so firefox is the "same"
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06:47<Good-maN>zimpee: have you tried to use the google packages?
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06:47<jm_>he is using google packages
06:49<zimpee>Good-maN, i downloaded the 64 bit .deb from this page you mentioned, installed it using dpkg. My firefox is placed under usr/bin/firefox/. No success.
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06:49<Good-maN>ok, they worked fine for me but i have a 32bit system installed.
06:49<zimpee>i wonder if i have to do any additional steps to make it work with my custom ff install. copy a .so to plugins folder etc...
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06:50<Good-maN>zimpee: okay that meens its not right installed and you cant see them under the plugins in FF?
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06:51<babilen>zimpee: Please use the iceweasel packages
06:51<zimpee>synaptic didn't say there were problems with .deb install. can't see the plugin
06:52<Good-maN>zimpee: give me a sec, and see if google talk plugin was installed here /usr/lib/iceweasel/plugins
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06:54<lindi-_>zimpee: doesn't google talk also work with the empathy package?
06:54<Good-maN>lindi-_: it works but without Video, what i know.
06:54<lindi-_>Good-maN: interesting. In pidgin I see video
06:55<Good-maN>lindi-_: really? i dint got it with pidgin.
06:56<lindi-_>when did you try?
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06:56<Good-maN>my pidgin crashed :/
06:56<Good-maN>maybe two days ago
06:56<Good-maN>or three something like this.
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06:56<lindi-_>Good-maN: right
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06:58<Good-maN>zimpee: go to your custom FF install and try to make under plugins a soft link to /opt/google/talkplugin/, this should fix it.
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06:59<Good-maN>lindi-_: hmm so you got it working? Or need i simply an update?
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07:00<babilen>zimpee: No, please use the Debian packages or *at least* don't install firefox to /usr/bin but to /usr/local/bin
07:00<lindi-_>Good-maN: I'll check
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07:00<Good-maN>lindi-_: oh thnx
07:02<zimpee>just a sec guys, got to work meanwhile... :D
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07:03<zimpee>babilen, why shouldn't i use /usr/bin?
07:04<jm_>because it clashes with debian packages
07:04<zimpee>got it
07:04<jm_>you can run mozilla's firefox from home dir if you really need it
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07:05<babilen>I still don't understand why you don't use the iceweasel packages
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07:05<jm_>he wasn't aware of it
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07:06<jm_>(for 4.0.1)
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07:08<babilen>jm_: I see :-)
07:11<lindi-_>Good-maN: yeah it was with pidgin that I got sound and video to work
07:11<lindi-_>Good-maN: but I still don't know how well it works if there are firewalls
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07:13<Good-maN>lindi-_: okay, my pidgin works fine only if i try video&voice call than it crashes, voice only works like a dream :)
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07:14<lindi-_>Good-maN: great, can you get a backtrace?
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07:15<Good-maN>lindi-_: need to reproduce it and my contacts are off...
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07:16<lindi-_>Good-maN: google talk could surely use a loopback service :)
07:16<Good-maN>lindi-_: oh :)
07:16<lindi-_>I could test later today
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07:19<Good-maN>lindi-_: oh cool, but how do i use a loopback service? or where can i find it?
07:19<lindi-_>Good-maN: that's the thing, it doesn't exist afaik
07:19<Good-maN>lindi-_: okay so i am not blind & stupid, thnx :)
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07:28<zimpee>man, i gave up, time to install iceweasel 4.0
07:28<Good-maN>zimpee: this should work like a dream :)
07:29<zimpee>Good-maN, as it turned out in the morning, i slept together with a spider... I'd hate to dream about that :D
07:31<zimpee>hmm, is that also an english term for "sharing a bed" for sleeping, or everybody laughs now because of the silly guy on irc had sex with a spider?
07:31-!-mode/#debian [+l 497] by debhelper
07:31<Good-maN>zimpee: ouuu, okay thats nasty, i hope not again a night like that. me not my english sucks ^^
07:32<gnugr>zimpee, GoodmaN, please join #debian-offtopic to talk about sex with spiders
07:33<zimpee>roger :D
07:33<ferni>zimpee: you did download also the 64-bit version of ff from mozilla? its same filename as 32-bit version and only found from ftp server
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07:34<ferni>zimpee: if your plugin was amd64 package, then ff needs to bee 64bit version also, otherwise it does not see the plugin
07:35<zimpee>ferni, only searched http. just got iceweasel to work as a dream with google talk plugin. will check ftp later, thanks
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07:37<ferni>i run ff5 beta 64bit (great that they provide 64bit builds finally) have it installed ~/.local/share , extra plugins can go to ~/.mozilla/plugins and then added it to alternatives so x-www-browser starts it
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07:39<jm_>there are 5.x beta debs too
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07:41<ferni>jeah, from iceweasel.. I think whole iceweasel thing is a big joke, isnt the namething resolved already. well just my opinion and I'm happy that mozilla provides the 64bit builds and dont need to depend on iceweasel debs
07:42<jm_>obviously another person who has no idea why debian had to do this
07:43<zimpee>jm_, why? (:))
07:43<ferni>I've read all about it and I think it's just stupid. No need to start all over again about it. I also think dfsg is a virus
07:43<ferni>like freeradius not linked to openssl
07:44<jm_>ahh best to ignore them
07:44<jm_>zimpee: ask dpkg -- /msg dpkg why iceweasel
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07:44<themill>ferni: #debian-offtopic -- #debian is a user support channel
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07:46<ferni>themill: well, I was giving support to running FF, jm_ just started offering some iceweasel debs and I gave a reason why not
07:47<ferni>has all support be related to installing the software from original repositories?
07:47<themill>ferni: and then you displayed your lack of knowledge about copyright law and started ranting about the dfsg.
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07:58<ferni>ok I'll stop. anyway, allways had hard time explaining my opinions to religious people :)
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08:00<ksaddique>any body help me ????
08:00<klando>Hello, I am installing debian squeeze with software (md) RAID1 on '/', idea is to be able to be able to boot on any of the 2 disk of this RAID1. Where do I have to install grub ? (mean drive boot sector, or partition ?)
08:00<zimpee>ferni, just downloaded ff 64 bit version, symlinked the google talk plugin, works fine, thanks for your help. Next move is to figure out how my microphone works. Thanks for your help, ferni, jm_, babilen
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08:00<Good-maN>ksaddique: try it, mostly some one can help :)
08:01<ksaddique>Good-maN: U r not in Some One ;)
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08:02<ferni>klando: well mbr, if the drives are sda and sdb, then grub-install /dev/sda and grub-install /dev/sdb
08:03<klando>ferni, ok, so from d-i, I do that by openning a console ? (the graphic installer will take care of that for me ?)
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08:03<ferni>klando: you can just install it, and to be sure issue those commands later
08:03<klando>ok, thank you ferni
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08:05<ferni>klando: if you need more partitions than one, i would suggest to create 2 raid1 devices, one for /boot and one to be lvm that contains the needed partitions
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08:07<ksaddique>Any Body Help me that how i can reslove any bug in debian please guide me
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08:09<Good-maN>ksaddique: tel about the bug then normaly some one can help.
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08:12<ksaddique>Good-maN: i am new on Debian OS; and guid me what i can do for solve any one bug in debian may i need enrolment on debian network ?
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08:14<babilen>ksaddique: What problem do you encounter?
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08:16<ksaddique>Babilen: i am Developer but in my MS project i need to aware with debian and try to resolve any one enrolled bug on debian, kindly guide me how i can solve that starting problems
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08:18<babilen>ksaddique: Hmm, I don't quite understand what your problem is. If there were a way to solve *any* bug in Debian we would have solved all of them a long time ago. I doubt that this is your problem though. Could you try to be more specific?
08:20<jm_>i think he wants to solve one bug by himself, but needs help :)
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08:21<babilen>jm_: I think so too, but I am unsure which bug ksaddique is referring to :)
08:22<babilen>ksaddique: Can you tell us what the bug is? Do you have the bug number or a link if it has already been reported to Debian's bug tracker?
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08:22<Good-maN>ksaddique: when i got you right, your devloping a ms project and this is related to debian, how? and where is now the problem/bug?
08:24<ksaddique>I am new on Debian i cont understand how i can solve from enroll bug or may i need any enrollment on debian network for resolving that bug. for exampl #337144 is simple bug and i cont understand i can resolve that bug
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08:25<babilen>!dbugs #337144
08:25<dpkg>#337144:M[libasound2-doc] example hyperlinks are broken (help confirmed); Wed, 02 Nov 2005 21:03:45 UTC []
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08:28<babilen>ksaddique: Bugs are typically resolved by creating a patch against the Debian package. That patch should solve the bug and the package maintainer can use this patch to fix the official package. I had a short look at #337144 and it looks as if it is unclear how to fix this bug. If you know how, you can send an email to in which you explain your solution.
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08:29<ksaddique>Thanks Babilen but tell me one thing how i can registred on debian side for debian maintainer
08:30-!-crib [] has joined #debian
08:30<babilen>ksaddique: Basically: You maintain one or more packages in Debian and apply to become a maintainer.
08:31<ksaddique>may i need OpenPGP key
08:31<ksaddique>from already enrolled debian maintainer
08:31-!-TheViper [] has joined #debian
08:32<babilen>yes, your key needs to be signed by a DD, see for people who offer keysigning
08:32<ksaddique>then any body offering keysigning?
08:33<shadenzo>i need to print graphical character in bash . how can i do it ?
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08:34<jm_>shadenzo: which graphical characters?
08:34<babilen>shadenzo: What do you mean? Print to a printer? Print to the shell? Which character?
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08:36<shadenzo>no print to screen
08:36<shadenzo>let me search the chars .......
08:36<babilen>Yes, please do that :)
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08:40<shadenzo>⎣⎤╒╔╖╩╣║ this caracters used to print basic "forms"
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08:40<jm_>line drawing - use a font that can show them
08:41<jm_>for VGA on linux console ESC(U code did the trick in old days
08:42<shadenzo>yes but now octal escapes squences don't seeem to work
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08:45<shadenzo>jm_ would u place an exaple that i can try ?
08:45<jm_>shadenzo: echo -e '\e(U'
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08:46<jm_>shadenzo: but if you want this in X it's a different problem
08:47<jm_>wait, those seem to be UTF-8 line drawing characters, I don't know how well console can do utf-8
08:47<shadenzo>no in the text shell
08:47<shadenzo>they are utf
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08:48<jm_>yes in that case forget about that echo -e thing
08:48<shadenzo>oh it was too beautiful
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08:51<jm_>did you try to configure console-tools?
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08:52<jm_>or console-setup, whichever you use
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08:52<shadenzo>no ... better for me to read more on the net . if i don't find , i'll ask again tahnks jm_
08:54<jm_>shadenzo: dpkg-reconfigure console-setup
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08:55<jm_>maybe it's only a matter of finding the right font - i haven't really bothered with utf-8 on console
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09:09<caletron>is there a way to programmatically get the codename of the current stable release?
09:10<caletron>so, today I could get a script to spit out "squeeze" but a year ago it would have said "lenny"?
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09:11<babilen>caletron: "lsb_release -c" for example
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09:11<caletron>but, that's the codename of the running system which is not necessarily current
09:11<babilen>caletron: Make that "lsb_release -cs" (which is rather what you want)
09:11<koollman>caletron: what are you trying to do ?
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09:14<caletron>I'm trying to figure out a script that bases its action on if it's on an uptodate system or not. (we have many that aren't)
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09:16<koollman>you could make a script that connects to a debian mirror and look for the 'stable' symlink
09:16<babilen>caletron: lsb_release basically looks at /etc/debian_version and translates that into code names. What qualifies a non-up-to-date system? Would a completely upgraded lenny system be considered outdated? A squeeze system that has upgradable packages? (aptitude update ; aptitude search '~U') ...
09:16<koollman>but considering the release rate of debian, I would just hardcode them :)
09:17<mandla>joar, Hello, have you ever installed Bria on an iPhone?
09:17<babilen>mandla: What is Bria and what is an iPhone and what does all that has to do with Debian?
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09:18<mandla>babilen, Im working on an Asterisk Server which is resting on a Debian server,
09:18<caletron>koollman: that may be a workable idea. babilen: an upgraded lenny system should, for my purpose, consider itself out of date.
09:19<mandla>babilen, anyway, i wont understand
09:19<babilen>mandla: Sorry, I have no experience with asterisk administration. #asterisk on freenode might be helpful
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09:24<alex__>люди добрые, помогите со звуком разобраться в дебиан!!!
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09:26<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian or use English here.
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09:51<fx>please, can anyone look at this strange(?) sudo+pam+limits behavior ->
09:51<fx>is this expected?
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09:52<fx>it broke somewhere between libpam-modules 1.0.1-5+lenny1 and 1.1.1-6.1
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09:54<Myon>is in su's config?
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09:56<fx># session required
09:56<fx>it is commented out
09:56<fx>and it is also commented out on the host where it works ok (as I expect, i.e. limits don't change)
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10:01<luca3003>ciao a tutti
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10:03<luca3003>hello everybody
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10:04<fx>hm, looks like it is affected by different defaults for hard nofile limits for root
10:04<luca3003>I have a strange issue with a russian file in a debian lenny
10:04<fx>as sudo goes through root env, I suppose
10:04<luca3003>may anybody help me?
10:05<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: How would we know? You haven't told us anything about it yet.
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10:06<luca3003>ok, I'm uploading this file to my lenny debian but when I try to opne it with vim or nano I can't see the russian characters
10:06<luca3003>it seems that there's something wrong on charsets
10:06<luca3003>my file is utf-8
10:07<luca3003>but my OS seems to open it as it were a cp1252
10:07<luca3003>any idea?
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10:10<luca3003>maybe I've not been so clear
10:10<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: I think I understand the problem, but I am not familiar with console font settings.
10:10<luca3003>ok, try to go here
10:11<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: Can you display cryllic characters from other files in the console?
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10:11<luca3003>I don't have any other cyrillic file!
10:11<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian or use English here.
10:12<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: If you speak russian, you may be able to find help there.
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10:14<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: Have you used console-setup to enable cryllic display?
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10:15<luca3003>I don't speak russian
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10:15<luca3003>and mine is a charset related problem
10:15<luca3003>maybe useful for everyone
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10:15<engywuck>luca, try :set encoding=utf8 in vim
10:16<luca3003>i tried
10:16<luca3003>no way!
10:16<bst>maybe help console-cyrillic
10:16<engywuck>do you have X on the machine? if yes try with gvim
10:17<luca3003>no, I don't
10:17<Good-maN>luca3003: whats the prob, you need to see the russian letters or you need a console with russian letters?
10:17<luca3003>but as I don't understand cyrillic, I'm not sure I really want to use console-cyrillic
10:17<jhutchins_lt>luca3003: Unless your system is capable of framebuffer video, you may not be able to display those characters.
10:17<luca3003>I need to see the russian letters
10:18<Good-maN>and you have russian locales installed?
10:18<luca3003>I need them to set-up a russian interface for Docebo
10:18<engywuck>are you direct on the hardware or connect from a different server?
10:18<luca3003>a LMS
10:18<luca3003>I connect from remote
10:18<engywuck>ok, then its possibly the fault of your local machine, not the server
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10:19<engywuck>I had this problem, when connecting from Windows to my debian box with putty
10:19<luca3003>I upload my files via winscp
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10:19<engywuck>how do you start vim? in a ssh session by putty?
10:19<engywuck>if yes: change putty to use utf8
10:19<engywuck>or try playing with putty locale
10:20<Good-maN>putty settings before you connect
10:20<luca3003>it's a virtual machine
10:20<engywuck>before opening connection with putty change the settings of putty. don't remember the exact location
10:20<luca3003>let me try to connect via the citrix interface
10:20<engywuck>but you should be able to find it by clicking through the menu
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10:22<luca3003>let me try+
10:23<betinho>anyone knows an code example (installer) in bash to make some questions to the user and specially ask him to edit a config file and give an option to call, for instance, the vim editor
10:23<betinho>tks in advance
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10:25<jhutchins_lt>betinho: You could look at how Gentoo's emerge system does it, that's a pretty good example.
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10:26<luca3003>ok, it works!
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10:27<engywuck>i don't know why putty *still* insists on latin1 as default encoding
10:27<luca3003>thank you very much
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10:28<luca3003>I'm trying to install docebo with russian interface once again
10:28<luca3003>let me tell you what happens
10:28<betinho>jhutchins_lt, thanks. i'm looking for it on the net (do you have the link for it?)
10:29<jhutchins_lt>betinho: No, I used to maintain a couple Gentoo systems and that was one of their good features.
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10:38<luca3003>it's frustrating...
10:38<luca3003>no problem with the file
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10:39<luca3003>i can see it correctly via putty if I set it with utf8 charset
10:39<luca3003>but when installing docebo, that's the result
10:41<Good-maN>luca3003: type on the server locale -a
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10:41<Good-maN>is there russian listed?
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10:42<kusanagi>is there a way to get a feed of packages changing from experimental to sid?
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10:47<Good-maN>luca3003: I see there only two options, 1 the russian language is not installed on the server (locale -a (not listed here)) or docebo need additional language files
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10:48<luca3003>I think the problem could rely on apache or mysql configuration
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10:49<Good-maN>luca3003: yeah not wrong, so check mysql, if its set to UTF-8 i should work, apache i dont know....
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10:54<amdgoon_>on squeeze (upgraded from lenny) dhcp is ignoring the assigned address for its mac and grabbing another one. How to get the client to use the correct one? This is not a router issue, afaict
10:55<amdgoon_>by switching between network-manager-gnome and ifupdown, i fixed one machine (at least it has stopped using other addresses)
10:56<jhutchins_lt>amdgoon_: Tell us about the dhcp server.
10:56<luca3003>It works now
10:56<luca3003>thank you!!!
10:57-!-hercynium [~hercynium@] has joined #debian
10:57<amdgoon_>it is the server inside a d-link DI-604 5-port switch/router
10:57<Good-maN>luca3003: and what was the fault?
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10:58<Good-maN>luca3003: no prob, your welcome
10:58<amdgoon_>i have rebooted the DI-604
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10:58<amdgoon_>still odd behaviour persists
10:58<kop>amdgoon_: Perhaps one or the other of your configurations (network manager does not use the interfaces file, does it?) has a static IP address configured, or something like that.
10:58<luca3003>the very first problem was putty
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10:59<luca3003>the connection wasn't utf8
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11:00<amdgoon_>nm avoids use of interfaces file yes. I am using ifupdown atm, and each address it picks is incremented by one
11:00<luca3003>then I've seen that the problem wasn't the file itself but the way the strings were inserted into mysql
11:00<amdgoon_>which says it is keeping track of used addresses. What "it" is not known to me
11:00<luca3003>so I edited the my.cnf file adding the right charset
11:00<luca3003>that's all
11:01<Good-maN>luca3003: :) sometimes the solution is simple, but find it ^^ well done
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11:01<luca3003>thank you!
11:02<amdgoon_>i deleted all the .lease files i could find. It's like I have two dhcp clients on here and one is over-riding the first??
11:02<kop>amdgoon_: Perhaps you have 2 dhcp servers?
11:02<kop>amdgoon_: What do the logs say about where the data's coming from?
11:03<jhutchins_lt>The client doesn't determine the IP address, that is determined by the server.
11:03<kop>amdgoon_: tail -f is your friend.
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11:03<amdgoon_>right, I need to watch it grab the address
11:03<amdgoon_>there is an odd pause as it configures eth0
11:04<jhutchins_lt>amdgoon_: You have told the router to serve a specific IP to your MAC?
11:04<amdgoon_>jhutchins_lt: yes
11:04<amdgoon_>I have computer lab of 20 machines, been using this router dhcp server for a few years now, it has behaved well so far.
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11:05<jhutchins_lt>You might need to use tcpdump to watch the dhcp exchange.
11:05<amdgoon_>what file should i watch with tail when I down and up eth0?
11:06<amdgoon_>ah ok.
11:07-!-mix22891 [~mix22891@] has joined #debian
11:07<mix22891>why i can't install Steam ?
11:07-!-Bogdan1 [] has joined #debian
11:07<towo`>mix22891, why my car dos not drive?
11:08<mix22891>any1 els?
11:08<Good-maN>mix22891: towo try to say whe need mor infos :)
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11:08<Good-maN>*whe = we
11:08<mix22891>ok :-D
11:09<mix22891>i just fallow the instructions from :
11:09<amdgoon_>i do have some "extra" machines in here now, perhaps a second dhcp server is running. Better check, thanks kop . . .
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11:11<mix22891>towo' you don't habe gus
11:11<towo`>i don't see any relevant info
11:12<towo`>"i can't" is not a error message
11:12<mix22891>E: Unable to locate package SteamInstall.msi
11:12<mix22891>E: Couldn't find any package by regex 'SteamInstall.msi'
11:12<towo`>then you have not followed the instructions
11:12<mix22891>i do : apt-get install SteamInstall.msi
11:12<mix22891>and get the error
11:13<towo`>you joking, or?
11:13<towo`>sure, you do
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11:14<towo`>you should install windows and forget any linux mix22891
11:14<mix22891>i'm right here: Download the installer, open a terminal and change to the download directory. Run wine start SteamInstall.msi
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11:14<mix22891>it says: open a terminal
11:14<madadam1>Hi is it possible to install unity 2d on debian?
11:14<jhutchins_lt>madadam1: Not at this time.
11:15<mix22891>and wine is for linux as i know
11:15<madadam1>jhutchins, ok thank
11:15<jhutchins_lt>madadam1: unity is a canonical project.
11:16<mix22891>look here:
11:16<mix22891>steam under linux
11:16<madadam1>jhutchins, ok
11:16<towo`>mix22891, and?
11:16<mix22891>what and?
11:16<towo`>mix22891, here is #debian, not #wine or #steam
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11:16<towo`>mix22891, and btw, where in this page, you read apt-get install SteamInstall.msi?
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11:17<mix22891>it says install
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11:17<jhutchins_lt>mix22891: apt-get only gets packages from configured debian repositories. It does not get .msi installers.
11:17-!-tchnkion-wrek-gar is now known as wrek-gar
11:17<mix22891>i c
11:18<mix22891>and i've tryed # wine steaminstall.msi
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11:18<mix22891>not work
11:18<Zaba>can't you read?
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11:19<Zaba>seriously though, it says 'wine start SteamInstall.msi' and you are unable to get that right for like ten minutes now
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11:19<wrek-gar>how can one disable ssh from starting automatically on boot?
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11:19<madadam1>someone can give me a dockbar about a launcher to use in squeeze
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11:20<madadam1>someone can give me an advice about a launcher to use in squeeze
11:20<mix22891>Zaba where it says that?
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11:21<towo`>mix22891, use windows, there you must read nothing
11:21<towo`>steam easy works under windows
11:21<Zaba>on the page that you've been linking here so many times
11:21<towo`>why installing linux, if you want to use windows apps?
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11:23<mix22891>Zaba thank you but i can't find that line
11:23<towo`>then, you realy unable to read
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11:24<Zaba>the key ability here is to read things carefully instead of expecting the needed things to magically jump out of the page to hug you
11:24<ZykoticK9>wrek-gar, check out update-rc.d (sorry, I'm not sure of the specifics, and update-rc.d was discussed on the mailing list a while ago saying it was not a tool for admins), I believe it can disable services from starting on specific runlevels however. Good luck.
11:24-!-ersoy [] has joined #debian
11:24<Zaba>and instead of trying to make random crap up and expecting it to work
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11:24<jhutchins_lt>ZykoticK9: rcconf
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11:25<ZykoticK9>wrek-gar, ^
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11:26<mix22891>why this line is not blod
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11:26<mix22891>i not even think that is a command
11:26<mix22891>but thanks Zaba
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11:27<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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11:27<Zaba>mix22891, good luck
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11:28<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
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11:28<mjt>heh, a dup
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11:30<zimpee> /msg dpkg lenny->squeeze
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11:37<amdgoon_>hmmm not second dhcp server . . .
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12:28<urban_>Hi, I'm upgrading an old machine from etch to lenny and I get some errors regarding fglrx:
12:29<urban_> fglrx-atieventsd: Recommends: fglrx-driver (= 1:8-12-4) but 8.33.6-1 is installed
12:29<urban_>and such...
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12:29<urban_>Does anyone know what to do about them?
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12:30<urban_>I can't purge fglrx-driver: fglrx-control: Depends: fglrx-driver but it is not going to be installed
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12:34<jgalt>anyone have a favorite app for recording the local webcam and audio to a file that will run decently on low end hardware (1Ghz netbook)? Cheese is lagging badly enough to be unusable.
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12:35<urban_>jgalt, I've used motion before but I don't know if does audio...
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12:46<jhutchins_lt>jgalt: ffmpeg
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12:48<dabir>hello i am new to linux and am completely lost.. what should i do first?
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12:49<jhutchins_lt>!tell dabir about overview
12:49<Zaba>dabir, it ultimately depends on what you want to do
12:50<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Do you have debian installed yet?
12:50<jhutchins_lt>dabir: (I thought that message from dpkg was more useful than it is.)
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12:51<dabir>yes i running debian right now, and i don't really know anything
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12:52<dabir>tried reading console_basics gnu linux tutorial on
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12:53<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Good start.
12:54<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Might have a look around
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12:54<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Anything in particular you want to do with the system?
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12:55<jgalt>Thanks, xawtv is an option that gives 2 recorded files that can be post processed, looks like ffmpeg is a good solution as well. much appreciated, adding short video files to an email to add some color.
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12:57<kop>!tell dabir about overview
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12:57<kop>dabir: Sorry. I see you already got that factoid.
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12:59<dabir>i just don't know where to look .. my main motive for using linux is to have control over my system, but i'm lacking the understanding of how anything works
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13:00<babilen>jhutchins_lt, kop: I am a bit surprised by the frequent references to the <overview> factoid, because it primarily describes where to get additional software. Wouldn't the <grounding> factoid (yes, it is references in <overview>) be better suited for people who ask "Where to start?"
13:01<babilen>!tell dabir -about grounding
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13:01<kop>dabir: What are you trying to do with your computer? There's a difference between someone who wants to program and someone who wants to say, watch movies.
13:01<babilen>dabir: I would start by installing Debian (read the installation guide) and by reading the Debian reference. The <general cli tutorial> is probably also worth a look.
13:01<jhutchins_lt>babilen: It probably would if we were to think of it first.
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13:02<jhutchins_lt>babilen: Maybe there should be an <introduction> or <new users> factoid or link.
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13:03<babilen>dabir: But the most important question has just been asked by kop: "What are you trying to do?" -- Just set yourself little goals (e.g. "I want sound" or "I want to develop in Python") and work on that. We can help you to achieve those goals, but it is good to start with something tangible.
13:03<babilen>jhutchins_lt: yes
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13:03<kop>babilen: I wrote the overview factoid to give people a place to start when it comes to administering their system; it's hard to learn anything on a broken system and it's easy to administer the box "like MS Windows" and break everything.
13:03<koollman>babilen: I want a pony
13:03<jhutchins_lt>dabir: *nix has what they call a "steep learning curve". To do the most basic things there is a huge range of concepts to understand.
13:03<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Nice thing is though, once you begin to get the hang of it you really can do whatever you want.
13:04<kop>jhutchins_lt: I like that. It can reference both grounding and overview.
13:04<babilen>Which would be just what is needed :)
13:04<babilen>software + docs
13:04<kop>dabir: But, once you learn something the knowledge stays relevant. A Un*x admin from 1974 would recoginse Debian today and be able to function.
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13:05<jordanm>the advanced stuff in *nix doesn't carry over as much as your might think
13:06<jordanm>things that interact with the kernel such as top, ps, free, etc are vastly different in other unix OSs
13:06<kop>jordanm: Advances do advance, yes.
13:06<dabir>we'll i've done some reading here:
13:06<dabir>but it's confusing.. is it really necessary for me to start there?
13:07<dabir>i end up losing track because i don't understand
13:07<jhutchins_lt>jordanm: They're different, but they still do essentially the same thing, and you can use the same tools (man, info) to find out what the differences are.
13:07<dabir>also thank you all for helping me
13:07<kop>jordanm: Not so much. You can still type "ps" or "ps -ef" or "ps ax". Sure there's lots of other args that are not portable but the basics don't change and are backwards compatible. You can still type ifconfig even though "ip addr" exists.
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13:08<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Just keep hammering at it. Try stuff. Make notes. Change one thing at a time and keep track of what you do.
13:09<kop>dabir: It's a matter of vocabularly. Learn one word at a time. (Not commands, although those help too, but the words that represent concepts. "filesystem" "partition" "mount point", etc. Wikipedia can help.
13:09<emmy>hello peeplz out there
13:09<jhutchins_lt>dabir: - System Administrator's Guid is a good reference.
13:09<kop>dabir: You'll want to forget everything MS. They like to blur the concepts and reuse/confuse existing words to enhance vendor lock-in.
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13:10<kop>dabir: Yes. The tldb stuff can be old but is still good for the basics.
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13:10<emmy>hi im bord at hme im goin to get a cream soda
13:11<jhutchins_lt>tldp also tends to be RedHat based, but it's getting better.
13:11<emmy>i r back hows it going
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13:11<kop>dabir: And don't bother trying to read something like Chapter 1 unless you've got a box running and can type commands to follow along. Learn by doing is a lot easier to remember and understand.
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13:11<jhutchins_lt>emmy: This isn't really a social channel, it's tech support. You can try #defocus.
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13:12<dabir>okay is their also a log for what's being done to my system? like connections, or
13:12<dabir>when i open a program it would say $ [program]
13:12<kop>dabir: Lots. They're in /var/log.
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13:13<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Some. Not so much of each command you execute, althoug that gets logged to your .bash_history
13:13<emmy>im stuck here
13:13<kop>dabir: Most programs won't log. But you have a command history. Type "man history" to see the docs or just "history".
13:13<dabir>is their a realtime 'terminal' type thing?
13:14<dabir>not terminal but like a log
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13:14<jhutchins_lt>dabir: There are a couple of ways to do that. One is to tell the logs to display on one of the auxilliary consoles (F12 is popular). That requires editing the syslog configuration.
13:14<kop>dabir: My recommendation is always: Read "man less", "man man", and "info info" to learn how to read the docs and search for just the part you need.
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13:15<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Another is to pick a log and tail -f /var/log/syslog - that will do a continuous follow of the log until you hit Ctrl-C.
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13:17<dabir>kop: when you say 'learn by doing' where can i learn 'doing' if not chapter 1?
13:18<kop>dabir: Then pick an editor, either vi or emacs. Learn it. You can use the editor keys (and the tab key is your friend too) at the command line to make typing easier. (I prefer emacs. Type "emacs" read the screen and take the tuitoral. It also helps to enable the non-free repos and install emacs23-common-non-DFSG package to get the full emacs docs.)
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13:19<kop>dabir: Chapter 1 is ok for "doing". I'm just saying don't read it unless you're in front of a working box and you type-along.
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13:20<kop>dabir: _Then_, don't forget to leave comments in the files you edit that say _why_ you made the changes you did. After that set yourself a task, like making backups, and just learn away.
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13:22<kop>dabir: To understand networking the IETF RFCs are quite helpful, although dense and, of course, detailed.
13:23<dabir>how do i install something ? also i feel like if i install i might lose track of it and not be able to uninstall if needed
13:24<kop>dabir: The package management system keeps track for you.
13:24<jrabbit>my "old" hfsplus crashed and corrupted a partition
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13:24<jrabbit>who do I file a bug with the dmesg output with?
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13:24<jhutchins_lt>dabir: You might want to look at man aptitude
13:24<jrabbit>debian or linux or hfsplus?
13:24<kop>dabir: You use aptitude or apt-get (aptitude is generally recommended). Or a gui based something like synaptic.
13:25<kop>dabir: You should also know about the fhs reference.
13:25<kop>!tell dabir about fhs
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13:26<dabir>this is still so alien to me.. seriously all i can do right now and feel confident about is surf the web
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13:27<kop>dabir: You don't need to learn _everything_. Nobody knows it all.
13:27<gnugr>kop: isn't good for dabir to start learning all about apt?
13:27<Nemoder>dabir: just set yourself some goals and look for guides on them if you get stuck
13:28<kop>gnugr: Yes. That's another very good thing to learn at the start, so you can tell what's what and where it came from and find it's docs.
13:28<dabir>apt = applications right?
13:28<dpkg>[APT] Advanced Packaging Tool, a package management system used by Debian and its derivatives. There is no apt program per se; APT is a C++ library of functions that are used by several command line programs for dealing with packages, notably apt-get, apt-cache, and aptitude. See also <aptitude> <apt-get>, <apt-cache>,
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13:29<kop>dabir: Apt, and it's counterpart on RedHat based systems (rpm), are what make managing a Linux box revolutionary.
13:29<gnugr>here is a good place to make practice with apt-aptitude-dpkg:
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13:32<chealer>jrabbit: uh, you attach the file?
13:32<jhutchins_lt>dabir: One of the big differences is that rather than hunting down applications on the web and downloading them, a huge number of useful applications have been pre-packaged for Debian and are available within the package management system, so all you do is tell it to install them.
13:32<chealer>jrabbit: oh. it's advised to report to Debian
13:32<jhutchins_lt>dabir: They've been tested and tweaked to make sure they work with debian and dont break stuff.
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13:33<dabir>and learning about apt will teach me how to install/remove software ?
13:33<dabir>i guess that's the first step or goal i'd like to accomplish
13:34<koollman>dabir: yes. the basic is rather easy. find a package name, then : aptitude install packagename. then it's installed.
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13:34<chealer>dabir: yes. what is your favorite package manager?
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13:35<jrabbit>chealer: hfsprogs?
13:35<jrabbit>its a kernel bug dmesg says
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13:35<dabir>chealer: idk? system>applications>software center?
13:35<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Most of us just use aptitude (or apt-get) from the command line.
13:36<chealer>jrabbit: I didn't see the bug. you can file it on 2 packages or even general if you don't know.
13:36<chealer>dabir: software center? that Synaptic?
13:36<koollman>it probably is
13:37<engywucz>dselect ^^
13:37<dabir>idk . i'm fresh new computer + debian netinstall
13:37<jhutchins_lt>dabir: You're going to find that there's usually more than one way to do everything in linux - sometimes many ways.
13:39<arand>chealer: Software centre is equivalent in many ways to synaptic, it is not the same.
13:39<dabir>so would i be able to learn linux without reading any basics?
13:39<dabir>but rather, just 'learn by doing'
13:39<arand>That's probably how most peaople do it..
13:40<engywucz>i always read the basicsfor every program I use. :D
13:40<engywucz>but that of course depends on what you call "basics"
13:40<dabir>program yes but i'm talking about OS
13:41<gnugr>jrabbit: can you please give us the output on pastebin of " /sbin/fdisk -l " ?
13:42<dabir>i tried to just learn by doing, so i tried installing a program but had NO IDEA how
13:42<dabir>by downloading one off internet
13:42<jrabbit>gnugr: hmmm?
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13:42<jrabbit>gnugr: I'll give you the kernel output onsec
13:43<jhutchins_lt>dabir: REmember what I said earlier?
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13:43<dabir>please tell me again
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13:44<jhutchins_lt>dabir: That's actually a lot of what the overview factoid covers - in modern Linux systems, you don't find-and-download, you use the package manager to grab a version that's pre-packaged and tested for the system.
13:44<riley>hey- how do i delete a file if it may or may not exist
13:44<riley>say i do rm test.t
13:44<riley>test.t may or may not exist
13:44<riley>and i don't want any errors
13:44<jhutchins_lt>dabir: You _can_ install other stuff - anything you can get the source code for - but start out with pre-packaged files. What was the program you tried to install?
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13:44<engywucz>man rm @riley
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13:45<engywucz>there you'll find the option. ;-)
13:45<engywucz>for the record: try --force
13:45<dabir>firefox.. and virtualbox
13:45<engywucz> -f, --force
13:45<engywucz> ignore nonexistent files, never prompt
13:45<dpkg>Mozilla Firefox is replaced by Iceweasel in Debian. Ask me about <iceweasel> and <why iceweasel>.
13:45<jhutchins_lt>dabir: Ah. Firefox is called iceweasel in debian for licensing reasons - aptitude install firefox - but it's probably already installed.
13:46<riley>ouch- i just got told to RTFM... AND I DESERVED IT
13:46<chealer>dabir: Software Center seems to be a simplified package manager. I recommend you try a real manager like Synaptic Package Manager.
13:47<kop>dabir: (Although we prefer to support command-line tools here, like aptitude, instead of synaptic because it's a lot easier to tell someone to type "aptitude install iceweasel" than walk you through all the pointing and clicking that'd be needed in synaptic.)
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13:48<kop>dabir: You must be root to install packages.
13:48<kop>!tell dabir about root
13:48<dabir>that much i do know ^^ ;)
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13:49<kop>dabir: You can type, say "aptitude search virtualbox" without being root. (Also take the advice above and glance through "man aptitude".)
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13:50<dabir>where do i type all this in? terminal?
13:50<kop>dabir: yes.
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13:51<mercutio22>quite often gnome seems to crash after login. Interestingly I can still move the pointer but I can't alternate ttys.
13:52<kop>dabir: Before you type "man aptitude" you need to read enough of "man less" to know that you exit by typing "q" and pressing enter. (Or, if you happen to type "h" you get to less's help screen which will also tell you how to quit.)
13:53<kop>dabir: (The convention in general is 'q' or 'exit' to get out of things, or pressing Ctrl-C (hold down ctrl and press c) to force quit.)
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13:54<mercutio22>nothing very interesting appears at .xsession-errors:
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13:55<kop>mercutio22: Anything of note in the X log?
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13:56<mercutio22>kop: hmm.. forgot to check that. Let me see..
13:56<dabir>wow linux is still so very confusing..
13:56<gnugr>jrabbit: well, yes its Kernel Bug, please go there #debian-bugs and show them that output line
13:57<kop>dabir: You might consider sitting down with someone from your local Linux user's group for a a half hour. Nothing like a real person to interact with.
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13:57<dabir>you mean online? all people i know are windows users
13:58<kop>dabir: No. In meatspace. has a list of user's groups. Or use google.
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13:59<mercutio22>kop: there are two EE lines
13:59<mercutio22>kop: does that tell you anything? Seems something failed
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14:00<darius>what could you recomend to colect data from remote hosts for nagios/cacti ?
14:01<dabir> is down or something cause doesn't go through
14:02<jthomas>Any reason why my kernel headers aren't out there? I cannot run VirtualBox without them: "Bad luck, the kernel headers for the target kernel version could not be found"
14:02<mercutio22>kop: no, I meant, the two WW lines are fishy
14:02<jthomas>lemme try an update
14:02<jthomas>nope, no headers for 2.6.39-1-686-pae
14:02<kop>mercutio22: Nothing leaps out, but then I don't know much.
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14:03<kop>darius: You might consider using icinga instead of nagios. In any case install the packages.
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14:04<dabir>kop: how do i find local linux user's group/
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14:05<kop>jthomas: the headers are in linux-headers-* packages. If you use the virtualbox-ose package instead of trying to do your own system's integration I'd expect that to be automatically installed. But I've not tried it.
14:05<jthomas>dabir google for one, or maybe create one, or read the back of 2600 magazine maybe
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14:05<jthomas>kop i'm using 'module assistant prepare' and it should be able to find the headers that it needs, before even worrying about vbox
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14:06<jthomas>and yes, i a using the ose
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14:08<kop>jthomas: Ok. Well then I'm clueless. Sorry.
14:08<jthomas>well, rebooting to an older kernel I guess.
14:08<jthomas>no worry kop
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14:31<urbanfbi>I'm new to debian. I have installed debian squeeze and want to install Truecrypt. How can I do that?
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14:34<dpkg>TrueCrypt is a <non-free> (under DFSG's definitions) implementation of on-the-fly disk encryption that also attempts plausible deniability, something not found in other OTFE systems like <EncFS> and <LUKS>. Not in Debian, RFP in bug #413070.
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14:35<gnugr>urbanfbi: go there
14:35<srtu>why using TC on a Linux mashine?
14:36<weasel>.O( tc is useful for traffic shaping )
14:36<urbanfbi>gnugr: done
14:37<arand>srtu: I think in the dual boot case..
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14:37<srtu>oh OK good point ,-)
14:38<urbanfbi>gnugr: I've extracted the truecrypt-7.0a-setup-x64, tryed to run it as root, but it failes with following error: ...
14:38<urbanfbi>Error: Can't open display: :0.0
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14:39<urbanfbi>so I tryed to run it as normal user and got: (gksudo:3785): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_str_has_prefix: assertion `str != NULL' failed
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14:39<urbanfbi>any ideas how to get truecrypt installed in debian squeeze?
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14:43<urbanfbi>ok, I found this ... maybe this helps:
14:43<jhutchins_lt>urbanfbi: Run it as root in a real console.
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14:45<omni>Is there any way in Terminal to change certain lines to show certain colors? IE: Commands typed out = Green, Misc info = Black, Questions = Red?
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14:47<jhutchins_lt>omni: Yes. Color VT.
14:47<jhutchins_lt>omni: I think the SAG has something on it...
14:48<omni>jhutchins_lt, i'm still new to Debian (Linux) I dont know the abbreviations yet :\
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14:48<jhutchins_lt>omni: .udevdb or .udev presence implies active udev. Aborting MAKEDEV invocation.
14:48<kop>!tell omni about overview
14:48<MrFrood>omni: if you are scripting the colour of output in the terminal can be chanched using eacape codes - best asking in the channal for your shell
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14:49<jhutchins_lt>MrFrood: bash can run in color as well.
14:49<jhutchins_lt>MrFrood: Interactively.
14:49<urbanfbi>jhutchins_lt: thanks a lot!
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14:50<dpkg>TrueCrypt is a <non-free> (under DFSG's definitions) implementation of on-the-fly disk encryption that also attempts plausible deniability, something not found in other OTFE systems like <EncFS> and <LUKS>. Not in Debian, RFP in bug #413070.
14:50<jordanm>opps, my scrollback was behind :\
14:50<MrFrood>jhutchins_lt: I never said it could not...
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14:53<omni>MrFrood, I'm not scripting, i have Terminal open and was doing updates and downloads. I just wanted a easier way to see where i had typed and where the system was doing things.
14:53<urbanfbi>how can I install firefox (not iceweasel)?
14:53*MrFrood wonders why why it is always assumed a user is using bash when a shell question is asked :-|
14:54<MrFrood>omni: just trying to cover all the bases
14:54<jordanm>omni: nothing distiguishes the differences between those things unless it is coded in
14:55<MrFrood>urbanfbi: iceweasel essentially is firefox - just with some rebranding
14:55<omni>MrFrood, Jordanm, Jhutchins_lt, kop: Allrighty then.. Thank you all for your help as always :)
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14:57<urbanfbi>MrFrood: so it is not possible to get an actual firefox running in debian?
14:58<retrospectacus>it's possible but is nothing but a pain in the ass and there's absolutely no reason to
14:58<MrFrood>urbanfbi: it is but iceweasel will intergrate better - if you need/want a newer version of iceweasel
14:59<MrFrood>!tell urbanfbi why iceweasel
15:00<jhutchins_lt>Is there a good reason to use ff4? I hear it crashes worse than flash on 64.
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15:01<retrospectacus>I'm using iceweasel 4 - hasn't crashed yet
15:02<retrospectacus>otoh I haven't found any reason to recommend people upgrade to it
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15:03<urbanfbi>MrFrood: following packages could not be identified: libpixman-1-0 libcairo2 libmozjs4d libnss3-1d xulrunner-2.0 iceweasel
15:04<MrFrood>urbanfbi: did you follow all the instructions on the site..?
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15:04<urbanfbi>I added the line into source.list
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15:04<MrFrood>urbanfbi: that site has worked for many users
15:05<urbanfbi>and did apt-get install -t squeeze-backports iceweasel
15:05<retrospectacus>the site tells you all about those exact errors...
15:05<urbanfbi>ah ...
15:05<MrFrood>did you update apt?
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15:06<urbanfbi>I got the problem ... thanks a lot for your help
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15:19<monteki>всем привет. может кто-нибудь помочь с samba?
15:20<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian or use English here.
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15:22<janice>#join ed
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15:22<janice>fuck girlvinyl
15:22<monteki>Hi! Can anybody help me with samba?
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15:23<MrFrood>!tell monteki about ask
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15:35<monteki>well.. I have troubles with Samba. My network content 2 coputers with Windows 7 and Debian 6. When I try to connect from Win7 to Debian I just type "\\" and everything is ok. But when I enter to win7 from debian, connection is lost through 5 minute. I tried to configure /etc/samba/smb.conf in differnt ways but not successfully. Sorry for my english - there no help in russian chanal =)
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15:44<nyov>monteki: to connect from linux to win, you only need an smb client, so your problem might rather be on the windows end, not in your samba's smb.conf
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15:45<nyov>monteki: did you try with smbclient ?
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15:45<nyov>monteki: any errors in /var/log/samba/* ?
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15:48<monteki>great to see any help - i'm a newbei. I just tried to connect with Krusader: "smb://192...." and Dolphin
15:50<monteki>smbclien - is it for bash? or maybe GUI app?
15:50<nyov>monteki: smbclient is a console client, yes
15:53<monteki>There are a lot of strings in /var/log/samba/
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15:54<monteki>for example: Unable to find the Domain Master Browser name MONT<1b> for the workgroup MONT.
15:54<monteki>Unable to sync browse lists in this workgroup.
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15:57<nyov>monteki: try smbclient in a terminal, smbclient -U username '\\SERVER\share'
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15:58<nyov>samba is a sore spot for me, so I might not be able to help much there ;)
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15:59<monteki>it's better than nothing)
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16:01<nyov>if smbclient can connect, you should see a prompt like smb: \> - then type ls or ? for help
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16:07<zimpee>can i set my squeeze to display my grub2 background during booting process?
16:07<zimpee>it doesnot disappear immediately, i suppose there is a way...
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16:13<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Which version of WIndows 7 is it?
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16:13<jhutchins_lt>The dropped connection sounds more like a network problem.
16:14<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Is wifi involved?
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16:15<monteki>no, win and deb connect to router through cables
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16:18<nyov>monteki: can you see those shares with: smbclient -L WIN7 %U
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16:21<nyov>monteki: if that other thing doesn't help, do a debug run and pastebin it, smbclient -d3 -U username '\\SERVER\share'
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16:22<jhutchins_lt>nyov: It sounds like hes connecting, but the connection is being dropped.
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16:22<monteki>Connecting to at port 445
16:22-!-Guest2483 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:22<monteki>Connecting to at port 139
16:22<monteki>protocol negotiation failed: ERRnomem
16:23<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Which version of WIndows 7 is it?
16:23<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Which "edition"?
16:23<monteki>it is result of smbclient -d3 -U username '\\SERVER\share'
16:23<monteki>Ultimate =)
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16:24<jhutchins_lt>K, so that shouldn't be a problem. W7 changes the way some SMB networking works...
16:24<nyov>there should be much much more output with that -d flag
16:25<monteki>When connection is lost, restart of Win7 helps
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16:25<monteki>but again only for 5 minute
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16:25<nyov>ok so it's working, for 5 minutes?
16:26<monteki>"When connection is lost, restart of Win7 helps" - can i post it here?
16:26<monteki>oh, wait
16:26<monteki>"there should be much much more output with that -d flag" - can i post it here?
16:27<monteki>there are a lot of strings
16:27<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Is your W7 completely updated?
16:27<jhutchins_lt>monteki: There was a bug with this.
16:27<diederik>monteki: use pastebin for that
16:27<jhutchins_lt>!tell monteki about paste
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16:27<monteki>yes, i've updeted it today
16:28<nyov>this still looks like a win issue
16:29<monteki>result of -d flag
16:29<ballison>how come sometimes ls -al returns the date field as "Jun 24 2008" and other times it returns as "2008-06-20" ? I'm piping it to awk and the number of fields keeps changing because of ls -al's date field.
16:30<nyov>this here is for NT, but maybe it's related:
16:30<nyov>monteki: can you check your windows event log for errors?
16:30<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Not verified:
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16:31<jhutchins_lt>monteki: fix the config file. It's acting like a memory problem.
16:33<ballison>notice the time stamps between these two machines --->
16:34<ballison>why is it different like that in the formatting?
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16:35<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Several different references to the settings described above, also this:
16:35<diederik>monteki: when I try to connect to my samba, I only get Connecting to IP at port 445, no 139 here (but not a Win7 client)
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16:36<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Fix the error on lines 6-7 - sometimes trivial errors can cause mysterious problems.
16:38<nyov>i already wrote that in the query, but it looks like a win issue -
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16:42<monteki>i've fixed error, but i still have protocol negotiation failed: ERRnomem
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16:43<monteki>about win issue - my friend have Arch and Wind7 in network - he has no problems
16:44<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Still, good to have a clean configuration. Did you check that procedure I posted to pastebin?
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16:44<monteki>no, repeat please
16:44<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Is W7 fully updated? There were bugs with smb.
16:45<monteki>yes, I've updated it today fully
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16:45<nyov>ballison: you probably have different locales on both machines
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16:58<monteki>in any case, tnx for your help!
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16:59<jhutchins_lt>monteki: Good luck. Could just be a bad network card or cable.
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17:01<monteki>I do not think so - Win7 can read and write Debian's share/
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17:08<monteki>"with love from Russia"
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17:08<monteki>bye ^_^
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17:20<vook>what are some good alternatives to minicom ?
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17:21<dpkg>VATTENE VIA!
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17:22<jhutchins_lt>vook: What's wrong with minicom?
17:22<themill>vook: depends what you're looking for; putty?
17:22<mjr>for minimalistin, cu
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17:24<jhutchins_lt>vook: What do you need to do ?
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17:32<vook>nothing wrong with minicom - just curious about other clients
17:33<vook>well, something with more than just vt102 and ANSI would be nice
17:33<Myon>vook: screen is nice
17:34<jhutchins_lt>vook: Last I looked it had about 10 terminal configurations.
17:35<jhutchins_lt>vook: The DE's might have serial utils, but nobody uses them much any more.
17:35<zimpee>Hey guys, my squeeze went crazy. Any ideas why can't i switch to tty1 from X? Using gdm +xfce4. Latest ATI graphics driver installed.
17:35<vook>jhutchins_lt: hmm, the version I'm using only offers vt102 and ANSI
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17:35<vook>Myon: how would I go about joining /dev/ttyS0 (to connect to a router for example) using just the terminal and screen ?
17:36<vook>...may be a long answer - if so nm
17:36<Myon>screen /dev/ttyS0
17:37<vook>hmm, I've never used it that way, thanks
17:37<Myon>screen /dev/ttyS0 19200
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17:37<Myon>minicom is nice, but if you don't want to connect it to a modem, you need to rip out half a dozen init strings first
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17:39<vook>currently I'm connected to a coraid and I typed "tail". now it's stuck in a spot where it just echo's everything I type, can't seem to escape.
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17:39<jhutchins_lt>vook: ctrl-C
17:39<vook>ya, no luch
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17:40<jhutchins_lt>vook: Try connecting to a different console and killing tail
17:40<vook>:) there's only one serial port, no monitor port
17:40<vook>it's a beast
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17:40<vook>no ssh
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17:41<vook>It's just running ata over ethernet
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17:41<ivo_>there is a really nasty bug
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17:41<ivo_>the asus xonar d1
17:41<ivo_>is not working properly with squeeze
17:41<ivo_>volume adjusting is VERYYYYYYYYYYY slow
17:42<ivo_>and there is random popping
17:42<ivo_>the bug is open since 2009
17:42<ivo_>come on guys
17:42<ivo_>it can not be that hard
17:42<themill>ivo_: if it's not that hard, youl
17:42<ivo_>I need to work myself in the source
17:42<themill>you'll send a patch, won't oyu
17:43<ivo_>but for a dev who knows how the stuff works together
17:43<ivo_>should be able to fix this more quickly
17:43<themill>but who doesn't have the exact hardware in question ...
17:43<ivo_>I'll pay for the hardware
17:44<Myon>did you mail that to the bug?
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17:44<ivo_>the bug has been opend many times on various lists
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17:44<ivo_>and marked as incomplete
17:45<ivo_>so I did not bother to post it too.
17:45<themill>bug number on
17:45<ivo_>hmm I've saw it on the ubuntu bug tracker
17:45<ivo_>not on the debian one
17:46<Myon>then poke them
17:46<ivo_>but even after 2 years the fix it
17:46<themill>ivo_: so what was debian supposed to do about it if it was never reported to debian?
17:46<ivo_>when is it goin to be backported to debian
17:46<Myon>ask ubuntu
17:46<Myon>or report it
17:47<ivo_>I'll report it
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17:47<themill>ivo_: Debian developers have all sorts of super powers, but mind reading and crystal ball gazing don't tend to be amongst them. If they don't know there's a problem and a particular way of fixing it, it definitely won't get fixed.
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17:50<dpkg>Debian stable does not always include all the software people need or want so there is much official, semi-official, and non-official software available for stable. See . Ask me about <security>, <installer firmware>, <backports>, <squeeze-updates>, <multimedia>, <non-free>, <contrib>, <emdebian>, <debian live>. See also <grounding>, <social contract>.
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17:50<dpkg>Before asking in here or on the <debian-user> mailing list, you should read the Installation Guide, or if you already have Debian installed, the Debian Reference. Ask me about <ig>, <overview>, <reference>, <refcard>, <docs>, <manuals>, <fundamentals>, <newbiedoc>, <faq>, <unix lessons>, <general cli tutorial> (e.g. in your IRC client, type /msg dpkg reference).
17:50<dpkg>The Debian Reference will answer most of your questions about Debian. The latest version (v2) is at . Read it after installing Debian and before asking for support, as it is the closest thing Debian has to a manual. You can install this too, the package name is debian-reference: 'aptitude install debian-reference'
17:50<weasel>dpkg: tell dabir about selftell
17:50<jhutchins_lt>ivo_: Bugs are marked as incomplete when there isn't enough information in the bug report for anybody to work on.
17:51<dabir>sorry :p
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17:54<ivo_>so the bug is reported to alsa-base
17:55<ivo_>if you need any help
17:55<ivo_>email me
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17:59<ivo_>if you need some more information or the Audiocard for testing
17:59<ivo_>email me
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18:00<Myon>ivo_: #628172 is totally useless because it doesn't mention any details
18:00<ivo_>what details do you need
18:00<zimpee>Anyone can help mi? Why can't i switch to tty1 from X? Using gdm +xfce4. Latest ATI graphics driver installed. maybe it is that i had plymouth installed, but removed it.
18:01<ivo_>I try to be as general as possible
18:01<Myon>ivo_: if it was reported in other places, urls
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18:04<ivo_>just posted more info
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18:04<chealer>zimpee: well, what prevents you?
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18:06<zimpee>chealer, using ctrl+alt+F[n]. Screen goes black for a 12-15 secs, then it changes to X again. Currently logged in user gots dropped of, i get back my gdm logon screen.
18:06<ivo_>do you need more information?
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18:08<zimpee>chealer, some forum comments suggest that initramfs updating has to do stg with this, but no other clues, don't know where to start.
18:09<chealer>zimpee: uh, that's odd. sounds like trying to switch crashes X, no?
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18:09<zimpee>seems like, chealer. checking some logs right now.
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18:16<zimpee>in Xorg.0.log must (EE) error mean crush, or not?
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18:19<zimpee>"(EE) Screen 1 deleted because of no matching config section." is the first error in my Xorg.0.log
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18:27<jhutchins_lt>zimpee: Turn off kms
18:28<dpkg>Kernel Mode Setting (KMS) has graphical modes initialized by the Linux kernel instead of X. It is hardware dependent, introduced in Linux 2.6.29. Enabled via modprobe as of xserver-xorg-video-intel 2:2.9.1-2 and xserver-xorg-video-radeon 1:6.12.192-2. To disable, edit /etc/modprobe.d/{i915,radeon}-kms.conf or boot with the 'nomodeset' kernel command line parameter.
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18:31<ivo_>do you need more information on my bug?
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18:32<zimpee>jhutchins_lt, no result with nomodeset, i'll try it with conf editing
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18:35<zimpee>jhutchins_lt, edited the two conf files, now after boot i get black screen only, no ttys, no X. unable to operate.
18:35<zimpee>will reset it
18:36<tharkun>Gentlemen one stupid question. Did the config file format for isc-dhcp-server changes a lot from the dhcpd-server ones? I am reading the changelog but it does not mention anything about it
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18:40<chealer>zimpee: an error doesn't necessarily cause a crash, no. see the end of the log file
18:40<ivo_>A Skull Full of Maggots by Cannibal Corpse from Live Cannibalism
18:41<chealer>zimpee: oh, and if X is restarting, don't forget to look at the *old* log file (/var/log/Xorg.0.log.old)
18:42<zimpee>chealer, it is restarting, found my little segfault in log.old
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18:43<chealer>zimpee: cute. so yeah, that's presumably an X or other low-level bug
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18:44<zimpee>chealer, googlin' it right now, brb if i find any solutions
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18:45<arand>I'vee mounted a smb share by going to smb://address/share in nautilus, where does this show up in the filesystem?
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18:52<chealer>arand: are you sure that mounted the share?
18:53<arand>I was assuming it was, (I recall in uubnt it used to get placed under .gvfs) I guess it didn't actually then...
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18:58<zimpee>chealer, thanks for your help, seems like there is something with my switchable graphics system.
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19:04<nyov>ivo_: from your bugreport and the PPA link i gather that your kernel is 2.6.32 and someone had success using 2.6.34 or later. So maybe try getting a newer kernel
19:04<ivo_>I don't want to mess with stuff
19:04<ivo_>if I get the current stable kernel
19:05<ivo_>I wont be able to use the normal system update
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19:08<nyov>If it's from a deb repository, I don't see why not. But I can't tell you the best way to do so, since I don't know.
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19:08<ivo_>but when debian stable is released
19:09<nyov>I would just add the wheezy repo and pull in 2.6.38 from there
19:09<ivo_>only security updates are avaible as updates
19:09<ivo_>I need a stable system
19:09<chealer>zimpee: oh, switcheroo stuff or what?
19:09<nyov>i'm not saying to update your stuff, only get the kernel and purge wheezy from sources again
19:10<ivo_>this seems a little hacked
19:10<ivo_>just installing the kernel
19:10<grove>There's a 2.6.38 in backports, that's a lot easier
19:10<ivo_>from wheezy
19:10<nyov>I do it all the time ;) but right
19:10<ivo_>and than ...
19:10<nyov>grove: it is? must have missed it on my search then
19:11<ivo_>yeah I have work to do, I don't have time for this :)
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19:11<dpkg> (formerly is an official repository of <backports> for the current stable distribution, prepared by Debian developers. Read to enable and use. See also <bdo key> <bdo mirrors> <bdo contents> <bdo list> <bdo kernel> <bdo bugs> <bdo pinning> <backports-sloppy> <volatile>.
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19:11<ivo_>oh 10x for the backport
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19:11<themill>,kernels --release squeeze-backports
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19:11<judd>Available kernel versions are: squeeze-backports: 2.6.38-bpo.2-686 (2.6.38-3~bpo60+1)
19:12<zimpee>no chealer, don't use switcheroo. installed ATI Catalys, didn't do muh since then, last thing can cause this was installing plymouth, and removing it. Just for a try, switched my cards to internal intel, i can acces tty1 since then.
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19:17<flan>i installed apache2 and have firehol firewall installed and specifically told the firewall to not allow http serving through but it does... seems like a firewall problem but this is a simple firewall... if someone would like to look i'll pastebin it but could there possibly be another cause allowing http to be served around the firewall?
19:18<ivo_>nyov, 10x I am just updating
19:19<nyov>no problem, hope it helps
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19:44<flan>"qemuctl" when executed opens a window for a split second then disappears, leaving no messages in the terminal, any idea why? i just installed the package and did no tweaking of the binary
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19:55<flan>does anyone have any experience with qemuctl?
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20:05<bst>flan: probably no, by description only x86 PC emulator is suported, view homepage or read /usr/share/doc/qemuctl/README or man page
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20:45<DennisTheTiger>I'm trying to put a configuration directory for apache2 back in /etc through aptitude (yes, I have removed it to attempt to fix a problem), however I am having no luck. I have, indeed, asked dpkg about confmiss, but that seems to do nothing - I sitll don't have an /etc/apache2. How do I restore that directory?
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20:58<kenyon>DennisTheTiger: did you try aptitude reinstall apache2.2-common ?
21:02<DennisTheTiger>kenyon: No, I haven't. Is that where the configs are contained?
21:05<kenyon>DennisTheTiger: yes, try dpkg-query --search /etc/apache2 to see which package owns those files
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21:08<DennisTheTiger>kenyon: Thanks for the pointer...
21:08<DennisTheTiger>...heh, go fig. Thanks!
21:08<DennisTheTiger>!beer kenyon
21:08*dpkg deftly decants a fine Yuengling Lager for kenyon
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21:35<edbian>Is there something similar to Gentoo's rc-status command?
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22:51<nueces>hi all, I want to build a package for python2.4 on sid, and I want to know if there something better to pbuilder to do that or maybe something new
22:51<nueces>somebody can point me the right path?
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22:58<Sebastian>hey there, I'm looking for some info on what it means for a bug to be in "pending upload" state. Specifically I'm wondering about this signing-party bug:
22:59<Sebastian>Does pending upload mean the packager has to make a package containing the fix, or does it mean the package was made and uploaded somewhere but it needs to be put into the correct location for inclusion?
22:59<Sebastian>Thanks for your responses
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23:03<Gerowen>Is there a known issue with the latest Iceweasel update? Sometimes I'm unable to move my mouse over context menus such as when you right click or when you click the menu button. It only recently started.
23:03<kenyon>Sebastian: | pending: A solution to this bug has been found and an upload will be made soon.
23:04<Gerowen>Whenever I mouse over the context menus they just disappear. Right now it's fine, it's an intermittent issue that popped up after the last upgrade.
23:04<Sebastian>kenyon: thanks! Would it be considered appropriate to ping the bug report for an update then? or is > half a year still acceptable for soon?
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23:05<kenyon>Sebastian: I'd say that's acceptable.
23:05<Sebastian>ok, I'll go back to waiting then. Thanks
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23:07<nyov>nueces: I would be interested in the answer aswell -- are there alternatives to pbuilder? is buildd an alternative or for different use-cases?
23:08<kenyon>Sebastian: no, I mean it would be acceptable to ping. :(
23:08<kenyon>er :)
23:09<nyov>oh, I was too late. but question still stands :)
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23:11<Sebastian>kenyon: oh! ok
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23:17<strato_>2.6.38 is a little better
23:17<strato_>but stil not fine
23:18<nyov>strato_: ?
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23:19<nyov>oh, alright. I remember.
23:20*DennisTheTiger idly wonders if there is a suitable daemon for pop3s....
23:20<nyov>well it was worth a shot. if it's different, but still an issue, maybe update that bugreport.
23:21<Arrowmaster>nyov: there is sbuild but ive heard its a bit more complex to setup
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23:24<nyov>Arrowmaster: thanks, that description looks like buildd and sbuild go together?
23:24<Arrowmaster>yeah they are part of the same larger system
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23:30<JerrySpringer>Hi could someone help me set up my sound in Debian?
23:31<JerrySpringer>i dont know why it doesnt work the drivers should be installed by default
23:31<sney>what sound card?
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23:31<JerrySpringer>its a standard intel idt or something
23:32<sney>what's the output of lspci -nn |grep -i audio
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23:32<JerrySpringer>00:1b.0 Audio device [0403]: Intel Corporation N10/ICH 7 Family High Definition Audio Controller [8086:27d8] (rev 02)
23:32<linux-fox>hi ,everyone
23:32<sney>,pciid 8086:27d8
23:32<judd>[8086:27d8] is 'N10/ICH 7 Family High Definition Audio Controller' from 'Intel Corporation' with kernel module 'snd-hda-intel' in squeeze. See also and the out-of-tree 'snd-hda-intel' module.
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23:33<sney>JerrySpringer: is the module 'snd-hda-intel' loaded?
23:33<JerrySpringer>im not sure how do i check?
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23:34<sney>the command 'lsmod' shows all the loaded modules
23:34<JerrySpringer>snd_hda_codec_idt 35293 0
23:34<JerrySpringer>snd_hda_intel 16823 4
23:34<JerrySpringer>snd_hda_codec 46002 2 snd_hda_codec_idt,snd_hda_intel
23:34<JerrySpringer>there loaded
23:35<sney>ok. make sure you have alsa-utils installed, and run alsamixer
23:36<JerrySpringer>ok its running
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23:36<sney>JerrySpringer: ok, it probably looks something like this
23:36<sney>see on the far left column, how at the bottom it says MM?
23:37<sney>do any of your columns have MM in the same place?
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23:37<JerrySpringer>it says 00 on my master
23:38<nyov>then aplay should work I guess
23:38<sney>no MM anywhere? make sure the levels for stuff like PCM are raised
23:38<sney>nyov: if you want to take over be my guest
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23:38<nyov>sney: no, sorry :/
23:38<JerrySpringer>master and pcm are both raised to 100 but show 00 at the bottom
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23:39<sney>JerrySpringer: yeah, it only ever shows 00 for live or MM for mute
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23:40<JerrySpringer>so what could my problem be??
23:40<sney>as root, run this: aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav
23:41<JerrySpringer>doesnt play anything
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23:41<sney>should have been a couple seconds of static
23:41<JerrySpringer>Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 48000 Hz, Mono
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23:41<sney>but no output? hmm
23:41<sney>you're on Squeeze, right? Debian 6?
23:41<JerrySpringer>that was the output but no sound
23:42<sney>how new is this pc
23:42<JerrySpringer>with lxde
23:42<JerrySpringer>its a hp mini 110 the sound works out of the box on mint debian and ubuntu
23:43<sney>ok, 3 more things to try
23:43<sney>as root, run 'alsactl init' then try the aplay command again
23:43<JerrySpringer>Unknown hardware: "HDA-Intel" "IDT ID 7667" "HDA:111d7667,103c148a,00100105" "0x103c" "0x148a"
23:43<sney>it'll spit out a warning about using a guess method, that's normal for intel hda
23:44<JerrySpringer>oh ok, well still no sound
23:45<sney>ok. try alsa force-reload and then try it again
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23:46<JerrySpringer>still nothing
23:46<sney>alright. your alsa modules are too old for your sound device. it's not too uncommon. you have 2 options: you can rebuild alsa, or you can install a new kernel from backports. both are pretty easy and I'll give you instructions. your choice.
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23:46<JerrySpringer>it shut down my taskbar lol
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23:47<JerrySpringer>i guess rebuild the alsa modules?
23:48<sney>Ok, follow these instructions to install and prepare module-assistant:
23:48<sney>then the module you want it to build is called 'alsa-source'
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23:50<JerrySpringer>ok im trying now
23:53<nyov>sney: have you followed ivo_'s sound problem? Do you think rebuilding modules could help there, besides the bpo kernel? It didn't cross my mind
23:54<sney>nyov: the alsa modules included with 2.6.32 are slightly older than alsa-source
23:54<sney>so "rebuilding" is actually a very minor upgrade, and has restored sound to a few systems, all with intel hda
23:55<sney>it's not out of the question but I don't have any experience with the xonar so I couldn't say
23:56<nyov>ivo_: ok maybe that's worth a shot. If you'd like to follow sney's instructions
23:56<sney>if he's already on 2.6.38 it won't change anything
23:57<nyov>hm, alright
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23:58<sney>I mean, unless he built the alsa-source from sid... maybe
23:58<sney>judd: versions alsa-source
23:58<judd>Package alsa-source on i386 -- lenny: 1.0.17.dfsg-4; squeeze: 1.0.23+dfsg-2; sid: 1.0.23+dfsg-4; wheezy: 1.0.23+dfsg-4
23:58<sney>or not
23:58<nyov>my bad. of course, a bit sleepy here :)
23:59<sney>(alsa in the 2.6.32 tree is 1.0.21)
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---Logclosed Sat May 28 00:00:13 2011