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#debian IRC Logs for 2012-06-20

---Logopened Wed Jun 20 00:00:32 2012
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00:01<kristianpaul>Hello
00:02<pparadis>kristianpaul: hi
00:02<kristianpaul>What are the common reasons for not audio just after install debian?
00:02<kristianpaul>I already tried alsamizer and unmuted all playblacks for the two audio cards
00:03<pparadis>!tell kristianpaul about alsa checklist
00:03<kristianpaul>lsmod show some snd_hda relatedmodules
00:03<kristianpaul>1) already done
00:03<hayloo>usually after a netinstall i have to : aptitude install alsa and alsactl init
00:03<kristianpaul>ah same here (netinstall)
00:03<hayloo>you installed alsa?
00:04<hayloo>alsactl init should be all you need. hdmi is another story though
00:04<kristianpaul>no no hdmi no interested ;)
00:05<kristianpaul>already installed yes
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00:05<hayloo>you ran 'alsactl init' ?
00:06<hayloo>it needs to be done as root
00:06<kristianpaul>yes hayloo - http://paste.debian.net/175392/
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00:07<hayloo>you initiated your hdmi card
00:07<kristianpaul>ahh step 5, fails.. pparadis http://paste.debian.net/175394/
00:07<kristianpaul>hayloo: dont know..
00:07<hayloo> HDMI" "HDA:1002aa01 thats hdmi
00:08<kristianpaul>hmm
00:08<hayloo>aplay -l to see your audio devices
00:08<kristianpaul>card 0: Generic [HD-Audio Generic], device 3: HDMI 0 [HDMI 0]
00:08<kristianpaul>card 1: SB [HDA ATI SB], device 0: ALC269VB Analog [ALC269VB Analog]
00:09<hayloo>ok at least try: 'alsactl init 1'
00:09<hayloo>and i have no other ideas, im just a debian user
00:09<hayloo>for card 1
00:09<kristianpaul>you know more than me about sound anyway, Thanks !
00:09<kristianpaul>let see
00:10<kristianpaul>nah still not working
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00:11<pparadis>kristianpaul: please forgive me if i missed it before, but could you please pastebin this? "lspci -nn"
00:11<kristianpaul>my fault
00:11<kristianpaul>surew
00:12<kristianpaul>http://paste.debian.net/175395/
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00:14<kristianpaul>acording to lspci -k | grep HDA
00:14<kristianpaul>Kernel driver in use: snd_hda_intel
00:14<pparadis>kristianpaul: this may or may not be relevant, but you might wish to see the "Audio" section here --> http://wiki.debian.org/InstallingDebianOn/Thinkpad/X120e/Sid
00:16<kristianpaul>indeed lets see
00:16<pparadis>kristianpaul: what specific model computer do you have?
00:16<kristianpaul>hmm but model is not ideapad i bet
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00:18<hayloo>just please dont forget to 'alsactl init' to reset it from the 'alsactl init 1' command i asked you run
00:18<kristianpaul>yes yes
00:20<kristianpaul>hmm :-|
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00:33<matias_>que tristes que son los irc hoy en dia... en una epoca estaban de moda
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00:51<alchemist9>Evening all, I have a question.. does anyone know how to get a wacom tablet working with gpm?
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01:25<forestbird>SynrG: so... that paging fault issue... in the end I found out it was a zombie process that ate up all the cpu. that's why i couldn't find anything about it in top etc. powertop could identify the process...
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02:31<lightcap>does anyone know how ssh-agent starts automatically when forwarding is requested from a client on squeeze? (Not an x session, just a plain old shell login)
02:32<lightcap>ssh-agent doesn't show up in the process list, there's no SSH_AGENT_PID, etc. But, ssh-add -l on the remote box shows keys from the local machine.
02:32<lightcap>I'm baffled, and have been googling and digging around the system for most of the day.
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02:52<Sorana>hi
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02:52<pparadis>Sorana: hi
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03:01<rpetre>lightcap: env | grep SSH on the remote box
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03:02<rpetre>the server sets a socket that's forwarded to your machine
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03:02<lightcap>rpetre yeah I see the SSH_AUTH_SOCK
03:02<rpetre>i had a pretty neat agent forwarding explanation tucked somewhere, just a sec
03:02<lightcap>but I see *no* docs on sshd doing that
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03:03<lightcap>everything still seems old and outdated (i.e., prior to 5.x
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03:03<rpetre>lightcap: http://www.unixwiz.net/techtips/ssh-agent-forwarding.html
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03:03<pparadis>secret aaaaagent ssh, secret aaaaagent, i've given you a pubkey, and disable root logins. </bond>
03:03<rpetre>well, the mechanism is the same since forever (at least on my timescale)
03:04<pparadis>sorry, i've had a few drinks. i'll wander off now.
03:04<lightcap>thanks, read that earlier. Still don't see anything that says sshd will automatically start the agent
03:04<rpetre>it doesnt
03:04<rpetre>it uses yours
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03:04<rpetre>it just sets the environment so it captures calls for agent and forwards them in real-time to your agent
03:05<rpetre>all key requests in the remote machine are forwarded back (backwarded?) to the agent you started on your client
03:05<lightcap>rpetre hmm
03:05<lightcap>heh backwarded
03:05<rpetre>reat that explanation for a bit, it'll make sense at some point
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03:06<rpetre>pretty pictures help :)
03:06<lightcap>rpetre but I can add a new key on the remote using ssh-add
03:06<lightcap>that does *not* show up on the local
03:06<lightcap>(I think. I should try that)
03:06<rpetre>try :)
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03:08<lightcap>nope, you're right
03:08<lightcap>well shit, all this time I thought ssh-agent had to be running on both local and remote
03:08<rpetre>the agent stays only on your machine
03:09<rpetre>it works like some sort of DNAT for sockets
03:09<lightcap>right
03:09<lightcap>that makes more sense, not sure why I couldn't get it through my head all day.
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03:09<rpetre>be advised that while you're connected on the remote machine someone with your or root privileges can use the agent on your client
03:09<lightcap>crazy thing is I'd swear when I'd set this up years ago that I did it with agents on both machines
03:10<lightcap>but, it's likely that the agent on the remote just didn't do anything
03:10<rpetre>lightcap: i told you it'll click into place
03:10<lightcap>rpetre yeah, this is as trusted as any box could be I suppose.
03:10<lightcap>and it's better than having my private keys spread across the world
03:10<rpetre>just keep in mind that you should at least consider this before forwarding the agent
03:11<rpetre>yeap, that's the intent behind this design
03:11<lightcap>yup. it's not something I usually do, clearly :-)
03:11<lightcap>this is basically for a bastion host, which is sorta the perfect use case
03:11<rpetre>glad i helped :)
03:11<lightcap>yeah, thanks!
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03:29<kolesov>привет!
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04:38<SynrG>forestbird: ah, interesting
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06:53<rgms>Hi. I'm running wheezy and I'm having some problems with my sound. Whenever I start playing a sound apparently my amplifier loses the signal for a second. There's an "Linear PCM" indicator in my amp which goes off for a second whenever I start playing a sound. For example, if I test speakers I can hear the "left" but miss the beginning, "front". I'm using s/pdif out.
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06:54<rgms>there's no problem if I'm watching a movie, for instance, only the first split second.
06:55<rgms>I guess playing a "silent sound" would get rid of the problem since something would fed constantly
06:55<rpetre>wheezy got asthma, needs to catch his breath
06:55<rpetre> /joke
06:55<rgms>:--)
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06:57<rgms>ideas how too google for this kind of problem are welcome too :D
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06:59<rgms>if I run vlc with 0% volume on the background, the problem dissappears. Is the sound system "sleeping" or something?
06:59<valen>hello
06:59<valen>: )
07:00<rgms>greetings
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07:34<SynrG>rgms: please note this channel is for squeeze support; see #debian-next for wheezy/sid (as per channel topic)
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07:46<patryk007>hi
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07:48<Franzel>Can someone help me add a group to the ftp and ssh access to my debian machine....I know that #groupadd ftpusers will create a group ftpusers and #useradd franzel -p franzel -g ftpusers will add username franzel with pass franzel to the newly created group ftpusers. My question is, how can I add the group ftpusers to enable them to log in via ftp.
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07:54<patryk007>@Franzel - you propably need to configure FTP server
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07:55<patryk007>have you modified FTP config files?
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07:55<grammoboy>The application cannot be started.
07:55<grammoboy>A general error occurred while accessing your central configuration.
07:55<grammoboy>libreoffice doesn't start
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07:56<patryk007>@Franzel - from @useradd manual: "useradd is a low level utility for adding users. On Debian, administrators should usually use adduser(8) instead.
07:56<patryk007>"
07:56<Franzel>patryk007: I have not...but I am using proftpd http://www.proftpd.org/docs/howto/ConfigFile.html and am looking at the config file
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07:59<heikkila>Franzel, for openssh you may add "AllowGroups <groupname>" in /etc/ssh/sshd_config
08:00-!-mode/#debian [+l 522] by debhelper
08:00<heikkila>see man sshd_config
08:00<Franzel>thanks heikkila
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08:00<heikkila>np
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08:02<patryk007>after reconfiguring /etc/ssh/sshd_config and adding new group (useradd) propably u will need to restart your machine
08:02<patryk007>or at least your FTP/SSH deamon
08:02<Franzel>thanks patryk007 will keep that in mind
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08:09<heikkila>Franzel, now I'm not sure AllowGroups was your real problem, installing openssh-server should allow any (real) user to login via ssh, but if you want to stop some users from using ssh you can use AllowGroups
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08:11<Franzel>thanks heikkila I was trying to create a group allow them access to my /var/www/public_html/username
08:12<Franzel>above statement was for ftp and for ssh...just wanted to create a different login name access to root
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08:18<heikkila>Franzel, then you have to modify permissions for that folder with chgrp (or chown) and chmod. Apache (and probably other http servers) have a public_html directive for users, so a user can have the folder /home/username/public_html which translates to http://somedomain.com/~username/
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08:20<heikkila>Franzel, http://wiki.debian.org/LaMp
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08:31<KRAMMER>Hey :)
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08:57<Franzel>heikkila: thanks...just got done looking at the last link...especially the changegroup
08:58<perlwizard>the last step of debian installation prompts for various packages to install (ssh server, web server) etc. one of them (the last one) is something like "standard utilites". is there a way to install that outside of installer ?
09:00<nevyn>perlwizard: tasksel
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09:01<perlwizard>nevyn tasksel has all the things except that last one...
09:01<nevyn>hrm
09:02<perlwizard>basically I have a debian system that was installed from a netinst CD without access to network
09:03<perlwizard>I'm looking for some way to get the usual stuff on it
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09:04<nevyn>so... netinst pretty much requires access to a network
09:04<perlwizard>well yeah
09:04<nevyn>cd1 is a far better place to be for offline installs
09:04<nevyn>or dvd1
09:04<perlwizard>but at that point there were network problems
09:04<perlwizard>so it ended up being that way
09:04<perlwizard>I hope I can fix it and avoid reinstall
09:05<perlwizard>it boots well and aptitude updated too
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09:07<nevyn>ok...
09:07<sagar>!hi
09:07<dpkg>hello, sagar
09:07<nevyn>so network problems....
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09:15<mekt>Is there a way to: cause a program to be associated with a certain CPU on a multi-CPU computer? cause it to be run with certain priority, such as idle priority or niceness? These could be accomplished by writing wrapper scripts, but is there another way?
09:17<perlwizard>taskset, nice
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09:19<mekt>perlwizard: I mean so that it happens whenever it is run, not afterwards; and not by using a command line wrapper execute it.
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09:22<mekt>For GUI programs, maybe user '.desktop' files would take precedence over system ones and could be used instead of wrapper scripts. That still leaves many batch type CLI programs out.
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09:25<mekt>Something which worked through FS extended attributes or SE Linux could do the trick.
09:27<mekt>Or maybe OS-level virtualization or linux containers.
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09:31<mekt>Can CGroups accomplish that?
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10:40<mekt>If a CGroup can keep a program on a certain CPU, one could set the governor for that CPU to limit its speed at least.
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10:58<berto>hey, does anyone know what's wrong with the debian-devel digest?
10:58<berto>it's been malformed for a while
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11:06<cannedheat>Was wondering if /boot/config-3.2.0-2-amd64 file was the same config use to compile the Debian kernel. When doing it yourself it looks like .config
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11:07<cannedheat>Reason I ask is the compiler used in my kernel is newer then my gcc and I am having some diver problems. I need to compile my kernel with and older gcc
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11:08<paris>how to change ubuntu 12.4 to classic look?
11:08<blast007>!ubuntu
11:08<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian. Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu (irc.freenode.net) instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>.
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11:10<cannedheat>paris I got a huge oneliner to do that. I used this on a computer at the office and it was magic. Ill put in on pastbin
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11:11<cannedheat>paris http://pastebin.com/uM87q9jc for ubuntu 12.4 to make it "normal"
11:11<cannedheat>one line
11:11<paris_>how to change to classic look on ubuntu 12.4
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11:11<cannedheat>paris_ http://pastebin.com/uM87q9jc
11:11<devil>paris_: this is debian
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11:11<cannedheat>devil he knows they are retards over at #ubuntu
11:11<devil>and?
11:12<devil>why does he use an operating system with retards and then get clues elsewhere?
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11:13<cannedheat>true .. I did give him a url what would fix his system though
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11:13<ansgar>cannedheat: Insulting people for using a different operating system isn't really useful.
11:13<perlwizard>funny paste cannedheat
11:13<perlwizard>I'll save that
11:14<cannedheat>ansgar its not an insult if its the truth.
11:14<cannedheat>perlwizard =) funny thing is it works
11:15<ansgar>cannedheat: Repeating it doesn't make it true.
11:16<paris_>PS. maybe I am retarded, but I have tried to experiments with this OS, but it sound that Mint is more intuitive for me. Big thanks for your help.
11:16<rpetre>calling other people retards doesn't help your point, even if you might have a reason to dislike them
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11:16<cannedheat>ansgar yes one day a monkey will write Shakspeare. Until then its truth in my world.
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11:21<ansgar>cannedheat: Fine. Then just try to resist telling others too much about your world if it means insulting. Thanks.
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11:34<cannedheat>Reason I dont like Ubuntu is because Canonical is deliberately avoiding using the Linux word. Now they are going so far to say "Wr're not Linux". Let alone GNU/Linux. If you read under "new features" they called it "The Ubuntu kernel" but "on a PowerPC Ubuntu can be along side linux". That might work with a BSD license (you hear me Steve?!) but the GPL...really ...?
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11:35<themill>cannedheat: this has nothing to do with #debian.
11:35<cannedheat>true dat
11:36<sney>cannedheat: distribution chatter usually goes in #debian-offtopic
11:36<youlysses>sney: Was about to say this. Thanks.
11:37<sml>hi all. is it ok to connect different IPs to the same hub/switch? they seem to talk OK, but i've not seen it written anywhere NOT to do this
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11:38<sney>sml: different IPs? do you mean different subnets?
11:39<sney>hubs and switches are pretty dumb either way, they just forward the traffic
11:39<sml>like, connecting 192.168.1.2 and 192.168.2.1 to the same switch. works ok but will there be sideaffects?
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11:39<sney>depends on what your subnet mask is
11:40-!-mode/#debian [+l 525] by debhelper
11:40<sney>if it's 255.255.0.0 then that's fine, it's one huge ass subnet but it's fine
11:40<sml>i can connect 192.168.1.2 and 192.168.1.1 to a hub and also 192.168.2.1 and 192.168.2.2 , say, and those on the same network will be able to see each other. but in typical diagrams you'd see two switches and a router in between
11:40<sml>sney: yeah or use CIDR like you suggest
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11:40<sney>also this is not a debian question, maybe try in #networking on freenode
11:40<sml>sney: ah sorry yes
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11:43<kusanagi>why apt-get source --build package and apt-get download package does not generate the same .deb? isnt the .deb from download generated from the source? also, the package name (version included) is the same :s
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11:44<kusanagi>also, if i do a debdiff i can see that only versions on depend line changes and the installed-size (almost double, 328 vs 600)
11:45<themill>kusanagi: apt-get source will download from your deb-src lines; apt-get download will download from your deb lines. These may point at different releases.
11:46<kusanagi>themill they point to the same line, just deb changed for deb-src
11:46<themill>kusanagi: Even if they do point at the same release, the generated package will often have different timestamps or auto-generated filenames in it. The build can also differ depending on the packages you've got installed.
11:46<kusanagi>the name of the package generated is exactly the same
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11:47<kusanagi>the changes are the versions on the depends line and the size-installed
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11:47<themill>what package is this btw?
11:47<kusanagi>so the depends line is autogenerated with the versions i have installed?
11:47<kusanagi>tilda
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11:48<themill>Versions in depends are often automatically calculated based on the functions used in the libraries and can even vary depending on the compiler used.
11:48<kusanagi>i see
11:49<kusanagi>i didnt know they could be generated from functions used... what program is in charge of such magic?
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11:51<kusanagi>the installed-size form the one compiled got reduced to half :ooo
11:51<themill>dpkg-shlibdeps
11:51<themill>It would be useful to look at specifically what files changed
11:52<themill>you could run "dpkg-deb -c $package | awk '{printf "%11s %12s %7s %s\n", $1, $2, $3, $6}' | sort -k4 > foo.files" on each .deb and compare the output to get a better overview
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11:52<kusanagi>wow, dpkg-shlibdeps is a nice idea
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11:53<kaizoku>I'm installing a debian testing weekly build on my new laptop (with windows 7) that uses GPT and UEFI. However during the grub install it says that no other OS was found and is asking if GRUB should be installed in the MBR. What is the correct way to have both system co-exist peacefully?
11:54<sney>grub should be installed in the mbr anyway. when you boot back into debian, make sure os-prober is installed, and run update-grub again. it should detect windows and add it to the list
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11:55<kusanagi>themill, it seems to be the main executable :) no suprise, since is the only executable :D
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11:55<albertsh>Install GRUB to the partition, then run "dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/tmp/boot bs=446 count=1"
11:56<albertsh>copy /tmp/boot onto your NTFS partition with some meaningful name, e.g. grub-bs.img
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11:56<chealer>kaizoku: which Debian architecture are you installing?
11:56<kaizoku>chealer: amd64
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11:56<kusanagi>thank you themill !
11:56<albertsh>boot into Windows 7, and use some BCD editor to add C:\grub-bs.img to the boot menu
11:56<themill>I wouldn't have been surprised if autogenerated stuff were different too. If you're building under wheezy or sid now, it's certainly being built with a different version of gcc and possibly different compiler options
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11:57<albertsh>(if you prefer using Win7's boot menu, anyway)
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11:57<chealer>kaizoku: on amd64, you **should** get your other operating systems as choices after the installation despite the prompt. see http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Today for more information
11:58<kaizoku>sney you're saying to the mbr, albertsh you're saying partition.... which is the correct?
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11:59<albertsh>Both are correct, but I'm worried that your grub won't pick up the Windows partitions.
11:59<albertsh>If that occurs, you can add the entry manually later on.
11:59<chealer>kaizoku: if you have a real problem, just come ask here. I'd appreciate if you'd report your results here in any case.
11:59<sney>kaizoku: try my method first as it's the debian way. albertsh is suggesting more of a workaround
12:00<kaizoku>ok, installing to the MBR it is
12:00<sney>kaizoku: was your network connection working during the install?
12:01<sney>I think os-prober might not be included on certain cd1
12:01<kaizoku>installed to the MBR, ready to "finish the installation"
12:01<kaizoku>sney: yes it was. And I'm using KDE cd.
12:02<kaizoku>it's there on the image... but I don't know if it's installed or not
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12:08<kaizoku>chealer, sney: it didn't work. after the system rebooted and I get a "bios/uefi" error... "reboot and select proper boot device or insert boot media in selected boot device and press a key" So I get back to the laptop bios/uefi and select the boot device from dvd to windows (it specifically says Windows Boot Manager (P0: hdd_drive_model_number)
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12:10<kaizoku>maybe the partition in the HDD for the UEFI needs to be hammered somehow
12:12<chealer>kaizoku: OK, thanks for reporting but I don't know about that problem. it looks like UEFI stuff indeed.
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12:12<chealer>maybe you should talk to #debian-boot
12:13<kaizoku>chealer: the debian testing images come with grub2, they should also include grub-uefi
12:13<kaizoku>thanks I'll try there as well
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12:23<Antibody>hello, is this a support channel?
12:24<heikkila>yes
12:24<retrospectacus>Antibody: yes for Debian
12:24<Antibody>i have a curious issue on my debian squeeze box. When I run "tar -xvf file.tar" I get: bash:untar command not found
12:25<Antibody>i tried posting on forum, but perhaps i wasnt communicating well
12:25<retrospectacus>Antibody: apt-get install tar
12:25<Antibody>tar is already the newest version.
12:25<retrospectacus>but you'd think it would have it... maybe your PATH is broken
12:25<Antibody>tar is fine
12:26<Antibody>its untar thats the error
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12:26<Antibody>which tar
12:26<Antibody>/bin/tar
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12:26<retrospectacus>it's only when you use -x then
12:26<Antibody>correct
12:26*themill would use "type" not "which"
12:26<Antibody>tar is /bin/tar
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12:26<Antibody>thanks thewanderer
12:26<Antibody>themill*
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12:28<Antibody>so tar cvf works
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12:29<Antibody>but tar xvf throws a missing untar command. the only existance of untar that i can find is in /etc/bash_completion.d/tar and its an alias
12:29<Antibody>tried aptitude --reinstall install tar
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12:30<Antibody>can anyone else determine how their untar command is created/aliased or see if they have the same behavior on squeeze
12:31*retrospectacus sees no trace of any "untar" on his squeezebox
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12:32<themill>Antibody: can you please pastebin the command and exact output for us? the output of "stat yourarchive.tar" and "file yourarchive.tar" would be interesting too. Use somewhere like http://paste.debian.net/
12:34<haylo>Antibody, 'man tar' it has a lot of options
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12:34<Antibody>haylo: i'm not caught up on options, but missing untar functionality
12:34-!-magnetic_ [~magnetic@212.199.178.162.static.012.net.il] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:34<Antibody>themill: will do
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12:34<haylo>i dont know if there is an untar honestly. you use tar to tar and untar
12:35<Antibody>i have been, using tar xvf
12:35<haylo>yes exactly
12:35<Antibody>^ calls untar
12:35<Antibody>when -x specified
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12:36<SynrG>sounds fishy to me. 'debsums tar'
12:36<haylo>you really are a fast learner Antibody
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12:37<haylo>tar both creates and "untars" files. if its an alias for untar, then its a very very common alias
12:37<haylo>hence why you can find "untar"
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12:40<Antibody>hmmm, it after two days... it seems to be working
12:40<Antibody>sorry for taking your time
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12:40<Antibody>idk what i would have done other than update
12:41<themill>Antibody: opened a new terminal?
12:41<Antibody>perhaps between updates or maybe the reinstall of tar worked
12:41<SynrG>Antibody: updated your packages? you did not 'debsums tar' first?
12:41<Antibody>themill: no, its just over ssh, but even new sessions didnt chance the behavior yesterday
12:41<Antibody>as root or normal user, same issue
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12:42<Antibody>SynrG: i dont have debsums installed
12:42<SynrG>so?
12:42<Antibody>no, i didnt not debsums it first
12:42<themill>debsums and etckeeper are the first things that get installed on new boxes around here...
12:42<SynrG>anyway, it's too late now
12:42<haylo>Antibody, tar has confused me before as well. Thats why i know
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12:43<Antibody>i've never had issues with tar in the past, it was just when i was tar xvf (no gzip) and getting untar not found
12:43<SynrG>if the problem was that your tar wasn't the real tar, but rather a compromised tar, debsums would be used to determine this (unless debsums is compromised)
12:43<Antibody>seems like some file is getting sourced correctly now
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12:43<Antibody>so debsums and etckeeper
12:43<Antibody>i'll take a look
12:43<SynrG>'sourced'? i am not sure what that has to do with tar, which is a binary
12:44<Antibody>tar always worked fine
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12:44<Antibody>but afaik, tar -x calls untar which is an alias set from /etc/bash_completion.d/tar
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12:44<SynrG>another diagnostic, if you thought your shell was interfering somehow would be to specify the full path to tar
12:44<Antibody>^ good idea
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12:44<SynrG>13:44 < Antibody> but afaik, tar -x calls untar which is an alias set from /etc/bash_completion.d/tar
12:44<SynrG>^^^ absolutely wrong
12:45<haylo>i think maybe you are looking into it in the wrong way
12:45<Antibody>oh?
12:45<haylo>yes thats what everyone is saying
12:45<themill>Antibody: tar doesn't call untar, at least not unless you'd made some funny alias or script that replaced tar
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12:45<Antibody>so what would explain why tar -c works, but tar -x did not
12:45<SynrG>Antibody: what you see in bash completion is a local variable called 'untar' which contains the untarring commandline options
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12:45<Antibody>and why was i getting untar not found, when running tar xvf
12:45<haylo>Antibody, you never manned tar
12:46<retrospectacus>there is no such thing as "untar"
12:46<Antibody>i was never calling untar
12:46<Antibody>always always using tar -xvf
12:46<Antibody>but, it was returning the untar not found
12:46<Antibody>when running tar xvf
12:46<themill>haylo: there was nothing wrong with Antibody's use of "tar ..." here.
12:47<Antibody>i'm getting confused. perhaps i'm missing something
12:47<Antibody>if i run tar xvf filename
12:47<haylo>well the whole "untar " concept is what im refering to
12:47<retrospectacus>Antibody: it would seem you have a broken/modified executable /bin/tar... hence debsums
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12:47<Antibody>retrospectacus: yes
12:47<SynrG>Antibody, themill: hence my line of inquiry about integrity of the tar package.
12:47<Antibody>SynrG: correct
12:47<themill>SynrG: I predict an alias.
12:47<SynrG>or that. which could be determined specifying a full path
12:47<Antibody>i believe if tar -x does not ever call an alias untar
12:48<Antibody>then my bin was somehow wrong
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12:48<Antibody>and perhaps an update fixed that
12:48<SynrG>highly unlikely
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12:48<SynrG>unlikely that there was an alias ... fixed by an update, i mean
12:48<Antibody>SynrG: well, the date stamp on tar is sep 22 2010, so yah, probably not
12:49<SynrG>the alias would need to be something strange *you* had done
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12:49<Antibody>yet, i had not created any aliases on this machine
12:49<Antibody>no bashrc or bash_profile changes whatsoever
12:49<SynrG>so unless you added crap to /etc/profile or some such and then said "y" (notice the default is "n") to accept the maintainer's version ...
12:49<SynrG>there's no way i can see that an update would fix it
12:49<haylo>i think that you just ran the command incorrectly actually
12:49<SynrG>it's not the sort of thing "just upgrading" would fix
12:50<haylo>if it works now- then that says alot
12:50<retrospectacus>if there was an alias, ''type tar'' would not have said tar is /bin/tar
12:50<themill>yeah, that's why I asked for type to begin with. But the problem was also solved by the
12:50<themill>n
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12:50<Antibody>ok ok, i see now
12:50<Antibody>sometimes, you just have to feel stupid to learn
12:50<Antibody>history|grep tar
12:50<Antibody>found this
12:51<Antibody>537 untar -xvf cms.migrate.tar
12:51<Antibody>^ issue
12:51<Antibody>so, all for nothing and I made a mistake
12:51<retrospectacus>dpkg: pal Antibody
12:51*dpkg points at Antibody and laughs uproariously
12:51*Antibody joins retrospectacus
12:51<themill>Antibody: that's why we always want to see the exact command and the output in a pastebin :)
12:51<Antibody>themill: when preparing to pastebin, i couldnt recreate
12:52<themill>yep
12:52<retrospectacus>that's very common
12:52<Antibody>i'm sorry guys.
12:52<Antibody>can that one be my freebie?
12:52<Antibody>i'll be back for a real issue next time
12:52<retrospectacus>issues magically fix themselves when trying to explain thoroughly
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12:52*Antibody admits stupidity
12:52<retrospectacus>Next time is $2 per line
12:52<Antibody>o!
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12:57<Antibody>well, thanks for helping me find out i was wrong. i'm going to let myself out now
12:58<retrospectacus>joking. We need a harder one next time tho!
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13:26<jchau>will a debian samba box that is joined to a Windows active directory, work wherein the samba box is also NIS client. The problem I am seeing is that `id username` will return the ActiveDirectory values rathen than the NIS value. Does this setup work?
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13:44<piero>I'm having a terrible headache trying to do make the sound works throught the hdmi cable. Everything works fine on another OS (ms win), but even if hdmi output is selected in gnome-shell, nothing can be heard.. The hdmi port is from my ati radeon video card. Thanks for help
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13:45<It9001>piero: Have you installed any drivers for your ATI card?
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13:45<piero>It9001, nothing.. I'm using the default X driver for video..
13:46<piero>gnome_shell fail to launch with the proprietary ati driver
13:46<It9001>hmm
13:46<towo`>in debian stable, the kernel is to old fpr hdmi with radeon
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13:47<It9001>that's a point, you could always update the kernal
13:47-!-el_erno [~el_erno@201.141.87.71] has joined #debian
13:47<piero>but Im using the testing release
13:47<It9001>hmm
13:47<piero>everything is up to date
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13:48<towo`>piero, cat /proc/asound/cards shows hdmi up?
13:49-!-janos_ [~janos@95.180.68.238] has joined #debian
13:49<towo`>and btw, no one knows your craphics card
13:49<towo`>s/c/g
13:50-!-mode/#debian [+l 535] by debhelper
13:50<piero>towo`, I think it does.. http://pastebin.com/btAeQWUB
13:50<It9001>i use the X support for my Ati Radeon HD 5xxx series
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13:50<towo`>piero, you use pulseaudio?
13:50<piero>my card is: 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI Turks [Radeon HD 6670]
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13:51<piero>yes
13:51<It9001>Ati Radeon HD 6670
13:51<It9001>xorg support for that card is not so great..
13:51<towo`>it works basicly
13:51*piero sad..
13:51<towo`>better would be a kernel 3.3 or 3.4
13:51<piero>hm
13:52<It9001>suppose so, it's still a fairly new card though
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13:52<towo`>but this has nothing to do with audio via hdmi
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13:53<towo`>i would get rid of pulseaudio and make hdmi as card 0 (= default)
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13:57<piero>alsa is using only snd_hda_intel module.. is this not a signal?
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13:59<TA_>bonjour
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14:00<TA_>Quelqu'un saurait-il m'aider s'il-vous-plaît ?
14:00<amphi>!fr
14:00<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr. Francophone users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr.
14:01<TA_>thanks
14:02*daemonkeeper could have sworn that was Klingon.
14:02<towo`>piero, snd_hda_intel is even the modul for the hdmi
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14:04<It9001>how do i get to the russian debian channel? It's for one of my friends
14:04<piero>how the sound get by pci bus throught the video card in the hdmi port ? which hardware processes are necessary to do it?
14:05<amphi>!ru
14:05<dpkg>Это английскоговорящий канал, пожалуйста, говорите по-английски или посетите #debian-russian (Russian speakers please go to #debian-russian)
14:05<It9001>cheers
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14:07<piero>Im downloading linux 3.4, but I dont think it will solve the problem.. any more ideas?
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14:20<piero>I think its important to say I have two monitors
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14:21<amphi>important enough for two channels, eh? ;)
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14:48<marcfp>hello
14:48<marcfp>does somebody know how i can install python-appindicator in debian wheezy ?
14:49<marcfp>i try to find at my sources.list with apt-cache search and apt-file, without any kind of result
14:49-!-kyconquers_ [~kyconquer@70-89-155-57-amigo-vino-wa.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #debian
14:49<marcfp>i'm trying to install gsharkdown 0.7.0, and i need this package
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14:49<towo`>python-appindicator is not in testing at the moment
14:49<marcfp>towo`: is not in testing at this moment ?
14:49<engla>marcfp: http://packages.qa.debian.org/liba/libappindicator.html
14:50<engla>appindicator is very new in debian
14:50<retrospectacus>,versions python-appindicator
14:50<judd>Package: python-appindicator on i386 -- sid: 0.4.92-2
14:50<retrospectacus>,checkbackport python-appindicator
14:50<judd>Backporting package python-appindicator in sid→squeeze/i386: unsatisfiable build dependencies: Build-Depends: libgtk-3-dev (>= 2.91.3), libindicator-dev (>= 0.3.90), libindicator3-dev (>= 0.3.90), libdbusmenu-glib-dev (>= 0.5.90), libdbusmenu-gtk-dev (>= 0.5.90), libdbusmenu-gtk3-dev (>= 0.5.90), gir1.2-glib-2.0, gir1.2-gtk-2.0, gir1.2-gtk-3.0, valac-0.16.
14:51<engla>marcfp: as you can see (my link), it enters wheezy in approx 1 day
14:51<engla>marcfp: so you can install it from unstable or wait
14:51<retrospectacus>you should be able to backport it to wheezy but not squeeze
14:51<marcfp>engla: mmmm
14:51<marcfp>what will you do in my state ?
14:51-!-r2d2 [~r2d2@p5DC1DA8E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #debian
14:52<engla>I'd try to install it from unstable.. provided it doesn't pull in lots of other unstable stuff
14:52-!-r2d2 [~r2d2@p5DC1DA8E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
14:52<engla>since you're on wheezy
14:52<marcfp>mmm
14:52<retrospectacus>ah
14:52-!-tesrryt [~Anon@95.211.10.3] has joined #debian
14:52<retrospectacus>marcfp: /msg dpkg tum
14:53-!-alephnull [~alok@122.167.170.141] has joined #debian
14:53<retrospectacus>(Testing/Unstable Mix) ...that should work
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14:53<marcfp>uops!!!
14:53<marcfp>retrospectacus: you are as geek ;)
14:54<marcfp>thank's a lot for all to all of us ;)
14:54<marcfp>ups
14:54<marcfp>of you :S sorry
14:54<retrospectacus>ahm.. you're welcome ?
14:54<rodrigo_br_root>olá
14:54<rodrigo_br_root>hellop mi name is rodrigo
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14:54<marcfp>retrospectacus: my name is marc xD
14:54<retrospectacus>rodrigo_br_root: Hi. Do you have a debian question?
14:54<rodrigo_br_root>im from Brasil (Brazil)
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14:55<marcfp>ps
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14:56<rodrigo_br_root>one minute I will use my translator to elaborate on the issue
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15:01<TA_>rodrigo_br_root, speak portuguese i understand it
15:01<retrospectacus>TA_: no. English only here
15:01<retrospectacus>there is a portuguese channel for that
15:01<retrospectacus>!pt
15:01<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
15:01<TA_>kk
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15:01<marcfp>~i don't have good luck
15:02<retrospectacus>you two are welcome to go there and speak PT :)
15:02<marcfp>gsharkdown doesn't run
15:02<retrospectacus>marcfp: we don't support "gsharkdown" but if you can explain the issue in terms of debian packages maybe we can help
15:03<marcfp>retrospectacus: i know :)
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15:04<marcfp>retrospectacus: gsharkdown is builded into python, and have and a graphical window, but well, when i execute ghsharkdown, the program doesn't start graphical window
15:04<retrospectacus>means nothing
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15:14<rodrigo_br_root>Olá TA
15:14<rodrigo_br_root>falemos em portugues entao
15:14<rodrigo_br_root>cara, eu uso gnu a um tempo mas como servidor da minha empres
15:14<rodrigo_br_root>cara, eu uso gnu a um tempo mas como servidor da minha empresa
15:15<engla>rodrigo_br_root: hay #debian-br pa ajuda em portugues
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15:16<jake-netbook>can somone help me?
15:16<retrospectacus>dunno
15:17<jake-netbook>i cant login to my router
15:17<retrospectacus>do you have a debian question?
15:17<rodrigo_br_root>po, obrigado cara!
15:17<jake-netbook>well sort of
15:17<jake-netbook>i am using debian
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15:17<jake-netbook>but cant acsess my router
15:18<jake-netbook>can u help?
15:18<retrospectacus>that does not sound like a debian problem
15:18<jake-netbook>can you still please help
15:18<jake-netbook>?
15:18<jake-netbook>i cant find help anywhere else
15:18-!-TA_ [~TA_@bny92-5-82-232-56-79.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Ping timeout]
15:19<retrospectacus>jake-netbook: well you haven't described any issue, except you don't know how to access your router. That's not something anyone can help you with
15:19<jake-netbook>i use the router ip and all it says is connection failed
15:19<jake-netbook>but i know for sure it is the correct up
15:19<jake-netbook>'ip
15:19<retrospectacus>does that IP appear when you run ''/sbin/route -n'' ?
15:19<jake-netbook>i get the up in windows
15:20<jake-netbook>in cmd
15:20<jake-netbook>it is the same in both
15:20-!-majlo [~majlo@79-139-92-170.rzeszow.hypnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
15:20<jake-netbook>yes i just ran it and it is the same
15:20<jake-netbook>192.168.7.254
15:21<jake-netbook>it is listed under gateway
15:21<retrospectacus>ok good
15:21<jake-netbook>but when i type it in a webbrowser it wont load the page
15:21<jake-netbook>it says connection reset
15:22<jake-netbook>i have tried restarting the router
15:22<retrospectacus>try https?
15:22<jake-netbook>ok
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15:22<jake-netbook>brb
15:23-!-x3x [~x3x@ip70-188-59-200.rn.hr.cox.net] has joined #debian
15:23<jake-netbook>no it did not work
15:23-!-sakal [~sakal@88.84.213.199] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:23<jake-netbook>any other ideas
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15:24<retrospectacus>consult the documentation for the router
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15:24<jake-netbook>i dont have it anymre lol
15:24<retrospectacus>that is hilarious
15:24<x3x>i was told that xorg.conf was no longer used, so how would i get the 'nv' driver to work, or any of the nvidia related ones?
15:24<jake-netbook>but i really need to login
15:25<jake-netbook>ugghhhh
15:25<retrospectacus>!tell x3x about xorg.conf.d
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15:26<x3x>ah ok, thanks
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15:31<ergalvao>Hi guys, what should I use to list all packages installed on my machine (Squeeze)? Can't find a related command or option on apt-get
15:31<tesrryt>is their a difference from testing and wheezy when configuring sources.list?
15:31<retrospectacus>tesrryt: "testing" will still be "testing" when wheezy becomes stable
15:31<retrospectacus>ergalvao: dpkg -l
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15:32<ergalvao>retrospectacus: awesome, thanks! :)
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15:33<retrospectacus>ergalvao: the packages are installed if "ii" appears at the start of the line
15:33<tesrryt>retrospectacus, ok I see cool. I have converted this system which is basicly custom put together from squeeze into wheezy/ testing my list is http://pastebin.com/DtWdE5mZ Everything is done good then after adding deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free it gets the updates and then errors on install immedietly with Could not perform immediate configuration on 'phonon-backend-vlc'., checked some bug reports but ive yet to get around this
15:33<retrospectacus>ergalvao: if it says "rc" it has been removed (but configurations still exist)
15:34<ergalvao>retrospectacus: This is perfect
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15:34<retrospectacus>tesrryt: unknown Paste ID, and never combine stable and testing!
15:35<tesrryt>retrospectacus, well I was on 3.2 not stable http://pastebin.com/ZzFPxTDt
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15:36<retrospectacus>tesrryt: you have a cb line... that is definitely not supported
15:36<retrospectacus>also dmm vlc is broken iirc
15:36<ergalvao>retrospectacus: June one other thing, is there a way to list only what was installed after Debian installation?
15:36<retrospectacus>ergalvao: pardon?
15:37<retrospectacus>how can there be anything installed before debian installation?
15:37<ergalvao>oh, sorry! s/before/after/
15:37<ergalvao>lol
15:37<retrospectacus>...you said after
15:37<ergalvao>oh, I see what you mean
15:37<blast007>probably means software that was not part of the base install
15:37<tesrryt>retrospectacus, I do, that was a mess up, thx for catching it. Umm but my apt error isnt coming from that bc i updated with it but ima remove it now
15:38<ergalvao>yes, blast007, exactly
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15:39<retrospectacus>ergalvao: well you can read hmm /var/log/dpkg.log I guess
15:39<tesrryt>retrospectacus, Do I have everything else right that I need?
15:39<retrospectacus>if it goes back far enough
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15:40<retrospectacus>tesrryt: I guess... I forget what your problem was... vlc something? It's broken in DMM, I said
15:41<tesrryt>Could not perform immediate configuration on 'phonon-backend-vlc' during dist-upgrade after adding deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free
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15:41<ergalvao>retrospectacus: It doesn't, but I'm guessing /var/log/dpkg.log.4.gz holds what I need :)
15:41<retrospectacus>ergalvao: zless /var/log/dpkg.log.4.gz
15:42<themill>!immediate configuration
15:42<dpkg>When upgrading from squeeze to wheezy, apt may stop with "E: Could not perform immediate configuration on '$package'." Fixing this is quite difficult and will take time... if $package isn't an Essential package, then "dpkg -r $package; apt-get -f install" will often be enough to solve the problem. If "dpkg -r" complains about dependencies, consider adding "--force-depends".
15:42<tesrryt>holy crap retrospectacus I think that solved it when u found my sources list issue
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15:42<ergalvao>retrospectacus: Perfect :)
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15:42<retrospectacus>tesrryt: the crunchbang entry? Well yeah that's insanity right there
15:42<themill>tesrryt: ^^ use that with phonon-backend-vlc and phonon. Also, use a mirror that's close to you rather than ftp.d.o
15:42<ergalvao>Didn't knew about zless, thank you for that also
15:43<retrospectacus>sure :)
15:43<tesrryt>no same error
15:44<tesrryt>reviewing what dpkg posted
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15:51<tesrryt>Would like to understand apt-get safe-upgrade, I tried to run this and it ran for 11hours before I stopped it just counting opening and closing packages.
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15:53<drhouse123>tesrryt: hmm I have same now :)
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15:53<memo>hi
15:53<drhouse123>memo: hi
15:54<memo>how are you .?
15:54<memo>any body speak arbic here ?
15:54<drhouse123>memo: I'm fine
15:54<drhouse123>memo: no sure about
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15:55<tesrryt>drhouse123, yes its proving to be a very difficult situation without wiping out the system
15:55<memo>Oh!
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15:55<drhouse123>tesrryt: omg, when it will stop counting...
15:56<sney_>tesrryt: safe-upgrade tends to do that when you mix branches that should never ever be mixed. it's punishing you, basically
15:56<tesrryt>drhouse123, oh no my upgrade error. but that counting thing have no idea! From what I knew it was same as dist-upgrade via research just only upgrade things with safe Dependants
15:57<sney_>full-upgrade is the same as dist-upgrade (essentially).
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15:58<tesrryt>sney, well I was taking a squeeze testing up to current testing
15:59<sney_>so you should be running aptitude full-upgrade or apt-get dist-upgrade for that task. safe-upgrade will just try to resolve dependencies forever. it's fighting battles with at least 3 different major transitions when it should just be replacing everything
16:00<drhouse123>tesrryt: it seems, doing aptitude full-upgrade started fine - there are small conflicts
16:00<themill>tesrryt: aptitude doesn't handle enormous upgrades very well; safe-upgrade is the wrong thing to be doing when you're trying to squeeze->wheezy.
16:00<tesrryt>I have done that and one deb list is holding dist-upgrade up the phonon-backend-vlc could not configure
16:00<sney_>purge everything related to vlc, do your upgrade, then install vlc again
16:02<drhouse123>tesrryt: aptitude full-upgrade does removing only that for me http://pastebin.com/qWVwGeFZ
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16:03<tesrryt>sney, same issue and cant install vlc bc of unment depends. if aptitude cant handle the large kernel update is their another method besides reinstalling the iso and letting it erase my old system setup
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16:05<themill>tesrryt: please pastebin real output. I don't think anyone understands what you have or haven't done.
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16:05<retrospectacus>!bat
16:05<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
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16:06<themill>(what dpkg and I said about immediate configuration for vlc works quite well)
16:06<tesrryt>themill, http://pastebin.com/E22CJm9K
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16:08<drhouse123>tesrryt: what aptitude said for that ?
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16:09<retrospectacus>tesrryt: ummm are you trying to "upgrade" from crunchbang to wheezy?
16:09<tesrryt>retrospectacus, no squeeze
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16:10<tesrryt>retrospectacus, its a very pieced together custom install its a deb kernel that ended with kde
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16:11<tesrryt>my cache policies http://pastebin.com/a0jxMpEe
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16:16<retrospectacus>I ain't touching that mess tesrryt, you've got CB and ubuntu and who knows what
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16:17<tesrryt>retrospectacus, thats just some i2p stuff
16:18<retrospectacus>gl hf
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16:20<abrotman>it's offtopic here
16:20<abrotman>what a mess of sources ..
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16:22<tesrryt>its pretty clean here. Was a amazing solid squeeze. Just getting messy trying to solve the error from going into wheezy
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16:23<Vulix>Hello everyone
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16:24<craigevil>no need to mess with ubuntu repos to use i2p, just download and run it nothing to install
16:24<Vulix>Is Debian Wheezy stable enough to run as a main OS at this moment?
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16:24<ompaul>!frankendebian
16:25<dpkg>When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. See if you can convince #linux to help.
16:25<sney_>ooh, I didn't know about that one
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16:26<ompaul>Vulix: no and yes, if you are willing to deal with ALL problems that it throws at you then kind of, if not, and you lack experience then no
16:26<sney_>Vulix: I trust it. some things are still incomplete, though, and I wouldn't if you need fglrx
16:26<tesrryt>craigevil, it was for a different vs then the download one I was working on something its irrelivant to the issue
16:27<Vulix>No gnome-shell on squeeze, right?
16:27<sney_>right.
16:27<chealer>Vulix: it depends on the hands you put it in and on the needs, but it's getting more stable
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16:28<Vulix>ah alright, ty
16:28<tesrryt>dpkg, I understand, my only point on it is that it is a documented deb bug and my kernals streight gnudeb. things tested for fun and removed should not matter.
16:28<dpkg>tesrryt: what are you talking about?
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16:28<kop>!tell Vulix about overview
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16:48<malik>hi all can anyone help me please on installing ATI Radeon 9600 Drivers on ubuntu 11.04
16:49<retrospectacus>!ubuntuirc malik
16:49<dpkg>malik: This is not the Ubuntu help channel. Please do /server irc.freenode.net and then /join #ubuntu. If you are using XChat, you can right-click the following link and choose connect. irc://irc.freenode.net/ubuntu
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16:59<canaima>hola
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16:59<canaima>hola dodo
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17:03<dodo_>hola
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17:18<qpr>help! I accidentally deleted my top panel - restored it to what it was before except the network manager icon/drop down menu. How can I get it back? (just using the gnome network manager, not wicd)
17:18<retrospectacus>added "notification area" applet?
17:19<qpr>not that one
17:19<retrospectacus>nm applet goes in there
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17:19<qpr>that did the trick! thank you!!
17:20<qpr>easy stuff this debian :)
17:20<retrospectacus>you're welcome :)
17:20<qpr>this was probably one of the easiest help questions today :)
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17:23<houms>is this the only way to get audio to bluetooth headset http://wiki.debian.org/Bluetooth/Alsa
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17:55<rgms>Hi. Is there a way to enable the non-free repository before installing debian?
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17:56<hocuspocus>Hi
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17:59<retrospectacus>rgms: you might be able to by editing sources.list from TTY2 at a certain point during installation... but why?
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18:00<retrospectacus>I don't think the installer would install anything from non-free anyways
18:00<pparadis>rgms: i'm on board with the "why" part, but i guess you could also preseed that with http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Preseed/EditIso
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18:01<pparadis>yeah, it shouldn't even install anything from non-free during a standard install anyhow.
18:01<rgms>not even drivers?
18:01<retrospectacus>you may be interested in <installer firmware>
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18:01<pparadis>yepper, or if your real problem is dealing with wireless drivers during an install, it would be much easier to simply install using a wired connection and then get the wireless working afterward.
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18:02<pparadis>rgms: what are you trying to do?
18:02<rgms>well basically just that
18:02<rgms>actually I did this earlier today already
18:02<rgms>and I've had problems on my desktop too
18:02-!-Holborn [~holborn@170.Red-88-26-182.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit []
18:02<rgms>I just wouldn't want to run into the problem again
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18:05<retrospectacus>!firmware images
18:05<dpkg>Unofficial <netinst> images - containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages - for installing Squeeze are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/ . See also <install guide>. http://deb.li/3tGse
18:05<retrospectacus>rgms: that might be what you want
18:05<rgms>sounds about right!
18:05<Vulix>I'm considering switching from Mandriva to Debian...is gnome-shell pretty easy to get on Squeeze, or not really advised yet?
18:05<rgms>Thanks for the help :)
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18:05<retrospectacus>Vulix: squeeze backports has gnome-shell I think
18:05<retrospectacus>,versions gnome-shell
18:05<judd>Package: gnome-shell on i386 -- wheezy: 3.4.1-5; sid: 3.4.1-7
18:06<retrospectacus>no?
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18:06<Vulix>sid = stable?
18:06<pparadis>oh god no
18:06<rgms>:)
18:06<engla>Vulix: sid an unstable are synonymous
18:06<pparadis>!tell Vulix about releases
18:07<Vulix>ty
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18:08<Vulix>http://wiki.debian.org/GnomeShell Is this current?
18:08<pparadis>GnomeShell (last edited 2012-06-09 11:08:08 by JPierreGiraud)
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18:18<Vulix>hm, so wheezy is not stable enough for everyday use?
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18:19<pparadis>Vulix: if you want stable, run stable. many people run wheezy (testing) every day, but some things may (probably will) break from time. sid (unstable) is for the highly adventurous who don't mind routinely fixing stuff that breaks.
18:20<houms>what is the proper way to install pulseaudio to replace alsa?
18:20<Vulix>Hm I wanted to use stable but it seems pointless to try and throw gnome 3 on it and hope everything holds
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18:22<dondelelcaro>Vulix: it depends what you are using it for
18:22<dondelelcaro>Vulix: but in general, if you need to ask, you should use stable
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18:24<pparadis>!tell houms about pulse
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18:32<x3x>whats a good alternative to Flash if you're using Chromium?
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18:32<Vulix>How do I download wheezy?
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18:34<retrospectacus>Vulix: you should install squeeze and then upgrade to wheezy
18:34<Vulix>Thanks
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18:38<Vulix>Well, I guess I will give wheezy a try now that Mandriva is folding and Mageia is buggy
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19:37<Rimbem>Slut
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19:37<tamaska>?
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19:46<Vulix>Should i expect catastrophic failures from testing or just minor bumps?
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19:51<abrotman>at this point, point at wheezy, it'll be minor mostly
19:52<abrotman>like, gnome3 plugins mysteriously not working
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19:52<abrotman>(i hvaen't really looked into why they don't work)O
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19:54<Vulix>hm is upgrading from squeeze pretty easy? never tried debian before
19:55<abrotman>!tell Vulix about squeeze->wheezy
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20:00<Vulix>Hm debating if its worth using as a primary os for now
20:00<abrotman>i use it as mine .. but i've been using Debian for a long time
20:01<retrospectacus>me too, and on all my servers, laptop, eeepc... stable though
20:02*pparadis likes the stability of stable, as it provides a stable platform for enhancing the stability of his computing endeavors.
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20:04<abrotman>my netbook is still squeeze, but that's because i haven't used it lately
20:04<abrotman>the mac mini is .. who knows
20:04<Vulix>i really just want gnome-shell from wheezy, blegh
20:04<abrotman>i think wheezy at this point
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20:04<pparadis>abrotman: safe to say "!macosx" ;)
20:04<abrotman>Vulix: yeah, if it's that big of a deal, use wheezy
20:05<abrotman>pparadis: it runs Debian, thanks though :)
20:05<pparadis>hehe
20:06<chealer>Vulix: how much experience do you have with GNU/Linux?
20:07<chealer>Vulix: there are apparently important upgrade bugs remaining. unless you already have squeeze installed, I'd recommend installing wheezy directly
20:07<Vulix>ive used it on and off since 2001
20:07<Vulix>but never really debian based distros
20:07<abrotman>chealer: did the unbreak the installer yet?
20:08<Vulix>how do you install wheezy directly? I thought the only path was an upgrade
20:08<abrotman>Vulix: the best way is the upgrade
20:08<sney_>the wheezy installer is apparently a lot more reliable now
20:08<chealer>Vulix: well, I started using testing after using Mandrake as my main OS for 7 months, and I never went back or anywhere else since then (although I did hit lots of problems)
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20:09<Vulix>im coming from drake as well actually
20:09<chealer>Vulix: see http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
20:09<Vulix>specifically, mageia
20:10<Vulix>So upgrade or straight install of wheezy?
20:10<abrotman>should be the same end result .. your call
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20:11<Vulix>current snapshot a better bet than the may 12th release?
20:11<sney_>if you go the upgrade route, don't install any big tasks until after you upgrade.
20:11<sney_>dunno, check the errata - should be linked on that page
20:11<chealer>(...but then, I guess I would come here for help at the beginning, and there were helpful here like abrotman helping with some.)
20:12<chealer>(...which is why I'm still here 8 years later :-) )
20:12<Vulix>Yes I really do appreciate the help =)
20:12<chealer>Vulix: maybe, but not necessarily
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20:16<chealer>abrotman: the grave bug in apt was fixed, although there's still a serious bug with GRUB ( http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Today )
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20:16<chealer>it's usable, when you're aware of the bug
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21:26<Vulix>Does wheezy automatically pick up the drivers for the Intel HD 3000 (comes with Intel core i series)
21:28<engla>define pick up
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21:29<Vulix>does it work out of box
21:29<Vulix>I think it will now that im looking into it, newer kernel should support it
21:29<engla>I think it does, don't know which packages are installed by default make sure you install xserver-xorg-video-intel and you'll be fine
21:30<engla>linux 3.2's support has been great for intel gen 6 graphics
21:30<Vulix>im really hoping wheezy is stable enough for everyday use
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21:32<mercutio22>Vulix: I've been using it everyday since its inception
21:32<mercutio22>and no problemo so far
21:32<Vulix>Great to hear
21:32<Vulix>I'm using Mageia right now..it's alright but not really finished, soem parts of it are unstable
21:36<mercutio22>Vulix: I just love debian. Welcome aboard.
21:36<Vulix>=)
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21:38<youlysses>Vulix: Intel is REALLY good with driver support. :-)
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21:39<Vulix>yeah im figuring its just the kernel version in squeeze
21:40<Vulix>is there a projected date wheezy goes stable?
21:41<youlysses>"When it's ready." :-)
21:42<mercutio22>Vulix: you know ubuntu? Debian testing is way more stable then ubuntu which used by the most linux users. So you should feel very safe with wheezy.
21:42<abrotman>Vulix: it's supposed to freeze very soon, then you have the period where they fix the RC bugs
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21:42<youlysses>It's not to far off, but really if your system is not "misson critical" testing will be good for you 9/10.
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21:42<abrotman>if it's mission critical, you shouldn't be using testing
21:43<youlysses>abrotman: Did I not phrase this well? That's what I meant.
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21:46<rdovr2011>Hi all my Debian friends
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23:50<Vulix>hm what cd is gnome on the wheezy install..
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23:59<Vulix>screw it ill get the dvd
---Logclosed Thu Jun 21 00:00:36 2012