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#debian IRC Logs for 2013-07-26

---Logopened Fri Jul 26 00:00:26 2013
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00:01<delirium>Anyone seen an issue Debian Wheezy with VLC muting itself and other programs. Killing the pulseaudio process and restarting it makes it work for other applications...
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00:35<fcrs>delirium: there was a debian bug where two pulseaudio processes would be started, a system wide one and another for the desktop user, and this could cause no sound every once in a while, killing and restarting pulseaudio would temporarily fix it
00:36<delirium>fcrs would that have shown multiple pulse audio listings with a "ps" ?
00:37<fcrs>i believe so, yes
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00:37<fcrs>with different owners
00:37<geopete123>it does appear that debian and ubuntu binaries may be the easiest in some situations
00:38<geopete123>it looks like some packages do not want to build properly after upgrading system and tcltk libs
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00:39<delirium>interesting though, not seeing multiple versions of pulse audio running. Just tried installing the vlc-plugin-pulse but that didn't seem to do the trick either
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00:40<jm_>doesn't PA have its own test buttons/tools? does that work?
00:40<srini>custom based distribution for Raspberry pi in debian
00:40<geopete123>it looks like upgrading some things to fix one package in some cases breaks another package
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00:40<delirium>jm_ not sure, been using alsamixer, aumix, vlc and exaile to test the audio
00:41<geopete123>all you need is aplay and a wav file ...or cat and an au file
00:41<fcrs>do you have /etc/asound.conf configured, it's referenced in a few pulseaudio tutorials
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00:41<geopete123>just try aplay filename.wav...and see if you get any sound
00:41<delirium>no /etc/asound.conf
00:42<delirium>I can get sound from everything I've tried besides VLC
00:42<geopete123>well i have not built vlc to test it yet...i cant even build libreoffice
00:43<geopete123>it seems like your machine must have 512M or more to try to build libreoffice...and i dont' know why that is the case
00:44<geopete123>some people say let the upstream people handle it
00:45<geopete123>or just do without it
00:45<fcrs>configuring asound.conf tells alsa to route sound through pulseaudio, and prevents apps that try to use alsa directly from monopolizing the sound card and preventing PA from using it
00:47<geopete123>it boggles the mind why you have to have 512M just to work on libreoffice...why can't they make use of swap space during compilations
00:47<delirium>Looking into asound now. Just downloaded a test wav file to try with aplay and that seemed to fail.
00:47<fcrs>in vlc, i've got PA as one of the choices for sound "output module", are you using that?
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00:48<geopete123>aplay did not play any sound...what are your alsamixer settings
00:48<delirium>yep tried the preference > audio > output module. Tried every type :)
00:49<delirium>One thing to note, vlc did work yesterday. (new system build been alive for a few days)
00:49<jm_>delirium: try vlc --verbose=2
00:49<geopete123>delirium...what about cat > /dev/pcm
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00:50<geopete123>do you have /dev/pcm
00:50<geopete123>did your kernel build produce it
00:51<delirium>no /dev/pcm
00:51<geopete123>oh..well you do not have a kernel build for oss drivers
00:51<geopete123>but you may have one for alsa drivers
00:52<geopete123>im still trying to figure out why 512M is necessary and why you can't make up for it with swap space
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00:54<delirium>Neat vlc --verbose=2 came up with some pulse audio output debug info. It looks like its trying to play off of my video card!
00:55<jm_>wait, if it's using PA then PA should decide which card to use
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00:55<geopete123>ok i will try a vlc build and see what you are talking about
00:58<geopete123>but it might take a few days
00:58<SamB>delirium: that would certainly explain your problem
00:59<SamB>the crazy thing is that playing sound on your videocard can actually make sense nowadays ...
01:00<delirium>hopefully I'm reading that right reading the output, will dink around for a bit with this
01:00<geopete123>i am just glad i can finally see and hear those doggone flash files we are supposed to complete
01:01<geopete123>and i am really taking a break after that mess
01:03<geopete123>and i only have one nonencryped cd to test vlc with so i really don't bother with stuff like that...but i will look at it to see if audio works on the one cd that i have
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01:04<geopete123>and i have one encryped dvd to test windows platforms with
01:04<SamB>wait, CDs can be encrypted now?
01:04<delirium>Yay! I have noise in VLC. after reading the --verbose=2 I was able to switch the output module to alsa and force the audio through my sound card to the port my headphones are plugged in. Did get an audio play back error with two devices open.
01:04<SamB>that doesn't sound like redbook to me ...
01:05<geopete123>SamB..well i don't buy any new stuff.because they started that DMCA crap with DRM stuff
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01:05<geopete123>SamB...they made it where you can't even hack a playstation3 to play non-protected stuff
01:05<geopete123>SamB..with that DMCA crap
01:06<SamB>if a CD refused to play, I would be all "this is not CDDA!" and demand a full refund plus a consulting fee
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01:07<geopete123> i just don't buy any new stuff...i just watch get a feel for what is going on
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01:08<SamB>does CSS still count as an effective measure?
01:08<geopete123>SamB because of that DMCA protection against DRM violation
01:09<geopete123>SamB...any DRM effort is protected by that damn DMCA crap
01:09<jm_>well you can buy cd-s as mp3 tracks or flac (but that costs more)
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01:10<SamB>can you seriously not buy genuine CDDA anymore?
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01:11<jm_>i'm sure you can
01:12<geopete123> can't even hack a playstation3 because of that DMCA crap
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01:16<geopete123>SamB ...and now some bastards have been putting TPM modules in mobos and computers
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01:16<geopete123>SamB...where it is now illegal to hack that shit!!!!
01:17<geopete123>SamB ..because of the DMCA
01:17<SamB>I heard TPM modules could be used for evil or good
01:18<geopete123>SamB...well they keep you from just scoping the data lines to see what data is being transferred...because of some damn encryption shit protected by the DMCA
01:18<geopete123>SamB..the bastards don't even want you to know what data is on the bus
01:19<SamB>just avoid the software that supports using TPM for DRM and I guess you'll be fine ...
01:20<geopete123>SamB...on your own damn machine if you buy one of those pieces of shit!!!
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01:20*themill searches for the user support aspect
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01:22<geopete123> is not about playing someone elses is about being deprived of knowing what data is travelling on your bus...of a machine you paid for!
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01:23<SamB>well I think it's actually useful for cryptoprocessing
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01:24<SamB>like, to store keys to use for YOUR purposes
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01:27<geopete123> it is there because the bastards want to pass secret data with some propietary operating system...and don't want you to know what the hell is going on
01:28<SamB>regardless of why it is there, cryptoprocessing can be for evil or good
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01:38<geopete123>SamB...regardless? effect of it being there is that people won't have a clue what is going on with the BLACK BOXES/VOODOO MAGIC they purchase!!!
01:38<geopete123>SamB...they can't even scope the data lines on the bus
01:38<geopete123> make any sense of it
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01:41<geopete123> deprives the owner of understanding their tools
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01:42<SamB>geopete123: hey, at least on Linux drm means something else ;-)
01:42<geopete123>SamB...really...well the DMCA protects any DRM...linux or is pure shit!!!
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01:43<SamB>I really don't think the DMCA has much to say about direct rendering
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01:44<geopete123>SamB...well if that rendering technology doesn't want competition...they may use a Rights Management procedure on it and then it would be protected by the DMCA
01:45<geopete123>SamB..but i do understand your comment that DRM stands for more than just rights management
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01:47<geopete123>just like MI can stand for monkey island, or military intelligence..etc
01:49<geopete123>my that it doesn't progress to a situation where it takes a signed kernel to boot the hardware...and then even worse the signed kernel wont let any programs run unless each of them are signed...and who is going to be the signing authority?
01:50<geopete123>and how much will have to be paid to such an authority?
01:51<geopete123>and if people refuse to pay...will they be prevented from booting anything else?
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01:53<SamB>hmm, yes, there are some ... issues with trusted boot ...
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02:28<sky>Does anyone know the best Video Converter software? I have some .ogm files that need to be converted so I can put them on a USB drive and play them on my Home Theatre System.
02:29<SamB>you realize that .ogm doesn't actually say much about what you've got right
02:29<themill>avconv tends to be a good swiss army knife
02:30<jm_>I used mencoder when I needed to convert stuff
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02:30<fcrs>all three are just front-ends to libavcodec right?
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02:31<themill>(especially since ffmpeg isn't in debian)
02:31<stderr>avconv is the new version of ffmpeg as far as I know.
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02:32<fcrs>debian switched from ffmpeg to avconv but both are active projects
02:35<stderr>Oh, I thought it was the same program, just a new name.
02:35<fcrs>it's a fork
02:35<murak>Good morning! I have a noob question about setting the resolution in openbox. Is it fine if I ask it here or is there a better channel for that?
02:36<fcrs>it's probably almost exactly the same
02:37<stderr>fcrs: Even compiled on the same second. :-)
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02:40<schichtleiter>Hi, is it possible to boot from lvm+raid5 without a seperate boot partition with wheezy and grub2?
02:40<jm_>!tell murak -about ask
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02:51<murak>I want to change the resolution on PiBang Linux for the RaspberryPi. It outputs 1080p to my monitor wich is correct, however I would like to try 720p to see if it will make the system more responsive. Thank you!
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02:52<jmcnaught>schichtleiter: i saw some ways to do it on google when i was helping someone with raid the other night.. i think my search term was "root on raid" or similar
02:52<Raposa>i'm having problems to install downverter
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02:53<Raposa>someone pleas teachme to install downverter
02:54<jm_>murak: we only support debian here
02:54<themill>murak: you need to ask the pibang people. (or perhaps the raspbian people). We can only support debian in #debian
02:54<Raposa>yes i'm using debian
02:54<Raposa>the problem is with debian
02:55<Raposa>the problem is noto the softwere, is just in debian that dosen't work
02:55<murak>Ok, thanks! bb
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02:56<SamB>Raposa: worry not, those comments were addressed to someone else
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03:02<chris429>Hello, I am having trouble setting up WIFI on my laptop. I think it has to do with the firmware.
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03:04<jmcnaught>Raposa: i don't know about downverter, but the odd time i've need to download a video from youtube i've used the unplug add-on for firefox. there's a beta version which fixes a bug if you're having trouble using the "save as" method (it can also integrate with a download manger like flashgot
03:05<dpkg>Support for your wireless LAN device is dependent on the chipset within. Don't know what you have? Ask me about <what's my wireless>. Atheros: <atheros>; Atmel: <atmel>; Broadcom: <broadcom>; Intel: <intel>; Intersil: <prism>; Marvell: <marvell>; Ralink: <ralink>; Realtek: <realtek>; TI: <acx-mac80211>; VIA: <vt665x>; ZyDAS: <zydas>. See also <crda>, <killswitch>, <wpa>.
03:05<chris429><what's my wireless>
03:06<dpkg>Support for your wireless LAN device is dependent on the chipset within. Don't know what you have? Ask me about <what's my wireless>. Atheros: <atheros>; Atmel: <atmel>; Broadcom: <broadcom>; Intel: <intel>; Intersil: <prism>; Marvell: <marvell>; Ralink: <ralink>; Realtek: <realtek>; TI: <acx-mac80211>; VIA: <vt665x>; ZyDAS: <zydas>. See also <crda>, <killswitch>, <wpa>.
03:06<Supaplex>chris429: try /query dpkg what's my wireless
03:07<chris429>ty Supaplex
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03:11<chris429>does anyone know a way to send every window the "close" or "kill" signal?
03:12<jm_>no, not anyone does - but more to the point, define every window
03:12<Raposa>thankś flash got is working here
03:12<chris429>often times I just log out and log in when I have too many windows open, but it would be nice to setup a button or icon that did it in one hot
03:12<schichtleiter>Just if anyone else is wondering, booting from raid5+lvm works flawlessly in wheezy. It didnt work at first because i only had a root partition bigger than 2TB, so the BIOS couldn't work with it. I created a logical boot volume with a size o 1GB in lvm and it booted flawlessly.
03:13<chris429>jm_, often times I will have a bunch of browsers and terminals open and file manager windows, that's what I mean by windows
03:13<jm_>chris429: which browser are you using?
03:14<chris429>i am not talking about tabs
03:14<Stummi>chris429, sending the "close" to every window is part of your WM. See if it has a feature for this
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03:14<Stummi>and sending "kill" to windows isn't possible since windows are not processes
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03:16<chris429>Stummi, how does the Super+D command minimize all windows
03:17<jm_>chris429: if you want to ungracefully kill it you can use xkill command, in combination with xlsclients, but it's probably better to send them SIGTERM
03:17<Stummi>it doesn't here. As already said i think your WM does this
03:18<kanliot>alt+prntscrn, alt+k
03:18<kanliot>kills X11
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03:20<chris429>so after alt-k I could enter startx?
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03:21<chris429>that might work, i would just have to be more careful about saving my work
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03:21<Stummi>your DM probably will restart x itself after it got killed
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03:21<themill>why do the words "data loss" come to mind here
03:21<jm_>ctrl-alt-backspace terminates X server, but a) it might be disabled by default, b) think twice about using it :)
03:22<chris429>alright I have a lot more to read about now, thanks all
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03:22<Stummi>how did we come from "how to close windows" to "how to kill the x server"?
03:22<kanliot>hmm did i connec my reset button to my motherboard.... i better test that
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03:23<jm_>he mentioned so after alt-k I could enter startx?
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03:25<schichtleiter>Does anyone know the right way to install third-party network drivers? If i just follow the procedure from, the driver gets overwritten with every kernel upgrade, so i have to manually reinstall it everytime or i will have no network.
03:25<schichtleiter>The card definitely doesnt work with drivers from the firmware-realtek package...
03:26<jm_>schichtleiter: which card?
03:27<schichtleiter>jm_: just a sec
03:27<schichtleiter>Realtek RTL8111E
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03:28<jm_>schichtleiter: doesn't this work with r8169 driver?
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03:28<jm_>note that most desktop cards don't need a firmware, despite you seeing it searching for one
03:28<kanliot>i have an 8111e/8169 it's a pain in the ass on the old kernels
03:28<jm_>ahh so he needs a newer kernel?
03:29<kanliot>that ^ or he can blacklist the broken driver
03:29<jm_>I have old 8111 and no issues with it it ever
03:29<themill>(realtek seems to specialise in being a pain)
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03:29<kanliot>i actually tried to install the realtek module but didn't get very far along in the administration
03:29<jm_>well there are now newer kernels in backports
03:29<jm_>judd kernels
03:29<judd>Available kernel versions are: experimental: 3.10-rc7-686-pae (3.10~rc7-1~exp1); sid: 3.10-1-686-pae (3.10.1-1); jessie: 3.9-1-686-pae (3.9.8-1); wheezy-backports: 3.9-0.bpo.1-686-pae (3.9.6-1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-4-686-pae (3.2.46-1); squeeze-backports: 3.2.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.2.46-1~bpo60+1); squeeze: 2.6.32-5-686 (2.6.32-48squeeze3)
03:29<snogglethorpe>hm,, wasn't realtek always the "cheapo option for checklist support of some feature"?
03:30<snogglethorpe>"chips for cheapskates"
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03:30<kanliot>don't bash realtek it was the option on my $60 motherboard and im running at 4.2 ghz
03:30<schichtleiter>i had a really nice intel card in the sys, but i borrowed it to someone T_T
03:30<jm_>the other ones I had were worse so I prefer realtek
03:31<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or for pics. Use for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>.
03:32<schichtleiter>here the persistent-net rules and the output from ifconfig after installation of firmware-realtek...
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03:33<schichtleiter>didnt copy the whole line - fixed:
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03:35<jm_>seems to me it works, but is not configured
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03:37<schichtleiter>dmesg on boot tells me the link is down, which it definitely is not
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03:38<jm_>just try with a newer kernel
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03:38<jm_>and I also see link down first (several times), before it shows link up
03:38<jm_>so that's normal
03:39<Stummi>ifconfig says its up
03:39<jm_>that's not showing the same thing
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03:40<schichtleiter>allow-hotplug eth0
03:40<schichtleiter>iface eth0 inet dhcp
03:40<schichtleiter>this is the configuration in network/interfaces
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03:42<jm_>does it work if you use 'ifup eth0' manually?
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03:43<schichtleiter>interface already configured
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03:44<kanliot>jm_, or whomever wanted to close a bunch of windows you should install xdotool and do a man xdotool
03:44<schichtleiter>another interesting dmesg line: r8169 0000:04:00.0: firmware: agent loaded rtl_nic/rtl8168e-2.fw into memory
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03:44<schichtleiter>shouldnt it be using the rtl8169 fw?
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03:45<kanliot>if it works it works
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03:45<jm_>kanliot: I've used xte in the past for such tasks
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03:46<schichtleiter>i think i will just buy another intel card for 20euro
03:47<schichtleiter>not worth the pain...
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03:48<schichtleiter>are all intel NICs well-supported?
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03:49<Stummi>schichtleiter, what says "dhclient -v eth0"?
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03:51<schichtleiter>No DHCPOFFERS received.
03:51<schichtleiter>No working leases in persistent database - sleeping.
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04:00<jm_>schichtleiter: did kernel ever report link up for it?
04:00<schichtleiter>jm_: nope
04:01<jm_>schichtleiter: perhaps try 3.9 kernel from backports then
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04:03<schichtleiter>jm_: is it stable? after all, this is my fileserver...
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04:04<jm_>schichtleiter: works fine for me at home
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04:49<prem_>what is the best way to join a debian wheezy client to Samba4 DC
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05:33<sneam>any body here
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05:34<stdhell>sneam: No. You're all alone...
05:34<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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05:45<klevin>hello guys
05:46<klevin>a question please
05:46<klevin>where to apply for server administrator linux
05:46<klevin>does any one know?
05:46<klevin>also volontary just to learn
05:46<kanliot>install debeian klevin
05:47<SynrG>are you talking about applying for accreditation? that's rather off-topic for here.
05:47<klevin>tryied all kind of server,
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05:47<klevin>ftp, samba, email etc
05:47<klevin>just need to have where to apply and to get involved more
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05:48<kanliot>just ask klevin
05:48<kanliot>be specific
05:48<klevin>does anyone require a parttime or fulltime assitant for linux servers adminisdtrator?
05:48<klevin>if is with salary, god if not not a problem
05:49<klevin>more specific than that? :D
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05:49<SynrG>i see. this is not the appropriate place for that. that's not a support question.
05:49<klevin>where should i ask? i know i am sorry
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05:51<Rudde>Where do I find a list of all OFTC servers?
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05:52<stdhell>Rudde: Google is your friend.
05:52<Rudde>Yea I found that
05:52<Rudde>but I have a hard time beliving thats all of them
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05:53<SynrG>and see #oftc, not here
05:53<mongrol>google is noones friend
05:53<stdhell>If you have support requests regarding the operation of the network please stop by #oftc or email
05:53<mongrol>startpage might be your friend
05:53<SynrG>(nice circular reference, btw ... links back to the home page, which links to the FAQ, which lands you back here :)
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05:54<stdhell>Recursive: See recursive.
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05:56<Rudde>Okey, relax guys :P
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05:56<geopete123> you mean this thing is still connected? it goin on like donkey kong.
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06:03<SynrG>greetings. do you have a debian support question?
06:04<martins>I do. Is this the right place to ask?
06:05<martins>Somehow i messed up the network manager. I have and in syslog
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06:07<geopete123>now just try to figure out why no one is allowed to build libreoffice without 512M ram...and why it is only for upstream..
06:08<SynrG>martins: that's ... interesting :)
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06:09<geopete123>SynrG..i know...its puzzling...why we are not allowed to use swap in lieu of 512M ram
06:09<martins>No really, i messed round with upgrading installing/uninstalling gnome/gdm and now have this.
06:09<martins>maybe i can try reinstalling everything?
06:10<geopete123>well you got into a mess with network manager?
06:10<martins>I did
06:10<geopete123>martins..yea..that is always an option
06:10<geopete123>martins..what did you push..that got you in a pickle.
06:11<martins>can someone please give me a list of packages? everything gnome related i guess?? reinstalling just the network manager doesn't solve it
06:11<lastwill>Does anyone know the reason of the addition of libjpeg8 to oldstable (aka squeeze)?
06:11<SynrG>martins: is that waking up after a suspend?
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06:12<martins>SynrG: ? is that pointed towards me? i'm not sure i understand you
06:12<SynrG>martins: googling the error message shows you are not alone (reports from several people across several distributions) but i have yet to see an answer for why the error occurs or what its significance is.
06:12<lastwill>I don't see any security announce on the mailing-list.
06:12<SynrG>martins: do the errors occur when you wake the computer up from a suspend.
06:13<martins>let me check
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06:13<musca>,v libjpeg8
06:13<judd>Package: libjpeg8 on i386 -- squeeze: 8b-1; jessie: 8d-1; sid: 8d-1; wheezy: 8d-1
06:13<SynrG>martins: what i'm trying to find out is if it is specifically related to suspend. if it occurs in all cases, then whether or not it happens after a suspend is, of course, not relevant.
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06:14<martins>I don't see a suspend option, only sleep.
06:15<SynrG>same thing
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06:15<martins>It's dekstop btw
06:15<SynrG>martins: if you did *not* suspend prior to the errors occurring, that's all i needed to know
06:15<musca>lastwill: ^ this means that there is no new version since the freeze of wheezy, and the version in squeeze is even older.
06:15<martins>SynrG: i didn't
06:15<SynrG>martins: i won't bother following that lead, then
06:16<SynrG>martins: did it work before? if so, what changed since then?
06:16<geopete123>martins..there are some reports that network manager interferes with dhcpcd on some distros..and needs an upstream correction.
06:16<geopete123> it may not be your fault
06:16<lastwill>musca: I'm wondering why should I update squeeze to libjpeg8 since the default is libjpeg62.
06:17<martins>no i had my hdd crash, reinstalled stable, upgraded testing
06:17<martins>added multiarch
06:17<martins>somehow it removed some of the packages
06:17<stdhell>lastwill: Some programs uses libjpeg62, some 7 and some 8. All 3 versions are in squeeze.
06:18<geopete123>martins..well you really don't want to mess with testing unless you are ready to deal with headaches.
06:18<musca>,v libjpeg62
06:18<judd>Package: libjpeg62 on i386 -- squeeze: 6b1-1; jessie: 6b1-3; sid: 6b1-3; wheezy: 6b1-3
06:18<martins>geopete123: im using testing for like 3 years
06:18<geopete123>martins..yes but now look what occurred
06:19<SynrG>martins: not sure if the warning in even is related to the problem you're experiencing so let's start at the beginning
06:19<lastwill>stdhell: Do you mean the last update of opendjk needs libjpeg8. That's what I suspected first.
06:19<geopete123> have to be ready for bugs...if you want to mess with testing.
06:19<stdhell>No idea, I don't use java.
06:19<SynrG>martins: are you connecting via ethernet or wireless?
06:19<martins>i have the network
06:19<martins>just it says it's "Not managed"
06:20<martins>i can't turn it off for instance
06:20<SynrG>martins: well, there's no problem with that.
06:20<SynrG>this is the default.
06:20<martins>i can add vpn connections, but can't connect to anything
06:20<SynrG>after a fresh install, ethernet should be managed by /etc/network/interfaces
06:20<SynrG>if you don't like that default, simply do not put any eth0 stanza in /etc/network/interfaces
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06:20<martins>oh, so that's normal?
06:21<SynrG>(assuming you're connecting via ethernet)
06:21<SynrG>this is the hazard of pasting error messages and not explaining what behaviour you're actually observing that you want us to solve :p
06:21<stdhell>lastwill: Try aptitude why libjpeg62 and aptitude why libjpeg8 (and maybe 7 too)
06:21<lastwill>stdhell: I don't use Java too but it looks like mandatory for some software...
06:21<SynrG>and it was sloppy of me not to ask.
06:21<martins>what about getting when trying to connect to vpn?
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06:22<SynrG>why not solve one problem at a time? i don't know how NM manages VPN ... whether it wants to also manage the underlying interface over which the VPN travels or not.
06:22<stdhell>lastwill: You can ofcourse try the aptitude why command with openjdk too. If nothing you need depends on openjdk, you could remove it.
06:23<lastwill>stdhell: according to libjpeg62 should be ok.
06:23<martins>SynrG: if manager in "Not managed" state is ok, that's my only issue
06:23<stdhell>lastwill: But what does aptitude why libjpeg8 say?
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06:24<musca>lastwill: aptitude why libjpeg8
06:25<lastwill> exactly
06:25<musca>heh, stdhell, you're quicker
06:25<stdhell>lastwill: You're right! The security updated version of openjdk-6-jre depends on libjpeg8.
06:25<stdhell>The "regular" one depended on libjpeg62.
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06:26<geopete123>what is this openoffice issue...and why is libreoffice reserved only for upstream people.
06:26<stdhell>And doesn't seem to track security updates?
06:26<stdhell>geopete123: What are you talking about?
06:27<geopete123>stdhell..i am talking about the 512 M ram issue for libreoffice..and why the bug says resolved an reserved only for priveledged upstream people
06:27<Apollo>geopete123: linking to the actual bug report might help...
06:27<stdhell>What issue?
06:28<geopete123>Apollo ok..let me go find it again.
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06:30<SynrG>geopete123: please do always provide details *first*. if you've started a support inquiry on a previous day (or even hours ago) don't rely on us to a) remember or b) even be the same people who helped before.
06:30<SynrG>geopete123: it's a good idea when reviving a stale support inquiry to collect your details into a paste and link to it
06:33<lastwill>stdhell & musca thanks for your help. ;-)
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06:33<stdhell>lastwill: No problem.
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06:34<arinov>SynrG, which vnc clients do we have (gtk maybe)?
06:35<SynrG>arinov: many. i tend to use xvnc4viewer
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06:35<SynrG>that's not gtk. i've also used remmina in the past, but have had all kinds of issues with it.
06:35<stdhell>arinov: I'm not SynrG, but try: apt-cache search vnc client
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06:36<SynrG>also, you can just address your questions to the channel. i have no specific expertise in this area :)
06:37-!-taiten_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
06:37<SynrG>(and even if i did, it's best to ask the channel unless following up on a prior conversation with a specific helper)
06:39<stdhell>gtkvncviewer sounds a lot like a VNC client using GTK. :-)
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06:49<esc>on debian stable:
06:49<esc>ca-certificates is installed
06:49<SynrG>i think specifying gtk is probably overvaluing one feature over more important ones, where vnc clients are concerned.
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06:51<geopete123>i could not find the exact one yet but here is a similar issue where you have to have big iron like core get it done.....
06:51<stdhell>esc: Can you try curl -v
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06:52<geopete123>SynrG..follow the page and you will see could not compile at top...and resolved at bottom with big-iron compile like core i7
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06:52<SynrG>esc: perhaps you meant curl -L ? in any case, i cannot reproduce your issue on a wheezy system with ca-certificates installed. i get a page back.
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06:53<esc>it is https
06:53<esc>i am on 7.1
06:53<SynrG>so i saw. and so am i.
06:53<stdhell>esc: Mine says CApath: /etc/ssl/certs
06:53<esc>it is a fresh install, like 1 week old
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06:53<geopete123>SynrgG..and i will keep looking for the 512M because there are so many hundreds to sift through.
06:54<fob>hi! I just tried to dist-upgrade, and now I have a locked up package system. Does anyone have a hint how to resolve this?
06:54<SynrG>geopete123: take better notes next time? :)
06:54<geopete123>SynrG..yes i guess i need to
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06:55<babilen>dpkg: tell fob -about bat
06:55<babilen>dpkg: tell fob -about localized errors
06:55<stdhell>esc: Where does /etc/pki/tls/certs/ca-bundle.crt come from? I don't have it.
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06:56<esc>my Continuum IO Anaconda has brough it's own curl
06:56<esc>system curl works
06:56<esc>sorry for the noise
06:56<stdhell>How nice of it... :-(
06:56<esc>submitting a bug report now
06:56<SynrG>fun stuff.
06:57<geopete123>SynrG..but anyway you can see at the person could not compile...and at the bottom..they conclude resolved because someone else with big iron like core i7 got it compiled...but it never really solved the top person's problem
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06:58<SynrG>geopete123: that is so utterly lacking details as to be impossible for us to follow up on, sorry. not even wild guesses here.
06:58<stdhell>geopete123: Maybe he ran out of RAM _AND_ swap.
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06:59<stdhell>libreoffice isn't a small program...
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07:00<SynrG>ah, you did link. my mistake. sec ...
07:00<geopete123>stdhell..well i can't even find out because i don't have 512Mram
07:01<geopete123>stdhell..maybe it is a big program..i have to counterevidence.
07:01<geopete123>no counterevidence
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07:02<stdhell>geopete123: # aptitude install libreoffice ... Need to get 122 MB/122 MB of archives. After unpacking 397 MB will be used.
07:03<SynrG>geopete123: that forum post links to this bug. you said it's similar to but not identical to your issue. is the bug at least consistent with what you are seeing?
07:03<stdhell>As I said: Not small...
07:03<geopete123>stdhell..yes but that is disk space for a binary..not some wierd ram space for a compile
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07:04<geopete123>stdhell..and plus i don't have a core i7 like that one issue i posted.
07:04<SynrG>geopete123: anyway, let's back up ... building libreoffice from source is not something most users need. what's your goal?
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07:05<ixi>whats geopete123's point ?
07:05<geopete123>SynrG....nearly everybody wants to know exactly what is being put on their machines..and they don't use binaries unless they can thourougly examine the code.
07:05<ixi>yes, building libreoffice with -pipe CFLAG will take a whole lot of RAM
07:05<ixi>what else is new ?
07:05<less>Nearly everybody?
07:05<SynrG>geopete123: and you are going to examine every line of code of every binary on your debian system? good luck with that.
07:06<stdhell>geopete123: So you're saying you read ALL the source code for libreoffice?
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07:06<geopete123>SynG..well would you rather be the victim of 7 inches of toolbars and 1 inch left of visual space in your browser because you did not check the code of a binary.
07:06<SynrG>geopete123: also, are you saying you don't trust debian? if so, maybe you should be running a different OS.
07:07<ixi>toolbars what?
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07:07<SynrG>please talk sense. what is your goal? stop spouting nonsense.
07:07<stdhell>geopete123: BTW: Have you read ?
07:07<geopete123> is not trusting anyone...not someone in particular.
07:07<stdhell>Do you trust your compiler?
07:07<geopete123>stdhell..well some people don't even trust that.
07:07<SynrG>geopete123: is there a bug you are trying to fix? are you trying to accomplish something *useful*?
07:07<SynrG>if not, please stop wasting our time.
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07:08<ixi>I think we're in 10km in offtopic territory
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07:08<geopete123>SynrG...yes right now i am looking into an earlier bug someone mentioned about vlc
07:08<geopete123>SynrG..but it takes me quite a while
07:08<stdhell>ixi: Do you have a map so we can find our way back?
07:09<SynrG>geopete123: i mean relating to libreoffice.
07:09<SynrG>if you have no specific goal in mind here, other than to see if you can build it from source ... then i think it's time we stop trying to help.
07:09<geopete123>SynrG..oh..i am not even allowed to compile libreoffice at this time because of a mimimum 512M ram limitation
07:10<SynrG>so ... wtf? why would you even expect that to work?
07:10<ixi> "even"
07:10<ixi> "allowed"
07:10<Maulkin>End of discussion all.
07:10<SynrG>moving on
07:10<Maulkin>geopete123: Try #moocows for offtopic discussion.
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07:14<stdhell>judd: version tzdata
07:14<judd>Package: tzdata on i386 -- squeeze: 2012g-0squeeze1; squeeze-updates: 2012g-0squeeze1; squeeze-proposed-updates: 2013c-0squeeze1; wheezy: 2013c-0wheezy1; jessie: 2013c-2; sid: 2013c-2
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07:15<stdhell>Does anyone know why squeeze is still stuck on 2012g while wheezy is using 2013c?
07:15<dpkg>from memory, oldstable is the previous stable version of Debian, as long as it is still supported by the security team. Squeeze (6.0) is oldstable. It is recommended to upgrade your system(s) to the current stable release, ask me about <oldstable->stable>.
07:16<stdhell>OdyX: I know, but it should still get updates as far as I know.
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07:16<mgv>stdhell: security updates only
07:17<OdyX>stdhell: "squeeze-proposed-updates: 2013c-0squeeze1" => it'll get 2013c at the next point release.
07:17*stdhell opens his eyes...
07:17<babilen>people might argue that correct timezone data is quite security relevant -- and you can install it from s-p-u right away
07:19<geopete123>stdhell..yes that was an interesting link at bell labs that you might not even be able to trust the compiler......
07:19<babilen>fob: Are you planning to provide the requested information? It is quite hard to help you if we can neither read your messages (well *I* as a fellow German can, but ...) nor without seeing the additional bits of information I requested.
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07:20<stdhell>OdyX, mgv, babilen (hope I didn't miss any): Got it now. Thanks. I'll try to keep my eyes open next time before asking. :-)
07:21<geopete123>stdhell....some people..sum it up as risks and rewards...saying we are surrounded by we take risks and hope for benefits to offset the suffering risks imposes.
07:21<stdhell>Time (lol) to update tzdata-javascript. :-)
07:22<fob>hi! I just tried to dist-upgrade, and now I have a locked up package system. Does anyone have a hint how to resolve this?
07:23<geopete123> becomes an issue whenever risk is in positive supply to the entire economy and cannot be costlessly eliminated.
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07:24<stdhell>D'oh! It wasn't even 2013c I was looking for. Already had that one. I was looking for 2013d.
07:24<stdhell>Guess I'll have to wait a bit longer.
07:25<geopete123>stdhell...because if it is in positive supply someone or group must bear it for all...and usually require compensation for the burden of accepting risks.
07:26<geopete123>stdhell..if a majority is risk-averse.
07:26<babilen>dpkg: tell fob about squeeze->wheezy failures
07:26<SynrG>geopete123: you've been asked nicely to take the off-topic elsewhere. you shouldn't have to be asked twice.
07:26<stdhell>geopete123: I should probably mention that I don't really read what you're writing anymore...
07:26<babilen>fob: You also really shouldn't use "stable" in your sources.list but the actual release names ("wheezy", "squeeze", "jessie", ...)
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07:37<litcanu>hello everyone. Can somebody help me with something please ?
07:37<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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07:38<litcanu>i want to install something with apt-get but that command gives me the stable release of that software. I want the unstable one... how do i do that ?
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07:39<litcanu>im running linux mint debian version
07:39<dpkg>Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at or join #linuxmint-help on for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available, based on <testing>. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>.
07:40<litcanu>Apollo: im with LMDE
07:40<Apollo>It's not Debian
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07:40<litcanu>yeah i know but the sources should be the same
07:41<Apollo>=> It's not supported here
07:41<Apollo>follow the instructions provided by dpkg
07:41<litcanu>i'm just asking what are the deb for the unstable
07:41<Khades>litcanu: can you show me your sources.list ?
07:41<Khades>i would help you
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07:42<stdhell>litcanu: Why not join Mints support channel?
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07:44<litcanu>stdhell: Apollo because i like debian more for some reason and i thought to ask in here. Does it really matter ... were oll on unix ... i don't know why so much hostility it's not like i'm asking for money or anything
07:44<stdhell>But you're not asking about Debian.
07:44<TobiX>litcanu: We are also not asking for money and we choose to only support Debian in here
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07:44<litcanu>TobiX: ok...
07:45<stdhell>TobiX: I am... (asking for money)
07:45<litcanu>stdhell: i was asking about some sources list not anything fancy
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07:45<TobiX>litcanu: stdhell might be able to sell some Mint support to you ;)
07:46<TobiX>dpkg: tell litcanu about mixing
07:46<stdhell>I get that, but we don't know what sources Mint uses. The mint support channel should know.
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07:46<litcanu>stdhell: thx for your time :)
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08:23<chrishell>hi, I get a error with my laptop fancontol, it says while booting "[warn] not starting fan control..."
08:24<chrishell>I found some solutions with google, but non of them seems really trustworthy
08:24<chrishell>is there an offical solution?
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08:25<Calinou>chrishell: it's laptop-dependant as always
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08:26<divya>how to dual boot (android and debian) on atab?
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08:26<SynrG>chrishell: first, that's normal. second, it's not needed.
08:26<SynrG>your BIOS probably does a fine job
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08:27<SynrG>it's a consequence of installing the 'laptop' task when you installed your system. you can remove the fancontrol package if you're not using it.
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08:29<SynrG>huh, fancontrol is only Suggests of lm-sensors. strange.
08:29<SynrG>i thought it was pulled in by task-laptop, but apparently not.
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08:30<SynrG>chrishell: 'aptitude why fancontrol'
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08:30<SynrG>chrishell: did you manually install fancontrol?
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08:34<SynrG>hm, on one system i have fancontrol and i'm positive i never asked for it. could be a consequence of some former dependency on it that no longer exists in the archive (yet oddly, apt-get autoremove didn't consider it a candidate for removal)
08:35<Stummi>if it is marked as manually, it may was in a task earlier
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08:36<gsimmons>SynrG: lm-sensors previously recommended fancontrol (#567185).
08:37<SynrG>gsimmons: thanks.
08:37<SynrG>gsimmons: still doesn't tell why it wasn't subject to autoremoval :p
08:37<Stummi>i have fancontroll here intentionally. The bios has a strange concept of handling my fan. (fan at minimal speed up to ~60°, at full speed above, IIRC)
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08:38<SynrG>that sounds like some stuff on my system was inappropriately marked manual in a conflict resolution.
08:38<jm_>i wish it worked for me like on old system ;)
08:38<SynrG>Stummi: yes, for strange/broken hardware fancontrol is sometimes needed. otherwise not.
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08:53<JacksonIsaac>I want to fix this bug
08:53<JacksonIsaac>Can anyone help me get started. This would be my first bug fixing
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08:54<kanliot>they might not want a fix
08:55<JacksonIsaac>Can you suggest a easy bug to get started
08:56<kanliot>yes, but i can't read your mind
08:56<kanliot>so i wont try
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08:57<JacksonIsaac>I want to start Contributing to Open Source. How can I start with?
08:58<kanliot>file a quality bug, or start fixing docs
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08:58<stdhell>What are your skills?
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08:59<JacksonIsaac>I know C, C++, little bit of Java, python and started a course on rubymonks
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09:03<stdhell>JacksonIsaac: One way to get started would be to find a bug that annoys _you_ and fix that. Then contact either Debian or upstream and get your patch included.
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09:03<JacksonIsaac>How can I find that. I am running Debian 7.1.0 on virtualBox
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09:04<stdhell>And everything just works? Great. You're done. :-)
09:04<Calinou><JacksonIsaac> I want to start Contributing to Open Source. How can I start with?
09:04<Calinou>by contributing to upstream
09:04<Calinou>tip: warrior baguettes are suggested
09:04<Calinou>you'll have to fight with them so that your patches are merged
09:05<JacksonIsaac>what is upstream?
09:05<Calinou>the people who make the software available in distros
09:05<Calinou>eg. gimp, libreoffice, redeclipse...
09:05<Calinou>note that you can also contribute by making art, and it would be welcome for games.
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09:10<Stummi>JacksonIsaac, in most distributions, you have at least two teams involved in your software: "Upstream" are the guys who originally write this software. Then you have the Package Maintainers who applies distro-specific patches an package it so you can install it e.g. via apt
09:13<JacksonIsaac>okay :). So how can I contact upstream and do some bug fixing?
09:13<stdhell>In what program?
09:13<JacksonIsaac>I didn't understand?
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09:14<Stummi>JacksonIsaac, yes, that would be the easiest way, especially by small OSS-Communities
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09:15<stdhell>JacksonIsaac: You would rarely say "I just want to fix a bug, I don't care which one...". More often you would say "ARGH!!! ___This___ doesn't work. I'll fix that...".
09:15<stdhell>So... What do you want to fix?
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09:15<babilen>JacksonIsaac: There isn't a single upstream but many independent developers. If you are interested in fixing bugs in Debian you might want to read up on "Bug Squashing Parties" (BSPs) and the techniques being used to do that. You might want to read -- How to fix a bug really depends on the program you want to fix a bug in.
09:16<musca>apt-cache show <package> | grep -i homepage
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09:18<babilen>JacksonIsaac: Teaching someone to fix bugs from the very beginning is not necessarily trivial as it includes: 1. Finding a bug 2. Triaging the bug 3. Fixing the bug (for which specific knowledge might be needed) 4. Contributing your fix to upstream/Debian -- If you want to fix bugs *in Debian* (as opposed to fixing them upstream) you should be familiar with the way software is being packaged in Debian.
09:20<babilen>JacksonIsaac: In the end it really depends on what you want to do - Good starter documentation for how to contribute to Debian can be found on:
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09:20<JacksonIsaac>So I should go and find some bugs and try to recreate it and then work on it ?
09:20<babilen>That is the idea, yes :)
09:21<stdhell>Depends on what you mean by "find some bugs and try to recreate it".
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09:21<stdhell>You should probably NOT find the bug on, but by using your own system.
09:22<JacksonIsaac>I don't have any idea about it.
09:22<babilen>You might want to search on for known bugs in packages you are using. You would then, probably, have to get rid of the source package from Debian (debcheckout PKG)/source code from upstream (maybe on GitHub, see "apt-cache show PKG" for information and the "Homepage" link)
09:22<stdhell>JacksonIsaac: Is there anything _on your system_, that doesn't work as you would like it to work?
09:22<babilen>stdhell: Why is using the bts to find bugs to work on a problem?
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09:23<stdhell>I have a feeling he would just look for any random bug. Might not be one in a package he use.
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09:25<JacksonIsaac>yes as stdhell said, I was looking at random bugs but I just skipped them as their name and desc were like too high-level
09:25<stdhell>babilen: I agree that all the bugs should be fixed, but for a beginner, it might be a lot easier to fix a bug that annoys yourself.
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09:26<JacksonIsaac>I don't like going back to previous page when I press the scroll button twice in Iceweasel.
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09:26<babilen>stdhell: Oh, absolutely
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09:26<stdhell>JacksonIsaac: Find something (on your system) that annoys you, then try to fix that.
09:27<stdhell>Ok, there you go! Get the source for Iceweasel and see if you can change that.
09:27<babilen>That's definitely a good first bug to work on! >:-)
09:27<stdhell>(You might want to start with a small and simpler program...)
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09:29<babilen>JacksonIsaac: is a good discussion about the general bug squashing process
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09:33<JacksonIsaac>I can't find a developer corner for iceweasel
09:33<themill>Pick small and simple things that you have some hope of making progress with.
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09:36<babilen>there must be a guide to find good "beginner bugs" -- I know that Gnome tags "easy" bugs specifically as detailed on but I can't think of anything similar for Debian or other upstream projects.
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09:37<babilen>JacksonIsaac: Find a tool that you use and that is not too complex (so no webbrowser), and familiarise yourself with the code. Even learning how to do something trivial such as changing a single string in the program will teach you a lot. You can then check the Debian's and upstream's bug tracker for known problems and try to traige them.
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09:38<JacksonIsaac>can you suggest anything.
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09:39<JacksonIsaac>Can I work on wget? Whenever I download anything from wget as a superuser. The file is a read-only, I need to manually change its permission.
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09:39<themill>umm... that's not a problem with wget.
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09:40<stdhell>Just the opposite... :-)
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09:41*Stummi did his first steps on an OSS project on rockbox with some patches against the games and gameboy-emulator for rockbox
09:41<Stummi>JacksonIsaac, oh, and OSS = Open Source Software
09:42<stdhell>JacksonIsaac: I got a small thing you can try for fun, but it's not a real bug... The command "cal" has an "-M" option to start the weeks on Mondays and "-S" for Sundays. Make a "-W" option to start weeks on Wednesdays.
09:42<babilen>Not bad :)
09:42<JacksonIsaac>okay. Can you share the link or something
09:43<stdhell>No link... I just made it up.
09:43-!-pablosilva [~pablosilv@] has joined #debian
09:43<stdhell>(And I was wrong. ncal has those options, cal doesn't...)
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09:44<stdhell>Actual... Fix "cal" so it understands "-M"...
09:44<stdhell>I live in Denmark and our weeks starts on Mondays, so it is a bug. :-)
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09:45<SynrG>stdhell: you have to file the bug first, since you're the one who wants it ...
09:45<Stummi>stderr, why not a general --start-with-day 0..6?
09:45<babilen>Weeks should start on Monday everywhere ... /me heads over to #debian-offtopic
09:46<stdhell>SynrG: I don't really care about that "bug", but if he wants a small-ish problem to work with... :-)
09:46<stdhell>Stummi: That's me too... This "me" is at work.
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09:46<Stummi>eh.. okay :)
09:47<SynrG>stdhell: if you don't care, then don't suggest it. he can't work his way through the "normal bug-fixing process" without an actual bug :p and somehow manufacturing new bugs for educational purposes seems ... not quite in the right spirit
09:47<stdhell>Ok, then I'm out of ideas...
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09:48<kanliot>linux kernel mailing list
09:48<Stummi>JacksonIsaac, do you like games? i think gnuboy could need some love
09:48<Stummi>(gnuboy is an gameboy emulator)
09:49<JacksonIsaac>okay no problem :)
09:50<JacksonIsaac>how can I contribute to it
09:50<kanliot>become a gdb expert
09:50<kanliot>that will take at least half a day
09:50<kanliot>seriously i don't want to troll u more
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09:51<Stummi>JacksonIsaac, if you have found something you want to work on, may the guys on #debian-mentors can help you further
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09:53<JacksonIsaac>nothing I could find
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09:55<babilen>JacksonIsaac: You have to have *something* you are interested in and you must have a more specific idea of what you want to contribute to. I linked you to various websites that explain on how you can help *Debian* (pretending to be on-topic here) and you might want to familiarise yourself with that. We can't tell you what you have to do ... Scratch your own itch. That's how open source software works.
09:56<babilen>but lets take this meta-discussion to #debian-offtopic now unless it really concerns a Debian specific problem ... ta! :-D
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10:37<epirus1> wireless is firmware missing ?how to solve it ?
10:39<mtn>epirus1: have you looked at the debian wireless wiki?
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10:39<jklaz_>u mean that doesnt exist a free driver or no linux driver at all
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10:40<ardex>what to use for fragmented files and broken symlinks?
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10:42<SynrG>ardex: do you mean you're seeking a utility that will report these things? i think they're two different problems and wouldn't expect a single utility to handle both.
10:43<epirus1>mtj, I use lspci and don't find the keyword wireless
10:43<ardex>I thought cruft, but don't know how to apply results
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10:44<mtn>epirus1: try lspci -nn and look through the list. is your wireless usb or ...?
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10:45<mtn>epirus1: how do you know your firmware is missing?
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10:45<ardex>SynrG: cruft?
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10:46<epirus1>mtj, not use and the gnome network-manage display the wireless firemare missing
10:46<epirus1>mtn, , not use and the gnome network-manage display the wireless firemare missing
10:46<epirus1>mtn, not use and the gnome network-manage display the wireless firemare missing
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10:47<mtn>epirus1: is your wireless usb or ...?
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10:47<epirus1>mtn, It's not wireless usb
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10:47<SynrG>ardex: yes, cruft should find broken symlinks. but fragmented files? that's something else
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10:47<mtn>epirus1: then lspci -nn should find it.
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10:48<SynrG>ardex: most linux filesystems are self-defragmenting, so i'm not sure what problem you're trying to solve ..
10:48<ardex>SynrG: and for fragmented and useless files, bleachbit?
10:48<mtn>epirus1: please paste the results of lspci-nn to
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10:49<ardex>SynrG: I installed and uninstalled a lot of packages, and know there is a lot of undone cleanup
10:49<SynrG>ardex: you'll have to explain what you mean by the word "fragmented". i have no idea what you mean.
10:50<epirus1>mtn, here is link:\
10:50<SynrG>ardex: one of the first things for cleanup after you've uninstalled is to purge packages you only removed.
10:50<epirus1>mtn, here is link:
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10:50<ardex>SynrG: I'll paste the cruft results. brb
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10:51<mtn>epirus1: and your card is a BCM4312
10:51<SynrG>ardex: if you don't mean sense 2 of i don't know what you mean
10:52<SynrG>ardex: that's an efficiency thing. that doesn't determine whether a file is useful or not, however.
10:53<ardex>SynrG: optimize disk
10:53<mtn>epirus1: looks like you want the b43 driver
10:53<epirus1>mtn,ok I'll try it and reboot
10:53<SynrG>ardex: as i said, ext# filesystems are self-defragmenting. one does not normally do anything to optimize them.
10:54<ardex>SynrG: still thinking ntfs I guess
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10:55<SynrG>ardex: e2fsprogs contains e4defrag. this is not something i have ever run, or felt i had a need to run.
10:55<ardex>SynrG: when I audit recommendations, I get a list of pkgs...
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10:56<SynrG>ardex: caution, though ... that seems to be for a very special use case. ext filesystem with -O extent option.
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10:57<ardex>SynrG: I have that installed
10:58<SynrG>ardex: but probably don't have a filesystem with 'extent' (or 'extents') option, so it's not relevant.
10:58<ardex>SynrG: I'll take your word for it
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11:00<SynrG>and the man page says using that option with mke2fs will "create a filesystem that is not supported by the ext3 implementation as found in the Linux kernel ..."
11:00<SynrG>(the mke2fs man page)
11:00<ardex>SynrG:better safe than sorry
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11:01<SynrG>which brings me back to my first point. i don't think defragging is needed.
11:01<ixi>it's not needed
11:01<ixi>this isn't windows xp
11:01<ardex>I will concur wholeheartedly
11:01<thefarcry118>I'm booting from a LIVECD, 8GB to be exact, do I copy the ISO onto the USB drive, or use DD, and or any other LiveCD software.
11:01<thefarcry118>*USB drive
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11:02<SynrG>thefarcry118: which OS?
11:02<SynrG>i don't know of any 8G *image size* produced by debian ...
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11:02<thefarcry118>SynrG: I meant my USB flash drive is 8GB, sorry for the confusion.
11:03<SynrG>and the live image was obtained from where?
11:03<thefarcry118>Do I use dd, like I do with other distros?
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11:03<thefarcry118>I can't find much documentation on the installation of LiveCDs.
11:03<ixi>dd will work fine for debian netinstall and debian live
11:03<SynrG>in fact, you can just use cp if it is one of debian's.
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11:04<SynrG>cp imagename.iso /dev/sdX (where X is the drive letter)
11:04<thefarcry118>SynrG: the iso?
11:04<SynrG>yes, which OS is the ISO. is that a debian live image?
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11:06<thefarcry118>SynrG: Yes, it's a KDE Wheezy Live image from one of the mirrors.
11:06<SynrG>k. then either dd or cp will work with it. it is hybrid
11:07<SynrG>see which indicates the FAQ applies ...
11:07<thefarcry118>SynrG: I'll give it a try.
11:08<SynrG>though the installation guide (which the /CD/live page also links to) indicates that 'cp' is fine
11:08<SynrG>both will work
11:08<thefarcry118>USB drivers are normally /dev/sdb, correct?
11:08<SynrG>CD/faq isn't my page though. i don't know why the author feels dd is appropriate :p
11:09<SynrG>no, they aren't normally anything
11:09<SynrG>they're whatever they are on *your* system
11:09<SynrG>make sure you've identified it properly. see dmesg
11:09<SynrG>also, try ls -l /dev/disk/by-i/d
11:09<SynrG>also, try ls -l /dev/disk/by-id/
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11:10<SynrG>you absolutely do not want to guess the device based on what it "normally" is
11:10<SynrG>that way lies a world of hurt
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11:11<thefarcry118>SynrG: my flash drive is sdb:
11:11<SynrG>it is this time around. you need to check that every time.
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11:12<SynrG>the OS does not assign fixed devicenames per removable media. it is dynamically allocated when you plug it in.
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11:12<SynrG>if you happened to have your camera or phone plugged in at the same time, then plugged in your USB key afterwards, the device assignment could be different.
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11:13<thefarcry118>SynrG: I always assumed that /dev/sdb was the de-facto name for USB devices.
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11:13<thefarcry118>I guess I was wrong.
11:13<SynrG>glad i spotted and corrected that mis-impression then :)
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11:14<ixi>that was one dangerous assumption
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11:15<thefarcry118>Another question: What would be the best method to back up my ~/home file, and all my dot files (.gitignore, .ssh_config). I'm tempted to simple zip all them up, and upload onto Google Drive.
11:16<SynrG>that's one way
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11:16<SynrG>just so long as you're comfortable sending any of your private info elsewhere
11:17<SynrG>if you don't trust either the place where you're sending it or the transport to get it there, then it is prudent to encrypt your data first
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11:17<thefarcry118>I could encrypt it with TrueCrypt, it does contain private keys, too.
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11:17<thefarcry118>I don't have a backup disk to rsync to :(
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11:18<epirus1>mtn, the driver is ok but I can't find any ap
11:18<mtn>epirus1: what does ap mean? how do you know the driver is ok?
11:18<SynrG>broadcom, shudder ...
11:19<mtn>well I sure hope someone knows more about broadcom than I do :)
11:19<SynrG>ap == access point
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11:21<SynrG>epirus1: as per the wiki link mtn pasted, apt-get install firmware-b43-lpphy-installer
11:21<SynrG>that's in contrib
11:22<SynrG>epirus1: this is for wheezy, right?
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11:23<epirus1>SynrG, yes it's wheezy and I have apt-get install firmware-b43-lpphy-installer and driver is ok ,I can't find the AP
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11:26<musca>epirus1: /sbin/iwlist scan
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11:26<SynrG>epirus1: you've reloaded the wifi modules (a reboot will do this) after intsalling the firmware?
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11:27<epirus1>I use the iwlist scan and display --->wlan0 Interface doesn't support scanning : Invalid argument
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11:27<musca>what SynrG said
11:28<epirus1>musca, I have rebooted
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11:30<gsimmons>epirus1, SynrG: firmware-b43-lpphy-installer installs firmware version 478.104, which is rather dated. Firmware 666.2 (provided by wheezy's firmware-b43-installer package) is actually compatible with BCM4312 devices. Owing to a PCI ID check in that package however, it isn't installed at postinst. The commands at can be used to manually install firmware 666.2 for use by the b43 driver.
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11:32<epirus1>ok, I need to reboot~
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11:33<king>hiiiiiiii debhelper
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11:35<king>how r u
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11:38<SynrG>gsimmons: ah. this is not mentioned on that wiki page ... update?
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11:39<gsimmons>SynrG: I'll wait for epirus1 to say something first. :)
11:39<SynrG>"If necessary, firmware can be manually acquired and extracted using the b43-fwcutter utility," but it's not clear what the conditions are for deciding "if necessary"
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11:39<epirus1>I still have the wlan0 interface but iwlist scan-->wlan0 Interface doesn't support scanning : Invalid argument
11:39<SynrG>nor the exact steps, as you gave them. and yes, we wait :)
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11:41*ardex has all day
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11:41<king>do u know about matasploit
11:41<SynrG>ardex: the broken symlinks under dev are false hits
11:42<ardex>AH SO
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11:42<ardex>SynrG: anything on the list to address?
11:43<SynrG>king: please play somewhere else.
11:43<gsimmons>epirus1: You'll need to raise the interface first (ifconfig wlan0 up), before a scan can be conducted.
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11:44<SynrG>ardex: update-alternatives --config dictionaries-common
11:44<ardex>Thanks much
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11:46<virfour>how can a fullscreen application like megaglest be minimized? (in my case under xfce)?
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11:46<SynrG>ardex: do you have the fonts-droid package installed?
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11:46<ardex>SynrG: update-alternatives: error: no alternatives for dictionaries-common
11:47<ardex>SynrG: nope
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11:48<mtn>virfour: in my experience full screen apps can't be minimized
11:48<SynrG>ardex: oh, sorry, that one isn't managed by the alternatives system. and i misread it anyway
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11:49<ardex>fonts-droid just installed... oops
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11:50<ardex>SynrG: just ^C 'd it
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11:50<SynrG>ardex: you have nothing providing wordlist installed?
11:50<SynrG>normally wamerican, wbritish, etc.
11:51<ardex>SynrG: I hope to install open-dict
11:51<SynrG>or else dictionaries-common
11:51<SynrG>any one of those would provide you with a /usr/share/dict/words
11:51<ardex>si I need more dictionaries
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11:52<SynrG>well, this is not just a dictionary, but a wordlist. and some programs (bsdgames, for example) use it as a source for random words, etc. it is normally present on all systems
11:52<SynrG>dunno about the .pulse thing in your homedir
11:52<ardex>ok i 'see' more now
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11:53<SynrG>as for the "unexplained", it would take too long to cover each case ...
11:53<SynrG>dpkg -S, apt-file, and so on, are useful ...
11:53<dpkg>SynrG: I think you lost me on that one
11:54<ardex>alsa is on board running sound. I can dump pulse
11:54<SynrG>i would not remove anything of those that i wasn't 100% certain is truly junk
11:54<ardex>ok good isea
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11:55<SynrG>as for "missing", i dunno wtf it's talking about :)
11:55<SynrG>maybe reading the README will help
11:55<ardex>dunno either. legacy stuff?
11:57<ardex>isea=idea typing is fun
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11:58<ardex>SynrG: more digging in order. thanks for the help. good day 2u
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11:59<xubuntu>is ubuntu the only user friendly distro?
12:00<virfour>xubuntu: no
12:00<xubuntu>for example?
12:00<dpkg>from memory, debian is See
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12:01<xubuntu>I just tried debian xfce and had wireless problems...
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12:01<virfour>xubuntu: Debian, Arch, Fedora...
12:01<xubuntu>Arch! Are you serious?
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12:01<xubuntu>I said user friendly....
12:01<virfour>xubuntu: (in the past Debian wasn't, but now it is)
12:01<xubuntu>with 6 cd's....
12:01<virfour>xubuntu: at least a few years ago it was
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12:01<retrospectacus>xubuntu, virfour: unless you have a Debian support question, take it elsewhere, like #moocows
12:01<P3tr3u5>ZORIN OS
12:02<virfour>xubuntu: even beginners should be able to handle a few CDs
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12:31<geopete123>ok i tested vlc for the benefit of that person's reported problem a few hours ago...and the video does seem to have a problem not fully utilizing GPU acceleration.
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12:32<geopete123>so whoever you now have 2 reports to back up your complaint
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12:33<retrospectacus>geopete123: what's the bug number
12:34<geopete123>retrospectacus..he did not give one..he came in here and complained about vlc a few hours ago
12:34<geopete123> i checked it ..and it does not fully support GPU acceleration
12:35<geopete123>on the one non-drm'd public domain cd that i have..of a pre-recorded video
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12:51<mpfusion>Are the man pages of debian packages available online, e.g. on a web server? Background: I'd like to link to the man pages but the man pages I found are not debian specific.
12:52<mgv>mpfusion: ?
12:52<dpkg>[debian man pages] The "Man Page Lookup" service searches on a man page's name and section as given in the selection menu and query dialog, for pages supplied in current Debian <releases>.
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12:56<kanwisher>whats the best debian channel to find out about upstreaming for debian
12:58<mpfusion>mgv: retrospectacus : Thanks, that was what I was looking for.
12:59<ompaul>kanwisher: what is upstreaming
13:00<ompaul>putting something into debian?
13:00*ompaul guesses
13:00<ompaul>kanwisher: so what you want to do is join #debian-mentors and there learn how to package for debian and then you can support your package
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13:01<ompaul>kanwisher: for others to do it - you just need an interested person who will package for debian - to do that you need an interesting package
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13:02<retrospectacus>ask the dpkg robot about itp or rfp
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13:03<ompaul>kanwisher: what retrospectacus said
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13:15<zipy>hey i installed debian on a 1101ha which uses the gma500. when i try to resume from suspend, it wakes up but leaves me a black screen only
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13:25<retrospectacus>zipy: check out and join #debian-eeepc
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13:27<abady>h r u girls Ojo
13:27<geopete123>well at least that individual will know that their comments do receive consideration even if we don't currently have a solution and can only agree with them
13:27<geopete123>regarding vlc
13:28<retrospectacus>abady: you seem to be in the wrong place
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13:30<geopete123>abady ...why do you seek girls?
13:30<retrospectacus>geopete123: that's not useful unless it is reported as a bug
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13:30<geopete123>retrospectacus..well i don't know how..but he may have already reported it besides commenting on this channel
13:31<abady>who see it>>> _1_
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13:31<abady>who admin here
13:31<retrospectacus>abady: unless you have a Debian support question, please be quiet.
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13:33<fede>hey if i was abad i would ask "will debian help me getting girl support?" :D
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13:34<geopete123> only want the pleasing help of a lovely female?..what problem with debian are you having?
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13:36<fede>geopete123, debian helped me to establish roles: she clean kitchen, i configure mediacenters. But that's not the final solution, where mediacenters are able to configure themselves :D
13:36<retrospectacus>and clean kitchens
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13:36<fede>nothing bad with that
13:36<fede>oh sorry misread
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13:37<fede>well autocleaning kitches is just a legend for dreamers, like uhm google glassess or.. hmm.. sound working perfectly on that netbook :D
13:37<sethlan>where am i
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13:38<geopete123>sethlan..what coordinate system do you wish to be expressed in.
13:38<retrospectacus>sethlan: Debian support
13:38<fede>sethlan, Debian support without kitchens
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13:39<sethlan>wow people still use irc?
13:39<sethlan>i remember using it back in 90s
13:40<retrospectacus>it is even more popular now
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13:40<sethlan>do you guys remember bbs's?
13:40<geopete123> could we forget the dragon's lair?
13:41<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #moocows on or #defocus on
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13:42<geopete123>dpkg..well he might be getting ready to ask if there is a debian app for a bbs
13:42<geopete123> never know
13:42<sethlan>so quiet here over 580 people?
13:43<zipy>hey i installed debian on a 1101ha which uses the gma500. when i try to resume from suspend, it wakes up but leaves me a black screen only <-- in xubuntu it works, what if i just copy the sleep.d folder might that work?
13:43<retrospectacus>sethlan: they don't have support questions so they are idling quietly. Do you have a Debian support question?
13:44<sethlan>yes, how do I turn on my computer?
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13:45<fede>i got one
13:45<fede>soon my lan will be populated by many debian things
13:45<fede>i don't want to download packages for every machine, for example when updates happens
13:46<fede>i have read about squid retaining .deb downloaded things, but also an apt-* thingy
13:47<fede>i would appreciate a suggestion to solve it in an easy-to-manage way
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13:47<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell fede about apt-cacher-ng
13:47<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell fede about approx
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13:48<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell fede about squid deb caching
13:48<retrospectacus>fede: I haven't tried any, maybe someone else has a recommendation of which you might prefer
13:49<fede>wow that dpkg bot is awesome, got even one more possible solution than espected
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13:50<retrospectacus>that robot knows a ton. Just say things to him you want to know about
13:50<fede>by now thanks retrospectacus, i will wait for eventual further suggestions
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13:58<Samkov>I have a directory of .png files I want to change all of their extentions to .svg, is there some type of batch command i could issue to do this?
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14:01<retrospectacus>Samkov: for f in *.png ; do <some program that converts> "$f" "${f//.png}.svg"; done
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14:04<retrospectacus>Samkov: I think you can use the simple "convert" program (provided by Imagemagick)
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14:06<Samkov>thank you!
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14:06<retrospectacus>(note of course, "change all of their extentions to .svg" is a simple renaming but you probably actually want to recreate the file as Scalable Vector Graphic)
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14:19<ardex>SynrG: fslint did it
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14:30<SynrG>ardex: ah, nice
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14:31<ardex>SynrG: perfect
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14:38<namid>Hallo jemand da?
14:39<dpkg>English as a language (and other uses) has plenty of background on wikipedia, however for #debian support, it's the primary and best supported language here. Please use other specific language channels (even if they're very idle), a related mailing list, or your best English here anyway (we'll try to cope).
14:39<namid>sorry hello
14:39<retrospectacus>hello namid. Please ask your Debian support question
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14:40<namid>i have no question.
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14:59<acerspyro>Hello, I'm back. Anyone remembering me?
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15:02<acerspyro>Any way to link my internal microphone to SOX?
15:02<acerspyro>I'm on an iMac G3
15:02<acerspyro>I try to speak, but it's not getting anythig
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15:17<Calinou>a wild acerspyro appears
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15:18<acerspyro>I'm chatting on the iMac itself this time
15:18<phillipsjk>funny how 4 people left after the dejected emoticon.
15:18<retrospectacus>it uses "ask vague question" - it's not very effective
15:18<acerspyro>It's Calinou's turn
15:19<acerspyro>I have an iMac G3, I just installed the SOX package, typing "rec ./test.wav" shows up the SOX ui with no problem, but it doesn't takes input from my integrated microphone. What should I do to tell it where to pick up sound?
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15:20<retrospectacus>you may need to mess around in alsamixer or pavucontrol to switch the mic on, or switch default input to it
15:21<retrospectacus>or it may not be possible. Who knows with Macs
15:21<acerspyro>Is it doable without Xorg?
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15:21<retrospectacus>acerspyro: I suppose so. You'll need some kind of sound system
15:21<dpkg>Ask me about <alsa>, <alsa checklist>. See also <default alsa>, <pulseaudio>.
15:21<acerspyro>I have one, I think it's alsa
15:21<acerspyro>Nvm, it's pulse
15:22<geopete123>acerspyro what does aplay -L say
15:22-!-BLHolliday [] has joined #debian
15:22<acerspyro>-bash: aplay: Command not found.
15:22<geopete123>acerspyro...well su to root and try again
15:22<acerspyro>I'm already root
15:23<geopete123>acerspyro..oh..well maybe you don't have alsa-utils installed
15:23<acerspyro>oh ok
15:23<geopete123>acerspyro...are you using oss stuff
15:23<BLHolliday>Anybody having weird USB drive problems on testing? Three different USB drives load read-only unless I'm root.
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15:24<acerspyro>geopete123: what?
15:24<phillipsjk>BLHolliday, there is a group for being allowed to mount stuff
15:24<geopete123>acerspyro..what hardware do you oss supported sound card or an alsa supported sound card
15:24<acerspyro>I really have no idea, it's an iMac
15:24<BLHolliday>phillipsjk: plugdev, right?
15:25<acerspyro>Can't open it and not witten anywhere
15:25<geopete123>acerspyro...oh..well i don't know anything about that apple will have to ask again
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15:25<phillipsjk>BLHolliday, that sounds like software, not a group name.
15:25<acerspyro>I know that the "play" command can play music
15:25<acerspyro>(In other words, the sound system works)
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15:26<BLHolliday>phillipsjk: ok, what's the group to mount things? I didn't have this problem before the latest update to testing.
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15:26*phillipsjk does not recall
15:26<geopete123>acerspyro..well the play command is a sox tool
15:27<geopete123>acerspyro...but you will have to ask some apple people
15:28<acerspyro>Thnks anyways
15:28<acerspyro>Is there a channel for it?
15:29<nmeum>how can I convert an .mp3 file to .ogg?
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15:29<geopete123>nmeum..that may not be legal
15:29<geopete123>nmeum..depending on where you are located
15:29<acerspyro>Can't SOX do it?
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15:29<geopete123>acerspyro..i don't give out advice on potentially lawbreaking activity
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15:30<retrospectacus>nmeum: ffmpeg -i somefile.mp3 somefile.ogg
15:30<BLHolliday>I can't find any web references regarding being able to mount... but isn't root doing all of the automounting anyways according to fstab?
15:30<nmeum>geopete123: oh?
15:31<BLHolliday>So, in effect, it's root that's doing all of the mounting?
15:31<retrospectacus>no. nmeum: you need a licence to *create* mp3, not decode it, if you care about that kind of thing
15:31<geopete123>nmeum...well once you cross the law into the land of criminals there may be no turning back...such as Long John i don't advise how to do things like that
15:32<phillipsjk>This seems to suggest everything is auto mounted now:
15:33<BLHolliday>ok, so still trying to figure out why an admin user has to switch to root to r/w on an automounted USB drive
15:33-!-grandie [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:33<retrospectacus>BLHolliday: "mount" - does the device have "user" in the mount options?
15:34<retrospectacus>(or some user_id)
15:34<BLHolliday>it's /dev/sdb1 /media/usb0 auto rw,user,noauto 0 0
15:34<BLHolliday>that's system-generated
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15:34<retrospectacus>that looks like fstab, not mount output
15:35<BLHolliday>hang on
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15:36<BLHolliday>mount -a shows /dev/sdb1 on /media/usb0 type vfat (rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec,relatime,fmask=0022,dmask=0022,codepage=437,iocharset=utf8,shortname=mixed,errors=remount-ro) [MET]
15:36<geopete123>nmeum crossing the law into the land of criminals can have serious consequences that you should strive to understand before you commit to violating the rules and regulations where you live.
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15:37<geopete123>nmeum..would you like to be another Long John Silver...or another Jesse James...or another RobinHood
15:37<retrospectacus>geopete123: playing mp3 is not a crime
15:37<nmeum>geopete123: aha
15:37<SynrG>talking crap again. please, cut it out
15:38<geopete123>retrospectacus..he did not ask how to play an mp3..he asked how to decode it and duplicate where laws may be enabled against it
15:38<SynrG>nmeum: installing Mac OS/X on non-Mac hardware is against the license terms
15:38<SynrG>oh ...
15:38*SynrG shrugs
15:38<acerspyro>SynrG: too late for me :3
15:38<acerspyro>oh, nvm
15:38<SynrG>really, i haven't a clue what he thinks is illegal. i would just ignore him
15:39<retrospectacus>geopete123: duplication of copyrighted material may be illegal but that is not our concern
15:39<SynrG>only about 1 in 10 things he has said all day makes sense to me :p
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15:39<retrospectacus>(we have no evidence his mp3 is copyrighted)...
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15:40<nmeum>retrospectacus: it isn't BTW
15:40<geopete123> don't know where he got it or what the author's intentions were.
15:40<retrospectacus>....and I don't care
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15:41<phillipsjk>I think geopete123 was confused because nmeum wants to convert from one lossy format to another.
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15:41<phillipsjk>You would get better results re-ripping the sound
15:41<acerspyro> Ok, I'll start from what I understand. The guy wanted to know HOW to convert from MP3 to OGG
15:42<Raf><-< I suck ur cock
15:42<acerspyro>I said that SOX could do that
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15:43<nmeum>phillipsjk: yeah, I know it's stupid
15:43<phillipsjk>retrospectacus, MP3 had patent problems in the past
15:43<acerspyro>Why aren't we all using OGG format?
15:44<geopete123> he needs to be informed that not every author agrees to the gpl for the benefit of everyone.
15:44<peter1139>iirc this is a support channel, not a ideology preaching channel
15:45<SynrG>srsly? wand where does our lofty moral mandate end?
15:45<phillipsjk>geopete123, why are you making assumptions about the content of the mp3 files? Maybe it is a meeting recording and the digital recorder only supports MP3
15:45<acerspyro>Anyone uding Debian on an iMac here? >.>
15:45<geopete123>peter1139..well you can't support people desiring to enter a life of crime...would you have supported RobinHood
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15:46<BLHolliday>oh for chrissake...
15:46<phillipsjk>OT, but Piracy is *NOT* a crime
15:46<acerspyro>That's not what I see in each movie's beginning...
15:46<phillipsjk>...unless you are hijacking boats
15:46<BLHolliday>any support chans around which aren't currently embroiled in a pointless argument?
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15:47<geopete123>phillipsjk...well perhaps you can explain then why many were caught, lawfully tried, and one of the worst possible deaths.
15:47<geopete123>phillipsjk..since you claim it is not a crime.
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15:47<BLHolliday>yes... argument through free association
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15:50<SynrG>fryzbi: hi. do you have a debian support question? lord knows, we need one.
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15:50<BLHolliday>okay... prior to the latest testing update I could mount a usb drive and r/w to it, no problem. After the update, only root can write. Ideas?
15:50<acerspyro>SynrG: I do too, but noone can answer it
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15:51<fryzbi>NO I just want to have a look on this chat
15:51<nmeum>BLHolliday: #debian-testing :p
15:51<SynrG>nmeum, BLHolliday no ...
15:51<nmeum>ah, right
15:52<BLHolliday>I'll stick around for a few more minutes in case somebody has a House moment.
15:52<BLHolliday>Been fighting this for a few days and it's annoying
15:52<SynrG>BLHolliday: but i'm on #debian-next and was going to follow up there ...
15:53<SynrG>so if someone else did want to pitch in, they could do it there, too.
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15:54<acerspyro>I have an iMac G3, I just installed the SOX package, typing "rec ./test.wav" shows up the SOX ui with no problem, but it doesn't takes input from my integrated microphone. What should I do to tell it where to pick up sound?
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15:57<Norbertos>Hi there !
15:57<Norbertos>Is there someone who familiar with Fluxbox ?
15:58<Norbertos>I have a very specific problem to solve
15:58<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
15:58<peter1139>oops :p
15:58<Norbertos>I used my Google-powers first indeed
15:58<Norbertos>Of course I will !
15:58<Norbertos>I'm just kinda slow :D
15:58<Norbertos>So here it is:
15:58<Norbertos>Debian Wheezy, installed fluxbox from the original repos
15:59<Norbertos>I'd like to use my Numpad num keys to a shortcut in ~/.fluxbox/keys
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16:02<Norbertos>But if I put "Control Mod1 1 :Workspace 1" line to my keys file, I can change the workspace with the number keys on top, but not the numpad number keys :S
16:02<Norbertos>It's kinda uncomfortable
16:03<Norbertos>I'd like to set them to the numpad ones
16:03<Norbertos>But I haven't found that what should I write to do this
16:03<Norbertos>I know there is Mod1, Mod4, Control, but I don't what is for numpad num keys
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16:08<otak>Norbertos: have you tried to use xev? On my keyboard those keys are named eg. KP_1, KP_2
16:09<retrospectacus>and tried having NumLock on/off
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16:10<retrospectacus>seems to say here they are 79 thru 89
16:12<acerspyro>Btw, I made a channel to settle debates --> #debates
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16:14<Norbertos>otak: Not yet, thanks for suggestion :)
16:14<Norbertos>retrospectatus: Of course !
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16:15<acerspyro>Sorry, it's #arguments
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16:15<otak>no it isn't
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16:31<Norbertos>otak: Mine is KP_1, KP_2... too. I tried to trick with xmodmap, but it wasnt necessary (they even didnt work !) I just wrote KP_1 to the konfig file and it worked ! Thank you ;) xev is cool ...
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16:39<feke>Im trying to open an jlnp file from a link on but when i try nothing happens (its suppose to luanch a game client). Im antix linux based on debian testing. running icewasel. and java -version says: java version "1.6.0_27"
16:39<feke>OpenJDK Runtime Environment (IcedTea6 1.12.5) (6b27-1.12.5-2)
16:39<feke>OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM (build 20.0-b12, mixed mode)
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16:40<feke>can anyone help me out with this? :)
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16:40<dpkg>antiX is a live CD distribution based on <MEPIS>. It is not supported in #debian. #mepis on See also <based on debian>.
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16:40<feke>ah ok ...
16:40<feke>thanks for the link :)
16:41<acerspyro>My X on an iMac G3 500 slot-loading with ATI Rage 128 video card crashes upon starting and leaves a debug trace
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16:41<acerspyro>says thayt
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16:41<acerspyro>says that i caught a bus error
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16:43<SynrG>zipy: heya. so you're here anyway, good :)
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16:44<SynrG>zipy: we were discussing gma500 over on #debian-eeepc, but i have no experience with it. zipy's problem is that when he wakes from suspend, the screen is black. he did not have this problem in xubuntu. we're busy trying to determine the differences (kernel, xorg, etc.) and then maybe some upgrade path for him (or patch that could be backported for wheezy)
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16:44<SynrG>s/zipy:// <- was meant for other potential helpers :)
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16:48<SynrG>by the way, to all who used to direct people to #debian-eeepc for eeepc issues, the project is pretty much dead now. there is nothing that distinguishes an eeepc from any other laptop. they're more-or-less no harder (nor easier) than any other laptop :p
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16:51<zipy>except of the ones with gma500 x)
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16:52<zipy> this is my xorg.0.log
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16:52<SynrG>well, gma500 is a disaster anyway ...
16:52<zipy>when i try to resume from suspend it wakes up but gives me a black screen only
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16:53<SynrG>and not a disaster specific to eeepc
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16:53<SynrG>so what i want to know, since this works on some other distros, is which components are different.
16:54<SynrG>on xubuntu is it using the same xorg driver, for example. and how do the kernels compare? a kernel backport is the obvious first thing to try ...
16:54<zipy>shall i get the xorg log from xubuntu too?
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16:54<SynrG>well, let's try the things we *can* upgrade in wheezy
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16:54<judd>Available kernel versions are: experimental: 3.10-rc7-686-pae (3.10~rc7-1~exp1); sid: 3.10-1-686-pae (3.10.1-1); jessie: 3.9-1-686-pae (3.9.8-1); wheezy-backports: 3.9-0.bpo.1-686-pae (3.9.6-1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-4-686-pae (3.2.46-1); squeeze-backports: 3.2.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.2.46-1~bpo60+1); squeeze: 2.6.32-5-686 (2.6.32-48squeeze3)
16:54-!-terrible96 [~terrible@] has joined #debian
16:54<SynrG>use the wheezy-backports kernel
16:54<SynrG>see if that solves it
16:55<SynrG>then yes, probably want to compare xorg log from xubuntu
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16:57<zipy>ok this is my xorg from xubuntu
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17:00<dpkg> mangles input, takes forever to load, often makes us enter a CAPTCHA to see your paste and fills the screen with ads. Please use a different site, like
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17:02<SynrG>zipy: looks like they're both supported through FBDEV
17:02<SynrG>oh, wait, i'm still looking at the old paste
17:02<zipy>looks pretty much the same logs
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17:04<SynrG>zipy: yeah. looks like the kernel may be a *tiny* bit a head (a few point releases) and xorg behind (1.11 on xubuntu vs 1.12 on wheezy)
17:04-!-SBauer [] has joined #debian
17:04<SynrG>but i don't really know the ubuntu kernel numbering scheme, so can't say for sure
17:04-!-krozus [] has quit []
17:05<SynrG>zipy: anyway, might be worth trying that wheezy-backports kernel. going to give that a go?
17:05<zipy>i can try, but how do i change the kernels
17:06<retrospectacus>!tell zipy about bpo kernel
17:07<retrospectacus>(then simply choose it while booting at the Grub screen)
17:07<acerspyro>What is the "int10" module inside Xorg?
17:07<acerspyro>In the log file, X crashes right after loading it
17:08<acerspyro>I removed it from the config file, still loads it
17:08<SynrG>grabbing a meal at masstown? what are you having?
17:08<SynrG>ECHAN. sorry
17:08*retrospectacus giggles
17:08<zipy>ok so i just have to add deb wheezy-backports main to the sources.lst and update?
17:09<retrospectacus>zipy: yes, and install linux-image-whatever
17:09-!-csotelo [~carlos@] has joined #debian
17:09<zipy>ok and then i can select it at boot
17:10-!-mtn [~mtn@] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:10<zipy>do i need dep-src too?
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17:10<retrospectacus>zipy: no
17:10<zipy>okay i give it a try
17:11<SynrG>good luck
17:11<SynrG>zipy: btw, i'm out for a while now. errands
17:11<zipy>cu thx for help
17:12<zipy>i cant wait to get rid of all my ubuntu installations -.-
17:12<acerspyro>nd me? :'(
17:13<zipy>slowly get annoyed of all those unstable crashs and all the 3rd party packages + amazon crap etc
17:13-!-Walex [] has joined #debian
17:13<zipy>u r still here, i can thank you later :D
17:13<retrospectacus>acerspyro: put that log on
17:13-!-amphi [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:13<zipy>ah ops
17:14<zipy>it was retro ^^
17:14-!-Brigo [] has joined #debian
17:14<zipy>ubuntu was just nice to get into linux from windows
17:15-!-cat_guy [~petarboes@] has joined #debian
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17:15<cat_guy>can I boot debian from ubuntu
17:16<zipy>what do u mean
17:16<zipy>u have ubuntu installed
17:16<zipy>and now u want to install debian next to ubuntu (dualboot)?
17:16-!-drali_ [] has joined #debian
17:17<cat_guy>no just debian
17:17-!-rik_ [~rik@2a02:578:f2e:0:e2cb:4eff:fe25:19a7] has joined #debian
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17:17<zipy>just download the netinstaller image
17:17<zipy>and boot from usb or cd
17:17<Out`Of`Control>or live CD image
17:17<zipy>same as u did in ubuntu
17:18<LtL>dpkg: u
17:18<dpkg>Damnit Jim! It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1, or wud. Dutch for 'you' (formal singular). See
17:18-!-amphi [] has joined #debian
17:18<LtL>speak english
17:18<Out`Of`Control>LtL u said something?
17:19<cat_guy>that escalates quickly
17:19<retrospectacus>cat_guy: you just asking how to install debian?
17:19-!-hazard2 [~hazard@] has joined #debian
17:19<cat_guy>no not really
17:19<acerspyro>retrospectacus: sorry I was in another terminal
17:19<acerspyro>I will
17:20-!-mode/#debian [+l 596] by debhelper
17:20-!-barballs [] has joined #debian
17:20<barballs>hey folks! :)
17:20<retrospectacus>wb barballs
17:21<acerspyro>retrospectacus: how do I do it in a terminal? Send a file there?
17:21<acerspyro>I don't feel like typing it all by hand
17:21<barballs>ty retrospectacus :)
17:21<acerspyro>There =
17:21<retrospectacus>acerspyro: apt-get install pastebinit && pastebinit /var/log/Xorg.0.log
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17:24<zipy>hmm retrospectacus, which kernel should i try, there r so many. maybe this one: linux-image-3.9-0.bpo.1-686-pae ?
17:24-!-manux [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:24<barballs>Have a question for the collective. I have two WD My Book USB External drives. Upon login only one is mounted. The other shows in the devices list on files but won't mount. They are both NTFS. The USB3 one is not mounting (not sure that has anything to do with anything though)
17:24<acerspyro>retrospectacus: it says the API has been disabled
17:24<retrospectacus>zipy: apt-get -t wheezy-backports install linux-image-686-pae
17:25-!-Calinou [] has quit [Quit: Excess Flood]
17:25<retrospectacus>acerspyro: pastebinit -b /var/log/Xorg.0.log
17:26<zipy>ok time to reboot
17:26<barballs>I can not see it in my /media folder either. the error that shows up on gnome is "unprivalaged user can not mount NTFS block devices using the external FUSE library. How do I make myself privaleged?
17:26-!-rik_ [~rik@2a02:578:f2e:0:e2cb:4eff:fe25:19a7] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:27<retrospectacus>acerspyro: try putting Option "Int10" "off" in the device section for you radeon
17:28<acerspyro>I have an Rage 128
17:29<retrospectacus>what driver are you using for that?
17:29<acerspyro>It's not using it?
17:29<cat_guy>1 4rn r0vv 2q34I<1r6 1337
17:30<retrospectacus>cat_guy: unless you have a Debian question (in English)... please be quiet
17:30<cat_guy>yeah yeah was jus bored
17:30<zipy>still black screen after resume :(
17:30<acerspyro>retrospectacus: still crashing
17:30<retrospectacus>go be bored in #moocows
17:31<zipy>it wakes up and i also hear sound when i press right or left arrow
17:31<retrospectacus>acerspyro: did you tryed disabling int10 in r128?
17:31<zipy>but still stays black
17:31<acerspyro>Option "int10" "off"
17:31<acerspyro>I add it to which section?
17:31<retrospectacus>acerspyro: device section
17:32<retrospectacus>acerspyro: the log should be different if it is disabled
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17:32<retrospectacus>zipy: confirm you are running the new kernel? (uname -a)
17:33<zipy>Linux zipy-eee 3.9-0.bpo.1-686-pae #1 SMP Debian 3.9.6-1~bpo70+1 i686 GNU/Linux
17:33<zipy>but now i hear a scratchy sound when it wakes up
17:33<zipy>i heard that in xubuntu too
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17:39<zipy>i wont give up yet :D i try out everything i can find about the gma 500 :P
17:39<zipy>is there a suspend log?
17:39-!-mczhb_ [] has joined #debian
17:40<zipy>this time i saw the terminal shortly
17:40<zipy>after resume
17:41<retrospectacus>zipy: you could try getting in by ssh afterwards, might be something on ~/.xsession-errors or Xorg.0.log
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17:43<zipy> my .xsession-errors
17:44<retrospectacus>zipy: or in dmesg
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17:44<retrospectacus>zipy: please stop using that site, as SynrG mentioned
17:45<SynrG>re. back only for a few mins at the bus stop
17:45<zipy>oh ok sorry
17:45<zipy>lol u r on the bus stop right now?
17:45-!-ajbbonkoski [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:45<SynrG>A&W free wifi
17:45-!-vladuke [~vladuke@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:45<SynrG>about 100 yards away
17:45<zipy>u r using a bouncer?
17:46<SynrG>no, maybe half that. yeah, ssh -> screen -> irssi
17:46<zipy>u were still connected
17:46-!-mczhb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:46-!-mczhb_ is now known as mczhb
17:46<SynrG>always on, 24/7. anyway, about the last logs ... (and please use ...
17:46-!-amphi [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:47<SynrG>there are some interesting gnome-settings-daemon things in there. not sure if those are relevant or not.
17:47<zipy>how r u still connected
17:48<zipy>over the time u had no internet connection
17:48<dpkg>Damnit Jim! It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1, or wud. Dutch for 'you' (formal singular). See
17:48<nmeum>what package do i need do install if i want emacs without a gui?
17:49<retrospectacus>zipy: put "dmesg" output on
17:49<retrospectacus>nmeum: emacs24-nox
17:50-!-Walex [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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17:52<retrospectacus>nmeum: emacs23-nox
17:53-!-swirl_ [] has quit [Quit: see u guys]
17:53<nmeum>ah, thanks
17:54<retrospectacus>zipy: I am not sure, it says gma500 0000:00:02.0: Backlight lvds set brightness 7a122710 it should be on
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17:58<LordD>hello room
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18:00-!-mode/#debian [+l 587] by debhelper
18:00<SynrG>zipy: hi from the bus. not getting EDID means it can't autoconfigure video properly. so ... a possible workaround might be to populate your xorg.conf with some appropriate modes (or an xorg.conf.d snippet)
18:00<SynrG>what's not clear is if that really has anything to do with the behaviour after suspend, or just when the display is started. another thing to test is to see if this is xorg-specific or not. might want to try shutting down X, logging in as console and suspending from there. then wake from suspend and see if your screen is dark or not
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18:01<SynrG>looking at your dmesg output
18:01<SynrG>btw, only have wifi here at this bus connection for another few mins, too.
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18:02<zipy>even the brightness keys work
18:02<SynrG>lines 392-394 from that last paste look relevant.
18:02<SynrG>zipy: after kernel upgrade, still black after resume, though?
18:02<LordD>hey has any one have problem with mounting ntfs
18:02<SynrG>zipy: can you restore it with brightness keys?
18:02<zipy>but i see the blackscreen goes lower or higher
18:02<SynrG>zipy: can you restore it with ctrl-alt-f1 ctrl-alt-f7
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18:03<SynrG>that might reset video
18:03<zipy>i tried, doesnt work
18:03<SynrG>so it looks like there's a backlight and it turned off.
18:03<SynrG>maybe there's some /sys interface for that or so
18:03<LordD>I am only able to mount ntfs in root only
18:03<SynrG>zipy: try /sys/class/backlight/
18:04<SynrG>and maybe some value echoed to some node there will help
18:04<barballs>is there a "perform as root" or equivalent option for right click menu?
18:04-!-notrev [~notrev@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:04<barballs>in Gnome that is
18:04<SynrG>barballs: i don't think so. i think those things that need root have *.desktop files that wrap the command in gksudo
18:05<barballs>but say you wanted to mount a device as root from GUI
18:05<SynrG>barballs: you could use alacarte to make a custom desktop file to wrap something in gksudo yourself
18:05<barballs>that's not possible?
18:05<barballs>will have to look that one up :)
18:06<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell LordD about user accessible ntfs
18:06<barballs>LordD I have havin the same problems
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18:07<barballs>only with external USB drives
18:07<LordD>yea same here barballs
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18:07<barballs>THe first one mounts fine in gnome. Any subsequent one refuses to mount
18:07<LordD>I install all the packages
18:08<LordD>and still no luck
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18:08<barballs>the set guid:root suggestion does not work for me either
18:08-!-pos_ [~mark@] has joined #debian
18:09<barballs>remove the space after //
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18:12<LordD>ill try it and stell what happnes
18:12<barballs>yeah trying it myself
18:12<barballs>only thing for me is that in GUI i can see "My Book" as a device
18:13<barballs>however in terminal i can't
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18:14<barballs>so I don't know how I can run a command I don't have an argument for :)
18:14<LordD>Yea I don't GUI for the device I am using or the flash drive
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18:15<LordD>sometimes you can see what the name of the device with df -h
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18:16<barballs>that found something
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18:19<barballs>oh yeah!
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18:19<LordD>Did you get something
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18:20<zipy>i got it to work
18:20<barballs>ok i got it to mount by finding the /dev/sd(whateverletterthedrivewas)1
18:20<zipy> pm-suspend --quirk-vbestate-restore <-- this works
18:20<zipy>i tried vbemode before
18:20<barballs>then just did sudo mount /dev/sd(x)1
18:20<barballs>and it worked
18:20<retrospectacus>zipy: very nice
18:21-!-mtn [~mtn@] has joined #debian
18:21<zipy>so if someone else got this problem u know now :D
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18:21<dpkg>Damnit Jim! It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1, or wud. Dutch for 'you' (formal singular). See
18:22<barballs>if you are dual booting LordD you can find out which letter your drive is then just replace (x) with that
18:22<barballs>and it will work
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18:23<zipy>retrospectacus, -.- im trying to think of typing you.. but its hard since i used u to often... bad habbit
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18:23<LordD>Okay Yea I am not dual booting but i going try the sudo mount with my flash drive
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18:24<zipy>retrospectacus, if this works with the old kernel too, should i still stick with the backport version?
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18:24<Norbertos>Hi there !
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18:24<Norbertos>Is this Flux menu structure okay ?
18:24<retrospectacus>zipy: yeah, might as well if it works.
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18:28<zipy>awesome, it works! you guys rock, thx for help
18:29<SynrG>zipy: oh? what finally solved it?
18:29<SynrG>zipy: i only just stepped back in the door
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18:29<SynrG>ahh.. --quirk-vbestate-restore cool
18:29<zipy>pm-suspend --quirk-vbestate-restore
18:29<SynrG>do you use eeepc-acpi-scripts?
18:30-!-jalalsfs [~jalal@] has joined #debian
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18:30<SynrG>(not that you need to; just curious who is still using this old thing and on what models)
18:30<zipy>its a fresh install
18:30<zipy>wohoo finally a rocksolid stable system :D
18:31<SynrG>zipy: would you mind editing the wiki page for your model?
18:31<SynrG>as i said, i think all these pages now belong on /InstallDebianOn on the wiki, but if you could just edit whatever's there now for 1101HA with whatever notes you can for wheezy, that would be super
18:32<SynrG>don't worry about format or anything. just mind-dump whatever you know. our wiki editors can clean it up, reparent it & whatever afterwards.
18:32<SynrG>the valuable stuff is the stuff *only you* can supply, which is specific to your model.
18:32<zipy>ok but i try to get it work with lid close now first :D
18:33<zipy>cuz it doesnt suspend when i close lid only locks
18:33<SynrG>i see. well, that should obey the gnome setting for it. we want to see whatever messages come out of an attempted suspend on close lid
18:34<zipy>hmm in advanced settings it says suspend on close lid
18:35<SynrG>yeah. so, first, wc -l ~/.xsession-errors to note the line# of the last line
18:36<SynrG>then close lid and open, and then only paste the stuff after that line, e.g. tail -n +1000 ~/.xsession-errors (or whatever the line# was ... don't forget the plus sign)
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18:40<SynrG>zipy: translate "Unbekannt"?
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18:41<SynrG>Unknown, i guess
18:41<SynrG>nothing useful there about lid action. how about in /var/log/syslog (again, only *recent* messages around the time of the lid close/open)
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18:42<SynrG>hmm. maybe this is the place where installing eeepc-acpi-scripts actually will still help you.
18:43<chris>anyone ever see this error: E: I wasn't able to locate a file for the libaccountsservice0 package. This might mean you need to manually fix this package.
18:43<zipy>unbekannt = unknown
18:43<SynrG>zipy: so, let's try just installing eeepc-acpi-scripts.
18:43<SynrG>yes. saw that. moving on :)
18:43<chris>hhahaha very funny SynrG
18:44<SynrG>chris: funny what? i am responding to zipy.
18:44<zipy>u still need syslog?
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18:44<Norbertos>Whether is it a regular flux menu file ?
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18:44<chris>i tried hitting the computer with a rubber mallet but it didn't help
18:44<zipy>hm why is my brightness keys working now
18:44<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
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18:44<SynrG>chris: ^^
18:44<zipy>i think i did some changes in grub too ^^
18:45<Reeckz>Hi, I'm having a issue installing debian. I get the "Bad Archive Mirror" error. I got no clue what to do, I've pinged ( doesn't work?).
18:45<SynrG>zipy: i think maybe not right now (the syslog)
18:45<zipy>i think i will reinstall again when everything works
18:45<SynrG>zipy: brightness didn't work before what?
18:45<zipy>just for the wiki
18:45<zipy>i think not
18:45<SynrG>if you like. did you do a lot of tinkering?
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18:46<zipy>ye ^^
18:46<SynrG>if you're going to do that, maybe i'll start with the reparenting job in the wiki
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18:47<zipy>i changed this in grub: GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash console=tty1" and GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX="acpi_osi=Linux acpi_backlight=vendor"
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18:47<SynrG>zipy: i think maybe don't do acpi_osi=Linux ... unless that solved something
18:47-!-Walex [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:47<zipy>k i restore it
18:47<SynrG>then reboot and retest all the important behaviours we've solved to date
18:48<SynrG>and retest the lid action thing
18:48-!-geopete123 [] has joined #debian
18:48<SynrG>if that's not helping, then we're back to trying to solve it with eeepc-acpi-scripts
18:49<SynrG>but ... hmm, that's not quite right.
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18:49<SynrG>see, i think acpi-support should be handling this.
18:49<SynrG>oh! do you not have acpi-support installed?
18:49<SynrG>zipy: at install time did you select "laptop" or not?
18:49<SynrG>zipy: task-laptop depends on acpi-support. and that contains generic lid action support code.
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18:50<zipy>it was preselected
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18:50<Reeckz>SynrG, after you solve zipys' issue, got time to help me? :)
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18:50<zipy>u cant ping google?
18:51<SynrG>hey, i'm not the only person capable of solving things :)
18:51<Reeckz>You seem to be the only one active.
18:51<zipy>k still works with the old grub
18:51<SynrG>only because i talk too much
18:51<Reeckz>I can't do netinstall, i get a error saying "Bad Archive Mirror".
18:51<zipy>brightness keys dont work anymore
18:51<Reeckz>I tried pinging
18:52<Reeckz>ping: bad port spec ''
18:52<SynrG>did you choose "Configure the network automatically" and did it succeed?
18:52<Reeckz>but pinging works
18:52<SynrG>huh? you don't ping web addresses :p
18:52<Reeckz>It's a virtualised server, did it manually.
18:52<phillipsjk>remove http://
18:52<retrospectacus>ping takes names, not URLs
18:53<Reeckz>bad port spec ''
18:53<SynrG>Reeckz: re "being the only one", see? retrospectacus is alive :)
18:53<Reeckz>I think it's something in the network settings =/
18:53<SynrG>zipy: ah, humm ... so that was after backing out the acpi_osi=Linux change?
18:53*phillipsjk is not; he is supposed to be leaving for work.
18:53<SynrG>zipy: was that the *only* thing you changed this time around?
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18:54<zipy>yes and the console tty line
18:54<SynrG>well, it's unlikely that hurt it ...
18:54<zipy>i installed the eee script now
18:54<SynrG>but changing one thing at a time is best practice when trying to nail down what was responsible :)
18:55<SynrG>zipy: that *may* fix the lid action, but only because it depends on acpi-support
18:55<SynrG>zipy: did it bring in acpi-support along with it? or was that already installed?
18:55<zipy>hm do i have to reboot? cuz it still doesnt suspend on close
18:56<SynrG>zipy: so this is the point at which i want to see those syslog messages relating to lid
18:56<Reeckz>@retrospectacus So, any ideas?
18:56-!-capo [~capo@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:56<SynrG>Reeckz: there's no way ping returns "bad port spec". that's not debian's ping
18:56<SynrG>Reeckz: take it up with your VPS provider?
18:56<SynrG>sounds like they have some screwy shit installed
18:56<zipy>Reeckz, u finished the installation and it also downloaded the updates during installation?
18:57<Reeckz>It's a HyperV virtual instance. And no, it's during install.
18:57<zipy>how did u ping during installation? tty?
18:58<SynrG>oh, even better
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18:58<Reeckz>I'm trying to install it, but when it asks for a mirror it gives me this error:
18:58<zipy>try another mirror
18:59<SynrG>so maybe you want to take this up with Microsoft?
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18:59<SynrG>i don't know the first thing about HyperV
18:59<SynrG>and no way to reproduce your issues with it
18:59<Reeckz>I've tried like 16 mirrors.
18:59<SynrG>do they have a support channel?
18:59<SynrG>this is likely a HyperV-specific problem.
18:59<zipy>hmm i would go back until network configuration again
19:00<Reeckz>it's a bridged connection. It connects to the internet just fine? (Pings IPs?)
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19:00<SynrG>Reeckz: yeah, but can it do nameserver lookups?
19:00<zipy>how do u ping ?
19:00<SynrG>Reeckz: e.g. 'host'
19:00-!-ao2 [~u@2001:1418:117::1] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
19:00<zipy>in installation, where did u get a terminal
19:00<SynrG>Reeckz: is there anything in /etc/resolv.conf ?
19:01<Reeckz>ALT + CTRL + 2
19:01<SynrG>zipy: so ... the lid syslog messages?
19:01<Reeckz>Sorry, yeah F2
19:02<Reeckz>I can't access /etc/resolv.conf , vi / nano isn't installed yet =(
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19:02<Reeckz>And 'host' doesn't work.
19:03<retrospectacus>Reeckz: cat /etc/resolv.conf
19:03<zipy>its not the ful syslo
19:03-!-wissem [~localhost@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:03<zipy>how can i copy all from nano
19:05<zipy>Length of code is not allowed to exceed 150kB ^^
19:05<SynrG>Reeckz: yeah, cat is fine. you don't need an editor for that
19:05<SynrG>Reeckz: oh, i see. the 'bad host' or 'bad port spec' is inside the very limited installer environment.
19:05<zipy> sry for pastebin but was to long for paste.debian :P
19:06<SynrG>zipy: there are still better alternatives to that accept longer
19:06<SynrG>anything but :p
19:07-!-adb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:07<Reeckz>So what exactly is it supposed to say? I see "search " and "nameserver "
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19:08<SynrG>zipy: ok, so all i see there is that there is a lid switch.
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19:08<zipy>thats more then i can see ^^
19:08<SynrG>zipy: now, edit /etc/default/acpi-support and find this line and uncomment it:
19:08-!-asmask [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:08<SynrG>maybe this will help
19:09<SynrG>again, we didn't need eeepc-acpi-scripts for that. just acpi-support itself.
19:09<zipy>it is uncommented
19:09-!-klatin_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:09<retrospectacus>Reeckz: it is supposed to have an IP there after nameserver
19:09<SynrG>zipy: it was beforehand? or you just did now?
19:09<Reeckz>Yeah, it does.
19:10-!-mode/#debian [+l 581] by debhelper
19:10<zipy>it was already
19:10<Reeckz>It's the IP i see listed as "Gateway"
19:10<zipy>schall i remove #?
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19:10<SynrG>if there is # then it is *commented* not *uncommented*
19:10<SynrG>yes, remove the # to uncomment, please :)
19:11<zipy>oh, my bad
19:11<SynrG>my bad for assuming you knew "to uncomment" means to remove the # :)
19:12<zipy>i knew
19:12<zipy>dunno what i thought lol
19:12<zipy>still doesnt suspend ^^
19:13<SynrG>yes, but ... did acpid reload your config change?
19:13-!-asmask [] has joined #debian
19:13<zipy>how do i reload
19:13<zipy>i just saved the file and tried out
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19:13<SynrG>/etc/init.d/acpid reload
19:14<zipy>k i did but still doesnt suspend
19:14<zipy>[ ok ] Reloading ACPI services....
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19:15<zipy>may i change the grub line again?
19:15<SynrG>hm. it may be that by default because gnome-power-manager runs, it refuses to meddle in the affairs of your lid
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19:15<SynrG>zipy: you didn't yet restore back the acpi_osi="Linux" thing?
19:15<retrospectacus>Reeckz: well that should be your nameserver. if it doesn't work... shrug
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19:15<zipy>it is set back to default again
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19:16<Reeckz>So...nothing can be done? o.o
19:16<zipy>updated grub and rebooted
19:16<SynrG>zipy: i think we found the brightness keys didn't work, without that, right?
19:16<zipy>they didnt work
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19:16<zipy>Reeckz, i would try reinstall again
19:17<zipy>and watch carefully for errors when its setting up ur network
19:17<zipy>and maybe sha1 the image before installing too
19:18-!-danu [~danu@] has joined #debian
19:18<Reeckz>So how does one "SHA1 the image" ?
19:18-!-Walex [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:18<SynrG>i doubt if you have a bad image
19:18-!-danu [~danu@] has quit []
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19:19<SynrG>i'm pretty sure if there is any damage to the image when you download it or burn it to media, the installer refuses to start
19:19<SynrG>because it checksums itself
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19:19<bejker>cane some one help me with alsarc?
19:19<SynrG>bejker: on debian wheezy?
19:20<bejker>on fuckin kubuntu
19:20<bejker>but thise is almost debian ;]
19:20<SynrG>!ubuntuirc bejker
19:20<dpkg>bejker: This is not the Ubuntu help channel. Please do /server and then /join #ubuntu. If you are using XChat, you can right-click the following link and choose connect. irc://
19:20<bejker>but thise problem is thise same in that os
19:20<SynrG>!based on debian
19:20<dpkg>Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare #debian only supports Debian; please respect our choice to volunteer here to help Debian users. Support for other distributions is off-topic on #debian, even if your own distro's channel is clueless or non-existent.
19:20<bejker>i just want to hange default sound card
19:21<SynrG>if they're not helping you, that's sad. but not our problem.
19:21<dpkg>Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) is a Linux kernel component providing device drivers for sound cards. Ask me about <install alsa>. See also <alsa-checklist>, <default alsa>, <alsa firmware>. #alsa on
19:21<bejker>ok i go there cu hf
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19:22<SynrG>these people might also be able to help
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19:22<Reeckz>So, i made it to where it asks for "Name server adresses"
19:22<Reeckz>I defaulted to the Gateway address.
19:22<SynrG>really? you're having to bang that in yourself?
19:22<Reeckz>It defaulted *
19:22<SynrG>configuring the network automatically is not working for you?
19:22-!-bejker [] has quit []
19:23<SynrG>that's half the problem right there.
19:23<Reeckz>The host OS works without a problem =/
19:23<SynrG>your network administrator should provide you with a valid nameserver address
19:23<SynrG>this may or may not be the gateway address.
19:23<SynrG>the host OS is windows, right? if you can bring up a command shell, try 'ipconfig'
19:24<SynrG>look for the nameserver address there. if it doesn't show you that, there's some switch that i forget right now that shows more info.
19:24<SynrG>ipconfig /all
19:25<Reeckz>"DNS Servers" ?
19:26<SynrG>it's funny though, you would think that if the interface is bridged, automatic would work (assuming automatic also works on the host)
19:26-!-paco [~paco171@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:26<SynrG>at least in other virtual environments where i use bridged (virtualbox, to name one) it works
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19:27<Reeckz>I'm using HyperV because It's what I'll be using at school.
19:27<SynrG>Reeckz: are there other HyperV network configuration options that may help here? like i said, i don't know the product ... maybe it is just set up incorrectly to allow "auto" to work.
19:27<SynrG>Reeckz: i know virtualbox defaults to NAT or so ... are you sure you're on bridged?
19:28<SynrG>with bridged, you should get an ip# on the same network as your host.
19:28<SynrG>and should be able to DHCP directly to the DHCP server on your host's network
19:28<SynrG>(assuming you have one)
19:28<Reeckz>Honestly, I don't know.
19:29<SynrG>compare the IP# you got in the installer with the one on the host. are they within the same network?
19:29<Reeckz>I got a /29, and yes.
19:29-!-mtn [~mtn@] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
19:29<Reeckz>The DNS is something completely different though.
19:30-!-mode/#debian [+l 574] by debhelper
19:30<Reeckz>I gave the installer a IP within the /29
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19:31<SynrG>Reeckz: in your "ipconfig /all" output on the host, is your "DHCP Server" set, and/or "Dhcp Enabled"?
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19:31<Reeckz>Hmm, it's "scanning the mirrir..." now.
19:31-!-daniel-s_ [~daniel-s@2001:388:608c:4c40:e8bc:14d2:7af0:4332] has joined #debian
19:31<SynrG>Reeckz: so you've tried "automatically configure the network" before, and it failed?
19:31<Reeckz>And "Bad archive mirror"
19:32<SynrG>sucks. and what about the settings from ipconfig /all on the host i asked for above?
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19:32<Reeckz>DHCP Enable: No
19:32<SynrG>crappity crap crap crap
19:32-!-sidmo [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
19:32<SynrG>so you have no DHCP server??
19:33<Reeckz>It's a Server I rent from a Datacenter.
19:33<SynrG>super. so maybe they won't give you another IP#, hm?
19:33<SynrG>if you rent that, you probably only rent one IP# as well
19:33<Reeckz>I got 5 with this node.
19:33<SynrG>new plan. try to configure HyperV to use NAT instead
19:33<Reeckz>A full /29
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19:33<SynrG>well ...
19:34<SynrG>so if you know for certain you have an unused one
19:34<SynrG>then if you manually configure DNS with the address the host uses *and* HyperV is really bridged ...
19:34<SynrG>it should all "just work"
19:34<SynrG>(assuming you got the other details right: netmask, gateway, ip#)
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19:35<Reeckz>I got "IP Blocks" - "Usable Range" - "Gateway" - "Subnet"
19:35<SynrG>sorry ... from what?
19:35<Reeckz>Reverse DNS.
19:35<Reeckz>Their control panel.
19:35-!-pipeep [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:36<Reeckz>Inhouse, I also got Reverse DNS & A ton of graphs...
19:36-!-LordD [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:37<SynrG>hurl a brick at it. hurl it really hard, and swear. then go out and choose a linux-based hosting solution :)
19:37<Reeckz>Sadly, that's not a option. I wish i could do that..
19:37<SynrG>(brick hurling and swearing optional, but it might help make you feel better ... briefly)
19:37<SynrG>maybe ##windows @ freenode knows about HyperV and manual IP# configuration?
19:37<Reeckz>The reason I'm using windows in the first place, Is because the game server we'll run on it doesn't support linux.
19:38<SynrG>ya. i know. reasons.
19:38<SynrG>and i bet you don't want to do it the other way around. windows on virtualbox cuz ... latency?
19:39<SynrG>anyway, if you had some quality HyperV help, i'm sure you would get further, faster.
19:40<SynrG>i'm sure if you pay MS $$ they would love to help ;)
19:40<SynrG>(or some consultant)
19:41<SynrG>gotta take a break, guys. i haven't eaten :)
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19:46<looool>HI i'm new and trying debian :)
19:47<zipy>nice ;)
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19:51<SynrG>xReeckz: so, i got flood kicked due to that netsplit. missed anything you might have said since i mused about windows on virtualbox ...
19:51<zipy>nothing was said
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19:52<Norbertos>I'd like to install 32 bit binaries, but no success
19:52<Norbertos>Synaptic told me: "This package requires multiarch to be enabled before it can be installed, use "dpkg --add-architecture i386"
19:53<Norbertos>I did that, but I'm still unable to install i32-libs
19:53<SynrG>you didn't apt-get update after that, i bet?
19:53<SynrG>and ia32-libs is dead. long live multiarch
19:53<retrospectacus>Norbertos: there is no longer any such package. You may install whichever 32-bit libraries you like though
19:53<SynrG>(well, not dead, but deprecated)
19:53<Norbertos>If I want to install with apt-get, it says ia32-libs-i386 is right, then I do that, and it tells me I have broken packages
19:54<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
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19:55<SynrG>Norbertos: if you're trying to install a third-party package that thinks it needs ia32-libs, it is wrong.
19:55-!-zem_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:55<SynrG>at last wrong for wheezy
19:55<SynrG>so install the right package instead.
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19:56<Norbertos>Here it is:
19:57<Norbertos>SynrG: Definitely no, because 32 bit Skype not able to do voice calling without 32 bit libs, I installed them on LMDE, and it worked. Definitely.
19:57<zipy>i think i dont want to let my eee suspend when lid close
19:57<SynrG>no, see, you're doing it wrong
19:57<Norbertos>So ?
19:57<zipy>i simply can press fn + f1 anyways
19:58<retrospectacus>Norbertos: where did you even get the idea to install ia32-libs?
19:58<SynrG>Norbertos: make sure you're following the 'amd64' instructions under that heading
19:59<SynrG>retrospectacus: probably from using LMDE?
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19:59<SynrG>Norbertos: debian isn't LMDE. just because something worked a certain way on LMDE doesn't mean it's going to work the same way on Debian
20:00<Norbertos>SynrG: I was well aware before
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20:00<Norbertos>retrospectatus: I just want full support for 32 bit apps, but you have the choice to fix me, or tell me how
20:01<SynrG>Norbertos: having trouble reading?
20:01<retrospectacus>the dpkg --add-architecture i386 was all you need
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20:01<SynrG>20:58 < SynrG>
20:01<SynrG>20:58 < SynrG> Norbertos: make sure you're following the 'amd64' instructions under that heading
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20:01<SynrG>Norbertos: nowhere there does it say to install ia32-libs
20:02<retrospectacus>installing a 32-bit program with apt-get/dpkg will bring in whatever 32-bit libraries it needs
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20:02<Norbertos>SynrG: No, fortunately I don't have Dyslexia
20:02<SynrG>please note the 'apt-get -f install'. maybe you missed this step?
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20:02<SynrG>Norbertos: well, i wondered, since you were still complaining about lack of support to retrospectacus after i had given you the answer.
20:02<Norbertos>SynerG: Well, I don't understand your last sentence, so I may have a problem ...
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20:03<SynrG>Norbertos: which sentence? the one about 'apt-get -f install' which is quoted exactly from the link i just gave?
20:03<Norbertos>Yea, I didn't know there is "force", I try that way too
20:03<Norbertos>Oh, no, sorry, I slowed down
20:03<retrospectacus>that's "fix missing" not force
20:04<SynrG>yeah, force is something else (and avoid using this!) for dpkg
20:04<Norbertos>Oh, sorry ....
20:04<retrospectacus>(you must (well, may need to) run it after installing a 3rd party deb not from the repos)
20:04<SynrG>another way to solve this is with gdepi
20:04<Norbertos>Well, whatever it is, didn't work ...
20:04<SynrG>sorry, "didn't work" tells us zero
20:05<retrospectacus>Norbertos: just follow the directions... it works for everyone else. If it really doesn't work, make a pastebin
20:05<SynrG>what did you type? what did you expect? what happened instead? paste lengthy output to please.
20:05<Norbertos>SynrG: Using the -f switch gave the same output I pasted before
20:06<SynrG>-f switch on *what*?
20:06<SynrG>are you still trying to install ia32-libs?
20:06<retrospectacus>what you pasted before is not even close to what the directions say
20:06<Norbertos>didn't work = leave my situation intact
20:06<SynrG>because the output above is about ia32-libs
20:06<Norbertos>SynrG: Yea'
20:06<SynrG>which we've repeatedly said DO NOT USE
20:06<SynrG>so i am beginning to think you really do have trouble reading instructions :p
20:07<Norbertos>Yes, it is possible, I don't doubt :S
20:07<SynrG>shall i start quoting the wiki page line by line?
20:07<Norbertos>No, I know RTFM
20:07<SynrG>Then, download the i386 package as above and install:
20:07<SynrG># wget -O skype-install.deb
20:07<SynrG># dpkg -i skype-install.deb
20:07<SynrG># apt-get -f install
20:07<SynrG>badabing. you should be happy
20:07<Norbertos>Anyway, it was an example only, I don't want to install Skype right now, I just want to get 32 bit support
20:08<SynrG>you don't "get 32 bit support". that's nonsense that we did away with with the release of wheezy.
20:09<SynrG>what you have now is the *capability* to install *any* packages from i386
20:09<SynrG>all a package needs to do is depend on the right libs
20:09<Norbertos>Well, I understand now :)
20:09<Norbertos>Thanks ;)
20:09<SynrG>install the package, and apt pulls in the deps
20:09<Norbertos>It's okay now :)
20:09<SynrG>very well.
20:09<SynrG>anyone with a real problem? tired of chasing pretend problems.
20:10-!-wefa [~wefa@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:10<Norbertos>Oh, poor you !
20:10<Norbertos>You know, every professional was a newbie someday
20:11-!-wefa [~wefa@] has joined #debian
20:12<Norbertos>SynrG: Well, I don't tire you more, I hope no newbie will get in your way in the future !
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20:13<barballs>another satisfied customer
20:13<retrospectacus>another 15 minutes of volunteer time wasted on a made-up problem
20:13<TheMike>How can I check what key signed a package installed on my system?
20:13<zipy>synergy, which page of the wiki shall i edit
20:14<zipy>SynrG, ^^
20:14<zipy>oh boy i didnt know that gnome3 is so awesome
20:14<zipy>i used gnome in ubuntu 10.04 the last time i think
20:15<retrospectacus>call the newspaper - another gnome-shell fan
20:15<zipy>i guess u r using xfce?
20:15<retrospectacus>me? yep
20:15-!-Walex [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:15<retrospectacus>and don't make me say !u again
20:16<zipy>argh i forgot again :(
20:16<dpkg>Damnit Jim! It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1, or wud. Dutch for 'you' (formal singular). See
20:16<barballs>u got you bro!
20:16<zipy>you dont like gnome3?
20:16<barballs>damn typo
20:17<SynrG>yes, because i'm such an asshole. yeesh
20:17<barballs>You know what linux needs? more GUI specialists. make a nice GUI it's the only thing keeping linux behind the rest of the pack
20:17<SynrG>sorry, i should gripe -> #debian-offtopic
20:17<zipy>i think there r enaugh guis
20:17<retrospectacus>zipy: too slow and I didn't like the interface.
20:18<barballs>none of them are stand out though
20:18<retrospectacus>there are certainly enough of them but I guess they are not "polished" enough
20:18<zipy>for all other settings that goes deeper its better without gui
20:19<SynrG>zipy: ah, from memory, ...
20:19-!-JanC [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:19<SynrG>but don't blame me if that 404s :)
20:19<barballs>true on both counts gentlemen but your average joe is terrified when you put a black screen in front of them
20:19<barballs>"what do you mean I have to type what I want to get?"
20:19<SynrG>great, i typoed it. nothing wrong with my memory :)
20:19<retrospectacus>barballs: -> #debian-offtopic
20:20-!-mode/#debian [+l 567] by debhelper
20:20<zipy>and i was wondering why is in german
20:20<barballs>sorry retrospectacus :)
20:20<SynrG>ah yes. content negotiation ftw :)
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20:21<zipy>oh that page is for squeezy
20:21<SynrG>yes indeed
20:21<zipy>so i just add for wheezy right after it?
20:21<SynrG>please do.
20:22<zipy>but not much to say only suspend, hotkeys and touchpad ^^
20:22<SynrG>well, instead of after ...
20:22<zipy>didnt get the lic close to work but i think i prefer if it doesnt to anything
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20:22<SynrG>hell, just a sec, i'll start restructuring it
20:22<zipy>i will just use fn + f1
20:22<SynrG>if you're in it, get out
20:23<zipy>im not
20:23<zipy>still just viewing :P
20:23<SynrG>i'll stub it out the way i think it should look, with "zipy: fill in details" in it :)
20:23<SynrG>(nah, not really ;)
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20:27<SynrG>zipy: i changed the recommendation to Wheezy, marked Squeeze as obsolete, and left an empty spot for Wheezy. go ahead and fill that in.
20:27<zipy>k, im registering right now
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20:28<SynrG>zipy: good luck (a certain percentage of those run afoul of the spam protection system ... if you have any issues registering, give me a shout :)
20:29<SynrG>with luck, it all goes well
20:29<zipy>im waiting for the mail ^^
20:29<zipy>i can edit the german page too after
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20:32<gsimmons>SynrG: Could you update DebianEeePC/Model/Template as well? Or are model pages deprecated in favour of InstallingDebianOn/Asus? (per your revision 19 comment)
20:33<zipy>hmm somehow i didnt receive an email yet
20:33<zipy>just saw the error
20:33<zipy>Account creation failed: INFO: HTTP request to GET failed: 500 Can't connect to (Bad hostname) Error 915: please contact for help if this continues.
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20:45<zipy>ill try tmrw again
20:45<zipy>tomorrow :)
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20:49<zipy>k guys, im off to bed now.. cya tomorrow good night x)
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21:21<cmck193>hello all
21:22<cmck193>anyone here?
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21:49<geopete123>what is the major difference between 7 and 7.1
21:49<geopete123>was there a necessary change
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21:50<geopete123>rudi..ok ill check out the link..thanks
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21:52<giltoon>In a SSH terminal, how to move the cursor back to the beginning of the line?
21:52<geopete123>rudi..well i never saw 7, i have to take their word..but i can tell you from experience that 7 initially had some kind of difficulty transferring files...and after i did a small system seemed to work much better.
21:52<giltoon>There is a shortcut for that, but I forgot it
21:53<jmcnaught>giltoon: the home key?
21:53<geopete123> while i did not upgrade all that jazz i did get a few upgrades and the network connection to sourceforge improved vastly
21:53<geopete123>rudi..but i was just wondering if there was a big deal about 7,1
21:53<rudi_s>giltoon: ^a - also see man readline, that's not a ssh specific tool.
21:54<rudi_s>geopete123: Debian updates only fix important (security) issues. "Nothing more."
21:54<giltoon>Good. Both home key and ^a works. Thanks
21:55<giltoon>where can I find a list of other useful shortcuts?
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21:55<bjartur>man readline
21:55<rudi_s>giltoon: ^a - also see man readline, that's not a ssh specific tool.
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21:57<giltoon>Great. Going to save that. Thank you :)
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21:57<geopete123>rudi..ok ...well just saying what i noticed about 7 and initial kernel upgrades and some misc stuff...but i never saw 7,1...after the printer fiasco i gave up becuase i did not want to pay such a high premium for Hewlitt Packard experience.
21:58<jordanrx123>hello all :D
21:58<jordanrx123>where are you all ?
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21:58<geopete123>rudi..they may have a lot of experience with printers...but they typically cost more than $ i wanted to work on virgin drivers for cheaper hardware.
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21:59<geopete123>but it sure comes at a cost..because i am prevented from even compiling and using libreoffice.
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22:01<geopete123>rudi..and i noticed HP is distancing themselves from the competition with a special hp version of hpcups..that has special hp protocols or something
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22:02<SynrG>um, #debian-offtopic maybe?
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22:04<SynrG>giltoon: and the corresponding ^e for end of line (and i 2nd that suggestion you read the readline man page :)
22:04<giltoon>what this stands for: forward-word (M-f)
22:05<giltoon>what is M ?
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22:05<jmcnaught>is there are reason why ^a and ^e are preferable to using home and end keys? is it because not all keyboards have those keys?
22:05<geopete123>rudi from that link it does look like debian made significant contributions to problem areas..
22:05-!-car_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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22:06<SynrG>giltoon: meta
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22:07<giltoon>so what key is it?
22:07<giltoon>on keyboard
22:07<SynrG>whatever you've mapped meta to?
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22:09<rudi_s>giltoon: Which is alt most likely.
22:09<geopete123>rudi..and from what i understand ...hp-setup will refuse to find a printer and set it up if you just use cups...apparently they use a special protocol or something like bonjour with hpcups to detect their propietary hardware.
22:09<jmcnaught>i'm reading the readline man page now too, and it says that meta is ESC on keyboards that lack the meta key
22:09<SynrG>depends on context? readline(3readline) says esc for keyboards without a meta key.
22:09<SynrG>see "NOTATION"
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22:10<giltoon>yep, it's ALT
22:10<giltoon>at least on my sys
22:10<rudi_s>geopete123: Hp printers work just fine with cups ...
22:11<geopete123>rudi_s..that is not the information i encountered.
22:12<geopete123>rudi_s...they have some special hpcups..and use special stuff like bonjour
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22:12<rudi_s>geopete123: Do you have an actual problem? If not, please talk about these things in #debian-offtopic.
22:13<geopete123> not my problem..HP does whatever they want to.
22:13<giltoon>asd ESC has same effect, so guess both can be used
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22:13<rudi_s>giltoon: Yes. alt-x sends esc-x (in some terminal emulator configurations).
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22:20<SynrG>yeah, it's important for serial terminals, for instance
22:20<SynrG>(not like we encounter many of those these days, but you never know)
22:22<geopete123>well it looks nouveau is trying to support some 3d..gpu acceleration...glxgears seems to work...but not too
22:23<geopete123>but it might be fast enough for some 3d apps
22:24<geopete123>without the kernel blob issue
22:24<SynrG>is there a support request hiding behind this line of thought?
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22:27<geopete123>of course i think these days people have already seen most of what 3d can there is a very limited market or that stuff anymore
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22:28<jmcnaught>geopete123: you may want to use #debian-offtopic for chit-chat. some of us find it difficult to follow the support questions in this channel when it fills up with people who just want to talk
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22:57<karen>I want to change the "army" time on top of my screen to regular clock time. How do I do that?
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22:58<jmcnaught>karen: in gnome? go to system settings, click on date and time, and there's an option to switch from 24 hour time to AM/PM time
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23:27<GI_Jack>so what is the deal with NTFS, FUSE and GVFS
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---Logclosed Sat Jul 27 00:00:28 2013