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#debian IRC Logs for 2013-09-01

---Logopened Sun Sep 01 00:00:59 2013
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00:31<toothpick>hello everyone
00:31<toothpick>welcome to official debian forum. ask your question and someone will help.
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00:57<toothpick>How to make a Samba Drive shortcut in Debian wheezy?
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00:58<LtL>toothpick: cross-posting isn't proper :)
00:58<toothpick>darn. Hi LtL. sorry how did you know
00:59<LtL>toothpick: because i'm in both channels of course.
00:59<LtL>many of us are
00:59<toothpick>oh. :) How are you buddy
00:59<toothpick>i missed you (genuinely)
00:59<LtL>toothpick: i'm fine, thanks :)
01:00<toothpick>toothpick: i'm starting to love wheezy in a strange way by the way
01:00<toothpick>LtL: got openoffice installed
01:00<toothpick>LtL: and what not..
01:00<LtL>toothpick: yes i do
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01:00<toothpick>LtL: I got a question (yet again) about shortcuts
01:01<toothpick>LtL: I have a samba share running on my home server.
01:01<toothpick>LtL: it shows up as a book mark under File Manager
01:01<LtL>toothpick: i'm oldstable, probably no help for wheezy
01:01<toothpick>LtL: but I cannot see it when I try to browse from an app
01:01<toothpick>LtL: but you give me ideas and i can usually find my way through like last time
01:02<LtL>toothpick: i don't use samba either, sorry.
01:02<toothpick>LtL: this isn't in regards to Samba specifically to be honest
01:02<toothpick>LtL: Samba folder is seen like any other normal folder
01:02<toothpick>LtL: if you have a network drive, how do you add it as a shortcut so that it appears in every file chooser dialog box from apps
01:03<LtL>toothpick: i don't even use nautilus but once in a long while, or any other file manager.
01:03<toothpick>LtL: Oh okay. what filemanager do you use then?
01:03<LtL>toothpick: command line
01:04<LtL>it's more funner ;)
01:04<toothpick>omg . interesting
01:04<toothpick>do you have any graphical user interface running at all?
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01:05<LtL>toothpick: i have gnome desktop with evolution and iceweasel running, other than that shells and irssi+screen
01:05<Khades>no gui needed ЖВ
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01:07<LtL>Khades: i couldn't do without nick colors because they're pretty!
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01:09<toothpick>LtL: i see.
01:09<toothpick>khades, what desktop manager is that?
01:10<Khades>toothpick: awesome
01:10<toothpick>awesome is the name of it? it doesn't look easy to use :)
01:10<Khades>awesome wm
01:10<toothpick>it comes with debian?
01:10<Khades>apt-get install awesome
01:11<LtL>toothpick: many ppl like awesome
01:11<toothpick>interesting. any particular reason you decided to use that instead of gnome? :)
01:11<toothpick>sorry for being nosey
01:11<LtL>personally i've never tried it, my gnome addiction is hard to break.
01:11<Khades>never got used to DE
01:11<Khades>so i used fluxbox
01:11<Khades>and then awesome2
01:11<Khades>then current awesome
01:12<Khades>that's like 7 years of my life :D
01:12<toothpick>interesting. i understand what awesome is now. what is DE, fluxbox
01:12<Khades>DE is any desktop enviroment
01:12<toothpick>and omg how many different flavours of desktop managers are there
01:12<toothpick>i only knew about about Xfce, Gnome and KDE
01:12<Khades>like gnome, kde, xfce, lxde
01:12<toothpick>i see
01:13<Khades>i prefered to use all separate stuff
01:13<toothpick>i tried xfce and now i'm on gnome 3 and am loving the experience
01:13<Khades>and ignore pulseaudio etc etc etc
01:13<toothpick>why would you want to ignore pulseaudio?
01:13<toothpick>it works flawlessly
01:13<Khades>got used to configure everything from console
01:13<Khades>i used linux way before pulseaudio was in linux
01:13<Khades>god used to
01:13<toothpick>i see
01:13<Khades>why should i?
01:13<Khades>everything works perfectly
01:14<toothpick>well, what if you want to run openoffice
01:14<toothpick>can you do that under awesome?
01:14<Khades>i just do win+R lowriter
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01:15<toothpick>is that sufficient replacement for openoffice?
01:15<toothpick>and it works under awesome?
01:16<Khades>awesome is just windows manager
01:16<Khades>window manager
01:16<Khades>so libreoffice works on Xorg
01:16<Khades>and gnome works on Xorg
01:16<Khades>and awesome works on Xorg
01:16<Khades>ITS ALL XORG
01:16<toothpick>for some reason I just feel now i finally understood it all
01:17<toothpick>so Xorg is the basic window manager?
01:17<toothpick>and gnome, awesome etc are just eyecandy on top of it ?
01:17<toothpick>lol ok nevermind i am confused again
01:18<toothpick>kinda what? confused or I got it
01:19<toothpick>Xorg will provide like API for rectangle, and basic shapes. and awesome/gnome/xfce will add their candy on it.. that's what i got so far
01:19<Khades>xorg is graphic system for building windows
01:19<Khades>windows manager is what?
01:19<toothpick>window manager is exactly that then. Xorg i'd say is a window manager
01:19<Khades>xorg doesnt manage windows
01:19<toothpick>actually ya you are right
01:20<toothpick>xorg just provides basic API
01:20<toothpick>for drawing basic shapes
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01:20<Khades>by default it would just start them at upper left corner
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01:20<toothpick>i remember reading that on xorg
01:20<toothpick>correct. so technically you are right. "Window Manager" is gnome/xfce/awesome
01:20<toothpick>but Xorg provides basic drawing shapes API
01:20<Khades>not gnome
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01:20<Khades>and xfwm
01:20<toothpick>what's metacity now?
01:21<Khades>gnome's window manager
01:21<toothpick>ok, can you draw a simple hierarchy for me? would be much appreciated
01:21<toothpick>that would show me the relationship
01:21<Khades>too much time to do
01:21<toothpick>i mean a simple one? lol
01:21<Khades>in nutshell
01:21<Khades>if you would instal fluxbox
01:21<Khades>and run fluxbox
01:21<Khades>you would allowed to run any apps you ran in gnome
01:22<Khades>unless they are uninstalled
01:22<toothpick>right because they all work on gtk+/xorg specification
01:22<Khades>not gtk
01:22<Khades>gtk is not involved in fluxbox/awesome
01:22<toothpick>just xorg
01:22<Khades>just know
01:23<Khades>when you say or see any gui app
01:23<Khades>then that's xorg
01:23<Khades>or xserver
01:23<Khades>matters of system
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01:23<Khades>or even xenorama
01:23<Khades>or xsun
01:23<Khades>or any of xserver realisations
01:24<toothpick>fair enough
01:24<toothpick>xserver/xorg it is
01:25<toothpick>no wonder why all apps that work on gnome also work in xfce/awesome etc etc
01:25<toothpick>because they all build on top of xorg
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01:28<toothpick>is there any other specification beside the main body of xorg?
01:28<toothpick>or xorg is the foundation of it all?
01:29<SamB>there are X11 specs, yes
01:29<Khades>x11 is main
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01:30<SamB>now it so happens that they are maintained in xorg repositories
01:30<toothpick>what is x11 now?
01:30<LtL>toothpick: for your perusal
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01:31<LtL>toothpick: x11 is the X windowing system
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01:32<LtL>pretty much one in the same with xorg
01:34<toothpick>LtL: i'll check that link
01:36<toothpick>LtL: i read that
01:36<toothpick>LtL: so xorg created the X11 specification
01:37<toothpick>LtL: so without xorg, we would have no gnome, no xfce, no awesome and no other GUI for linux?
01:37<LtL>toothpick: to be honest i haven't read it.
01:38<toothpick>LtL: oh ok. That's essentially what it says. and it makes sense
01:38<LtL>toothpick: right, no desktop environs without x11/xorg
01:38<toothpick>LtL: I'm actually trying to help that fellow with ralink wifi problem :) lol my first help
01:38<toothpick>LtL: thank you for sheding light on xorg. now it makes sense. I love xorg too now lol
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02:14<rahul_>debcheckout -auth stringtemplate
02:14<rahul_>declared svn repository at svn+ssh://
02:14<rahul_>svn co svn+ssh:// stringtemplate ...
02:14<rahul_>svn: To better debug SSH connection problems, remove the -q option from 'ssh' in the [tunnels] section of your Subversion configuration file.
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02:44<lika>whois lika
02:47<musca>hello lika
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03:13<dex>hi everybody, can somebody help me to move files with a particular extension from a directory to another one in linux console??
03:13<dex>I have done mv *.jpeg /home but it doesn't work
03:16<Ipsilon_>You shouldn't have permision to move to /home
03:16<Ipsilon_>unless you meant to move it to _your_ home directory
03:16<LtL>dex: what directory are the .jpeg files in? mv *jpeg /home/$USER/ perhaps
03:16<Ipsilon_>in which case... mv *.jpeg ~/
03:16<LtL>or just ~
03:18<LtL>dex: are you in that directory
03:19<LtL>dex: is 'files' a directory
03:20<dex>yes it is
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03:21<LtL>dex: mv *.jpeg ~ <enter> if you're in the files dir should work, then ls ~ should show them, sloppy but should work
03:21<Ipsilon_>unless he doesn't have priviliges over his current directory...I don't get what the issue is
03:21<Ipsilon_>but maybe just do cp
03:22<dex>now it works
03:22<LtL>dex: it's your /home/user dir yes?
03:22<dex>don't know why it didn't before
03:23<dex>mv *.jpg /home/user/dir works
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03:24<LtL>dex: well jpeg and jpg are two different things
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03:24<LtL>syntactically speaking
03:24<dex>thank you all for everything
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03:25<LtL>night all
03:26<Ipsilon_>dex: don't confuse extension with format.
03:26<Ipsilon_>doing *.jpg or *.jpeg doesn't match formats
03:27<Ipsilon_>it matches the have to type it correctly
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03:28<dex>maybe that was the error, i remember typing jpeg
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03:29<AaronCobaltDefender>Hello room
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03:29<dpkg>aaroncobaltdefender: È possibile di scaricare un sacco di software libero puntando il tuo browser a !
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04:11<zuluhere>hello everyone
04:12<zuluhere>I was wondering what everyone's favorite UI apps are
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04:12<Ipsilon_>UI apps?
04:12<zuluhere>User Interface
04:12<Ipsilon_>I know what it stands for..
04:12<Ipsilon_>I am just not sure what you mean by UI apps
04:13<zuluhere>Some apps are command line only, I am putting together a PC for someone who has knowledge or interest in the command line to use their machine
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04:14<zuluhere>no knowledge* excuse me
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04:15<zuluhere>I don't mind the command line myself and have a novice knowledge of it
04:15<xattr>give him vi ;)
04:15<zuluhere>if I have to use it to hook this person up that's ok
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04:15<zuluhere>what is vi?
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04:16<Ipsilon_>surely you mean vim
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04:16<Ipsilon_>zuluhere: vi/vim is a text editor
04:17<Ipsilon_>possibly an ide
04:17<Ipsilon_>I'd say
04:17<Ipsilon_>cmus or mpd
04:17<xattr>well, an ide dont make the user to commit suicide lol
04:18<Ipsilon_>I dunno, just having a terminal makes a lot of "applications" useless
04:18<Ipsilon_>I use the terminal a lot, but I don't use a lot of cli programs
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04:19<Nemoder>to answer the original question, it entirely depends on what the user wants to do with their computer, there are thousands of popular GUI apps
04:20<Ipsilon_>I think he wants cli apps
04:20<zuluhere>I like that the media apps suggested are soo small
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04:22<Ipsilon_>If you are intense, you can always try mutt
04:22<Ipsilon_>personally, I prefer the gmail client
04:22<Ipsilon_>forgot about a great one
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04:23<Gentleman>I was looking for that
04:23<Gentleman>but I forgot the name
04:23<Gentleman>and apropos was being lame
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04:24<zuluhere>what is taskwarrior?
04:24<Ipsilon_>Taskwarrior needs to get the android app finished
04:24<Ipsilon_>Then it will be amazing
04:24<Ipsilon_>zuluhere: it's a tool to manage your daily tasks
04:24<Ipsilon_>among other things
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04:27<xattr>does someone have experience in md raid1 with encryption (dm-crypt) on top of it? I make the experience on my system that its not very stable, sometimes its not accepting my pw, just after a power cycle or so...seems not reliable o.O
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04:47<zuluhere>are there any alternatives to teamviewer?
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04:49<xattr>sure... vnc
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04:49<xattr>afaik you can use xservers network stuff too
04:50<Ipsilon_>There are a few interesting alternatives
04:50<Ipsilon_>but if you want a good free one, I think vnc is best
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05:04<Ipsilon_>if I use proprietary nvidia drivers, can I use xrandr instead of twinview?
05:04<Ipsilon_>When I set my monitors via xrandr command..
05:04<Ipsilon_>nvidia-settings shows that twinview is enabled.
05:05<bernat>can you pastebin command and output?
05:05<Ipsilon_>Yes, sec
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05:15<Ipsilon_>bernat: my computer foobar'd...had to reboot
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05:17<bernat>that looks ok, right?
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05:18<Ipsilon_>bernat: yeah, it seems to work
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05:18<Ipsilon_>But i don't know
05:18<Ipsilon_>Because when I go to nvidia-settings...
05:18<Ipsilon_>I see it setup as twinview
05:18<Ipsilon_>I don't know if nvidia-settings is just assuming it is under twinview...
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05:19<bernat>I wouldn't trust n-s too much about anything but their driver and hardware
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05:20<Ipsilon_>ok, I'll assume it worked for now. thanks for the help :D
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05:59<Leonov>hi all.
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06:00<Leonov>have a bit annoying thing going on with my system, hope you can help.
06:01<Leonov>for a few months now i expirience random system freezes on my lenovo t420 notebook
06:02<Leonov>thing went from bad to worse since i've updated my system on friday
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06:06<zuluhere>Try operating from a usb and use the Hard Disk as storage. This method may also contribute to the lenovo security features
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06:07<zuluhere>I use an old acer aspire one. most distributions that would normally work "out of the box" on any machine are usually a no go for my machine.
06:08<zuluhere>so i use the usb
06:08<zuluhere>works like a beast
06:09<zuluhere>if you are using linux and a lenovo chances are the apps you require are pretty small in memory size too
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06:09<zuluhere>so the usb is the best way to go.
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06:10<zuluhere>Back solder the usb ports in your lenovo to a usb hub to be fitted into your hard disk space (in the encloser)
06:11<Leonov>zuluhere: from many of the bug reports to debian i see that many of the problems are probably in connection with kernel
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06:14<xattr>yeah there a lot of bugs, many are fixed upstream, but as always they are hardly arriving the distros...especially at suse btw
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06:17<zuluhere>What is the most common bug?
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06:19<xattr>well a big topic is the bug in xhci wich dont let some usb3 disk enclosures getting recognized by the kernel... is based on a crappy specification... I have one of that enclosures too, its annoying that I cant use it
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06:40<zuluhere>thanks for the chat you all have been insightful :)
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06:57<quadmonster>there anybody know about redmine alternative?
06:58<SynrG>there is trac ...
06:59<agaida>there is chiliproject
06:59<SynrG>why not redmine?
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07:18<quadmonster>not redmine because it's really fat
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07:26<agaida>all otheres are fat also - try trac or maybe mantis
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07:42<cousin_luigi>Is there a way to append a file to another only symbolically?
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07:46<cousin_luigi>abrotman: yes, to merge files on different volumes
07:47<cousin_luigi>I know it's a long shot, but I had to ask.
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07:49<abrotman>why not just actually merge them?
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07:50<cousin_luigi>abrotman: because one is vital to my system and the other one has to be frequently modified
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07:50<cousin_luigi>still, they have to look like one
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07:51<abrotman>cousin_luigi: but you always want to refer to them together as a single file?
07:51<cousin_luigi>I guess I'll have to compromise
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07:51<cousin_luigi>abrotman: yes
07:51<cousin_luigi>abrotman: it's one of those cases where the @include directive would come handy
07:52<abrotman>cousin_luigi: could you use something like famd or inotify to run a script when FileB is modified to then cat the files together to a third file
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07:53<cousin_luigi>abrotman: how would file #1 and #3 not collide?
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07:54<abrotman>because they're a third file?
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07:54<abrotman>cat file1 file2 > file3
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07:55<cousin_luigi>abrotman: but <path>/file1 and <path>/file3 would have to coincide
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08:00<abrotman>do they?
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08:10<abrotman>cousin_luigi: ?
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08:18<cousin_luigi>abrotman: the whole point is to have file1 available all the time
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08:18<cousin_luigi>abrotman: it's configuration files I'm talking about
08:18<cousin_luigi>abrotman: if file1 gets corrupted or disappears, my whole network goes down
08:18<abrotman>cousin_luigi: sure, so have your static file be /etc/foo.static, your dynamic file be /etc/foo.dynamic, and the actual config file be the concatenated file
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08:19<abrotman>cousin_luigi: might help us if you tell us the actual app
08:19<cousin_luigi>abrotman: radvd
08:19*abrotman cries, goes to google
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08:19<cousin_luigi>I'm actually thinking of patching the config parser myself.
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08:20*abrotman thought it was a DVD app :)
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08:21<abrotman>cousin_luigi: well, i gave you one idea that you apparently don't like
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08:23<cousin_luigi>abrotman: with all due respect, I don't like it because it won't work.
08:23<cousin_luigi>what good does me to keep file1 as backup if the daemon won't find it?
08:24<Apollo>I dont think you understood his idea...
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08:25<cousin_luigi>my point is that file2 is as likely to get corrupted as file3
08:28<abrotman>why is file2 or file3 going to get corrupted?
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08:28<abrotman>what kind of admins do you have?!
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08:32<cousin_luigi>abrotman: because scripts write on them, while file1 is on a volume mounted ro
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08:33<cousin_luigi>and a number of things can go wrong
08:33<abrotman>cousin_luigi: how do you currently solve this problem?
08:34<cousin_luigi>abrotman: I haven't adopted ipv6 yet
08:34<abrotman>cousin_luigi: so your main config file is /etc/radvd.conf, yes?
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08:35<cousin_luigi>I'm sure I'm losing $DEITY knows how much content on the internet without ipv6.
08:35<cousin_luigi>abrotman: yes
08:35<abrotman>cousin_luigi: and your /etc/ resides on a RO filesystem?
08:36<cousin_luigi>abrotman: yes
08:36<abrotman>and does radvd require a restart when the config file changes?
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08:38<abrotman>cousin_luigi: 1) symlink /etc/radvd.conf to /var/lib/radvd/radvd.conf.real 2) use inotify or famd to monitor /var/lib/radvd/radvd.conf.dynamic and then cat radvd.static and radvd.dynamic to then,3) kick off init script that you've altered to backup current radvd.conf.real, mv to radvd.conf.real
08:38<abrotman>3a) and restart radvd
08:38<abrotman>if init script notices an error in restarting, put the backup back in place, restart again, notify admin
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08:39<cousin_luigi>I see.
08:40<voobles>Hi, has anyone had success installing linux-image-3.10-0.bpo.2-amd64 from wheezy-backports?
08:40<cousin_luigi>I hadn't thought of that
08:40<abrotman>cousin_luigi: not a decent way to do this?
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08:40<grth>hey all
08:40<abrotman>voobles: are you getting an error?
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08:40<grth>anyone around help me with some questions about the console framebuffer setup?
08:40<voobles>abrotman: yes, dkms build errors
08:40<abrotman>for nvidia?
08:41<cousin_luigi>abrotman: could be, I'll give it a try
08:41<abrotman>grth: i was asking voobles, sorry
08:41<cousin_luigi>probably less problematic than altering radvd itself, although I'm submitting the feature request anyway:)
08:41<grth>nps, my bad
08:41<voobles>abrotman: Error! Build of vmblock.ko failed for: 3.10-0.bpo.2-amd64
08:41<cousin_luigi>are inotify or famd resource hungry? I'm running this on an embededd device.
08:41<abrotman>virtualbox modules?
08:42<nadir>grth: if that doesn't help i can search for a further thread, with some links/how-to's inside:
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08:42<voobles>abrotman: i think vmware
08:42<abrotman>cousin_luigi: famd isn't awful, but inotify is probably lighter
08:42<grth>whenever i use fbset to try and set an 8 bit depth mode, my console shrinks up?
08:42<abrotman>voobles: see if there's a newer set of dkms in backports
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08:42<cousin_luigi>abrotman: considering it's only another daemon that would launch it, perhaps I could avoid external monitoring
08:44<voobles>abrotman: no newer dkms in backports
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08:46<grth>nadir : modprobe uvesafb "request region failed"
08:47<nadir>grth: sorry, i only got those notes of mine, but else don't know much about the subject (i only needed bigger fonts for tty, hence framebuffer, but that's it)
08:47<abrotman>voobles: you can try looking for a bug report, but not sure that will help much
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08:48<grth>nadir: cool, thanks for the lead
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08:51<nadir>grth: this other thread contains further links (if the will or won't help you i don't know, just click on the links):
08:51<nadir>I think the third answer by PenguinSkinner contains the most basic links
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08:52<grth>nadir: mmmmm. no my problem seems to lie with KMS i believe
08:52<grth>anyone around care to give me a little rundown?
08:52<nadir>k, sorry, like i said: above me
08:53<grth>even when i set GFXPAYLOAD etc in the grub, when i check with fbest -i im getting a different res
08:53<grth>something else in the boot is changing it
08:53<grth>but even worse fbset just shrinks the resolution whenever i try to set an 8 bit depth
08:54<cousin_luigi>thanks everyone
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09:05<shtrb>Any ideas on the correct way to install ia32-libs on amd64 ?
09:05<Khades>apt-get install ia32-libs
09:05<shtrb>on unstable
09:05<Khades>use multiarch then
09:06<shtrb>have you tried that ? it's broken
09:06<Khades>use multiarch
09:06<shtrb>I thought not all apps support multiarch
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09:08<Khades>any apps support
09:08<Khades>just download 32bit ones
09:08<Khades>and you would not need ia32-libs
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09:09<Khades>i thought the main reason of multiarch is in installing any 32bit app with dependencies instead of ia32-libs
09:09<Zaba>that's right
09:10<Zaba>look at what is32-libs is on wheezy and newer - it just depends on the multiarch libs
09:10<themill>shtrb: rather than assertions like "it's broken", perhaps you could pastebin a command and the full output to help us understand what you're seeing
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09:11<shtrb>Here is a year old report : the point is that If I would try to install with ia32-libs-i386:i386 libjack-jackd2-0:i386 libopus0:i386 it will try to uninstall many related packages that I need
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09:12<shtrb>so a broken package is a one that cannot be simply installed via apt-get install package:arch
09:12<themill>a year-old report is pretty meaningless
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09:12<themill>what are *you* seeing right now?
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09:13<themill>(in sid, any given package can be uninstallable on any given day in any case -- if you want installable, use testing not unstable)
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09:17<shtrb>themill , the issue that I got the same point as the guy from a year old report but here is my flow
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09:18<shtrb>and If I continue in the route of missing packages (apt-get install package:arch) I get to a point it wishes to uninstall many other packages (anything with voice related like pidgin for example)
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09:26<esseks>hi! I've just built a Debian NAS and I was wondering: is there a simple way to make smartd, mdadm, syslog etc. send an alert email? Or should I configure each and every program according to its own flags?
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09:31<blast007>!tell shtrb about multiarch
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10:18<shtrb>Aurika!! had to manually choose what libs ia32-libs will bring for my need (I needed in the end only libc6:i386 libncurses5:i386 libstdc++6:i386) (I needed a way to execute 32 bit executables and used Zaba's idea)
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10:26<mshuler>esseks: logcheck works well for me
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11:55<nocturnal>does anyone know how to display unicode characters in xdm login screen? I've found the Xsession filef or xdm and typed in swedish phrases but the unicode characters don't display, and it doesn't help using \escape codes.
11:55<nocturnal>my locale is set to sv_SE.UTF-8 in debian
11:56<nocturnal>I mean Xresources
11:56<sney>oftentimes when you have a unicode locale and certain unicode symbols aren't showing in X, all you're missing is fonts
11:57<nocturnal>I thought that too so I tried changing the font of the prompt field
11:57<nocturnal>to Inconsolata that I use in xterm where unicode characters work, just for a test
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11:59<nocturnal>something tells me it's not being changed though. I tried it just now by commenting out the old xlogin*greetFont lines in Xresources and adding my own xlogin*greetFont: xft:Inconsolata:pixelsize=20:antialiasing=true
11:59<nocturnal>did sudo pkill X
11:59<nocturnal>but it looks the same
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12:00<nocturnal>actually, I don't have an xft server. so I'm probably specifying the font incorrectly
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12:16<ayaka>if the directory name contains special characater(like GBK code), how to remove it
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12:17<ayaka>I have tried to rm it using rm -r -- the_name, but it told me that no such file or directory
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12:18<ayaka>I have to move all files in its top directory and then remove its top directory
12:18<nikolay>help me
12:19<nikolay>in all brousers UPloads no work
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12:26<abrotman>ayaka: quote it
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12:32<ayaka>abrotman, sorry, no use
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12:36<abrotman>ayaka: maybe you should show us in a patsebin?
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12:38<ayaka>the directory contains "Ȧ-?" is extracted by the zip file
12:40<ayaka>abrotman, do you need that zip file and have a try?
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12:40<ayaka>but please attention, place it in temp directory
12:40<abrotman>ayaka: you could move the zip file, then remove the ~/t/ directory ?
12:41<ayaka>of course, it is the way I do
12:42<ayaka>but if the directory contains many files and directories, I don't think it is the best way
12:42<abrotman>but it doesn't
12:43<ayaka>abrotman, I wonder whether virus will use this to make a can't delete virus
12:43<ayaka>actually, I have done it before, the ~/t is created by me to show a sample
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12:49<ayaka>I am afraid I would need some files that can't be delete, and a zip can contain many files
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12:49<ayaka>if I extract the zip file in a important directory, I don't think I can't delete the whole directory to solve it
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12:51<valdyn>ayaka: this should be trivial once you set the locale to what its supposed to be for that zip file
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12:54<ayaka>valdyn, yes, but I use utf-8 most of time but most of zips that I download which contains chinese are in GBK code
12:54<ayaka>and I think the problem is not zip problem, I think the problem is that a file can't be del
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12:55<valdyn>ayaka: you think you found a bug thats been there since 1995, but you didnt, any file can be deleted
12:55<SamB>valdyn: I'm lost; how would setting the locale help? Won't it still use the same filenames?
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12:56<valdyn>SamB: he cant cut and paste and his shell cant expand on <tab> and he cant type the name
12:56<valdyn>SamB: i think the terminal running in the proper locale could fix that
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12:57<SamB>ah, yeah, if he runs the TERMINAL in that locale it might help, yes
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12:57<ayaka>valdyn, I don't think it is a bug, I wonder why it is from 1995, if that directory can be deleted, please tell me how to
12:58<valdyn>ayaka: i would need the zip file to try
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12:59<ayaka>please attention, place it in temp directory
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13:00<valdyn>ayaka: thats all chinese to me, where do I click?
13:01<abrotman>literally, eh? :)
13:01<ayaka>valdyn, "下载(2.21M)"
13:02<valdyn>doesnt work, not clickable
13:02<ayaka>abrotman, I don't think "下载" looks like "download", although there is a icon before
13:02<abrotman>worked for me
13:02<abrotman>valdyn: the middle button
13:03<valdyn>i found it, 2.21M appears twice
13:03<ayaka>valdyn, which way do you want, I don't know which network disk that english speaker use
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13:03<SamB>valdyn: what, you didn't search for that exact string?
13:04<abrotman>ayaka: i quoted it, deleted fine
13:04<ayaka>abrotman, would you mind paste your command?
13:04<abrotman>i just copied it .. i already had closed the terminal and deleted all those files
13:05<abrotman>i will tell you that gnome archive manager crashed mutter when it tried to unzip the zip file
13:05<ayaka>but I can't copy it(not the zip no)
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13:05<ayaka>ok, I use unzip to do it
13:06<valdyn>sits there forever, not downloading
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13:07<ayaka>valdyn, which network disk do you like? can I upload it to the other place for you?
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13:07<valdyn>anything closer to europe or usa will probably work fine
13:07<ayaka>abrotman, I think as you don't extract it, so you won't have problem
13:09<abrotman>ayaka: you're wrong, but okay
13:11<ayaka>abrotman, sorry, which is wrong?
13:12<abrotman>I did extract it, didn't have much of a problem
13:12<ayaka>abrotman, but you said gnome archive manager crashed
13:12<abrotman>so i used unzip, then deleted them both
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13:13<ayaka>abrotman, would you mind to paste all your command and let me see where is wrong
13:13<abrotman>i told you, i'd closed it
13:14<abrotman>already said that, five minutes ago
13:14<abrotman>ayaka: it could be your terminal, or the locales you have
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13:15<ayaka>abrotman, sorry, I don't know how to delete it, you don't use terminal, do you?
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13:18<musca>hello guido689
13:18<ayaka>valdyn, sorry, I don't find a proper place to place it, could you told me someone, you can pm me
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13:19<guido689>musca do you speak italian
13:19<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or for pics. Use for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>.
13:20<musca>guido689: there is an italian channel:
13:20<dpkg>Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help.
13:20<guido689>ok thanks
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13:23<valdyn>ayaka: you should probably rename that zip file before uploading to an english site
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13:23<valdyn>ayaka: nm, i have it now
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13:25<ayaka>I will remind to rename in the next time
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13:27<valdyn>ayaka: what did you want me to delete specifically?
13:28<ayaka>valdyn, delete the directory extracted by that zip file
13:29<valdyn>ayaka: run ls (just to use the output), rm -r -- "mento2.0<cut and paste the Ȧ>-*"
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13:30<ayaka>valdyn, yes, it works
13:30<ayaka>but is there a better way, a "*" may cause problem
13:30<valdyn>ayaka: last sign is a question mark, I can cut and paste that, but doesnt help, guess its ambigious
13:33<valdyn>ayaka: you can use "ls -b"
13:34<ayaka>valdyn, yes, actually that question mark and Ȧ> are some chinese charactors
13:34<ayaka>ls -b shows "mento2.0Ȧ-\331"
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13:37<ayaka>valdyn, can I use ls -b to do any things?
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13:42<zeev>Hi, how can I mount an ext2/3/4 filesystem with umask=value fmask=value dmask=value ? Is there something like those masks for ext? Or can I use it also for ext not only for vfat?
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13:44<valdyn>ayaka: that seems to work generally:
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13:46<ayaka>valdyn, yes it really better
13:48<ayaka>valdyn, thank you
13:48<ayaka>abrotman, thank you
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14:02<gnugr>zeev:check it with "man 8 mount"
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14:04<zeev>gnugr: I read it already
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14:04<zeev>gnugr: what do you mean exactly? it looks like umask is only for vfat
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14:15<gnugr>zeev:just meant read the manual
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14:16<zeev>gnugr: there is no answer there :(
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14:16<roughnecks>does anybody know what collation/charset should i use when importing dpkg's apt_dump into mysql? It seems that cyrillic characters are not displayed correctly, as for the "ru" fact
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14:18<SamB>is UTF-8 not working?
14:18<roughnecks>don't know, after i import the dump, i can see in phpmyadmin that collations for tables is set to latin1_swedish_ci
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14:20<roughnecks>the command i use is like: mysql -u user -p db < apt_dump
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14:37<roughnecks>if i change the charset to utf-8 just after i've created a new database and then try to import the apt_dump, i get: ERROR 1062 (23000) at line 43: Duplicate entry 'nickometer' for key 'PRIMARY'
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14:42<ekiwok>my debian does not boot after alsactl init
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14:43<devil>ekiwok: not connected to that command probably
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14:45<ekiwok>devil, seems like rescue mod fixed issue, but still no sound :( I have [AMD] FCH Azalia Controller
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14:59<ekiwok_>my sound does not work on wheezy :( any ideas how to fix it?
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15:04<devil>ekiwok_: all channels unmuted and pulled up in alsamixer?
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15:06<ekiwok_>devil, yes
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15:07<ekiwok_>when I'm trying to do aplay ring.wav ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:1401:(_snd_pcm_hw_open) Invalid value for card
15:07<ekiwok_>aplay: main:682: audio open error:
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15:10<ekiwok_>I cannot start alsa-utils I get
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15:13<dpkg>1) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out & in again) 2) unmute and raise channels w/ alsamixer (also try muting some & toggle jack sense if available) 3) <pulseaudio> or other daemon stopped? 4) speakers on? 5) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? 6) purge any installed <oss4> packages to remove ALSA blacklist. See also <list alsa users>, <alsa firmware>.
15:13<roughnecks>ekiwok_: ^
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15:18<ekiwok_>roughnecks, it didnt help
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15:20<tofix_>hi guys, i'm lost trying to find a solution to my problem?. i need some service which offer a webaccess to the user, offering him to browse his computer and choose a file. This file will be uploaded to the server, and once it's done it returns an url that the user can send to someone else. The receiver then just have to click on the link to download the file ?. Does this exist on your mind ? in don't need an hosted ser
15:20<tofix_>vice, i need to install it for my own company purpose ?
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15:31<ekiwok_>on jessie sound works fine ;/
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15:33<ekiwok_>I think alsa does not recognise my soundcard correctly
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15:33<devil>ekiwok_: you need to change the parameters, <== pcm_hw.c:1401_snd_pcm_hw_open) Invalid value for card
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15:35<ekiwok_>devil, how do i do that? which file shoud I edit?
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15:36<devil>ekiwok: can you pastebin your /etc/modprobe.d/sound?
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15:37<ekiwok_>devil, this file does not exist
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15:38<ekiwok_>all I have in /etc/modprobe.d: alsa-base.conf alsa-base-blacklist.con blacklist-fglrx.conf fbdev-blacklist.conf and radeon-kms.conf
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15:40<devil>ekiwok_: change opttions in /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base.conf then
15:42<ekiwok_>devil, ok but what shoud I set?
15:43<ekiwok_>I have now options bt87x cx88_alsa snd-atiixp snd-intel8x0m snd-via82xx-modem all set to index=-2
15:44<devil>ekiwok_: i would have no idea, never even heard of your card, but google knows
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15:49<ekiwok>devil, I'm googling few days and no solution :(
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15:52<devil>ekiwok: cat /proc/asound/cards
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15:53<ekiwok_>usb sound card works fine... ;/ but it's not the solution
15:54<devil>ekiwok_: no time to look into it further now
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16:06<ekiwok_>devil, thanks your suggestion made me focus on searching correct options and found this:
16:07<ekiwok_>I found similar post earlier but it didnt mention trying with auto option
16:07<ekiwok_>I have no idea what I did but it works now with auto option :/
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16:11<devil>so alsa recognized a wrong parameter. there is hundreds, if not thousands of different HDA Intel codecs for different cards
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16:17<joines>How I can run again the update of dbconfig of a package ?
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16:21<joines>Raziel: it doen't run the upgrade, it configure a new database :(
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16:32<Raziel>joines: maybe this will help you
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16:52<joines>Raziel thanks
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17:14<fopeio>سمَـَّوُوُحخ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ امارتيخ ̷̴̐خ
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17:15<cxd1>sorry i was disconnected. i'm going to download the backports kernel
17:15<abrotman>hi ..
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17:15<cxd1>looks like i missed out on something lol
17:15<abrotman>brilliant spammer
17:16<cxd1>bill gates has a lot of time on his hands these days i guess
17:16<abrotman>cxd1: you actually changed from freenode to oftc
17:16<cxd1>what does that mean?
17:16<abrotman>nevermind .. anyway .. what's up?
17:17<cxd1>not much. i'm downloading the backports kernel and will install that shortly on the other machine. trying to find the dependencies too
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17:20<abrotman>also look for newer firmware
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17:20<cxd1>ralink firmware? ok
17:22<cxd1>ok i got the newer package from testing
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17:26<cxd1>installing the kernel and it says i may have some missing firmware because its' non-free and not included in the debian install
17:27<cxd1>restarting to see if it worked anyways
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17:30<james41382>you need to download the non free firmware. do you have the non free and contrib set in /etc/sources.list?
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17:31<cxd1>the machine doesn't have an internet connection. that's why i'm doing this, in the hopes that it will work with my wifi card
17:31<cxd1>but it seems to have restarted fine into the new kernel
17:31<james41382>err.. /etc/apt/sources.list rather..
17:32<james41382>oh i see...
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17:32<james41382>no ethernet?
17:32<cxd1>no :(
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17:33<abrotman>cxd1: you're going ot have to install the firmware
17:33<cxd1>ok everything is set with the new kernel and the ralink firmware. i plugged in the wireless usb adapter and it connected to the network but there is no network activity even though it shows i'm connected. i can't open a webpage or anything
17:33<abrotman>ralink-firmware you said?
17:33<cxd1>hey the webpage loaded. even though it was really slow. that's something
17:33<cxd1>ya that's the one
17:33<abrotman>there is a newer firmware-ralink in backports also
17:34<cxd1>the version i got was from jessie. 0.40
17:34<james41382>if you use the newer kernel you need the appropriate firmware i think
17:34<abrotman>good enough
17:34<cxd1>well maybe i can download the frmware now that there seems to be something of a connection
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17:38<cxd1>right now the only sources in my sources.list are cd rom sources. i need to change that
17:38<cxd1>i think this did it though abrotman. i'm online!
17:40<cxd1>do i need to add main, contrib, non-free, security, and updates? or just some of those
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17:43<abrotman>cxd1: glad to hear
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17:43<abrotman>cxd1: you probably should
17:43<abrotman>dpkg: tell cxd1 about wheezy sources.list
17:44<abrotman>dpkg: tell cxd1 about wheezy backports
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17:45<cxd1>what about security?
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17:46<abrotman>see the first thing the bot told you
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17:49<cxd1>i may have spoken too soon. i can't even run apt-get update because it's too slow. it slows about 30 seconds after connection
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17:50<cxd1>i added the sources. if i can get it to work long enough to do an apt-get upgrade will it install that non-free firmware for the kernel?
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17:51*SamB is talking to himself
17:51*SamB realizes he should talk to the bot somewhere else ...
17:51<wompa>You got a good answer?
17:52<SamB>hmm, is there a way to browse the factoids?
17:52<abrotman>dpkg: tell SamB about your factoids
17:53<musca>cxd1: apt-get upgrade does not install new packages by definition
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17:54<cxd1>how about dist-upgrade
17:55<abrotman>cxd1: what are you trying to do ?
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17:55<cxd1>download that firmware that the kernel was complaining about during the install
17:56<cxd1>some ucode.bin files
17:56<abrotman>do you even know which files it was?
17:56<cxd1>i have a list of them. it's 3 files. the first is e100: e100/d102e_ucode.bin
17:57<abrotman>that's for your wired NIC
17:57*SamB was trying to find the <testing/unstable mix> factoid
17:57<wompa>tum ?
17:57<james41382>you can use apt-file to figure which packages contains those files and then just upgrade those packages..?
17:57<SamB>found it already
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17:58<cxd1>ok i'll try apt-file. it is not installed by default so it must be an extension package
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17:59<james41382>yeah you will have to install it, but it'll do the trick. I had to do that after upgrading to the 3.9 kernel a while back. it turned out to be two firmware packages...
17:59<james41382>the ucode files..
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18:00<cxd1>thanks for the info
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18:01<cxd1>i will have to spend some more time on this and figure it out because apt-get update has taken 20 minutes so far it's so slow lol
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18:04<abrotman>cxd1: what were the other firmware items?
18:04<cxd1>they were 3 ucode.bin files
18:04<abrotman>yes .. you told us one, which was your wired NIC
18:05<cxd1>what's NIC?
18:05<abrotman>your ethernet card
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18:06<cxd1>e100: e100/d101s_ucode.bin and e100: e100/d101m_ucode.bin are the last two
18:06<abrotman>that's all your ethernet card
18:06<cxd1>without the e100: part at the beginning
18:06<cxd1>oh ok so i can just ignore them since i only connect with wlan0 right?
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18:07<abrotman>you can, but you probably want to install it so it does work
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18:08<cxd1>ok so the speed issue with the wifi card is something else. i think there may be no solution. maybe the card is just not that compatible with linux
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18:09<abrotman>cxd1: have you tried restarting since you added the kernel and firmware?
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18:12<abrotman>you could make sure your router's firmware is up to date
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18:46<Celelibi>May I report a bug in the installer?
18:46<Celelibi>/sys is not "bind-mounted" in /target/sys
18:47<Celelibi>This may not be a problem for most operations.
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18:47<Celelibi>But lsmod have troubles without it.
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18:55<Infiltrator>Celelibi: Have you checked to see if it's already reported? And if it's not, feel free to file it.
19:01<Celelibi>I didn't check. I've just seen thiswhile grmbling with EFI and GRUB. :)
19:02-!-SWAT [] has joined #debian
19:02<Infiltrator>Fair enough.
19:02<Celelibi>And what package would it be about?
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19:04<Celelibi>Looks like I need an UEFI PXE boot image to be able to boot install grub-efi.
19:05<musca>Celelibi: in which image did you see the bug?
19:06<Celelibi>Let me check.
19:07<Celelibi>This is a Debian 7 (wheezy) installation netboot image.
19:07<Celelibi>It was built on 20130613.
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19:07<Celelibi>Is there any EFI-compliant debian installer netboot image?
19:07<Gentleman>j/ #linux
19:07<Infiltrator>I think that there is a debian-installer "package" against which you can file the bug.
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19:08<abrotman>he can file an installation report
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19:09<abrotman> 5.4.7
19:09<abrotman>bottom of the page
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19:33<cxd1>is it normal for a laptop to not be able to play HD video? i recorded some and it lags pretty bad in VLC and MPlayer
19:34<abrotman>which flash player are you using?
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20:57<samer>how r u ?
20:57<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #moocows on or #defocus on
20:57<samer>i want to know how i can see the language bar
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21:36<hanasaki>installed debian live 7 - the install failed on installing the grub bootloader however there wasnt any detail. There does nto seem to be a way to tell the installer where to install the grub bootloader.
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21:38<darkangel>Hey just wouldering whats stabler and faster Ubuntu or Zorin??
21:39-!-darkangel is now known as Guest5180
21:39<darkside>have an old notebook. Your setup is: dual core processor T2200 2.0 GHz - RAM 2 GB - and use SiS chipset (terrible)
21:39<darkside>I ned
21:39<abrotman>Guest5180: this is #debian
21:39-!-Guest5180 [] has quit []
21:40<darkside>I Need Assistance with my video card Mirage 3 672 FX (SiS Sylicon Integrated Systems)
21:41<darkside>I using Debian 7 Wheezy
21:42<hanasaki>darkside: just ask the question
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21:43<darkside>all right
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21:46<darkside>hansaki - my video card of notebook is: Mirage FX 3672 manufactured by Taiwanese company (SiS) Sylicon Integrated Systems). I have searched all over internet forums and sities. to know if I can use 3D acceleration. but not got no definitive solution.
21:47<darkside>hansaki - my video card of notebook is: Mirage 3 FX 3672 manufactured by Taiwanese company (SiS) Sylicon Integrated Systems). I have searched all over internet forums and sities. to know if I can use 3D acceleration. but not got no definitive solution.
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21:49<darkside>I would like to use applications like gnome 3 desktop or compiz fusion, but do not know how to enable this property video card if available.
21:50<hanasaki>where can the .deb for wheezy backports be downloaded directly?
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21:50<hanasaki>darkside: sorry.. no info to help you
21:51-!-btcahl [] has joined #debian
21:51<hanasaki>maybe someone elese can
21:51<darkside>somebody help me ?
21:51-!-darkside [] has left #debian [Saindo]
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21:52<darkside>Who ?
21:52<mshuler>hanasaki: for example - hit wheezy-backports, and at the bottom is the arch list with download links
21:52<mshuler>hanasaki: or you could just apt-get download foo
21:54<mshuler>darkside: is this machine currently running Debian?
21:54<hanasaki>not running debian right now ... so no aptget
21:54<hanasaki>mshuler: why is it not at
21:55-!-chitchat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:55<mshuler>hanasaki: what package are you looking for? it may not be backported, or the one in testing is installable - it depends
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21:55<hanasaki>mshuler: kernel 3.10
21:55<darkside>one moment
21:56<hanasaki>mshuler: isnt there a site with just the .deb to http too?
21:57<darkside>I want to clarify that my video card was recognized and installed by Debian Wheezy, using a generic driver. and reached the maximum permtida. however the 3D acceleration features do not work. I tried to use the command glxgears in the terminal and runs as it should.
21:58<darkside>hey mshuler and hanasaki this kernel is lasted version ?????
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22:00<mshuler>darkside: then you might be out of luck - for fun, paste your /var/log/Xorg.0.log to and post the link
22:01<darkside>I'll try this
22:01<darkside>did I compile the new kernel version (3.10) on my system? could you help me how to do it?
22:01<abrotman>why are you compiling?
22:01<hanasaki>darkside: messing with the backports by hand is not a great idea... lol I am doing it to get the NIC driver for my mobo
22:03<mshuler>btw, hanasaki you were looking at the metadata directory for the repository - that's where apt gets all its info - the packages are all in the pool, for instance:
22:03<hanasaki>thanks mshuler
22:04<hanasaki>mshuler: any idea how to get the debian live 7 installer to install grub? it says "failed" but does not tell why or let me specify where to install it
22:05<mshuler>darkside: compiling a new kernel will not help you get 3d..
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22:05<mshuler>hanasaki: I haven't played with the live images at all - I always (well, last time I installed was 2010) use a netinst.iso
22:06<hanasaki>what are net iso?
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22:06<mshuler>it's a very small installer image and installs everything over the network
22:07<themill>well... the netinst actually has everything on it to do a base install
22:07<hanasaki>the installer code would/should be the same though? dont see a way to specify where to install grub
22:07<mshuler>live images are great to test out things, but I've been doing this so long, I already know what I'm going to get :)
22:08<mshuler>hanasaki: it should be the same, yeah
22:09<hanasaki>so in netinstaller how do you tell it where to install grub? ie sda sdb etc
22:10<mshuler>hanasaki: /dev/sda in my case
22:10<mshuler>but then it already knew that and I just confirmed
22:10<hanasaki>is there a place to specify it? i need sdb
22:11<darkside>mshuler !!!!! look this
22:11<mshuler>darkside: don't yell..
22:12<darkside>ok excuse-me
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22:17<mshuler>darkside: I think you are out of luck for 3d, glx loads then states not dri capable (direct rendering)
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22:18<darkside>alternatives ?
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22:19<mshuler>new hardware?
22:19<darkside>lol ! no money !!!!
22:19<mshuler>I don't play games, so 2d is fine with me - too many other things to do anyway
22:20<darkside>next doubt !
22:20<mshuler>darkside: there is nothing wrong with the hardware - it's just not a gaming machine - use it for other things :)
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22:21<Celelibi>wow. atftpd is an order of magnitude faster that tftpd.
22:21<Celelibi>And it works with UEFI. :)
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22:22<darkside>ok but I can not use compiz fusion. for example
22:22<darkside>I do not care about games
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22:22<mshuler>darkside: you aren't missing much ;)
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22:24<mshuler>I equate large amounts of eye candy desktop whizbang stuff with people that drive Hummers - they are trying to look good for other people and prove something - just my opinion, but it's just pointless ey candy
22:25<darkside>I will be able to use compiz fusion on my notebook?
22:25<mshuler>I have ancient hardware that is super useful, but lacks any kind of advance video
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22:25<mshuler>darkside: I doubt you will like the performance if it even does work
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22:26<mshuler>I could be totally wrong there - I just install the OS and use things
22:26<mshuler>the defaults are usually just fine with me
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22:26<mshuler>I don't even change the background image..
22:27<darkside>thanks for help me
22:27<mshuler>again, that is all just my own personal use pattern and opinions - have fun, but if things don't work due to lack of hardware, then just do something else - go create!
22:28<darkside>what are the advantages of using the latest version of the kernel whezzy?
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22:28<mshuler>darkside: if your hardware all works, nothing - you could go read the features added and changelog on
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22:30<Kichigai>Has anyone experience with installing Debian along side Windows 8? It seems my EFI partition is NTFS formatted.
22:30<Kichigai>Or some such malarky.
22:31<Node-8392>i'm thinking of buying a edge series E431 and i have some questions for thinkpad owners about the bios. will the bios let you disable quickboot?
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22:31<darkside>mshuler you are a great friend
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22:32*Node-8392 hope i'm in the right place
22:32<mshuler>Node-8392: I'm a hardcore thinkpad user have 3, and I've had many - latest one I have is my X201, so I don't know much about the latest versions, however, you almost can't go wrong with thinkpads + linux
22:33<mshuler>so many linux users on thinkpads, if it doesn't work now, it will soon
22:34<Node-8392>i'm planning to go with the E431 + debian wheezy (kde) unless there will be issues with it
22:34<mshuler>Node-8392: I imagine that Lenovo has the BIOS fully configurable - I can't imagine that they don't, given their enterprise use
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22:35<hfp>Hi guys! So I installed the 32 bit version when I could have gone with the 64 bits version. Is there a way to migrate without formatting and reinstalling?
22:35<Node-8392>i really want quickboot disabled though. never seen the option in a consumer laptop. never seen a business lapop. desktop bios's have the option though
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22:35<SamB>hfp: I heard someone did it, but it's not exactly easy
22:36<Node-8392>eek. laptop
22:36<mshuler>hfp: no migration (easily) and really no need - stick with i386, you'll be fine :)
22:36<hfp>That was my next question: what are the benefits of 64 bits? This box will be a usenet downloader and fileserver, mostly
22:36<hfp>On a P4 HT 3.20Ghz
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22:37<mshuler>hfp: in your use case, none - it makes a difference with large amounts of RAM and things like database server performance
22:37<Kichigai>hfp: how much RAM will you be slinging?
22:37<SamB>hfp: cons: it uses more RAM; pros: each process can use more RAM
22:37<Node-8392>64-bit does have a few security benefits ...
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22:38<SamB>oh yeah, and it has more registers
22:38<Kichigai>And more bits, dood!
22:38<hfp>Nothing fancy, only 2 Gb of RAM
22:38<Kichigai>Wait, a P4?
22:38-!-zim [] has quit []
22:39<hfp>Yes, I bought this used for a song
22:39<Kichigai>Wasn't that 32-bit?
22:39<hfp>And added a 1 Tb hard drive + 2 Gb RAM
22:39<SamB>I think I heard some models supported 64-bit
22:39<hfp>I don't know, in cat /proc/cpuinfo the flags have lm
22:39<hfp>And I think I was running CentOS 64 bits on it previously
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22:40<Kichigai>Well, you could try live booting a 64-bit OS on there and find out.
22:40<SamB>or you could just keep using 32-bit and enjoy the RAM
22:40<Kichigai>I mean, hell, what's a 64-bit netboot these days? A drop in the bucket for bandwidth expenditure.
22:40<SamB>or you could install a 64-bit kernel and keep the userspace at 32-bit and still enjoy the RAM
22:41<Kichigai>SamB: Oh, I'm not arguing for utility, since you're probably right (I don't know the details on this one, so I'll defer to you), I just mean as a way to find out if the CPU is 64-bit or not. I hate unsolved mysteries.
22:43<hfp>If there are no benefits I'll stick with 32 bits
22:43<hfp>I thought maybe it would help with things like par2 checks
22:43<Kichigai>Oh, and not to sound like a pest, but does anyone know anything about installing Debian along side Windows 8? parted describes my EFI boot partition as NTFS, and the Debian installer can't write to it. It's custom hardware, and Secure Boot is not enabled. The rest is a mystery, first new PC I've owned in five years.
22:44<mshuler>third-party things like games sometimes only come 32-bit, too - multi-arch is simple, but it took me a while to sort out issues with Team Fortress 2 out of Steam..
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22:44<Kichigai>Makes me feel like a real neckbeard, thinking "what is this EFI nonsense? The old ways were the best ways!"
22:45<Node-8392>Kichigai, i've always given a whole hdd to each os i boot on desktop systems. saves me all the multi-boot nightmares. i move the data cable between the drives between bootups to select the os.
22:45<mshuler>Kichigai: I have no wisdom for you.. someone else might
22:46<SamB>!installation report
22:46<dpkg>rumour has it, installation report is
22:46<SamB>Kichigai: maybe submit one of those?
22:47<Kichigai>Well, given that kind of advice from mshuler and Node-8392 (which, no offense, I appreciate) I have to laugh. And quite loudly, since installing Debian on my MacBook Pro was easier than this!
22:47<Kichigai>SamB: I'll be doing that.
22:47<Node-8392>grub2-efi (64-bit) bootloader handles (u)efi bios
22:48<SamB>it sounds like it's not the BIOS that's the issue here, exactly ...
22:48<Kichigai>Node-8392: Right, but grub can't update the ESP because it's NTFS formatted.
22:48<Kichigai>SamB: No, sounds like it's Microsoft mucking about with the EFI partition
22:48<mshuler>Kichigai: I'm literally an old neckbeard.. with pre-EFI hardware as my latest workhorse.. :(
22:49<Node-8392>like i said, i use dedicated drives. repartition/format mbr/fat32 under windows then shutdown, unplug win-drive and boot debian installer
22:49<Kichigai>mshuler: How old, mightn't I ask? Because I remember an old "because we can, dammit" project with some *really* old hardware.
22:50*Node-8392 started with radio shack coco2
22:50<mshuler>Kichigai: my first tinkering with linux was ~1995 - I'm..
22:50*Kichigai started with a C64
22:50<mshuler>had to think - I'm now 45
22:50*Node-8392 had an atari
22:51<Kichigai>mshuler: well, you've got me beat, but I remember in 199...7? installing x11, gedit, and gqview onto a 486 laptop as part of a challenge to see just how far we could push the old thing.
22:51<abrotman>ahem ...
22:52<Kichigai>Si, senor?
22:52<mshuler>my first x11 configuration ended in a pop and a puff of smoke coming out the vents of my monitor..
22:52<hfp>Ah also, I was wondering, is there a way to take kind of snapshots as I configure the server? For example, I have all the usenet part up and running and now I have to dive into setting up NFS. I would like to have a snapshot to revert to in case configuring NFS messes things beyond repair. Any pointers?
22:52<Kichigai>Clearly it's YOUR fault. YOU let the magic blue smoke out!
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22:52<Node-8392>my first x11 booted 4 whole times before needing a reformat :/
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22:53<mshuler>hfp: I use etckeeper - keeps configs in git :)
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22:54<hfp>mshuler: Interesting, thanks! But what about config files that are not in /etc/ ? Does it work with it?
22:54<themill>hfp: all config files are in /etc
22:55<hfp>No, for example SABnzbd keeps its config in ~/.sabnzbd/config.ini
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22:56<themill>If that's a multi-user daemon, then that's a bug.
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22:57<hfp>It's not supposed to be multiuser. You set the user in /etc/default/sabnzbd and it always run with that user
22:58<Kichigai>Quick question: does the Debian installer have R/W access with ExFAT drives?
22:58<Kichigai>Or will I need to purge and format my flash drive before dumping installer logs to it?
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23:07<mshuler>Kichigai: vfat should be ok, but exfat may not - did you try it, yet and fail? or just asking?
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23:08<SamB>I hardly ever hear any mention of ExFAT
23:08<SamB>is that seriously used?
23:08<mshuler>I don't see anything exfat-related in mount..
23:08<Kichigai>I use it because in the office we're 98% Mac-based, but I'm the *one* guy who is willing to touch the PCs we have on hand.
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23:09<themill>istr exfat requires a fuse helper
23:09<Kichigai>Also it's useful to offload documentation to any of my machines on hand.
23:09<Kichigai>themill: got it, I'll just nuke the drive then.
23:09<SamB>Kichigai: why don't you use fat32 or something
23:09<Kichigai>SamB: I'm in video production. Files greater than 4GB are an every-day occurance for us.
23:10<SamB>is THAT the point of ExFAT
23:10<Kichigai>Sometimes I could use our SAN, but often that would require me to spin up a volume just for that purpose, and the SAN system has been rather... poorly behaving these days.
23:10<Kichigai>Sort of.
23:10<mshuler>if your install logs are >4G, file a bug :)
23:10<Kichigai>mshuler: lspci, actually.
23:11<Kichigai>I just wanted to know if I'd need to format the flash drive before lspci-ing my machine in the installer for the installation report SamB suggested I file.
23:12<Kichigai>I usually keep one USB drive formatted FAT32 and one ExFAT, but the one I keep FAT32 formatted is the one I'm booting from.
23:12<Kichigai>It's just a matter of copying some files off it and reformatting, no huge deal, I just didn't want to have to reboot unneccessarily.
23:12<Kichigai>...because I'm lazy.
23:13<Kichigai>Anyhoo, I shall return!
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23:18<hfp>mshuler: back to etckeeper, if I use git with it, do I have to pay to make it private? Or did I miss something?
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23:23<hfp>It seems I am mixing git with GitHub
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23:35<hanasaki>how to install grub on sdb ? ran grub-install and it does boot to grub... but the kernel is not run... just comes up grub> prompt
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23:41<cxd1>anyone know of a video player that can handle HD video better than VLC and Mplayer? both lag on my laptop
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23:53<beto>blz galera?
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---Logclosed Mon Sep 02 00:00:58 2013