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#debian IRC Logs for 2013-09-15

---Logopened Sun Sep 15 00:00:22 2013
00:00<kichigai>Well, last time I ran Linux using the MBR was the big deal. I haven't dickered with EFI on my MacBook Pro aside from rEFIt
00:00<kichigai>So I'm afraid I don't know much about EFI in general.
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00:01<kichigai>Can I nuke my NTFS ESP and then recreate the files I need to be in there?
00:01-!-HoChile [~smuxi@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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00:01<kichigai>Or back up the data, nuke, restore? Or something like that?
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00:01<kichigai>EFI Startup Partition
00:01<kichigai>Sorry, I got that from the Wikipedia.
00:02<kichigai>Thought it was common parlance.
00:02<sney>it might be. *shrug* is there a debian question in here somewhere?
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00:02<kichigai>Well, aside from the fact my final goal is to dual-boot Windows 8 and Debian, no. My problem is how to fix my issue with an NTFS formatted EFI partition.
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00:03<kichigai>So I can install Debian, I mean.
00:03<sney>I don't see how it's an issue in the first place. what's wrong with the windows loader partition? it sits there and loads windows. it doesn't get in the way of debian existing or booting
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00:03<kichigai>Well, it's all on the same disk.
00:03<kichigai>Debian wants me to specify an EFI boot partition, right? Or can I just not do that?
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00:04<sney>debian just wants a partition to live in and a place to put the bootloader. since windows doesn't use the MBR in any meaningful way, you can install grub to the MBR; the grub installer will detect the windows loader and allow you to boot to that too
00:05<kichigai>Aahh, OK. I didn't think that MBR-based grub and EFI could live together in harmony, I thought it was one or the other.
00:06<SamB>(GPT volumes *have* an MBR?)
00:06<kichigai>Yeah, I just got to that point, the partitioner is yelling at me for not specifying an EFI partition.
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00:07<sney>ah, sorry, brain fart
00:08<sney>what's the default? first partition on the disk?
00:08<kichigai>Primary, 367MB, NTFS, bootable.
00:08<kichigai>From what I know from my Mac, that looks like an EFI partition.
00:09<kichigai>Behind that is the partition I set up for Windows, and after that are the partitions for EXT4 and Swap Space.
00:10<sney>ok. take that default. I've done this once before (didn't remember the efi partition part but) I didn't have to do anything special.
00:10<kichigai>"take" it?
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00:10<kichigai>You mean claim it as the EFI partition and format it FAT32?
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00:11<sney>it's asking you to format it? what?
00:11<SamB>sney: how else are you going to install grub?
00:11<kichigai>Well, it's NTFS right now. The installer can't write to it.
00:11<kichigai>That's the problem I'm having.
00:11<kichigai>Otherwise I'd be cruising right through this.
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00:12<SamB>MS is just trying to make our lives difficult, isn't it?
00:12<sney>I don't know what I did that was special because I definitely didn't have to format anything outside of the debian partition(s)
00:12<kichigai>They're not the only ones.
00:12<sney>so I can't help, sorry. I don't know
00:12<sney>must be a win8 "upgrade" or something
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00:13<kichigai>?yep, you mentioned that fifteen minutes ago.
00:13*vntra <3 Debian!
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00:15<SamB>vntra: is that a support question? ;-P
00:18<HoChile>it sounds more like a statement of support to me
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00:29<snogglethorpe>"git for oxen"?
00:30<HoChile>git pull oxen
00:30<HoChile>thats what I meant
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01:00<bullgard4>[wheezy] /var/log/dmesg.0 includes a line of text: "fb0: inteldrmfb frame buffer device." What does this line mean?
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01:06<mshuler>that's the framebuffer initialization when the bootup text switches from vga console large text to the framebuffer with small text
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01:16*snogglethorpe wonders how many times the console switches resolutions/modes/fonts during boot...
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01:21<bullgard4>mshuler: '~$ locate inteldrmfb' does not produce any output. "The page "Inteldrmfb" does not exist." What is meant by "inteldrmfb"?
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01:22<mshuler>locate i915 ;)
01:23<bbecker>#debian-boot is pretty quiet right now, anyone in here able to help me figure out why my pxe booted network-console installation reboots 5 minutes after d-i starts, regardless of what i'm doing?
01:24<mshuler>bbecker: getting pretty sleepy, but are you preseeding?
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01:25<bbecker>just enough to get network-console working
01:25<bbecker>then i'm ssh'ing in to complete the install
01:26<bullgard4>mshuler: This produces ~60 lines of text. For example: "/lib/modules/3.2.0-4-amd64/kernel/drivers/gpu/drm/i915." How does this help answering my question at the outset?
01:27<mshuler>bullgard4: /lib/modules/`uname -r`/kernel/drivers/gpu/drm/i915/i915.ko is the kernel module for your intel video card - the framebuffer is a feature - what exactly is your question?
01:27<themill>bullgard4: if you knew why you were asking this question, then it would be easier for you to work out the answer
01:28<bbecker>mshuler: iirc, network-console is only supposed to reboot if there is no ssh connection, right?
01:28<mshuler>bbecker: I'm not really sure why it would reboot on you - that's never happened to me before, so I'm not sure where to look
01:30<mshuler>I've never used network-console, either, so if there's a timeout of some sort, I'm not sure about that
01:31<mshuler>done 1000's of PXE installs, though :)
01:31<bbecker>mshuler: ah ok. well thanks anyway. i'll keep digging
01:31<bbecker>nice. maybe i'll just build a full preseed and stop mucking with network-console
01:32<mshuler>that's definitely the way to go
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01:49<dtw>Chromium browser does not offer to save passwords for Google account. How can I make it do so?
01:52<mshuler>dtw: settings - show advanced settings - there's a checkbox (enabled on mine) for offering to save passwords
01:52<dtw>Yes there is, and it works elsewhere. Just not for Google accounts.
01:53<mshuler>oh, huh. I'm not sure about that, then
01:54<mshuler>dtw: are you using the sync feature with a google account? Perhaps that is their method for google accounts
01:55<mshuler>that's what I use with mutiple accounts, so I've never noticed. I do need to log in monthly or so
01:56<mshuler>sync with my main account, then log into 3 others
01:56<dtw>mshuler, no, haven't used that. So far I've thought that I don't want any cloud stuff. Perhaps I should consider the Chromium-signing stuff more closely.
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01:58<mshuler>dtw: I trust them with my mail, so my bookmarks are harmless.. the management of what is saved there seems pretty sane to me, although it depends on the tilt of your tinfoil hat :)
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03:01<Monery>greetings all.... is this a support channel or a general chat about debian
03:01<mgv>Monery: support channel
03:01<Monery>mgv: thx
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04:01<adga>what time is it in new york?
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04:02<gnugr>adga:this is a channel for Debian tech support
04:03<adga>gnugr: my PC not configured time on debian
04:04<gnugr>adga:just right click on time's icon and figure it out
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04:05<adga>gnugr: my GUI is console.....
04:06<gnugr>adga:from console you can type "dpkg-reconfigure tzdata" and set it up again
04:08<EmleyMoor>Is there a way I can prevent a particular user of a laptop activating "Aeroplane mode"?
04:10<adga>gnugr: thanks.
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04:20<shawn_>hello the word !!
04:20<captnfab>Does anyone know if there's a reason for apt-p2p not being advertised more than it is?
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04:22<shawn_>please how active the seLinux on Ubuntu Studio ? thanks !!!!
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04:25<gnugr>!ubuntuirc shawn_
04:25<dpkg>shawn_: This is not the Ubuntu help channel. Please do /server and then /join #ubuntu. If you are using XChat, you can right-click the following link and choose connect. irc://
04:26<shawn_>ok !!!
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04:29<gnugr>EmleyMoor:can't you setup user's permissions for that particular user? also read this
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04:31<lilibox>i am on squeeze, which reports some troubles with my SATA disks, i read wheezy fixes those bugs, i got several questions, a/ could i upgrade over ssh, b/ i am running it in RAID1, should i care about anything in this case?
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04:37<nocturnal>I've upgraded several boxes to wheezy over ssh. but there's always a risk of course.
04:37<nocturnal>never with software raid
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04:37<EmleyMoor>gnugr: What is the permission that affects this?
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04:41<gnugr>EmleyMoor:not sure but i think its in the group of ACL list
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04:45<EmleyMoor>This is all down to what file(s) that mode tweaks... and that is what I don't knew
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04:48<lilibox>nocturnal: well, if you got such box (with RAID1) what will be your decision then?
04:48<lilibox>process it as common box?
04:49<lilibox>i'll try follow these steps
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04:50<lilibox>in discussion is mentioned to download all packeges on disk first, not upgrade directly in fly, it is good hint imho
04:50<gnugr>EmleyMoor:read "Case 4: Special Bits" on the link i posted, if you know the specific path of "Aeroplain mode" to set it up
04:54<themill>EmleyMoor: I'd guess you were looking for polkit/consolekit to be authorising (or not) this action. (assuming that this is not a hardware switch were you have no control)
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05:20<JoeHart>yo, what's up.
05:20<JoeHart>this is the official Debian channel, but has only 574 users, and the un-official debian channel at freenode has over 1000 users, lol.
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05:20*themill searches for the joke
05:21<no-one>the other dev-ish channels are possibly more here
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05:21<no-one>i don't recall #debian-mentors on there for example
05:21<JoeHart>debian wheezy or ubuntu 13.04?
05:21<JoeHart>in terms of speed.
05:21<JoeHart>and less-resources.
05:21<no-one>depends on how you use it
05:22<no-one>given that this channel tries to not support debian-derived distros it possibly would also try to distantiate from how different they get :-)
05:22<themill>try it yourself. There's more to selecting a distro than "resources".
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05:22<no-one>i'm sure that even if the default setup is faster on your hardware, there's some customisation possible to tune the other to be faster and fit your needs
05:23<no-one>so it's up to what you like in the specific distro, its goals and way it's organised :-)
05:23<JoeHart>is debian wheezy installation pretty easy?
05:23<JoeHart>and I am a little confused on one thing for weeks.
05:23<no-one>yes, the istaller has an option of how verbose it should get
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05:24<no-one>you can ask it to ask as few questions as possible if that's what you like
05:24<rhagu>hi, I am running a ubuntu guest on a debian 7.1 kvm host. The host uses a bonded interface, which is bridged to the guests: the problem is: the guest is not able to retrieve an ip adress via dhcp, any ideas?
05:24<JoeHart>during installation, when the partition-part comes, I don't know what to do, it has options like "assign to home", "assign to /" - what option should I select?
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05:25<no-one>you can just go with whatever default it uses as long as it spots and tries to use the correct partition
05:25<rhagu>brctl show says:
05:25<JoeHart>what does
05:25<JoeHart>assign to / mean?
05:25<JoeHart>and assign to /home, /root...etc
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05:26<no-one>otherwise to be a bit more detailed, 'home' is the directory where users' files live (downloads, documents, and custom settings), and '/' is the entire filesystem, so it lets you know how large it makes them
05:26<JoeHart>I am still confused.
05:27<JoeHart>for example;
05:27<JoeHart>I want to install Debian in /dev/sdb1
05:27<JoeHart>and then it says
05:27<JoeHart>"assign to /home or assign to /"
05:27<no-one>take a peek at
05:27<JoeHart>I am confused at that assign part.
05:27<no-one>scroll down a bit to the list with blue names of directories and a note for each
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05:28<no-one>'assign to /' means 'allocate this space to this directory'
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05:28<no-one>so, allocate that space to '/', and this space to '/home', and the default typically is useful
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05:31<musca>rhagu: which network parameter do you use for kvm?
05:31<nicolette>Rory, I'm in Unity for Open Source drivers. What do you want me to do?
05:31<rhagu>musca a bridge setup
05:33<nicolette>Is dr_willis gone?
05:34<musca>rhagu: i will concentrating on the guest, what -netdev ... -device ... parameter do you use?
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05:34<rhagu>I used virt-manager to set it up, but I am looking for the right virsh command to pastebin its contents
05:35<musca>rhagu: ok, there is #virt on specializing in this topic.
05:36<nicolette>rory, hello
05:37<musca>nicolette: Unity on Ubuntu?
05:38<nicolette>whoa, i'm in the wrong cannel
05:38<nicolette>my bad
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05:59<no-one>hello :)
05:59<bfly>i'm having trouble with usb flash media connected to a sheevaplug (kirkwood) running wheezy
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06:00<bfly>it happens with multiple usb sticks, but those sticks work fine elsewhere.
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06:01<bfly>any suggetions on what i could try?
06:02<bfly>Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
06:02<bfly>Bus 001 Device 003: ID 0325:ac02 OCZ Technology Inc ATV Turbo / Rally2 Dual Channel USB 2.0 Flash Drive
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06:02<SynrG>would you describe the nature of the problem? when you plug them in, what dmesg output do you get? please use for that
06:03<babilen>bfly: Apart from the fact that you have "trouble" with it you didn't actually say what the problem is. Doesn't it want to tidy up its room?
06:03<SynrG>and that
06:03<bfly>those disconnects take place when the cpu is under load (and the usb controller, too, but probably not that much)
06:03<bfly>babilen: well the device disconnects with an error while writing to it (see the paste)
06:04<SynrG>ah, somehow i missed the paste
06:04<valdyn>bfly: and that happens only on the sheevaplug?
06:05<bfly>yes exactly
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06:05<babilen>I missed the paste also
06:05<bfly>i can write as much as i want to 2 sticks i tested on other computers
06:05<babilen>bfly: Sorry, i completely overlooked that.
06:06<bfly>... but as soon as they are connected to the sheevaplug and i compile software there they run into this
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06:08<bfly>also the device is reconnected with a different device name (sda -> sdb) which is also bad.
06:08<SynrG>yes. it has not been given long enough to release sda
06:08<SynrG>that's normal
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06:09<SynrG>mostly USB bouncing up and down for me seems to relate to the plug not making a good fit ...
06:09<SynrG>i don't know how that would be load-related though
06:10<bfly>well i can't say for sure whether it's CPU or I/O load (possibly due to lack of RAM and having to swap) causing it.
06:11<SynrG>maybe some place with more direct experience with sheevaplug would know better if this is a known issue with that hardware
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06:12<bfly>hmm yes you're probably right there. though i would assume a couple peopl ehere have one.
06:12<SynrG>possibly, but ... timezones
06:12<bfly>also it could be related to the wheezy kernel
06:12<SynrG>and if it's a rare problem ...
06:13<SynrG>that too. can you try any other kernel?
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06:13<bfly>hmm, not sure, i guess i'd have to build it which.... requires storage
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06:14<bfly>i guess i will try a usb hdd, might work out better.
06:14<SynrG>you said you have it with multiple usb sticks. so i assume that means *all* sticks you've tried have the problem, i.e. there is not any one that does not have the problem
06:15<bfly>i tried two stick, both ran into the same error message (though different sectors)
06:15<bfly>so both run into "Unhandled error code" and "Result: hostbyte=DID_NO_CONNECT driverbyte=DRIVER_OK"
06:16<SynrG>anyway, if it does disconnect under heavy load and it's not physical/electrical, i guess the kernel driver becomes suspect #1
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06:17<bfly>that'd be the default "usb_storage" then?
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06:19<bfly>lsmod doesn't list anything fancy
06:19<SynrG>well, that or the uhci or whatever it's called
06:19<SynrG>it may be nothing to do with storage in particular
06:20<valdyn>bfly: i believe your sheevaplug is simply not providing enough power for that stick
06:20<SynrG>oh! i didn't think of that
06:20<bfly>yes i suspect this might be the issue, others ran into usb power issues, too
06:20<SynrG>maybe smaller stick == less power required?
06:21<bfly>alas i'll try the externally powered hdd and see how this goes
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06:21<SynrG>so you could try that
06:21<SynrG>or that
06:21<bfly>well it is small
06:21<bfly>4 GB, but yeah, could still be
06:21<valdyn>it depends on the nand (or whatever) chip type
06:21<bfly>i see
06:23<bfly>joeyh had some trouble with sdhc and i/o errors (last paragraph on )
06:23<bfly>anyway, thanks for the help
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06:28<EmleyMoor>gnugr: I don't know the path.
06:29<EmleyMoor>themill: I don't mind what the method is...
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06:33<themill>EmleyMoor: yeah, I know nothing other than "that's the standard way of doing authz these days"
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06:41<EmleyMoor>themill: I haven't even heard definitively that what I want to do is possible
06:41<EmleyMoor>The other solution would be to persuade David to buy himself a laptop, so he doesn't use mine any more
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07:23<txt-file>I have a problem with iceweasel in combination with linux 3.2.0-4-amd64. Sometimes iceweasel is crashing and if I start it in the cli it just prints "Bus error". This problem does not occur under 3.10.
07:23<txt-file>Is there a way to get more verbose output from iceweasel?
07:24<ichdasic1>txt-file: strace iceweasel
07:25<txt-file>so iceweasel does not have an command line switch to enable debug?
07:26<ichdasic1>txt-file: i don't know. but in any case, strace will give you a more detailed set of information.
07:27<txt-file>yeah …
07:28<txt-file> I think the last 4 lines are the most interresting
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07:31<AgentC>what to do when a harddrive in a "asus eetop" flatsystem does not been recognised ?
07:32<AgentC>the bios is seeing the drive as "st300xxxx" but the op-sys not.
07:33<AgentC>even under debian as under windows, it says drive not found, but bios see it and shows it as startdrive
07:33<EmleyMoor>AgentC: Was it ever recognised?
07:33<EmleyMoor>Can a partitioning program such as cfdisk see it?
07:34<AgentC>only bios show it as startdrive !
07:35<AgentC>hardware fault !???
07:36<EmleyMoor>AgentC: Have you tried the drive in another system?
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07:39<AgentC>EmleyMoor: no, bios see it as startdrive, but on bootup it says there is no drive, even under rescue mode no dev sda sdb etc,,,,,,, not avail
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07:40<EmleyMoor>How about trying it in some other system, to see if it's seen there...
07:40<abrotman>perhaps it's not an actual disk, perhaps it's a ROM
07:42<AgentC>may be, i also assume on hardware failure....
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07:42<AgentC>xorg does also not start, only textmode
07:43<abrotman>did Xorg ever start?
07:45<txt-file>I have the feeling that my problem resulted from a full /home with btrfs.
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07:48<Zach>Hey guys, I know this probably isn't the right IRC for this chat - but you've all been helpful in the past. I'm leaving for uni in a few weeks and I want to upgrade my laptop (current laptop is over 5 years old) and I'm curious what suggestions you have for a top performance laptop that won't empty my pockets completely?
07:49<txt-file>Zach: then I recommend the one you already have
07:50<Zach>txt-file: surely there are some good deals out there?
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08:01<Zach>Does anyone here have a chromebook?
08:01<abrotman>Zach: Do you need help with Debian?
08:02<Zach>abrotman: I'll stop.
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08:25<toru>I'm getting an error "Failed to load" when I try to run steam in Jessie. Any ideas? I've googled and haven't found much relavent.
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08:33<abrotman>toru: does hte library exist?
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08:37<supaman>that was for toru
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08:44<toru> is definitely there. still can't figure out what could be wrong. everything is in my home directory.
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08:44<toru>the .steam folder i mean.
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08:49<abrotman>toru: ldd
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09:07<toru>ah. apparently xz-utils shoudl have been installed as a dependency.
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09:28<Osiris_X>if I want to do an OR inside [[...]] do you use | or ||?
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09:30<themill>the latter (help [[) but remember that these are all bashisms
09:31<Osiris_X>themill: bashisms? ie. they don't apply to perl and sed scripts etc?
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09:34<themill>Osiris_X: they apply only to scripts run with bash (#!/bin/bash) and not sh (#!/bin/sh)
09:34<Osiris_X>themill: got it
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09:59<supaman>in gnome shell, how do I switch between terminals (alt-tab switches between programs, but not many instances of the same program, like many different terminals)
09:59<supaman>using keyboard I mean :-)
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10:03<supaman>ahhh, alt + ° (the key above tab)
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10:31<win>hi all
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10:34<dpkg>Known issues with daily developmental builds of the Debian Installer are listed at . Also ask me about <transition> and check the /topic of #debian-next on
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10:46<mrc>Hello, I packaged and patched a program. quilt has created a .pc/ directory, should I ship that directory too with the sources or is the debian/patches/ directory enough?
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10:53<takis_GR>i need your help. I have install Wheezy+lxde+nvidia 6200. After slim i have a black screen...
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11:01<f8l>takis_GR: Reboot to single user mode and remove slim. This will hopefully get you some vision.
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11:23<f8l>tajwan: Witaj. To jest kanał anglojęzyczny. | Hello. This is an English only channel.
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11:51<woutjek>Anyone else had their bashrc changed by an update or something? Mine shows the complete path now..
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12:01<cae>woutjek: ~/.bashrc or something in /etc/? The latter could happen, but the user would be asked
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12:03<woutjek>I am not sure to be hondest cae, in .bashc the PS1 variable is still showing with /w which I think it only shows the working dir right?
12:04<woutjek>Then I could have a looksee in /etc/profile or /etc/bash.bashrc right? Are there more places where this behaviour could originate from (come to think of it, both root and normal users seem to have changed)
12:04<cae>\w the current working directory, with $HOME abbreviated with a tilde (uses the value of the PROMPT_DIRTRIM variable)
12:05<Ryccardo> /etc/profile.d/* and the bash_completion one
12:06<cae>woutjek: but it's probably easier to track the issue down if you'd tell what you have done (e.g. upgrade from what to what, /var/log/apt/history.log shows what new packages, etc.)
12:06<woutjek>cae: good plan
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12:07<cae>if there's no bash* package upgraded, it's most likely not direct issued by the upgrade... does this occur as root? As user? (All users?)
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12:08<woutjek>cae: it effects all usrs
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12:10<woutjek>Weird: there is no record of bash in /var/log/apt/history.log (cat /var/log/apt/history.log | grep bash
12:10<woutjek>lets see if bash is installed via another package.
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12:11<cae>woutjek: quick idea, if your prompt was previously something like user@host:~/foo$ and has changed to user@host:/home/user/foo$, then it could be caused by having your home moved (/etc/passwd, 6th column)
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12:12<Ryccardo>extreme method: run "strings | grep PS1" on every file, then if there's output locate if that file is in a package
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12:12<cae>but since it's for all users, the whole passwd should be broken (I don't belive that)
12:13<woutjek>Its more like whenever is was somewhere, say, /home/woutjek/Downloads it showed woutjek@server:Downloads. Now it is woutjek@server:/home/woutjek/Downloads
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12:13<cae>Ryccardo: optimize that by looking just at the files bash is looking into by $ strace -fe open -o $(mktemp) bash --login
12:13<woutjek>Hmmm lets see
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12:15<woutjek>My /home is still where it should be (same partition mounted as before). Good idea though, I did reboot today and after the reboot this behaviour showed up
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12:17<Ryccardo>find /etc -exec grep -l PS1 '{}' \+ 2>/dev/null
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12:19<Ryccardo>excluding false positives, I only have profile, bash.bashrc, /etc/profile.d/, /etc/profile.d/
12:19<woutjek>Ryccardo: the output of that shows it is used in /etc/profile /etc/bash.bashrc and /etc/skel/.bashrc /etc/profile/ and bash_completion
12:19<cae>if you did the strace thing, you should have a /tmp/tmp.* and you can run
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12:20<cae>$ grep open /tmp/tmp.* | sed 's/^.*open("//;s/".*$//' | sort -u | while read line; do test -f "$line" && grep -l PS1 "$line"; done
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12:21<cae>here, it shows /etc/bash.bashrc /etc/bash_completion.d/git /etc/profile /etc/profile.d/ and my ~/.bash_history and ~/.bashrc
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12:24<woutjek>cae: here it shows:
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12:25<twujfive_>is "kvm" equivalent to the command "qemu -enable-kvm" ?
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12:26<woutjek>Ehm : etc /bash.bashrc. etc/profile /etc/profile.d/ , /etc/profile.d/ /root/.bashrc /usr/lib/git-core/git-sh-prompt (?) and /usr/share/local/nl/LC_MESSAGES/
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12:31<fairway>hi all
12:31<fairway>how do I configure my debian box so that reverse dns works from outside?
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12:43<Ryccardo>even copy and paste has its problems
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13:22<ter>Ive installed owncloud but i cant find the owncloud.conf
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13:24<woutjek>so cae: any ideas?
13:26<cae>woutjek: probably double check that it's small \w and not capital \W... but then, no idea... crawl all the loaded bashrcs's?
13:27<ter>ive set up https but when i go to the owncloud webpage it says cloud not found
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13:29<cae>ter: --> /etc/apache2/sites-available/owncloud.conf (in case you took owncloud from the repositories; it's not in stable
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13:31<ter>i got it from an opensuse repo
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14:56<wdoodle>Hi, a formerly working serial console is no longer so. I could use some help figuring out why it no longer is. Server: squeeze with agetty listening on ttyS0. Console: laptop running squeeze with minicom attached to ttyUSB0. 115200 no parity 1 stop bit. Then server setup got sidelined for a couple of weeks. When I next fired up the server, I tried to connect with a desktop running wheezy, but also using minicom attached to ttyUSB0 at 1152
14:57<wdoodle>Swapped the cable back to the laptop, in the meantime upgraded to wheezy. There was no grub nor boot messages, but I did get the login prompt. Except that, when I tried to login, I never got the password prompt. Just hung. Subsequent attempts don't even get me the login prompt. getty is running on the server. The devices ttyS0 and ttyUSB0 exist. Going through the serial console howto and what's new in wheezy didn't shed any light. Test
14:57<wdoodle>Any thoughts would be welcome
14:57<MichaelPaoli>how to reconstruct debian-30r0-i386-binary-1.iso - has the jigdo files, but is missing at least some of the required component files
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14:58<wdoodle>btw, is the any cable testing I should be doing other than verifying the correct pin out of the cable via a continuity tester?
14:58<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Why do you need such an old image?
14:59<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle I don't know that it supports console on USB serial, should at least on legacy serial if you have that.
15:00<MichaelPaoli>f8l Just trying to complete a set of ISOs if ever needed for special purpose - e.g. low spec hardware on host isolated from Internet - have CD, but it's got a bad spot - missing about 75K of the data from that image; have the binary-2 through binary-7 CDs - all validated good, from that set - but have issue with the binary-1 CD.
15:00<wdoodle>MichaelPaoli: hi, I did have it working on USB serial, encouraged by the serial console howto
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15:01<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle Are you able to write stuff out to the serial device and see it show in output? Likewise, can you read input from it (but may need to temporarily disable any getty running on it to try that).
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15:02<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle Also, newer grub takes significantly different configuration for serial - but can come back to that after getting operating system console portion working.
15:02<wdoodle>MichaelPaoli: never tried. Can you give more detail on how to do such a r/w test?
15:02<wdoodle>or point me to a doc
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15:03<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Did you try snapshots?
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15:04*wdoodle thinks maybe the serial howto might talk of such a test
15:04<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle E.g.: # echo -e '\r\nfoo test\r' >> /dev/console ... likewise for, e.g. /dev/ttyS0, etc. - that's for write. Similar for read, e.g. use cat, redirect input from device, e.g.: # cat < /dev/ttyS0 - but getty to not be running on the device first - can use fuser to check if something has it open.
15:05<Argure>does a public windows share for debian netinst exist anywhere?
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15:05<Argure>my ipmi interface is stuck in the stoneage and doesn't just allow for a .iso upload
15:06<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle Can also use stty to check/set communication parameters; stty operates on stdin, so, e.g. to (temporarily) change ttyS0 to 9600, could do # stty 9600 < /dev/ttyS0
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15:06<alejandro>i have a question
15:06<wdoodle>and then I should see foo test in minicom on the laptop?
15:06<nevyn>lights and bells are for trauma or mica stuff aiui usually.
15:07<Argure>wait, never mind
15:07<alejandro>sometimes the task bar dissapears , and i cant open any program, i had to reinstall the linux
15:07<Argure>it's hidden in the java console
15:07<Argure>(seriously, who designs this stuff)
15:07<alejandro>does anyone knows waht it is?
15:07<MichaelPaoli>f8l snapshots ... as in URL under archive, e.g. ... ones like that are missing. Seems to have Woody, but not all the way back to 3.0_r0
15:08<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle Yes, write stuff to serial port, should see that output on whatever's connected. Likewise, read from it, should see what's sent from remote device (terminal, or what have you).
15:08<f8l>MichaelPaoli: I had 3.1 CD somewhere, but I lost it. It could contain the missing packages…
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15:10<MichaelPaoli>f8l I have later 3.0 CD ... 3.0r1, but it doesn't have the needed bits. But also, 3.0r1, I just have binary-1, not the full set of CDs, ... hence would be nice to be able to put 3.0r0 binary-1 CD together again.
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15:12<MichaelPaoli>wdoodle Can also do a simple loopback test - again, (temporarily) disable getty or the like on the port, and connect the data transmit and receive pins together (2 & 3 on DB-25 or DE-9), and then connect to it from host itself with, e.g. minicom - anything you type to it should then be echoed back to you. That at least tests through the hardware and serial port back to itself.
15:14<f8l>MichaelPaoli: It seems that libgd1_1.8.4-17.woody2_i386.deb is the oldest in the archive…
15:15<MichaelPaoli>f8l Yes, exactly, seems the archive goes back into Woody, but not all the way to Woody 3.0r0 :-/ ... even though it's got the jigdo for 3.0r0
15:16<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Have you tried p2p? You'd be surprised what can be found there.
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15:17<MichaelPaoli>f8l Which/what p2p? I've done quite a bit of searching, including The Internet Archive - haven't been able to find site that actually has that old ISO, nor the .torrent for it. Closest I found is some .pl site which claims to have it, but wants to charge for it (apparently wants payment for any downloads >= 1M).
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15:19<f8l>MichaelPaoli: eD2k for example. I used to seed Debian CDs there and I saw many really ancient ones shared by others.
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15:20<f8l>MichaelPaoli: I think I have a script which tells aMule which parts of the image are already downloaded, so that you don't have to download it from scratch.
15:21<MichaelPaoli>f8l Ah, cool, ... wasn't familiar with that p2p protocol, etc. I'll check it out, see if maybe I manage to find it there.
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15:22<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Beware though. It's a dark place… Debian ISOs are signed now, but I don't know if they were back then.
15:23<f8l>MichaelPaoli: If everything else fails, you can upgrade your set to Woody r1 easily with jigdo.
15:23<MichaelPaoli>f8l Yes, always verify - I have the old signatures on those ISOs, so can always validate once completed; can also verify via the jigdo files - so have at least 2 ways to validate completed ISO.
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15:24<gsimmons>MichaelPaoli: Why not just acquire the last point release (3.0r6)? At least those images are on cdimage.d.o.
15:26<MichaelPaoli>f8l Thanks, I'll give it a go, and true, if I can't reassemble 3.0r0 from any available sites or p2p, upping the image to whatever's closes point release that is available via jigdo on would be a good approximation - and since I have the binary-2 through binary-7 CDs, not so much data to suck down or load the archive site with handing out.
15:27<MichaelPaoli>gsimmons Main reason is I have the full set of 3.0r0 binary CDs ... except there's a defect on binary-1 CD, so I'm missing about 75 KiB of data from having the full set.
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15:36<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Let me know if you find a source for the CD. I've found that program for creating chunk data for .met files I mentioned.
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15:38<MichaelPaoli>f8l Okay, thanks, will do - looks like the protocol, etc. supports downloading "chunks" - so I could probably just get the one (or two, if overlaps) chunks to fill in the needed missing data. Have to head off in a bit, but will let you know later if I manage to find it.
15:38<f8l>MichaelPaoli: In eD2k, chunks are as big as 9500KiB.
15:39<MichaelPaoli>true - but one or two of those isn't all that much data to deal with or download.
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15:42<f8l>MichaelPaoli: You'll spend most of the time waiting in a queue either way… If you are lucky, the one who shares the image has the client configured to serve full chunks. If not, it's better to hunt for the missing part only.
15:43<MichaelPaoli>f8l Thanks - I'll keep that in mind.
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15:47*f8l dusts his not so old code and twitches in disgust.
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15:49<Guest6748>Anyone know of a site or sites that shows/explains how to work with partitions for installing Debian on same harddrive that I have 2 other Linux versions. Need to learn how to resize one of existing partitions. Thanks
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15:50<devil>Guest6748: you can google for 'gparted resize'
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15:51<devil>Guest6748: if windows is involved, you need to defrag first
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15:56<f8l>devil: Never heard about that earlier.
15:57<devil>ixi: hm?
15:57<devil>f8l: hm?
15:57<devil>sorry ixi
15:57<abrotman>close :)
15:58<devil>damn short nicknames and old eyes don't go well together :)
15:58<Guest6748>devil: No windoze.. 2 other clean installs of (Mint 15 (Cin) and Bohdi linux) Been awhile since doing partitioning etc. and can use a refresh. Don't want to "ball things up" as they say. Thanks
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16:00<f8l>devil: I don't know how defragmenting may help. The resize is likely to move the files around either way. I'd defrag after that though.
16:00<MichaelPaoli>Guest6748 gparted might be handy for that. In any case, need to first shrink the filesystem(s), then the corresponding partion(s) - but must *not* shrink the partitions to smaller than the filesystem otherwise data is lost.
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16:01<Xylon>debian rocks
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16:01<devil>f8l: you might not be able to resize to the extent you would like to without defragging. at least it used to be that way.
16:02<blubberdiblub>devil, i think that's only the case if you want to resize within windows itself. gparted/ntfsresize works fine whether it's fragmented or not, afaik
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16:02<devil>blubberdiblub: even if you want to shrink the win partition?
16:03<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Are you sure you lack that little? A quick wget --spider told me that 131 packages are missing from the archive…
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16:03<MichaelPaoli>devil Yep, ... Windows NTFS suckage - it's like that; can often only resize down to at most 1/2 size on first pass - there are some bits of its filesystem it won't move, but a defrag typically takes care of that ... after the first pass of resizing.
16:04<blubberdiblub>devil, yes, i was specifically talking about shrinking
16:04<devil>MichaelPaoli: that is what I remember from a decade ago, before i kicked windows alltogether
16:04<MichaelPaoli>f8l Yes, have physical CD, most of it is good, also able to mount it and read most of it ... jigdo mostly likes what it finds there, and finds the majority of the files.
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16:04<f8l>For growing, defrag makes absolutely no sense. Apart from the benefits of defrag itself.
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16:05<devil>f8l: that is obvious :)
16:06<Guest6748>MichaelPaoli: My goal is to do 4 or 5 separate clean installs of different Linux versions. One of course will be Debian. - I'm willing to format and repartition this drive. ~ Do you have a quick suggestion on setup this way instead?
16:06<MichaelPaoli>devil Yep, been many years since I've booted Windows on anything I own, and mostly only ran it quite rarely at that (e.g. when it was needed for some BIOS update or vendor hardware diagnostic utility). Only exception is I've got a Windows 8 image I rarely fire up on a virtual machine - just to remind me how ugly it is .. then I shut it down again.
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16:07<f8l>MichaelPaoli: Ah… I wonder if anyone would like to have these files in the archive. Also, maybe you could rescue the CD with gddrescue or dares.
16:08<MichaelPaoli>Guest6748 Interesting question too, do you need/want to do it physical? Or would virtual suffice for your purposes? Anyway, to repartition, I'd mostly look at the GNU gparted stuff - pretty nice 'n user-friendly and relatively goof-resistant.
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16:09<MichaelPaoli>f8l Have tried gddrescue ... did run across dares, haven't tried that one yet. Yes, question did occur to me, if I get that image, archive might want that (and the other 6 of 7 CDs) ... or their constituent files, for the archive, so that they could then be assembled properly with jigdo - as they do have the jigdo files.
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16:10<MichaelPaoli>f8l did also try on multiple CD drives, so ... it's the CD itself.
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16:11<f8l>MichaelPaoli: You're really determined to get that CD back… :-) If they provide the .jigdo, maybe they have ISOs as well. Or maybe some of the packages aren't there by mistake…
16:11<alejandro>hello, i have a question
16:11<babilen>alejandro: Just ask :)
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16:11<f8l>alejandro: Hello. Just ask it.
16:11<alejandro>sometimes my taskbar dissapears
16:11<alejandro>and i cant open any program
16:12<alejandro>i solved it by reinstalling everything
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16:12<devil>alejandro: what DE is that in?
16:12<babilen>alejandro: Which desktop environment do you use? And how does it disappear? Is it simply hidden and it reappears if you move your mouse towards it? Which distribution do you use and which version?
16:12<devil>desktop environment
16:12<alejandro>ok, i have cinnamon mint 15
16:12<babilen>dpkg: mint
16:12<dpkg>Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at or join #linuxmint-help on for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available, based on <testing>. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>.
16:13<babilen>alejandro: You want to ask in the mint channel ^^^ in that case as we only support pure Debian in here.
16:13<MichaelPaoli>f8l Hmmm, not sure why they're not there - but they don't have the isos - at least not on-line and publicy available on the site.
16:13<alejandro>it dissapears, i get near the mouse and i can see like shadows, but i cant open anything
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16:13<devil>alejandro: we cannot help you
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16:13<babilen>alejandro: Good luck! (consider installing Debian if you want our help (and a working system))
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16:46<wdoodle>just tested "echo -e '\r\nfoo test\r' > /dev/ttyS0" and "cat < /dev/ttyS0" and both worked just fine
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16:51<wdoodle>WTH!?! ctrl-C'ing the above cat command and restarting getty on /dev/ttyS0, all of a sudden I get the login prompt, the password prompt and a command prompt
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16:51*wdoodle scratches his head in bewilderment
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17:06<blubberdiblub>wdoodle, you usually have to press Enter one or two times after connecting the serial line to get a getty prompt
17:07<wdoodle>tried that. several times.
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17:07<wdoodle>tried hanging up the "modem", resetting it, sending a break. nothing seemed to work
17:08<blubberdiblub>maybe getty was stuck with wrong speed or handshaking settings on the line, then
17:08<wdoodle>I'm still scratching my head. testing the serial connection without getty on the line seemed to wake up minicom somehow
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17:09<wdoodle>blubberdiblub: do you know of any tests for such a condition?
17:09<blubberdiblub>no, sorry, just typed what popped to mind
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17:10<wdoodle>no worries. all ideas welcome. I can google such an animal myself. thanks for the suggestion
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17:19<Guest6748>MichaelPaoli: Had to step out, sorry. Yes I would like to end up with 4 to 5 individual native installs. I'll see what I can dig-up on the gparted stuff. thanks
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17:21<DrZaius>where does the default term for the ttys come from?
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18:11<Celelibi>Can I have a working dhcp server and a dhcpv6 at the same time?
18:12<abrotman>why not?
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18:15<vlt>Hello. How can I make "default:CARD=K6" the default playback device in .asoundrc?
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18:15<Celelibi>abrotman: Because if I run isc-dhcp-server in ipv6 mode, it doesn't start because it don't like my config file made for ipv4.
18:15<Celelibi>Meaning it can't serve both ipv4 and ipv6 at the same time.
18:16<abrotman>Celelibi: that seems like quite a but
18:17<Celelibi>I don't think isc dhcpd is meant for serving both protocols at the same time.
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18:17<Celelibi>However I can report a bug and let the maintainers find a solution.
18:17<Celelibi>Seems like ubuntu made two distinct packages.
18:19<Celelibi>Well, actually this bug has already been reported.
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18:20<abrotman>dpkg: dbug 592539
18:20<dpkg>abrotman: no idea
18:20<abrotman>dpkg: dbugs 592539
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18:20<dpkg>#592539:W[isc-dhcp-server] isc-dhcp-server: supply additional initscript for IPv6 daemon (ipv6 patch); Tue, 10 Aug 2010 19:51:02 UTC [611825]
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18:22<abrotman>it has a patch?
18:22<Celelibi>I'm reading the messages.
18:23<Celelibi>Seems like there are some patches to run two distinct instances of the daemon for both ipv4 and ipv6.
18:24<Celelibi>Where do I see the status of that bug?
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18:25<abrotman>at the top of the page
18:26<abrotman>it's a wishlist, and open
18:26<abrotman>should probably not be a wishlist
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18:26<Celelibi>I can't find that it's "open".
18:26<abrotman>it's not marked as "closed"
18:27<abrotman>Celelibi: .. marked as Done for example
18:28<Celelibi>An explicit "open" would be great. :)
18:29<abrotman>file a bug? :)
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18:30<Celelibi>A bug about the bug tracking system? :)
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18:33<Celelibi>abrotman: ok, so, there is a patch that seems functional.
18:33<Celelibi>Why is this bug still open.
18:34<abrotman>Celelibi: see the last comment, missing maintainer
18:34<abrotman>oh, wrong bug :)
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18:34<abrotman>Celelibi: ask the maintainer
18:35<abrotman>(that was the apparmor bug with the missing maintainer)
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20:50<Sekkite>Hello there folks! I'm considering using Debian as my main development/general browsing laptop and as a sanity check, are there any privacy/security concerns I should be particularly aware of?
20:51<Sekkite>Basically, I'm heading away from Ubuntu. I don't like their movement towards tracking more of what one does with it and I feel particularly uncomfortable with any service on a machine that tries to aggregate a behavioral log of everything a user does.
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21:00<abrotman>Sekkite: i am not aware of anything that Debian has like that
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21:00<abrotman>(unless intentionally configured)
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21:02<Sekkite>So there's no GeoIP service enabled by default? No "automatically upload a RAM dump to Debian's servers when an application crashes" service by default?
21:03<Sekkite>Like with ubuntu
21:05<Khades>debian application crashed?
21:05<Khades>never heard of
21:05<Sekkite>So I hear :P
21:05<abrotman>Sekkite: i've not heard of anything like that
21:05<abrotman>not even as an option
21:06<Sekkite>Good good. I'll give it a go then once I purge Windows 8 from my laptop.
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22:03<Sekkite>Purging Windows 8 is taking longer than I thought it would.
22:04<abrotman>Sekkite: just parition over it ?
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22:07<Khades>i'd keep win8
22:07<Khades>shrinking it partition to 100gb
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22:08<Khades>sometimes cames in handy
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22:08<abrotman>not your system is it?
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22:10<Khades>anyway when dota2 came out i no longer need windows
22:11<Sekkite>Abrotman - I do not support UEFI in its current implementation, so I am trying to disable it.
22:12<abrotman>i wasn't arguing with you
22:12<Sekkite>Lemme rephrase - I'm disabling UEFI before I do anything else :P
22:14<abrotman>no idea why you're arguing with me about it .. go for it
22:14<Sekkite>I'm...not trying to appear argumentative. I'm not arguing with you about it.
22:14<Sekkite>Evidently I'm failing.
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22:24<rrivera>hi all, how can I downgrade my kernel?
22:24<rrivera>I have installed 3.10-2-amd64
22:25<rrivera>but I have several issues with VMWARE
22:27<dvs>rrivera: You did keep your old kernel, right?
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22:29<rrivera>I guess... sorry I´m a novice user
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22:29<rrivera>I read that usually Debian keep the older version installed
22:30<rrivera>but I don´t how to switch it
22:31<rrivera>I noticed that my Kernel was upgraded since I added repositories from Debian Unstable
22:31<rrivera>my fault! :/
22:31<dpkg>Downgrading is not, nor will ever be supported by apt. Programs change their data in a way that can't be rolled back, and package maintainer scripts support upgrades to new config file formats but not downgrades. Try: "dpkg -i olderversion.deb" or "aptitude install package=version" using "apt-cache policy package" to get the old version number. See also <partial downgrade>, <unstable->testing>, <sdo>.
22:32<rrivera>thanks! I will check it... :)
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22:34<abrotman>brilliant plan ...
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23:03<Sekkite>I also forgot to mention that I can't actually install Debian until I disable UEFI, abrotman
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23:09<mwxhcy>anyone is there?
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23:11<mwxhcy>o,great,I used to guess there is no people
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23:12<mwxhcy>where are you come from?
23:12<mwxhcy>where are you come from?
23:13<dpkg>#debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
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23:21<mwxhcy>can you tell me where are you come from?
23:23<blast007>mwxhcy: This is not a social channel. It is a support channel for Debian Linux.
23:24<mwxhcy>oh,i'm sorry
23:24<SamB>I thought it was for Debian GNU/*
23:25<SamB>where * is usually (but not necessarily always) Linux
23:25*themill recompiles SamB on reactos
23:26<SamB>if only it were that simple
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23:29<mwxhcy>ys,I understand,but do you discuss the technology for Linux there?
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23:47<Sekkite>Anyone have experience with disabling UEFI in Windows 8 or know where I can download a UEFI-supported copy of Debian? I seem to be missing the option to disable UEFI from what I can see.
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23:50<topcyde>why would you want to disable uefi?
23:50<mshuler>Sekkite: I haven't tried, but here's the best reading I know of
23:51<dpkg>Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" supports installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is currently not supported. See also <errata>.
23:51<dpkg>Last minute notes regarding Debian 7 "Wheezy" are listed at . Known problems in the installer are listed at
23:52<mshuler>switching off uefi is evidently the best method - perhaps there is a bios update that enables that switch? that's about the only other thing I can think of, if you haven't found it in the bios
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23:54<topcyde>I don't think you can in Win8 I believe it was built without bios support.
23:55<mshuler>yeah, I don't have any uefi hardware, so I only know what dpkg knows :)
23:55<topcyde>the whole License in the firmware deal
23:56<mshuler>it's a cryptographic signature, not a license
23:56<mshuler>(to the best of my second hand knowledge)
23:59<topcyde>Network guy said it lets you install all versions previous and up to wha tit says
---Logclosed Mon Sep 16 00:00:11 2013