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#debian IRC Logs for 2013-10-10

---Logopened Thu Oct 10 00:00:56 2013
00:01-!-kenoby_ [~kenoby@host93-17-dynamic.248-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
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01:54<kefler>anyone having trouble with the nvidia drivers ?
01:54<kefler>I get a soft cpu lock whenever I use'em >.<
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03:23<sunkan>If I install stuff with PHP PEAR it looks like it will go to /usr/share/php (still using Squeeze if that matters). Do I have a risk of conflicts with PHP packages in debian if I do that?
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03:49<melmothX>sunkan: yes, of course you'll have conflicts
03:50-!-mode/#debian [+l 603] by debhelper
03:51<sunkan>melmothX: Ok, I'll see if I can avoid doing that then.. I think it would have been better if pear was configure to put stuff in /usr/local instead to avoid such issues..
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04:04<me-1>hi...how can I choose fastest mirror of Debian stable repos...?
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04:06<berto>me-1: http://http.debian.net/debian
04:06<me-1>404 . Not found
04:06<musca>!cdn.debian.net
04:06<dpkg>To have <APT> automatically select a mirror geographically close to you, you can use a Geo-IP service from cdn.debian.net. This service works at the DNS level. An example line for your sources.list is "deb http://cdn.debian.net/debian/ wheezy main". See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianGeoMirror for more information. Don't use this with Google DNS or similar.
04:07<me-1>I am asking for the software which selects fastest mirror for me
04:08<dcraig>for cdn.debian.net, I get a server on the east coast of the US, but I'm on the west coast !
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04:08<musca>!apt-spy
04:08<dpkg>a secret! Shh! 'Mirror, mirror, on the wall... who is the fastest of them all?' Note that it will overwrite your sources.list when finished, so (1) cp /etc/apt/sources.list /etc/apt/sources.list.mybak (2) apt-get install apt-spy (3) apt-spy update; apt-spy -d [stable,testing,unstable] -a [Africa,Asia,Europe,North-America,Oceania,South-America] (4) fix your sources.list by adding back in any other mirrors you had been using.
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04:33<bea>um, is cups broken in debian 7? i have 2 different installs of debian (1 clean, 1 upgraded) and 3 different printers from 2 different vendors, and none of them work. is there some 'master bug' behind this or do i have to tackle all of them one at a time?
04:34<bea>to clarify, this is not about permissions (group membership) or anything. in one case, i get random symbols on the paper, in 1 case printing works but takes ages (about 10 minutes per page), etc
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04:47<chris_>hi how to intall the steam client on a x64 machine?
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04:52<gonz>http://packages.debian.org/jessie/steam
04:53<gonz>this for a i386 but it should also be able to install it in a x64 system
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05:08<ompaul>bea: worked for me with right ppd file and when filters for odd (say samsung) printers were in use
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05:09<chris_>were to get the dpkg log?
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05:10<jm_>dpkg the irc bot or dpkg the command?
05:10<dpkg>jm_: no idea
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05:10<chris_>the comand^
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05:11<jm_>man page for dpkg gives you the logfile
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05:11<jm_>or rather explains what the default is
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05:16<lp>what is the best way to install a minimal debian system? d-i with recommends=false? d-i in expert mode? debootstrap?
05:20<chris_>ok i give up i got depandency problems while installing the steam-pakage
05:21<chris_>but i didnt find wichich packages are missing...
05:22<chris_>where to find them?
05:22<chris_>oh never mind...
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05:23<lp>chris_: did you try "apt-get -f install" after trying to install steam-package?
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05:24<chris_>actually no cause apt isnt able to find steam
05:25<themill>I think this is a situation where real commands and real output in a pastebin would be helpful for everyone
05:25<SynrG>lp: 'minimal' is a seductive thing. there comes a point when just seeing the numbers go down is the only real reward. what are your real world constraints?
05:25<chris_>ok i added "deb ftp://ftp.debian.org/debian experimental main contrib non-free" to /etc/apt/sources.list
05:26<themill>chris_: hang on...
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05:27<SynrG>lp: without any real constraints, other than a desire to have the bragging rights for those low numbers, i would say do a normal d-i install and leave 'standard' checked. if you really know what you're doing, you can uncheck 'standard' if you wish, but then you likely want to review the entire list of standard things that would've been installed and select from those missing things the ones you know you'll need.
05:27<lp>SynrG: no real constraints, i have a netbook - it's just that the default xfce desktop task pulls too many recommended packages that i don't need or want (nfs-common, avahi...)
05:27<SynrG>lp: if it were me, as i said, without real world constraints, i would just leave 'standard' and do the reverse process ... only trim *out* the things i know for sure i do *not* need.
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05:29<SynrG>lp: the debian-eeepc project came up with a minimal set specifically for eeepc model 4g ... (only 4g ssd ...) and similar models
05:29<lp>SynrG: that's old, the debian wiki recommends standard d-i for netbooks
05:30<SynrG>https://wiki.debian.org/DebianEeePC/Software/DesktopEnvironment
05:30<SynrG>lp: that's not what i meant.
05:30<lp>SynrG: i have 160G hdd, no SSD
05:30<SynrG>see the above link
05:30<SynrG>the debian-eeepc project has not recommended a custom installer for years
05:30<SynrG>i'm talking about standard d-i plus the stuff in the link above
05:31<SynrG>again, with the desktop environments, i would just install *with* recommends, and then trim out the stuff you don't want afterwards.
05:32<SynrG>160G is not very constraining
05:32<lp>SynrG: i see - i installed xfce-desktop via boot options for d-i, but without recommends disabled it took a lot of recommends
05:32<SynrG>so, just remove the ones you don't want. what's the problem?
05:32<lp>SynrG: thanks, i'll look at that
05:33<SynrG>if you do the reverse, you need to review the whole list of recommends and recommends of recommends, etc. ... and then install the ones that were omitted that you actually do need
05:33<SynrG>that's very tedious
05:33<SynrG>just coming up with that list is tedious ...
05:33<lp>SynrG: i was originally discouraged by how much extra stuff gnome pulls with recommends, perhaps it's still doable by hand with xfce
05:34<SynrG>you know a recipe for listing packages sorted by size?
05:34<lp>SynrG: i just thought there are too many packages to find and remove manually in a reasonable time, and reinstall would be easier
05:34<lp>SynrG: no :)
05:34<SynrG>!sort by size
05:34<dpkg>sort by size is probably aptitude search ~i -O installsize -F"%p %I", or see <sort by size sarge>, or see <dpigs>
05:35<SynrG>if size reduction is your goal, use that
05:35<lp>SynrG: thanks
05:35<SynrG>if ram consumption is your goal, top, and sort by size ...
05:35<SynrG>reduction of, i mean
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05:36<SynrG>then see if that includes things you can live without
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05:36<lp>SynrG: and to disable daemons at start, did insserv -r replace normal update-rc.d?
05:36<SynrG>lp: there comes a point of diminishing returns, where picking off the smaller things, or things that you're really not sure about ... just makes a tiny difference with dubious value.
05:36<SynrG>the main thing about this exercise is knowing when to stop.
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05:37<lp>SynrG: right
05:37<SynrG>hmm, dpkg bot still has:
05:37<SynrG>!disable service
05:37<dpkg>From update-rc.d(8): «A common system administration error is to delete the links with the though that this will disable the service…. However, if all links have been deleted then the next time the package is upgraded, the package's postinst … will reinstall links at their factory default locations.» Use «update-rc.d $service disable» instead.
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05:38<SynrG>and afaik, update-rc.d is insserv-aware. so there's no reason, really, to switch.
05:38<chris_>how to install libc.so.6 hor 32bit?
05:39<lp>hmmm. https://wiki.debian.org/Daemon#Enable.2Fdisable_daemons suggests insserv -r
05:39<SynrG>chris_: why? installing a proper foreign architecture package should 'just work'
05:39<lp>oh, ok then - update-rc.d might remin in case debian switsches to systemd as default
05:40<SynrG>s/foreign/i386/ (assuming you're installing on amd64). i did this with steam on sid with no problems.
05:40<SynrG>chris_: if you're having "dependency problems", it's the standard advice here:
05:40<SynrG>!bat
05:40<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
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05:42<SynrG>lp: well, i'm not sure of that. update-rc.d belongs to sysv-rc
05:42<SynrG>lp: as i understand it, systemd uses something else
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05:50<SynrG>chris_: oh, sorry, when i reported i installed steam ok on sid, that was, in fact, on an i386 system.
05:51<SynrG>chris_: but my advice still stands. we need to see all the standard stuff (apt-cache policy, the command you typed to install steam and its output) for debugging your problem.
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05:56<mpfusion>Is there a simple way of restricting the size of a directory without creating a new partition and using quotas?
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05:57<SynrG>mpfusion: not that i know of
05:58<SynrG>mpfusion: mind you, you could use a loopback device for that and a file
05:58<SynrG>but it's the same basic approach
05:58<SynrG>i have not actually done this, but i know of no reason that would not work
05:58<mpfusion>SynrG: That's not much better than creating a partition
05:58<SynrG>right
05:58<k-man_>well, its slightly better if you don't have spare unpartitioned space
05:59<mpfusion>it should work
05:59<k-man_>as in, it doesn't require repartitioning
05:59<mpfusion>but you loose the disk space
06:00<SynrG>but can be resized easily enough
06:00<k-man_>can you make some sort of thin provisioned file for the loopback fs?
06:01<SynrG>or if resizing doesn't appeal to you, i suppose you could do lvm-on-loopback ...
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06:01<SynrG>and add new volumes as needed.
06:01<mpfusion>k-man_: Should be doable. But what happens if you fill it up once and delete the files afterwards. The loopback device will not auto-shrink
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06:02<k-man_>mpfusion, no - i don't think there is a perfect solution
06:02<SynrG>does lvm not make provision for the removal of volumes as well?
06:02<mpfusion>lvm on loopback is too complex. Then I'd just repartition and use quotas
06:02*SynrG nods
06:03<k-man_>lvm seems to have some thin provisioning stuff: https://access.redhat.com/site/documentation/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Logical_Volume_Manager_Administration/thinly_provisioned_volume_creation.html
06:03<mpfusion>ok. so either quotas or a static loopback device are the practical options
06:04<k-man_>with lvm you can resise the partition. if you did lvm on a loopback file, would that allow the file to be resised too i wonder?
06:06<k-man_>this seems to have some info on growing lvm loopback volumes: http://www.anthonyldechiaro.com/blog/2010/12/19/lvm-loopback-how-to/
06:07<mpfusion>k-man_: I don't think so. I never used LVM, but using thin provisioning on ZFS, I can tell that it doesn't automatically shrink, growing is no problem
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06:11<mpfusion>Using LVM feels like shooting sparrows with a canon. I'll settle for the simplest possible solution. Thanks for your input guys
06:11<chris_>apt-cache policy how to get?
06:12<SynrG>chris_: by typing "apt-cache policy"? i don't understand your question ...
06:12<SynrG>!bat
06:12<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
06:13<SynrG>chris_: with no arguments it shows you the policy for the system. with arguments, it shows you the policy as concerning the specific packages you list.
06:13<chris_>http://paste.debian.net/55069/
06:14<SynrG>chris_: ok, no. you cannot do that.
06:14<chris_>can not do what?
06:14<SynrG>experimental and stable cannot be mixed. period.
06:14<SynrG>so, give up now.
06:15<SynrG>what you would need is a backport of steam for wheezy.
06:15<SynrG>,v steam
06:15<judd>Package: steam on i386 -- jessie/non-free: 1.0.0.39-2; sid/non-free: 1.0.0.39-2
06:15<SynrG>at this point, steam is only in jessie and sid. it is not even in experimental.
06:15<SynrG>so if you are following instructions that say it is, they are out of date ...
06:15<SynrG>and also do not apply to your release.
06:16<SynrG>i would counsel that you just be patient. i imagine eventually someone will backport steam for wheezy.
06:16<SynrG>if it is possible
06:18<chris_>lets try with that? https://github.com/GhostSquad57/Steam-Installer-for-Wheezy
06:18<SynrG>chris_: so, remove experimental from your sources.list and apt-get update.
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06:19<SynrG>chris_: that is a dubious solution. it may work, but personally i would not support it.
06:20<SynrG>chris_: if you try it and run into problems, you will have to ask the maintainer of that solution directly for help.
06:20<chris_>ok still play with windows :-(
06:20<SynrG>"This version comes with an extra folder called i386-linux-gnu and x86_64-linux-gnu which is from Ubuntu's libc6 deb package, it is saved in /usr/lib/steam/. The steam-debian excutable loads said folder which solves the need for glibc 2.15"
06:20<SynrG>^^ i find that part questionable
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06:21<chris_>i tryed it once, i had to reinstall my system after
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06:22<SynrG>if you have steam on windows that is certainly a well-supported solution and probably the best one for you, given your relative inexperience with linux.
06:23<SynrG>as i said, wait for a backport. if-and-when one is available, you may use it. if no backport is forthcoming, at least jessie will have steam.
06:23<babilen>SynrG: IIRC that was the "solution" that made its way around the net before Debian offered its packages and it caused some headaches for a bunch of kids who couldn't wait.
06:23<SynrG>babilen: ah. thanks for the background info
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06:25<chris_>thx anyway
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07:23<hotkey>is there a command line tool to select different mirror servers such as in the text installer?
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07:24<jm_>possibly apt-spy netselect-apt
07:25<babilen>hotkey: I would recommend to simply use a round-robin such as http.debian.net (read http://http.debian.net) or cdn.debian.net in lieu of hardcoding specific mirrors though.
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07:26<babilen>both apt-spy and netselect-apt are simply using too crude a method to determine the "best" mirror
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07:26<babilen>And don't cope with you changing locations :)
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08:11<Hatter>I just tried to update from squeeze to wheezy, following the instructions at debian.org - at the end of the apt-get dist-upgrade - i get this : E: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'libgstreamer0.10-0'. Please see man 5 apt.conf under APT::Immediate-Configure for details. (2)
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08:18<bremner>I have a lexmark CS310dn driven by CUPS 1.5.3-5 and the lexmark PPD; sometimes when it gets a job while in power saving mode, instead of printing the job it just prints a line from the PDF/PS source like "Decode filter /LZWDecode filter...". Does that sound familiar to anyone? I guess it could be the PPD.
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08:35<cronic>Hello , is there someone who could help me with a currupt grub?
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08:36<babilen>dpkg: anyone
08:36<dpkg>Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>.
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08:37<babilen>cronic: Please paste the exact commands you used and their output to http://paste.debian.net and show us the URL. Our crystal balls are good, but not *that* powerful ;)
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08:39<cronic>mhh what do u wanna know? i did not used much commands.. and i have no internet acces on this system.. so i can tell u what i did if thats ok
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08:40<babilen>dpkg: fixmbr
08:41<dpkg>To reinstall <GRUB> boot to your Debian install disk/live CD, switch to the other console (Alt-F2), then mount your root filesystem (mount -t ext2 /dev/whatever /target ; mount --bind /dev /target/dev ; mount -t proc none /target/proc ; mount -t sysfs none /target/sys), then chroot into it (chroot /target) and run "update-grub && grub-install /dev/whatever". See also <rescue mode>, <dual boot guide>, <supergrub>. Also works for EFI!
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08:41<babilen>cronic: Did you do something like (well, exactly) like that ^^ ?
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08:43<cronic>http://paste.debian.net/55161/
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08:43<cronic>i did this steps to enter my chroot ;)
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08:44<babilen>cronic: Try the instructions above instead
08:44<SynrG>amperx: could you possibly fix your connection? ...
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08:44<SynrG>i guess not.
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08:44<cronic>after entering my chroot i did update-grub && grub-install and after that i also tried to grub-install --recheck /dev/sda1
08:44<cronic>ok, ill try
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08:56<cronic>:o
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08:56<cronic>he found the linux image and initrd.. only giving error: will not proceed with blocklists
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08:57<cronic>http://paste.debian.net/55165/
08:57<babilen>cronic: You seem to be using EFI, but failed (forgot?) to create a EFI system partition (cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFI_System_partition ) -- grub refuses to be installed without that unless forced. You should repartition your drive (or use MBR) and make sure that you have a EFI system partition in addition to the other ones (including the BIOS boot partition)
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09:03<azyr>i have rsyslogd blasting mei_me error messages on my /var/log/syslog with 100% cpu utilization non-stop
09:04<azyr>my root partition is full now and i cannot properly use my system to correct this problem
09:04<azyr>how can i make it stop?
09:04<cronic>how shoudl i repartition the drive?
09:04<cronic>fdisk /dev/sda1 and then set 0xef?
09:05<azyr>basically the same problem as here: https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/36288
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09:05<Maulkin>azyr: rmmod mei-me
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09:07<azyr>Maulkin: thanks it works
09:07<didier>hola
09:07<azyr>now how do i delete syslog when my hard disk is full
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09:08<azyr>the log rotating script doesnt work
09:08<Maulkin>azyr: . > /var/log/syslog
09:08<azyr>with full disk
09:08<Maulkin>That'll wipe it
09:08<azyr>hmm good idea
09:08<Maulkin>Or delete some other stuff
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09:11<cronic>babilen: could u tell me how to repartition the efi fs? i dont know how to do that, my thought is to fdisk /dev/sda -> d -> 1 -> n -> +8MB -> t -> ??=
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09:13<azyr>Maulkin: what does ". > /var/log/syslog" actually write to that file?
09:13<Maulkin>azyr: Nothing
09:13<cronic>or should i create a new partition with +8MB and set them to ef? :X im confused
09:14<Maulkin>azyr: literally, nothing
09:14<azyr>Maulkin: it doesn't work
09:14<azyr>root@X230:/var/log# . > syslog
09:14<azyr>bash: .: filename argument required
09:14<azyr>.: usage: . filename [arguments]
09:14<babilen>cronic: http://tanguy.ortolo.eu/blog/article51/debian-efi (but heed the advice to make it larger if you plan to boot many operating systems)
09:14<Maulkin>azyr: Sorry, no .
09:15<azyr>i just did "ls > syslog"
09:16<azyr>thats good enough
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09:17<cronic>babilen: hold on. that has to be need if i have an uefi bios , right? as i mentioned the thinkpad t510 hasnt got a uefi bios. now im more confused :d
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09:19<babilen>cronic: What does "gdisk -l /dev/sda" give you?
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09:22<layziebone>anung meron?
09:23<cronic>babilen: http://paste.debian.net/55192/
09:27<cronic>babilen: http://paste.debian.net/55193/ theres the rest of fdisk -l /dev/sda, the head
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09:48<babilen>cronic: I was asking about "gdisk -l /dev/sda" *not* "fdisk -l /dev/sda" -- Please note that "g" is not the same as "f"
09:48<cronic>ok then: command not found :D
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09:51<babilen>cronic: It should look something like: http://paste.debian.net/55207/ and I am primarily interested in the "GPT: not present" output. If you don't have gdisk yet you should install it. Alternatively: What does "file -s /dev/sda" give you?
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09:53<wzh>hello
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10:00<cronic>babilen: http://paste.debian.net/55226/
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10:00<cronic>babilen: thats the output of file -s /dev/sda im not able to install gdisk cause i have no internet acces atm
10:01<petn-randall>Does anyone know of an online voting system? I.e. where I can set up multiple choices and let the users vote? Bonus if it's already in the repos. Basically doodle.com in FOSS.
10:01<babilen>cronic: Well, you obviously do (we *are* talking to each other, aren't we?); What prevents you from accessing the internet on the host we are talking about? And did you *type* that manually? (please, don't do that)
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10:06<TobiX>petn-randall: LimeSurvey?
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10:07<trico>forum software usually has polling capability builting
10:07<cronic>babilen: yep, i´m not able to get internet acces with the laptop in the office.. idk why .. ip , gateway and mask are correct..
10:07<trico>*built in
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10:08<trico>cronic: captive portal?
10:08<cronic>trico: nope
10:09<TobiX>petn-randall: I would even go so far as to suggest testMaker (http://sourceforge.net/projects/testmaker/) because I once wrote code for it, but I don't know what the current state of the project is...
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10:09<trico>check you have an ip, a gateway, and a route. can you tell if you are associated with the AP?
10:10<cronic>mhh.. he isn´t connected to the dns serv. hold on
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10:12<cronic>ok i´m connected ^^
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10:14<cronic>babilen: http://paste.debian.net/55228
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10:18<babilen>cronic: Hmm, interesting.
10:19<cronic>babilen: whats wrong? :D
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10:19<babilen>cronic: Mind showing me the output of "COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l 'grub*'", "update-grub2" and "grub-install /dev/sda" ?
10:19<cronic>hold on
10:19*babilen holds on
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10:20<neonxxx>.........
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10:23<cronic>http://paste.debian.net/55229
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10:26<cronic>update-grub2 found the background image, linux image, initrd image and windows 7 loader.. grub-install /dev/sda says nothing except "http://paste.debian.net/"
10:26-!-calisto [~calisto@r186-48-211-126.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:26<cronic>and grub2-update is also giving no pastebin url
10:27<babilen>cronic: So, where's the "blocklist" error?
10:28-!-trifolio6 [~h@62.43.62.203.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
10:28<cronic>i think that was in a wrong mounted chroot ?! :x
10:28<cronic>theres no blocklist error now
10:28<babilen>cronic: Ah, *sigh* ... You were installing to /dev/sda1 earlier. You almost never want that, but you want to install to /dev/sda (or /dev/sdb or whatever you boot from)
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10:29<cronic>naa .. ok .. should that run now?
10:29<babilen>that should work now, yes
10:30<cronic>babilen: then i try a reboot :)
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10:30<cronic>wheres the flattr button for you babilen? :D
10:31-!-asfethan_ is now known as asfethan
10:31<cronic>thank you very much babilen u saved my day
10:32<babilen>Anything else I can do for yoU?
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10:34<cronic>babilen: nope, i´m happy ;)
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10:35<babilen>cronic: Wonderful. Have a nice day! :)
10:36<cronic>babilen: have a nice day too , maybe ill come back one day ;)
10:36<cronic>adios muchachos, its home time :)
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11:09<Sherief>Hello, I installed Debian 7.1 today on an old laptop. I encrypted my HDD and used LVM but I am getting an error "no key available with this passphrase" while trying to unlock my HDD. I am sure I am entering the passphrase correctly. Is there anyway to resolve this without formatting?
11:10<bhuddah>maybe it's related to the keyboard layout.
11:10<babilen>Sherief: That's exactly the error you get if you enter the wrong key. Are you sure that you might not simply be the victim of a changed keymap ?
11:10<babilen>s/key/passphrase
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11:12<babilen>Sherief: And no, there isn't really anything that you can do apart from remembering the correct passphrase. Did you use any "special" characters that might have switched their location on the keymap? (e.g. ! " £ $ ...) ?
11:13<Sherief>babilen: only "!@" which shouldn't be a problem
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11:14<Ronjoe>What is your keyboard type, and what layout is the system set to?
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11:15<Ronjoe>because @ is in different places between US and most European keyboards
11:15<Sherief>hmm, I could try to write the passphrase in initramfs to see if any keys changed.
11:16<Sherief>but shouldn't the debian installer use the same keyboard layout?
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11:18<Ronjoe>Anyways, I came here to ask for some ideas of what to do with a Cinnamon issue
11:18-!-dous [~dous@cm198.sigma70.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #debian
11:18<Ronjoe>I'm experiencing this: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=720466
11:18<Ronjoe>I'm on sid, amd64
11:19<Ronjoe>I've used the version in the repos, a later version found in mint's debian repos, and the latest version compiled from source
11:19<Ronjoe>(1.7.4-2.2, 1.8.8, and 2.0.2 respectively)
11:20-!-mode/#debian [+l 629] by debhelper
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11:20<babilen>Sherief: Both @ and ! might have switched places. Which keymap are you using now? Which keymap did you configure in the installer?
11:20-!-student__ [~student@netacad.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit []
11:20<babilen>Sherief: I would try a few variations based on (assumed) different locations of ! and @
11:20-!-MANITARi [~fraank@ppp-2-84-161-183.home.otenet.gr] has joined #debian
11:20<Ronjoe>This became an issue after I transitioned from libcogl9 to libcogl12, so this MAY be the cause, but I have no way of knowing.
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11:21<babilen>Ronjoe: You want #debian-next for testing/sid support btw (cf. /topic )
11:21<Ronjoe>I'm using nvidia-driver (and glx), while users in the bug report are using intel, so I don't think that's too relevant
11:21<Ronjoe>right, right...
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11:22*babilen smiles ...
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11:28<RockLobster>hello
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11:35<leoslax>Hello everyone
11:36-!-Konrad127123 [~konrad@194.214.63.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:36<sney>hi.
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11:37<leoslax>I have a simple question
11:37<GigaCloud>What ?
11:37<leoslax>what irc client do you are using and why?
11:38-!-thunderrd [~thunderrd@119.42.120.165] has joined #debian
11:38<GigaCloud>XChat and I don't know why..
11:38<mtn>leoslax: asking for 610 opinions is an easy question?
11:39<Maulkin>!offtopic
11:39<dpkg>#debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
11:39-!-richardb [~ribe@c83-253-188-250.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #debian
11:39<Stummi>xchat here
11:39<Maulkin>This really isn't an on topic conversation - please take it to #debian-offtopic
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11:40<leoslax>Ok, sorry ;)
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11:41<sney>!tell leoslax about popcon
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11:49<babilen>Sherief: managed to get access?
11:50<Sherief>babilen: I gave up and now I am formatting and re-entering the same key I used before and this time I took note on which keymap I am using "American English"
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11:51<Sherief>will tell you how in goes in 45 minutes~
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11:57<Sherief>During the installation, can users skip "Erasing data" on the encrypted LVM disk?
11:58<Sherief>it does take a lot of time especially on large disks
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12:00<mgv>why is wine-unstable 1.5.31-1 in NEW? It does not look new to me, given that 1.5.30-2 is in unstable
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12:00<babilen>Sherief: Isn't there a "cancel" option ?
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12:04<Sherief>babilen: yes, I was just making sure that it wouldn't affect the installation process
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12:05<babilen>Sherief: I *think* that it would just interrupt the erasing and nothing else, but I am not entirely sure. Give it a try, certainly doesn't take as long to start over as waiting it out.
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13:30<linuxator>Sherief, any progress?
13:31<DNS>linuxator: if you are linuxator and i am...
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13:31<gnutor>\o/
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13:32<linuxator>hehe nice
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13:43<pencil>hi all - i'm installing wheezy with LUKS alongside Win7 and the installer is telling me that I don't have a boot partition set up (previous install was unencrypted so this was not an issue) - does anyone know what settings I would have to place on a new partition to make it recognisable as the boot partition?
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13:45<gnutor>pencil: basically just install grub on a new partition
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13:46<gnutor>maybe in an extra /boot partition, just need to be 1 gig or or even less, depends on how many kernels you want to store there
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13:46<pencil>gnutor: format for the partition? it seems that the installer selects the partition for boot based on the parameters you've set
13:46<pencil>just 1 kernel
13:46<retrospectacus>yep create a partition for /boot (unencrypted)
13:46<pencil>ext4?
13:47<gnutor>the format should ext4 as well
13:47<gnutor>yes
13:47<retrospectacus>200MB is plenty
13:47<pencil>retrospectacus: great thank you
13:47<pencil>there is a fat16 partition on there that is only 40 MB - is that windows related?
13:47<pencil>don't want to delete it if it's important
13:47<gnutor>pencil: yes i think so
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13:48<KapitaenM>Is that a recovery partition?
13:48<gnutor>pencil: or you have a netbook?
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13:48<retrospectacus>I have 5 kernels, total 83MB. 4 of them are obsolete
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13:48<pencil>it's a dell desktop (optiplex) - i think it may very well be a recovery partition
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13:48<pencil>good thought
13:48<retrospectacus>pencil: probably some recovery or memtest or so, just leave it
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13:49<pencil>retrospectacus: does it matter where on the disk the boot partition is located - e.g. if i have 6 other partitions does it have to be ahead of them?
13:49<retrospectacus>no
13:49<gnutor>no
13:49<gnutor>:-)
13:49<pencil>ok thank you both
13:49<pencil>cheers
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14:16<Rizin>Hello
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14:32<babilen>pencil: Is that a UEFI setup? If so you need a EFI system partition (at least 1MB, but more (50-200MB) is advisable if you boot other operating systems) or a BIOS boot partition if you use GPT. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFI_System_partition ; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BIOS_Boot_partition and http://tanguy.ortolo.eu/blog/article51/debian-efi for further info
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15:09<michy>ciao
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15:12<pencil>thanks babilen - it's got a traditional BIOS fortunately - Win8 is a nightmare (as is Mac OS X) for those of us looking to boot USBs for installs, Tails, etc.
15:13<patriku>Hi, can somebody explain me why I can see connection established to google's server on port 443 which has been idle for over 580 minutes. The same I can see in case of ip address which is registrated to liveperson inc. ? I have tried to close browser, but that didnt quit the connection. Thanks
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15:14<patriku>I am using iftop to see the connections and its state.
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15:22<SynrG>patriku: web browsers are not the only thing that can open https conversations
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15:24<SynrG>patriku: lsof -i
15:24<SynrG>see what process has that
15:24<stderr>patriku: Which one of Googles servers?
15:24<SynrG>i don't know iftop
15:24<patriku>SynrG: Yes, I do agree with you, but the reason why I mentioned web browser was that there was nothing else running and for sure not to connect to any liveperson inc. network or google servers. That is the weird thing. Let me try and thank you
15:25<stderr>SynrG: Or netstat.
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15:31<patriku>stderr: it is from 173.194.0.0/16 range it uses secured http protocol.
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15:33<stderr>patriku: That doesn't really say anything...
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15:34<patriku>stderr: well, if you need ip address it is 173.194.34.174 and 173.194.41.65
15:34<patriku>stderr: is it what you wanted, if not, just let me know, please
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15:35<stderr>It was. I was hoping it had a meaningful rDNS... They don't. :-/
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15:36<patriku>SynrG: lsof -i doesnt show anything than exim (local delivery only), dhclient, irssi ( i have to connect to irc somehow :) ) and nothing else.
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15:40<patriku>stderr: I checked rDNS first of all, but as you said, it doesnt say anything or doesnt give any hint.
15:40<stderr>The cert says "CN=*.google.com", so no help there either.
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15:45<patriku>stderr: if i may ask you how did you check certificate ?
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15:45<stderr>There's probably a "better" way, but openssl s_client -connect 173.194.41.65:443 worked for me.
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16:00<patriku>stderr: isnt the "problem" TLS session ticket lifetime hint field with 100800 sec which is 28 hours ? If I understood, once the handshake is done, ticket is given and this ticket can be reused for certain time and because the connection to googles server is in idle for 632 minutes at the moment, it might make sense now. What do you think ?
16:00-!-lukasz [~lukasz@109.231.26.75] has quit []
16:01<stderr>I haven't looked that much at TLS.
16:01<patriku>stderr: btw thanks for telling me how to chceck certificates. ;)
16:02<patriku>stderr: It is ok. I am just thinking loudly and you the only one who has listened.
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16:03<mayekkuzu>badnik.net
16:03<stderr>patriku: netstat didn't tell you what program opened the connection?
16:03<mayekkuzu>ouch
16:03<mayekkuzu>sorry
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16:04<ScotchMcFinn>hey
16:04<ScotchMcFinn>oh
16:05<ScotchMcFinn>really
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16:18<patriku>stderr: netstat -atp showed iceweasel until I closed it. Now it doesnt show anything except expected, but iftop still is showing 6 different, not just google ones, as established for long period of time beeing idle and except one all using https . Well, I am going to check man pages for iftop to see what it is meant to be exactly.
16:18<patriku>stderr: Thank you very much for your time and help.
16:18<stderr>No problem.
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16:50<trico>join #samba
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16:52<bernat>I'm want to use a VPS with Debian 7 as a mail server for several domains. I guess configuring exim and setting DNS entries for mail would be enough. Do I need something more to send and receive mail without problems?
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16:58<ewerton>Good afternoon! I want download Debian 7, but I don't know what download, what difference between CD and DVD?
16:58<musca>!various cd1
16:58<dpkg>There are CD-1 choices for various DEs (Desktop Environments) - there's one for GNOME, another for KDE, one for XFCE and another for LXDE. For example; if you wanted the XFCE CD-1 of Debian 7 "Wheezy", you'd grab -> debian-7.1.0-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso from the mirrors (if you were going for i386 arch). Also ask me about <firmware images>, <release notes>, <ig>, <setup.exe>.
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16:59<musca>CD is sufficient to hold one Desktop environment (aprox. 700 MB)
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16:59<Sherief>ewerton: you don't need the DVD, just download the first CD
17:00-!-mode/#debian [+l 630] by debhelper
17:00<ewerton>My desktop is i5-2500 3.3ghz RAM 4GB
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17:03<musca>ewerton: you can stay with "i386" or go for "amd64" - your system can operate in both modes.
17:03<ompaul>ewerton: what desktop do you want to use?
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17:04<ewerton>Personal
17:05<retrospectacus>!desktop environment
17:05<dpkg>Desktop environments available for installation on Debian systems include <GNOME>, <KDE>, <XFCE> and <LXDE>. See also <window manager>.
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17:07<retrospectacus>ewerton: what environment do you want to use?
17:07-!-thegodlikehobo [~thegodlik@aglarond.thegodlikehobo.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:07<ewerton>Gnome
17:07<ewerton>what is default debian environment?
17:09<musca>gnome3 is the default
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17:11<ewerton>thanks!
17:13<musca>no problem
17:14<musca>ewerton: you 'll need 3D-acceleration for the gnome3-shell
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17:41<antd>hi, can you help me make passwordless ssh. I'm running wheezy on the ssh server.
17:42<ewerton>colocar o modo +i?
17:42<antd>I generated the keypair but i dont know what to do next
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17:43<retrospectacus>antd: use ssh-copy-id command
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17:45<antd>i'm not sure what is meant by remotehost. i am on the remotehost
17:46-!-Cozminsky [~rjsalts@red.spectralmud.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:46<antd>i thought the remotehost will generate some keys that i can send to the client?
17:46<retrospectacus>hmm
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17:46<antd>i did this before a long time ago but totally forgot how. im not good with linux
17:46<retrospectacus>antd: no, you need to add your client's public key to the file ~/.ssh/authorized_keys on the server
17:47<antd>hmm
17:47<retrospectacus>ssh-copy-id on the client will do this
17:47<retrospectacus>but I suspect you are not using Linux on the client ...?
17:47<antd>ipad :p
17:47<antd>it can accept unix commands i think
17:48<retrospectacus>well, the ipad ssh client needs to have a private/public key pair
17:48-!-angelops [~angelops@2620:0:1cfe:18:1139:82c7:9655:3798] has joined #debian
17:48<retrospectacus>the public part goes in that file I mentioned on the server
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17:48<retrospectacus>and the client uses the private part
17:49-!-Alam_Squeeze [quasselcor@rigginstereo.lawarias.srb2.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:50<retrospectacus>also if you are manually editing ~/.ssh/authorized_keys then you need to set permissions:
17:50<retrospectacus>~/.ssh needs to be chmod 700
17:50<retrospectacus>~/.ssh/authorized_keys needs to be chmod 600
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17:53<antd>hmm i dont understand at all
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17:54<CyberBob>ewerton if the machine you want to set up has wired internet access you can use http://www.debian.org/CD/netinst/ to only burn the necessary setup files to install the rest of only what's needed for your system over ftp
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17:55<CyberBob>also retrospectacus is it possible to employ only one authorized_keys for the whole system?
17:56<retrospectacus>CyberBob: yes I think it is possible
17:56<antd>i already have it set up with a different server. so i guess then i can grab the public key from that server...
17:56<retrospectacus>antd: sure
17:56-!-piratebrido [~piratebri@host86-157-253-33.range86-157.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:56<antd>any idea what im looking for?
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17:56<retrospectacus>antd: authorized_keys
17:57<CyberBob>public keys will be in authorized_keys
17:57<retrospectacus>CyberBob: you would set AuthorizedKeysFile %h/.ssh/authorized_keys to some file that has not %h part
17:57<antd>hmm, im on windows using Bitvise SSH Server. looking...
17:58<antd>is that what is called a 'host key'?
17:58<ewerton>Debian is a complete system? I will not have problems with programs?
17:58<bremner>you will have problems
17:58<retrospectacus>antd: no
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17:58<CyberBob>ewerton by using the netinst? no
17:58<retrospectacus>ewerton: if you are asking such strange questions, yes probably you will have problems
17:59<antd>great, i found it under 'imported public keys'
18:00<retrospectacus>ewerton: but Debian is a complete system, yes
18:00<ewerton>I'm User ubuntu, debian already tested, are different, ubuntu is easier, debian does not allow some programs
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18:00<antd>i can export it under 2 settings: 1. standard ssh2 format or 2. openssh format
18:00<antd>is one easier than the other under debian?
18:00<CyberBob>ty retrospectacus i also found relevant info in man ssh_config
18:01<CyberBob>openssh format for most any client
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18:01<antd>and this key is not sensitive i guess? since it is called a public key
18:02<CyberBob>the pubkeys go on the server
18:02<retrospectacus>antd: right.
18:02<ewerton>I am new to debian, download CD1 or netinst?
18:02<CyberBob>the encrypted (hopefully) private keys go with your client
18:02<retrospectacus>ewerton: netinst if you have Networking dureing installation
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18:03<antd>CyberBob: yep, thankfully the private key is already on the client. cant remember how i generated it on ipad though...
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18:04<ewerton>is that? debian-7.1.0-amd64-netinst.iso.torrent ?
18:05<antd>is the public key just a text file?
18:05<retrospectacus>antd: it is a single line. It could be in a file
18:05<antd>as i dont have a way to move it to the server. wondering if i could just create a new text file and copy/paste the contents
18:06<antd>ah
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18:07<retrospectacus>ewerton: sure
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18:07<antd>and this file goes into authorized_keys on the ssh server?
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18:07<retrospectacus>antd: the line, yes.
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18:07<antd>ah
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18:08<retrospectacus>in .ssh/authorized_keys in the home directory of the user you want to login as
18:08-!-dcx [~dcx@201-213-71-198.net.prima.net.ar] has quit []
18:08<retrospectacus>with the permissions set as I mentioned
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18:08<antd>hmm, i dont have a file called authorized_keys
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18:09<CyberBob>make it afresh
18:09<SynrG>so you create one
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18:10<antd>ok that is done
18:10<retrospectacus>you must set permissions.
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18:11<antd>retrospectacus: yep, i looked back up the chat log and followed your direction
18:11<antd>so now i will try to connect from the client...
18:11<retrospectacus>you can regard /var/log/auth.log if it doesn't work
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18:14<antd>it asked for a password
18:14<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell ewerton about overview
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18:14<antd>do i have to somehow remove the password from the debian ssh server?
18:14<retrospectacus>antd: no; the key is tried first
18:15<retrospectacus>antd: ensure the ipad client is using a key
18:15<retrospectacus>and check that log
18:15<retrospectacus>*the key
18:15<antd>that log is on the ipad or server?
18:15<retrospectacus>on the server
18:15<retrospectacus>though there could be a log on the client too, but this is not iPad support.
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18:18<antd>it just says: " sudo: pam_unix(sudo:session): session opened for user$"
18:18<retrospectacus>that's your sudo, not ssh
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18:19<antd>seems there is nothing about ssh there
18:19<antd>there's an ssh log but that's from 1 hour ago
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18:20<antd>i can currently login to the other server without password
18:20<antd>so not sure what the problem is
18:20<CyberBob>other server or other user
18:20<antd>i have two different ssh servers
18:20<CyberBob>ok
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18:21<retrospectacus>are you sure you're connecting to the machine you think you are
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18:21<CyberBob>you can look up the man for and edit ~/.ssh/config to disable password attempts so only rsa login will happen if anything at all
18:21<antd>yup, the ip matches
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18:23<CyberBob>you should do that for all users on all servers where you're using rsa only
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18:23<antd>if i disable password i may be locked out forever
18:24<antd>so cant take that risk i guess
18:24<antd>hmm
18:24<retrospectacus>if you use the per-user config it would only be for that user
18:24<CyberBob>yeah enable root and keep access to that while you're working to get the user only using rsa
18:25<antd>yep, ok
18:25<CyberBob>just use a avery good temp password for both
18:25<antd>what is 'per user config'?
18:25<CyberBob>~/.ssh/config
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18:25<antd>ok, that is what im using
18:25<CyberBob>or /etc/ssh/ssh_config
18:25<CyberBob>for overrides
18:26<retrospectacus>itym /etc/ssh/sshd_config
18:26<CyberBob>Ciphers aes256-cbc is a good override you may want to use on your servers so long as your client supports it
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18:28<CyberBob>yes i meant that retrospectacus
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18:28<antd>should ~/.ssh/config already exist?
18:29<CyberBob>if it's not there just make a new one
18:29<antd>can i use that sqiggly line in the command? ~ <---
18:29<CyberBob>yup it means home for current user
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18:30<CyberBob>changes to represent /root on sudo/su/root term
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18:30<antd>ah ok
18:30<antd>the website im following says to make this change also: "usepam no"
18:30<antd>does that sound safe?
18:31<antd>i dont want to get locked out
18:31<CyberBob>if you don't user any pam auth mods to the default pam config
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18:31<antd>i have no idea what pam is, tbh
18:31<CyberBob>if you don't know and the server's only yours, you're not using any so yes that's safe
18:31<retrospectacus>I would strongly recommend getting your key login working before doing any of this other stuff
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18:32<antd>oh i thought that is what im doing
18:32<retrospectacus>no, you're dicking around with pam and password and per-user stuff. Unrelated
18:33<antd>oh ok
18:33<dondelelcaro>antd: there's no reason to set usepam no.
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18:34<antd>damn, i set passwordauthentication to no but it still asked for a password
18:34<antd>i restarted sshd too
18:34<retrospectacus>antd: you just need to check : ip match : user match : key is used : permissions
18:35<retrospectacus>it really sounds like you're talking to the wrong server
18:35<ardex>what are the most essential packages for a minimal install with fluxbox? Do I need Xorg?
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18:35<antd>it's definitely the right server as i used a really weird ssh port number
18:35<retrospectacus>antd: try ssh localhost from itself
18:36<retrospectacus>then you also need to check : port match
18:36-!-gzq [~gzq@2-236-238-139.ip235.fastwebnet.it] has joined #debian
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18:37<antd>"ssh localhost" = connect to host localhost port 22: connection refused
18:38<antd>ok i added -p <port number>
18:38<antd>now it asked me for a password
18:38-!-bst_ [~bst@net219-0-245-109.mbb.telenor.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:38<antd>from localhost
18:40-!-dcx [~dcx@0001bd75.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: .]
18:40<antd>it's definitely the right user, ip,and permissions
18:41<antd>i dont know about 'key'
18:41<antd>as i barely understand how it works :p
18:41<retrospectacus>well, I explained it when you got here
18:42<ardex>back in a minute or so
18:42<retrospectacus>basically you just need to use it, put it in the right places.
18:42<antd>right, just it isnt working, so not sure
18:42<antd>can i found out if my key is incorrect?
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18:44<retrospectacus>antd: what does "ls -la /root/.ssh" and "wc -l /root/.ssh/authorized_keys" say? please use http://paste.debian.net to show us
18:44<retrospectacus>swap /root for /home/antd if you are trying to login as antd or etc.
18:45<antd>trying to copy all of the lines...
18:45-!-nadir [~molloy@pD9EF1A8E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
18:46<antd>hmm no idea..
18:46<antd>it seems to copy only part of the lines in putty
18:47<ardex>I'm back
18:48-!-sakax [~sakax@0001bb5b.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
18:48<antd>sorry cant copy paste >.<
18:49<retrospectacus>maybe that's why your keys aren't working, you couldn't copy/paste it properly
18:49<Natureshadow>antd: use screen
18:49<antd>i could copy that key because i was in a windows server
18:49-!-redcloud319 [~redcloud3@66.96.73.61] has joined #debian
18:49<antd>just dont know how to copy lines in a terminal
18:49<retrospectacus>antd: iirc in putty you simply select text to copy it.
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18:50<antd>i can only see 2 lines in the terminal. above it should be a few thousand
18:51<antd>ok, this is the best i can do:
18:51<retrospectacus>that is beyond the realm of Debian support
18:51<redcloud319>hey does anyone have any idea's for a funny domain name for a school project?
18:51<antd>http://paste.debian.net/55540/
18:52<ardex>dummy
18:52<retrospectacus>redcloud319: ask #moocows; this is debian support
18:52<retrospectacus>antd: that's not what I asked for
18:53<retrospectacus>antd: and you shouldn't use an editor to read a log file
18:53<Natureshadow>antd: use screen, and a second window in which you use sprunge or something to pastebin, then you donot need to worry about the limitations of WIndows' clipboard and whatever
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18:54<antd>Natureshadow: ok, i will try
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18:55<retrospectacus>antd: I see that you added your public key to /home/antd/.ssh/authorized_keys - you are using the username antd on your ipad ssh client, yeah?
18:55<antd>http://paste.debian.net/55541/
18:56<antd>yep
18:56<retrospectacus>antd: also, you edited it as root -
18:56<retrospectacus>that is the problem
18:56<retrospectacus>~/.ssh and authorized keys need to be owned by the user in question (antd)
18:56-!-adb [~IonMoldom@2a02:1205:501a:f300:baac:6fff:fe67:305f] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:56<antd>hmm
18:57<antd>so delete the file and remake?
18:57<Infiltrator>antd: chown would be easier.
18:57-!-ardex [~ardex@184.19.201.88] has quit [Quit: back later]
18:57<retrospectacus>nah, just chown antd:antd autho<tab>
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18:58<antd>ok i did that
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18:58<antd>cd
18:58<antd>oops
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19:02<antd>and now for the test...
19:02-!-klatin_ [~klatin@p57B1B779.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
19:03<antd>woohoo!
19:03<retrospectacus>dpkg: congratulate antd
19:03<dpkg>Woohoo antd, you did it!
19:03<antd>it works. thanks so much for your patience :)
19:04-!-pillar2012_ [~gemboy@adsl-99-50-17-222.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #debian
19:04<antd>can you imagine that im an administrator of a server. surprised im not hacked in seconds...
19:04-!-idk [~idk@h-211-46.a197.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: idk]
19:05<noobur>cd ~
19:05<noobur>doh
19:06<linuxator>antd, windows administrator?
19:06<antd>debian
19:06<antd>and a windows
19:06<linuxator>nice
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19:07<antd>i had two windows server, but just changed to debian because i dont want to restart all of the time
19:07<antd>hence the extreme noob questions
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19:09<antd>so what happens if i dont have the keyfile?
19:09<antd>will it allow me to login with password only?
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19:10<linuxator>Is it ssh keyfile?
19:10<retrospectacus>antd: right
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19:12<antd>linuxator:i think it is a keyfile, yes
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19:13<linuxator>antd, yes only password
19:15<antd>does debian have something like 'windows update' every second tuesday of the month?
19:16<devil>heh
19:16<devil>that is a flawed concept
19:17<antd>just wondering when i should check for updates
19:17-!-q66 [~q66@213.191.105.214] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:18<devil>antd: debian can be updated 4 times per day
19:18<antd>:O
19:18<devil>antd: but you do not want that for a server of course
19:19<antd>wont my server be vulnerable if i dont update?
19:19<linuxator>antd, for server try to have debian stable
19:20-!-mode/#debian [+l 610] by debhelper
19:20<nadir>If you got a server you probably run stable and if so you can subscribe to the debian-security mailing list, which will inform you about upgrades
19:20<nadir>I myself upgrade as soon i log in, and on unstable i usually upgrade before i log out too.
19:20<antd>ok, i'll keep with stable
19:20<nadir>And if i am bored i upgrade too :-)
19:20<antd>i just dont want to break anything
19:21-!-philsf [~philsf@189.60.217.144] has joined #debian
19:22<nadir>The security mailing list: http://lists.debian.org/debian-security/ Don't take my word, but i am sure it is the one you want for stable upgrades
19:22<nadir>Once a week is probably a good timing
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19:22<antd>thanks
19:22<antd>but then i'll need to restart more than with windows?
19:22<nadir>(well: you asked how to do that automatic, i don't know)
19:23<nadir>I I only restart if the kernel upgrades.
19:23<linuxator>antd, there's no need of restarts on updates
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19:23<antd>oh nice
19:24-!-tuv [~ahmad@5.108.238.116] has joined #debian
19:24<nadir>i tell you what i do, there sure are more experienced people here
19:24<antd>then why does Windows need to restart but Debian does not?
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19:27<LtL>antd: ntfs is a locking filesystem, linux is not. to put it simply.
19:27<antd>hmm, interesting
19:27<LtL>antd: updating dll's requires restarts, linux diesn't unless its a kernel or firmware upgrade.
19:28<LtL>*doesn't
19:29<linuxator>antd, something if you dont do it already create a new account and be connected with it. General rule use root/su only when needed
19:29<antd>ah yeah. originally i just tried to use root
19:30<antd>but then it wouldnt let me join one of my irc servers
19:30<antd>it kept saying 'you are banned, do not use root!'
19:30<antd>how the hell did they know anyway >.<
19:30-!-vit [~vit@190.206.205.27] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:30<LtL>antd: most good ircd's do that, irc'ing as root is crazy.
19:30<antd>so it forced me to create a user
19:30<antd>oh
19:31<LtL>antd: by your ident, they know
19:31<retrospectacus>doing anything as root that you don't *need* to be root to do, is crazy.
19:31<LtL>antd: never use root in vain. rule
19:31<antd>is it really crazy? because on windows im admin all of the time
19:31-!-Lancien [~Lautiste@206.12.82.79.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte]
19:31<retrospectacus>windows is crazy
19:31<antd>lol
19:31<nadir>lol
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19:32<antd>nothing ever bad happened though, so i just wondered
19:32<LtL>antd: but are you sure?
19:32<retrospectacus>!root
19:32<dpkg>It has been said that root is the administrative account - only use it when root power is needed. So no reading mail, compiling programs, or running applications as root. And don't even think about irc'ing as root, it increases the danger from exploits and trojans (such as bliss), or see, for example, the security advisory on BitchX http://www.debian.org/security/2003/dsa-306
19:33<nadir>antd: above you said you worried about a "break". First it sounds unlikely to me. Second: If it is a server (if it is of any value) make sure to run a backup regulary. rsync is an easy solution. But there are many
19:33-!-dous [~dous@cm198.sigma70.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:33<antd>LtL: well nothing as far as i could see
19:33<antd>sometimes i need to be root to install a program
19:34<antd>actually almost always
19:34-!-ewerton [~ewerton@201-40-60-243.cpece700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #debian
19:34<retrospectacus>sure; that affects the whole system
19:34<antd>if i got owned as a user, can't they escalate to root anyway?
19:35<LtL>antd: its off topic, but it can be done, but why make it easy for them.
19:35<antd>ok
19:35<ewerton>hello, i'm downloading debian-7.1.0-amd64-DVD-1, is it a complete system?
19:36<LtL>ewerton: yes
19:37<nadir>If you got internet access you are probably fine with CD 1
19:37<antd>im now using ssh for tunneling. is there a faster encryption to use other than the default? or does it not effect speeds
19:37<nadir>Or even netinstall CD
19:37<linuxator>ewerton, The first CD/DVD contains the installation system and the most popular packages
19:37<linuxator>http://www.debian.org/CD/faq/
19:37-!-LittleGreenMartian [~GM@anon-se-84.nordvpn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:38<nadir>I usually use CD 1, so in case of problems i got a working system from which i can troubleshoot
19:38-!-Hauptfee [~anna@2a01:388:201:3062:ea40:f2ff:fe3d:8a80] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:39<ewerton>I'm a beginner, what is best for me? cd or dvd?
19:39<antd>ok guys well im off to sleep
19:39<antd>thanks for your help and advice
19:39<linuxator>ewerton, for band and hdd space you can use only first DVD and install later from internet what programs you want to add
19:40-!-mode/#debian [+l 604] by debhelper
19:40<linuxator>ewerton, you can try netinstall too (so you will not have unwated packages/programs and so on)
19:40<linuxator>*unwanted
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19:42<ewerton>sorry so many questions, I'm familiar with ubuntu, debian i have used before, but found it difficult to find programs
19:42-!-pillar2012 [~gemboy@adsl-99-50-17-222.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #debian
19:42<nadir>As far i can tell netinstall will not install less applications
19:42-!-DAVID37 [~DAVID37@62.57.170.14.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #debian
19:42<nadir>And as far i know means that i am pretty sure
19:43<nadir>If you tick "desktop" during taskel both CD 1 and netinstall will install pretty much the same, if you untick both will install pretty much the same too
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19:45<ewerton>why not install firefox? thunderbird?
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19:46<devil>why install them?
19:46<devil>iceweasel and icedove are native debian packages
19:46-!-excedion [~excedion@host86-160-17-214.range86-160.btcentralplus.com] has left #debian []
19:46<lostson>and they work very well
19:48-!-chihchun [~chihchun@218-161-0-222.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:48<ewerton>hum... ok
19:49-!-sidmo [~ilven@p5489EF44.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:50<ewerton>debian dvd has programs to download music and video? editor images and videos? text editor, spreadsheet, presentation?
19:50-!-chihchun [~chihchun@218-161-0-222.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #debian
19:51<linuxator>ewerton, sure
19:51<devil>ewerton: all you need is apt-get to have more than 20.000 apps at your fingertips
19:52<retrospectacus>dpkg: tell ewerton about overview
19:52<retrospectacus>(again)
19:53-!-shirish_ [~quassel@117.195.99.37] has joined #debian
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19:56<denis>terminal invisibles characters in debian7 lxde terminal
19:56-!-ixi [~ixi@0001ae3c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]
19:57<denis>i want help for this
19:57<retrospectacus>denis: can you make a screenshot
19:57-!-lduros [~user@pool-108-52-158-77.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:58<denis>yes
19:58-!-shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:59<denis>i cannot see the characters of my keyboard , like a password
19:59<denis>but i see the result on the terminal
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20:01<devil>denis: and the screenshot is where?
20:01-!-Greylocks [~Greylocks@66-87-9-161.pools.spcsdns.net] has joined #debian
20:01<denis>i am on debian 7 wheezy
20:01<devil>do you understand 'screenshot'?
20:02<nadir>if you enter a password it doesn't get shown.
20:02<nadir>at least that is "normal"
20:02<tarheel>could be the theme he chose
20:02<denis>i don't known , what is a screenhot ?
20:02<devil>a picture of your screen with the error
20:02<nadir>I'd start by installing a different terminal emulator and check if it has the same problem[s] (as long no password shown isn't the only problem)
20:03<linuxator>maybe it's local are you using an non english language installed?
20:03<denis>no message error
20:03<devil>s/error/problem
20:03<denis>language french
20:04<tarheel>he is losing font sounds like a theme issue
20:04<denis>i speek french
20:05<denis>denis.lechevalier@msn.com denis lechevalier 80600 doullens france
20:05<nutron>gnome 3 starts in fallback mode on a new wheezy install using the intel driver. This is on an i3 sandybridge processor. Known issue? If so how can I fix this?
20:06<denis>error on gnome3 , yes on start
20:07<devil>denis: maybe you should try french
20:07<devil>!fr
20:07<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr. Francophone users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr.
20:07<denis>ok thank you ...
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20:07<denis>good bye ...
20:08<denis>a+++
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20:09<Sherief>Hi, I am having trouble getting my RTL8188CE to work
20:09<retrospectacus>!RTL8188CE
20:09<dpkg>The Realtek RTL8188CE and RTL8192CE are PCIe 802.11n wireless LAN chipsets (PCI IDs 10ec:8176, 10ec:8177, 10ec:8178, 10ec:8191). mac80211 vendor driver (rtl8192ce) is available since Linux 2.6.38. Firmware is required (rtlwifi/rtl8192cfw.bin), ask me about <realtek firmware> to provide. http://wiki.debian.org/rtl819x
20:09<Sherief>I actually installed it.
20:09<Sherief>iwconfig has wlan0
20:10<retrospectacus>https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/HowToUse then
20:10<linuxator>denis, write /join #debian-fr
20:10<retrospectacus>denis_: to be clear: nothing should appear when you are entering a password.
20:10<denis>there is nobody on debian.fr
20:11-!-pillar2012_ [~gemboy@h-66-166-22-146.snva.ca.megapath.net] has joined #debian
20:11<retrospectacus>not letters, no *** , not empty space. Nothing. the cursor will not move.
20:11<denis>no
20:11<retrospectacus>denis: it is #debian-fr
20:11<retrospectacus>not .fr
20:11<devil>denis: it is #debian-fr
20:11<devil>71 ppl there
20:11<denis>ok
20:11<denis>i go
20:11<denis>thank you
20:11<devil>retrospectacus: so factoid is partialy wrong
20:12<retrospectacus>it is?
20:12<devil>yeah, first mention says #debian.fr
20:12<linuxator>denis, double click #debian-fr <---here ;)
20:13<retrospectacus>devil: looking up a few lines, that's not what I see
20:13<themill>devil: you might need to clean your screen ;)
20:14<denis_>no effect
20:14<devil>themill retrospectacus well, old yes, I was wrong :)
20:14<denis_>no effect on click
20:14<devil>eyes even
20:14<Sherief>retrospectacus: I am using xfce with NM and it says "wireless disabled" and i am sure my wifi hardware switch is on.
20:14-!-Manus [~manuel@84.166.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #debian
20:14<retrospectacus>denis_: type /j #debian-fr and press enter
20:14-!-denis_ [~denis@AAmiens-553-1-243-230.w86-215.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Quitte]
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20:15<retrospectacus>linuxator: I dont know what client you have but that is not a standard feature that I know of
20:15-!-denis [~denis@AAmiens-553-1-243-230.w86-215.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #debian
20:15<linuxator>retrospectacus, true doesn't work on all client
20:15<retrospectacus>denis: type /j #debian-fr and press enter
20:15-!-Manus [~manuel@84.166.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit []
20:15<linuxator>denis, write /join #debian-fr no need to close client
20:16<linuxator>and then enter
20:16<linuxator>he is on nice
20:17<Sherief>$rfkill list:
20:17<Sherief>hp-wifi.. soft blocked: yes; hard blocked: no
20:17<Sherief>phy0: Wireless LAN.. soft blocked: no; hard blocked: yes
20:17-!-ewerton [~ewerton@201-40-60-243.cpece700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Quit: Saindo]
20:17<Sherief>rfkill unblock all doesn't change anything.
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20:30-!-mode/#debian [+l 595] by debhelper
20:30<linuxator>Sherief, what wireless device you have
20:30<linuxator>?
20:31<Karu>Greetings folks - i'm trying to track down an issue on a bog standard stable install where root is unable to sudo to login shells using other user's environments. su - or sudo su - results in an "inappropriate ioctl for device"
20:31<Sherief>linuxator: RTL8188CE
20:31<Karu>and subsequently bash not having job control in that session
20:31<themill>Karu: within screen?
20:32<Karu>•themill• no, just a regular old ssh session
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20:35<themill>Karu: hmmm "ssh root@box" then "su - otheruser" works just fine here.
20:36<Karu>themill - yup, doubt it's a bug. I haven't really tweaked anything system level, so i'm guessing it's a package that did something hokey
20:36<Karu>problem is I don't even know where to begin looking. google for this error is surprisingly sparse.
20:37<linuxator>Sherief, did you try apt-get update && apt-get install firmware-realtek ?
20:38<Sherief>linuxator: yes, and iwconfig reads the card
20:38-!-aXqd [~axqd@122.234.62.176] has quit []
20:38<Sherief>problem is when I do ifconfig wlan0 up i get: operation not premitted due to RT-kill
20:38<Sherief>$rfkill list:
20:38<Sherief>hp-wifi.. soft blocked: yes; hard blocked: no
20:38<Sherief>phy0: Wireless LAN.. soft blocked: no; hard blocked: yes
20:38-!-aXqd [~axqd@122.234.62.176] has joined #debian
20:39<retrospectacus>Sherief: try the wifi-on/off "function" button
20:39<linuxator>Sherief, ifconfig wlan0 up ?
20:39<retrospectacus>e.g. FN-F5 or whatever
20:41-!-the_ross [~ross@ip216-239-85-53.vif.net] has joined #debian
20:41<Sherief>retrospctacus: if I toggle the hardware wifi switch it gets worse...
20:42<Sherief>$rfkill list:
20:42<Sherief>hp-wifi.. soft blocked: yes; hard blocked: YES
20:42<Sherief>phy0: Wireless LAN.. soft blocked: no; hard blocked: yes
20:42<Sherief>linuxator: yes.
20:42<retrospectacus>check dmesg
20:43<Sherief>I am writing by hand, I can't actully copy/paste.
20:43<Sherief>which part do you want me to check?
20:43<retrospectacus>the end
20:45<Sherief>rtlwifi: wireless switch is on
20:46<Sherief>cfg80211: regulatory domain changed to country: EC
20:46<Sherief>cfg80211: start_freq - end_freq @ bandwidth), ............
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20:51<linuxator>Sherief, strange other ppl with same card have no problems
20:52<k-man_>i seem to recall there is a command for managing services like "manageservie ssh start" instead of typing /etc/init.d/ssh start any idea what its called? I can't remember
20:53<LtL>k-man_: service ssh start
20:53<k-man_>ah, thanks LtL
20:53<linuxator>ShawnWhite, apt-get update && apt-get install wireless-tools
20:53<LtL>k-man_: although it's probably sshd
20:54<k-man_>LtL, nope, its ssh, i checked
20:54<k-man_>but i was speaking generally anyway :)
20:54<LtL>k-man_: okay, wasn't sure :)
20:54<linuxator>then iwconfig , let's see what it say that
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21:04<Sherief>linuxator: well, I did install firmware-realtek then switched my hardware wireless button but no luck getting network manager to work with the card
21:05<Sherief>iwlist wlan0 scan: Interface doesn't support scanning: Network is down
21:05<Sherief>I have no idea why.
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21:11<linuxator>Sherief, uname -r ? i see it is a bit buggy on kernel <3.0 so if you are on squeeze and upgrate to squeeze (kernel 3.2) might work
21:11-!-nardev [~nardev@46.36.177.29] has joined #debian
21:12<Sherief>linuxator: wheezy- 3.2.0-4-amd64
21:12<linuxator>damn
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21:17<Sherief>linuxator: can network-manager log its activity?
21:17<Sherief>when i right click the task bar icon to "Enable wireless" nothing happens
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21:26<linuxator>Sherief, i think it must be somewhere on /var/log/syslog
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21:29<linuxator>Sherief, is there a path /etc/modprobe.d/r8192ce.conf ?
21:30<Sherief>liuxator: no
21:30<Sherief>linuxator*
21:31<linuxator>Sherief, can you do a locate r8192ce.conf ?
21:32<linuxator>might give output some paths
21:33-!-phdeswer [~phdeswer@118-169-74-38.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #debian
21:33<Sherief>gives back nothing, I got news but I have to take a screenshot/photo
21:33<Sherief>sec..
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21:39<Karu>hah, i just realized this su bash ioctl thing happened a year ago on another install. except there I think a botched upgrade caused the problem. reinstall fixed it then, except now that's not really an option. SE for anyone who's interested in the nitty gritty: http://serverfault.com/questions/411307/cannot-set-terminal-process-group-during-su-to-another-user-as-login-shell
21:39<linuxator>Sherief, on general is really strange about that card at others works ok, at others after kernerl 3+ works ok while <3 doesnt but on general many problems cause of releatek no support
21:40-!-ClepCidre [~ClepCidre@243.61-66-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:41<linuxator>an alternative is the above install ndiswrapper and then load the appropriate Windows driver
21:41<Sherief>linuxator: here are the syslog messages that comes up when I try to enable the card from NM https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0x2hw7on7wwcpe/photo.jpg
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21:43<gustavo>Hello!
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21:45<linuxator>Sherief, what about try ndiswrapper method as alternative might that works
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21:46<ljsoftnet>i have no sound in flash in google chrome wheezy
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21:51<linuxator># aptitude install ndiswrapper-dkms then locate your windows driver something.inf , then # ndiswrapper -i /full/path/to/WinXP/Driver/driver.inf # ndiswrapper -m # modprobe ndiswrapper
21:52<themill>Karu: do you have custom .bashrc / .bash_profile etc there?
21:53<linuxator>Sherief, might that works
21:53<linuxator>let me know
21:54<Sherief>linuxator: Thanks, I will just stop for today, I've been trying to get it to work for 3 hours now.
21:54<Karu>themill - For root yes, for the user i tried to su to, no. However, I just tried moving the files out of the way, relogged so they wouldn't be in effect, and tried again, and it made no difference.
21:54<ljsoftnet>linuxator can u help me? i have no sound in flash in google chrome
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21:55<linuxator>ljsoftnet, break cigarette. Google chrome flash no sound?
21:56<ljsoftnet>linuxator yes, but i can play flash video
21:56<Karu>themill - and the system bashrc and profiles are stock
21:57<tarheel>try another browser
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21:59<ljsoftnet>tarheel i tried iceweasel but flash player plays in loops when playing at starting video
22:01<tarheel>thats weird i use opera
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22:05<ljsoftnet>tarheel whats the mirror for offical stable wheezy?
22:06<tarheel>deb http://deb.opera.com/opera/ stable non-free #Opera Browser (final releases)
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22:06<ljsoftnet>tarheel i mean mirror for debian wheezy main stable
22:07<linuxator>ljsoftnet, i remember i had some problems with flashplayer at firefox what i did was the above
22:07<linuxator>#apt-get remove gnash
22:08<ljsoftnet>linuxator i dont have gnash installed
22:08<tarheel>i never liked firefox its too big
22:08<linuxator>oh do you have adobe's?
22:08<ljsoftnet>linuxator yes
22:09<tarheel>i do
22:09<linuxator>i had some problems with firefox unistall gnash and install adobes and works proper
22:10<linuxator>ljsoftnet, did you try unistall/reinstall same happend?
22:10<Myhro>ljsoftnet, did you installed it with the 'flashplugin-nonfree' package?
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22:11<ljsoftnet>linuxator yes i installed flashplugin-nonfree but it bugges out it keeps looping while playing flash
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22:12<ljsoftnet>Myhro is this the rigth mirror for debian "deb http://http.debian.net/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free "
22:12<linuxator>ljsoftnet, did you try with other browsers too?
22:12<ljsoftnet>linuxator i tried google chrome, it plays flash video fine, but without sound
22:12<Myhro>ljsoftnet, it's something like 'http://ftp.debian.org/debian' instead
22:13<ljsoftnet>Myhro is there also a "main contrib free" mirror
22:13<dvs>Myhro: you're wrong, ljsoftnet is right about the mirror
22:14<Myhro>ljsoftnet, yes, the other parts are right - I've just told you the url
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22:14<Myhro>dvs I've never used the 'http.debian.net', but it could work, I'm telling him what I'm used to
22:14<dvs>!ftp.debian.org
22:14<dpkg>ftp.debian.org is not the principal mirror for Debian. It is just one mirror that uses bandwidth that was donated to the Debian project; you are kindly requested not to use this mirror but to instead use a mirror that is closer to you, ask me about <mirrors>. See http://www.debian.org/mirror/ftpmirror#wherefrom for more information.
22:15<Myhro>of course, ftp.your-two-letter-country-code.debian.org is better
22:15<Myhro>:P
22:16<Myhro>ljsoftnet, about the 'no sound problem' in Chrome, try opening it with the argument --audio-buffer-size=2048
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22:17<ljsoftnet>Myhro still nothing
22:18<linuxator>ljsoftnet, amd64?
22:18<ljsoftnet>linuxator yes
22:18<Myhro>ljsoftnet, wheezy + chrome in last version?
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22:18<ljsoftnet>Myhro yes
22:19<Myhro>same setup here, with the audio buffer arg
22:19<linuxator>i'm 32bit check that one http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=661210
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22:28<chainsaw>hello
22:28<chainsaw>?...
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22:28<sney>!ask
22:28<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
22:29<chainsaw>I would like help writing a script with a Y/n argument can anyone help me?
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22:31<chainsaw>I'm trying to write a bash script that reads like a classic text adventure. I would like some help with echo and read but also T/n arguments
22:31<chainsaw>Y/n**
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22:32<chainsaw>anyone?...
22:32<chainsaw>maybe I should use the crunchbang room they are way more helpful...
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22:46<NowStallman>Weird, irssi said I was 'banned' for like the last two days. But now I can connect?
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22:49<sney>were you running irc as root
22:50<themill>(yes)
22:51<NowStallman>Ya. That must have done it. I should probably change the default nick.
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23:27<AfterDark>Hi everyone. In Jessie, an attempt to view apparmor status results in this: http://paste.debian.net/55688/
23:27<AfterDark>Any ideas?
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23:59<xen>i'm having an issue i can't seem to solve
---Logclosed Fri Oct 11 00:00:09 2013