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#debian IRC Logs for 2014-05-22

---Logopened Thu May 22 00:00:27 2014
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00:39<bullgard4>Can you suggest an introduction to "The Linux Kernel API"? file:///usr/share/doc/linux-doc-3.2/html/kernel-api/index.html is too complicated to digest as a start.
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00:44<devil>bullgard4: read stuff on kernel newbies
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00:45<bullgard4>devil: Thank you.
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02:42<grummund>Hi, i just ran xfce for the first time and it asked do i want defaults or an empty panel, stupidly i clicked empty. :-/
02:43<grummund>i haven't done any customisation yet, how best to re-initialise it using the install defaults?
02:44<grummund>rm -rf ~/.config/xfce4 ?
02:46<jm_>maybe test that with a different user first
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02:50<grummund>guess i could just move it
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04:38<john_>so after asking multiple times about ati drivers and got the answer to install debian and see how it goes, well it went bad very bad, and i ended up installing ubuntu, and it booted up with all my 3 screens working from the usb, so my question is how can it be such a big difference between ubuntu and debian testing
04:41<jm_>are you using fglrx in ubuntu?
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04:44<lukrop>john_: probably because of version differences
04:45<babilen>john_: Well, there is *very* little we can do to help you if you don't use Debian right now. How did you install the drivers back then?
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04:46<lukrop>john_: what exactly went "very bad"? :)
04:46<Stummi>ubuntu shops some non-free drivers per default iirc. Especially on graphics this can make difference
04:46<Stummi>*ship
04:46<jm_>yeah that's why I asked about fglrx
04:46<john_>babilen: i couldnt install the drivers back
04:46<john_>it wouldnt let me uninstall or purge the fglrx drivers
04:46<Stummi>why not?
04:46<babilen>john_: "back" ? And what was the problem?
04:46<john_>my computer went all black
04:47<babilen>john_: So you installed the fglrx drivers on Debian? How did you do that?
04:47<john_>with the guide on debian wiki
04:47<john_>that lukrop sent me
04:47<babilen>https://wiki.debian.org/ATIProprietary ?
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04:47<john_>yes
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04:48<john_>and before i installed the drivers only one of my 3 screens where beeing recognized
04:48<john_>updatet to testing and 2 started to function but they were recognized as one so i couldnt turn off mirros screen or anything
04:48<babilen>Okay, that is the official documentation and has worked for many people. Please install Debian again. This time I would like you to try the radeon driver first with libgl1-mesa-dri and firmware-linux-nonfree installed before giving fglrx a try. Once you've tried installing fglrx you should paste your /var/log/Xorg.0.log to http://paste.debian.net and we can take it from there.
04:49<john_>then i went for installing fglrx drivers and then the screens went black and couldnt reset
04:49<babilen>john_: It might very well be that you made mistakes during the procedure (either during the upgrade to testing or the driver installation/configuration)
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04:49<lukrop>_configuration_
04:50<babilen>"recognised as one" == Do you mean that you had one large desktop?
04:50<john_>babilen: perhaps, but i dont think so, it was pretty straight forward
04:50<john_>no i had mirror screens
04:50<babilen>john_: Well, there really is nothing we can do right now but speculate and, frankly, I don't see the point of that.
04:50<john_>but if i opend the display manger there were only 1 screen there
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04:51<lukrop>you had two screens working with the opensource driver?
04:51<john_>babilen: well i just wantet to know how a live usb can boot up with three screens and debian cant, i get tears in my eyes cuse i love debian use it on all my laptops but still we are so far behind in basic things
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04:51<babilen>Well, you read what I suggested. You can now either happily use Ubuntu (and seek support in #ubuntu) or give Debian another shot. Both variants are fine and what you choose is entirely up to you, but there is simply no point in continuing this.
04:52<babilen>john_: Ubuntu includes various non-free drivers by default. These are missing in Debian's default configuration and, conversely, in the live cd.
04:52<john_>babilen: still u could answer my question why this is,
04:52<babilen>I just did.
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04:52<john_>babilen: what makes it possible on ubuntu but not debian, im aksing cause i want to know
04:52<babilen>And it is "you" not "u"
04:53<babilen>john_: Debian values "free" (as in speech and as defined in the DFSG) higher than a lot of other things (including user experience)
04:53<john_>babilen: i c
04:53<john_>babilen: i mean, I see
04:54<john_>babilen: ok be back after the installation be ready for support
04:54<babilen>+1
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04:54<john_>thanks for now appreciate your time and help, take care for now
04:54<babilen>And if you do this on testing or unstable ask in #debian-next please :)
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04:55<babilen>Could have been https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=745901 btw
04:56<babilen>Ubuntu uses an older version of fglrx in their current stable release (namely 13.350.1)
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05:04<john_>babilen: me again, just before i start with the install, could you send me a proper guide or commands how to do the install of ati drivers so i could try it, so i dont do the same "misstake?" again.
05:05<babilen>I mentioned the following earlier:
05:05<babilen>Could have been https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=745901 btw
05:05<babilen>Ubuntu uses an older version of fglrx in their current stable release (namely 13.350.1)
05:05<babilen>(in case you are using Gnome)
05:07<babilen>john_: My recommendation is to not install fglrx at first, but make sure to have firmware-linux-nonfree and libgl1-mesa-dri. That uses the open radeon driver and you can test that. You might have to grab an earlier version of fglrx driver if you want to run testing and if you are indeed experiencing the aforementioned bug.
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05:07<lzzluca>Hi all!
05:08<lzzluca>I would like to ask for some help in set up my notifications
05:08<john_>babilen: ok, how do i install them?
05:08<john_>babilen: is it with those to commands?
05:08<lukrop>lzzluca: which desktop environment are you using?
05:08<lzzluca>lukrop, I am using i3 (so only wm) and I have realised I know nothing about the notification system in Debian
05:08<lukrop>john_: the opensource driver should be installed by default if you have installed xorg
05:09<babilen>john_: Make sure that you have contrib and non-free enabled in your sources.list and run "apt-get install firmware-linux-nonfree libgl1-mesa-dri" -- A suitable sources.list that picks the "best" mirror automagically would be: http://paste.debian.net/101146
05:09<lzzluca>luchino_, i3 +dunst but I had Gnome3 installed previously, so maybe something from Gnome is still there
05:09<lzzluca>lukrop, i3 +dunst but I had Gnome3 installed previously, so maybe something from Gnome is still there
05:09<lukrop>lzzluca: what is working and what not? :)
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05:10<john_>babilen: onem ore question, should i update to testig first and then install the drivers or install the drivers first and then update to testing? cause i would want to use the testing repos
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05:12<john_>'
05:12<lzzluca>lukrop, well, if I run: notify-send "ciao" I get a notification by dunst. And that is it. Pidgin doesn't send any notification. Xchat seems to do (I am not sure about the last days), icedove doesn't
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05:14<lukrop>lzzluca: I see, well I think it depends on the applications then.
05:15<lzzluca>lukrop, at some point I tried more than one notifier (one was dunst, one was the Gnome3 notifier) and... I wasn't even able to set up the one supposed to work. In /etc/alternatives should i see any alternative to configure as default?
05:15-!-maxy [~maxy@178-26-77-183-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #debian
05:15<lzzluca>lukrop, sorry my really ignorant questions!! is the first time that I care about notifications
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05:16<lukrop>lzzluca: i don't think that those questions are ignorant. ;)
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05:21<lzzluca>lukrop, argh I am not sure if you have seen my previous message: should I find, in /etc/alternatives, the alternatives I can set up as default notifier? Because I don't...
05:21<lzzluca>lukrop Also, if I run: dpkg -l | grep notif I get this: http://paste.debian.net/101150/ Do you think it is ok?
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05:22<lzzluca>lukrop, and to finish: any nice manual for notification system? Ok I have asked you a lots..........
05:23<kblin>hi folks
05:24<kblin>so, it looks like wheezy's version of ruby is 1.9.1, but rubygems is still stuck on 1.8
05:24<kblin>is there a trick to get an up-to-date rubygems install?
05:24<SynrG>1.9.3
05:25<kblin>well, I'm fine with 1.9.whatever, just 1.8.x seems a bit oldish
05:25<lukrop>lzzluca: i don't have any experience with the combination of software you are currently running.. the paste looks good, still I don't know if there are some notificaiton daemons that don't play well together
05:25<lukrop>lzzluca: maybe there is a way to tell pidgin which notification system to use?
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05:27<lzzluca>lukrop, the surprising thing for me was that, in my /etc/init.d , I didn't see anything to start/stop notification daemons... Is that OK? Where the "notification system" daemon is supposed to be?
05:27<lukrop>lzzluca: if i am not mistaken most systems use the dbus message bus
05:28<lukrop>which is started at boot
05:28<SynrG>kblin: in later releases, ruby itself provides rubygems. it is not a separate package.
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05:29<lzzluca>lukrop, ok! I am going to read more about DBus then. I have just briefly checked few info about it, so far.( Thanks! :) )
05:29<SynrG>kblin: as for the name convention, 1.9.1 is the 'compatibility release' bridging 1.8 and 1.9. so the library soname is 1.9.1 even though the actual ruby version is 1.9.3
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05:30<ThCTLo>hi, anyone who is good with postfix.. im bit confused about lmtp virtual users and non virtual ( aliasses files ) and pipe to perl scripts..
05:31<SynrG>kblin: apt-cache show ruby1.9.1 and you will see it provides rubygems1.9.1
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05:32<SynrG>kblin: concerning rubygems in Debian, also read: https://wiki.debian.org/Teams/Ruby/RubyExtras/OnRubygems
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05:38<pgee>hi
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05:41<DrZaius>ThCTLo: postfix is a complex piece of software
05:41<DrZaius>try #postfix on freenode
05:41-!-buffoon_work [~buffoon@217.199.15.122] has joined #debian
05:41<DrZaius>or use workaround postfix debian tutorial
05:42<DrZaius>workaround.org
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05:47<ThCTLo>thanks i go look there also.
05:47<asd_>hi
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05:55<buffoon_work>Hi! I'm searching for a filesystem that does in-line deduplication. The only options I found until now would be opendedup (Java and not in wheezy - seems not to be the best for a fs imo) and zfs (zfs-fuse). What would you use?
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05:57<SynrG>there's also zfsonlinux, but only available upstream, and not yet in wheezy.
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05:58<SynrG>i.e. not supported here, but may be better than the fuse one
05:58-!-Airwave [~Airwave@0001a5d2.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
05:58<SynrG>and then there's debian/kfreebsd ...
05:58<petn-randall>buffoon_work: there's also btrfs, but I don't think the deduplication is implemented yet. How "real-timey" do you need it to be? Maybe a run of fdupes once a night would suffice?
05:58<SynrG>https://wiki.debian.org/Debian_GNU/kFreeBSD_FAQ#Q._Is_there_ZFS_support.3F
05:59<SynrG>so i would say 'yes' to zfs, and just work on which implementation you use
06:02<buffoon_work>petn-randall, I'm planning to store Backups so it should dedup as soon as possible. That's why btrfs is not an option.
06:03<petn-randall>buffoon_work: Most backups tools do dedup themselves, Bacula comes to mind.
06:04<petn-randall>-s
06:04<Brigo>buffoon_work, did you know http://zbackup.org/ ?
06:04<buffoon_work>SynrG, hmm, the kfreebsd kernel is something I didn't think of. Would maybe a better option than running the filesystem in userspace...
06:05<SynrG>possibly yes. native zfs is one of the biggest draws of debian/kfreebsd.
06:06<buffoon_work>petn-randall, changing Backup Software is not an option... As we have a lot of Windows Servers to backup and Bacula and others don't support a lot of stuff we need to backup
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06:07<buffoon_work>Even though it should be independent of the backup software we use. That's why dedup would be pretty cool
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06:08<buffoon_work>SynrG, Do you actually know if the HP E212 Controller and the HP Array Configuration Utility will run on the freebsd kernel?
06:08<SynrG>buffoon_work: absolutely no clue. have not tried it.
06:08<SynrG>there is #debian-kbsd i think
06:09<buffoon_work>maybe i should just try it out...
06:09<SynrG>yeah
06:09<SynrG>no harm, eh?
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06:20<buffoon_work>Installing and reading FAQ... I'll report back my results!
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06:22<SynrG>great. good luck.
06:23<buffoon_work>thx
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06:24<zsero>Hi, I’m running into an absolutely crazy issue with apt-get
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06:25<zsero>I’ve changed the repo url, did update, did install -f, and did dist-upgrade
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06:26<zsero>this breaks the whole upgrade, because it believes that one package is from an old version, while an other one needs a newer one and breaks the old
06:27<babilen>dpkg: bat
06:27<dpkg>In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
06:27<babilen>(also include your sources.list)
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06:34<zsero>babilen: is it possible that the bug is because I’m not doing apt-get clean after a repo url change? I’ll do the detailed log if this is not right
06:35<babilen>zsero: There is *nothing* we can do without seeing the requested information.
06:35<petn-randall>zsero: No, that's not the reason. Please provide the data babilen asked for.
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06:38<zsero>ok, i’ll try to do it
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06:49<babilen>zsero: What prevents you from copying and pasting the output + additional data to http://paste.debian.net ?
06:49<zsero>I’m doing it
06:49<camino>hello. I'm trying to configure smnp mibs on a debian system, but I can find processor load mibs hrProcessorLoad . any idea on how to solve this ?
06:50<zsero>I wanted to go back to the image i’m upgrading from and do the full output of the upgrade process
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07:07<petn-randall>zsero: We actually only need the info we asked for, not the whole upgrade ... :)
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07:12<ThCTLo>zsero: what you can do, revert the url backup. then apt-get -f install && apt-get update && apt-get upgrade when all done, then change url, again apt-get dist-upgrade -d && apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade. should do it.
07:13<ThCTLo>zsero: always use apt-get dist-upgrade -d first, it download the needed packages and you wont end up with a broken system.
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07:15<ThCTLo>camino : look here : https://wiki.debian.org/SNMP , download the mibs and put this in /etc/default/snmp export MIBS=UCD-SNMP-MIB should work.
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07:17<jm_>you might also want to add the rocommunity ... line
07:17<zsero>ThCTLo: wow, this looks like something I need. Can you tell me what is exactly again apt-get dist-upgrade -d && apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade doing and why is this better then a normal dist-upgrade>
07:17<zsero>?
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07:18<ThCTLo>wel its the same
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07:19<ThCTLo>when upgrading your dist. Adviced is :
07:19<ThCTLo>1) first upgrade the current system : apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
07:19<ThCTLo>2) change url in apt.
07:19<ThCTLo>3) apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade -d
07:20<ThCTLo>when useing -d it downloads the packages and it's not performing upgrade
07:20<zsero>aaa, I see
07:20<ThCTLo>then, when all packages are on your system do the upgrade. saves troubles.
07:20<ThCTLo>and, if needed, you have the packages to fix the problem.
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07:21<ThCTLo>and yes, sometimes you need to fix the upgrade with apt-get -f install
07:21<zsero>cool! and should -f install be the first step always? even before update?
07:21<ThCTLo>thats for fixing your problem now.
07:22<ThCTLo>apt-get -f install is only needed when you have problems.
07:22<zsero>ok, but if I’m writing a script for doing automatic upgrades, should it look like this?
07:22<zsero>1. -f install
07:22<zsero>2. update && upgrade
07:22<zsero>3. dist -d && upgrade && dist
07:22<zsero>4. clean?
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07:24<ThCTLo>a one linere : apt-get update && apt-get upgrade -y && sed -i 's]squeeze]wheezy]g'/etc/apt/sources.list && apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade -d && apt-get upgrade -y && apt-get dist-upgrade -y
07:24<ThCTLo>;-)
07:24<ThCTLo>( and fix my typo's ) :-/
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07:27<petn-randall>zsero: How does 'apt-get dist-upgrade -d' in any way prevent the system from getting broken? You're essentially just making one step into two.
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07:28<zsero>ThCTLo: thanks, amazing! Can you explain why is upgrade && dist-upgrade better then just one dist-upgrade?
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07:29<SynrG>zsero: the first one doesn't do removals. it can make it easier for apt to resolve 'hard' problems that otherwise would exist if going to dist-upgrade directly.
07:29<SynrG>this advice varies per release. some releases upgrade to others in one step without issues.
07:30<SynrG>but pre-depends can make things very hard on apt
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07:31<SynrG>oh, ThCTLo's step 1 and 3 are not what i had thought.
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07:32<SynrG>my explanation is for why "apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade"
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07:33<SynrG>but yes, ensuring your old release is up-to-date first is a good idea, too.
07:33<SynrG>otherwise all kinds of crap could happen
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07:40<ThCTLo>ah zsero i see SynrG has answered, .. what he said.. ;-)
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07:44<zsero>ok, thanks!
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07:53<zsero>one more question: I’m using the current line to do totally non-interactive upgrades, as I’ve read in the handbook:
07:53<zsero>yes "" | apt-get -y -o Dpkg::Options::="--force-confdef" ' + \
07:53<zsero> '-o Dpkg::Options::="--force-confold" dist-upgrade
07:54<zsero>how can I modify dist-upgrade -d and upgrade to be like this line? does dist-upgrade need anything similar?
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08:05<nkuttler>zsero: you really don't want to do this for dist-upgrades
08:06<zsero>you mean non-interactive?
08:08<ThCTLo>its not adviced no.
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08:09<zsero>ok, thanks!
08:09<ThCTLo>zsero, read this : http://www.howtoforge.com/how-to-configure-automatic-updates-on-debian-squeeze
08:10<ThCTLo>same for wheezy
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08:13<zsero>ThCTLo: thanks!
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08:22<babilen>zsero: I still don't quite understand what the actual issue is you are trying to fix. Pieces I gathered so far: 1. You want to upgrade from squeeze to wheezy 2. You want unsupervised upgrades 3. ???
08:22<babilen>zsero: The first is detailed in the wheezy release notes: https://www.debian.org/releases/wheezy/amd64/release-notes/ch-upgrading.en.html
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08:23<zsero>I never said I want to upgrade from squeeze to wheezy. I’m trying to implement a custom auto-updater for an embedded system, which would need to take care of dependency based installations and removals
08:23<babilen>Why did ThCTLo mention that one-liner then?
08:23<babilen>Ah well ..
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08:23<babilen>*shrug*
08:24<zsero>that one liner is quite good, I know which steps I have to exactly take
08:24<babilen>zsero: Why would you want to "sed -i 's]squeeze]wheezy]g'/etc/apt/sources.list" ?
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08:25<babilen>And I still have no idea what your initial issue was, but meh .. back to work.
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08:25<zsero>yes, that part I’m not using
08:26<zsero>actually, if you want to contribute, it is open sourced, feel free to join:
08:26<zsero>https://github.com/KanoComputing/kano-updater
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08:32<camino>ThCTLo thank you, but still it didn't work
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08:34<babilen>zsero: Thank, but no thanks.
08:34<babilen>+s
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10:05<EdMiranda>Bom dia!
10:06<EdMiranda>Sou novo no canal.
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10:06<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
10:07<EdMiranda>ok! Sorry! thx!
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10:37<noobie>is thi.s freenode:???
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11:35<rostam>hi I got no answer for this, trying for second time: we have installed debian on two different partitions, i.e. /dev/sda1 and /dev/sda2. One partition is active all the time, i.e. /dev/sda1. In the field, If active partition is corrupted we have a PIC controller which will detect the failure and switch the boot partition to /dev/sda2. My question is how I can reinstall debian on corrupted partition. This has to be automated, so it requires preseeding.
11:35<rostam> I was thinking of debbootstrap but it seems it does not support preseeding. Any help or suggestion greatly appreciated. thx
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11:36<narut0-sniper>i'm beginner ;/ i don't understand your problem :/
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11:42<ncl>https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/apb.html
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11:42<sara_>holas
11:42<sara_>kszs
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11:43<somiaj>rostam: if you have a non corrupted install image (you can store this on another partition or a file system ona backup disk), that is fully configured the way you want it, you could cp -a that to the place you want it. The only trick in the automation will be making it bootable
11:43<somiaj>rostam: the idea here is you don't actually do an install you just copy one over.
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11:56<rostam>somiaj, thanks for your feedback, but I like to know if there is a way to install a clean debian on that partition. I am kind of worried about using cp or dd for this ...
11:57<lupine>debootstrap ?
11:57<lupine>that'll get you part of the way there
11:58<rostam>lupine, I need to automate this in the field, could debootstrap work with preseed file?
11:58<ncl>he already mentioned debootstrap but said he couldn't figure out how to preseed it
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11:59<lupine>at that point, we're more or less at running debian-installer
11:59<lupine>which is probably possible, but I've never done it
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12:00<somiaj>rostam: at some level an install is just copying over the data/files. If you have a very static setup, hainvg a master to just copy from locally will avoid the whole debootstrap (what id does is copy the files from teh internet) or installer do it for you then have to automate installing/configuring additional packages.
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12:01<somiaj>rostam: My very limited experience (I'm just a hobbist) would be if you have a static setup you find you'll need to revert back to a lot, is use debootstrap and chroot to make the install the way you want to (basicaly do everything except make it bootable), then you can copy that to any partition you want to revert back to that point
12:01<somiaj>rostam: the only trick would be making it bootable
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12:02<rostam>somiaj, I see your point and make sense, so if I want to do this right, I need to find out what things to copy and what not to..
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12:02<somiaj>rostam: copy the whole root filesystem, you'll probabaly want everything except /home
12:03<somiaj>rostam: and then just store personal data in /home so that stays the same when you revert the base.
12:03<somiaj>rostam: another big draw back of this method is if you want to change things in your master copy, you'll have to manually chroot into it and do the changes each time. Using a tool such as puppet or some other auotmated install may be easier to tweak an option here and there when you want to change things.
12:04<rostam>somiaj, how about device node file system, i.e. /dev/.. or /var/log ...
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12:04<somiaj>rostam: /dev is a tmpfs with udev these days so the basic /dev is only needed to get udev up which is fine to copy
12:04<somiaj>rostam: make sure you don't copy it from a running partition, then things like /proc /sys are not mounted so they just stay empty
12:05<somiaj>rostam: keeping /var/log or backing it up may be useful, but tehre are other thigns in /var you'll want, naimly /var/lib/dpkg and /var/lib/apt
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12:06<somiaj>rostam: depending on your use some software puts personaly data in /var (/var/www /var/mail for isntance). If you do somethign like that you may want to configure/move where that personal stuff is stored as I think it would be a pain to pick and chose what in /var you want to copy (though with rsync you could have a config file setup to do it automatically)
12:06<rostam>somiaj, oh okay thank you so much for all the great advise, I will look into it..
12:07<somiaj>rostam: I copy installs from one drive to another this way and it works wonderfully. Making it bootable requires chrooting, configuring and installing grub
12:07<somiaj>rostam: last you may run into some little annoyances such as presistant network naming eth0 if you end up putting this on another machine with different hardware mac addresses
12:08<rostam>somiaj, great thx
12:08<somiaj>rostam: but you may want to look into something liek puppet or cfengine, good tools for automating installs and pushign configurations across to them. Might be a bit of a heavy tool if this is jsut for a local static image.
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12:12<eloybc>hola
12:12<somiaj>!es
12:12<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
12:13<eloybc>Excuse me
12:14<somiaj>my response to hola, thinking you may want help in spanish, otherwise feel free to ask your question. (:
12:14<mtn>eloybc: you are excused
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12:27<meaustin>!seamonkey
12:27<dpkg>SeaMonkey is a cross-platform Internet suite, a continuation of the unmaintained Mozilla Application Suite, based on the same source code. Formerly packaged for Debian as <iceape>. For help with upstream issues, ask #seamonkey on irc.mozilla.org. http://www.seamonkey-project.org/
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12:43<blawiz>debian packages sys doesnt have truecrypt?
12:43<blawiz>is there a good alternative in the repo?
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12:50<Arrowmaster>blawiz: cryptsetup
12:52<Arrowmaster>dpkg: tell blawiz about truecrypt
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12:54<blawiz>Arrowmaster, can it encrypt a folder also?
12:54<Arrowmaster>encfs can
12:54<Arrowmaster>i think, luks (cryptsetup) is for encrypting entire partitions
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12:57<john_>babilen: hi, you there?
12:58<babilen>john_: What is it?
12:58<john_>we talked earlier about ati drivers on debian,
12:59<john_>iv been trying to get it to work but with no luck, im doing a fresh instal of debian as we speak. you think you could guide me trouh it when it finish?
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13:00<babilen>john_: Unfortunately I won't have the time to do that right now. My recommendation would, however, be:
13:00<babilen>dpkg: tell john_ -about radeon
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13:01<babilen>john_: Try it with the open radeon driver first and make sure that you have firmware-linux-nonfree and libgl1-mesa-dri installed. You would, on testing, require a sources.list entry such as http://paste.debian.net/101233/ for that. (my recommendation would be to use a "/msg dpkg tum" setup as that allows you to pull from sid)
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13:03<john_>babilen: ok will try that the, thank you
13:03<babilen>john_: If that doesn't work for you you will have a bit of a problem as the current version of fglrx-driver in jessie and sid seems to suffer from https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=745901
13:03<babilen>john_: That means that you won't be able to use that driver and Gnome at the same time. You could, probably, grab an older version from snapshots.
13:03<babilen>dpkg: tell john_ -about snapshots
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13:09<maxime_>$Maxime$SAUREL$13;
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13:17<snima>Why i get this error in synaptic ?
13:17<snima>W: Failed to fetch http://http.debian.net/debian/pool/main/g/gsl/gsl-bin_1.15+dfsg.2-2_amd64.deb
13:17<snima> 403 Forbidden
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13:18<snima>my repository :http://paste.ubuntu.com/7502253/
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13:25<mtn_>snima: I can access file with no problem. try again?
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13:32<greyoda>hi
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13:41<chealer>snima: try updating your sources
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13:46<jdziak>hey
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14:11<snima>mtn_: The problem is since a week a go
14:11<snima>chealer: It is not possible . 403 happen
14:11<mtn_>snima: the site and the address are fine. maybe a dns problem. try using opendns or google for dns?
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14:20<ra> olaa
14:20<ra>hellow
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14:21<ra>hellow
14:21<ra>olaaa
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14:25<sterver>test
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14:29<edmiranda>tested
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14:31<sterver>ehm, not. I don't know how to disconnet :D. I'm trying irssi
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15:14<blawiz>what would be the debian stable equivalent to this: sudo /etc/init.d/fuse restart
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15:23<rudi_s>blawiz: What exactly is that supposed to do?
15:24<rudi_s>FUSE is normally managed by each user separately.
15:24<blawiz>rudi_s, dunno
15:24<blawiz>i get: fuse: failed to open /dev/fuse: Permission denied
15:24<blawiz>that code was supposed to fix it
15:24<rudi_s>blawiz: Fix the permissions on /dev/fuse ...
15:24<rudi_s>Or - most likely - put the user in the fuse group!
15:25<blawiz>ive done that.. but maybe it needs to restarT?
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15:25<rudi_s>blawiz: YOu need to relogin.
15:25<blawiz>:(
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15:35<alejandro>hola
15:35<alejandro>or hello
15:35<alejandro>et bonjour
15:36<alejandro>salam malegumm
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16:37<rryoumaa>where does one find an explanation of version strings for packages? e.g. ...dfsg-1~bpo70+1. lmgtfm did not produce.
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16:40<Arrowmaster>rryoumaa: https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Version but it probably wont help
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16:41<Arrowmaster>dfsg means the package was modified to remove parts that do not meet the debian free software guidelines, bpo means its a backport package
16:41-!-trifolio6 [~h@62.43.62.203.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #debian
16:41<Arrowmaster>do you have a more specific question?
16:42<grummund>Is it possible to re-run the installer partitioning step, after install?
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16:43<grummund>i want to change some (currently unused) partitions to use LUK/dmcrypt and the installer makes that easy
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16:44<rryoumaa>Arrowmaster: yeah i was wondering if it was possible (sounds like not) to, for example, compare a bpo that has a later upstream version with a stable version and determine whether it has been patched for the cves that the stable version was patched for
16:44<rryoumaa>Arrowmaster: i.e. so that you know which version to use -- the newer if it is as safe
16:45<Arrowmaster>for that you probably need to look at the debian changelog
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16:45<rryoumaa>ok, thanks
16:46-!-rpfr [~ropafiro@bl13-23-66.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #debian
16:46*rryoumaa wants a registry someplace that marks which bpo packages are up to date on safety :)
16:46<Arrowmaster>the base version should be before any of that extra stuff and you can use that to figure out if its the same or newer than a certain upstream version, if its older than an upstream version youll need to check the changelog to see if a newer patch has been backported into it
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16:46<Arrowmaster>rryoumaa: theres a security announce mailing list
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16:50<rryoumaa>i'm talkign aboutg the case where bpo is newer upstream version. i presume they can still be unpatched, right?
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16:51<Arrowmaster>rryoumaa: bpo can never be newer than upstream
16:52<Arrowmaster>upstream is upstream
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17:01<rryoumaa>Arrowmaster: i'm talking about the case where the bpo debian version uses a newer upstream version as its foundation than the debian stable version
17:02<Arrowmaster>then yes it will include any security patches that the newer upstream has
17:02<rryoumaa>i presume that the newer bpo version can still be unpatched while the stable version can be patched
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17:02<rryoumaa>the question is whether it includes everything the older stable debian version includes. remember, the goal is to choose one or the other.
17:02<Arrowmaster>it should
17:03<rryoumaa>oh? i heard security patches do not always go into bpo.
17:03<ntux>Does anyone know if support for Intel HD 4600 will be added to Debian Wheezy kernel?
17:03<rryoumaa>Arrowmaster: did i hear incorrectly?
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17:03<Arrowmaster>if there is a new security patch then a new version of a bpo package might not be created right away
17:04<Arrowmaster>while the stable version would be
17:04<Arrowmaster>but the next version for bpo would include it, it just a matter of how fast the patch is applied to each branch
17:04<Arrowmaster>ntux: use the kernel from backports
17:05<rryoumaa>oh, so you won't get something on bpo that would go for a week without a patch?
17:05<Arrowmaster>you could be
17:05<Arrowmaster>really it depends on who maintains the package and the security team
17:06<rryoumaa>so it's still safer to choose the older version, then, it sounds like, unless you root around for the cves in the changelog.
17:06<Arrowmaster>yes
17:06<rryoumaa>is there a quick way to check without installing?
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17:07<Arrowmaster>https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/status/release/stable-backports
17:08<rryoumaa>that looks useful
17:09<rryoumaa>though maybe somebody will patch source but not binary i guess
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18:35<Smx>hello
18:36<retrospectacus>hi, Smx !
18:36<Smx>is this the right place to discuss about a bug?
18:36<Smx>hi retrospectacus :)
18:36<retrospectacus>!bts
18:36<dpkg>Bug Tracking System for Debian packages, http://bugs.debian.org/ or to go directly to the bug page for a particular package/bug, try http://bugs.debian.org/packagename or http://bugs.debian.org/bugnumber . aptitude install reportbug, and check out <querybts> too. Users of unstable and testing are required to check the BTS. See also <apt-listbugs>, <reportbug>. http://wiki.debian.org/HowtoUseBTS
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18:37<Smx>i'm actually unsure which package is buggy
18:37<devil>Smx: describe the problem
18:37-!-SamB [~SamB@2001:470:1f07:57:10d3:632a:3284:eb1] has joined #debian
18:38<Smx>so...i have a script that uses ckbcomp to parse layout files in /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols
18:38<Smx>it runs ckbcomp on all layout files in all subdirectories
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18:38<Smx>it runs fine until it hits /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/fujitsu_vndr
18:38<Smx>ckbcomp errors out with the layout files in the folder
18:39<Smx> /usr/bin/ckbcomp: instead of "{override"fujitsu_vndr/us"augment key<AE01>{[],[ka" in fujitsu_vndr/jp expected string.
18:39<Smx>ERROR: no valid keyboard layout found. Check the input.
18:39<Smx>so i took a look at the layout files "us" and "jp" (the only one in that folder)
18:39<Smx>and i noticed they have this style: xkb_symbols {
18:39<Smx>so they haven't got a string before { symbol
18:40<Smx>but they have a single xkb_symbols {} block
18:40<Smx>so the question is: is it correct to have xkb_symbols {} blocks without a string if the layout file has a single block?
18:40<Smx>if it's correct: ckbcomp bug, that shouldn't give the error
18:41<Smx>if it's wrong: it's locales bug, because there should be a string there
18:41<Smx>all other layouts have , for example
18:41<Smx>xkb_symbols "basic" {
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18:43<Smx>they are the only two layouts giving the problem
18:43<Smx>so i think of a locales bug, but i'm not sure
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18:46<SamB>Smx: it seems you have a good enough suspicion of a bug to report it, along with your reservations?
18:48<SamB>Smx: though I don't know why you keep saying "locales" when that stuff is from xkb-data
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18:49<Smx>oops
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19:22<adham>26101992
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19:31<Smx>done
19:32<Smx>i sent a bug report to xkb-data
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19:32-!-us`0gb is "0gb.us" on #oftc #moocows #debian-security #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian-mirrors #debian #
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19:34<cookta2012->how do i speed up my system clock?
19:35<Arrowmaster>you mean adjust the time?
19:36<cookta2012->no i want to speed up my system time
19:36<cookta2012->the tick rate
19:36<abrotman>Hit the Turbo button ..
19:36*cookta2012- throws a fish at abrotman
19:36*Arrowmaster shudders
19:36<SamB>cookta2012-: I usually leave such micromanagement of the clock rate to ntpd
19:36<abrotman>cookta2012-: oh, it's not 1994?
19:36<Arrowmaster>are you trying to run a cs server im guessing?
19:36<cookta2012->no
19:36<abrotman>SamB: he already said, not that clock
19:37<Arrowmaster>oh good
19:37<SamB>oh, he wants to overclock ... which clock?
19:37*abrotman watches SamB flounder around ..
19:37<cookta2012->I am testing a custom application and i need to know how it will react to a system "time" clock ticking stupidly fast
19:38<Smx>ah so you want to make the RTC faster?
19:38<SamB>ooooh
19:38<cookta2012->smx yes
19:38<SamB>so basically you want to simulate a really slow and/or busy CPU?
19:38<abrotman>SamB: seriously ...
19:39<Smx>the RTC clock is fixed
19:39<Smx>it cannot be altered...
19:39<cookta2012->not the cpu.. but the clock tick time like with the adjtimex command but i need to go faster
19:39<cookta2012->adjtimex -t 11000
19:40<cookta2012->that has the clock going faster but i need even faster.
19:40<Smx>you could make a bash script
19:40<SamB>some kind of LD_PRELOAD trickery?
19:40<Smx>to increment the time by X every Y time
19:41<Arrowmaster>this sounds like a better idea than actually trying to make the kernel tick rate faster
19:41<Smx>store the current time number to a variable
19:41*cookta2012- sighs
19:41<Smx>increment it
19:41<Smx>and set it back
19:41<cookta2012->do you have a example then.
19:41<Smx>let me see....
19:42<Smx>a combination of "date" and "sleep"
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19:43<cookta2012->urgh
19:43<cookta2012->where is the kernel clock info stored?
19:44<Arrowmaster>try /proc/timer_list and /proc/timer_stats
19:44<Arrowmaster>it cant be changed without recompiling a new kernel
19:45<cookta2012->ok arrow then if i cant be how does adjusttimex work?
19:45*Arrowmaster is having flashbacks to arguments with counterstike players during a lan tournament about tick rates
19:45<cookta2012->no it is not counter strike!!!
19:45<Arrowmaster>adjusttimex adjusts the rtc and not the tick rate afaik
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19:46<Arrowmaster>yeah i know its not related to counterstrike
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19:46*abrotman wonders if this is a homework project
19:46<Arrowmaster>it was just a really bad event and engraved in my memory
19:47<Arrowmaster>whinny bitches even complained the dj was distracting
19:47<cookta2012->what is the default time tick?
19:47<cookta2012->in us?
19:47<Arrowmaster>1000
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21:08<canaima>hola
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22:58-!-zykotick9 [~zykotick9@000191a8.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:59-!-Rcart [~rcart@190.92.27.54] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:00-!-pwr_ [~pwr@84.232.198.177] has joined #debian
23:00-!-iwtkwtlrinidt [~quassel@217.172.94.46] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
23:01-!-pyromancer [~smuxi@c-67-170-24-169.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
23:03-!-Saxman1 [~Saxman@p5B021753.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
23:03-!-Saxman is now known as Guest11376
23:03-!-Saxman1 is now known as Saxman
23:03-!-pyromancer [~smuxi@c-67-170-24-169.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #debian
23:03-!-Rcart [~rcart@190.92.27.54] has joined #debian
23:04-!-cads [~m@c-50-160-191-71.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #debian
23:05-!-Guest11376 [~Saxman@p5B02176A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:05-!-ananth123__ [~ananth@triband-mum-59.184.131.50.mtnl.net.in] has joined #debian
23:05-!-iwtkwtlrinidt [~quassel@217.172.94.46] has joined #debian
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23:08-!-TheBonsai [~thebonsai@p54B5A233.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:09-!-rvdv [~richard@0001c8b4.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
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23:16-!-a_muva [~a_muva@184.101.103.216] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:17-!-badiane1 [~gdurand@cpe-24-90-39-153.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
23:18-!-zwol [~zack@71.182.234.147] has quit [Quit: zwol]
23:18-!-TheBonsai [~thebonsai@p54B5A0AA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
23:19-!-dvs [~colin@00012127.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:19-!-iwtkwtlrinidt [~quassel@217.172.94.46] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:20-!-gusmuk [~gusmuk@176.31.145.157] has joined #debian
23:21-!-gusmuk [~gusmuk@176.31.145.157] has quit []
23:21-!-pedro [~prokter@a89-155-101-4.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:24-!-tiago_ [~tiago@bl5-224-237.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #debian
23:24-!-bluewater [~nautics-a@000127d1.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:25-!-ananth123 [~ananth@00014e40.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:26-!-rickbol [~rickbol@cpe-174-096-184-106.carolina.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:26-!-xragnar_ [~ragnar@f051137079.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #debian
23:26-!-xragnar is now known as Guest11377
23:26-!-xragnar_ is now known as xragnar
23:26-!-xragnar_ is "(unknown)" on (unknown)
23:26-!-rickbol [~rickbol@cpe-174-096-184-106.carolina.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
23:27-!-tiago` [~tiago@bl9-250-140.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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23:28-!-Guest11377 [~ragnar@x590dfd1d.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:29-!-ananth123 [~ananth@00014e40.user.oftc.net] has quit []
23:30-!-ElVillano [~Alberto@190.201.176.226] has joined #debian
23:31-!-hugg [~hugg@0001c951.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: quitting time]
23:31-!-ananth123 [~ananth@00014e40.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:31-!-ananth123__ [~ananth@triband-mum-59.184.131.50.mtnl.net.in] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:32-!-Rcart [~rcart@190.92.27.54] has quit [Quit: leaving]
23:33-!-Airwave [~Airwave@0001a5d2.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:33-!-sol [~sol@c-76-97-27-149.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:35-!-mpfusion_ [~mpfusion@xdsl-92-252-66-237.dip.osnanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:37-!-mode/#debian [+l 662] by debhelper
23:38-!-lostson [~lostson@cpe-107-10-81-229.new.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:39-!-aranax [~aranax@190.148.61.96] has joined #debian
23:39-!-ElVillano [~Alberto@190.201.176.226] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
23:39-!-lostson [~lostson@107.10.81.229] has joined #debian
23:40-!-KillYourTV [~kytv@00019721.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:40-!-KillYourTV [~kytv@00019721.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:43-!-schleppy [~Adium@68.4.37.68] has joined #debian
23:48-!-Airwave [~Airwave@0001a5d2.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:50-!-ananth123 [~ananth@00014e40.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:50-!-Zer0Traf [~Zer0Traf@67.51.245.62] has joined #debian
23:52-!-Zer0Traf [~Zer0Traf@67.51.245.62] has left #debian []
23:53-!-ananth123 [~ananth@00014e40.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
---Logclosed Fri May 23 00:00:28 2014