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#debian IRC Logs for 2014-09-28

---Logopened Sun Sep 28 00:00:29 2014
00:00-!-darkbasic [~quassel@niko.linuxsystems.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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02:05<Ptah>can anyone tell me if it will be possible to not have to use systemd in jessie ?
02:08-!-toto42 [~toto@2a02:908:f324:7780:2c1:26ff:fe06:2bf2] has joined #debian
02:08<centrx>Ptah, Yes the other init systems are available as an option
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02:08<centrx>Ptah, systemd is to be default in installer
02:09-!-teslasmhd [foobar@ipb2189098.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Quit: http://conglom-o.org/ ownz j00!]
02:09<centrx>Ptah, sysvinit and probably upstart too still available
02:09<centrx>Ptah, Though things like gnome tend to install a lot of systemd components, it's not necessary to use it as the init system
02:10<Ptah>centrx: ok thank you. Do you know if the alternatives will be be removed eventually ?
02:10<centrx>Ptah, That seems very unlikely, as long as there are maintainers willing to do the work
02:10<centrx>Ptah, and e.g. kfreebsd can't use systemd
02:11<Ptah>Excellent. Thank you for your time.
02:11<centrx>You're welcome
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02:20<tasaif>so the best speech to text software for debian?
02:21-!-fnordperfect [~fab@95.89.215.16] has joined #debian
02:22<tasaif>, oh humber debian overlords
02:22-!-malimbar [~malimbar0@108.222.208.92] has joined #debian
02:23<Ptah>tasaif: There are a few. espeak , festival and jovie come to mind
02:23<tasaif>other way around
02:24<tasaif>espeak is text to speech
02:25<Ptah>tasaif: sorry I misread that. There is one you can train for your voice . I can't recall the name
02:25<Ptah>I will have a look for it
02:25<tasaif>I can find it, I don't want you to exert yourself on my behalf
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02:26<tasaif>I was hoping someone had already tried to mess with speech recognition
02:26<tasaif>and could recommend one over the other
02:26<Krashed>ok, i have a noobish question, and its hard to explain, so i had to take a screenshot
02:26<Krashed>http://i.imgur.com/NpTBpqE.png
02:26-!-malimbar [~malimbar0@108.222.208.92] has left #debian []
02:26<Krashed>when i download themes off xfce-look, and apply them, they arent skinning my notification area
02:27<Krashed>some themes do... wondering what i have to modify to have my notification area and whisker-menu skinned with the same theme
02:27<Ptah>tasaif: It was simon I was thinking of. Here is a list of speech recognition software https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speech_recognition_software_for_Linux#Free_speech_recognition_engines
02:27<tasaif>ty <3
02:27-!-mypapit [~mypapit@175.140.5.67] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:28<Ptah>your welcome.
02:32<Ptah>Krashed: I think you have to set the panel background for the notification area and the icons. This covers installing window and gtk themes and icons https://wiki.xfce.org/howto/install_new_themes
02:32<Kironide>has anyone been having networking problems after upgrading an installation of debian testing
02:32-!-teslasmhd [foobar@ipb2189098.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian
02:33<Krashed>yea, but Ptahm as you see, my panel IS themed, just not the notify area
02:35-!-jalalsfs [~jalal@0001afc5.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:36<bremner>Kironide: try #debian-next for testing support
02:36<Kironide>ok
02:36<bremner>let me rephrase that. Try asking in one channel at a time.
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02:39<tasaif>so unfortunately, Simon uses KDE
02:39<tasaif>but, I think they use something called julius in the back
02:39<tasaif>so, I'm gonna see what julius is about
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02:40<tasaif>julius looks scary and intimidating
02:40<tasaif>but it's not his fault, he was born that way
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02:48<helmut_>hi
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05:31<vore>hmm
05:31<vore>strange...
05:31<vore>ecchoooooooooo
05:31<vore>(echooo ecooo ecooo)
05:32<mongrol>r
05:32<vore>wow a person
05:32<mongrol>no, just ascii
05:32<vore>you know, debian used to be a very lively place
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05:33<vore>at all hours
05:33<vore>now... nope
05:33<vore>I wonder what transpired
05:34<mongrol>must be too stable
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05:34<petn-randall>vore: You already said that in the other channel, do you have a support question?
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05:34<petn-randall>vore: Also, please refrain from crossposting.
05:34<vore>yes, I would like to uninstall systemd.
05:34<vore>I don't know how to do this
05:34<vore>I didn't want it to begin with
05:35<vore>It is not what I know.
05:35<vore>It's not, how you say, "linux"
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05:35<petn-randall>!enter
05:35<dpkg>The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
05:36<vore>petn-randall: will you help me purge systemd from my system?
05:36<petn-randall>vore: Are you using wheezy?
05:36<vore>jessie
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05:36<petn-randall>vore: wrong channel then, and no.
05:37<petn-randall>!jessie
05:37<vore>I upgraded from wheezy and suddenly was systemd'd
05:37<dpkg>The release following Debian 7 "Wheezy" is codenamed "Jessie" (the cowgirl in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 8.0. It is the current <testing> distribution. Use the #debian-next channel on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net) for support. http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2012/07/msg00004.html . See also <jessie alpha>, <jessie freeze>.
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05:37<vore>why won't you help me?
05:37<vore>I want a jessie without that danmable crap
05:37<mongrol>read
05:37<vore>yes but I'll be forced to use jessie if I want debian on newer hardware
05:38<mongrol>you're in the wrong channel for jessie support.
05:38<vore>so I need to learn how to expuge the filth from the whore of an OS
05:38<vore>(jessie is the girl puppet in Toy Story)
05:38<vore>she needs to be cleaned up
05:39<peter1138>go to #debian-next
05:39<petn-randall>!ops vore, the troll from the last few days
05:39<dpkg>Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly: petn-randall complains about: vore, the troll from the last few days
05:39<vore>wheezy was a fairly respectable linux, with some minor viruses here and there, logind, dbus, etc
05:39<vore>and if wheezy were to be forked once jessie becomes stable I would prefer to stay with wheezy
05:39<vore>but I don't think that will happen
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05:40<vore>have you considered continuing wheezy, and not jumping on to jessie?
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05:40<vore>it would be a natural inflection point
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05:40<vore>worthless users would still get to have the old style linux they loved
05:41<vore>while people that like systemd/gnome3/wayland and whatever else unorthodox refuse could go with jessie
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05:47<ansgar>vore: Not working on Chaosesque today?
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05:53<vore>ansgar: you don't understand how to avoid burnout do you?
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05:56<vore>ansgar: I'm guessing you're talking about some linux software
05:56<vore>I would NEVER code linux software
05:56<vore>wouldn't be caught dead doing that
05:57<vore>linux is garbage now
05:57<vore>it has been taken over by faggots
05:57<vore>who have drummed up a whirlwind of code churn
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06:21<achintya>hey guys i have to return my notebook, which came without an os, to the company for a replacemnt. Now since i have installed onl ubuntu on this, could anyone guide me on th steps to un-install it?
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07:44<fr33domlover>Hello! I've been setting an HTTP proxy (to use privoxy) using Networkmanager GUI. I'd like to remove Networkmanager and still have the setting. I run several servers on this machine, so it's important they see the proxy settings as soon as they would with Networkmanager running. Where should I put the proxy settings? Is it enough to use /etc/environment? Or, can I use the proxy properties GUI provided by MATE?
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07:45<DNS>since when is mate in debian?
07:46<DNS>see it the 1st time heh
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07:47<fr33domlover>DNS, I use MATE from debian-backports
07:48<DNS>yea i see
07:48<wompa>DNS, since June or May even
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07:58<wompa>fr33domlover, yes, that seems to be the case for clients https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2009/08/msg00710.html
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07:59<fr33domlover>wompa, thanks, I saw that too
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08:00<fr33domlover>unfortunately it says nothing about things that run before login
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08:24<fr33domlover>Hmmm when the proxy config GUI changes the proxy in GSettings, suddenly the environment variables e.g. http_proxy changes too
08:24<fr33domlover>what does that?
08:25<fr33domlover>(is there a way to see a history of environment changes)
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08:46<Ryccardo>I know in Ubuntu there's a dedicated package that does that, something like ubuntu-settings-daemon
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09:02<agus>hola
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09:03<agustina>holas
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09:30<abc1234567>anyone know how to change things on an iso so that when you boot the live session your changes are default? Like, if I wanted to change the default wallpaper
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09:32<abc1234567>sriram, can you please send that again?
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09:34<wompa>abc1234567, are you using Debian live?
09:35<abc1234567>wompa, crunchbang
09:35<sriram>abc u r from
09:36<abc1234567>whois debian abc1234567
09:36<sriram>abc1234567 u from
09:36<wompa>abc1234567, then you have to ask the Crunchbang bunch
09:36<abc1234567>ok. wasn't trying to advertise. that's why I changed the nick ;)
09:36<abc1234567>bye
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10:40<anonymous>hello
10:40<anonymous>hey, guys
10:41<anonymous>Go hacking USA web sites ?
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10:41<anonymous>ninkotech
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11:17<Viande>Hello
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11:21<Viande>I have a problem with my connection with one of my laptop and maybe you'll be able to help me. I can connect to internet only after using the command "route add default gw 192.168.1.1" (as root)
11:22<Viande>How can I stop doing it ?
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11:27<grummund>Hi, GSM SIM card dongle presents itself as "pl2303 converter now attached to ttyUSB0" in dmesg
11:28<grummund>can someone suggest what software is needed to read contacts from the SIM?
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11:54<Ryccardo>pl2303 is a generic serial to USB adapter, in fact I have somewhere a circuit diagram for a SIM to serial adapter
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11:56<Ryccardo>grummund: if it's actually a direct interface that leaves card communication to the software, this miiiight help http://www.ladyada.net/make/simreader/download.html
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11:59<pillow>i updated debian. how can i know if the shellshock is fixed. is it possible to check that via terminal?
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12:01<p0rk0ff>pillow: just search how to test for it
12:01<sney>!shellshock
12:01<dpkg>The vulnerability in bash has been fixed for <wheezy> and <squeeze-lts>. https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2014-6271 and https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2014-7169
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12:29<pillow>p0rk0ff, thanks env x='() { :;}; echo vulnerable' bash -c "echo this is a test"
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12:40<grummund>Ryccardo: thank you
12:40<pillow>gnome desktop environment version i have is 3.4.2 (and not the one with the dock) . i am using the debian in a virtual machine. so i think maybe it is using dockless menu type because of lack of 2d acceleration. is that so?
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12:53<pillow>is 3.4.2 most supported gnome version in debian right now? is it more secure than 3.12 ?
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13:04<pillow>is there debian gnome jira with changelog, known issues etc? somewhere i could see which all gnome versions have security issues etc?
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13:05<pillow>oh got it https://wiki.debian.org/Gnome
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13:08<somiaj>pillow: debian security tries to backport security fixes, but there is a page you can check out for known CSV's and which versions of debian's packages are fixed.
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13:10<somiaj>pillow: https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/status/release/stable -- I don't see any gnome packages being mentiond for vulns, but if you have CVE you can look it up there to see if debian has it fixed or not
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13:11<pillow>somiaj, thanks for the link. so gnome 4.2 is more about stability than security.
13:11<pillow>*3.4
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13:13<somiaj>stable in debian means frozen more than it means stable/secure. But one of the advantage of a frozen system is it is a frozen target to fix issues, so before the release all release crittical bugs were fixed (hence stable as possible at the time to a reasonable expectation) and thougout the life of the release the security team address cve's and other security issues and the core team fixes some bugs deemed severe enough as well.
13:13<klemvor>#debian-next
13:14<somiaj>frozen systems have lots of advantages the main disavantage desktpusers run into is no new features, so if you need a feature not in gnome 3.4 you won't get it in stable.
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13:17<dzan>hi, quick question: I googled extensively about installing debian (unstable) on the latest macbook air but I read a ton of different ways and I think most outdated
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13:17<dzan>did anyone do it recently? I want to do it without "refind"
13:17<dzan>so Apple EFI -> GRUB
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13:18<dzan>question= do you know a list of steps on what to do after install? to fix the booting?
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13:21<default>hey guys, anyone know how i can get emacs24 in debian?
13:21<default>i've enabled SID repos, but apparently the package is broken. i don't think it's broken my end either
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13:24<default>how do i report this to whoever is in charge of maintaining the packages?
13:24<somiaj>default: do not mix sid and stable packages
13:24<default>i haven't
13:25<somiaj>default: basically if something is not in stable (a frozen) system you need to look for a backport (newer software built against the stable libaries)
13:25<somiaj>sometimes they are provided for you, in this case I belive you don't have to do much
13:25<somiaj>,v emacs24
13:25<judd>Package: emacs24 on i386 -- wheezy-backports: 24.3+1-4~bpo70+1; jessie: 24.3+1-5; sid: 24.3+1-5
13:25<somiaj>!tell default about wheezy-backports
13:25<default>yeah its there in backports
13:25<default>but if you try to download it
13:25<default>it says its broken
13:25<default>this isn't a local issue with my system
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13:26<somiaj>what do you mean download it? did you just download the .deb or did you add wheezy-backports to your sources.list file so it can also get any depends it needs from backports as well?
13:26<default>i added backports to sources
13:26<default>package emacs24-nox has unmet dependencies
13:26<default>as such will not be installed
13:26<somiaj>did you install it with apt-get -t wheezy-backports emacs24-nox after you apt-get update with the new sources
13:27<default>i did all that except -t
13:27<default>what's the -t do
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13:28<somiaj>wheezy-backports is pinned lower than stable (so you don't automatically upgrade to backport versions), one side effect of this is you need to explicity tell apt to use wheezy-backports for depends if needed
13:28<somiaj>whcih is what the -t does
13:28<default>i see, let me try that hang on
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13:28<default>do i need to put "install" in that line after backports?
13:29<somiaj>yes, if I forgot it sorry
13:29<default>np just making sure
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13:31<default>it now appears to be downloading
13:31<default>so i think that has done it, thanks a lot!
13:32<somiaj>yup, that is just the small detail you were missing, should work fine now. (:
13:32<default>thanks very much for the prompt and insightful responses
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13:38<pillow>somiaj, thanks
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13:40<dzan>no tips on the macbook thing? :)
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13:41<somiaj>dzan: the best way to install stable is to use the stable netinstall image from wheezy (this does support efi -- though sometimes apples need some special love after the install to make bootable). After you install a minimial base system (do not install desktop or much additional software) change your sources from 'wheezy' to 'sid' and then dist-upgrade, after you pgrade the base system you can then install the packages you need from unstable
13:42<somiaj>dzan: oh missed that you already did that, check the wiki under macbook, there are some tips, depending on the generation you use is what you need, most involve setting a kernel flag in /etc/default/grub
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13:43<somiaj>dzan: and ment best way to install unstable there, typo, I am good at those. (:
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13:44<dzan>somiaj: thanks! I indeed know how to install unstable :p
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13:44<dzan>somiaj: but all the info i find on dualboot feels outdated
13:44<dzan>i'm just wondering if the most recent version can just do it right without fixups
13:45<dzan>if you just install grub like normally is it EFI compatible and does it work with mac ( was looking for someone wo might have tried it recently )
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13:48<Ryccardo>dazi: from what I know, at some point in 2013 Apple updated their EFI implementation
13:48<somiaj>dzan: yea the wheezy install will install the efi and grub-efi just fine, but the machine may not boot without modifying the /etc/default/grub to include what ever kernel paramater your macbook needs. as far as I know this is not detected or automatic.
13:48<Ryccardo>grub-efi-amd64 worked well even on 2011s
13:48<dzan>somiaj: as long as it boots one of the OS'es i'm fine :p need the laptop tomorrow so can't afford to screw it up too bad
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13:49<dzan>Ryccardo: updated to make it sane/compatible? :)
13:49<dzan>Ryccardo: oh you mean it doesn't work anymore by default
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13:49<Ryccardo>dzan: your version can boot Win8 with audio working and mine can't ;)
13:49<somiaj>dzan: one thing to note about the debian installer on wheezy is it can boot efi or legacy, maek sure you boot it in efi mode (though Id on't think you have a choice with mac's on this)
13:49<dzan>maybe I should just give in and use the extra 'reFind' bootloader
13:50<dzan>Ryccardo: want to trade? :p
13:50<Ryccardo>soldered RAM? no way :)
13:50<dzan>somiaj: you can actually choose so good tip :)
13:50<dzan>Ryccardo: macbook AIR right?
13:50<dzan>Ryccardo: i don't know much about them, I was forced to use one wouldn't have bought it myself
13:50<Ryccardo>nah, I have a Pro (but the EFI compatibility doesn't change between pros and airs)
13:51<dzan>oh i see
13:52<dzan>i'm just gonna try and see what it does then
13:52<dzan>worst case I think is it does just keep booting mac osx
13:52<dzan>wow the efi installer is high res
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13:53<Ryccardo>dd the iso to an usb drive, turn the power on while holding Option and you'll see 2 (yes, two) "EFI Boot" options with the yellow external drive icon, both should be the same
13:53<dzan>yes i'm installing as we speak :p
13:53<dzan>thats why i noticed it being higher resolution
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13:57<Ryccardo>and hope your wifi card isn't the 4331 :)
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13:57<dzan>Ryccardo: it is ofc
13:57<dzan>i'm lucky that way
13:58<dzan>Ryccardo: just installing without internet adn then sideloadign the driver and updating the system I guess?
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14:00<Ryccardo>yeah, you can choose between the open b43 driver (still requires firmware, easiest way is to use *Ubuntu's* firmware-linux-nonfree) or Broadcom's own wl (from my experience doesn't work on kernel 3.15+)
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14:02<dzan>Ryccardo: thanks for the advice, so you recommend the ubuntu deb?
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14:03<Ryccardo>Debian's firmware-linux-nonfree is the same as Ubuntu's... but without b43, for some reason
14:03<Ryccardo>(well, it's Ubuntu that expands on Debian)
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14:07<dzan>Ryccardo: ok as expected after install no option which os to boot on boot
14:07<somiaj>we aren't allowed to distrube the b43 I think, and it needs to be cut from the windows driver. Not sure why debian seems to go though this, but I bet there is some licensing issue or what not
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14:07<sney>yeah, the b43-fwcutter package automates the process of downloading it from broadcom etc, not unlike the flashplugin-nonfree package does for adobe flash
14:09<Ryccardo>sney: too bad the b43-firmware-installer checks a PCI ID whitelist which doesn't contain the 4331 (not to mention it obviously prevents installing the driver offline)
14:09<Ryccardo>yes, I made my own package because of this ;)
14:09<duglas>I have just done a reinstall of Wheezy, it was a struggle but I managed to avoid pulseaudio. The only things left to install is The Gimp and Skype. Now I have to teach my grandson to use Email, and figure out how to install gimp.
14:10<Ryccardo>duglas: bad news -- skype 4.3+ requires pulseaudio
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14:11<dzan>so if I understand correctly, debian/grub create a good EFI partition but the mac doesn't know where to look and pick his own Ryccardo ?
14:12<duglas>Ryccardo, pulse is what started this marathon.
14:13<Ryccardo>dzan: you already have an EFI partition and GRUB did the "right thing" by adding itself to the bootables list, but Apple's EFI implementation doesn't allow you to manually select from that list (the thing you see while holding Option is another thing)
14:14<dzan>Ryccardo: oh oké, the existing Apple EFI partition is adapted as it should, nice
14:14<dzan>so the solution people have is to remove it and recreate the whole partition from linux
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14:14<dzan>conforming the EFI standards
14:14<dzan>I could have guessed it was Apple being "special" again...
14:15<Ryccardo>dzan: best thing to do is to immediately copy /boot/efi/EFI/debian/grubx64.efi as /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi so that you'll have GRUB as "EFI boot" in Apple's boot selector (and Mac OS will still appear there because it's independent from the EFI partition)
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14:16<dzan>Ryccardo: if you don't have time for this just tell me but i'm trying to understand instead of just do it :D so you have Apple Firmware -> apple EFI -> mac os x?
14:16<dzan>but the apple efi doesn't show
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14:17<dzan>so the changes don't help
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14:17<dzan>and you suggest copying the grub one to use instead of apple one?
14:18<Ryccardo>standard EFI can find a bootloader in 2 ways: EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi (assuming x64 firmware of course) + a bootorder list
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14:19<Ryccardo>the thing that runs when you hold Option ignores that list, it only recognizes bootx64 (on EFI partitions) and the set bootloader (on HFS partitions)
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14:20<Ryccardo>when you installed Mac OS, it marked /System/Library/CoreServices/boot.efi as the bootloader for its HFS partition -- and in the bootorder list, but only the first part is required to appear in the "Option menu"
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14:21<Ryccardo>GRUB installs to its own folder in the EFI partition and registers as a bootloader, which makes it boot but doesn't mean it'll appear in the boot picker (so if you reset PRAM, clearing the bootorder, you won't be able to run GRUB)
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14:22<Ryccardo>copying it to bootx64 just makes it appear in "the Option list", and then you'll be able to use it as a practical OS selector
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14:23<dzan>Ryccardo: thanks! i'm reading it a second time while installing fuse4osx ;)
14:24<dzan>ext4fuse it was
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14:37<pillow>somiaj, which is the most supported irc client for debian? kvirc (i saw some security updates cve list 2008 in kvirc)?
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14:41<sney>pillow: what do you mean by "most supported"? most current updates?
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14:42<somiaj>pillow: any in stable should be supported for security issues. But some of them are also backported for newer version. I really don't know much about irc clients and irssi does the job I need for me.
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14:43<sney>most current/active development is probably irssi for console and hexchat for gui
14:43<pillow>sney, like most people looking into the source code. or most secure.
14:43<pillow>sney, yeah most active dev.
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14:44<Ryccardo>xchat has a warning pissing you off if you ran it as superuser ;)
14:44-!-schinderhannes [~schinderh@95.88.221.211] has joined #debian
14:44<sney>(hexchat, despite being a gtk client, integrates pretty cleanly with kde if you also install gtk2-engines-oxygen)
14:48<sney>the most common security complaint about hexchat is that its default CTCP VERSION reply shows your arch and kernel version as well as the client version. this is trivial to turn off, so upstream usually just makes fun of people who complain about it
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14:49<pillow>sney, oh thanks.
14:50<sney>np
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14:51<Cylus>HexChat doesn't integrate with Xfce all that well.
14:51<Cylus>It's also not in Debian Stable.
14:51<pillow>Cylus, hexchat is not in debian stable?
14:51-!-xjuan [~xjuan@host36.186-124-247.telecom.net.ar] has joined #debian
14:51<sney>it's in wheezy-backports and if you find that the backports version doesn't integrate with xfce, please file a bug
14:52<Cylus>For example, if you set your preferred browser in Xfce, HexChat will ignore it.
14:52<Cylus>pillow: Not last I checked. I'll check again though.
14:52<sney>it wasn't available in debian yet when wheezy was released so -backports was the only option once hexchat did get into the archive
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14:53<Cylus>pillow: Nope, still not here in Stable. It's in backports though as sney said.
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14:55<sney>Cylus: do you have gvfs-bin installed?
14:55-!-bluewater [~nautics-a@000127d1.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
14:55<Cylus>sney: On this system? No. But on the one that I tried to use HexChat on I did.
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14:56<Cylus>I kill my system a lot though and have to reinstall. I'm one of those people who likes to poke at things, but doesn't know what he's actually doing.
14:57<sney>was that a package you built yourself? was it from glebihan's ubuntu ppa?
14:57<sney>etc
14:57<sney>I'm the hexchat maintainer so if something is broken I wanna know about it
14:57<Cylus>sney: It was one I got from the HexChat site. It was either a repo or a .deb file, I forget.
14:58<sney>oh, their hunk of junk monolithic deb... ok. crisis averted
14:58<Cylus>Well, if you're a HexChat developer, I'll test it again on my other laptop.
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14:58<sney>yeah if you have the time to test your issues with the debian package I would appreciate taht
14:58<Cylus>Oh, so the .deb file is known to be broken? That's probably it then.
14:59<Cylus>Okay, deal. I'm waiting for a video to load anyway, I might as well test wile I wait.
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15:01<Cylus>Great ... The battery is dead and half of my power cord is missing ....
15:01<Cylus>I'll keep looking for it, but no promises.
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15:02<dzan>Ryccardo: my /boot/efi folder is empty ..
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15:02<sney>the .deb that was previously distributed on hexchat.org was made by a fedora developer with no real knowledge of debian packaging, so it just kind of worked and they were pretty happy when debian started distributing a real package.
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15:02<sney>Cylus: ok. no rush really, if you find the problem just report it with bugreport
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15:03<Ryccardo>sney: while experimenting with Arch Linux, I remember something recommending "exo-open" "for XFCE compatibility" along with other choices for the other major desktops, not sure if it's useful
15:03<Ryccardo>probably firefox
15:03-!-jalalsfs [~jalal@0001afc5.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:03<sney>yeah, various apps use different things. some others use xdg-utils. for hexchat it's gvfs-bin
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15:04<Chilibird>Does anybody have any experience with getting debian-installer to load firmware files when booted from USB? I downloaded the netinst+non-free firmware ISO, but it fails to load the firmware files when I ask it to
15:04<dzan>hmm also no vmlinuz...efi.signed
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15:05<Ryccardo>dzan: is the EFI partition mounted? when installing, did you select it in the partitions list and mark it "use partition for/EFI boot"?
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15:06<dzan>Ryccardo: I booted a live disk to copy the file you said because I can't boot in the installed debian system and ext4 on mac osx... didn't work out
15:07<dzan>Ryccardo: I'm checking the ext4 partition of the debian system I installed... the /boot/efi not the mac EFI partition.. is that wrong?
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15:08<Ryccardo>aha, you'll have to mount the EFI partition somewhere
15:08<Ryccardo>it should be /dev/sda1
15:08<dzan>Ryccardo: oh oke, I didn't know I thought it would have been onthe other one
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15:09<dzan>http://heeris.id.au/2014/ubuntu-plus-mac-pure-efi-boot/#manual-boot was also trying that but I dont have the efi signed kernel image
15:09<Ryccardo>so, let's say, `mount /dev/sda1 /mnt && mkdir -p /mnt/EFI/BOOT && cp /mnt/EFI/debian/grubx64.efi /mnt/EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi && umount /mnt`
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15:10<Ryccardo>Debian doesn't installed the signed bootloader by default, and you don't need one anyways
15:10<dzan>yup I have the debian=grubx64.efi file :-)
15:10<Ryccardo>"that the Mac bootloader expects the EFI partition to be formatted as HFS+" from that website is also a lie, at least for current models
15:11<dzan>good to know :-) I'll try fixing the whole thing as it should be but for now the mac bootloader -> (efi option) grub -> linux is fine
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15:14<dzan>Ryccardo: thanks! that was pretty stupid of me :D was looking on my ext4 partition ofc it has to be the EFI one
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15:15<Cylus>Um. Synaptic is refusing to let me add "deb http://http.debian.net/debian wheezy-backports main" as a source .... I'll try from my other system, I don't know how much I broke that one last time. I use it as a test machine these days, because I can't use it as a working machine because of the graphical glitches (caused by lack of free firmware available).
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15:17<abrotman>You can always use vi
15:17<jo>Hi, I have flashplugin-nonfree installed and I just ran update-flashplugin-nonfree --install to get the latest version, and restarted iceweasel ... However, I'm still getting an error from a website (in iceweasel) saying that "You need to download the latest version of Adobe Flash Player (11.7) to view this site ...
15:18<jo>does update-flashplugin-nonfree not give me the latest version?
15:18<Cylus>Adobe abandoned you, jo. They do not make the latest version available to Debain users. All you get is an outdated version that they never took down.
15:19<jo>Yes, I just discovered that from the debian wiki ... well, that's shitty
15:19<Cylus>Alas, if they made the source code available, the latest version could be ported to be made work on Debian ....
15:19<sney>chromium/pepperflashplugin-nonfree gets 12.something
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15:21<Ryccardo>jo: sney: it'll be a long story, see http://www.webupd8.org/2014/05/fresh-player-plugin-pepper-flash.html
15:21<dzan>Ryccardo: you know what I mean :) I want grub when I turn the machine on :p
15:21<dzan>oh sorry old message
15:21<dzan>btw, this will do the trick right? http://packages.ubuntu.com/precise/all/firmware-b43-installer/download
15:22<Ryccardo>dzan: use this one http://packages.ubuntu.com/trusty/all/linux-firmware-nonfree/download
15:24<Ryccardo>and be prepared for occasionally losing connectivity until you reselect the network in networkmanager (or in worst cases reload the b43 module)... so much for being the worst known card by the b43 developers
15:24<dzan>ah shit
15:24<dzan>and this is still better than broadcoms own driver?
15:24<Ryccardo>yes and no
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15:25<Ryccardo>b43 supports monitor mode, wl doesn't
15:25<Ryccardo>wl has less dropouts, but allegedly has problems with hidden ssid networks
15:25<dzan>hmm but no using hidden ssid or monitor
15:25<Ryccardo>I can't get wl to work on 3.15+, no wifi card appears in /dev
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15:25<dzan>ot*
15:25<dzan>oh yes you told me
15:25<dzan>ok
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15:26<muhasinbabu007>hi
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15:29<dzan>oh wicd is no longer being developped, didn't know that
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15:31<Ryccardo>still works fine for me, not that it needed new features
15:32<Cylus>Link test: <https://debian.org/>
15:32<Ryccardo>and guarantees not starting to require systemd out of the blue ;)
15:32-!-badiane1 [~gdurand@cpe-24-193-80-159.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
15:33<Cylus_II>Default browser is set to IceWeasel, but HexChat opens links in Midori.
15:33<devil>Ryccardo: is it bashing-systemd-day again?
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15:34<Ryccardo>devil: you mean it isn't a day that lasts +∞ days? :P
15:35<dzan>who doesn't provide an usb->ethernet when shipping a laptop without ethernet ffs
15:35<dzan>Ryccardo: if it doesnt require systemd it's not cool :p
15:35<dzan>i'm sure someone will contribute a patch to fix that :p
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15:37<devil>*sigh*
15:37<Cylus_II>Okay, odd. After setting the default browser, then setting it back, HexChat reads it correctly.
15:37<Cylus>sney: ^
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15:37<dzan>Ryccardo: what did you do? guess you didn't start out minimal? ( don't even have iwconfig and tools )
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15:40<sney>Cylus: thanks
15:40<Cylus>Now the only issue I know of is the one where HexChat uses the same string for the <user> part of the <user>@<host> identifier as it does for the user name in SASL identification. Doing such make it impossible to use SASL (because my <user> has a dot in it, wile IRC disalows that in nicks), locking me out of Freenode (because Freenod has a moronic policy requiring Tor users to use SASL to reach the network).
15:41<sney>there is some sasl stuff being updated for 2.12.0, so I would wait until that's released and uploaded and then try it again
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15:42<Cylus>sney: Sweet. It would be awesome if I could switch to HexChat once it hits Debian Stable. XChat is nice, but it's kind of discontinued (read: outdated) now.
15:42-!-Se-bash [~seba@host105.186-124-185.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:42<sney>indeed. since 2010 even
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16:08<dzan>I need to install dkms without havign an internet connection and my biggest usb drive is 4GB... anyone knows if I can install it from one of the 3 dvd images? or are the dependencies all over?
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16:09<valdyn>!b-e dzan
16:09<dpkg>dzan: Sounds like you need to aptitude install build-essential.
16:09<abrotman>the dkms framework? it's probably on the first DVD
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16:09<abrotman>what app/driver are you trying to use with dkms?
16:09<valdyn>dzan: try ^^
16:09<monod>hello, in KDE I tried to install a widget, "minimalist clock", but when I go and place it on the desktop, an error message says a module is not installed. The module is org.kde.plasma.extras. How do I install it?
16:10<monod>(google didn't help me much, I tried it)
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16:11<dzan>valdyn: how will build-essential help me? I have no internet :p so i do have a compiler on the netinstall iso but it's not the 'gcc' packages and so on so I can't install a dkms.deb
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16:11<dzan>abrotman: thanks i'll test dvd1
16:11<valdyn>dzan: if you alreasdy have b-e then dkms does not add alot of depends
16:11<dzan>valdyn: I don't have them :-)
16:12<valdyn>dzan: then you might need alot more packages
16:12<dzan>valdyn: that's the issue, otherwise i'd just install the dkms.deb and one or two deps but
16:12<abrotman>if yuou have DVD1, you have b-e and dkms
16:12<abrotman>wtf is dkms.deb?
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16:12<dzan>abrotman: didn't want to type out the whole name
16:12<dzan>just the package on an usb stick
16:13<abrotman>dzan: do you have DVD1?
16:13<abrotman>did you install from DVD1?
16:13<dzan>abrotman: downloading it as we speak
16:13<dzan>abrotman: no I did a netinstall
16:13<dzan>without the net :p
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16:16<Ryccardo>dzan: you're installing jessie or what?
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16:20<dzan>Ryccardo: end goal is sid
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16:21<Ryccardo>but you used the installer for wheezy or jessie?
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16:23*abrotman doesn't see how this matters relating to needing DKMS
16:23<dzan>Ryccardo: jessie
16:23<Ryccardo>abrotman: he's probably going for broadcom-sta-dkms
16:23<dzan>Ryccardo: yes
16:23<dzan>Ryccardo: the one you linked doesn't work for my chipset apparently
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16:23<dzan>4360
16:24<abrotman>!bcm4360
16:24<dpkg>The Broadcom BCM4360 (PCI IDs 14e4:43a0, 14e4:4360) is an 802.11ac (a/b/g/n compatible) wireless LAN chip, found in the MacBookAir6,1 (11") and MacBookAir6,2 (13") mid 2013 laptops. Supported by Broadcom's proprietary driver since version 6.30.223.126 (packaged in Debian <testing> as broadcom-sta). There is currently no mainline Linux kernel driver supporting BCM4360-based devices.
16:24<Ryccardo>and what kernel are you running now?
16:25<dzan>3.16.3-2
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16:26<Ryccardo>hmmm, it's not in the repos, but if you get the headers yourself I could try to pack the debs for dkms
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16:27<abrotman>wtf ..
16:27<dzan>Ryccardo: it's oke i'll try the DVD :-) thanks for the offer!
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16:29<Ryccardo>well, to install dkms (without Recommends:) you need >>libc6-dev gcc g++ make fakeroot gnupg gnupg2 gpgv gpgv2 binutils base-files patch bzip2 libdpkg-perl module-init-tools coreutils dkms broadcom-sta-dkms
16:29<dzan>let's hope it's all on DVD1 ( writing the iso to usb atm )
16:29<abrotman>Ryccardo: please let him just use the DVD
16:30<Ryccardo>dkms is all on dvd 1 (at least for 7.6.0) indeed
16:30<Ryccardo>broadcom-sta-dkms itself isn't, being part of non-free
16:31<abrotman>...
16:31<dzan>thanks a lot for you help Ryccardo :)
16:31<dzan>writing the usb takes a while i'll be off
16:31<dzan>i'll get it working eventually :p
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16:51<Kureyslii>EUZUBILLAHIMINEÞÞEYTANIRRACIM BISMILLAHIRRAHMANIRRAHIM
16:51<Kureyslii>ALLAHU EKBERRRRR! LA ÝLAHE ÝLLALLAH MUHAMMEDEN RESULULLAH!
16:51<Kureyslii>END TIMES hadith
16:51<Kureyslii>There comes a time, then the Muslims do today if I did that one-tenth of worship, is freed from the punishment of the Hereafter. Prophet Muhammad s.a.v.
16:51<Kureyslii>A time it commanded you that you are leaving one-tenth of the world would be destroyed. Then it will come a time when he commanded the self gets rid of that one-tenth of Muhammad pbuh
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16:54<Bliepo>Hey everyone, I have a raspberry pi (model B+) with a USB to ethernet dongle connected to it. I want the raspberry pi to act as a sort of "VPN on the go". So you connect the raspberry pi to a network on one side, the device you want tunneled on the other and the pi takes care of the VPN connection. I already managed to set up the VPN connection, but I don't know how I "share" it.
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16:56<ReVoLt112>Bliepo: can you msg me?
16:56<abrotman>ReVoLt112: you haven't asked a question
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16:57<abrotman>Bliepo: what are you sharing it with?
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16:57<Bliepo>Well, it's a N300A IP
16:58<valdyn>!masq
16:58<dpkg>Network Address Translation (NAT) modifies IP address information in packet headers during transit across a router. IP masquerading is a form of NAT. Install the <iptables> package, then read http://tldp.org/HOWTO/IP-Masquerade-HOWTO/ and http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Masquerading-Simple-HOWTO/ for more information. Related Debian packages include <arno-iptables-firewall>, <ferm>, <iptables-persistent>.
16:58<valdyn>Bliepo: maybe you want a dhcp server on that pi ?
16:59<valdyn>!nat
16:59<dpkg>Network Address Translation (NAT) modifies IP address information in packet headers during transit across a router. IP masquerading is a form of NAT. Install the <iptables> package, then read http://tldp.org/HOWTO/IP-Masquerade-HOWTO/ and http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Masquerading-Simple-HOWTO/ for more information. Related Debian packages include <arno-iptables-firewall>, <ferm>, <iptables-persistent>.
16:59<valdyn>damn
16:59<Bliepo>I think so
16:59<valdyn>Bliepo: dnsmasq can do that for you, but that wasnt really your question
17:00<Bliepo>I'll take a look at dnsmasq
17:00<valdyn>Bliepo: you need ip masquerading for the connected client(s), probably
17:00<valdyn>Bliepo: if you dont need that, then you just need to enable ip forwarding
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17:01<Bliepo>valdyn, I'll read up on masquerading
17:01<valdyn>Bliepo: as to those 2 possibilities, I cant tell which one you need. You must know.
17:01<valdyn>( of course masquerading also needs ip forwarding anyway )
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17:02<qwk>hey, why do u guys ban tor nodes?
17:03<abrotman>because tor is heavily abused
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17:07<qwk>abrotman: cant u give some trusted people the ability to use it?
17:07-!-glebihan [~glebihan@89-92-63-176.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #debian
17:07<abrotman>Why should you be trusted?
17:08<qwk>Im I speak generelly
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17:08<qwk>remove "IM"
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17:36<qwk>hi, how do I find out which dekstop manager I got?
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17:38<Ryccardo>qwk: you could check which package Provides: x-display-manager
17:38<Ryccardo>as for which one you're actually using if you have more than one, you'll have to check what's enabled in your init
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17:42<abrotman>qwk: cat /etc/X11/default-display-manager
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17:48<qwk>thanks aboudreault
17:48<qwk>abrotman: *
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17:52<qwk>it is possible to check in the applications meny where any program points to
17:52<qwk>when I left/right click its just open the program
17:52<qwk>in gdm3
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18:21<Argyle>just installed debian and chromium-browser, cant get flash to work using pepperflashplugin
18:21<Argyle>flash works with ice weasel
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18:22<Argyle>any ideas?
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18:23<abrotman>Argyle: update the pepper plugin
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18:24<Argyle>done still get shockwave yellowbar on vids :(
18:25<Argyle>as in run update-pepperflashplugin --install
18:25<Argyle>?
18:28<Brigo>arges, did you install the package pepperflashplugin-nonfree ?
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18:29<Argyle>yes
18:30<Argyle>had to add backports to sources list
18:30<Brigo>Argyle, can you launch chromium-browser from a term and paste the error about a flash?=
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18:33<Argyle>[86:86:0928/233259:ERROR:ppapi_thread.cc(276)] Failed to load Pepper module from /usr/lib/pepperflashplugin-nonfree/libpepflashplayer.so (error: /usr/lib/pepperflashplugin-nonfree/libpepflashplayer.so: cannot open shared object file: Permission denied)
18:34<abrotman>does that file exist? ls -l /usr/lib/pepperflashplugin-nonfree/libpepflashplayer.so
18:34<abrotman>(as the user trying to run teh browser)
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18:35<Argyle>it exists
18:35<Argyle>owned by root
18:35<stojic>there is a thread on this issue at https://lists.debian.org/debian-backports/2014/09/msg00046.html . Basically, /usr/lib/pepperflashplugin-nonfree/libpepflashplayer.so from an older pepperflash player is needed with newer versions of chromium
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18:37<Argyle>ah so i should go find the archive of an older version then just replace the file?
18:37<Argyle>so anything less than 15.0.0.152
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18:38<stojic>Argyle: Yes, and keep the file handy because each time you run /usr/sbin/update-pepperflashplugin-nonfree --install you will get the new non-working version of the file. This sucks for security but I see no other options.
18:38<Brigo>yes, i remember it now.
18:39<Argyle>god i hope this gets fixed
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18:39<Brigo>Argyle, may be you already have chrome in this directory: /var/cache/pepperflashplugin-nonfree/
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18:39<Argyle>all this to use chromecast lol
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18:40<Brigo>Argyle, if yes, you only have to uncompress it and copy /pepperflashplugin-nonfree/libpepflashplayer.so
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18:41<Argyle>ok thanks brigo, i'll go find an older version now
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18:50<terravires>hi all, I've got a very strange problem on a new debian install. when I do "sudo su newuser -" I get a terminal, but it has no job control and keeps get "...killed" then my terminal becomes unusable. Can't even type reset to fix it.
18:52<Brigo>terravires, try to watch the syslog for problems.
18:53<terravires>Brigo, I checked auth.log and it only says pam_unix(su:session): session closed for user newuser
18:55<terravires>the only thing I found was a bug report that says that may have been a securtiy fix for sudo, but that is from dec 2013
18:55<peter1138>does sudo -u newuser -s do anything different?
18:56<Brigo>nothing in syslog?
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18:58<terravires>now that's odd, "sudo su newuser -" does not work, but "sudo su - newuser" does
18:59<terravires>- is just short for -l, but I've been using the other way for a decade. :-/
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19:01<terravires>is that a bug or new behavior?
19:01<wompa>man for su says "When - is used, it must be specified before any username."
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20:46<jpleau>from http://keyring.debian.org/creating-key.html - "Due to weaknesses found with the SHA1 hashing algorithm Debian prefers to use keys that are at least 2048 bits and preferring SHA2" -- How do I verify my key is strong enough? Is it in the form of 2048R/XXXXXXXX , is there something else I have to check?
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21:42<smacko>Hi all! Looking for some advise, I'd like to compile Gimp 2.9+, I'm guess there might be dependencies differences that gimp in Sid. Should I do this in a chroot? or is it a bit crazy to use a x11 application in a chroot?
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23:30<qwk>how to clean ppas from debian ?
23:31<ncl>debian has ppas?
23:32<qwk>ppa
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23:33<qwk>or clean apt-repository
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23:34<pngo>qwk: sudo add-apt-repository --remove ppa:PPA_Name/ppa
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23:39<qwk>sudo add-apt-repository --remove ppa:teeje2008/ppa
23:41<qwk>pngo: thanks
23:41<qwk>is there a way to have a gui "apt-get"
23:41<qwk>manager like the same as ubuntu
23:41<qwk>who notice when there is any updates?
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23:48<qwk>I have been googling gor like 1 h by now about auto update for servers etc, it is an good idea, and which way to do that is the best?
23:50<themill>cron-apt works well for servers. There are tools like update-notifier or packagekit for desktops
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---Logclosed Mon Sep 29 00:00:18 2014