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#debian IRC Logs for 2016-10-04

---Logopened Tue Oct 04 00:00:21 2016
---Daychanged Tue Oct 04 2016
00:00-!-jvoorhis [~jvoorhis@174-25-177-251.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com]
00:01<vortek>fore some reason , su will not work anymore. Any ideas?
00:03-!-Q-Master [~q-master@93-81-9-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #debian
00:03-!-Q-Master is "Vladimir Berezenko" on #debianppc #debian-next #debian
00:05<jmcnaught>vortek: what is the error?
00:05-!-Lordz1 [~Adium@177.16.204.210] has joined #debian
00:05-!-Lordz1 is "Adium User" on #debian-br #debian
00:06<vortek>su: Authentication failure
00:06<vortek>it worked last night
00:06<jmcnaught>vortek: that is the error you get with incorrect password
00:07<vortek>Thats the error im getting when I try su
00:08<jmcnaught>vortek: try again, or "/msg dpkg i forgot root password"
00:09-!-Lordz [~Adium@177.41.241.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:09<vortek>i tried man time, I was able to login to this computer 60 minutes ago With the same password. And nothngs changed sense them. And Ive been using this paaword for 10 years, s ikow i didnt forget it
00:10<vortek>i know you should change your password more often then exery 10 years
00:11<jmcnaught>vortek: capslock? broken key?
00:12<vortek>no capslock has a ;ight to indicate if its on and its not, and i tred with it on also
00:13<jmcnaught>vortek: your L key is making semicolons, and your I key only works 7/8 times from what i can see ^^
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00:14<vortek>how do you know this ? heh
00:14<jmcnaught>vortek: maybe it's a (not enough|too much) coffee problem?
00:14<vortek>hehe
00:14<vortek>well it let me log into the system and hour ago
00:15-!-azamat [~azamat@r4-pw-ituim.ibys.com.br] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:15<jmcnaught>vortek: your line from XX:12 ';ight', 'tred'. you're making lots of typos right now in other words.
00:16<vortek>oh yeah i noticed that
00:16<vortek>but when i tped my su passwd i always type it slow and key by key so no chance of mistake
00:17<jmcnaught>vortek: normally i wouldn't point out typos, but you are having wrong password errors
00:17<vortek>cool
00:17<jmcnaught>you're using root's password, or your user's password?
00:17<vortek>?
00:17<jmcnaught>they are two different passwords
00:18<vortek>i know
00:18<vortek>1 for root 1 for user
00:18<jmcnaught>with su you use root's password, with sudo you use user's password
00:19<jmcnaught>say that ten times fast
00:19<vortek>haha
00:19<vortek>so with sudo i can gain root privaligies
00:20-!-janus [~kratos@67.180.142.220] has joined #debian
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00:20<vortek>i never used sudo since this is a 1 user system
00:20<vortek>hrm
00:21<jmcnaught>vortek: that means you can change root's password by running "sudo passwd"
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00:22<vortek>WTF it worked i can now su!
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00:22<anonymous>aeb
00:22<janus>@vortek, always best to connect as a non-sudo user, and then #sudo up.
00:23<anonymous>stop netsh wlan profile
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00:23-!-aya_ is "Aya Shameimaru" on #debian-kde #debian
00:23<vortek>one thing though, isn't this a HUGE security problem? i mean a hacker who has local user password can easy get to roots acount?
00:24<jmcnaught>vortek: only if that user is in the sudo group, or otherwise listed in sudoers
00:24<janus>Theoretically, yes... but if you change #root's password to something other than you non-sudo user, shouldn't be as much of an issue.
00:24-!-jesusLovesWarez [~smuxi@2605:e000:308b:1e00:8200:6eff:fef1:245e] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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00:24-!-cragdor is "Craig Thomas,,," on #crypto #debian
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00:24-!-nilez is "..." on #powerdns #awesome #osm #tor-project #debian-mentors #qemu #ceph #linode #tor #debian
00:25<janus>If someone hacks you, they could always just replace you shadow file.
00:25<storge>The Shadow File
00:25<janus>s/you/your
00:25<storge>i love how that sounds
00:25<janus>lol
00:25<janus>yeah.. pretty sure I"m not grammatically correct on that
00:25<vortek>i mean what if i gave someoone a user account on my system, could they use this method toget root?
00:26<janus>as @jmcnaught said, not if they are not part of the #sudo'ers group.
00:26<jmcnaught>vortek: only if you put that user in the sudo group, or add them to sudoers
00:26<vortek>ahh , DUH! i didn't notice that hah , cool
00:27<jmcnaught>vortek: "apropos sudo"
00:27<vortek>whats that do?
00:27<janus>You're good. It takes years of breaking packages and systems to get savvy with it.
00:27<janus>Don't be afraid to get your hands dirty ;)
00:27<vortek>hehe
00:27<jmcnaught>vortek: "man apropos" :)
00:27<janus>@jmcnaught, that's new to me.
00:28<vortek>k
00:28<jmcnaught>every command in Debian should have a man page
00:28<jmcnaught>usually configuration files in /etc have a man page too
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00:29<vortek>sweet
00:29<jmcnaught>the other essential place to look is /usr/share/doc/$PACKAGE/ especially for a README.Debian
00:30<janus>so wise... XD
00:31-!-aya_ [~aya@c-66-235-24-115.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:32<janus>Debian jessie (8.3) headless .... ~ I seem to be having issues where after a week or so, the system just drops all connectivity on the network. I've checked daemon//kernel//network_manager log, and not really seeing anything valuable.
00:33-!-DrBrunheimen [~quassel@ks-184-2-97-139.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #debian
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00:33<janus>Anyone else have a thought where else to start? It's strange... It'll work great while I'm at work one day, then I'll try to VPN to it, and nothing. Not even a local #ping from an RDP session.
00:33<janus>And I apologize if I'm abusing the use of the chat.
00:34<jmcnaught>janus: this is a Debian Jessie support channel, you're not abusing anything
00:35<janus>;)
00:35<jmcnaught>janus: networking on the remote computer is configured by NetworkManager?
00:35-!-jm_ [flier@000125af.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
00:35-!-jm_ is "." on #debian #debian-ops
00:35-!-aya_ [~aya@c-66-235-24-115.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #debian
00:35-!-aya_ is "Aya Shameimaru" on #debian-kde #debian
00:36<janus>To the best of my knowledge. I use #tinc for VPN, but NetworkManager is the backbone.
00:36<janus>(/etc/init.d/networking restart)
00:36<jmcnaught>janus: /etc/init.d/networking and NetworkManager are two separate things
00:36<janus>NetworkManager is GUI, yes?
00:37<jmcnaught>networking restart is also deprecated since squeeze, use ifdown and ifup
00:37<janus>jmcnaught, get out!
00:37<janus>really?
00:37<jmcnaught>janus: NetworkManager is a daemon, it has a gui front end, and nmcli and nmtui for command line and ncurses
00:37<janus>I'm working on systemd...
00:37<janus>aight... so.
00:38<janus>I'll use ncurses if I'm using wifi
00:38<jmcnaught>janus: how did you configure networking on the remote computer?
00:38<janus>but for #eth, I'll just set a static DHCP lease on the router, and the machine just grabs it.
00:38<janus>DCP
00:38<janus>s/DCP/DHCP
00:38<janus>@ the router level.
00:38<jmcnaught>janus: how did you tell Debian to use DHCP?
00:38<janus>damn...
00:39<janus>uh
00:39<janus>I think /etc/network/interfaces
00:39<jmcnaught>janus: can you put that file on http://paste.debian.net/ please?
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00:43<storge>i thought debian used dhcp as default from install
00:43<janus>man... I was using #fiche (github) for a pastebin, and failing miserably right meow (totally unrelated). Let me post that for you on debian.net
00:43<storge>i guess i'm getting pretty out of touch with the installer, i need to install agains soon. i've just been migrating between versions for years.
00:43<jm_>it does try to use dhcp by default first yes
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00:44<storge>just: cat /etc/network/interfaces | nc termbin.com 9999
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00:44<jmcnaught>janus mentioned NetworkManager, so it's unclear how their remote computer (that loses connection after about a week) has its networking configured
00:44<janus>no doubt
00:45-!-DrBrunheimen [~quassel@ks-184-2-97-139.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:45<janus>@jmcnaught, http://paste.debian.net/855486/
00:46<jmcnaught>storge: cat killer! "nc termbin.com 9999 < /etc/network/interfaces"
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00:46-!-magyar is "Nagy Ondrash" on #debian-kde #debian
00:46<storge>heh
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00:46<janus>really? I would have agreed with storge ... that's how I use #fiche
00:46<janus>cat <file> | nc cronus 666
00:47<jmcnaught>janus: right, so /e/n/interfaces and the networking service are not involved. if network-manager package is installed, look at "journalctl -u network-manager"
00:47<janus>looks about right... thing systemd was giving me guff when I toyed around.
00:47<jmcnaught>!uuoc
00:47<dpkg>UUOC is the Useless Use of Cat Award. Given out for years by Randal Schwartz on the newsgroup comp.unix.shell. Basically, most constructions that look like "cat filename | grep pattern" can be more easily written as "grep pattern filename". Works for grep and most other Unix utilities. Easier to type and marginally more efficient.
00:47-!-descala [~descala@165.187.17.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #debian
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00:47<janus>But I'm not sure what I'm doing...
00:48-!-xecutiv [xecutiv@ool-2f11134c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit []
00:48<janus>I appreciate the isight... rebooting a server weekly is a pain in the a$$ (cron might be a ghetto-rig option). ...
00:48<jmcnaught>(or with IO redirection like < for stdin)
00:49-!-mjampala [~mjampala@208.146.43.5] has joined #debian
00:49-!-mjampala is "Mukund Jampala" on #debian #debian-next
00:49<janus>dpkg, jmcnaught : "UUOC" ~ that's funny
00:49<dpkg>parse error: dunno what the heck you're talking about, janus
00:49<janus>dpkg is a bot?
00:49<dpkg>janus: are you smoking crack?
00:49<janus>ha
00:49<jm_>dpkg, are you a bot?
00:49<dpkg>I ain't no stinkin' bot. I am a finely tuned and hand crafted tool. Oh wait... I guess I am a bot (that you should not abuse).
00:50<janus>ROFL
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00:50<janus>I"m jealous... I can read python, but fk me if I had to code it.
00:51<jmcnaught>janus: if you are rebooting to fix the problem, that journalctl command will not show you logs from the previous boot
00:53<janus>danke, jmcnaught I will check that out.
00:54<janus>if I could 'karma' you, I would
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00:55<jmcnaught>janus: well, if you *do* want to see logs from previous boot, either look in /var/log/syslog, or enable persistent journals (/usr/share/doc/systemd/README.Debian) and use "journalctl --boot -1 -u network-manager"
00:56<janus># journalctl --boot -1 -u network-manager - saved in my notes
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00:59<jmcnaught>janus: add "journalctl --list-boots" to your notes, reading the man page and http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/journalctl.html are also recommended
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01:00-!-towo^work is "Torsten -towo- Wohlfarth" on #kernelnewbies #siduction-dev #siduction-de #siduction #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian #aptosid
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01:05<janus>I'm actually having (re)-issues with #fiche not binding to any port it's previously used.
01:05<janus>but that's another story.
01:05<janus>What's good in the world, here?
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01:15<janus>anyone savvy with DHCPclient? (Rouge_accesspoint) ?
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01:18-!-queztor is "Michel" on #observium #qemu #debian
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01:24<janus>http://paste.debian.net/855560/
01:24<jm_>ait, are you using kali?
01:24<janus>I use a litte of everything.
01:24<jm_>!kali
01:24<dpkg>Kali Linux (http://www.kali.org/) is a security and penetration testing distribution from the creators of <backtrack>. It is based on Debian, but it is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Seek help in #kali-linux on chat.freenode.net or http://forums.kali.org/ . Also ask me about <based on debian>, and read http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
01:25<janus>My Air runs Kali. Pro and imac (2005) run debian 8.3
01:27<janus>but I figured the DCHPclient would function the same...
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01:30-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian-cd #debian-edu #debian-devel-changes #debian
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01:34<janus>dpkg
01:35-!-shell_ghost is now known as moony
01:37<vortek>how do i change the defualt font that my web browser uses?
01:37<moony>in all fonts if not the browser's own preferences.
01:39-!-paxmark9 [~paxtormar@64.64.121.39] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
01:41<vortek>thanxs
01:41<jm_>also note that web pages can supply their own fonts and sometimes the browser will have a separate setting for that (probably not all browsers have it)
01:41<moony>np
01:41<vortek>yea chromium has lots of addons for font sellection
01:41<vortek>cool
01:42<moony>jm_ is correct when saying the website it's self may still not host those selected fonts on the web server.
01:42-!-ewet [~ewet@ip1f11f883.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian
01:42-!-ewet is "Enno Weichert" on #debian
01:42<jm_>yeah probably because of a lack of such a setting (it's notorious for not having many settings)
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01:43<vortek>does anyone find the font hard to read on this site, http://www.oolite.org/starting/
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01:43<shell_ghost>no
01:44<jm_>yes, looks much better in firefox for me, also "zap colors" helps a lot
01:45-!-moony is now known as Guest1019
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01:45<moony>I also looked in firefox
01:45<moony>it was fine, I use Sans wide open though.
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01:46<moony>I'm still working on my kernel, sorry for the exit/reentry there.
01:47<vortek>ahh ts my veiwing angle that makes it look bad
01:47<moony>What font are you trying to use?
01:47<moony>Are you rendering the font?
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01:47-!-bolt is "-" on #awesome #virt #debian-next #debian #sd #oftc #qemu #suckless
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01:48-!-gry is "Svetlana Tkachenko" on #debian-next #gfortran #debian-offtopic #debian-ru #debian-mentors #debian-desktop #osm-ru #ikiwiki #debian #oftc #osm #unsw #debian-au #moocows
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01:54<janus>@vortek, is that your site?
01:54<janus>I like it
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01:55-!-sqirrrl is "Mirko Ahnert" on #debian
01:58<vortek>no its not
01:59<moony>@vortek what was the URL again?
01:59<moony>I crashed out of a duplicate client.
01:59<vortek>its something im interested in becoming part off
01:59<vortek>http://www.oolite.org/starting/
01:59-!-akew__ [~akew@81.162.112.142] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
01:59<moony>Ah, I heard someone telling me about this.
02:00<moony>I stay too buried in code, but it sounded interesting. I never have time to play games anymore.
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02:00<vortek>its a massive online rpg of space , like you bounty hunt or fight other shits you choose. over 2000 different world to exploe heh
02:00<moony>Yeah, I heard it was impressively large for it's age.
02:00<vortek>moony: im in anursing home i got all the time :P
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02:01<vortek>yeah i found this under the debian games page'
02:01<moony>I hear you. I spent way too much time there with my grand dad every lunch break for a copule years.
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02:01<janus>legit
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02:12<vortek>you guys seen the new birtual reality xwinndows demos?
02:13<vortek>virtual i meant
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02:16<moony>Yes.
02:16<moony>xwindows will still die in my opinion.
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03:16<lnslbrty>moony: Why do you think x11 will die? I dont get it. O.o
03:16<moony>It's already being written around.
03:17<moony>People are attempting now to replace it is as the goto window manager.
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03:18<lnslbrty>goto window manager? Does it implement its own xserver?
03:18<moony>With the newer processing abilities, so far according to "many" it's not keeping pace. I know I've been manipulating X11 driven video based virtualization for 5 years now. I have no intentions on replacing it in my every day work.
03:19<moony>the xserver is the window manager. X11, xephyr, etc.
03:19<moony>The desktop manager is it's own.
03:19<moony>or reverse that, sorry.
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03:20<moony>I'm running a rolling debian build now without X11 though and know many way beyond what I'm doing graphics wise.
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03:21<jm_>using wayland or what?
03:21<moony>Yes
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03:21<moony>I'm not using wayland.
03:21<moony>They are.
03:22<moony>I'm running Xfce running on my own custom xephyr build I'm manipulated in the world of Quality Assurance Automation for 5 years.
03:22<moony>I've*
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03:22<jm_>right, I also some some x11 features not available in wayland at work
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03:23<jm_>also use*
03:23<moony>Exactly. Most people I know who really like their graphics are all headed that direction.
03:24<moony>As far as work, I just need to manipulate my web UI drivers, etc., and I only build at home as a far as I need to for work.
03:24<moony>They're way too closely integrated for me to find as "off time" with docker containers now.
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03:25<moony>So my "off time" is a lot of Python and Java headed in different directions than display.
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03:27<moony>Also, let me be more clear; when I say X11 replaced as the default window manager, I'm talking about years from now.
03:28-!-mode/#debian [+l 722] by debhelper
03:28<moony>We know the computer time line of life is a lot slower than normal, especially in linux.
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03:28<moony>Too many desktop environments require X11 at this point.
03:29<moony>And give me a >1 year linux user who can run arch.
03:29<moony>sorry, less than a year depending on wording.
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03:32<moony>However, speaking of DE's, anyone that's not a big gamer try and like budgie yet?
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03:37<lnslbrty>I've tried arch a few years ago but switched back to debian. It's actually not a big deal.
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03:40<moony>Depends on what you want.
03:40<hewl>sup, what's going on?
03:40<moony>I'm living debian obviously, so don't misunderstand.
03:41<moony>But some people will stay without their graphics till the end of binary
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03:41<lnslbrty>stable software + x11 + xmonad
03:41<moony>no.
03:41<moony>not xmonad for me ;-)
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03:41<lnslbrty>why not?
03:41<moony>I don't know. I started on slackware in 93. It's just how I started.
03:42<moony>I still use the HELL out of my terminal windows for all my coding.
03:42<administrator>rootsector?
03:42<moony>;-)
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03:42<moony>It depends on what though, I will admit, like I said previously, I still have to use X11 a lot.
03:42<lnslbrty>linux term only?
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03:43<moony>Now, yes
03:43<moony>I'm running hexchat through a terminal.
03:43<lnslbrty>without screen/tmux/bonobo/whatever?
03:43<moony>one of 8 displayed now.
03:43<moony>no, i have a window manager.
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03:44<moony>i'm using the debian core, as a I stated, rolling.
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03:44<moony>only flux as my WM.
03:45<moony>and that's when I decide not to just use openbox. Depends on the project.
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03:46<moony>I would have never started using X if it wasn't for the fact I was an early 90's AOL kid.
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03:47<moony>Some people like the die hard Arch users will live in a terminal window.
03:47<moony>Not because it's the best technology available.
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03:49<moony>If people are faster in a terminal, why use a GUI period though? That part I see their point and that's why I still use terminal dominant.
03:49<hewl>On Debian stable. Whenever I put my machine into Sleep or Hibernate there's a 2/3 chance that when it wakes up I'll only see a cursor on a white/black screen and lose all functionality. Xorg won't even close with Ctrl+Alt+Backspace.
03:49<moony>That's not a recognized shortcut for X11
03:50<moony>Ctrl+alt+del and Ctrl + alt + L
03:50<jm_>sure it is, it's bound to Terminate_Server by default
03:50<moony>I just use Super + L
03:50<moony>Yes, terminate_server
03:51<lnslbrty>moony: Ok, seems that you are somewhat old. :)
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03:51<moony>but which manager do you have restarts server by default?
03:51<moony>If 28 is old, yes.
03:51<moony>I was coding by 7
03:51<lnslbrty>moony: I started using linux when I was 16, that was 2006
03:51<lnslbrty>moony: n1
03:51<moony>When I graduated
03:51<moony>;-)
03:52<moony>you're 30ish
03:52<jm_>surely 26
03:52<moony>age is irrelevant.
03:52<hewl>moony: I tried those too but it's still non-responsive. I have to reboot the machine in those situations. #stable
03:52<moony>You're on jessie, stable right?
03:52<lnslbrty>moony: definitly
03:52<jm_>hewl: do you have another computer and can connect to the problematic one with it?
03:52<hewl>moony: Yes.
03:53<moony>That's a WM issue..., what DM are you running on X11?
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03:53<hewl>jm_: I do not have another computer. It's not a problem that makes the computer unfunctional, I just can't use those sleep functions.
03:53<moony>Which Desktop @ hewl?
03:54<hewl>moony: KDE with Qt
03:54<aleksey>hi all
03:54<moony>Qt5?
03:54<hewl>moony: It's Jessie. Qt4
03:54<jm_>hewl: right, if you could connect to it after the problem occurs you might be able to get more clues
03:54<moony>OK, I'm just using Jessie kernel, so bare with me on DM questions...
03:55<moony>X11 isn't suspending when you lock
03:55<moony>That's my guess
03:55<hewl>jm_: I see what you mean now. We could get it into an interactive state, maybe. I don't have any networking or another computer though so it's still infeasible.
03:55<moony>Is this a default install with KDE?
03:55<jm_>hewl: then the only option would be serial connection
03:55<hewl>moony: Yes. On one occasion the "Present Windows" shortcut was still working, but I've been unable to reproduce it.
03:56<moony>Yeah... something isn't talking.
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03:56<moony>You've got a job hung up
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03:56<moony>as @jm_ said, I would start up in a safe mode.
03:56<moony>look at your jobs that start up
03:56<hewl>Would there be any hints in the logs I should be looking for?
03:56<moony>and make sure they lock/correspond.
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03:57<moony>I'm not a big KDE person... but if you run a recover start up, you can follow the journal
03:57<moony>it will tell you exactly what is hung up.
03:57<hewl>moony: Bare with me here that's terminology I haven't seen before. By jobs do you mean processes or scripts that execute on startup? By lock/correspond what do you mean?
03:58<moony>Terminology is Enlightenment's bash
03:58<moony>That's just another terminal...
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03:58<moony>by jobs I mean, necessary processes that run at all times.
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03:58<hewl>moony: I meant the actual word terminology, as in "words", not the terminal.
03:58<moony>oh sorry
03:58<moony>sec.
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03:58<hewl>moony: haha no problem
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03:59<moony>after you lock and attempt to unlock
03:59<moony>give me details
03:59<hewl>moony: Oh as in to log out and log back in. I understand now.
04:00<moony>Yeah, give me step by step
04:00<moony>what happens?
04:00<Tubber>i have to restore a server that i have as a copy of the previous running system. How can I scp the / to a server. tried with "scp folder/ serverip:/" but this is copied into the /root/ folder
04:01<moony>and if it's an enterprise (multiple user) environment, do you have the user manager being killed on log out?
04:01<hewl>moony: Ok, well considering I'm using Debian right now to talk to you I'm going to need to disconnect to do all those things. I'll try booting into safe mode, suspending/unsuspending and documenting everything. I'll be back soon.
04:01<moony>OK, I'll be here.
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04:01<moony>@tubber is this a different partition of the same HD?
04:02<moony>or different HD?
04:02<jm_>Tubber: probably scp origdir/* serverip:/, but if it's a running system this is not a good idea
04:02<moony>you are trying to copy a root "/" path to another root path
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04:02<moony>you need to give it an additional folder name.
04:03<moony>a full live update of a root to another root I have never done on Jessie though.
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04:03<moony>@hew how did it go?
04:03<moony>@hewl*
04:04<hewl>moony: quick update, I can still Ctrl+Alt+F2 to switch terminal and startx to get my DE to work. I haven't tested safe mode yet, though.
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04:04<moony>OK, so the DE essentially just isn't fully reloading?
04:04<hewl>moony: This is from a normal "standby" which results in a black screen.
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04:04<hewl>moony: Yes, it seems to be that.
04:04<moony>yeah, I know exactly where you're at.
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04:05<moony>What is your current lock script?
04:05<moony>Can you access it?
04:05<hewl>moony: I'm sorry how would I check that?
04:05<hewl>moony: Is that a DE specific thing?
04:05<moony>it would be KDE's locking software, yes...
04:05<jm_>ahh so computer still works, I thought you can't access console so you don't need remote connection
04:05<moony>@jm_ do you know kde's default lock software?
04:05<jm_>moony: nope, sorry
04:05<moony>hewl, give me a sec
04:06<hewl>moony: Klauncher.
04:06<moony>that's right.
04:06<moony>sec
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04:08<moony>@hewl try a safe mode bootup and let it rewrite your default config files. Do a full lock, unlock (logout, login) from safe boot, if it works, reboot
04:08<moony>if not tell me
04:08<moony>You've just got one job hanging up
04:08<hewl>moony: "rewrite your default config files" which config files are we talking here and how is that done?
04:08<moony>It will do that on default.
04:09<moony>I want klauncher to rewrite it's own config files
04:09<moony>they're basic.
04:09<hewl>moony: Is it permanent? I have changed my fonts.conf to make my fonts render correctly.
04:09<hewl>I wouldn't want that to change.
04:09<moony>Shoudln't affect those.
04:09<moony>should be basic boot up
04:09<hewl>moony: Alright, I'll check it out. Going to boot into safe mode and attempt standby/hibernate.
04:09<moony>No personal
04:10<moony>I'll be here.
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04:17<hewl>moony: Can confirm some very weird stuff is happening.
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04:17<moony>You should see a lot of text, but what do you mean by weird
04:17<moony>The startup should be verbose.
04:18<hewl>moony: Debian recovery boots up without displaying "root@computername:~#" but commands still work. I can still do startx to get into KDE
04:18<hewl>In klauncher, the options to
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04:18<moony>ok, this may be a key part...
04:18<hewl>I just realised they are hidden by default I'm an idiot.
04:19<moony>lol...
04:19<moony>you're fine, you're just in a recovery boot
04:19<moony>try a normal boot and check out your options.
04:19<hewl>moony: But the weird part is that when I went to lock the computer, the lock was successful but the unlock FAILED.
04:19<moony>any msg?
04:19<hewl>moony: I simply said "unlock failed" and cleared my password entry field.
04:19<hewl>*it
04:19<moony>did you hit enter on a dim screen?
04:20<moony>Mine does that.
04:20<hewl>moony: I tried multiple times.
04:20<moony>If I hit enter, but it's not fully awake, it tries an entry attempt.
04:20<hewl>moony: The screen was not dim at the time. Lock does not do that. Only standby.
04:20<moony>Write.
04:20<moony>right*
04:20<hewl>moony: I still need to test what standby does, however.
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04:20<hewl>moony: So I'll be right back.
04:20<moony>It's hibernate
04:21<moony>should put hard disk's into standby
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04:21<hewl>moony: Standby and hibernate are two distinctly different options. One allows power to be disconnected and still be able to resume later while the other just suspends everything to RAM.
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04:21<moony>I know, I just understood what you meant when you said try
04:21<moony>you meant try on safe boot
04:21<moony>let me know what occurs.
04:22<hewl>moony: Ah yes, I'll do that now.
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04:24<Tubber>jm_, You are right finding another solution
04:25<jm_>Tubber: boot it with grml, it has ssh on it, copy stuff to it using rsync
04:25<moony>^ agree
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04:25<moony>You have two servers fighting for root
04:26<Tubber>jm_ hmm do not know grml.. I will read up on that. Thanks alot
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04:27<moony>@Tubber https://grml.org/
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04:30<hewl>moony: I noticed an error message that repeatedly appeared while in safe mode. "KDE Power Management System could not be initialised. [...] No valid Power Management backend plugins are available. A new installation might solve this problem."
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04:30<moony>Ahhh
04:31<jm_>if you get that in normal mode it might be the reason behind suspend/resume issues I suppose
04:31<moony>Ok, so KLauncher isn't designated to take over power management responsibilities
04:31<hewl>moony: As for the standby and hibernation, I couldn't actually find them. They didn't appear in Klauncher's preferences. I do not know the terminal commands to execute these either, as klauncher doesn't even have a man page. So I was unable to attempt standby from recovery mode.
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04:31<moony>But he already had them... it's a safe mode catch on the job
04:31<moony>That job is booting up slow
04:31<hewl>To note: These errors don't appear on a normal login.
04:32<moony>@hewl you're system is so close to fine, I don't want to mislead you on anything, so I will tread carefully with you.
04:32<moony>@hewl no, it is.
04:32<hewl>And they appeared REPEATEDLY in recovery mode. It makes multiple attempts.
04:32<moony>@hewl klauncher manages your power management
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04:32<moony>@hewl the recovery boot noticed power management turned off, same time you said your unlock messed up
04:32<moony>that makes sense.
04:33<moony>you were on recovery and klauncher killed it's self on lock
04:33<hewl>moony: Not at the same time. I got these error messages since I booted into recovery, before I even locked or did anything. I also got a nice little crash dialogue telling me to report the bug.
04:34<moony>window manager bug report?
04:34<moony>or debian?
04:34<hewl>moony: Window manager.
04:34<hewl>moony: I mean, the desktop environment.
04:34<moony>That's good when compared.
04:34<moony>Yeah
04:34<hewl>moony: The bug reporter of KDE itself.
04:34<moony>It should have
04:34<moony>Because recovery, debian kernel locks down from scripts
04:35<moony>Do you have team viewer, skype, or any type of desktop sharing software?
04:35<moony>If you do or can get one of them and boot normally, let me see the lock and unlock
04:35<moony>You have a script that's missing a few variables
04:35<hewl>moony: No. I don't really use those sorts of software. Neither am I a fan of remote desktop connections.
04:36<moony>I agree, that's why the type I offered to you as a choice.
04:36<moony>You're at the point I only know the software well enough to see it.
04:36<moony>But you're only two files talking to each other away... you may want to be patient for the right Plasma user.
04:37<moony>Those error messages are what you should see.
04:37<hewl>moony: I'm sorry but I'm a bit confused at what you're saying.
04:37<moony>Let me try to be clear. Your problem is not severe.
04:37<hewl>that's good
04:38-!-mode/#debian [+l 728] by debhelper
04:38<moony>The only way I know how to help is by seeing what it's doing from here, that's why I asked about desktop connection software.
04:38<moony>However...
04:38<hewl>I'm not too fussed by this anyway, because Debian boots up quickly enough that I have no need to keep things suspended like I did in other OSes
04:38<moony>If you don't want to do that, I would wait for a fluent KDE plasma user.
04:38<moony>Your problem is small
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04:38<moony>I just don't use KDE fluently enough to know without seeing.
04:39<hewl>moony: That might be the best. It's a problem that's narrowed down to the DE, and not the OS.
04:39<moony>But if you don't want to risk a peer2peer connection, I understand completely.
04:39<jm_>you could try asking in #debian-kde
04:39<moony>Exactly!
04:39<moony>Your OS is fine and perfect.
04:39<moony>that's why I said tread carefully.
04:39<moony>You
04:39<hewl>moony: And we're on the IRC for the OS. I'll ask there as jm_ suggested... 75 nicks though
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04:39<moony>You literally have one application acting up.
04:39<moony>Glad if I helped in anyway.
04:40<moony>and you're talking to a guy that builds his own kernel from debian.
04:41<moony>I've been driven mad by one piece of software multiple times.
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04:41<hewl>moony: Clarifying the problem does a lot, I thank you for that. There might be some more general knowledge things I can throw at you to see if they'd be the cause of this.
04:41<moony>Anytime.
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04:41<moony>And this may be a much easier general problem then I'm aware, due to the DE
04:42<hewl>I'm using a different network manager in place of KDE's network manager due to inherit bugs in it. Wicd is what I'm using. Could that be causing it?
04:42<moony>No, they, not from what you're getting back.
04:42<moony>I've used Wicd in place of NetworkManager many times.
04:42<moony>Your errors are too distinct.
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04:43<hewl>moony: I have a partially uninstalled graphics driver. Could that be the problem?
04:43<moony>We know it's the power manager aka DE manager's lock/unlock software
04:43<moony>It's in the category...
04:43<moony>but I would be doubtful...
04:43<moony>What driver?
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04:44<hewl>moony: Nvidia-driver. It is however missing the dependencies nvidia-driver-bin and libegl1-nvidia.
04:44<hewl>moony: The graphics are perfectly fine though and I can use the driver as normal.
04:45<moony>With what feedback, you're save to do a sudo apt-get autoremove
04:45<moony>It will get rid of those unnecessary dependencies.
04:46<hewl>moony: Funny story, that command is what I was using to try and remove nvidia-driver. It failed.
04:46<moony>Shouldn't be causing your problem though at all.
04:46<moony>Really?
04:46<moony>Purge it.
04:46<moony>unless you know you hav eit.
04:46<hewl>moony: Is what I have tried. Purge failed to remove nvidia-driver.
04:46<moony>wow really?
04:46<moony>what is your output of the following...
04:46<moony>lspci
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04:46<moony>you can IM if you need to
04:47<hewl>moony: Yes. I found it weird that after a reboot my desktop still retained the ability to output 1920x1080, turned out the driver wasn't uninstalled. So I left it at that.
04:47<moony>Hmm.
04:47<moony>What's your actual graphics card?
04:47<hewl>The two aforementioned packages were killed by it, though. So hence a partially uninstalled driver.
04:47<hewl>moony: GTX 750Ti. Works perfectly fine.
04:48<moony>You need the intel driver then
04:48<moony>NVIDIA is intel
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04:49<moony>This is starting to make sense though... Some NVIDIA cards play bad with Intel.
04:49<moony>Not sure about which compared to your version though
04:49<hewl>moony: I'm sorry, what? Don't you need to install the nvidia drivers for a nvidia graphics card? What does Intel have anything to do with it?
04:49<moony>@hewl Intel makes NVIDIA... but the driver version overlap is significant...
04:49<moony>@hewl I'm not sure what versions though.
04:50<hewl>moony: So are you saying I should install additional drivers for Intel?
04:50<jm_>no, don't
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04:50<moony>@hewl I'm sying it's necessary for some versions.
04:50<moony>Don't know about yours.
04:51<moony>GTX I would assume to hell and back, no.
04:51<moony>I'm honestly confused why you couldn't purge that intel file though
04:51<moony>what processors are you running?
04:52<hewl>moony: One Intel i3 clocked at 3.2GHtz. I do not overclock.
04:52<hewl>moony: It's dual core btw.
04:52<moony>What generation?
04:52<moony>2nd?
04:52<hewl>moony: I have no idea.
04:52<moony>Wait no, too fast.
04:52<hewl>moony: Oh wait, lspci says it's 4th gen.
04:53<moony>The i3 is read by drivers WAY different than the i5 and i7
04:53<moony>ok, give me a sec
04:54<moony>@hewl just for my tired minds sake, verify you have the appropriate driver from here: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/product/75025/4th-Generation-Intel-Core-i3-Processors
04:54<hewl>I used the Debian installer to install Debian. Shouldn't that include a bunch of the basic drivers for CPUs?
04:54<moony>Yes
04:54<moony>It probably did
04:54<moony>We're still probably at the same small config issue
04:54<moony>Just to make me feel better, check the URL's driver version
04:55<moony>that will kill out a 1/4th of possible bad problems.
04:56<hewl>moony: That is a link to the page of drivers which can be downloaded. How does this help identify which drivers I have installed?
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04:56<moony>When you typed lspci
04:56<moony>what was the hex number to the left?
04:56<moony>of the graphics driver
04:56<hewl>01:00.0
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04:57<jm_>«lspci -k» shows drivers in use
04:57<moony>he has two installed though
04:57<moony>@hewl run jm_'s command now as well and compare
04:58<hewl>01:00.0 again
04:58<moony>wait
04:58<moony>are you running free desktop's x11?
04:58<moony>https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71659
04:58<moony>check that bug
04:58<jm_>you want lspci -nn for PCI ID
04:58<moony>look at the bug @jm_
04:58<moony>He may fall there/
04:59<hewl>10de:1380
04:59<hewl>moony: How could such a bug get into stable?
04:59<jm_>moony: I don't remember what he ended up using after messing with removing nvidia driver back then
04:59<moony>look at the most recent date
04:59<hewl>04/28
04:59<moony>Ignore the ubuntu
05:00<moony>They're both debian
05:00<hewl>moony: nouveau
05:00<hewl>moony: I'm using the proprietry drivers
05:00<moony>OK, keep in mind I'm eliminating with you and acting as if this was my problem.
05:00<moony>I just finished reading
05:01<hewl>moony: this is ok
05:01<moony>Let me check your new hex code
05:01<moony>sec
05:02<moony>ok we're making some ground
05:02<moony>read this
05:02<moony>https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
05:02<moony>let me know if anything there is common with what you're showing as far as display
05:02<moony>if not, we move on.
05:02<hewl>I've read that as many times as I've read the bible.
05:02<moony>then ignore me :-) and lets move on
05:02<moony>cause you know what you've checked.
05:03<moony>We'll find it.
05:03<hewl>moony: I used nvidia-detect to see which drivers I needed and it said "just install nvidia-drivers"
05:03<moony>I know, I'm starting to guess you have a "very small" conflict there...
05:03<moony>but I dont' think that's your issue
05:04<moony>are you on debian 8 jessie stable?
05:04<hewl>moony: One sec I have to check something
05:04<moony>just to make sure
05:05<moony>Like I said, I only know what you've ran into for the last two hours now... I'm just telling you what I would check first with my experience.
05:05<hewl>moony: I'm on debian 8 jessie stable but I do have some backports.
05:05<moony>What category?
05:05<moony>are the backports
05:06<hewl>moony: Jessie backports (main contrib non-free)
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05:06<moony>oh, that's fine.
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05:07<moony>@hewl I truly believe your problem is really minor one with your DE powermangement/locking software. I'm scared to lead you off that track if it's something so simple...
05:07<moony>I just never have used KDE more than briefly...
05:07<hewl>moony: It is ok. I'd rather be sure of it as well. I'm just not as familiar with Debian so I don't know the troubleshooting steps.
05:07<moony>What's your base distro
05:07<moony>That you know, i mean.
05:08<moony>May help with me knowing what commands to tell you to run for diagnostics..
05:08<hewl>moony: My previous system was Windows. Windows 10.
05:08<moony>Are you straight Windows to Debian?
05:08<hewl>moony: No. I've tried out many distributions, from Arch to Ubuntu. The most I had used for a while was Mint but then... security stuff happened.
05:09<moony>OK, that's all I was getting at. Your familiarity.
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05:09<moony>Give me a research moment.
05:10<moony>@hewl do you know what kernel you're running?
05:10<moony>@hewl I don't know what the stable is now
05:11<hewl>moony: x86_64 Linux 3.16.0-4-amd64
05:11<moony>@hewl ok, one moment.
05:11<hewl>wow I only use an eighth of my RAM while internet browsing maybe I overkilled it
05:12<moony>no, i use less. you're fine
05:12<moony>@hewl apt-get install -t jessie-backports linux-headers-$(uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,')
05:12<moony>have you ran that?
05:12<hewl>moony: Isn't that only for when you want to build stuff from source?
05:12<moony>It's for building backport graphic drivers
05:12<moony>for nvidia when you have backports
05:13<hewl>moony: That should have been done automatically when I ran "sudo apt-get install nvidia-driver"
05:13<moony>it's the step prior...
05:13<hewl>moony: I may have been misled, then.
05:13<moony>for that kernel...
05:13<moony>it's the 2nd step for intel
05:13<moony>as far as graphics
05:14<moony>If you've ran it or if you're ahead of it, it won't hurt anything
05:14<moony>just let me know
05:14<hewl>moony: my understanding is that you only need it if you're building and it isn't required if you're just installing the binary. Is this true or false?
05:14<moony>let me verify, sec.
05:15<moony>The one I provided is the command if you're already running a linux kernel
05:15<moony>but you need the backports
05:15<moony>it's harmless if it doesn't work
05:15<moony>It will tell you that you already have the version or above.
05:16<moony>It just gets system version
05:16<moony>and looks for higher.
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05:17<moony>@hewl Install Linux headers for the kernel you are using. If you are using the 3.16 Linux kernel in Debian Jessie:
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05:17<moony># apt-get install linux-headers-$(uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,')
05:17<moony>Or if you are already using a Linux kernel from jessie-backports:
05:17<moony># apt-get install -t jessie-backports linux-headers-$(uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,')
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05:17<moony>oops.
05:17<moony># apt-get install linux-headers-$(uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,')
05:17<moony>Or if you are already using a Linux kernel from jessie-backports:
05:17<moony># apt-get install -t jessie-backports linux-headers-$(uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,')
05:19<themill>(If you know you're running amd64, then just installing 'linux-headers-amd64' rather than the weird sed smileys would be simpler)
05:19<hewl>I did not install from backports, however.
05:19<hewl>I have backports enabled for other reasons.
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05:20<moony>then the bottom line of my code is invalid for your situation.
05:20<hewl>The main repositories have nvidia-driver so I installed and then attempted to remove that.
05:20<moony>Just verify the top line.
05:20<moony>Ahhhh
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05:20<moony>you installed then tried to remove?
05:20<hewl>moony: Yes. This is why I say have a partially uninstalled driver.
05:20<Hatsjoe>Hi, is anyone else having dependency issues with updating util-linux to latest (2.27.1-3) on jessie? It deletes my bash-completion (1:2.1-4) and when I try to install it again, it will try to install sysvinit-core too, and delete a whole lot of system packages with that
05:20<hewl>moony: The problem occurs irrelevant of this, though.
05:21<moony>@hewl I agree, I still believe yours is that small config between the kernel and your DE/Powermanager.
05:21<moony>@hewl I have to admit when I'm afraid to take you the wrong direction. There is someone better equipped than myself for your issue. It's so small and it's KDE dependent.
05:21<themill>Hatsjoe: util-linux 2.27.1-3 is nowhere in jessie (it's not in Debian anywhere)
05:22<themill>dpkg: tell Hatsjoe about bat
05:22<Hatsjoe>Ah then I am derping, we use custom repo's too
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05:22<themill>Check the output of "apt-cache policy $pkg; apt-cache policy" as dpkg suggested
05:22<Hatsjoe>I did check the version of bash-completion, but totally missed the util-linux one, thanks themill
05:23<themill>np
05:23<hewl>moony: KDE's irc is as dead as #debian-kde. Unfortunate but at least I know it's not an OS/GPU issue.
05:23<moony>that's why I keep rolling
05:23<moony>;x
05:23<moony>Yes @hewl, I would work with you for hours if I knew we were going the right way
05:23<moony>I don't want to mess you up though man, you're right there at a small issue
05:24<moony>someone will have the exact answer in here a couple hours from now. I can't get you off track though by guessing.
05:24<hewl>moony: I should get around to properly fixing my drivers though. I want to install nouveau but apparently they're already installed so I just need to uninstall nvidia-driver but apparently that's an impossible feat to perform.
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05:24<moony>I'm so surprised you can't purge the package
05:24<moony>then reinstall
05:25<moony>wait
05:25<hewl>moony: thank you for your assistance, I have a clearer image of what needs to be checked now.
05:25<moony>if you get the commands you need to do that
05:25<moony>and you boot recovery
05:25<moony>hit esc on welcome screen
05:25<moony>login with root
05:25<moony>you can do just the above said
05:25<moony>remove graphics driver that's ineffective
05:25<hewl>moony: Why would that be any different from "sudo"?
05:26<moony>it wouldn't, but it's not mounted and running yet
05:26<moony>I mean hit esc before the login screen
05:26<hewl>moony: But it is.
05:26<moony>at the boot art.
05:26<moony>and your root commands still were ineffetive?
05:26<hewl>moony: Are you saying to uninstall driver-nvidia while KDE is not running?
05:26<moony>yes
05:26<hewl>moony: I have not tried that.
05:26<moony>while NO graphics are running
05:27<moony>before graphic boot up
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05:27<moony>you can't remove the driver, because it's using it.
05:27<moony>But it's not the right one.
05:27<moony>you just need to go into bash before graphics boot
05:27<moony>and remove it there.
05:27<hewl>moony: That makes sense in a way, though on Windows you could just uninstall it from Programs and Features even while the system was running and it'd just ask to reset after it was done.
05:27<moony>if needed, remove the entire package, retinstall specific.
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05:28<moony>Windows is made to plug n play
05:28<moony>linux isn't.
05:28<hewl>moony: Is there a way to do this so if anything stuffs up I can resume the system as it was previously? Like System Restore?
05:28<moony>Remember, Windows came way after linux.
05:28<moony>Um, there are apps to make an ISO copy
05:28<moony>yes, let me get you one
05:28<moony>sec
05:29<moony>ok, I use a sparky fork, but they're both debian based
05:29<moony>so this package will sound strange, but sec
05:29<hewl>rsnapshot
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05:30<moony>let me verify before I tell you mine, because it will have extra dependencies I'm sure.
05:30<moony>Yes
05:30<moony>this is what you need
05:30<moony>Make a bootable ISO of your current system
05:30<moony>then you're playing with a backup.
05:31<hewl>moony: So like a live cd?
05:31<moony>exactly.
05:31<hewl>moony: But how would you restore from a live cd?
05:31<moony>The package from sparky is the following...
05:32<moony>sparky-backup-sys
05:32<moony>let me get you the repo
05:32<moony>sec
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05:32<moony>like I said, they're both debian based
05:32<moony>shoudl be no issues.
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05:33<moony>deb http://sparkylinux.org/repo/ testing main
05:33<moony>That's what I use
05:33<hewl>moony: I'd rather not introduce more repositories into my already bloated list
05:33<moony>but you can find a tool for your exact debian 8
05:33<moony>You just need an image creator
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05:33<moony>it doesn't HAVE to be live
05:33<leonidas1>I run Debian Unstable and there's a long list of packages that have been "kept back" when I run "apt-get upgrade". Is this normal?
05:33<moony>that's just preference
05:33<moony>burn it to a dvd
05:33<moony>Yes leonidas
05:34<moony>I run rolling debian as well
05:34<leonidas1>@moony, ok ty
05:34<themill>leonidas1: yes, you would need to dist-upgrade (and of course, packages might not actually be installable or upgradable on any given day)
05:34<moony>^ yes
05:35<moony>@hewl you just need an ISO maker of your current build
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05:35<moony>@hewl you can back it up anywhere you please.
05:35<moony>@hewl but what you need to do in recovery mode's bash is safe.
05:35<moony>@hewl I wouldn't tell you unless I knew and had done it.
05:36<hewl>moony: I can always restore by just running the reverse commands. I'll only get screwed if the system fails to boot or something.
05:36<moony>it won't, not on that.
05:36<moony>You're just removing those unneccesary drivers and installing the necessary ones..
05:37<moony>You have one hanging file.
05:37<moony>You
05:37<moony>You're good.
05:37<hewl>moony: Incorrect.
05:37<moony>If you had multiple dependicies, than I'd be worried.
05:37<moony>But just that one driver file, you're OK.
05:37<moony>I assure you.
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05:37<hewl>moony: Nouveau drivers are installed by the Debian installer. I do not need to install them. This is my understanding. They will be put to use once nvidia-driver is purged.
05:38<moony>Especially when you're running early NVIDIA GTX and it's an INTEL driver.
05:38<moony>Exactly.
05:38<moony>But if you can't get that one file gone
05:38<moony>Remove the ENTIRE package, and tell it to install nouveau
05:38<moony>make sense?
05:38-!-dooteo [~dooteo@188.86.38.45] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
05:39<moony>The installer looks at your hardware and installs what it needs
05:39<moony>not ALL drivers
05:39<hewl>moony: As of right now, nvidia-driver is claimed to not be installed. All but two of its dependencies are installed. These are what I need to be removed, and that can be done with "sudo apt-get remove -purge nvidia-driver". Is this information correct?
05:39<moony>It can make a mistake, that's the documentation I'm finding on NVIDIA and noveau
05:39<moony>Yes, I don't THINK the "-" before purge is needed.
05:40<moony>should be like the following
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05:40<moony>sudo apt-get purge nvidia-driver
05:40<hewl>"command line option 'p' [from -purge] is not known"
05:40<moony>do this then
05:41<hewl>without the hyphen,
05:41<hewl>"unable to locate package purge"
05:41<hewl>I swear this is the exact command I used last time. I'm just -s btw
05:41<moony>it should be no hypen
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05:41<hewl>"sudo apt-get remove nvidia-driver purge -s" is what I'm running.
05:41<moony>I"m going to run the command on my own system and hit n
05:42<moony>sec
05:42<xenomorph_xx_121>apt purge, or apt remove --purge
05:42<hewl>that's it
05:42<moony>Yeah, I know he can use just apt instead of apt-get
05:42<moony>but apt-get should have purge as well
05:42<hewl>two hyphens, not one
05:42<moony>yeah
05:42<hewl>fml
05:42<moony>that would be it.
05:42<hewl>anyway going to boot into recovery and try this now
05:42<moony>I'll be here.
05:43<hewl>"Package 'nvidia-driver' is not installed." Nothing was removed.
05:43<moony>If that dependency is being used, it's loaded
05:43<xenomorph_xx_121>long options (with --whole --words) usually have 2 hyphens. short options (e.g. -v) are only one hyphen
05:43<moony>you're running your graphics
05:43<ach>hi
05:43<moony>xenomorph, he's running an INTEL driver and he needs the nouveau running
05:44<moony>suggestions?
05:44<moony>He can't remove the intel, my only way I know is before the DM loads up
05:44<hewl>moony: I'm just going to install nvidia-driver and then remove --purge it. Seems to be the easiest.
05:44<moony>Same thing essentially
05:44<moony>I see no damage.
05:45<hewl>I'll be going to recovery and doing that now then, see you later.
05:45<xenomorph_xx_121>if you just want to remove unused dependencies, apt autoremove --purge
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05:45<moony>I'll be here.
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05:45<moony>He tried.
05:45<moony>But I think the dependency was being used by nouveau because of his NVIDIA GTX
05:45<moony>But his only problem is his lock/unlock
05:45<moony>I think it's a KDE software issue
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05:49<hewl>they're still installed
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05:51<hewl>should I just make a list of all the dependencies and remove --purge them one by one?
05:52<moony>If it will, but that's really strange unless you have intel drivers that you're missing
05:52<moony>are you on a laptop or desktop?
05:52<hewl>"unless you have intel drivers that you're missing" what
05:52<moony>are your graphics integrated?
05:52<moony>You're still running the i3...
05:53<hewl>moony: I'm on a custom built desktop with a Nvidia GeForce GTX 750Ti.
05:53<moony>you will need the intel drivers...
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05:53<moony>FML, I was half asleep
05:53<hewl>moony: i3 because it was cheapest but faster than the quad cores they had
05:53<moony>You still need your processor drivers
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05:53<moony>I'm not downing it, I wasn't thinking.
05:53<moony>I'm running the i3 also
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05:53<moony>The driver is needed for your processor
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05:54<moony>not your graphics card.
05:54<parrot>ew
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05:54<hewl>moony: I'm confused. Is it not removing/purging those packages because the proccessor requires them? Why would a processor require graphics drivers?
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05:54<moony>They're not graphics cards
05:54<moony>they're drivers
05:54<moony>all hardware requires drivers
05:55<moony>the GEFORCE GTX is your graphics card
05:55<moony>Your i3 is an intel and needs drivers
05:55<moony>That's why that intel package won't purge.
05:56<moony>They're two seperate drivers for two seperate pieces of hardware
05:56<towo^work>from what are you talking about?
05:56<hewl>moony: But I'm not purging any intel packages. I'm purging nvidia-drivers. They simply aren't related.
05:56<moony>but you're running an NVIDIA GTX
05:56<moony>it won't let you purge it's required driver
05:56<hewl>towo^work: trying to uninstall nvidia-driver after installing them. They seem to not be uninstalling because they might be being used.
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05:57<hewl>moony: Then how was my computer running at all before I installed nvidia-driver?
05:57<moony>@towo^work the GTX series graphics cards are a grey area with debian. Thoughts?
05:57<moony>Because of linux's default.
05:57<bluca>they can be removed just fine
05:57<towo^work>hewl, apt purge $(dpkg -l | awk '/nvidia/{ print $2 }') would do that
05:57<moony>he can't remove them
05:57<bluca>what is the error that it shows when you remove them?
05:57<hewl>moony: Then I'd hardly think it'd be "required"
05:57<towo^work>moony, sure he cant
05:58<towo^work>grr
05:58<towo^work>moony, sure he can
05:58<moony>Then you take over
05:58<hewl>bluca: There is no error. The driver's dependencies are still present after rebooting.
05:58<moony>I've been trying for three hours
05:58<bluca>then remove them
05:58<moony>lol
05:58<moony>He cant purge them
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05:58<moony>or remove
05:58<moony>in recovery mode or full boot
05:58<moony>we've tried.
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05:59<towo^work>moony, pls don't tell fud
05:59<hewl>sudo apt-get remove nvidia-driver --purge only removes the meta package and the OGL libraries.. The dependencies stay.
05:59<bluca>again, what's the error shown when removing them?
05:59<moony>fud =
05:59<hewl>bluca: There is no error message. As far as its concern it runs successfully.
05:59<bluca>I mean when removing the left overs
06:00<hewl>sudo apt-get autoremove successfully removes 45MB worth of packages.
06:00<hewl>the drivers are still installed and being used, however
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06:00<hewl>hell I just opened nvidia x server settings
06:00<moony>@towo^work what is fud?
06:01<bluca>nvidia-setting is separate and you can run it without any driver
06:01<bluca>get the list of any leftover packages, and remove --purge them
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06:02<hewl>bluca: Some are depencies for other packages, such as nvidia-settings.
06:02<hewl>bluca: nvidia-settings however is not a dependency of nvidia-driver.
06:02<hewl>bluca: However it wasn't installed before I installed nvidia-driver
06:03<bluca>yes, it's a recommends, as it's not required
06:03<moony>@towo^work by fud do you mean full user directory? If so, sorry, but I've typed a lot and wasn't even thinking of it as a group chat any longer.
06:04<hewl>bluca: And recommends are installed by default while suggestions are not?
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06:04<bluca>yes
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06:05<moony>@bluca if this was a language barrier, I failed at life.
06:05<hewl>bluca: How do I see what recommendeds were installed and is there a way to remove them based on the original package that caused their installation?
06:05<hewl>moony: I'll be trying --purge with autoremove as well.
06:06<moony>@hewl autoremove I use VERY commmon. It's much different than purge.
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06:06<moony>@hewl purge means FORCE. Autoremove just cleans us caches and previously used package downloads
06:06<hewl>moony: autoremove is a command for apt-get which you can use options on, such as purge. What are you saying?
06:07<moony>@hewl You have it correct.
06:07<moony>@hewl It's also a useful daily cleaning command when used alone.
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06:07<jmcnaught>purge doesn't mean force, it means also remove configurations (which remove does not do)
06:07<moony>right, purge means get rid of all
06:07<jmcnaught>apt-get autoremove is not to be used blindly
06:07<moony>I'm trying to work around language barriers.
06:08<moony>"apt-get autoremove" as an alone command can do no harm that I know of besides on rolling distros where the kernel doesn't know what it wants/needs.
06:09<hewl>I'm going into recovery mode and killing everything that nvidia-driver depends on. I will return with the results.
06:09<moony>If you're running stable like he is, autoremove should be near harmless.
06:09<jmcnaught>moony: not true
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06:09<moony>Please, educate me. and I mean that in honest.
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06:10<moony>@jmcnaught please, I would like to know the possible dangers.
06:11<jmcnaught>moony: you always need to carefully read what apt-get wants to remove. Say a user removed the iceweasel package, which removes gnome and gnome-core metapackages. Running "apt-get autoremove" could remove most of GNOME and Xorg at that point depending on how it was installed
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06:11<moony>@jmcnaught well, yes of course, maybe I'm wrong by assuming that's common sense?
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06:12<moony>@jmcnaught I mean by that, it's pretty verbose.
06:12<moony>@jmcnaught If you can't maintain a package, you can't maintain a system.
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06:14<jmcnaught>moony: we just shouldn't be telling people in #debian that apt-get autoremove is harmless and should be run daily. at least once a week someone is in here after not reading everything that will be removed
06:14<moony>@jmcnaught I understand that.
06:14<moony>@jmcnaught Sorry, it's been a rough 3 hour intro to debian help.
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06:15<moony>@jmcnaught I grew up in Slackware, I forget how foreign bash is to some.
06:15<moony>@jmcnaught a habit I'm trying to break by being here, btw. I roll debian kernels and everything else I write.
06:18<moony>@jmcnaught I forget where there's a shell, there's a disaster.
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06:23<hewl>I'm not able to start my DE now. I'm using the terminal to connect to irc.
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06:25<hewl>apt-get install nvidia-driver is failing. I cannot restore the system back to the way it was.
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06:25<jm_>if you don't mention exact errors, people aren't able to help
06:26<hewl>jm_: I was waiting for someone to ask for clarification. Now I look back upon that it's a bit silly.
06:26<hewl>So I ran "apt-get remove nvidia-driver --purge" and it ran successfully. Then autoremove took ~40MB worth away.
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06:27<jm_>hewl: it's better to start with as many details as possible
06:28-!-mode/#debian [+l 734] by debhelper
06:28<hewl>Still had the dependencies for nvidia-driver installed. So as instructed I started to purge them one by one. They all came with the error "dpkg: error processing package xserver-xorg-video-nvidia: subprocess installed post-removal script returned error exit status 20".
06:29<hewl>All the packages except for libgl1-nvidia-glx stayed installed. I ran "apt-get install nvidia-driver" so I wouldn't have a system that had no proper driver installed but that failed saying it couldn't configure xserver-xorg-video-nvidia properly hence it cancelled installation.
06:29<hewl>Now I cannot use startx to boot into KDE, as it claims there are no screens available.
06:30<jm_>edit /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg-video-nvidia/post* and add "set -x" as second line, without "", and run dpkg --pending --configure
06:31<hewl>jm_: this is a hard thing for me to do via terminal. What is the purpose of it?
06:31<jm_>hewl: then just run it manually, sh -x /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg-video-nvidia/postinst configure
06:32<hewl>jm_: But how does that work if the packages have refused to be installed?
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06:32<jm_>hewl: let's do one thing at a time ...
06:34<hewl>jm_: xserver-xorg-video-nvidia's install status is currently "half-installed", as claimed by dpkg.
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06:34<jm_>hewl: yes because postinst fails, I'm waiting for you to tell me which part in it fails
06:35<hewl>jm_: So after running apt-get install nvidia-driver?
06:35<jm_>hewl: no, run the command I gave you above sh -x ....
06:35<jm_>«sh -x /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg-video-nvidia/postinst configure»
06:37<hewl>jm_ It doesn't need double quotation marks?
06:37<jm_>hewl: no, remove «»
06:37<hewl>jm_ does it need root privleges?
06:37<moony>@jm_ the last word two words is messing him up
06:37<jm_>hewl: probably not, but not sure
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06:37<hewl>jm_ It says it can't find it.
06:38<hewl>jm_ I'll run it with sudo.
06:38<jm_>hewl: do you have postrm there?
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06:38<hewl>jm_ Same thing, it cannot find it.
06:38<hewl>jm_ I do not have postrm there.
06:39<hewl>jm_ Oh wait you mean I should search the directory for that file?
06:39<jm_>I am a moron, it's /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg-video-nvidia.postinst
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06:39<jm_>hewl: ^^^^^
06:39<jm_>so . not /
06:39<hewl>jm_ oh ok I'll try that
06:40<jm_>brainfart because I was looking at it in mc ...
06:40<jm_>(no longer use nvidia driver here)
06:41<hewl>jm_: "ERROR: DPKG_MAINTSCRIPT_PACKAGE is not set, usually a bug in dpkg-reconfigure"
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06:42<jm_>hewl: did you run postinst or postrm?
06:42<hewl>jm_: postinst
06:42<hewl>jm_: Should I run postrm?
06:42<jm_>hewl: ok then it;s best if you edit it
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06:43<hewl>jm_: Edit the file which I just executed? What would I do?
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06:44<jm_>hewl: sed -i -e 's/set -e/set -x\nset -e/' /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg-video-nvidia.postinst
06:44<jm_>then run dpkg --pending --configure
06:44<hewl>jm_: I'm sorry I don't understand those editing instructions. I have the file opened in nano.
06:45<jm_>hewl: ahh OK then, just add "set -x" as 2nd line, before the "set -e" line
06:45<jm_>save the file and run the above command
06:45<jm_>(all as root)
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06:47<hewl>jm_: "dependency problems [...] nvidia-driver depends on xserver-xorg-video-nvidia (=340.96-1); however: Package xserver-xorg-video-nvidia is not installed"
06:48<jm_>hewl: what did you run?
06:49<hewl>"sudo dpkg --pending --configure"
06:49<hewl>without double quotes
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06:52<jm_>ok do this: script /tmp/dpkg.out - this will start a new shell, repeat the dpkg command, then type exit, then put /tmp/dpkg.out on the paste site
06:52<hewl>jm_: I don't know how to put /tmp/dpkg.out on the paste site. I especially don't know how to do that from terminal.
06:54<jm_>hewl: you can use a browser like lynx/links or a CLI tool -- /msg dpkg paste
06:54<hewl>jm_: That mean I have to install more packages?
06:54<jm_>hewl: ohh good point, that might fail
06:54<jm_>you don't have any of those installed now?
06:55<hewl>jm_: Unless they were installed by Debian installer, I do not.
06:55<bluca>I have seen xserver-xorg-video-nvidia barf out before
06:55<bluca>never managed to get to the bottom of it, but in short it checks for mismatching modules/libraries
06:55<bluca>when removing, it -should- be safe to ignore
06:55<hewl>bluca: My DE fails to start up. I don't classify that as safe.
06:56<jm_>yeah, it's probably the same problem for him
06:56<bluca>yes because it's half removed, right?
06:56<bluca>by ignoring I mean to hack the postinst to remove the checks
06:56<bluca>so that dpkg can complete
06:56<bluca>and you can get back to a consistent state
06:56<hewl>bluca: Sorry I shouldn't be passive aggressive. I'm just a bit frustrated by this. I appreciate any and all help I can get on this manner, especially since I can't browse the web at the moment.
06:56<bluca>no worries
06:56<jm_>do you have curl installed?
06:57<hewl>jm_: No.
06:57<jm_>ok then edit the postinst and postrm and add "exit 0" as the last line, see if it helps
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06:57<hewl>bluca: How can one hack the postinst to remove the checks? My ultimate goal is to just remove nvidia-driver and use nouveau, btw.
06:58<bluca>as jm_ said, the file you opened before to add -x
06:58<hewl>exit 0 or -x?
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06:59<jm_>exit 0
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07:00<hewl>jm_: Does "set -x" need to be included in the second line of postrm as well?
07:00<jm_>hewl: it can stay if you'll purge these packages anyway
07:01<hewl>jm_: Right now there is no "set -x" line in postrm. Is it required to use "exit 0" later on?
07:01<jm_>hewl: no
07:01<jm_>set -x tells shell to show all commands as they are executed etc.
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07:02<hewl>jm_: I have appended "exit 0" to the end of both postinst and postrm. Now what do I do?
07:02<jm_>so it can help us find out where it goes wrong, if we want to find the reason
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07:02<jm_>hewl: try removing the remaining nvidia packages
07:03<hewl>jm_: The exact same error. I used apt-get install nvidia-driver.
07:03<jm_>hewl: I thought you want to remove nvidia driver and switch to nouveau, so which is it?
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07:05<hewl>jm_: I run install nvidia-driver first so autoremove can successfully remove the extra packages later, otherwise they will remain on my system if the first removal doesn't work.
07:05<hewl>Also the dpkg command from earlier also fails in the same manner.
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07:05<jm_>hewl: ok then edit both files and comment out "set -e" - put # in front of them
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07:05<jm_>should have done that before
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07:06<hewl>jm_ Doesn't that make them not executable?
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07:06<jm_>hewl: yes, we don't want set -e
07:06<hewl>jm_ Ok I'll comment them out.
07:07<hewl>jm_: Commented out. Tried installing again. Same error.
07:07<hewl>jm_: Should I be using the -f for apt-get?
07:08<jm_>hewl: yeah try that, if I was you I'd just remove them all with dpkg
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07:09<hewl>jm_: The exact same error message. Literally exactly the same. It suggests using -f, even though that is literally what I just used.
07:09<jm_>hewl: then just purge those packages with dpkg
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07:09<hewl>jm_ How do I do that?
07:10<hewl>jm_ Also how do I make it so the operating system uses the nouveau driver instead of nvidia's?
07:10<jm_>hewl: haven't people given you the commands before?
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07:10<hewl>jm_ I've never used dpkg before in my life. I've used apt-get to install and remove packages.
07:10<jm_>hewl: it does that by default if you don't have nvidia stuff + xorg config for it installed
07:10<hewl>jm_ But I may have the xorg config
07:11<towo^work>+if there is no blacklist for nouveau over
07:11<hewl>jm_ I was using it to enable the triple buffer. Also I think as towo said, nvidia-driver might blacklist the nouveau driver.
07:11<jm_>hewl: as I said before, one thing at a time - first check what this shows -- dpkg -l | awk '/nvidia/{ print $2 }'
07:12<hewl>jm_: A bunch of the dependencies for the nvidia drivers.
07:12<jm_>hewl: ok now try to remove it all dpkg -P $(dpkg -l | awk '/nvidia/{ print $2 }')
07:13<hewl>jm_ Plus any package I have installed that has nvidia in its name, such as nvidia-detect.
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07:15<hewl>jm_ Okay, I have a screen from what looks like the Debian text based installer. It says "NVIDIA driver still enabled in xorg.conf [...] xorg cannot be restarted successfully until NVIDIA is disabled in the following config files: /etc/X11/xorg.conf"
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07:15<jm_>hewl: yeah rename that file
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07:16<hewl>jm_: I don't know how to do that.
07:16<hewl>jm_: Is this for backup purposes? Would renaming to "xorg.conf.backup" suffice?
07:16<jm_>hewl: sure
07:17<hewl>jm_: How do I do this from the terminal?
07:17<jm_>hewl: you don't know the mv command?
07:17<petn-randall>hewl: mv xorg.conf xorg.conf.backup
07:17<hewl>I'll need the full path to it but yes I understand that.
07:17<hewl>however
07:18<jm_>it's in /etc/X11
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07:18<hewl>after dismissing the aforementioned screen, "Errors were encountered while processing: nvidia-installer-cleanup xserver-xorg-video-nvidia". Should I be concerned about this?
07:19<hewl>xserver-xorg-video-nvidia IS STILL INSTALLED
07:20<jm_>even if you repeat the dpkg command?
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07:22<hewl>jm_: "dpkg: error processing package nvidia-installer-cleanup: dependency problems - not removing" and "Removing xserver-xorg-video-nvidia ... Purging configuration files"
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07:22<hewl>xserver-xorg-video-nvidia is now removed from the system. Nvidia-installer-cleanup is not. I don't care about this. I'll deal with it later.
07:23<jm_>find out if you have anything that depends on it still installed
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07:23<jm_>I see a few packages depend on it
07:24<jm_>but they have nvidia in the name so that dpkg command should have removed them
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07:24<jm_>aha one that's not like that is glx-diversions, also, the xserver-xorg-video-nvidia does depend on it so running it again might do the job
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07:25<hewl>jm_: I still have configs in xorg.conf.d specifically for the nvidia driver. Does this matter?
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07:26<bluca>if still installed, you must remove also glx-alternative-mesa glx-alternative-nvidia glx-diversions
07:26<jm_>hewl: yeah move those elsewhere too
07:26<jm_>also check /etc/modprobe.d just in case
07:27<hewl>jm_ I already have them backed up elsewhere. How do I delete a folder and its contents in terminal?
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07:27<hewl>bluca: Why glx-alternative-mesa?
07:28<jm_>hewl: directory! rm -rf, but please be careful doing it as root
07:28<bluca>because it adds alternatives for mesa libs so that it can be diverted by nvidia/amd drivers
07:30<hewl>jm_: -rf does not appear in man rm. What does it do?
07:30<jm_>hewl: -r and -f do though
07:31<hewl>jm_: Why would we force this?
07:31<jm_>-r is for dirs, -f means delete the dir even if it's not empty
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07:31<jm_>hewl: because otherwise it refuses to remove dirs if they are not empty ...
07:31<jm_>so you have the choice - use rm dir/* && rm -r dir or rm -rf dir
07:32<hewl>jm_ Operation completed successfully. bluca: I'll check those packages.
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07:32<jm_>so check modprobe.d dir, then make sure nouveau driver is installed
07:32<hewl>bluca: They are installed. Should I remove them?
07:32<bluca>yes
07:33<bluca>wait
07:34<bluca>let me double check the rdepds
07:34<bluca>*rdeps
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07:34<hewl>bluca: oh jesus autoremove wants to kill linux-headers-amd64 that seems important
07:35<hewl>jm_ What is the path to modprobe.d?
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07:35<jm_>hewl: I already gave you full path -- <jm_> also check /etc/modprobe.d just in case
07:36<bluca>yes, good to remove the glx-diversions stuff
07:36<bluca>the headers are needed for the local build of kernel modules, which is just for the proprietary drivers, not nouveau
07:37<hewl>jm_ I don't know how to scroll in terminal, sorry. bluca: autoremove wants to remove some pretty important looking stuff, like linux-headers-amd64, pkg-config, dkms and fakeroot. Are you sure?
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07:37<jm_>hewl: try pageup/pagedown in your irc client
07:37<bluca>those are build dependencies for the dkms kernel modules
07:37<hewl>jm_: What file inside modprobe.d should I look at? There are three.
07:38<bluca>if you don't feel confident removing them, install them and they will be set to manually installed
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07:38<jm_>none of that is very important on a desktop system, if something needs it, it will pull it back
07:38<bluca>"apt-get install pkg-config" etc
07:38<jm_>hewl: try grep nouveau /etc/modprobe.d/*
07:38<hewl>I will go through with the autoremove, then.
07:38<bluca>but it's just to build the nvidia-kernel-dkms package
07:39<hewl>jm_ That command gives no output.
07:39<hewl>jm_ Are you sure you didn't mean nvidia instead of nouveau?
07:39<jm_>hewl: yes I am sure, so rebuild your initramfs just in case - update-initramfs -u
07:40<hewl>jm_ Does that need root?
07:40<EmleyMoor>Is there a tool for defragmenting a vfat filesystem in Debian?
07:40<jm_>hewl: yes
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07:41<hewl>EmleyMoor: If using Debian to write to that partition you don't really need to defrag.
07:42<hewl>jm_ The grep command from earlier still gives no output.
07:42<EmleyMoor>hewl: Semi-OK but there's a technical reason why in this particular case it might be necessary
07:42<jm_>hewl: yeah so all seems to be OK, install the nouveau driver and try rebooting
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07:42<hewl>EmleyMoor: Unfortunately I can't really help from the state I'm in. I've never had to defrag so I don't know any packages.
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07:43<hewl>jm_: Are you kidding me? The nouveau driver should already be installed. In fact it's impossible to remove like that nvidia driver because it's a dependencies from the Debian install.
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07:43<hewl>jm_: Does this mean that I have a system which is simply configured to not use any drivers?
07:44<jm_>hewl: no, it's easily possible to install a debian system without it installed, i.e. mine doesn't have it -- if you are sure you already have then ...
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07:45<hewl>jm_ Sorry for being a bit snappy. This has been dragging on for a really long time and I'm getting tired also. I'm sorry. I've been told conflicting information in the past.
07:45<hewl>jm_ Right now the grep command searching for nouveau does not find anything. I presume this means the system is not configured to use nouveau.
07:45<hewl>jm_ Is this correct?
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07:46<jm_>hewl: no, X does auto config so in general you don't need to configure it specifically to use nouveau (unlike for the nvidia driver)
07:47<hewl>jm_ So a simple reboot at this point in time should make Debian use nouveau to boot KDE?
07:47<jm_>hewl: hopefully yes
07:47<hewl>jm_ I have nouveau installed, just checked.
07:47<jm_>hewl: check with man nouveau if it supports your card
07:47<hewl>xserver-xorg-video-nouveau
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07:48<hewl>jm_ It says it supports GeForce 7XXX, so I presume that covers the GTX 750Ti.
07:48<towo^work>no, it doesn't
07:48<towo^work>but normaly your system will fallback to vesa
07:48<jm_>hewl: not in general, specific product ID-s matter
07:48<hewl>towo^work: It also, on a separate entry, says it supports GTX 750.
07:49<jm_>hewl: you can grab it from backports if it doesn't work
07:49<jm_>then it shouldwork
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07:49<hewl>jm_ What's the worst that can happen at this point? I'd just boot back into terminal.
07:49<hewl>Going to reboot. Wish me luck.
07:49<towo^work>in fact, the kernel module nouveau does not support that card
07:50<hewl>wait
07:50<towo^work>*module from 3.16
07:50<jm_>hewl: yes
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07:50<hewl>towo^work: Where did you get this information?
07:51<jm_>so best to grab both kernel and nouveau from bpo
07:51<hewl>jm_ If I'm going to be upgrading such a core component of my system would it be worth it to just upgrade to stretch?
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07:52<jm_>hewl: core as in kernel? it won't remove the old kernel so you can simply select the old one at boot if new one has problems
07:53<jm_>hewl: but no, I would not recommend stretch for you
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07:54<hewl>jm_ Does installing an additional kernel require super advanced configuration techniques such as editing the bootloader to include it as an entry?
07:54<hewl>jm_ Because by god I will not do that via terminal.
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07:54<jm_>hewl: no, it's all done automatically by debian
07:55<hewl>jm_ Since I already have the repositories, would all that's needed to be done is "sudo apt-get install linux-kernel"?
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07:55<jm_>hewl: maybe you'll need -t jessie-backports there, depends on your configuration
07:56<jm_>!bpo kernel
07:56<dpkg>Newer kernels for Debian stable releases are available from the "jessie-backports" repository. Ask me about <jessie backports> to modify your sources.list, then run «aptitude update». To install the current backported kernel: «aptitude -t jessie-backports install linux-image-`uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'`». To list available backported kernel image packages: «aptitude search '?narrow(~nlinux-image,?origin(Debian Backports))'».
07:56<jm_>obviously use apt-get if you normally use that instead of aptitude
07:56<hewl>jm_ why is everything so complicated
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07:57<jm_>look rather simple to me
07:57<hewl>jm_ Ok before I attempt to do that I'm going to reboot my system and see if it just works.
07:58<hewl>jm_ If not I'll need to find out which uname of the linux kernel I need so I can use that smiley induce command to get the newer linux kernel.
07:59<hewl>jm_ wait why did you tell me to include -t when dpkg says otherwise?
07:59<bremner>tbh, it's only complicated because it tries to automate things
07:59<jm_>hewl: actually no, it says the same thing "«aptitude -t jessie-backports install ..."
08:00<hewl>jm_ my apologies, misread it
08:00<hewl>ok going to reboot, will tell of results
08:00<jm_>that uname thing gives you architecture name
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08:03<hewl>ok so now I'm using a 800x600 resolution screen and it won't go higher, pretty sure this means the driver was uninstalled successfully
08:03<hewl>I'm back into KDE
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08:04<jm_>!which gfx driver
08:05<jm_>!which video driver
08:05<dpkg>To show the video driver used by your X server «egrep 'Load.*mod.*driv|UnloadModule' /var/log/Xorg.0.log». Also ask me about <fglrx>, <nvidia>, <which driver>, <nodriver>, <judd-hardware>.
08:05<jm_>check what that shows
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08:05<hewl>jm_ uh..
08:06<hewl>jm_ I see "modules/drivers/nouveau_drv.so" somewhere there, but no where else in the fifteen or so lines.
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08:07<jm_>hewl: does it say UnloadModule nouveau too?
08:08<hewl>jm_ No.
08:08<jm_>hewl: is 800x600 your native resolution?
08:08<hewl>jm_ No. Native is 1080p.
08:09<jm_>hewl: ok then maybe check X log to see what is going on -- /var/log/Xorg.0.log - I will have to go leave soon
08:10<hewl>It's failing to load module "nv".
08:11<hewl>jm_ There also seems to be screen delay and screen tearing.
08:11<bluca>that's a very old module name afaik so should be ok
08:12<bluca>as it was said above, your gpu is not supported on 3.16 kernel
08:12<bluca>so it falls back to vesa
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08:13<bluca>upgrading the kernel (and perhaps libdrm2 and libgl1-mesa-glx too) should help
08:13<hewl>I think I might also put this to rest for today and try fixing it in three days time when I get more free time again.
08:13<hewl>Thank you all for the help you provided.
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08:14<hewl>bluca: For future reference, presuming backports repositories are already installed, what command in apt-get would that be?
08:15<bluca>it was pasted above by the bot
08:15<hewl>bluca: I had to reboot. It's not in my scroll.
08:15<bluca>apt-get install -t jessie-backports linux-image-`uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'`
08:15<bluca>the uname sed is just to get the architecture
08:15<hewl>bluca: Thank you.
08:15<bluca>I guess it's amd64?
08:15<hewl>bluca: Yes.
08:16<bluca>if so the package is just linux-image-amd64
08:16<hewl>so,
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08:16<hewl>apt-get install -t jessie-backports linux-image-amd64
08:16<bluca>yep
08:16<hewl>bluca: So the smileys are just there to grab the version, nothing else. Awesome.
08:16<bluca>it will become the default, but you can alsways switch back to 3.16 at boot during the grub menu
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08:17<hewl>bluca: thank you for the information. I learned a lot today.
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09:30<zathras>Hi. Does anyone her ehave any info on Debian and the Open API Initiative (formally Swager) ?
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09:31<zathras>(ie packages to support it)
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09:37<AwesomeBot>!admin
09:37<dpkg>hmm... admin is like a omnipresent god, or http://home.datacomm.ch/prutishauser/humor/hack/know.ur.sysadmin.html, or and the guy you should always blame for problems with your computer
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09:49<aleksey>kde debian the hard disk does not show all size
09:51<Echoz>aleksey: how much did you expect to see and what did you see?
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09:54<aleksey>3 days
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10:42<blast007>aleksey: days?
10:44<petn-randall>aleksey: "days" is a usual unit to measure disk size.
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11:03<zathras>sounds like a crystal ball
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11:43<Guest1065>hi..Anybody
11:43<itd>Guest1065: hello
11:44<Guest1065>hi.
11:44<Guest1065>im from Brasil and i need to resolv one problem on Debian 8 kernell 4.7
11:45<Guest1065>failed to find cpu0 device node
11:45<Guest1065>Do you have a solution?
11:46<Guest1065>im not speak english very well
11:46<Guest1065>im sorry
11:46<itd>!pt
11:46<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
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11:48<Guest1065>thanks
11:49<itd>Guest1065: and if you want help you probably should give more information
11:49<blast007>are you actually having an issue with the computer beyond a message?
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11:51<Guest1065>itd
11:52<Guest1065>what kind of information
11:52<blast007>Guest1065: what problem are you having with the computer?
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11:53<itd>Guest1065: start with answering the questions of blast007 :)
11:53<Guest1065>I'm analyzing the output of dmesg and has this message in red
11:54<Guest1065>"failed to find cpu0 device node"
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11:55<Guest1065>I want to know if i can ignore
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11:56-!-Q-Master is "Vladimir Berezenko" on #debian-next #debian #debianppc
11:56<Guest1065>our has the corret
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11:57<blast007>Guest1065: that can probably be ignored as it sounds like *most* x86 systems do not use a device node. I saw a mention that the OLPC uses it. are you having an actual issue with your computer?
11:58<blast007>"This is a warning message from the OF layer in the kernel. Since i686 has CONFIG_OF enabled (for OLPC reasons) and your machine doesn't utilize OF or device trees, it errors out. There's nothing actually wrong here." https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1254210
11:58<C-Keen>I think that's from a cpufreq module
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12:00<blast007>"Such message is related to DT (Open Firmware Device Tree), and is enabled only on x86, there is no such thing on x86_64. Of course such option does not make sense if your hardware is not an embedded device." https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=199901
12:00<blast007>so you can just ignore it
12:01<Guest1065>thank you blast007
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12:03-!-Linked is "realname" on #debian
12:03<Guest1065>very good this channel.
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14:34<ZeroDarkLux>Hello, I'm setting up openvpn but when I use the init script or systemctl the vpn is not started... I see it takes the config file if I manually do : openvpn --config /etc/openvpn/server.conf
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14:34<ZeroDarkLux>with the init script there's only the started message that shows
14:35<ZeroDarkLux>no logs at all
14:35<PerfDave>ZeroDarkLux: Have you looked in /etc/default/openvpn ?
14:35<ZeroDarkLux>PerfDave, there is nothing useful there from what I could understand...
14:36<ZeroDarkLux>unless I'm forced to activate the AUTOSTART=all
14:36<PerfDave>ZeroDarkLux: The AUTOSTART variable doesn't look relevant?
14:36<Demian9>hello all :) I want to ask if it is known what version of KDE desktop will be used in debian 9? the recent release 5.8 LTS?
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14:37<PerfDave>ZeroDarkLux: I recommend taking a look at /usr/share/doc/openvpn/README.Debian.gz
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14:39<PerfDave>Demian9: Possibly one to ask #debian-kde
14:40<Demian9>oh, ok. i'll ask there :-)
14:41<ZeroDarkLux>PerfDave, from /etc/default/openvpn I see that for AUTOSTART If empty, "all" is assumed
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14:42<ZeroDarkLux>But I start does nothing, not even a message saying autostart is disabled like the init script does
14:42<ZeroDarkLux>If does start the VPN if I do systemctl start openvpn@server
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14:42<vincenet>hello here, I am trying the netinstall and it freeze at 12 percent during dpkg step. It seems it already happen in the past but update correct this. Concerning my case, I use the 8.6. Any idea ? should i ask somewhere else ?
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14:43<Echoz>Demian9: I really hope so...
14:43<ZeroDarkLux>either the systemd unit is not doing the same thing as the init script or the comment in default is outdated for systemd
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14:58<vincenet>I chose the version amd64 for my processor intel cleron N2807, is that correct ?
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14:58<csnxs>a quick google search says yes
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14:59<vincenet>thks csnxs
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14:59<vincenet>i do not know why it freeze during the install
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15:01<blast007>vincenet: where does it freeze during the install? are you installing from a CD/DVD or a flash drive? if a flash drive, how did you prepare the flash drive?
15:02<vincenet>from the iso netinstall amd64 on a usb stick
15:02<vincenet>install starts and freeze during dpkg step
15:03<vincenet>usb stick prepared from ubuntu with sudo copy thedebian.iso /dev/sdb
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15:11<Human_G33k>somebody can explain me why hpscan depends of systemd and systemd-shim ?
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15:12<blast007>vincenet: when it appears frozen, are you able to switch to another virtual terminal with Alt+F2 ?
15:12<blast007>1~
15:12<blast007>oops, sorry :)
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15:13<itd_>Human_G33k: what is "hpscan"?
15:13<Human_G33k>my bad hplip
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15:14<mimmo>xdcc
15:14<mimmo>ciao
15:14<mimmo>!list
15:14<dpkg>mimmo: vedi http://packages.debian.org/
15:15<vincenet>I have to check. Is there a way to see a log in live in case i become frozen ?
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15:15<Human_G33k>itd_, found because it need policykit ...
15:15<blast007>vincenet: one of the virtual terminals has detailed output, I believe
15:16<vincenet>an other guy respond to me on #debian-boot I suggest to continue there
15:16-!-knoppix_ [~knoppix@49.207.188.232] has joined #debian
15:16-!-knoppix_ is "Knoppix User" on #debian
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15:16-!-ggg is "dontron" on #debian
15:17-!-knoppix_ is now known as Guest1091
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15:18-!-ach is "KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://kvirc.net/" on #debian
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15:25-!-asc232 is "Moon" on #debian-next #debian
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15:25-!-fike_ is "realname" on #debian #debian-br #debian-l10n-br #debian-mentors #debian-devel-br
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15:28-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian
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15:29-!-krabador is "krabador" on #debian-it #debian
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15:40-!-azamat is "realname" on #debian-games #debian-br #debian
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15:43-!-Vollstrecker is "Werner Mahr" on #debian-kde #debian
15:44-!-roflcopter [~armin@base.m2m.pm] has joined #debian
15:44-!-roflcopter is "bam!" on #virt #ovirt #centos #debian #debian-systemd #debian-next #awesome #suckless
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15:47-!-roflcopter is "bam!" on #virt #ovirt #centos #debian #debian-systemd #debian-next #awesome #suckless
15:48-!-ansel [~ansel@p54886425.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
15:48-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian-ha #debian
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15:49-!-ao2 is "ao2" on #debian #cell
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15:55-!-DNS is "DNS777" on #debian-gnome #guardianproject #debian-www #debian-systemd #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian-hurd #debian #libreplanet #debian-mentors @#debian-audio
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15:57-!-leonidas1 is "realname" on #debian
15:58<leonidas1>Why is gnome 3.22 (eg. gnome-shell 3.22) "held back" in sid?
15:58<leonidas1>My current version of gnome-shell is 3.20.3
15:59-!-olivier [~quassel@modemcable239.14-19-135.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #debian
15:59-!-olivier is "Olivier" on #debian
15:59<itd_>leonidas1: #debian-next for testing/unstable :)
15:59<leonidas1>itd_: Thanks, I didn't now
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16:01-!-LotharKAtt is "realname" on #debian-next #debian
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16:11-!-debalance [~debalance@aftr-88-153-7-155.unity-media.net] has joined #debian
16:11-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian-cd #debian-devel-changes #debian-edu #debian
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16:17-!-Chained_ is "realname" on #debian
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16:17-!-mots_ is "realname" on #ovirt #debian
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16:18-!-srhnsn_ is "-" on #openttd #debian #osm #osm-de #osm-dev #osrm
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16:21-!-derfel_ is "derfel" on #debian
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16:23-!-mjampala is "Mukund Jampala" on #debianppc #debian #debian-next
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16:26-!-blu is "realname" on #debian #virt
16:27-!-CEP-2015-Jessie [~cep2015@host24.190-229-111.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Quit: Me jui]
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16:31-!-emerson is "realname" on #debian
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16:32-!-stegbth is "Thomas Stegbauer" on #debian
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16:32-!-jmux is "Jan-Marek Glogowski" on #debian
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16:33-!-mobe is "realname" on #tor #debian
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16:35-!-Volley [~worf@80-109-200-187.cable.dynamic.surfer.at] has joined #debian
16:35-!-Volley is "Wolfgang Scheicher" on #virt #debian-mentors #debian-live #debian-kde #debian-next #debian
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16:38-!-CoreDuo is "CoreDuo" on #linode #virt #siduction #debian
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16:42-!-arand is "Martin Erik Werner" on #debian-games #debian-mentors #debian-next #debian
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16:47-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian
16:48-!-ryouma [~user@ip24-251-133-185.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #debian
16:48-!-ryouma is "unknown" on #debian-next #debian
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16:50-!-kelsoo is "kelsoo" on #tor #slackware #openbox #freedombox #debian
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16:56-!-IRLC_ind is "Ralph Rajko-Nenow" on #python #debian
16:59-!-ansel [~ansel@p54886425.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
16:59-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian
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17:01-!-awal1 is "realname" on #debian-es #awesome #openbox #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian
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17:03-!-bolt is "-" on #awesome #virt #debian-next #debian #sd #oftc #qemu #suckless
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17:03-!-pycycle is "purple" on #debian
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17:07-!-vaz [~vaz@161.77.56.50] has joined #debian
17:07-!-vaz is "Corey Vaz" on #debian
17:07<vaz>omg
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17:10-!-darthmarlon is "DarthMarlon" on #debian
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17:15-!-pinkypie is "anthos@uy.cs.RLTKHLTETEbs.op@gemany.com/hhker$@swe" on #debian #debian-gnome #debian-ftp #osm-dev #debian-arm #love #observium #debian-systemd #debian-boot #moocows #openttd #debian-offtopic #debconf #gcc #ovirt #awesome
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17:15-!-asc232 is "Moon" on #debian-next #debian
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17:16-!-OneST8 is "kck" on #torontocrypto #debian
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17:17-!-thunderrd is "realname" on #aptosid #ck #debian #siduction #siduction-de #siduction-dev @#GamersOnLinux #tor
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17:22-!-dicko is "Bromine" on #debian
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17:41-!-star_prone is "star_prone" on #debian
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17:41-!-macaco is "macaco" on #debian-kde #debian
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17:50-!-pamaury_ is "Amaury Pouly" on #debian #debian-kde #debian-next
17:52-!-fike_ [~fike@2001:1938:0:5001:84b7:30ff:fea6:f1b5] has joined #debian
17:52-!-fike_ is "realname" on #debian #debian-br #debian-l10n-br #debian-mentors #debian-devel-br
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17:54-!-macaco is "macaco" on #debian-kde #debian
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18:05-!-aguslr is "Agus" on #debian #awesome
18:06-!-crash_ [~pi@81-224-101-125-no186.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #debian
18:06-!-crash_ is "pi" on #debian
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18:11-!-sl4v3 is "sl4v3" on #debian
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18:13-!-svendev is "Svend Erik Venstrup-Nielsen,,," on #debian
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18:13-!-sl4v3 is "sl4v3" on #debian
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18:24-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian
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18:27-!-zuker is "irc.irc-hispano.org" on #debian
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18:29<zuker>algun argentino re copado que me tire un par de tips con PXE
18:30-!-Brigo [~Brigo@164.11.60.178.dynamic.reverse-mundo-r.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:30<itd_>!ar
18:30<dpkg>it has been said that ar is a program packaged in binutils to create, modify, and extract from archives (man ar), or argentina, or #debian-ar on irc.oftc.net.
18:30-!-satbyy [~Satish@0002187b.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
18:30-!-satbyy is "Satish Bysany" on #debian-next #debian-in #debian #debian-mentors
18:30-!-bodhi [~bodhi@dslb-188-100-107-046.188.100.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:31<itd_>zuker: you could try #debian-ar
18:32<zuker>yes, im catching upp
18:32<zuker>thx
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18:45-!-quentusrex is "William King" on #debian
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18:47-!-fike_ is "realname" on #debian #debian-br #debian-l10n-br #debian-mentors #debian-devel-br
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18:47-!-satbyy is "Satish Bysany" on #debian-next #debian-in #debian #debian-mentors
18:51-!-RequiemAeternam [~Symphony@91.253.186.176] has joined #debian
18:51-!-RequiemAeternam is "Requiem" on #debian
18:52-!-Volley [~worf@80-109-200-187.cable.dynamic.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
18:52<RequiemAeternam>I'm writing some shell script. I want to create a file with variables with this shell script and make this script reas it.
18:54<RequiemAeternam>I don't want to source the file, because if so, adding commands to the config file will complete modify the script action. The config file should only store variables.
18:58-!-cybiko123 [~cybiko123@00020220.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
18:58-!-cybiko123 is "cybiko123" on #debian
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19:22<Echoz>RequiemAeternam: your best bet is making some regexp to make sure everything is variable assignment
19:23<RequiemAeternam>Echoz: How can I learn to write correct regexp?
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19:42<xcb1>does debian testing make you vulnerable since security team only supports debian release?
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19:42<sney>not inherently, but it does make it your responsibility
19:43<sney>testing has newer versions of most packages so that often takes care of security holes
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19:47<xcb1>i'm normally fine with stable packages but sometimes there's a couple things you need to be newer so those distros like kubuntu which provide security support with newer packages every 6 months sound tempting
19:47<xcb1>or any ubuntu
19:47<xcb1>and i know about backports but what i want usually isn't in there
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20:11<Fuck>hello
20:11<clim>hello
20:11-!-Fuck is now known as Guest1114
20:11<Guest1114>how are you?
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20:12<clim>im decent, i just did a fresh install of debian, added the contrib and non-free repos in the source list
20:13<clim>i downloaded the most recent linux kernel, if i make firmware and modules, i should have what i need right?
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20:15<sney>clim: the kernel source has a target for building a debian package, so you only need to run 'make deb-pkg' and you will have an installable kernel. you will probably want to start by importing the running kernel's config, though
20:15<sney>and you probably won't get as big of an upgrade as you expect as many newer kernel changes are backported to debian kernels
20:16<clim>so i dont need to make this right now?
20:16<clim>i can mrproper, and make deb-pkg olddefconfig?
20:16<sney>unless there's something specific you're after, it's certainly not necessary in most cases
20:17<sney>!kernel handbook
20:17<dpkg>The Debian Linux Kernel Handbook http://kernel-handbook.alioth.debian.org/ - packaged as debian-kernel-handbook since Debian 7 "Wheezy" - serves as a single access point to all kernel-related documentation. See chapter 4.2 to rebuild official Debian kernel packages, see chapter 4.5 to build a custom kernel from Debian kernel source.
20:18-!-mode/#debian [+l 719] by debhelper
---Logclosed Tue Oct 04 20:19:26 2016
---Logopened Tue Oct 04 21:05:18 2016
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21:45<Lelii>hola
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22:20-!-sleser is "my name" on #debian-offtopic #debian-kde #debian
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22:28<kernelcorn>is there a channel for discussing reading from sockets in Linux in C or C++, or is this an appropriate place?
22:29-!-mattcen [~mattcen@c122-108-68-124.sunsh1.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #debian
22:29-!-mattcen is "Matthew Cengia" on #debian
22:29<kernelcorn>I basically want to read a single line from a socket, but I can't see how to do this without reading character by character.
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22:31<kernelcorn>never mind, I found documentation online
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---Logclosed Tue Oct 04 23:13:02 2016
---Logopened Tue Oct 04 23:35:01 2016
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23:38-!-mode/#debian [+l 718] by debhelper
23:39<Arcade>on boot it seems to turn on now but gnome turns it off on final boot
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---Logclosed Wed Oct 05 00:00:55 2016