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#debian IRC Logs for 2016-10-14

---Logopened Fri Oct 14 00:00:12 2016
---Daychanged Fri Oct 14 2016
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00:08<Ouroboros>i am not even sure how to cleanly fix this, i guess i have to remove all those metapackages and then recreate them using alternatives
00:08<sleser>where is sudo file located in debian
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00:09<Ouroboros>sleser: the usual place
00:10<sleser>i dont know where it is
00:10<sleser>i wanted to look at it
00:10<sleser>just to see one exemple
00:10<Ouroboros> /etc/sudoers
00:10<sleser>ty
00:11<Ouroboros>you can find it yourself using 'which' 'find' 'locate' etc
00:11<sleser>cool thanks
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00:12<jmcnaught>sleser: you have to use the visudo command to edit the sudoers file
00:13<sleser>i dont wana edit it i just wana look at it so i can set it up same on freebsd
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00:16<sleser>cant find it
00:16<sleser>is it a .conf ?
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00:16<Ouroboros>no, its literally /etc/sudoers
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00:17<sleser>i use a nano /etc/sudoers and its empty
00:17<Ouroboros>try 'find /etc | grep sudo' in case it moved (my debian is older)
00:18-!-mode/#debian [+l 738] by debhelper
00:18<sleser>is it a ? 51-debian-sudo.conf
00:18<sleser>
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00:19<jmcnaught>sleser: is sudo installed?
00:19<Ouroboros>maybe you dont have it set up
00:20<sleser>i didnt install it it came with debian no ?
00:20<sleser>sudo works when i use it
00:20<sleser>https://paste.debian.net/874603/
00:21<Ouroboros>you need to open it as root
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00:21<jmcnaught>sleser: do not open it with nano. look at it with less, or open with visudo
00:22<Ouroboros>why not nano
00:22<sleser>how do i exit from it when use visudo ?
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00:23<jmcnaught>Ouroboros: because if you change the file and break the syntax, you can lock yourself out of using sudo. so people should be in the habit of never opening that file with nano directly
00:23<jmcnaught>visudo often calls nano if that's the default editor on the system
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00:24<Ouroboros>true, but that file is chmod 440 anyway
00:24<sleser>show me a site where i can learn the chmod #s
00:24<sleser>thouse things sometimes come complicated for new person
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00:27<MichaelPaoli>sleser There's both numeric and symbolic form for chmod(1). I thought I read that POSIX has deprecated numeric form, but it's still supported. And fully understanding all the permission stuff is a bit complex, but the basics are fairly straight-forward.
00:27<Ouroboros>sleser: lemme duckduck it for you: https://www.linux.com/learn/understanding-linux-file-permissions
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00:28<sleser>its all good duckducking still works
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00:29<sleser>thanks for tonites tips
00:30<sleser>very helpful things
00:30<MichaelPaoli>Ouroboros: sleser - yes, that looks like a pretty reasonable introduction+ for chmod and Unix/Linux permissions at that URL (https://www.linux.com/learn/understanding-linux-file-permissions)
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00:30<sleser>that aplys for bsd as well ?
00:31<MichaelPaoli>sleser Yes, ... theres's lots that BSD / Unix / Linux / OS X / Debian have in common ... there also some differences too.
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00:31<Ouroboros>there might be some minor differences, i am not sure
00:31<Ouroboros>https://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/permissions.html
00:31<sleser>ty
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00:34<MichaelPaoli>sleser most all use "POSIX" / Single Unix Specification (http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/) as a base common standard (with some occasional exceptions), however each operating system typically adds a fair bit beyond what's in those standards - and those standards don't cover everything.
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00:43<Zeeps_>my server doesn't send mail still. this was in the exim log
00:43<Zeeps_>2016-10-14 03:24:03 1but6J-00013t-KO ** gsaggi@gmail.com R=nonlocal: Mailing to remote domains not supported
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00:45<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: how is your server configured to send mail?
00:46<Zeeps_>exim I think
00:47<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: how is exim configured to deliver mail?
00:47<Zeeps_>I don't know. It is a fresh install
00:47<Ouroboros>argh, why does 'x11-utils' depend on 'cpp' in squeeze.... oh well, looks like the fixed it later
00:49<Zeeps_># dpkg-reconfigure exim4-config /usr/sbin/dpkg-reconfigure: exim4-config is broken or not fully installed
00:49<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: how did you install? is this some VPS? also are you looking to receive mail, or only send? sending from your own domain name, or using gmail/hotmail/yahoo email address?
00:50<Zeeps_>jmcnaught: it's a VPS from linode
00:50<Zeeps_>I want the server to be able to sendmail for wordpress
00:51<jm_>so you don't have exim4-config installed?
00:53<Ouroboros>this is exactly why prebuilt VPS images are a bad idea
00:53<Zeeps_>I don't have exim4-onfig
00:54<Zeeps_>I just installed exim4-config
00:55<Zeeps_>~# php -f testmail.php sh: 1: /usr/sbin/sendmail: not found
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00:56<Ouroboros>maybe you want to find a guide about how to configure a mail server
00:56<Ouroboros>its not entirely trivial
00:57<jm_>do you have any of exim4-daemon-* installed?
00:57<Zeeps_>how do I check?
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01:00<jm_>dpkg -l|grep exim
01:00<Ouroboros>Zeeps_: this may help https://wiki.debian.org/Exim
01:00<dpkg>jm_: wish i knew
01:01<Zeeps_>it seems now sendmail isn't installed and cant install as it is missing dependencies
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01:02<Zeeps_>http://pastebin.com/LLcHjhXj
01:02<Ouroboros>you dont want sendmail?
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01:03<Ouroboros>i mean, sendmail and exim do the same thing, why would you want both
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01:05<Zeeps_>i think php used sendmail
01:07<Ouroboros>Zeeps_: some info here https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-install-the-send-only-mail-server-exim-on-ubuntu-12-04 https://wiki.debian.org/GmailAndExim4
01:07<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: sendmail is a command that is provided by multiple MTAs including exim4 and sendmail
01:07<Ouroboros>yeah so sendmail should be a symlink to exim
01:08<Ouroboros>(sorry if i say something dumb, i havent dont this myself)
01:08<Ouroboros>Zeeps_: but you need to install exim4-daemon-heavy or exim4-daemon-light first
01:08<Zeeps_>I have light
01:09<Ouroboros>what does 'which sendmail' say
01:09<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: in addition to the debian wiki articles about exim4 you should look at /usr/share/doc/exim4-config for the README.Debian file. Alternatively if you do not need to receive mail, you may find something like msmtp-mta or ssmtp simpler to configure
01:09<Zeeps_>~# which sendmail /usr/sbin/sendmail
01:10<Ouroboros>then why the php error
01:11<Zeeps_>I installed the sendmail dependencies manually
01:11<Zeeps_>just then
01:11<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: did you install sendmail packages?
01:11<Zeeps_>yes
01:11<themill>egads
01:12<Ouroboros>yeah, you dont want that
01:12<Ouroboros>one of the exim packages should have made a sendmail symlink or wrapper or whatever
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01:12<Zeeps_>I removed sendmail
01:12<Zeeps_>how do I reinstall exim?
01:13<Ouroboros>'dpkg -L exim4-daemon-light | grep sendmail' anything there?
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01:13<jm_>apt-get install exim4-daemon-light
01:13<Zeeps_>nothing
01:14<Zeeps_>done
01:14<Ouroboros>same for exim4-base?
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01:15<Zeeps_>exim4-base was already installed
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01:16<Ouroboros>exim4-daemon-light provides /usr/sbin/sendmail on my system
01:16<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: before you can continue you need to decide *how* your server is going to send mail.. will it log into another mail server to have it send mail? will it connect to destination mail servers directly?
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01:17<Ouroboros>'dpkg -L exim4-daemon-light | grep sendmail' this should return about 3 items
01:17<Ouroboros>are you use you entered it exactly, capital -L
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01:18<Zeeps_>~# dpkg -L exim4-daemon-light | grep sendmail /usr/share/man/man8/sendmail.8.gz /usr/sbin/sendmail /usr/lib/sendmail
01:19<Ouroboros>yeah
01:20<Ouroboros>then what jmcnaught said
01:20<Zeeps_>I would want the server to send mail directly
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01:21<Zeeps_>unless that is harder/frowned upon
01:21<Ouroboros>much harder
01:21<Ouroboros>there are all kinds of things that need to be configured properly
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01:22<Zeeps_>this is the output from exim maillog
01:22<Zeeps_>http://pastebin.com/Fr8WtvFw
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01:25<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: is your hostname actually 'debian'? the error on line 1, do you have multiple MTAs installed at this point? The from address in the emails, is it your own domain?
01:26<Zeeps_>it's my own domain cromschosen.com
01:26<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: the people that sold you the domain, do they offer email hosting?
01:26<Ouroboros>did you configure rdns?
01:27<Zeeps_>they do email hosting but I didn't purchase it
01:27<Zeeps_>I didnt configure reverse dns
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01:27<Ouroboros>you need rnds and spf, at the very least, i think
01:28<Zeeps_>what is spf
01:28<Ouroboros>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Policy_Framework
01:28<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: unless you're going to invest some time into running your own mail server, i strongly recommend you purchase email hosting and configure your Debian server to deliver mail via your email hoster 'smarthost'
01:28<Ouroboros>yeah, running a real mail server is almost a full-time job
01:29<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: if you do a sloppy job of configuring mail, a lot (or most) of it is just going to end up in spam folders
01:32<Zeeps_>this isn't as easy as I thought it would be
01:33<jmcnaught>it's easy to configure outgoing mail through a smarthost
01:33<Ouroboros>if it was easy, there would be much more spam
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01:37<Zeeps_>can i use my isp as smarthost?
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01:38<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: if your ISP is okay with it, though your ISP probably won't have SPF and DKIM set up for your domain name
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01:43<Zeeps_>are there any recommendations for email host? my domain provider doesn't offer smart host email
01:45<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: they probably don't call it smarthost. do they offer SMTP/IMAP4/POP3 access for mail clients? You basically just need to configure your Debian server to us the same outgoing mail server and credentials that you'd use for Icedove/Thunderbird
01:45<Zeeps_>ahh
01:45<Ouroboros>will they relay messages though?
01:45<Ouroboros>well, hm
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01:47<Ouroboros>yeah, i guess that could work
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01:48<Zeeps_>they offer email accounts for $3 each. so i could just pay for 1 and use it for it's credentials
01:48<jmcnaught>there are alternatives like sendgrid, mailchimp and a bunch of others that i haven't used and can't recommend.. but it would be the same, they would tell you an SMTP server to connect to, and some credentials, and you'd configure Debian to use that for outgoing mail
01:50<jm_>also some domain registrars offer mail hosting, then there's google if that is still available, not sure
01:51<jmcnaught>it's not that i discourage people from running their own mail servers, but it's not something that can be learned over IRC in a night, and the world doesn't need more poorly configured mail servers
01:52<Zeeps_>thats totally understandable jmcnaught
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01:52<Zeeps_>https://support.google.com/a/answer/2956491?hl=en this it?
01:53<jm_>that's only if you use google apps (what I was refering to above)
01:54<jm_>I use that for my domain
01:56<jmcnaught>Zeeps_: once you pick a mail provider you can configure exim4 to use it with "dpkg-reconfigure exim4-config" and choose the smarthost option. Or use a null mailer like msmtp-mta. "aptitude search ~Pmail-transport-agent" will list available packages that can send mail in Debian
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02:26<stevenm_>hey when I install debian 8 I normally do the partitioning myself rather than guided (i don't bother with a swap partition, basically just one big ext4 with a swap file on that)... but i'm wondering if there is option to do this gpt-style instead of dos-style on the installer?
02:26<stevenm_>because I don't see one
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02:29<somiaj>stevenm_: the expert installer may give you more options. Also you may have needed to load the parted package sepertally.
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02:33<stevenm_>somiaj, yeah i just watched a youtube vid with someone doing it on expert - it gives an extra choice when you initialize the disk
02:33<stevenm_>it's crummy that is only on expert mode
02:33<stevenm_>i hate how many millions of questions that mode asks
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02:39<somiaj>stevenm_: you can always access a console alt-f2 and just manually partition with parted
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02:40<stevenm_>somiaj, parted not found it seems
02:43<somiaj>I think y ou have to load it as an additional model at the beginig. Unsure if you have that option if you don't use the expert mode.
02:43<somiaj>stevenm_: if you boot in efi mode it might default to gtp because of the efi partition.
02:43<stevenm_>somiaj, what if it gets booted in efi mode but all the disks are completely empty?
02:45<somiaj>stevenm_: it should create a gtp partition table with an efi partition along with the other ptitions you ask for.
02:45<Ouroboros>how can it be that i am getting "The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required: Y" when removing package X, if X does not depend on Y?
02:45<jm_>is that aptitude?
02:45<Ouroboros>apt-get remove
02:46<stevenm_>ok thanks somiaj
02:46<Ouroboros>or its possible these Y packages were somehow associated with X during the original install?
02:47<Ouroboros>in /var/log/dpkg.log they were auto installed together
02:48<somiaj>Ouroboros: if you pull in a lot of packages with a metapackage (such as the gnome task package), removing one peice removes the metapackage, and everythign else that is assoicated with that package is 'auto'.
02:48<somiaj>Ouroboros: this can happen on smaller levels too
02:48<jm_>Ouroboros: recommends?
02:48<Ouroboros>right, but this metapackage doesnt show those other packages as either depends, suggests or recommends
02:49<jm_>it might prove more helpful if we know what X and Y are
02:49<jm_>unless it's a top secret
02:49<Ouroboros>hehe
02:50<Ouroboros>X = https://archive.debian.net/squeeze/gnat, Y = https://archive.debian.net/squeeze/libatk1.0-0 e.g.
02:50<Ouroboros>is it possible there was a dependence originally, but the repository was updated, and now there is not?
02:50<Ouroboros>just want to fully understand how this works
02:51<jm_>unlikely
02:51<Ouroboros>there are like 10 of those random libraries listed
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02:53<Ouroboros>is there a way that these were installed with aptitude or whatever originally so this can happen?
02:54<jm_>did you check apt/aptitude logs too?
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02:58<Ouroboros>well, there is 'apt-get --yes install ... gnat ...' there
02:58<Ouroboros>and then libatk etc are listed as installed
02:58<Ouroboros>in apt/history.log
02:59<jm_>with aptitude one would go 'aptitude why libatk1.0-0'
02:59<Ouroboros>that options seems kinda unreliable
03:00<jm_>works fine for me on systems where only aptitude is used
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03:03<Ouroboros>recommended is not installed by default, is it
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03:04<jm_>it is now, not sure about squeeze
03:04<Ouroboros>it seems that all those things are dependencies of https://archive.debian.net/squeeze/gnat-gps, which is a recommended from gnat
03:04<Ouroboros>ah, hm
03:05<Ouroboros>that might explain it then
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03:06<Ouroboros>but the interesting thing, 'apt-get -s remove gnat-gps' does not give that "no longer needed" message for any of them
03:06<Ouroboros>this means it is not hierarchical, they are all associated with 'gnat'
03:07<Ouroboros>is that how it is supposed to work?
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03:09<Ouroboros>the way i think it should work is {install gnat: installs gnat -> gnat-gps -> other stuff} {remove -s gnat: remove gnat and suggest to remove gnat-gps} {remove -s gnat-gps: remove gnat-gps and suggest to remove other stuff}
03:09<Ouroboros>but it seems to be flattened instead
03:10<jm_>there's just "auto-installed" flag, not "auto-installed with foo" AFAIK
03:12<Ouroboros>but how does it know which auto-installed packages should be remove then?
03:12<Ouroboros>it must have some idea that there is no longer a manually installed package that links to them
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03:13<jm_>it can look at dependencies and check flags for those
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03:14<Ouroboros>right, but then why does 'apt-get -s remove gnat-gps' show nothing? those other packages now satisfy the condition "auto installed and not a dependency of any installed package"
03:15<Ouroboros>UNLESS in fact they are somehow still linked to 'gnat'
03:15<Ouroboros>linked from gnat rather
03:17<jm_>it's not, see /var/lib/apt/extended_states
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03:19<Ouroboros>hm, ok, but something doesnt make sense still
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03:19<jm_>maybe it only happens for manually installed packages, which gnat-gps is not?
03:19<Ouroboros>ah
03:19<Ouroboros>that could be
03:21<Ouroboros>related question: the dependency stuff comes from 'apt-get update'; can that ever change?
03:22<Ouroboros>i mean, can i install package X -> Y, then later in the package lists they change it to X -> Z, i do update, and now the dependencies are out of sync with what is installed?
03:23<Ouroboros>(not saying that happened above, just in general)
03:23<jm_>these days with packages being upgraded to a much higher major version for security updates, I suppose it's possible
03:23<Ouroboros>no, i mean for the exact same version
03:23<jm_>then no
03:24<Ouroboros>is it not possible by design, or is it more that they just dont do that
03:24<jm_>they don't do that, the idea is that as little as possible changes
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03:25<Ouroboros>ok, well, thanks for the explanation
03:25<jm_>no problem
03:25<Ouroboros>back to trying to clean up this gcc mess
03:26<Ouroboros>(still no clue why they didnt do it properly with alternatives, it has been broken like this since forever)
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03:28<jm_>how is it broken?
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03:28<Ouroboros>well, the individual versioned packages like gcc-4.3 gcc-4.4 etc are fine
03:28<Ouroboros>the problem is with those metapackages like gcc
03:29<Ouroboros>because they just statically link /usr/bin/gcc -> /usr/bin/gcc-4.4 e.g.
03:29<Ouroboros>(and also put a bunch of random crap in various places, i might add)
03:29<jm_>that's because there's just one default version for the release
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03:29<Ouroboros>right, but it makes it very difficult to install both 4.3 and 4.4
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03:30<jm_>really? I have like 4 versions installed
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03:30<Ouroboros>ok, but how do you maintain the 'gcc' symlink
03:31<Ouroboros>or do you just leave it pointed at the latest and then change to whatever version in your makefile
03:31<jm_>I don't, gcc is whatever is the version they selected for the current release
03:31<jm_>if I want to use a different version then yes, I tell the build system about it
03:31<Ouroboros>i am saying it would be much nicer if they just did it with alternatives, e.g. the say automake does it
03:32<Ouroboros>especially because the version they chose doesnt match the version the kernel was compiled with e.g.
03:32<Ouroboros>(not that it matters that much)
03:34<Ouroboros>there are some other minor problems in those metapackages as well
03:34<Ouroboros>e.g. the one i have links the manpage to the wrong version
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03:40<Ouroboros>i dunno, its workable, but just very messy; i am gonna change it using alternatives on my system
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04:06<hewl>What is the most efficient way to enable an automated script to run with root privleges? I'd rather avoid using chroot.
04:06<jm_>chroot is not for that
04:06<jm_>you could use sudo
04:07<hewl>It's a script which uses ifconfig to connect to a network. When run as an executable file, it fails. When run inside of a terminal, it prompts for the sudo password.
04:07<jm_>you can tell sudo to not ask for a password
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04:07<jm_>read about NOPASSWD in the man page
04:07<hewl>Isn't that super insecure?
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04:08<jm_>it can be, but if you want it automated ...
04:08<jm_>or you could run it from cron as root or whatever
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04:10<hewl>sorry, door knock. Is there documentation on running from cron as root? And is it a permanent effect?
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04:11<jm_>https://debian-administration.org/article/56/Command_scheduling_with_cron
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04:11<hewl>Alternatively, with the line used to identify the file, could that be used to initiate it as root?
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04:12<jm_>what do you mean with "with the line used to identify the file"?
04:13<hewl>By automatic, I mean "when an event is triggered". Wicd is the program that is doing it, an alternative network manager to nm (it was disconnecting me for no discernable reason). Wicd allows scripts to be run when networks are connected, and I'd like to see if running the pre-connection script will allow the network connection to be established the instant it is plugged in instead of having to invoke a terminal myself to connect.
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04:14<hewl>I do not think Cron has that ability.
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04:14<jm_>wait, doesn't have its own config to tell it which script to run at that point?
04:14<jm_>+it somewhere
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04:15<hewl>It may, but I was using the GUI tool to do so.
04:15<hewl>I'm not sure of what you're asking, exactly.
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04:16<hewl>wait do script files need to be called "<name>.sh"?
04:16<jm_>you said "Wicd allows scripts to be run when networks are connected" - this sounds like you could just tell it what to run at that point and it'll all work, no?
04:16<jm_>no
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04:17<hewl>In the settings panel for any particular network, you can click a "scripts" button which will show you a window with four text inputs. Each input corresponds to different stages of a connection, pre-connect post-connect pre-disconnect and post-disconnect. Those fields are empty.
04:18<hewl>The fields themselves only allow for one line, so I presume it's for a file path to a script.
04:18<jm_>sounds about right
04:18<hewl>There's no explicit statement saying this, however.
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04:19<duclicsic>these will correspond with the directories inside /etc/network/
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04:19<duclicsic>if-down.d if-post-down.d etc
04:19<jm_>man wicd-wired-settings.conf talks about some scripts
04:19<hewl>The commands I've put into the script file are "sudo ifconfig usb0 up && sudo dhclient usb0". Running it in a terminal successfully connects the network.
04:19<duclicsic>oh dear don't do that
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04:20<duclicsic>you are asking the system to run a script to bring the interface up whever the interface comes up
04:20<duclicsic>that will never happen
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04:20<jm_>you'll probably want to react on usb plugin instead
04:20<hewl>I'm confused. I want it to attempt to connect to a network when it is plugged in.
04:20<duclicsic>you don't do that with scripts
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04:21<hewl>duclicsic: So what would I do it with, then?
04:22<Ouroboros>(i may have been wrong about the metapackage linking the manpage to the wrong version, seems they just didnt update that version in the main packages)
04:22<duclicsic>i don't know about that network manager, but usually there will be a configuration option for an interface to make it automatically come up on boot, and to allow "hotplug" so it comes up whenever it detects a link
04:23<duclicsic>these are configurable via your normal /etc/network/interfaces file
04:23<duclicsic>but that likely isn't used if you're running a graphical network manager
04:23<hewl>duclicsic: Oh, well I've looked through wicd and there isn't an option to do that for usb interfaces.
04:23<hewl>The project itself seems to be rather dead. The original creator doesn't even write code for it anymore.
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04:24<Ouroboros>why do you need it
04:24<duclicsic>if you're not changing your interface config frequently just do it through the file then
04:24<duclicsic>no need for a manager
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04:25<hewl>Ouroboros: nm was disconnecting me after several seconds of connection. Apparently it's a bug specifically in KDE and the way it identifies networks, and it still hasn't been fixed.
04:25<hewl>nm being the network manager included with the KDE.
04:26<hewl>duclicsic: I believe the ID of the network changes every time it is plugged in, which is why I've been avoiding just editing the config files myself. Also, it's usually not connected on boot.
04:26<duclicsic>the "ID" ?
04:26<Ouroboros>hewl: why do you need nm
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04:27<duclicsic>hewl: is this a usb ethernet adaptor you're using?
04:27<hewl>duclicsic: I'm not 100% sure what it is but on all systems I've used Android tethering with, the network is identified as a different network every time it is plugged in, thus I don't believe a config for a network connection will work after the initial connection.
04:27<duclicsic>ok this is an issue with the network manager you're using
04:27<hewl>Ouroboros: nm was the package included with KDE. I never installed it myself. It's what it uses to connect to the network.
04:27<duclicsic>the interface is likely always usb0 right?
04:28<hewl>duclicsic Correct.
04:28<Ouroboros>hewl: i just uninstall that and use /etc/network/interfaces
04:28<duclicsic>then don't configure it through the network manager
04:28<duclicsic>^^
04:28<hewl>But doesn't that mean it'll just attempt to connect once on boot and then never try again?
04:28<duclicsic>no
04:30<hewl>How does it do it, then?
04:30<duclicsic>http://paste.debian.net/875004/
04:31<duclicsic>that should bring the interface up whenever it detects that it exists
04:31<hewl>To quote Debian reference, "Debian squeeze and newer can manage the network connection via management daemon software such as NetworkManager (NM) (network-manager and associated packages) or Wicd (wicd and associated packages)."
04:31<duclicsic>the important word there is "can"
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04:32<duclicsic>but i've never used wicd so i couldn't tell you how to make it do what you want
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04:32<duclicsic>networkmanager however does this absolutely fine for me
04:32<duclicsic>i've never had to do anything to make usb tethering work, it just does
04:33<Ouroboros>also i dont know what they mean by "squeeze and newer", nm has been around since forever
04:33<hewl>duclicsic so that set of commands you pasted before, are they just entered in the terminal and then are in effect permanently forever?
04:33<Ouroboros>and i always uninstalled it :P
04:33<duclicsic>those are not commands
04:33<duclicsic>that is a config snippet for /etc/network/interfaces
04:33<hewl>oooh
04:34<hewl>do you mean interfaces.d, though?
04:34<duclicsic>no
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04:35<hewl>It was my understanding that user scripts should go into "<name_of_tool>.d" folders so as not to overwrite defaults
04:35<Ouroboros>thats other stuff
04:35<duclicsic>it's not a script
04:35<duclicsic>it's just config
04:35<duclicsic>it goes directly in /etc/network/interfaces
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04:36<duclicsic>though you could put it in interfaces.d/ if you wanted, it's not required
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04:36<jm_>both can be used, sometimes foo.d is prefered (i.e. it's not touched on upgrades so you get no questions from dpkg)
04:36<Ouroboros>the scripts would be something like "when interfaces comes up, immediately mail a cat pic to grandma"
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04:36<duclicsic>but you may have to tell wicd that it isn't supposed to manage usb0 any more
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04:37<hewl>That's another thing. I'll have to uninstall wicd, or at least disable it.
04:37<duclicsic>no
04:37<duclicsic>you don't
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04:37<duclicsic>you just tell it the interface is not managed by it
04:37<duclicsic>at least, that's possible with NetworkManager anyway
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04:38<hewl>wicd is weird. It has the option "Always switch to a wired interface when available" but it doesn't do anything.
04:38<duclicsic>are you connected to a wireless network?
04:38<hewl>Not at all.
04:39<duclicsic>then of course it doesn't do anything
04:39<Ouroboros>(i am still wrong about the manpage version thing, actually i guess gcc-4.4.1.gz means "gcc 4.4, man section 1")
04:39<duclicsic>you are already on a "wired interface" so you can hardly switch to it
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04:40<hewl>Are you suggesting it's possible to have multiple connections to the internet at once?
04:40<jm_>Ouroboros: no, path dictates the section man/man1/gcc...
04:40<duclicsic>heh
04:40<duclicsic>of course
04:40<hewl>The more you know. Thanks.
04:40<Ouroboros>jm_: well, yes, but for some reason all the stuff ends in .1.gz, e.g. gnatgcc.1.gz etc
04:41<hewl>Unfortunately wicd isn't good enough to automatically use usb interfaces to connect, I suspect normal ethernet connections would be completely fine, though.
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04:41<hewl>I don't know if wicd is taking management of usb interfaces, though. Is there a way to check this?
04:42<duclicsic>as i say, i don't use wicd so have no experience with it, you'll have to hit the googles
04:42<duclicsic>or just add that config i suggested to /etc/network/interfaces and try it
04:42<hewl>I mean, is there a utility in Debian that allows you to see which network interfaces are currently unmanaged by any package?
04:42<Ouroboros>jm_: i dunno, either its something specific to gcc docs, or the version names are out of date, or both
04:42<Ouroboros>who cares :)
04:43<duclicsic>not a utility, that is going to be decided by the network management application
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04:43<jm_>Ouroboros: yes, it seems it needs to end with .<section>
04:43<duclicsic>hewl: for example, NetworkManager just has a config file where you can set interfaces as "unmanaged" and it will completely ignore them
04:43<Ouroboros>ah ok
04:44<jm_>maybe wicd-cli can tell you
04:44<Ouroboros>hewl: but do you have nm *and* wicd?
04:44<hewl>duclicsic, Alright let's see if that config file in interfaces will work, then.
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04:44<hewl>does the config file itself need any particular name or will any do?
04:45<duclicsic>the name of the file is "interfaces"
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04:45<duclicsic>it exists in /etc/network/
04:45<duclicsic>the path is /etc/network/interfaces, it should already exist
04:45<hewl>It doesn't.
04:45<hewl>Oh wait it does.
04:45<duclicsic>what distro is this?
04:45<duclicsic>right..
04:45<hewl>ah i'm blind
04:46<Ouroboros>:)
04:46<Ouroboros>is this interfaces.d thing new?
04:46<hewl>It says "source /etc/network/interfaces.d/*" so I presume literally any name will work.
04:46<duclicsic>ignore that line
04:46<duclicsic>you are not creating any new files
04:46<pinaraf>Ouroboros: new in stretch, as far as I know
04:46<Ouroboros>ah ok
04:47<jm_>it exists in jessie too
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04:47<duclicsic>you are just editing /etc/network/interfaces and adding the lines in that link i gave you
04:47<pinaraf>jm_: ho… missed it then, thanks :)
04:47<jm_>pinaraf: at least man page mentions it for me
04:48<hewl>duclicsic: Ok, I edited /etc/network/interfaces itself as a text file.
04:48<hewl>duclicsic: Are the effects immediate or do I need to reboot?
04:48<Ouroboros>depends on the type of interace i guess
04:48<duclicsic>next time you connect the usb interface it should come up
04:48<Ouroboros>you can always do 'ifup usb0'
04:48<duclicsic>shouldn't need a reboot
04:49<hewl>I'll try disconnecting the interface and reconnecting it. brb
04:49<Ouroboros>heh
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04:49<Ouroboros>he is never coming back, is he
04:49<duclicsic>heh
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04:49<hewl>well waddya know
04:50<duclicsic>worked?
04:50<hewl>it works flawlessly, wicd is even informing me of the connection process
04:50<Ouroboros>see how simple things are when you dont involve random gui crap :P
04:50<duclicsic>smashing
04:50<jm_>wasn't aware it works like that, I always assumed one needs something like ifplugd
04:50*HJfFun est content de vous retouver
04:50<hewl>now I'm going to place a text file of that into interfaces.d so it isn't overwritten in the upcoming upgrade
04:51<duclicsic>it shouldn't overwrite that file anyway, but feel free
04:51<jm_>interfaces file is not in any package so it won't be (and it asks, it doesn't overwrite, it also makes a backup)
04:51<duclicsic>it would be a nightmare updating my routers if it did overwrite it
04:52<duclicsic>some of them have as many as 32 interfaces defined
04:52<Ouroboros>:)
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04:52<hewl>Then for the sake of organisation, I'd prefer to keep files I've created myself separate to files automatically created by the system install.
04:53<duclicsic>fair enough
04:53<Ouroboros>this reminds me of the good old days when i was compiling custom kernels and making hundreds of tunnels all over the place
04:53<hewl>You guys are great, thank you for the help.
04:53<Ouroboros>alas, now i just have one interface :)
04:53<duclicsic>yw hewl
04:53<Ouroboros>hewl: i often keep a local copy of everything i modified in /etc
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04:54<Ouroboros>then i can just rsync it in or whatever
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04:54<jm_>disconnect?
04:54<hewl>interfaces.d/auto-connect-usb works as well
04:54<hewl>no worries I disconnected myself just to test it, everything's good
04:55<Ouroboros>hewl: i often keep a local copy of everything i modified in /etc, so i can rsync it in whenever
04:55<hewl>That's not a bad idea.
04:55<hewl>I've just got a little "log" of everything I've done to the system.
04:55<Ouroboros>yeah i do that too
04:55<hewl>It'll be a pain to have to do it all again if I upgrade, but at least I won't be starting from scratch.
04:55<Ouroboros>sometimes i even write a little PDF guide, and then never release it anywhere ;)
04:55<hewl>rippers
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05:38<hewl>Hi Bluca. I never managed to get nouveau working, unfortunately, if you remember all that from a while back.
05:39<bluca>ah, good
05:40<hewl>In your opinion, would it be better to not have the nvidia-drivers installed when doing a full system upgrade? ie. from Jessie to Stretch
05:40*Ouroboros slaps dozer
05:40<bluca>shouldn't make any difference
05:41<hewl>I've read in the manual that it should be done. Interesting.
05:41<hewl>Thank you for the information you provided earlier, helped me out a lot.
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05:47<bluca>we do test the upgrade path often, so it should be fine
05:48<hewl>I've got a very particular set up, though.
05:48<Ouroboros>man, i really need more than 6 ttys
05:48<jm_>I only had issues with that with newer kernels, but if using debian kernels that path should be well tested
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05:50<hewl>Ouroboros: Make a new distro called "Octopus" which has 8 ttys. It'll be great.
05:51<Ouroboros>Octoboros
05:51<jm_>so why not simply start more?
05:51<hewl>woah you can do that?
05:53<Ouroboros>to clarify, i am talking about in console, when you switch with ctrl-alt-f[1-6]
05:53<Ouroboros>can you increase that?
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05:53<jm_>yes, I know - see /etc/inittab, it only defines 6 by default
05:53<jm_>in jessie it's different with systemd
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05:54<Ouroboros>nice
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05:57<Ouroboros>how does it map it to f-keys, its automatic?
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06:00<Ouroboros>nm, found a doc
06:00<jm_>dumpkeys
06:00<jm_>and read through it
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06:03<Ouroboros>http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Keyboard-and-Console-HOWTO-7.html
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06:04<jm_>yeah good old howtos
06:04<Ouroboros>super old
06:04<jm_>i've done something similar, ctrl-alt-insert to call poweroff back then
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06:12<muellejo>for our three thier deployment environment (dev,qa,prod) and for our clustersystems I have to make sure that the installed packages are exact same on all nodes
06:12<muellejo>i would like to "pin" the apt repos of these machines to specific debian major.minor number version, this is what you call "Point Releases"
06:12<muellejo>for installation of the nodes we use pxe and preseeding, currently i use snapshot.debian.org as apt resource to make sure that alle machines in a dev,qa,prod or cluster environment use the same packages
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06:12<muellejo>e.g. "deb [arch=amd64,i386] http://snapshot.debian.org/archive/debian/20160916T101556Z/ jessie main contrib non-free" in /etc/apt/sources.list on all nodes
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06:13<muellejo>is ist also possible to point apt sources.list to a "Point Release" ? e.g something like "deb [arch=amd64,i386] http://pointrelease.debian.org/ 8.5 main contrib non-free" ?
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06:24<Ouroboros>jm_: how do you make init refresh the config
06:24<jm_>Ouroboros: telinit q
06:25<Ouroboros>its not gonna wipe my consoles, is it? ;)
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06:26<Ouroboros>nice, works
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06:44<Ouroboros>dozer: did you fix it?
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06:50<Ouroboros>jm_: hm, is it ok if you have say gcc-4.3.5 with libgcc1 4.4.5? depends says libcc1 >=4.3.5 and there is no older version
06:52<Ouroboros>i guess that shouldnt affect code generated by gcc
06:53<jm_>Ouroboros: how did you end up with that? normally libgcc1 will depend on exact (= version dependency) gcc version
06:53<Ouroboros>i dont know, thats how it is
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06:54<bremner>muellejo: maybe you would find FAI useful. http://fai-project.org/
06:54<jm_>Ouroboros: ahh 4.4.5 is the default gcc for squeeze, that's why
06:54<Ouroboros>yeah
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06:56<Ouroboros>but dunno why there is no libcc1 4.3, maybe there was a vulnerability, or maybe because you cannot have two versions installed at once
06:56<jm_>it's probably OK otherwise it would be pointless providing older versions
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06:56<jm_>yeah the latter
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06:57<jm_>older versions of the compiler in the above statement
06:57<Ouroboros>i think i am overthinking this :P
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07:52<luckyuser>hi
07:52<luckyuser>somebody can read me?
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08:23<lord_rob>Hi! /etc/hostname is "thinkpad" and/etc/dhclient.conf has "send-host-name = gethostname()" (uncommented of course). Why can't I ping thinkpad which is connected on DHCP? Both are on the same subnet?
08:24<themill>picking a hostname and teaching everything else on the network to resolve it are entirely different things
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08:26<lord_rob>I thought it worked before, without the need of a DHCP server
08:26<lord_rob>maybe only without dynamic IP
08:27<themill>avahi-daemon can help the machines resolve foo.local without additional infrastructure
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08:31<lord_rob>ok thanks themill
08:33<themill>some dhcp servers also offer themselves as a dns server to make it all happen, for instance
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08:43<lord_rob>yeah that's what I guessed but I use my cheap vdsl modem/router/dhcp to do all those things. And those things are not supported
08:43<lord_rob>and does network-manager work with avahi?
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09:46<sto->hey all, can I ask in this channel for technical help with something?
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09:47<duclicsic>sto-: that's what it's here for. just ask away
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09:48<duclicsic>sto-: assuming it's help with debian stable. if you're running testing or experimental try #debian-next
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09:51<sto->duclicsic: no, i actually have on my laptop a small bios problem, i just have a bios that has extension .403 and i want to convert it to .rom or .bin, was wondering if anyone would know here a way
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09:52<towo^work>mv foo.403 foo.rom?
09:52<towo^work>maybe it's only the version from that bios-file
09:53<sto->towo^work: that's the issue i am really not sure if just renaming the file will actually be enough
09:53<sto->its asus laptop, i downloaded the bios from there and its a .403 extension on the file
09:54<towo^work>in most cases, all provided bios-files are in .bin format
09:54<towo^work>so i would try it with renaming
09:55<sto->towo^work, so that .403 file is exactly the same as .bin and i just need to rename, i though of that too but i am just not sure thats why i came to ask
09:55<sto->i might just try to rename it a .bin and give it a try
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10:01<duclicsic>sto-: can you link to where you downloaded it?
10:02<sto->duclicsic, www.asus.com/Notebooks/X550LB/HelpDesk_Download/
10:02<sto->there is category on bios, the 403 version is the one
10:03<duclicsic>ok yeah, so they've just appended the version number to the name
10:03<duclicsic>it doesn't define the file type at all
10:03<duclicsic>it's just a binary blob
10:04<sto->duclicsic: that's what it seems to me so far, so do you suggest renaming it to .bin should be enough ?
10:04<duclicsic>do you even need to rename it?
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10:05<duclicsic>it seems unlikely that they'd distribute a bios update that you had to rename to make use of
10:05<sto->well it might be needed to .rom, the problem is in general more serious me and friend of mine are just trying to fix his laptop here
10:06<sto->long story his UEFI bugged out and now he cannot boot or anything
10:06<sto->he is just stuck on black screen completely can't get to no bios anything
10:06<duclicsic>ok well, i don't want to spam up this channel with off-topic stuff, but i doubt very much that you need to rename it
10:06<sto->we tried getting out hard drive, battery, anything, for 2 days still nothing
10:07<sto->so in general we will try to fix the bios i guess thats it
10:07<Ouroboros>how?
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10:08<Ouroboros>if the bios is broken you will have a hard time fixing it
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10:09<Ouroboros>unless this is one of those dual bios or some other out-of-band type thing
10:09<sto->we might need to find a way to put it back to normal by trying to install a version, what is happening is actually the laptop is trying to boot from USB or CD even though its completely bugged out
10:09<Ouroboros>oh
10:09<Ouroboros>did you clear the cmos?
10:10<Ouroboros>i.e. pull out the cmos battery
10:10<sto->yes
10:10<sto->we did that too
10:11<Ouroboros>are you sure its a bios issue and not the graphics
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10:13<Ouroboros>and no output on lcd and external monitor?
10:14<sto->yes because what happened is after recovering from UEFI boot of death just to speed the boot process, a problem appeared
10:14<sto->after upgrading debian it showed no bootable media and after going to UEFI and select EFI file to boot, since then no screen
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10:16<Ouroboros>oh
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10:21<Ouroboros>sto-: but where did you select the efi file? in grub?
10:21<Ouroboros>(i am not really familiar with eufi, i just set it to legacy on mine :P)
10:21<sto->euf
10:21<sto->euf
10:22<Ouroboros>in the bios?
10:22<sto->yes
10:23<Ouroboros>ok, i see
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10:23<Ouroboros>its weird that there is no output at all though
10:23<Ouroboros>well, you can try to reload the biod, perhaps it will clear those eufi settings
10:24<sto->even lights on the laptop don't work properly
10:24<sto->yep thats what we think off
10:24<duclicsic>the lights don't work?
10:24<Ouroboros>but some of those settings might also be persistent (assuming you can even reload the bios), so i dunno
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10:25<Ouroboros>sto-: does this laptop have a 'special' button?
10:26<sto->sensors show battery, they also show that it is trying to read from cd-rom and usb drive, but for example doesn't show that the keyboard is functioning even though it does
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12:37<r4f_debian>Hi all, I used to update my Debian here and had this issue: W: Failed to fetch http://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/dists/jessie-backports/main/binary-i386/PackagesIndex Hash Sum mismatch
12:37<r4f_debian>E: Some index files failed to download. They have been ignored, or old ones used instead.
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12:40<r4f_debian>Please, how to fix this issue ?
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12:56<retrospectacus>r4f_debian: try it again later
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14:09<aboulafia>hi, i made a fresh install of Jessie amd64 and I get an error on my sources list : http://dpaste.com/2R34C7J and i really don't see why ?
14:09<aboulafia>I made a fresh install of jessie
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14:11<mtn>aboulafia: you have jessie/updates in twice and no non-free or contrib in your first line
14:11<mtn>aboulafia: what errors do y ou get?
14:11<lindi->aboulafia: "an error"?
14:12<aboulafia>mtn, where ????
14:12<mtn>aboulafia: where what?
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14:46<Rippie>Hi all, installing Debian 8.6 with a Cinnamon desktop environment. I believe i set the /etc/network/interfaces for eth0 to be static and not DHCP but the GUI network manager still says wired connection is DHCP? is updating /etc/network/interfaces the right way?
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14:51<mtn>Rippie: no, make your changes in network manager, otherwise they will be overwritten
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14:52<Rippie>mtn: ok i can do that. how about when i am on a server with no desktop environment? this server i am doing now is a test VM for me to practice on as i dont want to mess about with the production server.
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14:53<anddam>any hint about how should I proceed with this error on a USB disk? https://gist.github.com/anddam/e176c365a9ea67e151957ab32e381cec
14:53<mtn>Rippie: it is different if network manager is not running, though you can still use it without a desktop environment
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14:55<Rippie>mtn: So if i google search on how to manage network manager without desktop environment something should hopefully show up on google right? :)
14:55<mtn>Rippie: you might even find help in the debian wiki. ;)
14:56<Rippie>anddam: Sorry buddy, i am the greenest of green with Linux, i am pretty sure i cant help you :(
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14:56<mtn>Rippie: oh, you mean how to use network manager that way. just start an interface with nmtui
14:56<anddam>Rippie: ok, I wasn't specifically targeting you but thanks for the heads up
14:57<bremner>Rippie: I would guess that many servers are not running network-manager
14:58<Rippie>bremner: i could not tell you. i just know that my colleagues with more Linux experience use Debian at work and without a desktop environment and i feel lost :) so got some studying to do
14:58<bremner>Rippie: i run several debian servers, and none of them use network-manager
14:58<bremner>it's not impossible to do, it's just not worth the trouble unless you have special needs.
14:59<bremner>servers don't generally have to deal with e.g. wifi
14:59<Rippie>bremner: ok perhaps i phrased the question wrong. whatever comes out of the box on a new installation. i called it the GUI network manager because lack of knowledge i think.
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15:00<ach>hi
15:00<Rippie>but i am refering when you have a Desktop Environment and go in under settings > network settings etc
15:00<mtn>Rippie: what comes out of the box depends on what you installed ;)
15:00<Rippie>mtn: i knew you were gonna say that. haha.
15:00<mtn>Rippie: you could have network manager or not, depending
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15:01<mtn>Rippie: if you install a de, such as gnome, you will have nm
15:01<Rippie>Cinnamon Desktop, ssh server, system utilities is what i select and thats it. On the production server no desktop at all
15:02<Echoz>Rippie: I would advise against using NetworkManager on a server. It's nice for fast changes on a client computer, but for static configurations it's just unnecessary complexity, if you ask me
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15:03<Rippie>Echoz: thx you are probably right. so lets just assume i am NOT installing a desktop environment. what manage the network cards? i am not sure i even know the proper program
15:03<Echoz>Currently I run 7 Debian servers for my personal use, none of them have NM, a keyboard or monitor. just ethernet and power.
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15:04<Echoz>I configure what I need in /etc/network/interfaces. then routing, firewall, etc. in IPtables, everything else sort of depends on what you need
15:05<Rippie>Ok so i still need to learn how to configure network card without a desktop. # nano /etc/network/interfaces ?? or do i need to edit this file some other way?
15:05<Echoz>You can do it with nano
15:05<Echoz>Will you be using DHCP or a static Address?
15:06<Rippie>static
15:06<jrms>Rippie: man interfaces
15:06<blast007>Rippie: https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkManager https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfiguration
15:08<Rippie>thx all, will try some more.
15:08<Rippie>blast007: yeah already looked there and not entirely sure i fully got it. but will try again. cheers
15:08<Echoz>Rippie: https://echoz.rocks/paste/?p=1476472087889
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15:08<Echoz>here is an example static configuration
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15:08<Echoz>if you want address 192.168.0.10 in netowkr 192.168.0.0/24
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15:09<r4f_debian>Hi retrospectacus, thanks for advice, I was absent, only now I've read your message
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15:09<Rippie>Echoz: thx bud. yeah mine looked similar. do you also edit resov.conf manually?
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15:10<Echoz>Rippie: Yes, in my local network it only has two lines
15:10<Echoz>search echoz.rocks, nameserver 192.168.0.42
15:11<r4f_debian>Hi all, please, how to fix this issue ? http://paste.debian.net/876493/
15:11<Echoz>the comma being a newline, not an actual comma
15:12<Rippie>Echoz: and then service networking restart?
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15:13<Echoz>Rippie: either that or you can use ifup/ifdown to restart the interface. however if you're only using one interface you may as well just restart the service
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15:13<Echoz>Rippie: make sure that no dhcp clients are running though, i had that once on one of my servers right after setup and suddenly i had no access to it :)
15:14<jrms>r4f_debian: apt-get clean && apt-get update ?
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15:15<r4f_debian>Hi jrms, I will apply these commands here
15:17<r4f_debian>Hey jrms, after have applied the commands you' ve suggested the issue is fixed ! Thanks a lot ! :)
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15:17<Rippie>ecx
15:17<Rippie>Echoz: back. got disconnected :(
15:18<Echoz>Rippie: Well, that might be a good sign of your changes working, or?
15:18<r4f_debian>As I always say: " Debian OS and Debian Warriors are the Best ! " Really thanks !
15:18<Rippie>Echoz: nah that was just my Hyper-V on this work laptop did not like i used another network card :)
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15:21<fr33d0m>hi
15:22<Echoz>Rippie: Interesting, I never tried Hyper-V
15:23<Rippie>Echoz: me neither really, just because it is in Win10 by default. we use ESXi at work
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15:39<Rippie>thx to everyone, now it works for me. did not realise if you have a desktop environment the same rules does not apply to network settings :)
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15:42<Rippie>Echoz: where did you register your domain?
15:42<Echoz>Rippie: Good :) one note though if you still have NetworkManager running it may mess with your configuration, especially /etc/resolv.conf
15:43<Rippie>Echoz: its a new VM :) so it is not.
15:43<Echoz>Rippie: Hmm... I bought mine for $10 from freenom, but you could buy from anywhere I guess
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15:43<Rippie>i was getting confused because i had the DE installed too.
15:43<Echoz>Rippie: or... "bought" I pay $10 a year
15:44<r4f_debian>Bye all !
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15:46<Echoz>Rippie: Freenom also allows you to get free domain names, but it's not as convenient as I believe you have to manually renew them yearly
15:46<Echoz>when i have it charging me automatically i just change the authorative NS and i can forget about it completely, haha
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15:48<Rippie>Echoz: any experience with PostFix on debian?
15:49<Echoz>Rippie: Limited, I have a postifx server (mail.echoz.rocks) that I use for my mail
15:49<Echoz>postfix for smtp and dovecot for imap more specifically
15:50<Echoz>I'm definitely no postfix expert though
15:50<Rippie>Do you know of any web front ends for postfix? more specifically i need to be able to accept emails from only some sending servers plus i would like to get some stats
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15:52<Echoz>Rippie: sadly no, I use the thunderbird MUA for mail
15:52<Echoz>Echoz: I would like webmail, but I don't really like hosting websites I haven't made myself to the public
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15:56<Echoz>Rippie: Oh, sorry, I didn't really read all of it. But no I don't know of any statistics or configuration front ends for it. I'm sure you could make some half assed PHP solution to the statistics quite easily though and the configuration just requires some dedication to learn
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16:04<aboulafia>hi, x11 is broken after installing nvidia-driver how i can fix it ?
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16:06<lostatwork>aboulafia: are you getting any errors or anything
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16:06<aboulafia>lostatwork: i'm chatting with irssi, i can't access to anything more
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16:14<Rippie>Echoz: do you mind a /msg?
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16:25<Rippie>installed postfix on a server and after initial install it says "to view postfix configuration values, see postconf(1) - how do i use this postconf(1) ?? sorry for the newbie question :)
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16:26<csnxs>man postconf
16:28<Rippie>i am still not sure what postconf(1) means. it mentions it in man postconf too
16:31<somiaj>Rippie: man pages are given different cateogires depending on what they are describing. postconf(1) means the man page 1, man 1 postconf for instance
16:31<somiaj>many times things only have one manpage, so man name gets the first one that is found.
16:31<somiaj>http://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/3586/what-do-the-numbers-in-a-man-page-mean
16:32<Rippie>somiaj: cool, thx alot
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17:24<Human_G33k>it's me or there are not only games here https://wiki.debian.org/Games/WNPP#Packages_for_which_help_was_requested
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17:27<somiaj>Human_G33k: why do you think only games should be listed?
17:28<Human_G33k>somiaj, because /Games/
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17:30<somiaj>oh I didn't see that it was just supose to be a request to package games. They could be packages that are related to games.
17:31<somiaj>looks like the script is generatating a whole list of data, some may not be releveant to games.
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18:17<kedidehdaoud>zill
18:17<kedidehdaoud>hi every you
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18:18<kewiha>Can I install 2 extra NICs in my machine and run PFsense (a router/firewall OS) without VT-d? I have VT-X but not D
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19:07<Ouroboros>kewiha: presumably your hypervisor has bridge mode?
19:08<kewiha>Ouroboros: Thinking KVM and whatever the default is (libvrt?). It would be my firewall, any glaring security concerns with setting it up that way?
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19:10<Ouroboros>why do you want it as a VM
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19:12<kewiha>Blast001_: I already have a debian server with a fancy Supermicro board, 16GB ECC RAM, 80Plus Gold PSU, and all that jazz. Doesn't make sense to build a whole other server just for firewall/routing. I'm using an old Core2Duo machine for it now, but when I move to my new place it woud be nice to consolidate
19:13<Ouroboros>ok, so this will be a firewall for other machines?
19:14<Ouroboros>well, i suppose it can be used for itself too
19:14<kewiha>Yep, the Debian server and it's containers/VMs if I make any will be virtually networked to the PFSense VM, and I'll have the rest of the house connected to the PFSense VM
19:15<Echoz>Rippie: still here, under a different nick?
19:15<Ouroboros>kewiha: it could even be physically looped back, heh
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19:16<Echoz>I was away for a long time but if you have any questions you can either /msg or email at chris@echoz.rocks
19:16<Ouroboros>kewiha: as for security and/or performance in this conifg, i am not really sure
19:16<kewiha>No problem doing that, I have dual intel GB onboard and another dual intel GB AIC
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19:16<Ouroboros>i guess you dont have much choice if there is no vt-d
19:17<kewiha>I mean I may be moving to a semi-rural area, 25mbit down to 150mbit down is what I'm expecting, and transfer speeds between the machines should be tolerable
19:18<Ouroboros>heh, thats semi-rural now?
19:18<kewiha>In Canada, ya we have it pretty nice
19:18<kewiha>not amazing, but pretty nice
19:18<Ouroboros>i think it should be fine, just test it
19:19<Ouroboros>as for security, i mean, what kind of attack are we considering? a packet that can somehow compromise the hypervisor's handling of the network in bridge mode?
19:19<Ouroboros>seems unlikely
19:19<Echoz>I live almost in the middle of nowhere and I can get gigabit here...
19:19-!-jegc [~jegc@dynamic-186-154-80-71.dynamic.etb.net.co] has quit [Quit: jegc]
19:19<Echoz>but I only have 100mbps since i use my internal network mostly
19:20<Ouroboros>kewiha: what cpu that it doesnt have vt-d?
19:20<kewiha>Core i3
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19:20<kewiha>Haswell i3's do ECC but not VT-D
19:20<Ouroboros>mmhm
19:20<Ouroboros>shrug, i say go for it
19:21<kewiha>It will keep me entertained if cabin fever gets to me
19:21<Ouroboros>or just have the debian server be the router, do you really need pfsense?
19:21<kewiha>DIY Router OS seems a little advanced for me
19:22<Ouroboros>depends what features you need, i guess
19:22<Ouroboros>basic routing is like 2 lines
19:22<Echoz>kewiha: it's not if you only want a gateway/firewall
19:22<kewiha>I play games so easy port forwarding and such are really nice
19:22<Ouroboros>thats all easy
19:23<Ouroboros>just iptables rules
19:23<Echoz>kewiha: just learn the iptables syntax and port forwarding is easy :) easier than any web interface gateway
19:23<Ouroboros>yeah, i agree
19:24<kewiha>For now I'm comfortable with PFSense, realistically it might be a pipe dream to have time to do any of this with how little free time I'll have until may. I really like my aliases for port forwarding, change one name and all the game's ports are changed to another device
19:24<Ouroboros>i mean, there are some advantages to having a separate firewall machine, i.e., isolation
19:25<Echoz>I use a ZyWALL USG100, but sometimes I'll admit I wish I could just use IPtables
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19:26<kewiha>I suppose it would be worth looking at power costs, if I get my first pick for coop placement I'll be working at the largest operating NPP in the world, heh
19:26<Ouroboros>anyone remember freesco?
19:26<Echoz>kewiha: the zywall is kinda like that, has some object thing for things like services, addresses, etc.
19:26<kewiha>I have enough C2D machines that I can just swap them out when something dies and not care about power
19:26<Ouroboros>that was my best router ever, some cyrix machine i fished out of the dumpster and freesco on a floppy
19:27<Echoz>free cisco, heh
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19:27<Ouroboros>it was all downhill from there :P
19:28<Echoz>I'd set up a debian firewall, but the ZyWALL was free and works effortlessly...
19:28<Echoz>or free as in i got it from work
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19:29<Ouroboros>that's the best kind of free
19:29<Echoz>:)
19:29<Ouroboros>i mean, if you cant steal stuff from work, why even bother working
19:29<Echoz>hahah
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19:30<Echoz>true, I've picked out a storage server that I want as soon as we've kept it long enough to throw it away
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19:31<Echoz>two relaitvely powerful HP tower servers, I'll just mix and match so i get the best i can, i guess. one has space for 2*4 SAS drives at the front, the other i believe has more RAM
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19:32<Echoz>the one with space for 2*4 sas drives also has a pcie raid controller, so i could take the hot swap module from the other server and get the full potential
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19:33<kewiha>Alas, I quit my part time job at a comp repair shop so the free stuff may be over. I don't think nuclear plants will let me take much home
19:34<Echoz>kewiha: well, if you sneak out enough plutonium you can run your home datacenter for free :)
19:34<kewiha>Canada uses Natural Uranium, I'll need heavy water too
19:35<Echoz>kewiha: Yeah, that's too technical for me
19:35<kewiha>It's just extra neutrons
19:35<kewiha>everybody loves neutrons
19:35<Echoz>kewiha: they make my beer taste better
19:36<Echoz>kewiha: well you must be the guy to ask about going to the chernobyl zone
19:36<Echoz>I want to go there
19:36<Ouroboros>kewiha: ram doesnt love extra neutrons, thats why we have ecc :P
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19:37<kewiha>I'm not sure how defended it is, I know there is still a border the army won't let you through, but I don't know if all the documentaries are filmed within that zone
19:37<kewiha>Definitely bring a detector, don't want supercancer
19:38<Echoz>kewiha: I've researched enough to know I can get a guided tour in there, it's good and all but most of all I want to walk around freely and explore
19:38<Echoz>yeah of course i'd have a geiger counter on me haha
19:38<Ouroboros>dont eat the mushrooms
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19:39<Echoz>Ouroboros: But I like mushrooms
19:39<kewiha>Ouroboros: And yet, the control computers we use all have 8-16kb nonecc ram
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19:39<Ouroboros>kewiha: kb?
19:39<kewiha>Echoz: Just know how far away you are from the spots they'll shoot you away from
19:39<kewiha>Yes, kilobytes
19:40<kewiha>CANDU Reactors were the first generation of digitally controlled reactors, in the 1960s
19:40<kewiha>Never upgraded the computers
19:40<Ouroboros>but are they in a place that has increased rad flux?
19:40<Ouroboros>or are they shielded? etc
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19:40<Echoz>kewiha: hehe, yeah i will probably end up taking the guided tour. think i might go there next summer. i've always had a fascination for places like that
19:40<kewiha>They're quite sheilded, in a separate building
19:41<Ouroboros>and susceptibility to radiation depends on ram technology and size, among other things
19:41<Ouroboros>and software of course
19:41<Ouroboros>frankly, most soft errors in consumer machines are *not* from external radiation
19:41<kewiha>Echoz: 100mSV dose gives you a statistically significant risk of cancer, try to keep at like 1mSV
19:41<Ouroboros>it is mostly marginal devices and/or material contamination with radionuclides
19:42<Ouroboros>this is why some ram will never see any soft errors and some will see many
19:42<techsearch>Not sure if this is a question better suited for here or the GPG channel, but here goes. https://keyring.debian.org gives the command to get the key to verify a deb distro download. Is the last string (the 0x___ address) valid?
19:42<Echoz>kewiha: I heard it was 50mSV that was the "recommended limit", but im sure i have cancer already anyway
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19:43<techsearch>The page doesn't quite give an indication about whether its the general syntax instructions or that key id is kept current.
19:43<Echoz>I'm willing to risk a little to see such an amazing place
19:43<Ouroboros>well, 1 mSv is like what you get in a year from background
19:43<Ouroboros>on that order, i think
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19:46<kewiha>Echoz: I'm sorry to hear that, 100mSV is about the limit where we're really sure you're at a higher risk of cancer. Bad Radon in the basement can easily give you that in a year if you spend a lot of time there.
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19:47<Ouroboros>alarp, man
19:47<kewiha>It's alara in my textbooks, heh
19:48<somiaj>This channel is for debian support. Please stay on topic.
19:50<Echoz>kewiha: I don't quite remember but I believe the radiation here is very low
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19:51<kewiha>Echoz: Anywhere a professional tour guide will take you has no significant risk of health concerns. somiaj has a point though
19:52<Echoz>kewiha: Yeah, I shouldn't bring up topics like this here, rather #debian-offotpic
19:52<Echoz>i mean #debian-offtopic
19:52<kewiha>See you there
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19:58<Ouroboros>techsearch: the key you need should be in the apt error message
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20:06<techsearch>ouroboros: I imported the key suggested by that page, but cannot confirm that the fingerprint is correct. Unfortunately, https://www.debian.org/CD/verify does not list current fingerprints.
20:09<techsearch>I'm new to gpg, so forgive me if there are glaring holes in my knowledge. The output after importing the keys state that expiration isn't until 2018, but I don't know enough to know if two keys can be concurrently importable (one valid, one that hasn't been manually expired yet).
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20:10<Vyrus001_>is there a way to install the debian bsd kernel headers without being on sid?
20:10<Blast001_>techsearch: this is the key id of Gunnar Wolf (debian-keyring maintainer)
20:11<Blast001_>techsearch: https://anonscm.debian.org/git/keyring/keyring.git/tree/keyids#n983
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20:13<Ouroboros>techsearch: so what happend when you do 'gpg --verify'
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20:17<techsearch>"gpg: Can't check signature: public key not found"
20:17<Ouroboros>does it say the key id there?
20:18<Ouroboros>maybe you just need to install debian-keyring
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20:25<techsearch>it identifies the key id used to make the signature
20:26<techsearch>install the keyring?
20:26<techsearch>all i've known to do thus far was to import individual keys
20:27<Ouroboros>you are on debian right
20:27<Ouroboros>'apt-get install debian-keyring'
20:27<Ouroboros>maybe that contains the key you need
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20:31<techsearch>nope, working on getting on debian
20:32<Ouroboros>ok, then you have to import the key based on the ID that gpg gave
20:32<techsearch>that's the goal at the end of this
20:32<techsearch>okay
20:32<techsearch>i'll give that a try
20:32<Ouroboros>(sorry, i am also not super familiar with how this works)
20:32<techsearch>hey, you know more than me
20:32<Ouroboros>gpg --keyserver keyring.debian.org --recv-keys <id from gpg error here>
20:32<techsearch>and i appreciate the responses
20:34<Ouroboros>which file are you trying t overify
20:34<Ouroboros>i will try it here real quick
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20:34<techsearch>the sha512sums for the xfce version of 8.6.0 (live)
20:35<Ouroboros>can you give me the exact url
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20:37<techsearch>http://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/SHA512SUMS.sign
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20:42<Ouroboros>yeah, gpg --keyserver keyring.debian.org --recv-keys 6294BE9B
20:42<Ouroboros>worked for me
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20:42<Ouroboros>(but i dont know how to verify the key itself :)
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20:45<techsearch>yes, that's the kicker
20:47<techsearch>is there a channel for installation issues specifically?
20:47<sney>there's #debian-boot
20:48<Ouroboros>ultimately, you have to get the key from the guy in person, otherwise the whole chain of trust thing makes no sense
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20:50<Ouroboros>damn, there are a lot of keys in debian-keyring
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20:52<Ouroboros>over 900
20:54<techsearch>lol yeah. the verification process page was all "once you find the key id you need" and once I saw that list my brain spontaneously combusted
20:55<Ouroboros>its taking forever to process too
20:55<Ouroboros>already like 15min
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20:57<r4f_debian>Hi all, I'm trying to study a bit more of qemu, an application for virtualization, but in each package qemu only describes: "virtual package provided" in the list of stable softwares in Debian site: https://packages.debian.org/stable/virtual/
20:57<techsearch>sheesh. Do you know what the process is to update your local keyring if they update it on their end?
20:58<somiaj>r4f_debian: what is your goal?
20:58<r4f_debian>as a result, I don't know exactly which of them should be include on basic qemu installation through 'apt-get install'
20:58<r4f_debian>hi somiaj, I would like to install basic qemu virtual environment in Debian
20:58<somiaj>r4f_debian: I personally use libvirt as a front end to qemu-kvm, and virt-manager is a gui application for this.
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20:59<somiaj>r4f_debian: if you want a gui app to manage virtual machines, apt-get install virtual-manager should work (this I think pulls in qemu-kvm by default)
20:59<r4f_debian>is qemu similar to any software for creation of virtual machines, such as xen hypervisor, virtual box and vmware ?
20:59<somiaj>r4f_debian: https://wiki.debian.org/libvirt
20:59<r4f_debian>ok somiaj, I'll check it here, thanks ! :)
21:00<somiaj>r4f_debian: yes, but qemu is a bit more barebones than virtualbox or vmware (And hence it is nice to have libvirt to help manage the vms)
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21:00<somiaj>r4f_debian: but if you want a gui app (and not have to do this all from the command line), apt-get install qemu-kvm libvirt-bin virt-manager
21:00<Ouroboros>techsearch: you are concerned about revokation?
21:01<somiaj>r4f_debian: double check you have the hardware virt enababled in your kernel, then run virt-manager and it should give you tools to create your first vm
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21:02<r4f_debian>somiaj, is that quite difficult to configure it (qemu) ?
21:02<Ouroboros>techsearch: gpg --refresh
21:02<Ouroboros>techsearch: gpg --refresh-keys
21:02<techsearch>ouroboros: I'm operating under the assumption that keys come and go and not always at regular intervals (correct me if I'm incorrect)
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21:03<Ouroboros>yeah, but each key as its expiration date
21:03<Ouroboros>that will only change if its revoked
21:03<techsearch>and they don't drop out early?
21:03<techsearch>ah okay
21:03<Ouroboros>(i think)
21:04<Ouroboros>anyway, --refresh will do all those checks, i think
21:04<somiaj>r4f_debian: I didn't find it difficult, and virt-manager makes it even easier.
21:04<Ouroboros>--refresh-keys rather
21:04<techsearch>excellent
21:04<somiaj>r4f_debian: but I also am fine using the front end tools that do most the work.
21:05<Ouroboros>techsearch: but again, its fairly meaningfless unless you can validate the key in the first place, i think
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21:05<techsearch>that's how it seems to me. If the whole chain isn't verifiable, its just a lot of smoke
21:06<Ouroboros>hm, import still hasnt finished.... its stuck at 100% cpu after "Total number processed", wonder if something broke
21:06<techsearch>but now I know more than I did, so its progress
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21:07<Ouroboros>techsearch: and even if you meet the guy in person, how do you know he is not an NSA mole
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21:07<Ouroboros>there is no ultimate authentication :)
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21:07<Ouroboros>i doubt very many people ever even verify the distro signature at all
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21:08<techsearch>lol if he's a mole, then he has gone to a lot of effort to get my useless, but private info
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21:09<r4f_debian>I see, somiaj, I gave up virtualbox because of such instability of this application, but prefer using Debian as the base for virtualization, than using Xen Hypervisor ( in this case, Debian would run under Xen and not the opposite)
21:09<techsearch>I hear most don't verify, but I can't quite identify with that.
21:10<Ouroboros>i verify the checksum and call it a day
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21:13<somiaj>r4f_debian: unsure in how qemu-kvm works in comparision to virtualbox.
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21:13<r4f_debian>Please, somiaj, you suggested apt-get install qemu-kvm libvirt-bin virt-manager to include in the basic qemu installation. Ok, I'll do it. Which of these suggested packages do you consider important to implement in the qemu pos installation for Debian ?
21:14<r4f_debian>http://paste.debian.net/877181/
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21:16<somiaj>r4f_debian: my suggestion gives you the libvirt tools to help create/manage the vms
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21:25<r4f_debian>ok somiaj, I will do it. virtual-manager will be needed here (need a gui for this purpose). But how do I install the 'libvirt' as front end ?
21:26<Ouroboros>hm, gpg still hasnt finished after 45 min, is is supposed to take this long?
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21:31<somiaj>r4f_debian: virt-manager is part of libvirt and should pull in all the libvirt stuff you need
21:33<r4f_debian>great somiaj, I've finished virt-manager installation here. Does this installation create any icon to get things easiest ?
21:33<somiaj>r4f_debian: I think virt-manager should appear in your desktops menus
21:33<somiaj>r4f_debian: you may need to add your user to the libvirt group and logout and back in
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21:34<r4f_debian>ok somiaj, sorry, don't know how to proceed in this case: add 'r4fkramer' user to the 'libvirt' group
21:35<somiaj>r4f_debian: adduser r4fkramer libvirt as root, then logout/backin as your user
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21:36<r4f_debian>ok somiaj, I will do it. Thanks for Great Support ! :)
21:37<r4f_debian>somiaj, done here - adduser r4fkramer libvirt
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21:41<r4f_debian>somiaj, here it is saying that qemu is an alternative for vmware: https://wiki.debian.org/QEMU . Do you know if QEMU reproduces all Vmware resources ?
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21:45<somiaj>r4f_debian: I don't know either vmware or qemu well enough to say all. But they do most of the same things. With qemu-kvm and libvirt I have made multiple debian vms as a guest of my desktop along with windows, freebsd and some other distros.
21:46<r4f_debian>oh, fine, and the good new is that I can use Debian as the base
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21:47<r4f_debian>Finished to install qemu-kvm
21:49<Zeeps_>ahoy
21:49<Zeeps_>can someone plese explain smarthost to me
21:50<Zeeps_>I want to setup a send only email service on my server
21:50<Ouroboros>back for moar?
21:50<Zeeps_>yeah, fresh awake
21:51<Zeeps_>I tried making an account at mailchimp, but I don't have an address on my domain that can recieve their verification mail
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21:53<Ouroboros>well, you can do that
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21:58<Zeeps_>how do I obtain a smarthost Ouroboros ?
21:58<Ouroboros>did you try your isp already
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22:00<Zeeps_>ISP doesn't provide an account
22:01<Ouroboros>techsearch: heh, gpg finally finished after over an hour
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22:01<techsearch>ha, well that was blazing fast
22:02<techsearch>maybe I should get a piece of that action too
22:02<Ouroboros>i dont think you need that keyring
22:04<Ouroboros>techsearch: the release key does not appear to be in there
22:05<r4f_debian>somiaj, please, just more one question if you permit me: can I use only .iso image as source for intallating a guest OS on QEMU the virtual machine ?
22:05<techsearch>when I checked the fingerprint that the gpg --verify returned, it matched one of the ones listed on deb's verification page. however, it was an old one so I'm a bit wary
22:06<somiaj>r4f_debian: you can use an .iso image to install a vm (but this is not the only way)
22:07<Ouroboros>techsearch: oh wait, i am dumb
22:07<techsearch>ouroboros: it is there?
22:08<Ouroboros>techsearch: i am using the packages from squeeze
22:08<Ouroboros>so probably it is not there :)
22:08<r4f_debian>ok somiaj, thank you very much for Great Support ! :)
22:09<Ouroboros>techsearch: well, i dont want to mess up my apt right now, so i am not gonna check the new ones
22:09<techsearch>but it should be for jessie, no? (its been a while since i looked at its codename)
22:09<Ouroboros>techsearch: but i think it would be in debian-archive-keyring, not debian-keyring
22:10<Ouroboros>yeah, but i am using an old live cd
22:10<Ouroboros>i dont want to put in the new repos now because i am working on some package crap
22:10<Ouroboros>anyway, it doesnt really help you, because you cant install it
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22:11<techsearch>ah okay, no worries. once i'm up and running on deb, it'll be useful to know that process
22:12<Ouroboros>then install debian-archive-keyring (or its prbably already installed), and then gpg --import those files
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22:15<Ouroboros>but that package itself is signed with a key that is in that package, heh
22:16<Ouroboros>so ultimately you would still have to get a key from the keyserver
22:16<techsearch>lol it'd damn well better be signed
22:17<Ouroboros>what i mean is, how do you actually install that package
22:17<Ouroboros>you need the key, which comes from the keyserver again
22:18<Ouroboros>so then we are back to how do you authenticate that
22:18<techsearch>are you regarding the keyring as a package?
22:18<Ouroboros>it is a package
22:18<techsearch>okay
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22:18<Ouroboros>well, there are two packages, each of which has a bunch of .gpg key lists
22:19<Ouroboros>apt also uses those keys to verify packages
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22:20<techsearch>so you'd need to find a published fingerprint to match the keyring key's fingerprint
22:21<Ouroboros>and then you have to verify the SSL certificate of that place etc
22:21<r4f_debian>Bye all !
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22:24<techsearch>oh? what's the et cetera from there?
22:24<Ouroboros>well, how do you authenticate the root CAs?
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22:25<Ouroboros>assuming you even trust the whole SSL chain thing
22:27<techsearch>that is an issue, but you have to try where you can
22:28-!-mode/#debian [+l 725] by debhelper
22:28<Ouroboros>i think you dont want to bring SSL into this, if you are really this paranoid, the correct way is to get the key in person at a debian conference or whatever
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22:30<techsearch>hell, I'm not qualified to audit that, but I can recognize that it has had issues
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22:39<AnotherPerson>hello?
22:40<AnotherPerson>is it possible to configure dovecot imap and postfix smtp with just an ip address?
22:40<AnotherPerson>and no domain name?
22:51<missmbob>you don't need a domain to send email. however, spam blockers will probably kill you. and you cant receive email just via ip
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22:54<Ouroboros>why not the latter?
22:54<missmbob>because reasons
22:54<Ouroboros>those pesky reasons, always spoiling my plans
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23:04<AnotherPerson>oh boo. wanted ,y own email but have no domain
23:04<missmbob>it's $10 a year. c'mon man :P
23:05<Ouroboros>AnotherPerson: running a real mail server is not trivial, just ask hillary
23:05<missmbob>i dont want to talk politics but it really isn't the easiest thing. email is annoying
23:06<Ouroboros>i am going to try soon, but i fully expect it will take months to set everything up properly
23:06<AnotherPerson>wantec to try for a personal experiment
23:07<missmbob>so don't buy two coffees. that's enough money for a domain
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23:07<AnotherPerson>really only $10
23:07<missmbob>yes
23:07<AnotherPerson>i got $20 out of my investements
23:08<AnotherPerson>case closed. thanks guys
23:08<AnotherPerson>now need to think of something catchy
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23:34-!-Zeeps is "OFTC WebIRC Client" on #debian #debian-au
23:34<Zeeps>hi
23:34<Zeeps>when my server sends mail to google I get this error
23:34<Zeeps>5.7.1 message does not meet IPv6 sending guidelines regarding PTR records\
23:35<Zeeps>using exim4
23:35<Zeeps>how do I troubleshoot that?
23:35<missmbob>i'm talking out of my ass since i dont have ipv6...but perhaps for that google requires spf?
23:35<themill>google normally includes a URL for more info in those messages
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23:39<Zeeps>it takes me to https://support.google.com/mail/?p=IPv6AuthError which talks about bulk email
23:40<Zeeps>is that because my domain is less than 5 days old?
23:41<jmcnaught>Zeeps: it's because your IP address does not reverse resolve to the same domain name that your mail server claims to be
23:41<jmcnaught>Zeeps: you're going to need to do a lot of learning if you want to run a mail server. If you're not going to do that, I still recommend that you use a service to deliver your mail.
23:42-!-Strife89|Quassel [~quassel@adsl-98-80-184-28.mcn.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:42<Zeeps>I'm doing this to learn
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23:46<jmcnaught>Zeeps: do you have a clear understanding of how SMTP works?
23:47<Zeeps>not really
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23:47<jmcnaught>if you don't, that's where i would start. you should also read as much of the documentation for your MTA as you can, including the README.Debian file
23:48<jmcnaught>in addition to SMTP, you should get familiar with dkim, spf, and have a decent understanding of dns
23:48<Zeeps>ok
23:49<Ouroboros>is dkim required these days?
23:49<jmcnaught>if you plan on receiving mail for your domain name, you'll need to figure out delivery too. most people will use an imap/pop server like dovecot but you could also do local delivery to system users for example
23:50<jmcnaught>Ouroboros: it's not listed as mandatory by any RFC but it's very difficult for a small mail server to get its mail accepted by gmail/hotmail/yahoo and other big providers.. you need to do everything you can to prove you're legit
23:50<Zeeps>for reverse dns should i use my domain or my servers fqdn
23:50<missmbob>Zeeps: that..what? makes no sense
23:51<jmcnaught>Zeeps: this is an exercise for the reader
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23:51<Ouroboros>jmcnaught: i thought dkim kinda flopped though or is considered pointless
23:51<Ouroboros>maybe i am remembering wrong
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23:54<jmcnaught>Ouroboros: look at the headers of an email you've received from a major mail provider and see if there's a dkim signature
23:54<Ouroboros>there is :)
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---Logclosed Sat Oct 15 00:00:00 2016