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#debian IRC Logs for 2017-06-28

---Logopened Wed Jun 28 00:00:52 2017
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02:21<joe>hi how can I disable autoclean on /tmp in Debian 9 ? In Debian 7 it was in /etc/default/rcS.
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02:31<dtw>joe, I have no personal experience but I think this will help: read "man tmpfiles.d", see /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf (don't edit), edit /etc/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf.
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02:39<joe>dtw: Thanks for this hint.
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02:52<deb9user>Hi, can someone confirm this? Install Debian 9 with debian-live-9.0.1-amd64-xfce.iso. Set a root password in the installer. After successful installation reboot and login as user. Open a terminal and type su. Enter root password -> Not accepted.
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02:58<elraro>hello. security debian repository is down? i get error when i try apt-get update
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03:00<danielsh>works here
03:00<jmcnaught>elraro: it was working for me a few minutes ago but you can also try using https://deb.debian.org/ if you're on stretch, it has the debian-security archive
03:00<arand>I also see it as unreachable.
03:01<arand>Both with deb.debian.org and without.
03:04<grove>It works here
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03:07<danielsh>maybe just one mirror is down
03:08<arand>Started working again now, I've jumped through three mirrors in this span, and it seemed like the two first did not work...
03:08<danielsh>it's very slow though
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03:12<danielsh>(report forwarded)
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03:18<annadane>deb9user, supposedly the live images are broken
03:18<annadane>so i assume they'll be fixed at some point
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03:29<deb9user>annadane, thanks. Who would need to know so that the issue can be fixed?
03:30<annadane>deb9user, pretty sure they're already aware of it, more than one person's brought it up
03:30<lindi->almost nobody seems to find the bug report about this :)
03:30<deb9user>annadane, ah ok... .-)
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03:40<mibster-t>hola
03:41<mibster-t>hay alguiien?
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03:41<annadane>!es
03:41<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte técnico en Inglés para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en Español, puede ingresar en #debian-es tecleando /join #debian-es en la línea de chat.
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03:57<rsmith>jmcnaught: thanks for the icinga/munin suggestion!
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04:05<jmcnaught>rsmith: you're welcome. there's a bunch of software like them in Debian if you search around in apt
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04:38<yuhlw>I'd like to build a tool that reboot my Debian a few days after a kernel patched appears. How can I do to be sure that no "apt" nor "apt-get" runs ?
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06:46<PaulePanter>Hi. For whatever reason Exim only listens on port 25 on my system.
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06:46<PaulePanter>In the Debconf configuration I chose *internet*.
06:46<PaulePanter>But I also like it to listen on port 587 for submission.
06:47<PaulePanter>I found the German thread https://lists.debian.org/debian-user-german/2014/03/msg00389.html making me believe that this is not possible by default?
06:48<PaulePanter>
06:48<PaulePanter>dc_eximconfig_configtype from http://pkg-exim4.alioth.debian.org/README/update-exim4.conf.8.html
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07:30<EmleyMoor>Regardless of the level of charge in my battery, if I disconnect the PSU from my laptop while the screen is locked, it goes into suspend. This is not sensible when there is plenty of charge, and does not happen when the screen is not locked. How do I correct this behaviour?
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08:06<Walex>EmleyMoor: depends which power management module deals with that.
08:07<Walex>EmleyMoor: it could be a BIOS function, or it could be the "pm" GNU/Linux subsystem, or something inside the power power management of your desktop environment.
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08:08<Walex>PaulePanter: don't understand the question, you can make Exim bind for listening to any collection of ports.
08:08<EmleyMoor>Walex: Nothing BIOS related...
08:08<patatate484894>hi
08:08<patatate484894>how can I have x11 autostart for all users?
08:08<EmleyMoor>So, pm or DE power management... how do I track it down?
08:10<Walex>EmleyMoor: usually logs... But typically first look at the "pm" module config. Your DE power management usually does a mix of PM and its own events handling
08:10<EmleyMoor>...
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08:11<Walex>EmleyMoor: power management is driven by "events", which come from the kernel to "udev", and from keyboard events, and things like say closing the lid of a laptop count as keyboard presses.
08:11<Walex>EmleyMoor: it is a mess, so what? :-)
08:12<Walex>EmleyMoor: I must confess that I have never seen or imagine that removing PSU could trigger suspend. Very weird.
08:13<Walex>EmleyMoor: most likely PSU removal is a kernel event. You can monitor those with 'udevadm monitor'
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08:15<Walex>EmleyMoor: https://askubuntu.com/questions/346595/which-file-is-called-or-event-is-fired-when-we-plug-in-plug-out-power-supply-t/346635#346635
08:16<Walex>EmleyMoor: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/227918/system-event-on-ac-adapter-insert-or-battery-unplugged/227967#227967
08:17<Walex>EmleyMoor: and if you are using 'systemd' that too has a PSU event handler
08:18<Walex>EmleyMoor: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Power_management#ACPI_events
08:18<EmleyMoor>I hawe nothing in /etc/pm/config.d or power.d, and only 10_unattended-upgrades-hibernate in sleep.d
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08:21<EmleyMoor>Oddly, the one time I want it to, it doesn't do it!
08:22*EmleyMoor wonders if it's because he's logged in remotely
08:23<EmleyMoor>Anyway, this is whan udevadm monitor reports when power is removed: http://paste.debian.net/973702/
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08:31<L33tPsyco>guys i installed this hexchat on kali linux but it sais im banned :o whats going on! on parrot im not
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08:32<L33tPsyco>hello?
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08:34<bremner>!next
08:34<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
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08:36<L33tPysco>dont matter :/ found issue
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08:39<PaulePanter>Walex: How can I do that?
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08:39<PaulePanter>Sorry, I know that it’s possible. But compared to Postfix, where you just uncomment one line, it looks more involved in Exim.
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08:40<PaulePanter>`daemon_smtp_port = 25:587` is listed in the official Exim documentation, but I don’t know where to add that in the split configuration files in Debian.
08:41<PaulePanter>https://bugs.debian.org/311033 is also tagged `wontfix`.
08:41<judd>Bug http://bugs.debian.org/311033 in exim4-config (open, wontfix): «exim4-config: support for submission port 587 in default config»; severity: wishlist; opened: 2005-05-27; last modified: 2012-03-21.
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08:45<PaulePanter>Adding that line worked. I added it to `exim4/conf.d/main/000_localmacros`.
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11:04-!-fooctrl is "Adnan Hodzic" on #debian #debconf
11:04-!-user is now known as Guest225
11:05-!-Guest225 is now known as LiVanych
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12:08<Walex>PaulePanter: yes, sorry for the delay, I was travelling, but rhe naser is that you can add it anywhere
12:08<Walex>PaulePanter: and "000_localmacros" is not bad.
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12:13<Walex>/w 13
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12:14-!-sunilmohan_ is "Sunil Mohan Adapa" on #osdg-iiith #debian #monkeysphere #debian-reproducible #debian-blends #debian-arm #freedombox #debian-js #debian-webapps #debian-in #pere #debian-boot
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12:21-!-Lirion is "I once rode an elk to Valhalla" on @#debian.offtopic #debian
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12:30<PaulePanter>Walex: Understood. I did that, and it seems to work. Thank you.
12:30<PaulePanter>Walex: Is “rhe naser” a typo?
12:32<Walex>PaulePanter: yes, for "the answer"
12:33<Walex>PaulePanter: BTW usually I configure things so that connections to 587 must be encrypted etc.
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12:33-!-MJD is "Matthew" on #obnam #debian #bcache
12:33-!-Noam_Chomsky is now known as Ann_franks_Ghost
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12:34<Walex>PaulePanter: my (hand written) config is at: http://www.sabi.co.uk/Cfg/exim4/
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12:37-!-sunilmohan is "Sunil Mohan Adapa" on #debian-arm #debian-js #freedombox #debian-in #debian-boot #debian-webapps #pere #debian-reproducible #debian-blends #osdg-iiith #monkeysphere #debian
12:38<PaulePanter>Walex: Thank you. I’ll look at those tomorrow. That’s much appreciated.
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12:49-!-yuhlw____ is "Cédric BRINER" on #debian #debian-fr
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15:10<mnuhmnuh>yo. i just went to zenwalk's home site, clicked on their announcements forum, and my browser was hijacked by ransomware. what can i do to stop that from happening in the future, other than not doing that?
15:11<bremner>do you have some adblocker in place?
15:11<mnuhmnuh>nope, stock + updates installed.
15:12<mnuhmnuh>hmm ...
15:12<bremner>ublock and adblockplus are both in debian.
15:12<bremner>should work ok with firefox (and maybe chromium)
15:12<blast007>ublock origin would be in both mozilla's and chrome's addon sites
15:13<mnuhmnuh>tx, will look into those. hoped i didn't really need 'em anymore.
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15:14<bill-auger>apt upgrade wants to remove pulseaudio - is this ok?
15:14<blast007>!bat
15:14<dpkg>In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
15:14<bill-auger>does not seem ok to me
15:15<bill-auger>so that is not ok? you want to see the output? or was that a canned answer
15:16<mnuhmnuh>bill-auger: not ok, unless you want to revert to doing everything pa does manually.
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15:16<annadane>it's a canned answer you should abide by
15:16<annadane>it will give us more information
15:17<bill-auger>https://paste.debian.net/973787/
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15:18<bill-auger>ive heard that firefox will not make sound without pulse now - anyone know is that true?
15:18<ryouma>i know that in jessie, purging pulseaudio is the opposite of a problem. but in stretch, i have heard it is potentially a problem.
15:18<bill-auger>although it wants to remove pulse it does not want to remove firefox
15:19<ryouma>i have jessie's pretty recent firefox and sound works on it
15:19<ryouma>so perhaps the firefox rumor is not totally true
15:19<ryouma>(adn muy stretch rumor was based on that)
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15:31<bill-auger>is there a way to find out which package is conflicting?
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15:35<bill-auger>should i run apt upgrade once first and then try apt dist-upgrade?
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15:38<amacater>Run apt-get rather than apt - you may get more / better output
15:38<piper>bill-auger: i am going to guess wine is messing something up,, how did you install it ?, it should be installed this way https://wiki.winehq.org/Debian
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15:38<amacater>If you are trying to move from Jessie -> Stretch READ THE UPGRADE INSTRUCTIONS :)
15:39<bill-auger>yea i just notice the wine and the pulse is from kxstudio - that probably the source of the trouble
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15:40<mnuhmnuh>amacater: "Read the documentation?!? I paid money for this thing! It ought to just work, FFS!!!" :-)
15:40<bill-auger>no im moving from testing to stable
15:40<darkphader>how to switch to PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames?
15:40<piper>!downgrade
15:40<dpkg>Downgrading is not, nor will ever be supported by apt. Programs change their data in a way that can't be rolled back, and package maintainer scripts support upgrades to new config file formats but not downgrades. Try: "dpkg -i olderversion.deb" or "aptitude install package=version" using "apt-cache policy package" to get the old version number. See also <partial downgrade>, <unstable->testing>, <sdo>.
15:40<amacater>Where testing was stretch prior to final release?
15:40<piper>bill-auger: ^^^^
15:41<bill-auger>which should have been quite non-eventful i would have expected
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15:41<amacater>i.e. you haven't upgraded since Stretch release?
15:41<bill-auger>yes i switched from testing to stretch about a week ago
15:41<bill-auger>i think i have upgraded once since the release
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15:42<piper>darkphader: https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames/
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15:42<gigli>Hello
15:42<amacater>Was your apt sources.list still pointing to testing at that point?
15:42<gigli>I just installed Debian Strech
15:42<gigli>I'm happy :-)
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15:43<mnuhmnuh>if you were running stretch/testing and kept it stretch/stable, you're good. s/testing/stretch/ in /etc/apt/sources.list, and it'll stay there.
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15:44<darkphader>?
15:44<amacater>For the future - there's a good argument to always refer to releases by codename - it will follow the distribution from testing -> stable -> oldstable through transitions that way
15:44<bill-auger>sry for the delay here is a more detailed report https://paste.debian.net/973789/
15:44<mnuhmnuh>darkphader: ?!?
15:45<bill-auger>admittedly i did not actually include " for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem" - that would be over 100 packages
15:45<bill-auger>thats why i asked may if i should run upgrad first - then the "problem areas" would only be 6 packages
15:46<mnuhmnuh>amacater: strongly agree. upgrading should be controlled by owner/user, not by debian's process.
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15:46<amacater>Purge anything from kxstudio _first_.
15:47<amacater>Remove anything not Debian otherwise you run the risk fo a frankenDebian that no one can troubleshoot
15:47<piper>bill-auger: apt-get purge '^(lib)?wine.*'
15:47<bill-auger>yea i did s/testing/stretch/ in /etc/apt/sources.list last week
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15:48<bill-auger>ok - will do - ive a feeling ima have a broken sound system afterward but thats ok
15:48<amacater>!frank
15:48<dpkg>methinks frank is elite
15:48<amacater>!frankendebian
15:48<dpkg>When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. See if you can convince ##linux to help.
15:48<bill-auger>dont need wine for anything anyways
15:49<mnuhmnuh>bill-auger: no-one ever really did, imho. dumbth.
15:49<piper>bill-auger: follow this http://paste.debian.net/973791/
15:50<piper>mnuhmnuh: i use, so do my grandids
15:50<piper>*grandkids
15:50<piper>never an issue
15:50<piper>steam also
15:50<amacater>Also - try using apt-get --dry-run
15:50<amacater>or -s for simulate
15:51<bill-auger>i also had to sudo apt-get purge '^(lib)?wine.*:i386' thats where the conflicts were
15:52<mnuhmnuh>piper: i'm a win* hater, i admit. it's always seemed a much smarter way to go to just cut it off and forget redmond and their !@#$ (and everything related) even exists.
15:53<piper>bill-auger: yep, only way to clean that, don't forget the directories , i have no idea where kstuidio puts stuff
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15:53<piper>mnuhmnuh: well at work, we can't have anything microsoft
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15:54<bill-auger>wow it is removeing 300MB of package now
15:55<piper>*kxstudio even
15:55<mnuhmnuh>amacater: ty for "--dry-run". i've missed aptitude's -s switch. by now, i prob. ought to re-read every manpage i've ever read.
15:55<bill-auger>no just the stuff wine was depending on
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15:57<darkphader>piper: I want to enable PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames in stretch that was upograded from jessie
15:57-!-brians__ is "brian" on #linode #oftc #sepia #ceph
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15:57<annadane>is there a way to export my entire firefox profile? cookies, cache, history, extensions, etc
15:58<grawity>annadane: it's there in ~/.mozilla/
15:58<mnuhmnuh>piper: at work, i used my own box to do _my_ stuff and $job's box to do their stuff. all my email didn't just disappear one day when some idiot fouled up an exchange upgrade.
15:58<deliver>Didn't it called mozarella
16:00<bill-auger>is there a way to ask apt or dpkg to list all installed packages from one certain repo ? - like kxstudio
16:00<piper>annadane: just move/copy the whole folder, .mozilla backup/restore that
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16:01<deliver>Did you try synaptic bill-auger
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16:01<bill-auger>nope dont think i have synaptic - that will let me filter by repo?
16:02<darkphader>fresh Stretch install uses PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames, upgrade does not, how to enable this after upgrade?
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16:03<deliver>You have some filter in synaptic, bill-auger try a look please
16:03<bill-auger>im getting the feeling i wont resolve this until everything from kxstudio is out - he targets ubuntu primarily so debian support is flakey
16:03<bill-auger>cool ok thanks
16:03<deliver>kxstitch Cross stitch pattern editor
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16:03<piper>darkphader: sorry, drinking coffee and chewing gum at the same time https://askubuntu.com/questions/628217/use-of-predictable-network-interface-names-with-alternate-kernels
16:04<deliver>I only found this, never heard of kxstudio in sources and packages
16:04<mnuhmnuh>bill-auger: i thot u* got their stuff from debian. trickle down yada yada ...
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16:06<bill-auger>now kxstudio has its own deb repo on launchpad
16:06<bill-auger>i think from now on i will compile what i need from there from source
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16:07<deliver>Launchpad, now I know, okay bill-auger
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16:17<humblebee>hi
16:17<humblebee>what are the best command line encryption tools for debian? just tried aespipe - it is very cool.
16:17<rudi_s>gpg
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16:19<humblebee>ah! it has a --cipher-algo option! very nice.
16:20<rudi_s>humblebee: What are you trying to do? Changing defaults is only a good idea if you know exactly what you're doing.
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16:20<humblebee>just trying to get an overview, i was thinking about encrypting my files in etc and /var/log. not sure how to keep the system running though.
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16:21<blast007>why just those files?
16:21<rudi_s>humblebee: Use LUKS to encrypt the complete disk.
16:22<rudi_s>Encrypting files which are used during runtime is not really worth much as they have to be available decrypted during runtime anyway.
16:22<humblebee>well just those files to start somewhere
16:23<blast007>humblebee: that's really not how it works
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16:24<humblebee>ok - it was an example to help me understand how you would do something like this. of course i can encrypt more/all files later.
16:25<blast007>you encrypt the partition(s), not the files
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16:27<humblebee>yes - but the files have to be decrypted to read them. wouldn't it be better to encrypt them again and only allow 'root users' to read the decrypted versions?
16:28<blast007>not if you want your system to work
16:29<blast007>you can't just encrypt the files in /etc.
16:29<blast007>what kind of attack are you trying to prevent?
16:30<bill-auger>yep i think im good now - it was all due to one package libjack-jackd2-0 - after removing everything from kxstudio i still had to force downgraded that package to the debian version
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16:31<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: good ideas can be good or bad in implementation. eg., use an rdb to manage what's in your freezer. will your kids faithfully update the db when stuff goes in or out? no.
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16:35<humblebee>i was thinking that actually only the processes reading and writing 'their' files need to know what is in them and am looking for a way to implement it.
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16:38<humblebee>maybe another way would be using many different users, but this seems very complicated
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16:41<humblebee>or groups, since processes may also share files
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16:42<rudi_s>humblebee: Look security frameworks like selinux, apparmor, tomoyo or smack.
16:42<rudi_s>*look into
16:42-!-Arcade [~Arcade@arcade.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Quit.]
16:43<rudi_s>They provide fine grained access for programs.
16:43<rudi_s>But sadly are quite difficult to manage and administrate.
16:45<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: i'd say if that level of paranoia is in play, just go with tails instead. KISS. :-)
16:46<humblebee>ok i will take a look at apparmor and friends
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16:46<humblebee>not sure if tails does something like this, didn't check
16:47<darkphader>piper: no help from that page
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16:52<piper>darkphader: https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfiguration http://www.debianhelp.co.uk/udev.htm
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16:53<humblebee>is there an easy way to avoid a command being saved to the shell history?
16:54<grawity>if it's bash and $HISTCONTROL has either 'ignorespace' or 'ignoreboth', just prefix it with a space
16:54-!-H4ndy [~H4ndy@2a00:c1a0:c0c6:6e00:69fc:7ee8:8625:5372] has quit [Quit: Blessed is the mind too small for doubt.]
16:54<darkphader>piper: "Upgrades to stretch will retain the old device names - despite what you will read on the web - removing /etc/udev/rules.d/70-local-persistent-net.rules will not give you the new names"
16:55<humblebee>cool, thanks!
16:56<piper>darkphader: what does ls /sys/class/net/ say
16:57<darkphader>the VM I upgraded eth0, the VM I installed from scratch enp0s3
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16:58<piper>darkphader: well, i run sid, don't use vm, i am of no help
16:58<piper>and i would have done a clean install, if it were me
16:59<amacater>!next
16:59<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
16:59<amacater>!debian-next
16:59<dpkg>#debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
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17:00<deliver>I#m althought satisfied with debian9.0
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17:02<humblebee>i will also install it when it reaches 9.1 - 9.0.0 or .1 usually will still get some bugfixes i think
17:02<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: tails wasn't a serious suggestion, btw. it likes to be run from usbkey, not installed. v. specific target audience.
17:04<humblebee>i'd rather run it from dvd and a driver that cannot write to disc, lol
17:04<humblebee>*drive
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17:06<humblebee>or a write-protected usb drive
17:06<humblebee>not sure if it is easily available
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17:08<mnuhmnuh>sounds like tails is what you want.
17:09<deliver>linuxmint have a nice tool to format a tick and copy an *.iso on it, works fine with debian.
17:10<deliver>missing s /s/tick//stick
17:10<mnuhmnuh>nicer than "cp blah.iso /dev/sdN"?
17:11<deliver>unetbootin would although a solution
17:11<piper>dd if=nameofiso of=/dev/sdd bs=4M; sync
17:12<deliver>Consolefetishist
17:12<piper>unetbootin good luck with that in debian
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17:12<mnuhmnuh>piper: i ought to do a compare (time?) of the two sometime. never had any trouble with the cp ver.
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17:13<mnuhmnuh>deliver: guilty. :-)
17:13<piper>mnuhmnuh: takes under 2 minutes for a 2.0gb iso on usb3
17:14<humblebee>here are usb drives with write protection: https://www.kanguru.com/storage-accessories/flash-drives.shtml
17:14<piper>i do this 2-4 times a day to test my builds
17:14<humblebee>seem a little expensive though
17:14<piper>or i just use fromiso and boot the iso from harddrive
17:15<deliver>I-m not your bench, you work properly and fine, piper
17:15<piper>deliver: ?
17:15<mnuhmnuh>i just dl'd a copy of zenwalk to a usbkey; 1.10 Gb. took less than a couple minutes, i think.
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17:16<mnuhmnuh>the key is likely the limiting factor, not cp vs. dd.
17:16<deliver>Someone tells me to keep quiet about you, that is all
17:16<deliver>You love your console
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17:17<humblebee>what is wrong about loving the console?
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17:17-!-amacater is "Andrew M.A. Cater" on #debian-hams #debian-arm #debian-cd #debian-efi #debian
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17:17<piper>deliver: i use console alot, how i grew up, we didn't have web browsers back then
17:17<deliver>gnome-multi-writer
17:17<piper>then came netscape
17:18<humblebee>i always do 'echo <3' after starting a new bash session
17:18<deliver>I'm here Prof. Weizenbaum and Eliza, Sir
17:18<mnuhmnuh>besides, less eye candy means you can concentrate on what *matters*!
17:18<humblebee>i mean 'echo \<3' of course
17:20<deliver>On german? We honour your work, master
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17:20-!-skitt is "Stephen Kitt" on #debian #debian-ftp
17:21<humblebee>German matters in Germany probably
17:23<mnuhmnuh>OT, i know, but i love germans, especially for not killing my pop for dropping bombs on them. admittedly, they were doing the same to angland at the time. glad we all got over that !@#$. eof!
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17:29<deliver>You are #debian-offtopic, but you right in your opinion Onomatopoeia
17:30<deliver>And in my: https://literarydevices.net/onomatopoeia/
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17:30<humblebee>i love debian for giving me a lot of signed high-quality packages i can download over an insecure connection without worrying.
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17:31<deliver>They have mediathek integrated for europian television, wow
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17:31-!-Haudegen is "AP,,," on #debian-next #debian-kde #debian
17:32<deliver>How makes the cow: muh
17:32<humblebee>not mow?
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17:33<deliver>Shakespeare: How you like it
17:33<humblebee>it is always nice to have your lawnmooer ready to go. feed your grass to a cow. mow!
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17:40<deliver>Do you know I was in Circus today, they invited me. panem et circenses Imustn't pay for it: https://flicflac.de/
17:40<deliver>must not
17:40<humblebee>cat encrypted.file aespipe -d <<< "Password" still asks for a password, what could be the problem?
17:41<humblebee>sorry, 'cat encrypted.file|aespipe -d <<< "Password"'
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17:44<humblebee>i like the circus, if it's not the political circus on tv
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17:46<humblebee>ah, it just doesn't read the password from stdin it seems
17:47<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: i recognize "<" and "<<", but not "<<<".
17:47<mnuhmnuh>bashism?
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17:47<mnuhmnuh>kshism? zshism??
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17:50<humblebee>i am not exactly sure how it works, but it passes on the string like << would do with the contents of a file
17:50<humblebee>for example, cat <<< "Hello friendly foe!"
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17:52<jmcnaught>https://www.gnu.org/software/bash/manual/bashref.html#Redirections also this covers it as well: http://mywiki.wooledge.org/BashGuide/InputAndOutput
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17:59<mnuhmnuh>"<" clobbers existing, "<<" appends to existing, "<<<" must append input and standard error onto *, i guess. bashism. feaping creaturism; did we really need to do that? "Who ordered this?"
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18:11<humblebee>what does the word clobber actually mean?
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18:13<jelly>overwrite, replace completely
18:14<jelly>or do you mean out of this context
18:14<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: "replace" or write over existing contents.
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18:17<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: we anglos accept that all our words come from you Euro-continentals (english, french, italian, greek, ...) so it's too easy for us to assume you understand this mishmash that is English. sry. :-)
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18:18<mnuhmnuh>i thot clobber was from german.
18:19<mnuhmnuh>er, mishmash == mess.
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18:22<mnuhmnuh>turns out according to dict, clobber din't come from anywhere. my bad. learned sumfin.
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18:23<mnuhmnuh>To overwrite, usually unintentionally
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18:33<humblebee>ok
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18:34<humblebee>because i think it is also used in context of bash when using * etc
18:34<humblebee>or was it clobbing/globbing?
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18:49<hanasaki>debian 9 seems to only have netinst and xfce CD iso. correct?
18:50<Brigo>hanasaki, and i can't see why Stretch has it.
18:50<Brigo>you don't need it.
18:51<hanasaki>Brigo: don't understand
18:51<hanasaki>http://ftp.utexas.edu/debian-cd/9.0.0/amd64/iso-cd/
18:51<hanasaki>what about a gnome or kde installer cd?
18:51<sney>use the netinst
18:51<sney>it will give you any desktop
18:52<sney>alternately, use a dvd image
18:52<Brigo>hanasaki, i think you don't need and xfce image, you can install whichever you want
18:52<sney>there's a writeup of this decision somewhere but basically, cd-only systems are too rare now to bother making huge cd sets. use dvds if you want something offline, otherwise the netinst will download and install exactly what you want
18:53-!-Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:53<sney>( hopefully this will kill some of the confusion re: kde/gnome "editions" of debian, which are a non-thing )
18:54<hanasaki>sney: thanks... although that doesn't explain why there is an xfce one
18:54<Brigo>hanasaki, ask google.
18:54<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: globbing == gathering together, i think.
18:55<hanasaki>there are 3 DVD's for download... when are the 2 and 3 needed? I usually got all I needed from CD1 for any of xfce,kde,gnome,server only . then just added a tasksel
18:55<sney>iirc it's to support that tiny .0whatever% of cd-only systems, with the only popular desktop env small enough to fit in a CD image
18:55<sney>the DVD images contain the whole package archive, for systems without a network connetion
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18:57<Brigo>they are sorted by popularity into the DVDs, so you most likely will find your packages in the first DVD.
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18:58<Brigo>buy if you wan the whole thing, you can get it.
18:58<hanasaki>thanks
18:58<Brigo>hanasaki, np
18:59<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: you only ever need the 1st. it ought (nvidia?!?) to get you a system working well enough to get anything else needed.
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19:00<hanasaki>what about nvidia?
19:00<hanasaki>is there a mini ISO for just a basic server / no gui?
19:00<Knorrie>fail
19:00<Knorrie>gp
19:01<Knorrie>whoops, wrong channel
19:02<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: some people say "never any problem, works great" and others (inc. me) hate the fscking things and see they're nothing but a minefield for newbs. bon chance.
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19:02<sney>hanasaki: that would be the netinst, again
19:03<hanasaki>sney: doesn't netinstall need a network to finish even a min install?
19:03<Brigo>hanasaki, i use nvidia, it should work flauless if you follow the debian instruccions.
19:03<Brigo>hanasaki, the netinstall can do just that too.
19:03<Brigo>hanasaki, yes.
19:03<hanasaki>Brigo: thanks. looking at laptops and some have nvidia + intel HD
19:04<Brigo>hanasaki, intel + nvidia is not what i am talking about.
19:04<Brigo>i don't know what that works.
19:04<sney>hanasaki: nope, it has the standard utilities so it can install a barebones server without a network connection.
19:04<hanasaki>any recommendations on a good midrange laptop that will work + touchscreen
19:04<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: good to have a wired conn. wifi on install may not be there sans more work.
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19:04<Brigo>hanasaki, you can use the DVD image and install just the base system and the servers you need.
19:05<hanasaki>seems mostly gnome for good touchscreen experience? kde / xfce not as usable?
19:06<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: not true. those should be good. worry about wifi/network hardware support, i suggest.
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19:06<hanasaki>mnuhmnuh: thanks!
19:06<mnuhmnuh>de nada.
19:07<hanasaki>don't seem to find references to what works... can I share my list of candiates and get your input?
19:07<hanasaki>does the gui autorotate with a tablet?
19:08<mnuhmnuh>"lspci -nnn | grep -i network" i think?
19:08<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: paste.debian.net?
19:09<hanasaki>how bout a link to a spreadsheet?
19:09<hanasaki>hmm my current desktop : 02:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Broadcom Limited BCM4352 802.11ac Wireless Network Adapter [14e4:43b1] (rev 03)
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19:09<mnuhmnuh>prefer text, thanks.
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19:11<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: if you've probs., that's what the wizards need to hear from you (i don't do wifi myself).
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19:12<hanasaki>mnuhmnuh: https://paste.debian.net/hidden/fda3f3fb/
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19:13<hanasaki>mnuhmnuh: this is a laptop / tablet convertible for a friend... just want to get the other OS's off it
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19:13<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: there's also wiki.debian.org/wifi you might check. may already be there, dependant on how new your box is.
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19:14<mnuhmnuh>accessing ... (commander data ... :-)
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19:15<mnuhmnuh>looks pretty. :-)
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19:16<hanasaki>thanks
19:16<hanasaki>the lenovo 710 looks good but there are a lot of stories about it not booting linux... something about ROMs and HD issues
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19:18<mnuhmnuh>er, wut? "256GB SSD 802.11AC Wifi HDMI Bluetooth Webcam-Silver" what a mishmash of hardware reportage. :-P
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19:20<humblebee>sounds like a cool piece of hardware
19:21<mnuhmnuh>yeah, looks pretty. :-)
19:21<mnuhmnuh>hope it works.
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19:24<hanasaki>mnuhmnuh: lol ya... looking for good return policies
19:27<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: "extended support" from BestBuy saved my butt bigtime once. it's not always wasted money.
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19:38<hanasaki>mnuhmnuh: saved how?
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19:42<mnuhmnuh>hanasaki: i had an hp pavilion that ran hot from day one. last month of support contract, i took it back and they replaced pretty much eveything in it, and it was a perfect machine, til it died three years later. BB honoured the contract well, i thot.
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19:49<mnuhmnuh>i'd say never buy hp, except my hp xeon quad tower is the best box i've ever run; the machine i only dreamed of owning more than a decade ago. meh.
19:50<mnuhmnuh>life.
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20:02<L33tPysco>Hello :)
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21:32-!-cyphase is "Cyphase" on #virt #suckless #qemu @#house.md @#heroes #guardianproject #gcc #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian-mentors #debian #debconf #ceph-devel #ceph #awesome @#PrisonBreak #powerdns @#p4xriddle #osm-dev #osm #oftc #love @#lost
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21:36-!-disposable is "Unknown" on #storage #ovirt #ceph #debian
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21:36-!-phorce1 is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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22:08-!-fmscott1_ is "fmscott1" on #debian
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22:25-!-linux is "linux" on #debian
22:25-!-linux is now known as Guest24
22:25<Guest24>nihao1
22:25<Guest24>hello
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22:26-!-linux__ is "linux" on #debian
22:26<linux_>hello
22:26<linux__>hello
22:26<Guest24>nishi1
22:27<Guest24>yourenma
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22:28-!-po is "linux" on #debian
22:28<Guest24>jiao
22:28<Guest24>wangjiaposhabi
22:28<po>sai
22:28<Guest24>shibushisha1
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22:30-!-myg is "linux" on #debian
22:30<po>iuewfhh
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22:30-!-linux_ is "linux" on #debian
22:30<linux_>try
22:30<linux_>shei1
22:30<linux_>sdnajwf
22:30<linux_>wef'n
22:30<linux_>asdjpia
22:30<linux_>as
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22:31-!-mode/#debian [+o themill] by ChanServ
22:31-!-mode/#debian [+q *!*@1.180.214.*] by ChanServ
22:31-!-mode/#debian [-o themill] by themill
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22:31-!-rein_ is "realname" on #debian
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22:32-!-bnw is "realname" on #dot #debian-zh #debian #debian-next
22:32<rein_>helooo
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22:32-!-csotelo is "realname" on #debian-es #debian
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22:32-!-linux__ is "linux" on #debian
22:32<annadane>hello. everybody is apparently drunk, but if you do have a debian support question those of us who are sufficiently sober will try to answer your query
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22:33-!-disposable is "Unknown" on #storage #ovirt #ceph #debian
22:33<humblebee>especially if it is about wine.
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22:39-!-phorce1 is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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22:51-!-phorce1_ is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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22:54<mnuhmnuh>humblebee: "apt-get remove ..." :-)
22:55<mnuhmnuh>annadane: people who can't hold their liquor shouldn't be drinking in the pirst flace. [sic]
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22:56-!-eldar is "realname" on #debian
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22:58-!-phorce1 is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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23:03-!-gtristan is "Tristan Van Berkom" on #debian #ninja-build
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23:04-!-Lordz is "Adium User" on #debian
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23:07-!-disposable is "Unknown" on #storage #ovirt #ceph #debian
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23:12-!-f10 is "f10" on #debian-kde #debian
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23:13-!-phorce1_ is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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23:20-!-phorce1 is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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23:31-!-phorce1_ is "Gerald" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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23:32-!-cyphase is "Cyphase" on #virt #suckless #qemu @#house.md @#heroes #guardianproject #gcc #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian-mentors #debian #debconf #ceph-devel #ceph #awesome @#PrisonBreak #powerdns @#p4xriddle #osm-dev #osm #oftc #love @#lost
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23:34-!-diegola is "diego-go" on #debian
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23:46-!-txt-file is "txt.file" on #debian #debianppc #debian-arm #debian-sparc
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23:48-!-txt-file [~txt.file@2a03:f80:354:37:235:49:34:f003] has left #debian [Leaving]
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23:48-!-imperia is "imperia" on #debian-next #debian
23:50-!-Intel4bite [~INTEL4BIT@184-96-250-34.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #debian
23:50-!-Intel4bite is "..." on #debian @#Base @#Subnet
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23:57-!-skitt is "Stephen Kitt" on #debian #debian-ftp
---Logclosed Thu Jun 29 00:00:54 2017