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#debian IRC Logs for 2018-05-11

---Logopened Fri May 11 00:00:06 2018
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01:48<twb>Who was telling me the other day that chromium should be buildable, slowly, on any old crappy hardware?
01:48<twb>https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/master/docs/linux_build_instructions.md says min 8GB ram, 100GB nvram
01:49<twb>most of my systems are about 10% of that :-)
01:50<somiaj>wonder if I could get it to build in a vm with 2gb of ram (but plenty of swap and disk space)
01:50<somiaj>though my vms don't have nearly 100gb of space, didn't realize it used so much. I just recall building all of gnome and xorg back in teh day and it taking 2-3 days to build on a pentium 3, 666mghz.
01:51<jm_>twb: why do you want to build it yourself?
01:52<somiaj>It was more that security didn't provide the debugging packages, so the only way to get them was build yourself.
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02:02<twb>jm_: because I want dbgsym and stretch security doesn't provide it
02:03<twb>somiaj: to be fair, that 100G is assuming you use 100% embedded copies, and the host OS provides NOTHING except python and git
02:03<twb>somiaj: IOW it includes stuff like clang source + binaries
02:04<somiaj>twb: yea, I'm just surprised it can't be done. I use to build things and it would take days, so I was thinking time commitment (and disk space) was the biggest issue.
02:04<twb>somiaj: I do compile a (allnoconfig) linux kernel regularly, and that only takes about 10 minutes. the chromium source tarball is about 10 times larger than the linux source tarball, and chromium doesn't have an "allnoconfig" equivalent, so it's more like 100 times what I normally build :-
02:05<twb>100 * 10min = 17 hours
02:05<twb>which isn't "impossible" I guess
02:05<twb>Although that 10min figure is assuming all I/O is to RAM, no HDDs, so add another 10*
02:06<somiaj>yea, I was expecting longer than that...but I was thinking time was the only restriction (provided you had enough hd space for the source and maybe some swap). But I do agree, browsers on monstrositites.
02:07<twb>apparently the chromium docs suggest you use some kinda inter-corporation distcc so that if Samsung or Lenovo has alrady compiled that paritcular .c, you can just download the .so from them
02:07<twb>*the .o
02:08<somiaj>yea this vm only has about 10gigs free, wonder if I can even download teh source.
02:08<somiaj>its a throwaway vm, so lets see
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02:09<twb>somiaj: source tarball is just over 512MiB
02:09<twb>So unpacked it should be around 1.75GiB
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02:10<twb>the build products for a full build just under 20B according to chromium's build notes -- they recommend making the dir a tmpfs to reduce build time from 18m to 15m
02:10<twb>*20GB
02:11<somiaj>yea, most likely this vm dones't have enough hd space
02:15<twb>virtio-9p ftw?
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02:16<somiaj>yea that could be fun, setup a shared drive space with spice, and see how that muks with the process.
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02:22*twb rages at trying to find anything like NEWS or ReleaseNotes for chromium
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02:29<somiaj>twb: the chromium source package unpacked is 2.6 gigs
02:29<twb>blerrrrrrrrrrrrgh
02:29<somiaj>this will probabaly totally fail according to your docs, but I have 2.6 gigs left on the vm and 2 gigs of ram, lets see how badly the build pukes
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02:30<somiaj>oh oops, forgot the build deps, that is gonna put it under 2gigs of free disk space.
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02:38<somiaj>alrighty here it goes, I'll let ya know tomorrow how baddly it failed.
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04:19<twb>Am I the only one that finds it a bit ridiculous that "print server" is still a top-tier option in the installer
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04:21<arto>twb: maybe newbies use those selections, I thin most users use expert installation mode
04:24<twb>arto: the prompt only appears with priority=low
04:24<twb>I just find it odd that cups gets such a privilege, when GUI installs pull it in anyways, and nobody else cares about cups
04:25<twb>postgres doesn't get asked about, only cups, sshd, and apache
04:26<arto>well. good be otherwise, or removed completely
04:27<jm_>yeah I think people realized there were far too many choices to add there
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04:29<twb>Yeah just get rid of cups from that list
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04:35<kot>what about people who don't install a desktop but want cups?
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04:36<arto>kot: those probably know what to do
04:36<b-lion>I found printer driver go to install says this "Debian package (application/vnd.debian.binary-package" ??
04:37<b-lion>looking for debian package
04:37<b-lion>where?
04:39<b-lion>im use to Linux Mint MATE much better apps and interface
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04:40<twb>kot: I'm asserting that is a low-probability scenario
04:40<petn-randall>!mint
04:40<dpkg>Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at http://forums.linuxmint.com/ or join #linuxmint-help on irc.spotchat.org for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>.
04:40<petn-randall>b-lion: Try asking in their support channel. ^^^
04:40<b-lion>im using debian
04:40<b-lion>not using mint
04:40<petn-randall>b-lion: oh, sorry, misunderstood you then.
04:41<b-lion>i got the driver but it says.
04:41<b-lion>Debian package (application/vnd.debian.binary-package
04:41<enyc>I have (or at least help-with) a mix of debian devuan ubuntu mint in different places ;p
04:41<b-lion>Need this
04:41<kot>twb, it's what i do. i like to install a desktop later, only the parts i want.
04:41<b-lion>Thats a good skill
04:42<b-lion>where can I find the Debian package to support the printer?
04:42<enyc>b-lion: ubuntu at least has "printer-driver-all"... I just look on packages.debian.org now...
04:42<b-lion>cool man ill take a look
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04:43<enyc>b-lion: same applies to debian... try "printer-driver-all" package and ese if that helps, otherwise give details of make/model etc. NOTE that OpenPrinting database can be helpful. https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/openprinting/database/databaseintro
04:44<twb>kot: ...and yet you're choose to install cups in advance?
04:44<twb>kot: why?
04:44<b-lion>Also any good light weight browsers at the moment? Very slow to follow link
04:44<arto>b-lion: I use gupzilla
04:44<enyc>b-lion: "dillo" maybe, there are many.
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04:45<b-lion>dillo seems good actually
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04:46<b-lion>positives and negatives about it?
04:46<kot>twb, i might want to print something before i get around to installing a desktop.
04:46<arto>b-lion: test it and your find what is good
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04:47<twb>RARGH. Installing from USB key to 3TB disks in BIOS mode, then put refind on another USB key and switch to EFI mode. Crappy old motherboard too confused to load refind off the USB key
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04:48<enyc>twb: o dear =)
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04:49<enyc>twb: I'd like to see distros setup so you can install on a disk in hybrid-bootable (support both bios and eufi) mode, hey-ho!.
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04:49<laitbringer>hola
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04:50<laitbringer>hola
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04:54<arto>kot: but if you need that gui, why not install it at same time, I just can't see so urgent need to print something nowadays
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04:55<arto>kot: and if you have not /home on own partition, there is not much to print :)
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04:58<kot>arto, xorg, slim, desktop core and dependencies, gui utilities, etc take a while to install. i like to mess around for a while, then install that stuff and walk away for a while. and my /home has been on a separate partition for years.
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05:03<arto>kot: yes, but do you need to print?
05:05<twb>enyc: you can do that with extlinux, but I've lost my notes about it
05:05<twb>oh ho wait it's working now at last
05:05<kot>arto, occasionally, lol. why wouldn't i?
05:05<twb>I put refind on an *INTERNAL* HDD and an optical disc as well
05:05<twb>One of those two has worked
05:07<twb>And then the ramdisk took about 15s of looping to find the root filesystem
05:08<twb>so hypothesis: "Loading Operating System........ <I give up>" message was coming from refind, which WAS loading correctly, but the AHCI HBA is taking way too long to tell refind about the disks
05:09<enyc>twb: heck maybe it will beome a heisenbug, you "can't make it go wrong now" etc etc ;p
05:09<twb>It's running now so I'll just leave it powered up forever
05:09<twb>by the time we have a blackout I'll be done with it
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05:23<twb>Heh. Had a brief freakout because wget reported chromium source as 409MB and curl reported it as 390M
05:23<twb>But that's probably just SI vs IEC
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05:23<twb>numfmt --from si --to iec-i 409M ==> 391Mi
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05:31<twb>It feels weird working on bare metal again
05:32<twb>3TB btrfs / and 12GB RAM for a single user
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05:38<arto>twb: should be enough
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05:41<twb>arto: yeah that's like 100 times more than I normally allocate
05:41<twb>Anyway, chromium from stretch-security is finally compiling now
05:41<twb>Oh and it's automatically using all 8 cores, even though I didn't think to do debuild -j
05:43<twb>haha it did one run of ~360 .cpp files and I was like "bloody hell, that's fast
05:43<twb>Now it's saying "[70/33757] CXX obj/base/allocator/tcmalloc/elf_mem_image.o"
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05:52<arto>twb: I duckduckgot that, and usual recommendation was reduce parallel processes , -j option
05:52<twb>arto: eh?
05:53<twb>-j N means run up to N jobs at once, it's an idiom from make that other build systems have borrowed.
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05:53<arto>twb: thanks for explanation!
05:53<twb>Debian packages historically default to -j1 for reliability; I was surprised that in THIS case, it has picked -j8 without me asking it to
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05:55<bremner>twb: that is most likely a debhelper change. compat 10, I think
05:55<twb>bremner: I agree
05:56<twb>I thought there 10 still had one remaining thing to block it happening by default; I probably misremember
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06:02<reaper666_>anyone active?
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06:03<bremner>!ask
06:03<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
06:03<twb>reaper666_: I ride a bike every day
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06:05<reaper666_>I am having trouble with my rasbian freezing as it is a type of debian distro can anyone help
06:05<bremner>!raspian
06:05<dpkg>Raspbian is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian on irc.freenode.net for support. http://www.raspbian.org/
06:06<twb>bremner: I like that dpkg is smart enough to fix your dumb typo
06:06<bremner>twb: I for one welcome our new bot overlords
06:07<reaper666_>thanks
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06:24<killwill>hi there
06:24<twb>killwill: hi, do you have a Debian question?
06:27<killwill>yes
06:27<killwill>i'm new to debian.. well, to this distro
06:27<killwill>and i have to install the drivers for the graphic card
06:27<killwill>but i don't know how to do it
06:28<arto>killwill: have you searched debian wiki?
06:28<killwill>yeah but not understing much
06:28<arto>killwill: what is you gpu?
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06:30<twb>killwill: lspci -nn | grep VGA
06:31<twb>killwill: does that say Intel, AMD, Nvidia, or something else?
06:32<killwill>Graphics: Card: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] Device 98e4
06:32<killwill>i saw it with inxi..
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06:32<twb>OK so it's an AMD card, reasonably new or obscure
06:32<arto>killwill: inxi is good program
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06:33<twb>killwill: what does uname -r say? 4.9.something?
06:34<killwill>twb, yhep
06:34<twb>righto
06:34<twb>when you say you need a driver, what are you currently seeing?
06:34<twb>80x25 text console? low-resolution GUI?
06:35<twb>or is it looking good and just too slow to render some 3D apps
06:36<killwill>twb, low resolution and at the very first boot debian said that the CPU usage was higher because ther could be a problem with the graphic drivers
06:36<twb>OK
06:37<twb>unlike the windows world, debian has a free AMD driver and a non-free AMD driver
06:37<twb>you'll be using a version of the free on that came out around May 2017
06:38<twb>So: let's try upgrading the free one, before we give up and use the evil non-free one
06:38<twb>There's two parts to this: newer kernel and newer userland.
06:38<killwill>k..
06:38<twb>First thing is to check if you have backports enabled. By default, they're not.
06:39<twb>(backports basically lets you cherry-pick only the new stuff you need, because new code = new bugs)
06:39<killwill>ok get it.. but how do i check them?
06:39<twb>run "apt-cache policy" and see if it mentioned backports at all
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06:41<killwill>twb what shoul i see?
06:41<killwill>should*
06:42<twb>http://ix.io/1a1I is an example
06:42<killwill>ok i see them
06:43<twb>OK awesome
06:43<killwill>4 i think
06:43<twb>So you should be able to do "sudo apt install linux-image-amd64/stretch-backports"
06:43<twb>(I assume you're on amd64 arch)
06:43<killwill>twb yes
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06:43<twb>It should install linux 4.15 or 4.16 or so
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06:45<mh182>Debian unstable - since a couple days I after system boot I end up on tty1 console login and not in the GUI login (display manager). Waiting for a long timeout (or hitting CTRL+ALT+F2) starts the display manager.
06:45<killwill>twb: E: Release 'stretch-backports' for 'linux-image-amd64' was not found
06:45<mh182>I use SDDM as display manager and use KDE
06:45<twb>!next
06:45<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
06:46<twb>!unstable
06:46<dpkg>Unstable is the status of a Debian release when packages can be added at any time, that can disrupt the integrity of the whole system! Ask me about <break>. If you have to ask whether you should use it or how, you shouldn't. http://www.debian.org/releases/unstable/ http://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable . See also <testing>, <sid>, <sid faq>, <apt-listbugs>, <apt-listchanges>, <bts>.
06:46<twb>dammit
06:46<twb>mh182: unstable questions go to #debian-next not #debian
06:46<mh182>twb thx - will do that (didn't konw about that channel)
06:46<twb>mh182: I think it's some hw rng security fix that landed in kernels just recently
06:47<twb>mh182: generate more entropy at boot time, install/enable hwrng, or fiddle with kernel versions
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06:47<twb>killwill: that suggests backports isn't on after all
06:48<mh182>twb: thx for the info - may be enough to google for a solution
06:48<jm_>!bat
06:48<dpkg>In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>.
06:48<jm_>killwill: try to provide the above info to us
06:48<twb>+1 for jm_'s suggestion
06:49<killwill>ok i'll do it in a minute
06:51<killwill>mmm i need some help
06:51<killwill>i'm not very experienced sorry..
06:51<twb>http://ix.io/1a1K
06:51<twb>killwill: that's OK, we all started out inexperienced
06:52<killwill>so... where do i start? xD
06:53<twb>do you know how to use a pastebin?
06:53<killwill>never used it
06:53<killwill>sorry for the waste of time bro
06:53<twb>browse to paste.debian.net
06:54<twb>it gives you a text box. copy-paste stuff from the terminal into it and hit submit, it gives you a URL back. copy-paste the URL into IRC, here
06:54<killwill>ah ok
06:54<killwill>just like imgur i see
06:55<killwill>and i have to put the content of /etc/apt/sources.list.d/debian.sources?
06:55<twb>killwill: we'd prefer to see what you currently have, first
06:56<killwill>so what?
06:56<twb>see what dpkg bot said
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06:57<killwill>ok sorry i'm lost
06:57<killwill>wanna open a private chat?
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06:58<twb>you'll get better help if you stay here
06:58<killwill>ok
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06:58<twb>unless you suddenly wanna talk about your sex life or something
06:58<jm_>yeah just paste the outputs of the commands mentioned above into the text area field on that page - all at once, click Send and give us the URL
06:58<killwill>so do i have to do again what i did before?
06:58<killwill>twb no thanks lol
06:59<twb>your URL should have content something like this: http://ix.io/1a1N
06:59<twb>we don't care if you re-run the command or grab the earlier output
07:00<killwill>ah okay get it
07:00<killwill>i just was not understanding what command i had to share
07:01<killwill>sorry my english it'a bit rusty.. i struggle to translate
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07:03<killwill>http://paste.debian.net/plain/1024245
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07:04<twb>killwill: ah sorry, I didn't realize non-native English was also a factor
07:04<twb>OK based on your paste, you don't have backports turned on
07:04<jm_>!bpo
07:04<dpkg>backports.debian.org (formerly backports.org) is an official repository of <backports> for the current stable (see <jessie backports>) and oldstable (<wheezy backports>) distributions, prepared by Debian developers. Ask me about <backport caveat> and read http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/. See also <bdo kernel> <bdo mirrors> <bdo contents> <bdo list> <bdo bugs> <bdo xorg> <bdo NEW>.
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07:05<jm_>so if you visit the above page you will know what to do
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07:06<killwill>so i have to turn them on.. and then?
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07:07<jm_>then install bpo kernel:
07:07<jm_>!bpo kernel
07:07<dpkg>Newer kernels for Debian stable releases are available from the <stretch-backports> repository. After modifying your sources.list, run «aptitude update». To install the current backported kernel: «aptitude -t stretch-backports install linux-image-`uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'`». To list available backported kernel image packages: «aptitude search '?narrow(~nlinux-image,?origin(Debian Backports))'».
07:07<jm_>or use the command twb gave you earlier
07:07<jm_>(use apt instead of aptitude if you use that normally)
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07:09<twb>Should I be worrying that chromium compile (which is still running) has started spewing
07:09<twb>cc1plus: warning: unrecognized command line option ‘-Wno-unused-local-typedef’
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07:10<killwill>jm_, the linux-image ecc.?
07:11<killwill>about the command who twb gave me
07:11<twb>20:43 <twb> So you should be able to do "sudo apt install linux-image-amd64/stretch-backports"
07:11<twb>^ that one
07:11<twb>the dpkg version is just a bit more flexible
07:13<killwill>ok thank you
07:13<killwill>sorry for the waste of time
07:13<killwill>i'll come back if i have problems
07:14<kot>suse was great until novell put that hideous licens on it. i wouldn't touch it after that.
07:14<twb>kot: do you mean SLES?
07:15<kot>twb, not sure. but i couldn't get past it without my upper lip curling up.
07:17<kot>oh geez, wrong window. sorry guys.
07:17<nicoco>hi guys! I recently switched from stable to testing and I experience massive CPU usage (to the point where closing the tab takes forever) randomly occuring when playing videos in firefox 59+. I tried disabling HW video decoding but it didn't help. Anyone has an idea how to fix this? I'm using the radeon open source drivers, and it used to work just fine with stable.
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07:19<twb>nicoco: no idea, but try #debian-next for testing questions
07:19<nicoco>twb: oops sorry
07:19<jm_>nicoco: you will probably find more users of testing/unstable in #debian-next
07:20<nicoco>thanks!
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07:54<cruskeh>hi, anyone have a few minutes to spare? having trouble with hostapd and could use some help
07:54<twb>what's the real question?
07:56<cruskeh>trying to set a raspi up as an AP, can get hostapd/dnsmasq running, but after rebooting mon0 becomes mon.wlan0 and hostapd fails. removing mon.wlan0 and restarting hostapd fixes the issue until reboot
07:57<twb>running real debian, or raspbian?
07:57<twb>pastebin your hostpad CLI args / config file
07:58<twb>I don't know what mon.wlan0 means, though --- is that udev trying to give the iface a "logical" name?
07:58<cruskeh>wrote a basic script to remove mon.wlan0 and recreate as mon0, and restart hostapd which works but i cant get it to run at startup, or its running at the point in time (before problem occurs) im not sure. using the kali linux raspi image
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07:58<twb>last time I used hostapd I just had wlan0 or something
07:59<twb>Yep, that host's still running, I just have wlan0. No idea what "mon" stuff is
07:59<cruskeh>far as i understand its to do with the need for a monitor mode interface, to broadcast certain frames
07:59<twb>I do have a phy0
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08:00<cruskeh>iw phy phy0 interface add mon0 type monitor && ifconfig mon0 up --- the command im using to create the monitor interface
08:00<twb>http://ix.io/1a23
08:01<twb>That's from an OpenWRT appliance so maybe it does some stuff for me, that yours doesn't
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08:01<twb>"ifconfig X up" should be "ip link set X up"; ifconfig is deprecated
08:02<twb>cruskeh: are you trying to just run an AP with WPA2-PSK? No fancy stuff?
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08:03<cruskeh>yeah just want to be able to ssh into raspi running headless
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08:04<twb>I *think* I've just done hostapd on a regular debian with hostapd and a boring regular pcie wifi dongle, too
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08:15<hugoShaka>Hi, I found an apparmor profile breaking some parts of ipsec (on debian testing strongswan and charon cannot edit DNS parameters) and I'd like to know if it really is a bug or an intended behaviour before reporting it.
08:15<hugoShaka>Is there some kind of flowchart, steps to checks or shall I report directly ?
08:16<twb>hugoShaka: most of the apparmor docs come from the apparmor community, not the debian community
08:17<twb>hugoShaka: there's a whole bunch of helper tools of varying abandon-ness and useful-ness, I don't remember which to use in this case
08:17<twb>hugoShaka: at a minimum, it makes sense to put usr.bin.strongswan (or whatever) profile into complain mode, and see if the problem goes away.
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08:19<hugoShaka>twb: when I disable the specific apparmor profile everything goes right and the VPN is fully functionnal
08:19<hugoShaka>So if the packaged apparmor profile breaks the app shall I contact the debian maintainer through an issue or the apparmor community ?
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08:20<twb>hugoShaka: if you care you can investigate further yourself
08:20<twb>hugoShaka: if you don't, run "reportbug /etc/apparmor.d/usr.bin.whatever" to report to the right package
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08:26<hugoShaka>twb: I guess I investigated enough to add the missing apparmor rule and fix the behaviour, so how shall I suggest an edit ?
08:26<hugoShaka>(just tested and it works well)
08:27<twb>I can't remember the details
08:27<twb>the apparmor website/wiki has some explanation IIRC
08:27<twb>it's something along the lines of "aa-profile /usr/bin/strongswan" and then run the tool in another window, and the profiling tool will give suggestions interactively
08:28<hugoShaka>thanks :) , I've done that and fixed the profile already
08:28<hugoShaka>Is there a way to suggest adding the missing lines in the debian package ?
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08:46<twb>hugoShaka: er, don't you just put that in the reportbug email?
08:46<hugoShaka>I'm doing this, thanks for your help !
08:46<twb>"dear maintainer, X breaks when apparmor is enabled, here is a patch that seems to work for me"
08:46<twb>that's the formula I generally follow
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09:25<manikanta>can i know best os on which i can work with virtual machines
09:25<twb>manikanta: "best" by what metric?
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10:03<somiaj>twb: still going, down to about 800Megs of disk free, but so far seems to be working with only 2gigs of ram, we'll see if it makes it
10:04<twb>somiaj: mine finally finished compilling just now, FYI
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10:05<twb>with 12GB ram and 3TB btrfs and a 3GHz core i7 from ~4 years ago
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10:05<twb>00:01 <twb> real 261m7.944s user 1951m36.172s sys 90m29.880s
10:06<twb>Now I can finally go home
10:06<somiaj>twb: oh nice, and that hardware doesn't sound old, it is more powerful than my machine. (:
10:07<twb>yeah I forgot we had a whole pile of 'servers too crap to be worth consolidating onto'
10:07<somiaj>though I would say mine is comperable, I have an amd phenom II x6 1090T, same ram, so I woudl say comperable. (:
10:07<twb>so I picked the goodest one from that pile and spent like 2 hours convincing it to actually EFI boot properly
10:08<twb>I think if I reboot it right now it won't actually find the refind_linux.conf :/
10:08<somiaj>I was thinking you were on core2 duos or something like that old, (:
10:09<twb>the machine I *thought* I would have to use would be something that was 'upgraded' to 200GB disks
10:09<somiaj>well glad it worked. I'm still surprised at how much it does take to compile.
10:09<twb>model name : Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz
10:10<twb>^ that's what I ended up using
10:10<twb>AFAIK that's our best hardware, it used to be reserved for visitor demos, and we got rid of visitors
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10:11<somiaj>well hopefully the debug package actually allows you to track down the issue.
10:12<twb>yea
10:12<twb>not gonna do that rtonight tho
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10:34<ach>mhm.
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10:35<jhutchins_wk>Was that a kernel compile?
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11:33<somiaj>jhutchins_wk: cormium
11:33<somiaj>jhutchins_wk: chromium
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11:37<FLD>i don't understand why does apticron keep sending me emails like this?: https://paste.debian.net/1024280/
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11:38<FLD>like is it saying the checksum is wrong? or what?
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11:43<petn-randall>FLD: Try running 'apt-get update' as root, you should see an error there. Then fix that to make the apticron mails go away.
11:44<somiaj>wonder if there is an issue with that mirror too, maybe try a different mirror if stretck-backports from that mirror keeps erroring out.
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11:45<FLD>petn-randall: it's been doing this for a ~couple of months now
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11:48<somiaj>FLD: the issue is the cron job is erroring out, mainly the apt-get update. Running apt-get update should reproduce that error. I would change mirrors as the first suggested fix.
11:49<FLD>yeah, suppose i'll just switch to another mirror for stretch-backports and see if that stops the emails
11:50<somiaj>why not just see if apt-get update works
11:50<somiaj>as suggsetd
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11:50<FLD>it sure does, as always
11:51<FLD>never encountered this problem while manually doing apt-get update/apt update
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11:52<somiaj>well check the cron job that is running apt-get update, see if you can emulate the enviorment being used and reproduce the error.
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11:54<FLD>perhaps: sudo /usr/sbin/apticron --cron
11:54<somiaj>or find the actual cron job that is erroing out.
11:55<FLD>that would be: /etc/cron.d/apticron: 32 * * * * root if test -x /usr/sbin/apticron; then /usr/sbin/apticron --cron; else true; fi
11:55<FLD>looks like this started happening on 2018-02-23
11:56<FLD>and it has since happened 6 times
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11:56<somiaj>that is the apticron process, find the actual apt command
11:56<somiaj>I mean cron job
11:56<FLD>oh, there are actual hash sum mismatches too
11:56<somiaj>anyways, sounds like it is an intermintate thing if it has only happened 6 times, makes it a little harder to reproudce.
11:56<FLD>and it's not even the same problem always!
11:57<somiaj>hence why you running apt-get update won't see the issue. You could also disable cron from running apt-get update, and just manually do it.
11:57<FLD>sometimes is hash sum mismatch and sometimes its "Writing more data.."
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11:57<somiaj>in either case, it is apt-get update erroring out, and whenever a cron job errors out, you get sent an email. Fix the actual thing that is erroring out.
11:58<somiaj>though changing the mirror might help. I would suggest deb.debian.org.
11:58<FLD>2018-02-23, 2018-04-12, 2018-04-18, 2018-04-30, 2018-05-04 and today
11:59<FLD>mismatch, more data, more data, mismatch, more data, more data
12:00<somiaj>Again seems like intermintant issue with the mirror you are using. deb.debian.org. Solutions, try a different mirror, realize that those emails are okay, they just mean a cron job failed, you can run apt-get manually to then get it, or just disable the cronjob and don't have cron automatcally run atp-get update daily.
12:01<arto>once the local mirror I use was down for a few days, I used neighboring country mirror that time
12:02<FLD>somiaj: i agree, glad i'm fully aware of it now
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12:11<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I have recently undertaken a quest to try and find one file written in code. My tool is gedit. I only want to find evidence that Linux is in fact written in C, C++, mySQL, fortran, or any of the other computer languages. I'm currently looking in /lib. Another project has also failed. I found /etc/wildmidi. cp -r /etc/wildmidi ~/Downloads didn't even make a new entry. although if you cat any of those files you will find out they are
12:11<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>blank anyway. Are there any packages in Debian Stable that can help me remove an EEPROM from a BIOS chip?
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12:12<pcods>I am having a problem getting cisco packet tracer to run in debian because of the libcrypto.so.1.0.0 lib. I pretty sure its an openssl lib and I installed that exact version of openssl but still cant run PT. Any suggestions??
12:13<retrospectacus>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: debian distributes software in binary form. If you want source code, you can add "deb-src" lines to sources.list and use the "apt-get source" command.
12:13<retrospectacus>!deb-src
12:13<dpkg>You can have apt download the <source package> from which a <binary package> was compiled using a "deb-src" line in your <sources.list>. A line like "deb-src http://deb.debian.org/debian sid main" does NOT make any binary packages available. Ask me about <source> <package recompile> <ssb>; make sure the "build-essential" package is installed. You might need linux-headers-$(uname -r) package installed.
12:14<retrospectacus>!apt-get source
12:14<dpkg>apt-get source is probably the way to download the debian source for your packages. Run apt-get source and compile packages as a non-root user. Ask me about <source> <deb-src>. If you have several deb-src lines in your sources.list, then you will need to use "apt-get source packagename=version" to control what source version is downloaded (apt-get source ignores the -t option). Also ask me about <package recompile> <simple sid backport>
12:14<retrospectacus>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: ^^
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12:18<somiaj>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: debian also provides an online database you can browse the source code of its packages and see all the different langauges that are used.
12:19<somiaj>pcods: have you installed the libssl1.0.2 package? That package has the 1.0.2 version of the lib which is compadable with 1.0.0 (sometimes you can just make a link from 1.0.0 to 1.0.2 and it works
12:19<somiaj>pcods: if the software is additionally making the version string be equal to 1.0.0, you can install the libssl package from jessie in stretch to get it to work.
12:20<pcods>o ok, I installed the openssl1.0.0 but I will try that real quick. forgive me but what directory are the lib shared objects in?
12:20<somiaj>you mean 1.0.2?
12:21<somiaj>if you isntalled libssl1.0.0 from jessie you shoudln't need much, you can do 'dpkg -L libssl1.0.2' to see where it put the libs
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12:24<pcods>ok i do have the openssl1.0.2 libs installed. so you are suggesting just to make a link from libcrypto.so.1.0.2 to libcrypto.so.1.0.0?
12:24<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>somiaj at wiki.debian.org?
12:24<somiaj>that will work for many things, the libs are compadable (I think mostly just security fixes)
12:25<somiaj>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: no. But you can find it on the package tracker, tracker.debian.org/packagename, and there is a link to source.
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12:25<somiaj>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: https://sources.debian.org/src/linux/4.16.5-1/ -- there is the current linux kernel's source, mostly written in C I belive.
12:26<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Thanks I will put that url in a document so I don't forget
12:26<somiaj>yea, seems 16million lines of C, but some other languages as well according to the scanner.
12:26<pcods>pcods@slooshtime:/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu$ ln -s libcrypto.so.1.
12:26<pcods>libcrypto.so.1.0.0 libcrypto.so.1.0.2 libcrypto.so.1.1
12:26<pcods>pcods@slooshtime:/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu$ ln -s libcrypto.so.1.
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12:26<somiaj>is that already a link? ls -l libcrypto.so.1*
12:27<pcods>that is my terminal output, so i already have the actual lib installed
12:27<somiaj>pcods: then try to get the actuall error, that might help. I was just thinking it needed the older ssl lib version.
12:27<pcods>sorry, i pasted that like a code snippet, its just the suggestion when i tab while doing the ln command
12:28<somiaj>you are also looking in the 64 bit libs, could this be a 32bit application and need the 32bit lib?
12:28<pcods>./PacketTracer6: error while loading shared libraries: libcrypto.so.1.0.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
12:29<pcods>it might not be reading from my system path maybe?
12:29<somiaj>it is more likely as I suggested a 32bit application
12:30<pcods>o ok so just dpkg --add-architecture then?
12:30<somiaj>pcods: what is the output of file binaryname?
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12:30<somiaj>pcods: yea you may need to enable multiarch and then install the 32bit libs for that, if it is a 32bit application. I would verfy that before preceeding.
12:31<pcods>sorry, file binaryname? you mean packetracer?
12:31<somiaj>yea, file <name if binary>
12:31<somiaj>trying to determine if the binary you are running is a 32bit or 64bit binary.
12:32<pcods>opt/pt/bin/PacketTracer6
12:32<somiaj>I need the full output, it should say what type of file that is
12:33<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>somiaj torture.c, kinda funny. Just clicked on the first compile that drew me. Must be an homage to how hard that c is to interpret. Thanks for the link. Hopefully I can learn C now...
12:34<somiaj>I think the linux kernel is probably not the source you want to start with to learn C
12:34<pcods>accessible Cisco-PacketTracer.desktop Cisco-pka.xml Cisco-pkt.xml Cisco-pkz.xml imageformats linguist Linux PacketTracer6 PT.conf unzip zip ZIP_LICENSE
12:34<somiaj>I thought you just wanted evidence linux was written in C, and the kernel seemed like a good place to start.
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12:35<somiaj>pcods: what command did you run. I want you to run 'file PacketTracer6' -- I need to know what kind of file that is
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12:35<pcods>omg, im so sorry
12:35<pcods>PacketTracer6: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (GNU/Linux), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib/ld-linux.so.2, for GNU/Linux 2.6.24, BuildID[sha1]=b3882ccf1f76084a57d98564f428229b0b6b29dd, not stripped
12:35<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Right I guess i can just go to github and click on any link that says source. Now that I know what it means
12:35<pcods>I'm such a noob lol
12:36<somiaj>pcods: yup just as I thought, see at the top it is an ELF 32-bit binary, so you need to install the 32bit version of libssl1.0.2
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12:37<pcods>ok so just dpkg add-arch multiarch? I tried to add i386 the other day for steam and it kept calling it a junk arch
12:38<somiaj>!multiarch
12:38<dpkg>Multiarch allows you to install foreign architecture packages. For example, to allow i386 packages to be installed on an amd64 system: «dpkg --add-architecture i386 && apt-get update». See http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch and <multiarch howto>, <multiarch failures>. For the unrelated installer that can install i386 or amd64, see <multi-arch installer>.
12:39<pcods>o ok so after adding multiarch, and I already have i386 in foreign-arch, then just reinstall the libssl packages and I will get the 32-bit libs?
12:40<somiaj>you have to state you want 32bit, apt install libssl1.0.2:i386
12:40<pcods>ok right on
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12:42<pcods>YES! I love you! Thank you
12:42<pcods>it works
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12:45<akash>why virtualbox is not installing directly
12:46<sney>gonna need more details than that
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12:46<somiaj>because it is not part of debian, you need to get it from stretch-backports. Or do you want to know why it was removed from stretch?
12:47<akash>yss
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12:48<akash>iss there any software store on debain
12:49<somiaj>ask oracle...anyways, oracle policy explicity forbids virtualbox devs to backport security fixes to older versions of virtualbox. But debian would have to provide security support, which means backporting fixes. Hence due to a policy confict, debian an't provide decent security for virtualbox, so it provides it though stretch-backports as an alternative.
12:49<somiaj>akash: there is apt, and repos, but I woudln't call that a software store.
12:50<akash>thanks
12:50<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>This also caught me when I was working on installing Wine. There was a link that said Wine was available in binary packages for Debian. I didn't look there bc whats a binary package. Now I understand it is just the same as a .deb package.
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12:51<somiaj>binary means the software has been complied into an exectuable, and yes .deb packages ship binaries (not source)
12:51<annadane>define software store, that's not necessarily easy to answer
12:51<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Anyway long story short i am lucky my system ain't broke
12:51<ach>!packages
12:51<annadane>if you just mean a way to download packages, there's synaptic and apper
12:51<dpkg>Debian .deb packages are a special form of <ar> archive which can be unpacked with "ar x pkg.deb". Inside the file control.tar.gz are conffiles, installation scripts, and a file "control" which contains the information shown with "apt-cache show pkg". Dependencies can be changed by editing this file. Install the dpkg-dev package and read "man 5 deb" for more details. A better plan is to see <package recompile> <source package>.
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12:52<annadane>oh, same person who asked about virtualbox
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12:54<ach>!software
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12:54<canaima>FACEBOOK
12:55<canaima>ENTRAR
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12:55<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>So why do we need Synaptic and Software Center?
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12:56<somiaj>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: because people like different tools. I don't think one needs either, but people want their gui tools.
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12:57<ach>like provider you need a host surface
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12:58<jhutchins_wk>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: Some people insist on GUI wrappers, even if they don't work as well.
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13:05<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>What is the command to run the torture test? Would it bork my system?
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13:08<ach>!etherreal
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13:08<ach>!ethereal
13:08<dpkg>Wireshark (formerly Ethereal) is a cross-platform network protocol analyzer. It allows data to be examined from a live network or from a capture file. To run as a normal user, see /usr/share/doc/wireshark/README.Debian. Console version is packaged as tshark. http://www.wireshark.org/faq.html #wireshark on irc.freenode.net.
13:09<ach>!xymon
13:09<jhutchins_wk>ach: If you're exploring the bot please use /msg dpkg ...
13:09<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Apparently /etc/midifiles is a junk entry there is no data listed there(on my system at least). Gedit just proves the files are empty
13:09<ach>but such things good for see insists....
13:09<petn-randall>ach: What do you mean?
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13:10<jhutchins_wk>ach: Use the public trigger when the factoid is relevant to a current discussion.
13:10<somiaj>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: you should probably find a programing channel, your questions are not really debian support.
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13:14<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I'm sorry I meant /etc/wildmidi
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13:16<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: for me there is wildmidi.cfg in /etc/wildmidi
13:16<jhutchins_wk>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: My guess would be that you've installed a midi programm that would look in that folder for files, possibly config files.
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13:16<jhutchins_wk>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: It's a VERY BAD IDEA to manualy go through your system and delete things you don't think are necessary.
13:17<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I ran cp -r /etc/wildmidi ~/Downloads and it didn't work. It probably is because I didn't specify the exact path under /home
13:17<arto>jhutchins_wk: +1
13:17<jhutchins_wk>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: Might be a good idea to look at the Debian handbook.
13:17<jhutchins_wk>!handbook
13:17<dpkg>The Debian Administrator's Handbook is at http://debian-handbook.info/ and can be browsed, bought and downloaded. From Debian 7 "Wheezy" onwards, it can also be installed from the debian-handbook package. Also ask me about <books> <docs>. PDF at https://debian-handbook.info/download/stable/debian-handbook.pdf
13:17<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: if you have clean debian installation, there is no 'junk'
13:18<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>^^^
13:18<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Not trying to delete it just copy it recursively
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13:21<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: but why?
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13:22<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I don't know. I guess it just took me a while to find out it was empty. Also I want to hear some cool sounds
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13:25<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Maybe Gnome Tweak Tool has these sounds *shrug*
13:27<jhutchins_wk>!midi
13:27<dpkg>hmm... midi is Musical Instrument Digital Interface, or timidity to play. smurf to edit, or http://www.midi-howto.com
13:28<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>idk I am pretty sure all Debian systems have /etc/wildmidi
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13:29<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: depends what packages have been installed
13:29<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: would not be so important on debian servers
13:30<sney>confirmed, it is not on my server
13:30<sney>it is a phonon dependency.
13:30<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Ok Gnome seems to have one system sound only. Does KDE have more?
13:31<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: if select dm on base what sounds they have...
13:31<arto>ElToro-Y-ElCuernos: there are many packages that can play any sound you want
13:32<somiaj>according to aptitude why here, it is a gstreamer depends
13:32<somiaj>I have it here due to virt-viewer and libspice, gstreamer seems to be common in desktop enviroments.
13:32<arto>somiaj: good digging
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13:34<ach>!dj
13:34<dpkg>one of the most prominant free software developers around, brian behlendorf, is a DJ. He is one of the core developers of apache. And now as a sidelight to DJ'ing and doing apache work, does sourceXchange.com. Djibouti
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13:36<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Well I think I am going to log off. Thank you somiaj for helping me understand binary and the source that people use to tell the binary code what to do. The CPU and all components are quite magical they just switch on and off at near light speed to form what we see and hear.
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13:38<ach>!zynaddsubfx rofl dpkg don't know it
13:38<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>All through the Linux kernel. The best man has ever devised!
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13:41<ach>thx
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13:42<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I mean FreeBSD doesn't have systemd. I'd imagine it doesn't boot up lightening fast. Maybe it would with a solid state drive. Might just be a characteristic of SSD's.
13:43<muep>systemd is not a requirement for booting fast
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13:44<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Well maybe all unix based kernels should be included in my list. Besides Mac...
13:47<somiaj>there is a large resistance against systemd, though it has mostly been adopted by linux, I doubt the BSD's are going to adopt it. People using BSD's are more intersted in what they consider a 'pure unix'
13:48<somiaj>but that is mostly off topic here, in debian systemd is the default, and though one can use other init systems, it does take a bit of work.
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13:49<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I used systemctl to disable CUPS yet I still get annoying notifications that the Brother printer is added.
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13:50<somiaj>cups probably uses hooks, so disabling it running at boot might not do much, once a hook sees a printer, it will run
13:50<somiaj>if you really want to disable cups, you should mask the service (this will keep it from running via hooks)
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13:54<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Right I was following the Linux System Administrator Handbook. It advised against masking a system.d service. I guess as long as I know it is masked it should be no problem. This is a personal computer.
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13:54<somiaj>That seems strange, adivising against making a unit file? I think you have left out some important context.
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13:54<somiaj>but systemctl mask cups if you want to mask the cups.service
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13:57<anders>I'm using a virtual machine supplied by a hosting service which runs a preconfigured version of Debian. To me it was a "click to start" setup. Now I'm trying to upgrade the kernel but after 'apt-get install linux-image-amd64' I'm unable to boot using the new kernel. I cannot find any reference to grub, lilo or any other boot loader I know of. /boot/ contains 4 files associated with my new kernel but nothing else. What can I try? How can
13:57<runlevel>When I run runlevel on debian 8.9 it returns "unknown". Services also won't start, how do I fix this?
13:57<somiaj>anders: uname -a (What kernel are you currently running)
13:58<anders>somiaj: 2.6.32-042stab127.2
13:58<somiaj>runlevel: debian jessie uses systemd, which doesn't use runlevels.
13:58<somiaj>anders: that doesn't look like a debian kernel. You maybe sharing the hosts kernel, in which case you may not be able to upgrade on that VPS.
13:58<somiaj>upgrade the kernel.
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13:59<runlevel>somiaj: It was returning 1 5 before I rebooted
13:59<anders>somiaj: ahh, maybe that's the reason I can't find a way forward. How do I confirm - besides contact them?
14:00<somiaj>anders: uname -a is what seems to confirm it for me. What version of debian is that vps?
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14:00<somiaj>runlevel: are you using sysvinit instead of systemd? (possible but not default)? Also what is 'it' that reutrned that.
14:00<anders>somiaj: I used a templated called "Debian 6.0" back in the day.
14:01<somiaj>that is an old kernel, maybe they vps provided you a custom kernel. But I see a non debian kernel, and if is still debian 6.0, that is quite out dated and not supported.
14:02<somiaj>unsure what the best way forward is. Maybe create a new vps from your provider of a newer debian (8 or 9) and then copy over the data..
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14:02<somiaj>but since that isn't a debian kernel, I would contact your provider and ask what they advise.
14:02<anders>somiaj: I was able to update to stretch but that maybe isn't related to to this issue?
14:03<anders>Yeah I guess I have to do that
14:03<somiaj>then yea, sounds like you are using some shared kernel for the vps, or maybe some custom kernel that needs to be changed on their end, not inside the vps.
14:03<anders>somiaj: Any way I can find out which boot loader I'm using?
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14:04<somiaj>anders: unsure, dpkg -l | grep grub (that will check if grub is installed), but sometimes vps do things slightly differerent (they don't virtualize the full booting process and kernel)
14:04<runlevel>somiaj: I was running sudo runlevel to see what level it was running at. I don't know the answer to your first question
14:05<somiaj>runlevel: on debian 8.9, you most likely are running systemd. What is the output of 'ls -l /sbin/init'
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14:06<runlevel>somiaj: /lib/systemd/systemd
14:06<somiaj>runlevel: yea that is systemd, so the idea of runlevel doesn't mean much. systemd uses a thing called a .target. So it could be that the output you are getting from runlevel is a bit confusing because you aren't using them.
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14:07<anders>somiaj: Thanks for you quick response! I'll contact them. Have a great weekend
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14:08<runlevel>somiaj: sudo runlevel is now returning N 3
14:08<runlevel>Ah my link is bad
14:09<somiaj>sure, but runlevel is for sysV, not systemd. systemd has some sysv compadablity, but a tool like that won't know what systemd is doing.
14:09<somiaj>What is your actual issue you were trying to fix?
14:09<somiaj>or I guess what is your goal.
14:09<runlevel>somiaj: Services wont start after running init 1, even after I run init 5
14:10<runlevel>somiaj: I think I might have fixed it, waiting on a reboot
14:11<somiaj>Same problem, init 1, and init 5 don't mean much to systemd. the manpage for runlevel seems to suggest there is a mpaping between run levels and systemd targets. But in the future I suggest using the systemd tools directly and not the sysv tools.
14:12<somiaj>https://www.systutorials.com/239880/change-systemd-boot-target-linux/ seems to ahve some info that could be helpful
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14:15<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>I'm trying to find the official bug report whose fix was to install the haveged package. The bug prevented normal bootup to the login screen due to lack of entropy. Failure to boot correctly is of course a rare event for Debian Stable.
14:16<somiaj>!cve-2018-1108
14:16<dpkg>cve-2018-1108 is probably a security fix for a lack of randomness at boot. Delays the use of the kernel crng by applications till sufficient randomness is ready. Can cause delays (up to to 4+ minutes) in boot time just before or just after login, esp with LUKS enabled. Short term workarounds: Wiggle mouse/tap keyboard a lot, install rng-tools5 or haveged pkgs, or boot previous kernel
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14:17<somiaj>look up the cve number in the security tracker. https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2018-1108 -- it will hav elinks to the bug reports and info about the CVE
14:18<somiaj>hmm, doesn't look like there is a debian bug report there, but there is an upstream bug report
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14:20<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>Now with haveged installed I get a TPM error, maybe I should just disregard it.
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14:22<ElToro-Y-ElCuernos>That was only on the most recent boot. Might be gone next time I restart.
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14:24<runlevel>somiaj: I can't seem to get the internet to work on it anymore. Other services seem to be running
14:24<somiaj>runlevel: how do you configure your internet? Network Manager? interfaces file? etc?
14:25<runlevel>somiaj: Interface file
14:26<somiaj>you can test things with ifup/ifdown
14:28<somiaj>for example ifup eth0 will bring up eth0. Things you can check, 1) systemctl status networking (see if the service is loading and if there are any issues)
14:28<somiaj>double check that the interface is set as auto, 'auto eth0' in your interfaces file, and as I said test with ifup/ifdown.
14:29<runlevel>somiaj: its static, it doesnt change
14:29<runlevel>somiaj: I am looking
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14:34<theryssahacker>hallo
14:34<andreas>hey
14:34<theryssahacker>hej
14:35<runlevel>somiaj: Fixed, thank you
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14:35<andreas>Hello
14:35<theryssahacker>hello
14:35<andreas>how are u this day today sir?
14:35<theryssahacker>good and you?
14:35<theryssahacker>how tohack
14:35<somiaj>!chat
14:35<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic, or #moocows on irc.oftc.net or ##chat on irc.freenode.net.
14:35<andreas>very nice
14:35<theryssahacker>how to hack
14:35<theryssahacker>???
14:35<theryssahacker>help me
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14:36<dboles>lol
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14:52<tda>this is probably a simple question, but i can't find the answer on google. how do you list all accounts that can login?
14:53<somiaj>they are all listed in /etc/passwd
14:54<somiaj>as for 'can login', that is a vague term, but in general in debian only accounts with uid >= 1000 are setup to login normally with password or key auth.
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14:56<somiaj>the other option is /etc/shadow, you might get what you want there.
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14:58<jhutchins_wk>tda: We're assuming this is a local system without external auth mechanisms.
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15:00<kcunac>This *might* work to give a rough estimate: getent passwd | grep -v 'nologin\|false' | awk -F: '{if ($3 >= 1000) { print $1}}' and may work with non-local accounts.
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15:06-!-nowhereman is "Pierre Thierry" on @#concatenative #emacs #git @#erights #lisp #debian-kde #debian
15:09<bb2045>Hi all, I'm interested in learning more about how Debian tracks upstream version of packages. For example, xorg-server 1.20 has been released, but despite this page being updated on 2018-05-11 14:05, it shows the latest new version as 1.19.99.905 https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/xorg-server
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15:10<bb2045>I understand a little bit from digging around through documentation- about how there's a debian/watch file, uscan, etc...But in the above example, the xorg-server page refers to a collection of debian packages. Where would one find the debian/watch file in all of this?
15:13<kcunac>bb2045: The debian/watch file is in the debian part of the source package. quilt 3.0 package have a separate debian tarball alongside the dsc and the orig tarball.
15:14<kcunac>The xorg-server package has a diff (it's not quilt 3.0). So in this case, the watch file would be created by http://http.debian.net/debian/pool/main/x/xorg-server/xorg-server_1.19.6-1.diff.gz
15:14<kcunac>(for the unstable distribution)
15:15<kcunac>which is available online at https://sources.debian.org/src/xorg-server/2:1.19.6-1/debian/watch/
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15:22<tda>jhutchins: thanks. yes, i meant local users
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15:29<bb2045>kcunac: Hmmm, doesn't seem like anything is wrong with the watch or changelog files running uscan locally. I wonder if there's something different about the way tracker.debian.org is going about things.
15:31<jhutchins_wk>tda: It's not 100% accurate, but ld /home/ might give you what you need.
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15:31<jhutchins_wk>ls /home, sorry.
15:32<retrospectacus>kcunac: cross-referencing /etc/shells instead of grep -v nologin|false might be slightly more accurate
15:32<tda>it sort of does, but i was looking for something that showed user accounts not locked and not set to a null shell
15:35<retrospectacus>tda, did you try kcunac' answer?
15:35<tda>retrospectacus: i didn't see it, but ill test it now
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15:39<tda>retrospectacus: looks legit. A+ for effort kcunac
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15:56<jpleau>hi. Is there a way to find out what packages are currently installed because they were "suggested" when installing another one ? I turned off installing suggests, but would also like to remove then retroactively now
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15:59<tda>jpleau: does this work? https://askubuntu.com/questions/351085/how-to-remove-recommended-and-suggested-dependencies-of-uninstalled-packages
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16:01<zx21>w
16:01<zx21>hi
16:02<jpleau>tda: looks promising, thanks
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16:03<zx21>هلا
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16:48<jhutchins_wk>jpleau: What problem are they causing?
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17:03<somiaj>jpleau: did you ever turn on installing suggested packages, by default these should not be installed.
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17:15<jpleau>somiaj: I may or may not have swapped out Apt::Install-Recommends and Apt::Install-Suggests in my config, put 0 to recommends and 1 to suggest :/ it's all fixed now though
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17:16<jpleau>jhutchins: None, but there's no point in having a lot of stuff installed if I'm not going to use it
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18:19-!-knix is "Jim Mitchener" on #debian @#dhd #awesome
18:19<knix>Docker busted in sid?
18:20<annadane>knix, possibly; ask in #debian-next
18:20<knix>thanks
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18:45<kot>jpleau, and for synaptic, if you use it, edit /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/99synaptic, change "true" to "0"
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18:58<hippopotamus>im a hippo
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18:59<hippopotamus>im a hippo using parrot OS
18:59<annadane>!parrot
18:59<dpkg>Parrot OS (https://www.parrotsec.org/) is a security and penetration testing distribution. It is based on Debian testing, but it is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Seek help in #parrot on irc.frozenbox.org or try the mailing lists at http://lists.parrotsec.org/listinfo. Also ask me about <based on debian>.
19:00<hippopotamus>join #parrot
19:00<annadane>it says ice.frozenbox.org...
19:00<mnuhmnuh>#parrot on irc.frozenbox.org
19:01<hippopotamus>oh
19:01<hippopotamus>did i say im a hippo?
19:02<annadane>hippos shouldn't use advanced pentesting distributions if they can't read a factoid
19:02<hippopotamus>id say that Parrot OS is noobier that kali
19:03<hippopotamus>black arch linux now thats some hard stuff
19:03<hippopotamus>and im in #parrot now its empty
19:04<somiaj>because it is on a different irc network. Read the whole factoid
19:04<hippopotamus>great
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19:05-!-Sane is "Sane" on #debian #slackware #debian-offtopic #linuxfs #llvmlinux #gc-linux #colinux
19:05<hippopotamus>funny people in linuxmint are actually quite nice seems like debain chat is full of stuck up cunts
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19:06<hippopotamus>"advanced pentesting distributions" still laughing now
19:06<Sane>Hi, is anybody able to help me connect to the web in colinux. At the moment, only windows has internet and colinux is local only. NB: I'm aware this is Debian but it seems like the other channel aren't active.
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19:07<hippopotamus>tell me annadane did the idea ever cross your mind that maybe i might be training to be a pen tester?
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19:12<kot>hippopotamus, in that case, go to irc.2600.net and use the special code words "plz make me 1337 hAx0r". the'll take care of the rest.
19:13<mnuhmnuh>what's colinux?
19:13<mnuhmnuh>what'!colinux
19:13<mnuhmnuh>!colinux
19:13<dpkg>Cooperative Linux (coLinux) is software for running Linux on Microsoft Windows. It is a port of the Linux kernel, allowing cooperative execution with another operating system on a single machine. http://colinux.wikia.com/wiki/FAQ http://www.colinux.org/ #colinux on irc.oftc.net.
19:15<Sane>specifically andlinux - andLinux is a complete Ubuntu Linux system running seamlessly in Windows
19:15<Sane>andLinux uses coLinux as its core - coLinux is a port of the Linux kernel to Windows. Although this technology is a bit like running Linux in a virtual machine, coLinux differs itself by being more of a merger of Windows and the Linux kernel and not an emulated PC, making it more efficient.
19:15<mnuhmnuh>"... only windows has internet and colinux is local only." well, what good is that?
19:16<Sane>ikr
19:16<Sane>:((((
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19:18<mnuhmnuh>go find a tree to bang your head on. it'll feel really good when you stop.
19:18<Sane>Will do
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19:20<ais-admin>well my dhcp problem is back again... dhcp requests are sent, server sends ack's back but system seems to ignore them. Sends 30-40 requests about 5-10 seconds apart. after a few minutes of this, one of the ack's is accepted and ip is bound. Its happening on more than one interface now. Deb Stretch amd64. Anyone heard of anything like this?
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20:45-!-galex-713 is "Alexandre Garreau" on #debian-kde #debian
20:46<nezZario>Hey guys. I am looking for a cheap UPS that will work well with Debian. I have lost WAY too much data due to unexpected power loss. Sure backups are great but it doesn't nix the root of the issue. Any suggestions? I really don't even know what I'm looking for exactly. I can look at these UPSs on amazon or newegg or whereever, .. But what do you call the kind, .. that will actually tell the PC "hey shut down gracefully as quickly
20:46<nezZario>as possible"? .. All I want is one that is strong enough to maintain the PC for you know, 120 seconds max, while it does a graceful shutdown of the PC
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20:48<sney>debian has 'apcupsd' for monitoring ups connections and doing specific stuff in certain situations
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20:49<sney>it's intended for APC devices only but might support others. I know my workplace has a non-apc ups that has a serial connection and its own linux client, which works well enough - I was able to hook it up to nagios and get alerts when it's on battery power
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20:49<somiaj>also sounds like you need to setup a backup method.
20:49<sney>but basically you need a hardware connection between the ups and the server and a software layer to make those decisions
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21:00<blast007>nezZario: https://networkupstools.org/stable-hcl.html <-- that might be useful information as well
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21:01<nezZario>somiaj: I do, but they're only daily, and ofc when my stuff keeled over, it hadn't ran in days. also, I don't copy stuff like /usr/bin/ and /boot. I guess I should change that, huh
21:03<sney>that stuff is pretty well protected just by being on a raid
21:04<sney>unless your power failures are really power surges that blow up your hardware
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21:04<nezZario>I have RAID1 using mdadm. This is like the 3rd or 4th time i've had a catastrophic failure due to a power outage
21:05<nezZario>in the last 18 months or so
21:05<sney>you might also need some like, really good surge protection. a good ups will do that for you too tho
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21:06<mnuhmnuh>doesn't mdadm re-build it whaen it comes back up? if not, why?
21:06<nezZario>I am totally sure it's not a surge, I do have a lot of power outages though. Usually 1-4 times per week I'll loose poewr for ~5-10m
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21:07<somiaj>nezZario: all the stuff in /usr/bin and /boot can just be reinstalled, the data is the most important.
21:08<nezZario>I've actually asked about this over at the freenode channel a couple of times, if it was something particular with extfs, .. and I was told that "maybe" it was something to do with mdadm, and that also running ssd's increases my chances of bad things happening due to sudden power loss
21:11<blast007>in one of my systems I've got one of Intel's DC series SSD that has power loss protection (iirc, it has a supercapacitor that allows it to flush the buffers)
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21:12<somiaj>probably the combo, and lot depends on what is running during the power loss. If you have lots of activity going on, the cache hasn't found any idel time to write changes to the disk. On the other hand if your system is mostly idel, most changes should be correctly written to the disk.
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21:14<nezZario>right, without going into a huge explanation, every time this has happened I was actively using the PC, and it usually happens around 1pm (all the other times, up until this point, has to do with the way I pay my poewr bill... if I am off by even $0.01 they shut me off, but I can pay online and get it turned back on automatically within about 3 minutes.. this time, though, was due to a small child and surge protector)
21:18<nezZario>anyway, sorry, back on subject ... looking at this URL provided by blast007 I'm pretty lost. I know APC is a pretty big brand, so it shouldn't be hard to find, but sney you said these UPSs usually plug up via serial?!
21:19<blast007>nezZario: you can narrow it down by selecting the max support level
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21:20<blast007>when you say "cheap UPS", what kind of price range are you talking about?
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21:46<ais-admin>most UPS's use either a serial port or more likely lately a usb port to communicate with the host PC to tell the PC when its running on battery. There is usially accompanying software that you run on the PC that will react to the signals sent by the UPS and do things for you (like shut your machine off)
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21:47<ais-admin>apcupsd is the APC UPS Daemon program that runs under linux and also other less desirable OS's
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21:49<ais-admin>whatever you buy its not likely the software that comes with it will be linux compatible so if I were you I'd start my search for Linux UPS software to get a list of what is available and what brands/devices are supported. Then, get one of those.
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21:56<davesp>For UPS monitoring on Linux, "Nut" has worked well for me: https://packages.debian.org/stretch/nut
21:57<davesp>(APC and CyberPower UPSes.)
21:58<blast007>Eaton's 5S UPS brochure specifically mentions Linux too
22:00<ais-admin>hmmm nut, thanks for mentioning that davesp. Looks like something I could use...
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23:59<rocostre>Hello World
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---Logclosed Sat May 12 00:00:08 2018