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#debian IRC Logs for 2018-09-11

---Logopened Tue Sep 11 00:00:45 2018
00:04-!-ttelford [zncsrv@2601:681:4100:8981:44dd:acff:fe85:9c8e] has joined #debian
00:04-!-ttelford is "Troy Telford" on #debian #debian-voip #debian-next #debian-ipv6
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01:50-!-tomg is "*Unknown*" on #debian-offtopic #debian @#initfreedom @#debian-support #debian-next
01:59-!-furrymcgee [~furrymcge@lippydanger.jumpingcrab.com] has joined #debian
01:59-!-furrymcgee is "Unknown" on #debian #debian-dpkg #devscripts #debian-qemu #elephant-shed
02:02<furrymcgee>my initrd does not find the root device after initramfs-tools reconfigure its looking for some mdadm.conf but why?
02:05<furrymcgee>there is the warning W: mkconf: MD subsystem is not loaded, thus I cannot scan for arrays.
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02:08<twb>furrymcgee: are you at the initramfs rescue shell currently?
02:10<furrymcgee>luckily i found an old initramfs on my disk
02:10<likcoras>So I accidentally pressed 'm' on aptitude while focused on 'installed packages', which made aptitude forget all packages installed due to dependencies. Is there any way to restore this?
02:11<likcoras>I do have (a week old) backups, so in the worst case hopefully I can restore from that. What would the procedure be to restore that information?
02:13<twb>likcoras: that metadata lives in /var/lib/apt/extended_states, I believe
02:13<twb>yes, that's the correct path
02:13<furrymcgee>this is after switch linux-initramfs-tool
02:13<twb>furrymcgee: you're using a non-standard initramfs package?
02:14<likcoras>Welp. Is there any way to make aptitude not be so dangerous about dropping all data next time I type something wrong?
02:15<likcoras>I can only think of running aptitude as an unpriviledged user and becoming root from within aptitude after I've figured out what I want to do
02:15<twb>likcoras: if you hit m then it only saves it if you hit q or g
02:15<twb>likcoras: you could have just done Ctrl+C to abort
02:15<likcoras>ah, brilliant.
02:15<likcoras>thanks!
02:17<furrymcgee>before there ws dracut for kvm
02:18<furrymcgee>this is whats used now, but qemu wanted initramfs-tools ...
02:20<furrymcgee>they have probably different configuration
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02:40<furrymcgee>debian boots again after changing netboot to most in /etc/initramfs-tools/conf.d/driver-policy
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02:42-!-peterS is "Peter Samuelson" on #debian-apache #debian-ops #debian
02:43<ach>ok
02:43<twb>initramfs-tools is the Debian default
02:43<ach>!?
02:44<twb>and yeah cool, that option is roughly where I was heading, but I wanted to check some other possibilities first
02:44<ach>!elf
02:44<dpkg>rumour has it, elf is information on ELF can be found at ftp://tsx.mit.edu/pub/linux/packages/GCC/ELF.doc.tar.gz,text doc here: http://www.muppetlabs.com/~breadbox/software/ELF.txt.
02:44<twb>it defaults to "most" which is why I didn't guess that straight away
02:47<furrymcgee>probably it was screwed when tried kvm
02:47<twb>kvm on its own shouldn't cause that; libvirtd might have indirectly
02:48<furrymcgee>thank you
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03:31<nyoron>> Thanks to some spammers you need to provide at least 2 linebreaks
03:31<nyoron>what kind of spammers?
03:31<nyoron>how does requiring 2 linebreaks help against them?
03:31<twb>nyoron: where is that written?
03:31<nyoron>3 of the 4 most recent pastes are adverts for CP
03:31<nyoron>https://paste.debian.net/
03:32<nyoron>try to paste something that has less than 2 linebreaks
03:32<twb>nyoron: SEO probably
03:33<nyoron>what's the most upsetting is that it loses your paste
03:34<nyoron>twb: I don't think that explains much
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03:47<twb>Flip! "make deb-pkg" isn't working for me in linux 4.17!
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04:00<at0m>dpkg: tell twb about doesnt work
04:00<at0m>,v linux-image-amd64
04:00<judd>Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- wheezy: 3.2+46; wheezy-security: 3.2+46+deb7u2; jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-backports: 4.9+80+deb9u4~bpo8+1; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u4; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u4; stretch-proposed-updates: 4.9+80+deb9u5; stretch-backports: 4.16+94~bpo9+1; buster: 4.17+97; sid: 4.18+98
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04:01<twb>at0m: yeah I bumbled over to #debian-kernel to whinge abuot it
04:01<at0m>twb: sure you're in the right channel? #debian-next
04:01<at0m>ah ok
04:01<twb>it's a bpo kernel
04:01<twb>I'm currently isolating the actual problem for a useful question/report
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04:04<twb>at0m: 18:04 <twb> http://ix.io/1ms7 quilt is getting confused somehow
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04:05<at0m>i have no idea about your issue, just that #d didnt look like the right place to ask
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04:05<twb>OK :-)
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04:42<webmind>wow, did firefox-esr just upgrade to the 'new' firefox? disabling extensions without even a warning?
04:43<twb>webmind: I don't see that in Debian 9
04:43<jm_>,v firefox-esr
04:43<twb>webmind: looks like firefox-esr=60~ has moved from experimental to unstable (sid)
04:43<judd>Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie-backports/firefox-release: 52.1.0esr-1~bpo80+1; stretch: 52.6.0esr-1~deb9u1; wheezy-security: 52.8.0esr-1~deb7u1; jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; jessie-security: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 52.8.1esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 52.9.0esr-1~deb9u1; buster: 52.9.0esr-1; sid: 60.2.0esr-1
04:43<twb>And something called "new" that I don't recognize
04:43<itd>https://www.debian.org/security/2018/dsa-4287
04:44<jm_>looks like in sid only
04:45<jm_>ohh stretch security too
04:45<arto>aptitude show firefox-esr
04:45<arto>Paketti: firefox-esr
04:45<arto>Versio: 60.2.0esr-1~deb9u2
04:45<jm_>looks like judd is outdated ATM
04:45<twb>rmadison also
04:46<jm_>good thing I switched manually to using their tarballs a while ago
04:46<arto>quantum came to stable last saturday
04:47<webmind>twb: I got firefox 60 from a security update
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04:48<webmind>in stretch
04:48<jm_>webmind: yeah see URL twb posted https://www.debian.org/security/2018/dsa-4287
04:48<webmind>jm_: itd posted that, but ok :)
04:50<webmind>I would have liked a warning before just disabling extentions
04:50<webmind>just blindly disabling them could be a security issue even
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04:51<twb>webmind: do you have apt-listchanges installed?
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04:52<arto>webmind: try: reportbug firefox -esr it will give good advice what you can try
04:53<arto>webmind: firefox-esr, no space
04:53<twb>I didn't think rmadison *could* lag behind reality
04:54<jm_>webmind: the thing is they just don't work anymore AFAIK
04:54<jm_>(legacy extensions that is)
04:54<twb>webmind: a small number of new-style extensions are in apt - https-everywhere, privacy-badger, adblock-whatever-it-is-called-this-week
04:54<ach>time to pack the cycle bomb out
04:54<jm_>I don't remember if firefox itself tells you about this, it was a long time ago for me
04:55<twb>Wow, firefox-esr is 3 times bigger in amd64 than armhf
04:56<twb>That CAN'T just be all the words being 32 bits wider
04:57<webmind>jm_: which is understandable. But disabling them without informing the user seems problematic to me.
04:57<webmind>arto: are you suggesting a file a bug for this?
04:58<twb>webmind: I agree that sucks. I think 1. apt-listchanges probably would've warned you; 2. if it didn't, that should change; 3. unpatched browser engine is WORSE than breaking all the plugins
04:58<jm_>webmind: yeah but that's more an issue you need to report to mozilla :)
04:59<arto>webmind: you dont have to actually do a bug report, but starting it, it gave me valuable hints, so I stopped there and did not file the bug
05:00<twb>The older version 60.1.0esr-3 definitely doesn't mention "third-party xul is dead" in NEWS.Debian.gz
05:00<jm_>apparently it just does this blindly without informing the user https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/re-enable-add-ons-disabled-when-updating
05:01<twb>jm_: ah I wouldn't see that because my firefox processes aren't allowed to have a persistent state :-)
05:01<jm_>twb: yeah but it would just disable them each time then, so the end result would be the same?
05:02<twb>Sigh at support.mozilla.org using the same "load-on-demand" img trick as bloody wikia
05:02<twb>Let me just patch my browser to convert @data-original-src so I can see the flipping screenshots
05:04<ach>i don't get it i was about to think maybe my computer before 4 years was more a state of perfect save to the internet?
05:04<webmind>twb: I agree the security issue needed to be resolved, and if the only way of moving to a newer version is how that could be resolved ok. But that does require informing users
05:05<twb>jm_: OK, _now_ I see what you're saying, and I agree it'd warn you
05:05<webmind>and that's a step mozilla could've provided, but I think they've moved to the new version quite some time already. It's also a step the maintainer could have provided
05:06<twb>webmind: the "we had to upgrade the village in order to save it" crap was in the Debian 9 Release Notes
05:06<webmind>twb: I
05:06<webmind>twb: I
05:06<webmind>arg
05:06<webmind>twb: I'm not disputing the upgrade
05:07<twb>The "warn me that plugin X is broken" should happen as a popup when you first run the upgraded firefox
05:07<twb>per jm_'s link
05:07<twb>If that didn't happen, it makes sense to investigate why
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05:08<webmind>it didn't happen
05:08<ach>it was
05:08<twb>However I personally don't care about that issue, so I'll go back to work now :-)
05:08<ach>but i don'T know why it gone disabled?
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07:11-!-cpaelzer is "Christian Ehrhardt" on #virt #debian #debian-qemu
07:16<_kab>I'm getting a bit screwed over by the combination of apt and gpg. gpg creates new keyrings in it's /new/ keybox format which apt doesn't understand. Because of that it hard fails and doesn't use any of the keys provided (even in different keyrings). This broke updating/upgrading for me
07:17<twb>_kab: are you running gpg directly instead of via apt-key ?
07:18<_kab>gpg doesn't appear to offer any kind of option to force the old keyring format. apt-key which would be an obvious choice otherwise is not intended to be used in scripts and just uses gpg internally anyway
07:18<_kab>Yes. Since apt-key comes with an obvious warning not to use it in scrips
07:19<twb>I noticed the same behaviour you describe, today, but I assumed it was my fault for doing chroot-y things without any of that dbus stuff inside the chroot
07:20<twb>I got the warning from "dpkg-source -x"; apt itself seems to be happy
07:20<bremner>_kab: you need to use the --export option with gpg
07:21<twb>apt-key --recv-key has failed a bunch of times today though :-9
07:22<bremner>_kab: --export is the option to force the old format
07:23<petn-randall>twb: I don't think your issue is related to _kab's.
07:23<twb>fair enough
07:23<petn-randall>twb: Can you paste the command + complete output you're getting that shows the issue? → https://paste.debian.net
07:23<_kab>I'll give it a try. From the manpage it does sound like that's for stdout only though
07:24<bremner>no
07:24<twb>Blargh. I'm _almost_ annoyed enough to keep the key locally and then just --refresh instead of --recv-key
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07:25<bremner>at least, I doubt it.
07:26<_kab>gpg --list-keys --no-default-keyring --keyring /etc/apt/trusted.gpg -> gpg: keybox '/etc/apt/trusted.gpg' created
07:26<bremner>and?
07:26<_kab>--export doesn't work in that combination
07:27<twb>_kab: I thought you were using apt-key *not* gpg
07:27<bremner>list-keys is a different command than --export, correct
07:27<_kab>I stay away from apt-key because it's not intended for script usage
07:27<bremner> gpg --output foo.asc --armour --export $thekey
07:28<twb>petn-randall: from a while ago 18:04 <twb> http://ix.io/1ms7 quilt is getting confused somehow
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07:28<twb>_kab: gpg isn't either, that's why gpgme is so awful
07:28<twb>(at least historically; gcrypt is A Thing these days)
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07:29<_kab>That won't help either, since I do need the overview of all keys and their expiration dates
07:29<_kab>Haven't worked with gpgme yet
07:29<twb>_kab: apt-key adv --whatever-the-gpg-thing-you-want
07:29<twb>I'm just going from memory here
07:29<twb>feel free to ignore me if you've already tried this
07:29<petn-randall>_kab: Then just check the outputu of apt-key strict, and test it if you ever intend to dist-upgrade the machine. The output won't change in the lifetime of stretch.
07:31<twb>petn-randall: hahaha: E: gnupg, gnupg2 and gnupg1 do not seem to be installed, but one of them is required for this operation
07:31<twb>petn-randall: maybe dpkg-source was running gpg instead of gpgv
07:31<_kab>Odd having to go through these hoops when all you really need is a format option. Thank you all for your suggestions
07:32<twb>_kab: what are you trying to do anyway? I mean, what's your high-level / end goal?
07:32<_kab>Automagically clean up expired and blacklist keys on ~2k servers
07:32<_kab>blacklisted*
07:33<twb>you mean third-party keys that you added?
07:33<petn-randall>_kab: Don't you have config management tools for that?
07:33<petn-randall>chef/puppet/ansible
07:33<twb>because the debian-archive ones should not need any special help
07:33<twb>also what petn-randall said
07:33<_kab>If by "you" you mean our customers, yes
07:34<_kab>We have a custom tool chain for deployment of configuration. That involves writing scripts in this case.
07:34<_kab>Debian keys are never touched. Just random 3rd party keys
07:35<bremner>_kab: random third party keys are just files. You can manage them as such.
07:35<bremner>you don't even need gpg.
07:35<_kab>They're inside a keyring
07:35<_kab>Not separate files, sadly
07:35<petn-randall>This ^. They should only be added/removed to /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
07:35<_kab>All in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg
07:36<bremner>don't use /etc/apt/trusted.gpg
07:36<_kab>Yeah I didn't add them :P
07:36<_kab>So not really my choice. Our own keys are in .d
07:37<bremner>OK, well, I think you know the technical things you need to. The rest is figuring out how to make it work in your organization.
07:37<twb>last time I fought this, back in 2008, I wrote my own trivial script around gpg --export --armor and gpg --import
07:37<twb>to convert between "a directory full of keys" and "a keyring"
07:37<twb>The debian equivalent is called jetring
07:37<_kab>Yeah as I said thanks for your hints
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08:08<simulala>hi. I came here to ask a question about PAM over SSH tunnel. Well I have an ngircd server and it works with PAM but not over ssh tunnel. Over SSH tunnel i can see the same SQL queries but another code - 6. Any idea why?
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08:10<simulala>even more - i can use weechat to login with PAM enabled (without SSH tunnel) but with SSH not.
08:10<simulala>I do not understand too, why I can't login using telnet if PAM is enabled but I can via weechat or without PAM
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08:37<simulala>anyone can help with PAM?
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08:41<LouWestin>simulala: Maybe this will help?https://wiki.debian.org/LDAP/PAM
08:43<simulala>hmmm why it should?
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08:47<simulala>let me explain cases to be clear
08:48<simulala>ngircd >> weechat works, telnet works
08:48<simulala>ngircd +PAM(mysql) >> weechat works, telnet not
08:49<simulala>ngircd via SSH tunnel >> weechat works, telnet works
08:49<simulala>ngircd +PAM(mysql) via ssh tunnel >> weechat not works, telnet not works
08:49<simulala>i have no idea why
08:50<itd>simulala: What does 'works' / 'not works' mean?
08:50<simulala>not works mean "Bad password"
08:50<simulala>but logged SQL query is the same
08:51<simulala>i can copy it to the query editor and it works - finding a user
08:51<simulala>only i have to add use {database} in both cases
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09:01<simulala>O.o7
09:01<simulala>i am an idiot
09:02<petn-randall>simulala: Do let us know what the mistake is, so others can learn.
09:02<itd>simulala: So ... it's working now?
09:02<simulala>well I can't believe
09:02<simulala>i am checking it
09:04<simulala>the password
09:04<simulala>i have completely no idea why I use wrong password via tunnel - ALWAYS; telnet, weechat
09:05<simulala>i even did select password('') to be sure if password is correct LOL TO THE MOON
09:07<simulala>how it is possible to TYPE two different passwords depending on connection mode
09:07<simulala>but i did it
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09:10<itd>Just focus on that part: you did it! ;)
09:14<simulala>:|
09:16<petn-randall>,botsnack
09:16<petn-randall>,botsnack judd
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09:17<chele>how do i answer dpkg-reconfigure from a script?
09:17<simulala>dunno, maybe using "expect"...?
09:18<simulala>not sure if it can handle ncurses
09:19<petn-randall>chele: Usually you don't it's meant for human consumption. What are you trying to do?
09:20<chele>petn-randall reconfigure wireshark-common in a machine deployed by a script where noninteractivity is desired.
09:22<nyoron>https://manpages.debian.org/stretch/debconf-doc/debconf.7.en.html#Unattended_Package_Installation
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09:27<petn-randall>chele: this ^
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09:30<wizofe>Is that supposed to happen? If I login as root and do an apt install xpack, I get a few error issues (I can paste log) but if I do sudo apt install samepack, it install correctly. Does apt need to be invoked through sudo?
09:31<wizofe>Note: using debian buster (testing)
09:33<arto>!debian-next
09:33<dpkg>#debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
09:34<petn-randall>wizofe: Please asking in the above channel. ^^^
09:34<wizofe>dpkg: you're the best bot! :)
09:34<dpkg>wizofe: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox?
09:42<chele>petn-randall thanks. checking it out.
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10:22<chele>petn-randall DEBCONF_DB_OVERRIDE can only specified different databases, e.g. i have to create the file... what if i wanna specify just some value... ?
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12:59<r0b0_sk>hi since I upgraded my debian stretch+backports PC to mesa 18, I have issues with transparency in KDE plasma and now also menus in firefox 60 do not show up
12:59<r0b0_sk>is this a known issue, please?
13:00<r0b0_sk>apparently it is an issue with some intel gpus
13:01<petn-randall>r0b0_sk: It's possible. I'd check the bug reports against testing if the issue has already been filed. In general, backports has seen less testing than stable, so you can expect more (unknown) bugs.
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13:07<r0b0_sk>I think it's these 2 upstream bugs https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=105871 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103699
13:07<r0b0_sk>any idea against which debian package I can report this?
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13:08<flips>to be alerted to S.M.A.R.T. pre failure messages (on a headless server), I should install smartmontools?
13:08<r0b0_sk>flips, yes
13:08<petn-randall>flips: Yes, and make sure smartd is running and can send mails.
13:09<petn-randall>(I'm currently fixing up a system were both disks failed and smartd could *not* send mails)
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13:11<flips>nice ... yes, making sure exim can actually send messages would be good thing :)
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13:20<r0b0_sk>and, especially if you have more than one server, you can also install some higher level monitoring tool and integrate smartmontools with it
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15:03<jhutchins_wk>petn-randall: I've seen several RAID systems where there was no notification, and they didn't know anything was wrong until the second drive failed.
15:04<petn-randall>jhutchins_wk: Well, the RAID wasn't failing, it still had at least one healthy sector on either side. And due to the cron job bug in stretch the RAID never got scrubbed.
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15:26<jelly>petn-randall: that's not what failing means!
15:27<jelly>and wasn't that bashism bug fixed in stretch
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16:06<petn-randall>jelly: nope https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=787950
16:06<judd>Bug http://bugs.debian.org/787950 in mdadm (closed, patch): «mdadm: checkarray don't work whit dash»; severity: important; opened: 2015-06-06; last modified: 2017-07-25.
16:07<petn-randall>jelly: Well, the failing part was never detected, because the faulty parts were never read by the raid. Close enough?
16:07<jelly>so it's another one of "who cares about stable"
16:10<jelly>,v whois
16:10<judd>Package: whois on amd64 -- wheezy: 5.1.1~deb7u1; jessie: 5.2.7; stretch: 5.2.17~deb9u1; buster: 5.3.2; sid: 5.3.2
16:11<petn-randall>jelly: I'm already subscribed to that bug, and I'm annoyed, since it's trivial (but ugly) to fix: Just depend on bash and add two bytes to the shebang.
16:12<jelly>$work solves it by not running Debian on metal :-)
16:12<jelly>and I _think_ I've /bin/sh -> bash'd some of my own systems
16:13<petn-randall>I just fixed it in my ansible role. It ain't pretty, but it works.
16:13<petn-randall>And "ain't pretty" is the lesser evil compared to "not running raid scrub for a whole release cycle".
16:13<jelly>because dpkg-divert is silly. Now that I know it exists, I might set up autodeb for some interesting but easily buildable bits and make backports
16:15<jelly>we can make a passive-aggressive overlay repo at http://some.of.the.other.worst.errors.unfixed.in.stable.tech/debian stretch main
16:15<jelly>(I think that's what devuan basically is, but for other raisins)
16:17<jhutchins_wk>We've got a bunch of old ksh stuff copied over from Solaris.
16:19<jelly>ksh isn't bad. I even used /bin/sh -> mosh at home for a bit, found some bugs
16:19<jelly>er, mksh
16:19<phy1729>Doesn't look like it'd be too hard to POSIXify
16:19<phy1729>Would loose long options
16:20<jelly>I think it has code for some of that when called as sh
16:20<jelly>,v mksh
16:20<judd>Package: mksh on amd64 -- wheezy: 40.9.20120630-7; jessie: 50d-5; jessie-backports: 54-2~bpo8+1; stretch: 54-2+b4; stretch-backports: 56c-1~bpo9+1; buster: 56c-1; sid: 56c-1
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20:50<nyoron>> In kernel 4.0, the md sysfs implementation does not work with partial reads from /sys/block/md0/md/sync_action; the read syscall returns the entire contents of the file even if you try to read less.
20:50<nyoron>how is that even possible?
20:51<nyoron>when you call read(fd, buf, count), shouldn't you always get count or less bytes?
20:52<nyoron>otherwise it could lead to a buffer overflow
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---Logclosed Wed Sep 12 00:00:46 2018