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#linode IRC Logs for 2008-06-24

---Logopened Tue Jun 24 00:00:12 2008
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00:27<sitespark>gautam: hi
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01:12<morgs>nic/ newnick morgs_b
01:12<morgs>nick/ newnick morgs_b
01:12<tjfontaine>/nick morgs_b
01:13<tjfontaine>is what you want
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01:13<morgs>:-P thanks
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01:18<morgs_b>can anyone lend a hand? our linode configured sites are not always resolving correctly
01:18<morgs_b>how do we tell if its a DNS issue or Apache issue? We have Virtual Hosts configured with names and not IPs, is this ok? how do we check?
01:19<tjfontaine>the same site works sometimes and other times doesn't .. or?
01:19<tjfontaine>which site?
01:19<morgs_b>sometimes wont load, sometimes to primary Linode IP
01:21<morgs_b>virtual hosts on , :
01:21<morgs_b>sry: virtual IP's
01:22<morgs_b>we've had an average of 6% cpu use, so its no server issues
01:23<tjfontaine>you're using named ips in the apache config?
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01:23<morgs_b>the site will usually resolve OK in most parts in the world, or via web tests: , but not in AUS - all kind of weirdness for Aus.
01:23<morgs_b>Named IP's yes
01:24<morgs_b>The dev responsible for this will be online soon; im getting the ball rolling :)
01:24<tjfontaine>are you telling me it only resolves improperly in .au?
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01:24<morgs_b>no - from Aus ISP's it seems to give the strangest most inconsistent results
01:25<tjfontaine>but the dns result is always right when it breaks?
01:25<morgs_b>my clients (sotai, sgch) have BOTH seen their site resolve to primary IP, but I have not been able to replicate - but they have definately seen this, and nto a cache issue
01:25<morgs_b>the DNS is correct, yes
01:25<morgs_b>and consistently traces and pings correctly
01:25-!-dev [~dev@] has joined #linode
01:25<dev>hi all
01:26<morgs_b>dev: evgeny?
01:26<morgs_b>this is sysadmin evgeny; welcome
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01:26<dev>hello again
01:26<tjfontaine>if dns is always resolving properly it sounds like an apache issue
01:26<dev>li30-132:/etc/bind# host
01:26<dev> A record not found, server failure
01:26<dev>li30-132:/etc/bind# mcedit
01:26<dev>li30-132:/etc/bind# host
01:26<dev> A
01:26<morgs_b>dev: ive explained the basic strange resolution issues, but not mentioned further details
01:27<dev>host -t ns
01:27<dev> NS
01:27<dev> host
01:27<dev> A
01:28<dev> this ip is ip of our vpsbut it is not inside virtual server
01:28<tjfontaine>ya but whois says your ns servers are
01:29<tjfontaine>dev: what do you mean by your last statement?
01:29<dev>so i suggested Morgan to change dns to ns1/ which will point to first and second ips inside our vps
01:29<dev> it is not assigned to an any interfaces inside our virtual server
01:30<irgeek>1) Fix your reverse DNS. 2) Make sure your DNS servers agree with your registrar on NS records.
01:30<morgs_b>godaddy SERVES the nameservers :ns1/ , I set to ns1: , ns2: , and as I said the domains resolve to correct IP.
01:31<morgs_b>dev: feedback?
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01:33<dev>checked whois. yes according to whois godaddy has ns1/2 as nameservers. let me correct zones again
01:33<irgeek>Your DNS server says that is the NS authority for those domains.
01:34<dev>yes. but it is not me who done this. I set up ns1/2 . it is bad when several people have power shell on one node
01:36<irgeek>So you're saying that you want help but you don't have access to try possible fixes we give you?
01:37<dev>no i am already changing zone to a valid one.
01:39-!-gautam [~gautam@] has joined #linode
01:40<morgs_b>gautam: welcome - with us also :)
01:41<morgs_b>where can you acess todays logs? ( is latest on [im in web client now])
01:42<irgeek>The date gets appended when the logs are rotated.
01:44<morgs_b>ok, thanks
01:44<dev><irgeek> can u check what we have now with ?
01:45<irgeek> Everything I've seen is
01:45<dev> host -t ns
01:45<dev> NS
01:45<dev> NS
01:45-!-morgs_b [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
01:45<dev>but for some reason i still get this
01:45<dev>li30-132:/etc/bind# host -t ns
01:45<dev> NS
01:46<irgeek>Your name servers still have the same serial numbers
01:46<dev>i changed it. incresed
01:46<irgeek>Did you reload bind?
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01:47<irgeek>It's still serving the same serial
01:47<dev>/etc/resolv.conf got overwritten again. igeek can you advice me, what is constantly overwrites it ???
01:47<dev>yes i reload that
01:47<dev>un 24 01:42:59 li30-132 named[29674]: zone sending notifies (serial 1206535392)
01:47<dev>Jun 24 01:42:59 li30-132 named[29674]: zone sending notifies (serial 1206535392)
01:47<dev>Jun 24 01:42:59 li30-132 named[29674]: client view localhost_resolver: received notify for zone ''
01:47<irgeek>And resolv.cont has nothing to do with the numbers I'm getting.
01:48<irgeek>What did you set the serial to?
01:48<dev>resolv.conf has something to local resolver. when i issue host command
01:48<dev>how can i force dhcp do not overwrite it ????
01:48<exor|zzz>don't use dhcp
01:48<dev>we we use dhcp here in vps ?
01:49<exor|zzz>its ot like your IP is gonna change
01:49<irgeek>Don't. Use dig
01:49<dev>i need to have in my resolv.conf nameserver
01:50<irgeek>Wait. I was looking at a different domain
01:50<irgeek>dev: No you don't.
01:50<dev>why. i want my local apps use my own nameserver.
01:51<dev>how can i implement that ?
01:51<irgeek>Why do you want to do that?
01:52<irgeek>Did you update your reverse DNS too? That will take longer to show up. I think it's reloaded every 12 hours
01:53<dev>it is mostly useful for troubleshouting dns problems. also it ensures that when i change zone locally, ecvery app on server will know it first
01:53<dev>i did not change reverse zone
01:55<irgeek>It would be a good idea.
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01:59<irgeek>Just a heads up, that animated menu on is really hard to navigate correctly.
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02:02<LinodeJavaUser>irgeek: at least you can see it, I cant :-P
02:02<dev>host -t ns
02:02<dev> NS
02:02<dev> NS
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02:03<irgeek>That's one problem squared away.
02:03<irgeek>morgs_b: What *do* you see?
02:04<dev>it is response of my dns. not tours
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02:05<morgs_b>irgeek: Firefox 2.* 'server not found'
02:06<irgeek>I'm asking your DNS servers correctly. I get the correct response for now, but not for or
02:07<irgeek>morgs_b: Are you using Windows?
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02:08<irgeek>Ok. Fat fingers. looks like it's answering correctly.
02:08<morgs_b>irgeek: on a web cafe terminal, yep
02:09<irgeek>Can you ping it?
02:09<morgs_b>irgeek: yes, but site does not resolve
02:09<irgeek>Does the other one resolve?
02:10<morgs_b> : NO
02:10<irgeek>Also, did you close and restart FF? It has it's own cacheing.
02:11<dev>interesting part that it resolves on my side
02:11<dev>PING ( 56(84) bytes of data.
02:11<dev>64 bytes from ( icmp_seq=1 ttl=54 time=239 ms
02:11<morgs_b>Ive cleared FF cache
02:12<dev>actually all domains get resolved for me
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02:13<morgs_b>dev: pls lets not start that dialogue again, shall we? there's obvious issues here
02:15<morgs_b>irgeek: ive cleared and restarted numerous times, ive check this from NUMEROUS places around sydney, on diverse connections
02:15<morgs_b>the issues have been the same since we transferred to Linode
02:16<dev>irgeek. the strange thing is when i change zone and change soa there - it does not updates on your nameservers
02:17<dev>though it should be. it is just A record. not whole DNS transition in registar
02:17<irgeek>It depends on cacheing.
02:18<irgeek>morgs_b: I'm guessing since you're on a web cafe computer you can't install anything, right?
02:18<dev>i know. but it is unusally long
02:19<irgeek>dev: There are still ISPs in the world that ignore TTLs
02:19<dev>i know. are you among them ? ;)
02:20<irgeek>1) This probably doesn't have anything to do with Linode since you are only using them for a VPS. 2) I don't work for Linode
02:21<dev>sorry i though u r linode person
02:21<irgeek>If there is a fscked up cacheing DNS somewhere, it would be on the Aussie side.
02:22<dev>i understood that. i just wonder why it is so.... in AU :)
02:22<morgs_b>IRGEEK: i complained enough to have full access - I can install now
02:22<irgeek>Get dig:
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02:23<dev>dig from russia answers ok now
02:24<dev>svd:~# dig
02:24<dev>; <<>> DiG 9.3.4 <<>>
02:24<dev>;; global options: printcmd
02:24<dev>;; Got answer:
02:24<dev>;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 4974
02:24<dev>;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 1
02:24<dev>;; QUESTION SECTION:
02:24<dev>; IN A
02:24<dev>;; ANSWER SECTION:
02:24<dev> 38400 IN A
02:24<dev> 38400 IN NS
02:24<dev> 38400 IN NS
02:24<dev> 3599 IN A
02:24<dpn`>use a pastebin ffs
02:25<irgeek>!calc 38400 seconds in days
02:25<linbot>irgeek: 38,400 seconds = 0.444444444 days
02:25<irgeek>!calc 38400 seconds in hours
02:25<linbot>irgeek: 38,400 seconds = 10.6666667 hours
02:26<morgs_b>irgeek: ok created c:/dig and unzipped
02:26<irgeek>dev: We prefer you use the pastebin for things that long:
02:26<irgeek>Ok: dig
02:27<irgeek>Then pastebin the output please.
02:32<morgs_b>irgeek: - but its a program error :-P
02:32<dev>ok. on my side dig shows new ns1/2 in zones. on linode server itself it still shows old ones
02:34<irgeek>dev: Your TTL is almost 11 hours. You're probably asking a cacheing server.
02:34<morgs_b>dev: a few too many 0's?
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02:36<irgeek>morgs_b: Can you pastebin the output of: ipconfig /all
02:37<irgeek>Now try this: dig @
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02:39<irgeek>If it gave output, could you pastebin it?
02:40<morgs_b>irgeek: thanks heaps for the help btw
02:41<irgeek>That's all it output? That's very strange.
02:41<morgs_b>thats it
02:43<irgeek>There's something strange with that DNS server. There was no error and no answer.
02:44<dev>morgan i used the same settng in zone that you had before
02:45<dev>actually the only changes in zones i did - it is ns1/2, soa and ip
02:45<Internat>time to change domain registers..
02:47<morgs_b>for (which clients just rang to confirm is showing content [root ip]) :
02:47<morgs_b>note: sgch is PRIORITY issue
02:48<irgeek>!calc 25744 seconds in hours
02:48<linbot>irgeek: 25,744 seconds = 7.15111111 hours
02:49<irgeek>morgs_b: Are you sure they aren't typing in and you don't have it configured in Apache?
02:49<dev>and still i think having such dns issue it is better to have IP in apache <VirtualHost IP/Domain>
02:50<irgeek>If they can see anything from your server, especially the default page, it's probably an Apache config problem.
02:50<morgs_b>irgeek: shit! resolves for me, but does NOT!
02:50<dev>they have it configured. but they use domain name niot ip. so if apache resolved it to something else than its own ips - it will show some other vhost on that ip
02:50<dev>some other = first one in the list
02:50<morgs_b>dev: what about * in Apache!?
02:51<dev>Morgan there is only
02:51<dev>not any *
02:52<dev>try now. if www resolves for you
02:52<dev>on my side it resolves
02:52<morgs_b>well you SHOULD specify WWW OR have a wildcard '*' - right!?
02:53<irgeek>dev: 1) Apache serves the first VirtualHost it finds on the config if there is no specific site to connect to. 2) Apache does not consider and to be the same site unless you explicitly tell it they are. 3) You can only have *one* ServerName directive per VirtualHost - any other name you want to map needs to be a ServerAlias.
02:53<Internat>hmms well that was a bonus.. free ssl cert from NameCheap when you transfer a domain..
02:53<dev>irgeek. i know. i tried to explain that to Gautam and Morgan last time..
02:54<dev> now works for me
02:54<dev>in FF
02:54<dev>though it is damn slow
02:54<dev>but i am downloading stuff..
02:54<CpuID>hey anyone here using ipsec on their linode? just curious as to which variant anyone else is using with success
02:54<irgeek>dev: I can almost guarantee they were using www - people do that and you can't stop them. It's better to define both. Especially when you have the www address in DNS.
02:54<morgs_b> WORKS but not
02:55<morgs_b>dev: if you understand why HAVENT you specified 'www' in Apache conf?
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02:56<irgeek>morgs_b: Can you pastebin the output of this please: dig ns @
02:56<morgs_b>ok, wrkng
02:58<dev>morgs_b: i took your configuration from old server
02:58<dev>it was a migration
02:58<dev>i dont know which of your domains use www which not. yet
03:00<irgeek>When did these domains get moved to Linode?
03:00<morgs_b>dev: there are evidently differences between linode & gplh
03:02<dev>last week tuesday or wednesday..
03:02<jimp>just signed up. advanced beginner. any good 'install perl catalyst on new linode image' tutorials?
03:02<dev>morgan - they are obvious for you. but not for me cause i am new in your team
03:04<irgeek>jimp: I certainly haven't seen one, but the only major difference between your Linode and a dedicated host is that Linode managed the kernel, so any tutorial for your specific software should work.
03:04<morgs_b>dev: there not obvious for me - i just know how they SHOULD be, i.e. OK ;)
03:05<dpn`>jimp: look for a guide for whichever distro you have deployed on there
03:05<dev>:) i agree with your point. but you also should agree with my, i have no telepathy ability
03:05<dev>i can check through all domains and add www. alias
03:06<dev>because all of them i suspect has no www. sub
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03:08<morgs_b>dev: yes, of CRS (that was a subtle hint)
03:11<dev>morgan, what about latest. i think no need for www.
03:11<morgs_b>dev: just use a SAFE default for all configs
03:18<dev>all zones changed to ns1/2 also.
03:20<morgs_b>no change yet for
03:20<irgeek>dev & morgs_b: I'd lower the TTL on every domain. 10 hours is a long time. I usually set domains I care about working to 1 hour
03:21<morgs_b>dev: could WWW explain resolving to primary IP, not domain content?
03:21<irgeek>morgs_b: Yes.
03:21<morgs_b>dev: restart apache
03:22<irgeek>Also, you're behind a cacheing DNS server. You won't see DNS changes for about 11 hours because of the high TTL
03:22<dev>www gots resolved. but it has no vhost match. so it show first vhost on that ip - probably argyle
03:22<dev>it was reloaded
03:22<dev>i will change ttl to 3600
03:24<irgeek>morgs_b: I'm getting correctly - if reloading FF doesn't show you the correct page you're probably behind a cacheing HTTP proxy. They are pretty common in Internet cafes.
03:24<morgs_b>irgeek: yeah I was asking about that - but they had no idea :-P
03:24<morgs_b>irgeek: anyway to refresh manually - I got CMD access!!
03:25<irgeek>That won't refresh the HTTP proxy. It's on a different computer if it's there.
03:25<morgs_b>irgeek: sure
03:25<dev>changed ttl
03:27<dev> 3600 IN A
03:27<dev>for all zones
03:27<irgeek>I see the change too. In 11 hours so will the rest of the Internet. :)
03:27<gautam>dev, morgs_b, igreek: Hello guys! (have been in listen mode). now loads now in FF.
03:28<dev>probably earlier. if they dont reqested that domain during last 11 hours ;)
03:28<morgs_b>dev: why such a long TTL? you previously told us 3600
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03:29<dev>it is 3600. now. but if domain was already reqested - there is still old zone information in some local ISP NS servers
03:30<dev>and it will be cleared ~11 hours at max
03:30<morgs_b>dev: i mean why previously was it *much* longer than 3600?
03:32<dev>I suspect it was deafult for some zone. then sergey or whoever else take that zone modified all information regarding IP, SOA, subdomains required - but left that TTL. actuially it is ok to have such ttl also. it is not a problem. but if you make changes often to a zone - it is better to keep it smaller
03:33<dev>i just took zones from old server modified them with new ip and changed soa, thats all
03:34<dev>also 3600 is too small for a very very high loaded domains. imagine you have several thousands of them, and every has several million hits...
03:34<dev>dns should be then on a separate server.. pretty powerful one to keep in order with that setting
03:35<dev>it is a question of balance
03:35<morgs_b>dev: ok, I understand
03:38<irgeek>dev: ns[12] used to be two Linode120s server something like 15,000 domains. They used something like 2Mb/s of bandwidth and didn't blink. You don't need powerful servers for just DNS.
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03:39<klono>Is there a problem if my linode is using 340 MB of ram, with 511 MB free swap - I'm only running a few daemons
03:39<irgeek>klono: How much of that is cache and buffers?
03:39<klono>should I check into what's hogging resources? or is this normal for a base install of Debian
03:40<klono> total used free shared buffers cached
03:40<klono>Mem: 356116 347456 8660 0 40840 212984
03:40<klono>-/+ buffers/cache: 93632 262484
03:40<irgeek>250M of that is cache and buffers - those aren't the same as system memory.
03:40<klono>I'm not sure if my Linode is under pressure or not
03:40<irgeek>It's not.
03:40<irgeek>If it were, cache and buffers would be very low.
03:41<klono>load averages don't seem to ever go above 1.0
03:41<irgeek>Are you even reading what I type?
03:41<klono>I just continued to type that out
03:41<klono>not that I was ignoring you.
03:41<klono>anyways, thanks for the help
03:41<dev>irgeek. what about root servers ? ;)
03:42<irgeek>dev: 10^6+ domains is not the same thing. Even Google's DNS servers probably aren't as loaded as the root servers.
03:44<irgeek>klono: The main thing you need to watch is the swap i/o over time. If you're hitting swap a lot you should probably upgrade your Linode or trim down your services.
03:46<irgeek>procinfo is a good program for checking it from time to time. Also there are several applications that will graph memory usage over time so you can see trends easier.
03:47<dev>ok. beat me :)
03:47<dev>anyway i think dns should be on a separate server for a heavy loaded domains. because they have to provide FAST response.
03:51<morgs_b>dev: we have no heavy loaded domains, and prolly never will ;)
03:51<morgs_b>(for us: a good thing)
03:55<klono>so if zero swap is used
03:55<klono>then it's a good thing
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03:56<irgeek>klono: It's not how much swap you're using, but how much you're actively swapping.
03:56<irgeek>But zero swap used is a good thing too.
04:00<Internat>lol out of my 512mb of swap ive used 52k
04:01<Internat>idle : 149d 15:40:32.08 97.0% swap out: 71
04:01<Internat>uptime: 38d 13:06:00.99
04:01<Internat>how can my idle time in proc info be greater then my up time?
04:01<Internat>is it based on time over processors?
04:03<irgeek>Four cores
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04:05<morgs_b>any ideas why I get DOWN and sgch see Argyle on
04:06<Internat>irgeek: yeah i was thinking that
04:06<morgs_b>I mean: why DOWN vs Argyle - why arent I seeing Argyle?
04:06<Internat>morgs_b: my guess if any, would be that you fubard appache
04:06<Internat>and shows me SCGH
04:07<irgeek>morgs_b: It's not down. You're in an Internet cafe and they are doing strange cacheing of DNS and HTTP it seems.
04:07<morgs_b>Internat: thats good news, if only we cared what other countries saw - we'd have no worries ;)
04:08<morgs_b>irgeek: ok, but I think they might kick me out soon for the scuff marks ive inflicted on their box
04:08<morgs_b>cracks, bite marks, etc - you know the usual
04:09<irgeek>That doesn't change that fact that they are cacheing. You're not going to see things correctly from there until their caches expire or are cleared.
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04:12<morgs_b>irgeek: my teeth have learnt that the hard way
04:22<morgs_b>dev, irgeek: im getting a direct conncetion around CACHING firewall/router at cafe , will confirm in moment
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04:29<morgs_b>dev, irgeek: no change with direct connection to . Could this be because Aus is the arse end of the IP propagation chain?
04:29<irgeek>Are you still getting the wrong page?
04:30<Internat>morgs_b: im in ausralia
04:30<Internat>im getting the right pages on both
04:30<Internat>and how do you think your getting a dirrect connection, out of interest?
04:31<morgs_b>Internat: egads! I used admins PC with ethernet into modem, I looked up router and it seems to cache and load balance content
04:31<dev>morgan.. it is not the fact indeed
04:31<dev>it maybe at their ISP side
04:31<morgs_b>internat, dev: sure, worth a try
04:31<Internat>the modem could be caching, the isp could be cashing
04:32<morgs_b>just a gamble
04:32<Internat>the list keeps growing
04:32<encode>the cable could be caching even
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04:32<Internat>the fact that most of us can see your website fine would lead me to believe that your site is working
04:32<morgs_b>Internat: who's your ISP out of interest?
04:32<Internat>and im in australia, so it has nothing todo with australia in the IP prop chain
04:32*encode loads
04:33<morgs_b>Internat: at home - the same, good to know
04:33<encode>and finds it working also
04:33<Internat>and i just loaded it from works connection (Boeing), and it runs fine
04:33<encode>doesnt TPG do caching?
04:33<morgs_b>Encode, Internat: thanks for your help, ill sleep better tonight. TPG does do caching
04:33<Internat>tpg's proxies suck some major balls
04:33<morgs_b>Internat: indeed
04:34<Internat>like theres standard ball sucking.. and there there is tpg
04:34<encode>Internat: giant chocolate coated hairy monkey balls?
04:34<morgs_b>I concur
04:34<morgs_b>Its awesome, if thats your thing
04:34<Internat>about 90% of the time that i get a connection refused error, pressing refresh fixes it.. of the remaining 10%, 9% of the time if i proxy via my linode it works fine.
04:35<encode>what about the other 9.1% of the time?
04:35<dev>isp sucks
04:35<morgs_b>Internat: OMG yes! I should look into proxying from Linode; is there an easy way to do this on the box im on (I have admin access :) )
04:36<dev>yes it is
04:36<dev>squid proxy
04:36<Internat>the easiest way i found was to ssh tunnel, and run tinyproxy on myt linode
04:36<dev>or ssh tunnel..
04:37<Internat>encode: smartarse.
04:37<irgeek>morgs_b: An ssh tunnel to tinyproxy is what I use to do banking from non-US IPs.
04:37<encode>Internat: always
04:38<irgeek>My stupid bank locks out your account if you try to log in from somewhere they don't like.
04:38<Internat>i use the ssh tunnel at work as well. when i dont want people knowing what im doing :)
04:38<morgs_b>irgeek: like the US!? Thats heavy
04:38<morgs_b>irgeek: who wouldnt like the US!? ;)
04:38<Internat>he said non-us.
04:38<irgeek>The bank is in the US. They don't like the rest of the world.
04:39<morgs_b>irgeek: oh, of crs, naturally
04:39<encode>Internat: i believe the feelin is mutual
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04:49<morgs_b>I installed squid but methinks my last 6 hrs of net cafe diet; snickers and powerade, has taken its toll. I'll setup when back on my connection tomorrow - useless doing any kind of dev with TPG caching
04:51<morgs_b>Internat: before sign off - with - can u pls confirm your NOT seeing any 'Argyle' content?
04:51<irgeek>I would hope that whoever is cacheing the site would expire it by tomorrow. I don't think people would be too happy if they had to see the same headline page every day.
04:52<Internat>im seeing st george community stuff :)
04:53<morgs_b>irgeek: can xen instances be easily transferred away/managed on Linode? &/or integrated with : ?
04:53<morgs_b>Internat: thanks mate
04:56<irgeek>morgs_b: Uh. Maybe. You could probably rsync they file structure and it should work as long as Xen is similarly configured. You may be able to transfer the whole disk image too if the other Xen knows how to read them.
04:56<Internat>i have not a clue what is.
04:57<morgs_b>xen management console, have a squiz
04:57<irgeek>Internat: OSS version of EC2 is what it looks like it wants to be.
04:57<Internat>i dont know what EC2 is either..
04:57<morgs_b>irgeek: that wld be a stretch, simply can integrate with EC2
04:57<irgeek>Amazon Elastic Compute Clound
04:58<irgeek>Cloud even
04:58<Internat>is that you have "resources" available to use in the web cloud somewhere?
04:58<morgs_b>me? no exploring for future
04:59<morgs_b>with EC2 it can be *hypothetically* seamless
04:59<morgs_b>only pay for what you use
04:59-!-arooni-mobile [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
05:00<morgs_b>SpaceHobo: its so hot right now
05:00<irgeek>SpaceHobo: You've never met my underpants I see.
05:01<morgs_b>irgeek: re; Xen disk image - thats what I was getting at, ta.
05:02<morgs_b>SpaceHobo: there's a reason we wear budgie smugglers down here
05:04<morgs_b>irgeek, Internat, dev, encode: signing off - thanks for all your help
05:05<morgs_b>SpaceHobo: think eurotrash / dame edna in budgie smugglers; Sydney in summer
05:05<morgs_b>till next
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05:13-!-klono [~pin@] has quit []
05:13<Internat>the dame enda thing
05:14<Internat>who knows
05:14<Internat>ah no
05:14<Internat>thank you for the offer though
05:14*linbot dispenses a sixpack
05:15<Internat>ok. who wants to write a rewrite rule for me?
05:16<irgeek>A rewrite rule to rewrite what?
05:21<tozz>long live lighttpd and the configuration format!
05:23<irgeek>s/format/nightmare/ <-- Fixed that for you
05:23<tozz>well compared to apache I find it to be a fresh breeze :p
05:26<irgeek>Having cut my teeth on sendmail config files, I thought Apache had the greatest config file format ever.
05:26<Internat>to rewrite (in vhost * to
05:29<irgeek>Why not just use a redirect?
05:29<irgeek>Actually, you have to.
05:29<encode>yeah, use a permanent redirect
05:30<irgeek>You can't rewrite http to https
05:30<encode>301 i think it is
05:30<Internat>yeah i want to do a perm redirect
05:30<Internat>dont i have to use mod_rewrite to do that?
05:31<Internat>Redirect permanent <== or will that work
05:31<Internat>if that is being put in the * vhost
05:31<encode>redirectMatch 301 ^(.*)$
05:32<encode>in .htaccess
05:32<encode>theres probably another way of doing it
05:32<encode>that doesnt involve .htaccess
05:32<Internat>well i cant use what u just gave me
05:33<Internat>since that will redirect everything
05:33<Internat>remember the vhost is servername serveralias *
05:33<encode>you could if it sat in a directory that you had a vhost for for
05:34<irgeek>Internat: You need to match in the webmail part and redirect everything under that.
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05:38<irgeek>$HTTP["host"] =~ "^" { url.redirect = ( ".*" => "" ) }
05:38<irgeek>I think that should work.
05:39<Internat>what the hell is that? :P that goes in the domain.conf for apache?
05:40<Internat>ive never seem a redirect like that in apache..
05:41<irgeek>I thought you were on lighttpd... An yeah, Apache is different. Hang on...
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05:43<irgeek>In a separate VirtualHost put "ServerName" and "Redirect permanent / https://etc/"
05:44<irgeek>That's how I do them.
05:44<Internat>yeah i didnt want to do that, because the only way for that to work is for that to be loaded before the * one. and thats not possible since the * is the default..
05:47<encode>so if you use my version, and change the regexp
05:48<encode>redirectMatch 301 ^
05:48<encode>might do the trcik
05:48<encode>im not exactly sure how regexps work in this context
05:48<encode>or rather, what gets passed to the rule for it to match against
05:49<irgeek>Um, if * is the default and doesn't match because of it, no other name would either so you're stuck with one site that you can reference by any name.
05:49<encode>you'd have to put that in .htaccess in *'s folder
05:49<Internat>wait what?
05:49<encode>oh yeah, good point
05:49<Internat>that makes no sesne
05:49<encode>sure it does
05:49<encode>if apache matches * to your default site
05:50<encode>then you can't use any subdomains at all
05:50<irgeek>But a specific ServerName should match no matter where it is in the config file.
05:50<encode>because they'll all load your default site
05:50<Internat>im not talking about other subdomains
05:50<Internat>the reason it needs to be default is so that if someone goes to any of the billions of addresses that resolve to that server, and arent an actual vhost, they get that one
05:51<Internat>if is the default, then everyone is going to get sent to the webmail login
05:52<irgeek>Internat: For that to work though, it doesn't have to be *
05:53<irgeek>As long as it's first it will do what it does now, but without fscking up the redirect.
05:54-!-exor|zzz is now known as exor674
05:55<Internat>so make a standard one, then a, then a * for the other random crap that happens?
05:56<encode>and prefix the link in sites-enabled for with 000 or something so that it always gets loaded first by apache
05:56<irgeek>You don't need the * unless you want to have a different default page than
05:57<Internat>well i do have a rewrite rule somewhere down the path that has * redirecting to*
05:57<Internat>so redirects to
05:58<Internat>but ok, it seems that is my best option so ill work on that :)
05:58<irgeek>You can do that inside the VirtaulHost too.
05:58<Internat>well no i cant. cause for that to work, it needs to be *
05:59<irgeek>No it doesn't. As long as it's first, the VirtualHost will be served for
05:59<irgeek>You'd need a different redirect rule, but it's still doable.
05:59<Internat>ah ok, i get what your saying
06:00<irgeek>Also, if I were bob, the redirect to would annoy me.
06:00<irgeek>Just saying.
06:02<Internat>yeah that redirect can probably go away now..
06:02<Internat>it was useful at the time
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06:04<Internat>oh fuck me. After all of that, i just looked at the file, and realised i disabled the * mapping about 3 months ago :(
06:05*Internat cries
06:09<@jadoba>Internat: congratulations on figuring out the issue and completing your task
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06:09<Internat>do i get the idiot of the week award
06:09<idangazit>Hi all
06:09<@jadoba>no, you get something better
06:09<@jadoba>... you live on to complete the next task!
06:09<@jadoba>hi idangazit
06:09<idangazit>how do I know whether or not my linode is on a xen host or UML?
06:10<Internat>god dammit
06:10<@jadoba>idangazit: do this: cat /proc/cpuinfo
06:10<idangazit>ah, UML
06:10<@jadoba>if it shows four cores, you are on xen. if it only shows one, you are on UML
06:10<@jadoba>er, ok
06:11<idangazit>well, it shows model name "UML" :)
06:11<irgeek>OJ did it!
06:11<idangazit>I think I'd like to move datacenters to newark anyways -- I guess at that time it would make sense to migrate to xen
06:12<irgeek>idangazit: At that time you would have to migrate to Xen.
06:12<irgeek>Newark doesn't have any UML hosts.
06:13<idangazit>irgeek: that's fine
06:13<idangazit>xen is supposedly better anyways
06:14<idangazit>and really what I want is to be closer to the machine, topographically speaking
06:16<irgeek>idangazit: If any of you disk images have 1k blocks, you may want to migrate to 4k blocks first. There is a very rare but potentially bad bug with 1k block size images.
06:16<Internat>yeah i still need to address that issue
06:18<idangazit>irgeek: I've just installed a fresh image, at worst can start over, I've got nothing to lose (old image left intact)
06:19<irgeek>Oh. If you don't care about losing everything deleting your disk images before you move will be *much* faster. New disk images are created with 4k blocks now.
06:21<idangazit>nope, looks like I'm safe
06:22<Internat>i have to organise time soon to do a transition from 1k to 4k
06:22<idangazit>is it bad to mount an image with 1k block size?
06:22<idangazit>not as the boot volume
06:22<idangazit>my old server image, I left intact
06:23<idangazit>it has 1k blocks, but there's data I want to copy off of there before erasing it
06:23<Internat>Its a random bug that does things
06:24<irgeek>idangazit: It's potentially bad. Linode has been trying to track the bug down for months, but can reliably reproduce it.
06:24<irgeek>If you want to migrate a FS, it's pretty easy under Finnix.
06:24<Internat>yeah im hoping to con the Linode admins to do it for me :P
06:24<irgeek>And Linode will give you some temporary space to migrate to if you ask.
06:25<irgeek>Internat: Good luck with that.
06:25<Internat>or help :)
06:25<idangazit>irgeek: i.e. i can migrate an existing volume to 4k-blocks?
06:26<Internat>yeah cp with some options or something simular. i dont know the exact way to do it..
06:26<irgeek>idangazit: Sort of. You create a second volume that has 4k blocks and copy the files over at the filesystem level.
06:27<irgeek>As far as I'm aware, you can't turn a 1k image into a 4k image directly. You have to copy files over.
06:29<idangazit>irgeek: so just the process of converting is ... dangerous
06:29<idangazit>because I have to mount the 1k filesystem and CP everything over?
06:30<irgeek>You can convert it while you're still on UML and there won't be any danger.
06:31<encode>idangazit: nothing is dangerous, if you keep proper backups
06:32<irgeek>But the problem under Xen is also very rare and not always destructive. Some people just had their FS remount readonly, others had data corruption. I'm pretty sure you'd be safe mounting the FS readonly under Xen no matter what.
06:34<idangazit>ahhh -- readonly is fine :)
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06:36<idangazit>ah, there we go
06:36<idangazit>much nicer than web-based IRC
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07:11<Internat>ok im n00bing up ssl here.. is a .pem file basicly a combination of the signed CSR and the key?
07:14<irgeek>Cat the file. I think pem files are base64 encoded.
07:16<Internat>hmms suggestions on how to generate one then?
07:18<irgeek>!google openssl pem file howto
07:18<linbot>irgeek: Search took 0.23 seconds: OpenSSL Certificate Authority Setup: <>; OpenSSL Certificate HOWTO: <>; Pine+ OpenSSL HOWTO: <>; OpenSSL Command-Line HOWTO: <>; [win32] stunnel / OpenSSL / Synergy howto: (2 more messages)
07:18<irgeek>I think pem files can have different entities inside actually.
07:20<irgeek>What are you trying to figure out?
07:22<Internat>well. I have my csr which ive sent off. ive have my key. Im going to get back the signed cert soon, and i was looking over how my current selfsigned cert is setup in apache and postfix and courier, and its all using a .pem file that has everything in it.. public cert, and private key.. since i know i didnt send the private key to the CSR, i know the key that comes back isnt going to contain it, so im trying to work that out
07:22<mattt>you can create a pem using the key and cert returning from teh certificate authority
07:22<mattt>just concat the file yourself
07:23<Internat>we were just talking about that.. and irgeek thought that it was base64 encoded..
07:24<irgeek>Yeah. If they are both pem files (basically base64 encoded with delimiting headers) you should be able to cat them together without a problem.
07:25<Internat>err im thinking they are not both pem files..
07:25<Internat>well i have no way of really telling
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07:27<irgeek>You can convert files with openssl
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07:29<irgeek>Private key pem files start with -----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY-----
07:30<Internat>-----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY----- <== fantastic
07:31<irgeek>The next line probably looks like "Proc-Type: 4,ENCRYPTED"
07:31<Internat>goes straight into the key
07:31<HoopyCat>pah, i hate this place, coffee for employees only
07:31<irgeek>That's unencrypted then I think.
07:32-!-TheFirst [] has joined #linode
07:33<irgeek>You probably don't want it encrypted though because then you need to enter the password to open it every time you restart a service.
07:33<irgeek>But it should be readable only by root and in a directory only root has access to.
07:33<Internat>yeah ive done that
07:34<Internat>wont that stop services such as apache or courier or postfix starting since they dont run as root?
07:35<HoopyCat>Internat: they start as root, then become not-root after they do everything they need to do as root
07:35<Internat>good good
07:35<HoopyCat>(load keys, bind to low ports, send your ssh private keys to bulgaria, etc)
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07:40<Internat>irgeek: for the record though my current selfsigned ssl key is in pem format and i dont need a cert
07:40<irgeek>You do need a cert, but it's probably in a different file.
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07:41<irgeek>The file would start with -----BEGIN CERTIFICATE-----
07:41<Internat>hello serveru38..
07:41<serveru38>I have a problem
07:41<serveru38>with my linode
07:41<serveru38>I cannot login
07:42<Dave>into what? the linode itself? lish? the dashboard?
07:42-!-serveru3 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:42<serveru38>the website
07:42<serveru38>I just paid for the account
07:42<serveru38>and tried to login
07:42<serveru38>changed the password
07:42<Internat>your account has to be manually activated
07:42<serveru38>changed it again ..
07:42<serveru38>emailed the staff
07:42<Internat>ifyou just signed up. your probably still in limbo until it is activated
07:43<serveru38>I mean just signed up a week ago
07:43<serveru38>I wasted 7 days and I paid for them
07:43<Internat>Oh. In that case, you will need to wait for one of them..
07:43<serveru38>one of them?
07:43<Internat>no doubt they will sort out your issues
07:43<serveru38>who are them?
07:43<Internat>However i dont think they are awake yet
07:43<Dave>they will be here shortly if you hang around
07:43<Internat>the @
07:43<Dave>mike is
07:44<serveru38>well ... I could call but I don't live in the states
07:44<serveru38>and I don't like international calls
07:44<serveru38>when will they show up
07:44<Dave>serveru38: just wait here
07:44<Internat>outside business hours. im not sure that they would answer :) If you wait a bit, theyw ill be in shortly
07:44<serveru38>for how long?
07:44<linbot>Internat: 07:44 AM, June 24, 2008
07:44<HoopyCat>you can call over SIP, but really, wait 'bout 45 minutes or so and they'll definitely be in the office
07:44<Dave>it varies, probably within the hour
07:44<serveru38>oh, ok
07:44<serveru38>so it's a timezone issue
07:44<serveru38>it's 14.44 here :)
07:44<Internat>yes :)
07:44<HoopyCat>unfortunately, new jersey bans IRC while driving a motor vehicle
07:44<Internat>its only 7:45 am at the moment :)
07:45<HoopyCat>you can't even pump your own gas there, really.
07:45<Internat>well where they are it is. Its 21:45 my time
07:45<serveru38>what was that about new jersey?
07:45<Internat>thats where the team is
07:47<irgeek>serveru38: Did you not get a third email when you signed up? The first email is the email address conformation, the second is the payment receipt and the comes after activation.
07:47<HoopyCat>serveru38: anyywaay... so you deployed an image, booted it, and the dashboard says it's running but you can't ssh into it?
07:47*HoopyCat tries to figure out the exact point of brokedness
07:47<irgeek>HoopyCat: He said he can't log into the website.
07:48<irgeek>serveru38: Have you ever gotten logged into the web site? Or did it stop working after you'd been able to log in?
07:48<HoopyCat>irgeek: that might do it. :-)
07:48<HoopyCat>*loads coffee into syringe*
07:49<serveru38>so ..
07:49<serveru38>I never logged i
07:49<serveru38>I have another linode and it works ok, I installed OS on it and 3 websites
07:49<serveru38>but with this second one ..
07:49-!-serveru38 [~serveru3@] has quit [Quit: serveru38]
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07:50<mwalling>did you add a linode to an existing account?
07:50<irgeek>Did you file a ticket?
07:50<Internat>you have two linodes?
07:50<Internat>are they on the samea ccount?
07:51<serveru3>2 separate accounts
07:51<serveru3>2 emails
07:51<serveru3>2 everything
07:51<mwalling>same CC?
07:51<irgeek>Is there a reason the second one is a different account?
07:51<serveru3>same CC
07:51<serveru3>I have 2 separate business partners
07:52<serveru3>and I need to have different passwords
07:52<mwalling>you can do that now
07:52<irgeek>You can have multiple users.
07:52<Internat>not two seperate bills?
07:52<irgeek>Under one account.
07:52<serveru3>yeah, well.. I already paid for the second one
07:52<serveru3>it's created
07:52<serveru3>I can reset the password
07:52<serveru3>but when I use it .. it doesn't work
07:53<irgeek>What doesn't work exactly?
07:53<serveru3>my keyboard is ok..
07:53<irgeek>Details help us a lot more than vague statements.
07:53<serveru3>-- Login incorrect or session timed-out --
07:53<serveru3>when I write my username and passwor
07:53<serveru3>I said, ok, let's reset the password
07:53<serveru3>I did reset the password
07:53<serveru3>entered the new password ..
07:53<serveru3>same error: -- Login incorrect or session timed-out --
07:54<serveru3>changed browsers, changed computers
07:54<serveru3>the same
07:54<irgeek>Everyone I've seen who can rest the password but not log in is waiting for activation.
07:54<serveru3>deleted cookies
07:54<serveru3>so they need to activate it..
07:54<serveru3>why isn't this automated
07:54<mwalling>it isd
07:54<Internat>manual activation prevents spammers :)
07:54<mwalling>if you're an existing customer
07:54<irgeek>Fraud protection.
07:54<serveru3>what spammers?
07:54<mwalling>you appear as a new customer
07:54<serveru3>I already have 1 activated
07:54<serveru3>oh..yeah ..
07:54<Internat>if you sign up via an existing account you dont have to go through activation
07:54<serveru3>my bad
07:55<serveru3>ok, not automated but 1 week?
07:55<linbot>New news from forums: How to setup a scheduled task in Ubuntu in Linux Tips, Tricks, Tutorials <>
07:55<irgeek>mwalling: It is if you're an existing customer who adds a Linode to their account.
07:55<mwalling>irgeek: thats what i just said.....
07:55<irgeek>I was slow.
07:55<HoopyCat>it should normally be closer to "minutes" than "weeks", so i suspect there might be additional oddness
07:56<serveru3>ok, so at 8 am new jersey time they open the office
07:56<irgeek>serveru3: Yes.
07:56<Internat>8-9 somewhere arround there :)
07:56<mwalling>something around there
07:56<mwalling>Internat: 10 if your caker
07:56<serveru3>man.. and they will have cofee ..
07:56<serveru3>and cookies and breakfast
07:56<irgeek>Since you already have a Linode you can also file a ticket which will likely get noticed before an email.
07:56<Internat>thats true, a ticket will page them..
07:56<serveru3>interesting view
07:57<HoopyCat>serveru3: what're you bitchin' about? sure, i have coffee and breakfast, but you've had hours upon hours of time to wake up naturally :-)
07:58*HoopyCat works through a bowl of Gorean Crunch
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07:59<serveru3>HoopyCat, are you from staff?
07:59<mwalling>serveru3: the ops are.
07:59<HoopyCat>serveru3: nope! the lack of @ is a sure indicator that i'm just here for the free beer.
07:59<serveru3>"bitchin" is not exactly business language.
08:00<mwalling>this is a community channel.
08:00<serveru3>yeah, thought so
08:00<serveru3>@Hoopy: I was joking with the coffee
08:00<irgeek>Hence "Linode Community Support" in the /topic
08:00<mwalling>irgeek: hey, thats not business like! the customer is always right!
08:01<irgeek>Yeah. Me.
08:01<serveru3>not always:
08:01<Internat>i didnt know about that site
08:01<Internat>*goes looking*
08:01<serveru3>it's quite nice
08:02<HoopyCat>serveru3: it's all good. :-) (btw, mikegrb isn't actually alive yet; he just has an autoresponder on particular sequences of characters.)
08:03<irgeek>!cacl (64 * 30000000) kilobytes in gigabytes
08:03<irgeek>!calc (64 * 30000000) kilobytes in gigabytes
08:03<linbot>irgeek: (64 * 30,000,000) * kilobytes = 1,831.05469 gigabytes
08:05<irgeek>Looks like we have a long way to go before the average computer has more memory that every C64 ever sold combined.
08:05<mwalling>no, the other C64
08:06<serveru3>commodore 64
08:06<HoopyCat>centaur 64
08:08-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
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08:10<straterra>my transfer from dallas to newark has stalled
08:10<HoopyCat>my mom has not quite yet grasped the differences between kilo, mega, and gigabytes, nor between RAM and storage
08:11<straterra>been taking 3 hours to transfer my swap file heh
08:11<HoopyCat>forget relativistic compensation breakdown; terabyte RAM would cause nomenclature breakdown
08:12<irgeek>straterra: Did you shut down first?
08:12<straterra>you..have to shut down first to even migrate
08:12*linbot dispenses coffee
08:12<linbot>mwalling: SSH /SCP/ SFTP logging [Archive] - Ubuntu Forums: <>; RE: [sentinix-list] ssh and sftp access: msg#00029: <>; Learn Security Online - SSH -SCP- SFTP Cheat Sheet: <>; net- ssh -0.1.0.gem: (2 more messages)
08:12-!-binel_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:13<mwalling>*blink* i wanted more COFEFEE Damnint
08:13-!-TheFirst [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:13<irgeek>!calc 2^64 bytes in gigabytes
08:13<linbot>irgeek: (2^64) bytes = 17,179,869,184 gigabytes
08:13*HoopyCat looks in his coffee cup, and notices an sftp log
08:13<straterra>none of the admins are awake, i imagine
08:13<HoopyCat>straterra: not yet; any minute now, we're figuring.
08:13<straterra>i hope so
08:13<straterra>My window of downtime is uhm..approaching fast
08:14<HoopyCat>marshallin' the mornin' rush
08:15<irgeek>Paging caker, mikegrb, tasaro & jadoba - you're wanted in aisle 10.
08:15<straterra>am i isle 10?
08:15*straterra throws a jar of pickles on the ground
08:15<HoopyCat>naw, you're the cleanup in 13
08:15<irgeek>No man is an island.
08:15<StevenK>Or an isle?
08:15<straterra>i duno..
08:16<straterra>ive seen people large enough to be an island
08:16<straterra>large enough to put the uk to shame :P
08:16<Internat>serveru3 i blame you for this
08:16<straterra>we must move them...
08:17<straterra>soon their mass will make the edges of the US curl upwards
08:17<straterra>and the US will look like a huge bowl...which will further increase eating!
08:17<zeroday>this cant be right....yum update seems to be trying to install everything again o.o
08:17<@tasaro>straterra: didn't read all the scroll back, but it looks like your migration is fine?
08:18<HoopyCat>there was a... rather bariatric gentleman on a scooter on the sidewalk in front of the hospital yesterday. this isn't that unusual, 'cept it looked like he just conned a young girl out of a piece of candy
08:18<irgeek>straterra: That will be a good thing when the ice caps melt and sea level rises.
08:18<HoopyCat>that was amusing and disturbing all at the same time
08:18<straterra>tasaro: on my dashboard...swap is still pending
08:18<zeroday>anyone have an idea why it would try that?
08:18<straterra>its like 30 percent through...and just sitting there with the status 'waiting on host'
08:18<HoopyCat>serveru3: *points at tasaro* :-)
08:19<@tasaro>straterra: 30% in the progress bar?
08:19<@tasaro>odd.. on my end it looks like: 65.0% done, 1:30:39 to go, 1.55 MB/s
08:19<serveru3>tasaro, the man for the job
08:20<straterra>its been transfering for almost 4 hours
08:20<irgeek>straterra: Maybe your bits got tired of driving across the country and stopped to get a snack.
08:20<straterra>lazy bits
08:20<@tasaro>Duration: 2:50:08
08:20<straterra>luckily its just swap
08:20<serveru3>tasaro, please look at support ticket 46401
08:20<straterra>tasaro: on my shows a start time of roughly 5 am
08:21<irgeek>straterra: Which was roughly 3 hours ago...
08:21<straterra>my 'almost' eas a stretch lol
08:21-!-Arnar [] has joined #linode
08:21<straterra>I thought it was closer to 9am than it is hehe
08:21<Arnar>hey there..
08:22<irgeek>straterra: Patience is a virtue.
08:22<irgeek>It's also boring.
08:22<Arnar>good <insert-part-of-day-in-your-timezone> to all
08:22<serveru3>Patience is not a virtue :)
08:22<straterra>over 3 hours for a 512mb swap file...
08:22<@tasaro>Looks like it's right on track to the estimate we gave in your ticket (~10 minutes per GB)
08:22<serveru3>Arnar, can I quote you on that
08:22<straterra>tasaro: its half a gig
08:22<Arnar>So.. i was wondering, after adding a CNAME record, how long should I have to wait
08:22<Arnar>serveru3: sure.. :)
08:23<@tasaro>straterra: it's 24GB
08:23<straterra>the root disk is already transfered...its the swap thats stalled
08:23<irgeek>Arnar: 15 minutes for the servers to reload the zone.
08:23<@tasaro>it hasn't started your swap image
08:23<straterra>uh..on my dashboard it says differently
08:23<@tasaro>let me look at this form your side.. one sec
08:23<Arnar>irgeek: ok.. I *think* it's been closer to 30
08:24<irgeek>Arnar: Was that name defined as something else before?
08:24<Arnar>irgeek: nope.. new record
08:24<irgeek>What's the name?
08:24<Arnar>irgeek: "last modified 12:47"
08:24<irgeek>It's resolving.
08:25<Arnar>not from my linode box and not from my desk :/
08:25<irgeek>You may be behind a server that's cached the negative response.
08:25<@tasaro>straterra: I'm looking at your dashboard now and it refelcts what I was seeing
08:25<@tasaro>the last three jobs in your queue:
08:25<Arnar>irgeek: ok.. doesn't that have a shorter TTL than a positive one in general?
08:25<@mikegrb>straterra: can you screen shot the dashboard so I can see the state it is in
08:25<@tasaro>JobID: 591809 - Linode Initial Configuration / Status Success
08:26<irgeek>In general, yes.
08:26<straterra>in a second...i have to shower...running late for work
08:26<irgeek>But not all nameservers do it properly.
08:26<@tasaro>JobID: 591810 - Migrate Filesystem - Root Disk from / Status In Progress / Host Message 68.3% done, 1:21:46 to go, 1.56 MB/s
08:26<Arnar>irgeek: ok.. fair enough. my linode is using - is that one of yours?
08:26<@tasaro>JobID: 591811 - Migrate Filesystem - Swap Disk from / Status In Queue
08:26<StevenK>From Dallas to Newark?
08:27<irgeek>Arnar: I don't work for Linode. ;)
08:27*StevenK guesses
08:27<Arnar>irgeek: and shouldn't it say "non-authoritative" if it's responding from chache
08:27<Arnar>irgeek: oh.. sorry, I assumed since you always answer my questions :)
08:28<HoopyCat>your negative caching ttl is set to... 86400 seconds
08:28<irgeek>!calc 86400 seconds in hours
08:28<linbot>irgeek: 86,400 seconds = 24 hours
08:28<Arnar>HoopyCat: 24h? is that normal for negative
08:29<irgeek>It's certainly not abnormal.
08:29<HoopyCat>Arnar: it's the default; i normally stick with that unless i know i'm going to be doing something interesting
08:29<Arnar>HoopyCat: you can see that with dig?
08:30<Arnar>I see
08:30<HoopyCat>Arnar: host -t soa
08:31<Arnar>HoopyCat: thanks
08:31<HoopyCat>you can get the same info with dig, but i learned host :-)
08:31<zeroday>anyone here running centos?
08:31-!-linville [] has joined #linode
08:31<HoopyCat>zeroday: yepslanti. 4.6.
08:32<zeroday>HoopyCat: does yum update give you anything similar to my paste?
08:32<irgeek>dig soa <-- less typing \o/
08:32-!-dpn` [~tripped@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:32<zeroday>apparently yum is trying to update to 5.2
08:32<Arnar>HoopyCat, irgeek: so my mistake was to lookup the name before the dns was generated? :)
08:32<zeroday>update centos to 5.2
08:32<irgeek>Cross-reference that soa record to
08:32<Arnar>tainting my caches
08:32<irgeek>Arnar: Yes.
08:32<Arnar>serves me right I guess
08:32<HoopyCat>Arnar: yep. :-) i love DNS.
08:33<irgeek>You can use: dig
08:33<HoopyCat>zeroday: i just ran yum update and only got one update from an unofficial repo; nothing crazy
08:33<irgeek>That will ask the linode server correctly so you don't pollute your cache.
08:35<zeroday>I'm not gonna run the update, if it's still there after a day or two, I'll do it
08:35<HoopyCat>zeroday: i think there's a function in there to clear caches and/or get a fresh copy of the whatevers from the repos
08:37<Arnar>hmm.. in the linode DNS manager.. "default TTL" - does that represent the min field of the SOA record?
08:37<HoopyCat>Arnar: i believe the same setting is used for both that and the default positive TTL
08:38<zeroday>according to the centos freenode chan, its an update to 5.2
08:38<Arnar>HoopyCat: ok.. so I can't lower the min field (used for the negative ttl) without changing the default ttl for positives
08:38<HoopyCat>Arnar: correct; however, you could change the individual records to not use the default TTL
08:39-!-xitology [] has joined #linode
08:39<Arnar>but having seperate settings would make sense I guess, I'd assume people generally want lower TTL for negatives
08:39<Arnar>perhaps I'll submit a ticket
08:40<irgeek>Arnar: Negative TTLs only matter if you're impatient. :)
08:40<Arnar>irgeek: true :)
08:40<irgeek>Just query the server directly to see if the zone reloaded.
08:41<serveru3>ok, brand new linode
08:41<serveru3>any images advice?
08:42<Arnar>irgeek: well.. my main concern today is that my school dns server is now caching the negative result, so I can't distribute the url to my colleagues until tomorrow :)
08:42<HoopyCat>serveru3: are you trying to incite a distribution flamewar? :-)
08:42<irgeek>Arnar: Changing the TTL isn't going to fix that.
08:42<Arnar>irgeek: of course.. lowering the TTL won't change my situtation today though
08:42<Arnar>irgeek: i know
08:42<HoopyCat>serveru3: really, 'tis whatever you're comfortable with.
08:42<mwalling>Arnar: stab someone to flush the cache?
08:43<serveru3>I mean, any tips and tricks..
08:43<irgeek>^^^ A good suggestion
08:43<Arnar>mwalling: was just about to go for that :)
08:43<exor674>serveru3: I suggest you print out the distrib wizard page
08:43<serveru3>it will perform better if ..
08:43<exor674>tape it to a dartboard
08:43<exor674>and throw darts at it
08:43<exor674>you choose whatever distro you land in the checkbox of <_<
08:44<irgeek>serveru3: Do it the same as your other Linode so you don't have to have two setups in your head to figure out.
08:44*irgeek points out to caker that he used setup correctly
08:44<serveru3>good point
08:44<serveru3>I guess I'll be seeing you around
08:44<HoopyCat>serveru3: ah. swap isn't that important, remember that you can resize the disk images in the future so you don't have to go full-hog if you don't want to
08:44<HoopyCat>that's my advice. ;-)
08:45<serveru3>Hoopy, swap is what I'm talking about
08:45-!-mendel [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
08:45<exor674>the most I've ever caught my machine using as swap is ike 150 bytes
08:46<HoopyCat>serveru3: i tried running one of my linodes without swap and it oom'd at 4am
08:46*irgeek still only has a 128M swap image
08:46<HoopyCat>serveru3: so perhaps keep 256mb around just for good luck
08:46<exor674>yeah, better to have it then to not i think
08:46<serveru3>and how about 3 partitions?
08:47<serveru3>like in this article:
08:47<HoopyCat>i have / and /home on different partitions on my personal linode, but everything in one on the other one
08:47<irgeek>I have /home & /var partitions so I don't have to monkey with backing up and restoring data if I want to reload a different os.
08:48-!-dpn` [~tripped@] has joined #linode
08:48<irgeek>But I only do that on my sandbox Linode.
08:48<irgeek>The others I rebuild more carefully.
08:48<serveru3>so .. 3 partitions
08:49<HoopyCat>serveru3: /, /home, and swap? that's a decent enough way to go
08:49<irgeek>Not necessarily. You need to figure out how you're going to manage the system and where you're going to put things and go from there.
08:50<HoopyCat>yeah... my personal linode has gigs upon gigs under /home 'cuz that's where i keep the good stuff, but my other one has almost nothing because it's just a web server
08:52*StevenK has /, /var, /home and swap
08:53<HoopyCat>i used to split it up /, /home, /tmp, /usr, /var, but then i got lazy one day and haven't had reason to go back.
08:55<irgeek>I used to come up with intricate schemes for partitioning my Linode boxes, but over time I just couldn't be bothered anymore.
08:55<HoopyCat>in theory, having /tmp and /var/tmp on a small partition of their own is wise because it'll keep / from filling up due to a bad process. however, in my experience, if it's going to fill up /tmp with a bunch of crap, it'll be nice enough to put it somewhere other than /tmp thereby still filling up /.
08:56*mwalling moves /srv/www/ under /home
08:56<irgeek>HoopyCat: It does keep a mailbomb attack from taking down the mail server, but Postfix has precautions against those now anyway.
08:56-!-serveru3 [~serveru3@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:57<HoopyCat>irgeek: if the system suddenly runs out of disk or memory, i'm a firm believer that Something Oughta Break to attract human attention :-)
08:58<irgeek>That's quite true.
08:58*HoopyCat <3 panic-on-oom
08:59<HoopyCat>holy goats, 9am. bbl, shower then class
09:08<straterra>I just have one big /
09:10<mwalling>yes, we know you think you're big
09:10<straterra>No think about it, nugga
09:14<mwalling>right, all imagination
09:24<path->mwalling, good news
09:24<path->delaware is buying 150 wind turbines
09:26-!-blithe_ is now known as blithe
09:27-!-jm [] has joined #linode
09:28<irgeek>$20 says a boat runs into one and disables it in the first year.
09:31<path->well, i don't think it's in shipping channels
09:32<irgeek>Like that matters. Drunken yahoos don't last long in shipping channels either.
09:34-!-Mojo1978 [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:35-!-BubbleWrap [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:36<path->you know the reason i mentioned this was because i thought they were planning to use GE's turbines
09:36<path->i don't see any technical stuff on the bluewind site anymroe
09:37-!-BubbleWrap [] has joined #linode
09:41<linbot>Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0 , Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0 , Atlanta360 - 0, Atlanta540 - 0, Atlanta720 - 0, Atlanta1080 - 0, Atlanta1440 - 0, Atlanta2880 - 0 , Newark360 - 9, Newark540 - 25, Newark720 - 15, Newark1080 - 2, Newark1440 - 1, Newark2880 - 1
09:45-!-Isvara [] has joined #linode
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09:59<straterra>There isnt anyway to check how much longer a disk resize is going to take, is there?
09:59<path->i've heard it just sits at 50% for awhile and you just wait
09:59<straterra>That's what I'm doing atm
10:00<@caker>it waits until you ask how long it takes. Then it finshes 3 minutes after that
10:00<mwalling>thats what linbot is *really* here for
10:00*caker throws subversion away
10:00<@caker>MERGE PAIN
10:00<mwalling>the !avail commands are a curtosy
10:00<straterra>git ftw
10:01<mwalling>caker: new SVN has merge stuff in it
10:01<irgeek>New Subversion merge stuff still sucks.
10:01<StevenK>caker: Merges can be automated in SVN. You just need to do them in wetware.
10:01<irgeek>Git, on the other hand, just does them smartly anyway.
10:03<mwalling>irgeek: sucks less, still sucks
10:04<mwalling>plus, the win32 support for svn is better then git
10:04*StevenK doesn't like git much
10:04*Bdragon waves a small monotone flag
10:06<irgeek>Git's Windows support is lacking, I'll admit. But I don't use Windows unless absolutely necessary so that doesn't bother me much. :)
10:06-!-Schroeder [] has joined #linode
10:06<mwalling>you dont work for $employer either
10:07*irgeek <-- my current employer :)
10:09-!-BubbleWrap is now known as nick
10:09-!-nick is now known as BubbleWrap
10:10*irgeek slaps everyone with a dirty diaper for getting that song stuck in my head
10:10-!-BubbleWrap is now known as nick
10:10-!-nick is now known as BubbleWrap
10:10-!-l0uis_ [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
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10:11<scorche>BubbleWrap/nick: identity crisis over there?
10:12<path->mirc--; irssi++
10:12<BubbleWrap>yes, srry
10:13<BubbleWrap>um guys
10:13-!-mendel [] has joined #linode
10:13<scorche>path-: jerk!
10:13<BubbleWrap>for some reason one of my IPs isnt asgined to my linode
10:13<BubbleWrap>it says its there, but its not pointing to it :x
10:13<irgeek>Did you reboot since you added it?
10:13<scorche>so you....change names?
10:14<BubbleWrap>no :$
10:14<BubbleWrap>reboot the whole linode?
10:14<BubbleWrap>thanks irgeek
10:15<Bdragon>A) you gotta reboot after adding an IP. B) You will probabaly have to do some extra configuration, I don't think dhcp will assign both addresses
10:15<Bdragon>There's probabaly a nice writeup on the wiki about the specifics...
10:15<BubbleWrap>o rlly?
10:15<BubbleWrap>ill go check it out then..
10:17<irgeek>BubbleWrap: Ubuntu?
10:17<BubbleWrap>irgeek, yes.
10:17<BubbleWrap>irgeek, yes.
10:18<BubbleWrap>my remotes are wacked, sry about the double typing..give me a second to fix that.
10:18<BubbleWrap>my remotes are wacked, sry about the double typing..give me a second to fix that.
10:18<irgeek>Add this to /etc/network/interfaces:
10:18<Isvara>caker: What are you throwing svn away in favour of?
10:18<irgeek>BubbleWrap: And change the auto line to: auto eth0 eth0:1
10:18<Isvara>Mercurial ftw!
10:18<irgeek>Then restart networking.
10:19*path- gives BubbleWrap new batteries for his remote
10:20<BubbleWrap>there, its fixed I think :$
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10:31<RossH>good morning
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10:45<Solver_>hi all
10:45-!-Solver_ is now known as Solver
10:45<Solver>so I know I can buy extra IPs from linode
10:45<Solver>is there a limit to how many I may buy?
10:46<irgeek>2 total per Linode
10:46<Solver>ok cool thanks
10:46<irgeek>Otherwise you need a justification.
10:46<Solver>ah cool.
10:46<CaptObviousman>can my justification be "I want them"?
10:46<Solver>well my justification would be I would be using that many :)
10:46<bd_>CaptObviousman: It can, but your request will likely be denied.
10:46<Solver>8 that is (wouldn't need to be a /29)
10:47<CaptObviousman>how about "I'm hosting multiple ssl-authenticated sites"
10:47<bd_>CaptObviousman: that works
10:47*Solver is just sizing up options
10:47*CaptObviousman takes notes
10:47<irgeek>Solver: There has to be a reason you can't run services on alternative ports.
10:48<bd_>note that theoretically these rules apply equally to all hosts everywhere... but some try to get away with a looser reading of the rules :)
10:48<bd_>also free /64s from ipv6 tunnel brokers! act now!
10:48<Solver>DNS SRV records will rock
10:48<bd_>Solver: good luck getting people to implement them :|
10:48<Solver>yes IPv6 would make this discussion moot :)
10:49<Solver>bd_: I think it'll happene eventually but it'll be years yet
10:49<Solver>sure would make my life simpler :)
10:49<bd_>someone needs to get them in firefox for starters :/
10:49<Solver>yeah it'd be a good start
10:50<irgeek>Solver: The IPv4 space will run out in about 940 days. That's not many years.
10:50*bd_ -> afk
10:50<Solver>irgeek: where did you get that number from?
10:51-!-Deetz [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
10:51<Solver>cool thanks
10:52<Solver>irgeek: actually my reference to years was re DNS SRV records anyway :)
10:52<Solver>but yeah IPv6 adoption is pretty pressing too :)
10:52<irgeek>That number does not account for the IPv4 landrush that will probably happen in about a year, so it's probably optimistic.
10:52<Solver>interesting discussions on NANOG about the amazon EC2 cloud
10:52<Solver>irgeek: why are you suggesting a landrush - hoarding?
10:53<irgeek>People will try, you can bet on that.
10:53<Solver>oh for sure
10:53<Solver>still IPv6 adoption has been slow. maybe this will speed it up
10:57<irgeek>The biggest problem is going to be home computers I think. Especially in the not-guite-so-developed world.
10:58<avongauss>you might be right, but based on adoption so far, I still think the USA will be the last to fully switch over.
11:00*cruxeternus speculates and bids the price of IPv4 addresses up to $200/barrel.
11:00<avongauss>cruxeternus's speculations are probably why oil prices went up so high... ;)
11:01-!-xitology [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
11:01<path->i've heard that you can get native ipv6 from comcast business and verizon business units
11:01<cruxeternus>I wonder if we can drill our way out of the IPv4 shortage.
11:01<irgeek>avongauss: Ya think?
11:01<path->but i can't find any info for residential
11:02<avongauss>I haven't heard of Comcast offering IPv6 for residential yet, supposedly with DocSIS 3.0, but no word from the MN test market yet.
11:03<avongauss>even if all ISPs enabled IPv6 today, with Windows XP not using it by default, it would still take a while to adopt.
11:04-!-JasonF_ is now known as JasonF
11:04<JasonF>Someone said something offhandedly good aboutVista
11:05<avongauss>Vista does enable IPv6 use by default, there I said something good.
11:05<avongauss>but it does have some quirks if you go roaming, such as remembering old addresses.
11:09<irgeek>Did they only test it with tunnels that keep the same address or something? How do they keep getting so many things completely wrong?
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11:10<Isvara>irgeek: It's internal subterfuge by the Apple fans in MS.
11:10<irgeek>There's a picture I saw a few weeks back of a developer meeting at MS. There were more MacBooks on the table than PCs. :)
11:11<Isvara>MacBooks can run Windows!
11:11<irgeek>Yeah. But they also run that other, better OS. :D
11:12<@jadoba>sorry to break this to you, folks, but apple is a hardware company
11:12<Isvara>irgeek: It's research
11:12<Isvara>jadoba: Apple make hardware? Who knew!
11:12<straterra>Overpriced hardware
11:12<irgeek>straterra: Not it isn't.
11:13<Isvara>Not especially.
11:13<irgeek>It's not.
11:13<straterra>It really is
11:13<mwalling>straterra: you bought one!
11:13<straterra>I know
11:13<straterra>Thats how I know
11:13<straterra>Let me put it this way..
11:13<Isvara>Compare an iMac to something like a Dell of the same spec. There's not much difference.
11:13<straterra>Friend of mine got a better laptop for half the price of my Macbook Pro
11:14<@jadoba>Isvara: dell makes AIO machines?
11:14<irgeek>straterra: Your friend of mine got a laptop for half the price of my Macbook Pro
11:14*BubbleWrap sighs
11:14<irgeek>It was not better for half the price.
11:14<straterra>Yes, it was
11:14<Isvara>jadoba: AIO? I presume you're not talking about async i/o, so what's AIO?
11:14<irgeek>Seriously. If you believe that you haven't compared prices.
11:14<straterra>Exact same specs + better resolution screen for half the price
11:15<straterra>irgeek: I SAW the receipts
11:15<@jadoba>display/machine in same form factor
11:15<irgeek>straterra: I believe it was half the price, I do not believe it had better specs.
11:15<straterra>It had the same cpu/mem/video with a larger screen and higher res
11:15<straterra>Making it a better laptop
11:15<tjfontaine>I doubt the the form factor was the same, it was more than likely wedge shaped
11:15<avongauss>straterra: you will never convince him...
11:16<@jadoba>straterra: macbooks are pricey, they are not cheap. this is true. they cost a lot more than most laptops across the board, that is a fact.
11:16<straterra>jadoba: I know this
11:16<irgeek>straterra: What about the firewire, built-in camera, bluetooth, 802.11n etc..
11:16<@jadoba>straterra: saying that they are overly expensive is false
11:16<straterra>irgeek does not
11:16<straterra>irgeek: yes
11:16<@jadoba>straterra: irgeek knows that too
11:16<straterra>jadoba: I consider double the price "overly expensive"
11:16<tjfontaine>Hi, welcome to Linode.
11:16<straterra>But thats just me
11:17<iggy>backlit keyboard ftw!!!!
11:17<@jadoba>straterra: macbooks are priced very fairly
11:17<straterra>Macbook Pro
11:17<irgeek>Are too
11:17<@jadoba>straterra: ... yes and?
11:17<Battousai>what kinda laptop did your friend get?
11:17<straterra>Battousai: HP
11:17<irgeek>Look at *all* the specs an you will understand what we're talking about.
11:18<straterra>All the specs?
11:18<straterra>Lets see..
11:18<Isvara>Why do I get the feeling that "sucker" would have been the response whatever laptop he got?
11:18*Battousai also has hp
11:18<straterra>2.5GHZ C2D Penryn. Check
11:18<tjfontaine>Hi, welcome to #linode.
11:18<straterra>512MB 8600M GT. Check.
11:18<Battousai>Isvara: no, i'm not a mac fanboy
11:18<straterra>4 GB DDR2 667. Check.
11:18<straterra>802.11n. Check.
11:18<straterra>DVD burner. Check
11:18<Battousai>Terrible thermal design. Check
11:19<@jadoba>straterra: hdd space, rotational speed?
11:19<straterra>250 5400 on both
11:19<irgeek>Multi-touch trackpad - uncheck
11:19<straterra>Uhm..ok? So..a multi-touch trackpad is worth $1200?
11:19<irgeek>iLife Suite equivelent - uncheck
11:19<Battousai>synaptics can do that can't they?
11:20<Battousai>or uh... synapticses
11:20<Battousai>whatever the plural would be
11:20<iggy>backlit keyboard uncheck
11:20<irgeek>built in camera?
11:20<straterra>$1200 for backlit keyboard and multi touch trackpad..pathetic
11:20<straterra>irgeek: yes
11:20<Battousai>iggy likes him his lightup
11:20<path->bleh.. i got the $999 macbook with educational discount.. maxed out ram from for $100
11:20<mwalling>mac os?
11:20<iggy>Battousai: I do, I really do
11:20<mwalling>vs windows...
11:20<path->and it works great
11:20<straterra>ilife suite? that is offset by the software suite on the HP
11:20<irgeek>dvi out?
11:21<straterra>Yes, DVI out
11:21<@jadoba>straterra: so youre saying the HP and the macbook pro have the same exact specs?
11:21<straterra>Shit..his has HDMI!
11:21<straterra>Mine doesnt
11:21<straterra>jadoba: yes...thats my point
11:21<Battousai>what were you thinking?
11:21<Battousai>go steal his
11:21<irgeek>FireWire 400 & FireWire 800 & 2 USB & ExpressCard/34?
11:21<Battousai>the small macbook ditched fw800 right?
11:21<straterra>Yes, no, yes, yes
11:22<straterra>So..$1200 for a firewire 800 port, backlit keyboard and multi touch trackpad
11:22<Battousai>and ilife damnit
11:22<irgeek>What model is this?
11:22<straterra>I don't know..I don't have it sitting right infront ofm e
11:22<iggy>so, what you are saying is the differences between the two weren't worth the extra cost FOR YOU
11:23<straterra>iggy: No. I'm saying double the price for those features is excessive
11:23<iggy>those aren't the only features
11:23<Isvara>iMac is good value for money.
11:23<irgeek>I'm having trouble finding a laptop in HPs site with those specs.
11:23<Battousai>it's probably a special edition
11:23<Battousai>with the white chassis
11:23-!-sveiss [] has joined #linode
11:23<straterra>Business model
11:23<Battousai>or offwhite or whatever
11:24<Battousai>that's one hell of a business laptop
11:24<straterra> doesn't have a glowing apple!
11:24<irgeek>What size is the screen?
11:24-!-webPragmatist [] has joined #linode
11:24<straterra>Mine is 15"
11:24<@caker>mine is 3" .... FROM THE FLOOR
11:24<Isvara>You also don't get a Mac OS X license ;-)
11:24<straterra>And with the mac you don't get a vista license
11:25-!-bliblok [] has joined #linode
11:25<Battousai>and with an inspiron 1420N you get neither
11:25<path->that sounds like a feature
11:25<Isvara>Are you saying Mac OS and Vista are of equal worth? Yeesh!
11:25<@mikegrb>yes but the os x license is desired, the vista license not so much
11:25<straterra>Vista isn't that bad
11:25<Isvara>For real?
11:25<straterra>Atleast I can turn off the "Close lid makes computer go to sleep" option in Vista without 3rd party software/hacks
11:25<straterra>OSX doesn't do that
11:26<path->you want to close the lid and keep it running?
11:26<straterra> that I can maybe..listen to music without it open..
11:26<path->get an ipod
11:26<Battousai>i do that with my laptop all the time
11:26<Isvara>Buy an iPod!
11:26<straterra>$250 for overpriced mp3 player!
11:27<Battousai>with no fm tuner!!
11:27<Isvara>It's lovely, though ;-)
11:27<Isvara>And, to be fair, you get a lot more than an MP3 player.
11:27<Bdragon>It's the mcdonalds of mp3 players.
11:27<Battousai>i spotted one of those damn ipod vending machines at my local mall
11:27<straterra>Let me get this right..
11:28<straterra>My $2500 laptop can't be expected to have its lid closed and play mp3's?
11:28<straterra>That's...a bit crazy
11:28<@caker>it's meant to be open and free
11:28<Battousai>you cannot expect to close the lid, carry it to the other room, and have it not go into s3
11:28<straterra>Of course..why would I ever want CONTROL of my hardware?
11:28<@caker>wth .. I have to TELL my computer to sleep before I close the lid?
11:28<irgeek>straterra: The only HP 17" laptop I can find with 802.11n for less than $2,349.00
11:29*Bdragon has a Panasonic CF-51.
11:29<straterra>Sucks for you then
11:29<Battousai>what is it a scientific calculator?
11:29<irgeek>s/for less than/starts at/
11:29<Bdragon>Nah, a toughbook
11:29<straterra>I do know this was during an HP deal a little while back
11:29<path->laptop is just a remote keyboard and display for me
11:29<iggy>oh, now we get the truth
11:29<Bdragon>Not a fully rugged one or anything
11:30<path->if i want to listen to music, i'd rather use real speakers
11:30*cruxeternus drops Bdragon onto his laptop.
11:30<irgeek>I call bullshit!
11:30<path->if i want to watch tv, i'll use a real tv
11:30<Bdragon>I have an elderly gateway laptop with NO display (and no hard drive)
11:30-!-weasel [] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting]
11:30<straterra>and $2500 was without 4gb ram..and with employee discount
11:30-!-weasel [] has joined #linode
11:30<Bdragon>Just the.. other parts..
11:30<Bdragon>(fun with netbooting)
11:30<iggy>hooray for fair comparisons
11:30<straterra>path-: listen to music..with headphones
11:30<Battousai>freaking employee discounts
11:30<Battousai>you sound like a car dealer
11:31<straterra>student, not employee
11:31<straterra>$2500 for the MBP with 2GB ram and student discount
11:31<straterra>4gb was $100~
11:31<Isvara>What's the deal with HP employee discounts? Why don't you have to be an employee?
11:31<Battousai>2GB should be enough for anybody
11:32<straterra>Who said anything about HP employee discounts?
11:32<Isvara>I did.
11:32<mwalling>my desktop has 512 and it hums along fine.
11:32<Battousai>my laptop has 1GB and it sucks wind just to catch up
11:33*iggy is bored... goes back to looking for a job
11:36<path->straterra: headphones aren't loud enough for me
11:36<straterra>You need better headphones
11:36<straterra>or better ears :)
11:36<path->never buy ram from apple btw
11:37<straterra>I didnt
11:37<@mikegrb>path-: headphone amps ftw
11:37<path->they'll charge you like $700 for 4gb when you can get the same thing for $100
11:37<straterra>they lowered their pricing
11:37<path->and they even put directions on the case on how to add memory
11:37<straterra>its like $200 now
11:37-!-iFear [] has joined #linode
11:37<straterra>Still cheaper to go elsewhere and get it
11:37<BubbleWrap>is it working?
11:37<iFear>It's talking in black here =X
11:37<BubbleWrap>told you -.-
11:38<path->headphone amps?
11:38<iFear>do //echo -a $Network
11:39<BubbleWrap>how about now?
11:40-!-Fear [] has joined #linode
11:40<Fear>wtf lol
11:40<Fear>JasonF <--- That's my name irl lol
11:41<cruxeternus>Your parents named you JasonF? How odd.
11:41<Fear>Jason F.
11:41<BubbleWrap>Fear, is it working?
11:42<JasonF>Fear: nice name.
11:44<BubbleWrap>And every1 told me I was retarded...I told them it didnt work.
11:44<Fear>I got it to work on SwiftIRC
11:44<BubbleWrap>Right, but here is the problem..
11:45-!-Fear [] has quit []
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11:52*BubbleWrap sighs
11:52<BubbleWrap>MSL sucks
11:53<Karrde>one of us! one of us!
11:53<BubbleWrap>oh im so mad at it right now
11:54<BubbleWrap>I've been working on the same script for over an hour when its a 5 minute script..ive asked so many ppl for help, but no1 either understands me or their versions of it wont work :(
11:55<BubbleWrap>meh..i need a break*lunch-time*
11:56<linbot>Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0 , Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0 , Atlanta360 - 0, Atlanta540 - 1, Atlanta720 - 0, Atlanta1080 - 0, Atlanta1440 - 0, Atlanta2880 - 0 , Newark360 - 5, Newark540 - 24, Newark720 - 14, Newark1080 - 0, Newark1440 - 0, Newark2880 - 0
11:56-!-BubbleWrap [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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12:16<scorche|sh>BubbleWrap: perhaps no one understands you because you use words like "no1"?
12:20<Core2Duo>Buble Wrap, nice name. Now we need to have a person called "Twist Ties".
12:21<Core2Duo>what are these items listed by linbot? I see some negatives on the list. Are those waiting lists/back orders?
12:22<Core2Duo>oh, they are not...just dashes. Cos I just noticed the negative
12:22<Core2Duo>@mikegrb: u don't talk much, do you?
12:23<tjfontaine>@ is not required mmk
12:23<@jadoba>Core2Duo: this is not twitter
12:23<@jadoba>thank God!!!!
12:24<Core2Duo>there u go again
12:24<@jadoba>although if twitter were implemented in IRC, it wou;d quickly be swallowed up by freenode
12:24<Core2Duo>I have never seen more words from mikegrb than the now famous "lolz".
12:24<@mikegrb>mmm cake
12:24<@mikegrb>mmm cake
12:24<@jadoba>you should try his cake
12:24-!-pbryan [~pbryan@] has joined #linode
12:25<@mikegrb>mmm cake
12:25<pbryan>mmm cake
12:25<pbryan>mmm cake
12:25<Core2Duo>mikegrb: is a bot controlled by mwalling:
12:26<mwalling>mikegrb: shush mwalling
12:26-!-mode/#linode [+q mwalling!*@*] by mikegrb
12:27-!-mode/#linode [-q mwalling!*@*] by mikegrb
12:27<mwalling>dman bot lag
12:27<mwalling>caker: i need a larger node for mikegrbBot
12:31<mwalling>W|GGL|T: i'm slapping you too
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12:52<HoopyCat>You were poked by Monroe County Juror Office. poke back | request postponement
12:54<BubbleWrapz>im looking at books on amazon...can u guys tell me if u think this one is good
12:54<jimp>just getting started, installed a Ubuntu 8.04 LTS Disk Image. screen does not work like I'm used to. How do I get multiple windows? (Ctrl-C c) doesn't do anything.
12:54<HoopyCat>jimp: try ctrl-A instead of ctrl-C
12:55<BubbleWrapz>its a year out of date, but I dont think that should make much difference should it?
12:55<BubbleWrapz>its like $6ish with shipping
12:55<mwalling>jimp: lish's screen doesnt spawn multiple terminals.
12:55<HoopyCat>BubbleWrapz: it doesn't have an animal on the cover, so YMMV :-)
12:56<path->yea, oreilly books are nice
12:56<mwalling>YMMV: your mileage may vary
12:56<jimp>I mistyped, I am using ctrl-A, not ctrl-C. "lish's screen doesnt spawn multiple terminals" explains it. thanks.
12:56<BubbleWrapz>well, it lists Ubuntu too SpaceHobo so dont laugh -.-
12:57<BubbleWrapz>^looks useful?
12:58<Isvara>SpaceHobo: Were you at KW?
12:58<BubbleWrapz>so do u guys think thats a good book(the first link)
12:58<Isvara>SpaceHobo: Kingswood Warren. I thought you were talking about BBC R&D.
12:59<path->i would go down to borders and pick up some books and start reading
12:59<mwalling>BubbleWrapz: ?
12:59<mwalling>or do what path- said
12:59<path->if you find one you feel comfortable with, then buy it or come back home and order it online
12:59<BubbleWrapz>path, there arnt bookstores where i live
12:59<BubbleWrapz>yes really
12:59<mwalling>BubbleWrapz: burlington cant be *that* far away :)
13:00<BubbleWrapz>nearest barns and noble is a 4 hour drive
13:00<mwalling>ROAD TRIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
13:00-!-lakin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
13:00<BubbleWrapz>and the nearest bookstore is an hour drive
13:00<HoopyCat>BubbleWrapz: i find ... it's hot and fresh, but covers mostly desktop stuff.
13:00<BubbleWrapz>and ive alrdy seen its linux books, it only had 2 last time i was there and they were really expensive
13:01<path->i just mentioned borders cause there is one nearby and they have a good selection of linux/programming stuff
13:01<BubbleWrapz> dont want mostly desktop stuff :[
13:01-!-lakin [] has joined #linode
13:02<mwalling>books for programing languages: good. books for an os: eh. wikis are better for that IMO
13:03*BubbleWrapz likes books
13:03*mwalling too
13:03<BubbleWrapz>nice and colorful/portable
13:03<wladek>i prefer digital sources for all documentation
13:03*mwalling points to the oriley section on his book shelf
13:03<mwalling>i have lots of animal books
13:04<BubbleWrapz>animal books?
13:04<HoopyCat>BubbleWrapz: most server-oriented stuff is going to assume you've got experience with unix concepts, basic command line usage, the permission model, etc... given that you probably don't have a local community college that offers an Introduction to Unix class, you gotta start somewhere
13:04<BubbleWrapz>HoopyCat: k
13:05<BubbleWrapz>well, ill bbs guys, my lunch break is over and i got to head back to work
13:05<HoopyCat>documentation-wise, if it's more than a few pages or if someone can't explain it to me in a brief video, it gets printed out and pondered deeply
13:05-!-BubbleWrapz [] has quit [Quit: bbs]
13:05<HoopyCat>books are awesome, because i don't have to print them :-)
13:05<path->saves paper!
13:06<Isvara>HoopyCat: That's what work is for.
13:06<path->my oreilly perl books were the best bang for the buck
13:06<mwalling>python in a nutshell is nice
13:06<HoopyCat>Isvara: i know... i miss having a job with a 20ppm duplexing full-color printer. the 15ppm b&w laser just isn't as fun.
13:07<mwalling>it could get 20ppm doing FD?
13:07<HoopyCat>however, books are already bound and ready to go, which is handy when you're done -- stapled pages get messy after awhile in the outhouse
13:07<Isvara>Books are easier to manage in bed.
13:07*mwalling points to the "top of the line" HP outside his office and the fact that if you hit duplex it goes at about 1 ppm
13:08<HoopyCat>mwalling: not even close, alas; fortunately, paper was cheap and the big recycloshred bins hid the evidence promptly
13:08<mwalling>SpaceHobo: aye
13:08<mwalling>oriley is a prefered vendor, so getting books from them is easy
13:08<Isvara>You can't beat the online source repository.
13:09<mwalling>SpaceHobo: wanna ship them to NY?
13:09<HoopyCat>i like books
13:09<mwalling>the books you dont want to keep around?
13:10<mwalling>i thought this was an ongoing cycle
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13:13<BubbleWrap>whats an animal book?
13:13-!-lakin [] has joined #linode
13:14<Isvara>It's like an animal cracker, but with words instead of chocolate.
13:14<Isvara>Books like Blogging Hacks aren't animal books, though, are they?
13:14<HoopyCat>Isvara: wait, animal crackers with chocolate?
13:14<Mithshark>BubbleWrap: Aren't you on Swift?
13:14*BubbleWrap didnt knoe animal crackers were chocolate
13:15<Isvara>HoopyCat: Ooh, I'd love some, thank you!
13:15<BubbleWrap>Mithshark, SwiftIRC?
13:15<Isvara>The Cadbury ones have chocolate on top. I think. It's been a while.
13:15<scott>but its out of print :(
13:15<BubbleWrap>Yes, I am
13:15<Mithshark>Is there a ETA on when there will be slots in other data-centers?
13:15<scott>i think you can download it still
13:15<Mithshark>Just wondering if you were the person I thought you were
13:16<HoopyCat>Windows XP Hacks, for instance, has a dangerous-looking fan on it of the sort that'll chop your finger if you are too casual in its midst.
13:16<BubbleWrap>i thought ur name looked familier
13:16<BubbleWrap>what channels are you in?
13:16<Mithshark>None atm
13:16<BubbleWrap>what channels are you usually in*
13:16<Mithshark>I'm chatting on other networks, as Runescape users give me a headache
13:17<Mithshark>^ That's my autojoin minus two secret channeels
13:17<BubbleWrap>ah, makes sense.
13:18*HoopyCat smacks side of monitor, as #linode appears to have suddenly turned into a two-meter repeater
13:18<BubbleWrap>internet here is dying..must be the weather.
13:19<BubbleWrap>Mithshark, you used to play rs?
13:19<Mithshark>I quit in 2005
13:20*Mithshark sighs as Windows Update finally wins with its constant restart notices
13:20<HoopyCat>at least it's better than the other channel, which just says "This Is The Mega Repeater System On June Twenty-Four Two Thousand Eight At One Twenty PM Seventy-Two Point Nine Degrees Fahrenheit Club Meeting Tomorrow" every ten minutes
13:20-!-Mithshark [] has quit [Quit: restarting]
13:20<BubbleWrap>I quit in 2005, 2007, and keeps bringing me back..
13:20<BubbleWrap>Idk why, its pretty lame. :s
13:20<mwalling>heh... wild blue
13:21<CaptObviousman>god I hate that stupid windows update ping
13:21<mwalling>FORMAT C: /Y
13:21<mwalling>problem solved
13:21-!-roadmr [roadmr@] has quit [Quit: off to take a shit]
13:22<HoopyCat>CaptObviousman: after the third "foad", it should send a note to the default printer and be done with it
13:22*CaptObviousman reformat's mwalling's face with a nailgun
13:23<mwalling>slackware still includes loadlin!
13:23<Isvara>People still use loadlin?
13:23<mwalling>i dont
13:23<Isvara>I wonder if they use umsdos too.
13:23<path->can i use loadlin to boot freebsd on my linode?
13:24<HoopyCat>4dos is still being actively developed! that is crazy.
13:24<Isvara>path-: Sure! Step 1: install DOS...
13:25<HoopyCat>apt-get install dosemu
13:25<Bdragon>An interesting thing, ntfs write support was readded to the linux kernel... And it can handle "safely writing to an existing file as long as the size isn't changed"... AKA "We got loopbacks working, ship it!"
13:26<Isvara>It wasn't the same one that got added, though, I think.
13:26<Bdragon>They ripped out the old "Experimental - Dangerous" write code and put in less capable but safe code instead
13:26<Isvara>Isn't ntfs3g different code?
13:27<Bdragon>with the assumption that people are only gonna use ntfs for storing loopback files for those "Install linux on windows without partitioning" distros...
13:27<Bdragon>(at least I assume that was the intent of the new code)
13:27<Isvara>Interesting. NTFS-3G is no longer FUSE-based.
13:28<Isvara>Oh, no, it still is. I misread.
13:28<Bdragon>Heh, is Captive NTFS still around? That's that one that uses the actual windows nt filesystem driver file...
13:28<Isvara>It was sent to the same hell that ndiswrapper should have been sent to already.
13:30<Bdragon>ndiswrapper: "It's like using a binary only driver, except you're using a WINDOWS binary only driver, so it sucks even more!"
13:31<Isvara>Cool. MS can't spell 'provider'.
13:32<BubbleWrap>10:18:59 <irgeek> BubbleWrap: And change the auto line to: auto eth0 eth0:1
13:32<BubbleWrap>um guys, where is that at?
13:32<mwalling>/etc/config/networking or something
13:33<Dave>try /etc/network/interfaces
13:33<Dave>thats where it is in debian, and im sure ubuntu too
13:33<BubbleWrap>thanks <3
13:33<Isvara>Just do it all in rc.local
13:33<HoopyCat>Isvara: a providor is like a humidor, but for printers; it's essential for inkjet cartridge life. don't you know anything about PC technology? ;-)
13:33*Bdragon is naughty and has a custom rc.inet1 :P
13:33<Isvara>HoopyCat: Not yet!
13:34<BubbleWrap>whats the name of that text editer program?
13:35<mwalling>Dave: he said text editor, not operating system
13:35<BubbleWrap>its nano :)
13:35-!-lakin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
13:35<Isvara>Be a man: use a paperclip and a magnet.
13:35<BubbleWrap>i typed nano etc/rc.d/rc.inet1.conf
13:35<BubbleWrap>what did I do wrong?
13:36<path->nano /etc/......
13:36<mwalling>13:33 < Dave> try /etc/network/interfaces
13:36<mwalling>13:33 < Dave> thats where it is in debian, and im sure ubuntu too
13:36<Dave>BubbleWrap: you also missed the leading /
13:36<Isvara>As appropriately pointed out by path-.
13:36<mwalling>he could be cd'd into /
13:36<Dave>mwalling: possibly
13:36<BubbleWrap>is it suposed to be a blank document?
13:37<Dave>BubbleWrap: no
13:37<Isvara>There's no .conf
13:37<Dave>anyone got a clue wtf he is trying to do now?
13:37<BubbleWrap>who knows? i dont even know
13:37<Isvara>What distribution is this anyway?
13:37<Dave>xp? you cant run windows on a linode
13:37<Dave>Isvara: he was running ubuntu unless he changed
13:38<BubbleWrap>:P but with x like xD
13:38<Isvara>Then someone already said /etc/network/interfaces!
13:38<BubbleWrap>-bash: cd: /etc/network/interfaces: Not a directory
13:38<Dave>I did!
13:38<Isvara>BubbleWrap: It's a file!
13:38<Dave>interfaces is a file...
13:38<path->cd /etc/network
13:39<BubbleWrap>f-down.d if-post-down.d if-pre-up.d if-up.d interfaces
13:39<path->the .d's are directories
13:39<path->and interfaces is a file
13:39<Dave>did we not already point to the file you need?
13:39<mwalling>13:36 < mwalling> 13:33 < Dave> try /etc/network/interfaces
13:39<mwalling>13:36 < mwalling> 13:33 < Dave> thats where it is in debian, and im sure ubuntu too
13:39<Dave>mikegrb: you need to implement in here
13:39<path->you want to edit interfaces
13:40*BubbleWrap confused :(
13:40<Dave>BubbleWrap: by what? the difference between a directory and a file?
13:40<BubbleWrap>im sorry, im not trying to be stupod
13:40<BubbleWrap>I understand that Dave, i dont understand where this file is
13:40<BubbleWrap>root@ubuntu:/etc/network# ls
13:40<BubbleWrap>if-down.d if-post-down.d if-pre-up.d if-up.d interfaces
13:40<BubbleWrap>because thats what im seeing
13:41<Isvara>There it is!
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13:41<Dave>interfaces is a file
13:41<Isvara>nano interfaces
13:41<Dave>thats the one you are looking for
13:41<path->ls -al
13:41<path->that'll show you the long listing
13:41<BubbleWrap>i didnt relize that was a file sitting there
13:41<BubbleWrap>i thought it was the name of the folder for sum odd reason
13:42<Dave>BubbleWrap: is bash not colour coding things?
13:42<Isvara>BubbleWrap: Is your ls colour?
13:42<path->it may not be color coding in putty
13:42<BubbleWrap>it is color coding things
13:42<tjfontaine>ls --color=auto
13:42<Dave>ok, blue is directorys
13:42<Isvara>Then directories should be blue.
13:42<BubbleWrap>but it doesnt help when idk what the colors mean
13:42<path->dir's are blue and files are white
13:42<Dave>path-: not always :)
13:42<tjfontaine>and executables are green
13:42<BubbleWrap>any other colors?
13:42<tjfontaine>Dave: generally speaking
13:42<path->on mine they are, and that's what's important :)
13:42<tjfontaine>red broken symlinks
13:42<Isvara>function ls() { /bin/ls --color -F "$*"; }
13:42<Battousai>and broken symlinks are blinking white on red
13:42<Dave>what colour are bad sym.... red
13:42<tjfontaine>light blue symbolic links
13:43*BubbleWrap hunts out linodestuff.txt
13:43<Dave>dont worry about sym links yet btw
13:43*BubbleWrap adds to .txt
13:43<Dave>but they are basically shortcuts
13:44<path->devices are yello
13:44*BubbleWrap scrolls up
13:44<mwalling>777'd files are $color on green
13:44<mwalling>compressed stuff is red
13:45<mwalling>images are pink
13:45<Battousai>oranges are purple
13:45<Battousai>but purples aren't orange
13:45<Dave>purple = NaF
13:45<BubbleWrap>13:05:48 <HoopyCat> books are awesome, because i don't have to print them :-)
13:45<BubbleWrap>13:05:58 <path-> saves paper!
13:45<BubbleWrap>13:06:18 <Isvara> HoopyCat: That's what work is for.
13:45<BubbleWrap>That is a very good idea :O
13:46<Battousai>purples are most definitely fruits
13:46-!-Mithshark [] has joined #linode
13:46<Bdragon>what about purple cabbage?
13:47<Mithshark>*sigh* Windows update sucks
13:47<Battousai>an interesting point
13:47<Battousai>we shall run an experiment
13:47<Battousai>i need some salad, stat
13:47<Dave>how to disable?! why would you do that?
13:48<Battousai>because the terminal codes suck up bandwidth?
13:48<Battousai>9600 BAUD!!
13:49-!-Shidden [] has joined #linode
13:49<Isvara>I used to have a 2k4 modem that was about 19" wide. Absolutely ridiculous.
13:50<Shidden>helo im new here and im having trouble connecting to the linode - through ftp
13:50<BubbleWrap>K, i changed that I need to reboot again?
13:50<Dave>Shidden: installed an ftpd?
13:50<Battousai>well, 2k4 was years ago
13:50<Isvara>BubbleWrap: /etc/init.d/network restart (maybe)
13:50<Isvara>Battousai: Early 90s.
13:50<path->probably want to do that from lish
13:50<Dave>ifdown -a && ifup -a
13:50<BubbleWrap>13:50:33 <Isvara> BubbleWrap: /etc/init.d/network restart (maybe)
13:50<Battousai>i thought that meant 2004
13:51<Dave>but yes, from lish
13:51<Dave>Shidden: what problems are you having?
13:51<Isvara>Battousai: That would be even more ridiculous.
13:51<path->i think it's /etc/init.d/networking on ubuntu
13:52<Dave> /etc/init.d/networking exists in debian :)
13:52<Bdragon>I just realized you could rig up a (very slow) network connection with two secretaries and two phones...
13:52<Bdragon>That would be funny to see an implementation of...
13:53<BubbleWrap>root@ubuntu:/etc/network# /etc/init.d/networking restart
13:53<BubbleWrap> * Reconfiguring network interfaces...
13:53<Dave>Bdragon: you would need to to a lot of error correction
13:53<Shidden>i cant get on
13:53<Shidden>it says failed in blaze ftp
13:53*BubbleWrap adds to .txt lol
13:53<Isvara>Bdragon: You could do some very lossy compression of images. "It's a house. With a dog on the roof. And the sun is out. So draw that."
13:53<Mithshark>blazeftpd :O
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13:53<Dave>Shidden: why not use sftp?
13:54<Mithshark>Isvara: 'very lossy' doesn't quite describe it well enough
13:54<Shidden>ok ill try it then but i dnt know wat to put where
13:54<Mithshark>I would call it corruption
13:54<Shidden>just ip ?
13:54<Dave>sftp should just work if you have ssh installed
13:54<Dave>yeah, sftp to your ip, and log in with a user account
13:54<Shidden>hm ok
13:55<BubbleWrap>hm guys, its still not working
13:55<BubbleWrap>o w8
13:55<BubbleWrap>i got an idea..
13:55<Isvara>"o w8"? Are you on IRC via a cellphone or something?
13:56<path->he's green
13:56<Mithshark>No, he's from SwiftIRC
13:56<path->saving bits
13:56<Shidden>something like sftp titan ftp ?
13:56<path->using less electric
13:56<BubbleWrap>o yes
13:56<Dave>BubbleWrap: have you added another ip or something?
13:56<Mithshark>Why use FTP anyways?
13:56<exor|plane>Bdragon: write the RFC for next april foo;s day :P
13:56<BubbleWrap>for every leter u type $0.00000000000001 of electricity is wasted.
13:56<BubbleWrap>Dave, yes
13:57<Dave>have you rebooted since adding it?
13:57<BubbleWrap>And my program isnt recognizing it.
13:57<BubbleWrap>Should I reboot now that ive edited my network config?
13:57<Mithshark>so he typed leter instead of letter, how enviromentally friendly
13:57<Dave>Shidden: what program are you using to sftp?
13:57<Dave>BubbleWrap: you shouldnt need to
13:57-!-BubbleWrap [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:57<path->rebooting will consume more power
13:57<path->i'd wait
13:57<path->electric is cheaper at night
13:57<Shidden>im just trying to upload my ragnarok server
13:58<Shidden>i dnt really not wth im doing tho - last vps was windows
13:58-!-BubbleWrap [] has joined #linode
13:58<exor|plane>windows vps? o.O
13:59<Shidden>im happy to go to linode - just dnt know wat im doing yet
13:59<Dave>Shidden: what program are you using to sftp?
13:59<Shidden>i was used to remote desktop control
13:59<Mithshark>They have uses, lots.. some.. a few..., what the hell, Windows?
14:00<path->try filezilla
14:00<Dave>yeah, or smartftp
14:00<Isvara>Mithshark: They're handy for running things like SQL Server.
14:00<BubbleWrap>still not working..
14:00<Isvara>And ASP stuff.
14:00<Bdragon>IPoAP -- IP over Administrative Professional
14:00<Mithshark>At least he hasn't installed x or something
14:00<Dave>BubbleWrap: pastebin your /etc/network/interfaces
14:00<Isvara>Yeah. He should install X.
14:01<Mithshark>Yeah Isvara, I use them at college, I'm a Information Security major :D
14:01<BubbleWrap>um Dave
14:01<BubbleWrap>erm nm
14:01*HoopyCat dons safety glasses and gloves, then slices cardboard box from crotch to sternum
14:01<path->i thought dhcp would only work for the first ip address
14:01<Dave>it will
14:01<path->i think that's what bubblewrap is trying to do
14:02<path->you got a second ip?
14:02<Dave>there is a wiki article
14:02<BubbleWrap>I got one..
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14:02<path->you should set them statically
14:02<path->ie, not "auto"
14:02<Isvara>How does one have one's second IP address assigned?
14:03<path->i think both ip's use the eth0 interface
14:03<path->so you need to add eth0:0
14:03<path->i don't have any experience with this on linode though
14:03<Mithshark>It's on the Wiki if he's using Debian/Ubuntu
14:03<Dave>path-: the auto is just so it gets configured on boot
14:03<BubbleWrap>nm that oops
14:03<path->oh.. speed/duplex and so forth
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14:04<CaptObviousman>whoever posted that stupidfilter, thank you
14:04<Dave>CaptObviousman: no probs :)
14:04-!-r3z`` [] has joined #linode
14:04<mwalling>ssh edison
14:04<Dave>BubbleWrap: the reason its not working, is because you haevnt actually configured eth0:1
14:05<BubbleWrap>I havent? -.^
14:05<Shidden>no smartftp int working either - "forcibly closed by remote host"
14:05<Dave>Shidden: have you specified its an sftp host?
14:05<Dave>BubbleWrap: no, read the wiki link i pasted
14:05<Shidden>how would i do that?
14:05<path->ssh tesla
14:05<Isvara>How do you get the second IP address assigned?
14:05<BubbleWrap>Dave, im reading it, its confusing.
14:06<Dave>BubbleWrap: sigh... what are your ip addresses?
14:06<BubbleWrap>plz dont get all honestly nto trying to be retarded
14:06<BubbleWrap>I've just never done this before.
14:06<Dave>Shidden: top left it says address, icon to its right is protocol
14:12-!-Isvara [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
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14:14<Shidden>ok i see that and that seems to let me in - but will it upload rars?
14:15<Shidden>ok then cuz when i click open it does nothing
14:16<Shidden>same with add
14:17<Mithshark>any admins around?
14:17-!-ondrej [] has joined #linode
14:17<Mithshark>er nvm it's a 540 avail, not a 720 :/
14:17<linbot>Don't ask to ask; just ASK
14:17<Mithshark>tjfontaine: only a admin could help with the situation
14:17<linbot>caker: The outlook is hazy, please ask again later.
14:18<tjfontaine>Mithshark: and it's easier to ask them then ask abotu asking
14:18-!-BubbleWrap [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:18<Mithshark>but then I deal with users thinking that they can help
14:18<Dave>Shidden: I have no idea what you mean
14:19<tjfontaine>and whois to you Mithshark
14:19-!-BubbleWrap [] has joined #linode
14:19<Shidden>w do i upload to it using smartftp - what should I try to do
14:19-!-ondrej [] has quit []
14:19<Mithshark>but I don't have a shiny user mode to tell me :(
14:19<Dave>Shidden: you have a local view and a remote view right?
14:19<Dave>BubbleWrap: you rebooted?
14:19<BubbleWrap>rebooted my BNC, not the linode.
14:19<Mithshark>tjfontaine actually using host
14:19<Dave>Shidden: click the file in local view, and then click the arrow to move it to remove view
14:19<Mithshark>I enjoyed that though
14:20<Shidden>i cant get the file to come um in local view
14:20<Dave>Shidden: its just a tree naviagtion...
14:20-!-ondrej [] has joined #linode
14:21<Shidden>yea i know that
14:21<Shidden>its not letting me get the file on the smart ftp at all tho
14:22<Shidden>i cant imagine hwy
14:22<Shidden>its as if it wont allow rar - thats why i was asking if it would
14:23<Shidden>ok well ill just keep playing with it - thanks for pointing out the sftp - i am alot further now
14:24<Dave>if it helps, my version of smartftp will show rars just fine...
14:24<Shidden>hmm - ok if its probably a comp setting or firewall then thx
14:25<BubbleWrap>ITS WORKING!!!! :DD
14:25<linbot>path-: The answer is def-- oooh! shiny thing!
14:25*BubbleWrap huggles Dave
14:28<Shidden>ok cool seems to be uploading then thx
14:29<Dave>Shidden: out of interest, how did you fix that problem?
14:30<BubbleWrap>hm..i think i can take off my rDNS now..
14:30<BubbleWrap>il wait, dont need to eff anything up when its working xD
14:32<Dave>Bdragon: readthat one earlier :)
14:32<Shidden>it wasnt the smartftp - my actual rar is messed up
14:32<Shidden>so i needed to use an older one
14:32<Shidden>which sux
14:35<Mithshark>What datacenter does Linode use in Newark?
14:36<iggy>they have a storage unit at a public storage place with a microwave internet link
14:37<path->Natural-underground-cave At Caker's-house
14:37<linbot>New news from forums: usernames can be longer than the login field allows in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
14:38<jcn>i think i went to a rave there over the weekend. some dude was dancing on the servers.
14:39<HoopyCat>i heard it was a shipping container full of lawn chairs that washed up on the beach; the department of transportation was going to blow it up, but they bid it out and linode won
14:40<HoopyCat>or was that in oregon? i can never remember
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14:58<bd_>Mithshark: the serious answer:
14:59<Mithshark>Yeah, path- said it
15:00<Shidden>so now that the rar (the online game) is on the ftp and transfered - how do i open it and install it - is there somehting similar to remote control?
15:00<bd_>and followed up with a NACronym :)
15:05<linbot>caker: Linode360 - 4, Linode540 - 27, Linode720 - 13, Linode1080 - 0, Linode1440 - 0, Linode2880 - 0
15:05<@caker>SELL SELL SELL
15:06<scott>they're selling faster than mikegrb's mom!
15:06<@mikegrb>and she's dead!
15:06<mwalling>!calc 315100 AUD in USD
15:06<linbot>mwalling: 315,100 Australian dollars = 300,825.97 U.S. dollars
15:06<mwalling>only 300k?
15:07<mwalling>^^also, why i shouldnt read /. while eating
15:08<scott>Bluewater Wind != GE
15:09<Dave>Shidden: you're after ssh
15:09<linbot>Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0 , Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0 , Atlanta360 - 0, Atlanta540 - 2, Atlanta720 - 0, Atlanta1080 - 0, Atlanta1440 - 0, Atlanta2880 - 0 , Newark360 - 44, Newark540 - 25, Newark720 - 15, Newark1080 - 2, Newark1440 - 1, Newark2880 - 1
15:09<bd_>oho, do I see a new host online?
15:10<@tasaro>roadtrip to NAC tomorrow
15:11<@caker>!alias add avail-all tell mwalling I just ran avail-all!!
15:11<linbot>caker: The operation succeeded.
15:11<linbot>Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0 , Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0 , Atlanta360 - 0, Atlanta540 - 2, Atlanta720 - 0, Atlanta1080 - 0, Atlanta1440 - 0, Atlanta2880 - 0 , Newark360 - 44, Newark540 - 25, Newark720 - 15, Newark1080 - 2, Newark1440 - 1, Newark2880 - 1
15:11<path->scott, doesn't bluewater use someone else to do the turbines who buy GE??
15:11<scott>path-: no idea. i only read /.
15:11<path->i should go read /.
15:12<path->i said something to mwalling earlier.. but wasn't sure
15:12*linbot slaps caker
15:12<scott>yeah mwalling was awol
15:12<path->hard to believe delaware is on slashdot
15:12<mwalling>no, i was here
15:12<mwalling>i kept my mouth shut
15:13<scott>so the asnwer to path-'s question?
15:13<Dave>is the answer
15:13<mwalling>i'm in applications, not sales
15:13<Shidden>ok so the ssh is something i use wiht the web browser or something entirely dif
15:14<Dave>Shidden: google for putty
15:14<mwalling>we make sure its not going to blow up the grid
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15:15*HoopyCat turns jiggawatt control to 11
15:15<mwalling>we also bring good things to life by putting imagination at work
15:15<path->according to, the wind turbine suppply and installation is from Vestas
15:15-!-Justin is now known as Guest1679
15:15<path->i thought i saw some technical specs page where they mentioned GE, but i can't now
15:16<path->so who knows
15:16<scott>people at GE dont even know!
15:16<path->i like the idea of wind power, but i fear by the time all the people on that page get done lining their pockets, my electric bill will go through the roof
15:16<scott>more nukes
15:16<Shidden>ok cool
15:17<Dave>just hook us up some nuclear reactors already
15:17<path->delaware is doing some grants for solar panels too
15:17<Dave>fusion is the way, untill we have fision
15:17<mwalling>Dave: not the only way... you still need diversity
15:17<Dave>mwalling: screw diversity! :)
15:17<mwalling>insensitive clod
15:17<scott>the man wants his fusion!
15:19<Dave>and the lord said, let there be fusion, and there was
15:19<Dave>and he saw that it was good
15:19<Shidden>Deve: anything else u have as far as info on this putty thing
15:20<Shidden>sry Dave:
15:20<Bdragon>It was written by Simon Tatham
15:20<Dave>Shidden: I suggest you read some basic linux guides
15:20<Mithshark> = coldfusion :o
15:21<Dave>Mithshark: a conspiricy!
15:22<Dave>wait. there is no f in :(
15:22<HoopyCat>tjfontaine: attempt on my life / fails no matter the season / 3 days on your clock
15:23<Mithshark>well it's obvious but I never thought about it
15:23<HoopyCat>"When police arrived, they found him wearing nothing but a baseball cap and drinking a cup of red wine."
15:23<HoopyCat>wait, that's... illegal? damn.
15:24<tjfontaine>arrived where?
15:24<HoopyCat>tjfontaine: to the sidewalk outside his house, at 10am saturday morning
15:24<tjfontaine>sounds like a good night
15:24<tjfontaine>or the best way to start caturday
15:26<tjfontaine>if you're sunbathing you don't want lines
15:31<Dave>Shidden: you may want to start
15:32<tjfontaine>Zotnix: haaa the catology
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15:38*scott waves bye
15:38<cruxeternus>thanks for coming
15:39<scott>same ip too
15:40<Dave>you're silly, scott
15:41<scott>ok, mr. fusion
15:42<Dave>is that some clever way of calling me silly?
15:43<scott>yeah, can you say PWNED
15:43<tjfontaine>you make no sense :)
15:47<scott>tjfontaine: 15:17 < Dave> fusion is the way, untill we have fision
15:48<path->didn't you see back to the future?
15:49<tjfontaine>gimmmie flux capacitors now kthxbai
15:49*caker capacitates tjfontaine
15:50<tjfontaine>ok splain something to me
15:50<tjfontaine>a specific track on a guitar hero game is significant, but Linode isn't? :)
15:51<@caker>irgeek: api stuff you want me to link to on its page?
15:51<tjfontaine>caker: I'll have a project like url RSN for my api stuff :)
15:52<tjfontaine>unless you plan on making them official ;)
15:52<@caker>you will have, or you do have now?
15:52<HoopyCat>tjfontaine: notability requirements for specific businesses are usually a couple notches higher than the requirements for specific pokemon. it's annoying, but changing that policy is physically impossible.
15:53<tjfontaine>caker: it will be at /projects/linode-api
15:53<tjfontaine>HoopyCat: haha
15:54<erikh>are you guys using "notability" as a legal term, or are you talking about some ethereal criteria that hasn't been discussed yet?
15:54<path->lameass wikipedia
15:54<erikh>because I'm hella confused
15:54<Battousai>i think they're talking about a video game
15:54<tjfontaine>erikh: wikipedia is the new rule of law
15:55<erikh>oh, awesome!
15:55<Battousai>with the pikachu
15:55<Battousai>and the bulbasaur
15:55<Battousai>what's the other one's name?
15:55*erikh makes edits declaring him supreme overlord of the internet
15:55<erikh>and I'll win on 3RR, so don't even try
15:56*HoopyCat shoves beans up his nose
15:56<Battousai>if you sneeze they fly out
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16:09<Battousai>poor useless floodbots
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16:10*HoopyCat stuffs beans up FloodServ's nose
16:10<tjfontaine>mwalling: what's the url again?
16:10<tjfontaine>it's actually GanneffServ doing this one :)
16:10<Battousai>wtf is a ganneff
16:10<tjfontaine>it's a who actually :)
16:10<mwalling>tjfontaine: i stopped logging...
16:11-!-SkiddieBot [] has joined #linode
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16:12<HoopyCat>tjfontaine: i figured it wasn't FloodServ, but that rhinarium is so tempting
16:13-!-SkiddieBot [] has joined #linode
16:13<path->i think that bot is broke
16:14<@caker>hmm ....
16:14<@caker>[PATCH] xen: remove support for non-PAE 32-bit
16:14<@caker>I had that backwards.
16:14<Battousai>gotta clean your pants now?
16:14<mwalling>use the toilet, not your undies
16:14-!-walbert [] has joined #linode
16:15<walbert>hrm, was newark down at all during the weekend?
16:15<Mithshark>box 10 wasn't, anyways
16:16<@caker>the deadline for migrations off a flakey box (newark6) occured last night .. otherwise, no
16:17<Mithshark>What are linodes, 2u?
16:17<mendel>infinitesimally tiny
16:17<tjfontaine>1U supermicros
16:17-!-Andy-34 [~caagon@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:17<mendel>such that 40 of them can fit in 1U
16:17<Bdragon>1U SuperMicro
16:17*tjfontaine has 4 decomissioned hosts
16:17<mendel>and that's only so they have enough room to bounce around
16:17<Mithshark>with quad xeons and raid 1 :~O
16:18<Xel>caker: Gonna sell some old hardware again any time soon?
16:18<bd_>actually one linode would be somewhere between (1/5)U and (1/40)U, wouldn't it?
16:18<Mithshark>I missed that by days last time :(
16:18<HoopyCat>the 360's are approx. 1.1mm thick
16:18<bd_>(depending on plan size)
16:19<HoopyCat>or just a hair over 1000 microns
16:19-!-walbert [] has left #linode []
16:19<Mithshark>I would hate to learn how much heat they put out...
16:20<mwalling>thats why they're in the high density area
16:20<Mithshark>yea, but the aurplane fans take care of it i'm sure :D
16:21<Mithshark>I have a dual coppermine rack, it sounds like a plane
16:21<HoopyCat>newspaper from mysterious future reveals that newark6 was missing a heat sink due to mikegrb forgetting his lighter in the car on install day
16:21-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:21<@mikegrb>HoopyCat: shhh
16:21<@mikegrb>don't tell anyone
16:22<tjfontaine>oh I wanna try that someday ;)
16:22*scott posts that to usenet
16:22<emag>are uml->xen migrations still on a manual request basis?
16:23<tjfontaine>and availability, aside from new boxes
16:23<bd_>emag: for now. I hear there might be mass migrations soonish though (6-8 weeks? I don't know, just a rumor :)
16:23<@caker>in Atlanta
16:23<bd_>note that no new signups will be on xen
16:23<bd_>on uml
16:23<@caker>all new ..
16:23<@caker>right :)
16:23<tjfontaine>bad bd_
16:23<emag>yeah, i'm on host129.dallas right now
16:23*path- flips bd upside down
16:23<path->hi db
16:23<emag>path-: you mean pq
16:24<tjfontaine>db: do you support ACID?
16:24<scott>the drug?
16:24<bd_>16:24 [oftc] -!- pq‾ Erroneous Nickname
16:25<emag>so i guess the question is... are there any xen 720s in dallas currently free?
16:26<Battousai>free 720s?!
16:26<emag>Battousai: yeah, everyone's using. 1.4M floppies these days, so 720K ones are free
16:27<mwalling>we can has?
16:27<bd_>2880K ftw
16:27-!-r3z`` is now known as r3z
16:27<HoopyCat>according to the boaroscope, there are 15 in newark but that's it
16:28<emag>well, then, errr... i guess i'll continue waiting
16:28<Xel>I just saw the best security quote ever
16:28<Xel>I love /.
16:28<HoopyCat>emag: you can enqueue yourself :-)
16:28<bd_>emag: there's a waitlist that you can put a ticket in to get on
16:29<Xel>"Security is like sex. Once you're penetrated, you're fucked"
16:29<emag>heh, i suppose that WOULD be smarter than waiting around. i'll go put in a ticket :-)
16:29-!-shakr [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:29<HoopyCat>Xel: eh, there's plenty of external attacks which will still end up counting as being at least gently screwed
16:29<BubbleWrap>well guys, im out. bbl
16:31-!-Battousai [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:31<linbot>New news from forums: How is the badnwith calculated? in Sales Questions and Answers <>
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16:32<path->mwalling, you should seed a RBL with those ips you're collecting
16:32<emag>HoopyCat: wouldn't those be more like dry humping? at least in this context...
16:32<cruxeternus>Please come again!
16:32-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
16:32<mwalling>path-: i spose i could
16:32<tjfontaine>path-: there's talk of OFTC and Freenode doing such a thing for the smaller networks, based on our klines
16:32-!-Guest1679 [] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
16:32<path->i was thinking about for spam
16:33<cruxeternus>Just needs to be a universal "you suck" list.
16:33<tjfontaine>it could be used as well
16:33<Mithshark>there are plenty of RBLs though
16:33<mwalling>Mithshark: yeah, but none with my wit
16:33<tjfontaine>dnsbl is dnsbl
16:33<path->i just checked one of those ip's
16:34<path->on 6 lists
16:34-!-Battousai [] has joined #linode
16:34-!-meffer [~meff@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:34*mwalling wonders if a `fortune -so` as the TXT record would be nice :)
16:34<avongauss>just wait til they get the clever idea of using ipv6.
16:34<path->i think some of the rbls would block dialup type ips, so they shouldn't count
16:34<erikh>dunno.. the tendency of freenode ops to kline first and ask questions later worries me a little
16:34<path->but you might be able to use some of them
16:34<mwalling>tjfontaine: Battousai is spamming me
16:34<Battousai>that's not spam!
16:35<Battousai>it's hot action
16:35<HoopyCat>ipv6 has a lot of room for wildcards
16:36<emag>oooh, that one always spams!
16:37<avongauss>yes, you probably could block a /64 by wildcard safely, but going larger than that increases risk of hitting other users.
16:38<emag>just /kline them all, let the netgod sort it out?
16:40<HoopyCat>some /64s are allocated for private users, and some for subnets; but when they're allocated for pleasure, they're the /64s that i like best
16:40-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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16:41-!-Justin is now known as Guest1696
16:42<Shidden>is there a way to manage linode through the ftp - such as open and install a program - so that i dont need to use putty?
16:42<@caker>Shidden: you know FTP sends information (including passwords) in the clear, right?
16:43<@caker>have we been over this already?
16:43<Xel>caker, what's a password?
16:43<tjfontaine>different user?
16:43<mwalling>caker: but all the other shared hosting providers have ftp!!!
16:44<path->the answer is to create usernames like 1apQCOSrUB8GH with the password of root
16:44<bd_>also note that ftp doesn't really support opening and installing programs (at least, not in a sane way, I'm sure)
16:44<path->then you can use ftp
16:44<@caker>Shidden: anyhow .. FTP and/or scp/sftp are for transferring files -- not interactive administration. That's what ssh is for
16:44<Shidden>and ssh is putty?
16:45<HoopyCat>you could log in via root over ftp, put the file in /tmp, and then send a command like "NOOP Hey, could you please untar that file, compile it, and install it? thanks"... Eve will take care of it promptly
16:45<@caker>putty is an ssh client, yes
16:45<path->putty is one of many
16:45<path->like thunderbird to email
16:45-!-jimp [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:45<bd_>Shidden: If you want the convenience of ftp's file transfer model with the security of ssh, look at WinSCP. Note that you can't 'open programs and install files' with winscp, but it'll do everything FTP does in a much more secure way.
16:45<Xel>Why should any of us care about security? That's caker's job.
16:46<path->i thought caker's job was to make linode cool
16:46<Xel>No. mikegrb does that.
16:46<@caker>I'm cakerlicious
16:46<path->what does jaboda do then?
16:47*mikegrb accidently doubles Xel's ram
16:47*mikegrb runs
16:48<HoopyCat>he watches the frobulator from a hole in the ceiling
16:48*caker accidentally halves mikegrb's salary for spelling accidentally wrong
16:48*mikegrb hides
16:49<Xel>caker, you mean mikegrb lowers YOUR salary.
16:49<Xel>... Right?
16:49<path->only in soviet russia
16:49<jcn>in soviet russia, salary lowers YOU.
16:49-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
16:50<Xel>caker: Do you guys have actual offices? ie. not your moms basement?
16:50<@caker> <-- one office to rule them all
16:50<scorche|sh>Xel: never seen the picture?
16:50<cruxeternus>Yes, there are even pictures.
16:51<jcn>there are pictures?
16:51<scorche|sh>they arent just offices...
16:51<scorche|sh>...they are PROFESSIONAL offices
16:51-!-Shidden [] has quit [Quit: Shidden]
16:51<HoopyCat>"Professional" "Offices"
16:51<scorche|sh>You must log in to see this page.
16:51<Xel>Wow caker!
16:52<Xel>That almost makes you guys look official.
16:52<Xel>It's cool how you took ClipArt and put it on your business site
16:52<Xel>So cute.... just like it was a real business!
16:52<Xel>I'll bet you have cute little pictures of mikegrb in a suit, too.
16:52<Xel>A photoshopped suit.
16:52<@mikegrb>Xel: nien
16:52<@mikegrb>Xel: not even photoshopped
16:52<scorche|sh>the banana is real though
16:52<Xel>Wait, you don't have a business formal dress code?
16:52<HoopyCat>you can see his chest hair
16:52<Xel>What gives?
16:53<scorche|sh>at least he told me the banana was real...
16:53*mikegrb only wears tuxedos
16:53<HoopyCat>so where does that stairway go?
16:53<jcn>so are linode in TN or NJ now?
16:54*cruxeternus only wears a penguin suit.
16:54<@mikegrb>HoopyCat: to the moon
16:54<cruxeternus>Mars DC, ETA 2011
16:54-!-xitology [~xi@] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
16:55<HoopyCat>sure beats SODTech World Headquarters
16:56<@caker> <-- SPECIAL DELIVERY!
16:57<path->you need like ten more truckloads of them!
16:57<cruxeternus>You came close to donating a server or two via "it fell off the back of a truck"
16:57<kupesoft>Having connection problems to my linode and to lish...
16:58<Mithshark>LOL caker:
16:58<HoopyCat>the local UPS store's hours sign is remotely controlled; at the push of a button, the hours suddenly become 6am to five-minutes-before-caker's-truck-drives-into-the-parking-lot
16:59-!-Alucard [] has joined #linode
16:59<Mithshark>the back of that truck is worth more than my car
17:00-!-Arnar [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:00<Alucard>newark die?
17:00<Mithshark>im on it
17:01-!-straterr1 [] has joined #linode
17:01<straterr1>Anyone in Newark seeing dataloss?
17:01<straterr1>Glad I'm not the only one
17:01-!-lakin_ [] has joined #linode
17:01<Alucard>it's back
17:01<HoopyCat>looks to be between and
17:02<path->better now
17:02-!-lakin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
17:02<HoopyCat>.... and now it's better
17:02<straterr1>Worse again
17:02<jcn>woah yeah, me too on newark20
17:03<straterr1>I'm on 20
17:03<Mithshark>and now newark15, lol
17:03<Mithshark>Glad I was workign in screen :~D
17:03<straterr1>I am too...but it doesn't do anything for my paying customers -_-
17:04<Peng>Hmm, mtr now reports some packet loss at savvis.
17:04<Peng>(, from my Dallas node)
17:05<Deckert>doesn;t seem to be bad from Dallas to Newark
17:05<straterr1>Its not bad now
17:05<Deckert>1% loss from my Dallas Linode to a Linode in Newark
17:05<bd_>straterr1: try getting a mtr from your linode to your local location, if possible, next time
17:05<Deckert>straterr1: ah, k]
17:05<bd_>also dataloss =/= packet loss :)
17:05<straterr1>I couldn't communicate with my linode
17:05<Mithshark>[15:59:43] <Mithshark> the back of that truck is worth more than my car
17:05<Mithshark>trade you my car for the servers!
17:06<Mithshark>who needs a car anyways
17:06<@tasaro>the back of that truck is worth more than the truck
17:06<Mithshark>I have a very expensive Lexus though!
17:06<Mithshark>Was liek $86k
17:06<Mithshark>Graduation present, I wish they let me pick the car though
17:06<@caker>does it have sex with you?
17:07<Mithshark>no.. :'(
17:08<Mithshark>Yeah, the last thing I would have picked was a Lexus, btu they get it because "it had a high safety rating"
17:08<Mithshark>Though I think they bought it because my mom liked it
17:09<Peng>You should sell the Lexus and get eight Kias and a mail-away bride. :)
17:09<Peng>mail-order*. That's the term.
17:10<HoopyCat>there are cars which are substantially more affordable and still have a high safety rating, so i'd have to say they probably have too much money and not enough brains.
17:10<Mithshark>I would agree
17:10<HoopyCat>$86,000 would buy my house AND my car
17:10<Mithshark>it parks itself though!
17:10<path->sell the lexus and get hybrid!
17:10<Mithshark>Oh, I just found the sheet, it was 74,291 delivered
17:10<straterr1>my car cost $7200
17:11<path->that would pay off my home loan :P
17:11<Mithshark>The only car I ever bought myself was ~8k
17:11<iggy>"Though I think they bought it because my mom liked it" <--- I think that says more than any kind of safety:value ratio
17:11<HoopyCat>ok, $74,000 would buy my house and pay off my credit card debt :-)
17:11<iggy>74k wouldn't buy an empty lot around here
17:11<Mithshark>heh, now I'll be labeled the spoiled one :'(
17:11-!-meff [~meff@] has joined #linode
17:12<Mithshark>Really though, I'm not even happy with it
17:13-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:13<jcn>74K barely buys a parking space around here.
17:14<path->people register for classes at my work to get the parking
17:14<path->then drop half way through after getting the parking pass
17:14<Mithshark>the only feature i really liek on it, is the cruise control :~D
17:14<straterr1>my $7200 car has that..
17:15<Mithshark>well it slows down if it gets too close to the car in front of it
17:15<HoopyCat>so does mine
17:15<straterr1> does that?
17:15<Mithshark>pfft, i'm to lazy tto use my foot
17:15<straterr1>I dont need my car to do that
17:15<HoopyCat>for admittedly uncomfortable values of "too close"
17:15<Mithshark>mine stays too far, unless the road is hilly, or curvey
17:16<Mithshark>then it gets WAY too close
17:16<iggy>quiet down spoiled boy
17:17<path->my car has holes in the floor, and i use my feet to push the car along
17:17<iggy>flintstoning it?
17:17<Bdragon>(insert flintstones sound effect)
17:17<path->i've saving gas
17:17<path->i think i've been eating a lot more lately though
17:18<erikh>well that's one way to save gas
17:18<erikh>eat more, fart less
17:18<HoopyCat>i qualify for welfare because i'm addicted to touch-up paint and bondo fumes
17:18<Mithshark>wanna buy my touch-up paint?
17:18<Mithshark>i don't think i even have any
17:19<HoopyCat>Mithshark: if your car is metallic silver, i have the same paint as you for tens of thousands less ;-)
17:19<Mithshark>Lexus hybrids start at $104k :|
17:19<Mithshark>yeah it is
17:19<HoopyCat>Mithshark: psst, lexus == toyota
17:19<Mithshark>I know :(
17:19<erikh>beat me to it
17:20<Mithshark>er, Lexus LS, they have cheaper models, nvm
17:20<Mithshark>I have a LX 570
17:20<straterr1>my corrola is a lexus?!
17:20<path->what a waste of money
17:20<Mithshark>yea straterr1!
17:20<path->just send it to me
17:20<HoopyCat>it's not entirely impossible to use lexus electronics in priuses...
17:20<Mithshark>I didn't pick it/buy it
17:20<erikh>straterr1: similar guts with extra useless features on the lexus as I understand it
17:20<path->car's > 100k
17:20<Mithshark>I would have been happier with a Checy Silverado z71 :D
17:21<mwalling>with todays gas prices?
17:21<erikh>similar to mini cooper == bmw
17:21<erikh>only the prices on those are much closer
17:21<Mithshark>er, Chavy*
17:21<HoopyCat>mmm, trucks
17:21<Mithshark>... Chevy*
17:21<HoopyCat>i get to navigate the tacoma in august
17:21<straterr1>I'd like to have a Mini
17:21<path->my gf wants a mini
17:21<erikh>me too, but when I went to the lot my own wife questioned my sexual preference
17:21<Mithshark>I generally disliek all Toyotas
17:21<mwalling>officemates wife has a mini
17:22<HoopyCat>my wife wants a smartcar
17:22<mwalling>slightly better then a lemon, and it has iDrive
17:22<Mithshark>I'd be scared to ever see my parents again if I sold the Lexus
17:22<mwalling>HoopyCat: now *that* is a fun car
17:22<path->i heard the gas milage isn't all that good on them
17:22<erikh>we got a jetta instead, much more practical
17:22<path->that they are as heavy as a tank
17:22<mwalling>path-: the smarts?
17:22<path->no mini
17:22<erikh>and really, they have some nice features.
17:22<Mithshark>My sister has a Passat
17:22-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
17:22<path->smartcars look funny
17:22<mwalling>HoopyCat: how would a smart handle the winter though
17:23<Mithshark>She got it in high school
17:23<path->put sleds on the front wheels
17:23<Mithshark>so it's like a 2000
17:23<mwalling>coworker here has one, he invents his own parking spaces with it
17:23<HoopyCat>mwalling: haven't driven one yet[1], but they look fun. i'm sure they'd probably be fine in the winter with snows... do they have handbrakes?
17:24<Mithshark>Newark working properly now?
17:24<HoopyCat>[1] we can't go to car dealerships or animal shelters without coming home with a regrettable addition to the family
17:24<mwalling>HoopyCat: sounds like my wife
17:24<erikh>yeah, sounds very familiar
17:25<cruxeternus>Mithshark: The city traffic is horrible, but the DC is fine.
17:25<erikh>I've been politely asking my legally-entitied-to-my-shit roommate to stop feeding anything with 4 legs in the neighborhood... now everytime I go out to smoke I feel like Ace Ventura
17:25<path->i wouldn't mind getting a nice new car, but lack of car payment is cheaper than fuel savings at this point
17:25<Mithshark>eh, New Jersey
17:25<HoopyCat>path-: Yes.
17:25<Mithshark>I live in ... Oklahoma :'(
17:25<mwalling>erikh: heh
17:26<HoopyCat>Mithshark: oklahoma isn't that bad. i hear it's actually ok.
17:26<cruxeternus>Mithshark: You should get in line for a Dallas Linode.
17:26<Mithshark>I want one, cruxeternus
17:26<Mithshark>Dallas is my #1, Fremont is #2
17:26<mwalling>Mithshark: ticket it
17:26<Mithshark>I was goign to wait until they were available
17:27<straterr1>I had a dallas
17:27<straterr1>I just moved to Newark
17:27<Mithshark>which Linode?
17:27<@caker>we're shipping hosts to Dallas this week, btw
17:27<straterr1>720 in dallas to 1440 in newark
17:27<mwalling>Mithshark: by then it might be too late, put in a ticket
17:27<straterr1>caker: you didn't tell me that -_-
17:27<Mithshark>[16:27:30] <straterr1> 720 in dallas to 1440 in newark
17:27<straterr1>I would have stayed in Dallas
17:27<mwalling>straterr1: you can migrate back!
17:27<Mithshark>Think his 720 might be available, caker?
17:28<straterr1>mwalling: but..that..took like FOREVER
17:28<linbot>caker: Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0
17:28<@caker>Mithshark: nope
17:28<straterr1>mwalling: and I don't want to burden the admins :/
17:28<@caker>If you want a specific location, send us a ticket. It's the only way we can keep track of demand
17:28*HoopyCat opens ticket for migration to other side of closed door
17:28<HoopyCat>... sorry, cat on keyboard
17:29<Peng>caker: Great. Are you also shipping hosts to Atlanta or Fremont?
17:29<@caker>Peng: nope. Just dallas and Newark for this batch
17:29*Bdragon cheers
17:29<Peng>caker: Oh, Newark too?
17:29<linbot>Peng: Newark360 - 38, Newark540 - 24, Newark720 - 15, Newark1080 - 2, Newark1440 - 1, Newark2880 - 1
17:29<@caker>we're in a holding pattern in Fremont -- they ain't got no more space.
17:30<Peng>caker: Oh.
17:30<mwalling>they should build a dc, just for you
17:30<Mithshark>Newark2880 - 1
17:30<Mithshark>I didn't know there was a 2880 :O
17:30<straterr1>Are migrations a lot of work for the Linode admins?
17:30<Peng>Mithshark: I think it's a month old.
17:30<@caker>straterr1: not at all
17:30-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:31<straterr1>Cause I feel like a douche with ticket 46369 lol
17:31<mwalling>straterr1: even if there was work involved, caker and tasaro make mikegrb do it all
17:31<straterr1>Oh..I don't feel bad then :D
17:31-!-Guest1696 [] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
17:32<Mithshark>pfft ticket 46447 >46369
17:32<Peng>Wasn't Fremont also the DC with the least power or cooling or whatever it was?
17:32<path->but it's he!
17:33<Mithshark>HE rocks :D
17:33<@caker>yeah... 15A per cabinet == 4 servers in a 42U rack :(
17:33<straterr1>Thats it?
17:33<path->that's horrible
17:33<path->why use a rack?
17:33<straterr1>Yeah..just toss them in a closet
17:33<straterr1>and shut the door
17:33<mwalling>with a space heater
17:34<tjfontaine>hair dryers!
17:34<straterr1>Servers need warmth too!
17:34<Peng>Wow.. Can't can one individual PSU use much more power than that?
17:34<cruxeternus>must have something do with California electricity prices / availability
17:34<path->dual power supply?
17:34<cruxeternus>really, when you think about it, a DC in California is pretty dumb
17:34<tjfontaine>cruxeternus: except for trying to get to .au
17:34<path->california has many lines to apnic places
17:34<tjfontaine>cruxeternus: the pigeons need a place to recharge
17:35<path->i read somewhere the other day that ca DCs aren't that overly expensive
17:35<path->it seemed odd to me
17:35<erikh>holy crap
17:35<erikh>I still have an account on slashdot
17:35<HoopyCat>according to it's not THAT expensive
17:35<cruxeternus>tjfontaine: really, when you think about it, what's worthwhile in .au?
17:36<mwalling>cruxeternus: Internat
17:36-!-Nickste [] has joined #linode
17:36<straterr1>What kind of uplink does Linode buy?
17:36<Nickste>Hi all :)
17:36<@caker>straterr1: usually dual gigabit
17:36<straterr1>For all of the Linodes?
17:36<HoopyCat>g'evening, Nickste!
17:37<Mithshark>er, dual gbit for the rack?
17:37<Mithshark>er cabinet
17:37<@caker>straterr1: that's into the DC's core network. The hosts themselves are gigE
17:37<straterr1>Yeah, I know the hosts are gigE
17:37<straterr1> all the linodes in the DC share the dual gigabit uplink?
17:38<straterr1>You couldn't get away with that here..
17:38<mwalling>caker: didnt you have utilization graphs from when TP upgraded you guys?
17:38<straterr1>Time warner charges out the ass for bandwidth
17:38<tjfontaine>TW or TWC?
17:38<@caker>mwalling: 70%->6% or something
17:38<mwalling>straterr1: ^^
17:38<@caker>which makes sense...
17:38<Nickste>I wonder if someone could help: I've followed this guide - - on setting up postfix and courier with TLS. I'm able to login and download emails using imap fine, but can't seem to send (have enabled TLS, etc in mail program).
17:38<Peng>What was Linode's first DC?
17:38<mwalling>straterr1: you should sell your macbook and buy an old host
17:38<straterr1>mwalling: why?
17:39<straterr1>How many procs are they?
17:39<Mithshark>ncurses is having issues it seems
17:39<mwalling>Peng: dallas... reading the old forum posts is fun
17:39<HoopyCat>straterr1: as in twtelecom? eh, they aren't THAT expensive
17:39<straterr1>HoopyCat: here they are
17:39<straterr1>HoopyCat: Especially for Gigabit :/
17:39<path->Peng: i would say to read the Linode entry in wikipedia
17:39<@caker>Mine was XO in Secaucus, NJ, but the first Linode hosts were sent to Dallas
17:39<path->but apparently, it's not important
17:39<Bdragon>Q) What do you get when you cross FedEx with a warez group? A) 0-day shipping!
17:39<Peng>path-: There isn't one.
17:40<mwalling>Nickste: logs? did you read and ?
17:40<Peng>mwalling: Okay. Thanks. :)
17:40<@caker>Bdragon: :)
17:40-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
17:40<mwalling>Peng: there used to be one, but it got "deleted"
17:40<Peng>mwalling: Of course.
17:41<Nickste>mwalling: I have gone through them (although will do so in more detail now). mail.log doesn't show any connection. Errmm... what should the outgoing mail port be set to in my mail app?
17:41<mwalling>Nickste: that depends, are you intending on sending mail to the smtp or the submission port?
17:41<HoopyCat>straterr1: keep in mind that you're probably also paying for more transport than linode is :-)
17:41<mwalling>(and no, i didnt read your tutorial)
17:41<mwalling>Nickste: 587
17:42<HoopyCat>you get a hundred customers paying for dual gig links and suddenly those gig WAN links to elboniatel become a lot less expensive...
17:42<Nickste>hrmmm.. that's strange. After following the configuration, I have ports 143 and 993 open. No 587..?
17:42<Nickste>and no smtp
17:42<straterr1>I know we pay out the ass for our 8mbit pipe
17:43<mwalling>Nickste: are you determining this with nmap? netstat?
17:43<mwalling>Nickste: is postfix even running?
17:43<jcn>dear sorbs. fuck you.
17:43<mwalling>use netstat, and make sure postfix is running.
17:43<HoopyCat>straterr1: whereabouts are you? we had a 30mb/sec pipe to twtelecom and i'm trying to remember how much it cost.
17:43<mwalling>HoopyCat: indiana
17:43<HoopyCat>indiana! luxury.
17:43<straterr1>HoopyCat: Indianapolis :/
17:43<Nickste>Errmmm.. I'm dobting myself now.. Lemme chek
17:44<HoopyCat>straterr1: hmm, that wouldn't be telcove land would it?
17:44<straterr1>TW has one of the few decent DC's here
17:44<straterr1>I've never hard of I assume not lol
17:44<mwalling>Nickste: also, #postfix on freenode has both a number of people smarter then me, *and* annoying bot factoids i can trigger
17:44<Dave>jcn: my sentiments exactly
17:44<Nickste>ahh, thanks mwalling, I'll try that as well. Thanks :)
17:44<HoopyCat>oh wait, level3 sucked up telcove, nevermind. then who did twtelecom suck up...
17:45<straterr1>I'm heading babysit
17:45<mwalling>babysit your macbook>
17:45<straterr1>Poor baby gets lonely
17:46<HoopyCat>straterr1: laters :-)
17:46<mwalling>no ircing while driving
17:46<straterr1>I IRC and drive well
17:46<mwalling>says your poor beat up car
17:46<HoopyCat>*** Signoff: straterr1 (Connection reset by jersey barrier)
17:47<straterr1>My car isn't beat up!
17:47-!-straterr1 [] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
17:47<straterra>It's not
17:48<Mithshark>so I still can't ssh to Newark15, is it problems there, or on my end?
17:48<straterra>My Newark issues are fixed
17:48<mwalling>Mithshark: traceroute/mtr?
17:49<straterra>mwalling: you lie
17:49<cruxeternus>I have ssh connectivity to newark15. :P
17:49<straterra>Broken motor mounts != beat up...
17:49<straterra>broken motor mounts == leet torque
17:49<linbot>New news from blog: Introducing the Linode API <>
17:51<cruxeternus>that's great guys, but where are the OCaml bindings?
17:52<Bdragon>Ooh, look, a volunteer :P
17:53<bd_>it'd be convenient to be able to get the api keys of limited users right from the user manager (as a master account)
17:53<@caker>I'll fixerate that
17:53<cruxeternus>tomorrow :P
17:54<@caker>bd_: I still have a fix for the other DNS bug you reported in my queue, too
17:54<bd_>ah, good to hear :)
17:54-!-mwkohout [] has joined #linode
17:55<Peng>/topic the API?
17:56<erikh>anyone working on a ruby port of these?
17:56<@mikegrb>mmm cake
17:56<pbryan>mmm cake
17:56<erikh>or a simple CLI tool?
17:56-!-caker changed the topic of #linode to: Linode Community Support | | Introducing the Linode API -
17:56<cruxeternus>erikh: you are
17:56<pbryan>Kudos to Linode on the API work so far.
17:56<erikh>cruxeternus: well that's why I was asking.
17:57<@caker>erikh: yeah -- not that I know of
17:57<Dave>erikh: tjfontaine's python one have a cli tool
17:57<@caker>pbryan: :)
17:57*cruxeternus wants api functionality via lish :P
17:57<erikh>it'll give me an excuse to write WDDX libs that run under libxml2 as well
17:59-!-mwkohout [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:00<erikh>Dave: ah, sweet
18:00<tjfontaine>it even does required parameter detection, and knows all the possible optional parameters
18:00<erikh>I don't have any need for the DNS api, but anticipate there'll be other twiddly bits I'll want to mess with eventually.
18:00<Dave>tjfontaine: If I could understand your awful python that would be awesome :(
18:01<Dave>thats not me saying that _your_ python is awful, just that python is awful
18:01-!-linville [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:01<erikh>tjfontaine: neat, I've only skimmed the docs at this point, is there a way to get that list from the server?
18:01<tjfontaine>heh I was just asking that question :)
18:01<tjfontaine>erikh: required / option parameter list?
18:02<Peng>Eek. Git.
18:02<tjfontaine>at the moment no, methods and parameters are not published via an api method :)
18:02<erikh>something like CAPABILITY from IMAP :)
18:02<tjfontaine>we discussed it with caker, in the long run it would be pretty difficult to maintain on the CFM side I think
18:03<tjfontaine>without say the use of something like soap which we know we all hate. </speaking for everyone>
18:03<tjfontaine>the only reason I agreed to do the python bindings is because it was *not* soap based :)
18:03<erikh>I don't know CFM, but I imagine a general introspection method would save maintenance on all levels
18:04<erikh>that said, I imagine there would be security concerns.
18:04*Bdragon is a bit of an xml-rpc fan...
18:04*erikh too
18:04<tjfontaine>erikh: introspecition only gets you so far, the complex information about required parameters based on specific other paramter values becomes difficult
18:04<erikh>I was praying there was a xml-rpc layer, I already have mature tools for that.
18:04<tjfontaine>erikh: at some point you will end up manually inputing the information
18:05<erikh>I disagree, but I've not enough energy to argue it.
18:05<Bdragon>Could always write a quick little WebService::Linode <-> XMLRPC glue shim in perl ;)
18:05-!-Dustin [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:06-!-Dustin [] has joined #linode
18:06<JasonF>oooh. API!
18:06<tjfontaine>erikh: I use a significant amount of evil to automatically generate the methods already, at some point it becomes too much to explain that if TYPE=MX PRIORITY is required, in a quick, efficient, utilitarian means
18:07<tjfontaine>erikh: irgeek and myself hashed out a few mechanisms, but in the end it was just as fast for me to quickly define required param list, optional param list, and then stick complex comparisons in the method body
18:20*caker bonks JasonF
18:20<JasonF>why am I bonked?
18:20<tjfontaine>you probably made the error logs
18:20<@caker>roll over the "Linode API Perl Bindings" link -- look at the URL
18:21<JasonF>I consider myself bonked.
18:21<Battousai>i demand a screenshot
18:21<tjfontaine>Battousai: of?
18:21<Bdragon>hee hee..
18:21<Battousai>that link upon rollover
18:22<Bdragon>my $api = new WebService::Linode(apikey => 'mmmcake');
18:22<tjfontaine>linode = api.Api('sekritmmmcakekey')
18:22-!-fred [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:22<cruxeternus>omg! I have the same password on my luggage!
18:23<CpuID>hmm an API hey
18:25-!-Nickste [] has quit []
18:27<Peng>Is it just me, or has been slashdotted?
18:28-!-fred [] has joined #linode
18:29<charlie>Peng: whaa?
18:29<Bdragon>I rang, but there was no answer.
18:29<Bdragon>Just... silence...
18:29*erikh drops a pin
18:30<charlie>i should consider making that site Peng
18:30<Dave>I made ruby download a list of domains I have :)
18:30*Dave is clever
18:30<erikh>mikegrb: btw, on your CPAN user page, one of the Linode modules is spelled wrong and leads to a dead link.
18:30<charlie>oh shoot, i should have released my PHP library
18:31<@mikegrb>erikh: hahaha thanks
18:31<Peng>charlie: Heh.
18:31<@caker>charlie: it's not too late...
18:31<@mikegrb>I wondered why the index was showing it as unfound
18:31<Peng>Huh, everybody's using Git.
18:31<erikh>btw, is that a PAUSE feature or a part of META.yml? I need to package something soon for CPAN.
18:31-!-bliblok [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:31<charlie>caker: its really ugly, i'll just call it alpha quality code
18:31<mwalling>so, anyone have recomendations of a iPod management thingy thats *NOT* RythemBox?
18:32<@mikegrb>erikh: that's from the registered namespaces
18:32<erikh>mwalling: on the iPod itself or a client software?
18:32<erikh>mikegrb: ah!
18:32<charlie>mwalling: you mean rockbox?
18:32<Dave>mwalling: rhythembox sucks, it doesnt actually remove the stuff off the ipod!
18:32<charlie>oh, a desktop software to manage your ipod
18:32<charlie>no i use itunes
18:32<erikh>mwalling: I've had good success with amarok.
18:32<Dave>banshee does, however its a bit ott for a music thing
18:33<HoopyCat>charlie: they've released it for slackware? good thousand island's ghost!
18:33<erikh>if you hook it into kdesu properly it happily prompts you when it needs to mount and eject the device
18:33<erikh>hooking is really trivial. also, if you have a account, you can set it up to dump your played settings there.
18:33*mwalling apt-gets
18:33<erikh>(on mount)
18:34<mwalling>amarok pulls in 41 deps
18:35<erikh>mwalling: there's an extensive page on setting it up should you have trouble on the amarok site.
18:35<erikh>mwalling: it's heavily dependent on KDE
18:35<erikh>very worth it, IMO.
18:35-!-dacoffey [] has joined #linode
18:35<erikh>(not KDE, amarok)
18:35<mwalling>i've used amarok before tyvm
18:35<erikh>oh. )
18:35<mwalling>slackware includes kde
18:36<Bdragon>It be on disk 3 in the last release
18:36<cruxeternus>KDE 2.1
18:36<mwalling>cruxeternus: +1.8
18:36<mwalling>or 1.6
18:36<mwalling>or major mathfial
18:39<dacoffey>guys, earlier today i started getting a crazy amount of inbound port 25 network traffic, it looks like i am getting a ton of automated reply email spam from other servers ... what should i do?
18:39-!-hobbes006 [] has joined #linode
18:39<mwalling>if your MTA is configured correctly all you need to worry about is rotating your logs so they dont get too big :)
18:40<dacoffey>i think it is configured correctly, but it seems to be slowing the box down, too much io?
18:40<hobbes006>hi... any linode admin around? my linode on dallas38 just crashed... not sure what happened.
18:41<iggy>hobbes006: check the log in lish
18:41<hobbes006>i am in ssh
18:42<hobbes006>managed to get in after rebooting in linode manager. before that, i could not get in via ssh.
18:42-!-paulcager_ [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
18:42<mwalling>dacoffey: single source ip?
18:42<mwalling>dacoffey: are you running any rbls?
18:42<iggy>hobbes006: if you rebooted, I don't think there's any way to figure out what went wrong
18:43<hobbes006>o. damn.
18:43<mwalling>hobbes006: did you look at lish?
18:43<hobbes006>no i didnt.
18:44<mwalling>out of band access *cough*
18:44<hobbes006>mwalling: out of band access?
18:45<mwalling>as in "not in band"
18:45<hobbes006>meaning ? sorry i am not superb in server administration.
18:45<hobbes006>so plain speak, if possible :)
18:46-!-cmantito [] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
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18:47<@caker>hobbes006: you OOMed
18:47<hobbes006>what's OOM ? :p
18:47<iggy>out of memory
18:47<dacoffey>mwalling: no, tons and tons of random ips ... i don't run rbls, i forward all mail on to gmail
18:47<hobbes006>ah ok. so how do i fix this?
18:47<iggy>get more memory
18:48<hobbes006>didnt know i used that much ram.
18:48<iggy>tweak daemons to use less memory
18:49<dacoffey>hobbes006: apache+mysql can eat a lot of ram up if not tweaked
18:49<hobbes006>i noticed my CPU usuage went crazy about 4 hours ago
18:49<hobbes006>it was abnormal to say the least.
18:49<erikh>given the predicament, you probably started thrashing
18:49<hobbes006>but now that i have rebooted, CPU usage has gone back to "normal" levels.
18:51<hobbes006>and my sites are up again.
18:51<hobbes006>how do i check what caused the spike in CPU usage ?
18:51<erikh>hobbes006: humor me and paste the Mem: line from free -m
18:52<iggy>your linode ran out of memory which means it was probably swapping a lot, i.e. lots of kernel cpu time spent moving memory pages around and trying to kill stuff off
18:53<erikh>hobbes006: and that's from a fresh boot, right?
18:53-!-paulcager [] has joined #linode
18:53<erikh>chances are you need to make the 'free' column at least double that if you want any sanity
18:53<hobbes006>erikh: yes. CPU usage are back to normal after reboot. no idea what caused the spike 4 hours ago
18:53-!-paulcager [] has quit []
18:54<erikh>we're trying to tell you what probably caused it
18:54<hobbes006>erikh: ok. double means? upgrading my plan?
18:55<erikh>for some reason, you started using a lot more memory and thus some of your running programs were pushed into swap. when they got to their turn in the run queue, the swap was traded into your physical memory and something else was sacrificed into swap. this transaction, repeated ad nauseam, uses a significant amount of CPU and depending on your situation can render your box completely unresponsive
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18:56<hobbes006>erikh: i have a bad feeling it has something to do with mongrels.
18:56<hobbes006>erikh: it seems that ever since i set up my mongrel instances, the server has a habit of crashing every once a month.
18:57-!-ondrej [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:57<erikh>rails is... not very memory efficient.
18:57<erikh>and the way mongrel tends to work, and the way it tends to crash does not help your situation at all.
18:57<hobbes006>yes. i wish there was a comparable bug tracker like redmine written in django or something.
18:57<erikh>I assume you're running mongrel with a mod_proxy frontend?
18:58<erikh>I haven't used redmine... trac is slow as snot but it's pretty powerful.
18:58<erikh>and you can embed it into apache with mod_python which might actually help with the memory usage.
18:59<hobbes006>erikh: not sure what is a mod_proxy frontend but this is how i set up my apache config:
18:59<hobbes006>i looked into trac but ended up going with redmine as redmine has much better features.
18:59<erikh>yeah, that's mod_proxy under apache, how most mongrel setups work.
18:59-!-Mithshark [] has quit []
19:00<erikh>hobbes006: the other option is that there's a fairly recent mod_rails implementation out there
19:00<erikh>embedding rails directly into apache.
19:00-!-mendel [] has quit [Quit: mendel]
19:00<erikh>I've heard some good things about it, but I'm not a big fan of rails myself.
19:00<hobbes006>erikh: sounds good. i will look into this option and hopefully that will stabilize the redmine install once and for all.
19:00<hobbes006>thank you for the tip.
19:00<hobbes006>i am learning django... converting from php.
19:00<erikh>yeah, it's got some funny web-2.0 market-speak name, it's just called mod_rails by people who don't work for the company
19:01<hobbes006>looked into rails and decided it wasn't really my cup of tea as well.
19:01<jetlag>I just restarted mysql and apache2 and freed up 46 megs.
19:01<erikh>"phusion passenger"
19:01<erikh>jetlag: most programs don't fill their lookup tables with garbage on startup
19:02<hobbes006>man... nice site. that's the thing i like about rails community. their design and marketing skill rocks.. all their sites look pretty as daisy.
19:02<erikh>that 46M still belongs to apache and mysql :)
19:02<erikh>hobbes006: heh, but the guts sure don't look pretty
19:02<erikh>ever peek at the activerecord core? :)
19:02<hobbes006>erikh: django community could do with a bit of that marketing savvy!
19:03<hobbes006>no... havent looked at activerecord core before. i am not that skilled... just a normal developer.
19:03<hobbes006>with average skills.
19:04<erikh>eh, it looks like some mutated beast from a satanic mating ritual between bjarne stroustrop and martin fowler
19:04-!-r3z [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:04<hobbes006>but i need to look into mod_rails... mongrels have been giving me grieve for months... it has a monthly... erm... thing. i bet this bunch of mongrels are female.
19:04-!-r3z [] has joined #linode
19:04<HoopyCat>mmmm... rule 34...
19:04<linbot>New news from forums: DDoS attacks and the Three Strikes "Policy" in General Discussion <>
19:04<hobbes006>erikh: haha. what a way to describe it :)
19:04-!-shakr [] has joined #linode
19:06<hobbes006>thanks again guys.. for giving me advice to fix this server crash... as usual, linode admins and linde community rocks :)
19:06<Xel>Hey caker - any chance of you adding a Darwin kernel + distro?
19:06<erikh>hobbes006: ooh!
19:06<erikh>one more thing
19:06<Xel>I hear it works on Xen
19:06<Xel>And I'd love to be able to mess around with that.
19:06<hobbes006>erikh: yes ?
19:06<erikh>if you end up stuck with mongrel, look at nginx for the frontend
19:06<erikh>it's basically the proxy features of apache and little more
19:06<erikh>lightweight and great for running things like mongrel.
19:06<hobbes006>ok. sounds good! i have been wanting to look into nginx for ages! now i have an excuse :)
19:07<erikh>Xel: I'd love to have FreeBSD personally :)
19:07-!-paulcager [] has joined #linode
19:07<hobbes006>THANKS ONCE AGAIN. :) linode rocks.
19:07<erikh>FreeBSD + lish is an excellent combo
19:07-!-hobbes006 [] has left #linode []
19:07<erikh>(or would be, rather)
19:08<bob2>then we can call it 'freenode'!
19:08<Xel>erikh: Well me first :P
19:08<erikh>bob2: heh!
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19:17-!-TheFirst [] has joined #linode
19:17-!-paulcager is now known as paulcager_
19:18<HoopyCat>``I presented the idea of entropy informally recently as "when you put a frog in a blender, the bits that are no longer frog".'' -- AJ Rosenthal
19:19*HoopyCat looks at blender and empty one-time pad, and hmms.
19:23<Xel>caker must be on the phone.
19:24<cruxeternus>Xel: Or.... he could be home... since it's 2.5 hours past end-of-business :P
19:27<Zotnix>I told my teacher about Linode. He was astonished. He used to be a software engineer and tells me he's getting old :p
19:27<cruxeternus>Linode made him feel old?
19:30<Xel>caker works and lives at the same place.
19:32<@caker>I do?
19:32<CaptObviousman>yes, you do
19:32*caker looks around
19:32-!-Justin [] has joined #linode
19:32<CaptObviousman>get with the program!
19:32<CaptObviousman>here in an hour, you'll have dinner (meatloaf, don't forget your sippy cup) followed by crafts, then wrapping up the evening with a singalong
19:33<mwalling>caker obviously sleeps under his desk
19:33-!-Justin is now known as Guest1722
19:33<CaptObviousman>then you'll get tucked into bed by a very nice lady named Gladys
19:33<CaptObviousman>she's 68 and smells of menthols
19:33<@caker>wait .. other Linode employees have DESKS?!
19:33*caker complains to the boss
19:35<Xel>I knew you'd be here
19:35<Xel>caker - any chance for darwin kernel support in xen?
19:35<Xel>So I could do some OSX-ish development?
19:35<mwalling>i want windows first!
19:36<@caker>Xel: very, very little chance
19:36<Xel>caker: What's the big roadblock?
19:36-!-dacoffey [] has joined #linode
19:36<path->i would think licensing would pose a problem
19:36-!-Guest1722 [] has quit []
19:37<bd_>Does darwin even have a xen port?
19:37<iggy>it could run hvm
19:37<avongauss>not to advocate, but it would be cool. as far as licensing, didn't they just change the OS X server licensing for virtual?
19:37<bd_>caker: You should just allow people to upload xen kernels on a strictly at-your-own-risk basis :)
19:37<Xel>avongauss: Darwin is open-source
19:37<mwalling>darwin is under bsd i thought
19:37<iggy>avongauss: it has to run apple hardware though
19:37<bd_>iggy: qemu has a history of security issues...
19:37<path->oh, darwin as opposed to osx
19:37<avongauss>iggy: good point.
19:38<bd_>at least, it would be measurably less secure than it is now, by allowing hvm
19:39<avongauss>on a side note, I believe I've gotten the bs=1024 bug to surface 4 times in the last day, but I still can not get it to do it on command.
19:40<iggy>use less files
19:40<CaptObviousman>you know, Gladys is a single woman
19:40<CaptObviousman>maybe you can snag a date with her caker
19:41<path->why should linode support anything other than linux?
19:41<Pryon>Yeah, I'd think 1 kind of nutjob is enough to deal with
19:41<Xel>path-: If there's demand for it...
19:41<path->well, that wasn't exactly what i was thinking, but sure..
19:42<Xel>Seriously, imagine how many OSX developers would want a remote dev platform
19:42<Xel>For super-cheap
19:42<iggy>yeah, otherwise, we'll have so many more idiots in here requiring us to hold their hand for days and days on end
19:42<Xel>Making binary-compatible apps
19:42<linbot>Pryon: Linode360 - 36, Linode540 - 25, Linode720 - 15, Linode1080 - 2, Linode1440 - 1, Linode2880 - 1
19:42<mwalling>avongauss: details! details!
19:42<Xel>path, "we"?
19:42<Xel>You don't work here.
19:42<Xel>You not liking it isn't a reason that someone shouldn't ask about it
19:42<path->i never said we
19:42<Xel>iggy did
19:42<Xel>Stupid BX
19:43<avongauss>mwalling: I tried several different ways, but it boils down to what caker originally said, create lots-a-files
19:43<path->you're crossing the streams :)
19:43<Xel>Yes, I am
19:43<mwalling>mine was reading
19:43<avongauss>mwalling: in this last case, more than a single folder can hold with a bs of 1024.
19:43<iggy>yeah, because we (this channel) have been hand holding a lot of complete idiots lately
19:43<Xel>iggy, that's your choice.
19:43<mwalling>avongauss: are you fscking after each?
19:43<Xel>You can't volunteer for something like that and then complain as if something bad had been thrust upon you.
19:44<iggy>"I can't compile a program" "I can't figure out how to use irssi, so I'm going to try to setup some crazy irc proxy"
19:44<scorche|sh>indeed...i was content on being a jerk
19:44<path->i think linode does a fine job with linux.. maybe they'd be able to support other operating systems with the same tools and support, but i wouldn't want negative impact on my level of service
19:44<avongauss>mwalling: some ways yes, some ways no. trying different variations to see which one can do it repeatedly
19:44<iggy>I'm not complaining, just saying we don't need any more of it
19:44<Xel>path, of course.
19:44<avongauss>mwalling: I've never had the fs go ro, but I have seen issues when doing fsck.
19:44<Xel>I didn't want other service reduced
19:44<Pryon>It seems like they have trouble keeping linodes on the shelf, anyway.
19:45<Xel>Just wanted to see if they could add one additional thing.
19:45<mwalling>tjfontaine: read scrollback from the last 5 minutes
19:45<mwalling>mikegrb: read what i said to tj
19:45<Xel>iggy: Maybe YOU don't, but I'm sure caker would not mind more business.
19:45<linbot>mwalling: Linode360 - 36, Linode540 - 25, Linode720 - 15, Linode1080 - 2, Linode1440 - 1, Linode2880 - 1
19:45<iggy>they've got plenty of business
19:45<Xel>And more never hurts.
19:46<Xel>I don't think that there are many businesses that will have future success that say "Well, we don't want more business. Let's refuse additional customers"
19:46<Xel>Linode isn't at capacity
19:46*scorche|sh suspects iggy of being a valley girl
19:46<iggy>install virtualbox if you want to do questionably legal development
19:47<Xel>How would using darwin be questionably legal?
19:47<iggy>the osx side
19:47<erikh>plenty of businesses artificially limit themselves to maintain scope, customer service and control
19:47<avongauss>I don't believe virtualbox can run OS X yet... :(
19:47-!-Alucard [] has quit [Quit: Oro?]
19:48<erikh>so perhaps caker should be the one speaking for what he does and does not want to do
19:48<iggy>he said already
19:48<erikh>oh, damn
19:48*erikh missed an excellent trolling opportunity.
19:48<iggy>18:36 <@ caker> Xel: very, very little chance
19:48<Xel>Yea, I saw.
19:48<Xel>And I asked why.
19:48<Xel>iggy: Mellow out, eh?
19:49<cruxeternus>I'm getting OpenBSD before you're getting OS X, pal. :P
19:49<iggy>that was for someone else's benefit
19:49<Xel>cruxeternus: Hah no!
19:49<iggy>I'm done arguing with you
19:49<mwalling>Xel: servers arent that expensive, xen is free...
19:49<Xel>mwalling: yea, but colo is, compared to linode's wonderful pricing.
19:50<Xel>I love the linode service
19:50<erikh>there's a lot more overhead in colocation
19:50<erikh>that's why I'm not constantly whining about freebsd. it doesn't matter that much.
19:50<Xel>This is the first I've ever asked about this
19:51<erikh>well you're doing a very good job of it.
19:51<CaptObviousman>IRC PENIS CONTEST
19:51<Pryon>(1) License the dashboard from linode (2) Colo. (3) Profit!
19:51*CaptObviousman automatically wins
19:52<mwalling>Pryon: 1 is impossible
19:52<avongauss>buy server, switches, consoles, build cage, establish contracts with dcs, ..., .... - one heck of a first step
19:52-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:54<CaptObviousman>it's not something you do lightly, let's put it that way
19:54<CaptObviousman>maybe if you're rich and bored you start your own company to do it
19:54<CaptObviousman>but there's a Very Large Gap between saying "You can do it" and actually doing it
19:56<erikh>there's plenty of inbetweens to that
19:56<erikh>from colocating 2U to renting your own box
19:56<erikh>still, however, migrating data centers is a lot more involved and expensive and RAID costs significantly more :)
19:57<erikh>which reminds me...
19:57<CaptObviousman>aren't 3ware cards around $250 a pop?
19:58-!-luca [] has joined #linode
19:58<erikh>never work for an internet entrepeneur with ADD
19:58<@mikegrb>not the ones we use
19:58<erikh>you'll never have time to do anything but install software
19:59<path->setup, next, next, next, finish!
20:00<CpuID>ive got a 3ware 2port sata card, somewhere around $300 i paid i think
20:00<CpuID>16 port cards are a bit different :P
20:00<CaptObviousman>how much, mikegrb?
20:00<@mikegrb>well they are 3ware 9xxx with bbu
20:00<CpuID>mmm :)
20:01<CpuID>05:00.0 RAID bus controller: 3ware Inc 9650SE SATA-II RAID (rev 01)
20:01<CpuID>bbu = batt backed up cache
20:01<CaptObviousman>is there an equivalent to newegg for server gear?
20:01<@mikegrb>newegg sells 3ware
20:01-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
20:04<HoopyCat>oh sweet balls of cthulhu
20:04-!-jm [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:05<HoopyCat>can of cat food should not be wet and stuck to shelf.
20:06<path->is the can dented?
20:06<Pryon>Yay botulism!
20:06-!-Rayhale [] has joined #linode
20:07<tjfontaine>mwalling: hmm
20:08-!-pbryan [~pbryan@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:09<tjfontaine>avongauss: you create lots of files then do an fsck? and define "issues" when doing an fsck
20:09<tjfontaine>I didn't purposefully do an fsck, I was expecting to break the directory structure in general
20:12<tjfontaine>you would think if the issue is just 'create a bunch of fies' and fsck *boom* that we'd see a lot more people hitting it
20:12<tjfontaine>and not just linode, it would be outside of xen too
20:12<path->i *thought* it happened after my host rebooted
20:13<path->when my linode booted up, mysql was messed up and i just quickly rebooted without poking around too much
20:13<tjfontaine>the problem is as sinister as caker says, though. you don't see the corruption until the next read
20:13<bd_>is this the 1kb issue?
20:13<tjfontaine>bs 1k yes
20:13<path->but the entire host was booting at the same time, and i'm not 100% positive it was the same thing, but i do have a 1k fs
20:13<@caker>money if it can be reliably reproduced.
20:14<bd_>jeez, you should've told me before I purged those fsck images that mysteriously failed to fsck in xen but worked fine on native hardware :|
20:14<@caker>bd_: that reminds me
20:15<Rayhale>Umm Hello? I'm newbie who just looking though VPS providers.
20:15<tjfontaine>bd_: in your xen or in linode specificaly?
20:15<@caker>lots of talk on LKML lately about fixing the ext3 sanity checks and surrounding code for dealing with BadData ..
20:15<tjfontaine>Rayhale: hi
20:15<cruxeternus>hi Rayhale
20:15<@caker>fsfuzzer or some evil tool that'll write random bits and then perform an fsck
20:16<bd_>tjfontaine: In linode; there was a host crash, and some fs corruption, and fsck kept crashing. So I painstakingly copied the image out, in the hopes of debugging, and suddenly it worked fine on my machine at home, same version of fsck.
20:16<bd_>I had backups, so I didn't lose anything... I chalked it up to weirdness at the time, but I now see I should've kept the images around :)
20:17<Rayhale>Sorry to ask, is VPS newbie-friendly? someday I like to learn how to run command line on server. so.. sorry for newbie question.
20:17<scorche|sh>Rayhale: never a time like the present to learn
20:17<@caker>Rayhale: Linode's a great place to learn Linux, in my opinion.
20:17<tjfontaine>Rayhale: linode more so than others
20:17<bd_>I really did go to insane lengths to get them too - involving parallel dd-over-ssh-to-EC2 and other funstuff
20:17<Rayhale>wow.. nice..
20:17<@caker>Rayhale: it's super simple to redeploy or experiment with cool stuff
20:18<path->Rayhale: it's a very easy way to learn linux because you can play and make different hard drive images and boot different distros
20:18<scorche|sh>you screw up something and you can have a brand new installation in a few minutes :)
20:18<bd_>Unlike certain other providers, you don't need to prepay three months either ;)
20:18<Rayhale>I assured you have reomte Reboot or/and reinstall OS as free? they need for that.
20:18<bd_>Rayhale: sure :)
20:18<Rayhale>brb change font. too hard to read.
20:19<path->there is an ajax web console and a way to ssh to the console
20:19<path->and you can shutdown/reboot from a linode manager
20:19<bd_>or lish
20:19<bd_>sysrq b :D
20:19<path->and you can run your own ssh on the linode
20:19<Rayhale>will be have CentOS 5?
20:20<path->that's one of the choices i think
20:20*bd_ looks
20:20<path->also fedora, debian, ubuntu
20:20<@mikegrb>! people still use slackware?!?!
20:20<path->i think there is some weird distro called slackware too
20:20<bd_>yep, it's there
20:21<Rayhale>aww.. I seem can't find to change font via MIRC.
20:21<HoopyCat>bd_: i think i remember that day :-)
20:22<HoopyCat>ok, i still feel like rancid cat food juice. i'm going to take a shower.
20:22<Pryon>Rayhale: Understand that, with linode, you'll learn by doing
20:22<bd_>I might have some of the errors I was having in my IRC logs, if it helps the debugging. *shrug*
20:22<Rayhale>True, Pryon. :)
20:22<Pryon>Rayhale: It's a great community, but you're in the driver's seat.
20:23<path->linode just gives you a blank slate to work with
20:23<bd_>and, if you join the channel, you'll have half a dozen backseat drivers shouting (at times conflicting) advice ;)
20:23<Pryon>at times?
20:23<path->you need to configure all the services
20:23<bd_>Pryon: well, occasionally sleep cycles will align
20:23<Rayhale>Mmmm.. good point
20:24<bd_>and only one person will be left :)
20:24<Pryon>just pray it's not mwalling
20:24<path->linode is good for trying out and learning, they are also insanely fair when it comes to billing
20:24<path->everything is prorated
20:24<path->most places want you to pay for months at a time
20:25<path->and if you cancel, you lost half a month's fee
20:25<bd_>they'd really like you to pay annually, but don't force you :P
20:25<Rayhale>ha ha.. yeah.
20:25<path->you can get extra disk that way
20:25<Pryon>Also, they don't send the goons if you happen to let your CC expire and they can't invoice you
20:25<bd_>path-: that deal's going away soon, I think
20:25<path->i paid for a month and then switched to yearly once i liked what i found
20:25<Rayhale>Yeah I check one of my fav. place to look is WHT forum
20:26<bd_>path-: caker was mentioning something about switching to a discount instead (with existing yearly customers grandfathered in)
20:26*path- shrugs
20:26<Rayhale>Thanks for advice, all of you.
20:27<path->no problem!
20:28<Rayhale>May I ask for address for ping? if not, I understand.
20:28<path->see that forum, there are links to do a download test
20:29<path->more real life than icmp
20:29<Rayhale>Aww... download test.. no offease.. it not much helpful at my end.
20:29<path->well you can ping those hosts too
20:30<Rayhale>Ok. thanks
20:30<bd_>a download test host can be pinged (modulo firewalls) - not necessarily so the other way :)
20:31<Peng>bd_: Switching from the 50% extra disk space to a discount?
20:31<bd_>Peng: I'll probably stick with the disk space.
20:32<Peng>Me too.
20:32<Peng>Unless it's a huge discount, the disk space is very appetizing.
20:32<Peng>(I'm still on monthly payments though.)
20:33<Peng>(But getting another 6 GB of disk space is something to look forward to whenever I decide to switch. ;) )
20:33<bd_>Peng: switch fast if you want the disk space :)
20:33<Rayhale>I wonder is possiable to learn linux via desktop Linux on my pc as command line, or not same as server is?
20:33<bd_>Rayhale: it's pretty much the same
20:33-!-lakin [] has joined #linode
20:33<Peng>bd_: Maybe this is just a trick to get monthly people to switch. :D
20:34<bd_>Peng: maybe! :)
20:34<Rayhale>Ok thanks bd.
20:34<path->with a linode, you are only using the cli
20:34<bd_>either way yearly payments -> more money onhand -> more servers -> more customers -> OSHI LOOP
20:34<path->since it's a colocated server
20:34<Rayhale>I aware that.
20:34<path->but it's probably the best way to learn how linux really works
20:34-!-jcn [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:34<Rayhale>Desktop linux able to do cli as well.
20:34-!-Iahova [] has joined #linode
20:35<path->yea, but with a gui, you may use distro specific tools and not have an understanding of the os beneath
20:35<path->which is linux's strength
20:35<Rayhale>Yearly payments.. not wise for me. hee. :D
20:35<path->you can change in the middle of the month and it'll all be prorated
20:36<bd_>actually it'll take effect at the end of the month, for switching to yearly
20:36<Peng>bd_: Hm.
20:36<path->and i think there is a money back 7 day guaruntee
20:36<bd_>you get the diskspace upgrade right away, though
20:36<Peng>path-: There is.
20:36<path->i can't speel
20:36<Rayhale>rare to see money back guaruntee on VPS level. I understand why.
20:37<path->linode is really fair and treats their customers very very well
20:37<path->like they gave everyone more disk because of their 5th birthday
20:37<Rayhale>As I see, your IRC chat seem good and helpful
20:37<erikh>i like it
20:37<CpuID>heh we get disk space almost every year :)
20:38<CpuID>no ones complaining of course hehe
20:38<path->not mine, the employee's are the ones with @'s
20:39<Rayhale>oh.. is howtoforge site good place to start learn?
20:39<Peng>linbot: ping
20:39<Peng>Just checking if he supported it. :)
20:40<Rayhale>pong.. hee old video game.. I miss that.
20:40<path->i've found useful information on that site
20:40<path->just about any linode howto will be applicable to a linode.. it's just a linux server
20:40<Rayhale>I understand.
20:41-!-Akazawa [] has joined #linode
20:41<Rayhale>is I able to intsall Lxadmia? (contral panel)
20:42<Akazawa>does anyone here know how to import sql files to mysql?
20:42<path->mysql dbname < foo.sql
20:42<Rayhale>altough I know little about cPanel but.. it is about 265 RAM if I remember correctly.
20:42*Bdragon prefers source ;)
20:43<path->most of us use the cli and vim instead of cpanel/webmin and so forth
20:43<Rayhale>Yeah seem so.
20:44<Rayhale>alright, Thanks Path!
20:45<path->no problem :)
20:45-!-Rayhale [] has quit [Quit: Sorry but Ciao]
20:46-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:46<Bdragon>pretty color for the bottom links... Dunno if it fits in though...
20:50-!-hal14450 [] has joined #linode
20:53<hal14450>i'm curious if there will ever be support for the zaptel driver that asterisk uses for features like music on hold and meetme conferences
20:54<@caker>it already exists
20:54<hal14450>wow that's a bonus
20:54<@caker>someone needs to update that to the latest Xen kernel, however
20:55<@caker> <-- kernel source for "Latest 2.6" is in there, too
20:55<hal14450>oh man this opens up some possibilities for having failover even ;-)
20:55-!-RiverRat [] has joined #linode
20:55<@caker>how so?
20:56<hal14450>well we already an asterisk ded box and if it ever went down we could use the linode
20:57<hal14450>so i just need to switch to xen then eh?
20:57<@caker>We're shipping hosts to Dallas, and Newawk has availability now -- all Xen
20:57<hal14450>thanks caker that's very good news
20:58<hal14450>i'm hosted in dallas currently
20:58<straterra>Who builds the kernels?
20:58<@caker>I do
20:58<mwalling>he does
21:00-!-mendel [] has joined #linode
21:01<hal14450>anything special to consider in the switch to xen ?
21:01<@caker>not really... it's a seamless migration
21:01<path->it's like apple, it just works
21:02<hal14450>well that's good news
21:02<Peng>Unless you have a 1k block size filesystem.
21:02<hal14450>i have whatever the standard linode on uml is
21:03<Peng>$ sudo tune2fs -l /dev/<device> | grep "Block size"
21:03<Peng>It should be 4k.
21:03<straterra>caker: Are they vanilla?
21:04<tjfontaine>caker: did I break my test node? :)
21:04<@caker>straterra: no. the 2.6.18 kernrels are Xen+vanilla bastard children
21:05<straterra>I'm running 2.6.25
21:05<@caker>those are from
21:05<Battousai>does pvops work?
21:05<straterra>So..vanilla then
21:05<@caker>Battousai: YMMV
21:05<@caker>Battousai: in my experience, not very well (yet) :)
21:05<Battousai>cmon, fix it
21:05<@caker>tjfontaine: which one?
21:06<tjfontaine>the one you assigned to tj1k
21:06<tjfontaine>I think fsfuzz broke it :)
21:06<@caker>well, yeah
21:06<tjfontaine>not in the way we need it though
21:07<tjfontaine>a DoS seems like a silly bug for kernel devs to ignore you know :)
21:07*tjfontaine reboots
21:07<@caker>tjfontaine: I don't think fsfuzzer is what we want
21:07<tjfontaine>nah I was just curious :)
21:08<tjfontaine>the concept is close though, if we knew exactly where the corruption occured we could reliably fuzz that same section over until it triggered
21:09<tjfontaine>it seems like such a AlignTheStars off-by-one though
21:09<@caker>we're gonna fire up about 200 nodes tomorrow across some spare boxes... we damn well better hit it -- and quickly
21:10*caker stabs
21:10<tjfontaine>linodehq nodes?
21:10<@caker>no .. spare box nodes
21:10<path->200 on one box?
21:10<@caker>I want it to be on the exact same hardware
21:10<@caker>path-: nah
21:10<tjfontaine>what kind of work loads are you going to put on them?
21:11<@caker>I dunno yet .. mike's scripts that triggered it twice just created a boatload of files...
21:11<tjfontaine>similar to what avongauss described
21:11<@caker>I guess we'll swoop in and create ManyFiles<tm> and then read them back
21:12<@caker>I just want a way to reproduce it, so I can try things (like I patch I received via LKML!)
21:12<Battousai>if there's one thing mikegrb's good at, it's breaking crap
21:12<tjfontaine>oh new message in the thread?
21:12<Battousai>and also perl
21:12<tjfontaine>I don't see it on
21:12*StevenK fondly remembers writing a script that caused Perl to SEGV
21:12<Battousai>what's the thread? i'm subbed
21:13<@caker>ext3 directory corruption under Xen
21:13<Battousai>oh yeah how bout that
21:13<@caker>ignore the comment about the 4096 report. I found out this morning that guy was running fsck on a mounted filesystem
21:13-!-jm [] has joined #linode
21:15<mwalling>caker: is it under a specific kernel or both the domU and pvops
21:15<@caker>mwalling: both...
21:15<mwalling>and different batches of hardware?
21:15<mwalling>glibc ;)
21:15<Battousai>you should get apple servers
21:15<tjfontaine>so mount, make many files, read back, unmount, fsck .. or do you plan to wait for RO to trigger, we are looking for the RO trigger right?
21:15<Battousai>they wouldn't crash
21:16<tjfontaine>that's an interesting patch
21:16<Bdragon>compile kernels, run bonnie, that sort of thing?
21:17<tjfontaine>I ran iozone multiple times in many crazy configs, no such luck, it seems very much related to many files in a directory
21:18<Bdragon>Set up a maildir and throw a bunch of shit at it?
21:18<hal14450>stupid question but where exactly is the option to sign up for xen located?
21:18<path->apple.. heh
21:18<@caker>hal14450: submit a ticket, please
21:18<hal14450>thanks caker
21:18<tjfontaine>Bdragon: that's how mwalling triggered it
21:18<@caker>from the few reports of this, the common thread was maildir on many of them
21:19<@caker>that and rsync, and portage rsync
21:19<Battousai>it's always gentoo...
21:19<Bdragon>ooh, I know
21:19<Bdragon>rsync a gigantic splayed out maildir back and forth and checksum the whole thing each time
21:19<bd_>caker: might be interesting to pull the rug out from a few of them while under IO load and see if fsck works from within the guest after
21:20<bd_>as it happend for me on a host crash
21:20<tjfontaine>hmm those email client people used to have huge mailboxes they used for testing, I wonder if they have creation scripts
21:20<bd_>that is, let it boot, do ext3 autorecovery, then try the fsck, in case the journal is the key
21:20*mwalling asks tjs q in #dovecot
21:20<tjfontaine>mwalling: yes please
21:20<tjfontaine>mwalling: a good imap hammer script would be great
21:21<Solver>fsck on a (read-write) mounted filesystem and someone was surprised they had problems :)
21:21<Bdragon>Anyone got, uh, any spammer scripts lying around? (for research purposes only!)
21:21<Solver>Bdragon: while true do
21:21<Solver>hey I've loaded tested mail with 5 line scripts like that :)
21:22<Bdragon>dd if=/dev/dsp of=- bs=1k count=1024 | mail
21:22<Bdragon>(blah blah)
21:22<Solver>'cept I normally pre-cook my dd file :)
21:22<Bdragon>Even better...
21:22<Bdragon>Find a framegrabber...
21:22<Bdragon>dd if=/dev/video...
21:22<hal14450>i guess i just have to convince everyone else that xen is a valid reason to switch
21:22<Solver>email huge images at them
21:22<Bdragon>Get an mjpeg capture card
21:23<Bdragon>and cat pieces of mpeg streams into emails XD
21:24<mwalling>little files
21:24<mwalling>not big ones
21:24<Bdragon>ahh, right
21:24<jetlag>pipe it through mpg2asc
21:24<Bdragon>no no no
21:24<Bdragon>through cacaview XD
21:25-!-hfb [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:28<path->so... if i wanted to migrate from 1k blocks to 4k blocks, i should just cp -a /old /new
21:29-!-exor|plane is now known as exor674
21:32<hal14450>so if we switch to xen we have the same ip addies right?
21:32<mwalling>same datacenter, same ip
21:32<mwalling>so assuming there is xen availability in your data center, yes
21:32<hal14450>i want the same dc
21:33<mwalling>!calc 2048*2048*2048*2048
21:33<linbot>mwalling: 2,048 * 2,048 * 2,048 * 2,048 = 1.7592186 * 10^(13)
21:33-!-Jag [] has joined #linode
21:33<hal14450>dallas available?
21:33<hal14450>lo jag
21:33<linbot>tjfontaine: Dallas360 - 0, Dallas540 - 0, Dallas720 - 0, Dallas1080 - 0, Dallas1440 - 0, Dallas2880 - 0
21:34<tjfontaine>you can submit a ticket and get in line though
21:34<Peng>They're shipping more hosts to Dallas soon.
21:34<mwalling>Dallas,Dallas, fscking ssh lag
21:34-!-lakin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
21:34<Solver>so I notice california is very popular
21:34<mwalling>20:57 <@caker> We're shipping hosts to Dallas, and Newawk has availability now -- all Xen
21:34<Solver>is this due to an intrinsic advantage like bandwidth?
21:34<hal14450>can you give me a timeframe ?
21:34<Solver>or just that people like their box on the US west coast?
21:34<mwalling>17:27 <@caker> we're shipping hosts to Dallas this week, btw
21:35<Peng>Solver: Well, the west coast is useful if your users are in Asia or Oceania.
21:35<Solver>mwalling: my box in dallas is snappy
21:35<mwalling>Solver: and?
21:35<Solver>Peng: I wonder how much of a difference is really makes
21:35<Solver>mwalling: you were saying about lag...
21:35<mwalling>no, i was whining about a wifi hiccup
21:35<Solver>mwalling: ah :)
21:35<Solver>wifi sux
21:35<hal14450>i need ircd and dallas is central so it works fine for me
21:35*Solver is getting cable in
21:36<Solver>used to have it in my old place... miss cable in the walls
21:36<hal14450>atlanta is a non starter since i can't have ircd
21:36<mwalling>well... you can have an ircd, just not on 6667
21:37<hal14450>mwalling that won't fly
21:37<mwalling>hey, you asked
21:37<hal14450>i'm not running an underground network
21:37<mwalling>no, most us dc's are above ground
21:37<mwalling>i dont think caker wants to ship to the bunker
21:37-!-jdub [] has joined #linode
21:37<ajmitch>I'm sure there are some in old missile silos
21:37<Jag>i run an underground network
21:38<jdub>caker: you guys rock.
21:38<hal14450>lol @ jag
21:38<ajmitch>hello jdub
21:38<Jag>basement apartments rock :)
21:38<hal14450>yeah you need to move up in the world lol
21:39<mwalling>caker: your post to lkml has soiled the google results!
21:39<hal14450>so if i submit a ticket do i get fair warning to move or will all hell break loose when i'm not around?
21:39<Jag>its too expensive to live in sunlight
21:40<mendel>hal: once they set up a migration, you hit the "migrate" button yourself.
21:40<mwalling>hal14450: you kick off migrations yourself
21:40<mendel>(i love that feature)
21:40<Jag>yea that does sound good
21:40<hal14450>thanks guys that's all i needed to know
21:40<Jag>does it take long to migrate ?
21:40<hal14450>sound kosher to you jag?
21:40<Jag>or is it instant
21:40<mwalling>Jag: images are copied from host to host...
21:40<mwalling>so if you ahve no data, its instant
21:41<hal14450>we have almost no data
21:41<Jag>ok cool
21:41<hal14450>has anyone here tried asterisk on xen yet?
21:41<hal14450>i'm curious as to MOH and meetme
21:41<Jag>does the rtc actually work good, no sound quality problems and timing ?
21:42<Jag>i guess if it has direct access to it, should be good ?
21:42-!-Sok [] has joined #linode
21:42<hal14450>would be killer to have it for failover
21:42<mwalling>it works for me
21:43<hal14450>mwalling well that's one testimonial anyway lol
21:43<mwalling>my housephone goes through my linode
21:43<hal14450>well that's what i wanted to hear
21:44<mwalling>and i've done a small confrence when the pebcaks at work couldnt get the mci confrencing system to behave
21:44<hal14450>a little bird told me you recently started working there so I just wanted to be sure
21:45<mwalling>working where?
21:45<hal14450>lol @ pebkacs
21:45-!-mode/#linode [+q *!*] by FloodServ
21:45<bd_>GAE's SDK does validation on load, not store?!
21:45<@mikegrb>mmm cake
21:45<tjfontaine>birds that talk creep the fuck out
21:45<tjfontaine>mwalling: thanks
21:45<mwalling>i dont work for linode
21:45<mwalling>tjfontaine: i'm trying to get to pick up on it
21:45*mwalling wonders if he can get SkiddieBot to do it
21:46<hal14450>mwalling then my little bird must have chirped the wrong nickname
21:46-!-jm [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:46<mwalling>hal14450: jadoba
21:46<linbot>New news from forums: How is the bandwidth calculated? in Sales Questions and Answers <>
21:46<mwalling>my employer prolly made your kitchen appliances, your light bulbs, or the generators that supply you with electricity
21:47<mwalling> <-- tjfontaine
21:47<hal14450>GE eh?
21:47<mwalling>we're a linode customer :)
21:47<hal14450>i have some pretty old appliances lol
21:47<hal14450>i have a 1950's GE stove
21:48<mwalling>hal14450: the edison measum is on our site, i've seen older :P
21:48-!-RiverRat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:48<tjfontaine>mwalling: interesting
21:49<Sok>Excuse me everybody!
21:49<mwalling>we also make nbc sitcoms
21:49<Sok>m a newb
21:49<mwalling>21:49 < tss> mwalling: good parameters might be something like delete=10 expunge=10 msgs=1000 - that way the mailbox size stays about 1000 messages
21:50<Sok>I want to ask some question. Do i interrupt everybody?
21:50<tjfontaine>or 10000 :)
21:50<linbot>Don't ask to ask; just ASK
21:50<mwalling>Sok: of course, but ask anyway... irc gets interesting when the conversation gets multithreaed
21:51<@caker>jdub: hey - :)
21:51<Sok>I host my site on other hosting company, and i my website seems very slow
21:51<hal14450>thanks guys
21:51<hal14450>see ya ;-)
21:51-!-hal14450 [] has quit [Quit: BitchX: often imitated, never duplicated!]
21:52<Sok>So, host with linode is the solution for that problem or not?
21:52<mwalling>is "other hosting company" shared or another vps?
21:53<mwalling>a vps could be faster, but it is more work. management is left as a task to the user
21:53<irgeek>Is your site dynamic or static? And if dynamic, what do you use on the backend?
21:54<Sok>also, I use backend
21:54<irgeek>Which one?
21:54<HoopyCat>it might not make it any faster, but it can make it possible to make it faster
21:54<jetlag>I can say gallery2 runs way faster on my 360 than on godaddy...
21:55<irgeek>Looking at GoDaddy's prices, they have to be overselling like crazy.
21:56<irgeek>Sok: Is it PHP, perl cgi, mod_perl... what?
21:56<Sok>Irgeek, I use PHP
21:56<irgeek>And I'm guessing MySQL?
21:56<irgeek>How big is the DB?
21:57<Sok>I guess 10Mb
21:57<Sok>i will increase later on
21:59<irgeek>Unless you have very high traffic, a Linode can handle that without issue. But there is a lot more administrative overhead in using a Linode than using shared hosting.
21:59<irgeek>You have to set everything up yourself, and if you break it you get to keep both pieces.
21:59<Bdragon>It's also a lot easier to set the dominoes back up after you knock them down.
22:00<irgeek>The staff helps people when they can, and the community support here is pretty awesome.
22:00<Bdragon>(i.e. don't worry about breaking stuff at first, you can always wipe it and try again)
22:00<bd_>note: get the data off before wiping it
22:01<Sok>but m newb with ubuntu system!
22:01<bd_>everyone starts out a newbie
22:02<bd_>also, jeez, openjdk takes aages to build
22:02<mwalling>what does ubuntu call bash-completion?
22:02<bd_>mwalling: bash-completion
22:02<irgeek>You can get a Linode and start playing around with it. There's a seven day refund policy, but it's also only $20/month for a Linode360.
22:03<mwalling>couldnt find it in aptitude
22:03<mwalling>No candidate version found for bash-completion
22:03<bd_>mwalling: it's in universe
22:04<mwalling>Sok: i'm an ubuntu noob too
22:04<irgeek>mwalling: Also, a fair number of packages have a bash-completion script, but they don't all activate by default.
22:04<mwalling>i just want aptitude to complete!
22:04<HoopyCat>ah hell
22:04<bd_>mwalling: use zsh :D
22:04<Bdragon>I really need to get around to rebooting my main linode...
22:05<Bdragon>Hee hee
22:05<HoopyCat>mwalling, who is the lieutenant governor?
22:05<mwalling>in the event of an emergency, bruno is acting
22:05<HoopyCat>mwalling: bruno resigned as temporary president of the senate
22:06<mwalling>i thought he just announced he wasnt running for re-election
22:06<irgeek>Sok: Getting a LAMP Linode going with Ubuntu is pretty easy. Getting everything set up so it doesn't blow up later takes a little extra work, but it's not too difficult.
22:07<irgeek>Default settings will be fine if your traffic is pretty low.
22:07<Sok>If i want to try host with linode, is it possible to pay one monthly?
22:08<Bdragon>yep. You can do monthly or yearly.
22:08<irgeek>Sok: You can cancel any time.
22:08<Bdragon>(that reminds me, I really need to switch my main linode to yearly XD)
22:08<mwalling>i cant even get dovecot to install
22:08<irgeek>mwalling: n00b!
22:08<mwalling>why did i decide to try ubuntu for S&Gs
22:09<mwalling>oh, thats why
22:09<mwalling>its not called dovecot
22:09<StevenK>Sure it is.
22:09<Bdragon>Ubuntu: Redefining reality since 200 BC
22:10<mwalling>no its not
22:10<StevenK>dovecot-imapd, dovecot-pop3, you're right.
22:10<mwalling>its called dovecot-protod and dovecot-common
22:10<irgeek>mwalling: aptitude install dovecot-common [dovecot-imap] [dovecot-pop3d]
22:10<HoopyCat>mwalling: he went ahead and turned in the majority leader and temporary president nametags... dean skelos is the new majority leader, but the media is strangely silent on who'll cover for D.P. if he has to drive to boston for some... uhh... library resources
22:10<Bdragon>dovecot-protod? What teh HELL was they smokin?
22:10<mwalling>HoopyCat: huh
22:10<irgeek>Sorry, [dovecot-imapd]
22:11<mwalling>Bdragon: s/proto/imap/, s/proto/pop3/
22:11<StevenK>Perhaps dovecot-imapd and dovecot-pop3d need to Provide: dovecot
22:11<mendel>dovecot pro toad
22:12*irgeek isn't sure why he runs pop3d since nobody uses it
22:12<Bdragon>We have a toad in the basement...
22:12<StevenK>irgeek: I solved that. I just declared that the new machine won't support POP3. :-)
22:12<Bdragon>I learned recently that his job is to take care of the spiders, and he's actually SUPPOSED to be down there... :o
22:12-!-cramer_as8758 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:12<mendel>You could name him "robots.txt".
22:13<Bdragon>(Apparently he's lived down there for years and I never knew it...)
22:14-!-jcn [] has joined #linode
22:14<HoopyCat>you had a mosquito problem, so a previous resident unleashed dragonflies
22:14<irgeek>StevenK: I set it up so my clueless users could be comfortable and do things the way they always had. Once they figured out they could have the same folder structure in their mail client and the web interface the pop3d requests shrank to near zero.
22:14<HoopyCat>then you had a dragonfly problem, so in came the spiders
22:14<Bdragon>Previous resident?
22:14<HoopyCat>and now you've got toads. wtf, Bdragon?
22:15<Bdragon>Just one... really... reallly.... big... toad...
22:15-!-cramer_as8758 [] has joined #linode
22:15<jetlag>Now you need a bass.
22:16<irgeek>Of course, the mail store also grew by almost 1GB in a few weeks when everyone copied their mail back into their folders, but there's plenty of space so I don't care.
22:16<StevenK>irgeek: I had that fun when I converted my wife from POP3 to IMAP.
22:16<guinea-pig>i don't know why she swallowed the fly...
22:17<irgeek>When I was very young we had a pet chameleon. My mother would carry it around to the windows and it would eat all the flies. Very efficient.
22:17<HoopyCat>Bdragon: the internet says you need a snake
22:17<StevenK>irgeek: Set up the IMAP connection, drag all of the folders from the local machine to the IMAP store, and wait them to sync. And then the POP3 polls and says, "Hey! I have new mail! *download*"
22:17<Bdragon>(singing) Mary had a little lamb, and the obstetrician is still trying to figure that one out....
22:17<Bdragon>Who says I wanted to get rid of the toad?
22:17<StevenK>Bdragon: You just seem a little freaked out. :-)
22:17<Bdragon>Freaked out?
22:18<HoopyCat>Bdragon: we work with solutions here, not problems
22:18<StevenK>Sure. You've been going on about the toad for minutes
22:18<irgeek>StevenK: I'm not sure if any of my users did that. They kind of helped each other get their mail back. Maybe the first one figured that out and warned the others about it. *shrug*
22:18<Bdragon>Well, it was a story..
22:18-!-lakin_ [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
22:19-!-lakin [] has joined #linode
22:19*HoopyCat secretly breeds mongeese so he can, in 6-12 months, corner the basement snake mitigation market
22:19<Bdragon>Since he doesn't have a habit of pissing on my computer equipment, he's cool with me...
22:19<StevenK>irgeek: I discovered there is no setting in Outlook to have it not check for mail. So I added a firewall rule that blocked POP3 on the mail server.
22:19<StevenK>Bdragon: Unlike, I guess, the cat?
22:19<mwalling>tjfontaine: you try it yet
22:20<Bdragon>Speaking of cats
22:20<Bdragon>We have a mummified one in the crawlspace... still...
22:20<tjfontaine>mwalling: trying
22:20<Bdragon>My shoulder still hurts from being in there running cat-5 over the weekend... :-/
22:20<tjfontaine>mwalling: it's adding messages atm
22:20<StevenK>My cat doesn't do her business on my computers, she will occasionally eat too quickly and then spit up on my workstation. :-(
22:20<HoopyCat>Bdragon: dude... dude. dude. woah. ok, so what the hell is going on under your house.
22:20*mwalling realized he never mounted his 1k partition
22:21<tjfontaine> - 1 stalled for 37 secs in command: 188 APPEND "INBOX" (\Answered \Seen \Draft) {2247+}
22:21<tjfontaine> - 2 stalled for 28 secs in command: 165 APPEND "INBOX" (\Flagged $Label2 $Label5) "05-Oct-2003 17:01:05 +0000" {2547+}
22:21<Bdragon>HoopyCat: It died down there, like, I'd guess, 20 years ago...
22:21<tjfontaine> - 8 stalled for 37 secs in command: 170 APPEND "INBOX" (\Answered \Flagged \Seen \Draft $Label5) {29384+}
22:21<Bdragon>And it just kinda dried out in the dust...
22:21*StevenK shivers.
22:21<Bdragon>Not very ew anymore...
22:21<Bdragon>Just... dry...
22:21<tjfontaine>mwalling: only downside is it requires dovecot 1.2
22:21<tjfontaine>mwalling: but it's running
22:21<mwalling>only the sources
22:21<Bdragon>Anyway, I obiously work AROUND it when I'm running cables...
22:22<HoopyCat>Bdragon: i dunno, man, but i'd be investing in wireless if i saw that shit
22:22<tjfontaine>but in for a penny
22:22<Bdragon>Because it is definately in the category of "won't touch."
22:22*path- notes his cats are alive
22:22<Bdragon>I have wireless... That's how I get between the buildings...
22:22<Bdragon>I was running some cat-5 up to the tv because I'm making a myth box
22:22*StevenK ponders skipping lunch today
22:22<HoopyCat>you need a wireless bridge to get around the dessicated cat and spider-eating toad
22:23<Bdragon>I'd like LESS wireless actually... It sucks running nfs over a WDS link...
22:24<jetlag>You should wrap the cat in gauze and place it somewhere
22:24<Bdragon>but I'd have to cross two pieces of the sidewalk at one of the ends of the run and I don't have the equipment or ambition...
22:24<HoopyCat>you have a lot more ambition than i do
22:24<StevenK>Bdragon: Or the authority to dig them up? :-)
22:24<Bdragon>Why bother doing anything with the cat? It's just part of the environment there..
22:24<jetlag>Eventually someone will think it's cute and try to see what the mummy cat is made out of
22:24<StevenK>jetlag: "Cat"
22:25-!-dacoffey [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:25<tjfontaine>mwalling: though i'm fairly convinced that if we're going to trigger it it'll be with this tool
22:25<HoopyCat>instead of office chair, box contained mummified remains of crawlspace cat
22:25<Bdragon>Uh, it's kinda hard to get into the damn crawlspace anyway, the entrance is a hole in the wall about 7 feet off the ground...
22:25<tjfontaine>this is about as close as we're going to get to real data and real usage in a testing sandbox :)
22:25<mwalling>tjfontaine: what about dossing it?
22:26<@jadoba>Bdragon: it wasn't too difficult for the cat to get in there...
22:26<tjfontaine>mwalling: I don't think throwing more IO ops at it will help anything
22:26<Bdragon>and the crawlspace is only about two feet high at the tallest point, and about one foot everywhere else...
22:26<tjfontaine>mwalling: iozone was cranking and cranking nothing blinked
22:26<HoopyCat>i'm not going to tell my wife anything about this discussion, as she has to work in crawlspaces
22:27<Bdragon>Speaking of which, it really sucks crawling through an area where the available space is smaller than the space required for full lung capacity... Especially while trying to hit a .8 inch hole a foot from my hand with the end of a cat-5 cable...
22:27<Bdragon>Did I mention dirt floor?
22:27*Solver dislikes cable work and pays others to do it
22:27<Solver>yuk yuk
22:27<Bdragon>Well, by dirt I mean "dirt and really abrasive pieces of mortar"
22:27<StevenK>Solver: Me too.
22:27<avongauss>attics aren't much more fun, especially in the summer.
22:27<HoopyCat>Bdragon: i'm going to regret this, but... rule 10. next time you're down there, pics. :-)
22:27-!-Iahova [] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
22:27<Bdragon>It's a deal.
22:28<HoopyCat>or up there, as the case may be
22:28<Bdragon>Hell, I could do that now if ya'll like
22:28-!-digx_ [] has quit [Quit: digx_]
22:28<StevenK>But no cat pictures
22:28<irgeek>"dirt and really abrasive pieces of mortar and desiccated cats"
22:28-!-hal14450 [] has joined #linode
22:28<HoopyCat>let's see... a picture of the toad, a picture of the cat, and that day's copy of your local newspaper of record in both shots
22:28<jetlag>I think that's what's in those little ramen packets.
22:29-!-Mithshark [] has joined #linode
22:29<Bdragon>Our newspaper is a weekly.
22:29<hal14450>boredome brings me back
22:29<Solver>jetlag: dessicated cat? :)
22:29<Solver>could be right
22:29<hal14450>i might learn stuff idling
22:29<HoopyCat>Bdragon: close enough :-)
22:29<StevenK>I did a weeks worth of cat5 and fiber runs for work experience. That taught me I never ever want to do it.
22:29<Bdragon>Printout of irc transcript would be funnier :P
22:29<Solver>StevenK: hhahaha
22:29<HoopyCat>hal14450: hee hee hee
22:30<Solver>hal14450: firewalls which block all icmp cause problems
22:30<Solver>how's that :)
22:30<tjfontaine>mwalling: imaptest - host=localhost port=143 append=100,0 logout=0 msgs=10000000
22:30<tjfontaine>mwalling: that's what I ran with
22:30<tjfontaine>mwalling: to seed the maildir
22:30<hal14450>Solver who me?
22:30<Solver>hal14450: you wanted to learn something while idling :)
22:30<hal14450>you can ping my host it resolves
22:31<StevenK>Let's teach him about dessicated cats, next
22:31<Solver>ok cool
22:31<hal14450>it's not wher i connect from but ...
22:31<tjfontaine>mwalling: are you running it as well?
22:31<mwalling>getting it going
22:31<tjfontaine>already having a maildir full is helpful
22:31<tjfontaine>poor cruxeternus
22:31<jetlag>cat5 cable is made from 5 dessicated cats per linear meter.
22:31<straterra>google haz unlimitedz storage
22:32<StevenK>jetlag: *twitch*
22:32*straterra wants to see the google san's
22:32<Solver>jetlag: does the e in Cat5e stand for elastic cats?
22:32<hal14450>hmm desicated cats eh?
22:32<HoopyCat>a cat6 is fine too
22:32<straterra>i have only fastcat6e in my house :O
22:32<StevenK>hal14450: Bdragon started it, it's his fault
22:32*hal14450 wonders what the resistance is for dead cats fiber wise
22:32<StevenK>straterra: Made from fast cats?
22:33<Solver>using a cat as a resistor
22:33<Solver>never thought of that
22:33<hal14450>tooo fucking funny
22:33<StevenK>straterra: Haha
22:33<straterra>with rhino shielding
22:33<straterra>nothing is getting past it
22:33<Solver>I wonder if the cat would sit still while I put the bands on
22:34<StevenK>Solver: Spoken like a person who doesn't own one
22:34<StevenK>Try to put *anything* on a cat
22:34<Solver>StevenK: oh I've bathed a cat and have the scars to prove it :)
22:34<StevenK>Solver: Haha. Me too. :-)
22:35<jetlag>Just dangle them in the air in front of it.
22:35<Solver>StevenK: it was just like the cartoons... legs strung out across the basin...
22:35<Sok>Excuse me! I have more one question!
22:35<linbot>caker: The answer is certainly yes.
22:35<hal14450>Sok just ask your questions
22:35<StevenK>Solver: Haha! I never had that, since I was holding all four legs.
22:35<irgeek>How about putting a cinder block on a cat? From about 10 feet above the cat while it's sleeping. That's probably pretty easy.
22:35<hal14450>asking to ask is silly
22:35<Solver>StevenK: nice. hold the legs and drop in upside down huh :)
22:35<StevenK>irgeek: Ewwww
22:35<Sok>i tried to choose first plan
22:36<StevenK>Solver: Not upside down. :-)
22:36<Solver>StevenK: oh good :)
22:36<HoopyCat>i tried bathing a cat once. i pay other people to do it...
22:36<HoopyCat>cheaper than the hospital copay
22:36<Sok>But the total i need to pay is $24.61
22:37<StevenK>"What happened to you, sir?" 'I tried to bathe my cat.' "Oh. I'll get a wheelchair."
22:37<hal14450>HoopyCat bathing a an animal with claws and a tempermant not suitable to persuasion will lead to bodilyharm
22:37<HoopyCat>Sok: it's near the end of the month, so it's now->july 1 prorated, then the entire month of july
22:37<irgeek>Sok: The rest of this month + next month
22:37<@caker>Solver: it's from now until the end of July
22:37<Solver>caker: you meant Sok i suspect
22:37<StevenK>Unless caker is talking about bathing a cat from now until the end of July
22:38<Solver>no thanks :)
22:38<irgeek>tab completion: 1, caker: 0
22:38<@caker>er, yeah.
22:38<Solver>tab nick completion gets me all the time :)
22:38<straterra>caker should setup proper tab competion :P
22:38<StevenK>sol: Oh, does it? :-)
22:38*StevenK smirks
22:38<Solver>StevenK: hahaha
22:38<@caker>z o m g s e t u p
22:39<linbot>setup is not a verb. Please see
22:39<straterra>i did it just to annoy :)
22:39<Solver>I use setup all the time :)
22:39<@caker>I figured.
22:39<straterra>ask great at that
22:39<Solver>is caker going to kick my linode now :)
22:39<straterra>caker...also..i was on dallas 20 when it was having issues
22:39<irgeek>When I first got a kitten--it was a Christmas present--I could bathe him in the sink. After a few months he got big enough he could stretch himself to the width of the sink and hold on. It was quite an impressive feat. I had to switch to bathing him in the bathtub.
22:39<straterra>i transfer to newark..the same day, there are issues
22:39<straterra>HARDWARE hates me
22:40<@jadoba>little-known secret.... caker has the string 'setup' in an irssi /hilight
22:40<@caker>what issues ?
22:40<straterra>some packet loss earlier
22:40*caker is now known as setup
22:40<straterra>it cleared in line 10 minutes
22:40<straterra>i bad luck
22:40<jetlag>You're not on verizon are you?
22:40<straterra>huh, mark?
22:41<straterra>it twas at the dc...other peoples had issues too
22:41<jetlag>I've lost touch with newark a couple times now.
22:41-!-dvgrhl [] has joined #linode
22:41*Bdragon returns
22:41<mwalling>Unknown arg: password=testpassword
22:41<mwalling>tjfontaine: ^^
22:42<Bdragon>Took me a while to figure out where the toad was hanging out..
22:42<straterra>make it abc123
22:42<tjfontaine>mwalling: just pass
22:42<warewolf>caker: yo, have you implimented IO activity graphs for everyone on the logged-in-panel page?
22:42<StevenK>Bdragon: You had to track the toad?
22:42<HoopyCat>StevenK: the toad is alive, the cat is dead
22:42<@caker>warewolf: are the io graphs for everyone? Yes
22:43<warewolf>caker: okay then.
22:43<@caker>there is still life left in RML, I think.
22:43<Bdragon>Well, it's not like the toad stays in one place or anything :P
22:43<warewolf>caker: I'm going to file an antitrust lawsuit againt you, for stealing my RML customers away from you.
22:43*irgeek 's Linode is now unrated since moving to Xen
22:43<warewolf>yes, away from you.
22:43<Sok>Oh, one more question. I have email with my current hosting company. If i change to linode, what should i do to config and import email?
22:44<warewolf>irgeek had the same thought on RML still having a bit of life left in it
22:44<Solver>what format is the email in?
22:44<Solver>in the existing system?
22:44<warewolf>sofa meter stick.
22:44<irgeek>Sok: Postfix + Dovecot is pretty popular these days. There are lots of tutorials on it.
22:45<StevenK>Sok: Depends on how they store your mail.
22:45-!-mode/#linode [-q *!*] by FloodServ
22:45*StevenK hugs his Postfix + Dovecot *setup*
22:45*StevenK looks at caker
22:45*straterra wants a hug
22:45*warewolf peers at floodserv
22:45<Solver>Sok: if the mail is in mailbox format it is normally enough to drop the folders in to the right place. the key is backups. I mean it - backups.
22:45<StevenK>I'm still unsure of how to do backups. :-(
22:46<warewolf>wtf did the reverened mikegrb do?
22:46<tjfontaine>said lolz too many times
22:46<Solver>backups are the truth and the light
22:46<@mikegrb>mmm cake
22:46<Bdragon>and mmm cake
22:46<irgeek>warewolf: Ask the choir boys
22:46<HoopyCat>backups bring dessicated cats back to life
22:46<warewolf>oh, his damn triggered response.
22:46<Solver>Sok: can you access the existing system via shell?
22:46<StevenK>Solver: Agreed, having worked as a sysadmin
22:46*Solver is a sysadmin so constantly worries about backups :)
22:46<StevenK>Solver: I used to. :-)
22:46<warewolf>so hey
22:46<Solver>StevenK: hahaha
22:46<Bdragon>Wish scp worked better over satellite..
22:46<warewolf>who wants to see me completely derail this current topic?
22:46<Solver>I like being a sysadmin but it can send one grey :)
22:47<Solver>warewolf: sure..
22:47<StevenK>I'm just unsure where to store 1.1GB of backed up data
22:47<warewolf>my father's in the hospital.
22:47<HoopyCat>derails in thread!
22:47<Solver>1.1GB - in your pocket of course ;)
22:47<warewolf>my sister is having serious depression and anxiety attacks.
22:47<Solver>warewolf: not good. has she seen a Dr?
22:48<warewolf>that's just the thing. She's seeing like three of htem.
22:48<jetlag>S3 looks like a cheap dumping ground.
22:48<warewolf>and not telling them about each other.
22:48<Solver>uh oh
22:48<warewolf>nor is she telling the rest of the family.
22:48<irgeek>I hope she's not taking three prescriptions too...
22:48<warewolf>may very well be.
22:49<warewolf>topicjack complete.
22:49*HoopyCat smacks forehead
22:49<warewolf>you may now return to your regularly scheduled #linode, already in progress.
22:49<Solver>I believe it is perfectly acceptible for you to contact the doctors and tell them of your concerns (and how there are 3 of them
22:49<Solver>they can't tell you stuff but you can tell them stuf
22:49<Solver>of course I would recommend a confidential approach
22:50<StevenK>Teehee. Looks like my monthly bill for S3 would be $0.50
22:50<irgeek>That's pretty steep.
22:50<StevenK>Yes ... :-)
22:50<irgeek>Don't they have something for about $0.25?
22:50<warewolf>I. HAVE. BANANNA CHIPS.
22:50<tjfontaine>yum yum
22:50<tjfontaine>haven't had those in years
22:50<warewolf>and a glass of wine.
22:50<warewolf>but not together.
22:50<Solver>yum ... oh wait, I hate banada chips
22:51<irgeek>Wine and banana chips would be... gross.
22:51<hal14450>that's hiking food dehydrated bananas
22:51<warewolf>caker: when do I get my commission?
22:51<warewolf>22:51 < purl> somebody said linode fans was warewolf, sungo, mmlj4, chargrill, rjbs, mendel, mdxi, hachi, Yaakov
22:51<warewolf>^ most, if not all referrals through me :)
22:51<hal14450>i challenge you to go hiking
22:51<mendel>NOT ME
22:51<HoopyCat>warewolf: i had a leaking, dented can of festering cat food, Bdragon has a basement spider-mitigation toad and a dessicated crawlspace cat, and linode's got a new API. and here you are with banana chips.
22:52<warewolf>mendel: go back into the woodwork!
22:52<Bdragon>OK, toad's up..
22:52<Solver>HoopyCat: did you use a marvok chain to make that sentence? :)
22:52<Solver>markov even
22:52<hachi>why you pasting that stuff here, willis?
22:52<mendel>Bdragon: awesome
22:52<jetlag>I wonder if people run folding etc on their linodes.
22:52<warewolf>hachi: that's my scoreboard, dood
22:52<StevenK>Bdragon: Nice!
22:52<hachi>hey, I told yaakov to go with linode
22:53<path->tis better not to hold it in
22:53<hachi>path-: scuse me, I need to go see a man about a wallaby
22:53<HoopyCat>Bdragon: that is AWESOME.
22:53*mwalling got BP{k}, CaptObviousman, straterra, jkwood to all buy linodes
22:53<path->i have no idea what you just said
22:53<Bdragon>I'm gonna go get some food while the others are transferring...
22:53<warewolf>hachi: I played my part :)
22:54<StevenK>Python command-line ftp and rsync-like clients for Amazon's S3 storage service. useful for backups, or... whatever.
22:54<Solver>hachi: hahah
22:54<hachi>someone got the joke?
22:54<Solver>well I'm an aussie
22:55<hachi>ahh :)
22:55<Solver>actually my Canadian business partner loved that line :)
22:55<jetlag>mwalling: so you're to blame!
22:55<Solver>for him it was always a snake though :)
22:55<mwalling>for which one?
22:56<hachi>americans tend to say "a man about a horse" for some reason
22:56<Solver>delusions of grandeur? :)
22:56<mwalling>we do?
22:56<jetlag>I've heard old people say that.
22:56<Solver>horse. big animals that
22:56<Solver>I have to go see a man about a blue whale...
22:57<StevenK>*BIG* mammal, that
22:57<Solver>sure is. big.
22:57<hal14450>what's the easiest way to setup a vpn to my linode? i run linux exclusively
22:57<Solver>hachi: I use openvpn
22:57<hachi>you mean hal
22:57<hachi>not hachi
22:57<Solver>damn nick completion
22:58<Solver>hal14450: I use openvpn
22:58<warewolf>can't say that enough
22:58<hal14450>easy enough to setup then?
22:58<CpuID>lol openvpn-- in my experiences
22:58*CpuID kicks the person who invented MTU
22:58<Solver>cross platform, no brainer to setup...
22:58<hal14450>i'm all done with my gentoo days lol
22:58<StevenK>Since IPSec gives me nightmares
22:58<Solver>CpuID: :)
22:58<mwalling>hal14450: slackware :)
22:58<straterra>i like openvpn
22:58<Solver>CpuID: you want infinite sized packets? :)
22:59<hal14450>mwalling i cut my teeth in slack ;-)
22:59<Bdragon>Hmm, looking at those pictures, I realize I should probabaly do something about the network cable that runs to the office... That is one shoddy splice I done did way back when I put that in...
22:59<CpuID>lol, nah i know its purpose, but it can be a PITA at times :)
22:59<Solver>CpuID: especially when it meets a broken firewall
22:59<HoopyCat>Bdragon: it's the photo shop of horrors
22:59<CpuID>had a site-to-site config setup, with a pseudo tun0 interface with no internal lan on the linode, and my internal lan at home as the other side
22:59<CpuID>pings were perfect everytime
22:59<hal14450>i just want the crazy dmtf tones to stop on the voip traffic
22:59<CpuID>but dataflow was my issue, and i isolated it to MTU everytime :P
23:00<CpuID>tried so many combos of mss/fragment/tun-mtu with no complete success
23:00<Solver>StevenK: the day I tried openvpn was the last time I touched IPSec
23:00<mwalling>hal14450: dont use inband then
23:00*StevenK tries to remember the backup tool he was reading about that used S3
23:00<CpuID>taking into account my 1492 pppoe mtu at home of course too :)
23:00<StevenK>Solver: $PREVIOUS_JOB had me using both
23:00<hal14450>they happen even when i'm using sip to sip accounts
23:00<StevenK>Worse, debugging both.
23:00<CpuID>authentication was fine, using ssl certs with my own ca, that side was all sweet
23:00<Solver>CpuID: unless something is really b0rked somewhere you shouldn't get mtu related issues
23:01<hal14450>bah i cabn't read this shit in the terminal that well brb
23:01<Solver>I used run into pmtu discovery and ECN problems
23:01-!-hal14450 [] has quit [Quit: BitchX: the headache medicine]
23:01*CpuID wonders if somehow theres PMTU issues
23:01<CpuID>that was one factor i had considered
23:01<Solver>could be
23:01<Solver>did you try a really love mtu
23:01<CpuID>went about as low as 1200
23:01<Solver>drop it right now for testing
23:01<CpuID>and if you cant get 1200 through somethings wrong :P
23:01<Solver>avoid fragmentation
23:02<CpuID>i also dropped the firewalls at both ends too, to avoid any chance of that causing an issue
23:02<CpuID>meh cbf attempting to fix it now, it pissed me off too much lol
23:02-!-mode/#linode [+q *!*] by FloodServ
23:02<CpuID>thx for the offer though :)
23:03-!-hal14450 [] has joined #linode
23:03<hal14450>much better
23:03-!-jcn [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:03<Bdragon>Establishing a sense of forboding...
23:03<@mikegrb>mmm cake
23:03<tjfontaine>mwalling: any luck yet?
23:03<mwalling>no :(
23:04<Solver>Bdragon: eek
23:04<tjfontaine>find cur | wc -l
23:04<hal14450>that's disturbing
23:04<tjfontaine>takes a while
23:04<Solver>Bdragon: I can read the printout though
23:05<hal14450>i probably should have used a proxy
23:05<CpuID>lol Bdragon
23:05<Bdragon>(scp over satellite is SLOW.)
23:05-!-Sok [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:05<Bdragon>I never read my webserver logs anyway...
23:05<hal14450>i'm immortalized in a joke between battling egos
23:05<CpuID>satellite ftl :P
23:05<HoopyCat>Bdragon: aight, that's an ugly crawlspace
23:06<Bdragon>Yeah, that picture shows the spacious part.
23:06<Bdragon>The cramped parts are to the left and right...
23:06<hal14450>i was too lazy to tunnel this irc session
23:07<CpuID>and to think i just sent in my final stuff to get my cablers license today :P
23:07<avongauss>caker: fyi, Linode API Blog Typo (relase)
23:07<tjfontaine>avongauss: describe your weirdness you've discovered please, and how you managed it please :)
23:07<HoopyCat>Bdragon: where are you located? you're totally on the beer list. ain't no way i'd go anywhere near that crawlspace, alone, at night. :-)
23:07<avongauss>weirdness? been trying to reproduce the bs=1024 error predictably.
23:07<@caker>avongauss: fixerated, thanks
23:08<mwalling>wow... make -j5 for the effing win
23:08<Bdragon>BTW, I'm standing on a chair to even reach where I put the paper....
23:08<avongauss>the only method I have found that works, sometimes, is to make out the directory listings.
23:08<hal14450>mwalling, you're a gentto user aren't you?
23:08<avongauss>haven't seen a fs go read-only on me, but I might not be letting it run enough, I just get the fsck errors
23:08<straterra>I am
23:08<mwalling>hal14450: no, impatient
23:08<Bdragon>It's really, uh, interesting, getting back out...
23:08<Bdragon>because you have to swing your legs down and hopefully find whatever you stacked up to reach the hole...
23:08<avongauss>Been able to do it about 4 times now, just not on command.
23:08<jetlag>Are those cables dirt-floor rated?
23:08<@caker>avongauss: fsck errors are good enough, I think
23:09<Bdragon>oh man, just wait till you see the splice...
23:09<hal14450>i used to break my gentoo weekly
23:09<avongauss>caker: that's what I'm hoping, just trying to narrow down what it is I am doing exactly so I can say - doTest (break)
23:09<tjfontaine>avongauss: what kind of fsck errors?
23:10<avongauss>Don't remember the exact i-node error, but truth be told I consider any fsck error a great measure of success. I'll write it down next time I get it.
23:10<tjfontaine>k thx
23:11<avongauss>things I don't believe it is - concurrency related (i.e. multiple processes). even with 64 threads, it didn't start causing problems that I am aware of
23:11<avongauss>until I maxed out the directory table.
23:12<tjfontaine>I've triggered the directory index full many times w/o any corruption :<
23:13<avongauss>I agree, it's not that by itself.
23:13<tjfontaine>I've had max directory with 1 random read thread, and 1 random move thread
23:13<tjfontaine>no trigger
23:14<tjfontaine>though it does get confused with thining the directory is full despite being able to drop out of the script and create files
23:14<avongauss>oh, I'm creating about 200,000 files, doing some reads, some directory listings, deleting all the files.
23:14<Bdragon>So I wedged myself up there a bit better and started taking pictures of the left area...
23:14<Bdragon>Boy, I used to suck at wiring...
23:14<Bdragon>(the cat is visible sorta by the big rock...)
23:14<tjfontaine>my last was creating 397000
23:14-!-jcn [] has joined #linode
23:14<@caker>Bdragon: nice foundation support there...
23:14<avongauss>if anyone from atlanta28 is on here, I'm sorry.
23:15<path->that's what i was thinking..
23:15<path->that irc log is about as sturdy as that support
23:15<Bdragon>It's not load bearing.. Well, sorta not load bearing.
23:15<Bdragon>I mean, if it has to it probabaly won't bear much load.
23:16<path->old house?
23:16<Bdragon>Pictures taken using the "let's randomly flail the camera around and hope we get a good one" method employed by me...
23:16<HoopyCat>Bdragon: that splice is scary, for sure
23:16<Bdragon>Oh, about 125 years old now...
23:16<path->no gige for you!
23:16<hal14450>caker, you got a second to look at my my /etc/network/interfaces setup to be sure i'm not shooting myslef in the foot?
23:16<Bdragon>give or take...
23:16<@caker>imma thinking that's not up to code .. even 25 yr old code
23:17-!-exor674 is now known as exor|zzz
23:17<Bdragon>Funny story about that cable
23:17<Battousai>that looks suspiciously similar to the crawlspace under my house
23:17<path->is the cat under the rock?
23:17<avongauss>that's not masking tape, is it?
23:17<HoopyCat>Bdragon: is the cat that... uhh... thing behind the 2x~8 behind the rock?
23:18<Battousai>except add some cloth-insulated electrical wires and home-cut coax
23:18<Bdragon>I scrounged it.
23:18<Bdragon>See, we had a new school built back in '00 or so...
23:18<HoopyCat>Battousai: knob and tube!
23:18<HoopyCat>'cept without the knobs or the tubes
23:18<Bdragon>And the guys running network cable were flagrantly wasteful...
23:18<Bdragon>I stuffed my totebag full of cat-5 scraps...
23:18<Bdragon>and by scraps I mean "Oh, sections about 15-20 feet long"
23:18<hal14450>oh dear caker i hope that comment wasn't directed at me
23:19<@caker>hal14450: <-- pastebin it -- I'm sure someone would review it
23:19<Battousai>actually we replaced the old electrical down there a few years ago
23:19<Solver>hal14450: I'm happy to take a peak. I with with Debian a bit :)
23:19<Battousai>so it's all plastic insulated and properly stapled to the beams
23:19<Bdragon>Actually, the electrical is pretty good
23:20<Bdragon>I believe my grandpa was actually a Journeyman at one point...
23:20<Bdragon>(and my dad had some training)
23:20<Bdragon>And I know my way around a breaker box as well...
23:20<Bdragon>"Finally," he exclaimed.. "A good shot of the cat!"
23:21<HoopyCat>WHAT THE F...
23:21<hal14450>that loo kosher?
23:21<hal14450>damn typos
23:21<Bdragon>And one more just cuz.
23:21<Solver>hal14450: I put network & broadcast lines in interfaces
23:22<Battousai>i had the wrong cat in mind i guess
23:22<Solver>it used to be necessary, maybe it isn't anymore.
23:22<mendel>Bdragon: There is no toad there.
23:22<mendel>Sheesh. :)
23:22<HoopyCat>Bdragon: ok, you win a beer.
23:22<hal14450>i've only got the 2 ip's to worry about for now
23:22<Bdragon>That's cuz the toad is in
23:22<Bdragon>Taken last, uploaded first
23:22<Battousai>the agreement was that they all be in the same photo
23:22<mendel>I know :)
23:23<mendel>but the transcript in 2952 says...
23:23<Bdragon>Anyway, I don't drink ;)
23:23<Bdragon>Although, after that crawlspace...
23:23<kupesoft>Any of you use mpm-itk on your linodes?
23:23<Bdragon>So, which is scarier? The cat or the splice? (That IS masking tape btw)
23:23<Eman>i love the taped up cables Bdragon
23:24<HoopyCat>Bdragon: i'd be hesitant to touch either of them
23:24<hal14450>Solver, so it looks kosher you just prefer a different setup?
23:24<Bdragon>I actually run 100baseT over that damn cable...
23:24<Battousai>splice looks okay
23:24<Eman>its like the cable running to my garage, it has 8 connections like that along the length of it
23:24<Battousai>if you don't have any rodents
23:24<Solver>hal14450: well I'm not convinced you can get away without the network & broadcast entries
23:24<Solver>hal14450: I'd put them in
23:24<irgeek>Bdragon: That's pretty disgusting. You're little pet does not look to be a recent addition to the family.
23:24<hal14450>it works currently
23:24<Bdragon>That was back when I couldn't actually afford cat-5 cable...
23:25<hal14450>can you give me an example?
23:25<Bdragon>Boy was finding all those discarded scraps a treasure trove...
23:25<HoopyCat>i think it's time to go to bed... was planning on going to sleep an hour ago, but damn
23:25<Bdragon>That splice is actually the oldest network cable run in the house...
23:26<irgeek>hal14450: Did anyone mention "auto eth0 eth0:1" yet?
23:26<irgeek>Doh. Nevermain.
23:27<Solver>irgeek: it's the great connudrum - one auto line or many
23:27*CpuID looks at his spare cat6 roll
23:27<Solver>I've never decided :)
23:27<CpuID>i ran a nice cat6 setup here in our rented house when we moved in hehe
23:27<irgeek>I didn't notice the second one until after I opened my big mouth.
23:27<Solver>hal14450: network address is the lowest in the range, broadcast the highest
23:28<Eman>im cheap and use whatever cable i can swipe from places
23:28<Eman>two cat3 cables = cat6 = gigabit time
23:28<Solver>Eman: hahaha
23:28<jcn>you people are all nerds. did anyone ever tell you that?
23:29<Bdragon>Nah, but thanks for the verification
23:29<jcn>i say that as someone who is sitting at work, and in this channel.
23:29<Solver>jcn: all the time
23:29<HoopyCat>jcn: i know you are but what am i !!
23:29<irgeek>jcn: i r not nerd - i r geek
23:30<HoopyCat>ok, g'nite folx
23:30<Eman>i r lulzcat
23:30<Solver>ni ni as my daughter says
23:30<hal14450>thanks for the review of the setup i don't really want to muck sbout with it it until i switch to xen it looks like it's kosher to me so far for xen so that's my main concern
23:30<jcn>i've decided to stop speaking lol
23:30<jcn>it's impacting my everyday speaking, and it's driving me nuts.
23:30<Solver>hal14450: ok cool
23:30<Solver>hal14450: and you can access the console if you futz it
23:30<HoopyCat>don't... uhhh... do what bdragon did and crawl under your house at 11pm to take dead cat photos, it's dangerous and should only be done by professionals
23:31<irgeek>hal14450: Did you double check /etc/resolv.conf too?
23:31<Eman>what about using cat3 cable as a tv antenna?
23:31<hal14450>Solver, yep that's one of the major selling points of linode
23:31<Solver>hal14450: yeah nice huh
23:31<hal14450>i can shoot myself in the foot unlimited times
23:31<Solver>I've only ever taken one remote box off air
23:31<Solver>it was 1000km away
23:32<Solver>luckily it had a getty running on a serial port
23:32<Solver>ifconfig eth0 down
23:32<Bdragon>Over ssh? oh man, I've done that more than once...
23:32<hal14450>if this xen zaptel driver does the business well i'm chuffed beyond belief
23:32<Solver>I've done it twice but the other one was local :)
23:32-!-hfb [] has joined #linode
23:33<Solver>a friend of mine had his neutal network dump core
23:33<Bdragon>It's a second favorite to "ill advised usage of iptables while connected over ssh"
23:33<Solver>he had time to walk across campus and talk to the sysadmin before it filled the filesystem
23:33<Solver>Bdragon: oh yeah. tip of the day: have a cron job to drop the firewall every 10 mins if doing remote firewall work. test the cron job
23:34<hal14450>you all run denyhosts or similar ?
23:34<Bdragon>Solver: Nah, I always had an alternate way in...
23:34<Solver>Bdragon: that works too :)
23:34<Solver>hal14450: firewalls/ids all thge way baby :)
23:34<Bdragon>Having to drag a monitor and keyboard into another room sucks though ;)
23:35<Solver>serial consoles rock
23:35<Eman>hal14450: i run denyhosts, a different port and certficate login only
23:35<Solver>taking a box offair from 15000km to reconfigure the network is cool
23:35<hal14450>i'm keen on sharing bad hosts is there some sort of database already setup for that or no?
23:35<Solver>rsa all the way for external ssh
23:35<Solver>hal14450: I thought you meant the silly tcp wrappers thing
23:35<Bdragon>Yeah, I use a rsa key.. Can't be buggered to mess with certs...
23:36<hal14450>i use key auth but i want to give the script kiddies a bad taste in their mouths
23:36<Solver>hal14450: ah ok ;)
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23:36<Solver>damn the debian ssl bug bit
23:36<hal14450>no kidding
23:37<Bdragon>yeah, that sucks...
23:37<hal14450>pissed me off
23:37<encode> <-- I love it :)
23:37<Bdragon>I had to make some users rekey...
23:37<Solver>made a lot of people work weekends
23:37<hal14450>since i had to do all sorts of work
23:38<Bdragon>I wonder how many hours total IT time was spent on that...
23:38<hal14450>that's unlikely to happen again now though
23:38<Bdragon>like, worldwide
23:39<Bdragon>Also, I wonder how many people haven't fixed their keys..
23:39<Solver>hhehe - my 19 month old daughter beat me to 2 passports :)
23:39<warewolf>caker: I think you may have answered this before: how long until I get pushed out of UML into Xen?
23:39<Solver>Bdragon: lots
23:39<Solver>warewolf: put a ticket in
23:39<Solver>that's what the docs say to do
23:39<Bdragon>Hahaha, all the sudden I am reminded of something funny that happened once...
23:39<hal14450>besides the vuln wasn't something like an M$ vuln where you can just walk in and look around without serious work
23:39<warewolf>Solver: no, I meant a forced upgrade.
23:40<Solver>warewolf: ah :)
23:40<Bdragon>So I was in a computer class of some sort and the whole lab was doing win2k installs to set up an active directory...
23:40<warewolf>like "we're not supporting UML anymore." forced upgrade.
23:40<Bdragon>So we get it all up and everyone talking to each other...
23:40<Bdragon>And then nimbda blasts onto the network and bluescreens the entire lab at the same time...
23:40<Solver>Bdragon: rotfl
23:41<warewolf>Bdragon: rofl.
23:41<warewolf>Bdragon: back in high school I told a teacher "Hey, you know all these windows machines aren't patched, right?"
23:41<hal14450>reason why i use linux everywhere
23:41<warewolf>Bdragon: he said "No, they're current."
23:41<warewolf>Bdragon: then I pressed the enter key.
23:41<hal14450>except at work
23:41<hal14450>i have no influence on them
23:42<Solver>warewolf: hahaha. proof of concept huh :)
23:42<warewolf>and one by one, in sequence, one second apart, the entire classroom bluescreened.
23:42<Solver>warewolf: ouch :) proved your point though
23:42<hal14450>it's like banging my head against a birck wall
23:42<Bdragon>But yeah...
23:42<Bdragon>A whole lab session down the shitter...
23:42<Solver>there was an incident with a bunch of Xterminals back at university (I was not in this class)
23:42<Bdragon>We still got credit for it :P
23:42<warewolf>Solver: he said "Okay, first you're going to tell me how to fix that. Second, you're never going to do it again."
23:42<Bdragon>Oh man
23:43<Solver>they ran a for loop to lock al ldisplays to check on what students were up to
23:43<hal14450>we have proprietary software that only runs on M$
23:43<Solver>it was slow enough (early 90s) that the people at the back of the room were deleting files while the screens locked
23:43<Bdragon>That reminds me of all the fun I had with net localgroup ;)
23:43<Solver>warewolf: hahaha
23:43<Bdragon>"What? Domain policy is forbidding me from installing this printer? Let's make a local user and elevate them to administrator!"
23:43<warewolf>I enjoyed using psshutdn.exe remotely over the network to lock a coworker's desktop repeatedly.
23:44<Bdragon>Oh man
23:44<hal14450>good times
23:44<Bdragon>We had the novell equivilent of that in high school
23:44*Solver has never touched Novell
23:44<Bdragon>I rather like netware...
23:45<warewolf>I'm certified CNA 4.11b
23:45<path->when i was young working on the helpdesk, i used some samba command to send a msg to another tech. "Click OK to format C:"
23:45<Solver>path-: uh oh :)
23:45<path->and with samba it didn't show the senders username in the title bar :)
23:45<Bdragon>I never got certification but I thoroughly enjoyed netware class in college
23:45<path->so it looked for real
23:45<Solver>ouch :)
23:45<Bdragon>Oh man
23:45<path->he was pissed
23:45<Bdragon>that reminds me..
23:45<path->and the aol hacker kid at work got all the blame
23:45<hal14450>windows is evil
23:45<path->it was great
23:46<Solver>path-: hhaha
23:46<warewolf>type /sign to sign the petition
23:46<Bdragon>People who steal ram from the netware lab...
23:46<Solver>warewolf: what petition?
23:46<Bdragon>"No seriously, we NEED 512M to do our stuff here, c'mon"
23:46<Bdragon>"It won't fucking INSTALL without it..."
23:46<warewolf>Bdragon: nobody needs more than 640k.
23:47<Solver>back when ram was expensive someone stole half the ram from a lab of 80 PCs
23:47<Solver>half from each box that is
23:47<hal14450>at least IT for me is a hobby since i have no say at work
23:47*warewolf -c sleep &
23:47<Solver>hal14450: what is your day job?
23:48<Solver>these days a bootloader needs more then 640k :(
23:48<hal14450>i kep showing them linux is better, hell we even have a unix system we rely on for everything it's the be all and end all of our whole business
23:48<Bdragon>Well, maybe one or two bootloaders
23:48<Solver>hal14450: is it backed up?
23:48<Solver>do they have a DR plan, etc, etc
23:48<Solver>offsite backups, I could go on.. :)
23:49<hal14450>the unix system i ssolid as arock it's windows that crashes
23:49<Solver>is it patched? ok I'll stop
23:49<Bdragon>Heh, 49.5 days...
23:49<Solver>Bdragon: haha
23:50<Bdragon>People: "Why didn't you notice that obvious bug?" MS: "Uh, you really think we can get our own machines to stay up that long?"
23:50<Bdragon>Meanwhile, in OpenVMS land...
23:50<hal14450>when the main windows box i use dies we can't log into the unix box but they're gonna let me setup a linux box now for that
23:51<Solver>hal14450: do they have a sysadmin?
23:51<hal14450>haha yeah i guess i'm it
23:51<hal14450>nobody else has a clue
23:51<Solver>but you said you have no say in IT matters :) if the sysadmin doesn't have a say it is bad :)
23:52<Solver>even if you are only the p/t sysadmin :)
23:52<Solver>make them pay for SAGE membership for you
23:52<Bdragon>Heh, the words "Workgroup server" comes to mind...
23:52<hal14450>haha dude i'm in shipping and receiving and i'n the IT guy
23:53<Eman>NT4? /wrists
23:53<Solver>hal14450: do they have backups of the unix system?
23:53<Solver>offsite backups? :)
23:53<hal14450>i have no idea
23:53<Bdragon>Man, if only you were janatorial staff, it would be even funnier...
23:53<Bdragon>janitors kick ass...
23:53<Solver>man people need to start thinking about information management
23:53<Bdragon>There should be ninja janitors...
23:53<hal14450>i doubt we backup offsite
23:54<Solver>a lot of companies don't do this.
23:54<hal14450>i'm just savvy and when boxes die i can fix them so i spend a lot of time not doing what i really get paid for
23:54<Solver>backing up regularly, offsite and having at least a sketch of a DR plan is extremely important
23:55<Solver>a proper tested DR plan is ideal of course :)
23:55<hal14450>we're gonna get a linux box setup to login to the unix box
23:55<avongauss>DR = run a Linode based host?
23:55<hal14450>so that's gonna be a relief
23:56<Bdragon>dvds in a safe deposit box...
23:56<Solver>I recommend getting to the bottom of the backup schedule and seeing where the backups are kept
23:56<Solver>hint: fire proof safes are not data safe in many cases
23:56<hal14450>they're kept on site for sure
23:56<hal14450>we suck
23:57<dvgrhl>what about off-site fire proof safes?
23:57<Solver>dvgrhl: you can do that if you want but the key is the offsite bit
23:57<Solver>no single disaster should destroy all copies of the data
23:57<avongauss>just don't let interns take them home.
23:57<hal14450>jesus man these people can't print sales orders without my help
23:57<Solver>data integrity
23:57<hal14450>they're lost
23:58<hal14450>i feel like i need a raise or something
23:58<Solver>offsite backups are job protecting
23:58<Solver>no company no job
23:58<Bdragon>Many company failures happen after a catastrophic data loss..
23:58<Solver>sure do
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23:59<hal14450>i just keep hoping shit will get better
23:59<Solver>it was something like 40% failure
23:59<Solver>in my experience you need to go against the current to fix this stuff
23:59<Bdragon>Doesn't the SANS reading room have a nice document on how to go about figuring out a dr plan for the first time?
23:59<hal14450>it's not even my department lol
23:59<dvgrhl>that may work, but often you just need to find a new job
23:59<Solver>Bdragon: I believe they do
---Logclosed Wed Jun 25 00:00:07 2008