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#linode IRC Logs for 2008-11-02

---Logopened Sun Nov 02 00:00:46 2008
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02:11<getsmart>hi guys
02:12<@mikegrb>mmm cake
02:12<getsmart>mhh looks like cake
02:12<getsmart>:)
02:12<getsmart>chhesckae?
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02:13<getsmart>mean, cheesecake?
02:13<Peng_>Is it just me or is the forum's database down?
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02:15<nknight>not just you
02:20<Peng_>caker: Err, the forum is down. phpBB says it can't connect to the database. FWIW, the wiki is fine.
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02:36<Peng_>Blaaagh, Daylight Saving Time.
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03:32<loxs>hello folks, I am using gentoo on linode, and I am wondering how acceptable is it to update my system and to install quite some stuff. I mean, that will be quite a lot of compiling... :)
03:34<erikh>don't worry
03:34<erikh>linode will make sure you be polite
03:34<erikh>your I/O gets throttled.
03:35<tierra>go for it, host resources are split up to handle anything you toss at it without bothing anyone else on your host
03:35<tierra>*bothering
03:36<erikh>basically, your builds will quickly get *very slow*
03:36<erikh>and you will strongly reconsider installing gentoo.
03:36<loxs>does this mean that as I can generally do anything I want on my system and linode will be OK with me?
03:36<nknight>pretty much
03:36<loxs>ok, thank you
03:39<railsninja>gentoo rocks
03:40<Peng_>It would be rude to run Folding@Home or intentionally thrash the disks 24/7 though..
03:40<Peng_>But within reason, you can do whatever you want.
03:40<loxs>I know Peng_, I have read the ToS :)
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03:43<loxs>another question. Is it possible for me to use two disk profiles as I would otherwise use two partitions on physical disk? I mean, I would like to have separate /home (and probably /var) partitions
03:44<railsninja>yes just mount them both in your profile configuration
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03:54<erikh>ugh
03:54<erikh>do we change the times tonight or tomorrow night?
03:55<nknight>tonight... in about 5 minutes in PDT/PST, in fact
03:55<loxs>we already changed them in Bulgaria last week
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03:57<loxs>does anyone of you know how much disk space would take up an average gentoo server (i mean with the usual stuff installed... like apache, mysql php)?
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04:31<loxs>folks, is it safe if I rename my machine? I mean, I don't like that li00-000 stuff very much :)
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04:38<Peng_>loxs: Sure.
04:38<Peng_>loxs: You can change your reverse DNS in the dashboard.
04:39<loxs>ah, that was helpful, thanks :)
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05:05<loxs>folks, what DNS-es do I enter in my domain WHOIS info?
05:05<loxs>I can't find this anywhere in the linode manager
05:11<Hobbsee>as in, which nameservers?
05:13<loxs>I am hosting my domains at dreamhost.com... of course I can use different DNS servers to host them. And I can change the whois info... so what are the DNS servers to host the domains on linode and how do I set them up?
05:20<tozz>ns1.linode.com to ns4.linode.com
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05:20<tozz>you set it up in the DNS Manager
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07:48<iQwerty>Are the forums down?
07:48<atourino>yeah
07:49<atourino>DB went bye bye i think
07:49<iQwerty>hmm... ok, thanks!
07:50<Peng_>Someone should wake up and fix it soon.
07:51<iQwerty>Another question: Can anyone recommend me a good .com domain registrar? After some research I found that a lot of people like godaddy, but also a lot of people say it's very bad.... Since a domain only costs about 5-20$/year, I don't want to be with a 'bad' registrar...
07:51<A-KO>godaddy
07:51<A-KO>the people that talk shit about godaddy are just talking shit or doing dumb shit
07:51<A-KO>IMO
07:52<A-KO>I've used godaddy for years and have never had a problem, and when I needed customer service, they were VERY quick to help me
07:52<iQwerty>A-KO: OK, well, I think I just take godaddy then. How long does it take to setup a .com domain name? I only set up .nl names in the past, which takes about 1-2 working days....
07:53<A-KO>a few minutes?
07:53<iQwerty>hmmmm.... nice :)
07:53<iQwerty>Tanks for the info!
07:53<A-KO>buy domain, go to manage domains, change nameservers to point to linode's for the domain, then go to linode's DNS manager and configure your DNS info
07:54<A-KO>your domain should be totally 100% up and running within maybe 30 minutes? if that?
07:54<iQwerty>That's great! (In The Netherlands, 'SIDN' needs to verify that you are a real person, and that your credit balanc is fine, whih takes a working day...)
07:56<HoopyCat>here, the computer verifies that you're a real person and it takes a few seconds to verify availability of funds. hooray computers :-)
07:56<Peng_>Oh, so that's why you don't see .nl spam domains. :P
08:02<tozz>I wanted to buy a .ru domain, they needed passport numbers etc
08:02<tozz>crazy russians :p
08:04<Peng_>Argh, Daylight Saving Time is killing me. I have no idea what time it is.
08:05<Peng_>Wait...it's Sunday, isn't it?
08:05<HoopyCat>Sun Nov 2 08:05:55 EST 2008
08:08<metaperl>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Parsons#Guantanamo_Bay_blog_controversy
08:10<metaperl>SpaceHobo: he retracted the article
08:10<metaperl>perhaps just for business reasons
08:12<HoopyCat>wow, Parsons Technology... there's a blast from the past
08:13<Peng_>I wonder how confusing it would be to use UTC all of the time?
08:13<Peng_>TV schedules would change twice a year..
08:15<metaperl>all OK? I wanted to get away from godaddy, but there is nowhere to run
08:15<metaperl>I tried out the suggested alternatives
08:15<metaperl>but didnt like them
08:15<metaperl>dotster, etc
08:15<Peng_>Oh, really? Which ones?
08:15*Peng_ is sort of in the market for a registrar.
08:16<atourino>I like name.com myself
08:17<atourino>it has a really straightforward interface
08:17*Hobbsee uses namecheap, with no problems.
08:17<HoopyCat>the problem is that godaddy works quite well and their prices are pretty good, and those are my top two criteria for a registrar
08:18<atourino>yeah godaddy is good for domain name registration (although their interface is so freaking slow... and they are constantly offering you all of their other crappy services...)
08:19<atourino>Im slowly switching to name.com because of their interface... it's zippy and they dont bombard me with stupid offers
08:19<HoopyCat>all i want is a few NS records and a record in whois. :-)
08:19<A-KO>yeah, they do bombard you
08:19<A-KO>but their service is good so
08:20<atourino>some of my domains I will keep on godaddy as their registration fee is much lower there than if i transfer them to name.com so yeah... use what is good for you
08:21<HoopyCat>name.com does look perfectly cromulent
08:22<Peng_>They even have a simple name. :D
08:28*metaperl checks out name.com
08:28*metaperl LOVES name.com - thanks atourino
08:29-!-mode/#linode [+o jadoba] by ChanServ
08:29<Peng_>Good morning, jadoba?
08:29<@jadoba>hello Peng_
08:29<@jadoba>and yes, it is a very good morning :)
08:29<Peng_>jadoba: So...the forum is a little bit...completely down. :D
08:30<@jadoba>not responding
08:30<Peng_>jadoba: It eventually comes up with a phpBB error saying the db is down
08:30<@jadoba>hrmm
08:30<Peng_>Although the wiki and everything else are up
08:31<@jadoba>thanks
08:32<@jadoba>ill take a look...
08:32<Peng_>Thanks. :)
08:32<Peng_>Sorry to bother you with something as soon as you get in...
08:33<@jadoba>in...?
08:33<Peng_>In to work. Or this channel. Or whatever.
08:33<@jadoba>nah, dont worry about it :)
08:58<JDLSpeedy>jadoba: i guess u got stuck doing irc help and tickets? heh
09:00<@jadoba>no, i just rolled out of bed earlier than my coworkers
09:00<JDLSpeedy>ah
09:00<JDLSpeedy>be back
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09:46<HoopyCat>mmm, french toast
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10:05<torrentt>hi everyone
10:05<torrentt>how can i backup a mysql database with mysqldump?
10:05<torrentt>i saw the man, but really didnt understand it..
10:10<Peng_>torrentt: You should google [MySQL backup] or something and read a guide.
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10:31-!-zebulon [~zebulon@5ac90a78.bb.sky.com] has joined #linode
10:32<zebulon>Hi guys, can anyone help me to test my fysigradis program on Linux: http://fisygradis.sourceforge.net
10:36<BP{k}>sorry no X installed here.
10:38*mwalling doesnt have X installed either... need a long VGA cable to get from dallas to NY
10:40<BP{k}> plus the website doesn't actually answer the question: "Why using windows instead of the traditional command line shell?" .. so ...
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10:42<Humpaah>hello there
10:42<Humpaah>are the forums down for everyone?
10:42<path->only people whose nicks start with H
10:42<HoopyCat>doesn't work for me either :-(
10:43<Humpaah>path- 's explanation makes sense then :p
10:43<mwalling>path-: ^5
10:43<path->\o/
10:43<HoopyCat>i thought it was International Web Forums Are Inferior To Mailing Lists day, but it appears to be a conspiracy by the non-H people
10:44<HoopyCat>with regards to the previous conversation, i do have X installed on a linux box here, but i fear my system requirements may be well below the minimum
10:44<Humpaah>non-H people suck anyway
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10:45*path- is enjoying the 3D view of his eggs and hash browns
10:45<path->the view is diminishing though
10:46<HoopyCat><--- totally H
10:46<spuhg>hi, when i set up a virtual subserver, using virtualmin, and declare it's zone in the linode dns manager, the page says server not found, am i missing something?
10:47<mwalling>you're talking about 2 seperate systems. see if ones broken before assuming the other one is.
10:48<HoopyCat>spuhg: what's the hostname?
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11:03<HoopyCat>this tuesday, vote in favor of kittens and bacon dispensers. vote YES to proposition 716.
11:03<A-KO>I need more HD space
11:04<A-KO>it sucks having a RAID environment it's never as simple as buying another HD
11:04<HoopyCat>(thank you, california, for making it so i had to edit that more than once to come up with a proposition number that hasn't already been used)
11:04<@mikegrb>lolz
11:04<DephNet[Paul]>lol
11:04<fo0bar>lolz
11:04<path->we don't have propositions here
11:04<path->we just elect people that make laws for us ;)
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11:05<michiel->kitten and bacon dispensers. Are they seperate? or are we talking kittens wrapped in bacon??
11:05<nknight>http://scalzi.com/whatever/004457.html
11:06<HoopyCat>we have one proposition on our ballot here... something about moving a property line somewhere in the mountains a couple feet to the west or something to correct a measurement error from 1755 or something
11:07<nknight>*snrk*
11:07<HoopyCat>ah yes, "Amendment to Article 5, section 6 of the Consbreastution, in relation to additional civil service credit for members of the armed forces of the United States"
11:07<nknight>where's "here", Hoopy?
11:07<HoopyCat>nknight: Ballot #6, Monroe County, New York State
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11:08<HoopyCat>clbuttic, SpaceHobo.
11:09<HoopyCat>i'll finipoopit later; time to run off to the grocery store
11:09<HoopyCat>err, finipoop
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11:09<HoopyCat>shit, i'm out of it today.
11:12<nknight>Hoopy: presidential election year and the only thing you guys can come up with for a proposition is one that's going to get 99.9% of the vote? you guys are boring :P
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11:27<loxs>could anyone help me to change my machine name please
11:28<loxs>I'm running gentoo
11:28<loxs>and as far as I see, the hostname is given by the dhcp server
11:28<loxs>is there a way to change the name it gives to me?
11:33<metaperl>loxs: you mean what you see when you type 'hostname' ?
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11:34<loxs>yes
11:34<metaperl>loxs: I just read the manpage for hostname and it also allows for setting it
11:34<metaperl>just type
11:34<metaperl>man hostname
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11:39<MotoHoss>you may want to adjust the dhclient file to not 'request' the hostname ... or adjust it according to your needs...
11:41<@caker>with ubuntu, if dhcp-client finds an /etc/hostname file, it'll leave the hostname unmodified
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11:42<@caker>and possibly debian as well
11:42<A-KO>probably gentoo also
11:42<path->then you'd need to recompile with --hostname=/etc/hostname
11:43<mwalling>OMG EMERGE WORLD
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12:02<zebulon>Come and visit me at #fisygradis to help me test my software
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12:10<atourino>think zebulon might be a bot?
12:11<Pryon>C21121: Probability 0.8211221
12:11<zebulon>atourino:sorry for the outrage
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12:18<eric>anyone here know anything about rrd?
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12:30<atourino>zebulon: No worries. I was just wondering if you were a bot as the only two messages I saw from you were invites to a project...
12:31<mwalling>atourino: 12:21 [*] zebulon [~zebulon@5ac90a78.bb.sky.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:31<atourino>arg
12:31<atourino>ok
12:32<mwalling>caker: any plans to add .ip6.arpa/PTR record support to the dns manager?
12:32<mwalling>(doing so would let me kill off bind on my node)
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12:50<springmeyer>.osgeo.
12:50<springmeyer>hey, trying to understand a boot problem on my linode...
12:51-!-RiverRat [me@97-112-133-141.clsp.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:51<springmeyer>can't ssh in so I'm watching it try to start in the lish console.
12:52<springmeyer>the lish console prompts for an 'ubuntu login:' which seems odd and my user:pass does not work for this..
12:53-!-elhippo [~elhippo@cpe-70-116-27-115.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
12:54<springmeyer>this step follows the starting of various logs, the sshd, and apache...
12:55<mwalling>its odd for your linode to ask you to log in?
12:56-!-TheFirst [gaveup@your.friendly.neighborhood.hellmouth.info] has joined #linode
12:56<springmeyer>no, not at all, I just feel like this is a different login step than I've seen before...
12:56<springmeyer>I may be just getting different linodes confused perhaps...
12:58<springmeyer>I think I'll check with the various other owners to see if the creds have changed, then check back if I still have problems...
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13:26<loxs>folks, I sync-ed portage and now all the packages are masked. Any ideas why?
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15:52<mjs>Just a quick question, I note that the Fremont DC is currently full, is there any ETA at this stage on when moe capacity will be added? specifically availability of a 720 VM?
15:53<A-KO>off the top of my head I think there's a waitlist for Fremont
15:54<Eman>i thought they just added capacity
15:54<SelfishMan>Many nodes opened up recently and it seems to be happening more often so check the availability page
15:54<mjs>Is that just a particularly popular DC, or is Linode jsut a bit restricted in expansion in that facility?
15:55<mjs>seems that there is plenty of availability in other locations.
15:55<Eman>!avail-he
15:55<linbot>Eman: Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0
15:55<Eman>those went fast wow
15:55<guinea-pig>eman, they went very fast
15:56<nknight>wow, lucky I grabbed mine when I did, I guess :)
15:56<Eman>me too
15:56<Eman>i beat the rush by 3 years
15:56<guinea-pig>heh
15:56<guinea-pig>yyeah
15:56<@mikegrb>lolz
15:56<nknight>lol
15:56<fo0bar>lolz
15:57-!-sleep_ [~coded@189.12.143.46] has joined #linode
15:57*SelfishMan mumbles about Fremont elitists
15:57<guinea-pig>SelfishMan: i can give you a shell...
15:57<Clorith>poor selfish doesn't have a freemont node? =P
15:57<sleep_>[HIghoS] im using ubunu 8.10, and i cant install the proftpd with apt-get, why?
15:57<sleep_>[ElectricElf] Couldn't find package proftpd
15:58-!-J-Node [~J-Node@cpe-70-112-224-193.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:58<SelfishMan>guinea-pig: I have half a rack in that facility so I don't really need the shell
15:58<mjs>:) fremont works out best for the huge transit back to Australia
15:58<guinea-pig>whatever script you're using, might want to turn it off...
15:58<Clorith>SelfishMan, you never say no to free stuff =P
15:58<Clorith>everyone knows this, haha
15:58<guinea-pig>sleep_: it's in universe
15:59<sleep_>so how i can install the proftpd?
15:59<sleep_>with apt-get
15:59<Clorith>yo umight want to add reppositories to the list ?
15:59<Clorith>:P
15:59<Clorith>or you could try aptitude update first
16:00<sleep_>i try update first
16:00<sleep_>-bash: aptitude: command not found
16:00<guinea-pig>in your sources list, uncomment the line that says: deb http://.. .... universe
16:00<mjs>got to run, unfortunately it's monday mornign here.
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16:00<guinea-pig>no aptitude... sounds broken
16:01<Clorith>maybe 8.10 doesn't come with aptitude...
16:01<Clorith>no, that sounds wrong
16:02<@mikegrb>lolz
16:02<Clorith>considerign aptitude isthe new apt-get, lol
16:02<fo0bar>lolz
16:02<sleep_>so
16:02<sleep_>im using ubuntu 8.10
16:02<sleep_>its just 225mb
16:02<sleep_>so small
16:02<Clorith>then apt-get update first
16:02<@mikegrb>lolz
16:02<Clorith>for example, lol
16:02<fo0bar>lolz
16:02<Clorith>n
16:02<Clorith>ok, that's just anoying
16:03<guinea-pig>sigh
16:03<sleep_>i did
16:03<sleep_>update fist
16:03<sleep_>and dont have proftpd =/
16:03<guinea-pig>and do you have universe enabled?
16:03<Clorith>id you uncomment universe ?
16:03<guinea-pig>i have headache. can't deal. bbiab
16:03<Clorith>linode already has the 8.10 dist avaialble ?
16:03<sleep_>where i see it
16:03<Clorith>/etc/apt/sources.list
16:04<guinea-pig>Clorith: he didn't say it's on a linode.... :P
16:04<sleep_># deb http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ intrepid universe
16:04<sleep_># deb-src http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ intrepid universe
16:04<sleep_>it?
16:04<sleep_>i have uncomment ?
16:04<sleep_>i need?
16:04<guinea-pig>uncomment at least the first line
16:04<sleep_>just first?
16:05<Clorith>guinea-pig, point taken :P
16:05<sleep_>just first line?
16:05<Clorith>sure
16:07<sleep_>yeah
16:07<sleep_>now works
16:07<sleep_>thanks guy
16:08<sleep_>- error: no valid servers configured
16:08<sleep_>when i try run proftpd
16:08<@mikegrb>lolz
16:08<sleep_>lol ^^
16:08<fo0bar>lolz
16:08<sleep_>im so stupid, can say
16:08-!-daniel [~daniel@ip70-185-107-2.ga.at.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:09<sleep_>but im learning
16:09<guinea-pig>i suggestt reading documentation :)
16:10<guinea-pig>apt-get install proftpd-doc
16:10<Clorith>never did like them
16:10<Clorith>it's like reading an IKEA manual
16:10<guinea-pig>oh btw
16:10<Clorith>nobody knows why they produce manuals for them, you always get leftover parts any way, and it's not THAT hard to figure out
16:10<Clorith>hehe
16:10<guinea-pig>i'd also suggest just using sftp/ssh/scp instead of ftp... but that's not the help you asked for
16:11<Clorith>I've actualyl nver used sftp...
16:11<Clorith>I should look into that
16:12<jkwood>scp ftw
16:12<guinea-pig>password over plaintext == bad
16:12<guinea-pig>down with ftp!
16:12-!-RSA [~4fb67f49@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
16:12<guinea-pig>RSA: encrypt me babu
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16:13<RSA>Hello, can anyone help me shutting down a phishing scam?
16:13<RSA>which is located on linode
16:14<guinea-pig>hmm
16:15<RSA>any admins around?
16:15<guinea-pig>they're all idle
16:15<Clorith>errm, phishing for what ?
16:15<RSA>http://li15-116.members.linode.com/twiki/redirect.to/www.visa.com/personal/security/
16:15<sleep_>why when i reboot the linode, the /etc/motd has been modified for default ?
16:15<Clorith>if it's paypal or such, reproting it to paypal is more effective
16:15<RSA>phishing against Visa bank
16:15-!-A-KO [as@c-68-55-148-111.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:15<guinea-pig>mikegrb: tasaro: caker: jadoba: ping
16:15<@jadoba>hi
16:15<guinea-pig>Clorith: it's also against TOS
16:15<guinea-pig>i'm pretty sure
16:16<Clorith>guinea-pig, of course it is
16:16-!-A-KO [as@c-68-55-148-111.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #linode
16:16<RSA>will do, thanks.
16:16<Clorith>but it's not official if you jsut say it in a chat channel
16:16<@jadoba>:)
16:16<Clorith>they need it properly I believe
16:16<guinea-pig>might just be a broken wiki install
16:16<guinea-pig>that got hijacked
16:16<RSA>have a good day
16:17<sleep_>why when i reboot the linode, the /etc/motd has been modified for default ?
16:17<Clorith>redirect.to
16:17-!-snitko [~roman@80.70.230.171] has joined #linode
16:17<Clorith>you sure it isn't the visa site inside it ?
16:18<@mikegrb>lolz
16:18<Clorith>nope, it's a folder anemd www.visa.com lol
16:18<fo0bar>lolz
16:18-!-mode/#linode [+q *!*@feh.colobox.com] by FloodServ
16:18<sleep_>how i can fix it, in ubuntu, when i reboot it, he restore the /etc/motd and the hostname of my linode
16:18-!-KB1PYW [~KB1PYW@cpe-74-66-8-214.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
16:18-!-KB1PYW [~KB1PYW@cpe-74-66-8-214.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit []
16:18-!-KB1PYW is "(unknown)" on (unknown)
16:19<sleep_>??
16:21<sleep_>its very strange =/
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16:29<PetraArkanian>why is there slackware 10 and slackware 12 is there something in 10 thats not in 12?
16:29<Clorith>don't you mean in 12 that isn't in 10 ?
16:30<PetraArkanian>NO
16:30<PetraArkanian>sorry caps lock
16:30<PetraArkanian>but um no i mean why keep 10 in the list if 12 is out
16:30<nknight>same reason there's a CentOS 4 and a CentOS 5? people (and the apps they run) aren't always ready for the "latest-and-greatest"
16:30<PetraArkanian>ah ok
16:31<nknight>heck, I do a little contract work that still involves RHEL 3 servers, ouchie :)
16:31<PetraArkanian>rhel is the enterprise one tho isnt it?
16:31<PetraArkanian>the ones that you pay for support and whatnot?
16:32<PetraArkanian>so if you already paied for the support and have it setup why pay for more support etc?
16:32<nknight>RHEL subscriptions aren't for specific versions
16:34<nknight>and there are good reasons to get off RHEL3 if you can, hardware support, for instance; and support/updates on it EOL almost exactly two years from now
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16:48<arooni_____>i got postfix installed; and also got postfixadmin installed.... what else must i do to be able to send emails?
16:52-!-lakin [~lakin@S01060013101832cd.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
16:53<HedgeMage>other than configuring postfix, not much. However, if you would like to receive them as well you need dovecot or courier or something like that.
16:54<nyerup>.. or configure Postfix to forward the mails somewhere else.
17:01-!-ph [~ph^@62.80-203-249.nextgentel.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:01<arooni_____>nyerup, how do i configure postfix to forward all emails sent to all accounts to a gmail address?
17:02<Clorith>look in the aliases file
17:02<Clorith>/etc/aliases
17:03<nyerup>Or users' individual ~/.forward files.
17:03<Clorith>so you'd do something like; support: myuser@gmail.com
17:03<nyerup>arooni_____: You could also start here: http://www.postfix.org/VIRTUAL_README.html
17:03<Clorith>that would forward support@mydomain.tld to myuser@gmail.com
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17:49<cu3edweb>can I upgrade and downgrade if necessary without reinstalling with linode?
17:50<cu3edweb>I am looking at linode and slicehost trying to decide who to go with?
17:51<Hobbsee>yes, afaik.
17:51<Hobbsee>it's a one click migration, usually.
17:51<jkwood>Yep. You request a migration, they set it up, and you move at your convenience by clicking the migration button.
17:52<cu3edweb>so just migrate no reinstall?
17:52<linbot>New news from forums: Reboot: atlanta36 in System and Network Status <http://www.linode.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3633>
17:52<jkwood>Right.
17:52<cu3edweb>has anyone here used slicehost and has a reason they switched to linode?
17:52<cu3edweb>just wondering
17:53<jkwood>Yes, several people.
17:53<jkwood>Not me, though.
17:54<jkwood>I don't know if any of them are around at this particular time on a Sunday evening.
17:54<cu3edweb>Does linode offer a online browser based console incase I am not at my computer?
17:55<jkwood>Yep.
17:55<jkwood>It's called lish, which is actually a separate ssh access to your machine (even if you're not running ssh!) and there's a Javascript browser for it.
17:56<Palintheus>!lish
17:56<linbot>Palintheus: "lish" could be allows you to perform certain actions without having to log into the LPM. Lish's primary function is to allow you access to your server's console, even if networking is disabled. http://www.linode.com/wiki/index.php/Lish_Documentation
17:57<cu3edweb>I am also assuming that I can easily reinstall my distro if I kacj it up?
17:57<jkwood>Oh, the Enrish!
17:57<cu3edweb>jack it up
17:57<jkwood>Yep. It's dead simple.
17:57<cu3edweb>Great thanks a lot! linode it is!
17:57<Palintheus>\o/
17:57<jkwood>\o/
17:58<jkwood>Note that as an additional pointer, while Linode offers referral benefits, I don't take advantage of them. That's how dedicated I am to the service.
17:59<Palintheus>ooo hardcore
18:00<Palintheus>!no-avail
18:00<Palintheus>ah fail
18:00<jkwood>!no-avail
18:00*linbot slaps jkwood
18:00<jkwood>Have to be registered. )
18:00<jkwood>Hmm... my winky smiley got mangled in the transition. Stupid gprstubes.
18:00<Palintheus>I am, forgot to identify
18:01<Palintheus>!no-avail
18:01*linbot slaps jkwood
18:01<Palintheus>:)
18:01<jkwood>I love you too, linbot
18:04-!-ph^ [~ph^@62.80-203-249.nextgentel.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:08<cu3edweb>is there a server location better then another one?
18:09<Palintheus>really depends on where you/your customers are
18:09<Hobbsee>depends where you (or your users are)
18:09<Palintheus>!download
18:09<linbot>http://www.linode.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2636
18:09<Hobbsee>!download
18:09<linbot>http://www.linode.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2636
18:09<Hobbsee>bha.
18:09<Palintheus>haha
18:09<@mikegrb>!download
18:09<linbot>http://www.linode.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2636
18:10<@mikegrb>! people still use slackware?!?!
18:10<jkwood>!slackware
18:11<jkwood>cu3edweb: The only major disadvantage to any DC is that Atlanta blocks certain ports (IRC being one of them.)
18:12<jkwood>Fremont has a waiting list a mile long, as well.
18:12-!-adi [~4cab0530@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
18:12<cu3edweb>only got to choose from atlanta and newark
18:13<cu3edweb>I choose newark
18:13<jkwood>mikegrb: What are YOU doing awake ?!?!
18:13<@mikegrb>ur mom
18:13<Pryon>walked right into that one
18:13<Hobbsee>!avail-he
18:13<linbot>Hobbsee: Fremont360 - 0, Fremont540 - 0, Fremont720 - 0, Fremont1080 - 0, Fremont1440 - 0, Fremont2880 - 0
18:13<jkwood>Pryon: One of the disadvantages of being talll.
18:13<Hobbsee>hm, so it does.
18:13<jkwood>mikegrb: Touche.
18:15<adi>hi guys
18:15<adi>I just came to add a domain to my linode..
18:15<adi>and, i can not get the host work
18:16<adi>i added an entry inside the apache sites-available
18:16<adi>and when i did sudo a2ensite mydomain.com, i got:
18:16<adi>sudo: unable to resolve host (none)
18:16<adi>and i cant add that domain!
18:17<adi>any one knows how to add a virtual host
18:17-!-Tallo [~meer@rigel.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
18:17<HedgeMage>adi: it sounds like you didn't create a link in sites-enabled (then restart apache2) -- however it also sounds like you didn't do your job with regard to DNS so that you can find the right server from the domain name
18:18<Pryon>a2ensite is supposed to create the link in sites-enabled.
18:18<adi>i added the domain as a slave zone, is that fine?
18:18<HedgeMage>ahh, I am not familiar with a2ensite
18:19<Pryon>adi: any chance you could paste the config file for the new virtual host?
18:19*HedgeMage is old fashioned, prefers to do things by hand
18:19<HedgeMage>adi: that depends on whether whatever it is a slave of is giving out the correct info
18:19<adi><VirtualHost *:80> ServerName 411usadeals.com ServerAlias www.411usadeals.com DocumentRoot /home/public_html/411usadeals.com/public/ LogLevel warn ErrorLog /home/public_html/411usadeals.com/log/error.log CustomLog /home/public_html/411usadeals.com/log/access.log combined </VirtualHost>
18:19<mwalling>adi: a slave zone requires a master.
18:19<mwalling>!pastebin
18:19<mwalling>bah, someone tech linbot pastebin
18:20<HedgeMage>linbot: pastebin is http://rafb.net/paste
18:20<adi>yes, i have a master zone... fir the ip address
18:20<guinea-pig>HedgeMage: ! what bout pb.linode.com
18:20<adi>http://rafb.net/p/dKOhdZ42.html
18:20<mwalling>adi: not a master zone. a master server.
18:21<HedgeMage>guinea-pig: ahh, I didn't even know that existed
18:21<jkwood>HedgeMage: It should be p.linode.com
18:21<HedgeMage>p or pb, guys?
18:21*HedgeMage thinks people should make up their minds
18:21<jkwood>At least, it used to be.
18:21<mwalling>or pastebin
18:21-!-getsmart [~getsmart@88-149-230-65.dynamic.ngi.it] has joined #linode
18:21<Peng_>I usually see p.linode.com used.
18:21<guinea-pig>HedgeMage: both
18:22<jkwood>Heh... both.
18:22<getsmart>hi guys
18:22<adi>See, i went to DNS Manager and i created a slave zone for the new domain. I specify my main site as a master
18:22<HedgeMage>linbot: learn pastebin as http://pastebin.linode.com/ <== for all your pasting needs
18:22<linbot>HedgeMage: The operation succeeded.
18:22<HedgeMage>linbot: pastebin
18:22<linbot>http://p.linode.com <-- paste here, not in the channel
18:22<jkwood>!pastebin
18:22<linbot>http://p.linode.com <-- paste here, not in the channel
18:22<@mikegrb>lolz
18:22<HedgeMage>lol
18:22<fo0bar>lolz
18:22<jkwood>Woot!
18:24-!-iQwerty [~jan@cust-02-D43B.adsl.scarlet.nl] has quit [Quit: iQwerty]
18:25<adi>so, what should I do guys?
18:25<adi>if u add a new site, do u add master or slave zone?
18:26<Peng_>adi: If you want Linode to be the main DNS servers for the zone, make it a master.
18:26<Peng_>adi: If you have other DNS servers you want Linode's servers to copy off of, make it a slave.
18:27<adi>Then it is a master
18:27<Peng_>:)
18:27<adi>I just did that, and then i am trying to use a2ensite, and i am still getting same error
18:28<HedgeMage>adi: it takes time for DNS to propogate
18:28<guinea-pig>i don't think dns is an issue...
18:28<guinea-pig>at least from my end, that host resolves fine
18:28<HedgeMage>adi: also, be aware that your domain registrar must be pointed to the nameservers
18:28<HedgeMage>guinea-pig: ahh, interesting
18:28<guinea-pig>the namesrverrs for 411usadeals.com is linode.com
18:29<HedgeMage>guinea-pig: maybe it just hasn't propogated to adi then, or adi's dns settings are borked
18:29<adi>yes, but i see different site !
18:29<guinea-pig>maybe
18:29<guinea-pig>adi: is it a different site that you're hosting? or someone else's?
18:30<HedgeMage>I'll leave you two to it... I have a migration of my own to finish :)
18:30<guinea-pig>is this correct?
18:30<guinea-pig>;; ANSWER SECTION:
18:30<guinea-pig>411usadeals.com. 85867 IN A 72.14.178.36
18:30<adi>thats a site that I own
18:31<daniel>Why does a float(5,5) only hold values of up to 0.99999 ? in mysql...
18:31<guinea-pig>adi: i thought that was the site in quesiton
18:31<guinea-pig>i was asking if that's the right IP
18:31<adi>yes, thats API I own
18:31<adi>when i restart apache i get: http://rafb.net/p/umCfYc79.html
18:32<guinea-pig>oh heh
18:32<jkwood>daniel: I would THINK that one of those fives means 10^-5.
18:33<jkwood>The other probably means 5^5.
18:33<adi>it worked now
18:33<jkwood>Or, 99999.99999.
18:33<Pryon>possibly (width, precision)?
18:33<adi>thanks GUYS
18:33<daniel>jkwood, right, I would think so too :)
18:33<daniel>but the value only goes up to 0.99999 :S
18:33<daniel>Sghould I be using decimal/double instead?
18:34<Pryon>What happens when you make it, say, (7,5)?
18:34<jkwood>Which is a shade less than 10^-5.
18:34<Pryon>Anyway, what is the range of values you want to store?
18:34<guinea-pig>what happens if you try specifying the IP in teh <VirtualHost> tag instead of a wildcard *?
18:34<daniel>Pryon, 7,5 worked..?
18:35<jkwood>Unless my brain is messing with me again.
18:35<daniel>Pryon, I want uhmm...a maximum of 6 digits on the left and 4 digits on the right :)
18:35<Pryon>If you're display 5 digits to the right of the decimal and you specify a field width of 5, that's probably why
18:35<daniel>10,000.0000 would be an example
18:35<daniel>ahh ok
18:35<Pryon>Then you probably want 10,4
18:35<daniel>so I should do...10,4
18:35<daniel>yeah
18:35<daniel>:) thanks
18:35<Pryon>np
18:37<daniel>#mysql over at freenode is telling me to use decimal instead of float
18:37<daniel>meh
18:38<cu3edweb>do you always have the same ip address for you linode?
18:38-!-adi [~4cab0530@webuser.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:39<PetraArkanian>um in slackware 12.1 is hosts.deny always checked for ssh connections?
18:39<PetraArkanian>cause i added an ip and i want that person to not be able to connect at all
18:40<Pryon>cu3edweb: yes
18:40<Pryon>cu3edweb: unless you migrate to a new datacenter
18:41<Pryon>PetraArkanian: hosts.deny is checked for all programs that use tcpwrappers. ssh is one of them. It might not stop the person from hitting your web server. Throw their address in the firewall to be sure
18:41-!-getsmart [~getsmart@88-149-230-65.dynamic.ngi.it] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
18:42<PetraArkanian>ty pryon
18:46<Pryon>man tcpd for more info (assuming debian isn't weird, which is not always the best assumption)
18:46<Pryon>wierd?
18:48<jkwood>PetraArkanian: I would think so.
18:48<jkwood>I don't really feel like testing, though. ;)
18:48<Pryon>ldd `which ssh` | grep libwrap to know for sure
18:49<Pryon>er which sshd
18:49<Pryon>Unless you're starting sshd from *inetd in which case see if it runs it using tcpd
18:54<schmichael>Pyromancer: debian doesn't do anything weird with sshd (no wrapper or anything)
18:55<Pryon>It's compiled with libwrap, so it will honor hosts.deny
18:55<schmichael>yeah, i've been using sshd & denyhosts on debian for a while
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19:08-!-xitology [~xi@78.31.182.24] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
19:27<DephNet[Paul]>either Newark is slow or BT has throttled me
19:28<PetraArkanian>newark isnt slow
19:28<PetraArkanian>im dling stuff and uploading just fine
19:28<DephNet[Paul]>im getting about 6KB/s when uploading stuff to Newark
19:34<KingTarquin>DephNet[Paul], Probably BT throttling you.
19:34<KingTarquin>My IRCd is in newark, and its fine.
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19:44-!-ae5ir [rob@cqtopia.com] has joined #linode
19:47-!-PetraArkanian [~PetraArka@h69-131-37-123.clevwi.dsl.dynamic.tds.net] has joined #linode
19:47<PetraArkanian>hey did something justh appen on newark48 i had to reboot my linode and it took like 5 minutes just to power down
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20:00<Ttech>Any idea why I get this when I try to run the Perl API (example) code? "
20:00<Ttech>No JSON found at ./list_records.pl line 15
20:00<Ttech>"
20:07-!-spuhg [~tyru@174.147.138.3] has joined #linode
20:08<spuhg>hi, what is the best way to do an exact image backup?
20:10<spuhg>for a linode?
20:11<Pryon>Assuming you've got the space, you can clone any of your images
20:11<bd_>remember if you're doing an image backup, you'll want to shut it down first
20:13<spuhg>really i was looking for a way to guarantee that should my system get scrambled, i could immediately return to a daily? backup
20:13<spuhg>without having to shutdown?
20:14<spuhg>so if i have the space i can do this, without shutting down?
20:15<bd_>not as an 'image' backup, as your system would modify the image as it's being backed up
20:16<bd_>you could use any of the many, many backup programs out there to backup to an offsite backup host, that's always the safest bet
20:16<bd_>or you could mount another disk image and cp -a across
20:16<Ttech>Any idea why I get this when I try to run the Perl API (example) code? "No JSON found at ./list_records.pl line 15"
20:17<spuhg>mount another disk image aon my linode?
20:17<spuhg>or a another linode?
20:17<spuhg>which?
20:18-!-Sindacious [~Xenu@c-68-59-120-56.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #linode
20:19<bd_>well, either one. another linode would, of course, give you the most disaster resilience :)
20:19<bd_>otoh it would possibly cost more
20:19<spuhg>true, but on the same linode is still cool though, right?, is it as good as off site?
20:20<spuhg>i mean does linode keep linode backups, or something if they get rocked?
20:20<HoopyCat>it's as good as an off-site backup that resides on the same physical hardware in the same location
20:21<HoopyCat>linode doesn't back up your data; there's protection against a single HD failure thanks to mirroring, but that's about it
20:22<HoopyCat><--- rsyncs his stuff to home daily
20:22<bd_><--- rsyncs his stuff to amazon daily
20:22<spuhg>can linode themselves somehow get rocked, and do they keep a backup copy of each linode if it were to happen?
20:22<spuhg>cool
20:23<bd_>spuhg: They don't keep backups of your linode. If both sides of the RAID array fail at once, linodes on that host may be lost.
20:23<bd_>I think it's only happened once in linode's five(?)-year history though.
20:23<spuhg>right, then off site is better then.
20:24-!-_PetraArkanian [1000@member.lethaltechnology.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:24<HoopyCat>depends on how important your data is. :-)
20:24-!-J-Node [~J-Node@cpe-70-112-224-193.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
20:24-!-DephNet[Paul] [~paul@host86-168-197-97.range86-168.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:24<spuhg>so if you had to restore the data, say from amazon rsync b/u, how long would it take?
20:24<bd_>if you have important data, then whatever the host may be, it's always best to do offsite backups to an independent host
20:25<bd_>well, 'amazon rsync' is, in my case, amazon's "elastic block store" thing
20:25<bd_>and, I guess an hour or two
20:25<bd_>depends on how fast I can ramp up a rsync+ssh connection
20:25<spuhg>not bad, is it the cheapest, and most reliable?
20:25-!-DephNet[Paul] [~paul@host86-168-197-97.range86-168.btcentralplus.com] has joined #linode
20:25<bd_>well, there are lots of choices
20:25<bd_>this is just what I set up :P
20:26<spuhg>should be cool then
20:26<bd_>the downside of using EBS is it's not designed as a backup system at all, so I had to write a mildly complex script to spin up an EC2 host to access it
20:26<HoopyCat>i back up to home, so i'd be limited by my upstream bandwidth. my plan would be to redo all the software stuff from repositories, configure stuff using my backed-up configs, then restore the data, which'd probably take me a good afternoon or so
20:26<HoopyCat>anyway, bedtime. bbl!
20:29<spuhg>well there must be a simple way to mirror somewhere
20:31<bd_>here's the script I'm using: http://fushizen.net/~bd/ec2-backup-scrubbed.rb.txt
20:31<bd_>you'll need to have some familiarity with amazon's EC2 and EBS services to set it up
20:32<bd_>there are simpler ways of course
20:32<bd_>duplicity + s3 is popular
20:32<bd_>rsync.net's an option
20:33<bd_>you could also simply get another linode (or a VPS at another provider) and rsync to it
20:33<bd_>heck, you could rsync to a dreamhost account ;)
20:33<spuhg>so rsync does an exact mirror ?
20:33<bd_>if you are using any databases, make sure to exclude them from your backup, and backup a proper dump instead
20:34<bd_>spuhg: it mirrors file content and permissions, etc, yes
20:34<bd_>inode numbers will change
20:34<bd_>but nearly all apps won't care about that
20:34-!-chmac [~chmac@203-58-24-146.tpgi.com.au] has joined #linode
20:34<spuhg>why the special treatment to the database?
20:35<bd_>spuhg: because if you backup a database, and it changes while you're backing up, you'll get a half-updated database in the backup - ie, corrupted
20:35<spuhg>right, is there software that can handle it reliably?
20:36<bd_>so you have to either halt all write operations on the database while the backup is running, or extract a consistent snapshot of the data in the database some other way and back that up instead
20:36<bd_>well, mysqldump works :)
20:36<bd_>just exclude the actual mysql directory from the backup, run a mysqldump and back that up instead
20:36<bd_>if your application doesn't use transactions, or uses myisam, there's a chance it'll catch it in the middle of a non-atomic application-level update, but those are easier to recover from, and would happen if the system crashes anyway
20:36<spuhg>why exclude the directory?
20:37<bd_>spuhg: well, you'll need to restore from the dump anyway, so might as well avoid backing up the data twice
20:37<spuhg>right
20:38-!-PetraArkanian [~PetraArka@h69-131-37-123.clevwi.dsl.dynamic.tds.net] has joined #linode
20:38<spuhg>so, excluding the mysql, a system snapshot can be done with an rsync
20:38<spuhg>?
20:38<spuhg>to another vps?
20:38<bd_>pretty much, databases tend to be the only thing sensitive to such atomicity issues
20:39<bd_>you'll just need to set up keyed or host-based ssh authentication so it can log in automatically
20:39<spuhg>there must be some open source software that would handle this
20:39<bd_>it's called rsync ;)
20:39<spuhg>cool
20:40<spuhg>how did you right that script, did amazon provide any info?
20:40<spuhg>api or such?
20:40-!-tjfontaine [~tjfontain@tjfontaine.chair.oftc.net] has joined #linode
20:41<bd_>Well, they provide the API, there's a ruby library for it, and then I wrote that script *shrug*
20:41<spuhg>well, it seems pretty complicated
20:41<spuhg>what does it do exactly?
20:42<bd_>basically, it boots a temporary VPS in amazon's EC2 thing, attaches it to a disk in their cloud, rsyncs the data over, then destroys the temporary VPS
20:42<bd_>and finally takes a snapshot of the disk for extra safety
20:42<spuhg>cool
20:43<spuhg>what do they run their vpses off?
20:43<bd_>xen, I guess
20:43<bd_>note that running a VPS in their cloud continually is a lot more expensive than linode - but they bill by the hour
20:44<spuhg>well why is xen better then parallels if at all?
20:44<bd_>so running one just long enough to transfer the backup is quite cheap
20:44<bd_>I've never used parallels
20:44<bd_>so I don't know
20:44<spuhg>cool
20:44<spuhg>so they promote this type of use then?
20:44<bd_>not really, I just took the tools provided and built something out of them :)
20:45<bd_>mostly because I was bored at the time <.<
20:45<spuhg>right, well thats cool
20:45<jkwood>Amazon doesn't really promote much of anything when it comes to s3e or ec2.
20:45<bd_>yeah
20:45<spuhg>what is their selling point?
20:45<jkwood>They give you a computing platform, and what you do with it as a developer is up to you.
20:46<jkwood>Which pretty much answers tyour question.
20:46<spuhg>same as linode or slicehost?
20:46<bd_>spuhg: well, amazon's selling point is that you can ramp up very very quickly with their systems"
20:46<bd_>ie, you could go from 1 VPS, get slashdotted, enter a command and five minutes later have 20
20:46<spuhg>why is linode different, better?
20:46<bd_>(assuming you're set up right for that kind of thing)
20:46<jkwood>Similar, although they don't put a limit on your computing from the beginning.
20:47<StevenK>Linode and Amazon aren't really doing the same thing
20:47<jkwood>Linode is more traditional.
20:47<jkwood>While you can use it for a large scale web application platform, it's not really set up for that.
20:47<bd_>Linode's services are geared for the traditional model of, here's a server, set it up and run it 24/7 forever
20:48<jkwood>Amazon's pricing point is that you only pay for what you use.
20:48<bd_>Amazon's more like, make a disk image, and start up and shut down servers whenever. Oh, a host died? Well, you backed up all your data, right? Just fire up a new one and be running right away.
20:48<bd_>Which works great as long as you back up all of your data all the time, continually.
20:48<spuhg>cool
20:49<jkwood>I'm helping to build an app right now using s3e, and I'm fond of it for what we're doing.
20:49<jkwood>But, for my personaly stuff, I'
20:49<jkwood>ll be keeping my linode.
20:49<spuhg>well linode has there own datacenters right?, they are off amazon?
20:49<spuhg>aren't
20:50<bd_>linode has nothing to do with amazon
20:50<spuhg>right
20:50<bd_>amazon probably owns their own datacenters... linode's not that big yet :)
20:50<spuhg>true
20:51<jkwood>"yet"?
20:51<spuhg>do you deploy a choice of os at amazon?
20:51<bd_>spuhg: they've got linux, opensolaris, and windows, I think.
20:51*jkwood waits for the day when Linode opens a dc and he applies for a job as a server monkey
20:51<@mikegrb>lolz
20:51<Ttech>jkwood, lol
20:51<fo0bar>lolz
20:51<Ttech>jkwood,
20:51<Ttech>err
20:51<Ttech>Sorry
20:51<Ttech>up arrow.
20:51<bd_>now we know who to blame!
20:51*Ttech wonders away
20:52-!-BrettM [~9665494e@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
20:53<BrettM>Anyone around who can point me to documentation on what must be a very common question? How do I attach a domain name to an Apache site running in my VPS?
20:53<spuhg>what is EC2?
20:54<spuhg>a language?
20:54<Ttech>EC?
20:54<spuhg>amazon: ec2
20:54<Ttech>There is a language called EC..
20:54<Ttech>But EC2 is not it
20:55<Ttech>Anyone know why the perl Linode API example just says NO JSON?
20:55<Ttech>Put in a valid key and such, still not working
20:55<jkwood>bd_: I can unplug a server to plug in a vacuum. That's pretty easy.
20:55<jkwood>spuhg: The Electronics Computing Cloud. (ECC, or EC2.)
20:55<spuhg>to fire up and attach a vps to a disk at amazon, then drop the vps, after the disk is rsynced you need EC2, must be the amazon api?
20:56<jkwood>s/Electronics/Electronic/
20:56<bd_>jkwood: Elastic*
20:56<exor|zzz>Ttech: 'sudo perl -MCPAN -e 'install JSON"' ?
20:56-!-_PetraArkanian [1000@member.lethaltechnology.net] has joined #linode
20:56<jkwood>Oh, fine then.
20:56<jkwood>The Elastic Computing cCloud.
20:56<Ttech>exor|zzz, Orly? Ok.
20:56<bd_>"Electronic Computing Cloud" sounds so 70s >.>
20:56<jkwood>Bascially, it's a distributed network of servers that act as one big server.
20:56-!-exor|zzz is now known as exor674
20:57<bd_>except that they don't
20:57<bd_><.<
20:57<exor674>I thiiiink thats the proper syntax.. I'm trying to kill shit in SSC so... <_<
20:57<jkwood>Oh, FFS.
20:57<bd_>it's more like, a VPS host with a LOT of spare capacity
20:57<bd_>to the point where (if you get your quota raised) you can dial up 1000 servers at a moment's notice
20:57<jkwood>The basic idea is, you pay them to use their computing capacity.
20:57<bd_>also billed by the hour, so if you need them for only a short time, no problem
20:58<Ttech>exor674, JSON is up to date (2.12).
20:58<exor674>meh, no idea then
20:58<spuhg>cool
20:58<Ttech>"No JSON found at ./dyndns.pl line 28
20:58<Ttech>"
20:58<bd_>but yeah, read the docs before explaining what EC2 is ;)
20:58<Ttech>Why can I never seen the stupid \n's.
20:59<jkwood>bd_: Sorry. =/.
20:59<spuhg>does google have something similar?
20:59*Ttech guesses nobody has a clue. :/
20:59<Ttech>Oh well
20:59<bd_>spuhg: They have a hosting service, but I wouldn't call it similar
20:59<bd_>see http://code.google.com/appengine/
20:59<spuhg>right, amazon is the cuttng edge then?
20:59<bd_>well, er, I have no idea how to answer that
21:00<bd_>they're all cutting edge :P
21:00<bd_>but they're all different edges
21:00<spuhg>true,true
21:00<bd_>basically app engine solves the same problem in a very different way
21:00<spuhg>hows that?
21:00<bd_>well, with app engine you don't get a server of your own
21:00<bd_>and you have to design your app around certain limitations and restrictions
21:00<bd_>but as long as you do so, you're basically infinitely scalable
21:00<spuhg>like?
21:01<bd_>well, there are restrictions on what kind of DB queries you can make, for example
21:01<bd_>read the docs for the details ;)
21:01<bd_>amazon on the other hand
21:01<bd_>they give you all the pieces you need for high scalability
21:01<spuhg>no liits?
21:01<bd_>but it's up to you to put them together
21:01<spuhg>m
21:01<bd_>which is really really hard
21:01<bd_>but a lot more flexible than google's app engine
21:02<spuhg>high scalability for what, for example?
21:02<bd_>and linode is more about small-to-medium scale stuff that doesn't want to deal with all the complexities of scalability just yet
21:02-!-arooni-mobile [~arooni-mo@c-67-168-26-198.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:02<bd_>spuhg: http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:YsxjeHxL3sQJ:blogs.smugmug.com/don/2008/06/03/skynet-lives-aka-ec2-smugmug/+smugmug+ec2&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=us <-- here's an example of how one company's using EC2
21:03<spuhg>maybe facebook type things need that scale?
21:03<spuhg>cool
21:03<jkwood>By george, I think he's got it.
21:03<bd_>you will note that they're essentially booting tens of thousands of VPSes, and then ramping down to mere thousands, over the course of a few hours
21:03<bd_>that is what EC2 gives you in a nutshell
21:03<bd_>but you need to deal with all of the details yourself
21:04<spuhg>cool
21:04<bd_>app engine puts your app under various restrictions, then takes care of scaling up to huge levels of load (note: currently there's no way to raise the quotas until the billing system is in place, so def. not for production yet)
21:04<bd_>and linode avoids all the complexity, but OTOH there are practical limits to how big you can get on a host like linode
21:05<spuhg>right
21:07<bd_>anyway this 'cloud computing' stuff is all very new still, so people haven't quite figured out the best way to use it :)
21:07<spuhg>right, image processing, and the like
21:07-!-_grepper [~chatzilla@201.82.200.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:07<bd_>well image processing is how smugmug's using it anyway
21:07<bd_>they'll be deploying a load balancer thing sometime soon(?), so it'll be useful for high-load websites too before long
21:08<spuhg>well, maybe seti would/does
21:08<jkwood>It'd be ideal for any application dealing with large amounts of data processing, as well.
21:08<jkwood>Somebody would have to be willing to pay for it.
21:09<spuhg>distributed computing via vps
21:09<bd_>spuhg: If someone's willing to pay for the $80/mo/instance, sure, seti would love it :)
21:09-!-TheFirst [gaveup@your.friendly.neighborhood.hellmouth.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:09<spuhg>what are the capacities of one instance?
21:09<bd_>spuhg: http://aws.amazon.com/ec2
21:10<spuhg>right
21:10<jkwood>Of coourse, if you were planning to run it for a sizeable amount of time, that $80 a month would look like a new piece of dedicated hardware pretty quick.
21:10<spuhg>right
21:10<spuhg>but their prices might drop fast
21:11<bd_>they've been the same since it was released... :)
21:11<bd_>the thing about EC2 is
21:11<bd_>it'll always be more expensive than just running a single dedicated server with the same specs
21:11<bd_>because amazon has to keep around lots of spare capacity
21:11<bd_>in order to accomidate those 'okay, let's ramp up another 10,000 servers in the next ten minutes' requests
21:12<spuhg>right, well it seems that it should be cheaper, because they can use a few really powerful processors for the cloud, instead of many
21:13<jkwood>Yes and no.
21:13<spuhg>thats why vps is great saves the environment
21:13<spuhg>well, maybe
21:14-!-_PetraArkanian [1000@member.lethaltechnology.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:14<bd_>spuhg: usually it's cheaper to use huge numbers of cheap machines than a smaller number of more powerful ones
21:14<bd_>also means failures are more localized
21:14<spuhg>hmmm
21:14<spuhg>right
21:14<spuhg>hence google
21:15<spuhg>low cost servers for their engine
21:15<jkwood>For what Amazon is doing, I would see the many cheaps being more likely than the few powerful.
21:15<jkwood>Linode goes the other direction.
21:15<bd_>well, linode's more many midrange
21:15<spuhg>many cheaps is cool because you can recycle
21:16<jkwood>Well, comparitively.
21:16<jkwood>I wouldn't exactly call 8 cores midrange, m'self.
21:17-!-RSA [~4fb67f49@webuser.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:17<bd_>they're not hulking behemoths like some of those mainframes out there :)
21:17-!-TheFirst [gaveup@your.friendly.neighborhood.hellmouth.info] has joined #linode
21:17<jkwood>Fair enough.
21:17<spuhg>what does amazon use then?
21:17<spuhg>quad cores?
21:18<spuhg>or frames?
21:18<bd_>probably a heterogenuous mix
21:18<bd_>model name : Dual-Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 2218 HE
21:18<bd_>is on one random host I landed on
21:18-!-_grepper [~chatzilla@201.82.200.132] has joined #linode
21:18<bd_>who knows how many
21:19<spuhg>well the vps thing is cool, i think xen is the leader?
21:19<spuhg>you access the cloud right now jumping through it?
21:20<mwalling>parachute
21:21<mwalling>jumping is stupid
21:21<mwalling>you go splat at the bottom
21:21<jkwood>mwalling: I tried, but the parachute wouldn't deploy in the three feet I had to fall.
21:21<spuhg>haha
21:21<mwalling>jkwood: fog != cloud
21:22<jkwood>Hmm... that would explain a LOT.
21:25-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:25<spuhg>so does rsync have any options to do a mysql dump, and then back u up?
21:25<spuhg>with the dump?/
21:25<bd_>rsync doesn't know about mysql
21:26<bd_>all it knows about is "okay, I need to get these files from point A to point B"
21:26*exor674 hits her head against the nearest wall
21:26<spuhg>any othr free software that does?
21:26<mwalling>spuhg: mysqldump + bash + rsync?
21:26<bd_>it's trivial enough that everyone just writes their own three-line shell script *shrug*
21:26<spuhg>well i'll have to check it out
21:27<spuhg>but it sounds easy enough
21:27<spuhg>write it in python, perl?
21:27<mwalling>bash?
21:27<bd_>easier to write it as a shell script
21:27<mwalling>why overcomplicate
21:28<spuhg>ok ill learn some bash then
21:29<spuhg>well what would that code be?
21:29<mwalling>http://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/
21:29<spuhg>thanks
21:29<spuhg>cool
21:30<spuhg>so with that yo ucan basically b/u securely and reliably?
21:30-!-pygmalion [~pygmalion@pyg8.com] has joined #linode
21:30<spuhg>no problem?
21:30<spuhg>s?
21:31<jkwood>Should be.
21:31<spuhg>so with rsync the system with the exception of mysql will retain exact state?
21:31<mwalling>...
21:32<spuhg>ok, cool
21:32<mwalling>i think you're taking the wrong approach ot the problem...
21:32<spuhg>why so?
21:33-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:33<bd_>spuhg: in general, any files that change while the backup is running may end up mangled in various ways
21:33<mwalling>either that or i'm being too literal again...
21:34<spuhg>really, i gues it is simple, dump the database, and copy your directories, right?
21:34<bd_>on most systems, as long as you don't run eg a package upgrade at the same time as the backup, about all you'll have changing the same time is your database and log files
21:34<bd_>and the log files being mangled if your system dies horribly isn't too bad of a price to pay
21:34<bd_>spuhg: basically, yes :)
21:34<bd_>rsync does the 'copy' part
21:34<spuhg>cool
21:35<mwalling>you wont be able to restore a running state from a backup though...
21:35-!-kev009 [~kev009@155.225.123.210] has joined #linode
21:35<kev009>any employees here?
21:35<mwalling>unless you put the machine into suspend or something...
21:35<kev009>I have 2 ns records on the DNS manager
21:36<kev009>for a subdomain
21:36<kev009>but it doesn't appear to be working
21:36<spuhg>actally, how would you boot back up?
21:38<spuhg>fire up another linode rsync the directories back, then pump in the mysql?
21:38<bd_>basically yes
21:38<spuhg>cool
21:38-!-r3z`` [~r3z@c-68-57-224-100.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:38-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:38<spuhg>any specifics?
21:39-!-r3z`` [~r3z@c-68-57-224-100.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:40<spuhg>well ill check out
21:40<mwalling>break it and find out
21:40<spuhg>negative
21:40<mwalling>wus
21:40<spuhg>sounds straightforward, but ill check it out
21:42<spuhg>gotta break some to learn some
21:42<spuhg>kidding
21:43<spuhg>well what is you favorite language?
21:44<spuhg>and what did you do with it?
21:46-!-_PetraArkanian [0@member.lethaltechnology.net] has joined #linode
21:46<spuhg>wondering, what do most people do with thier linode?
21:46<jkwood>I know several languages, and use each for what it's best suited to.
21:46<mwalling>i use jkwood
21:46<mwalling>its much easier then coding
21:46-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:47<jkwood>Much prettier, too.
21:47<spuhg>right, what have you created, or coded?
21:47-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:47<mwalling>jkwoodbot
21:47-!-Guest1235 [~bmontgom@cpe-70-115-194-140.satx.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
21:47<spuhg>haha
21:48-!-Xero9364 [djweezy@powerprecision.com] has joined #linode
21:48<mwalling>what, you thought jkwood was a person?
21:48-!-Xero9364 is now known as fuego
21:48<jkwood>Boing!
21:48<mwalling>hes the result of hours of tireless coding... lots of bawls too
21:48<jkwood>linbot: Stop looking at me like that!
21:48-!-fuego [djweezy@powerprecision.com] has quit []
21:48*linbot slaps jkwood
21:49<linbot>Pervert
21:49<chuck>What a smart bot!
21:49<mwalling>chuck: why thank you
21:50<mwalling>he also inherited my asshole personality too
21:50<jkwood>Yeah, you're right, it DOES smart when he does that.
21:50*chuck slaps linbot's butt
21:50<linbot>Ohhlala
21:50<chuck>*Oohlala
21:51<linbot>Don't correct my spelling.
21:51<jkwood>linbot: Aaron Spelling? Or Tori?
21:52-!-BrettM [~9665494e@webuser.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:52<linbot>I told you to stop acting like a pervert!
21:52<linbot>Don't make me get jadoba...
21:52*jkwood bribes jadoba not to kick him out
21:53<mwalling>jkwood: last time i bribed jadoba my linode was, ahem, "rebooted"
21:53<mwalling>:)
21:53<jkwood>:o
21:55-!-scsc [~4bad4e56@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
21:55-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:55<@jadoba>jkwood: your downgrade to a Linode32 has been configured. please (re)login to the members area, shutdown and click the "Migrate Now" button to being your migration. Your data and IP addresses will become unavailable.
21:56<mwalling>jadoba: i missed you sexy
21:56<@jadoba>no you havent
21:56<jkwood>It's days like this that make me segfault. =(
21:56-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:56<mwalling>jadoba: just a little bit
21:56-!-scsc [~4bad4e56@webuser.linode.com] has left #linode []
21:57<@jadoba>mwalling: i haven't been dancing around in your dreams all this time?
21:57<mwalling>no, but you've been in my thoughts all day
21:58<jkwood>I had a thought once. It was strange.
21:58<@jadoba>o.O
21:58<jkwood>Whatever that means.
21:58<@jadoba>jkwood: somehow I'm not convinced
21:58<@jadoba><3 jkwood
21:58<mwalling>jkwood: sorry... that was actually your ai accessing an uninitialized variable
21:58<jkwood><3 jadoba
21:59<mwalling>i should have the debian developers go through your code
21:59<jkwood>mwalling: Results for "uninitialized variable":
21:59<jkwood>LOGIC
21:59<jkwood>End of results.
21:59-!-_PetraArkanian [0@member.lethaltechnology.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:00<jkwood>Debain: Now with cutting-edge 15-bit encryption!
22:00<mwalling>burnnnnn
22:00<mwalling>jkwood: want a botsnack?
22:01*jkwood sits up and begs
22:01*mwalling gives
22:01*jkwood NOMS
22:03<jkwood>Mmm... chocolate...
22:04-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:04-!-TheFirst [gaveup@your.friendly.neighborhood.hellmouth.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:05*jkwood attempts to compile spuhg
22:05<mwalling>bad bot
22:05-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:05<mwalling>no agression towards humans... thats in your code damnit
22:06<jkwood>Running 3laws test suite...
22:06<jkwood>Tests completed successfully.
22:07<bd_>1 test(s) passed
22:07<bd_>30545 expected failure(s)
22:07<bd_>15043 test(s) skipped
22:07<bd_>0 unexpected failure(s)
22:07<mwalling>i missed you too bd_ :)
22:08-!-Humpaah [~7b79ce2c@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
22:08<bd_><.<
22:08<jkwood>Dictionary update requested. Connecting...
22:09<jkwood>Dictionary file updated. 1200 Additions, 15 Deletions, 1400 Changes.
22:10-!-Humpaah [~7b79ce2c@webuser.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:12-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:16-!-TheFirst [gaveup@your.friendly.neighborhood.hellmouth.info] has joined #linode
22:16-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:16<Fooj900>/names
22:16<Fooj900>/names
22:16<mwalling>fail
22:16<Fooj900>/names
22:17<mwalling>epic fail
22:17<Fooj900>/names
22:17<Fooj900>/names
22:17-!-mode/#linode [+q *!*@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] by FloodServ
22:17<mwalling>jkwoodbot: attack!
22:17<mwalling>or FloodServ... you work too
22:17-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:17-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:17-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:18-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:18-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:18<jkwood>Fooj900: HI-YAH!
22:18<jkwood>Darn, missed.
22:18*jkwood stuffs his face with cake in shame
22:18*mwalling decreases the lag on jkwood's message loop
22:19-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:20<ajmitch_>quick, now!
22:20<jkwood>Detected paramater change in recieve module: Reloading...
22:20<jkwood>I actually got kicked out of here once, before I was offered an invite. :)
22:20-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:20<jkwood>Off-by-one error detected.
22:20<jkwood>Reloading...
22:21-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:21-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:21<jkwood>Errors cleared.
22:21-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:21-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:22*jkwood preps for the kill
22:22-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
22:22-!-Fooj900 [~marcjohns@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:22<jkwood>Fooj900: *POKE*
22:23<ajmitch_>need to be faster
22:23<mwalling>fail
22:23<jkwood>He moved!
22:23<chuck>aww he's not joining now
22:23<mwalling>heh
22:24*chuck has "Fooj900: *poke*" all written out and everything
22:25<mwalling>chuck: aside from having a nick in common with the coolest show ever, you realize he's +q, and prolly too dumb to realize it?
22:25<mwalling>:)
22:25<chuck>22:15:50 < IPv4Freely> im still waiting for my friend to give me a rim job
22:25<chuck>22:15:51 < IPv4Freely> er
22:25<chuck>22:15:53 < IPv4Freely> a job at rim
22:25<chuck>22:16:03 < tabularasa> ...
22:25<chuck>hehe
22:29-!-_PetraArkanian [0@member.lethaltechnology.net] has joined #linode
22:29<Dreamr_3>caker: are you on freenode?
22:30<jkwood>Splitnode?
22:30<Hobbsee>looks like it.. [14:30] [Whois] caker is n=caker@ns.theshore.net (Christopher S. Aker)
22:30<jkwood>mmm, caker.
22:38<kev009>is there anything I need to do to make DNS Manager changes work?
22:39<Peng_>kev009: Wait <= 15 minutes?
22:39<kev009>Peng_: ok
22:39<jkwood>kev009: It takes time for changes to propagate.
22:39<jkwood>kev009: You can always try a hard refresh of your browser (f5).
22:40<kev009>jkwood: I'm using dig across multiple locations/dns servers, so it must be a refresh issue
22:41<jkwood>Well, I'm out of ideas then. (gasp!)
22:44-!-Kaisa_ [~PetraArka@h69-131-37-123.clevwi.dsl.dynamic.tds.net] has joined #linode
22:46-!-Kaisa_ [~PetraArka@h69-131-37-123.clevwi.dsl.dynamic.tds.net] has quit []
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23:11-!-darkbeholder [~darkbehol@203-214-145-2.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:14-!-nmorelli [~413c864d@webuser.linode.com] has joined #linode
23:14-!-nmorelli [~413c864d@webuser.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:14-!-nmorelli [~nmorelli@d60-65-77-134.col.wideopenwest.com] has joined #linode
23:15<nmorelli>hello all
23:16<@tasaro>hello
23:17-!-mode/#linode [-q *!*@c-71-204-9-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] by FloodServ
23:17<nmorelli>tasaro, would you be able to answer a question about some cpu stuff i noticed today?
23:20<@tasaro>i can try... may be best to open a ticket
23:21-!-DennisTT [~den@24.83.215.234] has joined #linode
23:21<nmorelli>oh, it's just something silly else i would have
23:21<nmorelli>it seems like when using HTOP i'm seeing everyone's use of the CPU
23:21<DennisTT>hi all
23:22<nmorelli>and i was wondering if that was possible at all
23:23<nmorelli>hello dennistt
23:24<DennisTT>hey hey
23:26<@tasaro>nmorelli: i didn't think that was possible
23:29<nmorelli>hmm ok, i'll keep and eye on it some more and open a ticket if it keeps being odd
23:29<nmorelli>thanks tasaro
23:32-!-nmorelli [~nmorelli@d60-65-77-134.col.wideopenwest.com] has quit [Quit: nmorelli]
23:34<bd_>steal% shows time 'stolen' from running processes by other domUs... but I don't think that's what he was seeing oO
23:35<bd_>(htop doesn't show steal%)
23:37-!-J-Node [~J-Node@cpe-70-112-224-193.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:51<BP{k}>hmm htop only shows me those processes of those on my linode ...
23:56-!-vcgomes is now known as vcgomes[away]
23:59-!-VS_ChanLog [~stats@ns.theshore.net] has left #linode [Rotating Logs]
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---Logclosed Mon Nov 03 00:00:48 2008