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#linode IRC Logs for 2010-07-23

---Logopened Fri Jul 23 00:00:01 2010
---Daychanged Fri Jul 23 2010
00:00<jazzybee>caker: You are right. I assumed this was sort of Linode-approved for optimized performance and what not. Assumptions are the mothers of all fuck ups
00:00<supine>the worst of it being 'make install' has no "this file has been changed" detection
00:00<@caker>jazzybee: I/we stand by the ones we made -- other than that, I don't think you can expect much :)
00:01<jazzybee>caker: Makes sense.
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00:03*caker : ALARM(7:00AM)
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00:11<dan>ever since i've upgraded from ubuntu 8 to 10.. i'm getting oom crashes almost daily.. i've done all the suggestions on the memory issues library page.. and i even have mysql and apache restarting every 2 hours in cron... doesn't seem to be helping... anyone have any other advice?
00:11*encode : ALARM(02:11PM)
00:11<dan>also, the linode totally crashes and doesn't reboot itself...
00:11<tanto>do you know what is crashing it?
00:12<dan>no idea
00:12<tanto>what does it run? like apache, mysql, etc.
00:13<dan>yeah, that's pretty much it
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00:13<tanto>what size linode?
00:14-!-agentbob [] has joined #linode
00:14<dan>or it was...
00:14<dan>think its 1gb now
00:15<tanto>hmm that should work fine
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00:15<dan>it's 64bit.. is the only issue i can think of.. but it was 64bit before i upgraded from ubuntu 8->10
00:15<tanto>i have 2x 768 that do apache+mysql+php+rails+etc with tons of vhosts and never had that problem.. i would guess something in the upgrade process may be borked?
00:16<tanto>ahh i'm running 32bit which was recommended at the time
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00:17<tanto>did you have that problem before you upgraded?
00:18<tanto>if you did not i have 2 suggestions:
00:19<tanto>1. spin up a brand new linode w/ ubuntu 10 and migrate everything over to it
00:20<tanto>2. set up a monitoring tool on your node which can track disk/io/swap/mem/cpu/processes/etc metrics, so try and figure out what is going on at the time of the crash
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00:21<dan>i had oom maybe twice a year before the upgrade..and it would reboot. now it's almost daily and when it crashes.. it doesn't reboot
00:21<dan>any tools you recommend?
00:22<dan>it seems to happen very fast whatever it is... cpu load spikes from 0 to 100% instantly
00:22<dan>and stays there for hours if i don't catch it
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00:22<dan>with the console just saying 'rebooting in 10s'
00:22<squircle>i guess
00:23<tanto>is it at the same time each day?
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00:25<dan>good question.. not sure.. i don't believe so
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00:25<tanto>you can roll your own with a cron script that runs each minute and just appends to a file
00:25<tanto>or a directory
00:26<dan>checked logs, not same time each day
00:26<tanto>like run each minute: top, ps, etc, and dump those to like /tmp/{date}/{date-time-second}
00:27<dan>had crontab running every min to email me whenever load goes above 60%.. but it's never gone off :| that's why i'm thinking it spikes really fast
00:27<tanto>load might not be going above 60
00:31<supine>cron up a task that dose 'ps auxf >> ps.txt' every minute
00:40<Defenestrator>dan: atop might be helpful as well
00:43<Defenestrator>You can set the collection frequency really high, rotate it often, and only have it log "interesting" processes
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00:45<Kane`>Write a script to parse /proc/cpuinfo and /proc/meminfo to check for spikes and run it every 1 minute or so
00:45<Kane`>Then email you if it spikes
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00:47-!-mode/#linode [-q *!*] by FloodServ
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00:48-!-mode/#linode [-q *!*] by FloodServ
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01:24<dan>thanks defen.. i set up atop and i guess i'll sit and wait til next crash :|
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01:41<amitz>people who abuse anonymous mechanism, should be punishable with something worse than death.
01:42-!-pikapi [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:45<amitz>a night with urmom should suffice.
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02:07<Marius>hmm, ok so FTP is being gay (before yo usay eww ftp etc; shush!), it's not letting me upload or make dirs etc =/ no errors i nsyslog either o_O
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02:11<Thmo>the evil randomness of ftp at play ;)
02:14<Defenestrator>permissions? what ftp daemon?
02:14<Defenestrator>Some of them need to be explicitly set to allow writes
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02:17<Kane`>FTP? eww...
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02:18<mdcollins_>Yeah, my thought exactly.
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02:19<encode>Marius: if you're after some assistance, it might be worthwhile mentioning which FTP software you're using
02:20<Marius>It would, but I decided I hate ftp and ignored it :P
02:20<encode>oh good. You made the right decision
02:21<Marius>oh I knew it already and I use sftp personally
02:21<encode>while you're making good decisions, consider disabling password authentication for ssh, and using key-based authentication instead
02:21<Marius>but some people are morons and don't know what sftp is nor do they ahve a capable client =(
02:21<Kane`>Marius: if you're using it for yourself, why not just SCP?
02:21<Kane`>Saves you from having to run another deamon
02:21<mdcollins_>Or for a client: winscp
02:22<Marius>ho about no to winscp as it's always been a bitch to me =P
02:22<Marius>I have filezilla, handles it all :D
02:22<Kane`>WinSCIP screws up line breaks for me
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02:22<Kane`>causes huge amounts of rage
02:22<Defenestrator>Yeah, I got rid of FTP on a site I manage a while back. Some of the users weren't delighted, but it's just too insecure
02:23<Defenestrator>Kane`: any particular file type? It might be trying to do FTP-style ASCII vs Binary, in which case you should be able to change the behavior
02:23<Kane`>Defenestrator: text files (PHP/HTML/CSS/JS)
02:23<Kane`>I've tried changing from ASCII to Binary
02:23-!-mdcollins_ is now known as mdcollins
02:23<Kane`>Just fails to work
02:24<Kane`>When you want to quickly change some text in a file, then open it up to see the line breaks ruined
02:24<Kane`>things around me get broken
02:25<encode>sure it's not a DOS style linebreak problem?
02:25<Kane`>I figured it may be the editor that's screwing it up
02:25<Kane`>But I save and open the files in the same editor
02:25*Kane` shrugs
02:26<Kane`>encode: hmm?
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02:26<encode>windows and linux have different ideas of what a line break is
02:26<Marius>that's why you need \r\n for them to show up properly in windows
02:26<Marius>and jsut \n on *nix
02:26<Marius>useless windows!
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02:27<Kane`>encode: that shouldn't matter if the files aren't being opened on linux though, right?
02:27<mdcollins>Any suggestions for a about me or personal resume type site?
02:27<Kane`>the EOLs shouldn't change unless they get opened/saved in an editor
02:27<Marius>well, the network traffic monitors must be broken
02:27<Marius>6 mb/sec incoming traffic it states...I'm only doing 600kb/sec
02:28<encode>with a binary style transfer, none of the data should be changed
02:29<encode>which leads me to suspect something else
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02:31<Marius>I'm feeling bored, and don't want to do real work
02:31<Marius>so I'll work on my bandwidth monitors for work :3
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02:32<Kane`>Marius: you monitoring the bandwidth of each virtual host?
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02:33<Marius>I like the 3GB/day ones, they are fun to process :3
02:33<Kane`>you using a home made script?
02:33<Marius>couldn't find anything that did what I wanted without being bloated and full of crap I didn't care for etc
02:34<Marius>and well, the stuff I could've used didn't give me an "administrative" overview, I'd have to go throug heach virtual host one by one, isntead of just pulling it all in one
02:34<Kane`>exact same reason I started writing my own
02:35<Kane`>was hoping you were using a nice apt-get'able program you could recommend
02:35<Kane`>to save me some time
02:35<Marius>Nope, sorry to disapoint you there, hehe
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03:33<JoeK>how can i search for a text in all files in a given directory?
03:33<Marius>heh, stupid NAS server without sftp support =(
03:34<dcraig>grep -lir "text" *
03:34<dcraig>that outputs a list of files that contain the text
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03:36<JoeK>ty :>
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04:16<coobra>Rush <3
04:17<coobra>Rush the band :D
04:22<coobra>i like it :D
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04:37<Marius>amitz: didn't knwo that was part of your portfolio?
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04:40<dcraig>what, there aren't a lot of rush limbaugh fans here?
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05:39<mib_zax12t>Hi. Are the images for Ubuntu 10.04 LTS provided by Linode the same as what you would get if you downloaded it from the Ubuntu website? Or does Linode install some additional packages too?\
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05:42<Marius>They should be pretty much the same
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05:42<Marius>except linode auto configures the DHCP for you and sets up ssh
05:43<mib_zax12t>My previous host installed a ton of packages like apache, mysql, perl, php.. Linode doesn't do that, just uses a few packages to make things work?
05:44<spkitty>certainly none of those anyway
05:44<amitz>Marius: part of the list of projects I did ;-)
05:44<Marius>I also applaud you for knowing what I was on about xD
05:44<Kane`>mib_zax12t, they probably set you up with WebHost Manager
05:44<Kane`>Linode gives you a bare OS that you build up yourself
05:44<Marius>mib_zax12t: linode -can- do that if you use a StackScript for it during setup
05:44<Kane`>Which is siiick
05:45<mib_zax12t>What i need. :P
05:45<mib_zax12t>thanks guys
05:45<amitz>Marius: thanks ;-) I actually had 2 versions. The java version landed me an interview. :-D
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05:47<amitz>but it's useless now -_-
05:48<Marius>usefull for a few months more, isn't it?
05:49<amitz>well, they say it will be useless by the end of this week. I'm going crazy now, squeezing it for what it worths :-p
05:51<Marius>Why are they closing down?
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05:55<amitz>some/a request. Yeah, they're probably one of the sites who complies the most to any request thrown at them.
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06:10<Gurpartap>blah spam.
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06:31<guruj116>g'd morning guys. Gotta a linode hosting question. Can get 3-5 server from linode and hide it behind a VPN access ? I wanted to create a private LAN with the hosted servers from linode.
06:32<Marius>of course
06:32<Marius>if they are in the same DC you get free data transfer on a local network
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06:34<guruj116>Yeah. They could be in the same DC. I want to make sure only access it thru VPN.
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06:34<Marius>I don't see why not
06:35<Marius>just set up a firewall to prevent unwanted access to it etc
06:36<guruj116>Does linode provide that service @Marius or do we have to do it ourself ? we have never setup firewalls/vpn etc.
06:37<avar>guruj116: Linode doesn't do your admining for you, no.
06:37<guruj116>k got it. Thanks. I gotta go do my home work now.
06:37<linbot>New news from forums: Problem with Hosting multiple rails applications on Ubuntu in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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07:16<HoopyCat>06:09 [@TrackThis (DM)] ASS motor Update: Out For Delivery: Rochester, NY, US (ETA Today)
07:16<HoopyCat>never too old to appreciate a good de-ampersanding
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07:20<Marius>was it suppsoed to be AS&S or soethign?
07:22<HoopyCat>Marius: nod
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07:28<chesty>stan, the man without an ampersand
07:31<HoopyCat>LINODE MUSIC FEST 2010
07:31<HoopyCat>STAN and THE MAN
07:31<Marius>WITH A PLAN
07:31-!-dpipi [~c0a89262@] has joined #linode
07:31<amitz>WHO CAN'T BAN
07:31<HoopyCat>and special guest MIKEGRB'S BOWEL
07:32*Daevien zaps amitz and stuffs him back iin the cage
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07:32*amitz fights back
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07:33*TimothyA plays the vuvuzela
07:33*Daevien zaps TimothyA. repeatedly
07:34<amitz>I should change the way I carry myself. People often mistaken me as grunts -_-
07:34*TimothyA plays the vuvuzela, repeatedly
07:34<chesty>amitz: bend over, grab your ankles and lift yourself in the air
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07:35<amitz>chesty: and people will think I'm a big boss if I can?
07:35-!-ufw_ [] has joined #linode
07:35<ufw_>hi :P
07:36<@stan_theman>featuring TimothyA on backup vuvuzella!
07:36<TimothyA>"It's their culture!"
07:36<amitz>ufw_: ignore us. how may we help you ;-)
07:36*TimothyA brings out the top 100 vuvuzela CD
07:36<ufw_>are there any deals at the moment? ;P
07:36<@stan_theman>with classics such as "bzz" and "long bzz"!
07:37<@stan_theman>ufw_: there's a 10% discount for prepayments of a year, and 15% for two years
07:37<Daevien>only the everyday normal deal of linode being the best ;)
07:37<TimothyA>stan_theman: and for 500 years?
07:38<chesty>is ericoc a new employee?
07:38<@stan_theman>TimothyA: you can pass your linode down through your family!
07:38-!-dpipi [~c0a89262@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:38<amitz>stan_theman: just like MLM ownership.
07:38<HoopyCat>prepay for a linode 20G for 5 years and stan_theman will not come to your house with a vuvuzela
07:38<ufw_>the ram increases are for new customers too? or only customers at that time?
07:38<HoopyCat>chesty: being opped, i'd say yes
07:39<HoopyCat>ufw_: the Linode 360 is, across the board, now the Linode 512. old, new, everyone.
07:39<@stan_theman>HoopyCat: the bonus is that I show up with a vuvuzela! :<
07:39<amitz>HoopyCat: so tjfontaine is a new employee? ;-)
07:39<chesty>HoopyCat: stan wasn't opped for years
07:39<HoopyCat>amitz: is he opped? :-)
07:40<amitz>HoopyCat: I will say 'yes' when the time comes ;-)
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07:40<HoopyCat>chesty: chanserv queries the payroll system. next question.
07:42<HoopyCat>!wx kroc
07:42<linbot>HoopyCat: [metar] OBS at KROC: 66.2F/19C, visibility 2 miles, wind 12.66 mph (altimeter: 29.87) [KROC 231137Z 16011KT 2SM R04/6000VP6000FT RA BR FEW009 BKN044 OVC060 19/18 A2987 RMK AO2 SFC VIS 2 1/2 TSE20 P0020]
07:42*HoopyCat inflates the pontoons
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07:43<Nivex>!wx keyw
07:43<linbot>Nivex: [metar] OBS at KEYW: 82.4F/28C, visibility 10 miles, wind 8.06 mph (altimeter: 29.91) [KEYW 231053Z 04007KT 10SM FEW022 28/23 A2991 RMK AO2 SLP129 T02780233]
07:44*Nivex blows a vuvuzela in SpaceHobo's ear
07:44<ufw_>why isnt linode listed as a business at that address on google maps ;P
07:44<ufw_>i wanted to see the building =o
07:44<HoopyCat>SpaceHobo: now the timing's critical here... you gotta pull on the door handle right when you hear the buzz or it won't unlatch, like the door locks on your friend's car
07:45<Nivex>ufw_: because it's a boring cube farm just like every other boring cube farm
07:45<ufw_>its just an office right? ;p
07:45<HoopyCat>ufw_: corporate headquarters is in a fairly boring suburban-style office building
07:46<HoopyCat>SpaceHobo: how'd you go on three-hour road trips for concerts without a car?
07:46<ufw_>cant see it at that address on google maps ;p
07:48<HoopyCat>SpaceHobo: ah, so you stay at home and never do anything awesome
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07:49<hobot>no he has a godamn jetpack
07:50<chesty>SpaceHobo wears a strapon is a false dichotomy?
07:50<HoopyCat>hobot: Goda, Minnesota?
07:50<HoopyCat>hobot: great little lakeside village
07:51<hobot>yep minnesota
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07:51<hobot>I dont know if I have been to goda
07:52<HoopyCat>SpaceHobo: we're scaling past suburbs here; i'm deep into rural territory
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07:53<hobot>I literally cant find goda minnesota on google or google maps
07:53<hobot>thats how small it is
07:53<hobot>so very rural
07:53<hobot>thats a pretty broad definition
07:54<hobot>SpaceHobo seems like a man who could kill and skin something to eat
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07:54<hobot>ubran sprawl gonna get ya
07:55<HoopyCat>SpaceHobo: i ain't, but the 50 miles between where my folks live and the nearest train station has a significant population of those who do
07:55<avar>Sprawl can be done better than in America, look at most of Germany for instance.
07:55<mib_6d3wjw>SpaceHobo: mibbit rlz
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07:56<hobot>I wish minneapolis/saint paul would do something like that
07:56<hobot>urban sprawl is just a big waste of resources
07:57<HoopyCat>i have just been informed that the amtrak station is actually on the north end of osceola, therefore the distance is only 49 miles. i apologize for any confusion this may have caused.
07:57<TimothyA>The Core
07:57<TimothyA>the movies that shall not ever be mentioned ever again
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07:58<avar>Do these sprawls in the US traditionally expand as a continuous carpet of houses, or are there pauses in between?
07:58<TimothyA>you mentioned it just now
07:58<linbot>New news from forums: Optimize nginx with many subdomains in Performance and Tuning <>
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07:58<avar>I.e. is it one big suburb or tiny seperated villages?
08:00<HoopyCat>avar: my personal example of sprawl is des moines, iowa. (fire it up on the google maps satellite view). it's an interesting pattern... the core isn't necessarily getting bigger on its own, but the outlying villages/towns expand and connect to it
08:00<avar>"I come from Des Moines, somebody had to"
08:03<HoopyCat>avar: there was a nice 10 mile gap between des moines and ankeny when i left about 12 years ago... now, the only housing gap is 1000 feet either side of the river
08:04<avar>SpaceHobo: It's the first line in Bill Bryson's first book
08:04<avar>HoopyCat: Yeah, that sort of stuff sucks.
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08:05<avar>I like this growth model somewhat better:
08:05<avar>I.e. expanding old villages, but each village has a forest/gap around them.
08:05<avar>SpaceHobo: Yeah, and all dependant on the automobile.
08:06<ufw_>is it possible to sign up for two linodes at the same time?E
08:08<HoopyCat>ufw_: hmm... not in one transaction, if it's a new account. later on, you can pre-load your linode account with funds to cover two linodes and do that. however, unless you've got an accounting department that needs a firm kick in the TPS, probably easier to just let linode do two transactions
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08:11<HoopyCat>avar: the motivator behind sprawl tends to be "wanting to live out in the country" and/or "wanting better public schools for the loinspawn"
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08:13<HoopyCat>avar: (typically, our urban school systems range from below average to abysmal)
08:13<avar>sure, avoiding the poor inner city while still getting most of the benefits with a 30 min car ride
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08:14<HoopyCat>if you have kids, and you can afford to move out of the city, you move. if you can't, you don't move.
08:14<avar>SpaceHobo: Yeah, that's a big advantage in moving outside the city limits.
08:14<amitz>I don't have kids but I want to move. ...can't breath...
08:15<amitz>at least my lung muscle please.
08:15<HoopyCat>i forget the exact percentage of rochester city school district students receiving subsidized lunches, but it's well above 90% and i can probably safely say "nearly 100%"
08:15<amitz>SpaceHobo: oh? where?
08:15<avar>SpaceHobo: What country is that?
08:16<HoopyCat>amitz: 1) quit smoking, 2) you mean your diaphragm
08:16<amitz>HoopyCat: there are actually 2 methods of breathing, with diaphragm and the breast muscle(?)
08:17<avar>SpaceHobo: Sure, but centerally managed systems have their disadvantages too.
08:18<Daevien>nice, found an addon that makes firefox NOT load every tab when it starts / restarts but only when they are accessed. great for people like me that love to leave dozen of tabs open :p
08:18<avar>The US is mostly (well, historically) not interested in doing things at the federal level.
08:18<avar>It's their equivalent of the EU managing German schools
08:19<HoopyCat>THE BEST GOVERNMENT IS TINY AND HELD AT GUNPOINT <--- notice to people reading this out of context: i'm mocking those who would say this, i don't hate america, i normally fly the flag but it's raining so i brought the flag in, that's how much i love america, kthx
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08:19<HoopyCat>but yes, productivity time. afk
08:20<praetorian>look you know that the ipv4 thing is getting bit when...
08:20<praetorian>alyssa milano decides she needs input on it.
08:21<Marius>this is hot.
08:22<avar>Good to live in world where Jenny McCarthy can educate us about vaccines, and Alyssa Milano about IP exhaustion.
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08:27<TimothyA>"it's closer to 50 thousand trillion trillion addresses per person."
08:28<Marius>SpaceHobo: make them fix it!
08:29<Marius>but it's so slowwww
08:29<amitz>A joke: On a bus, two men with really strong accents start a conversation. The lady next to them eavesdrops. "Emma come first. Den I come. Den two esses acoma together. I come once-a-more. Two esses, they comma together again. I come again and pee twice. Then I come one lasta time."
08:30<amitz>"You dirty-mouthed pigs! In this country we don't talk about our dirty sex lives in public!" the lady exclaims.
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08:30<amitz>SpaceHobo: I hate you ;-)
08:30<Marius>No problem, Erwin, I.m never too busy to talk about Cisco Routers!
08:31<Marius>Anyway, since then I have a become a Microsoft Certified Professional in Windows Notepad
08:31<Marius>LOL, alicia silverstone is a microsoft cvcertified notepad user!
08:32<amitz>I read that before -_-
08:34<Marius>SpaceHobo: is this a serious interview?
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08:52<Marius>oh goodie
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08:53-!-mode/#linode [+R] by pparadis
08:54<chesty>#linode is rated R now?
08:54<TimothyA>what's up with the botnets?
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08:55<chesty>oh, you have to be registered to join?
08:56<@pparadis>for now
08:56<@pparadis>until the foolishness ceases
08:56<chesty>yeah, was just guessing what +R stood for
08:57<@pparadis>i'm no irc pr0, but i've heard similar reports
08:59<chesty>is a parody site?
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09:00<@pparadis>you know, for when your domains are feeling inadequate
09:00<chesty>or cold
09:00<@pparadis>[insert cialis joke here]
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09:18-!-mode/#linode [-R] by pparadis
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09:37<dan>anyone running ubuntu 10? i have 50+ '/usr/sbin/console-kit-daemon --no-daemon' processes listed running in htop... is that normal?
09:37<dan>wondering if that's whats causing my system to die every other day
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09:41<mendel>daemon! no daemon! daemon! no daemon!
09:42<mendel>no whammy, no whammy, no whammy
09:43<aalcorn>dan: that's normal for console kit
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09:43<aalcorn>you don't strictly need it on a linode, probably
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09:45<aalcorn>it should be one process with many threads, could that be it
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09:48<HoopyCat>(the console-kit-daemon threads go away when i tell htop to hide userland threads, btw)
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09:58<orudie>in /etc/postfix/access i have an entry REJECT
09:58<orudie>and it keeps getting thruogh anyway :(
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11:10<tanto>hey friends
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11:12<dan>anyone have any simple port knocking tutorial urls? i'm getting tons of ssh scans/login attempts
11:12<Deezire>Just install denyhosts?
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11:14<tjfontaine>no, change from an Allow/Deny policy to a Deny/Allow policy
11:15<tjfontaine>port knocking is as absurd as changing the port of ssh to prevent ssh brute forces
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11:16<@jed>port knocking must be really fun when you're under attack and need access
11:16<@jed>"damn it, what port is my knockd on? was it two knocks or one?"
11:16<@jed>"new england clam chowder!!! c'mon, let me in!!!"
11:17<dan>is that the red, or the white?
11:17<@jed>I can never remember that...
11:17*dan unlocks the door
11:19*snubby tips hat
11:20<sh0gun>was trying to message someone and I have failed epicly
11:22<dan>hmm.. i remember denyhosts.. used to work 10 years ago.. but the scans use <10 attempts per username now so it doesn't really work well.. and if i set it to 1 failed attempt.. and i have a typo logging into my server then i get booted out :|
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11:23<@pparadis>dan: you can exclude IPs from being denied, right?
11:23<tjfontaine>dan: change to a Deny Allow policy, start by denying everyone and then allow those ips you want to be allowed access
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11:23<snubby>oi @ pparadis
11:23<chesty>heil hilter
11:23<Nivex>then when you're out at a coffee shop and need to log on in a hurry...
11:24<danp>or, more simply: change your ssh port to 2222
11:24<tjfontaine>you use the lish
11:24<snubby>heh the tj is doing tech support here too :>
11:24<tjfontaine>danp: NO FOADIAF
11:24<@pparadis>Nivex: why you tunnel through another connection, of course!
11:24<@pparadis>dan: don't do that
11:24<danp>go on
11:24<danp>why should i not do that?
11:24<tjfontaine>changing the port is not security
11:24<tjfontaine>it's obscurity
11:24<@jed>security through obsc...yeah.
11:24<@pparadis>2222 is an unprivileged port, to begin with. which means if your sshd were to go away for any reason, any user could start one on that port.
11:25<@jed>death blow ^
11:25<tjfontaine>so shall we go back to actually talking abotu sane policy
11:25<@pparadis>add in the fact that botnets can scan for listening daemons across all your ports really quickly.
11:25<tjfontaine>deny everyone access, and allow the ips and ranges that should be allowed access
11:25<@jed>(and do)
11:25<tjfontaine>and ssh gives off a pretty obvious fingerprint
11:25<Nivex>tjfontaine: and for _some_ that may not be sane policy
11:25<dan>deny allow only good if you never travel :|
11:26<linbot>LISH allows you to perform certain actions without having to log into the LPM. Lish's primary function is to allow you access to your server's console, even if networking is disabled.
11:26<@jed>dan: allow all and do key-only auth
11:26<@jed>badabam, done
11:26<ohkus>pparadis: however they don't usually scan high ports....secondly you can always run ssh on a port such as 1022
11:26<Nivex>if your userbase is all savvy enough to do key based, I prefer that route
11:26<@pparadis>ohkus: i have logs that say different
11:26<@jed>ohkus: I get hit on 2222 and 22000 and 22222 all the time
11:26<dan>that's what it's set at now, but i still get thousands of invalid logins in the auth.log daily
11:26<@jed>dan: so? rotate it
11:26<ohkus>jed: that is because 2222 is the directadmin port that was being exploited
11:27<ohkus>define "all the time"
11:27*jed gbtw
11:27<Nivex>has anyone in here ever set up OTP logins?
11:27*pparadis reiterates how ridiculously easy it is to scan _all_ ports, especially when you're a botnet operator and are using tens of thousands of other peoples' machines.
11:27<Nivex>We had that at a past place of employment, but I never figured out how to get it going.
11:28<@caker>my sshd port changes depending on what time it is!
11:28<ohkus>If you are specifically targetting someone yes, howeever changing your ssh ports keeps many of the standard rift raft from finding your ssh port
11:28<@jed>that would be: riff raff
11:28<@pparadis>you're missing the point entirely. individuals are rarely targeted, and botnets offer "free" and virtually unlimited computing resources to bad guys.
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11:29<@jed>ohkus: there's one box I regularly log into with ssh on a high port, and I always forget that it's -p for ssh and -P for scp
11:29<Nivex>the point is: the Internet is a bad place. The more padlocks the better.
11:29<@jed>and I always forget to put it in ~/.ssh/config because I'm too busy
11:29<ohkus>jed: yup..kind of a pain, thank Theo
11:30<@jed>yeah, so why bother, especially with key-only auth?
11:30<@jed>use standard ports, amigo
11:30<@jed>rotate auth.log or use something like fail2ban if the logging bothers you
11:30<@jed>done, on to something better
11:30<ohkus>or use bash shortcuts
11:30<ohkus>but...ever since I moved my port I don't see scans, so I guess you guys are special
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11:31<ohkus>jed: I also use fail2ban :)
11:31<danp>i'll give you port 2222 being unprivileged. but it has solved the scan/logging/etc problem for me
11:31<nisstyre56>I run mine on port 29045
11:31<nisstyre56>no login attempts at all
11:31<nisstyre56>apart from mine
11:32*pparadis shrugs, and offers the scrollback on key-based auth as a better solution, rather than attempting for security through obscurity
11:32<danp>well i also do key-based only
11:32<@pparadis>what's the point of running on an alternate port if you're only allowing key-based auth?
11:32<ohkus>Why do people think security through obscurity is stupid....military and spy agencies have been doing it for years :)
11:33<avenj>I run mine on 1289031.
11:33<@pparadis>ohkus: i have to hand you that one.
11:33<Nivex>ohkus: and then they wonder why Iraqis are watching the video from their spy planes
11:33<danp>pparadis: no/less scans
11:33<Daevien>caker: i thought it changed depending on the cloud formations going over?
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11:35<@jed>clearance delivery, Nivex with urmom?
11:35*jed likes it
11:36-!-eighty4 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
11:38<Nivex>Expect urmom one zero minutes after departure
11:38<squircle>!wx URMOM
11:38<linbot>squircle: [metar] URMOM: not found
11:39<@jed>!wx KMOM
11:39<linbot>jed: [metar] KMOM: not found
11:39<squircle>!wx UMOM
11:39<linbot>squircle: [metar] UMOM: not found
11:39<@pparadis>!wx MOM
11:39<linbot>pparadis: [metar] MOM: not found
11:39<Nivex>!wx KRAP
11:39<linbot>Nivex: [metar] OBS at KRAP: 66.2F/19C, visibility 10 miles, wind 0.00 mph (altimeter: 29.82) [KRAP 231452Z 00000KT 10SM OVC005 19/18 A2982 RMK AO2 CIG 003V008 SLP076 T01890178 50001]
11:39<@pparadis>!wx KLIN
11:39<linbot>pparadis: [metar] KLIN: not found
11:40<@pparadis>!wx KOLA
11:40<linbot>pparadis: [metar] KOLA: not found
11:40<Nivex>@weather kold
11:40*pparadis gives up
11:40<linbot>TheJoe: Yo momma's so unpleasant she makes mwalling look like Miss Congeniality. (822:40/22) [mourm]
11:40<Nivex>!wx KOLD
11:40<linbot>Nivex: [metar] KOLD: not found
11:40<Nivex>aww, it's a valid airport too. just no wx
11:41<@pparadis>!wx KORN
11:41<linbot>pparadis: [metar] KORN: not found
11:41<@pparadis>i had to
11:42<@jed>it cracks me up how the gentoo install guide times everything
11:42<@jed>time /etc/init.d/sshd start
11:42-!-zack_ [] has joined #linode
11:42<TheJoe>dor hor hor
11:42<@jed>ya, rly
11:42<Nivex>!wx pant
11:42<linbot>Nivex: [metar] OBS at PANT: 53.6F/12C, visibility 1 miles, wind 14.96 mph (altimeter: 29.97) [PANT 231534Z 15013G29KT 1 3/4SM RA BR OVC005 12/11 A2997 RMK AO2 PK WND 14031/1513 CIG 003V008 P0012]
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11:43<Karrde>so warnquota a) isn't compiled with LDAP support by my distro b) wants /dev/dm-X paths in quotatab but I need to specify by UUID or mount point c) may not let me search my LDAP server by UID# (my users aren't local!) d) doesn't speak English well. Is there an alternative & better program that will e-mail users (address looked up via UID# via LDAP) when they exceed their quota?
11:43<@pparadis>jed: dude, you weren't kidding... timing tar? wow.
11:43<@pparadis>THIS TARBALL WAS UNPACKED IN 1m14.157s, BITCHES!
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12:09<linbot>New news from forums: LAMP Memory Usage in Performance and Tuning <>
12:12<sm>heh.. who has more commits, rms or linus ?
12:12<sm>RMS! yaaaaaaay!
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12:14<linbot>New news from forums: editing files via sftp - permissions, users and groups... in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
12:14<sm>and that is a mischan. sorry all!
12:14*sm is watching
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12:19<linbot>New news from forums: Request New Features on Linode API in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
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12:26<Daevien>sweet, my canon 780is camera can now take RAW format photos... which it can;t natively lol
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12:47<amitz>interesting... attack through obscurity. You fill target's log so that the genuine effort is hidden.
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12:49<TimothyA>amitz: hm?
12:49<amitz>I heard corporation like to do that. If you subpoena a certain data, they will give you mountains of data hoping either to stall our progress or perhaps makes finding the relevant data impossible.
12:50<TimothyA>why would a corporation LIKE to do that?
12:50<TimothyA>"OH wait, you wanted the data related to the hacking attempt and not everything BUT the hacking attempt?! That's crazy talk!"
12:51-!-riottaba [~quassel@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:52<amitz>more like, you want data on our hack attempt to your company? Here is is the list of all connection to your company's IP. Good luck, see you next year.
12:52<Defenestrator>I think it's more of a standard lawsuit tactic than anything. That plus possibly laziness.
12:52<Defenestrator>"we don't want to comb through our logs for the relevant portion"
12:53<amitz>bonus point if the data is on papers with weird fonts :-p
12:55-!-hpj [] has joined #linode
12:56<amitz>another bonus point if there are footnote/headnote/sidenote randomly. Another bonus point for not giving the papers sorted.
12:58-!-dpipi [] has joined #linode
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12:59<amitz>a significant bonus point for printing the data on red colored paper.
12:59-!-LoseTheGame [] has joined #linode
13:00<@jed>LoseTheGame: .
13:02<amitz>damn I lost..
13:02<JoeK>you yawn, you lose
13:02<@pparadis>amitz is but a mere apprentice in the art of thug aim
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13:06<amitz>the apprentice will become a master, the master will die.
13:06-!-Dreamer3 [] has joined #linode
13:07<JoeK>amits: print all ips to said company on paper with unscanable font
13:07<JoeK>in a size 4 font
13:13-!-mdcollins [] has joined #linode
13:18<amitz>JoeK: the red paper, the random note, and weird font will make scanning almost impossible.
13:19-!-SelfishMan [] has joined #linode
13:20<amitz>anyway, what's a suggested solution to give a completed form for a user to print for their own? PDF is unfortunately not universal. Perhaps image file? any better solution?
13:20<linbot>SelfishMan: timed out
13:20<mendel>amitz: What are the cases where PDF isn't good enough?
13:20<amitz>urmom disappoints.
13:20<mendel>Printing image files is pain
13:21<amitz>mendel: when the windows user has no pdf reader.
13:21<mendel>"Install a PDF reader" is probably the least handholdy way to do it
13:21<mendel>er, the way that requires the least handholding
13:21<mendel>vs. "configure your browser to print this image correctly"
13:22<amitz>hmm good point. damn.
13:22<mendel>PDF might not be universal but it's pretty close.
13:22*pparadis sends amitz raw postscript
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13:24<HoopyCat>i vote PDF... pretty much every situation i've found where i've had to print a form either involves PDF or a bucket of shitty failure
13:24-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
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13:24<amitz>pparadis: heh, interesting.
13:25<@pparadis>oh man
13:25<@pparadis>it's moved!
13:25<HoopyCat>anyway, off to hail-mary the dehumidifier. wish me luck
13:26-!-LoseTheGameAgain [] has joined #linode
13:26<JoeK>invalid use of linode
13:26<JoeK>pparadis: suspend. now.
13:26*SelfishMan doesn't understand
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13:28<mdcollins>pparadis, how's everything going?
13:29<mdcollins>Feeling better?
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13:30<@pparadis>mdcollins: yah
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13:32<snubby>what has been not good? @ pparadis
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13:33<@pparadis>snubby: just a minor bump in the road, nothing big :)
13:33<snubby>aka life eh
13:34<Daevien>pparadis: who did you run over?
13:34<snubby>not somethin organic i hope
13:34<@pparadis>Daevien: urmom
13:34<Daevien>it wa sprob caker, that woudl explain why this "new" caker is different
13:34<snubby>now twas certainly organic
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13:45<A-KO>Hey, i did a dist upgrade on my ubuntu node, and I'm at a point where it's configuring 'grub-pc' and it's asking me for a device for "grub install devices" has /dev/xvda and b...
13:45<A-KO>any idea so I don't blow up my linode?
13:46<@pparadis>!library upgrade ubuntu 10.04
13:47<linbot>pparadis: 1. Host Email with Postfix, Dovecot and MySQL on Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid) ( - 2. Send-only Mail Server with Exim on Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid) ( - 3. How to Upgrade to Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid) (
13:47<@pparadis>#3 if you're actually upgrading to lucid
13:47<@pparadis>if not, nvm
13:47<@pparadis>also, are you running under PV-GRUB?
13:47<@pparadis>as in, not running a host-supplied kernel?
13:49-!-Issues [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:49<A-KO>running host-supplied kernel
13:49<A-KO>and I can't break out of this menu...heh
13:50<@pparadis>grub shouldn't matter if you're running a host-supplied kernel
13:50<mdcollins>You shouldn't need grub if using a linode kernel.
13:50<A-KO>I know :P
13:50<A-KO>but it's asking anyway
13:50<A-KO>when I did a do-release-upgrade
13:50<A-KO>no idea why...
13:50<mdcollins>No skip or anything like that?
13:50<@pparadis>well, you must have had grub installed for some reason
13:50<A-KO>I can choose /dev/xvda or /dev/xvdb and hit "ok"
13:50-!-JoeK [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:50<A-KO>pparadis: no clue why.....definitely didn't install it myself...
13:50<A-KO>so maybe something installed it at some point
13:51<@pparadis>well, xvdb is your swap disk, right?
13:51<A-KO>should be
13:51<@pparadis>so i wouldn't advise telling to use that
13:51<A-KO>oh well, we'll see what happens..
13:52<amitz>any suggested pdf writer for python? I just need the capability of font size, and drawing rectangles.
13:53<amitz>pypdf only provides write(stream),where I probably have to figure out the stream myself -_-
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13:55<linbot>New news from linodelibrary: Deploy Java Servlet Applications with Apache Tomcat on Fedora 13 <> || Deploy Java Servlet Applications with Apache Tomcat on Fedora 12 <>
13:57<amitz>just got a better keyword. reporting tool. never mind.
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14:03<Karrde>what provides -lldap?
14:03<Karrde>I can't build quotatools on my SLES 11.1 PPC system because thaheres 's lag?
14:04<Karrde>I can't build quotatools on my SLES 11.1 PPC system because it can't find ldap_init. it compiles on my suse 10.0 ppc but then the binary doesn't run on 11.1
14:04<@jed>Karrde: libldap2-dev or equiv?
14:04<@jed>that's what it is on debuntu, not sure about suse
14:05<Karrde>I have openldap2-devel installed
14:05<Karrde>how about a better alternative to warnquota?
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14:34<@caker>14:34 Ignoring ALL from Twayne
14:35<Daevien>caker: CLOUD!
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14:39<squircle>what's with all this spam lately (or why haven't I noticed it before)?
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14:47<@jed>is there a version of the traditional framebuffer fixed font for OS X that doesn't suck?
14:47<@jed>the only copies I can find suck
14:48*jed eyes FontForge
14:48<avar>fwiw I find that using X11->xterm sucks less than the
14:49<squircle>jed: not sure if this is what you're looking for, but whenever I need a monospace font on OS X, i use
14:49<@jed>squircle: using inconsolata presently
14:49<squircle>well then
14:49<@jed>avar: clever
14:50<avar>jed: Actually, just install Debian on that machine. It'll solve all the other problems you're having with OSX
14:50<@jed>but textmate
14:50<avar>chi ching!
14:51*pparadis waits for avar to say "vim" ;)
14:51<avar>Just use Emacs, here, you can have my 1100 .emacs config file
14:51<@jed>you and tychoish would get along
14:52<@tychoish>% wc -l .emacs
14:52<@tychoish>235 .emacs
14:52<@jed>he was like "office-provided iMac? feh. here's my ibm thinkpad that I bought on the cheap from colonel washington running emacsOS"
14:52<@pparadis>emacs actually contains a built-in macro that ends world hunger. unfortunately, it requires 147 keypresses in the proper sequence, and nobody has been able to pull it off yet.
14:54<Runar>Anyone here with Samba experience?
14:55-!-elfgoh [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
14:55<linbot>If you have a question, please just ask it. Don't look for topic experts. Don't ask to ask. Don't PM! Don't ask if people are awake, or in the mood to help. Just ask the question straight out.
14:56<squircle>don't apologize, just ask! :P
14:56<Runar>Being a Norwegian, I have to think for a while, trying to find the best words to describe my problem ;)
14:56<avar>tychoish: mmm :
14:57<Runar>I'm running Samba on my Ubuntu (10.04) box, but the box doesn't show up in Network on my Win 7 machine
14:57<Runar>I'm able to connect if I go to \\IP in Win 7, but that's it
14:57-!-kronos003 [] has joined #linode
14:57<grawity>Runar: Is nmbd running?
14:58<grawity>smbd handles the SMB protocol, nmbd - NetBIOS registration.
14:58<Runar>Haha, seriously
14:58-!-josemoreira [] has quit [Quit: Construct additional pylons]
14:58<Runar>I've been googling my ass of for the past hour
14:58<@jed>Runar: yeah, over there <--- is populated by NetBIOS
14:58<squircle>netbios needs to die in a fire
14:59<@jed>bonjour, baby
14:59<Runar>It never crossed my mind :(
14:59<@jed>avar: mother of god
14:59<dKingston>50/50 chance this is real
14:59<Runar>In other words, it works perfectly! Thanks, grawity
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15:01<linbot>New news from forums: unresponsive terminal - cannot access linode in Linux Networking <>
15:01<dKingston>i KNEW i would get that response
15:01<dKingston>you must admit, it's pretty convincing
15:02<squircle>not... really no
15:02<dKingston>to the normal user it would
15:03<dKingston>well, we're not normal
15:03<avar>jed: hah
15:03<squircle>why do all the domain registrars only let you put in 4 nameservers? i want but I have to exclude one :(
15:03<avar>jed: B.t.w. how's that kernel thing going, I'm watching the Xen threads but there's no movement. Was someone looking at making a better patch?
15:04<squircle>and complains
15:04<@jed>no idea
15:04<@jed>jeremy had a fat pile on his plate that he just dumped on the kernel list, so maybe it's in the queue
15:05<avar>ah, maybe
15:05<dKingston>i must be a little insane for asking this at my age
15:05<dKingston>does linode need any freelancing work?
15:05<@jed>less carriage return and more content!
15:06<@jed>those are in-office positions, I'm afraid
15:06<dKingston>well i'm already screwed
15:06<dKingston>"Absecon, NJ"
15:06<dKingston>i happen to live in PA
15:06<dKingston>dun dun duun.
15:07<squircle>does anybody know an article or something that explains SIP in an easy-to-comprehend way? (eg. why I can't just download a sip client and call
15:07<avar>you can, if that's a valid SIP address
15:08<mendel>That's as easy to comprehend as it gets
15:08<squircle>you don't need a SIP provider?
15:08<squircle>or is that if you want a real phone number?
15:08<mendel>SIP providers go between the phone system and SIP
15:08<@jed>SIP to SIP you can do with nada
15:08*dr_jkl gets interested in SIP now
15:09-!-saikat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:09*squircle contemplates calling linode just to try this out
15:09*jed watches for Q-sip
15:10<dKingston>jed: hm
15:10<dKingston>from where i live
15:10<dKingston>that'll take at best 3 hours
15:10*jed pries off dKingston's return key
15:10<@pparadis>for when you need to integrate your phone system with print functionality -->
15:10<dKingston>i have a bad habit of doing \n a lot.
15:11<squircle>we need to give linbot the !enter factoid
15:11<mendel>Heh, my ATA at home is named "sippycup"
15:12<linbot>New news from forums: IPv6 in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
15:12<squircle>is it just me or are the times in the DNS manager UTC+1 not UTC...
15:13<squircle>it says 8:00 PM but it's 7:00 PM UTC, right?
15:13<@caker>they're warped by daylight savings.
15:13<@caker>or something.
15:13<squircle>that would make sense
15:13<squircle>EDT is UTC-4, EST is UTC-5
15:15<squircle>are DNS updates performed every 15 minutes on the hour, or is it offset?
15:21-!-Bohemian [] has joined #linode
15:22<mdcollins>At least that's what I've seen.
15:22-!-cmayo_ [~Bohemian@] has joined #linode
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15:22<squircle>oh, apparently you can add up to 20 nameservers for .me domains
15:22-!-cmayo_ [~Bohemian@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:22<grawity>More than 7 is just insane.
15:22<squircle>make that 13
15:23<squircle>but still, i like having
15:23<squircle>not just 1-4
15:23*squircle pries his own return key off to appease jed
15:24-!-Netsplit <-> quits: jeek, jbw, spkitty, Deezire, peter-, Jippi_mac, Guspaz, jake, Rob, azaghal, (+1 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them)
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15:24-!-Netsplit over, joins: Jippi_mac, Guspaz, spkitty, jake, peter-, jeek, Deezire, Rob, tuntis, azaghal (+1 more)
15:24<squircle>i've just witnessed a netsplit; my life is complete
15:25<dKingston>i read '' as
15:26<squircle>why don't individual oftc servers have DNS records?
15:27<squircle>what if I want to be loyal to linode and only ever connect to
15:29<azaghal>dKingston: Does that mean you think plugging the cable into rectum host would help with the netsplit? ;)
15:30<HoopyCat>squircle: because connecting directly to a specific server is a bad idea for availability :-)
15:30-!-pi_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:31<squircle>makes sense
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15:35<squircle>is there a mode you can set on yourself so do you don't get channel join/party messages?
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15:35<dKingston>look through client documentation
15:35-!-SIAPA [~Jake_C00L@] has joined #linode
15:35-!-moel [~co-keren@] has joined #linode
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15:35<squircle>that's colloquy's downfall; too simple
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15:35<squircle>but it's all CSS so it shouldn't be too hard
15:35-!-Sadewa [] has joined #linode
15:35-!-AL7Up [~MTLParty@] has joined #linode
15:35<@jed>famous last words
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15:36-!-user-- [~^Anita20^] has joined #linode
15:36<dKingston>jed: +i
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15:36-!-co_jelekx [] has joined #linode
15:36<@jed>dKingston: what?
15:36-!-boy_Jkt [] has joined #linode
15:36-!-Cool_Cute_Dude [~BlackInNe@] has joined #linode
15:36<dKingston>i dunno whether it would be right to actually do this
15:36-!-kyky [] has joined #linode
15:36-!-na_ra [~^Anita20^@] has joined #linode
15:36-!-DOOLCE [~CoChnCrTt@] has joined #linode
15:36<dKingston>you could set +i on the channel
15:36-!-sSiSy_giRL [] has joined #linode
15:36<dKingston>invite only
15:36-!-mode/#linode [+R] by jed
15:36<dKingston>or that
15:36<@jed>slow botnet is slow
15:36-!-sSiSy_giRL was kicked from #linode by jed [hi]
15:36-!-DOOLCE [~CoChnCrTt@] has quit [autokilled: This host may be infected. Mail with questions (2010-07-23 19:36:41)]
15:36<squircle>jed: it *was* simple; .event { display: none; }
15:36<@pparadis>man, twice in one day?
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15:37<squircle>can't chanserv regulate the max # of users in a channel and bump it up/down as necessary?
15:37<@jed>that's why they're joining slowly
15:37<dKingston>it could
15:37<tjfontaine>I disabled that again, you can reset it if you like
15:37<tjfontaine>they're not saying atm though
15:37<@jed>I have +M armed
15:38<@jed>just letting your scripts do the needful
15:38<squircle>is there a better IRC client for OS X than Colloquy?
15:38<@jed>screen and irssi on a linode
15:38<dKingston>what jed said
15:38<squircle>available in macports i'm assuming?
15:39<@jed>on a linode
15:39<@caker>ssh urlinode; screen; irssi <-- done
15:39<squircle>why on a linode?
15:39<dKingston>you can stay connected
15:39<@jed>so you can detach and never go offline?
15:39<dKingston>i do it
15:39<squircle>what's the point of that?
15:39<@caker>and when you're at work, you can screen -rd
15:39*Solver runs irssi under screen also
15:39<@caker>and when you come home you can screen -rd !
15:39<Solver>I've changed countries without disconnecting from irc
15:39<dKingston>seeing what messages you got in your awaylog
15:40<HoopyCat>you can do random casual drivebys and say "sup" when people aren't expecting
15:40<@jed>and lurk
15:40*Solver uses screen -D -R ! :)
15:40<dKingston>i use screen -raAd
15:40<@pparadis>pparadis 10601 0.0 0.2 3164 1456 ? Ss May25 1:23 SCREEN -d -m -S IRC irssi
15:40-!-Co_mapan_kesepian_Dikantor [] has quit [autokilled: Mail with questions (2010-07-23 19:40:25)]
15:40<squircle>i use byobu... 'cause i'm a noob
15:40<Solver>sup linbot!
15:40<jeromy>i'm lazy... i alias it to "scr" to restore my screen/irssi
15:40<linbot>Solver: Yo momma's so adjective, she verbed an adjective noun! (787:2/8) [umrmo]
15:40<Solver>jeromy: I'm so lazy I haven't added an alias yet1 :)
15:41-!-mawolf [~mw@] has joined #linode
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15:41-!-DereckTheMan [~Guest6595@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41-!-pervers- [~cow_lg_pe@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41-!-Sadewa [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41-!-reigga [~boy_28_jk@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41-!-SIAPA [~Jake_C00L@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:41-!-Cool_Cute_Dude [~BlackInNe@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41*jed waves
15:41<@pparadis>"Cool_Cute_Dude" ?
15:41-!-co_cr_ce_ok_bgt [~C0-k0nToL@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41<@jed>tjfontaine: who was lurking here before when the last one went down?
15:41<@jed>I'm scanning /names and I don't see him
15:42<tjfontaine>in #tor
15:42-!-nisstyre56 [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:42<@jed>same guy behind all these, you think?
15:42<squircle>aren't there better uses for botnets?
15:42<@pparadis>from this morning:
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- co_dws-jkt-cr []
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- ircname : co_tng_cr_ce
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- channels : #linode #awesome #tor #gcc
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- server : [Freemont, CA, USA]
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- : :actually using host
15:43<@pparadis>09:24 -!- idle : 0 days 0 hours 5 mins 17 secs [signon: Fri Jul 23 09:19:32 2010]
15:43<tjfontaine>I've brought the large hammer out for now
15:43<@jed>clear R or leave it for a bit?
15:43<tjfontaine>depends on if you want to see the join/kill messages
15:43-!-mode/#linode [-R] by jed
15:43*jed tests frequency
15:44<tjfontaine>it's low right now
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15:45<dKingston>thats really familiar
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15:47<Bohemian>on windows, in a list where you can select more than one item, what key do you use? alt?
15:47<Daevien>alt f4
15:48<@jed>shift for a range, control for individuals
15:48<squircle>shift selects all items inbetween, control selects multiple tems
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15:48<Bohemian>thank you
15:56-!-zack_ [] has quit [Quit: zack_]
15:57<ohkus>Daevien: be helpful...not hurtful :-/
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16:04<ohkus>jed: can we get a community tab from the members area?
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16:07<linbot>New news from linodelibrary: Deploy Java Servlet Applications with Apache Tomcat on Ubuntu 10.04 (Lucid) <> || Deploy Java Servlet Applications with Apache Tomcat on Ubuntu 9.10 (Karmic) <>
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16:16-!-scorche` is now known as scorche
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16:32<squircle|irssi>irssi is confusing
16:32<Deezire>you'll get used to it
16:32<squircle|irssi>i'm sure
16:32-!-squircle is now known as squircle|mac
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16:32-!-squircle|irssi is now known as squircle
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16:33-!-squircle|mac is now known as squircle
16:34<Deezire>squircle: You also got macirssi with a more familiar UI
16:35-!-pi__ is now known as pi_
16:37<squircle>is it better to have the www subdomain as a cname of the root domain, or should it have its own A record?
16:41-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:45<dr_jkl>squircle: iirc it's a matter of preference.
16:45<squircle>then again, it's probably one less lookup for clients
16:45<squircle>(if you give it its own A record)
16:45<dr_jkl>this is also true
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16:56<HoopyCat>squircle: if they're in the same domain, usually the A record will be returned along with the CNAME, but yeah... if you can do so, avoid CNAMEs and life will be less weird
16:57<linbot>HoopyCat: That URL appears to have no HTML title within the first 4096 bytes.
16:59*Solver endorses avoiding CNAMEs
16:59<Solver>I avoid them whenever possible and live happy life :)
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17:28<@jed>oh gentooligans
17:28<@jed>if I delete /var/run/random-seed will it be recreated
17:29<HoopyCat>only if it is mounted on urmom
17:30<@caker>5.13 /var/run : Run-time variable data - This directory contains system information data describing the system since it was booted. Files under this directory must be cleared (removed or truncated as appropriate) at the beginning of the boot process.
17:30-!-Bohemian [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:30<@jed>caker: I know the standard in this case :>
17:30<@jed>but we all know things diverge, just making sure /etc/init.d/urandom won't fail if it's gone
17:30*jed reads it
17:30-!-dansnetwork [] has joined #linode
17:30<HoopyCat>there's exactly one way to find out
17:30-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:31<HoopyCat>mv /var/run/random-seed to /tmp, reboot, and if it borks, restore the copy from /tmp ;-)
17:31<@jed>if [ -f "$SAVEDFILE" ]
17:31*jed crush
17:31-!-zack_ [] has quit [Quit: zack_]
17:33*caker lights up
17:33<@caker> <-- yum
17:36<HoopyCat> <--- yum
17:38-!-eighty4 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:39<@caker> <-- mmmmm
17:40*caker consumes some dihydrogen monoxide
17:40<squircle>NOO CAKER!
17:40<squircle>that stuff's deadly
17:41<KingTarquin>Its a lie.
17:41<Yaakov>caker: That DHMO is daaaanerrrrous.
17:41<squircle>"Quantities of dihydrogen monoxide have been found in almost every stream, lake, and reservoir in America today"
17:41<squircle>scary stuff :P
17:42<KingTarquin>I know, DHMO can cause asphyxiation if inhaled too much.
17:42<@jed>can cause severe burns, too
17:43<KingTarquin>It can indeed.
17:43*KingTarquin speaks from experience.
17:43<KingTarquin>Also, in extreme circumstances, can cause loss of limbs through frost bite.
17:44<@jed>In 2007 Jacqui Dean, New Zealand National Party MP, fell for the hoax, writing a letter to Associate Minister of Health Jim Anderton asking "Does the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs have a view on the banning of this drug?"
17:44<squircle>it destroys cities and homes
17:44<squircle>not to self: don't move to NZ
17:45-!-zack_ [] has joined #linode
17:47-!-Xobb [~xobb@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
17:47<HoopyCat>i've spent hours today working on DHMO abatement equipment
17:48<Plinker>what is DHMO
17:48<squircle>di-hydrogen monoxide
17:49<Plinker>thank you
17:49<HoopyCat>Plinker: dihydrogen monoxide, a dangerous chemical. like mercury, it's liquid at room temperature
17:49<Plinker>yup I figured
17:49<Plinker>used to play with mercury as a child
17:49<Plinker>who knew
17:49<squircle>one day, somebody's going to completely freak out reading one of those sites
17:49<squircle>live in fear of dihydrogen monoxide
17:50<squircle>until they figure out what it really is
17:50<Yaakov>It is corrosive to many metals and many deadly poisons are soluoble in it.
17:50<Plinker>whats its chemical formula
17:50-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@] has joined #linode
17:51<squircle>hydroxide is OH-
17:51<Yaakov>It's got two molecules of the highly explosive hydrogen and one of the extremely corrowive and reactive oxygen.
17:51<HoopyCat>two atoms of the highly-explosive hydrogen (which is used as a rocket fuel and in atomic bombs) and one atom of a strong oxidizing element, oxygen
17:51<Plinker>I know
17:51<Yaakov>It's like a chemical disaster waiting to happen.
17:52<Plinker>there are two stable and two unstable
17:52<Yaakov>HoopyCat: Stop imitating me.
17:52<Plinker>why the early production rockets blew up
17:53<Yaakov>HoopyCat: Your imitation is flattering but also an occasion for legal action. You will hear from my law firm.
17:53<Guspaz>Fatal if inhaled.
17:53<Plinker>I would say rather than dangerous it may have its uses that benefit man in the right place
17:53<Plinker>dangerous in the wrong
17:53<Guspaz>It can be useful, but so is hydrochloric acid; wouldn't want to breath that either.
17:53<HoopyCat>it is an important agent in the manufacture of beer, for instance
17:53<Guspaz>Beer is very important.
17:53<squircle>and it's flux for solder
17:53<HoopyCat>Yaakov: you will hear from my flaw lurm.
17:54<squircle>(H2SO4 not HOH)
17:54<Plinker>like O2 killed the astronauts years ago when a fire occurred
17:54<Yaakov>It is VERY easily absorbed into the body which makes it potentially toxic. If introduced into the respripratory system it can be rapidly fatal.
17:54<Plinker>I know
17:54<Guspaz>Well, the O2 helped, it was also the velcro being super flammable.
17:54<Plinker>I worked in a lab
17:55<Plinker>they sometimes are matter of fact about the dangers
17:55<Guspaz>You know what else can be rapidly fatal if introduced into the respiratory system? urmom.
17:55<Yaakov>It's industrial uses are often used as an excuse for allowing its widespread proliferation.
17:55<Plinker>it cleaners
17:55<Yaakov>High levels of it have been detected in rainfall, worldwide!
17:56<Plinker>there are many
17:56<HoopyCat>it is also very addictive
17:56<squircle>once you consume some, if you stop, you die
17:56<bss>are we still talking about urmom?
17:56<Guspaz>Once you start to consume it, withdrawal is completely fatal.
17:56<Plinker>what perchance is that
17:56<Guspaz>*extended withdrawl.
17:56<Yaakov>It causes spontaneous combustion when combined with something as simple as the sodium which is found in ordinary table salt.
17:57<Plinker>ok you have been curious
17:57<Plinker>despite being exhausted
17:57<Guspaz>bss: We're always talking about urmom.
17:58<HoopyCat>these fish were found near a very strong concentration of dihydrogen monoxide
17:58<HoopyCat>dead. dead as a... dead fish.
17:58<Guspaz>This fish has ceased to be. It is an ex-fish.
17:58<Yaakov>DHMO has been used in so called "water cannons" to increase their effectiveness in supressing protests.
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17:59<Yaakov>It is a popular tool of repressive regimes worldwide.
17:59<Plinker>I just wonder how the pathnogen works
17:59-!-jackson is now known as Guest985
18:00<Plinker>excuse my spelling please
18:00<Plinker>we have introduced many dangerous things into our living space
18:00<HoopyCat>it is so dangerous, there are government agencies at all levels regulating it
18:01<Yaakov>Plinker: There are several potential modalities. One effect is the unbalancing of electrolytes in the circulatory system.
18:01<Plinker>that will certainly do it
18:02<HoopyCat>alas, such agencies are a bastion of corruption and political nepotism
18:02<Yaakov>Plinker: Another is the displacement of air in the lungs. It preferentially fills the aveoli and causes suffocation.
18:02<Plinker>yep I knew that
18:03<Plinker>not about the electrolytes
18:04<Plinker>we are very complex creatures with many feedback lops
18:04<Plinker>upset just one and it cause havoc
18:05<Plinker>like sodium
18:06-!-yakke [] has joined #linode
18:06<Plinker>been there with a family member
18:06<Plinker>had to follow the lab results all the time
18:06<HoopyCat> <--- one of the great environmental disasters of the 20th century, in which the cuyahoga river caught fire in cleveland, ohio. chemical analysis of the river found significant amounts of dihydrogen monoxide
18:07<Plinker>I would imagine any river in the world would show notable pollution now
18:08<HoopyCat>nod... the concentrations of dihydrogen monoxide found in the cuyahoga river back then are trivial compared to some of the situations we find today
18:08<Plinker>some researchers in Toronto used Lake Ontario water to develop pictures without anything else added
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18:08<Yaakov>Halon fire supression systems have many safeguards in place but fire supression systems which rely on DHMO have few saftey controls. Many times firefighters and even bystanders are soaked by DHMO fire supression systems without and regulations concerning decontamination or expsosure limits. Short term effect like depletion of natural skin oils causing the appearance of permature aging are often ignored because they are considered "temporary".
18:09<Plinker>thats scary
18:09<Plinker>not surprising
18:09<A-KO>holy shit it's going to be hot tomorrow
18:09<A-KO>it's already hot today
18:09<A-KO>37C, feels like 41C
18:10<squircle>!wx cyyz
18:10<linbot>squircle: [metar] OBS at CYYZ: 82.4F/28C, visibility 15 miles, wind 16.11 mph (altimeter: 29.81) [CYYZ 232100Z 26014G19KT 15SM FEW028 SCT043 OVC160 28/24 A2981 RMK CU1SC2AC5 SLP093]
18:10<Plinker>where are you?
18:10<Yaakov>It's frustrating. Proponents of DHMO will insist it is as "safe as drinking water", and some have even gone as far as to drink PURE DHMO to "prove" the point.
18:10<Yaakov>They ignore that the long term effects of concentrated DHMO don't have to be immediate!
18:10<Plinker>some people say smoking is ok
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18:11<Yaakov>These people often smoke too.
18:11<Plinker>no matter the lab results now that show genetic damage
18:11<HoopyCat>Plinker: p.s. if you developed film in lake ontario, please be sure to send a check to eastman kodak; those chemicals are kodak property
18:11<Plinker>to there genes
18:11<mdcollins>!wx ksmf
18:11<HoopyCat>speaking of the crisp clean waters of the genesee, off to enjoy some beer and food at the beer and food place
18:11<linbot>mdcollins: [metar] OBS at KSMF: 89.6F/32C, visibility 10 miles, wind 4.60 mph (altimeter: 29.84) [KSMF 232153Z 27004KT 10SM CLR 32/14 A2984 RMK AO2 SLP103 T03220144]
18:11<Plinker>HoopyCat: true
18:12<Plinker>but also many other industries
18:13<Plinker>Yaakov: Many years ago I said something people did not listen, many other have yelled loudly no one listens
18:13<linbot>New news from forums: Linode dashboard, Your Linode has averaged ... in General Discussion <>
18:15<Plinker>hopefully we will do something before its to late for this planet
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18:18<linbot>New news from forums: VPS under heavy attack. in General Discussion <>
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18:38<@jed>dum dum DUM
18:38-!-abysed [] has quit []
18:39<@jed>what is with planet earth's hate of new orleans? seriously, what did it ever do?
18:40<mdcollins>They built on land that was below the sea level?
18:41<A-KO>mdcollins: a vast majority of the world lives within dangerous reach of the ocean
18:41<A-KO>just an FYI
18:41<A-KO>or some form of river
18:41<A-KO>IN FACT
18:41<A-KO>If you really want to see
18:41<A-KO>Harper's Ferry, WV
18:41<A-KO>in the freakin' mountains :P
18:43-!-riottaba [~quassel@] has joined #linode
18:44<A-KO>you know
18:44<mdcollins>True, but when a big area is below sea level it takes a small hole to let in tons of sea water.
18:44<A-KO>something tells me we should be pulling back some of those funds for our wars.....and kinda sorta helping rebuild Louisiana....
18:45<@jed>mdcollins: amsterdam is below, isn't it?
18:45<A-KO>yeah, it is
18:45*mdcollins doesnt know
18:46<@jed>Amsterdam is situated 2 metres above sea level.
18:46<@jed>ah, it's close
18:46<mdcollins>Combine below sea level with big chance of hurricanes = disaster.
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19:07<rescrv>It appears from the features page that I can share disk images across linodes. For instance, if I were to purchase two 16GB instances, would I be able to partition it as one ~2GB instance and one ~30GB instance?
19:07<linbot>New news from forums: Linode disk usage in General Discussion <>
19:08<A-KO>sigh, fun fun--gotta troubleshoot apache ssl sometime tonight/tomorrow...
19:09<A-KO>the only thing that really broke on my linode after the upgrade--for some...really odd reason..
19:10<Daevien>bad thing: grabbing a bass guitar i haven't played in about 2 years and finding i forgot to loosen the strings. crazy thing: it's still in tune. in a place that widely flucuates between freezing int he winter to boiling in the summer
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19:17<Bohemian>hi, i have an apache2 server. how do i create a subdomain?
19:17<Bohemian>or since i don't use vhosts, should i first setup vhosts, THEN create the subdomain?
19:18<HoopyCat>Peng: was it you who recommended the weihenstephan hefe-weisse last year or so?
19:18<Bohemian>or are the two not related?
19:18<@caker>rescrv: no, not quite - you can share them across configuration profiles, not Linodes.
19:18<HoopyCat>Bohemian: a subdomain is nothing but a vhost
19:18<@caker>rescrv: however, there is a utility to clone (copy) disk images from Linode to Linode within your account
19:20<Bohemian>HoopyCat so i need to create vhosts for my server first?
19:21<HoopyCat>Bohemian: yes, because a subdomain is a vhost
19:22<HoopyCat>(there are, technically speaking, no such things as subdomains)
19:22<Bohemian>HoopyCat is there a linode guide that teaches how to set up vhosts?
19:22<HoopyCat>!library apache
19:22<@caker>is there!
19:22<linbot>HoopyCat: 1. Install the Apache 2 Web Server on Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid) ( - 2. Install the Apache 2 Web Server on Ubuntu 9.10 (Karmic) ( - 3. Install the Apache 2 Web Server on Ubuntu 8.04 LTS (Hardy) (
19:23<rescrv>caker: what's the difference between configuration profiles and linodes?
19:23<HoopyCat>Bohemian: well, it's somewhere at there's a few...
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19:23<@caker>rescrv: configuration profiles are what a Linode boots.
19:23<@caker>Accounts have Linodes which have Disk Images AND Configuration Profiles
19:24<@caker>the config profiles assign disk images and device nodes
19:25<rescrv>so it's to allow me to, say, dual-boot one instance into Fedora, then shut it down and bring it back as Debian?
19:25<Bohemian>HoopyCat: am i going to have issues since i setup apache2 (on a debian linode) with no vhosts?
19:25<@caker>rescrv: precisely
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19:26<Daevien>Bohemian: i expect so. but that's more due to pebkac errors than anything else
19:26<Bohemian>Daevien: huh?
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19:28<rescrv>caker: Is there any way to expand the space available without necessarily expanding the ram or transfer? I notice that extra bandwidth may be purchased a la carte.
19:28<linbot>Available Add-ons: Disk: $ 2 per 1GB/month. RAM: $ 5 per 90MB/month. Transfer: $ 10 per 100GB/month. IP: $ 1 per IP/month. To add extras:
19:28<@caker>rescrv: yes, but it's more economical to just upgrade the entire plan
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19:29<rescrv>thank you caker (that info was behind the member login)
19:30-!-grubby [] has quit []
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19:31<@caker>rescrv: :)
19:31<dKingston>if anybody's good with C
19:32<dKingston>correct me if i'm wrong
19:32<dKingston>structs like *_t are reserved
19:32<@caker>IRC supports complete sentences on one line.
19:32<dKingston>i know. it's a bad habit
19:33*HoopyCat deploys
19:33-!-json [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:33<HoopyCat>(not really)
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19:33<Bohemian>i'm going to install lightppd to get rid of apache2, since i need a vhost anyway. how do i set lightppd's port to something different than apache's (80). the linode guide says to change it if you have apache2 running already...
19:33<@jed>HoopyCat: they got a dock full of incoming
19:34-!-zack_ [] has quit [Quit: zack_]
19:34<@caker>Bohemian: google found the answer for me. give it a shot
19:34-!-abysed [] has quit []
19:34*Daevien snickers
19:34<HoopyCat>!wx klga
19:34<linbot>HoopyCat: [metar] OBS at KLGA: 86.0F/30C, visibility 7 miles, wind 6.90 mph (altimeter: 29.84) [KLGA 232251Z 16006KT 7SM SCT130 BKN250 30/24 A2984 RMK AO2 SLP106 T03000239]
19:34<Bohemian>caker well, i considered linode a great resource. maybe you should add that to your guide, caker. seriously.
19:34<HoopyCat>zomg you can swim through the air
19:35<Bohemian>i mean, you warn users to change the port, but not tell them how to. it could be useful for completeness sakes...
19:35<pharaun>kronos003: yo, saw the pictures, it looks pretty nice :)
19:35<Daevien>it's in there Bohemian, you just have to *gasp* look for yourself. think you can handle that without fainting?
19:35<HoopyCat>grep -r 80 /etc/lighttpd/*
19:35-!-json [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:35<HoopyCat>there'd be a start
19:35<pharaun>thankgod for UPS i've had 5 power failure today *sigh*
19:35<pharaun>short few seconds long but still ugh
19:36<Bohemian>in case anyone is interested, here's the article from the crimson when facebook was first launched (well, a few days after launch). the crimson is the main harvard newspaper
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19:38<Bohemian>touché. well, in the time i do apt-get install lightppd, before that, do i need to turn off apache2, wait for lightppd to install and immediately open the config file and change the port? THEN turn on apache2 again?
19:38<Bohemian>i found that article last night when i was bored
19:40*HoopyCat detaches and goes back to beer
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19:40*Daevien steals HoopyCat's beer
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19:45<Bohemian>Daevien could you at least tell me that?
19:46<Daevien>think about it logically. can two things listen on the same port? no. so you need to change one of them. can you change something before you install it?
19:46-!-ekrem [~ekrem@] has joined #linode
19:46<Daevien>no. so you install it, it fails to load, you change it, you restart it
19:46-!-silence [] has joined #linode
19:48<Bohemian>Daevien but doesn't that mean that since they are both trying to listen to 80, wouldn't one of them load? or do they fight with each other? so the site will be down, even with apache2 running, until i edit the port in lighttpd and restart lighttpd?
19:48<Yaakov>Wow. Google Images has CHANGED.
19:49<Bohemian>Yaakov yup
19:49<Bohemian>for the better
19:49-!-zack_ [] has joined #linode
19:49<Bohemian>unlike their constant changes to youtube
19:49<Daevien>seriously, you are going to switch entire www daemon because you can't be bothered to search the linode library or google & no one woudl spoonfeed you through every step liek they have now for liek months? seriously?
19:49<ekrem>Hello, Linode website says "You can also roll your own distribution and upload it." Does that mean that I could upload any linux distribution to use with a VPS?
19:50<Daevien>ekrem: in theory, yes. some distros coudl be a nightamre to setup & stuff though.w hat one wer eyou thinking of specifically?
19:50<Daevien>and yeah that was the link i was looking for jed heh
19:51<ekrem>jed: Thanks
19:51<ekrem>Daevien: I'm thinking about Pardus (
19:52<Karrde>in perl, what does $file ||= '/proc/mounts'; do? specifically the ||= (searching on that is kind of hard..)
19:54<Daevien>ah i dont' really know pardus, but it would prob not be trivial to put it on, i see references to improved bootup. which means non standard heh
19:56<ekrem>Daevien: :) I'll give it a try, I'm also a developer (volunteer) of pardus
19:57<@jed>ekrem: what's it based on?
19:57<ekrem>jed: nothing, its from scratch
19:58<ekrem>Linux Journal got a fresh review of Pardus:
19:58-!-abysed [] has joined #linode
19:58<Daevien>yeah not saying it owuldn't be possible, you just might be more bald after pullign out handfuls of hair doing it :p
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20:05<Bohemian>i just tried installing lighttpd, does this mean i need to stop apache2 first?
20:07<Karrde>unless you configure one or the other for a different port.
20:08<@caker>or ip.
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20:13<Yaakov>or 'node.
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20:20<Bohemian>can someone help? i stopped apache2, yet when i try to configure lighttpd it says port 80 is in use:
20:20<Bohemian>netstat -n | grep 80 says nothing
20:21<Bohemian>and my site doesn't load
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20:55<Pryon>Bohemian: just for fun, try 'netstat | grep www' instead
20:56<Bohemian>Pryon: i got it, after removing it, then installing again. then my lighttpd config was there
20:56<Bohemian>now trying to not get a 403 error when going to domain:81
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21:17<blognewb>hey guys, what's the typical max number of US high school units (9-12th grade) if curriculum was semestral?
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21:33<encode>i'm going to say 5
21:34<Daevien>42, the answer is always 42
21:34<@ericoc>the answer is applesauce
21:35<Daevien>if you are caker, the answer is CLOUD!
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21:41<amitz>and tifa
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21:48<linbot>New news from forums: lighttpd issue. in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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21:49<agentbob>anyone know how to use atop?
21:49<HoopyCat>you put it on the ground and spin the knob and it'll just kinda go all spinny around until it falls over
21:50<Daevien>drunken hoopy is amusing too
21:50<agentbob>my linode crashed again and i'd like to find out what caused it if possible...
21:52<HoopyCat>a friend of mine is working on a mobile application project, using the ample resources of my linode... alas, he ran into the good ol' expectation-failed lighttpd problem. rather than fix the problem, i spun up another linode, nfs-mounted his home dir, and had him repoint his application
21:52<HoopyCat>to whomever wrote the linode LAMP stackscript: <3 <3 <3
21:53<HoopyCat>"You know what's awesome about 2010? This server didn't exist 30 minutes ago."
21:54<HoopyCat>agentbob: i've never seen that particular file format before. congrats!
21:55<agentbob>HoopyCat: was recommended by someone in here previously
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21:59<agentbob>could i be getting oom crashes on 1gb linode for too small of a swp partition?
22:00<Daevien>well you can get crashes on anythign if you have a memory leak and hit your max mem + swap and then oom
22:03<agentbob>any tips/ideas on how to track down what's leaking all the memory?
22:06<HoopyCat>agentbob: ssh into lish, ctrl-a then d to detach to the lish prompt, then do "logview"... that'll give you the post-mortem of the last boot
22:06<agentbob>did all that
22:06<agentbob>still crashing
22:06<HoopyCat>agentbob: what'd it say?
22:06-!-squircle [~squircle@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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22:07<agentbob>li58-177 login: Kernel panic - not syncing: out of memory. panic_on_oom is selected
22:07<agentbob>Rebooting in 10 seconds..
22:07<agentbob>then it hangs there for hours
22:07<HoopyCat>that would be an oom
22:07<agentbob>yes i know :|
22:08<agentbob>i have the atop log of when it happened as well, but not entirely sure how to interpret it
22:09<HoopyCat>neither am i, it's this big binary thang and the judge installed a breathalyzer in my apt chain on my production systems
22:12<A-KO>wtf broke in my ssl apache config
22:12<A-KO>this is starting to piss me off now
22:13<agentbob>yeah well at least your system doesn't hang daily. be happy!
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22:15<dansnetwork>Would you typically assign www-data as the user and group for your web dirs?
22:15<Kos>I use root, like a real man
22:15<amitz>dansnetwork: yes
22:15<mdcollins>Id do owned by your user and group www-data
22:15<A-KO>dansnetwork: Idon't
22:15<amitz>root is only for chuck norris
22:15<A-KO>dansnetwork: I use mpm-itk
22:15-!-agentbob [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:15<amitz>and amitz.
22:15<A-KO>but it depends on your environment really
22:16-!-optix [] has joined #linode
22:16<dansnetwork>forgot the Ubuntu/Apache part
22:17<optix>Anyone know how long it takes Linode to process rDNS requests?
22:18-!-agentbob [] has joined #linode
22:19<squircle>max 15 minutes I believe
22:19*optix is at ~ an hour now
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22:19<HoopyCat>optix: allow a day or two
22:19-!-snubby [] has quit [Quit: autokilled: This host violated network policy.]
22:19<squircle>oh yeah, not normal dns...
22:19<optix>HoopyCat: okay
22:19<squircle>/ignore me
22:20<HoopyCat>between replication delays (esp. for non-direct allocations) and lengthy TTLs and all that, PTRs take awhile
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22:24<agentbob>wait! i think my swp isn't mounting
22:25-!-zack_ [] has quit [Quit: zack_]
22:25<agentbob>no.. n/m its mounted
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22:33<Alan>Question: is there significant performance penalties using CNAME records for websites?
22:33<Alan>I know that it could cause multiple lookups just to get the address... but is that usually a noticable penalty?
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22:34<squircle>didn't we have this conversation earlier?
22:34<Alan>did you?
22:34<HoopyCat>Alan: it can be... in general, if you can avoid cnames, avoid them
22:34-!-HelpMe [] has joined #linode
22:35<squircle>as long as the cname has the same base domain name as its target, the cname and corresponding A record will be returned together
22:35<squircle>just don't use cnames
22:35<Alan>heh, fair enough
22:35<HoopyCat>cnames have some annoying limitations here and there
22:35<Alan>fine for dev sites though, right? just avoid for live public sites?
22:35<HoopyCat>Alan: dev sites develop habits too, you know :-)
22:36*HoopyCat treats dev servers like prod servers, just more so
22:36<Alan>HoopyCat: heh
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22:39*Daevien prods HoopyCat's servers
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22:52<squircle>does debian testing get security updates, or only debian stable?
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22:53<tjfontaine>squircle: yes-ish
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22:53<squircle>tjfontaine: can you elaborate a bit?
22:53<amitz>squircle: not a priority.
22:53<tjfontaine>squircle: depends on the package, but generally as DSA deals with a package it's usually included in testing, but if the package is only available >= testing they don't do active DSA work
22:54<squircle>aah, thanks
22:54<squircle>the way I see it, when I re-roll my linode, I'll use either ubu 10.04 LTS, debian testing or stable
22:54<squircle>that's the problem with linux, too much choice (although I guess it's not much of a problem)
22:55<amitz>squircle: my rule of thumb, if I need stability = stable, newer version but less security update = testing, newer version more security update but less stable = unstable.
22:56<squircle>so would Ubuntu 10.04 LTS be more or less equal to squeeze (current testing)?
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22:57<amitz>appliaction versionly speaking, I believe so. IIRC, squeeze is a bit newer in application version.
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22:58<squircle>alright, thanks :)
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22:59<amitz>stability speaking, after a few months, ubuntu 10.04 is somewhat like squeeze but with better security update. That's how I usually perceive it.
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22:59<squircle>that's what I was thinking too
22:59<squircle>thanks so much amitz! :D
22:59<amitz>np :-)
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23:09<squircle>is there any performance advantage to compiling LAMP from source over using the standard .deb?
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23:13<HoopyCat>squircle: probably not, and any advantage is likely outweighted by the pain-in-the-ass and security issues inherent in not going with the flow
23:14<HoopyCat>in other words, if you're at the point where squeaking out another 0.5 hits/second matters and you can't afford to add another server, you probably need to evaluate your business plan
23:15<squircle>i see
23:15<squircle>makes sense for me
23:16<HoopyCat>i am responsible for... uhh... some dozens of servers, it's a friday night, and i'm more than half-tanked
23:16<HoopyCat>you know why? because apt-get update && apt-get upgrade --> love
23:18<HoopyCat>that said, the Tröegs Nugget-Westmalle cask wiped out about 95% of the local freelance tech community tonight, so it's not like i'm alone
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23:19<tjfontaine>HoopyCat: hehe, you have a good environment
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23:26<HoopyCat>tjfontaine: <--- awesome place where i believe i will start spending fridays
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23:34<tjfontaine>totally want to make one
23:36<amitz>good idea!
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23:38<amitz>as long as I'm not seated the way the right hand picture depicts right now.
23:39<HoopyCat>the lightning talks picture? yeah, we kinda crammed that place
23:40<tjfontaine>there's a building perfect for it locally, right pricing and everything, but there's no demand
23:40<tjfontaine>now, I might be able to swing that in Akron
23:46<Bohemian>how do i activate mod_evhost... i don't see it in lighttpd.conf
23:47<amitz>HoopyCat: yep
23:48<amitz>tjfontaine: I had stopped thinking about it, then you made me think again. Just found an ideal location too :-p. But perhaps one day..
23:50<amitz>perhaps my dad is right. When you have too many options, you're in great risk of losing your foucs.
23:50<amitz>I need to focus my energy to a business/work.
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23:53<HoopyCat>amitz: do something. whatever you do, do it. do it hard. do it like... like... i dunno, something you'd do hard and often
23:53<linbot>New news from forums: unresponsive terminal - cannot access linode in Linux Networking <>
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---Logclosed Sat Jul 24 00:00:13 2010