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#linode IRC Logs for 2010-09-07

---Logopened Tue Sep 07 00:00:31 2010
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01:31<amitz>i still somehow give a benefit of doubt.
01:32<amitz>what's the wise crowd of linode recommend for pronter/scanner/copier on linux?
01:35<auau>array: labor won
01:36<encode>amitz: finger paint
01:36<MarkJ>Yeah, 2 votes, Oakeshott could've easily made it 75:75
01:38<amitz>encode: that actually makes sense...
01:38<auau>amitz: something hp?
01:39<tonyyarusso>amitz: the HP PSC series works well usually.
01:45<amitz>woah, 2 hp recommendations. looking.
01:48<amitz>the problem of looking oin internet is, local stores may not stock what you want.
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01:54<orudie> is fun today
01:54<Pryon>can't touch the goog
01:55<orudie>its a good benchmark for your desktop try opening more than one browser window/tab
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02:07<tonyyarusso>dear god - they must thing processor cycles are free or something
02:14*Marius yawns
02:14<Marius>installing windows servers is so boing, there's just nothing to ... DO
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02:15<tonyyarusso>what about rebooting every fifteen minutes?
02:16<Marius>It does it automatically =(
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02:17<Marius>oh well, let's figure out why the networking on my vbox isn't working first
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02:31<auau>hi marius
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02:56<amitz>everyone is helloed
02:57<Marius>schweet, I was helloed
02:59<Marius>It must be said, because I just saw pictures, that renaissance fairs area freakfest
03:06<Marius>I take that back, if they look like the middle chick here it's all good;
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03:21<linbot>New news from forums: Using the Backup Service with Ubuntu's Private Directory in General Discussion <>
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04:10<Marius>Why isn't there a source of country flag images with the same dimensions on all the flags? >_<
04:10<Marius>well, there's famfam, but they're 16x11, way too small
04:10<Marius>and they are shit when resized
04:10<mdcollins>That would be sensible..
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04:11<G>Marius: obviously you'd want some done as a svg format :)
04:11<saikat>is there some way to make sure that all my replication server traffic is not getting counted towards my bandwidth quota (other than juts waiting and seeing how much bandwidth i've used tomorrow)?
04:12<Marius>obviously, but that's effort ;P
04:12<saikat>i just switched things over to use private ips, i think
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04:28<Marius>I just made my own images
04:29<Marius>I would've made vectors, but illustrator won't boot on my machine for some reason
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04:32<tronix>OK, so who's DDoS'ing HE @ Fremont? ;-)
04:33<Marius>urmom \o/
04:33<tronix>oh. thought it was some random skript kiddie. ;-)
04:33<tronix>MOM! Get off the computer!
04:33<tronix>there, Mom's apparently off.
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04:55<encode>quit fail
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05:21<amitz>any opinion on Brother printers?
05:24<G>amitz: my HL-2040 is great
05:24<tkoskine>Brother laser printers with Postscript support has been good for me.
05:24<G>amitz: original toner lasted me for ages
05:24<amitz>/ignore on nick=="chesty" .and. (message =="yes" or message =="no")
05:24<Marius>what is it called, the steel that doens't rust ?
05:25<Marius>it it just "Rustfreee steel"
05:25<Marius>thank'ye =)
05:25<Marius>that's what I wasl ooking for
05:25<G>amitz: only problem is, now it starts clicking every now and then after printing, or the odd paper jam after a big job
05:25<chesty>but it does stain
05:25<G>the only thing I dislike about it, is the paper out
05:26<amitz>G: you meant, HL-2140?
05:26<G>even 5 pages, it doesn't keep them stacked nicely or sometimes manages to insert a page in odd places in the print out :)
05:26<G>amitz: HL-2040, HL-2140 is the new model
05:26<G>amitz: no idea what they changed, but visually it's just a different colour and a bit more 'blocky'
05:27<amitz>tkoskine: and they also have linux drivers for the non=postscript!
05:28<amitz>SpaceHobo: fwiw, the corrosion-resistence depends on the grade.
05:28<G>amitz: personally, if I was to get a new printer or replacement printer, I'd get the HL-2040, if I couldn't get that, I'd go for the 2x70N (networking enabled)
05:28<G>unless I wanted to go the next step up and get a printer that did duplex printing to save the trees
05:29<amitz>G: well, I'm actually looking for the multi-function ones. Is looking for either MCF-490CW or MFC-6490CW. But the ink consumption is said to be scary.
05:29<amitz>the laser ones are very expensive -_-
05:31<G>amitz: hmmm, I've also got one of their old DCP-130Cs which is pretty good (their build quality for their older models seems to be really good) and ink consumption isn't too bad in them
05:32<G>amitz: that said, I know a guy that brought a later model Brother multi-function and returned it w/in the week because it did such a bad job at printing etc
05:32<G>(later model as in current series)
05:32<G>no idea if it was luck of the draw or what ,but not very encouraging
05:33<amitz>G: hmm, yeah, printers are getting sucky these days. but fwiw, I can testify on epson lx-800 and lx-300*. They just won't die despite harsh environment.
05:34<Deezire>Printers has something against mankind.
05:34<Deezire>This i am sure of.
05:35<amitz>SpaceHobo: I was led to believe otherwise. I thought stainless still just won't corrode -_-
05:36<amitz>SpaceHobo: I failed chemistry in highschool -_-
05:37<amitz>the organic one though :-p
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05:39<Marius>I just noticed that the new chrome version removes the http:// prefix on URLs o_O
05:39<Deezire>indeed, it's nice.
05:41<amitz>Marius: yeah. I rarely restart my chrome so I really had no idea which update did it.
05:41<Deezire>amitz: chrome for windows and mac are soft. They can happend while running.
05:41<Marius>Deezire: no they can't...
05:41<Deezire>Was kinda freaky going out of SC2 and seeing that Chrome has changed, a lot.
05:42<Marius>chrome won't update unless you kill all it's processes
05:42<Deezire>That cannot be true for OSX
05:43<Deezire>as i havent rebooted it for weeks nor restarted chrome.
05:43<Marius>I'm on windows, and it requires you to restart it all
05:43<Deezire>Maybe it's just steve jobs using his magic wand (tm)
05:43<Marius>also, unrelated yet always related; applefag.
05:43<amitz>Deezire: I believe it's more about, you can update linux files even when they're used, but accessing the new version requires you to release the last version from usage.
05:47<Deezire>You might be right, or i might even have acidentally have restarted chrome without remembering.
05:47<Deezire>I do stuff like that!
05:48<amitz>G: thanks for the information, I plan to settle MFC-490CW. Hopefully, nothing goes wrong :-p
05:49<amitz>Deezire: my chrome periodically restart. It chrases after all :-p
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05:49<Deezire>Only facebook crashes for me, when it has conumed like 4GB memory-ish.
05:49<Deezire>And then i get sad tab :(
06:01<Nova>has exceeded the notification threshold (1000) for disk io rate by averaging 1381.53 for the last 2 hours.
06:01<Nova>is 1381.53 io rate excessive?
06:02<chesty>for short periods of time, it's nothing
06:02<Marius>24/7, kinda :P
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06:07<G>amitz: good luck
06:10<Nova>Chesty it has been happening once a day for like 2 hours straight
06:10<Nova>and I cant figure out what is causing it
06:11<chesty>so you've checked cron?
06:13<Nova>but even though I am getting those notifications
06:13<Nova>the performance of my hosted sites does not seem to be affected at all
06:13<chesty>just raise the limit to 2000
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06:31<Marius>SpaceHobo: the website is somewhat borked in chrome xD
06:32<Marius>the fornt page looks like it has a spiders nest on it or something
06:32<Marius>I hope this is just a joke site ?
06:32<Marius>$4000 - INTRODUCTORY OFFER $299 !
06:34<Marius>haha, the vibration remover is hilarious
06:34<Marius>is that a bunch of sandbags packed to an amp panel O_o
06:34<Marius>CocoMass Hat of Silence
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06:49<chesty>what's that distro/software called designed for thin clients?
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06:52<mig5>chesty: ulteo?
06:52<chesty>nah, unless it changed its name
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06:57<HoopyCat>definitely not urmom
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07:01<G>chesty: there are a few
07:02<G>chesty: there is the LTSP one which has been around for a while
07:02<chesty>ltsp is what i was thinking of, thanks
07:04<G>chesty: np :)
07:05<HoopyCat>Before the start of the game, host Peter Tomarken made a prophetic comment, "We're going to have Big Bucks today; I can feel it." Then as he was learning about each player, he referenced the idea of overdosing on ice cream (a reference to Larson's occupation) with another soon-to-be-coincidental statement, "Hopefully you won't O.D. [overdose] on money, Michael."
07:08<HoopyCat>i'm gonna move #linode to window 4 'cuz baby there ain't never been a whammy here
07:09<encode>HoopyCat: curious. #linode lives in window 4 on my client
07:09<Marius>How rude, you ahve me here!
07:09<Marius>it lives in screen 2 for me
07:09<encode>Marius: screen != window.
07:09<G>used to be 4 for me, now 36
07:10<encode>irssi ftw
07:10<HoopyCat>G: extended basic? seriously?
07:10<HoopyCat>G: at least this channel isn't on your digital tier
07:10<G>extended basic?
07:10<HoopyCat><--- veritable font of american television references this morning
07:12<HoopyCat>G: cable television normally has a few different service levels... there's basic (which pretty much gets you the channels the carrier is paid to carry), extended basic (which has a crapload of analog channels everyone loves, like lifetime, oxygen, cspan2, and that catholic channel), then you get into the digital stuff where there's about 9000 channels because they squeeze 'em each into 56 kb/sec
07:12<encode>HoopyCat: fount or font?
07:13<HoopyCat>encode: you're right; i should have said typeface.
07:13<Yaakov>"Font" is correct.
07:13<Yaakov>Font *means* fount in that way that HoopyCat used it.
07:13<A-KO>what's today's significance? Google's logo is interesting
07:14<Marius>only the logo is swapped
07:14<Yaakov>It's Scared Ball Day
07:14<Marius>I think the significance is that google hired a new person who wanted to play with javascript
07:14<encode>I've always thought it was font, but then seeing HoopyCat use it, I wasn't sure
07:14<Marius>I found out it's fun to trap a single ball and keep it away form it's friends
07:14<Yaakov>It is, in fact, font--as in "font of wisdom".
07:14<Yaakov>Which as we all know is MS Comic Sans.
07:14<HoopyCat>encode: how often have i been incorrect aboot spellings of words?
07:15<Yaakov>HoopyCat: 323,846 times.
07:15<Yaakov>That is about 1%.
07:15<HoopyCat>anyway, afk, shower -> school -> zomgdiffeq -> wtfc++ -> fmlanalysis
07:16<Yaakov>But that's your lifetime average. In the last decade you've dropped to .2%
07:16<linbot>New news from forums: IPv6 in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
07:16<HoopyCat>oh christ not that thread again
07:16<HoopyCat>*locks terminal, runs*
07:16<encode>wtfc++ sounds interesting
07:17<Yaakov>I don't want to go straight to IPv6, it's too radical. Linode should ease us in with IPv5 first.
07:17<Yaakov>Then, IPv5.5
07:17<Marius>I'm a huge supporter of 5.39
07:17<Marius>But hey, that's just me!
07:18<Yaakov>Yes, yes it is. In fact, it's called IPvMarius informally.
07:18<encode>Yaakov: i disagree. I think IPv6 is too controversial, and we should skip it altogether. Let's wait for IPv16
07:19<Yaakov>encode: Taking that approach, I think we should just wait for IPw6.
07:19<Yaakov>OK, time to do things of great import.
07:20<encode>or wait for the successor to TCP/IP
07:20<spkitty>i want IPV6.5 TME
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07:24<Marius>blergh, ok so server 2008 SBS takes for ever to install
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07:34<G>Marius: I've never experienced that
07:35<G>always been fast for me
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07:45<Marius>my boss can be an ass at times
07:45<Marius>"heeey, there's aguy here asking for you"
07:45<Marius>and then he transfers the call
07:45<Marius>and it's a telemarketer who didn't evne know he was on hold, haha
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07:48*encode puts urmom on hold
07:50<Nivex>in Soviet Linode, urmom puts YOU on hold!
07:51<ttaylor>anyone had issue with iptables not logging to syslog on newly deployed Ubuntu or CentOS?
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08:01<chesty>ubuntu has an issue with some kernel messages not being logged, not sure if that includes iptables
08:01<chesty>the latest ubuntu, that is. no idea about centos
08:02<ttaylor>I've had it with CentOS in the past, but I'm working on Ubuntu at the moment.
08:03<ttaylor>dmesg is showing iptalbes is loggging but nothing via syslog files, so is must be with either syslog or the kernel.
08:08<Marius>So according ot fashion magazines (don't ask), IT personell should dress in kaki brown and sparkly grey this year
08:08<Marius>ond preferably see-through shirts under trenchcoats
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08:13*eighty4 have a couple of kaki:ish pants and a grayish skirt on
08:13<eighty4>and I have a black "tenchcoat" as a jacket
08:13<Nova>CentOS way better than Ubuntu
08:13<eighty4>Nova: Ubuntu kicks CentOSs ass
08:14<Nova>infact more business uses CentOs
08:14<Nova>CentOS supports more software than Ubuntu
08:14<eighty4>does Cent have apt?
08:14<Nova>who needs apt
08:14<Nova>yum is better
08:14<eighty4>yum works
08:15<Deezire>centos supports more software? To my knowledge both support all mainstream compilers...
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08:15<eighty4>Nova: 5.5. is the latest stable release?
08:15<Randomskk>centos is a massive pain in the arse really though
08:15<Nova>Deezire does Ubuntu support Cpanel/WHM?
08:16<Nova>it doesnt
08:16<Randomskk>it's like years out of date, you end up compiling all the crap you actually need yourself
08:16<Nova>i could make a long list of things that wont run on Ubuntu
08:16<Deezire>CPanel is php, so yeah, it does.
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08:16<Randomskk>yum is okay, but feels slower than debian
08:16<Nova>Cpanel is not just PHP
08:16<eighty4>Nova: why wouldn't Cpanel run on Ubuntu?
08:16<Deezire>It's just cpanel who don't support it
08:16<Deezire>And who the fuck would want cpanel?!
08:16<Nova>Deezire: Cpanel will not install whatsoever on Ubuntu
08:17<Deezire>As cpanel is shit.
08:17<eighty4>Deezire: it's better than the terminal for most people
08:17<Nova>Deezire: Last time I checked more than 300K websites run cPanel
08:17<Randomskk>cpanel-- anyway, but you can support cpanel on ubuntu
08:17*eighty4 downloads the net install to play with
08:17<chesty>ttaylor: are you running rsyslog, and is it running as root?
08:17<Randomskk>just a pain to do so
08:17<Deezire>Nova: it's basically because most libraries are in different places on centos not because it's any better.
08:17<eighty4>Nova: again, why doesn't it work on Ubuntu?
08:18<Deezire>Get some knowledge before you start saying that something is better than X, when you have NO clue...
08:18<Nova>eighty4, because WHM/Cpanel will totally modify the distro from the kernel down to every library
08:18<Nova>so it doesnt work
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08:18<eighty4>Nova: k
08:18<Nova>X is crap
08:19<Deezire>You have no clue what you are talking about, do you?
08:19<Nova>Deezire: if you do any webhosting your clients are going to want a panel of some sort and Cpanel offers the most features
08:19<ttaylor>chesty: appears rsyslog is running as syslog
08:19<Deezire>No, i dont want that and i do host people.
08:20<Nova>You probably are not making any money then
08:20<chesty>ttaylor: that's your problem, restart syslog and look for an error message about not being able to open some file in /proc
08:20<Nova>Cpanel/WHM is where the money is at
08:20<Deezire>How the hell can you say that?
08:20<Deezire>you have no clue what i'm doing
08:21<Randomskk>maybe I host couchdb instances for people. shame cpanel doesn't support that!
08:22<Nova>Deezire: Until you have a listing on Netcraft indicating how many sites you host.... I can honestly say you arent making much money
08:25<eighty4>Nova Deezire there's a big differens between host and host. Linode don't use cpanel and I bet they make some money
08:25<eighty4>BUT a huge section of users demands a gui based controlpanel
08:26<G>I've got no idea about margins, but I'm sure there isn't a LOT of margin in cPanel licenses
08:26<G>(for resellers of the licenses)
08:26<Deezire>im with a client right now... so brb
08:28<chesty>ladies and gentlemen, take my advice, pull down your pants, and slide on the ice
08:28<Marius>linode doesn't host websites :P
08:28<Marius>and they do have a control panel for what they DO host :
08:28*Marius just enjoys heating ze fire
08:28<G>the other thing is, imo cPanel isn't that great and has from experience had some quite bad flaws/issues
08:29<Marius>I don't like cPanel, but all the silly clients love it (stupid clients...)
08:29<G>(talking from personal experience a few years ago)
08:29<G>I must admit, Plesk always kinda tickled my heart
08:29<Marius>I found plesk to be unorganized
08:30*eighty4 hates plesk
08:30<eighty4>it's stupid and evil and must die!
08:30<G>(I had to install it for testing purposes at work once (I didn't have to use it, just install and make sure it installed properly) and it did seem quite good
08:30<G>plus, there are a few others that don't seem to take over the whole OS
08:30<G>(or eat all the memory)
08:30<eighty4>plesk eats memory
08:31<G>eighty4: sure it does, anything uses memory, but there is a difference between eating a lot of memory and eating everything
08:32<eighty4>it's still stupid and evil :(
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08:32<Deezire>Nova: Firstly, im not going to just blurt out all my clients, they might not want that, and secondly, i have clientes with to big sites for cpanel to be effective/usefull.
08:32<eighty4>But don't get me wrong, I see the point with a panel
08:32<ttaylor>chesty: thanks
08:33<Deezire>With cpanel, you as system admin, lose /all/ controll. And if something goes booboo you 1) have to pay for support or 2) wait for them to reply your email.
08:33<Deezire>I personally KNOW what can go wrong with MY setup, so then I can fix it in a matter of minutes.
08:34<G>oh my.... logging into the cpanel demo... "Kernel version: 2.6.9-42.0.3.ELsmp" so thats RHEL 4 update 4, where RH is up to update 8 or 9
08:34<G>good few years out of date on the kernel alone it seems :P
08:34<Deezire>That is, in my opinion the worst about cpanel hosters, they dont know shit about the inner workings and when things go boo boo on their over crowded server they just restore a freaking backup from a few days ago and plays along.
08:35<G>Deezire: pretty much
08:35<G>(the only reason why I don't like Parallels (hence Plesk) is Virtuozzo)
08:37<G>oh wow, Parallels brought out H-Sphere?
08:37<Deezire>I don't like it because it does not give me any more control over the server than i already have. It just opens it up for remote exploits and eats up resources.
08:38<Deezire>And my clients does not care if they have to call me to fix things, in their eyes, that's easier and cheaper than having some random at the office do all the stuff via some shitty panel.
08:38*Perihelion slaps Marius around a bit with a large cactus
08:38<Deezire>Now, back to do some actual work.
08:39<Deezire>Might take chesty up on his advice!
08:39<G>I saw that once upon a time Linode resold some DirectAdmin licenses
08:39<snubby>why talk about cpanel when we could do somethin else more useful like...
08:39<snubby>terraforming mars :D
08:40<G>snubby: thats what we have nukes for no?
08:40<Deezire>I havent looked lately but the bugtrack for zero day root expolits for cpanel and the works are HUGE. For debian/other flavoured linux it's pretty much only the SSH key issue back some years.
08:40<G>Deezire: yep, exactly
08:41<snubby>nukes eh @ G
08:41<G>snubby: targetted launches to part of mars to create valleys etc
08:42<snubby>atmosphere too
08:42*Marius winces and runs for cover
08:43<Marius>So yeah, I now have windows server 2003, SBS 2008 and Enterprise 2008 installed at the same time
08:43<Marius>good times >_<
08:43<Marius>and of course, this shit was developed for random crap that came IN BETWEEN...
08:43<Deezire>You just got three times as much workload doing patches? :D
08:43<G>Marius: you mean the R2 releases?
08:43<Marius>Deezire: all virtuals
08:43<Marius>G, yup
08:44<G>R2 releases are just so Microsoft don't have to do big marketing pushes
08:44<Marius>I jsut need them for development purposes
08:45<Marius>set the guy that does php and has his main priorities with linux to do the microsoft crap, good deal!
08:45<G>I went to a conference where they explained the typical plans for RTM/R2 releases etc, but I forgot it now
08:45<Deezire>Poor you, Apache/php/anything on windows is hell.
08:45<Marius>who said I had apache/php/anythin on there ?
08:46<Marius>I have linux boxes for that
08:46<Deezire>You said something about php, i just did some magic and added 1+1 and got 3.
08:46<G>Marius: IIS right? :)
08:46<Marius>G, IIS makes windows server work a joke :P
08:46<Marius>ANYONE can be a server admin with it, haha
08:47<Marius>which kinda bothers me, as everyone walks around drops out of school, starts a computer in their basement, isntalls windows server 2008 cracked, and sells hosting calling them self engineers (engineer isn't a protected title in norway)
08:47<Deezire>Marius: The problem is when it goes Booboo, then you need a microsoft expert <insert fancy title here>
08:47<coobra>Marius: so true :D
08:47<Deezire>And he'll tell you to reinstall it.
08:47<Marius>Then there's the guys (read: me) who do the work, actually get certified as said engineer and watch these morons get good clients because of their mommy or daddy
08:47<G>Deezire: you mean Microsoft Certified System X
08:47<G>or MCITP etc
08:47<Deezire>Something in that line. :p
08:48<Marius>MCSA/MCSE \o/
08:48-!-ojacobson [~ojacobson@] has joined #linode
08:48<G>Deezire: MCSA is a joke due to braindumping/etc
08:48<Marius>I can't stand microsoft shit, I don't know much about it, but I maanged to get certified as both an admin and engineer of it, haha
08:48<G>well MCITP now...
08:48<Deezire>Main problem i've seen with microsoft products is that if you're not a HUGE client they will just tell you to reinstall it.
08:48<Marius>I'm now looking at the IIS front page, it has big flashy buttons for everything...
08:49<G>worked for a training company, it was really suspect when students went on a 2 week holiday and came back passing all 3 MCSA exams w/o even getting the study materials :P
08:49-!-mathew [] has joined #linode
08:49<Marius>G, the MCSA is a joke though
08:49<Marius>some 10 year old mexican girl did it online and passed :P
08:50<Marius>MCSE is a bit harder, but still a joke imho
08:50<G>(especially when they strugled to pass any of the pre-req modules :)
08:50*snubby packs up a bag and gets a rocket ready to terraform mars
08:50<linbot>New news from forums: [Ubuntu 10.04] kernel: imklog: Cannot read proc file system in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
08:50<hobot>I worked for MSCE guys
08:50<Marius>hmm, I cna't find the big flashy "SQL" button in my IIS!
08:50<hobot>they didnt know crap about crap
08:50<Marius>THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!
08:50<Deezire>The problem with the tests is that things like "what does DHCP stand for" counts more than (if they even ask) "What does DHCP do?"
08:50<G>Cisco exams are pretty good though
08:50<G>Deezire: haha yeah
08:50<Marius>Never done a cisco one, I've heard rumors though
08:51<G>Deezire: CompTIA questions are that style too
08:51<Marius>My favorite question was "What does a firewall do"
08:51<Deezire>Cisco is timed with multple choices and more correct answers.
08:51<Marius>someone answered "keeps shit out" and passed...
08:51<Deezire>A friend of mine is CCNP, and he said it was pretty brainfuck.
08:51<hobot>yeah I have a few ccna friends who cried about it
08:51<G>glad I got my CompTIA certs before they brought in the whole "you have to renew it"
08:52<Marius>you knwo what's even more hilarious then an MCSA ?
08:52<Marius>people who write on their CV and brag about having the "computer license"
08:52<Deezire>hehehe, datakortet in good norwegian?
08:52<Marius>it's a stupid piece of paper that says you know how to make bold and italics in word etc, and people pay ~2000 USD for that crap
08:52<hobot>like the eula?
08:52<Marius>Deezire: yup =P
08:52<Deezire>It's a government issued thing we have in norway.
08:52<G>the Cisco exams are pretty good (especially CCNP upwards) the simulated questions are really good
08:52<MarkJ>lol. Some people SHOULD have a license to use a computer though :p
08:52<Marius>government issues ?
08:52<Marius>really o_O
08:52<hobot>some people need a license
08:52<Marius>I didn't know that part
08:53<G>Marius: oh you mean thet International Computer Drivers License thing they do in High Schools?
08:53<Deezire>Yeah, eksamenskontoret manages it.
08:53<MarkJ>The extent of idiocy in dealing with some clients... it'd be better if they couldn't get one :p
08:53<hobot>I can make things bold because I know what the bold button looks like
08:53<Deezire>Most of it is pretty untranslateable to english, though :-/
08:53<Marius>if you tried, brains would explode.
08:54<G>but yeah, I find the CCNx exams the best of the instantly marked exams
08:54<Marius>This doens't explain where my big flashy SQL button is though!
08:54<G>the Red Hat exams are imo the best, as they are highly practical
08:54<MarkJ>I was looking at J2SE cert ages ago, but never did that, so only have tertiary IT degrees rather than industry certs.
08:54<Marius>I had to do read hat for my MCSE
08:54<G>if you don't know how to do something or read instructions you will fail :)
08:54<MarkJ>Not that people pay attention to them, things change so fast chances are it'll be obsolete by the time you get a job with it
08:54<Deezire>I did a neste-if with 80 statements in it in excel the other day. I guess the examinator of "datakortet" would cum, instantly.
08:55<G>Marius: Red Hat, not read hat
08:55<Marius>sorry, typo
08:55<Marius>*red hate
08:55<Marius>(I do not like red hat)
08:55<Deezire>Red hat is nice if you need PCI compliances
08:55<G>Marius: Red Hat exams have no relevance to MS exams
08:56<Marius>didn't MS buy up red hat though?
08:56<G>but yeah, the Red Hat exams prove that you know what you are doing
08:56<G>Marius: what are you smoking?
08:56<Marius>and yeah, for the *E, I had to do server 03, windows xp (wtf?) and red hat
08:56<Marius>don't ask, it makes no sense...
08:56<MarkJ>MS buy RedHat? That'd be scary
08:57<Deezire>In the end most exams don't mean shit. It's what you know that is important.
08:57<hobot>you might be thinking of the cross certification program
08:57-!-silence [] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
08:57<G>seriously, Red Hat exams are strictly Linux based, Microsoft Exams, especially MCSA/E were: Microsoft Client (XP/Vista/7) + 2-5 Server exams
08:57<hobot>but ms never bought them
08:57<Marius>hobot, that might be it, yes
08:57<G>hobot: I'm pretty sure Microsoft don't even do cross certification w/ RH
08:58<hobot>yep they do
08:58<MarkJ>Wow, can't say I'm surprised at this though
08:58<MarkJ>Windows is better than a competitor? No wayzor
08:58<G>hobot: that is hardware certification
08:58<G>hobot: not professional certification
08:58<hobot>oh sorry, yeah I didnt mean like a cert you get
08:59<G>hobot: i.e. Red Hat Enterprise Linux is certified on Hyper-V etc, and Windows Server is certified on RHEL virt environments
09:00-!-awnstudio_ [] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> <- s0 d4Mn l33t |t'z 5c4rY!]
09:00<G>the only external certifications that Microsoft consider relevant for professional certification are CompTIA exams (at least when I did MCSA)
09:00<hobot>man this is some serious fud from the compare page
09:01-!-bigjocker [~ngranek@] has joined #linode
09:01<G>hobot: haha, yeah
09:01<G>under reliability makes me laugh
09:02<G>"Don't touch that package" well in the Windows world you can't even MODIFY anything
09:02<hobot>I remember I was working at that ms shop and ms pushed out an update that disabled outlook sending and receiving email for like 3 days
09:03<G>hobot: there are a couple of points I agree with though
09:03<hobot>yeah they couldnt make it 100% bs
09:03<G>(Having worked at RH personally and experienced some of it)
09:03<MarkJ>So many laughable points in that page
09:03<Marius>it ain't fun until AVG/McAfee push updates that delete window core files :P
09:04<MarkJ>I love their part about choice being vendor specific.. wth, you can install any packages you want, or install/run/compile anything else
09:04<@jed>you know, with policy, there isn't much you can't modify in windows
09:04<G>MarkJ: they are talking about rebuilding packages included in RHEL
09:04<G>MarkJ: which technically violated the support agreement
09:05<hobot>because then it is built non-standard
09:05<hobot>I assume
09:05<G>hobot: basically
09:06<MarkJ>I don't see how many problems there'd be, apart from some different default settings in some packages
09:06<G>the silly thing is, normally if that was the case, RH asks if they can reproduce the issue w/ the normal libraries/binaries/etc on a test machine etc (if we couldn't reproduce it w/ the normal packages)
09:07<MarkJ>It's not like Evolution will have different features in each distro
09:07<G>MarkJ: well there are things like, rebuild sendmail for vague option X
09:08<MarkJ>Included code as opposed to changing a default option?
09:08<Marius>man, windows server is so damn SLOW at rebooting
09:08<hobot>its because its designed to only reboot once a year
09:08<G>the worst thing to do on a supported system like that though, is to enable a repo that had backported versions of supported packages
09:09<G>which meant that a yum -y update meant that they were running a system w/ about 15% of the packages unsupported
09:10<G>MarkJ: as in, downloading the source RPM, changing the specfile/adding weird patches off the net etc, then rebuilding & installing
09:10<MarkJ>I guess that's a worst case scenario though. I would say 99% of what you use will work the same on any distro.
09:10<G>MarkJ: sure
09:10<MarkJ>Yeah, I wouldn't have thought there'd be much in terms of distro specific changes
09:10<G>MarkJ: but keep in mind, for ages RHEL5 didn't support FUSE
09:10<MarkJ>Missing packages from one repo more likely
09:10<G>(I think it got supported in Update 3 or 4)
09:11-!-oru_work [] has joined #linode
09:11<G>MarkJ: nah, normally all people do is install third party kernel modules to support say Oracle DB/EMC stuff etc
09:11<Marius>interesting, they even raided an university aparently
09:11<G>(I'm not critizing Red Hat by the way, great company to work for, and great software)
09:12<MarkJ>Really? I didn't think you'd need kernel patches/modules to run Oracle/DB2..
09:12<MarkJ>Maybe a few packages/libraries
09:12<G>MarkJ: technically you don't, but Oracle clustering (RAC) normally gets you to install kernel modules etc
09:13<G>MarkJ: pretty sure a default single server/DB Oracle env doesn't require too much custom stuff (Oracle-XE certainly doesn't)
09:13<G>MarkJ: but stuff like Oracle RAC may do
09:14<MarkJ>Fair enough, haven't played with any clustering stuff.
09:14<MarkJ>Nonetheless this kind of thing is up the "exception" end of the spectrum rather than the rule
09:15<Deezire>Marius: I love how PRQ said they have no record of who owns what ipaddress :p
09:15<MarkJ>If you're just setting up mail servers with postfix it'll be a different issue
09:15<G>MarkJ: sure
09:16<MarkJ>One thing I hated was RHN speed, so freaking slow, even with a subscription
09:16<G>oh the other common ones, are when Dell/HP/etc say "You have to install <bleh> on your linux machine for the hardware to be supported" which installs modules etc that override/replace default modules, and sometimes install modules that weren't needed
09:16<G>MarkJ: tried it recently?
09:17<MarkJ>No, using debian based systems now. Last runnign RHEL late 2007
09:17<G>MarkJ: RHEL4u8/RHEL5u4 includes CDN support
09:17-!-herve [] has quit [Quit: herve]
09:18<MarkJ>Closest thing would be a Centos VPS with CPanel I have here in Oz
09:20*Nova is currently developing a new identity management / age verification front end GUI to connect to his main database which he will then begin licensing to his clients
09:21<deejoe>wow, how many times does that wheel need to be re-invented?
09:22<Marius>Deezire: I love it as well, what bothers me is that they raided in Norway as well aparently
09:22<G>deejoe: I was thinking similar
09:23-!-spaceduck [] has joined #linode
09:23<deejoe>Nova: less a comment on you than on the culture in general
09:24<Marius>what's googles DNS again, isn't it and ?
09:24<tjfontaine> and
09:24<coobra>Marius: google it hahha
09:24<Nova>deejoe: its not AVS its more of a system for compliance and patriot act issues
09:24<Marius>I tjfontaine'd it ;P
09:24<deejoe>Nova: even so, those are ubiquitous requirements, aren't they?
09:24-!-DesertPanther [~Khalid@] has joined #linode
09:25<Nova>My clients dont seem to think so
09:25<deejoe>Nova: well, good for you then, I guess.
09:25<Nova>they pay $3.50 for a online verification and $5.55 for offline verification
09:25<Nova>not to mention a $200 setup fee
09:25<deejoe>to whom do they pay this?
09:25<Nova>they pay it to me
09:26<Nova>I outsource all processing to india
09:26<linbot>New news from forums: DNS Manager Feature Request in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
09:26<MarkJ>That'd go down well
09:27<Nova>MarkJ: What?
09:27<G>jed: hahaha nice one! :)
09:27<MarkJ>Sending sensitive details to India
09:28<randallman>Everybody does it :)
09:28<Nova>We limit what we send to india
09:29<Daevien>randallman: your office here survived the "hurricane". prob had you worried before it? :p
09:29<Marius>"Windows found a problem with your internet connection that cannot be solved automatically. Please click here to go to the microsoft website for instructions on how to solve this manually"
09:29<Marius>awesome, I have no internet, but I can find out how ti fix it by goin online!
09:30<MarkJ>That was well though out
09:30<randallman>Daevien, wasnt sure what was going to happen
09:30<randallman>Daevien: so I assume based on the ""'s that it was a non-event?
09:30-!-Nova [NovaSleep@] has quit []
09:30<G>MarkJ: haha nice
09:30<G>errr Marius
09:31<randallman>We put the instructions on how to restart the wiki, in the wiki :)
09:31<randallman>and it crashed one day :)
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09:31<Daevien>randallman: we got a tiny bit of wind and a bit of rain, couple hours later bright sunshine warm day. halifax got clobbered, like 160k people in halifax area or further in out of power, etc.
09:32<randallman>so it was a trajectory thang :)
09:32<Daevien>it was supposed to make landfall like right at us but got lost in teh fog or something
09:33<randallman>we didnt even get but like 10 drops of rain
09:33<randallman>in the philly area
09:33<randallman>I guess the shores got a bit more
09:33<Daevien>like maybe 30 mins of light rain, some dark clouds and nothign special wind
09:33<Daevien>it was kind of disappointing to be honest
09:34<Daevien>all sorts of buildup to omg it's coming right at us.. adn we get nothing
09:34<randallman><southpark>Its comin right at us</southpark>
09:35<mwalling>randallman: still drunk?
09:35<randallman>You? :P
09:35<G>jed: any updates on native IPv6 yet? :P
09:35-!-elfgoh [] has joined #linode
09:35<mwalling>ah, with BarkerJr's inciteful comment
09:36<Nivex>yeah, I was hoping for some more... active ideas
09:37<tjfontaine>ha ha ha, active ideas from trolls
09:37<linbot>New news from forums: A very easy question (I hope) in Linux Networking <>
09:37<G>Nivex: sure but that was last really updated in July
09:37<Nivex>G: then I guess the answer to your question is "No"
09:38-!-orudie [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:38<Marius>Deezire: did you read, they performed house razzias in norway, belgium, italy and the UK as well?
09:38<Deezire>Yeah, i heard.
09:38<Nivex>tjfontaine: I didn't feel like he was trolling. Unfortunately there's not a lot we can really do as customers it seems
09:38<Deezire>Not that i really care, as long as they are not waiting for me at home, heh.
09:38<Marius>my thought exactly
09:39<tjfontaine>Nivex: history as troll imo
09:39<Nivex>tjfontaine: ah, that I am not aware of
09:39<@jed>the rate at which we purchase isn't going to affect IPv6 either
09:39<@jed>I mean, just saying
09:40<mwalling>i'm going to slicehost. then linode will have to get ip6
09:41<G>jed: so yeah, any hints about IPv6? :)
09:41<mwalling>you coming too SpaceHobo ?
09:41<Daevien>jed: tell them you'll send mikegrb to harass them unless they get ipv6?
09:45<Marius>wow, I'm sure being loved today
09:45<Marius>my phone wont stop ringing
09:47<mwalling>leave it off the hook
09:48*Daevien stomps on Marius' phone
09:48<Daevien>no more calls
09:48<G>Daevien: shotgun would be just as effective, if not more
09:49<hobot>also mnore fun
09:50<hobot>mnore, the new way to spell more
09:50<Daevien>is that like manure?
09:51<Marius>mwalling: off the hook?
09:51<Marius>Where are you, the 80's ?
09:51-!-Shishire [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:52<Daevien>he's a fan of disco too, so yeah
09:57<@jed>Marius: mwalling is off the hook, fool
09:58-!-jimcooncat [] has joined #linode
09:58<amitz>Marius: ..I never knew english has that vocab, razzia...
10:01<hobot>as in what time line are you in
10:02<amitz>hobot: to me?
10:02<hobot>I think Marius is talking to mwalling
10:02<hobot>I was talking to you about vocab
10:05<amitz>hobot: I've never heard that word spoken in english in my entire life. I'm pretty surprised Marius could say it and nobody blinks.
10:05<Marius>jed, there is that :P
10:06<hobot>which word
10:06<amitz>hobot: razzia
10:06<hobot>that isnt english but we use it
10:06<hobot>its from the arabic word iirc
10:07<hawk>But it's not the normal word for it, though... Normally for the same kind of thing, "raid" is used, no?
10:07<hobot>Marius is a smarty pants though
10:08<Marius>I'm smert and speak arabic!
10:08-!-dajhorn [] has joined #linode
10:09<hawk>Or Norweigan... "same same but different", right?
10:09<amitz>Indonesian language absorbs way too many words, I no longer able to differentiate the origin of many other words. But I suspect we got it from french, since it sounds more similar to razzia? oh well.
10:10<amitz>s/no longer/un/
10:11<amitz>instead of directly from arabic.
10:12<Marius>well, time to head home!
10:13<amitz>Marius: watch your back.
10:13<Marius>yeah, not yet
10:13<Marius>just ticked in an email
10:13<Marius>client claims I've been stealing domains o_O
10:13<Marius>which is funny, since all the domains are still in their name with no reference to me at all
10:13<Marius>When this was pointed out, I aparently moved them to my gmail account (wtf?)
10:14-!-sm_ [] has joined #linode
10:16<tjfontaine>no thanks
10:16<Marius>nono, the raid
10:16<Marius>they've taken someones computers and are charging him
10:16<Marius>the only inforamtion they've given is the region
10:16<Marius>'s my region...
10:17<Marius>brb, checking if my machines are alive or if I should jsut make a run for it
10:17<amitz>Marius: watch your back.
10:17<Marius>amitz knew!
10:17<Marius>I'll be he's the one that ratted me out, bastard! :P
10:17<zibri>marius: .se?
10:17-!-oftc_net [] has joined #linode
10:17<oftc_net>Good morning
10:17<Marius>opk, I'm fine
10:17-!-jimmybaker [] has joined #linode
10:18<Marius>they raided a guy because he used IRC to chat about file sharing
10:18<jimmybaker>is there something wrong in the dallas datacenter?
10:18<zibri>marius: oh
10:18<oftc_net>I've configured arno-iptables-firewall with a very basic config but when I start the service I'm getting: iptables: No chain/target/match by that name
10:18<oftc_net>any suggestions?
10:18<Marius>They struck against an "object" beleived to be part of a larger network operating over IRC"
10:18<oftc_net>gah, brb
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10:19<hawk>Marius: oooh... over irc
10:19<chesty>dmckenna: i believe there is a kernel module missing from the linode kernels
10:19<Marius>yeah, DANGEROUS!
10:20-!-sm [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:20-!-sm_ is now known as sm
10:20<zibri>irc is serious business.
10:20<dmckenna>chesty: gah :\
10:20<hobot>well listen to him
10:20<amitz>I believe the largest crime syndication in the world also operates over email.
10:20<mwalling>dmckenna: check /proc/config.gz, it might be built-in
10:21<mwalling>although you'd be getting something else for an error message, so i'll shut up
10:21<Marius>amitz: the mafia does snail mail, they're hard core
10:21<linbot>mwalling: [mtr] 11 hops, ???: 100.0%/0.0ms
10:21-!-atula [~atula@] has joined #linode
10:21<@irgeek>chesty: Which module?
10:21<Marius>"For roughly two years the belgian federal police has been infiltrating a group know as "The scene""
10:21<Marius>I lol'd
10:22<linbot>mwalling: [mtr] 11 hops, no loss, last hop average RTT was 40.1ms
10:22<mwalling>jimmybaker: ^^ doesnt look like it
10:22<linbot>mtr combines the functionality of traceroute and ping into one easy to use tool, and the output can be useful for determining where the source of a problem is. It can be downloaded from or for Windows. MTR summaries can be retrieved in-channel using the command !mtr-CITY where CITY is fremont, atlanta, newark, dallas or london.
10:22<mwalling>jimmybaker: ^^
10:22<chesty>irgeek: let me google, it's in the logs
10:22<@irgeek>I know the CentOS iptables script fails with newer kernels because there's a new chain it doesn't know what to do with.
10:24<dmckenna>irgeek: I'm using on Ubuntu 9.04
10:24<@jed>oh my god! a security table! SIGBUS
10:29-!-orudie [] has joined #linode
10:32<chesty>irgeek: i think it was DSCP and or TOS, but I can't find a config.gz to test
10:32-!-orudie_ [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
10:34<chesty>it's pretty easy to spot, anyway, all the ones around it are =y, and two are =n
10:35<chesty>dmckenna: did you mean 10.04?
10:35<chesty>cause if you're running 9.04, it's probably something else
10:35-!-silence [] has joined #linode
10:35<chesty>suddenly silence entered the room
10:36<dmckenna>chesty: erm, the second 2009 release.. whichever one that was.
10:36<chesty>dmckenna: pastebin the full output?
10:37<dmckenna>chesty: it just says: Starting Arno's Iptables Firewall...(1) iptables: No chain/target/match by that name.
10:37<dmckenna>it repeats the last part about 50 times
10:38<dmckenna>then: ERROR: Not all firewall rules are applied.
10:38<chesty>nothing before about missing modules?
10:38<chesty>try bash -x /etc/init.d/arno* start
10:39<dmckenna>much more useful :)
10:41<dmckenna>Module "ip_tables" not found.
10:41<mwalling>that might be ok
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10:43<JshWright>Hmm... looks like it's going to be between the Droid X and the Galaxy S come upgrade time in October...
10:43<dmckenna>the full output:
10:44-!-Shishire [~shishire@] has joined #linode
10:45<chesty>dmckenna: zgrep TOS /proc/config.gz
10:47<chesty>just those three?
10:48-!-burningdog [] has joined #linode
10:48-!-buser [] has joined #linode
10:49<@irgeek>ipt_TOS is in DSCP
10:50<amitz>JshWright: what?! god dammit -_-
10:51-!-orudie_ [] has joined #linode
10:51<JshWright>amitz: ?
10:52*tjfontaine spirals into TMBBG fitz of happiness
10:52<amitz>JshWright: note really understand but are you saying update to froyo (2.2) is delayed until october?
10:52<tjfontaine>gawd I give up
10:52<JshWright>amitz: no, I'm saying I can upgrade in October
10:52<JshWright>upgrade to a new phone, that is
10:53<amitz>JshWright: make sure that the android update fix the GPS of samsung galaxy s, fyi.
10:54-!-vsnine [] has joined #linode
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10:54<JshWright>amitz: there are obviously pros and cons for each phone
10:54<JshWright>I'm hoping 2.2 will be standard on both by October
10:55<@Perihelion>Why would she want a birdhouse in her soul?
10:55<amitz>JshWright: well, a really badly working GPS may be a serious show stopper.
10:55<tjfontaine>I'm not actually your friend but I am
10:56<Deezire>by end of october i bet we'll see gingerbread coming to form
10:56<JshWright>amitz: but an e-fuse on the bootloader is pretty sucky too
10:56<Deezire>The joy of having a Nexus One <3
10:56<tjfontaine>my story's infinite
10:56<@Perihelion>Someone broke pparadis
10:56<@Perihelion>Well, made him moar broked
10:57<amitz>JshWright: ah, yes.... I heard about the dreaded e-fuse. Hopefully it's not as permanenet as I thought.
10:58<tjfontaine>you can reblow an efuse
10:58-!-orudie [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:58<tjfontaine>see: xbox360
10:58<amitz>Deezire: not available here -_-
10:58<amitz>tjfontaine: perhaps it will depend?
10:59<G>Perihelion: oh that doesn't sound good
10:59<Deezire>amitz: i bought mine via singapore
10:59<Deezire>best and cheapest phone i've ever had :p
11:00<G>pparadis: so you are related to a lighthouse operator?
11:01<@pparadis>I'D BE FIRED IF THAT WERE MY JOB
11:01<@pparadis>(THOUGH I RESPECT THAT A LOT)
11:01<G>pparadis: I said related to, not am
11:03<amitz>Deezire: my samsung is the most expensive phone I've ever I must squeeze the features to the end -_-
11:03<dmckenna>am just going with plain iptable for now
11:03<dmckenna>thanks for your help everyone
11:03-!-dmckenna [] has left #linode []
11:04<chesty>irgeek: DSCP isn't set
11:04<amitz>Deezire: I'm planning to make it a netbook replacement :-p
11:04<@Perihelion>I <3 my netbook
11:04<mwalling>i <3 urmom
11:05-!-sshaw [~decriptor@] has joined #linode
11:05<@Perihelion>So does half of Virginia
11:05<chesty>my mum loves me
11:05<G>damn, some of these ones that attempt brute force attacks are silly
11:05*tjfontaine is sure Perihelion just said vagina
11:05<G>"dovecot: imap-login: Disconnected (tried to use disabled plaintext auth)"
11:06<G>surely dovecot tells them that plaintext is disabled right?
11:06<tjfontaine>ha ha
11:06<tjfontaine>G: do you presume to believe they use DNS as well?
11:06<amitz>Perihelion: I'm sorry, I'll have to hate my netbook to resolve this cognitive dissonance of paying too much for a god damn cellphone -_-
11:06<G>tjfontaine: of course not, that'd be smart
11:07<amitz>Perihelion: and your netbook.
11:08-!-karstensrage_alt [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:08<G>hmmm do Comcast listen to abuse reports?
11:10<amitz>G: perhaps you're asking the wrong question :-p
11:11<G>amitz: okay... "do Comcast listen to anything?"
11:13<praetorian>prehaps you are asking a tautology
11:13<amitz>G: well, more like "do they take action on abuse report?". Perhaps they just make image files on the emails, and run them as changing backgrounds on their desktops :-p
11:14<amitz>umm.. I didn't answer the question. Perhaps they just read them but have no plan to take any action, *shrug*
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11:21<Alan_>Is there a way to do a non-toplevel wildcard DNS entry?
11:21<Alan_>i.e. *
11:21-!-jameswilson1 [~jameswils@] has joined #linode
11:21<G>Alan_: sure
11:21<chesty>first create a zone called
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11:24<Alan_>will i then have to addNS records for the new zone?
11:24<Alan_>and then treat the new zone like any other domain?
11:24<amitz>job ad wtf of the day: Supervisor Programmer Analyst.
11:24<G>chesty: actually, iirc you don't have to go that far
11:25<G>chesty: iirc it's possible to do a wildcard like that without delegating a single record zone
11:25<Alan_>G: how then?
11:25<chesty>G: it's an easy thing to test
11:25<Shishire> /cry. I just had a web developer send me 3 ssh keys. All 3 contained both the private and public keys. I'm supposed to give them access to my server. :(
11:25<Alan_>G: *.foo get's rejected...
11:25<G>Alan_: argh, oh well, create a zone
11:26<Alan_>Shishire: :(
11:26<G>I'm sure it used to be possible on one version
11:26<amitz>Shishire: hahaha
11:26<chesty>it's possible in bind, not in linode dns manager
11:26<Shishire>The thing is, I'm a web-dev too. I know better. They should to. :(
11:28<amitz>just realized, depending on the need, can I use ssh's "force command" to force a ssh-ing user to a chroooot environment?
11:28-!-cereal [] has joined #linode
11:28<amitz>that's reasonably secure, right?
11:28<Alan_>G: so what do i do? just create the new zone, remove the single-host entry from the old zone, and point "" and "*" at the IP address i want everything to go to?
11:29-!-orudie [] has joined #linode
11:30<praetorian>web dev eh?
11:30<praetorian>have you shard'ed your /dev/null ?
11:30*Nivex chuckles at praetorian
11:31<G>Alan_: so you are using the linode DNS?
11:31<Alan_>G: yes
11:31<G>Alan_: create a new zone for
11:32<G>add a record in there for and * (so blank and * iirc)
11:32<Alan_>G: that's what i've done
11:32<G>then in define 2-4 NS records as: foo NS, foo NS
11:33<G>and then it _should_ be okay
11:34<Alan_>that's the bit that's missing
11:34<chesty>praetorian: copy cat
11:34<Alan_>need those bits to delegate the DNS for that subdomain? even though it's being delegated to the same place...
11:34<praetorian>chesty: ~
11:34<G>Alan_: yep
11:36-!-materdaddy [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:36<Alan_>lets see what happens
11:36-!-orudie_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:36-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@] has joined #linode
11:37<hobot>man mp
11:38<Alan_>time to wait for the linode DNS to update to see if it workend...
11:38<praetorian>`Now I'm cleaning a cistern of chicken shit. But I don't care as i don't have to listen to the NoSQL reciting the feature list of their feature of their schema free database'
11:39*praetorian giggles some more
11:39<@irgeek>Alan_: You actually don't *need* the NS records. Adding the zone and the wildcard works.
11:39<mwalling>i never understood the nosql thing
11:40<mwalling>the only thing i see it useful for is stuff like email
11:40<Alan_>irgeek: no it doesn't
11:40<Alan_>not according to actual results when trying it...
11:40<Alan_>no address
11:41-!-buser [] has quit [Quit: buser]
11:41<mwalling>Alan_: how long did you wait to try that after working in the control panel?
11:41<@irgeek>Alan_: 86400 IN A
11:42-!-buser [] has joined #linode
11:42<Alan_>irgeek: yup, and you know what's changed?
11:42<Alan_>putting the NS records in for the subdomain
11:42<Alan_>irgeek: between my last request and yours, the DNS got updated
11:42<Alan_>... or did it?
11:42<Alan_>it didn't?
11:42<Alan_>lag in the DNS servers?
11:43<amitz>at this rate, debian will never be released this year -_-
11:43-!-DesertPanther_ [~Khalid@] has joined #linode
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11:44<@irgeek>Alan_: dig +trace
11:45<@irgeek>There's no step where we get referred to ns{1..5} for
11:45<@irgeek>As soon as it gets to one of them, there's an answer.
11:47-!-materdaddy [] has joined #linode
11:48<Alan_>mwalling: i waited until there was a new "last generated" time for both
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11:49<Alan_>irgeek: I guess if i put the NS records in the sone for, then there are 2 zones providing the same NS records on the same server?
11:49-!-DesertPanther [~Khalid@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:50-!-Aka [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
11:50<Alan_>and therefore linode's dns already knows where to find the subdomain without referring
11:50-!-Aka [] has joined #linode
11:50<Alan_>that makes sense
11:50<Alan_>I guess i just got burned by lag in the DNS servers updating, assuming that the "last generated time" meant it had been updated...
11:51<Alan_>Well thanks for the help :)
11:51-!-ojacobson [~ojacobson@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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11:53<Alan_>Will specific records override wildcard records?
11:54<@caker>another A record?
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11:54<Alan_>If i have a * A record, but also a foo A record
11:55<Alan_>that goes somewhere different
11:55-!-chemosh [] has quit [Quit: chemosh]
11:55<Alan_>is it certain that foo will go there, or might it get the wildcard address instead?
11:55<@caker>it is certain
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11:56<@Perihelion>OUTLOOK NOT SO GOOD
11:57<Alan_>caker: cool, thanks :)
11:57<Alan_>I was worried 
11:58-!-orudie [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:58<G>Perihelion: sounds like New Zealand you are describing there
11:58<Alan_>that it might be one of those undefined things...
11:58<@Perihelion>G: -_-
11:58-!-cereal [] has joined #linode
12:00<randallman>11:55 <@caker> it is certain
12:00<mwalling>Alan_: it takes time for the nameservers to reload after the zone is generated
12:00<randallman>Ask again later! :p
12:00<randallman>Query: why not use PowerDNS w/ a RDBMS backend? :P
12:00<G>Perihelion: well in the last 7 days, we've had a giant earthquake in one region + many medium aftershocks, 2 medium/small earthquakes in another completely different region (diff fault line & everything), 1 small earthquake in another region again, a air crash killing 9 instantly... what are you thinking will be happening next?
12:00<randallman>changes propagate as quickly as you can get them database replicated
12:00<G>Perihelion: the Apocalypse?
12:01<randallman>Earth Crustal Displacement :)
12:03<linbot>New news from forums: Apache errors and fail2ban in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
12:03<@Perihelion>G: Second coming of Christ, obviously.
12:03<@Perihelion>Prepare yourselves.
12:03-!-jimcooncat [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
12:06<pharaun>what about the third coming of christ? :-p
12:06<Chris___>THAT'S ME! :D
12:06<mwalling>god save us
12:08-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
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12:16<linbot>New news from forums: Using the Backup Service with Ubuntu's Private Directory in General Discussion <>
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12:17<amitz>Perihelion: I hope I won't regret ever saying this but that's a pretty saddening live, coming once in your whole life :-p
12:18<G>amitz: ewwww punny
12:18-!-orudie_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:18<amitz>for guy of course. -_-
12:19<G>and that is me for today
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12:46<linbot>New news from forums: setquota: Mountpoint (or device) / not found. in General Discussion <>
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13:24<DesertPanther_>is it okay to use BOINC on my linode? :/
13:24<amitz>DesertPanther_: pretty sure no.
13:24<DesertPanther_>even if I limited resources to it?
13:24<tjfontaine>even if it's niced, it's not nice
13:25<tjfontaine>as in polite
13:25<cmayo>i fucking hate att
13:25<straterra>Whats wrong with boinc?
13:25<DesertPanther_>eat resources...
13:25<tjfontaine>straterra: on your personal equipment, nothing at all
13:25<amitz>tjfontaine: for the second nice.
13:26<DesertPanther_>so it is not okay at all to run BOINC on a VPS?
13:26<straterra>AFAIK, unless its effecting other customers..they don't care what you run
13:26<tjfontaine>yes, but boinc and seti have been explicitly mentioned
13:26<@jed>DesertPanther_: as the environment is shared, I would consider it a disservice to your neighbors, since the entire goal of distributed computing is to use unused cycles
13:26<pharaun>tjfontaine: by linode?
13:27<@jed>that said, it /is/ legal, but we'd strongly prefer that you didn't
13:27<DesertPanther_>alright, I won't, thanks guys :)
13:27<@jed>I mean, a strict interpretation of the ToS says you can do it, but we will probably notice (as will your neighbors) and tickets will probably be opened
13:27<@jed>please don't make us add it to the ToS
13:27<pharaun>well if you do get one of those 14-20gb of ram linode, that is on their own machine, you can probably :-p
13:28<DesertPanther_>jed, well, I understood that I can limit resources to it
13:28<@jed>it just burns CPU, right?
13:28<straterra>I use my linode with distcc/icecream
13:28<hawk>jed: Afaik that's what it does
13:28<tjfontaine>limiting resources inside the VPS doesn't correlate necessarily to limiting resources on the host
13:28-!-Shishire [~shishire@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:29<pharaun>tjfontaine: how so?
13:29<tjfontaine>because the hypervisor doesn't know about your nice-perse
13:29<tjfontaine>jsut that your vps is asking for time
13:29<pharaun>ah right the whole nice thing, i was wondering bout that
13:29*path nices tjfontaine
13:29*tjfontaine enjoys
13:29<amitz>I notice linux developers love pun...
13:30<amitz>and recursions.
13:30-!-h [] has joined #linode
13:30<pharaun>amitz: and urmom
13:30-!-h [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:31<amitz>that too.
13:31-!-orudie [] has joined #linode
13:31-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has joined #linode
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13:32<straterra>It always strikes me as odd when people call Linux UNIX when Linux heavily uses GNU..
13:33<DesertPanther_>straterra, what is icecream?
13:33<HedgeMage>straterra: Most people don't understand the's a POSIX-based OS, they look the same to most people.
13:33<pharaun>straterra: how so? Isn't GNU borrowing the general toolset of "unix" :-p aka ls, cp, mv, etc....
13:33<straterra>pharaun: It's a clone..not a port or anything
13:33<pharaun>so it would look the same to most people
13:34-!-Shishire [~shishire@] has joined #linode
13:34<amitz>potayto, potahto.
13:34-!-orudie_ [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
13:34*HedgeMage notes that she doesn't run around saying "GNU/Linux" either.
13:34*amitz hides :-p
13:34<pharaun>straterra: yes if you want to be technical but if something uses the posix based api, it wouldn't matter to "most" people
13:35<straterra>My point is..if you mean Unix, say unix. If you mean Linux, say Linux. If you mean both, say *nix
13:35<pharaun>i suppose :)
13:35<Marius>i am once more on the phone
13:35<pharaun>oh on that topic, Solaris == unix, or something else?
13:36<straterra>Solaris is solaris :P
13:36<pharaun>i mean solaris has unix roots right?
13:36<tjfontaine>urmom loves my root
13:36<pharaun>roots tjfontaine's mom
13:36<amitz>linux is solaris clone. 3,2,1, go!
13:37<path>i don't like saying *nic
13:37<path>how do you pronounce that?
13:37<pharaun>path: you don't ;)
13:38<straterra>or unix-like
13:38<straterra>That works too
13:38<straterra>Linux is unix-like
13:38<pharaun>how about "Posix based system" :-p
13:38-!-kat_77 [] has joined #linode
13:38<straterra>That doesn't mean much
13:38<straterra>windows has a posix layer
13:38<pharaun>haha i know :-p
13:38<pharaun>its even more "generic"
13:38<straterra>Also, you have OSs like OSX that barely have POSIX compliance
13:39-!-Friction[2] [] has joined #linode
13:39<pharaun>speaking of the posix layer in windows, how good is it anyway?
13:39<straterra>Its easy to work around if you know its limitations, heh
13:39<pharaun>never played with it and always thought that it would be a piece of shit
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13:40<straterra>jed: Do you have FBSD supported on a Linode yet? :P
13:41-!-BP{k} [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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13:41<dcraig>any problems in the london DC?
13:41<straterra>Certainly looks that way
13:41<amitz>oh wait, that's SCO... nothing to do with solaris. A failed joke. /me returns to lurking.
13:41-!-tozz [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
13:41-!-jed2 [] has joined #linode
13:41<tkoskine>dcraig: I have some also.
13:41-!-Ueland_ [] has joined #linode
13:41<straterra>jed2: YOU BROKE LONDON
13:41-!-Frools [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:41<tkoskine>Other linode in Newark is ok, only London one is having very slow connection.
13:41-!-rHn_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:42<jed2>we're investigating london
13:42-!-Tiven_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:42-!-TheJoe [] has joined #linode
13:42<tjfontaine>jed2: you better.
13:42-!-jed is now known as Guest910
13:42-!-jed2 is now known as jed
13:42-!-Nicar [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:42-!-tozz [] has joined #linode
13:42<tjfontaine>off they go
13:42-!-Nicar [] has joined #linode
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13:43<jed>tjfontaine: or?
13:43-!-auau [] has joined #linode
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13:43<tjfontaine>jed: nothing
13:43-!-Marius [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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13:43<jed>leveling out?
13:43-!-mode/#linode [+o jed] by ChanServ
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13:44<mwalling>is nowish
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13:45<tkoskine>Connection to London is better now for me.
13:45<@jed>looks like routing wonky
13:45<straterra>Let's blame NAC
13:45-!-Ueland [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:45<straterra>I love blaming them
13:45<path>let's blame jed
13:45<@jed>path: maybe it's my excessive colon use, eh?
13:46<straterra>jed: CANADIAN
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13:48<@jed>looks fixed here
13:48<@jed>wonder what that was.
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13:49<Marius>my node died o_O
13:49<Marius>never experienced that before
13:50-!-axod [] has joined #linode
13:50*tjfontaine bops axod on the head
13:50<pharaun>london node? if so then its a causality of the london router wars ;)
13:50<Marius>that is why axod is here too
13:50*axod only arrives when there's packet loss :P
13:51-!-tktiddle [] has joined #linode
13:51<axod>hey tjfontaine hows it going
13:51<Marius>he only joins to bitch :p
13:51<axod>:( moi? would I
13:51<axod>I'm just glad that for once, it's not my fault
13:51<tjfontaine>axod: fine fine, don't forget to email support@oftc when you add/change ips
13:51<tktiddle>Hi can anyone point me in the right direction.. I have multiple domains pointing to my linode and I want to serve them seperate data...
13:52<@jed>Love and kisses, tjfontaine
13:52<Marius>only happened after you moved to london!
13:52<pharaun>tktiddle: webpage right?
13:52<tktiddle>yeah data = words and pictures via http
13:52<axod>tjfontaine: yup will do, I heard you were on the war path about that. Unfortunately we did not have an email set in our db for oftc :/ our bad
13:52<pharaun>tktiddle: then you want virtual domain in your webserver
13:52<Marius>first issue ever to poor cupcakes :(
13:53<tjfontaine>axod: no problem
13:53-!-techhelper1 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:53<Marius>yes, my uk node is named so, i was hungry when i up
13:53<tjfontaine>axod: I just don't like to mistakenly deny service unless I'm doing an akill *@*
13:53<axod>tjfontaine: I've updated the db so we now have listed. I doubt we'll change any IPs this year unless we have really unforseen circumstances
13:53<tjfontaine>axod: nod
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14:02<tuupola>hey this is a bit stoopid question but is not really clear from any docs
14:03<tuupola>even though linodes get their ip by default from dhcp I assume they get the same ip each boot and not just some random ip from dhcp pool
14:03<tuupola>though so, but just to be sure. thanks
14:04<whouweling>is it possible there was a short nameserver outage some minutes ago at the London facility?
14:05<Karrde>tuupola: it's called "reserved DHCP"
14:06<mwalling>tuupola: its called "make linode turnkeyawesome"
14:09<axod>whouweling: there was something afoot about 10 mins ago
14:09<axod>somewhere... anyway
14:09<tuupola>yeah I am impressed with linode. In progress of moving stuff from slicehost to linode.
14:10-!-kat_77 [] has quit [Quit: kat_77]
14:10<pharaun>*gasp* you dare say the dreaded s***** word!
14:10<pharaun>one must never mention that word around here ;)
14:10<tuupola>oops ok. "some other provider" ;)
14:10<tuupola>no wait that starts with s too
14:11<whouweling>axod: thex, then it wasn't my specific vps
14:11-!-weiminzhi [] has joined #linode
14:11<weiminzhi>Hello fellow linoders!
14:12<weiminzhi>these few days, I've been trying out some of linode's competition, and god do I feel sad for them ~_~
14:12<weiminzhi>it's crazy how above linode is on just about any account
14:12<weiminzhi>so a big congrats to the team. and thanks for a stellar service
14:13<@caker>! thanks, weiminzhi!
14:14<tjfontaine>only gets better
14:15<pharaun>indeed! one of the big thing that made me join linode in the first place was this irc channel + all of the support/options/feature :)
14:15-!-Alan_ [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:16<weiminzhi>I mean really... 4 cpu cores, the backup service, pv-grub, crazy good interface, performance is through the roof, IO is good... I can't fault it on anything! All that for two packs of cigs a month... Am I dreaming? ~_~
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14:17<path>wow, cigs are getting expensive
14:17<weiminzhi>yeah... definitly.
14:17<pharaun>i wonder what the tax percentage is on the cigs now >_>
14:18<weiminzhi>82% here currently
14:18<pharaun>it was already expensive enough that my parents were outsourcing their cig buying to another state 600 miles away -_-
14:18<pharaun>82% yikes
14:19<weiminzhi>I don't know about the states, this is in Martinique, French territory in the carribean
14:19<pharaun>ah? its probably getting dumb expensive here too in the states
14:20-!-tehdan [] has joined #linode
14:20<weiminzhi>if they ever reach 85%, I'me done. or wait... maybe 87%... :-p
14:20<tehdan>hi all - any network weirdness in London?
14:21<mwalling>there was
14:21<pharaun>just looked it up and the cig tax are weird here, its like "dollars" on top of cig
14:22<path>delaware is $1.60 for each pack of 20
14:22<path>other products are 15%
14:22<pharaun>additional $5.85 per pack, which means a single pack of cigarettes will cost up to $11.
14:22<path>other tobacco products..
14:23<pharaun>ny just bumped it up to 75% on tobacco, and $5ish for cigs
14:23*pharaun does not smoke but was curious
14:23-!-tktiddle [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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14:24<path>huh.. you are supposed to pay the tax if you bring more than 9 packs into the state
14:24<path>like that happens..
14:24<pharaun>hahah, like the "declare your sale tax on purchases online" thing
14:25<tjfontaine>what don't you do that?
14:25-!-tuquee [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:25<pharaun>i don't know anyone who does
14:25<pharaun>heck i don't even know if MA has that at all
14:25<path>i actually think people come to de to buy cigs to take to other states
14:26<pharaun>path: not surprised, looking at the ny tax
14:26<path>there was an article in the paper.. i'm not sure if it's still the case though
14:26<path>i think it goes back and forth between pa, de, and md
14:26<pharaun>probably will happen till they do like border inspection or all states in the area raise prices
14:26<pharaun>my parents when they smoked would import their cigs from missouri (600+ miles away) ugh
14:26-!-Ephialtes [] has joined #linode
14:27<linbot>Available Add-ons: Disk: $ 2 per 1GB/month. RAM: $ 5 per 90MB/month. Transfer: $ 10 per 100GB/month. IP: $ 1 per IP/month. To add extras:
14:27-!-dabear [] has joined #linode
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14:34<@Perihelion>I just lost the game.
14:34<tjfontaine>you can't lose if you don't play
14:35<pharaun>exactly, that's what i tell people who attempt to game me
14:36<@Perihelion>You are always playing.
14:36<pharaun>i opted out
14:38<Marius>this is almost as fun as ny isp's issues
14:45<amitz>i regret looking at #linode before i sleep. now i lost the game too ..
14:46<@pparadis>amitz: that seems to happen a lot with you
14:46<pharaun>amitz: look at it as a good way for you to ponder and wonder about the game :-p
14:47<amitz>pparadis: i play profesionally.
14:48-!-megatron27 [~firdaus@] has joined #linode
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14:50<amitz>tjfontaine: and seriously. although i still have't seen the money on this game yet, dang.
14:51<amitz>yes, we need a tournament.
14:51<megatron27>the new VMware server isn't bad...
14:52<megatron27>just a little strange to run it from a browser
14:53<straterra>Theres a new vmware server?
14:53<straterra>I'm..pretty sure Server isn't in active development
14:53<Daevien>esx 4.1 i think he means?
14:53<Daevien>which seems to have active directory support fo rth ehost, interesting
14:54<straterra>ESXi 4.1 is very nice
14:54-!-siculars [] has quit [Quit: siculars]
14:55<Daevien>i haven't used 4 or 4.1, didn't have gigabit nics it liked so i had bene using 3.5 til i flipped to citrix xenserver
14:55-!-RoosterJuice_ [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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15:04<@Perihelion>I can't hear islands in the stream without thinking of ghetto superstar -.-
15:04<customer>What happens to e-mails when my server is down? Will they get delivered later or get lost forever?
15:04-!-laser` [] has joined #linode
15:04<tjfontaine>Perihelion: dolly loves you
15:04<Solver>dolly the cloned sheep?
15:04<Solver>is she still around?
15:05<@Perihelion>tjfontaine: Actually it's the Bee Gees version :>
15:05<Solver>was dolly the original or the clone or both?
15:05<megatron27>well it's new if you were previously using the 1.0.x series
15:05<megatron27>which I tend to prefer
15:05<tjfontaine>Perihelion: blasphemey
15:05<@Perihelion>What? They wrote it.
15:06<tjfontaine>Perihelion: what do you call sweat in dollys cleaveage?
15:06<tjfontaine>mountain dew.
15:06<@Perihelion>I call it something that I don't wanna know about
15:07-!-tktiddle [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:09-!-customer [] has left #linode []
15:09<amitz>customer: the protocol says that the sending mail server should repeat the sending attempt.
15:09-!-zack_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:09<@jed>tjfontaine: hurrr
15:09<tjfontaine>jed: how can you tell dolly partons kids from everyone elses?
15:09<@jed>I don't know, how
15:09<tjfontaine>stretch marks on their mouths :P
15:10<@jed>oh, those aren't bad - I'd break out the Helen Keller if this weren't #linode
15:10<pharaun>jed: helen keller >_>
15:11<tjfontaine>why couldn't helen keller drive?
15:11-!-tktiddle [] has joined #linode
15:11<megatron27>I don't get that one
15:11<@jed>tjfontaine: couldn't reach the road?
15:11<tjfontaine>because she was a woman
15:11<amitz>tjfontaine: HAHAHA
15:12-!-segin [] has joined #linode
15:12<@Perihelion>Going from the Bee Gees to The Cars was an awesome move on the iPod's shuffle feature.
15:12<@Perihelion>I approve of this.
15:13<@jed>tjfontaine: how did helen keller burn her cheek?
15:13<@Perihelion>on the part of*
15:13<@Perihelion>English fail
15:13<amitz>tjfontaine: the laugh is for dolly parton joke btw ;-)
15:13<@jed>she answered the iron
15:13<Friction[2]>how do file hosts like rapidshare get away with charging so little for so much?
15:13<@Perihelion>I thought the sexist joke was moar bettar
15:13<@jed>how'd she burn the other one? they called back
15:13<Friction[2]>do they just count on the fact that most people won't fill 200GB of space?
15:13*jed goes to hell without passing Go
15:13<@Perihelion>I think they have mega ad space too
15:14<Friction[2]>where from?
15:14<megatron27>how much is it for 200GB
15:14<Friction[2]>i did the sums and it doesn't add up
15:14<Friction[2]>unless they have private servers
15:14-!-cereal_ [] has joined #linode
15:14-!-internalkernel [~internalk@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:14<@Perihelion>Don't they have ads on their pages?
15:14-!-cereal [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:14<Friction[2]>rapidshare doesn't
15:14<@Perihelion>When people download crap that is
15:14<@Perihelion>Hmm, dunno then.
15:14<pharaun>Friction[2]: look at mozy/carbonate/etc they charge like 5$ for unlimited or something
15:16<Friction[2]>backup services are different though
15:17<pharaun>Friction[2]: they still employ the same idea, they're betting on most people not using much space :-p
15:18<Friction[2]>mozy is 50c per GB per month though
15:18<pharaun>oh that's new
15:18<straterra>S3 is GREAT for backups
15:18<Friction[2]>that's 20c more than rackspace
15:18<straterra>I paid $2.50 last month
15:18<tjfontaine>stalkers are following me on twitter
15:18<pharaun>i use S3 myself for backups
15:19<Friction[2]>straterra, i thought their cheapest deal worked out to over $100
15:19<Friction[2]>a month
15:19<straterra>I back up both of my Linodes to S3 on the cheap
15:19<weiminzhi>s3 isnt ec2 ~_~
15:19<amitz>tjfontaine: I stalk professionally. and seriously. muahaha.
15:19<Friction[2]>then i'm still confused by their pricing
15:20<pharaun>Friction[2]: most amazon products are priced by usage
15:20<Friction[2]>i understand what cloud servers are
15:20<pharaun>Friction[2]: like S3 its ~15cent a gb to store stuff there for a month, i pay about $7 for 45-50ish gb
15:20<@caker>there is no such thing as a cloud server.
15:20*tjfontaine is now known as CLOUDtaine
15:20<pharaun>who here is being annoyed by the "cloud" being thrown around?
15:20<straterra>caker: Lies. 3g card + weather baloon + solar energy
15:21<Delph>pharaun: mem
15:21*Perihelion Pericloudion
15:21<Friction[2]>15c is cheap
15:21<@caker>Friction[2]: what's that for?
15:21<Yaakov>Err... YAAKLOUD
15:23<megatron27>VMWare server uses a gb of memory when it's not doing anything...hmm
15:23<Friction[2]>amazon needs an idiot proof slider price calculator like rackspace
15:23<pharaun>Friction[2]: slider price is not accurate
15:23<megatron27>what do you mean?
15:23<Friction[2]>why not?
15:24<pharaun>you got different pricing with S3, you got upload/download, storage, requests/gets/whatever, etc
15:24<Friction[2]>you only ever want an approximation
15:24<pharaun>Friction[2]: for what usage case?
15:24<Friction[2]>rackspace lets you enter how much ram, bandwidth, space you'll need and calculates the price for you
15:25<pharaun>amazon s3 has the same
15:25<Karrde>where's Friction[1]?
15:26<Friction[2]>i killed him
15:26<Solver>clones! :)
15:26<Friction[2]>bit strange to have no ram pricing. do you get unlimited ram for free?
15:26<Solver>or 0 ram for free :)
15:27<pharaun>Friction[2]: does that amazon calculator answer your question there :)
15:28<Friction[2]>yes thanks, except ram
15:28<pharaun>Friction[2]: you get unlimited ram as you approach ∞
15:28-!-cdlu [] has quit [Ping timeout: 600 seconds]
15:29-!-Ziggy` [] has joined #linode
15:29<pharaun>Friction[2]: what do you really need? if you need a VPS, then you would want linode, or amazon ec2 or something else, if you want just online storage, you want amazon S3
15:29<Friction[2]>i need lots of storage, bandwidth and probably ram
15:30<pharaun>why ram?
15:30<@caker>to get to the other side
15:30<Friction[2]>i do things like zip extraction
15:30<pharaun>Friction[2]: what is this for?
15:30<Friction[2]>it's a file hosting service
15:30<Marius>Seems to be a lot of those lately :P
15:31<pharaun>Friction[2]: ah k, then you will want something like S3 for storage, then a VPS for the processing end of things
15:31<Friction[2]>it's a hobby project really
15:31<Friction[2]>why the VPS?
15:31<hawk>Friction[2]: Because S3 is a pure storage service
15:31<pharaun>S3 is ONLY storage, it does not have a cpu/ram/etc for you to use, all you use S3 is for storing files/etc
15:31<Friction[2]>ok. well that makes life easier really :P
15:32<pharaun>its cheap storage yes but its still storage only
15:32<Friction[2]>how do you connect one domain to two ip's then?
15:33<pharaun>round robin
15:33<Friction[2]>if someone uploads on my domain and needs to be offered the download link with the same domain, but gets the file from another server
15:33<Friction[2]>round robin?
15:33<pharaun>with s3, you could 1) download it from s3 and stream to the user, but then that would chew up your bw, that's a no go,
15:34<pharaun>the other alternative i think has to do with dns/renaming, i wouldn't know details, i haven't looked into that, but you can probably redirect requests to your site for a file to the s3 storage service
15:34<pharaun>then the user would download the file directly from s3
15:34<pharaun>save your bw
15:34-!-weiminzhi [] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
15:35-!-allos[off] [] has joined #linode
15:35<path>well, you'll still need to pay s3 for bandwidth, but you won't be using yours twice.
15:35<allos[off]>Hi... I'm client and want to rent 1 new vps, has discount or promotial code?
15:35<pharaun>yeah, forgot that but still s3 costs are pretty cheap compared to adding bw to a VPS
15:36<pharaun>i think, i haven't done any price comparing
15:36<Delph>don't forget that it'll depend on the upload/download ratio
15:37<Delph>if you're doing upload to VPS, postprocess, upload to S3, then 302 requests to S3 to retrieve the content
15:38<Karrde>allos[off]: pay for a year or 2 years up front for a discount
15:38<Friction[2]>ok this is complicated
15:38-!-Daevien [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:38-!-Daevien [] has joined #linode
15:41<Friction[2]>couldn't i just use mod_rewrite?
15:41<pharaun>Friction[2]: for download requests? i think so, upload, no
15:42<Friction[2]>but with upload i'd just need to add it to the action parameter in the html form
15:42<Friction[2]>doesn't matter about using the ip there
15:42<hawk>Friction[2]: add "it"?
15:42<Friction[2]>the ip to the s3 server
15:42<Friction[2]>no wait
15:43-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has joined #linode
15:45<Friction[2]>but uploading seems to be a problem too, since i can't just send form requests to the storage server because it isn't a webserver
15:45<pharaun>this is only for download
15:45<Friction[2]>i know
15:45<pharaun>and on upload, you are right, you probably would have to upload the file to your server
15:45<pharaun>process it then send it to s3
15:45<pharaun>i think
15:46<Friction[2]>that would be twice as long uploads
15:47<Delph>do it offline in the background
15:47<Friction[2]>what do you mean?
15:47<pharaun>take the upload from the user
15:47<Delph>upload to your server, add to queue to be processed up to s3; requests while waiting for s3 to get the data get a "temporarily unavailable, try later" message (or just aren't visible yet)
15:47<pharaun>tell the user its done, then in the background, send it over to s3
15:48<Friction[2]>that could work
15:48-!-segin [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:48<Friction[2]>like an archiving thing
15:48<Delph>nothing fancy needed, just a holding directory of "files to send to s3", a bit of bash, and a cronjob
15:48<Delph>could even serve from that holding directory while you're waiting (but you want to /save/ bandwidth, so don't)
15:49<Friction[2]>i dono, maybe the bandwidth would be ok
15:49<Friction[2]>if someone uploaded several GB at once they're not likely to want to download it straight away
15:50<Delph>Friction[2]: "are you sure?"
15:50<Delph>Friction[2]: you upload your photos to a photo site. What's the next thing you do?
15:50<Delph>check they're uploaded properly and the ones you uploaded; by going and visiting the page?
15:50<Friction[2]>i wouldn't upload a GB of photos
15:50<pharaun>Friction[2]: i do, i have 50 gb of photos
15:51-!-cmayo [] has quit [Quit: cmayo]
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15:53<allos[off]>Not have the "code promocial" the first months?
15:55<mwalling>there aren't any right now
15:56<@Perihelion>If you prepay for a year there's a 10% discount
15:56<@Perihelion>15% if you sign up for 2 years
15:56<mwalling>[09-07] 15:38:33 < Karrde> allos[off]: pay for a year or 2 years up front for a discount
15:56<Yaakov>If you prepay for 100 years there is a free tshirt.
15:56<pharaun>what about 1,000 years?
15:56<@jed>if you prepay for over 9000 years you get a mug
15:56<@Perihelion>mwalling: I haven't read scrollback :P
15:57<@Perihelion>I may even throw in a hug.
15:57<Yaakov>If you pay for 150,000 years you get a 50% discount.
15:57<@jed>!newcalc 9000 * (19.95 * 12 * .90)
15:57-!-zack__ [] has quit [Quit: zack__]
15:57<linbot>jed: 9 000 * (19.95 * 12 * .90) = 1 939 140
15:57<@Perihelion>That is a smelly lie.
15:57<Yaakov>Ask caker.
15:58<@jed>wow, those were some pointless parentheses
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15:58<mwalling>bopm ftw
15:58<Nivex>Perihelion: yeah, but what's the shipping cost on a Perihelion hug?
15:58<randallman>Ok so who thinks that the new google logo is SERIOUSLY FSCKING ANNOYING
15:58<@Perihelion>You gotta come get it :>
15:59-!-leasmalsins [~mashaolss@] has joined #linode
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15:59<randallman>'yay look at us, we can write super obfuscated javascript to make your browser annoy the SHIT out of you'
15:59-!-Heinzel [~xmartyx@] has joined #linode
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15:59*jed yawns
15:59<purrdeta>randallman: it was amusing for about 30 seconds.
15:59<randallman>30 seconds :)
15:59<purrdeta>I mean, I got to play with googles balls.
15:59<HarryS>BING! BING! BING!
15:59<pharaun>i don't see it
15:59<Delph>randallman: yeah, i'm really annoyed, i can't use firebug to work out how they did it.
16:00<randallman>Well that one before this
16:00<randallman>they super-obfsucated it
16:00<Delph>every time i try to "inspect element", it moves away
16:00<randallman>like as if they were competing in the obfuscated perl contest
16:00<@Perihelion>I don't see a new logo :<
16:00-!-tktiddle [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:00<randallman>I guess they have to count bytes
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16:00<pharaun>nah its standard thing to do with a large traffic site, they crunch down the css/html/js to save bytes
16:00<randallman>since they must have zillions of page views per day
16:00<pharaun>you got it :)
16:01<@jed>every space is precious
16:01<@Perihelion>Every space is sacred
16:01<randallman>nice jed
16:01<mdcollins>My precious..
16:01<@Perihelion>Every space is good
16:01<@Perihelion>If a space is wasted, God gets quite irate
16:01<mwalling>tj is god
16:01<randallman>High volume websites are like a throwback to the old days of programming :)
16:01<Nivex>same holds true for IP addresses
16:02*Nivex wastes a couple /16s
16:02<randallman>Nivex, just think - IPv6 is going to quadruple the size of a request for an address
16:02<Nivex>randallman: I for one welcome our new /64 overlords
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16:02<randallman>stop the autokilling
16:02<Woomiapem>90 39 Woomiapem bigjocker rjsimmon Daevien allos[off] Ziggy` cereal_ laser` megatron27 dabear Ephialtes Linky tehdan Bass10 Alan_ whouweling axod mwalling kethry BP{k} Frools jeppe mac-mini WoodWork K-Zodron Marius auau Delph Tiven rHn Nicar tozz TheJoe jed Friction[2] Shishire orudie mdcollins rmayorga hfb eighty4 ojacobson Aka materdaddy DesertPanther_ sshaw burningdog silence atula sm dajhorn spaceduck oru_work math
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16:02-!-mode/#linode [+R] by Perihelion
16:02<randallman>just ban them :)
16:03<mwalling>randallman: we're trying, kthx?
16:03*randallman complains
16:03*Perihelion bans randallman
16:03<randallman>Now that I look, they are coming from all over
16:03<randallman>Sorry :)
16:03<megatron27>what is autokill
16:03<Shishire>:( stupid spammers.
16:03<megatron27>I'm IRC illiterate
16:03<mwalling>megatron27: removing from the network
16:04<megatron27>how can they tell whether a host is infected
16:04-!-sm [] has left #linode []
16:04<Friction[2]>are iv6 ip's ever going to become the only format of ip?
16:04<mwalling>megatron27: magic :)
16:04<amitz>I'm scared of my stalking skill -_-
16:04<tjfontaine>magic and blacklists
16:04<@jed>Friction[2]: no
16:04<morsing>Friction[2]: Yes
16:04<mwalling>megatron27: how can you tell that an email is spam?
16:04<randallman>Oh Oh Oh Its Magic... You know! Dont you ever believe its not so!
16:04<@jed>morsing: keep dreaming - IPv4 will persist in LANs for millenia
16:05<Nivex>jed: I wouldn't say millenia, but at last decades
16:05<Nivex>I don't see any IPX traffic anymore :)
16:06<pharaun>Nivex: nah not decades, centuries!
16:08<megatron27>mwalling, trick question?
16:08<mwalling>megatron27: not really
16:08<megatron27>I can more or less tell after seeing previous spam messages
16:09<mwalling>ok, how does your mailserver know?
16:09<megatron27>from the subject line alone
16:09<@jed>Nivex: the real question is are IPX questions still on certification exams
16:09<@jed>and the answer is probably: yes
16:09<megatron27>spam filters
16:09-!-TheJoe is now known as TheJoe_
16:10<@pparadis>NetBIOS 4 LYFE
16:10<Nivex>pparadis: Silence! I keel you!
16:11*pparadis flings NT4 install media at Nivex
16:11<Nivex>IT BURNS!
16:12*Nivex reinstalls pparadis' workstation with BeOS
16:12<@pparadis>R5 FTW
16:12<@pparadis>hellz yeah
16:12<Nivex>keep it up and you get QNX
16:13*pparadis did embedded development... embedded in urmom
16:15-!-mode/#linode [-R] by Perihelion
16:18<mwalling>might want to put that back
16:18-!-Jere [] has joined #linode
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16:18-!-mode/#linode [+R] by Perihelion
16:19<mwalling>there was a couple right after you did it
16:19-!-burningdog [] has quit [Quit: burningdog]
16:19-!-maku`off is now known as maku
16:19<@Perihelion>Ah, I'm lurking #debian and not seeing any haha
16:21-!-cereal_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:21<mwalling>and of course, since i said that there have been exactly 0
16:23-!-mode/#linode [-R] by Perihelion
16:24<@Perihelion> will be >:D
16:24<mwalling>oh really
16:24<pharaun>what is -r ??
16:25<pharaun><- irc newb :)
16:29-!-whouweling [] has quit [Quit: whouweling]
16:30<sshaw>is it possible to have move an IP address from one linode to another
16:31<sshaw>for example if I want to setup a new linode, transfer everything over, and then move the IP address over?
16:31<sshaw>caker: what's the time frame on that?
16:31<@caker>sshaw: as fast as you can click the "swap IPs" button?
16:32<sshaw>caker: crap, I'm really slow with the mouse :(
16:32<sshaw>caker: after clicking the button, do I need to reboot them?
16:32<@caker>sshaw: it forces you to shut down each affected node, so yes
16:33<sshaw>caker: ok. so, downtime is pretty much the time it takes to reboot the node?
16:33<sshaw>caker: I can live with that
16:33<TheJoe_>Does anyone have a Linode logo PNG that would be sort of suitable for a GNOME Panel item?
16:34<@jed>there's a .eps you can render and cut up, that's what I usually do
16:34<sshaw>caker: where can I find the swap IP option?
16:34<sshaw>caker: (I only have 1 node right now)
16:36<sshaw>caker: nm, found it
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16:41<eighty4>TheJoe_: writing a gnome app for linode?
16:41<TheJoe_>eighty4: Nah, nothing that dramatic
16:41<TheJoe_>eighty4: Just a launcher for SSHing to my node in one click
16:42<eighty4>TheJoe_: oh :/
16:42<sirpengi>the gnome terminal doesn't have profiles?
16:42<TheJoe_>sirpengi: It does
16:43-!-RoosterJuice [] has joined #linode
16:43<sirpengi>I guess the gnome app runner does kinda suck
16:44<sirpengi>the kde krunner has a plugin to hook into konsole profiles, so I can launch in a profile without leaving the keyboard
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16:50<allos[off]>a vps is turn on automatic...
16:51<sirpengi>allos[off]: was that a question?
16:51-!-mode/#linode [+v jed] by ChanServ
16:51-!-FloodServ [] has joined #linode
16:51-!-mode/#linode [+v caker] by ChanServ
16:51-!-mode/#linode [+v ericoc] by ChanServ
16:51-!-mode/#linode [+o tjfontaine] by ChanServ
16:51-!-mode/#linode [+v irgeek] by ChanServ
16:51-!-mode/#linode [-o tjfontaine] by tjfontaine
16:51<allos[off]>status: Brand New
16:51<allos[off]>what it means?
16:52-!-hfb [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:52<dr_jkl>no way to control it; it's totally automatic... o/`
16:55<mwalling>i think he was singing
16:55<chrisA>caker: have you had any issues with .de domains and linode dns?
16:56<chrisA>Maybe I missed a memo
16:58<pharaun>heh shouldn't be any issue, double check your dns stuff and it could be just waiting for some dns cache to expire
16:58-!-kassah__ [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:58<chrisA>godaddy actually sent me a response saying they can't swap to the linode settings for the .de domain because the nameservers do not meet some requirement for .de domains
16:58<tjfontaine>afaik linode has done the requisite work
16:59<chrisA>I have no idea if this is crap or not, hence asking
16:59<tjfontaine>.de is cranky
16:59-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
16:59<pharaun>chrisA: my bad :)
16:59<chrisA>Maybe it's a setting I can tweak
16:59<@jed>chrisA: my understanding is that some TLDs expect the domain to be there before they'll let you set your nameservers to it
16:59<@jed>is it in the DNS manager?
16:59<@jed>what's the error?
17:00<auau>anybody's linode drop out about 4 hours ago in London?
17:00-!-kassah [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:00<chrisA>All I've got is " apologize for any confusion, if you are unable to modify the nameservers for your .de domain it is likely that it does not meet the criteria for a .de domain name."
17:00<auau>aah I read status
17:00<pharaun>auau: there was a network issue/router/something a few hour ago
17:00<chrisA>and a list of TTL / refresh settings to check
17:00<@jed>chrisA: can you pastebin the full error?
17:00<linbot> <-- paste here, not in the channel
17:00<Torenn>jed, could you please check something?
17:01<chrisA>No, because the error is just their site saying it's no good and to ask support
17:01<auau>pharaun: okay :)
17:01<chrisA>I don't have a specific dns error or such I can pass on
17:01<@jed>chrisA: right, that list sound promising...
17:01<@jed>Torenn: I checked. It's fine.
17:01<chrisA>Looking at the settings now
17:01-!-kassah [] has joined #linode
17:01<chrisA>For one, refresh rate looks too low
17:01<@jed>you can edit all that - edit your SOA record in the DNS Manager
17:02<Torenn>no it's not, would you mind having a look at this dns zone on the linode servers?
17:02<chrisA>right, I'm doing that now
17:02-!-ajpiano [] has joined #linode
17:02<Torenn>^ i think it's from a paste customer of which I got an IP Address from so its record point unsollicitely to my linode?
17:02-!-ajpiano [] has quit []
17:03-!-DesertPanther_ [~Khalid@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:03<@jed>Torenn: ok?
17:03<@jed>what would you like me to do about it?
17:04<@caker>You expect me to talk? NOOoooo Mr. Bond - I expect you to DIEEEEE
17:04<Torenn>Well if it's a stale record from a non existant user, "something". Else nothing I suppose ^^?
17:04<@jed>Torenn: is it hurting something?
17:05-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has joined #linode
17:05<@jed>dig soa <thatdomain> will give you an e-mail, you can yap in that direction I guess
17:06<@pparadis>Torenn: or you can just make a vhost that redirects to some website involving ponies or rainbows or something.
17:07<randallman>jed, that email is usually invalid :)
17:07<Torenn>^_^, well not like someone who hasn't access to the Linode DNS manager can do anything about stale dns records being left on 'em.
17:07<@pparadis>we didn't put those records there.
17:07-!-silence [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:08<Torenn>pparadis, perhaps if you cancel the account subscription records do stay on the server?
17:08<@pparadis>Torenn: i could do the same thing with another DNS provider. you have the power to display whatever you want for those requests, or just 404 them.
17:09<@pparadis>and no, we stop serving DNS for cancelled accounts.
17:09<Torenn>Ok thanks :-)
17:09<@pparadis>you must have at least one linode on an account to have DNS, actually
17:09<@caker>ya - no free lunch^wdns
17:09<pharaun>pparadis: i forgot, is it 1 account per vps or can you have more than 1 vps to an account? i forgot
17:09<Torenn>Ok then guess, the guy deleted a linode and forgot to update his zone :-P
17:10<randallman>more and more DNS providers are actually returning SERVFAIL for customers who leave...
17:10<randallman>nearly immediately
17:10<@pparadis>pharaun: you can have multiple linodes under a single account
17:10<randallman>the moment the transfer out takes effect... no grace period to allow the TTLs to rollover
17:10<pharaun>pparadis: thought so, thanks been a while since i checked on that :)
17:10<@pparadis>np :)
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17:19-!-maku is now known as maku`off
17:19<mdcollins>Mmm.. Sandwiches with mayo, ham, pepperjack, lettuce, onions and avocados.. 'Tis awesome.
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17:28<chrisA>augh, it failed still
17:28<chrisA>and their error is frustrating; It gives no specifics
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17:31<TheJoe_> So here's the icon. 32x32 transparent. It's not much but it looks kind of nice on the Panel.
17:31<pharaun> <- YAY!
17:31<pharaun>giant hornet!
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17:33<tjfontaine>hai Perihelion
17:34-!-axod [] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
17:35<pharaun>chrisA: did you talk to support yet?
17:36-!-atula [~atula@] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
17:36<eighty4>isn't the UK servers located in London? When doing a check I got Paul, Cornwall, United Kingdom .
17:39-!-redgore [~redgore@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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17:40<TheJoe_>eighty4: UK nodes are in London, yes
17:41-!-x] [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
17:41<linbot>tjfontaine: IP:; rDNS:; ASN adv net:; ASN: AS15830; ASN owner: TELECITYGROUP UK; ASN reg: 2002-09-11; City: London; State: London; Country: GB; Domains: 1;
17:41<eighty4>strange, must be woorank that's messed up than
17:42<@jed>eighty4: there's a requirement for GeoDB databases that 20% of data be consistently incorrect. it's the Law
17:42<linbot>eighty4: IP:; rDNS:; ASN adv net:; ASN: AS15830; ASN owner: TELECITYGROUP UK; ASN reg: 2002-09-11; City: London; State: London; Country: GB; Domains: 1;
17:43-!-allos[off] [suporte@] has quit []
17:43<eighty4>eh? Law of 20%
17:43<pharaun>eighty4: yes it is a law :)
17:43<@jed>yes, joke.
17:43<eighty4>silly britts, one can never know with em
17:44<pharaun>eighty4: the problem with geoip is that ip can be moved/shuffled around
17:44<eighty4>also what should I do with my 388 free ram on my node ><
17:44<eighty4>It's just silly
17:44<pharaun>eighty4: find a way to eat it up? ;)
17:45<eighty4>I guess I could get a couple of more nginx workers
17:45<eighty4>but why?
17:45<pharaun>if you're not using the ram, the kernel will for disk cache/etc
17:45-!-A-KO [] has joined #linode
17:45<pharaun>so its still being used
17:45<@jed>like magic!
17:45<eighty4>pharaun: -/+ buffers/cache: 110 388
17:46<eighty4>I even have FREE ram, from what I understand Mem: 498 457 40
17:46<eighty4>and that's really silly. Stupid linode giving me more ram :(
17:46<pharaun>eighty4: free ram isn't an evil thing, some of it will be used for buffers and cached disk stuff/etc
17:46<pharaun>eighty4: uh why is it stupid?
17:47<pharaun>more ram is always nice, it keeps the evil oom killer away
17:47<Deezire>I think he's being ironic.
17:47<eighty4>pharaun: cause I enjoyed trying to get as much cache free as possible. Now I even have free memory.
17:47<Deezire>I think.
17:47<pharaun>Deezire: >_>
17:47<eighty4>now what? Hardly any point in trying to optimize anything now
17:48<pharaun>well then by golly go undo all of your optimization!
17:48<dr_jkl>GEE WHIZ.
17:48-!-D[a]rkbeholder [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:48<eighty4>I guess I could install something more on the node
17:48<pharaun>heh, you using mysql/etc
17:48<eighty4>redmine take up some crazy amount of RAM
17:49<pharaun>iirc if you have mysql/etc on low mem settings the performance suffers/etc so you can use that free ram to tune up mysql/etc
17:49<eighty4>and stupid nginx saving lots of ram
17:49<pharaun>to make the whole thing more performant
17:49-!-darkbeholder [] has joined #linode
17:49<eighty4>under 1sec loading time for most pages on my site
17:49<pharaun>oh i got a idea!
17:50<pharaun>install ruby on rails >_>
17:50<eighty4>that's good enough
17:50<eighty4>and I even use a webfont and google analytics on that
17:50<eighty4>I should mention that I have zero traffic on the site :)
17:51<pharaun>nah, details like that is unimportant! ;)
17:51*eighty4 thinks so to
17:51<pharaun>we all must scale up/out!
17:51<eighty4>I'm getting to the point where I don't know what to play with. I might actually have to do something with the node soon :|
17:52<eighty4>Like actually writing something and publish on the site :|
17:53<sirpengi>who cares about content? keep optimizing
17:54<sirpengi>do you have a cache?
17:54<eighty4>it's a serious problem, I've had a "blog" for about 10 years now and managed to not write more than 20-30 posts.
17:55<eighty4>sirpengi: nah, cache is no fun. Makes to big improvements to fast
17:56<sirpengi>okay, then go write your website in assembly
17:56<@Perihelion>Oh mah frick.
17:56<sirpengi>if you're using php, python or ruby, you've all this overhead
17:57<sirpengi>even java and c have overhead that you must get rid of
17:58<eighty4>but yeah I guess I could play with memcache
17:58<sirpengi>no, memcache is written in c
17:59<sirpengi>you need even faster
18:00<sirpengi>you should probably build the caching into your assembly-app
18:00<pharaun>its not a blog unless it can handle 60+ million hits a day
18:00<pharaun>in 512 mb of ram
18:00<sirpengi>otherwise you'll have to wait for socket overhead
18:03<pharaun>we have presented you our challenge, you shall complete it
18:04<eighty4>I guess one could play with gzip compression lvl
18:04<sirpengi>actually the fastest would be to implement everything in hardware
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18:17<eighty4>oh well, sleep instead
18:18<tjfontaine>dont' do it
18:18<tjfontaine>it's a trap
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18:26<dr_jkl>world... going dark
18:26<dr_jkl>brain... OOMing...
18:26*dr_jkl forgets the third grade
18:26<dr_jkl>that was close.
18:26-!-ektimo [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:26<dr_jkl>...wait, why is the sky blue again?
18:30-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:34-!-redtank [~redtank@] has joined #linode
18:35<redtank>ok so what do i do now?
18:36-!-rjsimmon [~Adium@CONCORDIA.WV.CC.CMU.EDU] has joined #linode
18:36<tjfontaine>you enjoy your linode
18:36<tjfontaine>to the fullest
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18:49<atourino>urmom lights my fire
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18:55<Marius>from what I heard, urmom lights everyoes fires ;)
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18:59<linbot>New news from forums: change apache2 default directory in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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19:07<Patrick>Hi guys. Can anyone help me with a linode ssh access?
19:08<JshWright>Patrick: not if you aren't more specific about the problem you're having
19:09<Patrick>Great. Thanks for your help. I don't see any place to configure it within the linode manager. I have access to the linode manager, and what I understood were my ssh creditials, but I'm having no success. Just wondering if there is a place within the linode manager where I can reset that password
19:10<JshWright>what password?
19:10<JshWright>the root password of your OS?
19:11<Patrick>I guess that would be it, if it's the root password used in the ssh access
19:11<@caker>Patrick: this is a newly deployed Linode?
19:12<Kyhwana>Are you trying to access your linode via ssh, or LISH? (the "kvm" that will give you "console" access to your linode)
19:12<Patrick>not exactly.. a few months anyway. i set up the linode account, and i allowed our web dev to take the rein. He provided me with the ssh pass - the same pass that I use to login to Linmanager
19:13<Patrick>I'm trying to access via SSH via WinSCP, port 22 root + pass
19:13<JshWright>Patrick: if you're just trying to ssh into your box, reset the root password, then log in as "root"
19:13<JshWright>the linode manager will let you reset the root password
19:13<JshWright>assuming password authentication hasn't been disabled, you'll be all set
19:14<Patrick>Perfect. I'll give that a shot..
19:14<Kyhwana>and that sshd isn't disallowing root logins
19:15-!-mdcollins_ [] has joined #linode
19:15<straterra>And sshd is running
19:15<straterra>And not firewalled
19:15<Kyhwana>and that too
19:15<JshWright>dare we ask what happened to the web-dev?
19:15<Kyhwana>and the linode is up
19:16<@caker>and your refridgerator running
19:16-!-mdcollins_ [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:16<straterra>JshWright: Python CGI
19:17-!-mdcollins_ [] has joined #linode
19:17<Patrick>Access denied
19:17<Patrick>server shut down, pass reset, and restarted.
19:17<@caker>Patrick: you sure?
19:17<JshWright>Patrick: there are a number of things that could be "wrong"
19:17<Patrick>haha they're still around, I just need to get in there and update a few things
19:17*caker spots a failed reset job in the queue
19:18<straterra>Caker be in your nodes..stealin yer boots
19:18<@caker>Patrick: Reboot != Shutdown :)
19:18<Patrick>haha oh
19:19<JshWright>and then there's lassie...
19:20-!-abc_123 [] has joined #linode
19:21<Patrick>Attempted the reboot method with no success. Any other recommendations?
19:22<@caker>Patrick: you seem to keep getting the sequencing wrong.
19:23<atourino>urmom gets the sequencing right
19:23<@caker>Patrick: click Shutdown on the Linode's Dashboard. Then head over to the Utilities subtab, do the password reset thing. Then head back to the dashboard and wait until the jobs complete before booting
19:23<@caker>Patrick: tell me what it says then for the "Change root password" job...
19:24<Patrick>Was pretty sure I did that but I'll take my time on this one.
19:24<@caker>Change root password - Status: failed
19:25<@caker>2742749 - Change root password - Status: success!!!
19:25<@caker>mkay - bewt and try to connect now... also, this is your Linode's IP right? NOT <-- correct?
19:26<Marius>JshWright: lassie doesn't kick in if you shutdown :P
19:27<JshWright>Marius: I'm aware of that, but if something is borked in the node so badly that it panics and shuts down on boot, then lassie could be kicking in
19:27<Patrick>Thanks guys.. much appreciated.. Most stressful thing I've done all day.
19:27<Marius>ahh, yes
19:28<Patrick>except i still can't get in..!?!
19:30-!-nisstyre56 [] has joined #linode
19:31<Kyhwana>then you might have root login over ssh disabled, if you can connect, but it's givingyou access denied
19:31-!-laser` [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:31<Patrick>yes that's what's happening
19:31-!-laser` [] has joined #linode
19:31<nisstyre56>got a user account?
19:32<Patrick>I think we've only been using root access.
19:32-!-LK- [~lk@] has joined #linode
19:32<nisstyre56>bad security!
19:32<atourino>you can try to log in via lish? and see if your root password works
19:32<JshWright>Patrick: is your web guy unavailable?
19:33<atourino>if it works then your ssh server is configured to not accept root logins
19:33<nisstyre56>(as it should be)
19:33<Patrick>Yes.. I realise that's bad practice, but we're just interested in getting up and running at the moment..
19:33<nisstyre56>yeah that's fair
19:33<Patrick>i'll check out lish. Thanks atourino
19:33<atourino>Patrick: dont worry about it... right now the important thing is to get something up and running :)
19:34<Kyhwana>(and then once you have it up and running, you have no time to do it properly)
19:34*atourino always has time to do urmom properly
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19:41<Patrick>yep. seems like lish worked..
19:41<Patrick>now to figure out how to enable root ssh
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19:46<@ericoc>Patrick: to enable root ssh, you would need to be sure "PermitRootLogin yes" is in /etc/ssh/sshd_config
19:46<atourino>Patrick: If you've got root logins disabled, I'd try a step forward and figure out if you can get away with creating a different user with sudo rights, instead of going back to enabling root logins... but if you really need to enable root logins, there you go:
19:46<atourino>or do what ericoc suggests
19:47<@ericoc>or do what atourino suggests :)
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19:54<Patrick>hey thanks a bunch guys.. I'm going to set up a new user
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19:55<linbot>New news from linodelibrary: Use Unbound for Local DNS Resolution on Ubuntu 9.10 (Karmic) <> || Use Unbound for Local DNS Resolution on Fedora 13 <>
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20:04<BarkerJr>mtr is a pretty cool command
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20:08<Patrick>Just curious. Who are the typical users here? General supporters of the service?
20:08-!-jamescollins [] has joined #linode
20:08<@jed>Patrick: and employees like myself and the other @'s
20:10<linbot>Users with ops are employees of Linode, and know what they're talking about. The rest of us are the ever-so-helpful(?) community. Official Linode contact information:
20:10<JshWright>and like caker who was helping you earlier (who owns Linode)
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20:12<atourino>and people like myself who are here just to throw out the random urmom joke
20:12<JshWright>and people like urmom, who are just here to be the butt of said jokes
20:12<hobot>I can use 4 letter commands on linbot and make mikegrb say lol
20:12<Patrick>I haven't seen a good support group like this for a paid service in a while. That says a lot. Cheers
20:12<hobot>thats my super power
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20:13<atourino>Patrick: Linode tends to draw geeks that hang out on IRC
20:13<atourino>so they a support group for free
20:14<JshWright>and run their IRC clients on their Linodes
20:14<atourino>it's all part of caker's evil plan
20:14<Kyhwana>I'm on here from my server at home, so if my linode goes down, I can all "wtfomgbbq"
20:14<hobot>you will just see me go bloop
20:14<hobot>im ok with that
20:14<@jed>atourino: we accidentally the support group?
20:14<JshWright>If my linode goes down, I go all *part*
20:14<hobot>the entire
20:14<atourino>jed: the whole thing!
20:15<@Perihelion>Holy crap!
20:15<@Perihelion>The whole support
20:15<@Perihelion>That's talent
20:15<atourino>and lots of practice
20:15<JshWright>then I connect via mibbit (and then I remember mibbit is also running on Linode...)
20:16*JshWright lights the axof signal
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20:17<atourino>oh... right
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20:25<Patrick>Hillarious.. I haven't used IRC since I was 13 back when it was really hard core. Then it went mainstream. And yeah, now it's definitely hard core.
20:25-!-buser [] has joined #linode
20:25*smed not sure if he should feel old.
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20:27<smed>I still have a couple of 19,200 baud modems in the cellar, unused, they were spares.
20:28<Patrick>Whoa. :) I remember with the 28,8 upgrade was a huge deal. that was considered serious speed.
20:28<MarkJ>hehe, dad still uses my 33600 at his place
20:28<MarkJ>I started with an internal 2800 baud Supra 16 bit card
20:28<MarkJ>Next upgraded was "huge" an Avtek 28800 pocket modem
20:29<MarkJ>I remember even thinking a 14,400 would be really fast
20:29<smed>I remember purchasing a 300 baud add-on modem card for an ibm pc-jr that I brought to college with me, it was this enormous boxy-module that bolted on to the side of the chassis and cost like $450 at the time, circa 1986
20:29<encode>I remember when the electron was first invented
20:29<smed>so there ya go....pc-jr...I had one. (2) wireless infra-red keyboards in 1985
20:29<MarkJ>Are you god in disguise?
20:29-!-drowe [~drowe@] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20:29<MarkJ>Noone else would have known when the electron was invented
20:30-!-drowe [~drowe@] has joined #linode
20:31<atourino>that was encode
20:31<atourino>he probably wanted to join in the pissing contest ;)
20:31-!-segin|2 is now known as segin
20:34<HoopyCat>so how do we now come to beeeeeeeee / afraid of sunliiiiiiiiiight / tell me girl why you and meeeeeeeeeee / scared of sunliiiiiiiiiight
20:37<smed>never heard of 'em....
20:37<smed>interesting though, that they are British.
20:39<smed>interesting lineage
20:41<smed>I recall around 1977 setting hands on a 32-key mini-moog and understanding at that time how "this changes everything"
20:41<smed>and now I look back at the music that's developed in the past 20 years and I still can't fathom how it's mutated
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20:47<HoopyCat>smed: vocoders and computers
20:48<Pryon>Everything sounds beeeeeeeeter auuuuuuutoooootuuuuuuuuuuuuned
20:49<HoopyCat>all owl city, all the time
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20:51<smed>oh god yeah....them
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20:55<Patrick>Question: any reason why I shouldn't upgrade my wodpress account from within its own dashboard using SFTP?
20:57-!-cats [] has joined #linode
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20:58<smed>I dunno the answer to that
20:58<path>ftp sucks
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20:58<path>i do something like that though
20:58<path>i have a special account for wordpress updates and the info is hard coded into a file
20:59<path>and it only allows logins from localhost
20:59<Patrick>Oh nice! thanks for that link..
20:59-!-cmayo [] has quit [Quit: cmayo]
20:59<path>but the files have to be owned by that user
20:59<path>i only use it for the plugins
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21:00<path>i dunno how accurate that post still is, but that's what i initially did when the ability first came about
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21:00<Patrick>What are you doing to update the general WP CMS
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21:02<path>i login to my linode, extract the files to tmp, then cp -a them to the right place
21:02<smed>my wife is filling out all the paperwork from the school for the kids.....looks thrilling.
21:02<path>general wordpress updates aren't that often that it's a bother
21:02-!-orudie [] has joined #linode
21:03<path>i guess there is a wordpress update for every 20 ubuntu kernel updates
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21:06<Patrick>Ha this is true.
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21:27<Patrick>Does anyone know if there is a GUI that I can use to administer with and access it via SSH?
21:27<Patrick>I'm able to log in via winscp, but I can't do much with users/groups
21:30<danieldg>if you start an X server on your local host, you can use the normal linux admin tools
21:30<danieldg>that's a lot easier if you're using linux to SSH to your linode, though
21:31<Kyhwana>Or if you're in windows, use cygwin/X. Or mingw's X server + putty
21:31<G>X server w/ VNC
21:31<danieldg>yes. But setting up cygwin/x isn't what I would call "easy"
21:31<Kyhwana>or just use ssh to admin it ;)
21:31<Kyhwana>danieldg: mingw is easier, I think.
21:31<A-KO>which by the time you're done setting all that shit up, it's easier to just use the cmdline
21:31<G>A-KO: haha yeah :)
21:32<danieldg>Xvnc running on the linode and a port forward is probably the simplest
21:33<Kyhwana>what do you need port forward for? just connect your vnc client straight to it?
21:33<danieldg>sure, if you don't care about security
21:33<danieldg>VNC isn't a secure protocol :)
21:33<Kyhwana>oh, true.
21:33<Kyhwana>you meant ssh port forward, obviously
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21:37<Patrick>I've figured out most of what I need to upload new files into my html folder, but to access it I had to set up a new user. The permissions for the user aren't set properly. I'd like to group user1 and user2 to have the same permissions. It takes me 10 minutes to look this up.. perhaps I could beg for this one :)
21:40<G>yeah, definately need SSH port forward w/ VNC
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21:40<Patrick>I've figured out: usermod [options] [username] but how do I lock the user to just the var file folder containing just the web content?
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21:43<danieldg>Patrick: you don't directly "lock" the user, you just don't give them write access anywhere else
21:43<danieldg>and prevent global read access to things you don't want everyone to read
21:43<Thorrr>Patrick: that is not simple you would have to use a jail shell/chroot environment
21:43<atourino>Patrick: I think that's a feature you can do with certain FTP programs...
21:44<Thorrr>or over FTP, proftpd supports it i know
21:44<danieldg>alternatively, you could confine the user in some way (SELinux, jail, chroot, ...)
21:44-!-DrDigital [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:44<atourino>normally, locking a user account from reading anything else is a PITA
21:44<danieldg>or use an application that doesn't expose the full FS, that'll work too
21:44<danieldg>but if PHP scripts are running as that user, they'll have full FS access unless you confine the web server
21:45<atourino>...which is a PITA
21:45<danieldg>atourino: not disagreeing with you ;)
21:45<Patrick>Thanks for the clarification. I'm seeing how it works now.
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21:56<atourino>Im off like a jewish foreskin
21:56<atourino>night folks
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21:57<Patrick>thanks again for your help atrourino
21:59<A-KO>I am considering that password protection is all but completely useless anymore
21:59<A-KO>for those with enough $
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22:02<HoopyCat>passwords suck
22:03<HoopyCat>password policies make 'em suck worse
22:03<A-KO>it's just so sad that a lot of people likely use very basic passwords that are likely very easy to crack
22:03<A-KO>assuming say, A-Za-z0-9
22:04<A-KO>and likely < 10 characters
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22:05<A-KO>ah well :P time for sleep
22:05<HoopyCat>it's worse that people are forced to write 'em down
22:05<A-KO>yeah, you get too complicated, and people write 'em
22:05<A-KO>I mean, GPU bruteforcing power is incredible these days
22:06<HoopyCat>i couldn't withdraw money for a few months last year because i forgot my ATM PIN
22:06-!-Plinker [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
22:06<A-KO>a room full of Tesla systems running distributed bruteforcing of passwords
22:06<HoopyCat>that's a four digit frickin' number and i just plain forgot it
22:07<HoopyCat>you think i'm NOT writing down a password that has to be 8 to 14 characters, a mix of letters, numbers, and symbols, not anything resembling a dictionary word or a password that i've used any time within the past five years, only valid for 90 days, and unique to a specific account?
22:07<A-KO>true that
22:07<A-KO>I've got a password remembering policy that I use though
22:07<A-KO>so I actually fluctuate password strengths
22:08<Kyhwana>HoopyCat: ugh, our password policy is 90 days here too, but I just remember my base password and then just keep adding a character onto it each time. It's like, 20+ characters now
22:08<HoopyCat>i randomly generate passwords and keep 'em in a password keeper thingy, with an autogenerated wallet-card
22:08<A-KO>I have a system in place mentally where I come up with a password that I can type from muscle memory, something simple to start--and then once I get that muscle memory down, I add on to it to increase its complexity
22:08<A-KO>until I can't think of another real way to vary it
22:08<HoopyCat>A-KO: that's the screensaver password :-)
22:09<A-KO>by the time I'm done I've got about 4 or 5 varying levels of complexity off of one "root" password, ranging from relatively weak to pretty damn strong.
22:09<amitz>A-KO: have you experienced the time when you can't recall your muscle memory because you're too concious of it?..
22:09<A-KO>amitz: yes, often--and it makes it really difficult when I'm not using my keyboard (i.e. mobile phone)
22:10<A-KO>the nice thing about this system is I can actually have about 10 different passwords remembered because they all vary off of 2 possible roots
22:10<A-KO>which makes it easier to recall what it might possibly be
22:10<HoopyCat>what we need aren't better password policies; what we need are better failed login policies
22:10<HoopyCat>you fail to log in twice in a row, you can't make further attempts for, say, 60 seconds.
22:11<A-KO>I've been coming up with a good audit policy at work
22:11-!-techhelper1 is now known as th1
22:11<A-KO>been thinking about object access policy and login count auditing
22:11<A-KO>failed login attempts gives an idea of what might be trying to do something (with say, administrator account)
22:11<HoopyCat>when you successfully DO log in, you get a nice big box saying "yo... was that you fuckin' all up in my shit?"
22:11<A-KO>unfortunately it's almost impossible to convince people at work that we need this
22:13<HoopyCat>unrelatedly, Subject: Your order has shipped (#104-9077956-4728263)
22:14<A-KO>what is it
22:14<A-KO>,SRX100B.html < I'm tempted to order this
22:14<amitz>et, the object itself hasn't been received by HoopyCat :-p
22:15<amitz>oh wait, has shipped.
22:15<HoopyCat>it has shipped, but has not been received; it should be here tomorrow.
22:16<amitz>HoopyCat: no more login from the same IP, needs that disclaimer IMO
22:17<HoopyCat>amitz: IP addresses are meaningless outside of your organization's network
22:18<amitz>perhaps no full control, but reasonable control. and there is the upper bound of 256*256*256*256.
22:20<HoopyCat>any true scotsman could make tens of thousands of bruteforce attempts on your ssh server without denyhosts even noticing a single thing, simply by distributing the requests through rented computers
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22:21<HoopyCat>speaking of scotch, time for sleep
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22:53<Hoggs>This guy seems legit
22:53-!-danieldg [~me@2002:45a4:c0a7::1] has quit []
22:55<sirpengi>I'm not familiar with Operasting Systems
22:55-!-danieldg [~me@2002:45a4:c0a7::1] has joined #linode
22:56<Hoggs>Should just give him a KDE desktop and tell him I made it
22:56<sirpengi>but: ALL the files that run on Windows XP ust also run
22:57<Hoggs>and WINE
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22:57<sirpengi>and then the serial number thing
22:57<sirpengi>that's a lot of work for $20
22:58<Hoggs>I was hoping for the $100 :(
22:58<sirpengi>you couldn't hire me to install Linux on a pc for anyone for just $20
22:58<sirpengi>I mean, I'd do it free for a friend. but if some schmoe wanted to hire me to do it that's not even worth my time
22:59<Hoggs>It amuses me how much us geeks charge to do REALLY easy things
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23:00<sirpengi>although I guess if I didn't have to travel, and the guy had the computer where I was with the install disk ready
23:01<sirpengi>and there weren't going to be any driver issues (or I don't have to deal with any of that), I could do an install for $20
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23:03<G>hahaha, he wants it in Visual Basic? :P
23:05<opello>$20 + all the support headaches you can't even imagine
23:05<opello>it's never worth it
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23:07<amitz>sirpengi: usd 20? linix? are you crazy?! despite yoir cost of living, if that matters.
23:08<sirpengi>amitz: what's so crazy about that? I'll take $20 usd for 15 minutes doing point/click on defaults and waiting
23:08<amitz>HoopyCat: it's limited, compared to the problem of login DOS.
23:08<Hoggs>Where do I get me a job installing linix for money?
23:08<amitz>sirpengi: hardware support problems.
23:09<sirpengi>amitz: I already said that such things were not_my_problem
23:10<amitz>but in practice, how do you declarw it's not yourproblem? the customer may claim that you're lyinf.
23:11<sirpengi>too bad, they'd have to have accepted those caveats prior to me taking the job
23:12<BP{k}>amitz: occasionally the client needs to be educated abotu the principles of right and wrong ;)
23:13-!-spaceduck [] has quit [Quit: spaceduck]
23:20<amitz>don't know, i think it may develops into one ugly PR
23:20<amitz>not worth the income
23:23-!-maushu [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:25<amitz>risk not worth the income unless you're large enough to professionally deal with any PR nightmare. at least for me.
23:26-!-Shishire [] has joined #linode
23:28<amitz>BP{k}: oh, i meant the customer may genuinely think you're lying.
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---Logclosed Wed Sep 08 00:00:13 2010