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#linode IRC Logs for 2011-01-12

---Logopened Wed Jan 12 00:00:05 2011
---Daychanged Wed Jan 12 2011
00:00<Boohemian>are there any high end laptops with IPS 15-17 screen (i want a screen resolution >= 1920x1200). i want to replace my mbp with a laptop with better hardware
00:01<amitz>Motherly Big PC
00:02<amitz>Boohemian: do you like to upgrade or add features?
00:03<encode>MacBook Pro
00:03<encode>o0h, it doesn't have an IPS screen
00:03<czr>does it have IPS?
00:03<encode>in fact, Idon't know of any laptops that have one
00:04<czr>I haven't seen any
00:04<czr>the market segment is niche at best
00:04<czr>too niche probably for anyone to bother
00:04<amitz>oh for mbp. IPS?
00:05<czr>amitz, a type of LCD-TFT (in-place switching)
00:05<czr>superior picture quality
00:05<czr>uses more energy though
00:07<czr>Boohemian, seems that some higher end lenovo models have S-IPS
00:07<amitz>yeah, reading that :-p
00:08<Boohemian>amitz: not really, why? figured with new SSDs coming out, it's a good idea
00:08<czr>Boohemian, also, hp's elitebook 8740w seems to have one
00:08<czr>dig around.
00:08<amitz>just realized, e-ink must looks really good for ssh-ing...
00:08<czr>they're being re-introduced it seems
00:08<czr>amitz, not the best use of eink though :-)
00:09<amitz>Boohemian: well, I'm looking forward to USB 3. It will be tough to use USB 3 in your notebook if it doesn't support it originally.
00:09-!-auraka [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:09<czr>Boohemian, the IPS seems to cost ~700USD extra though
00:10<czr>the base price is around ~2500USD for the laptop
00:10<amitz>czr: you mean a waste of e-ink, but it still looks really good :-). With the correct font, it will be like the parchments in harry potter movie. :-p
00:10<amitz>or the newspapers.
00:10<czr>amitz, ah, you're using it?
00:11<czr>I mean it's using more electricity than would be sane
00:11<amitz>oh no. Just wishing :-p
00:11<czr>since it needs to refresh the screen much more often compared to regular use
00:11<amitz>czr: well, perhaps they can use a physically scrolling e-ink! :-D
00:11<czr>it is physically scrolling. in a way..
00:11<Boohemian>czr: the T line? last time i checked, they didn't have IPS
00:12<amitz>I mean, physically scrolling the lcd.
00:12<czr>Boohemian, yeah, it was some obsolete model. IPSes disappeared from laptops. getting re-introduced now
00:12<amitz>assuming it's physically possible...
00:12<czr>Boohemian, but the price was for the elitebook
00:12<Boohemian>the reason i want to get rid of my MBP is i think the computer is way overpriced and would like to get about $500 back and have better hardware
00:12<amitz>to reduce the number of refresh, basically.
00:13<Boohemian>amitz: isn't USB-3 out?
00:13<czr>amitz, oh, that's not the worst bit. the worst bit is updating the chars as you type.
00:13<Boohemian>czr: re price, urgh
00:13<czr>Boohemian, what did you expect?
00:13<czr>as said, IPS is niche on laptops
00:13-!-fabzor3 [~fabzor3@] has joined #linode
00:13<amitz>Boohemian: it's out. But I tought it's still really rare?
00:13<Boohemian>czr: why did it go away? i read that computer screens suck because they focus on TVs that have higher profit margins?
00:14<czr>it's rare because intel wants royalties for it. it's not an industry standard.
00:14<amitz>czr: well, hmm... perhaps the last line can be displayed with the usual type of lcd...
00:14<Boohemian>czr: well, the ibm thinkpad T series is ~1200 USD right now
00:14<czr>Boohemian, because people wanted cheaper laptops, that's why
00:14<Boohemian>not sure how their default screen is though...
00:14<amitz>I'm visioning the perfect device for irssi-ing.
00:14<czr>Boohemian, almost all laptops use variants of TN
00:14<czr>which is your basic garden variety screen
00:14<fabzor3>iphones are okay with a bluetooth keyboard
00:14<czr>some have coatings, others dont
00:14<Boohemian>and i don't like that the battery sticks out from the back, but i guess it really doesn't matter (so long as i have an SSD and it's pockets me 1k)
00:15<amitz>Boohemian: basically, makes sure you get a notebook with USB-3.
00:15<Boohemian>my 17 MBP is being sold on craigslist for 2150 USD right now...
00:15<czr>Boohemian, why do you want IPS btw?
00:15<fabzor3>oh yeah and gigabit
00:15<straterra>I just bought a 1920x1200 LCD panel for my laptop
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00:16<Boohemian>amitz: how much faster is usb3 in real world environments? e.g. if i want to transfer over say 100gb of files to an external drive, how much faster is it than over USB2?
00:16<straterra>Depends on the speed of the drive
00:16<straterra>Single might notice it
00:16-!-Duke [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:16<straterra>External RAID enclosure? You'll notice it
00:16<Boohemian>czr: yeah but aren't some screens better than others? i think the MBP screens are extremely beautiful...
00:16<straterra>I'd rather just use eSATA..but meh
00:17<straterra> know Apple got sued over the fake advertisement of their LCD panels right?
00:17<czr>Boohemian, sure, there are some differences. but not like ISP versus TN.
00:17<straterra>They didn't meet the stated color profile
00:17<amitz>Boohemian: combined with SSD, USB-3 is gonna be awesome!
00:17<czr>Boohemian, also, what you might refer as beautiful might be just coating that you like.
00:17<amitz>external SSD connected to USB-3
00:17<czr>so it's difficult to say objectively what is "best", unless you do professional graphics and have proper color calibration stuff so that we can speak about broader gamuts and such
00:17<straterra>Uhm..dont do that
00:18<amitz>straterra: why?
00:18<Boohemian>czr: i didn't realize the price increase was so large, so i won't consider it now... but something that matters to me is a high resolution display. i have 1920x1200 now (17"), i'm okay with slightly lower res (in a 14 or 16 screen), but if there are any 17 laptops, i'd want at least 1920x1200 (not sure if there's anything higher on laptop screens)
00:18<straterra>External SSD + USB 3 == No TRIM
00:18<czr>Boohemian, again, niche market
00:18<mbreslin>trim != important
00:18<czr>the high res laptop screens came and went around 2003-2005
00:18<Boohemian>czr: i LOVE the screen res of the 1920x1200 MBP screen... and the screen, imo, is beautiful... so as long as the thinkpad's have as nice a screen as my MBP, i'm happy
00:18<straterra>TRIM is important
00:18<Boohemian>i didn't see any 17 thinkpads, though... :/
00:18<czr>Boohemian, yes, but you're ignoring what I write.
00:18<mbreslin>any ssd you will by going forward will have good enough gc to do without trim
00:19<vraa>w700 is a 17" thinkpad, i have a t410s
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00:19<czr>mbreslin, ssds don't do garbage collection
00:19<czr>they do wear-levelling, which is a different thing
00:19<mbreslin>they do both
00:19<czr>well, so try to parse the filesystem structures, but just for limited number of filesystems
00:20<czr>mostly just FAT
00:20<straterra>If they do garbage collection, you might wanna keep Ubuntu away from it
00:20<mbreslin>well some do, almost all ssds do some sort of wear leveling, many drives have internal gc
00:20<amitz>straterra: I'm under the impression that TRIM can one day be supported with USB-3?
00:20<czr>mbreslin, please explain how the FTL controllers implement gc for extN.
00:20<straterra>amitz: With a supported controller, maybe
00:21<czr>most of the smaller FTL controllers have crappy amount of memory too. too little to do anything sane.
00:21<czr>not even enough RAM to hold a full NAND block.
00:21<Boohemian>straterra: how much do multibay RAID enclosures cost? it seems that it would be a better value to just build a cheap i3 storage desktop (i have a case/psu to save about 50 bucks)
00:21<mbreslin>czr: the micron controllers in my 8 ssds do both, i'm not going to go look for the tech docs
00:21<czr>mbreslin, for ext?
00:21<straterra>Boohemian: The prebuilt ones cost more than they should..if you have a spare case, you could toss a shitton of drives in it and do the same thing
00:22<czr>mbreslin, what's the model of the SSD?
00:22<straterra>You could even share them over iscsi/nfs/fcoe/smb/etc
00:22<mbreslin>crucial c300
00:23<czr>mbreslin, hmm. same as micron c300?
00:23<amitz>hardwarery talk, /me lurks
00:23<czr>mbreslin, what's the LBA count reported by blockdev?
00:24<mbreslin>czr: sorry the c300s have marvell, the new c400s have the micron
00:24<czr>yeah right, like marvell would ever pull off anything decent
00:24<czr>micron could. marvell, never.
00:24<czr>they're almost worse than bcm
00:24<Boohemian>vraa: how do you like your T410?
00:25<vraa>i *love* it
00:25<Boohemian>czr: what did i ignore? i was typing with one hand so was replying slowly
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00:25<vraa>i have the intel 160gb ssd + 750gb wd sata in the 2nd bay, i removed cdrw
00:25<czr>Boohemian, about the high-res being niche market as well.
00:25<amitz>what's the ot... never mind :-p
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00:26<Boohemian>czr: i saw that... since it costs so much more for an IPS screen, i just won't make that a "must have" on my laptop shopping list
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00:26<mbreslin>czr: your opinion on the company doesn't match the performance of my array
00:26<Boohemian>czr: but there are different qualities of TN screens, i'm sure... (all the rest)
00:26<czr>mbreslin, performance has nothing to do with the issue
00:26<czr>and my opinions are based on working quite closely with chips from all three in previous times
00:26<czr>working mostly with micron nand nowadays
00:27-!-user6484 [] has joined #linode
00:27<czr>(my choice, slightly more expensive but damn I lose much less hair nowadays)
00:27*user6484 hey, my php script is giving me Severity: Warning
00:27*user6484 Message: mkdir(): Permission denied
00:27<mbreslin>of course it does, there is no trim in raid, i've written more data then you would believe, i built the array 1 year ago specifically for benchmarking, if there was no internal gc my drives would crawl by now
00:27<czr>you may obviously ignore all this and assume that marvell chips somehow miraculously understand in-flight ext3/4 data (not to mention journalling) and magically do gc on fs stuff.
00:27<user6484>my php script is giving me: Severity: Warning Message: mkdir(): Permission denied. Where do I configure this, from linux file system, from php.ini, apache?? where exactly?
00:28<amitz>Boohemian: oh yeah, I believe you were saying something and when I was about to reply you already left. Sorry I couldn't be there for you. Did the meet up with her family go well?
00:28<czr>mbreslin, maybe you mean with gc something other than I.
00:28<mbreslin>czr: do you understand "i've written more to each cell than wear leveling could ever keep up with"
00:28<mbreslin>the entire drive has received terabytes
00:29<czr>gc = automatically shuffling data around so that single blocks may be automatically erased in order to release them for new writes. based on knowing what is "in use" and "what is not". without fs-level data, you cannot know that.
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00:29<czr>mbreslin, what is the writing pattern?
00:29<czr>if it's linear, then your test does not test gc.
00:29<czr>if it's buffered over the NAND block size, it does not test gc.
00:30<Boohemian>amitz: yes, surprisingly. they have been fine. i am being VERY cautious. it doesn't make sense. i had surgery a few days ago -- the pain meds are making me VERY loopy
00:30<czr>Boohemian, maybe not the best time to build a laptop wishlist? :-)
00:30<mbreslin>what is making it so i'm still able to write without first erasing the block hence leading to horribly slow performance over time
00:30<czr>mbreslin, can you answer the write pattern question?
00:31<mbreslin>i didn't write iometer?
00:31<mbreslin>it's 4k random read/write
00:31<czr>right. which iometer test?
00:31<czr>right. good.
00:31<czr>over block or fs?
00:31<vraa>that way you get a hefty discount and you can customize your laptop, that's what i did
00:31<mbreslin>4k alligned
00:31<vraa>i paid about 1700$ for mine, it's got 2.53ghz core i5, 8gb ram, 160gb ssd, touchscreen, etc
00:32<czr>mbreslin, what's making it is that vms cache writes into large continous operations, and when the operations span a single NAND block, the block can be erased and properly reused again up to a point.
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00:32<czr>mbreslin, did you run iometer for how much I/O? the multiple terabytes?
00:33-!-Knight [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:33<amitz>Boohemian: oh... you mean despite you being visibly cautious they welcome you with open arm?
00:33<mbreslin>between iometer and the other popular ssd benchmarks
00:33<czr>the worst case test (for wl) is writing single 512-byte sectors randomly and reading them back to validate.
00:33<Boohemian>czr: hehe, always a good time when you're high on dilaudid :P
00:33<Boohemian>amitz: i am being VERY cautious - i don't understand how they did such a 180 degree turn
00:33<Boohemian>they went from telling caroline i would kill her to being genuinely nice to me
00:33<czr>the worst case test for gc support is creating random count of random sized small files at different dir depths and then randomly removing them (in parallel with creating new ones).
00:34<user6484>what user does apache run under?
00:34<czr>also, it can be made worse by randomly) appending and overwriting parts of existing files.
00:34<czr>user6484, depends on distro.
00:34<user6484>ubuntu 10.4?
00:34<czr>www-data, www, something like that.
00:34<czr>user6484, ps aux | grep apache
00:36<user6484>user6484 1913 0.0 0.0 2435120 532 s000 S+ 12:35AM 0:00.00 grep apache
00:36<mbreslin>that's 4k random read
00:36<user6484>ssh got dropped :)
00:36<czr>AFAIK iometer is not a reliability measurement tool
00:36<mbreslin>of what?
00:36<amitz>Boohemian: well, for me, what matter is how important is her family to her. If they're not important, just ignore her. But if they're important, I'll get into the core of the problem. *shrug*
00:36<czr>mbreslin, of wear
00:37<czr>or gc or whatever
00:37<mbreslin>you acknowledge it's accurate in reporting iops correct?
00:37<czr>I don't see why not, but that wasn't the issue.
00:37<czr>user6484, your apache is not running
00:38<mbreslin>if gc wasn't working i could not possibly get the same amount of iops as when the drives were new
00:38<user6484>czr: got it its www-data
00:38<czr>mbreslin, I see your nice pic, and raise it with
00:38<user6484>thanks, so now how do i give write access to the directory for www-data?
00:38<czr>mbreslin, did you disable the write cache for the test?
00:38<czr>and did iometer use directio?
00:38<czr>and set the kernel queue size to 1?
00:39<mbreslin>errrr all this fuss of yours is to do with linux?
00:39<mbreslin>futuremark apps don't run in linux
00:39<czr>wasn't that obviously when I mentioned gc support for ext?
00:40<czr>obvious even.
00:40<mbreslin>i thought you knew the internal fs of the controller or something
00:40<mbreslin>sorry i have no idea about gc for ext
00:40<czr>heh :-)
00:40*czr hugs mbreslin
00:40<mbreslin>what is that graph?
00:40<mbreslin>sequential transfer or something?
00:41<czr>linear read speed in MB over the whole disk
00:41<czr>MiB/sec even
00:41<czr>left = start, right = logical end.
00:41<mbreslin>i see
00:41<mbreslin>i'll take my 10 orders of magnitude faster latency
00:41<mbreslin>for random read/writes
00:41<czr>well, the graphs don't show latency
00:42<mbreslin>they don't need to, the drives are mechanical
00:42<mbreslin>the arm only goes so fast ;p
00:42<mbreslin>does linux have some kind of native command queuing
00:42<mbreslin>i assume it does
00:42<czr>and for that drive the RAL for the whole logical area was around 13ms AFAIR
00:42<straterra>My arm breaks the sound barrier
00:42<straterra>mbreslin: It does if the drive/chipset support it
00:43<czr>mbreslin, err, linux supports SCSI command queueing, and obviously SATA NCQ as well
00:43<czr>mbreslin, sitting on top of that there are queue managers and i/o schedulers
00:43<czr>my ARM runs at 400MHz :-(.
00:43<straterra>Overclock that shit
00:44<czr>I could.
00:44<mbreslin>i'm mostly a gamer and use linux for apache for django for small non-resource intensive things that haven't gotten me to learn about linux's full abilities
00:44<czr>it has sw programmable PLL. no locking or whatever.
00:44*czr nods
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00:50<eyecool>would you guys call linode VM's or VPS's
00:50<Boohemian>so, for a 1200-1500 USD laptop that will run linux fine (i am mostly concerned with wifi, any recommendations besides the thinkpad t410?
00:50<eyecool>I'm trying to educate the masses... but VPS to them is hostgator or fK even godaddy has vps now
00:51<czr>eyecool, VM is technical. VPS is more of "what you can do with it".
00:51<nick125>Boohemian: I'm happy with my Thinkpad..
00:51<czr>so comparing VM to VPS doesn't make sense.
00:52<Boohemian>nick125: which one do you have?
00:52<eyecool>czr: thx.. I'll go with VM's.. a term that hasn't been bastardized my marketing arms at puke hosts
00:52<czr>in venn, you'd have something like VPS( VM( xen (linode))))
00:52<czr>eyecool, safer choice probably :-)
00:53<nick125>Boohemian: I have a W510, but that's a bit out of your price range.
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00:57<Boohemian>nick125: what is your screen res? i have a 17 MBP now, and LOVE the screen and the resolution, but maybe i'd be happy with a 1400x1000-ish screen res, if it were half the price
00:58<Boohemian>i am planning on selling my mbp, i can fetch at least 1900 USD for it
00:58<fulg0re>give mbp 17"
00:58<fulg0re>hey, so i've got a fresh debian lenny install here, and when i run screen i get this error "Sorry, could not find a PTY."
00:59<fulg0re>anyone dealt with this before?
00:59<nick125>Boohemian: 1920x1080
00:59<fulg0re>google gives horrifying answers
00:59<bob2>mount | grep dev
01:01<Boohemian>which linux distro would you recommend on a laptop? (i don't want debian or ubuntu!)
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01:02<devsforev>fulg0re: install udev. that worked for me a couple months ago.
01:03<Milos|Netbook>I just wanted to say that I signed up to Linode yesterday and I think the service is simply amazing.
01:03<bob2>seriously, mount | grep dev
01:03<fulg0re>bob2: nothing looks strange there
01:03<fulg0re>udev on /dev type tmpfs (rw,mode=0755)
01:03<fulg0re>among other things
01:03<bob2>right, I didn't want to see the output
01:03<bob2>especially the bit about whether it has devpts mounted or not
01:05<fulg0re>so yeah, no devpts mounted
01:05<fulg0re>good times
01:05<bob2>that'll do it
01:06<@psandin>fulg0re: Debian will automount /dev/pts, but only if /dev/ isn't mounted on devtmpfs
01:07<@psandin>you can wiggle the automount devtmpfs knob on your config profile and debian will take care of itself
01:07<fulg0re>ah. ok
01:07<fulg0re>very good. thank you sir
01:07<Boohemian>something that doesn't compile... i also don't want fedora
01:07<@psandin>or you can leave it mounting devtmpfs setting as it is and add an explict entry for /dev/pts
01:07<bob2>the commercial backing of debian with the excellent package management tools of fedora
01:08<@psandin>it'd be so nice if everybody could just pick on method of handling /dev/ and stick with it
01:08<@psandin>and I want a pony too
01:08<fulg0re>any reason i'd want dev automounting to devtmpfs?
01:09<@psandin>Some distributions (Ubuntu 9.10+, recent Fedora) require it
01:09<@psandin>Debian 6 may be in that group too, but we'll see after it's releaseed
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01:11<eyecool>how about Perl 6?!
01:11*eyecool drools
01:11<fulg0re>sweet. that did the trick
01:12<bob2>eyecool: low blow
01:13<eyecool>bob2: CPAN !
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01:30<Jascal>I have a question
01:30<Jascal>Anyone have a link to a doc that would show me how to install a VPN to Ubuntu 10.4 LTS
01:31<bob2>so close
01:31<@psandin>I paused, thought I was too late but I got the right number
01:32<@psandin>point for me
01:32<bob2><- defeated
01:32<@psandin><- a very fleshy bot
01:32<Jascal>Humm... why couldn't I find that...
01:33<Hoggs>Aren't they pretty much identical anyway? >_>
01:33<@psandin>shh, I'm enjoying my technical victory
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01:34<@psandin>there are 6 differences 3 of which are just white space
01:35<bob2>+1 for bothering to verify your success with diff
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01:38<jameswilson>could anyone give me the brief explanation on how to ensure mail originating from a server hosting A record goes OUT to the internet to find the right MX record instead of keeping it locally?
01:39<bob2>do you mean "my mail server accepts incoming mail for but I don't want it to accept local mail for"?
01:39<jameswilson>this is when DNS is hosted remotely, obviously. im sure theres gotta be a tut somewhere for this, but i cant think of the right search terms
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01:40<jameswilson>bob2: no, more like: "my mail server X accepts incoming mail for, and my webserver Y cant seem to get the mail off the machine onto X, it stays locally"
01:41<bob2> is a web server that needs to send mail to
01:41<bob2>however keeps tryign to deliver that mail locally
01:41<bob2>tell the MTA on to not handle mail for that locally
01:41<bob2>e.g. on postfix remove it from mydestinations
01:41<bob2>and virtual_mumble
01:42<jameswilson>ok, i had the mydestinations right…. didnt know about virtual_mumble.
01:43<bob2>pastebinz /etc/postfix/
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01:44<jameswilson>… workin on it.
01:45<bob2>why does everyone else have real ellipses but me
01:46<jameswilson>bob2: your OS / and or IRC app?
01:47<jameswilson><— adium + mac os x here
01:47<bob2>oh, right
01:47<bob2>life is much easier if you give machines a hostname in a domain
01:47<bob2>instead of making the hostname be a domain
01:47<jameswilson>i need to rename myhostname to the actual subdomain (i mean hostname of the machine)
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01:50<mbreslin>wc -l links
01:50<mbreslin>105543 links
01:50<jameswilson>also bob2, the last line: myorigin = $mydomain, is that defined somewhere i dont know about?? or is that statement really doing nothing
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01:50<mbreslin>those are rss links, i need to grab every one and parse it for a pubsubhub/rsscloud tag, would you use threads for this?
01:51<mbreslin>or just a simple loop
01:51<bob2>jameswilson: I think that line is pointless
01:51<bob2>it defaults to myhostname
01:52<jameswilson>thanks bob2. ur a lifesaver.
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02:16<jameswilson>ugh, while that probably definitely helped the situation, it didnt fix it :/
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02:17<bob2>pastebinz and log
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02:22<jameswilson>logs comming.
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02:24<bob2>myorigin needs to be something different too
02:24<bob2>really, give your machine a real hostname
02:24<bob2>so 'hostname -f' prints and 'hostname' prints foo
02:27<bob2>honest to god man
02:27<bob2>postini bounced it because the user didn't exist
02:29<jameswilson>yes, that much is obvious, there isnt going to be a user on the machine.
02:29<bob2>so, short story: the address is wrong or someone messed up your postiini config
02:29<jameswilson>cause its the webhost… going to fix your recommendations for myorigin
02:31<jameswilson>is the myhostname, supposed to be fully qualified? (equal to hostname -f)?
02:32<jameswilson>because currently the fqh is,
02:33<bob2>anyway, the problem is postini is refusing the destination address
02:33<jameswilson>i read that $mydomain default is to use$myhostname minus the first component
02:33<bob2>unelss your problem is "it shouldn't be sending the email to postini", it's not a postfix problem
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02:35<jameswilson>what is postini?
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02:40<jameswilson>im trying to figure out why postfix picked up the email to the domain, when its clearly not set to 'listen' for mail to that domain.
02:40<bob2>not going to continue this unless you post unredacted logs and configs
02:42<jameswilson>ok, no problem with that. didnt know that was a kosher thing to do here
02:42<jameswilson>^ post unedited logs.
02:48<bob2>so what's the problem?'s MX points at postini, which is where postfix is tryign to send it
02:48<bob2>postini unfortunately says doesn't exist
02:49<jameswilson>hrm. wrong piece of log info
02:50<jameswilson>no its right.
02:50<jameswilson>is the line in question.
02:51<bob2>what part of that line do you think is wrong?
02:51<jameswilson>why is postfix listening for mail at domain
02:51<jameswilson>why didnt the mail get sent outside the webserver
02:51<bob2>presumably because your machine thinks it's domain is
02:51<jameswilson>those are logs for postfix on the webserver… that only hosts mail for subdomains
02:51<bob2>and line 36 says "hey take mail for $mydomain"
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02:52<bob2>so the logs and config are for the web server
02:52<bob2>wait, nevermind
02:52<jameswilson>i mis read "minus the first component"
02:52<bob2>it's relaying
02:53<jameswilson>$mydomain value for $myhostname, would be
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02:54<jameswilson>what value could i give mydomain, so that it doesnt accept "everything from *" and only listens on what ive specified for $mydestination
02:55<bob2>I'm lost
02:55<bob2>nothing you have pasted so far indicates that that is happening
02:56<bob2>what line of the logs makes you think that this is happening?
02:56<jameswilson>i see the logs picking up and trying to process an email to and then bouncing it because the mail couldnt be found.
02:57<jameswilson>i dont see anything about it forwarding that email outward
02:57<bob2>it tried to deliver it to postini
02:57<bob2>read the logs again
02:57<bob2>Jan 12 02:45:47 linode1 postfix/smtp[30231]: ED30F60FB: to=<>,[]:25, delay=0.97, delays=0.02/0.01/0.26/0.69, dsn=5.3.0, status=bounced (host[] said: 553 5.3.0 <>... no such - on relay of: MAIL FROM:<> (in reply to RCPT TO command))
02:57<bob2>= the MX record for indicates I should send this email to postini, however it said "" is not a valid email address
02:57<bob2>Jan 12 02:45:48 linode1 postfix/smtp[30234]: 1710060FE: to=<>,[]:25, delay=0.45, delays=0/0/0.26/0.19, dsn=5.0.0, status=bounced (host[] said: 550 No such user - psmtp (in reply to RCPT TO command))
02:58<jameswilson>now were talking
02:58<jameswilson>cant read freakin logs
02:58<bob2>= because it said the above address was invalid, I tried to send a bounce. however, hilariously, you set the envelope-from to be the same address that bounced! so now we're fucked
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03:03<icepup>Having a bit of an issue with following the Library's "security basics" guide when it comes to disabling ssh's PasswordAuthentication (Ubuntu 10.04)
03:04<icepup>When I try to connect through ssh, it won't allow me, so I gather that something went wrong when I generated the local keys and uploaded them.
03:04<bob2>how did you copy them?
03:04<dcraig>Ctrl+C, duh.
03:05<icepup>bob2, that is one of the steps I didn't quite follow exactly, because I did use scp, however my user on my linode did not have a .ssh directory under his home directory.
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03:05<icepup>so i copied them to home, and then from another root session, I ran the echo, cat >> ~/.ssh/authorized_keys
03:05<bob2>yeah, scp will break it
03:05<icepup>however that .ssh wasn't there, so I created it by hand.
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03:06<icepup>bob2, scp will break it? that was what was suggested in the library guide
03:06<bob2>login via lish and I bet the perms on ~/.ssh or ~/.ssh/authorized_keys are wrong
03:06<dcraig>it's important to make sure your .ssh directory is only readable by you
03:06<bob2>they need to be unreadable by anyone other than you
03:06<icepup>oh i see
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03:06<bob2>ssh-copy-id exists on modern unix systems (aside from OS X for some godforsakenreason)
03:06<dcraig>it must not be a modern unix system
03:06<icepup>so the file permissions on that file should be readable only to that user. ok. another side question. should the passphrase I create when i gen'd the local keys match my remote user's password?
03:07<icepup>or is that note related?
03:07<icepup>because mine don't
03:08<bob2>passphrase key is used to encrypt the private key on your machine
03:08<icepup>ok, but i was right to give it a passphrase? because it was optional when i ran the keygen
03:08<bob2>the remote machine never sees it
03:08<bob2>it is good to do so, but optional - if you don't, it just makes passwordless ssh one step easier
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03:10<icepup>hmm, so my authorized_keys file under ~/.ssh has perms of -rw-r--r--
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03:12<bob2>which leads to sshd saying "go away"
03:12<bob2>make it only readable by you
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03:15<icepup>bob2, guess this is ultra noobish, but i gather that chmod 400 <filename> should do that, right?
03:15<bob2>I can't do octal
03:16<bob2>chmod go= filename
03:16<jtsage>icepup- 600 for read/write.
03:18<icepup>Ok, hmm, that didn't work. I restarted ssh too. I dunno, I feel like there must be something else at play. I get the message Permission denied (publickey).
03:18<bob2>ls -ld ~/.ssh
03:18<bob2>that dir has to be unreadable by others, too
03:18<bob2>and no, ssh will give that error for just about everything
03:21<icepup>Ah I didn't do that. Ok, Chrome and Lish don't like each other
03:21<bob2>you can ssh to lish btw
03:21<bob2>the browser thing is just for super duper emergencies when you have no ssh client
03:21<jtsage>that error message at least implies that sshd didn't find a matching key in authorized_keys - either one wasn't sent for login, or the one sent didn't match anything
03:21<bob2>or the perms are wrong
03:22<bob2>or your user is banned from logging in
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03:25<icepup>bob2, it's a fresh install. should i try regenerating the keys?
03:26<bob2>fix the perms on ~/.ssh
03:26<icepup>i did that
03:26<icepup>my ~/.ssh and authorized_keys both have drw------- for perms
03:26<jtsage>icepup- if you're on ubuntu, /var/log/auth.log may provide more insight. it might also tell you a whole lot of nothing.
03:27<bob2>~/.ssh has to be executable
03:28<icepup>Ok, ~/.ssh is now drwx------, and ~/.ssh/authorized_keys is drw-------
03:28<icepup>jtsage, thanks i'll look at that
03:28<bob2>by default it logs bupkiss iirc
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03:30<jtsage>bob2- ubuntu (at least recent) drops bad user logins and the pam crap there. like i said, sometime helpful, sometimes a whole lot of nothing - depends what is happening
03:30<bob2>but: make sure ~/.ssh is u=rwx,go=, ~/.ssh/authorized_keys is u=rw,go=, make sure contents of ~/.ssh/authorized_keys on remote machine matches ~/.ssh/ on local machine
03:30<bob2>jtsage: ah, sorry, didn't realise it had changed
03:31<jtsage>nor did I until i was troubleshooting something equally dumb. actually, that file gets a bit more verbose than need be, tends to grow fast
03:33<icepup>ok, auth.log has tons of crap in it. i feel like i'm way over my head by trying to disable password authentication and using keys. i know it shouldn't be this hard. i must have done something wrong along the way, i'm inclined to just toss this build, which i've no investment in, and spin up a new ubuntu image.
03:33<icepup>or maybe just live with password authentication
03:33<bob2>do the above
03:33<bob2>it is almsot certainly one of those things
03:34<icepup>ok, i'm not following you on what go= means. otherwise i have that file and directory permissioned as you've suggested. i will however go and verify the files match, i hadn't looked at that yet.
03:34<bob2>ls -ld ~/.ssh ~/.ssh/authorized_keys
03:34<bob2>^ paste
03:37<icepup>drwx------ 2 icepup icepup 4096 Jan 12 08:00 /home/icepup/.ssh
03:37<icepup>-rw------- 1 icepup icepup 23 Jan 12 08:00 /home/icepup/.ssh/authorized_keys
03:38<jtsage>icepup- what's your local machine? is putty and/or windows involved in this mix? windows doesn't always play nice with key files
03:38<icepup>THe files match, although I notice that at the end of the file it has my user@host for my local machine. I guess that's supposed to be there, even though my local username doesn't match my remote one?
03:38<bob2>that's fine
03:38<icepup>no i'm osx snow leopard
03:39<bob2>are you telling ssh to use the correct user?
03:39<Marius>oh goodie
03:39<Marius>joomla 1.6 ...
03:39<bob2>yay php cms
03:39<icepup>bob2, i'm sshing in with -l icepup
03:39<Marius>Don't mock php!
03:39<Marius>I like php, I just don't like joomla
03:39<Marius>which is ironic since I maintain a server dedicated to joomla deployments
03:40<praetorian>bob2: \\\\\ more like
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03:41<jtsage>icepup- 'ssh -v user@host' it will tell you a lot, part of it might be whats going wrong
03:41<aces1up>hey all just signed up, how long does it typically take to provision a server?
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03:42<Marius>aces1up, usually as close to instant as it gets, but there are factors to take count for
03:42<Marius>Such as if you get marked for manual approval and the likes
03:43<jtsage>aces1up- assuming you were not auto-approved through the magic credit card checker thing, generally not more than a little while. depends if any staff members are awake
03:43<aces1up>bummer.. need this thing up by morning or my ass :)
03:44<icepup>jtsage, thanks, when i run that on remote lish, it says it can't resolve what i've given for host, which of course is the host name for my mac
03:45<aces1up>well i got the payment receipt in my email.. like almost instant.
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03:45<jtsage>icepup- other way around - run that locally to ssh to your linode. the -v is verbose mode, it'll dump all the authentication talking that ssh does.
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03:46<aces1up>anyone have any suggestions for apps that will protect agains ddos?
03:46<aces1up>say on a specific port?
03:46<bob2>that's not really how the internet works
03:47<Marius>aces1up, yo udon't protect against ddo
03:47<icepup>jtsage, hold up. what should my ssh command be to login? it shouldn't be my username on the remote?
03:47<bob2>I mean, you can firewall it locally, but you're still getting smashed
03:47<icepup>it should be the user@host ?
03:47<Marius>You take it like a man
03:47<bob2>linode will nullroute your ip if you like
03:47<bob2>then kick you out if it happens a lot ;)
03:47<Marius>What are yo usetting up, considering you expect DDoS?
03:48<jtsage>icepup- it's a shortcut. for instance, from home, I connect to my linode using something more of less like : 'ssh'
03:48<aces1up>nothing, i think that why my other server crashed but can't be certain. i'm just setting up a web site.
03:48<aces1up>i was using a crappy vps though only 64mb.. so that could be it too.
03:48<jtsage>and yes, 'myname' is the remote user. ssh dosen't particualarly care what the local username is
03:50<icepup>jtsage, i see. ok, well it spit out some semi interesting stuff
03:51<jtsage>if you wanna paste what it spit out here: we might be able to tell you a bit more
03:52<Marius>I've been dos'd twice =(
03:52<Marius>Although I think I got a "get out of trouble fre" card o nthe 1st one, because any evidence of it was removed o_O
03:52<finra>are you mirroring wikileaks or something??
03:52<Marius>(my graphs showing it suddenly got cleared)
03:53<Marius>Twice in my ... 2 or 3 years with linode
03:53<Marius>I make skids angry, they do not like me very much :P
03:53<amitz>Marius: perhaps greater power at work.
03:53<Marius>amitz, it was a pretty bad hit as well the 1st time
03:54<icepup>jtsage: what i posted was the last lines of the output, everything prior to that was fine, and unrelated
03:54<jtsage>icepup- ok, so, it is reading (on your local machine) ~/.ssh/identity, ~/.ssh/id_rsa, and ~/.ssh/id_dsa. but it isn't finding the corresponding .pub on the server.
03:55<icepup>jtsage, hmm, you mean it's not offering the local ~/.ssh/ is it?
03:55<icepup>i have two local files, ~/.ssh/id_rsa, and ~/.ssh/
03:55<jtsage>often when i have this issue, it's nothing more than me managing to screw up the copy process - you could try emptying authorized_keys and refilling it with the .pub
03:56<icepup>isn't the problem though local?
03:56<jtsage>yes. the one without the .pub is the private key - the part your local machine uses. that 'matches' the public key that goes in the authorized_keys file on the server
03:57<icepup>so my local box is sending over what's in the .pub file
03:58<jtsage>of a sort, yes. iirc, it's actually sending an encrypted message, using the non .pub file, which the .pub file on the other side can decode
04:03<jtsage>icepup- i know you checked to make sure that the .pub file and the authorized_keys files matched - but did you make sure that it was all on one line in authorized_keys? no extra linebreak anywhere? that bit me once.
04:04<icepup>ok, i retried the two commands from the guide, the 2nd one is failing, it's interpreting the cat command to be local.. really not sure why that is.
04:04<icepup>jtsage, yeah that's why i want to recopy it over
04:04<icepup>but i'm not able to get these two commands to work, the first one does, the scp, but then the ssh echo cat... fails
04:04<icepup>can't i just run that from an existing ssh session on the remote?
04:04<jtsage>if you have an editor on the server (pico for instance), you can actually just copy and paste the contents
04:05<praetorian>ugh, pico.
04:05<jtsage>praetorian- aye, but i know it's in the default install of ubuntu. so is vim-tiny which is just a horrible, horrible bastardization
04:06<praetorian>it is? i thought they installed nano?
04:06<jtsage>is it? my bad maybe. been a while since i've set up a new box without immediatlly installing the full version of vim
04:07<Marius>Dont' diss pico =(
04:07<Marius>it was the first editor I ever used!
04:08<jtsage>heh. edlin was the first editor i ever used. unless C64 basic counts...
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04:08<icepup>jtsage, wow. it worked this time, osx prompted me for my passphrase to use the local key
04:09<icepup>only thing i regret was saving it in my local keyring. guess i will have to google how to undo that on osx
04:10<jtsage>it's under the keyring manager (or something like that). point-n-click too iirc
04:11<icepup>jtsage and bob2, many thanks. and i just verified from my local linux VM instance that i was unable to ssh in, so it's working from both perspectives.
04:11<icepup>jtsage, thanks for the keyring info. i'll find it.
04:12<jtsage>coolio - glad it's working now
04:13<praetorian>if ubuntu has pico its probably a symlink
04:13*praetorian boots the ubuntu vm
04:13<jtsage>praetorian- right you are. header says nano indeed
04:14<jtsage>actually editors are the one thing that drove me crazy when i switched from freebsd to linux a few years back... i've always used vim for heavy stuff, but used to use 'ee' for the quick stuff.
04:15<icepup>jtsage, hmm, i deleted the keyring file, but still able to login. maybe i have to kill the terminal session or open a new one. Nope that didn't work either. Still logs in w/o prompting me for the passphrase
04:15<praetorian>i always used "jed"
04:15<praetorian>but now its vim
04:16<jtsage>icepup- it probably caches it in memory. if not, it is also possible that osx runs ssh-agent in the background, which would also cache it for a little while
04:16<praetorian>and of course, virtualbox needs to be upgraded.
04:16<icepup>jtsage, i see, good point. many thanks all. i'm sure i'll be back soon with more noobish questions, but i'll try to read up first :)
04:17<jtsage>hrm. they changed the behavior of screen under ubuntu again, didn't they? a detach did not used to log me out as well... that's sort of convienent until it's not
04:18<praetorian>that seems weird.
04:18<jtsage>it's not really screen anymore. it's '
04:19<jtsage>er, it's 'byobu'... it reattaches on login too, which is *very* handy
04:19<icepup>jtsage, i use tmux, does the same i believe
04:19<praetorian>yeah, ive moved to tmux recently.
04:19<icepup>jtsage, unless you're talking about something entirely diff.
04:20<jtsage>what's this now? i don't know tmux at all. looks interesting
04:20<praetorian>seems to just be a fork of screen
04:21<icepup>i pretty much live in it, i never use the osx terminal tabs anymore. not sure how it's better to screen, as i'm new to it all, but it is so i'm told
04:21<jtsage>it's pretty. (at least the screenshots are)
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04:22<praetorian>nod, and fixes some problems seen has apparently
04:22<praetorian>and features (like vertical splits without a patch!)
04:23<jtsage>gonna need to explore this more tommorow. I really should already be in bed
04:27<praetorian>doh. my ubuntu vm requires my ldap server to be up
04:27*praetorian boots that vm as well
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05:15<linbot>New news from forums: Rewrite rule: to in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
05:15*heckman sips his tea
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05:17*amitz sips heckman's tea.
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05:45*czr ships amitz's tea
05:46<amitz>tzar's ship on amitz's pee.
05:46*schwullo shits in czr's tea
05:47*czr doesn't drink tea
05:47<czr>(for obvious reasons)
05:48<amitz>I'd like to use this opportunity to tell the people of #linode that there is justice in this world.
05:48<amitz>that's all.
05:49<czr>there is. some. not for all obviously.
05:49*czr is happy finally
05:50<czr>got our IR stuff working, whee.
05:50<amitz>congratulation! iphone5? ;-)
05:51<amitz>from now on, I will assume that you're working on iphone5.
05:51<czr>I'm not sure if I'd like to work on it though. I like C too much
05:51<amitz>czr: I want kitchen sink!
05:52<czr>and a ring to sink into it?
05:52-!-dkam [] has joined #linode
05:52<amitz>yes, moar features! but make it small. Smaller than iphone4
05:52<dkam>Anyone know when Freemont will become available for new hosts?
05:52<czr>ah. a phone the size of ipod nano?
05:53<amitz>dkam: you can register to linode, and open your ticket to put you into queue for fremont.
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05:54<amitz>czr: yes, but with an HD screen.
05:54<dkam>amitz: so - buy the host, then create a support ticket asking for freemont?
05:55<czr>amitz, why would you want a harley davidson in your tiny phone?
05:55<amitz>dkam: well, hmm, you must ask for confirmation but maybe you can buy a host, destroy the linode, and open the ticket to put you in queue so that your money is not consumed towards a linode at a location you don't want.
05:55<czr>but no. no phones. almost got into a project to design one some years back, but luckily didn't join it
05:56<dkam>amitz: I've already bought the host - next step is to choose location - Fremont is not available.
05:56<amitz>czr: is phone messy?
05:56<czr>amitz, yes. gsm = uglycious.
05:57*snubby is alive
05:57<czr>that wasn't the main reason though. the main reason was that they didn't want to pay a decent salary and planned to hire most of their work force straight from uni's.
05:57<amitz>dkam: my suggestion is to buy somewhere else first, then destroy the linode immediately. You will lost 1/31 of your money though. But you need to confirm this workaround with an op in this channel.
05:57<czr>which would suck ass in the long run. 20 java coders..
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06:03<@heckman>work around?
06:03<amitz>better than 20 perl coders. Imagine the smell.
06:03*amitz hides :-D
06:03<@heckman>dkam: what size Linode you running?
06:03<linbot>heckman: Fremont512 - 43, Fremont768 - 29, Fremont1024 - 0, Fremont1536 - 21, Fremont2048 - 12, Fremont4096 - 7, Fremont8192 - 6, Fremont12288 - 2, Fremont16384 - 2, Fremont20480 - 1
06:04<dkam>Thank you heckman - I see the issue now.
06:04<czr>amitz, heh
06:05<@heckman>dkam: if you want, set the Linode in Dallas (or wherever) and do not deploy or create disk images.
06:05<@heckman>Open a support ticket, and I'll see if I can a 1024 for you in Fremont in a few hours.
06:05*heckman needs to wait until a sysadmin comes in.
06:05<dkam>heckman: Ticket: 335287
06:06<@heckman>Oh...that's you.
06:06<@heckman>I've tagged myself on the ticket. Just sit your Linode in Dallas.
06:06<@heckman>I'll make sure ti get it taken care of as best I can for you.
06:06<amitz>heckman: so, the money eating won't start until the linode is deployed or a disk image is created?
06:07<@heckman>Technically ... he's allocated resources so it starts now.
06:07<@heckman>But the billing system invoices by the day, not per hour/minute.
06:07<dkam>heckman: I've just deleted the host - I'll get a 1536 host.
06:07<encode>you deleted the host?
06:07<@heckman>Ah, okay man. Sorry I couldn't offer you a solution right now. If you want to bump down in the future you can do so from the Linode manager.
06:07*czr reminds of the time when I deleted the internet
06:07<@heckman>Mind if I close the ticket dkam ?
06:08<amitz>ah, so at worst (s)he lost 1/31 of money then. Assuming (s)he doesn't get the linode today?
06:08<@heckman>*URMOM IS BOLD*
06:08*encode deletes the gibson
06:08<warren>heckman: dude, do you ever sleep?
06:08<dkam>heckman: no - not at all. Thanks for your help.
06:08<@heckman>I got three hours last night.
06:08<warren>it seems you're always here.
06:08<encode>it's a requirement of linode staff that they not sleep
06:09<amitz>warren: no, the beard photosynthesis hence makes sleeping unnecessary.
06:09<@heckman>I had off yesterday
06:09<@heckman>I was just lurking from home for awhile.
06:09<warren>amitz: you mean he goes into the sunlight?
06:09<@heckman>Single in an area I recently moved to = lots of time at home
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06:10<czr>you live in some forest?
06:10<czr>but it got squirrels and stuff, no?
06:10<warren>good eatin'
06:10<@heckman>There's woods everywhere.
06:10<@heckman>but I'm not much for squirrel hunting.
06:10<czr>also according to disney they can saw clothes and stuff.
06:10<@heckman>end up shooting myself...
06:11<czr>you could do it manually. just run after them trying to grab them with your hands
06:11<czr>hunting with rifles is only fair when the animals can fire their at you.
06:11<czr>theirs even.
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06:18<amitz>warren: or flourescent light.
06:18<@heckman>This snow storm sucked...
06:19<amitz>heckman: or just throw your beard around, some animals are bound to be catch by it.
06:20-!-Guest4132 [~Paul@adsl-83-100-196-235.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit []
06:20<amitz>heckman: yes, I always fantasize about you with larger beard.
06:20<@heckman>I am working on it.
06:21<czr>it's snowing as we speak
06:21<@heckman>It rained, then snowed, then rained a bit more
06:21<@heckman>So it's like a frozen mess
06:21<czr>it was quite springy couple of days back
06:21<czr>all happy faces and that.
06:21<amitz>snow? what snow? ;-)
06:21<czr>not any more.. sad, dark and all that crap.
06:21<czr>amitz, crystallized "water" molecules.
06:22<czr>well, mostly water anyway.
06:22<amitz>czr: is that a technical term, crystalizaed. Because I still don't know the difference between ice and snow...
06:23<czr>ice is the same thing. packed more closely
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06:24<amitz>hmm i see
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06:25<czr>so is fluffy. mostly.
06:25<czr>however it "turns into" ice as it semimelts and re-freezes again
06:28<amitz>hmmm is snow/ice mower expensive? I mean why don't people make the smaller versions for home use?
06:28<czr>what do you mean "home use"?
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06:29<amitz>well, for your lawn, etc.
06:29<czr>snow on the lawn isn't really a big issue.
06:29<czr>snow on driveways and roofs is.
06:29<czr>especially in larger cities, getting the snow out of the driveways generates tonns upon tonns of snow that needs to be heaved somewhere
06:29<amitz>what's bad about snow on roofs? driveways, yeah slippery.
06:29<czr>snow weights a lot
06:30<czr>if you have one cubic metre of snow on a sq mem area, you can do the math yourself.
06:30<czr>packed snow that is.
06:31<dstufft>yea snow weighs a lot
06:31<amitz>can't you just design your house so that you can melt the snow and let it flow in a public reservoir?
06:31<dstufft>people's roofs cave in from the snow often enough it can be a problem
06:31<czr>amitz, melting snow means that you have to pump huge amounts of energy against the outside wather
06:31<amitz>ah.... large reservoir
06:31<czr>weather even.
06:31<czr>so it isn't very sane way to use energy
06:31<dstufft>that would require a heater yea
06:32<dstufft>it's mostly a problem (roof wise) on flat roofs
06:32<czr>plus the melting water would just drip down and refreeze somewhere else
06:32<dstufft>since it just sits there and doesn't do much
06:32<dstufft>on angular roofs it tends to fall off before it gets heavy enough to do something
06:32<amitz>dstufft: aah..
06:32<czr>tends do. yes :-).
06:33<dstufft>and driveway/walk/roadway, if you live in an area with a decent amount of population, finding someplace to put all that snow is a big headache
06:33<czr>it is indeed.
06:33<czr>we've been normally dumping most of the snow into the sea, but the sea is frozen now
06:34<amitz>so... I take it most people in 4 seasons part of the world hate snow?
06:34<czr>so now we're clearing out large farming areas and preparing the soil so that it can be used as the dumping ground.
06:34<dstufft>i live near philadelphia
06:34<dstufft>we have a bunch of it
06:34<dstufft>i don't mind it
06:34<czr>snow is ok. just not all "yay, wonderful" stuff :-).
06:34<czr>especially in norther/southern countries snow offsets some of the darkness
06:34<czr>since snow reflects light
06:35<amitz>ooh, interesting
06:35<dstufft>you just gotta factor snow into your descision making
06:35<czr>up north, you can get what people call "snow blindness"
06:35<czr>you go skiing on a sunny day for many hours without shades
06:35<czr>then you come back and don't see anything for a day or so
06:35<czr>cause people don't really factor in the reflecting sun
06:35<dstufft>my fiancee has a mustang, which is completly worthless car for driving in the snow
06:36<dstufft>but i have an explorer, so when it snows we just use that :D
06:36<czr>also, ironic as it might seem, sometimes people burn their skin like this. although assuming that they've had no exposure to sun otherwise :-)
06:36<amitz>czr: so they're stuck somewhere out there? heh
06:36<dstufft>snow blindness sucks yea
06:36<czr>I had a friend who liked to do mountaineering
06:36<dstufft>i like driving around town during/right after a snow
06:37<czr>and he was somewhere in norway doing his thing, and was out of shape. so ended up breathing through the mount a lot
06:37<dstufft>since most people don't have cars capable of driving around in it, it's kind of neat
06:37<czr>after the climb, they went back to the lodge and had some pancakes and strawberry jam
06:37<czr>and he thought it was some spicy stuff. ended up he burned his tongue while climbing
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06:37<amitz>czr: haha
06:37<czr>yes. weird stuff happens. all the time.
06:38<amitz>the cartoons shows it but how about freezing pee?
06:38<dstufft>that doesn't happen, well you would need really cold temperatures for that to happen atleast
06:38<czr>oh, you mean falling mostly water liquid that freezes before hitting the ground?
06:38<czr>snow happens :-).
06:38<dstufft>pee is warm when coming out of the body
06:38<czr>the distance obviously is quite much longer
06:39<amitz>yeah, or making connected ice from the ground to your little friend.
06:39<czr>I think realistically you'd need something like -70C to do that
06:39<amitz>ah, good point, it's warm initially.
06:39<czr>and at that tempereature you wouldn't be doing the peeing anymore
06:39<czr>it also depends on the salinity and other factors obviously
06:39<dstufft>water takes time to cool down yea, even if you have cold tap water
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06:40<czr>cold tap water isn't even all that cold :-)
06:40<dstufft>it won't freeze instantly in any temperature you can get where people routinely live
06:40*czr nods
06:40<czr>but I guess one could do an experiment quite easily
06:40<czr>there's a cold room some 20 km from here
06:40<dstufft>antartica on the other hand
06:41<Marius>wow, IIS 7+ is anoying, I'm so used to ACE foramted domains now, and suddenly they decide to use plaintext with international characters
06:41<czr>(cold room as in a place where they break coldness records)
06:41<amitz>is there a correlation between temperature and your frequency of bathing?
06:41<dstufft>-128 is pretty cold (F)
06:41<czr>amitz, no
06:41<dstufft>amitz: i suppose if you are showering outdoors you'd take less baths if it's cold
06:41<amitz>Marius: iis is evil, nough said.
06:41<Marius>amitz, damn straight!
06:42*Marius moves all his work DNS'es to ns{1-5}
06:42<dstufft>most people have heat in their homes though, so your indoor activies are mostly the same
06:42<czr>Marius, I did that for all my domains a while back
06:42<czr>never looked back :-0
06:42<czr>back even.
06:42<dstufft>yea so did I
06:42<Marius>well, I think linode owuld be bothered if I suddenly add a couple hundred domains xD
06:42<dstufft>the 15 minute interval on refreshing is a little annoying sometime
06:42<Marius>also, linode can't do .no domains :P
06:42<dstufft>Marius: i doubt they'd care
06:42<czr>Marius, why not?
06:43<dstufft>dns isn't really that resource intensive
06:43<czr>Marius, although I haven't tried .fi ones either.
06:43<czr>it's like, country-specific tld, pfft.
06:43<Marius>czr, because without being authorized by NORID you can't do dns for .no
06:43<czr>Marius, ah, thought so.
06:43<czr>something like that at least. that's somewhat lame
06:43<Marius>I can authorize through the company, but then we'd be responsible for any fuckup anyone with a .no on linode did :P
06:44<czr>"The DNS infrastructure is too redundant, we need to limit it!"
06:44<Marius>the rules surrounding .no domains is quite strict
06:45<@jed>I thought we had .no in our system
06:46<czr>jed, do you what is the metric that the per host cpu usage graph uses in the manager?
06:46<@jed>% of a single CPU used
06:46<Marius>jed, I can check! brb! :P
06:46<czr>pure cpu?
06:46<@jed>Marius: I see several
06:46<Marius>you do
06:46<Marius>someone added ns1-5 :o
06:46<@jed>and the authority chain is intact :)
06:47<Marius> is listed as the owner though
06:47<@jed>we had this come up with ... what TLD ... .is, I thnk
06:47<Marius>They have offices in london, san fran, and two lcoations in norway apparently
06:47<czr>the country of .. well.
06:49<dstufft>iceland is green and greenland is icey :3
06:49<czr>not for long though :-)
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06:52<schwullo>ha ha
06:52<schwullo>"Knowing the answer makes me feel so old."
06:52<czr>knowing the exact dos version which supports anything other than a: or b: makes me feel what..
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06:53<schwullo>5.25" floppy <3
06:53<schwullo>pure love
06:53<Marius>oik, what'd I miss
06:53<Marius>I losr connection after "iceland!"
06:53<@jed> is all you missed, really
06:53<Marius>also, only is added
06:54<czr>Marius, heh, bad luck guess, or .is fault :-)
06:55<@jed>Marius: the domain I looked at has ns1-ns5 in its SOA
06:55<Marius>jed, really? oh well
06:55<Marius>I won't get too hung up on it :P
06:56<@jed>well, it's a valid point ... I suppose the real place I should look is the NS from .no
06:56<Marius>you're actually listed on ns1 quite a few times, since each registrar that wants to use your dns needs to add it them self
06:56<Marius>since they'll be listed as the authorative of that DNS server for their use
06:56-!-Milos|Netbook [] has joined #linode
06:57<Marius>foudn the remaining ns's
06:57<bob2>why do registries feel the need to get all fancy about NS records
06:57<Milos|Netbook>Is it possible for a linode to have another physical interface? I'm having problems with ssh tunneling because it always ends up using your primary IP no matter which one you connected with. (problem since it's just eth0:X - an alias)
06:57<bob2>just use the goddamn names and optional glue I give you
06:57<Marius>well, for .no it's because ot register one you need an orgnization number and there's restrictions on usage
06:58<Marius>like if you use it for a funny vhost, they'll kill your domain
06:58<Marius>Milos|Netbook, there's LISH
06:58<@jed>Milos|Netbook: no - long ago linodes had 2, and it caused problems
06:59<Milos|Netbook>jed, odd.
06:59<@jed>problems for us, not linodes
06:59<bob2>Milos|Netbook: swap them around
07:00<Milos|Netbook>bob2, that would be more of a hack than a solution. I think I found one using iptables to force the source.
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08:00<tiny>Hi! How do I hide/protect private data for a certain domain?
08:00<mwalling>you mean whats on the whois info?
08:00<mwalling>ask your registrar
08:01<pl___>Hello. I have a linode 768, that should have 768MB or RAM, but the 'free' command reports only 540MB. What's the reason?
08:01<Marius>free -m ?
08:01<mwalling>pl___: have you rebooted since we got that upgrade?
08:01<pl___>Marius, yes, free -m
08:01<pl___>mwalling, yes
08:02<mwalling>pl___: did you manually configure the max memory in your config profile?
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08:02<pl___>mwalling, I don't remember doing so...
08:02<mwalling>check anyway
08:03<mwalling>tiny: hi
08:03<pl___>mwalling, Memory Limit Maximum (768 MB)
08:04<bob2>pl___: the output of 'free -m'
08:04<tiny>mwalling: just did a whois on you since your nick is very familiar to me
08:04-!-golb [golb@] has quit []
08:04<straterra>wrt snow/coffee
08:04<mwalling>pl___: its just funny, since 540 is the size the 768 plan used to be, thats why i was guessing that
08:05<bob2>pl___: and the output of 'uptime'?
08:05<pl___>wait, I'm not sure anymore I rebooted that linode since the last upgrade
08:05<Marius>Yeah, there are no 540's any more
08:05<pl___>up 212 days
08:05<bob2>pl___: and the output of 'dmesg | grep MEM'
08:05<mwalling>pl___: "whoops"
08:06<bob2>pl___: there you go
08:06<czr>now, oops your kernel quick!
08:06<pl___>well, thank you :)
08:07<tiny>A friend bought a domain and pointed it at linode name servers. I set it up in DNS manager. How long until I can resolve it to my IP?
08:07-!-krish [~krish@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:07<bob2>~20 minutes
08:08<bob2>use 'dig soa' to check so you don't pollute your isp's cache
08:08<amitz>bob2: why not 15 minutes at the most?
08:08<bob2>amitz: reload happens on the 15 minutes, but it takes some time for bind to reload
08:09<Megaf>Good morning
08:09<amitz>good morning
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08:13<tiny>bob2: it's more then 2 hours, I can see it listed with dig command @ ns1.linode but still not pingable/resolvable
08:13<@jed>buenas dias
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08:15<straterra>mas or menos tu gato y madre
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08:34<superdug>jed: whats so bueno about it?
08:35<@Perihelion>NOTHING >:3
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08:41<@irgeek>tiny: If it works when you dig but you can't hit it in a web browser, your upstream DNS resolver is cacheing the NXDOMAIN record.
08:41<@irgeek>If you can get them to clear it, it should start working. If you can't you need to wait for the negative cache to expire.
08:41<superdug>aight so I count 15 ops, is linode that big of an operation ?
08:42<czr>also a lot of web browsers have their own caches. and hosts too (windosen and some linuxen, don't know os x)
08:42<@irgeek>Every OP in this channel is an employee.
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08:42<tiny>irgeek: ok ty
08:42<superdug>irgeek: that gets paid in money?
08:43<czr>no, in linodes.
08:43*czr hides & runs
08:43<@irgeek>superdug: Yes.
08:44<@irgeek>Also, I didn't notice mwalling in the op list. He's not an employee.
08:44<@jed>he's contracted for various dirty work
08:45<czr>installs windowses?
08:54-!-krish [~krish@] has joined #linode
08:57<mwalling>czr: even i outsource installing windows
08:57<czr>I was just thinking of something that was very dirty.
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09:03<mhussa>I created community account yesterday but never received an activation email
09:03<mhussa>I've checked spam folders and every other folder, nothing
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09:12<akiva>Hello all
09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v tychoish] by ChanServ
09:12-!-ChanServ changed the topic of #linode to: Linode Community Support | | The Linode $100,000 Giveaway has ended! -
09:12-!-FloodServ is "FloodServ" on (unknown)
09:12-!-mode/#linode [-o stan_theman] by ChanServ
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09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v heckman] by ChanServ
09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v mikegrb] by ChanServ
09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v jed] by ChanServ
09:12-!-mode/#linode [-o deaton] by ChanServ
09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v restelow] by ChanServ
09:12-!-mode/#linode [+v pparadis] by ChanServ
09:12*jed pets services
09:12<@heckman>why hello thar
09:13*heckman is happy to be back
09:13-!-mode/#linode [-v Perihelion] by Perihelion
09:13-!-mode/#linode [-v jed] by jed
09:13<mwalling_>jed: services are fine, it was the server they link with
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09:14<akiva>Thoroughly enjoy Kohana 3's new features over 2
09:14<akiva>Oops. Wrong room window. Sorry
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09:15*praetorian pokes Perihelion
09:15<@heckman>I wouldn't do that...
09:15<@heckman>She bites
09:15*heckman shows off bandage wrapped finger
09:15*Perihelion prods PrgmrBill
09:15<@Perihelion>argh tab fail
09:16<praetorian>heckman: it's okay, i can just throw her in QLD if thats the case
09:16*Perihelion slaps praetorian around a bit with a large cactus
09:16<praetorian>poor Queensland
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09:18<akiva>I hate when a client messes up your schedule because you have to chase after payment
09:18<@Perihelion>I need my slap alias back :(
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09:18<akiva>Now this month I am all messed
09:18<@mikegrb>mmm cake
09:18<@Perihelion>Someone broke the cake boss
09:18<@irgeek>Party time!
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09:25<@heckman>mwalling_: the tubes...stop clogging them!
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09:26<@Perihelion>Why does it voice us :(
09:26<Marius>wow, I was abotu to make a joke about the rectum shitting on synthon...but then I realised it said "reticulum" xD
09:26<mwalling_>Perihelion: because you have AUTOVOICE turned on
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09:32<Nivex>check check test 1..2..3... sibilance
09:35<tiny>DNS manager ... What's "allow/deny domain transfers AXFR transfers" about?
09:35<linbot>New news from forums: Suggested spec of server in Sales Questions and Answers <>
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09:36<tiny>found it ...
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09:40<Marius>What's the lowest permitted TTL on a domain?
09:41<@Perihelion>5 minutes iirc?
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09:42<@irgeek>Marius: You can use lower TTLs if you configure your own master and have us slave it.
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09:43<Marius>irgeek, I ment in general
09:43<Marius>like we're prepping to move some servers at work, it's currently at 1 hour
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09:44<Marius>Was just wondering if it was possible to lower it, or if there are restrictions on how low a ttl can be
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09:44<Marius>would jsut be beneficial to change it to a lower value cclose ot the move to keep downtime to a bare minimum
09:44<praetorian>i think you can set whatever, but some upstream make cachee for a longer period
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09:44<Marius>yeah, that I know
09:44<@irgeek>There are no restrictions. Some (broken) ISPs set a minimum TTL and will override your TTL if it's below that.
09:45<praetorian>imho, 5 is more than sufficient
09:45<@irgeek>Don't forget - after you change it you need to wait until the current time has expired for everyone to see the change.
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09:46<praetorian>(i would be changing it atleast 48 hours before)
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09:58<amitz>I wonder if sophist and sophisticated has the same origin...
09:58<@Perihelion>Actually the way to fix this is more cowbell.
09:59<straterra>Do you guys think 1920x1200 at 15.4" is a bit insane?
09:59<Nivex>Yaakov: Excuse me good sir. I have consulted my Funk & Wagnalls and am unable to find any reference to "solipsistic"
10:00<Nivex>straterra: I imagine that to be very difficult to read.
10:00*Nivex starts banging away on a cowbell in Perihelion's general direction
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10:01<straterra> <- I HAS BOUGHT IT
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10:05<amitz>is it just me or I don't like wide screen...
10:08<straterra>I prefer 4:3...but good luck finding a laptop with 4:3 these days
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10:10<warewolf>dear services, stop bouncing
10:10<warewolf>no love, warewolf
10:10<straterra>Welcome to freenode...wait
10:11<warewolf>[GlobalNotice] [lilo] give me money
10:11<Nivex>maybe freenode and oftc should merge!
10:11*Nivex ducks
10:12<@jed>millions will die, Nivex
10:12<straterra>Millions of sperm
10:12<Nivex>jed: that's just the nick collisions
10:12<Nivex>it'll pass :)
10:12<@heckman>urmom is so stupid, she thought that "Freenode" was the next Linode Giveaway.
10:13<@heckman>I'm here til Thursday!
10:13<@heckman>Try the veal.
10:13<straterra><3 veal
10:13<straterra>But I think I'm craving cheesesteak today
10:13<@heckman>It's about lunch time for me
10:14<@heckman>But, because it's 10am, can't get lunch anywhere..hah
10:14<@heckman>Well..anywhere that I want to get lunch from...
10:15<straterra>People in NJ don't get lunch
10:15<czr>heh. freenode isn't all that bad though, at least imo
10:15<czr>but I guess it's a clique thing then.
10:15<@heckman>I'm on there for Android related things.
10:15<@heckman>mmh gingerbread on my evo
10:15*heckman drools
10:16<amitz>straterra: I assume 4:3 is the non wide screen. yeah..
10:16<czr>this is my only channel in otfc :-).
10:16<@heckman>"full-screen" is the term I believe.
10:16<amitz>heckman: full-screen = 16:9?
10:16<amitz>I meant, 4:3
10:17<@heckman>Yeah, I believe that's the term that's used.
10:17<Nivex>I'm on more channels on freenode than OFTC
10:17<amitz>I default on OFTC but many channels only exist in Freenode -_-
10:17<czr>yes. the BEST CHANNELS.
10:17*czr hides & runs
10:17<czr>except this one obviously.
10:17*amitz catches czr
10:18*czr splits all his cells and leaves amitz with the stupider half of himself
10:18<Pryon>mitosis? *Your*tosis
10:19<amitz>czr: well, it's kind of stupid to leave half. if I were you, I'll just leave my tail :-p
10:19<czr>I love my tail.
10:19*czr pets his tail
10:19<czr>Pryon :-)
10:19<Nivex>wait, you got some tail?
10:19<@heckman>Man, two hours of sleep is rough.
10:20<straterra>Nivex: damn furries
10:20<czr>I'm one of the infinite number of monkeys hired to rewrite shakespear
10:22<amitz>who when given infinite time, will be equal to the infinite number of monkeys in a limited time.
10:22<Pryon>"The probability of Hamlet is therefore zero in any operational sense of an event…"
10:23<Pryon>That's only for an observable universe filled with monkeys, thouhg.
10:24-!-asherkin [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:24<amitz>Not enough banana. That's the secret.
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10:28<straterra>I think whoever came up with SSL was masochistic
10:31<straterra>Probably the same dillhole and wrote the VNC server for OSX
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10:41<Pryon>I need to start using "dillhole"
10:41*jed hugs oftc
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10:42<pharaun>16:9 can die
10:42<pharaun>16:10 or 4:3 is the superior ratio
10:42<pharaun>heckman: oh why do you keep on abusing yourself? :-p
10:44<straterra>Put a banana in your ear
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11:18<robinetd>Perihelion: morning. <3.
11:18<linbot>robinetd: Yo momma's so stupid she tried to blow up a car and burnt her lips on the tail pipe. (823:14/4) [momru]
11:19<robinetd>o_O. That was only semi funny.
11:19<hobot>well linbot doesnt have the discrimination plugin for determining the quality of jokes
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11:20<@heckman>pharaun: how am I abusing myself?
11:20<@heckman>Btw, I did totally fail making tea at like 6am today
11:21<pharaun>heckman: 2hr of sleep?
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11:21<Pryon>Not knowing how to abuse one's self is a sure sign of overindulgence in self-abuse
11:22<@heckman>Oh pharaun, yeah. haha
11:22<@heckman>I couldn't fall asleep
11:23<pharaun>heckman: ah, hah alright, yeah i've had nights like that ugh
11:24<@heckman>Well, I worked 4am to 4pm on Monday. So Tuesday, not thinking, I slept in til like noon....and I had to work at 4am today.
11:24-!-devsforev [] has joined #linode
11:24<@heckman>So like, I woke up, and should have gone to sleep 8 hours later
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11:26<linbot>If you have a question, please just ask it. Don't look for topic experts. Don't ask to ask. Don't PM! Don't ask if people are awake, or in the mood to help. Just ask the question straight out.
11:26<linbot>Cromulent: Linode512 - 323, Linode768 - 255, Linode1024 - 165, Linode1536 - 96, Linode2048 - 72, Linode4096 - 29
11:26<Cromulent>ah thats the one
11:27<pharaun>ack! evil screen! it drifted out of alignment!
11:27*pharaun spends next 20 minute re-aligning the damn screen
11:28<pharaun>heckman: monitor arms
11:29<pharaun>heckman: usually not a issue but one of em is a tad long cos it need to work around a 30" :-p that one tends to drift out of alignment
11:29<@heckman>plastic it tie it to the other one.
11:29<@heckman>Unless it drifts towards it..then fail
11:29<pharaun>heckman: heh wish, its an arm :-p little hard to do that i do tie my cables to it
11:29<pharaun>and haha
11:29<pharaun>#screenfail !
11:32<@heckman>android2.3 is sexy
11:32<Marius>stop bragging =(
11:32<Marius>I barely got 2.1 and it's a bastard child of sony ericsson, not a real 2.1
11:33<pharaun>Marius: but you have one, i have not one
11:33<@heckman>Ew, and you can't even get custom builds like cyanogenmod on those
11:33<Marius>heckman, I know =(
11:33<pharaun>custom build? nice!
11:33<Marius>they eremoved native exchange support in 2.1 in favor of preinstalling moxier because they have a deal with the moxier devs
11:33<@heckman>yeah...I run an HTC EVO.
11:33<pharaun>how hard would it be to spin up a custom build?
11:33<@heckman>Lol...stock is 2.2
11:33<@heckman>Depends on the phone, I suppose.
11:33<@heckman>I usually rely on Cyanogenmod to give me some AOSP stuff
11:33<Marius>I use exchange all the time, moxier EATS BATTERIES, so it's a strained situation form e
11:34<Marius>I need ot recharge 2-3 time a day because it's drained completely
11:34<@Perihelion>Marius: I'll send you an Evo <3
11:34<@Perihelion>Not that it'll do you any good :>
11:34<Marius>Perihelion yesplx! <3
11:35<Marius>although I'd much rather have the desire HD
11:35<Cromulent>talking of android - is the nexus s considered the best android phone to get? I might end up getting one rather than a newer iPhone next
11:35*heckman keeps turning his phone on and off to see the CRT animation.
11:35<@heckman>Cromulent: The nice thing is it gets android builds first.
11:35<@heckman>So when the next version comes out, you'll have it almost immediately.
11:35<Marius>EVERYTHING is better then an iPhone :P
11:36<@heckman>well no
11:36<Cromulent>that is pretty important since I only really want it play around development wise with
11:36<@heckman>You have an Ericson.
11:36<pharaun>Marius: including verzion iphone? ;)
11:36<Marius>I don't know
11:36<@heckman>Cromulent: plus they are easy to root
11:36<@heckman>"fastbook oem unlock"
11:36<Marius>what's the deal with the verizon iphone? I barely heard it mentioned
11:36<@heckman>One command, and you have root.
11:36<@heckman>Marius: was released like two days ago
11:36<Cromulent>heckman: not a problem in the UK :)
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11:37<@Perihelion>Yeah the UK is moar bettar when it comes to phone freedom
11:37<Marius>heckman, but what's so special about it ?
11:37<@heckman>iPhone was locked to one carrier in the US
11:37<@Perihelion>When I inevitably move there I'll have a pr0 phone
11:37<@heckman>And the carrier was apparently unable to handle the data requirements of the device.
11:38<Marius>I see
11:38<Marius>but it's still an iPhone.
11:38*heckman shrugs
11:39<pharaun>heckman: i think that depends on the area
11:39<pharaun>heckman: some area was a clusterfuck but others it worked fine, so i guess
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11:46<Marius>Perihelion, why are you not on the messenger of sn?
11:46<robinetd>yay, I has droopal!
11:46<@Perihelion>Marius: Busy irl
11:47*jed points and laughs
11:47<@Perihelion>At who?
11:48<robinetd>Probably me.
11:48<@jed>Marius because he got pwned
11:48<pharaun>neat ->
11:48<@Perihelion>He's used to it
11:48<@Perihelion>It pretty much doesn't affect him anymore.
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11:50<@Perihelion>Found a cigar in my bag <3
11:50<@Perihelion>It's like CHristmas
11:51<Cromulent>ah that reminds me - I was going to buy a cigar
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11:52<robinetd>Perihelion: Is it old and falling apart?
11:54<Marius>CANCER DEATH!
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11:58<avenj>mmm cigar
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11:59<Megaf>Folks, im not really happy with my VPS, its a bit laggy
11:59<linbot>New news from forums: Cannot get new Mercury installation to answer on port 80 in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
12:00<@heckman>ask better question on port 80?
12:01<@caker>Megaf: where are you and where is the Linode?
12:01<@caker>there's likely a lot of Internet between you and the 'node
12:01<JshWright>Megaf: a mtr report is generally helpful in sorting out such problems
12:01<@caker>yes, an :)
12:01<JshWright>yeah... I think I'd go with "an mtr report"
12:01<@heckman>Yeah, I think it's 'an'
12:02<Megaf>caker: Im in Brazil and Linode in UK
12:02<Megaf>too far away
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12:02<JshWright>Megaf: well of course it's going to be laggy... the speed of light is laggy at those distances
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12:02<Megaf>I think I shoud disable my account and look for a nearby service
12:02<DephNet[Paul]>Megaf, why not move to Linodes California location?
12:02<JshWright>Megaf: you'd likely have a faster connection to a North American DC
12:03<Megaf>lets see
12:03-!-Cromulent [] has quit [Quit: Cromulent]
12:03<JshWright>ping the sites listed there and see which is fastest
12:04-!-bintut [] has quit [Quit: bintut]
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12:05<DephNet[Paul]>Megaf, to move, just send in a ticket, Linode will work its voodoo, then when they are done you hit the "migrate now" button, and about an hour later, depending on how much you are moving, you are done, apart from changing the IP on your Linode
12:05<pharaun>question about wireless/media converter, when you are all on the same network (switch) you can see each other MAC address right, its when you go out of the network via a router, that its replaced with the router's MAC address... my question is for like wireless access point in just "access point mode" is that considered a media converter hence you would still be able to see each laptop's MAC address or is it replaced with the a
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12:06<Megaf>the fastest one PING ( 56 data bytes
12:06<Megaf>64 bytes from icmp_seq=0 ttl=49 time=148.807 ms
12:06<gbit>I'm having extreamly slow mysql upload... any tips?
12:06<diwwin>Any experience securing phpmyadmin for a drupal site?
12:07<DephNet[Paul]>Megaf, send a ticket in asking to move to Atlanta (unless you want to use IRC)
12:07<@pparadis>diwwin: put phpmyadmin behind http auth.
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12:07<JshWright>Megaf: what's your ping to london?
12:07<@pparadis>gbit: are you trying to upload something from your residential connection to your linode?
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12:08<Megaf>PING ( 56 data bytes
12:08<Megaf>64 bytes from icmp_seq=0 ttl=49 time=208.147 ms
12:08<diwwin>pparadis: thanks for the tip. this is new to me, so I am looking for some steps. All I have done so far is install it.
12:08<gbit>pparadis, is not residential, but not powerfull ether.. 1mbps full
12:08<Megaf>PING ( 56 data bytes
12:08<Megaf>64 bytes from icmp_seq=0 ttl=52 time=314.901 ms
12:08<gbit>pparadis, and I'm getting 2kbps
12:08<gbit>pparadis, other things are great, just mysql seems to
12:09<@pparadis>gbit: i'm not sure what you're doing. are you connecting directly to mysql from a remote location?
12:09<gbit>pparadis, yes via odbc
12:09<JshWright>Megaf: I'm surprised you're seeing 150ms to atlanta... What sort of connection are you on?
12:10<Megaf>JshWright: ADSL 2+, 10mbps down 1mbps up
12:10<Megaf>JshWright: do you thinks thats too bad?
12:10<@pparadis>gbit: are you doing that in order to run some graphical mysql administration tool?
12:10*robinetd gets 70ms to atlanta.
12:11<Megaf>robinetd: where are you?
12:11<robinetd>Megaf: Michigan.
12:11<JshWright>well, you'll shave 50ms off your RTT if you switch to Atlanta... that will certainly be better, but 150ms is on the edge of what I consider "noticable" in an SSH session
12:12<gbit>pparadis, I guess this is an backbone problem, thanks for helping
12:12<JshWright>I'm 45ms from Atlanta here in upstate New York
12:12<@pparadis>gbit: sure, i was about to ask for mtr reports to and from the linode, but also possibly make a recommendation if you were connecting to mysql remotely for admin purposes.
12:12<JshWright>Megaf: you could use a tool like mtr to determine where the latency is occuring
12:13<diwwin>The Linode library instructions for securing phpmyadmin are quite vague. After installing phpmyAdmin, which folder needs an .htaccess file?
12:13<@pparadis>the directory it's installed in.
12:14<Megaf>--- ping statistics ---
12:14<Megaf>10 packets transmitted, 10 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
12:14<Megaf>round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 149.653/150.764/152.015/0.755 ms
12:14<Megaf>150 avarage
12:14<diwwin>pparadis: I'm not sure where that is. I see a phpmyadmin folder at /etc/phpmyadmin and /usr/share/phpmyadmin/
12:14<@pparadis>diwwin: what guide did you follow?
12:14<@jed>having teched DSL in a former life, DSL's latency tends to run higher than say, cable
12:15<diwwin>pparadis: apt-get install phpmyadmin. so far that's it.
12:15<@pparadis>diwwin: what distro are you on? you referred to a guide being "vague" so i'm not even sure what you're looking at.
12:15<gbit>pparadis, can I private you?
12:15<@pparadis>diwwin: this guide?
12:15<@pparadis>gbit: sure
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12:16<diwwin>pparadis: ya.
12:17<diwwin>pparadis: That is the part I don't understand.
12:17<@pparadis>diwwin: did you actually follow the whole guide, or did you just issue the apt-get install command?
12:17<diwwin>just the apt-get install. the rest is greek.
12:17*Daevien laughs
12:17<soctal>i am soooo lost. i am trying understand this vps thing, the "getting started" guide doesnt help, there seems to be steps missing. i thought linode would have video clips of tutorials, but i dont see any. is there another way to get help?
12:17*Daevien hands pparadis some advil
12:18<@caker>soctal: what's the problem?
12:18<pharaun>Daevien: make that a whole bottle :-p
12:18<@pparadis>diwwin: you need to follow the guide, step for step. if you continue to read through it, it explains exactly how to set up an apache virtualhost for phpmyadmin, where to put the .htaccess file, etc.
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12:20<diwwin>pparadis: "... by creating an .htaccess file in your phpmyadmin directory" I don't know which directory this is referring to.
12:20<Daevien>soctal: your vp sis essentially like a real system running linux. if you need help with the basics, the tutorials will help. it's hard to do a whole lot for video besides just typing in commands and reading the same thign thats in the guides
12:21<@pparadis>diwwin: actually, that particular reference tells you how to link phpmyadmin to a virtualhost, but it assumes you already have a vhost set up that you'd like to use phpmyadmin with. you probably want to set up something like "" and link it to that.
12:21-!-asherkin [] has joined #linode
12:22<diwwin>pparadis: now I'm lost. Where is the tutorial for that step?
12:22<@pparadis>the LAMP guides are a good reference for setting up any apache vhost -->
12:22<diwwin>pparadis: I have a drupal site setup with vhost. That is why I want to use it.
12:23<diwwin>pparadis: So do I have to set up another vhost???
12:23<@pparadis>you don't *have* to.
12:23<diwwin>pparadis: should I
12:24<@pparadis>you could create a subdirectory under that vhost called "phpmyadmin" or whatever, and link to that as per the phpmyadmin guide.
12:24<@pparadis>i'd set up a separate vhost for it, though.
12:24<diwwin>pparadis: So I don't know what that entails.
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12:25<linbot>New news from forums: Trouble with cloned Linode in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
12:26<@pparadis>and once it's set up, the directory for that vhost is where you link phpmyadmin to.
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12:30<diwwin>What values do I need for each element in the vhost file?
12:30<@pparadis>diwwin: that's a very general question.
12:30<linbot>New news from forums: Trouble with cloned Linode in General Discussion <>
12:30<diwwin>pparadis: Servername?
12:31<@pparadis>diwwin: hang on
12:32<@pparadis>diwwin: if you're going to set up a vhost for phpmyadmin, you should probably add something like "" that points to your linode's IP address, too.
12:33<@pparadis>as per the first two links here -->
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12:36<diwwin>pparadis: I am trying here. What to put for DocumentRoot?
12:37<diwwin>pparadis: Do I also need to create a folder somewhere?
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12:39<DephNet[Paul]>Now, I know that there has not been an outage in London since Linode opened there, as far as I am aware of, but would you guys recommend me moving my billing site to a different supplier? Away from London obviously!
12:40-!-markatto [] has joined #linode
12:40<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: it depends on if you want it to always be up, then you would need multiple dc, but just moving it from london won't help cos if london go down, or if that other dc goes down, well derp same thing
12:40<Daevien>redundancy is good, otherwise, doesn't matter really..
12:41<@pparadis>diwwin: if you follow the LAMP guide instructions for setting up a virtualhost, you'll be fine. you need to substitute "" for the example domains wherever they're given in these guides (if you're using "" as the vhost for phpmyadmin).
12:41<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, I know that, but I am mainly moving it so that if London goes dark, I have a way of getting client information, and a way of emailing them
12:41<Daevien>diwwin: if you want to save pictures in a folder called "omg phil needs advil", would you hve to create it first?
12:41<DephNet[Paul]>daevien, yes
12:41<@pparadis>diwwin: the guides do give you instructions for how to create directories and what they should be named.
12:41<markatto>how can I set my reverse dns? The documentation seems to indicate linodes->remote access->reverse dns, but that doesn't seem to give me any options to actually set anything
12:41<Daevien>DephNet[Paul]: and if you move it to dallas.. or fremont.. or where ever and it goes dark.. you are still stuck. so either leave it there or have it in 2 places
12:41<linbot>New news from forums: Rewrite rule: to in General Discussion <>
12:41<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: then you would have to deal with what if that *other* site goes dark ?
12:42<DephNet[Paul]>markatto,[linode name]
12:42<robinetd>Two datacenters down at one time? APOCALYPSE!
12:42<DephNet[Paul]>markatto, there is a link on that page, under the IP
12:42<Daevien>markatto: remote access and then reverse dns
12:43<erik`>DephNet[Paul], if you want it always up, host copies outside of linode
12:43<Daevien>right by where it says public ips, line below that to add ip, reverse dns, etc
12:43<erik`>if linode does a major fuckup, they could take down all their VPSes at the same time
12:43<mbreslin>grep "<link>.*<\/link>"
12:43<erik`>regardless of DC
12:43<mbreslin>i want to exclude <link> and </link> from the result, any ideas?
12:43<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: possible to like keep a offsite backup say s3 or local copy of the email list so you can atleast contact your clients/etc ?
12:43<Daevien>markatto: then punch in the hostname, it will check to see that the ip is pointing to a valid ip for that linode & let you setit
12:44<erik`>mbreslin, grep -v ?
12:44<markatto>Daevien: oh I see, you have to do the forward lookup thing first. Kinda unintuitive. Thanks!
12:45<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, true, I could keep a copy on a linode, but have the main copy away from Linode, but that just means paying WHMCS for 2 licenses. I think I really need to get my head down, and code my own billing app
12:45<mbreslin>erik`: so stupid, thanks
12:45<mbreslin>should have thought of that
12:45<Daevien>markatto: well it's to make sure that exists number 1 and number 2 is pointed at somethign that could be set for reverse
12:45<mbreslin>was trying to do it all in one pattern
12:45<mbreslin>no point
12:46<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: why paying? can't you just keep a rsync copy of the linode, and then if it go down, start up the other so you can access data ?
12:46<pharaun>and that is still "1 copy" running kind of thing, i don't know what the license says
12:46<markatto>Daevien: It makes sense that it looks it up first, but there is no indication that doing the lookup is part of the process for setting rdns
12:47<Daevien>WHMCS = pain, think it does ip verification first thing with their server before letting you run. so he'd be accessing form a diff ip
12:47<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, you could, but that would mean re-issuing the license whenever I access it on a different IP
12:47<pharaun>go talk to them then i guess, ask them about DR/etc
12:47<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: ah
12:47<Daevien>markatto: i guess teh assumption is that if you are in reverse dns, you want to set it and you'll punch in the host into the only box. jab caker and tell him you think it shodul be more explained ;)
12:49<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, besides, while WHMCS is good, there are some things I want it to do, like BOGOFF offers, that WHMCS can not do and the devs REFUSE to code for me
12:49-!-asherkin [] has quit []
12:50<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: yeah you've spoken before about coding up your own billing apps, but what i mean is the WHMCS has no provision for diaster/recovery or backup hosting other than just snapping up another license ?
12:50<markatto>Daevien: Well, maybe I'm just an idiot. Thanks again.
12:50<Daevien>markatto: nah, didn't say that. just saying, caker = boss, tell him to explain it better and maybe he will change it and thank you :)
12:51<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, other than re-issuing your license, when the DNS has resolved, not really
12:51<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: ew
12:51<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, exactly
12:52<markatto>Daevien: how should I contact him? privmsg?
12:52<DephNet[Paul]>markatto, ticket
12:52<markatto>thanks all
12:52-!-synapt [] has joined #linode
12:53<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, so if you want a highly available WHMCS setup, you need a license for every IP you will have WHMCS on
12:53-!-markatto [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
12:57<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: thats just downright nasty, i can kind of understand, they want money but same time ew
12:57-!-user6484 [] has left #linode []
12:57<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, up until version 4, if you wanted to have different currencies, they needed a separate install
12:58<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: HAHA ow
12:59<DephNet[Paul]>I know of one company that had 4 seperate installs, paying WHMCS close to $80 a month, because they accepted people paying in pounds, US dollars, Canadian dollars or euros
13:01<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: is whmcs ore for like small company or like do big company uses it? cos to big company that is probably pocket change
13:03<DephNet[Paul]>pharaun, they claim that some big companies use it, but when asked to provide proof they state that is "commercially sensitive" information
13:03-!-takamichi [Takamichi@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:06<mattybats>so is there any firewall protection to speak of provided by linode besides what you can set up on your vps's
13:06<pharaun>DephNet[Paul]: ah
13:06<linbot>Although Linode is committed to providing the best possible customer service and is often willing to go above and beyond in solving problems, it remains an unmanaged service. Please understand that we're not always able to assist you in setting things up on your Linode.
13:07<DephNet[Paul]>mattybats, no
13:08<mattybats>DephNet[Paul], i'm thinking I build two vps's and set one up as the firewall, does that sound like a good strategey?
13:08<robinetd>Not really.
13:09<pharaun>mattybats: no, put thje firewall on your regular vps
13:09<DephNet[Paul]>mattybats, why not just use iptables?
13:09<pharaun>mattybats: use iptables, and etc,
13:10-!-kmurph79 [] has joined #linode
13:10<mattybats>pharaun, I thought by dividing it it would make it more secure, no?
13:10-!-seanh-ansca [] has joined #linode
13:10<pharaun>mattybats: for a traditional setup, yes sure, but in VPS environment, no
13:11<pharaun>mattybats: because you are all on shared hosting, there isn't a single "path" between your firewall and your other VPS
13:11<pharaun>mattybats: so in the end it is moot point, so just put your iptable on your VPS and it will be more secure than a firewall vps and regular vps
13:11-!-jameswilson [~Adium@] has joined #linode
13:12<mattybats>pharaun, this is because in the event I made two vps's they would both be having valid IPs, right?
13:12-!-kassah [] has joined #linode
13:13<priyesh>hi there, anyone know any good resources for VPS newbies?
13:14<Gika>priyesh: :)
13:14<pharaun>mattybats: yes, both vps will have their own public valid ip yes, tho you could use like some sort of VPN between your firewall to your main vps but you would still in the end probably have iptable on *both* so why not toss out the firewall vps, and just go with a single VPS, it would be a better solution
13:14<JshWright>priyesh: what sort of stuff are you looking to do?
13:15<mattybats>pharaun, I see in the Linode Manager there is an option to have private IPs
13:15<priyesh>Gika: thanks - I've started reading the beginners section there
13:15<pharaun>mattybats: yes, but you still will have the public ip on both vps, and yes while you can setup VPN and etc, you WILL still probably need to setup iptable on *both* and iptable is your firewall filtering software, so why not just use one VPS, it would work
13:16<purrdeta>and it would be cheaper
13:16<seanh-ansca>you don't need public ip's on both
13:16<priyesh>JshWright: setting up OS, webserver, php, mysql, irssi, git, making the server secure, etc
13:16<@irgeek>mattybats: The private IPs are for doing un-metered transfer between your Linodes in the same DC. It does not provide a private network for just your Linodes.
13:17<pharaun>mattybats: ^^^ what irgeek said, he's a staff of linode, knows his stuff :-p and yes you could setup a VPN to create a private "network" between your linode, but still that's just silly, adds on complexity, overheads, and you would need iptable on both *anyway* which makes the whole thing be kind of a moot point
13:17<mattybats>pharaun, irgeek , thanks for information, I'm just trying to rap my head around the networking setup
13:18<pharaun>mattybats: so really what i would recommend is just setup one vps, put what service/whatever on it, and put up a firewall, iptable, or any of the other.... firewall modules like shorewall/ufw/etc that makes it easier, but put it on *that* vps
13:18<pharaun>mattybats: and you'll be on your way to success
13:19*irgeek doesn't even bother with iptables
13:19<JshWright>priyesh: yeah, check out the "getting started" articles in the linode library
13:19<@irgeek>Only services I want exposed are listening on external IPs.
13:19<pharaun>me either, i don't currently have one up, but i outta to put one up just to cover my arse in case i ever accidently put up an internal service
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13:20<priyesh>JshWright: thanks
13:20<mattybats>pharaun, you're saying, it is not possible to set up a vps just on a private network?
13:20-!-takamichi [~pri@] has joined #linode
13:21<priyesh>JshWright: Do you know any good comparisons of the os's and webserver's ? e.g. Debian, Ubuntu and Apache, cherokee, nginx
13:21<priyesh>Gika: Do you know any good comparisons of the os's and webserver's ? e.g. Debian, Ubuntu and Apache, cherokee, nginx
13:21<pharaun>mattybats: no, private ip is just for unmetered data transfer between your linodes, but it is *not* private, yes you can use VPN to setup a private network but really come on, most people don't need it
13:21<diwwin>So can I leave this attribute as is in the vhost file? DocumentRoot /srv/www/
13:22<Gika>priyesh: just try all of them and find the one that's best for you :) i personally go with ubuntu and nginx, but your mileage may vary
13:23<JshWright>priyesh: Google has tons of those... I personally use Ubuntu LTS and nginx for the most part...
13:23<JshWright>if you're planning on using irssi, be sure to check out GNU Screen
13:24<priyesh>Gika: JshWright: thanks!
13:26-!-Deviation [] has joined #linode
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13:29<linbot>New news from forums: Nginx banning in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
13:32-!-icepup [] has joined #linode
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13:38<diwwin>mysql noobie. I ran a mysql update command to replace a string on a database that I have grants on, but nothing changed. It shows 57 rows matched and 0 rows changed. what am I missing.
13:38-!-beTTY_ [~jparish@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:42-!-warren [] has joined #linode
13:43<seanh-ansca>what were you doing in the update?
13:43<seanh-ansca>gsub or something?
13:44<linbot>New news from forums: Nginx error 499 in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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13:49<d-b>Perihelion: i want an ipv6 pony!
13:49<@Perihelion>I noticed!
13:50<@Perihelion>I don't haz
13:50<d-b>its ok he has !
13:50<@Perihelion>Prove it!
13:50<+stan_theman>You realize that an ipv6 pony has two more legs, right?
13:50<d-b>linbot: hurry up and get ipv6!
13:51<pharaun>stan_theman: like avatar pony? ;)
13:51<d-b>if it has 2 more legs
13:51<d-b>how does it work?
13:51<pharaun>d-b: just like avatar's pony
13:51<d-b>pharaun: ill set my gravitar to it
13:51<pharaun>or shall i call it, hell horse
13:54<d-b>nawwwh my gravitar in the linode manager hasn't updated yet
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14:01<linbot>New news from forums: Rewrite rule: to in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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14:08<Getty>someone probably knows: does the american army/navy/air force says "sir" to a woman who is in the military rank?
14:09<warren>Getty, they do on TV!
14:09<Getty>AH! but not in real?
14:10<Getty>i just ask this cause of TV (battlestar galactica)
14:10<warren>which is not america
14:11<Marius>Hmm, why is it so hard to find a premium sms gateway that works internationally
14:11<@Perihelion>Because it's expensive
14:11<Marius>well, yeah, but I'm sure there's gotta be someone that does it somewhere
14:12<gbit>Marius, I give it up on that... :P
14:13<SleePy>Getty, You can call them that, but you will be doing pushups. You address them as ma'am
14:14<SleePy>At least thats what I remember
14:16-!-amarc [] has joined #linode
14:17-!-iondrip [~nibbler@] has joined #linode
14:17<JshWright>It's "ma'am" in the fire service, in my experience (though a lot people just use the rank to avoid the issue entirely)
14:18<Getty>just curious, is there any plan how it would all be if there is a woman president?
14:18<Getty>i guess her guy cant be first lady lol ;)
14:18<straterra>First Gentleman
14:18<straterra>(Thats what they did on 24)
14:18<Getty>thats defined?
14:18<Getty>oh we had a woman already?
14:18<Getty>or "they" lol ;)
14:19<@Perihelion>Madam President \p/
14:19<straterra>Madam President, get yer ass back in the kitchen and make me a sammich
14:19<amarc>so that's what mikegrb do..
14:20<Getty>the lol bot is boring!
14:20<Getty>..... ?
14:20<Getty>why he doesnt reply?
14:20<Marius>duff, interesting, thanks!
14:20<@Perihelion>He doesn't love you.
14:20<+stan_theman>Getty: you insulted him :p
14:20<Getty>the lol bot is boring
14:20<Getty>can someone else say it?
14:20<+stan_theman>told you!
14:20-!-gbit [] has quit []
14:21<Getty>the lol
14:21<Getty>other lol
14:21<Getty>.... lol ?
14:22<Getty>he just want to confuse me! he is controlling it manually right now! ;)
14:22<mwalling_>its smarter then you
14:22-!-kapeels [~kapeels@] has joined #linode
14:22<kapeels>linode down?
14:23<kapeels>i meant .. the main website
14:23<linbot>mwalling_: Is Down -> Check if your website is up or down?
14:23<linbot>mwalling_: Is Down -> Check if your website is up or down?
14:23<linbot>mwalling_: Is Down -> Check if your website is up or down?
14:23<mwalling_>kapeels: guess so
14:23<kapeels>not the websites.. people
14:23<mwalling_>kapeels: (thats from downforeveryoneorjustme)
14:23<@Perihelion>Hmm, we're looking into it
14:23<ekes>looks fine here
14:23<kapeels>mwalling_ : down for me too
14:24<pharaun>linode's up
14:24<kapeels>it loaded again..
14:24<kapeels>i was just checking graphs
14:24<mwalling_>i just literally facepalmed so hard i scared my cats
14:24<linbot>mwalling_: Is Up -> Check if your website is up or down?
14:24<kapeels>and saw a coldfusion warning page
14:24<linbot>kapeels: Is Up -> Check if your website is up or down?
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14:33<linbot>New news from forums: php 5.3.5 in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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14:46<mattybats>can I set up two boxes on one linode?
14:47<jtsage>mattybats- you could, but you can only boot one at a time
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14:48<mattybats>is that a standard thing with vps?
14:48<mwalling_>is it a standard thing with a normal server?
14:48<@jed>yes, a VPS is a server, just like a physical computer
14:52<mattybats>i thought it might've been a slice of resources that you could allocate however you please, all to one box, or split up into many
14:52-!-kmurph79 [] has quit [Quit: kmurph79]
14:53<mattybats>i guess that's why you buy additional nodes
14:53<pharaun>mattybats: treat your vps just like a "server" except that linode takes care of the hardware/etc for you
14:54<Daevien>caker: NO CLOUD
14:54<@pparadis>right now it's SNOW
14:54<Daevien>yeah, i've got lots of snow too
14:54<pharaun>heavy snow
14:55<Daevien>and power outages (yay)
14:55<pharaun>up to half maybe 3/4 a foot on my balcony now
14:55-!-nuclear [] has joined #linode
14:55<pharaun>9 inch of snow exactly as measured, if you care
14:56-!-paul3545 [] has joined #linode
14:57<Karrde>my car was in a tomb of snow
14:57-!-ohkus [] has joined #linode
14:57<pharaun>my site was closed so we're working from home.... yay
14:58<Karrde>I just shoveled out my car so I could deal with 12" now and only (knock on wood) a few more inches tomorrow morning
14:58-!-ohkus is now known as auraka
14:59<StevenK>Karrde: Which state?
14:59<robinetd>Karrde: If you close your doors, you won't get snow inside your car.
14:59<pharaun>Karrde: hehe true :) tho i decided $50 was worth my time to never deal with cleaning the car ever again :3
14:59*robinetd wonders if anyone got it.
15:00<warren> Even Hawaii is hit by 10 inches of snow
15:00<StevenK>robinetd: Two drums and a cymbal fall off a cliff ..
15:00<Karrde>StevenK: MA
15:00-!-ASnyder [] has joined #linode
15:00<StevenK>I mean, hell, even *TX* got snow recently.
15:00<Karrde>every state except Florida
15:00<Karrde>though I think they got flurries, just no accumulation
15:01<ASnyder>Hey guys, I seem to be retarded, but I'm trying to restore a backup to the same server and it says not enough space. I would expect, since I'm restoring I would be able to just click on it and it would take care of the rest. I suspect I don't have to manually delete my existing disk image, and then restore.
15:02<ASnyder>I can't seem to find any guide on Linode backups and restores.
15:03<pharaun>Karrde: where in MA :-p I'm on the 495 loop and its only 9ish inch here so not too bad
15:04<mattybats>is there a convenient way to differentiate between two configurations with the same name?
15:04<Karrde>same area
15:04<@caker>ASnyder: the restore system doesn't know what you want -- since you can restore to multiple places (either in your Linode, or into another Linode). If you want to restore into your existing Linode you'll need to de-allocate enough space for the restore - by removing disk images or resizing them
15:05<@caker>ASnyder: alternatively, you could just add another Linode in the same DC, don't deploy anything, restore to it, and move on
15:05<Karrde>the plow also plowed around my car in the lot, so when I pulled out I left walls of snow that just fit my car
15:05<pharaun>Karrde: haha nice :-p
15:05<pharaun>done that so much in rochester
15:06<pharaun>was always fun trying to fit something giant in a slot which used to have a tiny car -_-
15:07<ASnyder>caker: I can see the technical reason for that, but technically I picked a particular linode, I went to its backups, and the backups should account for that interface wise and offer to restore to it, since that's where I am, or to others like in the existing grid. It's confusing to me as a user to see the server I'm currently in and trying to restore a backup to treated like one of my other servers. It's confusing interface wise, and the
15:07*robinetd waits for the other half.
15:07<@caker>irc cuts off long messages -- "wise, and the"
15:07<@jed> ftw
15:08<Karrde>512 characters ought to be enough for anyone
15:08<@caker>ASnyder: so one navigates to the backups on a particular Linode, but wants to restore it elswehere -- where does that happen?
15:09<linbot>New news from forums: Trouble with cloned Linode in General Discussion <>
15:09<ASnyder>caker: it would happen there, but there should be a seperation. So that grid is fine that you have, I"m just saying there should be a clear separation for "this" server, versus others
15:09<@caker>you don't know which server you clicked on? :)
15:09<ASnyder>so instead of Select a linode to restore this backup to
15:09<@caker>I'm messing with you -- thanks for the input
15:09<warren>The Linode backups are file backups, not raw images right?
15:10<ASnyder>you would have "restore to this server" and a line, and it's info, without the not enough space issue, and then the gird you have, but saying something like Select a different linode to restore to
15:11<ASnyder>very clear to me and saves the several steps it will now take to delete the info, then click back, then click restore
15:13<ASnyder>caker: The current process is very confusing to me. So now I actually have to remove two disk images, then go to backups, then restore to, correct?
15:13-!-Sputnik7 [] has joined #linode
15:13<@caker>try it and see :)
15:14<ASnyder>caker: that's the thing, when dealing with a server, try it and see is not the right approach. If I don't live in this every day it can be daunting. Any uncertainties or extra steps just makes the user, in this case me, uncomfortable with the process.
15:16<ASnyder>caker: Even more steps now, they both failed, because I forgot to shutdown.
15:17<ASnyder>So to be clear, current restore process is. 1. Shut down server. 2. Delete any disk images 3. Wait for deletion 4. Click on backups 5. Click backup restore to 6. Click server to restore to
15:17<ASnyder>versus as it is on slicehost for example, 1. Click on backups, 2. Click restore
15:17<@caker>what you want is: Rebuild from Backup
15:17-!-necrodearia [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
15:18<robinetd>People use slicehost?
15:18<@caker>their limitations in other areas prevent it from being any more complicated. With our system flexibility can add complexity
15:18<ASnyder>caker: I clicked on rebuild, I didn't see that there was any choice to pick a backup
15:18<@caker>ASnyder: because that workflow doesn't exist
15:19<ASnyder>robinetd: It used to when they were good, years ago, I still have on server with them, and really love Linode, but in certain cases such as these I wonder why it can't be simpler
15:19-!-cps [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:19<@caker>for instance: you CAN'T have multiple disk images with them, so restoring replaces whatever was there. With our system, one can restore next to an existing deployment
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15:20<ASnyder>caker: sure, but just because an option exists doesn't mean that the simpler, more common option, can't be easier to accomplish.
15:20<robinetd>Interesting. The SATA3 drive I want is cheaper than its SATA2 counterpart. o.O
15:20<dominikh>that's because mechanical drives are obsolete!
15:20<ASnyder>caker: if there was a rebuiid from backup that would be nice, it should be in backups, but there's no option I can see there, nor is there an option in Rebuild.
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15:31<robinetd>dominikh: Is that you offering to buy an SSD for me? :)
15:31-!-nuclear [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:32<dominikh>robinetd: nope, it's me trolling the guy who said they were obsolete
15:32<SleePy>Why do things not make sense sometimes :(
15:33<robinetd>dominikh: I figured, but I would've been remiss if I didn't ask :D
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15:36-!-Randall_ is now known as rmunroe
15:36<rmunroe>How do I upgrade an existing linode from one plan to another?
15:36<@jed>Resize tab
15:36<mwalling_>theres a tab for that
15:36<rmunroe>Hah. I missed it somehow.
15:36<@jed>focus on a Linode, then hit "Resize" (fifth tab in), and np :)
15:37<@jed>there's a lot of R in there, my brain skips rebuild and rescue occasionally
15:37<straterra> <--- UML Linode XD
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15:41<hawk>straterra: See what you did, you scared away the xkcd guy!
15:44-!-kms [] has joined #linode
15:44-!-kenyon [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
15:46<Daevien>hawk: he always comes back though eventually
15:47<straterra>I just got..screwed
15:47<straterra>A company in NJ that I ordered a LCD panel from is closed today due to snow..
15:47<@Perihelion>I know a company called Linode that's open
15:47<straterra>jed's at work..why aren't they?
15:47<straterra>Can you guys drive over and steal the panel for me?
15:47<@Perihelion>Because they aren't champions
15:48-!-Jere [] has joined #linode
15:49-!-burningdog [] has quit [Quit: burningdog]
15:49-!-mwalling_ is now known as mwalling
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15:51<Talman>Because they don't live at work?
15:52<straterra>It snowed here and I still had to go to work
15:52<Talman>Don't you guys just have a small caspule hotel on site for employees who are working?
15:52<Talman>Attention Jed: Please enter sleep mode for 8 hours.
15:52<hawk>Talman: You mean for employees who aren't working?
15:52<Talman>For employees during their sleep and recreation cycle.
15:53<Talman>But still working. Because you can never stop working for Linode.
15:53*Perihelion hears a whip crack in the distance
15:54<robinetd>The whip cracked? Better repair it before it becomes too damaged.
15:54<hawk>Perihelion: In the distance? Have you escaped?
15:55<TheFirst>Perihelion: linode getting in to the BDSM biz?
15:56<heidi>it amazes me how small you guys think linode is
15:56<heidi>even though its number one in the industry and has been around for like 7 years
15:56<@jed>nearly 8
15:57<heidi>a pioneer in the industry no less
15:57<heidi>and other, smaller companies are in their own office spaces so why not linode
15:57<mwalling>but slicehost is better, duh
15:57*jed assigns 2 demerits to mwalling
15:58<@pparadis>permanent. record.
15:58<mwalling>try me
15:58<@jed>heidi: think I could take mwalling? I think I could
15:59<heidi>i am not sure i would waste the energy if he is truly a slicehost fanboy
15:59*mwalling stares
15:59<Yaakov>Actually, there is only caker. He's a mutliple personality.
15:59<heidi>hi sweets
15:59<bob2>Yaakov: and multiple keyboards
15:59<straterra>jed: Not if hes in his chicken suit
15:59<Yaakov>bob2: No, just screen.
15:59<@Perihelion>e cakerus unum?
15:59<bob2>hm, now I'm a bit nervous
15:59<bob2>charismatic leader
16:00<bob2>giant posters of his face on the walls
16:00<heidi>back to lurking
16:00<@Perihelion>Be good, Linodians.
16:00<heidi>my 2 cents dispensed
16:00<bob2>linode might be a communist dictatorship waiting to happen
16:00<ASnyder>caker: and after restore it seems there are then 2 restore disk images + 2 more profiles, so I then have to delete the previous profiles. I love Linode, I just wish this was easier.
16:00<Yaakov>HELLO HEIDI
16:00<Yaakov>I SEE YOU THERE
16:00<heidi>Yaakov: HI
16:00<Yaakov>Hello, Perihelion.
16:00<@jed>heidi silently judges, all the time
16:00<heidi>crap you ruined my lurking
16:01<heidi>i am the most judgemental of all, its ok
16:01<@caker>ASnyder: it restored whatever you had in the backup. However many profiles, however many images. If you restored more than once, you'd see multiples
16:01<@Perihelion>Good day, Yaakov.
16:01<Yaakov>heidi: I can't help it, you are just too alluring.
16:01<heidi>heheh yeah i figured
16:03<mwalling>huh, USD and AUD are almost on pariaty
16:03<mwalling>or how ever you spell that
16:03<encode>ooh, caker is in the building
16:03<bob2>we were above for a week or so
16:03<encode>oh, and hi heidi
16:03<heidi>hi encode
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16:04<tonyyarusso>mwalling: Yes, I suppose both the USD and AUD have become rather rejected and generally despised lately, what with Europe and China trying to distance themselves from such currencies.
16:04<tonyyarusso>wordplay fun!
16:05<mwalling>well, i mean i just did 450AUD in USD on google and it was 441
16:05<ASnyder>caker: I know, but I still have the previous ones. Again you're giving me solid technical reasoning, I do this too with our users, but the user just wants it to be easier :).
16:05<@caker>ASnyder: loud and clear :)
16:06<straterra>Roger dodger five-niner-charlie
16:06<tonyyarusso>mwalling: I was having fun with your spelling being equally similar to "pariah" as "parity" :)
16:06<@caker>straterra: your contributions are meaningful and worthwhile. Thank you.
16:07<straterra>caker: You're very welcome :)
16:07-!-laser` [] has joined #linode
16:07<straterra>Most of the time they just aren't around when it happens :/
16:07<Yaakov>Hello, citizen caker.
16:08-!-joeDeuce [] has joined #linode
16:08<encode>what's the special occasion?
16:09<encode>caker isn't usually that active in #linode, and heidi almost never is
16:09<encode>must be a slow day at the linode hq
16:09<Yaakov>caker is episodically active here.
16:09<straterra>Comrade Caker!
16:09<Yaakov>heidi was just sowing her IRC oats.
16:09<encode>but he's not around 24/8 like he used to be in the old days
16:10<Yaakov>He is, he just doesn't say anything.
16:10<pharaun>he is watching
16:10<@jed>well, linode is a juggernaut now, with 17,000 employees in 21 offices worldwide
16:10<@jed>takes a special man to lead this company
16:10<Yaakov>He's jacked in like Johnny Mnemonic!
16:10<encode>straterra: more useful contributions? :P
16:10<straterra>Say it ain't so! I will not gooo! Turn the lights off..carry me hoooome!
16:11<straterra>Blink 182 is always a useful contribution
16:11<heidi>encode: i lurk and i had noticed multiple times today that someone questioned the size/validity of linode being a real company and gave my 2 cents
16:11<Ovron>hows LINASA panning out? moon-landing R&D going well for datacenter #6 moon deployment?
16:11<heidi>but i lurk always
16:11<encode>it's as real as google. And almost as old.
16:11<heidi>hehe yeah
16:11<@caker>it's not the size that matters...
16:12<linbot>THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!
16:12<straterra>Aww snap
16:12<Ovron>that's what she said
16:12<heidi>just not as big cause google has control over the planet
16:12<SleePy>17k employees :o
16:12<@jed>SleePy: i'm kidding
16:12<Yaakov>Linode is run from caker's basement bedroom in his parent's house. The "servers" are in the garage and on a cable connection.
16:12<heidi>hahhaha true that
16:12<SleePy>Ok.. I was going to say :D
16:12<encode>i want a cable conneciton like that
16:12<mwalling><!--#include forwardlookingstatementsdisclamer.html -->
16:12<heidi>i think in the old days it might have been pretty close to true, hehehe
16:13<encode>heidi: nah, caker's garage would have been more reliable than The Planet
16:13<@mikegrb>mmm cake
16:13<heidi>when cake was in his apartment and then mike came on and was working from our little apartment
16:13<straterra>Hack Caker's garage!
16:13<Yaakov>Linode, LLC World HQ is an ultra-modern office complex with it's own police force and fire department.
16:13<Yaakov>its, too.
16:13<@Perihelion>That's not far off...we're close to both stations
16:13<encode>who's the police force?
16:13<heidi>Yaakov: with galloway pd just across the street that is almost true
16:14<encode>clearly mikegrb is the fire department
16:14<pharaun>and one day, every single computer/server/etc is going to be running on a linode :-p
16:14<Yaakov>mikegrb is the natural gas facility.
16:14<Yaakov>Well, I don't know how natural...
16:14<jtsage>unfortunatly, the fire dept is jed running around with one of them fake snake shooting fire extingshers..
16:14<pharaun>Yaakov: i would call it... unnatural
16:14<Ovron>Yaakov: does that involve a lot of beans?
16:14<Yaakov>Ovron: If Mike ate beans it wouldn't be so bad.
16:15<heidi>no, i dont cook beans often
16:15<@Perihelion>It makes no difference :(
16:15<Yaakov>heidi: It's the stuff you don't cook that makes it worse.
16:15<heidi>yeah we dont eat out as often as we used to
16:16<straterra>That's what she said!
16:16*encode wonders if array has been washed away or if he's ok
16:16<heidi>straterra: seriously think of a car every time i see your nick
16:16<Yaakov>straterra: You are a prurient ninny.
16:16<heidi>i dont know why and its nagging at me
16:16<Yaakov>heidi: It is a kind of chick car sounding nick, isn't it?
16:16*jed snorts
16:16<heidi>kinda yes
16:17<@Perihelion>Poor straterra. No respect.
16:17<heidi>like maybe by honda or something
16:17<Yaakov>It evokes pink and patchouli car deodorizer.
16:17<heidi>the Honda Straterra
16:17<Ovron>Das Straterra - handbag holder included.
16:17<@Perihelion>Toyota straterra
16:17<@Perihelion>Maybe a Daewoo?
16:17<@jed>hey, I drive a toyota and take that personally
16:17<Yaakov>heidi: I don't know... it's more Mitsubishish.
16:18<@Perihelion>jed: I wasn't calling toyota a piece...but it sounds like a name they might come up with
16:18<@jed>YEAH BUT
16:18-!-squircle [~squircle@] has joined #linode
16:18<@Perihelion>k. work.
16:18<encode>nah, I think it sounds like a Korean car
16:18<encode>a Kia Straterra
16:19<Ovron>Lada Straterra imo
16:19<encode>it doesn't sound too Soviet to me
16:19<mwalling>encode: straterra drives a chick car
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16:21<@jed>where's that photo of him
16:21<Daevien>yay, ibm model m keyboard from 1987 back in my possession, just had to narrow down where the heck i left it :p
16:21<encode>oh well. Maybe it makes the chicks feel less threatened?
16:21<pixl>I was just asked to setup a Handspring Visor on Windows 7.
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16:24<ASnyder>caker: can you clarify this one for me, the restore image has less disk space than the source, I have to resize the disk to get all the remaining storage, right?
16:25-!-WoodWork_ [] has joined #linode
16:25<@caker>ASnyder: it restores it as small as it can -- so a backup from a big-ass Linode that only has 2G used can be restored on a much smaller Linode (for instance)
16:25<ASnyder>caker: sure, but for my "rebuild from backup" purposes, I need to resize my disk to make use of that storage, correct?
16:25<@caker>if that is your desire, yes
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16:26<ASnyder>caker: Wouldn't there be issues immediately regarding storage? Since it's sized exactly to existing data, would basic things, such as logging, or uploads for example, exceed the resized image?
16:27-!-WoodWork [] has joined #linode
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16:28<@caker>ASnyder: there is headroom build into the calculation, but again -- we don't know what the end user's intentions are
16:28<@caker>*built ...
16:28<ASnyder>caker: no problem, I'll just make note of the additional step, :)
16:28<@caker>ASnyder: automagically resizing the images can get tricky too -- what if there are a couple disk images? Which one gets resized, or how do we resize them? What if the Linode itself was resized - how do we handle that, etc
16:29-!-Guest37 is now known as woodwork
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16:30<ASnyder>caker: in the most basic case of a rebuild, assuming the source hasn't gone through a metamorphosis in size, I would assume you mirror the original specifications. Of course in the other cases it would get more complex, but in the most basic case which would seem to me to be the most common case, you wouldn't have to worry about it.
16:30<Daevien>what if you dont want all the destination space used
16:30<mwalling>wow thats a lot of ccode for an edgecase
16:31<mwalling>20/80 rule
16:31<straterra>20% blood, 80% schnapps?
16:31<@pparadis>straterra: 100% schnapps
16:32<robinetd>I keep my alcohol stream clear of blood, thank you very much.
16:32<encode>i see what you did there
16:32*pparadis subscribes to newsletter
16:32<ejp>hard to cauterize a wound that way though
16:32<straterra>Why would you want to?
16:32<straterra>A wound means MORE SCHNAPPS!
16:33<mwalling>i was actually talking about 20 minutes of effort to solve 80% of the needs
16:34-!-KnyghtMare [] has joined #linode
16:34<straterra>Is that a programmers term type of thing?
16:35<Rob>assuming you mean 20% of effort then yeah
16:35<Rob>not actaully 20 minutes :)
16:35<mwalling>er, yeah that
16:35<@Perihelion>Lazy Rob is lazy.
16:35<KnyghtMare>is traffic over eth1 metered? and what types of speeds should you expect to get talking to other linodes in the same datacenter?
16:36<mwalling>there is no eth1
16:36<Rob>very lazy
16:36<@Perihelion>The interface is a lie.
16:36<@jed>what eth1?
16:36<Rob>your a lie
16:36<Daevien>maybe he added internal ip?
16:37<@caker>KnyghtMare: Linodes are outbound rate limited at the interface itself. If you need faster bandwidth between local Linodes, please submit a ticket
16:37<mwalling>Daevien: on eth0
16:37-!-ktabic [] has quit [Quit: I'm a professionally trainined computer scientist. That is to say, I am poorly educated]
16:37<Daevien>mwalling: i dunno, i'm just guessing :P
16:37<KnyghtMare>"If located within the same facility, you can take advantage of our private, back-end network, which does not count towards your monthly bandwidth quota. " from the FAQ
16:37*Daevien finds a new use for his model m keyboard, beating people with it
16:37<KnyghtMare>I assumed that'd be in the form of an eth1 device
16:38<Ovron>alias on eth0 probably
16:38<tharkun>caker: what is the rate they are limited at?
16:38<mwalling>KnyghtMare: its an additional address on eth0
16:38<@heckman>or eth0:1 rather
16:38<ejp>Daevien: that's not really new. people have been doing that since about 5 minutes after they came out.
16:38<encode>heckman: yeah, i was just typing that. But had to stop for a coughing fit
16:38<@heckman>My throat is buggin me, blah
16:38<@heckman>Even Mint tea failed today
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16:39<encode>Mint tea always fails
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16:40<Daevien>ejp: i suppose. new use for my exact keyboard which as far as i know has not been used as a blunt object for beating? :P
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17:12<Luizg>hmm, soo will linode have native v6 ready to go for world ipv6 day?
17:16<tonyyarusso>ipv6 day?
17:16-!-necrodearia [] has joined #linode
17:17<Ovron> had to google it, heh
17:18<Luizg>tonyyarusso: yeah, all the "major" sites are going to publish AAAA records for the day, see what happens
17:19*tonyyarusso should try setting that up
17:19<tonyyarusso>Also, if anyone knows a good ebook on IPv6 fundamentals, I'd love to have it.
17:20<@Perihelion>HE has a "school" thing
17:20<@Perihelion>You can get certified or something
17:20<Luizg>tonyyarusso: since linode don't offer native v6, you'll have to setup a tunnel via HE or sixxs
17:20<Ovron>putting aside connectivity speed and quality in sweden, barely any ISP here provides ipv6 >:(
17:20<@Perihelion>But they teach you the basics
17:20-!-necrodearia [] has quit []
17:22<tonyyarusso>Luizg: cool
17:24<tonyyarusso>Any preferences on HE vs Sixxs for a tunnel?
17:25<hawk>Can't say I have a preference but for me HE has worked fine
17:25<tonyyarusso>On two ends, actually. First priority is making my Linodes accessible over IPv6, second priority is figuring out how to have IPv6 connectivity at home.
17:26<Luizg>I use SIXXs
17:28-!-necrodearia [] has joined #linode
17:28<straterra>HE > Sixxs
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17:31<auraka>Native > HE
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17:32<tonyyarusso>Okay, I'm giving HE a shot.
17:32<tonyyarusso>Do a need a separate "tunnel" for each of my Linodes, or do I just get one?
17:33<straterra>You can create multiple accounts and get multiple /64's...or get a /48 and do it yourself from one
17:33<tonyyarusso>hmm, no library article eh?
17:33<@pparadis>not yet, planned (for tunnels).
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17:44<Boohemian>any recommendations for a linux distro for laptops? i don't want a fedora or debian/ubuntu based system... (i'm about to ditch my mbp and get a thinkpad)
17:44<Luizg>ubun.. oh
17:44<devsforev>Boohemian: I'm rolling with Arch now and love it
17:44<tonyyarusso>What does "Scope:Global" and "Scope:Link" mean in ifconfig output? (Which one goes in the AAAA record?)
17:44<straterra>Boohemian: OpenSUSE?
17:44<straterra>tonyyarusso: global
17:44<robinetd>If only there were a site that had a list of distributions. Maybe even watched them. :o
17:45<tonyyarusso>Boohemian: Why don't you want Fedora, Debian, or Ubuntu?
17:45<Boohemian>devsforev: yeah, that's on my list
17:45<Boohemian>that's the only distro that seems worthwhile now (if you dont want an apt or rpm based system)
17:45<tonyyarusso>straterra: Do I include the /64 bit on the end?
17:45<sirpengi>Boohemian: is there anything in particular you didn't like about those distros?
17:45<straterra>Do you include the mask in ipv4? :)
17:46<ToM5>hi, i changed my hostname and now cant connect to my linode. any suggestions on what to check
17:46<ToM5>connects just timeout
17:46<Boohemian>i'm also considering freebsd on my laptop, but linux may have better compatibility
17:46<tonyyarusso>straterra: No, but I don't entirely understand the format of v6 strings yet, so just checking.
17:46<Boohemian>sirpengi: i love debian for servers, but lenny is too old and i don't want a sid system because i want something reliable. i don't like the ubuntu philosophy (for myself, at least). i really hated fedora when i used it reviously
17:47<tonyyarusso>awright, should become available over IPv6 shortly.
17:47<tonyyarusso>straterra: Care to explain the "get a /48 and do it yourself from one" bit to me?
17:47<straterra>tonyyarusso: uhm..what address did you use?
17:47<tonyyarusso>straterra: 2001:470:1f10:b0d::2
17:47<straterra>Is that your end of the tunnel?
17:47<straterra>If so..don't use that
17:47<tonyyarusso>err, oh
17:47<straterra>Assign yourself an IP out of your /64
17:48<tonyyarusso>straterra: Okay, backing up - HE panel thingy, under "Tunnel Endpoints" - I take it I want one of those, yes?
17:48<tonyyarusso>The one I just pasted is the "Client IPv6 address".
17:49<straterra>In the panel, it should have your /64 and your tunnel endpoint..what are those?
17:50-!-cps [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
17:50<ToM5>"device eth0 entered promiscuous mode" what does this mean?
17:50<encode>that it's sleeping around
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17:52<tonyyarusso>straterra: In the section "IPv6 Tunnel Endpoints", there are 4 lines - "Server IPv4 addresss", "Server IPv6 address", "Client IPv4 address", and "Client IPv6 address". "Client IPv6 address" is 2001:470:1f10:b0d::2/64, Client 4 is (my normal Linode IP), Server 6 is 2001:470:1f10:b0d::1/64, and Server 4 is (HE in Chicago)
17:52<straterra>tonyyarusso: Right..and theres one more field
17:53<straterra>Something that ends with /64 that isn't either of those above
17:53<tonyyarusso>straterra: Not under that section there's not. Now, down further on the page, there's a section titled "Routed IPv6 Prefixes and rDNS Delegations", and under that there's a field "Routed /64" with 2001:470:1f11:b0d::/64
17:54<straterra>That's the one you want
17:54<straterra>Assign yourself an IP out of THAT range
17:54<sirpengi>Boohemian: that's still not any answer as to what you didn't like about them.
17:54<straterra>And put it on the he-ipv6 interface (or whatever you named it)
17:54<sirpengi>hard to make any recommendations when we have no idea what it is that you're looking for
17:54<straterra> can use 2001:470:1f11:b0d::1 if you want
17:55<Boohemian>sirpengi: i just wnat to use a different system that what i've used before
17:55<sirpengi>go bsd then
17:55<Boohemian>sirpengi: but it seems linux has much better support than bsd for laptops :/
17:56<tonyyarusso>straterra: The route2 instructions had me run 'ip addr add 2001:470:1f10:b0d::2/64 dev he-ipv6' - are you saying that was incorrect?
17:57-!-Amy__ [~Amy@] has quit [Quit: I'M SO TAKING THIS IC]
17:57<tonyyarusso>(Or am I totally confused? :P)
17:57<straterra>That's correct
17:58<straterra>But thats only for the point to point tunnel..that does nothing for your allocated range
17:58<tonyyarusso>So am I assigning *another* address to the interface, or making a second interface, or what?
17:59<straterra>Assigning another address on the interface
17:59<straterra>ip addr add 2001:470:1f11:b0d::1/65 dev he-ipv6
17:59<straterra>make that /64, not 65
18:00-!-jameswilson [~Adium@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:00<straterra>Lemme know when thats done
18:01<tonyyarusso>Should be there now.
18:01-!-storrgie_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:01<straterra>Yup..I can ping it
18:01<straterra>So..put THAT IP in your DNS/Apache configs
18:01<tonyyarusso>It's propogating through currently.
18:02<ToM5>hi, i changed my hostname and now cant connect to my linode. any suggestions on what to check?
18:02<tonyyarusso>Okay, so now, for the second Linode - is that 2001:470:1f11:b0d::2, or am I fiddling with a /48?
18:02<straterra>For the second linode, you can create ANOTHER HE account and do the same sort of thing
18:02<tonyyarusso>That seems silly.
18:02<straterra> can undo the work you just did, not use the /64 you were delegated..and request a /48 :P
18:02<straterra>On the dashboard there you should be able to request a /48
18:03<tonyyarusso>So why do I have more than one IP address for one machine?
18:03<tonyyarusso>or rather, an entire block exclusively for one machine?
18:03-!-user6484 [] has joined #linode
18:04-!-DephNet[Paul] [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:05<straterra>Because /64 is the smallest subnet for ipv6
18:05-!-iondrip [~nibbler@] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
18:05<user6484>I'm getting this error PHP Fatal error: Call to undefined function imagecreatetruecolor(), I read online that it means I don't have GD module?
18:05<user6484>How do I fix it with the apache stack instalation
18:05-!-cps [] has joined #linode
18:06<tonyyarusso>straterra: So, /64 is equivalent to saying /32 in IPv4?
18:06<straterra>a /64 has a LOT of IPs in it
18:06<straterra>But /64 is the smallest network in ipv6
18:07-!-ToM5 [] has quit [Quit: ToM5]
18:07*tonyyarusso sighs
18:07<@jed>/128 is the equivalent of /32 in IPv6
18:07<straterra>So..HE has a /64 for the tunnel between you and them..and then they allocate you a /64 to use at the end of your tunnel
18:07<tonyyarusso>Need to read the book, clearly :P
18:07-!-zivester [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:07-!-zivester [] has joined #linode
18:07<straterra>It's the same thing if you got a ipv4 block
18:07<straterra>You'd be given an IP on the ISPs network, and they route your block to that IP
18:07<pixl>How can I get started with IPv6? Is HE the best tunnel broker for someone that lives in America?
18:08<erik`>HE is the best tunnelbroker
18:08<BarkerJr>6to4 is much easier, but less stable
18:08<bob2>user6484: depends on your OS
18:09<user6484>unbuntu 10.4
18:09<tonyyarusso>straterra: Okay, so I need a /64 for every *external* IPv4 address I have, and then single address for every *internal* one. So, since my Linodes have one of each, I have a /64 separately for each of them, but would use a single /64 for all of my stuff at home, while assigning multiple IPs within that to each device, with the tunnel-to-address step being equivalent to the NAT I have on IPv4?
18:09<erik`>tonyyarusso, sort of, but then not having NAT ;)
18:10<tonyyarusso>There is no such OS as unbuntu user6484 ;)
18:10<tonyyarusso>erik`: right
18:10<tonyyarusso>Okay, maybe understanding then.
18:10<bob2>user6484: sudo aptitude install php5-gd ; sudo invoke-rc.d apache2 restart
18:11<BarkerJr>I bet that routers that delegate ipv6 just dump everything for the /64 or /48 onto the ethernet and let any PC pick it up
18:12<erik`>BarkerJr, no
18:12<erik`>this also does not work that way for ipv4
18:12<erik`>before you can send data to a IP on the local network, you need to find the MAC address
18:12<linbot>New news from forums: Huge http processes in Performance and Tuning <>
18:12<BarkerJr>you think dd-wrt is smart enough to check what ipv6's are in use?
18:12<erik`>done by ARP in IPv4, ND in IPv6
18:12<BarkerJr>oh, good point
18:12<erik`>yes, because it will do a ND for them
18:13<erik`>(or have that already cached)
18:13<BarkerJr>I wonder if my router will ICMP to any other IP
18:13<user6484>bob2: whats the second part? invoke?
18:14<erik`>BarkerJr, ICMPv6 ND you mean? only if the config says the host should be directly connected to an interface on the box
18:14<erik`>if not, it will go to the gateway
18:15<BarkerJr>dd-wrt is the gateway, right?
18:16<bob2>user6484: restarets apache
18:17<user6484>ah ok thanks it actually worked! :) appreciate the hel
18:17<user6484>i dont have invoke rc.d on my vps, you recommend it?
18:18<@caker>service apache2 restart or /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
18:19<tonyyarusso>If you're running Ubuntu like you said, you most certainly do have /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d
18:19<@caker> ... Bono .. really?
18:20<bob2>caker: oh, upstart
18:20<bob2><- getoffmylawn
18:22<Deckert>Just to point out the glaringly obvious fact that everyone is missing - Elevation Partners is not Bono's investment fund. It's an investment fund that he joined - after it had launched.
18:22*tonyyarusso likes upstart, but that doesn't mean he understands it
18:22<Deckert>(from one of the comments)
18:24<Deckert>BF is it's own bubble waiting to happen
18:25<@caker>FB is it is own bubble ??
18:25<Deckert>like the dot-com's of 2000
18:25<@caker> !!!!!!!!!
18:26<Deckert>yes, and I should know that, even if English is my 2nd language
18:26<Deckert>and it's 1:26 am here where I am
18:26-!-Boohemian [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:27*Deckert droops his eyelids further and drags himself off to bed
18:27<@caker>no worries - you probably are better at it than most English-as-a-first-language people :)
18:27*Deckert perks up a little and waves
18:28<encode>i'd like to get me a 2% stake in facebook
18:28<encode>that would be a nice retirement fund
18:28<praetorian>mm steak
18:29-!-Boohemian [] has joined #linode
18:29<Deckert>that 2% would only be worth something if you could sell it, remember that those are not publicly traded shares
18:30<encode>I would sell it to Bono. I'm sure he wants more facebook
18:30<Deckert>yah, you're probably right ... many people want FB shares right now
18:31*encode wonders what the world would do if they woke up one morning and facebook was gone
18:31<Deckert>fallback to myspace, email and IM?
18:32<purrdeta>it would be lulz
18:32<bob2>there are places to sell fb shares atm
18:32<encode>it should happen on April 1
18:32<encode>facebook replaced by failbook
18:32<robinetd>There's a difference?
18:33<@caker>09:32 < irgeek> MySpace is email with extra spam and a bad soundtrack! <-- best quote ever
18:33<encode>2 letters
18:35<robinetd>My drive is shipping from TN. :(
18:35-!-vcardoso [~vcardoso@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:35<robinetd>(Oh, and I bought a drive.)
18:35<robinetd>linbot be dead?
18:35<linbot>bob2: Point (0.36488429, 0.74780555) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 17575 of 22355 (π ≈ 3.144710355625140 - 0.003117702035347)
18:35<linbot>purrdeta: Point (0.75585390, 0.54411619) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 17576 of 22356 (π ≈ 3.144748613347647 - 0.003155959757854)
18:35<purrdeta>just slow
18:35<bss>a lot of hipsters would be pissed, and the parts of the internet where work happens would move right along. meanwhile, if google disappeared, huge swaths of infrastructure would just cease to exist. so yeah, i think the "omg facebook is bigger than google" claims at the beginning of the year were a bit false
18:36<bss>oh, that was a rhetorical question :|
18:36<purrdeta>bigger doesn't mean more important you know
18:36<bob2>"mainstream media in hyperbole shocker", film at 11
18:36<robinetd>purrdeta: Is that what she told you? ;)
18:36<purrdeta>I lol'd
18:37<bss>yeah, i know that the original claims were dumb, but there's dumb and then there's "we didn't think this through but are reporting it anyway" dumb
18:38<purrdeta>That's most "news" these days :P
18:38<bss>which indeed reduces to --- yeah
18:39<robinetd>Turns out that eating raw filet mignon isn't good for my stomach.
18:40<encode>facebook I could survive without. But not google.
18:40<robinetd>I think I could survive without google.
18:41<bss>i'd have to go back to using bookmarks
18:42<robinetd>I have my favorite sites memorized.
18:42<encode>judging by the amount of search hits showing up in google analytics, a lot of people enter urls into google to open websites
18:42<encode>so they would all be unable to use the internet
18:42<robinetd>encode: survival of the fittest.
18:42<encode>not sure how they manage to get to google in the first place
18:42<encode>must be their home page
18:44-!-vraa [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:45-!-Bhavicp [] has quit []
18:47<straterra>BrianHV: Though we both lie close together..we feel miles apart inside
18:47<straterra>Well..that was a random tab
18:49-!-atealtha [] has joined #linode
18:50<linbot>robinetd: Yo momma's so fat, she doesn't handle more than 2 gigs! (778:11/5) [umomr]
18:50<atealtha>how can I get a referral credit for signing up my friend?
18:50<robinetd>:|. These just get less funny with each joke.
18:50<robinetd>atealtha: Tell him to put your referral code in the referral box.
18:51<linbot>Looking for a referral code? Use this one for free activation: dbe98bfe8cad58e02d9ea22fc98f446240edc909
18:51<atealtha>thanks, couldn't find info on the site easily
18:53<linbot>Looking for a referral code? Use this one for free activation: dbe98bfe8cad58e02d9ea22fc98f446240edc909 (Referral docs: )
18:53<atealtha>the link works, but I don't see it linked in the Linode Manager section of the site
18:53<robinetd>atealtha: top right of your screen.
18:54<robinetd>To the left of "log out".
18:54<heidi>encode: i admit i have done that on accident
18:54<atealtha>sneaky camoflauge
18:54<heidi>wasn't watching where i was typing
18:55<heidi>boxes for url and google search right next to each other
18:55<heidi>or already being in the google search box and thinking i had switched to the url box
18:55<heidi>cause i use firefox, there is a google search box on the toolbar
18:57<heidi>its possible, but not always the case, that others do the same thing
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19:07<mwalling>ok, i no longer have the stupidest named cat
19:08<mwalling>anchor for the time warner 24hour news channel has a cat named brian williams
19:08<purrdeta>what's your cats name?
19:08<mwalling>... linode?
19:08<purrdeta>Oh duh >.<
19:08<purrdeta>I remember that
19:08*purrdeta slaps self
19:09<purrdeta>I'm sure you'll find it in your <3 to <3 me again
19:09<purrdeta>dammit :(
19:12<robinetd>I have a cat named archie, a cat named shakey, and a cat named sabrina.
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19:16-!-atealtha [] has quit [Quit: there goes my 6 day uptime]
19:25<praetorian>give you an example:
19:26<ejp>I have two cats. they both named "hey! stop that you fucker!"
19:27<robinetd>o_O Is that supposed to be funny?
19:27<ejp>not especially, no.
19:28<robinetd>Oh, mission accomplished. D:
19:28<purrdeta>one of my cats is named SecondCat
19:29<purrdeta>pretty dumb but I like it
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19:30<ejp>in reality ours are named Kali and Thor
19:30*nDuff used to have 1of4, 2of4, 3of4 and 4of4
19:30<nDuff>...then we found another kitten, so we had 5of4
19:30-!-jameswilson [~Adium@] has joined #linode
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19:31<@Perihelion>I'd get 2 cats, name then 1cat and 2cat, then get a ginger cat and name it redcat, then get a russian blue and name it bluecat
19:33*nDuff is pretty sure his ability to tolerate living with 5 felines was closely related to having kids in the house, and that he wouldn't do it again.
19:34<cats>I have to change my nick sometime, so many highlights
19:35*nDuff <- dog person now
19:35*encode would name his cat lol
19:35<encode>so I can say I haz a lolcat
19:35<praetorian>someone here has a dog
19:35<praetorian>its named dog dog
19:36<encode>that's just lame
19:36<hipsterslapfight>i am going to get a kitten and i am going to name it bear
19:36<encode>I've never had either a cat or a dog. But I think I would like a cat better
19:36<encode>I don't think they're terribly suited to apartment living though
19:36<purrdeta>I'm a cat person but my roommate has dogs and a cat :D
19:36<thegodlikehobo>cats rule, dogs drool
19:37<@Perihelion>cats are awesome for apartments
19:37<praetorian>i want a dropbear
19:37<@Perihelion>actually for *
19:37<@Perihelion>They don't require a whole lot
19:37<encode>what about pedobear?
19:37<nDuff>Perihelion, I'm living in 800 sqft with a Shepherd and a Chihuahua, and it all works out pretty well.
19:37<@Perihelion>i want a doberman :3
19:37<nDuff>(then again, it'd be harder without the big shared courtyard)
19:37<encode>I want a penguin
19:37<@Perihelion>i wouldnt be able to exercise it as much as it needs to be though
19:37<encode>saw some last week
19:38<encode>would cats be ok if thye're inside 24x7?
19:39*nDuff wishes he lived a bit closer to work -- right now he has to bring the Shepherd into the office in a trailer, as it's too far for him to run alongside the bike.
19:39<ejp>I've had a couple cats that would *never* go out. they hated it
19:39<@Perihelion>I doubt people would like me bringing a dog into the office haha
19:39<Gika>my cat is scared to go out. it starts screaming and scratching if i take him just outside the door
19:39<@Perihelion>ours used to escape...they'd make it to the bottom of the stairs then stop
19:39<@Perihelion>They ate some grass
19:39<@Perihelion>that was about it
19:40<encode>i'm a little worried about house-training it too
19:40<@Perihelion>It's not so bad
19:40<Gika>they know there's no food outside.
19:40<encode>given that my floors are nearly all covered in carpet
19:40<ejp>cats housetrain themselves really
19:40<@Perihelion>You just show them where the litter is and they're usually okay
19:40<@Perihelion>as long as you clean the box regularly they usually won't pee everywhere
19:41<@Perihelion>it's important that you get male cats fixed though or they'll spray :/
19:41<encode>then the only remaining thing to worry about is them scratching/chewing everything
19:41-!-JDLSpeedy [] has joined #linode
19:41<encode>plus what to do when I go away
19:41-!-JDLSpeedy [] has quit []
19:42<encode>I have a friend that breeds some sorts of cats
19:42<Gika>mine has the habit of shitting in the bathtub from time to time, but he hasn't destroyed anything in the last 2 years
19:42-!-JDLSpeedy [] has joined #linode
19:42<robinetd>Gika: You mean you aren't supposed to do that?
19:43<encode>I don't remember which breed though
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19:45<encode>I think he used to breed bengal cats
19:45<purrdeta>Gika: my roommates cat does that
19:45<purrdeta>she did it on her birthday, infact.
19:45<purrdeta>(my roommates birthday, not the cats >.>)
19:45<Gika>nice present :D
19:46<Gika> this is totally true though
19:46<purrdeta>haha yeah!
19:48<pharaun>thats accurate
19:49<Gika>with the cold lately he's been doing nothing but sleeping all day and he started waking me at 6 am, standing on my chest and staring at me
19:49<Gika>(and he runs away when i open my eyes)
19:50<@Perihelion>I want to get a kitty
19:51<pharaun>me too <3
19:51<pharaun>Still not sure if i'm going to settle down in a place long enough, want to settle down first before i get a kitty
19:52-!-Mumin [] has joined #linode
19:52<Gika>i moved six months ago, he got used to the new house in just a few days
19:53<pharaun>heh yeah, i still not sure where i want to *go* plus weeks long oversea trips
19:53<Boohemian>hi, someone told me last night i could build a multiple drive RAID array if i had a spare ATX case... i do (with a PSU)... what else do i need to do this?
19:53<robinetd>Boohemian: A motherboard, a processor, some memory..
19:54-!-Sios [] has joined #linode
19:54<Sios>I have a question regarding full refunds.
19:54<Sios>So I finally got my full refund after a few days later
19:54<Sios>But then it was taken from me again?
19:55<purrdeta>or billing I guess. Whatever
19:55<Boohemian>robinetd: oh, so you need to build an entire computer?
19:56-!-ASnyder [] has left #linode []
19:56<Boohemian>the person implied that you could just throw them in and it would work like an external HDD setup (i was asking because the multiple external drive arrays you can buy in the store seem very overpriced and this was his suggestion)
19:57<ejp>Boohemian: if you get something like a port multiplier board, and a bunch of cables, I suppose it would.
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19:58<bob2>you could be the 6th person in the world to use ESATA
19:58<ejp>I use esata. from my drive enclosure to my server.
19:58<ejp>via a PMP, so just one cable.
19:58<squircle>I use esata... didn't know I was part of such an exclusive club!
19:59<bob2>what badge number do you guys have
19:59-!-kenichi [] has quit [Quit: kenichi]
19:59<ejp>mine just says "666". does that mean something?
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21:11<amitz>quick question, how to dump the result of find to a file. To the spirit of: find /tobesearched > /tmp/dumpresult
21:11<nDuff>amitz, mean that specific example doesn't work for you?
21:11-!-jameswilson [~Adium@] has joined #linode
21:12<nDuff>(mind you, I'd use -print0 to make your output unambiguous, though that increases the work of reading it a little)
21:13<amitz>that doesn't work, bash: /tmp/dumpresult is a directory
21:13-!-v0lksman [] has joined #linode
21:13<sirpengi>amitz: you need to give it filename then
21:14<amitz>/tmp/dumpresult doesn't exist, I was hoping the file dumpresult will be created
21:14<sirpengi>are you sure it doesn't exist?
21:15<amitz>jsirpengi: just checked, yes doesn't exist. it seems I need to use the "|"
21:15<amitz>from other example. I just don't know how -_-
21:16-!-DephNet[Paul] [] has joined #linode
21:16<sirpengi>it totally works over here
21:16<sirpengi>what's the command in it's entirety?
21:16<sirpengi>the one you're actually trying to run
21:17<amitz>find manga/ -mtime -180 > /tmp/test
21:17<amitz>that doesn't work, bash: /tmp/test is a directory
21:18-!-squircle [~squircle@] has quit [Quit: this is not the default quit message]
21:18<sirpengi>that's weird, works over here (well, I've replaced 'manga' with something else)
21:18<amitz>dang... let me check and recheck everytghing
21:19<amitz>oh noes, I'm so sorry -_-
21:19<amitz>the folder dumpresult doesn't exist, the folder test does exist.
21:20*amitz returns to lurking with great embarassment -_-
21:20<sirpengi>do you actually need the result in a tile?
21:20<amitz>when you say it, I checked the file "dumpresult" -_-
21:20<amitz>actually no, it's an intermediate step. I'm going to copy all file of certain age.
21:21<amitz>modified from the last 6 months
21:21<amitz>planned to dump it to cp. Can rsync do that job? or a better tool?
21:22<sirpengi>depends, what's the overall goal?
21:22<amitz>to copy all files modified from the last nth months.
21:22-!-sm` [~s@] has quit []
21:23<amitz>while maintaining the directory structure, and create the parents directory structure if needed. Target has no directory structure. Not for backup.
21:24<sirpengi>I dunno. I'm sure someone could do a oneliner in bash to do that
21:24<sirpengi>I'm not one of those people
21:24<amitz>just want to give someone my newly modified files :-p
21:24<amitz>it's okay, thanks. I'm in a hurry too -_-
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22:01<linbot>New news from forums: nginx and cURL - Ubuntu 10.04 in Web Servers and Web App Development <>
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22:10<bob2>hoonteke: you can do it if you have linode setup to slave your domain
22:10<bob2>other than that, maybe a ticket to ask for SPF support
22:11<hoonteke>umm, heh. you must be in both rooms, bob2, because I haven't even asked the question!
22:11<hoonteke>No, I'm not worried about it. For the time being, TXT is the transitional (albeit deprecated) method.
22:12<Nivex>hoonteke: where you been hidin'?
22:12<hoonteke>Linode appears to be rather on top of their s***, so I figure when it becomes an issue, y'all will fix it
22:12-!-Hoggs [] has joined #linode
22:12<hoonteke>Nivex: heh, where you left with that rather uneventful message of "signal < noise"
22:12<bob2>hoonteke: :)
22:13<hoonteke>Nivex: but I did just get your FB invite to IPv6 day.
22:13<hoonteke>I'm proud of myself that I just successfully (I think) installed Postfix +Dovecot on my linode
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22:13<icepup>Is there anything special I have to do if I want to assign a domain name to my linode, if that domain name is currently configured to deliver its mail to Google Apps' mail system?
22:13<Nivex>hoonteke: sweet. You coming to the meeting tomorrow?
22:13<bob2>icepup: you mean "if I want to host a website on"?
22:14<hoonteke>Nivex: I have intentions too, and I may actually make it this time. I've been unable to make the last two for various last minute conflicts
22:14<bob2>icepup: that's fine, just make the A record point at your linode
22:14<bob2>icepup: assuming you have MX records pointing at google alread
22:14<hoonteke>Alan's a rather good speaker so I do want to be.
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22:14<hoonteke>good = engaging and smart
22:14<Hoggs>I'm tempted to migrate my server to Ubuntu, someone shoot me.
22:15<icepup>bob2, yes I already have the MX records working for google
22:15*hoonteke shoots Hoggs. (Why, I'm not sure, but I do what I'm told. "I just lurk here ...")
22:15<bob2>icepup: hot
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22:16<icepup>bob2, just changed my mind, i'm going to use another domain name that is not already pointing MX to google. so I guess I can now follow up with another question :)
22:16<icepup>does it make sense to host my own email? or is that asking for headaches? should I just spend the $50 annually and have google host it
22:17<bob2>goolge will do it for free if you don't mind ads
22:17<sirpengi>and if you don't mind the normal limits
22:18<d-b>hot hot hot
22:18<icepup>true, but question still stands. what do i gain by doing it myself? anything?
22:18<d-b>icepup: what's this $50 for google?
22:19<bob2>icepup: not having google sell your data to the NSA!
22:19<d-b>bob2: no that's a lot more
22:19<bob2>indepenence, more flexibility, some theoretical security advantage
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22:19<icepup>i forget what it's fore
22:20<d-b>icepup: enterprise googley?
22:20<icepup>ok, so i have a domain now parked at 1&1, i see basic and advanced dns settings. i'm thinking I need to change the Basic Dns from 1&1 name server to "my name server", and presumably enter the linode name servers?
22:20<icepup>the advanecd settings have A record and MX record. I can leave these for now?
22:21<d-b>icepup: follow what google says
22:21<d-b>erh well
22:21<icepup>d-b, i'm talking about setting it up for my linode, not google.
22:21<webroasters>hi guys. I just setup a mail server for someone. When I try to receive mail from the server, I get problems. It appears it has to do with the SSL that I set up. But I dont have the slightest idea how to fix it. i tried to redo the SSL cert, but still the same. When I view the cert it just says "localhost" and has generic inforamation in it.
22:21<d-b>icepup: yeah just the linode ns's to start with
22:21<icepup>webraosters just convinced me to forget about doing my own mail. lol
22:22<sirpengi>icepup: if you're going to use linode nameservers, you just set the nameservers at your registrar. all the other records you set at the linode manager
22:22<d-b>icepup: you can also get linode to import a domain via axfr
22:22<bob2>icepup: if you're going to have linode host your dns, ignore everything at 1&1 except for the nameservers (they should point at
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22:22<bob2>webroasters: depends which cert you mean
22:22<webroasters>icepup: the most priceless info you're going to get is "dont use 1&1". it sux :D
22:23<icepup>bob2, ok there's through, is that what you meant
22:23<icepup>webroasters, agreed, but too late.
22:23<icepup>should i at least keep 1&1 for my 2ndary name server, and use linode for 1, 3,4,5?
22:24<webroasters>@bob2: what do you mean?
22:24<bob2>webroasters: what ssl cert? you could be talking about the one your web, imap or smtp server uses
22:25<webroasters>im assuming its smtp. It appears to be the free one that is setup, using this tutorial:
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22:25<icepup>ok, 1&1 only allows you to set 3 2ndary nameservers, linode offers 4. oh well, so i'll set 1, and 2-4 for the 2ndary
22:25<bob2>perhaps just describe the thing you're seeing
22:25<bob2>icepup: 1,4,5
22:26<icepup>bob2, what? there's a primary, and a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd "secondary" field.
22:26<icepup>i put ns1 as primary, and 2,3,4 for the remaining, is that wrong?
22:26<bob2>icepup: ok, but do put in one of the boxes
22:27<bob2>since it is the only one not in the USA
22:27<icepup>bob2, oh i see. ok then i'll do 3,4, and 5 as the 3 secondaries, and skip the 2nd
22:27<d-b>bob2: that is a nice theory :P
22:28<icepup>once i hit ok, it takes about a day to propegate? then i would go back to my linode to further config it?
22:28<d-b>icepup: depends
22:28<d-b>but yeah go to your linode and configure it
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22:28<bob2>icepup: what tld is it
22:28<bob2>d-b: yeah yeah
22:28<bob2>it's worth a shot
22:28<icepup>bob2, .com
22:28<bob2>icepup: it'll be visible to the world within minutes
22:28<d-b>icepup: what's the domain?
22:28<bob2>icepup: so if you didn't configure it in the linode domain manager yet, downtime ahoy :)
22:29<d-b>k nevermind
22:29<icepup>it doesn't exist, i mean there's no site at 1&1 or anywhere, so not an issue
22:29<d-b>bob2: even if the ns ttl is huge?
22:30<bob2>d-b: hm, well, you can't control the GTLD NS TTL
22:30<bob2>so I dunno, good point
22:30<webroasters>hold on bob2, i'm re-checking everything
22:31<bob2>oh, cool, the linode nses are in each dc
22:31<bob2>i was mixing them up with theshore
22:32<icepup>what does CLIENT-TRANSFER PROHIBITED mean when I run whois on my domain?
22:32<icepup>still pointing to 1&1, but maybe i'm being impatient :)
22:33<bob2>I think that one means 1&1 are arseclowns and you registered it less than 90 days ago
22:33<icepup>bob2, hmm, ok, can't disagree with either of those assertions
22:33<icepup>but effectively that means what? that what I just did won't work?
22:33<bob2>ie they're not letting you transfer it
22:33<icepup>and if not, why does their stupid interface eve allow me to make the change
22:33<bob2>oh, that works fine, you just can't move to another registrar
22:34<bob2>CLIENT UPDATE PROHIBITED stops you making changes
22:34<bob2>until the 60/90 whatever days is up
22:34<icepup>oh, so just for a few months. not a big deal. why would i need to change registrars anyway (so soon)?
22:34<bob2>they might not offer some feature you want
22:34<bob2>someone else might have an awesome deal
22:35<bob2>it's possible they have a checkbox somewhere in their web thing that says "UNLOCK THIS DOMAIN" and that I'm being too harsh
22:35<icepup>could be. not important to me at the moment. i guess i'll have to wait for whois to say the ns has been updated and then proceed with adding a new domain zone through the linode config.
22:36<d-b>1&1 do something like that
22:36<icepup>you know this 1&1 stuff has me wondering, is putting a number in your domain a bad or good idea in today's world?
22:36<icepup>yeah, it's an OT question :)
22:36<d-b>icepup: not really a problem
22:37<bob2>as in
22:37<bob2>or phone number in whois
22:37<d-b>icepup: um try contacting 1&1 and see if they can wave the 90 day time period
22:37<d-b>they might
22:37<icepup>no in the domain name itself, as in
22:37<d-b>i don't see why you would have 53
22:37<icepup>will people think (fiftythreeapples?)
22:37<icepup>well it's an example, suppose the number had more meaning
22:38<d-b>why not
22:38<icepup>howdoyoulikethemapples is taken btw :)
22:38<icepup>42answers (guessing it's a hitchike ref)
22:39<icepup>37signals (no idea what that number represents, but hasn't seemed to hurt them)
22:39<d-b>icepup: it is avilable in .org :P
22:39<icepup>d-b, yeah saw that, but com/net is taken
22:39<dominikh>icepup: 37! I've been trying to remember the number for the past 5 minutes...
22:39<d-b>im tempted to get the .org
22:39<icepup>daminikh, oh, so that's a bad sign i take it?
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22:39<icepup>maybe because 37 has no meaning?
22:40<dominikh>yeah. I tried 13signals and then gave up
22:40<icepup>dominikh, is that a vote against number prefaced domains across the board, or just ones that use forgettable numbers?
22:41<dominikh>icepup: present me with a meaningful use of a number in a domain name and I shall make a decision
22:41<icepup>hmm, is actually free.. well that's surprising
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22:48<robinetd>friedwaffles sounds like a good domain name to me.
22:48<Solver>actually that is good
22:49<jtsage>waffles sound good. hmm.
22:49<Solver>dominikh: I have My contribution to the downfall of Pluto
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22:49<Solver>no, there is no website. I may use it for a bussiness one day
22:51<icepup>solver, nice one. dominikh, what do you say to that? :)
22:53<dominikh>icepup: I really don't have an opinion
22:53<icepup>dominikh, cool. it's not an important question, just trying to pass time until this dsn updates :)
22:54<dominikh>learn a new language
22:54<dominikh>e.g. Latin
22:55<icepup>dominikh, not a bad idea. i always wanted to learn a classical language
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22:58<tonyyarusso>My dad speaks Italian.
22:58<Solver>is he perchance Italian? :)
22:59<tonyyarusso>50% by ancestry; not by birth or residence.
23:00<dominikh>having learned Latin never helped me order a pizza :)
23:00<Solver>ah cool. I'd like to learn another language but it always seemed to be less important than something else
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23:30<d-b>Solver: inb4 we extend programming langauges into human dialogue
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23:43<icepup>well, this is taking a bit longer, whois still shows the 1&1 dns servers. guess it could be a full 24 hours, or i wonder if something is messed on 1&1's end
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23:48<SleePy>Your dns host just may be slow
23:50<icepup>could be, but i ran whois on my linode as well, same result. guess they could both be slow.
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23:51<jtsage>icepup- depending on how things are set up on their end, it could take the better part of 24hrs to show the changes. some registrars have fixed this, some have not. used to be pretty standard to have to wait a good day
23:52<SleePy>You could query their ns servers directly and see if they are updated.
23:52<icepup>their interface says the update is complete, not sure if that's reliable or not
23:53<SleePy>Whats your domain and the ns server for 1&1?
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23:57<SleePy>I wouldn't trust what their page says until you query the ns server directly to see if they where made
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23:59<linbot>SelfishMan: Point (0.28915288, 0.17922655) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 17577 of 22357 (π ≈ 3.144786867647717 - 0.003194214057924)
---Logclosed Thu Jan 13 00:00:09 2011