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#linode IRC Logs for 2011-10-10

---Logopened Mon Oct 10 00:00:10 2011
---Daychanged Mon Oct 10 2011
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00:01<kyhwana>!pi
00:01<linbot>kyhwana: Point (0.76874158, 0.24909890) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 108300 of 137492 (π ≈ 3.150728769673872 - 0.009136116084079). http://π.hoopycat.com/
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00:25<pjbrunet>!pi
00:25<linbot>pjbrunet: Point (0.61301563, 0.29841964) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 108301 of 137493 (π ≈ 3.150734946506367 - 0.009142292916574). http://π.hoopycat.com/
00:29<linbot>New news from forums: Send mail configuration problem with Postfix on Ubuntu 10.10 in Email/SMTP Related Forum <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7845>
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00:47<linbot>New news from forums: Exim sending only to non-local emails? in Email/SMTP Related Forum <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7875>
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00:52<the1>is this channel same as the channel in irc.freenode.net?
00:52<bob2>no
00:52<bob2>note the important /topic differences
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00:54<the1>oops, wrong channel. sorry.
00:54<dcraig>are there 400 people in the freenode channel?
00:54<kyhwana>?
00:55<the1>how long does it take for the password reset email to arrive?
00:55<bob2>minutes
00:56<dcraig>bob2 never gets any of my emails
00:56<kyhwana>check your spam folder, etc
00:56<bob2>-A INPUT -s dcraig -j DENY
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01:03<linbot>New news from forums: "bundle install" consistently killed - installing in Web Servers and Web App Development <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7897>
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01:12<the1>it has been half an hour since I tried password reset. now, how do I contact Linode to get help regarding this?
01:13<the1>thanks
01:13<bd_>are you sure you are checking the right email? :)
01:13<the1>bd_, yes and I checked spam folder too.
01:14<the1>also, I don't remember entering any password while signing up. I think it asked for the email ID and billing details only.
01:14<bob2>nah
01:14<bob2>it asked for passwords
01:15<amitz>maybe your password is your billing address ;-)
01:15<Fieldy>your SSN!
01:15<bd_>Fieldy: What, 1234?
01:16<the1>I logged in. :)
01:16<amitz>you're welcome ;-)
01:16<the1>I was entering the email address in the password field.
01:16<the1>oops
01:16<the1>sorry, email address in username field.
01:16*amitz attacks!
01:16<amitz>damn!
01:16<bob2>www.lastpass.com
01:16<bd_>the1: that might just explain why the reset email didn't go through :)
01:17<the1>yes
01:19<the1>does it matter where I place the new Linode?
01:19<the1>i have 6 datacenters as option
01:19<bob2>!speedtest
01:19<linbot>http://www.linode.com/speedtest
01:19<bob2>mtr thoue and see which is closest
01:19<Fieldy>if ipv6 is a need, look for those, otherwise, yeah mtr
01:19<bd_>the1: The atlanta DC is a bad choice if you intend to run an IRC server. If you want IPv6, look here first: http://www.linode.com/IPv6/
01:19<bd_>other than that pick whichever is network-closest to either you or your users
01:19<the1>okay.
01:20<bd_>you can change later, btw - although it takes some time to transfer your disk image
01:20<the1>most of my users are from India and US, two opposite parts of the world. So, European server would be a good idea?
01:20<the1>or Japan?
01:20<bd_>hmm, not sure which would be better in that case
01:20<the1>okay. thanks.
01:21<bd_>but yeah, one of those two
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01:21<bdube>linode lets you buy in BOTH or ALL
01:21<bob2>what
01:21<bd_>I shall purchase ALL THE LINODES
01:21<bdube>oh dang
01:21-!-pjbrunet [~pj@cpe-70-124-92-228.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
01:21<bd_>except not really because there's no way I can afford something like that :|
01:21<bd_>http://fushizen.net/munin/net/fushizen.net/index.html#linode
01:22<the1>bd_, why is atlanta DC a bad choice?
01:22<bdube>fort piltering
01:22<bd_>the1: atlanta dc filters some incoming ports. It's really only a problem if you're running an IRC server - 6667 is one of the blocked ports
01:22<the1>why do they do so?
01:22<bd_>http://www.linode.com/wiki/index.php/Atlanta_Port_Filtering
01:22<bd_>the1: it's some datacenter-level policy.
01:22<the1>okay
01:22<Fieldy>i've been at atlanta for about a year, it's never caused me problems
01:22<the1>Fieldy, do you run IRC server on it.
01:22-!-the1 is now known as spal
01:22<bd_>it was linode's second DC, they didn't think to ask if ports were filtered until it was too late
01:23<bd_>and now they're stuck with it
01:23<bob2>atlanta at least made the filters one way
01:23<bob2>iirc it was both originally
01:23<spal>so Linode outsources the datacenter work to other companies?
01:23<Fieldy>seems like a pretty reasonable list
01:23<bob2>yes linode owns no datacenters
01:23<Fieldy>spal: no but if I did, i'd just use a different port / SSL only
01:23<bd_>spal: linode's not big enough to build their own DCs from scratch. They just lease space, power, cooling, and network in existing DCs
01:23<spal>okay
01:24<bd_>Fieldy: atlanta doesn't do application protocol inspection, and there's no actual policy against running IRC in Atlanta. You just have to change the port, is all.
01:24<Fieldy>yeah
01:24<spal>what's an example of big enough VPS: slicehost, rackspace, etc.?
01:24<bob2>slicehost is not
01:24<Fieldy>i don't thinke ven rackspace is
01:24<spal>and I found Linode to be the cheapest. I wonder why it isn't big enough.
01:24<bd_>IIRC rackspace builds their own DCs. But they did that before they bought slicehost.
01:24<bd_>Amazon is certainly big enough...
01:25<bd_>spal: because if they spent all that money on the huge capital outlay needed to build a GINOURMOUS datacenter they wouldn't be the cheapest anymore?
01:25<bd_>also the DC would go mostly unused for at least a few years
01:25<spal>yes.
01:25<bd_>I suppose they could sublease space out to other providers though. But then it's not really Linode anymore, is it? :)
01:26<spal>is this a channel of linode users or are there linode staff also in this channel?
01:26<bd_>the ops are staff
01:26<bd_>!staff
01:26<Fieldy>staff too it's just late in the US
01:26<bd_>!ops
01:26<linbot>Users with ops are employees of Linode, and know what they're talking about. The rest of us are the ever-so-helpful(?) community. Official Linode contact information: http://www.linode.com/about/
01:26<Fieldy>heh (?)
01:26<bd_>it's 1:26 am where most of the staff are
01:26<bd_>the rest of the staff are probably paying more attention to the ticket queue than IRC
01:26<bd_>(hi, restelow!)
01:27<bd_>also tomorrow's a holiday in the US
01:27<bd_>or, well, today at this point
01:27<amitz>neat, lastpass.com
01:29<spal>if i a deploy a machine of 10 GB disk only (while I am allowed 20 GB), can I use the remaining 10 GB in my quota somehow?
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01:30<bd_>spal: you can resize later, or create a new image and attach it as well, or I guess use it for images that you don't have attached (some kind of homegrown backup system?)
01:30<bd_>you can't attach it directly to another linode, although you _can_ copy images back and forth between linodes
01:31<spal>so if I use two images, they'll appear as two disks in /dev right?
01:31<bd_>If you attach them both to your config profile, yes
01:32<spal>okay
01:32<bd_>you'll need to mount them of course
01:32<bd_>fstab etc etc
01:32<spal>I'll just go for a full 20 GB disk. I don't think I need backup images.
01:33<bd_>backup images aren't really a practical way to do things anyway, since linode (still!) doesn't do snapshots for image clones, so you need to umount before cloning, and stay umounted (or read-only) until the clone finishes :/
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01:39<spal>so if I mess something up, I can't revert to an earlier snapshot?
01:39<bd_>you can either use linode's backup service (for an extra fee) or hack something together on your own :)
01:40<spal>the getting started guide says, "We strongly recommend sticking with the default swap image size, as allowing your Linode to go heavily into swap can seriously degrade performance in an environment where disk IO is shared among virtual machines."
01:40<spal>the default swap is 256 MB. However, I was about to set it to 512 MB.
01:41<spal>is my intention contradicting the guide? I couldn't correctly interpret what they mean by "heavily into swap"?
01:41<spal>Does it mean, less swap implies heavy swap usage or more swap?
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01:45<bdube>it means, roughly, that more swap makes the kernel worse at managing its business. the default works well on linodes.
01:45<bdube>what do you plan to do with it?
01:45<bd_>spal: basically, if you have 256mb of stuff swapped out
01:46<bdube>and what distro?
01:46<bd_>chances are you're spending all of your time swapping stuff in and out and not getting anything done
01:46<spal>Debian, I'll run about 5 websites.
01:46<bd_>so better to keep your swapfile small, so, if you _do_ end up in this situation, the system runs out of memory, crashes the offending program, and recovers faster
01:47<spal>so you are saying that I should stick to 256 MB swap. If I use 512 MB swap, it can degrade performance?
01:47<spal>bdube, I am using Debian and I'll run blogs and websites on it.
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01:48<bd_>I'm saying if you set it to 512, you'll never actually use that much, and if you _do_ use that much your system's already basically dead in the water and you're just delaying its recovery.
01:48<@psandin>Any swap can degrade performance, the more swap you have the longer and worse it can be
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01:52<spal>is it true even for a personal laptop? I've always given 512 MB swap on my personal laptop.
01:52<bd_>laptops are a bit different - you want around the same amount of swap as physical RAM so you can do suspend-to-disk (aka hibernation)
01:52<bdube>different use case
01:53<bd_>and with a personal computer it's less of a problem having to reboot it when it starts swapping heavily
01:53<bd_>after all either you're right there to reboot it (in which case the outage is short) or you're not (in which case nobody notices the outage)
01:53<Solver>swap can be useful to avoid an OOM. the useful ration of memory:swap is much lower than it once was
01:53<bd_>Solver: OTOH an OOM is often exactly what you want - it's arguably better than the whole system grinding to a halt
01:54<Solver>bd_: depends on the situation imho.
01:54<bd_>yes, there are exceptions
01:54<@psandin>Call me odd if you must, I'd rather OOM and be done with it than have a slow death by thrashing
01:54<Solver>bd_: an OOM effectively leaves the system is an unstable state so a reboot is probabhly required
01:54<bd_>Solver: no, an OOM sends a SIGKILL to some group of processes that were using a lot of memory.
01:54<bd_>the kernel's just fine
01:54<Solver>bd_: exactly - so you don't immediately know what was killed
01:54<@psandin>unrelated services might recover, which is better than everything being hosed due to thrashing
01:54<Solver>it is rarely worth bothing to find out
01:54<Solver>rebooting is a better option
01:55<Solver>egro - it leaves the system in an unstable state
01:55<bd_>Solver: I suppose. But if you're not there to reboot it, it might be able to keep running for a while.
01:55<bd_>actually it's pretty likely to be able to keep running
01:55<Solver>runing after an OOM can be very bad in some situations
01:55<bd_>on a LAMP sort of setup, mysql's memory usage is more or less constant, the apache master server's process memory usage is constant, so you'll have some child process being SIGKILLed
01:55<Solver>if you have a complex app and part of it has fallen over the behaviour could be inpleasant
01:55<spal>any such issues between choosing Debian 32-bit or Debian 64-bit?
01:56<bd_>!64bit
01:56<linbot>http://journal.dedasys.com/2008/11/24/slicehost-vs-linode
01:56<Solver>fallen over because it was killed by the OOM killer, I mean
01:56<bd_>spal: if you don't know, pick 32-bit
01:56<bd_>Solver: Sure. But for 99% of people you'll either find out right away or it'll keep running just fine.
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01:56<spal>bd_, I don't know if there is any difference or not. I use 64-bit at home because I've got a 64-bit processor.
01:56<bd_>and at the very least you get a nice log entry
01:56<spal>bd_, why do you recommend 32-bit? what's the advantage?
01:56<bd_>spal: 64-bit uses more RAM for relatively little benefit, unless you have more than 4G of total RAM
01:56<Solver>I recommend retaining a small amount of swap to avoid most OM conditions
01:57<spal>bd_, okay. makes sense.
01:57<bd_>Solver: Sure, a small amount is good, to let you swap out truly cold data. Things like init's working set.
01:57<Solver>with a samll amounto f sawp you'll avoid most OOMs and still not thrash badly
01:57<bd_>Just, not an excessive amount. The point of swap is _not_ to avoid OOMs, because if you actually use it to avoid OOMs, you _will_ be thrashing.
01:57<bd_>The point is to let you free up valuable physical RAM for something more useful than holding the list of getty processes :)
01:58<Solver>bd_: I don't recommend having so much swap you;ll be in swap hell
01:58<Solver>maybe 2GB is reasonable for a 4-8GB system, excluding laptops as others have noted
01:59<Solver>bd_: yes it is valuable to 'swap commonly used memory for rarely used memory'
02:00<Solver>of course you can use swappiness to good effect too
02:01<bdube>I dropped swappiness to 5 on linode 512
02:01<Solver>the % of ram that needs to be swapped out before you thrash is lower than it used to be for disk since the data transfer rates have not grown as fast as memory or disk storage capacity
02:01<Solver>ssd may change that equation - I can't tried swapping to ssd to see how it performs
02:02<Solver>s/can't/haven't/
02:03<spal>I installed Debian 6 and it uses the 3.0 kernel already. :) I don't think Debian 6 distribution provides the 3.0 kernel. Has linode customized the distro?
02:04<bdube>you can choose the kernel in your profile
02:04<bdube>s/can//
02:04<bd_>spal: linode provides the kernel, the rest is vanilla. It's possible to provide your own kernel (including the distribution kernel), but not recommended.
02:05<spal>okay
02:07<spal>I've got an IP address for my linode instance. Will this IP address remain same between reboots? I need to make DNS entries. Hence, the question.
02:08<bd_>Yes, it'll remain the same unless you choose to move to a different DC at some point in the future (this won't happen unless you specifically ask for it in a ticket)
02:09<bd_>The default images use DHCP to configure things, but this is just to make deployment easier, you can go and change that to a static config if you want
02:09<spal>okay
02:11<spal>If I enable backups, would it cost me? If not, why isn't backup enabled by default?
02:11<bd_>it does cost you
02:11<bd_>http://www.linode.com/backups/
02:11<spal>okay. what's the link to see the available DCs?
02:13<bd_>!download
02:13<linbot>http://www.linode.com/speedtest
02:21<dcraig>don't pick the slow one
02:21-!-jasuess [~James@c-98-240-149-184.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
02:23<dr_jkl>kyhwana: yeah
02:24<spal>Japan works well for me.
02:24<kyhwana>DrJ: mrp?
02:25<kyhwana>fail
02:25<kyhwana>dr_jkl: mrp?
02:31<dr_jkl>i made it to work
02:31<dr_jkl>two hours late.
02:31<dr_jkl>on a fucki01:54 <@dr_jkl> oh
02:31<kyhwana>ouch
02:31<dr_jkl>on a fucking doughnut
02:31<dr_jkl>i hate doughnuts
02:31-!-seanh-ansca [~Adium@c-98-210-113-183.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
02:31<dr_jkl>80kph max
02:31<dr_jkl>faiiil
02:33<kyhwana>aww
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02:34<spal>I don't see /etc/hostname file on my Debian instance. I wanted to change the hostname to something meaningful.
02:36<Solver>add one in - and /etc/mailname if you want
02:36<Solver>also remember to look in /etc/default/dhcpcd - and tell it to not set the hostname from dhcp
02:36*Solver built a new linode from deb 6 on the weekend :)
02:39<onats>hi guys, just a question, is it possible to share a linode management to another user that signed up independently?
02:40<kyhwana>onats: I assume you mean with their own login and you have a different one, both managing the same linode?
02:40<onats>kyhwana, yes
02:41<kyhwana>AFAIK that's not possible. You can add a different user account to your manage tho
02:42<dcraig>it'd be neat if you could grant access to someone else's existing user name
02:42<kyhwana>(manager/account/user and permissions)
02:42<dcraig>then I wouldn't have to log out and log back in as someone else
02:43<onats>just thinking if its possible. coz i might be booting another 512 but for a different customer
02:45-!-crazedfred [~Pragmatic@c-76-17-207-164.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #linode
02:45<crazedfred>Hello. I'm having a problem getting postfix to talk to SASL. I've been told to turn off chroot, but I have done so and the problem persists. Relevant logs/postconf is here: http://pastebin.com/F2Dz5HBE
02:49-!-ktabic [~ktabic@host81-148-95-183.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #linode
02:54<bdube>crazedfred: did you restart saslauthd when you restarted postfix? and is saslauthd configured to listen on a socket?
02:55<crazedfred>bdube: yes, and not sure (how can I find out?)
02:55<crazedfred>I tested saslauthd and confirmed it is working, let me check my notes
02:55-!-tyler [~4b852465@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC]
02:56<bdube>crazedfred: I ask because of the no such file or directory error, but perhaps postfix can't find your sasl conf
02:59<crazedfred>saslauthd[12246]: ipc_init : listening on socket: /var/spool/postfix/var/run/saslauthd/mux
02:59<linbot>New news from forums: Why not to have Premium Linode Accounts? in Feature Request/Bug Report <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7695>
02:59<crazedfred>looks like it is :)
03:00<bdube>hmm
03:01<marius>aawww
03:01<marius>but I like my premium account!
03:02<marius>It sounds like facebook gold xD
03:02<@psandin>don't worry marius we know you're "special"
03:02<marius>I know you know
03:02<marius>Now give daddy some sugar!
03:03*psandin paging Perihelion to #linode
03:03*psandin slips away
03:03<crazedfred>bdube: hang on, after a reboot my testsaslauthd command is now returning "connect() : No such file or directory"
03:04<crazedfred>bdube: I'm guessing I have to fix that first, but s/etc/saslauthd.conf still looks fine...
03:04<linbot>New news from forums: Geological Load Balancing in Sales Questions and Answers <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7895>
03:07<crazedfred>bdube: Ah, I tried "sudo testsaslauthd -f /var/spool/postfix/var/run/saslauthd/mux" and that worked.
03:07<crazedfred>But obviously postfix still doesn't work
03:09<bdube>crazedfred: looking at my own sasl config isn't helping much
03:11<crazedfred>Yea, this is just super frustrating because I've been working on it for some time, and "No such file or directory" is rather useless
03:12<crazedfred>I've disabled the chroot, but maybe the fact that I had to use "sudo testsaslauthd -f /var/spool/postfix/var/run/saslauthd/mux" is a clue?
03:12<crazedfred>aka, postfix is trying the wrong socket?
03:13<bdube>the wrong socket or has the wrong permissions for the correct socket
03:14<crazedfred>I'm afraid I wouldn't know how to find out either, however.
03:14<G>wow nice, hit 37Mb/s on Dallas' IPv6 network :P
03:15-!-Boohemian [~Boohemian@209-6-67-222.c3-0.abr-ubr1.sbo-abr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Going to eat and then (hopefully) have sex. g'nite!]
03:15<Peng>bits or bytes?
03:15<G>pretty sure that's bits, unless Linode doesn't know the difference
03:16<Peng>Not very much, then.
03:16-!-kraz_ [~k@124-198-141-47.static.ubs.maxnet.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
03:16<Peng>Though finding even 37 Mbps of IPv6 traffic is impressive, I suppose.
03:16<Fieldy>agree that's quite a bit
03:16<G>(rsync between LA & Dallas)
03:17<Peng>I got 10 times that between LA and Dallas once.
03:17<Peng>(wget -O /dev/null to test it)
03:18<bdube>crazedfred: I'd check the effective permissions that are in play
03:18<crazedfred>bdube: how?
03:21<bdube>crazedfred: something like 'ps aux | egrep "post|sasl"' to see who is running what, and 'ls -l /path/to/socket'
03:21-!-kraz [~k@124-198-141-47.static.ubs.maxnet.co.nz] has joined #linode
03:21<bdube>might need root on that last 'ls'
03:23<crazedfred>bdube: http://pastebin.com/VtDf9XD3
03:23<crazedfred>bdube: raw version easier to read http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=VtDf9XD3
03:23<@mikegrb>lulz
03:23<crazedfred>dunno why a pastebin site enforces claustrophobic text wrapping >< lol
03:24<bdube>crazedfred: that looks fine to me, but I'm asleep
03:24<crazedfred>I hear ya :/
03:24<crazedfred>I've been stuck on this for weeks, figured I'd ask Linode folks as well
03:24<crazedfred>It's supoosed to be dead-simple
03:24<crazedfred>If I don't get it soon I will probably reformat and start over, the nuke-it-from-orbit strategy
03:26<bdube>crazedfred: maybe it's sasl complaining about not being able to talk to ldap
03:26<crazedfred>well, if I can make saslauthd work, but need to add that socket option, where do I go from there?
03:27<bdube>the option you added to testsaslauthd? I don't think you need to tell postfix about that
03:28<bdube>can you verify ldap? it could be sasl<-->ldap borking
03:28<crazedfred>but if saslauthdtest is working (it returns success), then I'd assume something with the postfix config is wrong
03:29<crazedfred>$ sudo testsaslauthd -f /var/spool/postfix/var/run/saslauthd/mux -u "test@example.com" -p "examplePassword"
03:29<crazedfred>0: OK "Success."
03:29<bdube>good point
03:29-!-sludge321 [~matt@203-59-221-7.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #linode
03:30<crazedfred>said example account/password is in LDAP, and sasl is returning success on right password (and incorrect on wrong password)
03:30<crazedfred>which means it has to be correctly hitting ldap
03:30<bdube>then I think you're on to something. I don't know where you'd tell postfix about that
03:32<crazedfred>hmmm
03:32<bdube>I have a very similar set up and I don't specify a path to the socket
03:32<crazedfred>right
03:33<crazedfred>I'm trying to find where one would be listed
03:33<crazedfred>of course this all begs the question, why would mine be different from anyone's -.-
03:33<crazedfred>HMMM: "Some distributions require the user postfix to be member of a special group e.g. sasl, otherwise it will not be able to access the saslauthd socket directory."
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03:35<crazedfred>awww
03:35<crazedfred>$ groups postfix
03:35<crazedfred>postfix : postfix sasl
03:35<@mikegrb>lulz
03:35<crazedfred>lol
03:36<crazedfred>mikegrb: !about
03:36<crazedfred>heh
03:37<bdube>I have 710 root:sasl on the socket directory
03:38<bdube>crazedfred: what distro?
03:38<crazedfred>bdube: debian 6
03:38<Sophira> /fm
03:38<Sophira>Oops, ignore that.
03:39<Sophira>(Custom IRC command)
03:40<@mikegrb>mmm bacon
03:40<bdube> /fm == feed mike bacon?
03:41<onats>hey guys, can anyone give me a sample of a popular app that's hosted on linode?
03:41<crazedfred>onats: actually the internet runs on linodes, don't tell anyone
03:42<onats>haha cmon. I'm trying to convince a customer to move from own server to this
03:42<kyhwana>onats: Amazon's cloud stuff!
03:42<bdube>yay, cloud
03:44<crazedfred>onats: sorry I'd be helpful if I could. generally I've seen linode offered as a much more cost-effective option than other VPS solutions
03:44<onats>crazedfred, sure. i know it is. but you know some people have the old school mindset that its 'safer' and more 'reliable' to have their own server
03:45-!-petedunham [~mehmet@78.191.125.242] has joined #linode
03:45<petedunham>Hello.
03:45<petedunham>Anybody using Linode for OpenCart hosting? Sure of that there are a lot of people.. I would like to hear your experiences..
03:45<bdube>crazedfred: in your second paste, the socket path is right there as an option to saslauthd. I don't think postfix needs to know separately.
03:46<petedunham>Stack is going to be PHP+MySQL+Nginx.
03:46<crazedfred>bdube: oh :(
03:47<crazedfred>bdube: the theory being since saslauthd is running with that socket, we have to assume postfix can talk to it?
03:47<crazedfred>in which case, wtf is postfix doing -.-
03:48<spal>Just like Apache is very popular as a web server, what's commonly used for setting up email?
03:48<bdube>crazedfred: well, postfix would talk to saslauthd and saslauthd knows about its own socket
03:48<kyhwana>spal: dovecot/postfix?
03:48<crazedfred>bdube: makes sense, but then why is postfix returning a sasl error is my question
03:48-!-Cypher100 [~Cypher@108-82-117-77.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has quit []
03:49<spal>kyhwana, dovecot and postfix are two different servers, right?
03:49<spal>services*
03:49<kyhwana>spal: er yes, you need one to receive mail and one to send
03:49<crazedfred>^
03:50<bdube>mail transfer and mail delivery
03:50<crazedfred>I'm trying to get them to play nice as we speak :)
03:51<bdube>crazedfred: I don't know :/
03:51<crazedfred>bdube: haha yeah, me neither :(
03:52<petedunham>Nobody...
03:53<crazedfred>petedunham: never heard of opencart, but everyone uses some variant of the LAMP stack....
03:53<bdube>crazedfred: but it *seems* to be a permissions issue
03:53<bob2>or it doesn't matter, since any crappy php app will run equally well
03:53<crazedfred>bdube: agreed.
03:53<@mikegrb>lulz
03:53<crazedfred>bdube: you see why I'm so stuck?! lol :(
03:54<bdube>crazedfred: nuking might just land you back here at the same issue
03:54<crazedfred>indeed :(
03:54<crazedfred>the config guides for postfix/sasl are like 12 lines that say "do what I just did"
03:54<crazedfred>and the email discussion lists were unhelpful/snarky
03:54<petedunham>crazedfred: Yes. So, there is no much difference actually, it is one of most popular ecommerce package like Magento, osCommerce, etc.
03:55<petedunham>I mean, it is LAMP stack also.
03:55<bob2>crazedfred, almost certainly you missed a step or copypasted wrongly - start from the start and check each step
03:56<crazedfred>bob2: I went back through 2 guides looking at each config file, it seems elementary and as far as I can tell all config files match
03:56<crazedfred>also restarted all 3 services, and later the linode
03:56<bob2>no
03:56<bob2>I didn't say that
03:56<crazedfred>ic
03:56<bob2>re-read the ONE guide that you were actually following
03:56<bob2>if you were trying to mix up two, you're probably boned anyway
03:56<crazedfred>petedunham: yea, looks like a standard CMS on PHP, you should have no problem running that basically anywhere
03:57<crazedfred>bob2: yeah I am following http://www.postfix.org/SASL_README.html
03:57<bob2>don't do that
03:57<bob2>follow workaround.org or one from the linode library
03:57<crazedfred>oh?
03:57<crazedfred>k
03:57<crazedfred>can you elaborate on why?
03:57<petedunham>crazedfred: Agree.
03:57<bob2>because they are complete and OS-specific
03:58<crazedfred>gotcha
03:58<petedunham>I am in between to choose a VPS provider at the moment. I may be using Linude..
03:58<bob2>whereas the postfix SASL README is not complete or os-specific
03:58<kyhwana>petedunham: hmm.. whats the other VPS?
03:59<crazedfred>bob2: can you help me find one that uses specifically postfix/sasl? A lot seem to configure postfix to talk to mysql...
03:59<kyhwana>Does it have the same features as linode?
03:59<petedunham>kyhwana: Some friends recommend some others like Hetzner, Proplay, Slicehost, etc.etc.
04:00<kyhwana>hmm, lots of people leaving slicehost fsr..
04:00<bob2>crazedfred, meh
04:00<bob2>slicehost is being wound up
04:00<bob2>so that's not a useful option
04:00<petedunham>kyhwana: Some similar services and I am not a edge user actually. I need only LAMP stack, and it is not hig volume business at the moment. So, easy to choose.
04:00<bob2>the other two sound made up
04:00<kyhwana>well, there are stackscripts for LAMP, etc
04:01<bob2>crazedfred, what backend are you hoping to use then
04:01<crazedfred>bob2: ldap. sasl can already correctly auth against ldap, postfix is evidently not talking to sasl correctly
04:01<petedunham>kyhwana: Why do they leave? Acutally I didn't like when Rackspace bought out them.. Their web site is something like fancy.. I like simple things. So, linode takes my attraction.
04:01<kyhwana>petedunham: I guess because of what changed when rackspace bought them
04:02<petedunham>kyhwana: I think so. It was friendly before I think. I have no idea at the moment. Anyway
04:02<petedunham>kyhwana: Stackscripts.
04:02<petedunham>?
04:02<kyhwana>!stackscripts
04:03<bdube>what, no trigger for that?
04:03<kyhwana>https://www.linode.com/stackscripts/
04:04<petedunham>Any PHP+MySQL+Nginx.. But not big deal if there is no..
04:05-!-Fieldy [tDkXy11LJi@li77-30.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:05<kyhwana>petedunham: LEMP
04:05<bob2>yes lot of people do that
04:05<AlexC_>g'morning all
04:05<bob2>did you have a question or are you doing a survey?
04:07<petedunham>bob2: Not survey at all..
04:07<amitz>rise and shine people!
04:07<amitz>!ask petedunham
04:07<linbot>If you have a question, feel free to just ask it -- someone's always willing to help. If you don't get a response right away, be patient!
04:07<bob2>petedunham, then what did you want to know?
04:08<petedunham>I got my answer actually, just wanted to hear from somebody who using opencart..
04:08<petedunham>There are some companies like Linode, they are opencart friendly and/or support open cart etc..
04:08<petedunham>So anyway..
04:08<kyhwana>Hmm, I don't think so
04:09<kyhwana>Linode's are unmanaged.. stackscripts are about as close as you're going to get ;)
04:09<petedunham>kyhwana: Alright.
04:09<kyhwana>linode is opencart friendly in that you can install it and do whatever you want
04:09<petedunham>kyhwana: :)
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05:07<herrherr>Hello everyone
05:08<amitz>herrherr hello
05:10<herrherr>in Germany §11 BDSG)
05:10<kyhwana>?
05:10<herrherr>meh, the client deleted the rest of my sentence
05:10<herrherr>let me give it another try :)
05:11<herrherr>we are operating a bunch of Linodes in London and are offering a service in Germany. Are you familiar with signing a contract regarding privacy protection?
05:11<herrherr>in Germany this is referred to as §11 BDSG
05:12<kyhwana>Er, tricky. The data's stored in England, so they are stuck with what england privacy laws are, sort of
05:12<kyhwana>there might be some european union thing
05:12<herrherr>and they are an american LLC, so this is a bit tricky ;)
05:12<AlexC_>herrherr: you're best off submitting a support ticket
05:12<kyhwana>linode is, yeah
05:13<herrherr>thought I'd ask here first, but I'll open a support ticket. Probably the easier way ....
05:13<kyhwana>You'll probably need to talk to a lawyer ;)
05:13<herrherr>I did of course :)
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05:17-!-pygi [~pygi@metronet470.metro.carnet.hr] has quit [Quit: Bye!]
05:18<herrherr>thanks anyway guys :)
05:18-!-herrherr [~d956cd61@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC]
05:18-!-Deegie [~Deegie@196-215-40-22.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com]
05:18<Peng>Sound like herrherr will be having fun.
05:21-!-mstum [~michael@dslb-092-072-044-252.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #linode
05:22<mstum>Hi! Wondering: Can I limit the users that can ssh into a Ubuntu 10.04 node? Looking at the sshd_config I don't see AllowUsers and wonder if it's just not there or if it's somewhere else
05:23<AlexC_>mstum: `man sshd_config`
05:23<AlexC_>if a directive doesn't exist in the config, the default shall be used. So you're free to add it in and configure your own value
05:24<mstum>Thanks, that manpage looks good.
05:24<AlexC_>one of the finest
05:27*rnowak giggity
05:28*AlexC_ hands rnowak a squirrel
05:33-!-gerryvdm [~5152d00e@chat.linode.com] has joined #linode
05:34<gerryvdm>is there anyone from Linode available to answer an administrative question?
05:35<rnowak>!ops
05:35<linbot>Users with ops are employees of Linode, and know what they're talking about. The rest of us are the ever-so-helpful(?) community. Official Linode contact information: http://www.linode.com/about/
05:35<rnowak>!ask
05:35<linbot>If you have a question, feel free to just ask it -- someone's always willing to help. If you don't get a response right away, be patient!
05:36<gerryvdm>i was wondering how i can receive an invoice for my account?
05:36<kyhwana>You get emailed one at the start of every month?
05:36<Peng>And they're listed in the manager?
05:36<gerryvdm>well i ordered for a year
05:36<gerryvdm>oh just found the right place
05:38<gerryvdm>but i only got emailed a payment receipt :) anyway they can indeed be downloaded in the manager, thx
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05:41<Peng>gerryvdm: You should've gotten both... Maybe your spam software ate the invoice?
05:41-!-wfwef [~5bbd7007@chat.linode.com] has quit []
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05:43<gerryvdm>Peng: ah found a plain-text version indeed, but it didnt include the pdf version, would be nice to send it attached
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05:45<Peng>PDF :X Still, makes sense to me (not that my opinion matters). Ask for it on the feature request forum. :)
05:46-!-wfwef [~5bbd7007@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)]
05:46<gerryvdm>Peng: it sure wouldnt be as easy to overlook, the plain-text version is laid out really bad :)
05:47<Peng>Oh? It's never bothered me.
05:48<gerryvdm>im sympathetic with my accountant who has to go through all the invoices for me :_
05:49<gerryvdm>:)
05:49<gerryvdm>mm, how do i login to the forum
05:49<gerryvdm>the register link prompts me a http authentication, and my linode username doesnt work
05:49<Typo>read what the auth screen says
05:50<Typo>the popup i mean
05:50<gerryvdm>right!
05:50<Typo>i did the same thing, i saw the auth box and assumed i was at a dead end
05:50<Typo>had to come here and ask too
05:50<Typo>;p
05:50<AlexC_>the most effective captcha
05:51<gerryvdm>blocks everything
05:51<Typo>indeed, just not used to seeing the login info in the request box
05:51<gerryvdm>i'll create two feature requests then :) one for a pdf invoice, one for a user friendly forum solution :)
05:52<AlexC_>gerryvdm: why can't you just print to PDF like normal folk?
05:53<gerryvdm>AlexC_ I can but my trouble was finding the PDF
05:53<AlexC_>gerryvdm: there is no PDF
05:53<gerryvdm>i'd prefer it to be attached to the invoice email
05:53<gerryvdm>there is
05:53<AlexC_>ah, yes I recall. Ignore me
05:55<rnowak>"one for a user friendly forum solution :)"
05:55<Peng>gerryvdm: What would you think if the emails just had a link to the PDF version at the bottom?
05:55<rnowak>reading is hard
05:56<gerryvdm>Peng, already an improvement
05:56<gerryvdm>or make a html version of the invoice mail
05:56<bob2>hey can I have a pony
05:57<rnowak>we're all out of ponies right now
05:57<AlexC_>you can have all the ponies, bob2
05:57<gerryvdm>on your 16th bday
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05:58<Peng>gerryvdm: I'm just thinking...Unconditionally adding a PDF to all invoice emails seems unlikely. Putting a checkbox in the manager to attach PDFs -- or HTML -- would be an option, of course, and HTML checkboxes are common, but adding options always sucks. A link seems like a good compromise to me.
05:59<Peng>Actually, now that I think about it, a PDF for a one-page invoice would hardly be a huge file, so unconditionally attaching it wouldn't be *that* bad.
06:00<bob2>tl;dr ask in a ticket
06:00<gerryvdm>yeah it weights 24kb now
06:00<gerryvdm>-t
06:01<zibri>it's bad practice. if people want pdf versions of the invoices (ugh), a url would be the best solution.
06:01<Peng>bob2: I suggested the forum.
06:02<rnowak>"bad practice"? According to?
06:02<gerryvdm>anyway the problem with the plain-text version probably is that many mail clients dont use a proportional font
06:02<zibri>the internet community
06:02<rnowak>oh, well of course!
06:02<zibri>:)
06:02<bob2>by problem you mean awesomeness right
06:02*rainman is happy with the current invoice emails
06:03<zibri>rainman: +1
06:03<rainman>when the time comes for tax work, i just go to the manager and get the pdf of all needed invoices, much faster than going through my inbox
06:03<rainman>the mail is for me just to skim whether linode did something outragious
06:03<gerryvdm>too many places to go check for invoices then
06:03<gerryvdm>i just move all internet invoices to an imap folder :)
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06:04<rnowak>Hello, I'm from the internet. I am here to invoice you.
06:04<rainman>rnowak, xkcd++
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06:06<Peng>rainman: Outrageous? Unless you click the below link within the next 5 minutes, all of your nodes will be upgraded to 20 GBs. And they'll be moved to Fremont.
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06:35<JediMaster>I've got an openvpn connection setup on one of our 30 linodes and it works just fine, but we've got an office network on a private subnet (10.0.0.0/24) that I would like to NAT through the vpn so they can access the server via 10.42.1.1 (the linode server's openvpn ip). I can ping 10.42.1.1 from the office ubuntu router fine, but I can't seem to figure out how to NAT the network through it
06:37<bob2>renumber the vpn
06:37<JediMaster>to what?
06:37<chesty>is the router the default gateway for workstations?
06:38<JediMaster>yes
06:38<chesty>what's ip ro look like on the router?
06:38<JediMaster>want me to paste route -n?
06:38<chesty>sure
06:38<chesty>!pb of course
06:38<linbot>http://p.linode.com <-- paste here, not in the channel
06:38<spal>what's the difference between "rebuild" and "deploy"?
06:39-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@w-221.cust-5547.ip.static.uno.uk.net] has joined #linode
06:39<JediMaster>chesty: http://p.linode.com/5877
06:39<JediMaster>I know that =P
06:40<JediMaster>192.168.1.0 eth0 network is the adsl router, eth1 is the internal network, tun0 is the vpn
06:40<@akerl>spal: deploy is buying a new car, and rebuild is replacing all your cars with a new car.
06:40<chesty>you can probably push a route from the openvpn server config
06:40<spal>okay
06:40<bob2>JediMaster, to another rfc1918 network you aren't using
06:40<JediMaster>chesty: I can already ping it from that router
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06:41<spal>so since I have paid for only Linode 512, if I "deploy", I'll have to pay for one more Linode 512?
06:41-!-Lynx [~Lynx@host86-173-220-79.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has joined #linode
06:41<JediMaster>spal: no
06:41<spal>JediMaster, then what's the difference between deploy and rebuild?
06:41<JediMaster>it's more like a credit
06:41<JediMaster>deploy will set it up
06:41<JediMaster>rebuild will wipe it all and rebuild
06:42<@akerl>?
06:42<chesty>JediMaster: ah, the server doesn't know how to get to 10.0.x.0/24 ask bob2
06:42-!-vai [542d3ef0@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #linode
06:42<spal>JediMaster, but to deploy, it has to wipe the current Linode 512 instance I am running.
06:42<spal>or where else would it deploy.
06:42<vai>Is london174 down?
06:42<@akerl>spal: You have 1 Linode with X resources. Deploy uses a specified amount of disk (you choose), and adds a Linux distro disk image. If you have available disk, you can do this more than once on the same Linode.
06:42<JediMaster>spal: you already have a 512 linode up and running?
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06:43<spal>JediMaster, yes.
06:43<@akerl>Only one profile can be booted at a time on each Linode, but you can have multiple disk images.
06:43<spal>okay.
06:43<JediMaster>chesty the problem is that 10.0.x.0 needs to nat through to tun0 to get to 10.42.1.1 (only)
06:44<@akerl>The difference between deploy and rebuild is that deploy will use free space on your node to add a new distro image, where rebuild will delete all existing images on that node and replace them with the new one
06:44<vai>aww looks like london174 did go down :(
06:44<chesty>iptables -t nat -I POSTROUTING -o tun0 -j MASQUERADE
06:45<JediMaster>surely that will route everything through it?
06:45<JediMaster>Just want it when the destination is 10.42.1.1
06:46<chesty>iptables -t nat -I POSTROUTING -o tun0 -d 10.42.1.1 -j MASQUERADE (but the -d isn't necessary)
06:46<JediMaster>ok, that looks better =)
06:46<JediMaster>let me try that
06:46<chesty>JediMaster: wait
06:46<JediMaster>kk
06:47-!-aziwoqpd [~jperry@ip70-187-182-99.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #linode
06:47<chesty>JediMaster: have a cronjob to run in 2 minutes to reset the rules
06:47<JediMaster>yeah
06:47<JediMaster>I do work remotely from the office, to make this all the more complicated ;-)
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06:50<chesty>suddenly 21:50 -!- JediMaster [~JediMaster@office.com] has quit [Ping Timeout: 480 seconds]
06:50<JediMaster>chesty, that worked
06:50<JediMaster>=P
06:50<chesty>nice
06:50<JediMaster>thanks mate
06:50<chesty>now remove the cronjob :P
06:51<Bret>Hey guys, about to order a Linode 512, I was wondering if anyone here has any discount / coupon codes for the first month to make it that bit sweeter? :-P
06:51<internat>ooh i see akerl is showing off his shiny new @ :)
06:51<JediMaster>chesty: I just did a iptables .....; sleep 120; script-to-reset-stuff
06:51<chesty>very clever
06:51-!-vai [542d3ef0@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]
06:51<JediMaster>and ctrl-c'ed it when I saw it was working
06:52<internat>Bret: yep! sign up for a year and get 10% off :P
06:52<rnowak>you did it in a screen session, nohup'd, or console right? ;p
06:52<chesty>if you do sleep 120 && whatever, if you ctrl the sleep the whatever doesn't get run
06:52<Bret>internat, bah ;p
06:52<internat>sorry, i dont think there are any promo codes atm
06:52<Bret>Nevermind, I'll just sign up anyway - shame IPv6 isn't live in London at the mo!
06:52<chesty>Bret: SOON
06:52<rnowak>soon(tm)
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06:53<Bret>Just hoping that my UK card doesn't get a charge for paying for it in USD$ - My bank are renowned for that :p
06:53<rnowak>it likely will, as you are paying in USD
06:53<Peng>Bret: Promo codes aren't very common, and are usually given out in person at events and such, AFAIK.
06:55<Bret>Ah well, will probably be a £1.50 charge and offset the weak $ at the moment so I won't complain
06:56<Solver>my aussie and canadian cards don't care what ucrrency a purchase is made in
06:56<rnowak>my bank here, in sweden, takes 1.41% for the exchange *shakefist*
06:56<Solver>exchange rates are competative
06:57<Solver>otoh 3g Internet access is much cheaper in Europe afaik :)
06:57<Bret>_much_ Solver, I can get "all you can eat" data usage as a £5 addon to my mobile/cell phone contract
06:58<Bret>and there's no FUP/AUP as to how much you can use - I've pushed 20GB a month before
06:58<rnowak>in the UK? "all you can eat"? itym 1GB and then we will terminate your account ;p
06:59<Solver>Canada needs more competition in that arena. Australia is a bit better but not as cheap as europe
06:59<rnowak>I've got a 4G sub for my laptop, around 90 USD/mo - getting around 70/60Mbps on the go is pretty sweet
07:00<Bret>Well, that was a painless setup - sweet, needed something extremely stable for my private IRC "BNC" as my current provider is up and down like a yo-yo
07:00<JediMaster>lucky sod, I can barely get 13Mbps through the landline =(
07:00<Solver>60-70Mbps _moving_? holy hell :)
07:01<rnowak>that was 70 down, 60 up :p
07:01<Solver>good enough :)
07:01<rnowak>They will likely limit it a bit when it goes more mainstream
07:01<Solver>even if you lost half that you'd still be fine :)
07:02-!-Luca_ [~Luca@static-217-133-103-157.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #linode
07:02<chesty>faster than wifi
07:03<rnowak>It is right now "upto 80Mbit/s bidirectional" in the specification
07:03<rnowak>"subject to change blah blah"
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07:03<Peng>70 Mbps for $90/month? In the US you can't even get that *wired*.
07:04-!-sylehc [~Luca@static-217-133-103-157.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #linode
07:04<rnowak>http://www.telia.se/privat/mobilt-bredband/abonnemang/mobilt-bredband-total-4g/mobilt-bredband-total-4g.page
07:04<rnowak>When I signed up, they didn't have data transfer limits, and they are honoring their part of the deal
07:04<Peng>And in the US you probably can't get 60 Mbps *up* anywhere.
07:05-!-sylehc [~Luca@static-217-133-103-157.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
07:05<Peng>(Or maybe you can, on like 100 or 150 Mbps plans. I don't know, and I'd die of envy if I ever read about such things.)
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07:09<Solver>as far as a home link is comcerned i stopped caring somewhere above 10Mb/s
07:09<Solver>at least for the current state of the Internet
07:10<Peng>I still care because I can't get 10 Mbps *up*.
07:10<Peng>s/can't get/don't have/
07:10<Solver>we were on 10Mb/s down in canada - but only 512kb/s up
07:11<Solver>so much for the old 10:1 rule
07:11<rnowak>I do enjoy my 200Mbps home connection here (at mom's), and my 1/1Gbps at my place. I'd probably die if I'd have to go back to crapdsl
07:11<Solver>I would have been happier with 7 down, 1 up
07:12<Solver>australia is rolling out 1Gb/s to 90%+ of the population
07:12<Solver>it'll probably arrive here about the time we leave again :)
07:12-!-[1]Bret [~bret@5adeea16.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:12<rnowak>too bad your link to the rest of the world will still make it crap :p
07:13<amitz>a solution is to instill enough nationalism to discourage people in consuming foreign content.
07:13<rnowak>In Lund (at Lund University), students can get 100/100 Mbps for 8USD/mo \o/
07:14<Solver>the are rolling out additional external capacity on a regular basis but it isn't like being in the heart of north america (as we were before)
07:14<Solver>rnowak: impressive :)
07:14<amitz>I used to have 57.6kbps for around that amount too \o/
07:14<Solver>europe benefits from population density of course - australia is >150% the size of the entire EU
07:15<Solver>with a population of 22Mil
07:15<rnowak>1000/1000 is 130USD/mo by Lund Via Europa - LKF, also using SUNET (Swedish University Network) as backbone
07:15<Solver>I'd be up for living in europe but my wife doesn't want to
07:15<Solver>not long term but a few years would be cool
07:15<rnowak>any idea where you'd want to settle down in europe then?
07:16<chesty>s/cool/cold/
07:16<rnowak>amitz: I'd take my interweb connection and cold, over heat and worse-than-dialup any day :p
07:16<Solver>rnowak: anywhere with interesting ancient sites to visit on the weekends would work for me :)
07:17<Solver>I was going to go to europe when I met my wife and moved to north america. Glad I went to canada though - it is a great place
07:17<amitz>rnowak: hey hey, that's dial up! please get the fact straight! you're libeling!
07:17<rnowak>Solver: nice part about europe is, everything is so relatively close, you can just do weekend trips if you got the cash etc
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07:18<Solver>rnowak: yeah I'd be up for 2-3 years but anne doesn't want to do it at this stage (maybe I'll talk her in to it :)
07:18<Peng>If you've got the cash, you can go on a pretty distant "weekend trip" by plane.
07:18<rnowak>heh :)
07:18<amitz>of course the bad thing about europe is that english can only carry you so far...? :-p
07:18<Solver>we plan to return to north america in a few years
07:18<Solver>amitz: I understand that in certain countries work places are often multilingual
07:19<rnowak>amitz: you'll find most refusal in germany and france, and it isn't because they don't know it, it is because they are being assholes
07:19<Solver>i know aussies in Germany with limited german who communicate in english at work
07:19<amitz>Solver: of course, but the places you're living in, etc?
07:19<Solver>my wife is fluent in french but I'm not
07:19<amitz>rnowak: or so I heard. switzerland too, although I'm not sure of the reason.
07:19<rnowak>close enough to germany and france, there's your reason
07:20<amitz>rnowak: oh, heh.
07:20<rnowak>although that was a joke, people in switzerland are generally friendly
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07:21<amitz>I'm under the impression that german is somehow the more universal lingua france in europe? at least the western part excluding england?
07:21<rnowak>no?
07:21<amitz>no?
07:21<rnowak>no?
07:21<amitz>no??
07:21<Solver>yes!
07:21<Solver>:)
07:22<rnowak>contrarian
07:22<amitz>col
07:22<chesty>culz
07:22*Solver was impressed at how few people spoke English in South america - i found it refreshing :)
07:23<rnowak>a german friend moved to sweden in feb, his swedish is still pretty much nonexistant and he is managing with english ;p
07:23<rnowak>nonexistent, as well
07:23<Solver>but I only went to one country (Venezuela)
07:23<amitz>eat that you germs!
07:24<amitz>Solver: I believe the 5 languages of UN will carry us far indeed, (english, spanish, france, german, chinese)
07:24<Solver>yeah but learning all 5 would be hard :)
07:25<amitz>small detail ;_)
07:26<Solver>amitz: do you speak any languages other than Indonesian and English?
07:26<rnowak>he speaks English?
07:26<Solver>hahah
07:26<amitz>Solver: conversationally? no, unfortunately. :-/
07:26<Solver>maybe I don't :)
07:27<amitz>rnowak, meets cactus. Kiss the cactus please!
07:27*Solver would like to learn Arabic but unless I was to go and live in th emiddeast (less likely now) there isn't a lot of point
07:28<amitz>Some languages I understand passively, some... probably under a life and death situation :-p
07:28<Solver>hahah
07:28<spal>what's the "SOA Email" in DNS Manager?
07:28<rnowak>I know enough arabic to get me out of tough situations as long as they are strong believers, also enough cursing to put me into the mentioned situation
07:28<spal>what does SOA stand for?
07:29<rnowak>how does google work
07:29<Solver>insh'allah
07:29<amitz>Some languages, I got them mixed up, the vocabularies. I know the meaning, but it takes effort for me to recall which language is that.
07:29*Solver went to the middeast and communicated in arabic a little 20 years go
07:29<amitz>Solver: oh, hah. If god allows ;-)
07:30<Solver>amitz: very useful phrase to know as it is widely used in arabic speaking countries :)
07:30<rnowak>spal: you should put in a working email there that you can be reached at, it should also not contain dots
07:31<spal>rnowak, what does SOA stand for?
07:31<rnowak>how does google work, but start of authority
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07:32<amitz>Solver: you know one thing that can save your ass in middle east? the ability to conduct sholat ;-)
07:32<amitz>in case you're getting kidnapped.
07:32<Solver>baksheesh! :)
07:32<rnowak>baksheesh++
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07:33<spal>okay
07:33*Solver never did baksheesh - not game :)
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07:33<rnowak>I accompanied an iraqi friend to one of those countries, and me not being arabic they just let me be at the airport, him being arabic, he had to give a bit of cash to go through ;p
07:33<spal>rnowak, email ID with dots in them worked for me. Any issues with dots in SOA email?
07:33<Solver>rnowak: bummer for him :)
07:34<amitz>rnowak: hah
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07:34<Peng>spal: Yes, thats why rnowak said not to do it.
07:34<rnowak>spal: yes, the @ is turned into a dot, you should not use an email with the user part containing a dot
07:34*Solver met an Iraqi prison in Jordan who was on his way back to Iraq (in the saddam hussein days)
07:34<Solver>poor guy
07:34<Peng>I've always wondered *why* the @ is turned into a dot.
07:35<rnowak>I wonder if anyone that can answer that is still alive
07:35<Solver>he was chained to a seat at a port and I sat down next to him before noticing
07:35<spal>Why is the @ turned into a dot? And what service uses the SOA email and turns the @ into a dot?
07:35<A-KO>bind?
07:35<Solver>Peng: because the @ has a special meanng n the zone file
07:35<rnowak>Just don't put a fucking dot there unless you want to fuck it up, k?
07:35<Peng>Solver: Ahhh. That's stupid, though.
07:35<Solver>Peng: yeah pretty much :)
07:35-!-AphisOne [~AphisOne@5-58.187-72.tampabay.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
07:36<amitz>Solver: did you talk?
07:36<Peng>It would've taken a pretty dumb parser to require that. :-\
07:36<rnowak>Peng: like those made decades ago? ;p
07:37<Solver>amitz: yeah we did. I saw his chains and he said "I'm being returned to Iraq"
07:37-!-AphisOne [~AphisOne@5-58.187-72.tampabay.res.rr.com] has left #linode []
07:37<Solver>amitz: shocked all I could think of was "I'm sorry"
07:37<Solver>amitz: he said "so am I"
07:37<rnowak>:<
07:37<Solver>yep
07:37<Peng>For all you know, he may have deserved it.
07:38<rnowak>and most likely, he didn't, but that does help you get through the experience eh
07:38<Solver>the guy looked like an intellectual and he spoke englisdh with hardly an accent
07:38<spal>The DNS manager shows the TTL of the records as "Default". Now where can I find the default TTL?
07:38<Solver>Peng: maybe
07:38<Solver>but deserving jail and deservnig jaill in iraq are different things
07:38<Bret>14400 isnt it?
07:39<Peng>86400
07:40<AlexC_>spal: default is the default set for your zone. Click 'Settings' next to SOA
07:41<spal>AlexC_, If I Click "Settings" under "SOA record", I find Default TTL = default. :)
07:43<AlexC_>spal: `dig SOA example.com` :)
07:43<AlexC_>whack a '@ns1.linode.com' to that actually
07:44<spal>oh! So, user.name@domain.com is actually interpreted as user@name.domain.com?
07:44<AlexC_>no
07:44<rnowak>user.name.domain.com, how it is interpreted will depend on implementation, but it won't ever be right
07:44<spal>okay
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08:12<@lBOTos>spal: the default is 86400 AKA 1 Day.
08:14<Peng>You're a bit slow for a bot.
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08:18<Bret>Got to say, I thought it was a bit of a fanboy trend for linode when everyone goes on about how good they are - but I'm pretty damn impressed with mine so far
08:18<dzho>Peng: also, short for a stormtrooper
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08:28<gerryvdm>anyone experience with running apache as different users based on the vhost? i see there are a couple of alternative solutions, but wonder what would work best
08:28<Peng>Bret: Good. The brainwashing is taking effect faster than we thought.
08:28<rainman>linode is simply quite good indeed
08:36<Bret>:P
08:36<spal>why is it that dig returns the new address of my domain name while nslookup returns the old one even though both are using the same DNS server configured on my laptop: 8.8.8.8
08:36-!-wkl [~wkl@219.142.118.237] has quit [Quit: wkl]
08:37<gerryvdm>spal: local cache/
08:37<gerryvdm>?
08:39-!-gerryvdm [~5152d00e@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC]
08:41<Peng>Bret: Once the brainwashing is complete, your Linode will actually be replaced with Geocities, but you won't notice.
08:42<jake>I used to have two accounts, one for buisness and one for personal, I stopped using personal one a while ago but wanted to create a new linode but can't seem to log in anymore and password recovery says emailed me but has not. Do accounts get automatically disabled if unsued with no linodes running on it?
08:43<Bret>ahh come on, I don't want geocities :-(
08:43<spal>I changed the nameservers for my domain. I see that I get one output from: dig susam.in A +trace but a different output from: dig susam.in A - Why is it so?
08:43<Peng>Bret: You will soon.
08:44<spal>here is the pastebin for the differing outputs: http://pastebin.com/tRWnbmGU
08:44<Peng>jake: I don't believe they get disabled.
08:44<jake>hmm how odd
08:44<Peng>spal: In the latter case, your resolver probably has the data cached.
08:44<Peng>spal: old data, that is.
08:45<spal>jake, are you sure you are entering the username in the password recovery box (and you are not entering the email address by mistake)?
08:45<jake>I would of thought if I had requested the account deleted or something I would have an email saying that.
08:45<jake>spal: I am entering username :P
08:45<jake>it says it sent me info on changing password
08:45*jake checks mailserver logs
08:45<spal>okay. just confirming. i've lost time entering email address there by mistake. :P
08:46<jake>wonder if it is because I am in Austria atm and normally log in via UK
08:46*jake logs in via browser using uk proxy
08:46<jake>nope
08:46<jake>:(
08:47<praetorian>doubt it.. are you sure you arent getting the email
08:47<praetorian>:p
08:48<jake>yep
08:48<jake>Just did grep of mail log :P
08:51<jake>maybe I asked for account to be deleted
08:51<jake>who knows :/
08:54<jake>yeah probs cancelled it, notice you can do that via linode manager
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10:14<niftylettuce>how would I unmount my linode's ext3 and then ssh back in to recover files from it?
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10:17<AlexC_>niftylettuce: boot up using Finixx
10:18<AlexC_>s/Finixx/Finnix
10:18<AlexC_>http://library.linode.com/troubleshooting/finnix-rescue-mode
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10:21<niftylettuce>AlexC_: thank you
10:22<AlexC_>you're welcome
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10:42<kelvin>Can somebody help me please with a billing question?
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10:46<AlexC_>kelvin: with no question? :)
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10:52<Nivex>!ask
10:52<linbot>If you have a question, feel free to just ask it -- someone's always willing to help. If you don't get a response right away, be patient!
10:53<niftylettuce>AlexC_: I tried to run apt-get update && apt-get install build-essential so I could run a `$ make && make install`, but got the following error output https://gist.github.com/6c85dd640bdde73e573f
10:54<AlexC_>niftylettuce: wait, where are you running this?
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10:54<niftylettuce>AlexC_: from finnix ssh
10:54<niftylettuce>AlexC_: well, lish
10:54<AlexC_>niftylettuce: then that's not going to do what you want
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10:55<niftylettuce>yea i know this is a temp environment how might else I do this?
10:56<@irgeek>Did you chroot into your Ubuntu install first?
10:56<Peng>niftylettuce: You want to compile something *in* Finnix?
10:57<niftylettuce>I've never done something like this before, I have my Ubuntu mounted on /dev/xvda so far while ssh'd into Finnix
10:57<@heckman>Technically you can do it if you chroot in.
10:57<niftylettuce>how would I chroot into this through Finnix?
10:59<@heckman>By using chroot. You'll probably want to mount the dev directory within your disk image tho. I can't remembe rif apt-get needs that or not.
11:00<@heckman>This *should* work, but admittedly I have no idea what you are trying to accomplish to ymmv: http://p.linode.com/5879
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11:31<@psandin>you're missing dev and sys in there
11:31<@psandin>just a second
11:33<@psandin>now with more psuedofilesystems! http://p.linode.com/5880
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11:41<niftylettuce>it won't let me read/write tho
11:41<niftylettuce>b/c finnix i think?
11:41<niftylettuce>err write*
11:43<Peng>niftylettuce: So, what *are* you doing?
11:43<Peng>niftylettuce: Why don't you just boot up your node and compile whatever?
11:43<niftylettuce>http://carlo17.home.xs4all.nl/howto/undelete_ext3.html
11:44<niftylettuce>had a facepalm moment =P
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11:45<niftylettuce>I think i got it
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12:28<linbot>New news from forums: Send-only needed. Cleanest solution? in Email/SMTP Related Forum <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7882>
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12:33<niftylettuce>well actually no
12:33<niftylettuce>Peng: I need the /dev/xvda to be unmounted while I run ext3grep so I can recover the files, but I think I already lost them since I rebooted into Finnix recovery
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12:47<HorizonXP>hi, i'm trying to migrate my services from slicehost to linode, and i've run into a bit of trouble with the DNS
12:47<HorizonXP>i imported the zones into the DNS manager, changed the IPs as appropriate, and activated them here at Linode
12:48<HorizonXP>I deactivated/deleted the DNS entries at Slicehost at the same time
12:48<HorizonXP>now, when I try to ping my domain from my machines here, it says unknown host, which indicates that the DNS entries were likely removed, but not updated.
12:48<HorizonXP>any idea how long I should be waiting? also, what would've been a better way to do this, to have avoided this downtime?
12:49<nDuff>HorizonXP, ...so, you should have added them in linode, then changed the servers at the registrar, and only after that had time to propagate, _then_ removed from your old DNS server
12:49<Fieldy>yep, I was just typing the part about updating your DNS servers at the registrar, nDuff is on it
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12:50<Peng>niftylettuce: What makes you think rebooting into Finnix would harm your files?
12:50<nDuff>HorizonXP, ...so, I'd actually put them back in your old DNS servers to get something working for now, then get the registrar updated
12:51<nDuff>HorizonXP, ...ideally, letting things propagate out (through whatever caching DNS servers various end-users' ISPs may be using) is a matter of at least a few days to be confident.
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12:56<HorizonXP>I didn't even know I had to update it at the registrar
12:56<@mikegrb>lulz
12:56<HorizonXP>i did this all like 3 years ago, difficult to remember all the steps! lol
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12:59<HorizonXP>crap, yeah, now I see it
12:59<HorizonXP>umm... here's another question: any recommendations on domain registrar?
13:00<HorizonXP>i'm using Netfirms right now, but i'm up for renewal in a month or so
13:00<HorizonXP>just wondering if there are better alternatives
13:00<Alan_>I've been using namecheap.com for quite a while
13:00<Alan_>never had a problem, but haven't shopped around much
13:00<Alan_>they were pretty cheap when i started with them, i think they still are
13:01<HorizonXP>interesting
13:01<HorizonXP>2.99 a year, 4.99 /yr to transfer
13:01<HorizonXP>definitely better than the 11.99 that netfirms wants to renew
13:02<Fieldy>namecheap works good here too. stay away from AIT / needhosting
13:04-!-akiva [~akiva@S0106602ad071894e.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #linode
13:05<pjbrunet><- Namecheap user for a long while
13:07<HorizonXP>hmm... interesting
13:07<HorizonXP>the price isn't any better
13:07<HorizonXP>namecheap wants $12/yr for my .ca domain too
13:07<HorizonXP>worth transferring for the same amount of money?
13:07<pjbrunet>How I picked Namecheap years ago, I read 100s of recommendations on WHT and Namecheap seemed to have the most recommendations.
13:07<HorizonXP>i mean, netfirms has been fine....
13:07-!-onats [~onats@112.201.175.17] has quit [Quit: onats]
13:07<HorizonXP>i don't use it for anything else
13:09<Alan_>how i picked namecheap about 7 years ago (i think): it wasn't godaddy
13:09<pjbrunet>Wasn't Godaddy recently sold to a new owner? Or did I imagine that.
13:10<rnowak>did he kill an elephant as well?
13:10<Alan_>i don't tend to keep up to date on this kind of stuff
13:10<Alan_>namecheap is the only provider i've not felt a need to switch away from, so i haven't switched away from them
13:17<HorizonXP>transferred.
13:18<Fieldy>congrats
13:19-!-DeaneVenske [~6f45f060@chat.linode.com] has joined #linode
13:19<DeaneVenske>Hey Guys
13:19<pjbrunet>Elephants in Africa? Sounds familiar. I could Google it, but too lazy ;-) I think I read somewhere Namecheap is owned by Russians in Chicago.
13:19<retro|blah>Hi.
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13:20<niftylettuce>\o/ recovered all the files \o/ !!!!
13:20<niftylettuce>Peng: thx
13:20<DeaneVenske>I have a random question. We have a large number of nodes. I'm wondering if there is any advantage to be gained installing snort or is that really only feasible if you're in your own network with control over a router/switch?
13:20<niftylettuce>AlexC_: irgeek heckman psandin thanks guys
13:23<AlexC_>;0
13:23<AlexC_>:) even
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13:39<tyler>Hi all. Anyone here?
13:39<Fieldy>DeaneVenske: it makes sense however it will be frustrating if you have not set up snort before. it comes with a fairly crappy default ruleset and you spend a lot of time tuning it up. then you look at addon rulesets like emerging threats (much better, but still has to be watched).
13:39-!-vraa [~vraa@h75.164.30.71.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has joined #linode
13:39<pjbrunet>I'm not really here.
13:40<tyler>can you guys tell me why when I type hostname -f I get: hostname: Name or service not known ?
13:40<tyler>hostname works.
13:41<Fieldy>DeaneVenske: in addition without having full packet capture for some time period so that you can pull the packets for a given alert, you'll have to trust snort, and IDS systems can be wrong
13:41-!-vraa [~vraa@h75.164.30.71.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has quit []
13:41<hawk>tyler: http://library.linode.com/getting-started#sph_set-the-hostname
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13:53<the1>dig reverse lookup gives no output but ping shows a reverse-address. could you explain how this can happen? Here is the output: http://codepad.org/o1pCwyxX
13:55<jtsage>try dig <hostname> OR dig -x <IP> - no mix and match. also, if you drop "+short", dig usually tells you what went wrong
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14:06<the1>jtsage, yes, resolved it. thanks.
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14:46<DeaneVenske>Fieldy : Thanks for the info on SNORT. I'm thinking for now my time is better spent setting up nessus and monitoring services and maybe outsource the SNORT stuff to someone that really knows their stuff
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14:47<Fieldy>DeaneVenske: glad to help, good luck. hopefully you can learn it at some point, everyone starts somewhere
14:49<Obsidian|server>http://theoatmeal.com/pl/brain/sleep
14:49*Obsidian|server shakes fist
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15:17<mycol>i <3 Linode
15:17<mycol>i figured that should be my first post in this channel
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15:20<Tea>In the event that you reside in Soviet Russia, please be advised that Linode loves you.
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15:26<pjbrunet>I love Linode too, as long as they're the best ;-)
15:26<pjbrunet>And a good value.
15:27<tyler>do you know about the AllowUsers value in /etc/ssh/sshd_config ?
15:27<mycol>that value is a myth, like the fountain of youth
15:27<tyler>do you use spaces or new lines?
15:28<Nivex>you love Linode long time?
15:28<mycol>spaces
15:29<hawk>tyler: man 5 sshd_config
15:29<mycol>"AllowUsers mike chris tyler"
15:29<pjbrunet>First time I paid for hosting was around 1998, HE.net, wow they are still in business and their website hasn't changed a bit ;-)
15:30<pjbrunet>Hopefully when I'm older and more cranky Linode is still around.
15:31<mycol>webpage will remain the same tooo
15:31<TheFirst>sorry, I have already reserved the cranky old bastard in #linode position...find another :P
15:32<pjbrunet>OK, cantankerous.
15:33-!-yacc1 [~Adium@mc30536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #linode
15:33<pjbrunet>TheFirst, if you die first, then I'll be waiting to wear your cranky hat.
15:33<TheFirst>the way I drink/work/live that's a good possibility :P
15:35<pjbrunet>What are you drinking?
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15:45<mycol>the good stuff, wood grain alcohol
15:46<pjbrunet>Linode distilled?
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15:49<@mikegrb>mmm cake
15:49<TheFirst>linode to too sweet...needs less cake :P
15:50<sherif>Hello , I am trying to install pv-grub kernel. everything works i can access the linode using the ssh, but i did lose the consloe , i tried to do 0:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty xvc0 but still the same, i am using centos 5.7 any idea ?
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15:52<sherif>0:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 xvc0 also that did not work
15:52-!-rurufufuss [~rurufufus@115-64-27-246.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:52<retro|blah>sherif: hvc0, not xvc0
15:53<sherif>did that too
15:53<linbot>New news from forums: Use of variables with an include statement (nginx) in Web Servers and Web App Development <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7898>
15:53<sherif>but i can try it again...
15:54<sherif>so the line will be 0:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 hvc0 ?
15:54<retro|blah>I believe so, yes
15:55<sherif>ok
15:55<sherif>brb
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16:06<linbot>New news from forums: awstats versus google analytics and how to monitor web logs in Web Servers and Web App Development <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7899>
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16:10<ronkrt>Hi, is it possible to ask Support to place a Blank dns hostentry to every one of my entrys that doesnt have to to point to the same ip?
16:10-!-mdcollins [~mdcollins@c-24-10-74-34.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #linode
16:11<ronkrt> currently worring about a move for my family) to do it.
16:11-!-ronkrt [~6277e5c0@chat.linode.com] has quit []
16:12<kyhwana>er what
16:12<kyhwana>geez, he didn't even stay a minute
16:12<kyhwana>and im not sure what exactly he was asking
16:13<Fieldy>patience--;
16:13<Fieldy>i don't know either... blank dns hostentry?
16:14<kyhwana>and why does he think support could/would do it? He could do it himself, unless what he's asking for is impossible in which case support couldn't either
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16:14<Tuxavant>it's called techiturrets
16:15<kyhwana>?
16:15<Tuxavant>joins channel, spits out random words, leave channel
16:16<kyhwana>never heard it called that before
16:16<Tuxavant>just made it up 8D
16:16<sherif>mmmmm it did work
16:17<sherif>but something wrong, using the console i can not log in :-)
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16:23<sherif>mmm this is crazy !! now i get the login console with pv-grub but not able to login
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16:34<gadams>ProTip: When creating applications make sure your queries use the right database.
16:34-!-ender|h [~ender@c-98-202-87-28.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #linode
16:35<sherif>hmm i see !! it should be included in /etc/securetty !
16:36-!-adnc [~akif@77-21-241-132-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:37<sherif>that is nice ! might write a full howto ! :)
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17:01<linbot>New news from forums: Alternatives to MySQL on Linode? in Web Servers and Web App Development <http://forum.linode.com/viewtopic.php?t=7857>
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17:02<kyhwana>hmm
17:02<kyhwana>postgres/nosql/etcetc
17:03-!-SteveX [~2985ec87@chat.linode.com] has joined #linode
17:03<Obsidian|server>sqlite if you want to have fun :)
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17:43<the1>why the dig with +trace and without trace gives different IP addresses for susam.in? http://codepad.org/xQz5XDDL
17:43-!-cdlu [~cdlu@cdlu.ombudsman.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
17:45<kyhwana>hmm
17:45<kyhwana>the1: wfm. resolves to 106.187.41.241 in both cases
17:45<the1>kyhwana, did you see my paste? That paste is from my Linode instance.
17:46<dcraig>without +trace, you're probably getting a cached result
17:46<the1>i am wondering the possible reason for the two outputs to differ when both commands are invoked from the same system.
17:46<the1>okay. anyway to clear the cache?
17:47<dcraig>the cache exists on your recursive resolver
17:47<dcraig>resolver1.tokyo.linode.com
17:47<the1>dcraig, how did you figure that?
17:47<dcraig>it's in your paste
17:47-!-Dreamer3 [~dreamer3@74-134-34-116.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #linode
17:48<the1>dcraig, I couldn't resolver1.tokyo.linode.com in my paste.
17:48<dcraig>line 64
17:48<dcraig>dig with the +trace option queries the authorative nameservers directly
17:49<the1>okay
17:49<dcraig>without the +trace option, it asks your recursive resolver
17:49<the1>okay
17:50<the1>so, I simply have to wait for the resolver1.tokyo.linode.com cache to expire?
17:50<dcraig>right
17:50-!-kokuei [~48be5a29@chat.linode.com] has joined #linode
17:50<the1>okay. thanks.
17:51-!-Cypher100_ [~Cypher@108-82-117-77.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #linode
17:52<the1>I have an alternative. I can temporarily add: <new_ip_goes_here> susam.in to /etc/hosts
17:52<the1>and remove it when the tokyo resolver's cache is updated.
17:52<dcraig>sure
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18:00<seanh-ansca>did the timeout for the linode manager get increased recently?
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18:01<Cypher100>What's the best way to let someone upload files to my server?
18:02<seanh-ansca>Cypher100: that's very usage specific
18:02<seanh-ansca>is the user going to have a shell login?
18:02<Cypher100>Like a folder for game maps
18:02<kyhwana>Cypher100: sftp
18:02<kyhwana>!sftp
18:02<kyhwana>hmm
18:02-!-metaperl|2 [~kvirc@c-65-34-171-178.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:03<seanh-ansca>Cypher100: for that usage i might recomend some kind of web drop off
18:03<Cypher100>If I have password disabled on ssh, will that effect the sftp?
18:03<Cypher100>web drop off?
18:03<seanh-ansca>the user will need to have their key added, just like ssh
18:03<seanh-ansca>a post form with a attach box
18:03<seanh-ansca>or a ajax upload widget of some kind
18:04<Cypher100>Where can I get one?
18:04-!-message144 [~message14@pool-72-67-93-229.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #linode
18:04<Obsidian|server>note, uploadify should not be used
18:05<dcraig>how big is a game map file?
18:05<Obsidian|server>(loluploadvulns)
18:05<Cypher100>there team fortress 2 maps, for the sv_downloadurl
18:05<Obsidian|server>hmmm
18:05<Cypher100>3 - 20mb each
18:05<Cypher100>a bunch of them
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18:11<seanh-ansca>caker: did the linode manager session timeout get increased recently?
18:17<Cypher100>Match group sftp X11Forwarding no ChrootDirectory %h AllowTcpForwarding no ForceCommand internal-sftp
18:17<Cypher100>This breaks ssh
18:18<dwfreed>Cypher100: an sftp jail is designed so that they can only sftp
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18:34<Cypher100>I added a link in the sftp users home folder and gave the folder that is link to ownership to that user
18:34<Cypher100>but the user still can't access it
18:34<kyhwana>you mean to outside the choor jail?
18:35<Cypher100>will, can I make it so the user can access that folder?
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18:38<Cypher100>the folder's owner is set to root:root and everything inside of it is sftpuser:sftpuser
18:38<Cypher100>and still can't access it
18:38<rnowak>symlink?
18:38<Cypher100>that's what I did
18:39-!-azaghal [~azaghal@109.207.38.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:39<rnowak>symbolic links are symbolic, it won't work as they will point to a location that does probably not exist in the chroot
18:39<Cypher100>a normal link?
18:41<Cypher100>what should I do
18:42<seanh-ansca>hard links will probably bite you in the ass when you are least expecting
18:42<seanh-ansca>cron script that runs as your game server's user that copies in new maps every so often?
18:42<bob2>also you can't hardlink dirs under linux
18:43<bob2>anyway, chroot sftp is a choice, seems like a bad chocie for you
18:43<seanh-ansca>bob2: i always forget that
18:44<rnowak>but but but everything is a file!!!111 *asplode*
18:46<bob2>worse is better
18:46<seanh-ansca>aren't . and .. technically hardlinks?
18:46<bob2>you can use plan9 if consistency is more important than a working OS
18:48<Cypher100>if I set a users chroot to a folder where it haves access to a web server files access from http
18:48*Solver wishes pla9 had been moore popular
18:48<rnowak>technically . and .. will be constructs that your environment understands, they need to be translated to a full path
18:49<Cypher100>and when I add a ssh key to it, will people via http access the ssh key?
18:50<rnowak>you should probably look at a different process, as mentioned above by bob2
18:50<rnowak>and seanh-ansca
18:50<bob2>Cypher100, no that's all gibberish
18:51-!-alester [~alester@host3130.follett.com] has quit [Quit: alester]
18:51<rnowak>python's test suite is taking a bazillion years *glares*
18:52<bob2>why yes it is quite thorough!
18:56<tolle>Ah, plan9... Always as interesting, but nothing to actually use.
18:56<seanh-ansca>there's plan9 in userspace
18:56<seanh-ansca>http://swtch.com/plan9port/
18:56<seanh-ansca>s/in/from
18:56-!-yacc1 [~Adium@173-228-89-232.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #linode
18:57<seanh-ansca>though some of the most interesting stuff was the filesystem, which i don't think they ported
18:57<seanh-ansca>or not all the way in anycase
18:58<tolle>Kinda hard to port it all the way I'd guess.
18:58<tolle>Since theres some rather cool stuff going on
18:58<seanh-ansca>right
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19:06<Cypher100>is there a basic php file manager out there?
19:07<SleePy>Most likely millions, just requires a google search and your own time.
19:07-!-JediMaster [~JediMaste@5ad5f04a.bb.sky.com] has quit [Quit: fnarble]
19:07<rnowak>and a lot of will to play with fire
19:08<dcraig>I used phpxplorer a long time ago
19:08<dcraig>it seemed to work ok
19:10<Cypher100>every file manager I see haves more lines of code then phpbb3
19:11-!-amoe_ [~amoe@host-92-26-171-61.as13285.net] has joined #linode
19:11-!-Fieldy [VjkySYu7ZA@li77-30.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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19:12<dcraig>I guess that speaks to the quality and conciseness of phpbb code
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19:14<SleePy>Cypher100, As long as it doesn't take more ram than crysis 3 :P
19:14<kyhwana>minecraft?
19:19<tolle>webdav doesn't work?
19:19-!-vraa_ [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:19<Cypher100>convert phpbb to javabb and use sqlite as the main database for a 30k+ member forum
19:19-!-vraa [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:20<rnowak>java would probably work quite a bit better for that purpose, what's your point?
19:20<tolle>I'd hardly convert phpbb to anything. complete rewrite is probably easier.
19:20-!-vraa_ [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has joined #linode
19:20<bob2>lololololol
19:20<tolle>And well, if theres anything java does well its large scale stuff.
19:21<bob2>love it
19:21<rnowak>*ENTERPRISE*
19:21<tolle>XML everything!
19:21<rnowak>all of it
19:21<tolle>But 30k member forum says nothing
19:21<Cypher100>Someone give me a vbulletin license
19:21-!-bbtech [HydraIRC@67-135-43-194.dia.static.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it]
19:21<tolle>Since you have no idea how much they actually do/use the forum
19:22<tolle>Has anyone tried fluxbb?
19:22<Cypher100>no
19:22-!-yacc1 [~Adium@173-228-89-232.dsl.static.sonic.net] has left #linode []
19:22<Cypher100>brb
19:22<tolle>All I know is that the arch linux forums run it.
19:22<rnowak>lolarch
19:23<tolle>And I did a quick setup to check it out, but well. its just forum software. Not much differance from any other.
19:23<tolle>rnowak: hey, they even sign packages now
19:23*rnowak checks temperature in hell
19:23<rnowak>nope nope nope
19:23<tolle>granted, the whole aur thing isn't to secure
19:24-!-DephNet[Paul] [~Paul@w-221.cust-5547.ip.static.uno.uk.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:24<tolle>Cypher100: What are you looking for, something to run a forum on?
19:25-!-goose [~goose@c-76-17-81-233.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Staying alive can kill you, it's taken years off of my life.]
19:27<SleePy>How about a 270k member forum :D
19:27-!-blorpy [~spork@frotz.zork.net] has joined #linode
19:27<bob2>yes membership is the important metric
19:27-!-blorpy is now known as emad
19:27<emad>mikegrb: hey
19:27-!-message144 [~message14@mad2036d0.tmodns.net] has joined #linode
19:27<bob2>because certain FORUM SOFTWARES can only handle N rows in a database
19:28<tolle>Haha.. for real?
19:28<bob2>............................................................................................................................................................................................................
19:28<Obsidian|server>all of them only can, duh
19:28<tolle>Well, thats true for all. Doubt anything can handle infinite rows.
19:28<Obsidian|server>eeeexactly.
19:28<tolle>But where that becomes a issue.
19:29<Obsidian|server>IIRC, phpBB3 uses INT(11)
19:29<SleePy>That becomes the issue of the database backend more than a limitation of the software.
19:29<bob2>yes, php authors are muppets
19:29<Obsidian|server>unsigned, of course
19:29<bob2>google for "int(11)"
19:29<bob2>==lulz
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19:30<tolle>Well, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
19:30<Obsidian|server>there's been a very limited number of people that went over that on the posts table iirc
19:30<seanh-ansca>why in the world is avahi installed by default in the ubuntu 10.04 install o_0
19:31<Obsidian|server>and then they just did an ALTER_TABLE on the primary key and moved to bigint
19:31<Obsidian|server>which buys you 2^64 rows
19:31-!-vraa_ [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:31<Obsidian|server>I can't remember who it was that needed that..
19:32<tolle>I cant really stand most forum software.
19:32<tolle>theres like a freaking billion options and checkboxes and shit.
19:32<tolle>Takes a fucking year to read up on what everything does.
19:33<Obsidian|server>think that's bad, go try messing with joomla's admin panel
19:33<tolle>I've stayed away from joomla
19:33<tolle>I was offered a job related to that for a few months a while back but I couldn't bother
19:33<seanh-ansca>or any reasonable drupal permissions page
19:33<SleePy>Yet if there isn't enough options, people complain that they want more features :|
19:34<Obsidian|server>pffft
19:34*SleePy adds the ability for his forum to check the milk in the fridge.
19:34<Obsidian|server>people ALWAYS want more features
19:34<Obsidian|server>"can you add a chat to it"
19:34<SleePy>bloatware
19:34<tolle>SleePy: Indeed
19:34<Obsidian|server>my immediate answer would be > NO
19:34-!-cygnus [~cygnus@74-131-161-158.dhcp.insightbb.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:34<Cypher100>Someone give me a vbulletin license
19:34<SleePy>?ber No?
19:34<Cypher100>now
19:34<Cypher100>right now
19:34<tolle>But we are freaking nerds I guess. Still using irc and mailinglists for discussions
19:34<tolle>Buy it?
19:35<tolle>If you really need it
19:35<Cypher100>No
19:35<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: aab123456
19:35<tolle>or try some other forum software.
19:35<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: there you go
19:35<seanh-ansca>tolle: no newsgroup love?
19:35<tolle>Actually no. Not recently
19:35<tolle>Maybe I should get back to it.
19:35<tolle>Bringing the geekiness up to 11
19:36<SleePy>Why break what isn't broken. IRC and mailing lists work just fine. Its not real time so I can reply at my own time.
19:36<Cypher100>is there a list of bb boards I can use?
19:36<tolle>Cypher100: on wikipedia
19:36<seanh-ansca>you need to use it for something other than alt.bin in order to hit 11 :-p
19:36<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: avoid mybb btw
19:36<Obsidian|server>lulzy security
19:36-!-goose [~goose@c-76-17-81-233.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
19:36<tolle>Yeah, I'd use the most paranoid one
19:36<Obsidian|server>even came with an eval() 'sploit until a few weeks ago
19:37<tolle>I dont get how forums and blog stuff, like wordpress, can become such massive hogs
19:37<tolle>they do nothing at all. some simple sql queries and list them
19:37<kyhwana>hmm
19:37<Obsidian|server>tolle: they query in /loops/
19:37<Obsidian|server>tolle: wordpress uses queries in LOOPS.
19:37<kyhwana>remote execution vulnerabilities in dovecot <2.0.13
19:38<Cypher100>then there was a security bug
19:38<tolle>I guess thats where they go full retard.
19:38<Cypher100>so they patched it
19:38<Cypher100>then that patch made more holes
19:38<Cypher100>so they patch those
19:38<Cypher100>then the software gets bigger and bigger
19:38<Obsidian|server>it's spaghetti code
19:38-!-vraa [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has joined #linode
19:39<tolle>A forum is a rather trivial thing to code yourself.
19:39<tolle>If you have the time. And can be bothered
19:39<Obsidian|server>a lot of the time though, it's also because there's poor organization - add in some OO and JIT autoloading, it drops the amount of stuff included into memory pretty nicely
19:39-!-dvgrhl [dvgrhl@c-71-231-204-127.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #linode
19:39<Obsidian|server>tolle: and care enough to deal with various browser....problems.
19:39<tolle>Yes, theres that
19:39<seanh-ansca>Obsidian|server: s/problems/features
19:39<seanh-ansca>:D
19:40<Obsidian|server>e.g. IE not knowing how to download files without executing them as HTML if it looks like HTML
19:40<tolle>"Ah sweet, 17:00 on friday, I hit the deadline!". Just to get a phonecall about something not working in IE
19:40<tolle>Because you forgot to check the shit
19:40<Obsidian|server>simple solution:
19:40<tolle>granted, 90% of the time its due to retarded users.
19:40<Obsidian|server>if useragent contains MSIE
19:40<Cypher100>I'm looking at the bb forum timeline
19:40<Obsidian|server>DENY ACCESS
19:40<Cypher100>funny how phpbb does not get any forks
19:40<kyhwana>tolle: "We don't support IE6"
19:41<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: it's had forks, but they've died out due to noody caring
19:41<SleePy>Down with IE6!
19:41<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: I've seen a couple that added the kitchen sink et al. They were ignored and discarded.
19:41<SleePy>FYI: http://www.ie6countdown.com/
19:41<tolle>Not sure if I can nag on people running old browsers since I still run firefox 3.6
19:42<Obsidian|server>SleePy: I wonder how much of those statistics are ruined by the hordes of spambots cloaking themselves with IE5, IE6 UA's
19:42<tolle>Granted, it is still supported. ie6 is just plain shit
19:42<Cypher100>vBulletin is a blackhole in your wallet
19:43<tolle>Yeah, but fork out or find something else.
19:43<SleePy>Obsidian|server, I would say 2% just as a guess :D
19:43<tolle>What functionality do you even need?
19:43<Cypher100>xenforo looks nice, til I find out it's also $100+
19:43<rnowak>how dare they earn a living selling software
19:43<Obsidian|server>fluxbb might work for something lightweight, but it's very barebones
19:43<dzho>haha "selling"
19:43<dzho>ITYM "renting"
19:43-!-vraa [~vraa@mf62736d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:43<dzho>"licensing"
19:44<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: xenforo is also very unaccessible to disabled users
19:44<tolle>Obsidian|server: Yeah, its kind of why i found it interesting. No useless shit.
19:44<rnowak>itym "I thought selling means handing over all rights to something"
19:44<Obsidian|server>tolle: Indeed - just wish it had some cleaned up, modernized code in the back so I can play with it
19:44<das_> /HELP
19:44*Obsidian|server has been messing with an Observer design pattern for some time and LOVES it
19:46-!-das_ [~das@pemberley.dlsand.com] has quit [Quit: leaving]
19:46<Cypher100>bbPress looks good
19:46-!-goose [~goose@c-76-17-81-233.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Staying alive can kill you, it's taken years off of my life.]
19:46<Cypher100>automatic updates
19:46<@mikegrb>lulz
19:46<Obsidian|server>lol automatic updates
19:46<Obsidian|server>worst idea /ever/
19:46<SleePy>Yea, because windows does great automatic updates :P
19:46<Obsidian|server>unless it does code signing, just wear a sign that says "screw me over please"
19:46<tolle>Automatic updates only make shit break without you touching anything
19:46<Obsidian|server>all it takes is a DNS poisoning and you're SOL.
19:47-!-goose [~goose@c-76-17-81-233.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #linode
19:47<tolle>Who runs automatic updates in production anyway?
19:47<Obsidian|server>"Oh, you just got automatically updated with a fake infected update. Sucks to be you."
19:47<SleePy>I would hope that before processing the auto update it checks a cert or at least a ping back.
19:47<rnowak>tolle: o/
19:47<Obsidian|server>SleePy: i personally like code signing, but https would work too tbh.
19:47<rnowak>we do write it ourselves and push to production, but... o/
19:48<tolle>rnowak: well tbh, no body actually "test" their code before deploying it. But you are supposed to say you do.
19:48<Cypher100>bbpress is made by the same people of wordpress
19:48-!-epochwolf [~epochwolf@c-67-170-60-66.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #linode
19:48<tolle>git push. then a pull in production right away. Like a boss!
19:48<rnowak>hell yeah, no not really, but hell yeah
19:48<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: DOOOOOMED
19:49<tolle>So the dashboard will be just as freaking slow?
19:49<Cypher100>IP.Board
19:49<seanh-ansca>http://blogs.msdn.com/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer-Blogs-Components-WeblogFiles/00-00-01-32-02-metablogapi/8054.image_5F00_thumb_5F00_35C6E986.png
19:49<Obsidian|server>tolle: that's what I do - I have my custom code hooked up to fire off git pulls
19:49<SleePy>Ok.. Can people tell me why Calendar is considered a forum feature?
19:49<Obsidian|server>tolle: my admin page has a button I can click to trigger a git update, and another button that triggers a revert to previous commit :D
19:50<tolle>I have no fucking idea
19:50<rnowak>seanh-ansca: damn straight
19:50<Obsidian|server>SleePy: kitchen sink
19:50<seanh-ansca>rnowak: stay buggy my friends :D
19:50<SleePy>Obsidian|server, Thats helpful :P
19:50<tolle>Obsidian|server: The revert button is huge, red and with the words "PANIC!" on it?
19:50<SleePy>The bb article on wiki has calendar as one of the major features. Just trying to figure that out.
19:50<Obsidian|server>SleePy: it's the kitchen sink mentality
19:50<tolle>SleePy: What does it even mean?
19:51<Obsidian|server>tolle: Damn straight it is. Also, there's a giant warning message on the update page too
19:51<tolle>That you can check a calendar, or that you can schedule events?
19:51*Obsidian|server goes to find the screenshot
19:51<SleePy>I think just the first is required.
19:51<tolle>Skip the screenshot, just give us access
19:52<Obsidian|server>Ahahahaa no.
19:52<Obsidian|server>not like it'd let you do anything anyways. It's locked to specific IPs :)
19:52<Cypher100>is there any good opensource forum software out there?
19:52<MTecknology>Cypher100: phpbb?
19:52<MTecknology>pretty popular anyway
19:52<bob2>troll
19:52<tolle>A few friends and I from univ have a homepage that some older peeps made, that shit is done in shellscripts and perl. With Makefiles for the homepage. Its a freaking nightmare to change anything
19:53<bob2>tolle, ikiwiki
19:53<rnowak>compile it, compile it all
19:53<Obsidian|server>tolle: http://i53.tinypic.com/1opxr4.jpg :D
19:53<tolle>but it was made around 96 or so, I keep saying we should wait untill people born in 96 starts at the univ to replace it
19:53<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: phpBB3's a solid choice anyways. the audit by sektioneins helps
19:53<SleePy>Obsidian|server, :o
19:53<seanh-ansca>tolle: https://github.com/jayferd/balls
19:53<Obsidian|server>Cypher100: (sektioneins also wrote/maintains the suhosin patch for PHP)
19:54<seanh-ansca>tolle: because that will be much better :-p
19:54<Obsidian|server>SleePy: awesome isn't it
19:54<Cypher100>http://i.nuseek.com/images/template/360x318/ist2_746781_female_student.jpg
19:54<tolle>seanh-ansca: Ah, that might be something for the site!
19:54<Cypher100>Everyone's fav picture
19:54<Cypher100>perfect for there domain name
19:54<Obsidian|server>it's the generic college student!
19:54<rnowak>you're not the guy that talked about wanting macosx on his non-apple pc a few weeks ago, are you, Cypher100?
19:55<Obsidian|server>Used by domain campers EVERYWHERE
19:55<SleePy>I knew that pic looked familiar :D
19:55<Cypher100>Not what I know of
19:55<Cypher100>I fking hate macs
19:55<SleePy>We hate you as well.
19:55<rnowak>You sure have a lot in common with that guy.
19:55<@mikegrb>lulz
19:55<Cypher100>lol
19:55<tolle>Fucking domain campers
19:56<tolle>They should have made registering a domain cost 200bucks in initial cost or something
19:57<rnowak>or require legitimate use
19:57<Obsidian|server>naw
19:57<tolle>Yeah
19:57<tolle>Something atleast
19:57<Obsidian|server>it should just be able to have it taken away if not used
19:57<Obsidian|server>want to squat? lose the ownership. contract clause.
19:57<tolle>Just do a whois and call the hells angels
19:58-!-maushu [~maushu@62.169.111.4.rev.optimus.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:58<Obsidian|server>whoisguard..
19:58<tolle>I'm sure they could find out who has the domain for the right amount of money
19:59<SleePy>A dcma request may help with that.. Not that it helps in this case.
19:59<rnowak>google: "I accept. Continue with set up"
19:59<rnowak>as in, a button on gapps
20:00-!-saikat_ [~saikat@173-228-28-38.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has joined #linode
20:00<amitz>GAAP? GAP? they're really different creatures ;-)
20:03<Cypher100>Is SMF good?
20:03-!-pyruvate [~irssi@cpe-069-134-062-245.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #linode
20:04<SleePy>Yes, but I am biased.
20:04<Obsidian|server>it's okay, has been a bit rocky in the past with security issues
20:04<SleePy>Oh that hurts :|
20:04<Obsidian|server>before you make a choice though, look at the security history of what you pick
20:04<Obsidian|server>secunia's got good records
20:04<rnowak>SleePy: are you responsible for the spaghetti code? ;p
20:04<tolle>Is there any forum software where you can search the forum and it takes you to the actual place where the string is located? Not just the entire 200 page thread?
20:05<SleePy>I contributed some? But I blame somebody else for not fixing it first :D
20:05<seanh-ansca>iirc in phpbb you get a thread link and a post link
20:05<Obsidian|server>tolle: phpbb3, mysql engine for search
20:05<rnowak>SleePy: nice save, shove the blame on others!
20:05<tolle>Ah I must have missed it.
20:05<Obsidian|server>not sure if phpbb native engine does it, I think it does
20:05<Obsidian|server>mysql search requires myisam tables though, for fulltext indexing
20:06<SleePy>rnowak, Of course. I blame the person before me for the problems.
20:06<SleePy>Although I am helping fix the spaghetti code slowly.
20:06<tolle>Once stuff goes spaghetti, it seldom goes back.
20:07<Obsidian|server>well, not without scrapping a ton of code and getting rid of half the development team
20:07<SleePy>A complete rewrite using a framework ;)
20:07<tolle>There are no such thing as a temporary fix. Its just permanent fixes you are ashamed of.
20:07<Nivex>you can weave spaghetti into a framework
20:07<avenj>historically smf has given me less of a headache than phpbb ... but all forum software sucks including the big-dollar packages
20:07<SleePy>Nivex, Not if I can help it. Kicking these devs to do the job right.
20:07<Obsidian|server>SleePy: now if only symfony was developed with performance in mind..
20:08-!-saikat [~saikat@173-228-28-38.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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20:08<Nivex>I thought MyISAM was deprecated
20:08<@mikegrb>lulz
20:08<Obsidian|server>symfony2: lol oop spam hog as much memory as possible USE MOAR REGEX we like inefficient code just because it looks prettier
20:08<SleePy>I don't think too many frameworks think of that. They are subject to bloat as well :(
20:09<Obsidian|server>OOP frameworks rarely think of it ~_~
20:09<SleePy>Users want and if you don't want to loose your user base, you give. Sometimes there needs to be a foot put down saying that this is not bloatware :D
20:09-!-epochwolf [~epochwolf@c-67-170-60-66.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
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20:10-!-kokuei [~48be5a29@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC]
20:12<Obsidian|server>SleePy: yeah, unfortunately. however, if you code it for easy extensibility, you can get the best of both worlds
20:13<Obsidian|server>SleePy: working with the observer design pattern on a test project (a challenge, really, to develop my OOP skills) I've found that you can really change it up with event-driven design
20:14<SleePy>From what I have seen, extensibility is not usually the thought process when designing the code structure. Its usually an afterthought.
20:14<JDLSpeedy>wow, Linode getting big, 14 irc operators?, heh
20:14<stan_theman>heh
20:14-!-stafamus [~stafamus@host-78-147-228-164.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:14<stan_theman>hey!
20:15<Obsidian|server>SleePy: it's a learning process of course - most don't learn how to do it, or care enough TO do it
20:15<amitz>stan_theman: despite all the people, have you managed to stay theman?
20:15<SleePy>Obsidian|server, Agreed :)
20:15<amitz>new people
20:15<stan_theman>yes yes
20:15-!-mode/#linode [+o stan_theman] by ChanServ
20:15<Obsidian|server>SleePy: anyways, my fun project - irc bot in just PHP. One HELL of a challenge. https://github.com/damianb/yukari/tree/develop
20:15<@stan_theman>usually i just have to roar a lot
20:15*stan_theman roars
20:15<amitz>stan_theman: very good, you do not disappoint me!
20:15<Obsidian|server>oh god why no please
20:15<@stan_theman>15 ops
20:16*Obsidian|server hides behind heckman
20:16<tparker>staaaan
20:16<Obsidian|server>heckman: stan_theman is scary ;-;
20:16-!-mode/#linode [+o tparker] by ChanServ
20:16<@stan_theman>tparker: <3
20:16<SleePy>Obsidian|server, Nice :)
20:16<@tparker>stan_theman: <3
20:16-!-beckham [~43da75ee@chat.linode.com] has joined #linode
20:16<Obsidian|server>SleePy: as a note, there's no IRC specific code in the core - totally event driven :>
20:16<SleePy>I assume that is your github account?
20:16<Obsidian|server>aye
20:16*SleePy watches
20:17<Obsidian|server>addons/ is purely the addons, and anything that does something functional is in an addon
20:17<Obsidian|server>the core is just a loop, a parser for argv, and an object that handles terminal output/tty colors
20:17<SleePy>"build_84! now with an untested addon."
20:17<Obsidian|server>heh
20:18<Obsidian|server>develop branch has build_85
20:18-!-darxus_ [~darxus@c-75-68-127-94.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #linode
20:18<Obsidian|server>I found bugs with said addon :D
20:18<SleePy>Gives your users a good sense of the quality assurance in your product :D
20:18<avenj>perl + POE + POE::Component::IRC = done ?
20:18*avenj hides
20:18<darxus_>75% packet loss at Fremont.
20:18<Obsidian|server>avenj: the point is to challenge myself and learn to do something difficult, and build skill. not take a cheap way out.
20:19-!-darxus_ is now known as Darxus_
20:19<Obsidian|server>SleePy: oh heavens yes. All...two users?
20:19<avenj>Obsidian|server: I jest
20:19-!-mode/#linode [+o brianok] by ChanServ
20:19<Obsidian|server>avenj: and I joust :3
20:19<@mikegrb>lulz
20:19<SleePy>lol, if I ever need a IRC bot, I will look into it. Good to know a competent coder programed it than somebody who just learned php 3 hours ago and doesn't know what security or organization means
20:19<@stan_theman>the ops are coming out of the woodwork
20:20-!-cygnus [~cygnus@74-131-161-158.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #linode
20:20<avenj>Obsidian|server: <3
20:20<Obsidian|server>SleePy: it's more of an experiment to figure out a lot of stuff. it's a playground; a lot of code that proved effective and powerful has been ported out into its own libs
20:20<AviMarcus>SleePy, linbot is supybot / gribble
20:20<AviMarcus>it's python and can do lots of stuff out of the box / easily
20:21<SleePy>AviMarcus, I know that :) I used to use supybot.
20:21<Obsidian|server>emberlabs/materia was the addon loading/metadata code originally. will likely reuse that for a bunch of web apps, for an addon framework
20:21<Obsidian|server>event dispatcher in openflame was originally in that project, and was ported out for general use...so was the dependency injector
20:22<Obsidian|server>ended up ripping out the symfony2 yaml component and replacing it with just json after I noticed the performance of their yaml parsing. Atrocious.
20:23<beckham>support request: could someone please reset my linode? i am 67.18.176.82, my username is either beckham or leftorium, and i have my cellphone on me for confirmation. the paper with my password on it is on the other side of the country from me right now.
20:23<Obsidian|server>in a web app, it ended up taking 30-40% page gen time.
20:23<SleePy>:|
20:24<beckham>sure, but not from my expected email address. :-/
20:26<SleePy>FYI, you shouldn't store passwords on things like paper, text documents, your hand, etc..
20:26<Darxus_>Just telnet into port 25 of their mail server and forger your from address :)
20:27<Obsidian|server>SleePy: paper is fine if it's stored in a safe, tbh
20:27<Darxus_>Fremont's back up.
20:27<SleePy>True, but still not the best place.
20:27<@Perihelion>Darxus_: Fwiw it was never down from our perspective. Did you get an MTR or traceroute?
20:28<dvgrhl>Darxus_: it went down?
20:28<Darxus_>http://xkcd.com/936/ - on passwords.
20:28<SleePy>Darxus_, It was never down.
20:28<rnowak>Fremont is always down in my heart
20:28<Darxus_>Perihelion: gige-gbge0.tserv3.fmt2.ipv6.he.net was the hop before my server, showing some loss. I still have the route if you're interested, but I hit reset since the loss stopped, and, well, it stopped.
20:29*SleePy wouldn't be here without freemont to bounce off of.
20:29<beckham>Darxus_: if my linode could establish a socket, i'd gladly telnet my way through. :)
20:29<Obsidian|server>SleePy: http://xkcd.com/538/
20:29<Darxus_>beckham: You don't have telnet on your phone?? :P
20:30<Darxus_>I wonder if there was an ipv6 specific outage, based on that host name.
20:30<SleePy>ipv6 didn't fail on me either.
20:30<beckham>Darxus_: no, i don't have a functioning mailserver.
20:31<SleePy>Obsidian|server: True, but they need my body first!
20:31<Darxus_>Huh.
20:31<rnowak>does the sun shine there SleePy?
20:32<Obsidian|server>SleePy: or family
20:33<Darxus_>And that reminds me of yet another xkcd.
20:33<SleePy>Anyways?
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20:54<beckham>in case anyone forgot... linode support is epically awesome! postmortem: i got pwned by the recent apache range vulnerability. cpu to 100%, network io and disk io to 0... keep those systems up to date, kids!
20:54-!-beckham [~43da75ee@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)]
20:54<bob2>yes
20:55<kyhwana>fail
20:57<SleePy>Nginx > Apache
20:57-!-blindwaves [~blindwave@bb219-74-61-65.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:57<bob2>don't encourage MTecknology
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21:02<MTecknology>bob2: i was not encouraged, in fact.. today i got into a fun debate about apache vs. nginx and it ended with me getting a job offer... that was enaugh fun for one day :P
21:03-!-onats [~onats@116.50.170.18] has joined #linode
21:04<Nivex>I wish I could pull that off with IPv6 :)
21:04<Solver>What is the the equivalent of a postfix transport map in sendmail
21:04<rnowak>god have mercy on those people
21:04<Solver>?
21:04<Solver>I thought it'd be mailertable but it doesn't seem to do per email address routing, only per domain
21:05*Solver hasn't done much sendmail in the last decade :)
21:05<rnowak>email, how very 1980
21:05<Solver>hahaha
21:05*Solver is stuck with sendmail on this box
21:05<bob2>HOW DO I DO PER ADDRESS ROUTING WITH EJABBERD
21:06<rnowak>just think it and erlang will do
21:06<Solver>yes yes one day I look forward to retiring smtp but that day hasn't arrived yet
21:06<Solver>:)
21:07-!-karstensrage [~karstensr@c-67-174-201-143.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #linode
21:11<chesty>wow, googles shutting down g+ and donating the code to apache. didn't take long
21:11<Nivex>say huh?
21:12<chesty>huh?
21:13<Nivex>precisely. how about [citation needed]
21:13<Solver>chesty: geez that was fast
21:13<Tappy>they did that with google wave
21:14<Tappy>http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/12/introducing-apache-wave.html
21:14<rnowak>chesty is from the future
21:17<MTecknology>any ideas how i could tab align columns in a text file?
21:17<MTecknology>seems like it should be really easy..
21:18<rnowak>padding, if you mean it should look nice visually, and not for reading in tabbed data
21:19<MTecknology>ya.. pad with tabs
21:20<rnowak>spaces are much nicer, but ok
21:22-!-boba [retrograde@what.is.meatspace.net] has quit [Quit: boba]
21:24*cafuego runs around with his hair on fire
21:24<chesty>kill the ginger
21:24-!-duckydan [~duckydan@97.218.100.97.cfl.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Bye!]
21:24<cafuego>farts in my hair, blue fire
21:25*kyhwana pours milk all over cafuego
21:25-!-boba [retrograde@what.is.meatspace.net] has joined #linode
21:27*MTecknology eats crispy cafuego
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21:36-!-Knight [~BOSS@snubby.user.oftc.net] has joined #linode
21:36<@Perihelion>Fedora 17 release name announced: it'll be called "Beefy Miracle". #Fedora #Linux
21:37<Nivex>there's been a group within the Fedora community trying for that for years. much amusement :)
21:37<MTecknology>that thing is still around?
21:38-!-json [~1b6efe66@chat.linode.com] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)]
21:38<MTecknology>wowzers :P
21:39<@Perihelion>Nivex: I know! It's so awesome.
21:45<MTecknology>How can I tell postfix to never send email to specific domains? like hotmail.com
21:46-!-Keyz [~Keyz@108-85-143-32.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #linode
21:46<MTecknology>I read that you can create a file with <domain><whitespace>REJECT\n and then in /etc/postfix/main.cf put smtpd_sender_restrictions = hash:/etc/postfix/access reject_unauth_destination = hash:/etc/postfix/access
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22:13<MTecknology>hmm........
22:13<MTecknology>I wonder if I can move /usr on top of a running system....
22:13<Obsidian|server>MTecknology: i tried this a while back; you have to send all mail through local smtp. using sendmail or mail won't do it
22:14<Obsidian|server>like, the sendmail/mail layers for postfix
22:14<MTecknology>Obsidian|server: :(
22:14<MTecknology>Obsidian|server: how much of a pain is it?
22:15<StevenK>For postfix, /usr/sbin/sendmail *is* postfix
22:15<Obsidian|server>MTecknology: enough of a pain that I said screw it and gave up, and went back to coding
22:16*Obsidian|server prefers coding over sysadmin-hackaging
22:16<MTecknology>I've been getting enough wiki spam that I do need to figure it out
22:16<Obsidian|server>MTecknology: http://stopforumspam.com/
22:16-!-Fieldy [gDelGTdAnh@li77-30.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:17<Obsidian|server>run submissions against SFS before allowing it to be submitted, disregard stuff that is heavily reported
22:17<MTecknology>i ran across that, mediawiki is hell to plug into
22:17<Obsidian|server>and anything that makes it past, get an API key and report them to the database so everyone else can benefit from the data
22:17<Obsidian|server>ah
22:17<MTecknology>i
22:18<Obsidian|server>j
22:18<MTecknology>i _should_ be making a plugin to do this but there's no possible way it's easier than making postfix work for me
22:19-!-triplei [~dank@205.250.46.50] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:19<MTecknology>StevenK: you happen to know how?
22:21<MTecknology>basically... this spam network has built a script to sign up for fake accounts, use a DEA, grob the verification link, novigate to it, log in, create a spam page
22:21<Obsidian|server>MTecknology: http://serverfault.com/questions/315263/refuse-to-send-email-to-specific-recipients-with-postfix
22:22<MTecknology>Obsidian|server: i love you
22:23<Obsidian|server>see, I'd asked this a while back on there
22:24<MTecknology>crap!
22:24<MTecknology>i passed to drunk to work on tech
22:25<MTecknology>Obsidian|server: i'll bookmark and read more- thanks!
22:27<MTecknology>does it make sense to put /usr on its own pantition?
22:27<Solver>not anymore imho
22:27<MTecknology>I was going to do that, and now I'm thinking that maybe it's a waste
22:28<Solver>it used to be common to mount /usr read-only and share it among many boxes but with modern packaging systems this doesn't work well
22:29<Solver>and besides disk is now much more plentiful then it once was
22:29<MTecknology>disk is scarce!
22:29<MTecknology>i only have 6GB after my raid setup
22:29<MTecknology>s/GB/TB/
22:29<Solver>hahaha
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23:03<kyhwana>wtf
23:03<kyhwana>http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/oct/11/pornography-internet-service-providers
23:03<kyhwana>Does this mean you won't be able to look at porn (or host it?) on a london linode?
23:03<kyhwana>And will have to VPN through one in the US?
23:04<dcraig>did you read the article?
23:05<kyhwana>Oh, only applies to the "four biggest ISPs"
23:05<praetorian>i like big butts and i couldnt lie
23:05<praetorian>or something.
23:05<kyhwana>I imagine all the rest of them will get a lot more subscribers if that goes through
23:06<Obsidian|server>why don't they just go the cheaper route and buy every child a WoW subscription
23:06<kyhwana>Then they can make them farm gold too
23:06<praetorian>or a football
23:06<kyhwana>win/win
23:06<praetorian>or maybe a rugby ball
23:06<praetorian>then england might not lose against france
23:06<praetorian>;p
23:07<Obsidian|server>praetorian: you forget; it's a nanny state. football, rugby is dangerous! they might get hurt!
23:08<kyhwana>Obsidian|server: nah, here it's "No saying rugby or advertising rugby or the RWC or trying to profit off it.. (Unless you're an official paid sponsors)"
23:08<kyhwana>If you try anything we'll fine the shit out of you and throw you in jail!
23:08-!-atula [~neobreed@c-24-63-134-156.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #linode
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23:13<Fieldy>Your Linode, linodexxxxx, has exceeded the notification threshold (10000) for disk io rate by averaging 22935.91 for the last 2 hours. fun. sometimes i wish i could set that higher (10000 is the max)
23:14<kyhwana>can't set it to 99999?
23:14<Fieldy>updating a large image gallery, pretty disk/cpu intensive
23:15<kyhwana>ahh
23:15<Fieldy>guess i'll just disable the notice for now cause I estimate 15+ hours
23:17<praetorian>Obsidian|server: haha :)
23:18-!-sivy [~sivy@ip98-167-222-209.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:18<G>hmmm did anyone else experience a moment of network funkyness at Dallas?
23:22<praetorian>notthat i saw.
23:22<praetorian>no funky town was involved.
23:23<G>hmmm okay
23:23*G puts it down to his own insanity
23:24<Solver>the two may not be mutually exclusive
23:24<avenj>yeah lack of funk over here too
23:25<Solver>you may be insane and there may also have been a brief network interruption :)
23:25<G>Solver: hmmmm I like the way you think :)
23:25<Solver>hahah
23:25<G>Solver: btw, long time no see, hows it going?
23:26<Solver>G: NZ still treating you well?
23:26<Solver>yeah pretty good. we're still in aus - will be for a few years yet
23:26<G>Solver: you were in Canada for a while iirc right?
23:26<Solver>bearly 8 years
23:26<Solver>*nearly
23:27<Solver>we'll go back one day. I quite liked living in a 'foreign' country. It's not really foreign anymore as I'm
23:27<Solver>canadian now :)
23:28<G>haha
23:28<Solver>I miss Toronto and Tim Hortons and kerbside hotdog stands
23:28<Solver>:)
23:28<G>heh just noticed one of Twitter's mail servers is called 'ham-cannon' :P
23:28<Solver>haha
23:28<G>Solver: in Re to NZ, yeah but I'm over Rugby
23:28<Solver>G: happy you went back to NZ?
23:29<G>makes me wish I could go to the GABBA and watch an AFL match :P
23:29<Solver>hahah
23:30<ajmitch>G: how could you not be excited about rugby every day?
23:30-!-cygnus [~cygnus@74-131-161-158.dhcp.insightbb.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:30<G>ajmitch: because I'm not that kinda guy ;)
23:30<kyhwana>G: Oh man, I've been over the RWC before it started
23:31<ajmitch>now that the pool games have finished, you can almost ignore it down here unless you look at a newspaper or TV :)
23:32*Solver feels rugby/afl is less in his face than when he lived in australia before
23:32<Solver>in contrast ice hockey is a religion in canada
23:32<G>seriously, I don't need/want to know about Dan Carter's crotch (which iirc both TV1/TV3 dedicated an entire 6pm news bulletin to), nor any of the other players
23:32<Solver>G: haha :)
23:32<G>kyhwana: I was 'over' RWC about a year prior, actually I think back in 2008 I was 'over' it
23:33<G>ajmitch: I must say I liked FOUR's advertising campaign
23:33<ajmitch>oh?
23:34<G>"The home of NOT Rugby" unfortunately they spoiled it by putting RWC ads, and ads for Rugby xbox/PS games directly after the slogan
23:34<ajmitch>heh
23:35<G>and thankfully TV2 isn't overrun by Rugby either
23:35*ajmitch doesn't bother with tv
23:35<G>Solver: btw, starting to like a Canadian TV show they are starting to show over here ;0
23:35<Fieldy>www.theonion.com/articles/area-man-constantly-mentioning-he-doesnt-own-a-tel,429/
23:35<ajmitch>though there are some shows that I watch online, hulu works for that
23:36<G>ajmitch: haha yeah
23:36<ajmitch>ssh tunnel + squid on linode is useful :)
23:37<G>ajmitch: I just use OpenVPN
23:37<kyhwana>ajmitch: I couldn't get hulu to work with just ssh tunnel, had to use openvpn
23:37<Fieldy>vpn here too, good stuf
23:37<G>OpenVPN + 'ip rule' = brilliant
23:37<Fieldy>my linode is my default gateway for everything at home
23:37<ajmitch>kyhwana: it works for me, I use ssh port forwarding to access squid
23:38<kyhwana>hmm
23:38<G>when I want to watch something on Hulu or something I just flick an ip rule entry in
23:38<G>and I wrote a DNS proxy to dynamically forward DNS requests based on the computers routing decision
23:38<ajmitch>that sounds like a little bit of overkill :)
23:38<G>which gets around Akamai's geo-DNS :)
23:38<kyhwana>ohh
23:39<G>ajmitch: it's only a ~20 line or so twistd script
23:39<Fieldy>sweet
23:39<G>and it works
23:39<G>Fieldy: the problem w/ default gateway via VPN, is anti-fraud scripts etc
23:39-!-bixgomez [~bixgomez@c-76-121-103-43.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #linode
23:40<Fieldy>I haven't had any issues in a year of full-time user
23:40<Fieldy>use
23:40<Fieldy>you have a good point though if you and the linode is far enough away, something can trigger and say "that ain't right"
23:40<Fieldy>particularly if in different countries
23:40<G>signed up for cloudfiles once when I had US traffic routed via a VPN while everywhere else was routed normallly, got the verification call from rackspace and they asked me if I was on holiday, took a few mins for the penny to drop
23:40<Fieldy>heh
23:41<Fieldy>yeah
23:41-!-agentbob [~dan@boxhosting.com] has joined #linode
23:41<Fieldy>my bank likes to try to force me to go to their georgia site (i'm in the atlanta datacenter) despite my bookmark going to the one for where I live (south carolina) but it gets the hint eventually
23:42<Fieldy>little google trick: if you're coming out somewhere in another country, it will try to force you to the google for the country it thinks you're in... if you visit www.google.com/ncr first, it won't do that (ncr = no country redirect)
23:42<bob2>get a proxy in the cloud
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23:44<G>Fieldy: actually I used to find that funny
23:44<G>at the time I was using a VPS in LA (which I'm migrating from back to Linode) and I used to find it funny the places google thought I was
23:44<G>for a while it tried to tell me I was in Chicago
23:44<Fieldy>heh
23:45<Fieldy>browse it using tor, refresh once in a while, you'll travel the world
23:45<Fieldy>"dang I didn't know they had google.ph!!"
23:45-!-arooni-mobile [~arooni-mo@189.166.134.102] has joined #linode
23:45<G>after Chicago, it settled on Seattle for a while (which is a place I wouldn't mind visiting) and then some random places all over the world
23:46<Fieldy>the fun one is to poke around google.cn, search for insults to various chinese leaders, magically: 0 results
23:47<G>the only problem, was when Googling for a shop location, it'd try and give me results for totally different companies in those locations
23:47<Fieldy>yeah it depends on the db they use and how often it's updated.. maxmind pretty much is the best, 95% accuracy for free version, 98% for pay
23:47<Fieldy>yep. it's curious to watch the changes when it thinks you're somewhere else
23:48-!-CompWizrd [compwiz@d24-57-202-59.home.cgocable.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:48<G>oh goodie, Google still have the 'swim/kayak' to US easter egg
23:48<Fieldy>heh yeah there are a few of those
23:48<Fieldy>san fran to tokyo, new york to london etc
23:49<G>"Kayak across the Pacific Ocean, Entering Washington"
23:50<Fieldy>hehe
23:50<Fieldy>!g the answer to life the universe and everything
23:50<Fieldy>guess not
23:51<G>I think the problem is, Google missed some logic in the directions search
23:51-!-kcfx [~kcfx@ppp-69-148-162-17.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net] has joined #linode
23:51<Obsidian|server>or perhaps it's that they have a sense of humor :)
23:51<pjbrunet>Fieldy, I'll have the answer for you at a moment infinitely distant in the future ;-)
23:51<Fieldy>it used to include something along the lines of "build a bridge" for san fran to hawaii
23:51<kcfx>Looking for someone who might know about Drupal 6 and Linode
23:52<Fieldy>doing a google search for "recursion" is cute too
23:52<G>specifying the address: 123 Brown St, QLD 4000, Australia, to 123 Other St, OtherSuburb it should assume that I'm wanting OtherSuburb in QLD Australia, not WA USA :)
23:52<Fieldy>hh
23:53<G>anyway, gotta go make some Pizza dough for dinner :)
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23:59<linbot>Point (0.50954624, 0.22786446) lies within the unit circle. Hits: 108304 of 137496 (π ≈ 3.150753476464770 - 0.009160822874977). http://π.hoopycat.com/
---Logclosed Tue Oct 11 00:00:20 2011