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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2003-08-27

---Logopened Wed Aug 27 00:00:21 2003
---Daychanged Wed Aug 27 2003
00:00<Captain_Murdoch>hardly ever watch LiveTV or real tv anymore. have a "buffer" of 60+ hours of stuff recorded that I can watch rather than having to sit through a commercial on real tv. :)
00:02-!-o_cee [~o_cee@h143n1c1o1029.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #mythtv
00:04<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: when will commercial skip get new features? like network logo detection? hehehe
00:06<Captain_Murdoch>that's what I'm working on right now. I have it pretty accurate. running a test on a copy of Peacemakers recorded off of USA network right now. logos don't start exactly at the start/end of a show segment though sometimes so I might just use this info to make the blank frame stuff more accurate by eliminating false positives. could make a new detection method that uses only logo for people who's stations are accurate, but I've s
00:06<Captain_Murdoch>hat aren't in my testing.
00:08<Captain_Murdoch>current code is doing pretty good at automatically detecting the logo (transparent or opaque) and I have to play with it more to see about color logos like VH1 uses. haven't tested VH1 but have recorded a few sample files to test
00:10<o_cee>Captain_Murdoch: would be great here in sweden as well, just give me a shout if you need testing or samples from over here :)
00:11<Captain_Murdoch>does blank frame work for you at all?
00:11<o_cee>haven't tried it alot, but no, it shouldn't.. it's not used in that way here at all
00:12<Captain_Murdoch>ok. how accurate are the logo start/stop points?
00:12<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: is any sort of sound detection ever used?
00:12<o_cee>it goes, as been discussed before for some EU country, to some standard mini movie logo thingie
00:12<Captain_Murdoch>linagee: not yet but that's one of the things on my list to look into.
00:12<o_cee>no fade to black at all
00:12<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: i would think audio levels would drop very very low for a few milliseconds in the black frames. :)
00:13<Captain_Murdoch>o_cee: yeah, the german clips I have use a mini-movie/clip type thing.
00:13<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: rather than just say, a quiet part in a movie
00:13<o_cee>Captain_Murdoch: just tell me if you need more samples or something.
00:14<Captain_Murdoch>linagee: well, the audio stuff would probably still use times to detect things like "this audio drop was 30 seconds from that audio drop and the relative volume inbetween them was higher than average so it might be a commercial"
00:14<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: right
00:14<Captain_Murdoch>o_cee, thanks. do you know how accurate the start/stop times for the station logos are?
00:14<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: you know, kick it up a notch in "high level"-ness, and you could even use some distributed stuff. :)
00:15<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: in other words, have a database of "FOX NETWORK" and then store when users have said that it's a commercial
00:15<linagee>:)
00:15<Captain_Murdoch>on the U.S. stations I'm testing on, they sometimes don't start the logo right away after a commercial and sometimes end it early (like a minute or more) before the next commercial, so logo detection by itself won't be as accurate here.
00:15<o_cee>Captain_Murdoch: it feels pretty accurate, but i haven't measured it.. it's like, you just have enough time to think "hey, time to take a break" when the logo dissapears and the comersials start.
00:15<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: oh wait, that might be a terrible bombshell and end-all to commercials. :)
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00:16<o_cee>i could take a closer look at it tonight to see how accurate it is
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00:16<Captain_Murdoch>o_cee: thanks. it appears pretty close on the samples I have but it may be a station specific thing. if it's accurate enough, I may make a "just logo detection" commercial detection option.
00:16<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: look for logo. if logo is found, go a few frames backward. if the frame did not change significantly, go backward to the previous black space. :)
00:17<o_cee>Captain_Murdoch: yepp, it might work. i'll look at it :)
00:17<Captain_Murdoch>linagee: most places that need logo detection don't have blank frames to begin with.
00:17<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: i've had a network logo appear on a black screen. possibly to throw off tivos and such. lol
00:17<Captain_Murdoch>linagee: could try to use the scene change detection.
00:18<mechou>I got a question regarding msec and a subdir under /var/log, and /etc/security/msec/perm.local
00:18<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: i've noticed that the whole commercial skipping in general doesn't work as well at decreased bit rates. :(
00:18<Captain_Murdoch>current code I'm working on tries to skip places where the logo will appear/disappear for a short period of time.
00:18<linagee>Captain_Murdoch: i think that would be expected though. just like OCR doesn't work as well at lower dpi
00:18<mechou>oops, wrong forum....
00:20<Captain_Murdoch>linagee: decreased meaning what? I'm using about 1900kbit/sec on 352x480 res
00:21* linagee watches "The OC"
00:36<Timon>"Days never finished; masta's got me workin; some day masta set me free"
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00:40<mdz>Chutt: ping
00:41<Timon>I'm having a hard time getting motivated to work on the next incarnation of the LCD stuff
00:44<Captain_Murdoch>mdz, can you scroll up and take a look at the question I asked Chutt about adding an option to allow subtitle or description to be empty when checking for dups rather than assuming non-dup if either is empty in scheduledrecording.cpp
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00:48<mdz>Captain_Murdoch: a global option?
00:48<Captain_Murdoch>nah, per recording.
00:49<Captain_Murdoch>I've got at least 3 shows where I fixup the sql nightly because the listings don't have subtitles but they do have descriptions for each episode.
00:49<mdz>as soon as I have a week or so to hack on mythtv, I want to implement an override system for changing parameters on a per-program basis
00:49<mdz>including suppressing and unsuppressing arbitrary programs which are scheduled to be recorded
00:49<Captain_Murdoch>I have a cron that copies the description to the subtitle if it's empty for those shows. runs after mythfilldatabase each night.
00:49<Captain_Murdoch>ok, so you think something like this could be part of that?
00:49<mdz>I have a program I record every day which has a description (which is always the same) but no subtitle
00:50<mdz>yeah, I think it would fit into it. I have just been talking about it for months and haven't done anything with it
00:50<Captain_Murdoch>Monster garage always has different descriptions but no subtitle so it's always unique. recorded 3 copies of each episode until I put the cron into place.
00:51<Captain_Murdoch>ok. I'll just keep using my cron for now since it may be moot at some point. :) advanced recording screen is cluttered enough right now until that's redesigned as well.
00:52<mdz>oh boy, another "usability review"
00:52<Captain_Murdoch>yeah.. lol
00:53<mdz>I was thinking today that it would be nice if viewscheduled would display a little indicator as to whether there is a bookmark for a particular recording
00:54<Captain_Murdoch>viewscheduled or playbackbox?
00:54<mdz>it'd mean adding another field to the backend communication stuff, so I wanted to ask chutt about it
00:54<mdz>er, playbackbox
00:54<mdz>hopefully there would not be bookmarks for anything in viewscheduled :-)
00:54<Captain_Murdoch>edit /usr/local/share/mythtv/ui.xml and search for commflag and uncomment that section and then go back into the playbackbox. what you want is already there.
00:55<Captain_Murdoch>can have pixmaps for bookmark, editing, commercial flagged, cutlist exists and one or two others I believe. I added that a while back and ran it by Chutt. no good pixmaps yet so it's commented out by default.
00:55<Captain_Murdoch>there are default pixmaps in the themes/default directory.
00:56<Captain_Murdoch>I have that section uncommented on my test and main frontend cause I like seeing those statuses.
00:56<Timon>Does anyone else have problems with the usb mouse driver randomly transmmitting mouse events that never happened?
00:57<Captain_Murdoch>mdz, that's the wrong filename I typed.
00:57<mdz>Captain_Murdoch: yeah, I don't have a ui.xml
00:57<mdz>Captain_Murdoch: excellent that you already did it though :-)
00:57<Captain_Murdoch>it's in themes/blue/ui.xml
00:57<Chutt>heh
00:58<Chutt>mdz, do you have 'aggressive sound buffering' turned on?
00:58<mdz>Chutt: no, I believe I tried it once and it just gave me some error about how it couldn't possibly work
00:58<Chutt>ah
00:58<Chutt>that fixes things on sblive cards
00:58<mdz>hmm, maybe I should try it again
00:58<Chutt>they've got abnormally large buffers, takes longer to clear out, so you get out of sync audio right after a change
01:00<mdz>er
01:00<mdz>where did that option go?
01:00<Chutt>setup -> general
01:01<mikegrb>mdz: just wanted to mention I just tried debian for the first time abt a week and a half ago and think it is great
01:01<mikegrb>:-)
01:01<Chutt>heh
01:01<mdz>I must be blind, but I don't see it
01:01<Chutt>not in tv options
01:01<mdz>mikegrb: heh, nice
01:02<Chutt>top level general section
01:02<mdz>ahh
01:02<Chutt>i couldn't get the via xfree driver to work in redhat 9
01:02<Chutt>so now i'm downloading rh8
01:02<mikegrb>yes
01:03<mikegrb>er sorry
01:03<Captain_Murdoch>mdz: if you see them you'll probably agree we need some less-cheesey pixmaps for those status images.
01:03<mechou>ok, I got a question regarding tuner affinity on multiple backends. Two shows record at the same time. One is 1 hr long, the other two hr. which program gets "assigned" to the "first" tuner in the DB?
01:03<Chutt>mechou, generally the one on the lower chanid
01:04<Chutt>that's 'first'
01:04<mdz>that seems to be better now
01:04<mdz>it's still out of sync for a short bit, but not as long
01:04<mechou>ok, thanks chutt.
01:04<Chutt>yeah
01:04<Chutt>mdz, and audio will stop sooner when you pause as well
01:04<mdz>Captain_Murdoch: I'd be fine if it just had a "B" or something
01:05<mdz>I'm not much for icons
01:05<Captain_Murdoch>I'm not much for drawing icons. :)
01:05<Captain_Murdoch>I figured it would/could probably be different in each theme so I didn't do much with it.
01:06<Chutt>no one knows about em, though
01:06<Captain_Murdoch>ought to enable it in cvs so someone will get sick of the stock ones and make some good ones. :)
01:06<Chutt>exactly
01:06<mdz>I agree
01:06<Chutt>damnit
01:06<Chutt>that's the _4th_ email i've gotten asking if i'd seen the pchdtv card
01:07<Captain_Murdoch>then I won't have to keep deleting that section from my diff file before copying over to my pristine cvs tree to commit. :)
01:07<Chutt>can't people read?
01:07<Captain_Murdoch>slashdot users? nahh
01:08<mdz>Captain_Murdoch: looks about like I thought it should be, thanks
01:08<mdz>I love it when that happens
01:09<Captain_Murdoch>the status icon code?
01:09<mdz>yes
01:10<Chutt>'hey, i should write X' 'oh, that's already in there'
01:10<Captain_Murdoch>ok. I was worried about hitting the db too much. on my system it's slow sometimes but I think that's because of my slow systems I'm running on. celeron 466 for main frontend and athlon 700 for main backend/db server.
01:10<Captain_Murdoch>once I scroll past an item the next time it displays faster.
01:11<Captain_Murdoch>I'll enable in cvs then.
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01:11<Chutt>oh, nifty
01:11<Chutt>more people 'contributing' with usability crap
01:12<mdz><mdz> oh boy, another "usability review"
01:13<mdz>also known as "whining"
01:13<Chutt>heh
01:14* linagee loves it in here
01:14<linagee>"feature bloat!" "bug fix!"
01:15<Chutt>someone was working on an email client
01:15<Chutt>that's the ultimate in feature bloat
01:15<linagee>Chutt: an email extension?
01:15<Chutt>yeah
01:15<linagee>Chutt: or an actual client? lol
01:16<Chutt>which, actually, a message center or whatnot wouldn't be too bad of an idea
01:16<Chutt>could be a place to collect notifications like 'you're out of space, delete stuff'
01:17* paulproteus thinks it was mikegrb, and points in his general direction
01:18<linagee>Chutt: or "your favorite episode of cooking with julia childs just got recorded"
01:18<linagee>LOL
01:18<Chutt>not saying it's a bad thing, but the whole 'every application eventually is able to read email' bit
01:18<linagee>Chutt: depends
01:19-!-tmk [~no@12-234-205-129.client.attbi.com] has joined #mythtv
01:19<Chutt>tmk, hi
01:19<linagee>Chutt: do you want mythtv to be a drop in for a "set top box thing"? maybe an email client would be a good thing to have from the tv
01:20<tmk>sup chutt
01:20<Chutt>linagee, isn't that what i really just said :p
01:23<Captain_Murdoch>tell the usability guys to go setup their own mailing list to discuss it and then they can document all their ideas and send back specs to the developers for the features they would like implemented. then we can promply ignore them.
01:24<Chutt>mdz, detecting and properly dealing with the backend going away is not even close to 'non-trivial' =)
01:25<tmk>chutt: is there a way to set some programs to record, but to delete when done (ie in case i want to watch live tv on them an i happen to be home?)
01:26<Captain_Murdoch>tmk: not really. no "auto-expire this program after X hours" type setting.
01:27<Captain_Murdoch>only auto-deletion of files is for low disk space right now.
01:27<tmk>i see
01:27<tmk>i was wondering if it could just record like NFL games or something
01:28<tmk>so it'd be pre-cached for me
01:28<tmk>if i wanted to watch them
01:28<tmk>but not to save them
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01:32<Captain_Murdoch>if the titles are always the same you could set it up to record anytime (or a timeslot) but keep only 1 episode and check the keep newest episode box.
01:32<Captain_Murdoch>that might work depending on the title/subtitle/description.
01:33<tmk>hmm
01:33<tmk>we'll see how my disk space goes
01:33<tmk>i may just keep them
01:33<tmk>and manually delete
01:33<Captain_Murdoch>on the advanced screen set max episodes to 1 and check "record newest episodes and delete oldest"
01:34<tmk>thx
01:34<Captain_Murdoch>yw.
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01:38<Primer>ahhh more people
01:38<Primer>Anyone using XvMC with mplayer or xine?
01:41<sc00p_>pardon my ignorance, but can mythweb stream tracks from mythmusic?
01:42<sc00p_>I haven't bothered to install it yet.
01:42<Captain_Murdoch>sc00p_: not yet
01:44<Captain_Murdoch>at least not that i know of. :)
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01:46<mechou>anybody here know much about devfs, and why /dev/v4l/video0 keeps changing ownership on me?
01:46<Captain_Murdoch>redhat?
01:47<mechou>no, mandrake
01:47<Captain_Murdoch>see if you have a /etc/security/console.perms file and check that.
01:47<mechou>but prolly close enough to redhat...
01:47<Captain_Murdoch>not sure if that applies to devfs or not.
01:48<mechou>I checked it, it says v4l belongs to root.sys
01:48<mechou>but depending who I log in as on vc/1, /dev/v4l/video0 changes to me.sys
01:50<mechou>which is a real drag if I want to run mythbackend as user mythtv
01:50<Captain_Murdoch>just change the permissions on each to group writeable for a group the mythtv user is in.
01:51<Captain_Murdoch>mine looks like this on my redhat 7.3 master backend: <console> 0666 <v4l> 0666 root.mythtv
01:52<Captain_Murdoch>and there's a mythtv group. probably should make those 0660 on my setup but I'm gonna rebuild soon anyway.
01:53<mechou>Captain_Murdoch, so you have mythtv (user) and mythtv group, or just mythtv group only?
01:53<Captain_Murdoch>both.
01:53<Captain_Murdoch>hand installed though, no packages or anything.
01:54<mechou>yeah, I just want to know the proper user.grp relationship....
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01:55<Captain_Murdoch>don't remember why I did it that way. this is my myth box I setup last november as a prototype/test and never got around to upgrading it since I put another tuner card in my workstation and run that as as occasional backend when I need it to record 2 shows.
01:55<mechou>Captain_Murdoch, what distro are you running?
01:56<Captain_Murdoch>redhat some and debian some. redhat on all my myth boxes
01:56<mechou>does your mythtv have a "system" uid, or "normal user" uid?
01:57<Captain_Murdoch>normal, 1002.
01:57<mechou>I think mandrake defines >=500 as normal user uid, <500 as system uid
01:58<Captain_Murdoch>shouldn't matter, nothing should be doing "if uid < 500 then allow whatever"
02:01<mechou>Captain_Murdoch, pls tell me what you think. on mandrake there is "video" group. cant I just make mythtv part of video group and change /dev/v4l to root.video? would'nt that make more sense?
02:02<Captain_Murdoch>probably as long as the permissions are group writeable on both permission settings in that file.
02:03<Captain_Murdoch>do a "man console.perms" for info on the fields.
02:08<mechou>Captain_Murdoch, do I need to reload anything once I change console.perms?
02:09<Captain_Murdoch>I think there is something you need to restart. check the manpage.
02:10<Captain_Murdoch>maybe not. I can't remember.
02:13<mechou>pam_console_apply
02:13<Captain_Murdoch>ah yeah, sounds familiar
02:21<mechou>Captain_Murdoch: do you run mythfrontend as user mythtv or as whoever's logged in to X?
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03:22<tmk>mech: yeah that's how i do it
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07:54<newman234>i am installing for the first time and am following the docs @ Mythtv.org.. when trying to launch the './setup' application for mythtv and am getting the following error "[root@localhost setup]# ./setup
07:54<newman234>./setup: error while loading shared libraries: libmyth-0.11.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
07:54<newman234>any ideas?
07:54<newman234>what i am doing wrong?
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07:57<choenig>newman234: try this? http://www.gossamer-threads.com/perl/mailarc/gforum.cgi?post=77490;search_string=ldconfig;guest=1077991&t=search_engine#77490
08:00<newman234>thanks... looking at it now
08:04<newman234>worked like a charm thanks man!
08:05<choenig>fine :-)
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10:39<newman234>when loading "irxevent &" i get the following message "irxevent: could not open config file
10:39<newman234>irxevent: No such file or directory
10:39<newman234>any ideas guys?
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11:32<bbeattie>Anyone know of someone getting mytthtv working in console?
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11:32<vektor>bbeattie: Can I ask why?
11:34<bbeattie>vektor console/directfb.. for mplayer directfb to work nicely into things
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11:36<Chutt>bbeattie, everything but video playback works with qt/e, and i imagine it also works with the qt/directfb port
11:37<vektor>Chutt: Hey, dude, I'm thinking of using some of your xmltv code.
11:37<Chutt>go for it
11:37<Chutt>that pulls in qt, though :p
11:37<vektor>ooh :(
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14:11<absurdhero>hello
14:11-!-choenig [~choenig@p50859DD9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #mythtv
14:11<absurdhero>is bbeattie around?
14:12<absurdhero>or anyone else with some HDTV knowledge?
14:16<absurdhero>Oh and I found a typo on the htpc howto. If someone could let bbeattie know, that would be great. At the bottom of the htpc software page, he wrote transooder instead of transcoder.
14:17<vektor>Yeah, there's more than just typos :)
14:17<vektor>I'm still going through like page-by-page with him :)
14:17<absurdhero>lol
14:17* vektor wonders if he'll slap me when he wakes up :)
14:17<absurdhero>do you know anything about HD?
14:18<vektor>Like, HDTV?
14:18<absurdhero>im trying to figure out how Im going to plug in a DirecTV signal into the pcHDTV card
14:18<vektor>I know random things but am by no means an expert.
14:18<vektor>Oh, I wouldn't know anything that specific.
14:18<absurdhero>I have to go through DTVs box, and it I dont think it has a coaxial output
14:18<absurdhero>i wish the pcHDTV card had a component input :(
14:19<absurdhero>so, I don't know how anyone is supposed to use this card for real TV watching =/
14:19<absurdhero>I'm going to go see if it happens to have coax out right now. its so hard to get back behind ye ol media center boxen. you know how it is im sure
14:20<tmk>sup vektor
14:20* absurdhero goes to wrestle with the media center wiring
14:21<vektor>yo yo sup tmk
14:21<vektor>tmk: my pvr-250 has been idle in my box for like months now :)
14:21<vektor>i suck ass :)
14:21<vektor>(or school does, one of those two)
14:22<tmk>hehe
14:22<absurdhero>lol
14:22<absurdhero>ok Im back. I actually found the manuals for the equipment :o
14:22<tmk>vektor: mine's finalyl getting use
14:22<tmk>and so i'm developing less, watchign more
14:22<vektor>haha
14:23<tmk>and typing poorly
14:23<vektor>i'm like rushing to finish my thesis
14:23<vektor>and then decide wtf to do next
14:23<vektor>damn life
14:23<absurdhero>cool. I'm still debating whether I should take the plunge and buy mass ammounts of hardware in a gamble to see if it will work right
14:23<vektor>absurdhero: it likely won't
14:23<vektor>but that's ok cause haxoring is phun phun phun
14:24<absurdhero>yup, I've never had a linux based project work right for the first couple years of hacking
14:24<absurdhero>but once it works, it works well
14:25<absurdhero>hey, the hd receiver has a coax out! I can hook it up to the pcHDTV card. But the manual says that coax is poor quality
14:27<absurdhero>nevermind, can't do that for HD
14:27<vektor>You sure the coax is for HD?
14:27<vektor>Yeah.
14:27<bline>vektor: I was looking for you the other day
14:27<Chutt>the pchdtv card is an over-the-air tuner card.
14:27<absurdhero>so, why does pcHDTV have coax connectors?
14:27<vektor>bline: Sorry.
14:27<absurdhero>ahh I see
14:27<tmk>cause that's what antennas provide
14:28<bline>vektor: do you know a term I can search for that describes how the tv's picture shrinks when the image displayed is dark
14:28<absurdhero>hmm that could be useful, especially if it had component and coax. Now I am stuck
14:28<Chutt>how would it having component in work?
14:28<Chutt>it's not a hardware compressor
14:28<vektor>bline: I'm pretty sure there is a term.
14:28<absurdhero>huh?
14:29<bline>I'm just gathering information
14:29<vektor>It has to do with some TVs that use the average brightness of the scanline somehow to affect the sync.
14:29<vektor>bline: I'm not sure it's part of the signal.
14:29<absurdhero>*shrug* my HD receiver has component out for HD. So if it had component in, that would be very convenient
14:29<vektor>I'll look it up for you later.
14:29<bbeattie>If you want a HD capture card, you need one that supports DVI-I/D and you can capture HD from a HD cable tuner box. The pcHDTV card is for OTA (Over the air) broadcast HDTV only.
14:29<bline>vektor: thanks
14:29* vektor gone for a bit
14:29<absurdhero>ah bbeattie you are here. good
14:30<Chutt>absurdhero, there are _no_ capture cards with component in capable of capturing raw hdtv
14:30<absurdhero>my HD box only has component out
14:30<absurdhero>alright, so how can I do it?
14:30<absurdhero>converter?
14:30<Chutt>what bbeattie just said.
14:30* bbeattie nods to chutt
14:31* tmk nods to both
14:31<bbeattie>;)
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14:31<absurdhero>I think I'm missing something. How can I capture DVI if I don't have any DVI out?
14:31<absurdhero>You are saying I can't?
14:31<Chutt>exactly.
14:32<absurdhero>hrm. damn. there goes the PVR idea :(
14:32<bbeattie>absurdero: DVI-I has component built into the design, so you can use a component<->DVI-I cable, so you also support future DVI-D if your HD cable box gets that. Next thing is being able to save the signal, but I don't know if that can be done currently or who/what group may be working on it
14:33<Chutt>bbeattie, but you'd have to compress in software with that, and i really don't think much stuff'll be able of compressing a full hdtv signal in software =)
14:33<absurdhero>bah! thats what I just said and I got chewed out
14:33<bbeattie>Chutt: not unless there is a hardware card to do so, which I don't know of one.
14:34<Chutt>nothing cheap that i'm aware of
14:34<bbeattie>I'm sure there is a capture card that can do that.. Right, probably not cheap, but broadcasters should have cards.. $2k a pop maybe.
14:35<absurdhero>hmm so currently, with the pcHDTV you cannot save to a hard disk? only stream through to the display?
14:35<bbeattie>absurdhero: spelling error corrected, thank you for finding and reporting it.
14:35<absurdhero>np
14:35<bbeattie>you can pipe it to display directly using xine, or save it to disk and view it, such as mythtv does
14:35<Chutt>absurdhero, um, the pchdtv card takes a mpeg2 stream from an over-the-air broadcast, and lets you do anything you want with it.
14:36<bbeattie>the pcHDTV card gives you a /dev/dtv device to stream mpeg2-ts for a channel from. You can do almost anything with it at that point.
14:36<absurdhero>oh good
14:37<absurdhero>oh you were talking about DVI?
14:37<bbeattie>because that's going to be probably the only way to capture HD from a HD cable box.. by using DVI-I or DVI-D.
14:37<absurdhero>hmm either way, unless I do something illegal like putting my DirecTV card into my computer and descrambling the signal, there isn't much I can do
14:38<bbeattie>right
14:38<absurdhero>damned laws
14:38<bbeattie>and there was a huge crackdown on that.
14:38<absurdhero>why I can't I have any friggin fair use rights?
14:38<absurdhero>so I heard
14:38<bbeattie>and I'm sure directTV would not like to know you can save their channels/programs
14:39<absurdhero>they promote the TiVo..
14:39<bbeattie>odd, true, well, Tivo will come out with a HD version something around november so I've heard, and I'm guessing they're developing their own HD support, as they arn't using the pcHDTV card, or I'd know.
14:40<absurdhero>I wonder how its going to hook up to the HD boxen
14:40<bbeattie>Several people have been working on fusion support behind closed doors. .. I need to find out how directTV Tivo's work...
14:41<Chutt>bbeattie, it's just built into the directv receiver
14:41<bbeattie>My guess is directTV and TV are working on a special card for receiving their HD.
14:41<bbeattie>does direcTV use linux in it's receiver box?
14:47<absurdhero>I was dreaming about HD capture cards all night
14:47<absurdhero>I guess thats what happens when you go to bed late after reading 90 MythTV mailing list messages
14:48<bbeattie>absurdhero: if it's some sort of consolation, DTV had 4 or 5 HD channels last I knew of. Most areas get 8-12, unless you're outside a good size city.
14:48<absurdhero>ya, we have DTV's HD right now
14:48<bbeattie>$10 a month for how many channels?
14:48<absurdhero>I am very disappointed. But it should get better in the near future
14:48<absurdhero>they already added a few just this past month
14:49<absurdhero>and they raised the prices for HD >:(
14:49<absurdhero>but there is no Digital cable avaliable in this area
14:49<absurdhero>so we are stuck
14:49<bbeattie>My opinion is I'll never get anything that requires a proprietary setop box. I want it over every cable in my home and to every TV.
14:50<bbeattie>I only get OTA now
14:51<absurdhero>cool. Direct doesn't provide the local stations or the big national ones in HD
14:51<absurdhero>even though the stations do support it
14:51<absurdhero>I could kick them
14:52<Chutt>tmk, hey
14:52<Chutt>does the pvr-250 have an audio line out?
14:53<absurdhero>I need to find out if I can get HD over the air where I am
14:54<absurdhero>that would be much more useful than DirecTV for HD
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14:56<bbeattie>www.antennaweb.org
14:56<bbeattie>go there, find out if you can get HD
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14:58<n1hck>user
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15:01<absurdhero>oh cool bbeattie, Im checking it out
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15:01<cats>help
15:01<absurdhero>whats up?
15:02<cats>lol I mean "/help" not help
15:02<cats>my bad'
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15:07<bbeattie>n1hck: do you need something?
15:07<absurdhero>well, i cant use a small antenna, but I can get a digital signal
15:08<bbeattie>what is your zipcode?
15:08<bbeattie>abs:?
15:10<absurdhero>95762
15:11<tmk>no not pvr250
15:11<tmk>only 350
15:12<absurdhero>woah when I put in my full address it show s me as having more options
15:12<absurdhero>I can use a medium multi-directional for two of the stations
15:12<absurdhero>sweet
15:12<absurdhero>and I can get pretty much everything around with a large multi
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15:42<mechou>hey choenig, you there??
15:43<choenig>ya
15:43<mechou>did you ever use nvram-wake?
15:43<choenig>yes, but not the current version
15:44<mechou>did you recall having to load rtc, mem, and nvram modules?
15:44<choenig>yes, I did
15:46<choenig>had to recompile my kernel for that
15:46<mechou>I have rtc and nvram (loaded), but what's mem? Is it part of the "stock" kernel?
15:46<choenig>I don't know. I only needed rtc and nvram, never heard of mem
15:46<choenig>but that other wakeuptool uses mem, too, right?
15:48<mechou>ok, in nvram doc they mention mem (now). I haven't looked very carefully at the other w/u tool since it only supports three board out of the box....
15:48<mechou>s/board/boards
15:49<choenig>in the docs they don't describe, where you find it?
15:49<mechou>inside the readme in the d'l tarball....
15:51<mechou>actuall, I take it back. Apparently mem is a device file /dev/mem, if you have rtc loaded, I guess it gets created atomatically. Never mind....
15:51<choenig>:)
15:52<mechou>sorry about the confusion....
15:53<mechou>you'd probably be happy to know I'm about to test the patched code. (No longer running BE as root)
15:54<mechou>at least now BE starts w/o problems....
15:54<mechou>DB or directory....
15:54<choenig>I really don't know, how that DB stuff can be related to that file
15:55<mechou>nfslock?
15:55<mechou>or mysql.txt?
15:55<choenig>the nfslock one
15:55<mechou>could be....
15:55<mechou>not sure who "owns" that problem....
15:56<choenig>I changed that warning a bit and will send in the patch with some other minor things some times
15:58<mechou>POS ecs k7s5a wol doesn't even work with a separate PCI NIC that supports wol. I really don't get it. nvram wake works, k/b works on it, just not wol
15:59<mechou>that's good to hear (patch)
15:59<choenig>doesn't it wakeup, when you short circuit two of the three WOL pins?
16:00<choenig>and, are you sure you're using the ether-wake correctly? (I had problems until I send my wol massages to bcast address .255)
16:00<mechou>hmm, now that's an interesting idea. Do know which two pins? (I'm assuming they ought to be adjacent, so only two possibilities, right?
16:01<choenig>think so
16:01<mechou>ether-wake wakes up all my other systems.....
16:01<choenig>ok
16:03<mechou>I send wol packet to k7s5a, system won't start again, unless you unplug the power suppy cord, and plug it back in again....
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16:03<mechou>funkiest behavior I've ever seen.....
16:04<mechou>more like wake-on-unlug (wou) :)
16:04<choenig>hehe
16:05<choenig>maybe its your power sup.
16:06<mechou>naw, tried with a differnt power supply, plus that would explain why nvram and k/b wake works correctly....
16:06<mechou>s/would/would't
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16:08<mechou>choenig, are u a hw-oriented person, are ther any pull-up esistors on the board or anything that I ought to check?
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16:08<choenig>I don't know, sorry
16:08<mechou>ok, just checking...
16:10<choenig>but, waking it up using the nvram stuff is the better sollution then using wol. hope your board doesn't need a restart to use the new bios wakeup settings
16:11<sfr>choenig: hi, got a link for this nvram wakeup stuff?
16:11<choenig>if you want to short the pins, you have to short the outer two pins
16:11<choenig>sfr, sure http://sourceforge.net/projects/nvram-wakeup
16:12<mechou>hmm, where did you find that iut?
16:12<mechou>s/iut/out
16:12<choenig>mechou: http://www.spettel.de/lanstart/wol_conn.html
16:12<mechou>cool, thx
16:14<choenig>sfr: the other one is http://www.malloc.de/tools/wakeup_clock.html but this one only supports a handful boards
16:14<sfr>choenig: thanks
16:14<choenig>null problemo ;-)
16:14<mechou>hmm, if I use a multimeter I should be able to measure >=600mA betweens pins 1 and 2 onhis diagram, right?
16:15<choenig>mechou: you 'should'
16:16<mechou>ok, brb, I'm going to try shorting the pins and see what happens.
16:17<mechou>actually, in theory, I need to enable WOL in BOIS before I try shorting the pins, I suppose?
16:18<mechou>s/BOIS/BIOS
16:19<choenig>of course
16:19<choenig>if its disabled, it will not work either way
16:23<choenig>mechou: and for that interactive shutdown behaviour you can use 'shutdown -t' and 'shutdown -c'
16:34<mechou>choenig, you still there?
16:34<choenig>japp
16:34<mechou>guess what? I think the pins are wired wrong.
16:34<choenig>oh?
16:35<mechou>shorting 1&3, same behavior as before. 1&2 woke up!
16:35<choenig>maybe you should check the board docs
16:36<mechou>at least now I know what's wrong, and can take steps to fix
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16:40<choenig>seems you're not the only one having problems with wol./.k7s5a
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16:44<mechou>choenig, you're a lifesafer!
16:44<choenig>I am? why
16:45<mechou>cause you gave me a way to solve wol prob
16:45<choenig>maybe you should check this, too http://ahh.sourceforge.net/wol/faq.html
16:46<mechou>hmm, that's interesting too. WOL didn't work in windows for me, even....
16:48<mechou>and I'm using tulip. But I'll give eth a try before "rewiring" my wol cable.....
16:49<sfr>mechou: one question, your wol cable is just a one-to-one cable from the nic to the mainboard?
16:49<choenig>auf der uebersichtsseite
16:49<choenig>arg
16:50<choenig>wrong one
16:50<mechou>yeah, a cable with white connectors on each end, consisting of rgr,bl wires...
16:50<mechou>yeah, a cable with white connectors on each end, consisting of r,gr,bl wires...
16:50<sfr>mechou ok
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17:17<choenig>so, bett time, mechou, good luck with your stuff, cu
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18:20<newman234>hey guys where can i ask questions specifially about lircd or more precisely irxevent?
---Logclosed Wed Aug 27 18:24:28 2003
---Logopened Wed Aug 27 18:37:00 2003
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19:01<mattfelsen>woooo i finally got lirc working!
19:01<mattfelsen>although i did a clean install so now i need to redo everything else
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19:08<mattfelsen>we should come up with a list of dependency abc's
19:08<mattfelsen>alsa, bttv, cron...
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19:14<mattfelsen>would adding the mythtv user (which both back & frontend run as) to the audio & video groups give it the proper permissions for the devices on debian?
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20:15<mattfelsen>eh sorry about that...
20:15<mattfelsen>not that it was interrupting anything...
20:16<mattfelsen>except the peace, i guess
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20:50<phar0e>Howdy
20:52<mattfelsen>hi
20:54<phar0e>does anyone here use Gentoo linux here?
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21:01<mattfelsen>i don't
21:03<phar0e>yeah, I am thinking it is mostly hype
21:03<phar0e>so I might just go with Debian this time around
21:03<phar0e>(got some new hardware) :))
21:03<mattfelsen>what needs to be running for remote controls to work? i have lircd running and nothing is happening
21:04<mattfelsen>i thought that irxevent wasn't necessary anymroe
21:04<mattfelsen>i'm using debian
21:04<mattfelsen>starting with a clean installation, it took me only a few hours to get myth up
21:04-!-keturn [~kevin@130-94-161-17-dsl.hevanet.com] has joined #mythtv
21:04<mattfelsen>(ie, i did this a few hours ago) :)
21:05<phar0e>dunno about remote controls, I like keyboard since I watch MythTV on computer anyways
21:05<phar0e>I think they use lirc though? not sure
21:05<mattfelsen>yea
21:06<phar0e>you use unstable or the release?
21:09<phar0e>I think I will go with stable even though it is nearly a year old
21:19<mattfelsen>i'm using testing
21:23<mattfelsen>hm
21:23<mattfelsen>looks like irxevent does have to be running
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21:55<Chutt>hrm
21:56<Chutt>never got a reply from the guy that said i should be using sourceforge more for PR reasons
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21:57<mikegrb>sourceforge sucks.... shouldn't be using sourceforge for pr reasons... a project looks better if it can secure it's own hosting
21:59<chinande>IMO, being listed on Freshmeat.net is more important than SF
21:59* mikegrb seconds that
22:35-!-CaCtus491 [~kent@CPE-144-137-127-52.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #mythtv
22:36<CaCtus491>hello
22:36-!-RippNB [~ripp@hiper30-ppp220.chouteautel.com] has joined #mythtv
22:36<CaCtus491>man this channel is hard to find :)
22:37-!-courtlr [~trillian@66.52.240.135] has joined #mythtv
22:37<courtlr>does anybody have the x10 rf remote?
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22:39<mikegrb>courtlr:
22:39<mikegrb>er yes
22:39<mikegrb>have a question
22:40<courtlr>Do you know what the default code is for the "PC" button, I can't get it set back to the default. I even took the batteries out for an hour
22:40<mikegrb>oh... no I sure don't
22:41<mikegrb>does it have one of those modes to show you the code programmed to a function key by flashing lights?
22:41<courtlr>yeah, but I changed the code and I can't get it back
22:41<mikegrb>well I could do that to get the code on mine <g>
22:44<courtlr>You press and hold setup until it stays on, then press "pc", then setup, and then you go through the numbers one by one and when it flashs that is the first number and the second flash is the second, and so on
22:47<mikegrb>hmmm it's not flash just staying on solid after I hit setup the 2nd time
22:47<mikegrb>have you tried all 0's?
22:48<courtlr>it should stay on after the second time you press "setup" until you hit the right number for the first digit, and then second and then after the thrid digit it should turn off
22:49<mikegrb>oh I see
22:50<mikegrb>looks like 013
22:51<courtlr>I must have broken mine then, stupid X10 crap
22:52<courtlr>Thanks mikegrb
22:52<CaCtus491>hey, is anyone actively working on mythgallery?
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23:06<Chutt>cactus491, not really.
23:07<CaCtus491>I'm considering a web based front end for it...
23:07<CaCtus491>also, does mythweather support anywhere outside the US?
23:10<Chutt>yes.
23:12<CaCtus491>cool, Australia? :)
23:13<Chutt>try it and see.
23:17<CaCtus491>hmm, a quick search on the mailing list looks promising...
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23:23<mikegrb>Chutt: what was the irc nick of the guy who did the new lcd stuff?
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23:57-!-Irssi: #mythtv: Total of 38 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 38 normal]
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23:58<mrallen>hello
23:59<mrallen>jumping in, under rh9, got xmltv and other dependencies installed
23:59<mrallen>./configure in mythtv-0.11 works but make fails immediately with ...
---Logclosed Thu Aug 28 00:00:25 2003