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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2003-10-30

---Logopened Thu Oct 30 00:00:35 2003
00:06-!-robertj [~robertj@c-24-98-81-170.atl.client2.attbi.com] has joined #Mythtv
00:07<robertj>hey all, does anyone here have a vi82xx based card?
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00:36<robertj>and sid debs are still .11?
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01:02<Chutt>yes
01:03<robertj>hrmm compile is complaining that extradata is already defined in dialogbox.o
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01:13<Urgo>anyone else having a problem with 0.12 and generating thumbnails? Mine will not create the thumbnails anymore
01:14<Chutt>nope.
01:14<Urgo>hmm
01:14<Urgo>mine hasn't generated a png file since oct 21st
01:15<robertj>Chutt: are these already defined errors standard fare? did I miss something?
01:16<Chutt>robertj, um, well, without you pasting in the actual error, i have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about
01:21<robertj>hrm its breaking somewhere before that
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01:32<robertj>it cant find the stuff in /usr/includes/qt3
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01:48<hadees>robertj: is your qt dir set correctly?
01:48<hadees>the docs say /usr/includes/qt3 but your qt might be in another dir similar
01:48<hadees>like /usr/includes/qt3-1 or somthing etc, i don't remember exaclty what mine was
01:48<hadees>but it is easy enough to look in the dir and find out
01:48<sfr>'robertj has quit '
01:49<hadees>i notice, my ethernet cord came loose i typed that before i saw he left
01:49<hadees>oh well free information
01:51<hadees>i learned all kinds of cool things about mythtv but i can't seem to learn what i need to know, like why my irman isn't working
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02:09* o_cee is back (gone 07:54:53)
02:09<o_cee>weh, i got permission to use the icons, meaning i can release the theme when i'm done.
02:14<o_cee>Chutt: wouldn't it be better to seperate the translation stuff that's in the theme files now to a seperate file that all themes can use? pain in the ass to keep it updated now :/
02:15<Chutt>sure, figure out how to do that and still let theme authors customize the text
02:15<o_cee>question is if that'd be necesarry.. but yeah, that's the negative part if it'd be done that way
02:16-!-phar0e [phar0e@cpe-24-24-236-156.socal.rr.com] has joined #mythtv
02:16<phar0e>Hello
02:18<o_cee>maybe move out the translation and make it optional to specify text, that way, if there's text in the theme, it overrides the standard text..
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02:21<o_cee>second question, it's only possible to do <titles> with images, right? it's not possible to have a set of different texts?
02:22<Chutt>believe so
02:22<o_cee>okay.. now all titles will be in english.. :/ guess it's the same with visor..
02:23<o_cee>and uhm.. did you see sfr's suggestion about a different background on the setup screen to make it more obvious that you're in the setup?
02:24<Chutt>i'll accept anything with the proper patch =)
02:24<o_cee>heh, okay :)
02:24<phar0e>If my digital cable box has a serial connector on it and usb, could I use one of those connectors to tune it with MythTV? If so, how? I understand how lirc works with infrared, but what about over serial/USB ports?
02:25<o_cee>look at the contrib dir
02:30<o_cee>what did you think about the theme anyway Chutt? i saw your ip in the log :)
02:30<o_cee>maybe i need to get a myth logo in there as well somewhere
02:30<Chutt>looked ok, from what i saw
02:31<Chutt>how custom are you planning on doing the other stuff, though?
02:32<o_cee>wich stuff do you mean?
02:32<Chutt>the non-menu screens
02:33<o_cee>oh. haven't started looking at it yet, but i'll start without chaning anything there i guess.
02:33<o_cee>i think those are good, not sure i'd be able to to it better myself
02:34<Chutt>bah
02:34<Chutt>i don't like that kind of 'theming'
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02:35<o_cee>have to start somewhere.
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02:36<o_cee>plus i feel to current look of it works as it should.. but sure, if i can come up with something nice, i'll do it ;)
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02:39<o_cee>joining two patches into on is just done with >> ?
02:40<Chutt>probably shouldn't do that.
02:41<o_cee>then i'll do two files..
02:42<o_cee>this patch might (will) break other themes.. hmm :\
02:43<o_cee>but, people running cvs should be able to fix it ;)
02:47<o_cee>patches send.
02:49<o_cee>blue as background is so common.. grey is to dull.. all reddish doesn't look good on a tv.. yellow/white is to bright.. maybe green. not sure what background to use
02:50<Chutt>dark green, or a textured grey looks nice
02:51<o_cee>yeah.. i'll have to go hunt
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02:55<o_cee>oh, that mail to the list didn't take 12 hours like it use to
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07:08<o_cee>what textcolors can i use? only the 19 predefined QColor objects? guess i could use RGB as well
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07:10<o_c>hmm
07:11<o_c>found a really nice grey background.. will try it out tonight and see how it feels after some use
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10:29<Tack_>If I may ask an opinion -- what will yield the best tv output quality of the two: the Matrox G400 (which I understand has very good tv-out) or ADS TV Elite XGA? Are there other options around the same price range?
10:39<Chutt>wintv pvr-350. :p
10:43<Tack_>I was afraid you'd say that, since I just bought a 250 :)
10:43<Tack_>Can I use mplayer with the 350 for tv-out?
10:43<Chutt>i can only tell it's compressed video if i'm right next to the screen
10:43<Chutt>only thing that supports the 350 decoder so far is mythtv
10:44<Chutt>if your machine's fast enough, you can just use it as a generic framebuffer for video display, though
10:44<Tack_>With high quality video I don't see the compression artifacting, it's mostly just that things look muddy and there must be sync issues as panning is quite jerky.
10:44<Tack_>(When using tv-out)
10:44<Chutt>right
10:44<Chutt>none of that exists with the -350 =)
10:45<Tack_>Most of my video output is done with mplayer, alas. :)
10:45<Chutt>i don't touch that stuff, so =)
10:47<Tack_>I'm torn. I could return the 250 and get a 350, but I'd not be able to use the decoder until mplayer supported it.
10:47<Chutt>I notice this in the code: "NuppelVideoPlayer *nvp = new
10:47<Chutt>NuppelVideoPlayer(db, pginfo);" yet the "nuppeldecoder.*" files are
10:47<Chutt>nowhere to be found post install, only in the install directory.
10:48<Chutt>is this guy really asking why it's not installing source files after compilation?
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11:11<Snow-Man>Chutt: MythTV can output to a wintv card now?
11:11<Snow-Man>Wel, pvr-350, more specifically.
11:12<Chutt>yup
11:12<Snow-Man>That one has an encoder too, no?
11:12<Snow-Man>And mythtv can use that?
11:12<Chutt>yup
11:12<Snow-Man>Hmmmm.
11:13<Snow-Man>I'd be screwed if I wanted to use mythvideo, eh?
11:13<Chutt>for a while, yeah
11:14<Snow-Man>Hmmm.
11:14<Chutt>and you have to hook your audio up with a couple y adapters to use mythmusic
11:14<Chutt>but the video playback quality is damn near perfect
11:14<Snow-Man>What's the output type?
11:14<Chutt>composite / svideo
11:14<Tack_>My audio out is digital, so that causes an extra problem for me. I'd need to use another input on my receiver.
11:15<Snow-Man>Hmm, I'd still need a VCR to go to coax, but that's not all *that* big a deal I suppose.
11:15<Chutt>i use a real dvd player for movies, and i don't anticipate changing that ever
11:15<Snow-Man>I'd rather use mythvideo for dvd playing, personally.
11:16<Tack_>What about the mythical convergence? :)
11:16<Snow-Man>haha.
11:16<Tack_>One box that does everything. :)
11:16<Snow-Man>Blah. How do I know which WinTV card is the PVR-350?
11:16<Chutt>that's the name of it
11:16<Tack_>It says "PVR-350" :)
11:17<Snow-Man>Well, none of the ones at microcenter.com say anything along those lines. :/
11:17<Chutt>it's a) huge and b) gets really, really warm
11:17<Chutt>it's not widely available
11:17<Chutt>probably because it's pretty expensive
11:17<Snow-Man>Oh, that sucks.
11:17<Chutt>mine was free, so =)
11:17<Snow-Man>Bastard! :)
11:17<Snow-Man>Who got it for you?
11:17<Chutt>hauppauge
11:17<Tack_>I wonder if there's a video card with tv-out or an external box that will do VGA->SVideo that will come close to the quality of tv-out on the PVR-350. That'd be my ideal solution.
11:17<Snow-Man>God damn you suck. :)
11:18<Snow-Man>Hrm, $176 doesn't seem *that* bad.
11:18<Chutt>no, it's not, really
11:18<Chutt>considering that and a cheap motherboard/cpu/tiny amount of ram gets you a fully working system
11:18<Snow-Man>Not even that many places on pricewatch selling it tho.
11:18<Snow-Man>See, now that shit would be *very* nice for me. :)
11:18<Chutt>it actually makes my mini-itx useable
11:18<Snow-Man>Since I could slap it in phoenix.
11:25<Snow-Man>So, I'm guessing there are some people working on getting mplayer or whatever working with the pvr-350, no?
11:26<Chutt>not at the moment, no
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11:27<Snow-Man>Oh, I thought that "for a while" thing meant work was in progress.
11:27<Snow-Man>I'm guessing it probably wouldn't be able to directly playback DVDs..?
11:28<Snow-Man>Using the hardware decoder that is.
11:28<Chutt>i dunno
11:28<Snow-Man>Hrm.
11:28<Chutt>i've not tried
11:28<Chutt>but it only has the stereo audio out, i'm not sure if you could pull out anything but that
11:29<Snow-Man>Ah, damn, that's a good point.
11:29<Tack_>Yeah, that's the biggest problem for me since all my audio is digital out.
11:29<Snow-Man>I could probably live with just stereo out in the near-term but eventually I'd want something nicer.
11:32<m0j0>MythMusic audio still comes out of the soundcard, correct?
11:33<Chutt>yup
11:34<Snow-Man>You know, I wouldn't think it'd be that difficult to test if the pvr-350 could play back ripped DVDs.
11:35<Snow-Man>Those MythTV files aren't much more than a header followed by an MPEG stream, are they? :)
11:35<m0j0>So, if I got a 350, I could probably feed audio out from that back into my soundcard and continue using my current setup
11:36<Snow-Man>If you had a receiver you could probably have MythVideo stuff play back on one channel and the pvr-350 on the other too.
11:36<Snow-Man>That requires X and that whole shit though, of course.
11:37<Snow-Man>Chutt: With a pvr-350 and just mythtv you can get away w/o X at all, right?
11:37<Chutt>doesn't hurt to run x
11:37<Tack_>m0j0: Good point, although I haven't been able to make line-in passthrough work with my digital output setup.,
11:37<Snow-Man>pah. :P
11:37<Chutt>lightweight wm
11:38<Snow-Man>Tack_: You might not be able to, it might not convert from analog to digital..
11:38<Chutt>and you can do cool transparency stuff with the video
11:39<Chutt>yay, it didn't oops on boot this time
11:39<Snow-Man>Would that still be at the quality of the regular playback?
11:39* Snow-Man tries to understand this shit.
11:39<m0j0>I seem to be able to feed any analog signal to /dev/adsp and get digital out, I wonder if I could do something similar to get pass-through...
11:40<Chutt>snowman, the card does arbitrary alpha blending from the framebuffer onto the video
11:40<Snow-Man>Ahhhhhhh.
11:40<Snow-Man>So you need X to get the stuff into the framebuffer.
11:40<Chutt>or just standard linux framebuffer stuff
11:41<Snow-Man>MythTV supports that?
11:41<Chutt>but using X makes things easier
11:41<Chutt>like, you know the myth program guide when you're watching tv?
11:41<Chutt>the little preview in the corner?
11:41<Snow-Man>Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
11:41<Snow-Man>I was asking if mythtv supported just linux framebuffer.
11:42<Chutt>yeah, it runs against qt/embedded
11:42<Snow-Man>Ah.
11:42<Chutt>though i may have broken that since i last tested
11:42<Snow-Man>hehe.
11:43<Snow-Man>I'm guessing there's no hope for getting mythmusic to go out on the 350?
11:43<Snow-Man>Which would avoid the silly y-cable stuff.
11:43<Chutt>there may be a way to treat it as a generic sound device, like it can act as a generic framebuffer, but i've not heard of it doing that
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11:44<Snow-Man>hmm.
11:44<Snow-Man>To be honest we'd probably mainly use the mythtv part of it anyway.
11:44<Snow-Man>Mainly anyway.
11:45<Snow-Man>So all I'd probably need would be a 350 and a VCR and I could throw it in phoenix and run the composite to the VCR, get that to convert it to coax and that signal would run upstairs to my main TV.
11:46<Snow-Man>Of course, I still need a way to control the damn thing. :)
11:46<Snow-Man>Which I imagine still expects the keyboard to be used.
11:46<Chutt>buy a tv that takes svideo.
11:47<Chutt>the pvr-350 remote works fine :p
11:47<Snow-Man>I have one but there's a long distance between the computers and the TV.
11:47<Snow-Man>Err, how's that work?
11:48<Snow-Man>Hmm, I suppose I might be able to put a machine upstairs.
11:48<Snow-Man>Maybe, heh.
11:48<Snow-Man>What would be the min. specs with a pvr-350?
11:49<Chutt>i dunno
11:49<Snow-Man>Hmm.
11:49<Chutt>still want some speed so you can search for commercials in a timely manner
11:49<Snow-Man>I'm guessing still need a pretty decent controller/disk.
11:50<Snow-Man>Probably need something better than a ppro-200. :)
11:51<Snow-Man>I do have a 300Mhz celeron w/ 64M.
11:54<Chutt>probably want more ram than that
11:57<Snow-Man>Hmmm.
11:57<Snow-Man>I'll have to think about it.
11:58<Snow-Man>$207 or so delivered from axiontech.
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12:17<Chutt>fixing tmk's bugs is fun.
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12:30<kvandivo>newegg has the 350 for $190 shipped free
12:33<Chutt>snowman left
12:33* kvandivo looks around.
12:33<Chutt>went 'out to eat' or something strange
12:33<kvandivo>why would he ever want to go offline for something like that.
12:33<kvandivo>that's what frozen pizzas and cans of soda are for
12:34<Chutt>you ever work more on that recommendation stuff?
12:35<kvandivo>at this time, no.. I've been spending most every waking moment the past few weeks putting siding on my house
12:35<Chutt>ah
12:35<kvandivo>I'm really wanting to change things in a couple of ways for the next couple of steps, though.
12:36<kvandivo>1) I want to change the name of program rankings. That's not really what it is doing. It's actually setting recording priorities... (and I want to use the name 'program rankings' to actually allow users to rank programs.. whether or not they might happen to have them scheduled to record)
12:37<Chutt>that'd be fine
12:37<kvandivo>2) actually implement the program rankings, where users can set a value (probably -5 through +5 or something) for how much they like/dislike a random show that shows up in the guide.
12:38<kvandivo>this would also show up in various pages in myth, such as when they delete a show.. they would be asked something like 'how much did you like this (-5 - +5), etc
12:38<kvandivo>and THEN, once that is in, I revise the way that I'm doing the recommendation calcs.. Right now it is working off of values in oldrecorded, recorded, and record.. I'd drop that, and switch to doing pure bayesian on what they have actually ranked
12:39<kvandivo>so that's my plan of attack right now
12:40<Chutt>sounds good
12:40<Chutt>any plans for cf?
12:42<kvandivo>absolutely.
12:42<kvandivo>that's stage 2, though. :)
12:42<kvandivo>that's where i really really really want to get to..
12:44<kvandivo>with the sparse amount of data that zap2it gives us here in na, i'm guessing that i can achieve pretty good accuracy on the recommendations without collaborative, but with it, it should really be effective
12:44<kvandivo>if we got actors, etc in the datastream i think i could do a pretty slick job without cf
12:44<Chutt>hopefully that'll change whenever they get off their asses and start their datadirect service
12:45<kvandivo>i mean, the current version does pretty well, but it's really using oldrecorded in a way that it wasn't meant for. the data in there isn't really perfect for determining whether or not a user _likes_ a show.. (hence the reasons for my planned changes)
12:48<kvandivo>and then, of course, there is all the configuration options that I have planned.. should it autorecord suggestions, if so, how (how much space, how many of each show, etc etc) and it would be helpful to add a recording type for suggestion, so that the autodelete code knows to kill those first, etc
13:10<Chutt>i really do need to figure out how to keep ivtv-fb from grabbing all the consoles
13:10<o_cee>what's cf?
13:14<kvandivo>collaborative filtering, where the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.
13:15<o_cee>okay
13:17<o_cee>Chutt: i found a really nice grey background that i think you might like ;)
13:17<o_cee>haven't got any new screenshot yet and the tv is occupied.. will take one later
13:18<o_cee>who wrote the theme stuff?
13:20<Chutt>moegreen, thor, and i
13:22<o_cee>okay. might ask them if they've got time to make <title> possible to use with <text> instead of just <image>. would make it alot more useful.
13:26<Chutt>oh, i did all the menu stuff
13:28<o_cee>oh :)
13:28<o_cee>you don't have time to do that do you?
13:29<Chutt>not at the moment, no
13:31<o_cee>okay. i'll finnish up the theme, maybe someone else can give it a shot.
13:32<o_cee>btw, i've tried to look at the qt docs about colors and such. don't really understand wich fonts and colors i can use.. all fonts that xft has?
13:33<Chutt>try to limit it to commonly installed fonts.
13:33<Chutt>but, yeah
13:33<o_cee>okay. and the colors? where does all the colors that's in the epg come from?
13:37<Chutt>ui.xml
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13:39<Snow-Man>newegg, eh?
13:39<Snow-Man>Heh, they don't have it in stock tho.
13:40<o_cee>but for example MediumSlateBlue, is that a predefined color in qt? Couldn't find any references more than 10 or so.
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13:41<Chutt>probably one of the standard X colors.
13:41<kvandivo>but they will have tomorrow, snow
13:41<o_cee>oh, there's x colors as well :) that explains it. will serach there
13:41<Snow-Man>kvandivo: Well, hopefully. :)
13:42<kvandivo>true. :) i ordered one of the pioneer 106 dvd writers from them a couple of days ago, and it is on the truck for delivery as we speak
13:43<Snow-Man>Cool.
13:44<o_cee>my gs-storm is on the way on a truck for me. yeah.
13:52<o_cee>anyone got suggestion for nice games to have in mythgames? got tuxracer and some tetris thingie.. tuxracer rocks :)
13:54<mikegrb>just ran into a mythtv user in real life :)
13:55<mikegrb>a contractor here on site that was out at the smoke pad
13:55<mikegrb>one of the it guys introduced me as a linux guy
13:55<mikegrb>tuxracer is damn addictive
13:55<mikegrb>my wife even plays it
13:56<o_cee>heheh :)
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14:02<kvandivo>there he goes... there goes tux racer..
14:06<mikegrb>something about that game
14:06<mikegrb>just can't stop playing it
14:08<o_cee>i haven't got that far yet
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14:45<kvandivo>hey isaac.. just for grins, you ever thought about adding some google AdSense stuff to the mythtv page? You could drop a little column in underneath the menu on the left side.. https://google.com/adsense/overview make a little cash in the process
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16:02<jcap>hi all... just had to pop in here to vent...
16:03<jcap>did'ya get a load of the guy complaining about how the 'XFree' drivers won't let him use XvMC on his Radeon?
16:05<jcap>responds to self:
16:06<jcap>"Why yes, I did... what a doofus"
16:06<jcap>Yeah... well, that was cathartic. See ya later.
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16:08<Chutt>um
16:08<Chutt>heh
16:08<Chutt>xvmc isn't specific to the nvidia cards
16:08<Chutt>guess joe doesn't realize that =)
16:10-!-Drikus [~Drikus@cc45940-a.deven1.ov.home.nl] has joined #mythtv
16:33-!-o_cee [o_cee@h235n5c1o1029.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #mythtv
16:34<o_cee>lame power blackout
16:38-!-poo [~langfors@h00105a206319.ne.client2.attbi.com] has joined #MythTV
16:45<o_cee>https://dragon.dyndns.tv/sc.png is a new screenshot. and this time. no one is allowed to look at it unless you say _something_ about it. okay? great :)
16:46<sfr>what about freedom of speech (or the freedom of being quiet)? :)
16:47<farce>me gusta mucho
16:47<o_cee>farce: i love you to.. hmm :)
16:47<o_cee>sfr: dunno anything about that..
16:47<Chutt>i dunno 'bout the background
16:48<Chutt>too bandy =)
16:48<sfr>aol
16:48<o_cee>it looks pretty good on the tv actually.. but you might be right.. could tone it down a little
16:48<sfr>i prefer the other one. but that tv screen looks nice.
16:48<o_cee>the icons are amazin
16:49<Chutt>o_cee, i'm really just talking about the darker bit in the lower right
16:49<o_cee>but yeah, i'm still not sure about the background.. still searching
16:49<Chutt>just seems abrupt and sorta pixelated
16:49<o_cee>hehe, oohkay.. not sure about "tiled" and "normal"
16:49<o_cee>might be that
16:50<o_cee>that shot is with it "tiled".. it changes sometihng but i didn't understand what :)
16:58<o_cee>the <title> for weather, games and gallery is never used.. ah well, guess i'll leave em there..
16:59<o_cee>do i need a myth logo there? maybe..
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18:29<CyberKnet>I'm about to install a dual PIII 733 / BT848 Myth machine... I've used RedHat most recently, but I thought perhaps a leaner dist. would be in order. Is it more worthwhile to download a Debian Woody netinst cd instead? Or would you recommend a different distro from that even?
18:30<Omnic>netinst is good
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18:31<CyberKnet>Maybe I havent looked enough , but the only official netinst cd I could find was for sarge, should I use one of the unofficial ones for woody?
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18:32<Omnic>there are no 'official' debian CDs
18:33<Omnic>but yes, the unofficial woody one will be fine
18:35<CyberKnet>Aha. Sorry for the mistake, I'm really not that familiar with Debian. But I guess that shows =)
18:36<CyberKnet>I installed RedHat, but the default install seems to leave Xawtv rather broken, so I thought since Isaac uses debian (or so I read) then it would probably be beneficial for me to use debian as well.
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18:50<D-side>evening fellas.
18:58<CyberKnet>evening
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19:16<CyberKnet>Omnic: have you used netinst?
19:16<MrChook>I have
19:17<CyberKnet>I'm running through the install, and I'm up to the "Install the base system" step...
19:17<MrChook>and?
19:17<CyberKnet>it asks for the medium, but only presents cdrom, fd0, fd1 and mounted
19:17<MrChook>have you confuigured the network yet?
19:17<CyberKnet>have I done something incorrectly?
19:18<CyberKnet>I have not found an option to configure the network yet...
19:18<CyberKnet>I partitioned the drive, added swap .. then it comes to installing the base system
19:18<MrChook>should be there, you need to configure the network, look further down in the steps
19:18<CyberKnet>perhaps I have done something wrong, or not done something
19:19<CyberKnet>aha
19:19<CyberKnet>thanks man. I'll go kick myself for you now =)
19:19<MrChook>you have to do them out of order a little for netinst
19:19<Chutt>depends on which image you use
19:20<Chutt>the debian install is all fucked up anyway, since they're _still_ rewriting things
19:20<MrChook>yeah
19:20<MrChook>the sarge one looks pretty good but it's a bit unreliable
19:21<Chutt>last i tried it, it was completely unuseable =)
19:21<MrChook>nah, I've used it a few times now
19:21<MrChook>had a few problems but it was useable
19:22<CyberKnet>aha! now it works. =)
19:23<CyberKnet>sorry guys. I should have tried to go down that list more before troubling you. But I really do appreciate your help.
19:24<MrChook>it's not that big a deal... te debian installer is not what I'd call intuitive at times
19:24<CyberKnet>Yeah, but I've installed Slackware before... I think RedHat has softened me some. I rather expect better of myself =)
19:24<MrChook>heh
19:25<CyberKnet>I ran slack for the better part of 4 years before my wife's college required her to have ms office et al so I had to switch back to windows for a while.
19:25<CyberKnet>rather inane question, but is debian more similar to redhat, or slackware? Or is it just in a ball park of its own?
19:26<MrChook>pretty much on it's own
19:26<CyberKnet>I was always rather partial to slack's bootup sequence... never did really like RedHat's rc.d setup
19:26<MrChook>i guess in some respects it;s similar to RH in that it has a package management system
19:26<CyberKnet>I've been itching to try apt for a while now =)
19:27<CyberKnet>I tried drake's urpmi and wasn't too impressed.
19:27<MrChook>but from my perspective, apt shits all over anything redhat has yet
19:27<CyberKnet>heh
19:28<MrChook>apt has been ported to RH but their repositories are shit
19:28<D-side>heh
19:28<D-side>still that bad?
19:28<CyberKnet>so after I install the base system, and setup the system to be bootable... I just reboot?
19:28<D-side>CyberKnet: thats about it.
19:29<CyberKnet>neat
19:29<CyberKnet>that was very fast
19:29* MrChook nods
19:29<D-side>thats when the meat of the install goes.
19:29<CyberKnet>aha
19:29<CyberKnet>heh =)
19:29<MrChook>it will then go through the rest of the install
19:29<D-side>the netinst just gives you a base bootable install
19:29<D-side>and as i was just reading backscroll, i concur. the sarge installer is a hunk of crap.
19:30<D-side>what pisses me off is, i went with redhat 9 because a clean install of woody gave me pure HELL when dist-upgrading to sid. :/
19:30<MrChook>yeah?
19:30<MrChook>nevr had a problem myself
19:30<D-side>i'm talking about FRESH install
19:30<D-side>i change the sources to unstable and it crapped all over itself.
19:30<MrChook>but then I tend to do the base install then bypass the package selection on reboot
19:31<MrChook>TEN do the dist-upgrade
19:31<CyberKnet>is there somewhere I can read about what the difference between sid/woody/sarge is/
19:31<MrChook>then install everything
19:31<D-side>i was trying to slim it down. :)
19:31<CyberKnet>never mind, i think I found woody / sarge
19:31<CyberKnet>but not sid
19:31<CyberKnet>I assume sid is unstable
19:31<D-side>went with gentoo but then i couldnt resolve the left channel audio only + garbling after channel change.
19:32<MrChook>CyberKnet: think of it like stable/testing/unstable
19:32<D-side>i see its a known issue per the list, but i never saw a post with a resolution. :/
19:32<D-side>back to rh9, waiting for the .12 rpms to be ready for release
19:33<D-side>feel free to call me a pussy for not beating sid into submission.
19:34<MrChook>ok
19:34* MrChook calls D-side a pussy
19:34<D-side>thats right.
19:34<MrChook>you use the bf24 installers?
19:34<D-side>i deserve it.
19:34<D-side>absolutely.
19:34<CyberKnet>http vs ftp ... any benefit either way with regards to apt repo?
19:35<D-side>not usually
19:35<MrChook>http iss faster usually
19:35<CyberKnet>thanks
19:35<D-side>ftp is the more "correct" method, if you're a unix nazi
19:35<MrChook>connection setup times for ftp are longer
19:35<D-side>heh
19:35<D-side>i'd never notice, myself.
19:36<MrChook>i do, even on cable
19:36<D-side>i have a problem with paying attention. i never do enough of it.
19:36<D-side>i learned that excuse from term.
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19:41<D-side>i swear you people all shut up the second i join this channel.
19:46<D-side>ugh, i seriously cant figure this out, and theres no solution listed on either list.
19:49<CyberKnet>I think I didn't install enough packages =)
19:51<CyberKnet>so I should run apt-get dist-upgrade as soon as install is done to get any updated patches to programs?
19:52<CyberKnet>Hmm... I think I should take this to a debian channel. It's not really appropriate here.
19:52<D-side>er
19:52<D-side>no
19:53<D-side>apt-get update will update you with available packages.
19:53<D-side>not the packages themselves mind you, just the availability.
19:53<D-side>apt-get upgrade will upgrade anything that has a newer version available.
19:54<MrChook>correct sequence is to edit /etc/apt/sources.list, run apt-get update then apt-get dist-upgrade
19:54<MrChook>if you are changing from woody to unsatble
19:56<CyberKnet>hmmm
19:56<D-side>oh, is that what he's doing?
19:56<D-side>CyberKnet: my bad.
19:56<CyberKnet>D-side: I'm just futzing around trying to figure myself out
19:56<CyberKnet>apparently I didn't install any packages
19:56<CyberKnet>so ... =)
19:56<CyberKnet>at all. just the base system
19:56<CyberKnet>so I just installed gcc and make ... but I'm pretty much just wandering around blind =)
19:57<D-side>are you at woody or sid now?
19:57<CyberKnet>woody
19:57<D-side>then listen to MrChook
19:57<CyberKnet>should I be running woody or sid?
19:57<D-side>iirc, just change all instances of "woody" or "stable" to "unstable" in /etc/apt/sources-list
19:57<D-side>sid.
19:58<CyberKnet>I think maybe all instances of stable to unstable
19:59<CyberKnet>you got it
19:59<CyberKnet>now I just gotta figure out this version of vi =) no pico... heh
19:59<D-side>then apt-get update, apt-get dist-upgrade
19:59* MrChook nods
19:59<D-side>what, vi?
19:59<D-side>thank god vi speaks regex
20:00<D-side><esc>:%s/stable/sid/g
20:00<D-side>or replace stable with woody, if thats what the repos are listed as
20:00<D-side>er
20:00<D-side>heh yeah.
20:01<MrChook>use unstable
20:01<D-side>seriously, i'm going to stop typing.
20:01<CyberKnet>so after changing to unstable, I run apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade
20:01<CyberKnet>?
20:01<D-side>MrChook: i swear to God i knew that, but for some reason tonight i'm a bumbling idiot.
20:02<MrChook>it happens
20:03<D-side>dont suppose you have any insight on my audio issues
20:03<MrChook>nope, sorry
20:04<D-side>oh well, thanks anyway. whom among us here usually field such questions?
20:04<CyberKnet>will it flash nice big red letters "Welcome To Sid!" when it's done? =)
20:05<D-side>probably not. i just hope you dont end up like me, where it set itself on fire and insulted my mother.
20:05<CyberKnet>hehehe =)
20:05<CyberKnet>it's chugging way there, so I assume it's doing something
20:06<CyberKnet>then I need to figure out what all to apt-get install to get myth to work
20:06<CyberKnet>I'm sure the install guide for myth is where I begin though =)
20:07<D-side>yeah, the docs are excellent.
20:08<D-side>jarod's RH9 + ATRPMS install guide is good too, just found that today.
20:09<D-side>brb. new ati drivers emerged.
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20:16<MrChook>CyberKnet: apt-get install mythtv should install everything it needs
20:16<MrChook>which is where apt/dpkg shits all over the rpm dependency nightmare
20:22<CyberKnet>hmmm
20:22<CyberKnet>is that .12?
20:22<MrChook>not yet I don't think
20:25<CyberKnet>apt-get dist-update is failing :|
20:25<CyberKnet>it updated libc6
20:35<CyberKnet>error: /var/lib/dpkg/info/libc6.postinst: line 324: 503 Illegal instruction sleep 1
20:35<CyberKnet>probably sleep command is not installed
20:40<CyberKnet>I think I am missing quite a few packages.
20:40<CyberKnet>ldconfig isn't there!
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20:43<CyberKnet>yes it is. This thing is on crack
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20:50<MrChook>hehe
20:51<CyberKnet>it is. I cant upgrade libc6 because it cant run ldconfig
20:51<CyberKnet>I need to get a new ldconfig from libc6
20:51<CyberKnet>...
20:51<CyberKnet>#@!
20:51<MrChook>odd
20:52<CyberKnet>I commented out the calls to ldconfig in postinst
20:52<CyberKnet>hopefully that will be enough to get by
20:57<CyberKnet>MrChook ... supposing I wanted to change all instances of ldconfig in all files in a particular directory ... would there be a tool to do that from the command line?
20:58<MrChook>find and sed would do it
20:58<MrChook>best thing is to get ldconfig working though
20:59<CyberKnet>yeah... it is saying "Illegal instruction"
20:59<MrChook>if you run ldconfig ?
20:59<CyberKnet>I tried apt-get upgrade ld
20:59<CyberKnet>yep
21:00<MrChook>try installing the libc6 package by hand... dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/libc6XXXXXX
21:00<MrChook>assuming it managed to download it
21:02<CyberKnet>there are two libc6's in there
21:02<CyberKnet>I tried to install libc6 and it says libdb1-compat is not configured yet
21:03<CyberKnet>I tried to install libdb1-compat and it says libc6 is not configured yet
21:03<MrChook>hehe
21:03<MrChook>dpkg -l libc6
21:03<MrChook>what's that give?
21:05<MrChook>also maybe try dpkg --configure -a
21:06<CyberKnet>I'm trying to get ssh access to the box so I can cut and paste the result
21:06<MrChook>i doubt ssh will work if libc6 is munted
21:06<MrChook>all I really want are the first to characters of the line for libc6
21:06<MrChook>two
21:07<CyberKnet>iF
21:08<MrChook>ok, that means it installed but failed to configure
21:09<MrChook>what does this do ? dpkg --configure -a
21:10<CyberKnet>. /var/lib/dpgk/info/libdb1-compat.postinst line 5 2212 illegal instruction ldconfig
21:10<CyberKnet>and then a long screen of text after
21:11<MrChook>how about dpkg --configure libc6 ?
21:12<CyberKnet>libc6.postinst illegal instruction sleep 1
21:12<CyberKnet>libc6.postinst illegal instruction ldconfig
21:12<CyberKnet>should I comment out those lines?
21:12<MrChook>how odd
21:15<CyberKnet>I'm thinking if I can comment out all the ldconfig / sleep errors until I get it all installed / configured then I can run ldconfig afterwards
21:16<CyberKnet>apparently not though.
21:16<CyberKnet>maybe if I do an apt-get upgrade ld
21:17<MrChook>ldconfig is in libc6
21:17<CyberKnet>oh.
21:17<CyberKnet>commenting out ldconfig entries then did not solve the problem.
21:18<MrChook>what version of libc6 is installed?
21:18<MrChook>dpkg -l libc6
21:18<CyberKnet>ii libc6 2.3.2.ds1-8
21:19<MrChook>dsl?
21:19<CyberKnet>ds[one]
21:20<MrChook>hmm, ok, no idea what that is
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21:20<MrChook>is this an intel machine?
21:21<CyberKnet>yes
21:21* robertj just got new stuff for his machine!
21:21<CyberKnet>dual 733Mhz PIII
21:21* robertj jumps up and down in girlie fashion
21:22<MrChook>the ds1 bit is odd, latest version in unstable is 2.3.2-8
21:23<MrChook>actually, it's 2.3.2-9
21:24<CyberKnet>if I wanted to specify the version on the command line, how would I do that
21:24<CyberKnet>apt-get libc6-2.3.2-9 ?
21:24-!-Ripp_ [~Ripp@dsl30-175.chouteautel.com] has joined #mythtv
21:24<MrChook>can't remember, there is a way though
21:25<CyberKnet>maybe I should just reinstall from the cd?
21:25<MrChook>I'm curious as to where it got that ds1 from though
21:32-!-mechou [~mchou@12-235-7-243.client.attbi.com] has joined #mythtv
21:35<Captain_Murdoch>mechou, nobody has the audio on the m179 working yet that I know of.
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21:41<mechou>Captain_Murdoch: ok, thx. so are u using windows? :)
21:42<Captain_Murdoch>well, I was able to get ahold of mce on CD, but it won't work in the first machine I tried it on. video isn't good enough. I'll have to try putting it on another machine to see if I can get it up so I can do some debugging reading in those port values after the card is in use.
21:44<Captain_Murdoch>machine I was trying on has built-in ATI video so I'll try it on another machine with a Geforce4 MX440.
21:44<mechou>Captain_Murdoch: are u msdn (MCE) subscriber?
21:44<Captain_Murdoch>no comment. :)
21:44-!-warlord is now known as warlord-afk
21:44<mechou>gotcha....
21:44<mechou>:)
21:46-!-D-side [pfft@bgp526783bgs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has quit ["brb"]
21:46<mechou>Captain_Murdoch: do you think MCE is going to work as reliably as myth? I tried doing PVR in windows (b4 MCE) and it was just too kludgy...
21:47<mechou>unreliable garbage.
21:48<Captain_Murdoch>I don't know. I thought it was kinda interesting that the first user I setup was given admin rights and it never even asked me for a password. boots up logged in as admin.
21:48<mechou>hehe. There's you first clue...
21:48<mechou>your
21:48<Captain_Murdoch>this is the older version though, not 2004.
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21:54<mechou>Captain_Murdoch: thx for info on m179. bbl....
21:54<Captain_Murdoch>I'm going to read in and record those values using pcidebug anyway even if I can't watch tv on it.
21:55<kvandivo>if i can help in any way, let me know
21:55<Captain_Murdoch>will do.
21:56<kvandivo>i loaded the drivers, etc in win XP, but I don't have a program that actually lets me watch tv with it
21:56<kvandivo>so i couldn't get any of the useful numbers
21:56<Captain_Murdoch>I was wondering if they would work with straight XP. wonder if the hauppauge software would work?
21:56<kvandivo>i went ahead and got 4444:0803, and the direction (0081) but that didn't help any on the software
21:56<kvandivo>hauppage software doesn't work.. complains it can't find the tuner or something..
21:57<Captain_Murdoch>even with the aver driver installed?
21:57<kvandivo>nod
21:57<kvandivo>i reinstalled the H software just in hopes that it would work
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22:00<monkeyBox>Is there any concensus on the best remote to use w/ mythtv?
22:05<kvandivo>remoteutil/mythcontext experts... I note on line 993 of mythcontext.cpp there is a call to serverSockLock.lock() which is attempting to lock a QMutex..
22:06<kvandivo>when being called from RemoteIsRecording (remoteutil.cpp:258) which is being called from xbox.cpp (line 39) I'm getting hangs
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22:14<cesman>hello everyone
22:17<D-side>ugh i need to make this problem go away
22:23<kvandivo>you need to make a problem go away? Perhaps you should talk to my brother Luigi.
22:23<kvandivo>He's a problem solver, but he doesn't come cheap
22:24<D-side>if he can help me fix this audio problem i'll kiss his ring and call him the Don
22:30<Captain_Murdoch>the numbers I got from reading using pcidebug were a little different from the ones that Nate on the ivtv mailing list got with hiis working xp install. only differ by a few couple bits though.
22:34<kvandivo>let me hop into XP and i'll see what i can come up with
22:34<monkeyBox>Strange... Why is my OSD black and White, no matter what theme I use??
22:34<Captain_Murdoch>I wonder if he typoed the direction number cause he has 2 bits reversed from what I get. could be uninitialized on mine though.
22:35<Captain_Murdoch>monkeyBox: are you using xvmc?
22:37<kvandivo>so you aren't starting your tv watching application.. you are just running pcidebug..
22:38<Captain_Murdoch>kvandivo: yeah, I can't run the app, cause my video card isn't good enough. have to reinstall on a different computer cause this machine has builtin video and no agp slots.
22:38<Captain_Murdoch>drivers supposedly loaded correctly but when I try to watch it gives an error. I think it's the video driver cause the menus are all hosed.
22:39<kvandivo>vendor id 4444, device id 0803
22:39<Captain_Murdoch>yeah
22:39<Captain_Murdoch>same as the pvr-250
22:40<kvandivo>filled in read addr of F200000 and same for write
22:40<kvandivo>9020 resulted in value becoming 00000081
22:40<Captain_Murdoch>I have 3 cards in the machine so I tried reading from all 3. didn't check all 3 to see if they compared though.
22:41<Captain_Murdoch>9020 for me as A081. nate said a180 that's why I think he swapped the 1 & 0.
22:41<kvandivo>900C results in 81 as well
22:42<kvandivo>9008 results in A381
22:42<Captain_Murdoch>my 900c was 8081 and 9008 was 8381.
22:42<kvandivo>hmmm
22:43<kvandivo>when you hit detect, are you getting: PCI Device Address:0208
22:43<kvandivo>Base Addr(MEM):F0000000
22:43<kvandivo>?
22:43<monkeyBox>Captain_Murdoch: what's xvmc??
22:43<Captain_Murdoch>his numbers were 9020 = a180, 900c = 8091, 9008 = 8291
22:44<kvandivo>how very strange
22:44<Captain_Murdoch>I got E000000 for one card, E4000000 for another and don't remember the third.
22:44<kvandivo>ok
22:44<Captain_Murdoch>monkeyBox: if you don't know you aren't using it unless you turned on random settings.
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22:45<monkeyBox>Captain_Murdoch: is the setting in the mythtv setup?
22:45<kvandivo>now that i'm here, i can actually say that the hauppauge prog, wintv2000, results in a popup saying "iVac Driver Not Found!"
22:45<monkeyBox>or is this some kind of compiled in option??
22:46<Captain_Murdoch>monkeyBox: it's for nvidia video cards. if you didn't turn it on then it isn't your problem.
22:47<monkeyBox>Captain_Murdoch: I may have turned it on w/o knowing... I do have an nvidia card, though...
22:47-!-manu [~manu@dsc03-wei-ut-204-30-93-89.rasserver.net] has joined #mythtv
22:47<kvandivo>i do, however, have a driver.. PVR-PCI, AVerMedia MPEG Capture Device.. using irq 22..
22:48<manu>hi all
22:49<manu>The channels list retrieved by XMLTV is false, how to fix that? I have already posted on mythtv list, but NBA has begun, so I really need to have that fixed :-)
22:52<Captain_Murdoch>run setup and say 'yes' to the first question(s) maybe?
22:53<kvandivo>Captain_Murdoch: what tv viewing app were you saying that you couldn't run? the hauppauge one, or do you have a different one, or do you happen to have an actual copy of winxp media edition?
22:54<Captain_Murdoch>mce
22:54<Captain_Murdoch>returns an error message about not able to display video. I think it needs a card better than the builtin ATI
22:55<kvandivo>hmmmm
23:05<Chutt>manu, congrats, you just got yourself banned from the lists.
23:05<Chutt>kvandivo, your first problem is that the Qt socket stuff is crappy =)
23:12<Chutt>kvandivo, for the second backtrace, i'd like to see the backend at that same point
23:14-!-[No_oNE] [1000@24.241.207.95] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
23:14<Chutt>far as i can tell, it's just waiting for a response from the server
23:14<Chutt>so the problem's on the server somewhere
23:15<Chutt>i really should dump QSocket :(
23:21<manu>Chutt, why is that? If I have the answer here I will put it on the list anyway.
23:22-!-nulltank [~nullman@c-66-41-110-140.mn.client2.attbi.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
23:23<Chutt>manu, i asked you to stop double posting.
23:24<Chutt>you didn't.
23:24<manu>Chutt, I really tried, so it is a problem with my MUA. Actually I am getting double posting back from the list soemtimes.
23:26<Chutt>you're the only one doing it.
23:27<manu>Chutt, look : do what you think is better for that list. I am trying to explain you, you do not have to trust me. I will just miss the good explanations I found there.
23:35<Chutt>if your mua is broken, then don't post to an extremely busy list with many people on it.
23:37<manu>Chutt, I just figured that out. I have perhaps the reason for it. Anyway I will not post to this list until I am sure, then I will resubscribe when I am reasonably sure that I won't double post annymore.
23:38<Chutt>ok
23:38<Chutt>that's acceptable
23:40<manu>Chutt, OK. Hope to be able to fix that quick. Bye
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23:42<kvandivo>Chutt: ok.. if i can recreate it again i'll let you have the bts..
23:43<Chutt>your first hang should be fixed, though
23:43<kvandivo>Captain_Murdoch: just spent the past hour or so trying out different version of drivers for the m179 and haven't had any luck at all in windows
23:43<kvandivo>Chutt: thanks a million. i'll give it a try
23:43<Chutt>heh
23:44<Captain_Murdoch>kvandivo: ok. I got it at least where i can punch in numbers without locking up. :)
23:44<Chutt>the xbox led crap might not update very timely
23:44<Chutt>but it won't hang anymore if it triggers in a recursive manner
23:44<kvandivo>i'd be happy with granularity of 1 hour if it means my box quits locking up. :)
23:44<Chutt>wish qt had a 'process only socket events'
23:45<Chutt>ah well
23:45<Chutt>if i wasn't doing bad things to it, it wouldn't be causing me problems
23:45* kvandivo smirks.
23:46<Chutt>but if anyone wants to code up a drop in qsocket replacement that doesn't need the main event loop to do stuff, i'd be very happy =)
23:47<kvandivo>isDoingNetworkStuff.. interesting..
23:47<Chutt>just drops it out of the timer trigger if it was doing stuff
23:48<kvandivo>sounds like a hack, but, like you said, if you have to deal with crappy code, you have to deal with it. :)
23:48<Chutt>right
23:49<Chutt>if you look at that backtrace, you can see what the problem is
23:49<kvandivo>i had thought about playing with the tryLock stuff in mythcontext
23:49<Chutt>it's in the event loop, getting the list of programs
23:49<Chutt>runs out of data from the socket, so it has to run processEvents to get more data
23:49<kvandivo>which grabs serverLock....
23:50<Chutt>says 'hey, there's a timer i should process'
23:50<kvandivo>ahh.. ok.. i follow you.. sneaky
23:50<Chutt>so the event loop is doubling back up on itself
23:50* kvandivo nods.
23:50<Chutt>it's because i really want qsocket to be synchronos
23:51<Chutt>err, however you spell that =) i've only slept like 2 hours in the past couple days
23:51<kvandivo>that would be convenient..
23:51<kvandivo>to coin a dave appell statement.. "Get some sleep!"
23:51<kvandivo>(or however you spell his name ;p )
23:52<kvandivo>attell, maybe it is..
23:52<Chutt>t's, not p's
23:52<Chutt>got one more little thing to do for Real Work
23:52<Chutt>if i didn't take so many mythtv breaks =)
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23:59<ChaosExiguum>I am having a very strange mythtv problem maybe someone can help with..
---Logclosed Fri Oct 31 00:00:31 2003