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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2003-11-06

---Logopened Thu Nov 06 00:00:01 2003
---Daychanged Thu Nov 06 2003
00:00<kvandivo>center, surround, etc etc
00:02<Octane>ok
00:02<Octane>should i be probing snd-emu10k1
00:03<Octane>or emu10k1
00:04<Octane>thing is
00:04<Octane>i see nothing in the mixer
00:04<Octane>its an empty window
00:06<kvandivo>oh.. you aren't making it that far..
00:06<kvandivo>you should be probing something with alsa- in it. the snd- stuff is what you specify in the config file
00:07<kvandivo>err.. let me rephrase that.. your module conf for alsa should have an alias that points to snd-
00:08<kvandivo>I _do_ have a module loaded that is snd-
00:11<Octane>can you tell me what sound modules you have loaded?
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00:32<bbeattie>bah, everytime I try to delete a recording, mythfrontend just hangs, any ideas?
00:33<bbeattie>hmm, I need to run mythbackend as myth, not root.. that's the problem
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01:07<tmk>ahh. updated mythv at last
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01:16<Chutt>tmk, hey, what blocksize would be best for me to send to the decoder?
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01:17<Chutt>can i get away with 32k in a tight loop?
01:17<Chutt>well, it'd be 128k chunks, sending 32k at a time, so i can break out of the write quicker
01:18<Chutt>instead of waiting for the full 128k to get written
01:21<tmk>yeah 32k is fine
01:21<tmk>no smaller tho
01:27<FryGuy>chutt: are you the person to send patches?
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01:46<Octane>anyone here runing alsa with sb live?
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02:12<hadees>can i get irxevent to switch windows to ogle when i start it up and use a diffrent set of key mappings
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02:50<hadees>so anyone use ogle and get irxevent to interact with it
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03:55<o_cee>what the hell, leave my showering alone! i like doing that! :)
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04:01<o_cee>Chutt: the weird problem i've been seeing with the recordings not stopping, how would i get some useful info about that? i'd need to set some breakpoints right? gdb feels like it'd be pretty useless
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04:42<Doukegata>has anyone with a pvr-250/350 encountered an error with the audio being distorted, presumably on capture?
04:45<Doukegata>well, I'll tinker around. it only happened twice, so far. and it's late.
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06:13<bobbyd>hi
06:14<bobbyd>will a 1.3Ghz duron be fast enough to watch live tv?
06:34<o_cee>depends on the rest of the hardware of course
06:36<bobbyd>o_cee: wintv go TV card 256MB ram geforce2mx with tv out
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06:55<o_cee>look at the doc, there's some examples there
06:55<o_cee>but it shouldn't be any problems, you can set the quality to whatever you like
06:55<o_cee>if there's not enough power
07:03<bobbyd>o_cee: cool thanks
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07:23<bobbyd>o_cee: what's your setup?
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10:43<o_cee>new preview of the theme availible.. https://dragon.dyndns.tv/mythtv/preview2.png
10:45<choenig>o_cee: it is really nice, though I don't like that down arrow, that doesn't fit the rest
10:46<poo>o_cee: slick
10:54<kvandivo>why are you putting it on https? do you not have http? https is going to use slightly more bandwidth, not to mention increased cpu load on your machine
10:55<mikegrb>maybe silly provider blocks it
10:55<kvandivo>so put it on port 81 instead of 80. :)
10:55<kvandivo>or, if you really want to confuse people, put http on 443
10:55* kvandivo grins evily.
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10:56<mikegrb>heh
10:56<mikegrb>indeed
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11:46<ByteNik>Is there some device I can copy a raw mpeg stream to play it?
11:47<ByteNik>I want to see if I have a good file w/o waiting forever for mplayer to install (I'm installing it anyway but while its goin)
11:57-!-warlord-afk is now known as warlord
11:57<warlord>ByteNik: only if you have a PVR-350
11:57<ByteNik>bah
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12:34<warlord>Hmm... my frontend is going into a loop and eating up tons of RAM..
12:34-!-mdz [~mdz@rrcs-west-24-199-0-118.biz.rr.com] has joined #mythtv
12:34<warlord>I wonder if the player has problems if there is no audio track?
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12:34<o_cee>choenig: well.. the arrow. i don't know what to do about it. could try and use another one and rotate it around.. problem is the shadow and stuff gets all funky.
12:34<o_cee>https, yeah.. well. uhm, i like using ssl :)
12:40<kvandivo>your bandwidth, your cpu time
12:42<o_cee>it's not a public site normally
12:42<o_cee>haven't got anywhere to put it
12:45<o_cee>choenig: what do you think of the arrows in preview3.png then? better?
12:47<choenig>o_cee: hmm, thats looks better to me, though that color looks kind of misplaced
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12:48<o_cee>i'll try another thing
12:51<choenig>did you test this theme on a TV? like ppl said it may have low contrast on one
12:51<Chutt>warlord, do you have 'extra audio buffering' turned on?
12:52<warlord>Chutt: i dont know. I dont _think_ so..
12:52<warlord>but let me check -- the machine is rebooting right now.
12:53<Chutt>i think that would cause what you describe if there wasn't an audio track
12:53<warlord>Hmm, once I insmod ivtv-fb, I can't dd an mpg to /dev/video19
12:53<Chutt>16
12:54<warlord>no, 19
12:54<Chutt>oh, nevermind
12:54<Chutt>it's not your first device =)
12:54<warlord>Nope, it's my 4th
12:54<Chutt>you have to play with the ivtvfbctl stuff
12:54<Chutt>to turn off global alpha and turn on localalpha
12:54<Chutt>for video playback to be visible
12:54<warlord>Do I have to do that everytime, or just once?
12:54<Chutt>if you're using dd, yes
12:54<warlord>(I presume Myth does that itself when it's in control?)
12:55<Chutt>well, only if you change it back so the fb can be used again
12:55<Chutt>yeah, mythtv does all that for you
12:55<o_cee>choenig: i'm only testing it on a tv. what do you mean with the contrast?
12:56<warlord>Ok. Well it's off for now. I dont think I'm going to get it all set before I have to leave for a week, so I'll probably just leave it on S/W decode until I return..
12:56<Chutt>ivank sent in a pretty much step by step dealie on how to get it going
12:56<Chutt>it's really quite easy :p
12:56<choenig>o_cee: ok, fine, I only meant that it may look pale or dull on a TV, but if you're actually testing it on one thats fine :-)
12:57<warlord>Chutt: to -dev or -users?
12:57<o_cee>i'm still not sure about the background.. but the watermarks makes it colorful enough i htink
12:57<Chutt>users
12:57<Chutt>last night
12:58<Chutt>My first attempt at PVR-350 TV-out "howto" (very LONG)
12:58<warlord>Yea, just found it. Cool, thanks
12:58<warlord>FWIW, the output *IS* significantly better with the 350!! :)
12:59<Chutt>of course it is
12:59<warlord>LOL
12:59<o_cee>ok, check preview3b.png .. those alternatives is pretty much what i can come up with.
12:59<kvandivo>you guys are making me want to put a computer up next to my tv in the living room
12:59<choenig>o_cee: thats better :)
12:59<Chutt>warlord, the default capture res/bitrates are pretty close to broadcast, excpect on small detail
13:00<josephk>not for me...hehe
13:00<Chutt>and the occasional decoding hiccup, but that's to be expected with this level of development drivers
13:00<o_cee>not really following -users, to much shit there. but the 350, will divx playback and such be supported as well? guess that's a matter of mplayer, do they plan support?
13:00<josephk>I like to jack it up to 8/9.5 for Live
13:00<o_cee>choenig: i'll use these a while and see how they feel ;)
13:01<Chutt>josephk, depends on the quality of your tv signal, of course
13:01<warlord>Chutt: thanks. I need to reduce my settings once I get the -350 setup. I'm still set at 8/16
13:01<o_cee>need to fix the shadow first
13:02<josephk>my signal is pretty good...good cables help
13:02<josephk>I capture at 5/6.5 and that looks ok as well
13:03<josephk>or is it 5.5/7 ...hehe
13:04<josephk>I still can't figure out why my output stops under Mandrake...I hope RH will be more helpful
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13:05<D-side>jesus christ. lirc is dead and the frontend is stuck on days of our lives. kill me
13:06<mikegrb>hahaha
13:08<josephk>these are the days of our lives
13:08<josephk>dodedodedododode
13:11<D-side>well thank god that was fixed.
13:11<D-side>soda can placed between the IR tx and the cable box. :/
13:12<josephk>I would have disconnected the machine and thrown it across the room...don't troubleshoot...lol
13:13<o_cee>bah, now the tv is occupied :/
13:15<o_cee>what about the new logo and the background then?
13:18<warlord>too bad I can't use ivtv-fb as the vt console.
13:19<Chutt>well, once someone fixes the pallette
13:23<josephk>anyone try getting myth running under mac os x?
13:24<o_cee>anyone who's got a suggestion for another background feel free to say so.. the blue one i tried first _is_ pretty nice as well, but the blue style feels so common
13:27<warlord>Chutt: to answer your previous question: yes, I have extra audio buffering turned on.
13:28<Chutt>well, that'll kill stuff without audio being present =)
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13:29<warlord>I suppose I dont need that at all with the -350, huh?
13:29<Chutt>nope
13:31<warlord>i probably dont need the deinterlace or jitter reduction either, huh?
13:31<Chutt>they'll not do anything at all =)
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13:33<warlord>Hmm, EPG from LiveTV looks --- weird.
13:33<Chutt>heh
13:33<Chutt>the transparency amount is hardcoded for now
13:34<warlord>I presume there's no way to do what it was doing before?
13:34<Chutt>'course not
13:34<warlord>*sighs*
13:34<warlord>does PIP work?
13:34<Chutt>'course not
13:34<Chutt>though
13:34<Chutt>it _could_ conceivably be done
13:34<Chutt>take a bit more cpu, though
13:35<Chutt>and i'm not sure what sort of framerate you'd get out of it
13:35<warlord>well, I was getting full framerate before... ;)
13:35<o_cee>framerate shouldn't be that important on a small pip imo
13:35<o_cee>better than nothing :)
13:35<Chutt>it'd have to be displayed on the osd
13:35<Chutt>and i really don't have the time to spend on stuff like that
13:36<o_cee>:)
13:37<o_cee>does the transparent epg look good?
13:37<warlord>Ok, a more immediate requirement: where is the code that hardcode's the alpha during EPG? My wife can't read it with the video behind the text and just wants the video turned off.
13:37<warlord>o_cee: no, it sucks
13:37<Chutt>it's quite readable here
13:37<o_cee>hehe
13:37<warlord>Chutt: you're clearly not dyslexic
13:37<warlord>congratulation
13:37<o_cee>won't that be possible to do with normal cards as well?
13:38<warlord>Hmm, and my machine just crashed hard.
13:38<josephk>I actually like the transparency but I can see how it would be unreadable at time
13:38<josephk>s
13:39<kvandivo>my mom dropped her cpu a couple of weeks ago when she was cleaning around it. now _that_ was a hard crash
13:39<josephk>*rimshot*
13:39<o_cee>:\
13:40<kvandivo>luckily i got one of those cheap dells a few weeks ago.. now i've just got to get back home sometime so i can install it
13:40<o_cee>i passed my math exam. i'm very very happy about that :))
13:40<warlord>Chutt: so you failed to answer my question. Where in the code can I find the EPG alpha so I can turn off the video (what file should I look at)?
13:41<josephk>ooo...he said failed
13:42<Chutt>there's 2 pvr-350 specific files.
13:42<Chutt>you can find it your own damn self with that attitude.
13:42<warlord>Neat, I just crashed it a second time..
13:42<o_cee>Chutt: will you make the transparent epg availible on normal cards as well? or that's a completely diferent deal?
13:42<warlord>what attitude?
13:43<josephk>o_cee: I think that was a happy little accident
13:43<Chutt>o_cee, it's completely different
13:43<kvandivo>the one where you only waited 3 minutes for a reply and used the word failed
13:43* kvandivo pokes warlord.
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13:43<warlord>Anyways, I dont think this is going to be stable enough for my wife while I'm away for a week.. :(
13:43<Chutt>the driver is alpha
13:43<o_cee>Chutt: allrighty. sounds like a cool idea.
13:43<Chutt>it hasn't been released.
13:43<josephk>warlord...where were you when mine was crashing every 3 hours?:)
13:44<warlord>Chutt: hey, lots of alpha stuff is still pretty good.
13:44<warlord>josephk: I dont know, but it's crashed twice in about 15 minutes, so....
13:44<Chutt>generally, reverse engineered drivers don't qualify for that
13:45<josephk>turn down the mbps and see if it crashes as often
13:46<warlord>josephk: I'll try that when I return from my trip. But thanks for the suggestion.
13:46<josephk>warlord: what distro?
13:46<warlord>RH9
13:46<josephk>greeeat
13:47<warlord>??
13:47<josephk>I'm setting up on RH9 now to see if it crashes the same as Mandrake
13:47<josephk>they
13:47<josephk>'re very similar
13:47<Chutt>i'd imagine higher bitrates would have greater chances of locking up the driver
13:47<Chutt>especially on certain motherboards
13:48<Chutt>as it's doing tons of little dmas all around, and that seems to be the sticking point for stability
13:48<josephk>on a certain motherboard of mine...via...it would lock up in a few minutes
13:48<warlord>Chutt: yea, it certainly makes sense... I just dont have the time to experiment right now. I've only got about 3 hours to play before i'm hosed and then go away.
13:48<o_cee>is the location of the weather images hardcoded? i can't put those files in a subdir?
13:48* warlord has an nforce2
13:48<josephk>I've tried 4 motherboards though
13:49<Chutt>rest is just driver stability
13:49<josephk>the rest lock up after an hour or two
13:49<Chutt>i've never had it lock up on me, and the thing's been in production use since before 0.12 was released
13:49<warlord>I'm sure it will stabilize over time.
13:49<josephk>although I got the KT400 to go for 18 hours...I have no idea how
13:56<o_cee>ok guys, do you feel like helping me out choosing watermark images?
13:56<o_cee>take the url and browse that dir to see all files there
13:57<o_cee>there's three different images for music.. let me know wich one you like the best please.
13:59<warlord>well, at least I have all the prep-work to get the -350 set up. I'll play more when I'm going to be in town. Thanks for the help, chutt.
14:01<o_cee>https://dragon.dyndns.tv/mythtv/
14:03<josephk>eclectic
14:03<josephk>:)
14:03<steelep>that is a sweet theme o_cee
14:03<o_cee>of course steelep :)
14:03<steelep>just include all of them and let us have some choices :)
14:03<steelep>and make some colored bgs
14:03<o_cee>i'll probably do that as well, but i need to settle for a standard one
14:03<Chutt>2nd or 3rd
14:03<josephk>now you've got me wanting to make a theme
14:04<steelep>i'd say #3 for a deafult
14:04<o_cee>Chutt: what do you think about the idea that a theme can have multiple backgrounds easily changed? instead of making multiple themes
14:04<Chutt>everything can be easily changed
14:04<Chutt>i dunno, i've been kinda wanting to whip up a theme editor
14:04<o_cee>yeah, but i mean through the gui
14:04<steelep>I just go in and hack the xml
14:04<Chutt>but it'd be external to mythtv, probably be a normal qt app
14:05<o_cee>would be nice
14:05<josephk>o_cee...can you have a cowbell for music...hehe
14:05<o_cee>uhm :)
14:05<josephk>thats ok...I'll make a blue_oyster_cult theme
14:06<o_cee>think i'll take the third one as default.
14:07<o_cee>struggling with qtlook.txt
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14:29<o_cee>ok, the next one.. same place. globe, globe2 and web.png..
14:29<o_cee>web2.png even..
14:30<o_cee>that would be for mythbrowser
14:33<Chutt>first one, i'd say
14:34<o_cee>globe.png?
14:35<o_cee>that's the one i'm using now..
14:35<o_cee>need to compile mythdvd as well..
14:36<o_cee>cvs checkout: authorization failed: server cvs.mythtv.org rejected access to /var/lib/mythcvs for user mythtv
14:36<o_cee>did you change anything? :)
14:37<o_cee>never had to do login before.. ah well
14:42<thor_>
14:42<thor_>
14:42<thor_>
14:42<thor_> hmm
14:42<kvandivo>you tell 'em, thor
14:42<thor_>
14:42<thor_>oops
14:42<thor_>seeing this vanishing OSD thing as well
14:43<Chutt>no errors on the console?
14:43* kvandivo shakes his head.
14:43<thor_>I'll let you know, I'm redoing ivtv to bleeding edge cvs
14:44<Chutt>it's working perfectly fine for me
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14:54<o_cee>arwh, i just want to get mythdvd going to test the menus
14:54<o_cee>now i need to install dependencys as well
14:55<o_cee>thor_: are you willing to try it out for me?
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15:04<o_cee>three more images. these are for mythgallery.
15:05<thor_>o_cee, yup ... but later ... have to run to airport right now ... tonight ok?
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15:21<rooot>hi all
15:28<rooot>anyone here who uses xmltv in germany? I cannot get tv_grab_de to work. it seems there is no actual listing on the server where the script trys to get it (nor the backup server)
15:29<Chutt>http://membled.com/work/apps/xmltv/#grabber_news
15:29<sfr>rooot: tv_grab_de doesn't work since September. see the xmltv website for alternatives
15:29<Chutt>good idea to, i dunno, look at the xmltv page if you have a problem with xmltv
15:29<rooot>thnx, i'll see
15:34<rooot>hm, seems that i need an alternative software to grad another feed and convert it to xmltv. :(
15:34<rooot>thanx anyway
15:37-!-ByteNik [nostpo@pcp03855134pcs.eatntn01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #mythtv
15:38<sfr>'anyone here using a pcHDTV card' ;)
15:40<ByteNik>lol
15:40<ByteNik>I have it working. I'm going to write a how-to
15:40<ByteNik>It took me 74 hours of my time, plus all the hours before I decided it'd be worthwhile to time it. :P
15:41<o_cee>thor_: right. i'll see if i can fix it tomorrow morning.. it's 9:40 here now, already evening :)
15:41<o_cee>did anyone look at the gallery pictures?
15:41<ByteNik>I got the PVR-250 running and the pcHDTV. finally. :P
15:41<sfr>ByteNik: :-). the pcHDTV is featurewise like a bt878 card? except it's for HDTV?
15:41<o_cee>using camera2.png npw
15:42<ByteNik>sfr: Yah
15:42<ByteNik>sfr: It has bt878 for NTSC also tho I believe
15:42<o_cee>back to 24.
15:42<ByteNik>sfr: I haven't played with the NTSC yet... that'll be project 2
15:44<ByteNik>Also, things not to try: Using mplayer in twm... it doesn't work. :P
15:44<ByteNik>I spent forever playing with it until I got so sick of using twm I emerged a window manager
15:44<ByteNik>Suddenly it worked
15:45<ByteNik>Other mistakes: Not plugging in the coax wire into the HDTV card
15:45<sfr>hehe
15:45<ByteNik>Installing 10 different versions of the driver at the same time and not being sure which is working.
15:46<ByteNik>My best one was when I had the drivers installed and running and I could do cat /dev/video32... but I only got back data every 2-3 seconds... and dtvsignal showed no signal
15:46<ByteNik>I wonder how hard it is to make an ebuild for Gentoo for this.
15:47<sfr>ByteNik: what type of TV do you use it with?
15:47<ByteNik>InFocus X1 DLP projector
15:47<ByteNik>72" picture. :P
15:47<kvandivo>9
15:47<kvandivo>$999, i meant
15:47<ByteNik>It only does 800x600, but the next one up was $2700 or so
15:47<ByteNik>Yah
15:48<ByteNik>Also, the X1 is currently the only to do 2000:1 contrast and have a bulb life of 3000hr
15:48<sfr>how much does a replacement lamp cost you? they are pretty expensive here (germany)
15:49<ByteNik>$200 or so, I think, but realistically, I only watch a max of 2 hours a day on the projector, plus the occasional movie or two, so 3000 hours / (2 hours * 365 days) == about 4.11 years
15:49<ByteNik>In 4 years I may end up selling the projector and upgrading, or it'll be older technology with a cheaper bulb
15:50<ByteNik>And if the bulb dies within 3 years I'm covered by warantee
15:50<kvandivo>what about the dlp pitfalls that you hear about? color, color flicker, etc how does the X1 do with that?
15:50<ByteNik>I hope it dies with 2 days to go on the warantee, and then I'll have 7 free years. :P
15:50<sfr>DLP ?
15:50<kvandivo>the type of projecter that the X1 is
15:51<ByteNik>Well, color is awesome at 2000:1 contrast... much better than any LCD. Flicker isn't noticable IMO
15:51<sfr>ah, the model, not a specific technology?
15:51<ByteNik>Nnono
15:51<Chutt>dlp is a technology
15:51<ByteNik>DLP is Digital Light Processing
15:51<Chutt>spinning wheel, mirrors
15:52<Chutt>or something like that :p
15:52<ByteNik>Its a chip made by (Ti?) that has micromirrors mounted on the top
15:52<ByteNik>They can be moved digitally to increase or decrease output light.
15:52<ByteNik>A color wheel spins at framerate * 3 to show the three colors for each frame
15:52<sfr>ah, i read about that some time ago.
15:53<ByteNik>Some people have super good vision and can see a raimbow effect
15:53<ByteNik>No one so far has seen it on mine.
15:53<ByteNik>The down side is you need to get honeycomb blinds that completely block light when closed.
15:53<Chutt>i can see rainbows on the older dlps, but with the double speed ones i don't
15:54<ByteNik>A glass bead screen helps with visibility during bright times of the day but its still hard to see.
15:54<Chutt>if my basement didn't suck, i'd have a projector =)
15:54<ByteNik>Chutt: My room is less than ideal for this, but I managed to do it sucessfully (or at least we'll see once my screen comes)
15:55<Chutt>there's just no place good to put a screen and speakers
15:55<ByteNik>The only downside to my theatre is a high ceiling... the screen has to be really large or have really long suspensions
15:55<ByteNik>Pull down?
15:55<ByteNik>That's what I did.
15:55<Chutt>7 foot ceilings, too
15:56<Chutt>i just need a new house is all =)
15:56<ByteNik>I have 8 foot... I got a very large screen (7x7). You could also put a long chain or suspension. *shrugs*
15:56<ByteNik>lol
15:56<ByteNik>bb... lunch
16:04<rooot>i found an alternative for tv_grab_de. thnx, and good n8
16:04<sfr>n8
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16:47<o_cee>what does mythdvd do? never tried it. is it anything more than viewing dvd's like mythvideo?
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16:49<o_cee>hmm "It can also be configured to let you rip
16:49<o_cee>DVDs"... isn't that like, illegal?
16:56<farce>uhm no
16:57<farce>why would that be illegal?
16:58<o_cee>you haven't read about the trial against the norwegian guy who broke the encryption?
17:00<farce>he's not on trial for breaking the encryption afaik
17:01<farce>perhaps distributing that info and such
17:01<farce>but you wont have that problem.
17:01<o_cee>but it's still illegal.
17:01<D-side>no, its not.
17:01<D-side>not if you own a copy of the movie you're ripping.
17:01<o_cee>right.
17:01<o_cee>that's what they all say
17:02<farce>cower in a corner
17:02<farce>good for you.
17:02<o_cee>cower?
17:02<farce>myself, i like to protect my rights
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17:03<kvandivo>but since you are doing something that directly attempts to defeat digital rights that's breaking the dcma, isn't it? ( /me grins evily as he plays devil's advocate and then sits back and awaits the frantic responses )
17:03<D-side>i can get ibm microdrives for $50. the 340mb ones.
17:03<o_cee>no one can say that it isn't illegal.
17:03<D-side>i think i want to attempt to build a frontend system on one.
17:04<kvandivo>how much do you weight, D-side? you might bust it if you attempt to do _too_ much on one.
17:04<kvandivo>although they _are_ pretty tough
17:05<o_cee>just think it's strange to allow DeCSS in Myth when other decryption algos is so out of the question to implement
17:05<farce>see the issue i have with all the DeCSS bullshit is...
17:05<farce>you could still copy dvds before.
17:05<farce>and they play just fine in dvd players
17:05<o_cee>sure, but that took forever.
17:05<o_cee>and that's also illegal i guess.
17:05<farce>so it doesnt stop piracy like they claim
17:05<o_cee>of course not
17:06<o_cee>but you're missing my point
17:06<farce>it's purpose is to restrict users from doing what they want with their own things
17:06<farce>like skip bs FBI warnings/commercials etc
17:06<o_cee>yeah, i know
17:06<farce>region restrictions...
17:06<o_cee>that's more something that has to do with the dvd player
17:06<warlord>farce: except general-purpose DVD blanks have the CSS keys zero-ized, so you can't copy the on-disk keys in your copy.
17:06<o_cee>and that has nothing to do with DeCSS
17:06* kvandivo leans back and grins to himself.
17:07<o_cee>what bothers me is why DeCSS is allowed in Myth when CSA isn't. strange philosophy.
17:08<warlord>CSA?
17:08<o_cee>DVB related.
17:08<warlord>ahh
17:11<D-side>okay so, honestly. anyone think i can fit a working mythfrontend in 340mb?
17:12<kvandivo>did you realize you were asking a question before
17:12* kvandivo mutters to himself at his typos.
17:12<kvandivo>didn't realize you were asking a question before..
17:13<kvandivo>you aren't really giving us enough info, D.. are you meaning the entire OS and everything on the microdrive, or just myth itself?
17:13<D-side>EVERYTHING.
17:13<kvandivo>how big is the knoppmyth stuff? i'd start from there, if i were you
17:13<D-side>true enough...
17:13<D-side>lets go see. afk
17:15<D-side>hm. 500mb.
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17:15<D-side>i think X and Qt would be the big problems in keeping down the size..
17:16<kvandivo>then, figure out how much extra stuff he puts on there to make it compatible with a large number of machines. obviously you don't need as much compatibility since you are building it for a single machine
17:16<kvandivo>he has stuff on there that you wouldn't need for just a frontend (mysql comes to mind.. i'm guessing he has that on there)
17:17<D-side>im half considering just making a chroot and dumping over only the required stuff. then write that to the drve.
17:17<D-side>then again, maybe i'll just shut the hell up and use knoppmyth itself anyway.
17:17<D-side>life is full of unknowns.
17:18<ByteNik>Okay, now that I got HDTV working, I have the problem that I have major lag when I decode...
17:18<ByteNik>This is on a 2.4 ghz machine tho...!?
17:18<D-side>so is it cpu usage thats causing the lag?
17:18<ByteNik>Nothing else is running... :-/
17:19<D-side>yeah but have you verified its killing the cpu?
17:19<kvandivo>you know.. a better place to look might be the xbox live cd that someone around here made. its frontend only and would probably be closer to an example of what you would need
17:19<ByteNik>Hmm... actually, does XINE have an equivelent to -framedrop from mplayer?
17:21<D-side>i wasnt aware the xbox cd was live. figured that was an installer.
17:21<kvandivo>i think the latest rev is runnable
17:22<ByteNik>Hrmmm
17:22<ByteNik>Why does it read "SSE support available but disabled."... same for MMX and SSE2
17:22<ByteNik>How do I enable it?
17:23<kvandivo>i believe it has to be compiled in
17:25<ByteNik>Hrmmm
17:26<ByteNik>No idea what to do now... :-/
17:28<ByteNik>Actually its only using 12% CPU
17:28<ByteNik>I have no idea what the heck is killing it.
17:29<ByteNik>What else would be a problem.
17:29<ByteNik>I'm definitely running with XvMC
17:31<ByteNik>Hmm... actually anyone have any ideas because its not pcHDTV specifically... I can record to a file... its just certain channels which are using the highest HDTV resolutions, the comp has problems with...
17:33<o_cee>get rid of xvmc
17:33<o_cee>g'night all
17:33<ByteNik>Really? O.o
17:36<ByteNik>Wow, that helps...
17:36<ByteNik>Its not perfect... and deinterlacing now kills it
17:36<ByteNik>But what is wrong with XvMC?
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18:22<thor_>Chutt, no error messages on the missing OSD (still missing) ... haven't poked around at it yet, but nothing on the console
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18:56<thor_>hmm, same thing on another slave
18:57<Chutt>i have no idea what the problem could be
19:00<kvandivo>nothing in here looks dangerous, does it? http://cvs.mythtv.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/mythtv/libs/libmythtv/videoout_xv.cpp?r1=1.85&r2=1.86&sortby=date
19:00<kvandivo>i'm just going through recent commits and looking for things that appear osd related..
19:00<Chutt>i went through it all myself
19:00<Chutt>nothing popped out
19:18<warlord>isn't "nothing popping out" part of his problem? ;)
19:21<thor_>checking a few things
19:23<thor_>this is non PVR-350 output (don't have a PVR-350) ... in case that makes a difference on anyone else's system(s)
19:25* CyberKnet didn't realise that a dual PIII 733 would not be able to handle live tv =(
19:27<CyberKnet>it seems like backend and frontend are both using 99% cpu
19:27<CyberKnet>is that encode/decode threads?
19:28<Octane>anyone know why my tv's display is jittery (geforce 4 mx 440) svideo tv out?
19:28<Octane>can it be caused by the computer too close to the tv?
19:29<Octane>i tried changing the refresh rate
19:29<Octane>to 60
19:29<Octane>that didnt do it
19:29<Octane>its jittery from post
19:30<warlord>define "jittery"?
19:31<Octane>hard to explain
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19:31<Octane>maybe ill shoot a movie of it?
19:31<Octane>its like really jumpy!
19:31<Octane>like it jumps up and down
19:31<Octane>really fast
19:31<Octane>as if the tracking is really messed up
19:32<warlord>so the picture isn't stable?
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19:32<Octane>yah
19:33<Octane>but not in mythtv
19:33<Octane>through and through
19:33<warlord>well, this sounds like either an X issue, or a tuner issue.
19:37<Octane>again, it happens in post too
19:37<Octane>its really bad in post
19:38<Octane>well i managed to capture something :)
19:38<Octane>5 seconds are 8 megs :D
19:38<Octane>it looks really bad
19:38<Octane>guess i gotta troubleshoot away
19:38<Octane>of course, no sound
19:42<Octane>its like
19:42<Octane>really really blury, unfocused, jittery, jumpy
19:42<Octane>and the sample mpeg i captured is really nasty looking
19:42<warlord>Well, try one thing at a time. start with a video that you know works. Get the output working. Then work on input.
19:43<Octane>right
19:43<Octane>what can i do to work on the output?
19:43<warlord>mplayer?
19:43<Octane>in post
19:43<Octane>its really bad
19:43<Octane>i dont raelly care about how it looks in post i guess
19:43<CyberKnet>doesn't the documentation say that Isaac's 733mhz machine *almost* does livetv?
19:43<warlord>what do you mean "in post"?
19:44<Octane>POST - when the computer boots up
19:44<Octane>but when i had this box hooked up through svideo to the same tv, the image on the tv was fine, even before loading the o/s
19:44<warlord>Huh? Not a phrase I've ever heard before..
19:44<Octane>you never heard of the acronym post?
19:44<CyberKnet>warlord: when the computer checks the memory, shows the video card bios and all that stuff
19:44<warlord>How can it display an image if it's not running?
19:44<CyberKnet>right as you turn on the computer
19:45<warlord>I've never heard that called POST before.
19:45<Octane>because its mirroring the image on the monitor
19:45<CyberKnet>warlord: learn something new every day =)
19:45<Octane>yah its pretty commonly used
19:45<CyberKnet>power on self test
19:46<Octane>well anyway, when you guys boot up your machines
19:46<Octane>and the output through svideo to the tv... is it clear?
19:46<warlord>so basically the BIOS output is fine, but once control shifts to Linux the TV looks bad?
19:46<Octane>no, even bios output is messed up
19:46<Octane>linux is a LITTLE clearer but still very ugly
19:46<CyberKnet>Octane: I think they call what I run a "Scan converter"
19:46<CyberKnet>I have an Avermedia Averkey 3
19:46<Octane>whats that CyberKnet?
19:47<CyberKnet>it converts VGA to RCA
19:47<Octane>oh, you dont use svideo?
19:47<warlord>Octane: the console text looks blurry, but it's stable.
19:47<CyberKnet>don't have that option on my tv unfortunately
19:47* warlord uses composite out, not svideo out.
19:47<Octane>any arguments for using svideo over rca?
19:48<CyberKnet>I use the one where you have a video cable, left cable and right cable. The three RCA plug thingies.
19:48<Octane>right right
19:48<CyberKnet>I don't have one of them fancy tvs =P"
19:48<Octane>jeeez CyberKnet
19:48<Octane>that avermedia thing is $150!
19:48<CyberKnet>pffft
19:48<CyberKnet>it's free! =)
19:49<Octane>huh? :D
19:49<CyberKnet>Work wasn't using it.
19:49<Octane>oh wow nice
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19:49<CyberKnet>Just until I buy a PVR-350
19:49<Octane>i bought the 250 for this box
19:49<warlord>The -350 is REALLY cool..
19:49<Octane>dont need the 350
19:50<CyberKnet>which I might have to do if someone can't help me understand why a dual 733Mhz machine can't even do live tv!!!
19:50<Octane>im having a hard enough time as it is
19:50<warlord>the video output is really sharp.
19:50<josephk_>fantabulous
19:50<Octane>time to mess with the xconfig
19:50<CyberKnet>I've been thinking pretty hard about the 350 actually. So many people are saying how great the output is.
19:50<warlord>however the driver is still very alpha. it hung my machine _HARD_ twice within 15 minutes when I was playing with it earlier today.
19:50<CyberKnet>And the hardware encode/decode would really help with this old box.
19:51<CyberKnet>I would have swore the docs said Isaac had a PIII 733 that could almost do live tv
19:51<warlord>So I've neverted back to s/w decode until I come back from the IETF>
19:51-!-Ripp [~chris@dsl30-175.chouteautel.com] has joined #mythtv
19:52<CyberKnet>oh. no it didnt =)
19:52-!-Ripp [~chris@dsl30-175.chouteautel.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
19:52<CyberKnet>but it does say that it should be able to record one stream of 480x480 MPEG4
19:52<CyberKnet>hmm... I should check what codec / resolution it's recording at
19:52<hadees>is the reason it takes the channel so long to change because the card can't do it any faster (hence it is like that in media edition) or is it just because the ivtv drivers arn't as good as the windows drivers yet?
19:53<Octane>can anyone give me some tips on tweaking the display of xwindows on a tv using svideo?
19:53<hadees>opps wrong channel
19:53-!-mdz [~mdz@dialup-67.73.26.172.Dial1.LosAngeles1.Level3.net] has joined #mythtv
19:54<Octane>i expected svideo out with clone option to work right out the box
19:55<hadees>Octane: what is wrong with the output?
19:55<Octane>hadees: i think at least something is wrong with it
19:55<Octane>maybe its normal
19:55-!-Ripp [~chris@dsl30-175.chouteautel.com] has joined #mythtv
19:55<Octane>its not sharp at all
19:55<Octane>its really jittery
19:56<hadees>what driver are you using?
19:56<Octane>uhm, 4363
19:56<hadees>do you have all the experimental stuff enabled in mythtv?
19:56<Octane>geforce 4 mx 440
20:01<CyberKnet>My bttv card wont change channel. It stays on the tv guide channel no matter what channel I select =(
20:06<Doukegata>is there documentation on the mythfrontend interface? specifically I'm looking for what the little hammer and the "no money" symbols mean in the recorded video list
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20:09<CyberKnet>Doukegata: I know that that was discussed on the list about a month ago
20:10<CyberKnet>Doukegata: I dont know what they mean, but I'm sure a gossamer threads search for money would turn it up
20:10<Doukegata>I'll go looking for a list, and also inside said list
20:11<Doukegata>in dev or users?
20:12<CyberKnet>users
20:12<Doukegata>k, thanks. commencing lookup...
20:13<CyberKnet>http://www.gossamer-threads.com/perl/mailarc/gforum.cgi?post=79108;search_string=hammer;guest=1514267&t=search_engine#79108
20:13<CyberKnet>hope that helps
20:17<CyberKnet>dammit. Redhat removed my bttv options from modules.conf
20:19<bline>it probably uses a modules.d directory for conf options..
20:22<thor_>hmm
20:22<CyberKnet>not that I can find. I looked because debian uses a modutils directory
20:22<CyberKnet>I think kudzu did it
20:22<thor_>just upgraded dev box to latest CVS, OSD disappears there as well.
20:22<thor_>Here's an "error" message though:
20:22<thor_>Unknown video codec: 2003-11-06 20:21:14 Changing from WatchingLiveTV to None
20:24<CyberKnet>I got one of those, but it was from the .12 release, and instead of saying changing from WatchingLiveTV to None, it said something about changing volume
20:25<thor_>OSD on Watch Recordings does work
20:26<Doukegata>CyberKnet: thanks... I found that same thread on my own, though
20:26-!-mdz [~mdz@dialup-67.73.26.172.Dial1.LosAngeles1.Level3.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20:27<Doukegata>bleh, another playback freeze
20:28<CyberKnet>no problem Doukegata
20:28<CyberKnet>I don't know too much, but I try to help where I can =)
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21:02<Chutt>thor, is it _trying_ to draw the osd?
21:04<Chutt>thor, i'd stick some debugging in videooutbase.cpp::DisplayOSD()
21:05<thor_>ok
21:05<thor_>hang on
21:06<thor_>I backed up CVS to October 31, and all is well again
21:06<thor_>(now, how do I unstick date in update, just -D?)
21:09-!-hfb [~hfb@adsl-63-201-201-224.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net] has joined #mythtv
21:12<warlord>-A, no?
21:13<warlord> -A Reset any sticky tags/date/kopts.
21:13<thor_>too
21:13<thor_>late
21:13<thor_>(but thanks)
21:13<warlord>*shrugs* HtH
21:15<Chutt>thor, and it breaks on nov 1st?
21:15<Chutt>or when? =)
21:18<thor_>works on Oct 31, rebuilding current
21:18<thor_>something weird though ...
21:18<thor_>I made the box on the study it's own master, and the OSD came back
21:18<thor_>s/on/in
21:46<Octane>i wish i wish that i would be smart
21:46<Octane>i would have mythtv working without a heart
21:46<Octane>attack
21:50<thor_>OK, clean checkout and build, no OSD
21:50<thor_>time to start to cout'ing videooutbase.cpp
21:51<warlord>thor_: can you use date-stamps to figure out when exactly it stopped working?
21:51<thor_>well, there's not that much between the 31st and now
21:51<thor_>let me see if it's at least "trying to draw"
21:51<warlord>Ok
21:53<thor_>doing this on the dev box, single bt848 card
21:54<hadees>Are there functions in mythtv for making custom OSDs in the tv? if i wanted to add a stock ticker or somthing
21:54<thor_>hadees, you probably want to look at the caller ID stuff
21:56<thor_>well, it gets to DisplayOSD, and the *osd pointer to type OSD is not null
21:58<thor_>"OSD locking patches from Kenneth Aafloy" sounds like a likely thing to look at (?)
21:59<Chutt>that shouldn't be it
21:59<thor_>ok
22:00<thor_>this "Unknown video codec:" line worries me
22:00<Chutt>can you try a checkout from the 2nd?
22:00<thor_>yup
22:00<thor_>exact time ?
22:00<thor_>of just 2nd
22:00<thor_>or
22:01<Chutt>yeah
22:01<Chutt>some stuff went in on the first, some stuff went in on the 5th
22:01<thor_>k
22:01<thor_>so just -D 11/02/03 ... building now
22:02<thor_>(with no distclean)
22:02<Chutt>i'd do a distclean :p
22:02<Chutt>just in case
22:02<thor_>well, let me see without first
22:02<thor_>as a distclean takes about 20 minutes here
22:06<thor_>although this isn't looking much faster ...
22:10-!-DogBoy [~john@cs2428116-149.houston.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving"]
22:13<thor_>we have osd
22:15-!-DogBoy [~john@cs2428116-149.houston.rr.com] has joined #mythtv
22:15<thor_>so ... something in the 5th commit
22:16<Chutt>well, that helps
22:16<Chutt>=)
22:17<Chutt>you have deinterlacing on or off?
22:17<thor_>checking ...
22:17<thor_>was on
22:18<thor_>suppose I should go back to current ...
22:18<Chutt>and just to confirm, you _don't_ get that 'Unknown codec:' with the build from the 2nd, but you do get it with current cvs?
22:19<thor_>Unknown video codec: <-- occurs in bot cases
22:19<thor_>both
22:19<Chutt>hm
22:19<Chutt>ok
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22:23<thor_>(building current, I'll be back in 10 mins)
22:38<thor_>OSD works when Deinterlacing is *not* selected with current
22:40<thor_>same on (now) standalone system in study (Deinterlacing On == no OSD)
22:41<thor_>which is a PVR-250
22:42-!-mdz [~mdz@dialup-67.73.7.147.Dial1.LosAngeles1.Level3.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
22:58<Chutt>allright
22:59<Chutt>so, it's definitely the filters =)
22:59<Chutt>in NuppelVideoPlayer.cpp, InitFilters()
22:59<josephk_>I suppose thats a new kind of filter...no OSD sounds like a cool trick...hehe
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23:00<Chutt>at the very end of the function, can you print out video_width, video_height, postfilt_width, and postfilt_height
23:00<Chutt>no idea what it could be yet, though
23:01<thor_>yup .. hang on
23:08<thor_>without deinterlacing, all are 480
23:08-!-FryGuy [~fryguy@c-24-2-50-122.client.comcast.net] has joined #mythtv
23:08<thor_>ditto with deinteralcing
23:09<warlord>Hmm, Chutt, have you ever noticed that if you start recording a program, then start watching it, at some point you stop being able to FF? It's particularly true when you're watching across the endtime.
23:15-!-brian____ [~brian@rrcs-west-67-52-96-220.biz.rr.com] has joined #mythtv
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23:15<jedir0x0r>hi guys
23:15<jedir0x0r>So like, I'm having problems wih mythgame
23:15<jedir0x0r>no games show up, and i do have some snes games
23:16<jedir0x0r>anyone here?
23:28<Octane>youre having problems with mythgame?
23:28<Octane>im having problems with linux!
23:33<Chutt>then quit bitching about it and install windows
23:34<Chutt>thor, could you comment out the filter stuff in videoout_xv.cpp, processframe?
23:37<FryGuy>chutt: can I send you a patch and you tell me if I did it right?
23:38<FryGuy>i found a problem, but I don't know what the ramifications of fixing it the way i did are
23:38<thor_>yuo
23:38<thor_>p
23:38<FryGuy>i don't know if I need to terminate the current thread (or process.. i'm not familiar with multi-threading) also
23:39<Chutt>sure
23:39<thor_>just the if and then
23:40<FryGuy>http://burntpopcorn.net/deleteme/mythtv_video0inusefix.diff
23:41<FryGuy>the problem is in the nuppelvideo::startrecording, where it will return if the video is not found, but not set recording=true, so it gets stuck in the infinite loop in tv_rec.cpp
23:42-!-nulltank [~irc@c-66-41-110-140.mn.client2.attbi.com] has joined #mythtv
23:42<Chutt>thor, yeah
23:43<thor_>yup, that "fixed" it
23:43<thor_>with or without deinterlacing, OSD works
23:43<Chutt>fryguy, that's not how to fix it properly
23:43<FryGuy>i figured.
23:43<jedir0x0r>hi guys
23:43<jedir0x0r>:D
23:44<jedir0x0r>I installed MythTV on a gentoo system... it rocks.
23:44<jedir0x0r>I'm having a prolem with mythgame however... it's not showing my roms.
23:44<FryGuy>should I let you figure out a proper way to fix it, or should I wait for you to suggest a better way?
23:44<Chutt>jedir0x0r, you just asked that.
23:45<Chutt>fryguy, just add an error condition it can test for
23:45<jedir0x0r>Chutt: yeah, sorry.
23:45<FryGuy>change the prototype on startrecording?
23:45<Chutt>no, you'd have to set a variable
23:45<Chutt>or whatnot
23:45<FryGuy>i thought about that too.
23:46<FryGuy>other than the hack to time out, is the way of aborting the rest of the stuff correct?
23:46<FryGuy>like, do I need to exit the process or something?
23:47<jedir0x0r>So nobody knows anything about mythgame?
23:47<FryGuy>somebody does
23:47<FryGuy>the guy that wrote it would I assume
23:47<Chutt>fryguy, well, no
23:48<Chutt>i'd say it'd just be better to turn those returns in startrecording into exits
23:49<FryGuy>i'm terrible at multi-threaded programming :(
23:49<thor_>jedir0x0r, http://www.gossamer-threads.com/perl/mailarc/gforum.cgi?post=55670;search_string=snes%20roms;guest=1515098&t=search_engine#55670
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23:49<FryGuy>i thought that would kill the main mythbackend process or I would've done it
23:49<thor_>Chutt, you want me to see what *frame looks like after the Filter's have returned ?
23:49<Chutt>yeah
23:49<Chutt>before and after
23:50<Chutt>fryguy, yup, it would
23:50<Chutt>but those are all fatal errors.
23:50<Chutt>so...
23:50<FryGuy>not really
23:50<FryGuy>i've got two tuners
23:50<FryGuy>so one can fail and the other will still record
23:51<Chutt>then you'd have to make it recover from those errors
23:51<FryGuy>and it's weird because it isn't really in use. I think another mythbackend process is using it at the instant it tries to open it, then it gets stuck
23:51<Chutt>and just continuing in tv_rec without doing anything isn't recovering :p
23:51<Chutt>another mythbackend process can't use it
23:51<jedir0x0r>thanks for the link
23:52<FryGuy>are you sure?
23:52<Chutt>yup
23:52<FryGuy>hmm
23:53<FryGuy>what would be the way to tell tv_rec to abort the current recording?
23:54<Chutt>i don't know right off
23:54<Chutt>if you're going to do something about it, try to figure it out
23:54<Chutt>i'm not going to write it for you
23:54<FryGuy>ok
23:57<Chutt>thor, any luck?
23:58<Chutt>i'm just going to revert the filter api patch
23:58<Chutt>unless you see something obvious
23:58<thor_>yup
23:58<thor_>heh
23:58<thor_>Above filterList->ProcessFrame():
23:58<thor_> height = 480
23:58<thor_> width = 480
23:58<thor_> bpp = 12
23:58<thor_> size = 345600
23:58<thor_>Below filterList->ProcessFrame():
23:58<thor_> height = 0
23:58<thor_> width = 0
23:58<thor_> bpp = 0
23:58<thor_> size = 0
23:59<Chutt>there's tons of bugs in it in NVP.cpp
---Logclosed Fri Nov 07 00:00:24 2003