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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2003-12-07

---Logopened Sun Dec 07 00:00:06 2003
---Daychanged Sun Dec 07 2003
00:00<bobnvic>It is usually with LiveTV for me.
00:00<Lenolium>Who wants to attempt to help me with mythtv tonight? When attempting to watch livetv all I get is a black screen and "waiting for prebuffer" on the debug output. I have tried the xawtv + aplay thing in the FAQ and it works fine. I have a seprate frontend machine from the backend machine.
00:02<Chutt>gdb.
00:03<Lenolium>Chutt, Where should I set the breakpoints?
00:03<Chutt>what breakpoints?
00:04<Chutt>why would you need a breakpoint to debug something hanging?
00:04<Lenolium>Chutt, Gdb would never give me any output, would it?
00:04<Chutt>you can always interrupt execution, you know.
00:06<Lenolium>I guess you have a point.
00:06<Chutt>nothing's going to get fixed until you provide information as to what's going wrong.
00:06<Chutt>just describing what happens isn't enough
00:07<Lenolium>This backtrace is suprisingly unuseful.
00:08<Lenolium>#4 0x400bda55 in ThemedMenu::handleAction(QString&) () from /usr/local/lib/libmyth-0.13.so.0
00:08<Lenolium>Then two ??'s , then a usleep and a nanosleep
00:08<Chutt>either you don't have things compiled in debug mode, or your gdb is broken.
00:09<Lenolium>Chutt, Probably not in debug mode... let me give it another compile.
00:09<Lenolium>Rebuilding...
00:12<Lenolium>Chutt, What information would be useful to you?
00:13<Lenolium>Is there a sample .nuv stream that I can watch, to rule out that it is the frontend that is hosed?
00:13<Captain_Murdoch>Chutt, what do you think of adding something like "Recording Groups". (can't think of a better term right now). The playbackbox would display a single group or all groups and groups could be password protected. When you setup a recording you specify a group to put the recording into otherwise it goes into the default group. So I could have Drama, Home Improvement, Sports, Movies, etc. groups and make browsing on the playbackbox
00:13<Captain_Murdoch>d even allow the user to change the group of a recording from the playbackbox. this would solve the "problem" someone was asking about archiving on the mailing list and would solve a few things I've been wanting for a while.
00:13<billytwowilly>hmm. I'm getting sound on my remote frontend if I watch a recording, but no sound if I watch live tv..
00:14<Netslayer>it worked before u messed it up in other words heh, like me
00:15<Netslayer>if i'm using a line in on my sound card to do the recording, what would generaly be the record source in the ./setup?
00:16<Captain_Murdoch>/dev/random, but some people prefer to use /dev/dsp0
00:19<Chutt>captain_murdoch, sure
00:19<Netslayer>how would i know, i mean guess and check is pretty sad
00:19<Captain_Murdoch>I was about to say something about you going to sleep reading my long description.
00:21<Captain_Murdoch>Chutt: so you think that'd be beneficial? people could even create groups for kids, etc.. could even lock a frontend into a single group if somebody made a patch for adding a setting like that.
00:23<billytwowilly>could someone point me in the direction of what is wrong with my setup? I get sound when watching recording on my remote frontend, but no sound when watching livetv.
00:23<billytwowilly>on the actual backend livetv works fine.
00:24<Netslayer>that makes no sense
00:24<billytwowilly>err on the backend that I'm connecting to remotely I have a frontend setup and it works fine with live tv.
00:24<billytwowilly>Netslayer: I realized that moments after I said it;) I hope that next sentence clears things up.
00:24<billytwowilly>sorry.
00:24<Captain_Murdoch>guess I'll think about it this week. thinking about a 'recordinggroups' table with a group name and id. then add the id field to record and recorded. have to think about it more. just thought of the idea tonight while browsing through the playbackbox.
00:27<bobnvic>I'm trying to recompile and want to clear out old versions (following instructions for compiling with gdb support). I type "make clean distclean" and get "make: *** No rule to make target `distclean'. Stop." Do I need to qmake first or something else?
00:27<Captain_Murdoch>the recording group could also be used for the thing that one guy was looking for to show when him and his wife/kids had watched something so he'd know when it could be deleted. Just move a show into a different group, or even move it into the Auto-Expire group and it'd get deleted automatically if need be.
00:28* Captain_Murdoch types (and talks to himself) while he thinks
00:28<billytwowilly>bobnvic: I think you need to run qmake to make a makefile..
00:28<Captain_Murdoch>"make distclean" only works if you're run qmake and make previously. it doesn't uninstall any previously installed files though.
00:28* billytwowilly hopes someone will give him pointers.
00:29<billytwowilly>would make uninstall work? I mean as long as no new files were added between versions?
00:29<Captain_Murdoch>might, haven't tried that. who would want to Uninstall Myth? ;)
00:32<bobnvic>so make distclean doesn't effect files that aren't in the mythtv directory?
00:33<billytwowilly>Captain_Murdoch: I wanted to uninstall mythtv after trying for 10 hours to get the freakin sound to work on mandrake 9.2;)
00:33<billytwowilly>I uninstalled it and then threw on knoppmyth;)
00:33<billytwowilly>so I suppose the short answer is someone wanting to upgrade;)
00:36<fulbert>I'm setting up a new backend server on rh9, I recall some talk about using qt 3.2, I have 3.1, should that still be used with 0.12+ ?
00:36<billytwowilly>fulbert: are you just using it for mythtv?
00:36<fulbert>yeah
00:36<billytwowilly>you might want to check out knoppmyth..
00:36<billytwowilly>it'll make your life way easier.
00:37<billytwowilly>I think 3.1 will be fine though, because that's what I'm using on my mythfrontend box.
00:38<fulbert>I'm a little behind the times I guess, that looks like a full dist with myth in a can?
00:39<billytwowilly>yep.
00:39<billytwowilly>it's pretty nice.
00:39<billytwowilly>I'm using it on my main box right now.
00:40<billytwowilly>simplifies setup greatly.
00:40<fulbert>I might give it a try on one of my frontends, but I guess the question was is the backend server just myth, and that answer is no, it has other minor functions too.
00:40<billytwowilly>read the docs with it if you want to set it up as a backend only because you'll have to comment out one line to get remote access to the db.
00:40<fulbert>I've had another system setup for some time, but I'm moving to a more dedicated machine.
00:41<billytwowilly>you can use apt-get to install whatever you need.
00:41<fulbert>the ivtv drivers keep crashing my file server, so I figured a more dedicated solution was in order ;-)
00:41<billytwowilly>hehehe;)
00:41-!-dakeyrus [dakeyrus@ephesus.rh.rit.edu] has joined #mythtv
00:43<billytwowilly>you might want to wait on this anyway.. I'd guess a new release is due shortly.
00:43<fulbert>does it support some of the stuff like the tvout for the pundit ?
00:44<billytwowilly>I don't know. I'd guess not. I'm not familiar with the pundit at all.
00:44<fulbert>I've been thinking of using those for fronends, but it's hard to tell how much tinkering will be needed to get that working.
00:44<billytwowilly>You can request it on the forum and they'll probably add it to r5.
00:44<billytwowilly>www.mysettopbox.tv
00:44<fulbert>ah, the asus pundit is a small form factor all in one applianice pc, lots of people have talked about using it on the mailing lists.
00:45<billytwowilly>oh, I remember hearing about that.
00:45<billytwowilly>I still don't know though.
00:45<fulbert>I'm just using mATX systems now, in those little coolermaster cases, like a fat VCR.
00:45<billytwowilly>If it's possible to get it working with mythtv then you can request it pointing to the info on getting it working and the knoppmyth guys will add it to r5.
00:45<billytwowilly>cool.
00:45<billytwowilly>nforce2?
00:46<fulbert>I'll take a better look at it, once my poor backend is running again.
00:46<fulbert>nope, I tend to stick with intel stuff, the boards I'm using are 865p based intel chipsets.
00:46<billytwowilly>I'm running a biostar m7ncg.
00:47<billytwowilly>nice.
00:47<fulbert>I've had my fun getting drivers and all working with via, and sis chips I the past, I'd rather spend $15 more for the board and not deal with all that mess.
00:47<billytwowilly>I thought about going intel, but I went nforce2 because cost/performance it blew intel out of the water.
00:47<billytwowilly>I'm a poor student;)
00:47<fulbert>I had one hell of a time getting the pvr250 cards running in a via board.
00:47<billytwowilly>the pvr250 is a fullsized PCI card right?
00:48<fulbert>not full, mid.
00:48<billytwowilly>it wouldn't fit in one of those slim mini-itx cases that only take half height PCI cards?
00:48<fulbert>full cards are rare now (well maybe other than like a 12 chanel 3ware card ;)
00:48<fulbert>this is not really so much as thin, you can see the case I used at: photos.fission.com/pvr
00:49<billytwowilly>http://www.a-computers.ca/imags/cd-100.jpg
00:49<billytwowilly>that's the case I'm using.
00:50<fulbert>that's cool. kinda like the sony and hp cases now. how large is that?
00:50<fulbert>mid-atx like?
00:50<billytwowilly>micro-atx.
00:50<billytwowilly>360x145x345
00:50<fulbert>oh, looks larger, hard to tell in the pic.
00:51<fulbert>can it lay down also ?
00:51<billytwowilly>yep. I have it laying on its side right now.
00:51-!-DogBoy [~jeffrey@cs2428116-149.houston.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving"]
00:51<billytwowilly>I'm using it because it's cheap.
00:51<Netslayer>if i set line in as capture source, shouldn't aplay /dev/dsp output what's coming into linein?
00:51<billytwowilly>69 canadian including the powersupply.
00:52<fulbert>heh, can I get one in windsor? ;)
00:52<billytwowilly>heh;) you could send me a cheque for whatever it costs plus whatever the shipping would be and I'd mail you one.
00:52<Netslayer>gosh u guys all from around my hometown
00:52<billytwowilly>Netslayer: where's that again?
00:52<Netslayer>winnipeg
00:52<billytwowilly>I'm from Edmonton.
00:52<billytwowilly>oh right. I think you mentioned that a bit ago.
00:52<fulbert>I'm outside detroit
00:53<Netslayer>ah close enough heh
00:53<fulbert>does that case need a special dvd/cd drive?
00:53<billytwowilly>nope, uses standard parts.
00:53<fulbert>cool. It's one of the nicer small, low cost cases I have seen.
00:53<billytwowilly>can fit 2 hard drives too, but I haven't tried it.
00:53<billytwowilly>Probably get too hot.
00:54<fulbert>I spent a little more on that cooler master, but I wanted something that looked good with the rest of my black AV gear.
00:54<billytwowilly>and/or not enough power.
00:54<billytwowilly>Yah, if I had the cahs I would have gone coolermaster too.
00:54<billytwowilly>very nice cases.
00:54* billytwowilly has case envy;)
00:54<fulbert>I have one of my front ends pxe booting now.
00:54<billytwowilly>pxe?
00:54<fulbert>netbooting
00:54<billytwowilly>oh.
00:54<fulbert>no local disc
00:55<billytwowilly>cool.
00:55<billytwowilly>hey, you use remote frontends, you might be able to point me to how to fix this.
00:56<billytwowilly>I have my main machine running downstairs in that case with a frontend and backend running on it. I have my computer upstairs that I have a frontend on. when I watch livetv on my remote frontend I get no sound, but when I watch recordings I get sound just fine.
00:56<billytwowilly>any ideas on what is screwed up?
00:56<fulbert>are they both set to the same sound rate/format ?
00:57<billytwowilly>both frontends?
00:57<billytwowilly>I don't know...
00:57<billytwowilly>heh. I'll look into that.
00:57<billytwowilly>Probably not actually.
00:57<fulbert>the cap settings for each, are they both 48/44/32kHz etc
00:57<fulbert>that may do it.
00:57<fulbert>I recall something like that when I first setup.
00:58<fulbert>It's been a while, and I hardly ever use liveTV. I'm never home to watch anything live it seems.
00:58<billytwowilly>crummy. lemme run downstairs and check if the sound is setup the same.
00:58<billytwowilly>brb
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01:04<billytwowilly>holy crap do I feel retarded. another family member had been down watching a dvd on the computer and unplugged the sound.. must have done it sometime in the last 36 hours.
01:04<billytwowilly>works fine now...
01:04<fulbert>heh
01:05<billytwowilly>fulbert: Do you have any links to info on what has to be done to get mythtv working on the pundit?
01:06<billytwowilly>I'll make an r5 feature request for knoppmyth if you point me to the info.
01:06<billytwowilly>That way it'll already be there when you want to use it;)
01:06<fulbert>not off hand, there have been strings from time to time on the users mailing list about the pundit.
01:07<fulbert>it just came up that some friends came by a week or to ago and they really want me to build them one, and I was looking for a more boxed setup for them
01:07<billytwowilly>If you find me a couple url's I'll be happy to do the rest.
01:07<fulbert>I'll take a look now, I'm waiting for my dual celeron 500 to compile myth ;-)
01:08<billytwowilly>hehehe;)
01:08<billytwowilly>Thanks.
01:10<fulbert>http://pvrhw.goldfish.org/tiki-page.php?pageName=rh9pvr250
01:10<fulbert>that page seems to talk about getting the pundit running, the pundit I guess is a nforce based board
01:11<billytwowilly>hmm. it shouldn't be a problem then. you might be able to just use it out of the box.
01:11<billytwowilly>lemme take a look and I'll get back to you.
01:12<fulbert>cool. I hope to have a pundit box next week, one of my friends was so hardcore about waning me to build one he ordered the parts, now I just have to make it work ;-)
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01:16<billytwowilly>hmm. it looks like 2 howtos built into one.
01:16<billytwowilly>one is for the nforce2 boards and the other is for the pundit.
01:16<fulbert>yeah, it's more or less an overall rh9 myth install, with notes about nforce and pundit systems
01:16<billytwowilly>Looks like it'll only need the ethernet drivers and video drivers
01:16<billytwowilly>the video drivers might already be in knoppmyth.
01:17<billytwowilly>Ok, I'll request it for r5 for you then. It looks like it'll be easy to do.
01:18<Netslayer>i need a tip
01:18<Netslayer>i can hear audio when source is connected to line in
01:18<Netslayer>it's coming in directly, but if i mute that and try aplay /dev/dsp like the docs say i just get static
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01:19<billytwowilly>I find it easier to use alsamixer and to fiddle with the volume on the two line ins to figure out which is which, then mute the one you want to record and set record ..
01:20<Netslayer>how do u set it to record from that one?
01:20<Netslayer>when i press the space bar i see nothing change
01:20<billytwowilly>it's graphical..
01:20<billytwowilly>it'll be at the top I think.
01:20<billytwowilly>one second.
01:20<Netslayer>it's not working for me
01:20<Netslayer>i can mute it with M, but that's it, no set source
01:21<billytwowilly>hmm. space bar should set it to record.
01:21<Netslayer>what changes graphicly?
01:22<billytwowilly>you should see "Captur" in red about the bar
01:22<Netslayer>nope..wtf
01:22<billytwowilly><> should set recording of left and right chan independently.
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01:23<Netslayer>every time i touch m, <, or > it makes it [off]
01:24<Netslayer>like mute
01:24<Netslayer>i have some devices market capture...hmm
01:25<Netslayer>but still aplay /dev/dsp is static
01:26<billytwowilly>I'm not sure..
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01:28<fulbert>heh, 'make install -j2' does not work with myth
01:28<fulbert>I guess parallel install is a bad thing
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01:30<billytwowilly>fulbert: Does the pundit have tv-out?
01:30<fulbert>yeah
01:30<fulbert>http://usa.asus.com/products/desktop/pundit/overview.HTM
01:30<fulbert>the only stupid thing, is that the only SPDIF is on the front.
01:31<fulbert>what they were thinking, is beyond me.
01:31<fulbert>so if you want to use digital audio, you need the front door open, and a cable there all the time, makes the nice clean small box a lot more ugly on the stack.
01:32<fulbert>they have a new small pc too, but it's a little unknown what all it has hardware wise.
01:32<fulbert>http://usa.asus.com/products/desktop/digimatrix/overview.HTM
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01:33<fulbert>looks nice, but has the same stupid problem with SPDIF on the front, behind a door...*smack*
01:33<billytwowilly>what would one of these things go for price wise?
01:33<fulbert>I think they are about ~225 or so
01:33<fulbert>USD
01:33<billytwowilly>heh. I don't imagine it would be too hard to just cut the cable going to the SPDIF on the front and rewire it? It's not optical is it?
01:34<billytwowilly>and that's without processor/hard drive etc?
01:34<billytwowilly>I can build my own for less;)
01:34<fulbert>it's 180 for the base, no cpu/ram/disc
01:34<Netslayer>think i see something amixer shows my line source with only pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined abilities and no cvolume..for capturing
01:34<billytwowilly>hmm. it runs a celeron?
01:34<fulbert>yeah, it's the small/quiet part that a lot of people are into, and it passes the ugly in the TV area test too.
01:35<fulbert>yeah, it's a p4/cel 533FSB SiS board
01:35<billytwowilly>hmm. the new one looks too small to throw a tv card in.
01:35-!-cmorgan [~cmorgan@cpe-68-118-244-105.ma.charter.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
01:35<fulbert>it may be. I know the pundit can hold the 250, but it's said to run a little warm.
01:36<billytwowilly>I wouldn't buy it then celeron=crap. even the duron soundly beats it (and it's WAY less expensive).
01:36<billytwowilly>Although I suppose that wouldn't matter if you were running a pvr-250.
01:36<billytwowilly>I guess it's just the principal of the thing;)
01:36<fulbert>yeah, the lack of the cache really kills it. I have a cel 1.8 as one of my front ends now.
01:37<billytwowilly>I'm sorry to hear that;)
01:37<fulbert>it takes longer to compile myth on it, than on my dual celeron 500 (p3 based).
01:37<fulbert>it was cheap, someone gave me the chip ;) I know why now too!
01:37<billytwowilly>come, switch over to the dark side;) buy an athlon;)
01:38<billytwowilly>That digimatrix looks awesome.
01:38<fulbert>I have some AMD stuff, I just don't like trusting things that I want to run 24/7 to them, lots of bad luck with the crazy chips sets and drivers.
01:38<fulbert>I'd really like to give the opteron a try, for once a AMD chipset with what looks like the industrys support...
01:39<billytwowilly>That's too bad. I've had nothing but good luck with them.
01:39<fulbert>but the price remains too high now, in 6 months, when the second core is out...
01:39<billytwowilly>Yah, the opteron will run you a grand easy up here.
01:39<Netslayer>can someone running ALSA do me a quick favor and open /etc/asound.state and tell me generally how big it is. mine is 3000 lines.. think that's not good
01:39<fulbert>same here, and I never like first gen hardware.
01:40<billytwowilly>plus it's kind of scary because the industry might get behind intel and the totally new processor architecture and then those who are running an athlon64 are boned.
01:40<billytwowilly>I don't think that will happen though.
01:40<fulbert>intel is in the hole now. they should have never passed up a 64bit extension of x86 of their own.
01:41<billytwowilly>Netslayer: 2308 lines
01:41<fulbert>it's hard to tell, AMD is smart, Intel is smart and has a lot of cash.
01:41<Netslayer>thx..hmm
01:41<billytwowilly>yah. didn't AMD post losses the last couple quarters?
01:42<billytwowilly>Opteron 244/242/240 $699/499/329
01:42<fulbert>not sure
01:42<billytwowilly>Athlon 64 3200+ socket 754 Processor 639
01:42<billytwowilly>Athlon 64 FX-51 socket 940 1144
01:43<fulbert>AMD seems to have slowed up with the stuff as the opteron hit, they have been lagging intel's top systems for a while now.
01:43<billytwowilly>best prices I've been able to find on the athlon 64 stuff.
01:43<billytwowilly>That'll change as everything gets switched over to the 64 bit cpus.
01:43<fulbert>I want a dual CPU opteron, on the Tyan Thunder board, but I also don't want to spend $1500.
01:43<billytwowilly>although from what I can tell their rating system is accurate on the side of caution.
01:45<fulbert>yeah, it's hard to tell.
01:45<billytwowilly>because the p4's have fairly poor performance/clock cycle.
01:45<billytwowilly>wow.
01:46<billytwowilly>the digimatrix looks awesome.
01:46<billytwowilly>it has an HDTV tuner card in it.
01:46<fulbert>I come from a background with proprietary unix stuff, mostly Sun and SGI where they have had a 64bit platform for a long time now, and the 64bit code tends to not add speed in most stuff I found.
01:46<billytwowilly>What is the benefit of 64 bit then?
01:46<fulbert>in most cases, running 64bit code is slower, since it tends to want more ram and execution cache
01:46<billytwowilly>Just more memory?
01:47<billytwowilly>averting the unix/linux clock problem??;)
01:47<fulbert>well, you can get at more ram yes, and there are some bandwidth issues with very high end stuff that can be solved.
01:47<fulbert>but as far as running a single app, it's not going to add a lot.
01:47<fulbert>for the desktop, it's going to matter most that you can break 4GB of RAM
01:48<billytwowilly>So you think it's a good idea to have 32/64 combined like the AMD solution?
01:48<fulbert>yeah, it makes the most sense. That's more or less what you find with the RISC chips, like Sparc and MIPS, they have both cores, 64bit is an extension.
01:48<fulbert>as an example, I run a lot of mail servers.
01:49<fulbert>I can compile postfix as a 64bit app under Sun Soalris, and I get a speed drop, the binary is larger, needs more RAM, and it's not adding anything for me. I compile most things in 32bit mode, even on the 64bit kernel I run the system with.
01:50<fulbert>now, a large Oracle server running 64bit, can make use of the larger pipe to gain performance, but smaller sites running 64bit oracle, are just eating more resource to do the same thing I find.
01:50<billytwowilly>So basically 64 bit only helps if you have things that need huge bandwidth on the motherboard?
01:52<fulbert>in my experince, yes. Now, what the desktop will do with it, is another question. one thing to deal with is the fact that while Solaris and IRIX (SGI unix) have had 64bit for 5+ years now, most of their core apps are still provided as 32bit apps, because so far no one has redone apps to tweak for any potential 64bit speedups.
01:53<fulbert>if developers with linux/windows take more advantage, it may yeild more performance I'd guess, but so far, mostly 3rd party apps, like Oracle, and other RDBMS packages are the only stuff you see as 64bit apps, that really need it.
01:54<fulbert>and with Solaris and IRIX you also have a lot of custom developed apps, in medical, engineering and so on, that are in 64bit, but they were wrote with that in mind, it's not like you are getting 64bit video editing apps, or that silly app that all the TV stations run their weather with, most of that stuff remains 32bit, 5 years after the 64bit conversion on those platforms.
01:55<billytwowilly>That's good to know.
01:55<billytwowilly>I had no idea.
01:55<fulbert>one thing I do find that is faster as a 64bit app, is mutt. I don't know why. ;-)
01:56<fulbert>'/usr/local/bin/mutt: ELF 64-bit MSB executable SPARCV9 Version 1, UltraSPARC1 Extensions Required, dynamically linked, stripped'
01:56<Netslayer>where can i get btaudio from?
01:56<fulbert>I was playing around one day, and got it to compile, and found that it opens and closes the mailbox way faster as a 64bit app, makes no sense really.
01:57<billytwowilly>maybe the guy that writes it uses it on 64bit systems and thus has tweaked it?
01:57<billytwowilly>Netslayer: Isn't it included with alsa?
01:57<Netslayer>hmm
01:57<fulbert>could, but he didn't note that anywhere. It could also be that the device driver for the software raid on solaris is 64bit
01:57<Netslayer>could be why it's not working
01:58<fulbert>it's not as much of a speed gain on another machine I have with non raid disc.
01:58<billytwowilly>Could be.
01:59<billytwowilly>well, I think I'm going to head off to bed.
01:59<billytwowilly>g'night all
01:59<Netslayer>ltr
01:59<fulbert>nite
01:59-!-billytwowilly [~chris@h24-66-18-138.ed.shawcable.net] has quit ["Client exiting"]
01:59<Netslayer>i have btaudio loaded
02:00<Netslayer>but when i go aplay /dev/dsp0 or /dev/dsp1 which are analog and digital btaudio ports (dmesg says) it's all static
02:22-!-Octane [octane@dsl092-100-149.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
02:26-!-shamoun [~shamoun@c-24-10-37-99.client.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
02:26<Netslayer>i don't get this it always says something is using /dev/dsp when i try to goto livetv, but fuser -v /dev/dsp shows nothing
02:47-!-Octane [octane@dsl092-100-149.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #mythtv
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02:47<billytwowilly>argh.. can't sleep
02:47<Octane>:)
02:47<Octane>i dont want to slepe
02:48<Octane>i hate sleeping, but thats cliche to say
02:48<billytwowilly>heh.
02:48<billytwowilly>are you running a pvr-250 or 350?
02:49<Octane>250
02:49<Octane>nothing at the moment though since i whiped out my mythbox and put windows on it for my mom
02:49<billytwowilly>what kind of file sizes do you get with that when recording?
02:50<billytwowilly>1gb/hour?
02:50<Octane>1.3 i think
02:50<Octane>is Kingston good ram?
02:50<billytwowilly>for home use.
02:50<Octane>for myth use
02:50<Octane>:)
02:51<billytwowilly>should be fine.
02:51<Octane>512mb corsair pc2700 or 512 kingston pc3200
02:51<Octane>both 80
02:51<billytwowilly>american?
02:51<Octane>yah
02:51<billytwowilly>That's quite a good deal Canadian. I don't know about american.
02:52<Octane>i know, but i dont know what is hould go for
02:52<billytwowilly>go search google.
02:52<Octane>i did
02:53<Octane>the kingston can do .5 gigs more a second
02:53<Netslayer>why does alsa suck so much to setup
02:53<billytwowilly>because it isn't designed for humans to setup. It's designed by coder gnomes for coder gnomes;)
02:54<Netslayer>i'm a junior in comp sc already heh
02:54<billytwowilly>junior is first year?
02:54<Octane>okay... case, dvd, floppy, hdd, ram, mobo, cpu (have hsf)
02:54<Netslayer>3rd
02:54<Octane>am i missing anything
02:54<Octane>oh and have tuner
02:54<Octane>oh yah, graphics card
02:55<billytwowilly>Netslayer: and that's at a uni, not community college type thing?
02:55<Netslayer>ya
02:55<billytwowilly>ethernet.
02:55<Octane>whats a good cheap card for a windows box
02:55<billytwowilly>probably built into mb though.
02:55<Octane>that will just be used for office
02:55<billytwowilly>something nvidia.
02:55<Netslayer>oh shit
02:55<Netslayer>my v4l capture card just vanished off my box
02:56* Netslayer goes crazy no myth box makes chris go crazy....
02:56-!-robbie_ [~rob@ESS-p-144-138-94-88.mega.tmns.net.au] has joined #mythtv
02:57<billytwowilly>hmm. I'm recording at 480 by 480 with mpeg4 and getting 3.2 gb/hour file sizes. Is the only way to make the file size smaller to decrease resolution?
02:57<billytwowilly>Or is there something else to fiddle with?
02:57<fulbert>that's large data
02:57<Netslayer>bitrate
02:57<fulbert>I do 720x480 and only get 2.1GB/hr
02:57<fulbert>at 4/6 VBR
02:57<Netslayer>i get 1gb/hr at 2300
02:58<Netslayer>"I DID"
02:58<billytwowilly>Netslayer: 2300 and 480 by 480?
02:58<fulbert>err, sorry, thats 1.2GB and hr for me
02:58<Netslayer>how ironic i unpluged my vcr today
02:58<billytwowilly>1.2 is more palatable;)
02:58<Netslayer>640x480
02:58<billytwowilly>much more palatable;)
02:58<Netslayer>2300 is a good bitrate for mpeg4.. it's just right
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02:59<Netslayer>ok so now nothing really works on my system omg
02:59<billytwowilly>hmm. it's set at 2200 kb/sec..
02:59<billytwowilly>why are my file sizes so big? hmm.
02:59<Netslayer>uncompressed audio?
02:59<billytwowilly>maybe mythweb is just screwed up and reporting incorrectly.
02:59<fulbert>anyone know how to get myth's setup app to dump me a xmltv file without having graphics to run it?
03:00<billytwowilly>Netslayer: Should be mp3. lemme check
03:00<Netslayer>that's it, my system is screwed i give up, i've lost all audio and now all video today
03:00<Octane>anyone use a good wireless card?
03:00<Octane>err
03:00<Octane>wireless keybaord
03:00<Netslayer>smc 54g PCI
03:01<Netslayer>building another myth box with it in a few days
03:01<billytwowilly>yah. audio is mp3..
03:01<billytwowilly>hmm. I'm going to set some more recordings and see what it gets recorded at.
03:01<Netslayer>theres no way ur files are that big with mpeg4 2300
03:02<billytwowilly>That's what myth is reporting.
03:02<fulbert>I get 1.2GB/hr at 720x480 4-6 vbr, in direct mpeg-2 from the 250 cards.
03:02* Netslayer just turned into a pumpkin
03:02<billytwowilly>err mythweb
03:02<Octane>man
03:02<Octane>why is it that keyboards have to come with so much shit nowadays
03:02<billytwowilly>1 hr 6.2 GB
03:02<billytwowilly>that's emeril live;)
03:02<Octane>i just want a standard friggin keyboard
03:02<fulbert>octane, what, you don't want a "internet" button?? ;-)
03:03<Octane>lol :)
03:03<billytwowilly>how do I get a file size from the command line?
03:03<Octane>ls -l filename
03:03<Octane>or just ls -l
03:03<fulbert>I still use an old metal base IBM kb, I just have to use a AT to PS2, and now to USB adapter.
03:03<Octane>okay im gonna go with this belkin keyboard
03:03<billytwowilly>3445261337 would that be file size?
03:03<fulbert>ls -lh
03:03<Octane>i want it to be wireless though fulbert
03:03<billytwowilly>that was right before date.
03:04<fulbert>heh
03:04<billytwowilly>3.3G;)
03:04<billytwowilly>damn..
03:04<Octane>nowadays you cant even get a keyboard w/o a mouse too
03:04<Octane>so lame!
03:04<fulbert>what I want...
03:04<fulbert>is a optical mouse _without_ a wheel!!!
03:04<fulbert>I hate that wheel. I was three buttons, and no wheel.
03:04<Netslayer>check your profiles, ur probably not editing the right one or using the right one for recording
03:04<billytwowilly>Octane: You obviously haven't found the right place;) You just need to find a guy and/or small business pc builder.
03:05<Octane>newegg!
03:05<Octane>only!
03:05<Octane>i am a neweggist
03:05<billytwowilly>Netslayer: That's what I thought. the high quality was rtjpeg, so that could be causing it.
03:05<fulbert>I have never seen a optical 3 button mouse without a wheel, makes me insane.
03:05<billytwowilly>I changed them all to mpeg4 the way I wanted.
03:05<billytwowilly>why would you ever not want the wheel? It's so nice to have.
03:06<fulbert>I hate the wheel. I never use it, I always hit it when I want the middle mouse.
03:06<Octane>wow. this box comes out to be 426 w/o hsf
03:06<Octane>oh and no tv tuner
03:06<Octane>I'm going with the Asus A7N8X-X
03:06<Netslayer>auh well more fun setup two gentoo systems with mythtv, and a raid5 storage system in like 5 days, plus time for building IR transmitter/receiver, this will be fun
03:07<Octane>Netslayer wtf u broke or somethin tryin to make money? :)
03:07<Netslayer>i've given up on my server.. it's going to be reformatted
03:07<fulbert>raid5 can be hardcore slow in write speed for more than one recording at a time.
03:07* Netslayer shouts "u hear that mandrake, your outta there"
03:07<Octane>i was gonna do gentoo but i decided against it. i think
03:07<fulbert>I was using a 3ware card with raid5 and the performance was too low for 3 tuners at once.
03:07<billytwowilly>ahh. I found it;) freakin rtjpeg.. make my recordings so big..
03:07<Netslayer>have u tried that fulbret?
03:07<Octane>i think my new box will be debian
03:08<Netslayer>well 3 tuners, what cpu?
03:08<fulbert>yeah, I have a 12x80GB 3ware setup now.
03:08<billytwowilly>knoppmyth
03:08<Netslayer>holy crap
03:08<Netslayer>12
03:08<Octane>...
03:08<fulbert>I had to drop to 0+1
03:08<Octane>fulbert for myth?
03:08<fulbert>then I gave up, and just went jbod
03:08<Netslayer>i'm going with 4x160 on an amd xp 2700
03:08<fulbert>yeah, that's my storage for the backend.
03:08<Octane>jesus christ
03:08<fulbert>heh ;-)
03:08<Netslayer>heh
03:08<Octane>mine will be a 120 lol
03:08<billytwowilly>fulbert: That's insane. why didn't you just go with one of those IDE array boxes that plug into a scsi card?
03:08<Netslayer>ya i went nuts
03:09<Octane>oh wait i forgot to include an hdd in my purchase, LOL
03:09<fulbert>I was using 3x200GB
03:09<Netslayer>cpu?
03:09<Netslayer>it takes that much out of it to calc parity
03:09<fulbert>it's now a dual celeron 500
03:09<Octane>nm i did have an hd
03:09<Netslayer>think i should be fine, at most two tuners will be on at one time
03:09<fulbert>it was on my file server, which was dual 1GHz p3.
03:09<Octane>dwhat brand hdds fulbert?
03:09<billytwowilly>Octane: are you buying this online?
03:10<Octane>billytwowilly: yah, of course!
03:10<billytwowilly>Octane: You're from Canada right?
03:10<fulbert>the 12 80's are maxtor.
03:10<Octane>billytwowilly: no us
03:10<fulbert>the 3 200's were seagate
03:10<Netslayer>and how many are left?
03:10<billytwowilly>oh ok, nm.
03:10<billytwowilly>If you were from Canada I thought I could probably point you to a better deal;)
03:10<Octane>fulbert how do you feel about maxtors. i am right now transfering over things from my 80gb wd to my 120gb maxtor. first maxtor ive ever bought
03:10<Octane>i figured my mom doesnt need 120 gigs
03:10<Octane>so i give her 80 gigs :)
03:10<billytwowilly>maxtor scares me. boo 1 year warranty.
03:10<Octane>she doesnt even need 10
03:11<Octane>lol
03:11<Netslayer>maxtors are quite, but WD's are nice
03:11<Octane>i am buying a samsung for my new mythbox
03:11<Netslayer>7200 drives are all 3yrs
03:11<fulbert>they have been fine.
03:11<Netslayer>u haven't lost one yet?
03:11<Netslayer>(aka the whole array) heh
03:11<billytwowilly>I used to run maxtors. Now I run WD.
03:11* billytwowilly likes his three year warranty.
03:11<hEximal>which is quietest?
03:12<Netslayer>maxtor fluid dynamic bearing motor
03:12<billytwowilly>If you're running 12 I don't think it matters;)
03:12<Netslayer>heh
03:12<hEximal>heh
03:12<hEximal>yeah
03:12<fulbert>yeah, the fans alone are super loud
03:12<fulbert>it's all in a 3U case too ;-)
03:12<hEximal>hmm
03:12<billytwowilly>fulbert: Out of curiousity, what do you do again? You sound independently wealthy;)
03:12<hEximal>I remember seagates were loud
03:13<Octane>yah
03:13<Octane>you can also run hdparm -u128 i think
03:13<fulbert>I ran an ISP 95-01, and now I do telecom and web hosting stuff.
03:13<Octane>that makes your drive quieter
03:13<billytwowilly>cool
03:13<Netslayer>fulbert, what fs did u use? i'm thinking about XFS
03:13<Octane>use fxs for myth
03:13<Octane>xfs
03:14<Netslayer>where can i get a patch for 2.4.23 for that?
03:14<fulbert>I'm using ext3, with the largefile tweaks.
03:14<Netslayer>hmm theres tweaks
03:15<billytwowilly>fulbert: Do you have a link to the tweaks? I'll recommend that for knoppmyth too.
03:15<fulbert>mkfs.ext3 -T largefile4 -m 0 /dev/hda1
03:15<fulbert>that just sets sparce superblocks and larger blocks
03:15<billytwowilly>is there a way to tell if that's been used?
03:15<fulbert>waste less space on large files.
03:16<Netslayer>u do have to patch a 2.4 kernel for XFS don't u?
03:16<Octane>ooh newegg have a customer appreciation gift
03:16<Netslayer>that paper weight gosh
03:16<Octane>i get a tshirt ! :)
03:16<fulbert>yeah, dumpe2fs will report the current file system.
03:16<Netslayer>how much did u bye
03:16<Netslayer>buy
03:16<fulbert>I got a black newegg shirt!
03:16<billytwowilly>Octane: isn't newegg expensive?
03:16<Octane>its w/ any mobo or videocard purchase
03:16<Octane>billytwowilly: its the #1 computer web place
03:17<Octane>billytwowilly: but us only
03:17<billytwowilly>I buy on price;)
03:17<Netslayer>well the shirt prob costs them a buck
03:17<billytwowilly>probably 3-5...
03:17<Netslayer>ahuh
03:17<fulbert>it's a hanes!
03:17<Octane>lol
03:17* Netslayer thinks maybe it's time to goto sleep
03:17<fulbert>I washed it today
03:17<Octane>pricewatch is ghetto!
03:17<Octane>shrunk?
03:17<fulbert>pre shrunk hanes!
03:18<Octane>preshrunk??
03:18<Octane>elite!
03:18<Octane>did it fade?
03:18<Octane>lol why do i care its free
03:18<fulbert>not yet, only third wash
03:18<Octane>lol
03:18<Octane>ill take it to drycleans
03:18<fulbert>and I use Tide (tm) !! ;-)
03:18-!-marc [~Marc@195.218.18.41] has joined #mythtv
03:18<Octane>should i get small or medium
03:18<Octane>hmmm
03:18<billytwowilly>oooh.. fulbert pays to much for his detergent;) he must be independently wealthy;)
03:18<fulbert>heh
03:19<fulbert>I don't know what I use really, I actually buy whatever is on sale when I'm out ;-) I want to keep that cash!
03:19<Netslayer>wtf
03:19<Octane>he has a rig with 12 hdd's you do the math
03:19<Netslayer>This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.
03:19<Netslayer>Delivery to the following recipients has been delayed.
03:19<Netslayer> kent2@optusnet.com.au
03:19<Netslayer>for a mythtv post?
03:20<Netslayer>i'm sending it to mythtv-users@mythtv.org
03:20<Octane>okay. case + psu. done. liteon dvd. done. floppy check. hdd check. keyboard check. memory check. mobo check cpu check
03:20<Octane>video card for other box: check
03:20<Octane>okay, im ready!
03:20<fulbert>vid cap ?
03:20<Octane>gonna ship this purchase
03:20<Netslayer>oh wait.. weird those aren't my posts
03:21<Octane>nice, 496
03:21<Octane>20 s/h
03:21<Netslayer>i'm all ebayed out.. bought almost everything for the new myth online
03:21<Octane>on ebay?
03:21<Netslayer>hell ya
03:22<Octane>brb, gonna shutdown and take out hdd
03:22<Netslayer>geforce 4 mx 440 ($39), tons of cable.. um
03:22<Netslayer>dang i forgot all the stuff i bought
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03:22<Netslayer>auh.. well i gtg it's way too late
03:23-!-Netslayer [~Netslayer@c-24-126-201-221.we.client2.attbi.com] has quit []
03:30<fulbert>running the myth config app over a remote X client, on windows, is fun.
03:31<billytwowilly>well, all I can come up with is "boo windows"...;)
03:32<fulbert>yeah, that's what I was stuck with tonight. I'm tearing apart all my workstations.
03:32<fulbert>I'm amazed the X server lived with the glx extensions in use, it took about 2 minutes to draw screen, over a local network.
03:32<billytwowilly>heh.
03:32<billytwowilly>out of curiousity, how many computers do you have in your house?
03:33<fulbert>... running ?
03:33<billytwowilly>sure;)
03:33<billytwowilly>If you have to ask that I know it's going to be a scary answer;)
03:34<fulbert>8 intel, 2 mac, 6 sparc, 2 sgi, 1 hp, and 4 router, 3 switches.
03:34<fulbert>if voip phones count, I have 8 of those too, they have an OS, and I can telnet to them, so maybe.
03:35<fulbert>that's just what runs 24/7, it would scare me to inventory the non running stuff.
03:36<fulbert>anyone need a pallet of sparc 2's? ;-)
03:38<billytwowilly>heh. I don't want the sparc 2's but I'll take the 8 intel machines;)
03:38<billytwowilly>So what's your electricity bill like? grand a month?
03:38<fulbert>~$350
03:39<fulbert>I guess I forgot the myth frontend machines in there, add 3 more intel.
03:41<billytwowilly>heh. you pay for all your hardware?
03:41<billytwowilly>I know rcam gets most of his for free because he needs "samples" for his job.
03:41<billytwowilly>do you also need "samples"
03:41<billytwowilly>;)
03:41<fulbert>heh, I have had some free stuff from time to time.
03:42<fulbert>running the ISP I got hardware demo stuff alot.
03:42<billytwowilly>thus the pallet of sparc 2's?
03:42<fulbert>most of what I have now, is mine, but some of it is hand me down from running the ISP, I buy a lot of it as a company expense.
03:42<fulbert>yeah, I sometimes sell hardware too.
03:42<fulbert>I have qty. 45 SGI Octane systems in stock now...
03:43<fulbert>I know people who get off lease contracts to sell.
03:43<billytwowilly>ahh, so you don't pay retail. You get it at wholesale prices.
03:43<fulbert>that's how I get a lot of the Sun and SGI stuff.
03:43<fulbert>right, I had 100 Octane systems.
03:43<fulbert>I sold 50 as a lot, and the other half (-5) are more or less free now.
03:43<billytwowilly>I'm not familiar with the Octane systems.
03:44<fulbert>It's one of SGI's semi-current MIPS systems.
03:44<billytwowilly>So how would it compare to a semi-current intel system?
03:44<billytwowilly>completely different target market?
03:44<fulbert>250MHz workstations, 512MB, 9GB SCSI, and graphics, $150 US.
03:44<fulbert>well, it's about a P3 500ish speed.
03:44<fulbert>but with pretty damn fast 3d graphics.
03:45<fulbert>and it also has 48bit color, so it's aimed at pro graphics, cad, modling and the like.
03:45<fulbert>it's not made to have super fast cpu.
03:45<billytwowilly>that's semi-current?
03:45<fulbert>yeah, it was new in 2000.
03:45-!-Octane [octane@dsl092-100-149.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #mythtv
03:45<billytwowilly>hmm. so they would be selling 1 ghz systems now?
03:46<fulbert>the current ones are 650MHz, 1-12GB ram, and faster graphics, new cost is $10K +
03:46<billytwowilly>oh ok.
03:46<billytwowilly>What kind of software would run on that?
03:46<fulbert>they have way more bandwidth than an intel system, they move multi GB on their bus.
03:46<fulbert>well, IRIX, their unix.
03:46<billytwowilly>yah, but what pro graphics software?
03:47<billytwowilly>all the stuff I've heard of I haven't heard of a unix port, but I'm not that familiar with the graphics market.
03:47<fulbert>oh, like the stuff they use for movie, SoftImage, Maya etc.
03:47<fulbert>some other stuff like CAD packages, Unigraphics and ProE.
03:48<fulbert>There are a lot of uses around here, with all the auto makers, they use SGI systems in their design labs a lot.
03:48<billytwowilly>ahh, ok. That makes sense.
03:48<fulbert>they have high precision 3d hardware, they can do a lot of stuff that many of the consumer 3d stuff can't as well, but it's only useful for engineering needs.
03:48<billytwowilly>Do you think those systems will eventually go linux?
03:48<fulbert>it would run a game slow.
03:49<fulbert>yeah, they are moving there.
03:49<fulbert>they are all moving away from their RISC chips too.
03:49<billytwowilly>I've heard lots about the movie industry going linux.
03:49<fulbert>Sun has announced Opteron, and a 64bit Soalris port.
03:49<fulbert>movie places are going linux, art stuff does not care about the 48bit color, and higher precision OpenGL stuff.
03:50<fulbert>SGI has been "dead" for years.
03:50<fulbert>they only have high end market in hollywood, and the gov.
03:50<fulbert>almost all the government image systems are still SGI.
03:50<fulbert>and SGI has a large visulization server market.
03:51<fulbert>you can get 256way Origin systems from them still, and their IRIX NEUMA support still rules the industry.
03:51<billytwowilly>But that's slowly declining?
03:51<billytwowilly>you mean NUMA?
03:51<fulbert>yeah, marketshare overall is lower.
03:51<fulbert>yeah, NUMA, bad extra e.
03:51<billytwowilly>how would the NUMA stuff in 2.6 compare?
03:51<fulbert>SGI sufferd from the inability to market anything for years, and as a result, they lost a lot of customers.
03:52<billytwowilly>bastard child of the IRIX stuff?
03:52<fulbert>not sure, but the IRIX stuff is where the cutting edge stuff still is.
03:52<fulbert>they have active installs of 2048 at many sites.
03:52<billytwowilly>It'll be sad to see them die then.
03:52<fulbert>Linux still suffers from lack of hardware intergration, it's getting better and better though.
03:53<fulbert>SGI has been able to design their hardware closely with their OS, and they still lead performance per node at this time.
03:53<billytwowilly>performance per node doesn't matter though performance/$ invested does.
03:54<fulbert>they also have the advantage, that you can goto them, and spend 30mill and they know how to make it all work, it's a matter of using parts they know work, not building something from scratch and working around bugs as they appear.
03:54<fulbert>yeah, they still lead in value, for now, but it's getting closer as intel hardware gets faster.
03:54<fulbert>when opteron is ready for large cluster, it will take the lead.
03:54<billytwowilly>It'd be nice if they converted and dumped their NUMA stuff into the linux kernel.. it'd also be nice if pigs could fly...
03:55<fulbert>sgi has slowly been working at it.
03:55<billytwowilly>So basically sgi is dead in 2 years?
03:55<fulbert>most of the NUMA stuff in linux is from SGI as far as I know.
03:55<billytwowilly>not according to SCO;)
03:55<fulbert>SGI I thought was dead in 2 years in 2000, so I say they keep around for at least 2, but they are likely to be sucked into someone else soon after.
03:55<billytwowilly>according to SCO it's from IBM.
03:55<fulbert>yeah, everything is...
03:56<billytwowilly>I was pleased that the judge ordered them to essentially put up or shut up.
03:56<billytwowilly>anyhoo, noone wants to talk about that..
03:56<fulbert>yeah, we'll see if they do it.
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03:56<fulbert>I used to use a lot of SGI, but not anymore.
03:57<fulbert>I run a workstation or two, but that's it.
03:57<fulbert>IRIX has always been insecure, and a bit of a admin nightmare.
03:57<billytwowilly>Hmm. I thought you said you ran an ISP?
03:57<billytwowilly>why with the SGI?
03:57<fulbert>developers don't often test their stuff with IRIX, and building stuff is harder now.
03:57<fulbert>well, when I started with it, I used SGI servers for mail and web services.
03:58<billytwowilly>Did you sell off the ISP or did it go bankrupt??
03:58<fulbert>scaled back, then sold.
03:58<fulbert>it was early 01, it was a mess.
03:58<billytwowilly>suffering from the dotbomb?
03:59* billytwowilly gleefully espouses the buzzwords;)
03:59<fulbert>we were not a public ISP, that is, we only serviced business customers, and a lot of our customers were in the crapper, so we started to loose business fast.
03:59<billytwowilly>Oh, so you actually did T1, etc, not dial up?
03:59<fulbert>we were not the lowest cost, and we started to have to lower prices to keep customers, and then it got worse and worse.
04:00<fulbert>right, hosting, isdn, T1, DS3, OC3.
04:00<fulbert>we had 500+ websites, some large.
04:00<fulbert>we did the used car system backend for yahoo as an example
04:00<fulbert>we did large search engines for news papers and stuff like that.
04:01<billytwowilly>cool. That would have been neat.
04:01<billytwowilly>It sounds like you've made your money though, so no worries;)
04:01<fulbert>it was fun. very early on we did dialup, like a stack of modems on portmasters, all duct taped together ;-)
04:01<billytwowilly>hehehe;)
04:02<fulbert>We do telco service now, voip and the like.
04:02<billytwowilly>voip is interesting to me.
04:02<fulbert>yeah, we use the Asterisk system for a numbe of things.
04:02<billytwowilly>the phone company up here just switched their entire network over to voip.
04:03<fulbert>I converted my house to voip a year or so ago, all phone lines gone and ethernet for all now.
04:03<billytwowilly>it's great as long as the power doesn't run out;)
04:03<fulbert>heh, generator.
04:04<fulbert>it's needed with all this crap anyhow.
04:04<billytwowilly>you generate your own power?
04:04<billytwowilly>or just emergency backup?
04:04<fulbert>no, I have a backup 20kW
04:05<billytwowilly>That's handy.
04:05<billytwowilly>diesel?
04:05<fulbert>NG. I have 10kVA battery, then the generator. I can run 30 min on bat.
04:06<fulbert>the battery is a left over from the ISP.
04:06<billytwowilly>hmm. it's too bad you can't get realtime price quotes on electricity from your electric company. You could write a script to tie it in so that if NG is cheaper you run off of NG.
04:07<fulbert>yeah, NG was a lot cheaper, last 2 years cost is really up.
04:08<fulbert>The way it is now, I'd be better with diesel.
04:08<billytwowilly>I'm hoping someone invents a way to burn coal much more cleanly. Up here in Alberta we have something like 12000 years supply left at the current usage rate, and most of our power is generated with coal;)
04:08<fulbert>It costs me $9/day on the generator. Back in August I was hit with the blackout.
04:09<billytwowilly>so it's close to the same price then, or slightly more?
04:09<billytwowilly>you said 300 bucks a month electric bill right?
04:09<fulbert>~$350
04:10<billytwowilly>Heh, so you are better off on the generator if the cost is 9/day..
04:10<billytwowilly>what's the projected lifespan of the generator if you use it everyday?
04:10<fulbert>that 9/day on the gen, is with some stuff not running, like TVs and stuff, I didn't want to tax the generator while I was on the generator, I just had some lights, applicances, and the racks in the basement running.
04:10<fulbert>umm, I'm not sure.
04:10<billytwowilly>Oh, so it's not enough power?
04:10<fulbert>not for the entire home.
04:11<billytwowilly>That's too bad.
04:11<fulbert>it's only running the "important" stuff.
04:11<billytwowilly>Do you remember how much it cost?
04:11<fulbert>the genrator was $4500, and some cost to install it, but I did most of the install.
04:12<fulbert>I have 300amp service to the house, about 35 circuits, my transfer switch only runs 15 of them.
04:12<billytwowilly>hmm. it has to last 57 months with no maintenance to recoup the sunk cost.
04:12<billytwowilly>if you run it all the time.
04:13<fulbert>I'm reading about the maint cycle now.
04:13<billytwowilly>almost 5 years without maintenance to approach break even.
04:14<billytwowilly>It's probably not worth it.
04:14<fulbert>not likely.
04:14<billytwowilly>Unless it won't wear out.
04:14<billytwowilly>atleast not for as long as you need it.
04:14<billytwowilly>Then you can atleast recover some of your sunk cost.
04:15<billytwowilly>sorry, I'm a second year econ student;)
04:15<fulbert>heh
04:15<fulbert>yeah, there is little mention about the life cycle in the doc I have.
04:16<billytwowilly>I'd need to know your projected needed usage time and its projected lifetime as well as maintenance costs to figure it out exactly, but it's probably worth it to run it atleast part of the time if you save money over your electricity bill.. of course that's a pain in the arse;)
04:16<billytwowilly>anyhoo, I think I'm going to attempt sleep again.
04:17<fulbert>It needs a new air filter every 2000 hr
04:17<fulbert>heh
04:17<fulbert>ok, I should get to bed too, nite
04:17<billytwowilly>hehe
04:17<billytwowilly>g'night.
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05:20<topgun98>anyone know if there is a way to put an image over the text that appears while linux is booting up?
05:21<topgun98>never mind: www.bootsplash.org
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06:09<janek>anybody else getting problems with really quiet sound from dvb?
06:17<janek>(that is with a budget card, so the actual mp2 stream get's decoded to a very low volume compared to anything else I play on that PC)
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08:40<JDonavan>heya all
08:43<janek>hey
08:43<janek>hmm, I just had the volume turned too low in mythtv
08:43<janek>go figure
08:43<janek>and there I was blaming the dvb card ;)
08:44<janek>well, I was blaming libavcodec but heh ;)
08:46<JDonavan>heh I hate it when I assume the worst and it turns out to be simple.
08:59<janek>well, it could be worse ;)
09:00<janek>though I spent maybe an hour trying to fiddle with the scaling factors in the mp2 decoder and wondering why the audio was clipping ;)
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09:24<faye>does anyone know a combination of mythtv and ivtv which is stable for pvr 350 output?
09:25<JDonavan>you around thor?
09:27<faye>I'm seeing LOST IRQ, DMA read error, DMAP not set, Got DMA-done but not expecting one
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09:43<mzupan>i'm testing out mythtv without a remote.. and when i just go to watchtv.. i cannot change channels.. if i hit the up or down arrows.. the frontend locks up
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09:51<janek>mzupan: what kind of input device are you using?
09:52<janek>for the tv signal
09:52<janek>i've had similar problems with my dvb card if the channel I was trying to change to wasn't set up properly..
09:54<mzupan>pinnacle pctv
09:54<mzupan>it works fine in like tvtime and mplayer
09:55<janek>don't know to be honest, I'm just using dvb so the tuning is all different
09:55<mzupan>ok
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10:20<Rule>I'm having serious problems loading the mythtv database with channel information. I am seeing sql errors when importing a file using mythfilldatabase --file <filename> --manual ... I get "Table 'mythconverg.channel' doesn't exist"
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10:30<JDonavan>Rule - Have you done all of the database setup?
10:33<Rule>ok, I fixed that... sorry
10:33<Rule>the actual error is some duplicate records...
10:35<Rule>Duplicate entry '1006-20031212210000' for key 1
10:35<Rule>strange..
10:40<Rule>The main problem I am having is : how do I manually set the channel frequencies for configured channels ?
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10:56<Rule>is the frequency stored in the freid field, and if so, in what format ? Mhz*1000 ?
10:58<sfr>Rule: you might want to add --preset to set up the channels table. see mythfilldatabase --help for details
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11:24<renchi>heh... crowded in here
11:24<D-side>not much talking though
11:27<janek>true
11:27<D-side>i'm mad at myth and alsa.
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11:28<renchi>D-side: what card
11:28<D-side>pundit's built in 810.
11:29<D-side>OSS works just fine though.
11:29<D-side>only in watching/recording tv via myth does the problem show up.
11:29<D-side>the problem being, only left channel audio works.
11:30<renchi>D-side: alsamixer doesn't help?
11:30<D-side>not in the slightest.
11:30<D-side>mythdvd, music, all the modules that use audio... perfect.
11:31<D-side>other non-myth related sound stuff, no problem
11:31<D-side>playing back nuv's recorded on a different box, no problem.
11:31<renchi>i'm also ready to ditch my onboard soundcard. too much static
11:31<D-side>anything w/ the line in on the pundit just sucks.
11:31<D-side>which one is that?
11:31<renchi>nforce2
11:32<D-side>interesting.
11:33<D-side>same core chipset really.
11:33<renchi>yeah its the same chipset intel8x0
11:33<D-side>havent heard reports of static on it, thats interesting.
11:33<D-side>irq issue?
11:34<renchi>don't think so. its a problem with the mb. i have heard of other people talking about the same problem with the same mb. some interference problem
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11:35<D-side>ah, that sucks. i'm sorry to hear that.
11:35<D-side>what board, so i can avoid it
11:35<D-side>if i can ever resolve the alsa audio issue, i'll wholeheartedly recommend a pundit. :)
11:36<renchi>shuttle AN35N-ultra. solid mb otherwise. i have never seen such short bootup times
11:38<D-side>heh.
11:38<D-side>afk a bit. food
11:41<janek>D-side: have you tried recording the sound with another app? From what you are describing it sounds like you're recording in mono...
11:41<janek>could also be that you've got one of the non-stereo tuner cards, perhaps...
11:42<renchi>whats a good sound card (read cheap) with toslink
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11:45<renchi>anyone else using a leadtek winfast 2000 XP card
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11:47<gerhard>hi all, I have a probl. with tv_grab_sn, it does not update my channel listings anymore, I also upgradet XMLTV to o.5.24. Does someone know what to do?
11:49<renchi>gerhard: http://membled.com/work/apps/xmltv/#grabber_news
11:49<D-side>janek: absolutely.
11:49<D-side>janek: works fine in everything but myth.
11:50<renchi>D-side: as janek said the tuner card might a mono card
11:50<D-side>janek: as an aside, i'm not getting audio through the tuner card. its a digital cable receiver dumping audio directly into the soundcard's line-in
11:50<D-side>renchi: see above. :)
11:50<D-side>and no, its not mono anyway, were i using it.
11:51<gerhard>renchi, thats not good, do u know if there is something else I could do?
11:51<renchi>gerhard: contact the xmltv guys. they will be in the best position to help you out
11:52<D-side>renchi/janek: quite a problem i'm facing, eh? :)
11:53<janek>odd, for sure :)
11:53<janek>but probably something like me poking around in libavcodec for hours trying to find out why audio was too quiet only to find that the mixer was set too quiet ;)
11:53<renchi>janek: and have you tried recording from the cable receiver to see if its stereo (i'm guessing you have already)
11:54<renchi>oops should be to D-side
11:54<gerhard>yhanks I will look into that
11:54<D-side>janek: i wish it were something so simple. OSS works. :/
11:54<D-side>renchi: oh sure. like i said, OSS driver is just fine.
11:54<D-side>now i'm just used to using alsa and i want it fixed, not worked around.
11:54<D-side>of course as I dont code, I have no room to complain.
11:55<janek>ah, right, so some kind of alsa setting
11:55<janek>sounds like alsa thinks it's supposed to record in mono, but play back in stereo
11:55<D-side>hm. could be.
11:55<D-side>wait no.
11:55<D-side>and i'll tell you why.
11:56<D-side>playback via the line in (i.e. unmuting line in alsamixer) works just fine, both channels.
11:56<D-side>recording through myth yields the single audio channel issue.
11:56<D-side>unless my logic is flawed, sounds like its not an alsa issue.
11:56<renchi>D-side: quick search on google shows that people seem to be using pundit-alsa-mythtv without any problems. you might want to post on the lists
11:57<D-side>renchi: other posts on the list talk about this SAME problem with i810 devices, but no posted fixes
11:57<janek>actually that does make it sound like a recording settings issue, as when you're listening to the line-in it's not recording anything, just routing it through the mixer on the sound card
11:58<D-side>hm.
11:59<D-side>seems my testing the line input was flawed. should i perhaps try unmuting the capture setting in the mixer?
11:59<D-side>whats a quick app i can use to record something to wav?
11:59<D-side>believe it or not i've never used one in linux.
12:00<janek>krec or whatever the gnome equiv is
12:00<janek>or audacity perhaps..
12:00<D-side>heh. no kde or gnome. off to google/freshmeat i go
12:01<Rule>which database field holds the frequency of a channel ? and what format ? Mhz*16 ?
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12:03<renchi>D-side: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Sound-HOWTO/x504.html#AEN611
12:03<D-side>janek: i appreciate your help, btw.
12:03<janek>how annoying, the music channels don't work any longer (too weak reception)
12:03<janek>D-side: I wish I could help more...
12:03<D-side>janek: well at least this way i'll narrow it down to a myth or alsa issue.
12:03<janek>unfortunately I don't know a great deal about either mythtv or alsa ;)
12:03<D-side>wish i could code. :)
12:03<janek>(well I've learned a little bit about mythtv dvb stuff over the weekend ;))
12:04<D-side>emerging audacify.
12:04<D-side>or audacity.
12:05<Rule>help :)
12:05<D-side>what theh
12:05<D-side>afk
12:05<Rule>can anyone give me the output of the channel table for their setup ?
12:06<janek>Rule: it probably wouldn't be much use to you as I'm using dvb, which doesn't have frequencies in the channel table ;)
12:06<D-side>okay this isn't goddamned funny.
12:06<D-side>now its working?!
12:07<D-side>so what. i wake up after spending 6 hours with it yesterday, change nothing, and now it WORKS?!
12:07<janek>what, in mythtv? ;)
12:07<D-side>i swear i'm going to throw this thing out the window
12:07<renchi>D-side: maybe a loose connection. happens to me all the time with headphones
12:07<Rule>janek : hehe ok, thanks anyway :)
12:07<D-side>renchi: i wish! the physical connections havent changed, and yesterday i shook it like an English nanny
12:07<janek>d-side: so is it recording in stereo in mythtv now, or in audacity?
12:08<D-side>myth!
12:08* renchi cheers
12:08<janek>heh
12:08<D-side>i'm going to reboot it and see if it freaks again
12:08<janek>we fixed it!
12:08<janek>;)
12:08<D-side>no you dont understand
12:08<janek>i'm kidding
12:08<D-side>the last thing i did last night was switch to OSS.
12:08<janek>oh ok
12:08<D-side>now, its using alsa again
12:08<D-side>and i dont remember rebooting it.
12:08<janek>that is odd I guess
12:09<renchi>D-side: maybe a power cut
12:09<janek>yeah, check what uptime says
12:09<D-side>first, a restart of alsa
12:09<D-side> 12:09:20 up 11:15
12:09<D-side>nope.
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12:10<D-side>uh.
12:10<renchi>maybe an angel set things right for you :)
12:10<D-side>mythbackend is at 99% cpu, and its doing nothing.
12:10<D-side>haha screw it i'm rebooting it and if it does this again its going in the dumpster.
12:10<D-side>of course, I still appreciate your help fellas.
12:10<janek>you mean other than having turned into an AI and messing around with your sound systems? ;)
12:11<janek>D-side: send it to me before you throw it in the dumpster ;)
12:11<D-side>i might sell it.
12:11<D-side>its a pundit. :)
12:12<Zeran>hmm
12:12<Zeran>hey all
12:12<D-side>okay so playing live tv from my workstation as frontend works. now lets try the tv itself. afk
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12:17<D-side>janek: this is absolutely unbelievable. its working fine.
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12:33<janek>D-side: heh :)
12:33<janek>congratulations, I suppose
12:33<janek>anyway bbl, got to do the shopping
12:33<D-side>heh
12:33<D-side>have fun
12:33<D-side>i'd celebrate this, but theres no proof it wont happen again
12:33<Zeran>heheh
12:33<Zeran>what did you get working?
12:34<D-side>audio was fouled up on my pundit
12:34<D-side>and for no good reason, it started working.
12:34<D-side>hell. "dont look a gift horse in the mouth"
12:39* Ripp is back (gone 14:02:53)
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12:50<Zeran>nice
12:50<Rule>hmmm for some reason I can tune to all the channels starting with "E" (such as E5,E6,E7,etc), but none of the others such as M9 or U3 ...
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14:25<Netslayer>do u guys recommend KDE for myth? Thinking it might be a little much considering myth is all I'm going to use the remote frontend/slave backend for
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14:33* Invisi yawns
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15:05<D-side>i use fluxbox.
15:05<D-side>shows you what i think of that. :)
15:10<Netslayer>wow that's scary
15:10<D-side>how so
15:11<D-side>makes perfect sense.
15:11<Netslayer>aaaaa transparent windows, nice..wait kde does that
15:11<D-side>you're using it a frontend. what do you care what the windows look like?
15:11<Netslayer>ya i'm thinking..might be better to use
15:12<Netslayer>it's actually going to be a slave backend also
15:12<D-side> i've never done that before. :)
15:12<D-side>w/ a slave backend are you able to sync between the shows stored on the master and the slave?
15:12<Netslayer>Windows Managers don't effect hardware at all right.. they won't screw anything up?
15:12<D-side>like, a frontend will list all of them?
15:12<D-side>thats right, it'll be fine.
15:13<Netslayer>slave backend stores all shows on the master backend system
15:13<D-side>ah.
15:13<Netslayer>it just is an extra tuner pretty much remotely
15:13<D-side>but it does the recording itself?
15:13<Netslayer>ya
15:13<D-side>hm.
15:14<D-side>i'm trying to figure out what else i'm going to do with this box. :)
15:14<Netslayer>actually i'm wondering if i can set presidence to which tuner to use. aka if someone is using the frontend with the remote backend it would be nice for that one to use it's own tuner
15:14<Rule>hmm why is mythfrontend using 100% cpu when watching livetv...
15:15<Netslayer>frontend only?
15:15<Rule>no
15:15<D-side>Rule: your recording profile is set to silly options?
15:15<D-side>oh
15:15<D-side>frontend, not back.
15:15<D-side>good question.
15:15<Rule>I don't think so, it's pvr350 in/out
15:15<Rule>ps and top show mythfrontend processes as using all cpu
15:16<Netslayer>might want to check your video card drivers
15:16<Netslayer>is fluxbox quick to emerge?
15:16<D-side>ivtv could be having a fit? dunno. dont have one of those cards. yet.
15:16<Rule>video card ? It's tv-out
15:16<D-side>Netslayer: oh god. its tiny.
15:16<D-side>Netslayer: gentoo eh?
15:16<D-side>Rule: ivtv qualifies as a video driver.
15:16<Netslayer>ya
15:16<Rule>yeah but not much to check there :P
15:16<Netslayer>ohya forgot your right
15:17<Rule>it should be sending the mpg stream to /dev/video16, that is almost 0% cpu
15:17<Netslayer>500K for fluxbox?!
15:17<Rule>what remains is OSD ?
15:18<D-side>Netslayer: like i said.
15:18<Netslayer>does it have a /Autostart for autostarting myth?, stuff like that
15:18<D-side>Netslayer: now, in gentoo tell me how to start X immediately as a user. :)
15:18<D-side>no, but you've got an .xinitrc for that
15:18<Netslayer>startx
15:19<D-side>uh.
15:19<D-side>no.
15:19<D-side>start x immediately as a user on boot.
15:19<Netslayer>really
15:19<D-side>i.e. xdm/gdm/kdm
15:19<Netslayer>hmm not sure.. myth box 'was' mandrake
15:19<D-side>i'm having a hard time convincing gdm it doesnt need to use gnome.
15:19<term>I'm fairly sure you can't start gdm as a user.
15:19<Netslayer>startkde, startgnome
15:19<jeffpc>use xdm...
15:19<term>and why are you using gdm anyway?
15:20<jeffpc>it's simple
15:20<jeffpc>(xdm)
15:20<D-side>jeffpc: xdm (vanilla, unpatched) can boot directly into a user? couldnt find any docs on that.
15:20<D-side>term: if i dont have to, i wont. ;)
15:20<term>if you want to go directly into X, just create an .xinitrc for that user and start that
15:20<jeffpc>D-side: oh...not sure
15:20<D-side>without logging in at the console.
15:20<D-side>and no, i'm not doing an init script to login and do that.
15:20<term>just tack it onto the last script or add an S99 script to that runlevel
15:20<D-side>bah. kludge.
15:20<D-side>no.
15:20<term>no it's not.
15:20<D-side>deeznuts it isnt!
15:21<D-side>what do you want me to do, su - user, then startx?
15:21<term>then change the inittab runlevel a
15:21<term>that's how gentoo starts X with *dm anyway
15:21<term>no, no logging in
15:21<D-side>sure, but as this is going to be set top i want a proper display manager running.
15:21<term>you want this to run as a user?
15:21<D-side>just for the fact that MAYBE i might want to drop from that session and log into a gnome session or something.
15:21<term>or as root?
15:21<D-side>absolutely.
15:21<D-side>user.
15:22<D-side>X? as root?
15:22<D-side>:)
15:22<term>hm
15:22<D-side>i just want to tell gdm to shut the hell up, stop whining, and use fluxbox instead of gnome.
15:22<term>well I can think of a way to do it.
15:23<term>gdm'll go right into soemone's session?
15:23<D-side>Netslayer: since you're a gentoo user, want a pretty bad bootsplash theme for mythtv? :)
15:23<D-side>term: absolutely.
15:23<term>ah.
15:23<D-side>it'll autologin as a user.
15:23<Netslayer>sure
15:23<term>change the default session
15:23<term>that's simple.
15:23<D-side>i know xdm can do it after you patch the crap out of it.
15:23<D-side>i'm not into that.
15:23<D-side>term: tried that.
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15:23<term>in /path/to/gdm/Sessions/
15:23<D-side>yeah.
15:24<D-side>i've got a /where/gdm/lives/Sessions/fluxbox script
15:24<D-side>thats nothing more than "exec fluxbox"
15:24<term>is that linked to Default or whatever it uses?
15:24<D-side>in the gdm.conf its set to the profile to use
15:24<term>hm there's no default.
15:24<term>odd
15:24<D-side>term: you act as if i'm a newbie. :)
15:24<term>I looked into this once (setting the default)
15:25<term>GnomeDefaultSession, what a dumb variable name
15:25<term>D-side: no, just that lately I mention something and you go "yeah I didn't want to look into that" :)
15:26<D-side>haha
15:26<D-side>well, its possible i f'ed my gdm.conf.
15:26<D-side>lets have a look.
15:26<term>hm
15:27<term>the gnome session stuff clearly is meant for gnome-session
15:27<D-side>right
15:27<term>you might be able to screw with that though and make it run fluxbox :)
15:27<term>0,id=default0
15:27<term>0,Priority=0
15:27<term>0,RestartCommand=fluxbox
15:27<term>etc
15:28<D-side>maybe, but its SUPPOSED to take a session defined in Sessions/
15:28<term>but I'm hacking
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15:28<D-side>heh
15:28<term>what variable did you set that with?
15:29<D-side>hang on
15:30<D-side>waht
15:30<D-side>wait even
15:31<D-side>where the hell DID i set that...
15:32<D-side>bah. i'm smoking crack. afk.
15:32<D-side>this is what happens when audio fucks me, i cant figure out apmd, and 17 other things go wrong.
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15:33<term>heh
15:35<D-side>term: i told you audio mysteriously started working, right?
15:35<term>no
15:36<D-side>term: audio mysteriously started working.
15:36<term>heh
15:36* Netslayer wants audio to mysteriously start working
15:36<term>now all that has to be determined is why :)
15:36<D-side>apparently, i loaded the oss sound module, and after i rebooted alsa started again (as usual)
15:36<D-side>then it worked.
15:36<term>hm
15:36<D-side>explain TAHT
15:36<D-side>THAT even
15:36<term>I'll have to keep screwing with it.
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15:41<CyberKnet>does anyone here use mythtv on redhat 9 with atrpms?
15:46<billytwowilly>CyberKnet: I've found it's just easier to get the right settings if you compile from source or use knoppmyth
15:48<warlord-afk>CyberKnet: I use RH9, but not ATrpms
15:48-!-warlord-afk is now known as warlord
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15:49<CyberKnet>I see.
15:50<CyberKnet>warlord: what permission/owner do you have your mythtv store as? And do you use mythweb? What user/group are the files?
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15:52<warlord>what do you mean "mythtv store"? And no, I do not use mythweb -- I dont trust php
15:53<CyberKnet>Aha. I just meant the place where mythtv stores the stuff recorded from live tv
15:53<CyberKnet>s/live//
15:53<warlord>Ahh.. Um..
15:53<CyberKnet>But if you don't use MythWeb, then it doesn't matter =)
15:53<warlord>drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Dec 7 11:52 /var/mythtv/video/
15:54<CyberKnet>I'm trying to repermission the directory so that the apache user/group has read access to it
15:54<Netslayer>think they are all apache
15:54<CyberKnet>Netslayer: that's what my directory + files are... apache:apache
15:55<Netslayer>and did u check your apache config
15:55<CyberKnet>Netslayer: yep.
15:55<CyberKnet>/etc/httpd/conf/httpd.conf
15:57-!-faye [~faye@marmite.zippysoft.com] has joined #mythtv
15:57<warlord>mode 755 will allow anyone to read the directory.
15:58-!-synthmeme [synthmeme@node-4024382a.dca.onnet.us.uu.net] has joined #mythtv
15:58<CyberKnet>drwxrwxrwx 3 apache apache 4096 Dec 7 14:50 .
16:00<CyberKnet>oh well.. I need to worry about 0 byte recordings now. I think I saw something about it on the list recently, so I'm off to search the archives.
16:01<warlord>CyberKnet: you've got a pvr-x50?
16:02<CyberKnet>an avermedia M179. I figure whatever it was will apply
16:03<synthmeme>I ger *really* quiet audio playing live TV through /dev/dsp. I'm on an nforce2 motherboard with the intel-i8x0 ALSA drivers, have normal audio in mythvideo/mythdvd et al. Any thoughts on how I can track down the problem?
16:03<D-side>set "use internal volume controls" ?
16:03<synthmeme>it's set
16:04<D-side>i'm out of ideas. :)
16:04<synthmeme>:)
16:04<CyberKnet>warlord: why do you ask?
16:05-!-billytwowilly [~chris@h24-66-18-138.ed.shawcable.net] has quit ["Client exiting"]
16:11<warlord>Well, ivtv has a problem where it will sometimes fail to read data.
16:14-!-Jy- [~Jy@alb-24-194-246-200.nycap.rr.com] has joined #Mythtv
16:15<Jy->anyone around to help?
16:28<Jy->anyone know why my screen licks up if i try to change channels?
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17:07<synthmeme>hrm - can't seem to get recorded shows to delete either using 'i' or 'd' from Watch Recordings or from Delete Recordings. All the videos in my store are owned by the user running both the frontend and the backend. Anything I'm missing?
17:07-!-mchou [~mchou@c-24-6-158-93.client.comcast.net] has joined #mythtv
17:07<synthmeme>I have verbose logging turned on for both the frontend and backend, and no errors are being reported
17:09-!-kslater [~kslater@24.svnf1.xdsl.nauticom.net] has joined #mythtv
17:11<kslater>dvdprobe.cpp: In member function `bool DVDProbe::probe()':
17:11<kslater>dvdprobe.cpp:557: `DVDUDFVolumeInfo' undeclared (first use this function)
17:11<kslater>dvdprobe.cpp:557: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once for each
17:11<kslater> function it appears in.)
17:12<kslater>was that a known and recently fixed problem with MythDVD or have I run into something unique?
17:13<mchou>anyone know if ivtv supports audio for avermedia m179 yet?
17:13<synthmeme>checked w/ #ivtv?
17:14<mchou>synthmeme: bah, I was hoping someone here might know offhand....
17:14<mchou>:)
17:15<kvandivo>mail archives are a wonderful thing
17:16<mchou>kvandivo: I checked mail archives, lots of people buying m179, but no definitive reports of whether audio works (unless I missed it....)
17:16<kslater>I thought it was working. lmatter over on the epia channel should know for sure. He did some captures with M179
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18:24<bbeattie>ahh, too bad, mythfrontend segfaults when I try to swap PIP when watcing 2 HDTV shows. :-/
18:36<faye>what is the best ivtv to use with mythtv atm if you want to use pvr350 tvout?
18:38<synthmeme>faye: you using .12 or CVS of mythtv?
18:39<faye>CVS
18:39<faye>is it better to use .12?
18:39<synthmeme>http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/axboe/ivtv/ivtv-031125A.tar.bz2
18:40<synthmeme>there have been a couple of patches on the ivtv-dev list since then, but that's the one you should be using
18:41<faye>I'm having DMA problems with 25A
18:41<synthmeme>you're not alone ;)
18:41<faye>that's nice to know :)
18:43<faye>I already took SMP out of the kernel, is there anything else I should do to try to fix it?
18:44<synthmeme>don't know. might want to check #ivtv and ivtv-dev@...
18:46<faye>I'm trying to find the patches on poptix.net
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18:46<faye>I wish they'd released that new self-healing ivtv
18:47<synthmeme>or self-authoring drivers :P
18:47<faye>now that would be cool
18:48<faye>woo, 25A seems to be working for the moment
18:48<faye>I'd better not sneeze
18:49<faye>oh no I sneezed and now it's stopped :)
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19:11<Jy->anyone know why mythfrontend just locks up when i try to change channels with the up/down arrows?
19:12<synthmeme>using a hardware decoder?
19:12<Jy->pinnacle pctv
19:12<Jy->if i stay on the channel its fine.. till i try to change it
19:13<billytwowilly>does the channle you stay on look funny?
19:13<Jy->nope
19:13<billytwowilly>is it actually locked up, or is it just taking forever to change channle?
19:13<Jy->locked
19:13<billytwowilly>I had a similar problem with my ati tv wonder, but it was because the card wasn't set right.
19:13<Jy->i've waited 2 minutes once
19:13<billytwowilly>that card use the bttv drivers?
19:13<synthmeme>i had similar problems with a pvr-350 until i installed the latest ivtv
19:13<Jy->was it not set right using the bttv driver?
19:14<billytwowilly>Yah, I hadn't set the card type properly.
19:14<Jy->options bttv
19:14<Jy->i just use that.. when i tried to set it to the card it wouldn't work
19:14<Jy->heh.. maybe i'll try again.. just to make sure though
19:15<billytwowilly>options bttv pll=1 radio=0 card=63 tuner=2 gbuffers=4
19:15<billytwowilly>I have that set and my card works fine.
19:15<billytwowilly>you probably have th change card= to something else.
19:16<Jy->ok i'll give it a try
19:16<Jy->thanks
19:16<billytwowilly>no problem.
19:16<billytwowilly>would you like all my bttv settings?
19:16<Jy->sure
19:16<Jy->it works with tvtime and such.. just not myth
19:16<Jy->firewall
19:17<billytwowilly>wrong button;)
19:18<Jy->i'm testing it out on my desktop first.. see if i need a new capture card or not.. i'm thinking about build a dual amd 1900 htpc
19:19<Jy->building
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19:20<billytwowilly>probably be better to go single processor and just buy two pvr-250's..
19:20<Jy->its gonna be my main desktop and webserver also
19:20<Jy->gonna put 3 machines into one
19:20<billytwowilly>nevermind then;)
19:20<billytwowilly>you should still probably go with pvr-250's though.
19:21<billytwowilly>~3% cpu usage while recording vs 50-80%
19:21-!-tmk [~no@c-24-6-225-39.client.comcast.net] has joined #mythtv
19:21<Jy->how much do they cost?
19:21<tmk>anyone know if myth will freak out if i rename a .nuv file to something else?
19:21<Jy->thats the winTV ones?
19:21<tmk>will the index get screwey or something?
19:21<D-side>tmk: freak? probably not.
19:21<D-side>wont read it though
19:21<tmk>sorry
19:21<tmk>i meant replace
19:21<D-side>unless you change the sql entry accordingly.
19:22<tmk>ie switch out a transcoded mpg
19:22<billytwowilly>Jy-: yah.
19:22<D-side>now you're losing me. youve got a transcoded mpg (non-nuv)?
19:22<billytwowilly>179 bucks canadian at shoppers drug mart. I don't know what they would be american.
19:22<tmk>it's a pvr nuv
19:22<tmk>so basically it's an mpg
19:22<Jy->billytwowilly, ya this pinnacle card is around 3 years old so it'll probably suck
19:22<tmk>i converted it to a svcd type mpg
19:22<D-side>oh i see, okay.
19:22<Jy->around $150
19:22<D-side>okay.
19:23<Chutt>tmk, just to be safe, delete the data that matches that from recordedmarkup
19:23<D-side>so basically you want to mv the file, not the filename.
19:23<billytwowilly>Jy-: I'm going to replace my ati tv wonder. I'm starting to get lines and such in the tv signal.. not the greatest cards.
19:23<tmk>k thx chutt
19:23<Chutt>tmk, and you may want to run mythcommflag on it
19:23<tmk>on the file?
19:23<Chutt>yeah
19:23<Jy->billytwowilly, thanks for the info
19:23<tmk>what's that do? just curious
19:23<Chutt>that'll regenerate the data in recordedmarkup
19:23<tmk>spiffy thanks
19:23<Chutt>well, it's meant for doing the commercial flagging, but it does that too
19:23<tmk>i see
19:23<tmk>makes sense
19:23<Chutt>did you see the patch from david engel on the mythtv-dev list?
19:23<billytwowilly>Jy-: no problem. I hope it's of use to you. I'm not sure if it will be because it's a different card, but it should be close to what you need to get it working.
19:24<Chutt>for some test pvr-350 enhancements?
19:24<tmk>nope
19:24<tmk>url me
19:24<D-side>i always figured the frontend would only playback nuv encoded filetypes, but of course it can at least handle pvr encoded mpegs.
19:24<Chutt>no url
19:24<tmk>fine i'll go look :)
19:24<Chutt>www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-dev/
19:24<Chutt>this month, 'Experimental pvr 350 output patch'
19:24<faye>Chutt: is that the ones that stop it opening/closing every time?
19:24<Chutt>yeah
19:25<tmk>i found that converting to svcd saves about 6x the space
19:25<Chutt>since he went and did what i didn't want to do, ie, use direct firmware controls
19:25<tmk>1.8 gb -> 350 mb
19:25<tmk>quality is good
19:25<faye>It seems to work ok, changing channel is much quicker
19:25<Chutt>i just got my epia-m back running
19:25<Chutt>so i can play with my 350 now
19:26<D-side>i think I want to stick a 250, 350, or m179 into my pundit.
19:26<D-side>how are the 179's looking now? whats the status?
19:27<D-side>as i scroll up and see this previously discussed...
19:27<tmk>i didn't hear it was broken :<
19:28<D-side>neither have i
19:28<faye>pvr 350 still stops working but without the open/closes it stays working longer
19:28<tmk>i would discourage the use of the fwapi direct from myth
19:28<D-side>i'm just wondering if its worth spending money on, currently
19:28<tmk>i told him to use that for testing
19:28<tmk>but it looks like he put it in the patch
19:28<Chutt>tmk, right, that's why it's not in cvs :p
19:28<tmk>:)
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19:29<Chutt>he has write access
19:29<tmk>m179 patch should go into the ivtv main branch in the next week or so
19:29<tmk>with the new version
19:29<tmk>well not THE m179 patch
19:29<Chutt>you merging in jens' latest as well?
19:29<tmk>kind of
19:29<tmk>I rewrote the init
19:29<tmk>and card support
19:29<tmk>jens is rewriting the buffering
19:29<tmk>so you can use v4l streaming
19:29<tmk>also perfomance should be much better
19:33<Chutt>i'd take stabler over better performace, though :p
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19:36<rcam>Hello.
19:36<tmk>yeah it'll do that too
19:36<tmk>should be able to reset the firmware if need be
19:36<tmk>automatically etc
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19:44<kslater>how's the stability of the cvs code? I'm thinking of updating to see if it'll correct a mythdvd compile error.
19:44<Netslayer>well i think there is a new bug, but anyway
19:45<Netslayer>when my box was working, it sometimes gave the waiting for 2 seconds for data..etc
19:46<billytwowilly>heh. this is amusing, I've found a visual basic (blech!) app that can change the channles on my motorol dct2224 cable box, but I haven't found anything for linux.
19:51<Netslayer>this is the first time in 7 months that my myth box isn't running :-(
19:51<tmk>billy: just write a linux app to do the same
19:51<tmk>that can't be a difficult port
19:52<billytwowilly>tmk: I have no coding skills at all. hmm. I found some dct2000 stuff in the cvs tree of myth.
19:52<billytwowilly>I might be able to do something with that.
19:52<tmk>yeah i hear that works
19:52<tmk>a few perl scripts
19:52<tmk>over teh serial port right
19:52<billytwowilly>yep.
19:52<billytwowilly>actually I think I just opened my mouth too soon;)
19:52<billytwowilly>this looks like it will work exactly fine.
19:54<billytwowilly>I'm going to have to fiddle with it.
19:54<billytwowilly>that's cool though.
19:54<Netslayer>that's nice that you have a connection, i have to go through IR
19:55<billytwowilly>I have to see if I have a firmware new enough, then buy a cable, then see if the serial port is enabled.
19:55<Netslayer>i should buy a new receiver on ebay or something.. but then i would have to get 5.1 working in mythtv. Not even sure if that's supported in recording
19:55<billytwowilly>anyhoo, I'm going to go check the firmware version.
19:55<billytwowilly>cheers.
19:55<Netslayer>ltr
19:56<tmk>commercial flagging appears to be very expensive.. with myth rebuild the index if it plays it back?
19:57<tmk>(ie if i just watch teh show)
19:58<billytwowilly>fark.. firmware is too old on the box..
19:59<Netslayer>ouch
20:05-!-Octane [octane@dsl092-100-149.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #mythtv
20:09<Netslayer>can mythtv actually capture in 5.1? like if u input optical or spdif?
20:17-!-mlasky [~mlasky@ip68-1-211-120.dl.dl.cox.net] has joined #mythtv
20:17-!-mlasky is now known as Rapala
20:17<Rapala>woohoo, found a mythtv channel! =)
20:19<Rapala>anyone happen to know how i can get the firmware image (.ROM) from the hauppauge CD for the WinTV USB PVR2? I isntalled all the programs on it via winex but can't seem to locate it
20:19<tmk>it's probably in the driver files
20:19<tmk>is this for windows?
20:21<Rapala>this is a linux box, but i can install the hauppauge software with winex. I'm trying to write a driver for the PVR2 USB based on the driver for the PVR USB written by Andreas Gal
20:23<tmk>i see
20:23<tmk>the firmware for the pci version is in the ddriver files
20:23<Rapala>but i cant seem to find the rom image anywhere, i'll look again
20:23<Rapala>thanks
20:23<tmk>see the ivtv project.. there's a program in the utils dir
20:23<tmk>that will extract it
20:24<jeffpc>um, how do I tell mythtv to use alsa and not the oss emulation?
20:24<Rapala>thanks
20:24* Rapala is new at this device driver stuff =)
20:24<Netslayer>jeffpc, if u figure it out let me know ;-)
20:24<jeffpc>Netslayer: heh
20:24<Netslayer>i'm reformating this week... i screwed my myth box up with updating to alsa
20:25<synthmeme>i looked at the code for that - looks like there's a call that looks for a driver who's name begins w/ ALSA. If it finds it, alsa is used, otherwise it defaults to the oss stuff.
20:25<Netslayer>uh huh
20:25* Netslayer wants to goto sleep and let someone else fix his nux box
20:26<jeffpc>2003-12-07 20:15:48 Opening OSS audio device '/dev/dsp'.
20:26<jeffpc>I have ALSA...
20:26<Netslayer>'did' the same for me
20:26<Netslayer>have u loaded alsa?
20:26<Netslayer>can u go alsamixer, amixer, aplay
20:27<synthmeme>what sound device do you have?
20:27<jeffpc>SB Live (emu10k1)
20:27<Netslayer>i'm running an Audigy (EMU10K2)
20:27<jeffpc>alsamixer works
20:27<Netslayer>hey when u hit the space bar does it set that device to capture form?
20:28<Netslayer>from
20:28<Netslayer>i could never set anything with mine
20:28<synthmeme>Here's where where the check is done: line 15 of .../mythtv/libs/libmyth/audiooutput.cpp: if(audiodevice.startsWith("ALSA:")) ......
20:28<Netslayer>heh
20:29<Netslayer>wtf audio device?
20:29<Netslayer>i want to printf that..
20:29* Netslayer writes that line number down
20:30<Netslayer>u'd think a program so popular as ALSA would have some kind of installer that could at least do your modules.conf for ya, and test itself
20:31<Netslayer>i bought that audigy just for the myth box but it has never worked properly from day 1.
20:32<Netslayer>from list: "Recording works great and even AC3 passthrough
20:32<Netslayer>works perfectly. The Sound Blaster Live! was $40.
20:32<Netslayer>"
20:32<Netslayer>i'm jelious
20:34<billytwowilly>is there a way to force mythfrontend into the background always?
20:34-!-Jy- [~Jy@alb-24-194-246-200.nycap.rr.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20:35<Netslayer>background? u mean behind other windows
20:35<billytwowilly>Netslayer: Yes, ideally so it looks like a wallpaper.
20:35<billytwowilly>and won't come to the front if I click on it.
20:36<Netslayer>have fun
20:36<Netslayer>prob is possible, but don't know how
20:39<synthmeme>augh!
20:41<jeffpc>hmmm...0.12 failed to build
20:41<Netslayer>oh i forgot about tux racer.. heh i'm going to play it on the big screen when i get my box running
20:41<synthmeme>I can delete recorded videos from the web interface, but not through mythfrontend. What gives?!
20:42<Netslayer>well that's ood
20:42<synthmeme>Neither the frontend or the backend report any errors to their logs (with -v all)
20:42<synthmeme>and all of the .nuv files are owned by the user who created them
20:42<Netslayer>what about the dir?
20:43<synthmeme>yep
20:43<synthmeme>same
20:43<Netslayer>no idea
20:45<Rapala>yay, got the firmware
20:45<Rapala>now i have no errors but it's not working... time for the fun to start
20:49-!-dja_ [~alden@dhcp9560042.columbus.rr.com] has quit ["Client exiting"]
20:49<Netslayer>interesting http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2770366871&category=51136
20:49<Netslayer>someone's selling a mythbox
20:51-!-shamoun [~shamoun@c-24-10-37-99.client.comcast.net] has joined #mythtv
20:51* Netslayer ponders
20:52<Netslayer>anyone in here running those newer NV drivers on a G4 MX440? tried em yesterday but my overscan stopped working.. #$%#$% nvidia
20:53<billytwowilly>Netslayer: I was going to, but now I'm not;)
20:54<jeffpc>did the keybindings change in CVS?
20:54<Netslayer>ya don't
20:54<Netslayer>i'm trying to think of what to install when i reformat.. they have the last 3 versions on their ftp..
20:54<Netslayer>guess i could always downgrade
20:57-!-Crib [Crib@iulaw-231-free.law.indiana.edu] has joined #mythtv
21:02<Netslayer>what is native alsa and lirc support anyway?
21:06* Ripp is away: AFK
21:07* Ripp is back (gone 00:00:00)
21:22-!-tmk [~no@c-24-6-225-39.client.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
21:24* Invisi yawns
21:32-!-shamoun [~shamoun@c-24-10-37-99.client.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
21:32* Netslayer picks up the cricket making all the noise and eats it survivor style
21:45<Invisi>Netslayer: eh
21:47<Netslayer>heh.. it's getting boring
21:50<Netslayer>gotta love the slashdot community, laser article, comment: "I also wonder if this laser is powerfull enough to fry a bird.
21:54<billytwowilly>Netslayer: That's important info. I want a cd burner that I can also use as an oven;)
21:55<Netslayer>ya me to, it has to glow and everything
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22:07<kslater>can anyone give me a status update on the keybindings stuff? Is it ready to go?
22:11<Rapala>think i can ignore the message from /etc/hotplug/usb.agent telling me there are no modules for the connected device?
22:38-!-renchi [~renchi@pooh.tam.uiuc.edu] has joined #mythtv
22:40-!-renchi is now known as pahli_bar
22:44<Invisi>anyone here convert an atsc stream to an mpeg file?
22:44* Ripp is away: ...speaking of ET time to blow up some stuff...
22:47* billytwowilly is away: I'm busy
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23:52<hadees>anyone know any way to have alsa auto turn the volume down if a file i am playing is to loud, for example i have a few files i play through mythvideo that i need to turn the volume on my tv down to 8 because they are so loud, but then after i have files i want to play that i use like 50 and i don't watn to have to change back and forth myself
23:59* kvandivo looks around.
---Logclosed Mon Dec 08 00:00:25 2003