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#openttd IRC Logs for 2007-04-19

---Logopened Thu Apr 19 00:00:09 2007
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03:39<Smoky555>hi all
03:40<hnsn>hello fellow ottd player
03:41<Smoky555>where i could place scr files? such as on_server_connect.scr ...
03:42<Rubidium>scripts/ I guess
03:43<Smoky555>but ... if i change script before server starting, i need to restart server or not?
03:44<Rubidium>don't know
03:47<boekabart_>Someone who knows the map array better than I do: I saw suggested in the forum (3 years ago), a type of tunnel that wouldn't start on a hill edge, but on flat land going down on the start-tile. Bridges have this flexibility (to start either on flat land going up, or on sloped land staying level), why not tunnels. Really that hard? Doesn't sound that way....
03:48<peter1138>Smoky555: no
03:48<peter1138>Smoky555: it's read whenever it's used
03:48<peter1138>so you can change it mid-game
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03:49<Rubidium>boekabart_: it ain't much a problem of the map array, but rather fixing the graphics and pathfinder code
03:50<Smoky555>peter1138 : ok, i make on_client.scr in scripts folder, i add 'say "Hello" ' into it. thats mean, that with new client server must say to all "Hello", isn't it?
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03:51<peter1138>on_server_connect.scr does that
03:51<boekabart_>Rubidium: how would it be any different for the pathfinder?
03:51<peter1138>on_client is used by the client when it connects (and is fairly useless)
03:51<Rubidium>because of the up/down penalties
03:51<Smoky555>peter1138: yep, it's work, thanks :)
03:51<boekabart_>for gfx, could be an IF (if land flat, take 'dug tunnel' gfx, if not, take 'old' gfx), for path finder no diff.
03:52<boekabart_>train height code, same if as ^^
03:52<boekabart_>up/down: right. Anyway, doesn't sound like anything that is impossible in the current map array, right?
03:53<boekabart_>biggest advantage would be to be able to tunnel under sea, and slightly shorter tunnel entrance footprint
03:53<Rubidium>no, but you need to fix 3 pathfinders and 2 vehicle controllers (I think)
03:53<peter1138>amend
03:54<peter1138>adding features isn't fixing :)
03:54<boekabart_>:)
03:54<boekabart_>so i'd need to featurize 3 pathfinders?
03:54<Rubidium>I think so
03:54<Rubidium>maybe even 4...
03:54<boekabart_>and of course the building UI
03:56<peter1138>coming up with a decent UI is hard
03:56<boekabart_>idea: copy from bridge ui?
03:56<boekabart_>tunnel is now a limited version of bridge, idea is to make it 'same' . if you know what i mean
03:57<peter1138>yes
04:00<boekabart_>as in: you know, or as in: i think that's feasable
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04:15<peter1138>as in, that's feasible
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04:32<Smoky555>huh, does anybody doing something with transparenting in trunk? 9653,9655 from trunk, 9655 nightly,9673 from trunk - transparenting doesn't working (for houses and trees). configs generating with first run. local dedicated server, localclient connected.
04:32<Smoky555> running local game - transparenting - doesn't working too ...
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04:36<Smoky555>all stable releases works fine with transparent ...
04:39<peter1138>what in particular doesn't work?
04:39<peter1138>oh, i get it.
04:39<peter1138>press x and it behaves like it did
04:40<peter1138>or use the transparency toolbar off the map menu
04:40<peter1138>changes != broken :p
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04:42<Smoky555>ok, i see, thanks ... :)
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04:44<peter1138>actually i will change it so the menu option toggles all
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04:44<peter1138>(the same as X)
04:46<peter1138>otherwise there is only the short cut key to do that
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05:01<peter1138>http://fuzzle.org/o/transopt.diff might do the job...
05:05|-|TheJosh [~josh@d220-238-182-33.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
05:06<TheJosh>Hey, what code-wise are the devels wanting the most?
05:12<TheJosh>documentation basically?
05:13<ln->teleporting trains.
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05:16<peter1138>heh
05:16<peter1138>make vehicles warp from one side of the map to the other
05:16<peter1138>to emulate a 'spherical' world...
05:17<peter1138>though it would be a doughnut...
05:17<ln->btw, ludde himself mentioned teleporting
05:17<peter1138>yes, but he was shot down
05:23<peter1138>that was for emulating bendy tunnels
05:23<peter1138>but 'real' tunnels are deemed better
05:24<TheJosh>so ditch this documentation then?
05:24<TheJosh>we could just have the map scroll onto itself
05:24<peter1138>ditch which?
05:24<TheJosh>i am adding documentation tags to functions
05:25<peter1138>well, i was jesting about the warp...
05:25<TheJosh>ah ok
05:26<peter1138>iirc farms used to be able to plant fields on the opposite side of the map, if they were near the edge
05:27<ln->has the ear ring bug been fixed yet?
05:27<peter1138>no, nobody cares about faces
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05:28<peter1138>especially not the 'females'
05:31<ln->i know one dev who could care about the 'males' being bi.
05:33<TheJosh>Hey In-, did you hear my patch got in?
05:34<peter1138>ln-, yes, bjarni... he seems to have an obsession with that sort of thing...
05:35<ln->TheJosh: hey th3j0sh, i didn't. congrats.
05:35<ln->TheJosh: also, please switch to another font in your irc client/terminal.
05:37<TheJosh>Thanks. it was all Maedhros really.
05:37<TheJosh>What is wrong with my font? this irc client is mega simple, does not support multiple fonts
05:37<ln->you don't see the difference of l and I.
05:38<ln->and probably not 1 and l and I.
05:39<TheJosh>actually i can see 1 from i and |
05:39<TheJosh>and I
05:39<TheJosh>what is your name
05:40<TheJosh>sorry
05:43<peter1138>ln-, short for 'Lord kNowitall'
05:44<ln->ok, admiral.
05:46<TheJosh>ln as in the linux command for link?
05:49<TheJosh>shutting up now
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05:59<TheJosh>Ok i cant help talking, meh, i have just made a documentation patch, does anyone want it?
06:00<TheJosh>i was told yesterday they are useful or something
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06:16<Eddi|zuHause2>talk to belugas, he is doing documentation stuff..
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06:19[~]peter1138 gruarghs at C#
06:20<peter1138>"Control cannot fall through from one case label to another" indeed :/
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06:45<TheJosh>Hey is there a function I can use to display a message on the screen or something for debugging purposes?
06:46<TheJosh>like a messagebox style thingo, or a console message
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06:49<peter1138>debug("foo", "message with formatting %d", 42);
06:49<peter1138>generally i abbreviate the function name in the first parameter, though it's freetext...
06:52<TheJosh>what is the 42?
06:53<TheJosh>the universe, life and everything?
06:53<peter1138>example parameter ;p
06:53<peter1138>for the %d
06:53<TheJosh>ah ok
06:53<peter1138>it's like a printf, but with an extra parameter at the start
06:53<peter1138>and no need for \n at the end
06:54<TheJosh>i get an error: debug is not declared in this scope
06:54<peter1138>hmmz
06:54<peter1138>#include "debug.h" at the top?
06:54<TheJosh>is now
06:57<TheJosh>ok heres a tougher one: how do you use the function SetObjectToPlace from a popup menu item
06:59<TheJosh>it sortof works: i take a copy of the window handle in the proc function, and use it later, show thingo but doesnt call my proc function when the user clicks
06:59<peter1138>uh
06:59<peter1138>pass :)
07:00<TheJosh>let me guess, you hate GUI code too?
07:00<peter1138>:)
07:03<TheJosh>does that debug launch a window or go to the console?
07:04<TheJosh>nvm
07:05<peter1138>console :)
07:08<TheJosh>im trying to code 'fund a town'...now ive got to the point where it says 'cannot put a town here'...
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07:15<TheJosh>w00t...i founded a town!
07:18<TheJosh>how do you change the current players money
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07:22<hnsn>hello also
07:22<hnsn>Ctrl + Alt + C
07:22<TheJosh>hello
07:23<TheJosh>no i am talking from a code perspective. I found a function to subtract, now I need a check function, because it made my bank balence -50million...
07:24<TheJosh>while towns should be expensive, it should report 'you are broke' rather than just make you bankrupt...
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07:52<Thomas[NL]>are there any train-tunnel-grf's for OTTD?
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08:04<@Belugas>hello
08:05<@Belugas>TheJosh : yes, documentation patches are more then welcome :)
08:05<@Belugas>show me da stufff!
08:07<Thomas[NL]>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=576682#576682
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08:09<TheJosh>My doc patch is currently part of another patch I created called 'fund a town', but ill remove those bits and give you just the doc bits
08:12<TheJosh>Belugas: do you want the doc patch?
08:13<@Belugas>of course :)
08:19<peter1138> * This obviously only works in the scenario editor. Function not removed
08:19<peter1138> * as it might be possible in the future to fund your own town :)
08:19<peter1138>lol
08:19<TheJosh>thats what im supporing in a patch i just amde
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08:20<peter1138>yes, i know
08:21<TheJosh>good point
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08:29<maddy>hiho
08:29<maddy>Brianetta: can you reset the server pls? :D
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08:57<@Belugas>!seen Maedhros
08:57<_42_>Belugas, Maedhros (~jc@host86-136-233-235.range86-136.btcentralplus.com) was last seen quitting #openttd 21 hours 50 minutes ago (18.04. 16:06) stating "Ping timeout: 480 seconds" after spending 6 hours 23 minutes there.
08:57<@Belugas>21 hours!!!!
08:57<@Belugas>tht's awfully long time!
09:06<peter1138>hmmz
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09:26<Maedhros>hi
09:28<peter1138>ah ha!
09:28<peter1138>the man himself
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09:30<@Belugas>hello Maedhros :)
09:30<@Belugas>how doyou DARE been away for 21 hours ???
09:30<@Belugas>shame on you ;)
09:30<peter1138>22 actually
09:31<@Belugas>time flies...
09:31<Maedhros>hehe, i'm sorry!
09:32<Maedhros>although it's exam season again, so you probably shouldn't expect to see me much until early June
09:33<@Belugas>you're excused :)
09:33<@Belugas>real life is the best excuse ;)
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09:43<CIA-2>OpenTTD: celestar * r9674 /branches/gamebalance/ (102 files in 7 dirs): [gamebalance] -Sync: r9322:9420 from trunk
09:48<CIA-2>OpenTTD: celestar * r9675 /branches/gamebalance/ (35 files in 8 dirs): [gamebalance] -Sync: r9420:9520 from trunk
09:50<CIA-2>OpenTTD: belugas * r9676 /trunk/src/ (industry.h industry_cmd.cpp):
09:50<CIA-2>OpenTTD: -Codechange: introduce NUM_INDUSTRYTYPES instead of IT_END.
09:50<CIA-2>OpenTTD: This makes the code clearer.
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10:09<@Belugas>whooo... no conflicts :D
10:14<SpComb>sync? Merge?
10:15<@Belugas>nope... work :)
10:18[~]peter1138 conflicts with working in the summer
10:18<SpComb>move to antarctica
10:18<SpComb>it's a fun place to be
10:19<SpComb>depending on where you go
10:20<@Belugas>peter1138, there is an empty chair by my side :)
10:20<@Belugas>you're more then welcome to fill it
10:20<@Belugas>it's cool in here ;)
10:22<peter1138>:D
10:22<peter1138>if i could work from home...
10:22<peter1138>i could have my aircon pointing at me...
10:22<peter1138>and no clothes :x
10:23<SpComb>oo ya
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10:29<@Belugas>i pass!
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10:31<Thomas[NL]>http://tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=576638#576638 what terrain grf's is he using :S?
10:32<peter1138>japan landscape, iirc
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10:40<SpComb>peter1138: move to finland, it's a pleasant +4°C outside right now
10:40<@Belugas>samo in Quebec
10:41<SpComb>although it was a rather warm 28°C on the 15th
10:41<SpComb>that was probably measured in the (light of the) sun, though
10:41<@Belugas>never reached that this year. LAst time it was that hot was in last summer :S
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10:48<peter1138>WHO! HAR! WHAT IS IT GOOD FOR
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10:50<MeusH>hey
10:51<peter1138>MEUSH
10:51<MeusH>yo homie
10:51<MeusH>I see nice progress :)
10:51<peter1138>yo homo :p
10:51<MeusH>not nice
10:52<peter1138>what isn't?
10:52<MeusH>random
10:52<MeusH>whatever
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10:52<@Belugas>pertinent...
10:53<peter1138>pert tits?
10:53<@Belugas>nice work on tropics, MeusH,by the way
10:53<MeusH>thanks, I'm drawing sprites right now :)
10:53<MeusH>if you have any suggestions please go on :)
10:54<@Belugas>nope...
10:54<@Belugas>sorry
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10:55<@Belugas>don't want to influence The Artist
10:55<MeusH>influence me :)
10:55<MeusH>please :D
10:55[~]peter1138 feeds MeusH something alcoholic
10:55<peter1138>now you are under the influence
10:55<MeusH>yeeea
10:55<MeusH>more!
10:56<MeusH>I'm having problems with pipes on oil station... That's one big spaghetti :)
10:56<MeusH>but more alcohol will untie the spaghetti
10:56<MeusH>or whatever
10:56<peter1138>GAH
10:56<peter1138>sometimes my browser locks up :(
10:57<peter1138>but it happens with opera, firefox and IE...
10:57<MeusH>it happens for me when there is something related to Java or Flash (firefox)
10:57<Ailure>It happens with msnmgr, explorer.exe and firefox here too
10:57<peter1138>MeusH: i'm only on our wiki though...
10:57<Ailure>well it's usually related to slashdot for some reason
10:57<peter1138>i think i need a reinstall
10:57<MeusH>hmm
10:57<peter1138>or some linux, heh
10:57<peter1138>but i need vs 2005 ;/
10:57<MeusH>oh yeah peter1138 do you know what's up with MiHaMiX?
10:58<Ailure>ok i'm unable to revive explorer.exe
10:58<Ailure>it goes 50% CPU all the time, without starting. :/
10:58<peter1138>no, what's up with MiHaMiX?
10:58<peter1138>Ailure, heh, my control panel makes it do that
10:58<Ailure>ok now it revived
10:58<Ailure>sometimes it helps to like
10:59<Ailure>termite, start, terminate, start, terminate
10:59<Ailure>repeat
10:59<Ailure>until it finally starts
10:59<MeusH>peter1138, could you take a look at http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/User_talk:MeusH#Scenario_Namespace ?
10:59<MeusH>MiHaMiX is kinda gone and he doesn't respond
10:59<peter1138>hmm?
11:00<MeusH>they want to have something like Scenario:Pagename
11:00<peter1138>Scenario: seems ok
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11:00<peter1138>or not?
11:00<MeusH>yeah
11:00<MeusH>but someone has to do it
11:00<peter1138>hmm
11:00<peter1138>but
11:00<MeusH>to find it in the code and modify it
11:00<Ailure>you need to change the code for that?
11:00<peter1138>would Category Scenario not work? heh
11:01<peter1138>all the links in the wiki/html code, i guess
11:01<Ailure>that's how it's done on most wikis too I belive
11:01<Ailure>unless i'm misunderstanding what they want
11:01<MeusH>it's pretty simple
11:01<MeusH>wait a sec
11:02<MeusH>http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Custom_namespaces
11:02<MeusH>this
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11:02<peter1138>well, i got rid of most of GFXDev:
11:02<peter1138>but mainly because two of the pages in it were redundant
11:02<peter1138>and *lots* of stuff that should be in it isn't
11:03<peter1138>hmm, so you have to edit them there too? that's lame ;p
11:03<Ailure>aaah
11:03<MeusH>peter1138, that's the only place where it should be edited, I think
11:04<peter1138>MeusH: well, what i mean is, that you *have* to edit it at all
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11:04<peter1138>i assumed just having the Foo: thing in the name would make it do the right thing o_O
11:04<MeusH>you mean no nice user interface, right?
11:04<MeusH>aha
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11:17<@Belugas>oups... lunch time started without me :S
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11:19<Thomas[NL]>what is this Peter1138/Towngrowth Challenge, will it be some game-mode?
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11:23<peter1138>possibly
11:24|-|Osai [~Osai@pD9EB7BF7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
11:24<peter1138>based on korenn's old OCS version
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11:24<Ailure>ah
11:24<Ailure>I thought it was another name for offspin challange
11:25<Ailure>(to be honest I forgot the name of the author of offspin challange :P and I never tried the 'OCS')
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11:28<peter1138>openttd challenge spinoff
11:28<peter1138>or
11:28<peter1138>openttd spinoff challenge
11:28<peter1138>or something
11:28<peter1138>but basically, with newgrf cargos, industries, houses, etc, a lot of the changes can be done with a grf file
11:29<Ailure>yeah
11:29|-|Wolf01 [~wolf01@host231-235-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
11:29<Wolf01>hello
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11:30<Ailure>I seen the progress with newCargos
11:30<Ailure>and the bugs coming with them :p
11:30<Ailure>such as a temperate sawmill acting like the tropical one
11:30<Ailure>eh that probably wasn't related to newcargos
11:30<Ailure>but still ;)
11:31<Ailure>A friend of mine thought it was a new feature
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11:31<Thomas[NL]>yea it happened to me :), suddenly there was a big square grassland in the forest :P
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11:32<Ailure>haha yeah
11:32<Ailure>it probably would been intresting near endgame
11:32<Ailure>considering how endgame in TTD
11:33<Ailure>is with forests being everywhere
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11:33<Ailure>there would be holes of trees all over the map
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11:35<peter1138>yeah, nothing to do with newcargos that :p
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11:36<Wolf01>i thought it was fixed by Belugas
11:37<Ailure>although I think the temperate forests feels kinda stupid
11:37<Wolf01>yeah, they are always the same... boring
11:37<Ailure>It feels like a unatural 'squarish' forest
11:37<Ailure>too
11:37<@Belugas>i fixed it
11:37<Wolf01>what about industries on slopes?
11:37<@Belugas>i think
11:38<Ailure>industries on slopes looks nice :)
11:38<Wolf01>ttdpatch has them for a long time
11:38<Ailure>but I wonder if they could have problems with the terragenesis generator
11:38<Ailure>yeah I saw them
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11:39<Wolf01>why? they are always the same, only they can be built on slopes and the graphics will change to look better
11:39<Ailure>I mean
11:39<Ailure>heh
11:39<Ailure>http://www.pikkarail.com/ttdp/ukrs/industries.htm
11:40<Ailure>look at the end of that page with the industry going up three tiles of slope
11:40<Ailure>a smooth terragenesis map might not have many of thoose slopes
11:40<Ailure>if any at all
11:40<Wolf01>you can always terraform a slope when placing the industry
11:41<Ailure>hmm
11:41<Ailure>rough have a few of them though
11:41<Ailure>and very roguh should have a few
11:41<Ailure>and true
11:41<Ailure>but I was mainly concerned with randomly placed ones
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11:41<Wolf01>now if the terragenesis want to place a forest in a rough area it terraform it, i've seen it with my eyes
11:42<Ailure>hmm
11:42<Ailure>I seen some automatic terraforming with industry placement
11:42<Ailure>sometimes bit unecessary as I seen it when I place industry and it flattens a area that the industry dosen't even build on
11:43<Wolf01>i saw also the castle for tourist cargo, i like the idea to place things on particular terrain configurations
11:43<Ailure>Kinda funny how it's a industry too :p
11:43<Ailure>Sure, there's a such thing as tourist industry
11:43<Ailure>but still
11:47<Wolf01>what about the ship improvement we talked about yesterday?
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11:52<sai>hello guys, I just try to make a friend like openttd, but he can't start it, because of the error "too many sprites". I read something about "onloading the grf-stuff", but how to do that? environment is windows... any help?
11:54<Wolf01>which triassic version is he using?
11:55<sai>what is triassic?
11:55<sai>it is probably the recent open ttd rc-3
11:55<@Belugas>synonim for dinosaur-age version :)
11:55<Wolf01>when dinosaurs ruled the world :P
11:55<+glx>he probably tries to load unneeded grfs
11:56<sai>so is it enough to just delete some from the folder where he put some grf-files?
11:56<+glx>I mean grfs that do not work in 0.5.x
11:56<sai>so he should delete all grf-files?
11:56<Wolf01>not all
11:57<@Belugas>sai, maybe he cold try the nightlies
11:57<+glx>what grfs does he use now?
11:57<sai>1sec
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11:57<Ailure>I wouldn't recomend too many GRF's for newbies anyway :p
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11:57<sai>he put these files in his folder: sample.cat
11:57<sai>TRG1.GRF
11:57<sai>TRGC.GRF
11:57<sai>TRGH.GRF
11:57<sai>TRGI.GRF
11:57<sai>TRGT.GRF
11:57<+glx>needed ttd files so it's ok
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11:58<Kittysune>I seen people hauling coal with... that railcar in the UKRS set.
11:58<Kittysune>!logs
11:58<SpComb>Logs: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd
11:58<Kittysune>[18:56] <Ailure> I wouldn't recomend too many GRF's for newbies anyway :p
11:58<Kittysune>[18:56] <Ailure> some trainsets are like, much more advanced than the orginal trains
11:58<Kittysune>[18:56] <Ailure> not that I mind, but it can be little confusing for some.
11:58<sai>so what is the problem then?
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11:58<sai>he did nothing else than to install the game and to cpoy these files...
11:59<Ailure>really? Hmm..
11:59<+glx>sai: using default openttd.cfg?
12:00<sai>well , I have never heard of an openttd-cfg, and he didnt play or had this game before, so I guess it will be the default.
12:05<Thomas[NL]>can't Invisible Trees (with transparent buildings) be removed out of the Patches in the nightlies now we have Transparency options?
12:06<Wolf01>i might put them in the gui
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12:18<Eddi|zuHause2>how would you make a 3-way-switch-button (full/transparen/invisible) in the GUI?
12:19<Eddi|zuHause2>+t
12:19<Wolf01>should be cool
12:24<Thomas[NL]>what TerraGenesis settings are you using most of the time?
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12:30<Maedhros>heh, http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=31560
12:30<Maedhros>i wonder why it's always the people who write perfect english that apologise
12:30<Maedhros>and it's usually the english people who write incomprehensible stuff
12:35<Eddi|zuHause2>Wolf01: what about this: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/ships.txt
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12:37<Eddi|zuHause2>Maedhros: because those native english speakers never experienced how hard it is to talk in a foreign language
12:39<Maedhros>probably, yeah
12:41<@Belugas>soooooo true
12:43<peter1138>helloa
12:44<Thomas[NL]>Eddi|zuHause2, I like the shipping routes idea
12:44[~]peter1138 returns from 'watering' the weeds
12:46<peter1138>evilly supplying them with roundup
12:46<Wolf01>Eddi|zuHause2, nice, but i can't understand how a route couldn't have more than one corner, if there is a b^b where ^ is a peninsulae and b the buoy, you have to put a buoy in the bit of the peninsulae?
12:46<Wolf01>(tell me if you can't undertand me :D)
12:47<Eddi|zuHause2>Wolf01: the more corners you allow, the more difficult the in-between pathfinding and the route-creating will be
12:47<Eddi|zuHause2>if you have a peninsula, just build more buoys
12:47<Thomas[NL]>what is a peninsulae??....
12:47<Eddi|zuHause2>a semi-island
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12:48<Eddi|zuHause2>a land edge that sticks into the water...
12:48<Thomas[NL]>ah ok :)
12:49<@Belugas>peter1138, the gardener :)
12:49<peter1138>yup
12:49<peter1138>the bindweed is coming back
12:49[~]Belugas imagines a hat, with flowers, gardening gloves and all...
12:50<peter1138>so getting it while it's young...
12:50<@Belugas>last time i checked, no need for water. just some snow shoveling :)
12:51[~]Maedhros doesn't have a garden, although our tenancy agreement says we have to tend it ;)
12:52<peter1138>http://farm1.static.flickr.com/253/452833136_d8b502c8b8_o.jpg
12:52<valhallasw>http://openttdcoop.ppcis.org/sandbox_new/banner/
12:52<peter1138>not flower
12:52<valhallasw>er
12:52<peter1138>s
12:52<peter1138>growing veg :D
12:52<peter1138>although... blurry photo
12:52<valhallasw>wrong button >_>
12:53<Eddi|zuHause2>a propos weeds... i should go watch it...
12:54<@Belugas>good growth so far :) green thumb sir
12:54<peter1138>well, no
12:54<CIA-2>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9677 /trunk/src/main_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Make the 'transparent buildings' menu item toggle all transparency, to keep its old behaviour.
12:54<peter1138>the holy and the shrub were there already
12:55<peter1138>they are starting to show up now though
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12:55<peter1138>that lot was planted a week and a half ago
12:55<hylje>bring me a shrubbery
12:55<+glx>ni
12:57<peter1138>for belugas... http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/384440055_8231ceb5ae_o.jpg
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12:58<@Belugas>hehe :)
12:58<@Belugas>that was how it looked in here about a week ago
12:58<Thomas[NL]>peter1138, transparent buildings just toggles transparency of buildables here
12:58<peter1138>hmm?
12:59<Thomas[NL]>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9677 /trunk/src/main_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Make the 'transparent buildings' menu item toggle all transparency, to keep its old behaviour., using it now toggles the transparency of "buildables" like stations, depots etc here
13:00<peter1138>well
13:00<peter1138>it remembers what you had selected as transparent
13:00<peter1138>same as pressing X
13:00<peter1138>the text is wrong
13:01<Wolf01>why are you keeping that option?
13:01<peter1138>but it matches what it used to do
13:01<peter1138>because i like it :p
13:01<Thomas[NL]>oops, In was still using r9676
13:02<peter1138>heh
13:02<Wolf01>if you want i have a patch to toggle the "remember the selected transparent options" with a nice gui button
13:02<peter1138>yeah, i might add that
13:03<Wolf01>http://wolf01.game-host.org/OTTD_related/patches/transparency_options_gui_9621_transparency_memorization_widget.diff here is it
13:04<Maedhros>wouldn't it be better to save the setting so you don't have to change it every time you start the game?
13:04<Thomas[NL]>imho, the gui & patches need a little clean up, there are a couple of buttons and options that are not needed any more
13:05<@Belugas>ha.. we have a volunteer for the cleanup!
13:05<peter1138>Maedhros: yeah, will at some point
13:05<Maedhros>cool and groovy
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13:09<Thomas[NL]>I, can make of list of proposed changes but I don't think I'll be able to code any of it
13:10<@Belugas>can start by a list...
13:11<peter1138>Thomas[NL]: there is more to helping a project than coding :)
13:11<Eddi|zuHause2>the most important imho is to clean up or split the vehicles patch page
13:11<Eddi|zuHause2>it is way too crowded
13:11<peter1138>the multiple pathfinder selections!
13:12<peter1138>are we ready to ditch npf yet?
13:12<Thomas[NL]>and npt?
13:14<Eddi|zuHause2>and in the long term, make some patch settings into difficulty settings, the rest into game options
13:23<Thomas[NL]>what is currently considered to be the "stable" pathfinder?
13:24<peter1138>yapf
13:25<Thomas[NL]>ok
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13:49<CIA-2>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9678 /trunk/src/aircraft_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: Support changing of aircraft running cost via callback 36.
13:50<peter1138>(probably :p)
13:51<CIA-2>OpenTTD: belugas * r9679 /trunk/src/transparency_gui.cpp: -Codechange: use enums to identify transparency widgets and add a bit of documentation (patch by Wolf01)
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14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: miham * r9680 /trunk/src/lang/ (17 files): (log message trimmed)
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-04-19 21:10:21
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: bulgarian - 2 fixed by thetitan (1), kokobongo (1)
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: czech - 2 fixed by joeprusa (2)
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: danish - 2 fixed by ThomasA (2)
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: dutch - 2 fixed, 1 changed by habell (3)
14:11<CIA-2>OpenTTD: esperanto - 2 fixed by LaPingvino (2)
14:12<@Belugas>whooo... a franzy
14:12<@MiHaMiX>MeusH: here
14:12<@MiHaMiX>MeusH: for 5 minutes, since I'm damn tired
14:13<ln->MiHaMiX: there are extra ':' characters in finnish.txt at STR_INDUSTRY_PROD_GOUP and _GODOWN
14:14<@MiHaMiX>ln-: i'll check it soon
14:14<peter1138>and in turkish
14:14<peter1138>STR_CONFIG_PATCHES_SERVINT_ROADVEH :{LTBLUE}Arabalar için varsayılan servis gecikmesi:: {ORANGE}{STRING} gün/%
14:15<Maedhros>hmm, that's done weird things to irssi
14:16<@MiHaMiX>peter1138: i can't check every single translation made by the translators
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14:16<@MiHaMiX>peter1138: if a translation syntactically correct, WT2 accepts that
14:18<peter1138>no
14:18<peter1138>i just pointed it out
14:19<CIA-2>OpenTTD: miham * r9681 /trunk/src/lang/finnish.txt: [Translations] -Fix: removed two unnecessary colons from the finnish translations (spotted by ln-)
14:20<@MiHaMiX>peter1138: ok then :)
14:20<@MiHaMiX>peter1138: shall I remove those, too?
14:20<@Belugas>Smoky555, are you around?
14:20<@Belugas>or in other words :
14:21<@Belugas>Smoky555 : ping
14:22<@MiHaMiX>ok, let's go to sleep, i'm pretty damn tired :-(
14:22<@MiHaMiX>bye :)
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14:57<@Belugas>'evening Tron
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15:16<Thomas[NL]>what was that site where you can upload text or code?
15:16<peter1138>paste.openttd.org?
15:16<Thomas[NL]>lol ok ty :)
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15:18<Thomas[NL]>http://paste.openttd.org/46 my suggestions for some gui text
15:19<Wolf01>good :D
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15:37<@Belugas>bye guys
15:38<Thomas[NL]>bye
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15:46<dihedral>hello
15:47<lolman>dihedral: ello
15:47<dihedral>anybody here know something about the status of the loading stuff
15:47<dihedral>i.e. trains at stations
15:48<Eddi|zuHause2>can you be any less specific?
15:48<dihedral>sure - anybody here know something
15:48<dihedral>:-P
15:48<Eddi|zuHause2>then no :p
15:48<dihedral>well - 2 trains at one station...
15:48<dihedral>you dont know anything Eddi|zuHause2 ?
15:48<dihedral>that is sad :-P
15:49<Eddi|zuHause2>"improved loading" does not do well with "gradual loading"
15:49<dihedral>only one train at a time can load
15:49<lolman>dihedral: what Eddi said :P
15:49<dihedral>so - which one would you advise me to turn off
15:49<Eddi|zuHause2>depends, gradual loading is more realistic, also it reduces loading times for long trains
15:50<dihedral>i found nothing on improved loading on the openttd.cfg wiki page
15:50[~]lolman reminds self to install OTTD again when he hits a GUI
15:50<Eddi|zuHause2>improved loading can help you when you have not-so-busy stations, where max. 2 trains arrive simultaneously
15:50<dihedral>what is it's behaviour over normal loading
15:51<Eddi|zuHause2>normal loading = all trains get the same amount of cargo
15:51<Eddi|zuHause2>so you might end up with two half-full trains
15:52<dihedral>and improved only loads one train at a time?
15:52<Eddi|zuHause2>improved loading = only one train gets cargo, until it is full
15:52<Eddi|zuHause2>which was fine, as long as cargo was loaded instantly
15:52<MeusH>goodbye
15:52<dihedral>to avoid 3 semi full trains at one station waiting for more
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15:53<Eddi|zuHause2>because then the remaining cargo could be distributed among the other trains
15:53<Eddi|zuHause2>but with gradual loading, you cannot easily decide, how much cargo is "remaining"
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15:54<Eddi|zuHause2>or rather, that check was never implemented
15:54<dihedral>so an "either or" is what i am looking for, right?
15:54<Eddi|zuHause2>yes
15:55<Rubidium>huh? what are you talking about?
15:55<dihedral>i heard a rumor of the entire loading algorithm needing to be redone...
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15:55<dihedral>is that being done or is that just an uninteresting rumor
15:55<Rubidium>well, the loading algorithms are ok; only some of the lookup related parts aren't
15:56<Rubidium>like for improved loading it iterates over all vehicles to check whether the 'current' train is the 'first' train in the station
15:57<Rubidium>so the loading algorithms are basically O(n^2), where n is the number of vehicles in the game (including shadows, rotors and wagons)
15:58<Rubidium>it would be much better when the algorithms become O(m), where m is the number of trains (front engines at the 'current' station)
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15:58<Eddi|zuHause2><Rubidium> huh? what are you talking about? <- if there are 200 goods at a station, and two trains with capacity of 100 arrive, improved loading will prevent the second train from loading, even though the cargo suffices to fill the first train (but it takes a while with gradual loading)
15:59<Rubidium>I thought that was already implemented
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16:00<Maedhros>nope
16:00<Eddi|zuHause2>not to my knowlege... but i did not really test
16:00<Rubidium>too bad :(
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16:00<Maedhros>and trying to add it to the current improved loading would probably cause it to explode
16:01<Rubidium>anyway, the major problem of improved loading and gradual loadin together is their time complexity, which is fairly easy to fix in-game, but the saveload code for that is quite ugly
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16:02<peter1138>what needs doing?
16:03<Rubidium>http://rubidium.student.utwente.nl/openttd/it_aint_nice_it_aint_pretty_fs423.diff <- that's how you make it O(m) instead of O(n^2)
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16:04<Rubidium>it also makes loading FIFO
16:05<peter1138>why does it need saving?
16:06<peter1138>hmm
16:06<peter1138>order
16:06<peter1138>of course
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16:06<Rubidium>exactly
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16:08<dihedral>if that is what needs doing, will it be included some time soon(ish)
16:09<dihedral>there is supposed to be a questionmark at the end of that last sentance :-)
16:10<Rubidium>well, if somebody comes up with a way to the current savegame hack
16:10<Rubidium>*way to solve
16:12<peter1138>generic SLE_ thing
16:12<peter1138>or maybe not generic :/
16:12<peter1138>SLE_VEHICLELIST?
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16:17<Eddi|zuHause2>shouldn't that stuff be saved with the station data?
16:17<peter1138>it is
16:18<Eddi|zuHause2>ah, so you mean a vehicle list in the station stuff
16:18<Rubidium>not-generic would be easiest I guess
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16:19<dihedral>in openttd.cfg, what is 'selectgoods' ?
16:19<peter1138>well, can we we runtime determine the type?
16:20<dihedral>not specified on the wiki under openttd.cfg
16:20<peter1138>src/variables.h: bool selectgoods; // only send the goods to station if a train has been there
16:20<Rubidium>peter1138: not really
16:20<dihedral>ah
16:20<dihedral>thanks peter1138
16:20<Rubidium>because we need to pass std::list<Vehicle*> and such
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16:22[~]peter1138 ponders
16:27<Rubidium>the major problem is that the saveload code assumes constant sized SaveLoad's, i.e. a variably sized list cannot be in a SaveLoad.
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16:33<Wolf01>'night all
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16:58<ln->what useful could one do with two identical Celeron 2.13GHz machines? (besides running distcc)
16:59<peter1138>give to me
16:59<Rubidium>starting a beowulf cluster
16:59<ln->peter1138: i don't own them yet, so not possible
17:00<ln->what can one do with a beowulf cluster, and is two machines enough for something sensible?
17:01<lolman>ln-, you could use folding@home :P
17:05<Sacro|Laptop>oh noes, its him
17:05<lolman>It is indeed
17:05<lolman>I installed Arch again :)
17:06<Sacro|Laptop>yay
17:06<Sacro|Laptop>Arch is amazing
17:06<lolman>Wireless took some prodding to get going but it works :)
17:07<lolman>A testement to ndiswrapper's progress I think
17:09<Sacro|Laptop>yeah, my desktop is using ndiswrapper
17:10<lolman>Now I just need to find a good emerald theme and I'm set :D
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17:15<Maedhros>night everyone
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17:29<peter1138>hmm, compiled, no warnings...
17:29<peter1138>yay, segfault :p
17:30<Sacro|Laptop>hehe
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17:33<UndernotBuilder>I wish.. that openttd 1.0 is out now :P
17:34<mikk36[EST]>u wish.... to much
17:34<mikk36[EST]>too*
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17:34<UndernotBuilder>I make reference to the "shoot a openttd wish" topic or whatever else
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17:39<peter1138>Rubidium: "appears" to work
17:39<peter1138>Rubidium: in that it doesn't crash, and save/loads games...
17:40<peter1138>it's a SL_LST type that will save/load any existing REF_ type
17:40<peter1138>and it's horrible, but at least it's more generic ;)
17:40<peter1138>http://fuzzle.org/o/sllst.diff
17:41<peter1138>http://fuzzle.org/o/sllst-aint.diff
17:41<peter1138>first is just saveload
17:41<peter1138>second is the saveload & the station changes
17:42<peter1138>mind you
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17:42<peter1138>it's probably invalid and just works by fluke...
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18:03<peter1138>quick test reveals correct save/load
18:06<peter1138>nini
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---Logclosed Fri Apr 20 00:00:19 2007