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#openttd IRC Logs for 2007-06-11

---Logopened Mon Jun 11 00:00:59 2007
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00:23<blathijs>omg: http://nanahara.student.utwente.nl/~matthijs/Onweer/closeup.php?filename=images/990%20The%20Day%20After.jpg
00:23<boekabart>jeeeseens!
00:24<boekabart>plons
00:24<boekabart>that's something else than a 'wisselstoring' (switch breakdown) for a change!
00:25<boekabart>blathijs: you made it yourself?
00:25<boekabart>no 'broodje puntmuts' today i'm guessing!
00:25<blathijs>yes, just got tipped off by my girlfriend (who is in the train on the picture) and rode there to make them :-)
00:25<blathijs>boekabart: Fortunately, it's underneath the tracks, so the trains still ride as normal
00:26<blathijs>though there is not really any easy way to get from one side of the track to the other, now
00:26<Gekko>http://etc.bbqsrc.org/mrxvt.png
00:27<blathijs>hmm, hadn't really thought about Broodje Puntmuts yet... The damage in their shop must be awful..
00:27<boekabart>while the iron is hot: care to comment on the coding style of my deep-water patch: http://www.tt-forums.net/download.php?id=72432
00:27<blathijs>heh :-)
00:28<boekabart>:D
00:29<boekabart>probably that was not a correct english expression, though
00:29<blathijs>isn't the assert in IsWater weird?
00:29<boekabart>neh
00:29<boekabart> :)
00:30<blathijs>There is also a "IsWaterTile" or something?
00:30<boekabart>the NAME is
00:30<boekabart>IsClearWaterTile
00:30<blathijs>yeah, that was my second thought :-)
00:30<blathijs>and the comment at IsCanal is also weird
00:30<boekabart>actually IsWater isn't used and weird
00:30<blathijs>you should use /** style comments above functions to say what they do, too
00:30<boekabart>eh, true :P
00:31<Maedhros>if statements should either have brackets or all be on one line
00:33<boekabart>anyway those map accessor 'IsSomethings' are weird: some assume tiletype before they check subtype, some check
00:34<Maedhros>make_canal |= (TileHeight(tile) > _current_sealevel); <-- it's a bool, so (imo) you shouldn't use | with it
00:34<boekabart>should be ||=
00:36<blathijs>boekabart: Those assumptions are fine, but they should be clearly documented I guess
00:36<boekabart>IsWater is and was the same as IsClearWaterTile except the latter checks the TileType to be water, the former asserts it to be
00:37<blathijs>though reading assumptions from function names is better
00:37<boekabart>agree
00:37<boekabart>I didn't like either of the names, not too clear at all
00:37<blathijs>boekabart: Why do you call DoClearSquare instead of MakeWater when removing an oil rig from deep water?
00:37<boekabart>not from deep water
00:38<boekabart>when lowering sea level (scen edit), it 'dries up' all the water at the old sea level
00:38<boekabart>maybe a <= or >= would be clearer, but the other case shouldn't happen I think
00:39<boekabart>if it would make water, that water would flood the whole map again
00:40<blathijs>hmm..
00:40<blathijs>Anyway, the first half looks fine to me
00:41<blathijs>haven't really checked for coding style (since I'm not really used to ottd coding style anymore), but looks like a decent patch to me
00:42<boekabart>ok, thanks
00:42<boekabart>thanks for the help guys. I'm going to check the oilrig thing just to be sure.
00:43<boekabart>btw that assert is not even duplicate, GetWaterTileType doesn't assert tiletype==MP_WATER :|
00:43<boekabart>though i guess it should
00:45<boekabart>Maedhros: "Maedhros: if statements..." <- where was that?
00:46<Maedhros>+ if (_game_mode != GM_EDITOR)
00:46<Maedhros>+ return 0;
00:46<Maedhros>for example :)
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00:46<boekabart>that 2nd line is NOT ok?
00:47<boekabart>that sucks, how does one ever put a breakpoint on just the 'true' case then :|
00:47<boekabart>(in msvc, that is)
00:47<Maedhros>boekabart: no, it should either be if (_game_mode != GM_EDITOR) return 0, or you should have brackets around the statement
00:47<boekabart>Maedhros: ok
00:47<boekabart>fair enough
00:48<boekabart>is this ok: + if (_current_sealevel > 0 &&
00:48<boekabart>+ ((TileX(ti->tile) == MapMaxX() - 1) || (TileY(ti->tile) == MapMaxY() - 1))) {
00:48<boekabart>the ( and ) on different lines?
00:48<Maedhros>yeah, that's o
00:48<Maedhros>k
00:49<boekabart>KTHX
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01:01<boekabart>blathijs: where I used to live in bucharest, with every good rain, the street in front of my flat would flood about 1 meter (it was at the bottom of a hill). Always a laugh. (water never entered the building, luckily)
01:02<@peter1138>:o
01:03<boekabart>peter1138: did you see the pic blathijs posted?
01:03<@peter1138>yes
01:03<@peter1138>any 'before' shots? :p
01:04<blathijs>no, sorry :-)
01:04<blathijs>I'll take them when the water is gone ;-p
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01:12[~]boekabart wonders if there's any breakfast better than coffee and cookies ('speculaas')
01:15<Smoovious>anyone know off-hand, what year the first road vehicles start showing up in default road vehicle list?
01:17<Smoovious>I suppose if you wanted to get to the other track bad enough, you could always take a quick swim
01:18<boekabart>Smoovious: i'm afraid homeless and drunks to take leaks in those tunnels at night... all that piss is still in there now :)
01:18<Rubidium>http://stationsweb.brinkster.net/enschededrienerlo/afb2.jpg <- that's the station when it's dry
01:19<boekabart>spacious!
01:20<Smoovious>yeah, but if you wanted to bad enough I suppose you'd overlook that :D
01:23<boekabart>i think i'd rather climb the fence and look left and right twice, before crossing the track
01:24<Rubidium>I'd rather take the train to the next station and then take either the bus from there or the (same) train back ;)
01:24<boekabart>i'm guessing also road tunnels under the tracks are blocked?
01:28<Smoovious>well, I like train a lot, so I'd probably extend my riding time too
01:28<hylje>interesting
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01:48<TheJosh>hey.
01:48<TheJosh>whats the best way to handle failure of a malloc call?
01:48<boekabart>it should never fail
01:48<valhallasw>add more memory? ;)
01:49<hylje>CALL IT AGAIN
01:49<valhallasw>while (!(a=malloc(10)));
01:49<boekabart>but seriously, it can only fail if you allocate way too much in one go, or allocate too often and don't free
01:50<TheJosh>in a loop could cause an infinate loop
01:50<boekabart>TheJosh: valhallasw was NOT serious
01:50<hylje>well you dont want it to fail?
01:50<boekabart>(but he was funny)
01:50<TheJosh>im sayinf _if_ it fails (say for the person who is playing on a mobile phone)
01:51<TheJosh>sayinf = saying
01:51<boekabart>TheJosh: Too much relies on malloc never failing
01:51<TheJosh>aka dont worry?
01:51<boekabart>it just shouldn't
01:51<blathijs>Usually stuff handles it nicely I think? Return CMD_ERROR?
01:51<hylje>what if some flavour of stdlib malloc fails most of the time
01:51<boekabart>blathijs: i'm not so sure about that
01:51<Noldo>TheJosh: just don't assert
01:52<TheJosh>blathijs: the code is usually called before or very near to there being a gui
01:52<boekabart>anyway, if you make a patch that makes it happen, see if you don't accidentaly alloc to much to often or so.
01:52<TheJosh>should i just do a printf?
01:53<TheJosh>it will allocate about 34 x 30 bytes initially, but that could grow to about 34 x 1000 bytes, depending on the size of the game
01:53<hylje>well
01:53<hylje>you dont want to make hueg games on silly hardware
01:53<Noldo>TheJosh: check how it's done elsewhere?
01:54<boekabart>it's only 71 mallocs in the entire game, not too much work to check them out
01:54<boekabart>i recall some do check, but most don't
01:54<hylje>(you just grepped?)
01:54<blathijs>TheJosh: What are the mallocs for?
01:55<boekabart>hylje: actually i fart-ed
01:55<TheJosh>the texteffect array
01:55<boekabart>(fart @ sourceforge)
01:55<TheJosh>texteffects are the rising monies
01:55<hylje>RISING MONIES
01:55<hylje>D:
01:55<TheJosh>and im making the array dynamic, because loading indicators use that array, and
01:56<TheJosh>it needs to work with games like pile, but not use stacks of ram for small games
01:57<boekabart>std::list?
01:57<TheJosh>huh?
01:57<boekabart>(you might want to use std:: to not re-invent the wheel)
01:58<boekabart>standard template library
01:58<valhallasw>svn doesnt support rename, right?
01:58<boekabart>it does
01:58<TheJosh>valhallasw: yes svn move
01:58<valhallasw>k, good
01:59<TheJosh>boekabart: does std:list work with structs or only classes
01:59<boekabart>valhallasw: do it directly on the repo though, not on the working copy
01:59<boekabart>svn move on WC is same as delete/add
02:00<boekabart>TheJosh: i think it's stl, not std (my bad) i'm quite sure with anything. = but not an stl expert myself
02:00<valhallasw>boekabart: er? how?
02:00<TheJosh>valhallasw: svn move is a add and a delete operation (but it preserves histories)
02:01<boekabart>svn move svn://svn.openttd.org/trunk/src/some_file.c svn://svn.openttd.org/trunk/src/other_name.cpp
02:01<boekabart>valhallasw: it will become a 'commit'
02:01<valhallasw>k
02:01<boekabart>then svn up to update your WC, of course
02:02<boekabart>valhallasw: you can do folders too of course
02:02<boekabart>but always do it directly in repo...
02:02<valhallasw>k
02:02<valhallasw>thx
02:02<boekabart>np
02:02<Maedhros>are you sure? copy at least works perfectly well in the working copy...
02:03<boekabart>if I do a svn copy in WC, the repo does not know the origin of that file
02:03<valhallasw> WC -> WC: move and schedule for addition (with history)
02:03<valhallasw> URL -> URL: complete server-side rename.
02:03<boekabart>(then that may be a windows problem??)
02:03<valhallasw>no
02:04<boekabart>hm! just did a test, and indeed, it keeps history with svn cp
02:04<boekabart>even on windows. :)
02:05<valhallasw>locally?
02:05<valhallasw>or does svn cp just ping the server? ;)
02:05<boekabart>yes, i did svn cp file.cpp filex.cpp
02:06<boekabart>still, i prefer the server side rename. does local rename work for moving files/folders far far away too?
02:06<TheJosh>doesnt it do a server side rename when you do a svn update?
02:07<boekabart>apparently (now) it does (when svn commit after the svn cp/mv)
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02:31<TheJosh>*** glibc detected *** corrupted double-linked list: 0x0834c778 ***
02:31<TheJosh>what does this mean?
02:32<@peter1138>it broke
02:32<TheJosh>duh
02:32<@peter1138>you freed something twice
02:32<hylje>you have a corrupted double-linked list at 0x0834c778
02:32<boekabart>hylje: really?
02:32<hylje>i'm fairly sure
02:32<TheJosh>peter1138: i havent written any code that does a free
02:32<TheJosh>only realloc
02:33<boekabart>do you do ptr = realloc( ptr, new_size ); ??
02:33<boekabart>(don't forget the ptr = in front!!)
02:33<boekabart>if you don't you will end up free-ing ptr more than once
02:33<TheJosh>_text_effect_list = (TextEffect*) realloc(_text_effect_list, _num_text_effects * sizeof(TextEffect));
02:34<boekabart>looks ok on first sight...
02:34<TheJosh>and appeared to work (one realloc worked, or so by debugging messages said)
02:43<boekabart>how do i 'collect' all tiles occupied by one industry?
02:44<Phazorx>is sunloadale save made with same release fixable?
02:44<boekabart>please not a foreach( tile ) if (getstationbytile(tile) == same_station )
02:45<Noldo>no because that's for stations
02:45<boekabart>well actually it's only for oilrig
02:46<boekabart>does oilrig have 6 station tiles or 1 station tile and 5 industry tiles?
02:48<TheJosh>dunno
02:49<TheJosh>why dont you look at the 8 (or 4) tiles around the tile, and see if they are in the oilrig and not in a small temp array. then if they are in the oilrig, (but not in the array) check around that tile too
02:49<TheJosh>thats one way that avoids a map scan
02:50<TheJosh>also allows for odd-shaped industries (NewGRF?)
02:51<Noldo>floodfill would work
02:52<boekabart>hmm , what happens currenly when deleting an oilrig, does it turn into water immediately or just the top tile, and the rest floods?
02:52[~]boekabart builds a trunk version
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03:04<Noldo>what are you tinkering with?
03:04<boekabart>deep seas
03:04<boekabart>actually, higher sea level so you can tunnel under it
03:11<Nickman>and, how is it going? :)
03:12<TheJosh>is OpenTTD threaded?
03:14<boekabart>no
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03:14<boekabart>only compressing savegame
03:14<boekabart>and generating world is fibered
03:14<boekabart>and stop there, discussion held too often already :)
03:16<TheJosh>i thouth that the case, i just wanted to check
03:18<TheJosh>hey i just got a YAPF assertion
03:18<Biff>TheJosh: _num_text_effects * sizeof(TextEffect)?
03:18<Biff>did _num_text_effects increase?
03:18<TheJosh>Biff: yes
03:19<Biff>ok
03:19<TheJosh>YAPF assertion => http://paste.openttd.org/93
03:25<@peter1138>BUG tracker => http://bugs.openttd.org/
03:28<Nickman>!help
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03:54<Maedhros>TheJosh: with the savegame in that bug report, how can we reproduce the assert?
03:54<Maedhros>... those bug reports now ;)
03:56<TheJosh>sorry
03:56<TheJosh>i had only added 1 line to the game
03:57<TheJosh>and it crashed
03:59<Maedhros>ok, but we need step-by-step instructions on how to reproduce it in order to fix it :)
04:01<boekabart>TheJosh: can you get the failed assertion with a clean trunk version?
04:01<TheJosh>boekabart: ill try
04:02<TheJosh>there is a good chance this error will not surface itself again, probably just a bad fluke
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04:07<kaan>mornings
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04:13<TheJosh>sorry, cant reproduce
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04:16<Maedhros>TheJosh: ok, i'm going to close it as "Unreproducable" then - if it happens again though, feel free to reopen it
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04:29<TheJosh>Maedhros: thanks. how have you been?
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05:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10090 /trunk/config.lib: -Add: add --with-distcc to configure, to enable distcc compiles. Not used by default
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05:19<TrueBrain>lalala
05:26[~]valhallasw generates some evil noise
05:27[~]TrueBrain kicks valhallasw
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05:27<TrueBrain>welcome pro
05:27[~]valhallasw sighs and continues with astrophysics
05:27<TrueBrain>valhallasw: enjoy :p
05:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r10091 /trunk/ (Makefile.in config.lib): -Add: make time detection whether you are using -jN when having distcc enabled.
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06:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10092 /trunk/ (22 files in 5 dirs):
06:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Codechange: code-seperated the spriteloader and blitter from the rest of the code
06:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Add: make it possible to pick your own blitter (-b <blitter>, -h for overview)
06:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Add: added a new optimized 8bpp blitter (default, caches sprites of all zoom-levels)
06:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Add: added a debug 8bpp blitter and a very slow normal 8bpp blitter
06:51<TrueBrain>so, there you have it! :p
06:52<Noldo>what is it?
06:52<hylje>blitterz
06:53<hylje>blit blit
06:53<Eddi|zuHause3>blitzers?
06:53<hylje>yarr
06:53<Eddi|zuHause3>the guys that catch you speeding?
06:53<TrueBrain>run: ./openttd -b 8bpp-debug, and you will see :)
06:55<@peter1138>it's pretty :D
06:55<@peter1138>beats that caps-lock thing any day ;)
06:55<TrueBrain>Yup :)
06:55<Kjetil>Compile faster god damnit *kicks his laptop*
06:56[~]Sionide also kicks his
06:57<Kjetil>OoO pretty colours
06:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10093 /trunk/src/ (sound.cpp texteff.cpp viewport.cpp zoom.hpp): -Revert: removed 16x zoom-out as it is broken beyond repair
07:01<Sionide>aw :(
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07:09<oxygene_>hi
07:10<TrueBrain>hello oxygene_
07:10<oxygene_>i think i found a trivial bug (one-line fix). shall i file a bug or bug a dev directly?
07:10<TrueBrain>do it via http://bugs.openttd.org/
07:10<TrueBrain>good for our bug-fix-stats :)
07:11<TrueBrain>(and if it isn't as trivial as you think, it leaves room for conversation)
07:11<oxygene_>indspec->accepts_cargo[0] == indspec->accepts_cargo[0] && (
07:11<oxygene_>looks quite trivial to me
07:11<oxygene_>inside a if-statement check
07:13<oxygene_>you can't fund industries within 14 tiles distance to any other industry (regardless of the "conflicting" field)
07:13<oxygene_>because the code always thinks that any industry within this distance accepts the same as the industry to place
07:14<TrueBrain>I truely wonder why people ask a question, and ignore the answer anyway
07:14<TrueBrain>why ask it in the first place?
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07:17<oxygene_>right, may asking was stupid. i was about to file it but though that 5 lines on irc wouldn't hurt
07:17<oxygene_>*maybe
07:18<TrueBrain>you only make the mistake that you assume the person working on that code is around and will read this. Where a bugreport will be read by him as others can point him to it. Pointing to an IRC conversation is much harder
07:18<TrueBrain>so I suggest to use the bug-tracker, but feel free to ignore the suggestions.
07:18<oxygene_>i wanted to file it anyway.
07:21<oxygene_>my explanation was just an answer to " (and if it isn't as trivial as you think, it leaves room for conversation)", but never mind
07:21<Rubidium>well, it is most certainly not a one-line fix, that I'm sure of
07:23<Maedhros>3 lines by the looks of it, though i'll wait for Belugas to be sure ;)
07:24<TrueBrain>I rest my case ;)
07:24<oxygene_>i'm not a openttd dev
07:25<oxygene_>but it looks to me like you need to take the type of "i" and get the industry spec and get the accepted_cargo from it
07:25<oxygene_>i'm filing...
07:25<oxygene_>so let it be 3 or 4 lines then. whatever ;)
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07:30<oxygene_>http://bugs.openttd.org/task/860
07:37<@peter1138>-- indspec->accepts_cargo[0] == indspec->accepts_cargo[0] && (
07:37<@peter1138>+ indspec->accepts_cargo[0] == GetIndustrySpec(i)->accepts_cargo[0] && (
07:37<@peter1138>probably that, no?
07:38<@peter1138>weird though
07:40<@peter1138>heh, not quite ;p
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07:40<@peter1138>i->type
07:41<oxygene_>does only the first accepted cargo needs to be checked?
07:42<oxygene_>not sure what the intention of the game is
07:42<@peter1138>apparnetly
07:44<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r10094 /trunk/src/lang/ (bulgarian.txt galician.txt portuguese.txt): -Fix: some really broken strings got in.
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07:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10095 /trunk/src/blitter/8bpp_optimized.cpp: -Fix: avoid reading outside the buffer because of scaling problems
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08:32<Sacro>!logs
08:32<SpComb>Logs: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd
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08:38<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10096 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): -Fix r10092: freetype bypassed the Blitter::Encode, making fonts look weird
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09:00<CIA-1>OpenTTD: maedhros * r10097 /trunk/src/ (21 files in 2 dirs):
09:00<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Feature: Add support for articulated road vehicles, or callbacks 11 and 17 for
09:00<CIA-1>OpenTTD: road vehicles for those who prefer the technical explanation.
09:00<Maedhros>callback 16, rather ;)
09:01<Digitalfox>Articulated road vehicles, very cool ;) Nice work Maedhros ..
09:03<@peter1138>:D
09:03<@peter1138>feature day :D
09:03<boekabart>peter1138: why don't you join that fun :)
09:04<hylje>choo choo
09:04<@Belugas>because peter1138 does not know which one to choose, of the countless uncommited patches he has done ;)
09:05<hylje>articulated RVs!
09:05<hylje>choo choo indeed!
09:05<@peter1138>hehe
09:06<Nickman>haha :D
09:06<Nickman>peter1138: do the "new blitters" also give a performance increase or just coede sepparation?
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09:07<@peter1138>code separation
09:07<Nickman>so no changes in performance?
09:07<Digitalfox>time to use kaan tool, compile and test this feature :)
09:08<Nickman>are there any GRF's that have the articulated road vehicles?
09:09<Rubidium>only trams IIRC
09:09<Maedhros>hirotram.grf is the only (released) on i know of ('tis the first google result)
09:09<Maedhros>*one
09:09<Nickman>:D
09:09<Digitalfox>George long buses, don't use this feature??
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09:10<Maedhros>nope
09:10<Digitalfox>ok
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09:15<@peter1138>Digitalfox: nope, they were made before artic RVs were written
09:16<Sacro>hahaha, DaleStan got pwned...
09:16<Digitalfox>peter1138: ah ok, you see, since george v4 set, has some big buses, i thought they would benefict from this :)
09:17<+glx>Sacro: in dual screen thread?
09:18<@peter1138>Digitalfox: yeah, they would
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09:18<@peter1138>Digitalfox: but this stuff needs special coding, heh
09:18<@peter1138>ukts uses it :D
09:18<Digitalfox>ok :)
09:18<@peter1138>yay, now i don't need a custom build to test it
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09:20<Digitalfox>peter1138: Need some help testing your new tram set? ;)
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09:21<@peter1138>not yet :)
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09:21<@peter1138>when ameecher is ready it will be
09:21<Digitalfox>The set looks great, from screenshots and tracking table :)
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09:22<Digitalfox>Do you think, since you are the one who coded and ameecher draw it, it could be part of openttd by default?
09:23<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r10098 /trunk/src/ (ai/default/default.cpp table/ai_rail.h): -Codechange: bilbo cared about the performance of the AI with respect to the airport placement, so he rewrote the aircraft handling of the AI; now it can actually make lots of money again :)
09:23<hylje>what
09:23<hylje>ai feature
09:23<hylje>zomg monies
09:23<@peter1138>wtf
09:23<@peter1138>who uses the AI? :p
09:24<+glx>bilbo does :)
09:24<Rubidium>I wanted to say that :(
09:24<boekabart>Rubidium: what did bilbo DO to you???
09:24<hylje>send a patch?
09:24|-|Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit []
09:24<TrueBrain>and money
09:24<TrueBrain>lots of it!
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09:24<Rubidium>he made a patch for something so completely rotten that it couldn't get any worse
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09:24<TrueBrain>good point :)
09:25<boekabart>very
09:25<boekabart>like TrueBrain just did :)
09:25<TrueBrain>I did what?
09:25<CIA-1>OpenTTD: belugas * r10099 /trunk/src/industry_cmd.cpp:
09:25<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Fix(r9867, FS860): Use the specs of the to-be-created industry instead of the scanned industry
09:25<CIA-1>OpenTTD: Spotted by Oxygene
09:25<boekabart>TrueBrain: the gfx stuff. sucked, so couldn't get worse
09:26<TrueBrain>it could
09:26<TrueBrain>I showed that clearly :)
09:26<boekabart>well AI could too
09:27<Rubidium>3 AI actually making money from the start is very very odd ;)
09:29<Sacro>oooh
09:29<Sacro>10099
09:29<hylje>binary combo next up
09:29<Sacro>whats new in r100100 ?
09:29<boekabart>100100??
09:29<Sacro>hylje: next 2
09:29<hylje>10100 ;)
09:29<Sacro>err... yes
09:29<Sacro>10100
09:30<hylje>the y2k problems were silly
09:30<hylje>1999 -> 19100
09:30<oxygene_>hehe
09:34<Eddi|zuHause3>hey, those were great :p
09:36<Sacro>!logs
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09:36<SpComb^_>Logs: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd
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09:42<Digitalfox>This articulated feature rocks.. The trams look great with it..
09:42<boekabart>Digitalfox: what tram set?
09:42<Digitalfox>hirotram
09:42<Digitalfox>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=24536&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
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09:44<boekabart>KTHX
09:44<Digitalfox>It's a shame that no other set's use it.. :(
09:45<Maedhros>they'll get there - until recently it was pretty unstable in ttdpatch, and obviously non-existant in openttd
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09:45<Digitalfox>Let's hope more coders start using it :)
09:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10100 /trunk/src/blitter/8bpp_optimized.cpp: -Fix r10093: some code now became obsolete as it never did something
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09:55<@Belugas>maybe it would be pay-back time and start trolling in TTDPatch's forums : We have stable trams!!!
09:55[~]Belugas hides
09:55<hylje>:o
09:55<TrueBrain>Is your name DaleStan?
09:55<Biff>trams in openttd?
09:56<hylje>"Hi. We have trams that work, articulated too! Thanks!"
09:58<@peter1138>we had trams for ages
09:59<@peter1138>at least a week
09:59<kaan>so aticulated trams are in trunk now?
09:59<hylje>pretty much
09:59<kaan>nice
10:00[~]kaan fires up bottd
10:01<hylje>implement an articulated tram network in the title screen!
10:01<kaan>19 revisions since last night? did you all go mad or something?
10:01<hylje>merge time
10:01<Eddi|zuHause3>yes, muahahaha!!
10:01<hylje>true
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10:04<Eddi|zuHause3>if i find a decent tram set, i should do a tram only game...
10:04<Eddi|zuHause3>at least i will not need PBS then :)
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10:05<hylje>o yea
10:05<hylje>happy dedicated tram networks!
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10:06<Eddi|zuHause3>it would be totally great with passenger destinations, delivering with inner-city trams to the main station etc.
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10:09<hylje>trams are like trains but without signs
10:09<hylje>in a good way too? :>
10:10<hylje>oh and smaller space and speed
10:10<Eddi|zuHause3>trams have lower speed and shorter stop distance
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10:11<Eddi|zuHause3>i.e. train stations have (usually) a longer distance than tram stops
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10:13<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10101 /trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: the class is named 8bppSimple, so name the files like that too
10:15<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10102 /trunk/src/blitter/ (8bpp_debug.hpp 8bpp_optimized.hpp 8bpp_simple.hpp): -Documentation: @file header was wrong
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10:16<kaan>hmmm, aticulated trams are nice but i think i found a bug ;)
10:17<Eddi|zuHause3>better than if you not found that bug :)
10:17<kaan>so who wants a save file?
10:17<Maedhros>moi, please :)
10:17<kaan>DCC?
10:18<Maedhros>i don't think i've ever got it set up properly, so http if you can
10:18<kaan>ok, ill post it in the general/trams in trunk
10:18<Maedhros>what's the bug, anyway?
10:19<kaan>tram stuck in a corner
10:19<kaan>trying to go forward
10:21<Nickman>that's just the dtupidity of trams :p
10:21<Nickman>don't make dead ends for trams
10:21<Nickman>it's not a real bug...
10:22<Nickman>just a probem with their pathfinder ;)
10:22<Maedhros>not even that, but a deliberate design decision
10:22<Maedhros>(ooh, alliteration!)
10:23<Nickman>:p
10:23<Nickman>why is it a design decision?
10:24<Rubidium>trams can't turn when there is not track to turn
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10:24<Rubidium>and when a tram reaches such place it's either a network that is broken by design or a tram that doesn't have any orders
10:25<Rubidium>the pathfinders know pretty well that they can't turn there
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10:28<kaan>Maedhros: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=595690#595690
10:28<kaan>ok, then the bug is that it doesnt get out of there even when i give it orders :P
10:29<@peter1138>it can't
10:29<@peter1138>solution for the moment: don't fuck up your tram network
10:29<Nickman>yep, design flaw ;)
10:30<kaan>oh well, now i went and made a nice post for nothing :P
10:31<Nickman>;)
10:31<kaan>maybe you should activate the reverse vehicle button for trams as a temp solution?
10:33<+glx>kaan: but it can't reverse :)
10:34<oxygene_>so you're doomed with such a situation?
10:36<kaan>glx: oh, then never mind, ill just go along now ;)
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10:43<mikk36>o.O
10:43<mikk36>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurocam
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11:19<kaan>mikk36: so you are basicly mindcontrolled?
11:19<mikk36>am i ? :)
11:19<kaan>oh noes, i failed in giving the order correctly
11:20<@Bjarni>that's no problem
11:20<@Bjarni>I did that all day
11:20<kaan>phew
11:20<kaan>ok, im going for pita kebab now, see ya all later :)
11:22<ln->how much does it cost?
11:23<kaan>30DKK
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11:38<ln->ok, a little cheaper than here.
11:38<ln->usually.
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11:41<CIA-1>OpenTTD: maedhros * r10103 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Fix (r10086): TrackBitsToTrack doesn't cope well with TRACK_BIT_NONE (e.g. non-rail tiles), so use FindFirstTrack instead.
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11:47<blathijs>Maedhros: What use is it to place signals on non-rail tiles?
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11:48<mikk36>o.O
11:48<Maedhros>blathijs: none at all, but this is before everything gets passed to the DoCommand, which provides the error
11:48<Sacro_>wtf?
11:48<blathijs>Maedhros: "the error" ?
11:48|-|Sacro_ changed nick to Sacro
11:49<Maedhros>"Can't {place,remove} signals {,from } here"
11:49<blathijs>ah
11:49<blathijs>like that...
11:50<blathijs>hmm, then this looks like an acceptable solution
11:50<blathijs>looked a bit weird at first
11:52<Maedhros>:)
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12:35<Wolf01>hello
12:35<@peter1138>hi
12:35<kaan>hey wolf
12:36<Wolf01>i'm waiting for the VS2005, a friend of mine has it, then i'll start to work on the WM5 port
12:36<Wolf01>:)
12:37<moe>anyone here from norway?
12:40<Wolf01>i think yes, they are shy ;)
12:41<moe>heh seems so =P
12:42<Wolf01>boekabart, the edit button exists in the forums :P
12:43<Wolf01>but you made a good work with that patch
12:43<MiHaMiX>evenin'
12:44<Wolf01>hello
12:45<boekabart>Wolf01: the edit button?
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: miham * r10104 /trunk/src/lang/ (7 files): (log message trimmed)
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-06-11 19:45:13
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: catalan - 4 changed by arnaullv (4)
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: czech - 3 fixed, 1 changed by Hadez (4)
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: danish - 2 fixed by MiR (2)
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: dutch - 1 fixed by habell (1)
12:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: estonian - 2 fixed, 15 changed by kristjans (17)
12:46<Wolf01>yeah, you made 7 post in a row :P
12:46<boekabart>Wolf01: actually I used it the last 3 times :)
12:48<Wolf01>the my suggestion is to have the first post of the topic as "informations and download links" place, so you need only to place a new link there if you want to keep all the old revisions of the patch
12:49<boekabart>Wolf01: good idea, i sometimes do that too ;)
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13:11<ln->omg, there'll be a a windows version of Safari.
13:14<Phazorx>glx are you around?
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13:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truelight * r10105 /trunk/src/spritecache.cpp: -Fix r10092: fix sprite 4845 till 4881 (inclusive), so they store the data as on the disk in the memory, as the old landscape generate assumes this. Talking about ugly hacks...
13:51<Nickman>ln-: indeed there will be :)
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13:57<+glx>[20:14:14] <Phazorx> glx are you around? <-- now I am :)
13:58<ln->[11/Jun/2007:21:58:16 +0300] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 2873 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; fi) AppleWebKit/522.11.3 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Safari/522.11.3"
13:59<Phazorx>glx: was wondering if you can make a build of nightly + hash optimization patch
13:59<Phazorx>but i already got one... however would be intersting to see if ming version is different from VC one
14:00<+glx>it shouldn't :)
14:00<Phazorx>i wont see unless there is a big diff
14:01<+glx>where is the patch?
14:01<Phazorx>http://fuzzle.org/o/newhash3.diff
14:01<Phazorx>i got ~500% improvement on huge game
14:02<Phazorx>compared to 300% for stillunknown's version
14:02<@Bjarni>stillunknown said that the improved hash looked better than his solution
14:03<Phazorx>he was correct
14:03<Phazorx>i wonder if they can be combined for even more effect
14:03<Phazorx>and e should bump 5000 train limit :)
14:03<Phazorx>we
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14:05<@Bjarni>you can test it
14:06<@Bjarni>apply both patches and recompile
14:07<@peter1138>stillunknowns patch has known (heh) problems
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14:08<+glx>Phazorx: http://glx.dnsalias.net:8080/openttd/OTTD-MINGW-custom-r10104M.zip
14:09<Phazorx>thank you much
14:10<Phazorx>i'm interesting in testing but can not compile
14:10<Phazorx>unless glx wants to make another one :)
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14:11<+glx>Can't you use BuildOTTD for that?
14:12<@Bjarni>BuildOTTD?
14:12<@Bjarni>we got such a thing running again?
14:12<+glx>kaan's tool to build openttd using mingw (it can apply 1 patch)
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14:15<Phazorx>glx: need 2 patches and dont have ming
14:15<Phazorx>thanks for your build tho
14:16<kaan>mingw comes with BuildOTD, you just have to go in the correct folder and start the commandline for msys and you are all set
14:17<Phazorx>i shall try
14:17<Maedhros>kaan: nice post in the feeder systems thread :)
14:18<kaan>thanks, i try to keep it simple ;)
14:20<kaan>Phazorx: start a separate chat with me if you need help with that :)
14:20<Phazorx>kk
14:21<Phazorx>i dealt with ming before tho
14:21<Phazorx>neverseen bottd however
14:22<Phazorx>saving on one of my saves with really thick ML - 1100% compared to 10048
14:22<kaan>basicly its a mingw/msys environment with the packages needed for ottd and then a small c# program to drive a userinterface that peeps can figure out how to use
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14:23<Phazorx>hmm... any idea why i get "Game Load Filed" with multiple saves of another game?
14:24<TrueBrain>no zlib? Custom patch?
14:24<Phazorx>both cuztom patches
14:24<Phazorx>10048M to 10104M
14:25<Maedhros>the other one probably had a savegame bump in it
14:25<TrueBrain>doesn't mean a lot ;)
14:25<Phazorx>savegame bump?
14:25<Phazorx>TrueBrain: these are stock + stillunknown's patch and stock + peter1138's patch
14:26<TrueBrain>we can't help you with custom patches
14:26<Phazorx>but what can be the reason?
14:27<+glx>the build I made for you doesn't have a savegame bump
14:27<TrueBrain>savegame bumps mostly are the reason
14:27<Phazorx>can you elaborate on what is the savegame bump please?
14:28<@Bjarni>something new is added to the savegame, so the savegame version is newer
14:28<TrueBrain>or of the older savegame the version is newer
14:28<TrueBrain>or the savegames were broken, always
14:28<@Bjarni>since the game don't know the structure of future versions, then it can't load a version newer than the newest one when it was built
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14:29<@Bjarni>we do try to make it able to load older versions whenever possible
14:29<@peter1138>i think there was a savegame bug in a few revisions
14:29<@peter1138>might be that
14:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r10106 /trunk/src/ai/default/default.cpp: -Fix (r10098): there's always a compiler complaining about something...
14:30<@peter1138>i don't bump the version, dunno about stillunknown
14:30<@Bjarni>stillunknown did
14:30<@Bjarni>in his diff
14:30<@peter1138>then that could be it
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14:33<Phazorx>hmm... can that be suppressed somehow?
14:34<Maedhros>no
14:34<Maedhros>it means the savegame contains something that your version of openttd doesn't know how to handle
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14:35<+glx>IIRC stillunknown used some bits in maparray
14:41<@peter1138>i need to do some benchmarking with different HASH_RES values
14:41<Phazorx>peter i need more trains to be able to show performance difference
14:41<Phazorx>it tends to get to fraction of percents looks like it
14:42<Phazorx>and it would be nice to override tyhat somehow
14:42<Phazorx>cuz i'm pretty sure it is just a bump rather than actual difference
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15:00<moe>is it possible to have 2 players in 1 company?
15:00<@peter1138>yes
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15:00<moe>cool
15:00<bob27>hello
15:01<+glx>moe: you can have up to 10 players in 1 company :)
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15:33<moe>so 8*10 palyers possible?
15:33<moe>or max 10 players in game
15:33<Sacro>Bjarni: http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/591_loko.jpg
15:33<Sacro>and anyone else :
15:33<Sacro>:p
15:34<+glx>moe: max is 10 clients, but they can all be in the same company
15:34<moe>=/
15:37<ln->can i ask a stupid off-topic question?
15:37<@peter1138>are there other sorts?
15:37<+glx>what is the topic?
15:38<ln->peter1138: stupid on-topic ones..?
15:38<ln->probability.
15:38<geoffk>i dont think off topic is a problem in channels so long as it don't get in the way of the topic
15:38<Biff>is there trams in openttd now?
15:38<Biff>people talked about it earlier
15:38<+glx>in trunk yes
15:39<ln->let's roll two dices; what's the probability that the larger number is exactly 3?
15:39<Biff>oh
15:39<Biff>i see
15:39<Biff>but no trams
15:39<Biff>i cannot build it, but maybe it wont work in an old savegame
15:39<+glx>you need a grf with tram vehicles
15:40<Sacro>ln-: err... 1/6x2/6
15:40<Sacro>3 in 36?
15:40<@peter1138>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/traindrift.jpg < multitrack drift again
15:40<+glx>hmm I already saw this picture in this channel
15:40<Biff>hmm, like what?
15:41<ln->Sacro: 1/6 times 2/6 is 3/36 in sacroan algebra?
15:41<Sacro>yes :p
15:42<Sacro>i fail at probabilities
15:42<ln->but i have the answer here, too, and it's supposed to be 5/36, and right now i'm unable to figure out why.
15:43<Rubidium>ln-: that can't be right, there's a 2 in 36 chance it happens, unless the dice are flawed
15:44<Sacro>yes, 2 in 36
15:44<Sacro>1x2 = 2 :p
15:44<Rubidium>Sacro: and for 11 ?
15:44<Sacro>Rubidium: 11?
15:44<Rubidium>what's the chance you've got 11 when throwing two dice?
15:44<Sacro>2/36
15:45<Sacro>either 5 and 4
15:45<Sacro>or 4 and 5
15:45<+glx>(1,3) (2,3) (3,1) (3,2) (3,3) out of all possibilities
15:45<Sacro>no...
15:45<Rubidium>but what has the 1x2 to do with it?
15:45<Sacro>2 dice
15:45<Sacro>thus 12 outcomes
15:45<Sacro>><
15:45[~]Sacro is confused
15:45<Sacro>36 outcomes
15:45<Sacro>2 of them are 11
15:45<Sacro>this 2 out of 36
15:46<Sacro>Rubidium: chances of one die being 3 = 1/6
15:46<Sacro>chances of the other die being 1 or 2, = 2/6
15:46<ln->hmmm, i think glx has a plausible theory there...
15:46<Sacro>you multiply, and get 2/36
15:46<Rubidium>hmm, I misread ln-'s question
15:47<Rubidium>glx is right
15:47<Biff>cool, its like buses only slower
15:47<Biff>:P
15:47<ln->merci
15:47<+glx>de rien :)
15:49<Eddi|zuHause3>it's totally obvious, isn't itß
15:50<Eddi|zuHause3>s/ß/?/
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15:51<ln->it's been too long since i last played with probabilities.
15:51<+glx>yeah I forgot all the formulas
15:51<ln->(i won't tell anyone i have an exam tomorrow.)
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15:54<Biff>hmm, the tram crashed with the bus
15:54<Maedhros>how do you mean crashed? exploded crashed, or just stopped?
15:54<Biff>just stopped
15:55<Biff>and the tram is now stuck on a square with no tramway in that direction
15:56<Sacro>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/1008_pic02480.jpg
15:56<Biff>http://discrete.eimot.no/~magne/openttd/Gl%c3%b8slia%20Transport,%2011th%20Feb%202027.png
15:56<+glx>Sacro: nice one :)
15:56<@peter1138>Sacro: heh, was on that exact same one
15:56<Biff>near "Gløslia West" station
15:57<Sacro>peter1138: disturbly, a few of us where :\
15:57<+glx>Biff: of course, you need to build the 'half' track so it can turn around
15:57<Biff>building some extra tramway it moved
15:58<Biff>oh, but i didnt think the corner would be built
15:58<Biff>in the direction without further tramway
15:58<Sacro>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/1611_trains-side-swipe-each-other.jpg
16:17<CIA-1>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r10107 /trunk/src/ (blitter/8bpp_optimized.hpp openttd.cpp): -Fix (r10092): Missing 'i' in 'optimized'
16:25<kaan>nice catch
16:26<Eddi|zuHause3>isn't it supposed to be "optimised"?
16:27<@peter1138>doesn't bother me
16:27<@peter1138>the missing i did though ;p
16:29<@Bjarni><Sacro> Bjarni: http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/591_loko.jpg <-- I see that you tried real life MS train sim
16:29<@Bjarni>luckily there are no cars on the road
16:30<Sacro>its a detour
16:30<@Bjarni>it's a tram
16:30<@Bjarni>trackless tram XD
16:31<Eddi|zuHause3>it's called a bus :)
16:31<@Bjarni>a bus with buffers?
16:31<@Bjarni>well
16:31<Eddi|zuHause3>try out something new every day :)
16:32<@Bjarni>looking at the track, it appears to be somewhat old and not in mint condition
16:32<@Bjarni>it derailed outside the picture... for all we know, the track entering the crossing is broken
16:32<Eddi|zuHause3>yeah, that was my thought as well
16:33<@Bjarni>maybe somebody added pavements or something
16:33<@Bjarni>besides it's a light vehicle
16:33<@Bjarni>it didn't matter as much if it were a 100+ ton locomotive
16:33<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/2939_pic13931.jpg <-- now this one is odd
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16:34<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/20070611-013208.jpg <-- Sacro is taking driving lessons?
16:34|-|aimes changed nick to KristjanS
16:34<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/1058_6997.jpg <-- and pilot lessons
16:34<Sacro>why always me :(
16:35<@Bjarni>the world is getting more scary the better you know Sacro
16:35<@Bjarni><Sacro> why always me :( <-- we know you say that when it happened
16:36<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/wrong23.jpg <-- LOL. Look at the back and then the passenger seat :D
16:39<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/2919_Snimka0005.jpg <-- I don't think that was the intention XD
16:40<@Bjarni>hmm
16:40<@Bjarni>did you guys leave?
16:40<KristjanS>yes
16:40<KristjanS>:D
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16:42<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/traindrift.jpg <-- I hate when that happens
16:42<@Bjarni>I haven't actually seen it in real life, but I know it happens once in a while and it's a mess every single time
16:43<KristjanS>that's a good feature idea for OpenTTD LoL
16:43[~]Bjarni knows a driver, who actually did this
16:43<@Bjarni>with a DMU
16:43<@Bjarni>well... know him like I know who he is
16:43<Eddi|zuHause3>happened multiple times with my model trains
16:44<@Bjarni>model train incidents are easier to fix than real life trains
16:44<@Bjarni>the tracks were blocked until they found a crane strong enough to lift the DMU
16:44<Eddi|zuHause3>:p
16:44<@Bjarni>he managed to jam it real good
16:45<@peter1138>in a model train you just reverse it, heh
16:46<@peter1138>also the bogies would let it go on at an angle anyway
16:46<@Bjarni>also the issue of "shit, the engine is in the wrong end of the train" isn't such an issue for model trains either
16:51<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/343_momentka.jpg <-- hmm... is this photoshop or a picture from just the right moment....
16:51<KristjanS>nice :D
16:52<@peter1138>photoshop
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16:53<KristjanS>yes, it's photoshop :p still nice'
16:53<Wolf01|AWAY>'night
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16:53<Eddi|zuHause3>it's pretty definite photoshop :p
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16:55<@Bjarni>I thought so too
16:55<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/2971_denge45.jpg <-- and people said that it's a disadvantage to be overweight :D
16:56<@Bjarni>I don't think a skinny person could do this
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17:00<@Bjarni>http://www.doingitwrong.com/wrong/20070603-055023.gif <-- wtf... nice teacher o_O
17:00<@Bjarni>one km is more than a mile and he gives detention to the student, who claims this to be incorrect
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17:03<XeryusTC>Bjarni: old
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17:05<@Bjarni>hopefully
17:05<@Bjarni>yet it's the first time I saw it
17:05<ln->http://www.snopes.com/humor/letters/hilliker.asp
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17:10<@Bjarni>I used to shut up about the teachers making mistakes because they didn't like that :s
17:10<@Bjarni>and that made them reply that I was incorrect in front of the class
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17:44<Eddi|zuHause3>i always pointed out if the teacher was wrong
17:44<Eddi|zuHause3>they usually did not like that, but i did not care :p
17:47<@Bjarni>it was a whole new experience to start at uni
17:47<@Bjarni>if the teacher was corrected, he became happy because it showed that the student understood the stuff on the blackboard
17:49<Eddi|zuHause3>uni wasn't all that different from school
17:50<@Bjarni>it is to me
17:50<Eddi|zuHause3>most of the things they taught in the first 2 semesters i already had at school
17:50<@Bjarni>I never messed around with robots in school ;)
17:50<@Bjarni>actually that's not true
17:50<Eddi|zuHause3>i never messed around with robots in university :p
17:50<@Bjarni>we once tried some lego robots
17:51<@Bjarni>mindstorm before it was named mindstorm and it was in mid 90s or something
17:51<@Bjarni>looked totally different
17:53<Eddi|zuHause3>i never had mindstorms
17:53<Eddi|zuHause3>i only had pneumatic lego stuff
17:54<+glx>I have both generations of pneumatic
17:54<@Bjarni>you will never get too old for coding, so it's a good excuse for buying lego today
17:54<@Bjarni><glx> I have both generations of pneumatic <-- me too... makes it even more fun when I combine them on the same tube system (yes, it can work if you know how to do it)
17:56<Eddi|zuHause3>hm, how insane am i if i listen to a song the 160th time in a row?
17:56<+glx>ready for commit :)
17:57<Eddi|zuHause3>!openttd commit me
17:57<@Bjarni>I once built a compressor like device. It consisted of an electric engine, a whole lot of gears to increase the force and in the end, it had a cranked axle with two old type pneumatic devices (angled 180° from each other). Each of them was connected to a device that could take air in from the outside and when it pushed the air the other way, it went into the tube system. I connected both outputs and I had a constant supply of air a
17:57<@Bjarni>nd due to the gearing, it could build up pressure if needed
17:58<@peter1138>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r10108 /trunk/src (Eddi|zuHause3): -Fix: infinite loop
17:58<Eddi|zuHause3>:p
17:58<@Bjarni><EddizuHause3> hm, how insane am i if i listen to a song the 160th time in a row? <-- that depends on the song. If it's Spice Girls, then yes
17:58<+glx>there is a compressor system with a small pump but I never tried it
17:59<@Bjarni>I never tried the official compressor either. That's why I built my own. It worked rather well even though it did shake somewhat and was a bit noisy
18:00<@Bjarni>the pistons did move slowly, yet with great force so the whole system moved a bit on the floor when it reached the end
18:00<Eddi|zuHause3>the song is called "Overfire" from "T.H.C."
18:01<@Bjarni>it wasn't as balanced as I had hoped because the resistance was much greater when compressing than when taking in new air from the outside... I expected that, but it spoiled my balance plan anyway :s
18:02<@Bjarni>"great force" is relative to what forces you expect coming from lego, not great force in general ;)
18:03<+glx>pneumatic was not very reactive
18:03<@Bjarni>you needed to build up pressure to make it respond quickly... I think having the air tank would help somewhat
18:04<@Bjarni>and using bigger pipes would also help
18:04<@Bjarni>placing the handle close to the controlled device also increased reaction speed
18:06<@Bjarni>I once wondered about making a device that could turn pressure into rotations again... it ended up becoming rather huge and it never worked reliably
18:06<@Bjarni>I think I lacked enough stuff to build it from
18:06<@Bjarni>the idea was that the rotations should turn the handles back and forth
18:07<+glx>yeah always some parts missing :)
18:07<Eddi|zuHause3>hm, you just need two other pistons and mount them 90° apart on a wheel
18:07<moe>there is no vehicle for fruits
18:07<+glx>moe: in standard set?
18:08<Eddi|zuHause3>and then control the handles that switch around the air direction in the pistons
18:08<Eddi|zuHause3>from that wheel
18:08<moe>for the tropical i think
18:08<@Bjarni><Eddi|zuHause3> hm, you just need two other pistons and mount them 90° apart on a wheel <-- yeah, but then I needed the stuff to control it by the rotation they generated and I needed all the stuff to generate the pressure (the compressor I mentioned before)
18:08<moe>you have fruit plantage but not the truck for
18:09<@peter1138>fruit truck is there
18:09<@peter1138>2 trucks and 1 wagon
18:09<moe>gmm
18:09<moe>hmm
18:09<moe>at what year?
18:09<@peter1138>first truck comes in at 1935
18:10<@Bjarni>goodnight
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18:11<moe>strange
18:11<moe>seems one set kills it
18:12<@peter1138>ah, so you are using newgrf then
18:12<moe>grain ==maize but food =/ fruits
18:14<+glx>should have a refit option then
18:14<moe>seems its a grf
18:14<moe>and nope there was no refit option
18:14<moe>just need to find out which grf it is
18:14<@peter1138>...
18:14<@peter1138>how many vehicle grfs would you want loaded...
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18:16<moe>2 bus + a tram
18:16<moe>some station ones + stolen tree
18:17<moe>loaded a grf ottd package but didnt use all
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18:37<eekee>Anyone else here play a tiny map with only one town? I'm getting told "too many stations in this town" & wondering if there's anything I can do about it
18:46<Eddi|zuHause3>there is a fixed number of station names
18:46<Eddi|zuHause3>try to rename a station
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18:50<eekee>Eddi|zuHause3: Already did
18:50<Eddi|zuHause3>then i don't know any further
18:52<KristjanS>i'm having an oil refinery
18:52<KristjanS>that accepts oil only on one side
18:53<KristjanS>my station touches the refinery but it doesn't accept it :p
18:53<+glx>not all tiles accept oil
18:54<KristjanS>:p shouldn't it accept it all around the refinery though?
18:55<KristjanS>now it accepts, but the tile didn't show up first as it would accept it
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18:57<KristjanS>hey lolman
18:58<lolman>Ello
18:58<KristjanS>do you lolcode? 8^)
18:58<lolman>I don't, unfortunately
18:58<@Belugas>KristjanS, only some tiles, not all the tiles do accept oil. it's how the game is done
18:58<@Belugas>and it is the same for all the industry tiles
18:58<@Belugas>not all accept what the industry needs
18:59<KristjanS>it's still weird
18:59<@Belugas>the best way for you to determine, use the query tool and click on each of the tiles of the industry
18:59<@Belugas>you will see
18:59<@Belugas>no it's not weird.
18:59<@Belugas>it is normal
18:59<KristjanS>on one side the radius for accepting is 1 square, on two sides it is 3 and one it is 1
18:59<KristjanS>one it is 4*
18:59<KristjanS>:p
18:59<Smoovious>any way I can give $ to a company that's offline? don't want someone to go bankrupt
18:59<@Belugas>it is not all the part of an industry that can deal with the stuff
19:00<@Belugas>like the power plant...
19:00<@Belugas>do you think tiles woth sparkles can process coal?
19:00<@Belugas>i doubt.
19:00<@Belugas>same for refinery
19:00<Smoovious>yeah... dumping coal at the business office doesn't do the power station much good
19:00<@Belugas>yup
19:00<@Belugas>that is exactly the point
19:01<KristjanS>are you saying they drop oil in the desert?
19:01<Smoovious>no, only along the coastlines :P
19:02<KristjanS>i am not talking about building oil refinery.... :-D
19:02<Eddi|zuHause3>nobody did tha
19:02<Eddi|zuHause3>t
19:02<KristjanS>you seem like you do
19:03<KristjanS>because you say that the 'tiles' need to process oil
19:03<Eddi|zuHause3>the industry is distributed over several tiles
19:03<Eddi|zuHause3>not all of them accept oil
19:03<Eddi|zuHause3>in fact, only very few of them do
19:03<Eddi|zuHause3>you have to have those tiles in the station coverage
19:04<KristjanS>never seen the radius for accepting tiles to be 1 though before
19:04<@Belugas>a hint... only the tile with the tower and the flame do accept oil
19:04<Smoovious>it is a radius around the acceting tiles
19:04<@Belugas>that's it
19:04<Smoovious>accepting
19:05<KristjanS>ah 8 - )
19:05<KristjanS>now it makes sense
19:05<Eddi|zuHause3>it made sense all the time...
19:06<KristjanS>no, becuase you didn't tell me that only the tower and the flame accept oil ;-)
19:07<KristjanS>because*
19:07<Smoovious>he told you to use the ? tool to see which tiles accept oil
19:07<Eddi|zuHause3>we told you that some tiles don't accept oil
19:07<KristjanS>i know that
19:07<Eddi|zuHause3>and we told you to check that
19:07<Smoovious>most people can handle that...
19:08<Eddi|zuHause3>and you did not do that
19:08<KristjanS>yes, but i didn't say that this is weird
19:08<Smoovious>so now you get spanked
19:08<KristjanS>yes i did it xD
19:08<KristjanS>i wanted to know why it is only 1 square on one side
19:08<Eddi|zuHause3>it is not 1 square
19:08<Eddi|zuHause3>it is 4 squares from the tile that accepts oil
19:09<KristjanS>it was 1 square from the refinery building
19:09<Smoovious>the building doesn't accept oil
19:09<Eddi|zuHause3>but the building does not matter
19:09<Eddi|zuHause3>we said that
19:09<KristjanS>:-D yes, but i thought you meant something else
19:09<Smoovious>the buildings don't matter... only the tiles that accept are what matters
19:10<KristjanS>i am sorry for not understanding what you said ;^)
19:10<eekee>Eddi|zuHause3: renaming did help after all, I had to free up a name the game thought appropriate (Tatminster East)
19:11<Eddi|zuHause3>err... yes... freeing "west" would not make much sense when building east
19:11<Eddi|zuHause3>but there are a lot of generic names
19:12<Eddi|zuHause3>but remember, the number of custom names is also limited
19:13<KristjanS>is there a jesus in openttd?
19:14<KristjanS>my friend needs a jesus to help him
19:16<Eddi|zuHause3>i have not spotted one yet
19:17<Digitalfox>You may speack with me, since i have Jesus in my name...
19:18<@Belugas>KristjanS, you might find one, it is called wiki.openttd.org ;)
19:18<KristjanS>i forwarded your messages in order to help him get enlightened
19:19<Digitalfox>Belugas what have you done... I was thinking of getting rich... :(
19:25<KristjanS>by the name of the purple frog
19:25<KristjanS>my friend has more cash than i do
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19:27<KristjanS>no wonder, one of my trains had a wrong schedule
19:27<KristjanS>and i have 2 trains
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19:32<@Belugas>Digitalfox : sorry ;)
19:32<@Belugas>next time, rect faster ^_^
19:32<@Belugas>react
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19:43<Digitalfox>Belugas: We split the money next time ;)
19:50<@Belugas>granted :D
19:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: belugas * r10108 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_industries.cpp newgrf_industries.h):
19:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Codechange: implement variable 0x60 (Get industry tile ID at offset) for industries.
19:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: It is exposed for for industry tiles who will reuse it too, for variable 0x62.
19:53<KristjanS>i stopped my train in a station
19:53<KristjanS>it say's it's stopping and that it's going at 20 km/h
19:53<KristjanS>while it's stopped already
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19:55<UndernotBuilder>what about making the trams topic a general announcement one?
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22:17<KristjanS>what key to close all windows? :p
22:17<KristjanS>ah insert :p
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22:41<KristjanS>items no more bring more money the further you transport them?
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---Logclosed Tue Jun 12 00:00:35 2007