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#openttd IRC Logs for 2007-09-25

---Logopened Tue Sep 25 00:00:36 2007
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06:40<SpComb>"Landscape: Toyland ;-0"
06:41<Eddi|zuHause2>lmao
06:41<boekabart>?
06:49<SpComb>http://www.openttd.org/server_detail.php?id=8833
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07:43|-|mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
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08:24<SpComb>http://tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=34194
08:29<SpComb>Rule #1 of adding copyright/license headers to your code: make sure you have the newest version of the code in svn, for you WILL corrupt your code
08:30<SpComb>in my case, for f in {daemon,openttd}/*.py_ web/web/*/*.py_; do echo cat license-header $f > $f; done;
08:30<SpComb>forgot to escape the > after I added the echo at the start
08:31<hylje>:o
08:31<SpComb>and the sudden presence of a file called *.py in daemon/ didn't help things
08:32<SpComb>cat foo bar > foo doesn't work, cat complains that the input and output files are the same, so you have to cat it out to foo_, and them mv foo_ back to foo
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08:43<Eddi|zuHause2>usually, you just end up with empty files...
08:43|-|prakti [~prakti@port-213-148-152-8.static.qsc.de] has joined #openttd
08:43<SpComb>or you have the license header twice in each file
08:43<SpComb>or you notice that you misplaced one of the comment marks, and now all the files have a syntax error in them
08:44<hylje>quite.. fragile.
08:47<@Belugas>anyone can draw me a pile of credit cards on a 16x16 pic?
08:47<@Belugas>i really suck at drawing :P
08:52[~]boekabart takes out his pile of credit cards and makes a picture with his phone
08:52<boekabart>that's about 16x16 :)
08:56<SpComb>256 pixels? That's a lot that you're asking for, you know
08:57[~]Belugas mumbles
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09:16<CIA-1>OpenTTD: glx * r11159 /trunk/src/fileio.cpp: -Fix (r11155): restore the ability to save in a non existing file
09:18<Amix>Nice
09:18<+glx>only windows was affected
09:19<Amix>?
09:19<Amix>Of the error?
09:19<@DorpsGek>glx: Commit by rubidium :: r11155 trunk/src/fileio.cpp (2007-09-24 19:15:42 UTC)
09:19<@DorpsGek>glx: -Fix [FS#1253]: work around a nasty MS CRT 8 SP1 bug making it virtually impossible to debug 32bpp games under MSVC (http://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257606). Patch by boekabart.
09:20<Amix>Glx: morphos couldnt save neither without the save dir
09:21<+glx>only morphos has this problem I think, on other platforms the save dir is created on start if it doesn't exist
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09:24<Amix>You should port openttd to Aros
09:24<Amix>www.aros.org
09:24<Amix>Open sourced amigaos
09:26<nzvip>:o
09:26<nzvip>What next?
09:26<nzvip>The iPod?
09:26<nzvip>The GameBoy Colour?
09:26<nzvip>The first Atari?
09:26<hylje>the nintendo DS
09:26<Amix>Nintendo DS
09:26<Amix>GPX2
09:26<nzvip>I said GameBoy Colour.
09:27<SpComb>my G15 keyboard
09:27<nzvip>Because I was referring to the old one.
09:27<hylje>DS would not be silly
09:27<nzvip>True.
09:27|-|Mucht [~Mucht@p57A0F9F5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
09:27<nzvip>:O!
09:27<nzvip>A Konversation user.
09:28<hylje>KDE :O!
09:28<nzvip>I say.
09:28<Eddi|zuHause2>where?
09:28<Sionide>eurgh
09:28<Sionide>KDE is wank :p
09:28<Eddi|zuHause2>don't get religious
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09:29<hylje>emacs sucks, use vim
09:29<nzvip>o_o
09:29<nzvip>I use nano, because... I dunno.
09:29<nzvip>I guess because it isn't crazy.
09:29<Eddi|zuHause2>i use Kate ;)
09:30<nzvip>:P I regularly use gedit.
09:35<@Belugas>I use a client that fits my needs ^_^
09:36<hylje>.. we're talking about text editors
09:38<@Belugas>i use Notepad2 because i like the syntax highlights, i use Delphi EDI for the block manipulations and... i use test editors that fit my needs
09:38|-|stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:38<@Belugas>er.... iDE
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09:41<boekabart>does anyone have a build of GRFMaker (from latest svn) ?
09:41[~]boekabart doesn't have Delphi
09:41<@Belugas>i can provide that.
09:42<boekabart>Belugas: I would love that
09:42<hylje>delphi :o
09:42<@Belugas>give me a few moments
09:42<boekabart>I suppose you have the svn url?
09:42<@Belugas>what do yo need it for?
09:42<boekabart>to MakeGRF !
09:42<boekabart>(I want to see if I can help the dutch train set project)
09:42<nzvip>Ooooh.
09:42<nzvip>A Dutchie.
09:42<@Belugas>you're aware that it is highly experimental, for a stat
09:43<boekabart>GRFMaker?
09:43<@Belugas>and that you will require the .lst file dutch tram is buil on
09:43<boekabart>well, Purno was using it, and Hyr. too
09:43<boekabart>Belugas: Purno gave me all that
09:43<@Belugas>they used the OLD one, not the one we're working on
09:43<boekabart>plus it's all in the same SVN as GRFMaker too ;)
09:43<nzvip>Let him has his fun, Belugas.
09:44<nzvip>What's the worst that could happen?
09:44<nzvip>That his computer crashes and burns?
09:44<boekabart>well - 3.03 is fine for me
09:44<nzvip>Even Vista haven't done *that* yet.
09:44<boekabart>nzvip: Delphi can DO THAT?
09:44<nzvip>On Vista, yes.
10:05[~]Belugas is not happy at all with his icon, but it will do the job
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10:09<skidd13>hi
10:11<boekabart>Belugas: ---------------------------
10:11<boekabart>GRF Maker [nsh1]
10:11<boekabart>---------------------------
10:11<boekabart>Invalid filename.
10:11<boekabart>---------------------------
10:11<boekabart>OK
10:11<boekabart>---------------------------
10:11<boekabart>sorry
10:11<boekabart>always
10:11<boekabart>what me does wrong? ;)
10:11<boekabart>(on GRF->Create GRF)
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10:17<@Belugas>dunno
10:17<boekabart>ill check tonight
10:17<@Belugas>not in the position to debug fun@work whikle do9ng work@work
10:17<boekabart>:)
10:17<boekabart>same here
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10:39<Iasjida>hey, its possible to avoid trains killing roadvehicles in openttd? =[
10:39<Eddi|zuHause2>build bridges ;)
10:40<boekabart>or tunnels. That's the only way
10:40<Eddi|zuHause2>other option would be to provide a diff that introduces such a cheat
10:40<Eddi|zuHause2>(cheats are automatically disabled in multiplayer)
10:41<boekabart>what, disable the collision detection?
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10:41<Eddi|zuHause2>no, just let them break down instead of crash, or something...
10:41<boekabart>on the rails? :D
10:41<Eddi|zuHause2>yeah :p
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10:46<Iasjida>or do like ttdpatch: With Disasters OFF, trains cant kill roadvehicles
10:46<SpComb>or disable road vehicles
10:46<Iasjida>lol
10:47<@Belugas>trains killing roadvehicles are considered as disasters?
10:47<Iasjida>in ttdpath, yes
10:47<Progman>Belugas: it isn't where you live? ;)
10:47<Iasjida>if you disable disasters, trains pass through roadvehicles
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10:49<Iasjida>in a city with a lot of roadvehicles its impossible to use trains
10:49<Iasjida>|=
10:49<Iasjida>they kill all buses in 5 minutes
10:49<Iasjida>xD
10:50<hylje>i call that solving the problem naturally
10:50<DaleStan>Iasjida, Belugas: No. Train/RV crashes are not disasters in TTDPatch. They're controlled by newrvcrash
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10:53<Iasjida>=/
10:53<@Belugas>though so...
10:54<Iasjida>so, a new option like TRAINS CAN KILL ROADVEHICLES? ON or OFF solve the problem
10:54<Iasjida>xD
10:54<@Belugas>would make no sens at all...
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10:55<Iasjida>or a really good system that STOPS the buses when they are about to cross a railway
10:56<@Belugas>where would be the fun at designing a good system if we temper you from accidents?
10:56<Iasjida>but with that and maglev trains the roadvehicles dies anyway xD
10:56<@Belugas>and when to think people are crying for realism...
10:57<Iasjida>simple: you like realism? TRAINS CAN KILL ROADVEHICLES ON
10:57<Iasjida>you DONT like realism? TRAINS CAN KILL ROADVEHICLES OFF
10:57<Iasjida>=|
10:57<skidd13>Hmm, I think it is better placed at the cheats
10:57<hylje>if you have anything more than occassional traffic on either the road or the rail
10:57<hylje>do tunnel or bridge it
10:58<Iasjida>or place at cheats, wherever...
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10:58<@Belugas>i agree with skidd13
10:58<Iasjida>but i cant do tunnels/bridges in ALL the city
10:58<Iasjida>|=
10:59<Iasjida>my english sucks, i know xD
10:59[~]Belugas does not feel a urge at that cheat
10:59[~]Belugas feels lazy
10:59<skidd13>Iasjida: Someone has written something to prevent crashes. IIRC it was mart3p. But I'm not sure, seach the forums.
10:59<skidd13>And with autoslope and enough planted trees every rail can be bridged :P
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11:01<Iasjida>but why bridge every rail if i can only turn on or off a single option/cheat? xD
11:01<hylje>:o
11:02<Iasjida>and a lot of cities with 50k people are not so easy to do bridges |=
11:02<hylje>autoslope
11:02<+glx>you just need 1 bridge, then add a very high penalty for crossings
11:03<skidd13>Why playing a game that do NOT challenge you?
11:03<hylje>also, is anybody looking at arbitrary bridgeheads now?
11:03<Iasjida>"very high penalty for crossings"
11:03<Iasjida>???
11:05<+glx>in openttd.cfg: npf_crossing_penalty for NPF, road_crossing_penalty for YAPF
11:08<Iasjida>road_crossing_penalty = 300
11:09<Iasjida>3000000000?
11:09<Iasjida>or 3000 is enought?
11:09<Iasjida>*enough
11:09<+glx>1000000 <-- this is the max
11:10<+glx>but 3000 should already make a difference
11:10<Eddi|zuHause2><Belugas> i agree with skidd13 <- hey, i said that first...
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11:10<Iasjida>k, thx
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11:11<Eddi|zuHause2>Iasjida: note that changing these values only affect new games
11:11<Eddi|zuHause2>damn...
11:11<+glx>and /me was typing the instructions to change it in running game
11:12<Eddi|zuHause2>through console i assume
11:12<+glx>yes
11:12<Eddi|zuHause2>well, if he really cares, he will be back :p
11:13<+glx>saying "hey that doesn't work" ;)
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12:01|-|mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
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12:07|-|mode/#openttd [-b *!*Thiering_@*.pool.t-online.hu] by Bjarni
12:07<@Bjarni>let's see if his client works better now
12:09<Eddi|zuHause2>you're feeling x
12:09<Eddi|zuHause2>experimental today?
12:11<@Bjarni>something like that
12:11[~]Rubidium knows something else that would be very experimental for Bjarni ;)
12:11<@Bjarni>you are right
12:12<@Bjarni>but I still wouldn't start smoking :P
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12:14<Wolf01>hello
12:14<Rubidium>Bjarni: was thinking about something more useful for this community
12:14<@Bjarni>hi there
12:15<@Bjarni>Rubidium: I know what you mean... however I'm pretty tired right now :(
12:19<@Bjarni>looks like the unbanning didn't result in spam... at least not right away
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13:06<[Surge]>Mark: Can you take a look in the other game when you get a chance? Thanks.
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13:19<skidd13>Rubidium: I updated FS1090. Are you ok with it now?
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14:12<dihedral>hello guys
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14:47<ment>hello
14:47<@Bjarni>hi
14:54<@Bjarni>looks idle tonight
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15:14<ment>may I have a question? how to add new packet type for client with two u32 fields in some portable way?
15:16|-|Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-234.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd
15:18<@Belugas>are you talking of network operations? for ottd?
15:19<ment>yep
15:19<ment>sending struct { unsigned long } over network is not a good idea i think
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15:24<@Belugas>why is that?
15:28<ment>because sizeof(unsigned long) differs on 64bit machines and I'm not sure about uint64_t on MSVC
15:28<+glx>we only send bytes over the network
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15:31<ment>ah, I see, there are NetworkRecv_uint* functions
15:32<+glx>check packet.h
15:33<+glx>and packet.cpp
15:38<@Belugas>does it help, ment?
15:38<@Bjarni>ment: are we allowed to know what you are trying to make? :)
15:39<ment>yes :)
15:40<ment>I'm trying to implement something like SCROLL_AT packet type to force client to scroll at certain positions
15:40<@Bjarni>so one client can tell another client to scroll to a certain tile?
15:41<+glx>ment: nice when you are building something
15:41<ment>nope, the server tells the client, I'm modifying openttd to act as screensaver
15:41<ment>it will be neat in lab with 20 computers in a row
15:42<@Bjarni>what if client A is building something and client B use this feature just before client A click to build? Wouldn't Client A then build the "something" at another location?
15:42<ment>the server will also have a mapping ip <-> position in map
15:42<+glx>ment: make it work only for spectators
15:43<Progman>ment: I'm not sure about network stuff but doesn't have the Cmd*-Handlers already got a TileIndex parameter for this?
15:43<@Bjarni>what if it could open a viewport on the other clients using the same company?
15:44<@Bjarni>DoCommandP() sends a TileIndex and 64 bits of parameters
15:45<@Bjarni>I wondered about this, but I'm not sure if it's a good idea
15:45<@Bjarni>commands are meant to do stuff in the game like building stuff
15:45<@Bjarni>not scroll to stuff
15:46<@Bjarni>also couldn't this be abused :/
15:47<Progman>it all depends on ment idea what acually to do ;)
15:47<@Bjarni>like some player joins a game and uses this over and over
15:47<ment>like I said
15:48<ment>I'm trying to convince OpenTTD to act as screensaver
15:49<ment>and I need to force clients too focus on certain position to reproduce train-moving-to-next-computer effect
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15:56<ment>http://ment.ibawizard.net/train.txt
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16:36<Amixwoktest>i cant join the server in latest nightlybuild
16:37<Amixwoktest>could not load savegame it says
16:38<+glx>did it work before?
16:40<Wolf01>'night
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16:57<ln->http://kuvat2.iltasanomat.fi/iltasanomat/iDoc/1439602-tankkiots.jpg
17:02<@Bjarni>nice offer
17:02<@Bjarni>but where is it?
17:02<@Bjarni>I mean it would matter if you have to pay to get it to your place
17:03<@Bjarni>bahh.. found the article... still can't read it :P
17:04<ln->it's not an offer, it's the the actual price that was eventually paid for it.
17:04<ln->an auction
17:04<@Bjarni>ahh
17:04<@Bjarni>see, I didn't understand the text :P
17:05<@Bjarni>speaking of Finnish, I met a guy named Valle
17:05<@Bjarni>named after some skiing guy... he has no Finnish relatives o_O
17:06<Amixwoktest>i forgot to add autosave dir inside save dir
17:06<Amixwoktest>;p
17:07<+glx>Amixwoktest: I though about that ;)
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17:14<Amixwoktest>glx: i dont know how dirs are created in amigaos
17:15<Amixwoktest>i just know that amigaos is pretty different to lots of other operating systems
17:15<@Bjarni>why should we care? It's MorphOS that we support ;)
17:15<Amixwoktest>a good example is the project to bring Firefox to morphos. its a hopeless battle ;p
17:15<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: morphos and amigaos is pretty much the same
17:16<@Bjarni>ok, then tell me why OpenTTD is ported to MorphOS, but not AmigaOS
17:16<Amixwoktest>SFS is the filesystem most use. Not Fat32, NTFS etc
17:16<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: different exec etc
17:17<Amixwoktest>shouldnt be a problem supporting AmigaOS at all
17:17<@Bjarni>instead of hacking every single app to deal with directories in the Amiga way, wouldn't it be better to make MorphOS allow POSIX directory creation?
17:17|-|Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-234.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: brb]
17:18<@Bjarni>I mean... it would make porting a lot easier and faster
17:18<@Bjarni>and easier and faster porting would result in more software
17:18<Amixwoktest>hehe
17:18<Amixwoktest>tell the coders of morphos that
17:18<+glx>Amixwoktest: when running 'openttd -d misc4' do you get some "...added as search path" lines ?
17:18<Amixwoktest>i am no developer
17:19<Amixwoktest>i can try
17:19<@Bjarni> <Amixwoktest> tell the coders of morphos that <-- you have a better chance of reaching them
17:19<@Bjarni>for all I know, we could discontinue support for MorphOS and it would still work for me :P
17:20<Amixwoktest>no
17:20<Amixwoktest>morphos is pretty closed
17:21<Amixwoktest>glx: here,...
17:21<Amixwoktest>Enter:Games2/OpenTTD-nightly> openttd -d misc4
17:21<Amixwoktest>dbg: [misc] Scanning for tars
17:21<Amixwoktest>dbg: [misc] Scan complete, found 0 files
17:21<Amixwoktest>dbg: [misc] Enter:Games2/OpenTTD-nightly/ added as search path
17:21<Amixwoktest>dbg: [misc] Enter:Games2/OpenTTD-nightly/ found as personal directory
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17:22<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i am very happy that you support MorphOS version.
17:22<Amixwoktest>I love it! Continue with it :)
17:22<+glx>ok so it should create dirs at the end of the function printing that
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17:23<Amixwoktest>glx: dont know
17:23<Amixwoktest>in morphos it starts the app then
17:24<+glx>mkdir seems to not work
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17:25<@Bjarni> <Amixwoktest> Bjarni: i am very happy that you support MorphOS version. <-- I don't mind supporting it, but I'm at a loss on how to solve issues like this
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17:27<Amixwoktest>glx: http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/test.jpg
17:27<Amixwoktest>it looks like this ;)
17:27<ln->jpg is not the format for screenshots.
17:27<+glx>yes the output is ok
17:27<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: they arent important
17:27<@Bjarni>...
17:28<@Bjarni>crashes aren't important?
17:28<Amixwoktest>they are
17:28<@Bjarni>or failure to save
17:28<+glx>Amixwoktest: open a bug report on http://bugs.openttd.org
17:28|-|elmex [~elmex@e180067018.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:28<Amixwoktest>but if the nightly builds came with save and savegame dir etc
17:28<Amixwoktest>that would be nice
17:29<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: make a bug report and add the output as a plain text file... always nicer to look at than a jpg
17:29<+glx>it should create it, so we won't change all makefile stuff just for that
17:29<@Bjarni>also you can copy paste if needed
17:29<Amixwoktest>i havent registered ;p
17:29<Amixwoktest>can i?
17:29<@Bjarni>yes
17:30<@Bjarni>we don't have a fee for opening new accounts
17:30<@Bjarni>just sign up
17:30<Amixwoktest>morphos users are a bit like osx users. gui lovers ;)
17:30<Amixwoktest>oki
17:30<@Bjarni>I prefer the terminal :P
17:30<@Bjarni>I guess the "Think different" fits me
17:30<+glx>Bjarni is an OSX user with a linux mind ;)
17:31<@Bjarni>but not in the way Apple intended when they made that slogan
17:31<@Bjarni>actually sometimes I prefer the terminal, sometimes the GUI... it really depends on the task I want to do
17:32<@Bjarni>so sometimes I switch back and forth really often
17:32<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: hehe.. i love shell in mos.. so i use both. but in osx and linux.. well, i dont like the way command lines are made
17:33<@Bjarni>cp bin/data/tr*grf ../new_checkout/bin/data/ <-- try making that faster in GUI :P
17:34<@Bjarni>it's not needed to do this anymore since now it can just be placed in Documents/OpenTTD/data, but before it could be placed there, it was a line I used once in a while
17:34<Amixwoktest>for a great coder as you are, i bet its better, but for me which works a lot with video and graphics stuff
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17:34<Amixwoktest>i am bound to a os that is fast
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17:34<@Bjarni>well
17:34<@Bjarni>make your account and verify that you get the confirmation mail
17:35<+glx>Bjarni: why cp them in new_checkout?
17:35<@Bjarni>or tell me if you fail to get it (the confirmation mailing thingie could be more stable than it is)
17:35<Amixwoktest>if i use osx, windows, os/2 or any other os in lets say 3-4 weeks without using morphos. when getting back to morphos. now thats adrenaline ;) mos is really a fast OS.
17:35[~]glx should backread better before replying ;)
17:36<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i have registered now. waiting for mail now :)
17:36[~]Bjarni refuse to answer glx
17:36<@Bjarni>make better questions to make it worth my time :P
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17:36<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i am good at finding bugs.
17:37<Amixwoktest>i already betatest WirelessIRC for Symbian.
17:37<Amixwoktest>its one of the best irc clients now for a mobile device
17:37<@Bjarni>what nick did you select?
17:38<Amixwoktest>Amix
17:38<Amixwoktest>;)
17:38<@Bjarni>not good
17:38<@Bjarni>it's not there
17:38<Amixwoktest>i am betatesting Wookiechat aswell for morphos ;p
17:38<Amixwoktest>ive got
17:38<Amixwoktest>your confirmation code has been sent
17:39<@Bjarni>odd
17:39<@Bjarni>well
17:39<@Bjarni>PM me your data and I will create an account for you
17:42<Sacro>orly?
17:42<Amixwoktest>haha, your from Denmark ;)
17:43<Amixwoktest>bjarni
17:43<Amixwoktest>;p
17:43<Sacro>*you're
17:43<@Bjarni>*Bjarni
17:43<@Bjarni>and I fail to see the haha part
17:43<Sacro>i do
17:43<@Bjarni>Sacro: shut up. You are from Hull... it beats everything
17:44<@Bjarni>even Hull itself :P
17:44<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: and you are from the rebellious province of Norway
17:45<Amixwoktest>hehe
17:45<Amixwoktest>live in norway, born in poland
17:45<ln->Sacro: which one is your favourite turtle?
17:45<Sacro>ln-: donatello
17:45<Amixwoktest>donatello
17:45<ln->Bjarni: see, he didn't consider it an odd question.
17:46<Sacro>though michealangelo was cool
17:46<ln->(which it isn't.)
17:46<@Bjarni>that's because everything around Sacro is odd, so he can't tell the difference
17:46<Sacro>http://xkcd.com/197/
17:46<@Bjarni>and wtf are you talking about
17:46<@Bjarni> <Amixwoktest> live in norway, born in poland <-- they still make those?
17:46<ln->favourite turtle.
17:46<+glx>michelangelo is the best for me
17:46<@Bjarni>ohh
17:47<ln->seems like everyone but Bjarni knows something. :)
17:47<@Bjarni>those pizza eating thingies
17:47<@Bjarni>never cared for them
17:47<+glx>yes
17:47<@Bjarni>thought they were silly
17:47<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: make?
17:48<Amixwoktest>oki
17:48<Amixwoktest>how to turn debug on?
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17:48<@Bjarni>how can it be that you live in Norway?
17:48<@Bjarni>Poland is in need of labour, so are you afraid of working?
17:48<Amixwoktest>hehe
17:49<Amixwoktest>no
17:49<Amixwoktest>i work
17:49<@Bjarni>browsing porn in a MorphOS browser is not considered work by western standard
17:49<@Bjarni>.. or maybe it is
17:49<Amixwoktest>porn
17:49<Amixwoktest>huh
17:50<ln->las tortugas ninja
17:50<Amixwoktest>hentai rather ;p
17:50<@Bjarni>pervert
17:50<+glx>Amixwoktest no ecchi
17:50<Amixwoktest>hehe
17:51<Amixwoktest>4chan ?
17:51<Amixwoktest>;p
17:51<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: are you aware that hentai means pervert and is actually not a word that Japanese people would use about those images?
17:51<Amixwoktest>hentai is pervert/porn
17:52<@Bjarni>maybe so, but it's still not one of the words that Japanese people use about it
17:52<Sacro>http://image.bayimg.com/oahipaabd.jpg
17:52<Amixwoktest>then you know more about that subject than me
17:53<@Bjarni>well
17:53<@Bjarni>according to people in here and elsewhere... I seem to know stuff
17:54<@Bjarni>Sacro: for once they actually told what's going on.... usually it's some hidden code with just the text
17:54<Amixwoktest>i am pretty much into anime
17:54<Amixwoktest>or japaneese cartoons
17:54<@Bjarni>anime != hentai
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17:55<Amixwoktest>anime is anime for us outside of japan
17:55<Amixwoktest>hentai for us is porn
17:56<@Bjarni>correction: I'm outside Japan :P
17:56<Amixwoktest>for japaneese people, anime means a cartoon.
17:56<@Bjarni>even though it appears that I'm not in the group you mention
17:56<Amixwoktest>a disney cartoon is anime to them
17:57|-|Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-234.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving]
17:58<@Bjarni>then where do manga fit in?
17:59<+glx>mang is a book
17:59<+glx>*manga
17:59<@Bjarni>I asked where it fits in for Amixwoktest
18:00<Amixwoktest>ahh
18:00<Amixwoktest>manga is comics
18:00<Amixwoktest>comicbooks
18:00<Amixwoktest>anime is rather cartoon
18:01<@Bjarni>so you fancy manga as well?
18:01<Ailure>hmm
18:02<Amixwoktest>typical difference from american and japaneese cartoons etc is that the endings of anime serier rather ends sad or that it dosent in a good way like in hollywood land. anime have everything from drama to comedy, from action to adventure. there are hundreds of anime series created in japan every year.
18:03<Amixwoktest>end...
18:03<@Bjarni>I asked if you like them, not what it is
18:03<Amixwoktest>yes
18:03<@Bjarni>I wouldn't ask something where I already know the answer :P
18:03<Ailure>hmm
18:03<@Bjarni>then how about shoujo manga?
18:03<Ailure>Anime heh
18:04<Ailure>I like how they're diffrent from western cartoon and stuff
18:04<Amixwoktest>i watch anime, but i dont read manga
18:04<Ailure>but they also have a overly tendancy to use cliche elements
18:04<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i dont know much about manga, sorry
18:04<@Bjarni>dammit.... you didn't fell for it
18:05<@Bjarni>shoujo means girl, so I hoped to have caught you in an embarrassing answer :P
18:05<Amixwoktest>i know there are mangas for kids, younger people, gays.. and offcourse for perverts ;) but japan have a different lifestyle, so kids are used to watch blood and violence from age of 5 etc
18:06<Amixwoktest>One Piece is full of violence and blood.. but it just add nice things to a great adventure anime
18:07<+glx>Death Note is nice too
18:07<Amixwoktest>in usa etc, they have censored guns, sigarettes and more
18:07<ment>and vaginas too
18:07<Amixwoktest>Guns is replaced with softguns, guns is replaced with lollipops and blood is offcourse taken away ;)
18:08<@Bjarni>I think vaginas are generally a no-no in children stories all over the world
18:08<Amixwoktest>sigarettes ...
18:08<Amixwoktest>doh
18:08<Amixwoktest>i need to sleep soon
18:08<@Bjarni>I was about to say something about Norwegian spelling, but decided not to
18:09<Amixwoktest>come on
18:09<@Bjarni>it was too easy :P
18:09<Amixwoktest>bigfoot, which is one of the main coders of morphos is danish
18:10<Amixwoktest>;)
18:10<@Bjarni>I don't know him
18:10<Amixwoktest>he ported Quake III for mos etc ;)
18:10<@Bjarni>however I do know that freeciv was made in Århus
18:10<@Bjarni>by some guys, who could beat everybody in it
18:10<Amixwoktest>ahh
18:11<Amixwoktest>freeciv
18:11<Amixwoktest>never got into that game
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18:11<Amixwoktest>i love playing Super Stardust HD for PS3 though :)
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18:16[~]Bjarni just realised something
18:16<@Bjarni>for the record: I don't spent ages on anime and manga even though it may look like that based on what I said before
18:16<@Bjarni>in fact I never even read a single manga
18:17<@Bjarni>and I'm pretty sure Amixwoktest has seen a whole lot more anime
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18:18<Amixwoktest>hehe
18:18<Amixwoktest>some
18:18<ment>and you can stop watching it whenever you want
18:18<Amixwoktest>but not that much
18:18<Amixwoktest>i am mostly into morphos stuff
18:18<Amixwoktest>hehe
18:18<Amixwoktest>been amiga user since 1988 ;p
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18:20<@Bjarni>I had an amiga around that time as well
18:20<@Bjarni>still have it
18:20<@Bjarni>not really used anymore
18:21<@Bjarni>as odd as it may sound, the C64 is used more
18:21<Amixwoktest>hehe
18:22<@Bjarni>haha
18:22<@Bjarni>found a new description for Sacro
18:22<@Bjarni>Sacro: ping
18:22<Sacro>Bjarni: pongs
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18:22<@Bjarni>Sacro: I found a new description of you
18:23<Sacro>:o
18:23<@Bjarni>shoujouteki
18:23<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i was pretty glad, when i saw openttd got ported to morphos. it was actually me telling tokai about it. i dont know if he ported it because of me or not. but openttd have given a amigaos alike os like morphos some nostalgic traumata memmories. ;P
18:23[~]Bjarni imagines Sacro spending a great deal of time trying to figure out what it means
18:23<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: I think I recall him talking about porting it by request, but I'm not sure
18:24<Amixwoktest>:)
18:24<Amixwoktest>well. Transport Tycoon Deluxe never got released for AmigaOS
18:24<@Bjarni>the same goes for OSX
18:24<Amixwoktest>SimCity 2000 came though, but was a terrible bad macos port.
18:25<Sacro>Bjarni: i am not narrow minded
18:25<@Bjarni>there is a version of Transport Tycoon for MacOS though
18:25<@Bjarni>Sacro: wtf... how did you figure that out so quickly???
18:25<@Bjarni>and you just proved me wrong by figuring it out
18:26<Sacro>Bjarni: http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=shoujouteki&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a
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18:27<@Bjarni>dammit
18:27<@Bjarni>but nice page
18:27<@Bjarni>now I know how to write it in kanji and hiragana, so it's not a total loss
18:28<@Bjarni>actually it's a really nice page
18:29<@Bjarni>but... who would create an anime dictionary???
18:29<Sacro>whois?
18:30<@Bjarni>somebody in USA
18:30<@Bjarni>freak :P
18:30<Amixwoktest>you have some
18:30<Amixwoktest>www.anidb.net
18:32<@Bjarni>btw searching for online dictionaries helped me once.... otherwise I would have no way of communicating with the Polish work crew digging up the road
18:32<Amixwoktest>what are you working with?
18:32<@Bjarni>my vocabulary in Polish is rather limited
18:33<@Bjarni> <Amixwoktest> what are you working with? <-- they digged a hole for the power cables and they blocked our access to the road
18:33<@Bjarni>so it was not job related
18:33<ln->isn't it dig, dug, dug
18:33<Sacro>Bjarni: dug
18:33<@Bjarni>digdug :D
18:34<@Bjarni>anyway they dug up the driveway and after the power cables were put down, they tried to rebuild it
18:35<@Bjarni>and as luck would have it, our driveway turned out to be really hard to repair (we knew that)
18:36<@Bjarni>actually I kind of felt sorry for them. Working in a strange country and totally unable to talk to the local population
18:36<@Bjarni>even though digging up the road and blocking driveways would indicate that communication could help
18:37<ment>do you think it's good idea to add new _game_mode or mess with this in general?
18:37<@Bjarni>I like the Polish lorry driver, who asked for directions and when nobody understood him, his solution was to yell louder, but still in Polish
18:38<ment>:))
18:38<@Bjarni>we took an estimated guess and pointed to a place where he could turn the lorry (dead end street)
18:40<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i work for a research company
18:40<Amixwoktest>statistics etc
18:40<Amixwoktest>in the future
18:40<Amixwoktest>in 2 years, i will have my own tv station
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18:41<Amixwoktest>thats my goal
18:42<@Bjarni>showing anime?
18:42<Amixwoktest>yes, that aswell
18:42<Amixwoktest>for Norway atleast
18:42<Amixwoktest>maybe for Scandinavia later on
18:43<@Bjarni>how will you transmit this?
18:43<@Bjarni>DVB-T?
18:44<Amixwoktest>ASTRA and cabletv
18:44<@Bjarni>that sucks
18:44<ln->ASTRA is ok
18:44<@Bjarni>because then I can't watch it
18:44<Amixwoktest>hehe
18:44[~]Bjarni only has DVB-T
18:44<ln->Amixwoktest: but it won't be FTA?
18:44<Amixwoktest>what is DVB-T?
18:44<ln->haha
18:44<@Bjarni>even the analogue receiver died
18:45[~]ln- has DVB-C and DVB-T
18:45<Grey_>sleep nao. Nini
18:45<@Bjarni><Amixwoktest> what is DVB-T? <-- it's radio waves like normal TV signals, except it's MPEG encoded and digital transmitted
18:45<Amixwoktest>ahh
18:45<Amixwoktest>digital
18:45<Amixwoktest>well
18:45<Amixwoktest>in norway they use mp4
18:46<ln->anyone not using at least one TLA per line shall be kicked.
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18:46<@Bjarni>isn't mp4 a variation of MPEG ;)
18:46<+glx>in France mp4 is used for HD content
18:46<Amixwoktest>but i will learn a lot about this, so ask me again in february next year
18:46<Amixwoktest>i am more into making logos, desiging promotions etc
18:46<Amixwoktest>marketing of the channel etc
18:46<Amixwoktest>and ceo offcourse
18:47<Amixwoktest>we will be a team of 10 people in the end
18:47<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: let's make a deal... you support DVB-T in this area and we will continue to support MorphOS
18:47<+glx>but HD tvs only understand mpeg2 when they can receive DVB-T
18:47<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: hehe
18:48<@Bjarni>and to be fair, we will charge the same for each other's services ;)
18:48<Amixwoktest>http://www.viasat4.no/component/option,com_azpress/Itemid,1099/
18:48<Amixwoktest>this is our newest channel
18:48<Amixwoktest>started up 8th of September ;p
18:48<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: i can put .. support OpenTTD team sponsor add before every show.. ;)
18:49<@Bjarni>hmmm
18:49<@Bjarni>interesting
18:49<@Bjarni>but how would we benefit from that?
18:49<Amixwoktest>channel will have computer related programs aswell
18:50<@Bjarni>the channel looks nice
18:50<@Bjarni>but...
18:50<nzvip>Bjarni: "I landet uden b."
18:50<nzvip>:D
18:50<@Bjarni>isn't it something we have seen before
18:50<@Bjarni>simpsons, star trek, seinfeld, stargate, cops...
18:50<Amixwoktest>sci-fi, drama, action, anime, computing programs, music programs etc. Will broadcast everyday from 14.00CET to 04.00CET and 08.25CET to 04.00CET in weekends and hollidays :)
18:51<nzvip>:o?
18:51<Amixwoktest>and its not Viasat4 ;P
18:51<nzvip>:O!
18:51<Amixwoktest>i have nothing to do with V4
18:52<nzvip>Are you a product placement?
18:52<@Bjarni>looks like it
18:52<Amixwoktest>hehe
18:52<@Bjarni>we just highjacked him to advertive OpenTTD
18:52<@Bjarni>or something
18:52<nzvip>hijacked*
18:53<Amixwoktest>we will see. it all happends 10th of September 2009
18:53<Amixwoktest>with full start in 2010
18:53<Amixwoktest>i hope to get lots interested people onto the project
18:53<nzvip>:<
18:53<Amixwoktest>going to course now about how running all this
18:53<nzvip>Don't get people interested too early.
18:53<ment>hah, scrolling working, screensaver mode working
18:53<@Bjarni>like in this channel right now
18:54<nzvip>Cause then their excitement will die down in time.
18:54<@Bjarni>and rather quickly
18:54<Amixwoktest>i know
18:54<Amixwoktest>we will start small
18:54<Amixwoktest>first meeting on thursday infact ;)
18:55<@Bjarni>the "donate now and the steam locomotive will drive in 5 years" plan didn't work out very well
18:55<@Bjarni>in fact nobody knows when it will drive
18:55<@Bjarni>due to lack of money
18:56<@Bjarni>I guess you can run into the same thing... too far into the future for people to even care right now
18:56<@Bjarni>2009... we will not have analogue channels in the air at that time and then DVB-T will have taken over completely
18:56<@Bjarni>which means... way more channels
18:56<Amixwoktest>sure
18:56<Amixwoktest>http://www.tv7norge.com/Pics/TV7torsdag.png
18:56<Amixwoktest>some design ideas
18:56<ln->analogue transmissions have already ended in finland.
18:57<Amixwoktest>same here
18:58<Amixwoktest>tv channel will be distributed thru ASTRA
18:58<Amixwoktest>and thru cable networks here in norway
18:58<@Bjarni>DVB-T is awesome because it's a sfn (single frequency network), meaning that the same channel has the same frequency all over the country without any overlapping problems and every carrier wave can handle up to 5 channels, so we will have bandwidth for.... most likely way more channels than we can get
18:58<Amixwoktest>with a potential of 50% coverage at start
18:58<@Bjarni>futurama
18:59<@Bjarni>I like this channel better and better
18:59<ln->some people were left without DVB-T coverage over here, they might get it during this year.
18:59<Amixwoktest>reason for it taking 2 years is norwegian goverment
18:59<@Bjarni>then 2 years are fast
18:59<Amixwoktest>takes 2 years for them to look over if my channel will be alowed to broadcast in norway
18:59<ln->so some people over here cannot watch tv at all, atm, unless they buy a satellite dish.
19:00<@Bjarni>ln-: that's silly
19:00<Amixwoktest>if it takes more than that, i need to find another country to start in
19:00<Amixwoktest>it in
19:00<Amixwoktest>Estland is a good way to start.
19:01<@Bjarni>I live in a black spot... at least so it appears. They had problems sending to this area, so they installed a new local transmitter. The distance to that transmitter resulted in the same signal strength from that one as the main one at my place, so it didn't mean shit :(
19:01<@Bjarni>so I invested in a dual tuner, so I get good reception even with a poor signal
19:01<ln->yeah, and due to political decisions, the analogue transmitters were turned off this month, and not even the auxiliary ones providing signal for problematic areas could be left on until their digitalization is ready.
19:02<Amixwoktest>heh
19:02<Amixwoktest>here they take area by area
19:02<Amixwoktest>first in 2009, 100% of norway will be digital
19:02<Amixwoktest>but then norway is a hilly place
19:02<Amixwoktest>takes time to build
19:03<@Bjarni>Denmark turned on the digital net more than a year ago and they made it to cover the whole country from day 1 (except they found black spots they then tried to fix). They will not turn off the analogue net until sep. 2009, so we will not have that problem
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19:04<@Bjarni>I like how they set up the digital net without telling the public about it. All of a sudden they made it public and there was this test signal everywhere people could get
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19:04<ln->here the national broadcasting company first said they'd sue anyone trying to do digital-analogue conversion in places such as hospitals...
19:04<ln->... then a special permission was given to hospitals...
19:05<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: why tv7?
19:05<ln->... later they accidentally gave a permission to convert all their channels to analogue and send them on cable until march 2008.
19:05<@Bjarni>I mean... why not a bit more creative name
19:05<@Bjarni>numbering the stations isn't the way to stand out
19:06<ln->creative such as tv9542345287523665683457298736598745123498457349856723454656769345725
19:06<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: tv7 is just a workingtitle
19:06<@Bjarni>ahh
19:06<@Bjarni>err
19:06<@Bjarni>TV7 i kveld
19:06<@Bjarni>14.00: ....
19:06<ln->there's already tv7 in finland, on cable, and it's a religious channel.
19:06<@Bjarni>14.00 is daytime :P
19:07<ln->there's sort of channel 5 too, but not channel 6.
19:07<Amixwoktest>in norwegian
19:07<Amixwoktest>kveld is evening
19:07<@Bjarni>but 14.00 isn't
19:07<@Bjarni>that's my point
19:07<Amixwoktest>it is
19:07<Amixwoktest>:p
19:07<ln->might be in norway, who knows
19:07<Amixwoktest>it means whats tonight
19:08<Amixwoktest>TV7 Tonight
19:08<@Bjarni>I know
19:08<@Bjarni>but from 14.00
19:08<Amixwoktest>TV7 i dag
19:08<Amixwoktest>huh
19:08<@Bjarni>evening is from 18.00 or 19.00
19:08<Amixwoktest>in norway Frokost is not same thing as in Denmark
19:08<Amixwoktest>;p
19:09<Amixwoktest>in norway, Frokost is from 06 to 10
19:09<@Bjarni>I know
19:09<Amixwoktest>from 10 to 14 its daytime
19:09<Amixwoktest>from 14 to 21 its evening
19:09<Amixwoktest>then its night
19:10<Amixwoktest>from 14 from september its dark,..
19:10<@Bjarni>I still don't like the 2 O'clock thing
19:10<@Bjarni>maybe I should ask a native
19:10<Amixwoktest>heh
19:10<Amixwoktest>i am native
19:10<Amixwoktest>;p
19:10<Amixwoktest>have lived here since i was 5
19:10<Amixwoktest>;p
19:10<@Bjarni>I meant one I trust on this issue :P
19:11<Amixwoktest>in november
19:11<Amixwoktest>at 16 its night
19:11<@Bjarni>there is one around 1 km that way
19:11<@Bjarni><--
19:11<@Bjarni>but I think she is asleep
19:12<Amixwoktest>in summer its different
19:12<ln->it's not unusual to go knock on a lady's door at this time to ask about word interpretation.
19:12<@Bjarni>that must be a Finnish thing
19:12<@Bjarni>I would certainly be finished if I did that :P
19:13<Amixwoktest>morning 06 to 10 as normal.. daytime from 10 to 20, evening from 20 to 23, night from 23 to 01, early morning 01 to 06
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19:13<@Bjarni>Amixwoktest: I wonder about this channel... it looks like it only contains American and Australian stuff
19:13<@Bjarni>where is the European stuff and the stuff that make this channel stand out?
19:14<Amixwoktest>ok
19:14<Amixwoktest>is that a bad or good thing?
19:14<Amixwoktest>:)
19:14<@Bjarni>it depends on the eyes of the beholder
19:14<Amixwoktest>it stands out in norway
19:14<Amixwoktest>in norway we have no really great channels
19:15<@Bjarni>you mean there is no simpsons, futurama, star trek... blah blah channel in Norway???
19:15<Amixwoktest>yes it is
19:15<@Bjarni>ok, there is tv7, but besides that one
19:15<Amixwoktest>but viasat4 is the first tempt to go on with stargate etc
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19:16<Amixwoktest>TV3 is there
19:16<Amixwoktest>but TV3 is kinda in mud
19:16<Amixwoktest>;p
19:16<Amixwoktest>borring, lots of commercial interruptions
19:17<@Bjarni>I think TV3 sucks because they hide in London and can transmit using British laws
19:17<@Bjarni>and I guess they try to move their income to the lower British taxes as well
19:17<Amixwoktest>well. i watched Sky Channel back in days
19:17<Amixwoktest>i liked it
19:17<Amixwoktest>TV3 was nice until 1994
19:17<ln->Sky One was nice until it got scrambled.
19:18<Amixwoktest>yup
19:18<Amixwoktest>Bjarni: ok, my channel wont be a commercial channel
19:18<Amixwoktest>it will be a pay-tv channel
19:18<@Bjarni>that's fine by me
19:18<Amixwoktest>about 100,- a month
19:19<ln->what unit?
19:19<@Bjarni>you just send me a smart card and everything will be fine :)
19:19<Amixwoktest>huhu
19:19<@Bjarni>ln-: Norwegian kr, I presume
19:19<Amixwoktest>you want to kill me before i start ;p
19:19<Amixwoktest>in nok
19:20<ln->it's quite much for one channel which isn't porn.
19:20<Amixwoktest>channel will focus on marketing itself good
19:20<Amixwoktest>3D logos
19:20<@Bjarni><Amixwoktest> you want to kill me before i start ;p <-- the alternative is that you will lack my feedback because I will not pay myself... my income is too low to pay for TV :P
19:20<Amixwoktest>great design etc
19:20<Amixwoktest>no cheap Flash alike design etc
19:21<@Bjarni><ln-> it's quite much for one channel which isn't porn. <-- good point... most of the stuff is already well known. I don't think that many people will pay that much to watch well known programs
19:22<Amixwoktest>i think they will
19:22<@Bjarni>then "people" have greater income than I do
19:22<Amixwoktest>without adverts interrupting
19:22<@Bjarni>but then again it's hard to get lower :(
19:23<Amixwoktest>we will be free to air from 19.30 to 20.15 everyday though
19:23<Amixwoktest>:)
19:23<ln->Bjarni: do you watch BahnTV?
19:23<@Bjarni>not right now
19:23<ln->it's FTA on satellite..
19:24<mcbane>rubi i reprobduced the 65k bug
19:24<@Bjarni>but then again why should I watch bahnTV?
19:24<mcbane>i replaced some trains via option in train menu and stopped it then
19:24<@Bjarni>I know what railroads looks like form the locomotive
19:24<mcbane>then it went from 2 to 65k.
19:25<ln->Bjarni: because they've got nice train driving videos from the cockpit every night.
19:29<@Bjarni>as I said
19:29<@Bjarni>I know what railroads looks like form the locomotive
19:30<@Bjarni>and I think I have yet to find any railroad that beats our local one
19:30<ln->you made the same typo twice
19:30<@Bjarni>single tracked though the forest... it's so beautiful, nomatter what time of the year or time of day
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19:31<@Bjarni><ln-> you made the same typo twice <-- LOL, I just used the up arrow and didn't check for typos
19:31<@Bjarni>specially during the spring when the forest is all light green
19:31<@Bjarni>but a snow covered forest is nice as well
19:33<@Bjarni>goodnight
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19:34<Amixwoktest>nite
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21:32[~]Belugas kicks CIA-1
21:32<CIA-1>ow
21:33<@Belugas>come on, you lazy bum
21:35<ment>anyone for patch review?
21:35<ment>http://ment.ibawizard.net/d/openttd/screensaver.patch
21:35<mcbane>?
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21:38<@Belugas>argv == 0 or 4 ? and nothing else?
21:38<@Belugas>herrr.. argc
21:39<mcbane>hmm is there a way to play with ai in network?
21:40<mcbane>even i said turn on ai in multiplayer it dont do it.
21:40<+glx>only newAI can do it IIRC
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21:42<@Belugas>ment, it looks clean. you followed quite well the coding style
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21:42<@Belugas>only point i would point out is the lack of comments
21:43<@Belugas>point point point
21:44<ment>ook, I will comment the changes
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21:44<@Belugas>have you tested it with your many computers?
21:44<@Belugas>does it look good?
21:45<ment>school lab is closed now :) I will do it tomorrow, maybe I'll take some photos too
21:48<@Belugas>not just photos :)
21:49<@Belugas>if it really goes from one screen to the others, video would be nice
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---Logclosed Wed Sep 26 00:00:14 2007