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#openttd IRC Logs for 2007-10-11

---Logopened Thu Oct 11 00:00:45 2007
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01:42<DaleStan>mattt__: Do not confuse station rating with town rating.
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06:06<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truelight * r11244 /trunk/src/ (openttd.cpp saveload.cpp tree_cmd.cpp):
06:06<CIA-5>OpenTTD: -Fix: trees can now be planted on bare land without making it grassy (Csaboka)
06:06<CIA-5>OpenTTD: -Fix: planting tree in desert doesn't make it grassy for the first tile-cycle (Csaboka)
06:06<CIA-5>OpenTTD: -Fix: when a tree dies in desert, it no longer becomes a snowy tile for the first tile-cycle (Csaboka)
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06:32<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truelight * r11245 /trunk/src/oldloader.cpp: -Fix r11228: the moreanimation feature made loading TTD(p) games impossible (Csaboka)
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06:57<huma>"bridges over anything" looks ugly
06:57<Ammller>huma: depense on the bridge, I like it.
06:58<huma>check this out: http://openttdcoop.ppcis.org/blog/files/pictures/terminus_tutorial/terminus_step_06.png
06:59<Ammller>hmm, and why is that ugly?
07:00<huma>looks hackish to me. the idea is good though.
07:00<Ammller>(x doesn't work on screenshots :/ )
07:00<Ammller>omg, 2way signals
07:01<huma>new industries is a great feature
07:01<Ammller>thats the only ugly thing I see there.
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07:03<Ammller>huma: you leave the topic...
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07:15<Ailure>[13:55] <huma> "bridges over anything" looks ugly
07:15<Ailure>[13:56] <Ammller> huma: depense on the bridge, I like it.
07:15<Ailure>[13:57] <huma> check this out: http://openttdcoop.ppcis.org/blog/files/pictures/terminus_tutorial/terminus_step_06.png
07:15<Ailure>dosen't look too ugly
07:16<Ailure>it's worse with Pikka's viaduct bridge :P
07:16<Ailure>where diagonal rail can hit the foundation the bridge uses
07:16<Ailure>but it's a such small detail it dosen't really bother me too much
07:20<Amixosx>http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Gronningley1986.png
07:20<Amixosx>:D
07:21<Amixosx>http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/tramroutes.png
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07:37<Ailure>hheh
07:37<Ailure>added thoose overlays manually?
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10:20<Jolty|OTTD>Hi
10:20<Jolty|OTTD>Can anyone help me with this: Does anyone notice anything wrong with this station, they refuse to leave the station, is it le fuxxoring my network: http://www.theskyisnotblue.com/images/screenshots/ottd/brokestation.png (460KB)
10:20[~]dihedral|work greets
10:21<Jolty|OTTD>They stop at the end of the station tile, and turn back into the station :|
10:21<hylje>elrail
10:22<Jolty|OTTD>The station is electrified. (if thats what you mean)
10:22<Jolty|OTTD>You can see the electic line just above the train in station.
10:22<hylje>its the prime reason trains wont go somewhere
10:23<dihedral|work>try converting the entire bunch again
10:23<dihedral|work>perhaps you missed a tile
10:23<Jolty|OTTD>Hmm, let me try that..
10:23<dihedral|work>lol
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10:25<Jolty|OTTD>Is there any way to delete the trains in the station, so I can just rebuild the station?
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10:28<@Belugas>put a depot upward, send them to the new depot
10:28<dihedral|work>remove a rail that joins to the staion, build a depot in it's place, and send the tains into the depot
10:28<@Belugas>lol
10:28<@Belugas>yeah
10:28[~]dihedral|work beat Belugas to it
10:28<Jolty|OTTD>oh
10:28<Jolty|OTTD>Duh.
10:28<Jolty|OTTD>lol
10:28<dihedral|work>yes
10:29<dihedral|work>it would be nice to have an advanced rail tile
10:29<dihedral|work>that has a variable yapf penalty :-)
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10:30<Jolty|OTTD>Ugh, this council is so getting on my nipples.
10:30<dihedral|work>and a 'penalty mesuring tool'
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10:30[~]dihedral|work does not want to know what gets on Jolty|OTTD's nipples
10:30<Jolty|OTTD>>__<
10:31[~]dihedral|work feels sick
10:32<dihedral|work>:-P
10:32<@Belugas>Jolty|OTTD,plant trees. A lot. Towns love trees
10:32<SpComb>tree-hugging hippies
10:32[~]Belugas pities dihedral|work
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10:34<dihedral|work>thanks Belugas, doing a lot better now :-P
10:35<dihedral|work>SpComb: i'd rather hug trees than paying people to 'be blind'
10:36<Jolty|OTTD>lol
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10:41<CIA-5>OpenTTD: belugas * r11246 /trunk/src/tree_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: beautify some conditions from "if else" into trinary operator
10:41<@Belugas>trees are popular today ;)
10:41<hylje>Belugas: ternary
10:42<Sacro>Belugas: i second hylje
10:42<hylje>piggybacker
10:43[~]Belugas mumbles
10:43<SpComb>ternary is more beautiful than if/else?
10:45<hylje>x if a else y
10:46<Sacro>mmm
10:47<SpComb>a and 'x' or 'y'
10:47<SpComb>krk
10:49<hylje>('x', 'y')[bool(a)]
10:50<@Belugas>SpComb, we do believe it is, yes
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10:53<SpComb>h.iif(a, 'x', 'y')
10:54<Eddi|zuHause>probably depends on the complexity of the expression
10:54<SpComb>ternary inline, if/else otherwise, and someone tell that to the phpBB2 devs
10:55<SpComb>they have lots of top-level multi-line ternary expressions in their code
10:55<hylje>bad developers with a bad language
10:55<Eddi|zuHause>don't use functions, use expressions with side effects
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11:00<dihedral|away>laters - my fellow tree-huggers
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11:02<Eddi|zuHause>happy tree friends? :p
11:02<Sacro>ack
11:02<Sacro>they scare me
11:04<huma>guido doesn't think ternary is beautiful. although, i like it. it's concise.
11:05<@Belugas>i think it's the point that makes us liking it :)
11:06<@Belugas>lunch time
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11:12<Ailure> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=325091&threshold=1&commentsort=0&mode=thread&cid=20940573 <-- Someone mod this guy up. D:
11:12<Ailure>lol
11:13<Ailure>:P
11:13<toresbe>hmm
11:13[~]Sacro listens
11:13<toresbe>I have an inexplicable urge to write a SimTower clone.
11:14<Sacro>:o
11:14<Sacro>i like this idea
11:14<toresbe>first I need to play it some more, though.
11:14<Ailure>heh Simtower
11:14<Ailure>the elevator simulator
11:14<toresbe>hehe yeah
11:15<toresbe>i've got some good ideas for it, I think.
11:15<toresbe>You wouldn't happen to know if Windows 3.11 could run on top of FreeDOS?
11:15<Ailure>It should be
11:15<Sacro>i think it can
11:15<Ailure>Win 3.11 runs in Dosbox
11:15<Ailure>infact
11:15<toresbe>I know, but I want to run it native, off a USB stick
11:15<Ailure>Win 3.11 runs n most DOS clones
11:15<Ailure>this been known for quite awhile
11:15<Ailure>Microsoft dosen't support it when run on DOS clones though.
11:16<Ailure>Then, Microsoft hadn't supported Win 3.X for ages :)
11:16<toresbe>yeah :)
11:16<Sacro>and apple won't support my hackintosh either
11:16<Ailure>Win 3.11 can even run NTFS partitions fine
11:16<Ailure>if you use the NTFS dos driver
11:17<toresbe>hah, cool
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11:20<toresbe>augh, crap
11:20[~]toresbe just remembered that his mobo's USB is shot.
11:20<toresbe>Disk /dev/hda: 20.8 GB, 20847697920 bytes
11:20<toresbe>/dev/hda1 * 1 2501 20089251 83 Linux
11:20<toresbe>/dev/hda2 2502 2534 265072+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris
11:21<toresbe>could I use /dev/hda2 as a DOS boot drive?
11:21<ln->theoretically, maybe, but i wouldn't count on that...
11:23<Ailure>as long it's not a extended partition
11:23<Ailure>it should work
11:24<toresbe>cool
11:26<ln->Ailure: even at that well-beyond-1024-cylinders location?
11:26<Ailure>ah wait
11:26<Ailure>is that a cylinder count?
11:27<ln->probably no.
11:27<Ailure>well
11:27<Ailure>it depends on what DOS he chooses too
11:27<Ailure>MS-DOS might have problems
11:27<Ailure>I doubt Freedos would
11:27<Ailure>I'm going to check
11:30<Ailure>seems like the only harddrive related limit is the "can only boot from a primary partition" limit
11:32<toresbe>cool
11:32<toresbe>thanks. I'll try it now
11:32<Sacro>heh
11:32<Sacro>why are you installing DOS/3.11?
11:32<Ailure>I looked for any limits in the install guide
11:33<Ailure>didn't find any
11:33<Ailure>for FreeDOS
11:33<toresbe>Sacro: hey, I figger' why not :)
11:33<Ailure>well
11:33<toresbe>I could install Windows 95 instead, I guess.
11:33<Ailure>if you have old DOS programs you want to run
11:33<toresbe>but that's not as easy to find.
11:33<Ailure>and DOSBox dosen't work too well
11:33<toresbe>oh
11:33<Ailure>I guess installing Freedos and run stuff from that works
11:33<toresbe>it's a performance thing
11:34<toresbe>simtower has a fast mode, which is like openttd's.
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11:34<Sacro>zomg Bjarni
11:34<toresbe>Even though I use dosbox on an AMD 3800+, the machine is still quite slow.
11:34<Ailure>There's a DOS version of Simtower?
11:35<Sacro>i can run it fine under XP
11:35<Ailure>I can't imagine Simtower suffering under running in Wine too
11:35<toresbe>Ailure: no, but Win 3.1 runs very happily under Dosbox.
11:35<toresbe>crashes wine with an 0xFFFF reference
11:36<@Bjarni>Sacro: I see that you have tried to drive a train
11:36<@Bjarni>but....
11:36<Sacro>Bjarni: i derailed a few
11:36<@Bjarni>don't drink and drive :P
11:37<@Bjarni>http://darkmonkey.org.uk/4/1/vias.jpg
11:37<Sacro>hehe
11:37<Sacro>that picture is amusing
11:37<@Bjarni>actually the cause of this is the sun
11:37<toresbe>yeah
11:37<toresbe>same problem in Norway.
11:37<@Bjarni>it heats up the metal and the rails becomes longer
11:37<toresbe>Rail workers have been killed by the incredible forces that build up in rails
11:37<@Bjarni>and it gives in at a poorly maintained location
11:38<@Bjarni>killed?
11:38<Ailure>hmm
11:38<@Bjarni>we only get speed restrictions
11:38<Ailure>that sounds like if ou are trying to hold the shape of the rails too sharply
11:38<toresbe>Bjarni: yeah. They're maintaining the track, and suddenly it gives in, in the general direction of the worker
11:38<@Bjarni>like 80 km/h instead of 180 km/h
11:38<toresbe>but you've got a flat country :)
11:38<@Bjarni>so?
11:39<toresbe>the Norwegian Dovrebanen is … in a different league :)
11:39<Ailure>heh
11:39<Ailure>I remember being in Norway
11:39<Ailure>hardly a flat country
11:39<toresbe>So do I!
11:39<toresbe>'cause I live there :)
11:39<Ailure>I was up in Dalarna once
11:40<Ailure>then went to Trondeheim for a bit
11:40<toresbe>Trondheim is wonderful. I miss it.
11:40<Ailure>and was in norway for about a week at diffrent location
11:40<toresbe>But my heart lies here in Oslo, I fear.
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11:44<dihedral>whasssuuuuuup
11:44<@Bjarni>not your u key
11:45<dihedral>would have said "whasssUUUUUUUp" in that case :-D
11:45<@Bjarni>no
11:45<Sacro>whassuuuuuuuuuUUUUUUUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuUUUUUUUUUUUUUUp
11:45<@Bjarni>because that would be the shift key
11:46<hylje>u
11:46<dihedral>actually - my u key is about the smae height to my w and p keys
11:46<dihedral>*same
11:47<dihedral>Mark will be back next week btw
11:48<dihedral>heh - wrong window :-P
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11:52<Wolf01>hello
12:00[~]Bjarni notes that he should help to prepare a welcome home surprise party for Mark
12:00<@Bjarni>whoever that might be :P
12:00<@Bjarni>bbl
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12:29<Eddi|zuHause>hm... i cannot check TTDP
12:29<Sacro>orudge: how'd you get that netmask? D:
12:32<@Bjarni>well, he owns that domain
12:32<@Bjarni>but it would still be nice to know how he managed to do it ;)
12:33<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: He is SROTU
12:33<@Bjarni>SROTU?
12:33<Sacro>i own a domain
12:33<Sacro>this is pc.benwoodward.me.uk
12:33<@Bjarni>I just said that
12:33<@Bjarni>err
12:34<Prof_Frink>Supreme and complete Ruler Of The Universe and multiverse
12:34<@Bjarni>you do...?
12:34<@Bjarni>Prof_Frink: you called?
12:34<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: The full form of SROTU
12:35<@Bjarni>so SROTU is short for Bjarni... nice to know
12:35<Prof_Frink>Well, SROTU is the short acronym ;)
12:37<Sacro>and orudge is a short person
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12:41<@Bjarni>orudge: back to the question... how did you managed to get that domain name into IRC?
12:41<DaleStan>The Proper reverse DNS entries.
12:42<Sacro>DaleStan: Yes, I thought as much, but I have no idea how to do this :(
12:42<@Bjarni>the question is how to do it, not what happened ;)
12:42|-|prakti [~prakti@port-213-148-152-8.static.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: Quitting .... Hackedi...hackedi...weg.]
12:43<DaleStan>You have to start by controlling the DNS and RDNS for the IP address from which you connect.
12:43<DaleStan>After that, I don't know much about it either, since I've never owned an IP address.
12:44<Sacro>well I am static IP, and I own a domain
12:44<@Bjarni>you ARE a static IP?
12:44<dihedral>LOL
12:44<hylje>that explains a thing or two
12:45<Sacro>Bjarni: adding an "a" adds a whole different meaning
12:45<@Bjarni>you ARE static IP?
12:45<Eddi|zuHause>so it is a difference if i say "i am god" or "i am a god" :p
12:46<@Bjarni>yeah
12:46<@Bjarni>the latter shows signs of being a polytheist
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12:46<Eddi|zuHause>at least it sounds better than SROTU ;p
12:46<DaleStan>But it isn't *your* IP, Sacro. It belongs to your ISP, and they run the reverse DNS. You might be able to ask them nicely to change it.
12:47<Prof_Frink>I am.
12:49<Sacro>DaleStan: ah, I see your point
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12:51<Eddi|zuHause>how do you actually get to own an IP?
12:53<|Jeroen|>you buy one
12:53<@Bjarni>the ISPs buys them
12:53<@Bjarni>and I guess they will sell one to you if you offer enough money
12:53<@Bjarni>usually private people have nothing to use it for though
12:55|-|Amixosx [~AmiXoamip@cm-84.208.143.45.chello.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:55<|Jeroen|>i guess you have to buy them by the 254
12:55<@Bjarni>don't be too sure
12:56<|Jeroen|>im not :-)
12:56<@Bjarni>I presume that specially in Asia they do fucked up stuff like selling minimal amounts of IPs (Asia seriously lack free IPs)
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12:57<@Bjarni>they simply don't have enough to sell 254 to a single company if they are only going to use say 50
12:57<|Jeroen|>that sucks
12:57<dihedral>anybody here live in sweeden
12:57<@Bjarni>USA took most of them, then Europe took more or less the rest and the rest of the world hides behind NATs and stuff
12:58<@Bjarni>because the global IPs are in use elsewhere
12:58<dihedral>uni networks
12:58<dihedral>they use a bunch
12:58<@Bjarni>Africa could have the same problem, but they lack both computers and IPs. Asia are really gaining on the number of computers with net access
12:58<dihedral>hide all of asia behind ONE nat :-D
12:59<|Jeroen|>yeah 127.0.0.2 or somthing :-)
12:59[~]Belugas awaits for ip6
12:59<|Jeroen|>ow well they better get ipv6 moving
12:59<@orudge>[18:29:43] <Sacro> orudge: how'd you get that netmask? D: <-- my ISP lets me set up my own RDNS
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12:59<@Bjarni>I think USA has around 50% of all IPs
12:59<|Jeroen|>then we should go kick some usa ass and steal them back
12:59<@Bjarni>not that they use that many, but they took whole ranges at first and then other countries came too late to claim enough
13:00<Sacro>Bjarni: http://xkcd.com/195/
13:00<@Bjarni>USA took them at a time where the number of IP4 IPs appeared as endless as IP6 does today
13:01<@orudge>My ISP is better than Sacro's, basically
13:01<@orudge>in many ways :D
13:01<Sacro>yes... mine is crappy
13:01<Sacro>orudge: isn't yours torch?
13:01<@orudge>torch?
13:01[~]orudge is with an Entanet reseller
13:01<Sacro>Torch Communications
13:01<@orudge>never heard of them
13:02<|Jeroen|>if that maps is correctn europa has way more then usa
13:02<@Bjarni>Sacro: yeah... you can see how American companies took a whole lot of it
13:03<|Jeroen|>reclaim
13:03<|Jeroen|>why would boing need a whole range
13:03<|Jeroen|>boeing
13:03<@Bjarni>Asia Pacific has 16 (+2 for Japan only) even though they have like half of the world population
13:04<@orudge>I think GE or something owns 4.*.*.*, yet their web site is on a 216.*.*.* IP. So even when they have an entire class A, they still nick IPs from elsewhere
13:05<@orudge>The University of St Andrews has 138.251.*.* - pretty much each networkable device has its own globally addressable addres
13:05<@Bjarni>the whole IPv4 claiming issue is a joke. We should take better care with IPv6
13:05<@Bjarni>and switch to IPv6 ASAP
13:05<|Jeroen|>yeah it should be only rentable
13:05<@Bjarni>even though the backbone is hardcoded IPv4, so it could take a while
13:05<|Jeroen|>well asap would be kinda hard i guess, almost all routers would have to be flashed or replaced
13:05<|Jeroen|>well home routers i mean
13:06<Eddi|zuHause>my university has 141.48.*.* i believe
13:06<@Bjarni>ASAP = As Soon As Possible, which is not tomorrow due to the backbone routers and gateways are IPv4
13:06<@Bjarni>home routers aren't an issue here
13:06<@Bjarni>the backbone is
13:07<|Jeroen|>i think there are quite a lot of backbones ipv6 ready
13:08<|Jeroen|>you can get ipv6 with some isp's
13:08<|Jeroen|>and on most colo's
13:08<Eddi|zuHause>i think they are holding it back to squeeze the most money out of the ipv4 bottleneck
13:08<@Bjarni>if the controlling guys for the internet decides to switch to IPv6 say the first of June next year, then they can just say "switch to IPv6 before that or we cut the connection"
13:09<hylje>then we have two internets
13:09<@Bjarni>no
13:09<Eddi|zuHause>oh the noes!
13:09<|Jeroen|>well if they give isp's and users like 2 years to update
13:09<@Bjarni>IPv6 can tunnel though IPv4
13:09<Eddi|zuHause>the internets split in half!
13:09<@Bjarni>to make the transfer to IPv6 easier
13:10<ln->can they have signals at the tunnel endings?
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13:10<@Bjarni>I think so
13:10<|Jeroen|>no only roundabouts
13:10<|Jeroen|>signals slow down to mutch
13:11<hylje>the real question is
13:11<@Bjarni>you mean they create router loops
13:11<@Bjarni>that's not good
13:11<hylje>can one have signals IN the tunnel
13:12<|Jeroen|>that would be nice for openttd
13:12<Sacro>the ipv6 move starts soon
13:12<Sacro>and ipv4 gets cut off in... 2012 i think
13:13<@orudge>Everything seems to be happening in 2012
13:13<@orudge>it's as if it's all huddled round the Olympics or something
13:13<Sacro>yep
13:13<Sacro>analogue tv switch off
13:13<@orudge>well, by everything I mean finishing off switching off the analogue TV signal
13:13<@orudge>and, um, some other stuff
13:13<@orudge>I think
13:13<@Bjarni>seriously, if I had an IPv6 and say hylje had one too and I send something to him, I would send it using v6 to the ISP. The ISP might forward me to an IPv4 gateway so it will be changed into an IPv4 package where the v6 package is the data in the v4 one. The v4 package will then go though to hylje's ISP where the v6 package is restored and send the rest of the way
13:13<|Jeroen|>better get a non it job by 2012 then
13:14<@Bjarni>because this is possible, using IPv6 ISPs is possible while the backbone is still v4
13:14<Sacro>ooh
13:14<Sacro>the second transit of venus
13:15<@Bjarni><Sacro> analogue tv switch off <-- we do that in 2009 and Sweden will do it in 2007 (I think)
13:15<Sacro>Bjarni: it differs over here according to area
13:15<@Bjarni>I didn't really pay attention to when Sweden will do it as I already switched to digital
13:15<Sacro>some has gone off already
13:15<Sacro>yeah, i only use dvb-t too
13:15<Sacro># July 27 — Opening ceremony of the 2012 Summer Olympics begins in London at 7:30 pm UTC, or 8:30pm BST.[4]
13:16<Sacro>i really hate people who put "or" in
13:16<@Bjarni>I like the ability to watch/record any channel in a multiplex :D
13:16<@Bjarni>two good movies at the same time, no problem if they are in the same multiplex, just record both :D
13:17<Eddi|zuHause>i think ASTRA switches off analog in 2009 or so
13:17<@Bjarni>so far Denmark managed to put all the digital channels into the same multiplex, so I actually don't have a channel limit
13:17<@orudge>well, over here, we have, hmm, 5 or 6 muxes
13:17<@Bjarni>I mean I can record from all channels at once if I like
13:18<@orudge>naturally
13:18<Eddi|zuHause><Bjarni> I mean I can record from all channels at once if I like <- i can't, i have like 300 channels FTA
13:18<@Bjarni>we have the problem that analogue TV takes up all the room so there is only room for a single digital carrier wave and it's not even a SFN either
13:19<@Bjarni>in 2009 when the analogue is turned off, then we will get a whole lot of channels :D
13:19<Eddi|zuHause>but the most common 10 channels divide over 4 transponders, i believe
13:19<@Bjarni>basically I have 3 channels :/
13:20<@Bjarni>I never watch the 4th, which is sign language for the news
13:20<@Bjarni>then I have 4 Swedish channels and naturally they are on 3 different frequencies (way to go Sweden)
13:20<Eddi|zuHause>i know that luxemburg has already switched off analog
13:21<Wolf01>BigBB, good work with the shores
13:21<ln->so has finland
13:21<@Bjarni>the same goes for the Faeroe Isles
13:21<BigBB>thank you :)
13:22<Wolf01>now we need your patch and the anti saw foundations patch to add to the game a good eyecandy level :)
13:23<@Bjarni>I come to think about it, I use multiplexed channels almost every day. You see, I start the tuner on the news on two channels and then I can switch between them and fast forward/rewind just like it was video
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13:24[~]Belugas seconds opinion of Wolf01 regarding BigBB's work
13:24<@Bjarni>and when I do that, they end up overlapping, so I just get them both at once
13:24<BigBB>maybe I release it tomorrow. Atm I'm testing...
13:24[~]Belugas thinks that deepwater may be receiving an helping hand
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13:25<Wolf01>what the hell, i'm redrawing those stupid road lines for the brickland climate, now seem that they are perfectly aligned
13:28<Sacro>Wolf01: did you try lcad?
13:28<Wolf01>yes
13:29<@Belugas>are you happy/sad/perplex/none of the above ?
13:29|-|Osai^2 changed nick to Osai
13:29<Sacro>perplex?
13:30<Eddi|zuHause>is that even an english word?
13:30<Sacro>yes
13:30<Sacro>"to perplex"
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13:31<Sacro>but the feeling would be "perplexed"
13:31|-|Frostregen_ changed nick to Frostregen
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13:32<Eddi|zuHause>in german you would say "ich bin perplex"... i have never seen it used as a verb...
13:32[~]Belugas must take some english classes
13:33<@Belugas>in french, yu do not need the "d". So i removed the "e" to make it english and there you go, a wrong word
13:34<Eddi|zuHause>honestly, i'd not really believe Sacro teaching any language...
13:35<Sacro>*I'd
13:35<Eddi|zuHause>see :p
13:36<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, i usually do not capitalise in IRC, except abbreviations or if i really want to emphasise anything
13:36<Eddi|zuHause>something?
13:36<Eddi|zuHause>whateverthing?
13:36<Sacro>Well you should type properley.
13:36|-|gynterk [~gynter@84-50-129-63-dsl.rkv.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
13:36<Sacro>something :)
13:37<Eddi|zuHause>you do not capitalise in spoken language either
13:37<Eddi|zuHause>and i consider chat spoken language
13:37<Eddi|zuHause>and i think i explained that before
13:38<Eddi|zuHause>besides, i do not feel the need to compensate for something by capitalising "i"
13:39<SpComb>not capitalizing your I's is bad grammar, and looks ugly
13:39<Eddi|zuHause>and even besiderer... it goes completely against german capitalisation rules
13:39[~]SpComb uses a variation of english grammar whereby there's no capital letter at the start of the line, and no period at the end
13:40<Eddi|zuHause>PS: shouldn't it be "properly"?
13:40<SpComb>because you don't really need that on IRC, because each line is its own sentence
13:40<Sacro>err...
13:40<Sacro>noooooo
13:41<Eddi|zuHause>SpComb: that goes along with my rule of "spoken language"
13:41<SpComb>you need the capital letter/period in normal text, because you have more than once sentence together, on IRC each line is it's own sentence. Of course, if there's two sentences in a line, then you have the normal period/capital letter
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>but in reverse of that, i put way too many commas...
13:42<SpComb>and breaking up a sentence over multiple lines is wrong
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>what
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>is
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>wrong
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>with
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>that
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>?
13:42<SpComb>/kick Eddi|zuHause spam
13:43<Eddi|zuHause>i just wanted to emphasise a point
13:43<SpComb>you have 512 chars to use, no need to use a seperate line for each word with more than one syllable
13:43<Eddi|zuHause>· <- the point
13:43<SpComb>that point isn't very emphasised
13:44<Eddi|zuHause>PS: i did not even use a word with more than one syllable
13:46<SpComb>wasn't specifically about your example
13:47<SpComb>19:29:53 < gibs> what do you
13:47<SpComb>19:29:54 < gibs> mean
13:47<SpComb>19:29:59 < gibs> like
13:47<Eddi|zuHause>that's not exactly a counterexample :p
13:48<Sacro>.
13:48<Wolf01>just one question, i was reading the "problems with ECS on ottd" topic, what about make ottd loading by default the grf on grfid order? if mistaking the order causes glitches and errors why is it allowed?
13:48[~]Sacro needs to learn how german signalling works
13:48<Eddi|zuHause>Sacro: ·, not .
13:48<Sacro>·
13:49<Wolf01>
13:49<Eddi|zuHause>Sacro: that's quite difficult, there are at least 4 different system in use
13:49<Wolf01>:D
13:49<Sacro>Eddi|zuHause: well this one had 2 green lights
13:49<Sacro>i was confused :(
13:49<Eddi|zuHause>that's just white here... what's it supposed to be?
13:49|-||Jeroen| [~jeroen@d51A43614.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO]
13:49<Sacro>Kuju Rail Simulator
13:50<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, you often have two lights at the same time
13:50<SpComb>···
13:50<SpComb>there's an emphasised point in there
13:50<Eddi|zuHause>green/green, green/yellow or yellow/yellow
13:50<Eddi|zuHause>SpComb: they look all the same
13:50<SpComb>·
13:50<Eddi|zuHause>and they are made of tickytacky?
13:50<SpComb>then your terminal has bold fonts disabled
13:51<Eddi|zuHause>i do%b have bold and underlined text
13:51<Eddi|zuHause>err... mistyped
13:51<Eddi|zuHause>i do have bold and underlined text
13:51<gynterk>lol
13:51<Sacro>what about green?
13:52<Eddi|zuHause>just the dot looks the same
13:52<gynterk>green works here?
13:52<gynterk>hmm
13:52<Eddi|zuHause>channel disables colours i believe
13:52<gynterk>+c afaik
13:52<gynterk>but not sure
13:53<Eddi|zuHause>[2007-10-11 08:54] *** Kanalmodi: Keine Nachrichten von außen, Topic-Schutz, Keine Farben erlaubt
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14:42<Wolf01>see what you did, you pressed the mute key
14:42<Eddi|zuHause>in IRC, that is called "Moderated"
14:42<Eddi|zuHause>like this: [Di Sep 25 2007] [05:05:41] Modus Kanalmodi: Geheim, Privat, Moderiert, Topic-Schutz, Keine Nachrichten von außen, Beschränkt auf 772 Benutzer
14:42|-|Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
---Logclosed Thu Oct 11 14:42:55 2007
---Logopened Thu Oct 11 14:43:01 2007
14:43|-|mikegrb [~michael@mail.thegrebs.com] has joined #openttd
14:43|-|Ekipa kanalu #openttd: Wszystkich: 95 |-| +op [5] |-| +voice [3] |-| normalnych [87]
14:44|-|Kanal #openttd zsynchronizowany w 90 sekundy
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14:52<Eddi|zuHause>that's like avoiding plane crashes by staying in the kitchen...
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14:52<@Bjarni>that's my strategy
14:53<Greyscale>Shit! I missed the strategy!
14:53<Sacro>Eddi|zuHause: i like that theory
14:53<Sacro>though i'd personally go to the bomb shelter
14:53<@Bjarni>that might be overdoing it
14:54<@Bjarni>your bed will do
14:54<@Bjarni>hmm
14:54<@Bjarni>move your bed to the bomb shelter, just in case
14:54<Sacro>ooh i could
14:54<Sacro>its an authentic ww2 air raid shelter
14:55|-|Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77CD9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
14:55<@Bjarni>don't mention the war
14:55<@Bjarni>now we lost Eddi|zuHause
14:56<Sacro>he started it
14:56<@Bjarni>no, you did
14:56<Greyscale>Who'da thunk the germans would be up for Round 2.
14:56<Sacro>Bjarni: no they did
14:56<Sacro>they invaded Poland
14:56<@Bjarni>so?
14:57|-|Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77CD9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
14:57<@Bjarni>in case you aren't aware of it, Poland isn't UK
14:57<Greyscale>And still BMW satnav only finds its way to warsaw.
14:57<@Bjarni>you could have cared less
14:57<Greyscale>The germans need a budget brand
14:57<Greyscale>like, VW, but cheaper
14:57<Greyscale>They *did* buy rover at one point
14:58[~]Prof_Frink slaps Bjarni around a bit with Fawlty Towers
14:58<@Bjarni>VW is meant to be cheap... at first at least
14:58<Greyscale>HAHA. Phaeton.
14:58<Greyscale>£60000 peoples car
14:58<@Bjarni>Prof_Frink: like I watch Fowly Owners
14:58<Eddi|zuHause>that was before WWII
14:59<Greyscale>yeah, VW have been sticking us with prices since :P
14:59<Sacro>mmm
14:59[~]Sacro wants a british car :(
15:00<Greyscale>Buy a taxi
15:00<Greyscale>They're still built here
15:00<Greyscale>by LTI
15:00<Greyscale>or a vauxhall
15:00<Greyscale>which are nailed together in luton
15:00<@Bjarni>Luton....
15:00<@Bjarni>you mean that should be better than Asian cars?
15:01<Greyscale>Where did I say that?
15:01<Sacro>Vauxhall aint british
15:01<@Bjarni>good point... nowhere ;)
15:01<Eddi|zuHause>get a VW New Beetle, at least they are manufactured in good old... mexico
15:01<Greyscale>Sacro, they are sortof.
15:02[~]Prof_Frink wants a DB9
15:02<Greyscale>They're the Blittish arm of GM
15:02<hylje>blittish
15:02<Greyscale>Mostly assembled in this country in a shed in luton between 3 hour teabreaks
15:02[~]hylje blits
15:02<@Bjarni>I like how some US ministry worked out a list of environmental good cars for their employes to buy and they were forced to recall it because none of the 10 cars were American
15:02<@Bjarni>profit before environment
15:03<@Bjarni>they were all Japanese or Korean
15:03<Greyscale>Rice is cheaper than petrol I hear.
15:03<Greyscale>:P
15:03<@Bjarni>:)
15:03<@Bjarni>I like the new Nissan
15:03<Prof_Frink>"Here's a list of environmentally friendly cars" "Oh, you can't post that, it doesn't have a Hummer on it"
15:03<Greyscale>which one?
15:03<Greyscale>Frankly, they're all fugly.
15:03<hylje>contary to popular belief even asian automobiles run on conventional means
15:04<Greyscale>hylje, I am aware.
15:04<Greyscale>Its not like the flintstones car anyway
15:04<Prof_Frink>hylje: Luke's car runs on unconventional means
15:04<Greyscale>it'd ATLEAST have satnav to help you find a bronto burger.
15:04<Eddi|zuHause>you mean "conventional" as in "feet stick out to the ground and then you run"?
15:04<Greyscale>why don't they just walk?
15:04<@Bjarni>http://youtube.com/watch?v=MxP-eDN_zns <-- this one
15:04<Prof_Frink>And makes people hungry as he drives past
15:05<Greyscale>and how does that shit turn?
15:05<Greyscale>it'd be an american car if it were
15:05<Greyscale>OH CRAP CORNER D:
15:05<@Bjarni>I'm not sure that I would buy it, but I like the idea and it's nice for city traffic
15:05<@Bjarni>but they do have to fix mirrors and stuff
15:06<Eddi|zuHause>Bjarni: err, what?
15:06<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: That's...
15:06<Eddi|zuHause>it's like a wheel on wheels...
15:07<@Bjarni>it's an interesting concept
15:07<dihedral>gnight
15:07<@Bjarni>and it will be interesting to see what it turns out to be
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15:07<Eddi|zuHause>hopefully we won't be getting to see THAT in heroes :p
15:07<Amixosx>Bjarni: nice
15:08<@Bjarni>in heroes?
15:08<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: What it will turn out to be is a perpetual concept car
15:08<Eddi|zuHause>Heroes == the best TV series out there
15:08<@Bjarni>I specially like the ability to drive sideways so it's easy to parallel park and parallel parked cars can be parked closer
15:08<Eddi|zuHause>they have a contract with Nissan for "product placement"
15:09<@Bjarni>hehe
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15:09<Greyscale>Why is there a megaman head in the pivo2 dash?
15:09<@Bjarni>it's a talking robot
15:09<Prof_Frink>Greyscale: It's a japanese car
15:09<@Bjarni>watching the driver to check for sleepiness and stuff
15:09<@Bjarni>and you can talk to it
15:10<@Bjarni>ask for directions and stuff
15:10<Prof_Frink>Like I said
15:10<@Bjarni>yeah, we kind of said the same thing
15:11<Eddi|zuHause>the keys are like next to each other
15:11<@Bjarni>it should be able to talk to the driver if the driver shows signs of falling asleep
15:12<@Bjarni>kind of like a dead mans pedal in trains, only not so aggressive
15:14<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: It probably has some flashing lights to a) wake the driver up and b) give him an epileptic fit
15:15<Greyscale>Bjarni, it should fucking drive
15:16<Greyscale>If I'm having megaman talking to me in my car, he may as well drive
15:16<Greyscale>nick the radar speed sensor kit from a Mercedes.
15:16<LeviathNL>wtf newshipsw.grf in combination with some other grf is crapping my sound up :/
15:16<@Belugas>poor sound :(
15:16<LeviathNL>anyone familiar with it?
15:17<@Belugas>not me, sorry
15:17<@Belugas>but you should define "some other grf"
15:17<LeviathNL>I'm trying to find out now
15:17<LeviathNL>which one
15:19<Prof_Frink>Greyscale: And stick some lane drift sensors on too
15:19<LeviathNL>hmm, it does not matter what grf I delete, the problem is gone.
15:20<Greyscale>Prof_Frink, yeah
15:21<LeviathNL>Is there some limitation I could have reached?
15:21<@Belugas>hardly
15:22<@Belugas>maybe the problem is not grf nor ottd related
15:22<LeviathNL>I'll try it on my laptop
15:26<LeviathNL>same problem
15:27|-|Hendikins changed nick to Hendikins|Work
15:27<@Belugas>grfs involved? what order? OS? OTTD Version?
15:27<Eddi|zuHause>so if the problem disappears if you remove ANY grf, why do you think it's related to newships?
15:28<LeviathNL>I said that before finding out deleting any of the grf's works
15:29<LeviathNL>r11246 (today's nightly) XP, http://paste.openttd.org/245
15:29<Phazorx>can any true type font be used in small_font/medium_font ?
15:30<LeviathNL>it is the standard (openttd first run generated) openttd.cfg only added the grf's
15:31<@Bjarni>Phazorx: go ahead and try them. I think it should work with whatever freetype works with
15:32<Phazorx>Bjarni: i dont se erthe effect anymore
15:32<Phazorx>i recall seeing it before
15:32<@Bjarni>hmm
15:32<Phazorx>do i need 32vpp and aliasing for that ?
15:32<@Bjarni>then you did it wrong :P
15:32<Phazorx>Bjarni: i dont see an error either
15:33<Phazorx>even if i put incorrect font there
15:33<@Bjarni>close OpenTTD, edit openttd.cfg where you set the fonts to use, save and open OpenTTD
15:33<Phazorx>and if i do "-s null" game CTDes even
15:33<Phazorx>Bjarni: that's close to what i am doing
15:33<Phazorx>and fonts are staying in the cfg
15:33<@Bjarni>hmm
15:34<@Bjarni>I have a fontconfig issue so I have to provide absolute paths to the fonts
15:34<Phazorx>and -s null only CTDes with 8bpp--optimized
15:34<Phazorx>Bjarni: you on linux right?
15:34<@Bjarni>...
15:34[~]Bjarni slaps Phazorx
15:34<@Bjarni>try again
15:34<@Bjarni>but at least you didn't say Windows :)
15:34<Phazorx>SCO BSD? :)
15:35<Prof_Frink>Anger like that would suggest a BSD
15:35<@Bjarni>you are getting closer, but not close enough
15:35[~]Bjarni slaps Phazorx
15:35<toresbe>Or even an amiga user
15:35<LeviathNL>if someone is interested i can upload my whole openttd directory
15:35<@Bjarni>I think you talk garbage because you enjoy pain :P
15:35<toresbe>oh
15:35<Phazorx>Bjarni: unlikely it matetrs anyway
15:35<toresbe>it's that glossy heap of transparency that thinks it's an operating system
15:35<@Bjarni>it's in the wiki
15:35<Phazorx>i use windows and self compiled binary
15:36<Phazorx>goona try official now
15:36<Prof_Frink>X-Chat Aqua 0.16.0 (xchat 2.6.1) Darwin 8.10.1 [i386/2.00GHz/SMP]
15:36<Prof_Frink>Hmm, what could that *possibly* be? :p
15:36<@Bjarni>http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Bjarni
15:36<Phazorx>darwin eh
15:36<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: it's a wiki
15:36<Prof_Frink>It's full of lies
15:37<@Bjarni>survival of the fittest
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15:37<Phazorx>Bjarni: so you are the reason for "rightclick_emulate" option in the cfg?
15:37<@Bjarni>well, there is one incorrect info on that page
15:37<@Bjarni>try to find it
15:37<Phazorx>and this is the person who says i like pain...
15:37<@Belugas>he's not active anymore ;)
15:37<@Bjarni>err
15:38<@Bjarni>actually I was talking about the year of birth
15:38<Phazorx>and btw, darwin is linux :)
15:38<@Bjarni>for the record: I have a multibutton mouse
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15:38<@Bjarni>in fact I have more than one
15:38<Phazorx>even if apple prefers to call it macos
15:39<@Bjarni>I added the right click emulation because other people requested it
15:39<@Bjarni>I don't need it
15:40<Phazorx>hm... in cfg do i need to supply full path and file or registered font name actualy?
15:40<Phazorx>and where did errors about fonts go... i used to be getting them
15:40<@Bjarni>Phazorx: you are only allowed to ask questions that we can answer. Now you make the illusion that we don't know our own game :P
15:41<Phazorx>so the erros do appear and my mind blocks them somerwhow so i dont see them?
15:42<@Bjarni>yeah, that sounds better
15:42<@Bjarni>but
15:42<@Bjarni>in fact you do get the font you select
15:42<Phazorx>Bjarni: i put fint blah blah blah there
15:42<@Bjarni>but you only select fonts that looks like the ingame spritebased font
15:42<Phazorx>i'm sure i dont have it
15:42|-|dihedral|away changed nick to dihedral
15:42<dihedral>http://www.break.com/pictures/bonds-dog380319.html
15:43<Phazorx>Bjarni: newspaper, station names and cargo abbriviation in station list'
15:43<Phazorx>are usual ways for me to check correct fonts
15:43<Phazorx>at the moment they look exactly same as usual
15:44<Phazorx>aha... oficial night does give me erro but compiled does not
15:45<Rubidium>with debugging vs without debugging
15:46<LeviathNL>if someone is interested rar of openttd-directory which gives distorted sound(win32)
15:46<Phazorx>Rubidium: as in --enable debug ?
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15:46<@Bjarni>http://www.break.com/pictures/double-seat-bike380307.html <-- hahaha. Imagine getting a ride with a fat person
15:46<LeviathNL>distortedhttp://rapidshare.com/files/61890604/Openttd.rar.html
15:46<Phazorx>CXXFLAGS="-pipe -O2 -march=athlon-xp -ffast-math -fomit-frame-pointer -msse -mmmx -m3dnow -falign-functions=64"
15:46<LeviathNL>whoops
15:46<Phazorx>gcc.exe (GCC) 3.4.2 (mingw-special)
15:47<Phazorx>could any of these 2 be the reason?
15:50<Phazorx>just in case doing a fresh co
15:50<Phazorx>and recompile
15:55<huma>http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/9347/flugr3.jpg
15:57<Phazorx>still no go on selfcompiled, crashes with -s, and ignores font option
15:58<Phazorx>what did i do wrong?
15:58<Rubidium>you didn't install libfreetype-dev and libfontconfig-dev (or whatever they're called)?
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16:01<Phazorx>Rubidium: win32
16:01<Phazorx>and it used to work ebfore
16:01<Rubidium>I'm only guess as I don't have Windows installed on any of my computers
16:02<Phazorx>Rubidium: i doubt ftype libs are neede in case of mingw... but i could be wrong
16:03<Rubidium>maybe it isn't needed on mingw, though I think it is *highly* unlikely as it is needed when you want to have fonts with a MSVC binary.
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16:08<+glx>freetype is needed
16:08<+glx>fontconfig isn't
16:09<Phazorx>glx: wehre do i get it
16:09<Phazorx>or do i need to compile it?
16:09<+glx>I compiled it
16:10<+glx>but I think there is a mingw-port for it
16:11<Phazorx>any pointers on either?
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16:13<+glx>http://freetype.org/ <-- get the source and compile it
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16:22<Wolf01>'night
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16:26<dihedral>http://www.break.com/index/song-for-the-perfect-girlfriend.html
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16:32<Phazorx>.
16:36|-|dihedral changed nick to dihedral|away
16:48<@Bjarni>http://my.break.com/content/view.aspx?ContentID=160129 <-- I thought I had seen most stuff when it comes to pool, but....
16:48<@Bjarni>wow
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17:05<Mek>yay, my ctrl-button works, finally I can build pre-signals on my phone :) http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/79bc0dce02527a77d0cf2cc94266e69c.png
17:05<valhallasw>neat :)
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17:15<Sacro>windows mobile?
17:15<Mek>nah, openmoko (linux)
17:21<Phazorx>heh linux on phones... removing last bits of differences between phones and computers
17:22<Sionide>Mek, OMG:D
17:22<Sionide>i want one of them
17:23<Mek>they can't really reliable make phone-calls yet, but for openttd playing it is just fine :)
17:23<Phazorx>lolz
17:23<Phazorx>a phone that runs games but cant call?
17:23<Sacro>ooh
17:23<Sacro>i want an openmoko phone
17:24<Sionide>Phazorx, i've got a mobile for that..
17:24<Sionide>more of a PDA the openmoko i'd say
17:24<Sionide>besides, the iPhone can't send MMS
17:30<Phazorx>what's the res on that thing?
17:30<Phazorx>if it betas psp - definately sometihng worthy then
17:30<Mek>640x480 (with someting like 280dpi...)
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17:40<Phazorx>one needs a zoom to use it?
17:40<Phazorx>i seen 210dpi, very hard to see pixels
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18:42<Sacro>I had a mate who was suicidal.
18:42<Sacro>He was really depressed, so I pushed him in front of a steam train.
18:42<Sacro>Then he was chuffed to bits.
18:42[~]Sacro roffles
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19:43<CIA-5>OpenTTD: belugas * r11247 /trunk/src/industry_gui.cpp: -Fix: The Industry's name to fund could be larger than the window itself. Now, it fits within the physical allowed space
19:58<huma>Belugas: i use lucida console 11 and it doesn't fit the line height
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21:11<mattt__>anyone know the ratio of trains/tile?
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---Logclosed Fri Oct 12 00:00:05 2007