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#openttd IRC Logs for 2007-10-15

---Logopened Mon Oct 15 00:00:56 2007
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02:48<asure>Hello people, I bet you're all sleeping.. Infact I don't even know why I come here to ask a question.. hehe
02:49<Noldo>now that's a great start
02:49<boekabart>hi asure
02:49<asure>So people are awake at this hour?!
02:49<boekabart>rest asure-d, some people are awake :)
02:50<boekabart>asure: 'this hour' doesn't mean anything on a world
02:50<asure>Would you mind if I asked you guys for some insight into a little problem I'm having with OTTD?
02:50<dihedral|work>you just asked a question
02:50<asure>Ah I did indeed, but it does not pertain to OTTD specifically.. Right?
02:50<asure>Atleast I think so, anyway..
02:51<dihedral|work>just ask - if nobody answers, ask again in 10 hours
02:51<asure>I'm having an issue with the vehicle replacement button, I really don't see it. I only see a manage vehicles button (Send to depot, etc) What's going on here, is there some patch or mod I have to enable to see it first?
02:51<boekabart>asure: first of all , what version do you use?
02:52<asure>I think that is the latest version, but it might not be
02:53<dihedral|work>vehicle list, button on the right hand side ('manage v') where v is a arrow pointing downwards
02:53<dihedral|work>click and hold
02:54<asure>Oh wow, I'm an idiot then I suppose..
02:54<asure>Sorry for such a simple question ;)
02:54<asure>Thank you
02:54<dihedral|work>you're welcome
02:54<asure>for answering such a simple question*
02:55<dihedral|work>* for showing you that you are.... just kidding :-P
02:55[~]dihedral|work laughs
02:56<asure>Oh, I'm well aware of how thick I can be sometimes. :)
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02:58<dihedral|work>same here, same here :-)
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03:18<dihedral|work>asure: enjoy the feature :-P
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04:46<dihedral|work>TrueBrain: for pisg are you using the cache dir option?
04:50<TrueBrain>dihedral|work: it doesn't have any, so no
04:50<dihedral|work>command line option -cf CacheDir="/path/to/config/dir"
04:51<dihedral|work>works for me :-)
04:51<dihedral|work>saves to a file called -
04:51<TrueBrain>maybe I should update pisg then :p
04:51<dihedral|work>so each channel should get a config dir
04:51<dihedral|work>which version do you have?
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04:52<dihedral|work>it's in the 0.70 documentation
04:53<kampasky>Hey guys, any chance to restrict openttd-svn to a closed list of senders? it's not like anyone other than the bot should ever send stuff there...
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04:54<TrueBrain>kampasky: it is; only the bot is allowed to send via it
04:54<TrueBrain>strangly enough, some spammer found a way to act like the bot...
04:54<kampasky>it should also restrict envelopesender then
04:54<TrueBrain>it does
04:55<TrueBrain>the headers of the spam and real email are identical
04:55<kampasky>Received: from [] (helo=
04:55<kampasky> by with smtp (Exim 4.67)
04:55<kampasky> (envelope-from <>) id 1IhMMM-0004ev-82
04:55<kampasky> for; Mon, 15 Oct 2007 09:35:41 +0000
04:55<kampasky>are they really?
04:55<TrueBrain>it should check on that.....
04:55[~]TrueBrain slaps mailman
04:55<TrueBrain>it can be so annoying
04:55<kampasky>of course even that protection is not perfect, but should cut off the spam rate a bit at least
04:55<TrueBrain>I wish mailman had an IP filter for this
04:55<TrueBrain>but I couldn't find it...
04:55<kampasky>yeah :(
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05:10<dihedral|work>TrueBrain: so what version of pisg do you have?
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05:24<TrueBrain>argh, I need a upnp av client for linux..
05:24<TrueBrain>djmount keeps giving: out of memory
05:24<TrueBrain>annoying!! :p
05:24<dihedral|work>free-av :-P
05:24<dihedral|work>has a linux client
05:24<TrueBrain>and how does a virus scanner going to help me?
05:25<dihedral|work>perhaps i should read every word you say (was missing the upnp)
05:25<dihedral|work>just read av and linux :-P
05:25<dihedral|work>and client
05:27<TrueBrain>k, CacheDir works, tnx a bunch dihedral|work
05:28<dihedral|work>otherwise pisg does use a bung and a gob
05:29<dihedral|work>i was having pisg runn every hour for 2 channels, and all games just started laging
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05:40<Phazorx>tb so it does do caching it seems...
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05:56<TrueBrain>Phazorx: clearly, hidden, but it does :p
05:57<TrueBrain>stupid djmount keeps giving: out of memory
05:57<TrueBrain>really: wtf?! :p
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06:05[~]dihedral|lunch greets Ammler
06:06<Ammler>hu dihedral|lunch
06:06<dihedral|lunch>irc-stats back up :-) found the caching feature :-P
06:06<dihedral|lunch>just for the fun of it :-P
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06:28<WITTU>I cant figure out what i should write to the ttd patch and to get it work right
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06:37<TrueBrain>wow, joining a channel for 4 minutes, asking a question after 3 minutes, and not waiting any reply be leaving after 1 minute
06:37<TrueBrain>people still amaze me
06:37<dihedral|work>and asking a question in the wrong channel :-P
06:37<TrueBrain>pff, the things you have to do to get your patch accepted by ffmpeg...
06:38<TrueBrain>I had to show tcpdumps to proof I was right...
06:38<dihedral|work>things one has to do to get patches into ottd
06:38<dihedral|work>heh - there is nothing one could do
06:38<dihedral|work>appart from being patient and let devs work in their own time :-P
06:40<TrueBrain>well, if you think ottd sucks, try ffmpeg :p
06:40<dihedral|work>i never said anything along those lines
06:40<dihedral|work>i think ottd is great
06:41<dihedral|work>for being at 0.x release versions :-)
06:41<dihedral|work>and you guys put a lot of work in
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06:41<dihedral|work>yet i somtimes miss some more admin features
06:41<TrueBrain>there simply are no admin functions :p
06:42<TrueBrain>NoAI should be finished, so Squirrel can be added as console script
06:42<TrueBrain>that opens up a lot of posibility :)
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06:42<dihedral|work>TrueBrain: it's still stuff like setting company passwords from the console
06:42<dihedral|work>and stuff like the 'reload config' patch :-)
06:43<TrueBrain>dihedral|work: which is much easier to allow via Squirrel, yes
06:43<dihedral|work>the reloading of the config?
06:44<dihedral|work>#openttdcoop uses it IIRC or at least the game
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08:50<dihedral|work>moin moin
08:50<dihedral|work>12 mins late, who cares :-)
08:50<dihedral|work>oh - it's just 2 ;-P
08:51[~]dihedral|work should learn to read the time correctly
08:51<dihedral|work>/s/the time// :-)
08:51<TrueBrain>time is all relative
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09:03<dihedral|work>TrueBrain: from your point of view, would i in any way be able to help with implementing squirrel?
09:04<TrueBrain>dihedral|work: finish NoAI
09:04<dihedral|work>TrueBrain: i dont have the skills
09:05<TrueBrain>finishing NoAI doesn't require skills, just a lot of time
09:07<dihedral|work>i shall have a snoop around the code
09:08<dihedral|work>and see if i find anything that i could possibly be of any help at
09:09[~]Sacro wants a bottle of vodka and commit rights!
09:09<TrueBrain>Sacro: proof your worthyness :)
09:09<Sacro>*prove :)
09:09<TrueBrain>k :p
09:10<Sacro>not as much a failure as him ^^
09:11<Sacro>that was almost "special"
09:16<Ailure>damn i'm tired
09:16<Ailure>I have too much fun
09:17<dihedral|work>you get tired from too much fun?
09:17<dihedral|work>your parents must have had a very easy life with you
09:17<Ailure>Actually I just had a exam and studied like hell
09:17<Ailure>and only slept two hours last night
09:17<Ailure>almost wrote that as two horses
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09:18<TrueBrain>It's the... EYE of the tiger (8)
09:19<Ailure>Trying to decode that smiley
09:20<Ailure>is screwing with my head
09:20<dihedral|work>it's not a smily - it's an 8 wrapped in brackets
09:35<Ammler>grf2html for 4LV takes long...
09:37<Ammler>there are also Linux gurus here, how can I run a command for every grf in the pack? (wine grf2html.exe <grf>)
09:38<Ammler>I would also have a list, if that would help
09:38<TrueBrain>for i in `ls *.grf`; do wine grf2html.exe $i; done
09:38<Ammler>ah, try that
09:38<Ammler>TrueBrain: they are in subfolders, does that work too?
09:39<TrueBrain>ls */*.grf
09:39<TrueBrain>scans 1-deep
09:40<dihedral|work>find . -type f -name "*.grf" -exec wine grf2html.exe '{}' ';'
09:40<Ammler>if I have a list like that, I could run cat <list> instead of ls *.grf
09:40<+glx>find and grep can manage recursion too
09:40<TrueBrain>Ammler: yes
09:41<TrueBrain>dihedral|work: find sucks for those jobs, as the syntax sucks ass
09:41<dihedral|work>was just a thought
09:41<TrueBrain>find * | grep ".grf$" | xargs -n 1 wine grf2html.exe
09:41<TrueBrain>also an option ;)
09:41<Sacro>glx: yay, another person who uses find | grep
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09:41<Ammler>I made the list with tree
09:41<TrueBrain>but I like fors, as you can alter the $i value ;)
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09:42<TrueBrain>cat <list> | xargs -n 1 wine grf2html.exe
09:43<TrueBrain>lol, many options :p
09:43<Ammler>tree -if ottdc_grfpack | grep -i "GRF$" > ottdc_grfpack.cfg
09:43<TrueBrain>tree -if ottdc_grfpack | grep -i "GRF$" | xargs -n1 wine grf2html.exe
09:44<Ammler>hmm, nice, thanks very much guys
09:45<Sacro>none use awk :(
09:45<TrueBrain>too tricky for such simple tasks
09:47<frosch123>Ammler: Try grf2html --nodata <- that is a lot faster :)
09:48<Ammler>then, I have no images?
09:48<Ammler>thats enough for reading nfo :)
09:48<frosch123>depends, if you have generated the images before.
09:48<Ammler>seems to be a cool tool frosch123
09:48<frosch123>nice, if it is useful for you.
09:48<@Belugas>it is, believe me
09:49<Ammler>yeah, I just try to understand some grfs
09:49<Ammler>frosch123: has it something to do with the grfmaker?
09:50<Ammler>or do they just share same svn repo
09:50<@Belugas>only sharing plus both written in Delphi
09:53<Ammler>ok, 4lv is a litte bit too big for it, 50% done in about half an hour.
09:53<frosch123>Note: If you decode a station, industry or house grf, you should not use the --nodata switch. It will skip the bounding box preview :) <- that is my favorite feature
09:53<frosch123>err, that does not sound correct.
09:53<fjb>Hm, maybe you could compile grf2html on Linux using Free Pascal?
09:53<Ammler>is it because of wine?
09:54<frosch123>No grf is big enough to take longer than a minute or two.
09:54<Ammler>ok, I try it on windows then....
09:55<frosch123>I am very sure, that I also testes 4LV with wine.
09:55<Ammler>Sysinfo for 'inspiron-suse': Linux running KDE 3.5.5 "release 45.4", CPU: Intel(R) Core 2 CPU T5600 @ 1.83GHz at 1000 MHz (3657 bogomips), HD: 80/141GB, RAM: 1976/2026MB, 152 proc's, 2.13h up
09:55<Ammler>so the hardware couln't be quilty
09:56<frosch123>much bigger machine than mine :)
09:56<Ammler>oh, maybe the network
09:56<frosch123>Yes that could be, it creates a lot of files.
09:56<Ammler>its a samba share, :)
09:57<frosch123>Under windows there is a big speed up, if you run grf2html a second time, when the files allready exist and only get overwritten.
09:59<Ammler>frosch123: Action 10 would be nice with seeing the char, if possible
10:00<frosch123>fjb: I already tried to compile it using lazarus, but it kept printing stupid errors I did not understood. I guess there are some subtle differences in "class" syntax.
10:00<Ammler>and of course, Action 7/9 too then...
10:00<frosch123>What do you mean with "char"?
10:00<Ammler>Label ID
10:01<Ammler>-> R
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10:02<frosch123>Interessting, who encodes label IDs with characters?
10:03<frosch123>I.e. which grf does that?
10:03<Ammler>oh, is that stupid
10:03<Ammler>my first try to fix the aircraft speed has that
10:04<Ammler>35 * 14 10 "Running costs"
10:04<Ammler>23 * 6 07 01 01 02 FF "R"
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10:10<frosch123>Ok, 4LV takes three minutes over the network here. one second with --nodata :)
10:11<Ammler>my "fileserver" is a really old maschine
10:19<fjb>I have the strong feeling that the combi presignals have some bugs...
10:19<Eddi|zuHause3>no, they just have poor semantics
10:21<fjb>Why does a train choose the occupied platform and not the free one? It can reach both. :-(
10:21<hylje>is a switch-based pathing mechanism feasible?
10:22<hylje>rather than train-based
10:22<+glx>like PBS?
10:22<hylje>it'd work like pbs
10:23<Sacro>hylje: yes, thats what tekky was working on
10:24<fjb>Anyway, the train should choose the free platform. There is a switch betwenn the train and the two platforms. In front of both platforms are block end signals. In front of the switch is a combi presignal.
10:24<fjb>Will Tekki ever come back...?
10:25<hylje>fjb: that works great, you're doing something wrong. the coop people do huge stations based on that all the time
10:25<Eddi|zuHause3>i assume it's poor signalling on your part, fjb
10:25<Eddi|zuHause3>but i have to catch a bus now...
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10:26<fjb>Ok, I'm also away for about half an hour.
10:27<Ammler>fjb: provide us with screen or save
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10:32<Ammler>4lv 2html done :)
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10:43<skidd13>Can I set defines via Configure/Makefile?
10:49<Progman>which one do you want to set?
10:51[~]dihedral|work greets
10:52<skidd13>Progman: MERSENNE_TWISTER
10:53<skidd13>I'm thinking of something like "./configure --enable-mersene"
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11:00<Ammler>ah, I see, you are using Action10 only with labe E0..., hmm, why?
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11:03<Ammler>hmm, just for downwards compatibility
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11:23<Progman>can you confirm this? If you buy and engine and add a waggon which supports different cargos the "change cargo type" button get not updated (only half by a MarkDirty call from the money raising in the trains viewport)
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11:29<skidd13>I've to leave for now. See you later.
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11:54<UnderBuilder>heh it is nice to see patch developers helping ottd
11:54<UnderBuilder>and will be even better if it also happens viceversa
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12:14<Ammler>SpComb: Is it possible to delete or stop Server on
12:14<Ammler>my tests are still in the official list
12:14<Ammler>I stopped them many times, but seems not working
12:16<SpComb>the list?
12:16<SpComb>do you mean the 1/2/3 servers?
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12:18<SpComb>hmm... Stop works fine on my servers
12:18<SpComb>what happens after you hit Stop?
12:18<Ammler>yeah, I can stop them
12:18<Ammler>but maybe after some days
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12:18<Ammler>I find them on the list and have to stop them an other time
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12:19<Ammler>and how to delete?
12:19<SpComb>I recently changed it such that stopping a server should cause it to not start up anymore
12:19<SpComb>there's no way to delete servers, you can only stop them
12:19<Ammler>ah, ok
12:19<Ammler>maybe last time I stopped, was before your changes
12:20<SpComb>Logs: (old: )
12:20<Ammler>^^ Do you host that?
12:20<Ammler>Possible you could add #openttdcoop there?
12:21<Wolf01>Channel not online: AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'getHighestFlag' «
12:22<Wolf01>i really like this log :D
12:23<Wolf01>uhm.. i should enable javascript sometimes
12:24<Wolf01>(but the error is there)
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12:28<UnderBuilder>what is wwottdg?
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12:31<Progman>world wide ottd game
12:33<Ammler>join #wwottdgd
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12:40<UnderBuilder>what is is? a openttd mod?
12:41<+glx>they raised the client limit
12:41<UnderBuilder>but not the company limit
12:42<UnderBuilder>will be hard to raise it to 16?
12:43<UnderBuilder>(16 = total number of CC
12:43<+glx>may lack of free space in map
12:43<+glx>but I didn't check
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12:51<Ammler>hmm, I guess the limit of companies is much harder, then the limit I patched.
12:51<Ammler>was only changing a constant
12:52<+glx>client number is just a memory thing :)
12:54<Ammler>YouTube link == Ban <-- serious?
12:54<bruce89>try it and find out
12:54<LionsPhil>Is bankrupcy supposed to actually sell off your assets, as the news report claims?
12:55<Ammler>I am wondering which movie was the source to make this rule
12:55<SpComb>Logs: (old: )
12:55<LionsPhil>Might just have been influx of "hey dudes check out this cool vid" ;)
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12:56<bruce89>Ammler: probably
12:56<Ammler>but sometimes I say really nice videos here
12:56<Ammler>releated to trains specially
12:56<UnderBuilder> :)
12:57<bruce89>you've done it now
12:57<LionsPhil>Good job it's not triggered automagically by the bot.
12:57<bruce89>now there's an idea
12:57<UnderBuilder>noone understands my sense of humour
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: miham * r11267 /trunk/src/lang/ (5 files):
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-10-15 19:58:13
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 1 fixed by fukumori (1)
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: bulgarian - 12 fixed by thetitan (12)
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: norwegian_bokmal - 118 fixed, 32 changed by jhsoby (150)
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: swedish - 1 fixed by ChrillDeVille (1)
12:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: ukrainian - 22 changed by mad (22)
12:59<Sacro>@kick UnderBuilder posting youtube links
12:59<Sacro>aww :(
13:00<bruce89>@lastseen Belugas
13:03<UnderBuilder>heh the wwottdgd binary's version is
13:04<Ammler>oh, only this Rabigram
13:04<bruce89>@seen Belugas
13:04<@DorpsGek>bruce89: Belugas was last seen in #openttd 3 hours, 13 minutes, and 46 seconds ago: <Belugas> only sharing plus both written in Delphi
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13:21<Wolf01>[information] i finished the curved road tiles for the brickland
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13:32<Sacro>[information] i want some tea
13:33<boekabar2>Sacro: via DCC ok?
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13:33<Sacro>boekabart: i like this idea
13:33<Sionide>gutsy is niiice
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13:36<CIA-5>OpenTTD: belugas * r11268 /trunk/src/industry_cmd.cpp: -Fix[FS#1336]: Call IsSlopeRefused whenever it is required. Looks like there was one spot missing. Thanks frosch
13:40<@Belugas>bruce89, you requesst re-opening of FS1331 can yu expand?
13:40<bruce89>there is no music on start now
13:41<@Belugas>can you activate the music afterward?
13:42<bruce89>yes, when playing, there is music
13:42<bruce89>just the main screen on first start has none
13:44<@Belugas>ll check tonigh
13:44<@Belugas>anyone that confirms/infirms this?
13:46<Wolf01>i can hear the music only during play
13:47<Wolf01>or when i return to main title
13:47<Wolf01>but not when i run openttd
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13:58<bruce89>how do I build a debug version?
13:58<Noldo>./configure --help
13:59<Noldo>don't remember the exact syntax so you should check it
13:59<bruce89>./configure --enable-debug
13:59<@Belugas>bruce89, i cannot reopen fs1331. i fear you should open a new one (which would make sens since it's not the same bug) or wait for Rubidium to be online
13:59<Noldo>add =3
14:00<bruce89>Belugas: right
14:00<bruce89>Noldo: likeeise
14:02<bruce89>Belugas: 1339
14:02<@Belugas>i've seen
14:03<@Belugas>it is shown on #openttd.notice
14:07<SmatZ>bruce89: do you have this problem on both windows and linux?
14:07<bruce89>I don't know about the no music problem
14:07<bruce89>certainly the old random music one was on both
14:12<bruce89>looking at
14:12<bruce89>in the else, it only resets the music, it doesn't play it
14:12<SmatZ>music doesn't work for me under linux...
14:12<SmatZ>and I have this problems for so long time
14:13<SmatZ>do I even forgot I could report this bug
14:14<peterbrett>The sound & music are annoying anyway
14:14<peterbrett>I always use the null sound device *shrug*
14:16<SmatZ>I like the sounds
14:16<SmatZ>escpecially trains
14:16<SmatZ>but the music - maybe is something wrong in my system
14:17<+glx>do you have timidity++ installed?
14:17<SmatZ>yes, and timidity use flag
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14:26<SmatZ>how can I use timidity ?
14:26<SmatZ>I see only
14:27<SmatZ>./openttd -m
14:27<SmatZ>extmidi: External MIDI Driver ; null: Null Music Driver\
14:27<+glx>extmidi is set in cfg
14:28<SmatZ>what is 'extmidi'?
14:29<+glx>the external midi program, like timidity :)
14:29<SmatZ>thanks :)
14:31<SmatZ>it plays the music
14:31<SmatZ>but I cannot hear music in ottd
14:31<SmatZ>looks like ottd problem...
14:31[~]Sacro fancies pizza
14:33<bruce89>I've done a bit of investigation
14:34<bruce89>ResetMusic() is called a huge number of times on first start
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14:37<Digitalfox>I don't understand much about codecs and encodings of videos.. But i just convert an 178MB AVI ( codec divx 5.0 ) to a 111MB AVI ( codec Xvid 6.0 ) and i don't see loss on image quality.. Is this normal shouldn't i see some image quality loss??
14:37<Rubidium>Digitalfox: there is image quality loss, *but*
14:38<Rubidium>computers usually display about 16 million colours
14:38<Rubidium>humans can only distinguish about 2 million colours
14:38<Rubidium>computers (or rather the displays) cannot display all of those 2 million colours
14:39<bruce89>there will be a loss if you recompress an already compressed file
14:39<Rubidium>and the image is moving, so you won't notice small changes either
14:39<Digitalfox>Oh ok Rubidium i never thought about that point, and it does have logic.. So i guess i may reencode my videos collections.. If i gain 65MB on a file, then on GB of videos i'll win also GB of space :)
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14:42<UnderBuilder>hehe I remember that I managed to run ottd on a p1 with 32mb of ram
14:43<SmatZ>I was running TTD on 486/33 with 8MB :)
14:43<SmatZ>bruce89: nice investigation
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14:43<bruce89>really, it's only 2 printfs
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14:44<SmatZ>but you was the first to do that 2 printfs :)
14:46<bruce89>now all I need to do is fix it
14:46<Sacro>we should s/^/printf $linenumber;/
14:46<Sacro>that'd be useful for debugging
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14:53<bruce89>_game_mode is 0
14:54<bruce89>which it should be
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14:55<+glx>yes it's the menu :)
14:56<SmatZ>glx: are you using Linux and music is working for you?
14:57<+glx>SmatZ: I'm not using linux
14:58<bruce89>what's msf.playing supposed to be
14:59<+glx>a bool
14:59<CIA-5>OpenTTD: rubidium * r11269 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): -Feature: user customisable faces. Patch by BigBB.
14:59<bruce89>is it supposed to be true when starting
15:01<Wolf01>yeah, faces patch
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15:05<Sacro>oh noes, a Bjarni
15:06[~]Wolf01 hides
15:06[~]Bjarni hides
15:07[~]Prof_Frink sees Wolf01
15:07[~]Prof_Frink sees Bjarni
15:07<@Bjarni>you can't see me
15:07<@Bjarni>I'm hiding
15:08[~]Prof_Frink awaits the inevitable
15:08<Wolf01>uhm, assertion failed on faces.h
15:08<@Bjarni>Prof_Frink: why did you wait for that?
15:09<Prof_Frink>You haven't kicked me...
15:09<@Bjarni>why should I do that?
15:09<Prof_Frink>Well, it would effectively hide you from me.
15:09[~]Rubidium slaps Wolf01... you should've tested it more!
15:09<Rubidium>before I committed it ;)
15:10<Prof_Frink>Now, you have so socially engineer me to type /ignore Bjarni
15:10<Prof_Frink>Except, as we know, engineers are not social creatures
15:10<@Bjarni>then you haven't met me
15:11<Prof_Frink>Yes, engineers, as a rule, don't sing very loudly, very badly in Scottish pubs.
15:11<@Bjarni>well, some engineers aren't really social, but it's not a general thing
15:11<@Bjarni>well, I don't go to Scottish pubs
15:11<@Bjarni>and I don't sing very loudly either
15:12<@Bjarni>so I guess you have a point
15:12<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: I take it you've heard the joke "What's the difference between an introvert engineer and an extrovert engineer?"
15:12<@Bjarni>but then again wouldn't it be bad to declare how engineers are based on a single engineer?
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15:13<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: But to solve that, you'd have to find a group of engineers
15:14<@Bjarni>actually I haven't
15:14<Wolf01>for what unknown reason exists the face setting variable on openttd.cfg?
15:15<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: An introvert engineer looks at his feet when talking to you. An extrovert engineer looks at *your* feet.
15:16<@Bjarni>I don't look at feet
15:16<SmatZ>bruce89: I found, where the problem is for me - I can use one of sound or music, but not both of them
15:16<Wolf01>the error is:
15:16<Wolf01>assert: /foo/bar/player_face.h, line 102, val < _pf_info[pfv].valid_values[ge]
15:17<+glx>SmatZ: use a sound "server"
15:17<bruce89>SmatZ: I was working on a different problem
15:17<SmatZ>glx: what is that?
15:17<bruce89>the fact that music doesn't start on OpenTTD starting
15:17<SmatZ>bruce89: ah, yes...
15:17<Wolf01>it occurs on new game generation, but not every time
15:17<@Bjarni>SmatZ: known issue on certain issues. I can't remember how to solve it though, but it looks like glx knows
15:18<Wolf01>so i think is caused of a randome face generated on new game
15:18<@Bjarni>it has something to do with not allowing more than one app to talk to the sound card or something like that
15:18<+glx>there are some program to "share" a sound device
15:18<SmatZ>Bjarni: most likely my system has some problems ... it happened some time ago, and I cannot use two programs with sound output :-/
15:18<SmatZ>glx: thanks, I will try to solve it
15:19<+glx>esd is one of them
15:19<bruce89>got it
15:19<SmatZ>glx: what about alsa or oss?
15:19<SmatZ>and arts?
15:19<+glx>arts is a bitch :)
15:19<+glx>never worked for me
15:20<SmatZ>it doesn't work for me neither :)
15:20<Rubidium>Wolf01: can't reproduce it with like 20 tries
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15:23<bruce89>should the music change when you go into a game from the menu?
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15:25<SmatZ>bruce89: it should start to play random/first song of your playlist
15:25<SmatZ>as I remember from TTD
15:26<SmatZ>openttd: /mnt/svn/openttd/trunk/src/player_face.h:102: void SetPlayerFaceBits(PlayerFace&, PlayerFaceVariable, GenderEthnicity, uint): Assertion `val < _pf_info[pfv].valid_values[ge]' failed.
15:26<Wolf01>Rubidium, tried on debug?
15:26<SmatZ>after loading first savegame I come to...
15:26<SmatZ>do you want that save?
15:27<Rubidium>Wolf01: I virtually never run without debug
15:28<Wolf01> this is my cfg
15:28<SmatZ>Rubidium: try to load this game, it crashes
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15:30<SmatZ>buggy patches are accepted, but my are not :-/ that really decreases my mood
15:30<Wolf01>s/buggy/popular :P
15:31<Rubidium>SmatZ: as if every one of your patches has been absolutely bug free...
15:33<CIA-5>OpenTTD: rubidium * r11270 /trunk/src/players.cpp: -Fix (r11269): black people only have one eye colour.
15:33<Prof_Frink>SmatZ: Reread the Patch Acceptance regs
15:33<Prof_Frink>Specifically the "Sexual favours" section
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15:37<skidd13>Hi again
15:38<Wolf01>hi skidd13
15:39<skidd13>I asked earlier today but didn't get any satisfying answer. Am I able to set defines by Configure or Makefile? (I'm thinking of the mersenne twister)
15:40<Rubidium>yes, via CFLAGS you are
15:40<Rubidium>but I wonder why you want to use mersenne
15:41<skidd13>Rubidium: Why not. I like to try "hidden" parts of OTTD. ;) How is the syntax for the CFLAGS stuff?
15:42<Rubidium>either after ./configure or make
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15:44<skidd13>Rubidium: Checked the update of the update of FS1338?
15:45<skidd13>Hmm one update too much :(
15:45<Wolf01>Rubidium, it continues to assert
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15:48<Rubidium>Wolf01, rule 1: make it easily reproducable for a dev, or easy to see where changes are needed.
15:49<Prof_Frink>Hmm, does Rule 34 apply to openttd?
15:49<CIA-5>OpenTTD: rubidium * r11271 /trunk/src/oldloader.cpp: -Fix [FS#1333]: some (very) old games (TTD original scenarios for example) would give a new vehicle spree, even though the vehicles were introduced decades ago.
15:49<Eddi|zuHause2><Progman> can you confirm this? If you buy and engine and add a waggon which supports different cargos the "change cargo type" button get not updated (only half by a MarkDirty call from the money raising in the trains viewport) <- i can confirm that
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15:49<Wolf01>more easy than this... it asserts every sin(3*pi) mod 5 times i try to make a new random game
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15:50<mcbane>yes eddi it happens.
15:50<Rubidium>every 0 times?
15:50<Wolf01>i put an odd function
15:51<SmatZ>is OTTD supposed to load all old ttdpatch games?
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15:51<Wolf01>but i think that one of the four kinds of faces trigger the assertion
15:51<TrueBrain>SmatZ: load: yes; load correct: not yet
15:52<SmatZ>TrueBrain: ok... I am having an assert for some games... maybe the problem is somewhere else, too... openttd: /mnt/svn/openttd/trunk/src/oldpool.h:113: T* OldMemoryPool<T>::Get(uint) const [with T = Vehicle]: Assertion `index < this->GetSize()' failed.
15:55<Rubidium>SmatZ: line 1234 of oldloader.cpp I presume?
15:56<dihedral>can i anywhere find text on what the aim of noai is and what still needs doing?
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15:56<SmatZ>Rubidium: I am recompiling... maybe I used ttdalter for these games, too
15:57<Rubidium>dihedral: ?
15:57<bruce89>Ben_1: something funny has happened
15:58<Ben_1>bruce89: whats that then?
15:58<bruce89>your name
15:58<dihedral>thanks Rubidium
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16:02<SmatZ>Rubidium: yes, 1234 ... is it because of multiheaded trains?
16:02<dihedral>Rubidium: that is documentation on how to write an ai using squirrel
16:02<dihedral>i was more interested in finding out what still needs doing
16:02<Rubidium>SmatZ: no, more TTDPs "lot of vehicles" thingy
16:03<Rubidium>by default a few hundred vehicles are allocated, but now it needs more and by accident a vehicle references to another vehicle with a way higher index.
16:04<SmatZ>Rubidium: so the number of "vehicle arrays" was not stored in ttdpatch games?
16:06<Rubidium>I've got no idea
16:06<Rubidium>does solve it?
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16:17<SmatZ>Rubidium: looks so
16:17<SmatZ>GetVehiclePoolSize() <= _old_next_ptr
16:17<SmatZ>except this direction of comparison
16:17<SmatZ>I was trying other savegames
16:17<SmatZ>I had only 61 trains
16:17<SmatZ>so if I didn't lose some after loading
16:21<SmatZ>but probably not a 'perfect' patch
16:22<SmatZ>one train seem to be missing its tail
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16:23<Ailure>r11265 maedhros 2007-10-14 23:20:12 +0200 (Sun, 14 Oct 2007) 2 lines
16:23<Ailure>-Feature: Make more advanced rail types more expensive to build.
16:23<Ailure>by how much though
16:23<DaleStan>SmatZ, Rubidium: It is. It's even so documented in the savegame bible:
16:25<Ailure>was just gonna compare ingame
16:25<Ailure>I guess monorail is inbetween :P
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16:26<Ailure>so now there's fnally a cost diffrence between regular and electrical railway
16:27<Ailure>thaht was something I always thought was silly
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16:27<@Bjarni>'s%20Car%20Theft%20Pevention%201000.jpg <-- that's most likely the most efficient car thief protection that I have ever seen
16:27<SmatZ>DaleStan: nice piece of text :)
16:27<@Bjarni>but... how do you get out? :)
16:27<Ailure>using a tesla coil
16:28<Ailure>...I think that's a tesla coil at least
16:28<Ailure>bit hard to see
16:28<@Bjarni>it is
16:28<@Bjarni>hint: the domain name is "tesla down under", so it's a tesla coil guy in Australia
16:28<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: Not really
16:28<Ailure>it so remind sme about the idea of a forcefield
16:28<Prof_Frink>A couple of Prism Tanks and *boom*
16:28<Ailure>excpet it's probably not strong enough to stop bullets
16:29<Ailure>living things however :)
16:29<@Bjarni>Prof_Frink: usually this will scare away car thiefs.... they know shit about electricity
16:29<Prof_Frink>Or, indeed...
16:29<Ailure>it reminds me about a car in a bond movie actually
16:29<Prof_Frink>KIROV REPORTING
16:29<Ailure>which zapped some people who tried to mess with Bond's car
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16:30<Prof_Frink>What was he doing with a German car anyway??
16:30<skidd13>I remember a guy in mexico who added a few flamethrowers to his car to protect him against robbery.
16:30<Ailure>the car is basically a faraway cage
16:31<Prof_Frink>skidd13: Was South Africa iirc
16:31<skidd13>Could be
16:31<Ailure>although the bolts only seem to touch the car on the front
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16:34<@Bjarni> <-- this is the guy who owns the car
16:34<@Bjarni>maybe he should find a safer hobby...
16:35<Ailure>After seeing that picture, I don't think it's a hobby anymore
16:35<Ailure>it's a fetish of his
16:35<@Bjarni>good point
16:35<Prof_Frink>DO WANT.
16:35<@Bjarni>find a safer fetish then :P
16:37<Sacro>i want a tesla coil
16:38<Prof_Frink>Sacro: See, I'm in two minds.
16:38<Ailure>mountain climbing maybe?
16:38<Ailure>Where I live
16:38<Ailure>there's always some danish falling down the mountains
16:38<Prof_Frink>Tesla coil... railgun... tesla coil... railgun...
16:38<Ailure>at Kullaberg
16:38<Ailure>which is north of Höganäs
16:38<@Bjarni> <--- o_O
16:38<Ailure>almost became a little joke within our family
16:39<@Bjarni>now I go for the fetish explanation
16:39<Ailure>that must sting
16:39<@Bjarni>"Wetting my hand beforehand reduces the sensation to a mild prickle"
16:39<Prof_Frink>Ailure: Not as much as...
16:39<Sacro>oh aye ;)
16:40<@Bjarni><Sacro> i want a tesla coil <-- no there is no doubt that it's a fetish thing
16:40[~]Prof_Frink wants to build a railgun and mount it on a hovercraft
16:41<@Bjarni>but it's already full of eels...
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16:41<Prof_Frink>Shoot stuff and run away at the same time!
16:41<Sacro>a nailgun would be good against a hovercraft
16:41<skidd13>Once we build a cheap railgun in physics lesson :). Shoot range was 1m.
16:41<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: That's the power supply
16:41<Sacro>or maybe it'd just go PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT and accelerate away
16:42<@Bjarni>yeah a modern nailgun is likely better than a modern railgun against a hovercraft :D
16:43<@Bjarni> <-- nice camera setup... this is done with colour filters while exposing the picture. It's not modified at all after the picture is taken (or so he claims)
16:44<Prof_Frink>He should build another personcage
16:44<Prof_Frink>then he'd have a ZOMG MIND CONTROL DEVICE
16:44<@Bjarni>it's some sort of spinning wheel with glass of different colours in front of the lens... gives a nice result
16:45<@Bjarni>yeah... we should write an Email telling him to do a mind control picture
16:45<@Bjarni>but.... it's possible that he can't get anybody to join him in his fetish :P
16:45<+glx><Ailure> the car is basically a faraway cage <-- Faraday
16:45<@Bjarni>far away cage.... not really the same as a Faraday cage :D
16:49<Prof_Frink>Bjarni: Well, if he wants to sends me plane tickets
16:49<Eddi|zuHause2>far far away?
16:49<Eddi|zuHause2>like in shrek?
16:49<bruce89>it is pretty far away
16:51<Eddi|zuHause2>what's funny about that movie is that "Schreck" is actually a german word (meaning "scare")
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16:57<@Bjarni>Eddi|zuHause2: and you don't think they knew that when they decided on that name for a scary character?
16:57<Eddi|zuHause2>Bjarni: i think they explained once that they took the word from jiddish, which has a lot in common with german
16:57|-|KouDy [~KouDy@] has quit [Quit: Trillian (]
16:58<Eddi|zuHause2>so yes, i am pretty sure they knew what the word meant :p
16:59<skidd13>damn wrong window
16:59<Eddi|zuHause2>you trying to touch your nose with your tongue?
16:59|-|SmatZ [] has joined #openttd
17:00<@Bjarni>I think he wants to quit vim or something
17:00<skidd13>yup: quit in vim
17:00<skidd13>:%s /\://g
17:00<Eddi|zuHause2>would have made a poor smilie anyway :p
17:01|-|dihedral [] has quit [Quit: cu]
17:01<Eddi|zuHause2>(and of course i know how you quit vim)
17:01<Prof_Frink>Ah, but do you know how to quit ed?
17:02<Eddi|zuHause2>what he said :p
17:02<Ailure>[23:40] <Sacro> or maybe it'd just go PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT and accelerate away
17:02<Ailure>my mind inserted a 0x before PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT
17:02<Ailure>then I started to wonder when hexdecimal numbers had P and T
17:02<bruce89>sudo rm -fr /
17:02<Sacro>Ailure: that's not valid HEX :p
17:02<bruce89>bloody silly
17:03<Eddi|zuHause2>you want to read mail really fast? type rm -rf /
17:04<Ailure>that so reminds me when I set up a box of some NIX
17:04<Ailure>and I let friends of mine log into it
17:04<Ailure>one of them tried rm -rf /
17:05<Ailure>didn't really do much damage though :)
17:05<@Bjarni>I don't think so
17:05<Ailure>I don't give out root randomly
17:05<@Bjarni>that would have caused damage
17:05<Ailure>he thought he would
17:05<@Bjarni>this is a reason why I don't give out ssh access to random people
17:05<bruce89>it would just kill out their ~ surely
17:05<Ailure>it wasn't a exactly bright NIX user
17:05<Ailure>he thought it would delete all files
17:06<Ailure>he actiually complained
17:06<Ailure>about it not working
17:06<Ailure>he didn't have many files in his own home folder
17:06<Ailure>so yeah :P
17:07<Prof_Frink>Hmm, you should write a script that, if someone tries rm -rf / it removes them from /etc/passwd and logs them out
17:07<Ailure>well hardly foolproof
17:07<Ailure>since there's more than one way
17:07<Ailure>you can just go down to root
17:08<Ailure>and type rm -rf * instead
17:08<Prof_Frink>or dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/hda
17:09<bruce89>or sda of course
17:09<Ailure>filling the harddrive with random bytes
17:09<Ailure>I seen variations on that
17:09<Prof_Frink>or, for nondestructive annoyance, chmod -R -x /
17:10<Phazorx>if if not all tiles of foodplant
17:10<Phazorx>that accept grain also accept livestock is that normal?
17:10[~]Prof_Frink smiles. :(){ :|:& };:
17:11<SpComb>grab a and try it out
17:12<SpComb>/dev/kmem is kind of amusing in sick way
17:12<bruce89>bugger, too late
17:12|-|BigBB_afk changed nick to BigBB
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17:14<SpComb>a virtual linux box, root access and at least 20 minutes
17:14<SpComb>you even have network access
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17:15<Eddi|zuHause2>Prof_Frink: what's the point? you just grab the next knoppix cd, and restor all the x'es
17:16<SpComb>all the right x'es
17:16<Eddi|zuHause2>well, all the ones in a "bin" directoryy
17:16<skidd13>and all dir x'es of cause
17:17<SpComb>and all of the other random x'es in e.g. /etc/init.d/ or such
17:17<SpComb>it would cause a bit of pain
17:17<Sacro>Ailure: as we pointed out to a uni lecturer rm -fr / won't do much
17:17<Eddi|zuHause2>you can easily walk all files beginning with #!
17:17<Sacro>or will it remove all files and just leave dirs
17:18[~]Sacro ponders over his putty window
17:18<SmatZ>\rm -rf /
17:18<Ailure>won't do much? :P
17:18<SmatZ>would be nicer, if you have rm aliased
17:18<Sacro>/exec rm -rf /
17:18<Prof_Frink>Or fix enough for your package manager to run, then reinstall from there
17:18<Ailure>last time I tried it, I destroyed the system :)
17:18<Ailure>well I ran it from root
17:18<Ailure>and it was a vm too
17:18<Ailure>so I didn't really care too much
17:18[~]Sacro forkbombs
17:19<Prof_Frink>How smiley.
17:19[~]SpComb plays with
17:19<SmatZ>dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/hda bs=512 count=1024
17:19[~]Sacro forkbums pro
17:19[~]Sacro forkbums Prof_Frink
17:19<SmatZ>will do the job, too
17:19<Ailure>it's even more fun with Windows though
17:19<Sacro>dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/core
17:19<Eddi|zuHause2>that'll be fun... replace ldd with rm -rf /
17:19<Ailure>I keep forgetting the windows equilant of rm -rf though
17:19|-|UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:19<Ailure>but it's much slower in Windows
17:20<Sacro>Ailure: deltree
17:20<Eddi|zuHause2>good luck installing any package :p
17:20<Prof_Frink>Ailure: del /F /S /Q *
17:20<Ailure>not deltree
17:20<Eddi|zuHause2>deltree /y
17:20|-|UnderBuilder_ changed nick to UnderBuilder
17:20<Ailure>deltree dosen't exist in Windows
17:20<Ailure>ah yes
17:20<Ailure>Windows NT
17:20<Ailure>that is
17:20<Ailure>it exists in Win 9x
17:20<Sacro>del doesn't exist in windows either
17:20<@Bjarni>I don't get it
17:20<Sacro>nooo ><
17:20<@Bjarni>why not solve the real problem
17:20<Sacro>deltree is dos 6.2x
17:20<Ailure>Which Win 9x is based on yeah
17:20<@Bjarni>why delete files rather than go buy a bigger HD?
17:21<Ailure>Win 9X is basically DOS hacked to run with GUI ;)
17:21[~]Sacro fancies some simsig
17:21<SmatZ>once I had 6 IDE ports used...
17:21<Prof_Frink>and Win ME is basically Win 9x hacked not to run.
17:21<SmatZ>there is no way to buy more HDDs forever
17:21<Eddi|zuHause2>i never had 6 ide ports (in the same computer)
17:21<Tefad>someone using archlinux?
17:22|-|Digitalfox [] has quit [Quit: Bye]
17:23<Ailure>I only seen one computer
17:23<Ailure>to run Windows ME
17:24[~]Prof_Frink shows Ailure his parents PC
17:24|-|mcbane [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:24<Ailure>hell I can name lots of other OS's
17:24<Ailure>I seen more of than Windwos me
17:24<Prof_Frink>Also, James' PC runs ME2.0
17:24<Ailure>and also weird OS's
17:24<Ailure>Win NT 4.0 on a ATM?
17:25<Ailure>or what about OS WARP?
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17:25<Ailure>that's is probably one of the funniest experiences I had at a bank
17:25<Ailure>I was going to withdraw money
17:25<Ailure>I walked up to the ATM
17:25<Ailure>...which showed Win 4.0 GUI
17:25<Ailure>that is
17:25<Tefad>heh. yay kiosks?
17:26<Ailure>I probably would try if I could mess around lol
17:26<Ailure>but it's hard with the keypad of an ATM
17:26|-|Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:26<Eddi|zuHause2>i had a scary meeting with an ATM also
17:26<Tefad>where's ctrl alt or del ; )
17:26<Prof_Frink>Ailure: Undo the four screws to the right
17:26<bruce89>I didn't think Windows needed hacking to not run
17:26<Prof_Frink>Tefad: See ^
17:26<Eddi|zuHause2>i wanted to check my bank account, put my card in
17:26<Eddi|zuHause2>the terminal said something like "internal error"
17:26|-|Vikthor [~Vikthor@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
17:26<Eddi|zuHause2>and rebooted
17:26<Tefad>nice one
17:27<Eddi|zuHause2>showing a Win2k boot screen
17:27<SmatZ>what happened to the card?
17:27<Eddi|zuHause2>still having my card in it
17:27<Ailure>I remember seeing Win NT 4.0 booting screen
17:27<Ailure>on the same ATM
17:27<Ailure>at another time though
17:27<Eddi|zuHause2>well, it spit it out after a while
17:27<Tefad>winnt is rather common for embedded crap
17:27<Ailure>I'm really not sure
17:27<Tefad>or OS/2
17:27<Ailure>if I should trust the bank using Win NT
17:27<Ailure>for embedded stuff
17:27<Ailure>sometimes they apparently run really old computers on that stuff
17:28<Ailure>but I wonder why they don't use specialized stuff
17:28<Eddi|zuHause2>i don't think the terminal is really embedded
17:28<Tefad>uh yeah.. P166 32MB for the win
17:28<Ailure>I can program a ATM quickly on a microcontroller
17:28<Eddi|zuHause2>i mean it has a keyboard to type in bank transfer data and stuff
17:28<Ailure>it would be more power-saving and secure
17:28<Tefad>Ailure: easy upgrade path?
17:28<Ailure>than programmig a Win NT application
17:28<Tefad>as if they'd use it
17:28<Prof_Frink>Or, go up to the machine, withdraw £10 and stuff a knoppix disc into the cash dispenser
17:28<SpComb> hmm... why would dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/ubd/0 kill my ssh connection?
17:28<Eddi|zuHause2>i'm pretty sure it runs a normal x68 PC inside it
17:28<Tefad>easy development ; )
17:29<Ailure>ATM's usually use old computers
17:29<Ailure>since they don't need anything more powerful
17:29<Eddi|zuHause2>the sad thing, the terminal is missing the most important keys to use windows :p
17:29<Ailure>sometimes refurbished even
17:29<Ailure>cheap bastards
17:29<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause2: CTRL+ALT+DELETE, indeed
17:29<Prof_Frink>Tefad: How do you know what hardware I'm running?
17:30<Eddi|zuHause2>it'd be so fun to see them catch anyone playing solitaire on a bank terminal :p
17:30<Ailure>whenever someone asks about my hardware
17:30<Ailure>I just point them there
17:30<Ailure>haha yes
17:30<Tefad>Prof_Frink: huh?
17:30<Ailure>sadly that would get them so nto trouble
17:30<Ailure>and argh
17:30<Ailure>ignore my network devices
17:30<Ailure>some bug always causes it to have screwy values
17:30<SmatZ>Ailure: nice
17:30<Prof_Frink>Tefad: "P166 32MB"
17:30<Tefad>what about it
17:31<Ailure>Device Received Sent Err/Drop
17:31<Ailure>NVIDIA nForce Networking Controller - Packet Scheduler Miniport 1.67 GB -240136.01 KB 0/0
17:31[~]SpComb tries again
17:31<Ailure>I sent a negative amount of bytes
17:31<Prof_Frink>That's what "this" computer is.
17:31<SmatZ>you have DL > UL
17:31<SmatZ>mm no
17:31<Ailure>the stats are way off too
17:31<Ailure>I have downloaded much more than easily
17:32<Ailure>*thna that
17:32<SmatZ>RX bytes:5242383144 (4999.5 Mb)
17:32<Ailure>so it probably have rolled over a few times
17:32<SmatZ>5000th anniversary coming :)
17:32<TrueBrain> Aug '07 194,970 MB | 1,558,276 MB | 1,753,246 MB
17:32<TrueBrain> Sep '07 17,592,186,002,452 MB | 17,592,185,515,890 MB | 35,184,371,518,343 MB
17:32<TrueBrain> Oct '07 128,948 MB | 1,279,165 MB | 1,408,113 MB
17:33<TrueBrain>talking about bugs in stats collectors
17:33<SmatZ>nice traffic at September
17:33<SmatZ>anyway... 1,5TB is a lot, too
17:33<Tefad>holy son of a
17:33<Ailure>did you download the whole internet
17:33<Tefad>he downloaded an internet.
17:33<TrueBrain>haha, okay, but the 1.5 is real :p
17:34<Prof_Frink>What happened? Get /.ed?
17:34<Tefad>i think i've got 1.25TB transfer since may on home connection
17:34<Ailure>terabytes is getting more and more common
17:34<Ailure>once upon a time, a gigabyte was actually alot
17:34<TrueBrain>what happened? a 100 mbit, that happened :p Never give students 100 mbit connections
17:34<TrueBrain>bad for bandwidth
17:35<Tefad>i remember my first computer upgrade
17:35<Ailure>so what did you do
17:35<Tefad>1.6GB addon
17:35<Ailure>download 10 movies at once or something
17:35<Tefad>8MB RAM was killing me too though
17:35<Ailure>my first computer upgrade
17:35<Ailure>was a harddrive around that size
17:35<TrueBrain>Ailure: you need more then 10 movies to get this volume of bandwidth :p
17:35<Ailure>boy it felt like a huge improvment from my measly 300 MB drive
17:35<Tefad>sadly i think my two first disks are near death
17:35<bruce89>hope you've got a 64 bit OS there
17:35<Tefad>400MB first disk here
17:35<TrueBrain>/dev/sdb1 298G 241G 58G 81% /data/extern
17:35<TrueBrain>/dev/sdc1 466G 418G 48G 90% /data/extern2
17:35<TrueBrain>/dev/sdd1 466G 124G 343G 27% /data/extern3
17:36<TrueBrain>nuff said
17:36<Tefad>pentium 60MHz woo
17:36<SmatZ>/dev/hde1 196015808 115221152 80794656 59% /mnt/200gb
17:36<SmatZ>/dev/hdg1 288451232 278109776 10341456 97% /mnt/300gb
17:36<SmatZ>/dev/hdc1 480719088 248254596 232464492 52% /mnt/500gb
17:36<TrueBrain>SmatZ: run -h
17:36<TrueBrain>easier to read
17:36<TrueBrain>anyway, night
17:37<Tefad>i use -xtmpfs -h for good measure
17:37<Tefad>silly udev shm nonsense
17:37<Prof_Frink>/dev/hda2 28G 12G 15G 45% /
17:37<Prof_Frink>/dev/hda1 89M 9.7M 74M 12% /boot
17:37<Sacro>*coughs* sad
17:38|-|gfldex [] has joined #openttd
17:38<skidd13>good night
17:38<Ailure>I already showed my discs earlier with my system utility
17:38<Ailure>really need to get around migrating to Linux
17:38|-|skidd13 [] has left #openttd []
17:38<Ailure>already did that on my laptop really
17:39<SmatZ>Distro Name Microsoft Windows XP Professional
17:39<SmatZ>errr :-D
17:39<Ailure>I really have no excuse staying with Windows anymore
17:39<Ailure>I didn't notice that earlier
17:39<Ailure>but it's a bit Linux-biased utility I guess
17:39<SmatZ>looks so
17:40<Ailure>like how it refers the discs as "mounted filesystems"
17:40<Prof_Frink>Dammit, refused uplink to the umcr
17:40<Ailure>which even is correct, mount is something Windows NT would avoid to use ;
17:42<Tefad>Ailure: if you like ubuntu, you can easily give it a whir using "Wubi" installer
17:42<Tefad>whirl? whir meh
17:42<Ailure>I know about Wubi heh
17:43<Ailure>seems intresting, but perfomance concerns me
17:43<Sacro>Tefad: why the arch q?
17:43<Ailure>still, I am slightly afraid of repartioning
17:43<Tefad>Sacro: just to make you worry.
17:43<Sacro>Tefad: i don't worry
17:43<Ailure>even if I succefully did that on my laptop
17:43<Sacro>i be happy
17:43[~]Prof_Frink bed
17:43<Tefad>Ailure: wubi doesn't suffer much from performance
17:43<Sacro>not too many pax trains at 00:30 :(
17:43<Tefad>it's like maybe 5% overhead if that
17:43<Prof_Frink>o it properly!
17:43<Ailure>kinda funny how it works though
17:43<Ailure>it creates a virtual disk image within Windows
17:44<Tefad>you can even access your windows files easily from within ubuntu
17:44<Ailure>then boots from that
17:44<Tefad>using ntfs-3g
17:44<Ailure>the inbuilt NTFS driver in Ubuntu
17:44|-|gfldex_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:44<Ailure>is read-only by default, but there's other you can get
17:44<Tefad>ntfs-3g is quite stable, i think it's even possible to use it as rootfs in linux
17:44<bruce89>which gusty has by default
17:44<bruce89>Tefad: no
17:44<Ailure>like ntfs-3g
17:44<Tefad>bruce89: i think so. initrd.
17:45<bruce89>symbolic links wouldn't work in NTFS anyway
17:45<bruce89>it'd be a bit daft
17:45<Tefad>i use them all the time at work
17:45<Sacro>bruce89: ntfs *has* symbolic links
17:45<Tefad>with SFU
17:45<Ailure>I thought it have symlinks
17:45<bruce89>it does now
17:45<Ailure>it's not widely known
17:45<Sacro>since... XP i belive
17:45<SmatZ>I wonder how I can redirect ONE HTML file to another computer in the network..
17:45<Sacro>bruce89: has for ages
17:45<Ailure>reason they implemented symlinks
17:45<bruce89>I was sure it was a Vista thing
17:46<Ailure>was mostly for POSIX complience
17:46<bruce89>anyway, permissions wouldn't work
17:46<Tefad>aka Interix, aka Services for UNIX, or Subsystem for Unix Applications
17:46<Sacro>oh, no
17:46<Ailure>since it's rather hidden away from most WIndows users
17:46<bruce89>the installer wouldn't let you install on a NTFS partition
17:46<Sacro>they had "junction points" since ntfs 3
17:46<Ailure>the commandline in Windwos isn't exactly nice
17:46<+glx><SmatZ> <-- nice link ;)
17:46<Ailure>so I didn't know about it for the longest time either
17:46<Ailure>ah yes
17:47<Ailure>that bastard
17:47<Tefad>cygwin is crap compared to SFU : \
17:47<Ailure>I DDoS him at times
17:47<Ailure>but he always manage to counter-attack
17:47<Tefad>meh, i guess Interix is the generic term
17:47<Tefad>(OpenNT Interix SFU SUA .. erghaspdoflkajsd)
17:48<Tefad>bruce89: permissions work fine.. NTFS has ACLs
17:48<bruce89>try installing a Linux on NTFS then
17:48|-|egladil [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:48<bruce89>there would be no advantage, if it were possible
17:49<Sacro>oh god
17:49<Sacro>this train is actually an engineering trains
17:49<Tefad>actually NTFS performs better than ext3 : \
17:49<Sacro>that hogs the line for 4 hours D:
17:49|-|egladil [] has joined #openttd
17:49<Tefad>and is competitive with other linux FSs
17:50<SmatZ>glx this is a better link :) sadly, it is "offline"
17:50<Ailure>NTFS isn't exactly a bad filesystem
17:50<Ailure>it just have a bad OS inbetween ;)
17:50<bruce89>WUBI looks like a nasty hack to me
17:50<Ailure>I think WUBI is a neat hack
17:50<Tefad>Wubi is an unofficial ubuntu installer
17:50<Ailure>File I/O in Windows is a bit slow
17:51<Ailure>but it seems to be becuse of Windows itself
17:51<Ailure>than NTFS
17:51<Ailure>batch tasks
17:51<Ailure>takes lots longer time in Windows
17:51<Ailure>than Linux
17:51[~]bruce89 formats drive to NTFS
17:51[~]Tefad laughs
17:51<Tefad>there are some corner cases to watch out for
17:52<Tefad>most of the time they rear their head when the FS is near capacity
17:52<Tefad>heads, meh
17:52<Ailure>rear head?
17:52<Tefad>rear heads.
17:52<Tefad>uh meaning pop up
17:52<Ailure>heads as in?
17:52<Tefad>it's an expression
17:52<Ailure>HD heads?
17:53<Ailure>never heard of that one D:
17:53<Tefad>to rear a head
17:53<Tefad>to pop up
17:53[~]Tefad shrugs
17:53<bruce89>rears ugly head
17:53<+glx>it's faster for me to compile openttd in vmware running mandriva64 on XP than using mingw :)
17:53<bruce89>of course
17:53<Tefad>glx: that's a threadding problem i think
17:53<Tefad>use SFU instead ; )
17:53|-|Stoffe [] has joined #openttd
17:53<Tefad>damnit, interix.
17:54<Ailure>NTFS-3G will be useful
17:54<Ailure>hell I gotta get around using it on my laptop
17:54<+glx>Tefad: I'd say it's a windows problem :)
17:54<Ailure>kinda sucks with my NTFS parittions being read-only
17:54<Tefad>glx: well you're not using the accepted UNIX environment for the platform.
17:54<Tefad>you're going to run into problems : )
17:54<Tefad>not saying that interix is the end all be all, but it performs rather well
17:57<Tefad>i think you can compile mingw under interix, then use it to create binaries from there
17:57[~]bruce89 thinks there are too many *ixs
17:57<Tefad>i think there isn't a proper OS yet.
17:58<Tefad>and there probably will never be
17:58<Tefad>the POSIX standard is nice to have though
17:58<+glx>well I don't make win32 builds in the VM :)
17:58<Ailure>Most operating systems are based on POSIX
17:58<Ailure>Even Win NT
17:58<Ailure>although it's probably the one being the most diffrent from it
17:58<Tefad>most operating systems were designed with posix in mind, maybe
17:58<+glx>NT miss a lot of POSIX stuff
17:58<Tefad>glx: interix fixes that
17:58<Ailure>Windows NT only did enough to cover the most obligatory stuf
17:59|-|Bjarni [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:59<Tefad>bare minimum to statisfy government contracts requiring posix compliant OS...
18:00<Ailure>stupid how goverments can be fooled so easily
18:00<Ailure>any UNIX user
18:00<Ailure>can see right away that Win NT is hardly anything like POSIX for the most part
18:00<Tefad>POSIX != UNIX
18:00<Ailure>I know
18:00<Ailure>but heh
18:00<Ailure>It derives so much that it's almost useless
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18:16|-|Sacro` changed nick to Sacro
18:38<Eddi|zuHause2>err... i believe i found a time warp or something
18:38<Eddi|zuHause2>the steel mill is converting steel from ore that has not been fully unloaded yet
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18:42<SmatZ>the iron ore was duped_
18:45<Eddi|zuHause2>no, it's just counted when the train arrives, not when it actually unloads
18:45<SmatZ>sometimes trains don't unload whole cargo, because it stops being accepted
18:45<SmatZ>but earns the money
18:45<SmatZ>i think
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19:00<Eddi|zuHause2>money is earned at the first unload step
19:00<Eddi|zuHause2>every subsequent unload step (even if the train leaves the station and arrives again) is "free"
19:01<Eddi|zuHause2>and i go to bed
19:02<SmatZ>I thought about cargo
19:03<SmatZ>better go to bed, I am so tired :-x
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19:36<CIA-5>OpenTTD: belugas * r11272 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Truncate text describing the grf file in the NewGrf settings gui
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19:47<Grey>sleep now. night.
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20:26<_Ben_>Sacro: you may be interested...middlesbrough overtook hull finally. >
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21:04<huma>how can i see the effect of "funding new buildings" in town?
21:07<bruce89>with your eyes
21:08<Ailure>haha oh my
21:08<Ailure>that picture is classic
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---Logclosed Tue Oct 16 00:00:32 2007