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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-07-06

---Logopened Sun Jul 06 00:01:00 2008
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03:54<ccfreak2k>Are there any forum mods or admins on that can edit my posts?
03:55<ccfreak2k>Oh hold on.
03:56<ccfreak2k>I wasn't logged in.
03:57<Alberth>that may help :)
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04:02<Wolf01>hello
04:03<ccfreak2k>Is there a strike-through bb code tag?
04:03<Eddi|zuHause3>probably ;)
04:04<Eddi|zuHause3>in most cases, these tags are the same as the html tags
04:04<hylje>mock html
04:05<ccfreak2k>No dice.
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04:18<Eddi|zuHause3>no quack.
04:18<Gekz>\_x<
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04:28<Mchl_>good moaning
04:29<Mirrakor>moin
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04:56<Noldo>ok, missing cursor is a bit problematic
05:01<@peter1138>use a 32bpp cursor ;)
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06:22<blathijs>Noldo: Huh? Empty graphic files?
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06:43<Ammler>blathijs: he might want to check, what's already done from OpenGFX :-)
06:44<blathijs>OpenGFX? I'm completely blank about what you guys are talking about :-)
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06:44<Ammler>:-P
06:45<Ammler>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=38122
06:48<blathijs>Ammler: cool :-)
06:51<@peter1138>people who try to make graphics but then give up
06:53-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
06:54<Ammler>well, parts like terrain and houses are nice already.
06:59<Ammler>I do not like signals and fences that much...
07:03<@Rubidium>that terrain is depressing; it's imo way too gray
07:06<hylje>realism
07:07<@Rubidium>true, as it always rains in the UK
07:07-!-Yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd
07:08<blathijs>hehe
07:09<CIA-3>OpenTTD: rubidium * r13678 /trunk/src/ (openttd.cpp vehicle.cpp vehicle_base.h): -Fix (r13677): electric trains from pre elrail savegames would get stopped on load.
07:09<hylje>lighting effects should be there for grayish/realistic terrain to be useful
07:10<hylje>so the places of interest are light up and therefore more saturated
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07:17<Ammler>[13:03] <Rubidium> that terrain is depressing; it's imo way too gray <-- that is a general problem of zephyris graphics...
07:18<Mchl>Zeph's GFX? too gray?
07:18<Mchl>no way
07:18<Ammler>check the farm
07:18<Mchl>I like'em this way
07:19<hylje>think the gfx are Free enough for someone to saturate them up
07:20<Mchl>just let me know, so that I can make copies of originals :P
07:20<Ammler>that's why we began to keep copy of almost every version :-P
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07:37<joachim>sparks should follow the train :)
07:39<Doorslammer|BRSet>I hate to ask what part of a realistic train network that would be :P
07:41<Yorick>would orudge mind if I copy his background.gif background?
07:41<Yorick>the tiled-one
07:45<Doorslammer|BRSet>Cat say why he would object
07:45<Doorslammer|BRSet>Swap cat for can' ;)t
07:45<Doorslammer|BRSet>Bollocks
07:45<Doorslammer|BRSet>Can't
07:45<Doorslammer|BRSet>;)
07:46<Doorslammer|BRSet>Phew
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07:57<@orudge>Yorick: ooh, well, I dunno
07:58<@orudge>you'll have to pay a very large fee first :P
07:58<@orudge>and then bow down to the moon every night before you go to bed
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07:58<Yorick>http://www.tt-forums.net/styles/ott/theme/images/background.gif
07:58<@orudge>also, something like that is available on every rubbishy GeoCities fan site since 1996 or so
07:58<@orudge>so yes, you can use it I imagine
07:59<Yorick>ok :)
07:59<Yorick>can I sell it too?
07:59<@orudge>well, legally, no, it's Simon Foster's work
07:59<Yorick>ok :)
07:59<Yorick>it's rather a screenshot of simon fosters work
08:01<@orudge>well, no
08:01<@orudge>hmm
08:01<@orudge>well
08:01<@orudge>I guess it's not technically located in the GRF files like that
08:01<@orudge>but anyway.
08:01<Noldo>blathijs: I made them my self, replaced all sprites in the original graphicfiles with complately transparent ones
08:04<Noldo>hmm, maybe I could use 32bpp gui
08:05<@peter1138>just don't use the old landscape generator...
08:06<Noldo>why?
08:06<blathijs>Noldo: And why would I have those?
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08:09<Noldo>blathijs: because I remember you making them some year back
08:11<Noldo>I'm trying to find out how to make openttd playable without the original graphics
08:15<SmatZ>Noldo: start with removing old terrain generator
08:17<blathijs>Noldo: Interesting, I don't have that memory :-p
08:18<SmatZ>mmm peter1138 already mentioned that
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08:58<Mchl>how is 'old terrain generator' related to playing without original grfs?
09:01<SmatZ>it has stored data as sprites
09:02<Mchl>in its code?
09:03<SmatZ>the old terrain generator loads sprites 4845-4881 and uses them as data/"program" for generating terrain
09:04<SmatZ>I haven't tried changing those sprites, but if they were different, the old generator wouldn't probably work well
09:04<Mchl>i see
09:04<SmatZ>or could crash etc
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09:09<ArmEagle>those 32bpp sprites look great (just tried the zoom exec)
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09:17<ArmEagle>..of course, then you're soon wanting more.. smoother turning of vehicles..
09:17<Mchl>some already want this
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09:43<ArmEagle>those new trains and wagons look great!
09:45<Yorick>the transparent ones?
09:46<ArmEagle>the one in the topleft here http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/32bpp_Extra_Zoom_Levels (Train.tar)
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10:02<Yorick>yeah
10:03<Yorick>but that graphics haven't been updated for a while
10:03<Yorick>and only one train's there
10:03<Yorick>sloped tracks are also mising
10:03<ArmEagle>2 i think. and a lot of wagons.
10:03<ArmEagle>yeah they are :)
10:03<Yorick>all wagons ae done
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10:10<ArmEagle>I only want to zoom in even further now :)
10:11<Cyclonerotary>new gfx?
10:11<Cyclonerotary>for openttd?
10:13<ArmEagle>yes
10:14<Cyclonerotary>available for all?
10:17<ArmEagle>http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/32bpp_Extra_Zoom_Levels
10:17<ArmEagle>or more general: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Graphics_Development
10:17<Cyclonerotary>thanks for the link
10:18<Cyclonerotary>is the 8bpp the best that can be suported now?
10:18<ArmEagle>depends on what you mean by best.
10:19<ArmEagle>I hope people just manage to work together
10:20<Cyclonerotary>looking good
10:22<Cyclonerotary>wow they look very nice indeed
10:33-!-karq [~karq@88-196-20-172-dsl.hps.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
10:33<karq>hey all
10:35<Yorick>hey, what's your question?
10:48<karq>got a answer from your page :D
10:49<karq>had problems with heavy load
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11:48<Alberth>Is the History tab in Flyspray supposed to be missing?
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12:00<fjb>Helli
12:01<Alberth>it's quite quiet here
12:03-!-ecke [~ecke@213.195.230.1] has joined #openttd
12:12<fjb>Psssssssst
12:13<Alberth>as long as you type quiet, nobody will notice
12:13<Alberth>s/quiet/quietly/
12:19<Yorick>quiet
12:19<Yorick>it doesn't work
12:19<hylje>/what/ doesn't work?
12:21<Yorick>ooh, it does!
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12:37<tneo>hi
12:42<fjb>Pssssssst. We are silent today.
12:46<tneo>so I notice, I'll bug you guys later then ;-)
12:46<hylje>did someone say something tneo?
12:47<tneo>I haven't asked yet and now I'm off for dinner and some other activities I'll be back later :)
13:00<Sacro>"other activities" eh
13:00<Sacro>nudge nudge wink wink
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13:05<smithj>hi guys
13:07<fjb>Pssssssst. We are silent today.
13:08<smithj>:P
13:09<smithj>Can someone explain how to convert a BMP to a GRF? I have looked on google and found various drawing links, but none on coversion
13:14-!-nekx [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
13:15<fjb>Look for grfcodec.
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13:16<smithj>thanks
13:16<peens>DCC SEND "startkeylogger" 0 0 0
13:18<fjb>What is that? A pseudoworm?
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13:28<Eddi|zuHause3>that hasn't worked in years :p
13:30<smithj>ok, I have GRF codec, but now it wants an NFO
13:30<smithj>?
13:30<bowman>and even then it didn't work for anyone other than those already infested with the norton brand of malware :) beyond redemption
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13:31<Prof_Frink>smithj: GRF file contain more than just images
13:32<Eddi|zuHause3>smithj: in the NFO you tell the game how to use the images
13:32<Eddi|zuHause3>smithj: look for the NFO tutorial
13:35<smithj>ok thanks
13:35<fjb>http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=NewGraphicsSpecs
13:38-!-energetic [~chatzilla@ip82-139-116-235.lijbrandt.net] has joined #openttd
13:38<energetic>hehe
13:39<energetic>hey all
13:39<energetic>I have this new idea for openttd, its called ACE
13:39<Eddi|zuHause3>what's there to laugh about?
13:39<energetic>Yorick laughs at my n00bie IRC skills
13:39<energetic>>}
13:39<Eddi|zuHause3>that is possibly justified ;)
13:40<energetic>it is :)
13:40<Sacro>2 men are in a boat, /part and /quit... /part falls over the side, who is left in the boat?
13:40<Eddi|zuHause3>/quit
13:40<Prof_Frink>/quit
13:40<Sacro>how clever
13:40<Eddi|zuHause3>i have never seen this actually work :p
13:40<Yorick>/quit
13:40<energetic>is that a standard n00b question?
13:40<Yorick>no, you're supposed to say /quit
13:41<Eddi|zuHause3>no, because no n00b answered it
13:41<energetic>and then i am kicked :)
13:41<energetic>by myself :)
13:41<Eddi|zuHause3>no, you are definitely not kicked
13:41<Prof_Frink>Nope, no kickery involved
13:41<energetic>or i quit myself
13:41<Eddi|zuHause3>you'll never know
13:41<Yorick>he tried mIrc first...but he managed to hide the menubar
13:41<Yorick>and the button to get it back
13:41<energetic>yup
13:41<Eddi|zuHause3>that sounds funny ;)
13:42<energetic>but that was after I realized Opera 9.51 crashes with irc links
13:42<+glx>to be kicked it's !something
13:42<Yorick>!something ?
13:42<energetic>anyway, idea "ACE"
13:42<energetic>--> Advanced Construction Engine
13:42-!-Zahl [~Zahl@f051109126.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd
13:42<energetic>prerequisite: templates can be send as one command to server
13:43<+glx>Yorick: I didn't want to give the full list
13:43<Mirrakor>Eddi|zuHause3: just ask it in Quakenet
13:43<Yorick>!password
13:43<Mirrakor>it works
13:43-!-Yorick was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Wrong channel. Retry in #openttdcoop.]
13:43-!-Yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd
13:43<energetic>someone makes a template, thinks its interesting, he can click a button "upload"
13:43<Eddi|zuHause3>i'd suggest the suggestions forum, but no important person actually reads that :p
13:43<energetic>then it gets uploaded to a server
13:44<energetic>where a database of templates exist
13:44<Yorick>energetic: and how did you get the template to the server?
13:44<energetic>via a webservice
13:44<Eddi|zuHause3>yay webservice :p
13:44<energetic>on the website, ppl rate templates
13:44-!-valhalla1w [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd
13:44<Yorick>that's where it goes from fine to unincludable :)
13:44<Eddi|zuHause3>let's reimplement multiplayer via webservices ;)
13:44<energetic>why?
13:44<energetic>no
13:45<energetic>since all communication is done by xml
13:45<Eddi|zuHause3>let's reimplement the GUI via webservices :)
13:45<SpComb>and rewrite the OpenTTD server as a set of PHP script and a MySQL database!
13:45<energetic>I would be able toi just put a bunch of XML files in the /templates folder
13:45*SpComb has never understood how copy-paste can be useful except in some bizarre corner cases
13:45<Eddi|zuHause3>let's store the PHP scripts in the MySQL database!
13:45<Prof_Frink>Let's rewrite openttd in a single line of perl!
13:45<SpComb>Eddi|zuHause3: even better
13:45<Yorick>urgh..xml
13:46<energetic>then in openttd, an interface should be made
13:46<energetic>stations/lines/junctions/specials
13:46<energetic>where when I click on stations, I set another button to "ro-ro", and another to "right driving"
13:46<Yorick>and how did you get the template to the client?
13:47<energetic>And the interfcae filters all appropriate templates
13:47<Mirrakor>http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Preliminaries it's a real long meal... (bottom of the page)
13:47<Yorick>btw, some people are dead against templates
13:47<energetic>template can either be downloaded and put in the templates folder as xml file
13:47<Yorick>downloaded how?
13:47<energetic>by a webserive
13:47<energetic>webservice has about 3-4 methods
13:47<Yorick>webservice is not going to get in openttd
13:48<Yorick>someone said that
13:48<energetic>GetRecentTemplates(Date date)
13:48<Mirrakor>aren't there some templates/grf lists already?
13:48<energetic>I dont care, a SQL command works also
13:48<energetic>implementation is a detail (though an important one)
13:49<Yorick>yeah, I got an idea, we'll make openttd fly to all computers in the world
13:49<SpComb>and this is a solution to what problem? I'm probably one of those who thinks that OpenTTD doesn't need templates/copy-paste
13:49<energetic>now it will be fun to make huge networks on huge maps, with new types of goals
13:49<Yorick>but I haven't got an implementation for it
13:49<Yorick>but that's just a detail, right :)
13:49<energetic>we can make goals like
13:49<energetic>"transport 50% of passengers of each town"
13:50<energetic>or
13:50<energetic>"move at least 25K passengers a month"
13:50<SpComb>"fill up the whole map with identical junctions joined together in a grid consisting of 90° angles"?
13:50<Prof_Frink>I've got an even better idea
13:50<Yorick>ad this is a solution to what?
13:50-!-valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:50<Prof_Frink>It's a button marked "Build rail network"
13:50<Yorick>yeah
13:50<energetic>no
13:50<Yorick>and it turns on an AI
13:50<Yorick>that builds the whole rail network for you :)
13:50<Prof_Frink>You click it, an it instantly builds a full rail network to every town and industry.
13:50<energetic>for AI it wilkl be great
13:50<SpComb>Prof_Frink: a new game mode that has one AI player, and the human is just a spectator!
13:51<energetic>Servers can disable it
13:51<energetic>since it is a command
13:51<Yorick>but it's a solution to ...?
13:51<energetic>so we will be getting servers optimized for template building
13:51<energetic>its a new way of playing the game
13:51<energetic>goals + templates
13:51<energetic>goals can be much harder
13:51<Yorick>new ways of playing the game do not happen on remakes
13:52<Prof_Frink>Why do they need to be connected?
13:52<energetic>they do.
13:52<energetic>look at MEGA tracksharing
13:52<Prof_Frink>*Why* do they need to be connected?
13:52<energetic>look at Kurt's hard goal
13:52<energetic>*Why* do they need to be connected?
13:52<energetic>who is they?
13:53-!-Cyclonerotary [~pokerking@host86-139-255-56.range86-139.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:53<energetic>look at speedy Gonzalez
13:53<Prof_Frink>Having special goals and being able to copy all the hard bits without thinking
13:53<energetic>all servers with a goal, and they are quite populair
13:53<energetic>no
13:53<Yorick>NONE of this stuff is going to get into openttd
13:53<energetic>since it isnt easy to build a network which is very busy
13:54<energetic>even with templates
13:54<Prof_Frink>I'd say it's harder with templates
13:54<Yorick>that makes openttd fun
13:54<Prof_Frink>Especially in a hilly map
13:54<SpComb>energetic: and that "isn't easy" is exactly the challenge in the game, the reason that people play it
13:54<energetic>id say it is *different*
13:54<Yorick>it loses all the creative-requirements
13:54<energetic>no
13:54<SpComb>every junction is unique, hand-tailored with love to fit into the surroundings <3
13:54<energetic>templates arent always appliucable
13:54<energetic>low space, terraforming
13:55<SpComb>they are if you blow up a couple towns and level the map
13:55<Yorick>IT LOSES IT'S EDUCATIONAL PURPOSE!
13:55<Prof_Frink>SpComb: Well, love and some heavy earth-moving equipment
13:55<energetic>remember: when templates are implemented using one command at the server, that command can be switched off
13:55<energetic>I think it will strengthen it
13:55<Yorick>the copy-paste patch can be switched off currently
13:55<energetic>how many n00b players have ever build a 2x2 network, for excample?
13:55<Yorick>you can workaround the switch, yes
13:55<Yorick>energetic: that's because they're n00b
13:56<energetic>some players are never, ever going to build a 4x4 network
13:56<energetic>becuase they dont understand how it works, they dont understand presignals
13:56<SpComb>Prof_Frink: well, I try and avoid having to bribe the towns too often...
13:56<Yorick>there's no fun in learning the game if there is no challenge
13:56<energetic>There actually is
13:56<energetic>well
13:56*Yorick redirects energetic to the suggestions forum
13:57<energetic>:)
13:57<Prof_Frink>SpComb: I was thinking more "Mountain? >click< >click< What mountain?"
13:57<Yorick>they got DaleStan there
13:57<energetic>I already made up some UI's, did some research
13:57<energetic>I'll put in onto the suggestions wiki
13:57<energetic>then makie a forum post about it
13:57<energetic>explaining why it still is a challenge
13:58<energetic>and what other possibilities it opens up for openttd
13:58<energetic>anyway
13:58<Yorick>if you always build the same junction
13:58<energetic>I had this other idea
13:58<Yorick>are you ever gonna improve?
13:58<energetic>that isnt template specific
13:58<energetic>ppl can built the same old junction without templates
13:58<Yorick>it helps people doing that
13:58<energetic>over and over again
13:59<energetic>templates also:
13:59<energetic>get a template from another player who created it
13:59<energetic>and improve it
13:59-!-fjb [~frank@p5485E726.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:59<energetic>anyway
13:59<Yorick>you're essentially making the game too easy :)
13:59<energetic>this idea might be falling in better earth
13:59<Yorick>anyway
13:59<Yorick>the priosignal idea
14:00<Yorick>and I'm going away now :)
14:00<energetic>ah, another one
14:00-!-Yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!]
14:00<SpComb>energetic: as you've probably noticed, you're going to run into a lot of critisim on a fundamental level as regards that idea
14:00<energetic>there was a guy working on rdoing the presignal stuff, right?
14:00<energetic>yes
14:00<SpComb>but I'm sure it's all been discussed before in the copy-paste patch topics, not that I've ever read those
14:00<energetic>But I think I have some good arguments against them
14:01<energetic>Though it is a very legitimate argument.
14:01<energetic>I see lots of ppl (including myself) making a presignal priority setup
14:02<energetic>(three/four rails crossed, some presignals, and the ML has prio over SL)
14:02<energetic>why no make a new signal "priopresignal"?
14:02<energetic>if signal turns red
14:02<SpComb>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=25037
14:02<energetic>entry signal higher up on the railroad becomes red too
14:02<energetic>yeah i know that topic
14:03<energetic>read it
14:03<energetic>very simple to implement, I think
14:03<energetic>But i heard there is to be a signal revamp done by some devver, anyone knows if thats correct?
14:03<energetic>PBS?
14:03<SpComb>YAPP
14:03<Eddi|zuHause3>i'd suggest you go to thedailywtf.com and read up on the definition of "very simple" :p
14:04<energetic>ghehe
14:04<energetic>so with YAPP a priopresignal isnt necessary?
14:04<energetic>otherwise I'll try to implement it
14:05<energetic>http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2zhmf5h&s=3
14:05<Eddi|zuHause3>with yapp, you first throw overboard anything you think you know about signals
14:06<energetic>its the intelligent rail scheduler we've been waiting for the last 15 years?
14:06<Eddi|zuHause3>it's kinda when you had maths at school and when you go to university, you learn _real_ maths
14:06<SpComb>energetic: well, YAPP makes presignals obsolete at stations, and it also lets you build mainlines where faster trains can overtake slower ones
14:07<energetic>http://www.openttdcoop.org/blog/2008/02/06/yapp-yet-another-pbs-patch/
14:07<SpComb>(and as a side effect, makes single-track with passing loops sometimes do very weird things)
14:07<energetic>right
14:07<energetic>so it also gives speedier trains right of way on mainline...?
14:07<Prof_Frink>SpComb: So, the AI gets even brokeder
14:08<energetic>was thinking, for AI a template DB will be awesome btw
14:08<SpComb>(whereby one train first enters a passing loop, and then a second train behind the first one reserves a path via the "wrong way" track of that passing loop, and to the next one
14:08<energetic>ah
14:08<SpComb>so that the trains leap-frog over eachother, which probably makes the latency twice as large
14:08<energetic>awesome
14:08<SpComb>but that can be solved with one-way YAPP signals)
14:08<energetic>okay
14:09<energetic>is it reasonable to say that yapp will be included in the near future in the main branch?
14:09<Eddi|zuHause3>let's say it's not going to not get included :p
14:10<SpComb>hopefully not entirely impossible, although I haven't actually heard anything indicating that
14:10<energetic>why not?
14:10<SpComb>well, now I have
14:10<energetic>same argument as ACE?
14:10<energetic>--> makes playing too easy?
14:10<Eddi|zuHause3>you have miscounted the "not"s ;)
14:11<energetic>ghhe
14:11<smithj>Can someone check my "attempt" at graphics?
14:11<energetic>sure
14:11<smithj>I am trying to create the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_Rail_New_Measurement_Train
14:12<energetic>yes, read it...?
14:12<energetic>u wanna introduce rail mainteneance in openttd?
14:12<smithj>here is my 1st attempt, clone of the openttd 125: http://77.97.50.77/trg1r.bmp
14:13<smithj>no, i only want to create the train, for aesthetic purposes
14:13<energetic>ah k
14:13-!-Osai`off is now known as Osai
14:13<smithj>but my coding and drawing skills are how shall we say, primitive :)
14:13<energetic>loading photoshop, takes some time, no 16x SSD in RAID 0 yet...
14:14<energetic>looks promising
14:14<Prof_Frink>smithj: Suggestion: Use .png for putting stuff on the internets
14:14<energetic>though
14:14<energetic>internets?
14:14<energetic>I thought it was called
14:14<energetic>Interwebz
14:14<smithj>the intertubes wasnt it? ;)
14:14<energetic>:)
14:15<energetic>you created the whole train or only the head?
14:15-!-McHawk [~hawk@p5489DF2A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
14:15<energetic>since I think it is a special long trains
14:15<smithj>I ripped off the IC125 and coloured it
14:15<energetic>basically a loc with about 8 sections
14:15<smithj>first I want to get the train made, then update it
14:16<energetic>three power cars
14:16<energetic>some tech cars
14:16<Prof_Frink>http://xkcd.com/181/
14:16-!-Mirrakor [~linuser@p57B2C50A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:16<energetic>xkcd should make a comic of ridiculizing xkcd itself
14:17<smithj>I am now working on NFO. I dont see any need to change much info. However, I dont want to replace the 125, i want to add a new vehicle
14:17<smithj>so I need a new GRF ID
14:17<SpComb>energetic: there's some potential for that
14:17<hylje>parody strip
14:17<energetic>since I am getting spammed with that stuff
14:18<energetic>digg, slashdot, tweakers.net, TDW, all blogs, etc
14:18<energetic>standard first post on blogposts
14:18<Prof_Frink>It's Monroe's Law
14:18<energetic>which gets modded up, cuz its funny ( a link to an xkcd)
14:18<Prof_Frink>All geeky conversations will eventually refer to xkcd
14:19<energetic>:P
14:19<energetic>What about a login required for openttd servers
14:19<energetic>so its easiers to block out ppl we dont want on the servers
14:19<energetic>A standard login implementation might not be a bad idea
14:20<energetic>i mean...
14:20<energetic>kurt, openttdcoop, and some more servers all require it already
14:20<energetic>more ansd more servers are using it
14:21<SpComb>energetic: centralized authentication has been discussed already as well
14:21<SpComb>can't remember what the conclusion of that discussion was
14:22<SpComb>probably something along the lines of it not really making anon vandals go away
14:22<energetic>will work on ACE now
14:23<energetic>hopefully it gets implemnted somehwere in .8
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14:35<smithj>I have a GRF, but openttd cant see it
14:36<smithj>I tried to refresh the list, but it doesnt show
14:37<smithj>GRF HERE: http://77.97.50.77/flyingbanana.grf
14:49<KingJ>Any reasons why train replacement wouldn't be working?
14:49<KingJ>They go into the depot and just come back out again, no change
14:49<KingJ>Got plenty of money, set it to replace etc
14:50<tneo>heya when compiling (openSUSE 11, gnome) I get WARNING: no video driver found, building dedicated only
14:50<tneo>what do I do to fix that?
14:51<Eddi|zuHause3>tneo: install sdl-devel
14:52<tneo>oke Eddi|zuHause3 compiling again :)
14:52<Eddi|zuHause3>and if that doesn't qualify as an FAQ, i don't know what does ;)
14:53<tneo>I was in the ignorance that I had that installed already :-(
14:53<Eddi|zuHause3>sdl != sdl-devel
14:53<tneo>do you know what I need for libtimitdy as well ?
14:54<Eddi|zuHause3>no idea
14:54<Eddi|zuHause3>i never play with music
14:54<Eddi|zuHause3>i believe it is working here, but i have no idea what i did to enable that
14:55<tneo>well thanks, now it works again :)
14:55<KingJ>Any ideas on the replacement?
14:56-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:56<Eddi|zuHause3>KingJ: try to stop a train in the depot, and hit the replace button there
14:57<KingJ>Nothing happens
14:57<KingJ>No error, no change, nothing
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14:58<Eddi|zuHause3>what kind of replacement did you enable?
14:58<KingJ>Engines
14:59<Eddi|zuHause3>from what to what?
14:59<KingJ>Using the UK Renewal Train GRFs,from HST/Eurostar to Pendilino
14:59<KingJ>Electric rails are disabled
15:00<Eddi|zuHause3>using several connected EMUs?
15:00<KingJ>No, just the standard 1 engine (well, the GRFs show top and tail)
15:00<KingJ>and enough carriges so that it shows as 10 long in the depot
15:01<Eddi|zuHause3>using vehicle groups?
15:02<KingJ>Yes, but I just assigned it to All
15:03<Eddi|zuHause3>well, it could theoretically be failing because of the disable elrail switch, but i'm not in the position to check that
15:06-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00aacc.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
15:06<KingJ>I just made a new train, no carriges and replaced it fine
15:07<KingJ>Added some carridges, tried another replacement. Works too
15:07<KingJ>So why this replacement isn't working with the main trains, I don't know
15:09<Eddi|zuHause3>then it's probably related to the groups
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15:10<KingJ>And just made a new train of the exact type i'm replacing, and that replaced
15:10<KingJ>All the ones in the groups are clones
15:13<KingJ>how do you think it could be solved?
15:13<Eddi|zuHause3>groups have a button "exclude this group from replacing"
15:13<KingJ>Yeah, it dosen't have the shield icon visible
15:14<Eddi|zuHause3>what happens if you remove the train from the group and then replace it?
15:14<KingJ>Lets see
15:16<KingJ>Same effect
15:16-!-lauanana [~lauanana@ANantes-257-1-35-57.w90-25.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd
15:17<Eddi|zuHause3>then i can't help you anymore
15:17-!-lauanana [~lauanana@ANantes-257-1-35-57.w90-25.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [autokilled: Undesired bot. Mail support@oftc.net with questions (2008-07-06 19:17:27)]
15:18<smithj>I think the flying banana has a problem with the GRFID
15:19<smithj>has anyone got it to work?
15:19<KingJ>Hmm, thanks anyway
15:26<ccfreak2k>TiberiusTeng, you around?
15:26<TiberiusTeng>here yes
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15:30<Wolf01>'night
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15:31<ccfreak2k>TiberiusTeng, some fixes need to be made for the opengl patch.
15:31<TiberiusTeng>yes?
15:31-!-Purno [~Purno@5350931D.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:32<ccfreak2k>First,
15:32<ccfreak2k>I'm missing SDL_CALL for SDL_GL_* functions in my sdlgl driver.
15:32<ccfreak2k>In the initializing part.
15:32<ccfreak2k>Second,
15:32<ccfreak2k><glx> btw configure source.list is 'incorrect', it shouldn't compile GLee when opengl is disabled
15:32<ccfreak2k><glx> same for blitters/opengl
15:32<ccfreak2k><glx> or video/*gl
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15:33<TiberiusTeng>ahh, OK
15:33<ccfreak2k>Third, glx made some changes to sdlgl (in addition to the bugfix) that allows it to work in Windows, although it's slow. :)
15:33<ccfreak2k>I have the diff.
15:33<TiberiusTeng>that
15:33<TiberiusTeng>that's great!
15:34<TiberiusTeng>I'll fix source.list here
15:34-!-valhalla1w is now known as valhallasw
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15:35<ccfreak2k>http://ccfreak2k.loliserv.org/opengl_r13671_mingw.diff
15:35<ccfreak2k>It includes your dif, so apply this to a fresh checkout and diff against your current patch to see what changed.
15:36<TiberiusTeng>got it
15:37-!-lobster_MB [~michielbr@86.89.201.189] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
15:38<TiberiusTeng>is it including the SDL_CALL stuff you mentioned ?
15:40-!-Osai is now known as Osai`off
15:41<+glx>yes
15:41<TiberiusTeng>OK, I'm checking the diff ...
15:41<ccfreak2k>Yes, it does.
15:42-!-smithj [~smithj@77-97-50-77.cable.ubr03.cast.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit []
15:45<TiberiusTeng>how do I modify the source.list so that it do conditional compiling ?
15:45<TiberiusTeng>I don't quite know where those variables #if used comes ...
15:46<+glx>they are parsed in configure
15:46<+glx>and in projects/generate*
15:46<TiberiusTeng>got it
15:48<ccfreak2k>if [ $WITH_OPENGL -eq 1 ] then; WITH_WINGL32=1; fi
15:48<ccfreak2k>Or something like that.
15:48<energetic>funny
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16:01<TiberiusTeng>ok, I've finished modifying the code, will publish the new diff later :)
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16:13<TiberiusTeng>I've updated the patch in the thread.
16:14<ccfreak2k>VisualStudio users like myself will need to do some SDL dickery to compile sdlgl support in a win32 binary.
16:15-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:16<De_Ghosty>a patch that does?
16:16<ccfreak2k>Adds an opengl blitter.
16:16<ccfreak2k>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=38151&start=0&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
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16:19<TiberiusTeng>actually I'm also a Visual Studio user ... but I haven't compiled SDL part myself.
16:19<TiberiusTeng>ccfreak2k, you can try edit projects/*.vcproj.in
16:19<TiberiusTeng>they are templates used to generate actual project files ...
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16:23<ccfreak2k>TiberiusTeng, it was a matter of getting the SDL project files and adding them or something.
16:23<ccfreak2k>I forgot what it took.
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16:27<+glx>ccfreak2k: you just need sdl headers and add WITH_SDL in preprocessor defines
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17:43<ccfreak2k>TiberiusTeng, does enabling opengl require enabling SDL?
17:43<TiberiusTeng>no
17:43<TiberiusTeng>both --with-win32gl and --with-sdlgl implies OpenGL
17:44<ccfreak2k>sdlgl requires SDL tho.
17:44<ccfreak2k>As well.
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17:46<TiberiusTeng>if [ -n "$sdl_config" ] && [ "$with_sdlgl" = "1" ]; then
17:46<TiberiusTeng>something like this ... hmm
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17:51<adriano1991>hi all
17:51<adriano1991>y have server
17:52<adriano1991>server off = lost password all company
17:52<adriano1991>what is problem????
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17:53<Eddi|zuHause3>yes. certainly.
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18:20<DjIdee>hi guys! I started playing OpenTTD again (0.6.1) and was busy building stations. In my memories there was an option that when you build a station near an other already existing one (not directly connected, but within range of 7-8 tiles) and at the same time press a button, you get a list of nearby stations to which the new platform should belong.. Anyone knows the key to press for it?? (or was it only a nightlies feature (forgot what previous version i ha
18:21<Eddi|zuHause3>DjIdee: that was never an official feature
18:21<DjIdee>ah, that would explain a lot
18:21<Eddi|zuHause3>you have faint memories of the miniin i assume ;)
18:22<DjIdee>and would explain why i can't find anything about it on tt-forums/google/wiki etc (spent two hours searching now)
18:22<DjIdee>miniin, yeah, used those indeed :)
18:22<Eddi|zuHause3>it's around somewhere, called "distant-join-stations patch" or something
18:22<DjIdee>hmm
18:23<DjIdee>neh, not going to add, quite stable now :)
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18:23<DjIdee>going for the old busstationtrick then :)
18:23<DjIdee>to bad for the city (will cost some houses etc :) )
18:23<DjIdee>thanx Eddi|zuHause3
18:23<Eddi|zuHause3>you can build busstops on roads
18:24<DjIdee>ah,sure :)
18:24<DjIdee>good, got a workaround now :)
18:27<joachim>it's in the russian pack
18:27<joachim>wups
18:27<joachim>wasn't scrolled down
18:28<DjIdee>hehe
18:28<DjIdee>found the patch topic now also
18:28<DjIdee>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=30960
18:28<DjIdee>when you know where to search for :)
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19:06<Sacro>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZaxC02W95w <- mmmmmm
19:12<Cyclonerotary>why though?
19:12<Cyclonerotary>wouldnt a view out the window be better Sacro?
19:12<Sacro>Cyclonerotary: just the noise
19:13<Cyclonerotary>ah
19:13<Cyclonerotary>doesnt sound as nice as a deltic!
19:15<Sacro>that's the point :p
19:15<Cyclonerotary>oh
19:15<Cyclonerotary>so thats a bad noise?
19:15<Cyclonerotary>in that vid
19:15<Sacro>well
19:15<Sacro>they all sound shabby
19:15<Sacro>but that one i think has leprosy or somethign
19:16<Cyclonerotary>the groanin?
19:17<Cyclonerotary>cus the engine sounds dead sweet
19:18<Sacro>heh
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20:05<fjb>Hello
20:05<Chrill>allo
20:09<Cyclonerotary>hallo
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---Logclosed Mon Jul 07 00:00:45 2008