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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-07-07

---Logopened Mon Jul 07 00:00:45 2008
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04:30<Doorslammer|BRSet>Afternoon all
04:31<Vikthor>morning Doorslammer
04:31<Doorslammer|BRSet>You guys were right
04:31<Doorslammer|BRSet>That was some GP last night :D
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05:24<CIA-3>OpenTTD: rubidium * r13679 /trunk/src/ (economy.cpp economy_type.h oldloader.cpp): -Fix [FS#2131]: saving TTD imported games in recession failed due to wrong (and unneeded) type conversions in the saveload code.
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08:57<Yorick>I'm testing vista speech recognition
08:58<Yorick>dictation doesn't work on IRC :-<
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09:12-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
09:13<Yorick>it even inserts a sad face when I say "press happy face"
09:14-!-Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:20<Eddi|zuHause3>"I'm testing vista [...]" <- you poor soul
09:21<Gekz_>LOL
09:22<Forked>does it type "LOL" for you if you start laughing?
09:22<Gekz_>"Open parenthesis cat close parenthesis, NO YOU STUPID THING... no, I- stop listening."
09:24<Yorick>(cat)
09:25<Yorick>yeah, I started dictating that after you finished that line :)
09:25-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1CAEF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
09:29<Gekz_>lol
09:29-!-Belugas_Gone is now known as Belugas
09:33<Yorick>meh, I'm quite sure I wouldn't want to enable "dictate everywhere"
09:34-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:38<@Belugas>the air conditioner is broken
09:38<@Belugas>my arms are sticking on the desk
09:38<Yorick>Is it ?
09:38<@Belugas>it is
09:39<Yorick>I'm testing out speech recognition
09:39<Gekz_>http://www.muppetlabs.com/~breadbox/software/tiny/teensy.html
09:39<Gekz_>that's crazy
09:39<Yorick>Currently dictating that text :-)
09:43<Yorick>NORMAL: print(a + b)
09:43<Yorick>BLOATED: am = new math.ArithmeticManager(); opA = new math.Operand((float) a); opB = new math.Operand((float) b); am.addOperand(opA); am.addOperand(opB); am.operator = new math.operators.Addition(); am.executeMathOperation(); system.io.output.print(am.mathOperationResult())
09:43<Yorick>:)
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09:56<SmatZ>that's disguisting
10:01<Ammler>does someone know the admin of www.openttdserver.de
10:05<Yorick>or does someone happen to be it?
10:06<Ammler>as the stats tells, he is on the server :-)
10:06<Yorick>where?
10:06<Ammler>on his server
10:07<Yorick>And how is he called ?
10:08<Ammler>whois tells Thomas Fischer
10:08<Ammler>so I assume, he is Tom
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10:12<Yorick>go there :)
10:14<Yorick>Ammler: go there
10:15<Ammler>:-)
10:15<Ammler>I do not like ingame chat :-)
10:15<Yorick>he's distributing the grfpack, is that the problem?
10:15-!-archjb [arcane@gurumeditation.68k.no] has joined #openttd
10:16<Ammler>yeah.
10:17<Yorick>he'll remove the files, he says
10:21-!-ecke [~ecke@213.195.231.53] has joined #openttd
10:26-!-rortom [~rortom@p57B7FB1B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
10:26<rortom>hey yorick
10:26<rortom>openttdserver.de here
10:26<rortom>fixed the website :)
10:26<Yorick>?
10:27<Yorick>OK
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10:28<Yorick>Ammler: ^^
10:28<planetmaker>Thx rortom :)
10:28<Ammler>heya rortom, thanks for it
10:29<Ammler>rortom: you can still use the pack, just link to our wiki, so you will be sure to have the current version. ( www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/GRF )
10:29<rortom>sorry that i upload it
10:30<rortom>but it was fast to get it out to some users
10:30<rortom>you did very good work with the gfx pack :)
10:30<rortom>mh im searching for server tools
10:31<planetmaker>The download link is also always online :)
10:31<rortom>currently im using the autopilot and the openttdlib for stats
10:31<planetmaker>^ so do we :)
10:32<dih>hi
10:32<dih>you highlightes me :-P
10:32<planetmaker>hehe :)
10:33*dih has a highlight for openttdlib ;-)
10:33<+glx>silly ;)
10:33<rortom>oh dih nice to see you
10:33<dih>yes - very! :-P
10:33<rortom>wanted to say thanks for the nice software :D
10:33<dih>heh
10:33<dih>your welcome ;-)
10:33<rortom>mh i wanted to add some stats to it
10:34<rortom>with DB logging
10:34<dih>feel free
10:34<rortom>http://www.maani.us/xml_charts/index.php?menu=Gallery&submenu=Line
10:34<rortom>i hope i find some time :\
10:34<planetmaker>actually that'd be awesome :)
10:35<rortom>is it possible to get more infos from ottd?
10:35<dih>only what is described in the docs
10:35<rortom>mh what about a bot that joins as spectator?
10:36<dih>not done easily
10:36<rortom>mh yeah :\
10:36<dih>unless you patch the source, you will not get more info using openttdlib
10:36<rortom>yes i thought that would be the answer
10:36<Eddi|zuHause3>it should be easier to change the server source to generate some output
10:36<dih>yes
10:36<dih>it is
10:37<dih>you could combine the mysql logging from autopilot with details from openttdlib
10:37<Eddi|zuHause3>maybe you can hijack the NoAI interface ;)
10:37<rortom>the integration of the changes is the problem ;)
10:38<dih>well - based on the unique id you are kinda safe
10:39<rortom>no i mean if i write a patch for the server it will be diffucult to get it into the trunk
10:39<rortom>or i misunderstood you
10:39<dih>i was not saying it should go into trunk
10:39<dih>:-P
10:39<rortom>:p
10:39<rortom>mhm
10:39<rortom>is the protocol documented somewhere?
10:40<dih>of the udp packets?
10:40<rortom>i wrote a python client for the RoR game
10:40<dih>you mean the packet structure
10:40<rortom>yes
10:40<dih>well... you can read the c++ or php code
10:40<dih>SpComb has written that stuff in python
10:41<dih>for myottd.net
10:41<rortom>ah, nice :)
10:42<rortom>you know what source code file by chance? :|
10:42<dih>for ottd or ottdlib
10:42<rortom>ottd
10:42<rortom>got it
10:42<dih>src/network/core/udp.cpp i think
10:43<rortom>thx
10:43<rortom>mhm
10:43<rortom>i was also thinking
10:43-!-Singaporekid [~notme@cm158.epsilon121.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd
10:43<rortom>the server knows how everything looks like
10:43<rortom>so if you could add a simple bitblit interface
10:44<rortom>you could use something like google maps to navigate in real time in a map
10:44<rortom>it would only have to render 200x200 pixel boxes or so
10:44-!-DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-120-109-218.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
10:44<dih>the server does not know what things look like
10:44<dih>it has no drawing at all
10:44<rortom>:\
10:45<Eddi|zuHause3>you can enable it, afaik ;)
10:45<Yorick>Someone tried that
10:45<rortom>so far for that idea :p
10:45<Eddi|zuHause3>but that is basically wasted computer power
10:45<rortom>yes
10:45<dih>yes
10:45<dih>it used to render
10:45<rortom>so you could write a client and emulate that
10:45<dih>it might be easier to teach python how to read a sav game
10:46<dih>and give it the required graphics
10:46<dih>:-P
10:46<rortom>:p
10:46<rortom>that could be ;)
10:46<rortom>not much udp packet types
10:46<rortom>that sounds nice :)
10:47<Yorick>dih: afaik spcomb did that using screenshots with a google earth interface :p
10:47<dih>yep - he did
10:47<rortom>so that idea is also old :|
10:47<Yorick>you could make the server nondedicated...
10:47<rortom>nah ;)
10:47<Yorick>but then you have no way of controlling it
10:48<rortom>also
10:48<rortom>why is there no rcon tool for the server?
10:48*dih controlls his server with shell sciprts :-D
10:48<dih>rortom: there is...
10:48<dih>just you need to run it from inside the game
10:48<rortom>:p
10:49<dih>or use autopilot connected to an irc channel
10:49<rortom>yeah, nice software you wrote btw ;)
10:49<dih>autopilot is from Brianetta
10:49<rortom>oh, good to know :)
10:49<dih>i just write mods for it
10:49<Yorick>dih: I got a "bad packet size" on openttdlib some time ago
10:49<Yorick>refreshing page fixed it
10:50<rortom>uhm
10:50<rortom>is there a wireshark dissector for openttd?
10:50<dih>the ottd server was down (or not responding) but the port was not blocked on the server
10:50<dih>rortom: search the forums
10:50<rortom>ok
10:50<dih>there is something along those lines ;-)
10:50-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd
10:51<Yorick>dih: querying the server on same pc, but to an ip it wasn't bound to
10:51<rortom>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=32840&hilit=wireshark
10:51<rortom>wonderful D:
10:51<planetmaker>rortom: there's a patch for OpenTTD which allows modification of the usual patch settings via the patch settings GUI...
10:52<dih>Yorick: you get that packet when the server does not drop your packet but no ottd server is running there
10:52<dih>i.e. a response rather than a drop
10:52<rortom>so i will write my own :\
10:52<Yorick>planetmaker: ...
10:52<planetmaker>:) Yorick?
10:53<Yorick>some way that's a discription of my unfinished patch
10:53<planetmaker>:)
10:53<planetmaker>yeah, was just thinking wether it is already around somewhere else...
10:54<Yorick>atleast the "waiting for dih" status hasn't changed
10:54*Belugas has a plan to remove the word "patch" in ottd's code...
10:54<planetmaker>^^ good plan, Belugas :)
10:54<rortom>lol
10:54<blathijs>Belugas: Fine plan indeed :-)
10:55<@Belugas>:)
10:55<@Belugas>happy to see so many positive reactions :D
10:56<Yorick>good plan
10:56<Doorslammer|BRSet>:D
10:56<Yorick>but it will make every patch currently available outdated
10:56<Doorslammer|BRSet>D:
10:56<Doorslammer|BRSet>Bipolar smilie
10:57<planetmaker>For the sake of clearity of the code and dis-ambiguation that's acceptable, IMO :)
10:57<@Belugas>Yorick: so ? It's not the first time there has been patch killers commit...
10:57<@Belugas>what's important is trunk.
10:57-!-fjb [~frank@p5485C80C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
10:57<Yorick>yeah, the cpp branch too
10:57<fjb>Hello
10:58<Eddi|zuHause3>s/patch/p*tch/g
10:58<rortom>:p
11:00<rortom>mh but the server uses tcp for its stream?
11:00<dih>16:54 < Yorick> atleast the "waiting for dih" status hasn't changed
11:00<dih>it will continue
11:00*dih will not patch for wwottdgd
11:00<Yorick>?
11:01<Eddi|zuHause3>rortom: UDP is only used for the server list, every game aspect has to be reproducable exactly, so it uses TCP
11:01<rortom>thanks for clearify! :)
11:02<rortom>we think think about to use udp for RoR :\
11:02<rortom>via raknet
11:02<hylje>RoR?
11:02<hylje>Rise of Rome? Ruby on Rails?
11:02<dih>Roads of Rod?
11:02<rortom>http://rigsofrods.com
11:02<dih>rigs
11:02<Yorick>you should use some udpstack and such
11:02<rortom>our game :)
11:02<dih>that's the one
11:03<dih>17:00 < Yorick> ? <-- what?
11:03<Yorick>dih will not patch for wwottdgd <-- what?
11:03<dih>what word do you not understand?
11:03<Yorick>the reason
11:03<dih>i never mentioned one!
11:04<Yorick>that's why I don't understand it yet
11:04<dih>there is no reason you need to know
11:04<dih>as far as you are concerned there is only 'dih will not patch for wwottdgd'
11:05<Eddi|zuHause3>rortom: UDP is fine if you depend neither on completeness nor on order of packages
11:05<@Belugas>'cause dih CANNOT patch right ^_^
11:05*Belugas hides
11:05*dih chaces after Belugas
11:05<SpComb>rortom: http://dev.myottd.net/
11:05<MorgyN>what would open transport tychoon do, god damn?
11:06<dih>there is no open transport tyhoon
11:06<rortom>@ SpComb: thats what i wanted to create :D
11:06<dih>and no open transport tycoon
11:06<rortom>@ SpComb: sources?
11:07<SpComb>rortom: http://trac.meta.myottd.net/browser/trunk/test <-- that's the python side of things, I'm not sure where the OpentTTD patches are
11:07<SpComb>but they're against some ancient version of OpenTTD, and a real pain to try and maintain
11:07<rortom>D:
11:07-!-mikl [~mikl@cpe.ge-0-2-0-812.0x50c774be.boanqu1.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
11:07<rortom>thanks
11:08<SpComb>http://zapotekii.srv.myottd.net/~terom/openttd/openttd-binapi-20080307-0439.patch <-- there
11:08<@Belugas>dih : "chaSes" buwhahaha!!! can't even spell right :D
11:08<dih>SpComb: how about a scrolto option, where one can enter the same tile number as in openttd
11:08<SpComb>basically, it replaces the console on stdin/out with a binary protocol
11:08<SpComb>dih: meh
11:08<rortom>urgs @ workaround
11:08<dih>Belugas: i dont need spelling tips from someone who makes those mistakes at a dozon every day
11:08<dih>:-P
11:08<rortom>seems not to be a nice idea about the binary IO
11:09<Yorick>dih: stop bashing french people!
11:09<SpComb>rortom: well, if you're going to ship PNG screenshots around, there's not much else you can use
11:09*dih ads Yorick to the ignore list again
11:09<rortom>mhm
11:09<Yorick>"ads", hah, he spellt it wrong!
11:09<SpComb>but yes, the current OpenTTD console is really limited if you want to try and do funky stuff with it
11:09<rortom>what about a userspace pipe?
11:09<SpComb>using squirrel for it would make it a bit better, if the interface that it provided was improvied
11:10<SpComb>but then you'd also need some kind of UNIX socket inteface or such
11:10<rortom>thats what i would use
11:10<SpComb>but to do that sanely it would need to be part of trunk
11:10<rortom>yes
11:10<rortom>for that reason
11:10<rortom>i will try to write a client
11:10<rortom>and use its data
11:10<SpComb>I tried setting up some kind of conditional module compilation thing, but it would be a realy pain
11:10<SpComb>*real pain
11:10<rortom>oh, i believe that :\
11:11<dih>@kick yorick
11:11<dih>:-(
11:11<dih>:-P
11:11<rortom>so is the tcp stream documented somewhere?
11:11<dih>in the source
11:11<rortom>dont say code :|
11:11<SpComb>in the source code...
11:11<rortom>:p
11:11<@Belugas>lol at dih :D true, i make TYPOS :)
11:11<dih>:-P
11:11<Yorick>rortom: /src/network/network_client.cpp
11:11<dih>i do too
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11:12<Yorick>Belugas: @kick dih :-)
11:12-!-Mirrakor [~linuser@p57B2EADE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
11:12*Belugas hugs dih
11:12<dih>thanks Belugas
11:12<rortom>:|
11:12*dih pats rortom on the head
11:12<rortom>:\
11:13<rortom>mh you thought about using scripting in the server? :|
11:13*Belugas hugs rortom, he seems to be jealous...
11:13<rortom>i am integrating it into RoR currently
11:13<dih>:P
11:13<dih>rortom: squirrel?
11:13<dih>see the noai branch
11:13<SpComb>but myes, a console that uses some proper syntax and a better API to the internals would go a long way
11:13<rortom>ugh
11:13*rortom like python
11:13<dih>SpComb: ;-)
11:14<Yorick>dih: you weren't gonna patch for wwottdgd ;)
11:14<dih>WHAT IS YOU ISSUE
11:14<dih>just get out of my face!
11:14<dih>sheesh
11:14<rortom>world wide ottd group destruction?
11:14<Gekz_>you issue
11:14<Gekz_>go chinese man
11:14<Gekz_>go
11:14<SpComb>but I'm currently working on too many other projects to touch OpenTTD
11:14*rortom also :(
11:15<rortom>you old c hackers D:
11:15<SpComb>http://skrblz.fixme.fi:8117/ <-- 4000 lines of *.c code
11:15<rortom>all those precompiler abuse :|
11:15<Yorick>dih: yes, I wonder what is your issue with _me_
11:15<rortom>@ SpComb: thats indeed nice :D
11:15<dih>no
11:15<dih>it's not with _you_
11:15<dih>it's with _you users_
11:15<dih>;-P
11:15<SpComb>it's an exercise in building a service that should scale
11:16<MorgyN>damn users.
11:16<rortom>nice :D
11:16<rortom>self served? or webserver?
11:16<SpComb>currently I only have a single node with eight 2Ghz cores, and it can easily utilize that to 800%
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11:17<SpComb>but it can also scale to multiple physical nodes right now, and it's still got a long way to go to add caching and other things
11:17<Yorick>dih: what users?
11:17<SpComb>I use libevent's evhttp library for the web server part, although I'm going to need to more or less roll my own
11:17<rortom>very nice :)
11:17<SpComb>the evhttp API isn't all that great, and the code is a little bit of a mess
11:18<dih>17:17 < Yorick> dih: what users? <- those who always have the urge to continue asking questions!
11:18<SpComb>still, I clocked almost 10,000 req/s and over a hundred MB/s of traffic on static resources (/static/tiles.js), and that's with a million data copies
11:18<rortom>mhm ottd is a great example of non-existing documentation :|
11:18-!-snorre [~snorre@c51F045C1.dhcp.bluecom.no] has joined #openttd
11:18<Yorick>dih: still looking for a question you may find annoying...
11:18<dih>shut up
11:18<dih>:-P
11:19<rortom>so
11:19<rortom>has anyone a bit time to help me understand the protocol? :|
11:19<Yorick>I have time, yes
11:20<rortom>the tcpstream consists of CommandPacket ?
11:20<Yorick>dih: shut up...shutting up has never done anything good...
11:20<Yorick>if I have the knowledge...
11:20<SpComb>rortom: you're going to write a custom OpenTTD client from scratch?
11:20<rortom>yes
11:20<rortom>did that for RoR
11:21<rortom>so it must be do-able for ottd too ;)
11:21<Yorick>it has multiple packets for tcp
11:21<Yorick>one of those is the COMMAND_PACKET, yes
11:21*planetmaker wonders whether under those conditions it wouldn't be easier to modify the existing client...
11:21<Yorick>planetmaker: he doesn't need a WHOLE transport simulation
11:21<hylje>yay rortom !
11:22<rortom>http://rorserver.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/rorserver/trunk/python/client.py?view=markup
11:22<rortom>RoR client i wrote ^
11:22<hylje>interesting
11:23<@peter1138>rortom: you wrote a custom ror client from scratch? ;)
11:23<planetmaker>interesting indeed.
11:23<@peter1138>hm
11:24<@peter1138>shame ror is closed source really :o
11:24<@Belugas>out of curiosity, rortom, why? just... wanting to know
11:24<rortom>about the RoR client?
11:25<rortom>@peter1138: yes :\
11:26<@Belugas>rortom, no for Open
11:26<SpComb>rortom: and what functionality is the client supposed to have?
11:26<rortom>it can record clients
11:26<rortom>and play back
11:26<rortom>its a tool to stress test servers
11:26<Yorick>http://pastebin.com/m4039f0d4, a list of packet-types openttd knows
11:26-!-Cyclonerotary [~pokerking@host86-141-83-150.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
11:26<rortom>@ Belugas: if i write a custom ottd client, i can attach it to any server without modifying the sources in any way
11:27<Yorick>those with _SERVER_ are sent by the server, those with _CLIENT_ are sent by the client to the server
11:27<@Belugas>mmh..
11:27<@Belugas>ok
11:27<rortom>got it, thanks :)
11:27<rortom>mh so is each packet different from each other?
11:27<rortom>means the patyload?
11:28<rortom>funny
11:28<@peter1138>same format for each command packet, different data
11:28<rortom>the RoR and ottd protocol is very much the same ;)
11:28<@peter1138>everything after the initial connect and map download is with commands
11:29<rortom>ah, thanks :D
11:29<rortom>where can i find the initial connecct routine?
11:29<Yorick>in the code
11:29<Yorick>network_server.cpp
11:30-!-Singaporekid [~notme@cm158.epsilon121.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:31<rortom>DEF_SERVER_SEND_COMMAND(PACKET_SERVER_WELCOME)
11:31<rortom>i guess?
11:31<Yorick>hmm
11:31<Yorick>DEF_SERVER_RECEIVE_COMMAND(PACKET_CLIENT_COMPANY_INFO) it starts with
11:32<Yorick>that's the network lobby screen
11:33<rortom>ok
11:33<Yorick>server then sends back company data, and you can send a PACKET_CLIENT_JOIN
11:33<rortom>ah :D
11:34<rortom>so let me create a basic server to be able to do this :)
11:34<rortom>*client
11:34<Yorick>at least, I think that's what it does
11:34<rortom>oh, if you dont even know, then im lost :p
11:35<Yorick>hmm...it checks the NetworkClientInfo before the company_info point
11:36<rortom>:\
11:36<rortom>should we move to -dev?
11:36<Yorick>what?
11:37<rortom>my fault :)
11:37<rortom>blender had the -dev channel ;)
11:39<rortom>so everything is a struct packet?
11:40<Yorick>yeah, I think you should send a PACKET_CLIENT_COMPANY_INFO first
11:40<dih>you can go to #yorick.annoymenot
11:40<dih>:-P
11:40*dih pets yorick on the head
11:41<Yorick>dih: and how am I annoying today?
11:41<Gekz_>he's easily annoyed
11:41<Gekz_>I did it once
11:42<dih>:-P
11:42<dih>i am easily annoyed if i dont get enough sleep
11:42<rortom>@ Yorick: let me trace everything down ...
11:42<Yorick>it goes back into udp
11:43<Yorick>or not
11:43<Yorick>ah, I'm just guessing a bit
11:43<Yorick>NetworkReceive()
11:44<rortom>:|
11:44<rortom>ah
11:44<rortom>that seems to be the core receive
11:46<Yorick>network.cpp provides the start of the routing
11:46<Yorick>routine*
11:47<rortom>Packet *NetworkTCPSocketHandler::Recv_Packet(NetworkRecvStatus *status)
11:47<rortom>i think thats what the server uses
11:47<Yorick>possibly both server and client
11:48-!-GoneWacko [~gonewacko@adsl-58.35.Static.ssp.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:49<rortom>so
11:49<rortom>let me sum
11:49<rortom>up
11:49<rortom>everything is send above the Packet struct
11:50<rortom>so i must recode that first
11:51<rortom>so my question
11:51<rortom>is every command one packet or multiple?
11:51<Yorick>what's your definition of "command"?
11:52<rortom>http://pastebin.com/m4039f0d4
11:52<rortom>those
11:52<Yorick>those are oacjets
11:52<Yorick>packets*
11:52<Yorick>the "PACKET_CLIENT_COMMAND"-packet forms a command
11:53<Yorick>but they're one packet, yes
11:53<rortom>ok
11:54<Yorick>or splitup by tcp, but you shouldn't be noticing
11:54<rortom>sure
11:54<rortom>i recognise some code you have
11:54<rortom>we do it the same way at some points
11:55<rortom>(in RoR)
11:55<Yorick>ror is closed source :(
11:55<rortom>yes :|
11:55<rortom>i have access :|
11:55<Yorick>but why?
11:55<rortom>many reasons :\
11:55<Yorick>?
11:56-!-grumbel [~grumbel@i577B9E64.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Client exiting]
11:56<rortom>i dont think because pricorde thinks he could make money with it some day
11:57<@Belugas>don't mind, rortom, Yorick is the most curious human been i've encountered so far, right after dih
11:57<Yorick>thank you
11:57<@Belugas>curious as in wanting to know everything
11:57<@Belugas>even waht is not of his matter :P
11:57<rortom>hehe ;)
11:58<rortom>i dont mind :)
11:58<SpComb>is RoR Rise of Rome, or some other game?
11:58<dih>oy Belugas...
11:58<dih>nofair
11:58<dih>:-P
11:58<rortom>not that you think i advertise here on purpose ...
11:58<rortom>http://rigsofrods.com
11:59<Yorick>spam, ohnoes
11:59<rortom>:p
11:59<SpComb>right, I was just trying to find it on the wikipedia disambiguation page
11:59<rortom>hehe
11:59<rortom>so i will start with a simple tcp stream
11:59<rortom>and try to send PACKET_CLIENT_COMPANY_INFO to the server
11:59<Yorick>don't think you need that
12:00<Cyclonerotary>anyone gonna start a opendttd mulitplayer anytime soon?
12:00<dih>Cyclonerotary: see http://openttd.dihedral.de
12:01<rortom>im currently playing ;)
12:01<dih>the game auto upgrades to latest nightly
12:01<dih>or join #openttdfairplay
12:01<rortom>nice :)
12:01<Yorick>PACKET_CLIENT_JOIN, at once should work
12:02<rortom>so that at first i guess :\
12:03<rortom>so i must just figure out how that packet is constructed :\
12:04<Yorick> p->Send_string(_openttd_revision);
12:04<Yorick> p->Send_string(_network_player_name); // Player name
12:04<Yorick> p->Send_uint8 (_network_playas); // PlayAs
12:04<Yorick> p->Send_uint8 (NETLANG_ANY); // Language
12:04<Yorick> p->Send_string(_network_unique_id);
12:05<CIA-3>OpenTTD: rubidium * r13680 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Fix: NPF crashing when a ship tried to find a nearby depot when on an aqueduct.
12:05<rortom>so i must be blind that i did not see that :\
12:05<rortom>ok, let me recode that thing :)
12:08<Yorick>_openttd_revision should match the server revision( char[15]), _network_player_name(char[80]), _network_playas(uint8), NETLANG_ANY = 0(uint8), unique_id(char[33]) :)
12:09<rortom>ah
12:09<rortom>thanks for your help :D
12:09<Yorick>the unique id is just a hash :)
12:09<rortom>so how does the packet type identify itself?
12:11<Yorick>network/core/packet.cpp helps
12:11<rortom>currently reading :)
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12:14<rortom>mmhm
12:14<rortom>this->buffer[this->size++] = type;
12:14<rortom>so last byte of the PacketSize is the Type
12:14<@Rubidium>no
12:14<rortom>and PacketSize is the whole size of all components
12:15<rortom>oh wrong
12:15<rortom>indeed
12:15<rortom>size is the counter :|
12:15<rortom>so the data is
12:15<rortom>packetsize
12:15<rortom>packettype
12:15<rortom>payload
12:15<@Rubidium>exactly
12:15<rortom>great :)
12:15<rortom>thanks
12:17<Yorick>Rubidium managed to explain the packet system to you in 2 words :-D
12:17<rortom>:p
12:19<rortom>we have nearly the same packet format in RoR
12:19<rortom>btw the network stuff for RoR is open source ...
12:20<rortom>including the server ...
12:21<@Rubidium>that sounds like a toyland climate; rabbits on rails
12:21<Yorick>yeah, like "ottd" is that clear
12:22<@Rubidium>it's wikipedia unambiguous, so yes it is clear ;)
12:22<@Belugas>hoo.... Yorick, the big expert :P
12:23<Yorick>hohoho...merry Belugas!
12:24<@peter1138>i just wish rigs of rods ran faster ;)
12:24<rortom>oh, i also ;)
12:24<@peter1138>although sometimes it's stupidly fast
12:24<@peter1138>110 fps is pretty good
12:24<rortom>yeah, when the physics is deactivated :p
12:24<@peter1138>then you go too near a plane and it drops to 30 or so
12:25<rortom>no wonders why
12:25<@peter1138>ah well
12:25<rortom>each beam is running in its own thread
12:25<@peter1138>just needs to be more parallel (the magic word)
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12:25<rortom>and those sync at 2000 FPS
12:25<Yorick>beam?
12:26<rortom>a Beam structure is a truck/car/crane/ship/anything in RoR
12:26<@peter1138>shame it doesn't (yet?) make use of my quad core...
12:26<rortom>i wass coding on a better core support :\
12:26<rortom>but time got short :\
12:26<@peter1138>ah
12:27<rortom>whats sizeof(uint16) ?
12:27<@peter1138>i still don't know why my q6600 gets decent frame rates but my athlon 5800+ struggles along
12:27<@peter1138>2
12:27<rortom>thx
12:30<@Belugas>grrrr... wrong database version :(
12:31<rortom>mhm
12:31<rortom>sizeof(uint8)? 1 byte?
12:31<@Belugas>up
12:31<@Belugas>yup
12:32<rortom>must create some c-->python mappings
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12:34<@peter1138>hehe
12:34<@peter1138>one thing i noticed with RoR
12:34<@peter1138>the right hand mirror shows the same image as the left hand mirror
12:34<@peter1138>makes it pretty useless :)
12:35<rortom>oh, no ;)
12:35<rortom>just rotate the camera more to the right ;)
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12:44<rortom>http://pastebin.rigsofrods.com/m456cbaa4
12:44<rortom>so far so good
12:44<rortom>i hope that is correct
12:46<Yorick>if it works on a server...
12:46<@Rubidium>but why do you want to join a server?
12:47<Ammler>Rubidium: spam bot ;-)
12:48<rortom>lol
12:48<rortom>oh, thats indeed bad
12:48<rortom>if i write a bot
12:48<rortom>anyone can miuse it D:
12:48<rortom>*misuse
12:48<Yorick>I wont :)
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12:50<@Rubidium>still... why do you want to join a server with a custom made client?
12:50-!-Lakie` is now known as Lakie
12:51<rortom>to prevent all those server console/stat hacks ...
12:51<Ammler>analyzing saves?
12:52<@Rubidium>and thus you are joining a server from where you get desynced in a few game days
12:52-!-dvdb [~dvdb@cable-static-21-192.rsnweb.ch] has joined #openttd
12:52<@Rubidium>i.e. kicked
12:52<dvdb>Salute.
12:52<rortom>mh
12:52<rortom>why?
12:53<dvdb>What type of OpenTTD is this? http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=65051
12:53<@Rubidium>to ensure game state consistency between the clients/servers
12:54<@Rubidium>dvdb: NoOpenTTD
12:54<dvdb>Any TTD Version?
12:54<rortom>@ Rubidium so i could not emulate the client behavior?
12:55-!-DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-120-109-218.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
12:55<dvdb>I saw it here: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=29813&view=previous
12:55<@Rubidium>rortom: you can, but that means porting the whole core of OpenTTD to python
12:55<rortom>@ dvdb its the TTD successor (cannot remember its name now...)
12:55<@Rubidium>and keeping it up to date
12:55<rortom>mhm
12:55<@Rubidium>dvdb: look at the subforum you're in there
12:56<rortom>@ Rubidium: so its not possible to join as spectator and just listen?
12:57-!-thingwath [~thingwath@heimdall.palisada.net] has joined #openttd
12:58<@Rubidium>rortom: what's listening?
12:59<@Rubidium>OpenTTD only transfers the map on join and then *only* the commands humans give
12:59<rortom>yes
12:59<@Rubidium>e.g. building a train, placing a signal
12:59<rortom>so as spectator i only receive commands
12:59<rortom>right?
13:00<@Rubidium>yes and you are requested to check whether you are still in sync with the server
13:00<rortom>how does that work (just if you have time)
13:01<@Rubidium>the random seed is send every X ticks and then checked
13:01<@Rubidium>the random seed changes (pseudo randomly) after getting a random number out of it
13:02<rortom>mhm
13:02<@Rubidium>so the only way to not fail that check is performing the exact same amount of calls to random
13:02<rortom>:\
13:02<rortom>tricky ;)
13:02<@Rubidium>and random is used *all* over the place
13:03<rortom>so i could not emulate that random number stuff?
13:03<KingJ>Hah, never knew OpenTTD had a special message when you drowned your competitor :P
13:03-!-raimar2 [~hawk@p5489F38A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
13:03<@Rubidium>rortom: exactly (except actually running OpenTTD)
13:04<@Rubidium>without the drawing, but that doesn't cut the CPU usage that drastically
13:06-!-DJNekkid [~chatzilla@static128-249.adsl.no] has joined #openttd
13:06<dvdb>What is the most powerful locomotive in OpenTTD? AsiaStar has only 8000 PS :/
13:06<DJNekkid>dvdb: the Chimaera :)
13:07<dvdb>DJNekkid: and for electric railways?
13:08<DJNekkid>asiastar afaik
13:08<rortom>@ rubidium, thats not good :|
13:09<rortom>so no passive clients possible
13:10<@Rubidium>exactly
13:10<rortom>i figure ...
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13:14<MorgyN>Need a cat mod for openttd... monorail cat, and the cat busses from totoro
13:15<@Belugas>miaoo
13:15<@Belugas>fuurrrr
13:15<@Belugas>fuurrrr
13:15<TiberiusTeng>XD
13:16<@Rubidium>http://catmas.com/images/2006/12/monorail-cat-has-left-the-station.gif ;)
13:16<rortom>lol
13:16<@Belugas>:D
13:16<MorgyN>http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2126/2243896008_37689e0a07.jpg?v=0
13:19<MorgyN>http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/02/11714107741.gif <- still the best tho
13:20<SmatZ>hehehehe
13:20<Yorick>rortom: rubidium has tricked you, ignoring the sync requests leads in you keeping connected
13:20-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host126-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
13:21<rortom>danm Rubidium :p
13:21<Wolf01>hello
13:21<rortom>so it would work ;)
13:21<Yorick>I guess it would, yes
13:21<@Rubidium>but you get some ancient game state
13:22<@Rubidium>and you know nothing about the 'current' game state
13:22<Yorick>do you need a game state for a passive client?
13:22<@Rubidium>what use is a passive client?
13:22<@Rubidium>except using player slots?
13:22<Yorick>logging commands and chat?
13:22<@Rubidium>the server can log the commands and so can any client
13:23<Yorick>he wants it on unmodified servers
13:23<@Rubidium>so I should rewrite the network so the server checks the sync
13:23<Yorick>R: ...
13:24<@Belugas>why logging everything? Are we going CIA or KGB or something like that?
13:24<@Belugas>commands and chats?
13:24<@Belugas>brrrr...
13:24<@Belugas>i think i'll keep on playing local :P
13:25<rortom>:|
13:25<Prof_Frink>Belugas: Well, why log that yourself?
13:25<Prof_Frink>Just say Bomb and let Echelon log it for you
13:25<Yorick>you've got irc channel logs, no?
13:25<rortom>mh
13:25<rortom>so i shouldnt even try to write that bot :|
13:26<Yorick>yes you should
13:26<Yorick>I like the idea
13:26<Ammler>rortom: maybe better to port autopilot to python?
13:26<@Belugas>me? ain't logging a thing
13:26<Yorick>of python-easy scriptable openttd
13:27<rortom>in RoR we use it in MP to create missions and stuff like that
13:27<Yorick>c has no good string parsing stuff
13:27<SmatZ>Belugas: to determine who is trying to destroy the game
13:27<Yorick>^^
13:27<rortom>means a python client join, and sends rcon commands to the server to control game flow
13:27<Yorick>yeah, I like that
13:28<@Belugas>it can happen both ways, don't you know that?
13:28<@Belugas>it can log, but it can destroy the landscape too...
13:28<@Belugas>i think
13:28<rortom>mh?
13:28<Yorick>sure it can
13:28<@Belugas>or send SPAMS!
13:28<Yorick>but it needs MANY!
13:28-!-lolman is now known as john
13:28<rortom>uhm
13:28<rortom>simple
13:28-!-john is now known as lolman
13:28<rortom>in RoR server we use tokens
13:28<rortom>like your unique IDs
13:29<Yorick>unique ids can be fakes
13:29<Yorick>faked*
13:29<rortom>to control what cleints may do clients
13:29<rortom>-last sentence
13:29<rortom>to control what clients may do
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13:30<rortom>mh
13:30<rortom>i hope you tested your net protocol with fuzzy data etc?
13:31<Yorick>how fuzzy?
13:31<rortom>random data
13:31<Yorick>should have been
13:31<Yorick>otherwize bug > fixneeds
13:31<rortom>yes
13:31<Yorick>you made the server crash from sending a packet
13:31<@Rubidium>someone did something like that a while ago
13:32<rortom>D:
13:32<rortom>imagine i write that bot
13:32<rortom>and someone uses it to take down ALL SERVERS
13:32-!-Rexxie [~rexxars@62.113.134.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:33<Yorick>you'd be getting to the master server, istantly
13:36<rortom>so i will test that on some local server ...
13:37<Yorick>Have you made any progress?
13:38<rortom>i stopped :|
13:38<rortom>but will continue now
13:39<Yorick>why did you stop?
13:40<rortom>RoR support :\
13:41<@Belugas>why do you ask?
13:42<Yorick>because he stopped
13:42<@Belugas>why do you care?
13:42<rortom>lol
13:42-!-Rexxie [~rexxars@85.19.218.24] has joined #openttd
13:42<rortom>im fine ;)
13:42<Yorick>Because I like his idea
13:42<@Belugas>why?
13:43-!-Slowpoke [~Lobster@dslb-088-073-225-133.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
13:43<Yorick>I don't know
13:44<@Belugas>so you like something and don't know why?
13:44<rortom>:p
13:45<rortom>oh god :|
13:45<rortom>worst RoR video ever: http://forum.rigsofrods.com/index.php?topic=12655.msg102323#msg102323
13:46<@Belugas>Yorick, why don't you answer?
13:46<rortom>lol :p
13:46<Yorick>speech recognition being slow
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13:47<Yorick>it's nice to have unpatched servers, and a most-likely quite compatible bot
13:47<@Belugas>are you answering to me, Yorick?
13:48<Yorick>yes
13:49<@Belugas>i do not understand your answer then. Could you add more content toyour answer?
13:50<rortom>@ Yorick i will continue to write the client
13:50<rortom>at least trying to
13:50<rortom>but not now and here
13:50<rortom>so much other stuff to be done :\
13:50<rortom>http://rigsofrods.spreadshirt.net/
13:50<rortom>like ordering tshirts :p
13:50<rortom>;) ;)
13:50-!-Marduuhin [~mardo4@84-50-171-144-dsl.rgu.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
13:51<rortom>btw you have an openttd shirt? :|
13:52-!-Mirrakor [~linuser@p57B2EADE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:54<@Belugas>no... sadly enough
13:54<rortom>D:
13:54<rortom>its readlly easy to create one
13:54<rortom>*really
13:54<@Belugas>i've got one from all the diving scholl i worked for, but not for ottd
13:54<rortom>:\
13:54<@Belugas>either way, i'd be almost the only one havng one in montreal ^_^
13:54<rortom>:p
13:56*Belugas wonders what could be printed on such a shirt...
13:56<rortom>the ottd community is much bigger than ours ;)
13:56<rortom>you dont have any official logo?
13:56<Ammler>the dollar sign :-(
13:57<rortom>:\
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13:57<rortom>isnt that the original one?
13:57<Ammler>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Openttdlogo.svg
13:57<rortom>ah :)
13:58<rortom>that would be nice on a shirt :)
13:58<rortom>and since its vector, it would scale well :)
13:58<rortom>let me try something out
13:58<Ammler>I have no idea, who to credit for...
14:01<@Belugas>hehe...
14:02<@Belugas>and on the sleeve : "Dev", "Code Leader", "Patcher", "User" "Server Admin", "/ignore Yorick"
14:02<rortom>https://rigsofrods.spreadshirt.net/en/DE/Shop/Index/index/
14:02<rortom>:)
14:02<rortom>as said, its easy and fast
14:02<Yorick>:)
14:02<Yorick>my name on a shirt!
14:02<rortom>:p
14:03<Ammler>wh is it cheaper then RoR shirt?
14:03-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd
14:03<@Belugas>colour of the shirt maybe
14:03<rortom>no
14:03<rortom>3 euro flow in my pocket :|
14:04<rortom>-> server refund
14:04<@Belugas>lol
14:04<rortom>:)
14:04<rortom>so that adds to the price ;)
14:04<rortom>have to pay ~60 euros a month
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14:04<@Belugas>any quantity? i mean... there is no minimum? nor rebate after x amount?
14:05<rortom>no
14:05<rortom>thats the cool thing about spreadshirt
14:05<Yorick>then how does it work?
14:05<rortom>no minimum
14:05<Yorick>you let them sell a shirt?
14:06<rortom>just order one for you and tahts it :)
14:06<rortom>you upload the design
14:06<rortom>and set how many you want per sold shirt
14:06<rortom>nothing more
14:06<rortom>they do the rest
14:07<rortom>and you will get such fancy online shop
14:07<Yorick>and what's the max you can want?
14:07<rortom>mh?
14:07<Yorick>what's their base price?
14:07<rortom>ah
14:08<rortom>thats fixed with a table
14:08<@Belugas>as much as your wallet can allow :P
14:08<rortom>the base shirt costs
14:08<Yorick>https://rigsofrods.spreadshirt.net/en/DE/Shop/Article/Index/article/OpenTTD-Fan-Shirt-7010197 :o
14:08<rortom>and everything you add costs also :)
14:08<rortom>i just created that shirt
14:09<Yorick>if someone buys it, you get the money...
14:09<rortom>no
14:09<Yorick>on their logo
14:09<rortom>that 15,90 is the minimum price
14:09<rortom>i added no commission
14:09<rortom>means no profit for me
14:10<Yorick>:o they're expensive
14:10<rortom>yeah, more expensive than normal shirts :|
14:10<rortom>but since its something special ...
14:11-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:11<rortom>do you want me to remove that shirt again?
14:11<@peter1138>hm
14:12<@peter1138>ooh
14:12<@peter1138>which image did you use?
14:12<rortom>from wikipedia
14:12<@peter1138>ah, the svg :D
14:12<Yorick>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Openttdlogo.svg
14:12<rortom>yes
14:12<rortom>exported as png, then uploaded
14:13<rortom>someone of your leaders/executives should create some spreadshirt shop :)
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14:13<Yorick>that'd be rubidium
14:13<@peter1138>Yorick: this sort of custom graphic printing place are always expensive
14:14<rortom>http://youtube.com/watch?v=DJ5OBhlJEhQ
14:14<rortom>"Spreadshirt - Hands per piece, how your t-shirt is made"
14:14<rortom>lots of manual work ...
14:14<Eddi|zuHause3># Weisst du noch wie's früher war?
14:14<Eddi|zuHause3># Früher war alles schlecht!
14:14<Eddi|zuHause3># Der Himmel grau, die Menschen mies.
14:14<Eddi|zuHause3># Die Welt war furchtbar ungerecht.
14:14<Eddi|zuHause3># Doch dannn; dann kam die Wende! - unser Leid war zu Ende.
14:14<@Belugas>that does not include shipping, does it?
14:14<rortom>no
14:15<rortom>its about 3 euros shipping
14:15<rortom>the main thing to notice: they dont do oversea shipping
14:15<rortom>so since its a german company ...
14:15<Forked>hmm, so why not use cafepress?
14:15<@peter1138>nice bosom shot at 30 seconds in ;)
14:15<Forked>you could get openttd boxer shorts
14:15<@Belugas>blahh
14:16<rortom>i think thats the same as spreadshirt :)
14:16<@peter1138>cafepress :(
14:16<rortom>if you want to reach US customers create an account at spreadshirt.com
14:16<Forked>CP keeps mislabeling what they ship..
14:16<rortom>they have different products
14:17<Forked>the prize
14:18<@Belugas>mmh...
14:18<@Belugas>Mogwai - Auto Rock rocks
14:18<@Belugas>even the remix :)
14:19<@peter1138>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=707150#p707150
14:19<@peter1138>did we ever solve the dos/windows graphics problem for 32bpp tars?
14:19<rortom>:|
14:19<@Rubidium>is there a problem?
14:19<rortom>hey Rubidium
14:20<Wolf01>houston, we have a problem!
14:20<rortom>http://rigsofrods.spreadshirt.net/en/DE/Shop/Article/Index/article/OpenTTD-Fan-Shirt-7010197
14:20<Eddi|zuHause3>Belugas: but it is not from "the best band of the world" :p
14:20<rortom>remove?
14:20<@peter1138>well, that 32bpp graphics depend on dos/windows version
14:20<De_Ghosty>anyone can read korean?
14:20<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause3, ot yours, but it's getting more and more mine :)
14:21<Eddi|zuHause3>www.die-beste-band-der-welt.de ;)
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14:23*Belugas is picking up some hot coffee, might eventually cool him a bit :S
14:25<Swallow>Question: Can I assume that CargoID 0 is valid?
14:25<Eddi|zuHause3>with newgrf, you can never assume anything
14:26<@Belugas>Swallow, yes you can
14:26<@Rubidium>Belugas: are you sure?
14:26<@Belugas>well...
14:27<@Belugas>i was pretty much sure, but you're shaking my convitions now
14:27<@peter1138>no, but quite a bit of code does
14:27<@Belugas>yes, i'm sure
14:27<@Belugas> CT_PASSENGERS = 0,
14:28<@Belugas>unless not talking about the same stuff ;S
14:28<Swallow>but NewGRF can override that, can't they?
14:31<@Belugas>ho... not the same stuff then...
14:31<Eddi|zuHause3>Belugas: http://youtube.com/watch?v=uFRxREFV5BY [song to the text above]
14:32<@peter1138>same stuff, CT_PASSENGERS only applies if a newgrf hasn't change it
14:32<@peter1138>+d
14:35<Swallow>I will take the safe route and add an extra check, thanks for your help
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15:05<rortom>whats an M in the revision number?
15:06<rortom>M for modified?
15:06<rortom>i mean the game version number
15:06<hylje>modified yes
15:06<rortom>D:
15:07<rortom>that russion patch pack
15:07<rortom>i have a precompiled windows client without M client
15:07<rortom>and when i compile the server i get an M :|
15:07<hylje>you can override it by running configure
15:07<rortom>same revision
15:07<Ammler>or you can force the join with argument -n
15:07<hylje>if you are really sure it's the same rev
15:08<rortom>ah, nice
15:08<rortom>thanks!
15:08<dvdb>How long is a "tick" ?
15:09<Ammler>the russion pack has a whole sentence as Revision name.
15:09<Prof_Frink>about |---| yay long
15:09<Ammler>around an hour :-)
15:09<dvdb>and in OpenTTD?^^
15:10<rortom>@ ammler i was just about to notice that too :|
15:10<dvdb>another question: how can i change ticks to days like here: http://www.tt-ms.de/forum/attachment.php?aid=449 ?
15:11<Eddi|zuHause3>dvdb: something around 30ms
15:11<Ammler>dvdb: it is a patch setting
15:11<rortom>./configure --revision="r13437 - Russian Community patchpack 1.2.0"
15:11<rortom>:(
15:11<Eddi|zuHause3>dvdb: it's a patch setting, "show timetables in ticks instead of days"
15:12<Ammler>Belugas: indeed, removing the word "patch"
15:13<@Belugas>btw, it has nothing to do agaisnt TTDPatch.. Just that we do niot have patches. We have options and advanced options
15:13<Eddi|zuHause3>newoptions! :p
15:13<rortom>noptions?
15:13<rortom>:p
15:14<@Belugas>and we are not applying patches, we're applying diffs!
15:14<@Belugas>less a confusion...
15:15<Ammler>did you discuss that with dih :-)
15:15<@Belugas>no
15:15<@Belugas>why?
15:15*Prof_Frink confuses
15:17<Ammler>nvm, we discussed that once, because I always renamed his *.patch to *.diff...
15:18<@Belugas>well... tell a newcomer to apply a patch, 99% of the time, he thinks it's a piece of a binay that fixes something in the orignal exe :S
15:18<Ammler>removing of word patch wouldn't need patching, would it ;-)
15:18<Ammler>just a matter of translation
15:19<Prof_Frink>No, it needs bodging
15:19<hylje>fudge
15:19<Prof_Frink>Nah, fudge is different
15:19<Prof_Frink>Bodging is making it right in the wrong way
15:20<@Belugas>call it deving then...
15:20<Prof_Frink>Fudging is making it wrong, but look right
15:22<Eddi|zuHause3>i already imagine the forum topic: "Patch: Diff" :p
15:22<rortom>mh russian pack lags as hell?
15:22<TiberiusTeng>about the file extension: .diff / .patch, which is better ?
15:22<Eddi|zuHause3>rortom: using ECS?
15:23<rortom>?
15:23<rortom>.patch IMO
15:23<Eddi|zuHause3>i meant do you use the ECS grfs?
15:24<rortom>i use the GRF pack
15:24<@Belugas>TiberiusTeng, i don't know to be honest
15:24<rortom>~10 grfs
15:24<Eddi|zuHause3>you should never enable all grfs from the grf pack ;)
15:24<rortom>sure, i did not ;)
15:24<@Belugas>i thnik that as long as you can apply either one, it's fine
15:25<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause3: wise suggestion :-)
15:25<@Belugas>(patch or diff, i mean...)
15:25<Eddi|zuHause3>TiberiusTeng: i use .diff most of the time
15:25<TiberiusTeng>I
15:25<TiberiusTeng>I'
15:25<TiberiusTeng>I always use redirect :P
15:26<TiberiusTeng>(sorry for those typo)
15:26<Prof_Frink>I use .badger
15:33<Yorick>badgerbadgerbadgerbadgerbadgerbadger
15:34<Prof_Frink>müshroom
15:34<Noldo>is it output of diff or input of patch
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15:53<+glx><@peter1138> did we ever solve the dos/windows graphics problem for 32bpp tars? <-- I have http://glx.dnsalias.net:8080/openttd/tardosttd.diff for that
15:54<+michi_cc>Rubidium: your bug's fixed
15:54<Wolf01>'night
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16:02<rortom>nite
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16:15<DJNekkid>a nfo-question if i may:
16:15<DJNekkid>i've added
16:15<DJNekkid>-1 * 0 02 00 D1 81 0C 00 FF 01 23 80 00 00 AC 00
16:16<DJNekkid>should not that give me a "generic text" number 00 00 (the 2nd and 3rd 00 from the back) ?
16:16<DJNekkid>or to be presice, the D000
16:17<DJNekkid>if i add the cid D1 to the action 3
16:19<@peter1138>err
16:20<Sacro>DaleStan: ping
16:20<@peter1138>"00 00" is not a callback result
16:20<DaleStan>pong
16:20<@peter1138>but i can't remember the format of it :)
16:21<DaleStan>DJNekkid: And that location isn't where a callback result would be, anyway.
16:21<DJNekkid>and where would that be?
16:21<DJNekkid>the AC?
16:22<DaleStan>Those would be <min> and <max>
16:22<DaleStan><setID>s (23 80) and (AC 00) are where you put results.
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16:25<DJNekkid>so ... FF 01 00 80 23 23 AC 00 ?
16:25<DaleStan>To return 0 for CB 23 (text D000) and chain to CID AC in all other cases, yes.
16:26<DJNekkid>but isnt that what i actually want? :)
16:27<DJNekkid>tho, it dont seem to work
16:28<DJNekkid>so, i guess not
16:31*Belugas Mogwai - Moses? I Amn't
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16:33<DJNekkid>what i want to do is add text to the purchase window :)
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16:44<DJNekkid>btw, i got it to work, but i had a separate purchise screen cID
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16:54<DaleStan>DJNekkid: Ah. CB23 will only be called with the purchase-window cargo type.
16:55<DJNekkid>DaleStan: yea ... i figured that out finally ... i mean, the cid i did set were the engine itself ... if that makes sense, but i needed to put in the separate puchsise screen cid
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17:18<Cyclonerotary>i dont get it, my large train stations right in the middle of town attract very few passangers
17:18<Cyclonerotary>whereas my docks on the edges of small towns rapidly get hundreds
17:24<fjb>How many trains are visiting the stations?
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17:31<DaleStan>And what are the station ratings?
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17:47<Eddi|zuHause3>Cyclonerotary: ships suffer less from rating decay, when no vehicle is waiting
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20:27<ijustam>hi all, my stations (under single player only) orient the wrong way: http://pbsmith.iweb.bsu.edu/what.png
20:27<ijustam>whats up with that?
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20:29<+glx>you selected the wrong orientation
20:30<ijustam>eh
20:30<ijustam>http://pbsmith.iweb.bsu.edu/1.png leads to http://pbsmith.iweb.bsu.edu/2.png
20:31<SmatZ>yeah
20:31<+glx>yes you selected exactly what you built
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20:32<ijustam>but... it's facing the wrong direction?
20:32<ijustam>i think im missing something here
20:32<+glx>no it's facing the selected direction
20:33<+glx>and you built 4 tracks of lenght 1
20:33<ijustam>oh shit
20:33<ijustam>christ im out of it today
20:33<ijustam>:(
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20:33<Cyclonerotary>lol ijustam
20:34<ijustam>man
20:34<ijustam>thats embarrassing
20:34<Cyclonerotary>just have lots of tiny trains :-)
20:34<Cyclonerotary>do i have to download an addon fro trams?
20:34<+glx>Cyclonerotary: what version are you using?
20:36<Cyclonerotary>whatever was top of the download list
20:36<Cyclonerotary>got it maybe a week ago
20:37<SmatZ>Cyclonerotary: does the NewGRF Settings window show Generic Tram Set 0.4 ?
20:37<+glx>0.6.1 is provided with a tram grf
20:38<Cyclonerotary>i just added it glx thanks for your help :-)
20:38<Cyclonerotary>also SmatZ
20:39<SmatZ>good :)
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20:42<Cyclonerotary>are trams anygood?
20:44<@Belugas>i'd say so, Cyclonerotary
20:45<@Belugas>on a recent game i played, i sold all my busses after completion of a trams network :)
20:45<@Belugas>3 trams made as much, if not more, tham 10 busses
20:45<Cyclonerotary>i rarely use busses
20:46<@Belugas>I use them a lot
20:46<Cyclonerotary>do busses across one city make it grow or does it have to be between 2?
20:47<Sacro>@seen Bjarni
20:47-!-Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:47<@DorpsGek>Sacro: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 5 days, 4 hours, 39 minutes, and 53 seconds ago: <Bjarni> I didn't have any
20:47<Sacro>hmm
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20:47<Sacro>http://photos-c.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v291/195/40/698739721/n698739721_514874_1121.jpg <- ahh the danish amuse me
20:47<Sacro>Lakie: zomg stealker
20:47<Sacro>err
20:48<Sacro>stalker
20:48<Lakie>mhmm?
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22:33<@Belugas>i am realistically bored by the wish of realism integration in thisnot realistic game
22:33<@Belugas>damn it
22:33<dvdb>^^
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---Logclosed Tue Jul 08 00:00:01 2008