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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-07-24

---Logopened Thu Jul 24 00:06:22 2008
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01:33<bilbous>hi all, quick question: why do all the transfered product I take to the end destination wind up losing money?
01:35<Ammler>bilbous: with transfer?
01:35<bilbous>ya secondary carrier always is in the red
01:35<Ammler>you got too much for the other transport
01:35<Ammler>so you have to payback a bit :-)
01:36<bilbous>because the first hop is longer?
01:36<Ammler>yep
01:37<bilbous>THat doesn't seem to make sense ;)
01:37<bilbous>Mak more money just sending the cargo to a dead end
01:39<bilbous>Well thanks for the answer Ammler
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02:22<TiberiusTeng>r13810 will trigger access violation in a VC build.
02:23<TiberiusTeng>TarListEntry needs a copy constructor that strdup(filename) ...
02:24<TiberiusTeng>or it will free itself up after being inserted into the map<string,TarListEntry>
02:25<TiberiusTeng>and triggers AV when it tries to access the (now freed) string by a bitwise-copied dangling pointer
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03:55<planetmaker>morning
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04:07<@Rubidium>TiberiusTeng: it shouldn't be copied around anymore; I see no reason why it would need to do it
04:07<@Rubidium>and a copy operator doesn't solve the problem anyways; it'll only move it slightly
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04:08<TiberiusTeng>typedef std::map<std::string, TarFileListEntry> TarFileList;
04:09<TiberiusTeng>when you insert a TarFileListEntry into TarFileList, it'll be copied ...
04:10<TiberiusTeng>I believe that's why it was TarListEntry *, not TarListEntry
04:11<@Rubidium>but... we don't insert a TarListEntry
04:12<@Rubidium>or at least, only after the insert the tarlist entry is actually set
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04:15<TiberiusTeng>anyway it's triggering Access Violation here on VC2005
04:16<@Rubidium>and when the constructor sets the pointer to NULL by default?
04:16<TiberiusTeng>and ... is the original AI broke in recent revisions ? I see them only terraforming around, but not building anything meaningful ...
04:16<@Rubidium>it's just enormously stupid that it needs to keep copying it around for absolutely no reason
04:17<@Rubidium>TiberiusTeng: the original AI still builds vehicles here
04:19<TiberiusTeng>C++ standard's sometimes strange on these aspects, but it do specify how object instances should be copied on assignment operator, parameter passing etc ...
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04:20<Gekz>it does*
04:21<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: newgrf?
04:21<@Rubidium>TiberiusTeng, the whole problem is: there is NO assignment, there is NO parameter passing, ...
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04:23<@Rubidium>and the copy operator can't do much good either cause there's no way to tell whether it should free the pointer it contains or not
04:23<TiberiusTeng>the TarList should std::map<std::string, std::string> IMO
04:25<Phantasm>http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/29-Just-Say-It.aspx
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04:25<@Rubidium>TiberiusTeng: but then the string pointer value changes
04:26<@Rubidium>which makes it break on all platforms
04:27<TiberiusTeng>looks like it's just a 'seen list'
04:27<TiberiusTeng>and we should leave all memory managing stuff to std::string ?
04:27<@Rubidium>TiberiusTeng: yeah, with other structs having pointers to the strdup-allocated filename
04:28<@Rubidium>and if MSVC's map keeps copying stuff around, that strdup-allocated pointer will be long gone before it even is inserted
04:28<TiberiusTeng>it's on the progress of moving to C++ if I get it right
04:30<@Rubidium>huh?
04:33<TiberiusTeng>or you want to stick with good old char * ? Frankly I don't have anything to say about this ...
04:34<@Rubidium>well, the piece of code is messy, tried to stop it leaking and apparantly it worked, only MSVC (as usual) can't handle it
04:39<TiberiusTeng>ok I ran it through debugger again
04:39<TiberiusTeng>it AV'd on the way while inserting a new empty TarListEntry into the list
04:40<TiberiusTeng>and apparently the copy operation occured there didn't get optimized out in a debugging build ...
04:40<@Rubidium>so it's copying a garbage pointer and then it frees the garbage pointer?
04:40<TiberiusTeng>_Where = this->insert(_Where, value_type(_Keyval, mapped_type()));
04:41<TiberiusTeng>looks so
04:41<@Rubidium>and only after that the pointer is set correctly (which you can't see as it's already crashed)
04:41<TiberiusTeng>the line's in VC STL map, here mapped_type() is TarListEntry
04:41<@Rubidium>but that'd mean that adding a default constructor that NULLs the pointer should fix it
04:41<TiberiusTeng>it'll get constructed, passed to insert (a copy operation here) ...
04:41<TiberiusTeng>looks so, I'm trying it now
04:42<TiberiusTeng>yeah, it worked.
04:46<CIA-3>OpenTTD: rubidium * r13814 /trunk/src/tar_type.h:
04:46<CIA-3>OpenTTD: -Fix (r13810): MSVC (as usual) does stupid things. This time it is copying
04:46<CIA-3>OpenTTD: around a struct it created itself, causing bad things to happen if you don't
04:46<CIA-3>OpenTTD: explicitly set all variables to something remotely sane in the constructor.
04:48<TiberiusTeng>thanks :)
04:48<TiberiusTeng>but actually I rally think gcc -O0 will crash too
04:49<TiberiusTeng>s/rally/really
04:53<@Rubidium>gcc -O0 without even inlining doesn't crash
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05:30<ln>@seen Bjarni
05:30<@DorpsGek>ln: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 0 days, 13 hours, 22 minutes, and 52 seconds ago: <Bjarni> I didn't have any
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05:33<ln>ok, i want ferries that can carry trains.
05:33<ln>any questions? good, start coding.
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05:39<TiberiusTeng>ahh, NewGRF GUI has added the preset function. another update ~_~
05:40<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: maybe you should make the reset economy optionally then :-)
05:41<TiberiusTeng>I'll try to remember that :P
05:41<ln>where are my train-carrying ferries?
05:42<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause3: would like it that way ;-)
05:42<TiberiusTeng>DIY :p
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05:51<fmauNeko>Hello, World !
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06:37<guru3>anyone recon it'd be possible to make a version of openttd that ran entirely in the browser?
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06:38<Yorick>guru3: possible
06:38<Yorick>but most likely slow as hell
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06:38<guru3>ive seen 3d games in the browser
06:38<@Rubidium>3d games are relatively simple
06:38<guru3>true :/
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06:39<guru3>still, i twould be cool
06:39<guru3>i could play openttd at work then
06:39<@Rubidium>they for sure don't push data around at the rate OpenTTD does, except for the drawing
06:39<@Rubidium>why wouldn't you be able to play at work then?
06:39<guru3>tcp connections have a way of mysteriously closing
06:39<guru3>i'm having to ssh via a webapp called anyterm as it is
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06:40<guru3>and so i toccured to me that if you can put a 25x80 terminal in a browser, why not openttd
06:40<guru3>so *it
06:40<blathijs>guru3: Running an app in a browser doesn't magically make it use a different protocol
06:41<Yorick>because the terminals are slightly more UFT-8 based and openttd somewhat sprite-based?
06:41<blathijs>guru3: I would say that that browser ssh terminal still uses ssh to communicate
06:41<guru3>no, but i just thought running it win a browser would be cool, portable, and wasy to use
06:41<Yorick>there are some remote-desktop java clients...
06:41<@Rubidium>blathijs: it looks like it actually doesn't
06:41<guru3>http://anyterm.org/ <-- uses a apache module in conjunction with javascript to do some funky magic
06:41<blathijs>guru3: No, to make openttd run in a browser, we would need to make it portable, it wouldn't magically become portable
06:42<blathijs>guru3: Yipes, that's scary
06:42<guru3>i didn't mean portable as in portable to a different platform porting
06:42<blathijs>OTOH, perhaps not as scary as TCP-over-DNS :-)
06:42<guru3>i meant portable as in easy to take a long
06:42<guru3>you wouldn't need to install it
06:42<guru3>you'd just need to open the page to your install of it
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06:43<blathijs>guru3: If you put openttd on an USB stick, you can probably get the same result
06:43<@Rubidium>TCP-over-DNS is just an awfully brilliant idea ;)
06:43<guru3>i'd need to carry a usb stick
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06:44<guru3>arghm can't you just let me enjoy my cool idea
06:44<guru3>*argh,
06:44<@Rubidium>http://httppc.sourceforge.net/
06:46<Yorick>argh...who got the idea of the onunload event
06:46<Yorick>in conjunction with opening the same page again
06:51<blathijs>guru3: Sorry, didn't mean to block your brainstorm :-p
06:53<guru3>np, i can forsee massive technical difficulties, but if we always let those get in our way... i'm sure you can imagine the technilogical level we'd all be at
06:54<guru3>that line needs a ;) after it...
06:54<guru3>;)
06:56<Yorick>http://www.abrahamjoffe.com.au/ben/canvascape/
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06:58<guru3>seems a bit jumpy
06:58<guru3>http://www.jangaron.net/jangaron0.5/jangaron.html
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07:19<Yorick>how about sending the framecounter with the game_info packet?
07:20<@Rubidium>and the usefullness of that?
07:21<blathijs>game_info packet is de UDP response?
07:21<blathijs>s/de/the/
07:21<@Rubidium>yes
07:21<Yorick>it is
07:21<Yorick>it would be helpful on a correct estimation of the game date
07:22<@Rubidium>and how would that algorithm work?
07:22<Yorick>game_date + (framecounter - game_info_framecounter) / 74
07:23<@Rubidium>huh?
07:23<Yorick>the openttd gamedate counts in days, right?
07:24<@Rubidium>yes
07:24<Yorick>one game day is 74 frames
07:24<@Rubidium>yes
07:24<Yorick>I could use that to calculate the game days at all times...
07:24<Yorick>date*
07:24<@Rubidium>no
07:25<@Rubidium>not correctly at least
07:25<Yorick>assuming I have a start-position and take pauses into account
07:25<Yorick>?
07:26<@Rubidium>framecounter can start at any moment in a day
07:26<@Rubidium>so if you get the game info in the half of a day, it's already 37 too much (or too few)
07:29<@Rubidium>and how do you count the framecounter for the "correct" game date?
07:33<Yorick>Rubidium: hmm...I think I'll request the date as soon as I'm in the game
07:33<Yorick>then track pauses
07:33<ln>i wants ferries
07:33<Yorick>and use the PACKET_SERVER_FRAME for the frame-counting
07:33<Yorick>ln: you wants grf
07:34<Yorick>also...I'll use something to floor it
07:34<ln>Yorick: do grfs have ferries that can carry trains and road vehicles?
07:35<Yorick>no
07:35<Yorick>only fake ones
07:35<@Rubidium>it does if you do s/mail/road vehicle/g;s/passenger/train/g
07:35<Yorick>and just use bridges
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07:54<Yorick>heh, searching your own name on wikipedia, not the best thing to do...http://yorick.sourceforge.net/index.php :O
07:56<Progman>you are an interpreted programming language? ;)
07:56<Yorick>apperently
07:57<fmauNeko>Yorick is a bot :p
07:57<Yorick>I know...
07:58<dih>i thought bots were more intelligent than that :-P
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08:17<SmatZ>any native English spearker here for a little question? :)
08:17<SmatZ>-r
08:17<ln>u cant trust them
08:18<SmatZ>hehe
08:18<SmatZ>my question is not about "wagon" x "waggon"
08:18<ln>try and ask your question
08:18<SmatZ>is it allowed to say "Your behaviour is likely to cause problems" ?
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08:19<SmatZ>!seen Bloody
08:19<SmatZ>@seen Bloody
08:19<@DorpsGek>SmatZ: Bloody was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 0 days, 21 hours, 38 minutes, and 2 seconds ago: <Bloody> :(
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08:20<ln>syntactically: yes, semantically: yes, pragmatically: unknown
08:22<planetmaker>[14:18] <SmatZ> is it allowed to say "Your behaviour is likely to cause problems" ? <-- though not native speaker, it looks to me like a correct sentence by all means.
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08:22<SmatZ>ln: planetmaker: ok thanks :)
08:22<planetmaker>np :)
08:23<Yorick>depends on who you are speaking to, if the content is also correct
08:24<SmatZ>:)
08:24<planetmaker>which depends heavily upon the definition of "problem".
08:27<Yorick>"/* Converted from an ingame table by WizKid */" <-- now is it converted by WizKid, or is the ingame table made by WIzKid?
08:28<SmatZ>I think b) is corrent
08:28<SmatZ>-n+c
08:29<Yorick>it's the OTTD_month_date_from_year_day table, btw
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08:31<rortom>oh
08:31<rortom>days working
08:31<rortom>but
08:31<rortom>money not :\
08:31<rortom>also 120 seconds are too long
08:31<rortom>thats 49 days
08:32<rortom>oh, btw
08:32<Yorick>?
08:32<rortom>the bot desyncs if the net_freq_value is changed
08:32<rortom>stats update interval now 90 sec
08:32<Yorick>1.you're talking in #openttd, 2. the bot can't desync, I think
08:33<rortom>wops :p
08:33<rortom>wrong chan ;)
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09:13*SpComb yawns
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09:38<CIA-3>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13815 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ai_controller.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: minor corrections in AIController (Yexo)
09:46<+glx>nice lag
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10:52<Yorick>hmm, is ● a real *, or is it a part of my password?
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10:54<Eddi|zuHause3>yes.
10:54<SmatZ>●●●●●●●●
10:56-!-Doorslammer [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-229-42.prem.tmns.net.au] has quit []
10:56<Eddi|zuHause3>SmatZ: does your client also mask your passwords with ● when you type it?
10:56<Eddi|zuHause3>like when i type ●●●●●● it comes out as ●●●●●●?
10:57<SmatZ>●●●●●●●
10:57<SmatZ>yeah
10:57<Eddi|zuHause3>cool ;)
10:57<Yorick>SmatZ> hunter2
10:57<Yorick>it didn't work here
10:58<SmatZ>[16:57:33] <Yorick> SmatZ>●●●●●●●
10:58<SmatZ>here it does
10:58<Yorick>ah, because it's your password :)
10:58<SmatZ>yeah :)
10:58<SmatZ>wait :-P
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11:11<planetmaker>lol. People reading too mach bash.org :P
11:11<Progman>indeed ;)
11:12<Yorick>you too, it seems
11:12<Progman>. o O (damn)
11:12<planetmaker>:) I was only told ;)
11:12<planetmaker>...or? :P
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11:19<CIA-3>OpenTTD: smatz * r13816 /trunk/ (12 files in 3 dirs): -Fix [FS#2150]: check for vehicle length changes outside a depot (callback 0x11) and give a warning about that
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12:13<dyzdyz>hi all
12:14<Yorick>hi
12:14<Yorick>what's your question
12:15<dyzdyz>i don't know how to compile openttd with copy-paste patch under Debian
12:15<dyzdyz>Debian Etch
12:15<dyzdyz>i can compile it without patch with no problems
12:15<dyzdyz>v 0.6.1
12:15<dyzdyz>where should *.patch file be located?
12:15<Yorick>what don't you know then?
12:16<Yorick>just in the directory you're compiling it in
12:16<+glx>put .patch where you want
12:16<+glx>you just need to apply it before compiling
12:16<Yorick>patch -p0 -i "/dir/to/your/patch/file.patch"
12:16<dyzdyz>oh, i didn't know that
12:17<dyzdyz>i'll try now
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12:21<Eddi|zuHause3><Ammler> Eddi|zuHause3: would like it that way ;-) <- ???
12:21<Eddi|zuHause3>what do i have to do with ferries?
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12:23<dyzdyz>ok, i've got it compiled
12:23<dyzdyz>how to check it? is there anything i neet to change in openttd.cfg?
12:23<Yorick>nope
12:23<Yorick>just run
12:24<CIA-3>OpenTTD: smatz * r13817 /trunk/src/train_cmd.cpp: -Cleanup (r13816): no need to check for ENABLE_NETWORK, _networking is defined anyway
12:24<dyzdyz>can i use my saved game?
12:24<Yorick>you can
12:24<Yorick>just RUN
12:25*SmatZ runs!
12:25<Yorick>run openttd
12:25<Yorick>cd bin
12:25<Yorick>./openttd
12:27<dyzdyz>no such file... but when i just run "openttd" game starts, but i think it's version from "deb" package
12:27<Eddi|zuHause3>run, dos, run!
12:28<Eddi|zuHause3>"make run" is the command ;)
12:28<Yorick>how exactly are you compiling?
12:28<nicfer>hmmm could I make an update to the opengfx all in one pak+
12:28<nicfer>?
12:28<dyzdyz>1. patch -p0 -i "copypaste.patch"
12:28<dyzdyz>2. ./configure
12:28<dyzdyz>3. make
12:28<dyzdyz>4. make install
12:29<Yorick>leave the make install
12:29<Yorick>I don't think you need it
12:30<Yorick>./configure && make && cd bin && ./openttd
12:30<@Rubidium>./configure && make run
12:30<Yorick>^^
12:30<dyzdyz>ok, just need to copy "sample.cat" & others
12:31<Yorick>and
12:31<Yorick>copypaste.grf ;)
12:31<Eddi|zuHause3>dyzdyz: put them in ~/.openttd/data
12:31<nicfer>could I zip my updated opengfx files and post it in the forums so people can download it faster?
12:32<Eddi|zuHause3>dyzdyz: then they can be used by every openttd installation
12:33<dyzdyz>brb
12:33<dyzdyz>phone :-)
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12:37<Eddi|zuHause3>limitation disturbs me very sprites. goes it throw out limitation?
12:42<nicfer>no response?
12:43<dyzdyz>wow
12:43<dyzdyz>i copied files into the "data" dirctory
12:43<dyzdyz>tried to run game
12:43<dyzdyz>and it look like gameserver starts...
12:44<Yorick>you have SDL installed?
12:44<Eddi|zuHause3>sdl-devel
12:45<Eddi|zuHause3>configure will cry if you don't
12:45<dyzdyz>libsdl1.2-debian
12:45<dyzdyz>?
12:46<Yorick>could you paste the configure and make output to paste.openttd.org?
12:46<dyzdyz>ok, one moment
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12:47<Eddi|zuHause3>dyzdyz: no, you need the development version of sdl
12:47<Eddi|zuHause3>not just the runtime version
12:48<dyzdyz>libsdl1.2-dev ?
12:49<Eddi|zuHause3>yes
12:49<dyzdyz>ok, done
12:49-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@78-21-228-27.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
12:49<dyzdyz>another try goes on :-)
12:49<Eddi|zuHause3>now ./configure again
12:50<dyzdyz>checking SDL... found :-)
12:50<Eddi|zuHause3>you should also install the dev versions of the other libraries used... png, freetype, fontconfig...
12:52<dyzdyz>ok, libtmidity is for music?
12:52<Yorick>it is
12:52<Yorick>zlib
12:53<dyzdyz>ok, i don't need music
12:53<Yorick>zlib is for savegame compression
12:53<Yorick>you need it to join network games
12:53<dyzdyz>i've got zlib, libpng12-dev...
12:54<dyzdyz>freetype and fontconfig now
12:54<Yorick>try ./configure
12:56<dyzdyz>checking zlib... found... checking libpng... found... checking libfreetype... not found... checking libfontconfig... not found
12:57<dyzdyz>ok, got everything - now compilig
12:58<dyzdyz>i love playing at work :-)
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13:01<dyzdyz>ok, now it works
13:01<dyzdyz>now i need to copy my savegames and .cfg
13:01<dyzdyz>are *.grf configuration saved in openttd.cfg?
13:01<Yorick>yes
13:01<dyzdyz>*is :-)
13:02<nicfer>could I zip my updated opengfx files and post it in the forums so people can download it faster?
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13:05<dyzdyz>how to tell my new version of openttd that my saves and cfg are in ~/.openttd ?
13:06<Noldo>there is propably command line option for the config
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13:07<dyzdyz>i can overwrite it, but where is the new cfg located?
13:08<dyzdyz>ok
13:08<dyzdyz>i've got it
13:08<dyzdyz>i just tried to run it as root
13:08<dyzdyz>thanks for help everyone
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13:10<nicfer>no response?
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13:28<nicfer>anyone here?
13:29<+glx>nicfer: I think you should ask on the forum as nobody here works won opengfx
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13:41<@peter1138>hello
13:43<rortom>hi
13:44<blathijs>glx: Silly graphic artists that don't use IRC :-p
13:44<blathijs>hey rortom
13:45<rortom>http://france.rigsofrods.com:8080/
13:45<rortom>also, sneak preview :)
13:46<rortom>its not perfect or anything...
13:47<blathijs>rortom: It generates its own API docs? :-)
13:48<blathijs>rortom: Or just serves them?
13:48<rortom>it serves them ;)
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13:59<@peter1138>Hm
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14:28<jordi>blathijs: I uploaded 0.6.2rc1 to experiemntal
14:29<jordi>blathijs: if 0.6.2 is released during the week, I'm confident it'll be able to slip in, and later on we'll have to fight for 0.6.3
14:29<CIA-3>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r13818 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#2157]: Deselect currently selected NewGRF when changing GRF preset.
14:29<jordi>which again, will have better chances the sooner it's released the better.
14:30<@peter1138>Well
14:30<@peter1138>That was the wrong TASK
14:30<@peter1138>never mind
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14:51<@peter1138>Hmm, autoreplace didn't refit my aRVs :o
14:51<Lakie>I suppose that could be a minor issue, Peter.
14:52<Lakie>Such as them just loading (nothing) for a long time...
14:52<@peter1138>No shit sherlock
14:53<hylje>dig deeper, Watson..
14:57<@peter1138>@seen bjarni
14:57<@DorpsGek>peter1138: bjarni was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 0 days, 22 hours, 49 minutes, and 21 seconds ago: <Bjarni> I didn't have any
14:58<hylje>he still doesn't have any
15:12<blathijs>jordi: k, cool :-)
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15:14<Wolf01>hello
15:16<ln>buongiorno
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15:19<jordi>blathijs: release people are saying the freeze starts this weekend
15:19<jordi>I don't know when exactly
15:20<jordi>so, let's count on our good luck
15:20<@peter1138>What's freezing?
15:20<rortom>feature freeze?
15:23<valhallasw>yeah, stable branch, probably
15:23<@Rubidium>jordi: but openttd 0.6.x is already in feature freeze for a long time
15:24<jordi>Rubidium: I know, but try to tell the Debian release team.
15:24<jordi>a Debian freeze is really a serious freeze, you need to fight every update
15:25<jordi>although I hope they'll be flexible due to the "network protocol compatibility" argument
15:25<@Rubidium>0.6.2 should be fairly easy to get in
15:25<Prof_Frink>jordi: That's what's powering the LHC cooldown
15:25<@Rubidium>due to the nature of the bugs that are fixed
15:25<jordi>LHC?
15:25<valhallasw>large hadron collider?
15:25<Prof_Frink>Large Hadron Collider
15:25<jordi>Prof_Frink: Debian?
15:25<jordi>/cool/!
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15:26<Prof_Frink>It's within about 3K of absolute zero
15:26<jordi>yeah, I read about it
15:26<jordi>pretty amazing
15:26<Prof_Frink>And still losing heat the the Debian Freeze
15:26<jordi>doh
15:26<jordi>now I get it :)
15:27<blathijs>jordi: We'll try to do the release tomorrow
15:28<jordi>blathijs: sounds very convenient
15:28<jordi>I'll see if any autobuilder picks openttd and unveils any build problem
15:28<jordi>in experiemntal, that is
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15:31<jordi>still no experiemntal builds
15:34<@Rubidium>it's just that everyone wants his/her packets in right now ;)
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15:35<fmauNeko>!playercount
15:35-!-fmauNeko was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Wrong channel. Retry in #openttdcoop.]
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15:35<Prof_Frink>fmauNeko: Fail.
15:35<fmauNeko>sry :p
15:40<jordi>Rubidium: the release team is being drowned in exception requests already
15:40<jordi>part of Debian was already frozen (toolchain, base system, etc) but tomorrow every other package will enter the freeze and everyone is scrambling to get their latest bits in
15:41<@Rubidium>just mail secunia and you'll get a higher place on the list
15:41<jordi>I'm seeing many new versions being uploaded, I suspect it's the same case as this one, Debian maintainers asking their upstream authors to "flush" their SVN changes to a tarball
15:41<jordi>heh
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15:42<@Rubidium>the ability to crash servers remotely should be enough to get past the freeze I reckon
15:44<jordi>that's some info I had no news about yet
15:44<jordi>is there a CVE for that?
15:44<@Rubidium>nope
15:44<jordi>will there be?
15:44<@Rubidium>not that I'm aware of
15:44<jordi>I guess mitre should be informed
15:44<jordi>it's pretty easy to do
15:45<jordi>also, if that's a vulnerability present in past versions of openttd, a CVE is good so distros patch it
15:45<jordi>it happens with freeciv frequently
15:45<jordi>well, not frequently
15:45<jordi>it has happened before
15:45<@Rubidium>for OpenTTD too
15:45<jordi>ah, good
15:46-!-TinoM| [~Tino@i59F5571A.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
15:46<@Rubidium>http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvekey.cgi?keyword=openttd
15:48<jordi>ah, all previous to Debian inclusion
15:51<rortom>mh RoR has also a debian package laying around somewhere :/
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15:54<jordi>rortom: a debian package for what?
15:56<rortom>http://rigsofrods.com/
15:56<rortom>;)
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16:00<@peter1138>Bah, stupid monitor.
16:00<@peter1138>Oh, maybe not.
16:00<jordi>rortom: wow, cool
16:00<@peter1138>It seemed to be non-linear in the X-dimension.
16:01<@peter1138>However it has an adjustment for that :o
16:01<@peter1138>Unfortunately RoR is not open source :(
16:01<rortom>yep
16:01<@peter1138>And there's no 64 bit Linux version either.
16:01<rortom>yep
16:01<rortom>http://apt.rigsofrods.com/
16:02<rortom>we are working on both topics :)
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16:02<@peter1138>64 bit support is easy: let me build it ;)
16:02<rortom>hehe :P
16:02<rortom>my 64 bit buildchain failed under gentoo :(
16:03<@peter1138>Oh bollocks, my libasound2-plugins package got updated :(
16:05<jordi>peter1138?
16:05<jordi>oh I had assumed it was fre
16:05<jordi>+e
16:06<jordi>peter1138: tell me more about that -plugins package of yours?
16:06<jordi>I'm currently talking about a 1.0.17 update in Debian with another DD on jabber :)
16:06<@peter1138>Ubuntu, I'm afraid.
16:06<@peter1138>I just compiled it with jackd support...
16:06<@peter1138>I don't know if Debian has the same issue.
16:08<jordi>peter1138: arey ou a MOTU?
16:08<@peter1138>Nope.
16:08<jordi>peter1138: we are *very* open to patches of this nature in Debian. Ubuntu will get them for free. :)
16:09<@peter1138>The support is there by default, it's just built without the jack dependency.
16:09<@peter1138>Annoying as the plugins are built as individual shared libraries, so in theory it could be a separate package.
16:09<jordi>Depends: libasound2 (>> 1.0.16), libavcodec51 (>= 0.svn20080206), libc6 (>= 2.7-1), libdbus-1-3 (>= 1.0.2), libjack0 (>= 0.109.2), libpulse0 (>= 0.9.8), libsamplerate0
16:09<jordi>Debian does TRT ;)
16:09<@peter1138>TRT?
16:09<jordi>the right thing
16:10<jordi>Build-Depends: autotools-dev, debhelper (>= 6), libasound2-dev (>= 1.0.12), libavcodec-dev, libjack-dev, libpulse-dev, libsamplerate0-dev | libsamplerate-dev, quilt (>= 0.40)
16:10<jordi>yeah, I explicitly build-dep on libjack-dev
16:10<@peter1138>Depends: libasound2 (>> 1.0.14), libc6 (>= 2.7-1), libdbus-1-3 (>= 1.1.1), libpulse0 (>= 0.9.8), libsamplerate0
16:10<@peter1138>Ubuntu doesn't want any jack dependencies by default, I believe.
16:11<Eddi|zuHause3>wasn't TRT some polish TV channel?
16:11<rortom>gentoo FTW! :)
16:11<@Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause3: turkish IIRC
16:11<blathijs>Probably because jack isn't in main and libasound is
16:11<Eddi|zuHause3>could be turkish, yes
16:11<@peter1138>blathijs: libasound2-plugins *could* technically be split up.
16:12<@peter1138>libasound2-plugins-jackd, for instance.
16:12<@peter1138>Apparently the build system does not support bits of a package in different sections.
16:12<blathijs>That might be the problem, indeed
16:13<jordi>no
16:13<jordi>splitting it is trivial
16:13<blathijs>I never really managed to understand all those *verses in Ubuntu, I like Debian's way better
16:13<@peter1138>https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-plugins/+bug/84900
16:13<blathijs>Then again, never really tried
16:13<@peter1138>Yeah, I'm tempted to switch back ;)
16:13<jordi>just put + * Merge from debian unstable, remaining changes:
16:13<jordi>+ - debian/control:
16:13<jordi>+ - Do not build-depend on libjack-dev and libavcodec-dev.
16:15<@peter1138>And I need jack to run all the synths for my keyboard ;)
16:16<jordi>ah
16:16<jordi>no build-deps from universe is a real problem
16:16<jordi>ah well, Ubuntu
16:16<jordi>Debian separates only due to licensing, not to support or not support :)
16:17<@peter1138>Indeed.
16:17*peter1138 considers the difficulty in switch to Unstable...
16:18<jordi>peter1138: testing is often a good choice too
16:18<@Rubidium>testing usually lacks security updates
16:18<@peter1138>But I like bleeding edge :)
16:18<jordi>peter1138: up to date, no bad surprises after an upgrade
16:18<jordi>Rubidium: afaik, there is testing security coverage except for the kernel
16:19<blathijs>testing-security is indeed in place since a month or so
16:20<@Rubidium>http://www.debian.org/devel/testing <- says quite explicitly something about the absense of security
16:21<rortom>http://xkcd.com/221/
16:21<rortom>;)
16:21<@Rubidium>ofcourse being near a release is a good reason to get the security team on it, but when lenny's out the security team won't touch testing till just before the near release
16:23<@Rubidium>never had any major issues with SID since I installed my laptop
16:23<@Rubidium>nearly 3 years ago
16:24<jordi>Rubidium: I've been a sid user for more than 10 years now
16:24<jordi>and I've seen scary shit
16:24<blathijs>Seems that that page is a bit outdated, testing has almost full security support
16:25<jordi>yeah
16:25<jordi>pam (0.76-6) unstable; urgency=low
16:25<jordi> * The "No, I don't think I actually want any of what upstream is
16:25<jordi> smoking" release
16:25<jordi> * If this were already in testing, this would be an severity emergency
16:25<jordi> upload
16:25<jordi> * pam_unix currently treats * in shadow file as no password not
16:25<jordi> disabled; major security issue; fixed in upstream CVS, (patch 035) Closes: #164659
16:26<blathijs>http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2008/06/msg00006.html
16:26<jordi>so, for 4 days, disabled accounts were accessible without a password
16:26<jordi>this one was fun ;)
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16:26<blathijs>jordi: yipes
16:26*Rubidium likes the excessive valgrinding too
16:27<jordi>actually, make that nearly one month
16:27<jordi>Rubidium: that was LEGENDARY ;)
16:27<jordi>that made me waste *a lot* of free time to fix
16:28<jordi>and days of paid work at office
16:28<blathijs>excessive valgrinding?
16:29<jordi>like removing two lines of code, one of which makes openssl's entropy pool a joke ;)
16:29<CIA-3>OpenTTD: glx * r13819 /trunk/config.lib: -Fix (r13801): --man-dir=xxx was 'ignored'
16:30<Eddi|zuHause3>i don't understand it...
16:30<@Rubidium>blathijs: finding a 'reading uninitialized' variable in valgrind and then trying to fix it at all costs
16:31<@Rubidium>when it's used for entropy of ssl key generation
16:32<@Rubidium>if only X, SDL and alsa would do that ;)
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16:42<blathijs>Rubidium: AH, that valgrind :-)
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16:49<@peter1138>SmatZ, why did you add that comment to callback 11?
16:50<@peter1138>In the GRF wiki, that is.
16:50<SpComb>ugh, photoshop -> HTML web design is a bad idea in my mind
16:51<@peter1138>Hmm
16:51<SpComb>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=38544 <-- hmm... I was thinking of that idea earlier
16:51<SpComb>but wasn't really interested in implementing it
16:53<@peter1138>Holy crap 13816 is a massive load of pointless ness!
16:54<Eddi|zuHause3>SpComb: iirc someone did that already like 2 years ago...
16:54<SpComb>figures
17:03-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@78-21-228-27.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO]
17:03<@peter1138>Hmm, last.fm's all changed :o
17:05<Sacro>peter1138: yeah
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17:11<Eddi|zuHause3>hm... one of these tiny black insects crawled under the surface of my display...
17:11<Prof_Frink>thrips
17:11<Prof_Frink>It'll crawl about a bit, then die and not move.
17:11<+glx>a bug?
17:11<Eddi|zuHause3>yeah... die where i cannot ever remove it...
17:12<Prof_Frink>Yep
17:14<Eddi|zuHause3>i'd make a screenshot... but ... :p
17:22<Eddi|zuHause3>"Fransenflügler beschädigt Monitore [Bearbeiten]
17:22<Eddi|zuHause3>Dieses Insekt ist zu einer Plage für Besitzer von TFT-Monitoren geworden. Vom Licht des Monitors angezogen, fliegt es durch die Lüftungsschlitze in den Flachbildschirm hinein und befindet sich dann hinter Panelglas und Diffusorfolie. Das Insekt stirbt und ist daraufhin im Monitorbild sichtbar. Garantieansprüche werden von den Herstellern unterschiedlich gehandhabt. Samsung bestätigt beispielsweise, dass "zwischen Diffusorfolie und
17:22<Eddi|zuHause3>TFT-Panel weder Staub, noch Tiere oder Fremdkörper gelangen dürften".[1]" [wikipedia]
17:22<rortom>D:
17:23-!-Nev is now known as bleepy
17:25<ln>Eddi|zuHause3: you have no problem having a dead body on your screen every day?
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17:58<Wolf01>'night
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18:20<Eddi|zuHause3>hm... i had my monitor off for an hour, and i don't see it anymore...
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18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: miham * r13820 /trunk/src/lang/ (13 files): (log message trimmed)
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2008-07-25 00:59:06
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 3 fixed by tucalipe (3)
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: catalan - 10 fixed by arnaullv (10)
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: czech - 12 fixed, 3 changed by Hadez (15)
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: danish - 21 fixed by ThomasA (21)
18:59<CIA-3>OpenTTD: dutch - 16 fixed by habell (16)
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19:34<ln>now that we know aliens exist, what next?
19:36-!-Blam [~blaminato@host86-139-173-142.range86-139.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
19:38<Eddi|zuHause3>i have one of two question: a) do we? b) is this new?, please choose ;)
19:42-!-Marduuhin [~mardo4@84.86.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:43<ln>if an apollo astronaut says they do exist, who are we to say no?
19:43-!-Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@ndb.demon.nl] has quit [Quit: Zzz]
19:43<Blam>people with common sense
19:44-!-Marduuhin [~mardo4@84.86.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
19:44<Blam>right pals, if anyone is about
19:44<Blam>i have a question
19:45<Blam>i can't seem to grasp the concept of how i should place the signals in a simple roro system
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19:59<Yexo>Blam: check http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/Presignal_Basics part 3
19:59<Blam>alright, i had a look around but didn't have much luck, thanks
20:00<Eddi|zuHause3>use YAPP ;)
20:01<Eddi|zuHause3>man... i urgently need this tanker wagon...
20:01-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:01<Eddi|zuHause3>whose brilliant idea was it to not have it available with the other wagons...
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21:13<Amix>hello
21:13<Amix>i am at the no air server using v0.6.1 RC1
21:13<Amix>:)
21:20-!-fmauNeko is now known as fmauNekAway
21:21<Eddi|zuHause2>weird version to use...
21:22<Amix>there is no v0.6.1 for morphos
21:36<Eddi|zuHause2>./configure && make?
21:39<Amix>got some problems with morphos itself. netstack
21:39<Amix>program doesnt quit fully when you quit it
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21:42<Eddi|zuHause2>use a real operating system...
21:42<Eddi|zuHause2>or a real computer for that matter
21:46<Amix>i do
21:46<Amix>morphos ;)
21:46<Amix>RC1 is great
21:46<Amix>also nightly builds works
21:47<Eddi|zuHause2>there was a "fix morphos compilation" commit somewhere recently
21:49<Amix>i know
21:49<Amix>well, i happy play v0.6.1 RC1
21:51<Amix>would be fun to have openttd for nokia e90 also
21:51<Amix>;)
21:51<Amix>but but
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23:05-!-mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
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23:31<rortom>dbg: [net] [udp] queried from '89.112.22.230'
23:31<rortom>Error: Autoreplace failed to refit. Replace engine 34 to 48 and refit to cargo 7
23:31<rortom>openttd: /compile_farm/openttd/nightly/compile_dir/src/openttd.cpp:142: void error(const char*, ...): Assertion `0' failed.
23:31<rortom>Aborted
23:31<rortom>D:
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---Logclosed Fri Jul 25 00:00:10 2008