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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-07-26

---Logopened Sat Jul 26 00:00:41 2008
00:04<TiberiusTeng>@seen Ammler
00:04<@DorpsGek>TiberiusTeng: Ammler was last seen in #openttd 13 hours, 22 minutes, and 39 seconds ago: <Ammler> so you just can check if there is a industrie with 0% and that one is new...
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01:29<Celestar>good morning
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01:56<@peter1138>Hi
01:58<Celestar>hey peter1138
01:59<Celestar>peter1138: route-setup nearly complete :D
01:59<Celestar>peter1138: got a minimal template/generic programming problem on route distruction
01:59<Celestar>destruction*
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02:11<blathijs>jordi: A watch file?
02:12<hylje>Celestar: omg! templates!
02:13<Celestar>hylje: what?
02:14<Celestar>the code is very very very full of templates
02:15<hylje>then it's all full of omg :)
02:15<hylje>does one of said templates produce, say, ponies?
02:25<blathijs>*grin*
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03:43<CIA-5>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r13831 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Codechange: Make purchase list order NewGRF property an extended byte.
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04:08<@peter1138>Hmm, 1964. I ought to replace all my old steamers.
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04:37<jordi>blathijs: debian/wach
04:37<jordi>debian/watch
04:37<jordi>see man uscan
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04:54<TiberiusTeng>@seen planetmaker
04:54<@DorpsGek>TiberiusTeng: planetmaker was last seen in #openttd 11 hours, 26 minutes, and 54 seconds ago: <planetmaker> now it compiles. Thx :)
04:57<ln>@sb
04:57<ln>@seen Bjarni
04:57<@DorpsGek>ln: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 2 days, 12 hours, 49 minutes, and 55 seconds ago: <Bjarni> I didn't have any
04:59<blathijs>jordi: I can't seem to find the actual use case for uscan/watch
04:59<blathijs>jordi: Is it meant for packagers to get notified?
04:59<dih>ln: wait another week, then it will say 4 :-P
04:59<blathijs>jordi: Or users that want nag maintainers with "new upstream version" reports?
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05:23<Wolf01>hello
05:28<Doorslammer>;)
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05:30<@peter1138>Whoops. I forgot to pause, and both the AIs went bust, in about 10 minutes.
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05:33<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: morning
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05:36<TiberiusTeng>Ammler, just wanna let you know I've incorporated NewGRF presets into the new gui :)
05:37<Ammler>you are my hero :-)
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05:41<Rexxie>dinosaurs!
05:42<Yorick>truths!
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05:44<Rexxie>dinosaurs ARE the truth!
05:44<Yorick>more truths!
05:45<Rexxie>the truth is a lie :(
05:45<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: I got exit
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05:45<Ammler>src/openttd.cpp:142: void error(const char*, ...): Assertion `0' failed.
05:46<Ammler>if I change to display mode "paths" and click on a GRF
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05:46<TiberiusTeng>ugh.
05:46<TiberiusTeng>ok, on my quest of bughunting ...
05:47<Ammler>yeah, the display mode seems broken...
05:47<Ammler>not that important, anyway
05:48<Yorick>could someone explain the openttd date format to me?
05:49<Yorick>it is counted in days
05:49<ln>Is there a risk that OpenTTD AI will become the Skynet and start the war?
05:49<Yorick>days from year 0?
05:49<Yorick>ln: not really
05:50<Eddi|zuHause3>Yorick: yes
05:50<Eddi|zuHause3>sometimes days from year 1920
05:50<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: it happens, if a grf on the list is marked...
05:51<Yorick>Eddi: I mean the date sent over the network UDP
05:51<Eddi|zuHause3>there is not actually a year 0, years switched from 1BC to 1AD on a "Point 0"
05:52<Yorick>you'll ruin my theories, shh
05:53<Yorick>hmm, why does my date constructor accept a long long for a day if it can not be any higher than 31...
05:53<Eddi|zuHause3>check "ConvertYMDToDate" and reverse...
05:54<Yorick>I know...but it isn't very clear to me
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06:04<TiberiusTeng>Ammler, fixed ... I wonder how it worked in previous versions :P
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06:04<TiberiusTeng>no need to redownload the patch
06:04<TiberiusTeng>just edit your english.txt, find STR_NEWGRF_NAME, change the {STRING} to {RAW_STRING} and remake the lang file
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06:21<CIA-5>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r13832 /trunk/src/fontcache.cpp: -Fix [FS#2152]: FreeType may return a bitmap glyph even if a grey-scale glyph was requested.
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06:30*peter1138 ponders investigating the articulated autoreplace refit problem.
06:31<Eddi|zuHause3>don't... you'll see scary bjarnisms
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06:36<Sir-Bob>Recently when compiling I've been getting a error with the determineversion.vbs. It says "Error: ActiveX component can't create object: 'Scripting.FileSystemObject'" It still compiles but shows wrong version, any ideas?
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07:50<Ammler>GermanRV released
07:52<Eddi|zuHause3>slowpoke :p
07:55<Ammler>:-)
07:56<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause3: already in use?
07:56<Eddi|zuHause3>would need to start a new game for that...
07:56<Eddi|zuHause3>not going to do that with the old paxdest patch...
08:05<@peter1138>Trunk needs YAPP and Celestar's work :D
08:05<@peter1138>When finished.
08:05<Eddi|zuHause3>exactly ;)
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08:08<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause3: don't you use the dynmaic engine pool?
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08:08<Eddi|zuHause3>Ammler: no, my version is pre-enginepool
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08:11<@peter1138>Use a later version! Loads of fixes!
08:11<Eddi|zuHause3>yeah... i'm not going to synch this stuff :p
08:11<@peter1138>Oh, you're not using trunk...
08:14<Eddi|zuHause3>main problem with updating is savegame compatibility...
08:14<Eddi|zuHause3>which is not worth it...
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08:29<Ammler>Is it possible to set a color as your default?
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08:32<@peter1138>No.
08:33<Ammler>It is mostly green here, is that intended or just accident?
08:34<@peter1138>It's random.
08:35<Ammler>Cargo tram has 5 waggons but only cap of 60 that is even not double of a truck... :-/
08:36<@peter1138>And what year is that?
08:36<Ammler>2001
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08:36<@peter1138>Hee
08:36<frosch123>german rvs?
08:36<Ammler>jep
08:37<@peter1138>Maybe it's using realistic values... ;)
08:37<frosch123>4 tons iron ore per articulated part :)
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08:38<Rexxie>are there any patches that slow down time (so a game lasts longer, vehicles are introduced slower etc)?
08:38<Ammler>refitable to Mail, Goods, Lifestock, wood and steel,
08:38<@peter1138>Rexxie, daylength.
08:38<Ammler>Rexxie: daylength patch
08:38<frosch123>however the readme tells something about capacities being wrong. But it is not clear whether the author means his set or ttdp.
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08:39<Eddi|zuHause3>i think he means ttdp displays the wrong capacities in the build window
08:39<Rexxie>many thanks :)
08:39<Eddi|zuHause3>but the capacities after build are correct
08:40<frosch123>don't know. I wouldn't mind 5x20 tons iron ore, instead of 5x4
08:41<Ammler>frosch123: also the trucks of germanrv has cap like the default trucks.
08:43<frosch123>just built a MB 0405G bus, the capacity in buy menu and after building are indeed different
08:44<Rexxie>what's preventing the daylength patch from being in trunk?
08:44<Ammler>:-)
08:44<@peter1138>The devs.
08:44<frosch123>the same holds for the passenger trams
08:44<@peter1138>frosch123, in TTDPatch or OpenTTD?
08:44<frosch123>only the cargo trams are different in that point
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08:45<Rexxie>"the devs" meaning what... the developers dont like the code? dont like the feature? think its too buggy?
08:45<frosch123>err no - the 'difference' also applies to the cargo trams
08:45<Eddi|zuHause3>Rexxie: the feature is very very incomplete regarding what should be slowed down and what should not be slowed down
08:46<Rexxie>ok
08:48<Ammler>hmm, then it might be something for the balancing branch
08:48<frosch123>peter1138: in ottd, but as the other tram sets work, it should be the fault of the grf
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08:49<Eddi|zuHause3>there's a callback for data on the build preview...
08:50<frosch123>peter1138: just scanned the log, I have a nearly finished fix for the articulated road vehicle refit problem
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08:52<Ammler>frosch123: aren't you able to append units individually in patch?
08:52<Ammler>so you can make aRV in the length you like?
08:53<frosch123>Ammler: IIRC that feature was only temporarly
08:54<Eddi|zuHause3>Ammler: i'm sure that can be prevented with callbacks
08:54<Ammler>just that would make sense to define cap per unit...
08:55<Ammler>indeed Eddi|zuHause3
08:55<@peter1138>frosch123, oh... right.
08:56*peter1138 shall continue not doing it then :D
08:58<frosch123>however autoreplace is doomed when cargo subtypes become important (e.g. different capacities)
08:58<@peter1138>Yup.
08:59<@peter1138>(George's LVs)
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09:05<Ammler>hehe, TiberiusTeng altered the warning msg. with the GUI: http://www.myimg.de/?img=grfgui4d48f.png (not sure, if that is good)
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09:08<TiberiusTeng>:P
09:08<@peter1138>Problem is you've now got two patches in one.
09:09<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: why is it cheating?
09:10<Ammler>hmm
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09:10<Ammler>TiberiusTeng: you could check if inflation is off, then the msg would be obsolete
09:10<Eddi|zuHause>gaah... i hate it... one hot day and everything blows up...
09:11<TiberiusTeng>I feel that resetting inflation is some kind of cheating ...
09:11<TiberiusTeng>yeah, another check
09:11<Ammler>:-)
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09:11<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause: do you play with inflation?
09:11<Eddi|zuHause>no
09:12<TiberiusTeng>but since changing NewGRFs is not supported in the first place, ...
09:12<Eddi|zuHause>TiberiusTeng: but you need not intentionally break stuff just because it says "it is not supported"
09:12<Ammler>it is supported, else you wouldn't be able too, it is just not recommend...
09:12<Ammler>-o
09:13<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause: he dosn't break something, he does fix something :-)
09:14<@peter1138>Wrong.
09:14<TiberiusTeng>hmm ... however I think loading NewGRFs with new cargo definitions without resetting those rates, is actually breaking stuff ...
09:14<Ammler>it is just not needed every time
09:15<Eddi|zuHause>what is this shit? after that reboot just now, kaffeine keeps on crashing...
09:15<@peter1138>I don't see why a patch to change the NewGRF GUI should ever affect the economy.
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09:16<TiberiusTeng>how about a global counter that records how many times AddInflation() is called, and redo that after resetting cargo rates?
09:17<Ammler>peter1138: reset engines is there too..
09:17<@peter1138>And shouldn't be.
09:17<@peter1138>There's no need for it to be automatically called.
09:17<Ammler>maybe moving them all to the cheat menu?
09:17<@peter1138>Well it could be a console command.
09:18<Ammler>no you do not like console commands!
09:18<@peter1138>No, I don't like you.
09:18<Ammler>:-)
09:19<TiberiusTeng>I don't see how it will become 'less evil' by making it more obscure to use ...
09:19<@peter1138>When the cargo rates can be done in a way that doesn't change the existing economy values, then it can be automatic.
09:20<@peter1138>When you can detect if a vehicle GRF is added or removed, then it can be automatic with a warning.
09:21<@peter1138>But as it is with your patch, just adding a station GRF will mess up the game.
09:22<Ammler>what about just allowing it in the scenario editor?
09:22<@peter1138>TiberiusTeng: possible solution for the inflation issue...
09:22<@peter1138>No counter is needed, because you can determine it from one of the old inflation values.
09:23<@peter1138>Compare a value before reset with the value after reset. Then apply inflation multiple times until they match, or at least match very closely.
09:23<@peter1138>If you fancy writing that as a separate patch... ;)
09:26<TiberiusTeng>hmm ... since StartupEconomy() resets everything, so I can use something in _price to "match" ?
09:26<TiberiusTeng>how "separate" do you want ? from the new NewGRF GUI ? :p
09:27<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13833 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ (ai_road.cpp ai_road.hpp): [NoAI] -Fix: make all AIRoad::IsNNN() also check for CurrentRoadType (Yexo)
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09:29<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13834 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ai_controller.hpp: [NoAI] -Fix: make doxygen happy again
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09:34<sheskar_>Even when I set the construction speed of my opponents to "very fast", with the new AI they only build very few trucks, maybe up to 15 or 20. How can I tweak it so that they really build lots of stuff? I'm using version 0.6.1.
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09:37<TiberiusTeng>finished a two-liner patch for the inflation issue. Now it's testing time ... :D
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09:41<frosch123>peter1138: Wrt. http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=36105&start=21 Do you know why some things are not done for articulated parts? I.e. http://www.math.tu-clausthal.de/~mtce/ottd/articulatedcb10.diff
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09:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13835 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: added AITile.IsStationTile (Yexo)
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10:01<@peter1138>frosch123, I cannot remember.
10:03<@peter1138>TiberiusTeng, separate as in separate...
10:07<TiberiusTeng>http://paste.openttd.org/36595 something like this ?
10:08<@peter1138>Something like that.
10:08<TiberiusTeng>forgot to include src/economy.cpp (remove static on AddInflation() so it can be called from openttd.cpp)
10:08<@peter1138>Of course it messes up if the base costs are changed, but...
10:09<@peter1138>But...
10:09<@peter1138>That doesn't work anyway.
10:09<TiberiusTeng>... NewGRF can change _price.build_railvehicle ?
10:10<TiberiusTeng>perhaps a counter would be better in that case ...
10:10<SmatZ>http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2074 isn't this the same? (except the inflation stuff)
10:11<@peter1138>SmatZ: No.
10:11<@peter1138>It's a better solution.
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10:15<Eddi|zuHause>it was closed very prematurely i think...
10:15*SmatZ agrees
10:16<SmatZ>but true is that automatic price calculation is better than console command
10:16-!-dlunch [~dlunch@61.108.29.49] has joined #openttd
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>if we have a "resetengines" command, there's no reason why we shouldn't have a "reseteconomy" command
10:16*peter1138 tidies up TiberiusTeng's patch.
10:16<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, but it's better if it's automatic.
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>yes, but automatic is bad if it may break stuff
10:17<TiberiusTeng>ahh, it should force bypass the year check in AddInflation(), or it will stuck in loop if _cur_year is too large ...
10:18<@peter1138>TiberiusTeng, ok.
10:18<@peter1138>I don't think that's needed.
10:18<SmatZ>peter1138: what about first calculating number of AddInflation() calls (with old base prices), and after resetting the economy calling it again? (but it would make code more complex)
10:19<@peter1138>Possible.
10:19<TiberiusTeng>the counter must saved in the savegame ...
10:21<Eddi|zuHause>i have a feeling having a simple counter is easier than recalculating everything
10:23<SmatZ>but it would need a savegame bump... and if it is possible to calculate (in a short time with a simple algorithm), why not do so
10:24<Eddi|zuHause>that sounds like a valid argument ;)
10:24<@peter1138>http://svn.bucks.net/~petern/reseteconomy.diff
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10:27<@peter1138>(Does that work? heh)
10:28<Yorick>I hope it does
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10:28<TiberiusTeng>some FF in a new game will find out ;)
10:28<@peter1138>Mmm, my game already has the cargo types I want ;)
10:30<@peter1138>A little larger than TiberiusTeng's patch, but means no change at all if no cargo types are added. Although, if they are only changed... :o
10:32<Eddi|zuHause>what happens if i intentionally have a cargo with a payment rate of 0?
10:32<@peter1138>Then it will just reset even though it's not needed.
10:32<@peter1138>And nobody will transport that cargo type...
10:33<Eddi|zuHause>it could have very ill (newgrf) sideeffects besides not being paid ;)
10:34<frosch123>ships need ballast to not overturn :p
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10:44<SmatZ>peter1138: what about computing the number of inflation steps from _economy.max_loan ?
10:44<SmatZ>or are newgrfs able to change that value?
10:45<SmatZ>_economy.max_loan_unround that is
10:45<@peter1138>Unfortunately that doesn't doesn't change in the same way as regular inflation.
10:46<@peter1138>Oh, unrounded...
10:46<@peter1138>That sounds like a good idea.
10:47<SmatZ>:)
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10:58<CIA-5>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r13836 /trunk/src/ (economy.cpp economy_func.h openttd.cpp): -Fix [FS#2074]: Automatically recalculate inflation if NewGRFs are changed and cargo types are added, so that cargo payment rates are correct.
10:58<@peter1138>So guys
10:59<@peter1138>Main use is of course for changing cargo types in a scenario....
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11:00<Ammler>;-)
11:02<CIA-5>OpenTTD: glx * r13837 /branches/noai/ (74 files in 4 dirs): [NoAI] -Sync: with trunk r13787:13836.
11:06<@peter1138>TiberiusTeng, you need to update your patch ;)
11:07<TiberiusTeng>the newgrf one? sure :)
11:08<Ammler>THank you guys and sorry for the obsolete work on the gui, TiberiusTeng.
11:08<TiberiusTeng>obsolete work ? what did you mean ?
11:09<Ammler>inclusion of those 2 functions there, which you need to remove now again...
11:10<Eddi|zuHause>you have a weird definition of "obsolete"
11:11<Eddi|zuHause>if everyone goes by that philosophy, nobody would ever build prototypes
11:11<TiberiusTeng>actually it was just a few lines now also in peter1138's update ;)
11:12<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause: is obsolete a bad word?
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11:14<Yorick>we should enlarge the openttd icon to vista sizes
11:14<Yorick>aka 256x256 :)
11:14<@peter1138>Has already been discussed.
11:14<hylje>there's a 512x512 icon in media i think
11:15<@peter1138>There's an SVG icon on wikipedia.
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11:15<Yorick>I know
11:16<Yorick>but we should get it into the binaries
11:16<Yorick>you*
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11:17<@peter1138>Why? I never see the icon anyway.
11:19<Yorick>it would look rather nice if I would set my desktop to XXL-Icons
11:20<Eddi|zuHause>nobody uses windows anyway...
11:20<Celestar>heyo
11:20<Yorick>some of our users do
11:21<Yorick>your*
11:21<Eddi|zuHause>nobody cares about users :p
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11:21<Yorick>Eddi: you're right...I don't really care about you
11:22<+glx>Yorick: but msvc8 doesn't support vista icons
11:22<Yorick>isnt msvc8 for vista?
11:22<Celestar>peter1138: heh. currently, my entire route network system just adds 70 lines to existing C++ and header files, and this *includes* the introduction of the "prev" member to the Order class.
11:23<+glx>msvc8 is 2005
11:23<@peter1138>Hmm
11:23<Yorick>who uses 2005 software anyway
11:24<+glx>those who paid it and are satisfied with it for example
11:24<Celestar>peter1138: apart from that, I'm adding about 20 lines of code :P
11:25<+glx>btw mingw as no problems with that ;)
11:25<@peter1138>And several thousand lines of Boost? ;)
11:25<@peter1138>But... cool.
11:25<@peter1138>How are owners handled?
11:27<Celestar>peter1138: not at all. as they do not share stations, it's no problem
11:27<Celestar>peter1138: their route networks do not interfere
11:27<@peter1138>Ah right. And if they did then it would still work properly.
11:27<Eddi|zuHause>you just get isolated components
11:27<Celestar>peter1138: correct
11:27<Celestar>even with shared stations
11:28<Eddi|zuHause>the existing patch has an experimental "walk x tiles" feature, which could be used to transfer between separate companies
11:28<Celestar>because we could pay-per-route-segment
11:28<Celestar>Eddi|zuHause: I'm not doing anything like this (yet)
11:29<Eddi|zuHause>just wanted to point out ;)
11:33<Celestar>Eddi|zuHause: sure
11:33<Celestar>peter1138: I'm currently not taking the maximum speed of the vehicles into account.
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11:34<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, doesn't the existing patch have a 'hiccup every month' feature?
11:34<Eddi|zuHause>:p
11:35<Celestar>peter1138: no, it has a "hiccup every day" feature, because it loops all existing cargopackets every day
11:35<Eddi|zuHause>the DB route calculation has also the ability to check "identical targets" [like route people from a station to the bus stop in front of the station]
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11:36<Celestar>Eddi|zuHause: the what?!
11:36<@peter1138>I think he's talking about real life.
11:36<@peter1138>Whatever that is.
11:37<@peter1138>In OpenTTD, of course, you'll just make the bus station part of the train station, thus an 'identical target.'
11:37<Celestar>peter1138: I've heard rumors that it exists
11:37*glx should try with the latest SDK
11:38<Eddi|zuHause>no, it's a simulation what you could do if you actually wanted to check out this "real life"...
11:39<Celestar>peter1138: I dunno how many lines of codes boost needs, but my route network framework is around 700 (400 of which are comments)
11:41<@peter1138>Mmm, it's good to avoid NIH syndrome if the code is good enough>
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11:44<@peter1138>Bah, updated my YAPP build and my savegame's lost :(
11:45<Eddi|zuHause>that is exactly what i meant...
11:47<@peter1138>Hmm, actually it might just be missing GRFs :o
11:50<@peter1138>Yay, it was.
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11:55<Celestar>peter1138: NIH syndrome?
11:56<@peter1138>Not-Invented-Here
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11:57<Celestar>peter1138: that means? We shouldn't reinvent the wheel?
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11:57<@peter1138>Yeah.
11:58<@peter1138>Unless it's autoreplace :D
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11:59<SmatZ>making OTTD dependant on boost only for one thing... I am not in favour of that idea
12:00<SmatZ>I hope it would be only compile-time dependency
12:01<@peter1138>It is a template library, I believe?
12:01<@peter1138>Of course, I am not against rewriting things when it can be improved or cut down to our needs.
12:02<@peter1138>Usually the latter, as there are plenty more skilled programmers than me :)
12:03<SmatZ>all I know is that installing boost takes ages on my system because it tries to optimise it somehow...
12:03<SmatZ>hehe sure :-D
12:03<SmatZ>*it->itself
12:07<Celestar>SmatZ: it is a template library
12:07<Celestar>SmatZ: only compile time, and its not a lot of files
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12:11<frosch123>do you want a new version of yapp?
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12:13<@peter1138>Who?
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12:14<CIA-5>OpenTTD: frosch * r13838 /trunk/ (12 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Make industry tiles aware of WaterClasses.
12:14<frosch123>I am quite sure the major version number of yapp will increase in near future :p
12:15<SmatZ>frosch123: did you find/fixed any new YAPP bug?
12:15<frosch123>no, I bumped the savegame version :)
12:15<SmatZ>aha :)
12:16<@peter1138>Boo!
12:17<@peter1138>Maybe michi_cc will just give up and never update it again! ;(
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12:25<planetmaker>g'day
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12:37<Eddi|zuHause>omg, he's gone down under...
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12:41<plakkertjes>hello
12:42<plakkertjes>anybody know why my monorail isnt available?
12:42<plakkertjes>:P
12:42<+glx>any grf?
12:42<plakkertjes>excuse me
12:42<plakkertjes>:P
12:42<plakkertjes>ye
12:43<plakkertjes>ye i do have those
12:43<plakkertjes>but why is it not working :(
12:44<+glx>if the grf provides electric trains, then it can't have monorail and maglev
12:47<plakkertjes>uhm
12:47<plakkertjes>so what'd i do? ()
12:47<plakkertjes>:P
12:47<plakkertjes>you know what
12:47<plakkertjes>ill tell you what i did -.-
12:48<+glx>don't use newgrfs or don't use monorail
12:48<plakkertjes>i copied the .cfg of the server of #openttdcoop
12:48<plakkertjes>because
12:48<plakkertjes>all i wanted is that trains dont slow down on slopes
12:48<plakkertjes>:)
12:48<+glx>realistic acceleration on or off (can't remember)
12:49<plakkertjes>ye, well dont work as far as I know
12:49<plakkertjes>ill try, thank you
12:49<plakkertjes>brb
12:49<Vikthor>some of the newgrf sets have convetional trains powerfull enough not to slow down
12:49<Vikthor>you have to search though
12:50<DaleStan><glx> if the grf provides electric trains, then it can't have monorail and maglev <-- Incorrect. Newgrf allows for all four track types, and, AFAICT, always has.
12:52<+glx>right but as most are designed for TTDPatch, 1 type as to go
12:52<Lakie>TTDPacth and OpenTTD have historically merged one based off electrication however.
12:52<Lakie>merged monorail and maglev
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13839 /branches/noai/src/ (8 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: introducing, save/load possibility for AIs. When you define a
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: Save() function in your AI, the table you 'return' from that function is stored
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: in the savegame. When loading a savegame, the function Load() is called in your
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: AI, with as only parameter the table you stored. (Yexo)
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: WARNING: you can (and will) receive data of other AIs when someone opens a
12:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: savegame while he doesn't have the AI used to make the savegame. Your AI might
13:00<Wolf01>your ai might... might what?
13:01<Eddi|zuHause>right... i just wanted to open a spam-account at hotmail, and it wants me to "update my browser" :ü
13:01<Eddi|zuHause>:p
13:05<Ammler>Wolf01: http://hg.openttd.org:8000/branches/noai.hg/rev/ff06fab6125c
13:06<Wolf01>I know it :P
13:13*peter1138 finishes weeding a metre square patch...
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13:14<@peter1138>17:43 +glx> if the grf provides electric trains, then it can't have monorail and maglev
13:14<@peter1138>^ Also not true with the engine pool stuff...
13:15<Wolf01>i'll be back!
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13:16<Eddi|zuHause>i thought it was possible before, just nobody used it because of ttdp
13:16<@peter1138>Correct.
13:17<+glx>we support 4 types, but most grfs have only 3
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13:19<SmatZ>there is space for 16 rail types in the map array :)
13:19<SmatZ>at least for MP_RAIL
13:19*peter1138 mumbles about his not-yet-available rail type patches also...
13:20<frosch123>and varaction2 variable 'current rail type' is not supported at all
13:20<@peter1138>:)
13:20<+glx>frosch123: because it's not desync safe
13:21<@peter1138>It could be done.
13:21<+glx>of course
13:21<frosch123>and it depends on ttdp settings
13:21<@peter1138>Only if in a purchase list.
13:21<frosch123>i.e. it does not support 4 rail typs
13:23<plakkertjes>does anybody know where i can get teh default .cfg for openttd?
13:23<frosch123>delete your config file
13:23<+glx>openttd -c default.cfg
13:23<plakkertjes>ok, i get frosch
13:23<plakkertjes>=]
13:23<plakkertjes>thanks though glx
13:24<plakkertjes>so you guys make openttd?
13:24<+glx>my solution is good to get default values without deleting everythings
13:24<plakkertjes>ye but glx, i dunno what to do with your line
13:24<plakkertjes>command line?
13:24<+glx>yes
13:25<plakkertjes>ah well i have already deleted it
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13:30<plakkertjes>what do i ahve to adjust in patches to get 'no breakdowns'
13:30<plakkertjes>?
13:30<plakkertjes>NVM
13:30<plakkertjes>:)
13:31<+glx>it's not in patches
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13:36<plakkertjes>ye i figured
13:36<plakkertjes>=]
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13:46<Roujin>long time no see :>
13:47<Wolf01>hello Roujin
13:47<Yorick>hello Roujin
13:54<Roujin>not much happening here eh? :)
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13:56<CIA-5>OpenTTD: frosch * r13840 /trunk/src/autoreplace_gui.cpp: -Fix: Some glitches in the autoreplace GUI.
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14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13841 /branches/noai/ (16 files in 5 dirs): (log message trimmed)
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: assign a 'dummy' AI in case there is no AI available, in such way
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: this dummy AI is always available (hardcoded in C++); this reduces complexity in
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: those corner cases someone trashes his whole ai/ dir (which of course will
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: always be a select amount of users who try..)
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: make sure an AI starts only when the AI blob is found, so the load-data has effect on the AI to load (instead of leaving it to pure luck and buffer-residu)
14:57<CIA-5>OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: for old savegames, make sure that ever AI controller company has an AI assigned to it (which contradicts above statement ;))
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14:58<Noetloj>heyy, is there any way to get the random generation to allow a snowline on temperate? It only activates upon Arctic :(
15:03<Eddi|zuHause>there once was a really really old patch that allowed this
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15:06<+glx>you can use a grf to have temperate on arctic
15:06<+glx>with variable snowline
15:08<Noetloj>Hmm.
15:08<Noetloj>is there a way for me to feature request it to be allowed onto Temperate, at all?
15:09<Noetloj>Having snow capped hills on temperate would be kinda neat :)
15:09<frosch123>play 'alpine' grf. It modifies arctic to look like temperate. however you can hardly combine it with other grfs.
15:10<+glx>it works with dbset
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15:34<@peter1138>Hmm, this 'new' method of placing one-way roads is much harder :o
15:34<Eddi|zuHause>i have never used one way roads
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15:38<@peter1138>Well you used to place them on top of roads. Now you have to remove the road first.
15:39<+glx>no, use autoroad + oneway
15:39<Eddi|zuHause>which great mind had that idea?
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15:41<@peter1138>glx, doesn't work properly
15:41<@peter1138>Hmm, maybe it's because I'm not the owner.
15:41<@peter1138>(The owner is N/A)
15:42<+glx>bankrupted company?
15:42<@peter1138>Yes.
15:42<@peter1138>Requiring autoroad seems odd too.
15:43<@peter1138>Yeah, if it's not owned by you, you get a message about road already being there, not 'can't make road one-way cos you're not the owner'
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15:54<rortom>hi all
15:54<rortom>whats the status of 32bit ottd?
15:55<rortom>meaning 32bpp
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15:56<Noetloj>32bpp would ruin OpenTTD.
15:57<@peter1138>OpenTTD supports 32bpp graphics.
15:57<hylje>openttd is therefore ruined
15:57<@peter1138>But there is no comprehensive set.
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15:58<rortom>just saw this: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/32bpp_Extra_Zoom_Levels
15:59<Noetloj>[20:57] <hylje> openttd is therefore ruined <--- gah.
16:00<+glx>that is not supported rortom
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16:04<@peter1138>Oh piss, I forgot to bid.
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16:07<CIA-5>OpenTTD: truebrain * r13842 /branches/noai/src/ai/ai_info_dummy.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix r13841: don't forget to add files
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16:28<CIA-5>OpenTTD: glx * r13843 /branches/noai/src/ai/ai_info_dummy.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix (r13842): 'unicode' compilation failed
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18:01<CIA-5>OpenTTD: frosch * r13844 /trunk/src/ (engine_gui.cpp engine_type.h): -Fix (r13074, r13591): Power, running cost and capacity of multiheaded engines were (too often) doubled in newspaper resp. offer window.
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18:42<Wolf01>'night
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19:12<AAK>is there a non-text-editing program that can edit vehicle stats in NFOs?
19:13<Eddi|zuHause>grfmaker?
19:13<AAK>though i'm not sure exactly how to use it, when i tried to import nfos, it gives me "out of range" errors
19:14<AAK>actuaslly "Range check error"
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19:17<AAK>can anyone help me with grfmaker?
19:18<Ammler>maybe grfmaker just doesn't support the GRF
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19:19<AAK>okay. but if the grf was supported, all i'd have to do is "paste nfo"?
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19:31<ln>@seen Bjarni!
19:31<@DorpsGek>ln: Error: 'Bjarni!' is not a valid nick.
19:31<ln>DorpsGek: don't start discriminating people like that
19:51<ln>Oceanic Airlines
19:52<Eddi|zuHause>flight 815?
19:53<ln>actually i watched a completely different movie with friends tonight, which featured Oceanic Airlines.
19:54<ln>http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0116253/
19:54<Eddi|zuHause>there are no coincidences ;)
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19:56<Eddi|zuHause>that plot sounds highly exaggerated...
19:57<ln>hercule poirot was one of the terrorists
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19:59<Eddi|zuHause>that name does not appear in the cast...
20:00<ln>david suchet
20:01<Eddi|zuHause>hm... i was never really interested in agatha christie stuff
20:07<ln>"ten little niggers" aka "and then there were none" is good at least.
20:07<ln>by christie.
20:07<ln>the book.
20:09<ln>good night for now, though
20:10<Eddi|zuHause>"zehn kleine jägermeister" :p
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---Logclosed Sun Jul 27 00:00:02 2008