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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-09-16

---Logopened Tue Sep 16 00:00:57 2008
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00:19<Forked:#openttd>I take it they went mental with serverbans a few hours ago?
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00:47<ccfreak2k:#openttd>It was a mistake.
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01:10<Forked:#openttd>figured :)
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02:07<roboboy:#openttd>I wonder why
02:07<roboboy:#openttd>gah
02:07<roboboy:#openttd>fixing a problem with mibbit
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02:07<roboboy:#openttd>fixing a problem with mibbit
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02:07<roboboy:#openttd>fixing a problem with mibbit
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02:08<Forked:#openttd>...
02:08<Forked:#openttd>fixed it yet? =p
02:08<roboboy:#openttd>yes
02:09<roboboy:#openttd>I figured id tell people why I was cycling instead of random parts and rejoins
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03:37<Tim:#openttd>Morning
03:38<planetmaker:#openttd>morning folks
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03:41<@Celestar:#openttd>\o
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03:41<roboboy:#openttd>hello
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03:57<ln-:#openttd>what did they do now?
03:57<Forked:#openttd>kill all
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04:01<ln-:#openttd>why?
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04:09<roboboy:#openttd>it is the bi-annual *@* akill from #oftc
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06:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>is CIA on strike for the last week?
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06:17<CommanderZ:#openttd>it was okay yesterday
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06:31<ccfreak2k:#openttd>There's a CIA in #mumble at Freenode that announces SVN commits sporadically.
06:32*Eddi|zuHause:#openttd slaps CIA-2
06:32*Eddi|zuHause:#openttd kicks CIA-2
06:32<CIA-2:#openttd>ow
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07:17*dih:#openttd would like to make some console changes ;-)
07:17<dih:#openttd>add some output
07:17<dih:#openttd>i.e. when a company goes bankrupt
07:17<dih:#openttd>output the client id when a client joins
07:17<dih:#openttd>or leaves
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07:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>oh... more yorick puppets
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07:19<dih:#openttd>thanks!
07:19<dih:#openttd>i was kinda being serious
07:20<dih:#openttd>i was not even wanting to add commands, just debug output
07:20<dih:#openttd>and you instult me with a word i dont want to repeat here again
07:20<dih:#openttd>:-P
07:22<@Rubidium:#openttd>what use it is? Except remotely logging all kinds of information via a client-slot
07:26<Sacro:#openttd>hehehehe
07:26<Sacro:#openttd>"client-slot"
07:27<planetmaker:#openttd>[13:22] <Rubidium> what use it is? Except remotely logging all kinds of information via a client-slot <-- autopilot could possibly make use of it.
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07:31<Ammler:#openttd>Maybe it would be worth to ask Kurt for his patch.
07:32<Ammler:#openttd>Rubidium: the "old" nightly server is switched off?
07:33<Ammler:#openttd>no chance to get some builds? (like wwottdgd/1)
07:33<Ammler:#openttd>http://nightly.openttd.org/wwottdgd/
07:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>it's not turned of, don't know whether you can reach it though
07:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>no, you can't reach it
07:33<Ammler:#openttd>I would like to wget those
07:33<welshdragon:#openttd>dih, console too should be able to allow server admins the removal of company passwords, without cleaning the server
07:33<Ammler:#openttd>so we can save them with our save.
07:34*Celestar:#openttd wonders whether to poke TrueBrain for another cargodest build :P
07:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>Celestar: just let me know :)
07:34*welshdragon:#openttd wants to moan at Brianetta more
07:34<@Celestar:#openttd>TrueBrain: ok. go ahead (=
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07:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>[2008-09-16 11:35:43] Scheduled task 0000008 started
07:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>Cargodest == 0000008
07:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>:)
07:36<Forked:#openttd>woo
07:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>[2008-09-16 11:36:26] Task 0000053 created (hg://hg.openttd.org/developers/celestar/cargodest.hg, h2d7ff353)
07:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: why didn't you download them when they were still available .. you of all people knew the old place would become unreachable (as I told you so :))
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07:37<Ammler:#openttd>well, didn't think for wwottdgd
07:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>stu-pid :)
07:38<Ammler:#openttd>well, the world will still cycle without :-)
07:39<Ammler:#openttd>I thought, you won't make new nightlies anymore there
07:39<Ammler:#openttd>not that it isn't reachable at all.
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>what did I say about that ... if you keep things available, people don't switch? :p
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>http://binaries.openttd.org/temp/forAmmler/
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>will be gone in like 20 minutes :p
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07:41<Ammler:#openttd>TrueBrain: they need to switch for new things...
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07:46<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: http://rbijker.net/openttd/cargop.diff (don't think I've seen all, i.e. let other devs review too)
07:47<Ammler:#openttd>shouldn't "wget -m <url>" download all packs at once?
07:49<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: thanks. I'll look at it in a minute or two
07:50<TrueBrain:#openttd>Rubidium: you faked 'Rietveld' (remember, that piece of software we used a few times :p)
07:51*ccfreak2k:#openttd is still waiting for Tiberius to update his opengl patch. :(
07:51<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: I think the "XXX" are your command, right?
07:51<@Rubidium:#openttd>TrueBrain: no, Rietfeld faked me!
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07:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>lol
07:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>Celestar: no, that are compilable opcodes :p
07:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: no they are my comments, in the previous review cycle I used >>> so I added <<< to it
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07:57<@peter1138:#openttd>heh
07:57<@peter1138:#openttd>XXX looks wrong to me!
07:57<@peter1138:#openttd>Well I did try fixing it but he didn't want it :o
07:57<Ammler:#openttd>TrueBrain: now I know, why I can't mirror them :-)
07:57<Ammler:#openttd>got a 404ert
07:58<Ammler:#openttd>-t
07:58<@peter1138:#openttd>(imho we should always be compatible with trunk, regardless of the ability to test previous saves)
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07:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: euh?
08:00<Ammler:#openttd>http://wwottdgd.openttdcoop.org/bundles/binaries.openttd.org/temp/forAmmler/OTTD-linux-amd64-wwottdgd-r11344-wwottdgd.tar.bz2
08:00<Ammler:#openttd>oh
08:00<Ammler:#openttd>sorry :-P
08:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>euh .. yeah ...
08:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>maybe better luck next time :p
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08:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: soon I can create a new set of binaries for you, based on the new compile-farm
08:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>then it can stay under custom/ and use our bandwidth, for all I care
08:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>(and soon: MIRRORS!)
08:01<Ammler:#openttd>we are already at wwottdgd/2
08:01<Ammler:#openttd>but for wwottdgd/3, that might be useful :-)
08:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>there was already a 1 and 2, not?
08:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>ah, like that
08:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>hehe
08:02<dih:#openttd>Rubidium: autopilot (and some other applications) wrap around the dedicated console
08:02<Ammler:#openttd>but I like to keep the old binaries, because the saves aren't compatible to other binaries.
08:02*peter1138:#openttd mirrors TrueBrain
08:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>peter1138: sounds painful :(
08:02<dih:#openttd>(as other apps, see Kurt's Servers)
08:03<dih:#openttd>keeping track of companies when there is one information missing, namely companies being closed due to bankrupcy
08:03<Ammler:#openttd>but why doesn't work my "wget -m". :-(
08:03<dih:#openttd>also - these wrapper aps (also admins) make use of client_id's
08:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: by now you could have done it manual
08:03<Ammler:#openttd>well, of course.
08:04<dih:#openttd>is he asking for someone to code for him again?
08:04<Ammler:#openttd>but then I would still not know, what my problem is and can't sleep...
08:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>Celestar: http://www.openttd.org/download-cargodest <- there! (finally I can give you THAT url :))
08:04<dih:#openttd>welshdragon: i did clearly say earlier, that i was not after adding console commands
08:04<dih:#openttd>that will not happen anyway afaik
08:04<Forked:#openttd>nice
08:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>if not it seems to display the old data ...
08:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>takes 5 minutes for him to reload the cache entries :p
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08:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Unhandled Exception
08:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>An unhandled exception was thrown by the application.
08:07<dih:#openttd>so, would it be such a bad idea to add more debug output?
08:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>@TrueBrain (clicking on the link above)
08:08<Ammler:#openttd>worked here...
08:08<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: works here
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08:08<Ammler:#openttd>I had that error yesterday for the server page (or was it on sunday)
08:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>redirects me to http://www.openttd.org/de/download-cargodest first, maybe that has something to do with it?
08:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: yup, fixed that
08:09<dih:#openttd>hehe - TrueBrain: browser detection? :-P
08:09<dih:#openttd>language detection rather
08:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>or maybe because i use konqueror?
08:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: no, that should happen
08:09<SmatZ:#openttd>indeed, with Konqueror, it fails
08:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TrueBrain: yes, it should happen, but maybe it doesn't work correctly?
08:10<SmatZ:#openttd>but it seems to be Konqueror error
08:10<SmatZ:#openttd>konquerror :)
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08:10<planetmaker:#openttd>lol @ SmatZ :)
08:10<TrueBrain:#openttd>what the ...
08:10<TrueBrain:#openttd>one browser who can trigger the error ... how is that possible :p
08:11<Ammler:#openttd>you might need to define another Browser as *default" browser for KDE :-)
08:11<ccfreak2k:#openttd>SmatZ, how long were you waiting to use THAT gem?
08:11<SmatZ:#openttd>stupid, I know :)
08:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it IS kind of funny ;)
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08:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>do you have any idea how hard it is nowedays to copy/paste a 'tab' from somewhere?
08:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>I hope to open kwrite for it :s
08:12<SmatZ:#openttd>no
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08:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it happens with the other download pages, too
08:13<Ammler:#openttd>seriously, I need help :-)
08:14<Ammler:#openttd>how do I download the whole directory at once?
08:14<Ammler:#openttd>(http://binaries.openttd.org/temp/forAmmler/)
08:14<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: I suggest visiting your doctor
08:14<@Celestar:#openttd>Ammler: wget -r --no-parent I thin
08:14<@Celestar:#openttd>k
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08:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: any only the download page .. weird ;)
08:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yeah, the other pages seem fine
08:16*Rubidium:#openttd wonders whether his konqueror is broken; it doesn't show unhandled exceptions
08:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>main page, screenshots, servers, development
08:17<SmatZ:#openttd>I have Konqueror 3.5.10
08:17<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: > grep ^XXX review.diff | wc -l
08:17<@Celestar:#openttd>78
08:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>happens also in konqueror/kde4
08:17<@Celestar:#openttd>only 78 comments :D
08:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>haha :p
08:18<Ammler:#openttd>Celestar: -r is included in -m but I tried it too and failed...
08:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: yeah, like: check the whole diff for xyz because it happens too often to annotate all
08:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>local variable 'architecture' referenced before assignment
08:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>what?!
08:18<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: uh?
08:19*TrueBrain:#openttd hits Rubidium
08:20-!-mortal` [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>but.. but... it worked in php!
08:21<hylje:#openttd>scope is a scary thing
08:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>archictecture = "*"
08:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>architecture.replace("i386", "i686")
08:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>find the mistake
08:21<hylje:#openttd>hahaha
08:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>(well, with this copy/paste it is darn easy ..
08:21-!-mortal`` [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>but I did had to look 20 times :p
08:22*hylje:#openttd doesn't typo names like, ever
08:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>another note: the top of the page used to have two dozen language flags. they are somehow gone now
08:23<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: yeah, because many of your fellow country people started to complain that the german translation was broken
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>there Eddi|zuHause
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>and tnx ;)
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: because people are idiots
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>and don't understand: no languages are translated yet
08:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yeah, page works now ;)
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>"Why does the website show up in english!?! I pressed the German flag!"
08:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>dipwits
08:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TrueBrain: add a warning "this page is not translated yet"?
08:24<TrueBrain:#openttd>removing the flags is more efficient
08:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>especially since not all pages will get translated at once
08:24<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: they will still miss that warning
08:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes, but not future-proof ;)
08:24<@Rubidium:#openttd>as people can't find the downloads either
08:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>I mean, how can you not find the downloads?!
08:25<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>there's no general "Download" item in the "Frontpage"/"About"/... bar
08:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>no, ther eis a very big DOWNLOAD bar just on top of it ..
08:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes, but it is not in the bar below ;)
08:26<Ammler:#openttd>is it possible that lighttdp not compatible for wget?
08:27<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: your 20 minutes are up :p
08:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: possible the index pages are too htmlized for wget to understand, yes
08:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>but most of all, the problem is because wget tries to download 'index.html'
08:29-!-mode/#openttd [+v peter1138] by ChanServ
08:30-!-sulai [~Miranda@p5B2B5F68.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
08:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>fixing that, Ammler, it still doesn't work, so give up
08:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it downloads index..html and robots.txt here
08:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then stops
08:31<Ammler:#openttd>is there no option for wget to work around that?
08:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>www.google.com
08:33<Ammler:#openttd>:-P
08:33<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>anyway, i have drag-and-dropped these links to a directory faster than configured wget to get them :p
08:38<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>echo '<copy-paste-table here>' | awk '{ system("wget " $1) }' <- how about that?
08:38-!-bleepy [bleepy@5ad456bb.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:38<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>need to put the prefix somewhere
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09:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: do you already have the files?
09:03<Sacro:#openttd>please e-mail me the files
09:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: About-page updated, tnx for the feedback :)
09:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>26 minutes to Weeds...
09:08*TrueBrain:#openttd removes the last CNAME from the OpenTTD DNS record .. good bye old friend, you always served us well .. (Refering to a specific piece of hardware in this world)
09:08<Gekz:#openttd>LoL
09:09<Gekz:#openttd>what's the difference between a CNAME and an A record?
09:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>CNAME redirects
09:09-!-lobster_MB [~michielbr@86.89.201.189] has joined #openttd
09:09<Gekz:#openttd>and A masks?
09:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i assume that is some kind of milestone ;)
09:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>no, gives IP
09:09<Gekz:#openttd>I see.
09:10<TrueBrain:#openttd>'milestone' is a big word ..
09:11<TrueBrain:#openttd>it does mean that all openttd.org related subdomains point to one server now
09:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>well, there are also halfmile stones and quartermile stones ;)
09:11<TrueBrain:#openttd>ttdpatch.net not yet, btw
09:12<Gekz:#openttd>lol.
09:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>ttdp nightlies need some serious work to be integrated ... will be nasty, sort of :)
09:12<Gekz:#openttd>TrueBrain: chroot?
09:12<Gekz:#openttd>chroot jails ftw
09:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>how would that help in this world ..
09:13-!-reldred [aegir@creep.bur.st] has joined #openttd
09:14<@peter1138:#openttd>So, server backups...
09:14<TrueBrain:#openttd>you have one peter1138? :)
09:14<@peter1138:#openttd>I do?
09:14<TrueBrain:#openttd>I dunno, you start to talk about it :p
09:14<@peter1138:#openttd>I might be able to provide one.
09:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>we have a .cz one, a .de one .. looking for me :p /me hungry :)
09:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>well, one might wonder how much OpenTTD need ..
09:15<@peter1138:#openttd>.uk one?
09:15<@peter1138:#openttd>How much space is required?
09:15-!-mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ
09:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>100 GiB diskspace, 200 GiB bandwidth a month, at least
09:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>(first is overkill, latter might be on the low side)
09:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>ssh (private/public key) + rsync a must
09:16<@peter1138:#openttd>Obvious :)
09:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>private and public dir, if possible
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09:16<@peter1138:#openttd>You wouldn't want to do full backups of that :)
09:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>(private for SSH backup, public for binary mirror)
09:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>SSH = SVN
09:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>I should add 'git' and 'hg' to the backups too I guess
09:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>btw, everything is backuped/mirrored, except the compile-farm itself (the images are, the code is, but the process itself is not), and developers-mail
09:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>binaries are mirrored, the rest is either in SVN, hg, or otherwise stored on safe places
09:18<@peter1138:#openttd>Just trying to find a cheap server with enough space ;)
09:19<@peter1138:#openttd>HP DL360s are my current favouriate for second hand stuff, but they tend to stop at 72GB space.
09:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>don't buy anything, enough people (as in: hosting companies) want to donate for free
09:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>SCSI :s
09:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>(or SAN)
09:19-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd
09:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>either way, sucks :p
09:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>I sold my last rackserver a few weeks back :p
09:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>else I could have shipped it to you :)
09:20<Ammler:#openttd>[15:19] <TrueBrain> [14:59:46] Ammler: do you already have the files? <-- had accidentially to move, will download them now manually...
09:20<@peter1138:#openttd>Bah :o
09:20<@peter1138:#openttd>Well I have old 4U shitters, but... urgh...
09:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>I should make a page with mirror requirements ... that sounds like an idea ;)
09:26-!-reldred is now known as reldred|gone
09:31<@peter1138:#openttd>lol cobalt raq :p
09:31-!-sulai [~Miranda@p5B2B5F68.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:31*Brianetta:#openttd owns an ageing 1U
09:31<@peter1138:#openttd>Hmm, DL320
09:31<Brianetta:#openttd>My OpenTTD server runs on it, as well as Tyneside LUG's stuff
09:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>I no longer own a single U .. I used to own lots of Us :p
09:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>(sold tha tpart of my company ;))
09:33<dih:#openttd>what do you mean with _that_ part?
09:33<@peter1138:#openttd>hmm, 1U dual athlon 2800+MP
09:33<dih:#openttd>i thought you sold the company....
09:33<Brianetta:#openttd>I get half an amp and 2000GB a month
09:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: I didn't sold my company completely
09:33<dih:#openttd>ah - :-)
09:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>just the part dealing with colocation and webhosting :)
09:33<dih:#openttd>what part you keep - services?
09:33<Brianetta:#openttd>upgradeable to 3000GB at no charge, if I want it
09:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: service, webdesign, network-support, mail-filter, ...
09:34<dih:#openttd>nice :-)
09:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>0.5A ..
09:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>most of the servers I owned, always used 0.6 at least :p
09:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>(150W)
09:34<@peter1138:#openttd>Hmm, 1U, 3* IDE drive bays, dual gigabit...
09:34<Brianetta:#openttd>I'm under the current level I pay for.
09:35<Brianetta:#openttd>There's only one hard disk.
09:35<@peter1138:#openttd>4GB ram, heh
09:35<Brianetta:#openttd>Half a giggle of RAM
09:35<@peter1138:#openttd>Ah, it's a va-technologies one
09:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>1 HD ...
09:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>that people seriously use that :p
09:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>I hope you don't have any criticial info on it :)
09:36<Sacro:#openttd>my ssh public key D:
09:36-!-ben_goodger [~ben@host86-153-45-29.range86-153.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
09:37<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: It's all backed up, and if the hard drive fails I'll have to rent a replacement anyway
09:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>they indeed removed 'ssh-keygen -t dsa' nowedays from every system in the world
09:37<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: about those modifications of the saveload revisions in the diff....
09:37<@peter1138:#openttd>I already had a patch for them.
09:37<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: they're in place so that loading older cargodest games is possible during the devving of cargodest. Once we're prior to a merge, this will be reverted of course.
09:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: I hope for you it is all safe :) Last month I walked into a big company, with N storage ... all non-RAID ... and their complain? A disk crashed, and they lost data ... really? NO SHIT?
09:38<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: you really don't like "xor_mask", do you ?:P
09:38<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: If it's lost, it's lost. Nobody will lose their livelihood.
09:38-!-Pikkaa [PikkaBird@58.173.248.50] has joined #openttd
09:38<Brianetta:#openttd>Pikka.. a (:
09:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: ;)
09:38<Pikkaa:#openttd>D:
09:39<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: about the vehicle_gui.cpp stuff. These changes are mainly to adapt the non-train view windows. They didn't have scrollbars before, now they do. I've another diff that further cleans up the Vehicle Detail Window.
09:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: what's more clear: new_mask & changed_mask or new_mask & xor_mask?
09:41-!-Pikka [PikkaBird@58.173.248.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:42<@Rubidium:#openttd>I'd immediately ask myself what the xor_mask contains, whereas in the former example I'd quite easily deduce that it only passes the newly added bits
09:45<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: yeah, I know (=
09:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: what I meant to say with vehicle_gui was to commit the non-cargodest part first
09:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>same with some of the order changes
09:48<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: like the ->first member?
09:51<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: why typedeffing EVERY std::something ? I mean for the stuff that is reused ... ok, but every?
09:51-!-welshdragon is now known as welshdra-gone
09:52-!-welshdra-gone is now known as welshdragon
09:52<SmatZ:#openttd>Celestar: why not?
09:52<@Celestar:#openttd>SmatZ: what's the benefit to typedef a std::vector<bool> ?
09:52<SmatZ:#openttd>it is clearly much easier to understand what it does
09:53<SmatZ:#openttd>and much simpler to change it sometimes in the future
09:53<SmatZ:#openttd>Celestar: once it can be StationBitfield, once CargoBitfield...
09:53<SmatZ:#openttd>and so :)
09:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: it's almost everywhere reused
09:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>std::map<bla, bla> something
09:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>std::map<bla, bla>::iterator it
09:56<@Rubidium:#openttd>that is something I saw happening *very* often in the diff
09:56<SmatZ:#openttd>std::map<bla, bla>::iterator won't compile on gcc2
09:56<SmatZ:#openttd>another reason for typedef :)
09:56-!-Doorslammer [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-229-188.prem.tmns.net.au] has quit []
09:57<SmatZ:#openttd>typedef std::map<bla, bla> Something;
09:57<SmatZ:#openttd>then you can use Something::iterator
09:57<SmatZ:#openttd>gcc2 doesn't like multiple :: in a type (I know gcc2 support is a very weak argument...)
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>gcc2 is ancient
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>no-one uses it any more
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>and for good reason.
09:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>we do
09:58<SmatZ:#openttd>Gekz: wrong
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>you people are no-ones now
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>!
09:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>so why are you here?
09:58-!-Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54470bf2.wfd82a.dsl.pol.co.uk] has joined #openttd
09:58<Gekz:#openttd>I like talking to no-one.
09:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>ah :)
09:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>well, welcome!
09:59-!-mode/#openttd [+qz #openttd!*@*] by Rubidium
09:59-!-mode/#openttd [-qz #openttd!*@*] by Rubidium
09:59<@Rubidium:#openttd>something went wrong with that command I reckon
09:59<SmatZ:#openttd>:-P
10:00*Forked:#openttd hides
10:00<@Celestar:#openttd>SmatZ: it does work on 2.95.3 according to TrueBrain
10:01<Gekz:#openttd>why are you using gcc 2?
10:01<Gekz:#openttd>honestly, I know of no-one else who uses it
10:01<@Celestar:#openttd>Gekz: Morphos
10:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>Celestar: the last time I tried cargodest, it did compile, yes
10:02<SmatZ:#openttd>@openttd commit 13985
10:02<@DorpsGek:#openttd>SmatZ: Commit by smatz :: r13985 trunk/src/yapf/yapf_destrail.hpp (2008-08-03 20:50:12 UTC)
10:02<@DorpsGek:#openttd>SmatZ: -Fix (r13944): gcc 2.95 compilation
10:02<SmatZ:#openttd>maybe it was caused by other things then
10:02<Gekz:#openttd>Celestar: and gcc3 isnt on MorphOS?
10:03<SmatZ:#openttd>Gekz: if it was that easy, we would have dropped gcc2 support years ago
10:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>SmatZ: GCC2.95 tends to be limited ;)
10:03<SmatZ:#openttd>:-)
10:04<Gekz:#openttd>SmatZ: ease != worth of doing
10:04<Gekz:#openttd>lol
10:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>SmatZ: as in: sometimes it does one thing here, but not there, depending on surroundings ;)
10:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>Gekz: and we even have a big hack to make gcc 2.95 still work with our C++ code :)
10:04<Gekz:#openttd>crazy
10:04-!-Fuco [dota.keys@wireless-98.fi.muni.cz] has joined #openttd
10:04<Gekz:#openttd>I mean, literally unsustainably crazy
10:04<Gekz:#openttd>haha
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>if we would give when ever it gets rough
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>we wouldn't have had Windows support
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>OSX support
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>MorphOS support
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>well .. not even 64bit linux support I guess
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>leaving only 32bit linux ..
10:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>maybe crazy in your eyes, required in ours :)
10:06<Gekz:#openttd>why isnt Gcc3
10:06<Gekz:#openttd>WHY
10:06<Sacro:#openttd>why 3?
10:06<Sacro:#openttd>4 is latest
10:06*Sacro:#openttd has 4.3.2
10:06<Sacro:#openttd>wtf is trrlang
10:07<Brianetta:#openttd>Why is anything but Linux required? (:
10:07<Brianetta:#openttd>Windows users have Patch
10:07<welshdragon:#openttd>Brianetta, but we still use openttd
10:07<Sacro:#openttd>but linux is free
10:07<Sacro:#openttd>so get it and install it
10:07*Brianetta:#openttd can't think of a reason to use Windows
10:08<Sacro:#openttd>Brianetta: solitarie!
10:08<welshdragon:#openttd>i have ubuntu, but no wireless
10:08<@peter1138:#openttd>SmatZ, oh, is std::vector<bool> optimised to a bitfield?
10:08<tegil:#openttd>shiny!
10:08<Spoons:#openttd>Sacro: I did, but it cost me so much time I decided Windows was cheaper.
10:08*Brianetta:#openttd still can't think of a reason to use Windows
10:08-!-Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has quit [Quit: On snow, everyone can follow your traces]
10:08*Sacro:#openttd has ubuntu
10:08<Sacro:#openttd>err
10:08<Sacro:#openttd>no
10:08*Sacro:#openttd has Arch
10:08<Brianetta:#openttd>I have Ubuntu at the moment
10:08<Sacro:#openttd>i have to fiddle with Ubuntu too much I reckon
10:08<Sacro:#openttd>what with needing OSS
10:08<Brianetta:#openttd>I've had Fedora, Trustix, Suse, Redhat and Slackware over the years
10:08<SmatZ:#openttd>peter1138: memory optimised :) hard to say something about performance... I have never looked at the generated code
10:09<Brianetta:#openttd>oh, and Gentoo
10:09<@peter1138:#openttd>Hmm
10:09<Brianetta:#openttd>nearly forgot Gentoo
10:09*welshdragon:#openttd wants to play with hiscompany
10:09<@Celestar:#openttd>peter1138: yes it is
10:09<@peter1138:#openttd>I tried writing a variable length BitField type, but got stuck at saveload...
10:09<welshdragon:#openttd>but a reset is not allowed :(
10:09*Sacro:#openttd installs FreeDOS
10:09<Brianetta:#openttd>Sacro: What say you we knock this game on the head at 2030?
10:10<welshdragon:#openttd>to stop my moaning?
10:10<@Celestar:#openttd>peter1138: at least my implementation of std::vector<bool> uses a bit per entry, and so should most other implementations
10:10<Brianetta:#openttd>yes, to stop your moaning
10:10<Brianetta:#openttd>You can always taka a saved game
10:10<welshdragon:#openttd>it's not my bloody fault
10:10<Brianetta:#openttd>I think it might be
10:10<Brianetta:#openttd>You passworded it, and didn't either remember it or make a permanent note of it.
10:10<welshdragon:#openttd>i gave Eoin the password, and h forgot it
10:11<Brianetta:#openttd>By an in-game PM
10:11<welshdragon:#openttd>yes
10:11<Brianetta:#openttd>You know they don't even stay on screen?
10:11<welshdragon:#openttd>ah
10:11<Brianetta:#openttd>They're not logged
10:11<@peter1138:#openttd>15:10 welshdragon> i gave Eoin the password, and h forgot it
10:11<@peter1138:#openttd>And... so did you ;)
10:11<welshdragon:#openttd>true
10:12<Gekz:#openttd>I find the MacOS X the least fiddly of all OSes
10:12<Gekz:#openttd>I still hate it.
10:12<welshdragon:#openttd>Brianetta, start a new game then
10:12*welshdragon:#openttd will have to create another awesome junction
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10:12-!-mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ
10:12<dih:#openttd>Gekz: you are just not used to it
10:13<dih:#openttd>hello Belugas
10:13<Sacro:#openttd>Brianetta: fine with me, I'm still unsure how to start a new game too
10:13<dih:#openttd>welshdragon: suffer in silence
10:13<@Belugas:#openttd>hello dih
10:13<Sacro:#openttd>i have little to no admin knowledge D:
10:13<Gekz:#openttd>dih: I use it all the time
10:13<Gekz:#openttd>I'm well and truly used to it
10:13<Gekz:#openttd>and I hate it.
10:13<Brianetta:#openttd>Sacro: Log in I'll show you
10:13<Brianetta:#openttd>phone call
10:13<Sacro:#openttd>Brianetta: in a bit, have to go to work
10:14<welshdragon:#openttd>Gekz, the fact that OSX failed in my school means i now hate it
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10:14<welshdragon:#openttd>and hate apple stuff in general
10:14<Gekz:#openttd>welshdragon: your reason makes no sense to me.
10:14*Sacro:#openttd never used OSX at school
10:14<Sacro:#openttd>System 7 though...
10:14<Sacro:#openttd>and BBC Micros
10:14<welshdragon:#openttd>Gekz, it was used by over 300 imacs
10:15<welshdragon:#openttd>it sucked
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>it's still better than Windows.
10:15<welshdragon:#openttd>Gekz, nothing can beat windows
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>Sacro: haha Acorn
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>welshdragon: everything beats Windows.
10:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>we had win 95 in school...
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>our ATMs run on Windows 95
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>and they're connected to the internet
10:15<dih:#openttd>welshdragon: you like blabbeling a bunch of nonsense when the day is long, eh?
10:15<Sacro:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: we got win95 when i was in year 8
10:15<Gekz:#openttd>they're meant to be fucking secure
10:16<Sacro:#openttd>god, when i started secondary they had 486s with DOS and Win3.11
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>haha
10:16<welshdragon:#openttd>dih, i'm still pissed about last night
10:16<Sacro:#openttd>i'd come from Amigas and Macs and thought "Whoah, what an old system this must be"
10:16<tegil:#openttd>a while ago eh
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>Amigas ftw
10:16<dih:#openttd>welshdragon: i dont even want to know
10:16<dih:#openttd>:-P
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>I still have my Amiga 500
10:16<Sacro:#openttd>only realised last year that it was fairly modern and windows was years behind Workbench and Apple OS
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>reckon you can get OpenTTD to run on AmigaOS?
10:16<Sacro:#openttd>Gekz: yeah, me too
10:16<Sacro:#openttd>Gekz: MorphOS
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>no.
10:16<Gekz:#openttd>I dont have a PPC
10:17<dih:#openttd>ha!
10:17<Gekz:#openttd>MorphOS is PPC only.
10:17<Sacro:#openttd>Morphos is next gen WorkBench
10:17<Sacro:#openttd>or you mean on a 7.21Mhz 60200
10:17<dih:#openttd>morphos gcc sucks
10:17<Sacro:#openttd>err
10:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Gekz: ure it's "the internet" and not "a ppp connection to an isolated network"?
10:17<Sacro:#openttd>68000
10:17<Gekz:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: it's Australia. i'm pretty sure it's internet.
10:17<Sacro:#openttd>to work!
10:17<Gekz:#openttd>nothing is done right here >_>
10:17<welshdragon:#openttd>bye Sacro
10:18<dih:#openttd>Gekz: i would be pretty sure it's not the internet
10:18<welshdragon:#openttd>enjoy playing with your routers
10:18<@Celestar:#openttd>O_o
10:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and win95 has by far less security holes than win2k+
10:18*Celestar:#openttd just reads the discussion about the OpenGFX license.
10:18<dih:#openttd>by far less != none!
10:18<dih:#openttd>Celestar: hehe
10:18<[com]buster:#openttd>win95 has one security hole
10:18*welshdragon:#openttd can't wait for OpenGFX
10:18-!-Pikkaa [PikkaBird@58.173.248.50] has quit []
10:18<[com]buster:#openttd>it has *no security*
10:19<[com]buster:#openttd>:)
10:19<@Celestar:#openttd>Just to make my point clear: Any license which will disallow including OpenGFX with linux distributions is completely pointless.
10:19<dih:#openttd>win95 _IS_ the security issue, anything prefixed with win is :-P
10:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it should be either GPL or cc-by(-sa), nothing else should be even remotely up to debate
10:20<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>especially not -nc
10:20<Brianetta:#openttd>attributeoin share-alike is fine
10:20<@Celestar:#openttd>so if it may not be included in a binary-only rpm/deb/whatever, what's the deal?
10:21<Brianetta:#openttd>what a hideous typo ):
10:21<Gekz:#openttd>so no-one has answered my question.
10:21<Gekz:#openttd>Amiga 500 + OpenTTD?
10:21<Gekz:#openttd>:P
10:21-!-ben_goodger [~ben@host86-153-45-29.range86-153.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
10:22<@Celestar:#openttd>Brianetta: what is cc-by-nc in non-lawyer-language?
10:23<Brianetta:#openttd>I'm not sure what the "by" is
10:24<dih:#openttd>Gekz: if you want somebody to spend dedicated time with your high priority issue, please draw a number and wait until it's called up
10:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>nc=non-commercial
10:24<Gekz:#openttd>dih: nevah
10:24<Gekz:#openttd>by = attribution
10:24<Gekz:#openttd>sa = share-alike
10:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>which would exclude most major linux distributions
10:25<dih:#openttd>i would love to hear from the devs if they would distribute OpenGFX with OpenTTD regardles of that license they choose
10:25<Brianetta:#openttd>creativecommons.org has a long quiz that will generate a license for you, but doesn't appear to have the reverse (a "wtf does this string mean?" key)
10:25<Gekz:#openttd>what licence are they choosing?
10:26<Gekz:#openttd>Brianetta: i unobfuscated above
10:26<dih:#openttd>Gekz: read the thread
10:26<Gekz:#openttd>Brianetta: by = attribution
10:26<Gekz:#openttd>dih: links
10:26<dih:#openttd>SEARCH!
10:26<Gekz:#openttd>I'm trying to help you.
10:26<Gekz:#openttd>with minimal effort.
10:26<dih:#openttd>there are not that many OpenGFX threads in the graphics forum
10:26<dih:#openttd>i am not even after your help
10:27<@Belugas:#openttd>let's call for a fund raising, in order to ask a lawyer about which distribution scheme we should use :P
10:27<@Celestar:#openttd>\o/
10:27<@Celestar:#openttd>good idea Belugas
10:28<@Rubidium:#openttd>yeah... that would mean the graphics can never be released using nc because someone already made profit of the graphics
10:28<@Belugas:#openttd>hem... no, not really... highly sarcastic...
10:28<Gekz:#openttd>cc-glCreative Commons Attribution 2.0 license (a.k.a. CC-BY)
10:28<Gekz:#openttd>This is a non-copyleft free license that is good for art and entertainment works, and educational works. Please don't use it for software or documentation, since it is incompatible with the GNU GPL and with the GNU FDL.
10:28<@Celestar:#openttd>ok let me put it another way: I think any license which prevents OpenGFX to be shipped in a (commercial or non-commercial) linux distro is not acceptable.
10:28<Gekz:#openttd>Creative Commons publishes many licenses which are very different. Therefore, to say that a work “uses a Creative Commons license” is to leave the principal questions about the work's licensing unanswered. When you see such a statement in a work, please ask the author to highlight the substance of the license choices. And if someone proposes to “use a Creative Commons license” for a certain work, it is vital to ask immediately, \xE2\x80
10:29<@Belugas:#openttd>VITAL
10:29<@Belugas:#openttd>oh yeah
10:29<@Belugas:#openttd>so true...
10:29<Gekz:#openttd>LOL
10:29<Gekz:#openttd>lol*
10:29<Brianetta:#openttd>Gekz: At least paste in using the UTF8 character set
10:30<Gekz:#openttd>I did.
10:30<Brianetta:#openttd>”
10:30<Gekz:#openttd>I can't use anything else.
10:30<Gekz:#openttd>I dont have the codepages other than utf8
10:30<Gekz:#openttd>the site probably crapped out at me.
10:31<@peter1138:#openttd>May have been cropped off the end of the line.
10:31-!-yorick [~Yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd
10:31<Gekz:#openttd>possibly.
10:31-!-ben_goodger [~ben@host81-152-232-177.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
10:31<Gekz:#openttd>anywho, I am going to sleep. Creative Commons is unacceptalbe.
10:31<Gekz:#openttd>albe ftw.
10:32<@peter1138:#openttd>Can I re-license something that is 'public domain'?
10:34<dih:#openttd>with agreement of all authors / contributors ?
10:35<yorick:#openttd>"Dedicator recognizes that, once placed in the public domain, the Work may be freely reproduced, distributed, transmitted, used, modified, built upon, or otherwise exploited by anyone for any purpose, commercial or non-commercial, and in any way, including by methods that have not yet been invented or conceived."
10:37<yorick:#openttd>I think you can't relicense
10:37<yorick:#openttd>if it's the GPL one
10:37<@peter1138:#openttd>Seems you can.
10:37<yorick:#openttd>that quote is from the creative commons page
10:38<@Celestar:#openttd>bah
10:38<@peter1138:#openttd>Celestar?
10:38<@Celestar:#openttd>there are more CC license types than there are pebbles on this planet
10:39<@Celestar:#openttd>and what the hell is dfsg??
10:39<@Rubidium:#openttd>debian free software guideline
10:39<@peter1138:#openttd>Debian Free Software Guidelines
10:40<@peter1138:#openttd>Their own take on what is or is not free...
10:40<@Celestar:#openttd>uh huh
10:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>like everything that forces an eula isn't free
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10:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>peter1138: you can only license something that you are the owner of, and public domain does not allow that
10:41<@Belugas:#openttd>so does it means that OpenTTD will need to get ownershp of the work?
10:43<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Belugas: not if you have a license that allows sublicensing
10:43*Belugas:#openttd feels sick about that licensing stuff... truely
10:44<TrueBrain:#openttd>I agree with Belugas
10:44<penfold:#openttd>Belugas: Agreed. It is a concern indeed.
10:45<@Belugas:#openttd>i think (personally) that anything distributed by OpenTTD should be the sole property of OpenTTD, and OpenTTD will be the one granted the licensing it wants to attribute to the work
10:45<@Belugas:#openttd>agreed, mentionning who is the artist is a good and polite thing, but let's be serious: who has a special liencing for the patch he has seen included?
10:46<blathijs:#openttd>Belugas: Is there such a thing as "OpenTTD" ?
10:46<TrueBrain:#openttd>OpenTTD Team :)
10:46<blathijs:#openttd>AFAIK, the OpenTTD source is also still owned by the individual contributors
10:46*yorick:#openttd owns OpenTTD :-p
10:46<@Belugas:#openttd>the OpenTTD organization, if you will :)
10:47<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>in germany, there are certain copyrights that you can _never_ give up
10:47<@Belugas:#openttd>yorick, you almost owned a kick ;)
10:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>the website is owned by 'OpenTTD Team'
10:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>I said before to a few devs, there should be a document that any and all patches you contribute, are immediatly property of OpenTTD Team (who ever that might be :p)
10:48<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>these must be held by the real person who created the work, they cannot be given to a legal entity (like a company, or "The OpenTTD Team")
10:48<TrueBrain:#openttd>and that by giving a patch, you agree that it will be GPL'd :p
10:48-!-Kasceh [~Kasc@cpc2-leed7-0-0-cust124.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd
10:48<Brianetta:#openttd>Belugas: If something is distributed under the GPL, you can include it with OpenTTD in safety. In this case, it's no different to any other contribution. You (the maintaining team) don't own copyright to all contributions, but you are licensed to use and distribute them as part of the product.
10:48<Kasceh:#openttd>Why isn't my configure patches options saving?
10:48<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: no copyright or license can ever be held by a non-legal 'person' (where 'person' in fact can be an organization)
10:48<Kasceh:#openttd>Anyone have any idea?
10:49<Brianetta:#openttd>Kasceh: Are you changing it within a game?
10:49<Kasceh:#openttd>Yes, is that the problem?
10:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TrueBrain: "legal" person is a superset of "real" person (as in human)
10:49<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: still it is a dangerous slope, as I can request to remove my 'contributaions' ;)
10:49<Brianetta:#openttd>It only changes it for that game
10:49<Kasceh:#openttd>Ahhh, kk :)
10:49<yorick:#openttd>Kasceh: it will only apply to that game
10:49<Kasceh:#openttd>Thanks
10:49<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: that I said, didn't I? :)
10:50<dih:#openttd>Kasceh: there is a command called saveconfig ;-)
10:50<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: You can; depends how they're submitted. If they're submitted for inclusion, I think any court would back your assumption of GPL. If they're just on the forum as a "here's a patch that does X," you're not so safe.
10:50<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TrueBrain: in germany, copyright is always with a real person, while any other legal persons must live with a license
10:50<Kasceh:#openttd>Thanks Dih
10:50<dih:#openttd>_d_
10:50<dih:#openttd>;-)
10:50<yorick:#openttd>lowercase d
10:50<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: exactly my point ;) And making things depending on court ... well .. you can better make a document which state what is happening ;)
10:51<yorick:#openttd>is the new website going to be at svn?
10:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: that sucks ;)
10:51*dih:#openttd needs to find a new colocator (a cheap one)
10:51<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: Yes. Unfortunately, all copyright infringement, even though criminal, has to be tested by court.
10:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>but I believe something like that is true in The Netherlands too ..
10:51<dih:#openttd>yorick: yes, but not publicly avail for people like you :-P
10:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>I never understood legal shit :p
10:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: hehe, true; but that was not what I meant :)
10:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>then again, GPL hasn't been battle in court anyway ..
10:52<Brianetta:#openttd>People are scared of it.
10:52<yorick:#openttd>it works.
10:52<Brianetta:#openttd>If it's upheld as-is, ,any companies will have to change practises.
10:52-!-Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
10:52<Brianetta:#openttd>s/,any/many/
10:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>it wouldn't suprise me that you can't have GPL like licenses in,s ay, 10 years
10:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>there are certain special cases, where copyright does not hold, like "insignificant" parts.
10:53<TrueBrain:#openttd>that Open Source dies because of court-rules :p
10:53<Brianetta:#openttd>I'd like to see which countries legislate for that, and how
10:53<dih:#openttd>never been tried, it's a very beautiful part of GPL
10:53<@Celestar:#openttd>Creative Commons Attribution-Sharealike 2.0 license (a.k.a. CC-BY-SA)
10:53<@Celestar:#openttd>This is a copyleft free license that is good for artistic and entertainment works, and educational works. Please don't use it for software or documentation, since it is incompatible with the GNU GPL and with the GNU FDL.
10:53<@Celestar:#openttd>very helpful :P
10:54<Brianetta:#openttd>GPL isn't illegal; it's just a license. You can choose to abide by the license agreement, or you can choose not to use the work. It's a simple choice.
10:54<dih:#openttd>heh
10:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>like one person sued because another person copied HTML-code, but lost the case, because the original HTML-code was autogenerated, so it did not fall under copyright
10:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>rather: useless, Celestar ;)
10:54<Brianetta:#openttd>It's extremely difficult to outlaw that
10:54<Brianetta:#openttd>since you'd be calling into question contract law in general
10:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: I wish it was that simple ;)
10:54-!-Zorni is now known as Zorn
10:54<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: It's that simple in the USA and UK
10:55<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: peter1138: Has any of us ever expressed what kind of licensing we _expect_?
10:55<Brianetta:#openttd>Where it's less simple is where somebody challenges the original application of the GPL to a work
10:55<Brianetta:#openttd>Such as Ludde's application of the GPL to his decompilation
10:55<blathijs:#openttd>Brianetta: When patches are submitted, aren't they by definition GPL? If a patch is a derevitive work, then there is no other choice for the author of the patch.
10:56<Brianetta:#openttd>blathijs: No, they are not
10:56<dih:#openttd>Celestar: that is waht i am waiting for....
10:56<Brianetta:#openttd>A patch is not a derivative work
10:56<Brianetta:#openttd>and this is how lame (the MP3 encoder) got around patents
10:56<@peter1138:#openttd>Celestar, expect for what?
10:56<blathijs:#openttd>Brianetta: Hmm, I always thought they were. The resulting program is, I think?
10:56<Brianetta:#openttd>It was a patch to a reference implementation
10:56<dih:#openttd>peter1138: OpenGFX
10:56<Brianetta:#openttd>blathijs: The resulting program, in the case of lame, couldn't legally be distributed
10:56<dih:#openttd>what would you be willing to distribute with OpenTTD
10:57<Brianetta:#openttd>You had to get one set of source code, patch it, and not distribute the resulting object code
10:57<dih:#openttd>i.e. if OpenGFX was gonna go some odd cc thing
10:57<@Rubidium:#openttd>Brianetta, I'd say: if you don't include a license in the patch, it falls under the same license as the patched stuff
10:57<Brianetta:#openttd>Rubidium: You might say that. The author of the patch can easily claim otherwise.
10:57<Brianetta:#openttd>You can try to get a court to back your assumption, but you need legal support for that.
10:57<Brianetta:#openttd>You might win!
10:57<@Belugas:#openttd>ho bullock...
10:58<dih:#openttd>if it's a patch for a gpl project, it cannot be licensed otherwise anyway
10:58*Belugas:#openttd goes somewhere else more pleasant to read...
10:58<Brianetta:#openttd>dih: It can
10:58<@Rubidium:#openttd>dih: not true; if you add a complete new file with all kinds of functions that can be licensed under another license
10:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: only if your want your patch inlucded, it can't
10:59<dih:#openttd>Rubidium: that sounds more like a feature than a simple patch :-P
10:59<Brianetta:#openttd>dih: Define the difference. In court.
10:59<blathijs:#openttd>Perhaps we should always explicitely require patch authors to state their patches are GPL ?
10:59<dih:#openttd>when i get a chance to i'll do my best :-P
10:59<blathijs:#openttd>Include it in a FAQ somewhere
10:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>dih: "feature" and "patch" are two entirely different things
11:00<@Rubidium:#openttd>but IMO you should add a license to the new files, otherwise it might be caught by the license of the rest of the code
11:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>blathijs: as I said, I think we should make something where a patch author agrees upon before adding it in SVN :)
11:00<@peter1138:#openttd>95GB!
11:00<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>doesn't the GPL require that the GPL text is attached to every file?
11:00<yorick:#openttd>it does
11:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>peter1138: it is going slower, not?
11:00<dih:#openttd>make a webpage where people can submit patches / features and they have to tick a box stating they agree with the code bing under GPL
11:00<@peter1138:#openttd>Probably.
11:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: at least the header, yes
11:01<Brianetta:#openttd>dih: http://www.oslawblog.com/2005/02/way-around-gpl.html
11:01<blathijs:#openttd>dih: Requiring an explicity comment in Flyspray is probably better
11:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>either way, how ever you look at all of this: licensing sucks, and it sucks even more people abuse it ..
11:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>then agian .. OpenTTD 0.1 was reversed engineerd ... :p
11:02<@peter1138:#openttd>Quite.
11:02<yorick:#openttd>max_age - age = time_to_live, isn't it?
11:02<yorick:#openttd>v->*
11:03<Brianetta:#openttd>The reverse engineering is the biggest legal problem OpenTTD is likely to face.
11:03<dih:#openttd>TrueBrain: how about some kind of gforge page for 3rd party openttd related projects? :-D
11:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>but first .. they need to find a legal person to blame :p
11:04<dih:#openttd>and require all projects to be GPL if they want to use the services
11:04<dih:#openttd>:-P
11:04<Brianetta:#openttd>This is why I've not committed any code to the project.
11:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>if you want to be license safe, I say: make it Public Domain ;)
11:04<dih:#openttd>Brianetta: (
11:04<Brianetta:#openttd>If I did, I'd disclaim any interest
11:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: well, can a patch maker be held responsible for the original state of the code he is writing a patch for?
11:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>if the patch itself doens't contain any code which is illegal
11:05<@Celestar:#openttd>I'm off
11:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>bye Celestar :)
11:05<@Celestar:#openttd>going to Berlin tomorrow
11:05<@Celestar:#openttd>cu Friday
11:05<Brianetta:#openttd>TrueBrain: I have no idea. A court would decide.
11:05<@Celestar:#openttd>\o
11:05<Brianetta:#openttd>It always comes back to courts.
11:05-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@129.187.69.65] has quit [Quit: leaving]
11:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: from what I have read so far, the patch maker can never be blamed
11:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>he didn't know better
11:05*Brianetta:#openttd shrugs
11:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>(unelss of course he was explicitly told so and needed to sign what ever for it :p)
11:06<Brianetta:#openttd>I'm not qualified to give legal advice.
11:06*penfold:#openttd goes to find a copyright lawyer :)
11:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>penfold: pleaes do :)
11:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: well, I wish there was a court over this
11:06<Brianetta:#openttd>This is why I keep trotting out the court line. It's where law gets clarified.
11:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>settles it once and for all :)
11:06<Brianetta:#openttd>Yes.
11:07<TrueBrain:#openttd>hehe, like rejecting a spam-law ..
11:07<yorick:#openttd>Eddi: sorting by remaining life time is possibly not so easy, as dates are int32
11:08<yorick:#openttd>and they can be over -age
11:08-!-Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5ad915a0.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:08*yorick:#openttd would like uint33
11:08<Brianetta:#openttd>yorick: How would that matter? Negative numbers are perfectly sortable.
11:08<yorick:#openttd>yes
11:08<TrueBrain:#openttd>anyway, the only reason I am not pro-OpenGFX .. OpenTTD now stimulates the sells of TT, and so no court will judge we are withholding funds of TT :)
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11:08<yorick:#openttd>Brianetta: it's more about the "32" part
11:09<yorick:#openttd>return values for the sorter functions are only 8-bit
11:09<Brianetta:#openttd>yorick: Again: subtract one from the other, then sort.
11:09<Brianetta:#openttd>It's not like your vehicles will be two centuries old
11:10<@peter1138:#openttd>Which sorter functions?
11:10<yorick:#openttd>they could
11:10<yorick:#openttd>the vehicleguilist sorter
11:10<@peter1138:#openttd>They're ints.
11:10<@peter1138:#openttd>So 32 bits.
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11:10<dih:#openttd>penfold: i am sure marjacq would love to talk to you :-P
11:11<yorick:#openttd>I shall just clamp :-p
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11:12<dih:#openttd>TrueBrain: that TT selling is unimportant
11:12<dih:#openttd>as neither Atari nor marjacq get profit from that, as it's all second hand
11:12<dih:#openttd>no new copies being produced
11:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: not our problem, is it? :)
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11:12<dih:#openttd>no - not a problem, just not a valid argument either
11:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>we do our best to give money to the people who it belongs to
11:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: the point here is, in my experience people only go to court if they think they lose profit because of something
11:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>I think I need a new BNC ... :(
11:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>(no, not the network component :p)
11:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i might be a problem, because technically, openttd is currently generating "profit" because it forces people to buy the original game, this "profit" would be gone when a free gfx set is distributed with the game
11:16<dih:#openttd>TrueBrain: you dont :-P
11:16<dih:#openttd>just need to optimize it
11:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>*it
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11:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: that is wha tI meant, yes :)
11:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>dih: ... :(
11:18<Swallow:#openttd>even with opengfx, sample.cat is still needed, so having a copy of TTD would still be required
11:19<@Belugas:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, the said profit is not in our pocket, so it's indirect profit
11:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not "our" profit, "their" profit
11:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>Swallow: and you think that is a 'real' problem, the requirement for sample.cat?
11:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>Belugas: he didn't mean 'our' profit ;)
11:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>if "they" lose that profit, they might consider to start sueing
11:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>I have counted 3 patches in the last 4 years removing the need for 'sample.cat'
11:19<dih:#openttd>Swallow: touch smaple.cat <- empty file!
11:19<@Belugas:#openttd>"they" would loose profit if sales of TTD was still happening
11:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>(did you know I still have NO idea what is in that file)
11:20<@Belugas:#openttd>not the case
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11:20<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TrueBrain: samples, obviously ;)
11:20<@peter1138:#openttd>It's a catalogue of samples :D
11:20-!-welshdragon2 is now known as welshdragon
11:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>samples of WHAT?
11:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>species?
11:20<Swallow:#openttd>sound?
11:20<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the sound effects
11:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"*Tuuut* *Tuuut*" "*dingdingding*"
11:21<@peter1138:#openttd>The bit that makes the annoying DING DING DING when you start it up...
11:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>orudge: you refered in an OpenTTD topic to a junction website which states is only for TTDPatch!!!! :p :p (sorry, had to ..)
11:21<tegil:#openttd>haha
11:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>peter1138: ah :) That is why I never 'missed' it :)
11:21<@peter1138:#openttd>Actually it's the HONK HONK that's annoying.
11:21<tegil:#openttd>or the vehicles starting
11:21<tegil:#openttd>wruuuuum
11:22<dih:#openttd>where is the sound replacement project at?
11:22<TrueBrain:#openttd>in fact ... all the sounds ...
11:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i find the *dingdingding* most annoying, because it happens the most times
11:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>dih: in a forum thread?
11:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>*Dih
11:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>:p
11:22<Brianetta:#openttd>OpenTTD. DindindingHORNKdingHORNK
11:22<Brianetta:#openttd>That's the main menu screen
11:23<Brianetta:#openttd>It's also the "you've been desynced" sound (:
11:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>Dih: in the freezer of orudge :)
11:23<dih:#openttd>_d_
11:23<@peter1138:#openttd>Brianetta :D
11:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>Brianetta: lol :)
11:23<yorick:#openttd>-D-
11:24<planetmaker:#openttd>[16:52] <TrueBrain> then again, GPL hasn't been battle in court anyway .. <-- not true
11:24<dih:#openttd>Brianetta: LOL
11:24*Brianetta:#openttd beams
11:24<Brianetta:#openttd>I said something lolworthy
11:24<TrueBrain:#openttd>planetmaker: gimme one that wasn't settled :)
11:25<planetmaker:#openttd>I think the one against netgear.
11:25<planetmaker:#openttd>But not entirely sure.
11:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>busybox: settled
11:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>oh, I just found that German court acknowledge GPL
11:26<planetmaker:#openttd>:)
11:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>(in a precedent)
11:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>but then again, Germans are known for weird laws
11:26<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
11:27<planetmaker:#openttd>biggest software market within the EU though :)
11:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>but besides the German one, I can't find any referense to one that wasn't dismissed, settled, or otherwise discontinued before the court ruled...
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11:29<planetmaker:#openttd>that I don't know.
11:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>I would like to read more about that stuff .. but okay .. :)
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11:31<planetmaker:#openttd>http://www.heise.de/newsticker/Urteil-gegen-Skype-wegen-GPL-Verletzung--/meldung/93189 <-- but obviously you can even sue foreign companies as long as their software is used in Germany, too (link is in German)
11:31<@Belugas:#openttd>ho... an idea... we will not use OpenGFX !
11:31<@Belugas:#openttd>no issues, no problems :D
11:32<@peter1138:#openttd>Indeed. I prefer the original graphics ;)
11:32<planetmaker:#openttd>:D
11:32<@peter1138:#openttd>Although my new GPL graphics set will rock.
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11:32<planetmaker:#openttd>concerning OpenGFX. It would probably help a lot, if you devs say we accept licenses A, B, C. Use that or bugger off
11:33<@peter1138:#openttd>Not really. I don't think anyone ever said that 'OpenGFX' would be distributed with OpenTTD.
11:33<@peter1138:#openttd>Well, they might've done :D
11:34<planetmaker:#openttd>peter1138: but that's the intention of the whole project, isn't it? So that there can be a completely functional download w/o the need of TTDX original files...?
11:34<blathijs:#openttd>peter1138: Are you saying we shouldn't?
11:34<dih:#openttd>peter1138: Belugas: may i quote you in the OpenGFX threads? :-D
11:34<@peter1138:#openttd>Certainly not at the moment. It's not finished.
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11:35<planetmaker:#openttd>peter1138: that may or not be so. But the motivation is from the aim. And a word from you devs what kind of licenses will make you do that once done will work wonders IMO
11:36<planetmaker:#openttd>At least on some. Others might then know what to work with :)
11:36<dih:#openttd>yes - i second that planetmaker
11:36-!-rortom [~rortom@p57B7C7E2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:36<@peter1138:#openttd>I was replying to blathijs :)
11:36<@Belugas:#openttd>dih, whaty you can do is summ up allthe different "options" and "arguments" been throwed here and there regarding which ever types of licensing been proposed. make pros and cons with keeping in mind that we're not talking ionly about germany's couert stuff...
11:36<@Belugas:#openttd>therefor,
11:36<planetmaker:#openttd>I figured :) Doesn't change what I said ;)
11:37<blathijs:#openttd>peter1138: That makes sense.
11:37<@Belugas:#openttd>right now, i'm pretty much pissed to see that no matter which liciensing been proposed, there is still someone objecting for this or tyhat
11:37<@Belugas:#openttd>it goes nowhere
11:37<@Belugas:#openttd>bike-shed-painting...
11:37<blathijs:#openttd>planetmaker: I agree that selecting a license is good for the long term, since relicensing afterwards will be bitchy
11:38<dih:#openttd>blathijs: it also would settle the entire situation a lot faster :-P
11:38<yorick:#openttd>there goes another small patch to flyspray, to be lost with the mass of 291 others, not to be found for another 500 revisions
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11:39<dih:#openttd>yorick: why do you ALWAYS have to announce anything you do and or see on FS?
11:39<Brianetta:#openttd>He has an ego.
11:39<yorick:#openttd>because dorpsgek doesn't do it anymore
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11:39<dih:#openttd>yorick: it's simply enough though if you say !fs
11:39<dih:#openttd>yorick: for reasons!
11:39<Brianetta:#openttd>!fs
11:39<dih:#openttd>damn it glx
11:39<dih:#openttd>:-P
11:40<@peter1138:#openttd>planetmaker, there has been no group discussion on it, so I can't say.
11:40<dih:#openttd>i wait for you before tricking someone into saying a !command and you dont work!
11:40<+glx:#openttd>dih: this never triggered a kick
11:40<dih:#openttd>i thought you had a type of regex :-P
11:40<dih:#openttd>hihi
11:40<yorick:#openttd>!rcon pause
11:41<@peter1138:#openttd>blathijs, there's a post in their threads somewhere where I said they need to decide before doing anything ;)
11:41<@peter1138:#openttd>blathijs, of course, they didn't...
11:41-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!*Yorick@*.adsl.wanadoo.nl] by peter1138
11:41-!-yorick was kicked from #openttd by peter1138 [Yes yes]
11:41<+glx:#openttd>hehe
11:41<dih:#openttd>;-)
11:41<+glx:#openttd>I was about to use !kick
11:42<dih:#openttd>aint gonna work in here!
11:42<+glx:#openttd>it does (my client transfer it to DorpsGek)
11:42<dih:#openttd>hehe - nice :-)
11:42<+glx:#openttd>but only for me
11:42<dih:#openttd>but @kick is nicer :-P
11:43-!-dih was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [yes but is 'hidden']
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11:43<+glx:#openttd>stupid script, it intercepted the second !kick
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11:43<@peter1138:#openttd>Oh, was that accidental?
11:44-!-mode/#openttd [-b *!*Yorick@*.adsl.wanadoo.nl] by peter1138
11:44<+glx:#openttd>no the kick was intended, just the message failed a little
11:44<@peter1138:#openttd>Ahh
11:44<dih:#openttd>;-)
11:47<planetmaker:#openttd>[17:40] <peter1138> planetmaker, there has been no group discussion on it, so I can't say. <-- maybe you do that sometime :) so you can speak with one official voice on this issue :)
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11:53<TrueBrain:#openttd>planetmaker: like we ever did something remotely like that :)
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11:56*Belugas:#openttd yans
11:56*TrueBrain:#openttd gives Belugas a towl
11:56<@Belugas:#openttd>another one please, all wetty :)
11:57<TrueBrain:#openttd>ieuw
11:57<dih:#openttd>Belugas: go to the toilet....
11:57<@Belugas:#openttd>with you sweety?
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12:00<orudge:#openttd>[16:21:15] <TrueBrain> orudge: you refered in an OpenTTD topic to a junction website which states is only for TTDPatch!!!! :p :p (sorry, had to ..) <-- OpenTTD didn't exist (as OpenTTD, at least) at the time though ;)
12:00<orudge:#openttd>and the sound replacement project was going reasonably well
12:00<orudge:#openttd>I did get it all into a bundle and wrote some code to make use of it
12:00<orudge:#openttd>but then I've been busy
12:01<orudge:#openttd>and it's sitting, as TrueBrain says, in the freezer that is my hard disk :p
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12:01<dih:#openttd>thaw it orudge
12:05<Rexxars:#openttd>is it edible?
12:05<Rexxars:#openttd>cause I'm hungry
12:05<orudge:#openttd>WELL
12:05<orudge:#openttd>*well
12:05<orudge:#openttd>I think I posted a test binary or something in the topic
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12:06<orudge:#openttd>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=37448
12:06<@Belugas:#openttd>anyine used a VERIFONE SC5000 PINPad before?
12:06<orudge:#openttd>will need a fair bit of updating though if you want to use it with the latest trunk
12:07<@Belugas:#openttd>what saddens me, orudge, is the requirement of having new code for the replacement :( It would have been nice if no new code was required, simple old format
12:08<@Belugas:#openttd>but that's just me
12:08<orudge:#openttd>Belugas: well
12:08<orudge:#openttd>that's possible
12:08<orudge:#openttd>but
12:08<orudge:#openttd>well
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12:08<orudge:#openttd>I guess for a simple sfx replacement, the current mixer can be used
12:08<orudge:#openttd>but it needs a littel bit of tweaking
12:08<orudge:#openttd>I did do this some time ago
12:08<orudge:#openttd>and then minor changes (which are in that patch) are needed in the .cat reading code
12:08<orudge:#openttd>the new mixer is mainly for the benefit of my new music patch
12:09<@peter1138:#openttd>Hah, I just noticed that Zephyris' signature is animated :D
12:09<orudge:#openttd>My original new music patch used a version of the current mixer
12:09*peter1138:#openttd agrees with Belugas. While the changes may've been nice, it's not simply sound replacement.
12:09<orudge:#openttd>but it was in some ways a hack
12:09<orudge:#openttd>well
12:10<orudge:#openttd>plain old sound replacement is easier
12:10<orudge:#openttd>and I could quite easily knock up a patch for that that doesn't involve a new mixer
12:10<orudge:#openttd>the changes required are fairly minimal
12:12<orudge:#openttd>I may have a fiddle after dinner
12:19*yorick:#openttd wonders how many times svn co svn://svn.openttd.org/branches/custombridgeheads && cd custombridgeheads && svn merge svn://svn.openttd.org/trunk will say conflict
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12:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><peter1138> Hah, I just noticed that Zephyris' signature is animated :D <- the cute horsies, yes ;)
12:32<@peter1138:#openttd>For mobile hard drives, what is more rugged, 2.5" or 3.5"?
12:32*Belugas:#openttd has seen more 3.5 crashes then 2.5
12:32<@Belugas:#openttd>dunno if it's worth saying
12:33<@peter1138:#openttd>The drive will be plugged into a machine, data backed up onto it, and then transported elsewhere. It won't be moved while in use.
12:37-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fe13f.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
12:37<@Bjarni:#openttd>* Belugas has seen more 3.5 crashes then 2.5 <-- me too. However the 3.5" disks are more reliable if you look at how many % of the drives that died
12:37<@Bjarni:#openttd>as I lost 25% of the 2.5" drives
12:38<@Bjarni:#openttd>that's 1 out of 4 ;)
12:38<@Bjarni:#openttd>bbl
12:40<yorick:#openttd>I can't reach openttd.org?
12:40<Forked:#openttd>but you're not sure?
12:40*peter1138:#openttd ponders a RAID of backup disks :p
12:41<yorick:#openttd>ah, it's 150!
12:41<yorick:#openttd>150 times!
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12:43<@Belugas:#openttd>solid state disks ;)
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12:59<@peter1138:#openttd>Belugas, expensive :o
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13:12<Swallow_:#openttd>Is there any difference between using this: "RailVehInfo(v->engine_type)->railveh_type == RAILVEH_WAGON" and this: "IsTrainWagon(v)" ?
13:15<FauxFaux:#openttd>Check the code..?
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13:16<Wolf01:#openttd>hello
13:16<frosch123:#openttd>Swallow_: yes
13:16<@Bjarni:#openttd>use IsTrainWagon()
13:17<Wolf01:#openttd>what's 'THIS'?
13:17<yorick:#openttd>where is 'THIS'
13:17<Wolf01:#openttd>topic
13:17<Wolf01:#openttd>I read topics :D
13:17<Swallow_:#openttd>Bjarni: thanks
13:17<yorick:#openttd>it said "THIS IS NOT A PSYCIC SUPPORT CHANNEL"
13:17<Swallow_:#openttd>^^
13:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the rest of the sentence has been chopped off
13:18<frosch123:#openttd>Swallow_: i.e. w RAILVEH_WAGON can also be a TS_FREE_WAGON
13:18<@Bjarni:#openttd>Swallow_: IsTrainWagon() asserts if the argument isn't a rail vehicle so you should make sure of that first
13:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>apparently, chanserv has a shorter topic storage than the network allows ;)
13:19<yorick:#openttd>bugsies
13:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and also apparently, nobody has bothered to fix it...
13:19<Swallow_:#openttd>frosch123: AFAIK a vehicle can have multiple types, so a TS_FREE_WAGON could also be a TS_WAGON, not sure though
13:19<yorick:#openttd>but has this channel been empty then?
13:20<@Bjarni:#openttd>I don't think so
13:20<@Bjarni:#openttd>but I can kick everybody
13:20<frosch123:#openttd>Swallow_: a enum is not a bitset
13:20<Swallow_:#openttd>return HasBit(v->subtype, TS_WAGON);
13:20<Swallow_:#openttd>is used in IsTrainWagon(v)
13:21<@peter1138:#openttd>yorick, except I spelled it correctly.
13:21<yorick:#openttd>yes, except you spelled it correctly
13:22<@Bjarni:#openttd>Swallow_: you shouldn't think about this. You see you should just use IsTrainWagon(). This will make it easier to change how the info is stored if needed
13:22<@Bjarni:#openttd>you see we already changed that one time
13:23<@Bjarni:#openttd>and if only train.h bothers with how it's stored, it's possible to change. It's no fun to alter 30 files if you could do with only changing one file
13:24<Swallow_:#openttd>Ok, I will use IsTrainWagon(v), thanks for help
13:26<+glx:#openttd>@op
13:27-!-mode/#openttd [+o glx] by DorpsGek
13:27-!-glx changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.6.2 | Website: *.openttd.org (Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs, Revision log: vcs, Release info: finger) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | UTF-8 please | No Unauthorised Bots | We Love YAPP | THIS IS NOT A PSYCIC SUPPORT CHANNEL
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13:27<@glx:#openttd>@deop
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13:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>PSYCIC?
13:29*glx:#openttd slaps yorick for not pasting the right thing
13:29<+glx:#openttd>@op
13:29-!-mode/#openttd [+o glx] by DorpsGek
13:29-!-glx changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.6.2 | Website: *.openttd.org (Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs, Revision log: vcs, Release info: finger) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | UTF-8 please | No Unauthorised Bots | We Love YAPP | THIS IS NOT A PSYCHIC SUPPORT CHANNEL
13:29<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><yorick> but has this channel been empty then? <- akill *@*
13:29<yorick:#openttd>heh
13:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>glx: yeah, I was wondering which one you ment :) Could also have been phsysics :)
13:30<yorick:#openttd>now it's more like a PSY-CHICK
13:31<@Belugas:#openttd>lesson for life... never trust a yorick!
13:31<Wolf01:#openttd>PSY-KICK
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13:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>it smells like a yorick kick
13:32<Wolf01:#openttd>hello Belugas!
13:32<@Belugas:#openttd>mister Wolf01!
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13:32<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>am i psychic when i predict a yorick kick?
13:33<yorick:#openttd>truebrain can smell those kicks from 10km away!
13:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: no, that is just a logic chain of events
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13:33<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>well, i could phrase it in a more nostradamus-y way :p
13:36<@Belugas:#openttd>yorick, by the way, nice stuff for sort_by_lifetime.diff :)
13:36<yorick:#openttd>thanks :-)
13:36<@Belugas:#openttd>se, i'mnot always a bad whale ;)
13:36<yorick:#openttd>most of the time
13:37<yorick:#openttd>and you are always plural :)
13:38<@Belugas:#openttd>yeah... i know.. it was a mistake i did from my forum's inscritption
13:39<@Belugas:#openttd>long stoty
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13:47<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: sounds like an interesting story :)
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13:55<sulai:#openttd>hi ho =)
13:55<sulai:#openttd>how do you like this station window http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=99080
13:55<Forked:#openttd>hum, when I press the "latest screenshot from 0.6.2" on the frong page it takes me to screenshots.. and top there is r10000 and 0.5.0. Am I blind that can't see anything newer? :)
13:56<hylje:#openttd>ratings could be colorcoded in each cargo description
13:56<@peter1138:#openttd>There are none.
13:56<Forked:#openttd>screenshots? but the picture advertises with "Latest User Screenshot of 0.6.2" :p
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13:58<sulai:#openttd>hylje: yes, but away from that, I like the idea to have no ratings button, but have the ratings integrated in the station window.
13:58<sulai:#openttd>I already wrote a patch for that =)
13:58<sulai:#openttd>I'd like to ask for general feedback ;)
13:59<sulai:#openttd>and maybe a dev can have a look at the patch http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=99078
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14:06<planetmaker:#openttd>I like the idea of the rating shown directly, sulai :)
14:06<planetmaker:#openttd>I think, though, that it would make more sense to integrate the rating somehow with the waiting cargo display
14:06<@Belugas:#openttd>why ? it's not everyone who cares for that
14:06<@Belugas:#openttd>some do, some don't
14:07<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: true. But that's no reason to not show it.
14:09<@Belugas:#openttd>and it's not a reason to show it either, imho
14:09<planetmaker:#openttd>maybe it suffices to put the percentage next to waiting cargo. Whether it's very good, good, outstanding or so is duplication of information
14:10<@Belugas:#openttd>i nderstand the good it wants to achieve, don't misunderstand me
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14:11<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: :) Time is money. And clicks are bad ;). And if a person choses to ignore that info, it won't hurt.
14:11<planetmaker:#openttd>otoh, if you want it, you have to click currently... and mostly I'm only interested in the percentage, not the translation of that into text
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14:14<sulai:#openttd>planetmaker: otoh, if you want it, you have to click currently... and mostly I'm only interested in the percentage <- yeah right ;)
14:14<sulai:#openttd>I *allways* click that "Ratings" button
14:16<@Belugas:#openttd>** plunk **
14:16<planetmaker:#openttd>:) Well... I don't need always that info as much waiting cargo also tells something, but...
14:16<planetmaker:#openttd>hm... you try to tell us something Belugas ?
14:18<yorick:#openttd>Forked: advertising with "latest user screenshot of 0.5.0", "current version: 0.6.2" does not make much sense
14:19<@peter1138:#openttd>97GB!
14:19<@Belugas:#openttd>and what if i am far more worried about my rating in regards of the town i am working on right now, shold i move the ratio in front gui too?
14:19<@peter1138:#openttd>:o
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14:19<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: I think I have seen such patch already...
14:20<@Belugas:#openttd>ho... of course... it makes it now a valid one, right?
14:20<@Belugas:#openttd>** plunk **
14:20<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
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14:20<planetmaker:#openttd>certainly not. But as an option (like with transparency Ctrl+X) it might be nice :)
14:20<@Belugas:#openttd>and if i care far more about my loans, as to get them replaid, shold i add a button ton the toolbar just tfor that??
14:21<planetmaker:#openttd>no :)
14:21<@peter1138:#openttd>Belugas, I think someone already suggested that :(
14:21<planetmaker:#openttd>that's utter rubbish. In my very non-subjective view :P
14:22<@Belugas:#openttd>the point is: this proposed cahnge is for someone who cares about THAT stuff. someone comes in and suggest another info that HE finds crucial
14:22<@Belugas:#openttd>and here we go again...
14:22<@Belugas:#openttd>christmas tree
14:22<@Belugas:#openttd>peter1138, you are right :)
14:22<@peter1138:#openttd>mouse wheel on the status bar or something silly, it was...
14:23<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: fair enough and surely true.
14:23<@peter1138:#openttd>Bah, I need a better chair.
14:23<SmatZ:#openttd>http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2254
14:23<planetmaker:#openttd>The point is: what is "most wanted" :) and what destroys the look & feel.
14:23<SmatZ:#openttd>but buttons etc. at the toolbar have been suggested too
14:24<planetmaker:#openttd>Until I learnt the usage of ctrl in that window I found the buttons most annoying.
14:24<planetmaker:#openttd>After that I didn't care anymore.
14:24<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
14:25<@Belugas:#openttd>what is not acceptable is "I am using it, so it must be good for all"
14:25<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas: that other people have a different conception of "I" - e.g. they might refer that to themselves and not me. :D
14:26<@Belugas:#openttd>i'm not pointing at you, planetmaker
14:27<planetmaker:#openttd>then I save this sentence for the next time - or the last time ;)
14:28<sulai:#openttd>Belugas: and what if i am far more worried about my rating in regards of the town i am working on right now, shold i move the ratio in front gui too? <- yes
14:28<planetmaker:#openttd>But in order to get the hang of how correct a statement like "I like it - all like it" is, discussions about exactly a topic may be helpful :)
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14:29<yorick:#openttd>topic is incorrect, openttd.notice isn't for FS notices
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14:29<@Belugas:#openttd>sulai this is self centered minding. not the way to go
14:29<@Belugas:#openttd>and a change for a change is not really welcome either
14:31<sulai:#openttd>Belugas: sulai this is self centered minding. not the way to go <- we need feature voting....
14:31<yorick:#openttd>don't we have that already?
14:31-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!*Yorick@*.adsl.wanadoo.nl] by peter1138
14:31-!-yorick was kicked from #openttd by peter1138 [Oh go away]
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14:32<sulai:#openttd>yorick: where?
14:32<@Belugas:#openttd>sulai, i'm sorry but it's not our way to go
14:32<frosch123:#openttd>the "votes" on flyspray are for rejecting patches :p
14:32<SmatZ:#openttd>:-D @ frosch123
14:32<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
14:32<SmatZ:#openttd>that would stop people from voting for their own requests though ;)
14:33<SmatZ:#openttd>but they could put negative votes to all other tasks...
14:33<frosch123:#openttd>funnily most of the new patches have exactly one vote, you might guess from whom :)
14:33<planetmaker:#openttd>better: 1€ / vote as donation to OpenTTD :)
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14:34<planetmaker:#openttd>buying votes might be anything but democratic, but that's besides the point :)
14:36<sulai:#openttd>I like this voting thing ;)
14:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>planetmaker: then make a 'bounty' page for OpenTTD :p
14:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>lol
14:38<planetmaker:#openttd>:)
14:39<planetmaker:#openttd>buy votes at a discount: pay 10€ and get 11 votes :P
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14:41<@peter1138:#openttd>This is not a democracy :D
14:41<@peter1138:#openttd>I AM YOUR OVERLORD
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14:42<planetmaker:#openttd>there you go. :D
14:46<@Bjarni:#openttd>democracy sucks
14:46<@Bjarni:#openttd>we just use it due to lack of a better system
14:46<@Belugas:#openttd>we do?
14:46<@Belugas:#openttd>never realized that...
14:46<@Bjarni:#openttd>Plato wrote that
14:47*FauxFaux:#openttd kisses peter1138's feet.
14:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>peter1138: somehow I get this nasty idea to type: @kick peter1138 :p
14:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>dunno why ... ;)
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14:52<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
14:52<planetmaker:#openttd>rise and fall of nations^Woverlords? written by Truebrain?
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14:53<hylje:#openttd>spawn more overlords
14:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and when you run out of mana/gold/whatever?
14:53-!-Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46ad5.virnxx14.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
14:53<hylje:#openttd>we require more vespene gas
14:55<SmatZ:#openttd>Woverlords?
14:55<SmatZ:#openttd>Not enough minerals.
14:56<SmatZ:#openttd>yay starcraft :)
14:56*Belugas:#openttd remembers a certain jezz who decided to do a branch/fork run by community
14:57<@Belugas:#openttd>it never did worked even a single week
14:57<planetmaker:#openttd>:) Easily imaginable
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15:03-!-mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
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15:19*SmatZ:#openttd is on a Commit spree!
15:20*Eddi|zuHause:#openttd does not see any commits
15:20<@Belugas:#openttd>ZOMG!!! a user's work been commited and no voting has been performed!!!
15:21<SmatZ:#openttd>indeed (!!111oneoneeleven)
15:21<SmatZ:#openttd>:-P
15:21<@peter1138:#openttd>eleventyone
15:21<@peter1138:#openttd>Get it right.
15:21<SmatZ:#openttd>:-)
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15:37<planetmaker:#openttd>you picked up the ultimate coding gun and a pack of code lines
15:37<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
15:37-!-lilman424 [~evanseeds@r59h83.res.gatech.edu] has joined #openttd
15:38<SmatZ:#openttd>:-D
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15:38<lilman424:#openttd>How feasible would it be to make cargo selectable by station?
15:38<lilman424:#openttd>like, instead of having grain appear when a train with grain cars, be able to say "hey, i want grain to appear at this station now"?
15:41<@Belugas:#openttd>yuo just have to move the farm near the other station
15:41<@Belugas:#openttd>it is what's nearby the station that decides what should be picked up
15:42<@peter1138:#openttd>Move the farm? :D
15:42<@Belugas:#openttd>;)
15:47<lilman424:#openttd>no, i mean....
15:48<lilman424:#openttd>I build a station near a farm and there's a check list or something on the station GUI so it can start accepting grain before any vehicles arrive
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15:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you can send a grain train before you finish building the line ;)
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15:49<lilman424:#openttd>that's not the point <_<
15:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but indeed, a checklist might be useful
15:49<lilman424:#openttd>:P
15:50<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>especially about "i don't want to transport this cargo anymore"
15:50<lilman424:#openttd>yeah
15:50<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>also a possibility would be "i don't want to deliver cargo here" [in case an unexpected industry appears near the station]
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15:52<@Belugas:#openttd>there's still the option (under stations) "Deliver Cargo to a station only when there is a demand" . put it off, it might getting close to your request
15:52<@Belugas:#openttd>otherwise...
15:52<@Belugas:#openttd>pffff...
15:52*Belugas:#openttd does not want to do that, too buzy elsewhere
15:53<SmatZ:#openttd>there have been several tries to code that, but everything ended in the "I have an idea" stage :)
15:53<@Belugas:#openttd>and i guess it would ruin a bit game play, would'nt it?
15:53<SmatZ:#openttd>last time I remember frosch123 or I wanted to code that
15:53<SmatZ:#openttd>it whould be fairly simple
15:53<@Belugas:#openttd>you did?
15:53<@Belugas:#openttd>ho boy...
15:53<SmatZ:#openttd>except... people could cheat by removing cargo acceptance when there is no train to increase station rating and so
15:53<SmatZ:#openttd>so some kind of timeout would be needed
15:54<SmatZ:#openttd>also that GUI part isn't fun to code
15:54<SmatZ:#openttd>and Belugas doesn't like Ctrl+click :)
15:55<@Belugas:#openttd>ctrl-click needs to be tamed and kept in a normal ratio and meaning
15:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i'd just have suggested: ctrl+click on the cargo in the provides/accepts list ;)
15:56<@Belugas:#openttd>it should not be a way to add a new functiaonlity without any kind ofconnect with the normal click
15:56*peter1138:#openttd considers an early night.
15:56<@peter1138:#openttd>Also...
15:56<SmatZ:#openttd>nn peter1138
15:56<@peter1138:#openttd>98GB!
15:56<@Belugas:#openttd>:)
15:56<SmatZ:#openttd>peter1138: what are those numbers?
15:56<@Belugas:#openttd>sleep nice
15:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>what's the target anyway?
15:56<@peter1138:#openttd>Aw crap, now the farms are closing :(
15:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>140GB?
15:57<@Belugas:#openttd>move them!
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>SmatZ, what 1138? ;)
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>Haha
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>SmatZ, I'm copying data of a broken disk, slowly...
15:57<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe :)
15:57<SmatZ:#openttd>ahh :) very slowly I see :)
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>Target is 120GB, although that's drive manufacturer GBs...
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>Copying it byte by byte, it seems :p
15:57<ln-:#openttd>has peter1138 subscribed to a HD porn site, or what are those GBs?
15:57<@peter1138:#openttd>Accessing it normally causes the drive to disappear.
15:57<SmatZ:#openttd>:-)
15:58<SmatZ:#openttd>interesting
15:58<SmatZ:#openttd>at least it works :)
15:59<@peter1138:#openttd>For now...
15:59<@peter1138:#openttd>Had to force the BIOS to ignore the drive, booted a Debian installer CD, and it managed to pick the drive up.
15:59<@peter1138:#openttd>So it's now using dd and nc to copy it.
16:00<SmatZ:#openttd>hmm maybe I could try it too, I have one drive that fails a lot...
16:00<Wolf01:#openttd>'night
16:00<SmatZ:#openttd>nn
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16:02<@peter1138:#openttd>This map is tricky :o
16:12<@Belugas:#openttd>which one? the map to your bed ?
16:12*Belugas:#openttd hides
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16:16<@peter1138:#openttd>Yeah :o
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16:17<frosch123:#openttd>http://cfopenttd.forum-actif.net/ <- someone must be colorblind o_O
16:17<frosch123:#openttd>at least I am now
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16:18<SmatZ:#openttd>helb!
16:19<SmatZ:#openttd>frosch123: what's bad about it?
16:19<@Belugas:#openttd>it's... blue with a violent aqua tone!
16:19<frosch123:#openttd>is the background not cyan for you
16:19<frosch123:#openttd>blue on cyan...
16:20<SmatZ:#openttd>I don't know, I am colourblind :-P
16:20<SmatZ:#openttd>fine for me
16:20<@Belugas:#openttd>seriously?
16:20<@peter1138:#openttd>It's readable, just ugly.
16:20<@peter1138:#openttd>Also... COMIC SANS :o
16:20<SmatZ:#openttd>Belugas: yes, a bit... 10% of male population is :)
16:21*Belugas:#openttd is happy not to be on that 10%
16:22<SmatZ:#openttd>:)
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16:23<SmatZ:#openttd>it has disadvantages, like it is almost impossible to find the iron ore in the minimap ;)
16:26<@peter1138:#openttd>Well, that's true for everyone...
16:27<SmatZ:#openttd>:)
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16:28*Belugas:#openttd sends a couple of metal detectors to SmatZ and peter1138
16:28<SmatZ:#openttd>:-)
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16:52<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>mental detectors?
16:54<@Belugas:#openttd>no, metal. remember, we're no psychics!
16:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no, we're no support channel :p
17:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i love torrents. they say they are done in two hours, and when you look at them two hours later, they take 1h 30m to finish
17:04<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: try installing the august 2007 direct x sdk and you'll go crazy
17:04<ln-:#openttd>is it dexter already?
17:05<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>ln-: no, dexter starts on the 28th
17:08*Belugas:#openttd goes home
17:08<@Belugas:#openttd>night all
17:09<ln-:#openttd>has Belugas moved to europe lately
17:09<ln-:#openttd>his night is at night now.
17:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"i go home" usually means he's still at work
17:13<ln-:#openttd>many people are at work at night
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17:14<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not those who work strictly from 9 to 5
17:17<ln-:#openttd>not as often, no
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17:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: I use 'usenet', that gives me a reliable number (like, on average: 4 minutes)
17:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>under the category: did you know, did you know that we made the first successful OSX binary on the compile-farm with 10.3.9? And that it was said to be impossible back then? :)
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17:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>man and woman in the mall:
17:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>man: darling, if you had no feet, would you then buy shoes?
17:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>woman: of course not
17:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>man: so, please, put that expensive bra back
17:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>auch
18:06<welshdragon:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, that was poor
18:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it was on TV here about an hour ago ;)
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19:05<ln-:#openttd>any minute now...
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19:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>any Mac OS X 10.4 Intel awake?
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19:13<ln-:#openttd>Bjarni is one, isn't he?
19:14<@Bjarni:#openttd>not really
19:14<@Bjarni:#openttd>as I upgraded to 10.5
19:14<ln-:#openttd>except TB has me on ignore.
19:14<ln-:#openttd>oh
19:14<TrueBrain:#openttd>Bjarni: that we already knew ...
19:14<TrueBrain:#openttd>dah
19:14<@Bjarni:#openttd>and my 10.4 setup didn't survive being moved to another disk for some reason
19:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>(I am talking to Bjarni in an other channel about OS X and testing some binaries .. and I already asked him if he had 10.4, he said no .. and still for some reason he needs to say that here again, instead of answering my other questions :p
19:15<ln-:#openttd>qed
19:16<ln-:#openttd>Bjarni: are you 10.5 times happier with it than 10.4?
19:17<@Bjarni:#openttd>good question
19:17<@Bjarni:#openttd>I like time machine and tabs in terminal
19:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>but okay, nobody to test this on then ..
19:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>how come i get the feeling that this is an instance of http://xkcd.com/ :p
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19:28<ln-:#openttd>@seen cia*
19:28<@DorpsGek:#openttd>ln-: cia* could be CIA-2 (12 hours, 56 minutes, and 12 seconds ago), CIA-1 (1 day, 9 hours, 55 minutes, and 45 seconds ago), CIA-5 (2 weeks, 6 days, 1 hour, 58 minutes, and 25 seconds ago), CIA-4 (5 weeks, 3 days, 4 hours, 40 minutes, and 26 seconds ago), CIA-9 (5 weeks, 3 days, 12 hours, 23 minutes, and 57 seconds ago), CIA-3 (7 weeks, 4 days, 6 hours, 31 minutes, and 14 seconds ago), or CIA-6 (11 weeks, 5 days, 5 (1 more message)
19:29<ln-:#openttd>@more
19:29<@DorpsGek:#openttd>ln-: hours, 44 minutes, and 44 seconds ago)
19:29<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>@more ln-
19:29<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: Error: That's all, there is no more.
19:30<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i'm too slow for this world...
19:30<ln-:#openttd>the remaining part was even slightly longer than the string "(1 more message)"
19:30*TrueBrain:#openttd gives Eddi|zuHause a hug
19:31<@Bjarni:#openttd>@less
19:31<@Bjarni:#openttd>@sleep
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19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>@less ln-
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>mmh...
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>no effect
19:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>ln--?
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>booooo
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>@less ln--
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>nope...
19:34<@Belugas:#openttd>sadly
19:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>:p
19:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>Belugas: try @kick ln-
19:35<@Belugas:#openttd>naaaa...
19:35<@Belugas:#openttd>cannot kick someone who is already on ignore :P
19:35<@Belugas:#openttd>it would be pointless
19:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>true, as we won't see that ..
19:36<@Belugas:#openttd>^_^
19:36<@Belugas:#openttd>life is sweet, isn't it ;)
19:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>yeah :)
19:36<Chrill:#openttd>nop
19:36<@Belugas:#openttd>ho?
19:36<@Belugas:#openttd>no operation?
19:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>like managing to make OSX 10.5 Intel binaries, just to find out the stage 1 gcc contains a bug :p
19:36<ln-:#openttd>who says "nop", honestly
19:36<Chrill:#openttd>Chrill does, the faggot
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19:39<@Belugas:#openttd>Chrill makes little sens, unless there is a parasit in the transmission
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19:41<penfold:#openttd>what an odd person
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19:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i wonder whether, in ten years, we will be speaking of the desaster of CERN-obyl
19:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: really, what are you getting those from? :p
19:52<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
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19:54<ln-:#openttd>since ops have ignored me, i might as well paste a youtube link to the large hadron rap; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM
20:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"background dancers: prefer anonymity" :p
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20:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"anyone else realize that the thing is 17 miles around. And the particles will be going around 11,000 times per second. Thats 187,000 miles per second. 187 is police code for murder. We're doomed!" :p
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20:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>and I am compiling libstdc++ for OS X (supporting 10.5 Intel)
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20:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>any OSX user here? Even Intel 10.5 is fine ...
20:17<SmatZ:#openttd>[02:09:05] <Eddi|zuHause> <== yeah, one can find magical numbers everywhere :)
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20:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>Mac OS X 10.[45] Intel users requested: http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/OTTD-OSX-custom-r14350.zip
20:40<nicfer:#openttd>would be useful implementing empty slopes?
20:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you make no sense.
20:50<penfold:#openttd>erk, one of my trains made a £34 trillion loss.
20:50<TrueBrain:#openttd>auch
20:51<penfold:#openttd>Bit of corruption there I think, since my bank balance wasn't affected :P
20:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i remember the times when money would overflow at 2^32 ;)
20:53<penfold:#openttd>:O
20:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>well, it was not such a big deal, as building a tunnel overflowed, too ;)
20:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>penfold: create a bug-report (with savegame)
20:56<penfold:#openttd>TrueBrain: Will do.
21:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>I wonder if anyone has a 10.5 Intel on 64bit ... (the OS itself)
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22:08<@Belugas:#openttd>[20:08] <Eddi|zuHause> "anyone else realize that the thing is 17 miles around. And the particles will be going around 11,000 times per second. Thats 187,000 miles per second. 187 is police code for murder. We're doomed!" :p <--- first time i see yu emotive
22:08<@Belugas:#openttd>must be a big day!
22:09<@Belugas:#openttd>nicfer, you have so strange ideas :)
22:09<@Belugas:#openttd>keep on getting them out!
22:09<@Belugas:#openttd>who knows, maybe ne day, a brilliant one might comes up ;)
22:10<roboboy:#openttd>fixing a problem with mibbit
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22:10<roboboy:#openttd>fixing a problem with mibbit
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22:13<@Belugas:#openttd>repeat after me
22:13<@Belugas:#openttd>repeat after me
22:13<@Belugas:#openttd>repeat after me
22:13<@Belugas:#openttd>**plunk**
22:13*Belugas:#openttd unstuck
22:13<@Belugas:#openttd>gaaa!!! you contaminated me!!
22:21<nicfer:#openttd>a void slope would look similar to the sloping system in locomotion/RCT but primitive-ish
22:23<@Belugas:#openttd>hooo... again... LOCOMOTION ...
22:23<@Belugas:#openttd>boooo
22:23<@Belugas:#openttd>prout!
22:25<nicfer:#openttd>well, it wouldn't be 100% identical
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22:26<nicfer:#openttd>I said that it would kinda of remember to the locomotion system
22:27<@Belugas:#openttd>imagine, just for sake of argument, that i have no idea whatsoever about loco system ;)
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22:30<nicfer:#openttd>it would mean that you'll be able to create a slope modification without tracks, roads, etc.
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22:31*roboboy:#openttd admits there are things nice about locomotion
22:33<@Belugas:#openttd>agreed
22:33<@Belugas:#openttd>so if you like them, play Locomotion
22:33<@Belugas:#openttd>so if you like OpenTTD, play OpenTTD
22:33<@Belugas:#openttd>so if you like SimCity, play SimCity
22:34<@Belugas:#openttd>but why... just WHY !! should OpenTTD be a conglomerat of everything that is available outthere???
22:34-!-Zeal [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:34<@Belugas:#openttd>just because we have the sources??
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22:34<@Belugas:#openttd>come one...
22:34<nicfer:#openttd>my goal was, if you build railway over a slope, it becomes a foundation (or fundation)
22:34<nicfer:#openttd>suppose I want only the foundation
22:36<roboboy:#openttd>that could then be used to create false cliffs
22:40<@Belugas:#openttd>a hint: i'd rather see REAL cliffs (no matter how hard they are to create) then look-alike ;)
22:40<@Belugas:#openttd>in the mean time, /me goes to sleep
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---Logclosed Wed Sep 17 00:00:42 2008