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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-12-05

---Logopened Fri Dec 05 00:00:55 2008
00:21-!-Sacro| [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
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01:18<NoPride>anyone here can help me out with openttd dedicated server
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02:01<Sacro>@seen Bjarni
02:01<@DorpsGek>Sacro: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 6 days, 9 hours, 33 minutes, and 1 second ago: <Bjarni> <ln-> well, good to see you back amongst the healthy, in any case. <-- sort off.... I'm totally tired and I missed everything at uni this week
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03:43<planetmaker>morning
03:44<Forked>greetings!
03:48<Alberth>good morning
03:48<planetmaker>hm... is it true that articulated vehicles can only use drive-through road stops?
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04:13<welshdragon>planetmaker, yep
04:13<clarkee>morning
04:13<planetmaker>hm... interesting :)
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04:39<Alberth>Found a feature; negative clearing costs are colored red in the landarea info window, which is incorrect. I can see two approaches to solve this, either by some local tweak in that part of the code, or by introduction of a {COST} currency in the string system. What would be the preferred solution here?
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05:18<Korenn>DaleStan: are you still working on that industry grf I posted about? Because if not, I'll have to advertize to find someone else.
05:19<@petern>the cargo grf should be available now, btw
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05:19<DaleStan>Not lately; Real Life got in the way just after I started, and hasn't let go. I'm still hoping it'll let go in the near future, but it hasn't happened yet.
05:20<Eddi|zuHause>another poor soul lost to that horrible desease of "real life" ...
05:20<Korenn>petern: yeah it is, thanks
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05:20<Korenn>DaleStan: that's fine, I'm not asking if it's done, just if it's still being worked on or not :)
05:21<Korenn>I realize the holidays are coming up so expectations are low
05:22<DaleStan>It's still relatively high on my list of things to do, just not tops.
05:22<@petern>hmm, does windows task scheduler keep a log file?
05:22<@petern>it says a task can't run, but i can't see why :o
05:23<Eddi|zuHause>in system logs?
05:24<Eddi|zuHause>no idea, i have never used it
05:27<@petern>don't see anything in event log
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05:56<yorick>is it me or could CargoList caches overflow
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06:17<yorick>argh, 3 times WITH!!!!! in one suggestion
06:20<Eddi|zuHause>well... when the person cannot type...
06:22<Alberth>or copy/pastes a word what he believes is a correct translation....
06:23<yorick>what kind of language has "!" as part of a word?
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06:38<Eddi|zuHause>yorick: it's an automatic replacement, when someone mistypes "with", it gets replaced by that...
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07:23<@petern>Eddi|zuHause: unfortunately, whit is actually a word :p
07:23<Eddi|zuHause>yeah :)
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07:23<Eddi|zuHause>but i suppose that it is too uncommon in the forum :p
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07:36<roboboy>gnight
07:39<@petern>i have that filter turned off anyway
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07:58<@petern>heh, double tracks in one go... such an *original* suggestion...
07:59<yorick>and he couldn't find anything similar
07:59<@petern>doesn't mean there isn't :)
07:59<yorick>heh
08:00<Eddi|zuHause>i want a LLL_RRR mainline in one go!
08:00<@petern>hehe
08:00<Eddi|zuHause>and automatically include load balancers!
08:01<yorick>and WITH!!!! switches!
08:01<Eddi|zuHause>actually, i have never even used either...
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08:07<fjb>Hello
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08:11<gynter>hmh
08:11<gynter>OpenTTDLib hates me
08:12<SpComb>In Soviet Russia, OpenTTDLib hates YOU!
08:12<SpComb>owait, that's what you said
08:12<Gekz>In soviet russia, you get destroyed by OpenTTDLib
08:13<SpComb>no, the you always has to go at the end
08:13<Gekz>no u
08:14<yorick>in Soviet Russia, the end always has to go at the you!
08:15<gynter>There is no soviet russia
08:15<yorick>in Soviet Russia, there is no you.
08:16<gynter>Wrong, I was born before the collapse
08:17<yorick>in Soviet Russia, the collapse was born before you.
08:17<gynter>thats quite correct
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08:26<yorick>what does int result do in void VehiclePayment(Vehicle *front_v)
08:28-!-Ridayah [~ridayah@173-19-228-199.client.mchsi.com] has joined #openttd
08:29<@petern>nothing
08:30-!-HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.209.139] has joined #openttd
08:31<yorick>then why is there?
08:31-!-Fangor [asd@c-ee0de353.013-115-7673741.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #openttd
08:31<Fangor>hello
08:32<yorick>no
08:32<gynter>false
08:32<yorick>NULL
08:32<Fangor>hmm, I have little problem if anyone care to help :=)
08:32*yorick crashes
08:32<gynter>hmh, why doesn't my server send response?
08:32<yorick>because it's not in soviet russia?
08:32<gynter>you keep repeating yourself
08:33<Fangor>its about building railway, really simple problem that you prob can figure out in 1 sec :P
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08:33<yorick>Fangor: don't ask to ask, just ask
08:33<Fangor>I wanna build 1 railway between 2 stations with 2 trains on it but I cant figure out the trafic lights on the side track
08:34<Fangor>see, real simple noobish question :P
08:34<yorick>and what can't you figure out
08:34<gynter>dont use any singnals, see what happens
08:35<Fangor>well, the trains crash
08:35<yorick>what version are you using?
08:35<Fangor>latest
08:35<Fangor>063
08:35<yorick>latest stable?
08:35<Fangor>0.6.3
08:35<yorick>ok
08:36<@petern>they're called signals, not traffic lights. you can most likely find simple signalling guides
08:37<Fangor>petern, sorry. yeah I've searched them but no one goes over what I need :(
08:37<Fangor>atleast I have not found any
08:37-!-Terkhen [~ircap@50.68.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd
08:37<yorick>then what's your problem?
08:38<Aali>Fangor: place a signal whereever a train may wait and dont ever build two-way signals unless you know what you're doing
08:39<Aali>you'll figure it out eventually
08:39<Aali>just experiment with it
08:39<Fangor>I might be dumb, but I just spend the last 2 hrs doing it :/
08:40-!-HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@89.246.219.196] has joined #openttd
08:41<Fangor>Like I wanna build I basic everyday railroad line, 2 stations 1 track, one sidetrack for train to wait, 2 trains but the with all combinations I've tried it always ends up in a jam
08:43<yorick>-------------------,-----------------,--------==============,--============--------,---
08:43<yorick>=<- train, -<- rail ,<- signal
08:44<mrfrenzy>yorick: you should have a single two-way signal at each end of the 1-way track
08:44<Fangor>Cant I do it with 2 way tracks?
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08:45<yorick>2-way tracks with more than 1 train will always jam
08:45<Fangor> ah ok, even with a sidetrack for the other train to wait on?
08:45<gynter>no
08:45<yorick>no
08:45<yorick>but the sidetrack needs to be long enough
08:46<yorick>and then you still only have 1-way signals
08:46<Fangor>ok, how long? My is just about the lenght of the train
08:46<yorick>lenght of train + 2
08:46-!-HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.209.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:46<mrfrenzy>I mean't one two-way signal at each end of the two-way track
08:47<mrfrenzy>then at each ends you need to have two one-way tracks, one in each direction
08:47<mrfrenzy>so trains can wait there until the 2-way track is clear
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08:48<Fangor>ok, will try that
08:48<Fangor>thx for helping a noob :P
08:49<yorick>stop hating yourself...
08:49<Fangor>^^
08:49<mrfrenzy>it's quite common for people to say noob when they mean beginner
08:49<gynter>noob != beginner
08:50<Fangor>aye?
08:50<yorick>newbie == beginner
08:50<gynter>yes
08:50<gynter>or newb
08:50<@petern>...
08:51<yorick>...?
08:51<gynter>Fangor, http://img19.picoodle.com/img/img19/3/12/5/f_trainsm_26fba35.png
08:52<Spoons>Eeew, turn around at station enabled.
08:52<gynter>^^
08:52<Fangor>gynter, thx mate
08:55<gynter>Hmm my server still doesn't like OTTD_PACKET_UDP_QUERY_SERVER
08:56<gynter>it sends the data, but doens't get anything back
08:56<gynter>$changed = stream_select($read, $write = NULL, $except = NULL, 0); this part returns false
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09:02<DASPRiD>gynter, that can be. is the socket blocked or unblocked?
09:02<yorick>blocking/unblocking?
09:02<DASPRiD>or well, more, blocking or non-blocking ;)
09:03<DASPRiD>gynter, you could describe your problem a bit more and probably show some source?
09:03<gynter>stream_set_blocking($this->fp, false);
09:03<gynter>Im using OpenTTDLib from rev 9000
09:04<gynter>http://pastebin.com/m43e62516
09:04<gynter>Haven't modifide OpenTTDLib
09:04<gynter>modified*
09:04<DASPRiD>hm well you have a timeout of 0
09:05<DASPRiD>which means, when there are no data on the socket at the moment, it directly returns false
09:06<DASPRiD>anyway, there's a huge "warning" oh php.net/socket_select about setting a timeout of 0 ;)
09:06<DASPRiD>your timeout should be at least 200,000 microseconds
09:06<gynter>timeout is 1 afaik
09:06<DASPRiD>$changed = stream_select($read, $write = NULL, $except = NULL, 0)
09:06<DASPRiD>i would say no ;)
09:07<DASPRiD>its 0
09:07<DASPRiD>btw, what exacly are you trying to archive
09:07<DASPRiD>query server information?
09:08<gynter>yes
09:08<DASPRiD>hm
09:08<gynter>$changes checks only if theres data in stream to process
09:08<DASPRiD>you could also use fread() :x
09:08<gynter>fread reads the data
09:08<gynter>sec
09:09<gynter>gona paste openttdlib
09:09<DASPRiD>kay
09:09<gynter>http://pastebin.com/d5482bba9
09:09<gynter>line 187 is the receive part
09:10<DASPRiD>ugh php4 :x
09:11<DASPRiD>so its only called once?
09:12<gynter>in while
09:12<gynter>until it has data in it
09:12<DASPRiD>ah
09:12<DASPRiD>i would just use fread
09:12<DASPRiD>then it returns as soon as data are there
09:12<DASPRiD>and in case of EOF, it returns without result
09:12<gynter>$data = fread($this->fp, SEND_MTU);
09:13<DASPRiD>yeah as i said, JUST the fread ;)
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09:14<gynter>var_dump($data) returns string(0) ""
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09:17<gynter>Might the sent packed be wrong?
09:24<gynter>packet*
09:27<yorick>when calculating a feeder share, is the age of the cargo used instead of the time it took someone to get it there?
09:27<Fantasya>mercy
09:29<mrfrenzy>yorick: it's always the time from pickup to delivery that is payed for
09:29<mrfrenzy>if you let it rot at some transfer station you will have to pay for it
09:30<yorick>so the days_in_transit is reset?
09:31<yorick>"pay transfer vehicle for only the part of transfer it has done: ie. cargo_loaded_at_xy to here", but the whole time seems to be used
09:32<gynter>thats odd, the packed whats sent has lenght 4
09:32<gynter>not 3
09:32<gynter>th*
09:32<yorick>did you include the size byte?
09:32<gynter>yes
09:32<gynter>i use OpenTTDLib
09:32<yorick>and the type byte?
09:33<gynter>it "should" work with that afaik
09:33<yorick>ask dih ;)
09:36<gynter>hmh, with my own written code, its 3, but still no answer
09:40<yorick>is it a transfer bug?
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10:04<gynter>I have no idea what I'm doing wrong
10:04<gynter>data should move correcty since i can get servers data via game
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10:11<gynter>hmm
10:11<gynter>im dumb
10:11<gynter>I was sending wrong packet size, now i get blocked error :P
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10:25<gynter>nevermind, got it working, thanks everyone
10:25<yorick>http://openttd.pastebin.com/m4c664e50 <-- does this fix anything?
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10:27<@Celestar>hey peops
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10:28<gynter>hello
10:28<yorick>hey Celestar :)
10:29*Celestar is in Paris :D
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10:29<yorick>ah
10:29<@Rubidium>so... ICE or TGV?
10:29<@Celestar>Rubidium: well, took the ICE to Paris. Will take the TGV back tomorrow
10:29<@Celestar>ICE at 320km/h is pretty pretty awesome.
10:30<@Celestar>Thanks to our incapable goverments, the Track from Frankfurt to the Border sucks ass
10:31*Rubidium didn't consider the Shinkansen pretty pretty awesome; it was all very quiet and uneventfull, even when passing stations at 300+ km/h
10:31<@Celestar>From an enviromental point of view, the train was horrible of course.
10:31<@Celestar>load factor of around 10%
10:33<Splex>i was on the shanghai maglev once... 450km/h
10:33<Splex>that was 2005, but when i went on it again in 06, they only went up to 350... top speed is 500, but i don't think they go that fast these days
10:34<@Celestar>Splex: they don't run 500km/h because it'd save them like 10 seconds on that short route :D
10:34<Splex>yeah :)
10:34<Splex>and... surely more costly
10:34<Splex>efficiency issue
10:34<Splex>was pretty crazy going 450 though
10:34<Splex>around the turns
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10:35<gynter>yeh, last year longest maglev arrival delay was 6 seconds
10:36<@Celestar>gynter: lol
10:37<@Celestar>we had 20 minutes of delay yesterday
10:40<@Celestar>Rubidium: the thing is, the ICE can't go 320km/h in germany.
10:40<@Celestar>it sometimes goes up to 300km/h in Frankfurt-Stuttgart and Nuremburg-Ingolstadt, but only if it is delyed
10:42<gynter>what happens if PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_GET_LIST sice exceeds the MTU?
10:42<yorick>it doesn't
10:42<gynter>thanks
10:43<yorick>you'd need some more than 11 clients
10:43<yorick>wait
10:43<yorick>there are no clients in PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_GET_LIST
10:43<yorick>only companies
10:44<gynter>no
10:44<gynter>ip's and ports
10:44<gynter>should be there
10:44<yorick>oh, you mean master?
10:44<gynter>according to network/core/udp.h
10:44<gynter>yeh
10:45<yorick>it only sends the first 300-something
10:45<gynter>hmm okey.
10:45<yorick>@servers
10:45<@DorpsGek>yorick: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
10:45<gynter>@error
10:46<gynter>hm
10:46<yorick>stupid DorpsGek :/
10:46-!-yorick was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [I'm not stupid]
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10:46<yorick>why did I expect that?
10:47<benjamingoodger>because you're not stupid either?
10:48<@petern>stupid DorpsGek
10:48<@petern>:/
10:49<yorick>how unfair
10:49<+glx>why?
10:50<yorick>he does not get kicked and I did
10:50<Eddi|zuHause>that seems completely fair to me...
10:50*benjamingoodger nods
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11:06<@Celestar>do we have any naming convention for static members of a class?
11:06<@Celestar>m_ or no m_?
11:07<@Rubidium>I'd say no
11:08<@Celestar>Rubidium: fine my be, but we cannot access them using this->, of course
11:08<@Celestar>hm ... we could prefix them with "_" only since they are, in essence, a global variable, aren't they?
11:09<@Rubidium>NameOfClass::variable
11:09<@Celestar>that is possible
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11:12<@Celestar>Rubidium: no it's not possible :P
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11:12<@Celestar>gives a compiler error
11:12<@Celestar>yeah, cuz I've been st00pid
11:13<@Rubidium>then it isn't a static variable
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11:14<@Celestar>should also change the declaration, not only definition :P
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11:23<@Celestar>heh.
11:23<@Celestar>ok
11:23<@Celestar>where did I fsck up the saveload in cargodest :P
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11:27<+glx>Celestar: trunk SAVEGAME_VERSION is 103
11:27<Fantasya>crisis coming
11:27<+glx>and same for cargodest
11:28<Fantasya>general motors going to bankrupt
11:28-!-Singaporekid [~notme@cm153.psi148.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:29<Fantasya>2.5million workers will lose the job
11:29<Eddi|zuHause>hm... general motors owns NBC, and NBC shows Heroes... this is going to be trouble...
11:29<Fantasya>world beautiful, by the way
11:30-!-yorick [~Yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd
11:31<Fantasya>beautiful day, yorick
11:31<@Celestar>glx: yeah, seems so ;)
11:31<Eddi|zuHause>they had that coming anyway...
11:31<@Celestar>glx: I just to find out where I have to raise it in cargodest :P
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11:31<Eddi|zuHause>they would have had that 5 years earlier, but they had to cover that up with a war...
11:31<yorick>Fantasya: your crisis was already there
11:31<@Celestar>glx: I'm wondering whether I should put the cargodest revision to 255, so that I don't have that problem all the time.
11:32*yorick points out to Celestar that there is such a thing as merge to trunk :)
11:32<+glx>use a #define CARGODEST_VERSION = SAVEGAME_VERSION + 1
11:32<Fantasya>but she dont want to stop. she still coming :]
11:32<Eddi|zuHause>Celestar: the MiniIN had a versioning system for that :)
11:33<+glx>Eddi|zuHause: a nasty one :)
11:33<Eddi|zuHause>well, but it did work ;)
11:33<@Celestar>glx: is there anything wrong with setting it to 255? :P
11:33<yorick>except for you can't bump it?
11:34<+glx>255 is SL_MAX_VERSION
11:34<@Celestar>hm .bad
11:34<@Celestar>but having a handful of revisions in between could be helpful (=
11:35<Eddi|zuHause>two ahead should usually suffice to maintain compatibility for trunk and limited compatibility in the branch
11:36<@Celestar>Rubidium: do we have any guildelines for that?
11:36<Eddi|zuHause>i still think the minor version should be used for patched builds
11:37<+glx>no minor version should never be used
11:37<Eddi|zuHause>and trunk would refuse to load games with a minor version > 0
11:37<@Celestar>I think we should have a branch suffix.
11:37<@Celestar>"-cargodest"
11:38<yorick>why not, glx?
11:38<yorick>Celestar: hg already has unique revisions for each branch
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11:38<@Celestar>yorick: savegame revisions
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>yorick: but you can't use those for savegame versions
11:39<yorick>you can't use a string either
11:39<@Celestar>well ..
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11:44<yorick>Celestar, if you have any time, could you look at http://mz.openttdcoop.org:8000/rev/70084715cdc2 ?
11:45<@Celestar>yorick: looking
11:45<yorick>I don't know if it even fixes anything
11:46<yorick>you're the cargopacket expert :)
11:47<@Celestar>yorick: what is it supposed to fix? :P
11:47<@Rubidium>what is what supposed to fix?
11:48<yorick>in case of multiple transfers, it uses only the time the transfer took instead of the whole journey for calculating the share
11:48<yorick>(Rubidium has me on ignore :p)
11:49<@Celestar>Rubidium: the link yorick posted
11:49<@Rubidium>he's on ignore because he's annoying 99% of the time I'm reading this channel
11:49<@Celestar>http://mz.openttdcoop.org:8000/rev/70084715cdc2
11:50<@Celestar>but theoretically, there' nutting wrong with setting the saveload revision to like 200 in a "branch"
11:50<@Rubidium>oh... he has actually found a way to make FS#2427 even worse ;)
11:51<@Celestar>FS#2427?
11:51*Celestar goes lookin
11:51<yorick>it is actually part of the fix
11:52<yorick>but, yes, it makes it worse
11:52<@Celestar>heh.
11:52<@Celestar>and what's wrong with your diff to 2427?
11:53<yorick>read the comments there...
11:53<@Celestar>oh man, I'm on something that is (apparently) a 56k line...
11:54<@Celestar>maybe I should hijack a better one :P
11:54<Eddi|zuHause>as long as it's the most expensive line you ever had... :p
11:54<yorick>don't they have global wifi in Paris?
11:55<@Celestar>it either doesn't have any signal here, or it doesn't work :P
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11:55<@Celestar>Rubidium: seems the entire partial payment system needs a bit o'thinking, doesn't it?
11:55*yorick points out he's working on it
11:56<yorick>aali and pm even more :)
11:56<Eddi|zuHause>i'm of the opinion that waiting times on stations should not be considered
11:56<Eddi|zuHause>possibly by having station expansion buildings like waiting halls and warehouses for certain cargo
11:57<@Rubidium>it's fine as it is... but as soon as people are going to move cargo from one company to another you'll end up with lots of trouble
11:57<@Celestar>Eddi|zuHause: not at the origin station, but in between they should be.
11:57<@Celestar>Rubidium: yes, for the moment.
11:57<yorick>I'm of the opinion that the profit will be devided between the shareholders
11:57<@Rubidium>which isn't solvable without enormously exploding the size of the cargo packets
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>you need a feeder share value for each company, or not?
11:58<yorick>check
11:58<SmatZ>why should company A take cargo dropped by company B?
11:58<@Rubidium>as basically each cargopacket would become a list of "origin + destination + time travelled + vehicle + company" for each leg
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>SmatZ: different local and long distance companies?
11:58<yorick>the idea is to make a List with vehicles and shares
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>happens a lot in reality
11:59<SmatZ>Eddi|zuHause: the R word :)
11:59<Eddi|zuHause>no, i deliberately used a different r word ;)
11:59<SmatZ>hehe
11:59<@Celestar>Rubidium: /me considers that too much
11:59<@Celestar>the word "overengineered" comes to my mind :P
12:00<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, connecting established networks is of big gameplay value with cargodest
12:01<@Celestar>it will be more so with v2 :D
12:02<Eddi|zuHause>Celestar: but the waiting time is the biggest problem for distributing a fair feeder share value
12:02<@Rubidium>the other thing that can be done is letting passengers and stuff pay for each leg of their route, but then you can very easily boost your profits
12:02<Eddi|zuHause>otherwise you could calculate each leg individually
12:02<Eddi|zuHause>and just add up the values
12:03<@Celestar>Rubidium: yes, hence I have been reluctant do so
12:03<planetmaker>SmatZ: a very usual behaviour in passanger transport :)
12:03<SmatZ>Rubidium: if company B takes cargo dropped by company A, the company A will pay company B current value... but then company A will have less profit
12:03<yorick>Rubidum: you only need the vehicleid and share-value for each company
12:03*planetmaker waves good evening to all
12:03<SmatZ>hello planetmaker :)
12:04<@Celestar>good evening from France, planetmaker :D
12:04<planetmaker>:D
12:04<@Rubidium>SmatZ: I've said that before too, in e.g. FS#2427
12:04<planetmaker>You must be really adicted, Celestar ;)
12:04<yorick>he's abusing someones dailup
12:04<SmatZ>Rubidium: fine then :)
12:04<@Celestar>yeah, I am :P
12:04*Celestar kicks acroread
12:04<@Celestar>planetmaker: no, it's just raining and I'm waiting for dinner time :D
12:04*Rubidium isn't waiting for dinner time
12:04<@Rubidium>... anymore
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12:05<Eddi|zuHause>Rubidium: that can be solved by taking only the "effective distance" into account, so if the passenger would go from A(0,0) to C(0,10) and you transport him via B(5,5), the feeder share at B would be calculated as if it was at B'(0,5). so transporting people backwards would actually cost you money
12:06<@Celestar>Eddi|zuHause: you mean projecting all intermediate points onto the line [A,C] ?
12:06<Eddi|zuHause>yes
12:06<@Celestar>hm . interesting concept
12:07<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: I don't think it's a terribly useful concept.
12:08<planetmaker>Just consider to play with the landscape and going around a mountain range
12:08<planetmaker>Rather like DB does: if you take the longer route between A and B, you pay more...
12:09<thingwath>reality ;-)
12:09<planetmaker>no no. I never use that word.
12:09<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: that is exactly the point that rubidium was trying to avoid
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12:09<Eddi|zuHause>you can too easily boost your money by just shoveling the passengers to the other end of the map
12:10<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: my approach is not to pay when you intermediately drop the cargo. All payment is done upon final delivery
12:10<thingwath>if there is no other way, they have to go to the other end of the map and pay for it :-)
12:10<planetmaker>And then calculate effective travel time --> all get less, if they carry it in circles.
12:10<@Celestar>that is what happens now.
12:11<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: but that requires keeping a reference to all vehicles that carried the cargo
12:11<planetmaker>Celestar: doesn't happen now. You get an approx. share when you transfer cargo. The final vehicle gets the difference between paid transfer money and actual payment
12:11<Eddi|zuHause>in each cargo packet
12:11<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: yes
12:11<planetmaker>I am aware of it. That's the backdraw...
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12:12<Eddi|zuHause>i don't think that would be terribly effective. plus what do you do with invalid references?
12:12<yorick>ignore
12:12<yorick>:)
12:12<planetmaker>you mean invalide vehicle IDs? Ignore.
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12:12<planetmaker>meaning: don't consider when handing out money
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12:12<Eddi|zuHause>like when you sell a vehicle, and build another one? do they get the old ID?
12:13<planetmaker>I don't know :)
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12:14<Eddi|zuHause>you can't cycle through each cargo packet each time you sell a vehicle
12:14<planetmaker>That might indeed have interesting side effects. But they could - in principle - be taken care of.
12:14<planetmaker>Then we don't use vehicleID, but companyID
12:14<planetmaker>hm... no
12:14<planetmaker>vehicles need income.
12:15<Eddi|zuHause>that's what is exactly the current problem ;)
12:15<planetmaker>yeah... :)
12:15<yorick>if someone sells a vehicle, it does not need income
12:15<planetmaker>that's for sure.
12:16<planetmaker>But you don't want to attribute the money to another vehicle either.
12:17<yorick>if someone sells a vehicle, just give money to the company
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12:26*Celestar gotta go
12:26<@Celestar>cu tomorrow or so
12:26<@Celestar>:D
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13:02<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r14656 /trunk/src/ (fileio.cpp fios.cpp): -Change: replace instances of x & S_IFREG with S_ISREG(x) as S_IFREG can be 0 on some platforms.
13:02<@petern>0(x)?
13:03-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host121-194-dynamic.58-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
13:03<Wolf01>hello
13:03<@Rubidium>S_IFREG != S_ISREG
13:05<@petern>ahh
13:06<@petern>close :p
13:06<@petern>there's only one letter between 'em
13:07<@Belugas>or eleven... depends how you count them ;)
13:08<+glx>:)
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13:34<@Belugas>hehehe really tired... Receviving an email starting with FYI. Read it as "Fuck You Idiots"
13:34<benjamingoodger>that is the traditional meaning, yes...
13:35<benjamingoodger>FYI: "you're an idiot and I resent having to remind you of this"
13:35<planetmaker>have a good night Belugas :)
13:35<planetmaker>Sounds like you need to call one or two buddies and order a round of cold beer or alike
13:35<benjamingoodger>indeed
13:35<benjamingoodger>good night
13:38<@Belugas>pretty much, yes...
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13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r14657 /trunk/src/lang/ (7 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2008-12-05 18:44:56
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: afrikaans - 5 fixed by burgerd (5)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: icelandic - 13 fixed by scrooge (13)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: latvian - 101 fixed by Wersoo (101)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: lithuanian - 4 fixed, 293 changed by linasmi (297)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: malay - 40 fixed by Syed (40)
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14:59<svippery>So I pop in to see if anything is new, but apparently not.
14:59<svippery>:(
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15:02-!-XeryusTC is now known as Xeryus|bnc
15:02<yorick>ld doesn't like me
15:03<svip>Really?
15:03<yorick>or I just forget to define pools
15:03<yorick>why are they called "old", btw?
15:05-!-Xeryus|bnc is now known as XeryusTC
15:12<yorick>whoa, it compiles =)
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15:22<Eddi|zuHause>because there are supposed to be new ones
15:28<gynter>hmh
15:28<gynter>why I get blocking error when communicating with masterserver?
15:28<gynter>but only if mtu is bigger than real packet size
15:29-!-De_Ghosty [~s@69-196-188-101.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd
15:30<gynter>blocking is set to true
15:31<svip>I haven't played this game in half a year, any new significant features since then?
15:31-!-XeryusTC is now known as Xeryus|bnc
15:32<Sacro>Rubidium: do you want ArchLinux packages?
15:34<gynter>svip, colors
15:34<svip>Colours?!
15:34<svip>But but... it had colours before!
15:35<svip>Or did they change all the colours (e.g. invert them)?
15:35-!-Xeryus|bnc is now known as XeryusTC
15:35<Eddi|zuHause>no, there are no new features since half a year ago
15:35<svip>:| I said significant.
15:35<Eddi|zuHause>except maybe "advanced settings"
15:35<svip>Sheesh.
15:36<Eddi|zuHause>that is clearly the most significant feature
15:36<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: yapp?
15:36<Eddi|zuHause>nah... how can that tiny thing be significant?
15:36<Eddi|zuHause>oh... and the earring bug is still not fixed...
15:36<planetmaker>hm... probably you're right.
15:37<planetmaker>and renaming player to company.
15:37-!-De_Ghosty [~s@69-196-188-101.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:37<Eddi|zuHause>that's clearly a huge indicator that nothing significant could have happened
15:37<planetmaker>yep
15:37<planetmaker>people are as bored as the devs.
15:39<yorick>svip: they made it possible to play dos grfs with windows grfs combined
15:40<yorick>and the YAPP
15:40<svip>Yet Another Pee Pee?
15:40-!-De_Ghosty [~s@69-196-190-235.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd
15:40<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, that's exactly it
15:40<svip>Ah.
15:40<svip>I thought so too!
15:40<yorick>PBS Patch :)
15:41<svip>Nice!
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15:41<Eddi|zuHause>oh... and there's this insignificant hg branch going on... but i forgot why people even wanted that feature...
15:41<Terkhen>hello
15:41<yorick>infrastructure sharing
15:41<yorick>and cargodest
15:44<planetmaker>lool
15:44<planetmaker>I've seen no AI for long either
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15:49-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-60-185.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
15:49<Nite_Owl>Hello all
15:50-!-De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-151-217.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd
15:50<@Belugas>[15:37] <Eddi|zuHause> oh... and the earring bug is still not fixed... <-- well... minds are really hard to bug fix...
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16:10<yorick>is there any pow function in C?
16:10<@Belugas>[15:38] <planetmaker> people are as bored as the devs. <-- another explanation: devs (at least me) are too busy with the insanity called R
16:10<@Belugas>pow wow!
16:11<yorick>like the one in math.h?
16:14<+glx>yes the one in math.h
16:14<+glx>but using float math is not welcome in a multiplatform program
16:16<thingwath>why?
16:17<+glx>well it's usually not a problem, but as OTTD requires every client do the exact same things, rounding errors can be a problem
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16:21<yorick>my oldpool doesn't like me :(
16:21<yorick>glx: pow isn't necessarily float math
16:22<+glx>double pow(double, double)
16:23<thingwath>pow makes sense even for natural numbers :-)
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16:25<Eddi|zuHause>but that needs a completely different implementation
16:25<Eddi|zuHause>basically, you do square-and-multiply instead of reducing it to e-functions
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16:28<yorick>oldpool.h:125, expression index < this->GetSize() failed
16:28<yorick>why does it do that
16:29<yorick>on creating a new pool item
16:31<+glx>you don't use the right method probably
16:31<yorick>what method should I use?
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16:34<+glx>how are you doing it?
16:34<yorick>CargoShareInfo *csi = new CargoShareInfo();
16:35<+glx>it should work
16:35<yorick>heh
16:36<+glx>did you check CargoShareInfo::CanAllocateItem() before?
16:36<yorick>m, no
16:36<yorick>but it was empty
16:37<+glx>doesn't mean you can add an item
16:41-!-rubyruy [~ruy@S0106000c6e57c851.vf.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd
16:46<yorick>undefined reference to `PoolItem<CargoShareInfo, unsigned int, &(_CargoShareInfo_pool)>::CanAllocateItem(unsigned int)'
16:49<+glx>then your code is broken
16:49<yorick>ah, I forgot adding a block to start with
16:50<yorick>but I still can't use CanAllocateItem :/
16:50<+glx>beacuse all PoolItems have static bool CanAllocateItem(uint count = 1);
16:50<+glx>it's a static function
16:50<yorick>mhm
16:51<yorick>but why isn't it in mine?
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16:55<yorick>m, I did not even call it with an int
16:57<yorick>wait, could it be that I have to include oldpool_func.h?
16:58-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ff58d.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:59<+glx>yes
17:00<+glx>needed for allocation tto
17:00<+glx>*too
17:01<yorick>that could explain something :p
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17:09<Wolf01>'night
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17:47<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r14658 /trunk/src/settings_gui.cpp: -Change: allow changing town names when there are no towns in the scenario yet.
17:47<Eddi|zuHause>interesting feature
17:48<Eddi|zuHause>anyone seen my DVD marker?
17:48<benjamingoodger>yeah, I borrowed it yesterday
17:48<@Rubidium>between your poptarts wrappers?
17:49<benjamingoodger>I left it sellotaped to the back of your monitor for a joke
17:49<Eddi|zuHause>you mean the printouts of my diploma thesis draft
17:50<@Rubidium>did you actually succeed in creating a draft?
17:50<Eddi|zuHause>i did write a few words down per chapter
17:51<Eddi|zuHause>i have till monday to send it to my professor
17:55<Eddi|zuHause>cool i actually found it...
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18:48<@Celestar>\o
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18:54<Eddi|zuHause>it's the frenchman
18:54<@Celestar>aye :P
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18:55<Gekz>/\/
18:55<Eddi|zuHause>hm, i don't think i'm allowed to send in my diploma thesis in french...
18:55<Gekz>lolo.
18:55<Gekz>why not
18:55<Eddi|zuHause>i believe the rules said german or english
18:56<Gekz>lol I see.
18:56<Gekz>I'm pretty sure in Australia it's whatever language you please, as long as there is a translator available
18:57<@Celestar>haha
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19:00<thingwath>or just anything, as long as there are pretty pictures
19:01<Eddi|zuHause>"(11) Die Diplomarbeit soll in deutscher oder englischer Sprache abgefasst werden."
19:02-!-Zahl [~Zahl@e179200129.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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19:11<@Celestar>http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3471 <= LOL, read the BIOS section (=
19:15-!-Fantasya [~a@78.59.192.248] has quit []
19:15<@Celestar>this is downright alarming
19:15<Gekz>lol
19:15<Gekz>it doesnt shock me
19:15<Gekz>:/
19:15<Gekz>this is why MacBooks are superior
19:15-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-60-185.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Read You Soon]
19:15<+glx>not worse than adsl boxes firmwares
19:17<@Celestar>Gekz: well, I've never had any of those problems with hardware from proper manufacturers eithers (=
19:17<@Celestar>e.g. Sun Servers and Workstations
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19:20<thingwath>with such hardware, there are problems even before you turn them on for the first time
19:21<@Celestar>never had that
19:21<thingwath>for example where to get enough money for them
19:21<thingwath>:-)
19:21<@Celestar>neither with IBM/Lenovo Stuff, HP stuff.
19:24-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1FB1B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:25<@Celestar>I found that the ASUS and Gigabyte stuff gets worse from generation to generation
19:25<@Celestar>especially the longetivity
19:25<@Celestar>(when you run that thing around 100% 24/7)
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19:33<benjamingoodger>hm
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19:39<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truebrain * r14659 /trunk/config.lib: -Add: in case Thief^ (forum user) ever tries what he thinks he will try when he doesn't know it is --prefix-dir, make sure he also gets what he assumes he gets :)
19:40<Eddi|zuHause>lmao :p
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19:46<benjamingoodger>heheheh
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19:59<Rexxie>best commit message ever
19:59-!-Rexxie is now known as Rexxars
20:00<benjamingoodger>absolument
20:00*benjamingoodger now feels a tiny bit flat...
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20:08<Eddi|zuHause>hm no, i believe there were better ones
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20:12<Eddi|zuHause>(Score: 5, Funny)
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22:40<@Belugas>HOLY SH...
22:40<@Belugas>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sHx7k1ndCA&feature=related
22:45<benjamingoodger>¬.¬
22:45<benjamingoodger>good night, belugas
22:47<@Belugas>if ever i can find my bed...
22:49<@Belugas>naaa...me goes back in the basement play guitare for a few more moemtbs
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23:02-!-elmex_ is now known as elmex
---Logclosed Sat Dec 06 00:00:58 2008