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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-12-08

---Logopened Mon Dec 08 00:00:10 2008
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04:48<@Celestar>morning \o
04:49<Forked>greetings, sir
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05:14<@Celestar>hm...
05:45<@Rubidium>Celestar: http://rbijker.net/openttd/cargop.diff
05:46<@Rubidium>and maybe when you've handled those comments ask TB for a run of the compile farm so people can test the new version
05:46<@Rubidium>and if that doesn't yield big problems merge somewhere begin next week?
05:49*Forked does a dance
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05:51<ccfreak2k>What if it does cause big problems?
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05:53<@petern>then it gets merged anyway and you personally have to pick up the pieces!
05:54<Forked>mmm cargodest in trunk mmmmm
05:56<Gekz>petern: you know things
05:56<Gekz>"- Environment and boundaries (scope of project on a DFD diagram)"
05:56<Gekz>what do I have to do here?
06:00<ccfreak2k>Is cargodest anything like paxdest?
06:00<@Rubidium>no
06:06<@petern>a what?
06:13<@Celestar>Rubidium: roger
06:16<@Celestar>who was our gcc 2.95.3 guy? TrueBrain ?
06:17<blathijs>Wasn't that tokai? For MorphOS?
06:17<@petern>that's more likely to be gcc 0.1 :P
06:19<@Celestar>:P
06:25<@Celestar>Rubidium: about that "front_v" instead of "u" thingy. Got no problem doing it, but that's the way it is in trunk
06:25<@Celestar>Rubidium: I just moved the declaration
06:25<@Celestar>cancel last statement :P
06:26<@Celestar>in many functions we have "u" as the first vehicle in the chain. Which is prolly a stupid thing anyway
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06:36<@petern>not really
06:37<@petern>usually it's just a way to iterate a chain without clobbering v
06:37<@Celestar>:D
06:38<Sacro>bored(sacro).
06:38<@Celestar>give(sacro, book)
06:39<@Celestar>take(sacro, book)
06:39<@Celestar>share_with(sacro, &work)
06:41<Sacro>mmm
06:41<Sacro>exam(prolog, failed).
06:45<@Celestar>uh_oh
06:46<@Celestar>bah
06:46<@Celestar>I hate dependency mess
06:46-!-treve [~treve@83.101.38.102] has joined #openttd
06:47<Sacro>nah
06:47<treve>hi, any dutch guys here
06:47<@Celestar>?
06:47<treve>any 1 here that can speak dutch?
06:48<treve>because i have a small problem, but its going to be hard for me to do it in english
06:48*Celestar looks in the direction of Rubidium and TrueBrain
06:49<treve>i am running a server, and i would like to run some irc bot on it
06:49<treve>but totaly suck at it
06:49<@Celestar>autopilot?
06:49<treve>yeah
06:49<treve>but i dont understand the websites
06:49<treve>so i am looking for a steph by steph help from some1
06:50<treve>and thats hard to find these days ;)
06:50<treve>i am also noob in mirc
06:51<treve>any 1?
06:51<@Celestar>I dunno mirc
06:52<treve>irc client?
06:52<@Celestar>yeah
06:52<@Celestar>but it's on windows
06:52<treve>:s
06:52<@Celestar>and I haven't touched that in a decade (=
06:53<treve>i am just wondering what to do to run something like autopilot on my server...
06:54<@Celestar>I really dunno on windows
06:55<@Celestar>but you might want to wait for Brianetta, he might be able to help
06:55<Sacro>brian's server is linux
06:56<@Celestar>but he knows about five orders of magnitude more about autopilot than I do
06:58<treve>daim windows :
06:58<treve>:p
06:58<treve>shoot bill
06:59<treve>or... are there some other scripts that are able to remember some players, and there cash, comp value, points earning system etc...?
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07:00<treve>any servers-hosters here (windows)???
07:00<treve>with some scripts or boths on the server?
07:02<treve>where can i obtain autopilot?
07:09<@Celestar>let's see
07:10<@Celestar>dihedral: you there?
07:11<treve>bad hour
07:11<Forked>http://svn.dihedral.de/listing.php?repname=OpenTTD.autopilot&path=%2F&sc=0 (googled)
07:11<treve>als see www.openttd.webs.com my free site
07:11<treve>about the server, but its no fun without ranking and stuff
07:12<@Celestar>Rubidium: so basically we drop all the _t ?
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07:15<planetmaker>[12:53] <treve> i am just wondering what to do to run something like autopilot on my server... <--- you need a fitting version of TCL. And the possibility to run screen helps A LOT
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07:15<planetmaker>whether that's possible on windows... who knows.
07:15<planetmaker>maybe by means of cygwin.
07:16-!-ecke [~ecke@pc149-233.upce.cz] has quit []
07:16<@Celestar>"GNU Screen is now an official Cygwin package"
07:16<treve>:s
07:17<treve>whats tcl
07:17<planetmaker>scripting language
07:17<treve>and how i know i have a fitting version
07:17<planetmaker>by reading the ap+ documentation.
07:17<treve>i am reading something... from that link
07:18<planetmaker>some 7.x and 8.0 will probably do. Butafaik not every 7.x.
07:18<treve>so i need to go find tcl 8.0?
07:18<planetmaker>well. Would be worth a try :)
07:19<planetmaker>oh... maybe it was 8.x instead of 7.x - dunno..
07:19<planetmaker>http://openttdcoop.org/wiki/Autopilot
07:20<planetmaker>read especially the (short) section on windows.
07:21<treve>it is unfortunate that its Expect package is unable to take control over a Windows based openttd dedicated server without modification of the latter
07:21<treve>dont like that :D
07:22<planetmaker>get a OS :)
07:22<treve>:p
07:23<treve>is there also an option/possibility/command to let the server reconnect/advertise again?
07:23<planetmaker>http://openttdcoop.org/wiki/Autopilot/ap%2B <-- the newest version
07:23<planetmaker>afaik not automatically.
07:23<treve>because i have alot of internet breakdowns, and it takes alot of time to re-advertise auto
07:24<treve>its getting my clients away :p
07:24<Forked>You want to host a server on an unstable connection? :\
07:24<TrueBrain>I wouldn't want to join a server which has a lot of internet breakdowns .. dunno .. sounds bad
07:24<TrueBrain>morning all
07:24<treve>i know, i want a stable connection :p
07:25<@Celestar>\o TrueBrain
07:25<planetmaker>:D
07:25<TrueBrain>or let others do the hosting
07:25<TrueBrain>like we say: yeah, we had to cut costs, so we put openttd.org on a home connection .. it is online 90% of the time!!! :s
07:25<planetmaker>:S
07:26<planetmaker>sounds like a bad plan... :) reliability of openttd is quite nice as it is :)
07:27<TrueBrain>hehehe :)
07:27<TrueBrain>I wasn't planning to ;)
07:27<planetmaker>:)
07:27<TrueBrain>we have 1500 binary downloads a day .. not bad :)
07:27<planetmaker>wow, that's quite impressive.
07:27<treve>what can i download with nntp?
07:28<treve>stuff on newsgroups?
07:28<planetmaker>a decent user base for such a "old" game :)
07:28<treve>openttd stuff on newsgroups?
07:28<TrueBrain>90% of that are windows binaries :p
07:28<planetmaker>well... that doesn't matter... *nix compile themselves ;)
07:29<planetmaker>treve: http://www.google.de/search?q=nntp&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a
07:29<TrueBrain>the weekends there are more users :)
07:29<TrueBrain>most *nix get their binaries from their repos, so we don't register those ...
07:29<TrueBrain>we should make a backdoor register protocol, to count the active clients ;)
07:29<TrueBrain>like 'auto-updater'
07:29<TrueBrain>(most software 'abuse' that to count how many clients there are active on a given week)
07:29<planetmaker>TrueBrain: initially... but any guestimate how many come here to obtain a (newer) version?
07:30<planetmaker>TrueBrain: you just would need to call it differently.
07:30<TrueBrain>how do you mean?
07:30<planetmaker>Something along the lines of "improved quality of service"
07:30<@Celestar>BAH.
07:30<planetmaker>spying is so... perjorative ;)
07:30<TrueBrain>hehe
07:30<@Celestar>can't call a class "Routing" apparently
07:30<TrueBrain>Celestar: bless you
07:31<TrueBrain>anyway, we started recording downloads from the moment we moved to LeaseWeb
07:31<TrueBrain>we hit the 1M downloads somewhere last month
07:32<planetmaker>that's impressive... you moved... some half year ago, or so, right?
07:32<TrueBrain>euh, 100k
07:32<TrueBrain>lol
07:32<planetmaker>anyway :)
07:32<TrueBrain>stats start at 2008-09-14
07:32<TrueBrain>so yeah .. a pretty active game :p Haha :)
07:32<planetmaker>any public stats? In order to satisfy now emerging curiosity?
07:33<Sacro>you put your emerging curiosity away
07:33<TrueBrain>the stats page is still on the test-www .. I guess it can be moved to the public one ..
07:34<planetmaker>:)
07:37<TrueBrain>Celestar: nasty restriction ... :s
07:40<Ammler>Heya TrueBrain, as you speak about clients, any chance of providing dedicated builds?
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07:42<treve>planetmaker, why that last link
07:42<treve>to nntp
07:42<treve>i use it all the time
07:42<treve>but not for messages
07:42<TrueBrain>Ammler: dedicated builds for what?
07:42<TrueBrain>the download counter for any dedicated build we ever had was VERY close to 0 ...
07:42<Ammler>I meant builds for dedicated server :-)
07:43<planetmaker>treve: you've been asking about nntp...
07:43<TrueBrain>and the difference is .. what?
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07:43<Ammler>you could use them without SDL
07:44<TrueBrain>I have no clue what Ammler is rambling about, and I guess he doesn't understand he needs to explain it in a different way :) Oh well ;)
07:44<planetmaker>Ammler: rather than dedicated builds I'd like him merge cargodest and noai into trunk ;)
07:45<TrueBrain>I think I will be killed on sight
07:45<TrueBrain>;)
07:45<planetmaker>TrueBrain: I think it means: if you run a server w/o sdl, you currently are in need of compiling yourself...
07:45<planetmaker>TrueBrain: well, then better refrain from merging it - for now ;)
07:45<TrueBrain>planetmaker: yup, you are :)
07:46<TrueBrain>as I said:
07:46<TrueBrain>[13:42] <TrueBrain> the download counter for any dedicated build we ever had was VERY close to 0 ...
07:46<planetmaker>:P
07:46<TrueBrain>I value my life, yes, thank you :)\
07:47<planetmaker>so... before doing that, get your asbesthos clothes - then you can survive the subsequent flame war ;)
07:47<TrueBrain>(did I just degrate most OpenTTD developer to a bunch of babarics? :))
07:47<planetmaker>:D
07:48<TrueBrain>haha :)
07:49<Ammler>TrueBrain: the reason is/was, that you mostly patch a server.
07:49<Ammler>but at least we wouldn't ;-)
07:49<TrueBrain>not really
07:50<TrueBrain>more that most repos systems didn't had it anyway
07:50<TrueBrain>and either you compile stuff yourself, or you use your repos
07:50<TrueBrain>for linux a _VERY_ limited group downloads from our website
07:50<Ammler>we do all the time...
07:50<Ammler>nightlies
07:52<Ammler>was there ever stable dedicated builds?
07:52<Ammler>so you can't really know, there is no interests.
07:53<TrueBrain>I am glad you can answer for us
07:53<TrueBrain>makes my life so much easier :)
07:54<TrueBrain>in the 3 months we no longer have dedicated builds you are the first (!) person to ask .. what a usergroup we have for dedicated builds ... waste of CPU time
07:54<@petern>heh
07:55<@petern>dedicated builds for releases seems reasonable
07:55<@petern>but not nightlies
07:55<TrueBrain>petern: the download counter for those was stuck as 1
07:55<Ammler>petern: there was never ded builds for stabels, afaik
07:56<@petern>stabels?
07:57<TrueBrain>dedicated builds were never published on SF
07:58<Ammler>oh well, I got my answer. ;-)
07:58<TrueBrain>so there is something to say for that
07:58<TrueBrain>still I doubt it will ever get any sane userbase :p
07:58<TrueBrain>(as again, linux systems tend to either use their own repos, or compile it ..)
07:58<TrueBrain>I will schedule some dedicated builds for the next stable release, then we can see ;)
08:00<@petern>:D
08:02<Ammler>there should be a way to see, if there are unpatched server running...
08:02<TrueBrain>yeah, that are those without an 'M' at the end
08:02<Ammler>lol
08:03<@petern>:)
08:03<planetmaker>TrueBrain: is there actually another way to see whether the source was patched than the 'M' of the version string?
08:04<planetmaker>I mean... the 'M' is not really a fail-save indicator...
08:04<planetmaker>:D
08:04<TrueBrain>svn diff
08:04<@Celestar>TrueBrain: could you try to build the latest cargodest on a gcc 2.95.3?
08:04<planetmaker>TrueBrain: well... that for sure :).
08:04<TrueBrain>Celestar: not really ... I think we currently don't have a gcc 2.95.3 ready anywhere ..
08:04<planetmaker>I prefer hg diff meanwhile ;)
08:05<@Celestar>TrueBrain: know anyone who a) needs it and/or b) could try it?
08:06<TrueBrain>planetmaker: fair enough :)
08:06<planetmaker>doesn't SmatZ have a collection of antique gccs?
08:06<TrueBrain>tokai :)
08:06<@Celestar>tokai: SmatZ: can any of you try to build cargodest (latest hg) on gcc 2.95.3 ?
08:06<TrueBrain>but I guess we need to start up a MorphOS VM sooner or later, so I might find time this week or so to create it ..
08:06<TrueBrain>then again .. I also still need several OSX libraries .. but Bjarni seems to have gone up in smoke :(
08:07<@petern>he's not the only OS X user
08:07<@petern>unfortunately
08:07<@Celestar>lol
08:07<TrueBrain>planetmaker: btw, any other method to register code changes is very useless in the Open Source world. If the initial attempt doesn't detect correctly .. it is not really needed to try any other method :)
08:07<TrueBrain>petern: but sadly enough, he was the only one understanding how to give universal libraries :)
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08:11<@petern>i think that was more of a fluke :p
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08:38<planetmaker>[14:07] <TrueBrain> planetmaker: btw, any other method to register code changes is very useless in the Open Source world. If the initial attempt doesn't detect correctly .. it is not really needed to try any other method :) <-- I was rather thinking of something which still persists even if configure --revision=rXYZAB
08:39<planetmaker>but I guess that's rather pointless.
08:39<TrueBrain>for the same reason, yes :)
08:41<TrueBrain>for more info on such techniques, I would like to refer to bzFlags :)
08:41<TrueBrain>they did a lot to prevent cheating clients .. in the end .. it is useless, as it is still possible :)
08:41<TrueBrain>(any and all protections you can avoid, as it is open source :))
08:42<TrueBrain>(well, I even did it for closed source projects, but okay)
08:42<@petern>let's build in drm!
08:42<TrueBrain>hahahahaha :)
08:42<TrueBrain>crazy person :)
08:42<Sacro>D:
08:42<Sacro>openttd
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08:43<TrueBrain>it is open, after activation! :P
08:43<TrueBrain>and you need to sign a NDA if you want to look at the source! :p
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09:01<@Celestar>:P
09:01*Celestar wonders what NDA TrueBrain's Brain is under :P
09:04-!-nfc [nfc@cable-hvk-fe7ede00-156.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: jepjep]
09:07<TrueBrain>I wonder that myself too :(
09:09-!-Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has quit [Quit: On snow, everyone can follow your traces]
09:10<TrueBrain>hmm .. snow ...
09:10<Sacro>hmm, pasties
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09:22<treve>any dutch guys here yet?
09:22<TrueBrain>nah
09:22<TrueBrain>we tend to hide
09:23<treve>you dutch?
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09:23*TrueBrain hides
09:23<TrueBrain>welcome back Belugas :)
09:24<@Belugas>hello :)
09:24<@Belugas>lost a physical drive
09:24<@Belugas>always nice on a monday
09:24<TrueBrain>that sucks ...
09:24<@Belugas>and it is COLD outside
09:24<@Belugas>-18 this morning
09:24<TrueBrain>I hope you have backups :)
09:24<@Belugas>yes
09:24*TrueBrain loves cold :)
09:25<TrueBrain>that is _very_ cold ;)
09:25<@Belugas>and it seems the dive just had a loose connection
09:25<@Belugas>yup, it is
09:25<@Belugas>my son almost refured to go to school heeh
09:26<TrueBrain>can you blame him? :)
09:27<thingwath>I want -18 too :-/
09:29<planetmaker>open the freezer's door, step in, close from inside.
09:30<@Belugas>no, TrueBrain, i caqnnot blame him at all. I was not in a mood to go back in the office either ;)
09:30<thingwath>I will not fit in.
09:30<TrueBrain>oeh, can I do that?
09:30<@Belugas>but that's for other reasons :D
09:31<planetmaker>thingwath: then add a step at the beginning: get bigger freezer ;)
09:32<thingwath>I would not have enough place for such a freezer :o)
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09:36<@Celestar>SUCKS
09:37<@Celestar>thingwath: me too, I want -18 ... % taxes
09:38<thingwath>try the freezer :-)
09:39<TrueBrain>you find taxes there?
09:40*TrueBrain starts to dail 911 ..
09:40<TrueBrain>dial
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09:52<@Celestar>\o glx
09:54<+glx>o/
09:55<@Celestar>glx: could you please try the latest cargodest on your various windows compilers? thanks.
09:55<+glx>ok
10:04<+glx>Celestar: both compiled
10:04<@Celestar>awesome
10:04<@Celestar>warnings?
10:04<+glx>same as trunk
10:04<@Celestar>k
10:04<@Celestar>even better
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10:13<@Celestar>petern: In [cargodest] src/routing.cpp:134, would it be possible to use the "armored cargo type" instead of CT_GOLD?
10:15<+glx>why not use CargoClass ?
10:16<TrueBrain>@calc 96.39 / 55.65
10:16<@DorpsGek>TrueBrain: 1.7320754717
10:16<@Celestar>glx: elaborate?
10:16<+glx>"armored" is a cargo class (CC_ARMOURED)
10:17<@Celestar>that's what I was talking bout ;)
10:17<+glx>but many cargo types can have the same class
10:17<@Celestar>that's the idea (=
10:17<@Celestar>so why isn't the "class" variable enummed?
10:17<@Celestar>classes*
10:18<+glx>it is, in newgrf_cargo.h:12
10:19<@Celestar>yeah, but the member of cargospec isn't
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10:19<+glx>CC are flags
10:19<@Celestar>glx: so anything that is TE_PASSENGERS is CC_PASSENGERS as well normally? (also for games without newcargos)
10:22<+glx>array in cargo_const.h tends to say that
10:23<+glx>but it's not true for TE_WATER and CC_LIQUID
10:23<TrueBrain>I finally (after 2 years or so) understand why my mapgen always produces wrong images :) hahahaha :)
10:23<TrueBrain>oh boy .. this is silly :)
10:24<@Celestar>hm?
10:24<@Celestar>WATER is a subset of LIQUIDS
10:24<@Celestar>glx: http://www.fvfischer.de/CC.diff <= this looks reasonable for you?
10:25<@Celestar>s/for/to
10:25<@Celestar>:o
10:26<+glx>for me it is
10:26<@Celestar>in the sense that it doesn't change anything I mean
10:26<+glx>yes it should do the same while being more generic :)
10:26<@Celestar>yes
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10:27<@Celestar>the question is, what happens, THEORETICALLY, if something is CC_PASSENGERS and CC_MAIL
10:27-!-M4rk is now known as Mark
10:27<@Celestar>I should basically assert that this doesn't happen
10:27<@Celestar>or at least give a big big warning
10:30<@Celestar>Rubidium: the stuff in english.txt cannot be done differently because the stuff needs to be consecutive
10:30<@Celestar>Rubidium: and I don't feel cargodest is the right place to rewrite the "Advanced Settings" GUI :P
10:31<+glx>hmm I think we'll never see CC_PASSENGERS and CC_MAIL at the same time (as it has an influence on station type too)
10:31<+glx>Only cargos which are in class 0 (passengers) will appear in bus stations. Only cargos which are not in class 0 will appear in truck stations.
10:31<@Celestar>yeah
10:31<@Celestar>well.
10:31<@Celestar>what about CC_MAIL and CC_ARMOURED
10:31<@Celestar>:P
10:31<@Celestar>armored mail :P
10:32<+glx>that is allowed I think
10:33<@Celestar>ok.
10:33<+glx>like express refrigerated (food) and bulk refregirated (fruit)
10:33<@Celestar>is that armored mail or is that mailed valuables?
10:34<@Celestar>so what should take precedence?
10:34<+glx>can be both (depends on the grf author idea)
10:34*Celestar shrugs
10:35<@petern>hmm?
10:36<@petern>replacing cs->town_effect with IsCargoInClass() is totally wrong
10:36<@Celestar>please elaborate
10:37<@petern>town_effect is there to specifically allowed modified cargos to behave in a certain way
10:38<@Celestar>TrueBrain: you're working on mapgen?
10:39<TrueBrain>Celestar: yup
10:39<TrueBrain>about time, not? :)
10:39*Celestar nods
10:40<@Celestar>I want my southern Germany map
10:40<@Celestar>:P
10:40<@Celestar>that one's HARD
10:44<TrueBrain>not as hard as fixing a 2 year old bug .. /me feels stupid
10:44<TrueBrain>Feb 2007
10:44<TrueBrain>so 22 months :p
10:44<@Celestar>heh
10:44<@Celestar>ok I'm outta here a bit
10:45<@Celestar>\o
10:45-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@129.187.69.65] has quit [Quit: leaving]
10:45<TrueBrain>I made latitude corrections from left to right .. when it should be done from center to left AND right ..
10:45<TrueBrain>grr
10:45<TrueBrain>bye Celestar
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11:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r14662 /trunk/src/lang/ (10 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
11:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2008-12-08 16:28:15
11:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: frisian - 216 fixed, 14 changed by Frysl?\195?\162n Boppe (230)
11:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: hebrew - 109 fixed, 2 changed by ybungalobill (111)
11:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: hungarian - 1 changed by oklmernok (1)
11:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: indonesian - 115 fixed by adjayanto (59), fanioz (56)
11:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: lithuanian - 24 fixed by Enternald (24)
11:36<CIA-1>OpenTTD: glx * r14663 /branches/noai/ (145 files in 18 dirs): [NoAI] -Sync: with trunk r14573:14662
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12:03<Terkhen>good afternoon
12:03<benjamingoodger>hello
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14:24<yorick>http://paste.openttd.org/177480 <-- any thoughts?
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14:53<SmatZ>Celestar: cargodest doesn't compile for me for neither 2.95.3, 3.4.6, 4.3.2 ... maybe I have different version
14:53<SmatZ>I get errors like
14:53<SmatZ> /openttd-exCargo/src/routing_classes.h:28:42: boost/graph/adjacency_list.hpp: No such file or directory
14:53<SmatZ> /openttd-cargodest/src/routing.cpp:108: error: 'CC_PASSENGERS' was not declared in this scope
14:56<Aali>did you get the boost library? :P
14:57<+glx>SmatZ: he's not here
14:57<+glx>but I get the CC_* errors too
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15:04<frosch123>looks like he can faster commit than his editor can save :)
15:07<+glx>that or he didn't compile before commit
15:08<SmatZ>glx: I hardly ever meet Celestar here :(
15:08<frosch123>http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/diffs/makeitcompile.diff <- works for me though
15:09<frosch123>though 7940ecee9754 was not finished, it still uses town effect in some places
15:09<planetmaker>g'evening :)
15:10<SmatZ>hello Mr. planetmaker :)
15:10<planetmaker>ha... my assumption seems right that you collect gcc, Mr. SmatZ :)
15:10<SmatZ>:)
15:11<yorick>Hello Mr. PlanetMaker
15:12<planetmaker>hi yorick :)
15:13<planetmaker>I haven't come to review the IS commit... too much to do these times :S
15:13<SmatZ>frosch123: thanks, it helps :)
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15:33<Nite_Owl>Hello all
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16:01<benjamingoodger>hello Nite_Owl
16:02<SmatZ>planetmaker: glx: ok, cargodest with frosch123's patch compiles with gcc-2.95
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16:16<planetmaker>now, that's good news :)
16:17<SmatZ>:)
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17:47<CIA-1>OpenTTD: glx * r14664 /branches/noai/bin/ai/regression/run.sh: [NoAI] -Fix: disable game_start.scr script when running regression
17:50<TrueBrain>laalla
17:50<TrueBrain>damn .. I even mistype that :(
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18:11<SmatZ>hmm I fell asleep, again... I should really be sleeping at night, not at this time :-x
18:12<TrueBrain>hahahaha
18:12<TrueBrain>poor SmatZ
18:12<TrueBrain>go to bed :)
18:12<SmatZ>I hope to go soon, thanks TrueBrain :)
18:13<TrueBrain>I try to do some math at this hour
18:13<TrueBrain>I kind of fail :p
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18:18<Eddi|zuHause2>if this is not night... what is it then?
18:18-!-Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause
18:18<TrueBrain>left!
18:18<thingwath>late evening?
18:19<TrueBrain>oh .. I read 'right'
18:19<TrueBrain>lol
18:19<Eddi|zuHause>maybe you should sleep, too ;)
18:20<Eddi|zuHause>or get glasses :p
18:20<TrueBrain>yes :p
18:20<TrueBrain>but I ordered food
18:20<TrueBrain>an other 40 minutes ;)
18:20<thingwath>or choose better font
18:20-!-TinoM| [~Tino@i59F5F5F6.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
18:21<@Rubidium>or replace your text lexer/parser with a less greedy one ;)
18:21<TrueBrain>acceptable
18:23<thingwath>but most likely also a slower one
18:24<TrueBrain>on the positive side, I just managed to generate a grid of 6000x6000 in a reasonable amount of time
18:24<Andel>random Q: anyone here know of a reasonable usa proxy?
18:25<TrueBrain>get a small VPS as some random provider :)
18:25<TrueBrain>as = at
18:25*Rubidium wonders why one would want a USA proxy
18:25<Eddi|zuHause>what's on with you? in the last two days you revealed more information about mapgen than in the last 2 years togethe
18:25<Eddi|zuHause>r
18:25<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: not really, 2 years ago I had images :)
18:26<Andel>a small vps?
18:26<Andel>and Rubidium: to watch us tv
18:26<TrueBrain>lylix.net or so
18:26<Eddi|zuHause>mh... i don't remember having seen those
18:26<TrueBrain>then you can set up your own proxy
18:26<Andel>good point
18:26<TrueBrain>there were like 102 in the end :)
18:26<@Rubidium>TrueBrain: but there still are images ;)
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18:27<TrueBrain>not really, they didn't move to leaseweb ;)
18:27<@Rubidium>(if you know where to look)
18:27<@Rubidium>e.g. http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=63338
18:27<TrueBrain>you need SSH access to view them now :)
18:28<TrueBrain>ah, like that ;)
18:28<@Rubidium>though TTDP has now introduced their own heightmap format
18:28<TrueBrain>damn, it still looks amazing :)
18:28<TrueBrain>just clearly not-corrected for latitude problems
18:29<@Rubidium>there'll always be problems, unless OpenTTD becomes true 3D
18:29<TrueBrain>... let me guess ... not equal to ours?
18:29<@Rubidium>TrueBrain: ofcourse not
18:29<@Rubidium>though a reasonable simple format
18:29<TrueBrain>there are problems, and clear errors :) The last image you pasted, is scaled wrongly on the x-scale
18:30<TrueBrain>why not just PNG?
18:30<TrueBrain>or BMP?
18:30<TrueBrain>(like we do)
18:30<@Rubidium>because PNG/BMP is hard when you can just read the data directly
18:30<TrueBrain>but okay, I want to extend the heighmap format anyway, to allow towns, roads, rivers, ..
18:30<@Rubidium>i.e. they have a 65536 bytes file with heights
18:31<TrueBrain>heheheh
18:31<@Rubidium>TrueBrain: I'd suggest PNG with layers for that
18:31<TrueBrain>BMP at 4 bit would do the same, minus the header .. ;)
18:32<TrueBrain>Rubidium: I would suggest that myself too :)
18:32<TrueBrain>as PNG allows any amount of layers :)
18:32<@Rubidium>and possibly the 'text' extension for town location data
18:33<TrueBrain>I rather give the tiles which should become a town ;)
18:33<TrueBrain>of course some auxilary data for the name of the towns ;)
18:34<TrueBrain>but .. baby steps first :)
18:34<Eddi|zuHause>easiest would be a 32 bit value for the name generator
18:34<TrueBrain>currently it just loads height-info from the SRTM :p
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18:34<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: no, you want custom names
18:34<TrueBrain>like: London
18:34<Eddi|zuHause>then provide an accompanying town name grf :p
18:35<TrueBrain>why? :)
18:35<Eddi|zuHause>encode the grf into the png :p
18:36<TrueBrain>hehe
18:36<TrueBrain>okay ... I need to see if the data in my buffer is anything real .. I need PNG output :)
18:37<TrueBrain>'gd' or 'libpng' .. hmm ..
18:38<@Rubidium>sdl!
18:39<TrueBrain>I personally rather die
18:39<TrueBrain>but that is just my person opinion :)
18:39<Eddi|zuHause>leather whip...
18:39<TrueBrain>(libSDL is such a pain in the ass for a library ... )
18:39<@Rubidium>oh bah... sdl only does loading
18:39<@Rubidium>how useless
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18:44<TrueBrain>idiotic libpng, still using longjmp :(
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18:55<TrueBrain>writing the image takes the longest .. pff ..
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18:55<TrueBrain>wow .. the result is an ar on its own ..
18:56<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image001.png
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18:59<SmatZ>nice, is that a fractal?
19:00<TrueBrain>no, a heightmap of some random coordinates
19:00<@Rubidium>looks like a mountain range near a desert with a river in it
19:00<TrueBrain>5 degrees by 5 degrees
19:00<TrueBrain>600 pixels per degree resolution (I can generate one at 1200 px/dg, but that gives an even bigger image :p)
19:01<SmatZ>interesting :) except for that line ~600 pixels from the bottom
19:01<@Rubidium>do you know the random coordinates of that image?
19:01<TrueBrain>yeah, some images are concatted wrong on eachother
19:01<TrueBrain>this image is part of 4 basefiles
19:02<TrueBrain>11N, 11E
19:02<TrueBrain>(exactly 11 btw)
19:03<TrueBrain>the colours btw overflow
19:03<TrueBrain>(image is 8bit, source is 16bit :p)
19:03<SmatZ>:)
19:04<SmatZ>+ * be triggered, so rereplace the signals and make the debugger userful. */
19:04<SmatZ>userful :)
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19:07<TrueBrain>new world, don't you love it? :)
19:07<TrueBrain>rereplace .. ;)
19:08<Eddi|zuHause>looks like a fractal to me...
19:08<@Rubidium>SmatZ: you're late with that comment
19:09<@Rubidium>#define userful "useful for the user using it"
19:10<TrueBrain>I have no idea where the distortion comes from ..
19:10<TrueBrain>how annoying
19:11<TrueBrain>it looks like the obttom 600px are reverted in the x-axis ..
19:11<TrueBrain>no idea how that can happen ..
19:11<SmatZ>:-)
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19:43<TrueBrain>now that was nice food :)
19:43<TrueBrain>expensive
19:43<TrueBrain>but nice :)
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19:44<TrueBrain>Rubidium: found of what region the image is?
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20:13<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image002.png <- at least the image is correct now ;)
20:14<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image003.png <- picture of the world :p (WARNING: IT IS BIG!)
20:16<+glx>there are missing data :)
20:16<TrueBrain>yup
20:17<+glx>and it's not world :)
20:18<TrueBrain>no, it is not :)
20:18<TrueBrain>bigger became slightly too large in PNG :p
20:18<+glx>but indeed it's big
20:18<TrueBrain>any more comments? :p
20:20<SmatZ>TrueBrain: where do you fetch the data?
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20:21<TrueBrain>SmatZ: SRTM
20:21<TrueBrain>Version 4
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20:21<TrueBrain>to be exact
20:21<SmatZ>aha aha nice :)
20:25<De_Ghosty>wow
20:25<De_Ghosty>takes forever to load
20:26<De_Ghosty>height map?
20:26<TrueBrain>SmatZ: so a 90m scan of the earth ..
20:26<TrueBrain>well, 90m on the equator
20:26<TrueBrain>55m on 60N
20:26<TrueBrain>better to say: 1200 px/dg
20:27<Sacro>glx: is
20:27<De_Ghosty>ok
20:27<De_Ghosty>it's a boring pic
20:28<+glx>Sacro: what?
20:28<TrueBrain>for now, yes
20:28<Sacro>glx: there is missing data
20:28<Sacro>data is plural
20:29<TrueBrain>omg ... you want a kick ban or something?
20:29<SmatZ>!logs
20:29<+glx>Sacro: plural so "are"
20:29<Sacro>TrueBrain: who me?
20:29<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image004.png <- pretty!
20:29<Sacro>wtf, my mind is dead D:
20:29*Sacro goes to bed
20:30<TrueBrain>sounds like a plan
20:30<+glx>looks better
20:30<TrueBrain>generating the biggest possible map ... the whole earth
20:30<TrueBrain>@calc 2048 * 34.6 / 100
20:30<@DorpsGek>TrueBrain: 708.608
20:31<TrueBrain>710 MiB of memory
20:31<TrueBrain>but wow :o
20:31<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image005.png <- BIG!
20:31<TrueBrain>but ... pretty :o
20:31<+glx>I clicked too early it seems
20:32<TrueBrain>btw, black is no data, any other color is detected height .. which can be below sealevel :)
20:35<TrueBrain>I only really wonder why there are squares of different colours
20:35<+glx>hmm ok it's too big for firefox
20:36<TrueBrain>use a real image viewer
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20:39<TrueBrain>I guess I should create more scaled down data-files, decreases the size of those images :p
20:39<TrueBrain>but .. I doubt this would even make a good heightmap :)
20:40<TrueBrain>even = ever
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20:42<+glx>even gimp has problems to handle it (slow reaction)
20:43<TrueBrain>libpng is SLOW with valgrind attached ..
20:43<TrueBrain>glx: what are the dimensions of the image? :p
20:45<TrueBrain>uploaded a new, slightly corrected, image of 005
20:45<+glx>26850*9000
20:45<TrueBrain>removes most of the weird squares
20:45<TrueBrain>now just a few are left ..
20:45<TrueBrain>takes 19 sec to generate the image :p
20:46<TrueBrain>hahahaha :)
20:47<SmatZ>:)
20:48<TrueBrain>http://devs.openttd.org/~truebrain/mapgen/image006.png
20:48<TrueBrain>the highest detail
20:49<Tefad>neat
20:51<TrueBrain>now it is time for some correction algorithms
20:51<TrueBrain>well, first I need to find my bed I guess
20:56<TrueBrain>those weird squares are images that are wrongly converted
20:56<TrueBrain>more exact: they contain 2 or 3 pixels with real data, the rest is garbage :p
21:04<TrueBrain>hmm .. somewhere a conversion went wrong .. oh well
21:04<TrueBrain>I just press: 'sh scripts/hmp.sh'
21:04<TrueBrain>which takes 3 hours
21:04<TrueBrain>and go to bed
21:04<TrueBrain>night all!
21:07<SmatZ>good night TrueBrain
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---Logclosed Tue Dec 09 00:00:12 2008