Back to Home / #openttd / 2009 / 01 / Prev Day | Next Day
#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-01-31

---Logopened Sat Jan 31 00:00:38 2009
00:12-!-DaleStan is now known as Guest35
00:12-!-DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
00:16-!-Guest35 [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:33-!-Vish [~vishalagr@d122-105-101-172.mas12.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
00:33<Vish:#openttd>hi
00:33<Vish:#openttd>is there someone who can help me
00:33<Aali:#openttd>not unless you tell us what the problem is
00:34<Vish:#openttd>well i got openttd and it was working fine..... i was just fiddling with the resolutions and other settings.....
00:35<Vish:#openttd>so i must have maybe chosen a lower resolution or something so now the program is runnign witht the music and everything bu ti can see nothing
00:35<Vish:#openttd>no mouse pointer or anything....the screen is grey
00:36<Vish:#openttd>i uninstalled the program and reloaded it again but the same proble
00:36<Aali:#openttd>are you on windows?
00:36<Vish:#openttd>yeah on vista
00:36<Aali:#openttd>the config file is stored in your My Documents folder
00:37<Aali:#openttd>if you delete it, it should work again
00:37<Vish:#openttd>where would that be ?
00:37<Aali:#openttd>the My Documents folder or the config file?
00:38<Vish:#openttd>both
00:38<Vish:#openttd>oh man ... u are a genius... it works
00:39<Aali:#openttd>you found it?
00:39<Vish:#openttd>i found it and deleted openttd in my docs and now the program works
00:39<Vish:#openttd>thanks a lot
00:39<Vish:#openttd>i did
00:39<Aali:#openttd>right :)
00:39<Vish:#openttd>thank you so much bro
00:40-!-Vish [~vishalagr@d122-105-101-172.mas12.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has left #openttd []
01:22-!-Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd
02:12*dihedral:#openttd has traffic spare....
02:12<dihedral:#openttd>like a few TB
02:12<dihedral:#openttd>:-D
02:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>torrents were invented for such problems
02:36-!-grahamk [~graham@c-71-230-12-156.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
02:37<grahamk:#openttd>hello
02:39<grahamk:#openttd>I was trying to install openTTD through the package manager in ubuntu but received an error message telling me that I needed the original TTD game files. Is this the case? and if so how would I obtain the files? I dont think TTD has been produced for quite some time
02:39<Aali:#openttd>well, technically, you can use OpenGFX
02:39<Aali:#openttd>but its not finished
02:40<Aali:#openttd>so you're better off with the original graphics
02:40<grahamk:#openttd>is there anywhere i can get them?
02:40<Aali:#openttd>and well, if you look for them, you'll find them
02:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>if you build it, he will come
02:44<grahamk:#openttd>hmmm... i think I might have found them :)
02:50-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1E765.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
02:51-!-TinoM [~Tino@i59F5CE06.versanet.de] has joined #openttd
02:53<doc:#openttd>I'm trying to set up suspended monorail. (to replace tram) but it always comes up as disabled. Anyone got any idea why?
02:53<dihedral:#openttd>is there no such info in ... say ... /usr/share/docs/openttd?
02:54-!-angelo [~angelo@ppp-94-65-248-156.home.otenet.gr] has joined #openttd
02:56<dihedral:#openttd>doc: are you missing some grf's?
02:56<doc:#openttd>dihedral: I don't think I should be. I used the download online content interface
02:57<dihedral:#openttd>well, there surely is info in the forums or on the grf's webpage?
02:58-!-angelo [~angelo@ppp-94-65-248-156.home.otenet.gr] has quit []
03:00<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>suspended monorail is a tram replacement, sure you looked in the right place, and have the appropriate vehicles?
03:02<doc:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: I used the 'check online content' part of the initial openttd menu
03:02<doc:#openttd>so if it's wrong, it's wrong there
03:02<doc:#openttd>and the only thing that's related is http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=38413&sid=996a3ef77b70e0c5b4440df9884bae4d&start=20 which hasn't been updated since may 2007
03:03<doc:#openttd>same error
03:04<dihedral:#openttd>doc: it does not mean that all required dependencies are in the online content!
03:05<dihedral:#openttd>grfs can have dependencies to other grfs and some might come from different authors
03:05<doc:#openttd>and there's no dependency setup even for the ones you can download?
03:05<dihedral:#openttd>yes, but if the one author does not upload his stuff, then that's missing, and one cannot define a dependency to missing grfs
03:06<dihedral:#openttd>whats the name of the grf?
03:06<doc:#openttd>susmon.grf
03:06<dihedral:#openttd>in bananas!!!!
03:07<doc:#openttd>?
03:07<dihedral:#openttd>bananas.opnettd.org
03:07<dihedral:#openttd>click on 'NewGRFs'
03:08<doc:#openttd>Urban Suspended Monorail
03:09-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@216-165-16-48.DYNAPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
03:09<dihedral:#openttd>do you have any other tram grfs loaded? and what year is it?
03:10<doc:#openttd>I've unloaded them, and I've tried everything from 1990 to 2200
03:10<doc:#openttd>and some in between
03:13<dihedral:#openttd>and the grf is loaded for your game
03:14<doc:#openttd>loaded but disabled
03:14-!-grahamk [~graham@c-71-230-12-156.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
03:15<dihedral:#openttd>and it sais why it's disabled
03:15<dihedral:#openttd>why dont you say that right away?
03:16<dihedral:#openttd>Fatal:Unexpected sprite.
03:17<dihedral:#openttd>perhaps you want to post that to the forum thread
03:17<doc:#openttd>I said I was getting the same error as the post
03:18<dihedral:#openttd>so?
03:18<dihedral:#openttd>just bump it, say that you are also getting it
03:19<doc:#openttd>so giving me hassle for not saying it is unfair
03:19<dihedral:#openttd>thought that it would had been fixed before it got uploaded to the bananas thingy
03:26<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, can you hide "Urban Suspended Monorail" from bananas? it's got an error and gets disabled (Fatal: Unexpected sprite.)
03:49-!-xerxesda1hat [~tom@118-93-246-106.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
03:52-!-xerxesdaphat [~tom@118-92-216-8.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #openttd
04:08-!-TinoDid is now known as TinoDidriksen
04:13<planetmaker:#openttd>moin
04:13<planetmaker:#openttd>dihedral: if it stays the author has more incentive to fix it :P
04:14<dihedral:#openttd>if it's broken it should not be downloadable!
04:14<planetmaker:#openttd>why?
04:14<dihedral:#openttd>because it's broken?
04:15<@petern:#openttd>heheh
04:15<dihedral:#openttd>and rises user questions
04:15<@petern:#openttd> 118 * 91,. 0C "Sprites for autoroad GUI; no way "
04:15<@petern:#openttd>,... "to code them yet, included for potential "
04:15<@petern:#openttd>,... "future versions" 00
04:15<@petern:#openttd> 119 sprites/susmon.pcx 258 792 09 13 20 0 4
04:15<planetmaker:#openttd>dihedral: why should broken things not be available? There might be people who want to fix it...
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>pm: via the content downloader?
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>seriously - that is really silly!
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>who does that?
04:16<planetmaker:#openttd>so is the proposal to play newgrf correctness police
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>pm: the proposal is to avoid user confusion!
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>wtf
04:16<dihedral:#openttd>c'mon
04:17<dihedral:#openttd>what the point would it be to download an osx update if it made your system unstable?
04:17<planetmaker:#openttd>I don't like to think for other people. And I don't want others to try for me
04:17<dihedral:#openttd>my word!
04:18<dihedral:#openttd>users will ask questions if they can download content via that feature and it does not work
04:18<planetmaker:#openttd>dihedral: exactly. So why stop people from doing nonsense, if they like
04:18<dihedral:#openttd>to avoid unnessesary stuff like that, you can hide them until they are fixed
04:18<dihedral:#openttd>besides, bananas is well watched anyway
04:18<planetmaker:#openttd>yes. they will. It's the grf author who needs to be directed to.
04:18<dihedral:#openttd>both
04:18<dihedral:#openttd>those who manage bananas and the author
04:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>planetmaker: the aim is to reduce "support" effort
04:19<dihedral:#openttd>but those who download from bananas will most likely assume things they get from there work
04:19<planetmaker:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: I understand that :)
04:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and repeatedly telling "it is broken, do not use" is extremely high and useless effort
04:19<planetmaker:#openttd>And I see the point in that.
04:19<planetmaker:#openttd>And still :)
04:19<dihedral:#openttd>then there is no 'and still'
04:19<dihedral:#openttd>they can fix it by getting it from the forums
04:20<dihedral:#openttd>those really interested in working on grf's dont get them from bananas
04:20<dihedral:#openttd>they just go 'bananas' trying to make the grf's :-D
04:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>so contact the author directly instead of getting questions why it's missing from bananas
04:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>after all... we don't guarantee anything works
04:21<dihedral:#openttd>right
04:22<dihedral:#openttd>so you are saying you dont maintain bananas?
04:22<@Rubidium:#openttd>we're not going to fix everything that's broken and put up there
04:22<dihedral:#openttd>i did never say 'fix'
04:22<dihedral:#openttd>i said 'hide' so that others cannot download it
04:22<@Rubidium:#openttd>removing it doesn't fix anything
04:23<dihedral:#openttd>(unless they know the id...)
04:23<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, it avoids
04:23<@Rubidium:#openttd>and that's hard...
04:23<dihedral:#openttd>unnessesary questions
04:23<@Rubidium:#openttd>heh, I've got this savegame and downloaded X and X doesn't work
04:23<dihedral:#openttd>happens less often
04:24<dihedral:#openttd>shame - i thought you were more interested in maintaining the downloadable content of bananas
04:25<dihedral:#openttd>maintain in a way that would cause less problems
04:25<@Rubidium:#openttd>"cause less trouble" means fixing bugs ourselves
04:26<@Rubidium:#openttd>hmm.. maybe we should remove opengfx and ecs too
04:26<@Rubidium:#openttd>those got bugs too
04:26<dihedral:#openttd>that is not what i mean and you know that
04:26<planetmaker:#openttd>dih certainly is right that you could just disable broken content.
04:26<planetmaker:#openttd>but still, I think, it's rather a grf author's responsibility
04:26<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, bugs != gets disabled on load
04:26<planetmaker:#openttd>and maybe an annual or bi-annual check
04:27<@petern:#openttd>hey
04:27<@Rubidium:#openttd>I could disable broken stuff, but what is buggy and what isn't?
04:27<@petern:#openttd>at least disabled on load fairly obviously won't cause game problems
04:27<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, Fatal: Unexpected sprite. and then being disabled - i consider that fairly useless, dont you?
04:27<@petern:#openttd>say if LV4 was on there, would we have to disable it because of graphical clitches in tunnels?
04:28<@petern:#openttd>bananas is about providing content, not providing working content :D
04:28<dihedral:#openttd>petern: it does not rise user support does it now
04:28<@petern:#openttd>raise
04:28<dihedral:#openttd>thanks
04:34-!-el_en [~lanurmi@dyn-xdsl-83-150-113-243.nebulazone.fi] has joined #openttd
04:42<Tefad:#openttd>up to 11 players?
04:42<Tefad:#openttd>wtf 11
04:44<planetmaker:#openttd>up to 255
04:45<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not in the latest release
04:45<Tefad:#openttd>the number 11 seems arbitrary to me
04:45<planetmaker:#openttd>read the code, understand network packet sizes and you'll understand :)
04:46<planetmaker:#openttd>in short: 11 players * player_info_size <= max_network_packet_size
04:46<planetmaker:#openttd>or something along those lines
04:51<Tefad:#openttd>yes but now it's 255?
04:52<el_en:#openttd>good morning, hobbits
04:54-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host114-234-dynamic.21-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
04:54<Wolf01:#openttd>hello
04:56<planetmaker:#openttd>@calc 42*3.1415
04:56<@DorpsGek:#openttd>planetmaker: 131.943
04:57<planetmaker:#openttd>I can make you a special edition with 131 max, Tefad :P
05:04<Tefad:#openttd>eh, try (exp(ln(2)*5)+exp(ln(2)*3)+2)*ln(-1)/sqrt(-1) instead. thanks.
05:05<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i don't see why it wouldn't do that, except for the periodicity(?) of complex ln
05:06<Tefad:#openttd>the answer to that isn't integral, but it is real
05:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes. it is common knowledge that ln(-1) can be calculated via the "world formula": e^(i*pi)+1=0
05:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>so the i's reduce themselves
05:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but still, ln(-1) is not one single number, but infinitely many
05:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>similarly, sqrt(-1) is two numbers
05:08<Tefad:#openttd>infintely many in the frequency domain but of zero magnitude
05:08<Tefad:#openttd>eh?
05:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i^2 = -1, (-i)^2 = -1, so sqrt(-1) = {i, -i}
05:09<Tefad:#openttd>depends on what i mean by sqrt()
05:09<@petern:#openttd>just google it ;)
05:09<Tefad:#openttd>petern has the answer.
05:10<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>similarly, e^(2*pi*i)=1, so ln(-1) = {(2*k+1)*pi*i | k \in |Z}
05:11<Tefad:#openttd>if anyone is familiar with the Unix bc command they'll know its exponent function only takes integral values, however its e-exponential function e() takes floating point
05:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>so ln(-1)/sqrt(-1) = {(2*k+1)*pi | k \in |Z}
05:12<Tefad:#openttd>i learned to exploit this to get any power of any base i want via a ^ b = e(l(a)*b)
05:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that is basic maths...
05:12<Tefad:#openttd>yup.
05:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>for certain definitions of "basic" :p
05:12<Tefad:#openttd>but it'd been a while and i had no reference material so i dicked around until i found it
05:12<el_en:#openttd>Integerish Only!
05:13<Tefad:#openttd>belonging to the integral domain
05:13<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>nah... algebraic numbers are great fun ;)
05:14<Tefad:#openttd>
05:14<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then add e and pi as special constants, and you can express almost all relevant numbers
05:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and you are still in a countable subset of |C
05:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>(Algebraic numbers are those numbers who can be represented as a root of a polynomial expression)
05:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>as such, i is an algebraic number, because it is root of the polynomial expression x^2+1=0
05:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>e and pi are not algebraic numbers
05:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>they are called "transcendent"
05:19-!-Zahl [~Zahl@e180234023.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd
05:25-!-ccfreak2k [~ccfreak2k@ip-67-205-67-52.static.privatedns.com] has joined #openttd
05:28<Tefad:#openttd>transcendental functions
05:28<Tefad:#openttd>delicious functions..
05:35-!-Yeggstry [~mind@cpc2-rdng14-0-0-cust631.winn.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd
06:07<dihedral:#openttd>Tefad, client names used to be in one of the UDP packets
06:07<dihedral:#openttd>more than 11 clients would exceed packet size
06:07<dihedral:#openttd>this part of the udp packet has been removed in the mean time
06:08<dihedral:#openttd>remember wwottdgd events?
06:08<dihedral:#openttd>we would do 55 clients, but it meant that we had to disable that part in the udp code
06:08<dihedral:#openttd>else the game crashed - which was the painful experience for wwottdgd/1
06:22-!-Yeggstry is now known as Yeggs-away
06:26-!-PhoenixtheII [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
06:27-!-SHRIKEE [~shrikee@84-105-52-118.cable.quicknet.nl] has joined #openttd
06:28-!-fawlty [angelo@ppp68-184.adsl.forthnet.gr] has quit []
06:48-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
07:00-!-davis- [~iloveme@p5B28C971.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
07:13-!-Yeggs-away is now known as Yeggstry
07:28-!-Roest [~schurade@p54B9C5AC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
07:30-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ffe4a.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
07:31-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
07:32-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@161-18-80-78.strcechy.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has joined #openttd
07:32-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
07:32<Noldo:#openttd>dihedral: you got that patch through then?
07:32<dihedral:#openttd>which one?
07:32<dihedral:#openttd>hae?
07:32<Noldo:#openttd>the more clients thing
07:33<dihedral:#openttd>more clients is not by me
07:33<dihedral:#openttd>i tried had issues
07:33<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium did it
07:33-!-Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:35-!-smeding [~smeding@5354BE76.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
07:36-!-davis_ [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
07:39<el_en:#openttd>http://www.spotify.com/blog/archives/2009/01/28/some-important-changes-to-the-spotify-music-catalogue/
07:43-!-davis- [~iloveme@p5B28C971.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:48<Gekz:#openttd>spotify doesnt even WORK in Australia
07:48<Gekz:#openttd>so fuck that.
07:49<el_en:#openttd>well of course it doesn't, 'cause you're using it upside-down.
07:50<Gekz:#openttd>hilarious.
07:51<dihedral:#openttd>hihihi
07:53<Gekz:#openttd>Hey hey hey
08:03-!-Roest [~schurade@p54B9C5AC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
08:04-!-Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
08:37-!-Roest [~schurade@p54B9C5AC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
08:39-!-NukeBuster [~wouter@80.101.115.82] has joined #openttd
08:41-!-KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-60-139.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
08:42-!-SHRIKEE [~shrikee@84-105-52-118.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Quit: SHRIKEE]
08:43-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-228-38.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
08:44-!-Elukka [~elukka.el@bb-89-166-45-150.dsl.phnet.fi] has joined #openttd
08:44<Elukka:#openttd>ok, so, scenarios
08:44<Elukka:#openttd>to ensure compatibility with other versions (future trunk, really), what should i make them with?
08:45<Elukka:#openttd>the latest nightly, the stable version?
08:45<Aali:#openttd>newer versions always load older savegames
08:45<Aali:#openttd>older versions newer load newer savegames
08:46<Aali:#openttd>*never
08:46<@Rubidium:#openttd>Aali: both are wrong
08:46<Aali:#openttd>sure, whatever
08:46<@Rubidium:#openttd>newer stables load older stables
08:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>that's all
08:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>the rest is just wishfull thinking; yes most nightlies load previous nightlies, but not always
08:47<Aali:#openttd>that nay be all you can be sure of
08:47<Aali:#openttd>*may
08:49<Elukka:#openttd>so i should make them with the newest stable+
08:49<Elukka:#openttd>?*
08:50<frosch123:#openttd>make a heightmap :p
08:51<Elukka:#openttd>heightmap doesnt contain the rivers, lakes have to be fixed a lot, not to even mention cities, roads and industries
08:54-!-Rexxars [~rexxars@62.113.132.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it's really an oversight that heightmaps were not prepared for non-height information coded into the palette
08:55<@petern:#openttd>if you wanted to use the 'freeform edges' feature you'd need to use a nightly
08:55<@petern:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, write a patch!
08:56<dihedral:#openttd>hehehe
08:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>or, an .ini file with stuff like town locations
08:56<Elukka:#openttd>a version-proof format for scenarios would be really cool...
08:57<dihedral:#openttd>...
08:57<@Rubidium:#openttd>Elukka: use the TTD scenari editor
08:57<@petern:#openttd>it can't be version proof
08:57<Elukka:#openttd>ok, reasonably version proof
08:57<@petern:#openttd>it is
08:58<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>is there an "export as heightmap" functionality in the scenario editor?
08:59<dihedral:#openttd>nope
08:59<@petern:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, write a patch!
08:59<Elukka:#openttd>i made a scenario yesterday, but because i made it with the cargodest branch i cant play it on any other version
08:59<Elukka:#openttd>even though cargodest doesnt do anything regarding scenarios
08:59-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-228-38.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:00<@Rubidium:#openttd>Elukka: it does
09:00<Elukka:#openttd>it does?
09:00<@Rubidium:#openttd>settings are part of the scenario
09:00<@Rubidium:#openttd>and thus are the cargodest related settings
09:00<Elukka:#openttd>why?
09:00<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>an alternate storage system was also discussed since the beginning of time...
09:00<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>(for settings)
09:01<Aali:#openttd>a "scenario" is really just a savegame
09:01<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>mainly, it would need to save (name,value) pairs
09:02<Elukka:#openttd>aali, i know
09:02<Elukka:#openttd>i just dont really understand why
09:02<dihedral:#openttd>you never will
09:02<@Rubidium:#openttd>2 save formats == twice the work
09:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>if that were implemented, many savegame bumps (especially of inofficial patches) could be avoided
09:03-!-Rexxars [~rexxars@62.113.132.255] has joined #openttd
09:03<Aali:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: what about when a setting changes name?
09:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Aali: you are screwed
09:03<Elukka:#openttd>i can appreciat it would be more work
09:03<Elukka:#openttd>man, i suck at typing today
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>no... just "you suck"
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>:-P
09:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Aali: if you want to introduce a conversion function, it will require a version bump
09:04<Aali:#openttd>so, basically you use the same system, just separate settings from the actual savegame?
09:05<Elukka:#openttd>it seems weird to save settings of patches in the scenario, because they dont really have anything to do with it
09:05<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no... you are reading stuff into it...
09:05<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: almost all settings that get added to the savegame change the savegame format slightly too, i.e. adding stuff that it didn't know about before. So loading that savegame in an older version must not be done, so the savegame bump doesn't matter anyways
09:05<dihedral:#openttd>Elukka, scenario = save game
09:05<Elukka:#openttd>i know this
09:05<dihedral:#openttd>now, assume you have a save game, where you alloed 90 degree turnes and you built according to that
09:05<@petern:#openttd>please bear in mind it is possible to have a scenario that starts with competitors already set up... stations, vehicles, etc...
09:05<@petern:#openttd>(i think, heh)
09:06<Elukka:#openttd>thing is, why is it the same thing?
09:06<dihedral:#openttd>and then you load that save game with previously having set 90 degre turns forbidden
09:06<Elukka:#openttd>there are no 90 degree turns or cargodest things in the scenario, they only apply when you start to play
09:06<dihedral:#openttd>no
09:06<Elukka:#openttd>i understand if you use something like the map edges patch
09:06<dihedral:#openttd>they apply to the save game
09:07<dihedral:#openttd>that in fact now only applies to map generation iirc
09:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but there is an economy, even though there are no industries yet. the available cargos and cargo payment rates and other stuff have already been set up
09:07<Aali:#openttd>Elukka: a separate scenario format is alot of work, and no-one wants to do it, so unless you're going to write a patch and maintain it forever and ever you'll just have to learn to live with it :P
09:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>this stuff, that generally happens at world generation, must be stored in the scenario
09:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no matter if you actually used it or not
09:10<@petern:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: "varaction2 support for bridges"
09:10<@petern:#openttd>should i rumble through my 'lost patches' directory? :p
09:10<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>well... ;)
09:11-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-228-38.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
09:12<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, can authors disable their own grf's at bananas?
09:12<dihedral:#openttd>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=761321#p761321
09:13<@Rubidium:#openttd>yes; just set the works till version X correctly
09:13<@Rubidium:#openttd>effectively disables them to be shown from newer version of OpenTTD
09:14<Elukka:#openttd>so the reason is that its a lot of work
09:14<Elukka:#openttd>thats a sensible reason
09:17<Elukka:#openttd>i might try another scenario, this time of just the great lakes
09:17<Elukka:#openttd>however, heightmaps
09:17<Elukka:#openttd>the srtm plugin in the guide doesnt work, so i have no idea where to get one
09:17-!-frederyk [~frank@brln-4dba7bab.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
09:17<dihedral:#openttd>can you not start a chat with /dev/null?
09:18<Elukka:#openttd>i'm wondering whether it's just me or if the service doesnt exist anymore
09:18-!-frederyk [~frank@brln-4dba7bab.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit []
09:19<dihedral:#openttd>it's you
09:19<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>an rtfm plugin? where can i get one of those?
09:19<dihedral:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, requirest tracker?
09:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: next to the stfu plugin?
09:20<dihedral:#openttd>http://bestpractical.com/rtfm/
09:21<Elukka:#openttd>dihedral, have you tried it?
09:22<dihedral:#openttd>worcester college of oxford university used to use it, i dont know if they still do
09:22<frosch123:#openttd>hmm, if something is buggy and inconsistent in ottd, and it is even more buggy and inconsistent in ttdp, should I then just set up my own interpretation of the newgrf specs...
09:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>dihedral: honestly, that reads like an april's fools version :p
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>hehe, yes
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>but it's a serious thing
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>not so nice to work with
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>not so nice to set up
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>rt was a real pain up my fuzzy rear end
09:23<dihedral:#openttd>rtfm was not as simple as i had assumed either
09:24<@petern:#openttd>frosch123: more inconsistent in ttdp?
09:24<frosch123:#openttd>yes, and more buggy
09:25<Elukka:#openttd>...am i the only one here who deals with heightmaps?
09:25<@petern:#openttd>are you on the engine id thing still?
09:25<@petern:#openttd>possibly, Elukka, i've never loaded one
09:26<frosch123:#openttd>no, now I am on CB15, CB36 'capacity', 'use first refittable cargo as default cargo' and traditional capacity mulitpliers for refitting when not using cb15
09:26<@petern:#openttd>ah
09:26<frosch123:#openttd>wrt. the engine id thingie, I guess it is all fine, the change should be documented for var60, and well varc6 was never documented
09:27<dihedral:#openttd>Elukka, why dont you just open threads in the forums
09:27<Elukka:#openttd>i feel worse pestering the forums than irc for some reason :P
09:27<Elukka:#openttd>i was meaning to post
09:28<dihedral:#openttd>dont you have a poisonous reptile you could play with?
09:28<frosch123:#openttd>they should use livery refit instead of var c6 if they want reliable behaviour :p
09:28<Elukka:#openttd>nah, it's not poisonous and it's sleeping
09:28<Elukka:#openttd>(i do have a reptile)
09:28<dihedral:#openttd>then talk to that thing instead!
09:29<Elukka:#openttd>i cant interrupt his sleep!
09:29-!-frederyk [~frank@brln-4dba7bab.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
09:29-!-glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd
09:29-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
09:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>that sounds really improbably
09:30-!-frederyk [~frank@brln-4dba7bab.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit []
09:30<@Rubidium:#openttd>s/y$/e/
09:30-!-TinoM [~Tino@i59F5CE06.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:31-!-TinoM [~Tino@i59F5CE06.versanet.de] has joined #openttd
09:31<@Rubidium:#openttd>putting it on a flat surface and hitting it with a frying pan should interrupt its sleep
09:31<Gekz:#openttd>Rubidium: bastard.
09:31<Gekz:#openttd>lol
09:32<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, i'd rather but Elukka on a flat surface and hit him with a frying pan
09:32<Elukka:#openttd>that wouldn't be very nice
09:32<dihedral:#openttd>none of my last 10 lines were very nice
09:33<dihedral:#openttd>have you piked up on that yet
09:33<dihedral:#openttd>ok 4 lines
09:33<dihedral:#openttd>whatever
09:33<Elukka:#openttd>http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/what.jpg?t=1233412432
09:34<Elukka:#openttd>fear, for i will send this after you
09:34<Gekz:#openttd>aww thats cute
09:34<Roest:#openttd>cool
09:34<Gekz:#openttd>iguana?
09:34-!-Zahl [~Zahl@e180234023.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:35-!-Zahl [~Zahl@e180234023.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd
09:35<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i thought frying pans are for handling orcs?
09:35<Elukka:#openttd>green water dragon
09:35<Elukka:#openttd>smaller than iguanas
09:35<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>were?
09:35<Elukka:#openttd>he doesn't like water that much...
09:35<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>english grammar is difficult
09:35<Elukka:#openttd>try finnish
09:36<Gekz:#openttd>Elukka: that's cool
09:36<Gekz:#openttd>what country?
09:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>try cleaning out the terrarium, i don't think that boots and plastic bags are supposed to be in there
09:36<Elukka:#openttd>what country what
09:36<Gekz:#openttd>the lizard is from
09:36<Gekz:#openttd>and you
09:36<Elukka:#openttd>naturally they live in southeastern asia, although this one is from sweden and i'm from finland
09:36<@Rubidium:#openttd>Elukka: tihiaiti iisi jiuisiti aididiiinigi ii'si eivieiriyiwihieiriei... ;)
09:37<Gekz:#openttd>weird
09:37<Gekz:#openttd>anyway
09:37<Gekz:#openttd>sleepy time
09:37<Elukka:#openttd>nights
09:37<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you forgot the äääs ;)
09:37<Gekz:#openttd>haha
09:37<Elukka:#openttd>yay, umlauts
09:37<Gekz:#openttd>night
09:37<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>finnish is made up to 50% of ä ;)
09:37<Elukka:#openttd>lies
09:38<thingwath:#openttd>down with the vowels
09:40<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>hm... i was just googeling for "häufigkeit von buchstaben finnisch", and klicked on a link there, and google tells me that this site is probably infected by malware...
09:41<thingwath:#openttd>google went mad
09:41-!-FR^2 [~frquadrat@frquadrat.de] has joined #openttd
09:41<thingwath:#openttd>http://upload.nanana.name/files/paranoid-google.png
09:41<thingwath:#openttd>(ah, it's czech, sorry)
09:41<valhalla1w:#openttd>good to know its a global problem :P
09:44<De_Ghosty:#openttd>is it me
09:44<De_Ghosty:#openttd>or is google broke
09:44<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"i'm feeling lucky" today :p
09:44<Elukka:#openttd>google works
09:45<valhalla1w:#openttd>its just that the links are broken :P
09:45<De_Ghosty:#openttd>maybe it's the server cluster i'm conencting to
09:45<thingwath:#openttd>only it has finally realised how dangerous the internet is.
09:45<Roest:#openttd>Results 1 - 10 of 33.100.000 for is google broke
09:45<De_Ghosty:#openttd>o
09:45<De_Ghosty:#openttd>so it's not me
09:45<Elukka:#openttd>huh
09:45<Elukka:#openttd>it says everything has malware
09:45<Elukka:#openttd>including google :D
09:46<De_Ghosty:#openttd>that's what u get for worknig with ms
09:46<De_Ghosty:#openttd>it became goo-ista
09:49-!-SHRIKEE [~shrikee@84-105-52-118.cable.quicknet.nl] has joined #openttd
09:49-!-davis_ [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:49-!-davis- [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
09:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>anyway, i can't find statistics for finnish... anyway, more than every 6th letter in german is "e" (english: every 8th)
09:52<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and every 2500th letter is a "y" (english: every 50th)
09:53<thingwath:#openttd>there had to be some reason for the qwertz nonsense
09:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>less common than the "y" are only "x" and "q"
09:54<@Rubidium:#openttd>even looks like that Google's malware diagnostics/faq servers are in denial
09:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yeah, i needed many tries before getting an actual page
10:00-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd
10:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>hm.. i'm pretty sure i have seen a statistics over the average word length, but i can't find it
10:09-!-Zr40 [~Zr40@120-12-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has joined #openttd
10:11-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:11-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
10:14<Zr40:#openttd>what does it take to get patches into svn?
10:15-!-Zr40 [~Zr40@120-12-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
10:15<Aali:#openttd>patience
10:15-!-Zr40 [~Zr40@120-12-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has joined #openttd
10:15<Aali:#openttd>Zr40: a commit, usually
10:16-!-angelo [~angelo@ppp-94-65-240-222.home.otenet.gr] has joined #openttd
10:16<Zr40:#openttd>you have to have access for that though
10:16<Aali:#openttd>of course
10:20<Zr40:#openttd>well, I mean, what does it take for someone to commit a patch? :)
10:20<@petern:#openttd>firstly, a patch
10:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then, a bribe
10:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>a review, testing, documentation (not necessarily in this order)
10:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and another bribe
10:23<Zr40:#openttd>what kind of reviews, tests and documentation?
10:24<@petern:#openttd>or beer
10:25<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i'd file that under bribe ;)
10:26<frosch123:#openttd>Zr40: after it is 'well tested' it can procede like in http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2291 :p
10:29<Zr40:#openttd>well, I've got this nice patch that works nicely
10:29<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
10:29<Zr40:#openttd>not even a complicated change
10:30<Zr40:#openttd>but it's just sitting there in bugs.openttd.org since 2006
10:32<Zr40:#openttd>http://bugs.openttd.org/task/104
10:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>then it's probably not that trivial/uncontroversial as you say it is
10:33<Zr40:#openttd>didn't say it's trivial
10:33-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@ip-105.imafexbb.sk] has joined #openttd
10:33<Zr40:#openttd>it's just not as complex as, say, the one frosch123 linked :)
10:34-!-Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd
10:34-!-davis_ [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
10:38<Aali:#openttd>Zr40: no screenshot?
10:38<Zr40:#openttd>old screenshot: http://bugs.openttd.org/task/104/getfile/172/finances_screenshot.png
10:38<Zr40:#openttd>I'll take a fresh one
10:39<Aali:#openttd>better yet, just upload one to the FS task
10:39<Aali:#openttd>anyway, that thing makes the finances window (which is already quite large) into a monster window
10:40<@petern:#openttd>the patch is still as ugly as it ever was. sorry.
10:40<Aali:#openttd>and I don't really see the benefit, you can easily work that out in your head
10:40<Aali:#openttd>not to mention the calculations are wrong in that screenshot :P
10:41<Zr40:#openttd>that's been fixed years ago :)
10:41<Zr40:#openttd>care to elaborate, petern?
10:42-!-davis- [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:42<Aali:#openttd>huge block of code with mostly identical lines? yeah that is nasty
10:43-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: from __future__ import antigravity]
10:43<Zr40:#openttd>indeed. But I can't use a nice loop because the order doesn't match
10:43*petern:#openttd has a go at reworking it somewhat
10:43<Zr40:#openttd>wait a bit please
10:44<Zr40:#openttd>just found a bug caused by manually applying the old one
10:44<Zr40:#openttd>old patch*
10:47<Zr40:#openttd>ok, I've uploaded the new patch
10:53<Zr40:#openttd>well, Aali, about the size, I don't think that's avoidable
10:53-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d87030a.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
10:53-!-mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ
10:54<Zr40:#openttd>the font could perhaps be made smaller, but that would make it an unreadable mess of numbers imho
10:54<@Celestar:#openttd>edeca: you around? :)
10:54-!-j-b-r [~j-b-r@ip98-169-72-161.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #openttd
10:58-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
11:00<@Celestar:#openttd>meh
11:00<@Celestar:#openttd>vmware workstation segfaults
11:03<Elukka:#openttd>hmm... i ought to try a finnish trainset
11:04<Elukka:#openttd>i dont have any grf related skills, but those can be acquired
11:16-!-Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]]
11:16-!-Zahl_ [~Zahl@f051084166.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd
11:17-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d87030a.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:19-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d858e2a.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
11:19-!-mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ
11:20-!-j-b-r [~j-b-r@ip98-169-72-161.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]]
11:23-!-Brianetta [~brian@client-82-26-67-90.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has joined #openttd
11:23-!-Zahl [~Zahl@e180234023.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:23-!-Zahl_ is now known as Zahl
11:29-!-Zealotus [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:30<el_en:#openttd>hello señor Celestar
11:31<@Celestar:#openttd>oy
11:32<@Rubidium:#openttd>yo
11:32<el_en:#openttd> λo
11:32<@Rubidium:#openttd>did you know this game is usually played with o and x and in a 3x3 field? ;)
11:33<@Celestar:#openttd>(=
11:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>_|_|_
11:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>_|_|_
11:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>|
11:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>go ahead ;)
11:36<@Celestar:#openttd>MEH
11:36<@petern:#openttd>Zr40: http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/economy.patch
11:38<@petern:#openttd>Zr40: ^ loops are not the evil you make out in the fs comments...
11:38-!-Brianetta [~brian@client-82-26-67-90.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:41<@Celestar:#openttd>where's edeca when you need him?
11:42<@Rubidium:#openttd>there where you're when he needs you
11:42<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Edeka is 2 roads around the corner
11:43-!-Zealotus [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd
11:45<@Celestar:#openttd>:P
11:47-!-Brianetta [~brian@client-86-27-118-35.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has joined #openttd
11:47<dihedral:#openttd>Celestar, nice to see you here again, how are you?
11:48<@Celestar:#openttd>fine :D
11:49<dihedral:#openttd>nice
11:49<dihedral:#openttd>glad to hear
11:51<@Celestar:#openttd>and you?
11:53<dihedral:#openttd>well.. not so well :-P
11:53<dihedral:#openttd>am a wee bit sick
11:54-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
11:55<@Celestar:#openttd>eeks
11:55<@Celestar:#openttd>not good
11:56<@Celestar:#openttd>vmware workstation seems to be a pita
11:56<dihedral:#openttd>had a fever of 39.5 degrees centegrad yesterday
12:00-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd
12:06-!-Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd []
12:10-!-mode/#openttd [+v Celestar] by ChanServ
12:19<frosch123:#openttd>http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/doc/capacityadventure.txt <- mhwhahahar
12:20<@Celestar:#openttd>ROFLMAO!
12:20<@Celestar:#openttd>from the win7 download site:
12:20<@Celestar:#openttd>You'll need some technical skills, like knowing how to:
12:20<@Celestar:#openttd>Burn an ISO file to make an install DVD (A good example of what we mean by “technical”)
12:20<@Celestar:#openttd>VERY technical
12:22<frosch123:#openttd>"(A good example of what we mean by “technical”)" <- is that from the site, or did you added that?
12:24<thingwath:#openttd>isn't it technical skill? if not, then what? artistic? :)
12:24<SmatZ:#openttd>[18:21:14] <frosch123> http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/doc/capacityadventure.txt <- mhwhahahar <== impressive
12:25-!-smeding [~smeding@5354BE76.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:25<@Rubidium:#openttd>frosch123: sounds like a nice reduction of code (unification) to me
12:26<frosch123:#openttd>now I need food :)
12:26<@Rubidium:#openttd>as in cooking or going to the edeka (or competitor)
12:26<frosch123:#openttd>hehe, the most lucky part of it is, that it is so broken/inconsistent that we do not really have to stay compatible with anything before :)
12:28<frosch123:#openttd>as in taking some flour, eggs and milk and but the stuff in a pan (not all at once)
12:28<frosch123:#openttd>s/but/put/
12:29<@Celestar:#openttd>I _hate_ recovery CDs
12:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>sounds like making pancakes ;)
12:29<Forked:#openttd>recovery CDs only recover all the crapware they push on you when you buy a new pre-installed computer :)
12:29<@Celestar:#openttd>yes
12:29<@Celestar:#openttd>and that you, in a vain effort, tried to remove after switching it off the first time
12:30*Celestar:#openttd is glad he bought his new laptop without software (=
12:30<Forked:#openttd>first thing I do when I get my hands on a new computer is reinstall it...
12:30*Rubidium:#openttd doesn't really care about the software on a new laptop
12:30<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: well, not. unless it causes the comp to take 2 minutes to boot
12:30<@Rubidium:#openttd>first thing is inserting the UTP cable in and boot from network to install Linux
12:30<@Celestar:#openttd>yes :D
12:30<thingwath:#openttd>without software as in "with freedos" or really without anything?
12:31<@Celestar:#openttd>thingwath: unpartitioned HDD
12:31<thingwath:#openttd>huh, who sells that?
12:31<@Celestar:#openttd>Lenovo ;)
12:32<@Celestar:#openttd>via the academic program
12:32<thingwath:#openttd>interesting
12:32<@Celestar:#openttd>well, it costs 100 EUR less than with VB/XPPro
12:32<@Rubidium:#openttd>Dell does too, IIRC
12:32<@Celestar:#openttd>but now I seem to have misplaced my XP CD :P
12:35<Elukka:#openttd>just to make sure: if i do a scenario with the latest stable, will it be usable on future versions?
12:35<dihedral:#openttd>oh man
12:35<dihedral:#openttd>read what you were told you earlier
12:36<@Celestar:#openttd>heh.
12:36<@Celestar:#openttd>VMware workstation apparently supports CPU hotplug
12:36<@Celestar:#openttd>I wonder what the guest-XP sais if I "unplug" one of the CPUs?
12:36<Zr40:#openttd>probably nothing at all
12:36<@Celestar:#openttd>yeah. nothing anymore ...
12:37<Forked:#openttd>no fun :\
12:37<SmatZ:#openttd>hehehe
12:37*Rubidium:#openttd expected a: your hardware changed, please reactivate Windows
12:37<SmatZ:#openttd>:-P
12:37<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><Celestar> but now I seem to have misplaced my XP CD :P <- you find it on TPB then :p
12:38<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, only as of 3 components, no?
12:38<@Celestar:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: TBP?
12:38<@Celestar:#openttd>TPB?
12:39<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>nevermind ;)
12:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar, that's easily googleable: http://www.google.com/search?hl=xx-pirate&q=tpb&btnG=Google+Searrrch
12:41-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1E765.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Progman]
12:41-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1E765.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
12:42<@Celestar:#openttd>uh huh (=
12:42<@Celestar:#openttd>theoretically, if I download that but still have a valid Key/license ...
12:42*Celestar:#openttd ponders
12:42<@Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: because TPB are ThinkPad Button for me :P
12:42<SmatZ:#openttd>software piracy? in my #openttd ?
12:42<Forked:#openttd>the copy is not illegal as long as you have a license is it? Consider it as backup of your lost cd
12:43<Forked:#openttd>however sharing it probably is
12:43<@Rubidium:#openttd>SmatZ: downloading it is legal in the NL
12:43<Wolf01:#openttd>no, the backup should be made with your own cd or it is illegal
12:43<SmatZ:#openttd>same here, Wolf01
12:44*Rubidium:#openttd doesn't know whether using it once downloaded is legal though
12:44<Wolf01:#openttd>but the question is: and when the seller doesn't provide you the cd but only the factory restore dvd?
12:44<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
12:44-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
12:44<@Rubidium:#openttd>but then, the EULA is fairly pointless in Europe too
12:45<Wolf01:#openttd>the EULA is not valid in many countries
12:45<SmatZ:#openttd>Wolf01: I downloaded CD image in case I had valid CD key (but I didn't receive the CD) ... well, it was friend's computer
12:45<SmatZ:#openttd>valid CD key = that stupid sticked with CD key
12:46<Forked:#openttd>even if the key it valid doesn't automaticly mean you own the license though? :p
12:46<@Rubidium:#openttd>download: to transfer (as data or files) from a usually large computer to the memory of another device (as a smaller computer)
12:46<thingwath:#openttd>Wolf01: without valid licence you can't use the software :)
12:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>now what IF I see the CD/DVD player as the 'large computer' and the HDD the 'large computer'... is installing illegal? It's downloading after all
12:47-!-Celestar_ [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d858e2a.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
12:47<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
12:47<Forked:#openttd>Rubidium: what if it's a network install? :)
12:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>after all, my CD player's bigger than my HDD and data gets passed directly between them using DMA
12:47<Celestar_:#openttd>Forked: I haven't _lost_ my CD. it's on my office desk :P
12:48<SmatZ:#openttd>I would consider a server that fits in 1U rack to be smaller than my computer
12:48<@petern:#openttd>i've never seen a 1U rack
12:48<Celestar_:#openttd>well, but you have seen 1U servers, aven't you?
12:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Rubidium: yes, copying from CD to HDD is illegal, unless permitted by the license
12:49<SmatZ:#openttd>I failed in transforming my thoughts to English words :-p
12:49*Rubidium:#openttd always thought those 1U things were the pizza boxes of the admins ;)
12:49<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but copying from CD to RAM (temporarily) in order to execute is not (according to german copyright laws)
12:49<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
12:50<Celestar_:#openttd>bah
12:50<Celestar_:#openttd>I'm STUPID
12:50<@Rubidium:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: what if the only way to see the license is by copying it first?
12:50-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d858e2a.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the word of the german copyright is something like: "temporary copies for technical reasons are permitted without license"
12:52<Wolf01:#openttd>like "I want to try it... for a year or.. five"
12:52<Celestar_:#openttd>we have a download service of microsoft products for the uni :)
12:52-!-Celestar_ is now known as Celestar
12:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>msdnaa?
12:52<Celestar:#openttd>yeah
12:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>then you need to hurry
12:52<Celestar:#openttd>?
12:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>activation (for me) requires calling MS
12:53<Celestar:#openttd>not for us.
12:53<Wolf01:#openttd>Celestar, I want to mess up your roadstops (in case you didn't know it already) do you have any short term projects for them?
12:53-!-smeding [~smeding@5354BE76.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
12:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>http://bundesrecht.juris.de/urhg/__44a.html
12:53<@Rubidium:#openttd>Celestar: are you sure? It's the experience I've got from using MSDN AA
12:53<Celestar:#openttd>Wolf01: yes, but I'm not working on them. you wanna fix DTRS?
12:53<Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: yes, it depends on the site apparently.
12:53<Roest:#openttd>Rubidium: i can activate my msdnaa windows just normally over the net
12:54-!-sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd
12:54<thingwath:#openttd>I was able to activate MSDNAA XP without calling anywhere.
12:54<Celestar:#openttd>Rubidium: 3:1 :P
12:54<Wolf01:#openttd>Celestar, no, I'm only trying to add them the graphics for the slopes, since I already made possible to build stations on slopes
12:54<Celestar:#openttd>Wolf01: that should work out just fine
12:54*Rubidium:#openttd slaps the person responisble for that then
12:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you may make temporary copies if they are an integral part of an otherwise legal use
12:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>or if you are just mediating between other parties in a network
12:55<Celestar:#openttd>at uni, windows is cheaper than SLES :(
12:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>meaning you can legally run proxy servers ;)
12:55-!-sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:56<Roest:#openttd>which reminds me i have to get everything from msdnaa before i leave the uni next month ^^
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>haha
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>same here in May.
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>does anyone run XP 64bit btw? does it WORK?
12:56<thingwath:#openttd>msdnaa software is limited to noncommercial use, I think
12:56<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: smatz * r15298 /trunk/src/company_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#2588]: don't start another AI company in MP when there are too many companies
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>thingwath: it is.
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>thingwath: my laptop is noncommercial.
12:56<thingwath:#openttd>:)
12:56<Celestar:#openttd>since I use XP only for gaming.
12:57<Celestar:#openttd>which is noncommecrial :P
12:57<Celestar:#openttd>mostly :P
12:57<Celestar:#openttd>now, if I would take part in some world championships, which offer prize money, is that non-commercial?
12:57<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>when does "commercial" start?
12:58<SmatZ:#openttd>yes
12:58<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>if you write a diploma thesis, and a company pays you during that time?
12:58<@Rubidium:#openttd>if it would be your job, then I'd say yes. In any other case: food for a judge
12:58<Celestar:#openttd>I've got to head out a bit. dinner time
12:58<Celestar:#openttd>cu later
12:58<SmatZ:#openttd>bb Celestar
12:58-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@mnch-5d858e2a.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Quit: leaving]
12:59<@Rubidium:#openttd>heading out for dinner sounds like a sound plan
13:01-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd
13:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>if i overview the copyright correctly, the easiest plan to legally download movies is to get a doctor to attest you a disability of going into cinemas ;)
13:03<Aali:#openttd>and be allergic to DVDs?
13:09<Zr40:#openttd>petern, could you add your rewrite of my patch to FS?
13:12<frosch123:#openttd>interesting request, I would have expected a different one :p
13:13<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>"could you commit [...]" :p
13:13<Zr40:#openttd>:D
13:13<RS-SM:#openttd>hey all
13:21<bandi_zz-sleeps:#openttd>hey
13:21-!-bandi_zz-sleeps is now known as bandi_zz
13:26-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1E765.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:33<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, does it sound like a semi good idea if server admins could specify whether joining clients only join existing companies / spectators, and that way force them to start new companies once they have connected?
13:34<dihedral:#openttd>would decrease the number of people who join + create a company, and leave as soon as they see the map or some of the settings etc.
13:34-!-HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.199.212] has joined #openttd
13:34<dihedral:#openttd>rephrase - would decrease the number of unused companies created by clients joining and leaving after seeing the map / some of the settings
13:39<Elukka:#openttd>they get declared bankrupt because of loan interest eventually, but it takes time
13:40-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:41<dihedral:#openttd>Elukka, that aint the point
13:41<dihedral:#openttd>there is a feature that allows clients to move between companies in the game
13:41-!-HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.171.31] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:41<dihedral:#openttd>and lets them create new ones if they are a spectator
13:42<dihedral:#openttd>and now that the feature exists, it would perhaps be useful if clients could be made to join as spectator and continue from there
13:42<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>means force people to join as spectator, and then create a company if the map/settings/players suit them
13:43<dihedral:#openttd>aye
13:43<@petern:#openttd>dihedral, .patch or it, er, never happened.
13:43<dihedral:#openttd>or perhaps also allow them to join already existing companies
13:44<Aali:#openttd>I was just going to say that
13:44<dihedral:#openttd>petern, the move thing is already included
13:44<@petern:#openttd>remove "New company" and "Spectate game" and merge them to "Join game"
13:44<dihedral:#openttd>my question is rather is it interesting
13:44<@petern:#openttd>and "Join game" does the same as what "Spectate game" did
13:44<dihedral:#openttd>petern: either that, or allow admins to set their servers up individually
13:45<dihedral:#openttd>i.e. let them chose if it's possible to create company upon join
13:47<@petern:#openttd>"dihedral, .patch or it, er, never happened."
13:47<@petern:#openttd>:p
13:47<dihedral:#openttd>i will write it if you guys think it's worth it
13:48<@petern:#openttd>only problem i forsee is people joining unpassworded companies instead of spectating
13:48<@petern:#openttd>hmm
13:48<@petern:#openttd>no
13:48<@petern:#openttd>duh
13:49<@petern:#openttd>that's what would happen if you did it the way i suggested
13:49<dihedral:#openttd>it can happen either way
13:49<Aali:#openttd>thats not really a problem though, is it?
13:50<dihedral:#openttd>well, some people (esp on stable games) have fun in destroying games for others
13:50<Aali:#openttd>doesn't really matter if they're spectating or not as long as they don't start useless companies
13:50<dihedral:#openttd>they join unprotected companies and waste their money on flooding the map
13:51<Aali:#openttd>I guess it could get confusing for new players though, spectate tends to imply that you wont be participating in any way
13:51<Aali:#openttd>so they'll join an existing company instead, which hides the new company button
13:52<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that's why petern's suggestion was to rename the button
13:52<Aali:#openttd>however, if the only thing you can do is spectate, they'll join and ask for help
13:53<Aali:#openttd>perhaps only allow directly joining passworded companies as another option?
13:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the join message can say "you are currently a spectator, to create a company [...]"
13:54<Aali:#openttd>well, the ask for help part is a good thing, I've got no problem with that
13:56-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
13:56-!-Celestar_ [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
13:57-!-Celestar_ [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #openttd []
13:57<dihedral:#openttd>welcome message is set by the server
14:00<Aali:#openttd>I think you should go with a setting with 4 options; new clients can do anything (same as it is now), new clients can join any company, new clients can join passworded and new clients can spectate only
14:00<Aali:#openttd>that should cover most people's needs :)
14:01<@Rubidium:#openttd>what's the use for 'join any company'?
14:01<@Rubidium:#openttd>and does that imply ignoring passwords?
14:02<frosch123:#openttd>I guess he did not meant 'join a random company'
14:02<dihedral:#openttd>hehe
14:03<dihedral:#openttd>join any random company, even if it's pw protected :-P
14:03<Aali:#openttd>some people might want to run servers where companies are "free-for-all" (no passwords) and still not allow random clients to create useless companies
14:03<Aali:#openttd>haha
14:03<Aali:#openttd>yeah, thats exactly what I meant :P
14:04-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:04-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
14:11-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.97.12] has joined #openttd
14:12<@Rubidium:#openttd>dihedral: you've got OSX, right? If so, can you reproduce FS#2585?
14:12*Sacro:#openttd has OSX
14:14<dihedral:#openttd>i'll do my best
14:14<frosch123:#openttd>Sacro: be careful, you might be forced into OSX maintance-slavery
14:14<@Rubidium:#openttd>yeah, lets assign Sacro to FS#1140
14:15<Sacro:#openttd>frosch123: I can't even compile it
14:15<Sacro:#openttd>Rubidium: link me
14:15<@Rubidium:#openttd>https://secure.openttd.org/bugs/task/1140?project=1&type[0]=1&sev[0]=&pri[0]=&due[0]=&cat[0]=&status[0]=open&percent[0]=&reported[0]=&order=id&sort=desc (I'm lazy)
14:17<Sacro:#openttd>invalid cert
14:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>then add the cacert root certificate ;)
14:18<Sacro:#openttd>ah hrm
14:18*Sacro:#openttd tries to figure out what he's doing
14:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>we don't fancy paying several hundreds of dollars a year for a SSL certificate that's supported by all major browsers OOTB
14:19<Sacro:#openttd>qwerty
14:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>azerty
14:19-!-Celestar1 [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
14:19-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:21-!-Celestar1 is now known as Celestar
14:21<@petern:#openttd>several? £50 max...
14:21-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.97.12] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- IRC with a difference]
14:21<@petern:#openttd>still too much when cacert is available
14:21<@Rubidium:#openttd>petern: not for the kind of certificate we use
14:21-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #openttd []
14:21<@petern:#openttd>oh, wildcard?
14:21<@Rubidium:#openttd>yup
14:22<dihedral:#openttd>hehe
14:22-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
14:27<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, i have no issues with 15297
14:29<dihedral:#openttd>appart from when the game is windowed but maximised, and i move the mouse down to the hidden dock and back into the game (after the dock appeared), then i have the default osx mouse on top of the openttd mouse, and i can get rid of the osx mouse my very quickly moving the mouse back down to the dock and back up again
14:29<dihedral:#openttd>but that has been the case for a long time now
14:29<dihedral:#openttd>fullscreen: no issues at all
14:30<dihedral:#openttd>and i have a few more apps open than just itunes :-P
14:30<dihedral:#openttd>though i must add, i have 10.4
14:30<dihedral:#openttd>the bug report might very well be for 10.5
14:30<@Rubidium:#openttd>so it's kinda confirmed; you can get the osx mouse
14:30<dihedral:#openttd>i can get the os x mouse
14:31<dihedral:#openttd>but not in full screen
14:31<@petern:#openttd>19:29 < dihedral> but that has been the case for a long time now
14:31<@petern:#openttd>IT'S NICE THAT PEOPLE REPORT BUGS ISN'T IT
14:32<dihedral:#openttd>i told bjarni a few times, just never wrote a bug report
14:33<dihedral:#openttd>however, i get a nasty mouse behaviour if i am in window mode and the window is smaller than the screen
14:33<dihedral:#openttd>then the openttd mouse and the osx mouse are at different locations
14:33<Sacro:#openttd>dihedral: i see that bug
14:33<dihedral:#openttd>and move simultaneously :-)
14:33<dihedral:#openttd>what i mentioned or what the fs report mentiones
14:33<Sacro:#openttd>mine are together
14:34<dihedral:#openttd>which os x version?
14:34-!-George3 [~George@212.113.107.216] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:35<Sacro:#openttd>10.5.6
14:35<dihedral:#openttd>i am on 10.4.9
14:36<Sacro:#openttd>hmmm, I see that fs bug
14:37<Sacro:#openttd>I seem to scroll off randomly
14:37<Sacro:#openttd>what is the required result?
14:38<@Rubidium:#openttd>Sacro: talking about FS#1140? Then I've got absolutely no clue. I'd say ask Bjarni :(
14:39-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:39<Sacro:#openttd>Rubidium: i think he's dead or something
14:39<Sacro:#openttd>@seen Bjarni
14:39<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Sacro: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 1 day, 0 hours, 10 minutes, and 16 seconds ago: <Bjarni> hi Wolf01
14:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>Sacro: so is the OSX port
14:42<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, can you make a change at bugs please? when specifiying os x, perhaps let them (the reporters) choose from 10.3.9 10.4 and 10.5?
14:42<Sacro:#openttd>Rubidium: hmmm
14:42<Sacro:#openttd>I don't know OSX coding
14:43<@Rubidium:#openttd>dihedral: that'd mean a lot of work maintaining an enormous list of different versions of OSX, Windows etc.
14:43<@Rubidium:#openttd>(can't specify versions per OS)
14:43<Sacro:#openttd>Rubidium: hmm, well yes
14:44<Sacro:#openttd>OSX panther, osx tiger and osx leopard
14:45<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, you dont have to maintain all of them, it just makes it easier when trying to reproduce
14:45<dihedral:#openttd>if it's 10.5 and the bug does not exist for me, then what can i do to fix it?
14:45-!-Rexxars [~rexxars@62.113.132.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>people should just mention the exact version in the details
14:47<Sacro:#openttd>Rubidium: well we could drop support for 10.3
14:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>Sacro: I rather drop support for 10.5
14:47<Sacro:#openttd>lets face it, it's a well old version
14:48<dihedral:#openttd>Sacro: why drop 10.3 now, as long as their are no issues with 10.3?
14:50<@Rubidium:#openttd>10.3 and 10.4 run faster than 10.5 intel (with a specific GPU driver)
14:51<dihedral:#openttd>depends on the model of the intel mac :-P
14:51<dihedral:#openttd>and on the model of the ppc mac
14:51<Roest:#openttd>hmm would it be possible that scenarios use the KI settings from the main menu, meaning which ones too load?
14:51<@Rubidium:#openttd>dihedral: it actually depends on the GPU driver
14:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>Roest: not really
14:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>only for new scenarios
14:53<Roest:#openttd>that's saved with the scenario?
14:53<@Rubidium:#openttd>yes
14:53-!-Rexxars [~rexxars@62.113.132.255] has joined #openttd
14:54<Roest:#openttd>could thta be overwritten by loading one into the editor and saving again?
14:54<@Rubidium:#openttd>no
14:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>as that would mean breaking any settings made before in the scenario
14:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>it'd also mean some conversion functions (when switching settings) aren't ran making the scenario invalid
14:56<Roest:#openttd>so in order to play an old scenario with a certain AI i have to delete all the others
14:56<@Rubidium:#openttd>you can't configure them in-game?
14:57<Roest:#openttd>either i'm blind or i really can't
14:57<@Rubidium:#openttd>ask Yexo about that ;)
14:59<@Rubidium:#openttd>otherwise you can start an ai using start_ai <name> from the in-game console
15:01<Roest:#openttd>ah ok
15:11-!-Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:16-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Quit: RS-SM]
15:16<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: smatz * r15299 /trunk/src/ (225 files in 13 dirs): -Cleanup: remove many redundant includes
15:20-!-George [~George@212.113.107.216] has joined #openttd
15:24-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:24-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
15:26-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd
15:30<Prof_Frink:#openttd>Wow, that host's shoutier than KCOM.COM
15:31<Sacro:#openttd>indeed
15:31<dihedral:#openttd>.edu?
15:31<Sacro:#openttd>new york uni
15:31<Sacro:#openttd>i guess
15:31<Sacro:#openttd>educational
15:31<dihedral:#openttd>prob
15:32<dihedral:#openttd>yes, i know .edu, just never seen anyone here with that
15:32<RS-SM:#openttd>yeah
15:32<RS-SM:#openttd>I'm in school
15:33<dihedral:#openttd>sm is no orientation of yours, is it?
15:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>on a saturday afternoon 'round tea time being at school?
15:34<@petern:#openttd>tea time? bit early for that
15:35<@Rubidium:#openttd>well, he still has to commute to a proper place to drink tea ;)
15:35<dihedral:#openttd>any time is tea time
15:39<RS-SM:#openttd>Yeah
15:40<RS-SM:#openttd>I have my tea here, in the library, my TTD ready, and I'm good
15:40<RS-SM:#openttd>and wait, are you all English?
15:40<dihedral:#openttd>nope
15:44<Prof_Frink:#openttd>I am all English.
15:44<Sacro:#openttd>me too
15:45<RS-SM:#openttd>Cool mates
15:45<RS-SM:#openttd>Grandfather came from one of your colonies
15:45<@petern:#openttd>OH MY GOD WE HAVE A CRITICAL SITUATION IN THE PETERN HOUSEHOLD
15:45<Prof_Frink:#openttd>petern: </beer>?
15:46<@petern:#openttd>Prof_Frink is a winner
15:46<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
15:46*Prof_Frink:#openttd has Pride.
15:47<@petern:#openttd>i could open the wine...
15:47<@petern:#openttd>but...
15:47<@Rubidium:#openttd>... the wisky's already opened
15:47<SmatZ:#openttd>:o)
15:49<@Rubidium:#openttd>or
15:50<@Rubidium:#openttd>... the brewery is next door, they're still open and sell to end users
15:51<Prof_Frink:#openttd>Rubidium: Install a pipeline!
15:52<Sacro:#openttd>we are making a brewery here
15:52<Elukka:#openttd>make a complicated miniature railway beer transportation network instead
15:52<Elukka:#openttd>much awesomer than pipelines
15:53<Prof_Frink:#openttd>Nah, having a set of pumps in the kitchen would be better.
15:54-!-TinoM [~Tino@i59F5CE06.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
16:01<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15300 /trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Cleanup: remove an unused icon and remove the references to swedish forgotten in r6358.
16:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>@openttd commit 6358
16:02<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: Commit by Darkvater :: r6358 trunk/ottdres.rc (2006-09-03 16:02:15 UTC)
16:02<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: -Codechange: update resource file to reflect development tree (0.5.0.0) as file
16:02<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: version, and added revision number. Also remove SWEDISH resources.
16:05<Sacro:#openttd>oh god
16:10<el_en:#openttd>what sort of SWEDISH resources?
16:11-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ffe4a.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:11-!-Zr40 [~Zr40@120-12-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:12-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:13<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i have no idea
16:14<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>sounds like the stuff that gets displayed in windows when you click on file properties
16:15<+glx:#openttd>just remember who started openttd :)
16:16<el_en:#openttd>i do remember.
16:16-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
16:16-!-mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ
16:20-!-const86 [~const@tower.mimas.ru] has quit [Quit: I'll be back]
16:21<@Celestar:#openttd>hm.
16:21<@Celestar:#openttd>bbl
16:21<@Celestar:#openttd>:P
16:21-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving]
16:22-!-Rexxars [~rexxars@62.113.132.255] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
16:22-!-const86 [~const@tower.mimas.ru] has joined #openttd
16:27<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r15301 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Feature [FS#104]: Add option to group and subtotal expenses list in the company finance window. Concept from Zr40.
16:29<@Belugas:#openttd>i don't remember,
16:29<@Belugas:#openttd>i don;t recall
16:29<@Belugas:#openttd>i've got n memory
16:29<@Belugas:#openttd>of anythng at all
16:32<@petern:#openttd><3
16:33<@Belugas:#openttd>strange is your language
16:33<@Belugas:#openttd>and i have no decoder
16:33<@Belugas:#openttd>what don't you make your intentions clear?
16:33-!-masdaskl [6151cd1b@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd
16:34<@Belugas:#openttd>I'm all mixed up,
16:34<masdaskl:#openttd>hello.. i have a question.. is openttd always going to require the original TTD data
16:34<@Belugas:#openttd>i've got nothing to say
16:34<@Rubidium:#openttd>no
16:34<@petern:#openttd>until somebody makes a replacement sample.cat ...
16:34<Elukka:#openttd>not once opengfx is done, i think
16:34<@Belugas:#openttd>miaooow
16:34<@petern:#openttd>incidentally, i should finish my catcodec...
16:34<Wolf01:#openttd>good night
16:35-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host114-234-dynamic.21-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
16:35<masdaskl:#openttd>so.. is it in developement or still concept
16:35<@petern:#openttd>so far it extracts to .wav files (except the corrupt one, heh)
16:35-!-tokai [~tokai@p54B806A5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
16:35-!-mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
16:35<@Belugas:#openttd>masdaskl, search for opengfx on the forums :)
16:35<@petern:#openttd>replacement data has always been possible. we're not making it though.
16:37<masdaskl:#openttd>is it a goal to move away from the copyrighted material so openTTD can be distributed freely
16:38<Sacro:#openttd>any manouvre from point a to point b makes point b a goal
16:41<@Belugas:#openttd>masdaskl, why do you think about it?
16:41<@Belugas:#openttd>what...
16:41<@Belugas:#openttd>not why
16:42<masdaskl:#openttd>Belugas: about what?
16:43<@Belugas:#openttd>about your question...
16:44<masdaskl:#openttd>i would hope that was the goal.. but petern stated that the openttd wasnt developing the openGFX .. so i thought id ask
16:44-!-Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has quit [Quit: On snow, everyone can follow your traces]
16:47<el_en:#openttd>masdaskl: it's questionable whether the opengfx would be considered not to be a derivative of the original graphics.
16:47<masdaskl:#openttd>i dont undestand what your saying..
16:47<masdaskl:#openttd>to close to the original copyrighted artwork... ?? is that what your saying?
16:48-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
16:48<el_en:#openttd>yes, it is quite close.
16:48<masdaskl:#openttd>so.. it may be to close to a copyright infringement to use ?
16:49<el_en:#openttd>possibly.
16:49-!-Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has joined #openttd
16:49-!-mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ
16:49<masdaskl:#openttd>is the plan to dev new GFX work.. or to rework the current openGFX
16:50<masdaskl:#openttd>wb Belugas
16:50<@petern:#openttd>the developers have no plans for that because none of them are artists
16:51<@Belugas:#openttd>hey... that's so not true!!
16:51<masdaskl:#openttd>i ask because i was looking at playing the game.. but i dont own a copy of ttd
16:51<@petern:#openttd>graphic artists :D
16:51<@Belugas:#openttd>I'm a great guitarist!
16:51<@Belugas:#openttd>heheh
16:51<@Belugas:#openttd>granted :)
16:51<@petern:#openttd>you can play with opengfx, but it's not made by the developers
16:52<masdaskl:#openttd>future official support ?
16:52<el_en:#openttd>i think any new graphics that is created will always be quite close to the original graphics, as long as the graphics needs to be exactly the same size as originally, and have same purpose.
16:53<masdaskl:#openttd>yeah
16:53<@Belugas:#openttd>mmh... could be, maybe not... let say the game will support alternative base gfx
16:53<masdaskl:#openttd>thats what i was pondering.. figured they needed to be the same dimension
16:53<@petern:#openttd>the developers provided the ability to use non-original graphics more easily
16:53<@petern:#openttd>just a different set of people work on opengfx
16:53<@Belugas:#openttd>that's waht i wanted to say, but i did it not as brilliantly :S
16:53<masdaskl:#openttd>do any of yall use the openGFX.. or do yall own the org ttd
16:54<@petern:#openttd>i own a copy of ttd myself
16:54<el_en:#openttd>what's the license of openGFX?
16:54<@petern:#openttd>i think they settled on gpl
16:54<Sacro:#openttd>heh
16:54<Sacro:#openttd>GPL was a bad choice
16:54<masdaskl:#openttd>what would you of chose ?
16:55<Sacro:#openttd>cos then you have the whole 'what format' issue
16:55<el_en:#openttd>hmm, then someone could actually package openttd with opengfx in some distro.
16:55<Sacro:#openttd>masdaskl: CC by-sa-nc
16:55<@petern:#openttd>el_en, ding
16:55<masdaskl:#openttd>public domain
16:55<Sacro:#openttd>no, not PD
16:55<@petern:#openttd>most likely is an opengfx package, and make openttd depend on it
16:55<Sacro:#openttd>openttd-data or something
16:56<@petern:#openttd>Sacro, shut up, all the license considerations were taken on the forums already
16:56<@petern:#openttd>and no, cc-by-sa-nc is not suitable
16:56<Sacro:#openttd>but then with banana you don't need to include them
16:56<Sacro:#openttd>petern: I think LGPL would be better
16:56<el_en:#openttd>what about the copyright-free midi music that Sacro found?
16:57<@petern:#openttd>who plays with the music on? :p
16:58<el_en:#openttd>i do, on mac. on linux the music won't play.
16:59<@petern:#openttd>silly linux
16:59<masdaskl:#openttd>what distro
16:59<@Belugas:#openttd>yall? what the heck does yall mean???
16:59<masdaskl:#openttd>you all
17:00<@Belugas:#openttd>oh... ok... and why didn't you wrote it as such in the beginning?? :P
17:00<@Belugas:#openttd>let me guess... you are american?
17:01<masdaskl:#openttd>yes
17:01*Belugas:#openttd wins
17:01<el_en:#openttd>Belugas is from Canada, where they have a 20-hour clock.
17:01<masdaskl:#openttd>20 hour clock?
17:01<@Belugas:#openttd>21, el_en, 21...
17:01<el_en:#openttd>oh, sorry.
17:02<@petern:#openttd># I AM IRON MAN
17:02<masdaskl:#openttd>21 hour clock really?
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>of course...
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>and Obama is thinking about using it, in order to boost productivity
17:02<masdaskl:#openttd>looking now for some info..
17:02<masdaskl:#openttd>really
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>haven't you heard?
17:03<masdaskl:#openttd>i havent no
17:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>everybody knows
17:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that the bird is the word
17:04<masdaskl:#openttd>i cant find any info on a 21 hour clock on google or wikipedia
17:04<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>well, it's the opposite of the 28 hour day
17:05<@Belugas:#openttd>yeah... only maericans are still under the 24 hours rule
17:05<masdaskl:#openttd>says that only qubec use a 12 hour clock
17:05<@Belugas:#openttd>americans... not maericans
17:05<masdaskl:#openttd>opps i mean
17:05<masdaskl:#openttd>qubec doesnt use the 12 hour clock
17:06<@Belugas:#openttd>indeed not, we're using the 21 one :)
17:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you know, 28 hour days mean you have 6 days per week
17:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and 21 hours per day, means you have 8 days per week
17:06<masdaskl:#openttd>Belugas: do you have a link.. for more info
17:07<@petern:#openttd>thailand has a 6 hour clock
17:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yeah, they have insanely long weeks
17:08-!-Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )]
17:08<@Belugas:#openttd>well... i could send you a photo of my watch, but i'm heavily in debugging stuff for work :P
17:08<el_en:#openttd>an hour of canadian time has 65 american minutes.
17:09<masdaskl:#openttd>never heard of such.. hows the economy
17:09<@Belugas:#openttd>better than yours ;)
17:09<@petern:#openttd>at least the bankers can afford their bonuses
17:10<masdaskl:#openttd>lol
17:11<masdaskl:#openttd>IMO our economy is about to go down the drain
17:11<masdaskl:#openttd>crime is .. outrageous right now..
17:11<masdaskl:#openttd>no one is working and people cant pay there bills
17:12<@petern:#openttd># laaaaaaaaa la laaa, la la
17:12<@petern:#openttd>name that tune!
17:12<Sacro:#openttd>masdaskl: their
17:13<masdaskl:#openttd>Sacro: Their?
17:13<@petern:#openttd>Sacro: they're thereing their theirs :o
17:13<Sacro:#openttd>i know :(
17:13<masdaskl:#openttd>ahh .. their bills
17:13<Sacro:#openttd>masdaskl: their bills
17:13<masdaskl:#openttd>pardon me
17:13<@petern:#openttd># <solo bit>
17:14<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it's weird how the native speakers are always the ones who write worst
17:14<Sacro:#openttd>petern: don't fear the repear?
17:14<@petern:#openttd>Sacro, yes
17:14*Sacro:#openttd wins
17:14<@Rubidium:#openttd>petern: the intro of the third Symphony of Nelson?
17:14<el_en:#openttd>over their people can't pay they're bills, their poor
17:14<@petern:#openttd>Sacro knows of last.fm
17:14<masdaskl:#openttd>spell check and typing lingo have killed my spelling..
17:14<Sacro:#openttd>petern: poo
17:14<masdaskl:#openttd>not to mention the growing spanglish ..
17:14<Sacro:#openttd>spanglish?
17:14<masdaskl:#openttd>spanish and english mixed
17:15*el_en:#openttd has heard of spanglish before
17:15<@petern:#openttd>like franglais
17:15<Sacro:#openttd>ahh
17:15<@Belugas:#openttd>joual
17:15<Sacro:#openttd>petern: ice cream?
17:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>we only have denglisch hier
17:15<Sacro:#openttd>heh
17:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>ice cream, you scream?
17:15<@petern:#openttd>avez vouz heardez mon farts?
17:15<Sacro:#openttd>we all scream
17:15<el_en:#openttd>masdaskl: please see this short documentary about the canadian clock (starting at about 0:35): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ydw4kj9P90w
17:15<Sacro:#openttd>petern: si senior
17:16<Sacro:#openttd>señor even
17:16<@petern:#openttd>si senior < spanglish :D
17:16<Sacro:#openttd>séñør
17:16-!-Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd
17:16<Mortal:#openttd>que
17:16<@petern:#openttd>señor ros
17:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>¿Qué?
17:16<Mortal:#openttd>el_en, that description screams rickroll to me
17:16<davis_:#openttd>barackroll
17:16<el_en:#openttd>Mortal: negative.
17:17<Sacro:#openttd>cakeroll
17:17<masdaskl:#openttd>so.. who thinks the US pulls out of iraq and deploys massive troops to afgan
17:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i have never understood this "rickroll" thing...
17:17<davis_:#openttd>how comes
17:17<xerxesdaphat:#openttd>I think they should deploy massive Uhl Mail Vans to Truninghill
17:17<el_en:#openttd>i've never seen this "rickroll" thing, and i think i'm happy this way
17:17<davis_:#openttd>http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4
17:18<davis_:#openttd>barackroll > rickroll anyway
17:18<Mortal:#openttd>duckroll > barackroll
17:18-!-masdaskl [6151cd1b@webchat.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]
17:18<davis_:#openttd>do the barrel role
17:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>breadroll > all
17:18<davis_:#openttd>:o
17:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>speaking of which... i need something to eat
17:19<davis_:#openttd>once in a while.
17:19<Sacro:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: sausageroll > breadroll
17:19<@petern:#openttd>except if it has gristle
17:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>how do i have to imagine a sausageroll?
17:21<Sacro:#openttd>well
17:21<Sacro:#openttd>how do you make a swissroll?
17:21<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>what's a swissroll?
17:22<Sacro:#openttd>sigh
17:22<Sacro:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: you know nothing
17:22<Elukka:#openttd>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_roll
17:22<Elukka:#openttd>the great oracle of wiki knows everything, though
17:22<davis_:#openttd>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mv5qzMtLE60
17:22<davis_:#openttd>barrel roll
17:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes, i do know stuff... but not under their foreignish names
17:23<el_en:#openttd>i'm not going to click on any of those links.
17:23<Sacro:#openttd>el_en: good idea
17:23<Sacro:#openttd>hmm, is this el_en the same as the old ln?
17:24<el_en:#openttd>could be
17:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no, he's the new and improved el_en!
17:24<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>now with longer nick!
17:25<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and with English Only!
17:25<el_en:#openttd>and more e.
17:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but! more e violates the english rules
17:27<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>only 12,7% of all letters may be "e"s
17:30<el_en:#openttd>over all text ever written in english?
17:30<thingwath:#openttd>are non-ascii characters possible in irc nicknames?
17:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>http://pages.central.edu/emp/LintonT/classes/spring01/cryptography/letterfreq.html
17:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>The license agreement from Sun for JDK 1.2.1.
17:31<el_en:#openttd>thingwath: yes and no.
17:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd> The teaching philosophy of a computer science professor from a liberal arts college in Minnesota.
17:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd> A letter of recommendation for a national competition for innovative uses of technology in collegiate teaching.
17:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>thingwath: yes, the IRC standard does not forbid them. no, most IRC servers forbid them
17:32<thingwath:#openttd>ah. :-(
17:32<@Belugas:#openttd>i dare you to try and show us how it would go!
17:34<thingwath:#openttd>no ř, then
17:36<@Belugas:#openttd>ho god.... what a nasty little bitchy bug...
17:36<@Belugas:#openttd>what an ass i can be from time to time :(
17:36<Elukka:#openttd>hmm... nars2 has company colours
17:36<Elukka:#openttd>i much preferred the real colours in the older version :/
17:36<el_en:#openttd>if you are using an ancient character set called... damn, i forgot what it was called.. then some ASCII characters such as [{}] are actually äö something.
17:38<el_en:#openttd>ah, it's ISO646-FI.
17:38-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:38<el_en:#openttd>ä = {, ö = |, etc.
17:38<thingwath:#openttd>ä and ö are not very useful for me :)
17:39<Sacro:#openttd>ö
17:40<Sacro:#openttd>:o
17:40<Sacro:#openttd>O;
17:40<Sacro:#openttd>o: even
17:40-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd
17:41<@Belugas:#openttd>Elukka, you know why i've suggetsed building time? as an irony. People want SOME part of OPENTTD to be more realistic, but would not ALL the parts of it, 'cause it would not be fun anymore... It was just an exmaple.
17:41<el_en:#openttd>this is relevant to IRC because i think that charset and those characters have affected the IRC RFC somehow.
17:44<Elukka:#openttd>belugas, i wouldnt want absolutely everything to be realistic either
17:45<@Belugas:#openttd>that's the situation that irritates me
17:45<Sacro:#openttd>http://www.b3ta.cr3ation.co.uk/data/jpg/busdog.jpg
17:45<Elukka:#openttd>in the context of the whole game, it's not a black and white realistic vs. unrealistic case
17:45<@Belugas:#openttd>you wnat a part of it, but not it all
17:45<Elukka:#openttd>so in your mind, there is no middle ground?
17:45<Elukka:#openttd>there are things that would be more fun were they to be more realistic, then there are those that would be less fun
17:46<@Belugas:#openttd>middle ground shifts as soon as someone wants a new piece of realism
17:46<@Belugas:#openttd>there are things that would be fun indeed, but some others that are added just to make it alike that will not bring anything more to the game
17:46<@Belugas:#openttd>cost...
17:46<Elukka:#openttd>sensible costs are one thing that would make the game more fun to play... and why not make them realistic if you're doing it anyway?
17:46<@Belugas:#openttd>frankly...
17:47<@Belugas:#openttd>it would not make the game more fun to play, at all.. only in your mind.
17:47<@Belugas:#openttd>oince you're filthy rich, you can afford everyting
17:47<@Belugas:#openttd>so... it's an illusion
17:47<Elukka:#openttd>that's a problem to which i don't know a solution
17:47<Sacro:#openttd>http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=tVde1Bs3MCQ <- XD
17:48<Elukka:#openttd>as it is, in modern times in ottd you can make the most money with planes
17:48<Elukka:#openttd>you dont need to do anything at all but plop down airports and buy planes and forget about it
17:48<Elukka:#openttd>it's not realistic, nor is it as fun as it could be
17:48<@Belugas:#openttd>for you it's not
17:49<@Belugas:#openttd>for some users , it is
17:49<@Belugas:#openttd>nobody is satisfied with what they have
17:49<Elukka:#openttd>some people find it fun that planes are much, much better from a financial standpoint than any other method?
17:49<@Belugas:#openttd>it's human nature
17:49<Elukka:#openttd>(while also being easier)
17:49-!-Osai is now known as Osai_
17:49-!-Osai_ is now known as Osai
17:49<@Belugas:#openttd>some people (if not most) are using the game as it is, a transport game
17:49<Elukka:#openttd>real life is a great model to use
17:49<@Belugas:#openttd>any means to get filthy rich is good enouhg
17:49<Elukka:#openttd>in real life, all methods of transport are viable and used a lot
17:50<thingwath:#openttd>well, in fact, I usually just use the cheat to get few hundred millions and then not care about money at all
17:50<thingwath:#openttd>if it were possible, I would just turn money off :)
17:50<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>el_en: that's what happens when you let finns draw up a specification...
17:50<Elukka:#openttd>trains dont obsolete trucks or buses, planes dont obsolete trains
17:51<@Belugas:#openttd>in real life, it takes years to byuild a bridge. you do not wanted to go there, but saying that real life is a great model, you're doing that, implicitely
17:51<Elukka:#openttd>again, everything need not be realistic
17:51<Elukka:#openttd>there's already a kind of middle ground
17:51<Elukka:#openttd>some things are realistic, the others are not
17:51<@Belugas:#openttd>why?
17:51<@Belugas:#openttd>who's to say?
17:51<Elukka:#openttd>how can you accept that?
17:51<@Belugas:#openttd>woith what criteria?
17:51<Elukka:#openttd>there are real things, there are unrealistic things
17:52<Elukka:#openttd>it's not completely fictional, nor is it a simulator
17:52<Elukka:#openttd>this implicitly means some things are realistic while some are not
17:52<@Belugas:#openttd>ho? a bridge created in one day is realistic?
17:52<Elukka:#openttd>nope
17:52-!-Osai is now known as Osai_
17:52-!-Osai_ is now known as Osai
17:52<Elukka:#openttd>all the methods of transport are real, though
17:52-!-ecke [~ecke@213.195.202.130] has quit [Quit: ecke]
17:52<Elukka:#openttd>as are cities growing, industries being built and forests growing
17:52<@Belugas:#openttd>so who is to say what could be realistic as much as openttd is?
17:52<xerxesdaphat:#openttd>what i want, that would annoy the hell out of all the grand-scale ottdcoop-types, is a shunting system, turntables, with trains that don't magically turn around on a single piece of track
17:53<Sacro:#openttd>Belugas: l can rattle up a bridge in an afternoon
17:53<@Belugas:#openttd>the cities are growing VERY reaslitaly indeed
17:53<xerxesdaphat:#openttd>that's what the `advanced settings' is for though
17:53<Elukka:#openttd>could you reword that?
17:53<@Belugas:#openttd>the industries are prodcing very realiscally
17:53<Elukka:#openttd>i didnt say everything is 100% realistic
17:53<Elukka:#openttd>in fact, nothing is
17:53-!-petern changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.6.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (BaNaNaS: bananas, Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs, Revision log: vcs, Release info: finger) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | UTF-8 please | No Unauthorised Bots | Discussion of realism is now a quietable offence
17:53<Elukka:#openttd>sensible costs wouldnt mean that either
17:53<@Belugas:#openttd>and they do not ask for merchandise, they just accept whatever we throw at them
17:53<Elukka:#openttd>hey, it's an interesting discussion!
17:53<@Belugas:#openttd>very realistally
17:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>lucky enough, i only ever talk about "realism"
17:54<@Belugas:#openttd>what about stations? passengers waiting for MONTHS to climb a bus...
17:54<@Belugas:#openttd>come one....
17:54<Elukka:#openttd>as openttd is based on real transport industry and has all the same basic things they do and the same methods of transports, realism in there would mean everything would be balanced and every method of transport would be viable
17:55<xerxesdaphat:#openttd>petern: bwahaha
17:55<@Belugas:#openttd>guess what, the game is not balanced, at all, so it is not as based on real transport as you would like it to be
17:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>exactly, the main problem is not that the game is not "realistic", but it is not balanced
17:56<Elukka:#openttd>i'd like balance
17:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>but balance has nothing to do with "realism"
17:56<Elukka:#openttd>eddi, i'm suggesting real life is a good basis to balance it on
17:56<Elukka:#openttd>as real life balances itself
17:56<@Belugas:#openttd>let say thatthe game borrows from reality, instead of being based on
17:57-!-Osai is now known as Osai_
17:57-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:57<Elukka:#openttd>would you not find it fun if trucks, buses, aircraft from small commuters to massive jets, ships of all sizes and all kinds of trains were viable and worked well?
17:58<@Belugas:#openttd>what do you mean?
17:58<Elukka:#openttd>in real life, all these are used and are financially viable in different situations
17:58<Elukka:#openttd>thus, if you based the balance on real life, everything would have their uses
17:59-!-ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd
17:59<Elukka:#openttd>you could make breaks from reality where it would not be fun
17:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Elukka: it's the right intention, but the wrong argument
17:59<@Belugas:#openttd>let see... planes will have to leave, even if they are not full. Yoi will get bankrupted if you could not service fast enough the stations
17:59<el_en:#openttd>but not everything is viable in real life either. for example, trains mostly aren't.
17:59<@Belugas:#openttd>planes speeds will have to be adjusted, as well as trucks
18:00<Elukka:#openttd>there are huge amounts of trains in the world
18:00<@Belugas:#openttd>we would need to lower the time speed too
18:00<Elukka:#openttd>not necessarily
18:00<@Belugas:#openttd>well... that's the price to pay
18:00<Elukka:#openttd>that's one thing i see as a good break from reality, it wouldnt be any fun if new vehicles never appeared
18:01<@Belugas:#openttd>you are diverging formthe goal for the same exactly reason i'm not fund of adding realism
18:01<@Belugas:#openttd>it would not be as fun
18:01<Elukka:#openttd>diverting from what goal?
18:01-!-Osai_ is now known as Osai
18:02<Elukka:#openttd>i was arguing why, in the correct places, realism would in fact be fun
18:02<Elukka:#openttd>i think it will have to be considered whether any new feature is actually fun
18:03<Elukka:#openttd>realism and fun are not mutually exclusive
18:03<@Belugas:#openttd>indeed not
18:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Elukka: "realism" is not a goal, and most times not even a means, at best it is a side product.
18:03<@Belugas:#openttd>i never said the opposite... that is what it means by adding to the game play
18:03<Elukka:#openttd>basing the balance on realism would increase realism, but it wouldnt be the main goal
18:06-!-lneckel [~lneckel@189.4.116.188] has joined #openttd
18:06<lneckel:#openttd>hello someone
18:06<@Belugas:#openttd>nope
18:06<@Belugas:#openttd>hello
18:06<lneckel:#openttd>I need some help
18:06<@Belugas:#openttd>me too
18:07<lneckel:#openttd>someone speak portuguese here 
18:07<lneckel:#openttd>?
18:07<@Belugas:#openttd>DigitalFox does
18:07<@Belugas:#openttd>dunno if he's around
18:07<@Belugas:#openttd>nope
18:07<lneckel:#openttd>hum...
18:07<el_en:#openttd>true realism would be that you are given a pre-built network of trains, road vehicles and all, which are taking more money than they produce. and your task is to close down lines, sell away vehicles and do whatever necessary to rescue the company.
18:08<lneckel:#openttd>hey... how can I make my dedicated server write a welcome message when a player join on it?
18:09<Elukka:#openttd>i think instead of playing a single manager, you're really a weird hivemind amalgamation of all the chairmen of that company ever :D
18:09<thingwath:#openttd>no fun with the real world, it's already too fucked up.
18:09<@Belugas:#openttd>i think the answer can be found on the wiki
18:09<Elukka:#openttd>that's another acceptable break from reality
18:09<lneckel:#openttd>i can´t find... ¬¬
18:09<@Belugas:#openttd>look for scrip sowmthing
18:10<lneckel:#openttd>yeah, i've done it
18:10<@Belugas:#openttd>i can't find either, but it's because i do not have the luxury to search
18:10<lneckel:#openttd>heheheheh
18:10<lneckel:#openttd>i was searching and trying some stuff
18:10<lneckel:#openttd>but i couldn't do nothing
18:10-!-DaleStan is now known as Guest44
18:10-!-DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
18:11<Elukka:#openttd>now to make a northeast corridor map
18:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>lneckel: most likely, by modifying a file in the scripts directory
18:12<lneckel:#openttd>hum... nice... I'll try it
18:12<lneckel:#openttd>thanks
18:13<lneckel:#openttd>ahn... where is it
18:13<lneckel:#openttd>?
18:14<@Rubidium:#openttd>what version of OpenTTD are you using?
18:14<lneckel:#openttd>0.6.3
18:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>next to the data directory, where you put your original TTD files
18:15-!-Guest44 [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:16<@Rubidium:#openttd>hmm... there isn't a script for 'on-join' it seems
18:17<@Rubidium:#openttd>that basically means that you need to run an autopilot
18:18-!-DaleStan is now known as Guest45
18:18-!-DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
18:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>hmm, oh... there's no example file
18:18<lneckel:#openttd>hum... sorry, but... what is an autopilot?
18:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>lneckel: never mind ;)
18:18<lneckel:#openttd>ok... Oo
18:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>locate your openttd binary (openttd.exe)
18:19<lneckel:#openttd>ok
18:19<lneckel:#openttd>easy
18:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>then make a directory named 'scripts' in the same directory where openttd.exe is
18:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>go into that directory
18:19<lneckel:#openttd>done
18:19<lneckel:#openttd>...
18:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>and make a file that is called on_server_connect.scr
18:19<lneckel:#openttd>ok...
18:19<@Rubidium:#openttd>now open that file
18:20<lneckel:#openttd>ok
18:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>and add to following to that file: say "Hello client"
18:20<lneckel:#openttd>hum...
18:20<@Rubidium:#openttd>should say 'hello client' to all clients when someone joins
18:21<lneckel:#openttd>i've tried this before, but i didn,t read about a "scripts" directories... thanks, I'll try...
18:22<lneckel:#openttd>OOOOOOO.... it works... thanks, very much!
18:23-!-Guest45 [~Dale@pool-71-98-104-215.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:25-!-ecke [~ecke@213.195.202.130] has joined #openttd
18:25-!-Roest [~schurade@p54B9C5AC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
18:32<lneckel:#openttd>hey, how can i change the servers language
18:32<lneckel:#openttd>that little flag that appears on the game...
18:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>http://wiki.openttd.org/wiki/index.php/Openttd.cfg -> server_lang
18:41<lneckel:#openttd>thanks
18:42-!-lneckel [~lneckel@189.4.116.188] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!]
18:43-!-Roujin [~chatzilla@mnch-5d85dafe.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
18:44<Roujin:#openttd>hi everyone :)
18:45<Elukka:#openttd>o/
18:47-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:47-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
18:48-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Quit: RS-SM]
18:50<Sacro:#openttd>uo
18:50<Sacro:#openttd>ö
18:51<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15302 /trunk/bin/scripts/ (3 files): -Add: example file for on_server_connect.scr and document it in the scripts readme
18:53-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd
18:54<el_en:#openttd>CONGRATULATIONS NYU.EDU FOR YOUR CAPS LOCK KEY.
18:55<Tefad:#openttd>larl
18:55<el_en:#openttd>or is it "congratulations .. on"?
18:55-!-DephNet[Paul] [~paul@host86-140-66-59.range86-140.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i'd say "for"
18:56<Tefad:#openttd>or
18:57<thingwath:#openttd>all caps and correct grammar?
18:57<Tefad:#openttd>'on your ability to use your..."
18:57<Tefad:#openttd>penis
18:57-!-smeding [~smeding@5354BE76.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:58-!-DephNet[Paul] [~paul@host86-140-66-59.range86-140.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
18:59-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@161-18-80-78.strcechy.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:10<Elukka:#openttd>hmm
19:10<Elukka:#openttd>my heightmap is 666x666 pixels by coincidence
19:11<Elukka:#openttd>i resize it shoddily in paint and end up at 666
19:11<goodger:#openttd>indeed
19:11<goodger:#openttd>you got it down to one of the nine triple-digit numbers randomly
19:12<Zahl:#openttd>THE triple-digit number
19:12<goodger:#openttd>there are nine of them
19:12<Zahl:#openttd>and there is no such thing as coincidence *speaks with spooky voice*
19:12<Elukka:#openttd>i also got 666 kills in separate battles in rome total war twice
19:12<Elukka:#openttd>when i played WoW, i often critted 666
19:12<Elukka:#openttd>clearly, i am the devil
19:13<goodger:#openttd>if you're thinking of the number of the beast, that's 616, or so it seems
19:13<Elukka:#openttd>hush
19:13<Zahl:#openttd>or maybe even just 5
19:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>or 42?
19:24<Roujin:#openttd>anyone remembers talk about the filtering of gui lists some days ago?
19:25<Roujin:#openttd>I got a working prototype of it now
19:30-!-el_en [~lanurmi@dyn-xdsl-83-150-113-243.nebulazone.fi] has quit [Quit: upgrade]
19:31-!-NukeBuster [~wouter@80.101.115.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:32-!-Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B76D30.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
19:33-!-Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B76D69.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
19:34<Roujin:#openttd>anyone can tell me quick how to check if a string starts with another string?
19:35<@Rubidium:#openttd>strncmp?
19:35-!-sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd
19:36<Roujin:#openttd>strncmp(str1, str2, length of shorter string) ?
19:36<@Rubidium:#openttd>something like that yes
19:37-!-sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:39<Roujin:#openttd>strlen > O(1) I guess?
19:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>it's definitely O(n)
19:40<@Rubidium:#openttd>where n depends on how far the first 0 byte is
19:41<Roujin:#openttd>hmm hmm.. then I'll calculate it before the loop and save it in a temp var.. ah, works! sweet :)
19:42<Roujin:#openttd>I think it's in a presentable state now.. going to upload to flyspray :)
19:44-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: from __future__ import antigravity]
19:46-!-SHRIKEE [~shrikee@84-105-52-118.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Quit: SHRIKEE]
19:50-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Quit: RS-SM]
19:51<CIA-1:#openttd>OpenTTD: smatz * r15303 /trunk/src/saveload/town_sl.cpp: -Fix (r12381): desync if a GRF used town's last month max. pass/mail
19:51-!-PhoenixII [ralph@g188103.upc-g.chello.nl] has joined #openttd
19:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>what does it matter if strlen is O(n) when strcmp is O(n) as well...
19:53-!-Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:53<SmatZ:#openttd>2 * n > n ;)
19:54-!-Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd
19:55<@Rubidium:#openttd>but it doesn't change the upper complexity bound
19:56-!-RS-SM [~RSCN@216-165-16-114.DYNAPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd
19:56-!-davis_ [~iloveme@p5B28F3FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:56<@Rubidium:#openttd>though one could argue that the string comparison is O(1) in this case
19:57<thingwath:#openttd>if we compare only strings no longer then some n, then we may say it is O(1)
19:57<SmatZ:#openttd>if they differ in the first char, then determining the length is the slowest part
19:58-!-fjb_ [~frank@p5485C6BC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
20:01-!-PhoenixII [ralph@g188103.upc-g.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:01-!-KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-60-139.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:02-!-fjb [~frank@p5485C3C8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:04-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.226] has joined #openttd
20:05<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>why is determining strlen even necessary?
20:06<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>It is possible to implement a very fast string comparison by comparing 32-bits at a time and other tricks, but is it really a critical part?
20:06-!-FR^2 [~frquadrat@frquadrat.de] has quit [Quit: Connection reset by caffein depletion...]
20:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: no, it is not, because you are comparing utf-8 strings
20:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>which means you have variable character length
20:08<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Which makes no real difference...compare bits up until they differ, then go from there with more thorough checks. Still faster than breaking into characters first.
20:09<Roujin:#openttd>eddi: because I want to use strncmp to check if string A is the beginning of string B. do you have a better solution?
20:09<Roujin:#openttd>i.e. strncmp(a, b, strlen(a))
20:09<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Roujin, is it critical that it is fast?
20:10<Roujin:#openttd>not really
20:10<Roujin:#openttd>I wouldn't break my leg to have it as fast as possible
20:10<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Then strncmp() will do fine.
20:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Roujin: but there are other functions than strncmp
20:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Roujin: basically you want to find the first differing character, and then check if the character of a at that position is 0
20:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>saves calculating the length
20:12<Roujin:#openttd>if there is already something better suited for the task in standard libs or openttd, enlighten me :)
20:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>how should i know
20:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i am not a c programmer
20:12<Roujin:#openttd>oh well
20:12<Roujin:#openttd>how should I know? ;)
20:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>in python i'd say "b.startswith(a)"
20:14<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>strncmp() is correct for standard C, but you run into issues if b is shorter than a so have to check that as well.
20:15<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: well, if he calculates strlen(a), he might as well check strlen(b), too
20:15<SmatZ:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: why? it will stop if a < b
20:15<Roujin:#openttd>Tino: If there are less than count characters in either string, then the comparison will stop after the first null termination is encountered.
20:15<SmatZ:#openttd>and return non-zero
20:17<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Oh right...forgot strncmp() was safe enough. I'm used to paranoid coding and always knowing the length of everything.
20:18<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that's why i say C/C++ is not the best language for beginner coders, there are too many side effects and corner cases to consider
20:19<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Absolutely true, but C/C++ are the best once you know what you're doing.
20:20<|Japa|:#openttd>the only programming I ever did was on my C64
20:20<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no, only they are the most common, so usually they get you the furthest
20:20-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.226] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:20<SmatZ:#openttd>I started with basic, later I came to pascal... and I hated it!
20:21<SmatZ:#openttd>so I was coding in ASM for ~6 years...
20:21-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.226] has joined #openttd
20:21<SmatZ:#openttd>but then I started using linux, so I got C compiler... and I like C/C++ since then ;)
20:21<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>I wish D would get more recognition. That's C++ done right.
20:22<SmatZ:#openttd>I miss bitfields in D :-)
20:22<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>Either that or C++0x getting finished...
20:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i liked Pascal and hated C
20:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>never did a lot of ASM
20:22<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe :)
20:22<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>C++ has std::bitset ...
20:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>ASM is fun and all, but it very soon gets very annoying if you are not heavily organised
20:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: what are the odds of them having to rename it to C++1x?
20:23<SmatZ:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: does it allow "packed unions" like bitfields? so you can access bits / bit groups in an int by names ;)
20:23<SmatZ:#openttd>btw, I like "restrict" in C99 :)
20:24<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>http://www.cppreference.com/wiki/stl/bitset/start
20:24<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>They shouldn't have to rename it to 1x. Many vendors are already implementing features from 0x, so it's getting usable.
20:25<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>TinoDidriksen: then they have to finalise it this year
20:35-!-Zahl [~Zahl@f051084166.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Rhabarberbarbarabarbarbarenbartbarbierbierbar]
20:36-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
20:36<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello all
20:37<Elukka:#openttd>hmm... tired ideas
20:38<Elukka:#openttd>why is it not possible to have two tracks on one tile, when it is done on diagonal track?
20:40<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>because nobody programmed it
20:40<Elukka:#openttd>of course, that'd introduce the problem of jamming 4 tracks on one tile on diagonals...
20:40<SmatZ:#openttd>...
20:40<SmatZ:#openttd>hello Nite_Owl :)
20:41<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello SmatZ
20:41<SmatZ:#openttd>Elukka: please come back with not-so-tired ideas :-P
20:41<Elukka:#openttd>hey, you could easily fit 2 tracks on one tile
20:41<Elukka:#openttd>hmm... should i say the R-word...
20:41<Elukka:#openttd>yes, they'd also be more realistic
20:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes, but how do you make switches between them? or to normal rail tiles?
20:41<Elukka:#openttd>damn.
20:42<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>or platforms?
20:42<Elukka:#openttd>yeah, umm.
20:42<Elukka:#openttd>i have absolutely no idea
20:42<Roujin:#openttd>finally
20:42<Elukka:#openttd>hey, it's 4 am, i have the right to be slow
20:43<TinoDidriksen:#openttd>If you really want to go realistic, you have to re-scale everything. Roads and rail should be much smaller compared to buildings.
20:43<Elukka:#openttd>uh, make stations that can accomodate tighter tracks? :P
20:43<Roujin:#openttd>updated to trunk, ironed out last tiny bugs etc. and now it's on flyspray :) http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2593
20:43<Elukka:#openttd>tino, lets not even talk of complete realism :D
20:44<|Japa|:#openttd>every station I've seen have two tracks beween a pair of platforms
20:44<SmatZ:#openttd>+// this->list_pos
20:44<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: what's that?
20:45<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Elukka: the question is a) when the platform does not fit on the track tile, how do you enforce having platforms on the neighbouring tiles? and b) how do you extend the newgrf spec and provide extensions of the default graphics?
20:45<Roujin:#openttd>SmatZ: whoops, that's nothing ^^
20:45<SmatZ:#openttd>:o)
20:45<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>|Japa|: i have seen ones that did not
20:45<Elukka:#openttd>404 - Brain not found
20:46<Roujin:#openttd>I wanted to add something there, then noticed it wasn't necessary hehe
20:47<Roujin:#openttd>instead of removing it again seems I just commented it out, embarassing :P
20:49<|Japa|:#openttd>oh come on, is it that hard to check if there's a platform adjoining the track?
20:50<|Japa|:#openttd>only problem I can see is the fact that on the diagonals there'll be 4 tracks on it
20:50<|Japa|:#openttd>that can be crowded
20:51<Elukka:#openttd>only problem, besides the huge amount of programming pains :P
20:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><|Japa|> oh come on, is it that hard to check if there's a platform adjoining the track? <- yes. it is. because the current code does not check for platforms at all, it checks for station tiles
20:51<|Japa|:#openttd>ok
20:52<|Japa|:#openttd>I'm no programmer, so I'll just keep my mouth shut now
20:52<|Japa|:#openttd>and daydream about smooth curves
20:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>how does one daydream at 3AM?
20:54<Elukka:#openttd>i give up... is anyone else able to generate heightmaps of areas?
20:54<Nite_Owl:#openttd>time zones
20:55<Elukka:#openttd>apparently the srtm plugin only runs on older versions of google earth, which dont exist or dont work anymore
21:05-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:05-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.97.61] has joined #openttd
21:15-!-nfc [nfc@cable-hvk-fe7ede00-156.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:17-!-nfc_ [nfc@cable-hvk-fe7ede00-156.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd
21:19-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.97.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:21-!-Zealotus [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:22<Roujin:#openttd>well, I'd be happy about some comments on the filtering patch.. ('sides that freak commented nonsense line, SmatZ :P hehe) If I didn't mess something up, it should be usable in all kinds of places: Filter sign list, filter purchase list for specific cargoes, etc. :)
21:22-!-Zealotus [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd
21:23<SmatZ:#openttd>interesting is there is already "Filter signs" patch
21:23<Roujin:#openttd>Yep, I know about it
21:23<Roujin:#openttd>but this is a more general approach (I hope)
21:23<SmatZ:#openttd>:o)
21:26-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
21:26-!-mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ
21:26<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: http://paste.openttd.org/179282 somehow...
21:26<Roujin:#openttd>so if these changes to GUIList were in trunk, Zuu could keep the GUI changes of his patch and define a callback function for the filtering he needs..
21:27<Roujin:#openttd>SmatZ: did you apply the second patch only?
21:27<SmatZ:#openttd>second patch? ... /me looks
21:27<SmatZ:#openttd>yes :-P
21:27<Roujin:#openttd>;)
21:29<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: http://paste.openttd.org/179283 still... with both applied
21:29<SmatZ:#openttd>http://paste.openttd.org/179284 with only base applied
21:30<@Celestar:#openttd>yay!
21:30<SmatZ:#openttd>yay, it's a Celestar! ;-)
21:31<@Celestar:#openttd>it is
21:31<Roujin:#openttd>uhm.. okay o_O I swear it compiled for me... checking...
21:31<SmatZ:#openttd>wow :)
21:31<@Celestar:#openttd>heh.
21:32<@Celestar:#openttd>@seen Darkvater
21:32<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Celestar: Darkvater was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 2 days, 5 hours, 55 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: <Darkvater> interseting
21:32<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: even gcc 4.1.2 doesn't compile it
21:33<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: gcc 3.4.6 compiles it though...
21:33<@Celestar:#openttd>hm. installing XP64 as a guest OS takes "approximately" 28 minutes
21:34<Roujin:#openttd>aha. well. I do not really know what I did that may have upset gcc 4.1.2 oO
21:34<@Celestar:#openttd>lol
21:35<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: I am using 4.3.3 :)
21:35<SmatZ:#openttd>3.4.6 is ancient :-P
21:35<SmatZ:#openttd>almost as ancient as 2.95.3 ;-)
21:35<@Celestar:#openttd>er
21:35<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
21:35<@Celestar:#openttd>"almost"
21:36<Roujin:#openttd>well, I am using MSVC right now, and that didn't complain either :P
21:36-!-fjb_ is now known as fjb
21:37-!-angelo [~angelo@ppp-94-65-240-222.home.otenet.gr] has quit []
21:37<SmatZ:#openttd>well it compiles with -fpermissive ;)
21:38<SmatZ:#openttd>but it's not in CFLAGS for OTTD
21:38<Roujin:#openttd>okay I see what I did there
21:39<Roujin:#openttd>just a naming issue
21:39<SmatZ:#openttd>hmmm no it doesn't compile with -fpermissive, I forgot to switch gcc
21:39<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
21:40<Roujin:#openttd>I named a function "Filter", but also a struct.
21:40<SmatZ:#openttd>no gcc 3.4.6 doesn't compile it neither
21:40<SmatZ:#openttd>...... I failed
21:40<SmatZ:#openttd>badlt
21:40<SmatZ:#openttd>badly
21:40<SmatZ:#openttd>Roujin: most likely ;)
21:40-!-Mark_ [~M4rk@5351EC68.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:42<Roujin:#openttd>well well the difference between compilers :P should I hate gcc now that it doesn't like what I did, or MSVC that it didn't give me any hint that I'm possibly doing a stupid thing? :D
21:43<Roujin:#openttd>going to rename the stuff and upload a new version quick..
21:43<SmatZ:#openttd>hate MSVC
21:43<SmatZ:#openttd>everyone who uses both hates MSVC
21:51<SmatZ:#openttd>(I don't(
21:59<goodger:#openttd>you should always blame MSVC
22:00<@Celestar:#openttd>only sometimes?
22:00<goodger:#openttd>no, no
22:01<goodger:#openttd>always
22:01<goodger:#openttd>do read things properly, Celestar
22:01<SmatZ:#openttd>grep sometimes logs | wc -l
22:01<@Celestar:#openttd>oh. I read "should not"
22:01<SmatZ:#openttd>0
22:01<SmatZ:#openttd>:-P
22:01<SmatZ:#openttd>hehe
22:01-!-stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-228-38.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:01-!-TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:05-!-TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
22:07<Roujin:#openttd>so... finally. I hope this compiles on gcc now too
22:08<Roujin:#openttd>but now I have to catch some sleep.. much too late already -__-
22:09<Roujin:#openttd>see you soon, then
22:09<SmatZ:#openttd>night night :)
22:09-!-Roujin [~chatzilla@mnch-5d85dafe.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]]
22:14<@Celestar:#openttd>can anyone recommend some free antivirus for XP? :P
22:14<+glx:#openttd>avg
22:14<+glx:#openttd>or avast
22:15-!-Backiz [~Backiz@a91-152-224-24.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd
22:15<+glx:#openttd>but I don't know if they are compatible with xp64
22:17<Nite_Owl:#openttd>http://free.avg.com/
22:18<@Celestar:#openttd>thanks
22:18<@Celestar:#openttd>I only need to turn the netnotworking into networking
22:19<goodger:#openttd>don't use AVG...
22:19<goodger:#openttd>it's gone the way of norton
22:20-!-Backiz [~Backiz@a91-152-224-24.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has left #openttd []
22:20<Nite_Owl:#openttd>what is better?
22:20<Nite_Owl:#openttd>for free that is
22:21<+glx:#openttd>I have no problem with avg
22:21-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving]
22:22<Nite_Owl:#openttd>neither do I except that it is no longer going to support the ancient OS I use on some of my computers
22:23<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Windows 98 for the curious
22:24<+glx:#openttd>my win98 box is still on 6.5
22:25-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
22:25<Nite_Owl:#openttd>7.5 here but AVG support stops at the end of Feb
22:27-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
22:32-!-TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:33-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:33-!-JapaMala is now known as |Japa|
22:35-!-TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
22:36-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
22:36-!-mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ
22:41-!-Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd
22:44<@Celestar:#openttd>dis AVG stuff costs money, doesn't it?
22:45<goodger:#openttd>nope
22:45<goodger:#openttd>just... don't use it
22:45<+glx:#openttd>avg free edition is free
22:45<goodger:#openttd>it's gone the way of norton, as I said. poking its tendrils into your system
22:45<@Celestar:#openttd>goodger: other suggestions?
22:46<+glx:#openttd>it's easily uninstalable (unlike norton)
22:46<@Celestar:#openttd>maybe I should install Sophos
22:46<goodger:#openttd>I hear good things about avast
22:46<goodger:#openttd>it's the AVG of the twenty-first century
22:46-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:47-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
22:48<Nite_Owl:#openttd>no - AVG has a free version
22:48<goodger:#openttd>indeed
22:48<goodger:#openttd>thanks go to glx for that information
22:48<+glx:#openttd>the free version doesn't have all the things similar to norton
22:49<goodger:#openttd>it's still slow, though
22:49<Nite_Owl:#openttd>sorry - I got dropped and missed a bit
22:50<@Celestar:#openttd>ls
22:52<@Celestar:#openttd>I'm trying avast
22:53-!-Nite_Owl_ [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
22:54-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:54*Celestar:#openttd thinks the mozilla devs should be executed for setting the default download location to the desktop
22:54-!-Nite_Owl_ is now known as Nite_Owl
22:56-!-Celestar_ [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DBD9A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
22:56-!-Celestar_ [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DBD9A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit []
22:56<Nite_Owl:#openttd>it is easy to change the download location
22:57<goodger:#openttd>*nod*
22:58<Nite_Owl:#openttd>tools -> options -> main
22:59<Nite_Owl:#openttd>although this is an old version of Firefox - it may have changed
23:00-!-Zorni [zorn@e177239060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd
23:01<+glx:#openttd>I set it to "ask"
23:02-!-fjb [~frank@p5485C6BC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
23:02-!-Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0D9A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:03<Nite_Owl:#openttd>I use a specific 'download' folder
23:08-!-Zorn [zorn@e177226248.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:13-!-glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye]
23:14-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-211-146-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Read You Soon]
23:37-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:38-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
23:40-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
23:42-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@ip-105.imafexbb.sk] has quit [Quit: Quit]
23:43-!-_|Japa|_ [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
23:44-!-michi_cc [12d52b9a7f@dude.icosahedron.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:46-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:46-!-_|Japa|_ is now known as |Japa|
23:49-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:50-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
23:50-!-TinoDid [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
23:52-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:54-!-JapaMala [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has joined #openttd
23:56-!-|Japa| [~Japa@117.201.96.234] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:56-!-JapaMala is now known as |Japa|
23:57-!-TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
---Logclosed Sun Feb 01 00:00:39 2009