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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-02-13

---Logopened Fri Feb 13 00:00:07 2009
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03:35<Flow>hi, hmm what i found: on vista - there is a specialfolder "Saved Games" - but openttd doesnt use it - it writes savegames and co into my documents - why don't you use FOLDERID_SavedGames to get that path?
03:35<Flow>(for shgetfolderpath)
03:36<dihedral>perhaps because vista was released way after OpenTTD had support for windows
03:36<dihedral>and in those days that folder did not exist
03:36<dihedral>+ you are the first vista user in here who even mentions that folder
03:37<Flow>hehe okay, better late then never ;)
03:37<dihedral>if that folder were standard, and all vista users playing openttd never even knew that folder existed, we would have a bunch of support time just because they cannot find savegames, config, grf files ......
03:38<dihedral>and no - that would not be solved by adding it to the readme file
03:38<dihedral>as most people dont even look into that file
03:38<planetmaker>good morning #openttd
03:38<dihedral>else they'd know where to find their savegames, grfs, config file, etc.
03:38<Flow>okay, but that folder is shown in your user profile directly, so you dont have to search more than for "documents"
03:38<dihedral>good morning planetmaker
03:38<planetmaker>hey dihedral :)
03:38<dihedral>and now i have to catch a bus to head to work
03:39<Flow>you could create a link to that dir then - for those who are not able to read a readme ;)
03:39<dihedral>none of them default "users" are able to do anything
03:39<dihedral>heck they even have probs with finding the files on their "Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM"
03:40<Flow>yes sure, but it would be a good thing to clean up those directory-structures, so I told you that there is a special folder for that kind of stuff ;)
03:40<Flow>you dont have to do that - I only asked myself ;)
03:41<planetmaker>actually.... not that opengfx exists, it would be nice, if OpenTTD could get it from bananas, if it doesn't find ANY basegrf (e.g. after a fresh, new install). Currently it just tells you to get tr...grf and
03:41<Flow>most people dont know about special folders at all, they put all there documents directly to C:\ and wonder why they dont find anything ;)
03:41<planetmaker>true indeed
03:43<Flow>for "newbie"-users you could create an installer like "please enter your ttd-cd and press Continue" XD
03:44<planetmaker>I think there exists a MSI installer.
03:44<planetmaker>Not sure about the TTD-CD part, though
03:45<Flow>no - i thought of it in the "oh no - please enter cd that I can copy it for you..."-part of the game ;)
03:47<planetmaker>yes, I understood that :) I'm just not sure what the existing installer actually *does*
03:47<planetmaker>(I don't run ottd on windows)
03:48<Flow>yea okay ;) i only have it on windows - my girlfriend only has vista on her laptop ;)
03:49<Flow>hmm O.o "TRGIR.GRF" is missing or corrupt - but if i press enter it works? and the file surely exists? I installed ttd 2mins ago
03:50<planetmaker>well... you may find errors later. Better copy it from your TTD CD :)
03:50<planetmaker>if they all miss, ottd won't start
03:51<Flow>hmm i recopied it - same thing?
03:53<planetmaker>copied to the data folder?
03:53<planetmaker>all of them?
03:53<Flow>thats the only file he complains about, but it exists, 324kb
03:54<planetmaker>maybe your original is corrupt
03:54<planetmaker>or you have one in the local folder and one in the global and it finds the corrupt first
03:55<Flow>aahh lol -.- i had my "ttd and ttdpatch-package" on my usb stick ;) so the trgir was patched
03:55<Flow>damn ... im so stupid XD
03:55<planetmaker>patched? For what does it need patching?
03:56<Flow>don't know, but it changes some bytes in there
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03:58<Roest>is anyone here compiling ottd on windows?
03:59<Flow>no sorry, no compiler here on that laptop
04:04<Flow>hmm another suggestion: if I build a station near a coalmine or similar, it creates a "townname's mine" - but near a powerplant it names it "townsname west/east/north..." why not "townsname's powerplant"?
04:05<FauxFaux>'cos stations aren't called that in England. ¬_¬
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04:06<Flow>FauxFaux: ;)
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04:20<dihedral>Flow, "is missing or corrupt" <- openttd has the checksum of the files, if your files checksum do not match what OpenTTD expects that is the message you get
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04:21<dihedral>Roest, you could ask Alain - he is (wanting to) compile on windows
04:21<dihedral>and hello
04:21<Roest>nah problem solved already
04:21<Roest>i'll ask alain when i need to patch it
04:21<dihedral>planetmaker, did you pick up on the messages that duck left?
04:22<planetmaker>uh... no?
04:22<dihedral>hihi - was funny
04:22<dihedral>like "i can change my ip"
04:22*Forked can too
04:23<Forked>why would one want to though?
04:23<planetmaker>dihedral: so... did he leave your channel, too? :D
04:23<planetmaker>Forked: in order to circumvent the bans posed on him
04:23<dihedral>did not even have to do anything
04:23<dihedral>he is still in #openttd.ap though
04:23<planetmaker>he :P
04:24<Forked>trick is not to get banned in the first place
04:24<dihedral>Forked, he sees himself as a oh-so-wonderful FPS game player
04:24<planetmaker>Forked: indeed. But he really made an effort to get there quickly
04:24<dihedral>which gives him the right (at least in his opinion) to have bad attitude
04:25<Forked>if I changed "my" IP my gf would give me a beating :\ she has had this IP for.. uh.. some years now
04:25<planetmaker>he :)
04:25<planetmaker>I guess I have another every 24h...
04:25<Forked>ISP has static IPs for DSL customers, but since I work here.. :p
04:25<planetmaker>well. Not with this computer, but...
04:26<planetmaker>... I'm still happy I got x.y.z.42 here :)
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04:26<Forked>I get to play with dns entries for the IP :) great fun
04:27<planetmaker>the IT person was actually quite surprised to see it still free when I came and asked for an IP for my computer :)
04:28<Forked>sorta geeky request :)
04:29<Roest>it's all geeks here
04:29*Forked plans on a day with cargodest and IS tomorrow
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04:31*dihedral gets a new ip every night
04:31<dihedral>sucks big time
04:31<planetmaker>well... there are worse things :)
04:32<dihedral>there are?
04:32<Roest>i don't care about the new ip, the 24h disconnect sucks more
04:33<planetmaker>well. At 4:30 am I'm usually asleep as are my computers at home.
04:33<dihedral>Roest, yes
04:33<dihedral>planetmaker, usually
04:33<dihedral>but there are exceptions to prove the rule
04:33<Ammler>dihedral: privacy
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04:33<planetmaker>well, yeah. My WiFi is anyway disabled between 1 and 7am.
04:34<Roest>i wish i could set my router to do it at a given time
04:34<planetmaker>dihedral: there're always exceptions
04:34<planetmaker>Roest: I can :)
04:34<Roest>anyway pm i'm turning oyu in, microsoft offered 250k $ for hints on the author of the conficker worm
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04:35<planetmaker>:P go right ahead. I'm not seeing the connection, but well, I hope you tell me :)
04:35<Roest>don't deny it
04:35<Roest>you just have to play along till i get the money
04:36<planetmaker>go to #hell and ask the guys there ;) There we can talk about it :P
04:36<planetmaker>Or... I take advance money, sufficient in order to buy an island...
04:36<Roest>interesting there are 3 guy in #hell
04:36<planetmaker>but I guess... 250k is not sufficient :)
04:36<planetmaker>yep :P
04:36<planetmaker>it's even a registered channel afaik
04:37<Roest>[10:36] * Topic is 'omg'
04:37<planetmaker>hehe, yes :)
04:37<dihedral>what about #heaven
04:37<dihedral>oh - we are already there :-P
04:39<Roest>anyway guys, stop distracting micheal blunck with translations and other stuff, he should only work on the next version of the db set
04:39<dihedral>we dont destract him - he does that all by himself
04:39<planetmaker>and new stations and new ships and new houses and... probably I missed at least two projects he talks about ;)
04:40<planetmaker>he should upload it to bananas :P
04:45<dihedral>and complete opengfx
04:46<planetmaker>that's not his business :P
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05:18<Brianetta>OpenGFX? Blunck works on that?
05:19<dihedral>hello Brianetta
05:19<Brianetta>I was going to say
05:19<Brianetta>I'd be surprised, he despises OpenTTD
05:19<Timitry>I hope Zephyris finds time to finish OpenGFX
05:19<Timitry>FooBar is now unfortunately rather workin on FIRS
05:19<Ammler>only some houses and engines for monolev
05:19<Timitry>(which might get fantastic, but i'd rather see OpenGFX finished first) ;-)
05:20<dihedral>Timitry, i am sure if you do some pixel drawings Zephyris would code it for you ;-)
05:21<Timitry>I rather try learning C++ in the spare free time that i have :)
05:22<dihedral>Alain can help you there - he's going through the same issues
05:23<Timitry>The guy with the patchpack? :D
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05:23<Timitry>I'll rather start with small projects ;-)
05:23<dihedral>he does not have one yet :-P
05:24<dihedral>like pixel drawing
05:24<planetmaker>[11:23] <Timitry> I'll rather start with small projects ;-) <-- sounds sensible :)
05:24<planetmaker>though... my motivation was kind of the same back then :P
05:24<planetmaker>but starting small is always good.
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05:25<planetmaker> /2 ;)
05:25*dihedral needs some coders and grf authors
05:25*Roest can't code
05:25<dihedral>Eddi :-)
05:25<Ammler>only hack ;-)
05:25<dihedral>uh yeah
05:26<dihedral>no Ammler: not only hack
05:26<dihedral>only hack if there is no other way
05:26<Ammler>(was refering to roest)
05:26<dihedral>me too :-P
05:26<dihedral>well also
05:26<dihedral>@seen Celestar
05:26<@DorpsGek>dihedral: Celestar was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 2 days, 22 hours, 35 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: <Celestar> great*
05:26<Timitry>The problem with me is that i always like to start to learn something, but am not very persistent...
05:27<Ammler>celestar would have other work, if he has time ;-)
05:27<Timitry>Just like the website for my judo-club, started but never finished...
05:27<dihedral>that is something websites just attrackt
05:27<dihedral>and patch packs
05:27<dihedral>or IN's
05:28<Ammler>but celestar showed already interests in combining IS and cargodest
05:29<Timitry>I'd prefer to have a finished CS first :D
05:29<Roest>cargo sharing?
05:30<Ammler>seems like nobody is able to make nice homepages without fixed widths.
05:31<Timitry>Well, that's due to the crappy IE6
05:31<Timitry>I really tried, but did not manage it...
05:31<Timitry>Problem was the header graphic
05:32<Roest>only thing IE6 users should see is "update your fucking browser"
05:32*Roest hates developing for IE6 with a passion
05:34<dihedral>Ammler: you can use em as width ;-)
05:34<Timitry>Having the red-black transition as background, putting the two logos on top of that and a text in the middle...
05:34<Timitry>With IE --> Forget it
05:34*TrueBrain is so happy OpenTTD website looks pretty simular in most browsers ... :) (just a random comment, didn't read this conversation at all :p)
05:35<Timitry>I think version 6 does not even know min-width...
05:35<Ammler>TrueBrain: but also fixed ;-)
05:36<TrueBrain>Ammler: small penalty to pay ;)
05:36<Ammler>yeah, seems so, the majority of websites tell that.
05:37<Timitry>And since i integrated lightbox2 on my website, i'm getting aware on how much websites use this :)
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05:40<Timitry>Quote Ammler: "seems like nobody is able to make nice homepages without fixed widths." --> The problem with non-fixed widths is readability... The columns just get too large and make it hard to read the text, but i guess you know that. However, i tried with a variable width from 800px up to somewhat like 1300px, but IE screwed that
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05:58<dihedral>^ lies
05:58<dihedral>you just joined
05:59<TrueBrain>dihedral: you are so weird
06:00<dihedral>whole heartedly
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07:34<dihedral>i received a private message.... on the forums: "what's irc"
07:35<TrueBrain>not everyone is as brilliant as you are dihedral ;) :p
07:36<dihedral>b-words come to mind TrueBrain
07:36<@Rubidium>that's an question to be asked google...
07:36<dihedral>hehe - create a magic-google-ball :-D
07:36<TrueBrain>they all apply to me, I know I know :)
07:37<|Japa|>along with blatant liar
07:37<dihedral>bastard, bloody <other 'nice' word>, bitch, ....
07:38<Forked>you don
07:38<Forked>'t have to be smart to know what irc is
07:38<Forked>just look at me :)
07:38<TrueBrain>Forked: who said anything about needing to be smart? :p
07:39<Forked>brilliant == smart?
07:39<|Japa|>no, means shiny
07:39<TrueBrain>is it? :)
07:39<|Japa|>as in: a brilliant white light
07:39<dihedral>there you are
07:39<Forked>smartest white light ever
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08:02*Rubidium wonders who have to pay for IRC
08:03<TrueBrain>Rubidium: you don't pay for access?
08:03<planetmaker>TrueBrain: but I guess most people nowadays pay a flatrate
08:03<|Japa|>I don't
08:03<planetmaker>so it doesn't matter.
08:03<@Rubidium>well, I pay for my internet connection, but I don't pay for IRC itself
08:03<|Japa|>I use a friends connection
08:03<planetmaker>yep ^^ :)
08:03<TrueBrain>flatrate for IRC?
08:04<planetmaker>TrueBrain: no. For Internet :)
08:04<TrueBrain>you are WEIRD!
08:04<planetmaker>Paying for IRC would surely hurt me :)
08:04<DASPRiD>pay for IRC? uh?
08:04<TrueBrain>planetmaker: we talked about IRC, if you would have read what was said correctly :)
08:04<TrueBrain>DASPRiD: so you are here illegal? :p
08:04<@Rubidium>apparantly some people have to pay for using/connecting? to IRC
08:05<DASPRiD>poor people
08:05*TrueBrain calls 0900-ILLEGALIRCUSERS
08:05<planetmaker>TrueBrain: I read that. And I pointed out due to an internet flatrate it isn't necessary to pay for IRC :)
08:05*DASPRiD calls TrueBrain's mom
08:05<planetmaker>But I guess... words and puns and ... :P
08:05<TrueBrain>planetmaker: so due to the internet flatrate, you don't have to pay for porno websites?
08:06<TrueBrain>weird conclusions ..
08:06<TrueBrain>as we say in dutch: "dat slaat als een lul op een varken"
08:06<planetmaker>yep :P
08:06<DASPRiD>well this server doesnt required a payed account, so
08:06<TrueBrain>or as I raid yesterday: "that is comparing apples with carrots"
08:06<DASPRiD>TrueBrain, ik ben ben!
08:06<planetmaker>hehe :)
08:07<@Rubidium>TrueBrain: okay, lets rephrase it for you: if you are connected with MSN, do you need to pay EXTRA for connecting to IRC?
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08:07<TrueBrain>Rubidium: for me? What did I do wrong :(
08:07<DASPRiD>everything ...
08:07<TrueBrain>I was just pointing out the flaw in planetmaker's thinking :p
08:08<planetmaker>:P I prefer the interpretation of "Truebrain willing to understand" :P
08:08<TrueBrain>but to answer: no, I only have to pay extra when I am not connected to MSN .. stupid Microsoft ... always finding ways to get money from us :(
08:08<TrueBrain>planetmaker: fair enough
08:08<TrueBrain>DASPRiD: fair enough
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08:09<planetmaker>darn.... +not ;)
08:09<TrueBrain>planetmaker: ghehe
08:09<TrueBrain>I am going to play a bit more F.E.A.R. 2 .. you guys are boring :p
08:10*planetmaker yawns
08:11<TrueBrain>that game is really good :) I have troubles putting it away :)
08:11<TrueBrain>played it for 10+ hours in the last 48 hours ... might be a bit sick :p
08:11*planetmaker hands TrueBrain one of his nice, tiny magnets
08:11<planetmaker>That can solve the issue :P
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08:22<DASPRiD>TrueBrain, is your pc fast enough for that? ;P
08:28<|Japa|>I understood ity perfectly
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08:29<|Japa|>but I think it would be better to use one of those magnets that can snap your fingeroff if your not carefull
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08:37<Roest>planetmaker do you still have high hopes?
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08:47<planetmaker>Roest: no
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08:48<Roest>but good post, that's what i wanted to tell him
08:48<planetmaker>I would have higher hopes, if he had demonstrated that he a) could compile trunk and b) could compile a patched trunk (correct revision)
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09:03<Roest>captain dihedral tot he bridge
09:04<Roest>we have an emergency question that needs to be answered
09:04<Roest>How do i compile it i cant see it were is the buton in TortoiseSVN to compile open ttd
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09:12*valhalla1w slaps Roest
09:12<valhalla1w>tortoiseSVN is an svn client, not a compiler :P
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09:13<Sacro>valhallasw: wrong
09:13<Sacro>tortoiseSVN is a frontend
09:13<Sacro>svn is an svn client
09:13<@Rubidium>Sacro: that's a frontend too...
09:13<Sacro>to what?
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09:14<Roest>valhallasw i did only forward the question to support operative dihedral
09:14<@Rubidium>tortoisesvn does also talk directly with libsvn
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09:16<valhallasw>Sacro: "A Subversion client, implemented as a windows shell extension.", as stated on
09:16<Sacro>i thought it was a wrapper
09:17<valhallasw>Roest: oh, wait, that's someone elses post on the forum? :P
09:17<@Rubidium>a random applause for valhallasw ;)
09:17<TrueBrain>DASPRiD: I have a nice xbox
09:17<|Japa|>my box is better
09:17<valhallasw>Rubidium: well, I don't read up further than the last 20 lines generally
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09:18<DASPRiD>TrueBrain, xbox is slooow :x
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09:41<planetmaker>DASPRiD: there's an English university which uses them in a cluster as high performance computer :)
09:41<planetmaker>maybe it was some other console, but some of that kind :)
09:41<Sacro>xbox cluster = sweet
09:42<planetmaker>hehe. That explains the sales of xboxes: computer clusters :P
09:43<SmatZ> like this?
09:44<planetmaker>might well be, SmatZ. I don't recall exactly. Been some time I read it.
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09:49<planetmaker>hello sir Belugas :)
09:52<@Belugas>hello indeed ho Maker of Planets
09:52<@Belugas>ooop.... sorry... you have notyet upgraded... still making one planet :)
09:54<planetmaker>lol :)
09:54<planetmaker>I'm only capable of making on at a time... or I'd bear a different nick... like
09:54<planetmaker>solar-system-maker :P or something
09:55<planetmaker>planets without stars are no fun...
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09:58<TrueBrain>DASPRiD: if you think an xbox is slow, you never played on any
09:58<TrueBrain>damn, finished FEAR2 ... good game .. good game :)
09:58<DASPRiD>i did
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09:58<Sacro>planetmaker: zartiblatfast?
09:59<Sacro>slartibartfast even >M
09:59<Sacro>has been a whlie since i read it
10:00<planetmaker>well... whatever :P
10:00<planetmaker>that word doesn't make sense to me :)
10:01<Roest>yea rrrrrrrright
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10:03*Roest wonders if Alain is a real person or someone making fun of us
10:06<planetmaker>He'll be real. He's playing on dih's server.
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10:22<dihedral>lol @ Roest
10:28<dihedral>alain seems to be a real twerp!
10:28<dihedral>i mean - it's worse than i had expected in the first place
10:29<dihedral>and planetmaker granted him the benefit of the doubt.... :-D
10:29*Forked ponders about punching out just to play openttd
10:30*planetmaker ponders about granting myself now the benefit of a weekend start :)
10:30*planetmaker decided on 'yes' :D
10:30<planetmaker>see you later :)
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10:41<Roest>man this is going to kill me, today is the date for the first review cycle notification for the eurovis, i wish they'd send it out already
10:44<TrueBrain>you are weird
10:45<Roest>why ?
10:46<TrueBrain>because I say so
10:46<Roest>i mean i knew that already, just thought i'd get a reason
10:46<TrueBrain>why specify such things?
10:47<TrueBrain>seems unreasonable to expect that of me
10:47<Roest>you never know
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10:48<TrueBrain>that is true for sure
10:50<dihedral>of course TrueBrain never knows
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11:04<dihedral>"hello computer"
11:04<Forked>ello master
11:05-!-kingj is now known as KingJ
11:06<Roest>a computer with a french accent?
11:07<Forked>it will cham you
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11:26<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r15466 /trunk/src/ai/ai_info.cpp: -Fix (r15330): The squirrel instance object was freed twice if an info.nut failed to compile.
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12:17<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r15467 /trunk/src/ (7 files in 2 dirs): -Fix [NoAI]: AIs with an error in their info.nut are no longer available in-game.
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12:32<Roest>rubidium spieler = player which of course could mean company in that case
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12:36<@Rubidium>Roest: in any case it was wrong and it currently is wrong
12:36<Yexo>it's not only in german though, english has the same text (2-8)
12:36<@Rubidium>and if it means company, then single player can be Mehrspieler too
12:36<@Rubidium>hmm... who wrote that?
12:37<Roest>no i meant spieler translates as player which wouldn't mean company in the language but a player could be understood as company in that environment
12:38<@Rubidium> <- that would fix english
12:38<@Rubidium>just don't mention the number of players ;)
12:39<Roest>that makes it y3k safe
12:39<Yexo>Rubidium: wouldn't it be better to remove the string from all other languages so they're force to correct it?
12:45<@Rubidium>hmm, I think there should be a more thorough review of the current english strings
12:46<@Rubidium>seems to me that there're quite some strings that aren't used anymore
12:46<@Belugas>watch out, some are maybe not explicitely used, but are referenced by incrementing the base one
12:46<@Belugas>thus implicit use
12:47<@Belugas>granted, it'snot the case of all those "unused"
12:47<@Rubidium>Belugas: I know
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12:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15468 /trunk/src/lang/ (47 files in 2 dirs): -Fix: reword the multiplayer tooltip so it doesn't mention the (incorrect) number of players anymore.
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12:55<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15469 /trunk/src/lang/english.txt: -Fix (r15468): why doesn't subversion trigger the save of my text editor before doing the commit?
12:56<frosch123>the man who can faster commit than his editor can save :)
12:57<el_en>your word order a little germanic sounds.
12:57<frosch123>maybe it is just old english
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13:01<@petern>maybe it was just wrong
13:06<planetmaker>[18:39] <Yexo> Rubidium: wouldn't it be better to remove the string from all other languages so they're force to correct it? <--- I would disagree. I think the translators think about what the function does.
13:06<planetmaker>word by word translations are often more a fail than not
13:06<Yexo>I think the translators think about what the function does. <- I hope they do, but I think a lot of them don't
13:07<planetmaker>Yexo: it's the easier way not to, sure :)
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13:07<planetmaker>But to fix the non obvious errors, that's what we started the German translation topic in the forums for.
13:08<Yexo>planetmaker: just take a look at the removed strings, almost all of them had 2-8 (only bulgarian had 1-7 for some reason)
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13:09<Nite_Owl>Hello all
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13:20<Nite_Owl>Reformatted the hard drive, reinstalled Windows XP and all the proper drivers, and now the PC is caught in a boot up loop - that is it gets to the windows loading screen, goes to a black screen, and then back to the windows loading screen in an endless loop. I plan on going into windows repair and trying to fix the boot sector etc. but any other advice would be appreciated.
13:22<SpComb>Nite_Owl: black screen, as in BIOS bootup?
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13:22<SpComb>if it reboots during windows-bootup, then it's probably BSOD'ing
13:23<Prof_Frink>But with BSODs turned off.
13:23<Alberth>The 'B' means Black here, obviously :)
13:24<Nite_Owl>no BIOS boot up - no key press
13:25<Nite_Owl>The black screen only lasts a second before the windows loading screen comes back around
13:26<SpComb>sounds wierd
13:26<Nite_Owl>normally it would go from the black screen onto the windows desktop
13:30<Nite_Owl>I have been playing around with this one for over a week and cannot get it back to a stable condition
13:31<Nite_Owl>Boot sector repair is the last possibility and if that does not work then the thing is toast. I could try replacing the hard drive but...
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13:34<Nite_Owl>tried that - the memory and the motherboard are fine as far as I can tell
13:40<Nite_Owl>I will give it one last shot tomorrow if what I have in mind does not work then it will be up to them to decide if they want to replace the hard drive or get a new tower/system
13:42<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: if your OS boots, it is not your boot sector which is damaged ...
13:43<TrueBrain>and most likely you installed a driver which makes windows BSOD .. wouldn't be the first time ..
13:44<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r15470 /trunk/src/ai/ai_info.cpp: -Fix [NoAI]: Check the types of the parameters passed to AddSetting, AddLabels and RegisterAI.
13:44<Nite_Owl>the OS (winXP) does not boot - it starts to then loops back which is what lead me to believe it could be the boot sector
13:44<TrueBrain>you say you see the windows loading screen
13:44<TrueBrain>this is WAY past the boot sector ...
13:45<TrueBrain>try pressing F8 .. if you get a menu, it is not your bootsector :)
13:45<TrueBrain>(if it is, btw, your BIOS will error out with telling you something nifty)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r15471 /trunk/src/lang/ (6 files in 2 dirs):
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-02-13 18:45:45
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: dutch - 12 changed by Excel20 (12)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: finnish - 1 fixed by jpx_ (1)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: french - 1 fixed, 2 changed by glx (3)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: luxembourgish - 333 fixed by Gubius (333)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: ukrainian - 5 fixed by mad (5)
13:46<Nite_Owl>and it was working fine for 3 days prior to this - the F8 does give a menu - darn, what could it be then?
13:47<TrueBrain>[19:43] <TrueBrain> and most likely you installed a driver which makes windows BSOD .. wouldn't be the first time ..
13:47<+glx>looks like a driver problem :)
13:47<TrueBrain>I generally hate repeating myself :p
13:47<TrueBrain>in the F8 menu, do: Load Last Known Good Configuration
13:47<TrueBrain>if you didn't disable that feature, it most of the time loads
13:47<+glx>check video driver (usually it's the faulty one)
13:47<TrueBrain>with the lost of a few drivers and windows updates, most of the time
13:47<TrueBrain>and if you are lucky safemode does load
13:47<TrueBrain>depending on which driver fucks up ...
13:48<TrueBrain>glx: how to check if you can't boot? ;) :p
13:48<+glx>safemode :)
13:48<TrueBrain>:) I hope for Nite_Owl that safemode loads ;)
13:48<+glx>and you can force VGA too
13:48<TrueBrain>true :)
13:49<goodger>I think you mean SVGA
13:49<+glx>no I mean VGA
13:49<TrueBrain>oh dear, goodger knows better again ...
13:49<KingJ>What's the command to enable the magic bulldoser cheat on a dedicated server?
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13:50<goodger>IIRC, windows XP's safe mode operates in 800x600 at 256 colours
13:50<Nite_Owl>according to the owner (not the most reliable source) she could not go to Last Known option because the keyboard would not work
13:50<+glx>KingJ: cheats are disabled for multiplayer
13:50<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: hahahaha :) Get a PS/2 keyboard, and plug it in :)
13:50<+glx>TrueBrain: try that on a dell ;)
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13:51<TrueBrain>glx: the dells without ps/2 have correct usb keyboard detection at bios level :) Well .. the ones I had in my hands :p
13:51<KingJ>Ah that's a shame, magic bulldoser is the only cheat I ever turn on
13:51<Nite_Owl>it is a Dell - I will bring an old keyboard - it does have a PS/2 port
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13:52<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: yeah .. some usb keyboards are not detected on those old machines ;)
13:52<TrueBrain>won't even let you in the bios ... annoying :p
13:52<Nite_Owl>She has a wireless keyboard
13:52<TrueBrain>even worse :p
13:53<+glx>if they implement BIOS stuff they should ;)
13:53<TrueBrain>but okay, the wireless keyboard most likely is just an usb keyboard, seen from the system
13:53*glx played with USB stuff recently (built a joypad adapter)
13:53<TrueBrain>glx: cool :)
13:53-!-goodger [] has left #openttd [+++ Rebooting Universe, Please Try Again Later +++]
13:53<Nite_Owl>I did not have her try to get into the BIOS over the phone - too risky
13:54<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: and no much she could do there anyway ;) Was just pointing out the keyboard is only detected by the OS .. rather annoying :)
13:54<Aali>funny tidbit; legacy keyboard emulation with a certain combination of BIOS and linux makes SMP systems unbootable
13:55<TrueBrain>strange things between BIOS and OS are not rare :) Far from it ..
13:55<Aali>happened on a newly assembled server of mine
13:55<Aali>if it weren't for google I would never have figured it out
13:56<TrueBrain>so you did send them money for it, I hope? :p
13:56<Aali>non-SMP kernel worked flawlessly, SMP kernel borked with a million errors and rebooted
13:56<+glx>even worse with USB ;)
13:57<Nite_Owl>Ah well it will be a fun day tomorrow - thank you all for the advice
13:57<TrueBrain>Aali: most problems are solved in 2.6.26+ kernels btw
13:57<TrueBrain>but SMP in general gave errors from time to time with older ones ;)
13:57<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: good luck :)
13:57<TrueBrain>happy driver-hunting
13:57<TrueBrain>one of the worst parts of Windows ....................
13:57<+glx>usually it's video :)
13:57<Aali>that server is running 2.6.25 :P
13:58<TrueBrain>glx: I have had it with my ATA driver, with my audio driver, with my video driver, and with a usb (!) driver ...
13:58<TrueBrain>but yeah, in general it is the video driver :)
13:58<Aali>unless you have a creative sound card
13:58<TrueBrain>the ATA one was the hardest to detect :(
13:58<+glx>anyway for dell, always use dell drivers
13:58<TrueBrain>from ;)
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13:58<Aali>creative makes the shittiest drivers ever
13:58<TrueBrain>morning DaleStan
13:59<+glx>I'm still trying to find why my father's dell sometimes hang
13:59<Nite_Owl>I have already spent many days trying to fix this one so just one more could not hurt too much
13:59<TrueBrain>I still wonder why they sold me a T5750 and claimed it supported VT-X :(
14:00<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: I hope she is pretty
14:02<Nite_Owl>she is my older cousin so it does not even count in those terms or in 'getting paid' terms although she will usually give me some money but not as much as I usually charge
14:02<Nite_Owl>still you do what you can for family
14:03<TrueBrain>hmm .. so 'pretty' is not relavant too
14:03<TrueBrain>sad :p
14:04<Nite_Owl>Hmmm - I better bring a mouse too just in case
14:04<+glx>mous is not important ;)
14:04<+glx>you can do everything without it
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14:05<+glx>but if install worked then keyboard worked too
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14:06<Nite_Owl>up until this boot loop problem everything worked fine - granted it only lasted a few days and then went nuts again
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14:18<Nite_Owl>Once again thank you all for your advice
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14:25<TrueBrain>Nite_Owl: those who do nice, receive nice ;)
14:26<TrueBrain>Mortal: can I suggest getting a more stable connection?
14:26<Mortal>sorry TrueBrain, that's my irc client plugin crashing
14:26<Mortal>I can turn autoconnect off for oftc if you'd like
14:27<TrueBrain>I think it is more useful if you have an irc client which doesn't cash all the time ;)
14:30<TrueBrain>haha, Marusha - Over the rainbow .. that is an old song :)
14:31<@Rubidium>depends on what one would classify as old
14:32<TrueBrain>(but that might have been very obvious)
14:32<@Rubidium>how would you classify something from like 1230?
14:33<TrueBrain>sorry, I don't have any recording from 1230, so I wouldn't know
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14:37<TrueBrain>plural? Cool :) Hi to you too
14:38<@Rubidium>TrueBrain: don't you have earlier music?
14:38<@Rubidium>or older
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14:38<Elukka>clearly plural greetings are superior to singular ones
14:39<@Rubidium>1966 seems to be the oldest song in my (relatively small) collection
14:40<@Rubidium>and that number has even been quite current the last few years
14:41<Elukka>do all the NoAIs do the "spam 9001 buses on the same road so that its a huge road composed of buses" thing when there are lots of passengers?
14:41<@Rubidium>Elukka: no, but some are 'encouraged' to build more busses because they are blocked by others
14:41-!-mode/#openttd [+o DorpsGek] by ChanServ
14:42<Yexo>admiralai has a limit on the number of AIs per bus stop, but with big towns you'll still get jams
14:42<Elukka>the only ai i've ever used was the old "alpha ai" patch in trunk :D
14:42<Elukka>it actually works pretty well for road vehicles
14:42<@Rubidium>Yexo: s/AIs/busses/ ?
14:43<Yexo>Rubidium: yes :p
14:43<@Rubidium>could be you made it IS compatible already
14:44<Yexo>that's impossible, since the AI can't check vehicles of other companies
14:44<Elukka>i liked using them to build bus services for me
14:44<Yexo>and if that is changes, other places that assume so will fail
14:44<Elukka>they'd build them, then i'd buy them out
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15:11<Roest>Max station spread. Warning High setting slows game. Now what would be considered a high setting?
15:12<Roest>hmm possible answers are 42 and depends
15:12<kingj>I run mine on 40, and notice no slowdown
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15:37<@Belugas>fucking Tomcat :(
15:37<@Belugas>cannot redirect an address
15:38<@Rubidium>well... it's chasing Jerrymouse ;)
15:41<@Rubidium>Belugas: you know that the Americans stopped using Tomcats in 2006, right?
15:43<+glx>they stopped using F14?
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15:43<+glx>wiki says that too
15:46<@Rubidium>true, but whatever wikipedia says doesn't mean it's true
15:46<@Rubidium>even when they got 'sources' for it
15:47<Zahl_>can somebody tell me why i wont get the subsidy-offer-dunnowhat in this savegame for gunnton and flendham?
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15:47<@Rubidium>station flag is not within 9 tiles of destination industry/town flag
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15:48<Zahl>hmmm.. has it always been like that?
15:49<Zahl>by station flag you mean what exactly?
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15:50<@Rubidium>there where the station name is
15:50<@Rubidium>and it has only been so since somewhere in the mid 1990s
15:51<Zahl>so its brand new, so to say
15:52<Zahl>awesome, it works! youre my hero Rubidium :-)
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16:19<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15472 /trunk/src/lang/english.txt: -Fix: consistency of capitalisation of words in the intro gui and of NewGRF.
16:24<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15473 /trunk/src/ (intro_gui.cpp lang/english.txt): -Fix: add two missing tooltips in the intro gui
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17:09<Roest>hmm is it possible for a vehicle with shared orders to get unshared again?
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17:12<valhallasw>Roest: select 'end of shared orders' and click delete
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17:36<el_en>what is under the openttd world?
17:37<el_en>is it possible the world lies on the backs of four elephants?
17:38<Nite_Owl>which in turn stand on the back of a turtle
17:38<Prof_Frink>The Great A'Tuin.
17:38<valhallasw>the only turtle ever to show up on a Hertzsprung-Russell diagram?
17:39<el_en>yes, naturally the elephants can't be standing on thin air (or space), there must be a turtle.
17:40<Elukka>then what do the turtles stand on?
17:40<Prof_Frink>Nah, it can't be the Disc because a) it's square and b) the circumfence goes all the way round
17:40<Prof_Frink>Elukka: It's a *turtle*. It *swims*.
17:40<Elukka>ah, that explains everything
17:42<valhallasw>Prof_Frink: maybe some alternate squareworld?
17:43<Sacro>Elukka: turtles all the way down
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17:59<Yeggstry>forgive my complete ignorance, but can someone explain how the transfers work?
18:00<Elukka>they transfer stuff
18:00<Elukka>which means you can drop off things to intermediate stations
18:00<Elukka>the cargo will wait there until picked up by another vehicle
18:00<Yeggstry>I dont understand the fact that my train has a profit but the lorries which move it to the final destination have a cost each time
18:02<Nite_Owl>it works better profit wise if the transfer is short and the trip to the final destination is long
18:02<Elukka>you'll still get the money, though
18:02<Elukka>the time the cargo is waiting is counted as travel time, i think
18:03<Nite_Owl>not necessarily - it could loose money if the transfer is really long and the trip to the final destination is really short
18:04<@Rubidium>1) the first vehicles don't actually earn money
18:04<Prof_Frink>How does one loose anything other than arrows?
18:04<@Rubidium>2) the last vehicle earns the whole trip
18:05<@Rubidium>to make the non-last vehicles not have negative income, the amount of money they would've gotten are virtually given to those vehicles
18:05<Nite_Owl>you know I can not spell
18:05<@Rubidium>after that whatever virtual money is handed out is substracted from the profit that the last vehicle shows
18:05<Prof_Frink>Yeah, but loose/lose really annoys me.
18:06<Nite_Owl>I blame it all on phonetic reading as a child
18:06<Yeggstry>ah ok, the problem I have was that the towns on this map don't give me easy access to transport goods, so I've done a train route to the outskirts then lorries to the final destination
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18:21<Prof_Frink>Sacro: Do it properly. Write a bash one-liner that gives you a countdown.
18:21<el_en>10 minutes!
18:21<Sacro>yes :D
18:21<Sacro>Prof_Frink: /exec -o date?
18:23<Prof_Frink>That's not a countdown.
18:24<el_en>while date +%s ; do sleep 0.8s ; done
18:25<Prof_Frink>Still not a count*down*, is it?
18:25<Sacro>I have ntp'd
18:25<Sacro>synctime :D
18:25<Prof_Frink>I have ntpd.
18:26<el_en>Prof_Frink: date +-%s ?
18:26<Sacro>come on...
18:27<Prof_Frink>el_en: No, you need to take the output of date +%s and do something to it
18:28<Mark>while true; do clear; echo $((1234567890 - `date +%s`)); sleep 1; done ?
18:28<el_en>Mark: there's a slight chance of missing the important number if you sleep 1.
18:28<Prof_Frink>I'm not bothering with the clear, but yeah
18:29<Sacro>whoo :D
18:30<Prof_Frink>1 minute
18:31<el_en>and we have a lift-off!
18:31<kingj>Happy 1234567890!
18:32<Tefad>i'm in ##1234567890 on freenode
18:32<Tefad>that crap exploded
18:32<Sacro>damn, didn't know that
18:33<kingj>And still is exploding
18:34<Prof_Frink>...well, that was fun, wasn't it.
18:35<Prof_Frink>Roll on 2038.
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18:36<el_en>never seen any channel with that much traffic
18:36<kd5pbo>What's 1234567890?
18:37<Sacro>Prof_Frink: FFFFFFFF?
18:37<wgrant>el_en: #ubuntu-release-party after Hardy was close, but not quite to that extent...
18:37<Prof_Frink>Sacro: The epochalypse, the end of the unixverse.
18:37<Sacro>hehe :D
18:37<kd5pbo>date() or time() or such returns 1234567890?
18:38<Sacro>seconds since 1/1/1970
18:38<wgrant>Sacro: FFFFFFFF will be the only sound heard as it ticks over, as the world begins to swear.
18:38<Prof_Frink>excluding leap seconds
18:38<Sacro>wgrant: true
18:38<Sacro>Prof_Frink: also true
18:39<kd5pbo>Wait, is it 1234567890 or 0xFFFFFFFF?
18:39<wgrant>1234567890 just happened.
18:39<wgrant>0xFFFFFFFF will happen in 2038.
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18:39<el_en>will it?
18:39<Mark>2000000000 will occour Wed, 18 May 2033 05:33:20 +0200
18:40<Prof_Frink>Pfft, my computer goes well past 2038 anyway
18:40<kd5pbo>Hopefully by then we'll be using four bytes for whatever datatype it returns.
18:40<wgrant>Prof_Frink: But lots of data formats still use 32-bit time_t, and will for a while yet...
18:41<kd5pbo>Well, we have 29 years to add bytes.
18:41<kd5pbo>Who knows, by then a byte maybe 16 bits.
18:41<Wolf01>good night
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18:41<Nite_Owl>Yes but the Maya calender ends December 21st, 2012
18:42<kd5pbo>Who do you believe, the Mayans, or the Unix folks.
18:42<Prof_Frink>How much beard did the Mayans have?
18:42<kd5pbo>Hm, maybe my girlfriend will cease to exist in 2012, and I'll disappear in 2038.
18:42<Nite_Owl>when the solar system aligns with the black hole at the center of the milky way
18:42<el_en>wgrant: but 0xFFFFFFFF is a negative number.
18:43<kd5pbo>Is it a signed int?
18:43<el_en>usually signed.
18:43<wgrant>You're right, it is signed.
18:43<wgrant>Forgot that.
18:43<Prof_Frink>Nite_Owl: That statement makes no sense.
18:43<kd5pbo>So, we've even less time.
18:44<Prof_Frink>Heh, there's even a 1234567890 thread on UKC
18:44<el_en>2038 is still the year when trouble arise.
18:44<Nite_Owl>which one?
18:45<Prof_Frink>< Nite_Owl> when the solar system aligns with the black hole at the center of the milky way
18:45<Prof_Frink>el_en: Nah, the *real* trouble's not for a few milennia, when Andromeda arrives
18:46<Elukka>by millenia do you mean billions of years
18:46<Elukka>and it's not real trouble
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18:47<Nite_Owl>Perigee might have been a better term
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18:48<Elukka>galactic collisions are fun
18:48<Elukka>they collide but nothing much actually collides
18:50<Nite_Owl>Marston's ???
18:51<Nite_Owl>Pedigree as in pure breed
18:51<Prof_Frink>As in the beer.
18:52<Nite_Owl>Ahhh - back on beer are we
18:52<Prof_Frink>Did we ever leave?
18:52<Nite_Owl>not really
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19:00<thingwath>whoa, spent 1234567890 a bus
19:02<thingwath>(I'm so drunk, aw.)
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20:29<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15474 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt strings.cpp): -Cleanup: remove some (long) unused strings.
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20:40<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15475 /trunk/src/lang/ (51 files in 2 dirs): -Update: do r15474 also for the other languages.
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15476 /trunk/src/gfxinit.cpp:
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#2630]: crash when opening the game options when the currently loaded
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: base graphics pack has less than 2 valid graphics files. For example when
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: someone replaces all his/her original base graphics with custom work (but keeps
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: the name) or renames the dos ones to windows or vice versa.
20:47<knl>this game is sort of depressing sometimes... out of the blue companies i'm servicing lose a lot of production or even just shut down
20:47<knl>is it better to ignore companies in the end, and just go for passangers or something? :(
20:48<Aali>you mean industries
20:48<Aali>and they dont shut down or decrease production if you service them properly
20:48<+glx>unless it's ECS
20:48<@Rubidium>Aali: depends very much on the industry
20:48<Aali>yeah, ECS is a pain
20:49<+glx>oil wells always decrease
20:49<knl>such as, delivering product to an industry, and if it makes something, deliver that too?
20:49<Aali>just keep ratings over 80%
20:49<knl>I have a really intricate chain of trains delivering everything to keep a vehicle factory (custom grf) supplied
20:49<Aali>that would be ECS
20:50<knl>the vehicles are then shipped off to an iron ore mine (?) and then... they actually don't help the production at all.
20:50<+glx>ECS is overcomplicated
20:50<Aali>they're not supposed to help production really
20:50<knl>yeah I suppose.
20:50<Aali>its just a place to get rid of all those vehicles
20:51<knl>fair enough to me
20:51<@Rubidium>best place for such vehicles is a maglevel crossing
20:51<knl>no, more like a competitor's road vehicles
20:52<knl>hmm, this just gave me an idea
20:52<knl>I wonder if it's possible to completely gridlock a small city with buses >_>
20:53<@Rubidium>yes, deadlock: no
20:53<knl>deadlock meaning
20:53<+glx>unmovable vehicles
20:53<@Rubidium>that the vehicles can't get out of it anywhere in the future
20:53<knl>they just move really slowly you mean
20:53<+glx>doable with trams though
20:54<@Rubidium>well, they stand still for a while and then they start moving through the stopped vehicle in front of them
20:56<knl>I have this really cute boat-to-truck fish delivery scheme going
20:56<knl>but the boat speeds sort of kill it >_>
20:58<Elukka>i had this thing where trucks delivered wood to a train which delivered it to the docks where ships delivered it to its destination
20:58<Elukka>it actually turned a nice profit!
20:58<knl>the speed compared to the distance traveled gives them a really huge boost in value
20:58<knl>or so I think
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21:00<knl>hmm, strange
21:00<knl>in the vehicle factory scheme i mentioned above...
21:00<knl>my biggest earning train is actually the coal-> steel factory train >_>
21:00<knl>steel milç*
21:01<Aali>you should check the cargo payment rates graph
21:03<knl>...vehicles is absurdly high
21:03<knl>but they take so long to full load the vehicles train that it don't really earn that much
21:04<Aali>and you'll have a hard time getting rid of all the vehicles once production picks up
21:05<knl>steel production isn't keeping up though...
21:05<knl>the coal train earning so much is probably due to the fact that i'm using two other trains to get coal from other mines to take to the steel mill...
21:05<knl>since the closest one had crappy production xd
21:07<knl>oil wells closed out of the blue.
21:10<Aali>dunno about ECS but with default industries all oil wells close eventually
21:11<knl>well they would when the oil runs out, sure
21:11<knl>but that one had at least 50million litres left to tap into, last time I'd checked
21:11<Aali>oh, you're playing with exhaustible resources too?
21:11<Aali>I could never do that
21:11<Aali>waay too annoying
21:12<knl>i suppose it was turned on by default or something
21:12<Aali>the value displayed doesn't actually indicate how much is left though
21:12<Aali>its a VERY rough estimate and really only affects the "% chance to close"
21:12<knl>sometimes it increases all of a sudden, too >_>
21:13<Aali>well, thats a feature
21:13<knl>this one oil wells was on 300m when I started taking the oil
21:13<knl>suddenly it's at 450m
21:13<Aali>yeah, that can happen if the initial estimate was too low
21:19<knl>oh nice.
21:19<knl>the iron ore mine stopped accepting vehicles.
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21:35<knl>how do I even change such things as the exhaustible resources or industries suddenly not accepting some cargo due to having too much of it
21:35<Aali>you can do it with grf parameters
21:35<Aali>see the documentation for whatever industry set you're using
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21:41<knl>that worked, thanks
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---Logclosed Sat Feb 14 00:00:11 2009