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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-02-22

---Logopened Sun Feb 22 00:00:54 2009
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03:25<Felicitu1>ahh, another won game on kurt's :) time for smoke
03:30<De_ghosty>MORE BUGS IN PBS
03:30<De_ghosty>:D
03:31<De_ghosty>i know exactly how to build it itin
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03:40<@petern>there are no pbs!
03:40<@petern>bugs in
03:41<Felicitu1>insane. let the AI build a two line track and auto placing signals plus depots is easier than i guessed
03:43<Felicitu1>btw, if someone has nice station layouts he likes to see in the felicitus AI, just send me a screenshot :)
03:46<@petern>pom te pom
03:48<Felicitu1>?
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04:02<Wolf01>hello
04:03<el_en>hello
04:05<planetmaker>Felicitu1: I want to see how it builds :). Get a damn first version uploaded to bananas and care about single newgrf support later then :)
04:05<planetmaker>and a wonderful good morning to all :)
04:06<De_ghosty>yea i found a buz
04:07<De_ghosty>u want it peter?
04:07<planetmaker>bugs go to bugs.openttd.org
04:07<De_ghosty>:o
04:08<De_ghosty>why do you do that to me?!!?
04:08<De_ghosty>i hate registerinbg
04:08<De_ghosty>cuz i can't rememberz
04:08<De_ghosty>can i just send save to u?
04:08<@Rubidium>then there is no bug
04:08<De_ghosty>alright then
04:08<De_ghosty>there is no bug
04:08<planetmaker>De_ghosty: just use one stupid login+pw for all the stuff you don't want to register to but don't want
04:09<De_ghosty>geeze
04:09<planetmaker>-want (in a proper place)
04:09<De_ghosty>omgz send code.......
04:10<Felicitu1>howdy planetmaker :
04:10<Felicitu1>:)
04:10<Felicitu1>planetmaker: well, as it is now, it would build a single line + train then stops
04:11<planetmaker>oh :)
04:11<planetmaker>I thought it would build more than one line :)
04:11<Felicitu1>but i dont want to have a basic version and then extend it later
04:11<Felicitu1>no not yet
04:11<Felicitu1>i hope i can do that today
04:11<planetmaker>nice.
04:11<Felicitu1>but i first want the "extending stations" stuff done
04:11<Felicitu1>because thats important
04:11<planetmaker>From what I read from you, it sounds quite promising
04:12<Felicitu1>well i am pretty excited myself, because things went so smoothly
04:12<planetmaker>it was also you with the pathfinder with the faster, but not necessarily best way, right?
04:12<Felicitu1>yes
04:12-!-Felicitu1 is now known as Felcitus
04:12<Felcitus>i planned that i use the aystar pathfinder only for the first line(s), as the line network stuff operates a littlebit different
04:17<Felcitus>btw, is the Pathfinder.Rail done by truebrain or someone else?
04:17<@Rubidium>Yexo IIRC
04:18<Felcitus>okay, i have to ask him nicely if he can add a multiplicator to _estimate ;)
04:18<@petern>multiplicator?
04:18<Felcitus>yes, to speed up the line planning
04:19<@petern>multiplier?
04:19<Felcitus>yes, multiplier
04:23<Felcitus>hmm, a nice feature i could add later is to track the usage of a built line...if the line is near max capacity, the ai could extend to a 4-track main line *yay*
04:24<De_ghosty>which makes the junction expoentially harder to make
04:25<Felcitus>De_ghosty: junctions are template-based in my ai, it will be just as easy as extending/upgrading stations
04:26<Felcitus>so i'm looking forward for the ai to build things like http://wiki.openttd.org/wiki/index.php/Transmogrified and http://wiki.openttd.org/wiki/index.php/Dual_Tetrathorp-Junction
04:33<planetmaker>yes, multiplier
04:33<planetmaker>[10:22] <Felcitus> hmm, a nice feature i could add later is to track the usage of a built line...if the line is near max capacity, the ai could extend to a 4-track main line *yay* <-- that'd be scary :P
04:34<Felcitus>why? :) there must be some challenge for the pros :)
04:35<planetmaker>hehe
04:35<planetmaker>True
04:35<Felcitus>okay, to be honest, the only f***in reason i write this AI is because i do not want to connect everything on a 2048x2048 map by myself :P
04:37<planetmaker>Lol!
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04:38<De_ghosty>lol
04:38<De_ghosty>he is gonna join mutiplayer game
04:38<De_ghosty>and set his ai on hihg
04:39<Felcitus>silence!
04:41<Felcitus>don't tell others my trick :P
04:45<planetmaker>He, yeah, Kurt's server are easy :P
04:45<Felcitus>it depends against whom you play
04:46<planetmaker>sure :)
04:46<planetmaker>when I joined with two mates, the others gave up after 6 years :P
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04:47<planetmaker>but might be that coop is frowned upon on that server. dunno
04:48<Felcitus>no, coop is allowed, but if you coop you only get half of the points
04:48<Felcitus>*sniff*
04:49<planetmaker>doesn't matter. We tried twice. Easy going each time
04:49<Felcitus>it builds stations prepared for dual line, but it doesnt build the dual line :(
04:49<planetmaker>but fun :)
04:49<Felcitus>happy bug hunting :(
04:49<planetmaker>(not the bugs)
04:50<Felcitus>:)
04:50<Felcitus>lol okay i found the bug
04:50<Felcitus>and well....uhm...yes...the pathfinder needs to be optimized
04:50<Felcitus>it builds bridges over its own tracks!
04:50<planetmaker>lol
04:50<planetmaker>sounds like the old AI :P
04:51<Felcitus>ok, a multiplier of 1.5 did the trick
04:53<planetmaker>Rubidium: I guess you can close the first fs entry from De_ghosty
04:54<planetmaker>concerning pbs.
04:56<planetmaker>I don't know what exactly the bug is - but it sent our PS into an endless loop
04:56<planetmaker>might be a duplicate of something reportet even earlier - if that wasn't fixed now. Don't remember
04:56<De_ghosty>o
04:56<De_ghosty>the ps one was weird
04:58<planetmaker>... nor do I find the other FS entry
04:59<planetmaker>it's IMO a critical bug. It poses means to shoot a server into nirvana
05:00<planetmaker>by malicious players :P
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05:28<el_en>Bjarni!
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05:36<Felcitus>hmm, this doesn't work as expected: http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=106293
05:38<Roest>what did you expect?
05:38<Felcitus>that it connects the oil to an oil refinery :)
05:38<Felcitus>but instead, it built a loop for some reason
05:38<insulfrog>hi
05:39<planetmaker>he
05:39*petern wonders if he left autosaves on :o
05:40<planetmaker>that's not quite the layout as described in your thread, Felcitus :) - it' symmetric now :P
05:40<@petern>hmm
05:40<Felcitus>:P
05:40<planetmaker>is it meant to be a two-way station?
05:41<@petern>apparently i did
05:41<Felcitus>planetmaker: yes
05:41<Felcitus>but for some reason it decided to connect to itself
05:41<planetmaker>(I'm not talking of roro)
05:41<Felcitus>oh well no
05:41<Roest>if sorting by cargo capacity doesn't work for trams is that more a problem of the game or of the grf?
05:41<planetmaker>I wonder about the depots at both sides of the station
05:41<Felcitus>good point
05:42<Felcitus>i guess it built the roro start and end station at the same spot
05:42<planetmaker>he
05:42<Felcitus>that explain why it connected to itself
05:42<Felcitus>HEH
05:42<Felcitus>i found the reason :)
05:42<Felcitus>the oil refinery was closed down during construction
05:43<Felcitus>and i think the station builder got the old coordinates then
05:44<planetmaker>:)
05:44<planetmaker>The company could also pour all the oil into the water well. Would make people happy, I guess :P
05:44<planetmaker>oh. :)
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05:44<planetmaker>Yeah, all those nice things which happen during construction
05:47<@petern>hmm
05:48<@petern>the network server 'loading a game when a game is loaded' problem still exists :(
05:48<@Rubidium>the what problem?
05:50<@Rubidium>is that related to the 'save preset' segfault?
05:52<@petern>er
05:53<@petern>no
05:53<@petern>aww
05:53<@petern>Error: [net] Trying to execute a packet in the past!
05:53<@petern>openttd: /home/petern/ottd/svn/0.7.0-beta1/src/openttd.cpp:115: void error(const char*, ...): Assertion `0' failed.
05:53<@petern>which is quite funky for a server :p
05:53<@Rubidium>already solved that
05:57<@petern>okay
05:57<@petern>i meant to look at it months ago but forgot :p
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06:52<Jag>hello
06:54<Alberth>hello
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07:23<Felcitus>planetmaker: i have good news for you :)
07:23<planetmaker>hm?
07:24<Felcitus>i'm almost done with a preview version
07:25<planetmaker>nice!
07:25<Felcitus>i just have to find out why it doesn't build a depot sometimes, even if there is an error handling
07:26<Mortomes>http://eviljaymz.com/files/whypeopleseemtohavefreetime.png
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07:41<@Bjarni>Mortomes: according to that overview I would be web developer, sysadmin, hacker and programmer today... yet I don't feel like I have free time :s
07:41<Mortomes>Bjarni: You're doing something wrong then :P
07:42<@Bjarni>yeah
07:42<@Bjarni>I should have been a programmer in the 80's
07:42<@Bjarni>their union stated that they were not allowed to get other tasks while their code compiled so they had pool tables and stuff
07:43<@Bjarni>because compilers of that age were kind of slow
07:45<KingJ>http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/compiling.png
07:45<KenjiE20>^ was wondering when that'd show up :P
07:46<KingJ>It was a race to see who would post it first
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07:51<Felcitus>hmm, have there been some changes to the acceleration of trains? a cs2400 in tropical with 19 wagons climbing a height difference of 1 takes nearly forever :(
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07:53<Felcitus>planetmaker: tgz or zip?
07:53<planetmaker>I don't care, Felcitus
07:53<Felcitus>ok
07:56<Felcitus>planetmaker: http://www.timohummel.com/temp/felicitus-ai-0.1.tgz
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07:56<Felcitus>you need to make sure that it loads the bundled libraries (or at least the rail pathfinder)
07:56<Tefad>ack. i clicked on open gfx in the onlinecontent thing
07:57<Tefad>now i have black boxes
07:57<Tefad>how do i revert?
07:57<planetmaker>ok Felcitus :) Will try. I think I have those
07:57<planetmaker>it should load them automatically then, I think, right?
07:57<Felcitus>i don't know what happens if you have libraries from the content download
07:57<KenjiE20>Tefad; game options
07:57<Tefad>oh i see. thanks
07:58<planetmaker>well. That's where I have them from, yes
07:58<Felcitus>it's important that you have the bundled one, because there's a change by me. i need to talk to yexo if he can include that in his railpathfinder
07:58<Tefad>wow. that was easy
07:59<Felcitus>and dont be disappointed - right now it simply tries to connect anything on the map. so nothing spectacular for now. i need to work on the station upgrade later, but now i finally need some sleep
07:59<Felcitus>but if there's some trouble with the AI (like: it dont populate the line with a train or such), it would be interesting to know
08:01<Felcitus>last cigarette for today, and in the meanwhile i let FelicitusAI and AdmiralAI play against each other :P
08:02*Bjarni points out that Felcitus is in a no smoking area
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08:07<KingJ>Hmm, activating the game speed boost seems to do nothing now, wonder if 700 trains and 700 road vehicles is too much
08:07<KingJ>plus a 100 or so ships and 50 aircraft
08:07<@petern>it just means your computer is too slow
08:07<@petern>to run it faster
08:08<KingJ>And OTTD isn't SMP aware is it?
08:08<@petern>only where it can be
08:09<Tefad>save/load i think is most often eh?
08:10<KingJ>I've got a Q9550, running at standard 2.8GHz
08:11<Tefad>i don't think anything above 2x CPU helps
08:11<Felcitus>time for bed
08:11<Felcitus>good night
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08:11<KingJ>Also running cargo/passenger destinations, which also adds extra load I guess
08:12<KingJ>And running at quite a high resolution
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08:13<Tefad>large maps i think are the most demanding
08:13<KingJ>2048^2 map too
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08:19<planetmaker>he...
08:19<planetmaker>darn.
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09:37<insulfrog>hi all
09:39<insulfrog>I have a quick question
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09:40<insulfrog>is it possible to have co-operative play with a 'NoAI' computer player?
09:40<+glx>no
09:41<insulfrog>ah, thanks :)
09:42<insulfrog>(be nice to do that though :p )
09:44<insulfrog>a NoAI does roads and air transport while a person does rails
09:44*insulfrog dreams
09:51<Tefad>yeah until the AI eats all your cash
09:54<insulfrog>well yeah, that'll be the problem
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10:13<Ammler>something changed with autosave filenames?
10:13<+glx>why?
10:13<frosch123>for dedicated servers: yes
10:13<Ammler>really ugly names now on our server :-)
10:14<Ammler>not loadable over ap anymore :-(
10:14<+glx>then keep_all_autosave is true :)
10:14<Ammler>ah, thanks.
10:17<Ammler>in general, openttd should "filter" the company name before using it as filename
10:17<Ammler>we have also many troubles here, if someone publish his screens :-)
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10:18<Ammler>!ip
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10:18-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx|away] by ChanServ
10:18<Ammler>sorry :-$
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10:23<fonsinchen>I want to use the route map from cargodest as capacity indicator, that is, I'd like to annotate the edges with the maximum capacity they can carry in a given timeframe. I already have a way to calculate the capacities. Is there a recommended way to print them as strings in the minimap?
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10:27<planetmaker>is there a way to set the filename for autosaves?
10:28<+glx>not that I remember
10:30<frosch123>you can change the format of the date
10:31<planetmaker>yeah. I found the date format
10:31<planetmaker>The problem I have is the spaces in the file names.
10:31<+glx>do you really need to keep all ?
10:31<planetmaker>They tend to pose difficulties with shell environments
10:32<planetmaker>glx: No, I don't need all, but saves of maybe a half a day or so, by the minute or two minutes
10:32<frosch123>change STR_GAME_SAVELOAD_SPECTATOR_SAVEGAME
10:33<planetmaker>frosch123: that's a patch then :)
10:33<+glx>you can change max_num_autosaves
10:33<planetmaker>glx: the number of saves is not a problem. The filename
10:33<+glx>and disable keep_all_autosave
10:33<planetmaker>we disabled keep_all_autosave
10:34-!-Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
10:34<planetmaker>set max_num_autosaves = 255
10:34<planetmaker>-rw-r--r-- 1 openttd users 535706 2009-02-22 16:32 Wandering Waters LtD, 1st Feb 2030.sav
10:34<planetmaker>which gives us these results
10:34<+glx>then there's a bug :)
10:35<+glx>** Create an autosave. The default name is "autosave#.sav". However with
10:35<+glx> * the setting 'keep_all_autosave' the name defaults to company-name + date */
10:36<+glx>and the code clearly does that
10:36<@petern>it does
10:36<@petern>so you must have keep_all_autosave enabled
10:36<fonsinchen>OK, to rephrase it a bit: Why is "static char *FormatNoCommaNumber(char *buff, int64 number, const char *last)" static?
10:36<fonsinchen>in strings.cpp
10:37<+glx>because it's used only from this file
10:37<fonsinchen>I want to use it somewhere else
10:37<@petern>no you don't
10:37<fonsinchen>Or is there an alternative?
10:37<@petern>you want to draw strings
10:37<fonsinchen>yes
10:37<fonsinchen>a string consisting of a single number.
10:37<+glx>then DrawString :)
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10:38<dihedral>glx, is there also a GoFish()?
10:39<fonsinchen>How do I get a StringID for my numbers?
10:39<planetmaker>hm... right. Obviously two many people mess up things. Sorry, glx. It works
10:39<planetmaker>s/two/too/
10:40<planetmaker>,though too many = two :P
10:40<planetmaker>probably simultaneous editing of the cfg :*
10:40<planetmaker>:P
10:43<Ammler>planetmaker: :P
10:44<Ammler>openttd needed a restart
10:45*planetmaker hugs Ammler
10:45<+glx>STR_00E2, STR_00E3, STR_01CB, STR_01E5, STR_0212, STR_021F, STR_7024, STR_TINY_BLACK, STR_GROUP_TINY_NUM
10:45<+glx>fonsinchen: all these draw just a number
10:46<+glx>the right one depends on what you want to draw exactly
10:46<fonsinchen>Ah, so I do a SetDParam and then call DrawString with that ID?
10:46<+glx>yes
10:46<fonsinchen>thanks
10:46<+glx>some specify color and/or size
10:47<fonsinchen>I'll try them and see what looks best
10:48<+glx>better look for them in english.txt first :)
10:48<@petern>stringid lottery?
10:48<fonsinchen>ah, ok
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10:57<Jolteon>Howdy.
10:57<Jolteon>I require assistance.
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10:58<Jolteon>I cannot build a train station, it says "Can't build train station" in true OpenTTD useless help message style.
10:58<KenjiE20>where, what and how
10:58<planetmaker>as reported in true useless bug report style
10:58<Jolteon>..........wat?
10:59<Jolteon>http://easytohide.info/imagehost/images/r74ynwscyjddqfozbzx3.png
10:59<planetmaker>e.g. describe what you _want_ to achieve, what you actually _did_ and when and where it exactly failed (from your expectations)
10:59<Jolteon>Ignore the hideous aspect of GTFO I'M BUILDING IN UR CITY.
11:00<Jolteon>the council didn't approve of my actions, so i turned on the cheat and just demolished half of it.
11:00<Jolteon>I bribed the council and built trees to get it back up to reasonable liking of me.
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11:00<dihedral>[16:58] <Jolteon> I require assistance. <- require as much as you like, people dont usually like the word though ;-)
11:01<Alberth>maybe the city just started a new building in your cleared aera?
11:01<Jolteon>Alberth: no, i've tried that.
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11:02<dihedral>you must build a 2 track wide station
11:02<dihedral>can you not read?
11:02<dihedral>you are doing drag & drop on the station
11:02<dihedral>the station however has a requirement of being 2 tracks wide, which is clearly visible by the '1' button under Tracks being greyed out
11:02<KenjiE20>^
11:02<Tefad>the error message does need improving
11:03<Jolteon>oh
11:03<Jolteon>I see the error.
11:03<Jolteon>But I do want to now make a suggestion.
11:03<Jolteon>Can you make the error messages a bit more revealing?
11:03<Jolteon>Currently they're a bit ... generic.
11:03<dihedral>depends on what is made possible to grf's :-P
11:03<dihedral>and it is probably based on the grf (the message that is)
11:04<Alberth>file a bug report in bugs.openttd.org would be best if it does not exist already
11:04<dihedral>Alberth, it's only worth it if the error message is not set in the grf (i dont know if that at all is possible)
11:04<dihedral>but if it is a message from the grf, then you'd have to make the suggestion to the author
11:04<dihedral>(of the grf that is)
11:05<Alberth>dihedral: right. Jolteon: plz ignore my suggestion :)
11:05<dihedral>glx can probably enlighten here
11:06<Alberth>we let too many things get decided by the GRF authors :)
11:07<frosch123>that message is not from the grf :)
11:07<Roest>ok, now that i added 1 wagon to 420 trains each, is there an automatic way to do it?
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11:09<yorick>any idea how to refuse CMD_COMPANY_CTRL from the server while still closing the progress window?
11:09<dihedral>in what way
11:09<dihedral>and why?
11:10<dihedral>yorick, ^
11:13<dihedral>refusing it client side, does not seem to make a lot of sense to me
11:18<dihedral>well, then i guess i cannot help you ;-)
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11:34<insulfrog>cyas
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11:35<Ammler>frosch123: is your source for the "noIndClose" GRF public?
11:36<frosch123>manual industries? well, the original source does not look very different as if you run the grf through grfcodec and nforenum :p
11:36<Ammler>this one: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=735659#p735659
11:36<frosch123>but the grf itself is gpled
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11:37<frosch123>so in this case I define the grf as the source :)
11:37<Ammler>:-)
11:38<dihedral>frosch123, so you wrote the grf by hand, did not use anything to 'generate' it?
11:39<Ammler>no, but he is a guy, who as all properities in mind, so he don't need to comment them ;-)
11:39<frosch123>that grf is by hand, it consists of 3 pseudo sprites :)
11:40<frosch123>Ammler: no, but I did not bothered commenting it
11:40<frosch123>run it through grf2html and it will be better than the original
11:40<Ammler>already did
11:41<Ammler>I would like to enable "closing" for PS for a test
11:42<Ammler>I thought, I could check your grf to see which properity that is :-)
11:42<frosch123>0B
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11:44<Ammler>frosch123: 0 means no closing?
11:44<planetmaker>hehe. You change one byte, claim (co-)authorship and then upload it to Bananas, Ammler? :P
11:44<frosch123>0 means behave like powerplant
11:45<frosch123>Ammler: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=IndustryDefaultProps
11:46<Ammler>I know that table, but the descripton of 0B isn't that clear to me.
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11:46<frosch123>at most set one bit of prop 0B
11:47<Ammler>what do you think (or maybe know), how a serviced PS will behave?
11:47<planetmaker>hehe. I still like the wording of the announcment of that grf, frosch123 :)
11:48<frosch123>0 means no production changes no closing, 1 and 2 mean primary industry (iirc the difference is only some map colour), 4 means no production changes and as probability for closing after 5 years no service
11:48<frosch123>what is a 'PS' ?
11:48<Ammler>PowerStation?
11:49<frosch123>so you want powerstations to close down like a not-serviced processing industry?
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11:49<Ammler>I was in thinking, that you have to set "no production" industries to "no closing" else it could disapear even if serviced.
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11:51<frosch123>only delivery matters
11:51<Ammler>I told that to FIRS and Eddi|zuHause laught at me
11:51-!-Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd
11:52<Ammler>frosch123: how can delivery matter for a coal mine?
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11:52<frosch123>btw. the only difference for 'extractive' and 'organic' is, that nearby stations will be named 'mines' or 'woods'
11:52<dihedral>coal mines should have a start value, and if that amount was exhausted (transported) they close :-D
11:52<Ammler>dihedral: PBI
11:52<frosch123>Ammler: for processing industries only delivery matters
11:52<Ammler>or ECS does that too.
11:54<Ammler>frosch123: so setting PS to processing industries should fix that?
11:54<frosch123>yes, should be enough
11:55<Ammler>hmm, now I don't see a reason, why TTO set PS that way.
11:55<Ammler>menno. :-(
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12:06<Radtoo>hi, does anyone have an idea what might be messing ottd's performance on a linux box?
12:07<FauxFaux>uYou.
12:07<frosch123>Ammler: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action0Industries <- better?
12:07<Radtoo>*messing up.
12:08<dihedral>Radtoo, other processes?
12:08<dihedral>how should we know?
12:08<Radtoo>dihedral: none that take up much performance.
12:08<dihedral>we dont know what you are expecting
12:08<Radtoo>But in particular, scaling the window size and raising the resolution of the game kills performance.
12:08<dihedral>we dont know what map you are playing
12:08<dihedral>how many industries are there
12:08<Radtoo>doesn't matter.
12:08<dihedral>or vehicles
12:10<Radtoo>It starts right from the title screen.
12:10<dihedral>what res?
12:10<Radtoo>800x600 in full screen already does... windowed still seems okay'ish
12:10<dihedral>on any new game?
12:11<Radtoo>Yes. Just openttd tho.
12:11<dihedral>not loading a save game, starting a new one right
12:11<Radtoo>Yes.
12:12<dihedral>what about starting the game with -s null ?
12:12<Radtoo>nope. doesn't change that its slow. given the symptoms, I'd say it something to do with the graphics display...
12:13<Radtoo>Although other SDL-based programs run fine, as does opengl based stuff.
12:13<dihedral>zoomed out?
12:14<Radtoo>same if I'm zoomed in or out on the game
12:16<frosch123>any difference if using '-b 8bpp-optimized' or '-b 32bpp-optimized'?
12:17<Ammler>frosch123: thank you :-) (what does e.g. mean, btw.?)
12:17<Radtoo>Yes, 32bpp-optimized is slightly better...
12:17<frosch123>exempli gratia
12:20<frosch123>or 'for example' for uneducated :p
12:20<Radtoo>... is there perhaps any known problems with ATI's drivers? Googled, but found nothing...
12:20*dihedral has an ati driver and has no issues what so ever
12:21<Radtoo>64bit linux as well?
12:21<dihedral>i doubt that would cause your issue
12:22<Radtoo>Well, my best uneducated guess is that somewhere between sdl and my drivers there's something inadequate. :)
12:22<Radtoo>It's clearly not the process priority or cpu resources.
12:23<dihedral>if that were the case, dont you think there would be a few more bug reports?
12:23<Radtoo>I guess that's what I came here for, to ask if you know anything besides the bug reports that don't seem to be there :p.
12:24<dihedral>hehe
12:24<dihedral>+ if it were what you assume, it would exist for other apps too
12:25<Radtoo>Dunno, not everyone might implement SDL the way openttd does or something...
12:26<Radtoo>All I can see here is that for no apparent reason at all, openttd has very poor performance on a very fast machine...
12:26<planetmaker>Radtoo: maybe you define "fast" machine and "poor performance" :)
12:27<planetmaker>they're by these words not really measurable...
12:27<frosch123>so using 32bpp or 8bpp had no impact?
12:27<Radtoo>frosch123: no, i said 32bpp was better...
12:27<frosch123>oh, missed that
12:29<Radtoo>planetmaker: Q9550 / 8GB ram / ati 4780 model video card. and I don't know any way to benchmark ottd well, but performance is worse than original transport tycoon on that old... was it, i386? Low fps, periodic (although very short) no new frames...
12:30<Radtoo>planetmaker: Its hard to describe accurately in other words than "poor performance" tho, unless you got some means to benchmark it?
12:30<dihedral>look at top, give us some info, what is 'lag'
12:31<planetmaker>hm... video card shouldn't matter
12:31<dihedral>poor performance is hardly anything that we can comment on
12:31<planetmaker>only cpu is used for openttd
12:31<Radtoo>as I said, no processes interfering, system is more or less idle, openttd odesnt cause lots of load...
12:31<dihedral>Radtoo, it still can matter!
12:32<planetmaker>and I don't know Q9550 :P
12:32<Radtoo>reniced the process and it didn't matter...
12:32<dihedral>Radtoo, what is the clock on each core?
12:32<Radtoo>planetmaker: intel quad core 2.8ghz per core, yorkfield.
12:32<KingJ>2.83
12:32<KingJ>I've got the same config, except for RAM (4GB)
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12:32<dihedral>quack
12:33<planetmaker>:D
12:33<planetmaker>Radtoo: that should suffice to play 1k^2 maps with 1k trains nicely
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12:33<planetmaker>it nearly works on the old P4 here
12:33<Radtoo>If not more, exactly...
12:33<planetmaker>with intel chipset graphics
12:33<dihedral>graphics is unimporatant
12:33<planetmaker>Radtoo: probably. But only one core counts
12:34<planetmaker>dihedral: see above :) yes
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12:34<Radtoo>I can play it fine on my dual core laptop, it plays fine on my brothers amd64, but not here in my comfy desktop machine's chair, for whatever reason.
12:34<Radtoo>I know.
12:35<Radtoo>But openttd is about the only 4-8% load on that core...
12:35<dihedral>did you compile yourself?
12:36<Radtoo>Yep.
12:36<Radtoo>But the binary also behaves the same way, so...
12:37<dihedral>any newGRFs you load?
12:37<Radtoo>It's also the same between 0.7.0 beta1 and 0.6.1 ...
12:37<Radtoo>I even tried that... but generally I have none.
12:37<Radtoo>(newgrf only tried on 0.7.0 beta1)
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12:41<Mark>Hmm, can you turn off a bot who's company you taken over?
12:41<Mark>hmm
12:41<Mark>who's wrong
12:41<Mark>Hope you understand anyway :)
12:41<dihedral>does it not do that automatically?
12:42<Radtoo>Mark: On the beta or the stable versions?
12:42<dihedral>i take it you are cheating Mark
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12:43<Mark>dihedral: yeah, just downloaded this game from openttd-forums
12:43<Mark>Radtoo: nightly
12:43<Radtoo>Hmkay, well, I guess I get the overall picture. Performance bottlenecks you had usually to almost always were on the CPU and y'dont recognize this problem of mine, even with similar hardware. Well, thats already valuable info. :D
12:44<dihedral>^^
12:44<Mark>I bought it instead
12:44<dihedral>Radtoo, i can tell you that you will not have the issue if you start openttd with -D
12:45<Radtoo>dihedral: well, that seems to run but I have no good clue if it performs well. :)
12:45<dihedral>it does
12:45<Radtoo>dihedral: I figure I could find out with another machine.
12:45<Radtoo>oh, you tried?
12:46<Radtoo>k...
12:48<dihedral>-D = dedicated server
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12:51<Radtoo>... mmkay. So it was the darn ati drivers.
12:52<Radtoo>Don't ask me why ONLY this game out of all applications (including 3d, emulators, ... yadda yadda) failed. Ati might just hate it for people not needing new hardware to play it or something ;)
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12:53<Radtoo>s/ati/amd
12:54<Radtoo>tyvm again...
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13:25<+glx>Radtoo: try disabling full animation
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13:29<Maarten->ugh
13:30*Maarten- slaps yorick around with a pink Macintosh
13:30<dihedral>"there is just one thing we can do... either we flee or we kill him"
13:30<dihedral>lol
13:30-!-Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.cpe.ge-1-1-0-1101.odnqu1.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:30<dihedral>Maarten, ?
13:30<energetic>whatever happend to the diagonal terraform patch?
13:31<dihedral>it tripped and fell down the stairs
13:31<dihedral>broke it's neck
13:32<dihedral>energetic, are you just looking for the patch, or what exactly do you want?
13:33<@petern>we're not allowed to call it terraforming now
13:34<dihedral>oh?
13:35-!-Maarten [~dutchusa@cpe-67-49-65-115.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:36<el_en>should we organize a native-english-speakers-speaking-non-english-day on this channel?
13:36<dihedral>vat du yu meen bey zat?
13:38*yorick slaps Maarten- around with a black acer ferrari
13:38<dihedral>oh my word
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13:47<energetic>just wondering why it didnt came into trunk, as it sounds to be a usefull feature
13:47<@Bjarni><el_en> should we organize a native-english-speakers-speaking-non-english-day on this channel? <--- let's pick a language for every Sunday and kick everybody using a different language
13:48<energetic>multiple patches where created though none integrated. one of those is http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=19311
13:49<@Bjarni>let's start next Sunday with some obscene language
13:49<@Bjarni>like Swedish
13:50<dihedral>energetic, reasons for not being included (not limited to): coding style not followed, badly implemented, not well tested, buggy, not something the devs want to include
13:50<energetic>ok. Is there any log of this? So I can check it out myself instead of asking? Like patch x rejected because y?
13:51<Alberth>Bjarni: Klingon
13:51<energetic>Alberth: no. Only string encoded in BrainFuck.
13:51<energetic>Klingon is too easy :)
13:51<@Bjarni>yeah
13:51<dihedral>energetic, no
13:52<@Bjarni>it needs to be obscene and something only "special" people can figure out
13:52<@Bjarni>so Swedish is a good choice
13:52<dihedral>energetic, unless you want to read irc logs and forum posts
13:52<energetic>right.
13:52<dihedral>chance that it was mentioned somewhere public are quite good
13:53<energetic>I just want to dive into ottd code my way. One way is analyzing patches. And knowing why it isnt good enough for trunk
13:54<energetic>and integrating patches into my own build.
13:54<dihedral>energetic, could very well be that something is coded alright, just no devs want it ;-)
13:54<energetic>i know.
13:54<energetic>But some functionality seems so obvious that thats out of the question
13:55<energetic>and it becomes a technicality instead of a decision
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r15553 /trunk/src/lang/ (french.txt japanese.txt polish.txt spanish.txt):
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-02-22 18:58:31
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: french - 2 changed by belugas (2)
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: japanese - 67 fixed by ickoonite (67)
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: polish - 3 fixed by xaxa (3)
13:59<CIA-1>OpenTTD: spanish - 38 changed by erregerre (38)
13:59<dihedral>energetic, every patch is a decision!
14:01<el_en>Bjarni: a great idea. och svenska är ju ett bra språk att börja med.
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14:05<planetmaker>energetic: with a bit of patching experience it gets easier to tell what things are considered decently implemented and what not :) There's no easy way to figure that, though, I think
14:05<planetmaker>It can only be seen by examples...
14:07<planetmaker>some long-time patches I certain wish to hit trunk where _i_ don't see problems, but then I don't have a complete overview of the code. So...
14:07<planetmaker>... enjoy patching :)
14:21<planetmaker>he, the new client limit rocks!
14:21<planetmaker>We have 16 people playing currently :)
14:21<planetmaker>two thumbs up for all :)
14:29-!-LUADuck [~luaduck@79-72-185-163.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd
14:29<@Bjarni>el_en: :)
14:29<@Bjarni>now we see the "special" person :P
14:35<energetic>Well I have seen some code in my life so it shouldnt be too hard to sniff out bad patches
14:39<dihedral>energetic, good luck :-)
14:40<energetic>Beautiful code can make me cry. The opposite happens too :)
14:42<@Bjarni>funny it takes !Beautiful code to make me cry (specially if it's mandatory to understand it)
14:49-!-davis [~malte@p5B28CC04.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
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14:50<energetic>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=41886 -> isnt this just a bug?
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14:51<davis>.
14:52<@Bjarni>looks like davis has a point
14:52<davis>yes sir , i do.
14:53<Eddi|zuHause>· <- i have a better point
14:53<energetic>: I have more?
14:53*Bjarni calls pacman
14:53<davis>(<
14:53<@Bjarni>we need to get this channel cleaned
14:54<davis>afk for dinner , bbs
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14:57<Belugas_nomade>hey :D my son has lost his very first tooth !!
14:57*Belugas_nomade dances!!
14:57<Prof_Frink>Stop punching him in the face.
14:58<Eddi|zuHause>he rammed into the wall edge while racing his toy car?
14:58<Belugas_nomade>does not need that, Prof_Frink : he's like me, a saint ;)
14:58<Eddi|zuHause>(my brother actually did that... was not very pleasant)
14:59<Belugas_nomade>Eddi|zuHause: no, mom rushed to the dentist since kiddo was in pain. mothers will never change...
14:59<Belugas_nomade>the doc just tilted it forth a bit and ... pooof
14:59<Belugas_nomade>duh...
14:59<davis>-20:57:52- (Prof_Frink) Stop punching him in the face.
14:59<davis>made me laugh
14:59<davis>:o
14:59<Belugas_nomade>going back to the "party"
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15:15<Ammler>[20:53] <Eddi|zuHause> · <- i have a better point <-- don't have this point :-(
15:15<Ammler>Eddi|zuHause: do you use a mac keyboard?
15:16<dihedral>what difference would that make?
15:16<Ammler>maybe that one has such a "better point" :-)
15:17<dihedral>does not do anything other than unicode :-P
15:17<planetmaker>dihedral: wanna be client no 22? You've got the chance with yesterday's nightly :)
15:17<Ammler>you mean soemthing like alt+<number>?
15:17<dihedral>\u0000
15:19<dihedral>planetmaker, dont have the grf's ;-)
15:20<planetmaker>you know how to get them :)
15:22<dihedral>yes,
15:22<dihedral>svn up
15:22<dihedral>:-D
15:22-!-gynter [~gynter@84-50-128-247-dsl.rkv.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
15:23<gynter>hello, is it possible to destroy an industry in network game when server is running as dedicated?
15:23<gynter>openttd0.6.3
15:23<dihedral>nope
15:23<dihedral>unless the map has a chat enabled
15:23*planetmaker donates an "e"
15:23<gynter>and not possible to enable cheat runtime?
15:24<planetmaker>no
15:24*Roest1 grabs the e
15:24<gynter>darn
15:24<dihedral>thanks pm
15:24<gynter>k, thanks
15:24<planetmaker>:) you're welcome
15:24-!-Roest1 is now known as Roest
15:24<dihedral>why on earth would you want to delete an indu?
15:24<Roest>because it's in the way?
15:24<Eddi|zuHause>Belugas_nomade has a "chat" ;)
15:25<dihedral>Roest, no such thing :-P
15:25<+glx>Eddi|zuHause: it's a "chatte" :)
15:25<dihedral>that'd be something for the 'i want realism in the game' users: oh - the indu is in my way, lets shift it 2 tails to the south
15:26<dihedral>glx, IT's ?
15:26<Eddi|zuHause>glx: close enough ;)
15:26<gynter>dihedral, 64x64 map and some unneeded industries :P
15:26<dihedral>then just wait for it to die
15:26<gynter>takes too long :)
15:26<dihedral>patience is a virtue
15:26<Ammler>gynter: just enable chat mode in local and transfer to server
15:26<Eddi|zuHause>dihedral: why not "it"? i would say it like that in german, too
15:26<energetic>realism is a virtue too
15:27<Ammler>*cheat
15:27<dihedral>Eddi|zuHause, because german and english differ?
15:27<dihedral>:-P
15:27<dihedral>just slightly
15:27<gynter>in real world with money you can close down industries you don't like :)
15:28<gynter>just buy em
15:28<dihedral>dschust zat vee smaaal bit
15:28<Eddi|zuHause>english is a simplified german with a tad of french vocabulary
15:28<dihedral>ouch
15:28<planetmaker>lol
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>well, that covers most of the english language really well...
15:29<@Bjarni><dihedral> what difference would that make? <-- basically mac keyboards has lots of interesting keys, like  µ and ·
15:29<@Bjarni>I really like  :D
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>that first one does not display
15:29<@Bjarni>:s
15:30<@Bjarni>then you need more than just a decent keyboard :P
15:30<@Bjarni>...
15:30<@Bjarni>google failed to find it too
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>and all german keyboards had µ as long as i can think back
15:31<Eddi|zuHause>on AltGr+M
15:31<dihedral>[21:30] <Bjarni> I really like  :D <- yes here too, but also like √
15:32<dihedral>[ ] interested [√] not interested <- :-P
15:32<@Bjarni>nice one
15:32<Eddi|zuHause>technically, that's supposed to be a "square root" symbol :p
15:32<+glx>µ is shifg+*
15:33<Eddi|zuHause>shift+* is not possible, because * is already shift++ (:p)
15:33<gynter>Ammler, what you mean? Do I have to restart server then?
15:33<Ammler>no, just reload
15:33<@Bjarni>http://www.evertype.com/standards/csur/klingon-table.gif <-- LOL, Klingon unicode :D
15:33<Ammler>gynter: !rcon load <uploadedsave>
15:34<Prof_Frink>dihedral: ?
15:34<Eddi|zuHause>Bjarni: we are still waiting for your klingon translation
15:34<@Bjarni><Eddi|zuHause> that first one does not display <-- It's the first char in this line http://www.decodeunicode.org/de/data/a//XS/AppleLogo.jpg
15:35<dihedral>Ammler, i doubt he's using ap+
15:35<dihedral>Prof_Frink, ?
15:36<Prof_Frink>Giving you a proper tick
15:36*petern wonders if the server he just lennyised will come back up
15:37<@petern>ooh
15:37<@petern>it took 2 minutes to start pinging...
15:38<@petern>oh right, it has a hardware RAID 5... that'll do it
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15:49<Eddi|zuHause># the tree, that wanted to be a beautiful book
15:49<Eddi|zuHause># it would die, if that's what it took
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15:50<Eddi|zuHause># in the shades of the woods
15:51<Eddi|zuHause># sat a bear who dreamed of being a poet's coat
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15:58<Sacro>Did someone fiddle with tables.h?
15:59<Sacro>my housemate has a town called Cuntfingford
15:59<Sacro>I thought Cunt* was blocked?
15:59<@petern>tables.h, eh?
16:00<Sacro>errm, whereever it iwas
16:00<Sacro>not looked in the source
16:00<Sacro>i recall there being a table of banned prefixes
16:02<@petern>well it should be replaced if it's from the english or additional english town names
16:02<Sacro>It seems not
16:03<Sacro>0.7.0 beta 1
16:03<Sacro>win32 installer
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16:08<@petern>mmm, threaded perl scripts
16:08<@petern>well the code is in there to do the replacement, so it should
16:08-!-smeding_ [~smeding@5354BE76.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
16:09<Sacro>well it didn't work :p
16:11-!-tkjacobsen [~tkjacobse@pppoe2-ves.broadcom.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:11<@petern>oh
16:11<@petern>and that code hasn't been touched since r1608
16:11<Sacro>hehe
16:11<Sacro>well he got Cuntfingford
16:12<Sacro>we chortled
16:16<@Bjarni>somebody made a bugreport about this and then MYOB said "well that explains Cunttown" when ludde worked on a fix
16:17<@Bjarni>ludde added some sort of filter but it looks like profanity filters fails big time in Hull :P
16:17<Sacro>Yeah
16:17<Sacro>talking of fail
16:17<Sacro>nice to see you again Bjarni
16:17<@Bjarni>o_O
16:17<@Bjarni>fail...
16:18<@Bjarni>I passed the exams
16:18<@Bjarni>in fact I got an email last week telling me that I also passed the last exam :)
16:20<el_en>Hull is a profanity?
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16:25<@Bjarni>I guess it could be considered a profanity
16:25<Prof_Frink>el_en: Yes. But there's no H.
16:26<Eddi|zuHause>so they can't bend it?
16:27*el_en booted to Open Firmware for the first time today
16:27<@petern>did you feel special?
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16:30<el_en>yeah. half of the world's population has never used a phone, but even fewer have ever booted to Open Firmware.
16:31<@Bjarni>petern: that's a silly question. We already learned that el_en is a "special" person
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16:32<Eddi|zuHause>you meant to say "special needs" :P
16:34<@Bjarni>no... I meant "special" in the nice way. It's a nice way to refer to a person with a certain brain capacity
16:34<@Bjarni>Forrest Gump is "special" ;)
16:40<Wolf01>'night
16:40<el_en>night
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16:43<el_en>Eddi|zuHause: is that supposed to be an insult?
16:43<Eddi|zuHause>no.
16:43<el_en>good.
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16:49<worldemar>el_en: half of the world's population has never used a phone... really?
16:49*worldemar can't believe that
16:50*KingJ can't beleive that worldemar can't beleive it
16:51<worldemar>of course i can, but _half_!
16:52*worldemar feelss "special" having cellphone
16:52<worldemar>s/ss/s
16:52<worldemar>s/ss/s/
16:52<worldemar>>_<
16:54<@Bjarni>cellphone?
16:55<@Bjarni>are you supposed to have such a gadget?
16:56<worldemar>maybe my english is crappy... but how i should call this small thing if i can make a "call" with it to any other person with similar one?
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16:57<planetmaker>mobile?
16:58<Prof_Frink>cocoa tins and some string?
16:58<worldemar>what differs mobile from cellphone?
16:59<dihedral>one is AE, the other is BE (wrt cellphone and mobile)
16:59<worldemar>o, yeah... cool...
16:59<worldemar>and what is AE and BE?
17:00<dihedral>American English, British English
17:00<Prof_Frink>Merkin English and English English.
17:00<el_en>worldemar: http://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=threadview&id=20411
17:01<worldemar>google...
17:02-!-Dred_furst [~Dred@resnet674.bournemouth.ac.uk] has joined #openttd
17:05<worldemar>Bjarni: okay, now i know i have such gadget)
17:05<worldemar>cellphone or mobile or cellmobile or...
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17:09<@Bjarni> <Prof_Frink> Merkin English and English English. <-- I thought it was corrupted English and real English :/
17:10<dihedral>whatever the americans did with it, it's not worthy being called 'english' nomore
17:11*worldemar is being corrupted :(
17:11<FauxFaux>You mean "American" and "English", right?
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17:12<dihedral>Americans should not be allowed to use the name of that language for their own language
17:13<dihedral>and americans are not native english speakers
17:13<dihedral>they only thing they are native in is idiocy
17:14<el_en>maybe that's why the language in TTD was named American.
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17:52<arex\>How can I change start capital?
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18:00<Ammler>arex\: ctrl+alt+c
18:00<Ammler>or with difficult settings
18:00<arex\>Almost tried it
18:00<Ammler>:-)
18:00<arex\>:-D
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18:17<arex\>finger
18:17<arex\>oh. finger.openttd.org
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18:58<Morloth>Hi everyone :)
18:58<SmatZ>hello :)
18:59<Morloth>d0h :P
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19:02<Belugas_nomade>hello Morloth
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19:23<Morloth>Hi Belugas_nomade
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19:42<Felicitus>morning
19:42<Felicitus>planetmaker: around?
19:42<planetmaker>somewhat... but sleepy :)
19:42<Felicitus>:)
19:43<Felicitus>what version of openttd do you use?
19:43<planetmaker>I should be sleeping for two hours already :P
19:43<Morloth>Hey Felicitus! How is your AI progressing? :)
19:43<planetmaker>r15549
19:43<Felicitus>Morloth: pretty well!
19:43<Felicitus>but i have to find out why it doesnt work on planetmaker's box
19:43<planetmaker>I'm not 100% sure, if I put everything in the right place. Maybe we walk through it together :)
19:44<Felicitus>yes but that it breaks in info.nut line 1 is odd
19:44<planetmaker>I'm not too experienced with the setup of AIs :)
19:44<planetmaker>e.g. all I ever got were from bananas.
19:45<planetmaker>(though I tested two in noai-times)
19:46<Felicitus>hmm 15549 should be alright
19:46<planetmaker>so... where exactly do I move this folder (or those two folders, felicitusAI and library)? Where are they at your place?
19:46<Felicitus>well, i have tar'ed them in bin/ai
19:47<planetmaker>I even made a tar of felicitusAI and put it in various places.
19:47<Felicitus>so if you are on *nix, just uncompress them in bin/ai
19:47<planetmaker>bin/ai? hm...
19:47<Felicitus>so you have bin/ai/FelicitusAI in the end
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19:47<Felicitus>do you have a binary build?
19:48<planetmaker>what do you mean?
19:48<Felicitus>i mean if you downloaded a binary version (e.g. the nightly) or if you built openttd from source
19:48<Morloth>Felicitus: Can you send me a copy as well? I'm keen to try it :)
19:48<planetmaker>oh, self-compiled
19:48<Felicitus>Morloth: yes, try http://www.timohummel.com/temp/felicitus-ai-0.1.tgz
19:48<Morloth>great, thx! L)(
19:48<Morloth>:)
19:49<Felicitus>planetmaker: on linux?
19:49<planetmaker>mac :)
19:49<Felicitus>oh :)
19:49<planetmaker>so basically it's the same from the handling perspective
19:49<planetmaker>bash is bash
19:49<Felicitus>yep :)
19:49<Felicitus>so you should have a folder "ai" inside the folder you've got your openttd binary
19:49<Felicitus>and the stuff goes into that ai folder
19:50<Felicitus>e.g. i got my binary in /home/timo/workspace/openttd-git/bin
19:50<Morloth>planetmaker: Put it in ~/Documents/Openttd/content_download/ai
19:50<Felicitus>so i have my ai folder in /home/timo/workspace/openttd-git/bin/ai
19:50<planetmaker>let me compile latest trunk
19:50<planetmaker>and put it in there
19:50<Felicitus>yes but that it gives you an error means that it is in the right folder, i just have no clue why it doesn't compile the info.nut file
19:51<Felicitus>its just "class FelicitusAI extends AIInfo {" in there
19:51<@Rubidium>dos vs unix newlines?
19:52<Felicitus>hmm i'm not sure, let me check
19:52<planetmaker>hm... just got an idea...
19:52<Felicitus>CRLF, that's dos, right?
19:52<planetmaker>hg doesn't automatically pull 3rdparty
19:53<planetmaker>4 changes...
19:53<Morloth>Felicitus: I get an error when starting your AI. I'll upload a screenshot 1 sec
19:54<Zahl>Rubidium: do you know of any memory leaks in ottd? or did i just skrew something up when i compiled it
19:54<Morloth>Felicitus: http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/Unnamed,%2015th%20Jan%201950.png
19:55<@Rubidium>depending on what OS there might be a few OS related things; SDL leaks a bit, gethostname might leak a bit, but don't know of any openttd leaks (in Linux)
19:55<Felicitus>Morloth: do you have a Pathfainder.Rail-library from bananas? if yes, you need to make sure it loads the bundled one
19:55<Morloth>Felicitus: You mean the one you provided?
19:56<Felicitus>Morloth: yes. because the one from bananas doesn't work for me, i have to talk to yexo to make a change
19:57<Zahl>hmmm
19:57<Zahl>i compiled on windows using vs2005
19:58<Zahl>memory usage increases by 4kb every few seconds
19:58<Felicitus>Morloth: so just move the .tar out of content_download and you should be fine :)
19:58<@Rubidium>I don't know about any Windows abstraction layer leaks
19:58<planetmaker>Felicitus: http://paste.openttd.org/179850 <-- full output with latest trunk
19:58<@Rubidium>but that's because I've never ever tested it
19:59<planetmaker>there's a number of "taking first library of two same versions", but always yours take precedence
19:59<Zahl>i also compiled the dedicated server on linux, but i don't know how to interpret the values top displays :>
19:59<Felicitus>planetmaker: i'm just converting all line breaks, give me a few minutes
19:59<planetmaker>you think that's it?
20:00<@Rubidium>Zahl: how are you determining memory leaks?
20:00<Felicitus>planetmaker: yes. try the file again
20:00<Zahl>well, basically just increasing memory usage
20:00<planetmaker>Felicitus: which?
20:00<Felicitus>http://www.timohummel.com/temp/felicitus-ai-0.1.tgz
20:01<@Rubidium>Zahl: that doesn't tell much about real leaks or just the game state getting bigger
20:01<Morloth>Felicitus: Still no succes :(. http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/Unnamed,%208th%20Feb%201950.png
20:01<Felicitus>Morloth: openttd version too old :) let me look up which release you need
20:02<Zahl>Rubidium: well after restarting the game and loading the savegame again it drops down again... at the beginning its around 30MB and after some hours its up to 120MB or more and the gameplay gets jerky
20:02<planetmaker>just to make sure I don't do a stupid mistake. Just unzip and put the stuff in bin/ai, right?
20:02<Felicitus>planetmaker: yep
20:02<@Rubidium>Zahl: running with AIs?
20:02<Zahl>nope
20:02<Morloth>Felicitus: I'll download the latest nightly
20:02<Felicitus>Morloth: yes, that should do the trick
20:02<@Rubidium>Zahl: is your build modified?
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20:03<Felicitus>GetPower was introduced not too long ago, around r15530
20:03<Zahl>Rubidium: yes, but i only made days last 20 times longer, so that really shouldn't cause it
20:04<Felicitus>okay, you need at least r15524, Morloth
20:04<@Rubidium>Zahl: thing is, I've never heard anybody talk about the behaviour you're having
20:04<planetmaker>works :)
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20:05<Zahl>Rubidium: oh and on the linux dedicated i don't see any steady memory increasement, but the "VIRT" column in top says 3055M, which soulds wierd to me
20:05<Zahl>i'll have a look at this tomorrow, i just discovered it today
20:05<@Rubidium>what version?
20:05<Felicitus>planetmaker: perfect :)
20:05<Felicitus>Rubidium: thanks for the line endings tip :)
20:05<planetmaker>:)
20:05<Zahl>Rubidium: r15476
20:06<@Rubidium>Zahl: got no clue then; maybe you can make it reproducable by: load this game, wait X amount of time in clean trunk
20:06<Zahl>yeah i'll try this
20:07<Morloth>Felicitus: Working :)
20:07<Felicitus>great! :)
20:08<planetmaker>though... the script now got an error...
20:08<@Rubidium>Felicitus: using mingw/cygwin?
20:08<Felicitus>Rubidium: no, eclipse on linux. probably CRLF was default for some reason
20:08<Felicitus>planetmaker: which one?
20:09<Morloth>Felicitus: I'm only a little bit afraid you use a to high WA* algorithm, it's a little bit to much inclined to go to the target. The pathfinder will be faster (usually), but the tracks get a little to curvy IMHO.
20:10<Morloth>But otherwise it's an impressive start! :)
20:10<Felicitus>Morloth: yes, right now it iterates through the path a few times. i have to change that
20:10<planetmaker>http://www.openttdcoop.org/files/pm/patches/felicitasAI.png <-- Felicitus
20:10<Felicitus>how often did it put out "transferring ..." ?
20:11<Felicitus>planetmaker: did you just put the tar there or did you untar the stuff?
20:11<planetmaker>I just put the tar there
20:11<planetmaker>should I have put library seperate?
20:11<Felicitus>oh pleae untar it. i use relative include directives, which might not work with tar files
20:11<Felicitus>no
20:11<Felicitus>just do a tar xfv
20:12<Felicitus>Morloth: because for every "transferring..." line, it does 2 pathbuilder calls for now
20:13<planetmaker>hehe. Timestamps from the future ;)
20:13<Felicitus>:) it's 02:13 am here
20:13<Morloth>Felicitus: http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/Unnamed,%205th%20Jan%201951.png http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/curvy1.png http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/curvy2.png
20:13<@Rubidium>hmm, \r\n should't matter, but why does it:
20:15<Felicitus>Morloth: yep, i know :) i might have to adjust the multiplier a littlebit better, right now it's using a multiplier of 2, which might be too much
20:15<planetmaker>that did the trick, Felicitus :)
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20:15<planetmaker>it's building!
20:15<Felicitus>planetmaker: great :)
20:15<Morloth>Felicitus: I'd say so ;)
20:15<planetmaker>indeed :) Your work! :)
20:15<Felicitus>well without yexo and the others, it wouldnt be possible
20:15<Felicitus>imagine if i really built my own pathfinder - i wouldn't be so far with the engine
20:16<Zahl>Rubidium: just downloaded the latest nightly build and loaded my savegame, it seems to be the same thing there... about 4kb every second
20:16<Morloth>Well, we're all here to help each other :)
20:16<Felicitus>Morloth: but using the stock rail pathfinder was too slow - it took months to find a route for a distance of, let's say, 200
20:16<Morloth>But I really like your iterative approach to building train stations
20:16<Zahl>Rubidium: i'll leave the game open without doing anything for some time...
20:17<Morloth>Felicitus: Yeah, it usually takes a bit of fiddling with the multipliers and other magic numbers before you find the 'sweet spot'
20:17<planetmaker>it doesn't build hubs yet, does it?
20:18<Felicitus>Morloth: if you want, you can change the multiplicator (yes, i know, it's called multiplier :)) in industry_connector.nut line 559 and line.nut line 118. try 1.5 or 1.1
20:18<Morloth>Felicitus: sure :)
20:18<Felicitus>planetmaker: no not yet, i have to finish the upgrading stuff first, there are still some problems, and i want that the station builder can do terraforming
20:19<planetmaker>track builder should do that moderately, too
20:19<planetmaker>it's building partially unnecessary slow curves
20:19<Felicitus>because right now, it rarely builds a station with a two track main line
20:19<Felicitus>planetmaker: yes
20:19<Morloth>Damn Felicitus you managed to write quite some code the last few days!
20:20<Felicitus>be glad that i documented only the station builder so far, it would be much more stuff then ;)
20:20<Felicitus>(but less code)
20:20<@Rubidium>Zahl: first few seconds my OpenTTD seems to be using more memory, but after that it doesn't change at all (for at least 2 minutes)
20:21<@Rubidium>that's fast forward without gui in a newly started game
20:21<Zahl>it started at 28M after i loaded the game.. now its at 33M
20:21<Zahl>the savegame i loaded has 5 companies and about 600 trains
20:21<+glx>Felicitus: if you modified pf.rail increase it's version (I just read the logs quickly)
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20:21<Felicitus>glx: good idea
20:22<+glx>that way it will pick the right one without problem
20:22<+glx>as both seems incompatible ;)
20:22<Felicitus>yep
20:23<+glx>Zahl: what's map size ?
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20:23<Zahl>1024x1024
20:23<+glx>@calc 1024*1204
20:23<@DorpsGek>glx: 1232896
20:23<+glx>@calc 1232896 * 9
20:23<@DorpsGek>glx: 11096064
20:24<Zahl>anyone else using windows to verify this?
20:24<+glx>that's map memory usage in bytes
20:24<Zahl>hm ok
20:24<Zahl>reached 35M now
20:24<welshdragon>does any mac user know how to solve the issue of a vista pc not being able to see a msacbook?
20:24<+glx>then add vehicules :)
20:25<Morloth> /* I know this function is ugly, but it's 5:30 am ;) */ << I love programmer's idea of documentation ;)
20:25<planetmaker>Felicitus: it doesn't seem to find profitable routes anymore...
20:25<Felicitus>planetmaker: how much lines did he built=
20:25<Felicitus>?
20:25<Felicitus>and has he got money left? :)
20:25<planetmaker>180k
20:25<+glx>welshdragon: firewall
20:25<Felicitus>hmm
20:25<planetmaker>256^2 with few
20:25<Felicitus>maybe its out of money
20:25<planetmaker>it calculates. But calculated routes' profit gets less and less
20:26<welshdragon>glx: hmm, but it's on a lan, and firewall on vsta is disabled
20:26<planetmaker>started with something like 12k
20:26<+glx>are they in the same workgroup ?
20:26<planetmaker>now down to just below 8k
20:26<@Rubidium>hmm, memory usage tracking is tricky with industries popping up
20:26<Felicitus>planetmaker: yes thats okay, that means that the good profit lines are too expensive to build, so it just iterates down until he finds one to build. if you want, you can use the money cheat and see what it does
20:26<@Rubidium>(or windows popping up)
20:26<welshdragon>yep
20:26<planetmaker>ah, ok.
20:27<+glx>welshdragon: can you access it using its IP ?
20:27<welshdragon>glx: see /query
20:29<planetmaker>well... actually... it should have much more.
20:29<planetmaker>it's making good profit
20:29<planetmaker>180k was my money :P
20:29<Felicitus>:D
20:29<Morloth>lol :)
20:29<planetmaker>it has 3 million
20:30<Felicitus>wow :) not bad for many lines, with one train each ;)
20:30<planetmaker>3 lines
20:30<planetmaker>8 years
20:31<Felicitus>well right now its only one train per line, so one of my next goals is to make it 2 track main line with dynamic train adding&removing
20:31<planetmaker>4 million
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20:31<Felicitus>yes, because the lines are so damn long, he makes a good profit, but the station rating goes down alot, so it could be much more profit
20:32<planetmaker>each train makes 180k/yr profit
20:33<Morloth>But an excelent begin. Your code seems to be pretty well organized :)
20:33<planetmaker>very much so
20:33<planetmaker>funnily it built two adjacent stations at one powerplant
20:34<Felicitus>yes, doesnt support a line network yet :) so everything is individual for now
20:34<planetmaker>oh... it built a lot more now :)
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20:34<Zahl>38M ....
20:34-!-Jolt [~jolteon@5acb31ae.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:34<Felicitus>okay, time for a smoke, then let's see what evil things i could teach my AI then :D
20:34<Morloth>I'd go for a backflip!
20:36<planetmaker>http://www.openttdcoop.org/files/pm/patches/mapcenter.png <--- hehe. Things are getting crowded in the map center
20:36<Morloth>wow!
20:38<planetmaker>it's only 256^2. So every line crosses there.
20:38<planetmaker>http://www.openttdcoop.org/files/pm/patches/pathfinder.png <-- that line looks peculiar...
20:40<Morloth>Ai, the AI seems to have a problem with the bigger stations
20:41<Morloth>http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~bridder/Unnamed,%2021st%20Mar%201955.png
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20:43<planetmaker>Felicitus: http://www.openttdcoop.org/files/pm/patches/stationplacement.png <--- you might want to re-consider your stationplacement. Not every tile where you can build obviously is desirable to be build upon...
20:46<Felicitus>Morloth: yes, it blocks itself there (the pathfinder assumes that the tile is taken, and don't notice that it could build a diagonal track there)
20:46<planetmaker>I'm off for today. If you want to look at the save: http://www.openttdcoop.org/files/pm/patches/olsheim_transport.sav
20:46<Felicitus>planetmaker: that won't happen later, as it would connect the two lines to a single track/station
20:46<Felicitus>good night planetmaker
20:47<planetmaker>good night / day / morning (whatever fits ;) )
20:47<Felicitus>:)
20:47<Morloth>nn planetmaker :)
20:51<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r15554 /trunk/src/highscore_gui.cpp: -Fix: -v null crashing in 2051 due to trying to show the high score of the spectator.
20:59<Zahl>55M... going to bed now
20:59<Zahl>gnite
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