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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-02-26

---Logopened Thu Feb 26 00:00:10 2009
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02:03<Timitry>One question... When writing english texts, would you write Path Signals and Block Signals in uppercase letters because those are proper nouns or write them in lowercase like everything else?
02:10<planetmaker>they're imo normal nowns
02:10<planetmaker>good morning #openttd :)
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02:13<Forked>morning =)
02:13<Yexo>morning :)
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02:25<Timitry>planetmaker: So that means you would write them lower- or uppercase?
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02:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r15587 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_vehiclelist.cpp: -Fix (r15345): I should really test even those simple api functions better.
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02:38<planetmaker>Timitry: I'd write it lower case. It's not a name imo
02:38<planetmaker>it's a word like washing machine
02:39<planetmaker>I don't write that with capital letters only because "washing" specifies what kind of machine it is.
02:41<planetmaker>it would be different if it were Timitry-signals :P
02:42<Timitry>Hehe, okay, guess you got a point there :)
02:42<Timitry>I wrote them lowercase now
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04:25<Timitry>morning dihedral
04:25*dihedral just sat through a 2 hour (unscheduled) meeting :-S
04:26<Timitry>Uh, what do you do?
04:26<dihedral>admin and soft-dev
04:34<Timitry>Hehe :)
04:34<planetmaker>g'morning dihedral :)
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04:36<dihedral>hey pm
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04:43<Timitry>Hm, anyone knows if it's possible on "our" wiki, that if you have inlined an image, to stop the inline, so that the following text will be under the image rather than at the side of it? In the "original" wikipedia, this is possible with {{subst:Absatz}}, but "our" wiki does not know that command...
04:49<dihedral>Timitry, i am pretty sure that the wiki also has documentation
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04:54<Timitry>Ah, found it...
04:54<Timitry>Well-hidden, and also just on the regular wikipedia
04:54<Timitry><br clear="all" />
04:55<db48x>standard html stuff
04:55<Timitry>well, yeah
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04:56<Timitry>although i'm not really used to things like that anymore, i'd rather use <br style="clear:both;">
04:57<db48x>yea, me too
04:57<db48x>or just clear: both on whatever comes next
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04:57<db48x>the paragraph itself
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05:26<Timitry>I guess i'm almost ready to replace most of the wikis content on junctions ;-)
05:26<Timitry>What do you think?
05:27<@petern>i think any article on junctions is pointless
05:27<@petern>i like that page
05:27<@petern>which is just simple advance
05:28<@petern>but any page which gives a junction layout to use is pointless
05:29<KingJ>Looks better than what's currently on the junctions page
05:30<@petern>all the example junction pages linked from the current junction are horrible
05:33<KingJ>The only problem I have with examples is that I build my trains the other way round, up on the left, down on the right
05:34<Timitry>Hehe, UKler are not being considered ;)
05:34<Timitry>And my pages aim to give players a basic knowledge on how to build junctions & show them what's important, so they can build their own
05:39<Ammler>are saves with noai-ais compatible to newer versions?
05:40<Ammler>dbg: [ai] The AI died unexpectedly.
05:40<@petern>i would guess that's up to the AI
05:41<@Rubidium>Ammler: they can be, but it up to the author (assuming you mean never versions of the AI)
05:41<Ammler>I meant, is it possible to update nightly?
05:42<Ammler>what else could this debug output mean?
05:42<@Rubidium>that the AIs saveload code is broken
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05:45<Ammler>hmm. loading an older autosave seems to work, strange.
05:47<Ammler>no, fail alarm :-(
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06:47<planetmaker>apropos debug output: is there a way to obtain AI debug output (AI console) as a text file instead of the ingame console?
06:49<dihedral>openttd -d ai=9 2>filename
06:57<planetmaker>hm :)
06:57<planetmaker>that's all ai-related output. But if I only want the one related to one?
07:04<dihedral>then you switch the 2 (stderr with stdout), pipe it through grep and send that output to a file :-P
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07:11<planetmaker>doesn't sound ideal. Alas it will work
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08:36<Forked>new guy who hasn't read a thing alert on forum.. beeeeooooooooop
08:37<planetmaker> <-- that one? yeah... :S
08:39<dihedral>that's alain
08:39<planetmaker>outch. even worse...
08:40<dihedral>would take an admin to check the ip's
08:40<dihedral>or mod
08:40<planetmaker> <-- the answer :P
08:43<dihedral>i read one line and gave up
08:43<planetmaker>well... something with bus and same orders
08:43<planetmaker>I only skimmed it :P
08:45<Forked>shared orders for ze win
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09:07<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r15588 /trunk/src/ (economy.cpp saveload/afterload.cpp station_cmd.cpp): -Fix: change owner of waypoints and deleted stations when merging companies or when a company benkrupts
09:11<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r15589 /trunk/src/ (waypoint.cpp waypoint_gui.cpp):
09:11<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Fix: drawing of waypoints with invalid owner was broken
09:11<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Change: don't take over waypoints without owner, it could belong to a bankrupted company (and the code was broken) - savegame conversion code is a bit more liberal now, too
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09:16<dihedral>orudge, around?
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09:25<Ammler>why doesn't have network_server.tmp have extension sav?
09:25<Ammler>he, -1have
09:26<Ammler>(or not)
09:27<Ammler>or how to load that save over rcon?
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09:40<dihedral>Ammler, the file is not as up to date as your autosaves
09:41<dihedral>at least not on my dedicated server
09:41<dihedral>it's not like the server writes the gamestate to it all the time!
09:42<Brokkoli>but it is a savegame
09:43<Brokkoli>so why not .sav
09:43<Ammler>dihedral: it is the save from last join, afaik.
09:43<Ammler>very usefull if you join, change something and want to revert it.
09:44<dihedral>Ammler: start a thread in the forums :-D
09:44<Ammler>about what?
09:45<dihedral>your fake 'undo' thingy :-P
09:45<Ammler>oh well, it was just a question, you can load it with -g
09:46<Ammler>but there might be something in, which isn't in usual saves...
09:47<Ammler>(or opposite)
09:47<@Rubidium>a scenario is a savegame too, why isn't it .sav?
09:47<@Rubidium>a tt(o|d(p)) is a savegame, why isn't it .sav?
09:48<Ammler>well, you go to far now :P
09:51<dihedral>Ammler, would you not rather want to ask why the load command on openttd's console does not let you load the tmp file?
09:52<Ammler>dihedral: I guess, you can
09:52<Ammler>with load <num>
09:52<Ammler>so no, that would be the wrong question :P
09:52<dihedral>then what is the problem if you can load it that way?
09:53<Ammler>it isn't that easy to determine that number...
09:53<Ammler>specially if you have 255 autosaves ;-)
09:54<dihedral>and what is the problem with quit and loading the game with -g?
09:54<Ammler>even ap can't do that
09:55<dihedral>Ammler, if you are using ap you can write a custom command that will run ls, search the output for the file you are looking for and run load with the appropriate file number
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10:02<dihedral>ah perfect
10:05<planetmaker>Rubidium: how come you think that people actually should start reading sticky posts?! :P
10:06<dihedral>they have the same standing as readme files :_D
10:07<dihedral>uh - the smiley got a punch in the face by the looks of it
10:07<planetmaker>do-not-readmes :P
10:08<dihedral>esp not if you are dislexic - you then read nothing
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11:31<Eddi|zuHause>that bus guy appears to be a little slow...
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11:38<SmatZ>Eddi|zuHause: yeah :-) I stopped replying him...
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12:46<Aali>I see squirrel moved into the main repo
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12:46<Aali>good stuff
12:51<@Belugas>so said my pusher
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13:16<batti5>is thare anybody hoo can help me, to make a grf of stripes i made?
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14:01<Aali>oh and MSVC is not too happy about the extern declaration for _screenshot_name in openttd.cpp
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14:01<Aali>you get some link-time warnings
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14:11<energetic>are there icons present representing city and town?
14:11<@Rubidium>Und ich sehe, dass das hier eine Sinnlose Diskussion wird!Sauer
14:13<@Rubidium>right... don't clean up your desk and hit your mouse, especially after browsing some german site
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14:25<energetic>Filter by town or city
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14:31<SmatZ>energetic: 403
14:31<SmatZ>ehlo Wolf01
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14:39<energetic>that one should work better
14:40<energetic>im not satisfied by the icons yet, they both can be improved i think
14:41<energetic>But Im sure you will get the idea
14:43<@Belugas>a filtering?
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14:49<@Belugas>a buffering?
14:50<@Belugas>a buggering?
14:50<@Belugas>a nothing?
14:50<@Belugas>a that-thing?
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14:50<@Belugas>a quiting!
14:51<frosch123>energetic: you should also put the icon in each row
14:55<Alberth>Belugas: apparently it is so secret nobody wants to tell
14:58<@Belugas>so secret i can only tell stupidity about it too...
15:01<Yexo_><Aali> oh and MSVC is not too happy about the extern declaration for _screenshot_name in openttd.cpp <- what are the warnings you get? (and what msvc vesion do you use?)
15:06<el_en>oaic 10floW
15:07<George>frosch123: what result should CB 2D return to have CC1 and no CC2 (default green) if vehicle is defined as 2CC? Failing callback acts like 00 C0
15:07<George>is there any value that does not requre calculation?
15:09<Aali>Yexo_: 2008 Express, and its complaining about conflicting types (char * in openttd.cpp, char[128] in screenshot.cpp)
15:09<frosch123>George: without calculation - no
15:10<Yexo_>I wonder why I didn't get that warning, using MSVC 2008 express myself too
15:10<Aali>only on release builds
15:10<Aali>debug builds get no warning
15:10<Yexo_>ah, that'll be the reason :)
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15:11<Belgabor>Hi guys, are screenshots currently broken in trunk?
15:11<Yexo_>not as faras I know
15:11<Aali>we were just discussing that
15:11<Aali>and yes they are
15:12<Yexo_>Aali: link warnings != broken
15:12<Aali>it crashes the game
15:12<Yexo_>I see
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15:13<Aali>(I didn't know that either, just tried it now)
15:13<+glx>that's something for SmatZ I guess
15:14<Yexo_>glx: it was my codechange that broke it
15:14<+glx>I though he played in this area
15:14<Yexo_>@commit 15584
15:14<@DorpsGek>Yexo_: Commit by yexo :: r15584 /trunk/src (11 files in 2 dirs) (2009-02-25 21:45:14 UTC)
15:14<@DorpsGek>Yexo_: -Codechange: Move several variables from variables.h to more appropriate headers.
15:14<Belgabor>segfault somewhere in the string/UTF8 handling
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15:15<SmatZ>glx: Belgabor I will have a look :)
15:15<Belgabor>want a backtrace? Just have it ready :p
15:15<Yexo_>SmatZ: changing openttd.cpp line 718 to : extern char _screenshot_name[128]; fixs it
15:15<SmatZ>Belgabor: would be good :)
15:15<Aali>^ what he said
15:15<Yexo_>just that isn't a nice fix
15:16<Belgabor>gimme a sec to pastebin it
15:18<SmatZ>Yexo_: why it isn't nice? it's as "nice" as current trunk ;)
15:18<SmatZ>broken by r15584 btw
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15:19<frosch123>what a redundant discussion :)
15:20<SmatZ>Yexo: placing that extern in screenshot.h is not a solution?
15:20<Yexo>that's also an option, but the only place it's used is in openttd.cpp
15:21<SmatZ>or move ShowScreenshotResult to screenshot.cpp
15:22<frosch123>George: however, your computation consists of a single addition, resp. one varaction2 without computation would be sufficient, as the 1cc recolour maps have fixed numbers
15:24<George>I know that. I was interesting about a single value that has this effect. Something like magic value 00 C0 that applies both CC1 and CC2
15:24<Yexo>SmatZ: screenshot.cpp currently doesn't include any string headers
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15:25<Yexo> <- still needs some includes in screenshot.cpp
15:25<Yexo>but I prefer the first diff
15:26<Belgabor>Other question: how does the showing of PBS reserved tracks work? Are these special sprites or are existing ones somehow automatically modified? I'm thinking about making some more visible 32bpp replacement (at least for the maglevs) if possible.
15:26<SmatZ>Belgabor: existing ones are drawn in PALETTE_TO_GREY or so...
15:27<SmatZ>Yexo: but the second removes one extern and moves screenshot-related function from openttd.cpp to screenshot.cpp
15:27<SmatZ>also, instead of making enum with 1 item, it's better to define static const uint
15:27<Belgabor>ic, damn, I sispected something like that. Unfortunately it hardly makes a difference for the maglevs.
15:28<Yexo>SmatZ: I've also the smallest fix:
15:28<SmatZ>Yexo: though, there is a MAX_PATH macro... maybe it can be used instead?
15:28<+michi_cc>Belgabor: single track sprites modified with PALETTE_CRASH to be exact
15:28<SmatZ>Yexo: that's the best :)
15:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r15590 /trunk/src/openttd.cpp: -Fix (r15584): _screenshot_name is an array, not a char * pointer.
15:31<Belgabor>Has anyone considered how that should/will work with 32bpp?
15:33<frosch123>it does work as less as drawing crashed vehicles
15:34<Belgabor>Thanks for the screenshot fix =)
15:34<Belgabor>frosch123, in other words "no" :p
15:35<frosch123>but you can include 8bpp pixels in 32bpp sprites
15:36<frosch123>also the most important part of 32bpp is the alpha channel
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15:36<Belgabor>frosch123, you mean with the masks mostly intended for company colors?
15:37<frosch123>where did you read "mostly intended for company colors" ?
15:37<frosch123>but yes
15:39<Belgabor>nowhere, I just learned about it in that context =)
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15:48<LUADuck>Hey guys
15:50<LUADuck>Anyone got any experience with Autopilot?
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15:52<energetic>frosch123: you mean like in front of every town to indicate it is a town or city?
15:52<frosch123>more like: in the same column as the buttons
15:53<energetic>you mean above the two sort buttons or left from it placed?
15:54<frosch123>I meant right aligned
15:54<LUADuck>Yeah, anyone got any experience with Autopilot?
15:54<LUADuck>or could you send me in the direction of a channel that do
15:55-!-andy` [] has joined #openttd
15:55<energetic>like the station window, first filter buttons then sort buttons
15:55<frosch123>LUADuck: I have no idea of autopilot, but if you would ask you question someone might answer you
15:56<planetmaker>LUADuck: autopilot or ap+ ?
15:56<Yexo>LUADuck: if you really want another channel, try #openttd.ap or #ap+ (the latter if for ap+)
15:56<planetmaker>then dih the person of your choice
15:56<planetmaker>and visit the channels Yexo mentioned :)
15:56<planetmaker>at least the first is frequented
15:57<LUADuck>Well openttd.ap is empty
15:57<LUADuck>And FYP ap+ redirects
15:57<frosch123>energetic: however, if you want to filter for something, you should also see the filtered property in the list
15:58<energetic>But i though that making a new column eats away valuable space - where those two now can be combined. If more icons need be added in future, maybe then add column?
15:58<energetic>yes, that is already taken care of by rendering the towns different then cities
15:59<energetic>I have several options: (city), render cities black, render cities bold etc
15:59<frosch123>there is no bold :)
15:59<energetic>or render non-city towns with some space (tab)
15:59<frosch123>and if you put icons in the buttons you should use the same icons in the list
15:59<energetic>sure there is :)
16:00<energetic>ie you could render it twice, though its dirty
16:00<energetic>(with one pixel diff, or more if you are making it bold)
16:01<@Belugas>#would yuou still kiss me
16:01<@Belugas>#if you find out
16:01<frosch123>ok, correction: with the sprite font there is no non-bold
16:02<energetic>so it would be doublebold
16:02<energetic>that would be a bit too bold
16:03<LUADuck>Yeah openttd.ap is dead
16:03<frosch123>LUADuck: maybe noone asked questions
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16:06<LUADuck>Question asked :3
16:07<Sacro>LUADuck: #autopilot ?
16:08-!-batti5 [~batti5@] has joined #openttd
16:08<planetmaker>LUADuck: ap+ has two developers at most. So... your questions will be seen, but you cannot expect them to be online 24/7 :)
16:08<batti5>problem encodeing grf
16:09<batti5>Warning: Found sprite 1 looking for sprite 0.
16:09<batti5>Error: Encountered invalid character looking for literal byte.
16:09<batti5> While reading sprite:
16:09<batti5>please help
16:09<LUADuck>planetmaker: Any ETA on their uptime?
16:09<planetmaker>eveing hours CET :) dih also sometimes during the day
16:09<Sacro>batti5: what help do you need?
16:10<planetmaker>also make sure to have the correct tcl version and latest ap+ trunk
16:10<frosch123>batti5: is you friend for showing the whole command line + error messages and the nfo
16:10<planetmaker>correct doesn't necessarily translate to latest concerning tcl version
16:11<planetmaker>and if you have a bouncer, LUADuck, you could stay in that channel and wait for an answer :)
16:11<batti5>its thare
16:12<planetmaker>batti5: you need to provide a link...
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16:13<frosch123>oh, you are using the win version, so try running the nfo through dos2unix or unix2dos
16:13<Ammler>batti5: maybe nforenum could help too.
16:13<batti5>i tryed
16:13<frosch123>or a linux binary compiled from trunk :)
16:14<frosch123>no, it is called misc, not trunk
16:15<Ammler>LUADuck: you use now linux?
16:15<frosch123>and the nfo?
16:15-!-andy` [] has joined #openttd
16:16<Ammler>looks like mingw or such
16:17<LUADuck>Ammler: yup
16:17<frosch123>uncomment the action 8 and put the grfid in quotes
16:17<frosch123>or better: "RT" 00 01
16:17<+glx>2 STRIPES\LE5100.pcx 0 0 01 24 8 -3 -12 <-- SPRITES != STRIPES
16:18<Ammler>LUADuck: there is no known windows admin using autopilot :-)
16:18<frosch123>0 * 1 08 07 "RT" 00 01 "LE5100 Class 41" 00 "By Batti5 & Andersl" 00
16:18<frosch123>^^ write it like that
16:18<batti5>Error on sprite 4
16:18<Ammler>I guess, teh revision detection migh fail there.
16:18<LUADuck>Ammler: What?
16:19<LUADuck>Ammler: It's Linux dummy
16:19<LUADuck>Ammler: besides, my roots are linux
16:19<batti5>Warning on sprite 6 (level 2).
16:19<Ammler>ah, I thought your yup is for mingw :-)
16:20<batti5>/!!Error (49): Missing real sprite. Sprite 2 declared 8, but only 1 have been seen.
16:20<+glx>that's true
16:20<Ammler>LUADuck: you have a nightly running with ap+ trunk?
16:20<+glx>you included only one real sprite
16:20<frosch123> 1 * 4 01 00 01 08 <- that says one trainengine with 8 sprites follows
16:21<batti5>how to fix?
16:21<frosch123>how many sprites does your engine have?
16:22<batti5>1 i think
16:22<LUADuck>Yeah AP is gone
16:22<frosch123>so your engine looks the same no matter in which direction it is driving?
16:23<batti5>4 in 1 pcx
16:23<batti5>4 stripes
16:23<frosch123>1 * 4 01 00 01 04
16:23<frosch123>so replace the 08 with 04
16:23<frosch123>and define all four sprites after that
16:24<frosch123> 2 STRIPES\LE5100.pcx 0 0 01 24 8 -3 -12 <- that is one sprite
16:24<frosch123>you need four lines like that
16:24<batti5>no idea how to do that
16:25<frosch123> <- read that
16:26-!-[1]KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@] has joined #openttd
16:27<batti5>don`t understan a thing from it
16:28<Brokkoli>it's realy not easy
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16:29<Belgabor>Is it normal that when using a freetype font and activating font aa the letters look like marsian?
16:29<batti5>what is wrong here ?
16:30<frosch123>the 08
16:30<frosch123>it is the number of sprites that follow
16:31<Brokkoli>batti5: you should look here
16:31<batti5>on, 1 more error Offset 32: No more data was expected.
16:32<frosch123>sprite 6 is an action4
16:32<frosch123>in the next line you seem to want to use a action 0
16:33<frosch123>but the beginning is missing
16:33<batti5>how to aad it?
16:34<frosch123><Sprite-number> * <Length> 00 <Feature> <Num-props> <Num-info> <Id> <- insert that after sprite 6, and fill in the appropiate values
16:34<SmatZ>aad? ascii adjust after division?
16:34<SmatZ>nah, before division...
16:35<frosch123>ascii adjuste ante division?
16:35<SmatZ>Hannibal ante portas!
16:35<frosch123>poor hannibal
16:35<el_en>English Only!
16:35<frosch123>id est
16:36<frosch123>exempli gratia
16:36<frosch123>^^ perfect english :)
16:36<SmatZ>Praga mater urbium :-)
16:37<SmatZ>sadly, my knowledge of latin ends roughly here...
16:37<el_en>et tu, SmatZ
16:37<SmatZ>and me?
16:38<+glx>tu quoqui fili
16:38-!-batti5 [~batti5@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:38<+glx>or quoque (/me is unsure)
16:39<frosch123>it was quite fun when I discovered that all those weird english abbreviations, I could not make sense of, were actually latin :)
16:39<SmatZ>google translate failed at this one :)
16:39<LUADuck>So yeah, I don't know what to do while I'm waiting on ap
16:39<SmatZ>frosch123: BC = before Christ, AD = Anno domini? is it mixing of english and latin abbrevations?
16:39<frosch123>you are talking quite elliptic
16:40<Sacro>SmatZ: yep
16:40<Sacro>should be AC techincally
16:40<frosch123>ante christus :p
16:40<@Belugas>i'd rather use DC
16:40<el_en>SmatZ: that's because the ancient romans spoke English before Christ was born.
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16:40<SmatZ>hehe :)
16:41<@Belugas>AD = After Death, by the way...
16:41<el_en>is not
16:41<@Belugas>is so!
16:41<el_en>is not
16:42<@Belugas>is so, because i say it is so, and becasue i can kick you if you say otherwise!
16:43<frosch123>Belugas: you can kick him also if he does not
16:43<frosch123>so, coffee is empty
16:43<@Belugas>true :) but i have some moral concerns kicking without justification heheh
16:43<frosch123>night :)
16:43-!-frosch123 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:44<@Belugas>coffee is empty... nice way of saying i'm tired, got no more juice to run the system :)
16:44<@Belugas>urban poetry
16:45<el_en>"Because B.C. is the English abbreviation for Before Christ, some people incorrectly conclude that A.D. must mean After Death, i.e., after the death of Jesus. If that were true, the thirty-three or so years of his life would not be in any era.[4]"
16:45<@Belugas>good work, LN :)
16:46<@Belugas>note: it must be true, since it comes from the internet :D
16:46<el_en>that's not from the internet, it's from wikipedia.
16:47-!-Guest760 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:47<el_en>and if something in wikipedia is not true _yet_, it _will become_ true soon enough.
16:47<Brokkoli>the thirty-three or so years of his life would not be in any era.[4]" <= thats wc
16:47<Brokkoli>while christ :P
16:47<SmatZ>tricky question: what abbrevation did ancient Romans use instead of BC?
16:47<SmatZ>like, on buildings, coins...
16:47*Prof_Frink smacks SmatZ with a cricket bat
16:48<SmatZ>cricket... bat?
16:48<@Belugas>wikipedia is not the password i had in mind :S
16:48<el_en>SmatZ: let me guess: none, because they weren't christians especially before christ.
16:48<Prof_Frink>SmatZ: bat for the cricketery
16:49<Prof_Frink>el_en: Never mind that, how would they know what to count down to?
16:49-!-Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
16:49<Prof_Frink>They're romans, not mayans.
16:49<SmatZ>well they didn't know there will be Christ born...
16:49-!-LUADuck is now known as OnStar
16:49<OnStar>I have an idea
16:50<OnStar>Cannot join #openttdcoop (You are banned).
16:50-!-OnStar is now known as LUADuck
16:50<SmatZ>LUADuck: why are you banned?
16:50<LUADuck>Many reasons
16:50<LUADuck>It boiled down to them getting annoyed with me for deleting MY OWN station
16:51<@Darkvater>Belugas: it was cheap :) 240EUR
16:51<SmatZ>well, in coop, it's not "your" station :)
16:51<LUADuck>Could someone else (not banned from ottdc) ask after me in there?
16:51<Ammler>LUADuck: those people are here too.
16:51<@Belugas>relatively speaking indedd, Darkvater :)
16:51<@Belugas>good memory, bty the way ;)
16:52<LUADuck>Ammler: I doubt every single one
16:52<@Darkvater>Belugas: /away ;p
16:52<Ammler>everyone able to help you.
16:52<LUADuck>Well then I'm f****d
16:52<Ammler>and, btw. they (we) do not more about AP ;-)
16:53<LUADuck>openttd.ap is dead
16:53<@Belugas>#I want to fuck you lke an ANIMAL
16:53<LUADuck>kk belugas
16:53<@Belugas>#i want to feel you from the Inside!
16:53<@Darkvater>pretty disturbing
16:53<@Darkvater>I'm outta here :)
16:53<@Belugas>does it work properly, Darkvater?
16:53<@Belugas>i'll shut my big ...
16:54<@Darkvater>oh yeah baby
16:54<@Darkvater>it's too big :P
16:54<@Darkvater>or my table's too small
16:54<@Darkvater>now I actually have to move my head
16:54<@Belugas>now... it's me who is disturbed...
16:54<@Darkvater>this is awhole new feeling for me
16:54<LUADuck>The iGiggle. Now jiggling mom's everywhere.
16:54<@Belugas>what? to feelyour head moving ?
16:54<@Darkvater>yes, for watching the screen
16:54-!-Timitry [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
16:55<@Belugas>i'm insanely tired... sorry
16:55-!-andy` [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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16:56<@Rubidium>insanely tired and it isn't even evening yet? You should consider getting out of bed later ;)
16:56<@Belugas>or not at all...
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16:57<@Belugas>i was on a customer support call yesterday, until 23:00h.
16:57<@Belugas>and today, i've not even had the time to sit down and quietly swallowed my lunch
17:01*SpComb has been in bed since sunday evening
17:01<SpComb>silly flu
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17:05<@Belugas>and now, i'm exhausted and now i leave and now i'll be out of the picture until later tomorrow
17:05<@Belugas>bye bye
17:05<@Rubidium>night Belugas
17:06<SmatZ>night Belugas
17:06<SmatZ>oh noes, another day is gone
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17:19<Brokkoli>is there any "more highlevel" language for creating newgrfs?
17:20<Brokkoli>its a bit painful, programming that *g*
17:20<+glx>not really
17:20<Brokkoli>ok with some more experience it may get better
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17:21<@Rubidium>there's English that can be "compiled" into NFO by piping lots of money into a NFO coder
17:23<Brokkoli>im not looking for somethink realy highlevel.. only symbolic names instead of numbers or something like that ;)
17:23-!-NukeBuster|laptop [] has joined #openttd
17:23<planetmaker>loool :)
17:23<@Rubidium>the cpp can help; you just need to #define the symbols ;)
17:24<Brokkoli>interesting idea
17:25<Brokkoli>i will try to try that ;)
17:29<LUADuck>Ok, what the fuck
17:29<LUADuck>dihedral: What?
17:29<LUADuck>Dihedral just banned me from openttd.ap for NO reason
17:30<Brokkoli>Text is likely to be stupid.
17:30<Brokkoli>ok i'm detected
17:30<dihedral>LUADuck, you posted your entire openttd.cfg to the channel!
17:30<LUADuck>Yes I know
17:30<LUADuck>But I corrected it
17:30<dihedral>now you know why you got the kban
17:30<LUADuck>Surely banning someone PURELY for that
17:31<dihedral>lines enter irc according to a buffer and get delayed
17:31<LUADuck>Happy now?
17:31<Ammler>Brokkoli: there is Makefile template some coder use
17:31<LUADuck>Posting my original openttd.cfg was a mistake
17:32<LUADuck>FYI that's not the correct rcon password
17:32<Brokkoli>where can i get it?
17:33<Ammler>Brokkoli: good question, maybe ask some of "the bigger" coders.
17:33<dihedral>i dont care for your rcon pass, and i think you realized that a wee bit too late, got annoyed and changed the password quickly
17:33<dihedral>and i can see why the forums i found your admin application in - lets just say i can understand the other posts
17:33<Brokkoli>ok i will do
17:33<Brokkoli>thank you
17:34<Ammler>Brokkoli: there are examples on our svn server using that file.
17:34<LUADuck>dihedral: What? I'm not even signed up on the forums
17:34<Ammler>DutchStations from XeryusTC, i.e. but there might be better examples.
17:34<LUADuck>dihedral: I bet you're looking at JokerIce
17:34<dihedral>where else would i be looking?
17:34<Brokkoli>ok :)
17:35<LUADuck>Well, a variety
17:35<LUADuck>duckystudios ffs
17:35<dihedral>you just did not sign up there with your nick or real name :-P
17:35<dihedral>and i find that thread rather amusing
17:36<LUADuck>Hey I've got a wonderful idea
17:36<LUADuck>Sign up and get me demoted
17:37<dihedral>i have an even better idea
17:37<dihedral>i extend my ignore list
17:37<dihedral>or perhaps someone in this channel feels like setting a +q
17:38<dihedral>i'll go with the first option
17:38<LUADuck>I have a even better idea
17:38<LUADuck>I'll stop hosting servers for openttd in the first place
17:38<dihedral>you really think anybody here is interested in who hosts what servers?
17:38<Yexo>quote from "There are 130 clients and 162 servers."
17:38<LUADuck>Well, a fair 3-8 servers
17:38<Yexo>we need more players, not more servers
17:38<dihedral>well, perhaps some people will be interested in Brianetta's server
17:38<dihedral>but that's about it
17:39<SmatZ>Yexo: I just wanted to post the same ;)
17:39<dihedral>you can fit all players into one game
17:40<dihedral>easily :-D
17:40<planetmaker>half a game
17:40<Yexo>let's all those 130 players enter the same 64x64 map :)
17:41<dihedral>fun times :-)
17:41<planetmaker>@calc 64*64 / 130
17:41<@DorpsGek>planetmaker: 31.5076923077
17:41<planetmaker>tiny space for each :)
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17:41<Tefad>someone broke svn?
17:41<dihedral>oh - and the openttdcoop games would of course be missed if they disappeared
17:41<el_en>planetmaker: "Text is likely to be stupid." (the @calc line)
17:42<LUADuck>Oh, also, if you want someone to raid, raid
17:42<Yexo>Tefad: remove src/3rdparty and update again
17:42<dihedral>Tefad, he only just joined the dev team, i doubt he broke it
17:42<dihedral>LUADuck, we are not interested!!!
17:42<LUADuck>Good, see you all later
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17:42<dihedral>wow - that was easy
17:43<dihedral>can you see the username in that hostmask?
17:44<planetmaker>oh no!
17:44<dihedral>only just mentioned something like that today to openttdcoop
17:44<planetmaker>And I made today already jokes about root@... host masks :)
17:44-!-stillunknown [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:45<dihedral>oh - and i bet that we will have a few servers less in the server list by now
17:45<dihedral>2 :-D
17:46<dihedral> <- nice
17:46<Yexo>There are 129 clients and 160 servers. <- indeed 2 servers less :)
17:46<Yexo>just make sure you don't mention the name of that server here :p
17:47<dihedral>why does it work again?
17:47-!-JurrienK [] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!]
17:50*Rubidium wonders whether he broke dih's autonightly
17:51<dihedral>oh yes you did
17:51<dihedral>thanks for the hint Rubidium
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17:59<Brianetta>gonna be interesting when the RCs come out
18:00<NukeBuster|laptop>ehh, has that changed recently?
18:01<welshdragon>it's under linkage
18:01<welshdragon> i think
18:01<Brianetta>should really have been called
18:01<welshdragon> < the logs
18:02<Brianetta>Might mention that to Owen in August.
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18:40<Eddi|zuHause>i don't understand some people... "i want a button that automatically places tram lines on every road"
18:44-!-Guest778 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:45<thingwath>maybe they simply see trams as a replacement for all road vehicles, like elrail for rail :)
18:59<Ammler>how many ticks has a day?
18:59<dihedral>72 or 74?
19:00<Eddi|zuHause>grep DAY_TICKS src/*.h
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19:27<@Belugas>[18:42] <Eddi|zuHause> i don't understand some people... "i want a button that automatically places tram lines on every road" <--- amazing, isn't it? Let's spell it out loud, shall we?
19:27<apo>I'm trying to set up a dedicated server and simply copied my ~/.openttd over to the server, but when I run it with -D -c <conf>, it doesn't choose the settings I want (for example, the map has a size of 256x256 instead of 2048x2048)
19:28<apo>How do I change that? :|
19:28<@Belugas>L A Z I N E S S !!!!\
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19:29<planetmaker>apo: I guess it looks for the file in <binarypath>/<conf>
19:29<apo>planetmaker: I specified what configfile to use, though
19:30<KenjiE20>it's a relative path from the launch dir
19:30<planetmaker>with fully qualified path?
19:30<apo>apo@0au:games$ ./openttd -D -c ~/.openttd/openttd.cfg
19:30<apo>I'd say so
19:30<planetmaker>hm.... despite. give it a try and copy the cfg in the binary dir
19:30<apo>still 256^2
19:32<planetmaker>hm... works for us to have the cfg in the binary dir
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19:32<planetmaker>try w/o specifying the cfg. And did you check that there's a different size specified in that cfg?
19:33<apo>It says map_[xy]=8
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19:33<KenjiE20>doesn't 8 = 256x256?
19:34<KenjiE20>iirc mines set to 9 for 512
19:34<@Belugas>cannot help you, apo. never did any dedicated stuff
19:34<KenjiE20>I could be wrong mind
19:34<KenjiE20>wiki time
19:35<@Belugas>map_[xy]=8 equals to 256*256. tht i can confirm
19:35<apo>Working now, thanks.
19:36<KenjiE20>Map_x = 10 = 1024 : map_x = 9 = 512 <-- on the wiki
19:37<apo>In my local client, everything's on 2048. Wonder where it stored its stuff...
19:37<KenjiE20>openttd.exe dir > mydocs
19:42<@Rubidium>apo: do-not-readme.txt
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19:44<apo>Rubidium: Silence. I copied the config over, but the settings (especially map size) weren't copied. That's probably not in the readme =P
19:46<@Rubidium>apo: can you show the config?
19:47<apo>When I started openttd, it had the right settings, so I'd assume that they're all in there.
19:48<@Rubidium>that config says map size 8, so if OpenTTD uses that it's doing the right thing
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20:09<nn64>I'm in need of some help
20:09<nn64>Ok so I want to set up a Massive new GRF server
20:10<nn64>problem is %80 of the grfs are not yet in
20:10<nn64>but it would seem that the package that contains all the ones im using is
20:10<@Belugas>just advertise on a web site or else the grfs yu are going to use
20:10<nn64>#openttdcoop NewGRF package 7.3 1364 times Feb. 12, 2009 Ammler GPL v3
20:11<Brokkoli>thats not realy a grf
20:11<Aali>nn64: thats a dummy grf
20:11<nn64>so im wondering is there a way to get the client to auto install that package above and thus play my games
20:11<@Belugas>forget that
20:11<KenjiE20>it can be a grf, if you jam all the grf out of the zip and into the .tar
20:11<Aali>the actual package can't be put on bananas
20:12<Aali>only the author of a grf may put it there
20:12<@Rubidium>nn64: that package is a fluke... it doesn't contain any useful NewGRF except a 'link' to where the archive with NewGRFs can be found
20:13<@Belugas>nn64 so... it seems that you were not aware of the content. I would suggest that, as an admin, you do some research as to what you would use as grfs
20:13<nn64>KenjiE20, so it is possable
20:13<@Belugas>make sure they are available for everyone who cares/knows how to search
20:13<KenjiE20>yea, it's how I have my ottdcoop install set up
20:13<@Belugas>that it has some USEFULL content
20:14-!-Korenn [] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.4.0 Virgo]
20:14<@Belugas>and that you UNDERSTAND what that grf do
20:14<KenjiE20>d/l zip from ottdcoop site -> use 7zip to copy everything into the .tar
20:14<nn64>KenjiE20, k ?
20:14<nn64>then what
20:14<KenjiE20>but that's just so it's easier to maintain my end
20:14<KenjiE20>nothing, ottd will find them all in there
20:15<nn64>and allow the servers clients to down load them ?
20:15<KenjiE20>it's a client only fix
20:15<nn64>Well there goes that idea
20:15<KenjiE20>for neatness sake
20:15<KenjiE20>1 file > bazillions
20:16<+glx>ottdcoop is the only one allowed to distribute this pack
20:17<nn64>KenjiE20, howmany people do you think have actually aquired that pack of ttds? and manually put it in
20:17*Rubidium wonders whether people look at the usage statistics for their servers
20:17<KenjiE20>I have absolutely no effing clue
20:17*KenjiE20 is not psychic
20:17<@Rubidium>like there's an average of roughly 0.7 clients per server
20:18<nn64>I had like 6 last night
20:18<nn64>on my servers
20:18<@Belugas>Rubidium: i would assume a very limited bunch. maybe even only dihedral and/or brianetta
20:19<KenjiE20>Rubidium, I probably would if I knew how :P
20:19<nn64>well ... it would seem I will have to make a server that supports onily what bananas offers
20:19<nn64>and one that supports the hole bunch
20:19<Brokkoli>yes... i have reduced it to bananas-newgrfs too
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20:19<Brokkoli>sadly some very good grfs are missing there..
20:20<@Belugas>nn64: why? openttd offered MP games with grf long before bananas has been added to trunk
20:20<KenjiE20>nn64, depends who you want on
20:20<Brokkoli>and noone played there ;)
20:20<@Belugas>i do not see why it shold rely ONLY on bananas
20:20<KenjiE20>most of the older players probably already have GRF folders with most stuff in them
20:20<@Rubidium>Belugas: ease of use
20:20<@Belugas>people are so lazy today....
20:20<Brokkoli>i had a newgrf server and rarely there was more than 1 player..
20:21<KenjiE20>bananas is good for new players starting out
20:21<@Belugas>REMOVE BANANAS!!!!!!
20:21<Brokkoli>now with the bananas newgrfs i have up to 10 players..
20:21<Brokkoli>maybe allow a klickable link per server
20:21<Aali>luckily, none of this will be a problem once 0.7 comes out
20:22<Brokkoli>so users can easyer find the needed grfs
20:22<@Belugas>Brokkoli : no
20:22<@Rubidium>KenjiE20: don't bet on that; just ignoring the default tram GRF lots of servers don't have any NewGRFs
20:22<Brokkoli>why? security?
20:22<@Belugas>we need to support multiple OSs
20:22<Aali>once support for human players gets removed :)
20:22<Brokkoli>thats a reason
20:22<@Belugas>not all of them require the same functionnality for clickability
20:22<@Rubidium>Belugas: we support clicking on everything in game
20:23<Brokkoli>yes for os'es which do not support that it could be disabled?
20:23<@Rubidium>just the 'feedback' to the clicking might lack functionality
20:23<@Rubidium>hmm... lets see
20:23<@Belugas>and lucky for us, no object on the game is a URL
20:23<Brokkoli>if the os supports -> open browser, else show a message
20:23<@Rubidium>do ALL windows installs have an internet browser?
20:23<Brokkoli>i think so
20:23<@Belugas>oh... I knoe... just need to add a CTRL+Ctrlclick
20:23<Brokkoli>at least ie ;)
20:24<KenjiE20>Rubidium, true, but I run a bananas reduced one for a group of new players, because it's kinder on them to not have to wade through for stuff not on grfcrawler
20:24<@Rubidium>Brokkoli: there you're wrong
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20:24<Brokkoli>ok old windowses don't
20:24<@Rubidium>or when you appropriately mutilate it ;)
20:25<Brokkoli>maybe it's possible
20:26<@Belugas>have fun, i close the shop for today
20:26<@Belugas>and good night
20:27<@Rubidium>even so, I don't care about MSIE
20:28<@Rubidium>MSIE users aren't quite our prime audience (or the world's browser stats are way off)
20:29<Brokkoli>i know
20:29<Brokkoli>i wont use msie, too
20:29<Brokkoli>but i use windows.. and when some program has a link, the choosen browser opens that..
20:30-!-glx [] has quit [Quit: bye]
20:30<Brokkoli>don't know about linux.. i dont use desktops there ;)
20:31<@Rubidium>that's not quite defacto standardised yet
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20:33*Rubidium wonders what browsers work on Windows 3.x
20:33<Brokkoli>i don't know
20:33<Brokkoli>never tried any ;)
20:34<+glx>ottd doesn't work there anyway ;)
20:34<@Rubidium>msie < 4 seems to roughly cover that
20:42<@Rubidium>glx: maybe they got allegro working for DOS
20:44<nn64>wow The auto download is limiting
20:47<nn64>well ... any how ... I fell like starting a game ... Anyone who wants a Fun challenging game come play me at """"""--NN's MAX Server"""""" Requires The Openttdcop new grf pack ... and client 0.7.0
20:49<Brokkoli>i don't think its limiting?
20:50<nn64>ok /
20:51<nn64>i just couldent add any OpenGRF files or the ecs one it said is supported in bananas were not supported
20:52<nn64>Brokkoli, So you willing to play me in the Game with the MAX viecules choice list EVER?
20:55-!-Aygar [~aygardupi@] has joined #openttd
20:56<nn64>anyone anyone else here ?
20:57<nn64>KenjiE20, ... you here .. you said you had the full graphics set ? ... come play me Plz ...
20:57<Brokkoli>i have it, but no time for playing now
20:58<Brokkoli>and dont want to play with to much newgrfs
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21:06-!-edgar [~chatzilla@] has joined #openttd
21:06<edgar>hello everyone
21:06-!-apo_ [] has joined #openttd
21:07<edgar>I'm using ubuntu and I have the original Transport Tycoon, where I should place the TT folder that OpenTTD require to run?
21:08<KenjiE20|LT>pretty sure that's in the wiki, but you'll want the tr*.grfs from data to go into /usr/games/openttd/data
21:08<KenjiE20|LT>(or wherever the binary install is)
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21:09<+glx>edgar: what version of openttd?
21:09<edgar>0.6.3 version
21:10<+glx>ok just put them in ~/.openttd/data
21:10<+glx>unless it's a multiuser system
21:11<+glx>and only tr*.grf and are required
21:11<edgar>ok thanks
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22:18<Aygar>Has the plan to rewrite the map array been abandonded?
22:19<Aygar>i.e. the stuff described at and
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22:43<welshdragon>crap ero exchange rate is crap
22:44<welshdragon>£500 = €166.37
22:51<+glx>Aygar: map rewrite is totally dead
22:54<Aygar>glx bad idea death or lack of intrest
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23:04*welshdragon sooo wants to book this holiday
23:04<welshdragon>but i'm afraid I might not have enough euros to enjoy myself :(
23:09<thingwath>such a materialst view :)
23:25<thingwath>I have no euros and I'm quite happy, now :o)
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23:57<MrFrans>welshdragon, that conversion seems wrong.
23:57*MrFrans checks
23:57<MrFrans>this what google says. 500 British pounds = 561.979576 Euros
23:58<MrFrans>or are you converting some other pound?
23:58<thingwath>it could be right some years ago
23:58-!-Dred_furst` [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:58<welshdragon>the rate i have is the latest rate
23:59<MrFrans>honestly that is wrong, the pound has not fallen below the euro.
23:59<welshdragon>(from yahoo finance)
23:59*welshdragon checks travelex
23:59<thingwath>oh, sure, this conversion rate was never right, sorry :)
---Logclosed Fri Feb 27 00:00:17 2009