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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-04-22

---Logopened Wed Apr 22 00:00:23 2009
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03:58<Celestar:#openttd>morning
03:59<Forked:#openttd>heya
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04:04<@Rubidium:#openttd>goooood morning
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04:15*Rubidium:#openttd waves to Celestar and HansAffe (even though he knowns that HansAffe won't wave back)
04:15<Forked:#openttd>but not me? pfft on you!"
04:16<@Rubidium:#openttd>nah, don't know which direction to wave to
04:17<@Rubidium:#openttd>so when trying to you I might accidentally (or with intent ;)) wave to e.g. TrueBrain or Darkvater or Belugas (all roughly in the same general direction from here)
04:17<Forked:#openttd>probably north
04:17<@petern:#openttd># flower king of flies
04:19<Forked:#openttd>http://preview.tinyurl.com/c2mtfj (maps.google.com)
04:22<@Rubidium:#openttd>poor Forked, you're behind a wall
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04:22<Forked:#openttd>a.. wall?
04:22<@Rubidium:#openttd>yup; got no window in your direction
04:23<Forked:#openttd>aw :\
04:23<@Rubidium:#openttd>so even if I'd wave you wouldn't be able to see it ;)
04:23<Forked:#openttd>probably a million .no mountains in the way anyway
04:26<@Rubidium:#openttd>still have to go to there some time
04:26*Rubidium:#openttd ponders to go sometime in the Dutch spring (hoping the pollen season hasn't started there yet)
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04:27<Forked:#openttd>the view can be quite nice.. like from the house we bought (moving in next month): http://cache.finn.no/mmo/0/164/943/70_1103490089.jpg
04:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>that I can agree on
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04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16120 /branches/0.7/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Road was removed when both the Remove button was active and Ctrl was pressed [FS#2582] (r16119)
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Connect tried to validate too much of the company ID with too little information on hand [FS#2849] (r16096)
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Insanely fast trains would not stop in time for stations/'jump' over
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: waypoints/via stations within a tick, which would cause the order not to be
04:48<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: processed causing the train to go in loops until (with luck) it 'hit' the tile
04:53<TrueBrain:#openttd>morning
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05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16121 /branches/0.7/src/ (13 files in 5 dirs): (log message trimmed)
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Add: [NoAI] UseAsRandomAI as function in info.nut. When an AI returns false, it will never be chosen as random AI (r16113)
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] Make sure AIOrder::GetDestination always returns a tile belonging to the station (16109)
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] When giving an aircraft a goto-hangar order do not let it be a normal goto-station order (r16108)
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Add: [NoAI] AIOF_STOP_IN_DEPOT to the orderflags in AIOrder to allow stop-in-depot orders (r16107)
05:00<CIA-9:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] AIOrder::SetOrderFlags always removed "Service if needed" from goto-depot orders (r16106)
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05:01<@petern:#openttd>zomg new 'features' in a bug fix :/
05:02<@Rubidium:#openttd>trivial features are known to sometimes get into 'bug fix' releases
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05:08<TrueBrain:#openttd>sorry about that httpd interuption .. I needed a lot of memory, really fast :p
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05:08<Forked:#openttd>quit hogging :\
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05:23<fjb:#openttd>Morning.
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06:28<@petern:#openttd>'s quiet
06:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>and now he isn't anymore ;)
06:29<planetmaker:#openttd>lalalala :)
06:29<planetmaker:#openttd>good day everyone
06:30*Rubidium:#openttd wonders why planetmaker is changing strings like a mad man now
06:30<planetmaker:#openttd>Rubidium :) Some things just become obvious if you look at them closely :)
06:30*Rubidium:#openttd remembers asking the translators to do that two months ago ;)
06:30<planetmaker:#openttd>Rubidium, I changed there like ~200, too.
06:31<planetmaker:#openttd>And I only fix things which I know are broken - like most people, I guess :)
06:32<planetmaker:#openttd>most changes are related to adding gender to cargo types.
06:32<@Rubidium:#openttd>hmm, it's "snowing"
06:32<planetmaker:#openttd>And some are removing spaces
06:32<@Rubidium:#openttd>... cherry tree blossom
06:32<planetmaker:#openttd>And some are... strings I never saw before, just in the related section of wt3 :)
06:33*petern:#openttd nods at Rubidium
06:33<@petern:#openttd>maybe i'll have some cherries
06:33*planetmaker:#openttd envies Rubidium ... those cherry blossoms are already gone here :S
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06:34<@Rubidium:#openttd>GRRRR!!!!!
06:35<planetmaker:#openttd>?
06:35<@Rubidium:#openttd>why does the rain fall before reaching my area?
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07:06<dihedral:#openttd>hello
07:09<@petern:#openttd>hmm
07:10<@petern:#openttd>is there any way to redirect traffic from one server to another, keeping the original IP address intact?
07:10<@petern:#openttd>i'm guessing not :/
07:10<TrueBrain:#openttd>There are techniques to do so :) Depends on what traffic, and what hardware is behind it ;)
07:17<@petern:#openttd>nothing special :(
07:17-!-[com]buster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
07:17<@petern:#openttd>also the servers in question are on different subnets :/
07:17<TrueBrain:#openttd>BGP access?
07:18<@petern:#openttd>i only want to redirect specific ports
07:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>else use proxies :)
07:18<@petern:#openttd>i'm using rinetd currently
07:18<@petern:#openttd>just makes it tricky to track things when reading logs
07:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>very true
07:18-!-thingwath [~thingwath@morana.sks2.muni.cz] has quit [Quit: Do školy.]
07:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>to solve that you need a common gateway; then you can do a bit of PRE and POST routing
07:21<@petern:#openttd>mmm
07:21<@petern:#openttd>i think i'll live with unintelligable logs
07:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>and petern, if bandwidth is not an issue, I even once managed to do PRE and POST routing on both servers
07:21<@petern:#openttd>it'll make following the eu log retention law so much fun :D
07:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>which made serverB think he was communicating with the internet, while it was rerouted through serverA :p
07:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>(for a set of ports and traffic-type)
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07:24<@Rubidium:#openttd>it almost calls for a collective ddos of all EU citizens on the entities that made that law in a way that creates minimal traffic, but maximal logs ;)
07:24<TrueBrain:#openttd>I dislike laws like that :(
07:25<@Rubidium:#openttd>too bad that the hosting costs of that are paid by the EU, thus by us and making us ddos them would cause them spending more money on it
07:27<@Rubidium:#openttd>which then results in raising our taxes
07:27<SpComb:#openttd>a lose:lose situation
07:28<@Rubidium:#openttd>oh crap my logic is flawed, it's the ISPs that need to log
07:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>so either install trojans at the EU so they generate lots of logs
07:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>so all we need to do is generate tons and tons and tons of logs besides our normal traffic, to drown the logs :p
07:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>or... scrap http/irc/smtp/imap and use https/ircs/ssmtp/imaps
07:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>https is trackable from the ISP point of view
07:30<@Rubidium:#openttd>they can only see what server you're connecting to
07:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>which alone tells you more than you would want to :p
07:31<@petern:#openttd>Device: ATA WDC WD5000AAKS-0 Version: 01.0
07:31<@petern:#openttd>Device does not support SMART
07:31*TrueBrain:#openttd is happy openttd.org has TLS for all services (even forces a few of them)
07:32<@petern:#openttd>i'm pretty sure all modern disks support SMART...
07:32<@petern:#openttd>so is it the controller being shit?
07:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: what ATA version?
07:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>and make sure you enabled SMART in BIOS .. some BIOSes allow disabling it :(
07:32<@petern:#openttd>it's enabled in the bios
07:33<@petern:#openttd>it's SATA, so hdparm isn't working, and sdparm isn't giving me useful info
07:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>smartctl should also tell the ATA version used
07:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>just host something legal/common and illegal/uncommon on the same IP, connect over HTTPS and they can't tell whether you're going to the legal or illegal site
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07:34<@petern:#openttd>it doesn't
07:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>smartctl -a /dev/sda .. shows to me always ATA Version is: line
07:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>even for non-SMART devices
07:35<@petern:#openttd>http://paste.openttd.org/182171
07:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>weird!
07:36<@petern:#openttd>drive definitely supports it
07:37<@Rubidium:#openttd>hmm, why doesn't gentoo have gcc 4.4 yet?
07:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: no idea
07:38<SpComb:#openttd>they haven't finished compiling it yet
07:38<@Rubidium:#openttd>SpComb: it takes over a year on gentoo?
07:39<@Rubidium:#openttd>http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-4.4/ <- it's already a year old according to them
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>Rubidium: http://overlays.gentoo.org/, overlay 'toolchain'
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>gcc 4.4 is alpha, so not in 'normal' portage
07:40<TrueBrain:#openttd>use layman to checkout overlays
07:41<@Rubidium:#openttd>TrueBrain: gcc 4.4.0 is released (a year ago)
07:41<planetmaker:#openttd>TrueBrain, gcc 4.4.0 is released right now, isn't it?
07:42<TrueBrain:#openttd>Rubidium: I was talking about Gentoo
07:47<@petern:#openttd>ah
07:47<@petern:#openttd>dmesg shows it on boot up
07:47<@petern:#openttd>ATA-8
07:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>ATA 3.3 and up supports SMART for sure
07:48<TrueBrain:#openttd>maybe your kernel is too old? I have no clue :)
07:48<@Rubidium:#openttd>isn't smart from like... before the 50s?
07:49<TrueBrain:#openttd>it is not that old as you might hope :p
07:49<@Rubidium:#openttd>sorry, I meant 1995 ;)
07:50<@petern:#openttd>okay
07:50<@petern:#openttd>it's shit
07:50<@petern:#openttd>fucking idiots buying desktop machines for servers :(
07:50<@petern:#openttd>it's an nforce-mcp51
07:50<@petern:#openttd>which apparently has issues
07:50<TrueBrain:#openttd>there are chipsets which don't relay the SMART info? Hahaha :) That is insane ...
07:51<@Rubidium:#openttd>TrueBrain: whould would you relay it?
07:52<@petern:#openttd>well
07:52<@petern:#openttd>i dunno
07:52<@Rubidium:#openttd>it reduces the number of transistors, most people don't care/know about it and if people need it you just charge them extra for a 'better' chipset
07:52<@petern:#openttd># sdparm -a /dev/sda /dev/sda: ATA WDC WD5000AAKS-0 01.0
07:52<@petern:#openttd>REQUEST SENSE failed, try again with '-v' option
07:52<@petern:#openttd>(er, second /dev/sda is actually on a new line)
07:54<dihedral:#openttd>lord let it rain brain ^^
07:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>Rubidium: yeah, for the same reason I have the only CPU out of the T5 line not supporting VT
07:56<@petern:#openttd># hddtemp /dev/sda
07:56<@petern:#openttd>/dev/sda: WDC WD5000AAKS-00A7B2: 29°C
07:56<@petern:#openttd>that works :s
07:56<TrueBrain:#openttd>LOL :)
07:56<@petern:#openttd>bit cold
07:58<Forked:#openttd>/dev/sda: WDC WD5000AACS-00ZUB0: 50°C .. a bit hot :\
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08:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>you can't have it all :p
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08:04<@Rubidium:#openttd># I want it all I want it all I want it all and I want it now
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08:12<dihedral:#openttd>Rubidium, have someone assign all fs tickets to you :-P
08:13<@Rubidium:#openttd>are you sure?
08:13*TrueBrain:#openttd gets to work :p
08:14<dihedral:#openttd>you said you wanted it all :-P
08:15<Forked:#openttd>I think he sang it
08:15*welshdragon:#openttd wants to play his savegame with the latest nightly, but will have to wait for the next Infrastructure Sharing beta
08:16<welshdragon:#openttd>seeing little trains crawling across a big station to terminate hurts my feelings
08:16*Rubidium:#openttd reckons there were savegame bumps in between, so I guess you won't be able to open it in IS anyways
08:16<dihedral:#openttd>welshdragon, compile it yourself !
08:16*TrueBrain:#openttd made drastic DB changes in WT3, and needs to walk over all scripts AGAIN :(
08:16<Forked:#openttd>eek?
08:16*planetmaker:#openttd thinks that we don't maintain savegame compatibility for IS
08:17<welshdragon:#openttd>dihedral, i have no coding skill
08:17<welshdragon:#openttd>planetmaker oh... damn :(
08:17<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon, you only need programme installation skills :P
08:18<welshdragon:#openttd>planetmaker, those i have
08:18<planetmaker:#openttd>and maintaining backward compatibility for saves is... a lot of work for very little gain.
08:18<@Rubidium:#openttd>welshdragon: because someone doesn't have cooking skills doesn't that person cannot cook a kettle of water if that person is capable of following instructions
08:18<welshdragon:#openttd>so that means i need to disable sharing skills
08:19<welshdragon:#openttd>....
08:19<welshdragon:#openttd>tracks even
08:19<planetmaker:#openttd>uhm... welshdragon: it won't help to make it compatible. I'm afraid
08:19<+glx:#openttd>TrueBrain: bottom black line in lists is weird :)
08:19<welshdragon:#openttd>planetmaker, please can you make it compatible?
08:19<TrueBrain:#openttd>glx: it is not as thick as the others, I know :)
08:20<welshdragon:#openttd>i've spent aaages on this map
08:20<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon, I lack the proper coding skills and the 6 hours to look into the problem in order to understand all hooks
08:20<welshdragon:#openttd>aah
08:20<welshdragon:#openttd>can you not ask somebody else?
08:21<planetmaker:#openttd>I would feel bad about that :)
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08:22*welshdragon:#openttd debates to ask Hirundo
08:23<planetmaker:#openttd>besides, it would be not the point of the repository to maintain backward compatibility. Hirundo and Aali would kick my ass for addint that - very rightfully even.
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08:23<@Rubidium:#openttd>welshdragon: planetmaker is already very busy with "not ask"-ing somebody else
08:23<planetmaker:#openttd>:P
08:23<welshdragon:#openttd>Rubidium, i am aware of that
08:23<welshdragon:#openttd>he already said
08:24<welshdragon:#openttd>which is why i want to ask Aali or Hirundo about it
08:24<planetmaker:#openttd>they won't commit the changes to the beta2. It would break trunk compatibility.
08:24<planetmaker:#openttd>it's intrinsically not possible to add it to beta2
08:24<@Rubidium:#openttd>then why do you ask planetmaker whether he can "not ask" somebody else?
08:25<planetmaker:#openttd>of course it would be possible to patch a beta2... but then... :)
08:25<welshdragon:#openttd>so i'm screwed when beta2 comes ouyt then
08:26<welshdragon:#openttd>fan-f**********g-tastic
08:26<+glx:#openttd>too many stars
08:26<planetmaker:#openttd>:D
08:26<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon, as said: it's much work - for one or two savegames.
08:27<welshdragon:#openttd>planetmaker, BUT IT MAINTAINS CONTINUITY
08:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>welshdragon: so buy a book "C++ for dummies", and do it yourself
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08:28<welshdragon:#openttd>No
08:29<@Rubidium:#openttd>and read up on MiniIN ;)
08:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>rude
08:29<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon, I rather have continuity wrt trunk :)
08:30<+glx:#openttd>the only simple thing to do is allow trunk games to be loaded
08:30<+glx:#openttd>everything else is a hell
08:30<welshdragon:#openttd>why force the end user to learn a new language just so they can implement it themselves, when there are people capable of doing it in 2 minutes?
08:30<planetmaker:#openttd>it's a few limited pieces of code which need looking at in order to add it. But glx sais it :)
08:30<Forked:#openttd>it's beta..
08:30<Forked:#openttd>expect it to act like beta :)
08:30<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon, no single person can do it in two minutes!
08:30<@Rubidium:#openttd>welshdragon: please list the people who can do it in two minutes
08:31<welshdragon:#openttd>...it was a number i picked out of thin air
08:31<planetmaker:#openttd>not even Rubidium could do - though he's probably the person who knows the code most intimately
08:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>one off by a factor 100 or so
08:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>I can hold my breath for 20 minutes!!!!
08:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>yeah .. it was a number I picked out of thin air
08:31<planetmaker:#openttd>:D
08:31<@Rubidium:#openttd>I can too, but only once
08:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>Rubidium: at the end of my life :p
08:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>"Suicide will be the last thing I do!"
08:32<planetmaker:#openttd>nah, we don't want that demonstration.
08:32<planetmaker:#openttd>Too much paperwork associated with that :P
08:33<+glx:#openttd>a very easy way (I think) would be to add a new chunk for the patch
08:33<welshdragon:#openttd>hmm?
08:33<@Rubidium:#openttd>glx: then you're still having trouble with settings and such
08:34<planetmaker:#openttd>glx, which e.g. on my part, would require to understand the savegame format in the first place wrt chunks and stuff.
08:34<+glx:#openttd>Rubidium: you can put the new settings in the new chunk :)
08:34<planetmaker:#openttd>I recall SmatZ doing manual magic with savegames. But that was hex editor magic.
08:35<+glx:#openttd>anyway adding full backward compatibility for patches is not really needed
08:36<welshdragon:#openttd>i just want to load my savegame :'(
08:36<+glx:#openttd>then fix it by hand :)
08:36<welshdragon:#openttd>(sigh)
08:37<welshdragon:#openttd>now i have to spend another uncountable number of hours undoing the patchwork that is my game
08:37<welshdragon:#openttd>and no, i don't have an old save
08:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>or simply: don't upgrade!
08:38<welshdragon:#openttd>but i want middlestop
08:38*welshdragon:#openttd cries
08:38<+glx:#openttd>then start a new game
08:38<welshdragon:#openttd>no
08:39*welshdragon:#openttd cries even more
08:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>you start to annoy me
08:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>rarely a good thing :)
08:39<+glx:#openttd>simple rule to remember, a game started in a patched version must be continued in this version
08:40<welshdragon:#openttd>TrueBrain, good
08:40<+glx:#openttd>the other rule is: don't load trunk game in patched version if you want to play it for long time :)
08:40<welshdragon:#openttd>glx, but still, how come nightlies are backward compatible and patches not?
08:40<dihedral:#openttd>...
08:40<dihedral:#openttd>welshdragon, stupid boy
08:41<dihedral:#openttd>they have code to ensure they are backwards compatible !!
08:41<welshdragon:#openttd>then that code should be in the patches too!
08:41<planetmaker:#openttd>welshdragon: it's easy to add things. But difficult, if you want to take provisions for different things which are called by the same name
08:41<+glx:#openttd>and usually when patch compatibility is broken it's because trunk savegame version is increased
08:42<planetmaker:#openttd>and if both, (later) trunk and patch add to the same place in the savegame file: poof.
08:42<planetmaker:#openttd>That's what happens right now with IS and trunk
08:42<welshdragon:#openttd>huh?
08:42<dihedral:#openttd>it's just 'backwards compatability' isn't it welshdragon
08:42<dihedral:#openttd>rephrase, it's "just" ...
08:43<dihedral:#openttd>for something you admittedly have a lack of knowledge of, the word "just" should be used with great care
08:43<+glx:#openttd>welshdragon: before r16037, trunk was version 116, IS was version 117
08:44<+glx:#openttd>in r16037 trunk become version 117
08:44<+glx:#openttd>no imagine the effect :)
08:44<dihedral:#openttd>also words like "simply" or "easily" should be avoided!
08:44<planetmaker:#openttd>oh, words come so easily... *träller*
08:45<dihedral:#openttd>:-P
08:45<+glx:#openttd>is that a german troll?
08:45<welshdragon:#openttd>when the nightly became version 117 i tried it and the game still worked (minus all the modifications
08:45<dihedral:#openttd>planetmaker, "just" add backwards comabebility
08:45<planetmaker:#openttd>glx, it's german for approx something like *hum*
08:51<dihedral:#openttd>planetmaker, look what you've done - you've killed the conversation :-P
08:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>dihedral: you call this a conversation?!
08:51<dihedral:#openttd>shhh ^^
08:53*welshdragon:#openttd is still around, just doing somethingt
08:54<dihedral:#openttd>who?
08:55<welshdragon:#openttd>http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3482/3465673816_3df001fef0_o.png < my lower network map, the light blue own most of the tracks, but the pink own the eastern area.
08:56<welshdragon:#openttd>http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3574/3464858721_c9bc3c660f_o.png < my companies and their trains, some are only small, others are large, and i plan on adding more companies to reduce the number of trains the blue company owns
08:57<dihedral:#openttd>you dont even have high wycombe in there
08:58<dihedral:#openttd>oh yes you do
08:58<planetmaker:#openttd>looks nice :)
08:58<welshdragon:#openttd>now that has taken me 3 - 4 hours a night work, for the last 2 months, i absolutely do not want to have to do all that again!
08:58<dihedral:#openttd>wow that map is off
08:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>welshdragon: SO DO NOT UPGRADE
08:58<welshdragon:#openttd>dihedral, yeah, i i know
08:58<welshdragon:#openttd>TrueBrain, BUT I WANT LATEST TRUNK FEATURES >:(
08:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>then stop wining!
08:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>you know the facts now, so accept that, or fix it yourself
08:59*dihedral:#openttd extends his ignore list
08:59<+glx:#openttd>then fix your savegame by hand :)
08:59<dihedral:#openttd>glx: i remember someone doing that for wwottdgd 1 ^^
08:59<+glx:#openttd>I did it once too
08:59<planetmaker:#openttd>dihedral, I also remember that someone doing for wwottdgd/2 :)
08:59-!-welshdragon [~welshdrag@80.247.163.137] has left #openttd [i don't want to be a part of this channel any more, you seem to all be bullies]
09:00<+glx:#openttd>lol
09:00<planetmaker:#openttd>tsk
09:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>bah, and I wanted to kick him out ...
09:00<dihedral:#openttd>planetmaker, did you really? i thought wwottdgd 2 worked nicer
09:00<planetmaker:#openttd>he's got the meaning of the word "bully" wrong, I say
09:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>bah, my IRC can't show his hostmaks anymore :(
09:00<planetmaker:#openttd>dihedral, well, our PatchY did once, I think, as the map was mad - guess - with a previous version of the patch, not with trunk
09:01<+glx:#openttd>[15:00:06] welshdragon [~welshdrag@80.247.163.137] vient de partir de #openttd: i don't want to be a part of this channel any more, you seem to all be bullies
09:01<dihedral:#openttd>~welshdrag@80.247.163.137
09:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>@mode +b *!*@80.247.163.137
09:01-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!*@80.247.163.137] by DorpsGek
09:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>tnx :)
09:01<dihedral:#openttd>thehe
09:01<planetmaker:#openttd>teeh
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09:02<dihedral:#openttd>tlet tus tall tuse ttees tinfront tof tnomal twords!!
09:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>@kick dihedral let us all ban dihedral over and over out of this channel
09:02-!-dihedral was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [let us all ban dihedral over and over out of this channel]
09:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>much more fun
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09:02<+glx:#openttd>you were too fast TrueBrain :)
09:02<dihedral:#openttd>:-{
09:02*Forked:#openttd stabs dihedral
09:02<dihedral:#openttd>:-P
09:02*dihedral:#openttd hugs TrueBrain
09:02<Forked:#openttd>now you're forked too.
09:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>glx: feel free to repeat the procedure ;)
09:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>:)
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>Forked, you never specified what you'd stab me with
09:03<Forked:#openttd>if you didn't get it by line two you'll never get it
09:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>I think with a fork
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>i cannot tell if it was a fork or a knife or ....
09:03<Forked:#openttd>also I'll call you stupid :\
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>:-D
09:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>I agree with Forked
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>aw.... c'mon ^^
09:03<TrueBrain:#openttd>we are bullies, remember :p
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>aye :-D
09:03<dihedral:#openttd>big fat ugly ones
09:04<dihedral:#openttd>:-P
09:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>don't call me big!
09:04<+glx:#openttd>I'm not fat
09:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>(wonders who will make the 3rd comment .. come on!!)
09:04-!-dihedral was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [I'm not ugly]
09:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>good :)
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09:05<Forked:#openttd>but we're all ugly?
09:05<+glx:#openttd>don't speak for everybody
09:07<planetmaker:#openttd>beauty is in the eye of the beholder
09:07*planetmaker:#openttd has his philosophical day today
09:07<TrueBrain:#openttd>planetmaker: very true
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09:08<@Rubidium:#openttd>if we're all ugly then nobody is ugly because there is no 'normal' to compare against
09:09<dihedral:#openttd>and nobody said i meant the outward appearances :-P
09:10<planetmaker:#openttd>wait... you say we have ugly character? Now... that's showing really ugly character :P
09:11<dihedral:#openttd>and i only addressed those who TrueBrain addressed with 'we'
09:11<dihedral:#openttd>:-P
09:11<dihedral:#openttd>which for one part at least includes TrueBrain :-D
09:11*dihedral:#openttd hides
09:11<TrueBrain:#openttd>@kban dihedral 30 Try hiding here!
09:11-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!~dih@vs241204.vserver.de] by DorpsGek
09:11-!-dihedral was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Try hiding here!]
09:12-!-mode/#openttd [-b *!~dih@vs241204.vserver.de] by DorpsGek
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09:12<dihedral:#openttd>^^
09:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>oh SHIT! I have to go ... I am already late
09:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>bye all!
09:12<planetmaker:#openttd>cu TrueBrain
09:14<Sacro:#openttd>hmm
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09:20<@Belugas:#openttd>[22:47] <[wito]> Belugas: still awake? <-- not then . now yes. but now, i'm busy
09:20<@Belugas:#openttd>hello all, by the way
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09:21<planetmaker:#openttd>ho Belugas :)
09:21-!-Exl [~myself@cp1224652-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has joined #openttd
09:25<@Belugas:#openttd>where ? where ? where?
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10:03<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>does anyone have sac arctic trees ?
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10:09<dihedral:#openttd>i never knew that existed :-P
10:09<dihedral:#openttd>i only know of her stolen trees
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10:19*petern:#openttd yawns
10:19<@petern:#openttd>dihedral, that's them
10:20<dihedral:#openttd>oh
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10:32<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>something bad with my ships, I've got: 2cc ships, MB ships, MB ships ECS extension
10:32<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>when I remove 2cc ships then original (TTD) ships are doubled on the list
10:32<+glx:#openttd>MB and 2cc probably conflict
10:32<Gekz:#openttd>my girlfriend plays ottd now
10:32<Gekz:#openttd>:D
10:32<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>they used to work fine
10:32<Forked:#openttd>Gekz: how did you manage that? :\
10:32<+glx:#openttd>and never remove grfs in a running game
10:33<Gekz:#openttd>I showed her the site Forked
10:33<Gekz:#openttd>and she demanded it
10:33<Forked:#openttd>I tried.. but no luck
10:33<Gekz:#openttd>she also demanded Ubuntu from me
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10:33<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>I've tried to install Price-Capacity multplier for MB ships .... but it work only for original ships not MB ships ... and after than I ended up with original ships appearing 3times on the list (each ships appears: original, original, original with capacity/price mod)
10:34<dihedral:#openttd>Gekz, what a sad life!
10:34<+glx:#openttd>you enabled "multiple engine" setting?
10:34<Gekz:#openttd>dihedral: how so?
10:34<@petern:#openttd>heh
10:34<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>glx of course
10:35<+glx:#openttd>that's your problem :)
10:35<dihedral:#openttd>:-D
10:35<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>is there grf that disables original vehicles ?
10:35<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>glx but I need multple ones
10:35<+glx:#openttd>every grf modifies original engines
10:35<@petern:#openttd>anyone fancy making a grf-override for that multiplier grf?
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10:36<+glx:#openttd>and with "multiple" each grf is separated
10:37<+glx:#openttd>unless coded to override another grf
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10:41<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>ok I do not have to remove 2cc ships
10:41<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>but price-capacity multiplier does not work :/
10:41<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>(with MB ships)
10:42<+glx:#openttd>you just need to write a grf to make price-capacity override MB ships
10:42<@petern:#openttd>"just" :)D
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10:45<Hirundo:#openttd>does NWidget(WWT_PANEL, ...) always order its children vertically, or can I somehow tell it to place them horizontally?
10:45<planetmaker:#openttd>I heard that word "just" before...
10:45*planetmaker:#openttd scratches the head
10:46*petern:#openttd makes a grf
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10:51<@petern:#openttd>http://fuzzle.org/ottd/shipcompat.grf < may or may not work
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10:53<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>glx
10:53<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>but there is one already
10:54<planetmaker:#openttd>o_O
10:54<planetmaker:#openttd>petern, you need to upload it :P
10:54<@petern:#openttd>no
10:55<@petern:#openttd>i need to provide the correct link
10:55<@petern:#openttd>http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/shipcompat.grf < may or may not work
10:55<planetmaker:#openttd>:)
10:55<@petern:#openttd>i crafted the nfo and compiled it, haven't tested at all
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10:56<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=619506
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10:58<Yexo:#openttd>hello
10:59<+glx:#openttd>SHADOW-XIII: try petern's grf
10:59<planetmaker:#openttd>salut Yexo
10:59<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>any links ?
10:59<+glx:#openttd><@petern> http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/shipcompat.grf < may or may not work
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11:11<@Belugas:#openttd>[10:44] <@petern> "just" :)D <--- you have a mustach now?
11:11<@petern:#openttd>hehe
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11:17<fjb:#openttd>shipcompat? shiptoolv4? What is that? Sounds interesting.
11:20<OsteHovel:#openttd>:P
11:20<@Belugas:#openttd>"garanted to blow your mind"
11:21<@Belugas:#openttd>usual reaction: SOMETHING NEW!!!! ME WANTS IT!!! what it does?
11:21<@Belugas:#openttd>hehehe
11:21<fjb:#openttd>Not possible. I don't have any mind.
11:22<@Belugas:#openttd>hooo... usual user then!
11:22<@Belugas:#openttd>youhou!!!
11:22<OsteHovel:#openttd>hehe :P
11:23<fjb:#openttd>I thought this project needs at least one usual user.
11:24<@Belugas:#openttd>no need for that anymore. we have AIs!
11:24<fjb:#openttd>Ok, then I can go now. Bye bye.
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11:25<planetmaker:#openttd>he...
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11:29<@Belugas:#openttd>ho :(
11:30<@Belugas:#openttd>i guess /me will shuts his big mouth from now on
11:32<Gekz:#openttd>haha
11:32<Gekz:#openttd>pwned
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11:41<dihedral:#openttd>Belugas, fjb always has been a bit instable :-P
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11:41<dihedral:#openttd>no need for feeling bad ^^
11:46<@Belugas:#openttd>Guilt is a state of mind deeply incrusted in my psyche by a long exposure to christian education
11:46<@Belugas:#openttd>somethng i've not totally been cured of
11:46<@Belugas:#openttd>Let me put on The Cure on...
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11:48<planetmaker:#openttd>hehe :)
11:49<Gekz:#openttd>it is bad english night
11:50<@Belugas:#openttd>it's normal, since it's still daytime!
11:51<Gekz:#openttd>haha
11:54<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>ok, I should kiss petern
11:54<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>:*
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11:57<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>your grf works like a charm, making ship tool working with newships (but not with originals) ... could adjust for 2cc ships but not necessary ... I think it's lowering their actual cost of mb ships (despite setting it to 3 times higher than should be,but that's ship tool error i think)
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12:07<@petern:#openttd>mmm
12:07<@petern:#openttd>base costs are an... issue with 'multiple engines'
12:08<+glx:#openttd>base costs are global
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12:28*Belugas:#openttd picks up his lunch box and prepares to devore his sandwich
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12:41<frosch123:#openttd>how about just removing base costs? :p
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13:18<taisteluorava:#openttd>hey all, is there some kinda cheat in openttd, check http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/9092/pelaaja1transport30thap.png
13:19<FauxFaux:#openttd>Yes, you can build routes.
13:19<taisteluorava:#openttd>check company value graph
13:19<taisteluorava:#openttd>that is insane
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13:20<+glx:#openttd>planes
13:20<taisteluorava:#openttd>all of us got planes, and its 2 plane maximium in that game
13:20<@petern:#openttd>stocks 'bug'
13:21<taisteluorava:#openttd>how its possible to make that?
13:21<taisteluorava:#openttd>and cant that be fixed?
13:22<+glx:#openttd>anyway a screenshot is not enough
13:22<taisteluorava:#openttd>its really annoying to people ruins public games by using that :/
13:22<+glx:#openttd>you can disable them
13:22<taisteluorava:#openttd>what else screenshots you need, game is online all time
13:22<+glx:#openttd>it's a setting
13:23<taisteluorava:#openttd>but even if he selled a shares, other companies value was so low
13:23<taisteluorava:#openttd>check first mont on that graph
13:23<taisteluorava:#openttd>in screenshot which i posted, first month on value graph
13:24<+glx:#openttd>company values depends on vehicles and some other things
13:25<taisteluorava:#openttd>so with disabling buying shares will disable that "bug" also?
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13:32<el_en:#openttd>http://www.noob.us/entertainment/danny-macaskill-parkour-bicycle/
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13:55<dihedral:#openttd>taisteluorava, disable shares and while you are at it, disable exclusive transport rights ;-)
13:55<dihedral:#openttd>you people seem like that'd get you into a fight if someone used it ^^
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13:56<dihedral:#openttd>hehe - making exclusive transport rights only purchasable to those who have a rating greater than x would be interesting :-P
13:56<SHADOW_XIII:#openttd>what happens if 2 ppl bu exclusive transport rights ?
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13:57<taisteluorava:#openttd>that who bounght first, lose it
13:57<frosch123:#openttd>the latter wins until a third one buys them again
13:57<taisteluorava:#openttd>so who latest bought rights, he got it
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13:57<dihedral:#openttd>i thought only one person can buy them
13:58<dihedral:#openttd>so in the rare event of 2 buying at the same time, the one who bought them last wins :-P
13:58<dihedral:#openttd>sounds odd :-D
13:58<taisteluorava:#openttd>yep
13:58<@petern:#openttd>it's lame
13:58<@petern:#openttd>you can have a tug-of-war over rights
13:58<taisteluorava:#openttd>so basically who got more money, he will win that competition at end : )
13:58<frosch123:#openttd>dihedral: it does not have to be at the same time. if you notice someone bought them, you can just buy them yourself
13:59<dihedral:#openttd>eh... is that not generally the case?
13:59<dihedral:#openttd>now that sounds great frosch123
13:59<dihedral:#openttd>i am astounded at that logic :-P
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14:23<@Belugas:#openttd>wasn't there a wishlist on blocking the possibility to buy rights up until end of rights period?
14:23<@Belugas:#openttd>or something..
14:24<frosch123:#openttd>you could also double the needed amount everytime another player wants to take them over, and give the old company a fraction back
14:25<frosch123:#openttd>or you could just not bother and disable it :p
14:26<@Belugas:#openttd>#Or you start to SCREEEEEEAAAAAM!
14:27<@Belugas:#openttd>dunno
14:27<@Belugas:#openttd>i do not care about the buying rights stuff, honestly
14:27<@Belugas:#openttd>but... ifi t can make the game more "fun" and "far" to play...
14:31<@Belugas:#openttd>the lightning of simultrans is not the same of openttd, i guess
14:35<pavel1269:#openttd>but?
14:35<pavel1269:#openttd>what do you mean?
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14:38<@Belugas:#openttd>who?
14:39<frosch123:#openttd>I guess belugas is talking about the comic set, pavel is talking about the weather
14:40<frosch123:#openttd>pavel1269: do not take "t"s too serious :p
14:40<frosch123:#openttd>err "n"s :/
14:40<@Belugas:#openttd>frosch123 got it right :)
14:40<pavel1269:#openttd>what/who are "n" ? :-)
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14:45<pavel1269:#openttd>lol, have you watched fast-build-ottd video?
14:54<@Belugas:#openttd>no. have you watched fast-working-belugas?
14:55<pavel1269:#openttd>link? :-)
14:55<frosch123:#openttd>no results were found for "fast-working-belugas", did you mean "fast-and-proper-working-belugas" ?
15:00<@Belugas:#openttd>not usable video. iamge is too blurry ;)
15:00<@Belugas:#openttd>buwhahahahha
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15:00<@Belugas:#openttd>image...
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15:05<@petern:#openttd>hm
15:10<SHADOW-XIII:#openttd>comic style looks great with ottd
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15:36<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello all
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15:46<fjb:#openttd>Hello Nite_Owl
15:47<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello fjb
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16:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>Lalalalaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
16:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>I AM PRETTY!
16:25<+glx:#openttd>no WT3 is ;)
16:25<@petern:#openttd>no i am
16:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>hehe, tnx glx
16:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: only when you are dressed :)
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16:25<@petern:#openttd>that's what she said
16:27<@Belugas:#openttd>before of after removing her glasses?
16:28<@Belugas:#openttd>hou hou hou!!!
16:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>oh no, it is a Belugas!
16:28<@Belugas:#openttd>yup!!! and it's... ho!!! A Brain!
16:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>I lost my brain long ago
16:29<@petern:#openttd>no
16:29<@petern:#openttd>you lost your light long ago
16:29-!-phidah [~phidah@1305ds3-oebr.0.fullrate.dk] has quit []
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>that is also very true
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>you lost your numbers
16:29<@petern:#openttd>(truelight was a better nick)
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>your numbers are count! :p
16:29<@petern:#openttd>cos we don't like change innit
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>I disagree :) I like this nick more :)
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>all my computers have this cool names
16:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>smallbrain, fastbrain, sharebrain, interbrain
16:31<@Belugas:#openttd>no brain
16:31<@Belugas:#openttd>er
16:31<@Belugas:#openttd>no brainer
16:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrxbojnGok4 <- it really is kind of fun :)
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16:33<@Belugas:#openttd>ChipnPin PINPad and simulator are finally working!
16:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>concratz :)
16:33<@Belugas:#openttd>tokk "just" 3 days to figure it out :S
16:33<@petern:#openttd>g
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>bah, GetText has really the worst format ever
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>it is very hard to update WT3 based on a diff over a gettext .po file
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>as ... it is multiline :(
16:38<@Belugas:#openttd>dunno what you're talking about, but it does not seems a friendly hobby
16:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>anyone clever suggestions to check in a SVN repos what entries are updated in a gettext .po file? Without reading the whole file :(
16:41<TrueBrain:#openttd>http://paste.openttd.org/182184
16:42<frosch123:#openttd>hmm, the fast-build stuff is indeed nice
16:42<@Belugas:#openttd>dunno, TrueBrain
16:43<el_en:#openttd>TrueBrain: you may want to consider reading the binary .mo files, which have the messages in one piece. except not fuzzy ones.
16:44<TrueBrain:#openttd>el_en: a bit of a problem there is, that non-translated aren't there ..
16:45<el_en:#openttd>that's very true.
16:47<TrueBrain:#openttd>el_en: what was the #, fuzzy keyword? (don't feel like looking it up :p LAZY!)
16:49<el_en:#openttd>it means that the message was either "guessed" by the msgmerge process, or the translator manually set it to fuzzy to indicate it needs more work. fuzzies are indeed not included in .mo.
16:49<TrueBrain:#openttd>so I reall yneed to read the .po files ..
16:50<el_en:#openttd>TrueBrain: btw, the WT would really need some kind of fuzzy status for the messages, too.
16:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>el_en: you mean in general, that you can mark a string as: need additional attention?
16:51<el_en:#openttd>exactly.
16:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>good idea
16:51<TrueBrain:#openttd>isn't there a way to force gettext to put everything on one line?
16:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>so you get 3 lines (a #:, a msgid and a msgstr)
16:52<el_en:#openttd>perhaps even two levels of those; "need additional attention, don't use in program" and "need additional attention, do use in program".
16:53<TrueBrain:#openttd>they will all be included in SVN, but you will be able to mark entries as needs attention :)
16:53<TrueBrain:#openttd>(the reason they need to go in SVN, is because that survives .. WT3 might not :))
16:53<el_en:#openttd>right
16:55<TrueBrain:#openttd>--no-wrap .. hmm ..
16:59-!-pavel1269 [~quassel@r2ao16.net.upc.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>grr .. I added --no-wrap, and it doesn't seem to work :(
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>bye all
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>enjoy the stars
17:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>bye Belugas :)
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>ciao bello
17:02<Xaroth:#openttd>o/
17:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>finally found why it failed ... --no-wrap needs to be done at msgmerge level
17:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>then it works fine
17:07<TrueBrain:#openttd>then 'svn diff' should always give me a big enough scope to process the data .. I hope :)
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17:17<TrueBrain:#openttd> * Checking for at least 512MBytes RAM ... [ ok ]
17:17<TrueBrain:#openttd> * Checking for at least 5120MBytes disk space at ${T} ... [ !! ]
17:17<TrueBrain:#openttd> * Don't have at least 5120MBytes disk space at ${T}
17:17<TrueBrain:#openttd>to compile OpenOffice :p
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17:20<fjb:#openttd>Use virtual storage. :-9
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21:27<voss:#openttd>Anyone awake?
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23:05<@Belugas:#openttd>yee yes yes... we know the game is not like real life... http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=29683&start=240
23:05<@Belugas:#openttd>lovely from you to tell us so...
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23:14*Belugas:#openttd keeps on waiting for the compile to finish
23:14<@Belugas:#openttd>it's loooooooooong
23:15<@Belugas:#openttd>infact... i'll sleep now and check the result tomorrow
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---Logclosed Thu Apr 23 00:00:28 2009