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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-05-06

---Logopened Wed May 06 00:00:04 2009
00:10<kkb110:#openttd>not ottd?
00:10<kkb110:#openttd>.
00:14<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i just tried openttd
00:14<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>its cool, but i miss the bugs from ttd ;>
00:20<kkb110:#openttd>hahaha
00:20<kkb110:#openttd>what bug for example?
00:20<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:)
00:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>for example the cheap water blowup using a dock, and place a flag to don't let water go back
00:24<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>while was bored, i've built a path for the maglev trains on water from the oil-refinery to the oil-platform in the middle of some ocean
00:30<kkb110:#openttd>haha
00:31<kkb110:#openttd>making seaworld is also funny
00:31<kkb110:#openttd>flat all the map at once to water level
00:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you can make some jokemap too
00:34<kkb110:#openttd>jokemap?
00:35<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>let map be at sea-level, place a square water somewhere hidden
00:35<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>let player notice after a while
00:35<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>waterworld is coming
00:35<kkb110:#openttd>lol
00:35<kkb110:#openttd>that's awesome hah
00:35<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>;>
00:36<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>did you know original TTD money counter overflows at longint to negative?
00:36<kkb110:#openttd>no I didn't know but it seems it'll take like 100 years to reach that negative balance
00:38<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>with effective railroad system you can overflow it faster
00:39<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but i guess OpenTTD won't overflow to negative at 32bit limit
00:42<kkb110:#openttd>I just checked
00:42-!-TinoDid [~projectjj@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
00:42<kkb110:#openttd>in economy_type.h
00:42<kkb110:#openttd>typedef OverflowSafeInt64 Money; // :D
00:42<csokisnyuszi:#openttd><;
00:43<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>that'd be hard to overflow
00:44<kkb110:#openttd>and what even more is that. this type actually checks and prevents even if there is an overflow
00:45<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>cool
00:47<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>so i can now have 9223372036854775806 euros
00:47<kkb110:#openttd>:D
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00:50<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>tried 2048x2048 map
00:54<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>looking forward for lev-5 maglev breaking mach-1 with a sonic boom and lev-6 @ mach-2 and lev-7 @ mach-3
00:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>like lev-5 be 50000hp lev6 be 200000hp lev7 be 1000000hp
00:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>heheh http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mach_number
00:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>cool pic
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01:02<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hi
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01:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>heil-o
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01:32<DaleStan:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, planetmaker, SmatZ, and anyone else who is having problems with NFORenum: Please post in the thread on the forums. Anything said here will be forgotten before I have time to touch the source.
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02:50<dihedral:#openttd>morning lads :)
02:58-!-Singaporekid [~notme@cm94.psi148.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd
03:13<planetmaker:#openttd>good morning
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03:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>"Anything said here will be forgotten before I have time to touch the source." <- you will all forget it, before he touches the source. Just so you know :p :p :p
03:55*Forked:#openttd fondles the source
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03:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>Either way, a very good morning to you all
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04:10<Forked:#openttd>morning, sir TB
04:16<planetmaker:#openttd>g'day TrueBrain
04:31-!-fonsinchen [~alve@BAEddf3.bae.pppool.de] has joined #openttd
04:31<Ammler:#openttd>hello ladies and gentlemen :-/
04:32<Ammler:#openttd>(and you)
04:37<planetmaker:#openttd>:-o
04:39<Ammler:#openttd>:-)
04:46<guru3:#openttd>Good morning.
04:54-!-Hirundo [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
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05:18<TrueBrain:#openttd>so what am I going to do today Pinky?
05:21<@petern:#openttd>something different
05:22<frosch123:#openttd>teach DorpsGek to kick everyone who joins 5 times within one hour
05:23<TrueBrain:#openttd>I considered that :p
05:24<blathijs:#openttd>So they can join _again_ ? :-p
05:25<frosch123:#openttd>yeah, so if they have autojoin, dorpsgek will kick them 10 times in a row, and then ban them
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05:45<Executioner:#openttd>http://3x3cut10n3r.mybrute.com/ <--- have fun & good luck
05:46-!-Executioner [Executione@dslb-094-223-192-177.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit []
05:47<Forked:#openttd>right
05:48<frosch123:#openttd>bad luck, noone was fast enough to kick him, so no fun
05:48<TrueBrain:#openttd>frosch123: exactly what I was thinking :p
05:53<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16238 /trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): -Change: improve/clarify some network related debug "error" messages by adding more information to them. Also give some clues on how to fix certain issues (like failing advertising).
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05:57<Hirundo:#openttd>Can differences in the yapf cache cause desyncs?
05:57-!-stuffcorpse [~rick@121.98.136.241] has joined #openttd
05:57<frosch123:#openttd>hopefully not :)
05:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>if YAPF caches differ on client and server, desyncs happens
05:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>(well .. not immediatly, but in the near future)
05:59<Hirundo:#openttd>OK, thanks for the information
05:59*Hirundo:#openttd runs and fixes desync in IS
06:00<TrueBrain:#openttd>last time I did track sharing ... YAPF needed a bit of patching ;) (and became somewhat slower :p)
06:02<Hirundo:#openttd>some YAPF patching has been done ... but notifying it that tracks have changed wasn't done at all
06:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>that will cause desyncs for sure :)
06:03-!-phidah [~phidah@1305ds3-oebr.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd
06:03<Hirundo:#openttd>fortunately the refresh algorithm isn't that sophisticated
06:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>a I-want-to-be-100%-sure-nothing-fucks-up-when-the-track-changes algorithm, if I am not mistaken ;)
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06:04<Hirundo:#openttd>Although I fear... I will have to do more yapf patching, so segments end on owner changes :S
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06:27<Chris_Booth:#openttd>hello
06:29<@petern:#openttd>i've not noticed any desyncs with IS2, oddly
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06:39-!-ohnoitsavram [avram@123-243-10-69.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd
06:43<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Query: Cargo destinations/distributions - I have one powerplant A and I have some coal mines X Y Z, if I connect power plant B do I get more coal produced?
06:43<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Is there any incentive to connect powerplant B to the network
06:44<Chris_Booth:#openttd>no
06:44<Chris_Booth:#openttd>just the fact you will need to run trains from a - b
06:47<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Well that's ok cause even in the current game there is no incentive to hook up more than one primary industry other than overloading
06:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Then query number two: when it comes to passengers, why would I ever build a network, wouldn't it be the most profitable to just set up routes from one point on the map to the point furthest away
06:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and keep all these routes exclusive
06:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>cause then I have all possible cargo going the furthest possible distance
06:50<Noldo:#openttd>yes, you are on to something
06:50<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>where as soon as I add another node to that network I have cargo going there and my profits actually decrease
06:51<Noldo:#openttd>I really starting to feel like writing the forums post about the different demografies of openttd players
06:53<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Unless Unless Unless as I thought originally adding more nodes just means more passengers and cargo, then there's no problem
06:54<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but if thats not the case then cargodest is seriously flawed in that it encourages players not to make networks
06:55<fonsinchen:#openttd>ohnoitsavram: read my last post in the cargodist forum
06:55<fonsinchen:#openttd>it's easy to implement passenger/cargo supply scaling on top of the linkgraph but I won't do it for now
06:57<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>I actually haven't used your patch yet but have been doing thought experiments about it in my head
06:57<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>what do you mean by supply scaling
06:58<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Do you mean pre-emptive supply scaling, so things know where they want to go before any route there has been made
06:58<fonsinchen:#openttd>supply scaling := generate more cargo if more destinations are available.
06:59<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>How would that work for industries
06:59<fonsinchen:#openttd>you connect power plant B and get more coal for each coal mine connected.
06:59<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Would it bypass the monthly production or would it determine monthly production
06:59<fonsinchen:#openttd>doesn't matter
07:00<fonsinchen:#openttd>someone suggested modifying the cargo ratings at the stations
07:00<fonsinchen:#openttd>that sounds good
07:00<fonsinchen:#openttd>but you could also modify the production of the industries
07:00<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Well it would be silly to have industry A produce 200 tonnes of coal a month but the station being capable of shipping 500 or something
07:00<fonsinchen:#openttd>you know what cargo rating is?
07:01<fonsinchen:#openttd>that's those percentage things you see in the station window
07:01<fonsinchen:#openttd>it determines how much of the produced cargo shows up at the station.
07:01<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Yes I see
07:03<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>But then comes the problem for when station ratings are maxxed out
07:03<fonsinchen:#openttd>have you ever seen a 100% rating anywhere?
07:03<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>But I guess that's not even a problem at all
07:03<fonsinchen:#openttd>also you could artificially keep them low if fewer destinations are available.
07:05<fonsinchen:#openttd>as I said: that's details. The framework is there. As soon as the link graph is stable and accepted as the way to do things like this, someone can go and write a patch doing supply scaling.
07:05<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Well alright but there's nothing wrong with talking about it
07:05<fonsinchen:#openttd>no, of course not. Did I say that?
07:05<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>nope :D
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07:06<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Station ratings would need to be very low for only one connection
07:07<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>You don't want it starting with 70% or something and going up by increments of 5% for each node added
07:07<fonsinchen:#openttd>no one said the scaling is linear.
07:07<fonsinchen:#openttd>you can make the starting value configurable.
07:08<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>On larger maps it'd need to be smaller, I'd think
07:08<fonsinchen:#openttd>and then apply some function to the number of destination to determine the actual rating.
07:08<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Ideally the value would depend on possible nodes
07:08<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>I mena possible destinations
07:08<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>as in to get a 100% station rating you'd need to have all posible destinations hooked up
07:10<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Just as long as you're getting marginal profits for each new destination you hook up the supply scaling is doing its job well
07:10<fonsinchen:#openttd>Well, personally I'd implement it by modifying the production values as the rating system is fairly fragile.
07:11<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Thats a good idea but it might be hard to make compatible with grfs and the like
07:12<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>It makes economic sense too cause once two suppliers are competing for the same demander they'd both be trying to outdo eachother
07:12<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and production would increase
07:15<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>yeah makes more sense than station ratings
07:16<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Is there some kinda base modifier for production increases that grfs call from or do they just put their own values in and aren't affected by ottd source
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07:18<Noldo:#openttd>connection from competition to more stuff suplied isn't very clear to me
07:19<Noldo:#openttd>maybe if the prices dropped and that would lead to increased demand
07:19<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Well think of it this way
07:19<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>We have one demander and one supplier
07:19<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Its int he suppliers interest to be hitting demand elasticity and produce no more than that
07:19<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>as that's where he has max revenue
07:20<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>however as soon as you add a competitor, its in the competitors interest to lower the price and provide the same amount
07:20<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>in response to this the once-monopolist would have to do the same
07:20<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and you would have a lowering of prices and an increase of supply
07:21<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>on both parts
07:21<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>generally the mroe competition there is the more there is of every good and the more efficient every competing firm needs to be to stay in the game
07:21<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>If you can't produce at the low prices you're effed
07:21-!-Roujin [~chatzilla@mnch-5d85f20b.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
07:21<Roujin:#openttd>cheers
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07:23<Roujin:#openttd>@seen alberth
07:23<@DorpsGek:#openttd>Roujin: alberth was last seen in #openttd 14 hours, 49 minutes, and 43 seconds ago: <Alberth> Hmm, I knew it was a bad idea to stay up and commit stuff :(
07:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><Noldo> connection from competition to more stuff suplied isn't very clear to me <- there are very easy examples for that. consider the "browser war". while internet explorer had the competitor netscape, a lot of new browser versions were produced in short time, then IE had a monopoly, and there was almost no improvement for several years. suddenly, a new competitor Firefox appeared and took significant market share, again, there were
07:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>several new IE versions in short time.
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07:24<Roujin:#openttd>hmm.. who else regards himself as an expert about the openttd GUI system?
07:24<Noldo:#openttd>I'm feeling there is a difference in how coal and browsers work
07:25<Noldo:#openttd>in the economycal sence that is
07:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not in the sense that monopolys generally hurt the customers if they are not regulated
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07:26<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Consider Coal mine A which is a monopoly
07:26<Noldo:#openttd>that is true
07:26<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>it can charge any price it wants right?
07:26<Roujin:#openttd>is there a way to use a WWT_TEXT widget so it automatically takes up the space it needs (depending on the selected language)?
07:27<Noldo:#openttd>ohnoitsavram: There need to be a increase in demand anyway
07:27<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>well yes but there's an optimal price for it to charge cause if it charges to much P(price)*Q(quantity) is smaller than it owuld have been for a price below that
07:27<Roujin:#openttd>I'm currently working on the content list, planning to introduce filters for each type of content {On/Off}
07:28<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>the point where it has the most revenue is where the monopolist is going to charge
07:28<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>As soon as a competitor comes in this point on your supply and demand curve moves to the right
07:29<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>which means more quantity
07:29<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Also if you're not familiar with it
07:29<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Say's Law
07:29<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Supply creates its own demand
07:29<Roujin:#openttd>For this I changed the "Tag/name filter" text which is currently just drawn onto the window into a WWT_TEXT widget - drawback is that it may be too small for some languages
07:29<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>aggregate and real
07:30<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>yeah your demand curve become smore and more horizontal the more competitors there are
07:30<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>some economists will tell you it becomes perfectly horizontal in the perfect competition model
07:30<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but that's b/s
07:30<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but it DOES get more horizontal
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07:32<Noldo:#openttd>I've always been a bit sceptical about the supply-side-economics
07:35<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>the easiest way to think about it is with a falling price more people will be able to buy the said product
07:35<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and competition makes prices fall (obviously)
07:36<Noldo:#openttd>I thought that was what I originally said
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07:38<Noldo:#openttd>but this is a part of the game that really needs some unrealisim because in single player game there is a monopoly of transport services
07:39<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Transport services maybe but not industries
07:39<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>the way I think of it is you are paid for transporting
07:39<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but the industries striek deals amongst themselves
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07:40<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>so two coal mines are trying to outbid eachother for the power stations dollar
07:40<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but you don't play part in that
07:40<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>you just transport from a to b
07:40<Noldo:#openttd>but it might be realistical that the monopolistic transport company doesn't want to connect certain industries
07:40<Noldo:#openttd>in the original case the coal plant b
07:41<Noldo:#openttd>connecting is in the interest of the coal mines though
07:41<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>why isn't it in the interest of the transport company?
07:42<Noldo:#openttd>there is no money in it
07:42<Noldo:#openttd>all the coal is already transported to the coal plant and the infrastructure to do that is already paid for
07:42<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>But you can transport more coal by connecting another mine
07:43<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>why would you make less money?
07:43<Noldo:#openttd>that's true, but you can't make more money by connecting another coal plant
07:43<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>:S howcome you say that
07:44<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>You charge $40 a tonne of coal lets say cause charging anymore will mean you get less revenue (i.e $40 is monopoly price)
07:45<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>you connect more coal, the powerplant is happy to have more coal at the same price
07:45<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>you make more money
07:45<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Maybe the price falls a little maybe
07:45<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>cause of the diminishing utility of extra units of coal to the powerplant
07:46<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but it won't fall too much and if it does then it would be in your itnerest to connect another specific factor such as a powerplant
07:46<Noldo:#openttd>that's true, but you can't make more money by connecting another powerplant
07:46<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and put the utility of coal back up
07:46<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>no you can't
07:47<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>but but but externalities come into play here
07:47<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>What I mean is when you hook up another plant you create a competition among suppliers for the coal on the industry side of things (not related to your transport empire)
07:47<Noldo:#openttd>my hidden asumption seems to be that the one plant can burn it all
07:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>I mean among demanders
07:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>and when there is more demand there is more supply
07:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>So you SHOULD have an incentive to do so both in real world terms and in the game
07:48<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>that's what I was originaly talking to fonzo about
07:49<Noldo:#openttd>I agree about the in the game part
07:49<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>?
07:49<Noldo:#openttd>real word is too complicated to agree about anything
07:49<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Well in this example
07:50<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>when you have competition among demanders that raises the price right?
07:50<Noldo:#openttd>and is increases suply
07:51<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Not in the short term
07:51<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>But in the long term increases in demand increase supply
07:51<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>if there is competition
07:52<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>even without competition come to think of it :S
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07:55<Yexo:#openttd>hello
07:56<Roujin:#openttd>hi yexo
08:02<fonsinchen:#openttd>that's all yadda. Try thinking about balanced gameplay, not about reality. If you create a perfectly realistic game that's unplayable what have you achieved? On the other hand if you create a really weird and unrealistic game which is very interesting to play I can see a utility for that.
08:06<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>I think giving the player incentive to connect as many industries as possible leads to good gameplay
08:06<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>It just so happens that it reflects reality, do we need to reject the idea just because it happens to do this?
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08:10<fonsinchen:#openttd>no, but the discussion about the reality aspects of the idea is irrelevant.
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08:14<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Maybe, but it was fun. I already made it clear earlier that I think the best solution to the problem was to make adding destinations increase production
08:15<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Then I went on to explain to Noldo how it reflects reality
08:15<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Gee talking about all things real is really really taboo around these parts
08:18<@petern:#openttd>you're learning :D
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08:20*Yexo:#openttd wonders whether ohnoitsavram has already spotted the channel title
08:20<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>Yeah I got grilled the other day trying to figure out if the huge maps patch would lead to maps bigger than the surface area of the earth O_O
08:20<planetmaker:#openttd>hahaha :)
08:20<planetmaker:#openttd>hello Yexo :)
08:21<Yexo:#openttd>hi planetmaker :)
08:21<@petern:#openttd>yeah, cos x by y arbitrary size tiles translate to surface area really well ;)
08:22<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>I assumed they were only one metre!
08:22<ohnoitsavram:#openttd>hell even if they were only one cm
08:22<@petern:#openttd>good luck with that :D
08:22<Roujin:#openttd>ah! the content list window has resize step x set to 2 to make the half/half resizing work! what a hack!
08:22<planetmaker:#openttd>cos y can be anything between -1 and 1
08:22<Roujin:#openttd>and a nowhere-documented-hack on top of that! :P
08:31<@petern:#openttd>it's self documenting :D
08:37<Roujin:#openttd>the problem is that I now introduced six buttons on the left half
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08:38<Roujin:#openttd>that means each will be resized 1/6th of 1/2th of the resizing amount -> i need to set resize step to 12 or resizing will be borked
08:48<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: yexo * r16239 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_order.cpp: -Fix (r16199): Use the stop/non-stop intermediate orderflags AIs can give for goto-depot orders
08:50<Sacro:#openttd>Anyone here used VBOs with OpenGL?
08:50<DASPRiD:#openttd>http://pixcrawler.isp4p.net/.de/2009-02-24-Confessions.png
08:53<Roujin:#openttd>hm, changing resize step to 12 opens up a can of worms... then the window size (min + default) must also be a multiple of 12...
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09:10<@Belugas:#openttd>[00:37] <csokisnyuszi> let map be at sea-level, place a square water somewhere hidden <--- i had an idea of towns on piles (therfor on water). I guess water world is not that far away...
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09:15<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: frosch * r16240 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Fix: Make 'stop in depot'-orders only apply on the target depot, not those which are entered on the way to them.
09:42<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16241 /trunk/src/3rdparty/squirrel/squirrel/sqvm.cpp: -Fix (r16181): regression failing due to wrongly initialised amount of traps
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09:54<guru3:#openttd>wow, if you take the top 10 used words of this channel, you could create an entire sentence
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09:56<guru3:#openttd>could think about something because which really should still would
09:56<guru3:#openttd>makes sense... sort of
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09:59<frosch123:#openttd>yup, that is said twenty times a day in this channel. no surprise they end up in the top 10
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10:04<Milloflex:#openttd>howdy people
10:05<Milloflex:#openttd>i was wondering if it is possible to auto-follow a player in spectator mode?
10:05<Milloflex:#openttd>cause that would be a very good feature to learn others to play the game
10:05<Roujin:#openttd>there's no information sent to the server where the player is currently viewing
10:06<Milloflex:#openttd>i see
10:06<@Belugas:#openttd>plus, a player can be in fact multiple users behind the same "company"
10:07<Milloflex:#openttd>yeah that i know of... just though it would be good to spectate a player directly aswell
10:07<Forked:#openttd>and a single user can have multiple views
10:07<Milloflex:#openttd>heh
10:08<Milloflex:#openttd>yes but yet again not what i'm after
10:08<Aali:#openttd>its possible to follow a company's actions with the center_company patch
10:08<@Belugas:#openttd>Makes me think of "Being Malkovich" or whatever the title in english :)
10:08<Aali:#openttd>so you see what they do, but not what they're looking at
10:09<Milloflex:#openttd>hm seam pretty good
10:09<Milloflex:#openttd>where do i find this 'patch'?
10:09<Roujin:#openttd>yeah! no "nested widgets gave different results" message anymore!
10:10<Roujin:#openttd>man, nested widgets are a hassle :P
10:10<Yexo:#openttd>initially, yes, but I prefer to build a new gui window with the nested widgets above the old system
10:12<Roujin:#openttd>yeah, it's true that the old system is unflexible...
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10:14<@Belugas:#openttd>Milloflex, i just had a though: your idea would be perfect too to spy on your opponent (taking for granted that NOW, you can efficiently play) and sabotage his efforts...
10:14<Milloflex:#openttd>could always be disabled
10:14<Milloflex:#openttd>dont have to be enabled on public servers
10:14<Milloflex:#openttd>more for private ones when you learn your friends to play etc
10:15<Progman:#openttd>Milloflex: there is a patch from the openttdcoop community
10:15<Milloflex:#openttd>does that mean i need to recompile code?
10:15<Milloflex:#openttd>or is it a in-game patch?
10:17<Progman:#openttd>every patch need to recompile the code
10:17<@Belugas:#openttd>in-game patch it not for Openttd, quiote not possible, for nightlies at least.... You have to recompile the code indeed
10:18<Milloflex:#openttd>oh i see. then its not for me. no hurry with such a feature, just through it would be a good thing to have and that's what brought me here. :- )
10:18<Milloflex:#openttd>very cool to see how ttd has developed this past years. was a long time since i've played it now.
10:19<Milloflex:#openttd>really love the 'online content'. got great potential.
10:21<Milloflex:#openttd>one other thing. is it possible to magnify the game (kind of "zoom in")? cause i got a pretty big monitor for my computer, and the grafic and texts are a litle small to me in some situations...
10:23<@petern:#openttd>no
10:23<@petern:#openttd>sit closer :D
10:23<Milloflex:#openttd>heh
10:23<Milloflex:#openttd>yeah, or use vistas magnifyer ;- )
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10:25<Milloflex:#openttd>there are some really odd stuff going on with the trains pathfinder... it tells me that a train is lost even though its right on track
10:26<Milloflex:#openttd>i even have put put some waypoints in the charp turn, but didn't help
10:27-!-snorre [~snorre@cF6FC00C3.dhcp.bluecom.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:27<Yexo:#openttd>can you upload a savegame somewhere reproducing that problem?
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10:30<Milloflex:#openttd>sure thing
10:33<Milloflex:#openttd>of course it just stopped happening even though i didn't change anything. ;- )
10:33<Milloflex:#openttd>i'll try to catch it next time
10:33<Ammler:#openttd>Milloflex: don't you use YAPF?
10:33<Milloflex:#openttd>default settings
10:34<Milloflex:#openttd>didn't change anything
10:34<Milloflex:#openttd>just downloaded the game yesterday
10:34<Milloflex:#openttd>so i have no idea :- )
10:34<Ammler:#openttd>maybe the train get lost, because you just changed some track tiles
10:34<Ammler:#openttd>and fixed it later
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11:07<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16242 /trunk/src/ (29 files in 5 dirs):
11:07<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: -Codechange: rework pausing
11:07<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#2864]: autopause and manual pausing conflict with eachother
11:07<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: -Fix: new game + pause on new game + autopause make the game not unpause on the first join
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11:18<Chruker:#openttd>Is it possible for the game to utilize additional CPU cores for the AIs?
11:18<@petern:#openttd>no
11:19<Chruker:#openttd>But would it be trivial to add it? Like starting a new thread for the squirrel engine for each AI (or something like that)
11:19<@petern:#openttd>no
11:21<Progman:#openttd>Chruker: what about players (in the same multiplayer game with AIs) who don't have a multi core system?
11:22<planetmaker:#openttd>Progman, that's not an argument.
11:22<@Belugas:#openttd>plus, if it was possible, it would have already been done
11:22<planetmaker:#openttd>the same could be argued with different processor speeds otherwise.
11:23<Progman:#openttd>Chruker: http://wiki.openttd.org/Rejected_features#Multithread.2FMulticore_support
11:25<@Belugas:#openttd>bad bad bad devs
11:26<Chruker:#openttd>progman, there is a huge difference between running the game engine (and all its data structures) as multicore. However the AI script engine should just be calling the game engine using thread safe functions (since it is essentially like a user).
11:26<@Belugas:#openttd>what a marvelous idea
11:27<@petern:#openttd>i'm pretty sure it was tried and removed
11:28<@petern:#openttd>there is no threadsafe way to 'look at the map'
11:33<@Belugas:#openttd>and that has always been the primary reason for no multi-core coding
11:33<@petern:#openttd>there's always the hilarious suggestion of making a copy of the map...
11:33<@petern:#openttd>hehe
11:34<@Belugas:#openttd>:)
11:34<@Belugas:#openttd>funny no one came up with a XML'ed map...
11:34<@Belugas:#openttd>o... yeah...they did...
11:34<@Belugas:#openttd>but for saving, not for using
11:35<Rexxars:#openttd>4096x4096 map... <Tile x="3403" y="590"></Tile>
11:35<@petern:#openttd>did they?
11:35<@petern:#openttd>only the suggestion, no?
11:35<Rexxars:#openttd>that would be a massive XML file :p
11:38<@Belugas:#openttd>yup, only suggestion
11:38<@Belugas:#openttd>luckily
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11:44<@petern:#openttd># jeux sans frontières
11:45*Belugas:#openttd whistles frantically
11:46-!-TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd
11:46*totalwormage:#openttd bites away the last bit of what used to be his nails
11:46<@Belugas:#openttd>how long was it? Hope it was Nine Inch
11:46<totalwormage:#openttd>hehe
11:47<totalwormage:#openttd>would've been fun hm ;]
11:47-!-Wolle [DrJekyll@p57B0BF2C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
11:49<Xaroth:#openttd>hah @ that multicore support topic
11:49<Xaroth:#openttd>poster posted only once.. that...
11:49<Xaroth:#openttd>never to be seen from again :P
11:50<@petern:#openttd>those with grand ideas...
11:52<Xaroth:#openttd>the bigger the idea
11:52<Xaroth:#openttd>the harder the disappointment :P
11:52<Xaroth:#openttd>though i do see his idea, somewhat
11:52<Xaroth:#openttd>he just doesn't know it won't work :P
11:56<@petern:#openttd>ah well, mr ottd+500 spammer hasn't complained yet either
11:56<Xaroth:#openttd>..yet
11:56<Xaroth:#openttd>anyways, time to go home
11:57<@petern:#openttd>"I'll be back next weekend!" ah :D
11:58<@petern:#openttd># oh biko
11:59<@Belugas:#openttd># Illamajo, Illamajo
12:00<@Belugas:#openttd>#the man is dead, the man is dead
12:00<@petern:#openttd># ah ah aaaaaaaaaaaaaah
12:00<@petern:#openttd># ooooooooh
12:00<@Belugas:#openttd>:D
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12:03<@Belugas:#openttd>i really wonder how far SirXavius will be able to go, this time...
12:03<@Belugas:#openttd>lat time he gained what? a few ground tiles, one industry or so?
12:03<planetmaker:#openttd>:)
12:03<planetmaker:#openttd>what? did he really produce something?
12:03<planetmaker:#openttd>or was he given by others?
12:04<@petern:#openttd>he's able to produced a fuck-load of topics
12:04<@petern:#openttd>-d
12:04<planetmaker:#openttd>ok. rephrase:
12:04<planetmaker:#openttd>did he really produce something valuable?
12:05<Chris_Booth:#openttd>evening all
12:05-!-Chris_Booth is now known as Booth
12:05<@Belugas:#openttd>it was given to him by others, planetmaker. of course of course
12:06<planetmaker:#openttd>he :)
12:06<@Belugas:#openttd>one thing he can produce is indeed vaporware
12:06<@Belugas:#openttd>of course of course
12:06<planetmaker:#openttd>of course
12:06<@Belugas:#openttd>hey Booth
12:06<Booth:#openttd>hello
12:06<planetmaker:#openttd>maybe that's why he's so "elevated" over the real problems for his tasks at had...
12:07<Booth:#openttd>i promise i wont annoy you all today
12:07<planetmaker:#openttd>*hand
12:07<@Belugas:#openttd>on the other hand, the least that can be said is that he cares for his ideas. just too bad he only has ideas
12:07<planetmaker:#openttd>:)
12:07<@Belugas:#openttd>Booth? you annoyed someone? don't remember seen you around. sorry, didnot want to be arsh
12:08<planetmaker:#openttd>we shall see what will come of it. But I haven't really seen substantial replies.
12:08<Booth:#openttd>black python
12:08<Booth:#openttd>the spin off from black adder
12:08<@Belugas:#openttd>[12:09] <planetmaker> maybe that's why he's so "elevated" over the real problems for his tasks at had... <--- yeah... welll... the look at his avatar gives a good idea on the man behind
12:08<planetmaker:#openttd>Belugas, he's usually hanging around in our channels :P
12:08<planetmaker:#openttd>hehe, yes Belugas :)
12:09<Booth:#openttd>i also asked you to hack 127.0.01
12:09<@Belugas:#openttd>hanging around is fine, i don't care :) as long as no connect-disconnect franzy occurs...
12:09<@Belugas:#openttd>Booth ?
12:09<Booth:#openttd>me
12:10<@Belugas:#openttd>hack 127.0.0.0?
12:10<@Belugas:#openttd>1
12:10<@Belugas:#openttd>not 0
12:10<@Belugas:#openttd>whatever
12:10<Booth:#openttd>i know its an IP loop
12:10<Booth:#openttd>i gave you permision to ahck my PC aswell
12:10<planetmaker:#openttd>this is weired...
12:10<Booth:#openttd>and we talked about black adder
12:10*planetmaker:#openttd will relax, watch and enjoy the firework
12:10<Booth:#openttd>or subtractor
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12:13*Belugas:#openttd did not remember any of these
12:13*Belugas:#openttd does not remember any of these
12:13<Booth:#openttd>i am sure it was you
12:13<@Belugas:#openttd>don't even know what is black adder
12:14<Sacro:#openttd>black udder?
12:14<Booth:#openttd>black adder is a british comedy program
12:14<Booth:#openttd>i also wanted under sea tunnels
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12:15<frosch123:#openttd>Booth: there is no need to hack your computer, belugas is already at the source of your money
12:15<planetmaker:#openttd>lol :)
12:15<Booth:#openttd>lol
12:15<Booth:#openttd>thats good i have no money
12:15<frosch123:#openttd>exactly
12:15<Booth:#openttd>i actualy have £3000 in loans
12:15-!-Vikthor [~Vikthor@161-18-80-78.strcechy.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has joined #openttd
12:15<Booth:#openttd>and £1500 overdraft
12:16<planetmaker:#openttd>frosch123, you mean access to something like that: http://www.cs.ucsb.edu/~seclab/projects/torpig/torpig.pdf
12:17<@Belugas:#openttd>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=26092 <-- there... sir xavius earlier project
12:18<frosch123:#openttd>they do not have any rule of their mail adresses, do they?
12:18<planetmaker:#openttd>he. ty, Belugas :) read about the same. Just a lot shorter
12:19<planetmaker:#openttd>at least by quickly skimming through it
12:19<frosch123:#openttd>ah, that is the thing he meant when he told he started thinking about it years ago
12:19<planetmaker:#openttd>frosch123, who's "they"?
12:20<frosch123:#openttd>Belugas: have you read TrueBrain's post in that topic oO
12:20<frosch123:#openttd>planetmaker: [bstone,marco,sullivan,rgilbert,msz,kemm,chris,vigna]@cs.ucsb.edu
12:21<planetmaker:#openttd>oh :)
12:21<Booth:#openttd>i hate wirelss mice
12:21<Booth:#openttd>that go flat at the wrong time
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12:22<@Belugas:#openttd>nope, not yet, frosch123
12:22<Xaroth:#openttd>Belugas: and most of em said 'yes' :P
12:22<Xaroth:#openttd>next time rig the votes to say no :-)
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12:22<frosch123:#openttd>"It sounds like a very cool and fun idea :) Work it out and make something of it :) If you need in-depth help, you can always ask me (although I will not help you with programming or what so ever). Also if you need SVN, webpage or access to the compile-farm, just let me know :)"
12:23<frosch123:#openttd>esp. the "work it out" part :p
12:23<planetmaker:#openttd>that's what TB wrote? Nice!
12:23<frosch123:#openttd>Sun Jul 09, 2006 2:05 pm
12:23<planetmaker:#openttd>:O
12:23<Xaroth:#openttd>lol
12:23<Xaroth:#openttd>back in the days he was supportive :P
12:23<Xaroth:#openttd>now look at him
12:23<Xaroth:#openttd>"Idea!?!?" ... "NO!"
12:23<frosch123:#openttd>so we can easily blame TB for all that
12:24<Xaroth:#openttd>oo, EvE online turned 6 today
12:24<planetmaker:#openttd>nice to have found scape goat.
12:25<planetmaker:#openttd>And such a nice one :)
12:28<@Belugas:#openttd>hehe... that is soo TrueBrain :)
12:28<@Belugas:#openttd>but take note, he never said "I'll do it", and that is exactly what SirXavius would love to see happen
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12:30<planetmaker:#openttd>sure :)
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12:56<Milloflex:#openttd>why is there two diffrent sets of signals?
12:57<Xaroth:#openttd>ones are semaphores, others are signals
12:57<Xaroth:#openttd>the difference, is the existance, or lack, of electricity
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13:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the answer is:
13:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>a) they look cute
13:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>b) there are many more, but only two can be active at the same time
13:13<frosch123:#openttd>c) you can set the "automatically build semaphores before"-setting to 1492 and never question yourself what signal you just built
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13:29<Ammler:#openttd>what happens 1492?
13:30<Chruker:#openttd>the indians lose america
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13:34<Ammler:#openttd>oh, indeed, expected something ttdish
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13:36<Wolf01:#openttd>hello
13:37<el_en:#openttd>buonasera
13:38<Sacro:#openttd>buenos nachos
13:40<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Ammler: "random number below any sane start date"
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13:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>hm... i really can't play this game without cargodest anymore...
13:41<Ammler:#openttd>hehe, even random numbers have sense, if frosch uses them.
13:41<Ammler:#openttd>another strike?
13:43<Ammler:#openttd>did you try cargod_i_st
13:43<Ammler:#openttd>?
13:43<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not yet
13:43<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>anyway: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/1492
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14:05<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hi:)
14:07<Milloflex:#openttd>in the train details there should be the total lenght of train aswell as total capacity sum of each cargo
14:07<Milloflex:#openttd>ah, foudn total cargo
14:08<Milloflex:#openttd>is there a way to default to 'totalt cargo' when opening up the train details?
14:18<@petern:#openttd>no
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14:29*Belugas:#openttd envisions a patch that would save all visual window properties with horror
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14:49*frosch123:#openttd envisions a gui that can save its state itself
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15:01<Milloflex:#openttd>you only need to save the latest train detail windows, or the latest plane detali window... and restore the last used tab
15:01*Eddi|zuHause:#openttd would like a way to configure the "speed buttons" on the order window
15:02<frosch123:#openttd>yeah, I guess the hardest part is to decide whether the gui shall be described using xml or using squirrel
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15:04<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>lmao :p
15:05<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>a propos... did anything ever come out of the squrirrel-grf thingie?
15:05<@Belugas:#openttd>welll... obviously not in trunk
15:06<@Belugas:#openttd>[14:51] * frosch123 envisions a gui that can save its state itself <- you stole my vision!
15:09<frosch123:#openttd>and I did not even credit you :p
15:10<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>last time i checked, visions did not fall under copyright...
15:11<@Belugas:#openttd>nor under implementations :)
15:11<@Belugas:#openttd>unfortunately...
15:11<frosch123:#openttd>last time someone claimed right about an idea got flamed on the forums and then decided to pretend it would have been fun :)
15:11<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>someone knows why time flies so fast?
15:12<@Belugas:#openttd>because of fun?
15:12<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:)
15:12<@Belugas:#openttd>because there is wind?
15:15<Milloflex:#openttd>i think its because we are trying to grasp to much at once
15:16<@Belugas:#openttd>in my case, it's because i'm crumbling under work :S
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15:30<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>hm... anyone got a spare RMB? mine is really failing right now...
15:31<@Belugas:#openttd>ReadMyBook?
15:31<@Belugas:#openttd>RightMostBall?
15:31<@petern:#openttd>gah
15:31<@petern:#openttd>laptop not fast enough :d
15:31<Booth:#openttd>RMB?
15:31<@petern:#openttd>right mouse button
15:32<Booth:#openttd>i have some elbow greese so you fix the old one
15:33<Booth:#openttd>that killed the convo
15:34<davis-:#openttd>:D
15:38<Booth:#openttd>hello davis
15:40<davis-:#openttd>hi
15:41<el_en:#openttd>when will the first international openttd meeting be held?
15:42<frosch123:#openttd>when? no idea, but if you ask 'where?', then here
15:42<@SmatZ:#openttd>there have been several meetings, just nobody cared to invite you, el_en
15:43<el_en:#openttd>frosch123: do you mean germany, or some more specific 'here'?
15:43<@petern:#openttd>there was the r10000 meet of may 2007
15:44<el_en:#openttd>i remember, but was it international?
15:44<@petern:#openttd>dunno
15:44<dihedral:#openttd>with the fake cake :-P
15:44<frosch123:#openttd>hmm, that is also an idea, I am right in the middle between smatz and the dutchies, and near enough to an airport for belugas
15:44<@petern:#openttd>and there were the irc developer meetings
15:44<@SmatZ:#openttd>:-D
15:44<@petern:#openttd>they were international...
15:45<Booth:#openttd>can i get the euro start to where you are?
15:45<Booth:#openttd>or will i have to use the plane?
15:47<el_en:#openttd>what about Copenhagen?
15:48<@Belugas:#openttd>this channel is already international...
15:48<@Belugas:#openttd>wat about Montreal?
15:49<frosch123:#openttd>or at pikka's house
15:49<@Belugas:#openttd>Depends which pikka you're talking about...
15:49<el_en:#openttd>Montréal might be too expensive for poor little europeans. otherwise not a bad idea.
15:49<Booth:#openttd>what about a location incovenient for all of us
15:49<Booth:#openttd>but very nice
15:49<Booth:#openttd>such a dubai
15:49<@Belugas:#openttd>tahiti!
15:50<el_en:#openttd>north korea
15:50<Booth:#openttd>tahiti it is then
15:50<@petern:#openttd>south pole
15:50<frosch123:#openttd>I think at pikkabird is already fine
15:50<@Belugas:#openttd>great! I'll bring hy wetsuit :D ICE DIVING!!!
15:50<PierreW:#openttd>hi, i got 2 train grf's included, but most of the trains do not show up - are there also other grf-types, that could break up train-grf's?
15:50<Booth:#openttd>dont go to france they might think we are invading
15:51<Booth:#openttd>no
15:51<Booth:#openttd>have you activated the mutli train grf option?
15:53<Booth:#openttd>ooh alpine skiing in the south pole
15:53<PierreW:#openttd>crap, that one i forgot
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15:53<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i have an idea, everybody gets some football-enthusiastic friends to sponsor a ticket to south africa for the world cup there
15:53<@Belugas:#openttd>PierreW, it might becasue you've not reached the introduction date
15:54<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then we can ignore the football, and have a TTD-meeting instead
15:54<el_en:#openttd>speaking of the Copenhagen....
15:54<PierreW:#openttd>Belugas, i did
15:54<Booth:#openttd>has that fixed it?
15:54<PierreW:#openttd>can other (non-train) sets also overwrite train-sets? like tram/bus etc?
15:55<@petern:#openttd>no
15:55<PierreW:#openttd>hm, weird
15:55<Booth:#openttd>only trains
15:55<Booth:#openttd>if they are using the same ID's
15:55<Booth:#openttd>then they dont work
15:56<@petern:#openttd>el_en, you evil man, you summoned him
15:56<@petern:#openttd>or should that be 'ellen' hehe
15:56<PierreW:#openttd>k thx for your replies
15:56<Booth:#openttd>you summoned whom?
15:56<@Bjarni:#openttd>hello nice people
15:56<Booth:#openttd>black python
15:57<Booth:#openttd>monty adder
15:57<@Bjarni:#openttd>money adder
15:57<Booth:#openttd>lol
15:57<Booth:#openttd>you hacked my pc yet?
15:58<@Bjarni:#openttd>not yet
15:58<@Bjarni:#openttd>I was busy with an exam
15:58<@Bjarni:#openttd>:/
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16:00<el_en:#openttd>petern: it should not.
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16:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>[18:23] <Xaroth> "Idea!?!?" ... "NO!" <- That AINT NICE! :'(
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16:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>Xaroth: if anything, I always help out people with subprojects .. for example IS2 .. I hate the idea, I still compile it in the CF! So that is not a nice comment of yours .. pfffffff :p
16:25-!-Klanticus [~quassel@143.107.231.49] has joined #openttd
16:26<@SmatZ:#openttd>but there are many people who like it :)
16:26<@SmatZ:#openttd>and users are very important...
16:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>so? Should I change my opinion because of others? :p
16:27<@SmatZ:#openttd>you are doing the right thing now
16:27<TrueBrain:#openttd>cool :) What is it? :p
16:27<@Belugas:#openttd>let's vote on features!
16:27<Booth:#openttd>true brain dont you like IS2?
16:28<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>he just said that, why ask again?
16:28*Belugas:#openttd is personnaly so freaking against it...
16:28<Booth:#openttd>tunnel to built at a level less that 0M (under sea tunnels)
16:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>I hate (and really hate) newgrf ... so what? :) I hope I can have my opinion ... although in this world I am not sure about that :)
16:29<Xaroth:#openttd>[TrueBrain]: Xaroth: if anything, I always help out people with subprojects .. for example IS2 .. I hate the idea, I still compile it in the CF! So that is not a nice comment of yours .. pfffffff :p << har har har
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>but I am very sure that line above will be abused in some conversation saying all devs don't like newgrf ... that always happens :p
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>Xaroth: I am going to kill your servers at Evo!
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>as soon as I found them .....
16:29<Xaroth:#openttd>hehe
16:29<Xaroth:#openttd>one of our servers is called... evo...
16:29<@petern:#openttd>i hate noai :p
16:29<Xaroth:#openttd>.. and it died the one day i had the day off :P
16:29<TrueBrain:#openttd>Xaroth: har har!
16:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: good for you ;)
16:30<Xaroth:#openttd>yeh, not har har to me, i was queueing for rollercoasters :P
16:30<Xaroth:#openttd>boss called me 'uh, we have an issue'
16:30<Xaroth:#openttd>i replied 'yeh, same here, this queue is taking fooking forever'
16:30<@Bjarni:#openttd><Belugas> let's vote on features! <-- great idea
16:30<Xaroth:#openttd>.. he didn't like that reply :/
16:30<TrueBrain:#openttd>correct reply :)
16:30*Bjarni:#openttd votes
16:30*SmatZ:#openttd votes for features
16:31<Booth:#openttd>i like no GRF game
16:31<Booth:#openttd>but i love IS2
16:31<@Bjarni:#openttd>SmatZ: I don't think we are supposed to tell what we vote. You know it's kind of like electing a government. You vote for somebody and then you will not tell anybody what you voted
16:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>I am also pro features!
16:31<TrueBrain:#openttd>very pro ...
16:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>Booth: good for you, I hope you enjoy IS2 :)
16:32<Booth:#openttd>i do and i thank you for it
16:32<Booth:#openttd>its a great addition
16:32<@SmatZ:#openttd>Bjarni: actually... it doesn't work this way here :) most people say who they voted for... at least among friends :)
16:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>I believe that I made parts of IS2 ... not sure if they ever used my patch :p
16:32<@SmatZ:#openttd>fooo Lisboa Treaty was accepted by senate :-x
16:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>(just to highlight the fun in it .. that I dislike a feature I worked on myself ... :p)
16:33<TrueBrain:#openttd>I am even not 100% sure I like NoAI .. but that is an other story :)
16:33<Booth:#openttd>what is no ai?
16:33<@Bjarni:#openttd><SmatZ> fooo Lisboa Treaty was accepted by senate :-x <-- are you surprised?
16:34<TrueBrain:#openttd>you should stop putting spaces between words ... 'true brain' .. 'no ai' ...
16:34<@Bjarni:#openttd>EU told all member countries to accept it and since some countries had elections which rejected the treaty the new EU order was not to have an election
16:34<@SmatZ:#openttd>Bjarni: it wasn't 100% sure, maybe 75%...
16:34<frosch123:#openttd>[22:34] <Bjarni> <SmatZ> fooo Lisboa Treaty was accepted by senate :-x <-- are you surprised? <- I am
16:34<Ammler:#openttd>around 40 downloads for IS2, is that much?
16:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>that is nothing :s
16:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>(sorry, not meant in a bad way)
16:35<@Bjarni:#openttd>EU is screwing up atm
16:35<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: can I suggest to get a dev behind IS2, so it can be put on openttd.org? Mostly gives a slightly bigger crowd
16:35<@Bjarni:#openttd>and is controlling all countries in a way that will eventually make countries leave the union
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>(oh wait .... I already suggested that ... damn, I always repeat myself :) Sorry about that ;))
16:36<Ammler:#openttd>or course it would
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>mostly = most likely
16:36<TrueBrain:#openttd>why do my brains work faster than my fingers?!
16:36<Xaroth:#openttd>because you have a true... brain?
16:36<@Bjarni:#openttd>TrueBrain: because you are on speed?
16:37<@petern:#openttd>i've been playing IS2
16:37<Xaroth:#openttd>wait, scratch that, i agree with Bjarni :P
16:37<@petern:#openttd>it has issues
16:37<@Bjarni:#openttd>maybe I shouldn't joke about that
16:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>Xaroth: are you ... sure?
16:37<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: doesn't all 'great new features' have? :)
16:37<Ammler:#openttd>petern: in "gameplay" or codewise?
16:38<@Bjarni:#openttd>last time I joked about it the target for the joke started telling about his experience with speed and other drugs and he assummed that everybody did drugs regularly :s
16:38<@petern:#openttd>gameplay mostly
16:38<@petern:#openttd>some simple technical things
16:38<@petern:#openttd>some impossible social things
16:38<Booth:#openttd>what are the issues?
16:38<TrueBrain:#openttd>haha, the social aspect .. always a bitch :)
16:38<Booth:#openttd>we havent found them in our testing yet
16:38<Ammler:#openttd>hmm, devs aren't around.
16:39<Ammler:#openttd>(of IS2)
16:39<@petern:#openttd>sharing costs aren't affected by inflation
16:39<Booth:#openttd>we found that
16:39<Booth:#openttd>but you just raise them yuor self
16:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>[22:38] <Booth> we havent found them in our testing yet
16:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>[22:39] <Booth> we found that
16:39<@petern:#openttd>TrueBrain, good isn't it
16:39<TrueBrain:#openttd>that should be a bash quote :)
16:39<Ammler:#openttd>Booth: and you did report it?
16:40<Booth:#openttd>planetmaker did
16:40<@petern:#openttd>Booth, you can but there's a limit
16:40<Ammler:#openttd>or was Swallow around?
16:40<@petern:#openttd>when inflation is really high you still basically give your stuff away, heh
16:40<Booth:#openttd>i just said planetmaker reported it
16:40<Booth:#openttd>well inflation works at 1.03
16:40<Ammler:#openttd>IRC has sometimes lags, sorry ;-)
16:41<Booth:#openttd>unless you play for millions of year you will never reach a limit as far as i can see
16:41<Yexo:#openttd>inflation is capped at 180 years iirc
16:41<TrueBrain:#openttd>oeh, a Yexo!!! :) Hello Yexo :)
16:41<Yexo:#openttd>hello TrueBrain :)
16:41<@petern:#openttd>even so, everything else tracks inflation...
16:41<TrueBrain:#openttd>how are you doing? :)
16:42<Yexo:#openttd>I'm fine now :)
16:42<Yexo:#openttd>have some time for openttd again :)
16:42<@petern:#openttd>possibly finer controls are desired on who can do what, and how much is costs them
16:42<TrueBrain:#openttd>always a good thing ;)
16:44<Booth:#openttd>when is cargo dest going into trunk (if ever),(if it has a date)
16:44<Yexo:#openttd>when it's done
16:44<TrueBrain:#openttd>when it is done :)
16:44<Booth:#openttd>?
16:44<TrueBrain:#openttd>oeh, I love saying that :) Can't get enough of that :)
16:44<@petern:#openttd>i'd say
16:44<@petern:#openttd>IF it is done
16:44<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><Bjarni> SmatZ: I don't think we are supposed to tell what we vote. You know it's kind of like electing a government. You vote for somebody and then you will not tell anybody what you voted <- wait... i learned that you tell everyone what you voted and if it is the wrong vote, you will get all kinds of visits that will convince you to change your vote...
16:44<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>is that not how it works?
16:46<@Bjarni:#openttd>that is how it works if you are stupid enough to tell who you voted for
16:46<PierreW:#openttd>is 0.9 the newest version of DBset?
16:47<frosch123:#openttd>I have a newgrf labeled dbsetxl 0.9 :)
16:47<PierreW:#openttd>only have 0.82 and don't knwo where to fetch a newer one
16:47<@Bjarni:#openttd>if somebody calls you and tell they are making a survey and ask you who you voted for then I have been informed that they have "interesting" questions after being told which party you voted for last time
16:47<Yexo:#openttd>frosch123: that one isn't a publicly available version, right?
16:48<frosch123:#openttd>PierreW: search for dbsetxl ecs extension, then you have the newest stuff of it
16:48<@Bjarni:#openttd>like they assume no education if you vote for certain parties
16:49<@petern:#openttd>tell?
16:49<frosch123:#openttd>Yexo: it is some test newgrf with a single engine I got somewhere, where the author was to lazy to replace the title, and iirc it was publicity available
16:49<@petern:#openttd>here they know who you voted for anyway...
16:49<@Bjarni:#openttd>they know?
16:49<@Bjarni:#openttd>how?
16:49<@Belugas:#openttd># He knows you know
16:49-!-lewymati [~lewymati@aeje1.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit []
16:49<Ammler:#openttd>grfcodec -d dbset.grf && cat sprites/dbset.nfo | sed s/0.82/0.9/ > sprites/dbset0.9.nfo && grfdocec -e dbset.grf or something like that.
16:49<@petern:#openttd>it all has tracking numbers on
16:50<Yexo:#openttd>cat sprites/dbset.nfo | sed <- that's so useless, sed can input from files itself
16:50<@Bjarni:#openttd>isn't that violating the principle about anonymity at elections?
16:50<TrueBrain:#openttd>Yexo: convention :) To keep the pipe clear :)
16:50<frosch123:#openttd>Ammler: maybe "sed -i 's/0.82/0.9 /' dbsetxlw.grf" also works :p
16:50<Ammler:#openttd>:-D I said something like that
16:51<@Bjarni:#openttd>http://www.worldnetdaily.com/images2/iraqballot.gif <-- if everybody knows who you voted for then you will end up like this
16:51<@petern:#openttd>no doubt the excuse is it's used to prevent voting fraud...
16:51<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd><Bjarni> that is how it works if you are stupid enough to tell who you voted for <- well, in "real democracies", i.e. in ones that have "democratic" in their name, the voting cabin is just there "pro forma", and when you make a single step towards it, your name gets written down, as it is likely that you voted with "no" then :p
16:51<Yexo:#openttd>TrueBrain: I still don't like those useless uses of cat
16:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>Yexo: I always use it :) As I tend to postfix or prefix a grep or something in it later on
16:52<Yexo:#openttd>I can see some uses for it, but not in this case
16:52<@Bjarni:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: single step?
16:52<Vikthor:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: That's also true for "democracies" have word socialistic in the name :)
16:52<TrueBrain:#openttd>as I said: convention .. that is what it is for me
16:54<TrueBrain:#openttd>habbit .. would fit too :p
16:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Yexo: the problem is, when you do not use "cat", the filename is at the end of the command, so when you want to change the replacement/search/whatever command, you have a lot of cursor movement
16:55<Yexo:#openttd>it works, and that's what counts most of the time for those simple bash scrits
16:55<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>like "grep <pattern> <filename>" vs. "cat <filename> | grep <pattern>"
16:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you reverse the order, and can access the pattern more easily on the command line
16:56<Yexo:#openttd>true, then I use it sometimes myself too
16:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>often those command lines grow incrementally
16:56<TrueBrain:#openttd>pipes .. you got to love them :)
16:56<Xaroth:#openttd>grep <pattern> <filename> | less
16:57<TrueBrain:#openttd>cat <filename> | grep <pattern> | less
16:57<Xaroth:#openttd>or that
16:57<TrueBrain:#openttd>I always fuck up the pattern .. rarely the filename :p
16:57<Xaroth:#openttd>and never the less :)
16:58<Yexo:#openttd>so put the less before grep too :p
16:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>wish that worked .... :(
16:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>worked = works
16:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>wish = wishes
16:58<TrueBrain:#openttd>oh, I give up
16:58<@SmatZ:#openttd>:(
16:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you should pipe your thoughts through sed ;)
16:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>mind controlled computers ...
16:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>not far away
16:59<Xaroth:#openttd>mind controlling computers, just as far away :P
16:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hi
16:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:)
16:59<Xaroth:#openttd>hi
16:59<Xaroth:#openttd>o_O
17:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>tried 2048x2048 map
17:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>looking forward for lev-5 maglev breaking mach-1 with a sonic boom and lev-6 @ mach-2 and lev-7 @ mach-3
17:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>you already said that once ...
17:01<Booth:#openttd>lev-7?
17:01<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>yep :)
17:01<Booth:#openttd>you own trains?
17:01<Xaroth:#openttd>to be exact, you said the exact same 15 hours ago O_O
17:01<@Belugas:#openttd>he owns a train? man.. what a rich guy...
17:01<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>didn't know everybody logs
17:01<TrueBrain:#openttd>Belugas: I own trains too ... very small ones
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>hey... got a few millions to spare? we'd like to buy back the rights of TTD
17:02<Booth:#openttd>i own HO scale trains
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>booh...
17:02<Xaroth:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: you're in a channel full of geeks (and geekettes) ... ofcourse we log
17:02<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>;>
17:02<@Belugas:#openttd>my son owns THOMAS trains!
17:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>well .. all he knows for sure I log :p
17:02<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Belugas, sure, just bought 71 aeroplanes
17:02<TrueBrain:#openttd>Belugas: mwhahahahaha :p
17:03<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but i like maglev trains more
17:03<Booth:#openttd>how much are the copy rights to ttd?
17:03<@Belugas:#openttd>csokisnyuszi, just in gold. only need one plane...
17:03<Xaroth:#openttd>Booth: how much?
17:03<Xaroth:#openttd>1.
17:03<Booth:#openttd>1?
17:03<@Belugas:#openttd>Booth, no one even know who have the rights
17:03<Booth:#openttd>chris saywer?
17:03<Xaroth:#openttd>there's no value to 'copyright' ... it doesn't have a set value.
17:03<@Belugas:#openttd>done snot look like it
17:04<Booth:#openttd>does the copy right even stand anymore?
17:04<Booth:#openttd>hasnt it run out?
17:04<@Belugas:#openttd>technically yes, they are still valid
17:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>stop putting spaces between words where they don't belong!
17:04<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>noone is admitting to own the rights because it would cause a legal debate on who REALLY owns the rights
17:04<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and neither side sees it worth the effort
17:04<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>so the situation is unlikely to change
17:05<@petern:#openttd>run out? no, ttd is not yet 50/70 years old...
17:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: not really ... there is only a debate who owns the distribution rights
17:05<@Belugas:#openttd>gottagobye
17:05<@petern:#openttd>or is it life + 50 years... never mind
17:05<Xaroth:#openttd>er
17:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>Belugas: bye :)
17:05<Xaroth:#openttd>US copyright used to be 14/28 years
17:05<Yexo:#openttd>bye Belugas
17:05<TrueBrain:#openttd>Xaroth: wasn't CS from uk?
17:06<Yexo:#openttd>petern: it's that I think
17:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>european copyrights are usually life of the author + 70 years
17:06<dihedral:#openttd>Yexo, i like your post ^^
17:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>copyright law changed, didn't it?
17:06<Xaroth:#openttd>it changed several times
17:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>in US I believe ..read something about that this week ...
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17:06<Xaroth:#openttd>http://uspolitics.about.com/od/electionissues/a/copyright.htm
17:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the european commission changed the performer's rights recently
17:06<TrueBrain:#openttd>either way, CS has most of the rights, that is for sure
17:06<Yexo:#openttd>dihedral: the one to Alain? all you said was true, but I feared he'd take only the negative points again
17:07<Xaroth:#openttd>A work that is created on or after January 1, 1978, is automatically protected from the moment of its creation for the period of the author's life plus an additional 70 years after the author's death.
17:07<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>everybody here only plays OpenTTD ?
17:07<TrueBrain:#openttd>yes, only, we play no other games
17:07<TrueBrain:#openttd>we signed an agreement for that
17:07<Xaroth:#openttd>Works for hire or those published anonymously are protected for 95 years from date of publication or 120 years from date of creation, whichever is the shorter period.
17:07<Xaroth:#openttd>according to that page.
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17:07<dihedral:#openttd>Yexo, yeah ^^
17:08<TrueBrain:#openttd>so games ar enot running out any time soon :p
17:08<dihedral:#openttd>though i must say, i enjoyed "i cannot say you did not come very far - that'd be wrong - you started from 0 and got to 1 (on a scale from 1 to 10)"
17:08<Xaroth:#openttd>so technically, by that, it'd mean that copyright runs out in 2048 at it's earliest
17:08<Xaroth:#openttd>and that's only if CS made it in 78, and died shortly after....
17:08<TrueBrain:#openttd>neither are true :)
17:08<Xaroth:#openttd>exactly
17:08<Xaroth:#openttd>expect.. somewhere around 2079 at earliest :P
17:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>but we are only interested in the distribution rights
17:09<TrueBrain:#openttd>then we can supply the ttd-graphic files with it
17:10<Wolf01:#openttd>'night all
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17:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i thought there is an open graphiic set already available
17:10<TrueBrain:#openttd>not finished
17:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>oh i see
17:11<Booth:#openttd>why not just replace all game graphics with sets (such as DB set)
17:11<TrueBrain:#openttd>go ahead :)
17:11<Booth:#openttd>or the added TTO graphics
17:11<Xaroth:#openttd>TTO graphics have the same copyright issues as the TTD graphics
17:11<Xaroth:#openttd>so don't bother with those
17:12<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>what do you think about including truecolor photographs with alpha channel in the game for graphics?
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17:12<Booth:#openttd>how does ttdpatch work with the graphics?
17:12<Xaroth:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: good luck :)
17:12<TrueBrain:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: photographs?!
17:12<Xaroth:#openttd>Booth: what graphics?
17:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>either way, 32bpp is already supported, including alpha channel ...
17:13<Booth:#openttd>just use the original game graphics?
17:13<Xaroth:#openttd>TTDPatch is just a program to 'alter' the original game
17:13-!-Progman [~progman@p57A1F202.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:13<Booth:#openttd>isnt that all openttd is?
17:13<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>TrueBrain, yep, į thought real photos instead of drawings
17:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>good luck!
17:13<Ammler:#openttd>it does patch the original binary.
17:13<Xaroth:#openttd>no, ottd doesn't 'alter' the original game
17:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>would be butt-ugly
17:13<TrueBrain:#openttd>but good luck! :)
17:13<Xaroth:#openttd>it re-creates/re-does it
17:14<Booth:#openttd>aah i see
17:14<Booth:#openttd>sorry if i just upset people for not knowing
17:14<Xaroth:#openttd>it's better to not know and be open about it, and not know and pretend to know
17:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>we have enough of the latter ....
17:15<Ammler:#openttd>the current 32bpp graphics are very nice.
17:15<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>TrueBrain, sure game hacking is advanced ;>
17:15<TrueBrain:#openttd>huh?
17:15<Xaroth:#openttd>advanced is a relative term
17:15<Booth:#openttd>what even happened to the 3D stuff smatz was working on?
17:15<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>is it advanced to park a taxi on the wall?
17:16<Xaroth:#openttd>depends on the wall
17:16<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>vertical
17:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>depends on the size of the taxi
17:16<Xaroth:#openttd>and the environment
17:16<TrueBrain:#openttd>I have no problems putting a 3cm taxi on the wall
17:16<Booth:#openttd>bluetac
17:17<Booth:#openttd>i could put any taxi on any wall aslong as it was made from iron or steel
17:17<Booth:#openttd>with my mega electro magnet
17:17<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://matrix.ratesz.hu/mean/gta3/index.html
17:17<Xaroth:#openttd>.. gta3
17:18<Booth:#openttd>that is stupid
17:20<Booth:#openttd>GTA is a great game with out patches
17:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>stop with those spaces! Grr ...
17:20<Xaroth:#openttd>TrueBrain: har har
17:20<Booth:#openttd>what spaces?
17:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>'with out'
17:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>'true brain'
17:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>'copy right'
17:20<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>without spaces
17:20<TrueBrain:#openttd>and there was an other one ...
17:20<Booth:#openttd>cail down
17:20<@petern:#openttd>yeah
17:20<@petern:#openttd>"an other" :p
17:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>petern: yeah :) But at least I am consistent :p
17:21<Booth:#openttd>i am consistent
17:21<Booth:#openttd>i cant spell
17:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>consistantly wrong :p
17:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>har har
17:21<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>another world is just cool
17:21<TrueBrain:#openttd>(I am a pirate!)
17:21<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>pirate bay
17:22<Chruker:#openttd>will the AIRail.BuildNewGRFRailStation function always work, regardless of whatever graphics and settings the user have?
17:22<TrueBrain:#openttd>do they say Har Har?
17:22<Xaroth:#openttd>TrueBrain: pirate as in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLsJyfN0ICU ?
17:22<Booth:#openttd>knock knock
17:23<jonty-comp:#openttd>< TrueBrain> consistantly wrong :p <-- *consistently
17:23<Booth:#openttd>(omg not lazy town)
17:23<Xaroth:#openttd>nothing wrong with lazytown.. the girl's legal ffs :P
17:23<Booth:#openttd>knock knock
17:23<jonty-comp:#openttd>LAZY TOWN
17:23<jonty-comp:#openttd>bing bang diggiriggidong
17:23<Booth:#openttd>knowone want to hear my joke
17:23<Booth:#openttd>:'(
17:25<TrueBrain:#openttd>now I am out of candy ....
17:25<Booth:#openttd>oh well poor you
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17:26<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>not neccesarily complicated combination of constant consistency
17:26<TrueBrain:#openttd>nice alliteration (is that the correct english translation? :))
17:28<Yexo:#openttd>you just replaced 'ie' with 'ion' and hoped it was english too? :p
17:28<TrueBrain:#openttd>yeah :p It sounded okay ;)
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17:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>ARgh .... I hate it when series stop when it is just getting good!!! (was watching Fringe)
17:32<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>reason why serial killers don't stop
17:32<TrueBrain:#openttd>cruwl comparising ...
17:33<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes, watch Dexter instead :p
17:39<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: yexo * r16243 /trunk/src/ai/api/ (ai_tunnel.cpp ai_tunnel.hpp): -Fix [FS#2875]: CmdBuildTunnel could be called with invalid parameters from the api code, causing crashes later
17:41<TrueBrain:#openttd>Windows 7 MCE is much better than Windows Vista MCE
17:41<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: yexo * r16244 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_tunnel.cpp: -Fix [NoAI]: Make sure AITunnel::BuildTunnel returns what the documentation says it does
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17:48<TrueBrain:#openttd>so who killed this conversation?
17:48<Xaroth:#openttd>I'd say Eddi
17:49<TrueBrain:#openttd>I tend to agree
17:56-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-51-190.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
17:56<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello all
17:57-!-nightstalker [~Alex@p5495435E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
17:57<TrueBrain:#openttd>hello Nite_Owl
17:57<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hello TrueBrain
17:57<Ammler:#openttd>hg has at least better initial usage, a 500k bzr repo is only 200k converted to hg.
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17:57<Ammler:#openttd>i hope that will change with size.
17:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>Ammler: repos sizes of such decentralized vcses is a bit tricky
17:59<Ammler:#openttd>oh, it has no work copy
17:59<TrueBrain:#openttd>;)
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18:04<TrueBrain:#openttd>well ... boring :) Night all!!
18:04<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>what do you think about making openttd an alien vs predator type grafx 3d game?
18:04<Nite_Owl:#openttd>later TrueBrain
18:04<Ammler:#openttd>but bzr without work dir is still 10% bigger
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18:09<Forked:#openttd>what happend to the +500 threads?
18:10<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>maybe they went 500 years into the future
18:10<Nite_Owl:#openttd>someone stuck a fork in them
18:12<Yexo:#openttd>someone merged them to one topic
18:12<Yexo:#openttd>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=43449
18:14<Forked:#openttd>poor mod :)
18:14<Ammler:#openttd>he should rather merge it to wiki
18:14<Ammler:#openttd>(the author, I mean)
18:17<Yexo:#openttd>he should start working on it (making sprites I mean)
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18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16245 /branches/0.7/src/ (7 files in 4 dirs):
18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Hardcoded (old sized) MAX_COMPANIES constant (r16182)
18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Do not try to reserve path for trains crashed in station [FS#2866] (r16178)
18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Forbid joining AI companies via the 'move' and 'join' console commands/multiplayer lobby (r16176, r16175)
18:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: The overflowsafe type did not like dividing by int64 larger than MAX_INT32 causing division by negative numbers and small anomolies when drawing graphs [FS#2855] (r16130)
18:23<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>preparing a 0.7.1?
18:23<Nite_Owl:#openttd>I just had the same thought
18:23<Xaroth:#openttd>0.8
18:25<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>btw a teleport gate would mess the gameplay? ;>
18:25<Nite_Owl:#openttd>0.8 which just be branched off from the current trunk not backported
18:25<Xaroth:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: stabbing a spork in your eye will mess your eyesight? :)
18:26<Nite_Owl:#openttd>spork - spork
18:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: every change messes with gameplay. what you really should ask is if you can get it balanced somehow, to make it interesting for players
18:27<Nite_Owl:#openttd>pardon my bad impression of The Muppets Swedish chief
18:27<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the what?
18:28<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>sure it would be interesting, make teleport station at one edge of the map, and at other edge, people step in, then step out at the other station
18:28-!-Zantor64 [46ed808a@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd
18:28<Zantor64:#openttd>anyone here?
18:28<Nite_Owl:#openttd>let me see if I can find a reference
18:28<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>no.
18:28<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>these are not the droids that you search
18:28<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>move along
18:28<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
18:28<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>;>>
18:29<Zantor64:#openttd>I am seeking railroad junction help
18:29<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>shoot...
18:29<Zantor64:#openttd>I am replacing a conventional roundabout with something more sophisticated as to reduce gridlock
18:29<Zantor64:#openttd>if I have my trains staggered right I don't get it but now and again it happens
18:29<Zantor64:#openttd>problem is
18:30<Zantor64:#openttd>on one of the ends of the junction I have a 6-platform terminus station
18:30<Xaroth:#openttd>Zantor64: http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/Junctionary might help a bit
18:30<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Oops - bad spelling - Chef
18:30<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>heheh
18:30<Xaroth:#openttd>has some nice junctions
18:30<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>į think į will make some screenshots
18:30<Zantor64:#openttd>ok
18:31<Zantor64:#openttd>well I have 3 platforms on one set of in/out tracks and 3 more on another set of in/out tracks and I was wondering how I could reduce it without holding up traffic
18:31-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590c394e.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:31<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i don't know, my junctions never look like the openttdcoop ones...
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16246 /branches/0.7/ (16 files in 5 dirs): (log message trimmed)
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [Squirrel] the traps variable wasn't restored, causing try/catch blocks to be 'forgotten' during a suspend (r16181)
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Add: [NoAI] Two new error codes to AITile: ERR_AREA_ALREADY_FLAT and ERR_EXCAVATION_WOULD_DAMAGE (r16171)
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Add: [NoAI] AITile::Get(Min|Max|Corner)Height (r16166)
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Add: [NoAI] Several functions to AIOrder to check the what kind of order an order is [FS#2801] (r16165)
18:32<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] AIOrder::GetOrderDestination and AIOrder::GetOrderFlags didn't work on ORDER_CURRENT when the vehicle was loading/leaving in a station (r16165)
18:32-!-tokai [~tokai@p54B80516.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:32<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>heheh
18:32<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/Image:JunctionaryBBH4.png
18:32<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>wow that's some insane junction
18:32<Xaroth:#openttd>i've seen worse
18:33<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/gzDNxYc2.bmp here is a pic of what I'm working on; I used cheats to get a sawmill out of the way
18:33<Zantor64:#openttd>but no other cheats have been used
18:33<Nite_Owl:#openttd>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOKUdMr95Ig Swedish Chef
18:33<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>bmp? wtf?
18:33<Zantor64:#openttd>what?
18:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>NEVER EVER push BMPs through the internet
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>can you not read it?
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>jeez
18:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hehehe
18:34<Xaroth:#openttd>the intertubes will be clogged!
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>I never knew that
18:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>use PNG
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>plus it's nto all that big
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>I'll do a png then
18:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>openttd produces them by itself
18:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>į pulled it down using gigabit
18:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>in the game settings, you can chose the screenshot format
18:34<Zantor64:#openttd>done
18:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then press ctrl+s
18:35<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm not totally unfamiliar with the game. I've been playing it off and on since christmas
18:35<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/BmfXplQw.png here
18:35<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>now compare the file sizes ;)
18:35<Zantor64:#openttd>see the 4 tracks on the north side? that's what I'm trying to figure out what to do with
18:35<Zantor64:#openttd>I noticed just in the upload, Eddi
18:36<Zantor64:#openttd>:D
18:36<Zantor64:#openttd>I considered an advanced roundabout but I thought that a Star would do better
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16247 /branches/0.7/src/ (11 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] Make sure AITunnel::BuildTunnel returns what the documentation says it does (r16244)
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] CmdBuildTunnel could be called with invalid parameters from the API code, causing crashes later [FS#2875] (r16243)
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NewGRF] ActionB should use the online parameters from GRFFile instead of
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: the initial user-specified values from GRFConfig. Also use the values as they
18:37<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: were set when the ActionB was executed, not as they are set when the message is
18:38<Zantor64:#openttd>I don't always consider compressed formats because I occasionally scan photographs at 600x600dpi
18:38<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>go round and roud is cool until all trains fit in it
18:38<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>things you have to ask with that kind of junction: do trains really need to get from every entrance to every exit? which directions do the most trains take?
18:38<Zantor64:#openttd>I have 23 trains
18:38<Zantor64:#openttd>most frequent are east, west, and north (north being upper-right)
18:39<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>directions are always "from-to"
18:39<Zantor64:#openttd>well I wouldn't have a six platform station if I didn't need it
18:39<Zantor64:#openttd>to and from the big station is frequent
18:39<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you have 5 bidirectional entrances into your junction
18:39-!-fonsinchen [~alve@BAEddf3.bae.pppool.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:40<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i guess train's AI searches a path to the destination, and takes the nearest free path
18:40<Zantor64:#openttd>two of which go to the same station
18:40<Zantor64:#openttd>I had to split it cuz I was getting bottlenecks
18:40<Zantor64:#openttd>otherwise I'd only have one set
18:41<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/TjET5j6R.png this is what it looked like before
18:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then, why do you use a LRLR setup? an LLRR setup might reduce the number of trains which will have to cross, or you don't need every entrance to be able to reach both station exits
18:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>would simplify your junction
18:42<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/fBUNs03g.png this is what the station looks like for reference
18:43<Xaroth:#openttd>why not convert it to just 1 entry/exit line?
18:43<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Zantor64, http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/Image:Junctionary2SLH.png
18:43<csokisnyuszi:#openttd><;
18:43<Zantor64:#openttd>LOL csokisnyuszi there is no way I need something that large and comples
18:43<Zantor64:#openttd>complex*
18:44<Xaroth:#openttd>that's not complex :/
18:44<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and if you update to 0.7, you might want to check out the path signals
18:44<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>are those the shinkansen tracks?
18:44<Zantor64:#openttd>http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/Image:PBS_Non_Ideal.png this would meet the load but it's so complicated there's bound to be problems
18:44<Zantor64:#openttd>I have 0.7
18:45<Ammler:#openttd>good night :-)
18:45<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hmm interesting
18:45<Zantor64:#openttd>it looks like it has a presignal
18:45<Xaroth:#openttd>not really complicated, but 6 stations to 1 entry/exit is easily doable
18:46<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>how about make connection to every direction? <;
18:46<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>and use reserve path signal
18:46<Zantor64:#openttd>that's a good idea, using a path signal
18:46<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm redoing it and will upload a screenie when I"m done
18:48<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>have someone tries printout of 2048x2048 map to bmp yet?
18:48<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>*d
18:48<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/TOi34BYb.png something like this?
18:50<Yexo:#openttd>if that's a pbs one-way signal, you can remove all the exit signals in front of the station
18:50<Zantor64:#openttd>really?
18:50<Yexo:#openttd>yes
18:50<Zantor64:#openttd>that path signal is one-way
18:50<Zantor64:#openttd>sdone
18:50<Yexo:#openttd>it was more a question whether or not it was a path signal
18:50<Zantor64:#openttd>done*
18:51<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/7mnp46I9.png update
18:51<Yexo:#openttd>now try it out :)
18:51<Zantor64:#openttd>one-way path based signal
18:51<Zantor64:#openttd>okay
18:51<Zantor64:#openttd>now back to the 4-way junction
18:52<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>will this be cool at the station?
18:52<Zantor64:#openttd>I was looking at adv. roundabout, star, or tetrathorp
18:52<Zantor64:#openttd>did you look at my new station setup?
18:52<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>yep
18:52<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>haven't tried this setup before
18:52<Zantor64:#openttd>oh did I come up with something new?
18:53<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>maeby but never did a screenshot
18:53<Yexo:#openttd>that depends what you call new
18:53<Zantor64:#openttd>oh
18:53<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>į have some savegames
18:53<Yexo:#openttd>it might be new for you and csokisnyuszi, this station setup (with just a single pbs signal) is not new for me
18:53<Nite_Owl:#openttd>you may want to try it with one way PBS signals facing into the platforms
18:54<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>btw original ttd savegames will work on openTTD ?
18:54<Nite_Owl:#openttd>in front of the platforms
18:54<Yexo:#openttd>Nite_Owl: that's only needed if it's a drive-though station / terminus statino combined
18:54<Yexo:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: they should, if they don't, poke SmatZ
18:54<Zantor64:#openttd>well this is my first time trying path-based signals, nite_owl
18:55<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>cool
18:55<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Hmmm - I will keep that in mind Yexo
18:55<Zantor64:#openttd>but I when I learned presignals I used them extensively
18:56<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Ravenswald%20Transport,%2018.%20Dez%201982.png <- check this one
18:57<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>draw the individual entrances separated as far as possible
18:57<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>those are 4 entrances
18:57<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>3 double track, 1 single track
18:57<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and a 4 track station
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18:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>how can i do cool screenshots in openttd?
18:59<Zantor64:#openttd>oops doggone mibbit and pushing wrong buttons by accident
18:59<Xaroth:#openttd>cool screenshots?
18:59<Xaroth:#openttd>pour liquid nitrogen over your screen
18:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>mean good quality, not zoomed-out
18:59<Xaroth:#openttd>take a screenshot
18:59<Yexo:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: sure, just press ctrl+s
18:59-!-Exl [~myself@cp1224652-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Bitches.]
18:59<Yexo:#openttd>and if you don't want a zoomed-out screenshot, be sure to zoom-in first :p
19:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>ty, trying out
19:00<Zantor64:#openttd>well I've leveled the area down one level
19:00<Zantor64:#openttd> hopefully I wil have room for this
19:01<Zantor64:#openttd>I have another question about path-based signals and one-way stations
19:01<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>searching for screenshot file...
19:02<Zantor64:#openttd>is it possible to use one path-based signal for a multiplatform one-way station?
19:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: on windows, most likely in "My Documents\OpenTTD"
19:02<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>linux
19:02<Zantor64:#openttd>eheh
19:02-!-KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-137-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:02<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then in ~/.openttd
19:03<Zantor64:#openttd>j/k linux is cool
19:03<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>o thx found it
19:03-!-KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-137-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
19:03<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:(
19:03<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>it's zoomed out
19:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>maybe your image viewer is zoomed out?
19:03<Yexo:#openttd>hmm? it should be a copy of the screen you saw at the time you took a screenshot
19:04<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Noldo, full size is small
19:04<Xaroth:#openttd>Zantor64: I think the linux users outnumber the windows users in this channel, so be careful :P
19:04<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>nooo, full size is small
19:04<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i will show you
19:04<Zantor64:#openttd>I was teasing, xaroth
19:05<Xaroth:#openttd>I know, but when yer outnumbered 2 to 1 that might be dangerous :P
19:05-!-Klanticus [~quassel@189.7.85.187] has joined #openttd
19:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that reminds me of a sketch in a tv show a few years ago
19:06<Zantor64:#openttd>I wish modern commercial games would be ported to linux
19:06<Zantor64:#openttd>using OpenGL and OpenAL for platforms
19:06<Zantor64:#openttd>er, APIs
19:06<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>there was a scene, people with white pointy hats masking their face, siting around a table
19:07<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/1828/ztransport15thjun2060.png
19:07<Xaroth:#openttd>EvE used to be linux compatible
19:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>one of the guys draws their hat off, it's a black guy shouting "surprise"
19:07<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>then the picture stops with an "alert"-noise
19:08<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>and the subtitle says "98% of all jokes happen at the wrong party"
19:08<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you can't see much out of this...
19:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i'm not sure if i really want to see much of this...
19:09<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>idea is to make 2 one-way lines, and connect the stations
19:09<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it has 90° turns and all...
19:10*Xaroth:#openttd shudders
19:10<Xaroth:#openttd>real men play without 90 degree turns
19:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>;>
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>I agree
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>my very first successful rail network was a mess
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>but then it was on a rather small map, 62x128
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>64*
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>but when I went up to 128x128
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>boy did I have room to make stuff owrk
19:10<Zantor64:#openttd>work*
19:11<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>2048x2048 gives you much space
19:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>oh i remember my first networks...
19:11<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>boy what had i fun after the AI taught me about signals :p
19:12<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>that was with the TT Demo, limited to 2 years of playing, and without manual
19:13<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, well i found this the cheapest effective solution
19:13<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>cost was primary concern
19:13<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but it worked
19:15<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hmm trees are sometimes confusing even if transparent
19:15<Xaroth:#openttd>make em full transparent?
19:16<Xaroth:#openttd>ctrl+x
19:16<Xaroth:#openttd>I play with full-transparent trees most of the time
19:16<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>ah i see thx
19:16<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>yep, they are annoying don't see the traffic lights
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19:19<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm slowly building up size
19:20<Zantor64:#openttd>I have a 256x256 in the works, but the size keeps intimidating me
19:20<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/4296/mtrx.png
19:20<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:)
19:21<Zantor64:#openttd>holy crap
19:21<Zantor64:#openttd>now to get rid of those 90 degree turns
19:21<Zantor64:#openttd>:P
19:21<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>there was no space for this many lines :(
19:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16248 /branches/0.7/ (7 files in 3 dirs):
19:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
19:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Improve corner case order handling: mark order as done only when actually done, obey non-stop orders, do only stop/refit at the depot in the order (r16240,r16228,r16199,r16198,r16187)
19:21<CIA-3:#openttd>OpenTTD: - Fix: Use the stop/non-stop intermediate orderflags AIs can give for goto-depot orders (r16239)
19:22<Zantor64:#openttd>tho that is very impressive
19:22<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i don't see how this is either "cheap" or "effective"
19:22<Zantor64:#openttd>I haven't even endeavored to do something that complex
19:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>this is a test setup
19:23<Xaroth:#openttd>[csokisnyuszi]: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/4296/mtrx.png << unefficient use of space tbh :/
19:23<Xaroth:#openttd>you could have done with 2 entry lines and 2 exit lines easily
19:23<Zantor64:#openttd>tbh?
19:23<Xaroth:#openttd>to be honest
19:23<Zantor64:#openttd>o
19:23<Xaroth:#openttd>or go for 3/3 and add a few more station lines
19:24<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>here's the other end http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/2471/mtrx2.png
19:24<Xaroth:#openttd>yeh, as i said, unefficient use of space :P
19:25<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i can guarantee you that this station can be served by 2 parallel lines instead of 7. possibly even 1 (per direction)
19:26<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>o.c. this is a small town
19:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i don't mean the town
19:26<Yexo:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: how many trains are running between those stations?
19:26<Xaroth:#openttd>http://users.tt-forums.net/autottd/screenshot.png
19:26<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>i mean the number of tracks at the station vs. the number of tracks inbetween stations
19:26<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>į have tried 15+
19:27<Xaroth:#openttd>that's 2 lines one way, two lines another, and that station can be visited from both ways entrance or exit
19:27<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but wasn't enough passengers
19:27<Yexo:#openttd>only that little? you can easily run 20 trains per track / 3-wide station, at least if there is some distance between those towns
19:27<Nite_Owl:#openttd>Ooo - late - must go get food - later all
19:27<Xaroth:#openttd>serves around.. 30-ish trains full load/unloading
19:28<Zantor64:#openttd>cya owl
19:28-!-Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-51-190.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Read You Soon]
19:28<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>:)
19:28<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: come back when you have 150 trains runnign on that...
19:28<Xaroth:#openttd>only 150?
19:28<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>so į made some how to inefficiently use 7 lines screenshot :)
19:29<Xaroth:#openttd>csokisnyuszi: quite :P
19:29<Xaroth:#openttd>1-on-1 lines are always inefficient
19:29<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>Xaroth: that is around 20 per track
19:29<Xaroth:#openttd>most stations are more than doable with just 2 lines, one for one way, one for another
19:29<Xaroth:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause: 256^2 map, both ends of map, should easily hold 30 per track i think
19:29<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>which matches what Yexo wrote
19:30<Xaroth:#openttd>anyways, off to bed
19:30<Xaroth:#openttd>nn
19:31<Zantor64:#openttd>cya xaroth
19:31<Zantor64:#openttd>and thanks for the help
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19:33<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Xaroth, made the junction all right?
19:33-!-Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77C37.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
19:33<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>oh not you
19:33<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>Zantor64, made the junction all right?
19:33<Zantor64:#openttd>finishing it up
19:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>you could check out this savegame: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Ravenswald%20Transport,%202.%20Jan%201972.sav
19:34<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>it has a few cute junctions
19:34<Zantor64:#openttd>ein moment, bitte
19:34<Zantor64:#openttd>http://mibbit.com/up/7BmNmliV.png updated and completed
19:34<Zantor64:#openttd>now to plant trees and stuff
19:36<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>doesn't look too bad, but leaves room for improvement
19:36<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>plant cute girls there
19:36<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
19:36<Zantor64:#openttd>well I'm still learning stuff about laying track and all
19:36<Zantor64:#openttd>but I have basics down
19:38<Zantor64:#openttd>how can I conquer the intimidation of large maps?
19:38<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>step by step ;)
19:38<Zantor64:#openttd>how so?
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19:38<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>daylength patch helps ;)
19:38<Zantor64:#openttd>where can I find that?
19:38*Sacro:#openttd 's daylength patch!
19:39<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>the game above was a 1024x2048 map (i think), and it was played with daylength x4, and even after 50 years, only half the map was connected
19:41<Zantor64:#openttd>ahh
19:41<Zantor64:#openttd>where can I find daylength?
19:41<Sacro:#openttd>I wrote it :D
19:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>in the forum
19:41<Zantor64:#openttd>ok
19:41<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>sacro contributed one line.
19:42<Zantor64:#openttd>brb
19:47<Zantor64:#openttd>bak
19:51-!-KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-137-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:52<Zantor64:#openttd>crap
19:52<Zantor64:#openttd>now I'm having lost trains everywhere
19:53<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you can always use waypoints
19:57<Zantor64:#openttd>I figured it out
19:58<Zantor64:#openttd>it was a pbs that wasn't working right
19:58<Zantor64:#openttd>putting presignals back in fixed it
20:00<Zantor64:#openttd>ok well it fixed part of it
20:00<Zantor64:#openttd>I still have 2 trains consistently getting lost even tho the path is there
20:02<Zantor64:#openttd>and yet another pbs was making things act up
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20:16<Zantor64:#openttd>Eddi|zuHause, are you there?
20:16<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>not really
20:16<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
20:16<Zantor64:#openttd>did you use a newGRF with that map you linked me to?
20:17<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hehe just made a tycoon map
20:17<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>who wanna try?
20:17<Zantor64:#openttd>what size?
20:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>yes. most notably alpinew.grf and dbsetxlw.grf
20:17<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>128x128 for testing
20:17<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>they all should be on grfcrawler
20:19<Zantor64:#openttd>gee I ought to get more into OpenTTD
20:19<Zantor64:#openttd>it's full of goodies
20:19<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://matrix.ratesz.hu/tmp/ttd/tycoonheaven.scn
20:19<Zantor64:#openttd>I can give it a try if you'd like, csokisnyuszi
20:19<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>now tell me it ain't perfect ;>
20:20<Zantor64:#openttd>is it a heightmap?
20:20<Zantor64:#openttd>how do I load it?
20:20<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>load scenario
20:20<Zantor64:#openttd>k
20:21<Zantor64:#openttd>hehe spots for stations; that's very nice
20:21<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>;>>
20:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>and it defaults to 2040 ;)
20:22<Zantor64:#openttd>I'll start playing with it right now
20:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you can experience with maglev
20:22<Zantor64:#openttd>o the time lol
20:22<Zantor64:#openttd>I like the technology progressing tho
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20:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hm well you'r right
20:22<Zantor64:#openttd>so personally I'd want to start in 1965
20:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>1950 ?
20:22<Zantor64:#openttd>or 1970
20:23<Zantor64:#openttd>not that early
20:23<Zantor64:#openttd>60 at the earliest
20:23<Zantor64:#openttd>I was told 1960 is a good starting year cuz there's a little bit more stuff availab
20:23<Zantor64:#openttd>le
20:23<Zantor64:#openttd>as in vehicles
20:24<SpComb:#openttd>depends on what GRFs you play with
20:24<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://matrix.ratesz.hu/tmp/ttd/tycoonheaven_1960.scn
20:24<Zantor64:#openttd>true; I use the stock ones
20:24<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>time machine started :)
20:24<Zantor64:#openttd>I have yet to find mods to help it reflect American stuff
20:25<Zantor64:#openttd>is the daylength path not a permanent feature yet?
20:25<Zantor64:#openttd>patch*
20:26<Zantor64:#openttd>that does look like a tycoon's heaven all right
20:26<Zantor64:#openttd>no, how to lay it out?
20:26<Zantor64:#openttd>now*
20:27<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>first i would reserve the places left out for stations
20:28<Zantor64:#openttd>obviously
20:28<Zantor64:#openttd>I read in the quick start guide that you should build stations first
20:28<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>then you can test making solutions
20:30<Zantor64:#openttd>stations built and track laid to reserve the spots
20:30<Zantor64:#openttd>but what's with the booku shopping malls?
20:31<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you mean the industries ? <;
20:31<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you can connect them too
20:31<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>in several ways
20:32<Zantor64:#openttd>it hadn't occurred to me that malls are industries
20:32<Zantor64:#openttd>it just hasn't sunk in lol
20:32<Zantor64:#openttd>this might make a great 4-player multiplayer map
20:33<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hm getting a dictionary on malls
20:33<Zantor64:#openttd>mall or shopping mall would be the word to look for
20:33<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>oh you mean many malls in a town?
20:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>it was generated
20:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>and į didn't bomb it
20:34<Zantor64:#openttd>lol ok
20:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hehehyes funny thing
20:34<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but population has to eat something
20:35<Zantor64:#openttd>true
20:36<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>btw i might start with industries to make some money
20:44<Sacro:#openttd>http://www.themuffin.net/j/magiceye.jpg
20:45<Zantor64:#openttd>I can't quite make it out. What is that shape supposed to be?
20:46<Zantor64:#openttd>I can get my eyes to focus on the illusion, but I don't know what it is
20:46<Sacro:#openttd>keep looking :)
20:47<Zantor64:#openttd>it would help to print it out but that would take a lot of ink
20:48<Zantor64:#openttd>a skull?
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20:55<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>well its interesting to see 5 megatons of coal waiting in a station ;>
20:55<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
20:55<Zantor64:#openttd>and 2 megatons of grain and livestock
20:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>yep
20:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>depends on how much time it accumates
20:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>*accumulates
20:57<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm just contemplating
20:57<Zantor64:#openttd>how to link it all together....
20:57<Zantor64:#openttd>because there are so many options
20:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>you go round and round or make a starburst, that will be more complicated į think
20:58<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm not big on roundaboust
20:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>what you think?
20:58<Zantor64:#openttd>I havent' toyed with it much yet
20:58<Zantor64:#openttd>or are you talking about junctions?
20:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>was talking about topologies
20:59<Zantor64:#openttd>oh
20:59<Zantor64:#openttd>I like roundabouts
20:59<Zantor64:#openttd>roundabout and cloverleaf mysefl
20:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>starburst means to connect everything onn level center
20:59<Zantor64:#openttd>myself*
20:59<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>cloverleaf is generally a bad junction
21:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i have to learn that too
21:00<Zantor64:#openttd>I've had it work fine for me in two junctions on my last map
21:00<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>roundabout is even worse, because it is a much bigger bottleneck
21:01<Zantor64:#openttd>hence why I want to get away from them
21:02<@petern:#openttd>mmm, extremely easy money cheat in IS2
21:02<Zantor64:#openttd>IS2?
21:02<@petern:#openttd>infrastructure sharing
21:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>people should get away from constructing rail junctions like road junctions, where every entrance is connected to every exit
21:03<Eddi|zuHause:#openttd>rail networks are not constructed like that
21:08<Zantor64:#openttd>true
21:08*Zantor64:#openttd is still contemplating how to do the railroads
21:12<@petern:#openttd>yay, £10m in 'free money' created
21:13<@petern:#openttd>nite
21:16<Zantor64:#openttd>gute nacht
21:16<Zantor64:#openttd>good night
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21:37<Zantor64:#openttd>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FD9FfOmt1oM&videos=kH4W5r5llio&playnext_from=TL&playnext=1&fmt=18 Inspector Gadget A Cappella
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21:55<Zantor64:#openttd>csokisnyuszi, for the one set to 2040, you need to start with more funds; I had to max my loan out just to get one locomotive engine
21:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>mee too :)
21:56<Zantor64:#openttd>it's slowly paying for itself, but not very fast
21:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>but earned 1 million in 1 years with 2 trains
21:56<Zantor64:#openttd>transporting what freight?
21:56<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>oil
21:56<Zantor64:#openttd>ah
21:56<Zantor64:#openttd>I'm doing passengers
21:57<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>and ofcourse with maglev ;>
21:57<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>in 2040...
21:57<Zantor64:#openttd>because I cannot make up my mind how to do the rail network. Often what I do is I just make a bunch of point to point stations and connect them into a network as I go
21:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>it don't need to be one network
21:58<Zantor64:#openttd>true
21:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>*doesn't
21:58<Zantor64:#openttd>I hadn't thought of that
21:58<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>then you can start making bridges
21:59<Zantor64:#openttd>it is nice to make 17k USD in one delivery tho
21:59<Zantor64:#openttd>I don't even have to advertise :D
21:59<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>yep ;>
21:59<Zantor64:#openttd>in ordinary SP you have to advertise sometimes
22:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/2206/trafi2045.png
22:00<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>i've made this now
22:01<Zantor64:#openttd>wow
22:01<Zantor64:#openttd>I'd have a different take on it tho
22:01<Zantor64:#openttd>as we all think differently
22:02<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>įve found the best be one-way stations, one side input other side out
22:02<Zantor64:#openttd>I agree
22:07<Zantor64:#openttd>I keep getting lost trains
22:07<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hm
22:07<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>then it must be a maze
22:07<Zantor64:#openttd>on the one map I just redid a main junction on
22:07<Zantor64:#openttd>lool
22:07<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>waypoints ?
22:07<Zantor64:#openttd>you want me to send you the save file?
22:07<Zantor64:#openttd>I have 1 waypoint and it's not in the area
22:08<Zantor64:#openttd>a waypoint shouldn't be necessary
22:08<Zantor64:#openttd>I've had no pathfinder issues before
22:08<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>if you like
22:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>btw
22:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9738/trafi2046.png
22:10<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>this little X earns 6.5 million euros/year
22:10<Zantor64:#openttd>thank you for the insight
22:10<Zantor64:#openttd>about 8 or 9 million USD
22:14<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>though just tried out things
22:15<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hehe į will build a lol train
22:18<Zantor64:#openttd>lol train
22:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/3599/loltrain.png
22:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>hahaha
22:22<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>even this makes mony
22:23<csokisnyuszi:#openttd>and faster than any bus
22:24-!-csokisnyuszi is now known as hoax
22:27<Zantor64:#openttd>o_O
22:28<hoax:#openttd>wait here's loltrain 2
22:33<hoax:#openttd>hard to find suitable place
22:38<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
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22:47<hoax:#openttd>ah smaller distance does pay too little
22:48<hoax:#openttd>nut it's lol to put 2 stations few cells away
22:49<hoax:#openttd>wow did you try to stack stations?
22:51<De_Ghost:#openttd>that is a bad station design
22:52<De_Ghost:#openttd>well for a 1 industry picup it's fine
22:54<hoax:#openttd>well it gives huge covering ares
23:00<hoax:#openttd>http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/3707/loltrain2.png
23:00<hoax:#openttd>hahah this actually makes money
23:01<De_Ghost:#openttd>have u seen the latest openttdcoop game :o
23:01<Zantor64:#openttd>no
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23:05<hoax:#openttd>Zantor64, what so you think about that platform? ;>
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23:16<hoax:#openttd>wow į found something new ;>>
23:20<Zantor64:#openttd>what platform?
23:20<Zantor64:#openttd>oh
23:20<Zantor64:#openttd>hold on
23:20<Zantor64:#openttd>I haven't been watching the IRC window lol
23:20<hoax:#openttd>http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/3707/loltrain2.png
23:20<Zantor64:#openttd>that is one weird lookin platform
23:28<Zantor64:#openttd>is there a way to use path-based signals with an advanced roundabout?
23:29<Zantor64:#openttd>hoax?
23:30<De_Ghost:#openttd>u don't have to drag platforms like that anymore
23:30<De_Ghost:#openttd>press ctrl
23:30<hoax:#openttd>hahah you will like this one http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/8662/lolplatform.png
23:30<De_Ghost:#openttd>when u drop iot
23:33<Zantor64:#openttd>LOL
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23:39<Zantor64:#openttd>hey hoax where would you recommend I start on the tycoon heaven map?
23:40<hoax:#openttd>transport oil from one map edge to the other
23:40<Zantor64:#openttd>k
23:40<hoax:#openttd>and you can take coal on same track too
23:40<hoax:#openttd>back
23:41<hoax:#openttd>and when you have money, you can think about passengers
23:41<hoax:#openttd>make some system you want to test
23:42<hoax:#openttd>i'm testing longtrains now
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23:43<Zantor64:#openttd>I just made a train with ten oil tanker cars
23:43<hoax:#openttd>didn't find a bypass;< so į must stick with limits
23:43<Zantor64:#openttd>bypass for what?
23:43<hoax:#openttd>hm wait maeby
23:44<Zantor64:#openttd>weight or wait?
23:44<hoax:#openttd>bypass for maximum platform length
23:44<Zantor64:#openttd>oh
23:44<hoax:#openttd>i'm not hacking, just hoaxing :)
23:44<Zantor64:#openttd>lol
23:44<Zantor64:#openttd>no you're h4x1ng
23:45<Zantor64:#openttd>or h4x!ng
23:45<Zantor64:#openttd>lol 2.2 million litres of oil
23:46<hoax:#openttd>;>
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23:53<Zantor64:#openttd>one nice thing about PBS is tracks can be less cumbersome
23:54<Zantor64:#openttd>I looked at PBS junctions and they look to use less track than pressignaled or conventional junctions
23:56<hoax:#openttd>http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/2433/longtrain.png
23:57<hoax:#openttd>have made a huge train, but only loads from hald of the 2 platforms it is in ;<
23:58<hoax:#openttd>and couldn't glue 24 square together
23:59<Zantor64:#openttd>I'll be able to pay my loan off quickly doing this\
---Logclosed Thu May 07 00:00:10 2009