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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-06-11

---Logopened Thu Jun 11 00:00:32 2009
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00:11<kkb110>I've found http://wiki.openttd.org/OpenTTD_0.7.1 this page but it's still up to RC3
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01:09<Smoky555>hi all
01:10<Smoky555>i want to ask about newgrf-static section in config file.
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01:13<Smoky555>russian2w.grf - file with russian glyphs. In old builds, when i add this file in newgrf-static section, game use this glyphs, not system fonts. But in 0.7.1 this settings ignored. What wrong i do OR something changed in game?
01:14<Sacro>rtfm
01:14<Sacro>which 'old builds'?
01:17<Smoky555>0.7.0, 0.7.1 RC1
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01:22<Sacro>Hmmm
01:22<Sacro>might wanna file a bug then
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01:28<Smoky555>Sacro: it just use action12 ... can you look at it?
01:30<Sacro>I'm no developer
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01:36<kkb110>
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01:56<Smoky555>RC1 - work fine (with russian glyphs)
01:56<Smoky555>RC2 - fine
01:56<Smoky555>RC3 - fine
01:56<Smoky555>0.7.1 final build - wrong :(
02:04<Noldo_>http://hg.openttd.org/openttd/branches/0.7.hg/file/e4960e9d1f99/changelog.txt
02:06<SmatZ>Smoky555: probably the translator added strings that use gliphs not present in your file
02:06<SmatZ>blame him :-p
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02:07<SmatZ>Smoky555: you can try copying the lang file from older version (no new strings were added, so it should work - but backup your lng file first)
02:08<Smoky555>SmatZ: hmm... someone change many string in russian language file... thanks, i'll try
02:12<@Rubidium>kkb110: what is do you intend to do with the 'revision of 0.7.1
02:12<@Rubidium>kkb110: what is do you intend to do with the 'revision of 0.7.1' information?
02:12<@Rubidium>check out trunk at that revision and assume it is the same as 0.7.1?
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02:15<SmatZ>@seen Xyzzy
02:15<@DorpsGek>SmatZ: I have not seen Xyzzy.
02:17<@petern>hmm
02:18<@petern>0.7.1 should technically be 0.7.1-RC3 which the version number changed
02:18<@petern>it is silly to make RCs and then still do changes for the final release
02:19<@Rubidium>oh, petern wants to do the releases. Go ahead with them ;)
02:22<@Rubidium>and given the amount of people actually testing RCs I doubt that this would've been found during the RC stages
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05:40<TrueBrain>General Notice: the SSL Certificate of OpenTTD.org just updated
05:41<TrueBrain>It now contains all the current subdomains, and also is valid for the next 6 months again ;)
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07:45<alekibango>hello. how much is opengfx ready for Free release of openttd, for example on my live cd? when can i expect it to be ready?
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07:47<Phazorx>hola
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07:48<Phazorx>got a general SDL dev question - can you point me towards some reading on blitters and overall SDL gfx efficiency optimization?
07:49<planetmaker>alekibango, when it's done :)
07:51<@petern>www.libsdl.org ?
07:56<alekibango>planetmaker: that means its still not ready for public and that you have no idea when it can be, right?
07:56<alekibango>hmm do you think it will be before winter?
07:56<alekibango>:)
07:57<Ammler>of course
07:57<frosch123>winter 2090 ?
07:57<Ammler>heeh
07:57<Phazorx>petern: well i was hoping for more details in form of a guide on dos and don'ts
07:57<Phazorx>like general practices
08:03<Phazorx>what ottd team used as guidance for example... why sw surfaces not hw, why no ogl renderer?
08:04<alekibango>Phazorx: imho there are still computers without GL capabilities
08:04<Phazorx>alekibango: as well as computers that have DOS
08:05<frosch123>you can compile ottd also with allegro instead of sdl
08:05<alekibango>for live cd using free software it is more suitable without GL
08:05<alekibango>Phazorx: licenses, bugs etc... i for one welcome the good old and working approach :)
08:05<Phazorx>alekibango: it can be an option rather than mandatory renderer
08:06<alekibango>oki :)
08:06<alekibango>but i am not a developer here :)
08:06<alekibango>gradual zooming would be nice too
08:06<alekibango>(using gl)
08:06<Phazorx>probaby will come at a price
08:06<Phazorx>hefty price
08:06<alekibango>and rotating...
08:07<Phazorx>and rotating isnt really possible w/o changes to all gfx
08:07<Phazorx>i was more thinking within lines of using gl surfaces and not doing bliting with cpu
08:07<alekibango>few years of using blender could help
08:08<Phazorx>well... that i a major change rather than what i was leaning to
08:08<alekibango>:)
08:08<alekibango>just few years of work... :)
08:09<Phazorx>aint really worth it imho
08:09<Phazorx>pixel gfx ftw
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08:23<planetmaker>alekibango, well... all people on it work voluntarily. And only do what they like to do :) I think we need especially people who draw these damn faces...
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08:27<planetmaker>it will be only really play-able when all sprites have been replaced by at least *something*
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08:41<alekibango>planetmaker: ic. i am not a good artist, but i can test it, shipt it, create live cd...
08:42<alekibango>and maybe create few faces using makehuman :)) but for now without hairs
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08:47<planetmaker>alekibango, the faces need to be done in parts... it's not one image. They're kinda modular.
08:47<planetmaker>Testing can be done by anyone who likes (and is appreciated a lot).
08:48<alekibango>ic... you need someone who will finish the hard job. i know this is hard task for free software projects (i manage one)...
08:48<planetmaker>Current development snapshots (nightlies) are available form the development site: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx
08:48<@petern>burp
08:48<planetmaker>yes. The usualy *someone*
08:49<planetmaker>He has unfortunately so many tasks already :P
08:49<alekibango>yes :)
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08:57<alekibango>btw nice european manager faces... but i think they are unnatural with naked shoulders... some clothes would be nice
09:01<planetmaker>nah. That's the new trend in management. :P
09:02<planetmaker>Less time spent on appearance, more spent on actual work. :P
09:02<alekibango>lol, like topolanek and berlusconi :)
09:02<planetmaker>see :) exactly :P
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09:03<alekibango>hehe
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09:09<@Belugas>hello
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09:11<@petern>hi
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10:00<@Belugas>grrrr.. one day out of the office and see the mess that needs to be cleaned :S
10:00<@Belugas>lovely
10:02<Eddi|zuHause>i see two solutions to the problem ;)
10:02<Eddi|zuHause>a) never go out of the office
10:02<Eddi|zuHause>b) never go into the office
10:03<Yexo>c) make sure no-one else gets into the office
10:03<alekibango>c) become trash cleaner
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10:04<@petern>d) play on the guitar
10:05<alekibango>btw the music in original ttd is so nice!
10:05<@petern>the original ttd, eh?
10:05<alekibango>i still am listening to it, even without playing
10:06<alekibango>i even play my guitar along :)
10:06<alekibango>(not right now, but wait few secs...)
10:07<alekibango>do you hear my guitar? lol
10:07<alekibango>:) this irc is obsolete, lets use mumble
10:08<@petern>we use ninjam
10:08<alekibango>oh, it is really used? i was just reading about it
10:08<Ammler>irc is better for ignoring...
10:09<alekibango>ignore repeated comments
10:09<@petern>yes
10:09<@petern>it takes some getting used to
10:09<alekibango>i have to try
10:09<@petern>as you don't play together but separated by a bar's (or two) latency
10:09<@petern>unfortunately the internet is not instant :(
10:11<alekibango>i have been reading about some low latency internet audio jam server... forgot the name...
10:11<alekibango>but i can imagine it is not as low latency as we need
10:11<alekibango>is tehere ninjam irc chan?
10:13<@petern>dunno, not seen one
10:15<Phazorx>damn... anyone got tes4 oblivion installed and some time?
10:15<CIA-6>OpenTTD: yexo * r16561 /trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): -Fix [NoAI]: AIMarine::AreWaterTilesConnected didn't return true for bridge head<>neighbouring water tile
10:17<alekibango>petern: what instrument do you play?
10:17<@petern>keyboard
10:17<CIA-6>OpenTTD: yexo * r16562 /trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): -Revert (r16561)
10:18<@Belugas>i like b) solution
10:19<@Belugas>too bad it's impossible to achieve
10:19<@Belugas>and d) is my overall best :)
10:19<@Belugas>ninjam's lag is bareable
10:20<@Belugas>in fact, over one or two sessions, you get quite used to it
10:20<@petern>well it's not lag
10:20<@petern>it's by design
10:20<@Belugas>true
10:20<alekibango>ic... listening
10:21<Phazorx>are there any tools that can normally open installshield cab files?
10:21<@petern># you fucking whore
10:21<@petern># that's all you are
10:21<alekibango>this recording is interesting ... even includes alex... http://autosong.ninjam.com/mp3.php/20090507_1702_1803-nt-thenextda-doc_Mc__1.mp3
10:22<Eddi|zuHause>Phazorx: yes
10:22<@petern>there's all sorts on the public ninjam servers
10:22<@petern>well mostly guitarists, but drummers, keyboardists and singers too
10:22<alekibango>i can do percussions too
10:23<alekibango>was singing, but lost my voice
10:23<@Belugas>the biggest problem, the really biggest one is not relevant to injam
10:23<@Belugas>it's a personnal issue
10:23<@Belugas>called time-zones
10:23<@petern>yeah
10:23<alekibango>:)
10:23<@Belugas>fucking hurdle
10:24<alekibango>too loud for people around... :))
10:24<@petern>playing with people you don't know is... just not the same
10:24<@Belugas>yup
10:24<Eddi|zuHause>that's why i play in a real orchestra
10:24<@Belugas>see, alekibango, petern is on the european continent, while i'm on the american one
10:25<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause, that's true, it's always better, but sometimes, having players with matching tastes is not really possible
10:25<Eddi|zuHause>you know the people, and they are generally in the same time zone ;)
10:25<@petern>my kit is not portable either :/
10:26<@Belugas>ho... that too :D
10:26<alekibango>so in ninjam you can play for example basic 12 blues and jam around it?
10:26<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause "generally" is the keyword
10:26<Phazorx>Eddi|zuHause: care to share a name of one that works?
10:26<@Belugas>alekibango : yup
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10:26<alekibango>ninjam seems to be friendly to standards and classic blues :)
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10:27<Eddi|zuHause>Phazorx: i forgot the name, but i believe when i tried cabextract, it told me the name
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10:27<@petern>hmm, although i guess i can manage fine on a laptop. maybe i should get a decent performing one
10:27<Phazorx>i hve a few but they fail in this particular case
10:27<alekibango>btw i would love to find people playing the style -- teh same as ttd music is... i found 1 who is now mostly not reachable...
10:28<Phazorx>could be an issue of archive be split between many big files
10:28<@petern>hmm, are there any powerful netbooks? heh
10:28<Eddi|zuHause>then i can't help you. Phazorx.
10:29<@Belugas>alekibango: ninjam is good for quite a variety of styles, in fact
10:29<CIA-6>OpenTTD: yexo * r16563 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_marine.cpp: -Fix [NoAI]: AIMarine::AreWaterTilesConnected didn't return true for bridge head<>neighbouring water tile
10:29<@Belugas>you just need a good inspiration
10:29<@petern>as long as it's repetitive
10:29<@Belugas>yup
10:29<Phazorx>thanks anyway
10:30<alekibango>i will try to install it... and i will come later to ping you if i will need sparing partner :)
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10:39<CIA-6>OpenTTD: yexo * r16564 /trunk/projects/ (langs_vs80.vcproj langs_vs90.vcproj): -Revert (r16561, r16562): english_rev doesn't belong in trunk (and certainly not twice)
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10:43<@Belugas>damned... i want to JAM!!
10:44<Noldo_>o!k
10:44<@Belugas>not WORK !!!
10:44<Noldo_>i'm booting a virtual machine from the net
10:48<@petern>how exciting!
10:48<alekibango>sorry for going OT, but make on my ninjam linux source (amd64 debian) -> ../njclient.cpp:169: error: cast from ‘WDL_HeapBuf*’ to ‘int’ loses precision
10:48<@petern>hehe
10:48<@petern>for a quick fix, change int to long
10:49<@petern>not technically right but it'll compile, ish
10:49<alekibango>which int ? all ints? :)
10:49<@petern>just on that line
10:49<@petern>there's a cast to int
10:50<@petern>it's abusing pointers :/
10:50<_ln>does someone know what insect this is: http://users.utu.fi/lanurm/kuvat/tmp/elain4.jpg
10:50<+glx>we call it perce-oreille here, but I don't know the real name
10:51<@petern>earwig
10:51<+glx>Forficula auricularia
10:51<alekibango>heh compiled finally
10:51<@petern>there's a bug in WDL/rsa.h too
10:52<alekibango>petern: i am not a c guy. i love python
10:52<@petern>prevents authentication
10:52<@petern>they used longs instead of ints there :/
10:52<alekibango>?
10:52<Noldo_>_ln: http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isopihtih%C3%A4nt%C3%A4
10:52<@petern>but it works with anonymous user, so no problem
10:52<alekibango>Noldo_: nice :))
10:52<alekibango>i love this bug
10:53<@petern>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earwig
10:53<_ln>glx, Noldo_: looks same, thanks
10:53<_ln>bought some cherries from spain...
10:53<alekibango>_ln: do not put it into your ears lol
10:53<_ln>it died
10:54<Phazorx>it actualy an underground creature dangerous mostly to potatos
10:54<Noldo_>I just followed the wikipedia links from the name glx gace
10:54<Noldo_>*gave
10:54<alekibango>there are many urban stories about people going really mad after it went in the ear...
10:54<@petern>alekibango, my nan had to have one removed ...
10:54<@petern>they were like "oh, they don't really go in ears"
10:55<@petern>you'd go mad from the tickling, i bet
10:55<alekibango>uh.... petern, thats ugly
10:56<alekibango>petern: ... back to our bug in ninjam preventing the auth... is there a diff somewhere?
10:57<alekibango>it would be nice to allow jackd to be used...
10:57<@petern>there's a version with jackd
10:57<@petern>support
10:57<alekibango>would allow creox etc
10:59<alekibango>petern: how did they get it out of the ear?
10:59<alekibango>i would use our plum brandy -> ear... that would kill the bug
10:59<alekibango>lol
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11:01<@petern>http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ninjam.tar.gz
11:01<@petern>dunno
11:02<alekibango>petern: ty, compiled
11:03<alekibango>it might be good idea to talk about ninjam on #ninjam
11:03<alekibango>:))
11:03*Belugas imagines snoring (therefor mouth opened) and swallowing a creaping thing
11:03<@Belugas>miam
11:03<@petern>Belugas, spiders
11:03<@Belugas>meunoum meunoummeunoummeunoummeunoum !
11:03<@Belugas>vitamin!!
11:04<@Belugas>Blood is Life
11:06<Singaporekid>blood sugars
11:07<@Belugas>#Brown Sugar
11:07<@Belugas>#How come you taste so good!
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11:48<@petern>#TERRIBLE LIE
11:53<alekibango>petern: obama like?
11:58<@petern>like trent
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12:17<@Belugas>:)
12:18<@Belugas>run for cover!!
12:19<@Belugas>Richk67 is back :S
12:19<@petern>oh fuck
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12:47<@Belugas>run away smurfs! here comes Azrael!!
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13:32<CIA-6>OpenTTD: translators * r16565 /trunk/src/lang/ (russian.txt unfinished/serbian.txt):
13:32<CIA-6>OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-06-11 17:32:14
13:32<CIA-6>OpenTTD: russian - 3 fixed, 1 deleted, 209 changed by Lone Wolf (213)
13:32<CIA-6>OpenTTD: serbian - 95 fixed by etran (95)
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14:25<DJNekkid>guys ... a question ... is the Company Color completely random?
14:25<DJNekkid>it seems to favor pink ALOT!
14:25<Eddi|zuHause>it guesses your personality
14:26<SmatZ>:-D
14:28<DJNekkid>and on the serious side?
14:28<SmatZ>it's 100% pseudorandom
14:28<DJNekkid>i just did a test, started 10 new games, 5 turned out pink, 2 dark green, one of each red, light blue and orange
14:29<Eddi|zuHause>and you think 10 is a "large number"?
14:29<SmatZ>maybe there are more colours that are similiar to pink?
14:29<DJNekkid>not large number, but i guess large enough to see a trend
14:30<DJNekkid>you know, after 5 countries had given its votes, norway had a CLEAR lead in eurovision :p
14:31<@Belugas>it's a feature. Its goal is to make all males who are playing the game less prone to react on pink, therefor to kill homophobia
14:32<SmatZ>:-p
14:32<DJNekkid>lol...
14:32<DJNekkid>well ...
14:32<DJNekkid>i've just noticed that pink _seem_ to be favored during all testing i've done the last year or so ...
14:32<DJNekkid>on newgrf i mean
14:34<@Belugas>it si a sign you have, therefor, not played the game long enough
14:34<@Belugas>keep on playing!!
14:34<SmatZ>blue ; red ; orange ; red ; orange ; blue ; green ; blue
14:35<Ammler>:-)
14:35<SmatZ>started new game 8 times
14:35<SmatZ>:-)
14:35<DJNekkid>[20:24:23] <FooBar_> Yes, it appears so indeed. Half of the times I start a new test-game I end up being pink. And I don't like pink for screenshots :P
14:36<DJNekkid>it's just not mee you see :)
14:36<SmatZ>no pink for me, maybe because I don't have gay porn on my computer :-p
14:36<SmatZ>(I hope)
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14:37<DJNekkid>i guess it's because you actually do have gay porn... it senses it, and therefor no need for pink trains
14:37<SmatZ>hmm do shemales count?
14:38<DJNekkid>well ...
14:38<@Belugas>#You can't Always Get what you want
14:38<SmatZ>static const byte _colour_sort[COLOUR_END] = {2, 2, 3, 2, 3, 2, 3, 2, 3, 2, 2, 2, 3, 1, 1, 1};
14:38<SmatZ>so some colours have priority
14:38<frosch123>since when is smatz argueing about colours?
14:39<SmatZ>COLOUR_PINK COLOUR_RED COLOUR_GREEN COLOUR_BLUE
14:39<SmatZ>frosch123: ;-) [20:29:41] <SmatZ> maybe there are more colours that are similiar to pink?
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14:40<SmatZ>and COLOUR_ORANGE
14:41<SmatZ>hmm the way company colours are generated is really too complicated
14:43<@petern>nah, it's easy
14:43<@petern>if (user == DJNekkid) colour = pink;
14:44<@petern>Belugas, should try some time
14:44<@petern>he might just find
14:44<SmatZ>:-)
14:44<@petern>he gets what he needs
14:44<@Belugas>hehe
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14:47<andreiro18>hy. can anyone tell me where can i find a patch or GRF with trolleybus
14:47<andreiro18>i've searched entire web and found nothing
14:47<andreiro18>please help
14:48<andreiro18>i have open TTD 0.7.0
14:48<andreiro18>latest stable ver from the main site
14:48<@petern>trams?
14:48<Yexo>check again, latest stable is 0.7.1
14:49<andreiro18>i'm sure 0.7.1 doesn't have trolleybuses to
14:49<SmatZ>trolleybus = trams with empty track sprites :)
14:49<SmatZ>I don't know if there is any GRF...
14:50<andreiro18>i've searched on the forum and some users have posted pics with screenshots
14:50<frosch123>I read several times the term "russian trolley bus", but they were just normal busses with a silly line drawn at the top
14:50<andreiro18>and the posts are from 2005
14:50<andreiro18>so loong time ago
14:50<andreiro18>electric buses
14:50<andythenorth>you could make one?
14:51<andythenorth>grf coding isn't hard
14:51<Yexo>andreiro18: it might help if you link us to those screenshots
14:51<Yexo>maybe someone recognises them
14:51<andreiro18>ok
14:51<andreiro18>w8 a sec
14:51*SmatZ w8s
14:51<SmatZ>:-)
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14:51<frosch123>how much do you w8?
14:52<SmatZ>:^)
14:52<Yexo>error: cannot convert 'sec' to 'kilogram' :)
14:52<SmatZ>:-)
14:52<Alberth>'stone' then?
14:52<andreiro18>weight a second
14:52<andreiro18>:D
14:53<SmatZ>:-D
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15:00<andreiro18>here: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=9916&p=765838&hilit=trolley#p765838
15:00<andreiro18>in the middle of the page are 3 pics
15:00<Yexo>that's not openttd but locomotion
15:00<SmatZ>umm it's locomotion
15:00<Yexo>a different game
15:01<andreiro18>ohh...i can see my mystake now
15:01<andreiro18>:D
15:01<andreiro18>sorry
15:01<SmatZ>no problem
15:01<andreiro18>it's like tycoon?
15:01<andreiro18>it seems like..
15:01<Yexo>it's also a transport game
15:01<andreiro18>what's the main difference between them?
15:02<andreiro18>promise it's the last question
15:02<andreiro18>:|
15:02<SmatZ>maybe for me the reason why I prefer TTD is that I can be more megalomaniac there
15:02<Yexo>no idea what the differences are exactly
15:02<Yexo>never played locomotion
15:03<andreiro18>ok..tanks for helping
15:03<andreiro18>i'll give you 10 beers and a jack daniels in bucharest :P
15:04<SmatZ>there aren't many romanian OTTD players
15:05<frosch123>so locomotion "invented" trams?
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15:09<Nite_Owl>Hello all
15:09<Alberth>hello
15:09<Noldo>ps
15:10<SmatZ>Hello
15:10<Yexo>there aren't many romanian OTTD players <- there are some annoying ones
15:10<Nite_Owl>Hello Alberth & Noldo & SmatZ
15:10<andythenorth>andreiro18: try talking to the romanian road vehicle set guys
15:11<andythenorth>I'll find you the url
15:11<andythenorth>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=42097
15:11-!-Zephyris [~Zephyris@lincdhcp23672.linc.ox.ac.uk] has joined #openttd
15:12<andythenorth>hi Zephyris
15:12<Zephyris>hi, hi, hi!
15:12<Nite_Owl>Hello Zephyris
15:13<@Belugas>[15:07] <andreiro18> i'll give you 10 beers and a jack daniels in bucharest :P <-- when is the next plane? I'll be there right away
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15:17<kick52>hello
15:17<kick52>I seem to be having trouble replacing vehicles in the depot or on the little list thing.
15:17<kick52>if I get vehicles in the depot and click "autoreplace all vehicles" nothing happens :(
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15:24*SmatZ has strong urge to /kick kick52 52
15:24<kick52>>:(
15:24<SmatZ>err hello
15:25<kick52>literally EVERYONE does that little (immature) joke.
15:25<SmatZ>do you have autoreplace rules set?
15:25<kick52>oh, nope. I assumed the button just "worked"
15:25<SmatZ>it doesn't know what should it be replaced to
15:26<kick52>what are autoreplace rules set? sorry I only downloaded it today :S
15:26<SmatZ>if you mean autorenew, vehicles have to be old
15:26<kick52>hm
15:26<kick52>no, just replace
15:26<SmatZ>http://wiki.openttd.org/Autoreplace
15:26<kick52>on the depot window
15:26<kick52>also on manage list-> replace vehicles, nothing turns up on the right side so I can't do anything
15:26<SmatZ>you have to set replace rules in the group/vehicle list window
15:27<SmatZ>maybe you need to switch train type?
15:27<SmatZ>(normal/el/mono/maglev)
15:27<kick52>I only have trucks and shit at the moment :P
15:28<SmatZ>good :-p
15:28<kick52>the replace vehicles window is completely blank for me
15:28<kick52>there is nothing on the right side, shouldn't there be vehicles I can replace them to?
15:28<SmatZ>so you say you don't have any trains?
15:28<kick52>ah, hang on. I need to revise for a bit
15:28<kick52>nope, no trains
15:28<SmatZ>you have to select train from the left panel
15:28<SmatZ>*locomotiove
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15:29<kick52>nothing comes up on the right side
15:29<SmatZ>then you can't replace it, the end :)
15:29<SmatZ>maybe try switching type to el.rail
15:29<Yexo>which year are you in and which train are you trying to replace?
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>you broke it!
15:30<SmatZ>you can try setting "Engines never expire" setting
15:30<SmatZ>*the
15:30<Nite_Owl>there may not be any road vehicles available to replace your current ones
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15:31<kick52>so I can't use replace just to effectively clone my current, broken vehicles?
15:31<kick52>:(
15:31<Nite_Owl>in other words your current road vehicles may be the most up to date versions available and they are not so old as to need replacing
15:32<kick52>is there a way I can just renew vehicles?
15:32<SmatZ>http://wiki.openttd.org/Autorenew we have a wiki, you know
15:33<kick52>I don't have that set automatically though, and don't want it automatically :S
15:33<Nite_Owl>then you have to replace them manually
15:34<Nite_Owl>sell one - buy another one
15:34<Nite_Owl>that way the orders get copied
15:34<SmatZ>I think old vehicles (those "in red") will be renewed even when autorenew is disabled
15:34<SmatZ>if you press "autoreplace all vehicles" in depot
15:34<SmatZ>I am not sure though
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15:40<Nite_Owl>I think that is dependent on the vehicle being replaced still being available - vehicles never expire option is OFF
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15:47<frosch123>[21:35] <SmatZ> I think old vehicles (those "in red") will be renewed even when autorenew is disabled <- seems like autorenew needs to be enabled, but I guess that could be considered a bug :) manually triggering autorenew/replace should always replace old vehicles
15:49<keikoz>Hi, have a little question: in order to take the entire production of an industry, do this industry has to be entirely in the catchment area of a station, or just a part is enough ?
15:49<Nite_Owl>but if it is disabled and there are several possible replacements available which one gets chosen
15:50<SmatZ>group replace, general replace, renew
15:51<Alberth>keikoz: part should be enough, it is not taken into consideration afaik (read 'game mechanics' at the wiki for details)
15:51<Yexo>part is indeed enough
15:52<keikoz>Alberth : I already read it, it doesnt tell anything about it
15:52<Nite_Owl>for primary industries - secondary industries have a specific tile
15:52<keikoz>ok, thank you Yexo and Alberth
15:52<keikoz>oh, Nite_Owl ?
15:53<Nite_Owl>primary industries any one tile will do
15:53<@Belugas>use the query tool (the red question mark) and explore the industry tiles. You'll see some indications
15:54<keikoz>Belugas already tried, doesnt tell anything :)
15:54<@Belugas>no indeed, it does not speak :) you have to read!
15:54*Belugas runs away
15:54<Yexo>Belugas: that's only for accepting cargo, not producing it iirc
15:55<keikoz>ok, i'll make a test
15:55<keikoz>two coal places, one with just one tile covered, another entirely :)
15:55<Nite_Owl>secondary industries have a specific tile(s) that must be in the catchment area to accept cargo
15:56<keikoz>Nite_Owl : yes, that"s only about accepting passengers, isn't it ?
15:56<frosch123>quite some myths around here :)
15:57<frosch123>however, the when bulding a station there is a "supplies" text shown in the gui
15:57<andythenorth>keikoz: In recent versions of OpenTTD supplied cargo is shown, try using that
15:57<andythenorth>oh frosch beat me :D
15:58<keikoz>i know, but that doesnt tell me if I will get the entire production or not, depending by the area covered
15:58<frosch123>I hardly beat someone, I only kicked benny once :p
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15:58<Yexo>keikoz: if you get some production, you can get all
15:58<Yexo>whether or not you get all depends on your station rating
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15:58<keikoz>ok
15:58<frosch123>keikoz: either you get nothing or you get the amount matching your station rating
15:58<Nite_Owl>Did I get it wrong ?
15:59<keikoz>ok
15:59<frosch123>Nite_Owl: there are no specific tiles
15:59<Yexo>Nite_Owl: you got the questino wrong, it was about producing cargo, not accepting it
15:59<keikoz>thank you everybody
15:59<Alberth>keikoz: if it doesn't say anything about tile counts, it is not a factor in the computation.
15:59<Nite_Owl>true - i just took it further
16:00<SmatZ>just the sum of "accepted cargo" of tiles in the coverage area has to be >= 1
16:00<Phazorx>can you guys point me towards some reading on blitters and overall SDL gfx efficiency optimization?
16:00*SmatZ has no clue :-/
16:00<frosch123>he, I already read that question today, was that also you?
16:00<Phazorx>hola SmatZ
16:01<Alberth>sdl.org?
16:01<frosch123>I also read that answer :p
16:01<Phazorx>Alberth: they have decent docs but not guides
16:01<SmatZ>hello Phazorx :) how are you doing?
16:01<Phazorx>i'm iso for some common practices
16:01<@Belugas>could be Yexo, just that I though someone ( SmatZ ) did the change a while ago
16:02<Phazorx>SmatZ: well, keeping bus to some extent, but okay in general i guess.. how about yourself?
16:02<Sacro>the room is alive, with the sound of an IBM Model M
16:02<Nite_Owl>so if you have just one tile of a factory in a stations catchment area it will accept cargo?
16:03<SmatZ>Phazorx: good to hear :) I have a lot of things to do, too :)
16:04<andythenorth>Nite_Owl: try it out, what do you see in the gui :P
16:04<Alberth>Nite_Owl: don't know, when the station picker window says it does would be my guess.
16:04<Nite_Owl>double checking now
16:04<frosch123>Nite_Owl: to transfer cargo from station to industry you need 8/8 acceptance (shown in the "tile information" window) within the rectancle around all station tiles + catchment radius. to transfer cargo from industry to station you need one station tile in the rectangle containing all industry tiles + station catchment radius
16:05<Yexo>Nite_Owl: that depends on whethe ror not that tile accepts 8/8 cargo
16:05<Phazorx>Nite_Owl: sometimes it depends on idustry since not all tiles that belong to picture of it can produce the cargo you are looking for
16:05<Phazorx>err... accept not produce
16:06<Yexo>Phazorx: yeah :), lets add more confusion
16:06<frosch123>note that all these "rectangles" might cause quite unexpected behaviour for non-rectangular industries and/or stations
16:06<Phazorx>Yexo: i think we could have stopped with "if it says it accepts when you try to place it - it does" :)
16:07<Yexo>maybe we should have
16:08<andythenorth>hmm that one accepts/supplies one seems pretty self explanatory. the gui kind of has it covered. nice work whoever added that btw
16:09<Phazorx>i wonder if there are any second tier industries that have tiles in them that produce 3rd tier but do not accept 2nd or vica versa
16:09<Phazorx>that would be evil
16:10<Alberth>that should be constructable <grin/>
16:10<Yexo>at least ecs has several industries were not all cargos are accepted by all tiles
16:10<kick52>SmatZ: sorry, revision break :S I tried hitting the "replace all vehicles" button in depot, but it doesn't do anything. is this a bug, d'you think?
16:10<Yexo>tiles that don't producing anything are not possible as follow from frosch123 explanation
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16:10<Phazorx>Yexo: that is acceptable but what i meant - you can have a station that is in acept area and can digest delivered but never gets any that are produced
16:12<Phazorx>hmm... i guess i didnt read frosch123 right
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16:15<Eddi|zuHause><kick52> SmatZ: sorry, revision break :S I tried hitting the "replace all vehicles" button in depot, but it doesn't do anything. is this a bug, d'you think? <- it only does something if any replacement rules apply, you have to set them up first, and need to have enough money
16:16<Nite_Owl>It appears to be industry dependent. Yes the GUI will let you know what is accepted. With the factory it 'accepts' on any tile. With the sawmill, power plant, and oil refinery the GUI 'accepts' only when specific tiles of the industry are in the catchment area.
16:18<kick52>Eddi|zuHause: oh. how can I set up replacement rules?
16:19<Eddi|zuHause>from the vehicle list
16:19<Eddi|zuHause>manage list -> replace vehicles
16:19<kick52>right
16:19<kick52>I've tried that before
16:19<kick52>and nothing comes up on the right panel
16:19<kick52>when something on the left is selected
16:19<Yexo>which year are you in and which train are you trying to replace?
16:20<Eddi|zuHause>kick52: then try switching between conventional and electric rail?
16:20<Yexo>and which newgrfs are you using (if any)?
16:20<kick52>1950ish
16:20<kick52>I don't want to upgrade them, I just want to renew them because they are old and breaking down every second
16:20<kick52>I can't upgrade them anyway
16:20<Eddi|zuHause>oh, yes, autorenew is somewhere else
16:21<Yexo>then go to "advanced settinsg-> autorenew"
16:21<Eddi|zuHause>in the advanced settings -> vehicles
16:21<kick52>oh, okay thanks. no manual autorenew
16:21<Eddi|zuHause>-> replace vehicles when they get old
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16:22<Nite_Owl>So I was not totally crazy
16:22<@Belugas>"manual" "auto" renew... that sounds a bit like antigonism t me
16:23<kick52>I mean
16:23<kick52>automatically renew stuff when you say
16:23<kick52>instead of doing it when they get old and you don't know about it
16:23<kick52>kinda confusing, since "replace" doesn't really imply "upgrade." at least, not to me :P
16:24<frosch123>kick52: you have to enable the automatic autorenew to make the manual autorenew work
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16:24<kick52>indeed. :(
16:24<frosch123>you can disable that afterwards again
16:24<kick52>yeah
16:24<frosch123>however, I guess I am going to consider that a bug :)
16:24<Yexo>kick52: "Autoreplace is a helpful feature implemented by Bjarni which allows you to upgrade your entire fleet of a certain kind of vehicle to a different type without having to sell and replace them individually." <- first sentence on wiki page about Autoreplace
16:24<Eddi|zuHause>that is not entirely true anymore ;)
16:25<kick52>Yexo: yeah, but I only wanted it once, and didn't know autoreplace would work manually once enabled
16:25<kick52>right, I really have to go
16:25<kick52>bye, thanks for the help :D
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16:26<frosch123>what makes me wonder is, that manual autorenew would also need some definition when vehicle are old. i.e. the months-setting of autorenew would also get a meaning when automatic renewing is disabled
16:26<frosch123>dragging a train on the autoreplace/renew button might also be useful :p
16:27<frosch123>in which case it could completely ignore the age and also renew brand-new vehicles :)
16:27<keikoz>oh, actually
16:27<keikoz>are transmitters useful for anything ?
16:27<frosch123>hmm, no, that sucks for trains when it would always renew all wagons
16:28<Yexo>keikoz: yes, for limiting terraforming
16:28<frosch123>keikoz: the only purpose of transmitters and lighthouses it to "be in the way" :)
16:29<keikoz>oh , ok :-)
16:30<@Belugas>and look realistic too
16:31<frosch123>no, afaik each lighthouse on the world has a individual coluring/lightning scheme
16:31<frosch123>and Belugas: give me my keyboard back and take your old one back :p
16:32<Alberth>looking realistic is just to avoid too many questions "what's that thing that's in my way?" :p
16:32<keikoz>in fact i was used to play TTD some years ago, didn't play it so much
16:33<keikoz>i retried with openttd some days ago, it's really great
16:34<@Belugas>:D
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17:48<Eddi|zuHause>hm... i just found a "OTTD-win32-nightly-r3361.zip"
17:49-!-Zephyris [~Zephyris@lincdhcp23672.linc.ox.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:49<Eddi|zuHause>and some missing screenshots...
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17:54<andy2309>hi can anyone help me install ttd on windows vista
17:54<Yexo>ttd or openttd?
17:54<andy2309>i try to install it and it says not available in full screen mode
17:55<andy2309>ttd
17:55<Yexo>ttd doesn't work under vista
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17:55<Yexo>you need either ttdpatch or openttd
17:55<andy2309>i have the ttd patch but i thought u need to instal it first to apply it
17:56<Yexo>I think just extracting all files from the cd to some folder should do
17:56<andy2309>ok il try that, cheers
17:56<SmatZ>andy2309: also, #tycoon is related to ttd and ttdpatch better than #openttd :)
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18:00<alekibango>petern: now i can see why the newgrf is still unfinished, LOL
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18:09<andy2309>yexo-tried that then tried reinstalling it and had the same problem
18:10<Yexo>andy2309: as SmatZ said, for help with ttdpatch go to #tycoon
18:10<Yexo>if you want to install openttd (which I can suggest :p), feel free to ask for help here
18:12<andy2309>how do i get openttd, is it just a patch
18:12<andy2309>i dont understand how to use th patch on a programme i cant install
18:12<SmatZ>openttd : http://openttd.org ttdpatch : http://ttdpatch.net/
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18:14<Sacro>doom with a model m is loud as fook
18:14<Nite_Owl>Chalk up another one for thedontreadme.txt
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18:44<Eddi|zuHause>hm... this "sapphire united" guy is on a good way to become a candidate for the ignore list...
18:45<Yexo>he hasn't made it yet?
18:45<Eddi|zuHause>i'm a too forgiving person :p
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19:09<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause, admit it, you like the battle too much to ignore him :)
19:15<@petern>hello belugas
19:23<@petern>hello belugas
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20:12<Sacro>god
20:12<Sacro>it's scary to see an Apple ][ on Wikipedia in a glass box
20:12<Sacro>we have 2 upstairs
20:16<fjb>Now start feeling old.
20:17<Sacro>it's older than me :p
20:17<Sacro>I think
20:18<Sacro>Yeah, course it is
20:18<Sacro>77
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22:20<@Belugas>damned... i mist petern :(
22:20*Belugas cries
22:21*Sacro hugs Belugas
22:21<@Belugas>well... thanks
22:21<Sacro>You're welcome
22:21<Sacro>:)
22:23<@Belugas>so.... i'll go down and i'll play a bit then
22:24<Sacro>beg pardon? :o
22:24<Sacro>that sounds most deceidedly rude
22:24<Sacro>erm
22:25<Sacro>decidedly
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22:39<Eddi|zuHause>hm... anyone ever tried to run win3.1 in dosbox?
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---Logclosed Fri Jun 12 00:00:40 2009