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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-06-29

---Logopened Mon Jun 29 00:00:46 2009
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04:12<SmatZ>quite quiet place
04:12<SirSquidness>Care to join me in making some noise?
04:14<planetmaker>pssst! You may wake the lions.
04:14<planetmaker>And then the crying starts...
04:15<SirSquidness>It's alright
04:15<SirSquidness>I'm in a car.
04:19<dihedral>what if that lion was in that car too?
04:19<dihedral>then at least all the blood would not squirt all over the place
04:20<dihedral>and your germs would remain 'contained'
04:20<SmatZ> :-p
04:21<SirSquidness>this is a good point, dihedral
04:21<SirSquidness>I hadn' tconsidered that possibility
04:21<SirSquidness>but I dare say if a Lion was in my car, it would have great trouble moving about trying to bite my head off
04:21<SirSquidness>due to it's size.
04:23<dihedral>i think you would have more trouble :-P
04:23<dihedral>either side of a big cat aint that nice
04:26<dihedral>SmatZ, pretty bad once lions taste human flesh
04:27<dihedral>it's sweeter than other meat, and lions tend to then try to get hold of more human flesh
04:27<SmatZ>ummm :)
04:27*SmatZ never tasted
04:27<dihedral>bite your finger, then go to a cow and bite it's arse :-D
04:28<dihedral>*bit :-P
04:28<dihedral>not 'byte' you'll miss the chunk after some time :_D
04:29<z-MaTRiX>hello :)
04:32*SirSquidness sniggers at dihedral's lame joke
04:33<dihedral>i am disappointed with the forums :-(
04:33<dihedral>they are not what they used to be :-P
04:36<SirSquidness>I can't say I have an opinion on this matter.
04:36<SirSquidness>I don't even have an account there :p
04:37<dihedral>dont think it would make an improvement
04:39<@petern>slow shit pc is slow shit
04:40<dihedral>you make sense!
04:41<SirSquidness>obvious statement is obvious?
04:43<Noldo>redundancy is redundant
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04:49<SirSquidness>unless the primary service has died, and fallen over to the redundant service, in which case teh redudancy is no longer redundant.
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05:33<CIA-2>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16691 /trunk/src/texteff.cpp: -Codechange: what's the point of getting the fifth dparam and then using that as the second dparam later on? Especially when the fifth dparam is never set and the second dparam is never used.
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05:43<fonsinchen>Hehe, Rubidium is reading my patches :)
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06:54<javispedro>hi everyone
06:54<javispedro>I am not able to find the window titlebar drawing code in openttd
06:54<javispedro>any hint of keywords or files to search?
06:55<Noldo>check the shade windows patch
06:59<javispedro>oooh WWT_CAPTION
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13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: translators * r16692 /trunk/src/lang/ukrainian.txt:
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: ukrainian - 3 changes by Madvin
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13:55<COLDICE>hi all.
13:56<COLDICE>is there is any way to replace airplanes with same model after there life
13:57<COLDICE>ok thanks, let me check
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14:02<COLDICE>Rubidium in multiplayer, do autorenew patch have to set on server or if it enables in client than it will work for that client
14:03<@Rubidium>it's a per company setting
14:05<COLDICE>thank you
14:05<COLDICE>take care
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15:17<CIA-2>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16693 /trunk/src/economy.cpp: -Fix [FS#3004] (r16883): cargo income was not added to the vehicle's profit.
15:20<Ammler>Rubidium: nice support on COLDICE :-)
15:21<Ammler>you make user expect, they can join ask get the answer and leave ;-)
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15:22<@Rubidium>*everybody* leaves after they get their question answered
15:22<SpComb>nobody told me that
15:22<alloc>how do I make my own map?
15:22<Ammler>Rubidium: you meant "should" ?
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15:23<@Rubidium>see, even you left
15:23<Ammler>he, indeed, worked :-D
15:23<rortom>what time is it? xD
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15:24<rortom>yay ;)
15:24<rortom>and good evening :)
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15:24<Sacro>will i get kicked if i ask a question?
15:25-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!*ben@150.237.48.*] by Rubidium
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15:31<@petern>r16693 fixes r16883?
15:31<gleeb>Makes sense to me.
15:31<+glx>nice one
15:31<@petern>at least i was only one revision out when i did it ;)
15:32<+glx>so we should reserve r16883 to readd the bug :)
15:32<@Rubidium>guess I need glasses; those 6s and 8s look so much alike
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15:36<@petern>join us!
15:36<@Belugas>heheh.. like my boss who mixes up "cottage" with "cctagp1"
15:39<@Rubidium>or should I blame it on (number) dyslexia?
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15:40<@Belugas>Alain, leave that Body! I Summon YOU!
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15:42*Rubidium ponders annoying some cheaters, though doing so might upset others too
15:43<@petern>do it!
15:44<Ammler>Rubidium: station teleport?
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15:49<@petern>what's a station teleport?
15:50<@Belugas>a station that moves back in forth in time, it's part of the project Darma
15:52<LadyHawk>lol poor sacro
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15:52<+glx>Belugas: don't spoil me :)
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15:55<@Belugas>what amazes me, as the series progress,is the complexity of the story. I really hope the ending will be as impressive as the build up
15:55-!-mode/#openttd [-b *!*ben@150.237.48.*] by petern
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16694 /trunk/src/ (13 files in 2 dirs):
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#2995] (rgradual loading, rnewindustries): only pay for whatever has been actually unloaded and perform the payment when unloading has finished. This fixes, amongst others:
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: * cheating by starting to unload and after getting paid rushing to the depot to get sold (or unloading, loading and getting paid again for the remainder)
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: * cargo being dropped onto a station at the moment a stockpiling industry doesn't accept it anymore
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: * industries getting cargo that has not been unloaded yet and subsequently dumping it back on the station in one go
15:55<CIA-2>OpenTTD: Note: you will now get paid after the unloading has finished, so you'll have to wait a bit longer for 'your' money.
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15:57<@Rubidium>my CFLAGS don't have -pedantic
15:58<@petern>obviously Ammler has a different unreported cheat in mind
15:58<@petern>(or he made it up)
16:00<Ammler>petern: you self reported it :P
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16:01<Ammler>at least you complained once about here...
16:01<@petern>are you referring to the possibilities opened up by distant join?
16:02<Ammler>no, that was possible before, just easier now.
16:02<@petern>then i don't care
16:03<@petern>because i'd rather get blood out of a stone than eke a sensible response from you
16:03<@Rubidium>Ammler: that's something that 'can' be easily resolved by disallowing distant join and non-uniform stations
16:03<Ammler>the problem is, it pays for the distance between stations signs., instead of nearest station tile.
16:03<@Rubidium>or reducing the station spread
16:04<Ammler>yes, the Goal server had a spread of 8 :-)
16:05<Ammler>we used 12 for competive games.
16:07<Ammler>hmm, non-uniform might be an idea to try on next game.
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16:09<LadyHawk>cheating by starting to unload and after getting paid rushing to the depot to get sold (or unloading, loading and getting paid again for the remainder)
16:09<LadyHawk>lol, if that was a cheat i'm afraid i'm guilty
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16:10<Sacro>ah ha
16:12<SpComb>ha ha ha
16:14<LadyHawk>i used to let trains get paid before sending them to train heaven
16:14<Korenn>LadyHawk: the cheat was to send the train to depot before it was fully unloaded, but after you got paid.
16:15<LadyHawk>yeah i know
16:15<LadyHawk>train arrives, gets paid, starts unloading but the depot order makes it go
16:15<Korenn>ok. it's not much of an exploit for human players, but AI can do it for every single vehicle :P
16:15<LadyHawk>then you can skip orders and repeat
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16:16<LadyHawk>too much hassle to do for 1 train, let alone for 3
16:16<LadyHawk>or 100s
16:16<Korenn>imagine an AI doing it with 400 trucks, all the time. That's Rondje om de kerk-AI ;)
16:17<Ammler>[22:15] <LadyHawk> then you can skip orders and repeat <-- did you get paid again?
16:17<LadyHawk>i always let it return to the loading station
16:17<LadyHawk>fills up the cars and changes whatever it is so it thinks the train has only just fully loaded itself
16:18<Ammler>what happened with the cargo you have still loaded?
16:18<Korenn>ammler: it would get overwritten
16:18<LadyHawk>the old car data gets 'overwritten'
16:18<Korenn>so taht works
16:18<LadyHawk>by the new
16:18<Korenn>or used to work
16:18<LadyHawk>cuz trains happened to unload a little bit from ALL cars at same time
16:18<@Rubidium>cargo that was loaded and 'paid for' would stay 'paid for' as long as it remained in the vehicle
16:18<LadyHawk>instead of 1 car at a time
16:18<Ammler>but it means, it get full again very fast
16:19<@Rubidium>loading anything extra into the vehicle won't change the 'paid for' status
16:19<Korenn>Rubidium: but as soon as you loaded a bit of extra cargo, those flags were overwritten, in older versions
16:19<LadyHawk>guess i musta been out of the loop too long as well
16:19<LadyHawk>last time i sat in this channel was years ago
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16:20<@Rubidium>Korenn: older as in before 0.6
16:20<LadyHawk>Ammler wasn't even here yet =P
16:20*dihedral likes the SR-71
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16:40<dpaanlka>Hello! I'm trying to start a dedicated server from the Mac OS X command line.
16:40<dpaanlka>Version 0.7.1. Anyways, instead of doing what it used to do, it's launching the OpenTTD application (gui version) and then gives me the cannot find error
16:41<dpaanlka>I'm typing ./openttd -D and also doing that as a sudo
16:41<@Belugas>do you have that file?
16:41<dpaanlka>I can play the game fine if I just launch OpenTTD in Mac OS X normally
16:41<dpaanlka>Also, it is doing this on two different computers of mine.
16:41<@Belugas>oh... Mac OS... sorry, cannot help
16:41<Eddi|zuHause>can you try with -d misc=3 and tell what it thinks the personal dir is?
16:42<dpaanlka>That returned a lot of lines which am I looking for?
16:42<dpaanlka>Oh... /Users/dpaanlka/Documents/OpenTTD
16:42<dpaanlka>Is that where the cat file and stuff should be?
16:42<dpaanlka>Because right now it's just in a "Data" folder in the applicaiton folder
16:43<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, try to put it there
16:43<dpaanlka>I don't remember ever having to do that before?
16:43<Eddi|zuHause>i can't help with that... ;)
16:44<dpaanlka>Like, perhaps that changed in 0.7.x?
16:44<Eddi|zuHause>it shouldn't have changed since 0.6
16:44<planetmaker>dpaanlka: :( you didn't read my answer in the forums... :(
16:44<dpaanlka>Oh, I must have just missed it
16:45<dpaanlka>Er... what answer?
16:45<planetmaker>I tell you exactly that: use your personal ~/Documents/OpenTTD/data folder for the files :)
16:45<dpaanlka>I don't see any such response to my thread
16:46<planetmaker>hm... I don't either now. I'm positive I posted... Maybe my wifi ate it. Nvm and sorry then.
16:46<dpaanlka>lol ok well
16:46<dihedral>whats with the /Library/Application Support/OpenTTD/data folder?
16:46<dpaanlka>in any case thanks guys that was really befuddling me the past few days
16:46<dihedral>i use that on my mac
16:47<dpaanlka>I've always ptu the data folder next to in it's folder in the applications folder and that worked fine before
16:47<planetmaker>dpaanlka: the readme tells you to use ~/Documents/OpenTTD/data
16:47<planetmaker>I *think*
16:47<dpaanlka>If it does, it probably didn't the last time i looked at it like four years ago lol
16:47<planetmaker>That way you also don't need to copy it for several installs.
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16:48<dpaanlka>does this also apply to scripts and the cfg file?
16:49<dpaanlka>Also, one more question... how do I kill the server in mac OS X/
16:50<+glx>type exit in the console
16:50<+glx>or quit
16:51<@Belugas>easier, unplug the machine ^_^
16:51<@Belugas>and mostly, don't listen to me when i'm listening to me
16:52<dpaanlka>well thaks everyone
16:52<dpaanlka>away i go
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16:54*petern unplugs Belugas from his work
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16:54<rortom>@seen yorick
16:54<@DorpsGek>rortom: yorick was last seen in #openttd 2 days, 11 hours, 21 minutes, and 1 second ago: <yorick> I fixed it :)
16:55<Eddi|zuHause>nobody ever warned you to not speak with yorick? :p
16:56<@petern>poor yorick
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17:05<@Belugas>a shame, really.
17:06<@Belugas>but youth... what can I say...
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17:06<@Belugas>petern, you did not unplugged hard enough
17:07<@petern>well, bed time i think
17:08<andythenorth>I have slaved some more over hot pixels. The work is never done it seems:
17:08<rortom>looks nice :)
17:09<Korenn>andythenorth: awesome
17:09<Korenn>why is the grass blue?
17:09<andythenorth>Korenn: :P
17:09<Hirundo>The grass pixels crashed and are showing a blue screen
17:10<andythenorth>hmm users
17:11<andythenorth>only 39 industries left to draw...
17:11<Korenn>O.o I thought the number was lower before?
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17:13<andythenorth>well there are the 14 industries that Simon Foster drew for original TTD. We can reuse those for a while. But ultimately they might need redrawn...
17:13<andythenorth>However that does only leave 25 to draw immediately
17:14<rortom>that happened quite some time ago ...
17:14<andythenorth>(correction) 14 that I want to use
17:15<@Belugas>there are 37 original industries
17:15<planetmaker>nice survey camp, andythenorth :)
17:15<@Belugas>all climate counted
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17:15<@Belugas>the system can handle up to 64 with grfs
17:16<andythenorth>Belugas: do we have crossed wires? :) I am drawing 57 industries for FIRS, with 7 slots left free for add ons ;)
17:17<andythenorth>Some days I wish I was drawing 1 industry with 63 slots left free for add ons
17:17<planetmaker>haha :)
17:17<@petern>"the 14 industries that Simon Foster drew for original TTD" < not crossed, just vagueness ;)
17:18<andythenorth>Wonder where Simon Foster is? His site is down it seems
17:18<andythenorth>oh, it's back again
17:19<@Belugas>i don't have wires. I have strings.
17:21<andythenorth>Looks like Simon Foster is in Newcastle
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17:40<dpaanlka>Hello, I've returned with a few other questions.
17:40<dpaanlka>One of which is, I'm familiar with the way to change a client's name via a console command and rcon
17:40<dpaanlka>However, I was hoping there was also a way to change a company name?
17:41<dpaanlka>I wonder why that is.
17:41<rasco>good evening
17:41<dihedral>if you need to change the company name, you can join the game, move yourself to that company, and change it
17:43<dpaanlka>Yeah I know.
17:43<dpaanlka>It'd just be a bit more convenient I think in console.
17:43<dihedral>it's not needed very often ist it?
17:43<rasco>is there any way to lower the passenger count? i already have very small towns.
17:44<dihedral>blow up some houses?
17:44<planetmaker>rasco: use a different building newgrf
17:44<rasco>planetmaker: thanks for that hint. i didn't know building-grfs changed population counts.
17:44<Ammler>rasco: early houses .grf :-)
17:45<rasco>hope those grfs are in bananas
17:45<planetmaker>^^ hehe, yes :)
17:45<rasco>lets see...
17:45<Ammler>not for stable openttd :-)
17:45<planetmaker>hm... not all building newgrfs are there
17:45<planetmaker>get the #openttdcoop newgrf package. It has some more.
17:45<rasco>about that package by the way
17:45<planetmaker>I dunno anymore which add how many people to houses
17:46<Ammler>planetmaker: he wants less :P
17:46<planetmaker>Ammler: or remove :P
17:46<planetmaker>IIRC playing with TTRS gives you big numbers of people
17:46<rasco>it looks like it's uploaded to bananas, but i can't get the included grfs from there
17:46<rasco>the big numbers of passengers are quite lame for planes :/
17:46<planetmaker>rasco: download from ingame, using the content download button
17:47<planetmaker>if you cannot download it from ingame you cannot use it anyway.
17:47<planetmaker>(if it's up on bananas at all that is)
17:47<rasco>it seems to be uploaded wrongly
17:47<Ammler>I once made a airmod.grf, which rises the loading time
17:47<rasco>Ammler: i had the same idea too
17:48<rasco>whats your best solution for planes yet?
17:48<rasco>(to balance them)
17:48<Ammler>not using
17:48<rasco>heh okay
17:48<Ammler>or reduce them to very few
17:48<Ammler>around 5 or so
17:48<rasco>what about higher running costs?
17:49<Ammler>well, that is very hard to handle
17:49<Ammler>basecosts does rise that.
17:49<Ammler>it might be well at early years, but later you should again rise
17:50<rasco>yea, either the modern planes are totally overpowered or the old planes are totally useless
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17:51<rasco>make the or an and
17:51<Ammler>speak with the grf devs about, maybe the can "fix" the set
17:51<rasco>OR the modern planes are too expensive and the old ones are even uslesser :)
17:52<rasco>you mean av8?
17:52<Ammler>making a openttd edition
17:52<rasco>should do
17:53<Ammler>dunno, if the plane speed factor is accessable from newgrfs
17:54<Korenn>rasco: you could also lower the base price of passenger cargo
17:55<@Rubidium>Ammler: you can get the plane speed factor from NewGRFs
17:55<Ammler>rasco: ^ , so it "should" be doable to balance them
17:55<rasco>Korenn: is that only possible via a grf or can i also compile a custom network server with it?
17:56<Korenn>grf, unfortunately
17:56<rasco>know any existing one?
17:56<Korenn>no, but it shouldn't be hard to write yourself. it's only 1 line
17:56<Ammler>hmm, cargo payment is the save, afaik
17:56<@Rubidium>'only' thing is that plane speed '3' isn't/can't be mapped correctly
17:56<rasco>yea, some known set of balanced planes<->other vehicles would be good to have for openttd
17:56<Ammler>so you could do it with server "hacking"
17:58<Ammler>but then you would also have lower earnings for trains and rvs, do you want that?
17:58<Ammler>so your game is again "unbalanced"
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18:01<rasco>i guess best solution would be to have pikka make a openttd variant of av8 :)
18:01<@Rubidium>Ammler: callback 39h maybe?
18:02<Ammler>rasco: or use 1/4 speed
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18:02<Ammler>well, it does earn too much with 1/4 speed, either
18:03<rasco>Ammler: been there, but it's just so weird some seeing planes going slower than slow trains
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18:04<rasco>and also, oldskool planes are very useless then
18:05<Ammler>rasco: that was the reason for the 1/1 patch ;-)
18:10<rasco>afk cooking something out of random stuff that's left
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18:11<@Belugas>fack feck fick fock fuck
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18:31*Belugas is ungry, tired. /me wants to go home
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18:44<@Belugas>wish granted
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20:46<jerker>hi folks
20:46-!-jerker is now known as TaggartTrans
20:47<TaggartTrans>Just letting you know that I added some dual line variants for my puppy braided junction at
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20:53<TaggartTrans>time to sleep, goodnight, but you are welcome to comment here on irc, i will read tomorrow.
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21:33<LadyHawk>anyone ever tried to make the towns fill the map?
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21:48<Korenn>LadyHawk: yes. with a single town, even
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23:20<welshdragoneee>anybody home?
23:21<welshdragoneee>which version of openttd do i need to download for the latest version of ubuntu?
23:21<welshdragoneee>0.7.1 isn't in the repo's
23:24<welshdragoneee>oh, it's ok, found it
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---Logclosed Tue Jun 30 00:00:06 2009